A defence of the right of kings Wherein the power of the papacie ouer princes, is refuted; and the Oath of Allegeance iustified. Written for the vse of all English romanists; more especially, for the information of those priests, or Iesuits, which are by proclamation commanded to conforme themselues, or depart the kingdome. By Edvvard Forset, Esquire. Forset, Edward, 1553?-1630. 1624 Approx. 171 KB of XML-encoded text transcribed from 53 1-bit group-IV TIFF page images. Text Creation Partnership, Ann Arbor, MI ; Oxford (UK) : 2003-01 (EEBO-TCP Phase 1). A01076 STC 11189 ESTC S119405 99854612 99854612 20039 This keyboarded and encoded edition of the work described above is co-owned by the institutions providing financial support to the Early English Books Online Text Creation Partnership. This Phase I text is available for reuse, according to the terms of Creative Commons 0 1.0 Universal . The text can be copied, modified, distributed and performed, even for commercial purposes, all without asking permission. Early English books online. (EEBO-TCP ; phase 1, no. A01076) Transcribed from: (Early English Books Online ; image set 20039) Images scanned from microfilm: (Early English books, 1475-1640 ; 956:08) A defence of the right of kings Wherein the power of the papacie ouer princes, is refuted; and the Oath of Allegeance iustified. Written for the vse of all English romanists; more especially, for the information of those priests, or Iesuits, which are by proclamation commanded to conforme themselues, or depart the kingdome. By Edvvard Forset, Esquire. Forset, Edward, 1553?-1630. [12], 93, [1] p. Printed by B. A[lsop] for Nathaniel Butter, and are to be sold at his shop, at the Pyed Bull, neere Saint Austens Gate, London : 1624. Identification of printer from STC. A belated answer to two items by Robert Parsons, STC 19408 and STC 19417. 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Parsons, Robert, 1546-1610. -- Treatise tending to mitigation towardes catholicke-subjectes in England. Catholics -- England -- Early works to 1800. Oath of allegiance, 1606 -- Early works to 1800. 2000-00 TCP Assigned for keying and markup 2001-09 Apex CoVantage Keyed and coded from ProQuest page images 2001-10 TCP Staff (Michigan) Sampled and proofread 2001-10 TCP Staff (Michigan) Text and markup reviewed and edited 2001-11 pfs Batch review (QC) and XML conversion A DEFENCE OF THE RIGHT OF KINGS . WHEREIN THE POWER OF the Papacie ouer Princes , is refuted ; and the Oath of Allegeance iustified . WRITTEN FOR THE VSE OF ALL English Romanists ; more especially , for the Information of those Priests , or Iesuits , which are by Proclamation commanded to conforme themselues , or depart the Kingdome . By EDWARD FORSIT , Esquire . LONDON , Printed by B. A. for Nathaniel Butter , and are to be sold at his shop , at the Pyed Bull , neere Saint Austens Gate . 1624. TO THE MOST HIGH AND POTENT MONARCH , IAMES , OF GREAT BRITAINE , FRANCE , AND IRELAND , KING , DEFENDER OF THE FAITH , &c. TO THE RIGHT REVEREND FATHER in God , GEORGE , by the Diuine Prouidence Lord Bishop of LONDON , my singular good Lord. THE whole Church , and Kingdome of England , ( Right Reuerend Prelate ) hath a long time together taken notice of that continuall neerenesse , into which it hath pleased his Maiestie ( who does all things vpon Iudgement ) to admit your wisedome and faithfulnesse , in matters of aduice especially , which be most proper to your sacred Function . Which Grace of your Lordships with so wise and learned a Prince , hath perswaded me , that as you were the fittest , so you would be the willingest to doe our Great Master this seruice ; for so I hope this Office will proue , if your Lordship wil be pleased , that this Boke may by your hands haue accesse vnto his Maiestie . It treats of a Royall Argument , and therefore ( euen of dutie ) to be dedicated to a King , as a thing due vnto Caesar : And due vnto our King especially , whom God hath raysed vp in Brittaine , as the Fort Royall of Princes , to amate that Tower of Babel , that prowd Castle of S. Angelo . And therefore as his Maiestie himselfe hath first of all , and best of all , written in this kind , and giuen the ablest directions vnto others to prosecute the Argument ; so it might seeme presumption , if any thing of this subiect should come abroad without his Royall assent . His Maiesties example ( together with this Gentleman 's owne zeale to the Cause ) did at first , no doubt , encourage this learned Author to vndertake this present Worke , who as he still is by his place a Iustice of Peace , so hath he here done Iustice vpon that sawcie Medler with the Rights of Princes , Parsons the Iesuit , and those two seditious Bookes of his , one comming our vnder the name of P. R. the other of a Catholike Gentleman , both which he hath here made to keepe the Kings peace . The Title will ( I hope ) find gracious acceptance , and the Booke honourable approbation with his sacred Maiestie . Which hope of mine hath emboldened me to offer it vnto your good Lordship , as a testimonie of my most hearty and humble thankfulnesse , for those fauors which I haue receiued from your goodnesse : the remembrance of which shall euer bind me to be at your Lordships seruice most faithfully . Nathaniell Butter . TO THE READER . OCTAVIVS the Emperour did rather chuse to violate the will of Virgil , then to consume those laborious AEneids of his in the flames of Obliuion . Why then should not this example of his , excuse me from blame of the Author of this following Worke , for attempting to commit to the Presse , and commending that to others in publike , which he but lent to me in priuate ? since good things are best knowne , by their vse ; and well considering , how acceptable it may prooue to our hopefull times . The end of his 〈◊〉 , when hee first began this Treatise ( I am well assured ) was onely to satisfie his owne priuate Iudgement , esteeming it ( through his too much Modestie ) so farre vnfit for the publike view , as for the space of tenne or twelue yeeres since the finishing of it , hee suffered it to rest obscure , amongst his other priuate Labours ; wherein his industrie and abilitie may appeare to be made yet more transparent , in his owne vnder-valuing of what hee hath so exactly performed : Which comming thus accidentally to my hands , and viewing the matter it treated of , and the malicious slanders it retreated , I could not chuse but euen blame the vnkind Author , that would haue made the very Wombe of this his seasonable Off-spring , the Tombe , and giuen it at one and the same time both life and dissolution together . I haue therefore aduentured my Endeuors ( without his knowledge , beyond his expectation , and I am afraid , against his desire ) for the publishing of that which I knew might prooue so vsefull : which remaining obscure , and in silence , neither should the Cause nor the Parsons be vindicated ; nor yet the soueraigntie of this Antidote against that dispersed Poyson , haue beene discernable , or serued for publike benefit . And though the man opposed be ( as I conceiue ) vncapable of defence , yet there remaine many of his Labors , that like the Vipers brood haue suckt a stronger Poyson from his death . Nor want there many of his Iesuited Disciples , who may yet doe him right , if they thinke him iniuried ; though it be true , Vni Caesari multi insunt Marii . All I desire , is pardon from the Author , vpon whose Worth so well knowne , and Loue so often tryed by me , I haue thus farre presumed ; not doubting , but the publike good that may ensue his owne Labour , will ouer-sway his resolued retyrednesse . As for thy acceptance , I doubt it not , because the benefit is thine owne ; and accounting it reward enough to my selfe , that I am but the Instrument of communicating this to others . Farewell . F. B. PARTICVLAR MATTERS discussed in this Treatise . THe occasion of this Question concerning the Popes power . The mitigations of P. R. touching the Powder-treason . His mangling and omitting of my Lords words . Whether the Pope cannot erre : with the manifold distinctions of the Papists therein . How the true estate of the Question concerning the Popes power , is hidden by a cunning forme of words . Whether this point be generally agreed vpon amongst Catholikes , and how dangerous the same is to the State. How he minceth and mitigateth the matter in question . The true Question , and how largely it extendeth . The reasons made for the position , and the same answered : and that there neither is , nor euer was , any standing Authoritie to depriue Kings . No reason for the Popes power in nature . Whether the vniuersall Pastorship be instituted by Christ , and what points must be prooued , before that come to be made good . The Iesuites busie entermedling in State-affaires . The proofe from the word Pasce Oues examined , and Baronius his expositions and inferences in this matter . Other strange arguments for the Popes temporall power . The Pope no rightfull successor of S. Peter , but wrongfully pretendeth his Authoritie , or Primacie . The Pope no successor or imitator of Christ. Their distinction of Authoritie , direct and vndirect , examined . What necessitie there is of this Pastorall power , and how it is qualified . Politike reaches in Poperie , to aduance the Authoritie aforesaid . The Pope may reduce all causes to his Cognizance , and how farre he may extend the power of Seculare Brachium , the Sccular Arme. The Doctrine of the Iesuits concerning the deposing of Princes , holding that euen priuate men may destroy Kings . P. R. yeeldeth vnto the point of the Kings Supremacie , in that sence as we doe accept the same . P. R. driuen to fall from that which he had yeelded . The Pope and Bellarmine will dislike as much of P. R. for yeelding to the Kings Supremacie of preseruation , as they do of M. Blackwell , for taking the Oath of Allegeance . P. R. thought to be the author of the Letter which replyeth to the Apologie of the Oath . He cannot yeeld Supremacie in all causes , in his owne sense , and yet main aine the Popes power of deposing . The maintaining of the Popes temporall power , and the denying of the Oath of Allegeance , is all one . He ought to haue shewed particular matter to be disliked in the seuerall parts of the Oath : the true cause why he doth not . His foure reasons , whereby he would proue matter of Religion in the Oath , be examined , and refuted . All limitting of the Popes power , is not matter of Faith. The allowing to the Pope a power to depose the King , cannot stand with Allegeance . A short answer ( consisting of two parts ) to the whole Booke , Written against Sir Edw. Coke , concerning the Popes Authoritie in this Kingdome . Difference in the case of subiects vnder Catholike Kings & the subiects of this kingdome , & between the now subiects & those of former times vnder 〈◊〉 Kings of England . The distinction of the Popes Authoritie , direct and indirect , 〈◊〉 . Reasons to induce the Catholike subiects not to refuse the Oath That sundry Papists haue taken the Oath willingly : and that the Gent. Wrongeth them in making a doubt thereof . vpon any allegation of constraint by feare . That the Law containeth not any compelling or vnlawfull meanes , to make any to sweare vnwillingly . That they haue also sworne faithfully : and that the equiuocating sence which the Gent. deuiseth , was not vsed by them , nor ought to be vsed by any , being sencelesse , and against the Oath directly . The Gent. rage and threats , for enforcing of the Oath . His Theologie controlled , concerning the ministring of an Oath vnto such , as hee that ministreth the same , suspecteth will forsweare himselfe . That amongst the Papists , there be greater enforcements to make men abiure Opinions , yea , vnder paine of death , as is confessed : And that the answer to maintaine the same by the title of Ius acquisitum , is idle and friuolous . A wish for eternizing the memorie of the Gunpowder Treason , in answer of their anger for our so often iterating or vpbraiding to them that most abhorred Conspiracie . FINIS . AN EXAMINATION OF a Position published by P. R. in the preface of his treatise , tending to mitigation , concerning the lawfullnesse of the Popes Power ouer Princes : with a defence of the oath of Allegiance . IT pleased the Right Honorable the Earle of Salisbury , in his exactly written , and necessary published answer , to certaine scandalous Papists prouoking him by occasion , and in fashion vnsufferable , to protest against the insolency and malignity of the Romish Church , out of the bosome whereof so many Treacheries , Conspirases and Immanities of the foulest kind , haue bin vented into the world , tending to ouerule or ruinate whatsoeuer authority , not submitting the necke to the yoake of that vsurping power ; in the very first passage of that his Appologetticall declaration ( which enuie it selfe could not passe ouer without attribution of highest praise ) hee was carried ( by the contemplation of so many dangerous designes , and complotting practises , dayly pretended and contriued against the safetie and dignitie of temporall Potentates ) to a more vehement expressing of himselfe in the zeale of words following . I haue been a long time sorry , that those which imploy so many seditious spirits dayly to instruct the vnlearned Catholikes , in these mysteries of deposing Princes , haue not by some publike & definitiue sentence Orthodoxall ( in which it is supposed , the Pope cannot erre ) made some cleere explication of their assumed power ouer Soueraigne Princes , as not onely those which acknowledge his superioritie might bee secured from feares and iealousies of continuall treasons , and bloody assassinates against their persons , but those kings which doe not approoue the same , and yet would faine reserue a charitable opinion of her subiects , might know how far to repose themselues in their fidelitie , in ciuill obedience , howsoeuer they seem to be deuided from them in point of conscience . To which his Lordsh. so honourable desire , this good father offereth and endeauoureth to giue satisfaction . Aman ( if we mistake not his sheepemarke ) of some fame , and note of that side , placed in a degree of preheminence , graced with more then ordinary gifts , confidently conceited of himselfe , and daring to vndertake matters of highest nature ; not withstanding , obseruation is made of him that his boldnes much ouerbalanceth any other his best worth . His said preface of the importune exasperations vsed by diuers to increase our diuision and disagreement about matters of Religion is very presumptuous , and altogether censorious , wholly spent in taxing and traducing not onely the particular speeches , or writings of some especiall men of excellent desert in this state , as if whatsoeuer they haue vttered out of the abundance of iust griefe in detestation of the late execrable treason , did wholly proceede from exasperation , exulceration , aggrauation , exaggeration and calumniation , ( for in those high sounding tearmes he beareth his stile aloft ) but also the administration of iustice , the vprightnes of our regiment , the newly enacted penall lawes , as making the state of English Catholikes vnder Protestant gouernement more miserable and intolerable , than that of the Iewes vnder any sort of Christian Princes , that of the Grecians , or Christians vnder the Turke or Persian , or that of bond Subiects , vnder the Polonians , Suetians , and Muscouites , onely he confesseth that in two mens writings he findeth more moderation . The one is his Maiestie in his speeches , both in Parliament , & in Proclamations ( whereunto yet he giueth some dash or wipe of exception ) The other is my Lord of Salisbury in his said answer , to that fond menacing letter , or rather franticke commination which yet ( hee saith ) wanteth not his sting , piercing euen to the quicke . After hee hath thus throughout his many licentious leaues , braued it with exorbitant and exulting phrases , at the last , he falleth in hand with this piece of doctrine occasionally drawne thereunto by the consideration of his Lordships said desire , and ( forsooth ) he is the man that must instruct and settle my Lords iudgment by his profound resolues , seeming to be moued with pitty , that his Honour ( in a matter not appertaining properly to his facultie or profession ) hath beene misled or misinformed by his diuine . Before he lancheth into the maine of the matter , he disposeth himselfe malepertly , to make a crosse , or quaere , of the truth of such threatnings and scandalls expressed in the said leters . For ● he pauseth vpon the matter , with his parenthesis ( if any such were ) and after infinuateth his suspition that the same came from the forge of some such as ( altogether with a blowe , to be thereby giuen to all Catholikes ) had a desire to draw foorth from his Lordship , &c. It seemeth that these laques of the Romish faction are very frequently acquainted with such fictions , what destinie can be more disasterous then that the credence , so publikly deliuered by so honorable a person of his place , and eminency in the state ; and of such vnspotted integritie , in the carriage of all causes , and otherwise to bee sufficiently testified also , by the concurrence of sundry mens particular knowledge , must vndergoe the girds and glances of his misdoubts and questioning curiositie ? but leauing the cauilling fellow to his maleuolent surmises ; I will now come to his other presumption , whereby hee vndertaketh to assure and satisfie my Lord of the doctrinall position , of deposing Soueraignes , wherein ( albeit I well know , that his honour is most able with his sharpe enquirie , and iuditious discerning , to looke into all the secretest corners and hiding places which he can contriue , or reserue in this cause , Nequae forte lateat intus garrula cornix , yet not knowing whether his Lordship out of his many other most waightie affaires can affoord vnto this vain discourser so much losse of time , as but to read his so idle , & frothy stuffe . I humbly aske leaue of his Lordship , 〈◊〉 my meanenes , and weaknes may make aduenture to take him in hand , to charge him , and combate him , in this so high and most important controuersie . But before we come to the core of the question , let it be obserued what good cause he hath to pleade for mittigation , and how well he acteth the part of a mittigator . In the mention which hee maketh of the late powder plot for the suddaine , and vnrecouerable subuersion of our gratious King , and the whole state at once , ( the very cogitation whereof , is as full of horror , as the perpetration thereof , would haue beene of treachery , and atrocitie ) what fit or equiualent tearme hath his mild , and mittigating spirit , deuised to expresse or paint forth the hainousnes thereof ? he doth twice ( for fayling ) iterate vnto vs that it was the temeritie of a few . He could not haue chosen a more easier , or more abating word , if he had beene , to reprooue them for some small misdemeanour against a petty Constable : can it be otherwise thought , but that this Artist , and Tradesman of words , did out of his inclination , and tendernesseof heart , sort out of the gentlest tearme he could find , lest he should seeme too sharpe and sore against them . Doth he imagine by such his initigation to persuade the King and Realme to tolleration ? the kings Councell , learned at the law , in the dinotation and amplification of that vnspeakeable conspiracy , finding it to conteyne so many treasons in one , declared the same to be , as Sine exemplo , & sine mode , so also sine nomine . Now this Rhetoricall Father could haue taught them all to haue framed the inditement vpon his so proper name , the treason of temeritie . I can hardly endure his other word ( few ) sauouring of the like mittigation also , yet I know that I shall euen madde him , in telling him the very troth of my thought . Hee sayth , That to extend and draw out the hatred and participation of that fault to others of that religion , yea vnto the whole multitude , is a matter of exorbitant iniustice and vntemperate malice . I confesse that he hath herein some aduantage , both by the admirable goodnes and clemency of so louing a Soueraigne that suffereth not Iealousie to out trunne proofes , and by the deffect of discouerie of the degrees and depths of that designe . Yet ( if it bee but to crosse him in the conceit ) hee carrieth , fronting the same in the stile and inscription of his booke . That it is not vnpossible for Catholikes and Protestants to liue together in dutifull obedience and subiection vnder the gouernment of his Maiestie . ( I will let him know ) that for my part , I did long since make it euen an article of my beleefe , that the like plot was rightly to be resembled to the trayne of powder ; wherby it was to haue had his execution , for as one corne thereof would haue fired another , carrying the flash along , till the whole should ioyne together in full force . So vndoubtedly , the maine corps of Papacy within this land would haue beene stirred vp being laid in order and prepared by those wicked traynors , and leaders , according as they had contriued , the fire of their treason and rebellion to catch