¶ A strong DEFENCE OF THE marriage of priests, against the Pope Eustachians, and Tatanites of our time, made dialogue wise by john Veron, betwixt Robin papist, and the true Christian. I. CORIN. VII. ♣ For avoiding of fornication, let every man have his wife, and every woman her husband. HEBRE. XIII. ¶ Wedlock is honourable among all, and the bed undefiled, but whoremongers and adulterers god will judge. ¶ Imprinted at London in Fleetstreet near to Saint Dunston's Church by Thomas Marsh. ☞ To the worshipful, Master George Basford Leather sealer, Citizen of London. etc. john Veron wisheth grace, peace of conscience, and increase in all godliness from God the father, through his Son jesus Chyrste our Lord. FOr as much as many do yet now at this time, in the which it hath pleased God our heavenly father, of his mere mercy and goodness to visit this flourishing realm again, with his holy and sacred word and with the gospel of his son jesus Christ, kick against the lawful marriage of the faithful ministers of the church holding still opinion that it is not lawful for them, which are preachers of gods word, and do minister the sacraments, to be couppled in matrimony: A brief sum of the whole doctrine that is taught in this book. I have thought good, somewhat to write of this matter, & to prove by manifest scriptures, and by the autorytyes of the old & ancient writers, that all they which have not the gift of chastity may lawfully, & without any offence of god marry, Hebre, xiii. yea, although they had by foolish and fond vows not commanded of god, bound them selves to the contrary, that so they may avoid fornication with all kind of uncleanliness, and kept themselves in that holy estate, undefiled members of our saviour jesus christ. First, and foremost these are the words of th'apostle: Marriage is honourabell among all, and the bed undefiled. Whereby this apostle doth admonish us, that as incontinency, is a disease comen to men of all sorts, and degrees, so marriage being the remedy against it, is offered by the free mercy and goodness of god, to all manner of men without any respect, The moderate use of a woman in lawful Matrimony is reputed for no sin. and that the moderate use of a woman in lawful Matrimony, is not reputed for sin, for which cause, he calleth the bed of the godly married, undefiled. Whereunto doth that godly ancient father agree, I mean Paphnutius, who in the council of Nice withstood those, Sozo. li. i echi. cap. xxiii. Socrate constan. Epiphanus. li. two. cap. xiiil. that would have forbidden marriage unto the ministers of the church, confessing wedlock to be honorabel, and the cohabitation of man with his lawful wife to be chastity. Again, this holy apostle in his first epistle to the Corinthians saith plainly thus: let every man have his wife, and let every woman have her husband, i Cor. seven. for avoiding of fornication. Which saying, as it ought not to be extended to those, that have of God, the singular gift of chastity, so it pertaineth generally to all them, that wanting the same, have need of the remedy, which the creature of all, knowing best the complexion and nature of men, did institute and ordain, saying: Gene, two. It is not good for man to be alone. And whereas the enemies, do affirm, that this aught to be understanded, Objection. & taken of those that be already couppled in matrimony, that we should grant that to be true, what can they gather of it, but that the same commandment is also given, Answer. unto them that are unmarried? If a man did use this kind or that kind of meat, and the physician should say unto him: see that ye use still that meat, and it shall preserve you from this sickness, or that sickness that ye are inclined and given to: if any other which used not that diet, and yet felt himself subject to that disease, heard this physicians counsel, would not he if he tendered his health, think that this were spoken unto him also? Even so if the apostle should say, to them, that be already married: See that ye abide, and continue still in this holy state of Matrimony, using with all thankfulness the remedy that god hath appointed for you, and ye shall thereby avoid whoredom and uncleanliness, and consequently everlasting damnation, which is of God prepared for whoremongers, and adulterers: Who being unmarried, and feeling themselves subject to fornication (if at lest they did tender the health and salvation of their own souls) would not think this to be spoken unto them? And that they are bound to use the same remedy against filthiness & unclean living, i Cor. seven. that the married folk are commanded to use? this I am sure, That is with the fire of concupiscence. I mean, when men's will, for lack of the gift of chastity doth so give place, to the lust that tempteth, that he can not call upon god with a quiet conscience. is spoken generally to all, that have not the gift of chastity. Let the unmarried and widows, if they cannot abstain, marry, for it is better to marry then to burn. Again if thou takest a wife thou sinnest not: likewise if a virgin marry she sinneth not, nevertheless such shall have trouble in their flesh. Whereby he understandeth the troubles and cares of their children and family, and other like, which do belong unto the cross that god will have to be annexed to this estate. Similitude. And for the which they that be destitute & void of the gift of continency, aught in no wise to forbear wediocke. For, that were, as if a man belng extremely sick, should say: I have need of that Physic, but because it is better, I will not take it, I had lyeffer die, than to suffer it to come within my lips: Who would not judge that man, to be worse than mad? But this goodly liberty that the holy ghost did give unto all men by his holy apostle, who saith in another place: I do not speak this, to tangle you in a snare, is clean taken away by the tyranny of that antichrist of Rome, who did lay on the necks of his clergy a burdone, heavier than the mount Aethna as the common by word goeth. Whereof, Aethna is a mountain in in Scicile that burneth continually, and is of the Italians called mount Gibello. many did very grievously complain, as it doth manifestly appear by their own writings. These are the words of Baptista Mantuanus being a Carmelite, in the life of Hilarius being bishop of Poetiers in France. Baptista Mantuanus in vita Hilarii. Integritas vitae, legum prudentia, cultus Caelituum, tutela inopum, diadema pedumque Pictaviense tibi, dum nil mortalia euras, Dum vivis tibi▪ sort tua contentus, ah omni Ambitione procul, populo applaudente, tulerunt Non nocuit tibi progenies, non obstitit uxor Legitimo coniuncta toro, non horruit illa Tempestate deus thalamos, cunabula, taedas. Sola erat in praetio, quae nunc incognita virtus. Sordet, et attrito vivit cum plebe cucullo, Propterea leges, quaesunt connubia contra Esse malas quidem perhibent, prudentia patrum Non satis advertit, dicunt, quid ferre recuset, Quid valeat natura pati: Ceruicibus aiunt, Hoc insuaue jugum nostris imponere Christus Noluit: istud onus quod adhuc quamplurima monstra Fecit, ab audaci, dicunt pietate repertum. Tutius esse volunt, qua lex divina sinebat Isse via, vetenrumque sequi vestigia patrum: Quorum vita fuit melior, cum coniuge, quam nunc Nostra sit exclusis thalamis et coniugis usu. Which verses, I will english as well as I can, following rather the sense and meaning, then either the words or the Meter. The integrity of life, And of laws the science, The worshipping of god, And of them the defence, Which poor and needy were, While thou livedst, not caring For worldly pomp and pride, Nor for richesse passing, But in all thy pilgrimage, And life held the content, With that which god appointed, And from ambition went, By this periphrase he understandeth the bishopric. Unto the have brought Of Poetyers most famous The mitre and croissier both, Thereat being joyous The people that in it dwelled, Nor yet did then thy wife Unto the by the law joined, Which then was rife, Nor thy lawful issue, That by her thou hadst had, Hinder the any whit, But that thou wast lad With the charge of the flock Which Christ so dear had bought, For, then god in those days, As of men well is thought Marriage allowed, And that to it pertained: For, then virtue alone, Whereunto few attained, Praised and allowed was, And had in most price, Which now unknown is, And dwells among lice, Amongst them, I mean, That in rags do go, And in poverty live, Misery, grief, and woe, Therefore, those laws, I say, Which wedlock do debar, To be wicked and nought, Men in wit passing far, Do judge, and also say, That the forefather's prudence, Weigh did not, nor perceive, The hurtful pestilence That thereof did ensue, And that human nature Such things to bear, Refuseth, this is sure, That Christ would never lay On us so unpleasant Nor yet so hard a yoke, That strength and might do want. Such great burden, say they, Which breadeth man monsters, By it he understandeth the strange kind of uncleanness that was used among them. Which to many a one, Will be in stead of wonders, Did come and so proceed Of bold (what should we it call?) arrogancy? not so: But pity, they do all Or godliness term it: Howbeit they all affirmed All manner of men's inventions cloaked under the name and title of godliness. That surer it had been, That way which god confirmed By his law to have gone, And of the father's ancient The trade and steps eke, To have followed, they meant, Whose life, was far better, With wife, children, and household Than our life is now, That wifeless life do hold. ¶ first and foremost we learn by baptist Mantuan, who, as I said, was a Carmelite, that Hilarius, bishop of Poetiers was married, & that neither his wife, nor his children, that he had by her, did let him to be a bishop. Secondly, how that many did complain, that they were deprived of the liberty to mary, having the intolerable burdone of constrained chastity laid upon their shoulders, whereby many, not being able to bear it, were driven to commit those things that were unlawful, & most detestable in god's sight. And therefore he did right well conclude, that the life of them in time past, which had wives children, & households, did far exceed & pass in godliness, the life of the wifeless clergy of his time. Siluianus also, bishop of Massilia, showing the matrimony is lawful for the ministers of the church, Siluianus. li. v. De providentia dei. doth speak thus of the forbidding of it. Nowm pro sus est conversionis genus, licita non faciunt, illicita committunt. Temperant a coniugio, et non temperant a rapina. Quid agis stulta persuasio? peccatae enterdizit deus, non matrimonia. That is to say. Truly this a new kind of conversion. They do not those things that be lawful, & commit those things, that be unlawful. They do abstain from wedlock, but they do not abstain from rapine. What dost thou foolish persuasion? God hath forbidden sins, & not matrimony. Your deeds do not agree with your studies. ye that say, that ye are the workers of virtues, ought not to be the friends of sins. This is not a conversion, but an aversion or turning away. Ye that a great while a go, as the report goeth have forsaken the work of honest matrimony, cease at length from wickedness. Polidorus Virgilius de inventoribus rerum. li. v. cap. iiii. So far Saluianus, unto whom Polidorus Vergilius may be joined, who in his books De inventoribus rerum writeth on this manner: This I am able to say, that it is so far of, that this constreigned chastity, did pass the chastity of married folks, that rather no enormity of sin hath purchased and brought greater infamy & shame to the order more hurt or harm to the religion, greater grief to all good men, Peradventure may right well be left. than the blot or blemish of the priests incontinency. Therefore peradventure it would be both for the profit of the christian common weal, and for the commodity of the order, that one's the right of public marriage should be restored unto the priests, which they might rather keep godly without any shame, than thus with such filthy vice of nature to defile them selves most unclenly. joha. Anto. Titu. Qui clerici vel voventes matrimonia contra here possunt. joannes Antonius bishop of Alexandria, doth plainly affirm that in the primitive church it was lawful for priests to have wives, yea being in the holy orders, so that in the time of the celebration or ministration of the Sacraments they should abstain from their wives Afterwards a forbidding thereof, did begin in the occidental church, that they which were in the holy orders, should live a continent life. Farther more this cardinal doth say, that this commandment did minister an occasion to snare many souls, and that therefore he did believe, that as the Church did bring in that commandment of constreygned chastity, so she would revoke or call it back again. i Cor. seven Which calling back, should be agreeable with this saying of Saint Paul, Panormitanus. touching the Virgins, I have no commandment, but I give consel. The like in a manner doth Panormitanus write, whose words for avoiding of tediousness, and specially because that they do agree, with them that I alleged before, I will now omit: doth not pope Innocentius the fourth set forth the same doctrine, saying received plainly that by the law of nature, Matrimony doth let no man to be received into the holy orders? Innocent .4. in suis commentariis Titu de conuers. coniug. cap. placet. For, by the law of nature, he that is received into the holy orders may use matrimony ready contracted as the oriental church doth. Yea, he might also marry or contract matrimony being in the holy orders, except the constitutions of the church should forbid it. Wherein two things are plainly granted of this Pope. first, that they that be coupled in marriage, may both be received into the ministery, and also use (and that by the law of nature) in the time of it, their matrimony. secondly, how that if it were not for the constitutions and laws of the church, they might also mary, after that they be called to the ministry. But as for the church, this are we sure of, that the true spouse of our saviour jesus christ, will make no laws and constytutions contrary to the word, institution & ordinance of her head and husband, jesus Christ, who in all places, both by himself, and by his apostles do give unto all them, The true church will make no laws contrary to God his word. that have not the gift of continency, free liberty to mary, and with a good conscience, to use that remedy, which god from the beginning hath appointed for all men. Therefore the constitutions & laws of the church, Panormitanus words are so notable▪ that I could not but bring them. can not debar from matrimony, those, that by a singular gift and calling of god, be not appointed unto a single, & wifeless life. Of force I am constrained contrary to that, which I said before, to bring in the words of Abbas Panormitanus, Panormi. de clericis coningatis. capi. Cum olim. which are these, Continency is not in the clergy, of the substance of the order, nor of the law of God. For, else the Greeks should sin: neither should custom excuse them, forasmuch as custom ought in no wise to prevail, nor to bear or have any place against the law of god. And I do not only believe, that the church hath power to grant that the clergy may marry, as the Greeks do, but also that this would be a wholesome statute, for the profit & health of the souls, that they, which can abstain & merit more, should be left to their own will, and that they which can not abstain might marry. For the experience doth teach us, that a contrarry effect doth ensue and follow, of that law of continency, sith that men live not spiritually, nor be clean, but are defiled with the unlawful use of women, not without great offence against god, whereas the lawful use of their own wives, should be chastity. Therefore the church ought to do, as a good physician, which having learned by experience, that his medicine doth more hurt than good, doth remove or take it away. Hitherto have we taught briefly, that it is lawful by god's word for all them that have not the gift of chastity, to couple themselves in matrimony, and also that the ancient ministers of the primitive church, as Hilarius and other, had wives, in the time of their ministry, whereunto I may by the way add these words of Jerome: If Samuel being brought up in the tabernacle, Hieroni. lib. prun. in iovinianum. did marry a wife, what is this prejudicial to virginity? As though now in these days many pryestes have not wives: and the apostle doth not describe & set forth a bishop to be the husband of one wife having children with all chastity? The Apostelle sayeth he, was of the jews, Idem an Oceanum. and the primitive church of christ was gathered of the remnant of the jews. He knew, that it was granted by the law, and that it was by the example of the patriarchs and of Moses, a familiar thing unto the people, to get children of many wives. Which privilege, was also open or free for the pryestes. He doth command them that the churches, Math. xi● Gene. two. do not challenge or claim the like licence, and that the priests have not at one time ii or iii wives, but one only, contenting themselves with the first ordinance of god, where he sayeth: And they shall be two in one flesh. We have also declared what complaints many godly men have made, that this liberty to mary, was by the cruel tyranny of the Roomishe beast, taken away from those, unto whom the gift of chastity was denied, & how earnestly they did desire, that it might be restored again. Now, for as much as I have sufficiently spoken in my book, of those that by foolish and fond vows not commanded of God, had rashly and unadvisedly bound themselves to single life, or rather to unclean chastity, and unchaste continency: I will shortly answer certain fond objections, that some worldlings which nevertheless will seem to be earnest favourers of the scriptures & of the gospel of our saviour jesus Christ, be wont to make. Although say they it be lawful by gods word that ministers should mary, Objection. yet it is not expedient, that they should have wives. For they that be married must care for the world, how they their wives, and children shall live, so that they can not lightly give their minds to other things: The fond reasons of the gospellicke worldlings. how can the ministers then, being married: and having houses full of children, apply their learning, and give themselves to heavenly contemplation, that they may feed their flock with wholesome doctrine? The whole day will scarcely serve to compass and cas●e, how they and their family may live, i Cor. seven. that we should let pass this saying of Paul: He that is married, careth for the things of the world, how he may please his wife: whereas he that is unmarried, careth for the things of the lord, how he may please the lord. Again: if they be suffered to mary, that will minister a great occasion to them to be covetous, and to keep nygarde houses, so that the poor shall not be refreshed by them as they ought to be, they will give themselves to purchase houses and land for their brottes: What hospitality then shall they be able to keep? Or if they will not in their life time provide for their wives & children, shall they not fill the world with beggars? These are the gay painted reasons that our gospellicke worldlings be wont to allege, Answer. for to put the true ministers of the church from that which is lawful by gods word, How the text alleged by the adversaries ought to be taken and of whom it is understanded. that so they may (whiles they maintain their expediency, I mean that which they call expedient) fall headlong into that which is unlawful, & forbidden of God in his holy scriptures. first, as touching that which they have alleged out of the first epistle to the Corinthians, it ought doubtless to be understanded of them, that having the gift of chastity, have no need to mary, except they will, and not of them, which for want of it are fayns to use the remedy which go denieth to no man, that hath need of it. For, doth he not say a little before: They that can not abstain, let them mary: ●. Cor. seven. It were in deed to be wished, that all they that be called to the ministry, should be endued with that most excellent gift. But sith that it hath pleased god, otherwise, who distributeth his gifts, as he knoweth to be most expedient for his glory: and for the profit and edifying of his church. Mark well this. Who are