Persecution for religion judg'd and condemned in a discourse between an antichristian and a Christian : proving by the law of God and of the land, and by King James his many testimonies, that no man ought to be persecuted for his religion, so he testifie his allegiance by the oath appointed by law. Helveys, Thomas, 1550?-1616? 1662 Approx. 222 KB of XML-encoded text transcribed from 41 1-bit group-IV TIFF page images. Text Creation Partnership, Ann Arbor, MI ; Oxford (UK) : 2009-10 (EEBO-TCP Phase 1). A43300 Wing H1413A ESTC R30775 11467420 ocm 11467420 47807 This keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the Early English Books Online Text Creation Partnership. This Phase I text is available for reuse, according to the terms of Creative Commons 0 1.0 Universal . The text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. Early English books online. (EEBO-TCP ; phase 1, no. A43300) Transcribed from: (Early English Books Online ; image set 47807) Images scanned from microfilm: (Early English books, 1641-1700 ; 1463:28) Persecution for religion judg'd and condemned in a discourse between an antichristian and a Christian : proving by the law of God and of the land, and by King James his many testimonies, that no man ought to be persecuted for his religion, so he testifie his allegiance by the oath appointed by law. Helveys, Thomas, 1550?-1616? [5], 2-75 p. Printed in the years 1615 and 1620 and now reprinted for the establishing some and convincing others, [London] : 1662. "Helveys, Thomas, 1550?-1616?" appears in manuscript on verso of t.p. Proving also that the spiritual power in England is the image of the spiritual cruel power of Rome, or that beast mentioned, Rev. 13, manifesting the fearful estate of those who subject to such powers, that tyrannize over the conscience: and shewing the unlawfulness of flying, because of the trouble men see or fear is coming upon them. To which is added an humble supplication to the Kings Majesty ... " Epistle dedicatory signed : "Ana-baptists." To "An humble supplication to the Kings Majesty" is added "Wherein (among other things) is proved, 1. That the learned usually erre and resist truth. 2. That persecution is against the law of Jesus Christ. 3. Against the profession and practice of famous princes. 4. Condemened by ancient and later writers. 5. Freedom in religion not hurtful to any common-wealth, and it depriveth not kings of any power given them of God." Reproduction of original in the Harvard University Library. 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Anabaptists -- England. 2008-08 TCP Assigned for keying and markup 2008-11 SPi Global Keyed and coded from ProQuest page images 2009-01 John Pas Sampled and proofread 2009-01 John Pas Text and markup reviewed and edited 2009-02 pfs Batch review (QC) and XML conversion Persecution for Religion JUDG'D and CONDEMN'D : In a DISCOURE , between an ANTICHRISTIAN and a CRHISTIAN . PROVING By the Law of God and of the Land , And By King James his many Testimonies , That no man ought to be Persecuted for his Religion , so he Testifie his Allegiance by the Oath appointed by Law. Proving also , That the Spiritual Power in England , is the Image of the Spiritual Cruel Power of Rome , or that Beast mentioned , Rev. 13. Manifesting the fearful Estate of those who subject to such Powers , that Tyrannize over the Conscience : And shewing the Unlawfulness of Flying , because of the Trouble men see or fear is coming upon them . To which is added , An humble SUPPLICATION to the Kings Majesty ; Wherein ( among other things ) is proved , 1. That the Learned usually Erre and resist the Truth . 2. That Persecution is against the Law of Jesus Christ . 3. Against the Profession and Practice of famous Princes . 4. Condemned by ancient and later Writers . 5. Freedom in Religion not hurtful to any Common-wealth , and it depriveth not Kings of any Power given them of God. 2 Cor. 10.4 . For the Weapons of our Warfare are not carnal , but mighty through God , to the pulling down of strong holds . Printed in the years , 1615. and 1620. And now Reprinted for the Establishing some , and Convincing others , 1662. To all that truly wish Jerusalem's Prosperity and Babylons Destruction ; Wisdom and Understanding be multiplyed upon you . IN these dayes , if ever , that is true which the Wiseman said , Eccl. 12.12 . There is no end in making many books , and much reading is a weariness to the flesh : yet considering how heinous it is in the sight of the Lord to force men and women by cruel Persecutions , to bring their bodies to a Worship whereunto they cannot bring their spirits ; we thought it our duty for Gods Glory , and the reformation thereof in this our own Nation , to publish this little Writing following , wherein is manifestly proved by the Law of God , the Law of our Land , and his Majesties own divers Testimonies , That no man ought to be persecuted for his Religion , be it true of false , so he testifie his faithful Allegiance to the King. What shall men do striving about matters of Religion till this be ended ? For , if this be a truth , that the Kings of the Earth have power from God to compel by Persecution all their Subjects to believe as they believe , then wicked is it to resist , and the Persecutions of such is justly upon them , and the Magistrates that execute the same are clear from their blood , and it is upon their own heads : but if the Kings of the Earth have not power from God to compel by Persecution any of their Subjects to believe as they believe ( seeing Faith is the work of God ) then no lesse wicked is it in the sight of God to disobey , and the Persecutions of such are upon the Magistrates , and the blood of the Persecuted cryeth unto the Lord , and will be required at the Magistrates hands . Wherefore in all humility , reverence and loyalty we do humbly desire of our Sovereign Lord the King , and all Gods Ministers under him , as Judges , Justices of Peace , &c. by whom this Persecution is executed , themselves to consider , not whether herein they please Lord Bishops , but whether they please the Lord Jesus Christ , who after a little while shall judge all Judges according to their works , without respect of persons , and therefore are commanded to kiss the Son lest he be angry , and they perish in the way , Psal . 2. Our humble desire is , that they would consider what is testified in the Scriptures ; That the Kings of the Earth shall give their power unto the Beast , till the words of God be fulfilled ; then shall they take their power from her . If it be granted ( as it is ) that the Kings of this Nation formerly have given their power unto that Romish Beast , it shall evidently appear that our Lord the King , and all Magistrates under him , do give their power to the same Beast , though the Beast be in another shape : For , as that spiritual Power or Beast of Rome sets up a Worship ( as they pretend ) for God , and force all thereto by cruel Persecutions , the Kings of the Earth giving their Power thereunto ; So this spiritual Power , or Beast of England , sets up a Worship ( as they pretend ) for God , and force all thereto by cruel Persecutions , the Kings Majesty giving his Power hereunto . Oh that all that are in Authority would but consider by the Word of God ( which shall judge them at the last day ) what they do , when they force men against their souls and consciences to dissemble to believe as they believe , or as the King and State believe , they would withdraw their hands and hearts therefrom , and never do as they have done , partly through inconsideration , and partly to please Lord Bishops being in favour with the King. It cannot but with high thankfulness to God , and to the King , be acknowledged of all , that the Kings Majesty is no blood-thirsty man , for if he were , bodily destruction should be the portion of all that fear God , and endeavour to walk in his wayes , as may be seen in the primitive time of this spiritual Power , or Beast of England , after that K. Henry the eight had cast off the Romist Beast and since ( so far as leave hath been granted them ) by hanging , burning , banishing , imprisoning , and what not , as the particulars might be named . Yet our most humble desire of our Lord the King , is , That he would not give his Power to force his faithful Subjects to dissemble to believe as he believes , in the least measure of Persecution ; though it is no small Persecution to lye many years in filthy Prisons , in hunger , cold , idleness , divided from Wife , Family , Calling , left in continual miseries and temptations , so as Death would be to many less Persecution ; seeing his Majesty confesseth , that to change the mind must be the work of God. And of the Lord Bishops we desire , that they would a little leave off persecuting those that cannot believe as they , till they have proved that God is well-pleased therewith , and the souls of such as submit are in safety from Condemnation ; let them prove this , and we protest we will for ever submit unto them , and so will thousands : and therefore if there be any spark of grace in them , let them set themselves to give satisfaction either by word or writing , or both . But if they will not , but continue their cruel-courses as they have done , let them yet remember that they must come to Judgment , and have their Abominations set in order before them , and be torn in pieces when none shall deliver them . And whereas they have no other colour of ground out of the Scriptures , than that they have canonized a Law , viz. That whosoever shall affirm that the Kings Majesty hath not the same power over the Church that the godly Kings of Israel had under the Law , &c. Let him be excommunicate ipso facto . The unsoundness of which ground is manifested in this Dialogue following , wherein is shewed their palpable ignorance , in that they know not the Mystery of God ; and therefore have they made this Canon in flattery to the King , only to support their Pride and Cruelty : For , if the Kingdom or Land of Israel , or Canaan now under the Gospel , be an earthly Kingdom or Land , or Israel now a worldly or fleshly Israel , as both were under the Law , Then we would confess there should be an earthly King thereof : But if the Kingdom of Israel now be not earthly , but heavenly , Joh. 18.36 . and the Israelites now not of this world , Joh. 15.19 . Then the King thereof is not of this world , as they are not of this world , Joh. 17.16 . And if these spiritual Lords confess that Christ is King now of the Land and People of Israel , but yet he hath left our Lord the King his Deputy , to make such Laws and Lords over the Church as pleaseth him ; the Word of the Lord is against them , There is but one Lord , ( 1 Cor. 12.5 . ) and one Law-giver ( Jam. 4.12 . ) over his Church . Nay , his Majesty himself is against them , who saith , There is no earthly Monarch over the Church , whose word must be a Law. And saith further , Christ is his Churches Monarch , and the holy Ghost his Deputy , alledging Luk. 22.25 . The Kings of the Gentiles bear rule one over another , &c. but it shall not be so among you . Saying further , Christ when he ascended , left not Peter with them to direct them in all truth , but promised to send the holy Ghost to them for that end , &c. If any will be rebellious against the Word of the Lord herein , yet let them not be rebellious against the word of the King. Oh that any thing would prevail with them to make them leave off these cruel courses , of persecuting poor souls that desire truly to fear God , and are most faithful Subjects to the King , and desire also the salvation of the souls of these their cruel Persecrutors , who do seek their utter undoing by all the fore-named Persecutions , only because they cannot of faith offer up such Worship to God as these spiritual Lords command ; and the rather let them leave off persecuting , seeing the Kings Majesty acknowledgeth , It is a sure Rule in Divinity , That God loves not to plant his Church by Violence and Bloodshed . And if it be a Law for all Christians , That in indifferent things one must not offend another , but the strong to forbear rather than offend his weak brother ; otherwise he wounds the weak conscience , and sins against Christ , 1 Cor. 8. Then how much less hath any man power to be Lord over the weak conscience , forcing it to practise that it hath not faith in , bringing it thereby unto sin , and unto condemnation , Rom. 14. We do unfainedly acknowledge the Authority of earthly Magistrates , God's blessed Ordinance , and that all earthly Authority and Command appeartains unto them ; let them command what they will , we must obey , either to do or suffer upon pain of Gods displeasure , besides their punishment : But all men must let God alone with his Right , which is to be Lord and Law-giver to the soul , and not command obedience for God where he commandeth none . And this is onely that which we dare not but maintain upon the peril of our souls , which is greater than bodily affliction : And only for the maintenance of Christs right herein , do false Prophets and Deceivers ( who by that craft are cloathed in fine apparrel , and fare deliciously every day ) labour to make us odious in the ears and eyes of Prince and People , knowing well that if they had not power by Persecution to force men to dissemble to believe as they , their kingdom and gain would soon come to nought ; the wickedness of which course is discovered in this Writing following . For the manner , being Dialogue-wise , we thought it the fittest in two respects : First , for the understanding of the simple , to whom especially Gods Mysteries appertain , more than to the wise and prudent of the world . Secondly , Because all the Objections that we have met with , might be set down , and the plainlyer answered . And because we have faith and assurance that many will see and acknowledge the unlawfulness of tyrannizing over the Conscience , by persecuting the bodies of such as cannot be subject , We have also though it meet to manifest the fearful estate of such subjection , that they may deliver their souls , if they will be saved : and also have set down the beginning of that old and good way , that John Baptist , Christ Jesus and his Apostles have left unto all that will be saved unto the end of the world . Beseeching that Almighty worker , that he would work in the hearts and consciences of men , that they may enquire for it , and that out of the Scriptures , and walk therein ; then shall they find Rest unto their souls , although Afflictions to their bodies . Oh it is time for the Lord to work , for they have destroyed his Law , and have set up in many Nations such Worship for God as best pleaseth them that are in Authority , and have power to persecute the contrary-minded . Let all Gods People cry , How long Lord ? when wilt thou come to destroy Antichrists cruel Kingdom , and establish Christs meek and peaceable Kingdom ? As thou hast begun , even come Lord Jesus by the Spirit of thy Mouth , and the Brightness of thy Coming , even come quickly . Amen . By Christs unworthy Witnesses , his Majesties faithful Subjects : Commonly ( but most falsly ) called ANA-BAPTISTS . PERSECUTION for RELIGION JUDG'D and CONDEMN'D : In a DISCOURSE between an ANTICHRISTIAN & a CHRISTIAN . Antichristian . VVHy come you not to Church ? Christian . VVhat should I do there ? Antich . Worship God. Chr. I must worship God as he requireth , and not as any mortal man requireth . Ant. True , but the Worship that we require you to offer up , is the Worship God requireth . Ch. If it be so , I will with all willingness assent unto it ; but my conscience must be satisfied thereof by the Word of Truth , that I may have faith in it , otherwise it is my grievous sin , Rom. 14.23 . For I may not believe it so to be , because you affirm it . Ant. Well , you must go to Church , otherwise you are disobedient to the Law , and will fall under punishment . Ch. But still remember that you would have me worship God as you pretend , therefore let us agree what Worship God requireth : Christ saith , Joh. 4.24 . God is a Spirit , and they that worship him , must worship him in Spirit and Truth . Here we see what Worship God requireth , viz. That we worship him with our Souls and Spirits , and also that we worship him according to the Truth of his Word : And therefore for your Book-worship , if it were according to Truth , ( from the which it is as far as light is from darkness ) yet if I cannot offer it up with my spirit , it is not acceptable to God , but most abominable . Ant. Well , you must come to Church . Ch. I pray let me ask you a Question , Do you seek the Glory of God , and the Salvation of my soul herein , or your own Obedience ? Ant. I seek the Glory of God , and the Salvation of your Soul , and not my own Obedience . Ch. Then manifest it not by words only , but by deeds and truth ; which if you do , you will not threaten me with punishment to cause me to come , but with meekness and patience satisfie my Conscience by the Word of Truth , ( for this is the duty of the Minister of Christ , 2 Tim. 2.24 . ) that I may come with a willing mind , so shall I be accepted , 2 Cor. 8.12 . Psal . 110.3 . For if by threatning me with punishment , as Imprisonment , Banishment , or Death , you cause me to bring my body , and not my spirit or soul , so shall I come near to the Lord with my lips , when my heart shall be far from him , which he accounteth vain worship and hypocrisie , Mat. 15. Ant. I perceive what you aim at , you would have none brought to Church , but such as come willingly of themselves , so should every man worship God as himself pleaseth . Ch. Your Conclusion I aim not at ; for I acknowledge , that as there is but one God , so there is but one way of worshipping him , out of the which way , whosoever is , and repenteth not thereof , shall pay a dear price ; and therefore it standeth all men upon , not to please themselves in worshipping of him . But you perceive aright that I aim at this , That none should be compelled to worship God , but such as come willingly ; for I will ( by Gods assistance ) prove most evidently by the Scriptures , that none ought , nor can be compelled to worship God to acceptance , by any worldly means whatsoever . Ant. Prove that . Ch. Well , I prove what I have affirmed , thus : First , Heb. 11.6 . Without Faith it is impossible to please God ; and , Rom 14.23 . Whatsoever is not of Faith , is sin . These two Scriptures prove most evidently , that whatsoever I have not Faith in , in worshipping God , although it were undoubtedly true , I may not offer it up to God , for it is displeasing to him , and it is a sin against him : As also it appeareth plainly by him , that came unto the Kings Supper , and wanted his wedding garment , Matth. 22. Ant. It is the Kings Law that you must go to Church , and therefore you must be obedient . Ch. The intent of the Kings Law is not so , as appeareth both by the Statute for the Oath of Allegiance , and also by his Majesties own words , manifested in his Apologie for the Oath of Allegiance , as is hereafter more fully declared . For , if the intent of the Law were to make me come to Church to worship God , and not of Faith , the intent of the Law were to compel me to sin , which his Majesty requireth not . Ant. I deny not but whatsoever is not of Faith is sin ; but we would have you come to Church to worship God in Faith. Ch. It is not so : you regard not whether I have Faith or no ; for if you did , you would not urge the Kings Law against me , which is but a carnal weapon , and cannot beget Faith , and therefore is no sure ground of Faith. For , in my obedience to God , I must not presume above that that is written , 1 Cor. 4.6 . For , the Word of God is the only ground of Faith , Rom. 10.17 . and therefore if you would have me come in Faith , you would only urge the Law of the King of kings against me . Ant. Have not all the Learned of the Land considered of these things , and set them down ? Are such simple men as you likely to see more than all these ? Ch. I demand of you whether they be not all subject to erre , as all men are ; and therefore I must try their spirits , whether they erre or no , 1 Joh. 4.1 . For I may not hold , either that they cannot erre , or that if I find them to erre , I must obey them notwithstanding ; do you not herein teach me that Popish and accursed Doctrine , that you inveigh so much against in the Papists , That I must believe as the Learned of the Land believe ? Ant. I do not hold that they cannot erre . Ch. Yes , you hold either that they cannot erre , or , if they do erre , I must obey them ; for , if I do not obey them , you threaten me with punishment . Ant. Nay , but I hold , that they being Learned do not erre , and therefore you must obey them . Ch. Then this is your Argument , The Learned do not erre , and therefore must be obeyed . The Bishops and the rest of that rank are learned , and do not erre , and therefore they must be obeyed . Another Argument as vain as they may be collected from this ground : The Learned do not erre , and therefore must be obeyed . The Pope and the rest of that rank are learned , ( yea , as learned as yours ) and do not erre , and therefore they must be obeyed . The one is as true as the other , but both abominable . If you prove , that they that want this Learning , must not meddle with the wayes of God but as these learned men teach them , then indeed you say something ; but if you cannot , as most certain it is you cannot , ( for the Word of God is against you herein ) then for shame to God and men leave oft your cruel persecuting ; For why do you persecute men that cannot in faith submit to your direction concerning the wayes of God , upon which consisteth their Salvation , if they walk in the true way of Faith with the love thereof , and their Condemnation if they walk in a by-path ? Ant. Then I perceive if a man can plead that he hath not Faith in any thing which the King commands , he need not to be obedient . Ch. Would God all men could see your dealing herein . This is your usual course when your mouth is stopped by the power of Gods Word that you know not what to answer , then you run to the Kings Command , and so make your matters good , like unto your predecessors the wicked Scribes and Pharisees , who when our Lord and Master had stopped their mouthes that they had no word of answer , then they sought to make him a trespasser against Caesar ; but I have learned in some weak measure , that as there is a Caesar unto whom in conscience I must be obedient , So there is another King , one JESUS , that is King of kings ; unto whom if you will not be obedient , in giving unto God that which is Gods , He will tear you in pieces , when there shall be none that can deliver you , and cast you into the Lake that burneth with fire and brimstone for evermore , where there shall be no rest day nor night ; and therefore agree with this your adversary quickly , whilst you are in the way with him . The Power and Authority of the King is earthly , and God hath commanded me to submit to every Ordinance of man , 1 Pet. 2.13 , 14. and therefore I have faith to submit to what Ordinance of Man soever the King commands , if it be an humane Ordinance , and not against the manifest Word of God , let him require what he will , I must in conscience obey him , with my body , goods , and all that I have : But my soul , wherewith I am to worship God , that belongeth to another King , whose Kingdom is not of this World , Joh. 18.36 . Whose People must come willingly , Psal . 