A CHRISTIAN AND MODEST OFFER OF A MOST INDIFFERENT CONFERENCE, OR DISPUTATION, ABOUT the main and principal Controversies betwixt the Prelates, and the late silenced and deprived Ministers in England: TENDERED BY SOME OF THE SAID MINISTERS TO THE Archbishops, and Bishops, and all their adherents.  1. Thess. 5.21. 
Try all things, and keep that which is good.  joh. 7.24. 
judge not according to the appearance; but judge righteous judgement.  joh. 18.23. 
If I have evil spoken, bear witness of the evil: but if I have well spoken, why smitest thou me?  
Imprinted. 1606.   

TO THE HIGH AND MIGHTY PRINCE, JAMES, BY THE GRACE OF GOD; KING of great Britain, France, and Ireland, Defender of the faith etc.  
MOst High and mighty Sovereign, As it is the office of every Christian to endeavour, by all good & lawful means, to procure the peace and prosperity of Zion; so is it principally required of the Ministers of the Gospel of jesus Christ, not only that they be God's Remembrancers, giving him no rest, until he set up jerusalem the praise of the world, but also that they be humble suitors unto those that, under him, be in supreme & sovereign Authority, that, according to their places, they will become nursing Fathers, & nursing Mothers to the Churches of God within their Dominions. And as this is a duty that lieth both upon Minister & people at all times (for the neglect whereof they shallbe accountable to that great and mighty God, whose servants they are) so are they then especially to be careful of it, when they see the truth of God, and the Ordinances of Christ jesus, the sole King and Prophet of his Church, to be opposed & oppugned, and the sincere Professors of the Gospel maligned and traduced, yea oppressed, and in a sort trodden under foot, by men who seek nothing but themselves, and who, for the maintaining of their own Pomp, and for the feeding of their idle bellies, stick not to wrest the Sceptre out of the hands of Christ, and to thrust him out of his chair of Estate. The consideration hereof (most dear and dread Sovereign) hath emboldened us, Gods most unworthy servants, your majesties loving and loyal Subjects, at this time to cast down our selves at your royal feet, and to crave your Princely favour.  
Your Majesty knoweth right well what Controversies there have been amongst us in this land, about the Prelacy, Ceremonies, & Subscription, ever since the bright shining beams of the glorious Gospel of Christ first dispelled & chased away the foggy mists, & black darkness of Popery from out of our coasts. You know likewise how hotly & eager the Approbation of these things hath been urged by the Prelates; who, being wise in their generation, have left no stone unrolled for the upholding of their ruinous & tottering kingdom; they having from time to time not only reviled and disgraced, both in Pulpit and in Print, those whom they call their brethren, and fellow servants of jesus Christ (who out of a fervent Zeal of the glory of God, and a perfect detestation of Popery, have witnessed against these Corruptions) but having also suspended, deprived, degraded, and imprisoned them, yea caused them to be turned out of house and home, denied them all benefit of law, and used them with such contempt & contumely, as if they were not worthy to live upon the face of the earth. Shall these Controversies be kept afoot for ever? Shall they not once be finally decided & determined? Will it not be misery in the latter end, if the Prelates be not restrained in time? It is true that books have been, and are daily written, on both sides: and yet the differences are as great, and greater now, than they were at the first; and so are like still to be, unless (by special order from your Majesty) the matter may once come to some such direct, and just Trial as is here offered.  
Wherein that your Majesty may be the more willing and ready to hearken unto us, we beseech you to consider, and that seriously, that the Cause, which here we present unto you, is not our own, but that it is the Cause of Christ jesus, who is become a Suitor unto you, and desireth that he may have Audience: for whom whatsoever you shall do, it shallbe remembered unto you, and abundantly recompensed at that great & last day of account, when you shall come to stand before his Tribunal, who is King of Kings, and Lord of Lords; who is not unrighteous that he should forget any thing that is done for him, or for any cause of his. And howsoever the Prelates, and their followers, do bear your Majesty in hand, that the Church-Government desired is an enemy to your Crown and dignity; believe them not, we humbly beseech you, neither hearken to their Siren songs: It is (as we are ready to prove) a holy Ordinance of God, which will stand when all such as oppose it, and blaspheme it in the ears of your Royal Majesty, shall melt away as snow before the Sun. And if by such an indifferent Conference as is here tendered, we shall not make it as clear unto your Majesty as the Sun at Noonday, that the Government of the Churches of Christ by Pastors, Teachers, and Elders is much more agreeable to the State of a Monarchy, then is the present Government by Archbishops, Bishops, Archdeacon's, Commissaries, and the rest of that Romish Hierarchy, let us then find no favour in your majesties eyes.  
Your Majesty professed before you came to the Crown, that you did equally love & honour the learned & grave men of either of these opinions: 
Basil. dor. Epist. pag 11.  and it is no small heartes-griefe unto us, that, since your coming into this land, your Affections are so alienated & estranged from us, who have done you no hurt in the world, but have wished you all the good that your own soul desireth; nay, who, before we saw your face, laboured by all good means (not without some danger) to promote your majesties just Title to this Crown, and have ever since carried ourselves dutifully towards your Majesty, and peaceably in the service of God, and of his Churches. We are not ignorant what the Prelates do pretend, and what they suggest continually in your Princely ears; they cry out against us with open mouth, that we are stubborn and refractory persons, and enemies to your Sovereign Authority: wherein they do both highly abuse your Majesty, and wrong us exceedingly. For it is well known, and the Lord beareth us witness, that we do, in the singleness and sincerity of our hearts, ascribe much more unto your Majesty and the Civil authority under you, than any Prelate in the land either doth, or is willing to do. And for the matters in question, we profess here in the presence of that great God, before whom we shall one day appear to answer it, if we speak not the truth, that we stand not against them out of any wilfulness, or peevishness, but out of the tenderness of our Consciences, as being persuaded in our very souls, that we cannot yield unto them, without sinning against Christ jesus, whose Ministers and Messengers we are. And if, upon such a due Trial of our cause as is desired, the truth of the ensuing Propositions (which are the special grounds on which we stand) shallbe infringed by the Prelates; nay, if we shall not be able to make them so clear and manifest by the infallible & undeniable evidence of the holy word of God, that who so doth not wilfully hoodwink himself may plainly see and discern the truth of them; we do here promise, and bind ourselves in the word of Christians, that we will presently change our minds, and become wholly Conformable to the present State.  
Wherefore we, being herein privy to our own uprightness both to God & to our Sovereign, cannot but conceive some hope, notwithstanding all the contrary plots and practices of the Prelates, that your Majesty (who are even as an Angel of God to discern between good and evil) willbe pleased now at last both to take a more exact knowledge of our cause, and (out of the tender bowels of your compassion) to think upon and pity the distressed estate not only of us the Lords poor servants, who are without any just cause cast out from serving at his Altar, but also of the Churches of Christ in this land, which do mourn and groan under the burden of human Traditions. Oh that this should be told at Gath, or published in the streets of Ashkelon, amongst the daughters of the uncircumcised, that, under the Government of so worthily renowned and famous a Prince, the Churches of God have been thus miserably wasted, and such a woeful havoc made in them by usurping & time-serving Prelates, as the like hath never been heard of in this land, under the Gospel. Oh that this should be either said, or written in succeeding ages, that in the reign of Noble King james (whose name shall live amongst men, when he, having finished his course, shall sleep with his Fathers) so many painful Preachers of the Gospel (even three hundred, or thereabouts) have in one year and a little more, been turned out of Christ's service, only for refusing such Ceremonies, as have their life, breath, and being from Popery, and such a Subscription, as the like, for aught we know, hath never been urged upon any Church of Christ, in any age, under a Christian Magistrate: there being in the mean time whole swarms of idle, Idol, scandalous, Popish, and Non-resident Ministers tolerated every where amongst us.  
The Prelates have left no means of rigour and extremity unassayed, for the suppressing of this cause, and for the discouraging and daunting of all those that either speak or write for it; and yet the glorious evidence of the truth is such, that it wanteth no witnesses; there being at this day many hundreds of the most painful & profitable Preachers in this Kingdom (besides those already turned out) which are ready to lose both their Ministry & their Maintenance, and to expose themselves & theirs to all manner of misery, rather than they will renounce this Cause, and conform themselves to the Corruptions of the times. If therefore there be in the Prelates any love of the truth, or any spark of desire of the peace and prosperity of our Churches (which is the thing that they so much pretend unto your Majesty) it will now appear and show itself, and you shall easily discern it, by their endeavour to procure the admittance of this Offer, which is the likeliest & the readiest way, that hitherto hath been thought upon, both to find out the truth, and to put a perpetual end to all these long-continued Controversies. Some other things there be, which we would willingly have brought to this, or the like Trial, as namely, the Oath ex officio, which is a cruel a racking of the mind, as the most exquisite Torture can be of the body; and sundry of the late Canons. But because they be of another nature, and we take them to be not only contrary to the word of God, but also directly against the laws of the land, we mention them not in our Propositions, in which we have endeavoured to set down only the grounds of all the main differences betwixt us & the Prelates: which if they be once thoroughly debated, & sound agreed upon, your Majesty shall see such a blessed unity and uniformity in all the Churches within your Dominions, as your own heart desireth.  
May it therefore please your most excellent Majesty to read, & examine this Offer, & to weigh in all the parts thereof the equity & justice of it, & the most certain advantage that the truth (on which side soever it is) shall receive by the acceptance of it: may it please you likewise to urge the Prelates, whom it deeply concerneth, to admit of it; and to secure by Royal protection those that shallbe Actors in it: who, howsoever they are forced to conceal their names (in regard of the rigour and severity of the Prelates) will notwithstanding be most willing & ready to show themselves, if your Majesty shall vouchsafe, to signify your gracious pleasure touching the admittance of this Conference. If therefore we have found favour in your majesties eyes, and if this great cause of Christ's be regarded; Our humble suit unto your Highness is, that you would make it known by some public Act, that the Offer shallbe accepted, and they protected by your Royal Authority, that have, or shall have to do in it. So shall we have occasion, every day more and more, to entreat the Lord, as we have done and will do for ever, that he will continue upon your Majesty, with a happy increase, all his graces both bodily and spiritual, even until, and in the day of Christ.  
The Lord jesus bless your Majesty, and your Royal posterity, and grant unto you a long and a happy reign over us: the Lord multiply all his mercies upon you both for this and a better life, and cover with shame the faces of all such as wish you the least evil. Amen.  
Your Majesty's obedient Subjects, most ready to do your will in all things, wherein they shall not disobey the will of God: Some of the late silenced and deprived Ministers.   