we, that should strive with god? One of these three things must we need to choose? Either we must content ourselves, with those ministers, which seeing, or rather feeling themselves to be destitute of the gift of continency do in the fear of god mary, that they may keep themselves undefiled members of our saviour jesus christ: or else we must call down angels from heaven to minister unto us: or if they please not, or if we can not have them as we would, we must suffer still those filthy whoremongers, and stinking sodomites, that swarmed heretofore over all the whole world, to remain still. I do not deny, but that there be some, unto whom it is given, that they should geld themselves, or make them selves chaste for the kingdom of heaven sake, but they are very thin sown. They that be so, let them with all thankfulness employ that gift to the advancing and setting forth of god's glory, i Cor. seven. and to the enlarging of his kingdom, having always this saying of Paul before their eyes: we would that all our brethren and fellow servants were all, as we are, but every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and an other after that. But now will I come to the rest of their objections. As touching the troubles & cares that are commonly in matrimony, we have spoken of them already, shewing that they do pertain unto the cross which God will have to be annexed to this holy estate: and that for them (as I said afore) no man wanting the gifts of continency ought to forbear matrimony. No state of man's life here in this world can be without troubles & cares. Howbeit I would by the way that they should show me any estate of man's life her upon the earth, that can be without troubles and cares. If any having the gift of chastity & being called to the mystery, do go about to keep hospitality, how many things, he shall daily and hourly be troubled with all common experience doth sufficiently teach us. How many times shall he be feign to play Martha's part, and by himself to do many things every hour of the day almost, which if he had a trusty yoke fellow, he needed not to trouble himself with all? but give himself quietly to his book? Although I say he doth all the day long give himself to his own study, being only careful over the flock of christ, yet he is sure that all things shallbe well seen to at home: Whereof else (such is the unfaithfulness of servants, without one that should always over see him) he will always be in doubt, and never be quiet in his mind. What shall we say then of those which besides these comen troubles and cares, The intolerable troubles of them that want the gift of continency, and cannot be suffered to marry do burn with the fire of concupiscence, and cannot be suffered to use the lawful waters, that God hath appointed, for to quench it? How well (I pray you) shall they be able to apply their learning, and to give themselves to heavenly contemplation? And as for the feeding of the people with the heavenly food of God's word, this I am sure, no man is able to deny, but that there have been more Godly Sermons made in one year, by faithful married ministers, sense our sovereign Lady Queen Elyzabeth did come in, than were made in all Queen mary's time, by their wyfelesse and virgin priests. But this is very handsome, that they do object, that scarcely the whole day will serve them, for to cast, how they their wives, & family may live. As though whole years will serve their unmarried priests, that want the gift of continency, for to cast, where they may get filthy harlots, how they may maintain them like gentlewomen, or rather, which is worse, how they may abuse other men's wives, and have their children to sit by other men's fierce, were it not better, for such a minister, as hath not the gift of continency, but yet hath the fear of GOD before his eyes, It is not better in the fight of the world. to care for his own lawful wife, and for his children lawfully begotten in true wedlock, in the which he may keep himself an undefiled member of our Saviour jesus Christ, than to be put, for want of his lawful remedy, to cark and care, and that to the utter destruction of his body and soul, for a vile strumpet, Sapience. and his bastards, which another day, shall bear witness against their ungodly parents? As for the parryll of covetousness, and the pourchassing of house and land for their brettes, whereby the married ministers, shallbe feign to keep nyggarde houses, or to keep less hospitality, and give less relief to the poor, than they ought to do. I answer that in this they may be likened unto a certain great usurer, This is spoken of the wicked worldlings. who did hire Preachers to Preach against usury, that all other being by the terrible threatenings of God's word, frayed from that abominable sin he alone might occupy usury: Esay. v, In like manner, that they may join house to house, A great offence, I tell you, if the faithful ministers should with their own money truly gotten pourchasse ought for their wives and children. and Land to Land, until there be not one plot of ground left, to be gotten for money, they will have none of the clergy to purchase one small Cottage for their wives and children, to hide their heads in, after their decease. And why, because that they alone will reign hear upon the earth, and will have the whole world in their hands. But in the mean while, no hospitality shallbe kept, and the poor shall want their due relief. Pauperes curant scilicet. As though they care much for the poor, whom every where they do most ungodly oppress, and with whose blood, the mortar is tempered that their princelike hoses be builded with all. Yea, are they not the cause, that the realm is so full of poverty? Diomedes was a cruel tyrant which gave men to his horses to be devoured of them which thing was said of him, because he caused the whole country to be eaten up with his horses, so that men could have no food. Do they not with their sheep (being in this point worse than ever Diomedes was) eat up whole villages and towns, so that where there were xl or lx plows going, ye shall now scarcely find ii going? And where good farmers dwelled and kept great hospitality relieving the whole township, there they keep a shepherd with his boy and his dog, so that a man may aswell break his neck as break his fast there, from whence afore no poor boy was suffered to go away empty or unrefreshed. And yet they will seem to favour hospytalytie, for sooth. But it must be at other men's costs, and that they their selves may be feasted, & have good cheer when they come to Master persons, or to master vicars. For, although the faithful Minister doth to his power refresh his poor neighbours, yet unless he doth every foot feast these great cobs, and make them lusty cheer, when soever they lust to come, he is not counted to keep any house at all. Now, if the peril of covetousness, which they will have the married ministers to be so subject unto, can debar them from marriage, which they grant to be lawful by god's word, what might be said of those that be in office under a prince? might it not with a better reason be said, that it were most parillous to suffer them to marry, No less peril of covetousness in them that be in office under a prince, than in the ministers. left being moved with an inordinate desire to leave their wives and children in a wealthy and rich estate, they should pill and pole the people, and pilfer from the prince? For, they can no more leave their offices unto their wives and children, than the ministers can their livings. Let any man that hath wit judge, in whether of those ii estates their is greater danger of covetousness, and in whether of them covetousness, can be more hurtful to the common weal. Howbeit, this as the rest is but accidental. For although some among the ministers, be stricken with covetousness, yet many (god be praised) have the fear of God before their eyes, and do from the bottom of their hearts detest and abhor covetousness. It was not prejudicial to the rest of the apostles, that judas being one of the xii was both covetous & a thief. Neither ought this to move any man, where they say, that unless they do whylles they be alive provide for their wives and children they must fill the world full of beggars. For they that are godly, will see their Children to be brought up, that they shallbe able to make honest shift for themselves, Psa●. xxxvii. after their parent's decease. Again, is not this David's saying: I have been young, and am old, yet I saw never the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread? Hereby do we learn, that although the Godly dieth, yet his blessings shallbe extended to his posterity. But in the mean season, this is not remembered of them, that their wifeless, priests do fill the whole world with whoredom and uncleanliness and all men's houses with bastards, as much as in them doth lie, which thing must needs kindle the wrath of GOD against us, and at length to bring the same vengeance upon the whole world, Genesis. nineteen. that was by the righteous judgement of God poured upon Sodom and Gomorre, and all the country about. Sith now therefore that I have made a sufficient answer, to the foolish and fond objections of our ghospellike worldlings, I will make an end, desiring your good Mastershyppe, to take this my rude labour in good worth, which I offer unto you now at this present, for a sign of gratitude and thankfulness, & to declare that although I have not seen you this great while yet I am not unmindful of you, nor of the gentle kindness, that ye have showed to me ward at all times. Thus the living God above, who is the giver of all goodness, preserve you and all yours and send you prosperous success in all your godly affairs to his glory, and your everlasting comfort. The argument of the book. FIrst & foremost, I call the enemies of the ministers marriage, pope Eustachians, because that in this point, they follow those ancient heretics, whom they called commonly Eustachians, which about the year of the lord .324. held opinion, the married ministers ought in no wise to be esteemed, yea that no man ought to receive the holy communion at the hands of them that were coupled in matrimony, which opinion was thought is strange, that then a council was gathered & assembled against in Gangris, The canon of the council Gangris. a town of Paphlagonia, where it was proved to be directly against God's word and the truth thereof. And therefore this canon or decree was made against them. Qui coniugatum presbiterum discernit, quasi occasione nuptiarum offerre non debeat▪ et iam ab eius oblatione abstinet, anathemas●. That is to say, he that doth discern or maketh a difference of a married priest, although because of his marriage, he can not offer, or minister the holy communion, & doth already abstain from his oblation, let him be accursed. Whereby, as I have proved in my book, we can judge none other, but that the Pope's catholics, which do so abhor married ministers, making no conscience at all to receive the sacraments, at a sort of whoremongers hands are by their own canons, anathema, that is to say, accursed. Against them I have here in this small treatise written. first, showing that all the scriptures, that they do allege, both out of the old and new Testament, for to impugn the marriage of priests, are shamefully wrested and wreathed. Secondly I have proved, that all the vows that the religious persons, or secular priests, did make, for to bind themselves perpetually unto single life, are directly against the holy and sacred Scriptures, and word of God, and that therefore they may lawfully break them, and couple themselves in honest matrimony, that so living in the fear of God, they may keep themselves undefiled members of our saviour jesus christ. thirdly, I have declared most manifestly, both by the examples of the Scriptures, and also by strong arguments taken out of the same, that all religious persons or seculare pryestes, that have not the gift of chastity, ought to mary: in so much that if there be any that having not the gift of chastity, will not use the remedy, that God hath appointed, for all men: The Godly Magistrates ought to compel them, and if they be disobedyente, to depose them least by their incontinent living, they be an offence and stumbling block unto the church, and a slander unto the doctrine that they have taught and set forth. These things have been done briefly and shortly, meaning hereafter, if any do kick against his doctrine, to answer them fully, by the leave & assistance of my lord and saviour jesus christ. To whom with the father, and the holy ghost, be all praise glory, and honour, world without end. Amen. DO they disaprove the apostles? Peter and Philip did beget children. Phil●p also did marry his daughters to husbands. Neither doth Paul stick in a certain epistle of his, to salute his wife, which he did not carry about, that he might be the more ready to the ministry. Clemens Alexandrinus. Ex Euschii historia. lib. 3. Cap. 30. I Do not backbite the other blessed men, which were coupled in matrimony, of whom I made mention now. For, I wish, that being worthy of god, I may be found in his kingdom at their feet, as Abraham, Isaac, and jacob, as joseph, Isaiah, and other Prophets, as Peter & Paul, & the other apostles, which were coupled in matrimony, which had wives, not for to fulfil the lusts of the flesh, but to have issue and posterity. Ignatius in epistola ad Philadelphienses. The Table. A Conscience marked with a hot iron what it is. 52 A notable history 36 A similitude. 47 A foolish objection. 51 A comparison betwixt the pope and Mahomet. 4 A pretty remedy to bring one to the devil. 23 A canon against the making of unadvised vows. 33 Aaron's briesthood abolished. 2 His priests must have no blemish. 14 Ambrose alleged. 24 All that have not the gift of chastity ought to mary. 6 All christians are priests, & home. 63. Arnobius. 44 Augustine contra Cresco. 57 Upon. 5. psalm 44 In libro heretico. 53 His counsel. 34 What he saith of them that marry after the vow. 35 Baal's priests and their marks. 2 Baptism and what we do vow therein. 31 By it we do become the servants of the lord. 32 By the pope's laws priests may not marry. 9 Canons and rules of the apostles. 56 Christ and his doctrine contrary to the pope. 56 Christ's body offered once for ever. 13 He hath put down the ceremonies of the old law. 18 He will have us to be free unto him. 38 He called married men to be his apostles. 45 Cyprian'S counsel. 34 Chrisostom. ad populum antiochenum. 58 Clemens Alexandrinus. 51 Counsel of Gangris. 53 And who are pronounced accursed by that counsel. 54 Church of Christ is obedient to his words. 9 Conclusion of vows. 45 Distinction. 55 Doctor martin proved a liar. 1 Eufrachians. 53 Eusebius ecclesiastical history. 53 God what he willeth. 24. He hath appointed a remedy for them that cannot live chaste. 17 He doth allow the company of man and wife together. 19 Who they be that tempt him. 16 Godly Counsel. 24 Gregory's repentance. 36. He saith marriage may not be broken for religions sake. 48 Huldaricus ad nicolaum papam. 36 If by priests we do understand ministers? all christians be not priests. 64 Isidorus counsel, upon rash promises, 33 Mahomet'S confession. 3 matrimony always in estimation among the gentiles. 50 Mar●us Antonius flaminius. 44 monkery what it is among the Papist. 49 Moses example can serve nothing for the pope. 11 What he did command the people. 10 Why he did bid them refrain from their wives. 10 Murderers of themselves. 16 Papist first argument of our time. 10 Their second argument of our time. 12 Their third argument. 18 Their forth argument. 21 Their shameless shifts. 11 Their fifth argument of our tyme. 26 Their chastity and to whom it is like. 27 They have their wife and Children sitting by other men's fires. 28 Their sixth argument of our time. 29 Their thunder bolts. 29 We must forsake their vows. 40 They are set forth with feigned chastity. 54 Their argument beaten upon their own heads. 57 They have put on whores faces. 59 They be married to our lady. 59 Paschal lamb. 20 Paul's counsel to married persons. 11 How his words ought to be understand. 26 Three things to be noted upon his words. 22 His saying doth nothing pertain to the papist. 26 Priests of Baal. 2 Pope doth blaspheme. 4 Pope hath all his service in latin and why. 6 He is worse than Mahomet which in some point doth give more honour unto christ then the pope. 7 Priests what it doth signify. 8 and why they be so called. 8 Priests of the old law why they did abstain from their wives. 13 Priests of the old law were married 45 Popish vows separate us from our true spouse jesus christ. 35 Preachers of our time and their cruel tyranny. 32 Spiritual whoredom. 36 Single life a let to those that have not the gift of chastity. 22 Sinedech and what it is. 48 Tatius, Martion, and Manicheus, enemies of matrimony. 53 The conclusion, or epilagus. 64 True chastity. 24 The sixth synod holden at Constantinople. 55 Vow, what it is. 29 How many things are to be considered in making a vow. 30 We must make them no further than it lieth in us to perform them. 31 What we vow in baptism. 31 What an ungodly vow is. 37 We must vow nothing that may let us in our vocation. 38 What liberty and freedom we lose by popish vows. 39 We must consider the intent of our vow. 40 We may vow those things that be indifferent and lie in our power. 41 Conclusion of vows. 43 Wherein they of the old law did confess. 44 What vow god doth require of us 44 The end of vows. 45 What married men might have said to the apostles if they had forsaken their wives. 46 When the apostles did leave their wives, and when they did not. 47 What sacrifices the priests of the new testament do offer. 63 What ceremonies the church doth use in choosing or making of ministers. 64 What god doth require of us. 30 Who they be that geld themselves for the kingdom of heavens sake. 28 Why widows were received into the church. 