110.3 . Whose weapons are not carnal , but spiritual , 2 Cor. 10.4 , &c. Ant. Is this all the Authority that you will give to the King ? Ch. VVhat Authority can any mortal man require more , than of body , goods , life , and all that appertaineth to the outward man ? The heart God requireth , Prov. 23.26 . He commanded to give unto Caesar the things that are Caesars , and to Himself the things that are His , Luk. 20.25 . Now if all the outward man be Caesars , and the inward man too , so that he must be obeyed is his own matters , and in God's matters also , then tell us what shall be given to God ? If you , or any man , will give him more Power or Authority than I give him , then you give him more than his Majesty requireth , as shall be shewed . Ant. We do not say that the King can compel the soul , but only the outward man. Ch. If he cannot compel my soul , he cannot compel me to worship God , for God cannot be worshipped without the soul , Joh. 4.24 . If you say he may compel me to offer up a worship only with my body , ( for the spirit you confess he cannot compel ) To whom is that worship ? not to God. Then consider you who they worship that are thus compelled , ( say you by the King. ) Let it well be here observed , that you make the King a commander of such worship as is not to God , contrary to his Majesties own mind , manifest in his Writings . But this you do , not to advance Gods Glory , nor the Kings Honour , but your own cursed kingdom of darkness , which you hold by flattery and falshood . For , if this compelled worship ( which is not to God ) were taken away , then your kingdom would fall to Hell , from whence it came ; and therefore all men may here see it is supported only by wickedness . Ant. I confess the Kings Authority is earthly , but he is Head over the Church under Christ . Ch. God forbid that any mortal man should so equalize himself with Christ , who alone is Head of his Church , as the Husband is of the Wife , Eph. 5.23 . and hath left no Vice-gerent in that his Office , for he is never absent from his Church , Mat. 18.20 amd 28.20 . All that any mortal man can be , is to be a subject of his Kingdom ; for there is but one Lord , 1 Cor. 12.5 . and one Law-giver , Jam. 3.12 . And that this is so , his Majesty confirmeth by his own testimony , in his Apology for the Oath of Allegiance , pag. 46 , 47. But as I well allow of the Hyrarchy of the Church for distinction of Orders , ( for so I understand it ) so I utterly deny that there is any earthly Monarch thereof , whose word must be a Law , and who cannot erre in his sentence by an infallibility of spirit : because earthly Kingdoms must have earthly Monarchs , it doth not follow that the Church must have a visible Monarch top : For the World hath not one earthly temporal Monarch ; Christ is his Churches Monarch , and the Holy Ghost his Deputy . The Kings of the Gentiles reign over them , but ye shall not be so , Luk. 22.25 . Christ did not promise before his Ascension to leave Peter with them , to direct and instruct them in all things ; but he promised to send the Holy Ghost unto them for that end . These are his Highness own words , whereby it evidently appeareth his Majesty challengeth no supremacy over the Church , but laboureth to overthrow that abominable exaltation of that Man of Sin in the Romish Profession ; for Christ hath given no Supremacy in , or over his Church to any mortal man , but expresly commanded the contrary , as that place of Luke , mentioned by his Majesty , plainly declareth . His Highness is supream Head and Governour over all his Subjects Bodies and Goods within his Dominions , and therein I detest and abhor all forreign Powers whatsoever . But now for the thing in controversie betwixt you and me , of compelling men by Persecutions to do service to God ( as is pretended ) wherein they have not Faith : it shall be manifest not to be of God , in that Christ Jesus himself , the only Lord and Law-giver to the soul , neither had any such Power and Authority , neither taught any such thing to his Disciples , but the contrary . First , Mat. 28.18 , 19. All Power is given me in Heaven and in Earth ; Go therefore and teach all Nations . And 2 Cor. 10.4 . The weapons of our warfare are not carnal , but mighty through God , to cast down strong Holds , &c. Here we see Christ hath no worldly power , nor worldly weapons . Secondly , He practised and taught the contrary . When the Samaritans would not receive him going to Jerusalem , Luke 9. his Disciples would have had Fire come down from Heaven and devoured them , but Christ rebuked them , and said , Ye know not of what spirit ye are of : for the Son of man is not come to destroy mens lives , but to save them . And the Apostle by the Spirit of Christ , 2 Tim. 2.24 . commandeth the Servants of the Lord , not to strive ; but to be gentle towards all men , apt to teach , suffering the evil-men patiently ; instructing them with meekness that are contrary-minded ; proving , if God at any time will give them repentance , that they may know the truth , and come to amendment out of the Devils snare , &c. These Scriptures need no explanation for this most evident Truth . Ant. Well , yet notwithstanding all this , it is manifest in the Scriptures , by the Example of the Apostle Peter smiting Ananias and Saphira to death , Act. 5. and of the Apostle Paul striking Elymas the Sorcerer blind , Act. 13.11 . and also by delivering Hymeneus and Alexander unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh ; that punishment upon the body may be used , and the flesh destroyed : For if it were lawful for them to smite to death , and the like , though by extraordinary means , then it must be lawful for us by ordinary means , since extraordinary means now fail : If you say it be not lawful for us , then you must say it was not lawful for them , and that were to accuse them of laying a false foundation , which none fearing God will affirm . Ch. I dare not once admit of such a thought , as to disallow the truth of that Foundation which the Apostles , as skilfull Master-builders , have laid : But for your Argument of Peters extraordinary smiting of Ananias and Saphira , he neither laid hand upon them , nor threatned them by word , only declared what should befall them from God ; and therefore serveth nothing to your purpose . Also that of Paul to Elymas , he laid no hands upon him , but only declared the Lords hand upon him , and the judgment that should follow . If you can so pronounce , and it so come to pass upon any , do it , and then it may be you may be accounted Master-builders , and layers of a new foundation , or another Gospel . And for the Apostle Paul his delivering Hymeneus and Alexander unto Satan , 1 Tim. 1.20 . it was not by any temporal sword or power , but even by the Power of our Lord Jesus Christ , in his Name , by the sword of the Spirit , 1 Cor. 5.4 . And this was not extraordinary , but ordinary , to continue in all Churches to the end ; and not to destroy the outward man , as you teach and practise , but to destroy those lustful affections which dwell in the flesh , that so the flesh being mortified , the Spirit may be quickned , and the Soul saved in the day of the Lord Jesus . And whereas you say , that as they did it by extraordinary means so you may do it by ordirary means : If you would use only those weapons which Christ commanded his Disciples to use in this business , which are not carnal , we would agree with you herein ; but if your ordinary means be such as Christ never had , nor any of his Disciples , then it is a means of your own devising , for Christ hath all means whatsoever for bringing men to the obedience of the Truth . Ant. Doth not Christ in the Parable teach , that he compelled all to come in ? Ch. I demand of you , wherewith doth he compel them ? he hath no carnal weapons : Doth he not compel them by his Word , which is his two-edged Sword ? Heb. 4.12 . Rev. 2.12 . Doth he smite the Earth with any other weapons than by the breath of his lips ? Isa . 11.4 Ant. Well then , you see then compulsion may be used . Ch. Yes , I confess to you such compulsion as much as you will , if when you have done you will walk in his steps , who when the Gaderens prayed him to depart , he left them , and taught his Disciples where they should preach the Word of God , if they would not receive them , that they should shake off the dust of their feet for a witness against them , Mat. 10.14 . which accordingly they practised , Act. 13.51 . and 18.6 . &c. He never taught them to pull the contrary-minded out of their houses , and put them in Prisons , to the undoing of them , their wives and children : This was Saul's course when he was a Blasphemer and Persecutor , &c. Act. 9.1 , &c. Christ taught his Disciples to wait if at any time God would give the contrary-minded repentance , and not to prevent their repentance by seeking their blood . Indifferent man. I have heard you all this while , and by that I have heard , I see evidently that none ought to be compelled by any worldly means to worship God , neither can any be accepted in such worship , in that it is Spiritual Worship that he accepteth . Ch. Blessed be the Lord that you see it , I would not you only , but all men did see that the sword of the Magistrate , and all afflictions proceeding therefrom , are only upon the outward man , and connot convert a soul from going astray , not beget faith ; for , Faith comes by hearing the Word of God , Rom. 10.17 . and therefore is no instrument in this work . All that the Magistrate can do , is to compel me to bring my body ; for , except there be a willing mind , which no man can see , there is no acceptance with God ; and therefore it is not Gods Glory , nor my acceptance with him they seek by forcing me , but meerly their own Obedience , to God's great dishonour , and the destruction of my soul , if I should so do . But if it would suffice them to bring my body to that they call their Church , and require of me no worship : I will go when they will , only not when their false worship is performed . For I abhor the accursed Doctrine of the Familists herein . Indif . It is a lamentable thing to consider how many thousands in this Nation there be , that for fear of trouble submit to things in Religion which they disapprove of . Ch. Oh! whose eyes do not gush out with tears in the confideration thereof ? seeing in all that God is highly displeased and all those are under the Judgments of God everlastingly , if they repent not . Ant. If it were as you would have it , that all Religions should be suffered , how dangerous would it be to the Kings Person and State ? what Treacheries and Treasons would be plotted ? Indif . Indeed that is a thing greatly to be suspected : but if permission of all Religions could be cleared in that , there is no question but it might prevail with the King and State. Ch. If it be not cleared of that , then let all men abhor it . It is the Commandment of him , who is the God , not of confusion , but of Peace and Order , and therefore to be obeyed , Mat. 13.30 . Let the good and bad grow together unto the end of the world ; Suffering the contrary-minded patiently , proving , if God at any time will give them repentance that they may acknowledge the Truth , &c. First , for all those that seek and practise in themselves Reformation in Religion , Satan himself cannot task them with the least jot of Treachery : And for the Papists , may it not justly be suspected that one chief cause of all their Treasons hath been because of all the Compulsions that have been used against their Consciences , in compelling them to the Worship practised in publick , according to the Law of this Land ; which being taken away , there is no doubt but they would be much more peaceable ; as we see it verified in divers other Nations , where no such Compulsion is used : for , if they might have freedom in their Religion , unto their faithful Allegiance to the King , the fear of the Kings Laws , and their own Prosperity and Peace , would make them live more inoffensively in that respect . Indif . Only the Papists are dangerous , in that some of them hold , That the Kings and Princes that be Excommunicated by the Pope , may be deposed or murdered by their Subjects , or any other . Ch. For that damnable and accursed Doctrine , as we abhor it with our souls , so we desire all other may : and therefore all the Laws that can be made for the prevention of such execrable practices are most necessary . But now I desire all men to see , that the Bishops and we justly cry out against this accursed doctrine and practice in the Pope and his associates , That Princes should be murdered by their Subjects for contrary-mindedness in Religion , yet they teach the King to murder his Subjects for the self-same thing , viz. for being contrary-minded to them in their Religion . So likewise , as that accursed doctrine is to be abhorred in the Papists , who teach Subjects not to be obedient to their Princes that are excommunicated by the Pope : even so is that accursed doctrine of the Bishops to be abhorred , who teach Princes not to protect their Subjects that are excommunicated by them , in not affording them either Law or Justice , nor to bear Testimony in any Court , Do not the Bishops herein justifie this accursed doctrine and practice in the Papists ? Ant. There is a great difference in the persons , for the one are Princes , the other Subjects ; and Subjects must be obedient . Ch. Most true it is ; but is it not also true , that Princes must afford all their Subjects Justice and Equity , although they be as Heathens and Publicans ? For , if Princes be freed from doing Right and Justice , and protecting their Subjects that be excommunicated , why are not Subjects also freed from Subjection and Allegiance to their Princes , being excommunicated , if Excommunication be Christ's Law to all alike that will be saved , without respect of persons . And also , Is not that Law of Christ herein to be observed , That whatsoevr ye would men should do unto you , even so do ye unto them , Mat. 7.12 . And therefore , as Princes would that all their Subjects should be faithfull and obedient unto them ; so ought Princes to be just and equal to all their Subjects , in maintaining them in every just and equal cause between man and man : For , For this cause ( not for Religion ) saith the Apostle , the Saints at Rome payed Tribute to Caesar their Heathen Prince , who was against them in Religion . Shall they not escape Damnation for this accursed doctrine and practice , and think ye you shall ? Thou that judgest another , judgest thou not thy self ? By this it may appear , as also by exceeding many other doctrines and practices , how near you are to that bloody spiritual power , what pretences to the contrary soever you make . Ant. It were a lamentable thing if that bloody Religion should be practised again in this Nation . Ch. I acknowledge it a bloody Religion , but God hath cast down the Power thereof in this Kingdom , blessed be his Name : but I would you could see your own cruel bloody Religion ; But that God of his mercy hath restrained it by the Kings Majesty ( who thirsteth not after blood ) How many , only for seeking Reformation in Religion , have been put to death by your Power in the dayes of Qu. Elizabeth ? and how many , both then and since , have been consumed to death in Prisons ? Yea , since that cruel spiritual Power hath been set up , hath not Hanging , Burning , Exile , Imprisonments , and all manner of contempt been used , and all for Religion ? ( although some for grievous Errours ) and yet you see not this to be a bloody Religion . Further , You cry out of their bloody Cruelty ; the reason is , because you will not be of their Religion ; And when you have done , your selves are most bloody and cruel ( so far as is in your power ) because we , and all men will not not be of your Religion . Ant. If men hold Errors , and will not obey the Truth , do they not sin against God , and deserve punishment ? Ch. Yes , such deserve punishment , but God hath appointed their punishment , and the time thereof . Their punishment , Rom. 2.8 , 9. To them that are contentions , and disobey the Truth , and obey unrighteousness , shall be Indignation and Wrath , Tribulation and Anguish shall be upon the soul of every one that doth evil , Mark 16.16 . He that will not believe , shall be damned , 2 Thes . 1.8 . In flaming fire , rendring Vengeance unto them that know not God , and obey not the Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ ; which shall be punished with everlasting perdition from the Presence of the Lord , and the Glory of his Power . The time thereof is mentioned in the last recited place , ver . 7. When the Lord Jesus shall shew Himself from Heaven with his mighty Angels . And Rom. 2.5 . The day of Wrath. And ver . 16. At that day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ . And Mat. 13.40 , 41. At the end of this World the Son of man shall send forth his Angels , and they shall gather out of his Kingdom all things that offend , and them that do iniquity , and shall cast them into a furnace of Fire , &c. Here is shewed the Punisher , the Punishment , and the Time thereof . This Punisher hath commanded you to wait for their repentance ( by his own example ) which is in his hands to give them ; and not to cut them off , and send them to Hell , as you teach and practise , which is contrary to God , who is patient towards mockers , which walk after their own lusts , 2 Pet. 3.3 . Because he would have no man to perish , but would that all men whatsoever should come to repentance . But you ( contrary to Him ) use all means you can to cut men off that they might perish , in that you seek to destroy their bodies whilst they remain in their errors . Ant. I confess that God commandeth ( Matth. 13. ) that the good and bad must grow together unto the end of the World , but that is in the Church . Ch. Well , if that be the true exposition , I pray you why do you then excommunicate any out of your Church , contrary to your own acknowledgment ? And here let all men take notice , that by this Exposition you overthrow your own Excommunication quite , and accuse Christ for giving a Rule , Mat. 18. and the Apostle Paul , and the Church of Corinth for practising that Rule , 1 Cor. 5. in casting out of the Church : For you say , all must grow together to the end in the Church : But the Exposition of the Law-giver himself is against you , that the Field is the World , ver . 38. Yet in that you confess that the Wicked and the Godly must be let alone in the Church unto the end , then much more in the World unto the end : For , if the Wicked pollute not the Church , sure , it is they pollute not the World. This then you are commanded unto ver . 29 , 30. Nay , gather them not , let them grow together unto the end of the World. Ant. Let them come to Church , and they shall grow together unto the end . Ch. Indeed I think so . Hereby you manifest you regard not how wicked and ungodly men be ; so they come to your Church , you will not destroy them , though they remain in their abominable lusts : but if they will not come to your Church , let them be Wheat or Tares , you will gather them , and ( as much as in you is ) send them to burning . Herein all men may see , as I said before , that you seek your own Glory and Obedience , and not Gods , and so exalt your selves above God , 2 Thess . 2. Indif . Well , I bless God , I see this as clearly as the Sun shining in his brightness , That it is to fight against God to compel any , contrary to their consciences , to perform any service unto Him , in that there are so many places of Scripture commanding the contrary . Ch. The whole New Testament throughout in all the Doctrines and Practices of Christ and his Disciples , teach no such thing as compelling men by Persecutions and Afflictions to obey the Gospel , but the direct contrary , viz. to suffer at the hands of the wicked ; when they were persecuted for Righteousness sake , to suffer it ; when the unbelievers and wicked curse them , to bless , and pray for their repentance , and that God would forgive them , and never lay these sins to their charge , as our Saviour , Luke 23.34 . Stephen , Act. 7.60 . and the rest did . And for a conclusion of this point , that your Faith may be full herein , consider , that we are to wait for the Jews Conversion , and not to destroy them . Indif . It is true , that might give all men satisfaction in these things . Ch. Oh yes , if men had any regard of God or his Word , they would never deal more in this thing : the Lord , we see , Rom. 11. hath promised , That when the fulness of the Gentiles is come in , the Jews shall be converted . Now if the Jews , who are such fearful Blasphemers of Christ and his Gospel , that contemn him and his Testament with all despite , if their Conversion must be waited for , that they may not be destroyed from off the face of the Earth , then who may not see ( if they shut not their eyes ) that the Conversion of all is to be waited for ? and , that no man for blaspheming Christ and his Gospel may be destroyed , or afflicted by Imprisonments , Death , or any Calamity whatsoever . Indif . It is not to be gain-sayed with any shew of truth . I would God the Kings Majesty would consider of this point , seeing that the cruel Bishops , by using his Power , commit such sin against God in this thing , both in persecuting them that cannot in faith yeeld , and also in forcing them that do yeeld , contrary to their consciences , to sin against God , and to perish , if they repent not . Ch. I am perswaded , that if his Highness did but once well weigh and consider it , he would never suffer such high iniquity to be committed against God , contrary to his express Commandment , and all to be done by the King's Power , for nothing have they else to bear them out . The Lord perswade the hearts of his Majesty and his posterity unto it , seeing his Throne is established by him , that he and his Posterity may sit and reign over these Nations and Kingdoms , till Jesus Christ the Commander of these things , come in his Glory to recompence every man according to his works , without respect of persons . Ant. If wicked Malefactors should be let alone to the end of the World , then where is the Magistrates Sword ? it is of no force if evil men may not be cut off . Ch. I acknowledge unfeignedly , that God hath given to Magistrates a Sword to cut off wicked men , and to reward the well-doers , Rom. 13. But this Ministry is a worldly Ministry , their Sword is a worldly Sword , their punishments can extend no further than the outward man ; they can but kill the body , Luke 12.4 . And therefore this Ministry and Sword is appointed only to punish the breach of worldly Ordinances , which is all that God hath given to any mortal man to punish . The King may make Laws for the safety and good of his Person , State , and Subjects , against the which whosoever is disloyal or disobedient , he may dispose of them at his pleasure ; the Lord hath given him this Sword and Authority , fore-seeing in his Eternal Wisdom , that if this his Ordinance of Magistracy were not , there would be no living for men in the world , and especially for the Godly ; and therefore the Godly have particular cause to glorifie God for this his blessed Ordinance of Magistracy , and to regard it with all reverence , But now , the breach of Christs Laws , of the which we all this while speak , which is the thing only I stand upon ; His Kingdom is spiritual , his Laws spiritual , the Transgressions spiritual , the Punishment spiritual ; everlasting Death of Soul ; his Sword spiritual : no carnal or worldly weapon is given to the supportation of his Kingdom , nor to punish the Transgressors of the Laws of this Kingdom : The Law-giver himself hath commanded that the Transgressors of these Laws should be let alone until the harvest ; because he knows , they that are now Tares , may hereafter come to repentance , and become Wheat : they that are now Blasphemers , Persecutors and Oppressors , as Paul was , may by the power of Gods Word become Faithful , and a faithful Witness , as he was : They that are now Fornicators , &c. as some of the Corinthians once were , 1 Cor. 6.9 . may hereafter become washed , clensed , and sanctified , as they were : They that are now no People , nor under Mercy , as the Saints sometimes were , 1 Pet. 2.10 . may hereafter become the People of God , and obtain Mercy , as they did : All come not at the first hour , some come not till the eleventh hour ; if those that come not till the last hour should be destroyed , because they came not at the first hour , then should they never come , but be prevented . Ant. Were not Blasphemers put to death in time of the Law ? Lev. 24.11 , &c. Ch. Yes , an Israelite blaspheming the Lord , or doing any thing presumptuously , which was Blasphemy , Numb . 15.30 . no Sacrifice was to be offered for him : But would you from hence have the Kings Majesty put all his Subjects to death that contemn the Truth of Christ ? If yea , see what will follow . All Papists ought to be put to death , who are direct Blasphemers , Rev. 16.10 , 11. When the Vial of Gods Wrath was poured upon the Throne of the Beast , ( which all England confess is meant the Popish Power ) they blasphemed the God of Heaven , &c. All the Jews , that speak many things blasphemously against Christ , ought to be put to death : Yea , of what Profession soever he be , doing any thing presumptuously against Christ , ought to be put to death by your Affirmation ; no Sacrifice to be offered , no Repentance to be admitted , dye he must under two or three Witnesses . But that this is most false , Christ and his Apostles in his Testament do manifestly declare , as is before shewed . Was not Paul a Blasphemer ? yet received to mercy . But this the holy Ghost teacheth from Blasphemy under the Law , Heb. 10.28 . He that despised Moses Law , died without mercy , under two or three Witnesses : Of how much sorer punishment suppose ye , shall he be thought worthy , that treadeth under foot the Son of God , and counteth the Blood of the Testament as an unholy thing , wherewith he was sanctified , and doth despite to the Spirit of Grace ? speaking of such as had received and acknowledged the Truth , ver . 