Confidence dismounted. Or a letter to Mr Richard Resburie of Oundle in North-Hamptonshire, upon occasion, partly of a title page prefixed before a small treatise of his concerning election & reprobation, conflicting of six sermons preached by him about three years since, and lately published; the said title page bearing in front these words, some stop to the gangrene of Arminianism, lately promoted by Mr John Goodwin, in his book intituled Redemption Redeemed; partly also, a short preface or epistle prefixed by the said Mr Resbury to that his treatise. / By the said John Goodvvin, Minister of the Gospel. Goodwin, John, 1594?-1665. This text is an enriched version of the TCP digital transcription A74862 of text R206012 in the English Short Title Catalog (Thomason E643_18). 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This Phase I text is available for reuse, according to the terms of Creative Commons 0 1.0 Universal . The text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. Early English books online. (EEBO-TCP ; phase 1, no. A74862) Transcribed from: (Early English Books Online ; image set 117457) Images scanned from microfilm: (Thomason Tracts ; 99:E643[18]) Confidence dismounted. Or a letter to Mr Richard Resburie of Oundle in North-Hamptonshire, upon occasion, partly of a title page prefixed before a small treatise of his concerning election & reprobation, conflicting of six sermons preached by him about three years since, and lately published; the said title page bearing in front these words, some stop to the gangrene of Arminianism, lately promoted by Mr John Goodwin, in his book intituled Redemption Redeemed; partly also, a short preface or epistle prefixed by the said Mr Resbury to that his treatise. / By the said John Goodvvin, Minister of the Gospel. Goodwin, John, 1594?-1665. 21, [1] p. Printed by John Macock, for Henry Cripps and Lodowick Lloyd, and are to be sold at their shop in Popes head Alley, London : 1651. Signed at end: Octob. 15. 1651; John Goodwin. Annotation on Thomason copy: "October. 17th". Reproduction of the original in the British Library. eng Resbery, Richard, 1607-1674. -- Some stop to the gangrene of Arminianism. Goodwin, John, 1594?-1665. Arminianism -- England -- Early works to 1800. Great Britain -- History -- Commonwealth and Protectorate, 1649-1660 -- Early works to 1800. A74862 R206012 (Thomason E643_18). civilwar no Confidence dismounted. Or a letter to Mr Richard Resburie of Oundle in North-Hamptonshire,: upon occasion, partly of a title page prefixed Goodwin, John 1651 9506 2 50 0 0 0 0 55 D The rate of 55 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the D category of texts with between 35 and 100 defects per 10,000 words. 2007-09 TCP Assigned for keying and markup 2007-09 Apex CoVantage Keyed and coded from ProQuest page images 2007-10 Emma (Leeson) Huber Sampled and proofread 2007-10 Emma (Leeson) Huber Text and markup reviewed and edited 2008-02 pfs Batch review (QC) and XML conversion Confidence Dismounted . OR A LETTER TO Mr Richard Resburie of Oundle in North-Hamptonshire , upon occasion , partly of a Title Page prefixed before a small Treatise of his concerning ELECTION & REPROBATION , Consisting of six Sermons preached by him about three years since , and lately published ; the said Title Page bearing in front these words , Some stop to the Gangrene of Arminianism , lately promoted by Mr John Goodwin , in his book intituled Redemption Redeemed ; Partly also , of a short Preface or Epistle prefixed by the said Mr Resbury to that his Treatise . By the said JOHN GOODVVIN , Minister of the Gospel . Desiring to be teachers of the Law , understanding neither what they say , nor whereof they affirm , 1 Tim. 1. 7. Nonnulli intelligentes citiùs volunt exagitare quod non intelligunt , quàm , quaerere ut intelligant , & non fiunt humiles inquisitores , sed superbi Calumniatores . Aug. de Temp. Serm. 72. Nusquam lego , quid erras , quid delinquis , Pulvis ? sed lego , quid superbis terra & cinis ? Musculus in Esa. 64. {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} . chrisost. . Hom. 7. ad Philip . LONDON , Printed by John Macock , for Henry Cripps and Lodowick Lloyd , and are to be sold at their shop in Popes head Alley . 1651. Confidence Dismounted ; OR A Letter to Mr Richard Resbury . SIR , MEeting lately with a little Book published under the Name of one Mr Richard Resbury ( a Gentleman , whose face , to my best remembrance , I never saw , whose name I never heard of , until now , ) in the Frontispiece whereof , and more especially in the Epistle to the Reader prefixed to it , I found many hard and unchristian sayings uttered , not onely against me ( which had been more venial , ) but against those most blessed and important Truths of God , for the vindication whereof against the contrary Errors ( being of most pernicious consequence , as I have demonstratively proved , & which is indeed a thing in it self sufficiently manifest , ) he was graciously pleased to stir up and arm my spirit , I judged my self so far a a debtor to the honor of those truths ( asserted by me ) and to mine own innocency , yea and to the interest of your comfort and peace also , as to declare briefly unto you , and to the World with you , how inconsiderately ( that I say not , unworthily ) you have vented your self both against a person , who never did you , nor meant you , the least harm , as likewise against those manifest Truths of God , which stand ready prest to bless you , if you reject not their blessing . And first I cannot but with bowels of compassion over you , take knowledg of that sad and most unchristian misdemeanor in you ( which I finde also in the generality of those , whose Judgments are entangled and polluted with the same erroneous conceits of God , his counsels and ways , with you . ) As the blinde and bloody persecuting Heathen of old , were wont to put the Christians into Wolves and Bears skins , and then to set Mastive dogs and other wilde beasts upon them , to tear in pieces and devour them ; so do you clothe with , and present the great Truths of God , under reproachful names , as of Arminianism , Pelagianism , and such like clamorous and scandalous imputations ( of Satanical