41. FINIS. ¶ A strong defence of the marriage of priests, made dialoguewise betwixt Robin Papist and the true christian. ¶ The true Christian. Well met good neighbour and in a good tyme. I pray you, where have ye been these many days? Ye were not seen here almost this hole month. ¶ Robin papist. ¶ Will ye know where I have been? I have been at London, I tell you: where I have heard many goodly sermons, They be no lecherous priests that take other men's wives, or that have hariottes in every corner. and specially against your lecherous and carnal priests, which be not ashamed to say, that they can not live without wives, and so mary, contrary to all good order, and also contrary to all godly constitutions, ordinances, and laws, of the catholic church. A reverend father I warrant you But against them did one reverend father Doctor Martin write a most learned and excellent work, which all the heretics in the world shall never be able to answer or confute. I would for your own sake that ye had read the hole book through. ♣ The true Christian. ¶ I never read Doctor martyn's book: but I have read a most clerkly answer, that a certain godly learned man, which now for the truth of god's word, Read his hole book through and thou canst say no less, but that he dooteth in deed. is fain to flee out of his own natural country, hath made against it. Where your Dooter Martin, is so handled, that he may be ashamed thar ever he did set the pen to the book. For almost in every sentence or line that he hath written, he is proved to be a most shameful liar. But we will let Martin's book alone, with the answer that hath been made unto it, and come to your goodly sermons that ye have heard. I pray you now what was the hole sum or effect of them? ¶ Robin papist. But it is lawful for them to be whoremongers. ¶ The hole sum or effect was, that it is in no wise lawful for priests to marry, and also, that marriage doth let a man to be a priest. The true Christian. ¶ Of what manner of pryestes did they speak I beseech you? Robin papist. ¶ What Question is this? Be there pryestes of more sorts than of one? The true Christian. ¶ Why should this question seem strange unto you? Do ye not know that there be priests of Baal, 2. king xviii and priests after the order of our saviour jesus christ? For, Hebru. seven. of the priests of Aaron, I need not to speak here, sith that the same priesthood, is wholly abalyshed by our saviour jesus christ, our sovereign priest, which, (as saint Paul sayeth) liveth for ever for to make intercession for us. ¶ Robin papist. ¶ I knew not so much. Therefore I thought none other, but that they spoke of those, that be pryestes after the order of our saviour jesus Christ? ¶ The true Christian. And which do ye think to be priests after the order of our saviour jesus christ? ☞ Robin papist. Those that we do commonly call: sir john, The marks of Baal's pryestes. sir Thomas, sir William etc. that have shaven crowns, and wear forked caps, with long side gowns and tippettes: which do put on white surplices on their garments, whensoever they go to their divine service: which do cense images, & say the holy and blessed mass. The true Christian. Those are not priests after the order of our saviour jesus christ. For his priests do not disguise themselves after such a sort, Read the iii chapter of the first epistle to Timothee and the fryste of the Epistel to Titus. they are no such marked monsters, but are known by other signs and tokens, which be expressly set out unto us in god's book. Therefore, those are rather the pryestes of that stinking beast and Idol Baal. Which I do intend to prove most manifestly unto you. Robin Papist. What beast or Idol is it, that ye call Baal. The true Christian. Will ye have me to tell it you? Robin papist. And I pray you so to do. The true Christian. And will ye not be angry with me? Robin papist. Wherefore should I be angry with you: for I know, that for the amity and friendship, that hath been betwixt you and me, ever sins almost that we were but young babes, ye do wish good unto me, and would that I should do no worse than ye yourself. The true Christian. ¶ I do understand by that beast or idol, which I call Baal, the bishop of Rome: which ye do name your holy father the Pope. Robin papist. I thought rather that by it, ye did understand that false prophet Mahomet. The true Christian. I do not deny but that Mahomet is most detestable, and to be abhorred of all men. But yet in comparison of your holy father the pope, in many things he may be accounted a saint. Robin papist. How can that be possible. These your sayings seem unto me very strange, yea mine ears do tinkle hear them. The true Christian. The confession of Mahomet touching our saviour jesus christ. Ye shall understand that my sayings are most true. For, although Mahomet be most wicked and devilish, yet doth he confess and acknowledge that o●re saviour jesus christ was conceived and borne of a virgin, & that the same jesus was in his time a great prophet, yea that he was the wisdom and soul of god. But in this he is most wicked, that he doth prefer himself before christ, calling himself a more excellent prophet than he was, saying also that he is the last prophet of all, and that none ought to be looked for after him. Again, he sayeth that god hath revealed more largely his secrets unto him, than to any other prophet that was before him. Moreover he doth write, that he hath showed unto him a more perfect rule, than the rule of the prophet jesus. This is the opinion of Mahomet. Now, let us come to your holy father the pope. A comparison betwixt the Pope and Mahomet. The pope doth confess that jesus Christ was conceived by the holy ghost, & borne of a virgin, that he is the son of God, and also that he was a great prophet. But afterwards, he sayeth as Mahomet, that is to say, that he is a more excellent Prophet of God, than ever jesus christ was. For he sayeth, The blasphemous saying of the Pope. that god hath revealed unto him, more of his secrets touching the salvation of men, and touching the estate and rule of perfection than unto our saviour jesus christ and his apostles. Robin papist. I think none other but that ye do slander him shamefully. He is slandered of the truth. For if he should say so, he were a very Antichrist, and not worthy to be accounted a christian man. The true Christian. Ye shall be judge yourself. For I do not intend to make a lie upon any man. It is a shame to make a lie of the devil. Now mark well what I will say, and print in your mind the words that I shall speak, and then I trust that ye will say as I say, except ye be utterly blinded, and given over into a reprobate sense. Robin papist. I tell you, neighbour, as I do see the world to go now a days, I do not intend to set myself styflye against the truth. The true Christian. Ye will grant me, that these are the words of our saviour jesus christ Without me ye can do nothing. Meaning thereby, john. xu.i. that without his special grace we can do nothing that is acceptable or pleasant unto god. And therefore, saint Paul sayeth, two. Cor. iii. that of ourselves we be not able to think as much as a good thought Again: Philippe. two. that it is god, that worketh in us both the will and also the deed But your holy father the pope sayeth that it lieth in man's power, or that man hath of his own nature liberty to do good or evil. By the doctrine also of our saviour jesus Christ, and of his apostles, we do learn, that no man is able to fulfil the law of god, Roma. three Mathe. v. Gala. two. iii. with such a perfection as god doth require at our hands, and that therefore, Ephe. two. all men are of their own nature children of wrath, and subject to everlasting damnation. But your holy father the pope sayeth the contrary, that is to say, that man is able to fulfil the law to the uttermost, and to purchase by his own merits and deservings the kingdom of heaven. jesus christ with his apostles doth say, john. iii. v. Roma. x. Gala. iii. that by the merits only of his death, passion, and bloodshedding we are delivered from everlasting death and damnation: but your holy father the Pope sayeth, that the merits of our own works, and do●nges may save us and that therefore they are necessary unto salvation. jesus christ with his apostles doth say, joh. iii. v vi Rom. iii. iiii. Gala. two. iii. that by faith only, without the works of the law, we are justified, and that it is the only mean, whereby we can obtain the free mercy of god. Nay, sayeth your holy father the pope, we are justified by our own works, & by the worthiness and merits of them, we do obtain the mercy of God. jesus christ doth forbid, to serve or worship any other, Math. iiii. v. Luke, iiii. but the living god only. Not so, doth your holy father the pope say, ye shall beside the living god, worship dead creatures and me also. jesus christ with his apostles doth say, Math. vi. Roma. x. that none ought to be called upon but God only, which doctrine is confirmed by the example of all the patriarchs, prophets, apostles, and martyrs of god But your holy father the pope, doth bid all men, to call upon the dead saints, excommunicating all them that will not do it. john. v. jesus christ with his apostles doth give a straight commandment that images should in no wise be honoured or worshipped: But your holy father the Pope doth pronounce them all heretics, that will not honour and worship them. jesus christ sayeth, that he is the way, the truth, and the life, john. xiiii. and that none cometh unto the father but by him. Again, the holy apostles do testify every where, Roma. viii. i. Cuno. two. i. john. two. that our saviour jesus christ, the only begotten son of God, is the only intercessor, advocate and mediator betwixt god and men: But your holy father the pope, doth boldy affirm, that all the blessed saints in heaven, are our intercessors and mediators, persecuting with fire & sword all those that will not agree unto his doctrine. Math. xxiii. jesus Christ will not have us to devour widows under the colour, pretence, and shadow of long prayers: But your holy father the Pope will have all his shavelings to do so, and to devour not only the houses of poor widows, but also hole realms under the colour & pretence of long prayers. Our saviour jesus christ did give a straight commandment by his holy apostle saint Paul, i Cor. xiiii. that nothing should be done in his church in a strange or unknown tongue, but that all things should be done to the edifying of the faithful congregation. Nay fie, saith your holy father the pope: Why Latin service is used in the popish church. that is not decente nor comely. Such service must be used, that no man almost doth understand, that so our Catholic proceedings, being known of no man, may the longer continue. These be almost the chief and principal points, wherein your holy father the Pope, doth most ungodly prefer himself before christ How do ye now like his doings. Robin papist. ¶ By your sayings, our holy father the pope, Hold thyself there papist. doth count himself wiser, than our saviour jesus Christ, being as much contrary unto him, as Mahomet is, though he will not be a known of it. The true Christian. ¶ Nay, ye shall understand, that he is a great deal worse than Mahomet. The Pope is worse than Mahomet. For Mahomet is no traitor to Christ, nor yet to his church, as your holy father the pope is, but professeth himself an open enemy of his, and of all his religion. Whereas your holy father the Pope under the title and name of a true servant of christ, doth both betray christ and his church, Math. xxvi. Mar. xiiii. Luke. xxii. being most like unto judas, which under the pretence and sign of love, that is to say, of a kiss, did betray his master Christ. Wherein Mahomet did give more honour unto Christ's than the pope. Moreover, although Mahomet be an enemy of jesus christ, yet doth he give him more honour than the Pope doth. For, Mahomet doth confess and acknowledge that afore he was sent of God, and had received the revelation of his rule, who so ever did live according to the rule of jesus christ, he was saved, and that whosoever shall live according unto it, shallbe saved. But that he shall not be so perfect, as he should be, by keeping his rule. Whereas your holy faher the pope doth plainly affirm, that no man can be saved by keeping of Christ's rule only, except he doth also keep his constitutions, laws and ordinances, saying that we must observe and keep them, if we will be perfect Christians. Is not this to say, that he knoweth more of the secreetes of God, than our saviour jesus christ, or his apostles did? Robin Papist. Let us leave the pope to his great judge our saviour jesus christ, and come to the matter that we began withal. Did christ no where in all his gospel forbid, that pryestes should mary? The true Christian. Afore we do begin, or go any further, What is meant by this word priest. with the matter, ye must understand what we do mean by this word, priest: for many are deceived in it. For they think that it doth only signify them, that wear shaven crowns, and white surplices upon their long side gowns, and such other gugawes. Robin papist. What doth it signify I pray you? hath it any other signification than we do give it commonly? The true Christian. This name priest cometh of this greek word, presbyter, What this word, priest, doth signify which in our english doth betoken an elder. Now if ye ask me whether Christ hath forbidden the elders of his church to marry, I answer unto you, that ye shall find no where in all the whole body of the scriptures, that they are more forbidden to mary, than the other christians are, which of the holy apostle saint Peter, are all called a spiritual priesthood, for to offer spiritual oblations and sacrifices unto almighty god. Robin papist. If this word priest doth signify an elder, why do we call them that serve in our church's priests, sith that they be for the most part, If he can say a mass, he is fit enough to be sir jodn. young boys and lads? For in these our days they do priest some, that be scarcely xviii. years old. The true Christian. ¶ They be so called, because of the ancientness, Why the ministers of the church be called priests or elders. wisdom, and soberness, and also for the great learning and discretion that should be in them. For, this word eldership, doth import and signify all these things. If they be not then ancient in age they ought to be ancient in wisdom and knowledge, and also in example of godly conversation, and living. Robin papist. Now therefore I do ask you, whether Christ hath not forbidden such priests or ministers of his church to mary? The true Christian. No verily, as ye yourself shall easily perceive, if ye will read diligently the scriptures, both of the old and new Testament. Robin papist. As I have said unto you already, our preachers of London do stoutly affirm, that it is in no wise lawful for a priest to mary, nor for a man that is married, to be a priest. The true Christian. In deed it is not lawefmll for popish priests to mary, what pryests they be that may not mary. if they will follow the ordinances, constitutions, and laws of your holy father the pope. For according to his rule, he hath rather that his pryestes be whoremongers. Sodomites, and filthy adulterers, as he is himself, than that they should be honest married men, according to the institution of our saviour jesus christ. Robin Papist. How know ye that to be true? The true Christian. God wots, it is very easy to be known. For if one of his pryestes be found or taken in adultery, Good justice I warrant you. or in whoredom, by giving the bishop a noble or two, or by bringing a couple or two of fat capons unto the commissary, he shallbe quittted, and let go: But upon a condition, that he do it warily afterwards. but if any of them should go about to take a wife, and so mary according to the institution and ordinance of god, for to keep himself an undefiled member of our saviour jesus christ, he shall be brent up like an heretic, whereby ye may know that he hath rather that his pryestes should wallow in filthy and stinking whoredom, It is a plain blasphemy against the god in earth so to do. than that they should once mary, and that he doth esteem it to be a greater sin to marry, than to be a common whorehunter Robin papist. But they say, that the church hath so ordained long a go. ♣ The tru● Christian. I grant that the popish church hath so ordained, but not the true church of Christ. i Timo. iii. The true Church of christ doth set forth nothing contrary to the laws and word of God. For the true and faithful church of our saviour jesus Christ, which is the house of god, the pillar and stay of the truth, will never take upon her to set forth any thing contrary to the mind of her true husband and head, our saviour jesus christ, nor yet to teach any thing, that might hinder the liberty and freedom, that he hath both purchased and given unto his faithful servants and ministers. This true and faithful church, I say, suffering herself to be ruled, guided, and governed by the only word and spirit of her head and master our saviour jesus christ, will in no wise presume to forbid any thing that our saviour jesus christ hath commanded, nor to command any thing that he hath prohibited and forbidden. Robin Papist. But they do stoutly maintain that this is done according to the scriptures and word of god. Exod. nineteen. The first argument that the Papists of our time do bring against the marriage of pryestes. For when the everliving and eternal god, did go about to deliver his law unto Moses, the same Moses being inspired of the holy ghost, did give a commandment unto the people that they should abstain from their own wives. The true Christian. Answer to it. That example serveth nothing for the popish church, if ye do well consider the words of Moses. For he did generally forbid all the people to come to their wives: but your holy father the pope doth only forbid his priests. Again, Moses saith not: I command & charge you that ye never come to your wives, Exo. nineteen. or that ye never marry: but saith only be ready against the third day, & come not at your wives. As if Moses would have said: Ye must sanctify yourselves these three days: therefore ye shall cease from all your bodily labours, and works, and also from the use of your own wives, that ye may the better pray unto God, and think on those things, that God hath appointed to do on the third day. Ye see that Moses doth command the people to abstain from their bodily labours, why the people was bidden to reframe from their wives. and companying with their wives, only for three days, that they might be the more ready both to pray, and also to receive the high mysteries, that God has appointed to show unto them the third day. The like doth the blessed apostle saint Paul say unto all christians that be married, speaking after this manner: i Corin. seven. This place shallbe more largely entreated of, afteewardes, about the mids of the book. withdraw not yourselves one from an other, except it be with consent for a time, for to give yourselves to fasting and prayer. And afterwards come together again, lest Satan tempt you for your incontinency. Ye see that saint Paul will not have a man to withdraw himself from his wife, nor the wife from her husband, but as far forth as the one can forbear the other. And if ye consider well the words of saint Paul, ye shall soon perceive, that he will not have the man and the wife to be long asunder, least Satan the Devil do tempt them, and make them to fall into some abominable sin, through their incontinency. For as a man can not always pray and false, so can not he be always without his o●ne wife. For, to pray, to fast, and to live chastely without the company of a woman, are special gifts of almighty God, which he giveth to whom it pleaseth him, and for as long as he thinketh it expedient. Mark then that Moses did not give a commandment to the pryestes only, that they should abstain from they wives, The example of Moses can serve nothing for the Pope. but also to the hole people. Therefore, if your holy father the pope, will have this place to serve for his purpose, he must aswell forbid all the Christian people to mary, as his pryestes. For why? The one doth stand with no more reason than the other. ¶ Robin papist. Our holy father the pope, doth forbid pryestes to mary, Objection. because that they are appointed in the church, to minister the holy mysteries unto the people, and also, because that they are mediators betwixt god and us. The true Christian. Answer. I answer, that Moses was then the only minister of the church; and as a mediator betwixt God and the people. And yet he doth not separate himself alone from his wife, for those three days, but also commandeth all the people to do the same. This the papists will never grant Do not the holy sacraments and mysteries pertain to the hole church, I mean, to all them that be Christians as well, as unto the priests and ministers of the church? I say, that they can no more challenge unto themselves of those holy mysteries and sacraments by any right or privilege, that they have given them of God, than the least christian in the world, saving only that they are ministers of them, for to distribute and give them unto the people, thereunto prepared and ordained. Now if the dignity & worthiness of the things that be ministered, doth require that the ministers be unmarried, how much more doth it require, that they which receive such holy mysteries should be unmarried? For if the marriage doth defile the minister, because that he doth minister holy things, how much more doth it defile those that receive than? If the minister ought to be holy in the ministration of the holy and sacred mysteries, much more ought they, to whom they be ministered to be holy It is plain & manifest then, that the pope hath no more cause to forbid priests to mary, than all the rest of the people. For, whether is the ministration of the sacraments, more precious and excellent, than the receiving of them is? Robin papist. The second argument of the papist of our tyme. I can say nothing against your arguments, but yet our preachers do say, that the priests of the old law, did abstain from their own wives during the time of their office and ministration in the temple. As it appeareth by Zacharie the father of john Baptist. Luke i The true Christian. This example doth serve for me, and not for them. For by it, it is manifestly proved, that the pryestes of the old law had wives. Robin papist. It is true. Objection. But if the priests of the old law, did abstain from their wives, when they came to the altar, for to offer sacrifices in the temple, how much more ought the pryestes of the new Testament, Where there is forgiveness of those things, there is no more sacrifice for sin. Hebre. x. to live chastely, all the days of their life, sith that they have such an high sacrifice to offer unto God daily for the sins of the people. The true Christian. I would feign know, what sacrifice the pryestes of the