A CHRISTIAN AND MODEST OFFER OF A MOST INDIFFERENT CONFERENCE or disputation, about the main and principal Controversies betwixt the Prelates, and the late sconced and deprived Ministers in England: TENDERED BY SOME OF THE SAID MINISTERS TO THE Archbishops, and Bishops, and all their adherents.  
Wherein are set down, 

1. The Propositions which the Ministers offer to maintain against the Prelates.  
2. The Conditions, form, and manner of the Conference or Disputation.  
3. Just Considerations moving the Ministers to make this Offer.  
4. An Answer to such opposisions, as may be made by the Prelates against yeeiding to the said Offer.    

1. THE PROPOSITIONS WHICH THE MINISTERS OFfer to maintain against the Prelates.  
1. ALL matters merely Ecclesiastical, which are lawfully imposed upon any Church, are such as may be concluded necessarily from the writ ten word of God.  
2. All human Ordinances used only or specially in God's worship, whereunto they are not necessary of themselves, are simply unlawful.  
3. Every true visible Church of Christ is such a spiritual Body politic, as is specially instituted by Christ or his Apostles in the New Testament.  
4. There is no True Visible Church of Christ but a particular ordinary Congregation only.  
5. Every true visible Church of Christ, or ordinary Assembly of the faithful, hath by Christ's ordinance power in itself, immediately under Christ, to elect and ordain, deprive and depose their Ministers, and to execute all other Ecclesiastical Censures.  
6. The Pastor of a particular Congregation is the highest ordinary ecclesiastical Officer in any true constituted visible Church of Christ.  
7. It is the Office of every true Pastor to teach & to govern spiritually only one Church or Congregation immediately under Christ.  
8. The Pastor alone ought not to exercise Ecclesiastical jurisdiction over his Church, but others ought to be joined in Commission with him by the assignment of the same Church; neither ought he and they to perform any main and material Ecclesiastical act, without the free consent of the Congregation.  
9 The Presbytery which is desired is not Lay, as they call it; And the Churchwardens and Sidemen here in England, being joined as Assistants to the Ministers in the oversight of the several Parishes, are a resemblance of those governing Elders which are desired.  
10. The Office and Calling of Provincial & Diocesan Prelates is contrary to the word of God.  
11. It is simply unlawful for any Pastor under the New Testament to be also a Civil Magistrate.  
12. The Civil Magistrates ought to be the Overseers of Provinces, & Dioceses, and of the several Churches therein: And it is their Office & duty enjoined them by God, to take knowledge of, to punish, and redress all misgoverning or ill teaching of any Church, or Church officer.  
13. The Church government desired is more agreeable to the state of a Monarchy, and to the King's Supremacy in causes Ecclesiastical, and more easy, and sat both for Church & Common wealth, then is the present government by Prelates.  
14. No man hath authority to bring into the service of God any Ceremony merely Ecclesiastical, of mystical signification.  
15. The Ceremonies in controversy are not indifferent, but contrary to the word of God.  
16. The Ministers refusing the Conformity and Subscription required, are therein neither schismatics, Seditious persons, enemies to the King's Supremacy, nor any way undutiful to King, or State.   

