A just and moderate Answer To a most injurious, and slanderous Pamphlet, entitled, An exact Discovery of Romish doctrine in case of Conspiracy and Rebellion.  
Wherein the innocency of Catholic religion is proved, and every objection returned upon the Protestant Accuser, and his own profession.   Maltese cross Psal. 57 vers. 1. 
Si veré utique, justitiam loquimini: recta iudicate filii hominum.  With licence of Superior.  

TO THE MOST EXCELLENT and mighty Prince, our gracious and dread Sovereign, JAMES, by the grace of God, King of great Britain, France and Ireland, defender of the faith.  
TWo things (most Gracious Sovereign) among the rest of chiefest regard, in terrene and human affairs, were ever apprized at the highest value: Life, the present being: Fame and Reputation, the beauty and splendour thereof: The first giving esse, aft●r non esse, to the greatest earthly Creature, the other maintaining in some sort, a per●ptuall life, and glorious living, when we be dead.  
Therefore, by how much the possessors of those dignities, be more popular, public, and greater in number, State, or pre-eminence: ●y so many degrees, unworthily and treacherously to be deprived of them, is more injurious, guilty of wickedness, and obnoxious to Restitution.  
Concerning the former; The late intended Conspiracy against the life of your Royal Majesty, (the Life, Union, Rule, and Direction to these united Kingdoms) so many Nobles, and Persons of esteem, was so heinous impiety, that nothing which is holy can make it Legitimate; no pretence of Religion can be alleged, to excuse it: God and heaven condemn it, Men and earth detest it: Innocents' bewail it, the Nocent and unhappy Delinquents themselves, perceiving how their Religion reproveth it, in repentance have lamented it: Protestants exclaim against it, and your dutiful, Religious, and learned Catholics, Priests, and others, which have endured most for their profession, hold it in greatest horror, and make it a subject of their grievous sorrow, that any of their profession should attempt so barbarous and unnatural cruelty, or practise any disobedience at all to your Highness.  
And will swear, protest, promise, and perform to your Majesty, whatsoever Loyalty, Obedience, and duty is due from a subject to his Temporal Prince, by the word of God, law of Nature, or hath be●ne used by the subjects of this Kingdom, to any your P●ogenito●s Christian, from the first to the last: acknowledge and tender to your honourable Counsel, and all Magistrates in civil causes, so much Honour, Reverence and Submission, and to all other Protestant subjects, like amity and neighbourly affection, as if they were of the same Religion, which we profess.  
Concerning the second, of public reproach, and defamation, (most worthy Prince) if it only concerned the Catholics of this Nation, although it be no easy question to prove, that men in such matters, and at such times, are masters of their fame: yet they could be content to bury it in their grave of oblivion with so many miseries which they have long sustained, for their holy faith; and to say with the Apostle, Maledicimur et benedicimus, persecutionem patimur et sustinemu●, blasphemamur et obsecramus: but when the Purgamenta huius mundi, and omnium peripsema, must be made the badge of all maintainers of that worship, and all be styled seditious and traitorous Persons, quite contrary to your Highness often Assertions, and public Proclamations; That all Catholic subjects to all foreign Princes, your Confederates, must wear that Livery, and their Sovereigns be attended with such servants; All Catholic schools termed Seminaries of rebellions: and so directly not only the reputations of all those Vni●ersities, Princes, and Prelates of the Church of God, but God himself (whose house it is, and whose honour can neither be given nor taken away) is thus condemned: as is set forth in a late pamphlett entitled, An exact Discovery of Romish doctrine in case of Conspiracy: Silence would be too suspicious, of neglect in many greatest duties, to God in heaven, his Church on earth, to your Majesty, and the whole Catholic world.  
Therefore I po●e wretch and sinner an unworthy member of that sacred body of Christ, and one of your highness obedient subjects, in all submission crave pardon, not only to make demonstrance of Catholics due and expected Loyalty, to your Sovereign Authority, and refute the frivolous objections of that Author: But with David against Goliath in the behalf of King Saul, and the people of God, to strike with his own sword, and return all and every of his deadly reasons, upon himself, and his own Profession.  
Which▪ as I may lawfully observe, by common consent of all, entreating of the law of conscience, in this case, being only to use our own right of just defence, and not to offend or defame Accusers, (which charitable exposition, I desire of all Protestant Readers:) So, if I had traveled no farther into that doctrine, then to the last printed book by your majesties Printer, of the late intended conspiracy, I might as easily perform it: for that Protestant author giveth it out as a general Rule & undoubted Maxim, to all professors of worship, to take arms, if their religion be in hazard: and that no private man could think his life more happily bestowed, than to fight pro Aris: which is greater liberty, than any opinion which our adversary can find among Catholic Writers, so by him attached of treason and rebellion. But he shall receive a more plain and plentiful recital, both of public positions and practices, from all his neighbouring Allies in religion, to prove his own profession, to be both Seminary and Granary of such provision.  
Which I am more enforced unto, because this discoverer, by so many, not usual Catholic Authors, alleged in his book, discloseth his inveterate malice against us, that he was now in his desired opportunity, delivered with joy of that, wherewith he had travailed so long in pain: or to renew in subtle m●nner, his old good affection to your Majesty, doth marshal you even now, (otherwise all his reason's be too childish) in the number of cruel Tyrants, Excommunicates, Apostates, and the infamous of all ages, not only Princes, but base persons. So that either for disloyalty to your Highness, or enured inflamed hatred unto us, or both, he can find no centre of his slanders, except your Majesty be m●de the man and mark, where at the penal canons and constitutions of holy Church, did point and level hundreds of years, before you were borne, ●r his religion received life.  
This is the miserable & distressed state, of many thousands your most loyal and loving subjects, (dread Liege) for their faithful duty to God, and a religion taught in this kingdom, and embraced by all your progenitors, and our ancestors, so many hundred years, from their first conversion: that every adversary may preach, and print against us, and make their challenges; as though either for ignorance we could not, or for distrust of our cause, we were unwilling to make them answer, or come to trial: when quite contrary, we have, often, earnestly, and by all means we could, desired to have it granted, with equal conditions, against the most selected and best learned Doctors of that religion.  
And at this present, when your chiefest Protestant Clergy, (Bishops, and others) is assembled, we most humbly entreat, this so reasonable a Placet; that although they will not (as we fear) easily consent to an indifferent choice, opposition, and defence in questions; yet, at the least, (to avoid the wonder of the world) they will be content, that we may have public audience, for those articles, opinions▪ and practise, for which we are so much condemned, and persecuted. If we shall not be able to defend or prove, any position generally maintained in our doctrine, to be conformable to those rules in divinity, which your Majesty, and the protestant laws of England (we can offer no more) have confirmed for holy, the canonical Scriptures, the first general councils, the days of Constantine, and the primitive Church; let the penalties be imposed and executed against us. If we perform it, or this petition may not be admitted, we trust, that both our office to God, and duty to Prince, is discharged in this point.  
Your royal Person, and that honourable consistory now assembled, or held in your doctrine, to be the supreme sentencer, even in spiritual business in this kingdom: we therefore hope you will not (in a Court from whence no appeal is allowed, and in matters of such consequence) proceed to judgement, or determine of execution, before the arraigned is summoned to answer, hath received, or refused trial, is, or can be proved guilty: for it is a Sages sentence: judicem & Aram esse idem; even in ordinary 
〈…〉. 3. Rhetor.  judges: because people injured or distressed fly to them both for refuge. And we humbly crave licence to say unto you, as Liberius, Pope of Rome, answered Constantius the Emperor, persuading 
Theodor. dialog. hist. trip, l, 5. c. 17  him to subscribe to the banishment of saint Athanasius, the great Grecian Patriarch, O Imperator, judicia ecclesiastica decet tam maxima proferri justitia. If we be condemned, & our cause be just, and religion true, it is God, and not man, against whom you proceed in sentence: if our profession be erroneous, and yet for consent with so many Nations, and so long continuance, it is left unpunished; you only pardon the frailty and ignorance of earthly men, and fight not with the heavenly.  
Deny not that to us, your ever true and obedient subjects, in a religion so ancient, which your colleged Princes, the King of Spain, and Archduke, do offer to the so many years disobedient Netherlanders, upon their temporal submittance, in so late an embraced doctrine. That which the Arrian Emperors of the East, permitted to the Catholics, (Bishops, Priests, Churches, toleration:) what the barbarian Vandals often offered, and sometimes truly performed in Africa; what the Turkish Emperor in Greece, and Protestant Princes in Germany, and other places allow to them of our religion, can be no singular offence, to grant unto us once in so many years, though our religion were untrue. It would be acceptable to all Catholic Princes, conformable to the examples of protestant Rulers, not unanswerable to your own princely piety, pity and promise, no disgust to any equally minded Protestant, or Puritan at home, a jubilee to us distressed; and (to answer all the discoverers quarrels in one sentence) a warrant of security to your Majesty, in all opinions against those terrors and dangers which he conceiteth: from which, and all others, of what kind soever, we most humbly beseech the infinite Majesty of God, to preserve your Highness, and send you, your Queen, and posterity, all happiness and felicity in heaven and earth.  
Amen.   

❧ A general Censure of this slanderous Pamphlet; proving, that no one Argument therein can conclude the Author's Intent.  

CHAP. I.  
THis Discoverer of Terrors and Dangers never before imagined, like unto the espial of King Alexander, which either 
Qu. Cu●●. in vi●● Alexand.  having his fantasy and interior powers distempered, or his external senses out of order, or both far from frameing right apprehension, and true judgement, brought word to his wise triumphant Emperor, that an army of enemies was approaching to assault him, when they were but a small company of silly Apes, imitating soldiers with a march on the Mountains, doubteth not to call such his deluded vision, An exact Discovery of Romish Doctrine in the case of Conspiracy and Rebellion: and a little after, A Plain Discovery of the Rebellious Doctrine of the Romish Church; and termeth Romish Schools (to use his own words) Seminaries of Rebellions, and telleth us, Popish Priests, as also their Adherents, be worthily executed for seditious and traitorous persons. Hitherto is the strange Discriall of this great Discoverer, not as yet yielding any Reason, but that we may think his brain distempered, conceiting Apes, for mortal Enemies, their sticks and Reeds for deadly wounding weapons. Therefore supposing, for his Reports of so unprobable things, he should be deluded as a man illuded, and strangely mistaken, except he pretended some strange and unusual Argument, for his rare Intelligence, falling into a second extremity, like a far travailer, giveth forth, that these wonders be collected out of the express dogmatical Principles, of Popish Priests and Doctors, and from their Public Positions and Practices, and accordingly entitleth every leaf, Romish Positions and Practices of Rebellion. What simply meaning mind would not be amazed with such a message, especially when he professeth these things to be collected, not without direction from Superiors.  
But, to overthrow his last Assertion; first, There is neither name of Author (the Current of time streaming for him) to the Pamphlet, nor Licence and Privilege of Impression, as all Books published by Authority by English Protestants ought to have: And therefore to be accounted a Libel.  
Touching the other, of proving his Intent by our own dogmatical Principles, and Public Positions, it is so impudent an untruth, That if all his falsely applied Authorities were to be admitted for Gospel, yet not one such dogmatical and Public Position or Practice, to the disgrace of our holy Religion, and to ratify his slanderous accusation, is registered in his whole Discovery, Except this Accuser will accuse and convict himself of treason, both with God and man, to indite his Majesty our gracious Sovereign 
Rat. 1. pag. 1. 2. 3. 4 5. & rat. 2. 3.  of highest disobedience to his King & Creator in heaven, engrossing him in the Catalogue of censured, excommunicate, and denounced Heretics, Apostates, Tyrants, and Usurpers: which if he intendeth to do, at his first entrance he hath committed a crime Laesae Maiestatis if the law of Q. Elizabeth be not dead 
Statut. 13. Eliz●b. ●a. 1.  with herself. If he will not be expounded in such sense, and to place all the honourable and inferior Magistrates, and Protestants also not in Authority, in that order, proportion of degrees observed (a paradox most monstrous, and not to be imagined by any learned Catholic) he warreth not against the Roman church, and schools, his aimed object; but against poetically or childishly feigned Prosopopeis', and Chimeres of his own creation; for against only such his Arguments have their force, against such as we esteem them, they are too foolish.  
Secondly, to give life to his feeble or dead objections, we must 
R●● 1. pag. 1. 2, 3. 4 5. 6. 7.  condescend at his high will and pleasure, not only that all Protestants of England are formal heretics, sentenced against, and censured, (all which we absolutely deny:) But that all penal decrees in the Canon and Papal law cited in his Treatise, are due and belonging unto them, which the whole Christian world will witness against: And that in no Kingdom where Protestants be planted, England, Scotland, Ireland, France, S●●●eland, Helvetia, Lorraine, Denmar●e, any part of Germany, Bohemia, Poland or any other they be practised as in force▪ or put in execution.  
Thirdly, we must give consent (against all Catholic schools) 
Rat. 2. pag. 9 10. 11.  that there is no difference between the chief spiritual power and pre-eminence which we give to Popes, and mere civil sovereign Authority over Princes, and all temporal things, when we only attribute the first, and not the second to the Roman See.  
Fourthly, we must not deny to this Discoverer, but if the Pope 
Rat. 4. pag 14. 15 16. 17. 18 19 22 23. 24. 25, etc.  commandeth Arms against our Prince (a metaphysical & needless fear to be put in practice) we would formally be conformed to such precept: yet when we give a true, real, present, and actual instance, that the same Papal Authority now commandeth all Catholics to perform all dutiful loyalty and obedience to his Majesty, (more than the protestant Clergy of England can justify for themselves) and quia Papa siciubet, et prohibet the contrary: it will be no satisfaction for good behaviour to this objector. These and more such absurdities must be yielded unto, if any one of his Arguments is to be respected. But I must needs 
All Protestants agree in disobedience to Princes of a contrary Religion.  put him in mind, that he hath beheld his visage too much in the glass of Wickliff, Husse, Waldo, Luther, Munster, Swinglius, Caluin, Beza, Knox, Cranmer, Ridley, Latimer, Sands, Rogesr, and all Protestants of all places, (as I will demonstrate hereafter) howsoever they varied in other questions, yet all jumping together in this, that Kings and Magistrates of a different Religion, are not to be obeyed, but contemned, contradicted, deposed, and not worthy to be accounted either Princes or men: And this coloured, bloody, and stained spectacle or speculum, hath so deluded his eyes, that he can see nothing but rebellions, seditions, and disobedience in professors of Religion, though never so holy and approved. But as we d●ffer from him & his adherents, in so many chiefest articles of Religion; so we utterly renounce both their doctrine and practice in this point.   