new Testament have to offer unto God daily for the sins of the people. Robin papist. Do they not offer our saviour jesus Christ, I pray you, both god and man, unto his heavenly father, for the sins both of the quick and of the dead. The true Christian. It hath been already sufficiently declared, in the first talk, In the overthrow of the Mass. that we had together a pretty while a go, what a blasphemy it is to say, that Christ can be offered any more. Read also of this in the vi. Dialogue of my true buckler and shield of the Christian faith and in my confession upon the Crede. Hebre, x. For, it is to abolish and put down that omny-sufficyent sacrifice which our saviour jesus christ the high priest did offer once for ever upon the altar of the cross, and to make it of no more efficacy, strength and value, than the sacrifices of the old law. ¶ Robin papist. I have not yet forgotten, what was said then. Therefore, show me now, why the pryestes of the old law did abstain from their wives in the time of their ministration and office. The true Christian. Your holy father the Pope, would gladly set up again, all the shadows and figures of the old law, which our saviour jesus Christ hath abolished. Why the pryestes of the old law did abstain from their wives. Ye shall therefore understand, that the pryestes of the old Testament, did abstain from their wives, during the time of their office, for to represent, and signify, the integrity and pureness, that should be in our saviour jesus christ the eternal and everlasting priest, whose figure they were only. But it also they did signify and represent that he should be conceived by the holy ghost, with out the seed or operation of man. Now these ceremonies are ceased and fully ended, after that our Saviour jesus Christ the eternal and everlasting priest after the order of Melchisedech, hath offered himself a sacrifice unto God his father, for the redemption of all mankind, as he himself did testify upon the cross, saying: It is finished. , john xix if Christians were compelled to follow the ceremonies of the old law, they might have no priests but of the kindred and Tribe of levy. But those are most meet for to be priests now a days. Moreover, they might have no priests, that were misshapen, and that had any blemish or fault in their bodies. For, these be the words, that Moses is commanded to speak unto Aaron: Whosoever of thy seed in their generations, levit. xxi. hath any deformity let him not press for to offer bread unto his god. For, whosoever hath any blemish, shall not come near, as if he be blind or lame, or that hath a bruised nose, or that hath any myshapen member or is broken, footed, or broken handed, or hath no hears on his eye brows, or be mange, or skaulde, or hath his stones broken. So long doth the pope follow the old law, as he doth think it to be profitable for him and his kingdom, No man that hath a blemish, and is of the seed of Aaron the priest, shall come nigh to offer the sacrifices of the Lord. But now, your holy father the pope doth clean contrary. For, he doth allow them for priests, which are misshapen, and which have deformyttes and blemyshes in their bodies, wherein he doth well declare, that the Christians are not subject unto the ceremonies of the old law. Robin papist. There is a good cause why. Yet he will allow none that have broken stones, or that lack them. The true Christian. If the priests had no stones, peradventure there might be less Chrisomes in the parishes where they do serve. Will ye know the cause why he doth it? hearken in your ear, and I will tell it you. ¶ Robin papist. Go to, go to: ye will be old john still. But now without all jesting, tell me why god would have none to be made pryestes, that had any faults in their bodies. The true Christian. For to signify thereby the great integrity and perfection, which should be in the highest priest of all, which is our saviour jesus christ. But mark ye this beside: if your hole father the pope, will follow the law of Moses, he must needs forbid the priests, that during the time of their office, which, as ye say, doth continue all the days of their life, they should drink no wine, This law would in no wise please the pryestes of our tyme. For they love good drink to well. nor no kind of strong beer or ale. For thus saith the lord unto Aeron: rhou and thy sons, shall drink no wine nor any kind of strong drink, when ye shall come into the tabernakle of witness. He must also forbid them to shave their heads, Levi. xxi and the corners of their beards. For, God did forbid the pryestes of the old Testament, the same. Any man may see that the Pope hath no more just cause to forbid his priests to marry, than to forbid them the other things heretofore rehearsed and named. Wherefore, The ordinance of the pope is a jolly bait for the devil, for to ketche the souls of men and women with all. all that he doth, is nothing else but a plain tyranny, whereby he doth cast away the souls not only of his pryestes, but also of many poor women and maidens, and also whereby he doth engender in the world a most detestable whoredom, and filthy Sodomy. When doth he presume, I beseech you, to command any man, that hath not the gift of chastity, to live without the remedy that God hath appointed for every man? If a Priest hath the gift of chastity, he needeth not to command him to live chastely, if he hath it not, why doth he lay such an heavy yoke upon his neck? Doth the Pope and his priests think to rule god as they list? He may if he list, for he is god in earth. if your holy father the pope hath such a delight to have his priests to be wifeless: why doth not he him self give them the gift of chastity? Robin papist. God only giveth the gift of chastity, as he doth all other gifts: Objection. therefore, they must ask it of him, with faithful and earnest prayers, and without doubt they shall obtain it. For, our saviour jesus Christ saith: Math. seven. Mar. xi. Luke. xi. Ask, and it shall be given unto you: Seek and ye shall find, Knock, and it shall be open unto you. The true Christian. What soever is necessary unto salvation we have a promise in the scriptures that we shall obtain it of God, if we do ask it in faith. Answer. Again, where have they a promise that god will give the gift of chastity unto all those, that the pope doth forbid to mary. But how shall ye be able to prove, that to live without a wife, is a thing necessary unto salvation? Therefore, if a man, not having the gift of chastity, or not being called there to of the Lord, doth wilfully and for his own pleasure separate or banish himself for ever from the holy estate of matrimony, he doth most paryllouslye tempt god. For whosoever he be that will not use in his necessity, What it is to tempt god the same natural remedy that god hath ordained and appointed, without all doubt he doth tempt God. Even as if a man would neither eat nor drink, though hunger did come upon him never so much, but forsaking all kind of meats and drinks, that god hath ordained for the use of man he should desire of God that he would take away his hunger by his absolute power. Should not such a man tempt God? would ye not judge such a man to be a despiser of the ordeynaunces of the Lord. And if he should die, Murderers of them selves would ye not judge him to be a murderer of himself? I say, that it is as hard for a man, which hath not the gift of chastity, to keep himself from falling into sin, as it is for him to live without meat and drink, Math. iiii. without the special gift of the Lord. We do read that our saviour jesus Christ did fast forty days & xl nights, and that all that space he did neither eat nor drink, but that he did hunger at length, and that the Angels ministered unto him. Whereby it doth appear, that when he was a hungerd, he did both eat and drink, using the lawful remedies and means, that his heavenly father hath appointed. When the gift of chastity is taken away from a man, he must use the remedy that God hath appointed. So it happeneth many times, that a man hath the gift of chastity for a time, but that afterwards it is taken away from him. Then must he use the remedy, that god hath appointed and ordained, is it not to tempe God, when a man feeling the fire of concupisbence, that burneth and tormenteth him, if he will not use the water, that GOD offereth unto him, which is marriage? Marriage is the lawful water for to quench the fire of concupiscence. It is even as if a man seeing his house on fire, would not use the waters that be round about it, for to quench the burning, but would say, let it alone, God will quench it. Verily, I say unto you, that whosoever doth in his necessity despise the ordinance of god, and hath liefer burn than to marry, he shall never be chaste, but his bed shall always be polluted and defiled: The punishment of those that despise matrimony. and as long, as he shall despise the holy estate of matrimony or refuse to use it, god will never give him the gift of chastity, but suffer him to burn, and to be tormented in his flesh, and to fall from one sin into another. For do ye think that god doth love them, that do despise his ordeynaunces in their necessity? Do not such persons declare themselves to be most unthankful unto him? In deed if a man be constrained to be away from his wife for a time, When we ought to pray most earnestly for the gift of chastity. for to follow his vocation that god hath called him to: it is his duty to pray unto god, that he vouchsafe to mortify and quench such fire of concupiscence in him, during the time, that he is away from his wife, and truly such a man ought to believe that god will hear him, if he doth pray with a faithful heart, having the fear of God before his eyes. ¶ Robin papist. This besides, they said, in their sermons, that when David came to Abimelech, and required him that he would give him of the holy loves which they call the show bread: i. Samu. xxi. The third argument of the papists of our time. or ever Abimelech the high priest would give him any, he did ask him, whether both he and his companions has kept themselves clean from their wives. And hereupon did they allege saint Jerome, who writing upon the epistle to Titus, doth say these words: The show bread did signify and represent the body of our saviour jesus Christ. Therefore, let them, Jerome upon the epistle to Titus that will eat the body of our saviour jesus Christ, abstain from their wives. For if such a cleanliness was required, for to eat of the show breed, how much more is it required, A goodly argument, I assure you. when we go to feed upon the precious body and blood of our saviour jesus Christ? Therefore, say they, sith the priests do daily make the precious body of Christ, & also eat it, in their holy & blessed mass, it is in no wise lawful for them to marry. The true Christian. Answer. All this maketh nothing against me. For, Abimelech himself the high priest was married. Therefore they can not prove by this, that the pryestes ought always to be put from the benefit of holy wedlock. Robin papist. Objection. But why did Abimelech ask, whether David and his companions, were clean, and specially from women? The true Christian. Answer. Because that the law did then require such an outward holiness, and bodily purifying. If any had touched but a dead corpse, Levi. xi.xu. or had suffered any pollution in the night, it had not been lawful for them to touch holy things, nor yet to come near the people or the tabernacle, except they had been purified before. Christ hath put down all the ceremonies of the old law. But all such ceremonies, and outward or bodily purifienges, are taken away by our saviour jesus christ who doth only require now the pureness of the heart, as he himself doth testify, saying: Math. v. blessed are they that are clean of heart, for they shall see god. Now, this clenelines is obtained by faith, without the ceremonies of the law. Robin papist. But what say ye to saint Hieroms' words? Me think that they do make directly against you. I would fain hear what answer ye can make to them. The true Christian. This answer do I make: both saint Hieromes words, and also your sayings were most true, if christ and commanded any such thing. But as I have said already before, he hath utterly abolished and put down, The honest companing of a man and a woman together in wedlock is pure and holy before God. all such ceremonies and bodily purifyenges. And now the honest cohabitation or companying of man and woman together in the holy estate of matrimony, doth in no wise pollute or defile them, but that they may at all times use and receive the holy sacraments. Hebr. xiii. Doth not s. Paul say that wedlock is honourable among all men, and that the bed of them, that be married in the lord, is undefiled. Robin Papist. Objection. Yet the saying of saint Jerome doth still stick in my mind. And verily me think that it agreeth best with the truth. For, if it was necessary, taht they which would eat of the show bread, should abstain from their wives: how much more is it necessary, that they that eat the body of Christ daily, as the priests do, should keep themselves chaste, and be altogether without wives? If the eating of the figure doth require such a clenelinesse from women, what shall the verity of the thing itself do? ¶ The true Christian. What we oghte to judge of the sacrament of the body and blood of Christ, In my light skirmishing against Marcus antonius' it hath been meetly well declared in our second talk and communitation, that we had last together save this. Therefore will I leave the saw, and come to your saying, which is this: If it was necessary say ye, that they, which would eat of the show bread, being but a bare figure, should abstain from their wives: How much more is it necessary, that they, which eat the body of Christ daily, as the pryestes do, should keep themselves chaste and be altogether without wives? Answer. Ye shall soon perceive how weak your argument is. Exod. xii. God gave a commandment, that when the paschal lamb should be eaten, the Israelites should use no leavened bread by the space of seven days, and that whosoever did eat or keep any in his house, all that while, his soul should perish from among his people. Now may I make mine argument after this manner: The one standeth with as good reason as the other. If it was necessary, that they which did eat the paschal lamb should abstain from leavened bread, not only when they did eat the Easter, but also, hole sire days after: how much more is it requisite and necessary, that they which do eat the sacrament of the body and blood of christ, which as ye say all, was figurate, signified, and represented by the paschal lamb, should abstain from leavened bread? Yea, how dare your pryestes eat any leavened bread at any time, sith that they do eat and drink the bydy and blood of Christ almost every day? He will do it for all that, and who so ever doth say the contrary shall fry a faggot. Ephesi. It is easy now to perceive, that your holy father the pope hath no cause at all to bring it to be church of christ, whether it be in general or particular, such outward and bodily sanctifienges or purifienges, except he will turn all the hole christian religion into a jewish supersition, and make the coming of our saviour jesus christ unprofitable, and also the alliance, agreement, and conjunction that jesus christ hath made of the two peoples, I mean, the jews and the Gentiles by abolishing and putting down the ceremonies, to be of no effect. Robin papist. Ye shall not so escape. For they did bring an other strong argument, The forth argument of the Papists of our tyme. i. Corin. seven. which they ground upon Paul, where he exhorteth them that be married, to forbear the liberty of matrimony, for a time, that they may the better give themselves to prayer. Sith then that priests are bound to minister continually in the church and also to pray daily for them selves and for the people, the church had a just cause to forbid them to mary. The true Christian. Did they allege the hole sentence as it lieth in the text? Robin papist. They did allege it none otherwise than I have rehearsed it unto you already. ¶ The true Christian. Ye may see what thieves they are, The foul shift of the Papists. they steal in a manner the hole sentence form the people, lest the simple and ignorant should espy out their juggling. The words are these: Withdraw not yourselves one from another, except it be with consent for a time, for to give yourselves to fasting and prayer. And afterwards come together again, lest Satan do tempt you for your incontinency. I have now rehearsed the hole sentence unto you. Robin Papist. As far as I do remember, we have had the same sentence already before. The true Christian. It is most true. Now, by these words, In the answer of the first argument. Answer. Saint Paul doth not command but exhort them, that be married, if their mutual dwelling or companying together, be a let unto them, that they cannot give themselves to prayers and fasting, to withdraw themselves one from another, but yet with consent, meaning if they have both the gift of continency, during the time of the fasting and prayer, and be able to forbear one another. But what doth it follow? Afterwards come together again, lest Satan do tempt you, for your incontinency, sayeth he. As if he should say: if du●ynge the time of your fasting and prayer, ye do feel that ye cannot refrain or live chastely, come together again, lest Satan under the shadow and colour of your fasting ●nd prayer do tempt you. Beware ●n any wise that ye give no occasion ●nto Satan to tempt you, Thee things to be noted upon Paul's words. for your incontinency. Upon which wor●es three things are to be notes. The first is, that the blessed apostle ●oeth only speak unto those, that ●y mutual companying together, ●re letted to fast and to pray. where ●pon I may make an argument af●er this sort. If we must leave of, ●he mutual companying together ●n Matrimony, during the time, ●hat it doth let us to fast and pray, ●y much more strong reason, ought ●e to forsake & leave all other things that do let us to pray or to do ●hose things, that pertain to our occasion. Robin Papist. I do confess that to be true. But what will ye make of it? I would fain hear what ye will say. The true Christian. For to help the weak memory of the simple and unlearned, I will begin again mine argument. If, as I said before, the mutual companying together in holy matrimony and wedlock, must be forborn for a while, I mean during the time, that it doth let us to fast and pray, how much more ought we to forbear, yea and to forsake all other things, that do hinder and let our prayers. The single life is a let unto those pryestes that have not the gift of chastity. But to live a wifeless life, doth let the pryestes, which have not the gift of chastity, to pray, and to do other things that pertain to their office and vocation: Ergoe they ought to forsake that kind of life, and to be at defiance with it. Robin papist. I deny the minour or second part of your argument. The true Christian. I desire no better than the comen experience, which we see daily before our eyes, for to prove it. The comen experience proveth all. Whereunto might be added the saying of Saint Paul which we rehearsed even now. Do we not see daily, I pray you, if a priest hath not the gift of chastity, that where as he should study and pray, This is to true. he doth occupy himself all the day long, in seeking of his harlots and whores, and if the find none at the first, he doth vex himself, night and day, studying, how he may, by one mean or other, bring some honest poor woman or maid to nought? And verily, if this fire of incontinency, which he burneth with all, be not quenched by one naughty mean or other, he shall never be able, to pray, to read, or study, he shall never think of heavenly things, not yet on any thing, that is good. These things being considered a right, i Timo. iiii. it is an easy thing to perceive, that this wifeless life, which truly is a plain invention of the devil, doth altogether let them, that have not the gift of continency and chastity, to do the things that pertain to their vocation and calling. Let these wifeless priests, what fair face soever they bear before men, and how soever they do dissemble, and cloak the fire of incontinency, that they burn withal, be judge their selves. I do only appeal to their own conscience, which now is, and shallbe hereafter a sufficient withnesse against them. Robin