2. The Conditions, form, and manner of the Conference or disputation.  
THat there may be a free choice made by the Ministers from amongst themselves of some 6. or 8. persons, unto whom the maintenance of these points may be committed; and as many chosen by the Prelates from among themselves, or their Conformed Clergy, to impugn the same.  
2. That it my be lawful for those on either side so chosen, in any particular occurrent difficulty, to take counsel and advise of any other their Brethren; and that then the special acts of the said chosen parties may be reputed the Acts of all those that chose them.  
3. That when one side hath opposed to the uttermost that they can, or shall see meet, than the other side shall oppose in like manner to the contrary: And that the Prelates may (if they will) make choice which side shall oppose in the first place.  
4. That the Opponents frame their Arguments in strict form of Syllogism only: And that the Answerers (without any excursions, or personal speeches whatsoever) answer directly to the premises, either by denying or distinguishing; and that all be done in writing.  
5. That if at any time the Answerer denying a Proposition shall withal give a reason of his denial, he do it in few words: and that then the Opponent shall briefly by way of discourse take away the reason, and after that presently conclude the denied Proposition; that so the Argument may come to the intended issue.  
6. That if either in the Question, Argument, or Answer there be any terms which shall seem doubtful, there be no proceeding in the Conference until the same be explained, and the explanations delivered in writing, if they which make doubt shall require it.  
7. That neither side be urged to conclude those clauses, which in the main Questions, or in the premises of any Syllogism are without controversy & granted: but that by consent they may be omitted, and that it may be only specified briefly that such or such a clause in such or such a Proposition is yielded unto: And if there be many clauses in one and the same proposition which are doubtful, that then it be lawful and free to prove one of them after another.  
8. That the Arguments, Answers, and Replies be sub scribed by every person of that side from which they come, and so delivered to the other side.  
9 That there be no passing to the second proposition, until the first be fully debated, nor to the third until the second etc. As also, no passing to a second or third argument, until the first be followed to the uttermost.  
10. That reasonable time may be allowed for returning Replies, & Answers: and when any argument is prosecuted to the uttermost, that all the Syllogisms, Answers, & Replies be written together, and subscribed by all parties of each side in the conference, as their joint act: and that after they are so subscribed, there shall be no liberty to alter or change any thing therein; But that before such subscription it may be lawful and free for each side upon better considerations to alter, change, or revoke any particular Reply, or Answer.  
11. That when these controversies have been debated to the uttermost, in manner and form aforesaid, two of each side be chosen to digest the whole into a book; and that it may be published in English and Latin.  
12. That all by controversies and contentions whatsoever, which shall fall out between the parties employed in this conference, may be heard, judged, determined, and sentenced by some civil Magistrate assigned by his Majesty for that purpose.  
13. That the said Ministers undertaking this conference may have public warrant and protection from his Majesty for the performance of the same, in such manner as is here set down.  
14. That if it plainly appear by this indifferent trial (or by the Prelates refusing to accept it) that the Ministers in these Propositions have the truth on their side, and that the Prelates are in so great error; Then the said Ministers & as many else as shall see the truth which they stand for, may be exempted from the jurisdiction of the Prelates, the Ministers restored again to their ministery from which they have been unjustly deprived, freed from the Conformity and subscription required, and may (with their particular Elderships & Churches) be subject only to the authority and jurisdiction of the Civil Magistrate; to whom at all times they are willing and ready to yield an account of all their actions, and to humble themselves under their censures for any thing they shallbe found to offend in; Conforming themselves unto their wills in all things, always, so far as they may with a good conscience; and where they cannot so do, submitting themselves to all such punishment, as it shall please them to impose upon them.  
15. That if it seem not good to his Majesty & the state (for reasons best known unto themselves) to admit of so indifferent, honest, and reasonable a Conference, yet it would please them to require the Prelates, to publish a direct and full answer to such books as have (upon occasion of the late storms) been published: viz. The Abridgement set forth by the Ministers of Lincoln Diocese; The Demands, & Considerations; Reasons proving a necessity of reforming our Churches in England; The old Protestant and New formalist; The Treatise of Divine worship; The 12 Arguments; The English Puritanisme; and the Protestation &c: And that it may be lawful for the Ministers modestly and directly to reply unto the said Answers, as also to any of the books which are lately, or have been heretofore written against them & their cause; and to publish the same in print with leave of authority, which they under take and bind themselves with all convenient speed faithfully and honestly to perform; they protesting here before Almighty God, the searcher of all hearts, and the just revenger of all hypocrisy, that (to their knowledge) there hath as yet no material thing been written against them in these foresaid Propositions, or any other Controversy betwixt them and the Prelates, but they are able to give a reasonable and just reply unto the same: and that by those books, which have been published against them, they have been rather confirmed & strengthened in the said opinions which they hold against the Prelates, than any way satisfied or answered, as shall appear to all the world (by God's gracious assistance) if they may have permitted unto them that liberty, to publish their writings to the world, which the Pray lats take unto themselves.  
16. That if this most reasonable and just course of composing these controversies be denied them, yet at least they may have free leave to publish and to offer to the censure of the whole world nakedly and plainly, all those several Arguments, & Reasons, which they have thought upon for the confirmation of the former Propositions; as also their direct Answers to all such Arguments on the contrary side, as they shall find published in the writings of the Prelates and their adherents. In all which they promise to keep themselves closely & directly to the points in controversy, in so strict a form, that it shallbe most easy for the Prelates to give an answer unto them, if so be they be in error in holding the said Propositions.   