The first Reason against Catholics confuted, and returned upon Protestaats. CHAP.. II.  
I Will come to his particular Reasons: The first whereupon (as a most certain ground and foundation, he frameth the rest of his building) is registered in these words. Their general Assumption whereupon all their rebellious Positious are founded, is this; that all Protestants are heretics, and excommunicate. Whereby it appeareth by his own judicial decree, that if Catholics do not teach, that all Protestants are heretics and excomunicate, that then no positions which we maintain, are rebellious, because he telleth us all such are builded upon that Assumption.  
Wherefore to purge us of all these crimes, by the first sentence of this Accuser; I answer, this position (all Protestants are heretics and excommunicate) is neither a general Assumption in Catholic Religion, neither do I suppose that any one particular learned Catholic in this kingdom (yet such can best judge of their country case) doth or will defend this opinion, which he calleth our general Assumpsion.  
For first, there is not at this present one Protestant absolutely (than not all Protestants) esteemed with us to be in that ca●e, within the Dominions of our Sovereign, of what condition soever to my knowledge: neither is there danger thereof hereafter, except such wicked and slanderous writings (as this Disconerie) be made incitement and citations for such censures. For although many, or most of the opinions defended by the Protestants of England were condemned for heresies, both in the primitive and later days of the Church of Christ, in jovinian, Vigilantius, Aerius, Berengarius, Waldo, Wickliff, Husse, and others: yet it doth not presently follow, that all which imitate those doctrines should be termed Heretics, as the first obstinate Inventors, and pertinatious defenders of those novelties were. For according to the sentence of S. Thomas, Halensis, Silvester, Durandus, 
D. Th. 2. 2. q. 11. ar. 2. H●ll 1. p. q. 181. m. 1. §. 1. Durand. 4. dist. 13. ●. 5. art. 6 Syl. v. Haeres. n. 5. August. l. de utilit. Cre●. in princip.  and the common opinion of Schools, ignorance (even vincible) excuseth from heresy. And this is the doctrine of S. Augustine, who in his book de vtil●tate credendi writeth thus, He is an Heretic who for temporal Commodity, or Vainglory, or principality, either begetteth or followeth false Opinion, but he who believeth Heretics (the case of the major part of english Protestants) is a man illuded with a certain Imagination of piety and truth. And he affirmeth, that the first (whereof I hope England is not so plentiful) is an Heretic, and not the other. And against the Donatists he telleth us, that he which holdeth that of Christ which Photinus the heretic did, thinking it to be the Catholic faith (as 
August. l. 4 c●●. Donaust. c. 1●.  hundreds of thousands of ignorantly seduced Protestants do, which hear no other doctrine but ministers Sermons) is not yet an Heretic, except when the truth of the Catholic doctrine is made manifest, he will resist it. And Cardin all Allane himself 
Cardin. Al lib. ●●persec●●. An●●.  so often objected ●n ●his discovery, thus writeth of that holy father and this question. Beatus Augustinus a●monuit, decipi ab Haereticus quis di●itur, & Haeretu is credere, nec tamen propriè est Haereticus. He is not properly an Heretic, which is deceived of Heretics, and believeth Heretics.  
S●condly, by common consent of Catholic Doctors, both 
Adrian, quandl●●. 3. art, 1. Sylu. v. Hae●●s q. 2. Ga●r. 4 dist. 1●. q. 2. Alph. de Cast. Io. de tu●r. Clement. 1. ex●r. joh. 22. Bull. Martin. 5. ●etit. 1000 minis Answ of Oxford by Adm●nit. 1 & 2. parliam. C●●●. against ●. W. etc.  sufficient knowledge of the truth proposed, and obstinate pertinacy in not embracing it, wi●h such defence of the contrary, is required to Heresy: in which case the principal preachers themselves in England, which have so often changed their opinions, and did voluntarily submit they. Religion (both P●●●t●n●s in their millinery Pe●●t●on, and the Universities Protestant's in their Answer) to his M●iestie●●e●su●e, to be changed or continued and in essential point● and necessary ●●●●●ation as the Puritans have oft written, wi●● the cond●●●e them to have ●● faith ●t all, (true faith cannot be changed corrected) then to be obstinately addicted ●o their profession.  
Thirdly many defend that although a man desireth to be ignorant of the tr●th and so professeth heresy in ignorance, (though he sinn●●h grievously in such case) yet he is not to be accounted an Heretic.  
Fourthly, Ca●u● holds, that a man dou●●●●● in his f●●●h (
〈◊〉 l. 1●. de loc. ●. 9 ●● 4.  common and g●●●r●ll t●i●g with ●nglish ●r●t●st●nts) is not preperl● an Heret●●ke.  
Fiftly, all Heretics (as internal) be not subject to Cens●●● and Excommunication.  
Sixtly, before excommunication, no communication is forbidden 
〈…〉  with any, 〈…〉 objecteth from ●a●●●mitanus, that where the 〈◊〉 is noto●●on (s●ch as ●his 〈◊〉 us. Heresy 1.) 〈…〉 not any declaration of ●●● sentence of Excommunication: 〈…〉 absolutely against t●e greatest 
〈…〉.  general 〈…〉▪ by whose dec●●e t●e 〈◊〉 must be both so censured ●nd 〈…〉 which, consenteth Cunerns, Navarre, and others.  
Sixtly, also after such proceed, (except specially excepted) 
Concil. Const. Suares de Censur. gloss. c. Cum desideras de sent. excommun.  the case of wife, children, servants etc. bringeth exemption.  
seven, no Protestant, or heretic, or Archehereticke, not excommunicate by name (as none in England is) lieth subject to any penalty pretended.  
Object But it will be objected, from the second Reason, that Catholics hold the Pope head of the Church, to have a civil power also over Kings, and circa omnia temporalia; therefore he may both depose Princes, and command subjects to arm against them, once excommunicate.  
Resp. First, I answer concerning Priests, most maligned in this matter, that the canon Law itself is to the contrary, where be these words; De Episcopis vero vel quibuslibet Clericis quod nec sua 
Decret 2 pa●●. caus. 23. q. 8. De episcopis, etc.  authoritate, nec authoritate, Romani pontific● arma accipere valeant, facile probatur. Neither Bishops nor any Clerks may take arms either by their own authority, or the authority of the Pope of Rome. And reasons be added there, authorized by Gregory 13. alleged here against us in this Treatise. Therefore all of that order be absolutely freed from that jealousy, and may answer with 
Ambros▪ orat. contra Auxent.  S. Ambrose against Auxentius. Quid ergo turbamini, volens nunquam ius deseram: coactus re pugnare non novi potero dolere, poero flere, potero gemere, adversus arma, milites, Gothos quoque, lacrimae meae, mea armasunt, talia enim sunt manimenta Sacer●otis, aliter nec debeo, nec possum resistere. Therefore why are you troubled, willingly I never will forsake right, compelled I know not to resist, I may be sorry, I may weep, I may groan against Arms, sould●ers and the Goths also, my tears are my armour, for such are the defence of Priests, otherwise I neither aught, nor can resist.  
Secondly, I answer, if any man hold that opinion, of such a power over Princes in Popes, yet they will plead, it is more tolerable to defend such authority in one supreme Pastor and spiritual governor in the Church, whereof Princes be sheep, and not shepherds (as the late wise Lord Treasurer acknowledged of Queen Elizabeth, that she was Ouis, and not Pastor) then to commit the censuring of Prince's cases, to such seditious judges, and superiors, as Protestant both public positions and practices assign; by which, not only every Wickliff, Luther, Caluine, Cranmer, Knox, and such supreme men, but the artisans and basest people in every Eldership, may sit in judgement upon their Sovereign, Cite, Excomunicate and Depose him, even for ordinary offences, as themselves expound convenient for their own advantage, as I will allege from their public opinions hereafter.  
Objection. And if this man will instance that the Author of the book De justa abdicat. Henric. 3. teacheth and excomuni consensu, that it is lawful for a private man to kill a Tyrant. Answer. I answer, it is more than disobedience, for any subject in England to make such comparison with his merciful Prince: And yet whatsoever that private Author writeth, or this Disputer citeth from him, that opinion is not the common consent; but against, not only the common 
Alphons. Castr. contr. Haeres. v. tyrannus. Petrus Gregorius in fine 2. to. de Republ. Cune●us ●e offic. priecip. christian. Hentic. quodl. 6. q. 23. Turrec●. l. 2. c. 113. Couo●. Victor de potest. eccl. concil. 1. q. ● Palat. 4 D. 25. Turrect. l. 1. c. 87.  consent of Catholic authors, Alphonsus de Castro, Petrus, Gregorius, Cunerus and others, but against the general council of Constance itself, to which, all Catholics must conform themselves.  
secondly, I answer for all Catholics in general, to the main Objection, that Henricus, Victor, johannes de Turrecr, Covorwius and the common opinion of Schools do teach, that there is no such mere Temporal and Regal power in Popes, over Princes, and civil affairs; but a Supreme spiritual, as that is which they claim in temporals in ordine ad Spiritualia, and is not (to use this Disputers words) Acivill power Sovereign over Kings directly; but only a spiritual pre-eminence (the subject, object, office and end thereof being such) for the spiritual good and behoof of the church of Christ, committed to his Vicar and chief Delegate here on earth, by commission of feeding, governing, ruling, binding, losing, shutting, opening, and the like in holy Scripture, and authoritatively citeing, summoning, admonishing and censuring both sheep and other shepherds of our saviours flock.  
Yet thirdly I answer, that the defenders of this sentence do farther teach, that this jurisdiction and power against sheep or inferior shepherds; is not to be put in practice, but in cases of obstinacy, contempt, and incorrigibilitie in the offendor, and being only for the profit and utility of the Spouse of Christ, & his mystical body, it may not be exercised where greater loss, damage, and hazard, then good and profit is to ensue from thence. The cause must be just, the suggestion not untrue, the means not turbulent tending to destruction.  
Fourthly, the maintainers of this doctrine do not urge greater indignity, or defend any sentence more offensive (in equallingement) to any prelate▪ sheep, or shepherd, then to the chiefest shepherd under Christ, the Pope him●e●fe: for they all with one consent affirm, that in case of heresy (now in question) he 
〈◊〉. v. pa● 2. §. 4. palud ib. & ei●t. Turrecr. li. 2 sum. c. 100L. l 4 c. 18. Aug. de An●on. ●ast●. l. de just. haeret. ●●nit. ●ot. 4▪ d●●t. 12 q. ●. ●●tic. 2. Can. l. 4 de loc. c. vlt. Co●dub. l b. quaestion●r q. 11.  is either actually and really deposed, or to be deposed. The Canonists do hold he is ipso facto deposed, if he fall into heresy; with whom Io de Turrecrem. Augustin●s de Ancona, Castro, and other Divines consent, which Censure Wickcl●ffe and hi● Protestant successors did imp●●e upon Princes and temporal Magistrates, either for h●r●si● or any other ●rime. Others, as S●●us, ●anus, and Cordubensi● affirm, in that 〈…〉 ●o be deposed, And such ●● the discipline of the Church of God. that these men, and all Catholic schools (even in Rome itself) as confidently dispit th●s● q●estions, for wh●●●a●se, h●w and when, and by 
Panormita●. sup. ca● Significa●●i. Canonist in c. Simo P●●●.  whom Popes may be deposed, a● they do● either speak or write of the greatest privileges of th●t Apostolic See. And Panormitanus a Canonist, with others, i● so confident in this business, that they teach, a Pope may be deposed for any sin, that is scandalous to the Ch●●ch of Christ, if he be incorrigible.  
Fiftly, the present Professor● which handle this question between Pope's a●d Princes, do not hold any sin●ul●r opinion tending to the indignity or damage of any Protestant Regent, more than to all oth●rs in equal terms; b●● what is now by them maintained, was public doctrine before protestancy had either pr●nce or pe●ple to embrace ●t, and at t●i● ti●e do justify ●he like sentence concerning all Catholic Rulers, in squall balance of comparison, and ●hat openly without ●●proofe in th●ir own dominions.  
Sixtly, to give contentment to all that will not be contentious, or ●ff●ct to be singular in persecuting or domag●ng ●he Church of God. Th●●e Authors do not s●y, that ●he 〈◊〉 power ●● simp●y and ●●●olutely subject to the Papal and Sp●r●tuall authority, but in case of injuries offered, or great impediment of the spiritual▪ good, more pre-eminent than the temporal. And in such c●uses even in temporal affairs, and among such powers and Princes, injuries offered, and just right denied, or hindered, giveth a prerogative to equals iure belli, among Kings and civil Regent's, to recover their own, redeem their wrong, requited their injuries, where the offendor denieth to make requital.  
Therefore, seeing this Discoverer cannot find any such civil power sovereign over Kings challenged by Popes, and against which he so much inveigheth, nor any other more peculiarly intended against Protestant Princes, than all others in like proceed; let him draw his weapon against those by whom he is assaulted in this kind. First against the Canonists and the Legists even in England, and of the Arches, except they will dissent from the more received opinion of like professors: secondly against himself & all Protestant write s. Against the first, because (which is his case in question) they defend that the emperor is lord of all the world, insomuch that Bartholus the great Leg●s● affirms, 
Ba●thol. in extra●ag. ad rep. imen. gloss per venerab. Qui filii, etc.  that peradventure it is heresy to te●ch the contrary 〈…〉 (saith he) it is against the scripture, Exist ed●ctum à Caesare v● d●●●r●beretur or●is, where the whole wo●ld and Princes thereof were at his designment: And (which the Protestants allege for temporal Prince's supremacy) omnis anima potestatibus sublimiorjbus subdita sit: therefore (as he reasoneth) all Princes be subject to him, as the highest power. And in this case of Arms and death (which this man so often objecteth) the cause is more dangerous in respect, that in the whole papal and canon law of the Popes, there is no penalty of death against any heretic, or excommunicate, neither is such punishment to be inflicted by any spiritual judge, or executioner: But that kind of revenge or justice, is only 
Codic. haeret. leg. Adrian et Cod●c. de judaeis leg. Quicunque.  provided by the imperial and civil Constitutions, and by temporal Authority and brachium scecuiare to be put in practice.  
Lastly, let him battle against himself, and his Protestant 
Protestant's Religion of all others is the greatest enemy to Princes and Catholic worship the most favourable.  brethren, which of all people in the wo●lde, that ever were, or be, are the most guilty in these proceed, as I will at large demonstrate hereafter) and Catholics of all most innocent. For seeing all professors of Religion, Israelites, pagan's, Catholics, Protestants, and all others ever prescribed some means and manner to keep both Rulers and the ruled in order: of all people to whom that authority was attributed by any. The Popes of Rome (proportion of time and place cousidered) have been the actors of the fewest translations of titles in Princes. Not above four or five examples can be given in the whole christian world in above 1500 years, and not many excommunications from the first of phillippe the first Christian Emperor (as some suppose by the 
Eusch histor.  Pope of Rome) or of Archad●●s by Pope Innoc n●●us the first within 400 years after Christ; when the Prophets and Priests of 
Nice●hor. h●st. in Arc●ad.  jury deposed more in one Kingdom; and the excess of the Paans' is not to be recited. And the Protestants themselves since their original have deposed as many or ●ore, th●n all the Popes in to many years, and that only for Religion, when for that quarrel not one Prince in the Popedom hath lost his Diadem, nor any without common consent of the Christian world. For Protestants▪ I instance in the Prince of Geneva deposed; and in the King of Spain, and the present Archeduke in the Low Countries, expelled from their Right, the King of Polonia in Sweveland at this present in little better estate, the Queen Regent in Scotland so made a subject, and his majesties mother deposed, the Emperor denied his allowance of tribute for the Turkish wars, his Towns taken, and ●ept against him, the Duke of Lorraine, and others in the like predicament.  
And the violent attempts which they have undertaken, by rebellion against their Princes, for this quarrel of Religion, have been more, than all excommunications of Princes by Popes, for any respect what●oe●er; the particulars will appear in their proper place.  
And whence can all these impious practices proceed, with so general ap●l●●●e, but from their most impious and rebellious public position? you have heard before, that the process of Popes is such in this business that no Prince (except more wicked th●n any now living, or as unfortunate as some four or five in all the time of Christian●ty in the world) need stand in danger.  
Contrariwise, by Protestant religion, no sinner, or no King: 
Const. Concil. in a●● Wickcl. Lu●●●●. to. 6. pag. 〈…〉. Luth.  in Dan. Suingl lib. 4. Philipp. Nichol. fund●m. Caluin. Sect etc.  Luther denieth all obedience to Princes differing from him in Religion; calling them pilate's, Tyrants, Herod's, judas, and that his Protestants hands must be imbrued with blood in such cases. Caluin telleth, that ipso facto they are bereaved. If no permission of Swinglius doctrine, no Prince with him, and all be Martyrs that be slain in rebellion for that quarrel. The english Protestant 
Confer. 14. 1604 pag. 47. Luther. lib. captain. Babyl.  Notes (as his Majesty is witney) upon the Bible do not disallow the kill of a Prince in such cases. And this is to be perfect Protestant disciples of their Apostle Luther, who taught, no law can be imposed upon Christians, but as they will, all human laws must be taken away. Therefore saith Caluin, Beza, 
Test●tr ordin. Burg. in Reman sup. edict. Reg. Gall, Petr. Frar, or▪ contr. Sect. Defen● Reg. & Relig.  Athomannus, Spiphazius, and the rest of that holy Synod, that Kings, Queens, their children, and post●ritie (l●st Kings a●●se again) and all Magistrates must be put to death, and so every particular Protestant must be more than a Pope, an Emperor, or rather a god, to put Princes to death at their pleasute: and we must say with the Consistorian Protestants, not only ●uerie private man may be executioner of Princes: but teach, that it is necess●●ie to assign rewards for such murderers of Rulers; we must not call them Kings or Superiors▪ but Tyrants, Monsters, and not worthy of life. But more of this hereafter, in their general positions and practices.  
The rest of the penalties which this Author allegeth as belonging 
Catholics deny no temporal society o● duty to Protestants.  to the excommunicate, and such heretics, and which he writeth, that Catholics do teach, are due, and to be extended upon all Protestants of England, be thus recited: to spoil Protestants of their goods; deny tithes to the Ministers; not paying debts to Creditors; servants not d●t●full to Masters; wives not benevolent to Hu●bands; Parents' disinheriting Children; children not obeying Parents'; kinsmen to kindred, and countrymen to their Country to be unkind. But I have answered before, that these societies are not to be denied to the Protestants of England, because we do not est●eme them in that case of heretics, and excommunicates. Secondly the world is witness for us, and against this Obiector, that we as truly and sincerely perform these communications and respects to our country protestants, as they themselves, and rather in more ample manner. And although Tithes be due to spiritual Ministers, for Sacraments and holy things, which we do not receive from them, yet we do not withdraw 
Concil. Const. in artic. Wickcliff.  their payment to the protestant Clergy, neither say as their martyr Wickliff did; that they be but alms, and may be taken away at princes pleasures. Thirdly I answer, that those canonical punishments he citeth against the censured, were not of purpose ordained against his protestancy; but the decrees of such proceed may be great-grandfather to that Religion: not now in use either in this kingdom, France, Helvetia, Sweveland, Denmark, and most part of Germany, or in farther circuit. And if the penal constitutions of the general Council of Trent representing Pope, Prelates, Princes, and the whole church of Christ, are not yet after forty years continuance received in the recited Provinces, or kingdoms: There is not so great danger, that those Papal pains will ever give to this man so much cause of so outrageous exclamations. They were long before the birth of protestancy, provided for countries and people whence heresies had not entered, not where such opinions have pre-eminence. And if it should please his Majesty to restore the Catholic faith in England, yet there is not peril that protestants should fall to such fears of these penal constitutions to be admitted: penalties are not so soon imposed, their nature is to be restricted and not dilated. If so many other kingdoms under Catholic Regent's, France, Sweveland, Bohemia, Polonia, Transiluania etc. do not consent to their admittance: This Island one of the last by situation, and so long at variance with the Roman Church, is not likely to be the first in that, wherein nature desireth to be the last. We have not now an other Queen Marie, Inheretrix to the Crown, to be joined in marriage with a potent Prince, in whose Dominions they be in force; simbolizing with husband, conformity in country discipline is never like to breed you scruples in this behalf. And yet in such a metaphysical case (nemo laeditur nisi à seipso) though you have anowed to be an heretic and excommunicate, you must be cited, and admonished before censure, and obstinate before and after, or else your danger is not deadly.  
Thus I have proved at large, as my violent and distressed leisure would give me allowance, that the chiefest building of all these slanders against us, is ruinated and overthrown; that we do not esteem all Protestants for heretics and excommunicate, as he pretendeth: neither that they are subject to such penalties, as he allegeth; that they are not censured, or as such to be deprived of any civil society, communication, their goods, lives, liberties, dignities, honour, homage, fealty, subjection, duty, love, or any thing precious, their proper and peculiar; but contrariwise to enjoy and possess those privileges, in as ample manner and freedom, as if they were of the same Religion which we defend.  
Answer to the first Reason. Now I will with brevity answer to his particular pretended reasons, grounded upon the general before confuted: And first to his first syllogism, or rather Sophism; the mayor proposition whereof is already overthrown, and only requiring repetition, is as followeth: They who by their slanderous doctrine make all Protestants (in their common censure heretics) so odious and unworthy of any civil or natural society, must necessarily be adjudged seditious, and intolerable among the Protestants: My answer is absolute before, that no learned Catholic so reputeth the Protestants, or any one Protestant of this kingdom; but attributeth (or aught so to do by his Religion) as much terrene honour, homage, duty and love to our King, his honourable Counsel, and all in Authority in their degrees, and unfeigned affection to the rest, as if they were of the same faith and profession in Religion.  
Then the minor proposition (if the same medium be kept) must needs be false, which is this: But the Romish Seminaries and jesuits do brand all Protestants with detestable crimes; thereby to deny them all civil and natural Respects. Ergo. I answer, If the first part of this second proposition, be understood of the wickedness of many English Protestants, not only condemned of their brethren 
Admonit. 1. & 2. Parliam. perit. 1000 Minist. Cartw. against I. W.  Puritans, but by themselves confessed, and their own laws so convicted: it proveth them for such; but proveth not sedition, but true and loyal dealing in Catholics, which do not say with Protestants, masters and martyrs, Wickliff and Husse, and their brothers 
Concil. Con●●. i● Wickl. artic. Io. Husse, etc.  Waldensians; that wicked men in Magistracy be deptived of Rule and jurisdiction: but against their own fellows in profession, defend their offices, power, authority and pre-eminence.  
If the Discoverer will have the force of this proposition to remain in the later sentence, (thereby to deny them all civil and natural Respects) It is both unproperly spoken, and slanderously objected against Catholics; which neither deny to Protestants in Authority, or others, any civil or natural Respect, for their crimes and sins, neither charge any one amongst so many millions, with Canonical demerit or impediment of such respects.  
Therefore first, Such opinions of some private Catholics, Andreas ●urg. Mr. Rainolds, D. Gifford, Mr. Wright. that Protestants hold no article of faith, Caluinismeis Turcisine, no better than Turkism; compared to Atheism, is no more than other 
Protestancy especially of Caluine and the English Protest described by their ●●ll●wes. Nichol. ●● fun●●m. De●●n. & Collig. Tub●●g. in praesa.  Protestants ch●●dge Caluin with. And what is this to the Protestants of this kingdom, except they mean to bring Arrianisme, Nestorianisme, and turcism into the world, as Philippus Nicholaus a learned protestant minister, and the protestant Deane and College of ●ubing write of Caluin, & ●w●nglius. The recited protestant hath written a whole Book of that Subject, giving it for Title, Fundamentorum Caluinianae Sectae cum veteribus Arrianis et Nestorianis communium Dete●●io. And yet the Turks Alcoran being made by Arrians and Nestorians (as the Preface there recounteth) 
Praefat. sup.  calvin's doctrine is proved by him, to agree with them in 17. or 18. chief articles. And in the seventh Chapter he plainly 
c. 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7 8. 9, 10 11, etc. s●●r. Cap. 7. supr.  writeth, that these Casuinists and Swinglians will not be quiet, until they have brought Mahumetisme and turcism into the West, as by the Arrians and Nestorians it came into the East. And among all people is most jealous of the Sacramentary Brabenders, Frankes, Heluetians, English and Scots in this behalf; and affirmeth, that Arrianisme, turcism and Swinglianisme, be the mother of Antichrist. And he bringeth in Luther prophesying (as 
Cap 9 ●upr.  he calleth it) that the Sacramentaries would never cease, until they denied Christ to be God, which M. Willet, D. Fulke, and others 
Will. Synops. contr. gene●. 19 Fulke in novo Testamento. Conci 1. Nicaen. in Symbol. condil Ephes. Const●nt. 1. H. ●rought. Ad●erus. o● Colup. an. 1604. Will. Antilog. Aduertism. sup. pag. 2. 3  have almost f●lly effected, denying Christ to have received his substance of his Father, or that he is Deus de deo, God of God, as the first general Counsels have defined.  
I will next allege Mr. H. Broughton a late english Protestant writer in the last year, and a man most highly commended by the great recited Summist, in his new born antilogy; who telleth his Protestant Brethren, or rather Fathers (he speaketh chief to the Bishops) in England, that their Translation of Scriptures into english is such; that it causeth millions of millions to reject the new Testament, and to run to eternal flames. In his second Chapter he challengeth their public translation, of perverting the holy text of the old Testament in eight hundred and eight and forty places. He telleth the late Archbishop of Canterbury, that he might with as good learning have subscribed to the Alcoran, as consent with such Protestants, as he did. He plainly writeth these words: Christianity denied in England by public Authority. He telleth the Bishops, that they betray the Gospel to the jews, and agree with the enemies of our Lord. Their Bible is inferior to the Koran. The bishops notes betray our Lord, and Redeemer, and befool the Rocks of Salvation. They are the very poison to all the Gospel. The Libyan sands may aswell be reckoned, as bilson's (the Bishop of winchester) Heresies. He hath a mind to be f●mous for millions of errors. And speaking in his own person saith thus: I gave I. C. (so he calls the late protestant Archbishop of Canterbury) the Anathema, Maranatha. No doubt but such a man would excommunicate a King, if he had come in his way, at that time.  
The admonition to the Parliament written with no small consent, 
Admonit. patl.  useth these words. No man in whom there is any spark of grace or conscience, can live in the commonwealth of England, whose inhabitants be all Infidels, and they be all Infidel▪ that go to their churches. archbishops and bishops government is both Antichristian 
Admonit. 2. pag. 25. 33. Suppl. vers. 56.  and devilish. Antichrist is among them. It is traitorous against the Majesty of Christ, It is accursed. It is an unlawful, false, and bastardly government. It shall be easier for Sodom and Gomorrhe in 
Admonit. 2. pa. 3  the day of judgement, than for the court of Parliament, where the Protestant Religion was confirmed. There is no right Religion established 
Admonit. 1. pag. 2. 32.  in England. I cannot for want of time, and need not for lack of witness, recite more testimonies in this business. These be sufficient for Catholics excuse, and to return the Argument upon Protestants. And let this Obiector understand, that these men which be so well conceited of his doctrine, and together teach, that all such sins, and less, deserve excommunication in what person soever, with the penalties thereof; and that they are deposed from their Seats by such offences, may justly come within the compass of his Conclusion, and Ergo: for by his own allowed mayor proposition, whosoever do make Protestants so odious, and unworthy of any civil etc. is se●●●ious, and intolerable among Protestants: But as I have proved ●●●●●●estants themselves, Protestants do so, or be such, or 〈…〉 are so to be esteemed by this Reasoner.   