papist. A pretty remedy to bring one to the devil. Ye hit partly the mass on the head. But ye know what remedy they have in their canon laws. Si non caste tamen caute. The true Christian. That is as much to say, if thou canst not live chastely, play thou the knave privily. But to the matter: The second point, that we shall mark in Paul's words, is that he doth prefer, the honest companying together of man and wife in matrimony, before fasting or prayer, Godly counsel. or before the wifeless life in them that have not the gift of continency or chastity. For, he sayeth: And come again together, lest Satan do tempt you for your incontinency, that is to say, Sometimes the liberty of matrimony is to be preferred before prayer and fasting. if ye perceive, that ye can not live chastely, during the time of your prayers, leave praying alone: For, then ought ye to prefer the honest liberty of Matrimony, before prayer, lest Satan do tempt you. Satan is a subtle and crafty enemy, therefore, ye must beware of him, lest under the shadow and colour of prayer, he cause you to commit some filthenesse. Therefore, Saint Paul sayeth afterwards: This I say of favour and not of commandment. Where upon, I dare boldly say, that your holy father the Pope is a very Satan or rather an incarnate devil, The Pope is a devil incarnate. which under the pretence & colour of prayer doth cause his priests to fall into the net of of the devil by many abominable and horrible sins. Why will the not permit unto them the same, that Saint Paul doth both permit and also command unto all those, that want the gift of chastity? doth that fleashlye Idol think, that to be without a wife, The true chastity. is to live chastely? The true chastity doth consist in the true pureness of the heart, and mind. Ambrose upon the vii Chapter of the first Epistle to the Corinth. i. Corinth. seven For as Ambrose saith, what doth it avail or profit, if thy body being chaste and clean, they soul or mind be polluted and defiled? To be short, no man can be counted chaste before God, except he be holy both in body, and also in spirit. Which thing can not be in such pryestes, that have not the gift of chastity, until they use the godly remedy, that is offered unto them in the holy estate of matrimony. Robin papist. When I do well weigh the words of Saint Paul, where he saith. The single men or women, do care for the things that belong to the lord, that they may be holy both in body and also in spirit, I do in a manner agree to your sayings. But go forwards I pray you. ♣ The true Christian. The third doctrine, that we do learn of Paul's words, is, that there is neither fasting nor prayer, Neither fasting nor prayer can quench the fire of incontinency. that can quench the fire of incontinency, except god doth quench it himself, by his especial grace. Which thing saint Paul doth well declare when he sayeth. Come together again, least Satan do tempt you for your incontinency. i Cor. seven. Mark ye now this: if the incontinency could be taken away by prayers or fastings, sayncte Paul need not to say: Come together again, least for your incontinency, ye be tempted of Satan, but rather: continue still in fasting and prayer, and so shall ye overcome and quench at length the burning concupiscence of your flesh. Again, he sayeth not: i Cor. seven. he that can not abstain, let him pray and fast, but contrariwise he sayeth: i Cor. seven. he that hath not the gift of chastity let him marry. Moreover he doth not write: for avoiding of fornication, let every man fast and pray, or beat himself, but rather this commandment doth he give for avoiding of fornication, let every man have his wife, and every woman have her husband. I do always except them, Who they be that ought to be accepted from this law that do not tempt God, that is to say, which can not commodiously come at their wives, by reason of their office or vocation, as many gentlemen and other be, which by the commandment of their prince, are fain to keep the wars or merchandise, following their merchandise and other like. They that cannot commodyouselye come at their own wives ought to pray for the gift of chastity. Such are bound to pray unto almighty god, that he vouchsafe to give them the gift of chastity during the time that they be absent from tdeyr wives: but yet they ought not to separate themselves, for to long a time, nor without a just and lawful cause. Robin papist. Why doth saint Paul write then that it is good for a man not to touch a woman? The fift argument of the papist of our tyme. i. Cor. seven. Here saint Paul seemeth to allow the opinion of them that say, that it is meritorious or available unto salvation to live without the company of a woman, or in the state of single life. Math. nineteen. Doth not also our saviour jesus Christ say himself, that there be some, which have made themselves chaste for the kingdom of heavens sake. ♣ The true Christian. All these places make nothing for the papists. For first and foremost, Answer. How the words of saint Paul ought to be understanded the meaning of saint Paul, is not, that to abstain from a woman, is meritorious, or available unto salvation, but that it is more commodious for a man, if he can live so, or hath the gift of chastity, to be unmarried, then to be married. For, i Cor. seven. he that is single and unmarried having the gift of chastity and continency, careth for the things that pertain unto the lord, that he may be holy both in body, and also in spirit: he may at all times go abroad to preach the gospel, Math. x. and if persecution doth arise for the words sake, he shall neither by wife nor by children be letted to fly from city to city, as our saviour jesus christ doth bid: and if he fall into the enemy's hands, he shall with a better mind go to the fire. Many other commodities might I rehearse, which they have, that having the gift of chastity do remain unmarried. But what doth this pertain to your wifeless priests, The saying of saint paul doth nothing pertain to the papists. which as vile stinking goats do wallow themselves in all kind of Sodomy and whoredom? They say that it is not lawful for them to have wives of their own, and to touch them, as God hath ordained and appointed, but how they handle other men's wives & common harlots in their blind and thievish corners, Roma. i. th● very children in the street are able to testify. These are they, that for the despising of the lords institutution and ordinance are given up into a reprobate sense that they should do the things which are both unseemly & alo too filthy, Math. nineteen. & abominable to be uttered out. As for the words of our saviour jesus Christ, they are easy to be understanded: for, there he speaketh of those, that having received the gift of chastity, do abstain from marriage, that they may the better spread abroad and publish, the glad and joyful tidings of the kingdom of heaven. But how chastely doth your wifeless merchants live, I beseech you? Can any man say themselves chaste, They be as chaste as sparrows or as are lusty stalauntes that run among mares. or that they have gelded themselves. Let the poor women and maidens, whom they seduce & deceive daily, testify of the same. And as for the preachings of the gospel of god, which our saviour jesus christ doth call therein that place the kingdom of heaven, that is not the mark that they shot at, in abstaining from marriage, but that they may live at ease, & pamper up up their idle and resty bodies, that so they may do the better service unto lady Venus at all times, Nay not so, for they be our ladies knights whose knights they do declare themselves to be. This am I sure of, that there have been more godly sermons made here in England in a week, by honest married ministers, that lived in the fear of god, in the holy estate of matrimony, then be now made in a hole year, by your maiden priests and lusty champions of dame Venus. Robin papist. Question. How can ye prove, that they, which make themselves chaste, or geld themselves for the kingdom of heavens sake, have received the gift of chastity before? The true Christian. When the apostles had said if she matter be so betwixt the man & the wife, Answer. Math. nineteen. then it is not good to marry, our saviour jesus christ did answer & say: All men be not able to comprehend or receive this saying, but they to whom it is given. Now if ye will ask me who they be, that geld themselves or that make themselves chaste for the kingdom of heavens sake: I will answer, They do geld themselves for the kingdom of heavens sake, to whom it is given. that they geld themselves or make themselves chaste for the kingdom of heavens sake, unto whom it is given. But this (as I have said before) can not be spoken of your unmarried and wifeless shavelings, for they neither live chastely, nor yet care for the promoting or setting forth of the kingdom of heaven, but to set out their own kingdom & glory, that they may live like lords & kings and have all men's heads under their girdelles. Now do ye plainly see, that the places that ye have alleged, do no more pertain unto your holy priests than the godly documents of virginity, i Corin. seven. that s. Paul giveth in the epistle to the Corinthians, do pertain, to the hores of the stews. Would God such a law might be made. If kings and princes would once make a law, that all priests that be found to live unchastely, or to lead an unclean & filthy life, should be brent up as they make laws to burn them up, that would fain live in the fear of god, and keep themselves undefiled members of our saviour jesus Christ, ye should see shortly these common bulls to sing an other song: But as long as they may without any fear of punihsement wallow themselves in every man's bed, & have gentlewomen with freeh hoods (for so make they their boasts) to come home to them into their own chambers, they will be still at defiance with matrimony. And no marvel why? For as long as they may have their wives & children sitting by other men's fires, But this wisdom of theirs shallbe dearly sold them at length. and to be kept at other men's costs & charges, they were fools (sith that they be at this point, that they think that there is neither heaven nor hell) if they would burden themselves with the charges, troubles, & cares that do pertain to the holy estate of matrimony. But, alas what shall be the end of them? As abominable whoremongers & adulterers, & as stinking & filthy Sodomites, they shall be cast into the lake that burneth with fire & brimstone, ¶ Robin papist. I perceive that sweet meat must have sour sauce. The sixth argument of the Papists of our time. They said moreover, that the pryestes, which did marry in king Edward's days, did sin most grievously against god, and not only against the laws and constitutions of our holy mother the church, because that they did most ungodly break the vows, which they made unto god. For, say they, if we should but make a faithful promise unto a mortal man, it were a shame for us to break it: What ought we then to judge of those that dare most ungodly presume, to b●eake the vows or promises, that they have made solemnly unto god, The thunder bolts of the papists, before his holy church? They therefore, that marry, after they have made their vow, do not only live in adultery, but also are unfaithful promiss breakers. And they that are such must needs provoke the wrath and indignation of God, not only against themselves, but also against the country that they dwell in. The true Christian. Answer. Of vows. Or ever we do preceade any further, we must mark what a vow is? Secondly what things ought to be considered in making of a vow. first and foremost, it is agreed among all men, that the same, which we call a promise, in the respect of men, is called a vow in the respect of god. what a vow is. But this ye will grant me, that we be wont to promise those things unto men, which we know to be acceptable unto them, else our promiss shall scarcely be welcome, it shall skarcelye be allowed or accepted of them, to whom it is made. How much more ought we to beware, that we promise or vow nothing unto God, except we know by his word, that it is acceptable unto him for, Levi. x. he doth detestand abhor all manner of worshippings and services, that he himself hath not prescribed in his holy and sacred word. Isaiah. nineteen, Math. xv. And for this cause he crieth out by his Prophet, saying: they worship me in vain, teaching the doctrines & precepts of men. Therefore, in making of a vow, How many things are to be considered in making of a vow. three things are to be considered: what he is unto whom we make the vow: what we be that make the vow, and for what intent or in what respect we do make it. first & foremost, then, we must consider with ourselves, that it is god, unto whom, we make our vow, which as I said before, can away with no service, worshipping or religion, that is invented or found out by man, without or against his holy word, though in the sight, of the foolish world, it seemeth never so gay, excellent & goodly. If the thing then, The thing that we vow unto god, must be commanded in god's book or else our vow is abominable. that we promise or vow unto him be not commanded or prescribed unto us in his word, it must needs stink before the face of his majesty: yea in stead of praise or reward we shall receive condign punishment, for our abominable presumption, & unadvised rashness. God doth only require of us an obedience towards his holy law, What God doth require of us. institutions & ordinances, which if we do offer unto him through faith in our saviour jesus christ, though on our part it be most unperfect, yet will he accept it for his son jesus Christ's sake, and impute it unto us, as most perfect. But if leaving the same obedience, that we own unto his holy law, institutions and ordinances, we do seek new ways for to serve and worship him, doubtless, he will pour the same vengeance upon us, Levi. x. 〈◊〉 xv. that he did pour upon Nadab and Abihu and also upon Saul, the first king of the Israelites. Robin papist. I do remember well, how sore god did punish them. For Nadab, and Abihu were before the whole congregation of Israel devoured with fire, that came down from the wrath and indignation of God. And as for saul both his kingdom was rend from him, and also he himself, was delivered up unto an unclean spirit, which should vex and torment him. The true Christian. Blessed are ye, neighbour, if these men's harms and grievous punishments can make you to beware. But now, will I come to the second thing, that ought to be considered in making of a vow. When we go about to promiss or vow any thing unto almighty God, we must not only consider, that it is God unto whom we make the vow, but also what we are ourselves, that do make it. We must always have before our eyes, that of ourselves we can do nothing. Therefore, to promise a thing, that it lieth not in us, We must vow nothing that it lieth not in us to perform, and whereof we have no promiss in gods book. to perform, and whereof we have no promise in God's book that we shall obtain it at gods hands (if we do ask it) it is a perilous presumption and which deserveth no small confusion and shame both before god and the world. Robin papist. By your saying, all that we promise and vow in our baptism, Objection. it is but a perilous presumption. What we do promise and vow in baptism. For it lieth not is us, to forsake the devil and his works, the pomps and vanities of this wicked world, nor yet the sinful lusts of the flesh. We can not of ourselves believe all the articles of the christian faith, with all other things, that we are commanded to believe in god's word. It lieth in no man's power to walk all the days of his life in gods holy law & commandments. And yet all these things, we do promiss and vow in our baptism. Therefore, might any man, hearing you speak thus, accuse us all, of presumption and rashness. The true Christian. Answer. God doth promise all those things that we do vow and promise in baptism, and therefore are we sure that we shall obtain them at his hands by faithful prayers. But ye must mark good neighbour that god doth in his holy word, require of us all those things, that ye have rehearsed, and which we do promise & vow in our baptism. For, his will & pleasure is, that we should forsake the devil & his works, that we should be at defiance with the pomps and vanities of the wicked world, and with the sinful lusts of our flesh. His will and pleasure is, that we should believe and credit all things, that he doth set forth unto us in his word, taking a sure hold through faith upon his mercy & goodness, declared unto us in his Son jesus christ, our lord & saviour, & that all the days of our life, we should endeavour ourselves to the uttermost of our power, to walk sincerely in his holy laws and commandments. Therefore we may be sure, that he will at all times (if we do require it of him with faithful prayers) assist us with his grace, that we may to his glory & to the salvation of our own souls perform, & fulfil all those godly promises and vows that we have made unto him in our baptism, wherein we have so faithfully and so straightly bound ourselves unto him, & his service that we are no more our own men. For, why? In baptism we do become the servants of the lord, so that we are no more our own men. by receiving this holy sacrament of baptism, which is a seal of the covenant & promises of god, we do acknowledge & confess that we are bought & purchased unto him, with the most dear & precious blood of his son jesus christ our lord: what presumption is it then, sith that we are no more our own men but the servants of him, that hath so dearly bought us, which thing as I said before we do acknowledge, by taking upon us the seat of the people of God: what presumption, I say, is it for us, to promise or enterprise any thing, without the knowledge, will and pleasure of our sovereign lord and master? But where have we any place, yea, one jot or syllable in all the whole body of the scriptures, that doth certify us, that it is the will and pleasure of god (who is our sovereign lord and Master) that we should vow and promise to live a single and wife less life, as long as we have any breath in our bodies? The cruel tyranny of the preachers of our tyme. It is manifest then that all those godly vows, that ye do so magnify & extol, and which your Preachers do defend with tooth and nail, persecuting them, most tyrannously and also most cruelly, that perceiving the error and parall that they be in, do with a good and upright conscience, being builded in god's word, utterly forsake, and abjure them, it is most manifest I say, that such vows, are without faith, sith that they have no ground nor foundation in gods holy word. Therefore, away with them, for what can they be else but sin. Whatsoever saith saint Paul is not of faith, Roma. xiiii. Hebr. xii. the same is sin. Again: without faith, it is impossible for to please god. We might say then, and that by good right, that they which are offended with them, that being better instructed in god's law, do go from such rash & presumptuous vows, The one standeth with as good reason as the other. and are at defiance with them, may with as good a cause be angry and displeased with them, that do fly and forsake sin, or that will to the uttermost of their power, avoid and eschew those things, which they know to be abominable and stinking before the face of almighty god Why are they so blinded, that they will not see this canon of theirs: Isidorus in sinonimis li. 23. questione 4. capi. In male pro. In male promissis rescind fidem: in turpi voto muta decretum: quod incaute vovisti, ne facias, impia est promissio, quaescelere adimpletur. That is to say: In those things that be not well promised, break thou thy promiss. In a shameful & unhonest vow chaung● thy mind: Do not the thing, An applienge of the canon unto the present matter. that thou hast vowed unware or without deliberation & advisement It is an ungodly promiss, that is fulfilled, with wickedness. Now can ye say that the promiss of your wive less priests, is good, or that it is well made, sith that it is without faith, & hath no manner of ground in god's book? why should they not then by the virtue of this canon break it? Again, how shameful & unhonest the vow that they make is, it is apparent to the sight of all men. For by it they are constrained to forsake the honest & lawful remedy, that god hath appointed for all men, & for lack of it, to wallow themselves in all kind of filthy & stinking abomination. Why do they not then (as this holy decree doth bid them) change their mind, & that betimes, lest for their stinking & filthy abomination, they be utterly cast out of the favour & sight of god. Thirdly, the vow that they make, they make it so unadvisedly, & without all deliberation, that many priests can not tell whether they ever made any vow or not. And as for your friars, Al seculare priests that I have talked withal have steadfastly affirmed unto me, that they never made vows saving only that when the Bishop gave them the ●ote, he did say: Accipe jugum castitatis. receive thou the yoke of chastity. nuns, & monks, they be feign to make their vows, afore that they know the bent of their own bow, that is to say, afore that they have examined & tried their own strength, or what they be able, to abide or do. Shall we say, that such vows are advisedly done & with such a deliberation, as is required in so high a matter, as this is They may then by the authority and virtue of their holy canon's break such unadvised vows. For, besides the afore rehearsed canon, these are the words of the blessed martyr S. Cyprian: If the virgins that have with faith vowed themselves unto Christ, Cipri. li. 1. epistolarum epistola. 