3. Just Considerations moving the Ministers to make this offer.  
MAny of the Ministers having by reason of their Deposition from the public ministery more cause, occasion, and leisure to study these controversies then before, do find that the more they wade into them, the more they are confirmed in that truth for which they suffer. So that howsoever the intendment of the Prelates hath been by their rigorous extremity of affliction to make them to force their consciences, against conscience to yield, that so they might rejoice in their flesh; and though the Lord hath surrered their rod (to the further hardening of their hearts) to lie so heavy upon some of his servants that they have put forth their hand to injquitie, yet othersome by this means are so far from shrinking from the profession of that truth which by their sufferings they have honoured, that the more they have sustained for it, the more (by the mercy of God) they see the glorious evidence of it. And therefore in honour unto that heavenly truth they can do no less, then in the fear of God make this offer unto the greatest enemies thereof.  
2. This cause, which the ministers profess and witness unto by their constant sufferings, being (as they are persuaded in their very souls and consciences) a divine & sacred truth; and being notoriously reviled and blasphemed as a hellish error by the mouths of the prelates & their favourers (one saying that he damned the discipline to Hell from whence it came; 
Vaughan his Con●orie in uses. Powel de diap. pref.  others publishing in print that Christ is not the Lawgiver of his Church; all generally calling our doctrine and opinion in this cause, Schism and Heresy, yea Treason and Rebellion; they having received this grace from God not only to see the truth herein, but to seal and confirm it by their sufferings, think it a most bounden duty that they own unto their Lord and master jesus Christ, whose Ministers and Servants they are, by all good means to justify the same; yea though they neither had suffered nor should suffer for it. Much more now, when as by the providence of God, they have in themselves, their wives, and children, sustained & endured so heavy things for it: And a more honest, moderate, Christian, and religious defence or Apology they cannot yield unto it, them by making such an offer as this is, to the avowed enemies thereof.  
3. It is notorious unto all the world, what indignities, sianders, false accusations, and calumniations, over and beside the other Legal proceed (as they are pretended to be) the Prelates and their adherents in their private speeches, public sermons, and writings, lay upon those Ministers that hold & maintain this cause, proclaiming them to be Obstinate & Refractory persons, Enemies to the King & State, Notorious & manifest Schismatics, Turbulent spirits, 
chaplain well in 〈◊〉 Considetions.  Contemptuous and disdaining the Authority of their lawful Governors, presumptuous and wilful Contenders with the Magistrate, Impugning his authority in things indifferent, and Sovereignty in Ecclesiastical cause, False Prophets, Members rend and cut of from the Church of God, Runaways from their Ministry, some standing upon these points of difference not for conscience but for carnal respects, some because otherwise they know not how to be maintained but by depending on that faction, some to gratify their benefactors & patrons and to please their friends, some for discontentment and want of preferment, some for giddiness of innovation, some for pride of heart and self-love, some for hatred of order, and restraint of their liberty, some for ignorance, yet wilful, because they will not know the state of the question, some to retain the opinion of constancy, etc. Now it being the duty of every Christian even for Christ's sake and the Gospels which he doth profess, to clear his innocency against such false and impious slanders; much more is it fit for the Ministers of the Gospel, being thus wickedly traduced, so to do. And therefore they think themselves bound in conscience to make this free and voluntary offer unto their Calumniators; the very propounding whereof is sufficient to all honest and just minds, that do not wilfully shut their eyes against the truth, to clear and free them from all the aforesaid slanderous imputations.  
4. The Christian and merciful disposition and inclination of the Lower house of Parliament, and of sundry of the Nobles of the Higher house (who in a holy Commiseration of the Ministers distressed estates, and in a certain knowledge both of their honest lives and conversations, and of the good they have done in their ministries, and of their peaceable and dutiful behaviour to all in authority, have been earnest and zealous suppliants for them) hath been shamefully traduced by the Prelates; as though only through the encouragements & hopes reposed in them, and for this cause specially, that they might not be discredited and disgraced in their endeavours and intendments for Reformation, the Ministers did stand forth: Whereas by these presents all the world shall know and understand, that the cause for which the Ministers do suffer is such, as (all due thankfulness and service reserved to the Honourable and Christian endeavour of the Parliament) though God should (which we hope he will never permit) so far forsake that High and Honourable Court, as in steed of being suppliants for the poor Ministers, they should join with the Prelates in making the most rigorous laws against them that might be (even to blood) yet the Ministers, by God's good grace, stand resolved to hold and maintain their said profession. In witness whereof they publish to the view of all men, this offer as a testimony of their confident resolution in the said cause for which they suffer.  
5. There is such indifferency in this offer, and it standeth upon so just & equal grounds, that it ought not to be refused of any Christians, no though made by jews, Turks, Arrians, Papists, or any other Heretics whatsoever: Much less when it is made by Ministers constantly professing & showing themselves willing and ready to submit themselves in all things to the written word of God; and who in all matters (except in these Controversies of Religion, wherein yet they agree with most of the Churches that have made a separation from Rome) are as obedient to the present State, and as unblameable in life and conversation as any other of his Majesty's subjects.  
6. Divers of the aforesaid Propositions are such, as that if the Ministers should not constantly hold & maintain the same against all men, they cannot see how possibly (by the rules of Divinity) the separation of our Churches from the Church of Rome, and from the Pope, the supreme head thereof, can be justified. And therefore for as much as in these controversies the Papists and the Prelates go hand in hand, the said Ministers do in like form and manner make the like Offer to the Priests and jesuits, promising their reconcilement unto that Sea, if they can either by Arguments pull them from the foresaid Propositions, or can answer such Arguments as they shall propound in the defence of them, in manner and form before specified in the Offer. And therefore it both stands the Ministers upon to make the aforesaid Offer, and the Prelates (except they will have all the world to judge them to be friends in heart to Popery) to accept of the same.  
7. The Doctors of Oxford in their answer to the Petition of the 1000 Ministers, and G. powel in his last book undertake the answer of whatsoever can be objected in these causes: 
●ook. pref. ●…g 25.26.  and M. Hooker in his Preface before his first book of Politiks, propoundeth unto the Ministers that seek Reformation the very like Offer and form of disputation: Which books were published with the special approbation of the Prelates. Wherefore the Ministers having been in such a manner challenged, they can do no less then make this offer; which cannot be refused of the Prelates, but they will be judged of all the world to offer that which they will not perform.  
8. The Bishop of Rochester with the consent, and by the direction (no doubt) of some of the chiefest Prelates, hath now lately published his Sermon preached in September last before the King at Hampton Court; the main drift whereof is to prove that the office & calling of Dioce sand Bishops, in present controversy, is a Divine & Apostoli call Ordinance: Besides, in his epistle to the Ministers of Scotland, prefixed before the said Sermon, he professeth that if there shall an answer be made thereunto with modesty and learning, nothing shall be more welcome, And that to avouch & make it good that the said Episcopal calling is unlawful, were a labour worthy the travel, and of the Prelates much desired. Wherefore seeing the Prelates themselves do offer to bring this cause to a public trial (& it concerneth us in England also no less than our brethren in Scotland) & seeing by this course & order here laid down, this question amongst the rest will come to be far more exactly tried, then by any other way hitherto thought on, the Ministers have just cause to tender this Conference; nothing doubting but that the Prelates will willingly accept it, especially seeing they seem so much to desire it, and in all reason it is like to put an end to all these controversies, which have so long troubled the peace and quiet of our Churches.  
9 Since the Ministers late troubles, there have been many books published in Print against them, containing many shameful untruths and abuses, wherein great violence & wrong hath been offered to God's truth; many gross and Popish errors have been divulged, and many impostures used, only to deceive the simple, and to blind their eyes, that they may not see the truth of the Ministers cause; which the Ministers take themselves bound in conscience to answer. But being not able partly by reason of their poverty, partly by want of means of Printing, partly for other difficulties, to publish, so soon as is requisite, so many answers (except they might have leave from authority) unto so many great books as many of them are: They have judged it meet (in the mean time) to make this Offer, wherein if they prevail & gain the cause, they make no question but they shall have all other particularities yielded, and shall save that other labour.  
10. They have warrant thus far from his Majesty, both in his book called Basilicon doron; where he willeth them to press by patience and well grounded reasons to persuade other men to like of their judgements; and by the Proclamation of july 16. 1604: In which the Prelates are required to do their uttermost endeavour by persuasions, Conference, Arguments, and all other ways of gentleness and love to reclaim the Ministers; which being as yet not done by them, can not be performed by a more direct and indifferent course, then by accepting such an Offer as this is.  
11. By direction from the chief of the Prelates, 
Consid. p●…  G. powel hath published, That his excellent Majesty, as he loved these Ministers dearliest of all others, so he sought the more earnestly to reclaim them by some correction. So that either the Prelates herein have offered his Majesty open wrong in proclaiming his special favour to the said Ministers, or else they are not to doubt, but in the abundance thereof he will vouchsafe to those poor distressed and chastised favourites of his so much grace, as to command that this Offer may be accepted, and by his Royal assent to confirm the same.  
12. The Apologetical books which the Ministers have been constrained from time to time to publish in defence of their Persons and Cause, can not come to the hands & scanning of those powers, that next under God are most able to relieve them. And therefore for the cleared of their innocency and the justifiyng of their cause (which is indeed the cause of God) they are constrained to make this public and solemn Offer, by means whereof it may come to pass that all men may take notice of the goodness of the cause, and of the gross wrongs they have sustained and endured for maintaining the same.  
13. His Majesty signified to the Committees of the Lower house (Supplicating on the behalf of the Ministers) that before mercy there must go a submission, and that if they look for mercy at his hands, they must acknowledge a fault. This is that which they desire; If it can be proved that they have offended his Majesty in the least thing, they desire no mercy till they acknowledge a fault, and submit themselves for the same. But it is (no doubt) far from the heart of so Royal a Prince to require either Confession, or Submission, wherther is no transgression. For their own parts they are persuaded and resolved, that that truth for the professing whereof the Prelates proceed so severely against them, is most behoveful for his Majesty, his Crown, and dignity, and the whole State: And that in yielding herein in unto the Prelates, they should make a breach in that duty, which by God's law every true hearted and loyal subject in this kingdom oweth both to the King and State. And yet if they be in an error, there can be no more direct and likely course used to bring them unto a submission for the same, then to have these points freely debated by the acceptance of this Offer.  