The second Reason answered, and returned upon Protestants. CHAP. III.  
THe second Reason is contained in these words; Whosoever do profess any civil power sovereign over Kings, whether directly or indirectly, are to be accounted seditious. I would wish him to except the Emperor of the Princes of Germany, and such as be subject to the Empire, & such cases. Then to pass over the Turkish regiment, I say transeat maior for Christendom: And thus I frame the minor. But all Protestant writers do ordinarily both teach and practise this Doctrine, as I have proved before, and will more plentifully perform hereafter. For this place I only instance in this united kingdom, Britain, and principally in two Queen Maries.  
Against her that reigned in this part which we inhabit, it was 
Protestants seditious by this man's Argument  the public consent of the chiefest Protestant Bishops and Divines, Cranmer, Ridley, Latimer, Sands, Rogers, and the rest, principal Preachers, That she might be deposed, and not only she, but her sister Queen Elizabeth, a Protestant, and the family of his Majesty should be defeated. And was publicly put in practice both with wit and weapons, to the uttermost of the greatest Protestants power, the Dukes of Northumberland and Suffolk, and many other of great estate. And this not only contrary to the law of God, and the express Statutes of this kingdom, but their own oath to the Lady Mary when she was Princess in her father's life. The public practice also of Protestants in the attempt of sir Thomas Wyatt, warranted by the Protestant Clergy, with divers others in the short regiment of that Queen, may be given for instance. Therefore let no man object hereafter, that the Positions 
Protestant's may not condemn their Puritan Brethren.  and Practices of Rebellion proceed only from the Puritan Protestants; for such pure protestancy had not audience in England at that time, but the defenders there of were called New upstart arrogant spirits by Latymer, and such Protestants as I 
Latim. Serm. before King Edward the fixed.  have condemned guilty in this kind. And yet the present Protestant Writers of England, which teach, that the true Church can not err in things essential to true Religion, and necessary to salvation, and communicate in Sermons, Sacraments, Doctrine, and subscription to articles (the very notes of the Church in their proceed) cannot condemn these traitorous and rebellious positions and practices in Puritans, for great and damnable offences in Religion, or impediments of Salvation: therefore by this disputers Argument, they are to be accounted seditious.  
Now I will recite his second proposition against us, which is this. But all Popish priests do profess a double prerogative over Kings: democratical and Monarchical: namely, both people and Pope: ergo: To the Pope's Authority I have already sufficiently answered, and will demonstratively prove farther hereafter, that as it is defended by catholic doctors, it is far more favourable and defensive to Prince's titles, than either doctrine or practice of Protestants, or any other professors of Religion, whereof I have also entreated before. Concerning his conceit of Catholics defending a democratical prerogative in the people over all Kings: (so be his words) It fighteth with his own assertion, and present position of the Pope's Monarchical prerogative over all Kings (which likewise is his sentence.) For where there is a Monarchy, and Monarchical power or government in one, there is unpossibillitie of a Democracie and democratical Power and Regency in the people: otherwise these propositions be true: Kings be subjects to subjects, and subjects be Kings of Kings, servants be masters to their masters, Masters be servants to their servants, Fathers be children of their Children, and Children be fathers to their Fathers: and the like relations must be inverted by this Logicians Argument.  
But let us hear what public Positions he will bring from our Writers, to prove our opinion of a democratical power in the people over Princes, which I have confuted by his own proposition. He only citeth the Author de justa abdicat Henric. 2 to say that Maiestas Regni est in populo, potius quam in persona Regis: That D. Stapleton affirmeth, people are not ordained for the Prince: but the Prince for the people: and Mr. Rainolas to call a King a creature of Man's Creation: the like he citeth out of Dolman. All which in equal sense his Majesty himself in open Parliament doth not so much seem to dislike; especially in vacancy of a King or the original of kingdoms, of which cases those Authors 
The king's speech Parli. 1.  do principally entreat. And in such circumstances I demand of this Obiector, whether there ever was, or could be a King, and Ruler over people, where there was no people to be ruled, or consent to be ruled. But people both were in the beginning without kings, and made election of divers kinds of regiment, as they thought fittest and most secure for their defence, and government in peace: some Monarchical, some aristocratical, others democratical: although none made election of a Monachy by one, and Democracie by the multitude at once in one Commonwealth, as this simple Disputer did argue before against Prince's titles; for that is unpossible, as I have made demonstration. And his majesties words be these: Although a Kingdom and 
The king's speech supped.  people be Relata▪ yet can he be no King, if he want people and Subjects: but there be many people in the world that lack a head, as when Regal Lines be extinct, people be yet without Kings; but not e contra: So where regiment passeth by election. In Polonia at the death of every King, the case is such, because that Kingdom and principality goeth by voices: So in Venice: So in the Empire by the seven Princes, called Princes electors, supplying the people's suffrages, and consents. And this the Discoverer 
Rat. 3. infr.  himself hath remembered in framing his next Reason, wherein he maketh mention of Election, and calleth a seditious to hinder the right thereof. But slanders and contradictions be neither wilful wickedness, nor unlearned ignorance in this Accuser. How the Protestants, both clergy and people, claim Sovereignty over Princes, is spoken before, and often proved in this Treatise.   