hold , & flame forth . And it may sooner be feared , then it can be known , that ( besides the few powder cornes ditected and disappointed ) there was a longer and stronger traine , yea great and mighty barrells , that would haue beene combined to haue wrought the generall combustion , and dissipation of the whole state . I will rest this point with prayer , that ( howsoeuer there may be vse or necessitie to trust vnto their faithfulnes ) yet that there may neuer be opportunitie , or meanes giuen them for the triall of her infidelitie , and disloyaltie . An other tricke of his running in mittigation , is shewed in the mangling and mincing of the sense and feruency of his Lordships speech , hee wholly pretermitteth that part of the recited sentence , which by charging them to haue imployed so many seditious spirits to instruct the vnlearned Catholikes in the mysteries of deposing Princes , doth the more vrgently presse them by a iust account to make good the causes of such their mischieuons and detestable proceedings . Shall I coniecture at his conceite in concealing or withdrawing of these words ? be felt the same to strike into his sides the spurre of guiltines , by the remembrances of his owne notorious offences : who for many yeares hath beene thought a busie instrument of enkindling the simple and deuoted Catholikes with the spirit of sedition , and hath beene a detected confederate in the trayterous agences , wherein his subordinate Iesuites hath beene so disloyally imployed . Wherefore ( though he had no great liking to heare againe the sound of such words , as must conuey an accusing sting into his conscience , yet he thought to lay it heauy vpon him ( as a charge that hee might not well auoyde ) to set forth ( by declaring of the Papall right ) some seeming shew in iustification of his owne and his complices , vndue & disloyall dealings . In the rehearsall of the same sentence , he maketh one other omission of these words , inclosed in a parenthesis ( in which it is supposed the Pope cannot erre . ) This prero gatiue point of the Popes new erring iudgement , hee hath slyly passed by , as not willing to rush vpon that rock , vpon the firmenes and stabilitie whereof , their whole Church is bailt , this opinion ( as his Lordship truely deliuered ) hath for some ages passed beene receiued , and stifly maintayned by the fawning hindes of the Pope , that hath beene accustomed , Tribunat Romanum lambere , but this good mitigator , finding no coulerable defence against many and wayty arguments , whereby such the transcending exaltation bestowed one his holinesse , is vtterly deiected and ouerthrowne , hath no great liking to passe his affirmation , and assent to that doctrine , which the powers of his wit and learning , is not able to vphold . Nay hee hath in this controuersie taken an head , and singled himselfe from the common Catholikes , closing hands in conclusion with the Protestants . For in this very treatise , he hath affoarded vs this fauour , that Popes may erre , yea euen in the articles of faith , yea and become Heretickes , and Apostataes , and that as Popes , that for the same , they may be deposed , and depriued of their Papall preheminence , doth he not speake like an honest plaine dealer , as if he would no more adore that I doll of Rome ? and as if hee cared not any whit for the triuiall obiections made out of the words of Christ vnto Saint Peter , I haue prayed that thy faith shall not faile : and againe , vpon this Rocke ( meaning Saint Peter ) I will build my Church ? Nothing more permanent and vnmooueable than a rock , nothing more certaine of effect than what Christ prayeth for , and whatsoeuer endowments of gifts or graces was bestowed vpon Saint Peter , did become the fee-simple and inheritance of the sea of Rome . Hee that regardeth not these inferences , and allegations so generally allowed and insisted vpon in the Church of Rome , and which hath hitherunto been vsed as the shoulders of Atlas to vphold the earthly heauen of the Pope , their earthly god , doth he not giue good hope , that hee will reuolt from Papacy it selfe ? But ( notwithstanding these faire shewes ) by the helpe of some of his fellowes , hee hath found out a shifting distinction to winde himselfe out of all the straights , and entrapments , wherewith he seemed to be fettered so vnuoydably , Aud this it is . That albeit the Popes , as Popes may erre , become Apostataes and Heretikes , yet that God ( as Popes ) will neuer permit them , to decree any hereticall 〈◊〉 , to be held by the Church , or for the whole Church ; What can we say to the subtletie of this distinction ? It is like to the buckler of Achilles that had many plates ensolded , one within the other , to giue the more assurance against all blowes or thrusts . It is a fertile and pregnant distinction , it hath these seueral issues of his body begotten . First , that Popes as men may erre , and be Heretikes , yea and decree hereticall doctrine , but not as Popes , for that God will not permit ; It is pretty , but what sure marke or token doth he giue , whereby it may be knowne , what hee doth as Pope , or what hee doth as man ? they say that God permitteth not , and we say , that onely God knoweth the difference Between his actions , or enactings as Pope , and his decisions as man , and so the Church resteth vncertaine how farre to be bound . Secondly , God may permit Popes ( as Popes ) to hold hereticall doctrine , but not to decree it , where shall wee finde consistendi locum ? if in their consistory , they shall declare , pronounce , and resolue vpon Heretical doctrine , may that amount vnto a decree , we haue had many such decrees reuersed and repeated . Thirdly , though God permit Popes ( as Popes ) to decree an erronious and false doctrine , yet if at any time after ( as if that wild beast euen the Bore of the forrest , had reuertendi animum ) he recall or reiect the same , or doth not wittingly ( as against the known Catholike truth ) oppose himselfe with peruersitie , that doctrine is not to bee adiudged hereticall , and thereby commeth vnder the couert of the first distinction . Fourthly , though God permit Popes ( as Popes ) to decree any hereticall doctrine , yet doth this distinction affoard one hiding corner more , that the same is not decreed to be held by the Church . Then let them , at the least , allow vs this footing against the Pope , that the Church is not bound to maintaine all his decrees . Fiftly , though God permit Popes ( as Popes ) to decree any hereticall doctrine to be held by the Church , yet the former distinction is further enriched with this clause , ( taken out of Canus ) that God permitteth not that decree for the whole Church : as if by the permission of God , the Church ( like to the moone ) may bee for the greater part thereof , darkned and seduced by such hereticall decrees of the Pope ; yet that the whole Church , and euery member of the same , as ( for instance ) the Protestant part , which is deuided and departed from the abhominations of Rome , is not carried headlong into heresie by any sentence or decree Papall Sixtly , there is yet included and reserued in this distinction one question more , as conceiued in the wombe , but not expressed in plaine tearmes , which ( at times of exigent when they be pressed ) they forget not to cleaue vnto ; which is , that the Church here mentioned , is , and must be the Catholike Romish Church , as if that particular of Rome , were the generall of the world , and that the Romish alone , had this eminent exception , aboue all other Churches , that the members thereof were not to be concluded or enthralled by euery decrees of their Head. I cannot yet haue done with this seauen-headed subtle serp̄et , this deceitfull distinction . Allow it in his perfectest shape , and close it together in all his ioynts , God permitteth not the Pope ( as Pope ) to decree hereticall doctrine to bee held by the Church , and for the whole Church ; what hath all this more then an equiualence to this saying ? God permitteth not the diuell to haue power to destroy the elect and faithfull ? And as when the Angell Raphaell bound the euill spirit from hurting of Tobias , it could not be construed to bee a fauour or a signe of loue vnto that euill spirit : so the not permitting of the Pope to decree hereticall doctrine , is no aduancing or aduantage of the Papall authoritie from being restrained , or not suffered to doe so grieuous hurts . This may suffice for his distinction , and subdistinctions , like the foxe and the cubbs , vnto which I haue the more respectiuely cast mine eye , because I find this matter of the vnfallibilitie of the Popes decrees so closly couched euen to the centure of our question , of his power ouer Princes . If I haue beene too long in examining his malam 〈◊〉 in the mittigations and omissions before mentioned , I must ( for excuse ) confesse , that I was well content to take him tardy in that very fault which hee so clamerously vpbraideth to his Antigonist Master Morton , carping and catching at him throughtout his whole book with a triumph of phrases for the very same corruption , ( as he tearmeth it ) though I nothing doubt but hee will sufficiently acquit himselfe of all those friuolous and vniust cauells . The matters that we haue hitherto met with , haue been but introductory , and vpon the bye . Now it is meete we look into the maine and substantiall point of doctrine , which ( as if hee were closset-keeper to the Pope ) hee confidently deliuereth to be Catholike and Orthodoxall , inducing his Lordship to set vp his rest vpon that vnreprooueable resolution . I protest , that when I first considered how to redvce the question to a true discussable state , I found that I could not draw downe the right proposition , which is to bee controuerted betweene vs in that kind of language which hee speaketh , I found that hee vsed so much glosing , and dilating so many gay shewes and pretences , such cloathing and decking of the cause with well chosen words for the faire carriage of the matter , as that the naked and plaine sence thereof was not easily to be discouered . But after scanning more aduisedly , and breaking the ranke of his words , to looke into his innermost meaning , and matching the same , with that hee must stay if hee will performe his vndertakings , I discerned at the last a sowre pill to bee wrapped vp in a leafe of gold , the doctrine of conspiracy and rebellion against the state and life of Princes , cunningly couered ouer with a thicke crust of sweet Candie , to relesh the better with the simple , and so to deceiue them with a fore-inducing sweetnes . The Proposition must be this , The Pope may depose the king , and such his power is approoued of all Catholikes . And that appeareth thus , his Lordship speaking of the seditious spirits , that instruct the vnlearned in the mysteries of deposing Princes , desireth therein some publike and definitiue sentence Orthodoxall for cleare explication of such . The Popes assumed power , ouer Soueraigne Princes , therefore if this smooth mittigator will without winding away by circumlocutions , and without his so finely framed tendernesse of Phrase , speake ad idem , plainely , and home to the purpose , hee must auouch this to bee a publike definitiue sentence , That the Pope hath lawfull power to depose Princes , but how doth hee expresse and pronounce this point ? hee is so nice and warie , that hee thinketh not good to name the Pope at all , doubting belike that that name is distastfull , but in stead thereof , hee bestoweth on his holinesse the stately stile of Supreame Gouernour and Pastor of the Church and Common-wealth , repeating the same words sundry times , and purposedly auoiding the other , doth hee not imploy and inferre by this mounting of the Pope to the title of Supreame Gouernour of the Common-wealth , that hee is the king of kings , and that Princes hold their scepters , as Viceroyes , and Lieutenants vnder him ? I vnderstand not else how he can close the Common wealth within the Popes clawes : then again in the like sort , he shunneth the hatefull tearm of deposing , and vseth in the stead therof , restraining , repressing , censuring , or iudging . And lastly he doth very mildly mittigate the rigor of deprauing the name , or depriuing the person of the Prince , by applying this power , to the restraining or censuring any exorbitant & pernicious excesse of great men , States or Princes , would not any man iudge , that ( being so mannerly , so 〈◊〉 , and cautulous , he were affraid or shamed to fall so fowle vpon Princes , as to maintaine the vsurpation of Papacy , in deposing of them ? hee setteth not one step in this question , wherein hee doth not doubt , that hee treadeth vpon thornes , yet trusting vpon his two great gifts , facilitie of speech , and boldnesse of face . Hee spareth not to tell his Lordship that his Diuine might easily haue enformed him , that amongst Catholike people the matter is cleere , and sufficiently defined , and declared in all points wherein there may bee any doubt concerning this affaire . Surely , his Lordships Deuine , may perhaps concurre in opinion with Master Morton , and most euidently discerne the consent and adherensie of Catholikes in the execrable practise of this proposition , but ( that they haue not agreed in the iudgements and approbation of the point in question ) the direct renouncing and disclayming thereof by some of the best learned of that side , at the time of their suffering of death for Treason , doth cleerely and fully make knowne vnto him and all the world . I will not take vpon me to search out and lay together heapes of rapsodies and collections , culled our of their writers to demonstrate their differences in this argument , thereby to disprooue their so pretended agreement in this definitiue sentence ; but I trust to shew the same to be so false , so weake , so washie , and of so little waight , as vpon the ripping and examining thereof , it will euery whit of it fall quite asunder , fayling altogether of all ground , whereupon to stand , and hauing no good props to sustaine or support the same . In the meane while hee may perhaps doe vs a little more good than hee wisheth by his intimation vnto vs , That among Catholike people the matter is so cleere , for we are thereby to take notice and warning , how little wee are to trust Catholikes , seeing they acknowledge this L. Peramount , aboue the Kings , & must yeeld their Omni-modā obedientiā to that supreame Pastor , combining themselues at his beck in al dangerous designes when any pretence is made , that the gouernment of spiritual affaires appertaining to the Cath. Church , is letted or impugned by our temporall gouernour , for in such case ( saith this learned Father ) the said supream Pastor hath authority to proceed against the said temporall gouernor , for defence & preseruation of his spiritual Charge , had we not need to looke about vs euen with Argus eyes , when wee haue so many hands of this Briarius to fasten vpon vs at euery turne : euery let of spirituall affaires is punishable by the supreame Pastor , and such lets may as easily be imputed or imposed for a crime vpon the temporall gouernour ; here is a good gap opened , and a way made wide enough for the firebrands of sedition , and the contentious discontented , to reuell and route it in a common wealth , to suggest , inform , obiect , and oppose against all magistracy . Here againe I must put him in mind of his mittigations and extenuations , in sorting and vsing the gentler , and more pleasing words . What shall we think he meaneth by proceeding against the Temporall gouernor ? might he not as well haue said , cite him , censure him , excommunicate him , depose him , and beare him out of his chaire of estate with the horns of a dreadful Bull ? If Paulus the 3 , or Pius the 5 , had had this our mealie mouthed mittigator to haue bin the penman of their Bulls , he would rather haue the milder words of proyning or repressing , then the other of extreame and violent ( borrowed from the Prophet Ieremie ) of destroying and pulling vp by the rootes , yet his kindnesse doth not hold constant , for in after reasonings , when he ioyneth vp issue vpon the true state of the question ; whether the words of the Prophet be well applyed by allusion to make good the authoritie of Christs successors vpon earth , and whether the forenamed Popes by such their arrogant and impudent glosing vpon the text , doth not ( in this forcing and streyning of the Scriptures ) peruert the Sacred Oracles of God , he is content to ioyne with his companions of that feather , in iustification of the right ayplying of the text , for the confirmation of the Papall power , of pulling vp and destroying Soueraigne Gouernours , though indeed ( to doe him right all the reason he vseth , or yeeldeth in defence therof , is onely and barely this . Is this so great an impietie thinke you ? Then let him giue what allay he listeth to the tartnesse of this doctrine , by his well seasoning thereof with his soft and supple words ; yet as in the practike , the degrees of proceeding against Princes doth grow in order ( or rather in disorder ) of consequence by the actuall attempt of their subuersion and destruction , so in the disputatiue to allow him his mittigating tearmes , of redressing or repressing , will by direct inference and necessarie extention , reach to the crowne and life of Imperiall Maiestie . Therefore laying aside all masking and mincing of the matter , by his artificiall vtterance , the cause in controuersie , and to be argued is all one in the words as we put it , whether the Pope may depose the Prince , and in the words , as this shye and slye discourser will needes haue it , whether the Supreame Pastor may reftraine the exorbitant and pernicious excesse of great men , &c. Now that we haue the right questioned proposition , set downe plainely , and stripped of that Rhetoricall array which dazled our eyes from discerning the true vnderstanding and intention thereof , wee may proceede to the considering and sifting of the reasons , deuised and alleadged for the maintenance of this assertion : Neuerthelesse it is not my purpose , nor standing with my profession ( being no Diuine , and scant a Scholler ) to looke into all the sinewes and veines of this question , to the vttermost spread and extent thereof , it toucheth vpon some principles of naturall reason , it also runneth through the course of Histories of all ages and countries , It is triable by many rules and examples , both in the old and new Testament , it wanteth not the censure of the old Doctors , and Fathers of the Church . It is handled cunningly , and mystically , by the Popes Minions , the Canonists . It must abide a canuasse amongst the Sophisticating Schoolemen : Finally , it hath beene by the moderne handlers of controuersie , argued with much skill and strength of wit. I haue no intent to leade along this question , through all the parts of learning . I will willingly leaue the loade , and tugge off such multiplicity , or rather vniuersalitie to his good hand , and dexterity of handling , who is already interessed and engaged thereunto , and no doubt well prouided , and most accomplished , I meane , Mr Morton , against whom this Popish volume is addressed , in refutation of his former learned and religious treatise . My endeauours in this cause , be confined onely to that part of the Preface , in the which ( concerning this question ) that dissembling Authour , hath set forth the Catholike opinion , accompanyed , and garded with some reasons , to confirme and strengthen the same , pretending thereby to let his Lordship know , that the point whereof hee resteth doubtful , is amongst them reduced to a generall resolued certainety ; the opinion it selfe what it is indeed , or what it ought to be , in the direct opposition , or ( as he presumeth ) satisfaction to his Lordship hath beene already sufficiently debated , and laid downe . His reasons to cogere assensum be two ; one , that this assertion is founded in the very law of nature , and nations , the other is also maintainable by the authoritie , prouidence , and ordinance of our Sauiour Christ : for declaration of his first reason , hee setteth forth , that in the Common-wealths that are not Christians , all Philosophers , Law-makers , Senators , Councellors , Historiographers , and all other sorts of soundest wisedome , prudence , and experience , either Iew , or Gentile , haue from the beginning of the world concurred in this , that God and Nature , hath left sufficient authoritie in euery Common wealth , for the lawfull and orderly full repressing of these euills , euen in the highest persons ; so what a cloude of witnesses hee hath brought out with one breath , and yet no more for the proofe of his purpose , than the casuall confluence or concourse of Democritus his motes , did serue to make solide bodies or concreate substances . In this obiection he and I are as sarre a 〈◊〉 , as is from Rome to London , nay , as farre as the 〈◊〉 is from the West , where he saith , all Common wealths Philosophers , Law-makets , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , hers , and all sorts of 〈◊〉 dest wisedome , Iew or Gentile , &c. I on the other side , will be centent to make the like pompious and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 : of all Common-wealths , Lawn published or professed , that by any ordinary authority , such redresse as herein is meant by deposition of Princes , or highest persons , was , or might be , lawfully , reasonably , or iustly , had , vsed , or exercised . I am not ignorant , that hauing in this challenge put my felfe vpon the negatiue , and so giuen to him so large a scope of aduantage , as to disprooue my generality , with any one affirmatiue instance , it behooueth me to hold my selfe close to that very point which I require to be fully prooued ; therfore once againe ( so he will take in for a fauor that I doe ease him of the great taske which hee hath vndertaké to shew , that all Common wealths , Philosophers , &c. wherin his friends may pitty him for presumption , in proposing impossibilities ) I redouble it vnto him thus , that he cannot produce from al the infinity of learning , any one president , prophane or sacred , whereby it may appeare , that by any publikely authorised orders , there was euer any standing and ordinary direction , and power , for the deposing of lawfull Princes against their wills from their inheritable rights of Soueraignty ; I say lawfull Princes to meet with the obiections he is like to cloy vs with , of some Princes , who by reason of their naturall impotencies , were accounted vncapable or vnlawfull , & of other some , who acquiring Kingdomes by the sword inuasion , may be deemed vnlawfull , and so with like force & violence , to be repressed and expelled . Likewise I haue added ( inheritable rights ) as well because that fitteth our state , ( in whose bowels this debate hath so dangerously striuen ) as also to cut off from him the feeding supplies of his error , which are the electiue governments , wherein perhaps now & then vpon breaches of contracted condition there hath ensued deprauation from the possessed dignitie , ( yet those deprauations for the most part ) haue beene in tumult , violence , and disorder , factiously , and mutinously performed , without any reguler or iuridical course , agreeable to the tenure of the lawes of that place . 