2. can not persever or will not: it is better that they marry than that they should through their tender niceness or deliciousness fall into the fire. Augu. in libro de bono coniug●li ad julianum. disci. 27. capi. Quondam. And S. Augustine doth allow the marriage of such, invehing sharply against them, that call such marriage, adultery, and go about to separate them, that do mary after their vow. The words are these: Some do suppose, that they that marry after their vow, are adulterers, but I say unto you, that they which separate them do offend grievously. ¶ Robin papist. Objection. I pray you, give me a little leave to speak: if now your wife, that is wedded unto you by the laws of god and of the realm, should in your life time, go take another husband would not all the world count her an adulteress? What ought then to be said of those women, that being wedded unto Christ by a solemn promiss or vow, be not afraid their husband being alive, to take mortal and sinful men to their husbands. The like may be said of the men, whether they be seculare priests or other, for, as they say, they be all married unto our lady, and unto our mother the holy church. ¶ The true Christian. It is not for nought that saint Augustine doth both write and say, Answer. that they, which judge or count those persons, August. 27. questio. 1. cap. nuptiarum. which mary after their vow, to be adulterers, are shamefully deceived by a foolish similitude, meaning the self same similitude that ye have now alleged and brought in. Ye shall then understand that we are all both men and women, as many as do pertain to the covenant of life, married unto the lord. For, Osee. two. thus he sayeth himself unto his faithful congregation & church: I will marry the unto me in faith. Again, be not these the words of saint Paul, two. Cor. xi. I have coupled you (speaking to the hole church of Corinthus) to one man, to make you a chaste virgin to Christ. In how many places, is the faithful congregation or church, called the spouse and wise of the lamb? Ye learn by this, that we are all, Revela. nineteen. Ephesi. v. as many as do believe and put our trust in the everliving and eternal god, the spouse of our saviour jesus Christ. Therefore we need not to be married or wedded to him, by such kind of new forged vows, sith that we are already through faith, whereby we do apprehend and take hold upon the covenant that God hath made betwixt him and us, so surely married to him, Ephe. v. being in many and sundry places of the scriptures called the spouse & wife of the lamb, I mean of the only begotten son of God, our saviour jesus christ, who hath so loved us, that he gave himself for us, to sanctify and cleanse us, in the fountain of water, through the word, to make us to himself a glorious congregation, without spot or wrinkle, or any such thing, that so we might be holy and without blame. To tell you the truth, it is rather to be believed, that by such invented vows (which we may well call doctrines of devils) we are utterly separated and divorced from our true husband our saviour jesus christ, By popish vows, we are separated and divorced from our true husband our saviour jesus Christ. and coupled or married unto Idols I mean unto dead creatures, which we know not whether they be in heaven or in hell. For by them some be married to francis, some to Dominike, some to Augustine, and some to this or that saint (at least they call them so) and so poor Christ, the only husband of the true christian church, is utterly forsaken and not once thought upon. All ye then, that through ignorance and error, have coupled yourselves unto such unlawful husbands, with whom ye do daily and hourly commit spiritual whoredom (which is the mother and nurse of all filthy and stinking abomination which is committed in the body to the utter casting away of the soul) Spiritual whoredom is mother and nurse of all filthy and stinking abomination. Rom. i. repent betimes and come again to your true and lawful husband, our saviour jesus Christ, and stick to his laws, whereby he hath ordained and appointed, i Cor. seven. that for avoiding of whoredom, every man should have his wife, and every woman, her husband. Let it not move you, that ye have made a promiss, sith that it was made unadvisedly and without deliberation, and again, sith that it can not be fulfilled without committing great wickedness, and mischief. For as ye learn by the canon heretofore alleged & rehearsed, such a promiss is ungodly, and aught in no wise to be kept. It is not unknown, that many under the pretence and colour of keeping of their vows, or because that they would not seem to break them have committed most shameful and horrible murders. We do read in a certain epistle that a famous clerk called Huldarichus, Huldaricus ad Nicolaum papam. being then bishop of August, did write unto Pope Nicolas being first of that name, that Gregory did on a time cause one of his ponds to be drawn and that there was found in it above six thousand heads of young infants which had been murdered & cast into it, A notable history. by those, that by their violent and tyrannous laws, were forbidden to mary. The repentance and sobbing of Gregory. Which when Gregory did see being wonderfully moved in his mind did with sighing and sobbing praise and commend highly the saying of Saint Paul, 1. Cor. seven. where he writeth and saith: Better it is to marry than to burn, adding unto it: yea, better it is to marry, and to suffer to marry, than to give occasion of such a shameful murder and children slaughter. This was done in Gregory's time, many hundredth years ago: What, think ye, hath been done sense, among so many thousand of nuns and friars, which are spread abroad through out all the hole world? I do here. Let pass the sodomitical and filthy acts, that these marked mounsters of antichrist do perpretrate and commit among themselves, if they chance to want and lack women: And all this do they forsooth, that they may seem unto men to keep the promise & vow that they have made. But, as Isidorus saith, What an ungodly promise is. ungodly is that promiss, that is fulfilled with such wickedness and mischief. Therefore, most dearly beloved brethren and sisters in christ break such devilish promises and vows betimes, & come away from that whorish and bloody generation unto your true and lawful husband our saviour jesus christ: & if ye have not the gift of chastity, couple yourselves in honest Matrimony, having the fear of God before your eyes, that ye may keep yourselves undefiled members of our saviour jesus christ. Robin papist. I am sorry that I have brought you so far from the matter, that ye were in, I am afraid that ye will scarcely remember where ye left. The true Christian. Take ye no thought for that I remember as well where I left, as if I had made no degression at al. We were in the second point, which I said aught to be considered in making of a vow. And in it besides that, which hath been said already, this aught diligently to be observed & marked: Sith that we are able to do nothing of ourselves, We must vow nothing that may let us in our vocation. & that we be no more our own men, but are dearly bought, we must beware that we do promise or vow nothing, that may be a let or a hindrance unto us, in that vocation or kind of life, that it shall please our sovereign Lord and Master to call us to, as this foolish vow of single life, is unto all those, that lack the gift of chastity. They their selves can bear record, what tormenting and vexation they feel in the flesh, so that the troubles that are commonly in wedlock, are nothing in comparison of it. Can they study or pray, think you? or can they do any thing, that pertaineth to their vocation or calling? God knoweth, there is a poor studying, but a more homely praying, where the fire of concupiscence of the flesh, is kindled, and no lawful water by, for to quench it. Moreover, we must in this second point, that pertaineth unto us beware and take heed, that we do not spoil ourselves of that goodly liberty and freedom that our saviour jesus Christ, hath so dearly bought and purchased unto us, we must take heed I say lest with our foolish vows and unadvised promises we do make ourselves both servants and slaves unto those things, that God will have to be servants unto us. Christ our saviour will have us to be free unto him, christ our saviour will have us to be free unto him and in his freedom to use all his creatures with thanks giving, as he himself hath appointed and ordained, let us beware therefore that we become not, under the shadow and colour of their goodly vows, the servants of men's dreams and traditions. Stand fast saith Saint Paul, Gala. v. in the liberty where with Christ hath made you free, and wrap not yourselves again in the yoke of bondage. And after that he had given counsel touching the wifeless and single life, he doth add by and by these words. This speak I for your profit, i Corin. seven. not to tangle you in a snare. Who considering these things would not judge them to be stark mad, and besides their own selves, that having such a goodly liberty and freedom already purchased unto them, wherein they may most conveniently serve and worship god, as he himself will be served and worshipped, do wittingly cast themselves into a perpetual bondage and thraldom, where they shallbe fain, by reason of their foolish and unadvised vow, to serve god, as most ungodly, and superstitious persons shall prescribe and appoint unto them, and not as he himself hath willed and ordained in his word. There again, shall they lose the free and lawful use or handling of the good creatures of God. What liberty and freedom we lose by popish vows. and though they burn never so much with the fire of concupiscence and incontinency, they shall never be suffered because of their wicked bond, to have access unto those lawful waters, that God, from the beginning hath appointed for the quenching and putting out of it. Robin papist. But what remedy, when they have once brought themselves, in to that bondage and thraldom: Question. Is it lawful for them to get out of it again, or not? The true Christian. Why not? are they not the servants of the lord? Answer. Who dare keep another man's servant against the will of his master? Again, is it not lawful for them, that know the selves to be with wrong Masters, unto whom they own no service at all, and also to whom they have been enticed and brought by sottell and deceitful means, for to come again unto their right and lawful masters, from whom they were enticed and bigged away? christ our saviour is our sovereign lord and master: If then by the deceivableness of men's doctrines and persuasions, Math. ten we be made to shake of, his gentle & easy yoke, and receive upon us the intolerable burdone of men's traditions & dreams: shall it not be lawful for us, when we perceive our own folly and how shamefully we have been beguiled, for to come again (notwithstanding that we did make a promise unadvisedly and without deliberation) unto our sovereign lord and Master, which is our saviour jesus Christ, who in his holy gospel doth cry out and say: Math. xi. Come unto me, all ye that labour and are lawden and I will refresh you? Again: do ye not think it to be lawful for us, to flee from sin unto god? If it be lawful to flee from sin it is lawful to flee from popish. vows. But it hath be already declared, and proved, that all such vows, sith that they be not of faith, are but abomination and sin before god. Therefore, we may lawfully and with a good & upright conscience, flee from them and forsake them, whatsoever the wicked world sayeth to the contrary. Robin papist. There remaineth yet behind, the third thing, which ye said, aught to be considered in making of a vow. The true Christian. Ye say very well, and I perceive that ye are unwilling, that I should leave any thing behind. The third thing then, which ought to be considered in making of a vow is this: When we go about to promise or vow any thing unto god, we must consider and weigh with our selves, for what intent or in what respect we do it. If a vow be never so lawful yet must we consider, for what intent we do mark it. For, it may be so, that being done for this or that intent and in this or that respect, it shallbe pleasant and acceptable unto God, where as if it be done for an other intent, or in another respect, it shall stink before the face of his majesty. As for an example, I perceive that the drinking of wine, is hurtful unto me, or that it doth let and hinder me in my vocation and calling: Whereby I am moved to abstain from it altogether: and that I may have the better occasion to do it, I bind myself to it by a vow, promising faithfully unto god, that I will all the days of my life (except I be driven to do the contrary by urgent necessity) refrain from drinking of wine, that I may the better serve him in that state or condition of life, that it hath pleased him to call me to. This vow, sith that it is made only to this end, that I may follow my vocation the better, cannot but please god. But if I should do it, thinking or being persuaded that the abstaining from wine, is meritorious before god, and that by it I shall deserve heaven or the forgiveness of my sins, then must such a vow, be abominable and stinking before the face of almighty God. Those things may we only vow that be indifferent and that lie in our power The like may be said of all other things, that of themselves, are indifferent, and lie in our power Now, let us grant by way of disputation, that the vow of chastity or single life, is lawful or allowed in the scriptures and word of god: yet unless we do take upon us that vow, to the intent that we may the better give ourselves to the true meditation of heavenly things, and again to this end that we may the better edify the holy congregation and church of christ, by publishing and preaching abroad the glad and joyful tidings of salvation, all that we do is abominable in the sight of god. For, if we do it, thinking to deserve heaven by it, or to this end that we may live at ease, and without all solicitude and care, or troubles of this world. And also because that we will not be burdened with the charges that pertain to the common wealth: although we could live as chaste a life, as ever the blessed virgin mary, the mother of our saviour jesus Christ did, it is impossible for us to please god: all that we do (sith that in it we do not seek his glory, and the profit of our neighbour) will he detest and abhor. 1. Tim. v. Why widows were received into the church. And as it is of men, so it is of women. It appeareth by the words of s. Paul, that widows did promiss their service unto the church, to this end, that they might see to the poor which were kept at the costs & charges of the faithful congregation & in deed they were most meet for that purpose, for to see them to be washed & kept clean, & for to see their meat to be handesomly dressed. Howbeit saint Paul will have none to be chosen to that office under three score years of age, biding the younger widows to marry & to bring forth children. As for maidens & virgins, that be endued from above with the gift of chastity, the chief cause why. i Cor. seven. S. Paul will have them to abstain from marriage, is, that being free from the cares & troubles that be commonly in matrimony, they should give themselves to the contemplation and study of heavenly things, & also endeavour themselves by diligent reading and hearing of the scriptures, to be holy both in body and also in spirit. It appeareth by saint Hieromes writings, that there were both widows and maidens in his time, which did with the substance that was left unto them, either by their husbands, or else by their parents and friends, relyve the poor, i Cor. seven. and also maintain learning if then, either widows or maidens (I do here speak only of those that have the gift of chastity) do abstain from marriage, for any other intent, or in any other respect, than I have said already: that is to say, if they do think, that by such kind of life, they shall merit or deserve heaven, or do embrace it, to this end, that they may be free and exempt from all sorrows and pains that other women suffer in bearing and bringing up of their children, all that they do is nought, God will have all things to be referred to his glory, and to the profit of our neighbour. and hated of God, who will have all things to be done to his glory only, and for the profit of our neighbour. Ye may now learn by this, how pleasant and acceptable the vows of your priests, nuns, friars, and Monks, are unto god. For do they not all, take this vow of single life or chastity upon them (though they be as far from keeping of it, as the East is from the West) to this end that they may live at ease, and be without all troubles and cares of this common life, pampering up or fatting themselves, with the sweat of other men's brows? Again, do they it not to this end, that they may be in estimation among men, and taken as Gods, reckoning holy matrimony, which hath been instituted of the lord himself, to be but filthiness and pollution, in comparison of their counterfeited chastity? Yea, they that are of the best sort among them, do think verily that god is greatly in their debt, because that they do willingly abstain from this holy estate of matrimony, yea, if God do not place them in his kingdom of heaven, far above his married elect and chosen, they are ready to enter an action in the law against him. Therefore, we may well conclude, that all their vows that they make after the rules & doctrines of men, The conclusion of vows without or against god's word, or to any other end than for to set forth the glory of god & that profit of our neighbour are stinking and abominable before the face of almighty god, and that therefore it is lawful for any man or woman, that by the means of them, hath been brought into the snare of the enemy, for to break and forsake them, and if they can not live chaste, to couple themselves in honest matrimony. Robin papist. Objection. Deu. xxiii. Yet this shall ye find written in the scriptures: When thou dost make a vow unto the lord thy god, do not defer from day to day to perform it. Ecclesiastes or the preacher. ca v. For verily the lord shall require it at thy hand. The like shall ye read in Ecclesiastes otherwise called the preacher, yea sayeth Moses if any thing be come forth of thy lips, see that thou dost keep and perform it: as thou haste vowed unto the lord thy god of thine own free will, and as thou haste spoken with thy mouth. What are all men able to say against such manifest and plain texts? The true Christian. This are all the godly able to say, Answer. Wherein the vows of the old law did consist. that both Moses and Solomon, do speak of the vows of the old law which did consist in certain kind of sacrifices, and ceremonies which our saviour jesus christ did utterly abolish and put down by his coming, so that they pertain no more unto us, except ye will have all other sacrifices and ceremonies to pertain unto us also. Robin Papist. These be also the words of the psalmist. Objection. Offer thou the sacrifice of laud and praise, Psal. 1. & pay thy vows unto the highest. Again: make vows, and pay them unto the lord your God. Will ye say now, Psal. 76. that David doth here speak of the vows of the old law also? ¶ The true Christian. I will here bring nothing of mine own. first, Answer. Arnobius in psalm. 