device ) and then encourage your selves , and embolden your Consciences , to storm , and rage , and rail your pleasures against them . But if that be a Gangrene of Arminianism , which you charge me to have lately promoted , I marvel under the shadow of what conceit , or notion of hope , you stile your piece , Some Stop to it . If you expect your Book should work after the manner of a charm , or spell , ( as I confess many such pieces do upon persons of weak and light apprehensions ) you have the same ground to honor your Book with such a title , which you have for such an expectation . But if you look that it should operate upon the Judgments and Consciences of men onely by that evidence and demonstration of the Spirit , which shall appear in it , doubtless you had very slender grounds to think , that it should give any stop to the Gangrene you speak of . I beleeve I have far better grounds to judg that it will occasion a further spreading of this Gangrene , and give no stop at all to it . They that are armed with Will and preoccupation , against the Doctrines asserted in my Book of Redemption , who are the onely persons with whom your Book is like to finde approbation and applause , are far from the happy danger of being infected with the said Gangrene : and therefore your Book is no ways medicinal unto them . The whole need not the Physician . A Gangrene cannot be stop'd , where it never comes . As for those , who have conscientiously enquired into , and diligently weighed the grounds of those Doctrines , which you think to blast with an angry puff of Arminianism , and have throughly tasted the spirit and life which reign in the Doctrines themselvs , they are far enough out of the reach of your unhallowed Notions , or from being taken in those snares of your ridiculous pretending to magnifie God , and his Grace ; which you spread in the way of the simple . And for such persons , who possibly may be at present unsatisfied whether the Truth be on your side of the way , or on mine , but withall are seriously engaged ( as becometh those , who are resolved not to lose their Souls for want of looking to , in such a posture ) {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} , to follow , and , if it be possible , to finde out the truth , your Sermons are much more like to bring the gangrene you speak of , into their Judgments , then any ways to stop or prevent it . For doubtless such monstrous Principles , such uncouth , hard , and horrid Notions and thoughts concerning God and his Grace , which are the pillars of your Tenents and Discourse , are not like to sway the Judgments or Consciences of conscientious Enquirers , unless it be the contrary way . Nor can I give any account unto my self , why you should ( in your Title page ) pretend any thing soveraign in your Book against the danger of infection from me , or what hath been written by me , unless it be this ; viz. That this Book of yours having for some years ( as you acknowledg , if not complain , in your Preface , or Epistle to your Reader ) layn upon your hands as a drug , or dead commodity , you thought by setting such a face or gloss upon it , to make it vendible . For as Erasmus sometimes said of Luther , that poor Luther made many rich ; meaning , by occasion of his writing against the Pope , and such Doctrines , which were the pillars of his Throne and Kingdom , which whosoever would undertake to oppose or confute , had great matters of preferment cast upon them ; so I perceive that my poor Writings are like occasionally to enrich many with credit , approbation , and applause from men : and that as Caleb promised his daughter Achsah to wife , to whosoever should smite Kiriath-Sepher , and take it ; so doth that Spirit that is abroad amongst those that are called Ministers of the Gospel amongst us ( though they preach another Gospel , in effect , and not that of Christ Jesus ) promise honor , name , and applause unto any man , that shal but offer to smite either my person , or writing with his tongue , or pen , though they speak or write , neither truth , nor any thing to purpose , against either . And Mr Resbury ( it seems ) hath harkened unto the encouragement of this Spirit , and by his Title-page hath tempted the World to beleeve , that he hath done some worthy thing against me in my Book of Redemption , whereas it cannot reasonably be thought by any thing in his Book , that ever he look'd any argument , or line of mine , in the face . So far is he from answering any thing argued or asserted by me , either {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} , or {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} . Yet not content with the sound of his own Trumpet ( in the Frontispiece of his Book ) by which he would give the world to hope that he was preparing to battel against me , he , or some factor of his about the City , have purchased the lowder blasts of two Trumpets more to make the same sound , and have bought of two of our common Diurnalists their respective Out-cries , or Proclamarees , to call the world together to be Spectators of his learned valour against me , and my Book . Indeed in his Preface he supplies in most untrue and unchristian revilings of my person , that which in his Discourse is wanting in weight and substance of matter for answer to my Book . But the Spirit I spake of , suggested ( it seems ) this unto him ; If thou beest not able to grapple with his Writings , lay on load of reproach upon his person : thou shalt have a good reward for thy labor as well in the one kind , as in the other : they shall prosper both alike in thy hand . But Sir , I beseech you by the love you either bear , or pretend to bear unto the Lord Christ , with what goodness of Conscience , or face of ingenuity , can you say , that the main Truths of God concerning his Electing and Redeeming Grace ( asserted , as you say , by you , in your Sermons ) have been by the daring hand of that unhappy man Mr John Goodwin , in his wretched Treatise , by him called ( but miscalled ) Redemption Redeemed , been so highly assaulted ; when as you neither have shewed , much less proved , nor ( I have very sufficient ground to believe ) are able to prove , that so much as any one , no not the least of these Truths , have been in the lightest manner assaulted by me in this Treatise ? Sir , I trust you will suffer this word of Christian Admonition from him , who God knoweth , and your own Conscience may know , is no enemy unto you , nor to your peace , nor to your honour or reputation ; that such causless , groundless , and wretched aspersions and reproaches cast upon your Christian Brethren , as these , will never make your face to shine with any true or permament lustre , nor abound to your account in the great day . In terming me , an unhappy man , you speak truth enough in one sence , and little enough in another . It is my unhappiness , in point of honour and respects with men , not to be believed , when I speak the truth ; and much more , that my speaking the truth should prove a stumbling stone unto so many , and occasion their falling into the great and dangerous sins of hard speaking , reviling , persecuting with the tongue , hating , opposing , calumniating the Truth manifested unto them . In all this I am ( I confess ) an unhappy man . But the Lord Jesus Christ himself was in all such respects as these , an unhappy man also , being set as well for the falling , as for the rising of many in Israel . But that he was a sweet savour unto God , as well in those who perish , as in those that are saved by him , as well in those who fall by occasion of him , as in those who rise , he was a person thrice happy and blessed . And I should deny the signal grace and goodness of God towards me , if I should not judg my self happy in those ( not a few ) who have been built up by my hand in the knowledg of God , in the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ , in the peace and joy of their Souls ; yea and in the reproaches , hard sayings , and evil entreaties which I meet with from Mr Resbury and others , in as much as these also work for me so much a better resurrection , and a far more exceeding eternal weight of glory . In what sence you call my Treatise of Redemption , wretched , I do not well understand . If you mean it , wretched , in respect of the sad doom that hath befallen it , by falling into the hands of such hard-spirited men as you and some others are , who by unjust clamours and reviling , set your selves to render the condition of it as calamitous and miserable , as you can , I confess your epithete of wretched may stand : I think it is one of the wretchedest Treatises in the world ( in this sence . ) But if you call it wretched , in respect of the matter , or native tendency and import of the Doctrine contained therein , as if this tended , or had any thing in it likely to make any person under Heaven wretched , or miserable , your Epithete it self is wretched ( in this sence , ) because it directly tends to make men miserable and wretched , by dividing their judgments and affections from such Truths , which would make them happy , were they received and submitted unto by them . Whereas you seem desirous to pick a quarrel against my hand , by terming it , during ; I confess my hand , and heart too , are very daring , venturous , and bold in assaulting Error , how strongly soever fortified by the judgments , affections , interests , preoccupations , Authorities , credits , writings of men . That clear , satisfying , and convincing light of the knowledg of the Truth , which God hath graciously shined into my heart , teacheth my hand to war , and my fingers to fight , against all that is lesser and lower then God in the quarrel and cause of the Truth . And if you count it a blemish , or disparagement unto my hand , to be daring ( in this kind , ) it is a sign that your own hand hath little courage for the Truth , nor that it dares lift up it self in the defence of it , unless it hath a proud arm of flesh to stand by it , and second it in the engagement . But I perceive that Mr Resburies hand it self is daring enough , whether in the cause of Error , or of Truth , when he thinks he hath hands enough with him to bring him off with honour , though he be foyled . Whether in calling my Treatise , Redemption Redeemed , I miscall it , or no , will in due time be judged by a streighter Rule then Mr Resburies sence or notion in the case , and by a far more competent Judg , then He. In the mean time , you will give me leave ( I trust ) to marvel a little , that you , professing your self so devoted an enemy to that , which you call Arminianism ( though I have cause in abundance to judg that you little know what Arminianism indeed meaneth , ) should notwithstanding practise that , which you call ( though you miscall it ) the Arminian mode so frequently , as you do , in spreading a table of Imperial Dictates , in stead of Arguments , before your Reader . This is more like to be the mode of those , who deny the lawfulness of the interposure or use of reason in matters of Religion , then theirs , who profess to hold nothing , to believe nothing in such things , but only what they see or apprehend sufficient reason to evince the truth in . But I fear Mr Resbury was conscious of this nakedness in himself , and fellows , ( I mean , of dictating like Emperors , in stead of arguing like Teachers , ) and hoped to cover it , with a covering made of a bold imputation of it to his adversaries . For what Argument , or proof , or colour of either , doth he bring , or can he bring , to evince Truth in that charge against me , that in calling the Treatise he speaks of , Redemption Redeemed , I miscall it ? Your subtile insinuation , to have your self notioned like unto Michael the Arch-angel , and me unto the Devil , in this imprecatory prayer against me , The Lord rebuke him , I perfectly resent . But Sir , you should have done well to have considered , whether in case the Arch-angel had had to do with a man , as you have ( though as vile and sinful as you apprehend the man of your contest to be ) and not with the Devil , whether ( I say ) it be not probable , that he would have prayed for him , The Lord forgive thee , and not , the Lord rebuke thee , until his obstinacy had appeared . However , if I have so deeply finned , as you deem and doom me to have done , in judging me worthy to drink of the Devils cup after him , I