〈◊〉 added ( against their wills ) both because this enforcement from the Pope is of that nature , and vpon purpose to disfurnish him of some examples , wherein I foresee how triumphantly he would haue gloried . For we doe not deny but there hath beene many resignations vpon due consideration had by those suppressed Princes , of the many acknowledged , and vnanswerable defects , or offences in their regiment , and of the vndigestable dislike conceiued by the subiects of such their misgouerning and abusing superiority . Besides , I must 〈◊〉 him with an other Caueat , that neither the Romane , Turkish , nor any such Emperours will serue the turne , for instances in this case , because ( to say nothing of their forceable acquirings for the most part of such their Imperiall feares ) their deposing hath bin executed by strong hand , & rather by the fury of armed soldiers , than by any ordinary censure , or proceeding of Law or Iustice ; much lesse is hee to alleadge or propound any 〈◊〉 , wherein priuate or Phanaticall spirits , out of humor & 〈◊〉 reuenge , reward , or glory , haue attempted or 〈◊〉 the 〈◊〉 of Hostile , & bloudy assault , vpon the 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 of Soueraignes . Hee must ( for very 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , the mention of such , left the may by naming vnto vs either the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , that 〈◊〉 K. Henry of France , was by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 with 〈◊〉 and Acclamations , or the English 〈◊〉 , who of a deuotion to the Pop 〈◊〉 faction , poysoned King Iohn of England : yea , he might so bring in diuers Popes & Cardinals , that haue in such good zeale destroyed and made away Princes and Emperors . I am yet to 〈◊〉 him a little shorter , I must take from him , his discoursing vaine of mitigating , and blanching the matter , in a disguise of some selected phrases , whereby hee intendeth to aduantage himselfe . For example , when we are at this issue , whether there hath euer beene in any Common-wealth , any sufficient Authoritie left by God , and Nature , for the lawfull and orderly deposing of Princes , hee inserteth the repressing of euils , euen in the highest persons , so that when hee shall bee put to it , and the weight of his vndertakings is likely to breake his backe , or his braine ; then will hee take the benefite of this shift , of repressing of euills euen in the higeest , and rather then faile of matter , tell vs a stale tale of the Ephori , or Tribuni , and such like politike Constitutions tendering the liberties , or safety of the people , against the cruell oppressions , or encrochments of the mightie placed in Authoritie : neither is it yet my mind at this time , against the vniuersall affirmatiue of all Countries , all Philosophers , &c. or the Decrees of Law-makers , or the sage sayings of Senatoricall States-men , or the Reports and Obseruations of Historiographers , Poets , and Orators , 〈◊〉 and proouing the trueth of our contradiction . All the worthy Sentences and examples in 〈◊〉 of best acccount , either expressing the excelencie , and Maiestie of Soueraigntie , or the 〈◊〉 and submissiue demeanour of Subiects , are aplyable to this Theame , and would easily bee wrought , and as it were , embroydered into the contexture of a Treatise vpon this Subiect . To that which resteth in this Assertion , auouching that GOD and Nature hath left sufficient Authoritie in euery Common-wealth , &c. I pleade ignorance of his meaning , not vnderstanding ( except hee meaneth the Creation , in which sense hee should haue said , God in Nature , or by Nature ) how God should leaue or institute any such authoritie , but by his reuealed word . I trust hee will not obtrude vnto vs , any long concealed or closited Tradition , or any iuggling tricke of Reuelation , and vnwritten Veritie , wherewith the Christian world hath beene so notoriously 〈◊〉 ; and I am sure , that in the written Law of God , there is not any sillable sounding so harshly ( or rather horribly ) as to giue any order or rule , to dispoyle Princes of their Diadems , or to depose the Anoynted of God. Now for Nature , if shee haue any part in the frame and workemanship of the publique body of the State , as shee hath in the particular and naturall bodies of men , certainely shee hath allowed the like right to the Head of the Common-wealth , as shee hath done to the head of this fleshly Fabrifacture . Doeth not the inferiour members , patiently , and without repugnance , beare all the offences and surcharges , descending vpon them from the head ? Is there in Nature any so much as desire ( much lesse meanes ) of remoouing or repressing of the Head ? I acknowledge that Medicines are often applyed for the curing of the griefes and diseases of the Head but what more ready course is either deuised in 〈◊〉 , or assented vnto by Nature , for the cure of the infirmities and faults of the head , then to vnload the annoyances thereof vpon the subiected parts of the body ? Will you examine another degree of the opperation of Nature ? Next vnto the body it selfe , is the issue and off-spring of the bodie , what bounds of dutie hath nature made of the children towards the Father ? Hath shee left any such Law or libertie , that in any respects the childe may renounce or disclaime his parents ? yea , though the father should ( as oft as out of iudgement hee doth ) cast off or disinherite his sonne ? Let vs now but applyingly remember , that the Prince is Pater Patriae , the Father of the Countrey ; then will our cogitations aptly accommodate this similitude in Nature , vnto the dutious dependancy of the Subiect vpon the person of the Soueraigne , with a true naturall relation and recognition of all loue and obedience , hauing from nature ( out of the resemblance of these two paternes ) no other Law , then parendi & patiendi . Where shall we find more representatiue obedience of Natures intentions and operations , then in these originals and fountaines of Loue ? Then from what stepdames milke hath hee sucked this impuritie of opinion , That Nature hath left some sufficient authoritie in euery Common-wealth for the repressing &c. I will not deny but that there be some axioms of Reason , ingrauen in our nature , which perhaps ( being not rightly vnderstood ) hath occasioned this imputation and slander against Nature , Omnis natura est conseruatrix sui quisque sibi melius vult quam alteri , f●●●e nequimus eum qui infert iniuriam , and the like ; which as they argue a sense and sting in Nature , to vpholde our owne welfare , to feede our owne humour , to further our owne desires , to hate our enemies and wrong doers ; so they must admit the brideling limitation and exposition of reason , which also Nature hath giuen to rule the rest , that all the foresayd priuate , and indiuiduall respeets , must haue no place in the question of our naturall obligation to Superiours , as Fathers , and of our naturall vnion in the communitie of humane Societie ; for the preseruation whereof , Nature hath ordeined Gouernment , and the Soueraigntie thereof to bee sacred and inuiolable . The want of vpright consideration heercof , hath oftentimes been cause of precipitation in vntempered and ill gouerned natures , when seeking to serue their owne purposes in matters of affection or faction , they will easily make pretences of wrong to become auengers thereof against whatsoeuer lawfull authoritie . There bee too many such combinations in all Countreys , wherein euery Sect or side ( with intention to aduaunce that part whereunto it is 〈◊〉 ) doth dreame of these redresses and repressings of their opposites , extending their strength , and endeauour euen to the highest persons . Such , actions or pretences haue no more ground in 〈◊〉 , then if any adulterer should maintaine his 〈◊〉 by the 〈◊〉 pronenesse of appetite ; The Thiefe by the naturall instinct of prouiding 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 or the Murtherer , by the naturall 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 of reuenge : But we stand assured , that whatsoeuer nature by her vncorrupted rules , doth induce or perswade vs vnto , touching our duties in Morall actions , the same , as it was written by the finger of God , in the heart of man , at the Creation , so was it also reduced , and comprised by the Wisedome of God , into the Tables of the Morall Law , in the which for as much , as we haue an expresse commandement , of honor and obedience to gouernors that must remaine fixed in our hearts , to hold vs firme in the Bond of allegiance : Then let P. R. and all his conjoyned Catholikes , ( as hee vaunteth ) make it plaine vnto vs , that eyther Nature hath implanted , or the Commandements of God haue enioyned , therepressing or deposing of such Princes , vppon any exceptions , surmizes , or accusations whatsoeuer : As for the Law of Nations , because that is but secundary and derivatiue , from the other , what hath beene averred of the one , holdeth the same respect and certainty , as doth the roote it selfe , from whence it issueth , yet before wee depart from this Argument of Natures working , I haue to note that this cunning and curious Composer of Bookes , and Contriuer of cases , doth in this his chiefe proposition , worke himselfe quite out of the question , and putteth the Pope cleane out of the doores , for the question being of the power of the Pope , that is of the power , authority , and iurisdiction of a Forraine Commander , and Iudge , he telleth vs , that God and Nature , hath left some sufficient authority in euery Common-wealth , &c. which directly maketh the Popes preheminency with vs altogether needelesse , and a very nullity , sith ( by his owne sayings ) and that more agreeable to reason , there is sufficient authority within the Land , ( not requiring any his 〈◊〉 or vsurpations ) to the gouerning of that body , which is of it selfe compleate and liueth by the vigor , spirit , and powerfull opperation of his owne soule , his lawfull Soueraigne : Thus is the Pope ( as touching the first reason , drawne from the Law or Right of Nature , or Nations ) either left out by him , or cast out by me , from repressing of Princes , or 〈◊〉 himselfe within these our Countries or Territories . The second reason bringeth a better Commission , that will make way through all repugnances , it is inforced in the name and authority of Christ himselfe , and it is thus chayned together for impregnable strength , Christ was to found is Common-wealth of Christians the farre more perfection , then other states had before been establishe , subjecting temporall things to spirituall , and appointing a Supreame Vniuersall gouernour in the same , with a generall charge to looke to all his sheepe ; without exception of great or small , people , or Potentates : Therefore hee inferreth that the Supreame care , iudgement , direction , and censure , of the matter in question , was left by Christ vnto the sayd Supreame 〈◊〉 or Pastor of his Church , and Common-wealth : But it was doubted whether this power was committed to the supreame Pastor directly , and immediatly , or indirectly , and by consequence : The Canonists out of the Commission vnto St. Peter , Pose ones meas , do hold the direct and immediate authority , charge , and ouersight , in temporallities . The Catholike Diuines ( vpon whom the brunt and pressure by 〈◊〉 , must bee sayed ) haue thought it safer , to chuse the indirect and consequentiall , which they expresse in this manner : When the gouernment of spirituall affaires , is impugned by any temporall Gouernors ; so as the sayd spirituall Commission , cannot be executed without redresse or remedy , 〈◊〉 and in such cases , the said Supreame Pastor , is to haue authority to proceede against the temporall gouernors ; Also , for the defence and preseruation of his spirituall charge , but both parts fully are agreed , that there is such authority left by Christ in his Church , for remedy of vrgent causes , otherwise he should not haue sufficiently prouided for the necessity thereof . Here is goodly building of Castles in the ayre , Castles did I say ? Nay , of the Tower of Babell , in the steede of the City of God , Christ ( sayth hee ) was to found his Common-wealth of Christians , in farre more perfection then other states , &c. why Christs intentions , erections and perfections were all to saue sinners , and to bring them vnto Heauen , what proofe is this that hee was to found the Popish Hyerarchy , or the Antichristian Monarchy ? and what is this farre more perfection , &c. Is it an outward pompe or power , to chayne and fetter Princes , vnder a temporall obedience of a Spirituall Vsurper ? What is this same subjecting of temporall things to spirituall , is it to make a Minister or Bishop of Heauenly matters , tyrannous and rampant , ouer the temperall states , setting their imperiall feete vppon the neckes of Lyons and Dragons ? what is the nature , end , and eminency , of the spirituall Kingdome of Christ , is it any other then the Preaching of the Gospell , the way of salvation , and the possessing of euerlasting life ? Then what straightnesse , what extractions , doth the Limbeckes of their braines ( bewitched with temporall vanities ) make of a worldly rule , and Dominion ? He was to appoint one Supreame and 〈◊〉 Gouernor , &c. we on the other side constantly denying this their principle , doe easily bring them to the end of their wits ; yet wee will pocket vp one confession in this place , which hee is likely to forsake , and not acknowledge another time : In more perfection ( sayth hee ) then other states had before beene established , acknowledging thereby , that vnder the Law , and in the old Testament , the temporall was not subject to the spirituall . Hath hee not well collected and conected his propositions to bring out this grand conclusion of superiority ouer Princes ? doth he not neede a distinction of proofe , to make these parts that cleaue like sand to hold together , against the breach which wee are to make vppon him ? His distinction of direct , or indirect , shal be directly anoyded and his great Mace , which hee beareth vp in his March of state , of Ordine ad Deum must bee directed and ordered to a better sence ; and his commission of pasce , shall bee examined how farre it can authorize him to assume the pretented power : If hee will but thanke me for it , I will befriend him a little with my directions : I will chalke him out his way , with a straight line , by the which hee must be brought and passe along , if he desireth to come right vppon the conclusion . I will distribute his journey into seuerall baytings , or reposes , otherwise called common places : I doubt it will prooue a long labour , and very troub esome to carry his commission along with him , hee is like to venture himselfe in many straights , and hazardable passages , and will be often stayed by the Kings Watch , but more often foundred by the rubs , and roughnesse of the way , which hee is to walke through : He must begin and set forth at this poynt . 1 That Christ purposing to found his Common-wealth of Christians in farre more perfection &c. hath appoynted the same to be an absolute Monarchy , vnder one supreame and vniversall Governour , visible , eminent , and knowne as the head on earth , in all causes of Christs kingdome . 2 Next who that individuall person is , whom Christ appointed to be such a Monarche , and by what commission is he assigned thereunto , and by what words thereof can he challenge the obedience of all the subiects or Christians in that Common-wealth ? 3 Whether if St. Peter be affirmed to be the said Monarche , what can be alledged for his Superiority , that is not equally communicable to the rest of the Apostles , ioyntly or severally , by the like authorizement ? 4 Whether St. Peter was more especially appointed the chiefe Apostle for both Iewes and Gentiles ; If for the Iewes , how came it , that St. Paul reproved him for misleading the Iewes ? If for the Gentiles , why was St. Paul by a publike consent and Counsell nominated to be the Apostle of the Gentiles , who at Rome planted the Church , and from whom the succession is most proper . 5 Whether St. Peter ever came at Rome ? sith there is evident demonstration by computing the times and places of his abode , during his life after Christs ascension , that he could not be there at all by any coniecture , as by the Epistles of St. Paul is evicted . 6 Allowing that St. Peter was at Rome , was he not there as an Apostle and so no more appropriate to that place then to the whole world ? 7 Being an Apostle , how came he to be chiefe , yea the vniuersall Pastor over both Iewes and Gentiles ? except such his Pastorship were rather Apostolicall then Episcopall ? If his 〈◊〉 were Apostolicall , then all the Apostles had interest thereunto as well as he : If Episcopall , did he renounce or relinquish his Apostleship to erect a new state or seate of an 〈◊〉 Bishop , neuer mentioned in the Scripture , and of a larger extent and dominion then the Apostleship , and by what warrant and authoritye did he so ? 8 If he did found any such Episcopall eminencie vniversall over all the Churches of the world , and that invested in his owne person , why may it not be thought , that such his Episcopall function was setled vpon him rather at Antioch , where his chiefest abode was ( after his departure from Ierusalem ) then at Rome ? 9 Whether in case he preferred Rome before Antioch , Ierusalem and other places , ( whereof there is no apparant proofe or certainty , ) is that successive seare established at Rome , of the like and the same power , vertue , and veritie , as was conferred on his owne person ? 10 Whether such supposed succession were afixed to the place , or aplied to the persons ? 11 Whether if the succession were applied to the place , was it not cut off and discontinued when there was no vniuersall Bishop refiant at Rome ? which for some hundreths of yeares after Christ , and since the vsurpation Papall for a long time together hath come to passe ? 12 If the succession were in the persons , did not the abominable wickednes of life , or the open profession of Atheisme , Arianisme , Coniuration , and contracting with the Deuill , damnable doctrines of all sorts , and hereticall positions , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by such persons ; yeain their Cathedra , dissolve the said succession ? and what 〈◊〉 they make for Pope Ioane , whose stay standeth vnrefuted ? 13 Moveover he 〈◊〉 me what became of this 〈◊〉 ; and where that Common-wealth of Christians ( as they will needs calbit , that they may make themselues common wealths men ) could finde there one 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 Governor , when there were two , three , or 〈◊〉 such 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 at once ? 14 Yet we haue not done questioning with him , This great 〈◊〉 of doubts must resolve vs how it commeth to 〈◊〉 that the 〈◊〉 persian , 〈◊〉 Russian , 〈◊〉 , and other 〈◊〉 Churches , haue not beene made 〈◊〉 with this 〈◊〉 mentall part of doctrine , that Christ hath ordayned the Bishop of Rome the supreame and vniuersall Pastor of the whole Common-wealth of Christians , which he hath 〈◊〉 and founded ? 