The third Reason confuted, and returned. CHAP. FOUR  
THe mayor Proposition of his third reason, is; Whosoever upon any pretended Supremacy, whether of Pope or people, do deny the necessary right of Election, or of Succession of Protestant Princes, are to be holden amongst all Protestants, seditious: his Contradiction in this against the former reason, I have spoken of in the last Argument. And for this present, I grant this mayor, and make this my minor: But Protestants, and English Protestants, 
Protestants are seditious by this Argument.  do deny the necessary right of Election, or Succession of Protestant Princes: ergo; the minor is proved before in Cranmer, Ridley, Latimer, Sands, Rogers, and the Dukes of Northumberland, and Suffolk, with their Protestant Preachers and forces against the Succession of Queen Elizabeth, a Protestant, and (though then not borne) his Majesty a Protestant King. I add further, that his highness title was expressly contradicted, and written against of purpose, in a book to that end, by Hales, (a companion to Knox) an English Protestant; to which, no Protestant (to my knowledge) did ever give answer, or denial. But many Catholics confuted it, as the Catholic Bishop of Rosse, in Scotland, and three Catholics of distinct professions in England; S●r Anthony Browne, Knight, and judge of the common Law, Doctor Morgan, a Divine, and Doctor Mytch, (or like name) a civil Lawyer.  
Now let us hear his second proposition against Catholics, Thus it is: But all Popish Priests, do utterly abolish the title of Succession, in all Protestant Princes, etc. go, This he would prove against all Priests, because Toilet, (and conformably to him, Doctor Stapleton, Master Raynolds, Symancha, and the Author of Philopatre) writeth Nulla est Imperatoris, aut Regis Electio, si cum Eligitur, excommunicatus est. The Election of an Emperor or King, is none, if he be excommunicate when he is chosen.  
I answer: First, here he contradicteth himself again, making election and consent of the people, an essential thing to Prince's titles. Secondly, let all be true which he citeth, and that they so teach: yet, if five particular men could make a general council, and their sentence be termed a public position; yet they speak only of a Prince, excommunicate before his Election; which case is not now in rerumnatura, much less in England. His Majesty was not excommunicate before his Election, neither is he now, but is both elected and settled in his throne, both without any contradiction of the Pope, and with his jubet of all obedience, and prohibet of denial thereof. All the Catholics of this Kingdom, applauded it as much as Protestants. And his union and league with Catholic Princes and people abroad, is sufficient answer, that this is a malicious slander of holy Priesthood; and proveth Catholics innocent, Protestants guilty, and this man an unjust accuser. 
The Argument returned upon Protestants, with a recital of their seditious doctrine   
But for brevity, to pass over foreign Protestants in this place, I will put this disputer in mind of his brethren's dogmatical principles and positions, in this united Kingdom. The Protestant Writers and Preachers of England defended, that Wyatt was no Traitor to Queen Mary. And thus they wrote expressly; It is lawful to kill Kings, and both by God's law, and man's law, Queen 
Goodm pag 103 obed pa. 99 113. Goodm. pa. 99  Mary ought to be put to death, (what Priest of England did ever so write, speak, or think of any Protestant his Sovereign?) she was a tyrant, a monster, a cruel beast. And yet the purer sort of Protestants affirmed of Queen Elizabeth, (as his Lordship of Canterbury 
Hay an. pag. 13 15. 23. D●ing. poli●. p●g. 133. 134. sup.  witnesseth) That she was worse than her sister Many, and they more suppressed by her, then by the other. They did write; That she was not to be obeyed, being against their proceed, and openly moved the greatest Sub●egents in England, to take arms against her; affirming, if they 
Suppli●a●. to the gover. of Wales pa. 16. 36, 37, 38, 39 D●ng. pos●t. lib 4 e. 3▪ 4 Goodm p. 144. 145. Obed. pag 110. Knos. hist. pag. 37 ●. Obed. pag 99 103. 104. Goodm. pa. 99 Buchan. i●●. ●●g pag. 40. 58 Obed. pa. 111  refused it, they ceased to be Magistrates. These also ensuing, be more of their holy dogmatical principles. Evil Princes, aught by the law of God, to be deposed, and inferior Magistrates ought to do it chiefly: It is lawful to kill wicked Kings: It were good that rewards were appointed by the people, for such as kill tyrants, as commonly there are, for those that have killed either wolves, or bears, or taken their whelps. The people have the same power over their King, that the King hath over any one person. judges ought by the law of God, to summon Princes before them, and to proceed against them, as against all other offenders: the people may arraign the Prince: the Ministers may 
Buchan. pa. 62 Cartwr. replic. 2. pag. 65. Obed. pag. 115. 116. Bucha. p. 70.  excommunicate him: any Minister may excommunicate the greatest Prince: he that is excommunicate, is not worthy to enjoy any life upon earth. Whereby is evident, the monstrous dissimulation of this people, which sometimes, for their advantage, will not be scrupulous to deny, that with other articles of their religion, and the chiefest, and to say; that they only claim power to excommunicate, not to depose and kill Princes. And to testify how easily, 
Suru. pretend. holy D●●cipl. pag. 283. 284. Buchan. pag. 6 13. Obed. pag. 25  and for what ordinary offences Princes may be thus entreated, the present Protestant Archbishop of Canterbury is witness, that fornication, drunkenness, swearing, cursing, fight, chiding, brawling, breaking of the Sabbath, wanton and vain words, and the like, be sufficient incitements and causes of such proceed with them. And they tell us further; That the people are better than the King, and of greater authority: the people have right to bestow the Crown at their pleasure: the authority which Princes have, is given them from the people, and the people may take it away again, as men may revoke their Proxies, and letters of Attorney.  
Now I would demand of this objector, whether they be members of the Roman Catholic Church, or the pillars of his Protestant Congregation, that congregateth and gathereth together such monsters as holy children, which teacheth a double prerogative over Princes: one in the people, when inferior Magistrates, and not Magistrates may, (and must by their doctrine) depose Kings and Sovereigns: and likewise their ministry, (as before) hath as ample, or a more pre-eminent authority. Which also concluded from these English Protestant principles; If Magistrates transgress Gods laws themselves, and command others to do 
Goodm. pa. 119. 139.  the like, then have they lost that honour and obedience, which otherwise their subjects did owe unto them, and ought no more to be taken for Magistrates, but to be examined, condemned, and punished, as private transgressors. When Magistrates do cease to do their duties the people are as it were without officers, and then God giveth the sword into their 
Pa. 185. 180. 184  hands.  
And such was the universal practice of all protestants (especially Calvinists) in all places of their holy preaching, Germany, Helvetia, Denmark, France, England, and Scotland, with others in fo●mer times: and at this present, the Protestants in Hungary, Transiluania, Sweveland, and the Low Countries, in actual sedition and rebellion against their Sovereigns, Emperor, King, and Princes, are instance.  
Concerning that spiritual supremacy, which the laws of England 
The King's supremacy denied by all Puritans, and e●ther den●ed, or doubted of by all english protestant writers.  atrribute to his Majesty, it can be no question, but all Puritans do deny it; which not only teach a superior power, both in people and Ministers, to which the rest of the Protestants of the same congregation, (as before) must needs consent: But also in this regard, that the government of their Eldership, or Bresbitery, (incomposible with Prince's Supremacy) is the chiefest article of their religion, and distinctive note of their reformed Church.  
Then to come to the present Protestant writers, an● their designments, the Archbishop of Canterbury is the man which maketh 
Suru. of pre●, Di●cipl.  relation, that this was a common proposition: Princes have no more to do with matters of the Church, than the Ministers have with the affairs of the Commonwealth. And there it is alleged▪ that such government by Princes, is worse than by the Pope, for divers reasons 
Pa. 25● 253. 254 255 ●●6 etc. sup.  there recited, and not confuted by any Protestant: I will recite the sentences of the principal.  
Protestants of this time, Doctor Fulke in plain terms acknowledgeth, 
D Fulke hebr. c 13 ●ect 9 1. pe●r. 2. v. 13. ●●ct 5. joh. c. 21. 1. petr. 5. Mat. c. 16. Bell. mo●iu. lib. 2. fol. 78, 79. 80. 81 Suru. part. 3. c. 10 pa. 426. & 1. part. pag 34. Whit●ker contra Bellar controu. 1. q 8. D. 〈◊〉. li. de council.  that Emperors and Kings, own obedience to the Clergy, and cannot prescribe lawe● of Religion to Bishop●, by their judgements. Master Bell writeth the Ecclesiastical affairs to be in the Clergy, as to decide controversies, and that the King hath only charge and authority, to command the Ministers to preach, and giveth him no definitive sentence. Doctor Whitaker is all for the private spirit, and bringeth divers reasons▪ all peculiar for that purpose. Such also is Doctor Su●liues sentence; and yet he addeth, that general Counsels are absolutely necessary: then Kings judgements not sufficient: And a general Counsel (none yet among them) necessary b●fore their religion may be approved. Master Hooker, and Doctor Covell, make the Ecclesiastical power supreme 
Hooker l. 5. eccl. Polit c. 77. D. Covel. c. 4. Defence of Hooker pl. Innoc c. 1. D. Dow. ep●st. ded●c. count Bellat. Bills. tit. li. true. Differ. Willet Synops. controu 7. 9 1.  in such business, and the Temporal, to be dependent and subordinate. Doctor Downam assigneth the Prince's office to maintain the truth, supposed to be otherwise determined. Bishop Bilson saith; that the Princes lawful power is to command for truth. Master Willet telleth us; that the Prince in his kingdom is neither the mystical head, nor ministerial head, but a politic head of the Church, and to see that every member do his office and duty; and he useth these words: Neither do we give unto the Prince absolute power (than no supremacy) to make ecclesiastical laws. And his Majesty is witness, that many other Protestant 
Confer. 14 jan. an. 1603. p. 82. 83  Preachers before him, were content to pass over that title with silence, which they would not perform in such audience, if in opinion they did maintain that supreme ecclesiastical prerogative in Princes. And to add one former example more: Doctor 
●. So●e against Barrow & Greenwood, etc. p. 17. 18  Some writeth thus: The greatest Prince whatsoever, is to obey such as teach them out of God's book. And doth not disallow this sentence in such sense. From this ohedience there is no exception nor exemption of Kings, nor Princes, be they never so great, if they have souls, and be Christian men, they must be subject to some Bishop, Priest, or other Prelate.   

The fourth Reason confuted, and returned CHAP. V  
THe fourth Reason is thus delivered. When the King is established in his Throne by common consent of the Kingdom: (here also is a contradiction to his second reason, which doth not allow of such consent) Whosoe'er shall manacle the hands of his subjects, detracting all obedience, may justly by order of law be challenged and condemned for a disordered and rebellious person. This is the first proposition, 
The Argument returned upon Protestants  which I grant unto, and thereby I frame this second: But ordinarily Protestant preachers and professors do thus manacle the hands of Subjects, and detract all obedience as is most manifest in their public positions and practices before, and more amply to be recited hereafter: Ergo: they may justly by order of law be challenged and condemned for disordered and rebellious persons.  
Let us hear the rest of his syllogism: All Popish priests, saith he, 
Priests cleared, and proved innocent.  do dissolve the oath of obedience to all Protestant governors: Ergo, How slanderous and false this assumption is, I have proved before; and the dutiful behaviour of Catholics in all parts of the world to their Protestant Princes, not any at this present with consent of their priests denying obedience, (the case of Protestant Ministers and Subjects in diverse places, being in contrary practice and experience,) giveth condemnation to his Assertion. Secondly, all the Authorities which he bringeth from Cardinal Tollet, Massovius, and others, private men, entreat of such as be nominatim excommunicate. In which state there is not any one Protestant governor at this time; neither can any just fear thereof be reasonably apprehended, by the Pope's general proceed in this behalf, except any Protestant prince (which God forbidden) should be incited by such unchristian spirits as this Discoverer seemeth to be possessed with, to exceed all others in persecuting Catholics, or offering indignities to the church of Christ. Thirdly, I answer, that the opinions of Tollet, Massovius, Panormitane, Gregorius de Valentia, Bannes, and the Author of Philopater (all the private Writers he aleadgeth in this place) though they did approve (as they do destroy) his conceit; yet such private men can neither make a dogmatical principle, nor public position, by which his promise was to make probation. And in this his affirming, That all priests do dissolve the oath of obedience to all Protestant Governors, the Authority which bindeth them all to such opinion, can be no less, than a dogmatical and public Doctrine, And these may also suffice for his next objections, from the practice of Pope Gregory 7. Pius 5. and Gregory 9 To whom I farther answer in particular.  
And first to Gsegory the 7. who as this man urgeth, absolved all from obedience to Excommunicates. I answer for all Catholics in general: That this nothing concerned Protestants, than not thought of in the world, neither any heretics (than not reigning) 
Fox to. ●. Mon. in Greg 7. Will. Antil Genebr. Chron in Greg. 7. Plate in Greg. 7.  but only such as he had other quarrels and contentions against.  
But he urgeth the gloss upon Gregory the ninth, to have both excommunicated all heretics, and to have absolved subjects from their obedience, and citeth for his authority, Greg. 9 Pont. lib. 5. Decret. tit. 7. Cap. 5. glossa. I answer that in the place alleged 
Decr. per Greg. 13.  there is no mention of any such matter, or any thing like unto it: only there is cited the African Council in these words. Si quis Episcopus heredes instituerit extraneos à consanguinitate sua, vel haereticos etiam consanguineos aut Paganos praetulerit saltem post mortem ei Anathema dicatur, atque eius nomen inter Dei Sacerdotes nullo modo recitetur. And this Canon both for substance and antiquity opposeth itself against him.  
Lastly, he brings again the Bull of Pius the fift against Q. Elizabeth. To which, answer is made before: whereto I add, that many grave and learned men have affirmed the information of the case of Queen Elizabeth to the Apostolic See, whereupon that censure of excommunication was awarded against her, to have been untrue. And that Pius the fift then Pope, and inflictor thereof, an holy man, bewailed the proceed upon such suggestion. And that many Catholics of both conditions, were both sorry for the censure, & it was defended by D. Sanders, D. Br●stow or any other English writer, rather wishing the controversy betwixt two Superiors th'one temporal, th'other spiritual, had been reserved to the high Tribunal in heaven (than so subject to many jealousies) had been so prosecuted in earth: among which, Cardinal Allane writeth of that matter in these words. Hoc tamen scimus 
Card. Allen. ad per. ●cu●.  multos Catholicos illud factum agre tulisse, optasseque omninò ut ea res tam gravis, varijsque obnoxia suspitionibus, literis commissa nunquam fuisset, sed sublimioribus Potestatibus, Deique potissimum judicio reseruata, ut vel in hoc seculo, vel in altero, cum & Pontifices & Principes rationem reddent villicationis suae, de hac re controversia decideret inter nostros Superiores. Notwithstanding, this we know, that many Catholics did think hardly of that deed, and did wish, that if so great a matter and subject to divers suspicions, had never been committed to writing, but reserved to higher powers, and most chief to the judgement of God, that either in this world or in the world to come, when both Popes and Princes must render account of their Bailifewicke, the controversy of this matter should be tried between our Superiors. Then, if the case was such, between the Pope, and that deceased Princes; I cannot conceive, how any equally minded Protestant can be of mind, that the Pope so strictly commanding obedience of all Catholics in England to his Majesty, will, or can be so contrary unto himself, to publish a contrary command against a King, offering in public Parliament, to meet with the Roman Church 
King's speech parliam. 1.  all Novelties taken away (we wish no more) and in the mean time acknowledging the same Roman Church to be our Mother Church, and that his mind was ever free from perfection or thralling his subjects in matters of conscience. Of such a King, Bellarmine himself cited against us will be witness, that he thinketh 
Be●lar. ●ib. 5. de Rom. pont. c. 7  the Pope cannot so proceed against him.   