26. This is now the due proportion , an Israelite according to the flesh , in the time of the Law presumptuously sinning against Gods Commandment , by his Command must die by the worldly Sword , no Sacrifice was to be offered for him : So in the New Testament , or time of the Gospel , a spiritual Israelite according to the Faith , contemptuously or despitefully sinning against Christs Commands , which he hath formerly acknowledged , despiting and contemning them , by his Command must die by the spiritual Sword , no repentance to be admitted , seeing he crucifieth again to himself the Son of God , and makes a mock of him , Heb. 6.6 . David and Peter came not within this compass ; though they sinned of knowledge , yet they did it not contemptuously or despitefully , but through frailty . If an Israelite under the Law did ought through ignorance , as Numb . 15. or through frailty , as Levit. 6. there was Sacrifice for him : So under the Gospel , an Israelite doing ought through ignorance , or through frailty , as Peter and Barnabas , with the rest of the Jews , mentioned Gal. 2. or the Incestuous Person , 1 Cor. 5. there is Repentance for him . This is it that confounds all true Religion ; That because it was so in the time of the Law , therefore it may be so in the time of the Gospel : by which reason men might set up as truly the whole Law , as some part , and utterly abolish Christ . I pray you seriously consider what is here said . Ant. Hath not the King the same Power that the Kings of Israel had , who compelled men to the observation of the Law of God ? Ch. First , I answer you : That the Kings of Israel had never power from God to set up any thing in or for the the service of God , but that only which was commanded by God , Deut. 4.2 . no , not so much as the manner of any Law , Numb . 15.16 . and 9.14 . and therefore this will not serve your purpose , that Kings may set up within their Dominions such spiritual Lords and Laws for the serving of God ; no , nor the manner thereof , as may best please themselves , under what pretence soever ; thereby making God for his Worship subject to their pleasures . And his Majesty acknowledgeth that Christs Church after the establishing of it by miracles in the primitive time , was ever after to be governed within the limits of his revealed will. Speech at Parliam . Anno 1609. Secondly , the Kings of Israel might compel men to the Sacrifices and Ordinances of the Old Testament , all which were carnal , and purged not the conscience , Heb. 9.9 , 10. as Circumcision , the Passeover , &c. But no mortal man , whatsoever he be , can compel any man to offer the Sacrifices of the New Testament , which are spiritual , and purge the conscience , except he can beget Faith in him , and convert his soul . The Ordinances of the Old Testament were to be performed by the posterity of Abraham according to the flesh , that thereby they might be taught Christ : but the Ordinances of the New Testament are to be performed only by the posterity of Abraham according to Faith , that have learned Christ , and have put on Christ , and so having Him , all things else appertain unto them . But one thing I demand of you , Who now is King of Israel ? Ant. I confess CHRIST is King of Israel . Ch. Yes , CHRIST alone is King of Israel , that sits upon Davids Throne , and therefore mark the true proportion : In the time of the Old Testament the Kings of Israel had power from God to compel all to the Ordinances of God , or to cut them off by their Sword from the earthly Land of Canaan , and the Promises thereof : So in the New Testament the King of Israel , Christ Jesus , hath power from the Father to compel all to the Ordinances of God , or to cut them off by his Sword from the heavenly Land of Canaan , and the Promises thereof . The Kings of Israel only had this power under the Law , and the King of Israel only hath this power under the Gospel : And therefore whosoever will challenge this power under the Gospel , he must be the King of Israel in the time of the Gospel , which is peculiar only to Jesus Christ , unto whom all Power in Heaven and Earth is given . And let it be here well observed , that by this opinion of yours you make the Kingdom and Ordinances of Israel under the Law , and the Kingdom & Ordinances of Israel under the Gospel all one ; directly contrary to the whole Scripture : for the Kingdom and Ordinances of Israel under the Law were of this world , but the Kingdom and Ordinances of Israel under the Gospel are not of this world , as Christ the King thereof himself testifieth , John 28. And therefore you setting up a worldly King over this Heavenly Kingdom and Ordinances , you and all of your Profession declare your selves to be of that worldly Kingdom , and so to look for that Heavenly and Spiritual King yet to come in the flesh ; being of the number of those that deny Him to be come in the flesh , and so are Deceivers and Antichrists , whatsoever you say to the contrary . Ant. Well , yet I cannot see , but that as the Kings of Israel had power from God to compel all their Subjects to the Worship then appointed ; so the King , being a Christian King , hath power to compel his Subjects to the Worship now appointed . Ch. You may see , if you shut not your eyes , that what power the Kings of Israel had under the Law in matters of Religion , Christ Jesus the King of Israel hath under the Gospel : but I pray let me ask you this Question , you say the Kings Majesty hath this power as he is a Christian King : my Question is , Whether it appertain unto him as he is a King , or as he is a Christian ? Ant. Neither simply as he is a King , nor as he is a Christian , but joyntly as he is compleat in them both : for I grant that no Heathen King hath power to compel in matters of Religion , but a Christian King hath . Ch. Then you confess that if a Christian King may be deprived of his Christianity , ( for of his Kingdom or Kingly Power , or any part thereof , I affirm he may not be deprived ) he hath lost this power you plead for , in compelling men in matters of Religion : What say you to this ? Ant. I confess if he may be deprived of his Christianity , he hath not this power I plead for . Ch. Then I demand this Question , Whether every Christian , without respect of persons , ought not to be subject to Christs Laws for his Salvation ? Ant. Yes , it cannot be denyed . Ch. Christ hath given his censure , Excommunication , for the Salvation of every Christian , That he that will not hear the Church , is to be as a Heathen and a Publican ; that is , hath lost all right and title in Christ , and in his Church , till he repent . Now I know it cannot be denyed , but every Christian whatsoever is subject to sin , and so to Excommunication , to be as an Heathen , &c. If you say , that Kings either are not subject to sin , and to impenitency therein , and so not to this censure of Christ , of Excommunication for their impenitent sin ; then consider what you make them , and God you make a lyer . If you grant ( as you cannot deny ) that Kings as well as others , are subject to impenitent sin , and so to Excommunication for the same ; then they being deprived of their Christianity , by your own confession , they are deprived of power to compel in matters of Religion , the which , if it were any part of their Kingly Power , they might be deprived of a part of their Kingly Power by being excommunicated . Consider what a wicked doctrine you teach herein . Ant. Doth not the Prophet say , That Kings shall be Nursing Fathers , and Queens Nursing Mothers to the Church ? And also it is said , that Kings shall hate the Whore , make her desolate , eat her flesh , and burn it with fire . Where we see , that Kings that have power and authority , shall destroy Antichrists Kingdom , and nourish and cherish Christs Kingdom . Ch. Most true it is , the Lord hath spoken it , and therefore it ought to be a great comfort to Gods People : but what is this to the purpose in hand , namely , That Kings may persecute the contrary-minded . The words of the Prophet Isaiah prove , that Kings and Queens that have formerly persecuted and destroyed the Church , their hearts shall be turned by the power of Gods Word , to be lovers and preservers of the Church . And the other place , Rev. 17.16 . proves , that Kings shall make that Whore desolate , &c. not by their temporal Authority or Sword ( as some say , that make more shew of Religion than you do , although themselves be now persecuted , yet , if Kings were of their minds , would be as cruel as you , for they maintain the same thing ) but by the Spirit of the Lords mouth , and the Brightness of his coming , 2 Thess . 2.8 . For this kingdom of Antichrist shall be destroyed without hand , Dan. 8. 25. only by the Everlasting Gospel , the true Armour indeed , wherewith the Witnesses fight against the Antichrist . As the Kings Majesty , acknowledgeth , Apol. pag. 93. Ant. You are so stiff against using of outward weapons in Church matters , Did not our Saviour make a Whip of small cords , and whip the Buyers and Sellers out of the Temple ? And why may not we follow his example ? Ch. In this and many other actions of Christ our Saviour , we are to consider him as the fulfiller and ender of the Law ; as in the action of the Passover , and sending him that was clensed of his Leprosie , to offer to the Priest the gift that Moses commanded ; in which things we are not to imitate him ; for by him the Ceremonies are fulfilled and abolished , and the everlasting Gospel established , in the which we are to walk : and it were more than foolish to reason thus : Christ whipped wicked men out of Gods Temple made with hands , with whips made of cord ; therfore we may whip wicked men out of Gods Temple made without hands , with whips made of cord . There is a wholsom doctrine to be collected from the Type to the Truth , as thus : Christ drove out wicked men out of the Temple made with hands , by a carnal or worldly whip ; So Christ ( by his People ) must drive wicked men out of the Temple made without hands , by a Spiritual whip , even his Word , which is called a Whip or Rod. Rev. 2 27. and Psal . 2.9 . So is Excommunication , 1 Cor. 4.21 . Ant. If freedom of Religion should be granted , there would be such Divisions as would breed Sedition and Innovasion in the State. Ch. Thus when your shews out of the Scripture are answered , then you run to conceits and imaginations , of Sedition , Innovasion , and the like , thinking thereby to disswade Princes , and all that are in authority therefrom , knowing else your kingdom of iniquity would fall . But that it may appear to all that you deal deceitfully herein , let us consider first the Scriptures ; secondly , behold the success , of suffering of Religion free in other Countries . And first , Christ our Saviour ( who is that Prince of Peace , Isa . 9.6 . not of Sedition ) hath taught , Mat. 10 , and Luk. 12. That he came not to send Peace on the earth , but Debate ; to divide five in one house , two against three , and three against two ; the father against the son , &c. And a mans enemies shall be they of his own houshold : And his desire is , that the fire of such Sedition should be kindled . Where we see , this Prince of Peace putteth difference in Religion by preaching his Gospel , which some receive as the savour of life unto them ; others refuse it , and so become enemies unto the Truth , and witnesses thereof , as they did to Christ Jesus himself and his Disciples , and as you do to me and others . Secondly , behold the Nations where freedom of Religion is permitted , and you may see there are not more flourishing and prosperous Nations under the Heavens than they are . Indif . The Convocation of Bishops , and the rest , have made a Canon , That whosoever shall affirm that the Kings Majesty hath not the same power in Causes Ecclesiastical under the Gospel , that the godly Kings of Israel had under the Law , let him be excommunicated , ipso facto . Ch. Yes , they have so . In the beginning of his Majesties Reign , when they had gotten him sure unto them , of the which they so much doubted , as with my own ears I heard some of their chief followers say , when his Highness was coming into England : Now must Steeples down , and we shall have no more High Commission ! ( with a lamentation they spake it ) then they made this Canon ; because their consciences are convinced , that they stand only by his Power , and if his hand be turned , their spiritual power of darkness falleth to the pit of darkness , from whence it came , and whither it must go , though there be never so much means used for the supporting of it ; for the strong Lord hath spoken it , Revel . 18. As for their sending men to Hell ( as they suppose ) with their ipso facto Excommunications ; if they had no stronger weapons for the supportting of their kingdom , it would stand but a short space . If Israel now were of this world , as it was under the Law , then they said something ; but if it be not of this world , as it is not , John 17.14 . then the King of Israel is not of this world ; for when this King came , the worldly Israel knew him not . Indif . I see evidently , that all are but cavels , and that no mortal man can make any man offer Sacrifices under the New Testament , until he be a Believer and converted ; for he must be in Christ before he may offer Sacrifices ; for in Christ only the Father accepteth us . But what say you , Have they not power to compel men to come to the place where the Word is publickly taught , that they may be converted ? Ch. Well , then you see that the example of the Kings of Israel ( who had power to compel them to Sacrifice , or to cut them off ) applyed to earthly Princes , is gone , as a meer doctrine of man , and not of God. And for compelling men to hear , that they may be converted ; we can learn of no better than of Him , who if we hear not we shall have a dreadfull recompence . He had all power in Heaven and in Earth for converting souls given unto him , and sent his Disciples , as his Father sent him , Joh. 20.21 . charging them that when they should come into a City , &c. if they would not receive them nor their Word , to shake off the dust of their feet for a witness against them , saying , it should be easier for Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of Judgment than for that City or house . And so the Apostles went from City to City accordingly . Here were no Temples made with hands , nor worldly power to compel all to come unto them to hear the Word of the Lord , but they were commanded to go from City to City , and from house to house . Indif . In those dayes the Magistrates were Vnbelievers , but the question is where Magistrates are Believers . Ch. Christ had all power needful for that work : if Magistracy were a power needful for that work , then Christ had not all power ; Magistracy is Gods blessed Ordinance in its right place , but let not us be wiser than God to devise him a means for the publishing of his Gospel , which He that had all power had not , nor hath commanded . Magistracy is a power of this world ; the Kingdom , Power , Subjects and means of publishing the Gospel are not of this world . Ant. A goodly thing indeed that men must go about the Country to preach . Ch. In your estimation it is base and contemptible ; your Pomp and Pride will not bear this ; it is more easie for you to hunt after Promotion till you come to the highest , in getting to be chief Bishop of Bishops within these Dominions , and then cometh your fall , full low , if you repent not : But the wisdom of God hath appointed the chiefest Officers of Christs Kingdom , even the Apostles , thus basely to go up and down to and fro to preach the Gospel ; yea , that worthy Apostle Paul preached this Gospel night and day with many tears openly and throughout every house , Act. 20. Indif . But if this be thus , as for my own part I am fully perswaded it is , then I see the High Commission cannot stand ; for , as I take it , it is only for Causes Ecclesiastical . Ch. So far as it is over Church-matters , it is most unlawful : for the Commission for judging and punishing of the transgressors of the Laws of Christs Church is given to Christ the Monarch thereof , a part whereof he hath left to his Disciples , which is no worldly Commission or Power , but only the Power of the Lord Jesus , the uttermost of which Commission is Excommunication , 1 Cor. 5. Ant. The High Commission is from the King , and dare you once call it into question ? Ch. If I do take any authority from the Kings Majesty , let me be judged worthy my desert ; but if I defend the Authority of Christ Jesus over mens souls , which appertaineth to no mortal man whatsoever , then know you , that whosoever would rob him of that Honour , which is not of this world , he will tread them under foot : Earthly Authority belongeth to earthly Kings , but spiritual Authority belongeth to that one spiritual King , who is KING of Kings . Ant. Well , all your pleading will not serve your turn , either you must come to Church , or else go to Prison . Ch. I have shewed you by the Law of Christ that your course is most wicked , to compel any by Persecution to perform any service to God ( as you pretend . ) Now I desire also to shew you , that the Statute Law of the Land requireth only civil obedience , and his Majesties Writings , maintaining the Oath of Allegiance , testifie the same . The Law of the Land requireth , that whosoever cometh not to Church , or receiveth not the Sacraments , the Oath of Allegiance is to be tendred to them , which , that it may be manifest to all , that not only I , but all that profess the Faith with me , are most willing to subscribe unto it in faithfulness and truth , I have thought good to express it . The words of the Oath , Anno 3 , Jacobi Regis . I A. B , do truly and sincerely acknowledge , profess and testifie , and declare in my conscience before God and the World , That our sovereign Lord King James is lawful King of this Realm , and of all other his Majesties Dominions and Countries ; And than the Pope neither of himself , nor by any other Authority of the Church or Sea of Rome , or by any other means with any other , hath any Power or Authority to depose the King , or to dispose of any his Majesties Kingdoms or Dominions , or to authorize any forreign Prince to invade or annoy him or his Countries , or to discharge any of his Subjects of their Allegiance and Obedience to his Majesty ; or to give licence or leave to any of them to bear Arms , raise Tumults , or to offer any violonce or hurt to his Majesties Royal Person , State or Government , or any of his Majesties Subjects within his Majesties Dominions . Also I do swear from my heart , that notwithstanding any Declaration or Sentence of Excommunication , or Deprivation made or granted , or to be made or granted by the Pope or his Successors , or by any Authority derived , or pretended to be derived from him or his Sea , against the said King , his Heirs or Successors , or any Absolution of the said Subjects from their Obedience , I will bear Faith and true Allegiance to his Majesty , his Heirs and Successors , and him and them will defend to the uttermost of my power against all Conspiracies and Attempts whatsoever which shall be made against his or their Persons , their Crown and Dignity , by reason or colour of any such Sentence or Declaration or otherwise , and will do my best endeavour to disclose and make known unto his Majesty , his Heirs and Successors , all Treasons and traiterous Conspiracies , which I shall know or hear of , to be against him or any of them . And I do further swear , that I do from my heart abhor , detest and abjure , as impious and heretical , this damnable doctrine and position , That Princes which be Excommunicated or deprived by the Pope , may be deposed or murdered by their Subjects , or any other whatsoever . And I do believe , and in conscience am resolved , that neither the Pope , nor any person whatsoever , hath power to absolve me of this Oath , or any part thereof , which I acknowledge by good and full Authority to be lawfully ministred to me , and do renounce all Pardons and Dispensations to the contrary . And all these things I do plainly and sincerely acknowledge and swear , according to these express words by me spoken , and according to the plain and common sense and understanding of the same words , without any equivocation , or mental evasion , or secret reservation whatsoever . And I do make this Recognition and Acknowledgment heartily , willingly and truly , upon the true Faith of a Christian . So help me God. Ant. This Oath was intended for the Papists , and not for you . Ch. It is not so : for his Majesty at the last Session of Parliam . Anna 1609 , saith thus ; Some doubts have been conceived anent the using of the Oath of Allegiance ; and that part of the Act that ordains the taking thereof is thought so obscure , that no man can tell who ought to be pressed therewith , &c. And therefore if there be any scruple touching the ministring thereof , I would wish it now to be cleared , &c. And thereupon this Statute was made , Anno 7. Regni Regis Iacobi , &c. Chap. 6. towards the latter end . And if any person or persons whatsoever of , or above the age of eighteen years , do now stand , or at any time hereafter shall stand , and be presented , indicted , and convicted for not coming to Church , or receiving the Lords Supper , according to the Laws and Statutes of this Realm , before the Ordinary , or any other having power to take such Presentments or Indictments ; or if the Minister , petty Constable or Church-wardens , or any two of them , shall at any time hereafter complain to any Justice of Peace near adjoyning the place where any person complained of shall dwell , and the said Justice shall find cause of suspition ; that then any one Justice of Peace , within whose Commission or Power any such person or persons shall at any time hereafter be , or to whom complaint shall be made , shall upon notice thereof require such person or persons to take the said Oath . And that if any person or persons being of the age of eighteen years or above , shall refuse to take the said Oath , duly tendered unto him or her , according to the true intent and meaning of this Statute , that then the persons authorized by this Law to give the said Oath , shall and may commit the said Offender to the common Jayl , &c. Where we see , that if any take the said Oath at their first apprehension , they are not to be committed , or if they , being committed , take the said Oath at the next open Court , they are be set at liberty ; if they will not take the said Oath , to be in a Premunire , as is at large in the Statute declared , and as is daily practised with Papists and others . Ant. The Kings Majesty requireth your Allegiance to be testified by your coming to Church . Ch. I pray let me demand this Question ; Doth the King require my coming to Church to worship and serve God , or to worship and serve the King ? If to worship and serve the King , I am ready to obey ; if to worship and serve God , which none can do but of conscience , the King himself saith he never intended to lay any thing to the charge of any for the cause of conscience ; and this coming to Church being a cause of conscience , if not he , why do you lay any thing to my charge for the same ? And therefore you wrong his Majesty in thus affirming ; for his Highness requireth only my faithful allegiance to be testified by the aforesaid Oath , and therefore hath ordained it , as I shall shew by his Highness own testimony . If I should come to Church , and not in conscience , but for other respects , as many Papists and other Hypocrites do , to God it were most abominable ; and what faithfulness can be hoped for in such towards , his Majesties Person and State ? Can any godly wise man think that he that playeth the dissembling Hypocrite with God , that he will do less with men , and will not work any villany , if it were in his power ? and therefore herein you compelling me by tyranny , to bring my body whereunto my spirit cannot be brought , you compel me to hypocrisie with God and man : for if my heart were not faithfull in sincerity to his Majesties Crown and Dignity , as I take God to witness ( before whom I must be condemned or justified ) it is , these courses would rather harden my heart to work villany than otherwise . Now for his Majesties many Testimonies in his Writings , they are worthy to be recorded with thankfulness to the Highest for guiding his heart and pen to write such things . In his apology for the Oath of Allegiance pag 4 , he saith ( speaking of such Papists