THE PROTESTANTS EVIDENCE, TAKEN OUT OF GOOD ●●●ORDS; Showing that for Fifteen hundred years next after CHRIST, diverse worthy guide's of God's Church, have in sundry weighty points of Religion, taught as the Church of England now doth: DISTRIBUTED INTO SEVERAL CENTURIES, and opened, By SIMON BIRCKBEK, Bachelor in Divinity, sometime Fellow of Queen's College in Oxford, and now Minister of God's Word 〈◊〉 Gilling in RICHMONDSHIRE.  
LONDON, Printed for Robert Milbourne, and are to be sold at the Sign of the Grayhound in Paul's Churchyard 1635.   

TO THE RIGHT Worshipful, HV●FREY WHARTO● of Gillingwood, Esquire, Receiver General of his Majesty's Revenues within the Arch-Deaconry of Richmond the Bishopric of Durham, and Northumberla●d, my m●ch respected Patron, G●ace and Peace be multiplied.  
Sir,  
THe free access which you made me, for the exercise of my Ministry within your donation, (what time, besides other Suitors, you had a son of your own, whose sufficiency of Gifts might have antedated his years, and made him capable of greater Preferment, had God been pleased to have continued his life) hath so far engaged me unto you, that I have laid hold on the first opportunity, whereby I might manifest my thankfulness unto you; which I could not better express, than by Dedicating this Treatise to your Name and Memory, beseeching God, that as he hath hitherto done great things for you, and given you a Benjamins' portion above your brethren, 
Gen●s●● 3.34.  so he would still continue his favours to you and yours, and bless you, both in your own person, and in your fruitful & promising offspring. Now if this Treatise seem not no suitable a Present either to your years or disposition, which call you indeed rather to a point of Devotion, than Disputation; the truth is, it is a Controversall Treatise, yet it is withal a just and Defensive War, which I have undertaken, rather for the clearing of our own (cast, than the infesting of others; and the end I aim at, is to discover the truth, and guide others therein; And I know it would please you at the heart, to see such as have gone astray, reduced into the old way, 
jerem. 6. 1●.  which the Prophet calls the Good way. If any shall reap benefit by this Work, and thank the Author for his pains, I shall forthwith take them up, and bestow them wh●re they are due, namely, next under God, upon yourself, upon whose Glebe these first Fruits of mine grew, and are now (in such sort as you see) gathered into this Storehouse, and sequestered into several Centuries, for the Church's use and benefit, by one of her meanest Proctors, but  
Your much bounden Kinsman, and Beneficiary, SIMON BIRCKBEK.   

TO THE READER.  
CHristian Reader, this Treatise was first occasioned, and afterwards composed in manner as followeth: The Prophet 
a Hosea 7.8.  Hosea saith of Ephraim, that he had mixed himself among the people; that Ephraim was as a Cake on the hearth not turned, baked on the one side, and raw upon the other; that is, 
b Popular Israel non solum f●it inf●ctu● Idololatriâ jeroboam, sed & Idololatrijs Gentilium existentium circa populum Israel. Lyra in loc.  in point of Religion, was partly a jew, and partly a Gentile. It was my lot to fall upon a Charge, which like Ephraim, was part Protestant, part Papal, and the one side questioned with the other, Where their Religion was before Luther? Whereunto I addressed such answer, as I thought might satisfy the weak, and repress the clamourous; but the matter growing to farther debate, it occasioned me to draw a Catalogue of our Professors. Now it fell out, that about the same time, M Doctor ●e●●ly (one who is excellently versed in Controversies) had with good success stood up in this quarrel with jesuit Fisher. I acquainted him therefore with the business, and he gave me the right hand of Fellowship, 
Galath. 2.9.  encouraging me to go on with my Catalogue: but I found it too hard a task for me, (though I had good helps from others, namely from the wel-furnished Libraries of my much respected friends, Master D. Potter, the worthy and learned Provost of Queen's College in Oxford, and Mr. W. Richardson, Minister of God's Word at Borough Church in Westmoreland, a very learned and reverend Divine, & also my good neighbour M. Nathaniel Hawksworth) to procure such Records as might prescribe for 1500 years together: so that it caused me travel as far as Oxford, there to visit those famous private and public Libraries, where I became an eyewitness of diverse parcels of Evidence, whereof I made use in this Treatise. And now having my materials about me, I thought myself tolerably furnished for the Work; and yet if I had had ●he whole Bodleian-Vaticane Library about me, I might sometime have been at a stand, if I had not had some Living Library to consult withal. Whereupon (having to deal with a company of subtle Adversaries, like the sons of Zerviah, of whom David complained, 
2 Sam. 3 39  that they were too hard for him; and lest the truth, and the Churches Cause might seem to suffer through my weakness) I repaired, by intercourse of Letters, to my learned Counsel Mr. Dr. Featly, and he (I thank him) was ready to resolve me when I was in doubt, and to direct me, (yea and correct me also) when I was at default; and indeed I was well pleased with the Obelisks and dashes of his pen; for, as Solomon saith, The wounds of a lover are faithful. 
Prov. 27. v. 6.  I have used the help of Ancient and Modern Writers, foreign and domestic, and namely, the Reverend and learned Bishops, and Doctors of our Church; insomuch as I may say in Samsons language, 
judge, 14.18.  That if I had not ploughed with their Heifer, I had not so easily unfolded diverse Popish Riddles. I have dealt faithfully in the business, not wresting, nor wittingly misalleadging any Authors testimony, nor yet slightly proposing the Adversaries Argument: for that had been to have set up a shaw-fowle of mine own framing, and then have battered it in pieces with mine own Ordnance; but I have done as the Israelites, who went down to the Philistines to sharpen their tools: 
1 Sam. 13.10.  I have set as keen an edge on the Adversaries Arguments, as Bellarmine's, Parsons, or Brereleyes' Forge could afford. I confess the Work is larger, than I either desired, or expected; but it could not well be otherwise and speak fully to a thousand years and a half, and withal clear the Evidence as it went, from the Exceptions of the Adversary. I have also been long about it and so my worthy Doctor tells me; but withal he puts me in hope, it may prove like the 
* ●ardius enascitur seris umbram factura N●potibus Cupressus.  Cypress tree, which though it be long a growing, yet wh●n once it is grown up to a tree, the shade of it serves for an harbour to the child unborn, the issue hereof I leave to GOD. This only I may truly say of this Work, It hath stood me to some charges, and cost me much pains and travel; All which (were it an hundred times more than it is) I should think well bestowed, if the Church of God, and my Charge profit by me, and the Christian Reader pray for me.  
S. B.   

Catalogue Testium Veritatis. OR, A Catalogue of such Witnesses as are produced in th●● Treatise, for proof of the PROTESTANTS Religion, disposed according to the times wherein they flourished.  

Witnesses produced in the first Age, from Christ's birth to 100 years.  
CHRIST JESUS.  
The twelve Apostles.  
Saint Paul, and the Churches of the Romans, and others.  
Anno 63. joseph of Arimathea, who brought Christianity into Britain.  
70. Dionysius Areopagita. The Books that bear his Name, seem to be written in the fourth or fifth Age after Christ.  
100 Ignatius the Martyr.   

In the second Age from 100 to 200.  
150 justine Martyr.  
166 Hegesippus.  
169. The Church of Smyrna, touching the Martyrdom of their Bishop Polycap.  
170 Melito, Bishop of Sardys.  
177 Pope Eleutherius his Epistle to Lucius, the first Christian King of Britain.  
180 Polycrates of Ephesus, and the Eastern Churches, touching the keeping of Easter.  
180 Irenaeus, Bishop of Lions.  
200 Clemens Alexandrinus.   

In the third Age, from 200 to 300.  
201 Tertullian.  
230 Origen.  
230 Minutius Felix.  
250 Cyprian, Bishop of Carthage.  
300 Arnobius.  
300. Lactantius.  
Anno 291 Amphibalus, and his associates martyred in Britain; and Saint Alban. ann. 303.   

In the fourth Age, from 300 to 400.  
310 A Council at Eliberis in Spain  
317 Constantine the Great.  
325 The first General Council at Nice, against the Arrians.  
330 Eusebius Bishop of Caesarea.  
337 Ephraim the Syrian.  
340 Athanasius Bishop of Alexandria.  
360 Hilary, Bishop of Poitiers.  
364 A Council at Laodicea.  
370 Macarius the Egyptian Monk.  
370 Cyril Bishop of Jerusalem.  
370 Optatus Bishop of Mela in Africa.  
370 Ambrose Bishop of Milan.  
370 Basil the Great, Bishop of Caesarea.  
370 Gregory Nazianzen.  
380 Gregory Nyssen, Bishop of Nyssa in Cappadocia, brother to Basil.  
381 The second general Council at Constantinople, where Macedonius was condemned.  
390 Epiphanius, Bish. of Salamine in Cyprus.   

In the fifth age, from 400 to 500  
406 S. chrysostom, Bish. of Constantinople. Andr. Rivet. Critici sacri.  
415 S. Hierome. idem.  
420 S. Augustinus.  
429 Palladius, sent (by Pope Celestine) into Scotland; and Germanus (by the French Bishops) into Britain, to beat down Pelagianism.  
430 Vincentius Lirinensis wrote against the Pelagians, and Nestorians.  
430 Cyril Bishop of Alexandria.  
430 Theodoret the Historian, Bish. of Cyrene.  
431 The third general Council at Ephesus, where Nestorius was condemned & deprived.  
450 Leo the Great.  
451 The fourth general Council at Chalcedon, where Dioscurus & Eutyches were condemned.  
490 Gelasius the Pope.   

In the sixth age, from 500 to 600.  
520 Cassiodore, Abbot of Ravenna.  
520 Fulgentius, Bishop of Ruspa in Africa.  
529 A Council at Aurange, against Semi-Pelagians, and Massilians.  
540 justus Orgelitanus claruit ann. 540. Trithem. de Scriptor. Ecclesiast.  
545 junilius, Episcopus Africanus.  
545 Primasius, a Bishop of Africa. Bellar. de Scriptor. Ecclesiast.  
540 Rhemigius, Bish. of Rheims. Andr. Rivet.  
553 The fifth general Councili at Constantinople, to confirm the Nicen Council.  
560 Dracontius.  
580 Venantius Fortunatus, Bish. of Poitiers, a Poet, and Historian.  
596 Augustine the Monk, Mellitus and Laurence, sent into Britain by Pope Gregory.  
596 The Britain's Faith.  
600 Columbanus, or Saint Colme of Ireland.   

In the seventh age, from 600 to 700.  
601 Greg. the First, the Great, placed by Bellar. in this seventh age. Bell. de Script. Eccles.  
601 Hesych. Bish. of Jerusalem. Bellar. ibid.  
630 isidore, Bishop of Sevill, Disciple to Gregory the Great.  
635 Aidanus, Bishop of Lindasferne, or Holy Island, and Finanus his Successor.  
681 The sixth General Council at Constantinople, against the Monothelites, who held that although Christ had two Natures, yet he had but one will.   

In the eighth Age, from 700 to 800.  
720 Venerable Bede the Saxon.  
740 joannes Damascenus.  
740 Antonius Author Melissa.  
754 A Council held at Constant. wherein were condemned Images, and the worshippers of them●  
768 Clement, B. of Auxerre, Disciple to Bede.  
787 The second Council at Nice, about restoring of Images.  
790 Alcuinus, or Albinus, an Englishman, Disciple to Bede, and Tutor to Charlemaigne: this Alcuinus laid the foundation of the University of Paris.  
794 A Council at Frankford, wherein was condemned the second Council of Nice, for approving the worshipping of Images.  
800 Carolus Magnus, and Libri Carolini.   

In the ninth Age, from 800 to 900.  
815 Claudius Scotus.  
820 Claudius Taurinensis, against Image-worship.  
824 A Council at Paris about Images.  
830 Christianus Druthmarus, the Monk of Corbey.  
830 Agobard, Bishop of Lions.  
840 Rabanus Maurus, Bishop of Mentz, Disciple to Al●win.  
840 Haymo, Bishop of Halberstadt, Cousin to Bede.  
840 Walafridus Strabus, Abbot of Fulda, Disciple to Rabanus; he collected the Ordinary Gloss on the Bible. Trithem. de script. Eccles.  
861 Hulderick, Bishop of Auspurge.  
862 john Mallerosse, the Scottish Divine; or joannes Scotus Erigena; he was slain by the Monks of Malmsbury.  
860 Photius, Patriarch of Constantinople; he wrote the Nomo-Canon.  
876 Bertram, a Monk and Priest of France.  
890 Rhemigius, Monk of Auxerre; he wrote upon Saint Matthew.  
890 Ambrose Ansbertus, the French Monk.   

In the tenth Age, from 900 to 1000  
910 Radulphus Flaviacensis Monachus. Bellarm. quò suprà.  
950 Stephanus Eduensis Monachus. Idem.  
950 Smaragdus the Abbot.  
975 Abbot Aelfrick, and his Saxon Homily, and his Saxon Treatise of the Old and New Testament, both translated into English.   

In the eleventh age, from 1000 to 1100.  
1007 Fulbert, Bishop of Chartres.  
1050 Oecumenius.  
1050 Berengarius.  
1060 Radulphus Arden's.  
1070 Theophylact, Archbish. of the Bulgarians.  
1080 Anselm, Archbishop of Canterbury.  
1090 Hildebert, Archbishop of Tours.  
1100 Anselmus Laudunensis, Collector of the Interlinear Gloss.   

In the twelfth age, from 1100 to 1200.  
1101 Zacharias Chrysopolitanus.  
1120 Rupertus Tuitiensis.  
1130 Hugo de Sancto Victore.  
1130 Bernardus Clarae-vallensis.  
1130 Peter Bruis, and Henry of Tholouse.  
1140 Peter Lombard, Master of the Sentences.  
1150 Petrus Cluniacensis.  
1158 joannes Sarisburiensis.  
1160 Petrus Blesensis, Archdeacon of bath.  
1170 Gratianus.  
1170 Hildegard the Prophetess. Trithem.  
1195 joachimus Abbas.  
1200 Nicetas Choniates.   

In the thirteenth Age, from 1200 to 1300.  
1206 Gul. Altissiodorensis.  
1215 Concil. Lateranense, & Cuthb. Tonstal. Dunelm. Episcop. de eodem.  
1220 Honorius Augustodunensis. Bellarm.  
1230 Gulielmus Alvernus Parisiensis Episcopus.  
1230 Petrus de Vineis. Trithem.  
1240 Alexander de Hales.  
1250 Gerardus and Dulcinus.  
1250 Hugo Cardinalis.  
1250 Robert Groute-head, or Grosseteste, Bishop of Lincoln.  
1256 Gulielmus de Sancto Amore.  
1260 Thomas Aquinas.  
1260 Bonaventura.  
1260 Arnoldus de Nouâ villâ.  
1300 joannes Duns Scotus.   

In the fourteenth age, from 1300 to 1400.  
1303 Barlaam the Monk, and Nilus' Archbishop of Thessalonica.  
1320 Gulielmus Ockam.  
1320 Nicol. de Lyra, a converted jew, who commented on all the Bible.  
1320 Marsilius Patavinus.  
1320 Michael Cesena. Trithem.  
1320 Dantes.  
1320 Durandus de S. Portiano.  
1330 Alvarus Pelagius.  
1340 johannes de Rupe-scissâ. Trithem.  
1340 Thomas Bradwardin.  
1343 The Kings of England oppose Papal Provisions, and Appeals, Anno 1391.  
1350 Richardus Armachanus.  
1350 Robert Holcot, the Englishman.  
1350 Francis Petrarch. Bellarm.  
1350 Taulerus, a Preacher at Strasbrough. Bellarm.  
1370 Saint Bridge●.  
1370 john Wickliff, and the Lollards.  
1386 Gregorius Ariminensis.  
1400 Sir Geoffrey Chaucer.   

In the fifteenth Age, from 1400 to 1500.  
1410 Petrus de Alliaco, Cameracensis. Bell.  
1410 john Gerson, Chancellor of Paris.  
1411 Petrus Dresdensis, and jacobellus Misvensis.  
1414 john Hus, and Hierome of Prague.  
1414 Constantiense Concilium.  
1417 Nicholaus Clemangis. Trithem.  
1420 Ziscay, the Captain of the Hussites.  
1420 Laurentius Valla.  
1426 john Rochezana, Disciple of Hus.  
1430 Paulus Burgensis.  
1430 Alphonsus Tostatus, Bishop of Avila.  
1430 Thomas Walden.  
1431 Basiliense Concilium.  
1440 Bessarion the Cardinal.  
1453 john de Vesalia.  
1460 Nicolaus de Cusa.  
1460 Dionysius Carthusianus.  
1479 Wessellus, Preacher at Worms.  
1480 Gabriel Biel.  
1490 john and Francis Picus, Earls of Mirandula.  
1494 Trithemius the Abbot, teste ipso.  
1498 Hierome Savonarola, burnt at Florence for Religion.  
1500 Ernestus, Archbishop of Magdeburge.   

In the sixteenth Age, from 1500 to 1600.  
Anno 1517. Martin Luther published his Propositions against Indulgences; and shortly after opposed the Pope's Supremacy, Purgatory, and other Tenets of the Pontificials of Rome.    

A Catalogue of Authors cited in this Treatise, with the time and place of their Edition.  

A.  
ADo Viennens. Chron. 1512.  
Agobardi opera, Parisijs 1605.  
Aelfrickes' Sermon on Easter day, printed at London by john Day, and reprinted Lond. 1623., with his Saxon Treatise of the old and new Testament.  
Aeliani varia Histor. Graeco-lat. Tiguri 1556.  
Paulus Aemilius de gest. Francor. Basileae the place expressed, but not the year.  
Alcuini opera, Paris● 1617. 

— idem de Trinitate, Lugd. 1525.    
Alexander de Alice (his) Summa in quatuor partib. Papiae 1489.  
Clem. Alexandrini opera Graec●, ex Biblioth. Medicaeâ, Florent, 1550.  
Petr. de Alliac● Cardin. Cameracens. in lib. 1, 3, & 4. Sentent. Paris.  
Monachi Altissiodorens. Chronologia Trecis, 1609.  
Gul. Altissiodorens. in Sent. Paris. 1500.  
Alvarus Pelagius de planctu Eccles. Venetijs 1560.  
Ambros●j opera tom. 5. Basileae 1538.  
Bishop Andrews Answer to Cardinal Perron's Reply, London 1629. 

— ejusdem Responsio ad Bellarmini Apologiam, London 1610.    
Ambros. Ansbertus in Apocalyps'. Colon. 1536.  
Anselmi opera● Colon. 1573.  
Anselmi Laudunens'. Gloss. Interlinear, apud Lyran. Lugduni. 1589.  
Antiquitates Britanicae Hanoviae 1605.  
S. Antoniuses Melissa in Biblioth. S. Patr. per Margarin● de la Bigne.  
Thomae Aquinatis Summa. Paris. 1608.  
Thom. Aquinatis opera Antuerp. 1612.  
Radulphus Arden's in Dominical cited by Doctor Usher in his Answer to the jesuit.  
Gregor. Ariminens. in prim. & secund. Sentent. Venet. 1503.  
Ric. Armaca●i Sermons contrà Fratres Mendicant. & Quaestion. Armenor. Paris. 1511.  
D. Arnobius advers. Gentes. Antuerp. 1582.  
Articles of Religion in England, London, 1631.— In Ireland, London 1629.  
S. Athanasij opera Graeco-Lat. Paris 1627. 

— Latin. in 4. tom. Basil 1556.    
Io. Aventini annal Boiorum, Ingolstad. 1554.  
Augustini opera in 10. tom. Basil 1529.  
A●orij Institution. Moral. tom. primus, Colon. 1602.   

B.  
●oh. Balaeus, de Scriptor. Britan Basil. 1559.  
The prudential Balance, weighing the Catholic and Protestant Religion, 1609.  
Theodori Balsamon. Com. in Canon's, Paris. 1561.  
Caesaris Baronij annal in 10. tom. Antuerp. 1597.  
Basilij opera S●aeco-lat. tom. 2. Par. M.DCXVIII. 

— Lat. Antuerp. 1568.    
Bedae opera in 8. tom. Basil. 1563. 

— Ecclesiast, Histor. Gent. Anglor. Antuerp. 1550.    
Master B●dels Letters to Master Wadesworth, London, 1624.  
Robert Bellarminus de Controvers. Fidei, Ingolstad. 1587. 

— de Scriptorib. Ecclesiast. Colon. 1622.  
— de Indulgentijs & jubilaeo. Colon. 1599    
Benno Cardinal. de Vitâ & Gest. Hildebrandi, in Fascie. rerum expetend & fugiend. Colon. 1535.  
jaco. Philip. Bergomens. Supplement. Chron. Venet. 1503.  
Bernardi opera, Paris. 1513.  
Philip Ber●●●●j Pithanon Diatribae 2. Tolosae. 1608.  
Bertold. Constantiens. Appendix ad Hermanni Chron. Francof. 1585.  
Bertram de corp. & sang. Domini. Colon. 1551. 

— Anglicè. Lond. 1548.    
Bessarion. Tract. de Sacram. Euchar. habetur inter ●iturgias S. Patr. Antuerp. 1560.  
Biblia Latin. per Sanct. Pagnin. Lugdun. 1527.  
Bibliotheca Patrum, tom. 14. Colon. Agrip. 1618.  
Bibliotheca S. Patr. tom. 9 Edit. secunda, per Margarin de la Bigne, Paris. 1589. 

— cadem tom. 8. Paris. 1575.    
Bibliotheca vet. Patr. seu Scriptor. Ecclesiasticor. tom. 1. Graeco-lat. Paris. 1624.  
Magna Bibliotheca, vet. Patr. tom. 15. Colon. 1622.  
Gabr. Biel super Canone Mi●sae. Lugdun. 1542.  
Bishop Bilson, of Subjection, Lond. 1586.  
Pet. Bles●nsis opera, Mogunt. 1600.  
Bonaventurae opera, tom. 7. Romae 1588.  
Tho. Bradwardin. de Causâ Dei contrà Pelagium. London. 1618.  
Io. Brereley, (his) Protestants Apology. 1608.  
Breviarium Roman. Lugd. 1548.  
Edward Bre●rewoods Inquiries of Languages and Religions, Lond. 1614  
Brigittae Revelation. Nurenburg. 1521.  
Rich. Bristol (his) Motives. Antwerp. 1599  
Abr. Bucholceri Chronolog. Basil. MDCXI.  
Gul Budaei opera Basil. 1556.  
A Bull granted by Pope Pius the fifth, to Doctor Harding.  
Paul. Burgensis Addit. ad Lyran. inter opera Nicol. de Lyra. Paris. 1590.   

C.  
Anthon. Cade (his) justification of the Church of England. London 1630.  
Tho. de Ʋio Caietan. Comment. in tertiam part● Summae Aquinat Bononiae. 1520. 

— In Epist. Pauli. Lugdu●. 1556.    
Gul. Camdeni Britannia Lond. 1600. 

— Anglice Lond. 1610.    
Edm. Campiani Ratione● Cosmopoli. 1581.  
Codex Canonum vetus Eccles. Romanae. Lutetiae. 1609.  
Canon's Apostolorum & Concilior. ex Editione joan. Tilij Graec. 

— & Lat. Lutet. Paris. 1620.    
Thom. Cantipratanus de mirac. & exempl. memorabilib. sui temporis, Duaci. 1605.  
Melchior Canus de loc. Theolog. Lovan. 1569.  
Barthol. Caranza (his) Summa Concilior. Antuerp. 1577.  
Hugo Cardi●alis Postillae pa●t. 6. Paris. 1539.  
Carion Chronic. à Caspar Pe●cero auctum. Witebergae. 1570.  
Caroli Magni libri quatuor contrà Imagines, Francof. 1608.  
Dionys. Carthusiani opera, Colon. 1533.  
Georg. Cassandris de Articul. Religion. Consultatio. Lugdun. 1608. 

— Liturgica. Colon. 1558.  
— De Officio pij viri in dissidio Religionis Colon. 1577.    
Cassiodorus in Psalmos, Paris. 1519.  
Alphons. de Castro advers. Haeres. Venet. 1546. 

— de justâ Haereticor. punitione, Antuerp. 1568.    
Mathias ●laccius Illiricus (his) Catologus testium veritatis study & curâ Si. Goulartij. Gen. 1608.  
Ambros. Cathaerini disceptatio de Certitudine Gratiae. Romae. 1551.  
Georg. C●dreni annal Graec. & Lat. Basil. 1566.  
Centuriae ecclesiast. Histor. Magdeburg. Basil. 1569.  
Edw. Chaloners Treatise upon Credo Eccles. S. Catholicam, Lond. 1625.  
Sir Geoffrey Chaucer's Works, Lond. 1602.  
Mart. Chemnit. loci Theologic. parts 3. Fr. 1608.  
joann. Chrysostomis opera Graec, in tom. 8. Etonae. 1613. 

— Ejusdem opera Lat. in tom. 5. Paris. 1588.    
Zacharia● Chrysopolitan. Episcop. in Concord. Evangel. 1535.  
David. Chytrai Chronolog. Helmaestadij, 1593.  
Nicol. de Cl●mangijs opera, Lugd. Batav. 1612.  
Pet. Cluniace●s. opera, Paris. 1522.  
Robert. Cocus (his) Censura quorundam Scriptor. veterum. Lond. 1614  
joan. Cochl●i Histor. Hussit. Mogunt. 1549.  
S. Col●mban. in libro cui titul. Paraenetic. vet. cum notis Goldasti. 1604.  
Philip de Cominees (his History of Lewis the eleventh, and Charles the eighth, Gallic●. A Paris. 1551.  
Concilia General. & Provincial. per Severin. Binnium● tom. 4. Colon. 1606.  
Concilia General. Edit. Romae, 1612.  
Concil. Tridentin. Antuerp. 1577.  
Gaspar Contareni opera, Par. 1571.  
Costeri Enchiridion Controversiar. Colon. 1586.  
Rich. Crakanthorpe, of the Pope's temporal Monarchy. London. 1621. 

— Of the fifth General Council. Lond. 1631.  
— Defensio Eccles. Anglicanae contrà Archiepiscop. Spalatens. Lond. 1625.    
Saint Augustine's Sums of Religion by William Crompton, in answer to john Brereley, Lond. 1625.  
Nicol. de Cusâ opera, Basil. 1565.  
D. Cypriani Opera cum Annotat. jacob. Pamelij. Paris. 1603. 

— Et edit. à Goulartio. 1593.    
Cyrilli Alexandrini opera, tom. 5. Basil. 1566.  
Cyrilli Hierosolomit. Catecheses' Graec. Lat. Paris. 1609.   

D.  
Lamb. Danaeus in August. de Haeres. Genevae 1595.  
Dante l' Inferno del Purgatorio del' Paradiso. Appresso in Lione 1571.  
Damasceni opera Graec. & Lat. Basil. 1559.  
Mart. Delrio Disquisition Magicar. Mogu●t. 1603.  
Pauli Diasoni Histor Ingolst. 1603.  
Dionysi●s Ar●opagi●a ●e oelesti Hierarchiá. Graec. Basil. 1539.  
Dracon●ij Po●ti●um Hexame●o● in Tom 8. Biblioth. Patr. Paris. 1580.  
Christian. Druthmarus, Comment. in Matth. in tomo 9 Biblioth. Patr. Colon. 1618.  
Math. Dresserus de Religione sub Precioso Ioanne Lipsiae. 1597.  
joh. Driedo opera. Lovanij. 1550:  
Durand● S. Porciano in Sent. Antuerp. 1567.  
johan. Duraeus advers. Whitaker inter Whitakeri oper●. Genev. 1610.  
Andr. Duvalius cited in Doct. Vsserij Gotteschalco, Dublin. 1631.   

E.  
Histor. Ecclesiastica Scriptores Graec. Paris. 1544. 

— Latin. Basil. 1611.    
Eckij Enchiridion. Colon. 1535.  
Steph. Edvensis Episcop. de Sacram. Altar. in tom. 6. Biblioth. Patr. Edit. secunda per Margarin. de la Bigne. Paris. 1589.  
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Z.  
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FINIS.   


Errata si● corrige.  
In Epist. Ded. pag. 1. lin. ult. read antedated. pag. 2. lin. 16. no, r●so.  
In Praef. ad Lect. pag. 4. lin. 2. and speak, r. being to speak.  
In Catal. test. in the 5. Age, lin. 2. deal. Andrew Rivet. lin. 10. B. of Cyrene, r. B. of Cyrus, or Cyria.   

In the first Alphabet.  
Pag. 7. lin. penult. r. they practise. p. 18. in marg. li. 17. r. 1590.  
pag. 35. lin. 18. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 r. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  
pag. 39 in marg. li. 21. cap. r. cont. pag. 42. l. 19 other, r. the other.  
pag. 55. l. 25. Christ, r. God. p. ●9. l. 5. learned, r. taught.  
pag. 76. lin. 12. add, and we truly eat the word flesh.  
pag. 78. l. ult. substance, r. person. pag. 16●. lin. 2. haec, r. he. viz.  
pag. 182. lin. 15. were condemned, r. were not condemned.  
pag. 237. lin. 2. glorifieth, r. glorieth.   

In the second Alphabet.  
Pag. 14. in marg. lin. 1. nulluum, r. nullum. p. 31. l. 28. r. by a strain.  
pag. 32. lin. 24. deal. as. pag. 34. lin. 31. saith, r. hath.  
pag. 51. in marg lin. 14. r. sibi ipsi. pag. 62. lin. 3. r. I used.  
pag. 84. in marg. l. 13. r. salvatione. pa. 100 in marg. l. 8. r. tenuerim.  
pag. 116. l. 14. r. hear. pag. 123. l. 31. remain, r. to be abolished.  
pag. 155. liu. 29. universal, r. eastern. pa. 161. lin. 13. did, r. I did. & in marg. lin. 4. xiv, r. xii. pag. 197. lin. 24. many, r. may.  
pag. 204. lin. 2. 60. r. 600. pag. 206. lin. 1. god, r. good.    

The nine Articles of Religion handled in the several Centuries of this Treatise, are these:  

1 Concerning the Scriptures sufficiency.  
2 Of the Scripture Canon.  
3 Of Communion in both kinds.  
4 Of the number of Sacraments.  
5 Concerning the Eucharist.  
6 Touching Worship of Images.  
7 Concerning Invocation of Saints departed.  
8 Of justification.  
9 Of Merits.   
By the way ar● handled, 

The Pope's Supremacy.  
The power of Calling Councils.  
Appeals to Rome.  
Priest's Marriage, etc.     

THE PREFACE TO THE PROTESTANTS EVIDENCE.  PAPIST. 
GOod morrow Neighbour, are you going to Church so early?  PROTESTANT. 
I am Sir, and I should be glad of your company.  PAP. 
So should I be of yours; but I doubt, we go not to the same Church.  PRO. 
I am going to a Protestant Church, and I take that to be a true member of the Catholic.  PAP. 
It is not; for the true Church is ever gloriously visible, and had visible Professors in all ages; but yours was not in being, (
a Prot. Apolog. Tract. 3. chap. 2. sect. 2. p. 330.  saith Father Brereley) until Luther's days: and Father Campian 
b Testes res omnes & reculae, nullam in orbe religionem nisi nostram imis unquam radicibus insedisse. Camp rat. 10.  calls to witness, res omnes & reculas, all things both great and small, things and thinglings, that never any other Religion but the Catholic, took any deep root upon the face of the earth. And he saith further, That 
c Seculis omninò quindecim, non oppidum, non villam, non domum reperiunt imbutam doctrin● suâ. id. rat. 3.  one cannot spy out so much as one town, one village, one house for fifteen hundred years that savoured of your doctrine: And jesuit Coster saith, 
d Constat manifestè, neminem to●o o●be mortalium, ante M. Lutherum, hoc est, an●e annum 1517 〈◊〉, qui eam fidem ten●r●t. Coster. E●ch●●id. Co●trovers. cap. 2.  It is manifestly evident, that none in the universal world before Luther, in the year 1517, held that Faith, which Luther, and calvin's Scholars professed.  PROT. 
This is but a vain flourish of the Jesuits, and controlled by their own man Bristol, who acknowledgeth, that 
c bristol Motives. Presat. & Motive 45.  some there have been in many ages, in some points, of the Protestants opinion.  
Now for our Tenet, this it is; The Church, (that is the society of Christian people, professing saving faith) is never totally hidden; but there be still some, that hold the right faith, and deliver it over to others; and yet in time of persecution, and the like cases, the Church is not always so conspicuous, as that a man seeing her outward pomp and ceremonies, may point her out, and safely join himself to such a company: for thus 
f Romani●ellarm ●ellarm. lib. 3. de E●cle●. cap. 2.  Bellarmine makes the Church to be a Society subjecting themselves to the See of Rome, teaching truth without error, and this Company as visible, as are the Citizens of Rome. Now for the Protestant Church, though it have not been always gloriously visible; yet it hath been evermore so visible, as the true Church ought to be.  PAP. 
Saint Austin saith, 
g In Sole, id est● in mani●estatione. Aug. t●m. 7. cont lit● Petil. l. 2. cap 32.  He hath set his Tabernacle in the Sun; Is not the Church then conspicuous as the Sun?  PROT. 
You may not argue from such Allusions as are taken from the outward pomp of the world, thereby to describe the inward beauty of the Church.  
2. Besides, according to the true reading, 
h So●t po●uit taberna●al●m in eyes, id est, in cistic Hie●on. i● Psal. 18. to. ●.  the mea●ing is; he hath set up a seat for the Sun in the heavens, that there it might be viewed as on a scaffold: now this Sun may be eclipsed.  
3. Again, this was only an Allusion which Saint Austin used against the Donatists, (who pinned up the Church within a corner of Afri●k, as now the Papists confine her to Rome) thereby telling them, there were many Churches besides theirs, to be seen as clear as the Sun, if the Donatists could discern them.  
4. Lastly, though Austin termed the Church in diebus illis, in his own time, to be set as it were in the Sun; yet he denies not, but that afterwards, in declining ages, this Sun might be darkened, and the Church make but small appearance in the time of persecution, as the same Father 
i Ecce●●ia non apparebit, impi●s tunc persecuto●ibu● v●tra modum savientibus. Aug. epist. 80. tom. 2.  speaks.  PA. 
The Church is as a City upon an hill 
k Math. 5.15.16. , a light upon a Candlestick, and therefore conspicuous.  PRO. 
1. This also is an Allusion, which yet Saint Chrisostome 
l Chrysost. in Math● c. 5. hom. 10. tom. 2.  understands to be meant of the Apostles; that they were to look to their carriage, since they were to preach abroad, and had many looke●s on.  
2. Again, though the Church be set on a hill, yet as the Aramites could not discern ●he city of Samaria, whither the Prophet led them, till their eyes were opened, 2 Kings chap. 6. no more can one discern, or difference the true Church from the malignant, and conventicles of the wicked, until his mind be enlightened. And thus Austin 
* Montem ●on vide●●, n●lo mireris; oculos non habent. August tract. 1. in epist. joan. tom. 9  told the Donatists, they could not see the Church on the hill, because their eyes were blinded, to wit, either with ignorance, or malice.  
In a word, this Hill may be hid with a mist, this Sun obscured with a cloud, and the Moon eclipsed. The blessed Apostles were no corner-creepers, yet were they not seen and acknowledged for true professors by the Scribes and Pharisees, that dwelled but hard by in jewrie.  
Howsoever, what is this to Rome, if she hold the socket, and want the light? if she be seated on a hill, yea seven hills, like 
m A●o●al. 17.9.  Babylon?  PA. 
Will you call Rome Babylon?  PRO. 
Your own Jesuits 
n Babylon matter fornicationum, Roma quidem est. Ribera in cap. 14. Apocal. nu. 39  call Rome Babylon; neither can this be meant of Heathen Rome, but of Rome Christian, and as it shall be at the end of the world: for so speaks 
o De Româ intelligendum, non solum quali● sub Ethnicis I●peratoribus olim fuit, sed etiam qualis i● fine seculi futura est. Riber. in 14 Apocal. nu. 42.  Rib●ra; and 
p Colligitur ●o●am, extremis mu●di ●●mp●ribus, post quam a f●ie defe●erit, ad s●mm●m potentiam perve●●uram. Vi●gas in cap. 18. Apoc. come. 1. sect. 4.  Viegas saith, After that Rome shall fall from the faith. Now Heathen Rome could not fall from the faith, since it never professed the faith: therefore the prophecy is to be fulfilled in Rome Papal, and Christian.  PA. 
If thy brother offend thee, 
q Math. 18.17.  tell the Church; then must we needs know the Church.  PRO. 
1. We are bid tell the Church, that is, her Pastors and Governors, when there is such a standing Ministry, and public discipline exercised.  
2. But in case Tyrants hinder the open meetings of Christians; even then also in some good sort, though she be not so outwardly visible to her foes, yet may the Church take notice; as the faithful in the primative Church met together privately, and observed orders for reforming of abuses, being known one to another as friends, but unknown (as such) to their foes.  
In a word, one may tell the Church, though for the time she be hid from her foes; even as one may tell a message to his friend, who for the time is hid from his enemy.  PA. 
Some of yours say, 
r Napier 〈◊〉 the Revel. P●op. 35.  The Church was invisible for diverse ages.  PRO. 
They say not it was simply invisible, but they speak respectively; so that looking on those times, which fell out somewhat before, and after the first six hundred years, and seeing the title of Universal Bishop (which Grego●y detested as 
s Quisquis se univer●●le● Sa●er●otem ●o●at in ●●tion● suà Anti●h●●st in 〈…〉. Greg. ●pi●t. lib. 6. ●p 30 to. 2.  Antichristian) settled on the Pope, about the year 666, and that this 
t Revel. 13.18.  number so fitly agreed to the Man of sin: as also looking downward to the thousand year, wherein Satan was 
u Revel. 20.3.  loosed, and the Turk and Pope grew great; looking hereon, and comparing the Church as she was then (under 
x Gregory the seventh, Ann. 1075.  Hildebrand, forbidding Marriage, and deposing the Emperor) with herself in the primitive ages, they said she was in manner invisible in the Western Horizon, to wit, in respect of that degree, and measure of the light of the Gospel that broke forth in the time of the Reformation. Besides, during the time mentioned, it was visible enough, in the Greek and Eastern Church: and for the Western, it had the same subsisting and being with the best members in the Roman Church.  PA. 
Master Napier saith, 
y Napier on the Revelat. p. 68 & 191 & 161 cited by the Prot. apology tract. 2. cap. 1 sect 4.  Our Religion hath reigned universally, and without any debatable contradiction 1260 years; Gods true Church most certainly abiding so long latent and invisible: And Master 
z Perkins 〈◊〉 Exposed. of the Creed. pag. 400  Pe●kins saith, That for the space of many hundred years, an universal Apostasy overspread the whole face of the earth, and that your Church was not visible to the world.  PRO. 
Master Napier saith not, that your Religion reigned so universally; neither doth he speak in general of the whole body of the Romish Faith, and of the universal Antiquity thereof, which is the point in question; but only of the first original of the papal dominion, and Antichristian kingdom, as he calleth it, as Bishop Morton hath well 
a Prot. Appeal. ●. 1. c. 8. sect. 2. in Marg. lit. F.  observed: neither yet was this papal Hierarchy, or as Master Perkins calls it, 
b Master Perkins on the Creed. pag. 307.  popish Heresy of being entitled, Universal Bishop of the Church, carried without the opposition of several Counsels, and Worthies in God's Church; as (God willing) hereafter shall appear.  
For the place cited out of Master Perkins, it is as we in our common phrase of speech use to say, That all the world is set on mischief, because so many delight in wickedness. Neither is this manner of speech unusual in the Scriptures, From the Prophet to the Priest, all deal falsely, saith Ie●emy 6.13. and 
c Omnes querunt que 〈…〉. 〈◊〉 in 2. 〈…〉 Ph●lip.  Saint Paul saith, All seek their own, and not that which is jesus Christ's, Phil. 2.21. besides he saith, I● had overspread the face of the earth: Now a large field may be overspread with Tares and weeds, and yet some good corn in the field: Neither saith Master Perkins, that our Church was simply invisible, but that it was not visible, to the world; and withal he tells us where it was. It lay hid (saith he 
d It lay hid un●e● the ch●ffe of Pope●●●, ●nd the truth of this, the Records o●●ll Ag●● manifest. M. ●●rkins on the 〈◊〉. ●ag. 4. ●. ) under the chasse of Popery. Now the grain is not utterly invisible, whiles it is mingled with cha●se in the same heap.  PA. 
Was not the Church ever gloriously visible?  PRO. 
It was not; for (as S. Austin 
〈◊〉 in solo Ab●l 〈…〉 August. in Psal 12● tom. 8.  saith) it was sometimes only in Abel, and he was slain by his brother; in Enoch, and he was translated from the ungodly; it was in the sole house of Abraham, Noah, and Lot.  
Afterwards how was it so notably conspicuous, when as both Israel and judah fell to Idolatry, 
f 2 〈◊〉. 28.24. & ●9. 7.8.  in the times of Achaz and Manasse? when as those Kings caused the Temple to be shut up, the Sacrifice to cease, and erected Idols in every Town?  
Besides, at our Saviour's coming, we find but a short Catalogue of true professors mentioned, to wit, joseph and Mary, Zacharie and Elizabeth, Simeon and Anna, the Shepherds in the fields, and some others.  
When Christ suffered death, his little flock (as he called it) 
 was scattered, his disciple ●led, 
 and none almost durst show themselves, 
 save Mary and john, and some few women, with o●hers.  
After our Saviour's death, the Apostles, and their followers were glad to meet in 
 Chambers, whiles the Priests, Scribes and Pharisees bore all the sway in the Temple; ●o that (as the 
l Page 1●.  Treatise of the true C●urch●s visibility ha●h it) if a we●ke body had then enquired for the Church, it is likely, they had been directed to them.  
In ●he time of those Ten persecutions, there could not be any known assembly of Christians, but forthwith ●he Tyran●s laboured to root them out: but (as T●rtullian saith) 
m S●men est Sanguls Christianorum. Tertull in Apologet. cap. 50 to. 1.  The blood of the Martyrs was the seed of the Church, they were persecuted, and yet they increased.  
Afterwards, when the Arrian Heresy overspread all, so that all the world was against Athanasius, and he, and some few Confessors stood for the Nicen Faith; (insomuch as Hierome said, 
n Ingem●it totus orbis, & Arri●num se esse miratus est. Hieron. advers. Luciferian. tom. 2.  The world sighed and groaned, marvelling at itself, how it was become Arrian,) what a slender appearance did the true professors then make? and yet in such dangerous and revolting times, even small 
o Math. 18.20. Phil●m. 2.  assemblies of particular congregations, wheresoever dispersed, serve to make up the universal Church Militant: so that the Reader is not to be discouraged, if he find not the Protestant Assemblies so thronged, since it was not so with the primative Church; and S. john foretold, 
p Apocal. 12 14.  That the woman, that is, the Church, persecuted by the Dragon, that old Serpent the Devil, and his instruments, should fly into the Wilderness, where the Lord promised to hide her, till the tempest of persecution were overblown; wherein God dealt graciously with his Church, for had her enemies always seen and known her professors, they would (like cruel beasts) have laboured to devour the dam with her young, the mother with her children.  
Now whereas the Papists brag of their Church's visibility, their own Rhemists are driven to confess, 
q Rhem. Annot. on Thessal. 2.2. sect 6.  that in the reign of Antichrist, the outward state of the Roman Church, and the public intercourse of the faithful with the same, may cease, and practise their Religion in secret: And jesuit Suarez thinks it probable, 
r Non est incredibile, Romam propè Antichrist● tempora, it a a●●lic●a●, ut quasi in Angulo, ●el in ●avernis terrae delitescat. Suarez Defensio fide● Cathol. lib. 5. c. 21.  That the Pope shall profess his faith in secret. Where is then your Tabernacle in the Sun? your light in the Candlestick? when as your Church and Pope shall walk with a dark Lantern, and say Mass in a corner.  PA. 
Why was not the Church always so conspicuous?  PRO. 
Because sometimes her best members, (as Athanasius, Hilary, Ambrose, and others) were persecuted as Heretics, and ungodly men; and that by learned persons, and such as were powerful in the world, able to draw great troops after them, of such as for hope, favour, fear, or the like respects, were ready to follow them: In this, and the like case, when false Priests broach errors, and deceive many, Tyrants persecute God's Saints, and cause others to retire; then I say, (when the faithful want their ordinary intercourse one with another) the number of the Church malignant maybe great, in comparison of those that belong to the true Church.  PA. 
If the Church were not always so conspicuous, in what sort then was it visible? a visible Church you grant.  PRO. 
In the general militant Church, there have in all ages been some Pastors and people, more or less, that have outwardly taught the truth of Religion in substance, though not free from error in all points; and these have been visible by their ordinary standing in some part of God's Church.  
Besides, for the more part there have been also some, that withstood and condemned the gross errors and superstition of their times; and these good men, whiles they were suffered, taught the truth openly; but being persecuted by such as went under the Church's name, even then also they taught, and administered the Sacraments in private, to such faithful ones as would join with them; and even in those harder times, they manifested their Religion by their Writings, Letters, Confessions; at their judgement, Martyrdom, or otherwise, as they could.  
Now (as learned Doctor White in his Defence of his Brother's book hath observed) 
u The Orthodox F●i●h. chap. 3. Paragraph 3.  whensoever there be any Pastors in the world, which ●ither in an open view, or in the presence of any part thereof do exercise (though in private) the actions of true Religion, by sound teaching the truth, and right administration of the Sacraments, this is sufficient to make the Church visible, by such a manner of visibility, as may serve for the gathering and preserving of Gods elect. Now such visible Pastors and people, the Protestant Church was never utterly destitute of.  PA. 
You seem to make the Church both visible, and invisible.  PRO. 
May not one be within, and seen with his friends, and yet hidden to his enemies? visible to the seeing, and invisible to the blind? Indeed Tyrants, Infidels, and Heretics, they knew the true believers, as men of another profession; but blinded with malice and unbelief, they acknowledged them not for true professors: 
* Acts and Monuments. vol. 2. lib. 10. pa. 1616.  as M. Bradford told D. Day, Bishop of Chichester; the fault why the Church is not seen of you, is not because the Church is not visible, but because your eyes are not clear enough to see it; and indeed, such as put not on the spectacles of the Word to find out the Church, but seek for her in outward pomp, are much mistaken.  
Aelian in his History tells us of one Nicostratus, who being a well-skilled Artisan, and finding a curious piece of work drawn by Xeuxis that famous Painter, one who stood by, wondered at him, and asked him, what pleasure he could take, to stand as he did, still gazing on the picture: to whom he answered; 
x 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. AElian. 〈◊〉 Histor. lib. 14. cap. 47.  Hadst thou mine eyes, my friend, thou wouldst not wonder, nor ask me that question, but rather be ravished as I am at the inimitable art of this rare and admired piece. In like manner, if our Adversaries had their eyes anointed with the eyesalve of the holy Spirit, they might easily discover the Protestant Church, and her visible congregations. The Aramites, 2 Kings 6. chap. could not discern the city of Samaria, whither the Prophet led them, until their eyes were opened; no more can one discern, or difference the true Church from the malignant, and conventicles of the wicked, until his mind be enlightened. And thus Saint Austin told the Donatists, 
* Mo●tem non vident, nolo ●●●●eris; oculos non habent. August. Tract. 1. in epist. joan. tom. 9  They could not see the Church on the hill, because their eyes were blinded, to wit, either with ignorance, or malice.  
Saint Austin compares 
y Ecclesia propter ipsam mutabilitatem Luna nomine in Scriptures signatur. Aug. tom. 8 in Psal. 10. & tom. 2. ●p. 119.  the Church to the Moon, which waxeth and waneth, is eclipsed, and sometime, as in the change, cannot be seen; yet none doubts but still there is a Moon. The Church sometimes shines in the clear days of peace, and is by and by overcast with a cloud of persecution, as the same Austin 
z Aliquando obscuratur. Id. ep. 48.  saith: The Moon is not always in the Full, nor the Church ever in her glorious aspect.  PA. 
If your Church were always visible, where then was it before Luther's time?  PRO. 
I might also ask you, Where was a great part of your Religion before the Trent Council, which was but holden about the year 1534.  
Now for our Religion, it was for substance, and in the affirmative parts, and positive grounds thereof, (the question being not of every accessary, and secondary point,) it was I say, contained in the Canonical Scriptures, whereas you are driven to seek yours in the Apocryphal, in the Trent Creed, the Trent Council. Now ours it was contained in the Apostles Creed, explained in the Nicene and Athanasian, confirmed by the first four general Counsels, taught in the undoubted writings of the true, ancient, and orthodox Fathers of the primative Church, justified from the tongue and pen of our adversaries; witnessed by the confessions of our Martyrs, which have suffered for truth, and not for treason. This is the Evidence of our Religion; whereas for proof of yours, in diverse points, you are driven to fly to the bastard Treatises of false Fathers, going under the name of Abdias Linus, Clemens, S. Denys, and the like; as sometime Perkin Warbeck a base fellow feigned himself to be King Edward the fourth's son, and for a time went under his 
a Fabian. Chron. ad Ann. 1495.  name: and yet these Knights of the post, must be brought in to depose on your behalf, though others of your side have cashiered them as counterfeits 
b Se● D james of the Bastardy of false Father's, and D. Raynolds Conference, Chap 8. Divis. 2. .  PA. 
If your Professors were so visible, name them.  PRO. 
This is no reasonable demand; you have razed our Records, conveied our Evidence, clapped up our Witnesses, and suborned your own; you have for your own advantage, (as is already shown by that learned Antiquary of Oxford, D. james 
c A Treatise of the corruption of Scripture, Counsels, Fathers. , and others, and shall (God willing) appear in the Centuries following,) you have I say, corrupted Counsels, Fathers, and Scriptures, by purging and prohibiting what Authors, and in what places you would; and now you call us to a trial of Names.  PA. 
Particular men may mis-coat the Fathers, but our Church hath not.  PRO. 
You have; witness your expurgatory and prohibitory Indices, or Tables, whereof since myself have of late been an eyewitness, and seen diverse of them both in the public and private Libraries in Oxford; I will therefore acquaint the Reader with the mystery thereof.  
When that politic Council of Trent perceived, that howsoever men might be silenced, yet books would be blabs, and tell truth, they devised this course: They directed a Commission to a company of Inquisitors, residing in several places, and thereby gave them power to purge and prohibit all manner of Books, Humanity and Divinity, ancient & late, in such sort as they should think fit. Upon this Commission, renewed as occasion served, the Inquisitors set forth their several expurgatory, and prohibitory Indices, printed at Rome, in Spain, in the Low-countries, and elsewhere; and in these Tables (yet to be seen) they set down what books were by them forbidden, and which to be purged, and in what places ought were to be left out, whensoever the Works should be printed anew: for according to their Tables or Corrections, books were to be printed afresh. Now to make sure work, they got as many of the former Editions of the Father's works, as they could, into their hands, and suffered no new Copy to come forth, but through their fingers, purged according to their Receipt: neither feared they that their adversaries would set forth the large volumes of the Father's Works, or others, having not the means to vent their Impressions, being forbidden to be sold in Catholic countries. By this means, the Roman Censurers thought to stop all tongues and pens, that none should hereafter speak or write otherwise than the Trent Council had dictated● and so in time all Evidence should have made for the Roman cause.  
Hereby the Reader may perceive, that had their device gone on, they would in time, by their chopping and changing the writings of the Ancient at their pleasure, have razed and defaced whatsoever Evidence had made for us, and against themselves. But so it pleased God, that howsoever they had carried the matter cunningly in secret, yet at length all comes out, their plot was discovered, and their Indices came into the Protestants hands. The Index of Antwerp was discovered by junius 
d D. james part 4. of the Mystery o● the Indices expurgatorij. pag. 21. ; the Spanish and Portugal was never known till the taking of Cales, and then it was found by the English.  PA. 
Might we not purge what was naught?  PRO. 
Indeed, if you had purged or prohibited the lewd writings of wanton Aretine, railing Rabelais, or the like, you had done well: but underhand to go and purge out the wholesome sentences of the Fathers, such as were agreeable to the Scriptures; thus to purge those good old men, till you wrung the very blood and life out of them, bewrayeth, that you have an ill cause in hand, that betakes itself to such desperate shifts.  
Neither can you justly say, that you have corrected what others marred: for it was your side that first kept a tampering with the Father's Works, and corrupted them. Francis junius reports, 
e ●unius in praefatione arte ●ndicem Expu●gato ium B●lgi●um ● se editum. 1586. referente Andr●● Rivet lib. 3. Critici Sacri. cap. 16.  that he coming (in the year 1559) to a familiar friend of his, named Lewis Savarius, Corrector of a Print at L●yden, found him overlooking Saint Ambrose Works, w●ich Fr●llonius was printing; whereof when junius commended the elegancy of the Letter and Edition, the Corrector told him secretly, it was of all Editions the worst; and drawing out many sheets of now waste paper from under the table, told him, they had printed those sheets according to the ancient and authentic Copies: but two Franciscan Friars had by their authority canceled and rejected them, and caused other to be printed, and put in their rooms, differing from the truth of all their own books, to the great loss of the Printer, and wonder of the Corrector: so that had yo● prevailed, neither old nor new, Greek, nor Latin Fathers, nor later Writers, had been suffered to speak the truth, but ei●her (like Parrots) been ta●ght to lisp Popery, or for ever bee● put to silence. The best is, the Manuscripts (which by God's providence are still preserved amongst us) they m●ke for us, as D. james, excellently versed in Antiquity, hath shown at large 
D. Ia●e● his Manuduction to Divinity. .  PA. 
Have ●ee purged aught in the Fathers, or Scriptures, that was not to be purged?  PRO. 
You have, as appears by these instances following; St. chrysostom in his third Sermon u●on Lazarus, and elsewhere maintaineth th● perspicuity and plainness of the Scriptures, saying, 
g In 〈◊〉 Scriptures 〈…〉 quaecunque ●unt nec●ssaria Ch●ysos●. tom. 4. in 2 Thess●l. h●mil. 3.  That in divine Scriptures all necessary things are plain. He likewise holdeth, that faith only sufficeth in stead of all, saying, 
h Illud unum ass●verave●im, quod so●a fides p●r se salvum sec●rit Chry. ●o. 3. de Fide & L●ge nature. & to. 1. in P●al. 13.  This one thing I will affirm, That faith only by it self sa●eth. In like sort Saint Hierome holds, 
i Impium per sol●m ●idem ●usti●icat De●s Hier. to. 9 in ca 4. ad Rom.  That faith only justifieth, that works do not justify, that Images are not to be adored. Now all this is to be found, even totidem ve●bis, in the self same terms in the Father's text; and yet the Index of Spain (published by Cardinal Quiroga, and reprinted at Samur, by the honour of the French Gentility, the Lord of Plessis) comes in, and gives these Fa●hers a strong purge, commanding 
k ●x Chrysost●mi Indice edit. Basi●●ae delea●tur— Iusti●●●●tio ex fide sol●; Scripturae omnibu● volentibus perviae ac ●a●ile●— ●x Ind●ce Hieroa●●●●●lende sunt— Fides sola justi●icat. Imago 〈◊〉 tanti● veneranda. Opera non justi●i 〈◊〉 p. 106 Index libr. Expu●gat. per Q●●rog. Sal●u●i. 1601. & M 〈◊〉. 1584.  all the sentences above named, to be blotted out of the Fathers Indices, or Tables.  
In like sort hath another Index of Spain 
l Index 〈◊〉 j●ssu Be●nar●i ●e Sand●●al & R●xas M●●i●i, 1●●2. & per ●ur●etin ●en●u● 1019. , printed at Madrill, reprinted by Turretine, and still preserved and kept in the Archivis, or Treasury of Monuments in the public Library at Oxford, dealt with the Index, or Table of S. Austin and Athanasius, as by these few instances may appear.  
Blot out, say the Spanish Inquisitors, 
m Ex Indi●e Augustini delent, Non m●r●t● nostra● seu● 〈…〉 De●● coronet in nob●●; relents Sancti ●o●norandi imit●ti●●e, non ad●ratio●e; Ex Athanasij Ind●ce d●●ent, Ad●ra●i solius Dei est. Creatura nulla ad●ran●●. Creatural creatura no● adorer. Index Expurgatory quo su●ra.  these words out of Saint Augustine's Index, to wit, Wh●n God crowneth our merit's (that is good deeds) he crowneth nothing else but his own gifts: and, The Saints are to be honoured for imitation, not to be adored for Religion: as also out of Athanasius Index, that God only is to be worshipped, that the creature is not to adore the creature. Now all these must be razed out, notwithstanding they be the selfsame words, which these Fathers used in the Text 
n Ipsissima verba sun Augustini; C●m Deus coronat merita nostra, nihil aliud coronat quam munera sua. tom. 2. ep. 105. Et Honorandi sunt propter imitationem, non adorandi propter religionem. tom. 1. de vera relig cap. 55. & 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Athanas. orat. 3. contra A●rianos. .  
Now this is no good dealing, since these Tables and Indices truly gathered out of the Father's Works, might have served for a hand to point at the chiefest Sentences in each Author; but they have either removed, or turned the hand aside, to the great hindrance of those, which upon a sudden occasion are to see what such a Father saith to such a point, and have not the leisure to peruse over the whole book.  PA. 
We have not purged the Father's Text, but only the Index.  PRO. 
You have put out the very Text itself out of Saint Civil, whose words are; 
o Cy●il. Al●xandr. to. 5. comment. in Esaiam lib. 1. cap. 1. Fidei autem gratiam, etc.  Now this faith which is the gift and grace of God, is sufficient to purge, not only them which find themselves somewhat ill, but those also that are dangerously diseased: Now all this is commanded to be blotted out by the expurgatory Index of Spain 
p Ex Divi Cyrilli Commentarijs in Isaiam Laurentio Humphredo interpret; ●x T●xtu deleantur illa verba; Fidei autem gratiam, cum his qui valdè inquinati sunt, tùm etiam paulùm m●rbo ●ff●ctis, satis ad emundationem valituram esse fidem dicit. Index Expurg. per Quirog. Mad●id● 1584. .  
Neither can it be justly replied, that these words are put out of Cyril, as not being the Author's words, or not truly translated by our men; for they be Cyrils own words faithfully translated, and the copy agreeth with the Original; yea, this golden sentence thus razed, is still to be found in Cyrils Works, set fo●th by your own man Gentian Hervet.  
Neither yet hath God's Book escaped your finger's, witness the Bible set forth by your own men: 
q The B●ble of Robert Stephens, with the double Text, and Vatablus Annotations.  there we read in the Text [Levit. 26. chap.] according to your translation; Thou shalt not make to thyself an Idol, and graven thing: your Index saith, 
r Deleatur illud, Sculptilia prohibet si●ri. Ind. Expurg. per Quirog. Madrid. 1584.  Blot this out of the marg●nt, that graven things are forbidden.  
Again the Text saith [1. King. 7.3.] Prepare your hearts to the Lord, and serve him only; your Index saith, 
s Deleantur illa Verba. rv●endum soli Deo.  Blot out this gloss, that we must serve God only. Besides, Christ is noted to be the sacrifice for our sins; now these words, Christ is the sacrifice for our sins, must be dashed out 
t Psal. 39 lit B. ad ma●g deleantur illa verba; Christus hostia p●o peccatis nostris. . In like sort, they have blotted out these words in Vatablus Annotations 
u Ex Bibl. Vatabl. Annot. Esai● 8. nu 32. de●●nt; Qui credent in Deum, sal●● 〈◊〉; qu● verò non● peribunt. ●ud. Ex●●●●. M●drit. 1612. ; They that believe in God shall be saved, and they that believe not shall perish.  
Now if these sayings alleged, be to be found in the Fathers and Scriptures, not only in the same sense, but totidem verbis, in the same terms; why do they then blot them out of the Fathers Indices, or the Margins and Concordances of the Bible? they might as well raze them out of the very Text of Fathers and Scripture; but this they durst not openly attempt, and therefore under hand they wound both Scripture and Fathers through the sides of their Expugatorie and prohibitory Tables.  PA. 
Your men have published Parson's Resolutions, and Granades Meditations, and therein have changed and altered diverse sentences.  PRO. 
Some private men amongst us have dealt so with some late Writers; but withal they professed, that they had changed and altered their words; thereby to show, that with a little help, your books, such as do tend to godliness of life, might lawfully be r●ad of us; now what you did, you did it secretly, and under hand, whereas ours dealt plainly and openly. Besides, you have altered, and changed the writings of the Ancient at your pleasure; and then would make the World bel●eve, you have only corrected the faults of the Print, or some such matter.  
Now as you work by your Expurgatory Indices; so do you also by your other trick of prohibitory; whereof you make this use, that in case (upon the evidence given in by good Authors) the verdict be like to go on our side; than you bring a Prohibition and remove the matter to be tried by Tradition.  
But it is no wonder you prohibit our Writers; for you have forbid God's Book; and called it into the Inquisition; Forbidding the having, or reading of any part of the Bible in the vulgar Tongue 
x Quaeritur, 〈◊〉 ex●ediat sacra volumina in verna●ulas linguas converti● Resp●ndeo, min●m●, qui● 〈◊〉 variae heresies & 〈◊〉 caus● nas●●re●tur. Az●r●us Ins●i●. Mor●l. to. 1. lib. 8 cap 26. p●g. 715. , though it be set forth by Catholics; and, howsoever you wink at the matter where you cannot help it, yet in countries generally Popish, as in Spain, and elsewhere, The Bible and each part thereof in the vulgar tongue, is utterly prohibited, as your own jesuit witnesseth 
y In H●spania, in Indice librorum prohib.— Regula sexta sic habet. Prohibentur Biblia in vulgari li●gua, cum omnibus suis partibus. Azo●us quo sup●à pag. 714. .  
And this have diverse felt with us in Queen Mary's days, and of late john Murrey 
z Episcop. Eliensis in Respons. ad Apolog. Bellar. cap. 11. pag. 266.  a Merchant of Aberden in Scotland, who having a New Testament in the ship, was accused by the Searchers, brought before the Inquisition, and lost both his goods and life for it.  
To close up this point, you have laboured to root out all memory of our Professors: for example sake, Is King Edward the sixth styled (and that worthily) A Prince of admirable towardness? Is Frederick Duke of Saxony termed, Christianissimus Princeps, A most Christian Prince; this commendation of King Edward must be left out in the next impression, & so must the Duke's title of Christian Prince: and thus they deal with our Writers, Is Melanch●on termed A man famous for all kind of learning? and Bucer surnamed the Divine? doth Beatus Rhenanus in his notes upon Tertullian call Pelicane A man of admirable learning and holiness of life? All these Epithets and Titles the Romish Inquisitors have commanded to be blotted out 
a Pag. 148. Ex Michaelis Beutheri Fastis & Ephimerid. ubi agit de Phil. Melanchtone, deleantur illa verba, Vi● in omni literarum genere clarissimus. Mart. Bucerus Theologus, deleatur verbum Theologus, Frideric. Christianiss. Princeps, deleantur illae du● voces, Christianiss. Princeps. Edovardus sextus admirandae indolis adoles●ens; deleā●ur haec verba, Admirandae indolis adolescens. Ex Beati Rh●nani notis in T●rtulliani librum de Corona Militis, deleantur illa verba, Pelicanus homo mira sanctitatis ac eruditionis. Index Expurgat. per Quirogam Salmuri 1601. & Madriti 1584. . Yea, whereas Oecolampadius and Doctor Humphrey of Oxford have taken good pains in translating some parts of Cyrils Works, they a●e but slenderly rewarded; for Possevine 
b Oecolampadius & Laur. Humf●edus aliqua Cyrilli verterun, in quibus eorum nomen imprimis eradendum est. Possevini apparat. to. 1. verbo Cyrillus.  saith, that by all means their names must be razed out of those Translations. And another jesuit tells us 
c Ex●ungenda sunt nomina, nisi in libris Catholicorum hae●etici nominentur per ignominiam et contemp●um. Azor. mor. Instit. li. 8. cap. 26. pag. 676. , that Our names must not be suffered to stand upon Record: nor Protestant Writers once so much as to be named either in their own Works or others, unless it be per contemptum, by way of scorn and reproach; and yet you bid us name our men.  PA. 
We have purged some books, but not corrupted the Scriptures.  PRO. 
Your Trent Council makes 
d venerutur●yn●d ●yn●d. ●nd. Sell. 4. Decr. 2.  Traditions of equal credit, and to be embraced with the like godly affection, as the Scriptures are to be reverenced. Is not this to mingl● water with wine, base mettle with good Bullion? and so indeed a corrupting of Scripture.  
Besides, you have (which is 
e Revelat. 22.18.19.  fearful) detracted from God's Word, tha● which was written with his own finger, to wit, the second Commandment, against the worship of Images; and because the words thereof are sharp, and rip up the heartstrings of your Idolatry, you have therefore omitted them in your Catechisms, 
f Vaux Catechism pag. 31 What is the ●econd C●●m●ndement of God? 〈…〉 t●ke the Name o● GOD in vain— & pag. 51.52. ●e subd●vides ●he tenth Commandment, and so it is in 〈◊〉 Catechism  Prayer books, and in your Office of the blessed Virgin, set forth by command of 
g Ossi ●u● B. M●●ae P●. v. P●nt. ●●ssu ●dit. A●twerp. M. D. etc.  Pius Quintus; and to salve up the matter, lest thereby we should have no more than nine Commandments, you have cut the tenth into two. You might well have left the words ●here, that God's people might know there was such a Commandment, howsoever they had counted it, the first, or the second.  
Now, as you have detracted, so you have added to the rule of Faith, by thrusting into the Canon, the Apocryphal books, which Hierome (the best languaged of all the Father,) 
h Hi●ronym tom. 3. in Prologo Gal●ato in Prae●at. in lib. Reg.  rejected.  
Lastly, you do not only allow, but impose on others a corrupt translation of Scripture, to wit, the vulgar Latin Edition, whereas we refer ourselves to the Originals. Now surely, we may better trust an original Record, than a Copy extracted thence; and it is more wholesome to drink at the wellhead, than at a corrupt and muddy stream. Now the Latin Edition (which you follow, and prefer before all others) it is but a Translation itself; but the Hebrew and Greek which we follow, are the Well-springs and Originals. Is not this now a manifest corrupting of Scripture, to bind all men, (as your Trent Council doth 
i Nemo illam reij cere quovis praetextu audeat. Synod. Trid. Sess. 4. ) that none dare presume to reject this Translation; which by your own men is confessed 
k Quanquam eam quae passim legitur D. Hieronymi Germanam editionem haudquaquàm esse arbitramur. saints Pagnin. praef. suae interpret. Biblior. ad Clem. 7. Pont.  not to be Saint Hier●mes, and already shown to be a corrupt one by the learned of our side 
l B. morton's Prot. Appeal. lib. 4. c 18. sect. 3.   PA. 
I look to have your Professors named.  PRO. 
Restore us entire our Evidence which you have marred, and made away; return us our Witnesses which you have chained up in your Vatican Library, and elsewhere, and we accept your challenge. But do you indeed look to have our professors named? and why so? the true Church of God may be visible, though the names of her visible professors from time to time can not be showed: there might be thousands of professors in former ages, and yet (happily) no particular authentic Record of their names now extant; or if extant, yet so as we cannot come by them. Nevertheless (to answer you at your own weapon) I hope to make it clear, that God hath dealt so graciously with his Church, as that he hath continually preserved sufficient testimonies of his truth, that are ready to be deposed on our side, and that successively from age to age: so that I may say, as Saint Ambrose did in the like case; 
m Et literas quidem potuistis abolere, sed fidem non potuistis au●erre. Ambros. ●om. 2. de Spirit● Sancto. lib. 3. cap. 11.  You may well blot out our Letters, but our Faith you shall never abolish. Papists may conceal our evidence, and wipe out the names of our Professors out of the Records; but when all is done, the Protestants faith is perpetual.  
Now, in that we yield thus far to their importunity, we do not this, as if it were simply necessary for the Demonstration of our Church, to produce such a Catalogue of visible Professors in all Ages; but only out of the confidence of the truth of our cause, and partly to stop the mouth of our clamorous adversary's; For it is Tertullia's Rule, 
n Tamen in ea●em side ●onspirantes none mi●us 〈◊〉 d●pu●antur pro ●●orsangui●●●ate 〈◊〉 ●e●●ullian. de 〈◊〉 ●dve●s 〈…〉 tom. 2.  that A Church is to be accounted Apostolic, if it hold Consanguinity of Doctrine with the Apostles. Now, what though we could no● successively name such as taught as we do; yet because God hath promised there should be always in the world a true Church, (having either a larger or smaller number of Prosessors, (it sufficeth that we are able out of Scripture to demonstrate that we maintain the same Faith and Religion, which the holy Apostles taught, and Christ would have to be perpetual; this I say sufficeth to manifest our Succession, although all Histories were silent of the names of our Professors.  
Now, that I am to speak of the Church in her several and successive Centuries and Ages, to give the Reader some Character and touch thereof, I will begin with the fi●st 600. years' next after Christ; wherein ten several times during the fi●st three Centuries, the Church was persecuted by Tyrants, and almost continually assaulted by Heretics; yet in the end, Truth prevailed against Error, and Patience overcame her Persecutors. This is the time wherein our learned Bishop jewel, challenged the Papists, to show any Orthodox Father, Council, or Doctor, that for the space of those 600 Years, taught as the present Church of Rome did: the like challenge was lately renewed by my dear friend, that worthy Divine, Doctor Featly of Oxford, challenging 
o  the jesuits to produce out of good Authors, any City, Parish, or Hamlet, within 500 years' next after Christ, wherein there was any visible assembly, that maintained in general, the Articles of the Trent Council, or such and such points of Popery, as at the Conference he named in particular. Now of this period, the first 300. years thereof, 
 were the very flower of the Primitive Church, because that in the●e days the truth of the Gospel was infallibly taught, by Christ and his Apostles, and that in their own persons; as also by othe●s that lived to hear, see, and converse with those blessed Apostles, and disciples of Christ jesus; and this (haply) made Egesippus, an ancient Author, call the Church of those days, 
p 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Hegesippus apud Euseb lib. 3. Hist. cap. 32. & lib. 4. cap. 22. edit. Graec.  an uncorrupt and virgin Church: and yet was this virgin Church ill entreated by such a sowed the tares of error, which yet the careful husbandman in time weeded up: neither indeed for the space of these first 300, could those Tenets of Popery get any footing, their Papal Indulgences were yet unhatched, their purgatory fire was yet unkindled; it made not (as afterwards) their pot boil, and their kitchen smoke; the Mass was yet unmoulded, Transubstantiation was yet unbaked, the treasury of Merits was yet unminted, the Pope's transcendent power was uncreated, Ecclesiastickes were unexempted, and deposing of Kings yet undreamed of: the Lay-people were not yet cozened of the cup, Communion under one kind, was not yet in kind, it was not then known, that Liturgies and prayers were usually and publicly made in a tongue unknown: they did not then worship and adore any wooden or breaden god; they worshipped that which they knew, and that in Spirit and truth 
q john 4.22.24. , and they called on him, in whom they believed 
r Rom. 10.14 : so did they, and so do we. In a word, in the former ages of the Church, Satan was bound, after the thousandth year he was loosed, and after the middle of the second Millenary, about the year 1370, he was bound anew. Concerning the Church's estate in the next five hundred years, 
The Estate of the Church in the 7, 8, 9, 10, and 11 Age.  it grew very corrupt: so that of these times we may say, as Winefridus, borne at Kirton in Devonshire, after surnamed Boniface, was wont to say, 
s Beat Rhenanus lib. 2 rerum Germanic. pag. 98. Bonifacius rogatus an licéret ligneis cal●●ibus sacrificare; respondit, oli● aureos sacerdotes ligneis vas●ulis litasse nunc vers● vice ligneos aureis ●ti.  In old time there were golden Prelates, and wooden Chalices, but in his time wooden Prelates, and golden Chalices; knowledge was now decayed, Princes, Prelates and others were now more busied in building, or beautifying material Temples and Chapels, than in the gathering together of living stones, and re-edifying Gods spiritual Temple: so that in this time of Monkery, many religious Houses were erected, either out of voluntary Devotion, or enjoined Penance: Now, instead of the right administration of the Word and Sacraments, came in the dumb guise of the Mass; and the people instead of the pure milk of the Word, were entertained with feigned Liturgies, Legends, and Miracles, & their consciences loaden with a number of unprofitable Ceremonies, and unwarrantable Traditions; now there was great con●idence put in holy Grains, hallowed Beads, Agnus Dei's, and the like Babies; and the honour due to the Creator, was given to the creature. Now the people made many fond vows, went many merry Pilgrimages, and beheld many garish Processions; now they were taught that abstinence from meats and drinks was Meritorious; that the opus operatum, the work done was sufficient in their Sacraments, and their Devotions, and much of this service performed in an unknown tongue. Now the crowns of Martyrdom wherewith the first Bishops of Rome were honoured, were changed into a Triple Crown, and the Pastoral Staff, began to quarrel with the Princely Sceptre; and all these things were carried by the name of the Church, the People many of them believing as the Church believed, and this Church was the Roman, and this Roman Church, was the Pope.  