The fift Reason confuted, and returned. CHAP. VI  
THe fift Reason is nothing in effect, but the former confuted: now again repeated with malice, and suiting also with the three next ensuing, and is thus objected:  
Whosoever suggesteth a Doctrine of forcible deposing of Princes from their thrones, are therein manifestly rebellious. Let us grant this Mayor Proposition: then thus I make my Minor. But Protestants be such, as both their public opinions and practices before, and after convince. Ergo, they are manifestly rebellious by this disputer.  
Now let us hear what dogmatical authority, principle, or position he produceth to justify his accusation: Th●t all Popish Priests (his phrase) defend and approve these things. For although I have confuted this in the former, yet I will rather multiply repetitions, then leave any suspicion behind me, to omit any of his oppositions.  
First, for the violent deposing of Kings and Emperors, he citeth Costerus, to say; That the power to depose Kings and Emperors, was ever in the Popes of Rome; penes Romanos pontifices, which he translateth peculiar to the Pope. But he must understand, that here is no speech of violence, violent deposing, or forcible deposing, which is his proposition to be proved. We will proceed. He citeth Molma to say; that, Depositio Imperatoris ex justa causa pertinet ad summum Pontificem.  
But first again, here is no speech of force or violence, and so not to your purpose. Secondly, there is at this present, a great difference between the Emperor which is created by the Pope's 
I. Cerem. Rom. eccl. in Coron. Imperat.  laws, and with his solemnities, and from whom he receiveth his sword: and a King that is absolute, & not so created, or depending for power or jurisdiction, such as our Sovereign in England is. And Molina himself, cited in this place by our accuser, insinuateth the same disparity and reason in these words: Quia Imperator est tanquam minister summi pontificis, etc. Because the Emperor is as it were the Pope's Minister, exercising the sword of jurisdiction at his will; ad natum summi pontificis: which is altogether untrue of his Majesty, not so receiving or exercising authority.  
To Bellarmine I have answered before, that his opinion is against this discoverer. For he alloweth not of censures against Princes, where they grow not to violence and persecution. Concerning Doctor Saunders and Philopater, I have already spoken sufficiently, and yet their citations do not conclude violence in the case of excommunicates, whereof they entreat. Bannes alleged to defend; That an Apostata King, may be deposed by the Commonwealth, meaneth such a Prince as julian the Apostata, a renowncer of Christianity, which is properly termed Apostata. And conformable is the Allegation from Simancha, which be all the authorities he bringeth to bind all Popish (his Epitheton) Priests to defend violent deposing of Kings: which not one of those particular writers affirm, but was both the public opinion & practice of protestants, in a●l opportunities & occasions, as is often remembered in this defence.  
Now let us hear the supposed public practice in this point. He allegeth three authorities only of particular men, which sentence be not sufficient to pronounce their judgement or allowance to be public. But let them be urged to his greatest advantage. The first is, against Henry the third of France, excommunicate, from the Author De justa abdic. Henr. 3. affirming only; that the French subjects which armed against him, did it secura conscientia, with secure conscience, as against a violater of public faith, violatore publicae fidei.  
I answer: first, this is no English case, except this discoverer will enrol his Majesty in the number of excommunicates, and violaters of public fidelity, which is most injurious to his Highness, and in Catholics, would be called treacherous. And yet this Author doth only affirm; that they did it, or might do it in conscience. But he doth not justify (which this man must generally prove) that all those, and the rest of the French subjects, were bound in conscience to take Arms against him: and yet, if he had so said, there is an evident inequality assigned between the cases in comparison.  
His second authority, is an opinion of Divines, in a College at Salaman, in Spain, (no public authority, if true) that all Catholics which did not follow the O-neale, did sin mortally. Queen Elizabeth then being excommunicate, and that Xistus quintus did rather allow, then approve their opinion. But first, who seethe not the disparity of those Princes, before compared. Secondly, that school followed their information; which being untrue, their sentence faileth, which the experience itself of that time, convinceth: for most Catholics practised the contrary to that judgement, resisted Oneele, and defended Queen Elizabeth. And Xistus quintus, never did see the resolution of that school. The practices of Protestants, are no novelties in such affairs.   

The sixth Reason confuted, and returned. CHAP. VII.  
THus he proceedeth to his sixth Reason: Whosoever do intend, design, or practise the murder of Princes, must necessarily be holden for desperate Traitors. This is the Mayor proposition which I grant, and thus proceed in form: But Luther, Munster, Suinglius, Caluine, Bezae, Spiphanius, Cranmer, Ridley, Latimer, Sands, Knox, Goodman, and other Clergy Protestants, with their Adherents and Disciples, did intend, design; and (so much as they could) practise such impiety, as I have demonstratively proved. Ergo, they must necessarily, by this man's argument, be holden for desperate Traitors.  
But against Catholics he urgeth: That all popish Priests, are guilty in some of these kinds: that is, intending, designing, or practising the murder of Princes. Ergo, I answer, that the late Lord Treasurer, reputed the Author of the book entitled, The execution of justice, etc. was thought, in his days, to be a man, not second to many in political wisdom, and affairs of Commonwealth: And I think, much to be preferred before this Discoverer, for 
Execut. of Just.  place and wisdom, and yet he will tell us the quite contrary, to this assertion; That there w●re many Catholic Priests and Bishops also in this kingdom, which, although they were deprived of their preferments, and imprisoned by Queen Elizabeth, yet they were so far from being contained within the circuit of this man's proposition, that they be dignified by that wise Counsellor, with these titles; faithful and quiet subjects, very quiet subjects, inclined to dutifulness to the Queen's Majesty, and the like. And for such, he reciteth very many famous men, Doctor Heath Archbishop of York, Doctor ●oole, Bishop of Peterborough, Doctor Tunstall, Bishop of Durham, Bishops of Winchester, Carlisle, Ely, Lincoln, together with Abbots, Deans, etc. Therefore by this authority, the obiecters general proposition, of all Priest's guiltiness, cannot be true. But he urgeth; That all Priests profess it lawful to take Arms against their Kings; and what other meaning (saith he) can Arms have, but blood?  
I have answered him before that this is false, by the chief Protestants declaration of many Priest's quietness, loyalty, and obedience. Secondly, I tell this disputer, that he hath made a sound argument, to prove all the Protestant Ministers of England, Scotlund, France, Helvetia, Germany, Sweveland, and other Nations before, with their confederate Protestants, convinced of sedition, for taking, or persuading Arms against their Sovereigns, to be likewise guilty of the blood and murder of those Princes, in their designments.  
If Arms can have no other meaning but only blood, as this bloody Sentencer affirmeth; for all the world can witness that they took Arms against their Rulers: But against Catholics, which know both an offensive, and defensive war, his bloody judgement can give no deadly wound, though he had proved (which is most falsely spoken) that all Priests profess it lawful to take Arms against their Kings: which I have before returned upon the Protestant profession. And yet how doubtfully, and with equivocation, (against which, he● argueth in his ninth Reason) doth he speak in this place: neither expressing in what case, or against what Prince, A●mes are defended lawful.  
But I will answer him (as before) except he will make his Majesty (for whom he would seem to plead) an usurping Tyrant, an Apostata from Christian faith, incorrigible in impiety, and a monster (as it were) among men, it is a protestant doctrine, and no Catholic opinion, that either blood must be exacted, or Arms taken against a Prince.  
Seeing his own reputation hath no happier success, let us examine his authorities. He first bringeth the Author of Just. abdic. Hen. 3, to say; that Tyrannum occidere honestum est: it is honest to kill a Tyrant. Well, then King james is a Tyrant by this judgement: otherwise, both he and his Author, be judges against himself; for that writer expressly nameth a Tyrant. And to show this man's further dutiful affection to his Prince, he must mean an 
Read Peter N●u●r. Domin. So●o, Cuner, and others.  usurping Tyrant, which is no King, but an intrudor: for by the common opinion, such a Tyrant is understood in this case, by the general Council of Constance, to which, that Author, and all Catholics must give assent, and yield obedience. But such Divines (as this discoverer) which are above general councils, the whole Church of Christ, and all authority, may make Tyrants of whom they list, and depose Princes at their pleasures. And this futeth best with their holy spirit: For if every man among them, may judge of all Fathers, Popes, councils, Scriptures, and authorities, which be the highest, they may with less presumption, challenge to be Superiors, and sit in judgement of all terrene, and temporal business.  
He bringeth no other authors for priests intending, designing or practising the murder of Princes, but only citeth Mr. Rainolds, Gregorius de valentia, & Simancha about censured heretics, often before answered in his sense and meaning: But his holy obedience and duty can find no other company in the christian world, for his King, and Sovereign, but Tyrants, excommunicate heretics, and such exploded persons.  
For practise in this point, he only allegeth three authoriiys, besides this late unhappy Stratagem. His first testimony is from Gallobelgicus, who among other of his far fetched intelligences should affirm, that one arnold in Paris ascribed the Tyranny of the Spaniards in the Indies, to the jesuits. But Lewis Granado, Metellus Sequanus and others of greater credit, who speak dolefully, and bitterly against that Tyranny, be of other mind: And we entreat now of Christian Princes, and not of poor Infidel and Pagan common people. Therefore if this were true, yet to no purpose, if there were no priests but jesuits. But it is well known that Arnoldus was a professed enemy to that Society, and is confuted by Montanus and others. And yet Gallobelgicus is not without his hyperbolical Locutions.  
His second example is, that Rodolphu● Comes, (which he translateth Duke Rodolph) fought against the Emperor Henry the 4. excommunicate. To which he joineth the often repeated Bull of Pius the fift against Queen Elizabeth, both answered before. And still this man cannot balance his Sovereign with any but excommunicates, Indian infidels, Tyrants, Apostates etc.  
last; he addeth the late conspiracy against the house of Parliament. But as he hath heard, that all priests were not so well pleased in the former proc●dings with the deceased Queen: So I trust they will be innocent in so vile a practice against our present Sovereign; And it is most certain that this example serveth not for his purpose, of proving all priests to intend, design, or practise such things. For first, the chiefest priest the Pope had absolutely forbidden all disobedience, and strictly commanded obedience unto his Majesty, by English Catholi●es, priests, or other, and by his absolute power of spiritual superiority, as by these words; Quia Papaiubet, the obedience, and prohibe● the disobedience. The chief superior of priests in England, in spiritual things, the Archpriest had so received, and promulged the same command long since, in August last. And upon his first notice of the pretended wickedness▪ condemned it by his particular letters for an intolerable, uncharitable, scandalous, and desperate fact, against the order of holy Church, against the prescript of a general Council, against the sentence of the best writers of this age, against the Pope's commandment: and consorting with the error of Wickliff, (the protestant Saint and Martyr) condemned in the Catholic general council at Constance.  
Then, if the secular priests of England will acknowledge, either the Archpriest for their superior at home, or the Pope at Rome, (as all, both regular and others must do) neither all the priests of this Nation, nor any one (except disobedient to his superior) was guilty of this conspiracy, or did, or doth either intent, design, or practise such irreligious wickedness. And both holy and happy is that religion to be esteemed, among whose professors in this 
The discourse of the la●e intended treason.  Kingdom, so many thousands, and in the days of so manifold disgraces and miseries for that faith, so small a company of chiefest Agents, or Assistants are charged with that offence.  
We have heard, read, seen, and tasted of many conspiracies and rebellions by protestants, and more and greater by them, (proportion of time and Countries observed) where both Kings, whole kingdoms, and Commonweals, have been put in hazard, and yet they were dogmatical men in that profession, accounted Prophets, Apostles, Evangelists, and conspired thousands for every one particular person in this recited: and yet their conspiracies were not condemned by their Preachers and Doctors, but justified and applauded, not forbidden, but commanded by their spiritual masters, and their rebels, slain in such actual seditions against Princes, not reproved, but approved and canonised for holy Martyrs. When all things be contrary in this case, by the protestant disourse itself of this tragedy. And if proof can be made, of any one of holy priestly order, to have been an Agent in so unholy business, he will be as much abandoned of all good priests and Catholics, as of the protestants themselves, for that disloyalty. The ignominy and perpetual reproach wherewith the names of unhappy Watson, and Clerk are stained, with all of our religion, will be a witness in any case of like comparison.   