14. When the Ministers consider the daily increase of Papists, their treacheries and conspiracies, their insolent boldness, the continual broaching of gross and Popish errors, what little molestation the Papists have by the government of the Prelates, yea what favour they find secretly and under hand, what resistance was made to the Laws intended to have been made against them, especially by some and those not the meanest of the Prelates, what light matters are made of their horrible Treasons and damnable opinions, what little execution there is of the laws against them; they have reason to fear, that before they are aware & as it were in a dream, (if the raynes be in this manner left in the Prelates hands for matters of religion) the neck both of his Royal Majesty and of the whole State shallbe brought under the yoke of the Pope that Antichrist of Rome, and his devilish idolatry. And therefore in a serious mediatation of the best means to prevent this great & imminent evil, which lieth working in a mystery, they cannot think of a more direct course then this open and professed Opposition unto the Prelates in the foresaid Propositions; wherein if they shall prevail, they shall not only give a deadly wound to the Prelacy itself, but to the accursed Religion of Rome, from which (at least, if it be held to be jure divino) it receiveth both breath and life. For who was so simple that saw not, that at his Majesty's first coming to the Crown when the Prelates hanged down their heads in suspense & fear, the Papists hearts were as dead as stones; and that the very first Proclamation against the Ministers in behalf of the Prelates, revived the Papists again: And that ever since with the increase of the grace, favour, and authority of the Prelates, the hopes, boldness, and numbers of Papists have increased. And therefore howsoever the Prelates may mock children and fools in imputing the Ministers; yet any that wisheth the confusion of that Antichrist may with half an eye see, where the true cause is. And therefore they seeing this (except they should be wilful traitors to God, their King, and Country) cannot but make opposition unto the Prelates in approving the Propositions above specified: wherein if they be in an error, and the Prelates on the contrary have the truth; they protest to all the world that the Pope and the Church of Rome (and in them God and Christ jesus himself) have had great wrong & indignity offered unto them, in that they are rejected; and that all the Protestant Churches are Schismatical in forsaking Unity and Communion with them.  
15. The former Propositions are such, that there will not be found (as we are verily persuaded in our consciences) any one Conformable Minister in this kingdom, except he be a masked Papist, that will refuse to Subscribe to any one of them, if so be it would please the King and State by Law to urge them thereunto under such penalties as the Ministers are urged to subscribe unto the Articles devised by the Prelates. Yea, we are out of all doubt, that the Prelates themselves (if it were pressed upon them by the King and state under pain of deprivation from their Bishoprics) would not stick to avouch upon their oaths, that the Ceremonies and Subscription, for which the Ministers stand suspended and deprived, are wicked and ungodly, & such as no good Christian ought to yield unto. Nay, if the case stood but upon the saving of their temporalties thereby (which else they should lose) we doubt not but they would with heart & hand subscribe to any one of the aforesaid Propositions. Sith therefore it is more than clear, that they have Offered plain violence unto the Consciences of all most all the conforming and subscribing Ministers; & that even contrary to their own consciences they have proceeded against their poor brethren, because they will not by conformity & subscription renounce the truth contained in these propositiens; can any blame the said Ministers, if having not only the said truth on their side, but in likelihood the Consciences of the Prelates also, they make such an Offer as this is?  
15. It is agreeable to common sense and reason (and the Bishop of Chichester hath some such thing in his Lectures upon the Commandments) that doubtful actions should always give place unto those that are out of all doubt & question. Seeing therefore no good Protestant ever doubted, but that it is lawful enough in itself to administer the word and sacraments in common and ordinary civil attire, to administer Baptism without the sign of the Cross or any such like mystical rite, and to undertake a Ministry (being called thereunto of the Church) without the authority of a Diocesan Prelate, and without any such subscription as is required: and seeing the consormity and subscription required (against which the Ministers do witness) hath been ever called into question since the first appearance of the Gospel out of Popery, & concluded and determined against, both in the profession and practice of the greatest lights of this age, and of so many Reformed Churches; have not the Ministers just cause (they desiring nothing which is of itself unlawful, & suffering for nothing but for the refusal of those things which have ever been in Controversy, whether they be lawful or not) have not the Ministers (we say) just cause to make this Offer, and to cleave constantly unto that which all men grant to be lawful, until by some such indifferent means as this is, the contrary matters, bejng so doubtful, shall be proved to be lawful.  
16. It is notorious unto all the world what damnable and impious imputations the Prelates and their defenders have laid upon Calvin, BeZa, and all reformed Churches, raking up calumniations against them out of the writings of Allen, Parsons, and other traitorous Papists, notwithstanding Bishop jewel and Bishop Bilson have most clearly in their writings against the Papists detected the falsehood thereof. And seeing that the Papists have gone about, since the discovery of that late detestable plot by gunpowder, to justify their abominable Treasons, Conspiracies, Rebellions, Perjuries, and Equivocations by the doctrine of the worthiest Protestants, taking just advantage thereof by the slanderous writings of the Prelates against those of our own religion; And further seeing that the intent of the Prelates therein was to make all the Ministers, that consent in judgement with those persons and Churches which they have thus traduced, odious and vile in the eyes of all men, as persons in clined to perilous conspiracies, Treasons, and Rebellions; there being no other ground, nor any colour of all this, but because together with other Churches they hold the foresaid propositions; howsoever in a late Reply unto the Papists the matter be pitifully shifted of: yet seeing these heavy proceed against the said Ministers are a kind of confirmation of the aforesaid imputations, it stands them upon by this Offer to clear themselves, and to detect the unchristian and ungodly wrongs which the Prelates have done to so many worthy persons & Churches.  
17. Upon a serious consideration how the hand of God hath been upon many of those, who, having formerly embraced this cause, have shrunk from tree truth maintained in these propositions; how some of them have evidently lost the grace and power of their gifts, some grown to be idle, neglecting both private and public duties, yea profane and scandalous in their lives and conversations, some ashamed to show their faces in the presence of any who truly fearing God have known their former carriage, some languishing and pining away till they have died, & that within few days after their yielding, some possessed (as it were) with a continual fury incessantly vexing & tormenting them, 
FR. MARTINO  and thrusting them into continual storming & raging in the pulpit against those that do not as they do, all of them falling to the maintenance of most gross and Popish errors, and none of them respected almost by any, but contemned & scorned even of the Prelates themselves, as those which were either hypocrites before, or hypocrites now; The Ministers having received this grace from God, not only to see and acknowledge this truth, but to confirm it with their sufferings, have thought it more than needful to make this Christian Offer, for the staying and strengthening of such of their brethren, as are otherwise in danger to fall after the same manner.  
18. In as much as all the professed and notorious Atheists, Papists, Blasphemers, Adulterers, Drunkards, & infamous persons in this Kingdom, are together with the prelates professed enemies unto the Ministers in this cause, and have been from time to time the special instruments of all the troubles which have befallen them for the same; can any man lay any just blame upon the Ministers for making this Offer, now, when as the Prelates have by their late proceed given such cause to all the wicked and profane of the land to clap their hands in Triumph over them?  
19 It is well known in those Countries where the said Ministers have lived, especially to the Towns where they have exercised their Ministry, that, according to the proportion of their Live and maintenance, they have kept as good hospitality, given as liberal entertainment unto others, and as much relieved (to their power) those in want, as any other Ministers whosoever; whereas now a great part of them, with their wives and children, are forced to live upon the benevolence and devotions of others. Which lamentable and miserable estate of theirs, the Prelates and their Adherents are so far from pitying, that they take occasion the more to scorn & deride than, yea and to insult over them for the same: they being not ashamed both in the Pulpit & in Print falsely to affirm, that by this means not only the outward estate of the Ministers is bettered, but that they have voluntarily and of set purpose left their Ministry, that they might live in this manner upon the sweat of other men's brows, and by Contributions enrich themselves. Though therefore the many & great means, which the Ministers have used both to prevent these proceed, and to be restored to their places again, are sufficient to lay open the shame of these malicious & spitful calumniations; Yet they have thought it meet by this Offer to make it known unto all the world, that they are so far from affecting such a course of life, that they ever have been, and are still, most willing to do any thing (but that, the doing whereof may procure damnation unto their souls) for the keeping or recovering of their former places, from which they have been thrust; to the end that they might ease their Christian friends of those great burdens, wherewith since these late troubles they have been pressed, in yielding relief unto their extremities.  
21. The Prelates are now come to this height of Popish injquitie, 
G. Powel Adiaph. c. 2. sect. 7.8.9.10:  that they are not ashamed to hold & maintain, that they being the Church, are in their Canons and Constitutions always directed in external things by the spirit of God; and that therefore whatsoever they decree is more than human, yea even Divine; and that the true Church always depends upon the word, so as it cannot possibly serve from the same; and therefore all her Traditions are holy and divine. And this Church of Prelates (professing themselves to be assembled in a sacred Synod in the name of Christ, and directed by the spirit of God, 
Canon 13  and Excommunicating all them that shall say the contrary) have in their said late Synod decreed, that all who shall affirm, that either the Ceremonies in Controversy are superstitious and unlawful, 
Can: 6, &  or that the Government by Archbishops and Bishops is not Apostolical and lawful, are to be excommunicated ipso facto. Now seeing that not only the Ministers suspended and deprived, but many thousand others in this Kingdom, do affirm and maintain these things, they stand all by virtue of those Canons Excommunicate, and standing in that estate (if justly) are by consequence in the case of damnation, yea so as (dying resolutely in these points) they must needs be damned everlastingly. Either therefore the Prelates shall show themselves to be Antichristian, and that in a high degree, in sending without any mercy or compassion so many thousand souls, with the dash of a pen, to Hell, it being in their power to keep them out; or exceedingly presumptuous, in denouncing such a sentence against those whom they cannot but know & oftentimes do confess, to be the true servants of God; or at the least it standeth them upon diligently to use all good means for the recovery of so many souls out of Hell, especially then, when, by such an Offer as this is, they hold up their hands out of the pit, desiring to be pulled out.  
22 Last of all, the Propositions being so plainly and distinctly laid down, and so directly opposite to the profession of the Prelates; they having also so often disgraced the Ministers for their paucity, and poverty of gifts and learning, and so often vaunted of the multitudes of great learned men on their side, and by that means having far greater choice of sufficient and able men than the Ministers have; and being better able to furnish them with all needful helps to such a work, and the points in Controversy so nearly touching their jurisdiction, state, and dignity, which is so dear and precious unto them; also the Offer that is made unto them being so equal, just, and Christian, if they shall refuse to yield unto the same, & in steed thereof afflict the persons which humbly make this Offer unto them, they shall therein proclaim to all the world, that in these their proceed they have sinned & do sin with a high hand and malicious heart, (contrary to knowledge and conscience) against God and his Divine truth: and therefore are to be judged to be at the next door of committing that unpardonable sin, which the Prelates, in the time of our Saviour Christ's being upon the earth, in the like cases committed. From which if it be the good will of God (notwithstanding all the evil which they have done against these poor servants of Christ, and the Churches of God committed to their charge) they pray earnestly that they may quit themselves, and that, upon their repentance in this life, they may attain unto such a crown of glory, as they in their consciences are persuaded is laid up for some of those, whom they use now living in the world as Heathens & Infidels.   