as took the Oath of Allegiance ) And I gave a good proof that I intended no Persecution against them for conscience cause , but only desired to be secured of them for evil obedience , which for conscience cause they were bound to perform . And pag. 60. ( speaking of Blackwel the Arch-Priest ) he saith , I never intended to lay any thing to the said Arch-Priests charge ( as I have never done to any ) for cause of conscience . And pag. 127. he saith , First , for the cause of their punishment , I do constantly maintain that which I said in my Apology , That no man , either in my time , or in the late Queens , ever dyed here for his conscience : for , let him be never so devout a Papist ; nay , though he profess the same never so constantly , his life is in no danger by the Law , if he break not out into some outward act expresly against the words of the Law ; or plot not some dangerous or unlawful practice or attempt , &c. Where we may see in short what is the whole sum that he requireth . And in his Majesties Speech at the last Session of Parliament , Anno Dom. 1609. where he saith he sheweth his Subjects his heart , he saith thus ; I never found , that blood , and too much severity , did good in matters of Religion : for , besides , it is a sure Rule in Divinity , that God never loves to plant his Church by violence and bloodshed , natural reason may even perswade us , and daily experience proves it true , that when men are severely persecuted for Religion , the gallantness of many mens spirits , and the wilfulness of their humours , rather than the justness of their cause makes them take a pride boldly to endure any torments , or death it self , to gain thereby the reputation of Martyrdom , though but in a false shadow . A most undoubted Truth ; which if be , ( as most manifest it is by the Testimony of the holy Ghost throughout Christs Testament , as before is proved ) then how cursed are all the rank of you that continually break this sure Rule of God , thus confidently acknowledge by his Majesty , planting your Church by violence and bloodshed , forcing many thousands against their consciences to be of your Church , and to receive your Sacraments , by all the persecutions that would follow if they do not yeeld ; and those that fear God more than men , and dare not yeeld , casting them into noisom Prisons , amongst most wicked Blasphemers of God , to the wounding of their souls , dividing them from their Wives , Children and Families , and from their Callings , some an hundred miles and more , utterly consuming that substance they have , which sustaineth the blood of them , their Wives and Children ; seldom or never affording them Release , but either by yeelding to you against their consciences , or else by consuming their bodies to death in Prison , Banishment , or the like , leaving them and their Wives to horrible temptations of Adultery , by parting them and their Wives , and to all manner of evil , in taking them from their Callivgs , and so leaving them in continual Idleness . Is Gods Church thus planted ? or , do Christs Disciples thus plant ? Indif . Oh I see this spiritual power is little inforiour cruelty to the Romish spiritual power : I pray how , or when was this set up . Ch. Henry the eight casting off Pope Clement the seventh , and so the Popes Power , anno 1534 , set up this Spiritual Power under him . See Acts and Mon. pag. 1201 , &c. Indif . I pray you shew the likeness between these two spiritual powers . Ch. I will do my best endeavour , which is but small . First , the Romish spiritual Power doth make Laws to the Conscience , and compel all thereunto by Excommunication , Imprisonment , Banishment , Death , and the like . This Spiritual Power doth the like , upon the like penalties , as all know . The Romish Power doth give Titles to his Ministers , which are the Titles of God and Christ , as spiritual Lords , great Bishop , and many more . This spiritual Power doth the like , as all know . The Romish Power doth set up Lords over their Brethren in spiritual things , unto whom they command Honour , and great Livings to be given , great Pomp and Pride . This Power doth the like , as all know . I shall not need to speak of this , in that all Books are full , and all Consciences ( except those that are seared with hot irons ) convinced hereof . Let but Mr. Fox , or any others , who have described the spiritual Power Rome , let but their Description thereof be compared with this spiritual Power , in all their Laws , Courts , Titles , Pomp , Pride and Cruelty , and you shall see them very little differ , except in their Cruelties , which ( glory be to God ) the Kings Majesty , who thirsteth not after blood , hath something restrained ; although it is most grievous Cruelty to lye divers years in most noisom and filthy Prisons , and continual temptations of Want , their Estates overthrown , and never coming out ( many of them ) till death ; let it be well weighed , and it is little inferiour to the cruel sudden death in times of the Romish Power in this Nation . Indif . It is very apparant it is that image or similitude of that Beast spoken of , Revel . 13. Ch. Oh yes , for there is no such Image of the Popish Power under the Heavens as this . Well , our comfort is , the strong Lord hath said , The Kings of the Earth ( by whose Power both the Beast and his Image is supported ) shall take their Power from her , then shall she stand naked and desolate : And to this purpose his Majesty hath a worthy Exhortation to all Princes , &c. in his Apologie , pag. 103. The words are these : For as she did fly but with feathers , borrowing as well her Titles of greatness , and forms of honouring her from You , as also enjoying all her Temporal Livings by your liberalities : so if every man do but take his own again , she will stand up naked &c. Oh that the words of God might be accepted of his Majesty , set down by the holy Ghost , Rom. 2. Thou that teachest another , teachest thou not thy self ? For , if he would take but his own , their Titles of Greatness , and forms of honouring them , and their Temporal Livings , this Spiritual Power would stand very naked and desolate . Indif . Well , the hears of Kings are in the hands of the Lord , and he can turn them as the Rivers of waters : but I desire your advice for my own estate : I know every one must bear their own burden , I have a long time remained subject to this Spiritual Power , partly through ignorance , and partly through fear . Ch. I will first declare into you the Judgments of God against such as submit thereunto , that so from an utter abhorring thereof you may come out , never to return thither again . Secondly , I will do the best I can to shew you the way the Lord requireth you to walk in , and that only out of his Word . The Judgments are so fearful as I tremble to think of them , greater than which is not manifested in the whole Book of God , Rev. 14.9 , 10 , 11 , And the third Angel followed them , saying with a loud voice , If any man worship the Beast and his Image , and receive his Mark in his forehead , or on his hand , the same shall drink of the Wine of the Wrath of God , yea , of the pure Wine that is poured into the Cup of his Wrath ; he shall be tormented in Fire and Brimstone before the holy Angels , and before the Lamb. And the smoak of their torments shall ascend evermore , and they shall have no rest day nor night , which worship the Beast and his Image , and whosoever receiveth the print of his name . Indif . I confess these Judgments are to be trembled at ; but how do you apply them properly to such as worship in these Assemblies ? Ch. For the satisfaction of all consciences herein , that it may appear plainly , not to be gain-said , let us consider the words of Wisdom , set down in order as they lye . And first , what is meant by Worship . 2ly , what is meant by the Beast . 3ly , what his Image is . 4ly , what his Mark is . And lastly , what is meant by Forehead or Hand . And first , for Whorship . It is plentifully manifested in the Scriptures , that it is Service , Subjection , or Obedience to such things as are commanded by God , or others , as Mat 4.10 . Exod. 20.5 . Deut. 13.4 . and therefore his servants we are whom we obey , Rom. 6.16 . and as the Lord saith , If I be your Master , where is my fear ? if a Father , where is mine honour or worship ? Mal. 1.6 . Secondly , by Beast , the Scripture speaketh sometimes of cruel men in power and authority ; as Dan. 7.17 . Luke 13.31 , 32. 2 Tim. 4.17 . Sometimes of a blasphemous Spiritual Power exercised by men , received of the Dragon exalting it self above God , making war with the Saints , and overcoming them ; and that hath power over every Kindred , and Tongue , and Nation , so that all that dwell upon the Earth worship him , &c. And this is the Beast here spoken of , even that Spiritual Power of Jurisdiction of Rome , which first wrought in a mystery , and by degrees was exalted , till at last it was exalted to this cruel Beast , described Revel . 13.1 , &c. which Beast openeth his mouth to Blasphemy against God , saying and practizing , that the Commandments that God hath given for his Service , are not to be regarded , but instead thereof , setteth up Commands of his own , unto which whosoever will not be subject , Excommunication and all cruelty , even unto Death , will ensue , yea even with Gunpowder ere it fail : and for this his cruelty he is called a Beast . Thirdly , By Image is meant any form , shape similitude , or resemblance of the thing spoken of , as Deut. 4.15 , 16 , &c. Exod. 20.4 . so that wheresoever such a spiritual power is , as this above described , there is the Beasts Image , as in England : the like Power or Beast to the first , is not to be found under the Heavens , in exaltation and cruelty . Fourthly , By Mark , is meant Profession or Practice , whereby we are know from others , as Mat. 7.20.1 Joh. 2.3 . Joh. 13.35 . As Badges of Marks do put difference between this mans and that mans , in cattel or servants , as by such a mans Mark we know these are his Sheep , and by such a mans Badg we know this man belongeth to such a great man : so they are said to have put on Christ , that have received his Baptism , Gal. 3.27 . even as a servant is known by putting on his Livery . Lastly , Forehead or Hand ; the holy Ghost useth that phrase from the Old Testament , where Gods People were commanded , not only to lay up his Commands in their hearts and in their souls , but to bind them for a sign upon their hands , that they might be as frontlets between their eyes , Deut. 11.18 . and 6.6 , 8. the Wisdom of God therein teaching , that the Forehead and Hand are the apparantest parts of the body , to the view of all men : so that to receive the Mark in the Forehead or Hand , is to make manifest Profession of him we obey . The sum of all which is , that whosoever openly professeth obedience and subjection to that spiritual cruel power of Rome , the Beast , or to that spiritual cruel power of England , his Image , ( wheresoever they or either of them are exalted ) such a one , and such persons shall drink of the Wine of Gods wrath , and be tormented in fire and brimstone , and shall have no rest day nor night for evermore . Indif . Your description of the Beast the Papists will deny , so will the English Lord Bishops and their followess , deny your description of his Image ; but thousands will grant both : and some will deny both , as the Familists , who say , that Religion standeth not in outward things , and therefore they will submit to any outward service , and they that do not so , but suffer persecution ( say they ) are justly persecuted . Ch. Those Enemies to the Cross of Christ are most of them not worth information , because for the most part they are such as do with an high hand sin after enlightning , having forsaken the way wherein they walked , because they would not bear Christs Cross ; but in that some simple souls may be seduced by them , let us a little in general compare their Opinion with the Scriptures . True it is , that Religion standeth not only in outward things , for God requireth the heart , and truth in the inward parts : but that God requireth not our subjection ( upon fearful punishments ) to those outward Ordinances which he requireth , is a doctrine of Devils , as I shall prove . And first , for the outward Ordinances of the Old Testament , which were meerly shadows , and now are beggerly rudiments , Gal. 4.16 . what indignation the Lord had towards them that transgressed . Nadab and Abihu offering strange fire , which the Lord hath not commanded , a fire went out from the Lord and destroyed them , Levit. 10.1 , 2. The men of Bethshemesh looking into the outward Ark , which God had forbidden , the Lord slew fifty thousand and threescore and ten of them , 1 Sam. 6.19 . Vzza , of a good intent , leaning his shoulder to the same outward Ark , which God forbad , the Lord slew him , I Chr. 13 7 — 10. Vzziah the King oftering up outward Incense , ( which God commanded to be done only by the Priests , Numb . 18.3 , 7. ) the Lord smore him with Leprosie until his death , 2 Chron. 26. Corah and his company , what fearful Judgments came upon them ( though he a Levite ) for presuming to meddle with the Priests Office , the Earth opening and swallowing them up , Numb . 16. King Saul likewise offering up Incense ( in time of need as he thought ) the Lord rent his Kingdom from him , 1 Sam. 13. as also for his disobedience afterwards , touching the fat of the Amalecks Cattel , 1 Sam. 15. How often was the wrath of the Lord poured down upon them Israelites , because of their transgression of his outward Ordinances , in place , person , and things ? for it was a Law , Lev. 17.3 , 4. That who so brought not his Sacrifice to the place , viz. to the door of the Tabernacle of the Congregation , but offered it up other where , blood should be imputed to that man , and he should be cut off from among his People : yea , such Sacrifices were esteemed of God , as offered to Devils , ver . 7. And the Lord caused them to pronounce , ( Deut. 27.26 . ) Cursed be he that confirmeth not all the words of this Law , to do them : and all the people must say , So be it . Was God thus jealous of Moses's Ordinances , and is he less jealous of Christs ? Must he dye that despiseth Moses Law , and shall he escape that despiseth Christs , upon what pretence soever ? And Christ saith , It becometh him , and all his , to fulfil all Righteousness in outward Ordinances , as washing with water , Mat. 3.15 . And , whosoever saith , he knoweth God , and keepeth not his Commandments , ( which are outward , aswell as inward ) he is a lyar , 1 Job . 2.4 . And whosoever breaks the least Commandment , and teacheth men so , he shall be , called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven , Mat. 5.19 . And whosoever will not hear that Prophet ( Christ Jesus ) in all things that he shall say unto them , shall be destroyed out of his People , Acts 3.22 , 23. The affections of the soul are to be manifested by the actions of the body , according to Gods Word , and all other good intents or affections are abominable . We may not , neither can we worship God with our spirits , and the Devil with our bodies ; for , we are bought with a price , and therefore must not be the servants of men ; but must glorifie God with our bodies , and with our spirits , for they are his , 1 Cor. 6.20 . and 7.23 . And this may suffice to satisfie any concerning the overthrow of this cursed Conceit , knowing also that Christ and his Apostles , and all his Disciples to the end of the world , might , and may live peaceably enough from Persecution , if this Doctrine might be observed , viz. Submission with our bodies to any outward service . The Lord discover such Hypocrites . Indif . I bless God , I have learned of the Apostle , 2 Cor. 13.8 . to say nothing against the Truth , but for the Truth , and therefore when I see things are evidently manifested by the Scriptures , am desirous to submit , and not to cavil . But you know it is pleaded , they have the Word and Sacraments in the English Assemblies . Ch. I confess they have the Scriptures , in the which Gods Mysteries are contained , which are locked up from them , and revealed to his Saints , Col. 1.26 . which they wofully pervert to their own destruction : They have also imitations of Gods Ordinances , as Water , Bread , and Wine , and other things , which they use after their own inventions ; which things make them boast so much of their Christianity , and of their Church , which makes them reason thus : We are Gods People , for we have the Word and Sacraments . The Philistims might better have reasoned , 1 Sam. 5. who had the true Ark of God amongst them ; ( these have but a shew ) We are Gods People , for we have Gods Ark and holy Oracles amongst us . But I think they had no great cause to rejoyce thereof in the end : No more shall these have in the end , when God recompenceth all that withhold the Truth in unrighteousness . Gods dealing is not now as it was of old , he now reserveth punishment to the last day , he is patient , and would have men repent : but they despise his bountifulness and long-suffering , preaching peace when there is no peace . Indif . It cannot be denied , but that the Ministers preach many excellent Truths , and do bring people to much reformation in many things . Ch. True , it cannot be denied . For , if the Devil should come in his own likeness , men would resist him ; but because he transformeth himself into an Angel of light , therefore he deceiveth . So his ministers , if they should teach all lyes , man would not be deceived by them , nor plead for them ; but because they teach many Truths , people receive them . But first , for whatsoever they teach , they neither could nor should teach publickly , their mouths should be stopped , if they received not that their power to teach such Truths from those the Dragon sends ; and therefore none can receive those Truths from them , but they receive the Devil by whose power they teach : for , as our Saviour saith , Mat. 10.40 . He that receiveth you , receiveth me ; and he that receiveth me , receiveth him that sent me . So , he that receiveth those the Beast sends , receiveth the Beast ; and he that receiveth the Beast , receiveth him that sent him , that is the Devil . Further. Did not that Southsayer Balaam teach excellent Truths ? Numb . 23 & 24 chapters . Yea , the Southsayers of the Philistims the like , 1 Sam. 6. Yea , Those in the Gospel preach in Christs Name , Mat. 7.22 . As many moe testimonies might be manifested . And secondly , For their bringing of people to Reformation , and therein doing great works . Did not the Southsayers , before recited , 1 Sam. 6. shew the Princes their sin in detaining Gods Ark , and the judgments against them for the same , exhorting them to send it away , and not to harden their hearts , as Pharoah and the Egyptians hardned their hearts ? And was not Reformation wrought hereby ? And did not they that preached in Christs Name cast out Devils , and do many and great works ? of whom our Saviour testifieth , he never acknowledged them . But let us a little consider wherein the Reformation consistech , procured by their preaching , in Drunkenness , Whoredom , Swearing , &c. moral duties , which things whosoever is not reformed in , shall never see Gods Kingdom ; yet which things many of the Philosophers ( that knew not God ) abounded in , as they that know the Stories cannot deny . But do they teach their hearers to hate vain inventions , and love God's Law ? In a general manner of teaching they may , but if it come to particular practice , you shall see what they will do . Do they teach any to submit to that one Law-giver , Christ Jesus , for the guidance of his Church , and not to Antichrists Abominations ? No , they will tell you , you must sigh and groan , till the Magistrate will reform ; for you are a private person , and must be subject : And if the powerful working of Gods Word and Spirit prevail in you , to let you see , that the Magistrates not reforming will not excuse you at the day of account , but that that soul that committeth abomination shall dye , and that rather than you will worship the Beast or his Image , you will suffer with Christ peaceably , separating your self from such open prophanation as neither can nor will be reformed ; endeavouring to square your self both in your entrance , and walking in Christs way , unto that golden Rule that he hath left for direction : then the best of all those Preachers and Reformers will be hot and bitter , labouring with all the turning of devices to turn you , and withhold you from Reformation : And if they cannot prevail hereby , then publish you in their priviledged Pulpits , where none may answer them , You are a Schismatick , Brownist , Anabaptist , and what not ? to make the multitude abhor your doings , and not to follow you therein ; and some of them ( if not all ) under a colour , procure your Imprisonment and trouble by their Canonized Lords , or some of their hellish Pursevants . And such Preachers of Reformation are the best of them all . Indif . Oh how have we been besotted in these things for want of true knowledge and understanding from the Scriptures ! how have I and others satisfied our selves with these things , in that our estate was happy , perswading our selves thereof ! when alas , our fear towards God was taught by the inventions of men ; but the reason thereof was , we judged our selves by our own perswasions , and not by Gods Word . Ch. I pray you let not that seem strange unto you , that people should perswade themselves of their good estate with God , when it is not so . The Israelites , Gods People , thought their estate good many times , when alas it was otherwise , as the Prophets declared unto them ; yea , our Saviour testifieth , that they boasted of God being their Father , when they not so much as knew him , Joh. 8.19 . yea , when they were of their father the Devil , ver . 