shall joyn issue with you in the words of your prayer against me , and pray with you , The Lord rebuke me , only with Davids addition , not in his anger . Mr Resbury ( I fear ) is impatient of all rebuke , for his Errors , either from God , or man , though administred with never so much love and sweetness , by the one and the other . The ground of my fear in this kind , is , because I find that the bare pleading of the Truth , which contradicteth his Error , though without any reflexion in the least upon him , as holding any Error , becomes matter of very high and haynous provocation to him . And Sir , give me leave to doubt whether you had the consent of your Conscience , or no , in drawing up this charge against me , that for the present I so seriously despise , and so boldly bid defiance unto the peculiar Grace of God . Michael the Archangel durst not bring any railing , much less any forged or false , accusation against Satan himself , when he contended with him . If he had done this , he had fought against him with no better weapons , then those which Satan himself useth in his battels : he had plainly diabolized . It is a thing of most deplorable consideration unto me , that those who call themselves Ministers of the Gospel , and are so reputed by others , should so far harden themselves from the fear of the Lord , as to speak and spread abroad at pleasure , words of an infamous and disparaging import against their Brethren , ( who never gave them the least cause of offence , whatsoever was taken by them , ) and this without so much as any colourable pretence of truth in them . For Sir , I beseech you , what sentence , clause , word , sillable , letter , tittle , can you , or any other for you , find either in my Book of Redemption , or any other of my Writings , wherein I make the least semblance , or give the lightest intimation that can be imagined , that I at all , much less so seriously ( as your charge advanceth ) despise the peculiar Grace of God ? And yet the unchristian rage of your pen riseth much higher , and proclaims , that I also boldly bid defiance to it . Well might the Apostle James complain , that the tongue is a fire , a world of iniquity . I , especially in my Treatise of Redemption , am so far from despising the peculiar Grace of God , or from any bold bidding defiance to it , that I magnifie it upon all occasions with all my might ; and demonstrate the peculiarity , i. e. the signal excellency and glory of it , to consist in this , that it encompasseth the whole world about , and particularly visiteth and addresseth it self to every creature of mankind ( until it be rejected , ) and this in order to their Salvation . So that I make the Grace of God , which is saving in the nature and tendency of it , never the less , but rather the more peculiar , by commending the rich diffusiveness of it to particular men . As for that Grace of God , or rather that degree , or that operation of this Grace , which is actually and eventually saving unto men , I peculiarize it every whit as much , and ( for ought I yet know to the contrary ) upon the same terms , which Mr Resbury himself , and men of his Judgment generally do . For my sence and Judgment clearly is , that no person is actually saved , but by such an assistance or operation of the Grace of God , which no other person whatsoever partaketh of , or which is vouchsafed unto no other person , but only unto those , who are actually saved also . Only herein I may ( I conceive ) possibly dissent from them : They hold , that this peculiar actually-saving grace of God is upon such terms decreed by God , or intended to be given by God , unto those that come to be saved by it , that there was , or is , an absolute necessity for them to embrace it , and so to be saved by it ; whereas my sence is , that such grace is no otherwise decreed by God unto those , who in time come to receive it , and in fine to be actually saved by it , then it is unto others , who never come to receive it ; and that these might have received it , or come to be partakers of it , in the same way , and by the same means , by which those others , who are in conclusion saved by it , came to have part and fellowship in it . But this difference between Mr Resbury and me , about the peculiar Grace of God , doth no whit more prove me to be a serious despiser of it , or a bold bidder of defiance to it , then himself . Therefore his charge against me in this point is meerly clamorous and aspersive , and such as a tender Conscience would have trembled so much as to demur upon ; and how much more to have published ? Of a like staring and broad-fac'd untruth is that charge also , that I challenge an whole Vniversity . His ingenuous and modest words are these : Neither hath he , for ought I can ( and without partiality ) discern ( I know not how you should , in case you never read my Book , whereof I have more grounds then one , to be jealous ) at all repaired their loss , ( which is none at all , that either I , or you , know of , ) only concealing it from vulgar eyes , ( it seems you honor your own , as super-vulgar , ) he treads with confidence in their steps , ( if all be true , that you say , ) and that nothing may want to set IT off bravely , [ It ? What ? what Noun shall we find for a match to this Pronoun ? My Masters loss , of which you spake last , is but an untoward one for the relation , ] challengeth an whole Vniversity to remove him . Sir , I desire fairly and friendly between you and me , to understand from you , what either word , or carriage of mine , tempted or provoked you to cast this mire in my face , that I challenge an whole Vniversity to remove me ? I confess I dedicated my Book of Redemption , not to an whole University ( much less challenged an whole Vniversity , as you asperse , ) but to the Vice-chancellor of the Vniversity of Cambridg ( my worthy Friend and acquaintance , ) together with the rest of the Heads of Colledges , and Students in Divinity in that Vniversity . And they who shall please to peruse my Dedicatory Epistle before the said Book , will find , that I am so far from challenging those to whom I make the said Dedication , that I set my self to put all terms of honour and