The Church's state in the 12.13.14.15. and 16. ●entu●●●s.  Concerning the Church in the next 500 years, even to these our times; the Church began to recover her strength● and the light of the Gospel was notably discovered by Waldus in France, and his followers, Wickliff in England, john Hus, and Martin Luther in Germany. Now also by the benefit of Printing (which was found out in the fifteenth Century,) the Tongues came to be known, Knowledge increased, Books were dispersed, and Learning communicated; the Scriptures were perused, the Doctors and Fathers read, Stories opened, Times compared, Truth discerned, and Falshood detected.  
Now because there hath already, and will hereafter be occasion to speak of Antichrist; I will therefore here point out his several Ages. About the year 607. Antichrist began in part to appear and show himself, rising by degrees until he came to the height of impiety; for as other things, so Antichrist also, was to have his rising, growth, height, and fall; even as monstrous and huge Beasts go with their young ones many years, as other creatures do many months. The main strength of the Romish Antichrist consisted in those two Swords, the Spiritual and Temporal; now the Pope did not at once attain to the managing of these two Swords; but by degrees he came to usurp this two-handed Sword.  
The first step that he made to the throne of pride, was about the year, 607, when Pope Boniface the third, by the grant of that murderer Phocas, took to himself the Title, Authority, and Supremacy over the whole Church.  
The next time, that he notoriously showed himself, was after the thousand year, when Gregory the ●eventh claimed and usurped both the Swords; that is, a Sovereign and Universal jurisdiction, not only Ecclesiastical over the Clergy, but also Temporal over Kings and Emperors: unto this second Sovereignty they had long aspired, but never attained until the time of this Hildebrand, in whom Antichrist came to his growth: yea, the Pope was discovered to be Antichrist by those Catholic Bishops, the Bishop of Florence 
x Florentinus Episcopus a●firmare solitus [est] Antichristum natum esse. Platina in Paschal. 2. , and Robert Grosthead Bishop of Lincoln 
y Ergò si qui● animas perdere non ●ormidat, nonnè Antichristus meritò est dicendus? Math. Paris. in Henr. 3. ad an. 1253. , and others. Upon this discovery of the Man of Sin, sundry of God's people refusing the Mark of the Beast, severed themselves from the Papal Communion; whereupon the Pope and his Faction raised grievous persecutions against the servants of God.  
To speak yet more particularly; the degrees of Antichrist may thus be reckoned. He had his Birth or rising in Boniface the third, 
Anno 607.  who took to himself that Antichristian title, of universal Bishop, which his Predecessor Gregory so greatly condemned. He had his growth, 
Ann. 788.  or increase in the time of Pope Adrian the first, and the second Council of Nice, who jointly agreed to set up the Adoration of Images, and the practice thereof to be generally received in the Church.  

Ann. 1●75.  He came to his Kingdom, and reigned in Pope Hildebrand, who excommunicated and deposed Henry the fourth, the lawful Emperor, and gave away his Empire to Rodulph, and after his death to others.  

Ann. 1517.  He was in his jollity, and triumphed in Pope Leo the tenth, and his Lateran Council; s●ewing himself a God in pardoning sins, delivering souls out of Purgatory, defining Faith; setting himself above a general Council, controlling, and judging all men, himself to be judged by none; professing (for so it is recorded of Gregory the seventh 
a 〈◊〉 Deus 〈◊〉 se errare n●● p●sse gloreatur. Ave●t n. Annal. Bo●o●●● l●● 5. p●g● 5●3. ) That he was a God, and could not err.  
In a word, (as my learned kinsman hath deciphered him) 
b 〈◊〉 of the sit● 〈…〉 Co●n●ell. 〈◊〉 ●3. 〈…〉.  when he usurped an universal authority over all Bishops, the Pope was but Antichrist Nascent; when he maintained the doctrine of Adoration of Images, he was Antichrist Crescent; when he exalted himself above all Kings and Emperors, he became Antichrist regnant; but when he was made Lord of the Catholic Faith, so that none must believe more, nor less, nor otherwise then he prescribed, he became Antichrist Triumphant. Thus did the Pope in process of time become a perfect Antichrist, playing the Hypocrite and Tyrant, both in Church and State; exalting himself a● a Monarch over God's house; making his own word, and definition, of equal authority with holy 
c 
〈◊〉 Pontisi●is Summ●● 〈◊〉 & 〈…〉 lib. 2. c●p. 2.  
〈…〉 B●ll●r. lib. p●imo pag. 1●. c●p. 〈…〉.  
●t pl●●è appareat ex 〈◊〉 p●pe●disse Rom●ni fo●tif●●is Fidei Decre●● san●●●e & sancita mu●●re. Baron. ad ●nn. 373. ●um. 21.   Scripture; usurping temporal jurisdiction over Civil States, murdering Christ's servants that yielded not to his beck. His last Age, is his declining age, wherein the Lord by the spirit of his mouth [2 Thess. 2.8.] that is, by the Ministry of his Word, Shall consume this Man of Sin; and this is come to pass in part; For he is already fallen into a Consumption, whereon he irrecoverably languisheth, notwithstanding all the help that can be made him, by his College of Physicians, Canonists, Schoolmen, Priests and jesuits; but for his final Destruction we must expect it at the glorious coming of our blessed Saviour.  
The sum of all is this, the Pope having pearkt himself above his fellow Bishops, it grieved him to be subject to Kings and Emperors; not to exalt himself above them, he distracted both Church and State in the point of Image-worship, which occasioned much bloodshed in Christendom, and then having weakened the Empire, he became superior to Kings and Emperors: there being nothing now but the Church in his way, he prevailed over it by his Lateran Flatterers, who set the Pope above a general Council, that is, above God's Church; a General Council being indeed the Representative Church of God here on earth, and the Pope himself being the Virtual Church, for so Gretser confesseth, 
d Per Ecclesiam intelligimus pontificem Remanum. Grets'. Def. cap. 10. li. 3 de verbo Dei § jam. p. 1450. & ibid. A●. pag. 1451. non abnuo.  that by the Church they do mean the Pope for the time being. Now to this height the Pope came under pretence of the Church's government, the Church's discipline racking the spiritual censure to a civil punishment; by the Church solemnities in crowning Emperors; by his Excommunications, Absolutions, and Dispensations, he rose to his greatness of state; by the doctrine of works meritorious, jubilees, Pardons, and Indulgences, he maintained his State.  
And now I come to show out of good Authors, that in nine several weighty points of Religion, the best guides of God's Church for the space of 1500 years, have taught as the Church of England doth.   

THE FIRST CENTURIE, From the first year of Grace, unto the year One Hundred.  
Christ jesus and his Apostles the Protestants Founders.  

PAPIST.  
WHom do you name in this first Age, that taught the Protestant Faith?   

PROTESTANT.  
I name our blessed Saviour Christ jesus, and his Apostles, Saint Paul, and his Scholars, Titus and Timothy, together with the Churches which they planted, as that of the Romans, Corinthians, and the rest. These I name for our first Founders, and top of our kin, as also joseph of Arimathea, that buried Christ's body, a special Benefactor to the Religion planted in this land. These taught for substance, and in the positive grounds of religion, as we do in our Articles, Liturgies, Homilies and Apologies, by public authority established in our Church of England. Besides these, there were but few Writers in this age, whose undoubted Works have come to our hands; yet for instance sake I name that blessed Martyr of Christ, Ignatius Bishop of Antioch, who for the name of jesus, was sentenced to be devoured of wild beasts, which he patiently endured, saying, 
a Euseb Histor ●●cles. lib 3. cap. 33.  I am the Wheat or grain to be ground with the teeth of beasts, that I may be pure Bread for my Master's tooth: let fire, racks, pulleys, yea, and all the torments of Hell come on me, so I may win Christ. Here also, according to the Roman Register, I might place Dionysius Areopagita, whom they usually place in this first Age, as if he were that Denys mentioned in the 
b Acts 17.34.  Acts, whereas indeed he is a post natus, and in all likelihood lived about the fourth Age, and not in this first; for Denys 
c 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Dionys. epist. ad Demophil.  saith, That the Christians had solemn Temples like the jews, and the Chancel severed, with such and such sanctification, from the rest of the Church; whereas the Christians in this fi●st age, made their assemblies to prayer, both in such private places, and with such simplicity, as the Apostles 
d Acts 1.13. & 12.12. & 20 8.  did, and as the times of persecution suffered 
* Andr. Rivet. Critici Sacri. lib. 1. cap 9 rat. 6.  them.  
Again, Denys tells us, that when he wrote, Monks were risen, 
e Dionys. Eccles. Hierarch. cap. 6.  and they of credit in the Churches, and many Ceremonies to hollow them; whereas in the Apostles time, when the true Dionysius lived, Monks were not heard of; yea, chrysostom saith, 
f 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. C●●ys. Homil 25 in Moral. super cap. 11. ep ad Hebr.  That when Paul wrote his Epistle to the Hebrews, there was not then so much as any footstep of a Monk.   

PA.  
I challenge Saint Denys for ours; he was (as our Rhemists 
g Rhemists' Annot. on Acts 17.  say) all for the Catholics.   

PRO.  
Take him as he is, and as he comes to our hands, he is not wholly yours, but in some things clean contrary to you; as namely in the Sacrament of the Lords Supper, wherein you vary from us most. Besides, he hath not your sole receiving of the Priest, nor ministering under one kind to them who receive, nor Exhortations, Lessons, Prayers, in a tongue which the people understand not, he hath not your Invocation of Saints, no● adoration of creatures, nor sacrificing of Christ to God, nor praying for the souls in purgatory: so that in things of substance, and not of ceremony only, he is ours, and not yours, as I hope will appear by his Writings: for we will (for the time) suppose him to be a Father of this first age, although the books which bear Saint Denys his name, seem to be written in the fourth or fifth age after Christ.   

PAP.  
Can you prove that Christ and his Apostles taught as you do?   

PRO.  
We have clear testimonies of Scripture, 
h Math. 26.27. & 1 Cor. 11.23, etc.  which appoint God's people to receive the blessed Cup in the Sacrament, and to be present at such a divine service as themselves understand 
i 1 Cor. 14.15, etc. ; we have express command forbidding Image-worship 
k Exod. 20.4. Deut. 4.15. ; against Invocation of Saints it is said 
l Esay 63.16. , that Abraham knoweth us not, and Isaac is ignorant of us; and the blessed Angel refused all religious honour and Adoration 
m Apoc. 19.10. & 22.8, 9 . Likewise against Merit of works, and works of Super-erogation, it is said 
n Rom. 8.18. , that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us; and that we are unprofitable servants, when we have done all that was commanded us, we have but done that which was our duty to do, and the like.   

PA.  
You allege Scripture, and so do we; yea in some things the Scripture is plain for us, as where it is said, 
o Math. 26.26.  This is my Body.   

PRO.  
What though it make for you in show? so doth it for the Anabaptists, where it is said, 
p Acts 4.32.  that the Christians had all things common: you will not hence infer, that because in such an extremity, their charity (for the relief of others) made things common concerning the use, that therefore we should have no property in the goods that God hath given us? It is not the show and semblance of words, but the sense thereof that imports the truth. Saint Paul says of his Corinth's, 
q 1. Cor. 12.27.  Ye are the body of Christ, yet not meaning any Transubstantiation of substance: but hereof anon in his due place.   

PA.  
The Scriptures make not for you, but as you have translated them.   

PRO.  
For any point we hold, we refer ourselves to the Originals; yea, we say further, let the indifferent Christian Reader, (who hath but tolerable understanding of the Latin Tongue,) compare our English translations, with those which your own men, Pagnine, Arias Montanus, and others have published, and they will find but little countenance for Popery; and namely, for Communion in one kind, and Service in a strange Tongue, which (as is already proved) hath been decreed directly contrary to God's express word, but let us come to the particulars.  

Of the Scriptures sufficiency, and Canon.  
The Church of England holds, 
r Articles of Religion. 6. Ar●i●.  that Holy Scripture containeth all things necessary to salvation: so that the●e is no doctrine 
s Homily 1. the first part of the exhortation to holy Scripture.  necessary for our everlasting salvation, but that is (or may be) drawn out of that Fountain of truth, as being either expressly therein contained, or such as by sound inference may be deduced from thence: and this is witnessed by Saint Paul, saying, that 
t 2 Tim. 3.15, 16, 17.  they are able to make us wise unto salvation, that the man of God may be perfited, and throughly furnished unto all good works; which they should not be able to do, if they contained not a perfect doctrine of all such points of faith, as we are bound to believe, and duties to be practised. And if it be said, that S. Paul speaks of the man of God, such an one as Timothy was, it holds in others also: for if the Scripture be so profitable for such and such u●e●, that thereby it perfects a Divine, much more an ordinary Christian; that which can perfect the teacher, is sufficient for the learner.    

PA.  
Do you disclaim all Traditions?   

PRO.  
We acknowledge Traditions concerning Discipline, and the Rites and Ceremonies of the Church; but not concerning the doctrine, or matter of faith & Religion.  
You equalise unwritten traditions to holy Scripture, receiving them, saith your Trent Council, 
u Nec●on traditiones ipsa● tum ad fidem, tum ad mores pertinentes— Part pietatis affectu as reverentià suscipit, & veneratur. Concil. Trid. S●ss. 4 Decret. 1.  with equal reverence, and religious affection, as you receive the holy Scriptures themselves: we da●e not do so, but such traditions as we receive, we hold and esteem far inferior.  
Concerning the Scriptu●e Canon, the Trent Council accurseth 
x Si quis librum Hester, Daniel●s, Baruch, Ecclesiastict, Sapientiae● judith, Tobiae, duorum Mac●abaeorum libros pro Canonicis non susceperit, Anathem● sit. Concil. Trid. Sess. 4.  such as receive not the Books of Maccabees, Ecclesiasticus, ●oby, judith, Baruch, Wisdom, for Canonical Scriptu●e. Now we retain 
y The sixth Article of the names and number of Canonical Books.  the same Canon which Christ and his Apostles held and received from the jews, unto whom were committed the Oracles of 
z Rome 3.2.  God, being, as Saint Augustine speaks, 
a Codicem portat judaeus undè credat Christianus; Librarij nostri facti sunt, quomodo solent servi post Dominos codices far. August. in Psal 56. to. 8.  The Christians Library-keepers. Now the jews never received these Books which we term Apocryphal into their 
b Iosephu● contra ●●pionem. lib. 1.  Canon: yea, Christ himself divided the 
c Luke 24.44.  Canon into three several ranks, into the Law, the Prophets, and the Psalms; now the Apocryphal come not within this reckoning. Indeed (as S. Hierome saith) The Church reads these Books for example of life, and instruction of manners; but yet it doth not apply them to establish any Doctrine.  

Of Comunion under both kinds, and the number of Sacraments.  
If any shall say, The Church was not induced for just causes to communicate the ●ay people under one kind, v●z of bread only, and shall say they erred in so doing, let him be accursed, 
d Si quis dixerit Ecclesi●m non ●ustis causis adductam ut Latios sub panis ta●tummodo spe●●e communicaret, aut in eo errasse, Anathema sit. Conc. Tried C●n. 2. Sess. ●1.  saith the Trent Council. Now our Church holds, 
e Articles of England, 30. Art. Articles of Ireland 97.  That both the parts of the Lords Sacrament, aught to b●e ministered to all God's people: so tha● according to us; In the public celebration of ●he E●cha●ist, Communion in bo●h kinds, ou●ht to be given to all sorts of Christians, rightly disposed and prepared: and this o●● Tenet is agreeable to Christ's Institution 
f M●th. 26●27.  and Precept, 
g 〈…〉 in joan. 〈◊〉  who saith expressly and li●erally, Drink ye all of this. It agrees also with Saint Paul's 
h 1 Cor● 11●28. 〈…〉 pr●cipit ut h●bitur. Cyprian. de Coena Dom.  precept, and with the practice of the holy Apostles, 
i 1 Cor. 10.21. & cap. 11.23.26.  and the privative Church.  
Dionysius Arcopagita, who (as you say) was Saint Paul's Scholar, and Disciple, relates 
k 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, etc. Di●ny●. A●cop●g. Ec●les. H●erarch. c. 5.— 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. Ibid. ●ap. 3.  the practice of the Church in his time, on this manner; After the Priest hath prayed that he may ho●●ly distribute, and that all they that are to partake of the Sacrament may receive it worthily; he breaks the Bread into many pieces, and divides one Cup among all. Ignatius, who was Scholar to Saint john the Evangelist, saith; 
l 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. ●gnat. ●p. ad Philadel●h.  That one Bread is broken unto all, and one Cup distributed unto all.    

PA.  
Bellarmine saith, 
m In ●atinis ●ed●cibus. non habetur. ●●us Ca●●x o●●ibus d●stri●utus; sed un●s Calix ●●tius Ecclesiae: est enim communi●●alix qui pro om●ibus ●sse tur Deo Neque multum ●idendum est Grae●●s Codicibus. Bella●m. lib. 4. de Euchar. cap. 26.  the words of Ignatius are not as you allege them; There is one Cup distributed unto all; but, there is one Cup of the whole Church, and though the Greek Copies read as you do, yet he saith, That much credit is not to be given to them.   

PROT.  
Shall we give more credit to a Translation, then to the Original? If the Wellhead and Spring be corrupted, how shall the Brook, or Stream run clear? It may be indeed that diverse errors are crept both into the Greek & Latin Copies, but for the place alleag●d, there is no colour of corruption, in as much as the same that Ignatius spoke of the Bread, the same are repeated of the Cup according to Christ's Institution; and howsoever Bellarmine may produce some Latin Copy, that translateth the words of Ignatius, as Bellarmine sets them down, Vnus Calix totius Ecclesiae; yet (as D. Featly observes in the Grand Sacrilege of the Romish Church) Vitlemius, and diverse other Latin Copies following the original verbatim, render them thus, Vnus Calix omnibus distributus, that is, One Cup distributed unto all, and not as Bellarmine, and 
* Et unus Calix qui pro omnibus nobis distributus est. Bar. Annal. tom. 1. ad ann. Christ. 109. Ita legit locum Ignatij Ep. ad Philadelph.  Baronius ad Ann. 109 sect. 25. would have it; as if Ignatius had said, that one Cup was distributed not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, omnibus, but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, pro omnibus, not to all, but for all, that is, for the behoof and benefit of all. Howsoever they wrest it, Ignatius tells us of one Cup, and this not the Priest's Cup, but the Church's Cup, and this Cup was distributed. But now adays in the Mass, there is no distribution of the Cup.   

PA.  
Christ spoke these words, Drink ye all of this, only to the Apostles, 
n Mandatum solis Apostolis datum ●uit. Bellarmin. de Euchar. lib. 4. cap. 25. § ●estat.  as they were Priests, and not to the Laity.   

PRO.  
By this means, you might take away the Bread, as well as the Cup from the Lay-people; for when Christ administered the Sacrament, none were present (for aught we know) but only the Apostles.  
Besides, the Apostles were not yet fully ordained Priests, though they had been once sent to Preach; Christ after his Resurrection breathed on them the holy Ghost, and fully endued them with Priestly power. john 20.22.  
Again, the Apostles at this Supper were Communicants, not Ministers of the Sacrament; Christ was then the only Minister in that Action. Now Christ delivered them the Cup as well as the Bread, saying to the same persons, at the same time, and in the same respect, Drink ye all of this, to whom he had said before, Take, and Eat, giving both alike in charge; so that you must either bar the people from both, or admit them to both: now if neither precept of eating or drinking belong to the Laity, the Laity are not at all bound to receive the Sacrament.   

PA.  
Although it be said of Drinking the Cup [Do this in remembrance of me;] Yet the Words [Do this] are spoken Absolutely 
o Post p●nis conse●●●tionem ab●●lutè pon●tu [h●c ●ac●t●] p●st salicin verò idem ●●p●titur, sed ●um ●●nditione, Quo 〈…〉 b●beritis, Id. ibid. §. 〈◊〉.  of the Bread, and but Conditionally of the Cup, namely [as often as ye shall drink it: 1 Cor. 11.25.] So that these Words, Do this in remembrance of me, infer not any Commandment of receiving in both kinds.   

PRO.  
According to your Tenet, our Saviour saith not, Do this as often as you Lay men communicate; but whensoever you receive the Cup and drink, then do it in remembrance of me; as much as to say, as often as you Lay people drink, which needeth never be done by you (according to Romish Divinity) Do this nothing in remembrance of me: Besides, as there is a Quotiescunque, as often, set before the Cup, As oft as you drink; so there is a Quotiescunque set before the Bread, As often as you shall eat this Bread, (vers. 26.) so that quoti●scunque biberitis, as often as you Drink, cannot make the Precept Conditional in respect of the Cup, more than of the Bread; it being alike referred to the Bread and to the Cup.   

PA.  
We wrong not the Laity, ministering unto them under one kind only; they receiving the same benefit by one, that they should do by both, Christ's body and blood being whole in 
p Concil. Tried. Sess. 13. cap 3.  each; so that the people receive the blood together with the Host, by a Concomitancy.   

PRO.  
In vain have you devised Concomitance, to disguise your sacrilege of the Cup taken from the people; as if our Saviour Christ were not sparing enough in ordaining as few outward Ceremonies as might well be; but that he must do that by two, which might have been compassed by one; or as if he would have the Ministers receive his body and blood superfluously; that is to say, both in the Bread, and in the Cup too, which was sufficiently received in either of them. Again, though the devout Communicant, receiving Christ spiritually by Faith, is thereby possessed of whole Christ crucified, in the inward act of the soul; yet we deny, that the whole is received Sacramentally in this outwad act, under one only part of this Sacrament: so that if Concomitance were granted, yet Communion in one kind is not justifiable; for although it deprive not people of Christ's blood, as it is a bodily part contained in the veins; yet it depriveth them of the blood of Christ, as it was shed, poured out, and offered in sacrifice for them; neither can su●h manner of receiving show forth the Lords death, which is one chief end of the celebration of this Sacrament, 1 Cor. 11.28. The breaking of Bread repesenteth in no wise the effusion of blood; this is lively represented by the pouring out of the consecrated Wine, and drinking of the Cup, there being a perfecter signification in both kinds then in one.  
Lastly, though the people might receive the blood together wi●h the host, ●et he that so receives the blood, cannot properly be said to drink: now Christ saith expressly, Unless you drink his blood, you shall not have life in you, john 6.53. which place your Papists themselves understand of the Eucharist.  
Concerning the number of Sacraments, the Trent-Councell accurseth 
q Si quis dixerit, aut plu●a esse Sacramenta, ●ut pauciora quam septem, Anathema sit. Concil. Trid. Sess. 7.  all such as shall say, that the number of Sacraments is either more or less than seven: but our Church holds, 
r Art. 25.  that of the Sacraments of the New Testament, there be two ordained of Christ our Lord in the Gospel, that is to say, Baptism, and the Lords Supper; and those five, which by the Church of Rome are called Sacraments, to wit, Confirmation, Penance, Orders, Matrimony, and Extreme Unction, are not to be accounted Sacraments of the Gospel 
s Art. of Ireland. Art. 87. .  
Now that there are and aught to be two Sacraments only in the New Testament, appeareth hereby, in that there is no promise made unto us of life everlasting in jesus Christ, which is not sufficiently witnessed, and assured unto us by these two 
t 1 Cor. 10.1, 2, 3. & cap. 12. verse 13.  Sacraments. For the sum of all the promises of God in Christ, is reduced unto these two heads: that for his sake we are received into the favour, and household care of God; and that being once received, we shall be continued in the sa●e for ever: the former whereof is sealed unto us by Baptism for our entrance and admission into the Covenant; and the later by the Lord's Supper, for our continuance, growth, and confirmation therein. These two were instituted by Christ; Hoc facite, Do this in remembrance of me 
u Math. 28.19. & Luke 22.19. , is our warrant for the one; and go teach and baptise, for the other ˣ; there is deep silence in the rest.  

Of the Eucharist.  
The Trent Council holds, 
y Synodas' declarat, per consecrationem pa●is & vt●i, conversion●m sieri t●tius substantiae p●n●s in substantiam corporis Christi, & to●i●s ●ub●tan●iae v●ni in substantiam ●anguinis ejus. Concil. ●●id. Sess. 13. cap. 4.  that there is a conversion of the whole substance of bread and wine into the substance of Christ's body and blood, wrought by the words of consecration; and that there only remain the semblances and shows, the outward shape●, 
z Romanentibus duntaxat spectobus 〈◊〉 & vini. Id. Ibid. Can. 2.  forms, or accidents of bread and wine: yea, the Council accurseth 
Id. ibid. Can. 2.  such as affirm bread & wine to remain in this Sacrament after consecration. And yet S. Paul tells us, 
b 1. Cor. 11.26.  that after consecration it is bread, which is broken and eaten; & it is no less than fivetimes so called after the pretended change. Neither is it called Bread, because it was bread, but because it is bread, not in name only, but in nature and properties: for after consecration, the bread and wine they nourish the body, and comfort the heart as before but the bare forms of bread and wine, as the roundness of the Host, or colour of the Wine, (such as they say only remain, the substance thereof being abolished) cannot nourish without corporal substance. Now our Church holds, 
c A●ti● of England● 28 Of Ireland●3 ●3.  that the change of the substance of the bread and wine, into the substance of the body and blood of Christ, commonly called Transubstantiation, cannot be proved by holy Writ, but is repugnant to plain testimonies of holy Scripture.    

PA.  
How doth it appear that Christ's body and blood are not corporally given and taken in the Sacrament?   

PRO.  
By these reasons: First, we receive the body and blood of Ch●ist in the Sacrament, as the Disciples of Christ did in the first Institution of it. Now the body and blood of Chri●t were not corporally received by them, but only spiritually.  
Secondly, Christ his body is ascended and taken up into heaven, and the heavens must contain him, 
d Acts 3.11.  till the end of the world.  
Thirdly, 
e Math. 28.6, 7. Luke 24.39. john 20 27.  Christ hath but one body, and that a true body, and such as cannot be in many places at once and it filleth a place wheresoever it is, and may be both seen and felt. This was also the judgement of other●, whom you much reverence. Dionysius Areopagita held not Transubstantiation● For he distinguisheth between the substantial Sign●s, and Christ signified by them, saying; 
f 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Di●nys. Areopag. Eccles. Hierarch. cap. 3.  that By those reverend Signs and Symbols, Christ is signified, and the faithful made partakers of him. He calleth not t●e ministration of the holy mysteries the sacrificing of Christ unto his Father (as the Papists do;) but a Typical or 
g 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. ibid. c●p 3.  Symbolical Sacrifice, that is a figure or sign of that great sacrifice: and the same Denys (as 
h Imm● & Dionysius cap 3. Eccles. Hier●rchiae Eucharist●●m vocat Antitypon. Bellarm. lib. 2 de Eucharist. c. p. 15 §. Sed hoc.  Bellarmine confesseth) calleth the Sacrament an Antitype, and that after consecration; so that according to Saint Denys, the Elements of Bread and Wine in this Sacrament, are Types, Antitype, and Symbols, that is, Figures and Signs of the body and blood of Ch●ist; and yet not only bare, naked, and Signs significative, but re●lly exhibiting Christ, for that is Denys his word, to wit, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, that the faithful thereby partake Christ jesus.   

PA.  
The Scripture is plain for us, where Christ saith, This is my Body. Math. 26.26.   

PRO.  
Although Christ say, This is my Body, yet he saith not (as you do) this is made, or shall be changed into my Body; he saith not, that his body and blood is contained under the shapes or forms of B●ead and Wine.  
Again, you that stand so for the Letter, take not Christ's Words literally; for it is an improper speech to say, This is my Body, that is, the thing contained under these forms, is by conversion, and substantial transmutation, my Body; but your Papists maintaining Transubstantiation, expound Christ's words in this, or the like manner; therefore in the point of Transubstantiation, you depart from the Letter, and consequently make it figurative. You indeed allege the Words and Letter, but not the true meaning; we believe Christ's words in their right sense; now the show makes for you, the sense and substance for us. Now though Christ's Body is not according to his material substance wholly and entirely, under the outward elements, yet the Bread may be truly termed Christ's Body, because of a Relative and Sacramental union, and donation of the thing signified, together with the Signs worthily received.   

PA.  
What reason have you to interpret these words figuratively; this is my body, that is, this bread is a sign of my body, and not plainly and literally as they sound.   

PRO.  
Figurative speeches are oftentimes plain speeches; now there be no other Figures or Tropes in the Lord's Supper, but such as are, and always were, usual in Sacraments, and familiarly known to the Church. Now Sacraments must be expounded Sacramentally, and accordingly the words alleged must not be taken literally, but figuratively. Christ taking bread, and breaking bread, said of the same, [This is my body] now this cannot be properly taken, therefore for the right expounding of these words, we are necessarily to have recourse to a figurative interpretation; and the reason hereof is that common Maxim, 
i Bishop Morton against the Mass. Book 2. chap. 1. sect. 4. and cham 3. sect. 6.  Disparatum de disparato non propriè praedicatur, that is, nothing can be properly and literally affirmed jointly of another thing, which is of a different nature. By this rule, bread and Christ's body cannot be properly affirmed one of another; bread being of a different nature from flesh, can no more possibly be called the fl●sh or body of Christ literally, than lead can be called wood: and this makes us interpret the words figuratively; and we have in Scripture most manifest places, which prove these wo●ds, [This is my body] to be figuratively taken and understood, because in Scripture whensoever the sign (as the Bread) being called Christ's body, hath the name & appellation of the thing signified, the speech is always tropical and figurative. And this agre●th with S. Austi●s Rule: 
k Si enim Sacrament● quandam similitudinem earum ●erum quarum S●cramenta sunt, non ha●erent, omninô Sacramenta non essent: ex hâc autem similitudine plerumque etiam ipsa●um rerum nomina accipiunt. Sicut ergo secundùm quendam modum Sacramentum corporis Christi corpus Christi est. Aug. tom. 2. epist. 23. add Bonifac.  Sacraments be signs, which often do take the names of those things, which they do signify and represent: therefore do they carry the names of the things themselves: thus is the sign of the Passeover, the Lamb, called the Passeover, Math. 26.17. Exod. 12.11, 27. the Rock, the sign of Christ in his passion, is called Christ, and the Rock was Christ, 1. Cor. 10 4. Circmmcision, the sign of the Covenant, called the Covenant, and Baptism the sign of Christ's burial, called Christ's burial: for so saith S. Augustine, 
l 
Vt Baptismus dicitur sepulchrum; sic, H●c est Corpus meum. August. cap. Faust. lib. 20 cap. 21.  
Non enim Dominus dubitavit dicere, ●oc est corpus meum, ●um signum daret corporis sui. August tom. 6. contra Adimant. cap. 12.  
— Figura est ergò praecipiens passioni domini esse communicandum. Id tom. 3 lib 3 de Doctr. Ch●ist cap. 16.   that as Baptism is called Christ's burial, so is the Sacrament of the Body of Christ call●d his Body. Now this show, or semblance of words concludes not, that Christ or the Lamb were really the Rock, the Passeover, but that these things are meant figuratively, it being usual in Scripture, specially in such Sacramentally speeches as this is we are now about, to give the name of the thing to that which it betokeneth; and so to call, Circumcision the Covenant, because it is a sign th●t betokeneth the Covenant, and so of the rest. Besides the other part of the Sacrament, to wit, This Cup is the New Testament in my blood, Luke 22.20. is figurative, and not to be literally taken: for you yourselves s●y, 
m Non ●●gamus in verb● 〈◊〉 ●●pum es●e. Bel 〈…〉 lib. 1 c●p. 11. § R●s●ondeo.  that Calix, or the Cup is there taken for that which is i● the cup: so that your s●lves admit a trope in the institution of this Sacrament.   

PAP.  
If these figurative spe●ches were true, yet I cannot see what argument you can draw from hence, or how you can hence prove any thing against our Tenet, saith our ●nglish 
n The Lord Ar. Ba●o● num●●●●, 4● touching some mis-allegations.  Baron: for it is a rule in Divinity, that Theologia Symbolica non est a●gumentativa, that figurative speeches afford no certain proof in matters of Faith.   

PRO.  
The ze●lous, Reverend, and learned L. Bishop of Dur●sme, Doctor Morton, tells 
o A discharge of five Impu●●●ions of mis-allegati●ns, falsely c●a●ged upon the (now● Bishop of Dure●me, by an English B●●on. pag. 133, etc. ad. num. 42.43.  your Baron and his Suggester, that upon the no-p●oper sense of the words, [This is my body] it must follow, that there is no Transubstantiation in your Romish Mass, no Corporal presence, no r●all Sacrifice, no proper eating, no lawful divine adoration thereof: and as for the rule, that Symbolical arguments m●ke no necessary Conclusions, the said learned and reverend Father saith, That this makes not against us, touching the figurative wo●ds of Christ, This is my body, the position maketh only against them, who extract either a literal sense out of a parabolical and figurative speech, as Origen did, when having r●ad that scripture● Th●re be some that castrate themselves for the kingdom of God, (wh●ch was but a p●rabolicall speech) he did really, and therefore foolishly castrate himself: or else, when men t●r●e the words of Scripture, properly and literally spoken, int●● figurative meanings as when Pope Innocent th● third, t● prove that his Papal authority was above th● Imperial, alleged that Scripture, Gen. 1. God made two great lights, the Sun, and the Moon; as if the Imperial like the Moon, had borrowed its authority from the Papal, as from the Sun: or as Pope Boniface 8, from those words, Luk. 22. Behold, here are two swords, argued, that both the temporal and spiritual sword are in the Pope, as he is Vicar of Christ. Now such kind of Symbolical reasoning is indeed of no force. ●ut by that position was it never forbid, whensoever in Scripture the name of the thing signified, is attributed to the symbol or sign, that then the Symbolical and Sacramental speech should be judged tropical. But this kind of exposition was always approved of Christ, and by his Church: so here, Christ taking bread, and breaking bread, which was the symbol and sign of Christ's body, and saying of the same Bread, [This is my body] the sense cannot possibly be literal, but altogether figurative, as hath been shown by diverse examples in Scripture, to wit, the sign of the passing over, called the Passeover; the Rock, but a sign of Christ, called Christ: In each on● of these the Symbols being a Sign and Figure, the speech must infallibly be Figurative. And therefore Bread, being a Figure of Christ's Body, is called Christ's body Figuratively. And thus far our learned Bishop of Duresme.  

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
The Church of Rome holds, 
p Imagines hab●ndas & r●tinendas esse, a●que ●is debitum honorem ac venerati●nem impertiendam. Bull● Pij qu●rti super formâ Iu●am●nti, ad calcem Concil. Trid. & Conc. T●●d. Ses●. 25.  that Images are to be had and retained, and that due honour, worship, and veneration is to be given to them; The Church of England holds, 
q Ar●ic 22.  that the Romish doctrine of Adoration of Images and Relics, and also of Invocation of Saints is grounded upon no warranty of Scripture, but rather repugnant to the word of God. And so indeed we find, that the Lord in his Moral law hath condemned 
r Exod. 20.5. Levit. 26.18.  in general all Ima●e● and Idols devised by man, for worship and adoration. And this Precept being a part of his Moral law, it binds 
s Deca●ogi verba ipse per seme●ipsum om●ibus simititèr Dominus ●●quutus est; & ideo sim●●●ter permanent abud ●os, extension in & aug●entum, sed non dissolut●o●●m a●●●pientta, per ca●●●tem ejus ad●●ntum I●enaeus ●o●●●. Haere●. lib. 4. cap 31.  us in the state of the new Testament, as it did the Israelites of old: for in all the Apostles doctrine, we do not find that ever this precept was abrogated; so that it binds, Israelites, Christians, and all.    

PA.  
If all worship of Images be forbidden, (Exod. 20. ver. 4, 5.) then all making of them is forbidden, for the same precept which saith, thou shalt not bow down to them, nor worship them; saith also, thou shalt not make to thyself any graven Image.   

PRO.  
Our learned Bishop White, hath answered for 〈◊〉: the Ground and Proposition of this argument (saith he) 
t D●ctor Whites Reply to jesuit Fisher's Answer. Fi●st point. §. 3. p. 266.  is fal●e; for worshipping of Images is forbidden, as the principal object of that negative precept, and as a thing Morally evil in his very kind: but making them is forbidden, (only) when it is a means subservient to worship; and because it may be separated, both in his own nature, and in man's intention from that end and use; therefore the one is simply forbidden, and the other is only prohibited, when it becometh a means, or instrument to other: for we mislike not pictures or Images for historical use and ornament; now this distinction and disparity between making and worshipping, is comfirmed by the example of the brazen Serpent, made by Gods own appointment; for when the same was only made, and looked upon, it was a Medicine, when it was worshipped, it become a poison, and was destroyed. 
2 King's 18●4.   
To proceed●; the Church of Rome holds, 
x Sa●●●os un●●um Christ's regnante●, venerandos a●que i●vocan●os esse Bulla P●● Q●●●● quò s●p●a. ●t Con●. Trid. Sess. 25.  that the Saints reigning with Christ, are to be worshipped and prayed unto; but this we hold is not warranted by God's word, but rather repugnant to it: for we are commanded to invocate God in the name of Christ 
y john 16. ●●. ; and our Saviour himself inviteth us, to approach with confidence to the throne of his grace 
z john ●5. 16. Ephes. 3.12. Hebr. 4.16. : he is rich in mercy 
a ●phes. 2.4. , to such as call upon him; and more compassionate, better able, and more willing to help us than any Saint or Angel; and he is appointed by God to be our Intercessor 
b Rom. 8.34. H●br. 7.25.  We read in the new Testament, many examples of people which made supplication immediately unto Christ, but not of one which made intercession to the Virgin Mary, or to the blessed Saints or Angels. And if any question with this our negative concluding from Scripture; Saint Hierome upon occasion did the like, saying, 
c Non credimus, quia non legimus. Hieron. advers. Helvidium. tom 2.  we believe it not, because we read it not.  
I will close up this point with that advice which Ignatius gave the Virgins of his time; 
d 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Ignat. in Epist. ad Philadelph.  not to direct their prayers and supplications to Saints or Angels, but to the Trinity (only). O ye Virgins, have Christ alone before your eyes, and his Father in your Prayers, being enlightened by the spirit.  

Of Faith and Merit.  
The Trent 
e Si quis dix●rit, sol● side impium jus●ifica●i, Anathema sit Conc. Trid. Ses●● 6. Can. 9  Councils accurseth all such as say, that a si●ner is justified by Faith only, or deny that the good works of holy men do truly Merit everlasting life, 
f Si quis dixe●it justifi●ati hominis opera bona non verè mereti vitam aete●nam● Anathema sit. Idem S●ss. 6. cap. 16. Can. 32.  our reform Churches hold, 
g Artl●. of England 11. and of Ireland 34.  that we are accounted righteous b●fore God, only for the Merit of jesus Christ, applied by Faith's and not for our works or Merits. And when we say, that we are justified by Faith only, we do not mean that the said justifying Faith is alone in man, without true repentance, hope, charity, and the fear of God; for such a Faith is dead, and cannot justify. 
h Art. of Ireland● 36.  Even as when we say, that the eye only seeth, we do not mean, that the eye severed from the head doth see, but that it is the only property of the eye to see. Neither doth this Faith of Christ, which is within us, of itself justify us, or deserve our justification unto us (for that were to account ourselves to be justified by the virtue or dignity of something within ourselves:) but the true meaning thereof is, that although we hear God's Word and believe it, although we have Faith, Hope, Charity, Repentance, and the flare of God within us, yet we must renounce the Merit of all our virtues, and good deeds, as far too weak and unsufficient to deserve remission of our Sins, and u● justification; and therefore we must trust only in God's mercy, and the Merits of our only Saviour and justifier jesus Christ. Nevertheless, because Faith doth directly send us to Christ for our justification, and that by Faith given us of God, we embrace the promise of God's mercy, and the remission of our Sins, (which thing none other of our virtues or works properly doth:) therefore the Scripture useth to say, 
i Rom. 3.28.— 42, etc.  that Faith without works, and the ancient Fathers of the Church to the same purpose, that only Faith doth justify us. 
k Homily of Salvation 2. Part.   
Now for the Point of Merit, it is neither agreeable to Scripture nor reason, for we cannot Merit of him whom we gratific not; we cannot gratify a man with his own; now all our good is Gods already, his gift, his propriety: What have we that we have not received? saith the Apostle, 
l 1. Cor. 4.7  not our Talon only, but the improvement also is his mere bounty; there can be therefore no place for Merit.    

PA.  
We hold the ancient Roman Faith.   

PRO.  
That is not so, as may appear by these instances.  
Saint Paul taught 
m Rome 9.11. Rome 11.5, 6.  his Romans, that our Ele●●ion is of God's free grace, and not ex operibus praevisis, of works foreseen.  
He taught, that we are justified by 
n Rome 3.28. Rome 4 2, etc.  Faith only; we conclude that we are justified by Fa●th without the work●s of the Law, which is all one as to say, a man is justified by Faith only.  
He taught, that eternal life is the gift of God, 
o Rom. 6. ●3.  and therefore not due to the Merit of works: that, the good works of the Regenerate are not of their own condignity meritorious, 
p Rom. 8.18.  nor such as can deserve heaven, and the sufferings there expressed are Martyrdoms sanctified by grace.  
He condemned Images, though made to resemble the true God; and taught 
q Rom. 1 23, 25.  that to bow the knee religiously to an Image, or to worship any creature, is meère Idolatry.  
He taught 
r Rom. 10.13, 14.  that we must not pray unto any but unto God only, in whom we believe: and therefore not to Saints or Angels, since we believe not in them.  
He taught that 
s Rome 7.7.— 8.10.  concupiscence is a Sin, even in the regenerate: 
* Apos●olus Concupiscentiam peccatum voca●; non licet nobi● autem ita l●q ●●. Possev. in Apparat. verbo Patres.  and Possevine the jesuit confesseth, that Saint Paul called it so, but saith he, we may not call it so.  
He taught, 
t Rome 4.9, 17, 23.  that the Imputed righteousness of Christ, is that only that maketh us just before God.  
Thus taught Saint Paul, thus the ancient Romans believed: from this Faith our latter Romanists are departed.  
Here then let the Reader judge, whether it be likely that Saint Paul, who (as Theodoret 
x Variam quidem & Om●is generis doctrinam per haec scripta exhibet Apostolus. Thedoret. tom. 2. in argum. Epist. ad Rom. Gen●iano Herveto Interpret.  saith) delivered doctrine of all sorts, and very exactly handled the Points thereof, should nevertheless (writing at large to the Roman Church) not once mention those main points, wherein the life of Popery consists; namely, the Pope's Monarchical jurisdiction, Transubstantiation, Communion in one kind, Service in an unknown tongue, Pope's pardons, Image worship, and the like, if the Church of Rome were then the same that now a days it is.  
Now if these points mentioned, were no Articles of Faith in the ancient Roman Church, in Saint Paul's days, when their Faith was spoken of throughout the whole world; 
y Rom. 1 8.  then they be not Articles of Faith at this day, but only Additions to the rule of Faith, such as the corruption of the times hath patched up, and pieced it withal: for it is a ruled case in the 
z Quan●um ad sub●stantiam Arti●ulorum fidei, non est sactum corum augmentum, sed quantum ad ●xplicationem, quia quaed●m explicitè cognita sunt à poster●oribus, quae à prioribus non cognosceba●tur explicitè. Aquin. ●●. 2 ae. qu. 1. Art. 7.  Schools, that the body of Religion may grow in respect of farther Explanations, but it cannot increase in Substantial points; even as a child (as Vicentius Lirinensis 
a Imi●etur anim●r●● Religio rationem co●po●●i, q●ae licet annorum pr●●●ss● num●ros suos evolv●●t & explicent, ●alem tam●n quae craft permanent; qu●● parvuloru● a●tus 〈◊〉 i●o●um. Vincent 〈◊〉 ● contra Haeres. ca 29.  ●aith) though he grow in stature, yet hath he no more limbs, when he becometh a man, than he had when he was a child; so the Church hath no more parts, or Articles of Faith in her riper age, than she had in her infancy, and by this rule, new Rome is a Monster, if she have more sword o● limbs of Faith now in her declining age, than ancient Rome had in her flourishing age.  
And herein we challenge our adversaries to show the body of their Religion pe●fited in this first and purest age, what time the Church was in her vigour, and the Scripture Canon finished and consigned: but they dare not be tried by the book of Scripture. Now for us, we willingly put our cause to be tried by that honourable and unpartial jury of Christ and his twelve Apostles, and the Evidence that shall be given by the testimony, and viuâ voce, of holy Scripture; but they turn their backs, and fly from this trial.  
But I proceed, and come to joseph of Arimathea, whom I named for one of our Lands special Benefactors; it was this joseph (as our best Antiquaries say 
c Gildas in the life of Aurel. Ambr●sius; and William Malm●bury apud C●●●b●en. in Belge or S●●me●jet. ) that together with twelve other Disciples his Assistants, came out of France into Britain, and preached the Christian Faith in the Western part of this Island, now called Glastenbury; which place in ancient Charters, was termed the Grave of the Saints, the Mother Church, the Disciples foundation: whereby it is very likely, that our land was first converted by joseph of Arimathea being sent hither by S. Philip, & not from S. Peter, and that not from Rome, but from Arimathea, which was not far from Jerusalem, so that Jerusalem is the Mother of us all, as both Hierome 
d Io Hieru●alem primum fund. t● Ecclesi●. to●ius o●b● Ecclesias sem●●●it. Hieron. tom. 2. in Isai cap. 2. [Ex Zion I●x ex●●●●, & v●●bum Domi●●ex Hieru●●lem]  and Theodoret 
e 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Th●odoret Histor. Eccles l●b 5. cap. ●.  say. And this is the rather probable, because that upon Austin the Monks coming into England, the British Bishops observed their Easter, and other points of difference, according to the Gre●ke or Eastern Church, and not after the Roman Western Church; which makes it probable, that our first conversion came from the Christian converted jews, or Grecians, and not from the Romans; but howsoever it were, or whence-soever they came, we bless God for the great work of our conversion.    

THE SECOND CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 100 to 200.  

PAPIST.  
WHom do you name in this Age?   

PROTESTANT.  
In this Age lived Hegesippus of the jewish Nation, afterwards converted to Christianity. Melito Bishop of Sardis: justine Martyr, who, of a Philosopher, became both a Christian and a Martyr. Now also lived Irenaeus Bishop of Lions in France, sometimes Scholar to Polycarp, and both of them Martyred fo● the name of Christ; of this Polycarp, Bishop of Smyrna it is recorded, 
a Eus●b. lib. 4. cap. 15.  that being urged by the Roman Deputy to deny Christ, he stoutly replied on this manner: I have served him these fourscore and six years, and he hath not hurt me, and shall I now deny him? Now also lived Clemens Alexandrinus, who was Scholar to one Pantenus, these two seem to be the Authors of Universities and Colleges, for they taught the Grounds of Religion, not by Sermons and Homilies to the people, but by catechetical doctrine to the Learned in the Schools.  
Now that in point of doctrine we consent with the Worthies of this Age, it may appea●e by the testimony of Iren●us, a Disciple of those that heard Saint john the Apostle, for he 
b Irenaeus lib. 1. cap. 2. & 3.  layeth down no other Articles of Faith, and Grounds of Religion than our ordinary Catechism teacheth: beside he showeth that in the unity of that Faith the Churches of Germany, Spain, France, the East, Egypt, Libya, and all the World, were founded, and therein sweetly accorded: as if they had all dwelled in one house, all had had but one soul, and one heart, and one mouth. 
c Regula est autem Fidei, ut ●am hinc quid ●redamus prositeamu●, illa scili●et: qu● creditur unum omninò D●um esse, etc. Tertul. de p●aes●●ip●ione advers. haeret. c. 13.  The like doth his contemporary Tertullian, he gives the fundamental points of Religion, gathered out of the Scriptures, and delivered by the Churches, the same which our Church delivereth, and no other for the Rule of Faith.  

Of the Scriptures Sufficiency, and Canon.  
Irenaeus saith, 
d Quià S●●ipturae quidem perfec●●e sunt, quippè ● ve●bo D●i & spi●itu ejus dic●ae. ●en. lib. 2. c. 47.  The Scriptures are perfect, as spoken from the Word of God, and his Spirit: and Erasmus 
Solis Scripturarum praesidijs pugnat a●ve●sus ●atervam. Here●ic●rum. Erasm p●aefat. in Iren  observes, that Irenaeus fought against the troops of Heretics, only by the forces and strength of Scripture, indeed he sometimes chargeth them with the Church's tradition, (wounding them with their own weapon:) but this was with such undoubted tradition, as were in his time thought to be Apostolic, which he might easily discern living so near the Apostles days.  
Melito, Bishop of Sardis, being desired by Onesimus to send him a Catalogue of the Books of the Old Testament, 
f 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Eus●b. lib. 4. cap. 26.  makes no mention of judith, Tobit, Ecclesiasticus, nor the Maccabees: and yet he profes●eth that he made very diligent search to set down a perfect Cannon thereof. And this is likewise confessed by Bellarmine; many ancients 
g Multi vete●um ut Melito, aperte s●q●●ti sunt Hebreos● non G●ae●os. Bell●r● de verb. Dei lib. 1. cap. 20 § Ad alter in.  (saith he) as namely Melito● did follow the Hebrew Canon of the jews.   

Of Communion under both kinds; and number of Sacraments.  
justin Martyr saith, 
h 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Iust. Ap●log. ●. in fine p 162.  they which are called Deacons among us give to every one that is present of the consecrated Bread & Wine● adding withal, 
i 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 In●●●. Id. ibid.  as Christ commanded them: now these words which mention Christ's Commandment, 
k Respondeo, illa verba justini, ubi commemoratur Christi praceptum, non pertinent ad Communionem, sed ad consecration●m. Bellarm. lib. 4 de Euchar. cap. 26. §. Respondeo.  Bellarmine would have to belong to the Consecration only, & not to the Communion; whereas I●stin extends Christ's precept to both, both being enjoined in that precept, do this in remembrance of me: so that we have both Christ's precept, and this Age's practice for our Communion in both. Clemens Alexandrinus wrote a book against the Gentiles, 
Stromata.  which he calls 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, (as ye would say) woven after the manner of cover, mixed with the testimonies of Scriptures, Poets, Philosophers, and Histories, and therein he hath these words: 
l 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Clem. Alexandr. Stromat. lib. 1. pag. 94.  When they distribute the Holy Eucharist, as the custom is, they permit every one of the people to take a part or portion thereof: and what he meaneth by Eucharist, himself explaineth, saying, 
m 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Idem Paedagog. lib. 2. cap. 2. pag. 35.  the mingling of the drink and of the Water and the Word, is that which we call the Eucharist: so that according to him, not Bread only, but Bread and Wine is the Eucharist, and of this every one of the people participated in his time, and therefore all drank of the Cup. justine Martyr in his Apology for the Christians 
n justin. Apol secund●.  specifies no other Sacraments, than Baptism, and the Lords Supper; and yet in that treatise of his, he was justly occasioned to mention the Sacraments of the Church; and there he relates the manner of their Church-service, Liturgies, and Commnuion: so that there had been a fit place for him to have named those other five, if the Church had then known them.   

Of the Eucharist.  
That the substance of Bread and Wine, remaineth in the Sacrament after the words of Consecration, albeit the use of the elements be changed, is clear by the Fathers of this Age. justine Martyr saith, 
o justin. Apolog. 2.  that the elements of Bread and Wine in the Sacrament of the Supper, are made flesh, and the blood of jesus, in that same manner that the eternal Word of God was made flesh: but so it is, that the substance of the Divine nature, neither evanished nor yet was changed into the substance of flesh: and in like manner, the Bread is made the Body of Christ, neither by evanishing of the substance thereof, nor yet by changing the substance thereof into another substance.  
justine Martyr telleth us, that the Bread and the Wine, even that 
p 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ●u●●in. Apolog. 2 in sin  sanctified food wherewith our blood and flesh by conversion are nourished, is that which we are taught to be the flesh and blood of jesus incarnate. Our Lord, saith Clemens of Alexandria, 
q 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 C●m. Al●●andr. Paedagog lib. 2. cap. 2. pag 38.  did bless Wine, when he said, take, drink, this is my blood, the blood of the Vine. Irenaeus saith, 
Quomodo autem justè Dominus, si alterius Patris existit, hu●us ●onditionis quae est secundum nos, accipi●ns pa●em, suum corpus esse consit●batur. I●en. lib 4. c p 57●  that our Lord, taking Bread of that condition, which is usual among us, confessed it to be his Body: and 
s Et cali●em similtèr, qui est ●x ea c●●atur●, quae est se●undùm nos, suum sanguinem con●●ss●s est. Id. ibid. lib● 4. cap 32.  the Cup likewise containing that creature which is usual among us, his blood: so that in their construction, it was Bread and Wine which Christ called his Body; it was Bread in substance, material Bread, and the Body of the Lord in signification, and Sacramental relation. The Lord called Bread his body, now since Bread could not be his body substantially, it must needs be, it was only his body Sacramentally.   

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
Concerning the use of Images, we find that in these best & ancient times, Christians were so far from bringing them into their Churches, that some of them would not so much as admit the Art itself of making them, so jealous were they of the danger, and careful for the prevention of deceit, whereby the simple might any way be drawn on to the adoring of them: we are plainly forbidden, saith Clemens Alexandrinus, 
t 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ● Clement. Alexan. Protreptic. ad Gent. pag 24.  to exercise that deceitful Art; for the Prophet saith, Thou shalt not make the likeness of any thing, either in the Heaven, or in the Earth beneath. 
u 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. Pae●dag. lib. 3. cap 2. p●g 58.  Moses commandeth men to make no Image, that should represent God by Art, 
x 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. Protreptic. pag. ●1.  for in truth, an Image is a dead matter, form by the hand of an artificer, but we have no sensible Image made of any sensible matter, but such an Image as is to be conceived with the understanding, 
y 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. in Protreptic. oratione Adhortat ad Gentes. pag. 23.— 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Ibid. pag. 20.  yea but thine Images are of Gold: be it so: now I pray thee, what is Gold, or Silver, Iron, Brass, Ivory, the Adamant, Diamond, or Precious Stones? Are they not terra et ex terrâ, are they ought but Earth and made of the Earth? now being nothing else but a piec● of more refined Earth, I have learned 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, terram calcare, non colere; to walk on the Earth, and not to worship it; to set my foot on it, not to bow my knee to it. And thus far Clement of Alexandria, holding it a monstrous thing to bow down to a stock or a stone.  
Irenaeus reckons it among the abuses of the Gnostikes, 
z Imagines quasdam depictas, quasdam de relic Materie fabricatas habent, dicentes formam Christi factam ● Pilato, e● has coronant. Iren. lib. 1. cap. 24.  that they had certain painted Images, and others made of other stuff, saying, that it was the Picture of Christ made by Pilate.  
When the Emperor Adrian, in favour of the Christians 
a Alexander Imperator Christo templum facere voluit, eumque inter Deos recipere: quod & Adrianus cogitasse fertur, qui templa in omnibus civitatibu●●ine simulachris jusserat fieri, quae hodie idcirco quia non habent numina, dicuntur Ad●iani● quae ille ad hoc parasse dicebatur, sed prohibitus est ab iis qui consulentes sacra, repererant omnes Christianos futuros si id optatò eveniss●t, & templa reliqua deserenda. Lamprid. in Alexandro.  had commanded that in every City, Churches should be built without Images, which at this day are called Adrian's Temples, because they have no Gods in them; which they said he made for that end: to wit, to pleasure the Christians; it was presently conceived, that he prepared those Temples for Christ, as Aelius Lampridius noteh, in the life of Alexander Severus: which is an evident Argument, that it was not the use of Christians in those days to have any Images in their Churches.  
Learned Master Casa●bone in his notes upon this place of Lampridius, 
b Historiam istam ad Tiberium potius referendam puto, quam Adrianum. Hadrianum autem templa sieri suo nomini mand●sse, quae eo morte praerepto imperfecta postea & fine simulachris mansere; unde factum ut in animum inducerent multi non ●ibi sed Christo templa ista extruxisse Adrianum, quibus assentitur Lampridius; ut qui norat, quod ignorare tum poterat nemo, & judaeos o●im in Hierosolomytanâ aede 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Deum co●uisse, & suis etiam temporibus Christianorum templa ejusmodi esse, qualia adhuc memorià suâ B. Augustinu● cum alibi prodit fuisse, tum in Psalmi 103. enarratione. Isaac. Causabon. in notis in hunc locum Lamp●id.  thinketh that this story is rather to be referred to Tiberius the Emperor, ●han to Hadrian: and that Adrian caused Temples to be dedicated to his own name, and th●se Temples, Adrian being prevented by death, remained unfinished, and without any Images at all: whence it came to pass, that many w●n thought that Adrian built those Temples not to himself, but unto Christ, and with these agreeth Lampridius● as one who knew, that which none could then be ignorant of, that both the jews in the Temple at Jerusalem did worship God without Images and Pictures, as both Strabo and Dio write, and that in their days the Christian Churches were such, as afterwards Saint Austin reports them to have been in his days.  
Saint Austin upon the hundred and thirteenth Psalm, 
Hoc enim venerantu, quod ipsi ex auro argentoque●ec●runt, sed enim & nos plaraque inst●umenta & vasa ex hujus modi materi ● vel metallo habemus in usum celebrando●um Sacramentorum Et sunt pro●●cto etiam illa ins●rumenta vel vosa, q●●d alive quam opera manuum hominum? ve●untamen nunquid or habent, & non loquentur? Nunquid its supplicamus quia per ea supplicamus Deo? plus val●nt s●melachra ad curvandam infael●●m animam quod os hubent, oculos, aures; quam id corrigendam, quod non loquentur, non videhunt, non audient. Aug. in Psal. 113. conc. 2.  expounding those words of David, that Idols have a mouth and speak not, makes this objection, that the Church hath also diverse instruments and vessels made of gold and silver, for the use of celebrating the Sacraments: but he answers, have these instruments mouths and speak not, eyes and see not? do we address our prayers to them? now surely he could not have spoken thus, if he had Images in Churches, or if Images had been a part of the Church's Utensils and moveables in his days.  
Concerning Prayer to Saints, justine Martyr, Clemens Alexandrinus, and Tertullian have reported the public forms of Christian service, and Religious exercises of the Primitive Christians, and yet make no mention of Prayer to Saints, or Angels, but only of Prayer directed to God in the name and mediation of Christ alone.  
Irenaeus tells us, 
d Ecclesia per u●iversam mundum— Nec invocationibus Angeli●●● fac●●● a'●quid, nec incantationibus, n●● aliquâ prauâ curiosirate● sed mundè, & 〈◊〉 & m●●i●●estè orationes di●igentes ad Dominum qui omnia facit, & nomen Domini nos●●● 〈◊〉 Christi [●nvo●ant, virtu●t●s] secundum utilitates b●●onum sed non a● se●ducti●ne● per●e●it. ●●n. ●● 2. c●p●●7. 〈◊〉 Fe●● de● tius.  that in his days the Church, per universum mundum, Irenaeus●aith ●aith not (as 
e ●Nec invo●ationibus Ang●l●●●] mal●gnorum vid●●●●●●p●●tuum. ●ev. ●d. ●. t●s in locum Ir●n●ei.  Fevardentius, and the Papists now a days would teach him) that the Heretics called upon false and imaginary Saints and Angels, and the Church upon the true Saints, and holy Angels; but this he saith, that the Church called upon God in Christ jesus. Eusebius in his Story, setteth down Verbatim a long Prayer used by Polycarp the Martyr, at the time of his suffering, wherein, if Invocation of Saints had been reputed any part of Christian devotion in those days, he would undoubtedly in so great peril and at his death, have recommended himself to God by the Prayers and Merits of Saints: but his form of Prayer is Protestant-like, tendered to God himself only by the mediation of Christ, concluding his Prayer in this manner: 
f 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Euseb. Hist. lib. 4. cap. 15.  therefore in all things I Praise thee, I bless thee, I Glorify thee through the eternal Priest [of our profession] jesus Christ thy beloved Son, to whom with thee, O Father, and the Holy Ghost, be all Glory, now and for ever. Amen.  
When the people of the Church of Smyrna desired to have the body, or bones of their Martyred● Bishop Polycarp to burial, the jews persuaded the Governor not to grant it, for that then the Christians would leave Christ, and worship the body of Polycarp: to which surmise they return this answer: 
g 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Eccle. Smy●n, apud Euseb. l. 4. hist. cap. 15 pag. 39  we can never be induced either to forsake Christ, which hath suffered for all that are saved in the World, [〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 
* 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 with religious worship. ] or to worship any other for him, being the Son of God [〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉] we adore him; but the Martyrs, as the Disciples and followers of the Lord [〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉] them we love worthily. Now when they say, that they cannot worship any other: our learned and divine Antiquary Doctor Usher 
h An Answer to the jesuits Challenge. Of payer to Saints. pag. 426.  observeth, that the Latin Edition of theirs, which was wont to be publicly read in these Churches of the West, expresseth their meaning in this manner: 
i Nunquam Christum relinquere possumu● Cristiani, neque alterì cuiquam precem orat●onis impendere. Ex Passionario MS. seven. Kalend. Febr. in Bibliotheea Ecclesiae Sarisburiensis, & D● Robert● Cottoni.  We Christians can never leave Christ, who did vouchsafe to suffer so great things for our Sins, nor impart the supplication of Prayer unto any other.    

PAP.  
Irenaeus termeth the blessed Virgin 
k V●i virgini● Evae virgo Maria ●ie●e● Advoc●●a. I●en. lib. 5. c. 16. edit Gallasij c. 19 edit. Fevard.  the Advocate of Eve.   

PRO.  
Indeed Bellarmine 
l Bellar. l. 1. de Sanct. Beat. c. 19 quid clar●us?  cryeth up this place with a quid clarius? what can be said more plainly? and Fevardentius, answerable to his name, falls not upon Gallasius about this place. Now Irenaeus his meaning (as elsewhere he expresseth himself, 
m 
Sicut Eva, & fibi et universo generi humano causa facta est mortis; sic & Maria, e●●●●i, & universo generi humano causa facta est salutis. Iren. lib. 3. cap. 33.  
[Causa salutis] causa pro organo exteriore accipitur. N●col. Gallas. in loc.  ) is this, and no more, that as by Eva Sin came into the World, and by Sin death; so by the Virgin's means, life and salvation instrumentally, in that she was that chosen vessel of the Holy Ghost, to bear him in her womb, who by taking flesh of her, redeemed us from the curse of death. And thus she was the Advocate or Comforter of Evah and her children, by bearing Christ, and not because she was invocated, as a mediator, after her death by Evahs' children.  

Of Faith and Merit.  
Irenaeus (as Chemnitius observeth 
n Et ●●●è quid allud est, quam exclusiva, quod Ire●au● habet. lib. 4. c. 37.38. Non aliter servar● homines ab antiquà Se●pentis plag●● nisi credant in cum, &c Chemnit. loc. Theolog. de justif. 2. part p. 773. ) though he speak not expressly of Sola Fides, yet he useth terms equivalent to that exclusive particle: saying that there is no way to be saved from the sting of that old Serpent the Devil, but by believing in Christ.  
The Fathers of this Age, the most of them alleged (if not all 
o 
Mi●i nondum satis liquet Graece ne scripserit, an Latin, etiamsi magis arbi●●or L●tine scripsisse. E●●●in● pr●fat. in Iren.  
Phrasis ejus [●●en●e●] Graecismum redolet. Bellarm. de Scriptor Eccles.  ) wrote in Greek, and could not understand Merit. And Polycarp the Martyr in his Prayer above mentioned, useth the term 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, not for to deserve, but for to attain, procure, or find favour. I thank thee O Father (saith he 
p 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Euseb. lib. 4. cap. 15. ) 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, that thou hast graciously vouchsafed this day and this hour to allot me a portion among the number of Martyrs. Now surely had the doctrine of Merit been Catholic in his days, he would doubtless being now in extremis, and upon his fiery trial, have recommended himself to God by the Prayers and Merits of Saints; but he neither pleads his own, nor others Merits, none but Chaists.  
In this Age Polycrates Bishop of Ephesu●, and other Eastern Bishops in Asia, withstood the Pope about keeping the Feast of Easter; 
q Euseb. hist lib. 5 ca ●1. 22, 23.  they proved their custom to be received from Saint john, and that it was practised and continued by Polycarp the Martyr, and others. This did so vex Pope Victor, as that he excommunicated the Churches of Asia 
r V● omnes Eccle●ia A●●● ab eodem V●ctore Romano ●xcommunicat●●ueri●●. Bell●●. de verbo Dei lib● 3● cap. 6. § Secundo. : neither did he revoke his 
s Q●●d Vic●●● sententiam s●●●m m●●●ve●it, nusquam le●im●● Bellarm. lib● 2. de P. 〈◊〉 c 19 §● at obijcit.  censure for aught that Bellarmine can find: and yet Irenaeus a godly Bishop of Lions in France, sharply rebuked 
t Euseb. cap. 23.  the Pope for troubling the peace of the Church: yea P●lycrates stood at defiance with the Pope, and contemned his threats, 
u Euseb. cap. 22.  to wit, excommunications.    

PA.  
This was no great difference.   

PRO.  
If it were a matter of small weight, why then would the Pope excommunicate so many famous Churches for dissenting from him therein? Besides, Bellarmine saith, 
x Qu●niam ergò Papa vide●at illam diver●itatem de Paschate adferre secum Haere●in. Bellar. de Rom. Pont. lib. 2. cap. 19 S. Quoniam.  that the Pope conceived that this difference might breed heresy; belike than he thought it a matter of consequence.  
Howsoever by this opposition to the See of Rome we may observe: that had those ancient Churches of Asia acknowledged the Pope's Supremacy, they would not have thus opposed his Constitutions, nor slighted his Censures.  
In this Age also I find that when Lucius a Christian Prince in this our Britain, sent to Pope Elentherius, to receive some Laws thence, the Bishop returned him this Answer, as appears by a Letter or Epistle usually inserted 
y Haec Epistola communiter habetur inter leges Divi Edwardi. Antiquitat. Britan. pag. 5. in Margin.  amongst the Laws of Saint Edward the Confessor: 
z Habetis penes vos in regno utramque paginam, c●● illis Dei gratia per Concilium regni vestri sumere po●estis legem, vicarius verò Dei ●●●is in regno. Antiquitat. Britan. p●g. 5.  There are already within your own Kingdom the Old and New Testament, out of which by the Council of your Kingdom, you may take a Law to Govern your people, for you are the Vicar of Christ within your own kingdom. Whence we may observe, that (howsoever the Papists now adays labour to prove 
a Bellarminus lib. 2. de Rom. Pont. ca 19 probare nititur primatum Papae● ex ferendi● legibus, & censuris.  the Pope's Supremacy, by his giving of Laws, and inflicting his Censures on others,) yet in these ancient times, even by the Pope's own acknowledgement, the King was held to be Supreme Governor within his own Kingdom.   

PA.  
Belike then, Britain was now Converted to the Faith.   

PRO.  
It was converted before this time, for in the Reign of this Lucius, 
b Dicetas, Deane of London, a Manuscript in the King's Library ad ann. 178. alleged by M. S●●eds History of Great Br●tain, Book 6. cap. 9 sect. 18.  lived those two learned British Divines, Elvanus of Glastenbury, and Medvinus of Wells; and these two were sent by King Lucius to the Bishop of Rome, to desire a supply of Preachers to assist the Britain's; and with them returned Faganus and Damianus, and these jointly with the Britain's, preached the Gospel, and Baptised amongst the Britain's, whereby many were daily drawn to the Fa●th of Christ, and the Temples of the heathenish Priests their Flamines, and Archflamines (as they termed them) were converted into so many Bishops, and Archbishops Sees; as the Monk of Chester, Ranulphus Higden, 
c Polychronic. lib. 4. cap. 16. pag. 163.  reports. Neither yet is this to be called a conversion of our Island, but rather a new supply of Preachers● for john Capgrave a Domynick● Friar, (one whom 
d Conversion of England, 1 Part. Ch●p. 1. num. 25.  Parson's commends for a Learned man) reports, that Elvanus the Britain, had dispersed thorough the wild fields of Britain, those seeds of the Gospel, that joseph of Arimathea had formerly 
e joseph ab Arimathea anno ab I●carnatione 63. cum d●cem socijs i● Britannia fid●m Christi praedicab●nt. Nova Legenda Angliae pag. 187. column● 4.  sown, and that the Pope made Elvanus Bishop in Britain, and Medvinus a Doctor to preach the Faith of Christ throughout the whole Island; which showeth that when they were sent Ambassadors to to Ele●therius Bishop of Rome, they were then no novices, but learned and practised Divines, as one of their own Historians 
f Lucius Brittaunorum Rex literas per Elvanum & Medvinum viros rerum divinarum peritos ad cum mitte●at [Eleutherium] Richardus Vitus Basingstoochiensis. Histor. lib. 5. pag. 1.  calleth them.    

THE THIRD CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 200. to 300.  

PAPIST.  
WHom name you in this Age?   