4. AN ANSWER TO SUCH OPPOSITIONS, AS MAY BE MADE BY THE Prelates, against yielding to the aforesaid Offer.  

1. OPPOSITION.  
The reverend Fathers of the Church, before they proceeded to suspension and deprivation of the Ministers, used godly admonitions, exhortations, & arguments to persuade them to conformity, answering whatsoever they could then object, why they should not conform. Therefore what need they now to enter into that trouble again?  
ANSWER.  
This is not true. 

I. They never used any one Argument to the purpose, but such as hath been sufficiently answered we know not how often.  
2. Their Admonitions were mere formal; wherein also the Ministers were exceedingly wronged: diverse of them (who were very poor men, and some of their live not above 40. some 30. some 20. pounds by the year, & their charge of wife, children, and family very great) being forced to come in the depth of winter 9 or 10. times, yea some oftener, unto their Palaces, some of them 30. some 40. some 50. miles and more to receive their Admonitions, and at length their deprivations for their labour.  
3. We desire that the Prelates would publish to the view of all the world those Arguments which they used, and the Ministers did not, or could not answer.  
4. This is a most certain truth, & willbe justified to the faces of them all, that many of the Ministers demanded of them Reasons and Arguments, according to the form of the King's Proclamation, and they refused to give any: yea diverse of them sundry times offered their Propositions, and Reasons to the Prelates, promising, upon their reasonable answer, with out any further question to Conform; and to this day they never gave them any.  
5. This may the more incite them to accept of this Offer: for by this means they may make known to the world those great Arguments and Resolutions, which then they used, and may set them down with mature and advised deliberation, to the honour of their proceed.  
6. The only Argument to purpose that they used, was this, that it was his Majesty's pleasure it should be so: thereby laying the imputation and envy of their unjust proceed upon him.     

2. OPPOSITION.  
The Ministers can say no more than they have said & written already, and which we have answered often. And why then should we try these things any further?  
ANSWER.  

1. This is more than the Prelates know. Some of the Ministers have lately said more to some points, then hath been said before. And upon such occasions as may be offered by such a Conference, they may say more than they have said yet.  
2. The prelates, by their corrupt answers in their late published writings, have given them occasion to say more, than yet hath been said.  
3. This they are able to make good, that that which they have said already, hath not been answered as yet; and therefore this Conference is desired that these matters may be further tried.    

3. OPPOSITION.  
It is dangerous that matters established by Law should be thus called into question, and disputed of as matters doubtful.  
ANSWER.  

1. These matters are not now newly called into question, but they have been from time to time opposed against, and so will be to the end of the world; at least wise so long as so many Churches of God in other Kingdoms profess and practise as they do; and the rather because many great and famous Lights of the Church, both beyond Seas and at home, in their Monuments that shall last to all posterity, have testified against them. This therefore is not to call a matter, which is out of question, into question, but to call a matter already in question, to a direct and final determination.  
2. It cannot but be rather very profitable unto any State (such rules and conditions, as are here propounded, being observed) to debate and dispute, in such a manner as this is, of any human law whatsoever. For by this means, if a law be just, it willbe an honour unto it to have the justice thereof manifested; if unjust, it may be abrogated. And how cometh it to pass, that so many laws of man are abrogated by man, if when once a Law is enacted, it may not be called into question? Just Laws grounded upon equity, reason, & the word of God never dread examination, but unjust and Antichristian Laws do.  
3. These matters were never yet so established by law, as is pretended, but only tolerated: it being the intent of the first retainers of these Relics of popery, in time to abolish them. And since the 14. year of her late majesties Reign, the High Court of Parliament and the state of this Kingdom (who only, with the assent of the King, have power to make and abrogate Laws, whether Civil or Ecclesiastical) have ever showed themselves ready to ease the Churches of these burdens, which under the name of things established by Law are impose upon them by the Prelates. Only the Prelars, having many voices of their own in the upper House, have, by their gross flatteries & feigned promises to the in Chief place, ever crossed the holy endeavours of the Parliament for the removal of these burdens, grievous both to Church and Commonweal.  
4. It is ordinary in our Universities to admit of argumentation against any point of Religion and Faith; and that in such a manner, as is more dangerous to the truth, and less indifferent, than this form that is here offered.    

4. OPPOSITION.  
If Schismatics and factious persons may have this favour, why then may not Brownists, Anabaptists, and Papists expect the same?  
ANSWER  

1. They Ministers deny themselves to be schismatics, & shall at any time justify themselves to be as honest men, and as dutiful & loyal subjects as any Prelate in the Kingdom.  
2. The thing they desire is no favour, but that which in justice is to be yielded unto them: Neither shall they get any good, but hurt by it, except the truth be on their side.  
3. It were a shame for a state professing the true Religion publicly, to deny to the free subjects thereof, desiring it, such an indifferent hearing of their opinions, as this is, be they of the Separation, or Anabaptists, or what they may be. For if the Heathen had not, much less should true Christians have any such law, to condemn any sect or faction whatsoever, before they hear them: and hear them they do not, that will refuse to admit of such an indifferent Offer as this is. And it is a shame of shames to the Doctors of Oxford, who provoking those whom they call Brownists, in their Answer to the Ministers Petition, and being challenged of dishonesty and injustice in an Answer thereunto, have not in all this time justified themselves, & answered that which the other say in their own defence; it being so gravely, moderately, and discreetly set down. How much greater shame & reproach would it be, to refuse such a direct kind of trial as this is, tied to so strict rules, so prejudicial to error, & of so great advantage to the truth.    

5. OPPOSITION.  
This Offer argues only a wilful obstinacy of persons that will never be satisfied, and content with reason. For was not (according to their own seeking) their cause handled & heard in the Conference at Hampton Court, his Majesty himself moderating the action, and answering whatsoever, in these points their own Agents could object? what would they more?  
ANSWER.  

1. In their objecting to the Ministers the Conference at Hampton Court, they object to them, as it were, that which is Non Ens: None of them knowing what it was, nor any other save a few that were present, whose reports thereof are also so diverse, that one spoils the credit of another. And that which is set forth as the true report of it, being published only by the Prelates (who are partial) without the knowledge, advise, or consent of the other side, deserves no credit; the rather considering that D. Morton hath been allowed to call some part of it into question, even some speeches fathered upon his Majesty, which he was feign to confute as unsound and contrary to divinity. Wherein sith the Kings own speeches be, as it seemeth, grossly abused by the author, it is much more likely that speeches of other men are abused. Besides, none but Prelates, and such as were partial, being present at the first days Conference, there can be no credit at all given to the report thereof: for it is more than apparent, that they have fraudulently cut of, and concealed all the speeches (which were many) that his Majesty uttered against the corruptions of our Church, & practise of the Prelates: as appeareth by that testimony of the Dean of the Chapel, which he gave thereof, saying, That his Majesty did that day wonderfully play the Puritan. But if he played that part no otherwise then is specified in the Prelates report, he acted it very poorly, or rather never a whit. If therefore they would have had the Ministers to stand to the determination of that Conference, they should have used more indifferency and honesty in the Relation of it, than they have done; they should at least have made it appear by mutual testimony of all sides, that it was a true act. For they have no reason to believe such enemies, as the Prelates have showed themselves to be unto them, any further than they see them.  
2. Such a conference as that, was never desired by the Ministers; And it seems by the whole managing of it, that it was underhand plotted and procured by the Prelates themselves; abusing therein his Majesty, and using M. Galloway as an instrument in the matter, to the end that they might have the more colour for their intended proceed afterwards. And there is great probability of this, for that the Archbishop professed to the Committees of both Houses, the last session, that he had the letters written from M. Cartwright to M. Galloway about that matter.  
3. Most of the persons, appointed to speak for the Ministers, were not of their choosing, nor nomination, nor of their judgement in the matters then and now in question, but of a clean contrary. For being entreated at that time by the Ministers to dispute against these things, as things simply evil and such as cannot be yielded unto without sin; they professed to them, that they were not so persuaded, and therefore could not so do. Being then requested, to let his Majesty understand that some of their brethren were further persuaded touching the unlawfulness of these things, than themselves were; they refused that also. Lastly being entreated either to give them in writing their reasons to prove these things indifferent, or to give them an answer in writing to such reasons as they would give them in writing, to prove them simply evil; they would do neither the one nor the other; so that there neither was, nor could be any hope of good by that conference.  
4. The matters in controversy were not in that Conference thoroughly debated, but nakedly propounded, & some not at all touched: neither was there any one Argument to the purpose followed in the same.  
5. The Prelates took unto themselves liberty to interrupt, at their pleasure, those of the other side; insomuch that they were checked for it by his Majesty.  
6. The Ministers (if his Majesty will give them leave) will at any time, in one week's space, deliver to his Majesty in writing a full answer to any Argument, or Assertion, propounded in that Conference against them by any Prelate: and they do here plainly profess that all and every one of them are most vain and frivolous.    