50. ye shall hear old father Arnobius, who expounding the first verse that ye have alleged writeth on this manner. What shalt thou retch unto me of thine own? This is thine own, if thou dost with a pure heart pour before me praises and laudes: and pay unto me to vow, that thou haste made me in baptism, wherein thou didst promiss that thou wouldst forsake the devil, God doth require none other vow of us, but that which we have made in baptism. and keep my commandments. Here do we learn by this most ancient writer that the vow, which god doth now require at our hands, is the promiss & vow that we have made unto him in baptism which we ought as long as we have any breath in our bodies, to endeavour ourselves always to perform and fulfil to the uttermost of our power. Marcus Antonius Flaminius in ps●almum. 50 Al we (saith Marcus Antonius Flaminius writing upon the same verse) that profess godliness, do promiss & vow that we will prefer the glory of god before all things, & worship purely & sincerely, August. in psal. 55. his holy & blessed name. As for the second sentence that ye have alleged, thus doth s. Augustine expound it: What should ye vow or pay? The brute beasts that were sometimes offered at the altar? Offer thou no such thing: thou hast that thing in thee, which thou mayest both vow and pay. Bring forth of the chest of thy heart, the sweet smell of laud and praise, bring forth of the cellar of thy conscience the sacrifice of faith. And whatsoever thou dost bring forth, fire it with charity. Now do ye see, how those holy ancient doctors, do expound the places, that ye have alleged out of david, and how that those texts do make nothing at all, for the maintaining of the new fourged vows of your wifeless clergy. The end of vows. Therefore I say boldly in the Lord, that all such beggarly vows notwithstanding both men and women, that have been or are yet entangled with them, may lawfully marry, if they have not the gift of chastity given them: & that none will find fault with their doings, except it be they, that for the despising of gods holy law and ordinance, are already given over into a reprobate sense. ¶ Robin papist. Question. What scriptures, I pray you, can ye bring, that priests ought to marry? Or what example have they in all the book of God, otherwise called the Bible, that they should have wives? The true Christian. We have examples enough. For first and foremost, all the pryestes of the old law were married. Answer. The pryestes of the old law were married Which thing ye have granted me already before, except ye have forgotten it. And in the new Testament Christ our Saviour, did call married men, for to be his apostles, christ called married men to be his apostles. which thing the heavenly wisdom of the father, would not have done, if it had not been lawful for his ministers to marry. Robin papist. Objection. But they did put away their wives or at lest they'd did separate themselves from them, as soon as they were called. The true Christian. It is an easy thing to say so, but it is not so easy to prove it. For if they had put away their wives (as ye say they did) then should they have done contrary to the doctrine of their teacher and Master, which sayeth: whom god hath joined and coupled togehter, Math. nineteen. let no man put a sunder. Again: It is not lawful for any man to put away his wife, except it be for fornication. Moreover if the apostles had put away their wives, with what face, I beseech you, should they have gone about to teach married men how they ought to behave themselves towards their yoke fellows? Among all other the blessed apostle saint Peter saith: Likewise, ye men, dwell with your wives according to knowledge, i. Peter. iii. giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as unto them that are heirs also of the grace of life, that your prayers be not hindered. When both Peter, and the other apostles also, should have given this or other like counsel unto married men, What married men might have said to the apostles if they had forsaken their wives. might they not by good right have said unto them again: Ah, ye are good fellows, ye come to teach us, how we ought to behave ourselves towards our wives, and how that we ought to bear with them, as with the weaker vessel, to cherish and make much of them, yea and that we ought to love them, as our own flesh: how chance that we do not the like yourselves, but put away your own wyveds from you lest ye should be cumbered or troubled with them, or lest ye should be fain to do, as ye would have us to do? first, let us see how well ye agrewith your own wives, Physician heal thyself or how ye behave your selves towards them: and then will we follow the godly counsel, that ye give us. Such like taunts might married men, when they were taught their duty towards their wives, have given to the apostles, if it had been so, that they had put away their own wives, or had separated themselves from them. But it is not to be believed or thought, that the apostles would give any occasion, whereby their doctrine should be despised, or laughed to scorn. This then with the doctrine of their teacher and master being well considered, I may conclude boldly, that the apostles did not put away their wives, nor yet separated themselves from them. Robin papist. Do we not read in the scriptures, Question. that the apostles did forsake all things, for to follow our saviour jesus christ? if they forsook all things be like than they forsook their wives also. The true Christian. Who hath taught you, Answer. to make such a goodly argument? I confess it to be true in deed, that when the apostles were called by our saviour jesus christ, they did forsake all things, that might have letted them to follow him, yea and their own wives also, but not for ever. For they separated themselves from them only for a time. A similitude. As when a king doth call his nobility and communes for to follow him in wars, or when he doth send some of his nobles into foreign countries for to be his ambassadors there, then do they all forsake their own business, yea and leave their own wives also, but not for ever. For they do it only for a time, that is to say, till their Prince give them leave to return home again, or till they have done their ambassade. Yea some of them, if they perceive that the time of their ambassade be over long, do send for they wives to come unto them. So the apostles that were married, when they could not without leaving of their wives do their office nor follow their vocation, When the apostles did leave their wives and when they did not. they did leave them. But when they could do their office or follow they vocation without leaving of them, truly they separated not themselves from them. Do we not read, that after Saint Peter was called, our saviour jesus christ went into his house, and healed his wife's mother, Math. viii. which was sick of an ague? john. xxi. Moreover, went not Peter to his old occupation again, after that Christ was risen again from death? where by it is easy to understand, that the apostles did not so forsake all, that they had, but that it was lawful for them to return again unto their own. Besides all this, i Cor. ix. it is plainly written, that both Peter, and other of the apostles did carry about their own wives, when they travailed among foreign & strange nations, preaching the Gospel of our saviour jesus Christ. Whereby it is evident and plain that they forsook them not utterly. Finally in this word, all, there is a figure to be understanded, Synecdoch and what it is. which is called Sinecdoch, whereby other whiles, part is taken for the hole, and the hole for part. Therefore, when it is said, that the apostles forsook all, it is to be understanded of those things that it is lawful for a man to forsake: But it is so far of, that the christian religion should constrain or compel any man to forsake his wife and his children (except it be in an urgent necessity, as when we must suffer for the word sake) that rather it doth call them all infidels and worse than infidels that do not provide and see to their own household, i Timo. v. of the which household, ye will grant me, that the wife and children are the chiefest part. Why doth not the saying of Gregory take place among them where he saith: Grego. 27. quest. 2. cap. Sunt qui some do think that for religion sake, marriage should be dissolved and broken, but we must consider, that though man's law doth permit it, yet gods law hath forbidden it. For, the truth himself doth say: Whom god hath coupled together, Math. nineteen. let no man put a sunder. Again: Let no man put away his wife, except it be for fornication. Who will withstand the maker of so strong a law. ¶ Robin papist. Gregory doth not speak there of the Christian religion, Question. but of monkery, which they do commonly term, with this term religion. ♣ The true Christian. Very well, Monkery among the papists, is of more perfection than Christ's religion is. I am content that it be taken so: yet shall ye be fain to grant, that monkery is, after your doctrine, a more perfect religion, than the religion of Christ is. Whereupon I will make mine argument after this sort: It it be not lawful to break wedlock for monkery sake, which is of more perfection: how much less shall it be lawful to break matrimony for christian religion sake, which is of less perfection? But ye say, that it is Gregory's meaning, that a man or woman may not break wedlock for to enter into monkery, much less than shall it be lawful for to break matrimony for christian religion sake, which as I said, by your own doctrine, and after the opinion of many men is of less perfection than monkery is. Robin papist. Ye said, me think, that both Peter and also other of the apostles did carry about their wives with them, when they went about to preach. Where (I beseech you) do ye find that written? Questin. The true Christian. Answer i. Corinth. ix. Thus is it written, and thus do we read in the first epistle to the Corinthians: Have we not power to eat and to drink? Have we not power to lead about a sister to wife, (some do translate these Greek words, Adelphen Gyneca, a christian wife) have we not power, I say, to lead about a sister to wife, Cephas is Peter. as well as other apostles & as the brethren of the lord and Cephas? Robin papist. saint Paul doth not there speak of the apostles wives: Objection. but of honest christian matornes, which followed the apostles, whether so ever they went for to minister unto them in their necessities, Max. xv. As we read that certain women, followed our saviour our jesus christ from Galilee, ministering unto him of their substance. The true Christian. Without all doubt some expound it so, as ye say. But I can not see, Answer how it should stand with the truth. For first and foremost, although it was lawful in the country of jury, that such honest matrons should follow the prophets and apostles, for to minister unto them in their necessities, yet the same could not have been done among the Heathen without very great suspicion. But this is most true that the apostles did to the uttermost of their power avoid and eschew all sinister and lewd suspicions, lest they should by any means give an occasion that the gospel of our saviour jesus christ should be hindered. What should have been said, I praty you, among the Gentiles, if such lusty young men as some of them were, had gone about with other wives ihen their own? It is to be believed them that they had their own wives with them, matrimony was always in estimation and honour among the Gentiles. sith that they knew, that even among idolatrous Gentiles, matrimony was always had in great reputation and honour. Again, if s. Paul did speak of such women as followed the apostles for to minister unto them in their necessities, he himself did great wrong unto the churches of Macedonia and of Achaia, whom he did rob, taking wages of them, two. epist. to the Cor. xi. cha. that so he might preach freely unto the Corinthians. For, such honest women might have ministered unto him, aswell as unto other, all manner of things, that he should have needed, without putting of the churches of Achaia, and of Macedonia to such intolerable charges. Whereby it doth appear that he did speak of none other but of the apostles wives. For his meaning was, that it was as lawful for him as for the other apostles, to take a living of them unto whom he did preach the gospel, not only for himself, but also for his wife: which thing nevertheless he would not do, lest he should be chargeable unto them. Moreover who hath power to lead any other woman besides his wife? The husband hath power only over his wife, and not upon an other woman Sith then that saint Paul sayeth, that the brethren of the lord, and Cephas (which is Peter) had power to lead women about, it is without all controversy, that he spoke of none other but of their own lawful wives. Euse. ecclesi. hist. lib. 3. cap. 3. But ye shall hear what Clemens Alexandrinus doth say writing against them that did contemn marriage: Do they (sayeth he) disallow the apostles? For, both Peter and Philip had wives, and gave their daughters unto husbands. And a little after it focoweth. Ibidem. They report (sayeth he,) that when Peter did see, that his wife was led away for to suffer, he did rejoice because of the election. And that therefore he did cry out aloud unto her, when she was led forth, & calling her by her name did say. O wife remember the lord. Now do ye see plainly, that neither Philip, who was both a deacon, and a preacher of the gospel, nor yet Peter, whom ye will have to be chief among the apostles did put away there wives, till the lord who had coupled them, did put them asunder. I may then conclude and say, Conclusion. that we have sufficient examples both in the old and new Testament, that pryestes which want the gift of chastity, ought to marry, and have wives of their own, that they may keep themselves undefiled members of our saviour jesus Christ. Robin papist. How be ye able to prove, that after they were once called, A foolish objection, how be it the papists be not ashamed to use ill. they did company with their wives after the fashion of the world, though they had them with them, whether so ever they went? The true Christian. In good sooth, neighbour, Answer neither ye nor all the prating papists, were ever pillows or boisters unto them for ro testify of the same, therefore leaving such subtle questions unto them that list to busy their brains about such vanities, we will prove by plain and manifest scriptures, that all priests which have not the gift of chastity, aught to mary. first and foremost these be the words of the blessed apostle Sayncte Paul: i Corin. seven. For avoiding of fornication, let every man have his wife, and every woman her husband. In this general or universal sentence, They are I warrant you every enche of them. Sayncte Paul doth comprehend all men, as well pryestes as other, except ye will say that priests are no men. Therefore they are as well as all other men, commanded by Paul to have wives of their own, i Cor. seven. except they be made chaste from above. Again: they that can not abstain, let them marry. Here doth the apostle, give generally a commandment unto all them that can not abstain that they should mary, he excepteth none. Therefore they that forbidden marriage unto any person upon the earth, which can not live without it, are fellows of them, or rather the self same, that saint Paul doth prophecy of, i Timo. iiii. saying: The spirit speaketh evidently, that in the later times, some shall depart from the faith, and shall give heed unto spirits of error, and devilish doctrines of them, A conscience marked with an hot iron, is an unclean conscience defiled, marked, and printed with many marks of wordly lusts. that speak false by hypocrisy. And have their consciences marked with a hot iron, forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats which god hath created to be received with thanks giving. Robin papist. But once preachers do say, that saint paul doth here prophecy of certain heretics, which afterwards did most falsely affirm that marriage was instituted and invented of the Devil. Such were Tatius, Martion, and Manicheus, of whom saint Augustine doth speak in his book of heresies. Augu. in lib. heretico. The true Christian. Those heretics did forbid marriage in general, but your holy father the pope doth forbid it in particular. Again there be certain times in the year, when by his laws no man may marry. Tatius, Martion, and Manicheus enemies of matrimony. Is not this to be a companion of Tatius, Martion, and Manicheus, I say, that the pope can not excuse himself, but that he is a Tatianiste, Martioniste, and a Manichean, and even of the number of those heretics that saint Paul doth speak of there in the sentence afore alleged. Robin papist. The church doth not forbid marriage, but it hath only ordained, Objection. that they which will be made pryestes, should bind them selves by a solemn vow, to keep perpetual chastity. The true Christian. Is not the one as evil as the other? Answer. For it belongeth not to the Church to require any such thing of the priests. It is our saviour jesus christ only, who is the only Master and head of his congregation and church, to whom such authority doth pertain: As for the authority of the church it is limited by his word and can extend no farther, than the word will permit or suffer. In the mean while both the pope & all his adherentes which either forbid marriage to themselves or to any other are plain Tatianistes Manicheans and Martionistes. The Eustachians. As far, as I remember, there was a certain kind of heretics, which were called Eustachians, which did so abhor marriage in the Ministers of the church, that they would in no wise receive the communion, Out of the counsel of Gangris. at the hands of them that had wives. And against them was a godly decree made, in a council that was holden at Gangris in the country of Paphlagonia. This is the very decree itself: He that maketh a difference of married priest as though by reason of marriage, he ought not to offer or to minister the communion, They that abstain form the communion of a married priest, are pronounced accursed. & doth already abstain from his oblation, let him be accursed. Ar● they not then all by the virtue of this decree excommunicated and accursed that hold opinion, that married pryestes may not minister in the Church of christ? Though they be abominable whore mongers, adulterers, drunkards, Meet champions to serve lady Missa. blasphemous swearers fighters and blasers: yet they will find no fault with their oblation: If they do but once ring the bells, to their divine and holy service, they will flock unto them as the sheep do to the fold. But if they do hear of a married minister, though he be never so well learned, though all his study is to set forth purely and sincere lie gods holy and sacred word, Nothing can set forth the Pope shavelings but feigned chastity. and to minister most rightly the sacraments according to the lords institution & ordinance, though his conversation and living be altogether angelical, that is to say, most godly and virtuous: yet will our pope Eustachians detest & abhor to receive the communion or any other sacrament at his hands, thinking most ungodly that the married ministers of the church are more defiled and polluted, by companienge with their own lawful wives, I myself have heard a great many say so. than if being unmarried, they should lie commonly with common whores and harlots of the stews. Yea, the pope's shavelings their selves, be not ashamed to say, that it is for them a less offence before god, to lie with a hundredth harlots, than to have wives of their own. A very substantial argument I assure you. For, say they, if we have never so many harlots and take our pleasure with them, whensoever we list, we may repent the next day, and being shriven, we shall obtain at our holy father the pope's hands (which is the vicar of god, The Pope is the vicar of God. here in earth, and hath absolute power to do what so ever he list) free remission of our sins both a paena et culpa: But if we have wives of our own, we shall live in continual unclenelinesse, In deed good christian reader they call matrimony nothing but uncleanliness, & pollution, therefore that they call it a sacrament, it is for none other thing but that they may have the handling of it under their jurisdiction, & jam their spiritual court. Esay. v. and stinking pollution whereby it shall come to pass, that we shall never be pure and clean, for to come to the altar of the lord. Who would not judge, I beseech you, that such vile persons are given over into a reprobate sense, and that all godly knowledge and understanding being by the righteous judgement of god, taken away from them, they do call that which is good evil, and that which is evil, good, they do call light, darkness, and darkness, light, esteeming that to be sweet which is sour, and that which is sour, to be sweet? In the sixth synod or counsel that was holden & kept at Constantinople, where it was forbidden, The sixth Synod holden at Constantinople. that no man should take upon him the vow of single life, and also commanded that all they that for any ecclesiastical orders, did put away their wives, should be put from the communion of the faithful: this holy decree was made. If any man presume contrary to the rules and Canons of the apostles to deprive any pryestes or deacons, Distinc. 