respect upon them , as far as is Christian , and meet to be done . Nor is there any one line throughout this whole Epistle , that , as far as I can imagine , hath so much as the softest ayr , or gentlest breathing of a challenge in it . And yet you not content to have traduced me , as a Challenger of an whole Vniversity , add drunkenness to thirst , ironically , and with the open breach of all the Laws of Ingenuity , ( that I say not of Piety it self , ) insult over me ( that I say not over the Spirit of Truth indeed , ) in these words ( immediately subjoyned , ) Doubtless such modesty and ingenuity must needs be the Character of the Spirit of Truth in him . Sir , the worst I wish you ( and there is no harm , I am certain , in the wish ) is , that some better and more pregnant character of the Spirit of Truth were discernable in you , then appears either in your Stop , or in your Epistle prefixed to it . Upon this occasion , I shall crave leave to inform you , that other manner of characters of the Spirit of Truth , and of a far more gracious import , were found ( and this in the Judgment , and by the Confession of some of his Enemies ) in my Great Master Arminius ( as you , who , it seems , claim your tongue , and pen , for your own , are pleased to stile him , though , as the saying is , you neither know why , nor wherefore , ) then the Consciences of your best Friends ( I fear ) have found in you ; though far be it from me to disparage you . You have one who disparageth you ( I am unfeignedly sorry to see it ) even your self . Towards the close of your Epistle , the remainder of your wrath , instead of refraining , you pour out in words seasoned with no better salt , then this : And here I now thank Mr Goodwin , whose darkness , I doubt not , will occasion more light , his boldness ( confident I am ) will excite modesty ; I will not say what an edg his sometimes imperial Dictates , in stead of Arguments ( as is the Arminian mode , ) sometimes his monstrous Conclusions , sometimes his wrested Quotations , sometimes his uncouth Philosophy , sometimes his Consequential Blasphemy , will put upon the spirits of some , whom the Lord shall honour to rescue his truth out of his hands , &c. Sir , I fear that in speaking these things you fall into the condemnation of the English Proverb , which saith , that many talk of Robin Hood , who never shot in his Bow . I cannot judg you a man of so little , either Conscience , or Understanding , as to think that such causless and groundless imputations as these could have been taken up by you into your pen , in case you had read that Book , the report whereof ( it seems ) hath put the edg you speak of , not upon your modesty , but your confidence : though ( I confess ) it argueth not much , either of the one , or the other ( Conscience , I mean , or Understanding ) in any man , to speak evil of the things , which he knoweth not , ( Jude v. 10. ) For how can I reasonably conceive , that you intending to publish a Discourse for the stopping of an erroneous Doctrine ( erroneously so called ) maintained in a printed Book , should not so much as draw blood of this evil beast with one pointed Argument , in case you had come within the reach or sight of it ; though you had left the other Huntsmen you speak of to have followed the chase , and done the plenary execution ? Upon which account likewise I cannot praise your saying , that though your Treatise be no Answer directed {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} to my Book , yet , &c. For doth not such an expression as this import , that though you have not shaped an Answer to every particular Argument , or passage , in my Book , yet you have grappled with the most , and most material of them ? When as the truth is , you have not in all your Discourse done so much as Canis ad Nilum , or toucht the lightest Argument therein with the least of your fingers . Is it fair for you to say , that you never indeed read over all Chrysostoms works , when as you never read so much as one line of them ? But whereas you say , I now thank Mr Goodwin , whose darkness , &c. it seems you trade much in ironies , and jeers , having a little before informed your Reader ( in the same figure ) that my modesty and ingenuity must needs be the character of the Spirit of Truth in me . Mr Resbury , as our Saviour admonisheth men not to judg , lest they be judged : so I fear you will first or last meet with those , that will execute legem talionis upon you , that will {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} with you , and pay you home in your own coyn . But if my darkness will ( as you doubt not ) occasion more light , it is ( doubtless ) of a much better genius then yours : for your darkness occasioneth ( or , which is worse , directly causeth ) more darkness dayly in the world , and leadeth poor people they know not whither . However , I count the imputation of darkness , no disparagement unto me , {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} , i. e. but that which every man lieth under , as well as I : and if Mr Resbury counteth it no robbery to make himself equal with him , in whom there is no darkness at all , that consequential Blastphemy , which without so much as any colour or pretext of ground he layeth to my charge , will be real and apparant guilt upon his own head . I dare not number my self amongst men of any higher attainments in knowledg , then those , who acknowledg , that at present they know but in part : and if those spots of ignorance , which are upon the face of my understanding , may occasion a further clearness and brightness in the understandings of other men , it will help to ballance the sorrow of the inconvenience and loss I sustain by them . Nevertheless as the Apostle speaks of science , or knowledg , falsly so called ( by men in his times , ) so I make no question but there is darkness falsly so called by men in our days : and I fear Mr Resbury speaketh this dialect too familiarly . Whereas you say , my boldness ( confident you are ) will excite modesty ; I am sorry it hath had so little of this happy influence upon you . Your own pen falls upon you with the confession of confidence : and your neighbors pen should not much