6. OPPOSITION.  
These Ministers, by oppugning the Prelates, do openly disgrace the Government of his Majesty, and the whole State: and therefore no such favour is to be yielded to them.  
ANSWER.  

1. If the aforesaid Propositions be all of them true, & such as will be justified by the written word of God, them the Ministers (who herein seek nothing but the bare defence of that truth contained in them, which is of so great importance) cannot be truly charged with any undutiful behaviour toward King or State: if they be not true, this trial will make it manifest to all men, and that to the greater shame of these Ministers.  
2. They doubt not (whatsoever the Prelates shall intimate to the contrary) but that this Conference will much redound to the Honour of his majesties person, and Government. For by it that truth shall appear, which (how soever it hath been generally received in other Churches abroad) hath been hitherto either unknown among us, or much obscured by the Prelates & their friends; albeit it doth indeed concern, and that deeply, the true ordinary means of saving our souls.  
3. The Ministers are herein so far from seeking to disgrace the King or his Government, that they would esteem it a singular blessing of God, if they might be so happy, as to obtain that the aforesaid Propositions (containing in them the nature of Christ's true Visible Church, ministery, and Worship) may, by his majesties special order and appointment, be examined and determined, in such a most reasonable and unpartial Conference, as before is tendered: whereunto they make no question but they shall find his Majesty willing enough, if the Prelates do not under hand procure him to hinder it.    

7. OPPOSITION.  
It is not meet that the Governors of the Church should in this manner debase themselves unto such mean and private people.  
ANSWER.  

1. They are no private persons, being public Ministers of the Gospel; and divers of them of as good estimation in the Schools for their knowledge in Divinity and Humanity, and as reverend for their years, as any of the Prelates are.  
2. Some of the principal of the Prelates have already more disgraced themselves in this kind, than they should by yielding to such a Conference as this is. The Bishop of Winchester (as is well known) undertook the Answer of M. jacobs' last book. The Bishop of London professed openly in his Consistory, that he would shake out of the rags that book, which the Ministers of Lincoln Diocese delivered to his Majesty, the Abridgement whereof is published in print. Doctor Felton also at the request of the Archbishop undertook to answer the Treatise of Divine worship: which books maintain and defend in substance the aforesaid propositions. And though two years are now almost past, yet no Answer to any of them appeareth.  
3. The Prelates may choose whether themselves will personally deal in the Conference or not; they may assign hereunto their ordinary Champions, who have for their preferment already put forth themselves in the cause: And who (for greater hopes) willbe ready to undergo this service.    

8. OPPOSITION.  
This very Offer is enough to justify the former proceeding; of the Reverend Fathers against the Ministers, and to manifest how intolerable they are in this state. They pretended, in their first Petition to his Majesty no desire of innovation of the Government, but only the removal of a few Ceremonies, and some other supposed corruptions. Now they have manifested their hypocrisy to all the world; which the Bishops foreseeing thought it needful to take this course against them. For nothing will satisfy these fellows, but either the overthrow of Bishops, or at least wise their freedom from them. And therefore can any blame the Bishops, if they give them the same measure, that they, if they had the power in their hands, would meet unto them?  
ANSWER.  

1. If the Ministers do now cut deeper at the root of the Prelacy, them heretofore they have done, it is because, since their late proceed, they have seen more into the mystery of injquitie, that worketh in their spiritual Dominion, than ever they saw before: And therefore they must thank themselves for it.  
2. It is now made manifest to the whole world, that there is no hope of freedom from the spiritual bondage of Antichristian Traditions, so long as the Prelates sit in their Thrones, but a more direful expectation of greater slavery and servitude, than ever before, as may appear by the late Canons and their other proceed. And therefore howsoever some reverend Ministers nourish still many hopes, that the Prelates will at length show mercy, and be content to let them in joy the liberty of their consciences, and suffer them to exercise a ministery under them; yet they that make this Offer seeing no likelihood nor possibility of any such matter, but of the clean contrary (the Prelates having in so high a degree blasphemed and persecuted this truth of God) they think themselves now bound in conscience by all honest & good means to seek to be freed from that estate, which cannot (as it appears now to all the world) uphold itself, 
G. Powel Adiaph. ●…ef.  but by the ruin of the Gospel, and exaltation of Antichristianisme. For they that plead for their Government and Traditions are driven to hold these impious and irreligious Absurdities; 
D. Covil, ●…ainst the ●…ea of the ●…n: pa. 19  * That Christ is not the Lawgiver of his Church:! That it is a virtuous obedience, to rest as well in that which the Church commandeth unto us, as in that which God commandeth to his Church: 
Hutton, 〈◊〉 the Cross, ●●g 3.4 " That the Church is ruled by the spirit of Christ, who is the truth; and therefore her Traditions are true and holy: 
Hooker, ●ef. pag 28.  〈◊〉 That God alloweth men to do that which in their private judgement it seemeth; yea and perhaps truly seemeth, 
B. Roch. ●ermon at ●ampton ●ourt, p. 31.  that the Law doth disallow. § That unwrit ten Ordinances, aswell as written, are Divine and Apostolic in the constitution of the chiefest Office, and ministery of the Church.  
3. They do no further desire their freedom from the Prelates, & from that power which they have, than they shall be able to prove, that it is lifted up against the Doctrine and Kingdom of Christ our Lord.  
4. They leave their overthowe to God and the King; and do only by these premises labour, that that truth, which hath been amongst us long suppressed and afflicted, may come to light, and may be so honoured and freed at last, as God requireth that it should be.  
5. If the Callings of the Prelates be warrantable, and of Divine ordinance (as Bishop Barlow avoucheth in his late Sermon) than the yielding unto this Offer willbe a notable means to establish the same, and can no ways be derogatory unto it: for no Divine ordinance will fly or fear any such Trial. But if it be unlawful (as it will be supposed of all men to be, even in the consciences of the Prelates, if they shall refuse this Offer) them indeed this Trial can be no means to justify the Prelates, who ought in such a case either to give over their places, or at least to suffer those, that have their consciences persuaded of the unlawfulness of their Callings, to be free, even as Christ hath made them free both from them and their Government.    

9 OPPOSITION.  
This Offer proceeds from them who willbe satisfied with nothing. If they should have the Discipline granted them, and all that they desire, they would not stay there; that would not content them. At the first they stood upon a few Ceremonies only; after this they cried down with Bishops; and when they have their desire in this, then let the King look to himself.  
ANSWER.  