31. canon. Quoniam in rom. ordine. from the touching and communion or fellowship of their lawful wives, let him be deposed. Again, if any priest or ●a●on, do for religion sake, expel or put away his wife, let him be excommunicated, and if he persever in it, let him be deposed. Many other Canons and decrees might I allege that do pronounce them to be accursed, that either forbidden priests to marry, or that go about by violent and tyrannous laws to separate them that be already married in the lord, from their lawful wives. ¶ Robin papist. Objection. Those decrees and Canons have been abolished by the latter Concilles, therefore they stand in no effect. The true Christian. Answer. How shall then their doctrine stand, where they say, that concels cannot err? If the later concilles do abolish the decrees and Canons of the old ancient Concilles, than they must needs grant, that they did err: The canons and rules of the apostles. else they would not abrogate and put down the decrees and Canons that have been made in them. But now will we come to the Canons and rulers of the apostles, which are set forth unto us in the book of god: A bishop, saith Saint Paul, must be blameless, the husband of one wife, i Timo. iii such a one as ruleth well his own house, and such a one as hath his children in subjection with all reverence. For if a man cannot rule his own house, how shall he care for the congregation of christ? This shall ye have in the third chapter of the Epistel to Timothee, which chapter I would feign have you to read through for there shall ye also find, that both ministers and deacons ought to be husbands of one wife. And besides that, what qualities their wives ought to have. The very like shall ye have in the first chapter of the epistle to Titus. For, Titus. ●. there the apostle writeth on this manner: for this cause I left thee in Crete, that thou shouldest ordain elders in every city, as I had appointed the. Gala. i. If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children, which are not slandered of riot, nor are disobedient. These are the rules and canons of the holy apostles (for having all one spirit, they did set forth all one doctrine) whereby the elders or priests of the christian church may law fully marry. And truly, if an angel from heaven, should teach any other doctrine contrary unto them, I would count him accursed. ¶ Robin papist. Objection. But our preachers did say, that it is not the apostles meaning, that a bishop must of necessity be married, or that he must be married, when he is in the office of a bishop. For Paul himself, being a most excellent bishop was not married, nor yet saint john the evangelist, with many other that had been bishops, but that rather none that had had many wives should be choose to such an excellent office. For so Chrysostom, Ambrose, Jerome, and Theophylacte, do expound the words of the apostle. ¶ The true Christian. When Cresconius Grammaticus did allege a certain epistle of the blessed martyr saint Cyprian, Answer. for to maintain his opinion and doctrine against s. Augustine, Augu. contra Creiconi. Gramaticum lib. 2. cap. 32. this holy bishop of God did aunswre him thus I am not moved with the authority of this epistle: for, I do not take the letters of transverse, as canonical scriptures, but I am wont to try his letters by them (meaning the Canonical scriptures) and whatsoever in them doth agree with the authority of the canonical scriptures, I do with his praise and thanks giving receive and embrace it, and whatsoever doth not agree with the authority of them, I do by his good leave, utterly reject and refuse it. Even so now, will I answer you touching Chrisostome, Ambrose Jerome, and Theophilacte, I do not take their writings as canonical scriptures unto the which only I do owe a consent without any contradiction or gaynesayenge) but I do try them by those heavenly and canonical scriptures, and whatsoever I no find in them to be grounded upon the infallible word of god, the same do I with all reverence due unto such worthy men, Aug. in epist. ad fortunatianum de videndo deo. embrace and receive: but if I find any thing in their writings and works, that doth disagree from the truth of the holy and sacred scriptures, giving them still the honour, that such worthy members of the church do deserve, I do utterly reject and forsake it. Which thing I intend to do, in this text, that we have now in hand For, by the leave of holy Chrisostome, and of them all, S. Paul doth not mean in this place, that he which hath been the husband of one wife, The argument of the papists beaten upon their own Heads. should be chosen to be a bishop but rather he that is the husband of one wife. For else it should follow, that he which hath been blameless, & not which is blameless, aught to be promoted to the dignity and office: so that it were enough for him, whom they call to such an high room, if he hath been blameless, diligent, sober, discrete, a keeper of hospitality, etc. nor by their own saying, it is necessary, & requisite, that he should be such a one, neither when he is chosen, nor yet when he is in the office itself. For it shallbe enough, that he hath been such a one already. truly neighbour, the one doth stand with as good reason as the other. Therefore I dare boldly say, that the meaning of the apostles is, that a bishop, which hath not the gift of chastity, ought to be the husband of one wife, Extripartita historia. li. 2. capi. 13. dist. 31. canon nicena. that by his chaste and holy conversation or dwelling with his lawful yokefelowe & wife (for Paphnutius did call it chastity to company with his own wife only, whereunto agreeth Chrisostomes' saying, Chrisost. ad populum Antiochenam. the first degree of chastity is virginity, the second, faithful matrimony). He should be an example of like godliness unto all the hole flock. Robin Papist. Objection. Doth not saint Paul say the like, of the widow, which he will have to be received unto the ministry of the church? For, there it is written (say they) on this manner. i Tim. v. This goodly text did gardener allege against me. Let no widow be chosen under threescore years old, and such a one as is the wife of one man. If ye will have this to be taken, as it is written, and admit no exposition, how can she be both a widow, and the wife of one man. As then the blessed apostle saint Paul must be understanded in this place, so must he be understanded in the other texts that have been alleged before. The true Crist●an. Answer. This I say, that these Antichristes' shall make an answer before the judgement seat of almighty god, for falsifyenge and wrastinge his holy and sacred scriptures. This is the very text: Let no widow be chosen under three score years old, and such a one as was the wife of one man, which translation doth agree both with the Greek and the latin But they are ashamed of nothing: they have put on whores faces. The papists have put on whores faces So that they may by hook or by crook maintain their kingdom (which is altogether leasing and falsehood) they care not what they prate or say. Be it right wrong, it shall out, and all for to dazzle the eyes of the simple and ignorant people. But the most righteous lord, will not always wink at their wickedness and ungodly doings, two. Thesso. iii. but will (when he seeth his time) wake out of sleep, and with the breath of his mouth ourthrowe their tyrannous and ungodly kingdom. Robin papist. There be some, A substantial exposition, and worthy to be written in god bachus book. that by the same one wife, that the bishop or priest should have, do understand one benefice. As though Paul should say. The bishop or priest must be content witho one benefice. These do underdand by the bishops or priests house nothing else but the church and by their children, those that are committed unto their charge. Some again do say that pauls meaning is, that they ought to have none other wives but the Church. The true Christian. Answer. Gay sirs I tell you, for to be the husbands of the church. How doth it chance then, that they say, that they be married unto our lady? The holy scriptures do testify unto us, the only christ is the husband of the church. Therefore, she will never acknowledge such wild & lusty stalantes, or rather stinking goats for her husbands. Again, if Saint Paul doth mean by these words, let the bishop or priest be the husband of one wife, that they ought to content themselves with one benefice: how doth it come to pass, that some of them have so many benefices, that they do scarcely know the number of them? Is this to keep the Canons & rulers of the apostles? Moreover where they say, We will keep them, as long as it is for our profit that by the bishop or priest's house the church, & nothing else is understanded it is a plain & manifest lie, as any man that doth but only read the text, shall easily perceive. The words are these: i Timo. iii. If a man can not rule his own house, how shall he care for the congregation of christ? Meaning thereby, that if a man can not rule his own household, or bring up his youth godly and in the fear of god, he is not worthy to be put in trust with the church & congregation of Christ. Ponder and weigh the text diligently yourself, and ye shall find, that it is none otherwise than I say. Robin papist. Is this word oportet, or must, Objection. of such importance, that generally all bishops and priests must marry and have wives? This question also, did Gardener ask me. How doth it happen then, that Latimer, Doctor Ridley bishop of London, and doctor Tailor bishop of Lincoln, with many other, which I could rehearse, whom ye do reckon all to be honest and godly men had no wives? The true Christian. It is of such importance, Answer that by it all bishops and priests, that have not the gift of constinencie, or chastity, are bound to mary, and have wives of their own: Would God this were observed and kept in all places. in so much that if there were any bishops or priests, that having not the gift of continency would not marry, the magistrates (if there were any godliness or fear of god in their hearts) ought to compel them to marry, and if they will not obey, to depose them least by process of time, they should fall into whoredom, and so be an open slander to the church. As for those blessed martyrs of GOd master doctor Hugh Latimer, and the reverend father master doctor Ridley, most worthy bishop of London: all their adversaries can say none other. but that they had a most special gift of chastity, which they did so declare in their living and conversation, all the days of their life, that no man could ever lay any thing to their charge, This can I justify. For I have heard them do it. touching that matter, and yet both they and also Doctor tailor, with many other more which were gelded or made chaste from above, did stoutly defend always, the marriages of priests, & of all other ministers of the church of Christ. ¶ Robin papist. If so be that all they, Objection. that have not the gift of chastity or continency are bound to marry: How doth this come to pass, that Saint Paul being tempted with the intemperancy of the flesh did not marry. The true Christian. Both Ignatius, Answer. Eus. ecclesiasticae historia li. iii. cap. thirty and also Clemens Alexandrinus, which were very nigh the apostles time, do plainly testify that Saint Paul had a wife. But let us grant that he had never none, where do ye read in all the new Testament, that Saint Paul was tempted with the incontinency of the flesh? Robin papist. These be his words: There was given unto me unquietness through the flesh, even the messenger of Satan to buffet me. two. Corin. xii. What should we understand and by this, but the filthy lusts & incontynency of the flesh. The true Christian. How saint Paul ought to be understanded in the place afore alleged. There Saint Paul understandeth no such thing, but by the unquietness of the flesh, and messenger of Satan, he doth understand the persecutions and troubles, which by the stirring and means of Satan, he was feign to suffer continually, for the Gospel sake, not only of the open enemies, but also of the false brethren. In so much that some times, he seemed to be utterly forsaken and given over of god, and that he was the most wretched & miserable man in the world. For, why? all the world was against him. He could not come so soon in to a town, but that he was by and by after, with knocks, driven out of it: himself many times betrayed, even of those, that he did trust best: Was not this, think ye, a great temptation to the flesh? Therefore, did he many times, pray unto the lord, that he would deliver him out those afflictions & troubles, which his flesh, did grudge to bear. Thus doth Theodoretus, Theodoretus Ambrose and Erasimus in xii capitu. two. ad Corinth. Ambrose, and also Erasmus expound this place. Robin papist. Ye did say a while ago, that neither fasting, nor beating of the body could quench nor put out in man the fire of incontinency, Objection. except god did put it out by his special grace. Why doth then saint Paul say, i Corin. ix. that he did subdue and bring his body under? For our preachers do understand by it, that saint Paul did mortify in himself, the fire of incontinency, by long fasting, by putting much water into his wine, and by beating and scourging of his body. The true Christian. Although saint Paul had not had the gift of continency or chastity, yet needed he no long fasting: Answer. If our fat red cheek priests were but half handled as paul was they would not be so lusty as they are. for many times being shut up in dark prisons he had nothing to eat. He needed not to put much water into his wine: For he drank nothing else but pure water, for the most part. And what need (I pray you) had he, to beat and scourge his body? Did not he suffer stripes enough of the enemies of the truth? And that he had the gift of continency, it appeareth most manifestly by his own words, which he doth speak in the first epistle to the Corinthians: I would (sayeth he) that all men were, as I myself am. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner and another after that. without all doubt, he would have used the same remedy, that he did prescribe, and offer unto other. He did then by these words, mean and understand that he did subdue and mortify his body i Cor. seven. What saint Paul did mean in the sentence afore alleged. for to live according to the doctrine that he himself did teach: & that in all things he gave a good example to the whole world For ye must understand that besides the incontinency of the flesh, there be in man many other concupiscences which do move a man to offend the lord. These concupiscences ought to be mortified by such means, as God hath appointed. Which thing saint Paul followed, in mortifying them that were in his body. As for the fire of incontinency, it was all together quenched and mortified in him. As we do learn every where, both by his own words, and also by his own doings. For as I said before, if he had wanted the gift of continency or chastity, he would with all thanks giving, and submission of heart have used the remedy, that he wylled all other men to use. Robin papist. Are all the Christians priests? Question. for me think, that I heard you say of late that they were all pryestes. And this did I not only hear of you, but of many other besides. I have mused many times, how that could be. Therefore, I will desire you, afore we depart, that I may hear what is your advise in it. The true Christian. If ye do understand by the priests, Answer. such as be anointed of God, for to offer sacrifices unto him. I say that all Christians are pryestes. All christians are pryestes and how. For they are anointed of god not with material or earthly oil where with the body only can be anointed but with the virtue of his holy spirit, which of the blessed evangelist saint john, is called anointing. i. john .v. The lord then anointing all Christians, with this spiritual unction or anointing, did ordain & make them all, a spiritual or kingly priesthood, What sacrifices the pryestes of the new testament do offer. not for to offer brute beasts, as the pryestes of the old law did, but for to offer spiritual sacrifices, I mean, the mortifying of their own bodies, which is a lively sacrifice, holy & acceptable unto God, for to offer also, the sacrifice of righteousness, Roma. xii. of praise, & of thanks giving with a contrite and humble heart which are the true sacrifices of all them, Psal. iiii. Psal. l. Hebru. xiii. Psalm. l. that do sincerely profess christ, and are denominated or called Christians of him. But if by priests ye do understand the ministers of the church, I say, that in the same signification, all Christians be not pryestes: for, If by priests we do understand ministers, all christians be not pryestes. i Corin. xiiii. they be not all called to the ministration of Ecclesiastical Sacraments, nor yet to the preaching of the gospel of our saviour jesus christ. For in the church all things must be done in order. ¶ Robin papist. And ought not the ministers of the church to be anointed after the manner of the old law? Objection. The true Christian. No, Answer for after that Christ hath watered with his most precious blood the consciences of the christians, all such unctions & anointinges are utterly cessed, and are no more necessary among christians: And all they that go about to bring in again, or have brought in again already, into the church, such juyshe unctions and anointinges, are false Prophets. Against whom, S. paul hath written very sharply in all his epistles, & specially in the epistle to the Romans, to the Galatians, and to the hebrews. In deed the christian Church, doth use certain ceremonies, as is the trying and examining of them whom they do choose unto that worthy office, What ceremonies, the church doth use in choosing or making of ministers. where unto is added th● laying on of hands. Of these ceremonies doth Saint Paul speak● in his epistles, but specially in th● Epystel to Timothee. Robin papist. This than have I learned in our● communication. first that all the scriptures, which our preachers do allege, The conclusion or Epitogus. for to impugn and overthrow the marriage of pryestes, are shamefully writhed and wrested. secondly, ye have proved unto me, that the vows, whyches all religious persons or seculare priests, did make, for to bind themselves perpetually unto the state of single life, are directly against the holy and sacred scriptures, and word of God, and that therefore they may lawfully break them, coupling themselves in honest Matrinony, that so living in the fear of god they may keep themselves undefiled members of our Saviour jesus Christ. thirdly, ye have showed and declared most manifestly, both by the ●xamples of the scriptures, and also by strong argument taken out of ●he same, that all religious persons, ●r secular pryestes, that have not the gift of chastity, aught to marry, in ●o much that if there were any, which having not the gift of chasty●ye, would not marry, the godly Magistrates ought to compel them, ●nd if they be dysobedyente, to depose or put them down, lest by process of time they should become an open slander unto the church. Now far ye well in the Lord till another tyme. FINIS.