PROTESTANT.  
In this Age there flourished Tertullian, Origen, and Saint Cyprian; now also lived Minutius Felix a famous Lawyer in Rome, Arnobius and his eloquent Scholar Lactantius. Tertullian was a man of a quick and pregnant wit; he wrote learned and strong Apologies in the behalf of Christians; Cyprian read daily some part of his writings, and so reverenced him, that he used to say to his Secretary, 
a Ad notarium dicere consuevit, Da Magistrum, Tertullianum videlicet designans. Hieron. in Catal. Scriptor. Eccles.  Da magistrum, help me to my Tutor, reach me my master; meaning Tertullian: afterwards, through spite of the Roman Clergy, he revolted to the Montanists, and was taken up with their idle Prophecies, and Revelations.  
Origen was in this his age, a mirror of piety, and of learning of all sorts, both divine and humane; he conferred the Hebrew text, 
b Euseb. lib. ●. cap. 16.  with the Greek translations, not only of the Septuagints, but also the translations of Aquila, Theodosion, and Symmachus; he found out other editions also, which he set forth and called them Octupla or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, because every page contained eight columns, or several translations, such as were then in estimation: he was of so happy a memory, that he had the Bible without book; 
c 
Scripturas memoritèr tenuit. Hier. ad Pammach. & Ocean.  
Novu● et vetus Testamentum v●lut alter Esdras memor●tèr noverat. Tri●hem. de scriptor. Eccles.   and could at the sam● time dictate unto seven several Clerks or Notaries: 
d Septem Notarijs potuit dictare. Trithem. Ib.  he was of such esteem, that diverse would say, 
e Vincent. Lirinens. de H●res. cap. 23.  Malle se cum Origene errare, quam cum aliis ver● sentire; that they had rather err with Origen, than think aright with others: he exhorted others to Martyrdom, and from his childhood was himself desirous of the honour thereof; but in the seventh persecution under Decius he fainted, and his heart was so overset with fear to have his chaste body defiled with an ugly Ethiopian, that he chose rather to offer incense to the Idol, then to be so filthily abused; for this cause he was excommunicated by the Church of Alexandria, and for very shame fled to judea, wher● he was not only gladly received, but also requested publicly to preach at Jerusalem: But so it was, 
f Epiphanius contr● H●resin 64. lib. 2. tom. 1. in ●dit. L●●.  falling upon that place of the Psalmist; Unto the ungodly saith God; why dost thou preach my Laws, and takest my Covenant in thy mouth? whereas thou hatest to be reform, and hast cast my words behind thee: [Psalms. 50.16.17.] These wo●ds so deeply wounded his heart with grief, that he closed the book, and sat down and wept, and all the congregation wept with him. In expounding the Scriptures, he was curious in searching out of Allegories; and yet falling on that place Math. 19.12. Some have gelded themselves for the kingdom of heaven, he took those words literally, and gelded himself, to the end he might live without all suspicion of uncleanness: 
g Amore castitati●, ut mulier●bu● securè auderet pradicare, se castrari fecit. Trithem de Scriptor. Ecclesiast.  whereas he expounded almost all the rest of the Scriptures figuratively. He held a fond opinion, concerning the pains of devils, and wicked men, after long torments to be finished. It is usually said of him, Vbi bene scripsit, nem● melius, ubi malè, nemo pejus: where he wrote well● n●ne better; so that we may say of him, as jeremy of his figs, the good, none better, the evil, non● worse, jer. 24.2. Cypria●● was a learned godly Bishop, and glorious Martyr, he erred (indeed) in that he would have had, such as had been baptised by Heretics, if afterwards they returned to the true Church, to be rebaptised: yet he was not obstinate in his error: he was as A●stin saith of him, 
h Non solum do●●●● sed etiam do●ibilis. August. l. 4. de Baptis. cap. 5.  not only learned, but docible, and willing to be learned; and that 
i Satis f●cilimè o●tendit se correctu●um fuisse sententiam suam, si quis e● demonstraret. Id. Ibid. lib. 2. cap 4.  he would most easily have altered his opinion, had this question in his life time been debated by such learned and holy men, as afterwards it was: so that S. Austin makes this observation touching Cyprians error; 
k Properer non vidit aliquid, ut per ●um aliud super eminent●us videre●ur. Id. Ibid. lib. 1. cap. 18.  he therefore saw not this one truth touching Rebaptisation, that others might see in him a more eminent and excellent truth; to wit, his humility, modesty, and charity.  

Of the Scriptures sufficiency and Canon.  
Tertullian, though he stood for Ceremonial traditions unwritten, and for Doctrinal traditions which were first delivered from the Apostles by word of mouth, and afterwards committed to writing; yet dealing with Hermogenes the Heretic in a question concerning the faith, (whether all things at the beginning were made of nothing?) presseth him with an Argument ab Authoritate negatiuè; Whether all things were made of any subject matter, I have 
l An autem de aliquâ subjacenti materiâ f●cta si●t omnia, ●usquam adhuc legi; Scriptum esse doceat Hermogenis Officina. Si non est scriptum, tim●a● vae illud adijci●●tibus aut de●rahentibus des●inatum. Tertul. advers. Hermog. cap. 22.  as yet read no where (saith he) Let those of Hermogenes his shop show that it is written: if it be not written, let them fear that w●e which is allotted to such as add or take away: but for himself he professeth, that 
m Adoro Scripturae pi●n●tudin●m. Id. Ibid.  he adoreth the fullness of the Scripture. And why may not we also argue negatively, touching diverse Tenets of Popery? that from the beginning it was not so, Math. 19.8.  
In the two Testaments (saith Origen 
n In quibus liceat omne verbum quod ad D●um pe●tinet r●quiri et discuti; atque ex ip●is om●em rerum scientiam c●pi. Si qu●d ●●tem super●uerit quod non divina Scriptura decernat● nullam aliam de bere terti●m scripturam ad authoritatem scientiae suscipi. Orig. in Levit. Homil. 5. tom. 1. ) every word that appertaineth to God may be required and discussed; and all knowledge of things out of them may be understood: but if any thing do remain, which the holy Scripture doth not determine; no other third Scripture ought to be received for to authorise any knowledge. Origen in his exposition upon the first Psalm, faith, w●e may not be ignorant, there are two and twenty books of the old Testament after the Hebrews; which is the number of the Letters among them. This is likewise witnessed by Eusebius, 
o Euseb. lib. 6 Histo●. cap● 24.  that as Origen received the Canon of the jews, so likewise he rejected those six books which we term Apocryphal with the jews.   

Of Communion under both; and the number of Sacraments.  
Tertullian speaking in general of Christians, saith, 
p Caro corpore et sanguine Christi ●escitur, ut & anim● de Deo saginetur. Tertul de Resurrect. cap. 8.  the flesh feedeth upon the body and blood of Christ, that the soul may be fatted, as it were of God: he speaks of the body and blood of Christ as distinct things; saying, Corpore & sanguine; and elsewhere he mentions the Cup given to a Lay-woman, saying, 
q De cujus manu d●●iderabit? de cujus po●ulo participabit? Ter●ul. lib. ●. ad V●orem cap. 6.  from whose hands shall she desire the Sacramental Bread, of whose Cup shall she participate? he speaketh of a Christian woman married to an Infidel, and showeth the inconvenience of such a match, whereby the faithful wife was like to be debarred of the comfort of receiving the Sacrament, and drinking of the Lords Cup. Origen maketh this question; 
r Populus in usu habet sanguinem bibere. Origen. hom. 16. in Num.  What people is it, that is accustomed to drink blood? and he answereth the faithful people. Hereunto Bellarmine saith; 
s Respondeo, habet in usu, non in precepto Bellar. de Euchar. lib. 4 cap. 26.  the people did drink, but they had no comm●nd so to do; where he grants us, that communicating under both kinds, was the Agend or Church practise in this age: beside, Origen in this very place allegeth Christ's precept for the Cup out of the sixth of john.  
Cyprian speaking of such as in time of persecution, had lapsed and not stuck to the truth, and thereupon were barred from the Communion, he desires that upon their repentance they may be admitted, and he gives this reason: 
t Quomodo a● Martyrij poculum idone●s facimus si non eos pri●s ad bibendum in Ecclesi● poculum Domini jure communicationis admittimus? Cyprian. epist. 54. ●om. 1. lib. 1. epist. 2. in aliis edit.  How shall we sit them for the Cup of Martyrdom, if before we admit them not by right of Communion to drink of the Lords cup in the Church? And again; 
u In chalice Domini sanctificando, & plebi ministrando, non hoc faciunt, quod Iesus Christus sacrificij hu●us auctor et doctor, 〈◊〉 et do●uit. Id. Epist. 63. lib. 2. ep. 3.  Because some men out of ignorance, or simplicity in Sanctifying the Cup of the Lord, and ministering it to the people; do not that which jesus Christ our Lord and God, the Author and institutor of this Sacrifice did and taught: Where albeit the main scope of the Epistle be, to prove the necessity of administering the Sacrament in Wine, and not in mere water, as the Aquarij did; yet on the buy he discovers the practice of the Church for both kinds; and saith expressly, that the Cup was ministered, or delivered to the people.  
Tertullian, in diverse places 
x Nec alibi conjunctos ad Sacramentum Baptismatis, & Eucharistiae admittens. Tertul. advers. Martion. lib. 4. cap. 34. & de Co●onâ Militis. cap 3.  of his works acknowledgeth the same Sacraments with us, to wit, Baptism, and the Lords Supper: and Beatus Rhenanus in his notes upon Tertullian, observes the same, and for this he is brought under the Spanish inquisition, 
y Censurae Inquisitionis Hispanicae in B. Rhenani Aannotationes ad Tertullian. Prout edita sunt in ●udice Libror. Expurgator. jussu Quiroga. Madriti 1584. ex libro 4. advers. Martion. Deleantur illa verba, [Baptismus & Eucharistia duo Sacramenta Primitivae ecclesiae.]  and roughly entertained for his pains, as appears by a Censure passed on him, and extant 
z Tertulliani opera cum c●stigat. Fr. junij in Bibliop. Commel●●●●●o. 1609.  in the latter end of Tertullia's Works.   

Of the Eucharist.  
Tertullian disputing against Martion, who denied that Christ had a true Body, confuteth him by a reason drawn from the Sacrament of the Supper, in this manner.  
A Figure of a Body, presupposeth a true Body, for of a show or fantasy there can be no Figure.  
But Christ gave unto his Disciples a Figure of his Body.  
Therefore Christ had a true Body.  
Tertullia's words are these: 
a Ac ●ptum panem & distributum discipulis, corpus suum illum fecit, hoc est corpus meum dicendo, id est, Figura corporis mei: figura autem non fuisset, nisi veritatis esset corpus: c●terum vacua res, quod est phantasma, figuram capere non posset. Tertul. advers. Martion. lib 4. cap. 40.  Christ taking the Bread, and distributing it to his Disciples, made it his Body, saying, This is my Body, that is to say, this is a figure of my Body, but a figure it could not be, unless there were a Body of a truth and in deed: for a void thing as is a fantasy, can receive no figure. Here Tertullian affirmeth expressly of Bread, which he received into his hand, and distributed to his Disciples, that it it is a figure of Christ's Body. The Rhemists' answer, 
b Rhemists' Annot. on Math. 26. chap. sect. 9  that when some Fathers call the Bread, a figure or sign, they mean the outward forms of Bread and Wine; but Tertullian proving the truth of Christ's humanity, by the Sacrament of the Supper, interprets these words, This is my Body, that is to say, the figure of my Body; where, if by the figure of Christ's Body, there were nothing else to be understood, but the forms, and outward shapes, the Heretic upon this construction might have concluded for himself; that the figure of his Body is nothing but a bare form and shape of a thing, therefore he himself was nothing else but a ●hew of a Body, no true Body.  
Others expound Tertullia's words in this sort: 
c Master Fisher in D. White● Reply 6 point. pa. 400.401.  The figure of my Body is my Body, or this Bread which under the Law, was a figure of my Body, is now my Body.  
But Tertullian both here, and in diverse other places, 
d 
〈…〉 Deus in Evangelio reve●avi●, panem corpus suum appellans. Tertul. con. Martion. l 3. c. 19  
Panem quo corpus suum repraesentat. Ibid. l. 1. c. 14. Et contra judaeos. cap. 10.   makes Bread the Subject of the proposition, this is my Body, now the Accidents and shape of Bread, are not Bread.  
In a word Tertullian showeth that Christ called Bread his Body, in saying, this is my Body, as the Prophet jeremy 
e [Venite mittamus lignum in ●●nem ejus. jerem. 11.] Vtique in corpus; sic enim De●s in Ev●ngelio, panem corpus suum appellan●● ut & hin●●am eum intellig●● corpori● sui figuram p●ni dedisse, cujus retr● co●poris in panem Prophetes figuravit. Tertul. l. 3. advers. Martion. c. 19  called the body bread, in saying, Let us put wood upon his bread, meaning his Body; showing them both to be spoken equally in a figurative sense. For although Tertullian say, that the Bread of the Old Testament was a figure of Christ's body, yet he denyeth not thereby that it is so in the new.  
The truth is, Tertullia's exposition is so full for us, that Gregory Valence rejects it. 
f Greg. de Valent. in Sum. Aquin. tom. 4 disp. 6. the praes●nti● Ch●isti in Euchar. pag. 968. Paris. 1609.   
Cyprian in the third Epistle of his second book, saith, 
g Vinum fuit, quod sanguinem suum dix●t.  We find that the Cup which the Lord offered was mixed, and that that which he called blood was wine. So that if we ask Cyprian, what consecrated thing it was which Christ had in his hands, and gave to his Disciples? he answereth, 
h 
D●dit Dominus noster in mens● proprijs manibus panem & vinum; in cruse verò manibus militum corpus tradidit vulner●●dum.  
— Vt significantly & significata eisdem vocabuli● consecre●tur. Cypr. lib. de V●ctione num. 7.   it was bread and wine; and not absolutely that, which he gave up to be crucified on the Cross by Soldiers, (namely) his body and blood; if again we demand of Cyprian, why Christ called the bread which he had in his hand, his body? he readily answereth, saying, the things signifying (or signs) are called by the same names, whereby the things signified are termed.  

Objection.  
Cyprian saith, that this bread is changed, not in shape, but in nature, naturâ mutatus, 
i Panis iste non effigy, sed naturâ mutatus omnipotentia verbi factus est caro. Cypr. de coena. Dom. nu. 6.  and by the omnipotency of God, is made flesh: now omnipotency is not required to make a thing to be a sign significant. 
k Omnipotentia non requiritur, ad faciendum ut res aliquid significet. Bel. lib. 2. de Euch c. 14.    

Answer.  
Bellarmine saith, 
l 
Bellar de scriptor. Eccles. & lib. 2 de Euch●r. cap. 9 § extet.  
Et de Confirmat. lib. 2. cap. 6.   Cyprian was not the Author of the book De Coenâ Domini; and he saith well, for these Sermons are extant 
m Doctor james of the Bastardy of Fathers. Part. 1. pag. 12.  in All-Soules College Library in Oxford, in an ancient Manuscript under the name of Arnoldus Bonavillacensis, and Dedicated not to Pope Cornelius, (as these are pretended) but to Adrian the fourth, about the year 1150, the same time that Saint Bernard lived, and wrote an Epistle to this Arnoldus.  
But to let it pass for Cyprians; it follows not, the bread is changed in nature, therefore it is Transubstantiated; for every change of nature is not a change of substance; nature implies qualities and properties, as well as substances: an evil man changeth his nature when he becomes a good man, yet is he not Transubstantiated; bread is changed when of common it becomes consecrated to an holy use, and office, and omnipotency is required to make the dead and corruptible elements, a bit of bread, and a draught of wine, not only significative, but truly exhibitive seals of the body and blood of Christ; and to elevate them so high as to be channels and effectual instruments of Grace.  
Besides, the Author by the words naturâ mutatus, changed in nature, understood not a coporall change; for in the same sentence he declareth himself, 
n Et sicut in person● Christi, humanitas videbatur, & la●ebat divinitas; it● Sacramento visibili, ineffabiliter divina se insudit essentia. Cypr. de coena Dom. num. 6.  by the example of Christ's humanity, which being personally united to the Deity, is changed, but not so as that it looseth his natural form and substance.    

Origen against Christ's Body going into the Draught.  
To proceed, Origen saith, 
o Ille cibus quì sanc●i●icatur per verbum Dei, perque objecrationem, juxta id quod habet materiale, in ventrem abit, & in se●essum ●ij citur; caeterùm juxta precationem qu● illi a●cessit pro port●o●e ●idei fit ut●lis: nec materia panis, sed super illum dictus sermo est, qui prodest non indignè domino comeden●i illum: & haec quidem de Typico Symbolicoque corpore. Origen. in Math. cap. 15.  that meat which is Sanctified by God's Word and Prayer, as touching the material part thereof, goeth into the belly, and is voided into the draught; but as touching the Prayer which is added according to the portion of Faith, it is made profitable; neither is it the matter of bread, but the word spoken over it, which profits him that doth not unworthily eat thereof; and these things I speak of the Typical and Symbolical body. Here we see Origen disting●isheth between the Spiritual bread, which is the real body of Christ, and the bread Sacramental, saying, that not that body, but this bread goeth into the draught, or siege, which no sanctified heart can conceive of Christ's body.  
Now whereas Bellarmine saith, 
p Bellar. lib. 2 the Euc●ar. cap. 8. §. ad tertium.  that the Accidents only are called by Origen the material part: we answer that it was never heard that mere Accidents were called (which are origen's words in this place) either meats or materials.  
The truth is, this place of origen's touching the typical and symbolical body, is so clear for us, that Sixtus Senensis grows jealous of it: to speak my mind freely (saith he 
q Ego, ut liberè pronun●em sen●entiam meam su●picor hunc locum suisse a● hereticis depravatum. Sixt. Sen. Biblioth● Sanct. lib. 6. Annot 66. ) I suspect this place to be corrupted by Heretics.   

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
Concerning Images, Origen replieth thus to Celsus the Philosopher; that 
r 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Origen. contr. Celsum. li. 7. pag. 3●6.  it is not a thing possible that one should know God, and Pray to Images; and that Christians did 
s 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. ibid. pag. 387.  not esteem these to be Divine Images, who used not to describe any figure of God, who was invisible and without all bodily shape, nor could endure to worship God with any such kind of service as this was. In like manner, when the Gentiles demanded of the ancient Christians, 
t Cur nullas aras habent, te●pl● nulla, nulla nota simulachre? Min. Felix in Octavio. pag. 27.  why they had no known Images? Minutius Felix returns them for answer again: 
u Quod enim simulach●um Deo singam, ●ùm si recte existimes, sit Dei homo ipse simulachrum. Id. ibid. pag. 104.  What Image shall I make to God, when man himself, if thou rightly judge, is God's Image? and again, 
x Cruces c●iam n●● colimus, n●● optamus. Id. ibid. pag. 97.  we neither worship, nor wish for Crosses: these holy Images which vain men serve, want all sense, because they are earth. Now who is there that understandeth not, that it is un●it for an upright creature to be bowed down, that he may worship the earth? which for this cause is put under our feet, that it may be trodden upon, not worshipped by us, 
y Ipsae imagines sacrae, quibus vaniss●●● homines serulunt, omni sensu c●●●ent, quoniam terra sunt: quis autem non intelligat, nesas esse rectum animal curvari, ut ad ret t●●ram? quae id●irco pedibus nostris ●ubjecta est, ut cal●and● nobis, non adoranda ●it. L●ctan● Divinar. justit. li. 2. cap. 18.  wherefore there is no doubt, that there is no Religion, wheresoever there is an Image: 
z Quare non est dubium, quin Religio nulla sit, ubi●u●que simulachrum est. Id. ibid. cap 19  thus far Lactantius.  
Tertullian stood not only against adoration of Images, but al●o against the very making of them; 
a Idolum t●m sieri qu●m coli Deus prohibet. Tertul. de Idolatry c●p. 4. & 5.  as formerly Clemens Alexandrinus had done.  
Concerning Saintly Invocation, Origen saith, 
b 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Origen lib. 8. cont. Celsum. pag. 432.  we must endeavour to please God alone, and labour to have him Propitious unto us, procuring his goodwill with godl●nesse, and all kind of virtue. And if Celsus will yet have us to procure the goodwill of any others, after him that is God over all, let him consider, that as when the body is moved, the motion of the shadow thereof doth follow it; so in like manner, having God favourable unto us, who is over all, it followeth that we shall have all his friends, both Angels, and Souls, and Spirits loving unto us. And whereas Celsus had said of the Angels, that they belong to God, and in that respect, we are to pray unto them, that they may be favourable to us; to this Origen answereth in this manner: 
c 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. ibid. pag. 406.  Away with Celsus his Council, saying, that we must pray to Angels; for we must pray to him alone who is God over all, and we must pray to the Word of God, his only begotten, and the first borne of all creatures, and we must entreat him, that he as high Priest would present our Prayer (when it comes to him) unto his God, and our God.  

Objection.  
jesuit Fisher saith, 
d M. Fisher's rejoinder to D. Whites Reply.  that Origen in his writings upon job 
e O bea●e job ora pro nobis miseris. Orig. l 2. in job  and Numbers 
f Quis dubitat quod sanctiqueque orationibus nos ●●vent. Orig. in cap. 31. num.  taught Invocation of Saints.   

Answer.  
Bellarmine saith, 
g Bellar. de Scriptor. Eccles in Origen.  that Origen was not the author of those books upon job: for therein is mention made of the Homousians (so the Arrians called the Orthodox believers). Now the Arrians rose not till after origen's time.  
Origen indeed upon the Canticles saith, 
h Si dix●ris sanctos pro nobis orare non erit inconveniens. Orig. in Cant. cap 2.  it is not inconvenient to say, that the Saints pray for us; and in his Homily upon josuah, he ●aith, 
i Ego fic arbitror, quod om●es illi qui do●mie●uat ante no● P●tres, pugnent nub●seum, & adj●●e●t nos oratio●ib●s sui●. Origen. in jos. Homil 16.  I do think thus, that all those Fathers who are departed this life before us, do assist us with their Prayers: and in another place he saith, 
k ●●m 〈◊〉 si etiam extrà corpus positi sancti, agunt aliqu●●, & laborant pro nobis, ha●●●atur hoc quoque inter ●●●ulta Dei, nec ●ha● 〈◊〉 committenda m● st●ria. I●. lib 2 in epist. ad Rome cap 2.  if the Saints that have left the body, and be with Christ, do any thing, and labour for us; let this also remain among the hidden things of God, and mysteries that are not to be committed unto writing. Now we yield that the Saints pray for us in general; yet hence it followeth not, that we should direct our prayers to them. Besides, origen's, if, and, as I suppose, and it is not inconvenient to say so; these are but ●aint affirmations, showing that he speaketh doubtfully, as on not fully resolved that it was so, and in conclusion determineth, si laborant pro nobis, if in particular, upon particulars, they do labour for us, yet it is amongst God's secrets, and a mystery not to be committed to writing.   

Object.  
It appeareth by Saint Cyprian, 
l Si quis nostr●m prier d●vin● dignationis ce●eritate pracesseri●, p●rseveret ●pud cum nustra dilectio pro fratribus & sororibus ●pud m●●ericord●●m Patris non ce●●et oratio Cypr. lib. 1. epist. 1. vel (ut in alij● edit.) epist. 57 ad Cornel. & de Discipl. & ha●itu. virg.  that the Faithful used to covenant in their life time, that whether of them went to heaven before the other, he should pray for his surviving friend.   

Answer.  
Concerning Faint Cyprians conceit, that the Saints after death remembered their old friends here, as having taken fresh and particular notice of their several states, votes, and necessities; it followeth not thence, that other Saints unacquainted with our particular desires and exigents, do in particular, and by their merits, intercede for the living; and though they should make suit on our behalf, yet we have no warrant to pray to them.  
To close up this point of Prayer to Saints, Tertullian, Cyprian, Gregory Nyssen, with others, have written set Treatises the Oratione, of Prayer, and therein they deliver nothing touching this Saintly invocation: but teach us to regulate 
m Alitèr orare quam Christus do●uit, non ignorantia sola est, sed & culpa. Cypr. de Orat. Dom.  all our Prayers according to that perfect pattern prescribed by our great Master; wherein we are required to direct our Petitions unto our Father which is in heaven: Math 6.9. Luk. 11.2.  
These things (saith Tertullian 
n Haec ab alio orare non poss●m quam à quo me sci● consecuturum, quoniam & ipse est qui solus praestat, et ego sum cui impetrare debetur, famulus e●us, qui eum solùm observo. Tertul. in Apologet. cap. 30.  in his Apology for the Christians in his time) I may not pray for from any other, but from him of whom I know I shall obtain them; because both it is he who is alone able to give, and I am he unto whom it appertains to obtain that which is requested, being his servant, qui eum solum observo, who observe him alone.    

Of Faith and Merit.  
Origen saith 
o Dicit sufficere solius Fidei justificationem. Orig. lib. 3. in epist. ad Rom. c. 3.  that Faith only sufficeth to justification; and concerning Merit, the same Origen saith, 
p Vix mihi suadeo, quòd possit ullum opus esse, quod●x debito remunerationem Dei depos●at; cum c●iam hoc ipsum, quòd agere aliquid possumus, vel cogitare, vel proloqui, ipsius d●no● & largitate ●aciamus. Orig. lib. 4. in epist. ad Rom. c. 4.  I ca●●ardly he persuaded, that there can be any work which may require the reward of God by way of debt, seeing this very thing itself, that we can do, or think, or speak any thing, we do it by his gift and largesse.  

Objection.  
Did not Origen and Tertullian hold Purgatory?   

Answer.  
Bellarmine indeed allegeth 
q Bellar● lib. de purgat. cap. 4. §. tertio.  Tertullia's Book de Animâ for proof of Purgatory; but it is well known 
r Hoc etiam Paraclet commendavit. Tertul. de Animâ. cap ult.  that he was led with the spirit of Montanus the Heretic when he wrote that book: and for Origen, Bellarmine 
s Non desue●unt, qui purga●orium adeò proba●riot, ut nullas poenas nis● pu●gato●●as post have vit● agnoverin●, it a O●●genes sensit, qui & Daemonibus t●ndem salutem polli●●tur. Bellar. ibid. c 2. § Por●●.  confesseth, he was one of those who approved so much of Purgatory, that he acknowledged no other pains after this life, but Purgatory penalties only; so that with him Hell and Purgatory were all one.   

Objection.  
In Saint Cyprians time, 
t Cyprian lib 3 ●p●. 15. Tertulli●n de Pudicit●● cap 22.  the Martyrs entreated the Church for mitigation of penance imposed upon some offenders; so that the satisfactions and suffering of Martyrs were communicated to others, and thereby their indulgence or pardon was procured.   

Answer.  
In those times of persecution, when many weak ones fell away from the open profession of the truth, and sacrificed to Idols, the Church sought by all means to honour Martyrdom, and encourage Christians thereunto; so that upon the request of imprisoned Confessors, and designed Martyrs, the Bishops were wont to release some time the Canonical censure enjoined by the Church: but these Martyrs did not hereby think that they had made satisfaction for the temporal pain of Sin. Besides, this was spoken of living Martyrs, and not of Martyr's defunct; and of releasing censures, & forgiving faults in this world only, & not in Purgatory.     

PA.  
Did not Cyprian hold Saint Peter's Supremacy?   

PRO.  
He might do much with Pamelius his help, who hath taken the Marginal gloss, Petro primatus datur, and put 
u 
〈…〉 Father's. 〈…〉 M. Be●el in his 〈◊〉 to M. Wadsworth p●g. 101.  
B. Bilson. Difference of sub●●ction and rebellion. 〈◊〉 part pag. 89.   it into Cyprians text; whereas Cyprian in the selfsame Treatise saith, 
x Hoc erant ut●que & 〈◊〉 Ap●●●oli, quod ●uit 〈◊〉, par● consortio 〈◊〉 & hon●ris & po 〈…〉— sed exordium ab 〈…〉. Cypr. de 〈◊〉 Eccl●siae.  the rest of the Apostles were even the same that Peter was, being endued with the like fellowship of honour and power. Cyprian indeed reverenced the Sea of Rome, yet would he have her keep within h●r bounds, as appears in the case of Fortu●atus, and others; for so it was, Cyprian having censured them, and fearing lest they should fly to Rome, and there seek favour and protection from that Sea, and so work distraction between Rome and Carthage, makes a decree to prevent Appeals to other places, or claims of other Bishops: and this Synodall Epistle is sent to Pope Corn●lius, persuading him not to admit of their complaints: Seeing that it is decreed of us all (saith S. Cyprian) 
N●m ●um s●●tutum sit 〈…〉, & ●q●ū sit pa●iter a● jus●um, ut 〈…〉 causa illic 〈◊〉 ubi est crim●n 〈…〉 non 〈…〉 agere illic 〈◊〉 ●uam, ubi & 〈…〉 sui 〈◊〉 peasant; ●●si si pau●is d●speratis & 〈◊〉 mino● vi●●tur ●sse 〈◊〉 ●pi●●oporum in 〈◊〉 constitutorum● qui 〈◊〉 de illig judicav●runt. C●p●ian lib 1 e●ist. 3. in 〈…〉 apost. 55.  that it is meet and right that every man's cause be heard where the crime is committed; and every Pastor hath committed unto him a portion of the Flock (of Christ) which he is to govern, and whereof he is to give an account unto God; and they who are under our government ought not to gad and wander, but they should plead their cause there, where both Accusers and Witnesses may be had; except some few desperate and naughty fellows think the authority of the Bishops of Africa, which have already judged and condemned them to be l●sse, meaning less than that of Cornelius, to whom they fled.  
Here we find opposition made to the Sea of Rome by that Catholic 
z Cyprianus semper est habitus in nume●o C●t●olic●rum. B●lla●min. lib. 2. de Council cap 5 § Altera  Martyr Cyprian and others, even in the weighty point of Appeals: for so Bellarmine 
a Appellatio e●t c●r●iss●mum A●gumētum Princip●tus. Bellarm. lib. 2. de Rome Pont. cap. 21.  makes appealing to Rome, and not appealing from thence, a main● proof of the Pope's Supremacy.  
Now to close up this age, and to look a little homeward; all this time the Christian Religion flourished quietly in Britain, till in Dioclesian's days (which made up the tenth persecution) their Churches were demolished, their Bible's burnt, their Priests and their flock murdered: for now was Saint Alban beheaded 
b Math. Westmon. ad annum 303.  at the City Verulam, now called after him Faint Albans, of whom Fortunatus Presbyter an ancient Poet saith: 
Albanum egregium foecunda Britannia profert.  
Fruitful Britain bringeth forth,  
Alban, a Martyr of great worth.   
He was the first that in Britain suffered death for Christ his sake; whereupon he is called our Stephen, and the Proto-martyr of Britain. In like sort his Teacher, or Instructor Amphibalus 
c Math. Westmon. Ibid.  was cruelly Martyred at the same place, being whipped about a stake, whereat his entrailes were tied, and thus winding his bowels out of his body, was at last stoned to death; so also was julius and Aaron 
d Master Speeds History lib. 6. cap. 9 sect. 19  Martyred at Leicester; and in Lichfield so many, that the place became another Colgatha, or field of dead corpse, for which cause the City doth bear a field charged with many Martyrs diversely tortured, they bear it for their Seal of Arms, even unto this day, as Master Camden hath recorded. Now these Martyrs they suffered for that truth which we at this day hold; and not for Popish Tenets, which then were not in being.  
We have now Surveyed the Father's Faith, and practice of the Church, for the first three hundred years next after Christ; and by this particular, (as Hercules whole body was measured by the breadth of his foot) the Reader may proportion what were the Church's Creed, and her Agends generally and constantly taught and practised in these times, and I doubt not but he shall find, that for substance of Religion they held as we do, and not as the modern Papists do; so that in comparison of Original, and Primitive Antiquity, Popery is but novelty, and this hath been already shown, when as we drew the Character of the three first Centuries. I will now only give instance in the point of Indulgences, and show, that in these best and ancient times, there were no such Pope's pardons, as afterwards were marted. For in latter times we find it recorded in the Salisbury Primer, 
e Horae B. virgins Mar●● ad Sarisburtensis ●cclesiae ritum ●um Orationibus & Indulgentijs Paris. 1529.  that john the two and twentieth, for the mumbling over of some short Prayers, granted a Pardon of no less, than a million of years. Besides, these three Prayers be written in the Chapel of the holy Cross in Rome, who that devoutly say them, they shall obtain ten hundred thousand years of Pardon for deadly sin, granted by our Holy Father, john the two and twentieth Pope of Rome: and of another Prayer to be said as one goes thorough a Churchyard, the same book saith, as followeth: 
f joannes Papa 12. concessit omnibus ●icenti●us orationem sequentem transe●●d● per C●emeterium tot ann●●um Indulgenti●s, quot fue●unt ibi corpora inhumata ● cons●itutione ipsius Coemeterij. Id. quò supra.  Pope john the twelfth granted to all that shall say the Prayer following, as they pass by any Churchyard, as many years of Indulgences, as there have been bodies there buried since the Consecration of the said Churchyard.  
In the same book, there is power given to one little prayer beginning with O bone jesus, to change the pains of Hell into Purgatory, and after that again, the pains of Purgatory, into the joys of Heaven. This Prayer is written in a Table that hanged at Rome, in Saint Peter's Church, near to the high Altar, there, as our holy Father the Pope is wont to say Mass; and who so that devoutly with a contrite heart daily say this Orison, if he be that day in the state of eternal damnation, than his eternal pain shall be changed him into temporal pain of Purgatory, and if he have deserved the pain of Purgatory, it shall be forgotten and forgiven, through the infinite mercy of God. Now sure I think that Antiquity cannot parallel such precedents as these.    

THE FOURTH CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 400. to 500  

PAPIST.  
WHat say you to this fourth Age?   

PROTESTANT.  
This was a learned Age, 
a Bucolceri Chronolog. hoc tempore fulserunt in Ecclesia Dei clarissima lumina. ad Ann. 365.  for now there lived Optatus Bishop of Milevis in Africa, and in Asia there lived Epiphanius Bishop of Cyprus, Cyril Bishop of Jerusalem, Macharius the Monk, Basil the great; the Christian Demosthenes, as Erasmus calls him 
b Dan Tossanus in Synopsi de Legendis Patribus. cap. 3. , Gregory Nazianzen surnamed the Divine, and Grigory Nyssen brother to Saint Basil, these three were equal in time, dear friends, and of near alliance; now also lived the Hammer of the Arrian Heretics Athanasius the great, Bishop of Alexandria, great indeed for his learning, for his virtue, for his labour, for his suffering, when almost the whole world was set against him; but above all great for his Creed, the Athanasian Creed. He suffered much trouble for the truth, but God upheld him, so that he died in peace, full of days, after he had governed the Church of Al●xandria six and forty years: Nazianzen compared 
c Percuti●●tibus Alamas ●ffi●itur. Nazianzen. orat. 31. in laudem Athanasij.  him in time of adversity to the Adamant, for that no trouble could break him; and in time of prosperity to the Loadstone, for that he alured the hearts of men, more intractable than Iron, to embrace the Truth of God.  
In Europe there lived Hilary Bishop of Poitiers in France, and Ambrose Bishop or Milan; Ambrose was a man of noble parentage, under the Emperor Valentinian he was Governor of Liguria, he was chosen from a secular ●udge to be Bishop of Milan, and was fain to be christened before he could be consecrated, he was zealous and resolute, he sharply reproved Theodosius for the slaughter of the innocent people of Thessalonica, he was grievously troubled by the Lady justina, mother to Valentinian the second, he said to his friends that were about him at his death, 
d P●ssid. de vità Augustini. cap. 27. tom. 1. Non sic vixi, ut me pudeat inter vos vivere, nec mori ●imeo qu●a bonum habemus Dominum Et Buchol●er. in Chronol. ad Ann. 398.  I have not so lived, that I am ashamed to live longer, nor yet fear I death, because I have a good Lord.  

Of the Scriptures sufficiency.  
Athanasius saith, 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Athan. orat 1. cont. Gent. tom. 1. sufficiunt per se, vertit Petr. Nann●us.  the holy Scriptures given by inspiration of God, are of themselves sufficient to the discovery of truth; now if they be (as the word signifieth) all-sufficient to instruction, then must they needs be all sufficient to all instruction in the truth intended, and not only sufficient for this or that point, as Bellarmine would have it 
f L●quitur non de omnibus d●gm●●●bus, sed sol●m ●e duobus. B●ll●r de verbo Dei non script●. li. 4. cap. 11. §. Profert.  Saint Hilary commendeth 
g Verè te D. Constanti Imperator admiror, ●idem tantùm 〈◊〉 lù●● ea quae scripta sunt deside antem. Hilar. de ●rinit. lib. 2.  the Emperor Constantius, for desiring the Faith to be ordered only according to those things that be written: th● same Hilary 
h Su●●●●●ebat quul● crede●tibus Dei se●m●● quid enim in eolem Sacramento saluris hum●n●e non contin●tu●? aut quid sit quod reliquum est, aut obs●rii? pl●na sunt omnia ut à ple●● & persecto ●acta. Id. ibid. lib. 2.  assures us that in his days, the word of God did suffice the believers; yea, what is there saith he, concerning man's salvation, that is not contained in the word of the Evangelist? what wants it, what obscurity is there in it? all things there are full and perfect.  
Saint Basil saith, 
i 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Basil. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. de side, Inter Ascetica, ●ive exercitamenta Monach. tom. 2.  it is a manifest falling from the Faith, and an argument of arrogancy, either to reject any point of those things that are written, or to bring in any of those things that are not written.  
Gregory Nyssen layeth this for a ground, 
k 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Greg Nyssen. de Animâ & Resurrect. to. 2. edit. Gr. & Lat. pag. 639.  which no man should contradict; that in that only the truth must be acknowledged, wherein the seal of the Scripture testimony is to be seen.  
The same Father in an oration of his, calleth the Scripture, 
l 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. tom. 2. deijs qui adeunt Hierosol.  an even, straight, and inflexible Rule; neither mentioneth he any more rules but this on●; and adding the word ipsa to the Rule, he delareth the same to be an adequate, and only Rule.   

Of the Scripture Canon.  
The Council of Laodicea saith, 
m Quae autem opor●eat legi, & in authoritatem recipi haec sunt; Genesis &c Not mentioning the Controversed Books. Condil. Laod. Can. 59 Caranz. in Sum. Council.  we ought to read only the books of the Old and New Testament; yea the same Council recites only those Canonical books of Scripture which we allow, and the Canons of this Council though a provincial Council, are confirmed by the sixth general Council in Trullo: now if it be replied, the Laodicean Council excludes the Apocrypha, the Carthaginian Council receives them, and both these were confirmed in the sixth general Council, held in the Palace called Trullo, and how can this stand together? the matter is thus reconciled; the Laodicean speaks of the Canon of Faith, the Carthaginian of the Canon of good manners; to both which the sixth Council subscribed in that sense, and we to it.  
To proceed, Hilary tells us; 
n In viginti duos libros, Lex Testamenti ve●●●is deputet●r, u● cum literarum numero conveni●ent. Hil. in Prologue. in Psalm. explanat.  the Law of the Old Testament is contained in two and twenty books, according to the number of the Hebrew letters; and Athanasius saith the same, and as touching the Apocryphal books, as namely, the book of Wisdom, Maccabees, and the rest, he saith; 
o Praeter i●●os au●em ●unt ad●uc alij e●u●dem veteris Instrumenti Libri, qui non sunt Canonici, qui Catechumenis ta●tum legantur, Sapientia Sal●m●nis, etc. Athanas. in Synopsi.  Libri non sunt Canonici; they are read only to the Caetechumen, (or novices in Religion) but are not Canonical.  
Epiphanius after he had reckoned up the Canon of two and twenty books, censureth the books of Wisdom and Ecclesias●icus in these words; 
o 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Epipha●. in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. de pond. & men's  they are fit and profitable, but not reckoned amongst those books which are received by our Church; and therefore were neither laid up with Aaron, nor in the Ark of the New Testament.  
Ruffinus, in his explanation of the Creed, which is found among Saint Cyprians works, and so attributed to him, setteth down the Catalogue, containing all those books which we admit, secluding all those that are now in question; we must know (saith he) 
q Al●j ●●bri sunt qui ●●n sunt Canonic●, sed E●clesiastici à maso●ib●s appellati sunt, ut Sapientia Salomonis● & alia Sap. quae d●citur filij Syrach, ejusdem ord●n●● est Liber T●bi●, & judith & Maccab eorum Libri— quae omnia legi quidem in Ecclesijs volue●unt, non t●men pro●erri ad authoritatem ex his Fidei con●●rm●nd●m. Ru●●in. sive Cyp●●an. in explic. Symboli. pag. 189 par. 1580.  that there be also other books, which are not Canonical, but are called of our Ancestors, Ecclesiastical, as is the Wisdom of Solomon, Ecclesiasticus, Tobias, judith, and the books of Maccabees; all which they will indeed have to be read in the Church, but not to be alleged for Confirmation of Faith. To this testimony of Ruffian, Canus a Popish writer thus replieth: 
r Ru●●inus (pa●e Le●tor●●●ictum sit) ●a●rum trad●ti●n●s igno●avit Canus Loc. 〈◊〉 l 2. c. 11.  although Ruffin did affirm, that the books of Maccabees were to be rejected by the tradition of the Fathers, yet by the Readers leave, he was ignorant of that Tradition; as if Canus a late writer, were better skilled in the Primitive tradition than Ruffinus, or Cyprian.  
Gregory Nazianzen nameth 
s 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Greg N●z. in edit. G●ae●o-lat to. 2. numb 33●  all the books that we admit, save that he omitteth the book of Hester, being mispersuaded of the whole, by reason of those Apocryphal additions to it.  
Now Bellarmine would shift off such testimonies as these, by saying; 
t S●i●bat rem non fu●sse a 〈◊〉 a G●●●rali Con●il●o d●s●●●tam. Bel●●r. de verbo Dei. li. 1 cap. 10.  it was no fault in them to reject these book●s, because no general Council in their days had decreed any thing touching them. But we ask how it came to pass, that so many Catholic Divines after this pretended decree of their Canon rejected these books, as others had done before; for some in every Age rejected th●m.   

Of Communion under both; and number of Sacraments.  
Gregory Nazianzen saith of his sister Gorgonia, in this manner: 
u 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Gr. Nazianz. orat. 11. in laud. Gorgon.  
— ac ●icubi quidpiam signorum preciosi corporis aut sanguinla manus condiderat. Interpret jac. Billio. tom. 2. orat 35 edit. Lat.   if her hand had laid up any portion of the types or tokens of the precious body, and of the blood: he saith, that his sister after she had communicated, she laid up some part of the Sacrament, of the body and blood of Christ, now as she kept the consecrated bread in a cloth, so she might carry the wine in a vial; howsoever this religious woman received in both kinds.  
The same Nazianzen bids, 
x 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Greg. Nazian. orat. 40. in sanctum Baptism. tom. 1.  reverence the Lords Table to which thou hast access, the bread whereof thou hast been partaker, the cup which thou hast communicated, being initiated in the passions of Christ.  
Athanasius, being accused for breaking a Chalice, writeth thus; 
y 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  
High enim usus est Culicid & p●aeter cum alius nullus; eoque solo vos legitimo ritu propinatis populo. Athan. Apolog. 2. contra Arrianos. to. 2. p●g. 385. Petro Nannio Interpret.   What manner of Cup? or when? or where was it broken? in every house there are many Pots, any of which if a man break, he committeth not sacrilege; but if any man willingly break the sacred Chalice, he commits sacrilege; but that Chalice is no where, but where there is a lawful Bishop: This is the use destined to that Chalice, none other; wherein you, according to institution, do drink unto, and before the Laity. This was the custom in Athanasius his days.  
Saint Ambrose speaks to a great secular Prince Theodosius in this sort; 
z 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Theodoret● hist. eccles. lib 5. cap. 18.— & Ambros. in orat. ad Theodos.  How dare you lift up to him those hands, from which the blood yet droppeth? will you receive with them the sacred body of our Lord? or how will you put in your mouth his precious blood, who in the commanding fury of your wrath have wickedly shed so much innocent blood? The same Saint Ambrose, in his 
d Ambros. de Sacramentis● tom 4. & de iis qui Mysterijs initian●●r.  Treatise that he wholly set apart for the laying forth of the Doctrine of the Sacraments, specifyeth not any other, than either those two of ours, Baptism, and the Lords Supper; and yet we have of his (as they are divided) six● books de Sacramentis, of the Sacraments. And so I come to treat of the Sacrament Of the Eucharist.    

PA.  
You have produced Hilary and Cyril of Jerusalem, on your side, whereas they make for us in the point of the Sacrament; Saint H●larie saith, nos verè verbum carnem cibo Dominico sumimus; Hil. l. 8. de Trinitate.   

PRO.  
Hilaries testimony was much urged by Mr. Musket Priest, and was notably cleared by Doctor Featly, in the second day's disputation; now to the place alleged he saith, The Word truly became Flesh, truly, to wit, by Faith and Spiritually, not with the mouth, and carnally.  

Objection.  
These words of Hilary, Sub Sacramento communicandae carnis, and the like following, nos verè sub mysterio carnem corporis sui sumimus, we truly receive the Flesh of his body under a mystery, prove the real presence of Christ's flesh under the forms of bread and wine.   

Answer.  
Saint Hilary, by the words, [Sub Sacramento, and sub mysterio carnem sumimus], meaneth nothing, but that in a mystery, or Sacramentally, we eat the true flesh of the Son of God; sub mysterio is no more than in mysterio, that is, mystically, under a similitude, in a similitude, or after a resemblance.   

Object.  
St. Hilary saith, in the book alleged [de veritate carnis & sanguinis non est relictus ambigendi locus] of the truth of Christ's flesh and blood there is no place left for doubting.   

Answer.  
Neither do we doubt of the truth of Christ's body and blood, but firmly believe the doctrine of the true Incarnation of Christ.   

Objection.  
Hilary saith [in nobis carnalibus manentem per carnem Christum habemus] we men consisting of flesh and blood have Christ remaining in us by his fl●sh.   

Answer.  
So we have by reason of our mystical union with Christ's flesh, and not by any corporal transubstantiation of our flesh into Christ. The same Hilary saith [nos in eo naturaliter inessemus, ipso in nobis naturaliter permanente] Christ is naturally in us, and we in him, but we are not in him naturally or carnally by any transubstantiation, therefore neither is he so in us; these terms then of Hila●ies, [permanent●m in nobis carnaliter silium] the son remaining in us carnally, note only a greater and more real union, than barely by consent or concord of will, such as the Arrians acknowledged only betwixt the Father and the Son, denying an unity of nature, purposely to avoid that text, I and the Father are one● Hilary speaking of this near union, calleth it the mystery of a true and natural union, [mysterium verae ac naturalis unitatis] and so indeed it is, in respect of Christ's inseparable union which he hath with us by his incarnation, by which he is become flesh of our ●lesh, and bone of our bone; and in respect of our mystical union with him and his body, whereby we become members of Christ's body, and quickened by his spirit.   

Object.  
Saint Cyril in his fourth Catechism saith, He that in the marriage of Cana changed water into wine, by his only will, is not he worthy that we believe him that he hath changed wine into his blood?   

Answer.  
S. Cyrils place maintaineth not Popish transubstantiation; for in this, the shapes and accidents remain, and the material substance is corrupted; but in our Saviour's miracle in the second of Saint john, the shapes, accidents, and form were changed, and the common material substance remained, john 2.9.   

Object.  
Cyril saith it is not simple bread and wine, it is not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. ibid.   

Answer.  
He showeth his meaning to be this, namely, that the consecrated bread, is not common, ordinary, and mere natural bread; but sanctified, elevated, and changed to supernatural use and operation. And so I proceed.   

The Elements called Antitypes after Consecration.  
The Fathers of this age, treating of the Sacramental Signs, call them Similitudes, correspondent types or figures of the body and blood of Christ; the figure of the body and blood of the Lord jesus, saith 
b Similitudinem p●etiosi sanguinis bibis. Ambr. de Sacram. lib. 4. cap. 4.  Ambrose: and Nazianzen speaks (as we have heard) of his sisters laying up some portion of the types or tokens of Christ's precious body and blood; and again, 
c 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Greg. Nazian. Apolog. orat. 1. tom. 1 quomodo illud magno●um mysteriorum Antitypum ipsi offerre a●derem?  how dared I offer unto him the type of so great a mystery; in l●ke sort Cyril of Hierus●lem calls 
d Cyril. Hierosol. 5. Cate●he●. Mystag.  them types and antitypes; and they call the Symbols after Consecration [Antitypes.] Now that which is a figure, similitude, and representation of a thing, is not properly the same.    

PA.  
It followeth not 
e Rhemists' Annot. on Luke 22. Sect. 7 on Heb. 1. sect. 1 & the rejoinder to D. Whites Reply the 6. point.  the Eucharist is termed the figure of Christ's natural body, therefore it is not substantially and properly his body. The figure of a thing may be the same with the thing figured. Christ jesus is a figure of his Father's substance, [Hebr. 1.3.] and yet is the same substantially with the Father, john 10.30.   

PRO.  
There is such opposition of Relatives, as that the sign and the thing signified cannot be the same in that very respect and point, wherein they are opposite: for the instance brought, it followeth thus; the son is the character of his Father's substance, ergo the Son is not the Father, though of the same substance, nor is the Father the Son: so must the opposition of necessity hold; the Sacrament is the figure, sign, and representation of Christ's body, ergo it is not the body of Christ, but sacramentally, and figuratively.  
In a word; you say, that Christ is a Character, and figure of his Father, and yet of the same substance; but to have spoken home to the matter in question, you should have said, that Christ a figure of the Father's person, is yet the same person that the Father; which is utterly false.  
To proceed, Saint Ambrose saith; 
f Si ergo tanta vis est in sermone Domini, ut inciperent esse quae non erant quantò magis operator●us est, ut sint quae ●rant, & to aliud commut●ntur. Ambr. de sacram. l 4 ca 4.  if th●re be such virtue in the words of our Lord, to make those things that were not, to begin to be; how much more powerful is his word, that they remain the same they were, and yet be changed into another thing? he holdeth the bread and wine in the Lord's Supper to remain, to be the same tha● they were; therefore they are not changed in substance, for than they should not be the same they were; yet he saith they are changed into other, to wit, not in substance but in quality, use, and signification; for so he saith, 
g Ante benedictionem alta species nominatur post consecrationem corpus significatur. Ambr. lib. de iis qui mysterijs initian●●r.  before the blessing of the heavenly words another kind is named; after the Consecration, the body of Christ is signified. Now if by the consecrated bread in the Eucharist the body be signified, then is not bread essentially the body.   

PA.  
Saint Ambrose in the ninth chapter of such as are newly instructed in the mysteries saith; 
h Ambr. de iis qui myster. initiantur. cap 9  Moses his word changed the water of Egypt into blood; if so great was the benediction of man, what may we think of divine Consecration where the very words of our Saviour work: he saith also, 
i Quia benedictione etiam Natura ipsa mutatur. Id. ibid.  that by benediction or consecration the nature of the Elements in the Lord's Supper is changed.   

PRO.  
Among the six or seven examples brought by Saint Ambrose, only two are substantial, and the rest accidental, for in the place alleged, he addeth also these examples; that Moses divided the Red Sea, that jordan turned his cou●se, that the bitter waters of Mara were made sweet; in all which works of God there was no Transubstantiation; for the waters and the Red Sea were the same in nature and substance, as they were before; so that by these examples it appeareth, that notwithstanding Saint Ambrose say, the nature is changed, yet he meant a change in quality only, and not in substance. And such a change there is in the Eucharist; the Elements are changed, when of common and natural creatures, they are made sacred, and become Channels, and Instruments of saving grace; and such a change Ambrose meant; for comparing these miracles of the Prophets, wherein God changed the nature of things, with the change that is wrought in the Sacrament, he saith, 
k Non minus est novas rebu● dare, quam mutare natural. Ambr loco citat.  that it is no less to add some new things, unto things, than to change the nature of things, averring plainly thereby that the bread had received some new thing, without losing the nature of bread; and such a change is not strange, for thus a piece of wax becoming the King's Seal changeth its nature without Transubstantiation.  
Besides, the Father's use the like Tenor of speech of the Sacrament of Baptism, and yet do not hence infer any Transubstantiation: they say, 
l 
Non agnosco usum naturae, ubi est excellentia gratiae. Ambros de iis qui mist. 〈◊〉 cap. 9  
Quid v●listi? [●q●as ●ti que] sed non solas. Id. ibid. cap. 3.   the word of Christ is most efficacious to alter the property of natural water, and to give regenerating force and virtue to it. Saint Ambrose saith, that in Baptism man is changed, and made a new creature. Learn (saith he) 
m Post●aquàm consecratus es, 〈◊〉 creatura esse coepisti. Serm● Christi ●reaturam omnem muta●e consueverit, & mutat quando vult instituta nature. Idem de Sacram lib. 4. c●p. 4.  how the word of Christ is accustomed to change every creature, and when he will he altereth the course of nature.  
Saint Cyril saith, 
n Spirit●s Sanct● operatione 〈…〉. ●y●il. Alexandr. 〈◊〉 joan li. ● cap. 4●. ●om. 1. Ge●rg. Tra● 〈…〉.  the waters are changed into a divine nature. And Gregory Nazianzen saith, 
o 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Greg. N●zi●n 〈…〉 pag. 643 tom. 1 Paris. 1609.  that by Baptism we put on Christ, by Baptism we are changed or transmuted into Christ. Now from hence we cannot infer that ei●her the water of Baptism, or regenerate persons are changed by Transubstantiation; the change is not corporal in either of the Sacraments, but mystical in use and signification.  
In the Church (saith 
p 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Macar. Egypt. Homil. 27  Macarius, Scholar to Saint Anthony) bread and wine is offered; the type of his flesh and blood; and they which are partakers of the visible bread, do Spiritually eat the flesh of the Lord. Now according to this Father, bread and wine are taken, bread and wine are offered; and these be the types or tokens of the body and blood: and that they be so called after Consecration, is likewise acknowledged by Bellarmine. 
q Bellar. de Euchar. li. 2. c. 15. § Sed haec.   
And we may farther observe that the words of Macarius are so clear for the spiritual, and not corporal receiving; as that some were feign to set a Marginal gloss 
r Offerendum esse in Ecclesi● panem & vinum exemplar exhibens carnem ipsius & sanguinem● sumentesque de pane visibili  upon Macarius his text. 
* spiritaliter carnem domini edere. Macar. homil. 27. in Bib. S. Patr. tom. 2. edit. 2. pag. 398. per Marg. de la Bigne. Par. 1589.   

Of Image-worship.  
The Council of Elliberis in Granado in Spain, 
* spiritaliter, id est, non visibili modo, & eo quo editur alia caro● sed spiritali & indivisibili. in margin.  decreed 
s Placuit, pic●uras in ecclesia esse non debere; ne quod colitur aut adoratur in parietibus depingatur. Concil. Eliber. cap. 36.  That no Pictures should or ought to be in the Church, lest that which is worshipped or adored, should be painted on walls. Now it will not serve to say, that the Council only forbade the painting of Images on Church-walls, where in time of persecution, or otherwise, they might be defaced; as if they might be set or hung in tables; for the Counsels decree runs generally, saying, It is our mind that Pictures ought not to be in the Church. Now if it forbade the very being of them in Churches, then surely it utterly condemned their adoration.  
Melchior Canus chargeth this ancient Council with impiety, 
t Illa [Lex] impiè à Concilio Elibertino lata est de tollendis Imaginibus. Melch. Canus loc. theol l. 5. c 4.  for making such a decree de tollendis Imaginibus. Saint Ambrose saith, 
u Non vult se Deus in lapidibus coli. Ambr. in ep. 31. ad Valent. Imp. lib. 5. tom. 3.  God would not have himself worshipped in stones: 
x Quae Ecclesia i●anes Ideas, & vanas nescit simulachrorum figuras, sed veram novit Trinitatia substantiam. Id. de fug● saeculi. cap. 5. tom. 1.  the Church knoweth no vain Idaea's, and diverse figures of Images, but knoweth the true substance of the Trinity. The fact of Epiphanius (which himself records 
y Epiphan. edit. Lat. in fine operum.  in his Epistle to john Bishop of Jerusalem, translated by Saint 
z Epist. Epiphanij ad joan. Hierosol. in tom. secundo oper. Hieronymi.  Hierome out of Greek into Latin) is very famous in this case, namely, how himself found a Picture in the Church of the village of Anablatha, which (though it were out of his own Diocese) yet in an ho●y zeal he tore it, and wrote to the Bishop of the place, beseeching him that no such Pictures might be hanged up, as being contrary to Religion.  
The words of Epiphanius are these: 
a Inveni ibi velum pen●●n● in sorites ejus●●m eccl●si● tinctum atque depi●tan●. & habens imaginem quasi Christi vel Sancti cujusd●m, non enim satis memini, cu●as imago suerit; cum ergè hoc vidissem, in Ecclesia Christi contra out●rit●●ē Scripturarum hominis pend●●e Im●ginem, sci●●illud— Epiphan. quò ●up●a.  I found there a veil hanging at the door of the Church died and painted, and having the Image as it were of Christ or some Saint; for I do not well remember whose Image it was: when therefore I saw this, that contrary to the authority of the Scriptures, the Image of a man was hanged up in the Church of Christ, I cut it, and gave counsel to the keepers of the place, that they should rather wrap and bury some poor dead man in it: and afterward he intreateth the Bishop of Jerusalem (under whose government this Church was) to give charge hereafter, 
b Dein●●ps p●aecip●re in Eccl●si● C●risti is●i● ismo●ivel● quae contrà R●ligionem nostram veniu●t non appendi. Id. Ibid.  that such veils as those which are repugnant to our Religion, should not be hanged up in the Church of Christ.  
I know indeed, that jesuit Fisher would shuffle off this evidence, by saying, that it was the picture of some profane Pagan; b●t Epiphanius himself saith, it had imaginem quasi Christi, vel Sancti cujusdam, the image as it were of Christ, or of some Saint: surely therefore the Image went for Christ's, or for some noted Saints, neither do●h he find fault with the irresemblance, but with the Image, as such. Baronius saith, 
c ●●ono● astarum poti●●●●gmentum quam Epip●anij ge●●a●um scriptum Baron. A●●●l. tom. 4. ad ann. 392 nu. 59  they are rather the forged words of some Imagebreakers, than of Epiphanius: Bellarmine would disproove them by sundry conjectures, which Master Rivet 
* An●. 〈◊〉 Criti●i Sacri. lib. 3. cap. 29.  rejects, and defends the foresaid Epistle of Epiphanius, clearing it from all the Cardinal's cavils: a●d surely if we observe Epiphanius his practice about the foresaid Image, and his Doctrine of Mariam nemo adoret, we may well think these two had both one Father.    

PA.  
The Idolatry forbidden in Scripture, and disliked by the Fathers, is such as was used by jews and Pagans; and this wee Christians practise not.   

PRO.  
Indeed the Apostle, when he dissuadeth Christians from Idolatry, propounds the jews fall, saying, Neither be ye Idolaters, as some of them were [1 Cor. 10. 7, 8.] The like also he addeth touching another sin, Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them did: as well then might one plead that jewish or Heathenish fornication were only reprehended, as jewish or Heathenish Idolatry, it being a foul sin, whether it be committed by jew, Pagan, or Christian, and more heinous in the Christian, who professeth Christ, to practise that which Gods word condemneth in the jews and Pagans for Idolatry.   

PA.  
The Heathen held the Images themselves to be Gods, which is far from our thought.   

PRO.  
Admit some of the simpler sort of the Heathen did so, what shall we say of the jewish Idolaters who erected the Golden calf in the wilderness? can we think that they were all so senseless, as to imagine that the calf, which they knew was not at all in rerum naturâ, and had no being at that time, when they came out of Egypt, should yet be that God which brought them out of Egypt. [Exod. 32.4.] And for the Heathen people, though they (haply) thought some divine Majesty and power was seated in the Images; yet they were scarcely so rude as to think the Images which they adored, to be very God; for thus we find them usually to answer in the writings of the Fathers: 
d Deo● inquitis per simul achia veneramur. Arnob. contra Gent. lib. 6. sect. 10.  We worship the Gods by the Images; and, 
e Nec Simulachrum nec Daemonium colo, sed per ●ffigiem corporalem ejus rei signum intu●●r, quam colere debeo. August. in Psal. 113. concion● secunda.  I neither worship the Image, nor a Spirit in it, but by the bodily portraiture, I do behold the sign of that thing which I ought to worship.   

PAP.  
Though the Heathen did not account the Image itself to be God; yet were those Images set up to represent either things that had no being, or Devils, or false-Gods, and in that respect were Idols; whereas we erect Images only to the honour of the true God, and of his servants the Saints and Angels.   

PRO.  
Suppose that many of the Idolatrous jews and Heathens Images were such as you say they were, yet they were not all of them such: howsoever, Idolatry is committed by yielding adoration to an Image of the true God himself, as appeareth by the first Chapter of the Epistle to the Romans, where the Apostle having said, that God showed unto them that which might be known of him; and that the Invisible things of him, that is, his eternal power and Godhead, was manifested unto them by the creation of the World, and the contemplation of the creatures; he addeth presently, that God was sorely displeased with them, and therefore gave them up unto vile affections, because, They changed the Glory of that incorruptible God, into an Image made like unto corruptible men, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things: whereby it is evident, that the Idolatry condemned in the wisest Heathen, was the adoring of the invisible God, whom they acknowledged to be the Creator of all things, in visible Images fashioned to the similitude of men and beast, as the admirably learned, Bishop Usher hath observed 
f Doctor Ushers Sermon the 18. of Febr. ann. 1620.  in his Sermon preached before the Commons House of Parliament in Saint Margaret's Church at Westminster.  

Of Prayer to Saints.  
There wanted not some, who even in the Apostles days under the pretence of 
g Colloss. 2.18.  Humility, laboured to bring into the Church the worshipping of Angels, which carried with it 
h ●oid.. vers. 23.  a show of Wisdom (as Saint Paul speaks of it;) not much unlike that of the Papists, who teach their simple people, upon pretence of Humility, and their own unworthiness, to prepare the way to the Son, by the servants, the Saints and Angels; this they counselled (saith 
i Ill● ergo hoc consul●bant utique humilita●e utentes, di●entes universorum De●m, nec cerni nec ad cum perveniri poss●; & opo●tere p●r Angelos divinam sibi benevolentia● concili. re. Theodoret in Coloss. cap. 2. to. 2. Gentiano Herveto interpret.  Theodoret) should be done, using humility, and saying, that the God of all was invisible and inaccessible; and that it was fit men should get God's favour by the means of Angels. And the same Theodoret saith 
k Oratoria sancti Michaeli●. Theod quò suprà.  that they had 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Oratories, or Chapels of Saint Michael. Now the Council of Laodicea, to meet with this error, solemnly decreed; 
l 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Concil. Laodice● can. 35 In edit. T●lianâ● p. 841.  that Christians ought not to forsake the Church of God, and go and invocate Angels, and pronounced an Anathema against any that should be found to do so, because (say they) He hath forsaken our Lord jesus Christ, the Son of God, and given himself to Idolatry. And Theodoret mentions the Canon of this Council, and declares the meaning of it in these words: 
m Hanc e●iam l●gem sequens, Laodicena Synodus, & volens veteri illi morbo mederi, Lege cavit ne precarentur A●gelos, & ne reli●qu●r●nt Dominum nostrum jesum Christ●●. Theod. in 3. cap. ad Col.  Whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord jesus, giving thanks to God, and the Father by him.—  
The Synod of Laodicea also following this Rule, and desiring to heal that old disease, made a Law, that they should not pray, unto Angels, nor forsake our Lord jesus Christ: now there is the same reason of Saints, that there is of the Angels.    

PA.  
jesuit Fisher in his rejoinder to Doctor Whites Reply, the second and third point, saith, The Council and Theodoret are thus to be understood, that Angels are not to be honoured as Gods.   

PRO.  
How appeareth it that Christians were so rude in those Ages, as to imagine that Angels were Gods? or that sacrifices after the Pagan manner, were due to them? It appeareth by Theodoret, that those whom he condemneth did not think the Angels to be Gods, but that they served them as ministering Spirits, whose service God had used for the publishing of the 
n Dicentes, ●uisse ●ege● p●r eos dat●m, id est, per Angelos Theod. in 2. c●p. Coloss.  Law.   

PA.  
Bellarmine saith; 
o Conciliu● non damn●r qu●mlibe● v●n●r●tionem Angelorum, sed eam quae Deo prop●●● es●. B●llar. de sanct. Beat lib. 1. c. 20. § Hie●on●m●.  The Council forbade all worship of Angels, called Latreia, as being proper unto God: but Binnius liketh 
p Mihi magis pl●cet ●xpositio Baronij, q●ia it hoc Canone 〈◊〉 ac religiosam venerationem 〈◊〉 Deorum, eo●um nimirum quos Gentiles Idololat●ae venerab●ntur, Christ●●nis interdictan es●e. B●●. in Synod Laodic p. 294. ●ol. 2●.  Baronius exposition better, who saith, The Council only forbade the religious worship of false and heathenish Gods.   

PRO.  
Bellarmine doth wrong in restraining the Counsels speech to a special kind of worship: for Theodoret saith generally, that the Council forbade the worship of Angels. Neither did the Council mean thereby to forbid the religious worship of false and heathenish Gods; for Theodoret mentioneth the Oratories of Saint Michael, and of such Angels as were supposed to give the Law, and therefore were not ill Angels.  
Baronius perceiving that the place in Theodoret toucheth the Papists to the quick, telleth us plainly, 
q Ex his vide●s (quod necessario dicendum est) Th●oderetum haud satis feliciter (e●us pace sit dictum) assecutum esse Paul● verborum sensum. Baron Annal. tom. 1. ann. ●0. sect. 20.  That Theodoret, by his leave, did not well understand the meaning of Paul's words: and that those Oratories of Saint Michael were anciently erected by Catholics; as if Baronius a man of yesterday, at Rome could tell better what was long since done in Asia, than Theodoret a Greek Father, and an ancient Father and Bishop, living above twelve hundred years ago, not far from those parts, where these things were done.  
Others, to avoid the force of the canon, have corrupted the Council, making this reading; 
r Non oportet ad angulos cong●egationes ●acere. ●aranza in summâ Concilior.  That men should not leave the Church, to pray in angles or corners; turning Angelos into Angulos, Angels into Angles or corners; but Veritas non quaerit angulos, the truth will admit none of these corners; neither hath the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 any affinity at all with corners. To proceed, the Fathers of this age affirm, that religious prayer is a proper worship belonging to the sacred Trinity; and by this argument [Rom. 10. 14●] conclude against the Arrians and Macedonians, that Christ jesus and the Holy Ghost are truly God, because Christians believe in them, pray unto them, & they accept their petitions.  
Athanasius saith; 
s 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Athanas. orat. 4. contr. Arrian.  No man would ●ver pray to receive any thing from the Father, and from the Angels, or from any of the other creatures. Gregory Nyssen saith: 
t 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Greg. Nyssen. cont. Eunom. tom● 2. orat. 4. pag. 146.  We are taught to worship and adore, that nature only which is uncreated; 
u Anton. Meliss. lib 2. Serm. 1.  and accordingly Antonius in his Melissa hath set down the foresaid sentence; but the Spanish Inquisitors have commanded 
x Deleatur dicti●, ●●lum modo. Ind. 〈◊〉. p●● Quirog. Madr. ann. 158●  that the word Only should be blotted out of his writings: Now the word Only, is the only principal word, whereupon the whole sentence dependeth.  
In like sort, where Athanasius saith, that 
y 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. A●●an. to. 1. orat. 3. contr. Arrianos.  God only is to be worshipped, that the Creature is not to adore the creature, that neither men, nor Angels are to be worshipped. The popish Index (as is already observed in the Preface to this Treatise) hath razed 
z Ex Athanasij Indi●● d●lean●ur. Adorari soliu● Dei est, Creatura creaturam non adorat. Ind ●xpurg. Madr. 1612. E● per Tu●re●●n. Genev●. 1619.  these sayings out of his Index, or table, which yet remain in the text.  
Epiphanius tells us of some superstitious women that were wont to offer up a Cake to the blessed Virgin, and this vanity he calleth 
a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Epiphan. in hae●esi Collyrid. haer 79 p 1065.  the woman's Heresy, because that sex mostly used it, but he reproves them saying; 
b 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. Ibid pag. 10●4. 1065  Let Mary be in honour, but let the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost be worshipped, let no man worship or adore Mary; and indeed he bends all his force against that point of adoring; no less than in six several places, saying; [Mariam nemo adoret.] Now Adoration being condemned, it can not be conceived, that adoring her, and offering to her, they prayed not also to her, and required of her, somewhat again. All which Epiphanius reproves.  
Saint Ambrose speaking of our Advocate, or Master of Requests, saying; 
c Q●id enim t●m 〈◊〉 C●r●stum quam Advocatum apud D●●n● Pat●em ad●●are popul●rum? Ambr tom. 4 in Psal. 39  What is so proper to Christ, as to stand by God the Father for an Advocate of the people? 
d Sed tamen tu solus Domine invocandus 〈◊〉 Ambros. tom 3. de 〈◊〉 Theodsij  and elsewhere he saith, Tu solus Domine invocandus es, thou Lord only art to be invocated: and whereas there were some that about this time sued unto Saints and Angels, saying; 
Am●ros. tom. 5. in Rome cap. 1.  We have recourse to Angels and Saints with devotion and humility, that by their Intercession God may be more favourable unto us. Saint Ambrose (or who ever else was author of those Commentaries upon Saint Paul's Epistles that are framed among his works) hath well m●t with them, calling it, 
f So e●t tam●● pu●o●em p●ssi n●g●●c●i Dei, 〈◊〉 u●i ●x●us●tione, dicentes p●rist●s pos●e ire ad Deum● si●ut per ●●mites per●e●atural Regen Id ibid.  A miserable excuse, in that they think to go to God by these, as men go to the King by an Officer: Go to (saith he) 
g Age, nu●qui● t●m demens est aliqui●, aut salutis suae imm●m●r, ut honorisicentiam Regis vindicet C●mit●— nam & ideò ad Regem per Tribunos aut Comites itur, quia homo u●ique est Rex, & nes●it quib●s debeat Rempublicam credere. Ad Deum autem (quem utique nihil latet, omnium enim me●ita no●it) promerend●m suffragatore non opus est, sed ment devot●. ubicunque talis locutus suerit ei, respondebit illi. Id. ibid.  is any man so mad, or so unmindful of his salvation, as to give the King's honour to an Officer? for therefore do men go to the King by Tribunes or Officers, because the King is but a man, and knoweth not to whom to commit the state of the Common wealth: but to procure the favour of God, from whom nothing is hid (for he knoweth the works of all men) we need no spokesman but a devout mind: for wheresoever such a one shall speak unto him, he will answer him. This testimony is so full, that it makes me remember what I have seen written with his own hand, in Saint Ambrose his Margin by Archbishop Hutton, (one that by Campians testimony 
h Matheus Huttonus, ●ui v●r nominatus in paucis. ve●sare patr●s dicitur. Campian. Rat. 5.  was well versed in the Fathers) namely, hoc testimonium jugulat pontificios, this evidence chokes the Papists.  

Reply.  
The place alleged is none of Saint Ambroses; neither was he the Author of those Commentaries on Saint Paul's Epistles 
i Commentaria in Epistolas S. Paul à multis non creduntur Amb●●sij, nec sine causà. Bellar. de Scriptor. Eccles. ad ann. 374. .   

Answer.  
We are not so straightened, that we need make any great reckoning whether they be his or no; for we have alleged other places of Saint Ambrose out of his works, of which there is no question. And yet they are usually cited under Saint Ambrose his name: Bellarmine in five several places allegeth them, 
k R●bertus Cocus in censu●a Scripto●um Vet. p. 133.  and in particular this Commentary on the Romans; and the Rhemists they vouch them too: and when any thing in these Commentaries seem to make for them, than they cry them up and say, 
l Bea●us Ambrosi●s in cap 3. prime ad ●imoth. inqui●; D●mus ●ius Ec●l●si● di●itur, cujus ●odi● Rector e●t Damasus. Bellarm de R●m. Pont. l. 2 c 16 §. Certius ●. Amb●os.  Beatus Ambrose; and when they would thence prove the Pope to be the ruler of the whole Church, than the style runs Blessed S●int Ambrose in his Commentaries saith thus, and thus: and then Saint Ambrose is the Author of them.   

Reply.  
Where Saint Ambrose saith, Thou Lord only art to be invocated, it is (saith Cardinal Perron) very true, of Invocation absolute, sovereign, and final.   

Answer.  
This is as much as we desire, saith our acute and learned Bishop of Winchester Doctor 
m B. And●ews Answer to Cardinal perron's Reply. Pag. 44.45.  Andrew's; for as for their relative and subaltern Invocation, we know them not; and it is likely the Fathers knew not of any such oblique means to help men in their devotions: for if they had, so many, so divers Fathers, in so many Treatises, specially where they wrote the Oratione, of Prayer, must somewhere have mentioned them.   

Reply.  
Saint Ambrose saith, Ad Deum suffragatore non opus est; now suffragari is to give one's voice. God indeed needs not any (be they Elements, Stars, Angels, or Saints they meant) to interpose between God and men, pour l' enformer, to inform him: but there needs some to interpose between God and men, pour les favoriser, to procure favour on our behalf.   

rejoinder.  
Although the word in Heathen Authors be used in that sense, yet in the Church's style, Suffrages are taken for Prayers; and in their Portuises language I find that Suffrages 
n Suffragia de S. Antonio. Ora pro nobis Bea●● Pa●er Antoni. Hor● B● M●r.  are used for Ora pro nobis: now to the point. God, as he needs not any referendary to give him intelligence, nor Counsellor to give him advice; so neither needeth be any Solicitor to incline him to hear the Prayers of a devour spirit, but the great Mediator of all, which is Christ our Saviour, saith our learned Winchester. 
o Id Ibid. pag 43.    