The seventh Reason confuted, and returned. CHAP. VIII.  
HIs seventh syllogism is this: Seeing it is in a manner all one to commit a villante, and to commend it, we may argue, that whosoever shall justify acts of treasons and parricides, are not unguilty of the same crimes. To this I grant, and add, (which is evidently proved before) that the chiefest teachers and professors of Protestancy, do not only justify, but commend, canonize for holy, encourage, command, and reward such proceed: therefore they are not unguilty of the same crimes.  
And whereas he setteth down for his less Proposition: But all Priests do justify such heinous parricides. Ergo, I have proved before, both by their own authority, continual experience, and at this time, that such assertions be most false and slanderous.  
But he will maintain his sentence, because Bellarmine saith; Many Popes have worthily deprived many Princes, of their regal authority. The examples be in Leo 3. Frederick 1. Otho 5. and Childericke, King of France. To Objections of which nature, I have often answered before. And sincere dealing▪ would have alleged the true causes of such process, with those Princes, which take away the envy of this matter, prove a flat disparity in the cases compared, and bring eternal shame to many Protestant rebellions, and often deposing Princes for meaner quarrels, and for no true cause at all. The rebellions and attempts be too many to be recited. The examples of Princes deposed, or deprived of their Kingdoms, Countries, or territories, by Protestants, (meaner than Popes) be more in so short a time, then in all the papal government, Queen Mary of Scotland, the King of Spain, and Enfanta in Flanders, the Emperor in divers parts of Germany, and elsewhere, in former time, the present Emperor in Hungary, the Prince of Transyluania, the Prince of Geneva, marquess of Embden, Duke of Lorraine, king of Denmark, king of France, king of Sweveland, in their territories surprised, invaded, taken, sold to enemies, or kept by rebels, (no such thing in the Pope's cases, never making themselves the richer by others losses) yield testimony in this business.  
Next cometh in a gratias agimus, for the death of King Henry the third of France, by the Author of the book, de justa abdicat. Hen. 3. which was a Catholic. But I tell him, that also a Catholic, Doctor Barkeley, a professor at Mussipont, hath confuted that book, which also may serve for other citations from thence, which I have answered before.  
He accuseth Cardinal Alane, for approving the rendering of Davontore, unto the hands of the King of Spain, the true owner. By which, he condemneth himself, to be within the compass of his own conclusion of rebellion, and to justify such acts of treason: for all the world can witness, that Town truly to belong to that King. Then, not the surrendering of it to the lawful Prince, (which he condemneth) but the wrongful withholding of it, (which he approveth) was treason and rebellion.  
And such as this discoverer is, such also the rest of his Clergy protestant brethren in England, must be esteemed, even in this point: for in their name, the first defence of those disobedient and seditious Netherlanders▪ was undertaken. And so, both by public positions, and practices, they teach and justify acts of treason, and rebellion, both in themselves, and their evangelical brethren, so many years, in so many disloyal attempts, rapines, intrusions, disinheritings, deposings, piracies, murders, and extremest outrages, against their natural and true Sovereigns; and not in one only act and oration, (one of Gallobelgicus excessive reports) made of the death of Henry the third in France. Ergo, Protestanrs are not unguilty of these crimes.   

The eight Reason confuted, and returned upon Protestants. CHAP. IX.  
THus he frameth his next Argument. Those Snakes that do● naturally sting, so soon as they get warmth, may not be harboured in the bosom of the Commonwealth. To which proposition I say, concedo: & further add by such assertion, that the protestant Preachers, and professors of the reformed Churches, may not be harboured in any kingdom, or civil Country: for they are proved before, naturally to sting, (and kill, if they can) so soon as they have obtained power to perform it. Which I will now also, more plentifully demonstrate in this chapter, when I have exempted Catholics from the accusation, in the second proposition; which is: But all Priests profess rebellions, as soon as they can presume of their strength. Ergo.  
His chiefest proof of this, is from Bannes, who (as he telleth us) teacheth; that a King may be deposed, where there is evidens noticia criminis, evident knowledge of his sin. I answer; That such opinion is to be reproved, as against, not only Cunerus Navarre, etc. but the great Laterane general Council, to which, Bannes, and all Catholics, must submit their sentences: which also dischargeth us of this forged slander, and condemneth the accuser, of unjust calumniation.  
But he urgeth further from the same Author, holding the English Catholics excused; quia non se eximunt ex superiorum potestate, nec bellum contra eos gerunt: quia non suppetunt illis vires, ob sequentia pericula: which this discoverer thus translateth; The English Catholics, who now do not take Arms against the Protestants, are excused, because they want sufficient power. I answer: If this be the opinion of Bannes, he speaketh ignorantly in this case: For the Pope himself, Gregory the thirteenth, had declared, for the instruction of the vnl●a●ned, that we might perform all duties of obedience, notwithstanding any censure. And this we may prove by the next objection itself, of this accuser▪ acknowledging how the Pope dispensed (as he termeth his declaration) That the Catholics in England, might profess a large obedience: (his own words) notwithstanding the excommunication of the Queen.  
But where he addeth this restraint; rebus sic stantibus, and that it was recalled by Xistus the fift, in the year 1588. when the Spaniards pretended invasion. I answer in the first case: That Cardinal Allane, better acquainted in these affairs, than any protestant Writer, so long after in England, relateth the Pope's declaration, for 
Cardin. All. ad pers●cut. Angl.  Catholics obedience to Queen Elizabeth, without any restraint or limitation: neither doth this man discover where he findeth such restricting clause. And as for Pope X●stus Revocation, if any such was, (which he rather imagineth, then proveth) it is not in force in any opinion▪ not being published.  
The case of the Earl of Tyrone, whatsoever it was, is not now imputed against him, as his liberty and favour in England, since then be witness. Therefore it might better be suppressed, than urged by this discoverer.  
Hitherto I have answered to all the objections of this disputer, against Catholic religion, showing the innocency thereof in the offences objected, and that Protestants be guilty in all, and every of the pretended crimes. And in that order, I have made return of every Argument, upon the discoverer, and his own profession. But seeing his confusion and repetition of the same, or eq●iuolent reasons, was such, as (I have noted before) that I could not give him so ample allowance in that kind, as his courtesy deserved, except I would fall into the like repeating error, I have reserved some payment to this place. Before performance whereof, I desire my Reader to remember the substance of his mayor propositions, in all his syllogisms, that the less●r and minors with their consequence, may be better considered. Then thus he writeth: Reason 2. supr. Whosoever profess any civil power sovereign over Kings, directly, or indirectly, deny necessary right of election, or of succession of Princes, & e. shall manacle the hands of subjects, detracting all obedience, suggest a doctrine of forcible deposing Princes from their thrones, intent, design, or practise the murder of Princes, justify acts of treasons, and parricides. And snake's that do naturally sting▪ so soon as they get warmth, are seditious, intolerable, may be challenged and condemned for disordered and rebellious are manifestly rebellious, desperate traitors, & not to be harboured in the bosom of the Commonwealth. This is the general Mayor proposition in all his eight recited Arguments, being one and the same (for the most part) in substance and effect; but varied and repeated so often, with this man's protracted malice Therefore, joining all these together in one, for my first proposition, granted by my adversary for most certain, I make this my second general proposition. But the Clergy Protestant professors and patrons, in all times and places, as opportunity hath been ministered▪ were in this case described: which, (besides my former probations) thus I demonstrate from their most dogm●●tica●l 
Protest 〈…〉 Ger●any.  principle, and public professors, positions, and pract●●es.  
First, Martin Luther the first known Protestant, was accounted so dogmatical, principle, and public, both for doctrine, and practise that the prime Protestants of that time, Amsdorsius, Sarcer●●s▪ M●●●hesius, Michael, Neander, and others, honoured him 
Am●●orf praefat. 〈…〉 16. 〈…〉. Carolost. A●dr. Musc ●raes. degerm d● d●abol. Luther. to. 1. ●●nt. germ fol. 522. 79 to. 3. fo. 334. to. 4. to. 5. fol. ●98 Colloq. mensal. fo●. 488 l. con●●. Henry 8. in Psa. 71 etc. ●●. 3. fol 533. 326. 360. Colloq. mensal. fol 342 343. ●up. edict. Imp.  with ●●ese pre-eminent titles, an other Saint john Baptist, the third and 〈◊〉, E●ias, the last tiumpet of God, an Angel● of God, a great Prophet, mighty in word and work, a man according to the heart of God, the mouth of Christ, a God of Divines, the only Divine of Divines, supreme Father of the Church, etc.  
And himself giveth himself no inferior style; a faithful Prophet, an Apostle, Evangelist, a living Saint, receiving his Gospel from God, Isaias, etc. such a Master above all Doctors, Popes, and councils, may be termed a public man, and his positions public. Then he saith, that he careth not for Kings: and so careless he is in this case, that he censured king Henry the eight of England, the marquess of Brandenburge the Princes of the imperial orders, the Princes of Germany, the Duke of B●unswicke, to be unworthy, either of obedience from subjects, or life in themselves. And giving the same doom of his own natural Sovereign, George, Duke of Saxony nameth him the calamity of his Country, a Tyrant passing all Tyrants, Pilate, Herod, judas: So he scorned 
To. 6. germ fol. 6. Georg. Wicell. deretect. Luth. Luther. epist ad 〈◊〉. inst. germ. ●●. potest ●ecul. li. cont. 2. Edict, Imper.  the Emperor, and wrote directly against his Edicts: he taught, that Protestants hands must be imbrued with blood, teaching that he had warrant from God to battle against Princes: He telleth us, it is the nature of the Gospel, to raise wars and seditions; that among christians, there is no magistrate, no superior: that it is to be entreated by many prayers (so holy a thing is rebellion in his sight, that it must be bought with prayers) that the countrymen obey not their Princes: no law, or syllable of law can be imposed upon christians, more than themselves will, neither by men nor Angels: there is no hope of remedy, except all human laws be taken away.  
Munster was of the same opinion and practice, and called rebellion 
Cacl in act. Luth. Ann. 1525.  for his religion, the war of God; affirming, that he had received especial commandment from God, to war against Kings, and had promise of victory from heaven. And thereupon such rebellions ensued, that of his own adherents and traitorous protestants, were slain within the space of three mon●ths, one hundred and thirty thousands. The rebellions, murders, and destructions which they performed and publicly practised, by words and Arms, cannot be recounted. And not only 
Luther. l. captivit Babyl l. de bell. count Turc. Munster in chro. pantal. chronol. fol. 121 etc.  these miseries by their own rebellions, but by Luther's doctrine; that Christians might not fight against the Turk; in short time, Belgrade & Rhodes were taken, Hungary was entered, King Lodowicke slain, Buda conquered, & Verima Austrae besieged with two hundred & fifty thousand Turkish soldiers. And the Protestants of that Nation, were not content with these public opinions and practices of rebellion in themselves against their emperors Ferdinand and Charles, whom they persecuted and besieged, but conspired with the Turk himself, both against them, and the whole christian world. And their successors in Hungary, these last years, no better behaved themselves: these directly admitted the Turks entry: the first endeavoured to perform it, as their own 
Caspaectalio hist. Symp. ad Sabell●c. Defence. Stap. contr. Illerich. & Sleid, petr. Frar. ora●. count Sectar. Sleidan. l. 22.  letters of conspiracy, and the coming of the Bassa of Buda, against Ferdinando into Pannonia, were witnesses. And Sleydan himself, a German Protestant giveth testimony; that this was the doctrine of their divines of Magdenburge publicly teaching in defence of s●ch rebellions, that such wars were lawful.  
For Sweveland, the protestants themselves give also testimony; 
Sweveland. Chit. chron. an. 1593. 1594.  that the Catholic King thereof, was enforced by his rebellious gospelers, to make himself a subject unto their designments, and condescend, that no Catholic should bear office in that kingdom, and catholic service for the King should be confined only to his own Chapel. And what rebellions did the Protestant 
Petr. Fa●. orat. contr. sect.  Nobility, by advise of their Clergy, raise against their Prince for this cause in former times? And who is ignorant of their still continued seditions and rebellions?  
In Denmark, the same dogmatical opinions were both publicly defended and put in execution: What insurrections and rebellions 
Petr. Frar. sup.  d●d the Protestants of that kingdom maintain by this title? Did they not assault the King under years, and in minority with open wars? Did they not confederate and colleague themselves with the professed enemies of the kingdom, sell the Cities to strangers, challenge regal power to their rebellions, and such like intolerable treasons?  
Let us come to Helvetia, and especially Geneva, the mother Church of the ●eformed, Master Caluine, the supreme head of the Consistory there, hath told us before; that Princes (not agreeing 
Bez. l. iur magist. in supqit. Sutclif answ. l. to suphl.  with him in religion) are rather to be spitted upon, than obeyed; they ●re not worthy to be numbered among men, they are bereaved of all authority. Beza, his successor in place, succeeded him also both in opinion and practice, arming subjects against their Prince. And as Master Doctor Sutliffe saith in effect, overthrowing all authority of Christian Kings and Magistrates, and giving power to subjects, not only to take Arms, but to depose and kill the Prince, if he impugn their religion. And accordingly in practice, the Protestants there, (as Caluine himself, Doctor Sutliffe, 
Caluin Sutel. sup. kiru. pret. discipl.  and the Archbishop of Canterbury be witnesses) deposed their Sovereign from his temporal right, and ever since, continue in that state of rebellion. And not content with rebellion to one and their own Lord and Ruler, they celebrated a Council, wherein it was concluded; that King Francis the second, than king 
Petr. Fra●. orat. contr. sectar. de●ens. Reg. & relig.  of France, his wife, the Queen, his children, Queen mother, the Nobility, and all good Magistrates of that kingdom, should by a certain day, by treacherous deceits, be put to death.  
In Burgundy, a like Assembly and Conventicle was called, kept, and therein decreed at Cabillon; that three worms must be taken forth of the world: (these men were not content to make their opinion and practice, to one, or a few kingdoms) first, the Church of Rome: secondly, the noble families of ancient houses: and thirdly, all civil policy, government, and jurisdiction. How faithfully the Protestant Netherlanders, laboured by all seditions and rebellion, so many years, and still persever to have the canon of this holy Council observed; it is too lamentable to be repeated, that subjects should maintain it, or any Christians should applaud it.  
Let us come to France. Were not Caluine, Beza, Othomanus, Spiphanius, 
Claud. de sanct. de Saccad. eglif. fol 58. 55.  and such public and dogmatical Protestants, the eggers and instruments of all those slaughters, rebellions, and oppressions in that Monarchy, wherein they took all law, authority, and 
Petr. Frar. sup.  execution thereof, from the King and Magistrates. They conspired in one night, to rob all the Church's in France: how did they depose Magistrates, fell Cities, give the spoils to strangers, etc. what murdering of priests and religious men, hanging, cutting, bowelling, rending, strangling, flaying, drowning, stabbing, shooting through with guns and arrows, of religious Priests, wearing chains of their ears cut off, about their necks? how many were buried alive, and little infants themselves cut in sunder, enforcing men to eat their undecent parts, cut off, and roasted; and opening the bellies when they lived, to see whether they digested them, or no; I cease to recount the unspeakable tyranny of those Protestant traitors, whom no conditions, peace, or grant, could satisfy.  
After the remembered conspiracy against King Francis, his 
Genebr. chron. ann. 1560.  Mother, wife, children, Nobles, and Magistrates at Geneva, in the year 1560. within two years after 1562. they raised such rebellions and civil wars against King Charles the ninth, that as Genebrande writeth, France was more endamaged by one years civil wars, than in all wars passed by strangers. The King of Navarre, and Duke Nyvers, with others, were slain; the Duke of Guise treacherously murdered, by Pultrotus Canickname in France, for that fact suborned by Beza, and the Protestant Admiral, and they enforced the Kings to grant them peace and conditions, but they kept neither: for in the year 1567. they made a new rebellion, and being subdued, accept again of peace, but 
Genebr. chron. 1567. Geneb. chro●. in these ye●●es.  break it again: for in the year 1569. they rebel: and in the next year 1570. and yet in the year 1575. break again into rebellion. And such were the miserable murders and calamities which they brought to that distressed kingdom, that i● 〈…〉 first civil wars and rebellions, above 100000. were slain, as Gaspar Coligne, a principal Captain in those rebellions, witnessed in an oration before the King. And when Charles the ninth forbade by Edict, that no such Protestant should publicly 
H●stor F●ucase Popelim. li. 27. stat Relig. in gall. Sub. Carol. 9 lib. 3 pag. 347.  preach, thirteen thousands of them armed, assembled at such a sermon, in the suburbs of Paris itself, and their rebellious malice and disobedience, did not only extend to their living Kings, but endured against the dead: as they most rebelliously persecuted King Francis when he lived, so being dead, they burned his heart in rebellious despite. So they dealt with King Lewis the eleventh, defaced his Image, dismembering every part thereof, and burned his body.  
Concerning this united Kingdom of Britain, I have spoken before sufficiently, for the confusion of all Protestants thereof for ever. I will add something, and first for Scotland. Was not their Gospel there planted by force and violence to Princes, and by the public dogmatical decrees of Caluin, and Knox 
Knox hist of the church of Scotland pag. 143. 144. Holins. hist. Scot anno 1546. Knox sup. pa. 217 218. 256 258. Holinsh. sup. ann. 1559. Knox pag. 265. 268. 269. Holinsh. sup. Knox sup. pag. 501. 502. 503. & usque pag 531. Holinsh. supr. an. 1566. Dang. pos. l. 1. c. 6.  Apostles, and their conspiracies and practise? I refer the Reader to Knox himself, to know what public subscriptions and conspiracies to this end, what authoritative Sermons to the Religious, and Monasteries, what protestations of violences against the Queen's Edict, and Parliament, what contempt of Authority, they used, in commanding the Nobles under penalty of excommunication to assist them, the Bishops and Clergy, not to resist them, writing, and sending to all their Sect, to join in Rebellion with them; no Law or commandment of Prince obeyed. They took upon them the Regality itself, they coined money by their Authority, seized the Inns and renounced all obedience unto their Princes, terming her obedient subjects and partakers, a Faction, and threatened them with punishment for Treason. How wickedly did they reject her Authority in Parliament, and made themselves Supreme, both in Ecclesiastical and Temporal business? Did they not murder the Kings and Queen's Secretary in their sight, and intended the same to the Queen herself, then great with child with our present Sovereign, so to have brought all into their own hands, the Issue and Posterity Regal taken away? And when that holy last recited Queen, Mother to his Majesty was first imprisoned, then expelled her Kingdom by these Rebels, and escaped murdering, her Husband being slain by their villainies. How did they condemn all decrees of the State, deposed the Bishops as Antichristian by their supremacy? What comminatory letters did they write to his Majesty which now Reigneth, then young in years, and the Nobles of that Land to effect their designments? did not they wholly disclaim from the kings Authority, and not that only, but made him their subject in prescribing laws unto him? did not they surprise and imprison him as 
Declarat. B 1. 2. 3. 4 parliament. Sect. ann. 1584.  their Vassal? what Traitorous and more than Rebellious excommunications and censures did they impose upon him? how many 
Declarat. 1582. parlia. 1584. c. 7.  Conspiracies did they contrive, how did they force him at Striueling, besieged him, took the Castle, imprisoned the King with violence, v●till he had signed their high wills and pleasures.  
For England I have spoken already more than I desired, had not such wicked accusations against us urged me to breach of silence. And now I will only say, that the public and dogmatical positions and practices of Rebellions by the greatest Protestant subjects of this Kingdom, the Dukes of Northumberland and Suffolk, (again and again) so many Nobles to be pas●ed with oblivion, all their whole Cleagie, archbishop, Bishops and others, not only against the law of God and their Queen, but oaths of fidelity to K. Henry the eight, that I am bold to affirm, no Protestant obi●ctor can give instances in any time or Nation of Catholic Regiment or Subjects, where so great and manifold outrages have been committed. And yet that which Catholics lost by the new proceedings, so many thousands of Monasteries, Religious houses, Churches, their Religion, Sacraments, Prayers and Sacrifice for their soul's sakes and their posterity, Corrodies, Pensions, and Education for their children, was a greater loss to them and their profession, than ever Protestants with their new Faith will bestow, recompense, or equivalent benefit upon the world.  
Now let us review this Disciferers examples of practice against Henry the third of France, the resistment of this present King of that country, the Bull of Pius Quintus against Queen Elizabeth, Henry the fourth Emperor excommunicate, Leo the third, Frederick the first, Otho the fift, and King Childericke. Henry the second in like case, which be these practical objections he can find worthy of reciting against us, since the first conversion of Kings and Countries to Christ. Among all which tragedies, let him single forth what kingdom, country, territory, or town, the Pope possesseth, detaineth, or keepeth against any of those, or any other christian Prince. And compare them with the Protestants proceed with Princes, in this short time of their new Gospel, and ●heir usurped ministerial and popular outrages, rebellions, excommunications, deposings, and violence to Princes, do far exceed, both for number, and extremest injuries. And so many Countries, States, Towns, and territories, both violently taken, and still kept from the true possessors, and reserved to themselves, as Princes; doth not only argue the impiety of injuries past, and a continued state of rebellion, but giveth demonstration of their continued opinions, to practise the same generally in all times and places, as occasions shall give them power and advantage. Ergo, Protestants, (and not Catholics) by this man's arguments, be seditious, trey terous, rebellious, intolerable.   