wrong you , in stead of confidence , to write , impudence . But your supposed Antithesis between boldness , and modesty , is no praise to your learning , or understanding . The Apostle Paul was a man of singular modesty , far from all unseemly self-assuming , conversing with fear and trembling amongst men , devesting himself from place to place of the honour and praise of all those worthy accomplishments , that were in him , and of all those great things that had been done and suffered by him , for the Gospel : and yet was he {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} , a man as bold as a Lion , not fearing the fiercest countenance of man in the world , nor reproof from any man touching the truth of those things which he held and taught . Vprightness ( as the common Motto hath it ) hath boldness . But amongst all your undue aspersions , you should have befriended your reputation in forbearing that of Imperial Dictates in stead of Arguments . If you had judged it safe to have followed me in my Book with your Answers {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} , you would have met with Arguments , in stead of Dictates ( whether consular , or Imperial , ) and not Dictates , in stead of Arguments . They that are acquainted , either with my Preaching , or Writings , will ( I doubt not ) be my Compurgators in the scandal of being wanting , or sparing , in Arguments , or of obtruding things without ground or proof , upon the judgments of men . And if to use imperial Dictates , in stead of Arguments , be the Arminian mode , it seems the Arminians are Presbyterians , these being the men , who in their Synods and Assemblies are wont to bind what burthens of Faith they please upon the necks of men , without giving any why , or wherefore , but their own Authority . My frequent and free advice to all my Friends and Hearers , is known to be this : Not to believe any thing , whether from me , or any other man , but what they see sufficient ground and reason why they should beleeve . He that should satyrize the Town of Newcastle for want of Coals , might comfort Mr Resbury in his Indictment against me for want of Arguments . What you mean by monstrous Conolusions , I confess I understand not : I wish you well understand your self . There are no conclusions I know of , or am able to call to mind , in that Book of mine , which so much offends you , but what are the genuine and natural issue of your own Principles and Tenents : yea and are frequently delivered and asserted by your own Prophets , and Great Founders of your Faith in the Points of Election , Reprobation , &c. Calvin , Musculus , Bullinger , Peter Martyr , &c. So that in calling my conclusions , monstrous , you fall foul upon your own Tenents and Opinions also , and put these to rebuke . But it may be your maxim is : Pereant amici , dummodò & inimici unà pereant : i. e. Let dearest Friends destroyed be , So Foes may bear them company . However , you should have provided for your credit somewhat better at this point , in case you had brought forth ( at least ) one of the monsters you speak of , that so your Reader might the better have understood what you call , monstrous , and likewise have had some ground for his belief of your honesty , in charging me with monstrous conclusions . For ( as the saying is ) Si accusâsse sufficiet , quis erit innocens ? If it sufficeth to accuse , Who shall be innocent , I muse ? Concerning your charge of wrested quotations , I must crave leave to tell you , that wrested quotations are as far beneath me , as I perceive speaking truth to be above you . If you wrested the Scriptures no more , then I do Authors , your notions about the Counsels and Dispensations of God would be much streighter then they are . I am all thoughts made that the Truth maintained by me is able to stand upon her own proper base , against all opposition , and hath no need at all to be supported by the rotten props of wrested quotations , no nor yet by the credit or repute of any Author , or Authors whatsoever , though never so pertinently or candidly quoted to her assistance . Nor do I mention or make use of Authors upon any such account , as if the Doctrine I teach , were not able , without having any thing at all added unto it by men , to commend it self with sufficient evidence and power unto the Judgments and Consciences of all considering men , and truly desirous of the knowledg of the Truth : but partly to remove that stone , or straw rather , of offence , ( at which people of effeminate and weak apprehensions are so apt to stumble , ) viz. That the said Doctrine wanteth an arm of flesh to stand by it , was never held by orthodox or pious men : partly also to demonstrate that the greatest Opposers of this Doctrine were not so consistent with themselves in their opposition to it , but that ever and anon they fluctuated in their Judgments about it , yea and sometimes pulled down with one hand , what they had built up with the other . This is a thing so manifest to those , that with judgment and observation are any thing conversant in their writings , that to deny it , is ( in effect ) to deny that the Sun is up at noon day . Therefore for him to wrest quotations , or pervert the sayings of men , who hath no more need either of men , or their sayings , then I , or the Doctrine asserted by me have , is to sacrifice both his precious Name , and more precious Conscience , upon the service a nut-shell , or thing of nought . There was more wisdom then so , though not much honesty , in that saying of the Heathen : Si jus violandum est , regnandi gratia violandum est : i. e. Justice too sacred is to harm , Unless a Kingdom be the charm . Nor am I at all edified by your reproof for my uncouth Philosophy . I make little use of any kinde of Philosophy in the Book you wote of : nor can I imagine unto what passage throughout the whole Book this stigm relateth . My whole Estate in Philosophy is not ( I confess ) very great . That modicum which I have , is generally of the ordinary and best-known stamp : nor have I , to my knowledg , so much as any one uncouth , affectate , or sequestred notion in my whole Systeme . If you were as chaste from the pollutions of uncouth Divinity , as I am of uncouth Philosophy , the Lord Christ would take more pleasure in you , then now ( I fear ) he doth . But ( it seems ) you wanted two words to make a new slander : and he that stood invisibly at your right hand , and of whom you were not sufficiently aware , bad you put in , uncouth Philosophy . I perceive you do not think that you have yet layd on a sufficient load of calumny and reproach ; and therefore you resolve to adventure onesheaf more of the same grain upon your cart , heavier then all the rest . You arraign me for a misdemeanor , which you call , Consequential Blasphemy . I want your heifer to plough with , to finde out your riddle of consequential Blasphemy . What may we call the opposite species of Blasphemy , contradistinguished to that which you term , Consequential ? Or by charging me with consequential Blasphemy , do you mean , that I hold or reach such Positions or Doctrines , the direct consequences whereof are blasphemous ? This is the fairest and best sence that ( as far as my short understanding is able to reach ) your words will bear . But Sir , if the Doctrine or Principle it self be not blasphemous , unpossible it is that any legitimate Consequ●●●e , or Position deducible from it , should be such . If the first fruit be holy ( saith the Apostle ) the lump is also holy : and if the root be holy , so are the branches . And your Logique Maxim is : Ex veris possit nil , nisi vera , sequi : i. e. From Truth , nothing , but truths themselves , will follow . Therefore if there be any thing blasphemous in my Book , you should rather have charged it upon my Principles , or fundamental Doctrines , then upon any thing consequentially deducible from them . Or if by the consequential Blasphemies you speak of , you mean your own spurious consequences begotten rape-wise , either by your ignorance , or passion , or some worse spirit then either , upon my innocent premisses , and call these blasphemous , it is a clear case , that the bastards are yours , and only layd by you ( after the manner of those that are loath to own , or keep their own children ) at my door . Onely you should have done well to have given your Reader a tast of that which you call consequential blasphemy , out of the book it self , that so he might have understood your meaning in this particular of your Charge . But as Potiphars wife out of a spirit of Anger and Revenge , accused her chaste and loyal servant Joseph of incontinency unto his Lord , because he rejected and abhorred her unchaste and disloyal motions : so ( I fear ) you accuse me of Blasphemy ( whether consequential , or by what name or title soever called or distinguished ) unto the world , out of a spirit of indignation , because I will not say a confederacy , where you , and men of your Principles , say a confederacy , against the honor , mercy , goodness , justice , truth , and other the glorious Attributes of God , but have set my self , and endevored with all loyalty and faithfulness unto my God ( whom with my whole heart and Soul I love , reverence , and honor ) to detect those Doctrines and Tenents of Blasphemy , wherewith the Judgments and Consciences of so many thousands have been bewitched and abused ; as the ●●ghter sort of the Jews were with those garnished or painted Sepulchres of the Prophets and righteous men ( thus garnished and painted by the Scribes and Pharisees , Matt. 23. 29. ) which within were full of nothing but rottenness and dead mens bones . I had a full taste of this spirit in a man of your , Judgment ( a Minister in this City ) at a publique Disputation about these Controversion ( now above a year since ) who when I argued , and clearly evinced that Doctrine of Reprobation maintained by him , and his party ( which is the same with yours ) to contain this Blasphemy in it , viz. that God should Reprobate himself , he replyed unto me ( in the hearing of thousands there present ) Sir , I pray speak more reverently of God . By which words he sought to insinuate into the Auditory , that I had spoke irreverently or blasphemously of God , when as I onely detected and brought to light before the people that horrid Blasphemy , which was bound up in a bundle at the heart of his and your Opinion , against which I then disputed . Sir , you say ( though untruly , as is before proved ) I challenge an whole Vniversity to remove me : I will not challenge you , but modestly and humbly entreat and desire you ( and if you please , you may take ten Universities to your assistance ) that you will please to shew me ( onely I desire withall that you will not shew me darkness in stead of a vision , or that which is not , under the name of that which is ) but that you will please to shew me , any one spot of my darkness , any one strain , either of any unseemly boldness , or of any uncouth Philosophy , or of any Blasphemy ( whether consequential , or of what kinde soever ) any one instance , either of my imperial dictating in stead of arguing , or of any monstrous Conclusion , or of a wrested quotation , throughout my whole Book . If you be able , and shall please christianly and friendly to shew me any of these , it will be an excellent oyl , that shall not break my head ; you shall finde me {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} {non-Roman} , easie to be entreated , tractable both to matter of acknowledgment , and amendment of what is amiss . But if you be not able to make good , upon a fair and reasonable account , all , or any the particulars , wherein you have rendered me to the world a man of guilt , and much unworthiness , I trust you will make haste to the golden Altar of Repentance , and lay hold upon the horns hereof for the safety both of your conscience and reputation : and will not count it any great thing to repair , what you have demolished and pulled down . One thing ( before I cloze ) I desire calmly to know of you : why , or upon what account , you term the Doctrine , maintained by me in my Treatise of Redemption , by the name of Arminianism . If it be simply because the said Doctrine was ( as you suppose ) held and maintained by Arminius , 1. I must crave leave to inform you , that unless the good figure Synecdoche makes peace between such your supposition , and the Truth , they will never agree : For the Doctrine here taught by me was onely in part held by Arminius : the main foundations on which I build , you will not finde layd by him . 