Reply.  
Bellarmine replieth, 
p Intelligi●●● 〈…〉 Dei, q●a●i 〈◊〉, D●us 〈◊〉 eg●r interpretibus, ●um. ps● p●● se om●●a vid●●●, & int●llig●●; tam●n●x 〈…〉 lepus est suffa 〈…〉. Bel. li. 1 d● Sa●●● Be●●. cap. ●0. §. Ad●  that non opus est su●●ragatore, is not said on our part, but on Gods.   

R●joynder.  
It would be asked of him, saith the same learned Bishop, 
q Id. ibid. p 44.  when it is said, Ad D●um suffragatore non est opus; whether non est opus, sh●ll be non est opus nobis, or non est opus Deo; to say, non est opus Deo, were absurd; so i● must be non ●st opus nobis, and so the opus est must needs lie on our parts.   

Reply.  
Bellarmine saith, 
r Dico● cum agere contrá ●thnicos, qui As●●●tum cursus col●bant, Bellar. de Sanct. Beatit. li. 1. cap. 20. §. ad ●ocum Ambr●si●.  that Ambrose speaks against the Heathen that worshipped the Stars: whereupon he saith that they worshipped their fellow servants, that is, Creatures.   

Answer.  
How doth it appear, that they were so rude, as to imagine that the Stars were Mediators to God for them?    

PRO.  
What do you say to the testimonies of Athanasius, Ambrose, and Epiphanius, alleged 
s Quintum Arg●m●ntum ex P●t●b●s, Athanas. serm 3. c. Ar●ian● docet neq●e Angelos, neque homin●s sanct●s ad natione colend●s esse. Epiphan. in haer. Coll● rid sepius r●petit, Mari●m non ●sse adoran lamb, sed solum Deum. Ambros. in cap. 1. ad Rom. reprehendit e●s qui adorant c●nservos. Bell●r. de Sanct. Beat● l. 1. c● 11. §. Quintum.  against praying to Saints?   

PA.  
jesuit Fisher in his rejoinder to Doctor Whites Reply, saith, 
t I. F. rejoinder to D. Whites Reply, the 2 and 3 point.  The Fathers are thus to be understood, that Angels are not to be honoured as Gods, nor by Sacrifices in the heathenish manner.   

PRO.  
This answer is defective; for the Fathers not only when they answer Heathens, but when they instruct Christians, deliver the like speeches; as appeareth by chrysostom in the fifth Age. Besides, how doth it appear that Christians were so rude in those Ages, as to imagine that Angels were Gods? or that Sacrifices after the Pagan manner, were due to them?  

Reply.  
B●llarmine saith farther, 
u Ad ultimum ex Patribus ●●ico co● loqui con●r●● erro●es Ge●ti●um, qui ●x h●miribus 〈…〉 ●sserebant. 〈◊〉 l. 1 de 〈…〉 §. ad ultimum collat cum ●ine c. 11  that the Fathers alleged do speak against the errors of the Gentiles, who made wicked men departed, their Gods, and did offer Sacrifice unto them.   

rejoinder.  
By this Reply of Bellarmine's, the Reader (saith the Right reverend & learned Lord Primate Doctor 
x An answer to a Challenge m●de by a jesuit in Ireland. S. Of prayer to Sain●s. pag ●76  Usher) may discern the just hand of God, confounding the man's wits, that would thus abuse his learning to the upholding of Idolatry; for had he been his own man, he could not possibly have failed so foully, as to r●ckon the Angels and the Saints, and the very mother of God herself (of whom these Fathers, specially Epiphanius, do expressly speak) in the number of those wicked persons, whom the Gentiles did take for their Gods.    

PA.  
We give Latrîa, or worship to God; and Dulia, or service to the Saints.   

PRO.  
You give a higher worship to God, and a lesser to his Saints; like that wanton Roman Dame, who thought to excuse her folly, by saying, 
y joannes Rainaldus de Idololatria. Rome Eccl. lib. 1. cap. 1. num 13. ex Cicerone in oratione pro Caelio.  she companied with Metellus as with a Husband, and with Clodius as with a Brother, whereas all was due to her husband only; so do these spiritual wantoness part stakes in God's worship, whereas all religious worship is due to God alone.  
Neither will this distinction salve the sore; for the Scripture useth these terms without any such difference: 
z Hebrai●um verbum, Ghabad, quod 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 redditur apud Spetuaginta, Deut. 6.13. in loco quem Christus ●itat, Mat●. 4.10 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉: reddite 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. 1 Sam. 4. ubi scriptum est in laud●m Israelitarum, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  for the word Latria, which you appropriate to God's service, is applied to men, as in this place: you shall do no servile work, the word used is Latria, [L●vit. 23.7.] the word is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉: so chose, the word Dulia, is taken in Scripture for the proper service of God, as in this place, serving the Lord with all Humility, the word there used is Dulia; so that this distinction is idle, since that Religious worship and service is all one.   

PA.  
We do not invocate the Saints by Faith, as Authors of the benefits we crave.   

PRO.  
Your 
* They pray directly, absolutely, and finally to Sain●s, to give such and such gifts & graces themselves; and diverse instances are given in this kind by Bishop Andrews in his Answer to Card Pe●r●n's Reply. P●g 58.59. etc.  practice showeth the contrary, for you pray to the Virgin Mary in these terms: 
a O●fic. B. Mar. pij v. jussu edit. and the office of the Blessed Virgin according to the ●ef●rmed Latin a● S. Omers. 1621.  

Maria matter gratiae,  
Mater misericordiae;  
Tu nos ab host besiege,  
Et horâ mortis suscipe.   

Marry Mother of Heaven's grace,  
Mother, where mercy hath chief place;  
From cruel Foe, our souls defend,  
And them receive when life shall end.    
The Cross is likewise devoutly saluted in this manner: 
b Breviar. Roman. Sabbat. infrà Hebdom. 4. Quadrages.  

O Crux ave spes unica,  
Hoc passionis tempore;  
Auge pijs justitiam,  
Re●sque dona veniam.   

All hail O Cross, our only hope,  
In this time of the passion;  
Increase thou justice to the godly,  
And give to sinners pardon.     

PA.  
You have alleged diverse Fathers against praying to Saints, give me now leave to produce such testimonies as Bellarmine brings in 
c Bellar. l. 1. de Sanct. Beatit. cap. 19 , for invocation of Saints.   

PRO.  
The learned Bishop● on our side, Bishop 
d 
Ad Cardinalis Bellarmini Apolog●●m Respons. cap 1 pag. 40 etc.  
His Answer to the 20. Chapter of Cardinal Perron's Reply.   Andrew's and Bishop Montague 
e Master Rich: Montague now Bishop of Chichester his Treatise of Invocation o● Saints. , have particularly examined the several testimonies alleged by Bellarmine, and found that he hath utterly failed in his proofs.   

PA.  
Let us hear the Fathers themselves speak; for their testimonies seem to be clear for us; for instance sake. Nazianz●n reports 
Viginem Mariam rog●●●, u● p●r●●li●ant● Vng●●● 〈…〉. Gregor. Nazianz●n Or●t. in Cyprian.  that Cyprian whiles he was a Pagan, and a Conjurer, he fell in love with justina a Christian virgin at Antioch, whom, when as by wooing and ordinary means he could not win to his will, he went about to entice and prevail with by Magical spells and conjurations; which the damosel perceiving, besought the Virgin Mary to succour her, being a distressed virgin.   

PRO.  
This goes under his name, but (haply) is none of his; for it is not likely that Nazianzen (one of so great learning, judgement, and memory) could (as Billius speaks 
g Tam foedo errore prolapsum esse Billius in not. ad locum. ) be so grossly mistaken, to ascribe that unto Saint Cyprian Bishop of Carthage in Africa, that (if it were at all) was done by one Cyprian the Deacon of Antioch in Asia. But yet say it were Nazianzen's own report, it being but a private act, out of the devout affection in a Maid, it cannot be drawn to a rule of Faith; neither is it proposed as an example to be followed, but only by way of bare narration what she did: the relater passeth not his own censure upon it; yea, but he taxeth it not; though he did not, yet others, and (by name) Epiphanius in the same age taxed such of that sex, as offered Cakes, and the like presents, and oblations to the blessed Virgin.  
Lastly, the story saith, that despairing of all other remedies 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, she flieth to God, and then assumeth for her Patron and Protector Christ jesus her Spouse; and after this: 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, she besought the Virgin Mary to succour her, being a distressed virgin. First, she flieth to God; secondly, she maketh Christ her Patron; thirdly, she requesteth the Virgin Mary (in zeal rather than upon knowledge.) And although Nazianzen (speaking only by hearsay) reporteth that she supplicated (not by any Collect, or set form of devotion, but by a short ejaculation) to the Virgin Mary; yet this was done by her in the last place, and after she had first sought to God and Christ: Whereas, in their Romish devotions, our Lady hath their orisons first addressed to her; and our Lord hath them but as it were at second hand, the reversion of th●m.   

PA.  
Gregory Nyssen calls to Theodore the Martyr, saying, 
F●●trum tuorum Martyrum ●oge chorum, & 〈◊〉 omnibus una depre●are. Greg Nyssen. ●●at. in S. Theodor.  gather together the troops of thy brother Martyrs, and thou with them jointly, beseech God to stay the invasion of the Barbarous Goths.   

PRO.  
Nyssen spoke this in a panegyrical oration, as an Orator, not as a Divine, in a popular sermon of Commemoration, not in doctrinal determination.  
In like sort Bellarmine objects Nazianzen in his orations calling unto Cyprian, Basil, and Athanasius, with a tu autem è supernis nos respice, 
i Nazianzen. in orat. in Atha●as.  do thou favourably look upon us from an high; Whereas, this is no direct invocation, but rather a vote, wish and desire that Basil and Athanasius might do so and so; for it is not respice nos, but o si; or utinam nos respicias, and so he speaks of Basil, and now Basil is in the heavens offering as I think sacrifices for us, and praying for the people: he comes with an 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, as I take it, as I am persuaded; it was but his opinion, and conjecture; being indeed nothing but a Rhetorical flourish.  
The like answer may serve to that of Hierome, who concluding his Funeral Oration upon Paula, desireth her in heaven, to assist him with her prayers; 
k Vale ò Paula, & cult●ris tu● vl●imam ●ene●tutem orati●nibus ●uva. Hieron. in Epitaph. Paulae.  the speech h●e useth is no more but a Rhetorical Apostrophe or conversion to her. Besides, it is but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a wish; and not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, a direct prayer unto her.  
In the like manner ●or proof of prayer to Saints Bellarmine allegeth two Poets, Paulinus and Prudentius; now we answer him in his own words, 
l Nihil aliud di●o, nisi mor●●●ëtico ●usiss P●udentium. Bellar lib 2. de Pu●gat. cap. 18. §. Ad.  who when Prudenti●s was alleged against him in the point of Purgatory, he puts it off, saying, Prudentius played the Poet, so say we, that they spoke it in a poetical vain, as others in a strain of Rhetoric: Now in Poetry, men take more liberty; beside, their words serve them not at will, as they do in prose: but they must often take such to make up their verse, as were otherwise inconvenient to be used; moreover, the heat of their invention carrieth them further oftentimes, then in a temperate speech, they would be carried.   

PA.  
Saint Ambrose exhorts widows to pray to the Angels and Martyrs, 
m Obsecrandi sunt Angeli, Martyrs, speculatores vitae, actuumque nostrorum. Ambros. lib. de Viluis.  whom he calleth beholders of our lives and actions.   

PRO.  
Saint Ambrose was chosen from a secular judge, to be Bishop of Milan, and was fain to be christened before he could be consecrated. Now this book de Viduis, of widows was written about the beginning of his christianity and divinity both: 
n Bishop Andrews Answer to Cardinal Perron's R●ply, proves this out of Baronius in the l●●e o● Saint Ambrose.  and therefore it is not strange, if in his beginning and novice ship he said some things, for which he afterwards corrected himself; of this sort is that which he hath in the book alleged, which shows he was a novice in divinity, when he wrote that book de Viduis, for there he doubts, whether the Martyrs had any sins or n●; and then saith, 
o Qui proprio sanguine, etiam si quae habuerunt, peccata laverunt. Amb●. de Vid. ●oco citato.  That the sins they had, they did themselves wash away with their own blood: Whereas the holy Scripture gives us no other L●ver for our sins than the blood of jesus Christ, Who hath loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood 
p Apocal. 1.5. . And again, 
q Apoc. 7.14. & 1 john 1. vers. 7.  The Saints have washed their robes in the blood of the Lamb. Now the blood of Martyrs is not the blood of Christ: and therefore that speech was neither so safely, nor properly set down. Besides, the words rea●h not home, it is only his opinion, that the Saints and Angels are our Patrons, Videmur, 
r Quorum vide●ur n●bis quoddam corporis pignore patrocinium v●n●icare. Ambr. loc. citator  We seem to have their patronage, and yet it is but Patrocinium quoddam, a certain kind of guardian ship.  
But what Saint Ambrose's opinion was touching this point, no man can better tell than himself, who elsewhere saith 
s Ad Deum autem promerendum, Suff●agatore non opus est, sed ment devotà. Ambros. in Rom. cap. 1. Tom. 5.  That to procure God's favour, we need no spokesman but a devout mind: and again, 
t Sed tamen tu solu● Domine invocandu● es. Ambr. de obitu Theodosij. tom. 3.  Thou only O Lord oughtest to be invocated and prayed unto.  

Objection.  
Saint Cyril of Jerusalem saith, 
u Facimus mentionem etiam corum qui ante nos obdormierunt, ut Deus Orationibus aliorum, suscipiat preces nostras. Cyril. Catech. 5. mystag.  That we make mention of those that sleep in the Lord before us, that by their Intercession God would receive our prayers. Thus he in his mystagogicall Catechisms.   

Answer.  
The learned 
x Andr. Rivet. Critici sacri. lib. 3. cap. 8. & Rob. Coci censura Patrum pag. 118.  do think that Cyril of Jerusalem was not Author thereof, but one john Bishop of Jerusalem, who lived about the year 767, a great advocate of Images; and indeed it may seem so by some idle stuff we find in them, as namely, where it is said, 
* 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Cyril Catech. 4.  That the wood of the Cross did increase and multiply in such sort, that the earth was full thereof.  
But, be it Cyrils of Jerusalem, it makes not for the Romists. All he saith is this in effect; he supposeth that those holy ones with God, do continually pray unto God, which prayers he desires God would mercifully hear, and grant unto them, for the good of his servants here on earth.  
Lastly, he saith mentionem facimus; and so did the ancients in their Commemorations, mention the Godly Saints deceased, and yet without any direct invoking of them. And so Saint Austin saith: 
y Suo loco & ordine nominatur, sed non invocantur. Aug. lib. 22. de civet. Dei cap. 10 tom. 5.  That the Martyrs were named at the Communion Table, but yet not invocated by the Priest. Saint Austin flatly opposeth invocantur, to nominantur; nominantur, sed non invocantur, so that they might be nominated, and mentioned, (as Cyril speaks) and yet not at all invocated.   

Objection.  
Saint Hilary saith, 
z Intercessione Angelor●●● indiget infirmitas nostra. Hilar. in Psal. 129.  that by reason of our infirmity, we stand in need of the intercession of Angels, and the like he hath upon the 124 Psalm. 
a Hilar. in Psal. 124. Nec leve praesidium in Angeli●, qui Ecclesiam quadam custodiâ circumsep●●unt.    

Answer.  
Hilary speaks only of Angelical intercession: not a word touching invocation or intercession of Saints. And if any intercession be intended, it is that in general for the whole Church.  
In the other place upon the 124 Psalm, Hilary speaks neither of Saints praying for us, nor of praying to them, but saith: That the Church hath no small aid in the Apostles, Prophets, and patriarchs, or rather in the Angels which hedge and compass the Church round about with a certain guard, the aid therefore he meaneth, is the example and doctrine of 
b Circuibat cum Sacerdotibus & populo omnium orationum loca, ante Martyrum & Apostolorum thec●● jacebat cilicio prostratu●, & auxilia sibi ●ida Sanctorum intercessione poscebat. Ruffin. lib. 2. hist cap. 33.  the Saints departed, and the ministry of the Angels.   

Objection.  
The Emperor Theodosius went in Procession with his Clergy and Laity, 
b Circuibat cum Sacerdotibus & populo omnium orationum loca, ante Martyrum & Apostolorum thec●● jacebat cilicio prostratu●, & auxilia sibi ●ida Sanctorum intercessione poscebat. Ruffin. lib. 2. hist cap. 33.  to the Oratories and Chapels, and lying prostrate before the Shrines and Monuments of the Apostles and Martyrs, he required aid to himself by the faithful intercession of the Saints.   

Answer.  
The Emperor did not invocate any Saint, or Saints at all; only upon that exigent of the rebellion of Eugenius and his complices, he repairs to the Shrines and Chapels of the Apostles, Martyrs, and other holy Saints; there he made his prayers unto God in Christ, not unto them, desiring God to aid him against his enemies, and the rather upon the prayers and intercession of the Saints on his behalf; now invocation follows not presently upon intercession. 
c Theodosia's Sanctorum invocator 〈…〉; ●liud enim est pos●●re à Sanctis auxilium, quo● 〈◊〉 invocare 〈◊〉 alive a Deo poscere, Sanctorum intercessions: ex inte●cessione non ●●●uitur invocatio. D●ct Andrew●s in Respons. ad B●l●●r. Apolog. cap. 1. P●g 45.    

Reply.  
Sozomen telleth us that the Emperor before he joined battle, he earnestly entreated to be assisted by Saint john Baptist.   

rejoinder.  
The learned Bishop, Bishop Montague answereth, 
d Treatise of Invocation of 〈…〉  that the credit of this story may ●e questioned; for Socrates and Th●odoret elder than Sozomen, have it not; and Sozomen himself hath no greater warrant for i● then hea●e say; 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, the report is; but who the Author was, wha● credit it was of, is not related. But supposing the truth of the story, Ruffinus hath the very form of the Prayer which the Emperor made, 
e Ruffinus quò sup●à  and there is no mention therein of invocating either Saint or Angel. Socrates saith, 
f Dei ●●plo●avit 〈…〉 S●●rat. hist. lib SIXPENCES p. 4.  that the Emperor implored God's assistance, and had his desire; Theodoret saith, 
g De●m pr●cab●●ur. The●d ●●b. 5. ● p. ●4.  that the Emperor prayed to God; so that the Emperor had repair unto God alone, without any mediation at all. 
h 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Sozom. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.   
I have consulted with the Original, and there indeed I find that the Emperor being in Saint john Baptist's Church which Theodosius himself had built, 
i 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Pag. 102. edi●. Rob. Stephani. In Lat. editione Ruffin. l 7 cap. 24.  He called to have Saint john Baptist's assistance in the battle; he did not directly call upon S. john Baptist, but he called upon God, that he would appoint the Baptist for to a●d him.  
But be it that he called upon the Baptist indeed; yet this was done in the second place, after he had first immediately called upon God himself.   

Objection.  
Athanasius in his Sermon upon the Annunciation of blessed Virgin, saith to the Virgin Mary, 
k In●lina aurem tuam [Ma●ia] in pre●es nostras● & ne ●blivi●caris populi tui— & in●rà, ad ●e clam●m●s— & in●ra— ●●t●rc●de Hera, & Domi●● & Regina, & mate● Dei pro nobis Athan● serm. in Evang. de sanct. Deipara. se● A●nunciat.  Incline thine cares to our prayers, and forget not thy people.   

Answer.  
Indeed this speaks home, but it is not the true Athan●sius, but some counterfeits bearing his name; and this is confessed by the two Arch pillars of Popery, Bellarmine and Baronius; for howsoever Bellarmine, to make up his number, produce 
l B●llar. lib. 1. de Sanct. Beat'st. cap. 19  Athan●sius for proof of Saintly invocation; yet the same B●llarmine when he is out of the heat of his controversies, and is not tied to maintain ●he invocation of Saints, but treateth of other matters; then, in his Catalogue of Ecclesiastical writers, he is of another judgement; and saith 
m Sermo de sanctissimà D●i●a●a, non vi●●tur esse S At●anasij, sed ●l●●ujus ●oste●ioris● qui nost sextum Co●cilium fl●ruerit. Bell●●. de Scriptor Eccles. ad ann. 304. in Athanasio.  that this Sermon of Athanasius of the Annunciation of the blessed Virgin, seemeth not to be Athanasiusses, but some later writers, who lived af●er the six●h general Council.  
Baronius also is of the same judgement: 
n B●ron. tom 1. Annal. ad ann. Ch●isti. 48.  and indeed he that shall consider and w●i●h what the true Athanasius writes, to wit, 
o 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Athanas. to. 1. orat. 3. contr. Arrian.  That God only is to be worshipped: that the creature is not to fall down and worship or supplicate the creature: nor 
p Sanctos non à crea●o postulare, ut auxiliator s●●. At●anas. or t. 2 con. Arrian. pet. Nannio Interp.  to make the Saints (being but creatures, & no creators) special helpers and opitulators: he (I say) that shall duly weigh these things, will easily conceive when he reads this Sermon of the Annunciation, that either Athanasius was not constant to his own doctrine (which is not to be imagined, or that this Homily alleged is none of the true Athanasiusses, it is so far different from his other doctrine.   

Objection.  
Bellarmine, for proof of Saintly invocation, 
q B●llar. de Sanct Beatit. lib. 1. cap. 19  allegeth a place out of Eusebius; the testimony speaketh thus, as there it standeth reported out of the thirteenth Book, and seaventh Chapter of his Evangelicall Preparation: 
r Verae pietatis milites, u● Dei amicos honoran●es, ad monument● quoque illorum accedimus, vot●que ipsis sacimus, tanquam viris sanctis. quoram intercessione ad Deum non parum juvari p●ofitemur. Euseb. lib 13 praep●rat. E●angel. cap 7.  This we daily do: we honour those heavenly Soldiers, as God's friends, we approach unto their Monuments, and pray unto them, as unto Holy men, by whose intercession we profess ourselves to be much helped.   

Answer.  
Eusebius speaks not of particular invocation for particular intercession: but of general mediation of the Saints in heaven, who pray for Saints on earth in general, according to the nature of Communion of Saints, without any intercession used to them, or invocation of them, by that other moiety of the Church Militant o● earth.  
Secondly, Eusebiu● doth not enlarge his speech to all the Saints departed, but unto Martyrs only, whom he calls Heavenly Soldiers. Now the case of Martyrs and other Saints is not equal: for in the opinion of the Ancients, that of Martyrs was fa●re above all other departed with God; as enjoying mo●e privilege from God, with Christ in glory, by some specially enlarged dispensation, than they the other holy Saints did, as Saint Augustine 
s Augustin. ●e cur● pr●mortuis. ca● 8.  teacheth.  
3. Thirdly, the place alleged is taken out of a corrupt translation made by Trapezuntius, and afterwards followed by 
t Ad M●numenta quoque●●lorum acce●●mus, votaque ipsi● sacim●●. Euseb. de P●aep●rat. Evangel. lib. 13 c●p. 7. Euseb. ope●a Io. Dadraei, Parisij●. 1581.  Dadroeus a Doctor of Paris, who set forth Eusebius. Now Eusebius hath no such thing as is pretended; his words in his own language are these: 
u 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Eu●●b. 〈…〉 13. c●. 11. ex 〈…〉 ●●●phani. Lute●. 1544.  It is our custom, to come to the Tombs and Monuments [of the Martyrs] and to make our prayers at, or before those Shrines, or Tombs, and to honour those blessed souls. Pl●●saith they used 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to present themselves at the Martyr's Tombs, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, and to make their prayers, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 at those 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 those Tombs and Monuments; he saith not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to these Martyrs, as Bellarmine would have it. It is onething to pray ad memorias Martyrum, before or near the Sepulchers of ●he Martyrs, as anciently they were wont to do: & another thing to say (as our adversary's do) that these Praye●s were made unto the Martyrs themselves: the truth is, they were made unto God to p●aise him for the assistance given unto the Martyrs, and to crave of God the like G●ace.  
4. F●urthly, and lastly, Eusebius in the same treatise doth fully expre●se himself touching this matter, saying, 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. ●useb ●b●d. lib. 4 c●p. 10. pag. 88 & 89  We are taught to worship God only, and to honour those blessed Powers that are about him, with such honour as is fit and agreeable to their ●state and condition: and again, 
x 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. ibid. l 4. c. 21. p. 〈◊〉. in edith Ro. S●eph g●ae. l. ●●et. 1544.  To God only will we give the worship due un●o his name, and him only do we religiously worship and adore.   

Object.  
Saint Ephraim the Syrian 
y 〈…〉 18. in 〈…〉 to. 3. p. 247.  saith, We pray you O ye● blessed Spirits, vouchsafe to make intercession to God for us miserable sinners.   

Answer.  
The 
z D. Fulke in his Annot. in Rhem. Test. upon 2 Peter 1 15. Et Rob Co●● 〈◊〉 Script. Vet. p. 118.  learned take exceptions at this Ephraim, as being a counterfeit, lately brought to light, and not set forth in his native language, but taught to speak in the Roman tongue: ●ut be it that it is the true Saint Ephraem, yet he saith nothing directly for praying to Saints: for it is but an Apostrophe in general, which infers no conclusion a● all, no● is it directed to any one peculiar Saint, b●t ●o the Saints i● general. Now it is confessed that they pray to God Pro nobis miseris peccatoribus; and this their brotherlike affection, and Saintlike performance, is an aspeciall pa●t of the Communion of Saints.  
Besides, Ephraem (take him as he comes to our hands) delivereth that which overthroweth Saintly Invocation; for he prayeth to God only, without mentioning any Saint at all; 
a Nec in me quidquam bont reperio, quod in conspectu tuo memorari poss●t, nisi hoc solum, quod praeter te, aliam ignorem. S. Ephraem. sermon. p●g 65 tom. 1.  yea he saith expressly, That he knoweth no other save God, to whom he should present his prayers; and yet more fully 
b Idem ibid. pag. 269. edit. Vossian●e.  saying; Tibi soli redemptori supplico, To thee only my Saviour and Redeemer I make my prayer and supplication. And thus speaks Ephraem when once he is out of his p●osopopeiaes, and Rhetorical compellations, his panegyrics, and commendatory orations of the Saints.   

Of justification by Faith only.  
Concerning justification by Faith only, Saint Ambrose (or some of the same standing with Ambrose) 
c Author Commentariorum in Epistolar Pauli, aeq●alis, si●e dubio Ambrosij fuit. Bellar. lib. 4. de justif. cap. 8.  is clear and plentiful throughout his Commentaries on Saint Paul's Epistles.  

Sol● fide justi●icati sunt dono Dei. Id. in 3 ad Rom. Et impius per solam fidem justificatur apud Deum. Id in 4. Rom.  They are justified by faith alone, by the gift of God; yea, he farther saith, 
g Nullum opus dici● legis sed solam f●d●m dand●m in caus● 〈◊〉 Id in c. 10  No work of the Law, but only faith is to be given in Christ's cause. Saint Hilary saith, 
h Fides enim sola justificat. Hilar Comment. in Math. canon● 8.  That which the Law could not unloose, is remitted by Christ, for faith alone justifieth. Saint Basil saith, 
i 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Basil Homil. 22. de Humilitate. to● 1.  That it is true and perfect rejoicing in the Lord, when a man is not puffed up with his own righteousness, but acknowledgeth his want thereof, yet rejoiceth that he is justified by faith alone in Christ.  
By this that hath been said, it appeareth, that when we say, Faith only justifieth, we have not departed from the doctrine of the ancient Fathers in this point of justification.   

Of Merit.  
Concerning Merit, Saint Ambrose saith, 
k Nam ●●de mihi tan●um meriti, cui indulgentia pro coron● est Amb●os. in 〈…〉 virg. ●om. 1.  Whence should I have so great merit, seeing mercy is my crown? and again, 
l Q●●d p●ssums dignum praemis● 〈…〉 Dei● 〈◊〉 d●cretorum in homines 〈◊〉 procedit. Amb●os. in P●●m. 11●. serm 20 to●  What can we do worthy of the heavenly rewards? the sufferings of this time are unworthy for the glory t●●t is to come: therefore the form of heav●nly Decrees doth proceed with men, not according to our merit's, but according to God's mercy.  
Basil saith, 
m 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Basi●. in Psal. 114. 〈◊〉. 1.  Everlasting rest is laid up for them that strive lawfully in this life; not to be rendered according to the debt of works, but exhibited by the grace of the bountiful God to them that trust in him.  
Macarius the Egyptian Hermit, touching the gift which Christians shall inherit, averreth; 
n Si qu●● ex quo creat●s est Ala● ad con●umm●tion●m usque mundi cer●●●●● 〈◊〉 Satan●m, & 〈◊〉 e●●lictiones, 〈…〉 it perag●●et, 〈…〉 ad●pturus. M●●ar homil 15 interpret joanne P●●●, in Bibl. S. Patr. tom. 2. edit. 2. pag. 353. ed●●. ●ute●ae, per M●●g 〈…〉 158●.  That this a man may rightly say, that if any one from the time wherein Adam was created unto the very end of the world did fight against Satan, and undergo afflictions; he should do no great matter in respect of the glory that he shall inherit; for he● shall reign together with Christ world without end.    

PA.  
You produced Saint Cyril of Jerusalem, as if he should witness for you, whereas he is ours; and your Mr. Cook tell●th us 
o Censina S●r●p●o●um Peterum. pag. 117.  that Bellarmine often allegeth him on our behalf.   

PRO.  
The learned make question whether Cyril, or john B. of Jerusalem were the Author of those Catechisms; and surely in some part thereof there be diverse things unworthy of that ancient and learned Cyril, who is the more to be beloved of the Orthodox, as he was greatly hated of the Adrian's; yet even in these Catechisms (take them as they come to our hands) Master Rivet, a learned, and judicious Divine, finds many testimonies 
p And●. Ri●et Crit. 〈◊〉 l. 3 cap 9 & 10.  that make for us, and against the Papists: For instance sake, Cyril in his Catechism, having numbered all the books of the old Testament omitteth all those that are controverted; and saith, 
q Cyril. Hierosol. Catech. 4.  Peruse the two and twenty books, but meddle not with the Apocrypha; meditate diligently upon those Scriptures, which the Church doth confidently read, and use no other: He saith, 
r 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. Catech. 4.  That the safety and preservation of faith consists not in the eloquence of words, but in the proof of divine Scripture. The same Cyril saith, 
s Cyril Catechesi Mystagogicà 5. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  Receive the body of Christ with a hallow hand, saying Amen, and after the partaking of the body of Christ, come also to the cup of the lord The same Cyril saith, 
t 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Cyril. Catech. Mystag. 4.  that the words [my Body] were Spoken of the bread. Christ thus avoucheth and saith of the Bread, this is my Body. He resembleth the consecrated oil wherewith their foreheads were anointed, to the consecrated bread in the Eucharist. Look (saith he, 
u 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Idem. Catech. Mystag. 3.  Thou do not think it to be only bare and simple oil, for even as the consecrated bread after prayer and invocation is no more common bread, but Christ's body; so the holy oil is no more bare and simple oil, or common, but Charisma the gift of Grace: whence (as Master Rivet saith) 
x Andr. Rivet. Critici sacri. lib. 3. cap. 10.  we may thus argue as is the change in the oil, such there is in the Eucharist; but in the oil there is no change in substance, but use, and sanctification by grace; and therefore there is no substantial change or conversion in the Elements of bread and wine when they become the body and blood of Christ.  

Objection.  
Saint Cyril saith, 
y Cyril. Catech. Mystag. cap. 4.  Know you for a surety, that the bread which is seen of us is not bread, though the taste find it to be bread, but the body of Christ: insomuch as Bellarmine upon this testimony saith, 
z Bellar. lib. 2. de Euchar. cap. 13. §. Quarto.  Quid clariùs dici potest? What can be said more plainly?   

Answer.  
Cyril saith; The bread which is seen of us is not bread, and the same Cyril saith 
a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Cyril Catech. 3.  of the Water in Baptism, it is not simple water, let the one satisfy the other. Cyril saith of the bread, as he doth of the oil; that it is no bare, simple, or common oil; but Charisma, the type, and symbol of a spiritual gift; and so he meant of the bread, the Consecrated bread; that it is no ordinary or common bread, but of different use and service, and yet therein not any change of substance at all. Neither doth Cyril say as Bellarmine corruptly translateth it, or at le●st m●kes use of a corrupt translation, 
b Sub 〈…〉 datur 〈…〉 Eu●h●r. 〈◊〉. 3 § 〈◊〉  That the body of C●rist is given Sub sp●cie pan●s, Under the form of bread; but (as it ●s in the Greek) 
c 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Cy●●l. 〈◊〉. 4  Under the type of bread; even as he saith afterwards, 
d 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id 〈◊〉. 5.  Think not t●at you taste bread, but t●e Antitype of Christ's body; so that he calleth the consecrated bread and wine, ●ypes, and Antitypes, that is signs of the body and bloo● of Christ. Now where●s Cyril would not have us judge of th●s Sacrament by our taste or sense; it i● true; that as the Bread and Wine are ●ound and whi●e, a●d sweet in taste, our bodily senses m●y indeed perceive th●m; but as they are types, and A●titypes, that is, sign●s Of the body and blood ●f Christ, so ●hey a●e spiritually to be discerned, with our understanding only; as the Reverend and learned D●ctor Morton, Lo. Bishop of Coventry and Lichfi●ld, and now Lord Bishop of Dur●sme, hath observed 
B. Mo●ton 〈…〉. Book 3. ●h●p. 4 〈◊〉 4. . Lastly the same Cyril saith, 
f  That we have repentance, and remission of sins, confined only to the term of th●s present life: More might be alleged out of the same ●y●il, but these may suffice to show what he in his Catechisms taught his scholars, touching the Scriptures sufficiency, a●d Ca●on, Communion in both kinds, the Eucharist and Purgatory.  
Before I clo●e up this Centurie, I must needs speak of Constantin● the Great, and the two general Councel● held in this Age.  
In ●his age flourished the honour of our nation, that Christian Prince Constantine the Great, borne of our co●n●rey woman H●l●na; both of them Britain's by bi●th● Royal by descent, Saints by esti●ation, and true Catholics by profession.    

PA.  
Do●tor 〈◊〉 and Master Brerely show them to have b●●n● o● 
g  〈…〉.   

PRO.  
Our reverend and learned Doctor, Doctor Abbot, late Bishop of Salisbury, hath sufficiently confuted your Bishop, and acquitted them from being Papists; since they held not the grounds of Popery, as at this day, they are maintained.   

PA.  
If constantine were no Papist, of what faith t●en was he?   

PRO.  
He was of the true, ancient, Christian Faith, as may appear by these instances following.  
He held the Scriptures sufficient for deciding matte●s of Faith, and accordingly prescribed this rule to the Nicene Council, saying, 
h 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. ●heodor. E●cl●s Hist li. 1. cap. 7.  Because the Apostles Books do plainly instruct us in divine matters; therefore we ought to make our Determinations upon Questions, from words which are so divinely inspired: he saith not that the Scriptures plainly teach us what to think of the nature and substance of God (as Bellarmine would 
i Bellar lib. 4. de verbo Dei cap. 11.  wrest it) but also of the holy Law, and things concerning Religion; for so do the words sound in the original 
k 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. ●h●od. quò supra. ; and herein (saith Theodoret) 
l Theod. quò suprà.  the greater part of the Council obeyed the voice of Constantine. Constantine held it not the Pope's peculiar to summon general Coun●●lls; for he called the Council of Nice himself 
m 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Theod. lib. 1. cap 7. , and therein sat as Precedent and moderator, receiving every man's opinion, helping sometimes one part, sometimes another, 
n Eus●b de vit● Constantini● lib. 3. cap. 13.  reconciling them when they were at odds, until he brought them to an agreement in the Faith.  
The same Emperor by his royal Letters 
o 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. ibid. li. 3. c 23.  Prescribed to the Bishops such things as belonged to th● good of God's Church; yea he held himself to be a Iu●ge and supreme Governor in Causes Ecclesiastical: for he professeth (speaking generally of all so●t● of men) if any shall rashly or undadvisedly maintain these pestilent assertions (meaning the Arrians) 
p 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Theod. l. 1. cap. 1●.  His sauciness shall be● instantly kerbed by the Emperor's execution, who is God's Ministers. Moreover Constantine never sought to the Pope for pardon, he never worshipped an Image, never served Saint nor Shrine, never knew the Mass, Transubstantiation, nor the half Communion: he prayed not for his Father's soul at the performance of his Funerals, 
q 〈◊〉 de vi●a C●nstan lib. 1 ●ap. 16.  used no Requiems nor Diriges at his Exequys; he wished not any prayers to be made after his death for his own soul; but having received Baptism newly before his death, professed a steadfast hope that needed no such after-prayers, saying; 
r 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id ibid. l. 4. c. 63.  Now I know indeed that I am a blessed man, that God hath accounted me worthy of immortal life, and that I am now made partaker of the light of God. And when they that stood about him wished him longer life, he answered, 
s 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. I●id. gr●●dit Rob. S●ep●●ni Lutetiae an. 1544.  That he had now attained the true life, and that none but himself did understand of what happiness he was made partaker, and that he therefore hastened his going to his God. Thus Constantine died outright a Protestan●, he craved no after-prayers for his soul, he dreaded no Purgatory, but died in full assurance of going immediately to his God. Was this Prince now a Trent papist?  
Now to proceed; the fi●st General Council in Christianity, after the Synod of the Apostles, was that famous fi●st Council of Nice, consisting of 318. Bishops, the greatest lights that the Christian world than had; it was called about 325 years after Christ, against Arrius, that denied Christ to be ve●y God; from this Council we had o●r Nicen Creed, it was summoned not by the th●n Bishop of Rome, but by the Emperor Constantine, Gathering th●m together out of diverse Cities and Provinces, as themselves have l●f●●ccorded 
t  : We produce the sixth Canon of this Council, against the Pope's monarchical jurisdiction; the menour thereof is this: 
u 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Condil. Ni●●n. 1. 〈…〉 6 ●ag. 28 ex edit. Tilij Pa●●s. 1●●0.  Let ancient customs hold, that the Bishops of Alexandria should have the government over Egypt, Lybia, and Pentapolis, because also the Bishop of Rome hath the same custom; as also let Antioch and other Provinces hold their ancient privileges: Now these words of the Canon thus limiting and distinguishing the several Provinces, and grounding on the custom of the Bishop of Rome, that as he had pre-eminence of all the Bishops about him, so Alexandria and Antioch should have alL about them, as likewise every Metropolitan within his own Province: these words (I say) do clearly sh●w, that before the Nicene Council, the Pope neither had pre-eminence of all through the world (as now he claimeth to be an universal Bishop) nor aught to have greater pre-eminence (by their judgement) than he had before time, this being the effect of the Canon, to wit, That the Bishop of Alexandria shall have authority over his Dioceses, as the Bishop of Rome over his.   

PA.  
Bellarmine saith, 
x Sensus est, quià ità Pontifex Romanus consuevit permittere. Bellar. lib. 2. de Pont. cap. 13. §. Quarta.  the meaning of the Canon is, that the Bishop of Alexandria should have the Provinces there mentioned, because the Bishop of Rome was accustomed to permit it so to be.   

PRO.  
The words of the Canon are, Because the Church of Rome hath the like custom, here is not one word of permission. They be indeed (as learned Bishop Morton saith 
y The Grand Imposture of the (now) Church of Rome, by the Bishop of Coventrie and Lichfield. Chap. 8. sect. 2 ) words of comparison; that the Bishop of Alexandria should enjoy his privileges accordingly as the Bishop of Rome held anciently his: as if one should say, I will give this man a crown, b●cause also I gave a crown to his fellow.  
Besides, Cardinal Cusanus understandeth the Canon as we do, in this sort; 
z [Quoniam parilis mos est] id est, sicut Romanus habet omnium suorum Episcoporum potestatem; ita & Alex●ndrinus ex more habet per Aegyp●um● etc. Card. Cusan. concord. Cathol. l. 2. c. 12  As the Bishop of Rome had power and authority over all his Bishops, so the Bishop of Alexandria, according to custom, should have throughout Lybia, and the rest.  
Here by the way, the reader may observe, that though the Pope should have a large circuit for his Diocese, yet was n●t this jurisdiction given him, by the Law of Go●, but by the custom of men. Let old customs b● kept s●ith the Council: he●e was no ordinance of Christ, acknowledged, no Text of Scripture alleged for it, as now a day's; Tu es Petrus, and pasce oves, and tibi da●o claves; Thou art Peter, f●ed my sheep, and unto thee will I give the Keys of the Church. The P●p● held it not then, as it is now pre●ended, 
a 〈◊〉 2. de Pont cap. 12.  Iure Divino● by divine ordinance, but only by use and custom which may be altered, and was upon occasion; for when Constantinople became the Imperial City, than was the Bishop thereof equalled with Rome as appears by the Chalcedon Council.  
About the year 381 the second General Council, was held at Constantinople, against Macedomus, who denied the Divinity of the Holy Ghost; ●t consisted of an hundred and fifty Bishops; it was called not by the Pope, but by the Emperor Theodosius the elder. 
b 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Socrat lib. 5. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. cap. 8.   
This Council confirmed the foresaid sixth Canon of the Nicen, which bounded the Bishop of Rome (as well as other Bishops) within the precincts of his own Province. The third Canon of this Council of Constantinople speaks in this tenor: 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Synod. Occumen 2. can. 3. p●● 306. edit. Tilij G●aece.  That the Bishop of Constantine's City, that is, Constantinople hath Prerogatives of honour next after the Bishop of Rome, because it is new Rome.    

THE FIFTH CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 400. to 500  

PAPIST.  
WHat say you of this fifth Age?   

PROTESTANT.  
We are yet within the compass of the first 500 years' next after Christ, and so nearer to the time and truth of the Primitive Church: now for this present Age, it may for choice of Learned men, be compared to the Golden Age, for now flourished the Golden mouthed chrysostom, 
* nommatur●●●●them ●●●them. de Sc●●ptor. Ecclesiast.  the Well languaged Hierome and Saint Austin the very Mall and Hammer of Heretics.  
Chrisostome was 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, the most copious writer of any of the Greek Fathers now extant; he was an eloquent Preacher, full of Rhetorical figures, and amplifications; so that his vein and gift lay rather in the Ethique and Moral part of divinity, 
a In Ethicis plus exc●ll●t● quam in Didasia 〈◊〉 & Ex●geticis● Dan Toll●n● in Synopsi de legendis Pa●●ibus.  working upon the affections, than in the doctrinal and exegetical part, for information of judgement. By his liberty of speech in Pulpit, he drew the hatred of th● great ones of the 〈◊〉, and of the Emperor himself, but above all, of the Empress Eudoxia, upon his head: so that she, and Theophilus, Patria●ke of Alexandria procured his deposition and banishment, with commandment to ●●●●ney his weak● body with excessive Travels from place to place, until he concluded his life, 
b Sozo●en. lib. 8. cap. ui●. hist. Eccles.  about the year four hundred and eleven. 
c In ●xlio ponti m●●itur, Anno 411. T●it●em. de Scrip Eccl●s.   
Hierome was borne in Dalmatia, and instructed at Rome. He travailed abroad into France, and other places, of purpose to increase his knowledge, at Rome he acquainted himself with Honourable women, such as Marcelia, Sophronia, Principia, Paula, and Eustochium, to whom he expounded places of holy Scripture, for he was admitted Presbyter; he served Damasus Bishop of Rome in sorting his Papers; his gifts were envied at Rome, therefore he l●ft Rome, and took his voyage towards Palestina: by the way he acquainted himself with Epiphanius, Nazianzen, and Didymus Doctor in the School of Alexandria, and sundry other men of note and mark. In the end he came to judea, and made choice of Bethlem the place of the Lords Nativity to be the place of his death. At Bethlem, Paula a noblewoman (who accompanied Hierome, and his brother Paulinianus from Rome) upon her own charges builded four Monasteries, whereof herself guided one, and Hi●rome another. Hierome was 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 well skilled in the tongues; but he wa● a man of a Choleric and stern disposition, more inclinable to a solitary and Monkish li●e, then to fellowship and society: neither Heliodorus in the wilderness, nor Ruffinus out of the wilderness, could keep inviolable friendship with him, he flourished about the year 390. but he lived unto the year 422, 
d Hier●n●mu● mo●it●r 〈…〉 & Theod 〈…〉. T●●them i●●d●  & therefore we place him in this fifth Age, and so doth Bellarmine. 
〈◊〉 lib 2 de Euc●●rist●●, cap. ●3.   
Augustine in his younger years was infected with the error of the Manichees; his mother Monica prayed to God for his conversion, and God heard her prayers; fo● by the p●eac●ing of Ambrose, bishop of Milan, an● by reading the life of Antonius the Eremite, he was wonderfully moved, and began to dislike his former conversation. He went into a quiet Garden accompanied with Alipius, and there as he was with tears bewailing his former course, and desiring God's grace for working his conversion, he heard a voice sa●i●g unto him, 
f Augustin. 〈◊〉 lib. 8. cap. 12.  Tolle & lege, and again, Tolle & lege, that is to say, Take up and read, Take up and read: at the first hearing, he thought it to be the voice of boys or maids speaking in their play such words one to another: but when he looked about, and could see nobody, he knew it to be some heavenly admonition, warning him to take up the book of holy Scripture (which he had in the Garden with him) and read. Now the first place that fell in his hands, after the opening of the book, was this: 
g Rom. 13. vers. 13 14  Not in gluttony and drunkenness, neither in chambering and wantonness, nor in strife and envying● but put ye on t●e Lord jesus Christ, and take no thought for the flesh to fulfil the lusts of it. At the reading whereof, he was so fully resolved to forsake the vanities of the world, and to become a Christian, that immediately thereafter he was babtized by Saint Ambrose, with his companion Alipius, and his son Adeodatus. He was afterwards made bishop of Hippo in Africa. He defended the truth against the Manichees, Pelagians, Donatists, and whatsoever error else prevailed in this age. He is to be commended, in that he revised his own Writings, and wrote his retractations, or r●cognitions. When he had lived 76 years, he re●●ed from his labours, before the Vandals had taken the town of Hippo which in the time of Augustine's sickness they had besieged: and thus was he translated, and taken away, before he saw the evil that came upon the place. 
h Isai. 57.1.   
Besides these learned Trium virs, there lived in this age Theodoret bishop of Cyrus a town in Syria, cyril bishop of Alexandria, Leo the great and Gelasius bishops of Rome, Vincentius Lirinensis a great impugner of Heresies, as also Sedulius of Scotland 
i Sedulius Presbyter, natione Scotus, claruit Anno 430. Trith●m. de Script. eccles. , whose Collections are extant upon Saint Paul's Epistl●s, 
k Sedulij Scoti Hi●erniensis, in omnes Epistolas ●auli Collectane● excus. Basil. 1528.  and his testimonies frequently cited by the learned L. Primate Doctor Usher in his Treatise of the ancient Irish Religion.  

O● the Scriptures sufficiency.  
Saint Augustine saith, 
l In 〈◊〉 qu● aper●è 〈…〉. Aug de Doctrine. 〈◊〉 li. 2 c 9 tom. 3.  In those things which are laid down plainly in the Scriptures, all those things are found, which appertain to faith and direction of life.  
Bellarmine would shift off this place by saying, 
m Loquitur de ill● 〈◊〉 quae necessa●ia sunt omnibus simplici●●●, qu●●lia sunt quae habentur in Symbolo Ap●●tolico, & D●●alogo. Bellar. lib. 4. de Ve●bo D●i non sc●●pto. ●●p 11. §. ultimo.  That Austin meant, that in Scripture are contained all such points as are simply necessary for all, to wit, the Creed, and the Commandments; but beside these, other things necessary for Bishops and Pastors 
n 〈…〉 I●. ibid. § 〈◊〉.  were delivered by tradition: but this stands not with Austin's drift, for in the Treatise alleged the Doctrine Christianâ, he purposely instructeth not the people, but Christian Doctors and Teachers; so that where he saith, In the Scriptures are plainly set down all things which contain Faith, Hope, and Charity, he meaneth (as elsewhere 
o Aug. de 〈◊〉 Christ. lib. 1. cap. 1. & lib. 4 ●a●. 4.  he expresseth himself) all things which are necessarily to be believed, or done, not only of the Lay people, but even of Ecclesiastickes. In like sort the same father saith; 
p  Those things which seemed sufficient to the salvation of believers, were chosen to be written.  
Vincentius Lirinensis 
 saith, that the Canon or Rule of Scripture is perfect, abundantly sufficient in itself for all things, yea more than sufficient; neither is this a false supposal, as a jesuit pretends it to be, 
r  but a grounded truth, and the Author's doctrine: Li●inensis indeed maketh first one general sufficient Rule for all things, the sacred Scriptures; Secondly another, useful in some cases only, yet never to be used in those cases without Scriptures, which is, the Tradition of the Universal Church, and general consent of Fathers. The first was used by the ancient Church from the worth that is in itself; the other is used to avoid the jarring interpretations of perverse Heretics that many times abuse the sacred Rule & Standard of the Scripture. Now we admit the Church's Interpretation, as ministerial to holy Scripture, so it be conformable thereunto. And we say with the learned rejoinder to the jesuit Malounes Reply: 
s rejoinder to the jesuits Reply, sect. 5. pa. 1●0.  Bring us now one Scripture expounded (according to Lirinensis his Rule 
t Quod ubique quod semper, quod ab ominibus creditum est. Lirin.  ) by the Universal consent of the Primitive Church, to prove Prayer to Saints, Image worship in your sense, and we will receive it.  
Saint Cyril saith, 
u Non omnia quae Dominus fecit conscripta sunt, sed quae scriben●●s tam ad mores, quam ad dogmata putarunt sufficere. Cyril. Alexand. tom. 1. lib. 12. in johan. cap. ult.  that All things which Christ did are not written, but so much as holy writers judged sufficient both for good manners and Godly faith. And in another place he saith, 
x Sufficit divina Scriptura ad faciendum eos qui in illà educati sunt sapientes et probatissimos et sufficientissi●am habentes intelligentiam. Cyril. tom. 1 lib. 7. cont. julian. pa. 159.  The holy Scripture is sufficient to make them which are brought u● in it wise, and most approved, and furnished with most sufficient understanding.  
Saint Hierome reasoneth Negatively from the Scriptures, saying: 
y Vt haec quae scripta sunt non negamus, it●●a quae non sunt scripta renuimus. Natum Deum esse de virgi●e credimus, quia legimus: Mari●m nupsisse post partum non credimus, qula non legimus. Hieron. tom. 2. advers. Helvid.  As we deny not those things that are written, so we refuse those things that are not written; That God was borne of a Virgin we believe, because we read it; That Mary did marry after she was delivered we believe not, because we read it not.  
Saint chrysostom saith, 
z 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Chrysost. in 2. epist. ad Thess. tom. 4. edit. Savilij p●g. 234.  that All those things that are in holy writ are right and clear: that, Whatsoever is necessary, is manifest therein; yea, he calleth the 
a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. Hom. 13. in 2. ep. ad Cor. To. 3. edit. Savilij. pag. 624.  Scripture, The most exact Balance, Square, and Rule of Divine verity.  
This was the Father's Rule of Faith of old, and the same a perfect one; but the Papists now adays make it but a part of a Rule, 
b Regula Fidei, non totalis, sed partiali● Bellar. lib. 4. de verbo non scripto. cap. 12. §. Dico.  half a Rule; and piece it with Tradition.   

Of the Scripture Canon.  
Saint Hierome, who was well skilled in the tongues, travailed much, and saw the choicest Monuments of Antiquity, as also the best Libraries that the Eastern Parts could afford, and was therefore likely to meet with the best Canon, nameth all the Books which we admit, and afterwards addeth: 
c Hic Prologu● Scripturarum quasi Galeatum principium omnibus libris quos de Hebraeo vertimus in Latinum convenire potest, ut scire valeamus qui●quid extra hos est inter Apocrypha esse ponendum; igitur Sapientia quae ●ulgo Salomo●is inscribitur, & jesu ●ilij Syrach liber, & judith, & Tubias, & Pastor 〈◊〉 sunt in Canone. Hieron. Tom. ●. prae●at. in libr. Regum.  Whatsoever is beside these, is to be put amongst the Apocrypha; and that therefore the Book of Wisdom, of jesus the Son of Syrach, of judith, Tobias, and Pastor, are not in the Canon.  
The same Hierome having mentioned the Book of Wisdom, and Ecclesiasticus, and delivered his opinion, that it is untruly called the Wisdom of Solomon, and attributed to him, then addeth: 
d .  That as the Church readeth judith, Tobias, and the Maccabees, but receiveth them not ●or Canonical Scriptures; so these two Books, (●amely) the Wisdom of Sal●mon, and jesus the Son of Syrach, doth the Church read for the edification of the people, not to confirm the authority of any doctrine in the Church.   

Objection.  
The Carthaginian Council received those Books which you account 
〈◊〉 ●arthag te●tium Can 47.  Apocryphal.   

Answer.  
They received them in Canonem Morum, not in Canonem Fidei. It is true ind●ed that Saint Austin, and the African Bishops of his time, and some other in that Age, finding these Books which Hierome and others reject as Apocryphal, to be joined with the other, and together read with them in the Church, seem to account them to be Canonical; but they received them only into the Ecclesiastic Canon 
f Ho● 〈◊〉 [Maccab●●●um] none Iul●i sed 〈◊〉 Can●nicis habit Aug. de Civit Dei. lib. ●8. cap. 36. tom 5. & de M●●abil. S. ●cripturae. li. 2. cap. 34. tom 3.  serving for Example of life, and instruction of manners: and not into any part of the Rule of Faith, or Divine Canon, as Saint Austin speaking of the Books of the Maccabees distinguisheth, saying: 
g Quo●um supputatio t●mp●rum, non in Sc●ipturu sanctis, quae Cano●●cae app●lla●tu●, ●ed in aliis invenitur, in quibus sunt M●ccabaeorum L●b. ● Aug de C●vit. D●●. lib. 18 c. 36  This reckoning is not found in the Canonical Scriptures, but in other Books, as in the Maccabees; plainly distinguishing between the Canonical Scriptures, and the Books of the Maccabees: Wherein, (saith he 
h In 〈◊〉 libr●●, et si aliqui● mi●abilium numero in●erendum i●veniatur, de ho● tamen null● cur●●a●iga●imur, quia tintum ag●r● pr●posui●us● ut d● divi●i C●●on●● mirab●l●bus exp●sition●m t●●ge 〈◊〉. August. de Mirabil. S. Scr●ptu●ae lib. 2. cap. 34. ) There may be something found worthy to be joined with the number of those miracles; yet hereof will we have no care, for that we intent the miracles, Divini Canonis, which are received in the Divine Canon.  
Of the book of judith he tells us, 
i L●br●m judith, in Canone S●●iptur●rum judei non 〈◊〉 dicunt●r. Aug. d. Civitat. Dei. lib. 18 c●p. ●●.  The jews never received it into the Canon of Scriptures; and withal there he professeth, That the Canon of the ●ewes was most Authentical.  
Touching the books of Wisdom, and Ecclesiasticus, he tells us, 
k Sapientia & Ecclesiasticus, propter eloquij nonnullam similitudinem, ut Salomonis dicatur, obtinuit consuetudo, non autem esse ipsius dubitant doctiores. Id. ibid. lib. 17. cap. 20.  that, They were called Salomon's, only for some likeness of Style, but the Learned doubt whether they b●e his.  
Lastly, the Council of Carthage, whereat Saint Austin was present, Prescribing that no books should be read in the Church as Canonical, but such as indeed are Canonical, leaveth out the book of Maccabees, as it appeareth by the Greek Edition, 
l Synod. Carthag. apud Balsam. in editione joh. Tilij.  though they have shuffled them into the Latin; 
m Caranza in summ● Concil. & Codex Cano●● vetus Ecclesi● Romanae.  which argueth suspicion of a forged Canon.  
Now to this ancient evidence of Hierome, and Austin, the Papists make but a poor Reply. Canus saith, 
n Hieronymus non est regula fidei— nondum eares satis erat explorata. Canus loc. Theol. li 2. ca 11.  that Hierome is no rule of Faith; and that the matter was not then sufficiently sifièd: Bellarmine saith, 
o Adm●tto Hieronymum in eâ ●uisse opinion, qu●a nondum generale Concilium de hi● libris aliquid statuerat. Bellar. de ve●bo Dei li. 1. ca 10. § Respondeo.  I admit that Hierome was of that opinion, because as yet a General Council had decreed nothing touching those books; and Saint Austin might likewise doubt thereof; so that by Bellarmine's confession, Hierome, and Austin, in this point are ours.   

Of Communion under both kinds.  
Saint chrysostom saith, 
p 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Chrys●st. sup 2. Co●● Homil. 18. tom. 3. edit. Savilij pag. 645.  that whereas Under the Law, there was a difference between Priests and Laics in communicating of victim●s; In the n●w it is otherwise; for one body and one Cup is ministered to all.  
Hierom saith 
q Sacerdotes qui Eucharistiae serviunt, & sanguinem Domini populis ejus dividunt. Hieron s●p. Sophon cap 3. tom 6.  that the Pastors administered the Eucharist, and distributed the blood of our Lord to his people; the same Hierome report●th how Exuperius Bishop of Tholouse in France was wont to carry the Communion to person's absent. There was no man (saith he) 
r Nihil illo d●tius qui corpus Domini can●stro vimineo, sanguin●m po tat in vitro. Hieron Epist. ad Rusticum. tom. 1.  richer than Exuperius, who carried the Lords body in a Wicker basket, and his blood in a Glass. It is true indeed that the Bishop sold the Church●Plate for the relief of the poor; 
s Avaritiam eje●i● è t●mplo Higher ibid.— sac●o vasa erogavit in usum pauperum E●asm. in loc. Hiero●ymi.  so that he was driven to use Osier baskets, and Glasse-cups; but withal the story saith, he carried the consecrated bread and wine severally and apart, and not by way of concomitancy.  
Besides that, the wine might be carried abroad in a vial, to sick persons, without any such danger of spilling, as the 
I. F. rejoinder to D. Whites Reply, 7. point.  jesuit dreams on.  
Saint Austin saith, 
u Non solum nem● p●ohibetur, sed ad bibendum poti●s omn●s exhortantur, qui vo●un●●●bere vi●●m Aug. to. 4● qu. 57 sup Levit. Sang●●● Abe. sig●●●ic●t sanguined Ch●isti, qu●●niv●●sa ecclesia acce●t● di●it Amen. Id. abide. qu. 49  All that would have life are exhorted to drink of the blood; and, that The whole Church having received the Cup, answereth, Amen.  
Pope L●o reproveth such as in his time refused the Cup, which is a token that the Cup was then in use among the Laiety, his words are these: 
x Cumque a● tegen●am in●id●litatem s●am, n●st●is a●de●nt interest myst●●i●●, ita in Sac●am●nt●●●m 〈◊〉 se temper at, ut interdum 〈◊〉 lateant, ore i d●g●o C●risti corpus accip●urt, s●●guinem auté Red●mptioni. ● strae haurire omnia● declinant; quod ide● v●str●m volumus s●i●e sanctitatem ut vobis hujusmodi hom●nes et his manifestentu indi●ijs, et quorum depre●ensa ●●rit sacri●ega 〈◊〉, n●tati et proditi, á S●ncto 'em societate, s●cer●●ta i aut● crit●te pellantu● Leo ser. 4. de Quadrages.  Whereas some to hide their infidelity come sometimes to Catholic Churches, and are present at the celebration of sacred mysteries, they so temper the matter that with unworthy mouths they receive the Lords body, but decline to drink the blood of our Redemption. I would ●herefore have your holiness take notice, that by these signs they may be discovered, and their Sacrilegious dissembling may be found out and descried, that being thus discovered they may by Priestly authority he cast out of the society of the Saints.  
In like sort Gelasius enjoined Communion in both kinds. We have found (saith he) 
y Comperimu● autem quod qui la●●mptà tant●●●odo corpo is sacri poti●ns, a chalice sacri cruno●is abstincant; qui proculdubi● (quùm neset qu● superslitione do●entur obstringe) aut integra sa●ramenta recipiant aut abinteg●is arce●tur: quia divisio unius eju●demque mysterij fine gra●d sacrilegio non potest perven●re. Dec●e● 3. part. de Con●ecrat. Dist. 2. cap. Comperimus autem.  That certain having received a portion of the sacred body only, abstain from the Cup of the most holy blaud; which men because they are said to be entangled with I know not what superstition, either let them receive the whole Sacrament, or else let them be wholly excluded from receiving; because there can be no dividing of one and the same mystery without grievous Sacrilege.   

Reply.  
Gelasius (haply) speaketh of some 
* [●ut integre] Hoc ●●t●lli●● de Confi●i●nte. G●o●●a ibid.  Priests who consecrated the elements, but themselves received not in both kinds.   

Answer.  
The words he useth are Recipiant, and Arceantur, which do evidently prove, that he speaks of the people, who do not themselves receive the Sacrament, but from the Minister's hand; as also the word Arceantur, that is, Let them not be received, though they offer themselves.  
Besides, the ancient histories speak not of any Priest that ever made scruple of drinking of the Chalice which himself had consecrated.   

Reply.  
The Manichees had an opinion, 
z Vinum non bibunt dicentes fel esse tenebrarum. August. de Haeres. 46. Tom. 6.  that Wine was not created by God, but by some evil spirit, and that Christ did not shed his blood on the Cross, and hereupon they abstained from the Chalice: therefore the Church in detestation of this error, for a time commanded Communion under both kinds; 
a The rejoinder to Dr. Whites Reply.  upon this occasion Gelasius made the Decree recorded by Gratian.   

R●joynder.  
This was not done upon occasion of the Manichees error; for before ever they appeared in any number, Communion in both kinds was practised, as appeareth by the Apostles, Ignatius, justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Tertullian, and Saint Cyprian. Now Cyprian the youngest of these flourished about the year two hundred and fifty 
b Floruit Cyprian ann 250. Bell. de Script. eccles. , and the Manichees rose not till about the year two hundred seventy three. 
c Manichaei a Manete quodam dicti sunt circ● annum 273. Prateolus de Haeres. lib. 11.   
Again, although Leo speak of the Manichees, yet jesuit Vasques saith, 
d Leo non commendavit usum Calicis contra Manichaeos', sed admonuit ut diligentur observarent quosdam Manich●os, qui ut se Ca●holicos simularent, ita sumebant calicem, ut sanguinem non haurirent in alterâ specie. Vasquez qu. 80. art. 12. Disp. 216. nu. 42  that He commanded not the use of the Cup because of them, but required that those which feigned themselves Catholics, and came to the holy Communion, receiving the bread, and taking the Cup into their hands, pretending that they drank the wine, and yet did not, should carefully be observed. Now among a multitude of Communicants some few might hold the Cup to their mouth, and make show of drinking, and yet receive no wine. The Cup then was not for a time only allowed to the Laics by Leo and Gelasius, thereby to discover who were Manichees; but in these Pope's days the Cup was usually and ordinarily given to the Laics, and upon the refusing of the Cup (then in use among the Catholics) the Manichees were discovered; otherwise how could the Pope have reproved their practice? How could the Manichees have be●ne espied and known, if they and the Catholics had received in one kind both alike? For this is the token that Leo would have them known by, for that Th●y refuse to drink the blood of our Redemption; by which words it is clear, that the Cup was offered orderly unto them, as unto others, but th●y refused it.  
Now touching the place of G●lasius, the same Vasqu●z saith, 
e Quid●m probabiliter exp●ic●nt de 〈◊〉 Mani●●ae●●, q●i communicabant sub alte●● specie tantum: 〈…〉 licet 〈◊〉 verbi 〈…〉 poss●t 〈…〉 reddit, non 〈…〉 esse 〈…〉 ut sine grandi sacrilegio divi li ●●queat nempe intellige●e videtur ratione suae signifi●at●●onis & institutionis. Vasquez. in 3. part. Tho●ae quaest. 81. Disp. 216 nu. 76.  that Whereas some of his part apply the same to the Manichees, Canon● for therein he teacheth That the mystery of the Eucharist is of that nature in regard of itself, that without grievous sacrilege it cannot be divided and severed the one part from the other, to wit, because of the institution and signification. Admit then, that the Manichees occasioned this Decree; yet this Decree is backed with a general ●eason which forbids all to communicate in one kind only, under the peril of Sacrilege: so that the Pope's Canon reacheth not only to the Manichee, but to all such as halve the Communion, be they Manichees, o● Papists, or whatsoever they be.   

Of the number of Sacraments.  
Saint Austin 
f Dormi●●ti Ad● fit Evi de ●atere, mortuo Christo per●utitur la●●●, ut pros●●ant Sacram●nta, quib●s formetur Ecclesia. August. tract. 9 in joan. & tracts 15. to 9 Leo ep. 22.  with others, tell us, That the Sacraments of the n●w Law flowed out of Christ's side: now none issued thence, but the Sacrament of water, which is Baptism, and the Sacrament of blood in the Supper.  
The same Austin saith, 
g Qued●m pa●●ca pro multis cad●mque factu facillim●, & intellectu augustissima & observatione cass●ssima, ipse D●minus, et Apostolica tradidit Disciplina, sicuti est Baptismi Sacramentum & celebratio corporis & sanguinis Domini. Aug de doctr. Christ. ●ib. 3 c. 9 tom. 3  Our Lord and his Apostles have d●liv●red unto us a few Sacraments in stead of many, and the same in doing most easy, in signification most excellent, in observation most rev●rend, as is the Sacrament of Baptism, and the celebration of the body and blood of our Lord. And the same Father speaking of the same Sacraments (whi●h he calleth, for 
h Sacramentis ●ume●o paucissimis, observatione facillimis signifi●atione prestantissinis, so●iet t●m novi pop●li colligavit; si cuti est Baptisinus, & communic●●● Corporis, ●t sang●i●is i●fius Aug. epist. 118 ad januar. tom. 2.  number the fewest, for observation, easiest, for signification excellentest) withal indeed addeth a si quid aliud, if any such other Sacrament be to be found in Scripture, but himself could not find any other; for he concludeth them within the number of two, saying, 
i H●ec sunt Eccl●siege mina Sacramenta. Aug. de Symbolo ad Catech. tom. 9  These be the two Sacraments of the Church.   

Of the Eucharist.  
Saint chrysostom saith, 
k Sicut enim antequàm sanctificetur pani●, panem nominamus: divin● autem illum sanctificante grati●, mediante Sacerdote, liberatus est quidem ab appellatione ●anis, dig●us aut●m habitus est Dominici corpo●is appellatione etiamsi natura panis in ipso remansit Chrysost● ad Caesa●ium Monach.  that Before the Bread be sanctified, we call it Bread, but when God's grace [after consecration] hath sanctified it by the means of the Priest, it is freed from the name of Bread, and is accounted worthy of the name of the Body of Christ, although the nature of the Bread remain still in it.  
Ch●ysostome saith the nature of bread remaineth after consecration, they say nothing remains but the outward forms and accidents of bread.   

Reply.  
Bellarmin 
l Neque in toto Chrysostomi opere ullus est liber. vel Epistola ad Caesa●ium. Bell. lib. 2. de Euchar. cap. 22. §. Respo●deo.  saith that this Epistle is not extant amongst Saint Chrysostome's Works: and when Peter Martyr objected this place to Stephen Gardiner Bishop of Winchester, the Bishop replied, 
m Non est hoc ●oannis Chrysostomis, sed ●oanni● cujusdam Constantinopolitaniss Pet. Mart. defensio doctrinae de Eucharistiâ adversus Gardinerum. pag. 368.  That it was none of Chrysostom's, but another johns of Constantinople.   

rejoinder.  
What though it were not then extant? divers parcels of chrysostom have been lately found out, and annexed to his other Works.  
Besides, the same Bishop Gardiner reports, 
n Stephen Gardener in his Explication of the true Catholic faith, touching the Sacrament of the Altar. pag. 116.  that Peter Martyr saith, that this Treatise of chrysostom was extant in a Manuscript, and found in the Library at Florence; and that a Copy thereof remained in the Archbishop of Canterbury's hands. Again, they that would father t●is treatise on another, the● must bring us another john of Constantinople, besides chrysostom, and tell us what time he lived; it is usual with the church-story, and S●int Austin, and Jerome to call chrysostom john of Consta●tinople, or Priest of Antioch. Lastly, this Author saith nothing but what Saint Ambrose, Gelasius, and Theodoret have vouched.  
For whereas the Heretic E●tyches taught that Christ his body was changed into the substance of his Divinity after the resurrection; and that the substance of his body remained no more the same; Pope Gelasius confuteth him by a similitude and comparison drawn from the Sacrament, to wit, T●at as the substance of Bread remaineth after consecration; so Christ his bodily substance remained after the resurrection. His words are these: 
●●rta Sacrame●ta quae 〈…〉 & sanguinis Christ, d●vira r●s ●st, propter qu●d, 〈◊〉 p●r ead●m divinae 〈◊〉, ●●nsortes natu 〈…〉 timen esse non des●●t ●●bstanti● vel natura pa●●● & vini. G●l●sius de du b. nature. in Christo, con●●à Fu●ichen. p●g. 233. B●sil. 1528. & in Bi●●●ioth. Patr. to. 5. pag. 475. Pa●is. 1575.  The Sacraments which we receive, of the body and ●loud of Christ, are a divine thing, by means whereof we are made partakers of the divine nature; and yet the substance or nature of Bread and Wine doth not cease to be. The Papists they tell us, that after consecration the substance of bread and wine is abolished, and the sha●e●, accidents, & quantity thereof only remain: but this is contrary to these Father's assertion, who say, there ceaseth not to be the very substance of bread and wine. Neither will it serve to say 
p Loq●●tur de Essen●ia & natu●à accident●um. B●ll●r. lib. 2. de Euchar. c. 27. § S●d. & Gelasiu● idem docet quod The●do●etus. Bellar. ibid. § Eadem.  that Gelasius by substance meant accidents: for if Gelasius had not taken the word substance properly in both places, he had not concluded against the Heretic.   

Reply.  
Pope Gelasius was not the Author of this 
q No●andum est Gelasi●m i●●um non ●uisse Rom●num Pontifice Bellar. loco citato. §. Vbi●  Treatise, but some other of that name.   

rejoinder.  
There be diverse Authors that entitle Pope Gelasius to it? but were it Gelasius Bishop of Caesarea, as Bellarmine seems to incline 
Id Ibi●. , or a more ancient Gelasius, Gelasius Citizenus, as Baronius would have it 
an●o●●2 ●●2. ; the record is still good against our adversaries, for it is confessed on all sides, that he was an Orthodox Father, and very ancient.  
Theodoret brings in Eranistes in the person of an Eutycl●ian Heretic, who confounded the two natures in Christ, and (falsely) held, that The body of Christ after his Ascension, being Glorified, was swallowed up of the Deity, and continued no more the same humane and bodily essence, as before his resurrection it had been; and for defence of this his Heresy, he takes his comparison from the Eucharist and argues in this sort: 
t 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Theodor. Di●log. 2. cap. 24. p●g 113.  Even as the symbols or signs of the Lords body and blood, af●er the words of Invocation (or Consecration) are not the same, but are changed into the Body of Christ; even so after his Ascension was his body changed into a divine substance.  
To this Objection of the Heretics, the Orthodox or Catholic (which was Theodoret himself) replies, and retorts his own instance upon him thus: You are caught (saith he 
u 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. Ibid. ) in your own net, for as the mystical signs in the Eucharist, after sanctification (or Consecration) do not go out of their proper nature, but continue in their former figure, and substance, and may be seen and felt as before: so the body of Christ after the Resurrection remaineth in its former figure, form, circumscription, and (in a word) the same substance which it had before, although after the Resurrection it be immortal, and free from corruption. In which passage we see the Heretic held, that Bread is changed after consecration into the substance of Christ's body, and so do our adversaries; the Orthodox or Catholic taught, that Bread after consecration remaineth in substance the same, and so do we teach. Theodoret indeed (and so do we) acknowledged that Christ's body after his Ascension was changed from a corruptible, to an immortal and glorious body, but yet not changed in substance; it still remained the same in substance; even as the Elements in the Sacrament remain the same in substance, 
x Neque enim signa mysti●a post sanctification●m r●c●●ūt à suà naturà● manent ●nim in priore su●s●anti●, et figur●, et fo●m● & videri et tangi poss●n●, sicut & p●ius. Theodor. tom 2. Dial. 2. Inconfusus. Gentiano Herveto Interpret.  that they Were before consecration, and may be seen and felt, though they be changed in use, from common to consecrated bread and wine.  
Now if the Elements of Bread and Wine (according to this Orthodox Father) remain in their former substance, shape, and species, then is not the whole substance of bread and wine changed into the whole substance of the body and blood of Christ; and where is then your Transubstantiation.   