15 He is also to 〈◊〉 himself of an answere to another question , Whether the succesors of S. Peter ( were it once agreed vppon ) who they were , Clement , Linus , Cletus , or 〈◊〉 , did over hold or exercise any ditivation of authority from St. Peter over 〈◊〉 and other Apostles that survived St. Peter in the Church or did they or any of them striue for Superioritye with them , yea rather did they not yeeld vnto them ? 16 Besides , this 〈◊〉 diving determinor in Divinity doubts , must take into his consideration what warrantize of any lawful vocation , election , and ordinatiō , the succeeding Bishops of Rome can avow or maintain , sith no man may take on him any 〈◊〉 ministery or 〈◊〉 but in that regular and 〈◊〉 manner . And whether such their calling to their Ministeriall offices , and Pastorall charge , were ordinary , or extraordinary , the difference in the admissions and choyce of such Bishops which sometimes was by substitution of the proceeding Bishop , sometimes by election of the people , and in later times by the suffrages of Cardinals , and sometimes by meere intrusion , giveth cause to move this question . 17 What reasons can be pretended or alledged , why if both Christ and St. Peter intended the succession of Bishops onely in that Sea of Rome , 〈◊〉 there hath new Titles beene taken vp , of Patriarke 〈◊〉 , and then of Supreame head of the Church , and then of Papa or Pope , which seemeth to inferre an alteration , or else an augmentation of the power or charge , first conferred by Christ or St. Peter vppon that Sea ? and so consequently a question , whether the latter diuised Titles be likewise authorized from Christ ? 18 Doth it not behoue that this so pregnant a Patron of Papacy , doe cleare all causes touching the interruption and discontinuance of the supposed succession of Popes ; whereof ( some hauing before beene propounded ) it shall not be amisse to cast him one bone more , to whet his teeth or witt vppon , I would know whether ( after cannons , and constitutions made by his Holinesse , and ratyfied by Councells , touching the lawfull election , and admittance of the Bishop of Rome ) if a Pope enter vnduly , and contrary to such orders and Cannons , by simony , bribery , faction , yea with strong hand , or any other corrupt courses , may notwithstanding be held and reputed a lawfull Pope ? and the acts by him done , the carnalls by him made , and the decrees or trans-actions of his time , shall bee adiudged as to stand in the right of Christs Vicar on earth ? Are not in such cases , the linckes of the chaine tying together the succession broken , or let loose sith in the particulers ( in whom the same should be continued ) such elections and ordinations , are adiudged intrusions and vsurpations , yea vtterly voyde and very nullities ? 19 Yet I must make him a little more worke with other questions , what is the cause that for so long a space of 600. yeares after Christs Assention , this position of the Romish Supremacy , and vniuersall head-ship , ( if it were so evident and demonstratiue from Christs owne appointment , as this bold bragger would haue vs to beleeue ) was neither by the Fathers of the Primitiue Church , nor by any generall Councels , approoued or ratified . 20 I am disposed to offer him another objection like a blocke to stumble at , which neuer any Papist yet well passed ouer , but he brake his shin against it ; and that is the opinion and censure of Gregory the great , Bishop or rather Patriarke of Rome , how did hee inuey against that tytle of vniuersall Bishop , as an arrogant stile , calling Iohn Patriarke of Constantinople , the fore-runner of Antichrist for assuming of such a title or authority : may it not stagger this stout Champion of Popery to heare from the mouth of a successor of St. Peter , such a detestation of that stile , as Antichristian , which is auouched to haue beene the ordinance of Christ , yet did Bonifacius that succeeded him , ambitiously affect nd accept the very same appellation giuen to him from Phocas the Emperour 600 yeares after Christ , as is sayd before . 21 Here , if I should let in vpon him a sea of proofes , that the Pope is clearely convicted to be not a fore-runner ( as Gregory speakes ) but the very same Antichrist described by so many particularities in Daniel the Appocalips , in St. Paul and other places of the Holy Scripture , he would neuer be able to scape drowning , but would be so over-whelmed in those depthes , that hee could neuer more get forth , yea , or stirre either hand or foote , for his swimming to any shore ; and the great disputant could then hold his breath no longer in this question euen sinking downe to the bottome after all his strength spent in vaine , by striuing to hold vp his head . 22 Now , to draw to the issue in hand , wee must trouble him to make manifest vnto vs , what is the true extent of this so high power and vniuersall charge in St. Peter , or any other his successors , and whether the same do include any temporall iurisdiction , and entermedling in civill causes , to the deciding , iudging , or ordering thereof ? 23 Lastly , to bring him home to his rest , and to the ground whereupon hee must reare his foundation , hee must euict by proofe , that the Supreame , Vniuersall , Romane , Bishop , by force or tenor of any Commission giuen by Christ , and transferred vnto St. Peter , and so diriuatiuely and successiuely conueyed ouer to him , may censure , iudge , or depose Princes , taking vppon him the decision of Regall rights , assayling of Subiects from obedience , animating at home rebellion are from abroad invasion , and that vnder protext of aduancing of the Ecclesiasticall regiment of soules , and the good of Catholike Religion . This is the highest ladder of the Popes eminency , to the which exaltation , hee cannot otherwise assend then by these stayres and steps , before rehearsed , which must lead him vp to his lofty consistoriall Chayre : If any of these stayres bee loose and faile him , hee falleth vnrecouerably , and shall neuer bee able to assume the power , which hee pretendeth himselfe to bee lawfully possessed of . But when of all these exceptions and interruptions cast in his way , hee can cleare or assure not any one , his presumption in taking so much vppon him , will but argue his all daring boldnesse ; and his striking close to the conclnsion , when the premises runne another way will make euen Children to scoffe at the want of judgement in his so great vndertakings . By these few indissoluable questions ( amongst infinite others ) for all the world knoweth what a world of doubts , and what a sea of controuersies , is encompassed in this cause . This P. R. or rather R. P. ( if hee would be better knowne ) that would seeme to bee so iudicious in his resolues , and so modest and moderate in his assertions , might haue beene put in minde to stay his confidence in concluding so Magistraliter , that case , with his peremptory est amen , which hath so many stopps , windings , and euen breake necke passages , as hath hetherto perplexed , and plunged the whole Alphabet of their owne Authors . By that time , that he hath runne through the explication and proofe of the particuler difficulties before propounded , hee will somewhat slacke , the heate of his audacious affirmations , and to let him know that this poynt , ( as wee now propound it and debate it ) is not amongst the Catholike wrighters themselues , so clearely and generally agreed vppon as hee avoucheth ( for hee sayth ) that in this there is no difference of opinion , or beleefe in any sort of Catholikes whatsoeuer , ( so they bee Catholikes ) I must remember him ( if hee forget not his owne name , yea and his nick-names too , ) that in the bitter contentions , and fiery conflicts , betweene the Priests and the Iesuites , a principall matter of their variance was this , That the Priests vtterly condemned this Turbulent , and Sedicious opinion of the Iesuites . That the Pope might and ought to intermeddle in the temporall rights and preheminencies of Princes , and that he had a powre to depose and deiect them at his pleasure . Doth not William Watson the Priest in his booke of quidlibets bestow a whole Chapter with much earnestnes of spirit , and variety of arguments , vpon this very subiect , making in the same this R. P. the obiect of his scornings and revilings ? Doth he not in many places of that worke impute all the causes of the many troubles and extremities which they vndergoe in England to the violent spirits , and treacherous practizings of the Iesuites , who neglecting or despising the Ministeriall function , are become meere Statists , and negotiating factors of the Sea of Rome , disturbing the quiet of all Countryes where they be entertained , and working wicked stratagems and damnable devices against Soveraigne Princes ? Hath hee so soone forgotten , or can hee so bold'y dissemble , in what sort the said Priests vncased and discovered him for his many notorious and scandalous intermedlings in 〈◊〉 ? Perhaps he will say that they be no Catholikes , for so he enterposeth ( if they be Catholikes ) he dareth not to lop away at once so many chiefe lims , so many strong armes , yea such stocks and plants of the popish religion , though the said Priests doe not feare or spare to affirme , that the Iesuites are not any certaine order or vocation in the Church , being rather to be reckoned ( as their vse and imployment is ) to be Lay-men , States-men , busie-bodies , pragmaticall agents beyond all limits of any spirituall calling ) yet it is necessary , ( if he will constare sibi ) to stand to it , that ( seeing they vary from him , in this part of doctrine ) they be no Catholikes , because in this refusing and refuting of his Majesties distinction of the difference of Papists , he expresly affirmeth , that he that holdeth not all and every Article assented vnto and established in the Church , he is not to be accounted Catholike , acording to St. Augustine . Catholicum is constered to be secundum totam , and not secundum partem , I will leaue the Priests to defend that they be better Catholikes then he , notwithstanding this discrepance and my selfe will revert to the parting place where occasion was taken to make this digression . There is offered for plea the words of the institution , and the very authenticall enstallment made by Christ himselfe , Pasce oues me as which words include ( say they ) acording to Catholike exposition , not only authority to feede , but to governe also , direct , restraine , cure , represse , and correct when neede is . Allow that these words doe appoint and institute a pastorall charge ( which is a geminall vnderstanding thereof ) yet such charge is not thereby more appropriate to Peter , then to other Apostles , but if they so far tender out the same , to make them beget vnto vs a Pastor , of Pastors , a Bishop , of Bishops , a supreame and soveraigne governor of the whole Church , I may not yeeld their logick such libertie , as to conclude so vnconsequently . Againe allow that in this commission and charge every Pastor were required not only to instruct the sheepe of his fold with wholesome doctrine of faith , but also to have an eye to their life and conversation to reprove them , admonish them , and censure them with ecclesiasticall discipline , what is that to the governing in secular affaires , or to the claime of such an vnlimmited power by the Popes intrusion ? I may not yeelde to their Rhetoricke , such a preuayling or perswading power , as that where they cannot shape so much as a shadow , there they shall erect and create the true substance , of a more then Monarchiall principallity : It is heere auouched , that Catholike exposition includeth within this worde , Pasce the commission of gouerning also . Therefore many Catholikes that will rather hazard the exclusion of his ( if they bee Catholikes ) then they will condiscend to this interpretation . A graue and profound Catholike , one of the pillers of papacy , Cardinall Baronius being to animate and confirme his Holinesse proceedings , against the Venetians for their great sinne , of executing Iustice , against men of clericall habit , in causes criminall , and ciuilly punishable , passed ouer this Text of Pasce , as not sufficiently seruing the turne , to prooue the Popes right of jurisdiction in such t̄eporall affaires ; and thereuppon interpreting and applying the same restrictiuely , to the teaching function , made choyce of a fitter peece of Scripture , to accommodate vnto that case , and to put into the Popes hand , for the justification of that excesse of his authority : Hee maketh the office of St. Peter to be two-fold , the first of feeding and teaching , comprised in the word , Pasce , the other of correcting , and chastifing contayned in the words of Christ , vsed in the vision of the beasts presented to Peter , occide et manduca , kill and eate : You see that hee was content to leaue that leane and pining application of Pasce , and to finde out a more stinging Text , that might pierce to the very quicke of the cause , doth not this same ( occide et manduca ) giue authority to draw blood , putting the Sword into his Holinesse hand , to execute at his will and pleasure , such as hee shall recon , Beasts without exception of great and small , people or potentates , Is it not made evident thereby that all sorts of people whatsoever , cleane or vncleane , high or low , friend or foe , are as it were tyed and bundled vp together , and so subiected and abiected at his feete , to feed vpon , and satiate his devouring appetites ? It maketh no matter for the proper sense of the text , ( figuring and signifying Iew , or Gentile ) the wrest and streine thereof serveth best to his purpose , cutting even to the core of this question . Old Father Barronius in his dreame , espied more then young S. Peter could apprehend by vision : He hath found and inferred out of that place , that which St. Peter if hee lived to this day ( except his successors did teach him ) could never have gessed at , the Excommunication , and further degradation of States and Soueraignes . In the same his encoraging advice to his Holinesse ( which I rather recount , because it so evenly matcheth with their moderne divinity ) hee stirreth vp the fainting spirit of the Pope with a Memento te positum esse in Petram , Remember that thou art placed for Rocke , whosever rusheth against thee shall be crushed all to peeces . Therefore where his Holinesse layeth a heavie hand to his fulminating censures , there no resistance , rescue , or reliefe , can availe to defend from destruction . For this Prophesie is as fitly appliable to the Viear of Christ , as it was directly and properly referred to Christ himselfe . Thus this learned Cardinall bestowed vpon his Holinesse as he were the very image and character of Christ vpon earth the self-same attribute , and exaggeration vsed in scripture , to set forth the might and dignity of our redeemer . Nay further , hee will needs comfort the Pope with the application of that to his person in perticuler , which Christ assured to his whole Church in generall , that the gates of hell shall not prevaile against him , and will earthly Princes then persume to shut his Holinesse out of dores ? Hee that hath a power over Hell it selfe , shall not he commaund and over-rule the earth ? These beeing the proude and prophane conceits which they have of that Idoll of Rome ( their imagined Lieutenant of Christ ) they draw not only from the Spouse of Christ the rich ornaments of her glory to deck that bewitching Harlot with , but also hold it no robberie , to enrobe the man of sinne with the gracefull and blessed titles of the Sonne of God , for which so Luciferian and blasphemous arrogatings , I doubt it will not be made good and verified , that the gates of hell shall not be shut against him . I must confesse , that I like better of the simplicitie of our mitigator , in misliking vpon the poore probability of reason picked out of the word ( Pasce ) and that rather by a consequence , then by any direct induction , then I doe of the affected and vnserchable subtilty of this Cardinall , and some others , who studying for vnwonted straynes , and forcings , doe cast beyond the Moone to magnifie or dignifie his Holinesse aboue the Sunne , I will be bold to set downe some more of these deepe digged and far-fetched argum̄ets , not with any purpose to vouchsafe them any time , or paines for answere , but euen to admire , if not exclaime at the impious and presump tuous absurdity , of such their so frivolous and most strange inferences ; Pope Bonifacius the eight ( that layd the first stone of this Babilonian building ) out of the words of Christ vnto his Disciples , in the twenty two of St. Luke ( they sayd vnto him , behold here are two Swords , Christ answered it is sufficient . ) By these two Swords ( sayth Boniface ) Christ meaneth the spirituall and temporall , both the which are left by our Sauiour , for the defence and preseruation of his Church ; and because there would be no order , but mutiny , tumult , and confusion , if these swords should not well agree , therefore there must needes be employed , and intended by Christ , a subjection , and subalteration of the one sword vnto the other , and both depending vpon one Supreame Command . From this supposed authority of Christs leauing and recommending both Swords vnto his Church , Boniface tooke vppon him the power of both Swords , and caused to be passed as an Article of Faith that the Pope is supreame , ouer both estates , spirituall and temporall , and shortly after in a Iubile , publikly shewed himselfe , with a key in one hand , and a sword in the other . And that hee may the better maintaine , the taking of the sword , hee further argueth , that one of the swords , was his prodecessors St. Peters sword , ( it being well knowne that Peter had a sword ; because Christ sayd vnto him put vp thy sword ( shall I neede to make any refutation of this collection , or assertion ? being declared not as positiue out of the word , but expository , by a sence which the Pope assumeth ? Let me yet gather vp this note by the way , that it was good fortune , that Christ did command St. Peter to put vp his sword , else perhaps the sharpenesse and weight thereof , had long since light vppon the heads , and neckes of Princes , as well as it cut off the eare of Malchas : for the same pretence which occasioned him to draw vppon Malchas in rescue and maintainance of his Maister Christ might incite the high courages of his supposed successors to bee as actiue with their blades and forces , for the support and furtherance ( as they alledge ) of the Christian faith and religion , impugned , or impeached by temporall Potentates . I would now know of Maister P. R. whether hee accounteth the exposition and decree of Bonifacius the Pope , to bee Catholike and Orthodoxall , if hee doe not , wee also will take ( by his example ) the like liberty of acceptance or dislike in any the Articles of Faith , concluded and adiudged by his Holinesse : If hee doe , then what neede hee bee so slye and mistrustfull in affirming the same Doctrine , absolueth also , without any distinctions and cooling quallifications , as if hee were either ashamed of confession or afraid of conviction ? when hee hath such an argument ab authoritate to a rest him to stand vnto it ? Why should hee ( I say ) runne about the bush , with a Commission direct and indirect , when hee cannot but know that Bonifacius was resolute in opinion , that his power ouer Princes , and in temporallities was absolute without any oblique consequence , or respectiue dependency , jumping therein plainly , and fully with the Canonists , Papa est Dominus totius orbis directe in temporalibus . How would this so well tempered and timorous mitigator bee brought to iustifie the hautinesse of Pope Clament the fifth , successor to Bonifacius , who not satisfied with the rule and command ouer temporall and earthly states , did brauely adventure , by his papall Bull , expressely to enioyne , and command Angels to execute his will : Me thinketh I should aske him also whether hee will hold consonancy of iudgement with his owne Country-man , and good friend the renowned Cardinall Allen , who in his Appology for the English Catholikes , out of the miraculous working of St. Peter mentioned in the fifth of the Acts , of sentencing to suddaine death Ananias and Saphira , doth no lesse miraculously wring out this great Ministery of excommunicating , censuring , and other proceedings against Princes . There is no parcell of Scripture wherein any mention is made of St. Peter , but if it can be racked to affoord them any patterne or patronship for either their deedes or decrees , it is miserably torne , and tormented to vndergoe that seruice : Not so much as the power of Keyes ; but it must needes bee made a picke locke , to possesse prisons , Castles , and Towers : The Key of knowledge for the sauing of soules , is turned to a Key of powre to deprive Princes , the binding and loosing of sinnes , is but