44. The five foolish Virgins thought their condition good enough , and that they should have been let in , but it was otherwise , Luke 20. The wicked thought they did God service that killed Christs Disciples , Joh. 16.2 , Mans heart is deceitful , Jer. 17.9 . Who are more confident of their good estate with God than the Papists , notwithstanding all their gross abominations ? Even so have you and I ( God pardon us ) thought beyond all , that we were in a good estate , having such zealous Teachers , that teach so many excellent Truths under the title of Christs Ministers , till we came to examine them , as the Church of Ephesus did , Rev. 2. then we found them to have no other Ministry than that they received from the Beast and his Image , which the Dragon gave , Rev. 13. Indif . Are all , without exception , in this fearful estate to be case into the Lake , that burneth with fire and brimstone ? Ch. All that submit , obey , or worship the Beast without exception ; for there is no respect of persons with God. So saith the Lord , If any man worship , &c. These worshippers under the Beast's Image may be divided into two sorts : First , those that ignorantly perswade themselves that all that is practised is good and acceptable to God : Secondly , those that see and acknowledge many things to be evil , which they would gladly have removed ; but because they cannot without the Crosss of Christ , partly for that , and partly by the perswasion of their Prophets ( that the things are not fundamental , and the like pretences ) all submit , and teach men so . Indif . Some affirm , There be thousands in England that never worshipped the Beast , &c. but be careful to keep the Commandments of God , and Faith of Jesus . Ch. Such are not under these Judgments ; but if their meaning be of any that submit to these Ordinances appointed for these Assemblies , such Teachers preach peace when there is none , strengthen the wicked that they cannot return from their wicked way , by promising them life , whose reward shall be according to the reward of such false Prophets , Ezek. 13.1 . and chap. 14.10 . because they follow their own spirit , and have not received it from the Lord : for thus saith the Lord , Such shall drink of the Wine of the Wrath of God. Indif . It is also affirmed by some , That in respect of personal graces , some of the Professors ( as they are called ) are the Children of God , and may be communicated with privately , though in respect of their Church actions they are members of Antichrists body , to whom are Judgments of God appertaineth . Ch. This opinion proceedeth not from Gods Word , but from man's vain heart , by the suggestion of the Devil : which , that it may evidently appear , let us a little consider of it . In truth it is to say , that in one respect they have Gods Promises appertaining to them : in another respect they have Gods most fearful Torments ( pronounced against that Beast , and that false Prophet , Rev. 19.20 . ) appertaining to them : In one respect they are Gods People , serving Him their Master : in another respect the Devils people , serving him their master : In one respect they shall be saved , in another respect they shall be damned . But what false doctrine this is , Gods holy Word doth discover . Our Saviour saith , No man can serve two masters ; ye cannot serve God and Riches , Mat. 6.25 . And can any serve Christ and the Beast , God and the Dragon ? When Christ shall come at the last day to give to every man according to his works , will he say to any one , In respect of thy personal graces I will save thee , Come thou blessed , ( as he will say to all his Children : ) But in respect of thy being a member of Antichrists body , I will damn thee , Go thou cursed , as he will to all that worship or obey the Beast ? Will not Christ Jesus pronounce absolutely either Salvation or Condemnation to every one ? and that according to this word , Joh. 12.48 . so as God in his Righteousness will either justifie or condemn every man : So hath He taught us to know , that no Fountain can make salt water and sweet , Jam. 3.12 . And therefore , that by mens fruits we should know and judge them to be not both good and evil trees at one time , as this opinion teacheth , but either good , or evil : alwayes taking heed , we justifie not the wicked , nor condemn the innocent , both which are abominable to the Lord : And for any communion whatsoever with them ; What fellowship hath Christ with Antichrist , the Righteous with the Wicked , the Servants of the Lamb , with the servants of the Beast ? But I leave this for further answer to thse , who although they are nearer to this man that hath published this opinion than I am , yet hath ( according to truth ) confessed in writing , That there is nothing to be expected from Christ , by any member of the Church of England , but a pouring out of his eternal Wrath upon them . Mr. De-Cluse . Advertis . pag. 9. Indif . Well , I praise God , I am much informed in these things ; yet one thing more I will desire your answer unto : The case standeth thus with me : In these things I am betwixt faith and doubting ; though the rather I believe these things you say are true , and that I may never go to these Assemblies again without sin ; but I am not so perswaded thereof , that I dare suffer for it : What if I should ( not having Faith to suffer ) for fear of persecution , go to their Worship again ? Ch. It were your most fearful sin , which I prove thus ; and I pray you observe it well : You must do it , either as being verily perswaded you do well , and then all this beginning of Light in you should be extinguished , and so your estate is with the worst , if not worse : or else you must do it , doubting whether you do well or no : For I hope you will not say , you do it knowing you do evil . If you do it doubting , the Lord saith , It is sin , Rom. 14.23 . which I hope you will acknowledge , and not approve your self to do well in sinning , and then God is merciful to forgive your sin , either this or any other , 1 Joh. 1.9 . But if you say , you sin not therein , doing it doubtingly , you make God a lyar , who saith , It is sin , and your sin remaineth . Indif . What if I should many times go through weakness ? Ch. If you unfainedly repent , being through weakness , there is mercy with God , though it should be seventy times seven times in a day , Mat , 18.21 , 22. But we had need to take heed of our repentance . The Apostle saith , where there is godly sorrow for sin , what Care it worketh in you , yea , what Indignation , &c. 2 Cor. 7. and custom in sin is dangerous , we had need to take heed we be not hardned through the deceitfulness of sin , Heb. 3.13 . Indif . Then you hold , that if any man approve himself in sinning , his sin remaineth . Ch. If any man sin , and say he hath not sinned , there is no truth in him , 1 Joh. 1.8 . and God will enter into judgment with him , Jer. 2.35 . Indif . Then absolutely I see , that if any man worship the Beast , or his Image , &c. as before you have shewed , he neither hath Faith nor Fear of God in him , what shew of Godliness soever he maketh . But what say you , may not a man that separateth from all uncleanness , though he yet see not the way of Christ in his Ordinances , may not such a man be saved ? Ch. Yes , upon this condition , that he believe in Jesus Christ for his only Righteousness , and be willing and ready to hear and obey his Ordinances ; an example hereof we have in Cornelius , Acts 10. But if any will not hear that Prophet ( Christ Jesus ) in all things whatsoever he shall say unto them , they shall be destroyed out of his People , Acts 3.22 , 23. Indif . What do you mean by will not hear ? Ch. That when any part of the Way of God is manifested to them , they despise and contemn it , or carelesly neglect it ; otherwise men may not receive some of Christs Truth , and yet not be said , that they will not receive it . Indif . Next after forsaking the wayes of wickedness , and imbracing Christ for our Righteousness , what must we do ? Ch. Christs whole Testament teacheth this , and no other way , after repentence from dead works , and faith towards God , to be baptized with water , Matth. 16.16 . Acts 2.41 . and 8.12 , 38. and 9.18 . and a cloud of witnesses , calling these the beginnings of Christ , and foundation , Heb. 6.1 , &c. Indif . May none be admitted to the Church to partake in the Ordinances , except they be baptized ? Ch. If any teach otherwise , he presumeth above what is written , 1 Cor. 4.6 . and therefore ought to be held accursed , Gal. 1.8 , 9. For there was never true Church , since Christ was manifested in the flesh , joyned together of unbaptized persons , though some have vainly published the contrary . Indif . True , I think that cannot be denyed , where the persons were never baptized ; but now the members of the Church of Rome , from whence the Baptism of the Church of England cometh , are baptized , Therefore why need they again be baptized ? Ch. If they be baptized with Christs Baptism , I will acknowledge they need not again be baptized : but that the Baptism of the Church of Rome is Christs Baptism , that can never be proved ; for Christ requireth that only his Disciple should baptize his Disciple , and into his Body : none of which is in Romes baptism : For Christs adversaries wash with water , those that are not Christs Disciples , into the body , not of Christ , but of Antichrist . Indif . I confess that the Church of Rome , and members thereof , are the Church and members of Antichrist , but they use the water and words in their Baptism that Christ appointed . Ch. What then ? is it therefore Christs Baptism ? The Conjurers used the same words that the Apostles did , Acts 19.13 , &c. We adjure you by the Name of Jesus , &c. yet abominable was their action . Also , Psal . 50. Unto the wicked said God , What hast thou to do with my Ordinances , or to take my Word in thy mouth , &c. Also the Papists use the same words in their Church , that Christ hath appointed to be used in his , as also in their Ministry , Is it therefore Christs Church and Ministry ? They use also the same words , and washing with water , in baptizing their Bells , that they use in baptizing their Infants , Is it therefore Christs Baptism ? If answer be made , Bells are not to be baptized . I answer , No more are the seed of wicked Persecutors , by our Opposits own confession . If this were any thing , you should see what would follow : The Baptism of Rome is Christs Baptism , because they use water and these words ; So if any use water and these words , as the Jews , or any other of Christs adversaries ( as the Papists are ) then there is Christs Baptism . Consider this , and see what truth there is in it . Indif . Though the Baptism of the Church of Rome should be naught , yet the Baptism of the Church of England may be good , in that there be many thousands that were never baptized in the Church of Rome . Ch. I answer , that the first beginning of the Church of England was made of the members of the Church of Rome , as is apparant in the dayes of King Henry the eight , and afterwards in the beginning of Queen Elizabeths Reign , after Qu. Maries death , and so continueth unto this day ; and the long continuance of it , makes it not approvable . And the Papists themselves bid the Protestants prove if they have , or hold any other Baptism , Church , or Ministry , than that they have from them , and shew it , and they will recant . Besides , the Baptism now practised in the Church of England , is no better , no otherwise than that of Rome : for the Church of Rome baptizeth all the Infants of the most wicked that are in her Dominions ; and so the Church of England baptizeth all the Infants of the most wicked that are in the Kings Majesties Dominions ; and of this Timber are both these Churches built ; and therefore we may truly say , as is the Mother , so is the Daughter . And as they are in their first building , so they are in most of their Laws , Lords , Law-makers , Courts , and thousands of their Abominations , insomuch that it is plain enough , the latter is the very Image of the first ; unto which , whosoever submitteth , or obeyeth , or maintaineth their Baptism , or any other of their humane trash , he shall be tormented in fire and brimstone for evermore , and shall never have rest day nor night , Rev. 14. And therefore in Gods fear cast away that cursed action of washing , where was neither Christs Disciple administring , nor his Disciple upon whom it was adminstred , nor Christs Body or Church baptized into : and obey Christs Voice , in becoming his Disciple , and to his Church , that you may be baptized by his Disciple , and be made a Member of his Body or Church . This only is Christs Baptism , and of him acknowledged , and ought to be of all his Disciples , and the contrary to be held accursed , and in no sort maintained or kept . Indif . It is objected , That we must cast away that which is mans Ordinance , and retain that which is Gods Ordinance , namely , Washing , and Water , and Words . Ch. I deny that any thing in that action was Gods Ordinance or Appointment : what truth is there in this , to say , That because God appointeth Water , and Washing , and Words in his Baptism , therefore howsoever Water , and Washing and these Words are used , that is Christs Ordinance ? I confess , Water , and Washing , and Words are Gods Ordinance , being used as he hath commanded , the which I acknowledge must be held ; but this use of them , or action fore-spoken of being not the use of them , or action appointed of God ( as the adversaries confess ) is to be cast away as execrable . Indif . Further , it is objected , They repent of that which is evil , and retain that which is good . Ch. For the better discovering of this deceit , let us consider what is the evil they confess and that they repent of : say they , An unlawfull person performed an unlawful action upon an unlawful person , this is the evil . Now this is the question , whether this action , thus unlawfully performed may be kept , and yet repented of ? The Scripture teacheth , That not only confessing , but forsaking sin ; in repentance , Pra. 28.13 . Can a Thief that hath stolen Goods , repent thereof to acceptance with God , and not make restitution to the party wronged ? being in his power , or having ability to restore ; I would know how this will be maintained ? for the one is a greater theft than the other . Indif . It is further objected , That Jeroboams followers had no right to Circumcision in their idolatrous estate , yet such as were circumcised in that estate , were not afterwards circumcised when they came to repentance . Ch. It is their forgery so to object : for , either they had right to Circumcision , being true Israelites , although in transgression , or else none had right to Circumcision in the world , no not Judah : For , what can be said , but that because the ten Tribes were in rebellion against God , therefore they had no right to Circumcision ? May not the same be said in as high a measure of Judah ? was Israels sin half so great as Judahs ? If it be said , that Israel forsook the place of Gods Worship , the Temple ; so did Judah too , worshipping under every green tree , and Grove , and high place : whatsoever can be said of the one , as much may be said of the other . This is a meer deceitful forgery , raised up by Satan in the hearts of his false Prophets , to deceive themselves , and them that shall perish , if they repent not , in that they receive not the love of the truth , but believe these lyes , and have pleasure therein ; concluding from this false ground , That because the Israelites in transgression were circumcised , and after coming to repentance were not circumcised again : So Egyptians , Sodomites and Babylonians , never having been Israelites , baptized in the Synagogues of Satan , are not to be rebaptised ( as they call it ) there being no comparison betwixt the persons ; the one being true Israelites according to the flesh , Gods People , to whom by Gods appointment Circumcision appertained , & who should have increased their transgressions if they had not performed it ; and the other true Babylonians , Gods adversaries , unto whom God threatneth his Judgements , for taking his Ordinances in their mouthes or hands . Indif . I see indeed there is no true proportion betwixt the persons in Circumcision and Baptism ; for the one were the persons appointed of God to be circumcised , which Circumcision taught them the forsaking of their wickedness , and bound them to the observation of the Law , Gal. 5.3 . and they had no cause to repent of that their action : The other are not the persons appointed of God to be baptized , but sinned in that their action , and must repent thereof , by your opposits own confession . But if this be granted , this question ariseth , Who shall then baptize after Antichrists exaltation ? Ch. For answer to this : There are three wayes professed in the world ; One by the Papists , and their several successors , professing succession from the Pope and his ministers : Another by the Familists and scattered flock , that none may intermeddle therewith lawfully , till their extraordinary men come : Another , we and others affirm , That any Disciple of Christ , in what part of the world soever , coming to the Lords way , he by the Word and Spirit of God preaching that way unto others , and converting , he may and ought also to baptise them . The two former I shall through the help of God confute , and confirm the latter by the Scriptures . First , to the Papists and all their several successors , some standing for all by succession from Rome , some for more , some for less , some for nothing but Baptism , being of our Judgement for the appointing of their Ministry . To them all I answer with the words of the Lord , Psa . 50.16 . What have Antichrists Ministers to do to take Gods Word in their mouths , or to declare his Ordinances , seeing they hate to be reformed , and have cast Gods Word behind their backs ? If they have nothing to do with his Word and Ordinances , then not with Ministry and Baptism . Besides , God hath forbidden that the adversaries of Him , his Temple , and them that dwell in Heaven , should build , according to that of Nehem. 2.20 . The God of Heaven he will prosper us , and we his Servants will rise up and build ; but as for you , you have no portion , nor right , nor memorial in Jerusalem . Secondly , to that fantastical Sect I answer ; It is their dream and false vision to look for extraordinary men , for God hath not spoken it : For if an Angel from Hevven should come and preach otherwise than those extraordinary men the Apostles have preached , which none else could preach , and which is written in Christs Testament , we are to hold them accursed , Gal. 1.8 , 9. Which Truth none need go into Heaven to seek , but every one that searcheth the Scriptures may find by the direction of the holy Ghost , which God hath promised to all that obey him , Acts 5. and ask it , Mat. 6.1 . Indif . Now I pray you let me hear your confirmation of your practice . Ch. As it was in the second building of the material Temple , after the captivity of Babylon in Caldea ; so , according to the true proportion , it is to be in the second building of the spiritual Temple after the captivity of spiritual Babylon . Now this is to be observed in the former , that every Israelite , with whom the Lord was , and whose spirit the Lord stirred up , was commanded to go and build , Ezra 1.3 , 5. though some were more excellent in the business than others . So now , every spiritual Israelite with whom the Lord is , and whose spirit the Lord stirreth up , are commanded to go and build , and the Lord will prosper them in rising up and building , though some be more excellent in the business than others ; the beginning of which spiritual building , is , first to beget men anew by the immortal seed to Gods Word , so making them living stones , and thereupon to comple them together a spiritual house unto God , 1 Pet. 2. upon the confession of their Faith by Baptism , as the Scriptures of the New Testament every where teach , as before is shewed . Indif . It is confessed of many , that any that have gifis may preach , and convert , but not baptize . Ch. Such our Saviour accounteth Hypocrites , and reproveth , Mat. 23. that held it was lawful to swear by the Temple , but not by the Gold on the Temple ; by the Altar , but not by the Offering on the Altar : to whom he saith , Wether is greater , the Gold , or the Temple that sanctifieth the Gold ? the Offering , or the Altar that sanctifieth the Offering ? So may I say , Whether is greater , the Water and Washing , or the Word that sanctifies the Water ? Indif . What other example have you in the Scriptures , that an unbaptized person may baptize ? Ch. If there were no other than that afore-mentioned , it were sufficient . An Israelite circumcised in flesh , God stirring up his heart , was to build the Temple made with hands , from the first stone to the last ; So an Israelite circumcised in heart , God stirring him up , is to build the Temple made without hands , from the first stone to the last , beginning with , Go , preach and baptize , teaching to observe all that God commands , as Christ teacheth his Disciples to the end of the world . But further , we have the particular example of John Baptist , who being unbaptised , preached , converted , and baptised . Indif . But John Baptist was an extraordinary man , it will be objected , for God spake to him extraordinarily . Ch. What then , Is not his practice written for our instruction ? God hath spoken at several times after sundry manners , Heb. 1.1 , &c. yet all to one end . As for this of John Baptist , the same God that spake to John Baptist in the wilderness his Word , the same God speaketh to us in his Scriptures the same Word he spake to John ; and therefore seeing the Lord hath spoken , who shall not preach and practise according to his Word ? seeing now God speaketh to no particular persons ; For whatsoever things were written afore time , were written for every mans instruction , Rom. 15.4 . Indif . Many famous men , as Mr. Perkins and others confess , that if a Turk should come to the knowledge of the Truth in Turkey , he might preach the same to others , and converting them , baptize them , though unbaptized himself . Ch. True , but this Mystery of Iniquity so prevaileth , perswading many that they are Christians , because they had Baptism in their Infancy , when it appertained not to them , that they think their case is better than the Turks , though alas , it is much worse ; for it shall be easier for the Turks than for them , if Gods VVord be true . Are not all Jews and Gentiles in one estate by nature ? and is there more than one way of coming to Christ for them both , namely , to be the Sons of God by Faith , and to put on Christ by Baptism ? Gal. 3.26 , 27. Who hath set up his new way , Christ or Antichrist ? Indif . Many of those called Brownists do confess , that they are reasonably perswaded , that Antichristians coming to the Truth may be baptized ; and they would not differ with you concerning that , but that you deny Infants Baptism ; What say you , may not the Infants of the Faithful be baptized ? Ch. No , except God have appointed it . Indif . You know it is granted , that there is neither plain command nor example for it in Christs Testament , but from the consequence of Circumcision , in that Covenant that God made with Abraham and his seed , Gen. 17. and other places agreeing therewith . Ch. Let us endeavour to put an end to this , if it may be in short . I demand of you , what Covenant the Lord meanthe here ? It must be granted , he meaneth , either the Covenant of the Land of Canaan , with all the Promises thereof ; or the Covenant of Christs coming of his lyons concerning the flesh ; or else the Covenant of Life and Salvation by Christ : one of these three it must needs be . Let me have your Answer , or any mans hereto . Indif . The first and second cannot be pleaded , therefore it must be the third , namely , Life and Salvation by Christ . Ch. VVell , then I demand , Have the fleshly Children of the Faithfull more priviledge to Life and Salvation than the Faithful themselves ? Indif . No , I think it cannot be said . Ch. VVell , then I affirm that the Faithful have right to this Covenant of Life and Salvation only upon their Repentance and Faith , and not otherwise ; and so have their Children , and not otherwise ; except you will say they have greater priviledge thatn the Faithful ; or else , that they have Life and Salvation by their Parents Faith ; or else , that they have right and title to it , whether they repent and believe or no. If any say they have right and title to it by Gods Promise . I answer , God hath promised Life and Salvation by Christ to none that are under Condemnation , but only by Repentance and Faith : let any shew the contrary if they be able . If any say , as some foolishly have done , being urged , That it is the Covenant of the visible Church : what Covenant is that but the Covenant of Life and Salvation made to the Faithfull , Christ Body and Church ? And therefore , seeing they are so confounded herein , some teaching one thing , and some another ; some that Infants have neither Faith nor Repentance , but by vertue of the Covenant made to their Parents : Others teach , that Repentance and Faith is to be performed of every one that is to be baptised , and that Infants may repent and believe by their Sureties till they come to age themselves : Seeing , I say , they are thus confounded herein , having nothing in Christs perfect Testament , only some shew of a forged consequence , and also that they agree not amongst themselves ; Let us take heed of prophaning the Lords holy Ordinance , administring it where he hath not commanded . Many other things might be said , but this may suffice , seeing much is already written , and more may be ere long , knowing they have nothing to say but their several conceits . Indif . I praise God you have given me great satisfaction in these things ; What must we do after our Baptism ? Ch. As the Saints our predecessors did , They that glady received the Word , were baptized , and they continued in the Apstles doctrine , fellowships , breaking of bread , and prayers , Acts 2. walking in fear towards God , and in love in word and deed one towards another , according to the blessed rules in Christs Testament ; and also justly and unblamably towards all men , that they may cause their Conversation aswell as their Doctrine to shine before men , that men may see their good works , and glorifie their Father which is in Heaven ; without the which conversation all profession is nothing . Indif . It is a great stumbling-block to many , that divers who profess Religion , walk corruptly in their conversation , it is a great cause that the wicked open their mouthes against Gods Truth . Ch. Alas , it is most lamentable ! but Gods People must know , it hath been and will be so unto the end of the world : And therefore Christ Jesus hath appointed means for the redressing thereof in his Church , Mat. 18. and 1 Cor. 5 , &c. And we may not justifie or condemn any Religion whatsoever by mens personal walkings . May we say , the Religion of the Philosophers was good because of their moral vertues ? or , that the Religion that Judah and David professed was evil , because of Judahs Incest , and Davids Adultery and Murder , Gen. 38. & 2. Sam. 11. or the Religion of Christ evil , because that one that professed it , fell into Incest , I Cor. 5. Gods People had need to take heed of sinning , whereby to cause the adversaries to blaspheme , for the which God may make them examples to all succeeding ages . Ind. I give you hearty thanks for your pains with me in these things , and I trust I shall not let them slip , but remember them all may life , and put them in practice . Ch. The glory and thanks thereof only belongeth to God , for to him it is due ; but this I desire you to consider , that the knowing of the Will of God , without practising of it , doth us rather hurt than good ; the Scripture saith , Not the knowers , but the doers are justified , Rom. 2.13 . Jam. 1.12 . And , He that knows his masters will and doth it not , shall be beaten with many stripes . Many there be in this Nation ( with grief of soul I speak it ) that acknowledge and confess the Truth , but praclise it not , for some respects or other ; the Lord Perswade all your hearts to the speedy practice thereof , and that by many examples that are left unto you . David that man of God saith , I made haste , and delayed not to keep thy Commandments , Psal . 