The ninth Reason confuted, and returned. CHAP. X.  
THus he frameth his next Reason; Whosoever doth perfidiously either deny, or violate with men of diverse religion, an oath, etc. must necessarily be esteemed of them, a person perfidious and treacherous.  
This is his Mayor proposition, wherein he must needs make some exceptions of the lawfulness▪ etc. of the thing sworn, or else the Protestants which swore loyalty to Queen Mary, in her Father's life, might not safely take Arms against her, to advance a forged title: and the Protestants which had sworn obedience to the Pope, could not deny their subjection; and whatsoever wickedness is sworn, must be performed: as Saint Paul, and Saint john Baptist death, because their death was sworn by Herod and the jews. But if his proposition be true, Protestants be perfidious and treacherous, by the example of England recited, and all the Countries before remembered: where Protestants broke their oaths of loyalty with their Princes, kept not oaths of conditions with subjects. But he thus objecteth: Popish Priests are guilty of such perfidy. And in his prosecuting of this assertion, he disputeth against equivocation, although the interrogatory be unjustly proposed, and chargeth us with these words of Cardinal Tollet; Cum judex non vindice petit juramentum vel contra justitiam, licet uti 
Tollet. li. 4. Inst. Sacerd. c. 21. 22.  aequivocatione secundum mentem suam contramentem judicis, ut puta quaerenti fecisti ne illud? respondeat non feci, intelligendo inter se non hoc tempore aut ut narrem tibi aut aliquid simile. Let this be the case as himself hath alleged it. Th●n for Tollet, sometimes a jesuite, I cite another jesuite, famous among Casuists Emanuel Sa, who in his Aphorisms, writeth of this matter ●n these words; Quidam 
Sa Aphoris. mendacium 4.  dicunt eum qui non tenetur respondere ad intentionem Rogantis, posse respondere aliquid subintelligendo, ut non esse, scilicet it a ut dicere es teneatur, velse non habere, scilicet ut ei det, licet alij id non admittunt & fortè potiori ratione. Whereby it is manifest, that all Catholics do not allow of equivocation, where he is not bound to answer the judge, or examiner proceeding unjustly, and not according to law and equity: that a man in such case, is not bound to answer at all, if the question concerneth his life, liberty, or fame, his Majesty, his honourable Council: and the Protestant Bishops have consented 
Conference 14. januar. 1604.  unto, in the conference with Puritans, whether he may equivocate or no, they do not mention: but other Protestants, as Cranmer, Luther, Caluin, and others, have both taught and practised it as lawful, and so do all English Puritans, and most Protestants, (even in religious business) which all men of learning do condemn, as I will prove in this chapter.  
For our excuse in this place and question, Catholics do generally agree, that to equivocate before a competent judge, (such as we allow all Magistrates in England, in temporal causes, in as ample 
Cap. quacunque act. 22. q. 5. Naurar. c. 12. Numb. 8. D. Thom. 2. 2. q. 89. act. 7. ad 14.  manner, as if they were of our religion) keeping the order of law, is a mortal sin; so the canon law itself, so Navarre, Saint Thomas, and others teach. And if it be defended by divers Catholics, (as Protestants also) that in case of unjust and injurious interrogatory, equivocation may be used, I desire to know against what virtue this discoverer can discover this to be a sin. First, it is not against justice; for we supposed the interrogatory to be unjust, than the injustice is in the judge, exceeding his commission, and offering injury to the Respondent; and not in him which neither contradicteth any law, or offereth injustice to him, to whom no justice belongeth in that cause.  
Secondly, against verity and truth it cannot be, for the thing affirmed or denied, is true in the sense of the Respondent, as we still suppose, and he is not bound to answer in other sense, as before: yea, to answer in the sense of the injurious examiner, rather seemeth a breach of law and duty with him, than an observation thereof. Therefore, seeing as Saint Augustine writeth, mentiri, to lie, is eontra ●entemire, to go against a man's mind and meaning; there is neither lie, unjustice, or any sin in this case; but only in the examiner, there is usurpation against the law, and injury to the examminate: and this doctrine of equivocation in this sense, is no late invention. The Scripture telleth us, how jacob told his father Isaac, that he was his first begotten Son Esau, 
Gen cap. 27. jerem. ●. 38. ver. 26. 27.  which was not so in the sense of the Patriarch Isaac: such equivocation also the Prophet jeremy used to the people, when following the advice of the King, he told otherwise then the truth, in their sense, one thing for another: so the Scriptures affirm in divers senses, that Saint john Baptist was E●ya●, and was not. Our Saviour himself said to his Apostles, he would not go up to jerusalem, and yet secretly he went: he feigned to his Disciples, going to Emaus, that he would go further. Concerning, the Pope's dispensation in oaths, when this discoverer can prove abuse in Catholic doctrine, in such cases he shall have further answer: in the mean time, he may understand that meaner superiors then Popes, may irritate the oaths and vows also of their subjects. So the father may 
Gloss. 32. q. 2. Mul●er, 31. §. 34. Sa v. princeps §. 3.  deal with his child in divers cases, and other superiors of their subjects: so temporal Princes may do, and also legitimate their children, not legitimate, as many teach: so King Hen●y the eight both thought and practised with his daughters, Queen Mary, and Queen Elizabeth, whom he had illegitimate, and after, declared the contrary, and made them legitimate by statute.  
Now I plainly answer to his proposition of breaking oaths, That all Catholics of this kingdom, both priests and others, do, and aught, sincerely to acknowledge his Majesty to be as absolute and really true King of all his kingdoms, and over all his subjects of what profession or calling soever, as ever any Catholic King his predecessor was either of them jointly united or disjoined, and that as much temporal duty and obedience belongeth unto him, and in their degrees to his honourable Counsel and inferior Magistrates, concerning the affairs of Commonwealth; and that among other duties, to deny to swear, or violate an oath, iuridicè, justly, and according to course of law proposed, and to equivocate therein, is a sin damnable: and that it is the error of Wickliff and later Protestant's to be of other mind. But seeing the internal cogitations of men, only naturally known to God, defiling the soul, and not offensive to external peace, and government, how wicked soever they be of their own nature, belong only to the consistory of God, and internum forum, we hope it will not be offensive, to entreat that the natural consciences be not arraigned in external courts, which the Pope himself doth not, nor can do, especially where no crime can be objected, 
Navarr c. 18. Num. 29. D. Tho. 2. 2. q. 6. articul. 1. 2. Gaiet. 16. cap. Quando de poenit d. 1. c. si omnia q. 1. c. 2. de maiorit. & obed. cap. 2. de Confess. Conference 14. 1604. pag. 92.  where there is no such law ordained, where not so much as a semiplea, probation, or any accusation at all is precedent with the judge, or known to the conveuted: And this is not only conformable to the law of nature, conscience, and canonical proceed, even allowed and practised in England, but publicly confirmed by his Majesty, the Archbishop of Canterbury, the Nobles and Bishops of this kingdom in the late conference. The words of his Majesty be, Nemo cogitur detegere suam turpitudinem in such a case, and that fame and scandal must be looked unto, with a condemning of the Statish protestants in that point. The Archbishopps words be these, If any article did touch 
Pag. ●●.  the party any way, either for life, liberty, or scandal, he might refuse to answer, neither was he urged thereunto; semblable was the consent of all. And if this Rule was general, I hope Catholics be not exempted.  
As concerning interrogatories de futuris contingentibus, first things hereafter to have an uncertain being, concern not a present certain state, secondly the Angeiles themselves naturally know them not; thirdly the soul of Man is ignorant of them; no creature doth by natural science understand them: for all such knowledge is either by the object present, that is not in this case, or by the effect, that is to come, or by the cause which is here most uncertain. Therefore, the examine of such things we entreat may be left to God, who only in that sense, is Scrutat or cordis, and comprehendeth all causes more excellently than themselves; otherwise it would be hard to decipher, how he himself knoweth such things.  
B●t to speak to this objector, concerning his protestants proceed in dissimulation and aeq●●●ocating; Was not the behaviour of Luther the Evangelist, so vile in this kind, that never any pill●ry-mate so beh●ued himself, as his own friends, Fox, Sleiden, and other Protestants give demonstration, and not only in 
Fox 2. in Luth. Sleidan lib. 1. Staphil apolog Cocl. in act Luther.  civil but d●uine matters▪ where, b● all judgement, no equivocation may be allowed: yet at his pleasure now, he appealed to Pope, now d●●i●d it now recanted his errors, presently defended them, now submitted him sel●e to Cardinal C●●etan, now refused it, now teaching one now another religion, a● best served his purpose: all hi● own writings be still witness against him. So did the Protestants of England dissemble, flatter, change, and rechange, both their faith, and their fashions, to please King Henry the eight, the protector● of K●ng Edward the sixth, and Queen Elizabeth, as histories and statutes are testimony to th●ir confusion. The like (and worse) cogging, lying equivocating, and dissembling was practised by Calum, as the Lord Archbishop of Canterbury, Beza, and 
Suru. pret diseipl. Beza ●n vi●. Ca●u. Staphil Apolog.  others bear r●cord: for which, he was banished Geneva, for a lying and dissembling seducer; and by such trades, deluded the Artisans and ●it●zens there, the second ti●e restored himself, & obtained principality by such means. So also he loosened the tigurines, and among his Disciples, jura per●●ra, se●ua fidem (scili●et Calui●ia●um) was made a dogmatical principle. In England, Cramner the protestant Archbishop o● Canterbury in his time, and the most ●ubli●e man of that profession, cannot be excused, (Fox himself being judge) from counterfeiting the hands of 50. convocation 
Fox 10. ● in C●●nmar.  men to give a lying credit to his false cause, as Doctor Weston proved against him in the public Schools of Oxford; and in the same place, Doctor Marti● made demonstration, how he had forsworn himself, and been perjured in a most high degree, twice at the least, swearing obedience to the Sea of Rome. And most certain it is, that so often he had sworn to the supremacy of King Henry the eight, and King Edward the sixth: and yet, after all this again, in the days of Queen Mary, he swore a new obedience to the Pope. And Cranmer himself confessed, he had sworn such contrary oaths, but excused it by equivocation, (so much condemned by this accuser) affirming, as his words do signify, that he spoke one thing, and meant another, which in causes of religion (such as this) all men condemn for greatest wickedness. For what authority soever men have to examine, God hath always a true right unto his honour, not to be denied. Such was the proceeding also of Bucer, and Peter Martyr, the two great Protestant professors of divinity in Cambridge and Oxford, whom the whole English Gospel could not match; and yet contrary to their fo●mer profession and doctrine, they taught what the Parliament would please to appoint. And I would demand, whether all the Protestant Adherents, to the Dukes of Northumberland and Suffolk, were not in this case of equivocation: and is it not both now ordinary to Puritans, who in acknowledging externally his majesties supremacy, and suppressing their Presb●terie, an essential point of their faith, and note of their Church, do not as they believe in mind. And externally communicate in Churches, service and sacraments with Protestants, whom, and whose religion they condemn to hell: and the Protestants dissemble likewise in the King's supremacy.   