a very legerdemaine of fast and loose at the Popes pleasure , the fishing for men to bring them to eternall life , is made a pretence for spreading his nets , to catch and conquer whole States and Dominions : The Pastorall Sheep-hooke , subdueth Kingly Scepters , Saint Peters Aurum & argentum non habeo , doth now glitter in all the pompious and copious varietye of riches , and the promise of Christ , Dabo tibi claues regni caelorum , is not so much esteemed , as the offer of the Devill , Dabo tibi &c. All these things will I giue thee , if thou wilt fall downe and worship mee . If the Pope will needs enioy a right of succession of all that Christ sayd vnto Saint Peter , let him not refuse also ( Get thee behinde mee Sathan , ) and , O thou of little faith . Nay , the denying of Christ , so expressely imitated in the declining , degenerating , and sliding away from the sinceritye of the Gospell , is apparently branded vpon this Antichristian iniquity , where Saint Peters either example , or precept , fitteth not their turnes , there they will not vse , or rather cannot relieve it , and could be well pleased that it were put over to their Ezponctorius his charge and admonition , that they subiect themselves vnto all manner of ordinance of man for the Lords sake , whether it be vnto the King , as vnto the Superior , or vnto Governours , as sent of him for the punishment of evill doers , and for the prayse of them that doe well . And likewise his beseeching of the Elders , as his fellow Pastors , that they feede the flocke not as Lords over Gods Heritage , will not fashion to , or cohere with their owne proude doctrines of exemption from Temporall Authoritye , of opugning and repressing Princes , of their Lordlinesse over their fellow-Ministers , of their desisting from Teaching and Preaching , and of Saint Peters Primacy to reare vp the Romane Papacy . And therefore must be censured , interpreted , distinguished , abridged , and limited , by such curtelings , and consterings , as the glosser or goulfe of the Sea of Rome shall devise for the best advantage . In the like manner doe they all so deale with Christ himselfe , whom whence they fetch and found the originall of theyr lineally derived Popedome . Christ professed himselfe , and so instructed his Disciples , to bee humble and meeke , but how doth the Pope tread that path ? not so much in the exercise of his owne Lowlinesse , or in the abstinence from high state and loftye cariage , as in the depressing of the mightynesse and power of Lawfull Soveraignes , reducing or enforcing them to be meeke indeede , in a degree of base and contemptible humiliation . Christ refused to be made a Iudge in a Civill or Temporall cause , the Pope maketh himselfe Iudge of any debates , that by any pretext can be conceived to be fit for his cognizance : Christ bad , Giue vnto Caesar that which was Caesars : The Pope robbeth Cesar , of his treasure , of his honor , of his power , of his rights , and of his subiects . Christ declareth his kingdome not to be of this world , the Pope ( besides his owne Temporall Soveraignity , will haue an Oare , and commaund in all the States of Christendome . In which part , of the Temporall kingdome of Christ in this life , P. R. is much cumbered , and put to his shift , to finde out an even cutting distinction , to saue the repugnancye of Christs sayings . The Canonists , and some other Catholikes , out of these words , All power is given vnto mee in Heaven and in Earth , doe conclude , that besides his Spirituall government of our Soules , he hath a kingly Dominion also vppon our bodies and goods , and vppon all the Kingdomes of the earth , and might iustly haue exercised all actions , of temporall iurisdictions , as casting into prison , appoynting new Offices , Kings , and great Monarckes . Marke how they compell our Sauiour Iesus Christ to sallogize against himselfe ? All power is giuen to mee in Heauen and in Earth , but my Kingdome to bee of this World is such a power , Ergo , my Kingdome is of this same World. Now obserue also his witty and substantiall reconcilement , hee had a Kingly temporall power in this life , but hee renounced the vse and priuiledge of the same : Or thus , hee had no direct Dominion vppon temporall things , yet indirectly , for preseruation of his spirituall Dominion hee had and might haue vsed the same , and in that sence left it to his successour : Is not this most shamelesse , and direct abusing of Christ , and his most Sacred Word ? When hee sayd at another time , that the Foxes had holes , and the Birds of the Ayre had nests , but the Sonne of man , had no place to hide his head : If these expositors had then beene knowne to his Apostles , they would haue replyed ; Sir , you haue places of refuge , but you renounce the vse and priviledge thereof , or albeit you haue not any place directly , yet indirectly for the necessity of your function , you haue all palces at your Command , or if you haue not in your owne indiuiduall person , yet in your Successors , you must needes haue , else how should they maintayne the hauing and inhabiting of such Royall and Magnificent edifices , wherein they keepe such stately and more then imperiall Courts ? What is this else ; then to tell Christ hee wotteth not what hee sayth , and to enter him like a Novice in their new Schooles of equiuocation , to learne their falatious mentall preseruations ? But admit it to be incident into their Offices , to interpret Christ as themselues listeth , How doth it happen , that the rightfull successors of Christ doth not also succeede him in his modestye , humilitye , povertye , and meekenesse ( especially beeing commaunded to learne of him ) and so ( in like sort as Christ did ) renounce the vse and priviledge of Temporall Power , or whence haue these successors their so plenarye and direct preheminence , when from Christ they could convey it but indirectlye , and by consequence : Or can they make any demonstration or playne proofe of the stint and circuite of time , at the periode or expiration whereof , that Temporall Dominion which in Christ was Indirect and Potenticall , should become vnto the Pope , Direct , and Ordinarye ? Or was there not as vrgent cause that Christ , ( in respect of the many letts , impeachments , and impediments which he met withall ) should for the preservation of his Spirituall Dominion , directly , or indirectly , in some sort or other , betake himselfe to his Temporall Authoritye ? Except they will say , that hee was in his owne person militant and suffering , but in these his successors triumphant and glorious . Let mee then bee answered , Whether such a Succession hath any image or representation of that first type or patterne which sayde ( Learne of mee . ) To manifest yet more discerningly , the idlenesse , the fraude , and vnfit applying of this distinction , let them know , that is not to be trusted vnto , because it will serue their adversaries as well as themselues , for where the question may be propounded and disputed , whether temporall Princes may suppresse or remooue Popes , ( if the authorities alleadged out of Gods Word , and the Histories of the Church shall not suffice to giue in evidence for any such direct and vndoubted preheminence in Princes ) then we may make bold of this their make-shift distinction , that Princes haue euer had such a power annexed , and proper to their governing charge , though they haue forborne the vse and preuiledge thereof , or that indirectly and by consequence ( for the vpholding of their states , and keeping of their people in obedience , which by so many Popish practises is dayly perverted ) they may and ought to exercise and execute the same . Moreouer , let it be examined , how and from what originall this distinction draweth his pedigree , what bosome or heate did first hatch it , and what causes of weight doth still nourish and continue the same , Mr. P. R. hath fully acquainted vs with the certainty thereof . For if Christ ( sayth he ) should not haue left such an authority in his Church for remedy of vrgent causes , hee should not haue sufficiently provided for the necessity thereof . It is maruaile that this our Moderator , and mollifying Mittigator did not vse the word of conveniency , in the stead of necessity , to haue avoyded the disadvantage of the stricktnesse of that word , can there ( concerning the subsistance , and stability of the Church ) any more vrgent causes to be imagined for the vpholding thereof , then there was in the first times of the primitiue purity ? or is the vsurping power of the supreame Pastor , his ouer awing or over peering of Princes , his correcting and repressing of them , by alienating subiects , and egging enemies against them any constitutiue causes or essentiall necessities of the Church ? I will not deny but that the height and eminency , wherevnto the Bishops of Rome , haue aspired , by encroching vpon the rights and vndermining the states of temporall Gouernors , as indeede to be provided for , and maintayned by this presupposed necessity : But the purity , the poverty , the simplicity , the feruency , of the first fathers , and propagators of the faith and Church of Christ needed none of these humaine and worldly additaments , none of these temporall encountrings , or conflicting with Potentates , no such foreseeing perpecations , to affront all occurting causes , nor any such politiciall circumventings , and fortifications for defence and offence against Princes : They conquered powers and principalities , but with the spirituall Armor of God , they beate vppon them with the hammer of the word , they cut deeply into the secrets of their soules , with the sword of the spirit they prayed for their peace , and prosperity , they embrased the very persecutions with obedience , and for the countenancing fauours , ( by giuing them respit from affliction , and the sunne shine of liberty ) they honoured them as the nursing fathers of the Church , ( when I contemplate the composute and frame of the Popish Monatchy , and the linking together of so many cunningly contrived positions , tending ( all of them ) to the encrease of gaine and advance of Honor to the Sea of Rome , I wish that some excellent Scholler extraordinarily endued would out of his many obseruations collected , exhibite vnto the world ( in imitation of Matchauell , who made the shames and vices of the house of Florence , the patterne of a perfite Prince ) this Antichrist of Rome as a true president of Tyranny and Vsurpation by publishing with an apt resemblance , as well the vilde and vnchristian practises , as also the false and pernicious articles , whereby he hath atchived so strange matters , and attained vnto so vnmeasurable greatnesse , which my desire is the more increased , the more I consider , how the webs of that worke , hath ensuared , if not enthralled Christian people , euen in the carriage of this controversie . I haue traced the foot-steps of many politicke reaches , and now in the closing vp of the matter , a faire traine is layd , to catch and lay hold vpon an easie follower , which we must not so suddenly passe by , as not to discerne the sleight thereof , he speaketh plainely in honest and oyly words : That that authority temporal is to be moderated by many perticularities to be considered , There must be iust cause , graue and vrgent motives , formall proceedings , great deliberation , lawfull meanes , and other circumstances , to concurre , requiering great discretion ; what a goodly displaying he maketh , in tearmes of the best shew , when yet ( howsoeuer occasins shall alter their intentions ) there is no more conteyned or propounded thereby , then what is vsually requisite in all Benches of Iustice , erected for tryall of common rights , But our question is , Whether the Pope be a competent Iudge , vpon or against Temporall Gouernours , let the matter be caried neuer so presizely and circumspectly , that maketh him no title for enterposing his vsurped Authority . Therefore hee might well haue spared his paines , in making this the third question which neither in this , nor any other iudiciall power is any question at all . But he conceived , that this orderly course and discrect cariage which hee would haue vs to presuppose in the Pope , would carry vs along in all conformity , to condiscend to any his presumptious and vsurping iurisdiction . Let him tell whether the publicke denunciation , or rather execration made euery Maundee Thursday against the Hereticks whatsoeuer , doth not also enwrap the Princes of our religion ( especially if they haue made and executed feuere lawes against the Popish ) within the danger and rigor of that sentence , which if it do , then these flourishing and superfluous words , of the cognition of the cause , of due proceedings , of vrgent motiues , of aduised consultations , of lawfull meanes of preambles and circumstances are but snares to beguile the simple , seeing that his Holinesse ( for the most part ) acteth his solemnities , and ceremonies of Excommunication , both generally and personally , without the obseruing of the particularities . Beyond all this the pondering of such seuerall considerations , to whose brest , or trust are they recommended ? are they not euery one wholly and absolutely in the Popes discretion ? Let vs but remember the course of proceedings by these perticularities , against our late Queene , his Holinesse tooke knowledge , as well by publicke fame , as by complayning relacions , of the afflicted and distressed Catholikes , and of Queene Elizabeths hard vsage of them in this Kingdome , there is the vrgent motive and importing cause , what were the consultations , what the meanes , and what the proceedings , a Bull of Excommunication publickly deprived her , of her Royall Dignity , setteth free her Subiects from their Allegiance , enioyneth all Catholikes to endeavor her deposing , and so exposeth her to continuall Treasons , and bloody Assassinates ; This is the short Epitome of this all presuming Papacy , Then let any other Prince take to himselfe the like scantling , by the measure offered to Queene Elizabeth , ( bethinking himselfe whether the enumeration of so many good poynts , of aduisednes , and the cautilous respects set forth by glosing words , may sufficiently secure him from feares and iealousies . One other doubt ( of great consequence and preiudice ) may much perplex Princes , which is the vndistinguished and vnlimited nature of the causes , triable by the Popes authority , for what cause can be supposed so meerely Ciuill , as hath not some mixture of cases in Conscience , and so to be referred in order to a spirituall end , becomming ( as in that regard ) of a spirituall cognizance . And then his Holinesse ( holding himselfe onely in his owne element ) beeing the supreame Iudge in spirituall doubts , how extendable is the amplitude of his power to any manner of debates or variences , which ( by complaint or appeale ) vnder a colour of devotion or religion shall be presented to his holy decision ? But the deadliest poyson that lyeth in the Dragons Tayle , is the disposition and ordination of the meanes , of giuing to such Popes Iudgements , the full blow of execution . For where the spirituall blast of his indignation , is not much regarded , there ( as the inferior rout of the Clergy , doth ) his holinesse will not sticke to implore the ayde of the secular arme , be it forraine , be it domesticall , be it directly for the same cause , or indirectly ( I am in loue 〈◊〉 that distinction ) vpon the fore-plotted quarrells , be it by the sedicious tumult of insurrection , or by any 〈◊〉 audaciousnesse of 〈◊〉 . Surely , when I consider the desperate 〈◊〉 . of some particular men , who abandoning all care or respect of themselues , and instigated onely with a seeming zeale of religion , do with violent hands of blood , enterprise the distruction of Prince . I am induced to beleeue , that they haue some direct Commission , or some indirect incitation so to compell and precipitate their ill gouerned mindes , into the horror of so vild an action : Neverthelesse , I may not dissemble , that concerning any priuate exployts , in this kinde , they disclayme the approbation thereof ; though I am well assured , that experience to the contrary doth make it manifest , that they dissemble . This authority ( sayth this our satisfying mittigator ) doth not onely not allow the wicked and vnlawfull attempts of priuate men , but also doth expressely and publickely condemne the same , as in the Councell of Constance , the wicked article of lawfull killing of Princes , by private men ( holding them Tyrants ) is rejected and condemned . Euery man seeth how resolued a case he maketh it , both by the Catholicke Divines , and by the Cannon of the Councell of Constance , that no priuate attempts though of neuer so magnanimous a spirit against the life of a Prince , though neuer so much tainted with Tyranny , insuffieiency , infidellity , or heresie can be in any sort iustifiable . But that it may the better be knowne , that these be but fallacious and gay-coated words , Ad faciendum populum , I will ( for bearing any mine owne refutations , encounter and contradict this smoothing P. R. with one of his owne fellow Iesuites , that goeth more roundly , and plainly to this poynt : Such a one as whether he bestowed his skill and faculty , with any mischiefeuous intention to animate wicked enterprises , ( for his Booke was Printed about the very time of our last so memorable plots of Treason ) my charity will suspend my iudgement , he casteth no colours , nor feareth to deliuer boldly his resolutions , and encouragements to all Catholikes . It is Iohannes Mariana , a Spaniard and Iesuite , and a Diuinity Reader , his Booke is intituled , De Rege et Regis institutione , published in the the yeare 1605. Dedicated to the King of Spaine , and printed Per missu superiorum , yea and Regia authoritate . Now if Mr. P. R. will allow this great Scholler , comming foorth in lucem et oculos hominum , accompanied with such estate of attending approbations , to be a Catholike , hee shall heare him speake , and then set him blame his temerity , for telling tales out of the Iesuiticall Schoole . The sixe Chapter of his first Booke , is wholy bestowed vpon this question , of the lawfulnesse of deposing or slaying Tyrants . The particularity of killing the French King is argued , the reasons on both sides produced , pondered and enforced : His determination decideth , and adjudgeth the fact to haue beene just , prayse worthy , and agreeable to the Catholicke grounds . He further setteth foorth , the receiued opinion of the Church , to be that it is lawfull for Subiects , when the King resuseth to be reformed , and after sentence against him , to renounce their Obedience , to consult for the leuying of a necessary Warre , to taxe the people , with the charge thereof , and with armed force and weapons , ( in such case of necessitie ) to set vpon him , to kill him , and destroy him , and then descendeth to this conclusion Eademque facultas esto , cuicunque priuato , qui spe impunitatis abiecta , neglecta propria salute , in conatum iuvandi rempublicam , ingredi voluerit ; Let any private man , which ( casting aside all hope of impunity , and carelesse of his owne safety ) will adventure to enterprise his endevors to relieue the Common-wealth , take vnto him the same liberty , Hath he not soundly and definitively declared the doctrine of the Church of Rome , and the very secresies and misteries of the Iesuites profession ; to the apparant conviction of this Mittigators fained attestations ? And to the foresaid Councell of Constance , ( which is produced to impugne this position of the practises , or attempts of private men against lawfull Soveraignes ) hee also maketh answere in this manner , First , that no Decree of any Councell standeth good and holy , without the consent of his Holinesse thereunto , Then , that this Decree was neuer approved by Pope Martin the 5th , neither would Eugenius or his successors euer ratifie the same , and after declareth also , that the Fathers of that assembly did chiefly intend that their Session and consultation against the Hussits who maintained that Princes , for crimes by them committed , did forfeit their estate , and that thereupon they might lawfully be by any man deprived of that power which they vniustly held , or obteined . Againe , that in perticuler and properly , they then purposed to opugne the proposition of Iohannes Parvus , a Divine of Paris , who vnder colour of this defence , that it was lawfull by private authority to kill a Tirant , endeavored to justifie the fact of the Duke of Burgundie in slaying of the Duke of Orleance , In which case there were these diversities from that rule . Here was betweene these persons equallitie , and no inferioritie , there was a solemne oath violated and broken , and here was no attending for the sentence , or direction of the Superior . Here we see two Iesuites in two different opinions in a matter of greatest moment , both of them founding vpon the faith of the Church , both approved permissu superiorum by the allowance of the superiors . Thus hauing buckled together two principall Iesuites to lugg and tugg each other by the eares , I will only thus far giue my verdit of their variance , That the Spanierd Mariana dealeth plainly and constantly to the practize of Popery , and the ratificacions and afirmacions of the Popes themselues , who will not endure any abridging of their prerogatiue power of proceeding against Princes in what sort soeuer , And our English P. K. hideth the sting , would conceale deepe dissembled treacheries by protesting termes to secure vs from suspicions , till the venome of malice hath pierced all the veines of the state , and seazed our very hart and life-blood , by surprizes vnthought of , hauing brought vs into a carelesse and deceitfull securitie ; P. R. hath beene very curious and copious in trying , and examining his aduersaries allegacions , interpretacions , falsificacions , translacions , and applicacions , seeming so watchfull and diligent in that kind of animaduersion , as if he accounted it a shame , and foile , to omit any line or sillable vnanswered , for indeede , the whole bulke of his booke in this businesse , is fraught with no other stuffe then with such wrangling matter , of misavouching , and misconsterings of quoted allegacions . But that it may appeare how his deadly hooke resting in the beliefe of his heart , is covered over with an honied bait beguiling vs with fairer speach , I shall be bold to trouble him with one question . What is the cause that Mr. Mortons publication , of the solemne Oration made by the Pope Xixtus the 5. in the Consistory of the Cardinalls , in the commendation of the notable , rare , and memorable act of the braue Monke that killed the French King , and the inferrence by him made and vrged against the Pope , for his maintenance of Conspiracy , and Treason , is both by the modrate answer first , and after , by this mitigating replier layed aside in silence , and not once handied , or glanced at by any seeming answer . The truth is , they were enwrapped with a dilemna to allow the fact was against their pretence in their position , and to disallow the Pope , was against their faith in their religion they must defend by argument , what for outward carriage is giuen them in charge , sith it tendeth to their aduantagious purpose : and they may not ( without dispensation ) either presume to censure , or vndertake to oppugne , what his Holinesse approveth , lest they betray and shake the foundacion of their Supremacy . By this time , I trust his well cloaked dubble iniquity is discovered to his very nakednesse ; were it not now very strange that hee and I ( whom our former contencions haue so farr devided afunder ) should part reconciled , and well accorded ? In his sixt Chapter ( of corruptions and falsificacions ) hee taketh hold of Mr. Morions exposition , That the Imperiall and Kingly Authority in Spirituall causes , reacheth no farther then as to outward preservation , and not to personall administration : Hereupon he assureth vs , that if this be really ment , all the Catholikes of England will presently take the oath of Supremacy , requiring with an earnest challēge that as this is publikely printed , and that by Authority , so it may have publike allowance & performāce to make it good , whereby as touching that poynt there may be an attonemēt . I feare that the man in the heate of his sudden apprehension , and without the wary consideracion which his pen hath been accustomed vnto , doth overshoote and forget himselfe . Shall I thinke that he hath never read , or vtterly forgotten the Oath of Supremacy ? He hath so scanned and canvased the Statutes of Henry the eight , Edward the sixth , and Queene Elizabeth picking at every mote thereof , and making a beame of the same ( though with a left eye , and a left hand ) that I cannot so much as surmize but that he hath had every threed of this question betweene his fingers . Therefore ( if his former subtillity hath not suddenly betrayed him , and exposed him to derision ) as I must admire that he is so easily reformed in Iudgement , so , I shall be content to embrace the occasion of a well gained agreement . And will P. R. the Iesuite , and the rest of the English Catholikes of the Romish faction abide by this word in good earnest ? that if the Kings Maiestie doe not claime or assume vnto him personall administration in cause Ecclesiasticall , the Oath of Supremacy shall no further be stood vpon , or refused . Then let him bethinke himselfe of this part or clause of the Oath , That no forraigne Prince , Person , Prelate , State , or Potentate , hath or ought to haue any iurisdiction , power , superiority , preeminence , or authority Ecclesiasticall , or Spirituall within this Realme , if he digest this , then see how one thing draweth on another : all our former differences are at once , and in this one compounded : also , for if the Pope ( being a forraigne Prelate or Potentate ) be excluded , from hauing any Ecclesiasticall power or Spirituall authority within this Realme . Then our question of his preheminency or jurisdiction in repressing the exorbitant and pernicious excesse of great men , as an Ecclesiasticall Iudge , or Supreame Pastor , direct , or indirect , is at an end clearely determined : I doubt not but his excellent Majesty of his Princely care to bring home so many lost sheepe , and to bosome them againe in his dearest loue , will affoord them that fauorable interpretation which this there Aduocate and Orator , requireth in their behalfe . In the meane space ( not to loose what we haue got ) I returne vnto P. R. the like charge of making good of his word , touching the Oath of Supremacy , in the sence and distinction afore mentioned , and therewithall might thinke it not reasonable , any further to stricke a yeelding aduersary , that by so voluntary an offer cleareth the cause from any further controuersie . But remembring the nature and quallity of our adversary and the many winding and intricaking trickes he is vsed vnto in the canvassing of this or the like controversies , I feare that this our reconciliation is rather seeming then substanciall , and will suddainly vpon a small touch , fall a sunder againe to as great a discrepance ; for howsoeuer he doth so franckly yeeld vnto his Majesty , a supremacy , of the Church in Ecclesiasticall causes , as touching outward preseruation onely , let him be but sifted a little in his meanings , it will breake from him that he neuer purposed to strengthen the state and authority of our Soueraigne , with any such power of absolute defence and protection , which shall presently appeare by ministring vnto him some few questions : I pray you Sir , what Church , and what Ecclesiasticall causes , doe you consent to be within the Kings Royall preseruation ? is it incident and appropriate to his Princely Scepter , to mayntaine the religion now established in his Dominions ? by making Lawes for enforcing subjects , to an vniforme allowance , and profession thereof , by punishing Recusants according to Iustice , and by employing all his powers to suppresse the oppugners , or Conspirators against the same ? Dareth he to abide by this ? will he henceforth justifie this preseruation , and that by his religious oath , which hitherto the impoy-soned pens of these Iesuited spirits haue not spared odiously to tearme a cruell persecution ? wee haue shaked him already from his attonement , with vs in this poynt , He will tell vs plainely , That the Church and Ecclesiasticall cause which he authorized the Prince to protect and preserue , is onely the Catholike Church , and Religion , and then ( as if orbs , and vrbs , were all one ) that the Catholike is the Romish , so that vnlesse the King will turne Leigeman , with a kinde of vazilage to the Sea of Rome , his right of Supremacy in the outward preseruation of the Church , ( which this man dareth assure vs that all Catholikes in England will easily accord vnto ) must be denied him , as not due and proper to the Title of his Regality , Papacy is the pole-starre of all their contemplations , It is the Centure whereunto are carried and cleaueth fast all their drifts and disputations . And no further shall any Prince hold power ( especially , in Ecclesiasticall causes which are all bosomed vp in the breast of his Holinesse ) then the same shall serue in a sub-ordination to the advancing and exaltation of that most imperious Romish Hyerarcy . Nay their temporall authority , also must be kitbed , stinted , and subjugated by that vntollerable yoake of Popish vsurpation , except it should be made plyant , ranged , and accommodated , In ordine ad dominum Papam , Then ( not regarding P. R. his assurance of the voluntary submissions , and subscriptions of all Catholikes of England , to the Kings Supremacy , according to the limitation or interpretation aforesayd ) we may well assure our selues that no English Papists , ( finding this supremacy of defence and preseruation to tend to the subversion and extirpation of their idolatrous Religion ) will euer yeelde oath to keepe fayth thereunto : Yet ( hauing closed with him in a full consent vnto this position , that euery Prince hath Iure divino , the supremacy of outward preseruation of the Church , and Ecclesiasticall causes within his Territories and Dominions ) let it be remembred that he neuer hereafter scandalize the proceedings and execution of Iustice in England against the refractaries and treacherous oppugners of the Religion established in this Realme , sith the same is the lawfull and necessary act of a well warranted and acknowledged Supremacy ; from which our publicke profession of Fayth is to receiue protection and preseruation ; I cannot but conceiue that this Clearke P. R. wil be shent , and receiue some checke for his Doctrine : For out of question if his Holinesse , and Cardinall Bellarmine , haue enkindled their displeasures against Mr. Blackwell , the Arch-Priest for allowing the Oath of Alleagiance ( which contayneth onely an acknowledgment of the hereditary rights of temporall Soueraignity , whereunto naturall duty , ( in respect of relation ) doth bind each subject : How much more heynously will it be taken , that this Arch-Iesuite ( as if both their Arches , had slipped from them at once ) should so confidently condiscend to this artickle of Spirituall Supremacy , in the sence , qualification , or moderation , before expressed ? He cannot escape the blame , of forgetting or forsaking of his principles , neyther can he euer salue his offence , by any wily Interpretation or beguiling distinction . His direct , and indirect , his absolute and conditionall , his mediate and immediate , his simpliciter and secundum quid or quatenus , and the like ( which in all his discoursiue argumenting doth make his way for him through many Obstacles , whilst he treadeth out vnto vs his maze of Circuler shifts , and manifold euasions ) can touching this his confession or protestation haue no place or serue him to any stead , because knowing aforehand how the case standeth in euery circumstanciall or considerable perticularity , he hath to the King of England within his seuerall Dominions adjudged the Supreame gouernment of causes Ecclesiasticall , as in the office and care of preseruing the Church , with the fayth and Doctrine thereof , from all wronges or corruptions Forraigne or Domesticall . I encroach not vppon him by inferences and constructions , I onely take that which he so fully and clearely gyueth ; and do challenge him that what he hath deliuered vnto vs for his judgement and resolution , ( and that in high termes and vanting and flaunting of his aduantages therein . ) He will ( notwithstanding any reprehension or retreite from the Pope or Bellarmine ) still with the like brauery and constancy mayntaine vnto the end ; but shall I disclose a secret or rather a wonder vnto the World ? What if the very same Author who so boldly assumeth and assureth at this time for all Catholikes the Title of Spirituall Supremacy , to appertayne to the Crowne Imperiall of this Land , doth after in another set Treatise , published purposedly , or rather maliciously , to traduce and discredit our gouernment , and to vphold the Popes and Cardinall Bellarmines censures concerning the Oath of Allegiance , like a very Changling , fall quite away from this his former so earnestly pro ferred and promised conformity , declareth himselfe , to be so farre from affoording his Majesty by oath his supremacy of preseruation in causes Ecclefiasticall , as that he holdeth it vnlawfull for a Catholike conscience to take the oath of Temporall Allegiance , as repugnant to the Religion of the Church of Rome , will not euery man of vnderstanding admire , how the same person can refuse to sweare Allegiance Temporall , that hath so readily and hotly , granted a Supremacy Spirituail ? To induce me to beleeue that it is all one person that hath so vndertaken to act vnto vs two so repugnant parts , I haue ( besides fame and report ) and a kind of idempnity in the phrase and stile , some very approveable probabilities , his mencioning of the powder-treason in these weake and tender tearmes , of that headlong action of a few Catholike Gentlemen , and such other lamenting speeches , for the euill cariage , or miscarying of the enterprise without any one apt or right expressing word to denotate or condemne the foulenesse thereof , is certainely moulded with the soft hand of this our countersetting kind-hearted mitigator , his shaping and propounding of the generall question concerning the Popes authority over Princes , is conceaved even in the same words which this P. R. hath vsed in delivering and expressing the same , and then acquainteth vs with his supposall , That it was never the meaning of such Catholikes as tooke the Oath of allegiance to deny simply and absolutely , That the Pope as supreme Pastor of the Catholike Church hath any authority left him by Christ , either directly or indirectly , with cause or without cause , in neuer so great a necessitie , or for neuer so great and publike vtilitie of Christian religion , to proceede against any Prince whatsoever , temporally , for his restraint or amendment . Is not this the very same water of the same Cesterne ? He yet goeth further for better proofe and confirmacion of his said supposall by the selfe-same reasons set forth Verbatim : for that they should thereby contradict the generall consent of all Catholike Divines , and confesse that Gods providence for the conservacion and preservacion of his Church and kingdome vpon earth , hath beene defectuous , for that hee should haue left no lawfull remedy for so great and excessive an evill as that way might fall out . I had set the print of my fingers vpon all and every of these words before , so that by that brand they were presently knowne vnto mee , and their Author or owner apparantly discovered , howsoever as a Iesuite he stileth himselfe Gent. who bound to no order may assume any shape . Then presupposing vpon these likelyhoods , that in the pursute of this my slippery adversary ( Iesuite or Gent. ) I haue met with him againe as at a new turning , I must not let him escape vntill hee make mee a good answere , how he can affirme for the King a Supremacy Ecclesiasticall for preserving of the Church , and yet alledge against the oath of allegiance a more supreame power in the Pope , to suppresse and annihilate that Supremacy , and that in a course of Temporall Supereminency ? I ever tooke Supremacy to be such a superlative , as admitteth no superior : I never heard of any subalternate supremacy , it hath too harsh and absurd a sound ; but that any temporall Prince absolute of himselfe , vndependent vppon any higher on earth , immediate to God Almighty should be over-awed or over-topped by the pretended primacy of a Luciferian Prelate , and that by the brandishing of a temporall sword , and imploying forces , coercians temporall , what can be more vnsensible to be conceaved , more vnreasonable to be maintayned , or more impious to be practized ? Yet the only cause and couler why the Pope commandeth , and the Cardinall adviseth , the Catholikes of England , to forbeare and refuse to take the oath of allegiance , is this , That in the said oath is couched and included the derogation , and renunciation of the sufficiency and absolutenesse of the Popes authority over or against his Majestie , claymed by vertue of his high office of supreame Pastor , whereby he is enabled to proceed against any Prince whatsoever temporally for his restraint and amendement , or to permit other Princes to do the same : So that the question of the lawfulnesse of this oath , and the question argued in these few leaves of my labor concerning the Popes arrogant Vsurpation , hath not any threed of difference sorting both alike to one and the same purpose . Therefore if vnto my former refutation of the Mittigators , immoderate attribution of power vnto the Pope , I shall ioyne some few animadvercions vpon the epistoling Gentlemen : also ( an alter idem of P. R. ) for the better observing and discovering of his deceitfull and disloyall cariage , in the reproving of that oath , it will be a continuance of the same skirmish , and the like battering of the same bulwarke which the pride of Rome hath erected and endeavoreth to fortifie against the dignity of Kings and the truth of God. First I observe that howsoever he vndertaketh in generall tearmes to make good the Popes desision touching the refusall of that oath on the part of his Maiesties Catholikes subiects , yet in his perticuler arguing thereupon , ( as if he were also another Pope , whom as a iudge , it becommeth not to dispute ) he discusseth not the severall parts to be disliked in the oath , or setteth forth plainly and contradictorily the words which hee will hold or maintaine to be vnlawfull or cumbersome to the squemish conscience of their pretended Catholikes , whereby a true state or issue of the matter in question might be taken in consideration , but in stead of such expresse and positiue mentioning of the disliked parts of that oath , glideth away in his glosing fashion wiht bare affirmation of dangerous doctrinall clauses , conteining matter of faith craftely conioyned together , with the exacting of civill duty , preiudiciall to the integritie and purity of Catholike religion . This kind of handling a controuersie , is rather resoluing then reasoning , and more Pope like in determining as a Iudge , then Scholler like in demonstrating as a Disputer : Why doth hee not to euery branch , of the sayd oath affixe and oppose his negatiue , without any such faynt plea , or fumbling and broken speeches , cut of with &c. Will the distinction of direct , and indirect , as he maketh it to serue the Pope for actions and authorities , so serue his turne also in speaking and argumenting ? standeth it with any Logicall rules , to induce or inforce conclusions , indirectly by conception and application , which ought to be produced directly , in a full opposition to the questioned proposition . Then where the oath hath these plaine words , that the Pope hath not any power or authority to depose the King , or to dispose any his Maiesties Kingdomes , or Dominions , or to authorize any Forraigne Prince to invade or annoy him in his Countries , or to discharge any of his Subjects from their allegiance and obedience to his Maiesty , or to giue Licence or leaue to any of them to beare Armes , rayse Tumults , or to offer any violence , or hurt to his Majesties Royall person , state , or government , why doth not he in justification of the vnlawfulnesse of this oath , by as playne , full , and broade termes , tell vs that the Pope , by the capacity of his omnipotency , is indued with so plenary a power , as that he may depose the King , dispose his Kingdomes , authorize Forraigne invasions , discharge his Subjects from allegiance , licence them to offer violence to his Royall Person , state , or gouernment ? And that for that regard the conscience of the Catholikes may not be obliged by any such prophane oath , impyous against the Pope , and the amplitude of his Pastorall primacy ? But doth hee in any-one line of his whole Volume , let slippe any word expressely declaring , naming , or mentioning any power of this nature , and that Lawfully may produce these effects , to be invested or bestowed vpon his Holinesse ? I am perswaded that the igniculi of naturall duty , the morsus of an acknowledging conscience , and the pudor of his face ( which perhaps yet retayneth some remnants of modesty ) would not suffer him so far to degenerate from naturall notions , so farre to be alienated from his dutious recognicion , or so farre to passe all the bonds of shame , as directly , and roundly to deliuer vnto the World any sentence so monstruous , and so full of horror and heynousnesse . Neuerthelesse hee hath taken such a taste of the sower grape of Rome , and is dipped so deepe into the venome and malice of that imperious and persecuting Church , as that yet indirectly , and by a subtile conueyance of his meaning , hee giueth vs to vnderstand , that his inward soule , hath pronounced this doome and judgement against his annoynted Soueraigne , and therefore that soule , must not be entangled , stayed , or bound , by any brideling or restrayning oath to the contrary . But how doth his outward man manage these difficulties ? Iust in the same manner to an hayres breadth , as Mr. Mittigator ( whom hee may call his ille ego ) doth that is closly , dissemblingly , timorously , and treacherously : In the place of the Pope , hee vseth the entitleings of Supreame Pastor , the deposing and killing of Princes , hee compriseth , and couereth vnder the words of proceeding against , and restrayning of them , what is done by inuasion , insurrection , or force of armes , is included in the word temporalty , the stirring vp and appoynting of other Potentates , to partake , in the quarrell , is brought in very gently in this good shew of permitting other Princes , &c. Now fie vppon this blaunching and disguising Oratory , If hee could passe away cleanly with these easie and fauouring phrases , hee would steale out against vs , ( as not suspecting his harmefull intentions ) his deadly writ of execution : This one word of restrayning would ( like to a ball of wild-fire ) disclose it selfe , and breake a sunder , into censuring , depriuing , deposing , destroying , and murthering of Soueraignes , and would haue no meane , or end of oppression or Tyranny . Next , admitting him to this liberty , as not to single out any speciall , or particular clauses of the oath , let vs examine how hee prooueth that there bee enwrapped within the sayd oath , poynts of religion as well as of 〈◊〉 obedience ; he maketh reckoning to haue shewed it by foure seuerall distinct wayes : I will beare him witnesse that the wayes be seuerall ; for onely one of them hath shewe of leading vs to the scope and conclusion fore-intended , the rest are all straggling pathes , quite from the purpose , for are not these I pray you good arguments ? The Pope telleth the Catholikes that hee hath heard , that they are compelled to go to the Churches and Assemblies of Heretickes , and to be at their Sermons , Ergo , the oath of Allegiance contayneth matter of Religion , as well of ciuill obedience . Againe , Bellarmine compareth the oath to the crafty composion and commixture of the Images of the Emperor Iulian , and the Pomim gods , all coupled and combined together in this Imperiall banner : Ergo , by an argument ab authoritate , there be in that oath poynts Spirituall and Temporall conjoyned together . Lastly , the good Gentleman doth kindly make this reall offer for satisfaction of his Majesty , that hee will sweare vnto him , as much Loyalty as euer any Catholike Subject of England did , vnto the lawfull Kings in former times before the change of King H. 8. Ergo , there lurketh articles of sayth in the sayd oath , vnder the pretence of ciuill duties . The first of the foure , seemeth to shute faire , and and at the least to sticke in the Butt , though farre enough from the marke ; and thus it speaketh , from the plaine expresse words , sence , and drift of the oath it selfe , That besides the acknowledgment of our Soueraigne to be true King and rightfull Lord ouer all his Dominions ; and that I will be a true loyall Subject vnto him and such other clauses , whereat no man sticketh or maketh any difficulty , the sayd oath contayneth further , that I must sweare in like manner some poynts , concerning the limitation of the Popes authority , to wit , what hee cannot doe towards his Majesty , or his Successour in any case whatsoeuer ? Which question brought vnto the Thesis of all Kings toucheth ( sayth he ) a poynt of Doctrine and Catholike beliefe , concerning the sufficiency of of Pastorall authority , left by our Saviour in his Church vnto St. Peter , and his Successours , for redressing of all inconueniences that may fall out ; and this to forsweare hath perill of euerlasting Damnation . There must be a monstrous strayne , nay , hee must breake through and steale , before his Holinesse with his predominate power , can get into the Creede . 〈◊〉 haue before set in his way crosse barres , and obstacles ●● nough , which hee will neuer be able to 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 impeach his assention into any such height , as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 our consciences , The article of Catholica Ecclesia , 〈◊〉 be no cloake or conductor for him , nor shall 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Canopy over his high estate of ● , 〈◊〉 callity . The Argument wherewith this Gent. doth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Pope to so eminent a place of power , and reputation that his prerogative is past questioning , and that vpon paine of 〈◊〉 , is this , every oath that conteyneth poynts concerning the limitation of the Popes Authority , is an oath belonging to Religion ; but this oath expressing what the Pope cannot doe towards his Majestie , or his successor in any case whatsoever , is an oath concerning the limitation of the Popes authority , therefore this oath is belonging to Religion : If the Maior propofition be vntrue or vncertaine , all the rest tottereth and falleth , as without foundation : I will examine the same by the pondering of the particuler words thereof . First , ( belonging to Religion , in a generall sence may comprehend all the actions and resolues of men : yea ciuill duties , also are within the spaciousnes thereof , because a true Christian is governe his whole life and carriage by the rules of his Religion : but this Disputor must narrow the signification thereof more precisely , tying and applying the same onely to the articles of Payth . Secondly , the Popes authority must vndergoe the like distinction as themselues haue propounded vnto vs , ( that is to say ) what he may doe as Pope , and what he hath accustomed to doe by other acquiered titles , or by meere vsurping intrusion . Now then to say , that euery limiting of the Popes authority whatsoeuer the same be , or howsoeuer obtayned or exercised belongeth to the Articles of beleefe , I for my part will neuer beleeue it , and I do not thinke , that any of their owne Secritaries will be so much besotted , I will explayne my meaning by instances and cases of the like condition ; suppose that the Pope would pretend and pleade that the King doth hold of him the Crowne of this Land , and therefore as Superior Lord , will require homage or trybute , and in default of rendering the same , will invade his Dominions with sword and force : If in this case the King shall for more security of his Imperiall State , aske ( vppon Allegiance ) the oathes of all , or any his Subjects in detestation of that claime , may the Catholikes make scruple of conscience concerning such an oath , because the same seemeth to limmit and abridge , the Popes pretended right and authority ? making in the meane time no Religion of the limitting , lessening , and detracting from the Soveraignes Title and pre-eminence ? perhaps they will say that this is a question of civill right , and that the Subject is cleerely bound to maintaine the Prince . But how if the Pope pretend withall his Pastorall care , and preservation of matters spirituall , then I trust ( in ordine ad spiritualia ) his temporall attempts must bee supported , by his spirituall Children , against the King and Country . Againe , let it be conceiued that the Pope much mooued with indignation , at the execution of Iustice ministred in this Kingdome , against the Treacherous Conspirators of the Popish faction , should vpon that gnawing grudge towards the Iudges of this Land , take vpon him by solemne Censure , to depriue and displace them from their Iuridiciall offices , wherein ( though he can assume no ordinary or rightfull power ) yet in ordine ad spiritualia and for the generall releefe , and necessity of the Catholike cause hee adventureth as from his pastorall charge , to pronounce them from henceforth to be incompetent Iudges , commanding all Catholikes also to reckon of them , and the iudgements by them giuen : Now the question is , whither to make a constant asseueration that the Pope hath no such authority , be vnto a Catholike conscience a poynt of Faith or Religion , because of such limiting bounds , disabling the Pope in his supposed sufficiency of his generall function for the good of the Church ? If the denying or abating of the popes authority over these inferior minifters of Iustice be not accounted cumbersome to the c̄osciences of Catholikes ( wherein I thinke they will make no doubt ) why should the abjuring of this papall power ouer our Supreame Magistrate touching the 〈◊〉 and destroying of him , be thought so dangerous , and damnable , or repugnant to their owne Religion ? will Religion allow him more liberty against the highest , then against the meaner Substitutes ? or if hee haue such a Rule ouer Princes themselues , why not also ouer the Subordinate Officers of the Kingdome ? to command , direct , authorize , or suppresse them , to the best auayle and aduancement , of the Catholike side , that so hee may become more then Monarchiall , by an absolute and vnlimited Dominion ? This Gent. saith that touching the acknowledgement of our Soveraigne to be true King and rightfull Lord over all his Dominions , no man sticketh at that : But , I aske , whether if the Pope haue already enwrapped his Majestie within any of his generall sentences , or shall declare by any especiall means , that he is not to be acknowledged King , will not then the Catholikes sticke at that ? must not they refuse to sweare vnto that clause of recognition also ? for feare that his Holinesse be questioned and limited in his owne powre and preeminence ? I will not feare to affirme , That the true allegiance , and obedience of a naturall subject , cannot dwell together in the corrupted heart of a devoted & dissembling Papist , and therefore no marvell that the heart preposessed with Papacy , doth cast such doubts , of offending his dearest love , especially having plighted faith , and vowed his service , by all constant endeavors thereunto . This contrariety of Masters , must needs breed iealousies on both sides , for as the Pope forbiddeth Papists , to sweare their allegiance and fidellity to the King , ( fearing lest himselfe should thereby be excluded and renounced ) So the King can never thinke himselfe secure and assured of those subiects , who ( from their acknowledgement of the Popes superiorship over the King , and that in such a degree as may indure no limiting ) dare not be affianced by oath to the safety of the King against the decrees and designes of their Dominus dominancium . Then what will they say , or do , to free his Majestie from feares and ielousies ? Doth this supple Gent. thinke to make or bring confidence , which I hope in Gods goodnesse that the Pope will never attempt any thing in preiudice of his Majestie . Surely Sir , your hope is too weake a stay for our state to rest or trust vnto : For what if the same great important and vrgent cases , concerning Christian religion doe fall out wherein yee averr the Popes authority over Princes : Then in that case I perceive the best answere wee shall expect from you will be the fooles proverbe , non putarem . For here againe you feede and foppe vs one with another of your hopes ( which wee hope will never be betweene our Soveraigne and the Sea Apostolike . ) Is it not more then strange that this so provident coniecturer of future events , should hope that that matter will neuer be ; which long hath beene , continually is , and I trust perpetually will be , seeing , that these same great , important , and vrgent cases concerning Christian Religion haue done , and doe dayly fall out , betweene our Soveraigne and the Sea of Rome , called by him Apostolike , Therefore it appeareth that the man hath lost his wits , whilest he would obtrude his hopes . The true conclusion is , that for as much as these great and important cases are in continuall conflict and question betweene the Pope and his Majestie , and that consequently the Authority of the Pope lyeth prest in dayly readinesse to represse and suppresse his Majestie vpon all occasions , as it concerneth his Royall person , for the preservation of his Life , State , and Dignity , to assure himselfe of the vnviolable faithfulnesse of his Subiects , so that must needs be accounted a disloyall and vnnaturall part for any subiect to be so seduced , by hipocriticall pretences , as to adhere to a forraine and fained clericall Primacy , against his alleagiance , love and duty , towards his true Soveraigne Lord and King. The Gent. vseth many glorious and plausible speeehes of the humble acknowledgment of all temporall dueties to his Majestie , and iumpeth with the Mittigator in opinion , that it is not vnpossible for the Catholikes to conforme in Subiection to the Civill goverment , and yet to reserve their consciences to the religion of Rome , if this were affirmed of such Countries only where the Prince is of the Romish faith , or of this Nation whilest the Pope had some hold , and prevalency in the same , then perhaps we might come neere to an agreement in this poynt , but where the Prince and Pope are of religion so repugnant and opposite , where the Pope is quite secluded and expelled frō any power Eccleslasticall or Civill , and where the Prince as in the right of the Crowne , is the defender and preserver of the faith within his Kingdome , there we are taught by experience , and directed by reason , that the entertayning and professing of Papacy , is the renouncing and repressing of regallity . I weigh not the allegation that is made , of the long continuance for well-neere a thousand yeares , of the admission and permission of the Popes Superioritie in this Realme , and how the same for all that space stood vn-offensive vnto this state , for whilest there was either subiugaiton , or coniugation of the two powerfull commands , their contrarietyes and repugnances could not be so apparently discovered , as they be now manifested , by the distinguishment and finall dissevering of them into their proper natures , rights , and limitations . I haue read diligently that great Volume , avouched by this Gent. written with much labour to this poore purpose , of declaring the Papal pre-eminēce within this Cuntry , ever since the first conversion thereof to Christianity , vntill the reigne of King Henry the eight . The Authors sedulity and devotion may amongst the Birds of the same feather , receiue his reward , ( at the least ) of commendation , but I will vndertake with one short answere , ( consisting but of two parts ) to runne my pen through every line of that huge Bulke , blotting and putting out whatsoeuer he hath painted , foorth for the best shewe . First , ( forbearing to refute their Fables , and taking their owne accompt of time , which they make of the entry of the Romish Religion into this Land , ) it is euident that the mystery of iniquity , and the Antichristian arrogancy of the Romish prelacy , was then reuealed and exalted into worldly pompe : So as they then sending of Factors into these parts , was but to Conquer the simple people , of that vninstructed age to the bondage and yoake of Rome . ' And therefore no maruaile , if they were still held in the same , or the like subjection in the succeeding times , wherevnto they were at the first surprized by politicall handling , and with much simulation of piety trayned one for intromitting , and acceptation thereof ; and I cannot invent a fitter resemblance whereby to represent the cunning carriage of that plot in those dayes , then that which Cardinall Bellarmine hath vsed and applyed in this question . Which is the crafty composition and commixture of Images set by Iulian the Emperour of himselfe and the panim gods coupled and combined together , in his Imperiall banner , for as that Emperour vnder the shew of reuerence due to be performed to himselfe , though to haue seduced those good Christians to the honoring of Idols , so in those darke and vndiscerning times of our fore-fathers , by the tempering and ioyning of the Christian Religion , and the Antichristian vsurpation , their simplicity was abused , and they by subtile practises , wrought vnto such a credulity , as that together with the sweete comforts of Christ , they sucked in at once the poyson of Romish Idolatry , and the oppression of papacy : The second part of my answere is , that notwithstanding such encroachment of the popedome vnto this Kingdome , wherein by stealing steppes and sundry Hypocriticall passages that had gotten good footing , keeping in the meane while both Prince and people in an ignorant devotion , and a dread of damnation : Yet did the Kings of England , from time to time , feele themselues and their Soueraigne state to be enthralled and wronged by the ouer-awing , and busie intermedling of that vniversall pastorship , and therefore omitted not , vppon all occasions , to make knowne their dislikes and reluctations , to vphold the course , and force of the ancient Common Law , to defend and put in practise the Imperiall prerogatiues of their Crowne , and to restrayne the exorbitant ambition of the sea of Rome , by prouiding statutes , vnder grieuous penalties against the Subjects of this Land , that in derogation of the Iustice , gouernment , and regall rights , of the King , did make recourse vnto Rome , by way of appeale , impetration , or other pretences contrary to the naturall obligation of their faith and allegiance . But it will be sayd , how came it to passe then , that the Subjects held on their former orders , and no whit refrayned from Rome , yeelding still to the pope the same their dependency , and acknowledgments : That shall I also tell you , the pope and Councell of Rome ( knowing right well , how fully they had possessed all sorts of people , with a blind zeale , carried after idle Ceremonies , and well pleasing superstitions , and remembring that they had so seazed and fastned vpon their Conscience , as that euery one held the saluation , or damnation of his soule , to consist in his obedience , or disobedience to the Church of Rome , ) did crosse and avoyde the execution of such states by decreeing and sending foorth their Ecclesiasticall execution , of suspending , and excommunicating , of all Ministers of Iustice , or other ministeriall persecutors whatsoeuer , that should attempt to enforce , or execute any such 〈◊〉 ; by this meanes of denouncing such terrors to the soule , the mightinesse and authority of the pope , grew dreadfull and powerfull , vntill it pleased the Almighty God , by the revelation of his truth , and discouery of Popish falshoods , to inspire with courage and magnanimity the heart of that Right Noble King H. 8. who finally without any feare of his thunderbots , accomplished that worke of freeing this Realme from the grieuous butthen , and heauy yoake of the popish Supremacy , which diuers of his prodecessors Kings of England , had often , and much endeauoured , and desired to do , if their illightnings with grace , and enablings with meanes , had serued them thereunto ; Thus it is made cleare , that the Popes authority , neither at the first landing thereof vppon the Coast of this Kingdome ( which was not in the purer times , but 600 yeares after , Christ as themselues confesse , when the Church of Rome was falne from sincerity ) neyther in the continuance and exercise of the same was lawfull , allowable , or beneficiall , but rather intruded , offensiue , and prejudiciall vnto this state ; and for his motion of sampling our proceedings to the practise vsed in other Countries ouer Catholike Subjects , in this poynt of excluding the Pope for intermedling temporally against Princes , shewing that they will be ready to answere as much duty and allegiance to his Majesty , as any such Catholike Subjects in any other Kingdome doth , or is bound to doe : He must know that he must then make and take his patterne , from the Protestant Princes , who haue resumed their ancient and originall rights , and not from them whom he calleth Catholikes , that honoreth the best , and dishonoreth themselues ; wherefore the Gent. may hold his hand from the booke , his kind offer of swearing vnto his Majesty as much loyalty as euer any Catholike Subject of England did vnto the lawfull King in former times and ages , before the Change of King H. 8. will not be accepted as a suffring seruice or duty ; Then was both King and people made drunke with the Popish cup , of spirituall Fornications , the Kings then were but halfe Kings , and the Subiects but halfe Subjects ; his Holinesse had pared away so much from the one , and gayned so much vppon the other , the one could not be absolute in commanding , for feare that his Superior should enterpose , the other could not be absolute in obeying , because there might come a stronger countermaund ; then what hath this offer more then thus ? We haue beene filthy and will be filthy still . And why should not his Maiesty require of his Subiects such obedience , as by the rules of the true reformed Religion , which hee professeth he lawfully may doe ? Or is there any reason that he should still be held to the former wrongs , and disaduantages , which ignorance , hypocrisie , pride , and other manifold corruptions did beget and produce against his Crowne , and Soveraignity : Is it to be reckoned a poynt of Fayth and Saluation to lay forth a limitation of that power which hath beene heretofore so infinitly extended , and