119.60 . The Disciples , Mat. 4. immediately without tarrying followed Christ . The three thousand , the same day they were informed , obeyed the Lord , and were baptized , Acts 2. The Samaritans , Acts 8.12 . assoon as they believed were baptized , both men and women . The Eunuch likewise , ver . 38. The Jaylor , Lydia , Paul , and a cloud of witnesses , communing not with flesh and blood , but obeyed the Lord assoon as they believed . Here was no staying to hear what this , and that learned man could say against it , as now a dayes , but as they were confidently perswaded thereof , they obeyed . And so I am assured it shall be by little and little , as the kingdom of the Beast diminisheth . Indif . I hope I shall testifie to all , my speedy walking in the steps of these holy men ; but one thing there is yet which bath much troubled me and others , and in my judgment hat much hindred the growth of Godliness in this Kingdom , and that is , That many , so soon as they see or fear trouble will ensue , they flie into another Nation who cannot see their conversation , and there by deprive many poor ignorant souls in their own Nation , of their information , and of their conversation amongst them . Ch. Oh! that hath been the overthrow of Religion in this Land , the best able and greater part being gone , and leaving behind them some few , who by the others departure have had their afflictions and contempt increased , which hath been the cause of many falling back and of the adversaries exalting : But they will tell us , we are not to judge things by the effects , therefore we must prove that their flight unlawful , or we say nothing . And frist Whereas it is said by some of these flyers , that many of the People of God fled into forreign Countries , and that God gave approbation thereof , as Moses , David , our Saviour Christ in his infancy , and other , thinking hereby to justifie this their flight . I answer , God preserved Moses and the rest in their flight , till the time was come that he imployed them in his service , then in no case he would suffer them to flie ; as when Moses manifested his exceeding backwardness to the Lords work , in helping his People out of Bondage , using many excuses , the Lord was very angry with him , Exod. 4.10 — 15. And whither out Saviour flie when the time came that he was to shew himself to Israel ? Luk. 1.80 . If any of these men can prove the Lord requireth no work at their hands to be done for his Glory , and the Salvation of thousands of ignorant souls in their own Nation , let them stay in foreign Countries . But I trust Gods People have learned , not to say , the time is not yet come that Babel should be destroyed , and the Lords House builded , but that the time is come to build the Lords House , and not to dwell in ceiled houses , Hag. 1. or any way to seek our outward promotion ; which if it be granted , that the time is come , not only to come out of Babel , but to destroy her , all these objections are nothing ; except they prove , that when God called any of his People to his Work , they left it for fear of trouble . This doctrine was not approved of God when the time came that his Adversaries were to be rooted out , and that his People had gotten some victory . The Rubenites and the Gadites could have been content to have remained to their most peace and commodity , Num 32. but Moses said unto them , Shall your Brethren go to war , and ye tarry here ? where fore now discourage ye the hearts of the Children of Israel , &c. sharply reproving them , as an increase of sinful men , risen upon their fathers steads still to augment the fierce wrath of the Lord ; and Moses would not be satisfied until they had promised that they would go with their Brethren to the Lords work , and would not return to their houses till they had accomplished the same . And the Angel of the Lord doth say , Curse ye Meroz , curse the inhabitants thereof , because they came not to the help of the Lord , to help the Lord againsst the Mighty , Judg. 5.23 . Also , because the men of Jabesh Gilead came not up to the Lord , to help their Brethren against the wicked men of Gibeath , all the men were destroyed , and all the women that had lien by men , Judg. 21.11 , no excuse whatsoever could serve . Did God thus respect his Work and People then , as all must put to their helping hand , and none must withdraw their shoulder lest others were discouraged ; and is there no regard to be had thereof now , but any occasion , as fear of a little Imprisonments , or the like , may excuse any , both from the Lords work , and the help of their Brethren , that for want of their society and comfort are exceedingly weakned , if not overcome ? If answer be made , They perform their duty in both , that they do the Lords work ; the pastor feeding his flock , and the People walking in fellowship one towards another . I demand , Doth the Lord require no more work of them ? doth he not require that they should help to cast down Babel ? If reply be made , They do it by their Books . I answer , That may be done , and their Lights shine by their mouthes and conversations also among the wicked , which is the greatest means of converting them , and destroying Antichrists Kingdom : They overcame ( not by flying away , but ) by the Blood of the Lamb , and by the Word of their Testimony , and they loved not their lives unto the death , Rev. 12.11 . Gods People are the Lights of the World , a City set on a hill , a Candle set on the candlestick , giving light to all that come in , Mat. 5 and therefore must shine by their Persons , more than by their Books . And great help and encouragement would it be to Gods People in affliction of Imprisonment and the like , to have their Brethrens presernce to administer to their souls or bodies , and for which cause Christ will say , I was in Prison , and ye visited me ; in Distress , and ye comforted me ; and unto those that do not so according to their ability , Go ye cursed , Mat. 25. If men had greater love to Gods Commands , or the Salvation of thousands of ignorant souls in our Nation , that for want of instruction perish , than to a little temporal affliction , they would never publish nor practise as they do in this thing . Thus have I in short shewed you my poor ability in these things . And for all other things we hold ; as the lawfulness of Magistracy , Gods blessed Ordinance : And Christ our Saviour taking his flesh of the Virgin Mary , by the wonderful work of the holy Ghost , &c. You may see them in our Confession in print , published four years ago . Indif . Many that be called Anabaptists hold the contrary , and many other strange things . Ch. We cannot but lament for it ; so did many in Christs Churches in the primitive times hold strange opinions ; as some of the Corinths denyed the Resurrection ; and in many of the Seven Churches were grievous things , which the Lord by his Servants warned them of , upon pain of his displeasure and removing of his Presence from them ; nevertheless , others professing the same general Cause of Christ , were commended . Indif . Well , you will yet be called Anabaptists , because you deny Baptism to Infants . Ch. So were Christians before us called Sects : and so they may Iohn Baptist , Jesus Christ himself , and his Apostles Anabaptists ; for we profess and practise no otherwise herein , than they , namely , The baptizing of such as confess with the mouth the belief of the heart . And if they be Anabaptists that deny Baptism where God hath appointed it , they , and not we are Anabaptists . But the Lord give them repentance , that their sins may be put away , and never laid to their charge , even for his Christs sake . Amen . AN HUMBLE SUPPLICATION TO THE Kings Majesty ; As it was presented , 1620. To the High and Mighty KING , JAMES , By the Grace of God , King of Great Brittain , France , and Ireland . To the Right Excellent and Noble PRINCE , CHARLES , Prince of Wales , &c. To all the Right Hanorable NOBILITY , Grave and Honorable JUDGES , and to all other the Right Worshipful GENTRY , of all Estates and Degrees , assembled in this present Parliament . Right High and Mighty , Right Excellent & Noble , Right Honourable , and Right Worshipful ; AS the Consideration of that divine Commandment of the King of kings ( Let Supplications , Prayers , Intercessions , and giving of Thanks be made for Kings , and for all that are in Authority , that we may lead a quiet and a peaceable life , in all Godliness and Honesty ) doth cause in us a daily practice thereof in our secret Chambers for you all , as in duty we are bound , of which the searcher of all hearts beareth us witness ; so let it be pleasing unto your Majesty ; and the rest in Authority , that we make humble Supplications and Prayers to you , for such our bodily miseries and wants as are upon us ; in that it is in your power to redress them ; and especially at this present in this High Meeting , assembled for the publick weal of all your loyal Subjects . Our miseries are long and lingring Imprisonments for many years in divers Counties of England , in which many have dyed and left behind them Widows and many small Children : taking away our Goods , and others the like , of which we can make good probation ; not for any disloyalty to your Majesty , nor hurt to any mortal man , ( our Adversaries themselves being Judges ) but only because we dare not assent unto , and practise in the Worship of God , such things as we have not Faith in , because it is sin against the Most High , Heb. 11.6 . Rom. 14.23 . as your Majesty well observeth in these words : It is a good and safe Rule in Theology , That in matters of the Worship of God , Quod dubitas , ne fereris , according to Pauls rule , Rom. 14.5 . Let every man be fully perswaded in his own mind . Medit. on Lo. Prayer . If we were in error herein , these courses of afflicting our bodies for Conscience cause , are not of Christ , but of Antichrist , as hereafter is most plainly shewed ; And if no Church be the Rule of Faith , but only the holy Scriptures ; as the learned Protestants do truly confess , and that therefore the Doctrine of the Church of Rome ( that all must believe as the Church believes , and so practise , or else be cruelly persecuted ) be most ungodly , as it is : then how can they avoid the like censure that practise the same thing , contrary to their own Judgement ? For the learned Protestants do say , it is high cruelty for the Papists to constrain them to practise those things in Gods Worship which they have not Faith in , nay , which they know to be evil , with Imprisonment , Fire and Faggot : and therefore why may not we say , it is great cruelty for the learned Prorestants to constrain us to practise such things in Gods Worship , which we have not Faith in ? Nay , which we certainly know to be evil , with lingring Imprisonment , loss of Goods , and what other cruelties they can procure against us of your Majesty and the Civil State. If your Learned say , they have the Truth , and we are in Errour ; that resteth to be tryed by the true Touchstone , the holy Scriptures . If they be our Judges , the Verdict must needs go against us . If their sayings be a safe Rule for us to be saved by , we will rest upon them ; And then why may not the saying of the Papists be sure also , and they be the Protestants Judges ? and so bring us all to believe as the Church believes . The iniquity of which we have discovered as briefty as we could ; beseeching your Majesty and all that are in Authority , to hear us . It concerneth our eternal Salvation , or Condemnation , and is therefore of great importance ; for what can a man give for the ranfom of his Soul ? Oh he pleased to remember the saying of that great and good man Job , chap. 29. I delivered the Poor that cryed , and the Fatherless , and him that had none to help him : The blessing of him that was ready to perish came upon me , and I caused the Widows heart to rejoyce . I was a Father to the Poor , and when I knew not the cause , I sought it out diligently . I brake also the jaws of the unrighteous man , and pluckt the prey out of his teeth . Our prayers are , and shall be for you day and night , to that God of glory , by whom you reign and are advanced , that He will pat it into your hearts to let these things enter into your thoughts , and then we doubt not ( the evidence of them being such ) that you will be moved to repeal and make void all those cruel Laws ( which we most humbly beseech ) which persecute poor men only for matters of conscience ; not that we any way desire for our selves or others , any the least liberty from the strict observation of any Civil , Temporal , or Humane Law , made or to be made , for the preservation of your Majesties Person , Crown , State or Dignity ; for , all that give not to Caesar that which is his , let them bear their burden : but we only desire , that God might have that which is his , which is the heart and soul in that Worship that He requireth , over which there is but one Lord , Eph. 4.5 . and one Law-giver , who is able to save it , or to destroy it , Jam 4.12 , which no mortal man can do . It is not in your power to compel the heart ; you may compel men to be Hypocrites , as a great many are , who are false-hearted both towards God and the State ; which is sin both in you and them . The vileness of persecuting the body of any man only for cause of Conscience , is against the Word of God and Law of Christ : It is against the profession of your Majesty ; against the profession and practice of famous Princes ; The antient and later approved Writers witness against it ; so do the Puritans ; yea , the establishers of it , the Papists themselves inveigh against it : so that God and all men do detest it , as is herein shewed . And therefore in most humble manner , we do beseech your Majesty , your Highness , your Honours , your Worships , to consider of it , and do as God directeth you in his Word , that cannot lye ; Let the Wheat and Tares grow together in the world until the harvest , Matth. 13. And so in humble manner we proceed . CHAP. I. The Rule of Faith is the Doctrine of the Holy Ghost contained in the Sacred Scriptures , and not any Church , Council , Prince or Potentate , nor any mortal man whatsoever . PRoved , by the Scriptures themselves , which are the Writings of Moses and the Prophers , the Evangelists and Apostles ; these are a sufficient Rule alone to try all Faith and Religion by : our Reasons are , 1. They are inspired of God , and are able to make us wise unto salvation , and perfect to every good work , 2. Tim. 3.15 , &c. 2. Because these Writings are written , that we might have certainly of the things whereof we are instructed , Luke 1.4 . That our joy might be full , 1 Joh. 1.4 . And that we might believe , and in believing might have life , John 20.31.3 . We are commanded not to presame ( or be wise ) above what is written , 1 Cor. 4.6 . For , with this weapon Christ put to flight the Devil , Mat. 4.4 . And taught his Disciples , Luke 24.27 , 46. And Paul taught Christ Jesus , Acts 17.2 . The Godly are commended for searching the Scriptures , Acts 17.11 . All are commanded to search them , John 5.39 . And they that will not believe these Writings , will not believe Christs Words , John 5.47 . nor one that should come from the Dead , Luke 16.31 . If any ask how we know all , or any of these Scriptures to be inspired of God ? We answer , The ear ( saith Job 12.11 ) discerneth words , and the mouth tasteth meat for it self ; And as the eye discerneth the light of the Sun , so doth our Spirit discern these Scriptures to be inspired of God , and that for these Reasons : 1. In regard of the Majesty , Wisdom and Grace of them from all other Writings ; for there is a great Glory in these Scriptures , as in the making of this wonderful World , which is most evidently discerned , Heb. 11.1.2 . By their Teachings , which excel all humane teachings , leading us from Satan , from this world and our selves , to God , to holiness , faith , love , fear , obedience , humility . 3. The true events of them , or fulfilling of the Prophesies contained in them . 4. The consent and agreement of all the parts of them , the like whereof cannot be shewed of so many several Writers since the world began . 5. The admirable preservation thereof against Time and Tyrants ; all which could not extinguish them . 6. The Devil and his Instruments rage against those that practise the Doctrines contained in them . 7. The Conversion of thousands to God , by the power of their Doctrine . 8. The Vengeance that hath come upon such as have not obeyed them . 9. The Acknowledgment of them by the very professed Adversaries thereof . 10. The Miracles confirming them from Heaven . 11. The fight of a Saviour to man is only by and from them . And lastly , the simplicity of the Writers and plainness of the Writings ; for God hath chosen the mean , contemptible and despised , to manifest unto the world his Mysteries , 1 Cor. 1. These are sufficient to perswade , that those holy Writings are inspired of God , and so able to make wise unto Salvation , and perfect to every good work , These Scriptures contain the Law and Testimony ; and if any Church , Council , Prince or Potentate speak not according to this Word , it is because there is not light in them , Isa . 8.20 . And we are commanded to hold them accursed , Gal. 1.8 , 9. For , Whosoever shall adde unto these things , God shall adde the plagues written herein ; and whosoever shall take away from these things , God shall take his name out of the Book of life , and out of the holy City , and from those things that are written , Revel , 22. Much by us shall not need to be written on this Subject , the thing is so evident , and so generally acknowledged , at least in words , ( excepting the Papists , with whom we have not here to do ) only we will adde some humane Testimonies . Whites Way to the Church , dedicated to two Bishops , pag. 12. The learned Protestants affirm and prove , that it is the doctrine of the Church of England , Artic. 6 chap. That the Scripture comprehended in the Old and New Testament , is the Rule of Faith so far , that whatsoever is not read therein , or cannot be proved thereby , is not to be accepted as any point of Faith , or needful to be followed ; but by it all Doctrines taught , and the Churches Practice must be examined , and that rejected which is contrary to it , under what title or pretence soever it come unto us . And further they say , p. 1. That the Pope , or any mortal man should be the Rule that must resolve in questions and controversies of Faith , is an unreasonable Position , void of all indifferency ; when common sense teacheth , That he that is a party , cannot be Judge . And again , pag. 17. — Which is the Church is controversal , which is the Scriptures is not ; therefore let that be the Rule which is out of doubt . And again , The Scriptures contain the Principles of our Faith , and shall we not believe them ? Or , cannot we know them infallibly of themselves , without we let in the authority of the Church ? This , and much more , the learned Protestants have written , and sufficiently confirms , that no Church nor man whatsoever may be the Judge , Rule or Umpier in matters of Faith , but only the holy Scriptures ; and whosoever teacheth and practiseth otherwise , they must hold and maintain the Papists , Creed , or Colliers Faith , which the Protestants so much in words detest , pag. 6. and mention our of Staphilus his Apology , thus : The Collier being at the point of death , and tempted of the Devil what his Faith was ? answered : I believe , and dye in the Faith of Christs Church : Being again demanded what the Faith of Christs Church was ? That Faith ( said he ) that I believe in . Thus the Devil getting no other Answer , was overcome and put to flight . By this Paith of the Collier every unlearned man may try the spirits of men , whether they be of God or no : by this Faith he may resist the Devil , and judge the true interpretation from the false , and discern the Catholick from the heretical Minister , the true Doctrine from the forged . If the Answer of the Collier , and the Papists Conclusion upon it be not sound , but detestable , as the Protestants confess , and cry wo unto the Papists for the same , and that justly ; Then is it no less detestable in the Protestants or any other to require , or any to yeeld so far in Religion and Faith , that upon such a temptation he hath no better answer to make than as the Collier , to say , I believe and dye in the Faith of the Church ; or of the Prince , or of the Learned ; for , being demanded what that Faith is ? if he be not able to prove it by Gods Word , contained in the Scriptures , it is no better nor other than the answer of the Collier , The Faith that I believe in . Oh how many millions of souls in this Nation , not Papists but Protestants , live and dye , and have never other Faith than this , whereunto they are constrained and compelled by persecution , without either Faith or Knowledge . CHAP. 2. The Interpreter of this Rule is the Scriptures , and Spirit of God in whomsoever . THe next thing , as the immediate Question from this former , is , Who must interpret this Rule , because , as is objected , There are many dark places in it ( 2 Pet. 3 ) hard to be understood . Unto which we answer : The two Witnesses of God shall be the onely Interpreters therof ; which are , The Word of God contained in the same Scriptures , and the Spirit of God , so are they called , Joh. 15.26 , 27. Act. 5.32 . First , for the Scriptures themselves , though some Doctrines in some places be dark and obscure , as Peter speaketh , yet the self-same Doctrines in other places are plain and manifest : For , all the words of the Lord are plain to him that will understand , and streight to them that would find knowledge , Pro. 8.9 . And knowledge is easie to him that will understand , Prov. 14.6 . Secondly , the Spirit of God ; So saith the Apostle , 1 John 2.6 . It is the Spirit that beareth witness : for the Spirit is Truth . And John 14.26 . But the Comforter , which is the holy Ghost , whom the Father will send in my Name , he shall teach you all things , and bring all things to your remembrance which I have told you . And Joh , 16.13 . Howbeit when he is come , which is the Spirit of truth , he will lead you into all truth ; for he shall not speak of himself , but whatsoever he shall hear , shall he speak , and he will shew you of things to come . And 1 Cor. 2.10 . For the Spirit searcheth all things , even the deep things of God. And ver . 11. For the things of God knoweth no man , but the Spirit of God. And 1 Joh. 2.27 . But the Anointing that ye have received of Him , dwelleth in you , and ye need not that any man teach you , but as the same Anointing teacheth you of all things , and it is true , and is no lye ; and even as it hath taught you , you shall abide in Him. And 1 Joh. 3.24 . Hereby we know that He abideth in us , even by the Spirit that He hath given us . And 1 Cor. 12.8 . For to one is given by the Spirit , the word of Wisdom ; and to another the word of Knowledge , by the same Spirit . The Scriptures be so plain in this , that the greatest adversaries thereof do acknowledge the truth of it : only herein lyeth the difficulty , Who it is that hath this Spirit of God to interpret the Scriptures , which is this sure Rule ? which in the next place is to be handled . CHAP. 3. That the Spirit of God , to understand and interpret the Scriptures , is given to all and every particular person , that fear and obey God , of what degree soever they be ; and not to the wicked . PRoved , Psal . 25.12 . What man is he that feareth the Lord , him will he teach the way that he shall chuse . And ver 14. The secret of the Lord is revealed to them that fear Him , and his Covenant to give them understanding . And Psal . 