2. Were it granted , that what I teach in that Book , was ( for substance of matter ) nothing but what is to be found in his Writings ; yet what reason is there why that which I teach in common with Arminius , should be termed , Arminianism , when you teach twenty times more upon the same , terms ( I mean , in common with Arminius ) and yet would be judged the freest man in the World from Arminianism ? If you charge me with Arminianism , because the Doctrine which I maintain , was held by Arminius with opposition or contrariety to the Truth ; 1. Whether this be a truth , or no , adhuc sub judice lis est , is a case yet depending in the Court of Equity : and I beleeve before many years shall have passed over the head of the world , all competent Judges will pass sentence against you in the Point . 2. In case it were true , that Arminius did indeed maintain that Doctrine in opposition to the Truth , about which I make one in Judgment with him , yet why should my Doctrine be rather termed Arminianism , then either Calvinism , Musculism , Martyrism , or the like , considering that Calvin , Musculus , and others ( reputed Orthodox ) did assert over and over , and this in terms every whit as significant and express , as any found in Arminius , the very self-same Doctrine , as I fully , and above all controversie and contradiction , prove by many Testimonies cited from the Writings of these men , in my said Treatise of Redemption . If you here plead , that these Authors elsewhere in their Writings , declare their Judgments in opposition to this Doctrine ; 1. I make little question but that this may with as much truth be said concerning Arminius himself . 2. If those other Authors declare sometimes for the said Doctrine , and otherwhile against it , why should he , who teacheth contrary to what they deliver in one place , be traduced as an Opposer of their Doctrine , rather then he , who teacheth contrary to what they teach and deliver in another ? Sir , I fear that when the Lord Jesus Christ ( both yours , and mine ) shall come to umpire between you , and me , your aspersing his Truth with infamous and ignominious terms will turn to no good account unto you . Concerning your Treatise , or Sermons , if there be any thing in them more material or weighty , then what your Great Makers at the Synod of Dort have upon the same account , which you stand up to justifie , afforded us in their Synodical Writings , it shall ( God willing ) be taken into consideration in due time . But I beleeve that when the Oaks of Bashan shall be hewn down and fall , the shrubs and under-wood will be broken and beaten down to the ground under them : and that when the horsemen are put to rout , the infantry will throw down their arms , and quit the field . As for your Decree of Absolute Reprobation , when you seek for it in the nineth to the Romans , you dig in a wrong field to find any such treasure : and the truth is , that you will , or may , as soon discover the Element of fire at the bottom of the Sea , as such a Reprobation as you dream of , in that Chapter , or indeed in any other quarter or passage of the Scriptures . Yea your self in this very Epistle , making your Elect ones , through weakness of Judgment , and unskilfulness in the mystery of Christ , liable to be seduced by a Spirit of Error , do little less ( if not every whit as much ) then shake the foundations of your Absolute Reprobation . If you speak of such a liableness to seduction , which endangereth not the Salvation of the seduced , your zealous solicitousness for the suppression of Error , is to little purpose , at least in reference to such persons . For men , whether Elect ( in your notion ) or not Elect , will be always liable to be thus far ( at least ) seduced , were all the Errors at present on foot in the world , never so throughly suppressed . Besides , according to your principles , all the sins which your Elect shall at any time commit , or fall into , shall work for good unto them , and not only be forgiven immediately upon the Commission . Therefore your care of preventing their seducement , being truly interpreted , is only a care to keep them from that , which would turn to a certain benefit or advantage unto them , in case they were not kept from it . If you speak of a liableness to such a seduction , which may possibly end in the destruction of the seduced , then you clearly suppose a possibility of the perishing of your Elect ones : and if your Election staggers , or waves , how can your Reprobation stand fast ? How impertinently you cite , and apply to your purpose , those words of the Apostle , The foundation of God stands sure , but that I am unworthy to teach , you might have learned from the 359. and 360. Pages of my Book of Redemption . But I shall ( I trust ) ere long , interruptory occasions not too numerously or importunely thronging me , vindicate the innocency of that nineth Chapter to the Romans , from the scandalous imputation of holding correspondency with so monstrous and horrid a Doctrine , as that which Mr Resbury , with many others , ( led aside out of the way of Truth by the same spirit of Error and delusion , ) teach under the notion and name of , Absolute Reprobation . In the mean time , hoping that for the future you will be more Christianly tender of the Names and Reputations of your Brethren , at least until you know more evil by them , and this upon better terms , then ( I am certain ) you yet know , or can know , any by me , or ( I trust ) ever shall know , I take my leave , beseeching the God of all Grace , with all fervency and effectualness of prayer and supplication , that he will vouchsafe to make both your anointing and mine , with the Spirit of Revelation , much more rich and full , then hitherto it hath been , that we may be more able to give the light of the knowledg of God in the face of Jesus Christ , unto men . Your assured Friend in Christ , above , and against , all unkindnesses , or evil intreaties , John Goodwin . From my Study . Octob. 15. 1651. FINIS .