so vniustly claymed ? and what is this limitation ? Forsooth that the Pope cannot make Kings no Kings , or Subiects no Subiects , that his spirituall Sheephooke may not subdue the Princely Scepter , nor order and dispose of temporall rights ; why may not the Pope be limited with some clauses ? Of what he may do , and what he may not doe ? The Gent. dogeth me , with P. R. his distinction of directly , and indirectly , which importeth thus much , that in plaine , true , and in direct course , to his Pastorall office , there be fixed bounds , which he cannot passe , but in an vndue vnproper , and indirect course , he may goe where he listeth , neyther hedge nor ditch can hold him , neyther can there any matter of cause be conceiued , wherevnto this indirect and outstretched power may not be carried , we reckon in the Common acceptation of speech , vndirect dealing to bee fraudulent and vniust dealing , and why shold it not likewise be vnderstood , that this indirect authority is a wrong vsurping , and mis-begotten authority ? The temporall is subordinate to the spiritual therefore ( in ordine ad Spiritualia ) he that hath all spirituallity , may in that regard , as occasions be ministred , rule , and order any temporall thing , or businesse whatsoever ; this is the reach & strayne of their ( indirectly ) which can be no lesse then a direct and shamelesse illuding shift , for maintayning whereof , and iustifying of that infinity of doing and determining , so many English Subiects , must forsake and abandon their obedyence , breaking a sunder all the chaynes of loue and allegiance , which Nature , Lawes , Diuine , and humane , and necessity it selfe doeth tye them with , alas , that vppon so slender proofe , not contayning so much as a shadow of any probability , our deare Country-men enjoying the benefits of the same soyle , and pertaking the protection of so gracious a Prince : whereby their liues and estates are preserued in peace and good repose , should bee bewitched to their owne woe , and seduced to the stirring of sedition : Yet it is not vnknowne that diuers of them moued more with the true zeale of rendring to his Maiesty , their dutious respects , then carried with that head-strong , and blind zeale , of attending the pleasure and commands of their great Dragon , haue willingly ( and as wee are to judge ) faithfully taken the oath aforesayd , to the exceeding comfort and ( as he entertayneth the same with an acceptable construction ) to the assuring of his Maiesty , of their vnfeined fidellity . But this cauilling Gent. taketh exception vnto , and maketh considerations vppon the words , ( willingly and faithfully . ) First , for shew and proofe that they haue not done it willingly or freely : hee alledgeth that the statute imposing such a paine vppon the refusors , doth make a kinde of restraynt through feare ; and so depriueth them both of liberty and freedome ; I appeale to the parties themselues , that haue taken the oath , who speaketh more truely and honestly of , then he , or I , when I finde it a branch of their oath , that they doe sweare willingly , I doe beleeue them , not taking them to be so Reprobate , as in any such 〈◊〉 rate manner forsweare themselues : Neither doe I 〈◊〉 , so 〈◊〉 of them , as that the passion of feare could so farre transport them as to make them sweare 〈…〉 : He ( belike knowing them better then I ) 〈◊〉 against them , that they haue not taken the oath willingly , and therefore they be directly 〈◊〉 , yet he thinketh he hath pleased them againe , and falued the matter by laying the fault vpon the enforcement of feare , wrought in their hearts , by the rigiour of the Law : In the meane time hee maketh them in their Religion to be very faint , and of little faith , if worldly respects and dread of Calamities . can so farre stagger them , or preuaile ouer their infirmities , as to make them feare man more then God ; and so in an vnbeleefe and prophannesse , hazard saluation by forswearing ; but because he so carpeth at the carriage , and composure of that oath , and the enterlacing of those words , I would aske his opinion whither it be not lawfull and reasonable that any Magistrate may , yea ought , to charge the conscience of him that sweareth , that he shall doe the same willingly , and faithfully ? Or doth he know any oath , wherein the same are equall thereunto , to expresse the trueth and sincerity of the heart , be not eyther directly vsed , or necessarily imployed ? His supposall of feares , troubles , or losses , is as applyable to the taking of any other oath , and by any other persons aswell as to this , by them taken , seeing that there is no oath prescribed to be required or exacted of any subiect , but the refusall thereof doth occasionally , and consequently , draw dangers and losses to the partie so refusing . And doth hee thinke it fit to infert thereof that all the oathes that are propounded with such condition , or likely to breed such inconvenience to the refuser , are not taken freely and heartily ? I wish his wits more freedome , and his heart more loyalty then so to judge . If the oath had stayed at the recognition of his Majesties right vnto the Crowne , and had not mentioned the Popes Authority , or any restrictions concerning the same , the heauinesse and extreamitye of the penaltye appoynted against the refusors , and so much aggrivated by this Gent. had not beene charged as a compulsarie cause , or any privation , or impediment to the freedome of the Catholikes consciences , whereby it is made evident , that not the manner , but the matter of the said oath , it is , that stingeth and offendeth them so much , for otherwise they will not deny , but his Majestie may lawfully , either by oath ( which putteth vpon their Soules an awe and obligation spirituall ) or by propounding correspondent punishment temporall ( which often worketh a suppression of outward attempts ) secure himselfe so farre as he may of good affection , or at the least of no aversion in his Subiects . As touching the other word ( faithfully ) howsoever he comments vpon the same either by way of interpretation of the sense and meaning , which his Catholikes reteyned to themselves , when they tooke the said oath , or by way of direction vnto such as shall hereafter be pressed thereunto , what cautelous reservation they may make by a mentall conceit , ( for surely by giuing his judgement what the former haue done , he intendeth to instruct the rest what to do ) yet for my part , I will still hold my selfe in my rule of charity which before I haue obserued , That for as much as they haue sworne , that the words by them spoken were sincerely acknowledged , according to the plaine and common sense and vnderstanding of the same , without any equivocation or mentall evasion , or secret reservation whatsoever . I doe not beleeue , that any of them haue vsed any such damnable deceit , or haue so apparently and grossely foresworne themselues . Can this Gent. be so hard-hearted towards his beloued , as when he seeth and rehearseth the very words of their religious asseverations , and protestations , and that with this concluding clause ( by the faith of a Christian ) yet to iudge that they tooke the said oath in the same lawfull sense and interpretation which might stand with the true Catholike doctrine , making them thereby equivocators , and mentall Iugglers , yea , expresse periured , if they haue secretly reteyned any others meanings then as the common and plaine sense of the words affordeth . But how doth he convey and conster that part of the oath as concerning the Popes Authority , in dealing with temporall Princes ? What moderate meaning hath he found for the safegard of the Catholike consciences that haue taken that oath ? Truly this devise and exposition is so sleight and simple , as that I am verily perswaded he propoundeth and publisheth the same , meerely for the instruction and practise of the simple and vulgar Catholikes : The learned amongst them would be ashamed of so meane and vnschollerlike a shift , to wit , that in swearing , that the Pope hath no authority to proceed against Princes , they should subunderstand ( without good cause ) for this inperpretation ( saith he ) is agreeable to the integritie and sinceritie of the Catholike doctrine , quia illud possumus quod iure possumus , And I pray the Gentlemans worship , to tell me whether non possumus etiam quod iure non possumus , is not power for the most part extendeable beyond right and iustice ? But in this case the question it selfe being De jure , Whether the Pope rightfully and lawfully ( as incident into his Pastorall place ) may exercise power and authority over Princes temporally , how frivolously , and ridiculously , is this evasion devised , that hee may not doe it without good cause , which is as much to say , hee may not doe it lawfully , except hee doe it lawfully . Why ? the question is not what hee may doe vnlawfully , for then wee might give to some one Pope an exemption , and dispensation for more sinnes , then there were vertues among them all . But when it is asked what this supreame Pastor may doe , or what he may not doe , in the right of his ministeriall office , this same ( jure ) hath reference to the authority generall , and not to the exercise thereof in any vnlawfull particularitie . Yet I may not so haue done with this his so foolish conceit , lest if I let him passe therewith , hee may gather vpon me another absurdity , that ( with good cause ) the Pope may take vpon him the power , which we absolutely deny him , who knoweth not , that the cause and offence may be such as may moue and provoke the dislike of all men ? yet the correction , reformation and restraint belongeth not to all men , but only to a competent and authorized Iudge , which the Pope over Princes can never be , especially in temporall affaires , neither directly , that is truly and by commission , nor vndirectly , that is coulerably by any devised or fained pretence , wherfore if he can invent no better an hiding corner for dissembling swearers , I hope there is no Catholike will make vse of his so fond a reservation and favorable interpretation , which indeed is all one , as if he asked leave to speak senselesly , to meane deceitfully , and to practize treacherously ; presently after this out of his charity he had conceaved this escape by construction , for the consciences of Catholikes , forgetting ( as it seemeth ) that the said oath had by speciall words provided against such reserved meanings , he remembreth himselfe better acknowledging that as this case standeth , they may not well induce themselues to equivocate , or sweare in any other sense then frō his Maiestie is proposed , and concludeth it to be lesse hurt plainly to deny to sweare , then by such swearing to giue no satisfaction neither to God , the King , himselfe , nor his neighbors , thereupon falleth into a deepe grave invective against this great pressure laid vpon mens consciences , shewing that howsoever we recken it a godly devise & intent , and that God did accordingly blesse the same , yet that no violēce or oppression whatsoever is like to this , and that the devising of this new oath was no blessing , but an vnspeakable afflictiō and augaraciō of mind ( his angry passion forging vnto vs that new word ) and in this fuming fashion he preceedeth , not forbearing to tell vs that by such extreame vexing of men , we shall gaine nothing , and giueth vs further to vnderstand , that such forcing of men against their consciences may make vs more doubtfull of their good will after they haue sworne , then we were be-before ; and that iniury receiued , must needes stirre them to more auersion of heart , working contrary effects to that which is pretended ; Nay , he dareth also to adde hereunto some threates and terrors , Setting foorth that amongst all other passions , none is more strong then that of reuenge for oppressions receiued , and therefore would haue vs conceiue , and apply it , that such as do not sticke to sweare against their consciences , for feare or other passions , will as easily breake that oath vppon like motiues if occasion serue : In this boyling manner doth the fervency of his spirit inkindle the inclinable hearts of the male-contended , Catholikes , by the memory of their wrongs , and with vehemency of words , making incitations , to sedition , and insurrection ; his Theologicall resolving that wee commit a grieuous sinne , when wee force and presse men to sweare against their consciences , making the same the highest degree of scandall actiue , tendeth to no other end , then to scandalize the Iustice of our state , and to animate their mutining and factious complices , to some desperate vndertakings . And because hee sayth , that such their Catholike Doctrine , will not be denyed of the learned Protestants themselues : He forceth for answere a declaration of the truth , positiuely mayntained amongst vs in that behalfe ; wherein ( first absolutely denying that de facto we inforce any so to sweare ) or that the tenor of the Statute , or any rigor contayned in the penalty thereof , doth presse them to any repugnancy , against their consciences , we confesse that amongst priuate men in particuler neccssities , for discouering of some truth , which otherwise cannot be made knowne this course of giving and taking satisfaction by a voluntary oath is held in vse , and that needfully and lawfully ; and that in such debates of priuate nature , it belongeth to the discretion , honesty , and conscience of any well aduised man , not to require or accept of the oath of any such as hee by vehement presumption mis-doubteth will forsweare himselfe . But when for the publike good , and by publike authority of the Law , the publike officer or Magistrate is enioyned to vrge an oath , or to be satisfied by the same , he therein ( for performing and executing of the direction and command of the Law ) is not to be blamed , neyther committeth any sinne , though in his priuate opinion hee shall suspect that the party so brought to his oath , will falsly or corruptly forsweare . For heerein hee is but a Minister of the Law , and must leaue the searching into the secrets of the heart , to the Almighty all seeing , and all iudging God , his duty and office both worketh and endeth in the act of the Law , saving that piety and charity may mooue him zealously to admonish him that so sweareth , to haue God and his Christian faith in remembrance , and to beware of all precipitation into the danger of hell fire . This godly and charitable aduisednesse , ( I am well assured ) is duely obserued by the Magistrates of this Realme , not suffering any to passe so carelesly , as not with louing tendernesse to admonish them , of the important poynts , of that oath , and to adhort him to plainnesse , and willingnesse in taking of the same , that their consciences may not after be combred , and confounded with scruples , conflicts , or reluctations . He affirmeth a likely obiection to be made on our side , for defence of the enforcing of Catholikes to this oath , which is by way of justification , of our doings therein , to be agreeable to the practise of the Romish Church , or in a course of recrimination that the Popish authority is more or equally culpable of the same offence , because in the tribunalls of inquifitors , men are forced to abiure their opinions , and that vnder paine of death , or other most grieuous punishments . Now what is his answere , and what is the difference which he findeth out , to convince our constraynings to be dissauowable , and theirs ( much more violent and Tyrannous ) to be approueable ? marry , because the Catholike Church hath Ius acquisitum ouer Heretickes , as her due subiects , though now gone out of her , and departed from her ; doth this answere beseeme a Gent. that professeth learning , who well knoweth that wee will presently deny the Popish to be the Catholike Church ? that we haue not departed from the Church ? but from the abhominations of Rome , that we be neither Heretickes , not subiects to that Antichristian Supremacy , and that their Ius acquisitum is not obtayned by any derivation or substitution from Christ , but it is intruded and vsurped , and so rightly termed acquisitum , beeing neither Datum nor Legitimum , but gotten by fradulent contriuings , and strong illusions ; in which cases it is not vnlawfull to shake of the yoake of bondage , and Tyranny , so vniustly brought vppon vs , so soone as any meanes and opportunity shall be offered . And the rather because we haue ( to front this Ius acquisitum with ) an old and strong opposition in our Law , that nullum tempus occurrit Regi , whose Royall pre-eminence and supreame power , God hath in due time redeemed , from that great captiuity of the Romish Babell ; and was it not high time , and most requisite that the dignity , and Maiesty of this Kingdome should be exempted from the seruitude of that Ius acquisitum ? Doe you not note that all such as be or haue beene brought vnder the same , are by this Gent. called the subiects of the Catholike Church ? such is the haughtinesse of that high built Tower of pride . The Pope is here made a Soveraigne , St. Peters nets catcheth more Kingdomes , then Fortune cast into the nets of the Athenian Captaine . The Monarchies of Europe must be come the acquisites or perquisites of the Court of Rome . Hath not then the Pope some reason thus to contend for the retayning of his subiects in his obedience , by barring of them from swearing themselues subiects to his Majestie , and by performing of the duties of allegiance requierable of subiects ? I shall be driven to avouch in earnest , that which Cardinall Bellarminegathereth against vs as a great absurditie , that is , That no man can professe vnfeinedly his civill obedience , and detest treason and conspiracy , but hee must bee forced also to renounce the Primacy of the Sea of Rome . The headship of the supreame Bishop which beareth away in his streame the service and devotion of so many reputed Catholikes , is the headspring of treacherie and sedition , which by claiming amongst vs so many subiects , draweth from vs their affection and obedience . The distinction of Spirituall subjection and civil obedience , is become idle and of no vse , because the Pope doth not keepe his quarter , but will needs breake forth of the rayles and limits of that distinction , taking vpon him to be authorized also temporally , and that , for the suppression and subversion of the Civill Soveraignity , and so vpon that occasion ( hauing his sheepe as by his pastorall charge to attend his call and heare his voyce ) maketh at the lest a scruple , and distraction , if not a full declination in the wills and dutyes of the people of this Kingdome , whence must necessarily arise either privie complottings , or open attempts , in favour of their opinions , and in furtherance of their defires , which how farre it will extend , and into how deepe degrees it vseth to grow , many sorowfull and fearefull examples hath in this Realme demonstratively declared vnto vs , to every whereof Papacy hath beene the stirrer and instigator . I scant dare to mention that late most memorable example ( beyond all examples ) of the Powder-Treason , this Gentleman is so tender-eared , as that he cannot indure to heare of that , he findeth fault with the appolloger for the odeous and often repetition thereof . I cannot blame them if the repetition of that purpose bee thought odeous , which maketh them odeous to all true Christian hearts , and putteth all the world at gaze , in admiring at a designe so diuellish and detestable . And because he asketh whether there be no end of reprobation , I will end with a wish , That there were in that hollow vault some shrill and screeching Eccho , that might never cease , by continuall resounding out-cryes , to beate and fill the aire , with the memorie of that hellish enterprise , that a Treason so extraordinarie , hatched vp with the heate of Papacy , should even from forth of the stones themselves receave for ever in all succeeding Ages , a most iust reproofe and exprobation . My position wherewith I will conclude is this , That albeit I doe not hold all popish opinions , or Papists seduced with such errors , to be culpable of Treason , knowing that many simple and vninstructed people , may in some perticulers be misled , and neverthelesse , remaine allowable subiects , and perhaps not forsaken Christians : Yet such and so many of them , as directly , and compleatly , maintaine Papacy , that is , the Supremacy of the Popes power and Authority in the sense , and to the purpose , as this Gentleman and P. R. hath expressed and advanced the same , and in vpholding thereof , deny their Faith , Allegiance , Assistance , Subjection , and Adherence vnto their Soveraigne , doe carry Treasonable hearts , and are thereby apted for the like Actions , as opportunity shall allure or enable them thereunto . FINIS . Notes, typically marginal, from the original text Notes for div A01076-e280 Inter 〈◊〉 fragmenta . Suat . li. 1. c. 1. Notes for div A01076-e1010 Cae. 6. par . 2 Cae. 5. par 2 ● Pet. ●● 1. Pet. 5. A Letter of a Catholike Gentleman touching the Oath of Allegiance , Fol. 67. Fol. ●● Answere to Sir Edward Cooke .