107.43 . Who is wise that he may observe these things , he shall understand the loving-kindness of the Lord. And Dan , 12.10 . None of the wicked shall have understanding ; but the Wise shall understand . For God will do nothing , but He revealeth his Secrets to his Servants , Amos 3.7 . And Psal . 119.99 , &c. I have had more understanding than all my Teachers , and than all the Antients ; because I kept thy Precepts . For he that keepeth the Law is a Child of understanding , Prov. 28.7 . And Joh. 14.15 . If ye love me , keep my Commandments , and I will pray the Father , and He shall give you the Spirit of Truth . And ver . 23. If any man love me , he will keep my Word , and my Father and I will come unto him , and will dwell with him . And John 7.17 . If any man will do his Will , he shall know of the Doctrine whether it be of God or no. And Acts 5.32 . Yea , and the holy Ghost whom God hath given to all that obey Him. And Luke 21.15 . I will give you ( my Disciples that obey me , and suffer for my sake ) a mouth , and wisdom , &c. and Luke 12.12 . The holy Ghost shall teach you what ye shall say : For , Mat. 10.20 . It is not you that speak , but the Spirit of my Father that speaketh in you . And Mark 4.11 . To you ( my followers ) is given to know the Mysteries of the Kingdom of God ; but not to them that are without : For , the Mystery of the Gospel is made manifest to the Saints , Col. 2.2 . The Church and Saints of God have revealed unto them by the Spirit , the things that eye hath not seen , &c. 1 Cor. 2.9 , 10. And they have received the Spirit of God , that they might know the things that are given them of God. But the natural man perceiveth not the things of the Spirit of God , for they are foolishness to him ; neither can he know them , because they are spiritually discerned : but he that is spiritual , discerneth all things , &c. ver . 14. Hence is most plain to whom the Spirit of God is given , even to every particular Saint of God. And it is no private spirit , but even : the publick , Spirit of God which is in him , which enableth him to understand , and so to declare the things given him of God , 2 Pet. 1.20 . That is a private spirit that is not of God , though it be in multitudes ; but the Spirit of God , though but in one Saint , is not private . Gods Spirit is not private , for it is not comprehended only within one place , person , or time , as mans is , but it is universal and eternal ; so is not mans : therefore mans is private , though they be many ; Gods is publick , though but in one person . CHAP. 4. Those that fear and obey God , and so have the Spirit of God to search out and know the mind of God in the Scriptures , are commonly and for the most part , the simple , poor , despised , &c. PRoved , Mat. 11.5 . Our Saviour faith , The Poor receive the Gospel . And v. 25. I thank thee Father , because thou hast opened these things unto Babes ; it is so , O Father , because thy good pleasure was such . And Jam. 2.5 . Hearken my beloved Brethren , hath not God chosen the Poor of this world , that they should be rich in Faith , and Heirs of the Kingdom which he hath promised ? &c. And 1 Cor. 1.26 , &c. Brethren , you see your calling , that God hath chosen the foolish of this world , the weak of this world , the vile of this world and dispised , and which are not . Gods dealing is , to give unto the Simple sharpness of wit , and to the Child knowledge and discretion , Prov. 1.4 . The Sprit bloweth where it listeth , John 3.8 . and is not tyed to the Learned . Poor persecuted Micaiah had the Truth against four hundred of King Ahabs Prophets , 1 King. 22. So had Jeremiah against all the Priests and Prophets of Israel . The Lord of Life himself in his fleshly being , what was he but a man full of sorrows , in his Birth laid in a Cratch , because there was no room for him in the Inne , Luk , 2.7 . A Carpenter by Trade , Mar. 6.3 . Having not a hole to rest his head in , Mat. 8.20 . And in his Death contemned and dispised . His Apostles in like manner , what were they but mean men , Fishermen , Tentmakers , and such like , having no certain dwelling-place , 1 Cor. 4.11 . which the worldly-wise Scribes and Pharises took notice of , and reproachfully said , Joh. 7.48 . Do any of the Rulers , or of the Pharisees believe in him ? but this people that know not the Law are accursed , ver . 49. The truth of this is as plain as may be , that the Scriptures being the Rule of Faith , perfect and absolute , and that the plainness of them is such , as by the Spirit of God they may be easily understood of those that fear and obey God , but of none else , and that such are most commonly the poor and dispised ; for , if any man want wisdom ( be he never so simple ) let him ask of God , and he will give him , Jam. 1.5 . Which is also confirmed by humane Testimonies . The Protestants confess , Whit. pag. 7. That in the Primative Church the Doctrines and several points of Religion , were known and discovered by the most mean of the people , and the Bishops exhorted them thereunto , &c. Also , pag. 9. That this Rule is of that nature , that it is able to direct any man be he never so simple , yea , the most unlearned alive may conceive and understand it sufficiently for his salvation . And they relate the Sayings of the Ancient in this thing , pag. 32. First , Clemens Alexandrinus : The Word is not hid from any , it is a common Light that shineth unto all , there is no obscurity in it ; hear you it , you that be far off , and you that be nigh . Next him , Austin ; God hath bowed down the Scriptures to the capacity of Babes and sucklings , that when proud men will not speak to their capacity , yet himself might . After him , Chrysostom ; The Scriptures are easie to understand , and exposed to the capacity of every Servant , and Plowman , and Widow , and Boy , and him that is most unwise . Therefore God penned the Scriptures by the hands of Publicans , Fishermen , Tentmakers , Shepherds , Neat-herds , and unlearned men , that none of the simple people might have any excuse to keep them from reading , and that so they might be easie to be understood of all men ; the Artificer , the Housholder and Widow woman , and him that is most unlearned : Yea , the Apostles and Prophets , as Schoolmasters to all the world , made their Writings plain and evident to all men , so that every man of himself , only by reading them , might learn the things spoken therein . Next , Justin Martyr saith : Hear the words of the Scripture , which be so easie that it needs no exposition but only to be rehearsed . And this the Protestants say was the perpetual and constant judgment of the antient Church , &c. And further , pag. 21. he alledgeth Theodoret who writ of his times , You shall every-where see these points of our Faith to be known and understood , not only by such as are Teachers in the Church , but even of Coblers , and Smiths , and Websters , and all kind of Artificers ; yea , all our Women , not they only which are Book-learned , but they also that get their living with their Needle ; yea , Maid-servants and Waiting-women ; and not Citizens only , but Husbandmen of the Country are very skilful in these things : you may hear among us Ditchers , and Neat-herds , and Wood-setters discoursing of the Trinity and the Creation , &c. The like is reported by others . And , say the Protestants , his Doctrine that was President in the Trent-Conspiracy , That a Distaff was fitter for Women than a Bible , was not yet hatched , &c. Oh it were well if the contempt of these pious practices were paled only within the Romish profession , and were not practised in and among those that profess themselves to be separated there-from : as what is more frequent in the mouthes of many Protestants , yea the Bishops themselves , than these and such like words ; Must every base fellow , Cobler , Taylor , Weaver , &c. meddle with the exposition or discoursing of the Scriptures , which appertains to none but to the Learned ? Yea , do they not forbid their own Ministers to expound or discourse of the Scriptures ? read their 49 Canon , which is ; No person whatsoever , not examined and approved by the Bishop of the Diocess , or not licensed , as is aforesaid , for a sufficient and convenient Preacher , shall take upon him to expound in his own Cure , or elsewhere , any Scripture , or Matter , or Doctrine ; but shall only study to reade plainly and aptly ( without glozing or adding ) the Homilies already set forth , or hereafter to be published by lawful Authority , &c. So that not only Jesus Christ and his Apostles ( who are alive in their Doctrine , though not in their persons ) are forbidden all exposition of the holy Scriptures , or Matter , or Doctrine , not being licensed by the Bishops , but also their own Ministers , who have sworn Canonical obedience to them . Yet when they are put to answer the Papists , who practise the same thing , they take up both Scriptures and antient Writers to confute it . CHAP. 5. The Learned in humane learning , do commonly and for the most part erre , and know not the Truth , but persecute it and the professors of it ; and therefore are no further to be followed than we see them agree with Truth . THe next thing in order is , seeing the Lord revealeth his secrets to the humble , though wanting humane Learning , that we now prove on the contrary ; That God usually and for the most part hideth his secrets from the Learned , and suffereth them to erre and resist the Truth , yea so far , as to persecute it and the Professors of it . And first , let us begin with the Learned Heathen , who were behind none in humane Learning : the wise-men of Egypt , how did they resist the glorious and powerful Truth of God delivered by Moses ? yea , they resisted it with such signs and lying wonders , that the heart of Pharaoh and all his people were hardned against it , Exod. 7.11 , 12 , 13. and 8.7 . And what was the cause of Babels destruction , but their trusting in the Learned ? Isa . 47.13 . Thou art wearyed in the multitude of thy Counself , &c. And Isa . 44.25 . I destroy the tokens of thy Southsayers , and make them that conjecture fools , and turn the wisemen backward , and make their knowledge follishness . The things of Gods dealing none of the Learned of Egypt or Babel could interpret , but Joseph and Daniel . Next come to the learned Priests and Prophets of the Jews , Whose lips should have preserved Knowledge , and at whose mouth the people should have sought the Law : But saith the Lord , Mal. 2.7 , 8. They are gone out of the way , they have caused many to fall by the Law , &c. Also Isa . 29. Stay your selves and wonder ; they are blind , and make you blind ; they are drunken , but not with Wine ; they stagger , but not with strong drink : for the Lord hath convered you with a spirit of slumber , and hath shut up your eyes , the Prophets , and your chief Seers , &c : Therefore the Lord said , Because this people come near to me with their mouth , and honour me with their lips , but have removed their heart far from me , and their fear towards me was taught by the precepts of men : Therefore , behold , I will again do a marvallous work in this people , a marvellous work and a wonder ; for the wisdom of their wise men shall perish , and the understanding of the prudent shall be hid , &c. And Isa . 56.10 , &c. Their watchmen are all blind , they have no knowledge , &c. And these Shepherds cannot understand , for they all look to their own way , every one for his own advantage , and for his own purpose . Also Jer. 8.9 , &c. The wise-men are ashamed ; they are afraid and taken : lo , they have rejected the Word of the Lord , and what wisdom is in them , &c. And Jer. 14.14 , &c. and 50.6 . My People have been as lost sheep , their Shepherds have caused them to go astray , and have turned them away to the mountains , &c. And Micah 3. Night shall be unto them for a vision , and Darkness for a divination : the Sun shall go down over the Prophets , and the Day shall be dark over them , &c. For they have no answer of God : they build up Zion with blood , and Jerusalem with iniquity , &c. And Zeph. 3.4 . Her Prophets are light and wicked persons ; her Priests have polluted the Sanctuary , they have wrested the Law. And in the time of our Saviour , How had they made the Commandments of God of no authority by their Traditions , Mat. 15.6 . And Act. 13.27 . The Rulers of Jerusalem ( the High-Priests , Scribes and Pharisees ) knew not Christ , nor yet the words of the Prophets , which they heard read every Sabbath , but fulfilled them in condemning him . And our Saviour saith , Mat. 11. I thank thee Father , Lord of Heaven and Earth , because thou hast hid these things from the wise and men of understanding . And none of the Pharisees nor Rulers believed on him , Joh , 7.48 . And 1 Cor. 1.20 . Where is the Wise ? where is the Scribe ? where is the Disputer of this world ? Hath not God made the wisdom of this world follishness ? And ver . 26. Not many wise men after the flesh , not many mighty , not many noble are called , &c. And for the Learned since the time of our Saviour ; The Council of Ephesus were where 132 Bishops : Of Seleucia where were 160 Bps , related by the Protestants : How grievously did they erre , in decreeing the detestable Error of Arrianism ? Who is ignorant ( knowing the Histories ) that from time to time , both particular Popes and general Councils , have grosly erred in many things ? only one we will mention , passing by Trent and others ; The Council Lateren we mean ( Pope Innocent , 1215. ) which for universality was behind none , where were present 2 Patriarchs , 70 Archbishops Metropolitans 400 Bishops , 12 Abbot , 800 Conventual Priors , the Legats of the Greck and Roman Empire , besides the Ambassadors and Orators of the Kings of Jerusalem , France , Spain , England , and Cyprus . In this Council it was decreed , That all Hereticks , and so many as do in any point resist the Catholick Faith , should be condemned , &c. And also that the Secular Powers , of what degree soever they be , shall be compelled openly to swear for the defence of the Faith , that they will to the uttermost of their power root out and destroy in all their Kingdoms , all such persons as the Catholick Church hath condemned for Hereticks : and if they do not , they shall be excommunicated . And if they do not reform within one whole year , then the Pope may denounce all their Subjects absolved , and utterly delivered from shewing or owing any fidelity or obedience towards them . Again , that the Pope may give that Land , to be occupied and enjoyed of the Catholicks to possess it , ( all Hereticks being rooted out ) quietly and without any contradiction . Tho. Beacon in his Reliques of Rome , printed 1563. And the Protestands confess , that this imperfection hath hung so fast upon all Councils and Churches , that Nazianzen saith , He never saw any Council have a good end . Thus are here sufficient Testimonies proved from Scriptures and Experience , That the Learned may , and have usually erred ; and therefore the holy Scriptures often warn us , To beware of false Prophets , for many are gone out into the world , Mat. 24. and 1 Joh. 4. And will not your Majesty , your Highness , your Honours , your Worships , be pleased to consider of these things ? but will your selves submit the guidance of your Souls to the learned Spirituality , ( as they are called ) without due examination by the Scriptures ? which if you will stil do , we can but bewail with the sorrows of our hearts ; and not so only , But will you with your Power which God hath given you to use well , compel and constrain your Subjects and Underlings , to believe as the Learned believe , not suffering us to reade or search the Scriptures ? Which if you abhor , as being the Romish practice ; Will you do that which is worse , letting us reade the Scriptures , whereby we may know the Will of our Heavenly Master , and have our Consciences enlightned and convinced ; but not suffer us to practise that we learn and know ? whereby our Sin and Condemnation is made greater than the blind Papists , as is proved , Luke 12.47 . And not only so , but will you cons●●ain us to captivate our Consciences , and practise in that , which in our ●●●ls we know to be evil , and contrary to the manifest Law of the Lord , and that only because the Learned have so Decreed , ( whom you acknowledge are subject to erre aswell as others ) or else lye in perpetual Imprisonment , and be otherwise grievously persecuted ? May it please you to observe , that the Church of Rome seeth and acknowledgeth in words , That Jesus Christ is come in the flesh , and hath abolished the Priesthood of Aaron , and the legal Sacrifieces ; but the Jews see it not to this day , nay , the High-Priests , Scribes and Pharisees saw it not , but for the publishing thereof persecuted Christ the Lord , and his Apostles , unto the Death ; calling their Doctrine Heresie , and them seditious Enemies to Caesar , &c. For the which we all justly condemn them for their wickedness , so often as we reade the holy History . And the Church of England seeth and acknowledgeth divers damnable Doctrines of the Church of Rome ; this among many , That the Scriptures are not the only Rule of Faith , but that men ought to be constrained to believe as the Church believes . The Protestants see the iniquity of this , because they see and acknowledge all Churches are subject to erre . But the learned Papists see it not , but have decreed , That whosoever resisteth in any point shall be judged as an Heretick , and suffer fire and faggot : and every Temporal Magistrate that doth not root such Hereticks out of their Dominions , shall be excommunicated ; and if he do not reform , he shall be expelled his earthly Possessions , and his Subjects freed from owing any fidelity or obedience towards him , &c. For the which height of iniquity , the Protestants and we justly cry out against them for all the innocent blood that they have shed . And we see most manifestly , that what soever is not of Faith is Sin , Rom. 14.23 . And without Faith it is impossible to please God , Heb. 11.6 . And therefore that no mortal man may make a Law to the Conscience , and force unto it by Persecutions , and consequently may not compel unto any Religion where Faith is wanting , as hereafter more largely we prove . But the Learned of this Land see it not ( or rather will not practise it ) but for our not submitting herein , procure your temporal Sword to persecute us , by casting us in Prisons , where many of us have remained divers years in lingring Imprisonment , deprived of all earthly comforts , as Wives , Children Callings , &c. without hope of Release , till our God ( for the practice of whose Commandments we are thus persecuted ) perswade the hearts of your-Majesty , your Highness , your Honours , your Worships , to take pitty upon us , our poor Wives and Children , or His heavenly Majesty release us by Death . Will not succeeding Ages cry out against the Cruelty of the learned Protestants herein , aswell as they cry out against the Cruelty of the learned Jews and Papists ? yes , we are assured they will , as many millions do in other Nations at this day . The Scriptures declare , the cause of the Jews blindness was , not the obscurity of the Scriptures , but that they winked with their eyes , lest they should see that which would deprive them of their honours and profits , as Joh. 11.48 . And because , their fear towards God was taught by mens precepts , and because they looked to their own way , and to their own advantage , and had rejected the Word of the Lord ; and because they builded their Zion with blood , and Jerusalem with iniquity , and sought their own honour , and not Gods , as before is proved . So the cause of the blindness of the learned Papists , in denying the Scriptures the only Rule of Faith , is not the obscurity of the Scriptures , but their winding with their eyes , lest they should see that , that would bring them from their honours and profits , and all the forenamed in the Jews . And also as the Protestants well observe , Whit. pag. 18. First , That they might make themselves Judges in their own cause ; For who seeth not that if the Church be the Rule of Faith , and their be the Church , which way the verdict will go ? Next , for that the greatest points of their Religion have no foundation on the Scriptures , &c. So that take away the Scriptures , and establish their Religion ; but establish the Scriptures , and their Religion vanisheth ; and that Mother of Whoredoms that glorified her self as a Queen , Rev. 18. shall be consumed ; and her Merchants that were waxed rich through her pleasures and profits , shall wail and weep , the which they now seeing , shut their eyes , lest they should see that which would bring them from these honours , profits and pleasures . In like manner it may easily be judged by every indifferent man , that the cause why the Learned of this Land will not see , or at least practise , ( that seeing there is but one Lord , Eph. 4.5 . and one Law-giver over the Conscience , Jam. 4.12 . Therefore no man ought to be compelled by persecution , to a worship wherein he hath not Faith ) is not the obscurity of the Scriptures , but their winking with their eyes , lest they should see that that would take away their honours and profits ? For , if Bribes blind the eyes of the Wise , Deut. 16.19 . then Honours and Profits much more : For , who seeth not , if none should be compelled by persecution to worship God in Spirit and Truth ( such only worship Him , and none but such are required to worship Him , Joh. 4.23 . ) that these Learned would lose their Honours & Profits , in being Lords and Law-makers over the conscience & souls of men : although your Majesty might lawfully give them what temporal Honours and Profits your Highness liked of . These are the true causes of the blindness of the Learned : For so Christ saith , : How can ye believe when ye seek honour one of another , and seek not the Honour that cometh from God alone ? Joh. 5.44 . And how can men but be blind in gods Mysteries , when they look to their own way , for their own advantage , and for their own purpose ; for , having rejected the Word of the Lord , what wisdom is in them ? they have no answer of God , that build up their Sion ( for so they account their Churches and Professions ) with blood , and Jerusalem with iniquity , as before is proved . If these Learned could free us from the Lords wrath ; or , if they might answer for us , and we be free ; it were safe for us to submit our selves , and captivate our judgments and practice to them ; but seeing they cannot so much as deliver their own souls , And that if the blind lead the blind , both must fall into the Ditch , Mat. 15.14 . and , Every one must give account of himself to God , and be judged by his own works done in the flesh , and that the soul that sinneth shall dye , We dare not follow any mortal man in matters of salvation further than we know him to agree with the meaning of God in the Scriptures . Paul the holy Apostle of Jesus Christ , taught , That we should follow him no otherwise than he followed Christ , 1 Cor. 11.1 . Yea , Christ himself sent men to the Scriptures to try his Doctrine . The Apostles suffered their Doctrine to be tryed , and commend them that try it . And the Protestants confess , Whit. pag. 127. This Doctrine was never misliked , till a Church rose up , whose Silver being Dross , and whose Milk , Poyson , could not endure the tryal : which being true , that we may try , why may we not also judge and practise according as Gods Spirit shall direct us in our tryal ? If a man should drink poison , and know it to be poison , were he not in a worse estate than he that should drink it ignorantly not knowing thereof ? even a murderer of himself in the highest degree : So he that drinketh spiritual poison , knowing it , ( for according unto mens faith it is unto them ) he is in a worse estate , and a murderer of his own soul in the highest degree . And therefore that Church , or those Learned , that will suffer their Doctrine to be tryed , and yet constrain men to receive and practise it , when upon examination their consciences are convinced of the falshood thereof , are worse , and do more highly sin , than they that constrain a blind conscience , though both be evil . We despise not Learning , nor Learned men , but do reverence it and them , according to their worthiness ; only when it is advanced into the seat of God , and that given to it which appertaineth unto the holy Ghost , which is to lead into all Truth , than ought all , as Ezekiah did unto the brazen Serpent , detest it and contemn it . CHAP. 6 , Persecution for cause of Conscience , is against the Doctrine of Jesus Christ , King of Kings . 