Answer.  
B●llarmine answereth this place by distinguishing the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, substantia, saying 
y Non loq●itur de sub●st●ntiâ quae dist●nguitur c●●trâ 〈◊〉; sed de essentiâ & naturâ Accidentium, quae ipse perpetuò symbo●a appell●t. Bellar. li. 2. de Euchar. c. 27. §. Sed. ; When Theodoret saith, ●hat the substance of the Elements remains, and is not changed, he speaketh not of substance, as it is opposed to accidents, but of the ●ssence and nature of accidents, which he always understandeth by Symbols.   

Reply.  
Theodoret in this very Dialogue exactly distinguisheth between Substance and Accidents; and showeth that by 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 he means not Accidents, but Substance properly so taken, saying; 
z 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Theodor. Dial. 2. ca● 22. p. 105.  Therefore we call a body substance, and health and sickness an accident; by which passage it is evident against Bellarmine, that Theodoret takes not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for the essence, specially of accidents, but for substance properly so called, as it is opposed to Accidents. Besides, if Theodoret had thought (as the Papists hold) that the substance of bread and wine ceaseth, and is changed into the very body and blood of christ; and that the accidents thereof only remain, as namely the whiteness, roundness, taste, or the like; then could not this Father have drawn or retorted an Argument from the Sacrament, to proeve that the substance of Christ's body remained after his ascension; for then (as the learned on ou● side have well observed) 
a 
Bishop W●●te● Reply to jesuit Fisher's Answer, 6. point.  
Doctor Featlies' Conference with M. egleston. and Wo●d.   the Heretic upon the doctrine of Transubstantiation, might have inferred this erroneous opinion, about the humane nature of Christ, to wit, that as in the Eucharist there is only the outward shape and form of bread, and not the real substance: even so in Christ, there was the shape and form of flesh but not the very nature. The same Theodoret saith, 
b 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Th●od. 〈…〉 c●p 8. p. 34.  that our Saviour honoured the visible symbols with the name of his body and blood; not changing the nature, but adding grace to nature. The same Th●odoret saith, 
c 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. Ibid.  that our Saviour gave the sign the name of his body. What can a man say more express? then that in th●se words, This is my body, our Saviour hath given to the sign, that is to say, to the bread, the name of his body.   

Answer.  
You stand much upon Theodoret, but Gregory Valence 
d Theodoretus de aliis quibusdam erro●ibus in Concilio Ephesino notatu● fuit, etiamsi posteà resipuit. Greg. de Valentia lib. de Transub. cap. 7. sect. 11. pag. 390. volume. de reb. fidei controvers.  tells you that Theodoret was taxed of error by the Council of Ephesus, although he afterwards revoked his error.   

Reply.  
You should have shown that the Council taxed him with error in this point of the Sacrament; or that he retracted this opinion as erroneous, and then you had said somewhat.  
It is true indeed, that at fi●st he was not so firm in his faith, being too much addicted to Theodorus Bishop of Mopsvestia, and to Nestorius, so that he wrote against the twelve Chap●ers which Cyril composed against the Nestorians; but afterwards he revoked his error, and accursed Nestorius, 
e Mariam virginem quae peperit Dominum nostrum jesum Chris●um, non 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 dicendam, sed 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 [dixit Nest●rius] Danaeus in Aug. de Haeres. cap. 91. ex Evagrio.  and whosoever should not confess the blessed Virgin to be the mother of God, whereupon th● Council of Chalcedon received him into their Communion. 
f D. Crakentho●pe of the fifth general Council. cap. 9 nu. 9   
Besides, in the Dialogues alleged, Theodoret hath notably opposed the Grand Heretic Eutyches, and therein showed himself very Orthodox.  
I proceed to Saint Austin, the Oracle of the Latin Fathers; whose judgement touching the Eucharist hath been in part declared in the first Centurie. He held that those words, This is my Body were to be taken in a figurative sense; his rule is, that whensoever the Sign (as the Bread) being called Chris●'s body, hath the name of The thing signified, the speech is always figurative, 
g Ex hac autem similitudine plerumque e●iam ipsa●um r●rum nomina accipiunt, quarum Sacramenta sunt, sicut ergò secundum qu●●dam modum Sacrame●tum Co●po●is Christi ●orpus Christi est. Augustin tom. 2 Ep●st. 23 ad Bonifa.  for Sacraments be signs which often do take the names of those things, which they do signify and represent, Therefore do they carry the names of the things themselves. Thus Baptism the sign of Christ's burial, is called Christ's burial; now as 
h Vt Baptismus dicitur sepulchrum, si● hoc est corpus meum. Aug. con. Faust. lib. 20 cap. 21.  Baptism is called Christ's Burial, so is the Sacrament of the Body of Christ, called his Body; and again, 
i Non enim Dominu● d●bitavit dicere, hoc est corpus me●m● cum sig●●●n ●aret co●poris sui. August. to 6 contr. Adimant. c. 12.  Christ doubted not to say, This is my Body, when he gave a sign of his body. The same Father upon occasion of Christ's speech, Except you eat the flesh of the Son of man, [joh. 6.53.] gives us this general rule; 
k Q●●●quid in sermon divino neque ad morum honestatem, neque ad si●●i veritatem propriè ref●●ri pot●●t, siguratum esse cognos●●●. Aug. lib. 3. de doct●●●. Christ. c. 10● tom 3.  That whensoever we find in Scripture any speech of commanding some heinous act, or forbidding some laudable thing, there to hold the spe●ch to be figurative, even as this of eating the flesh of Chr●st. Now of this Sacrament doth not Christ say, Take, eat, This is my Body? Saint Austin's words are these: 
Si preceptiva locutio ●lagitium aut facinus videtur ●ubere, figurita est● ut [N●si manduc●veritis ●arnem meam] sacinus videtur jubere. Id. Ibid. c. 16.  If the Scripture seem to command any vile or ill fact, the speech is figurative; Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you; facinus vel flagitium videtur jubere, Christ seemeth to command a wicked and sinful act; figura est ergo; It is therefore a figurative speech, 
m Figura ell ergo, pr●ecipiens passioni Domini esse communicandum● et ●uavitèr a●que utilitèr rec●●dendum in memori●● quod pro nobl● caro ●jus ●rucis●xa & vulnerata sit. Id. Ibid.  Commanding us to partake of the passion of Christ, and sweetly and profitably keep in memory that his flesh was crucified for us. Now for the manner of our feeding on Christ's body, the same Father tells us, 
n Q●omodo in c●●um 〈◊〉 mittam, ut ibi s●dent●m t●neam● s●dem 〈◊〉, & 〈◊〉 August. sup. 〈◊〉 50 tom. ●●  that It is not corporal and sensual, but spiritual, credendo by believing: How shall I send up my hand into heaven, to take hold on Christ fitting there? Send thy Faith (saith he) and thou hast hold of him. Again, 
o 〈…〉. 25.  Why preparest thou thy teeth and thy belly? Believe, and thou hast eaten; and again, 
p 〈◊〉 enim 〈…〉. Id. Ibid. 〈◊〉. 20●  For this is to eat the living bread, to believe in him; he that believeth in him, eateth.   

Objection.  
You rely much upon Saint Augustine, but he makes for us, as may appear by that place where he saith, 
q 〈…〉 illud corp●● in manibus 〈◊〉 Aug. to●●. in Psal 33. Con●● 1. tom. 8.  that Christ at his Supper carried himself in his own hands.   

Answer.  
Our learned Doctor, Bishop Morton hath notably cleared 
Bishop Mor●on of ●he M●sse, Book 4. ch●p. ●. s●ct. 8.  this place. Saint Augustine expounding the 3●. Psalm, and falling upon a wrong translation of that place in Samuel 1.21.13. And David feigned himself mad in their hands, reads thus, He carried himself in his own hands. Now this cannot (saith he) be meant of David, or any other man literally; they are meant then of Christ, when he said of the Eucharist, This is my body. Now these words, Et ferebatur in manibus suis, are neither in the Original Hebrew text, nor in your vulgar Translation, for there it is● & collabebatur inter manus eorum, David playing the mad man, slipped, or fell into the hands of others; they that transcribed the Septuagint mistaking 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, his hands, his own hands, for their hands occasioned this interpretation. Now Saint Austin interprets himself, and answereth his Quomodo ferebatur? with a Quodammodo, an 
s Et ipse se portab●● Quodammodo. Aug. in Psal. 33. conc. 2.  Adverbe of likeness and similitude, saying that After a certain manner Christ carried himself in his own hands, and thus he qualifies his fo●mer speech; so that it cannot be understood of Christ's Corporal carrying of his body properly in his own hands; but Quodammodo, af●er a so●t: and thus Saint Austin saith, 
t Sicut secundum quendam modum Sacramentum Corporis, corpus Christi est; ●ta Sa●ramentum sidei Fides est. Aug. epist. 23. ad Bonifac.  Secu●dum quendam modum, this Sacrament after a sort is the body of Christ, n●t literally, but as Baptism (the Sacrament of Faith) is called faith, to wit, figuratively and improperly.   

Objection.  
You alleged Saint chrysostom against Transubstantion, but he makes for it, saying, 
u Qu●madmodum si cera igni adhibi●a illi assimilatur, nihil substantiae remanet, nihil superfluit: sic & hic pu●a mysteria consumi corporis substantia. Chrysost tom. 3. Homil. de Euchar. in Encoenijs.  Dost thou see bread? dost thou see wine? do these things go to the draught as other meats do? not so, think not so● for as when wax is put to the fire, nothing of the substance remaineth, nothing redoundeth; so here also t●inke thou the mysteries consumed with the substance of the body of Christ.   

Answer.  
This place (as Bishop Bilson saith) 
x Bish. Bilson of Christian Subjection, the fourth part, pag. 658.659. etc.  makes not for you; for you say the substance is abolished, but the accidents of bread and wine remain: but when you put wax in●o the fire, nothing, neither show, nor substance, nor accidents remain; and yet if you consult the Schools, they will tell you the accidents only perish, the matter doth not.  
Neither doth chrysostom say, that the mysteries are consumed by the body of Christ● but he saith, So think when thou comest to the mysteries; that is, think not on the elements, but lift up the eyes of thy mind above them, as if they were consumed: and this he spoke to stir up the Communicants, rather to mark in this Sacrament the wonderful power and effects of God's spirit and grace, than the condition, and natural digestion of the bread and wine. And it is clear that this was his meaning: for in the very next words following he saith 
y Num vides panem? num vinum? Nè putetis corpus accipere ab homine, sed ex ipso Seraphin forcipe ign●m. Chrysost. de Euchar. in Encoenijs. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. ; Wherefore approaching (to the Lords Table) do not think that you receive the divine body at the hands of a man, but that you take a fiery coal from a Seraphim, or Angel, with a pair of tongs. By this strain of rhetoric chrysostom (as his manner is) persuadeth the people to come to the Lords Table with no less reverence, than if they were to receive a fiery coal (as Esay did in his vision) from one of the glorious Seraphims. chrysostom had no intent that the bread was transubstantiated, no more than that the Priest was changed into an Angel, or his hand into a pair of tongs, or the body of Christ into a coal of fire; and he useth the same amplification in both the speeches, the same phrase [think you] and at the same time, and to the same people: so that if one be (as certainly it is) a strain of rhetoric, why not the other also? Sixtus Senensis gives a good rule for interpretation of the Father's speeches, specially in this argument; 
z Non sunt Conclonatorum verba semper eo rigore ac●●p●end●, multa enim Declamatore● per hyperbolen enunciant Hoc interdum Chrysostom● cō●ingit. Sixt. Senens. Biblioth. lib. 6. anno● 152.  The sayings of Preachers, are not to be urged in that rigour of their words; for after the manner of Orators, they use to speak many times hyperbolically, and in excess. And he instanceth in chrysostom, as well he might, for he is full of them, even there where he speaks of the Sacraments, he saith, 
a Dentes carni suo infer Chrys. tom. 3. Homil. 45. in Io●n.  That our teeth are fixed in the flesh of Christ; that 
b 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Lingu● cruentatur hoc admirabill sanguine. Chrys. tom. 2. Homil. 83. in Ma●h.  our tongues are died red with his blood; and again, 
c Ille non te baptizat, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. ●d Homil. 50. in Math.  That it is not the Minister, but God that baptizeth thee, and holdeth thy head. Now these and the like sayings must be favourably construed, as being improper speeches, rhetorical strains, purposely uttered to move affections, stir up devotion, and bring the Sacrament out of contempt, that so the Communicants eyes may not be finally fixed on the outward elements of bread and wine, being in themselves but transitory and corruptible creatures; but to have their hearts elevated and lift up by faith to behold the very body of Christ, which is represented in these mysteries. Otherwise, the Fathers come down to a lower key, when they come to speak to the point, yea or no: and accordingly Faint chrysostom, when once he is out of his Rhetorical vein, and speaks positively and doctrinally, saith, 
d Quando hoc mys●e●ium trad●dit, vinum ●radid●t. Chrys Homil. 82. in Math.  When our Lord gave the Sacrament, he gave wine; and again, 
e 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.— 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Choice. in Hebr●● 10. Hom. 17. to● 4. pag. 523. edit. Savilij.  Do we not offer every day? We offer indeed, but by keeping a memory of his death; and he puts in a kind of caution, or correction, lest any should mistake him; We offer (saith he) the same Sacrifice, or rather the remembrance thereof. And such a Commemorative and Eucharistical sacrifice we acknowledge.   

Object.  
Saint Cyril of Alexandria, useth the word corporally, saying; 
f Corporaliter enim s●lius per bened●ctorem mysticam nobis, ut ●oma unitu●; Spi●itualitèr autem ut Deus. Cyrill. in joan. lib. 11. cap 27 tom. 1.  that by the mystical benediction, the Son of God is united to us corporally, as man, and spiritually, as God.   

Answer.  
Hereby is meant a full perfect spiritual conjunction with the sanctified Communicants, excluding all manner of Imagination, or fantasy; and not a gross, and fleshly being of Christ's body in our bodies, according to the appearance of the letter; otherwise, this inconvenience would follow, that our bodies must be in like manner corporally in Christ's body; for Cyril as he saith, Ch●ist is corporally in us, so he saith, 
g Communicatione corporis et sanguinis Christi, ipse in nobis est, & nos in ipso. Id. ibid. l. 10. c. 13.  wear corporally in Christ; by corporally than he meaneth, that near, and indissoluble union, in the same sense that the Apostle useth it, saying, In him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily, Coll. 2.9. bodily, that is indissolubly.  
Besides, Christ is likewise joined corporally to us by the Sacrament of Baptism, and yet therein there is no Transubstantiation.   

Of Image-worship.  
Saint Hierome saith; 
h Nos unam veneram●r Imaginem quae est Imago invisibilis et omnipote●tis Dei. Hi●ron to. 50. li. 40. in Ezech c. 16.  We worship one Image which is the Image of the invisible and omnipotent God. Saint Austin saith, 
i N●lla imago e●us coli debet, nisi illa quae hoc est qu●d ipse, nec ipsa pro illo sed cum illo. Aug ep 119. add januar. cap 11.  No Image of God ought to be worshipped, but that which is the same thing that he is, meaning Christ jesus, [Col. 1.15. Hebr. 1.3.] nor yet that for him, but with him. And as for the representing of God in the similitude of a man, he resolveth that it is Utterly unlawful 
k Tale simulac●●um Deo nefas est Christiano in templo collocare. Idem tom. 3. de Fide & Symbolo cap 7.  to erect any such Image to God in a Christian Church. He condemneth the use of Images, even when they are not adored for themselves, but made instruments to worship God, saying, 
l Sic omnino ●rrare meruerunt, qui Christum & Apostolos ejus, non in sanctis codicibus. sed i● pictis pari●tibus quaesierunt. Id. to. 4. de Consens. Evang. lib. 1 c. 10.  Thus have they deserved to err which sought Christ and his Apostles in painted Images, and not in written books. The same Austin writing of the manners of the Catholic Church, directly severeth the case of some men, who were wont to kneel superstitiously in Church yards before the tombs of Martyrs, and the painted histories of their sufferings; these private men's cases he severeth from the common cause, and approved practice of the Catholic Church, saying, 
m Nolite consectari turbas imperitorum, qu● vel in ips● ver● Religione superstit●osi sunt. Novi multos esse sepulchrorum & picturarum adoratores: n●nc vos illud admoneo, ut aliquando Ecclesi●● Catholicae maledicere desi●atu, vi●uperando m●res hominum, quos & ipsa condemnate & quo● quoti●ie tanq●am malos ●ilios corrigere st●det. Id. to. 1. de mor. Eccles. Cathol. cap. 34.  Do not bring in the company of rude m●n, which in the true religion itself are superstitious. I know many that are worshippers of Graves and pictures. Now this I advise that you cease to speak evil of the Catholic Church by upbraiding it with the manners of those men, whom she herself condemneth, and seeketh every day to correct as naughty children, so that in Saint Austin's times, (as is already no●ed) 
* See in the second Centurie S. Augustine's testimony on the 113. Psalm.  Images, and Image-worship were not used by any general warranted practice; if some misinformed men used it, this could not in Saint Austin's opinion, make it a Church duty, necessary and Catholic, or draw it to be a general custom.  
Bellarmine answereth, 
n Dico Augustinum scripsisie cum librum in primordio conversions su● ad sidem Cath●licam; tamen posteà meli●s instructu● excusavit [eos ritu●] ab Idololatrical Bell● li. de Imag. cap. 16. §. Dico.  that Saint Austin wrote this in the beginning of his Conversion to Christianity, and that upon better information he changed his mind; but he tells us not in what part of his Retractations this is to be found.  
Divers other shifts beside are used herein: and some fly to the distinction of an Idol and an Image, but that will not se●ve; for the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is often translated Simulachrum, a likeness or similitude; and as every Idol is an Image of some thing, so every Image worshipped turns Idol; there may be some odds in the language, but none in the thing itself.  
Bellarmine minceth 
o Bellarm. de Imaginib. cap. 23. & 25.  the matter, and would have the Image worshipped, not properly, and because of itself, but reductively, inasmuch as it doth express the Sampler: Others 
p Thom●s 3. part. qu. 25. art. ●.  hold that the Image is to be worshipped in itself, and with the s●m● worship that the person is, which is represented; so that the Crucifix is to be reverenced with the self same honour that Christ jesus is. And as for the vulgar people, they go bluntly to it with down●right adoration Cassander saith, 
q Mani●e●tius ●st, quam ut multis verb●●●xpl●c●ri debeat— ita ut ●l summ● adorationem quae ●el ● Pag●n●● suis f●nu●●c●● is ●xhib●i ●on●ucuit, nil ● nostris reliqui ●●ctum esse vid● atur. Call●●d●● Consult. de Imagine.  It is more manifest, than that it can be denied, that the worship of Images and Idols hath too much prevailed, and the superstitious humour of people hath been so cockered● that nothing hath been omitted among us, either of the highest adoration and vanity of paynims, in worshipping and adoring Images. Polydore also saith, 
r Sunt exim be●e mul●i ●u●iores, qui Imag●nes ●ola●t non ut sig●●, s●● pe●i●●e cue ●si ipsae ●easam ali qu●m habeant ●t iis magis fi●●● q●àm C●●isto, vel aliis Devis q●●●● d●ca●ae sunt P l●d. Vng. de Invent. li. 6 c●p. 13.  People are grown to such madness, that there are many rude and stupid persons, which adore Images of wood, stone, marble, and brass, or painted in windows, not as signs, but as though they had sense; and they repose more trust in them, than in Christ or the Saints, to which they are dedicated. Ludovicus Vives saith, 
* M ●●i christianis in re bo●● ple●unque pe●●ant, quo● Divos D●●●●que●on a iter venerantur q●● Deum. Nec video in m●ltis q●●d fit dis●●imen i● 〈◊〉 ●o●um opinionem de Sanctis, & il quod G●n●il●s p●t●hant de suis D●●●. 〈◊〉. Vives Schol●n Au●ustin. de Civit. D●●. l. 8. cap. 27.  Saints are esteemed and worshipped by many, as were the Gods among the Gentiles.   

Objection.  
The honour or dishonour done to the Image redoundeth to the person represented, or p●ototype, as appears by our being uncovered, & using reverence in the King's Chamber of presence, and before his Chair of estate, when his person is absent; in like sort, the honour, and worship due to the Image, redoundeth to Christ and his Saints: now if an Image be capable of contempt and reproach, it is also capable of honour and worship.   

Answer.  
The Rule [The dishonour done to the Image redoundeth to the person] is true, specially in civil affairs, when the Party would be honoured by the Image: and thus was Theodosius grieved with them of Antioch, 
s Theodoret lib. 5 pistor. cap. 19  for casting down his wife's Statue. It may also redound to the p●rson by accident, that is, when a man doth a thing with a purpose to dishonour him; as julian did, 
t Sozomen 〈◊〉. lib. 5. cap. 20.  when he pulled down the Image of Christ, and set up his own.  
Besides, these contraries are not paria; for it sufficeth, to the dishonouring of God, that there be an evil affection or intention: but a good intention is not sufficient to the honouring of God, except the means, as well as the meaning be prescribed of God.  
Lastly (as learned Bishop White saith 
u Bishop Whites Reply to jesuit Fishers Answer, point 1. pag. 228. ) this Similitude halteth: for the King's Chair of State, and his image, when they are honoured or dishonoured, are conjoined with his person, by civil ordinance and relation: but the artificial Image of Christ and his Cross are not conjoined with Christ, by divine ordination, or by relation grounded on Christ's Word, but by an imaginary act of the superstitious worshipper; also civil and religious worship, are of divers beginnings, and forms, and every thing that is possible, lawful, and commendable in the one, is not so in the other.   

Objection.  
Adoration is performed to Images, as being done outwardly, relatively, and transitorily unto the Image; inwardly, affectuously, absolutely, and finally unto Christ.   

Answer.  
If you adore Images outwardly, relatively, and transitorily, than (as the same Bishop saith 
x Id. ibid. pag. 246. ) you make Images a partial object of adoration: but God himself who saith, I will not give my glory to another (to wit, in whole or in part) neither my praise to graven Images (Esay 42.8.) hath excluded images from copartnership with himself in adoration,   

Of Prayer to Saints.  
Concerning Prayer to Saints, Saint Hierome, or whosoever 
y Recte quoque Commentaria in Proverbia tribuuntur Bedae, non Hieronymo. Bellar. de Script. Eccles. seculi quarti.  else was the Author of those Commentaries on the Proverbs, saith 
z Nullum invocare, id est, in nos orando vocare nisi Deum debemus. Hieron. tom. 7. in Proverb. cap. 2. : We ought to invocate, that is, by Prayer to call into us none but God.  
And in another place, 
a Quicquid dixero, quia ille non audit, mutu●● videtur. Id. to. 1. ad Heliodor. Epitaph. Nepotiani.  Whatsoever I shall utter seemeth dumb, because he (Nepotian) being defunct, heareth me not. Theodoret upon the 2. and 3. Chapter to the Colossians expressly says (and that by the authority of the Council of Laodicea) that Angels are not to be prayed unto: and if not Angels, not Martyrs.  
Saint Austi●e in his book which he wrote of true religion, saith; 
b Non sit nobis Religio cultus hominum mortuorum. Aug. tom. 1. de verâ Relig. cap. 55.  The worshipping of men that are dead should be no part of our religion. Papists invocate Saints in the Liturgy of their Mass, which the Ancients did not. Saint Austin saith expressly, that Martyrs were named at the Communion Table, but not invocated: his words are these, 
c Ad quod sacrificium, sicut homines Dei, qui mundum in eju● confession vi●●r●nt suo loco et ordine n●minantu●, non tamen à Sa●erdote qui sacri●icat, i●●o● antur. August. li. 22. de civet. Dei. c. 10. to. 5.  At which Sacrifice the Martyrs are named in their place and order, as men of God, which have overcome the world in the confession of him; but yet notwithstanding, they are not invocated by the Priest which sacrifiseth.   

Answer.  
This place is thus answered: 
* Non tamen à sacerdote qui sacri●icat, invocantur; Deo quip, non ipsis sacrificat. ●ac. Pa●●el. Litu●g. secul. 5. tom. 1. Non invocantur ut Dij. L●●. Coquaeus.— Card Perron.  The Priest doth not invocate Saints by direct Prayer. Besides, the Sacrifice is directed to God the Father alone, and that may be the reason why the Saints are not invocated.   

Reply.  
Saint Austin excludeth all invocation of Saints, both direct and indirect, in the administration of the Eucharist. Nei●her will th●se distinctions help them; for though the invocation of them be not a direct, absolute, and sov●raigne invocation, yet if it be an indirect, relative, or subaltern invocation, an invocation it is: (and such a one is the invocation at the Altar in the Mass: for thus it is, 
d M●nuale Ec●esi● Sali●b●●●●●is. In Canone Mi●iae  Libera nos Domine ab omnibus malis, etc. interced●nte pro nobis beatâ virgine, etc. beatis Apostolis, etc. cum omnibus Sanctis.) and so what shall become of Saint Augustine's non invocantur, who knew none of these distinctions of the Cardin●ll's, which in that Age, and many Ages after were not heard of, 
e Bishop A●d●ewes Answer to Cardinal perron's Reply. pag. 3● 38.  saith our learned Bishop of Winchester.  
Neither can the Cardinal allege any reason, why if the Saints may be prayed unto, they may not be so, as well by the Priest as by the people; as well at M●sse, as at Matins; as well in the body of the Church, as at the Altar?  
A● for th●ir new distinction, of sacrifical and unsacrificall Invocation, and their conceit, that the Sacrifice is Offered ●nto God the Father alone, it is (saith the same Learned Bishop) 
f B●●l●. And●ewes ibid.  refuted by the Canon itself of the Mass: th● conclusion whereof, 
g M●nuale Eccle●. Sali●bar. ibid.  is Placeat tibi sancta T●i●i●as obs●q●ium servitut●s meae, etc. So that that the Sacrifice is offered ●o the whole Trinity. Besides there are diverse Coll●ct● more● directed unto Christ himself, and ●●l of them said, Dum assistitur Altari.  
Now in case that any upon consideration of their owns unworthiness, and Gods dreadful Majesty, should se●k● to Go● b● mediation of others; Saint C●rysostom● of all the Father's is most plentiful in refuting this course of Int●●cession by others. When thou hast need to sue unto men (saith he) 
h 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. 〈◊〉 Serm. 7. de 〈◊〉 tom. 6. Edit. S●vil p●g ●02.  thou art forced first to deal wit● door keepers, an● Po●ters, and to entreat Parasites and Flatterer's, and to go a long way about. But with God there is no such matter; he is entreated without a● Intercesson: it sufficeth only that thou cry in thine heart and bring tears with thee; and entering in straightway thou mayst draw him unto thee.  
And for example hereof, he sets before us the woman of Canaan, She entreated not james, (saith he) 
i 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Idem in dimissione Chana●●ae tom. 5. Edit. Savil. p. 190.  she beseecheth not john, neither do●h she come to Pe●er, but broke thorough the whole company of them, saying, I have no need of a Mediator, but taking repentance with me for a spoakesman, I come to the fountain itself. For this cause ●id he descend, for this cause did he take flesh, that I might have the boldness to speak unto him: I have no need of a mediator, have thou mercy upon me. And whereas some repose such confidence's in the intercession of the Saints, that they look to receive greater benefits by them, than by their own p●ayers, he brings in again the w●man of Canaan, and wishes us to observe, 
k 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id●m Se●m. in Philip. v. 18. c 1 de profectu Evang. tom. 5. Edi●. Savil p●g 417.  How when others entreated, he put her back: but when she herself cried out, pr●ying for the gift, he yielded. Yea, he saith farther; that, 
l 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id●m in Acta Apost. c. 16. Homil. 36.  God then doth most, when we do not use the entreaty of others: for as a kind friend than blameth he us m●st, as not daring to trust his Love, when we entreat others to pray unto him for us: thus use we to do with those that se●ke to us: then we gratify them most, when they come unto us by themselves and not by others.   

Answer.  
chrysostom spoke thus, 
m Protulit haec, adversus quosdam d●sides, qui 〈◊〉 Divor●m patrocinio ●●mmi●tu●t, ut interdum ipsi 〈◊〉 se t●t●s in peccata a●●●ciant. Sixtus Senens. Annot 123● ut desert Nobil ●l mimus in notia in Chrysostomum.  against such idle fellows as Committed themselves wholly ●o the patronage of their Tutelar Saints, and themselves lived in their Sins; or he uttered such speeches Homily wise, 
n Haec 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. dicuntur, non 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Nobil. Fla●in. not ●● Chrysost.  as in the Pulpit, not Dogmatically, as delivering his judgement.   

Reply.  
As if a man might not deliver his judgement in the Pulpit; for albeit in figures and phrases, and manner of handling, there is s●me d●ff●rence, between a Preacher before the people, and a R●ade● before the learned; yet no learned Go●ly man, such as chrysostom was, will so advisedly, so vehemently, and often times as he did, utter any thing in the Pulpit, before the weaker, the truth whereof he is not able to justify in the Schools before the best learned.  
Neither we●e they whom chrysostom taxed so very lazy, but rather such as took more pains than needed; and (as he saith) went a long way about, by se●king to their patrons, mediators, and favourites; whereas he shows them a nearer may, to wit, to go immediately to the Master of Requests, Christ jesus.   

Objection.  
You have produced divers Fathers against Saintly invocation, and much pressed Saint Chrysostome's testimony, whereas he makes for us; for Chrysost●me saith 
o Sanctis suppli●●t●●us a●cedit, ut pro se apud Deum intercedent. Chrysost. Homil. 66. ●d popu. Antio●hen.  that the Emperor laying aside all princely state, stood humbly praying unto the Saints, to be intercessors for him unto God.   

Answer.  
Bellarmine indeed allegeth 
p Bell●r lib. 1. de Sanct. Beatit. cap. 19  Chrysostome's sixty sixth Homily Antiochenum● and yet the same Bellarmine, upon better advice, when he is out of the heat of his polemic controversies, & comes to a pacific Treatise of the Writings of the Fathers; then he tells us, 
q ●x Homi●ijs ad pop An●io●he● viginti & una tant●●m ●eperiri 〈…〉 in antiqu●s 〈◊〉 Bellar. li. de Script. ●c●les. ●d an. 398.  that chrysostom made but one and twenty Homilies to the people of Antioch, and that no more are to be found in the ancient Libraries.  
And yet posito, sed non concesso, admit that these words were Ch●ysostome's indeed, yet they reach not home; for they speak only what the Emperor did de factor not d● jure: it is only a relation, what he did out of his private devotion, it is no approbation of the thing done. Now what some one or two shall do, carried away with their own devout affection, is not strait way a rule of the Church.  
Besides, though the Saints interceded for us, yet it will not hence follow, that we are to invocate them, having no warrant from God so to do: now in such a high point of his worship, we must keep us to his command 
r Deu●er. ●2. 32. , and that must guide ou● devotion.  
The other places of Chryso●tome alleged by B●llarmine speak of the Saints living, and not of the Saints deceased.  
Lastly, chrysostom (as hath been observed in the point of the Eucharist) speaks oftentimes rather out of his rhetorick●, than out of his divinity. Sixtus Senensis delivereth this observation concerning the Fathers, and he names chrysostom, 
s Non sunt Concionatorum verba semper eo rig●re accipienda; multa enim D●clamato●es per Hyperbolen enunciant Hoc inte●dum Chrysostomo ●ontingit. Sixt. Senens. Biblio. lib. 6. annot. 152.  That in their sermons we may not take their words strictly, and in rigour, because they many times break out into declamations, and declare and repeat matters, by Hyperboles, and other figurative speeches. In a word, whatsoever chrysostom report of others, himself (as we have heard) was all for our immediate address of our Prayers unto God.   

Objection.  
Bellarmine saith, 
t Theodoretus in Historia Sanctorum patrum, singulas vitas ita concludit; ego autem huic narrationi finem imponens, rogo & quaeso ut per horum intercessionem divinum consequar auxilium. Bellar. li. 1 de Sanct. Beat. c. 19  that Theodoret shutteth up the story of the Father's lives in these terms: My suit and request is, that by the Prayers and intercession of the Saints, I may find divine assistance.  
And the same Bellarmine saith, 
u Multa it●m habet de Invocatione Sanctorum lib. 8. ad Graecos. Bellar. quò sup●à.  that Theodoret in his book of the greeks hath much touching Prayer to Saints.   

Answer.  
Theodoret saith only, Rogo & quaeso, I beseech and entreat, not th●s, nor that Sa●nt, but God alone: to this end and purpose, that by their intercession and prayers, I may have assistance.  
Now to the book de curandis Graecorum affectibus questioned, whether i● be 
x Rob. Coci Censure Patrum. pag. 195.  Theodoret's, or no; we oppose that which is Theodoret's out of question; upon the second and third Chapters to the Colossians, where he expressly says (and that by the authority of the Council of Laodicea) Angels are not to be prayed to, and if not Angels, than not Saints and Martyr's.   

Objection.  
Saint Austin saith, 
Injuri● est en●● pro 〈…〉 17. de verb. Apost li.  It is injury to pray for a Martyr, by whose prayers we on the other side ought to be recommended.   

Answer.  
This place is not to the purpose, for he saith only that the Saints pray for us, which thing we have never denied. We do out of Godly considerations presume, that albeit they know not the necessity of particular men, yet they pray for the Church in general. But that we should for this cause invocate them, or yield them any religious service, S. Austin doth not avouch.  
The other testimonies alleged by Bella●mine, out of Saint Austin, are all for Martyrs, and not for Saints; now in Saint Aust●nes opinion, the Martyrs had an especial privilege above other Saints.  
Besides they might well have spared the alleging of Saint Austin, Theodoret chrysostom, Prudentius, Saint Ambrose, Origen, Irenaeus, and othe●s, in proof of Saintly invocation; inasmuch as these with diverse others, are by their great Author 
z Sixt●s Senens. Bibl. San●t. lib. 6. Annot 345. 〈…〉 of this opinion.  Sixtus Senensis reckoned up amongst them that held the Saints departed did not enjoy the presence of God, ●ill after th● general Resurrection; which if they h●ld that they did not, then would they not hold that they were to be prayed to; they being secluded from God's presence, being only in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in 
a Secreti● 〈…〉 A●g li●. 2. de civet. De● cap 9 tom. 5.  Some certain Receptacles or Wards, 
b Omnes in und commun●que●ustodia detinentu●. Lactin. li 7. cap 21.  attending in the porch or base Court abroad; not admitted to the presence of the Almighty; and so not seeing● hearing nor knowing, whether prayer were made to them at all, or no; being but as yet in Atrijs, as Bernard would have it 
c Primum in tabernacular; secundam in A●rijs; tertio in Do●o De●. Be●n. ●erm. 3. de omnibus Sanctis. . For in such Retiring or drawing rooms, they placed the souls of all the faithful, except those of the Martyrs.   

Objection.  
Maximus Taurinensis in his Sermon upon Saint Agnes, saith, 
d Vt no●tri meminisse 〈◊〉 quib●s pass●mus precious 〈◊〉. S. Max●●●●erm. de S. Agn●te. in M. B●blioth Patr Colon. 16.8. to 5. pag. 29.  By all such Prayers and Orisons as I can conceive, I beseech the●, vouchsafe to remember me.   

Answer.  
The●e Sermons of Maximus, as great as he was in name, they are not greatly to be esteemed; 
e M●ximi Homiliae, & r●tiquae ferè quae de Tempore, de Sanctis circumferuntur, maximae faciend●e non sunt. aliens. Respons. ad Bell. Apolog. c. 1. p 42.  inasmuch as they go with an Aliâs, sometimes under one name, sometimes under another, 
f Tribuuntur simul, & S. Ambrosio, et S. Maximo. Bell. de S●r. Eccl. ad ann. 420 Maximi Taurinensi● sermons, ai● Perkinsus, incen●tae fid●● sunt; ex iis enim plu●imi varijs authoribus ad s●ribuntur. Andr. Rivet. Crit. sacri. l. 4. c. 23.  having indeed no certain known Father: so that they are not to go for Maxims in divinity, or rules of Faith.  
But suppose they be his own words; they are but a Rhetorical flourish which he used in his commendatory, panegyrical Sermon upon Saint Agnes her anniversary; and he speaks but faintly, Quibus possumus precibus; in effect 
g Bishop. Montagu of the Invocation of Saints. pag. 207.  as I can, so I direct this my address unto thee: hear and help me accordingly as thou canst, and mayst: so the man, in the point was not so fully persuaded of that, or any Saint's assistance, as that he went farther than opinion.   

Objection.  
Victor Bishop of Utica, when the Church was pestered with the barbarous Vandals, 
h Adestote Angeli Dei, Deprecamini Patria●chae, orate S. Prophetae, estote Apostoli Suffragator●s, praecipuè tu Petre B. quare files pro ovibus et agnis? S. Victor V●icens. l. 3. de perseq. Wandal propè sinem. & in Biblioth. Patr. tom. 7. pag. 1928 Par●●dit. per Margarin. de la Bigne. ann. 1589.  calleth to the Angels, Prophets, Patriarches, and Apostles, to Deprecate, and Pray for the distressed Church.   

Answer.  
Victor Bishop of Utica, is an Historian; and such are Narratores, relaters of other men's Acts, not Expositores, of their own opinions; narrations have no more weight or worth, then have those Authors from whence they proceed.  
But Victor in this place laying aside the person of an Historian, takes up the carriage of a Panegyrist merely, as appears by his expostulating with Saint Peter, and chiding him, which was not really and indeed, but only Rhetorically, and Figuratively, saying, Why art thou Blessed Saint Peter silent? Why dost not thou above all the rest take care of the Sheep and Lambs committed unto thee: Now if this were a strain of Rhetoric, why also is not that his compellation of the Saints Triumphant to assist the Church militant, and then distressed.   

Object.  
Fulgentius speaks 
i ●●co●maes is●●os cursu● nature V●●g● M●ri●● in Domino nostro ●esu Christo ●us●epst ut 〈◊〉 ad se 〈◊〉 s●●ntnis subventi●; ●t sic restaura●er omne ge●us 〈◊〉 ad se vententium n●va Eva si●ut omne gen●s vir●rum Ad an no●us recuperat Fulgent. in serm de Laud. B. Ma●iae.  of the blessed Virgins helping all suc● women as ●lie unto her.   

Answer.  
The same Author goes on (though Bellarmine conceal it) & tell● us, that the Virgin Mary (whom he entitles the new Eve, as Christ is called the new Adam) restored all womankind, as Christ did all mankind. Shall we th●nk that the true Fulgentius (a man of worth in his time) would thus par● stakes betwixt Christ jesus and the Virgin Mary, in that great work of our Redemption? Surely, this is some sergeant going under the name of Fulgentius. And so I find, that the whole Homily is in the tenth Tome of Saint Austin's works, u●der the Title of the fiftee●th Sermon de Tempore. And the Divines of Lovan 
k In Appendice ad decimum tom●m Augustini. Pa●is. 1586.  found it ascribed unto Severianus in some Copies, an● printed amongst Fulgentius his wo●kes; so that it appears to be but filius populi, some b●●e issue, whose Father being mean and unknown, yet the brat is laid at some honest man's door.   

Object.  

l Et per ●on●m aemulationnē ip●o●um ambite suf●ragia. ●eo serm. 5. de Ep●phan. V●de cu●dem in se●m, d● annive●sar●o suae assumptionis, & de sanct. Petro & Paulo & Lau●●n●o.  Saint Leo would have us to make suit for the votes, prayers, and suffrages of the Saints, specially Saint Peter.   

Answer.  
Saint Leo goes no farther than this, By his merits and prayers we hope to find assistance. Besides, he speaks of Intercession without any Invocation.   

Object.  
The Fathers in the Chalcedon Council said, 
m Flavianus Martyr pro nobis oret. Concil. Chalced. act. 11.  Let the Martyr Flavianus pray for us.   

Answer.  
Flavianus, a Catholic Bishop was murdered for an Heretic by the Ephesin latrociny, and Dioscarus his Faction; the worthy Council of Chalcedon loosed him af●er his death, and honoured him as a Saint and Martyr: insomuch that upon the mention of his name, the Fathers there assembled made this joint acclamation, Flavianus lives after his death: Let the Martyr pray for us. Now this was votum, non invocatio, a wish, and no direct invocation. Or if they will read it, Martyr pro nobis orat, the Martyr prays for us, to wit, in genial, we do not deny it, nor doth it help their cause.  
By this we see what to think of the thirty Fathers Greek and Latin, mustered up by Bellarmine for proof of Saintly invocation; they may (as learned Winchester observes) 
n 
1. Verè Patres, sed non verè citantur.  
2. Verè citantur, sed sidei suspect●e.  
3. Et ve●i P●tres, & verè citantur, sed nihil ad rem. Resp. ad Card. Bellarm. Apol. cap. 1. p. 39   be put into three ranks; some of them being indeed true Fathers, but not truly alleged: others truly alleged, but they be not homines legales, good men and true Fathers, but counterfeits, bearing their names: others be true Fathers, and truly alleged, but they speak not ad rem, to the point in question.  
To come to particulars; there be seven of the thirty, who lived after the first five hundred years, 

Post-nat●.  
G●egory the first, Gregory of Turon, Bede, Anselm, Bernard, Damascen, Theophylact.   so that they are later, and Post-nati unto Primitive antiquity, being out of the verge of the limited time, and out of the compass of the Church's purity; Damascen living about the year seven hundred and thirty, and Theophylact surviving William the Conqueror, some of them also be partial, as speaking to the point when it got some footing in the Church.  
There be others to the number of eight, 

Suspect●e Fidei.  
Ign●tius, Cornelius Papa, Athanas. de S. Deipara, Ephraem de laude Mariae, Nazianzen upon Cyprian, Cyril's Catechism, Chrisos●ome's 66. Homily ad popul. A●tioch, Tulgen. de laude B. Mari●.   who have put on the visor of antiquity, and would seem ancient, but are justly suspected to be rank counterfeits; and men of yesterday in comparison.  
Two or three of the Greek Fathers are wrong cited, by a false writ, and a corrupt translation.  
There be seven other of the witness, 

Non verè citati.  
●asil in ●rat in 40. Martyr. Eus●bius de praep. Evang.   who speak not positively as Divines, but like Poets, Panegyrists, & Orators, with Figures, Apostr●phe's, and Prosopopeiae's in a Poetical vein, and Rhetorical strain; 

Rhetoricantur Paties.  
Nazian●ere, Hie●ome. S. Maxi●us, Nyssen.   of this rank is Nazianzen's Respice de caelo; Hierome's Vale ● Paula; Maximus, his Itaque ô splendida virgo; Nyssen, his compellation to Theodore the Martyr, Coge chorum Martyrum; Saint Victor, 
Victor, Paulinus, Prudenti●s.  his adestote Angeli, and Paulinus and Prudent●us with th●ir Poetry.  
The o●her six tha● remains upon record, speak not to the point: 
Patres ve●● citati, sed nihil ad rem.  they t●ll us indeed of the Saints interceding for us, to wit, in gen●rall; but this infers not our invocation of them.  
They tell us also of some private men's opinion, and the practise of so●●e few; but this doth not warrant it to have been the doctrine and practice of the Church.   

Of justification by Faith.  
Although Faith only justify, yet is not Faith alone, or solitary in the person justified; even as the eye though it only see, yet it is n●t alone in the body, but joined with the rest of the members; in like sort, Faith a●d Charity where they are not both jointly together, there (as Leo saith) 
o Vbi non simul fuerint, simul d●sunt. Leo S●rm. 7. de Qu●d●●ges.  they are both wanting.  
Saint Augustine saith, 
p Sola Fides Christi mund●t August. in Psal. ●● tom. 8.— praecogn●tis, quod non fuerant credituri in Fide, qu● 〈◊〉 a p●catorum obligattone liberari.  That Faith only purifieth the ●eart.  
Saint Chysostome often useth the self same 
q Chrysost in cap. 4. ad R●m. tom. 4 & de side & l●g● nature. tom. 3.  form of spe●ch, to wit, t●at Faith only justifieth.  
Saint Augustine saith, 
r Ipse ergo p●●●atum ut 〈…〉 in ipso; 〈…〉 non suum, 〈…〉 nec in ●●, s●d in nobis 〈◊〉 Aug. tom. 3. in Enchi●id. ad 〈…〉 cap. 41.  He is sin, and we are justice; not our own, but Gods; not in ourselves, but in him; as he is sin, not his own, but ours; not in himself, but in us: so are we made the justice of God in him, as he is sin in us; to wit, by Imputation.  
And again, 
s In 〈◊〉 Fidei pro non peccanti●us h●b●ntu● quibus peccata n●n imputantur Id. tom. 8. in P●al. ● 18 conc. 3●  In the way o● Faith, they are reckoned for no sinners (and therefore are ●eputed Just) who have not their sins imputed to them.  
This f●ee remission of sins he elsewhere notably describeth, saying, 
t Si texit 〈◊〉 Deus, n●luit adv●●t●re; si noluit ●dve●●e●e, 〈◊〉 animadverte●e, 〈◊〉 punt●e, noluit 〈◊〉, malu●t ignoscere Id● s●p●● Ps●l. 31.  If God hath covered our sins, he will not observe them, he will not thi●ke upon them, to punish them, he will ●ot take knowledge, but rat●er pardon t●em.  
It i● cle●re also out of Saint Austin, that there is such imperfect on in our wo●ks, as tha● they cannot justify. All our Righteousness (saith he) 
u I●sa 〈◊〉 n●stra 〈…〉 ●it●, ut 〈…〉 remissione●o st●t 〈◊〉 per●e●● 〈◊〉 virtutu●● Id tom 5 de civet. Dei. li. 19 cap. 27.  standeth ra●her in the remission of our sins, than in any perfection of justice; and again, 
x V●e et●am laudabil● vitae hominum, si r●mot● misericordi● discutia● eam Id. tom. 1. confess. lib. 9 cap 13.  Woe be to the commendablest life we lead (saith he) if thou Lord setting thy mercy aside, shouldst examine it; but this is our comfort, God dealeth graciously with us, accepting our willing desires, in stead of the work done, as Saint Paul saith, 2 Cor. 8.12. and accordingly Saint Austin saith, 
y Omnia mandata 〈◊〉 deputantur, quando qu●●q●id non fit ignos●●tu●. Id. to. 1. Retract. lib. 1. cap 19  All the commandments of God are then esteemed to be done, when as that is forgiven, whatsoever is not done.   

Of Merit.  
Concerning Merits, or the dignity of good works equal to the Reward, Saint Paul is against it, saying; 
z Ro●. 8.18.  That the sufferings (Martyrdoms) of this present time are not worthy to be compared to the glory that shall b●e revealed in us; and both Hierome 
a ●ieron super Ephes. 2. tom. 9  and chrysostom 
b C●rysost. oper. imperfect in Math Homil 53.  allege this place against Merit. Leo saith, 
c N●que enim de quali 〈…〉 'em ●perum 〈…〉 Leo ●erm ● de Assump. 〈…〉 Id. serm ● de Pass. Dom.  The measure of celestial gifts depends not upon th● quality of works. Saint Au●tine saith, 
d No● pro merito quidem 〈◊〉 ●itam ae●ern●m sed ta●tum pro grat●● 〈…〉 ●oan. tract. 3. tom. 9  Thou shalt not receive eternal life for thy merit, but only for grace. And they speak reason; for he that would merit or deserve any thing at another man's hand, must of himself 
e 〈…〉 Hil●r de T●init lib. 11.  by his own power, do something, that the other had no former claim unto: now our good works, inasmuch as they are good, are God● fr●e gifts. We are not sufficient to think any thing that is good. 2 Cor. 3.5. It is God that worketh in us both the will and the deed Philip. 2.1. And Man stands bound to God, either in strict terms of law, or by way of gratitude, as his creature, servant, and son, to do him the uttermost of his service.  
My good deeds (saith Austin) 
f 〈…〉. Aug. 〈◊〉. lib 10. cap. 4. ●om 1.  are thy ordinances, and thy gifts; my evil onest are my sins, and thy judgements. Theodoret saith, 
g 〈…〉 & 〈◊〉 non mer●●dem sed glor●am vocavit 〈◊〉 quae expectantur. Theod. in Rom. 8. tom 2 Gentiano Herveto interpret.  The Crowns do excel the Fights, the rewards are not to be compared with the labours; for the labour is small and the gain great that is hoped for; and therefore t●e Apostle called those things that are looked for, not wages, but glory (Rom. 8.18.) not wages, but grace (Rom. 6.23.) The same Theodoret saith, 
h Temporalibus labo●●●us ●terna i● aequilibrio ●on respondent. Id. ●n Rom. 6. vers. ul●.  That things eternal do not answer temporal labours in equal poise.  
Saint Hierome saith, 
i 
Si nostra considerem●s merita desperandum est. Hieron. lib 17 ●n Isai. cap. 64. to. 5.  
Nullum opus dignum Dei justitià reperietur. Idem lib. 6. in Esai. cap. 13.   If we consider our own merits, we must despair: And again, When the day of judgement or death shall come, all hands shall fail, because no work shall be found worthy of the justice of God.  
Saint chrysostom speaks very pathetically, 
k 
Chrys. tom. 5. the Compunct. Cord. ad Stelech. post ●ed● in Lat. editione.  
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Chrysost. de Compunct. Cord. ad Stelechum. tom. 6. edit. Savil. pag. 157.   Etsi millies moriamur, Although (saith he) we die a thousand deaths, although we did perform all virtuous actions, yet should we come short by far of rendering any thing worthy of those honours which are conferred upon us by God.  
Indeed the Lord rewards good works, but this is out of his bounty, free favour, and grace, and not as of desert. Rom. 4.4.  
In giving the Crown of Immortality as our reward, God crowneth not our merits, but his own gifts; and, when God crowneth our merits (that is, good deeds) he crowneth nothing else but his own gifts, saith 
l 
Qu●d ergo praemium ●mmorlit it is poste● 〈◊〉, coronat dona sua, non merita tu●. August. in joan. tract. 3. tom. 9  
Cun Deus coronat 〈…〉, ni●il aliud 〈◊〉 quam. M●nera sua Id. epist. 105. tom. 2.   Saint Augustine. So that God indeed is become our debtor, not by our deserving but by his own gracious promise.  
God is faithful, who hath made himself our debtor, (saith Austin) 
m Fidelis Deus qui se postrum debitorem fecit; ●on aliquid à nobis accipiendo, sed tanta nobis promitendo quicquid promisit, indigmis promisit. Id tom. 3. in Psalm. 100  not by receiving any thing from us, but by promising so great things to us: whatsoever he promised, he promised to them that were unworthy. In a word, though he give heaven propter promissum, for his promise sake, and because he will be as good as his word, yet it is not propter commissum, for any performance of ours.  
This was the doctrine of old, but the Rhemists have taken out a new lesson, saying 
n Rhemists' Annot. upon Hebr. 6. sect. 4.  That good works are meritorious, and the very cause of salvation; so far, that God should be unjust, if he rendered not heaven for the same.  
Now by this that hath been alleged, the Reader may perceive, that besides divers other worthies of these times, S. Augustine the honour of this Age, agreeth with us in divers weighty points of religion, as also in the matter of God's free grace and justification, insomuch as Sixtus Senensis saith, 
o D. Augustinus dum toto spiritus ac verbo●um ardore pro defensione Divinae gratiae pugnat advers. Pe●agianos, liberum arbitrium cum 〈◊〉 divinae gratiae ex●oll●ntes, in alteram quasi ●oveam delabi vid●tur minusque interdum tribuere quam par sit liber● hominis voluntati sixth Senens. in Bibl. Sanctâ lib. 5. in prae●at.  Whilst Saint Austin doth contend earnestly against the Pelagians, for the defence of divine grace, he doth seem to fall into another pit, and sometimes attributeth too little to freewill.  
And Stapleton saith, 
p Vtcunque in hac disputatione modum fortasse excesser●t Augustinus Stapleton. de justificat. lib. 2. cap. ult.  t●at Austin (haply) in his disputation against the Pelagians, went beyond all go●d measure.    

PA.  
Saint Austin prayed for the dead, to wit, for his mother Monica, desiring God not to enter into judgement with her.   

PRO.  
What though he did so? the Examples of Christians (which sometimes slip into superstition) are no rule for to order our life, or devotion thereby.  
Besides, if he prayed for eternal rest, and remission of sins to his deceased mother, this was not for that he doubted she enjoyed them not, or that he feared she endured any Purgatory pains; but he sued for the continuation, accomplishment, and manifestation thereof at the general resurrection. Yea, even then when he prayed so, he saith, 
q Et credo jam feceris, quod te rogo. Aug. Confes. lib. 9 cap. 13. tom. 1.  he believes that the Lord had granted his request, to wit, that his mother was out of pain, and that God had forgiven her her sins: Which argueth, that it was rather a wish, than a Prayer, proceeding more out of affection to her, than any necessity to help her by his Prayers, who was then (as he persuaded himself) in a blessed estate: so that howsoever Saint Austin at first made a kind of prayer for his mother, yet a little after (as it were repressing himself) he saith, he believeth that she is in a blessed state.  
The Letters of Charles the great unto our Off a King of Mercia, are yet extant; wherein he wisheth, 
r Deprecantes ut pro ●● interaedi jubea●i●, nullam habentes dubitationem, beatam illius animal in requ●e esse; sed u● fidem & delectionem nostram ostendamus in amicum charissimum. Carol. Magnus apud Guliel. Malmesbu. d● gest. Reg. Anglor. L 1. c. 4.  That intercessions should be made for Pope Adrian then lately deceased; not having any doubt at all (saith he) but that his blessed soul is at rest, but that we may show our faithfulness and love to our most dear friend.  
In a word, Saint Austin's prayer was not (as Popish prayers now a days are made) with reference to Purgatory; and therefore it makes nothing against us.   

PAP.  
Did not Saint Austin hold Purgatory?   

PRO.  
That some such thing should be after this life, it is not (saith he) 
s Tale aliq●id etiam post h●n● vitam 〈◊〉, incredibile non est 〈◊〉 ut ●●m ita sit 〈…〉, ●t aut taveniri aut la●cre. Aug. in En●hi●id. cap. ●● tom. 3.  incredible, and whether it be so it may be enquired, and either be found, or remain hidden. In another place he leaveth it uncertain, 
t Siv● ib● tan●um, sive et hic ●● ibi; sive ●deo hic, ut non ●●i, sae●ularia q●●mvis a 〈◊〉 ne ven●alt●) 〈◊〉 ig●em transi●o●iae tribulati●●●●nveniant, non ●●d●guo quia so●sitan verum est. Aug. de C●vit. De●l. 21. c. 26. & de Fide & oper. c. 16. tom. 4.  Whether only in this life men suffer, or whether there follow some such temporal judgements after this life, so that Saint Austin saith, it is not incredible, and it may be disputed whether it be so, and perhaps it is so: words of doubting, and not of asleveration, but in other places he gives such reasons as overthrow it. 
u Tertium penitus ignorantus, im●● nec esse in Scriptures Sanctis invenimus. Aug. Hypog. l. 5. to 7  The Catholic Faith (saith he) resting upon divine authority, believes the first place, the kingdom of heaven, and the second hell, a third we are wholly ignorant of; yea we shall find in the Scriptures that it is not. Neither speaks he only of places eternal that are to continue for ever; beside, he there purposely disputes against Limbus Pucrorum, and rejects all temporary places, not acknowledging any other third place, and elsewhere he saith, 
x Nec est ullus ulli medius locus, ut p●ss●t esse nisi cum D●●bolo qui non 〈◊〉 cum ●hri●to. Aug de 〈◊〉 mer●● & ●●miss. ●. 1. c. 28. Habent gaudium 〈◊〉 & m●l● to m●ntum Id. in joan. ●ract 49. tom. 9  There is no middle place, he must needs be with the devil, that is not with Christ; and again, 
y In 〈◊〉 e●um quemque 〈…〉, in hoc cum com●rehendet mundi nov●ssimus d●es Id epist. ●0.  Where every mans own last day finds him, therein the world's last day w●ll hold him. Thus far Saint Austin according to the Scriptures, which acknowledges but two sorts of people, Children of the kingdom, and children of the wicked; faithful and unfaithful, M●th. 13.38. And accordingly two places after this life, Heaven and Hell, Luke 16.23. Mark. 16.16. Neither doth the Scripture any where mention any temporary fire after this life; the fire it speaks of, is everlasting and unquenchable, 
z M●t. 18 8● & 3.12.  and so doth Austin take it; 
a Non da●o quod non 〈◊〉; ignem 〈…〉 8. Aug. in Psal. 80  and as for that fi●e which Saint Paul mentions, 
1 Cor 3.15.  It is not a Purgatory, but a Probatorie fire.   

PA.  
Master Brerely hath set forth Saint Austin's Religion, agreeble to ours.   

PRO.  
The Learned on our side have confuted him; 
c See Saint Augustine's Sums by M● Cromp●on.  and have proved out of Saint Austin's undoubted writings, that he agreed with the Church of England in the main points of Faith and Doctrine.  
And so I come from Fathers, to Counsels, and first to the sixth African Council, held at Carthage, and another at Milevis; both which denied Appeals to Rome. Now the case was this; Apiarius a Priest of Africa, was for his scandalous life excommunicated 
d Ap●a●ium, loci is●ius Episcopus, quampiam ob causam à c●●tu ●idelium exclusit, ●und●mque Synodus exauctoravit, q●em Sozimus Papa ad se conjugtentem, causamque ibi probant●m absolvit, & cum literis ad Synodum ●em●ssum recipi imperavit. Binnius in Council African sextum tom. 3 council O●cum. 8. act. 6. p. 867. edit. Colon. 1606.  by urban his Diocesan, and by an African Synod: Apiarius thus censured, fled to Pope Zozimus, who restored him to his place, & absolved him, & this he did, pretending that some Canon of the Nicen Council had established Appeals from other places to Rome: the Bishops of Africa, not yielding too hasty credit to this allegation, debated the matter with Pope Zozimus and his successors, Boniface and Celestine for the space of four or five years together, at length, 
e In Co●cilijs verioribus qu●e accip●u●tur Nic●●na●a S. Cyril. Alexan. Ecclsiae et ● venerabili Attico Constantinopol. Antistite miss●●— in quibus tale aliquid non potuimus reposure. Binn. in Conc. Charth. 6. c. 105. p. 646. tom. 1. Sed nunquam in Concilio Niceno in L●tini● Codicib● legimus— in nullo Codice Graeco ea potu●mus inv●ni●e. Id. Ibid. cap. 101 pag. 64● col. 2.  when the true and authentical copies of the Nicen Council were searched by Cyril Patriarch of Alexandria, and Atticus Bishop of Constantinople, and that neither in the Greek nor Latin copies, this Canon touching Appeals to Rome could be found; then the African Bishops told the Pope that he should not meddle with the causes of men in their Province, nor receive any such to Communion as they had excommunicated. For the Council of Nice, (say they) 
f Decreta Nic●●na prudentiss●mè justiss●m●que p●oviderunt, quaecu●que negotia in suis locis, ubi o●ta sunt, ●inienda. Id. Ibid. ca 105. pag 646.  Did consider wisely and uprightly that all matters ought to be determined in the places in which they began. Chiefly sith it is lawful for any, if he like not the sentence of his judges, to appeal to the Synods of his own province, yea, or farther also to a general Synod: to wit, of the Diocese 
g By [Universal] is meant a Synod of the Diocese and not of the whole World. Conc. Constan●inop. Can 6. ; Unless there be any perhaps, 
h Nisi fortè quispiam est qui credat, unicuilibet posse Deum nostrum examini● inspira●e justitiam, et innumerabilibus congregatis in Concilium Sacerdotibus denegare— nam ut aliqui tanquam à tuae sanctitatis la●ere mi●tantur, rulla inven●mus P●trum Synodo, ne fumosum typh●● saecu●i in Eccl●si●m Christi vid●amur inducere. Binn. qu● sup●à cap 105. Council Carthag. pag. 646.  who will imagine that God would inspire the trial of right into one man, and deny it to a great number of Bishops assembled in a Synod: and so going forward with proof, that the Pope ought not to judge their causes, either at Rome himself, or by his Legates sent from Rome; they touched his attempt in modest sort, but at the quick, Condemning it of pride, and smoky stateliness of the world.  

Reply.  
It may be (saith Master Brerely) 
Pro● Apology, tract. 1. sect. 7 subd. 2.  that the Arrian Heretics had corrupted the Nicen Council, and therefore this Canon which the Pope alleged could not be found there.   

Answer.  
Had this pr●t●nded Canon made aught against Christ's Divinity, we might have suspected the Arrians to have corrupted it, if they could; but this concerned the Pope's jurisdiction in matter of Appeal, and trenched not upon the Ar●ians tenet.   

Reply.  
Perhaps, the Pope when he alleged the Nicen Council, meant the Sardican Council, 
k Bellar li 2 de R●m. 〈…〉. 25 & 〈◊〉 quo suprà.  wherein it was decreed, That they in Af●icke might appeal to Rome.   

Answer.  
The African Fathers say, 
l In null● in●enimus p●trum Synodo. Con●. Carthag. cap. ●05.  They could not meet with this pr●tend●d Canon in any Synodall of the Fathers, and therefore neither in the Nice● nor Sardican Council, nor any other that could bind the whole Church. Besides, Saint Austin who was a principal actor in these African Counsels, and subscribed to them 
m Subs●ripserunt Ali●i●● Au●ust●●us et ●aeteri Epi●copi 217. Concil. Ca●thagin. ca 101. , he was not ignorant of the Catholic Sardican Council; for as Binius observes, 
n Hoc concilium O●cume 〈…〉 ab A●gustino epist 162. plenarium universae 〈◊〉 Con●ilium. 〈◊〉. no●. in Cancel. Sardi● §. 〈◊〉 tom. 1.  S Austin in his 162 Epistle calls it a plenary or full Council of the whole Church; neither indeed could S. Austin be ignorant thereof, inasmch as he rea● diligently the acts and decrees of every Council, and searched all Registries, by reason of the many conflicts he had with Heretics, saith Baronius 
o Omnia ●portuit Concilia 〈…〉 Baron. ad an. 347 〈◊〉. 74. . Neither could t●e African Bishops b●e possibly ignorant of this Sardican Council, inasmuch as some thirty six of them were present at it, 
p 〈…〉 2 p●g. 407  and subscribed to it, together with Gratus Primate of Carthage. Besides, it was yet within their memory, being held 
q 〈…〉 3●7. B●ron ●od. ann● nu● 1. 〈…〉 an. 4●4 Ba●on. & Catholic●m Sa●di●ense habit ●n suit, 〈…〉 tum est A●i●anum. Bar. ann. 347.  little above fourscore years before this African Council: neither could they be ignorant of the Decrees of that Council, inasmuch as they were wont to bring a Copy of such Decrees as were agreed upon in general Counsels, as themselves say, 
r Conc. Carth. 6. ca ●.  that Caecillianus brought with him the Decrees enacted at Nice, at which he was present. Now if they knew this Sardican Council, and the Decrees thereof, and yet knew no such Decree therein for Appealing from Africa to Rome, it followeth that the Pope's preten●ed Canon for Appeals was no Canon of the holy Sardican Council, and is therefore justly suspected to be forged by some of the Pope's Factours, who would gladly have brought all the G●iest to his Mill, and the main Suits of Christendom unto his Court and Consistory.   

Reply.  
Bellarmine saith, 
s Bellar. lib. 2● de Rom. Pont. cap. 24.  that the Decree forbade only the Priests, and inferior sort of the Clergy to appeal to Rome, but not the Bishops.   

Answer.  
This is an idle allegation; for the African Bishops provided for the conveniency of their Priests and Clergy, to hinder them from vexatious cou●se●, and wasteful expenses in the point of Appeal, by saving them from unnecessary travails beyond the Sea; and therefore they intended much more, that they themselves should b●e freed.  
Besides, the Decree runs generally, and forbids all sorts of Apellants, from Africa to Rome, as well Bishops as others: the tenor of the decree is this: 
t Quod si ab eyes (id ●st Epis●opis vi●ini) provo●ādum put●verint, non provocent nisi ad Africana Con●●●ia, & ad Primates pro●inci●rum s●●rum, a● t●ansmarina autem qui put●verit appelland●●, ● nullo 〈◊〉 ●●ricam in Communione 〈◊〉. Condil. 〈…〉 pag. 〈…〉 pa. 6●3.   
It was thought good, that Priests, Deacons or other inferior Clerks, if in their causes they complain of the judgements of their Bishops, and if they Appeal from them, they shall not Appeal but to the African Counsels, or to the Primates of their Povinces; but if any shall think that he ought to Ap●peale beyond the Sea (meaning to Rome) let him not be received any longer into the Communion of the Church of Africa.  
Binnius tells us, 
u In hoc concilio, non jus appeland● ad Sedem Apostolicam sed tantum modum p●osequend● appellationis per Legatos a Latere, controve●sum ●uis●e, a●t Binnius in Con●. C●rch●g. 6. ●om. 1. pag 619.  that the question was not about the right of Appealing to the See of Rome, but de modo, touching the manner of the Pope's admitting Appeals, of prosecuting and deciding complaints by his Legates, â latere; but the decree forbids Appeals from Africa to Rome, and condemns not only the manner, but the matter itself.   

Objection.  
You say Saint Austin opposed the Pope; but he was in good savour with 
x Bonifacio 〈…〉 Bellar. 〈…〉 Pont cap. 25. 〈…〉 Augustinus.  Zozimus, Boniface, and Celestine.   

Answer.  
Saint Austin kept good terms with the Bishops of Rome, 
y Augustini ●pist. 90. ad Boni●ac Papam.  and he had reason for it; because they were great patriarchs, and he had occasion to use their help and countenance, for quelling the Pelagian Heretics and others; and yet notwithstanding when their factors began to usurp jurisdiction over other Churches, than he might stand for the right of his African Churches, and give his vote freely in the Council.  
And thus we have found opposition made to the See of Rome by a whole national Council, in the weighty point of Appeals; for so Bellarmine makes appealing to Rome, and not Appealing from thence, a main proof of the Pope's supremacy. 
Appellatio est certissunum Argumentum prin●●p●tus Bell. li 2. de Rome Po●t. cap. 21.   
Now to proceed, about the year four hundred thirty and one, was the third general Council held at Ephesus, against the Nestorian heresy which divided Christ into two persons; it was summoned, not by the Pope but by the Emperor Theodosius the younger, At his beck, and by his command. 
a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ● authorit●tate ac nutu Theolos●● cogeb●tur. E●agr. hist. lib. 1 cap. 3.   
In the year four hundred fifty and one, the fourth general Council was held at Chalcedon, against Eutyches, (who in opposition to Nestorius) confounded the natures of Christ, making of two distinct natures, his humane and divine, but one nature; whereas Nestorius' rent is ●under his person, making two of one; this Council was called not by the Pope, 
b Sacerdotes Chal●edon●m venerunt ●uxta nostra prae●epta. Concil. Chale. apud B●n. tom. 2. act. 3. pag. 84.  but by the Emperor's Edict: it was first called at Nice and then recalled from thence, and removed to Chalcedon, wholly by the disposing of the Emperor; yea, Leo Bishop of Rome, wrote to the Emperor instantly beseeching him, to call it in Italy: all the Priests (saith he) 
c Omnes mansuetud●nē vestram cum gemitibus & lac●rimis supplicant Sacerdotes g●neral●m Synodum jubeatis intra Italiam celebrari. Leo Epist. 23.  do beseech your clemency with sighs and tears, that you would command a general Council to be celebrated in Italy. But their request was denied; it was held at Chalcedon for the ease of the Bishops of Asia: Leo could not have it where he would, but where and when the Emperor appointed; and Leo was glad to send his deputies thither.   

Reply.  
The Emperors summoned Counsels, but by the Pope's consent. 
d Dico nullum Concilium generale Catholicum ● solo Imperatore indictum, id est, sine consensu & authoritate Rom●ni Ponti●icis. Bell. lib. 1● de Concil. cap. 13. § Ad h●c.    

Answer.  
It is true indeed, that the Pope's consent was to these ancient Counsels, but no otherwise than as the consent of other chief Bishops; they consented because they could not choose, because they resolved to be obedient, but they could not appoint either place, or time.  
To proceed; This famous Council of Chalcedon renewed and ratifyed the Canon of the second General Council held at Constantinople● and accordingly (following their example) gave the Bishop of Constantinople equal privileges with the Bishop of Rome. The tenor of their decree runneth thus, 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Synod Chalced. act. 16 can 28. pa. 350. in editione ●ilij.  Our fathers have very rightly given the pre-eminence to the See of ancient Rome, because the City was the seat of the Empire; and we moved with the same reasons have transferred the same pre-eminence to the s●at of New Rome (that is to say Constantinople) thinking it reason that the City honoured with the Empire, and with the presence of the Senate, and enjoying the same privileges as Ancient Rome, being the seat of the Empire, did; and being after it the next should in matters Ecclesiastical have equal advancement.  
Here we see the reason which the Council gives why Rome had the first place, was not because it was so ordained by God's law, jure divino 
* Supponi●, quod Romana sedes tunc primatum habere me●uerit, cum Romani or●is imperio potirentur atque adeo non divino, sed huma●o jure caput Eccle●inum effecta suerit. Not. Binn●j in Conc. Chal. act. 15 p●g. 180. tom. 2. , or in Saint Peter's right; but by the consent and constitutions of men, because Rome was sometime the imperial seat; and the seat being thence translated to Constantinople, upon the same reason Constantinople was made equal with Rome.   

Reply.  
The Pope's Legates protested against this 
A Leg●t● Ponti●icis ●●●l●matum est. B●lla●m. lib. 2 de Rome Pon●. cap. 18. § 〈◊〉.  Ca●on you allege.   