1. This is but a malicious surmise of that whereof there is no ground; the Propositions before set down making it more than manifest, that as the Ministers have not any the least intention to impeach the Royal dignity, so likewise they do much more advance the same indeed, than the Prelates do.  
2. The practice of all other Reformed Churches, enjoying the Discipline which is desired, confuteth this slanderous objection; in as much as they rest content under the same without seeking, or endeavouring, any vain or rebellious innovation.  
3. Though some Ministers have stood upon the Ceremonies only, yet many of them have from time to time witnessed vehemently and in special manner against the Prelacy, according as God hath opened their understanding in this point, though some of them at the first did not sufficiently consider how unlawful and unwarrantable it is: and this is no more prejudicial either to them or to the cause, than it was to the Apostle Paul for teaching that doctrine afterward, which at first he understood not: or to those now professing the Gospel, who in times past have been ignorant Papists, & enemies to the truth.  
4. The Ministers desire not that either the Discipline, or any thing else should be yielded unto them, or that they should have their wills satisfied in any thing, further than they are able to prove the thing (for want whereof they are unsatisfied) to be due unto them by the word of God. And so far forth they think it lawful for them, or any else, to show themselves unsatisfied: it being a grievous Sin for any, in matters of Religion and means of Salvation, to content themselves with less, than God will have them to be content withal. The Ordinances of God will content them sufficiently; and nothing will discontent them but to be deprived of any of the same, they all being ordinary means of Salvation. And is it not an Antichristian spirit, that would bind men to any other Content? If in their discontent they desire any thing that God doth not require them to desire, there may be as many means found then, as now, to bridle their desires.  
5. Their advising the King to look to himself, when Ceremonies & Diocesan Bishops are down, is a Scarecrow, fit to fright Daws away, then to hinder so wise a Majesty from yielding his furtherance to so Christian an Offer. The Ministers therefore do here again profess to all the world, that they no further desire the overthrow of the Prelates, than they shall prove that their standing is derogatory both to Christ & to the King; and that they take nothing from the Prelates, but what they give to Christ, his Church, the King, & the Civil Magistrates under him: the Prelates unjustly keeping that from them, which by the word of God is their due, and which the said Ministers are ready to yield unto them, before they desire to see the overthrow of the Prelates: who (we doubt not) will appear to be enemies (though in a mystery) to God, to the King, and to his people, even in their very Callings and Offices.    

10. OPPOSITION.  
Shall we hearken to the Offer of such as are not yet agreed amongst themselves what they would have? There are not two of them of one mind: and therefore it is to no purpose to hearken unto them. Let them first agree amongst themselves, and tell us what they would have, and then they shall be heard.  
ANSWER.  

1 They are all agreed already upon these points: that the Ceremonies are scandalous, and aught, by those that are in authority, to be removed; that the Ecclesiastical Government of other reformed Churches is more agreeable to the word of God, than the Government by Diocesan Prelates; that Pluralists, non-residents, and dumb Ministers ought not to be tolerated in any Christian Church; that it is fit we should conform ourselves to other Reformed Churches in our Liturgy, Ceremonies, & Discipline, then to the accursed Synagogue of Rome. Their differences are only about the manner of maintaining these points. Let them hearken to the Ministers in the things wherein they all are already agreed, and they will not trouble them with any disagreements: Yea, they shall find, that in their differences they will agree better than they would have them.  
2. If they disagree so among themselves, as the Prelates would bear men in hand, they have the less cause to fear them, & may with more hope of prevailing enter into this Trial with them. But the truth is, that their differences are neither half so many, nor half so great, as those that be among the Prelates.    

11. OPPOSITION.  
Either their Propositions are false, and sufficiently confuted by their own practice; or if they be true, then why do they joint to our Church, which is governed by the Prelates? why do they desire to execute a public Ministry under them? why do they not wholly with the Brownists separate, and get them to Amsterdam to their holy brethren there.  
ANSWER.  

1. The practice of the Ministers herein is no way contrary to their Propositions: & this is a most desperate shift in the Prelates, to press then herewith.  
2. They protest (to the shane of the Prelates, & to the testifying of their charitable love to those of the ministery, which are otherwise minded them themselves) that they are persuaded, that many of the Conforming Ministers are (notwithstanding the great defects, and corruptions in their calling and standing) true Ministers of jesus Christ, and endued with gifts from heaven for that holy function; And that the Churches which they teach (howsoever in their Constitution very defective and unperfect) are true Churches; whose willing subjecting themselves unto their ministery maketh the very outward calling itself of the said Ministers to be such as it is. And therefore so long as (their consciences being in the mean time vnconvinced of these their errors wherein they stand) God taketh not away their Ministerial gifts from them, and so long as their Churches cleave unto them (though in their entrance & continuance they were, and are guilty of much sin, in approving by Conformity and Subscription the jurisdiction of Prelates) they think it not just wholly to separate from them and their ministery, but are content, though with some grief and sorrow, so far forth to join with them in the worship of God, as they can without their personal Communion with them in those corruptions, which in their weakness they yield unto.  
3. If the Prelates shall still hold the things in question in such sort as of late they have done, & shall urge them so hotly as they begin; both the Ministers & many of the people willbe forced to leave their ordinary standing in these Churches. In which regard they humbly pray that they may be exempted from the Prelates, & may have liberty granted unto them by the King, to serve God according to his own will revealed in his word, without any human Traditions. As for that public ministery derived from the Prelates, besides that it cannot be entered into without yielding to corruption & sin, it is also very defective, &, to speak the truth, little more than a half ministery, if it be compared with the Pastoral Office commanded and commended unto us by the Holy Ghost. Which the Ministers discerning, and perceiving plainly that there is little or no comfort to be had in the exercising of such a ministery, as hitherto they have enjoyed they are bold to make their humble Suit to his Majesty, that they may be freed from the Prelates usurpation over them, and may be under the guidance & Censure of the Civil Magistrates; unless by such an indifferent Trial as is here Offered, the Prelates shall justify their Callings and Courses to be of God.    

12. OPPOSITION.  
A vain thing it is to yield to any such Offer. For who must judge on which side the truth is. They name none; And when they have been heard to oppose and Answer what they can, they will not stand to any man's definitive sentence, but will continue obstinate still.  
ANSWER.  

1. In desiring that the whole carriage of this intended Conference may be published, they make all the world to be judges thereof; even the Prelates and the Papists themselves, & all that shall read the same.  
2. They do not think it lawful in any matter of Religion, much less in matters of so great consequence, to settle their consciences upon the definitive sentence of any person absolutely: that is, so far as to renounce any thing which they have believed, because such or such judge it to be otherwise. For so they might both headily & wilfully betray the truth of Christ, and enthrall themselves to error, and also detract from Christ and his blessed word their proper right, and give it unto men. It should therefore content any Christianly affected man, that the Ministers are content to offer their Defence of these points to the view of all, to skan and to weigh them, and so far forth to judge thereof, as (if their reasons do not satisfy them) to give them leave to condemn them of error: which willbe a judgement heavy enough to them, if notwithstanding they shall still persist in their former opinions.  
3. It may please God, that by the evidence and force of those Arguments or Answers that shall be propounded, both sides may think themselves satisfied, and one side yield. If the Prelates have this grace to yield, than his Majesty & the State know best what they have to do in such a Case. If the Ministers yield, than the greatest matter that can be expected of them, is Submission and Conformity: which if they shall refuse, the Law is open; so that in this case there needs no Definitive sentence of a judge. It both sides rest unsatisfied, and continue persuaded still, that the truth is on their side, it were impious for either side in such a case to commit the absolute determination thereof unto the will and pleasure of any man or men whomsoever. And it were unjust for either side, to require judges either incompetent, or not indifferent. For as the Prelates might justly (except they would wilfully betray their own cause) refuse such to be judges, as have in any degree inclined more to the Ministers then to them; so may the Ministers in like manner as justly refuse to stand to the judgement and determination of such, as incline more to the Prelates then to them; much more of such, as have showed themselves main patrons and upholders of the Prelates, and adversaries to the Ministers. Sith therefore the Prelates can not set forth any person, or persons, to whom it is meet to commit the absolute determination of so great a cause, it were very unjust, and unequal, to bind the Ministers to stand to the judgement of those that are partial.  
4. It is needles to name judges: his Majesty, the Civil Magistrates under him, and the High Court of Parliament (though the Ministers should appeal from them) would in this case judge them, and their Cause, yea and are bound so to do. Whose judgement if it go against the Ministers, and it appear to be righteous; the more they shall neglect the same, and refuse to submit themselves unto it, the more gross & refractory they shall show themselves to be: and with the more honour and credit may the State join with the Prelates, in making and executing Laws for the suppressing of them, and their Errors; which is as much advantage as any Christian can desire over any Enemies of the truth. And what would the Prelates have more?     Prov. 19.21. 
Many devises are in a man's heart; but the Counsel of the Lord shall stand.  Math: 22: 21. 
Give unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and give unto God those things which are Gods.