1. CHRIST commanded that the Tares and Wheat ( which are those that walk in the Truth , and those that walk in falshood ) should be let alone in the world , and not plucked up until the harvest , which is the end of the world , Mat. 13.30 , 38 , &c. 2. The same commandeth , Mat. 15.14 . That they that are blindly led on in false Religion , and are offended with him for teaching true Religion , should be let alone , referring their punishment unto their falling into the Ditch . 3. Again , Luke 9.54 , 55. He reproved his Disciples ( who would have had Fire come down from Heaven and devoured those Samaritans that would not receive him ) in these words , Ye know not of what spirit ye are : the Son of man is not come to destroymens lives , but to save them . 4. Paul the Apostle of our Lord teacheth , 2 Tim. 2.24 . That the servant of the Lord must not strive , but must be gentle towards all men , suffering the evil men , instructing them with meekness that are contrary-minded ; proving if God at any time will give them repentance , that they may acknowledge the Truth , and come to amendment out of the snare of the Devil , &c. 5. According to these aforesaid Commandments , the holy Prophets foretold , that when the Law of Moses concerning Worship should cease , and Christs Kingdom be established , then all carnal weapons should cease , Isa . 2.4 . Micah 4.3 , 4. They shall break their Swords into Mattocks , and their Spears into Sithes , &c. And Isa . 11.9 . Then shall none hurt nor destroy in all the Mountain of my Holiness , &c. And when he came , the same he taught and practised as begore , so did his Apostles after him ; for the weapons of his warfare are not carnal , &c. 2 Cor. 10.4 . But he charged strictly , that his Disciples should be so far from persecuting those that would not be of their Religion , that when they were persecuted they should pray , Mat. 5. when they were cursed , they should bless : the reason is , because they that are now Tares may hereafter become Wheat : tehy who are now blind , may hereafter see ; they that now resist him , may hereafter receive him ; they that are now in the Devils snare , in adversness to the Truth , may hereafter come to repentance ; they that are now Blasphemers , Persecutors & Oppressors , as Paul was , may in time become Faithful as he ; they that are now Idolaters , as the Corinths once were , 1 Cor. 6.9 . may hereafter become true worshippers as they ; they that are now no People of God , nor under mercy , as the Saints sometimes were , 1 Pet. 2.20 . may hereafter become the People of God , and obtain mercy as they . Some come not till the eleventh hour , Mat. 20.6 . if those that come not till the last hour should be destroyed because they came not at the first , then should they never come , but be prevented . And why do men call themselves Christians , and do not the things Christ would ? CHAP. 7. Persecution for cause of Conscience , is against the profession and practice of famous Princes . First , we beseech your Majesty we may relate your own worthy Sayings , in your Majesties Speech at Parliament , 1609. Your Highness saith , It is a sure Rule in Divinity , that God never loves to plant his Church by violence and bloodshed , &c. And in your Highness Apol. pag. 4. speaking of such Papists as took the Oath , thus : I gave a good proof that I intended no persecution against them for Conscience cause , but only desired to secured for civil obedience , which for Conscience cause they were bound to perform . And pag. 60. speaking of Blackwel the Arch-Priest , your Majesty saith , It was never my intention to lay any thing to the said Arch-Priests charge , as I have never done to any for cause of Conscience , &c. And in your Highness Expos . on Revel . 20. printed 1588 , and after 1603. your Majesty truly writeth thus : Sixtly , The compassing of the Saints , and besieging of the beloved City , declareth unto us a certain note of a false Church to be Persecution ; For they come to seek the Faithful , the Faithful are those that are sought : the Wicked are the besiegers , the Faithful be besieged . Secondly , the saying of Stephen King of Poland : I am King of men , not of Consciences ; a Commander of bodies , not of Souls , &c. Thirdly , the King of Bohemia hath thus written : And notwithstanding the success of the later time , wherein sundry opinions have been hatched about the subject of Religion , may make one clearly discern with his eye , and ( as it were ) touch with his finger , that according to the verity of holy Scripture , and a Maxime heretofore held and maintained by the ancient Doctors of the Church , That mens Consciences ought in no sort to be violated , urged or constrained ; and whensoever men have attempted any thing by this violent course , whether openly or by secret means , the issue hath been pernicious , and the cause of great and wonderful Innovasions in the principallest and mightiest Kingdoms and Countries of all Christendom , &c. And further his Majesty saith , So that once more we do protest before God and the whole world , that from this time forward we are firmly resolved , not to persecute or molest , or suffer to be persecuted or molested any person whosoever for matter of Religion , no not they that profess themselves to be of the Roman Church , neither to trouble or disturb them in the exercise of their Religion , so they live conformable to the Laws of the States , &c. And for the practice of this , Where is Persecution for cause of Conscience , except in England , and where Popery reigns ? and not there neither in all places , as appeareth by France , Poland , and other places ; Nay , it is not practised among the Heathen that acknowledge not the true God , as the Turk , Persian and others . CHAP. 8. Persecution for cause of Conscience , is condemned by the ancient and later Writers , yea , by Puritans and Papists . HIllary against Anxentius , saith thus : The Christian Church doth not persecute , but is persecuted ; and lamentable it is to see the great folly of these times , and to sigh at the foolish opinion of this world , in that men think by humane aid to help God , and with worldly pomp and power to undertake to defend the Christian Church . I ask of you Bishops , what help used the Apostles in the publishing of the Gospel ? With the aid of what Power did they preach Christ , and converted the Heathen from their Idolatry to God ? When they were Imprisoned and lay in Chains , did they praise and give thanks to God for any dignities , graces and favours received from the Court ? Or , do you think that Paul went about with Regal Mandates , or Kingly Authority to gather and establish the Church of Christ ? Sought he Protection from Nero Vespatian ? &c. The Apostles wrought with their hands for their own maintenance , travelling by land and water from Town to City to preach Christ ; yea , the more they were forbidden , the more they taught and preached Christ . But now alas , humane help must assist and protect the Faith , and give the same countenance ; To , and by vain and worldly honours do men seek to defend the Church of Christ , as if He by his Power were unable to perform it . The same , against the Arians : The Church now which formerly by enduring Misery and Imprisonment , was known to be a true Church , doth now terrific others , by Imprisonment , Banishment , and Misery , and boasteth that she is highly esteemed of the world ; whereas the true Church cannot but be hated of the same . Tertul. ad Scapul . It agreeth both with humane Equity and natural Reason , that every man worship God uncompelled , and believe what he will ; for , another mans Religion or Blief neither hurteth nor profiteth any man : neither beseemeth it any Religion , to compel another to be of their Religion , which willingly and freely should be imbraced , and not by constraint : for asmuch as the Offerings were required of those that freely and with a good will offered , and not from the contrary . Jerom. in Proaem lib. 4. in Jeremiam . Heresie must be cut off with the sword of the Spirit ; Let us strike through with the arrows of the Spirit all sons and disciples of misled Hereticks , that is with testimonies of holy Scriptures : The slaughter of Hereticks is by the Word of God. Brentius on 1 Cor. 3. No man hath power to make ( or give ) Laws to Christians , whereby to bind their Consciences : For willingly , freely , and uncompelled , with a ready desire and chearful mind must those that come , run unto Christ . Luther in his Book of the Civil Magistrate . The Laws of the Civil Government extends no further than over the body or goods , and to that which is external : for , over the Soul God will not suffer any man to rule , only He himself will rule there : Therefore wheresoever the Civil Magistrate doth undertake to give Laws unto the Soul and Consciences of men , he usurpeth that Government to himself which appertaineth to God , &c. The same upon 1 King. 6. In building of the Temple there was no sound of Iron heard , to signifie that Christ will have in his Church a free and willing People , not compelled and constrained by Laws and statutes . Again , he saith upon Luke 22. It is not the true Catholick Church which is defended by the Seculare arm or Humane power , but the false and feigned Church ; which although it carries the name of a Church , yet it denyes the power thereof . And upon Psal . 17. he saith , For the true Church of Christ knoweth not Brachium Seculare , which the Bishops now a dayes chiefly use . Again , in Postil . Dom. 1. post . Epiph. he saith , Let not Christians be commanded , but exhorted ; for he that will not willingly do that whereunto he is friendly exhorted , he is no Christian : Therefore those that do compel them that are not willing , shew thereby that they are not Christian Preachers , but worldly Beadles . Again , upon 1 Pet. 3. he saith , If the Civil Magistrate would command me to believe thus or thus , I should answer him after this manner ; Lord , or Sir , look you to your Civil or worldly Government , your Power extends not so far , to command any thing in Gods Kingdom , therefore herein I may not hear you : For if you cannot suffer that any man should usurp Authority where you have to command , how do you think that God should suffer you to thrust him from his seat , and to seat your self therein ? The Puritans , as appeareth in their Answer to Admonit . to Parl. pag. 109. That Papists nor others , neither constrainedly nor customally communicate in the mysteries of Salvation . Also in their Supplication , printed , 1609 , pag. 21 , &c. much they write for Toleration . Lastly , the Papists , the inventers of Persecution ; in a wicked Book lately set forth , thus they write : Moreover , the means which Almighty God appointed his Officers to use in the conversion of Kingdoms and People , was , Humility , Patience , Charity , &c. Saying , Behold , I send you as sheep in the midst of wolves , Mat. 10.16 . He did not say , I send you as wolves among sheep , to kill , imprison , spoil and devour those unto whom they were sent . Again , ver . 7. he saith , They to whom I send you will deliver you up in Councils , and in their Synagogues they will scourge you ; and to Presidents and to Kings shall you be led for my sake : He doth not say , You whom I send shall deliver the people ( whom you ought to convert ) into Councils , and put them in Prisons , and lead them to Presidents and Tribunal Seats , and make their Religion Felony and Treason . Again , he saith , ver . 12. When ye enter into the house , salute it , saying , Peace be to this house : He doth not say , You shall send Pursevants to sansack and spoyl the house . Again , lie saith , Joh. 10. The good Pastor giveth his life for his sheep ; the Thief cometh not , but to steal , kill and destroy : He doth not say , the Thief giveth his life for his sheep , and the good Pastor cometh not but to steal , kill and destroy , &c. So that we holding our peace , our Adversaries themselves speak for us , or rather for the Truth . CHAP. 9. It is no prejudice to the Commonwealth if freedom of Religion were suffered , but would make it flourish . BE pleased not to hearken to mens leasings , but to what God and Experience teacheth in this thing : Abraham abode among the Canaanites a long-time , yet contrary to them in Religion , Gen. 13.7 , and 16.3 . Again , He sojourned in Gerar , and King Abimelech gave him leave to abide in his Land , Gen. 20 , & 21.33 , 34. Isaac also dwelt in the same Land , yet contrary in Religion , Gen. 26. Jacob lived twenty years in one house with his uncle Laban , yet differed in Religion , Gen. 31. The People of Israel were 430 years in that famous Land of Egypt , and afterwards 70 years in Babylon , all which times they differed in Religion from the States ; Exod. 12. and 2 Chron. 36. Come to the time of Christ , where Israel was under the Romans , where lived divers sects of Religions , as Herodians , Scribes and Pharifees , Saduces , Libertines , Theudaeans , Samaritans , besides the common Religion of the Jews , Christ and his Apostles , all which differed from the common Religion of the State , which ( is like ) was the Worship of Diana , which almost the whole world then worshipped , Act. 19.20 . All these lived under the Government of Caesar , being nothing-hurtfull to the State and Commonwealth ; for they gave unto Caesar that which was his ; and for Religion to God , he left them to themselves , as having no dominion therein . And when the enemies of the Truth raised up any Tumults , the wisdom of the Magistrates most wisely appeased them , as Acts 18.14 , &c. and 19.35 , &c. Again , be pleased to look into the neighbour Nations who tolerate Religion , how their Wealths and States are governed ; many sorts of Religions are in their Dominions , yet no trouble of State , no Treason , no hinderance at all of any good , but much prosperities brought unto their Countries , they having all one harmony in matters of State , giving unto Caesar his due , and for Religion they suffer one another . If any object the Troubles of France , Germany , &c. We answer : They are such as have been procured by the learned , but most bloody Jesuites , who seek to establish their Religion by blood , for subversion of whom your Wisdoms are wise to deal in : Yet be pleased not to let faithful Subjects be punished for their wickedness : But let most severe Laws be made for the maintenance of Civil and humane Peace and Welfare , as to your Majesty and others shall seem expedient . And if it be well observed , it is the Learned that raised up all the bloody Wars among the Princes of the Earth . CHAP. 10. King are not deprived of any Power given them of God , when they maintain Freedom for cause of Conscience . WE know the Learned do perswade that Kings have power from God to maintain the Worship and Service of God , as they have power to maintain Right and Justice between man and man ; For Christian Kings ( say they ) have the same power , that the Kings of Israel had under the Law. For answer to which , First , let it be observed , the Kings of Israel had never power from God to make new Laws , or set up new Worships which Gods Word required not ; nor to set high Priests , or Spiritual Lords for the performance of the Services , other than such as God by Moses expresly had commanded ; and therefore the power of the Kings of Israel will warrant to Kings to make or confirm Canons , set up new Worships , and appoint Spiritual Lords and Law givers to the Conscience , and persecute all that submit not to them , 2. Let it be well observed , only the Kings of Israel had this power , but no other Kings , whose Commonwealths did flourish to them and their seeds after them to many generations : and it must be granted that he that is King of Israel now , which is Jesus Christ , ( the truth of those typical Kings of Israel ) he hath the power according to the proportion ; the temporal Kings had temporal power to compel all to the observation of those carnal or temporal Commandments , Heb. 7.16 . and 9.10 . So Christ the Spiritual King , hath Spiritual Power to compel all to the observation of his Spiritual Commandments ; For when he came , himself said , Joh. 4.23 . The hour cometh , and now is , when the true Worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth ; for the Father requireth even such to worship him . If Christ be only King of Israel , that sits upon Davids Throne for ever , as he is , Acts 2.30 . far be it from any King to take Christs seat from him . The Wisdom of God foresaw , that seeing the Misteries of the Gospel are such spiritual things , as no natural men ( though they be Princes of this world ) can know them ; he left not Kings and Princes to be Lords and Judges thereof , seeing they are subject to erre , but he left that Power to his beloved Son , who could not erre ; and the Son left his only Deputy the holy Ghost , and no moral man whatsoever , as your Highness worthily acknowledgeth , in Apol. pag. 46. I utterly deny that there is any earthly Monarch over the Church whose word must be a Law , and who cannot erre by an infallibility of spirit . Because earthly Kingdoms must have earthly Monarchs , it doth not follow the Church must have a visible Monarch too . Christ is the Churches Monarch , and the holy Ghost his Deputy . The Kings of the Gentiles reign over them ; but you shall not be so , &c. Luke 22. Christ when he ascended left not Peter with them to direct them into all truth , but premised to send the holy Ghost unto them for that end , &c. Further , these Learned alledge the Commandments , Exod. 23.33 . Deut. 7. and Deut. 13. where Israel are commanded to destroy all the Inhabitants of the Land , lest they intice them to serve their gods ; and to slay all false prophets , &c. These they collect from the time of the Law , for in the time of the Gospel they have nothing to alledge ; for , Rom. 13. maketh nothing for their purpose , Caesar being a Heathen King. For answer unto the places of Moses : first , The sins of this people the Canaanites were full , and the Lord would destroy them , and give their possessions unto the Israelites ; but the sins of the refusers of Christ , are not full until the end , or last hour , as before is proved . 2. The Children of Israel had a special Commandment from the Lord to destroy them ; but the Kings of the Nations have no Command at all to destroy the bodies of the contrary-minded ; nay , they are expresly forbidden it , Mat. 13.29.3 . The Canaanites would have rebelled against Israel , and have des ; troyed them ; but the contrary-minded will not rebell against their Kings , but give unto them the things that belong unto them ; not so much for fear , as of conscience : and of this the GOD of Gods is Witness . 4. The Heads and Rulers of Israel could command and compel the people to observe those carnal Rites and Ordinances of the Law ; even as CHRIST the Head and Ruler of Israel can compel to the observations of his spiritual Ordinances of the Gospel ; but the Heads of the Nations cannot compel their Subjects to believe the Gospel ; for Faith is the gift of God ; which Faith if they want , all they do in Gods Worship is sin , Rom. 14.23 . Heb. 11.6 . Therefore they cannot compel any to worship , because they cannot give them Faith ; for which cause the Lord in wisdom saw it not meet to charge Kings with a duty which they cannot perform , God will never require it at their hands ; the blood of the faithless and unbelieving shall be on their own heads ; He that will not believe shall be damned , Mark 16.16 . Again , Seeing it is true , as your Majesty well observeth in your Highness speech at Parl. 1609. That the Judicials of Moses were only fit for that time , and those persons : And also it is confessed , the Law for Adultery , Theft , and the like , is not now to be executed according to the Judicials of Moses , nor directions for the Magistrates of the Earth to walk by ; Why should these be any directions for them , seing also our Savior and his Apostles have taught the contrary , as before hath been proved ? If all false Prophets should be now executed , according to Deut. 13. the Kings of the Earth would not onely be deprived of many of their Subjects ; but the Cities of their habitation , with all the Inhabitants of the Cities , must be destroyed with the edge of the sword ; the cattel thereof , and all the spoyl thereof must be brought into the midst of the City , and the City and all therein by burnt with fire , be made a heap of stones for ever , and never be built again : which God forbid such execration should ever be seen . And if these Judicials of Moses be not now directions for the Kings of Nations , we reade not in all the Book of God , any directions given to Kings to rule in matters of Conscience and Spiritual Worship to God : But often we reade that the Kings of the Nations shall give their power to the Beast , and fight against the Lamb , Rev. 16.14 . and 17.2 , 12 , 13 , 14 , 18. and 18. 3 , 9. and 19.19 . as lamentable experience hath plainly taught it . Thus all men may see there is only deceit in these Learned mens comparisons of the Kings of Israel in the Law , with the Kings of Nations in time of the Gospel , in matters of Religion . Much might be written to prove , that Kings are not deprived of their power by permitting of Freedom of Religion , but are rather deprived thereof by using compulsion to the contrary-minded , and do sin grievously , in causing them to sin for want of Faith ; but this may suffice , the Almighty blessing it with his blessing , which we humbly-beseech Him for his Christs sake , for his own Glory sake , for the prosperity and welfare of these Kingdoms , and for the comfort of your faithful and true-hearted Subjects , that are now distressed by long and lingring Imprisonments and otherwise ; who of conscience give unto Caesar the things which are his , Which is , to be Lord and Law-giver to the Bodies of his Subjects , and all belonging to their outward-man , for the preservation of himself , and his good Subjects , and for the punishment of the evil ; In which preservation , the Church of Christ hath a special part , when their outward Peace is thereby preserved from the fury of all adversaries ; in which respect Princes are called Nursing Fathers , as many are at this day , blessed be our Lord. Oh be pleased to consider , why you should persecute us for humbly beseeching you in the words of the King of kings , Mat. 22.21 . To give unto God the things which are Gods ; which is , to be Lord and Law-giver to the soul in that Spiritual Worship and Service which he requireth : If you will take away this from God , What is it that is Gods ? Far be it from you to desire to sit in the Consciences of men , to be Law-giver and Judge therein . This is Antichrists practice , perswading the Kings of the Earth to give him their power to compel all hereunto : But whosoever submitteth , shall drink of Gods fierce wrath Revel . 14.9 , 10. You may make and mend your own Laws , and be Judge and Punisher of the transgressors , thereof ; but you cannot make or mend Gods Laws , they are perfect already , Psal . 19.7 . You may not adde nor diminish , Deut. 4.2 . Rev. 22.18 , 19. Nor be Judge , nor Monarch of his Church , that is CHRISTS Right ; he left neither you , nor any mortal man his Deputy , but only the holy Ghost , as your Highness acknowledgeth , And whosoever erreth from the Truth , his Judgment is set down , 2 Thess . 1.8 , &c. Rom. 2.8 , &c. and the time thereof , Matth. 13.40 . and 25.31 , &c. Rom. 2.16 . This is the Sum of our humble Petition , That your Majesty would be pleased , not to persecute your faithful Subjects ( who are obedient to you in all Civil Worship and Service ) for walking in the practice of what Gods Word requireth of us , for his Spiritual Worship , as we have Faith ; knowing ( as your Majesty truly writeth in your Medit. on Mat. 27. pag. 69. in these words ) We can use no Spiritual Worship or Prayer , that can be available to us without Faith. This is the sum of our most humble Petition , thus manifoldly proved to be just . O LORD GOD of Glory , raise up in this High Assembly , the heart of some Nehemiah , of some Ebed-melech , That may open their mouthes ( for the Dumb , that cannot speak for themselves ) in a Truth so apparant as this is , lest it be said , as Isa . 59.16 , And when he saw that there was no man , he wondred that none would offer himself ; Therefore his Arm did save it , and his Righteousness it self did sustain it . And now we cease not to pray for the King , and his Son , and his Seed , and this whol High and Honourable Assembly , now and alwayes , Calling the all-seeing God to witness , that we are your Majesties loyal Subjects not for fear only , but for Conscience sake . Unjustly called , ANA-BAPTISTS