Answer.  
It is a rule in law; 
g Est autem 〈◊〉 ●ecr●●um ●oncilij 〈…〉 a m●j●r● part●. Bel. li 2 de council. c 11 § At 〈◊〉 lib. ● tit. 17. de Reg. Iu●●s 160.  That is accounted the act of all, which is publicly done by the greater part, by the most voices; otherwise there would be no judgement given, because some perverse ones would still dissent. Now all the Council, save only the Pope's Legates, consented upon the Canon; and they were to be ruled by ●he major part of the Counsels votes: neither do we find that anciently the Pope had a negative or casting voice in Counsels; and therefore the Chalcedon Council notwithstanding the Legates opposition, professeth, 
h Haec omnes dicimus, haec om●ibus placent. Con●●l. C●alced. apud Bin. act. 16. pag 137. tom. 2.  Hae● omnes dicimus, this is all our vote, and Tota Synodus, 
i Et ●ota Synodus appr●havit. Ibid.  the whole Council hath confirmed this Canon for the honour of the S●● of Constantinople. And accordingly the whole 
k R●latio Synodi ad Leonem p●st Council. Chalced. ●ct. 16. p. 14●.  Council wrote to Pope Leo.  
Why bu● the Pope's Legates approved it not, 
l Contra●ic●io nos●ra 〈…〉. Ibid. pag. ●37.  they contradicted it. True, in this particular they dissented. But because they as all other Bps, even Pope Leo himself, consented un●o that general Maxim, That the judgement of the greater part shall stand for the judgement of the whole Councell● in that general both the Legates of Leo, and Leo himself, did implicitè, and virtually consent to that very Canon, from which actually and explicitè they did then descent. For which cause, the most prudent judges truly said, Tota Synodus, the who●e Council hath approved this Canon; either explicitè or implicitè, either expressly or virtually approved it. Yea the whole Council professed the same, and that even in the Synodall relation of their Acts to Pope Leo, saying: We have confirmed the Canon of the second Council for the honour of the See of Constantinople; declaring evidently that Act of approving that Canon to be the Act of the whole Synod, although they knew the Pope and his Legates contradicted it, as my learned kinsman Doctor Crakanthorpe hath well observed. 
m Doctor Crakanthorp of the fifth general Council. chap 18. sect. 29.   
In a word, what though the Pope's Legates were absent at the making of this Act, because they would not be present, and when they were present disclaimed it? the major part of the Synodall voices carried it; and so the Decree passed, and was afterwards confirmed by the sixth General Council.   

Reply.  
The Canon which equalleth the Patriarch of Constantinople to the Bishop of Rome makes not against us, since it was not confirmed by the Pope, who only confirmed such 
n Leo scribit, se Concilium illud app●obasse solùm quantum ad explicationem Fidei. Leo Epist. 59 ad Concil. Chalced. Bellar. li. 2. de Rom. Pont. cap. 22. § secundo.  Canons as concerned matters of Faith. Now Counsels are not of force till the Pope ratify them. 
o Conciliorum judicium tum demum firmum est cum accesserit Romani Pontificis confirmatio. Id. ibid. lib. 4. cap. 1. §. Sed.    

Answer.  
By this reason you will make the Pope's supremacy no Article of Faith; And what though Leo opposed the Canon, yet as Cardinal Cusanus saith, 
p Sed ita usus obtinuit longo tempore. Cusan. concord. Cathol. li. 1. ca 16.  Use and custom carried it against the Pope.  
Besides, a Council may be approved, though the Pope approve it not; and so was the second general Council called against the Macedonian Heretics and others; it was held by the Catholic Church a lawful general Council, though none of the Popes before Gregory's time approved it, for Gregory speaking of the Canons of that Council, saith, 
q Et Canon's quidem Constantinopolitani Concilij Eudoxianos damnant; sed quis fuerit eorum author Eud●xius, minimè dicunt. Romana autem ecclesia ●osdem Canon's vel gesta Synodi illius hactenus non habet, nec accipit; in hoc autem eandem Synodum accepit, quod est per eam contrà Macedonium definitum. Greg. Epist. l. 6 indict. 15. epist. 31.  Eosdem Canon's, vel gesta Synodi illius, hactenus non habet, nec accipit, the Roman Church neither hath, nor approveth those Canons or Acts; so that the Roman Church, until Gregory's time, neither approved the Canons nor Acts of that second general Council. And that is it, which Gregory intendeth, saying, hastenus non habet nec accipit, not meaning that till the year wherein he writ that Epistle; for himself before professed, 
r Et 〈…〉 Synods 〈…〉 Id ●p l●b 2 ●●dict. 1●. 〈…〉.  to embrace that s●cond Council a● one of the four Evangelists: but until Gregory's time, hactenus, until this age, wherein I live, w●s the second Council, the Canons or Acts thereof, not ha● nor approved by the Roman Church; and yet all this time, it was held an approved Synod; as the same D. Crakanthorpe hath observed. 
s Dr. 〈◊〉 of 〈…〉 18. 〈◊〉 2●.    

Question.  
Had not the Bishop of Rome the priority?   

Answer.  
He ha● a priority of Order, Honour, or Place before others; but not of jurisdiction over and above others; but even as Ambassadors take place one of another, yet have no dominion one over another.   

Question.  
Was not Rome highly esteemed of old?   

Answer.  
Old Rome was highly esteemed. First, because the●e the Apostles taught, and Rome professed the true Faith, and diverse of her Bishops were Martyrs.  
Secondly, because Rome was sometime the chief seat of the Empire, and so the chief City had a chief Bishop.  
Thirdly, because the Eastern or Greek Church was often at odds, the dissension; therefore such as were distressed had their recourse for Council and help, to the Patriarch of the West, the Bishop of Rome, an● this made him much respected; and her bishops withal being Godly men, and in good favour with the Emperors, they of●en times ●elieved such as were distressed: thus Iul●us bishop of Rome helped the banished Athanasius: for these, and the like respects the Fathers sp●ke reverently of Rome, as she was in diebus illis, in their time. But what is this to Rome in her corrupt estate? whil●s the Pope challengeth to himself infallibility of judgement, and not content with the primacy which his ancestors held, this Roman Dio●rephes se●kes pre-eminence, affecting not only an Hierarchy in the Church, but a Monarchy over the whole Church, as if Saint Peter (whose successor he pretends to be) had h●ld the Apostolic chair, as it we●e in Fee, for him and his Successors for ever, and the other eleven had held thei●s for term of life only.  
And now to look homewards to our Britain: in this Age we find our ancestors, besides their common enemies the Scots, Picts, and Saxons, troubled with another more secret, but as dangerous, to wi●, the Pelagian heresy, wherewith Pelagius (a Roman Monk, borne in Little Britain) with his Disciple Celestius, began to infect these Northern parts. But after they, and their heresies were condemned in the Counsels of Carthage and Mela, Pope Celestine sent Palladius into Scotland, as also our neighbours the French bishops (at the request of the Catholic English) s●nt 
y Sanctio. Germanus in Britanniam ven●● & pelagia●am heresy p●o●●iga●it M●th. Westmon. ad ann. 446.  Germanus bishop of A●xerre, and Lupus bishop of Troy's in Champeigne, into England, to beat down Pelagianism, which they happily suppressed.  
Now also there was a Provincial Council 
z Master Speeds History. lib. 6. cap. 9  held in Britain, for the reforming of Religion, and repairing of the ruined Churches, which the Pagan marriage of Vortiger had decayed, to the great grief of the people. A plain token that their zeal continued ev●n unto those day's: for so it was, whiles Vortiger a British Prince married with the fair but Infidel Rowena, Hengists' daughter, this Saxon match had almost undone both Church and State, whilst (as 
a Beda Histor. Anglor. lib. 1. cap. 15.  Bede complains) Priest's were slain standing at the Altar, and bishops with th●ir flocks we●e murdered; till at length, they assembled a Council to repair those decays which this marriage had made.  
Now to close up this Age, the Reader may observe that we have surveyed the first four General Counsels, which Gregory the Great 
b Greg. ep l. 2. ind●ct 11 ep. 10. Savino ●ubdi●●o●o. & lib 1. Epistolar. indict. 9 epist 24.  pro●essed that he ●mbraced as the four Gospels: and indeed they were called against those four Arch-heretickes that pestered the Church: the first was h●ld at Nice, against Arrius a Priest of Al●xandria, who held that Christ was neither God, nor eternal, but an excellent creature, created before all creatures. The second at Constantinople, against Macedonius, who held, that Christ was not of the same essence; not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, consubstantial, and of the same substance, with the Father, but only 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 like to him; and that the Holy Ghost was not God, but God's Minister, and a creature not eternal. The third at Eph●su● against Nestorius, who held, that Christ had two several persons, but not two wills; 
c Cum Ecclesia distra●eretur. & pars Mariam 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Hominiparam, pars 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 D●iparam nominand●m a●●irmarent, Nestorius, voc●m 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, qu● Maria appell●retur, ●xcogitavit. Evage. Histor. Ecclesiast. lib. 1 cap. 7.  and that the Virgin Mary was not to be called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, the mother of God, but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, the Mother of Christ. The fourth at Chalcedon, where Dioscorus, and Eutyches were condemned. This Eutyches (confuting Nestorius) fell into other heresies, and confounded the two natures of Christ, making him (after his union) to have but the divine nature only.  
Besides, the Reader may farther observe, that upon the survey of these first four General Counsels (so much esteemed by S. Gregory) it is found, that they confined the bishop of Rome to his bounds, with other patriarchs; and they equalled other patriarchal Seas to the Roman: so that hereby is discovered the vanity of Campian's flourish, saying, 
d Concilia generalia mea sunt; primum, ultimum m●●ia. ●amp. Rat. 4.  General Counsels are all ours, the first, and the last, and the middle. For we embrace such General Counsels as were held in those golden Ages, within the first six hundred years, or thereabouts.  
The middle rank, beginning at the second Nicene, unto the Council of Florence, held in the Ages of the mingled and confused Church, they are neither wholly theirs, nor ours.  
The two last, the one at Lateran, the other at Tr●nt, these (being held by the dross of the Church) are theirs.     

AN APPENDIX to the fi●th CENTURIE.  
Of the Father's Authority.  

PAPIST.  
YOu have produced the Fathers for these five or six hundred years, as if they had been of your Faith; whereas you descent from th●m, 
a B●lla●● de notis Eccles. c●p. 9  and refuse their trial: but we honour them, and appeal to the joint consent of Antiquity.   

PROTESTANT.  
Where we se●me to vary from them, it is either in things humane, arbitrary and indifferent, or in matters not fully discussed by the ancient, or in points which were not delivered by joint consent of the ancient, or in things which are reproved by plain demonstration of holy Scripture, and wherein the Fathers permit liberty of dissenting, and the Papists themselves usually take it. Neither would Saint Austin 
b Neminem velim sic amplec●i mea omnia, ut me sequatur, nisi in eyes quibus me non errare perspexerit. Aug de persever. Sanct. cap. 21 tom. 7.  (the fai●est flower of Antiquity) have his Reader follow him farther than he followeth the Truth, not denying but that as in his manners, so in his writings many things might justly be 
c Multa ●sse in opusculis meis quae ●ossunt justo judicio culpari. Id. de orig. anim● cap. 1. tom. 7.  taxed.  
Neither do we refuse the trial of the Fathers, truly alleged, and rightly understood, witness the challenge made by Bishop jewel 
d Master jewels Sermon at Paul's Crosse. , and seconded by Doctor Whitaker 
e W●itak●r in 〈◊〉 Rat. 5 Camp. , and Doctor Featly; yea, Doctor Whitaker 
f T●ti ad nostras partes pervolant. Id. ibid.  (as Scultetus observeth) 
g Patres in maximis judicijs toti sunt nostri, in le●ioribus varij, in paucissimis ac minutissimis vestri. Scultetus in Medullae Patr. parte 2. c. 15. p. 140.  was confident, That the Fathers, although in some matters they be variable, and partly theirs, partly ours, yet in the material points they be wholly ours, and theirs in matters of lesser moment, and some few Tenets. Likewise, that great light of Oxford Doctor Reinolds, in his Conference with Master Hart, solemnly protested, 
h Conference with Hart. chap. 8. divis. 6.  that in his opinion not one of all the Fathers was a Papist; for (saith he) The very being and essence of a Papist consists in the opinion of the Pope's supremacy; but the Pope's supremacy was not allowed by any of the Fathers, as he there proveth against Hart: not one then of all the Fathers was a Papist.   

PA.  
May we not ground our Faith upon the Father's Testimonies?   

PRO.  
We reverence the ancient Fathers, but still with reservation of the respect we owe to that Ancient of days, Daniel 7.6. their father and ours, who taught young Elihu, job. 32.6. to reprove his Ancients, even holy job amongst them, job 33.12. him alone do we acknowledge for the father of our Faith, on whom we may safely ground in things that are to be believed. For every Article of Christian Faith must be grounded on divine revelation 
i Audi dicit Dominus, non dicit aut Ambrose, aut Augustinus, sed dicit Dom●nus. August. Epist. 48 tom. 2. ; but all opinions of the Fathers are not divine revelations, neither do the Father's challenge to themselves infallibility of judgement. S●int Austin saith, 
k 〈…〉 Au●ust. Epist. 19  This reverence and honour have I learned to give to those Books of Scripture only, which are called Canonical, that I most firmly believe none of their Authors could any whit err in writing: But others I so read, that with how great sanctity and learning soever they do excel, I therefore think not any thing to be true, because they s● thought it; but because they were able to persuade me, either by those Canonical Authors, or by some probable reason, that it did not swerve from truth.  
Neither do our Adversaries yield infallibility of judgement t● the Fathers; Baronius saith, 
l 〈…〉 34.  The Church doth not always, and in all things follow the Father's interpretation of Scripture. Bellarmine saith 
m 〈…〉 c. 12. § R●●p●nd●o.  Their writings are no rules of Faith, neither have they authority to bind. Canus tells us, 
n Reliqui ve●ò scriptores inferiores & human● sunt deficiuntque interdum, ac monstrum quandoque pariunt. Canus loc. Theol. l. 7. c. 3. nu. 7.  That the ancient Fathers sometime err, and against the ordinary course of nature bring forth a monster. And it may be some of the well-gifted modern Doctors may see as far as some of the ancient. Friar Stella, though it be far from him to condemn the common exposition given by the ancient holy Doctors, Yet I know full well (saith he 
o Bene tamen scimus Pygmeos Gigantum humeri● impo●itos, plusquam ipsos Gigantes videre. Stella ●narr●t. in Luc. cap. 10. p. 15. to. 2. super illa verba, Consiteor ●ibi Pater.  that Pygmeis being put upon Giant's shoulders, do see farther than the Giants themselves. Neither do we speak this, as if we refused the trial of Fathers, but partly to bring the matter to a shorter issue, and partly to give the word of God (the foundation 
p Ephes. 2.20.  on which we build our faith) it's due; for we do usually produce the Father's testimonies, thereby to show our consent with the ancient Church.   

PA.  
Will you charge the Fathers with error?   

PRO.  
The Father's being but men have erred through oversight and affection.  
Saint Cyprian, and a whole Council with him erred in the point of Rebaptisation, 
q Cyprian in epist. 73. ad jubian. tom. 1.  whiles through too much hatred of Heretics, they condemned the Baptism of Heretics as unlawful, and would have them baptised anew.  
Origen, 
r Misericordi●r suit O●igines, qui & ipsum Diabolum, atque Angel●s ejus post graviora pro Meriti● & diuturniora supplicia, ex illi● cruciatibus eruendos, atque sociandos S. Angelis cr●didit. Aug. de Civit Dei lib. 21. cap. 17. tom. 5. & ibid. c. 24. Origen in his book 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, held this opinion.  through too much compassion of the wicked, thought that the Devils themselves should be saved at length.  
Tertullian through spite of the Roman Clergy, revolted to the Montanists, 
s Hoc etiam Paracletus commendavit. Tertul. de Animâ. cap. ult.  and was taken up with their idle Prophecies and revelations.  
Divers of the Fathers were tainted with the error of the Chiliasts, or Millenaries, 
t Sixt. Senens. Biblioth. lib. 5. annot. 233.  mistaken herein in that they thought that Christians af●er the Resurrection should reign a thousand years with Christ upon the earth, and there should marry wives, beget children, eat, drink, and live in corporal delights; which error, though flatly repugnant to the Scriptures, (which say 
u Matt●. 22 30. & 1. thessal. 4.17.  that in the Resurrection, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the Angels in heaven) they fell into; part●y by confounding the first, and second Resurrection, Revel. 20.5. and partly, by taking that carnally, which was mystically meant in the Revelations, Revel. 21.10. and 22.2.  
Besides, the Fathers in the exposition of Scripture, do oftentimes differ each from other, as Sixtus Senensis hath observed in his Bibliothecâ. lib. 5.   

PA.  
Though particular Fathers do err in some things; yet the body of them is ●ound; now we are bound to 
b B●lla Pl● 4. super formà juram.  interpret the Scripture according to the joint consent of the Fathers.   

PRO.  
You have forfeited your bond, for in the division of the ten cō●andements (to conceal your Idolatry touching Image worship forbidden in the second) you go against the stream of antiquity, the learned jews, the Father's Greek and Latin, for though Saint Austin, 
August. quest. 71. in Exo●. tom 4.  in respect of the mystery of the blessed Trinity, placed three commandments in the first table, and seven in the later, yet there be a dozen of the Ancients that divide them as we do; namely, the Hebrews, as Philo 
c Philo Iud●eus in libro de Decalogo. , and josespus show 
d joseph Antiquit. judaic. lib. 3. ; and amongst the Grecians, Gregory Nazianzen 
Greg. N●zianzen. in Carm. ●5. in Decalog , Origen 
f Origenes in Exod. Homil. 8 tom. 1. , Athanasius 
g At●anas in Synopsi ● Scripturae tom 4. , chrysostom 
h Author Oper●● imper●ecti in Math. Homil. ●9. , or whosoever was the Author of the work unperfit upon Matthew; amongst the Latins, S. Ambrose 
i Ambros in Epist. ad Ephes. cap ●. tom. 5. , S Hierome 
k Hie●on i● 6. cap ep ad ●phe● , and one more ancient than they both, to wit, 
l August. qu●st● vet & 〈…〉 7. tom. 4.  the Author of the questions of the old and new Testament, going under Saint Augustine's name. And for Historian●, Sulpitius Severus, in his sacred History 
m Sup Severus Sacr●e 〈◊〉 lib. 1 cap 16. , and Zonaras in his Annals 
n Zo●●ras Arnal tom 1 , they be of the same mind; where is now your submission to the joint consent of the Fathers?  
In like sort, you hold 
o 〈◊〉 Trid. 〈◊〉 5. 〈…〉 orig. & 〈◊〉 6. the ●ustif. can. 23.  that the blessed Virgin was free from all spot of Original sinne● and yet the Scripture saith, That in Adam all have sinned, Rom. 5.12. and your own man Melchior Canus produceth seventeen Fathers to the contrary: 
p Sancti omnes qui in ejus rei m●moriam inciderunt uno 〈◊〉 asseverarunt, Betam virginem in peccato originali conceptam. Mel. Canus loc. Theol. l 7. c. 1.  Sancti omnes, all the holy Fathers, that have mentioned this matter, (uno ore) with one consent affirm, the blessed Virgin to have been conceived in Original sin. And yet these be the men that crack of the unanimous consent of Fathers, that the Fathers are as sure to them, 
q Patr●s tam sunt nostri quam Gregorius decimus tertius. Camp. rat. 5  as Gregory the thirteenth is a loving Father to his children of the Church. The truth is, whatsoever they say of the Fathers to dazzle the people's eyes withal they use them as Merchants do their Counters, sometimes standing for pence, sometime for pounds, even as they be next and readiest at hand, to make up their accounts; neither are they farther entertained, than they favour the keys and authority of the Church, saith Duraeus 
r Neque enim Patres censentur, cum ●uum aliquid, quod ab Ec●l si● non acceperunt, vel scribunt, vel d●cent. Du●aeus Resp. ad Whit. 〈◊〉 rat. 5. p. 140. ; now by the Church he means the Roman Church. And Grets●r saith, 
s E●tenus, non Pater sed vitricus, non Doctor, said seductor est. Gretser de jure p●ohibendi libros. lib. 2. cap. 10 pag 328.  that if the Fathers teach otherwise than the Church, (namely the Roman Church) than they be not Fathers, but step-fathers': not Doctors, but Seducers. Cornelius Must the Bishop of Bitonto saith, 
t Ego● ut ingenue fatear plus uni summo Pontifici creder●m in his quae fidei Myst●ria tangunt, quam mille Augustinis, Hieron●m●, G●egorijs ne dicam Richardis, Scoti●, Gulielm●. C●rnel. Musso. Comment. in Rom. c. 14. pag 606.  That in points of Faith, he giveth more credit to the Pope, than to a thousand Austin's, Hieromes, Gregory's; and yet these be the men that cry up the Father's. Now if the Fathers make so much for them, or they of the Fathers; how is it that they corrupt the writings of the true Fathers, and devise such sleights to elude their testimonies? how is it that they are driven to fly to the bastard treatises of false Fathers going under the name of Abdias, Linus, Clemens, S. Denys, and the like Knights of the Post, brought in to depose on their behalf; though others of their own side have cashiered them as counterfeits? 
u See Doctor james of the Bastardy of fal●e Fathers; and Doctor Reinolds Conference with Hart Ch●p 8. Divis. 2.  for instance sake; amongst the Pope's decretal Epistles, the first of Clemens written (as is pretended) to james the brother of the Lord, is vouched by Bellarmine, 
x Bellar. de Rome Pont. lib 2. cap 14.  for proof of the Pope's Supremacy; as also by the Rhemists, 
y Rhem. Annot. in Pet. 1.15.  to prove that Peter promised Saint Clement, that after his departure he would not cease to pray for him and his flock; now this Clement is pretended to be the same that lived in the Apostles times, and is mentioned by Saint 
z P●al. 4 3  Paul, but it is discovered for a sergeant; for in this Epistle it is said, that Peter prayed Clemens to write (after his death) this Epistle to james the brother of the Lord, to comfort him, and Clemens did so; whereas james was dead long before Peter, 
a 
Eus●b. hist lib. 2 c. 23. joseph. antiq. jud. lib. 20 cap. 8.  
Qui tamen [S. jacobꝰ] octo ante Petrum annos Martyrio vitam sinierat. Cusan. lib. 3. de Concord. Cathol. cap. 2. & lib. 2. c. 17   about an eight years at least, now what a senseless thing is this to write letters to a dead man, specially knowing him to be dead: and hereupon Cardinal Cusanus hath cast off this Epistle as counterfeit: In deed Turrian the jesuit striveth to defend 
b Ostendamusque verissima esse, quae B. Petrum docuisse Clemens dicit. Fr. Turrian. defence. Canon. & epist. Decretal. lib. 4. cap. 4. pag. 306.  this Epistle, but yet he cannot show by what carrier Clement did send the letters to Saint james. And yet must these be vouched under the reverend names of Saints Abdias, Saint Linus, Saint Clement, Saint Denys; being not much unlike (as one in Budaeus compares 
c Quales sunt quae aedi●●● sacred mutulares statuae pilis aut columnis imponuntur— patere ●os nihilo utiliores statuis lapideis esse. Budaeus de Ass. lib. 5 pag. 277.  some grave pontifician Fathers) to antiques in Churches, which bow and crouch under vaults and pillars, and seem to bear up the Church, as sometime the Pope thought he saw the Church of Saint john Latterane totter, and ready to fall, had not Saint Dominick upheld it with his shoulder 
d The life of Saint Dominicke. , whereas these do not bear up the Church, but are borne out by the Church, and are indeed but puppets.   

PA.  
Master Wadesworth saith, He found the Catholics had far greater and better armies of evident witnesses than the Protestants.   

PRO.  
Master Bedel answereth Master Wadesworth, 
e Bedews Letters to Wads●worth pag. 109. 110  that had it pleased God to have opened his eyes, as he did Elisha's servants, he might have seen, that there were more on our side than against us. Besides (as Master Bedel saith) the Roman Doctors may bring in whole armies of witnesses on their side, when they change the question, and prove what no body denies; as when the question is, whether the Pope have a monarchy over all Christians, an uncontrollable jurisdiction, and infallibility of judgement, 
f Bellarm. de Rom. Pont. lib. 2 cap 15 & 16. answered by D. Field. lib. 5 cap. 35.36.  Bellarmine allegeth a number of Fathers, Greek and Latin, to prove only that Saint Peter had a primacy of honour and authority, which is far short of that supremacy which the Popes now claim, and which is the question.  
So also to prove the verity of Christ's body and blood in the Lord's Supper, 
g Bellar. de E●char. li. 2. toto.  Bellarmine spends the whole book in citing the Fathers of several Ages. To what purpose? when the question is not of the truth of the presence, but of the manner, whether it be to the teeth or belly (which he in a manner denies) or to the soul and faith of the receiver.  
So also 
h Bell●r. de Purgat. lib. 1. cap. 6.  Bellarmine for the proof of Purgatory allegeth a number of Fathers (as Ambrose, Hilary, Origen, Basil, Lactantius, Jerome) but far from the purpose of the question, and quite beside their meaning: for they spoke of the fire at the end of the world (as Sixtus Senensis saith 
i Sixt. Senens. Biblio● lib. 5. Annot. 171. ) and Bellarmine cities them for the fire of Purgatory before the end.  
In like sort, for proof of Saintly invocation, Bellarmine musters up thirty Fathers, of the Greek and Latin Church 
* Bellar. l. 1. de Sanct. Beat. cap. 19 ; now here is an army of ancients able to fright some untrained soldiers; but it is but like the army that troubled the Burgundians, 
* Voyans grande quamtité de lances debout, si leur sembloit;— ils trouuerent que s'estoient ●●ans chardons. Philip. de Comminees Cronique du Roy loys unziesme Chapit. nineteen.  Who lying near to Paris, and looking for the battle, supposed great Thistles to have been Lances held upright: or like those soldiers mentioned by Plutarch in the life of Agesilaus, who bombasted, and embossed out their coats with great quarters, to make them seem big and terrible to the enemy; but after they were overthrown, and slain in the field, Agesilaus caused them to be stripped, and bid his soldiers behold their slender and weerish bodies, of which they stood so much in fear, whiles they looked so big upon their enemies: the like may be said of Bellarmine's forces, they keep a great quarter, but when they come to join issue for it, they are soon defeated. For of the Fathers alleged by Bellarmine, th●re be (as is already shown in the fifth Age) seven of the thirty, which be no Fathers, but post-nati, punies to primitive Antiquity.  
Eight of them be justly suspected not to be men of that credit, as that their depositions may be taken.  
Two or three of them are wrong cited by a writ of error, being either ignorantly, or wilfully mistranslated.  
Seven others of them speak like Poets, Orators, Panegyrists, not dogmatically, but figuratively, with rhetorical compellations, expressing their votes, and desires.  
The other six that remain, they speak of Intercession in general, not of Invocation in particular, of some few people's private practice, but not of the Church's Office, Agend, or Doctrine generally taught, practised, and established.  
Besides (as Master Moulin saith) 
k M. Moulins waters of Siloe, or Confutation of Purgatory, Chap. 7. pag. 324.  among so many Authors as might fill a house, it is an easy matter to find somewhat to wrest to a man's own advantage, and never to be perceived, because few men have these books, and of them that have them, few do read them, and of those that read them, fewest of all do understand them.  
But that we may the better conceive the meaning of the testimonies and allegations of the Fathers, let us observe such cautions as the learned 
l 
M. And. Rivet tract. de Pat●um auto●it. c. 11.  
Bishop Montague his Treatise of the Invocation of Saints. pag. 155.  
Doctor F●atlyes Disput. with M. M●sk●t pag. 100   have set down for our help herein.  
The Father's writings be either Dogmatic, polemical, or Popular. 
1 Cau●ion.   

2 Caution.  In their Dogmatic, and Doctrinal, wherein they set down positive Divinity, they are usually very circumspect: in their Polemickes, and Agonistickes, earnest and resolute: in their Homilies, and popular discourse, free and plain.  

3 Caution.  In their con●roversall writings, it falls out sometimes, that through heat of disputation, whiles they oppose one error, they sl●p in●o the opposite; like one that labouring to make a crooked thing strait, bends it the quite contrary way: thus Hierome wh●les he affronts such a● impugned virginity, himself quarrels at lawful Matrimony; otherwise the Fathers in their Polemiques, whiles they keep themselves close to the question in hand, their tenets are ever most sound, and direct.  
In their Homilies, 
4 Caution.  and exhortations to the people, they st●ive to move affections, so that they run forth into figu●es of Rhetoric, and keep not themselves close to points of doctrine.  
Of this kind of speech, Sixtus Senensis gives a good Rule, to wit, 
n Non sunt Concionatorum verba semper eo rigore accipienda, multa enim Declamatores per Hyperbolen ●nunciant, ho● interdum Chrysostomo contingit. Sixt. S●nens. Biblioth. lib. 6 Annot. 152.  that Their sayings are not to be urged in the rigour, because that Orator like they speak Hyperbolically and in excess; and he gives instance in Chysostome, as well he might; for in the point of the Sacrament, he used such Rhetorical strains, as hath been noted in the fifth Centurie: and Hierome saith of himself, 
o Rhetoricati sumus, ●t in morem De●lamatorum, pau●ulùm Ins●mus. Hieron. advers. Helvid.  I have played the Orator, in manner of a declamation, to wit, by way of amplification, and exaggeration.  
Saint Hierome observes, 
p Ant●quam in Alexäd●à quasi Daemonium meridianü Arius 〈◊〉 innocenter quaedam & minus cau●e locuti sunt. Hieron. in Apolog. 2. advers. Russinum. pag. 220.  That before that Southern Devil Arius arose at Alexandria, 
5 Caution.  the ancients spoke certain things in simplicity, and not so warily: Saint Austin makes the like observation touching Pelagius; how that the Fathers, ante mota certamina Pelagiana, extended the power of freewill above measure, having then no cause to fear, there being no Pelagius then risen up in the world, an enemy of grace, and advancer of nature. Until the Pelagians began to wrangle, the Fathers (saith Saint Austin, 
q Tali qu●stione nullus pul●abatur; vobis [pelagianis] nondum litigantibus securius loque●atur I●annes [Chrysostomus.] August. lib. 1. cont. ●u●i●n. c. 6. tom. 7.  and he gives instance in Saint chrysostom) took less h●ed to their speeches, to wit, in the point of Original sin, and freewill, but after that the Pelagian heresy arose, it made us, saith the same Austin, 
r S●d non erat ●x●●●tus hanc haeresin [〈◊〉]— multo vigila● 〈◊〉 diligentio e●que re●● d●t nos [Pelagius] 〈◊〉 li 3. de doctr. Ch●ist. c. 33. tom. 3.  Multò vigilantiores, diligentioresque, much more diligent, and vigilant in scanning of this point. In like sort, the Doctors that lived in the middle ages, what time Popery was not yet grown to his height, they spoke not so warily in the point of justification and grace, yet they left not the truth of God without a witness, 1 Tim. 6.12.  

C●u●ion.  We must not take up such customs as were sometimes used, in the Church, and make precedents of them, as if they had been warranted by the Church, and the Fa●hers then living; for the Fathers, being taken up wi●h weightier matters, winked at other faults, and were driven to bear with what they could not redress. Saint Austin complaineth of the superstition of certain Christians, that in Church yards did kneel before the Tombs of the Martyrs, and before the painted Histories of their sufferings. 
Novi multo●●sse 〈◊〉 pulchro●um & pict narum ad●rato●es. Aug. de morib. ec●les. cap 34. tom. 1. Qui aut●m se in memorijs Martyrum inebr●ant, quomod● à nobis approbari possunt? sed ●liud est quod decemus, aliud quod susti●em●s Idem c●ntrà Faustum M●nich● lib. 20. cap. 21. t●m. 6.  I know many (saith he) who worship Sepulchers and Pictures, I know many who drink most excessively over the dead. The good Bishops saw these maladies in their flocks, and desired to reform them, but they feared lest the rude people should hinder their reformation, so that they were constrained to tolerate these and the like abuses; insomuch that the same Austin speaking of them saith, 
t Quod a●tem instituitur pre●er con●uetudinem, ut quasi observatio Sacra menti sit● approbare non p●ss●m, etiamsi multa hu●u modi propter nonnulla●um v●l 〈◊〉, vel turbulentarum personarum 〈◊〉 devi●andi libe●●●is impr●bare non audeo. Aug. Epist. 119. d januar.  Approbare non possum, I can no way allow them, and yet liberius improbare non audeo, I dare not freely reprove them: and why? lest thereby I either offend some good men, or provoke some turbulent spirits.  
And the same Father speaking of such as drank, drunk over the Sepulchers of the dead, withal he addeth: 
u S●d ●liud est quod dos●m●s, aliud quod sustinemas; aliud quo● praecipere 〈…〉 & 〈…〉. Au●. contrà Faustum Mani●●. li 20 ca 21.  It is one thing that we teach, another that we tolerate; it is one thing that which we are commanded to teach, another thing we are commanded to correct, and which we are constrained to bear withal, until that it be amended.  
Neither indeed is it to be marvailed, if the learned among them, and such as were lately come from the Philosopher's Schools into Christian Colleges, and a people newly crept out of Paganism; I say it is not to be marvailed, if they retained something of their former Tenets and customs; but these are no precedents for us who have now better learned Christ jesus.  

7 Cau●ion.  For farther caution, we may make use of that rule which Bellarmine layeth down; and it is this: We must (saith 
x Oportet ex verbis ape●ti● S Patrum expone●e ea● quae videntur obscura et dubia in aliis Patribus. Bellarm. lib. 2. de Euchar. cap. 37. §. Ex.  he) confer the Father's one with another, and the same Father oft times in divers Treatises with himself; and by those things that are clearly set down in one place, or one Father, expound those things that seem more obscure and doubtful in another.  
Now we accept of this rule, and thereby defeat divers of our Adversaries allegations; for example: Those words of Saint Ambrose 
y Quia benedictione etiam Natura ipsa mutatur. Ambros. de iis qui myster. initiantur cap. 9  are much pressed, Benedictione natura mutatur, By benediction or consecration the nature of the elements in the Lord's supper is changed; and yet Saint Cyrill 
z Spiritus sancti operatione ad divinam aqua reformantur naturam. Cyril. Alexand. sup. joan. lib. 2. cap. 42. tom. 1. Georg. Trapezontio Interpret.  saith as much of Baptism; namely, That the Waters are changed into a divine nature.  
They will not hence infer a Transubstantiation in Baptism; why will they then from the like words in Saint Ambrose infer a Transubstantiation in the Lord's Supper?  
Those words of Gregory Nyssen 
a 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Greg. Nyssen. Orat. Catechet. cap. 37. pa. 536.  are much pressed, namely; Panem in corpus Christi 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉; Bread to be changed into Christ's Body. Now let Nyssen expound Nyssen, who in the words immediately going before saith, Corpus Christi ad divinam dignitatem 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, that Christ's body is changed or turned into a divine excellency; and yet this is done without any Transubstansiation at all.  
In like sort, that of Theophylact is much urged, 
b Bellar. lib. 2. de Euchar. c. 34. § Sed— adducit testimonium Theophylacti●a c●p. 26 Math. & in cap. 6 joan. dicentis panem transmutari in carnem Domini.  who saith of the Bread, That it is trans-elementated into the body of Christ, he useth the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉: Now Theophylact may expound Theophylact, who in the very same place saith, 
c 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Theophyl. in joan. cap. 6. vers. 54. pag. 654.  Nos in Christum 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, that we also are trans-elementated into Christ; that a Christian is in a manner trans-elementated into Christ: Now they will not say, that we are transubstantiated into Christ; therefore neither doth Theophylact by the word Trans-elementation used of the Bread and Wine, understand any substantial, but only a Sacramental change. The like is shown in the testimonies objected out of Hilary in the fourth age, and cyril of Alexandria in the fifth, answered by themselves.  

8 Caution.  We are to make a dfference of the Father's age, and writings, as also of their gifts; Saint Austin wrote more sound than Origen, though Origen were his Ancient; for Origen turned almost all into Allegories; yet as with Wines, so in Writings, usually the elder the better, and the Water near the Springhead runs clear and sweet; so it was with the Fathers that wrote during the first five hundred years next after Christ: others, that wrote after the first six hundred years, such as Damascen, Anselm, and the like, they were post-nati to primitive antiquity, and out of the verge of the Church's purity, as also some of them partial, for so was Damascen a party in that Image quarrel in the Eastern Church; and therefore in that case his testimony is to be barred.  
Besides, for the answering of allegations out of the Fathers, we must sever the bastard treatises, from the true and undoubted writings of the Fathers: for example, Dionysius Hierarchy is a counterfeit; Clement's constitutions are suspected, and Cyprian de Coena domini, is not 
d Doctor james, of the Bastardy of Fathers. p●rt. ●. p. 12.  Cyprians; as is already shown in the third Centurie.  

Object.  
If these be counterfeits, how is it that yourselves produce diverse testimonies out of them; as also out of the Commentaries of Saint Hierome, and Saint Ambrose, upon Saint Paul's, Epistles, which yet yourselves do not hold them to be Saint Hieromes and Saint Ambroses 
Rob. C●ci Consura Pa●●um. p. 133. & 143. And. ●ivet Critici sacri. lib. 4. c. 5. de Hieronymi exegeticis. Id. lib. 3 c. 18. de ●●bijs & suppositijs to●i 4. & 5. Ambrosian. ?   

Answer.  
It is not to be marvelled, if some of our learned Protestants (admitting the books were written by them whose names they do bear) do thence produce testimonies against you: for it is a rule in Law, 
f Tynd●rus Tract. de Testibu●.  Testem quem quis inducit pro se, tenetur recipere country se, you have produced them for your own benefit, and therefore in reason you cannot disallow of them now, though it be to your great hindrance, you first produced these witnesses, and now that they are in the face of the Court, you must give us leave to examine them upon cross Interrogatories.  
To close up this point; the Fathers are more to be credited, when they conclude a thing de fide, dogmatic 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 didactic 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, doctrinally, positively, purposely, by way of setting forth a matter of faith; than when they write Agonistic 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, 
g Master Harding. 1●. Artic. division 10.  that is to say by way of contention and disputation, or obiter, touching a point only upon the by, and as it may serve and suit with the point they have in hand, without farther respect thereunto. They are more to be credited when they speak Categoric 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, assertiuè, with asseveration; than speaking only Historic 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, and ex opinione aliorum, relating only the opinion of others, or what was done, and not delivering their own judgement; they are more to be esteemed wh●n they speak as Divines in a professed discourse, than when they speak as Orators, Poets, Panegyrifts, and in a popular 
h Demegorica, non sunt Lit is Decretoria. D. Andrew's Resp. ad Card. Bellarm. Apolog. cap. 1. pa. 42.  discourse.  
In a word, we must observe, what they write out of their private opinion, and what they deliver as the judgement of the Church: when any of them go alone, it is not so safe following them; but where we have their unanimous and joint consent in any material point, we may more securely rely upon them; and this was one of King james his directions for Students in Divinity 
i King james his Cygnea Cantio, or Directions for Students in Divini●●●, published by D. Featly. : and I find the same rule in Vincentius Lirinensis; to wit, 
k Quicquid non unus, aut duo tantum, sed omnes pariter uno eodemque consensu, apertè, frequenter, perseveranter, tenuisse, scripsisse, docuisse, cognoverit, id sibi quoque intelligat abs●ue ullá dubitatione ●●ed●ndum. Vincent. Lirin. cont. Haeres. c 4. etc. 39  That we may rely upon that, not which one or two of the Fathers, but either all (or most of them) have taught, and that manifestly, frequently and constantly.    

PA.  
Although in some things the Fathers make for you, yet in the point of Merit, prayer for the dead, and prayer to Saints they are against you; 
l Bellar. de N●t Ec●les. lib. 4 cap. 9 § Item.  they used the word Merit, and held as we do.   

PRO.  
The Ancients used the word Merit (and so also they used the terms, Indulgences, Satisfaction, Sacrifice, a●d Penance) but quite in another sense then the later Romanists do: the Fathers who use it, took up the word as they found it in ordinary use and custom with men in those times, not for to deserve, which in our language implieth Merit of condignity, but to incur, to attain, impetrate, obtain and procure, without any relation at all to the dignity, either of the person or the work; thus Saint Bernard concerning children promoted to the Prelacy, saith; 
m L●●tiores interim quòd virgas evas●r●nt, q●am quòd meruerint principatum. Be●n. Epist. 22.  They were more glad they had escaped the rod, than that they had merited (that is, obtained) the preferment. Saint Augustine saith, 
n P●o actione gratia●um flammas meruimus odio●um. Aug. lib 3. con●●à Lit. 〈◊〉. c. 6. tom. 7.  that he and his fellows for their good doings, at the hands of the Donatists, In steed of thanks merited (that is, incurred) the flames of hatred: on the other side the same Father affirmeth, 
o Pro p●rse●utionibus ●t bla●phemys vas electionis me●uit n●min●ri. Id. de pr●d●st. e● great. c. 16.  That Saint Paul for his persecutions and blasphemies merited (that is, found grace) to be named a vessel of election. Saint Gregory hath a strain concerning the sin of Adam, which is sung in the Church of Rome, at the blessing of the Taper; 
p 〈◊〉 Cerei 〈◊〉 O ●alix 〈◊〉 quae 〈◊〉 ac ta●tum meruit 〈…〉 Ma●●●le E●●les. Sarisbur. ●●g. 30  O happy sin that merited (that is, Found the favour) to have such and so great a Redeemer. In like sort by merits they did ordinarily signify works, as appears by that of Saint Bernard, saying, 
q N●que enim 〈…〉, ut p●●pt●r ●a vita ●eterna deb●●tur 〈◊〉 jure. Merita o●nia 〈◊〉 D●i ●unt. Be●n serm. 1. in Ann●n●i B. Mariae.  The merits of men are not such, that for them eternal life should be due of right; for all merits are Gods gifts.  
Neither did the ancient Church hold merit of Condignity, but resolved according to that of Leo; 
r N●que 〈◊〉 de quali●●●● 〈…〉 dono●um Leo S●●m. 12. de 〈◊〉. Dom.  The measure of celestial gifts depends not upon the quality of works; they were not of the Rhemists' opinion, 
s Rhemists Annot. up●● H●br. 6. sect. 4.  That good works are meritorious, and the very cause of salvation; so far that God should be unjust, if he rendered not heaven for the same. They were not so far jesuited as with Vasquez 
t Vasquez in primam secundae qu. 114.  to hold, that 
u Opera bona justorum ex seipsis, absque ullo pacto & accep●atione digna esse remuneratione vitae aet●rnae, & equalem valorem condignitatis habere ad consequendam aeternam gloriam. Vasquez Comment. in primam. secund. q●. 114. disp. 214. cap. 5. in inition  The good works of just persons are of themselves, without any covenant and acceptation, worthy of the reward of eternal life, and have an equal value of condignity to the obtaining of eternal glory.   

PA.  
You cannot deny, but that prayer for the dead is ancient.   

PRO.  
The manner now used is not ancient, for they that of old prayed for the dead, had not any reference to Purgatory, as Popish prayers are now adays made.  
It is true indeed, that anciently they used Commemorations of the defunct; neither mislike we their manner of naming the deceased at the holy table; in this sort, they used a Commemoration 
x 
Missa Chrysostomis, in Biblioth. Patr. graeco-lat. Par. 1624.  
— & inprimis sanctissimae Virgins. ordo Liturgiae B. joann Chrysostomis ex versione Leonis Tusci apud Cassand● in Liturgiae. ca ●.   of the Patriarches, Prophets, Apostles, Evangelists, Martyrs, and Confessors, yea of Mary the mother of our Lord, to whom it cannot be conceived, that by prayer they did wish their deliverance out of Purgatory, sith no man ever thought t●em to be there; but if they wished any thing, it was the deliverance from the power of death, which as yet tyrannised over one part of them; the hastening of their resurrection, as also a joyful public acquittal of them in that great day wherein they shall stand to be judged before the judge of the quick and dead, that so having fully escaped from all the consequences of sin (the last enemy being then destroyed 
y 1 Cor. 15.26.54.  and death swallowed up in victory) they might obtain a perfect consummation and bliss, both in body and soul, according to the form of our Church's 
z At the burial of the dead.  Liturgy.  
In the Commemoration of the faithful departed, retained as yet in the Roman missal, there is used this Orison: 
a Requiem aeternam dona ei● Domine, & lux perpetua luceat eyes. Agenda Mortuorum, in Antiphonario Gregorij. apud Pamel. to. 2. p. 175.  O Lord grant unto them eternal rest, and let everlasting light shine unto them: and again, 
b Hanc igitur oblationem, quam tibi pro commemoratione animarum in p●ce dormientium suppliciter immolamus quaesumus Domine, benignus accip●as. Pamel. Liturg. pag. 610 tom. 2.  This oblation, which we humbly offer unto thee for the Commemoration of the souls that sleep in peace, we beseech thee O Lord, receive graciously; and it is usual in the Ambrosian, and Gregorian Office, and in the Roman missal, to put in their Memento, the names of such as sleep in the sleep of Peace, & omnium pausantium, and to entreat for the spirits of those that are at rest: 
c Memento Domine eorum qui dormiunt in somno pa●●s. A●brosiana Missa, in orat pro defunctis. Pamel. Liturg. pag. 303. to. 1 & Canon Missae, in Officio Gregor. apud. Pamel. pag. 182. to. 2.  Remember, O Lord, thy servants, and hand maids, which have gone before us with the Ensign of Faith, and sleep in the sleep of Peace; now by Pausantium, 
d Pro Spiritibus pausantium Ambrosij, Augustini, Fulgentij, Isidori. Missa Mozarabe. Muzarabes di●ebantur mixti Arabibus. In Liturg. Pamel. pag. 642 [Et Pausantium] quo nomine intelligi puto, Confessores qui in Domino, & sanct● pace quies●unt. Id. Ibid. pag 645.  Pamelius understands, such as sleep and rest in the Lord. Where we may observe, that the souls unto which Everlasting bliss was wished for, were yet acknowledged to rest in Peace, and consequently not to be disquieted with any Purgatory torment. So that the thing which the Church anciently aimed at in her supplications for the dead, was not to ease or release the souls out of Purgatory, but that the whole man (not the soul separated only) might find mercy of the Lord in that day, as sometime Saint Paul prayed for Onesiphorus, 
e 2 Tim. 1.18.  even whiles Onesiphorus was yet alive. Besides, they desired a joyful Resurrection, as appears by several passages, and Liturgies; by the Egyptian Liturgy attributed to Cyril Bishop of Alexandria, where we find this Orison: 
f Resuscita corpora eorum in die quem constituisti secundum promissiones 〈◊〉 veras et mendacij expertes. Cyr. Litur. ex Arab. in Lat. conversa. pag. 62.  Raise up their bodies in the day which thou hast appointed, according to thy promises which are true and cannot lie. And that of Saint Ambrose, for Gratian and Valentinian the Emperors: 
g Te qu●eso, sum Deus, ut charissimes ●uvenes maturà resurrectione suscipes, et resuscites; ut immaturum hu●● vitae isti●s cursum maturà resurrectione com●enses. Ambros. de obitu Valentin.  I do beseech thee most high God, that thou wouldst raise up again those dear young men with a speedy resurrection; that thou mayst recompense this untimely course of this present life with a timely resurrection.  
As also in Grimoldus his sacramentary; 
h Omnipotens s●m●iterne Deus, coll●ca●e digna●e corpus et animam & spiritum samuli tui N. in sinibus Abrahae Isaac & jacob, ut ●um dies agnitionis tue venerit inter sanct●s et electos tuos eum ie●uscita●i praecip●as. G●●moldi Sacramentor. lib. in to. 2. Liturg. Pamelij pag 456.  Almighty and everlasting God, vouchsafe to place the body and the soul, and the spirit of thy servant N. in the bosoms of Abraham, Isaac, and jacob; that when the day of thine acknowledgement shall come, thou mayst command them to be raised up among thy Saints and thine Elect. The like is found in the Agend of the dead, 
i— Vt in Resurrectionis glorià inter Sanctos tuos resus●●tari mercantur. Agenda mortuorum, in Antiphonario Gregorij in Pamelij Liturgi●. to. 2. p. 175  already mentioned.   

PA.  
Invocation of Saints was anciently used.   

PRO.  
I answer, that though in respect of later times, Prayer to Saints and some other of our adversaries Tenets may seem ancient, and gray-headed; yet in respect of the first three or four hundred years next after Christ, they are not of that ancient standing: now the true trial of antiquity is to be tak●n from the first and purest age's; for as Tertullian telleth us, 
k Id verius quod prius, id prius quod & ab initio, ab initio quod ab Apostolis. Tertul. advers. Martion. lib. 4. cap. 5. Id esse verum quodcunque primum, id esse adult●rum quodcunque posterius. Id. advers. Praxeam. cap. 2. Id Dominicum & verum quod prius traditum; extraneum & falsum quod posterius immissum. Id. de praescrip. advers. Haeret. cap. 31.  That is most true, which is most ancient, that most ancient which was from the beginning, that from the beginning which from the Apostles, so that which at fi●st was delivered to the Saints, is truest; and the good seed was first sown, and after that came the tares.  
Besides, what though some points in Popery were of a thousand yeared standing? it is not time that can make a lie to be truth; antiquity without truth is but antiquitas erroris, an ancient error; and there is no p●aescrip●ion of time can hold plea against God and his truth.  
Neither yet can you prescribe for diverse Tenet●● Scotus that was termed the Subtle Doctor, telleth us, 
l Vaun tamen addit Scotus, quod minimè proband● est, ante Lateranense Concilium non fuisse dogma fidei Transubstantiationem. Bellarm. lib. 3. de Euchar. cap. 23. § Vnum.  that before the Council of Lateran (which was not till the year 1215) Transubstantiation was not believed as a point of Faith. This did Bellarmine observe as a thing remarkable in Scotus, although he doth not approve the same.  
Cassander saith, 
m Satis compertum est universalem Christi Ecclesiam in hunc usque diem; occidentalem verò s●u Romanam mille omplius à Christo annis, in sol●mni praesertim et ordinaria hujus Sacramenti dispensatione utramque panis & vin● speciem omnibus Ecclesiae Christi membris exhibu●sse; id quod ex innumeri● veterum Scripto●um, t●m Graecorum, quam Laticerū testimonijs manifestum est. Cassand. Art. 22. Consult. de ut●âque specie.  It is sufficiently manifest, that the Universal Church of Christ until this day, and the Western or Roman Church, for more than a thousand years' aft●r Christ, did exhibit the Sacrament in both kinds to all the members of Christ's Church, at least in public, as it is most evident by innumerable testimonies, both of Greek and Latin Fathers. So that the barring of the Lay-people of the Cup, came not into the Church by any public decree, till the Council of Constance, which was held in the year 1414, some two hundred years ago.  
Fisher Bishop of Rochester saith, 
n De quo tamen [purgatorio] apud pris●os illos nulla, vel quam rarissima fiebat mentio; sed et Graecis ad hunc usque diem non est creditum. Ro●●ens. ar●. 18● contra Lutherum.  that of Purgatory there is very little or no mention amongst the ancient; and that the Grecians do not believe it to this day.  
In like sort, their Latin service, which Pope Vitalian brought in, 
o Papa Vitaltanus, omnia in Christianorun t●mpl●s per suos sacrificos in latino sermone fieri jussit. Wolf. Lection. m●mor●bil. pa 74. add an● 6●6.  is not of Primitive antiquity, for it was not generally put upon the Church until the year 666. which is the number of the name of the beast mentioned in the Apocalypse, Revel. 13.18. and found out by Irenaeus 
p Sed & Lateinos nomen sexcentorum sex●ginta sex numerum [habet] & valde verisimile est, Latinienim sunt qui nunc regnant. Iren l. 5. advers. Haer. cap. 25. edit. Gallasij cap. 30. edit Fevard.  to arise out of the numeral letters of the word Lateinos; now this name 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 well suits with the Pope whose Faith and Church is the Romish or Latin Church, and his public Service in Latin, and his translation of Scripture in Latin.  
Now touching prayer to Saints; It is true, that such as had lapsed, and fallen in time of persecution, were wont to implore the prayers of Martyr's and Confessors imprisoned for the 
q Cyprian l. 3. ●p. 15 Tertull. de pudiciti●. c. 22.  Gospel; that by their interceding for th●m, they might procure some ease or relaxation of such canonical censures as were enjoined them by the Church, & Cyprian was of opinion, that the Saints aft●r death, remembered thei● old friends here, as having tak●n fresh and particular notice of their several states, votes, and necessities; and hence grew that compact betwixt Cyprian and Cornelius, that whether of them went to heaven before the other, he should pray for his surviving 
r Si quis nostr●m prior divinae dignationis celeritate praecesserit, perseveret a●ud cum nostra dilectio pro fratribus & sororibus apud misericordiam patris non cesset oratio. Cypr. l. ●. cap 1. vel (ut in aliis edit.) ep. 57 ad Cornel. & de Discipl. & habitu virg.  friend. Now this soliciting of Martyrs before their deaths, brought in the next Age a custom to call upon them after their deaths: yet so as they did not directly invote them. For so it was; for the better preservation of the memory of Saints and Martyrs, they had their Commemoration days, and were wont to meet at the Tombs and Monuments of Martyrs, where they kept their anniversary, and yearly solemnities, and made speeches in their praise and commendations; and in these their orations they spoke to the deceased, as if they had been living, and present there, but these were only strains of rhetoric, Figures, and Apostrophees, rather Declamationes rhetorum, flowers of rhetoric, than Definitiones Theologorum, decisions of Divines. In this kind Gregory Nazianzen saith, 
s 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Greg. Nazian. orat 3. in julian.  Hear, O thou soul of great Con●●antius, (if thou hast any understanding of these things) and as many souls of the Kings before him as loved Christ. The like he hath in his funeral oration which he made upon his Sister Gorgonia, where he speaks thus unto her: 
t 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. orat. undecimâ in Gorgon.  If thou hast any care of the things done by us, and holy souls receive this honour from God, that they have any feeling of such things as these; receive this oration of ours, in stead of many, and before many funeral obsequies. He speaks doubtfully and faintly, If thou hast any sense or apprehension hereof; and, if you be affected with these things; it seemeth he thought that the defunct had not ordinarily notice of things done on earth, neither will it serve to say as Bellarmine doth, 
u Si, non est dubitantis, sed affirmantis, ut ●um dicit Apostolus ad Philemonem, Si habes me so●ium, suscipe illum. Bellarm. de Sanct. Beat. li. 1. cap. 20. § ad locum Nazianzeni dico.  that Si, is not dubitantis, but affirmantis, not a term of doubting, but of asseveration, as that of Saint Paul, If thou count me therefore a partner, receive him as myself. For there is no man, but if he read these places unpartially, Hear, if there be any sense, and, Hear, if God grant it as a privilege to souls deceased to have sense of these things, but he will conceive that Si is not put for, For; or quoniam, or as a note of affirming, but as a note of doubt, at least in the parties that spoke it.  
Hitherto the Saints were rather Vocati, called unto, as comprecants, to join their prayers with the living, than Invocati, Directly called upon, or prayed unto; yet in process of time the prayers made to God to hear the Intercessions of the Saints, were changed into prayers, to the Saints, to hear our intercessions themselves: For we deny not but that among the ancient writers, there are some places found which speak of the Intercession of the Saints; there are also wishes found that were made by living men, that the Saints would pray for them; but this is not the difference betwixt us, whether the Saints pray for us, but whether we must pray unto, and call upon them? for we grant, that the Saints in heaven do pray for Saints on earth in general, 
x Et tamen ge●●raliter orantibus pro indigenti● supplicantium. Aug. de ●urâ pro mortuis c. 16. to. 4.  according to the nature of communion of Saints; but their intercession for us in general, will not infer our invocation of them in particular.  
There are also in ancient Writers particular examples to be found of some, that ou● of their own private devotion have called upon Saints; but thi● cannot raise up a tenet in Religion to bind the Church, either for doctrine or practice; for what one or two shall do, carried away with their own devout affection, having zeal (haply) not according to knowledge, is not strait way a Ru●e of the Church, nor one of the Church's Agends. The thing we stand upon is this; that there were not any Collects, nor set forms, nor any di●ect Invocation of Saints put into the Common-service, and public Liturgy of the Western Church until the days of Gregory the Great, or there about, six hundred years after Christ; so that their Saint-invocation is not so ancient as they would bear the world in hand.  
In a word, there is much difference between the ancients, and modern Romists herein; for in the compellations which the ancients used, they pleaded only Christ's merits, making the Saints (high in God's favour) competitioners to the throne of grace with the Saints living on earth: but not content herewith, the Schools afterwards held meritorious Invocation of Saints, wherein the Saints own merits were brought in, and pleaded. We pray unto the Saints (saith the Master of the Sentences) 
y Oramus ergo ut intercedant pro nobis, id est, ut merita eorum nobis suffragentur. Petr. Lombard. l. 4. dist. 45. lit. G.  That they may intercede for us, that is to say, That their merits may help us; and Biel speaks to the same effect. 
z Sanctos invocamus, ut medi●tores, quorum meritis et intuitu nobis Deus conferat, quae ex nostris accipere minus sumus digni. Biel. in Can. Missae lect. 30.     

THE six CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 500 to 600.  

PAPIST.  
WWhat say you of this sixth age?   

PROTESTANT.  
Quod dies ●egat, dies dabit; what one age affords not, another doth: and dies dedit, I trust we have got the day in the two last, justly styled the learned Ages. The Reader is not now (in the close of the first 600 years) to expect so full and frequent Testimonies as formerly: such as we find we produce, 
* Acts 14.17.  For God hath not left himself without witness.  

Of the Scriptures Sufficiency and Canon.  
justus Orgelitanus compares the Scriptures to David's Tower wherein hang a thousand shields, and all the targets of the strong men; 
a In S. Scripturâ omnis fortium armatura reperitur, ex quâ vel contrâ Diabolum, vel ministros eju● fortitur repugnatur. Iust. Orgelit. in cap. 4. Cantic.  it being furnished with all sorts of armour, to encounter Satan, and his Instruments withal.  
Saint Bede records of the successors of Colum-kille the great Saint of Ireland, That they 
b Tantùm ea quae in Propheti●is, Evangelicis et Apostolicis literis discere poterant, observantes. Beda lib. 3. Hist. cap. 4.  observed only those works of piety and chastity, which they could learn in the prophetical, evangelical, and apostolical writings; and these they esteemed as their chief riches, according to that of 
c Columban. in Mono●lich. & in Epist. ad Hun●ld.  Columbanus: 
Sint tibi divitiae divinae dogmata legis.   
junilius an African Bishop, treating of the Canonical books, and having said that some account Toby with others Canonical, he puts the question, and then resolves it: Why are not these books inserted amongst the Canonical Scriptures, and he names amongst other Toby, Esdra, judith, and the second of the Maccabees? Because (saith he) 
d Quare hi libri inter Canonic●s S. non c●●runt? Quoniam apud Haebraeos quoque super h●c diff●renti● recipiebantur, sicut Hieron. caeterique testantur. junil. African. de part. divinae legis lib 1. c 3. to. 1. Bibl. Patr. Par. 1589.  The jews did make a difference of them, as Saint Hierome, and others witness.   

Of Communion under both kinds, and number of Sacraments.  
Hinemar in the life of Rhemigius Archbishop of Rheims (who converted King Clovis of France to the Christian faith) 
e Cassandris Liturg. ca 31. Pamelij Liturgi●. pag. 618. tom. 1.  reports that the Archbishop gave a Chalice for the people's use, with this Motto; 
Hauriat hinc populus vitam de sanguine sacro  
Injecto, aeternus quem fudit vulnere Christus.  
Rhemigius domino reddit sua vota sacerdos.  
Rhemigius Priest, that gave this cup,  
Prayeth that in it the people sup;  
And still draw life from flowing blood  
Out of Christ's side, as of a flood.  He saith not, Hauriat hinc Clerus, but populus; not, Let the Priest, but let the people drink of this ministerial Cup, as Cassander calls it.  
The Divines of this Age (as others of former times) 
f Duo tantùm Sacramenta Theologi hujus sextae aetatis agnoscunt. Illyric. Catalogue. test. verit. li. 6.  acknowledged only two Sacraments, Baptism, and the Lords Supper.   

Of the Eucharist.  
Fulgentius speaking of the Eucharist, saith; 
g In isto sacrificio gratiarum actio a●que commemoratio est carnis Christi, quam pro nobis obtulit. Augustin de fide ad Petr. Diacon. cap. 19  In this sacrifice there is a thanksgiving and remembrance of the flesh which he offered, and the blood which Christ shed for us; and 
h S●crificium panis & vini Ecclesia Catholica per universum orbem terrae offerre non cessat. Id. ibid.  this sacrifice of bread and wine was offered throughout the whole Catholic Church.  
Here Fulgentius mentions a Sacrifice not proper and propitiatory for the quick and dead, but Eucharistical, and Commemorative, of praise and thanksgiving, a lively memorial, and representation of the Sacrifice offered on the Crosse.  
The words alleged are found amongst S. Austin's works; but Bellarmine 
i Tribuitur à multis Fulgentio. Be●tramus hunc librum sub nomine Fulgentij citavit. Bell. de Scriptor. Eccles. sect. 5. in Augustino.  saith; Many father them on Fulgentius, and that Bertram citeth these words under his name, and so indeed I find it: howsoever, were it Austin, 
k Bertram de Corp. & sang● Dom. ●udiamus quid B. Fulgentius in libello de Fide dicat.  or Fulgentius, the Master, or the Scholar; so they taught, and so we learned, both from them and others, namely 
l Offerunt quidem S●●erdotes nostri, sed ad recordationem mortis ejus. Primas. in Heb. cap 10.  Primasius, 
m Offerimus quidem, sed recordationem sacientes mortis ejus. Ambros. in Hebr. 10.  Ambrose, and 
n Eandem hostiam offerimus, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, vel potius recordationem ipsius. Chrysost. in Hebr. 10. Homil. 17.  chrysostom, who by way of correction say, We offer the same sacrifice, or rather the remembrance thereof. Besides, the same Fulgentius saith, 
o Filium Dei unicum per fidem recipiunt. Fulg. de Incarn● & great. ca 26.  They receive the only Son of God.   

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
Fulgentius saith, 
p In primo Decalogi mandato, sicut unius Dei cultur● servitusque manifestissimè praecipitur; ità omni Creaturae adoratio ac servitus à fidelibus exhibenda vehementissimè prohibetur. Fulgent. ad Donatum.  That as in the first Precept, the worship of one God is manifestly commanded; so the faithful are utterly forbidden to yield the service of Adoration to any creature.  
Dracontius in his book of the Creation, saith; 
q Dracont. Poetic. Hexameron. in Bibl. Patr. to. 8. edit. 2. Par. 1589.  It is God's pleasure, Esse nihil prorsus se praeter ubiquè rogandum. That nothing beside himself should every where be prayed unto.   

Of Faith and Merit.  
Primasius saith, that 
s Non ex operibus, sed sol●●ide per gratiam, vitam habere te nosti Primas. in cap. 2. ad Galat.  We are freely justified by faith only, and not by works.  
Fulgentius saith, 
t Sola ●ides eripit jesu Christi. Fulgent. de Incar. & great. cap. 16.  From this our original corruption, not any power of nature, or letter of the Law, but faith only in jesus Christ doth free us.  
Now this saving faith, though it never go alone, yet may there be some gift of God, which it alone is able to reach unto, 
u Columban. in Monostych. pag. 62.  as Columbanus also implieth in that verse: 
Sola fides fidei don● ditabitur almo.   
Concerning Merit, Fulgentius saith; 
x Grati● autem eti●n ipsa ide● non injust dici●ur, quià con sol●m Deus 〈◊〉 suis dona sua reddit; se● quià tantùm etiam ibi 〈◊〉 d●vinae retributionis exuberat● ut incomp●rabilitè atque in●ff●bilitèt omne meritum, quamvis bonae et ex Deo d●tae, humanae vo●u●tatis atque uperationis 〈◊〉. edat. Fulg. ●d Monim. lib. 1. cap 10.  Our glorificacation is not unjustly called grace, not only because God doth bestow his own gifts upon his own gifts; but also because the grace of God's reward doth so much there abound, as that it exceedeth incomparably and unspeakably all the merit of the will, and work of man, though good, and given from God: and 
y N●ll●t●nùs 〈…〉 salubriter 〈◊〉 ●emus, tàm in no, 〈…〉 nostro ope●e tanqu●m nostrum nobis aliq●●d ve●dica●e. Id. abide.  That this is wholesome doctrine, to challenge nothing to ourselves in any good we do.  
And justus Orgelitanus saith, 
z Et ide● quicquid justi in bonis op●ribus ●●uc●●ficat, totum est referendum ad Christum. Iust. Orgelit. in cap. 2. Canti●.  We must thank the Stock Christ jesus, if any good fruit grow on our branches.  
Cassiodore saith, That 
a Qu●●i●m vocatio Domini omne meritum praecedit; nec in venit dignum sed fa●it: id●ò c●●m gratuita, alioqa●n justa diceretur. C●ssiodor. in Psal. 5.  God's vocation goes before our merit, not ●inding us worthy, but accepting us for such.  
The Council of Orange hath notably decreed against the Semi-pelagians. There are many good things (saith the Council) 
b Multa in homine bo●● sunt, que 〈◊〉 tacit 〈◊〉, nulla v●ro 〈◊〉 homo bona quae non Deus praestet ut 〈◊〉 homo. Concil. Ara●sic●●. ●. Cano. 20. C●r●nz● in summà Concil.  done in man, which man doth not; but man doth no good things, which God doth not make man to do. 
c Hoc ●ti●m salubrit●r pro●item●r & credimu●, quoth in omni opere bono, non nos in 〈◊〉 & 〈◊〉 per Dei 〈…〉; sed ip●e nobis nullis praecedentibus b●nis meritis, & ●●dem & amorem ●ui 〈◊〉 inspirat. Canon. 25. Ca●an●a ibid.  This also do we wholsomely profess and believe, that in every good work we do not begin, and are holpen afterwards by the mercy of God; but he first of all, no good merits of ours going before, inspireth into us both faith and the love of him: which place Binnius hath 
d Concil. tom. 2. pag. 392. Edit. Colon. 1606.  corrupted, reading for nullis, multis; many good works going before: surely this was none of his good works to corrupt the Council.  
Now also was held the fif●h General Council at Constantinople, Anno 553. 
e 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Evagr. Eccles. Histor. li. 4. ca 11.  Called by the Emperor justinian, and not by the Pope.  
This Council confirmed the decrees of the former; and withal (according to the former Canons) decreed, 
f Can. 35.  That the See of Constantinople should have equal dignity with the See of old Rome. Unto these foreign testimonies, we may join some of our own, namely, the Britain's about the year five hundred ninety six, what time as Gregory the Great scent Austin the Monk into England.    

PAP.  
It was our Gregory, and his Austin that first converted your Island.   

PRO.  
It was converted long before Augustine's coming, even in the first Age of the Church, as is already shown. Besides, at his coming, there were in Britain 
g Septem Britonum Episcopi, et plures viri doctis●imi. Beda hist. Angl. lib. 2. cap. 2.  seven Bishops, with other learned men, professing and teaching the Christian faith; and above two thousand Monks in the Monastery of Bangor, 
h Qui omnes [Monachi] labour maruum su● 'em vivebant. Galfrid. Monumetens. Hist. Reg. Britan. lib. 11. cap. 12.  All living with the labour of their hands. Yea, Geffrey of Monmouth speaking of Cornwall, and the Western parts, saith; 
i In parte autem Brit●num adhuc vige●at Christianitas, quae à tempore El●utherij Papae habita, numquam inter eos defecerat. Id. quò suprà. & Math. Westmon. ad anu. 596.  In a part of the Britain's, Christianity yet flourished, the which being received in the days of Eleutherius (in the year 179.) Never failed amongst them; so that Austin was not our first Converter.   

PA.  
You say the Britaines held the Christian faith; how then differed they from our Austin?   

PRO.  
They differed both in Ceremonies, and Substantial doctrine; namely, in not acknowledging the Pope's Supremacy, which is now a grand Article of the Roman Faith: for whereas Austin came with a kind of Legantine power from the Pope, and for the execution of this Commission (not unknown to the Islanders) used both prayers and 
k Fertur minita●s praedixisse. Beda hist. li. 2. c. 2. & Math. Westmonast. ad ann. 603.  threats, to move them to conformity with the Roman Church, at least for their manner of baptising, and keeping of Easter; but they told him plainly, that 
l At illi nihil horum se facturos, neque illum pro Archiep. habitu●os esse respond●●ant. Id. ibid.  They would not yield to any of his motions, nor acknowledge him for their Arch bishop: yea, 
m Dinoc ●orum Abbas, mi●o modo liberalibus artibus cr●ditus diversis argumenta●ionibus ipsos ei nullam subjectionem d●be●e respondit. Galfii. quò ●uprà.  Dinooch the Abbot of Bangor, a learned man, made it appear● by diverse arguments, when Austin required the Bishops to be subject unto him, that they ought him no subjection; yea, they farther added, 
n Cum Archi●pis●opum suum hab●rent ●ui deh●rent et v●ll●●t 〈◊〉, externo ve●ò Episcopo se mi●●mè subjectos ●ore. Antiquir. Britan. in Augustino. pag. 46.  That they had an Archbishop of their own, him they ought and would obey, but they would not be subject to any foreign Bishop. For such an one (belike) they held the Pope to be.  
Neither can it be truly alleged that they refused his jurisdiction, not his religion; for Bede saith, 
o Cu●ctis qu● di●ebant, 〈◊〉 laborabant. Beda quò supra.  That they withstood him in all that ever he said: now surely he said somewhat else besides his Archbishopricke, and his Pall; or else he had been a very ambitious man. Besides, in the days of Laurentius, Austin's successor, Bishop Daganus denied all Communion, 
p Nam Daganus Episcopus ad nos veniens, non solum ●ihum sumere nobis●um, sed nec in eodem hospitio voluit. Bed● lib. 2. Histor. cap. 4.  And refused to eat bread in the same Inn, wherein the Romish Prelates lodged; belike than they differed in matters of weight.   

PA.  
Wherein stood the difference, what do you hence infer, whether were you not beholden to our Austin?   

PRO.  
The Romans kept their Easter, in memory of Christ's Resurrection, upon the first Sunday after the full Moon of March, the Britanes kept theirs in memory of Christ's Passion, upon the fourteenth day of the Moon of March, on what day of the week soever it fell; this they did after the example of the Eastern Churches in Asia, grounded on a tradition received from Saint john; whereby it seemeth, the British Church rather followed the custom of the East Church in Asia, planted by Saint john, and his disciples, than the Roman; which yet had they been of the Romish jurisdiction, they would (in all likelihood) have followed; now since they followed the Eastern custom, it is probable, that our first conversion to Christianity, came from the Converted jews, or Grecians, and not from the Romans; and that Britain was not under their jurisdiction. But whencesoever our Conversion were, we bless God for it.  
Now concerning Austin, and the Britain's; we acknowledge to God's glory, that howsoever the superfluity of Ceremonies which Austin brought in, might well have been spared; yet Austin, and his Assistants, justus, john, and Melitus, converted many to the Faith. Neither can we excuse the Britain's, for 
q Nec suam praedicationem inimicis suis impendere [volebant.] Gal●rid. quò suprà.  refusing to join with Austin in the conversion of the Pagan Saxons; yet withal we must needs say, they had just reason to refuse to put their necks under his yoke: and surely if Austin had not had a proud spirit, he would only have requested their help for the work of the Lord, and not have sought dominion over them: which makes it very probable, that his obtruding the Pope's jurisdiction over the Britain's, occasioned that lamentable slaughter of the Britain's. For when as Austin solicited the Britain's to obey the See of Rome, 
r Antiquit. Britan. cap. 18. out of Amand. Xierxiens. a Friar Minor collecteth thus; Mo●a est discordia propter ●orum inobedientiam ad Augustinun.— saxons conversi volebant Britoneses Augustino subdere.  and they denied it; then did Ethelbert a Saxon Prince, lately converted by Austin, stir up Edelfred the Wild, (the Pagan King of Northumberland) against the Britain's; whereupon the Infidel Saxon Soldiers, made a most lamentable slaughter of the Britain's, assembled at Westchester; and that not only on the Soldiers prepared to fight, but on the Monks of Bangor assembled for prayer; of whom they slew twelve hundred, together with Dinooch their Abbot; all which (as jeffery Monmouth saith) 
s Et sic mille ducenti eorum in ipsa die, Martyri● decorati, regni caelestis adepti sunt sedem. Gal●rid. Mon. lib. 11. cap. 13.  being that day honoured with Martyrdom, obtained a seat in the Kingdom of Heaven. And this was the woeful issue of their stickling for jurisdiction over other Churches.   

PA.  
Baronius 
t Britanni schismatis rei. Baron. tom. 8. ad ann. 604. nu. 65.  calleth the Britain's Schismatics, for not yielding to the Pope.   