The tenth Reason confuted and returned. CHAP. XI.  
THe tenth and last Objection, being no new Reason, but an Epilogus of the former, that is; All Romish Priests, as Priests to profess some, and other some: All of those sed●ious posirions, are before confuted and proved in every particular, to be untrue, and needeth no further answer, being before evident; that neither all Priests, nor any one Priest, as a Priest doth, or can maintain any one disobedient or seditious opinion.  
And whatsoever this man, more maliciously, than truly or wisely, saith; That all Priests in the Popish Seminaries, vow obedience to their superiors: and therefore, that the superiors maintaining such Seditious positions, the scholars are bound to their doctrine. These assertions be most falsely objected, for first the scholars do not vow any obedience to their Superiors; and that obedience which they promise, & practise, is in observing the collegiall ●●●es and constitutions: as in Cambridge and Oxford, all Scholars, when they be matriculated & engraffed to the University, do accustom; there is neither vow, oath, nor promise to obey them in their doctrine. secondly, this cannot be either vowed▪ punished, or performed: for no Rector of any college is ordinarily a Reader of divinity in his College. Thirdly, the Caholike Students neither of England or any other Nation are bound to defend their masters reading, but in matters of faith, and generally received doctrine▪ And although Bellarmine did some times read controversies in Rome, And Doctor Gifford was a professor in Rheims, Doctor Stapleton at Louvain, and the Cardinal at Douai, (which be all readers to English, which he allegeth;) yet not all English Priests, nor the tenth part of them, were Auditors and Scholars to these professors: and yet there is not any one sentence alleged, from any of them, or any other Catholic, which in true sense will bring any prejudice to our most holy and innocent cause, as I have made demonstration.  
Thus it absolutely remaineth proved (most gracious Prince) that if the opinion of any Divines, concerning deposing Princes, or making war against them by subjects, be treasonable, and not tolerable in a Commonweal, it is in the Protestant profession, by many degrees, exceeding any other, both for opinion and practice: and that the opinion of Catholics, is the least dangerous to this, or any State.  
And for this Discoverer, if his late recited Arguments, that scholars must agree with their Masters in sentence, shall stand good, himself, (with all Ministers of his profession) being the disciples of so many seditions, and rebellions, Pedagogues, his, and their Ancestors in protestancy, must also with them be guilty in that kind.   

The Conclusion.  
WHerefore (most merciful Sovereign) the poor, innocent, and distressed Catholics of this kingdom, humbly entreat licence, to propose that question to your Majesty, our earthly King; which guiltless and holy job, in his greatest 
job c. ●.  afflictions, so confidently in this manner, disputed with his Creator and King in heaven: Answer me, how great iniquities and sins I have, show unto me my wickedness and offences: why do you hide your face, and suppose me for your enemy? you show your power against a leaf, tossed with the wind, and do persecute dried stubble. Non pecca●●, & in amaritudinibus moratur oculus meus: we have not (as we hope) sinned against you, and yet our eyes remain in bitterness of tears, and can behold nothing but matter of mourning and lamentation. Our nature and Nation, cannot turn your gracious aspect away: for all of this Dominion, and your most favoured be therein, in the same case with your Suppliants: that ancient faith and religion which we defend, cannot be cause to such offence; for so all Catholics in the world, that be, and ever were, were to be censured by their Princes, with such measure. To profess that religion in a Protestant regiment, cannot breed such variance; for so all other Catholic subjects, in all protestant Countries, were in the same case.  
And if one and the same religion, can (by any not appearing reason) be feared by some, subject to suspicions at home, which thei● politic wisdom may suppose, no foreign protestant government hath so sufficiently attended and considered; we have in the sincerity of our souls, without all equivocation or doubtful sense, purged ourselves from all jealousy of those opinions, pretences, or practices, which our enemies could discover, worthy to b● objected. In answer whereof we have both made manifest proof, that we do not otherwise esteem of the Protestants of this nation, than ourselves, and those of the same faith with us, in all civil societies and communications; that we give the s●me temporal duty, loyalty, and obedience, to our Sovereign, honour to Nobles, and love to all; that although we differ in religion, yet we are so far from making Protestants odious, and unworthy of mutual communications in civil affairs, that we defend their dignities, magest●acy and rule, against men of their own profession. We do not assign any sovereign mere civil power over Princes as the Protestants in all places have taught and practised, neither any spiritual pre-eminence in any extern Prelate, prejudicial to Princes right. as our opposers do in presbyteries, and private Ministers; we have not denied either election, or succession of Protestant Princes, as our adversaries have done, both to Catholics and Protestants, for their own advantage: our doctrine denieth no obedience to you, which was ever given to any Christian Prince of England, from the first, unto the last King Henry the seventh, by whom, and whose eldest Catholic Daughter, your Highness is enthroned. We do not suggest the discoverers objected forcible deposition of elected Princes: Protestants have deprived more in this short being of their Gospel, by their popular mutinies and private authority, than all Popes in all ages of christian religion, with public consent of Princes and people, have condescended unto. Protestants have taken Arms and raised general rebellions, more often against Princes, not to be condemned, than all Popes have imposed censures, by public complaint, against those which are noted in histories, for extraordinary impious. If any hath otherwise proceeded, no Catholic may defend it: we do not, nor may not by our religion, intent, design, or practise, justify, or defend the murder of Princes, or profess rebellions: the discipline of the holy Church and general councils, (rules in our religion) deny it for lawful: what privileges protestancy claimeth, what it hath taught and practised in that point, Hungary, Transiluania, Germany, Bohemia, Denmark, Helvetia, Flanders, Sweveland, France, Em●en, your majesties kingdoms, and yourself have been witnesses, for many years. We do not allow in opinion, or may practise in act, equivocation, concealed, double or secret sense, in affairs of Commonweal, and juridical interrogatories, and profession of religion. They be Protestants which defend and practise it in such causes, not justifiable in true divinity. Our Priests, neither under that reduplicative formality (as Priests) nor otherwise maintain by our religion, any position or practice seditions, or not obedient: if any particular men for want of learning, have seemed to speak or think, or for want of grace, dealt or practised in other sense, (no religion made all men Saints) religion did not teach it, and Catholics generally condemn it.  
Therefore our confidence cannot but continue, that the Royal promises of your highest Authority, of Lenity, of no blood for Religion, shall not be recalled. The demerritt of a few, is no general impediment. The Scriptures instruct us, anima quae peccaverit ipsa moriatur; one man must not be are the burden of others sins. All Schools agree, that no man can condignly merit first grace, to any other, though but one; then the transgression of one, or few, cannot be demeritte, for innocents to be afflicted; great is the difference of the members in a natural, and civil body, in this cause, though the first do suffer in some sense together, by connexion in nature, yet in the second, the case and reason is different.  
Remember most worthy Prince, not only how grievous, but how general the penalties against your Catholics be enacted: And yet new threatenings be made, that new and more strange (as nec inter gentes) shall be ordained: The bodies, honours, reputations, and riches of husbands, to be punished for their wives religion, and souls; to which they are neither husbands, nor superiors. Children to be taken from Parents, Parents to be deprived of thei● education; which Catholic Princes do not, and in conscience, cannot offer to the jews themselves, though (in some opinion) the slaves of Christians. Children, servants, kinsmen, and neighbours are to be made hired Espials, to betray their parents, masters, kindred, friends, in things, as unlawful, which the whole Catholic world honoureth for holy, and they venture their souls and fempitermtie that they be such, commendable Arts, Functions of physic etc. which have not connexion with Religion, are to be put to silence in Catholics. The severe penalty for not monthly professing the Protestant faith in Churches, (when in all divinity the precept of Profession of true and undoubted faith, in se, and ex se bindeth but seldom) is to be increased: And others of such condition, too many here to be mentioned, and too grievous and unnatural (we hope) in your Princely opinion, to be concluded by a King's consent. Therefore, under savour for all, I instance in one most heavy and general in those of our deceased Queen.  
All Priests though never so dutiful or obedient be censured for Traitors, equally with the greatest offendor in sin of Treason, when many guiltless souls of that sacred order, would not for thousands of worlds once consent to any such, or a far inferior offence. A thing most strange and beyond all example, that men in respect only of their calling, and function, and that function so reverenced by all our forefathers, should without further cause be condemned as guilty of so a detested crime. We defend holy priesthood to be a sacrament, which being ordained by God, cannot be changed by man, Pope, Prelate, or human power but remaineth in all things, substance, and doctrine, the same which in those days when it was so honourably esteemed of all your christian progenitors, & when our mother Church kept her first integrity by your highness judgement as we are ready to make defence. And if your Majesty should decree the like law against any degree, or profession of your other subjects; or the king of France, (or other Prince in other estate of men) should enact by Parliament, that all Ministers in his Dominions made contrary to the Roman use, approved in his Territories) should be Traitors; the pulpits of England would not be silent, to reprove it of great absurdity. We ●ope therefore; that the rare example of one Queen, will not over balance so many your holy and wise Progenitors, and all Princes of the world in this point. And if one against so many hundreds, could carry (against so many reasons) equivolent motive of imitation: yet we trust, as you do not inheritte by Queen Elizabeth, (or King Edward the sixth, or King Henry the eight) whose next line and life, rather suspended your Title, than gave you the Diadem of these united dominions; but by Queen Margaret, and Queen Marie of Scotland, Catholic princes, and King Henry the seventh, of England, of the same Religion, with all their, and your common Ancestors; so you rather will inheri●te the steps of them, so many, and holy, in this path, which left you so great a Title, both to heaven and earth, then follow the lone example, of one woman, or the father, and son, a child, from whom no such preeminens is, or can be derived.  
It is the honour of our King in Heaven, (most mighty Sovereign) for which we continue in combat: that Religion which the whole Catholic world in all general Councils, Popes, Doctors, and learned men, hath ever professed, wherein this Nation (as our Protestants acknowledge) one thousand years since, 
joh. Bal. l. de Script. Angl. in August. monach. Will. Tetrastyl.  was converted, all our Christian ancestry embraced, and which all Princes (in the school of Christ) of whom your Majesty is descended, maintained in themselves, and subjects. That which is so general, cannot be surrendered by a small number, of one kingdom: It is not in the power of Man to resign the honour of God. Protestant's and Puritans, which have turns, and changes, for all occasions, which communicate in spiritual things, with so many different in profession, which can subscribe, and swear to Parliament articles, and yet renounce them, take oath of Prince's supremacy, yet speak, preach, and print against it, communicate in Churches, service and sacraments with them, which they say, be infidels, and that none going to their Churches, can be saved, submit their faith and religion to stand, or be changed, as pleaseth Princes, which had not any Church, chapel, Prince, or subject, of their religion, until the days of Luther; and now is the same no further, then in one time or Country, may without great loss to themselves, damage to others, or new dishonour to God, change as the wind serveth, their spirit suggesteth, or appetite desireth. Such men may easily and only condescend, to change their right, and relinquish their interest: being such as the Apostle thus describeth: Always learning, and never attaining to the knowledge 
2. Timoth. 3▪ v. 7  of truth.  
Yet nevertheless (dread Liege) if it will please your Majesty to vouchsafe us licence to request, and grace to obtain, that your own princely sentence and censure may stand: that we ought not to departed further from the Roman Church, (our mother Church by your judgement) than she hath departed from herself, when she was in her best, and flourishing state. And that the time of Constantine was incorrupted in religion, we humbly again offer trial before your Highness, with equal c●nditions of Schools, against the most selected & chosen Protestant Bishops & doctors of your dominions, to prove, or defend any, or every substantial article, which we now profess, to be agreeable unto (and not dissenting) the known, public, Catholic doctrine of that mother Church, in those your mentioned incorrupted days of Christianity.  
And seeing the disfavour and penalties against lay Catholics, are grounded upon their Recusancy, to be present at your protestant Service; we humbly beseech, it may be called to memory, how they have protested in several supplications, one to your Majesty, before the end of the last Parliament; and the other to Queen Elizabeth, in the seven and twenty year of her reign, to be builded only upon fear of offending God. To which, their so long and manilold disgraces, losses, imprisonments, and sufferings, are sufficient witness; and for further trial thereof, have offered to repair to your Protestant Churches and Service, without further exception, if the learned of your religion can, and do prove to the learned of their profession, that it may be performed without offence to God: which is so much in the opinion of all divines, as any christian subjects can offer in this cause. In which mind, as I doubt not but they still continue, so I am assured, that the Priests of England will give like consent. This if your Protestant Clergy do refuse, or do not satisfy so Christian a request, we hope your Majesty, being wise, learned, judicious, and gracious, will perceive, that the severity of the laws against them, for that cause, is not to be put in practice. These things in most humble manner, we commend to your highest and merciful consideration: And so, desiring of the Almighty, to grant all happiness and prosperity to your Majesty, and posterity, we conclude in all dutiful subjection, with that ancient Father: We will faithfully serve you in your Palace, we will accompany other your subjects in the market, we will join with them in the field against your enemies; only to you we leave the Churches.   
FINIS.   

Fauls escaped.  
In the Ep●ste, or, are. tam, cum.  
Chap. 1. Rogesr, Rogers.  
Chap. 2. Haereticus, Haereticis. manimenta, munimenta. not above four or fine, not many. the Prophets and Priests of juda deposed: under the Prophets and Priests of juda were deposed. not now, and are not now.  
Chap. 4. Philopatre, Philopater. which, which is.  
Chap. 5. and it was, and that it was. if, it.  
Chap. 6. natum, nutum. violatore, violatorem. approve, reprove.  
Chap. 9 vermia, Austrae. vienna, Austriae. Canickname, a nickname. 100000, 1000000. Inns, Irons.  
Chap. 10. vindice, iuridieé. mentire, mentiri. natural consciences, internal consciences. a semiplea, a semiplene. statish Protestants, Scottish Protestants. Caluinianum, caluinianam.  
Chap. 11. punished, promised.