PRO.  
The Britain Church had anciently a 
u Cantuariens. Episcopus alterius Orbis Patriarcha dicius est. Berterius in Diatribâ. 2. cap. 4.  Patriarch or Primate of her own like other Provinces; to him the other Bishops of his Church were subject, and not to the Roman.   

PA.  
The Nic●n Council condemned the Quartadecimans (and in them your Britain's) for Heretics, 
x Three Conversions of England, p●●t. 1. ch●p. 3. nu. 13. & ●4.  saith Parsons.   

PRO.  
To his testimony, we oppose the judgement of a Friar minorite who expressly 
y Amand Xierxiens apud Antiquit. Britan. in Augustino pag. 48. Britoneses ●uerunt Catholici.  calleth them Catholics. Besides, had that famous Council of Sardice, held our British Bishops for Heretics, they had never admitted them to give sentence in that Council, as they did: 
z Britanniarum Episcopi se ad magnum Sardicum Conci●●um cōtul●●unt. Athanas. Apolog 2. to. 2.  for by name, Restitutus Bishop of London, 
a Athanas. ibid. pag. 407.  subscribed thereunto; and was likewise present at the Synod of Arles in France, as Parsons 
b Three C●ntrove●s. part. 1. chap 9 nu. 7.  reporteth out of Athanasius.  
Again, those who kept Easter on the fourteenth day precisely, were of two sorts.  
Some as Polycrates, and other Bishops in Asia, kept it so, merely in imitation of 
c Ipsum est quod B. Evangelista joannes cum omnibus quibus praerat ecclesijs, celeb●asse legitur. Beda hist. li 3. ca 25.  Saint john the Evangelist; as an ancient, but yet an indifferent, and mutable rite or tradition; and these were condemned for Heretics, and such were our Britain's.  
Others kept the fourteenth day, even eo nomine, and by virtue of the Mosaical law; holding a necessity of observing that peremptory day, as appointed by Moses● now this was the means to bring judaism, which quite abolisheth Christ, and evacuateth the whole Gospel; like those who amongst the Galathians urged Circumcision, to whom 
d Galat. 5. 2●  Saint Paul professeth, that Christ should profit them nothing. And this was it was condemned in the Quartadecimans: but of this the Britaines were clear.  
They should indeed have conformed themselves to the Counsels decree; yet because that decree was not a decree of Faith (no farther than it condemned the Necessity of observing the fourteenth day, and therein condemned the Quarta●decimans) but a decree of Order, discipline, and uniformity in the Church; when it was once known, and evident, that any particular Church condemned the necessity of that fourteenth day; the Church by a connivency permitted, and did not censure the bare observing of that day.  
The same 
e Concil. Nicen. Can. 20.  Council decreed, that on every Lord's day, from Easter to Whits●ntide, none should pray kneeling, but standing; wherein the Church (notwithstanding the decree) useth the like connivance, not strictly binding every particular Church to do so; so long as there is unity, and agreement in the doctrines of Faith; the Church useth not to be rigorous with particular Churches, which are her children, for the variety and difference in outward rites, though commanded by herself, as my learned kinsman 
f Dr. Crakanthorp of the Pope's temporal Monarchy. Chap. 12.  Doctor Crakanthorpe, hath well observed.   

PA.  
This odds about keeping Easter was but of small weight.   

PRO.  
It was so, if we consider our Christian 
g Galat. 4.9.  liberty in the observation of times; y●t was it held a matter of that consequence, that Pope Victor 
h Omnes Ecclesiae Asiae à Victore excommunicatae fuerint. Bellar. de verbo Dei. lib. 3. cap. 6.  Excommunicated all the Churches of Asia, which differed from him in the observation thereof.   

PA.  
What conclude you from your Britain's Faith?   

PRO.  
Upon the Premises, it followeth; that seeing the doctrine of the Pope's Supremacy over all Churches, was no part of the Britain's Faith when Austin came; therefore neither was it any part of their Faith in Eleutherius days, no nor in the Apostles time neither; since as Matthew of Westminster saith, 
i A ●ide Christi nunquàm recesserant Britannorum reliqu●ae Matth. Westmon. ad an. 586.  The Britain's Faith never failed.  
Again, seeing the Britain's Faith, (
k Convers. part. 1. chap. 9 nu. 3.  as Parsons truly affirmeth) was then; to wit, at Austin's coming, the same which the Romans, and all Catholic Churches embraced: it further followeth, that the Pope's Supremacy, was no material part of the Roman Faith, or of any Catholics, either in Pope Eleutherius time, or in the Apostles days; for had it been so, the Britain's (who changed not their Faith, but kept still the substantial grounds thereof) would likewise have held the Pope's Supremacy; yea, doubtless, those Catholic Bishops of Britain, had they but known and believed (as now it is given out) the Pope to be jure divin●, by divine right, and God's appointment the Monarch of the whole Church, they would have yielded obedience to Austin, and in him to the Pope; but they opposed it as being urged by those of the Romish faction; so that it was not then, (as now it is made) one of the chief heads of the Romish Faith: for now a days, men are made to believe that out of the Communion of the Roman Church, nothing but hell can be looked for: and subjection to the Bishop of Rome, as to the visible Head of the Universal Church, 
l V●i●as cum Capite R●m●no 〈◊〉 s●mper ●uit nota 〈◊〉 ●atholicae. Bell. li. 3 de 〈◊〉. milit. cap. 2. & 5.— et extravagant Commun. dema●orit. & a-bed. Cap. unam Sanct. Sub●sse R●m. Pontifici omni ●umanae creatur● desinimus omninò esse de necessitate solutis.  Is required as a matter necessary to salvation. But this was no part, nor Article of the ancient Britain's Creed, and therefore they withstood it; and if it were no Article of Faith them, surely it is none now a days.  
To close up this point: hereby is overthrown the main Article of the Roman Creed. For, if (as the Papists 
m ●ulla pij. 4. pro soim● juramenti professions fid●i. Dat. Rom. an. 1564.  say and swear) there be no salvation out of the Roman Communion, then is the case like to go hard with the one thousand two hundred British Monks of Bangor, styled Saints and Martyrs, that died out of the Roman Communion, and yet within the Communion of Saints. But this Grand Imposture of the [now] Roman Church, is notably discovered by the learned and zealous Bishop of Coventrie and Lichfield, 
n Bishop Morton, 〈◊〉 L. Bishop of Durham.  Doctor Morton, now Lord Bishop of Durham.  
My conclusion shall be this: out of the holy Catholic Church of the Creed, there is no salvation; but out of the fellowship of the Roman Church there hath been, and is salvation, as appears in the case of these our British Martyrs, therefore the present Roman Church is not (as it is pretended) the Catholic Church of the old Creed, but a particular of the new Trent Creed.    

THE SEVENTH CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 600. to 700.  

PAPIST.  
Proceed to name your men.   

PROTESTANT.  
I name Gregory the great, whom Bellarmine usually 
a Bellar. de Scriptor. eccles. sect. 7. et li. 2. de Euchar. cap. 22.  placeth in this seventh Age, for that he lived unto the year 605, what time (as Trithemius saith) 
b Trithem. de Script. Eccles.  he died: Now also lived his Scholar Isidore Bishop of Sivil in Spain, usually 
c Trithem. ibid.— et in praefat. Etymolog. edit Venet. ann. 1583.  termed Isidore the younger. Now also by Bellarmine's account (though others make him much ancienter) lived Hesychius Bishop of Jerusalem, with other Worthies, as namely the Britain's of Wales, as also Saint Aidan, and Finan, now also was held the sixth General Council.   

PA.  
I challenge Saint Gregory, he is ours.   

PRO.  
Gregory indeed lived in a troublesome time, whiles the Goths and Vandals overranne Italy, and Rome was besieged by the Lombard's. There was then also great decay in knowledge, and scarcity of able men to furnish the Church withal; and few in Italy (as Baronius saith 
d Vt ●aud in promptu esset, qui utriusque linguae peritus esset. Baron. Annal. tom. 8. ann. 593 nu. 62. ) that were skilled both in Greek and Latin. Yea Gregory himself 
e Name no● nec Gr●ecum 〈◊〉 Greg tom. 2. ●p. lib. 9 epist. 69.  pro●esseth that he was ignorant of the Greek tongue; yet was he st●led the great, and yet not so great, as godly and modest. It is commonly said of him, That he was the last of the good Bishops of Rome, and the first of the bad ones; 
f Primus Papa et Pontificij Cho●i pre●ult●r, & ultim●● Epis●opus Romanus. And R●ve●. Critic. s●cri li 4. cap. 29.  That he was the first Pope, and leader of the Pontifician companies, and the last Bishop of Rome. He was superstitious in divers things, he lived in a declining age, and as in time, so in some truths came short of his predecessors; yet, he taught not as your Trent Papists do, but joined with us in divers weighty points of Religion. 
g ●●. Panke● Collectane● out of S. Gregory.   

Of the Scriptures sufficiency, and Canon.  
Gregory held the Scriptures sufficiency, saying, 
h In ho● volumine cun●●● q●e aedis●cant s●ripta continentur. Greg. in Ezechiel. li. 1. Hom. 9 tom. 2.  Whatsoever serveth for edification, is contained in the volume of the Scriptures; 
i Flu●nta pl●nissim●, quià de quibuscunque scruple in scriptures consilium quaeritur ●ine minoratione ad plenum invenitur. Id in Cant. cap. 5.  wherein are all resolutions of doubts fully and plentifully to be found; they being like a full Spring, that cannot be drawn dry.  
He approved the vulgar use of the Scriptures, 
k Greg lib 4. Ep. 40. ad Theod. 〈◊〉 to. 2.  exhorting a Layman to study them; because (saith he) 
l Scriptura Epistola Dei ad Creaturam suam. Id. li. 4. ep. 40 Et p●r ●am Deus loquitur omne quod vult. Id. moral. lib. 16. cap 17. tom. 1.  they be as it were God's Letter or Epistle to his Creature, wherein he reveals his whole mind to him.  
And lest any complain of the difficulty of the Scriptures, he compares them to a 
m Scriptura qu●si flu●ius est planus & altus, in quo & Agnu● ambulet, & 〈…〉 epist. ad Leaned. cap. 4. Praet●●. in job to. 1.  River, wherein there are as well shallow Fords for Lambs to wade in, as depths for the Elephant to swim in. And Isidore saith, that 
n Vtrisque manet communis, et parvulis, et perfectis. Isidor. de sum. bono lib. 1. cap. 18.  the Scripture is common to petty Scholars, and to Proficients. And whereas Heretics use to allege Scripture for themselves; Gregory saith, 
o Greg. Moral. lib. 8. cap. 8.  they may be confuted by Scripture itself, even as Goliath was slain with his own sword.  
Gregory held the books of Maccabees Apocryphal; We do not amiss (saith 
p Ex libri● lic●t non C●nonic●s (Machabe●r●m testi●●nium pr●feramus Id. moral. li 19 ca 17.  he) if we produce a testimony out of the book of Maccabees, though not Canonical, yet published for the instruction of the Church. And Occam accordingly reports Gregory's judgement, saying, 
q Secundum Gregorium in moralibus liber ●udit●, T●hia, et Macabeo●ū, Ecclesiasticus, atque liber Sapientiae non sunt recipiendi ad confirmandum aliqui● in side. Occam. Dialog. part. 3. tract. 1. lib. 3 c. 16.  The book of judith, Tobias, the Maccabees, Ecclesiasticus, and Wisdom, are not to be received for the confirmation of any doctrine of Faith. Isidore saith, 
r In his Apocryphis etsi invenitur aliqua veritas, tamen propter multa fals●, rulla est in e●s canonica authoritas. Isidor. Etymolog. lib 6. cap. 2.  In these Apocryphal although there be some truth to be found, yet by reason of the many errors therein, they are not of Canonical authority.   

Of Communion under both kinds; and number of Sacraments.  
Saint Gregory in his Dialogues (if they be his) 
s In nav● corpus et s●nguinem Redemptoris acceperunt. Greg. Dialog lib. 3. cap. 36 tom. 2.  tells us of some that were going to Sea (some whereof happily were Laymen) carried with them the consecrated body and blood of the Lord in the Ship, and there received it.  
And again, 
t Ejus ibi corpus sumitur, cujus caro in po●uii salutem parti●ur; ejus sangu● non ●am in manus infidelium, sed ad fidelium ora perfunditur. Id. Dial. li. 1.4. ca 58.  His body is there received, his flesh is there divided for the people's salvation; his blood is not now poured out upon the hands of Infidels, but into the mouth of the Faithful. He speaks expressly of the Faithful, and of the people.  
And in his Homily touching the Passeover he saith, 
u Quid sit sa●gu● Agni, non jam audiendo, sed bi●endo didicistis; qui sanguis super utrumque pos●em poni●ur, quando non solum Ore Corporis, sedetiam o'er Cordis ha●●itur. Id. in Sab. Paschae Homil. 22. tom. 2.  What is meant by the blood of Christ, you have now learned, not by hearing of it, but by drinking of it; which blood is then put on both posts, when it is drawn in both by the mouth of the body, and of the heart. Herein Gregory resembles the partaking of Christ's blood in the Eucharist, to the blood of the Paschall Lamb in the twelfth of Exodus, stricken upon both po●ts of the door: thereby noting the mouth and the heart, each whereof after their manner receive Christ: for with the mouth and corporally we receive the wine, which is the Sacrament of his blood; and with our heart, and by faith we receive the thing Sacramental, the blood itself.  
Besides, he speaks expressly of drinking, and the terms he useth, hauritur and perfunditur, That Christ's blood is shed, and taken as a draught, demonstrate, that he speaks not of partaking Christ's blood, as it is joined to his body, and enclosed in his veins, but as severed from it; as my worthy and learned friend Doctor Featly hath 
x The Grand Sacrilege, sect. 7.  observed.  
Isidore saith, 
y Vt charita●e omnes reconcil●at● inv●cem dignè sacramento corpori● et sanguinus Christi consocientur. Isidor. de Divin. Offi●. lib. 1. cap. 15.  The fourth prayer is brought in for the kiss of Peace, that all b●ing reconciled by charity, may join in the worthy participation of Christ's body and blood. Omnes, all; the people as well as the Priests.  
Isidore saith, 
z Sunt autem Sacramenta ●aptismus et chrisma, corpus & sang●is Ch●ist●. Isid. Origin sive Etymolog. lib 6. cap. 19  These be th● Sacraments, to wit, Baptism and Chrism, and the body and blood of Christ. Now with Baptism he joins Chrism, because their manner was to anoint those who were baptised.   

Of the Eucharist.  
Isidore saith, 
a Sed panis, quià confirmat corpus, ideò corpus Christi nun ●upatur; utaum autem quià sanguinem operatur in c●rne, ideò ad sanguinem Christi re●ertur— haec autem duo sunt visibilia sanctificata tamen per S S. in Sacramentum divini corporis transeunt. Isidor. de Offic. Ecclesiast. lib. 1. cap. 18.  Bread because it strengtheneth the body, is therefore called Christ's body; and wine, because it worketh blood in the flesh, it hath therefore relation to the blood of Christ: but these two being sanctified by the Holy Ghost, are changed into a Sacrament of the body and blood of Christ. He saith, Christ called bread his body, to wit, Sacramentally, a sign, a Sacrament of his body, and not Substantially: he saith, Bread is changed into a Sacrament of Christ's body, which notes a Sacramental Conversion, and not Substantial: he saith, Bread strengthens man's body, bread Substantially, and not Accidentally, so that it is not the roundness, or figure of bread that strengthens man's body, nor the colour of wine that is turned into blood.  
Hesychius saith, 
b Comedimus a●●em nunc cibum, sumentes ●jus memoriam pass●onis. Helych. in Levit. lib. 1. c. 2.  We eat this food by receiving the memory of his Passion: not of his Glory, but of his Passion: the same Author saith, 
c Mysterium di●itur, quod simul panis & 〈◊〉 est. Id. Ibid. lib. 2. cap. 8.  Our mystery is both bread and fl●sh, to wit, bread in substance, and indeed; and Christ's body, not in substance, but in a mystery.   

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
Gregory allowed only an 
d Greg. Epist. 109. ad Se●en. ep lib. 7 tom 2.  Historical use of Images; otherwise he speaks positively, that 
e Adorare ve●ò Imagines, omnibus modis d●vita. Id. l. 9 ep. 9  The worshipping of Images, is by all means to be avoided: and though he misliked the breaking of them, yet he commended those that forbade the adoration of them: yea he commands the people to 
f In ad●ratione solius T●initat● humiliter prost●●nantur. Id. ibid.  Kneel and bow down to the omnipotent Trinity only: and therefore not too, or before an Image. And Cassander saith, 
g Non ut adore●tur, sed ut imperiti picturis i●spiciendis, ●aud alitèr ac literis legendis, rerum gestarum admoncre●tur, et ad pietatem incitarentur. Cassand. Consult. 21.  that Gregory therein declared the judgement of the Roman Church, to wit, that Images are kept not to be adored, and worshipped; but that the ignorant by beholding those Pictures, might as by written records, be put in mind of what hath been formerly done, and be thereupon stirred up to Piety.  
Concerning Prayer, as we find in Gregory very rarely any prayer to Saints; so unto the Virgin Mary not any one. Which we may conceive he would not have omitted, if he had believed, as diverse Papists maintain: That she is a Savioresse, a Mediatresse: 
h An non apertè s●ribit Gabr. Riel [in Can. li. ●.] patrem caelestem dimidium Regni sui dedisse B. Virgini Caelorum Reginae, idque in Esther significatum ●uisse. Cassand. de Offic. boni vi●i & Consult. Art. 21.  That as Assuerus offered half of his kingdom to Queen Esther; so Christ reserving the kingdom of justice to himself, hath granted the other moiety, the kingdom of mercy to his mother.    

PA.  
Was not Invocation of Saints used in the Church-service in Saint Gregory's days.   

PRO.  
Be it so, that some such devotions were used in his time, yet in the ancient Missals, there is no such form to be found. In them indeed the Saints names in their anniversary solemnities, and Holidays, were remembered, and put into their Memento, but they were not prayed unto, men prayed only to God, that he would give them grace to follow their examples, and make them partakers of that happiness which those blessed ones already enjoyed; and at that time, when this alteration began, and that the Gregorian form took place, the Invocation was not brought into the Liturgy, and public prayers of the Church in Direct form, but men prayed still unto God only, though desiring him the rather to respect them, for that not only their brethren on earth, but they also that are in heaven, cease not to pray for them: neither is there any other form of prayer found in the missal, but in the Sequences and Litanies only, 
i Doctor Field, of the Church, lib. 3. cap. 20.  saith Learned Doctor Field. Gregory indeed 
k O●d navi● Missale & Graduate, & Antiphonarium. 〈◊〉 de Vorag● serm. ●1 de Greg. 1. Gregor. subjunxit postulationes, di●sque nostros in tu● pace disponas. Cassand. Liturg. c. 21. Pamel. Liturg pag. 656. tom. 1.  added some things to the Canon; the Alle-lujah, the Kyrie Ele●son, Lord have mercy upon us: the Orison, Di●sque nostros in pace disponas, Give peace in our times O Lord, together with other Collects. But I do not find either in Cassander or Pamelius their Liturgies, that Gregory brought in any direct form of Prayer to Saints. Afterwards, 
l Trith●m● de script. Eccles.  Nocherus the Abbot, who lived about the yea●e eight hundred and fifty, 
m Abbas Nocherus de S. Gallo Sequentias' pro●neumis composuit. Cassand. Liturg cap 21.  composed the Sequences, and so when the ancient missals were abandoned, it is no marvel if Invocation of Saints stepped up in their place.  
Lastly, the form and manner of Saintly Invocation used about the year 600, in Saint Gregory's days, differeth extremely from that which was used by Papals in later times, as may appear by these instances following. The Hymn of Thomas Becket runs thus in the 
n H●r●e B. Mariae ad usum Sarum.  Salisbury Primer: 

Tu per Thomae sanguinem,  
Quem pro te impendit;  
Fac nos Christe scandere,  
Quò Thomas ascendit.   

By the blood of Thomas,  
Which for thee he did spend;  
Make us thither O Christ to climb,  
Whither Thomas did ascend.    
To the blessed Virgin they 
o office B. Mariae pi● v. ●ussu edit And the Office of the B. Virgin, according to the reformed Latin at Saint Omers. 1621.  pray: 

Maria matter gratiae,  
Mater misericordiae;  
Tu nos ab host besiege,  
Et horâ mortis suscipe.   

Marry, mother of heaven's grace,  
Mother, where mercy hath chief place.  
From cruel Foe, our souls defend,  
And them receive, when life shall end.    
The Cross is likewise devoutly saluted in this 
q Breviar. Rom. Sabbat. infra. Hebd●m. 4. Quadrages.  manner. 

O Crux ave spes unica,  
Hoc passionis tempore;  
Auge pijs justitiam,  
Reisque dona veniam.   

All Hail O Cross, our only hope,  
In this time of the passion:  
Increase thou justice to the godly,  
And give to sinners pardon.    

Of Faith and Merits.  
Hesychius saith, 
r Gratia verò ex misericordià, atque compassione praebetur, & fide comprehenditur sol●, non ex operibus. Hesych. in Levit. li. 4 cap. 14.  The grace of God is given only of mercy and favour, and is embraced and received by only Faith.  
Gregory held not justification by inherent righteousness; for speaking even of the second justification, he teacheth, that we are justified before God, freely by grace: 
s justus igitur Advocatus nos●er, justos nos de●endet in 〈◊〉; qui● nosm●tipsos ●ognos●●mus & ac●●samus in justos. Greg. tom. 2 in Ezech ad finem.  Our just advocate (saith he) will in judgement defend us for just, if so be we know and accuse ourselves to be unrighteous and unjust.  
He confesseth, 
t Omnis humana justitia injustitia esse convincitur, si districte judi●etur. Id. lib. 9 Mor. cap. 14.  That all our righteousness is manifestly proved to be unrighteousness, if once it be strictly examined according to justice. He accounts a man's best actions imperfect, 
u Ipsa nostra per●ectio culp● non ●a●et, nisi han● severus Iud●ae in subtili lan●e examinis misericordit●r ponsite●. Id. Moral. lib. 5. c. 8● & l. 29 c● 9  and unable to abide the judge's trial, unless he weigh them by the scale of his mercy.  
Isidore saith, 
x Cathari propter munditiam it● se nominarunt; gloriantes enim de suis meritis negant p●eniton●ibus veniam peccatorum Isidor. li. 8. orig. five E●●molog. cap. 5.  it was noted a property in the Catherists, or ancient Puritans, to glory of their merits.  
Gregory held not Merit of Condignity, but appealed to the court of M●cie, saying, 
y Ad vitam non ex meriti●, sed ex veni● convales●o. Gregor Mor. lib. 9 cap. 14. Et de solà misericordiâ tua praesumens impetrare quod non de meritis meis spero. Id. in Psal. 1. Poenitent● tom. 2.  I grow on to eternal life, not by the merit of my works, but by the pardon of my sins, presuming to obtain that by the only mercy of God, which I dare not hope for by my own deserts; and hereof, as also of the imperfection of our works, he gives a good reason, saying, 
z Mala nostra pu●a mala 〈◊〉, ●●na verò quae nos habere credimus pura bona esse nequaquàm possunt. Id. Mor. lib. 35. cap. ult.  that the evil that is in us is simply evil; but the good that we think we have, it is not absolutely pure, and simply good: 
a Quamlibe● rectis operibus insud●mus, veram munditiam nequaquam apprehendimus, sed imitamur. Id. Mor. lib. 9 c. 28.  So that how much soever we travail in good works, we never attain to true purity, but only imitate it.  
And this may suffice to show what religion Saint Gregory professed; other testimonies may be seen in Master Panks Collectanea out of Saint Gregory, and Saint Bernard, showing that in most fundamental points they are ours.    

PA.  
Gregory 
b De quibusdam levibus culpis esse ante judicium purgatorius ignis, credendus est. Greg. tom 2. Dial. lib. 4 cap. 39  held a Purgatory for some smaller faults.   

PRO.  
He held not your Purgatory; his was only for venial and light faults; yours is for such as have not 
c Propter satisfactionem pro Mortalibus remissis non plen●egrave; expletam. Bellar. de purg●t. l. 1. c. 3. § Hinc.  fully satisfied for the temporal punishment due to their mortal sins. Again, his differeth from yours in situation, for you place yours in some quarter bordering on hell: but Gregory 
d Id. ibid. lib 4 cap. 40. & 55.  tells us of certain souls that for their punishment, were confined to Baths, and such other places here on earth.  
Besides, Gregory in his Dialogues, whence you would prove your Purgatory, tells many strange tales; as, of one Stephen a Priest, 
e Dial. l. 3. c. 20.  who had the Devil so serviceable to him, as to draw off his hose: of 
f Dial. l. 1. c. 8.  Boniface that wanting money, procured diverse crowns of our Lady, and such like stuff: insomuch that your Canus saith, 
g Gregorius in Dialogis quaedam miracula scribit vulgò ●ac●ata & credita, quae hujus presertim saeculi Aristarchi esse censebunt. Can. loc. Theol. lib. 11. cap. 6.  Gregory in his Dialogues hath published such miracles, commonly received and believed, which the censurers of this Age will think to be doubtful and uncertain.  
Besides, Gregory had his Purgatory, and Soul masses from visions, 
h Dial. l 4. c. 55.  and feigned apparitions of Ghosts, 
i Deut. 18. v. 11, 12.  which the Scripture holds unwarrantable.  
And yet Gregory upon occasion of that place of Ecclesiastes, 
k Eccles. 11.3.  If the tree fall towards the South, or the North, where it falls there it shall be, makes another inference; namely this: 
l In die mortis suae justus ad Austrum cadit peccator ad Aq●●lonem; qui● et justus per ●ervorem spiritu● ad gaudi● ducit●●; & peccator cum Apostata Angelo in frigido suo corde reprobatur. Greg. Mor. lib. 12. cap. 3.  The just one in the day of his death falleth southward, and the sinner Northward; for the just by the warmth of the spirit, is carried into bliss, but the sinner with the revolting Angel, in his benumbed heart, is reprobated and cast away. And 
m Olympiodor. in ca 11 Ecclesiast.  Olympiodore who lived about the year 500, makes the very same inference; and Gregory elsewhere to the same purpose saith, 
n cum humani casus tempore, ●ive sanslus, ●ive malignus spiritus egredientem animam claus●ra carnis, acceperit, in aeternùm secum sine ullà permutatione retinebit, ut nec ●xaltat● ad supplicium pr●rua●, nec mersa aeternis supplicijs, ultra ad remedium ereptionis ascendat. Greg. moral. lib. 8. cap. 13.  that at the time of a man's dissolution, either the good or evil spirit receives the soul as it comes out of the cloister of the body; and there without any change at all, for ever retains it: that being on●e exalted, it can never come to be punished: and being plunged into eternal pain, can never thence be delivered.  
Now if (according to these testimonies) after death there be no deliverance; but that the soul for ever remains in that degree and order wherein death takes it: if there be no change after this life (such as the Papists imagine theirs to be from the pains of Purgatory, to the joys of heaven) surely then there can be no Purgatory, nothing but heaven or hell, whither they that come abide for ever. Now let us see what Gregory held touching the Supremacy.   

PA.  
Gregory maintained his Supremacy, did he not?   

PRO.  
Whatsoever he did, Stapleton strives to uphold it, by corrupting a place in Gregory, who speaking of Saint Peter and other Apostles, saith, 
o Q●id aliud quam s●●gularium sunt plebium c●pita? & tame● sub uno capite omnes membra sunt Ecclesiae. Greg. lib. 4. Epist. 38.  that they were all members of the Church, under one Head, meaning Christ; as his own words make it clear. Now Stapleton, to make the Pope Head of the Church, citeth the words thus: 
p Singularium plebium capita, sub uno Capite Petro. Stapleton. princip. Doctrinal. lib. 6. cap. 7.  They are all members of the Church, under one head Peter, shuffling in the name Peter: but for Saint Gregory, he knew not your modern papal Supremacy, and when the See of Constantinople challenged the style of Universal Bishop, he opposed it.   

PA.  
He might dislike it in another, and yet claim it himself.   

PRO.  
He disclaimed it in any whosoever. Now so it was, john Bishop of Constantinople, seeing the Emperor's seat, translated thither, and other Provinces governed by Lieutenants, as also Rome besieged by the Lumbards', thought this a fit season for the advancement of his chair, that the Imperial City should also have the high●st chair in the Church; as the Emperor counted himself Lord of the World, so he would be styled 
q 〈…〉 Greg●. lib 4. ●p. 3●.  Ecumenical, or Universal Patriarch in the Church.  
Now when john affected this Title, Gregory complained not, that he wronged his See, by usurping that style, as if it had belonged to the Pope; but he mislikes the transcendent power claimed by that style, and he calls it 
r 〈…〉 Id. lib 4 ep. 32. 〈…〉 Id. lib. 4. ep. 36.  A style of novelty, and profaneness, such as never any godly man, nor any of his predecessors ever used: 
s Absit● 〈◊〉 Christianorun nomen 〈◊〉 Blasphemiae. Id. li 4 ep. 32.  A name of Blasphemy, 
t Contrà E●●ngelicam sent●a●am B. petrum Ca●●numque statuta. Id. lib. 4. ep 34.  A thing contrary to the Church's Canons, to Saint Peter, and to the holy Gospels.  
Yea, he pronounceth any one that should presume to challenge the foresaid title, To be the 
u Ego si●entur di●●, quisqu●●e u●●versa, 'em Sacerdot●m 〈◊〉, vel vo●ari des●●e●at in ●latione su● 〈…〉 quia 〈…〉 praepacit. I●. lib 6. epist. 30.  very forerunner of Antichrist, because herein he lifts himself above his brethren.   

PA.  
Gregory forbore this Title in humility, 
x Ill●d recusavit, ad ●acili●s com●rimend●m super●ia● Episcopi Constantin●p. B●ll de ●ont. lib. 2 c. ult. § Re●pondeo.  thereby to repress john's insolency.   

PRO.  
This is, as if a King should renounce his Royal Title, to the end that a Rebel challenging it, might disclaim it.  
Gregory indeed was an humble man, and (as one saith of him) 
Mi●●s capi●b●t sola●●ax m●ibus divitijs, & 〈…〉 quam ●remita quid●● ex Feel 〈◊〉. joan. 〈◊〉 ule●us in Festo omn●um S. Ser. 2.  When he was in his jollity, and Pontificalibus, he was not so much delighted therewith, as an Hermit was with his Cat, that he used to play withal in his Cell.  
Gregory indeed 
z Vt ●t ●umilitatem 〈…〉 in ment, et tamen 〈…〉 d●gnitatem 〈◊〉 i●●ono●e. Greg. l●b. 4. e●ist. 36.  professeth to be humble in mind, but still so, as to preserve the honour of his place. Gregory would lose nothing of his freehold I warrant you.   

PA.  
Gregory found fault with this Title, in the sense that john desired so to be universal and sole Bishop: and the rest to be his 
a Vt alij non sint Episcopi, sed Vicarij. Bell. de Pont. li. 2. cap. ult.  Vicars or Deputies.   

PRO.  
It is not likely the Bishop of Constantinople (though he were a proud man) would keep all others from being bishops; that is, that they should neither ordain Priests, nor excommunicate, nor absolve, nor sit in Counsel, but himself alone do all. Besides if john had sought this, surely the Greek Bishops who consented to john's title of being their universal patriarch (in respect of Order, though not of jurisdiction;) would never have yielded to have made themselves only Vicars to that one bishop, and so deprive themselves of all Episcopal jurisdiction. Yea the same bishops, though they submitted themselves to the bishop of Constantinople, and approved his Title, yet notwithstanding they exercised their ancient jurisdiction over their several Sees; they were not degraded by john, or his Successor Cyriacus, both which affected that Title.  
The true and undoubted meaning then of Gregory, (as his words 
b Vt et nulli subesse, ●t solus omnibus praeesse videretur. Gregor. lib. 4. epist. 38.  import) was this; namely, that Gregory (by impugning the Title of Universal bishop) would have no Bishop so principal, as to make all others, as members subject to his Head-ship: and is not the charge of bishops at this day under the Papacy, for the most part Titular, they being wholly at the Pope's beck.   

PA.  
Was the Title of Universal Bishop so odious.   

PRO.  
It was, in that sense which Gregory taxed in the bishop: otherwise, neither he, nor we mislike such Universal bishops, as with Saint Paul, 
c 2. Corinth. 11.28.  Have the care of all Churches, and in this respect godly bishops when they meet in Counsels, and in their own Dioceses; whiles by their wholesome advice, admonition, or reproof; by their writing, or teaching; they instruct others in the truth, prevent Schism, and stop the mouth of Heresy; may be called Bishops of the Universal Church. Thus was 
d 〈…〉 2 p●g. 419.  Athanasius called a Bishop of the Catholic Church, not as it precisely signifieth Universal, but rightly believing, or holding the Catholic Faith.   

PA.  
What conclude you out of all this?   

PRO.  
That which maketh strongly against the Papacy. For now a dai●s, this Style of Universal Bishop (which Gregory held to b●e the Harbinger of Antichrist) is brought in as a main proof of the Pope's Supremacy. 
e 〈…〉 2 de 〈…〉 31.   
Neither could Gregory restrain his Successors from bearing this Title: for Boniface the third, who next save one succeeded Gregory 
f 〈…〉 Plat. in Boni●●●. 3.  Obtained of Phocas the Emperor, not without great contention, that the See of Rome should be call●d the head of all Churches, being the same place of pre-eminence in ●ffect which john in Gregory's time so much affected.  
Now by this the Reader may perceive, and that from the tongue and pen of one of their best Popes, that were since his time; that in Gregory's judgement, his successors that enjoy this swelling Title, and transcendent power are proved to be Antichristian Bishops.  
Lastly, the Reader may observe, who it was that gave the Pope this jurisdiction; it was even that usurper Phocas, 
g 〈…〉 W●●●monast. ad An. SIXPENCES.  who murdered his master Maurice the Emperor, and then conferred this profane Title on Pope Boniface; a fit Chaplain for such a Pa●ron.  
Hitherto we have treated of Saint Gregory's Faith, and visited the College of Bangor, the Foundation whereof is ascribed to King Lucius, from whose time unto the entrance of Austin the Monk 438. years were expired; In all which space the Christian Faith was both taught, and embraced in this Island, notwithstanding the continual persecutions of the Romans, Huns, Picts, and S●xons; which last made such desolation in th● outward face of the Church, that they drove the Chri●●●●n bishops into the Deserts of Cornwall, and 
h Tu●● Archipraesu●e● Theonus Lond●niens. & Th●●ioc●●● E●●racens. c●m omnes 〈◊〉 sibi subd●●●● solo t●nus. 〈◊〉 vi●isse●t in Cam 〈…〉 ●iffugeruat. M●th. Westm●● ad An. 586. M. Speeds Hist. lib. 6. ch. 9 sect. 20.  Wa●es; in which number were the bishops of London and York. Now by their labours the Gospel was replanted amongst the Inhabitants of those vast Moun●taines; and farther spread itself into these Northern parts, what time as Edwin and Oswald Kings of Northumbe●land sent for Saint Aidan and Finan into Scotland to convert their Subjects to the 
i Bed● Hist. lib. 3. ca 3.  Faith.   

PA.  
What were this Aidan and Finan?   

PRO.  
They were the worthy instruments which the Lord raised up for the good of our country, for by the ministry of 
k Beda lib. 3. Hist. cap. 3. & 6.  Aidan was the kingdom of Northumberland recovered from Paganism: (whereunto belonged then, beside the shire of Northumberland, and the lands beyond it unto Edenborrough, Frith, Cumberland also and Westmoreland, Lancashire, Yorkshire, and the Bishopric of Durham:) And by the means of 
l Id. ibises. cap. 21● 22, 24  Finan, not only the kingdom of the East-Saxons (which contained Essex, Middlesex, and half of Hertfordshire) regained, but also the large kingdom of Mercia, with the shires comprehended under it, was first converted unto Christianity; so that these two for their extraordinary holiness, 
m Id. ibid. cap. 3, 4, 5● 17, 26.  and painfulness in preaching the Gospel were exceedingly reverenced by all that knew them; Aidan especially, 
n Vade ab omnibus eti●am his qui de Pascha alitèr sentiebant, meritò diligebatur Aidanus; nec solùm ● medio●ribus, v●rùm ab ipsis qu●que Episcopis, Honorio Cantu●rioru●●, et Felice O●iental●um Angl●rum venerationi habitu● est. Id. ibid. cap. ●5.  Who although he could not keep Easter (saith Bede) contrary to the manner of them which sent him, yet he was careful diligently to perform the works of Faith, Godliness and Love, after the manner used by all holy men; whereupon he was worthily beloved of all, even of them also who thought otherwise of Easter than he did, and was reverenced not only of the meaner rank, but of the Bishops themselves, Honorius of Canterbury, and Felix of the East-Angles.  
In this Age also was held the sixth general Council at Constantinople, summoned by the Emperor's 
o Secundùm Imperial●● 〈◊〉 congr●●●ta est. C●●anza in Sum. Concil.  commandment: it was called against the heresy of the Monothelites, and therein Honorius the Pope was 
p Honorio 〈◊〉 A●athem● Act. 13. & 16.  accursed for a Monothelite.  
It was the●e also 
q 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Co●cil. 6 in 〈◊〉 habit. 〈◊〉 36● p. 401. ex edit. Io. 〈◊〉.  decreed that the See of Constantinople should enjoy equal privileges with the See of Rome.  
And whereas some Canons were alleged for restraint of Priest's marriage, they were opposed by this Council; and the Church of Rome is in express terms 
r 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Ibid. c●● 13 p. 374  taxed for urging them. And upon pain of deposition to the gainsayers, it was decreed; 
s 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Ibid. p. 374.  That the marriage of Ecclesiastical persons was a thing lawful: and that their conjugal cohabitation stood with the Apostolic Canons, was an ancient tradition, and orderly constitution. And in case continency were enjoined, it was not perpetual, but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, in the proper turns, or courses of their ministry: so that the restraint of Priests from marrying, neither is, nor ever was conceived to be (
t Bishop Andrews Answer to Cardin. Per●on●s Reply. pag. 10.  saith learned bishop Andrews) but Positivi juris, which being restrained upon good reason, it might upon as good reason be released; and Pope Pius the second, was of opinion, 
u Sace●d●tibus magnà r●ti●ne 〈◊〉 nupt●●s, 〈…〉 vider●. 〈…〉 2 vit●.  That there was better reason to release them, then to restrain them; and so were diverse other at the Council of Trent, if there had been fair play; and yet jesuit 
x 〈…〉 Coster 〈◊〉 de C●lib. Sacerd. pr●p. 9  Coster holds, that a Priest offends greatly if he commit fornication: Gravius tamen peccat, but he offends more grievously if he marry.   

PA.  
This Council was neither the sixth, nor general.   

PRO.  
Caranza, and Balsamon call it both sixth and general. 
〈…〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. R●●s. Com. 〈…〉 O●h●rs call it, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Quini-sextum.  We grant indeed (that to speak precisely) the sixth Synod under Constantine the fourth published no Canons; but afterwards diverse of the same Fathers, which had formerly met in the sixth Synod, they and others, to the number of 227, being called together by the then penitent and restored Emperor Ius●inian, gathered up, and set for●h the Canons formerly made, and by them reinforced: and Balsamon 
z 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Balsam●n Photij Nomocan. ex edit. Tilij pag. 359.  
— totius Synodi Rom. Ecclesiae vicem gerentes. Bals. in Phot. Nomoc. lat. edit. Par. 1561.   saith, that Basilius Bishop of Gortyna, the Metropolis of Crete, (which was then under the Archbishop of Rome and the Bishop of Ravenna, were there to represent the Roma●e Church.  
The truth is, your Romanists cannot endure t●is G●eeke Council, because it sets the Patriarch of Constantinople, cheek by jowl with the Roman Bishop.  
In a word, if some Canons of this Council be justly excepted against, this mak●s not against us; for we warrant not all that goes u●d●r tha● Counsels name; nor them that once spoke truth from ever erring.  
And it seems Gratian he Monk hath been a tampering with the Canon alleged; for in one of Gratian'ss Editions, we read thus: 
a Non tamen in ecclesiasticis rebus magni●icetu● ut illa. Decret. p●rt. 1. Dist. 23. Renov. Edit. Par. 1507.  Let not Constantinople be magnified as much as Rome in matters Ecclesiastical: and in another, 
b Nec non in Eccles. magnificetur ut illa. Edit. ●aris. 1585. [Nec non] sic emendatum est ex aliquot MSS. & Graeco; anteà enim legebatur; non tamen. Glossa ibid.  Let Constantinople be advanced as well as Rome.  
And now have we surveyed the first six general Counsels, and found them to have been 
c Licet universalia Concilia saepe legam●● convocata per Imperatores, im● omnia octo u● ex gestis haberi poorest. Cusan● de concord. Cathol. li. 2. ca 2.  called by the Emperor, and not by the Pope; and yet 
d Pontificis est, non Imperatoris congregare ●yn●dum generalem. Bellar. de Concil. li. 1. ca 12.  Bellarmine now a days denies this power to godly Princes, and would confer it on the Pope.    

THE EIGHTH CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 700. to 800.  

PAPIST.  
WHat say you to this eighth Age?   

PROTESTANT.  
This Age was beholden to our nation which 
a Venerabili● Beda Presbyter Anglus, floruit anno 720. Bellar. de script. eccles.  afforded such worthies, as venerable Bede, the honour of England, and mirror of his time for learning; as also his 
b Al●ninus sive Albinus natione Anglus● S Bed● quondam auditor, cujus Alcuini minis●erio ipse Imperator omnibus libe●alium artiam disciplinis initiar● satagebat●●la●uit an. 770. Trithem. de script. eccles.  Scholar Alcuinus, counted one of the Founders of the University of Paris, and Schoolmaster to Charles the Great; by whom, or his procurement were written tho●e Libri Carolini, King Charles his books, opposing the second Nicen Synod which stood for Image worship. Now also lived Antony the Monk, and Damascen, one that laid the foundation of school-divinity among the greeks, as Peter Lombard afterward did among the Latins: he was indeed a Patron of Image-worship, yet in some other things he was Orthodox, and in those we comply with him. Now also was held a famous Council at Constantinople in the East, and another at Frankford in the West, both of them opposing the second Nicen Synod.  
Now also lived Adelbert of France, Samson of Scotland, and Claudius Clemens of the same nation, Bishop of Auxer●e in France: 
c Adelb●r●●s, & Clemen●, & Sampson●●t complures alij ● B●ni●ac●o dissenserunt, quod re●iqut●rum venerationem, sta●aarum a lorationem, purgator●um praelica●et, & Sacerdotum conjugium ab●●garet. ●ist. M●gdeb●rg. Centur. 8. c. 8. p. 534. & Cent. 8. c. 10. p. 776. Catalogue. Test ver. lib. 8. & ve●er. Epist. Hibernicorum Sylloge Epist. 15. & ep. 17.  Th●se with others opposed Boniface the Pope's factor, whiles he sought to establish Papal Supremacy, adoration of Relics and Images, Pargatorie, prayer for ●he dead; and to impose single life on the Clergy; and for ●his they were persecuted under Pope Zacharie with bonds and imprisonment.  
Aventin● saith, 
d Alber●us Gallus, & eju●dem sectae Sacerdotes atque Episcopi— D● B●nifacio adversari vehementissimè c●●perunt. Aventin. Annal. Boior. lib. 3. pag. 218.  ●ha● Albertus Gallus, and other Bishops and Priest's of his sect (so calls he the way after which they worship●●od) did mightily withstand this Boniface, or Winifrid an Eng●i●●●an bishop of Me●tz.  
Toward the la●er end of this Age there lived, though they flourished in the ninth Age, 
jacob. Frisius in Biblioth. Philosophic ad ann. 790. & B●laeus centu●. 14 cap. 32 33.  Claudius Clemens Scotus, as also joannes Mailrosius Scotus, called Madrosius, haply for that he lived in the Monastery of Mailros, planted by bishop Aidan, and his followers in Northumberland, where also Saint Cuthbert had his education.   

PA.  
I claim Saint Bede for one of ours.   

PRO.  
You will lose your claim, for though he were tainted with superstition, and slipped into the corruptions of the Times wherein he lived, Believing and reporting diverse Fabulous Miracles, and incredible Stories, as some of your own men have 
f Beda vulgò ●acta●a miracula scribit. Canus Loc. Theolog. li. 11. c. 6.  censured him; neither do we defend all he wrote; yet in diverse main grounds of Religion, he was an Adversary to your Trent Faith.  
Bede was a Priest, he lived in the Monastery of Saint Peter and Saint Paul at Weere-mouth near Durham: A great Clerk, and writer of the English Story.  
Alcwin, or Alwin, was a Yorkshire man, as appears by his name Alwin which in these parts continues to this day; He was 
i Godwins Catalogue of the Bishops of England  Keeper of the Library at York, erected by Archbishop Egber●: He was also Schoolmaster to Rabanus, and in great 
k In tanta ●amiliar●tate apud eum habitus, & Imp●ratoris Magister deliciosus ●aerit appellatu●, Trith●m. Ibid.  favour with his Pupil Carolus Magnus, whom he persuaded to found the University of Paris. He wrote three books of the Trinity, and Dedicated them to Charles. The Papists charge 
l Rursusque aliud Calvini opus ●miserunt sub nomini Alcuini; Sixt. Senens. in Praefat. suae Biblioth. nu 3.  Calvin to have made these books, and to have set them forth in Alcuinus name, (Alcuin and Calvin being all one name by changing the Letters) but this is untrue, 
m D. james of the Father's Corruption. part. 4. pag. 50.  since both the note of the beginning and ending of this book is to be seen in an ancient Manuscript in Lincoln College; and the very Copy itself written (as it may be conjectured) above five hundred years ago, is to be seen in the Prince's Library at Saint james.  
Besides that, myself have seen 
n Homiliae Doctor jussu Caroli M. & Alcuin de Trinitate. Lugd. 1525.  Alcwin's book of the Trinity, Printed in the year 1525. whereas Calvin (by 
o Bellar. de script. eccles. in Chronolog.  Bellarmine's account) showed not himself until the year 1538.  

Of the Scriptures Sufficiency and Canon.  
Damascen saith; 
p 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Damascen. de Orthodox. fide. lib 1 cap. 1.  Whatsoever is delivered unto us in the Law, and the Prophets, by the Apostles and Evangelists; that we receive, acknowledge and reverence: and besides these we require nothing else. The same Damascen numbers all those books, and those only as Canonical, that we do; and addeth, That 
q 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. ibid. lib. 4. cap. 18.  the Books of Wisdom and jesus the Son of Syrach are good Books, and contain good Lessons; but that they are not numbered in this account, neither were laid up in the Ark.  
And our Alcuinus, Abbot of Saint martin's at Tours in France, writing against Elipantus bishop of Toledo, tells him that he urged authorities out of the book of jesus the son of Syrach: but (saith he 
r Quem librum ●. Hi●ron● atque Isidorus inter Apocryphas, id est dubias Scripturas deputatum esse absque dubitatione testantur. Alcuin. advers. Elipant. lib. 1. pa. 941. Edit. Paris. 1617. ) Saint Hierome and Isidore do testify, that without question it was to be reputed amongst the Apocryphal and doubtful Books.   

Of Communion under both kinds, and the number of Sacraments.  
Charles the Great saith, 
s Corpori● & sanguinis Dominici myst●rium quod quotidiè in Sa●ramen●o à fidelibus sumitur. Lib●i Carolini de Imaginib. li. 4. cap. 14.  The mystery of the body and blood of Christ is daily received by the faithful in the Sacrament. of his ●lesh and blood in ●anis ac vini figurâ, in the figure o● bread and wine. And that ●he Sacrament is in it own nature br●ad and wine, but the body and blood of Christ by Mystical and Sacramental relation he shows in the same terms as Isidore did before him, and Rabanus after him. Because bread (saith 
c Qu●●●rgò ●ani● carn●m con●i●mat, vi●um 〈◊〉 sangu●●●m operatur in ca●ne, hi● ad ●orpas Chris●i 〈◊〉, il●ud re●ertur ad ●a●guin●m Id. Ibid.  Bede) confirms the b●dy, and wine doth work blood in the flesh; therefore the one is mystically referred to the body of Christ, the other to his blood.  
But to leave particular men, we have the suffrage of a whole Council held at Constantinople in the year 754, wherein it was maintained, that 
d 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  Christ chose no other shape or type under heaven to represent his Incarnation by, but the Sacrament 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉  which he delivered to his Ministers for a type and a most effectual commemoration thereof; 
f 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  Commanding the substance of bread to be offered; and this bread they affirm to be, 
g 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  a true Image of his natural flesh. And these assertions of theirs they are to be 
h Concil. gener. tom. 3. pag. 599. edit. R●mae. ann. 1012.  found in the third tome of the sixth Action of the second Council of Nice.   

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
Concerning Images, venerable Bede (as we find him cited by Gerson 
i Vndè Bed●, 〈◊〉 omnino prohibentur s●eri ad ●un● v●●elicet sin●m, ut a●orentur, & colantur. Beda, tes●e Ioan●e Ge●s●● p●r●. 2. compen. Theolog. de primo praecepto  the Chancellor of Paris) saith, That Images are not simply forbidden to be made, but they are utterly forbidden to be made to this end, to be worshipped and adored.  
Charles the Great (
k Nil si non ●abentur d●●ogant●●i●, si h●bentur, pr●erogant: ●ùm tamen a●dicat●e quandam in●auta● levitat● afferant, a legatee verò ●ulpa● inurant 〈◊〉. M. lib. ●. advers. S●nod. 〈…〉 C●ssand●om Cons●l●●ar●●● 2●. de cultu Sanct.  as Cassander saith) hath pithily and wittily stated this question of Images; that it is no prejudice to want t●em, nor privilege to have them; that such as utterly reject them, may be taxed with fickleness, and they that worship them, branded with folly.  
In this Age there arose great contention in the Church, touching the matter of Images; the Greek Emperors, Leo Isaurus, Constantine, Nic●phorus, Stauratius, Leo Armenus, Michael Balbus, Theophilus, and others their successors, opposing them in the East; and on the other side, Gregory the second, and third, Paul the first, Stephen the fourth, Adrian the first, and other Popes of Rome as stiffly upholding them in the West.  
In a Council of 338 Bishops 
l Concil. Constant 〈…〉 mag habitum est. 〈◊〉 754. Bin. Conc. to. 3. pag. 2●●.  held at Constantinople Anno 754, they were solemnly condemned; for they banished all other Images, and determined, That there was one only Image appointed by Christ, to wit, the blessed bread and wine in the Eucharist, which represent to us the body and blood of Christ: there was decreed under Constantine, nicknamed C●pronymus; 
m Qui imagin●m ●●●u●●uerit parare aut adhere, aut in Eccl●si●, aut in private domo con●i●●uere, si Episcopus fuerit depen●t●r decretum extat in 〈◊〉. Conc. 2. ●pud Bin. Act 6. p●g. 377.  That none should privately in houses, or publicly in Churches, procure, keep, or worship any Image, u●on pain of deposition. Zonara's saith, 
n 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Zonar. h●st. to. 3 p. 88 Basil. 155●.  That in the hearing of all the people, they openly forbade the worship of Images, calling all such as adored th●m, Idolaters: and speaking of the Emperor Leo Armenus, he saith, 
o 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id. Ibid. p 105.  He was mightily bend against them, insomuch as he decreed utterly to abandon them. Thus did those Ezekiahs of Greece, being strongly opposed by the Papal fo●ces.  
Now so it was, afterwards in another Co●n●el of 350 bishop 
p 〈◊〉. Ni●●n. 2. h●bit. est an. 787. B●n. in not. in i●. Condil.  held at Nice in the year 787. Images were set on foot again, and this Council was called and swayed under that Doctress Irene the Empress, 
q 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Annal. cap 188. pag 389.  
C●udeli●er & Insanabilitèr oculos ej●s ev●llunt, ita ut hunc mor● subsequens con●istim ext●●gueret, consi●io 〈…〉 Paul. D●acon. hist. lib. 23. pag. 747.   By whose Council and procurement, the Peers whom she had corrupted, shut up her son Constantine the Emperor in the palace where he was borne, and there they put out his eyes so that he died of heart's grief. Thus they put out the eyes of him that saw, and set up Images that have Eyes and see not: and all this was done (saith the story) that her son being deposed, she might 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Rule alone.  
But this decree of the Nicen Synod, repealed by that at Frankford, was not half so bad as that which followed, when Aquinas set up School, and taught, 
r C●ux Christi lat●i● adoranda est. Aquin Sum. Theolog. pa●t. 3 quest. 25. a●● 4.  That the Crucifix, an● Image of Christ must be adored with the same honour that himself is; to wit, with Latria, or divine Honour: whereas those Nice Fathers haply stood but for veneration, 
s Bishop Bilson of Subjection 4 p●rt. pag. 387.  or outward reverence of Images, in passing by them, or standing before them, as friends use to salute or embrace one another. Howsoever, the Nicen d●●r●e was rejected as repugnant to the doctrine of G●ds Church, by the Prince's and bishops of England fi●●, about the year 792. And by Charles th● Great afte●w●rd; a●d by the bishops of Italy, France, and Germany, which by his appointment were gathered together in the Frankford Council in the year 794.  
Rog●r Hovede● saith, 
t  ●harl●s the French King sent a Synodal into Britain, directed unto him from Constantinople, in the which book many things (out alas) inconvenient, an●●epugnant to right faith, were found, especially it was con●●●med a most by the unanimous consent of all the Eastern Doctors, ●o l●sse than three hundred or more, that Images ought to ●e worshipped, which thing the Church of God doth altogether d●test: against which Synodall b●oke, Albinus wrote an Epistle m●rveilouslie confirmed by authority of divine Scripture, and carried the same to the French King, together with the fore. s●●d book, in the name of our Bishops and Princes.  
H●n●marus Bishop of Rheims living at the same time, s●ith, 
u 〈…〉 Syno●us in Francia convoc●nte 〈…〉 traditionemque ma●o●um ip●● Grae●o 〈…〉 non in dicum voli●●●●, quo● 〈…〉 Missum. Hinc 〈…〉.  In the time of the Emperor Charles, by the command of the See Apostolic, there was a general Council, called by the Emperor; wherein according to the pathway of Scripture, and tradition of ancestors, the greeks false Synod was destroyed● and wholly abrogated, touching the repealing whereof, the●e was a just Volume sent from the Emperor to Rome, which myself have read in the Palace, when I was a young man, saith Hin●marus.  
●he same also i● testified by 
x 〈…〉 quam septi●am Graec● 〈…〉. Ado V●en. in Ch●on ae●●t. 6. pag. 181.—. Regi 〈…〉 21. de Cul●●. Sanct.  others, namely, Ado, Rh●g●o, and Cassander, a moderate Pontifician: and King Charles speaking of this Synod, saith; that 
y Ad Apocryphas quasdam, & 〈…〉. 〈◊〉. M. lib. 3. cap. 30.  be●●g destitute of Scripture proole, they betook themselves to Apocryphal and ridiculous toys.    

PA.  
This Book is 
z Prot. Apol. tr. 2. sect. 7. pag. 364.  forged, under the name of Carolus Magnus.   

PRO.  
Indeed, we were not at the making thereof, yet thus much we can witness; that your Champion Eckius saith, 
a Carolus M●quatuor libros scripsit contrà v●lentes to●lere imagines. Eckij Enchi●●d. cap 16.  Charles' wrote four books touching Images; and Austin Steuchus, the Pope's Library-keeper, 
b Aug. Steuch●s de donat. Constantin●. pag 226.  presseth some things out of those Caroline books, making (as he thinks) for his master's advantage. Cassander saith, 
c Ca●oli ips●s titulo quatuor l●b●i cons●ripti su●re, quorum Hincmarus Episcopus meminit, et ●o u● ex●mplum hodi●que in ●ibliethe●●● Vaticine, et nonnullis G●llic loci● extat. C●ss●nd. Consult. A●t. 21. de cultu Sanctor.  That in his time there was a copy of those Caroline books in the Vatican Library, and in diverse places of France; and that Hincmarus Bishop of Rheims, mentions those four Caroline books.  
Besides, they were lately to be seen in the Palatines Library at Heidelberg, but are now conveyed to Rome: where, yet for all charlemagne greatness, th●y h●●e sued out a Prohibition against him, 
d Index liber prohib auth●ritate Pij 4. primùm ●ditus, post●a ve●o a Sixto quinto auc●●s; 〈…〉 H●n 〈◊〉 1611. p. 83 lit. ●. In●ertorum 〈…〉  And his book● are forbidden in the Roman Index, first published by Pius the fourth's command, enlarged by Sixtus Quintus, and reviewed, and published by Clement the eight. Howsoever, you see, and Baronius confesses, that the most learned an●●amous of these times speak against this Nicen decree.   

PAP.  
The Council of Frankford and Paris, 
e  under Lewis the first, and other learned men mistook the definition of th● Nicen Council, and therein erred● yet no● i● a m●tter of doctrine, but a matter of fact, say Geneb●ard, and Bellarmine.   

PRO.  
There be of their own side as learned as they whi●h mislike this excuse, to wit, 
f 〈…〉 sit ergò tertia responsio, Concil. Fra●cos. de●inivisse potius verit 〈…〉 Synodo con●en●isse. Suarez. tom. 1. disp 54. sect. 3. pag. ●01, 802. M●●unt. 1604. 〈…〉 Tho disp. 107. quaest. 25. Art. 3. Ingolstad● 1610.  Suarez, and Vasques; so tha● it seems, they are not agreed of their verdict, nor who shall speak for them.   

PA.  
Bellarmine saith, That 
Ab eodem Ad●iano 〈◊〉 qu●ntum a● alte 〈…〉 Be●l. de Concil. lib. 1 ca 7. § Qua●tum.— ●on 〈◊〉 Leg●ti R●ma●● Id. de Im●g. ●●p. 1●. § Si.  the Pope confirmed the Frankford Council in one part, and canceled it in another; to wit, in that point, touching adoration of Images, whereunto the Pope's Legates never consented.   

PRO.  
This betrays the Pope's partial d●aling, to make the Councils only to serve his own turn. But what if it wa●ted ●is approbation? the thi●d Canon of the Chalced●n Councils, that gave the See of Constantinople the precedence b●f●re other patriarchs, as the n●xt after the Bishop of Rome, was opposed by Pope Leo's Legates; and yet the Canon was decreed and passed, and the Council is held for General, howsoever the Pipes Legates 
h Co●tradictio nostra his gestic inhaereat. Concil. Chalced. tom. 2. Concil. general. per Bin. actione 16 p 137.  contradicted it. For they were to be ruled by the mayor part of the Counsels votes; neither do we find that anciently the Pope had a negative or casting voice in Counsels. And therefore the Chalcedon Council, notwithstanding the Pope's opposition professeth; 
i 〈◊〉 ●mnes dicimus, 〈◊〉 om●ib●s placent. Ibid. p●g. 137.  Haec omnes dicimus, This is all our vote, 
k 〈◊〉 tota Synodus app●obavit. Ibid.  and tota Synodus, the whole Council hath confirmed this Canon, for the honour of the See of Constantinople: 
l 〈◊〉 Synodi ad ●eonem post 〈◊〉 Chalked. a●t. 16. pa. 1●●●.  and accordingly the whole Council wrote to Pope Leo.   

PA.  
Could the later Council at Frankford, repeal the former at Nice?   

PRO.  
Very well, for as Saint Austin saith, 
m 〈…〉 August. de 〈…〉 Donatist. l 2 c p 3. to 7.  Even full and plenary Counsels themselves, may be amended by the later. Neither doth he mean it in matter of fact, but in point of doctrine; for Austin there speaks of Rebaptisation; and ●m●ndari, is as much as è mendis purgari, to be rectified, wherein it erred; and not only to be Explained.   

PA.  
Would Charles who loved Pope Adrian so dear, 
n Num credibile est Carolum in ipsum Adrianum tam acritèr scrip●isse● cum ●um tantoperè coluerit? Bel. de Imag. c. 14. §. num.  write against him so sharply? or the See of Rome (which by the hands of Leo the third crowned Charles Emperor of the West) endure that Charles should condemn Images?   

PRO.  
Charles might love the See of Rome, and yet express his judgement in the point of Images; neither do we doubt, but that Charles and Pipin would have condemned the Pope's proceedings therein more expressly, but they could not meddle with the point of state, without quarrelling the Pope in a matter of the Church: so that as Saint Austin saith of the old Romans, 
o C●eteras cupiditates hujus unius ingenti ●upiditate presserunt. August. de Civit. Dei. lib. 5. c●p. 1●.  That they bore down many desires, for the excessive desire they had of one thing, to wit, Sovereignty and Dominion; so the bishops of Rome, desirous to keep their new purchases of Lombardy, and Ravenna, which Charles and Pipin had procured them, thought it not fit to contend with their new and potent favourites. For so it was, when the Emperor Leo the third, desirous to abolish Image worship, (which then was creeping in) had caused them to be defaced, and thereupon did punish some who withstood it; 
p Leonem 3. Imperat. Constantinopolit. imperio simul & communione sidelium pr●v●t. Platina in Greg. 3.  Gregory the second excommwicated him, 
q Ne ●i aut tributum d●rent, aut ali●●atione obedi●ent. Sigon. de regno Italiae. lib. 3.  Forbidding the Italians to pay him tribute, or to obey him; upon this sentence and exhibition of the Pope, a great part of Italy 
r G●egorius● Romam cum tot● Italià ab illius Leonis imperie recedere faciens. Paul. D●acon. hist. lib. 21. p. 665.  rebelled against their Emperor resiant at Constantinople, and part of the country that rebelled was Conquered by the King of Lombardy; and Rome, and the Roman Dukedom fell unto the Pope; now was the Emperor driven out of Italy, and every one caught what he could; the Lumbards' were the strongest party, and with them the Pope falls at odds about the dividing of the spoil; and finding them too hard for him; as before he had used the strength of the Lumbards', to suppress the Emperor; so now he calls in Pippin, Martial of the Palace, or Constable of France, and ●●a●les his son surnamed the Great, and by their power he suppressed the Lumbards': this service did Pipin and his son to the See of Rome; in requital whereof Chilp●ricke being a weak Prince was deposed; Pipin, and the Barons and the people of France, are absolved from their Oath of Allegiance, and by Pope Zacharies favour, Pipin, son to Carolus Martellus, is crowned King of the F●a●ks, and Charles the Great, son to Pipin, is crowned Emperor of the West, by Pope Leo the third, who succeeded Adrian. Then came the Pope, and Charlemaigne to the partage of the Empire, leaving a poor pittance for the Emperor of Greece. And this was the issue of the fierce contentions about Images, The Pope's pulling down Emperors, and setting up Images: and indeed these babies and puppets served the Popes to stalk withal, but other fowl was shot at, to wit, jurisdiction, and a temporal Monarchy: and indeed about this time the Pope grew great, so that it was Gods gracious dealing with his Church, that he found such opposition as he did; the Eastern Emperor not daring, and the Western in regard of late courtesies received from the Pope, being (haply) not willing openly to affront him. And thus much of Images, come we now to speak a word or two of Prayer to Saints.  
Concerning Prayer, Bede in his Commentary on the Proverbes (rightly 
s 〈◊〉 ●ucque Commen●●●i ● in pro●●b t●buuntur Bede, ●o● Hiero●●●●.. Bell. de scrip. ecles. sect. 4.  ascribed to Bede, and not to Saint Hierome) saith; 
t Nullu● invocare, ●d est, in ● 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Beda in cap. ● Proverb to 4.  We ought to invocate, that is, by prayer to call into us, none but God.  
Antonius in his Melissa, or mellifluous Sermon, saith, that, 
u  We are taught to worship and adore that nature only which is uncreated: but the Spanish Inquisitors have clipped off a piece of his tongue, 
x Index. Expa●g 〈◊〉 Q●●●g. M●d 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 1584.  Commanding the word, Only, to be blotted out of his writings; now the word, Only, is the only principal word that shows us the Author's drift, and the word which Gregory Nyssen (from whom he borrwed this speech) 
y 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 N●s●●● cont. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 4 tom. ● edit. 〈…〉  used in the Original.  

Of Faith and Merits.  
Bede held that we are justified by the merits of Christ imputed to us: 
z Eju●mors, nostra vita; ejus damnatio, nostra justificatio. Beda in Psal. 87. tom. 8.  Christ's condemnation is our justification, his death is our life. He disclaimed justification by inherent Righteousness; for speaking of a regenerate man, he saith, 
a Per justitiam factorum nullus salvabitur, sed per solam justitiam fidei. Id. in Psal. 77.  That no man shall be saved by the righteousness of works, but only by the righteousness of Faith: and therefore 
b justruit videlicet ut nemo vel libertatem arbitrij, vel merita sua sufficere sibi ad beatitudinem credat; sed solâ gratià De● se salvari posse intelligat. Id in Psal. 31.  No man should believe, that either his freedom of will, or his merits are sufficient to bring him unto bliss; but understand that he can be saved by the grace of God only. And elsewhere he saith, 
c In suturo benè remuneretur, & hoc non ex merito, sed ex grati● solâ. Id. in Psal. 23.  That in the life to come we shall be well rewarded, and that not by merits, but by grace only; and he hath a sweet prayer, that 
d Vt miserearis secund●m mesericordi●m ●uam, id est, te condignam, non secundùm iro●●, me condignam. Id. in Psal. 24.  the Lord would take compassion of him, and that after the worth and condignity of his mercies, and not after the condignity of wrath which himself had deserved.  
His Scholar Alcuinus maintained the same truth, as appears by these passages following.  
I could (saith 
e Sordidare me potui, sed emundare nequeo, ●isi tu Domine jesu sancti sanguinis tui aspersione mundum me facias. Alcuin. in Psal. 50.  Alcuinus) defile myself with sin, but I cannot cleanse myself; it is my Saviour's blood that must purge me: and again, 
f Add me unum cum respicio, nihil aloud in me nisi peccatum invenio; tota liberatio mea, tua est justitia. Dei miseratione in nomine salvatoris, non nostris meritis vivisicati sum●●. Id. Ibid.  Whiles I look on myself, I find nothing in me but sin; thy righteousness must deliver me; it is thy mercy, not my merits that saves me. And elsewhere, he saith very sweetly, 
g Ille solus liberare potest de peccato, qui venit sine peccato, & factus est sacrificium pro peccato. Id. lib. 4 in joan. cap. 8.  He only can free me from sin, who came without sin, and was made a sacrifice for sin. And thus by God's providence, was the weighty point of justification preserved found in these latter and declining times.     

THE NINTH CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 800. to 900.  

PAPIST.  
WHat say you of this ninth Age?   

PROTESTANT.  
The seeds of Knowledge which our worthy Countrymen Bede and Al●win planted in God's Field, showed themselves in their Scholars, such as were 
a Claudius, discipulus quondam (ut serunt) Bedae in Angl●●, et Collega Alcuini, natione Scotus, claruit an. 800. T●ithem de Script. eccles.  Claudius Scotus, Scholar to Saint Bede: Rabbanus Maurus Abbot of Fulden, one who (as 
b Cui Rabano, nec Italia similem, nec Germania peperit. Trith. verbo Raban.  Trithemius saith, for his learning had not his match in Italy, or Germany. Haymo bishop of Halberstat, and our Countryman, joannes Scotus Erigena, all three Scholars to 
c Albini Anglici quondam Auditor R●●anus, claruit an. 855 Trit●em. H●ymo Episc. Halbe●stat. Alcuini Auditor, claruit ann. 850. Bell. de Scrip. eccles. joan. Scotus discipulus olim Bedae. Possevin. in Apparat. Sacro. to. 1. p. 868.  Alcuinus.  
Now also lived Christianus Druthmarus the Monk, and the Abbot Walafridus Strabo, who collected the ordinary Gloss on the Bible; Agobardus bishop of Lion's, Claudius bishop of Thurin in Piedmont; Bertram a P●iest and Monk of Corbey Abbey, whereof Pascha●ius was sometimes Abbot, and about the year Eight hundred and ●inetie according to Bellarmine lived the Monk Ambrose Ausbertus.  
About the year 880● lived 
d Remigius Antisiodorensis claruit ann. 880. Trith●m.  Remigius borne at Aux●rre in Fra●ce, and sometimes called Rhemensis (haply) because he taught at Rheims: there was another Remigius Archbishop of Rheims, who lived in the sixth Age, and converted King Clovis of France to the Christian Faith; but this Saint Remigius (for aught we know) wrote nothing.  
Claudius' Scotus already mentioned, was one of the Irish Nation by birth, a famous Divine, and accounted one of the 
c C●audius Cl●mens ●ce●us, 〈◊〉 Abbatis in fundable Academià Parisiensi C●ll●ga Possevir. in Appara● 〈…〉.  Founders of the University of Paris: this Claudius Clemens Presbyter, 
f jac Vsserius Armach. Archi●p. vete●. Epist. Hibernicorum ●●ll●g in praefat. & epist. 19  was of latter standing, and inferior in place to that other Claudius Scotus bishop of Auxer●e, a great opposite to Boniface Archbishop of Me●ts. This latter Claudius wrote on the Gospels and Epistles, and is often alleged by the Reverend, and learned Lord Primate, Doctor Vsher.  

Of the Scriptures sufficiency, and Canon.  
Claudius' Scotus saith, 
g Proptertà errant quià s●ripturas nesciunt, et quià scriptural ignorant, consequenter nesciunt virtutem De●, hoc est, Christum. Claud. in Math. li. 3. cited by D. Usher, of the ancient Irish Relig. pag. 2.  That men therefore err, because they know not the Scriptures; and because they are ignorant thereof, they consequently know not Christ, who is the power and wisdom of God. He also bringeth in that known Canon of Saint Herome, 
h Hoc quia de Scripturis non habet auctoritatem, ●á●em facilitate contemni●u●, qu● probatur. Id. ibid.  This, because it hath not authority from the Scriptures, is with the same facility contemned, wherewith it is avowed.  
Nicephorus Patriarch of Constantinople, gives us to understand, 
i 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Nic●ph. Patr. C. P. Cannon. Script. in operibus 〈◊〉 cited by S●● Humf. 〈◊〉. Via devia sect. 5.  That the Books of the old Testament were twenty and two. And treating of the Apocryphal Books, he mentioneth in particular, the Books of Maccabees, Wisdom, Ester, judith, Susanna, Toby.   

Of Communion under both kinds; and number of Sacraments.  
Paschasius upon our Saviour's words, Drink ye all of this, saith, 
k Bibite ex hoc omnes tàm minist●i qu●m reliqu● cred●ntes Pasch. de Corp. & Sang. Dom. cap. 1●. pag. 18●. tom 4. Bibl. Patr. Par. 1575.  Drink ye all of this, as well Ministers, as the rest of the Faithful. Rabanus saith, 
l M●luit D●m●nus Co●poris & Sanguinis sui Sacramenta fideiium ore percipi. Raban. lib. 1. de Insti●ut. Cleric. cap. 31. pag. 49. ●d●t. Colon. 1532.  That the Lord would have the Sacrament of his Body and blo●d to be received by the mouth of the Faithful.  
Haymo saith, 
m Calix appellatur commu●i●atio, quasi par●●●ipatio quia omnes commu●icant ex illo, partemque sumunt ●x sanguine D●mini, quem contin●t in se. H●mo in 1 Cor. cap. 10 pag. 124. Edit. 1534.  The Cup is called the Communion, because all communicate of it, and do take part of the blood of the Lord which it containeth in it. He saith, all did communicate; so that the People as well as the Priests were admitted to the Cup. And 
n Rhemig in 1. cor. ●ap. 10. v. 16. in part 3. to. 5●1● pag●8● ●8●  Rhemigius hath the very same words with Haymo; as indeed his Commentaries on Saint Paul's Epistles are in a manner all taken out of Haymo, as Doctor Rivet hath 
o Andr. Rivet. 〈◊〉. sacri lib 4. cap. 27.  observed. It is the report of our Ancestors (saith 
p Relatio majorum est● ità primi● temporibus missus ●ier● solitas, si●ut ipse Dominus noste● praecepit, commemoratione passion●● ejus ad●ibità, ●os corp●●● D●mini●o communicasse 〈◊〉 sanguini quos ratio permitt●bat. Valafrid. Strabo de reb. ●c●les. c. 22. in Bibl. petr. Par. 158●  Walafridus Strabo) that in the Primitive times, they were wont according to Christ's Institution, to Communicate and partake of the Body and Blood of our Lord, even as many as were prepared and thought fit. 
q Regino in Chron. ad an. 8●9. Communionem co●poris ●t sanguinis Domin● de manu Pontif●●●● sumpsit. Lib. 2. pag. ●0. Fr. 1583.  Regino describeth the manner of Pope Adrian's delivering the Communion to King Lotharius and his followers in both kinds; The King (saith he) takes the Body and Blood of our Lord at the hands of the Pope, and so did the King's Fallowers.  
Paschasius saith, 
r Sunt aut●m Sacramenta Christi in Ecclesi●, Baptismus & Chrisma. ●orpus quoque Domini et sangu●● Pas●h●l. de Corp. & sang. Dom. cap. 3. in to. 4. col. 162. Bib. Pat. Par. 1●75.  These be the Sacrament● of Christ in the Church, Baptism and Chrism, and the Body and Blood of Christ: and 
s Rab. de sacr. Euch. Col. 1551. ex Bib● Cuthb. Tunstalli Ep Dunelm.  Rabanus hath the self same words: Now with Baptism they join Chrism, because they used to anoint such as were baptised; for otherwise 
t Ecce duo ista sacramenta quid efficiunt. Id. ibid. cap. 23.  Rabanus speaks precisely of two, saying; What do these two Sacraments effect? and than he answers; That by the one we are borne anew in Christ, and by the other Christ abides in us.   

Of the Eucharist.  
Rabanus saith, 
u Quià panis corporis ●or confirmat, ideò ille congru●nter co●pus Christi nun●upatur; et quia vi●um sanguinem operatur in carne, ideò refertur ad sanguinem Raban. de Instit. Cleric. li. 1. ca 31.  Bread because it strengtheneth the body, is therefore called the Body: and Wine because it maketh blood, is therefore referred to Christ's blood.  
Haymo 
x Haimo in pass. secund. Marc. Fer. 3 palm.  saith the same with Rabanus; Rabanus farther saith, 
y Aliud est Sa●ramentum, aliud vi● sacramenti; sacramentum in alimentum 〈◊〉 gitur, virtute socr●menti aeternae vitae dignitas adipiscitur. Raban. de Instit. Cleric. lib. 1. ca 3.  That the Sacrament in one thing, and the power thereof another; the Sacrament is turned into the nourishment of the body; by the virtue of the Sacrament we attain eternal life: He saith, the Sacrament (which is the Bread) is turned into our bodily nourishment; n●w species, shows, and accidents can not nourish: but these latter words of Rabanus 
Rabani libro, hanc 〈◊〉 quasi spuriam 〈◊〉. P●aetat. ad Ma●h. Westmon.  are razed ●ut; whereas the Monk of Malmesbury witnesses that Rabanus wrote accordingly as is alleged, and this razure is observed by the publisher of Matthew of Westminster's History. Haymo calls the Eucharist, A 
a Sa●ramentum muner●s aet●rai quod n●bis Domi●●● nass●rus i● mem●riam su● d●misit tenendum. Haimo in 1 Cor. cap. 1.  Memorial of that Gift or Legacy, which Christ dimised unto us at his Death.  
Rabanus saith, 
b Quoth ●●inde Ap●sto●i imitati 〈◊〉, & 〈…〉 & nunc per totum terrarum ●●bem generali●●● tota cus●odit ecclesia. R●b●n de Inst●t. Cl●●●●. lib. 1. c●p. 32.  that Christ at first instituted the Sacrament of his Body and Blood, with blessing and thanksgiving; and delivered it to his Apostles, and they to their Successors, to do accordingly; and that now the whole Church throughout the world observes this manner.  
Christianus Druthmarus reporting our Saviour's Act at his last Supper, saith, 
c  Christ changed the bread into his body, and the wine into his blood Spiritually: he speaks not of any change of substances. Walafridus Strabo saith, 
d  That Ch●ist delivered to his Disciples the Sacraments of his body and blood, in panis & vini substantiâ, in the substance ●f bread and Wine.  
When Carolus Calvus the Emperor, desired to compose some differences about the Sacrament then on ●oot; he required Bertram, a learned man of that Age, t● deliver h●s judgement in that point, 
〈…〉 Colon. Ann● 1551 p●g 18●.  Whether the body and blood of Christ which in the Church is received by the mouth o● t●● faithful, be celebrated in a mystery, or in the truth; an● whether it be the same body which was borne of Mary? Whereunto h● returns this answer; 
f Panis ille 〈◊〉 figu●atè Christi corpus & sang●●● 〈◊〉. Ibid. p●g. 183.  That the bread and the wine, a●e t●● body and blood of Christ figuratively; that 
g Et h●c ●orpus pign●s est & species, illud verò ipsa veritas. Ibid. 〈…〉.  This body is t●e pledge, and the ●igure, the other the very natural body; 
h Nam secund●m ●●●turarum substantiam quod ●uerunt ante conse●ra●ionem, ho● & postea ●ensis●unt. lb. pag 205  That for the substance of the Creatures, that which they were before consecration, the same are they also afterward. 
i ●omini●um corpus 〈◊〉 sanguis domini●us app●ll●●●tur qu●niā●jus sum●●t ●●pellationem ●uj●s 〈◊〉 sa●ramentum. Ibid. p. ●●●  That they are called the Lords body and blood, because they take the name of that thing of which th●y are, a Sacrament; 
k Vid●mus ●●aque 〈◊〉 diff●renti●●epara●t in 〈◊〉 sanguini● & 〈◊〉 Christi, quod ru●c a 〈◊〉 ●●mitur in 〈…〉 illud quod natū●st ●e Ma●●a V●●gin●. Ibid p. 222.  That there is a great difference betwixt the mystery of the blood and body of Christ, which is taken now by the faithful in the Church, and that which was borne of the Virgin Mary. All which he proves at large by Scriptures and Fathers.  
Your wisdom most excellent Prince, may perceive (saith he 
l A●imad● ertat (●●●●●sime princeps) sapi●ntia vestra, quòd positis S. Scripturarum tell●morijs, et. S. Patrūd●c●is evident●ssim● mo●s●ratum est quò● 〈◊〉 qui co●pus Christi, ●t 〈◊〉 q●i sarguis Ch●ist● appellitur, ●igura sit 〈…〉 Ibid p●g 228. ) that I have proved by the testimonies of holy Scriptures and Fathers, that the bread which is called Christ's body, and the Cup that is called his blood, is a figure, because it is a mystery.    

PA.  
I except against Bertram, his book is forbid to be read, but by such as are 
m  licenced, or purpose to con●ute him.   

PRO.  
Bertram 
n  wrote of the body and blood of Chr●st, as Trithemius saith; and by your Belgic or L●w Country Index, Bertram is styled 
o  Catholic. Now this Index was published by the King of Spain's commandment, & the Duke of Alva, and first printed at Antwerp, in the year 1571, and often since reprinted. Now so it is, howsoever he be accounted a Catholic Priest, and much commended by Trithemius, yet are this Catholics writings forbid to be read, as appears by several Indices; the one set forth by the 
p  Deputies of the Trent Council; and another printed at Parts, 
q  under Clement the eight.  
Now these Inquisitors dealt too roughly, and therefore the divines of Douai, perceiving that the forbidding of the book, kept not men from reading it, but rather occasioned them to seek after it; thought i● better policy, that Bertram should be suffered to go abroad, but with his keeper, to wit, some popish gloss to wait on him.  
Seeing therefore (
r Quum igitur in Catholic●● veteribus al●ot plu●rimo●●●●amus error●s & ex●enuemus, ex●u●●mu● excog●tato commento pers●●● n●g●●●● 〈◊〉 com●●d●● iis 〈…〉 cum oppo●untu● 〈◊〉 disp●●ationibus ●ut in ●onflictionibus cum ●●versarijs; 〈◊〉 videmus cur non ea●dem equitatem & diligentem recognitionem me●●atur B●rtramus, ne ●●ret●ci ●gganniant●●os an●iquitatem pro ipsis ●acientem ●xurere 〈◊〉 prohibe●e. Index expurgator. Belgie. pa. 12. lit. B. ut liber ●ertrami tolera●i emendatus queat. & ●udicium Vniversitatis Du●c●nsis Ibidem.  say they) we bear with many errors in other old Catholic writers, and extenuate them, excuse them, by inventing some device, oftentimes deny them, and ●aine some commodious sense for them when they are objected in disputation with our adversaries: we do not see why Bertram may not deserve the same equity, and diligent revisal; les● the Heretics cry out, that we burn and forbid such antiquity as maketh for them; and accordingly they have dealt wi●h Bertram; for by their Recognition, 
s Legendum invisibilitèr pro visibilitèr, ●t [s●cundùm creaturarum substantiam] explicandum est secundum external species sacramenti Ind. expu●g. B●lg●●. pag. ●7.  We must read Invisibiliter, in stead of Visibiliter; and these words, [The Substance of the Creatures] must be expounded to signify outward shows, or Accidents.  
But this will not serve the turn; for Bertram speaking of the consecrated b●ead and wine, saith, that for the substance of the creatures, they remain the same after consecration, that they were before. Now if they do so, then is not the substance of b●ead and wine changed into the substance of the flesh and blood of Christ, as the Trent Council would have it. 
t Concil. Tr●d. Sess. 2. Can. 13.  Nor will it serve to say, that by the substance of the Creatures is meant the outward accidents, as the whiteness of the bread, the colour of the wine, or the like: for Bertram speaks properly, that the consecrated bread and wine, remain the same in substance. And it were an improper speech to attribute the word Substance, to Accidents, as to say the substance of the colour, or redness of the wine, or the like.   

PA.  
Master Brerely suspects 
u Protest. Apol. Tract. ●. chap. 2. sect. 7.  that this book was lately set forth by O●colampadius under bertram's name.   

PRO.  
This suspicion is cleared by the ancient Manuscript copies of Bertram extant, before Occolampadius was borne; one whereof that great Scholar, Causabon, saw in the Library of Master james Gilot, a Burgess of Paris, as he 
x D. Vss●rius de Christian. Eccles. succ●ssione. cap. 2. sect. 18.  witnessed to the Reverend and learned Primate, Doctor Vsher.  
And yet besides these Manuscripts, Bertram taught the same doctrine in other books also, to wit, De Nativitate Christi, and de Animâ, which are to be seen in the Libraries of the Cathedral Church of Sarisburie, and Bennet College in Cambridge, as the same 
y D. Vss●r. in Gotteschal●●, seu p●aedest. Cont●overs. cap. 11.  Bishop Usher observes.   

PA.  
Was Bertram a learned man, and of a good li●e?   

PRO.  
Trithemius the Abbot gives him a large 
z Be●tramus Presbyter, q●● in ●ivin●s S●riptu●●● va●dè peritus, non mi●ù● vit●, qu●m doct●i●i i●sign●s s●●ipsit co●m●ndabile opus de p●aedestinatione, et librum un●m de Corp. & sang Dom. Trithem. verb. Be●●ram.  commendation, For his excellent learning in Scripture, his godly life, his worthy Books, (and by name, this of the Body and Blood of Christ)  
Clodius de Sanctes 
a Refertur in Catalog● Scriptor Ecclesiast. ut ver ●on minùs vit●. quam doctrinà insign●●, et Ca●●oli●●●. Cl●d. de Sa●ctes. de ●●b. Eu●h●●ist. controvers. rep●tit 2. p. 55. Par. 1575.  ●aith, He is put in the Catalogue of Ecclesiastical Writers, for one Catholic in life and doctrine; and your Brerely 
b Brer●●y P●o●. Apol. ●●. 2 ● 2 sect. 7.  saith, That ancient Catholic Writers doubt not to honour Bertram for a holy Martyr of their Church.  
Now are we come to our famous countryman Scotus, much what of bertram's standing, and both of them in favour with Charles; unto whom as Bertram Dedicated his Treatise of the Sacrament; so also joannes Scotus wrote of the same argument, and to the same effect that Bertram had done. Bellarmine saith, 
c Is primus in Ecclesi● la●in● de 〈◊〉 ●u●i è s●ri●ere capit Bellar. de S●cram Eu. har. lib. 1. cap 1. §. Secundus.  That Scotus was the first who in the Latin Church wrote doubt●fully of the real presence. It is indeed their fault that we have not his Book, yet may we presume that he wrote positively; neither do we any where find, that his book of the Sacrament was condemned before the days of Lanfrancke, 
d Tantùm Lan●ia●●● ait, ●●●tum in 〈…〉 ●●●sell●nsi ●●m 〈◊〉 damna●um ●et 〈◊〉 ●xillius s●riptis opinionis 〈◊〉 ●eminari● 〈…〉 Cl●d. de Saints ibid. 〈◊〉. 2. p. 54.  who was the first that leavened the Church of England with this corrupt doctrine of the carnal presence; so that all this while, to wit, from the year 876, to 1050, he passed for a good Catholic.   

PA.  
Was Scotus a man of that note?   

PRO.  
He was (as Possevine saith 
e I●m. Scotus. dis●ipulus olim ●ede, et collega Alcuini unus ex ●undatoribus gymnasij Parisiensis, qui po●●e● ab Al●redo Rege ex G●llij●, ●●i Carolus Calvus eum ●ove●at, revocatus in Angliam, in s●holà Ox ●●iensi praelegit. ● Discipuli apud Monas●e●ium M●l●●sburiense graphijs trans ●ixerunt, & Martyr Christi ●●●i●atus est. Possevin. Apparat. to. 1. pa. 868. & Petrus ●rinitus lib. 24. de honestà Discipl. c. 11.  Scholar to Bede, Fellow-pupill with Alcuinus, and accounted one of the founders of the University of Paris, and in the end died like a Martyr. For after that he came into England, and was public Reader in Oxford, by the favour of King Alfred, he retired himself into Malmsbury Abbey, and was there by his own Scholars stabbed to death with Pen-knives: and this was done (saith Bale, 
f Inter legendum à quibusdam discipulis m●levolis interin●●batur A. C. 88●. ●ortass● non sine monachorum impulsu. Balaeus Cent. 2. cap. 24.  and others) 
g Ia●. Philip. Bergoni. Su●●lement. C●ron. Venet an 1503. Hospinian. hist. 〈◊〉. part. 1 l. 4. p 316. & 317— ●●br. ●ovel. de Antichr. in Prae●a●.  Fortassis non sine Monachorum impulse, haply not without the Monk's procurement; being murdered by his Scholars, whiles he opposed the carnal presence which then some private persons began to set on foot.  
By his birth he was one 
h Doctor notum est● candem esse veterem S●●t●am et Hiberniam. D. V●ser. in Gottes●halco c●p. 9  of the Scottish or Irish nation, and is sometime called Erigena, sometime Scotigena. He was surnamed Scotus the Wise, and for his extraordinary learning, in great account with our King Alfred, and familiarly entertained by Charles the Great, to whom he wrote diverse 
i Veter. Epist. Hibernicor. S●ll ge. D. 〈◊〉. Vsserias ●pist. 22.  letters.  
In a word, there is an old homely 
m Milms●●●●n●● de gest. R●g. Anglor. lib. 2. c. 4. pag. 45.  Epitaph, which speaks what this Scotus was; 

Clauditur hoc tumulo Sanctus Sophista joannes,  
Qui ditatus erat jàm vivens dogmate miro,  
Martyrio tandem Christi conscendere regnum  
Quo● meruit, sancti regnant per saecula cuncti.   

Under this stone  
Lies Sophister john,  
Who living had store  
Of singular Lore.  
At length he did merit,  
Heaven to inherit;  
A Martyr blessed.  
Where all Saint's rest.    
Or thus: 
Here lies interred Scotus the Sage,  
A Saint, and Martyr of this Age.   

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
jonas Bishop of Orleans, who wrote against Claudius' bishop of Turin in the defence of Images, holds that 
n Quae picturae xon ad adorandum, sed solummod● (teste B. Greg.) add 〈◊〉 nes●i●ntium mentes in 〈◊〉 sunt antiquit●●●ieri permissae. jonas Aurelian. de cultu Imag. lib. 1 in Biblioth. Patr. tom. 4. pa●. 692. edit Par.  The Images of Saint●, and Stories of divine things may b●e painted in the Church, not to be worshipped, but to be an ornament, and to bring into the minds of simple people, things done and passed. But to adore the Creature, or to give it any part of divine honour, we count it (saith he 
o Creaturum verò ado●rari, e●que aliquid divinae servitutis impe●di, nesas ●u●imus; hujusque sceleris patratorem detestandum 〈◊〉 anathem●tiz●ndum● liber● unce pro●l●mamus. Id. ibid. p●g 699 ) a vile wickedness, detesting the do●r thereof, as worthy to be accursed: It is fl●t impiety (
p Adorare alium praeter Pat●em, et Filium, et S. ●. impi●tatis est ●rimen. Ibid. pag. 701.  saith the same jonas out of Origen) to adore any save the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. Agobardus, bishop of Lions saith, 
q Sed nullas antiquorum Catholicorum unquam c●s colendas vel adorand●s sertè existimavit. Agoba●d● opera. Par. 1605 pa. 253.  That the Ancients, they had the pictures of the Saints, but it was for history sake, and not for adoration; and that none of th● ancient Catholics haply thought that Images are to be worshipped, or adored.  
And 
r Rec●è nimirum ob ejusmodi evacuandam superstitionem ab orthodoxis patribus definitum est; pictural in ecclesi●●i●ri non deb●re; ne quod colitur et adoratur, in parietibus d● pingatur. Id. ibid. pa. 254  the Orthodox Fathers for avoiding of superstition, did carefully provide that no pictures should be set up in Churches, lest that which is worshipped should be painted on the walls.  
Rhemigius saith, 
s Quia non sunt ado●anda simulachra, nec etiam Angelus adorandus ●st. Rhemig. in Psal. 96.  That neither Images nor Angels are to be adored; and 
t Quid non sint Deo debitis ●ultibus et honoribus colend●, quae ab illu vel nobis facta sunt. Vala●rid. Strabo de ●eb. ecclesiast. cap 8.  Walasfridus Strabo, would not have divine honour given to aught that is made by us, or any other Creature.  
Now what say the Papists to these Testimonies? Baronius yields us Walafridus Strabo, jonas bishop of Or●leance, Hincmarus, Archbishop of Rheims, and saith 
u  That they forsook the received opinion of the Church; and yet they were ever held sound Catholics.  
Bellarmine saith, 
x 〈…〉 est, 〈…〉 Agobardus, et r●liqui 〈…〉. Bell. 〈…〉 Eccl●s. s●●t. 9 verbo jonas.  That jonas was overtaken with Agobard his error, and other bishops of France in that Age, and therefore puts in a Caveat, that jonas must be read warily. So that by their own confession the learnedst, and famousest men of this Age stand for us in this point; & this makes them seek to suppress such testimonies as are given of them. Papirius Massonus set forth this book of Agobards, and delivers the argument thereof to be this: 
y Grae●o●um errores de Im●ginibus et picturis mani●e●tissimè d●tege●s ●egat 〈◊〉 ad●rari d●b●re; quam sente●tiam om●es Cat●●li●i p●obamus G●egorijque M testimonium d●●llis se qui mur. Pap●●. M●sson. in 〈◊〉 ●p p. 7.  Detecting most manifestly the errors of the Grecians touching images & pictures: he (to wit, bishop Agobard) denies t●at they ought to be worshipped: which opinion all we Catholics do allow and follow the testimony of Gregory the great concerning them. Now this passage the Spanish Inquisitors, in their expurgatory Index, 
Expungantur omnia 〈◊〉 sub hoc 〈◊〉 (de Imaginibu●) continentur. ●nd. l●br expugnat. de 〈◊〉 Sena●u● general. I●q●isit Hi●p 〈◊〉 Madr●an● 1612.  Commanded t● be blotted out, and this is accordingly 
a M Bibliot●. vet. Patr. to. 9 pa●t. 1. edit. Colon. an. 1618. pa 551.  performed by the Divines of Collen, in their late corrupt Edition of the great Bibliothek of the ancient Fathers.  
To close up this point; Charles the Great was seconded by his Son Lewis the Godly; for by his appointment, the Doctors of France 
b Synod parisians. de Imaginib sub Ludovi●o ●io.  assembled at Paris, in the year 842, and there condemned the adoration of Images.  
It is not strange (saith 
c N●n autem mi●un si 〈…〉  Ambrose Ansber●us) that our prayers and tears are not offered up unto God by us, but by our High Priest, since that Saint Paul exhorts us, to offer up the Sacrifice of Praise unto God. Haymo upon those words of Isay, 〈◊〉 enim Pater noster, Thou O Lord art our Father. [Isay. 6●. ver. 16.] ●aith, 
d Ha●m● in cap. 63. 〈◊〉.  Et rectè solum invocamus ac d●p ecamur te, And we do right, only to invocate thee, and to make our supplication to thee.   

Of Faith and Merit.  
Claudius' Scotus saith, 
〈…〉 Usher, of the 〈…〉 Religion.  that Faith alone saveth us, because by the works of the Law no man shall be justified; yet he addeth withal this caution, 
f No● quod legis opera conte●●enda sunt, et absque eis simplex fides appetenda, sed ipsa opera ●ide Christi adornentur. Id. in Gal. 3.  Not as if the works of the Law should be contemned, and without them a simple faith, (so he calleth that solitary faith, which is a simple faith indeed) should be desired; but that the works themselves should be adorned with the Faith of Christ. Rhemigius saith, 
h Re verá isti soli bea●●● qui per gratiam justificantur, non ex meritis. romig in Psal. 32.  That in truth, those only are happy, who are freely justified of grace, and not of merit. Haymo saith, 
i [Et salvamur] 〈◊〉 gratiâ non nosiris me●●tis, quae quidem merita sunt nu●la. Haimo in Esai. ca 63.  We are saved by God's grace, and not our own merits; for we have no merits at all.  
Ambros. Ansbertus expounding that place, Revel. 19 7 makes this inference. 
k In eo autem damus illi gloriam, quo nullis praecedentibus ●onorum actuu● meritis, sed solà nos ●ju● misericordià, ad t●ntam dignitatem pervenisse sateamur. Ambr. A●sbert. in Apocalyp. lib. 8. cap. 19 Et pr●ventente gra●t● salvamur, et subsequente justificamur. Id ib. l. 10. c. 22.  In this do we give glory to him, when we do confess, that by no precedent merits of our good deeds, but by his mercy only, we have attained unto so great a dignity. And 
l Ne dicerent, Pat●es nostri suo merito pla●uerunt, ideò tant● sunt à Domino consecuti; intu●it non meriti● datum, sed qui● ita sit Deo placitum, cuj●s est gratuitum omne quod praestat. Raban. in Ie●em. lib. 18. cap 2.  Rabanus in his commentaries upon the Lamentations of jeremy; lest they should say, our Fathers were accepted for their Merit, and therefore they obtained such great things at the hands of the Lord; he adjoineth, that it was not given to their Merits, but because it so pleased God, whose free gift is whatsoever he bestoweth.  
I will close up this Age only with producing an Evidence drawn about the year 860, namely, a learned Epistle which Huldericke Bishop of Ausburg, in Germany, wrote to Pope Nicolas in defence of Priest's Marriage. From this holy discretion (
m Non parum quippe ●b h●c sa●cta discre●ione deviasti cum Cle●i●os quos ad continentiam conjugij 〈◊〉 d●b●bas, ad hanc ●mperi●s● quadam violenti à ●ogi voleba●. Nunquid enim merit● c●muni omnium sapientun● judi●to hae● est violenlentia, cum contrà Evang●licam institutionem, ac S. ●p dictatim●m, ad privata aliquis dec●eta cogitur ●x●quenda? Domirus quidem in v●te●i l●ge Sacerdoti conjugium, constituit, quod illi post modùm interdixisse non legit●r. S. Vd alric. de celibatu 〈◊〉 inter Monum. S. Patr. Orthodoxographa p. 481. edit. à joan. jac. Grynaeo Basil. an. 1569.  saith he) thou hast no a little swarved, when as thou wouldst have those Cleargy-men, whom thou oughtest only to advise to abstinence from marriage, compelled unto it by a certain imperious violence: for is not this justly in the judgement of all Wise men to be accounted violence, when as against the Evangelicall institution, and the charge of the Holy Ghost, any man is constrained to the execution of private Decrees? The Lord in the old Law appointed marriage to his Priest, which he is never read afterwards to have forbidden.    

PA.  
Master Brerely saith, 
n Prot. Apol. ●. 2. ch. 2. sect. 7.  that this Epistle is forged under the name of Ulrick Bishop of Augusta.   

PRO.  
Your Spanish Inquisitors have 
o Index lib. prohibit. et expurg Bern. de Sand●val 〈◊〉 R●xas ●uss● edit. Ma●r. 1612. et per Turietin. Genevae 1619. H●ldar●●o Episcopo Augu●●●●o ep●●●ola ascripta pro●ibe●tur. pag. 47. 〈◊〉. H.  suppressed this Testimony, and struck it dead with a 
p Deleatur tota Epistola V●a●rici de 〈◊〉 Cl●ri Ind expurg. H●p. Quirogae. edit. M●dr. an. 1584. in 〈◊〉 lit. O.  Deleatur; Let that whole Epistle be blotted out: but our learned bishop, Doctor Hall, 
q The honour of the married Clergy, by Dr. Hall. lib 3. sect. 2, 3, 4, 5.  proves that this Huldericke wrote such a Treatise, and about the time assigned, and also that this Record is Authentic; that it is extant, (as Illyricus saith) in the Libraries of Germany, that ou● Archbishop Parker, bishop jewel, john Fox, had Copies of it in Parchment of great Antiquity.  
Besides, your own man Aeneas Silvius, afterwards Pope Pius the second, almost two hundred years ago, mentions it, and reports the Argument of it; for speaking of Ausburg, he saith, 
r A●n. Silvius de morib. German●ae.  Saint Vdalricus huic praesidet, qui papam arguit de Concubinis: Vdalricke is the Saint of that City, who reproved the Pope concerning Concubines.    

THE TENTH CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 900. to 1000  

PAPIST.  
WE are now drawing on to the thousandth year, what say you to this tenth Age?   

PROTESTANT.  
By the fall of the Roman Empire, Learning was now decayed, and the public Service no longer to be understood, by reason of the change of the vulgar Tongues. Wernerus a Carthusian Monk 
a Sanctitas Papas dimifit, et ad Imperato●es accessit hoc tempore. Wernerus Fascic. tempor. aetate 6. circa ann. 944. p. 6●.  saith of this Age, That holiness had left the Popes, and fled to the Emperors. Bellarmine saith, 
b Nullum fuit indoctiu● et infelicius. Bell. lib. 4. de Pont. ca 12. Seculum inselix in quo nulli Scriptore● illus●res. Id. in Chronolog.  There was no Age so unlearned, so unlucky. And Baronius complains saying 
c Quae tunc facies Ecclesi● Romanae. Baron. to. 10. Annal. ann. 912. §. 8.  What was then the face of the Roman Church? when potent and base Whores bore all the sway at Rome? at whose lust, Sees were changed, Bishoprickes bestowed, and their Lovers thrust into Saint Peter's Chair? Insomuch as Baronius is glad to prepare his Reader with a 
d Prae●ari aliquid necessarium duximus, ne quid s●andali pusillus animo patiatu●, si quando videre contiger●t abomi●ationem desolationis in templo. 〈◊〉 ibid. ann. 900. §. 1.  Preface, before he would have him venture upon the Annals of this Age, Lest a weak man seeing (in the Story of those times) the abomination of Desolation sitting in the Temple, should be offended, and not rather wonder, that there followed not immediately the Desolation of the Temple. And he had reason to Preface as much, considering the corruption that grew in this Thousandth year, wherein 
e Revelat. 20.3.  Satan was let loose. For at thi● time they of Rome forbade others to mar●y, and in the mean whiles themselves slept in an unlawful bed: They also devised a carnal Presence of Christ in the Sacrament, so that (as the noble Morney 
f M●steri● of iniquity the 37. p●o●●●●sion. p. ●08.  saith) The less that they believed God in heaven, the more careful were they to affirm him to be in the Bread, in the Priest's hands, in his words, in his nods; and that by these means when it pleased them, they could make him appear upon earth. Thus dishonesty accompanied infidelity; and no marvel since (as Ockam 
g M●limores ex oe●a●t i●t 〈…〉 Dial. 〈…〉, c●p. 26.  saith) A lewd life (oftentimes) blind●th the understanding. But le● us see whether in this Monkish Age, during this mist in Egypt, we can discover any light in the Land of Goshen  
In this Age lived the Monk Radulphus Flaviace●sis, Stephanus Edvensis Bishop, Smaragdus 
h Smaragdus Abbas Monasterij S. Michaelis scripsit in Psalterium ●pistolas, Evangeli●. Trithem. de scriptor. eccles.  Abbot of Saint michael's in Germany, and Aelfricke Abbot of Malmesburie, about the year, 975.  

Of the Scriptures sufficiency, and Canon.  
Flaviacensis compares the Scripture to a well-furnished Table, or Ordinary. It is (saith he) 
i Sacra scriptura mensa nobis est, & spiritalis refectio, ad consolati●nem nobis data contrà iniraicos. Rad. Flau. in Levit. li. 17. cap. 5.  our spiritual refection, and Cordial given to us against the heart-qualmes of our enemies. The same Author speaking of Books pertainning to sacred History 
k Nam Tobias, ●udith, ●t Macab●or●m, quamvis ad instructionem Ecclesie legantur; perfectam tamen non habe●t authoritatem. Id. in p●ae●at. in lib. 14. Levit. pag. 203.  saith; The Books of Tobit, judith, and of the Maccabees, though they be read ●or the Church's instruction, yet they have not any perfect Authority.  
In like sort Aelfricke Abbot of Malmesburie, in his Saxon Treaty of the old Testament, tell us; 
l Ael●rick of the Old Testament. pag. 17, 22, 23.  There are two Books more placed with Salomon's works, as if he had made them, which for likeness of Style, and profitable use; have gone for his, but jesus the son of Syrach composed them: one is called Liber Sapientiae, the Book of Wisdom, and the other, Ecclesiasticus, very large Books, and read in the Church of long custom, for much good instruction: amongst these Books the Church hath accustomed to place two other tending to the glory of God, and entitled Maccabaeorum: I have turned them into English, and so read them you may (if you please) for your own instruction. Now by this Saxon Treatise, written by Aelfricus Abbas, about the time of King Edgar, (seven hundred years ago) it appears what was the Canon of holy Scripture here then received, and that the Church of England had it so long ago in her Mother tongue.   

Of Communion under both, and number of Sacraments.  
Stephanus Edvensis saith 
m Quotidiè nobis haec dona praestantur, quando corpus et sanguis in Altari sumuntur. Steph. Edvens. de Sacram. Altaris. ca ●7. in Biblioth. Patr. Paris. 1589. edi●. 2. per Margarin de la Bigne. to. 6. p. 587  These gifts or benefits ●re daily performed unto us, when the Body and Blood of Christ is taken at the Altar.  
Aelfricke mentions but two Sacraments, of Baptism, a●d the Lords Supper; the same which God's people had under the Law; who though they had many Rites and Ceremonies, yet (in proper sense) but two Sacraments; his words are these; 
n Aelfricks' Sermon on E●ster day, pag 24. editionis joan. Da●●. Load.  The Apostle Paul saith [1 Cor. chap. 10. vers. 1, 2, 3, 4.] That the Israelites did eat the same ghostly meat, and drink the same ghostly drink; because that heavenly meat that fed them forty years, and that water which from the Stone did flow, had signification of Christ's Body, and his Blood, that now be offered daily in God's Church. So that as a good Author saith, 
o Seculum de●imum d●● tantum ag●●●vit Sacram●nta. joan a Munste, ●n Vor●lage nobilis discurspropos. 3.  This Age acknowledged only two Sacraments.   

Of the Eucharist.  
Our English Abbot Aelfricke in his Saxon Homily, which was appointed publicly to be read to the people in England, on Easter day, before they received the Communion, hath these words; 
p Ael●●ick i● die S. Pas●●●. A Se●mon on ● ast●r d●y. pag. 23.  All our Forefather's they did eat the same Ghostly meat, and drank the same Ghostly drink; they drank truly of the stone that followed them, and that stone was Christ; neither was that stone then from which the water ran bodily Christ, but it signified Christ. The same Abbot saith, 
q Id. ibid. pag 12.  Men have often searched, and do yet often search (so that it seems that this was then in question, and so before Berengarius time) how bread that is gathered of Corn, may be turned to Christ's body, or how wine that is pressed out of many grapes, is turned through one blessing to the Lords Blood: and the resolution returned is this: 
r Id. ibid. p●● 12, 13, 14.  Now say we to such m●n; that some things be spoken of Christ by signification, some thing by thing certain: true thing and certain is that Christ was borne of a Maid: He is said Bread by signification, and a Lamb, and a Lion; He is called Bread, because he is our life, he is said to be a Lamb for his Innocence. But Christ is not so notwithstanding after true nature, neither Bread, nor a Lamb. Why is then the holy Housell called Christ's Body, or his Blood, if it be not truly that it is called? Without they be seen bread and wine both in figure and taste; and they ●ee truly after their hallowing, Christ's body and blood, through Ghostly mystery.  
And again, 
s Ibid. pag. 1●. & 18.  Much is betwixt the body Christ suffered in, and the body that is hallowed to Housel: the body truly that Christ suffered in was borne of the flesh of Mary, with blood and with bone; and his Ghostly body which we call the Housel, is gathered of many Corns, without blood and bone; and therefore nothing is to be understood therein bodily, but all is Ghostly to be understood. Here we see, the body of Christ borne of the blessed Virgin, the body of fl●sh, is plainly distinguished from the consecrated substance of bread, or the Body Sacramental, which the Homilist calls Ghostly.  
And again, 
Ibid. pag. 20.  This Mystery i● a pledge and a figure; Christ's body is truth itself; the pledge we do keep Mystically, until we be come to the truth itself, and then is this pledge ended. Truly it is Christ's body and blood not Bodily but Ghostly; and ye should not search how it is done, but hold it in your belief that it is so done.  
The like matter also was delivered to the Clergy by the Bishops at their Synods, out of two other writings of the same 
u A●lfricks Sermon●, joined with the Saxon Homily, printed at London by john Day, and reprinted Ann. 1623.  Aelfricke; in the one whereof directed to Wulfsine Bishop of Shy●burne, we read thus: 
x Pag. 45.  That holy Housel is Christ's body, not Bodily, but Ghostly; not the body which he suffered in, and so forth.  
In the other witten to Wulf●tane Archbishop of York, thus: 
y Pag 51.  That lively bread is not bodily so, nor the selfsame body that Christ suffered in; nor that holy wine is the Saviour's blood which was shed for us in bodily thing, but in Ghostly understanding; both be truly the bread his body, and the wine also his blood, as was the heavenly bread which we call Manna: which words are to be seen mangled 
z Non sit tamen hoc sacrificium corpus ejus in quo p●ssus est pronobis; neque sanguis ejus quem pro nobi● effu●●t, sed spirit●alitèr corpus ejus efficitur et s●ngu●● sicut Manna.  and razed in a Manuscript, in Bennets College in Cambridge, as our learned Antiquary of Oxford, hath well observed 
a D. ●ames of the corruption of the Fathers. part. 2. pag. 55. . And we may conceive it to be done by some Papist, for that it plainly confutes the doctrine of Transubstantiation; the best is, the evidence is restored out of another Copy.    

PA.  
Here is much a do with an old Record, which yourselves will not (haply) justify in every point.   

PRO.  
The Record is both ancient and authentic; but to be free from error, is the privilege of holy writ: yourselves stand not to all which the Fathers, even of the first Age wrote. Why then should we make good all that was delivered in this later, and ignorant Age, so much cumbered with Monkery? There are indeed in this Homily some suspicious words; as where it speaks of the Mass to be profitable to the quick and dead, of the mixture of water with wine; and a report of two vain miracles, which notwithstanding, seem to have been infarced; for that they stand in their pl●ce unaptly, and without purpose, and the matter without th●m, both before and af●er, doth hang in itself together most orderly: beside, these mistakes they are but touched by the way, and a●e different from th● whole scope of the Author.  
Thus was Priest and people taught to believe in the Church of England, above six hundred years ago; for this Sermon was written in the old Saxon tongue before the Conquest, and appointed in the reign of the Saxons to be spoken to the people at Easter before they should receive the Communion. Neither was Aelfricke the first Author of this Homily, but the Translator thereof out of Latin into the old English, or Saxon tongue; the Homily itself was extant before his time, and the resolution thereof is the same with that of Ber●●am, and in many places directly translated out of him; so that the doctrine is both ancient and Orthodox; whereas that of Transubstantiation was not publicly taught in the Church of England, till Lanfranck and others, a thousand years after Christ, came with an Italian trick, and expounded Species and forma panis, for the qualities and accidents of bread without subject or substance; But from the beginning it was not so.  

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
Concerning Images, Churches●an ●an a middle cou●se, neither rudely breaking them, nor superstitiously adoring them; and this opinion they stoutly maintained, and for some ages after continued most constant therein, as C●ss●●der 
b  s●ith; and he saith true, as appears by the practice of the French in the ninth, and the Almains in the tw●lfth Age.  
The Abbot Smaragdus saith; that 
 Christ only makes Intercession in heaven for us, performing that with the Father, which he petitioned of the Father; being both our Mediator to prefer our Petitions, and our Creator to grant our requests. In li●e sort, Radulphus Flaviacensis calls the Angel of the covenant Christ jesus, 
d Angelus is●e non nisi Ponti●ex ille summu● missus s●ilice● à ●atre ad homines, et ab hominibus ad Patrem remissus, ut hominum caussas ●pud Patr●m peroret, Mediator Dei, hominumque. R●d Fl●vi●●, in Levit. lib. 2. cap. 24.  The Master of Requests to prefer our suits in the court of Heaven, and to mediate betwixt God and men. Now if he by his Father's Patent, be Master of Requests; surely we may not without Commission and warranty out of God's word, constitute others, either Saints, or Angels, Mediators of our Prayers.   

Of Faith and Works.  
It is of necessity, that believers should be saved only by the faith of Christ 
e Necesse est sold fide Chris●i salva●●●redentes● Smaragd. in G●lat. cap. 3. in Catal. Test. verit. l● 11. ; saith Smaragdus the Abbot. Who is it that can do all that God hath commanded? we are not come to that blessedness or merit, to yield him obedience in all things 
f Non ejus beatudinis sumus ●ut m●riti, ut i● universis illi obtemperemus. Fl●viac. in L●vi●i●. lib. 20. cap 1. , saith Flaviacensis: For as 
g Alij bon● fa●iunt non be●●, quia si●e side pla●ere D●● non p●ssunt. Id. ibid. l● 15. 〈◊〉 ●.  he saith, One may do bonum, and not benè; one without grace may do a Moral act, as give Alms; the act Morally good, ex genere & objecto, but not good ex fine & circumstantijs, in case it be given out of vain glory, or ●he like.    

PA.  
You taxed this Age for imposing single life on the Clergy, this was no Innovation.   

PRO.  
In this Age there arose great contention about Priest's marriage: At length about the year 975. the matter was referred to the Rood of Grace, which as the 
h Literae do●ent, Dominic●m imaginem expressè locutam, Clericos, co●umque fautores, con●udisse. Gu●. Malmes. de gest. Ang●● li. 2. cap. 9 & Polychron. lib. 6. cap. 12. pa. 240.  Annalists, and Legendaries say) returned this answer: God forbid it should be so, God forbid it should be so, you have judged well once (said the Rood) and to change that again is not good. Now this Oracle made for Saint Dunstan, 
i Absit ut hoc siat● absit hoc ut fiat; judicastis benè m●t●retis non b●nè. No●● L●genda Angliae. de ●. Dunstano pag. 94.  and against the Priests, who said this was but a subtle trick of the Monks, in placing behind the wall a man of their own, who through ● Trunk uttered those words in the mouth of the Rood; the matter therefore came again to s●anning, the Prelates and the States met at 
k Cl●ve, or Calne, ut Mal●●sbur. vel T●●ne. ut Hen●. Huntingd.  Cleve in Wiltshire; where after hot and sharp Disputation on either side, a heavy mischance fell out: for whether through the weakness of the Foundation, or the overpresse of weight, or both, 
l Sola●ium totum repen●●●um ●xibus & ●ra●ibu● dissiluit et co●●idit; omnibus ad terram ●lisis, solus Dunstanus stans super un●m trabem quae superstes er●t, ●vasit probe. Gu●l M●lms. quò sup●a.  The upper L●ft, where the Council sat, fell down, and many of the People were hurt, and some slain outright. But Dunstan the Monks Prolocutor remained unhurt; For the Post whereon his Chair stood, remained safe. By this fall, fell the cause of the Secular Priests, and they of Dunstan's side thought these rotten joists foundation enough whreon to build their Prohibition of Marriage. But Henry Archdeacon of Huntingdon interprets this casualty more probably, To 
m Signum scilicet Dei ex●elsi fu●t, quod proditione● et inter●ectione Regis su●, ab amo●e Dei, ●asuri essent, et a diversis gentibus ●ign● contrit●●e conterendi. Henr. Huntingd. Hist. lib. 5. pag. 357.  be a sign from God, that by their Treason and murder of their King (who was slain the year after) they should fall from God's favour, and be crushed by other Nations, as in the event it proved. And thus did Dunstan by his feigned Miracles seduce King Edgar to drive out the Secular Priests; wh●re yet Dunstan (haply) thought not to thrust married men out of the Clergy, but to thrust married Clergy men out of Cathedral Churches, because they required a daily attendance, as the Learned bishop Doctor 
n The honour of the married Clergy. lib. 3. sect ●0.  Hall hath observed.  
Howsoever it fell out, it is worth the observing, that the Clergy pleaded Praescription for themselves; for so their own Monk of Malmesbury hath recorded their plea; they alleged saith he; 
o Di●entes, ingen● esse et miserabl●e ded●●us, ut nov●● advena veteres ●olonos migr●re compelle●et: hoc nec Deo gratum puta●●, qui veterem habitationem concessisses, ne● alicu● pr●●o homini qui fi●i idem t●●●re re posset quod aliis pre●●d●c●o acc●disse 〈◊〉. M●lmes. quo up●●.  That it was a great sh●me, that these upstart Monks should thrust o●t the ancient possessors of those places; that this was neither pleasing to God, who gave them that long continued habitation, nor yet to any good man, who might justly fear the same hard measure which was offered to them. Matthew of Westminster speaking of Pope Gregory the seaventh, saith; that 
p Sacerdotes ux●●atos à d●vino o●●i●io ●movit, novo ●xemplo, et ut mult● vi●um est, inconsi●erato ●r●●udicio● cont●à sactorum patrum sent●n●●● Math. Westmon. ad an. 100LS.  He removed married Priests from their function: a new example, and as many thought, inconsiderately prejudicial, against the judgement of the holy Fathers; And Henry of Huntingdon saith, 
q Ans●lmus A●chiep. Concilium an● Londoniam te●uit, in q●o prohib●●●uxores Sacerdot 〈◊〉 Anglorum, 〈◊〉 non prohibitas Henr. ●untingd. pa. 378.  Archbishop Anselm held a Synod at London, wherein he forbade wives to the Priests of England, before not forbidden. Was not this now an Innovation?  
Besides, 
r Acts & Monuments Vol. 1. Book 3. pag 150● ad ann. 941.  we find that in King Edmund's reign, a West Saxon Prince, (before the days of Edgar or Dun●tan) bishop Osulphus with Athelme and Vlricke Laics, thrust out the Monks of Evesham, and placed Canons (married Priests) in their room.  
And afterwards, when not only the meaner sort, but the Nobles and great ones ●ided; even then also, 
s P●oceribus succlamantibus prae●udioiū, quòd Clerici passi fuerant injustè. H. Huntingd. loc. citato. Optimates, Abbates cum Monachis, de Monaste●ijs, in quibus Edgorus eos locaverat expule●unt; et Clericos● ut pri●s loco ●o●ii●i●n uxo●ibus induxe●unt; nam unus eorum Aelferius nomi●e omnia penè Monasteria subvertit. Mat. Westmon. ad ann. 97●.  Alferus a Mercian Duke, favouring the cause of married Priests, cast out the Monks, and restored again the ancient revenues to the Clerks; and it seems they were the ancient owners, and others but incommers; inasmuch as diverse Cathedral Churches originally were founded in married Cleargy-men, and afterwards translated from them to Monks; as appears by that which the Monks of Worcester wrote 
t Charta R. Edgari de Oswaldeslaw extat inter epist. veterum Hibernic. apud D. lac. Vsserium.  under their Oswald Archbishop of York: 
Per me fundatus  
Fuit ex Clericis Monachatus.  That is, By me were Monks first founded out of Clerk's. So that the Monks were not the first possessors, but came in by such as Dunstan; who wrought with that good King Edgar, by dreams, visions, and miracles, mostly tending to Monkery; as namely, that, 
u Nova Legenda Angliae de S Dunstano pa. 90. & Polychron. lib. 6. cap. 13. pag. 241.  When the Devil in the likeness of a fair woman, tempted Dunstan to l●st, he caught him by the nose with an hot pair of tongs, and made him roar out for mercy: that, 
x Legend ibid. p 94. & Polychron. loc. citato.  Eastwards That 
y Cythera illius absque ullo hominis ●mpulsis, Antiphona personuit. Legend. loc. citat. pag. 89. Polych●on. ibid. quò suprà.  Dunstan's harp, hanging upon the wall, played by 〈◊〉 self, the tune of the Anthem, Gaudent in coelis animae Sanctorum.  
By the means of this Dunstan, and his Cousins Athelwold, and Oswald, King Edgar was set on work for the building of religious houses; wherein he surpassed Charles the Great, for whereas he 
z Polychron. li. 5 cap. 26. pag. 220.  built as many as there be letters in the Alphabet, or A. B. C. King Edgar as (appears by the Charter of the foundation of Worcester Church 
a Carta Regis E●gari d● O●waldes law quo suprà. ) he built almost as many as there be Sundays in the year. I have made (saith he) 47 Monasteries, and I intent if God grant life, to make them up fifty, which seems to be the number that Dunstan set him for his penance.    

THE ELEVENTH CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 1000 to 1100.  

PAPIST.  
YOu said of the last Age, that Satan was let loose; was he bound in this?   

PROTESTANT.  
He that broke loose in the former, tyrannised in this: for now those two great Enemies of the Church, the Pope and the Turk, the one in the East, and the other in the West, began to rise to their greatness: about the y●are 1075 lived Pope 
a 〈…〉 Card. ap. ●Orth●●●. Granum in 〈◊〉. ●e●um expe●end & 〈◊〉 p. 40.  Hildebrand, who forbade marriage, and deposed Kings from their lawful thrones; so that for his doctrine the Churches did ring of him for an Antichrist. In their Sermons (
〈…〉 Annal. 〈◊〉 li. ● p●g. ●73.  saith Aventine, bo●n about the year 1466) they declared him to be Antich●ist, that under the title of Christ, he played the part of Antichrist: 
c 2 〈◊〉 2 4.  That he sits in Babylon in the Temple of God, and is advanced above all that is called God; as if he were God, he glorifieth, that he cannot err.  

d Suavis hom● sacerdotes qu● uxores habent ●●gitim●s sacr●si●os esse pe●negat; interim tamin ●●●●tatores, adult●ros, incest●os●s a●is admovet. Aventin.  This fine man denies those Priests which have lawful wives, to be Priests at all; in the mean time he admits to the Altar, Whoremongers, Adulterers, Incestuous persons: and afterwards Everard Bishop of Saltzburg in Germany, in an assembly at Regenspurge spoke thus of the Pope.  

e Hildebrandus— p●lmus specie religionis Antichristi Imperij fundamenta ●ecit: perditus homo ille (que●a Antichristum vocare sol●nt) in ●ujus fronte contumeliae nomen scriptum est, Deus sum, err●re non possum, in templo Dei sedet, longè lateque dominatur. Id. lib. 7 pag 684.  Hildebrand under colour of Religion, laid the foundation of Antichrist's kingdom: thus doth that child of perdition, (whom they use to call Antichrist) in whose forehead is written the name of blasphemy, [Revel. 13.2.] I am God, I cannot err, he sits in the Temple of God, and beareth rule far and near.  
Now began the Croisier staff to beat down Crowns and Sceptres, when Hildebrand deposed the Emperor, Henry the fourth; and yet this fact of his was opposed and condemned by diverse worthy Counsels, Bishops and Historians, both in France and Germany; and the like Papal Usurpations, Appeals, and Investitures were also resisted in England. Hubert your Legate (
f Fidelitatem facere nolui ●●●●volo: qu●a nec ego prom●si, nec antecessores m●●s ante●esso●i●us tuis id 〈◊〉 comperio D. Vsserius de eccles. success. c. 7. s●ct 9 ex Lanfranc. Epist. M S. in Biblioth. D. Rob. Cotton.  saith William the Conqueror in his letter to Gregory the seventh) came unto me, warning me from your Holiness, that I should do fealty to you, and your successors; as for fealty, I neither would do it to you, neither will I; because I neither promised it myself, nor do I find that my predecessors have done that to your predecessors. When Anselm an Italian, was chosen Archbishop of Canterbury, he craved leave of king William the second to go to Rome, to receive his Pall of Pope Vrban, wherewith the King greatly offended, answered, 
g Rex allegavit, quòd n●llus Archi●●. v●l Episcopus Regni su●, Cu●ia Romanae vel Papae subess●t; praecipu● cum ipse omnes l●b●rtates haberet in regno suo, quas Imperator vendic●bat in Imperio. Math. P●ris. Hist. an. 1094. & Holinshead. Hist. ann. 1099. pag 24.  That no Archbishop, nor bishop in his realm, was subject to the Court of Rome, or the Pope; and that he had that liberty in his realm, that the Emperor had in his Empire.  
Anselm therefore was accused of high treason; and being still desirous to go to Rome, the King told him, That if he would promise, and swear, neither to go nor Appeal to Rome for any affairs whatsoever; he should then well and peaceably enjoy his Bishopric: if not, that it should be free for him to pass the Seas, but never to return; as the Monk of Saint Alban 
h Nec p●o quovis negotio Romanae ●edi● au●ien●iam Appell●tu●u●. Id. ibid.  reports the matter.  
Now also there arose great contention about the carnal presence of Christ in the Sacrament, under Pope Victor, and Nicholas the second, Hildebrand being the brand that kindled it, making Berengarius subscribe to their Tenet; That all the faithful in the Sacrament do really tear with their teeth the body of Christ; which position nevertheless in these days is with them accounted heretical. And to say the truth, they really tear the body of Christ, who by their ambition do miserably tear in pieces the Church of Christ.  
Now to proceed; there lived in this Age, 
i Fulbert. Episc. Ca●notens. ●laruit an. M X. T●ithem. d● s●●p eccles.  Fulbertus' bishop of Chartres, 
k Anselm Laudunens'. Sc●●last. ●cripsit Glossam I●t●rli●. que extat 〈…〉 Ordinari●●t Lyr●●. B●ll. d● script eccles  Anselm of Laon, Author of the Interlineall Gloss. Theophylact Archbishop of the Bulgarians, a great follower of chrysostom, and indeed his Epitomiser, or Abbreviator, and our Anselm Archbishop of Canterbury, a man of special note in this Age. For as the 
l 〈◊〉 M●lms●●r. de 〈◊〉. Anglor. Ponti●. lib. 1 pag. 223.  Monk of Malmsbury reports, in the Council at Bar, when the greeks disputed against Pope Vrban so eagerly against the procession of the Holy Ghost, that the Pope was at a Non plus, remembering himself that Anselm was in the Council, he cried aloud before the whole Council, Pater & Magister Anselm ubi es? Oh my Father and Master Anselm where are you? come now and defend your Mother, the Church: and when the● brought him in presence among them, Pope Vrban said, Includamus hunc in orbe nostro, quasi alterius orbis papam, Let us enclose him in our Circle, as the Pope of the other world.  

m ●ish V●her●●●t●logue ●●t●logue.  Now also lived Oecumenius, Radulphus Arden's, and Berengarius. And now let us see, what these good men, and ●●ue Catholic witnesses can say to the matter in question.  

Of the Scriptures sufficiency, and Canon.  
Sa●nt Paul saith of the Scriptures, that 
n 1 Ti●. 3.15, 10, 1●.  They are able to make us wise unto salvation, that the man of God may be pe●fited, thoroughly furnished unto all good works. That the man of God (saith O●cumenius 
o Occum. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. ) may be not only partaker, after a vulgar manner of every good work, but perfect and complete by the doctrine of the Scrip●u●e. And Anselm in his Commentary upon this place saith, 
p Quae literae p●ssunt te insl●uere id est, su●fi●ien●èr ●oc●am r●dd●●● ad eternam salutem conseque●dā. A●s●lm. t●m. 2. p●g. 121.  They are able to make thee sufficiently learned, to obtain eternal salvation.  
Petrus Cluniacensis, Abbot of Clugin, abutting on these times (for he was saith 
q S. Be●na●di aequalis fuit. B●lla●m. de Script. 〈◊〉.  Bellarmine, of the same standing with Saint Bernard, who was borne in this Age, ●ut flourished about the year 1130) after the recital of the canonical books saith, that 
r Restant p●s● h●● 〈◊〉 c●●i●os S. Scripture lib●os s●x non r●t●c●●d● lib●●; Sa●i●nt●ae. 〈◊〉 silij Sira●, T● b●e ●ud●th, ●t ut●●que M●ca●●●rum; qui ●tsi a● ill●m sublim●m prae●e●entium d●gnitatem perveni. ● non po●uciunt● p●opter laud. bil●m tamen ●t pernecessa●●am d●●trinam ab ●●●lesi● sum ●ipt m●●uerunt. P●tr. 〈◊〉 d● authorit. V. Test. Epist. 2. advers. Petrobrus.  There are beside the Authentical books, ●ixe others not to be rejected, as namely, judith, Tobias, Wisdom, Ecclesiasticus, and the two books of Maccabees, which though they attain not t● the high dignity of the former, yet they are received of the Church, as containing necessary and profitable doctrine.   

Of Communion under both; and number of Sacraments.  
Theophylact sharply reproves those, who delighted in drinking alone, and quaffing by themselves, saying to such, 
s 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Theophyl. in 1. Co●. cap 11. v. 25. M. S. in A●chivis Biblioth. Bodle●anae Oxon.  How dost thou take thy cup alone, considering that the dreadful Chalice is alike delivered unto all. The Normans (
t Normanni mané Domini●i co●poris ●t sanguinis mu●imine saginati— Mat. P●ris. in ●araldo.  saith Matthew Paris) th● morning before they fought with Harald, strengthened themselves with the body and blood of Christ. Hildebert B. of Man's, palates and approves that Canon of the Council of Brachara, which condemneth the delivering of the bread sopped in the wine to the Laity, for the whole Communion. It is the manner (saith Hildebert 
u Consuetudinis est● Eucha●istiam nulli n●si intinctam da●● quod n●c ex Dominica Institutione, nec ●x sanctionibus authent●●is reperitur assumptum. Hildebeit. Cenoman. Epist. 64. in Biblioth. Patr. to. 12. pag 338. Col● Agri●. 1618. ) in your monasteries to give the Sacramental bread to none, but dipped in the wine, which custom we find is not taken either from the Lords institution, nor out of authencall constitutions. Now they that misliked the receiving of the bread dipped in wine, how would they have been pleased with a dry feast? for of the two, it is better to receive the bread dipped in wine, than the bread and no wine at all. Fulbertus shows us the way of Christian Religion, Is to believe the Trinity, and verity of the Deity, and to know the cause of his Baptism, and in whom 
x Terti on est, nosse in quo duo v●t● S●cramenta, ●l●●st Dominici c●rpori● et s●nguinu c●tinentur. 〈◊〉 e●ist. 〈◊〉 Biblioth● Pa●●. to. 3 p●●. ●35. edit. P●●is. an 1589.  (duo vitae Sacramenta) the two Sacraments of our life are contained. Anselm mentions 
y Conanu●●a faerunt ●mnibus ●udaeis Sa●●●men●a, sed non communis gra●●a: it● et nunc Baptismus 〈◊〉 omnibus ●ō●unis est, ●●d non virtus Baptismi. Commune nobis om●ibus est ●●crament●m corpo●is & sangu●uis Domini, sed non co●muri● v●●tus Sacramen●●. Anselm. in 1. Cor. ●●p o. to 2. p. 170.  but two Sacraments common to us under the Gospel, as the other were to the jews under the law; they two, and we two, two, and no more.   

Of the Eucharist.  
In the year 1608, there were published at Paris certain works of Fulbertus 
z Que tam a●res●tand●●●e 〈…〉 temporis qu●m a● G●ll●rum his●●riam pertinent.  pertaining as well to the refuting of the heresies of this time (for so saith the Inscription) as to the clearing of the history of the French. Among these things that appertain to the confutatio●●f the heresies of this time, there is one specially, fol. 168. laid down in these words, 
a Nis● manda●averitis in●uit ●arn●m fili●●●minis, 〈◊〉 sanguinem biber●●i●, non ●abebi●●s vitam in vobis●●a●m●s vel slagitium ●ide●ur ●●bere; sigu●a ergo 〈…〉.  Unless (saith Christ) ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye shall not have life in you; he seemeth to command an outrage or wickedness; It is therefore a figure, will the Heretic say, requiring us only to communicate with the Lords passion and sweetly and profitably to lay up in our memory, that his fl●sh was crucified & wounded for us. He that put in these words (Dicet Haereticus) thought he had notably met with the Heretics of this time; but was not aware, that thereby he made S. Austin an Heretic for company; for the words alleged, are S. Augustine's de doctrinâ Christianâ. lib. 3. cap. 16. Which some belike having put the publisher in mind of, he was glad to put this among his Errata; 
b Nota 〈…〉 1618. to●● ●● pag. 4●.  & to confess that these two words [Dicet Haereticus] were not to be found in the Manuscript copy which he had from P●tavius; bu● telleth us not what we are to think of him, that for the countenancing of the Popish cause, ventured so shamefully to abuse S. Austin, as both the learned Archbishop of Armagh, Doctor 
c 〈…〉 15.16.  Usher, and Master 
d 〈…〉 Lords Supper. 〈…〉  Moulin have observed.    

PA.  
Here is much a do about a mistake of two words, 
〈…〉 6.  saith our I●suit Maloune.   

PRO.  
There hath been much a do ere this about one word, the word Deipara; whether the blessed Virgin Ma●y were to be called the mother of God, or no; great difference raised in the Church touching the Sacrament, and all about three prepositions, Trans, Con, and Sub; and the greatest stir that ever was in God's Church, was about one letter; (it was but one little jota) whilst the Arrians●eld ●eld Christ to be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of the like substance with the Father, but denied him to be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Consubstantial, of the same substance with the Father. Besides, was it a matter of nothing to corrupt the ancient writers, Austin, or Fulbertus, or both? or could this Dicet Haereticus, in probability be the mistake of the Printer? and not rather purposely done by such as could not brook the truth of that doctrine which Fulbert delivered out of S. Austin. But the same Fulbert elsewhere, in a higher strain, tells us of a Spiritual, yet real receiving of Christ, saying, 
f Exere palatum fidei, dilata fauces sp●i, vis●●r● charitatis extend, et sum panem vitae, interioris hominis alimentum. Fulb●●●. Episc. in Bibl●oth. S. Pat. Paris. 1589. ●o. 3. col. 640. in Epist. ad Adeodat.  Hold ready the mouth of thy Faith, open the jaws of hope, stretch out the bowels of love, and take the bread of life, which is the nourishment of the inward man.  

Objection.  
Theophylact saith, 
* 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Theop●ylact in joan. cap. 6 v. 54 pag 654. Qui manducat me vivit propter me, dum quodammodò miscetur mihi, e● transelementatur in me. Theophylact. ibid.  He that eateth me, shall live by me; forasmuch as after a sort, he is mingled with me, and trans-elementated into me, or changed into me.   

Answer.  
Theophylact is not of that credit, as being but a late writer, above a thousand years after Christ, and therefore far short of Primitive antiquity, living as Bellarmine saith in his catalogue of Ecclesiastic writers, about the year 1071. Besides, transelementaion proveth not transubstantiation; for in transubstantiation, the matter is destroyed, and the quantity and accidents remain; and in trans-elementation, the matter remaineth, and the essential accidental forms are altered.   

Objection.  
Yea but Bellarmine 
* Theophylactu● di●it panem transmuta●i in carnem Domini. Theophyl. i● cap. 26. Math. & in cap 6. joan Bellar. li. 2. de Euchar. cap. 34 §. Sed.  allegeth Theophylact saying, of the Bread, that it is trans-elementated into the body of Christ, and he useth the word, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.   

Answer.  
Theophylact can best tell us his own meanings now the same Theophylact, who said that bread was trans-elemen●ated into Christ's body, saith also, nos in Christum 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, that we also are trans-elemē●ated into Christ; that a Christian and faithful Communicant is in a manner t●ans-elementated into Christ; for so his words are, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ● id. in cap. 6. joan. N●w they will not say that we are transubstantiated into Christ; therefore neither doth Theophylact by the word Trans-elementation, used of the bread and wine understand any substantial, but only a Sacramental change, in respect of the use and effect. And so I proceed. At this time also Berenger Archdeacon of Angiers in France, resisted the corporal presence.    

PA.  
I challenge Berenger.   

PRO.  
You cannot justly except against him, either for his life or his learning● In these times (
g Fuisse in pretio hac tempestate constat et Odi ●onem Abb●t. Cluniac & B●rengarium Turonens vi●os s●nct●●●te & doctri●à indigned Plate in joan. 1●.  saith Platina) Odo Abbot of Clunie, and Berenger of Tours, were of great account, for their excellent learning, and holiness of life. Sigebert Abbot of G●mbloux saith, 
h Liberalium artium, et a●●lius 〈◊〉 p●ritia 〈◊〉 Sig●be●t. Gembl●●● de ●llustr. eccles. Sceptre cap. 155.  that Berenger was well skilled in the Liberal arts, and an excellent Logician; Hildebert Bishop of Man's, and afterwards Archbishop of Tou●s, was his Scholar, and honoured his deceased master with this Epitaph 
i G●l● Malms●ur. de 〈…〉. engl. lib. 3. p●g. 113 & 114. . 

Vir vere sapiens, & parte beatus ab omni,  
Qui co●los animâ, corpore ditat humum;  
Post obitum vivam secùm, secùm requiescam,  
Nec fiat melior sors mea, sort suâ.   

He was a man, was blessed on every part,  
The earth hath his body, the heavens his heart,  
My wish shall be, that at my end,  
My soul may rest with this my friend.     

PA.  
What though he opposed the real presence; this was but one Doctor's opinion, which himself br●ached without any former Catholic precedent?   

PRO.  
That is not so; for his countryman Bertram, who was a Monk of Corbey Abbey in France, opposed the same long before him: and Duval a Doctor of Sorbone saith, 
k Duvalius ●it Amalarium unà cum joanne Scoto fuisse Berengarij p●aecursores. Andr. Duvalius in notis ad Flor. in Psal. 80. teste D jacob. Vsserio in Gotteschalco. cap 8.  that Amalarius and joannes Scotus were Berengers forerunners. The tru●h is, he neither wanted forerunners, nor followers, and favourers. Sigeberts' Chronicle speaking of Berengers Tenet, faith, That there was much disputation, and by many, both by word and writing, against him, and for him. Where the learned bishop Usher observes, 
l jacob. Vsser. de Christian. eccles. suc●essione ca 7. nu. 26.  that the words, Et pro eo, and for him, specially favouring Berengers cause, are left out in some Editions; 
m Vndè contrà eum multùm à multis et verbis & scriptis dispuratum est. Sigebert. Gemblac● Chron. ad an. 1051. Par. 1583.  but they are to be found in other authentic copies: 
n Vndè contrà ●um, & pro ●o, multùm à multis, et verbis et scriptis disputatum est. Sigebe●t. Chron. à Miraeo edit. Antu●rp. ann. 1608. & apud Surium to. 2. vit. Sanctor. April. 22. Colon. 1521.  and we may by the way observe, that this point of carnal presence, or the Sacrament Sub Spectebus, (for so they term it) was but a disputable point, pro and contra; and no matter of Faith in Berengers days. Indeed this doctrine was borne down by the Pope's power, so that diverse durst not make open profession thereof, yet privately they employed both their tongues and pens in defence thereof; and some even in a Roman Council, (purposely called against Berenger) stood in Defence of his figurative sense of the Sacramental words, as appears by the 
o Quid●m ve●ò coecitate nimia et longà perculsi, ●iguram tantum, substantiale illud corpus esse conabantur as●ruere Concilior. tom 3. edit. à Binnio. p●●t 2 p. 1286.  Acts of the same Council. In a word, Matthew of Westminster saith, 
p Berenga●ius Turon●ns. in haeret●●● p●olapsus pravitatem omnes Gallos', Ital●s, et Anglos, suis ●àm penè cor●uperat pravitatibus. M●th. Westmon. ad a●●. 1087.  that Berenger had almost drawn all France, Italy, a●d England to his opinion: so that the Berengarians did not lurk in any obscure nook, or corner of the world, but spread themselves into the famousest parts of Europe.   

PA.  
Father Parsons saith, 
q Parsons in his three Conv●rs. p●rt. 1. chap. 10. nu. 21.  that Berenger Recanted; so that you cannot account him one of your side.   

PRO.  
Indeed Berenger was called, and appeared before diverse Counsels, was questioned, and censured by f●u●e several 
r ●eo 9 Victor. 2. Nicol 2. Gr●gor. ●.  Popes; and there was a form of Recantation tendered to him, the tenor whereof is this, 
s ●go Be●●nganus— p●osi●●●r me ●●n●r●, pan●m & vinum quae in Alta●● ponuntur, p●st Conse●ration●m non s●l●●m Sa●ram●ntum s●d●●●●m ●●rum ●●rp●s, & s●●guin●m D●mini nos●●i Ie●u Chris●i e●●e, & 〈…〉 sacram●●to, 〈…〉 ●●ni●●s Sa●●rd●tum, trac●ari, ●ia●g●, & sid●lium dertibus atte●i. Gratian. d● Conse●rat. D●●●. 2. ca Ego B●r●ng●●.  as Gratian hath registered it in his Decrees, 
t Dec●et Gratiani Greg. 13. jussu edit. Par. 1585.  afterwards published and confirmed by Pope Gregory the thirt●enth: ay Berengarius do firmly profess that I hold, that the body of Christ is in this Sacrament, not only as a Sacrament, but even in truth is sensibly handled with the Priests hands, and broken and torn with the teeth of the faithful. Now this was such a form of an Oath, as that your own Gloss saith of it, 
u Nist sinè intell●ga●●●ròa Berengarij in majo●●●m insides ●aeresin quam ipse habit, & ideò omnia ●e●eras ad species i●sas, G●o●●● apud Gr●tian. D●c●e●. 3 part. de Conse. D●●t ●. ca Ego B●reng.  that Unless it be warily understood, on● may fall into a greater heresy than Bereng●r did. And yet this corporal eating of Christ's fl●sh, with the Capernaits in Saints jobus sixth Chapter● and this tearing his body with the Communicants teeth, must be understood literally; inasmuch as the words were purposely set down for a formal Recantation: and Bellarmine confesseth, that 
x Nu●●e ●unt exac●iores formul● loquendi, in 〈…〉, quam ●ae 〈◊〉 ●●●nturij qui 〈◊〉 a●jurant. Bellar. li. 〈◊〉 nag. c●. 21. § 〈◊〉.  There are no forms of speech more exact and proper in phrase, concerning the matter of Faith, than such as are used by th●m that abjure heresy. Again, what though B●renger upon the Clergies importunity, through humane frailty, were constrained, For fear of death (as an Historian saith 

B●r●●ga●us ipse prae 〈…〉 mortis lib●os à 〈…〉 ignem proj●●it. papyr. M●ss●n. An●al. ● 235.236.  
〈◊〉 Sco●● liber d● 〈…〉 est 〈…〉 Condil. ve●c●l●●●se apud ●innium ●o. 3.  ) to subscribe● and to burn● both his own book, and Scotus his treatise of the Eucharist, which had led him into that opinion? yet he might still be of the same judgement he was on before. And though he Recanted, yet he●ein he did no more than Saint Pet●r (whose successor the Pope pretends himself to be) in denying his Master; no more, than Queen Mary, who being terrified with her Father's displeasure, wrote him a letter with her owns hand, in which for ever she renounceth the Pope's authority here in England. And though he was driven for the time to retract, yet upon his coming home, he returned to his former Tenet; and as one saith who lived about the same time, 
z Ad vomi●●● 〈…〉 no● 〈…〉. Name in 〈…〉. ●ert. Constantiens. Presb. ad ann. 1083. in Append. ad Herman. Chron. p. 352.  Nec tamen post●à dimisit, af●er that he never changed his opinion. In a word, ●hough Berenger himself were somewhat wavering, yet were his Scholars constant; insomuch that Malmsburiensis a bitter enemy of theirs, saith, that 
a Be●engarius planè quāvi● ipse sententiam correxerit; omnes tamen, quos ex totis terris depravaverat, convertere nequivit. Malmesbur. de gest. Anglor. lib. 3. pag. 114.  Though Berenger retracted, yet they could never reclaim all those, whom he in diverse countries had drawn away. And no marvel, since they leaned not on the weak reed of man's authority, but on God's word which abideth for ever.  

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
Anselmus Laudunensis in his Interlineall Gloss on the Bible, 
b Anselm. Laudun. u●riusque Testamenti scriptura● glosà Interlineali et Marginali ex Patrum scriptis explanavit. Tri●hem. de Scriptor. Eccles.  Composed out of the Father's writings, 
c Glossa Inter●in. in Deut. cap. 4.  expounds that text of Deuteronomy, Formam non vidistis, ye saw no manner of similitude, [Deut. 4.15.] in this sort; Ne scilicet volens imitari sculpendo faceres Idolum tibi, lest that willing to resemble that similitude by engraving thou shouldst set up an Idol to thyself. In the former times, 
d Respondeo magnam quidem esse qua●tionē; utr●m, vel quatenùs, vel quomodè ea qu●e circ● nos aguntur noverint spiritus mortuorum. Aug. in Psa. 108. ●n●●rat. 1  it was a great question, Whether at all, or how far, or after what manner the Spirits of the dead did know the things that concerned us here; and consequently whether they pray for us only 
e Et tamin generalitèr orantibus pro indigenti● supplican●tum A●gust. de c●●a pro mo●t. cap. 16.  in general; and for the particulars, God answereth us according to our several necessities, where, when, and after what manner he pleaseth. Anselmus Laudunensis Interlineall Gloss upon that text; Abraham is ignorant of us, and Irael knoweth us not; (Esay. 63.16.) note●h that Augustine saith, that 
f Augustinus dicit; qui● mortui nesciunt, eti● sancti quid agant vivi, etiam eorum silij. Glossa Interlin. in Es●iae. 63.  The dead, though Saints in heaven, do not know what the living do, no not though they be their own children, of whom in all probability they have a more special care. And indeed Saint Austin in his book Of the care for the dead, makes this inference upon that place of Scripture; that 
g Si tanti Patriarchae quid ergà populum ex his pro●r●atū ageretur, ignorav●runt; quomodo mortu● vivorū●●bus atque actibus cognos●●ndis adjuvandisque misc●ntur. Au●. ibid. c. 13.  If so great Patriarches, as was Abraham knew not what befell the people that came of them; it was no way likely that the dead do intermeddle with the affairs of the living, either to know them, or to further them; and Theophylact gives some reason hereof, saying, 
h 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Theophyl. in 1. ●p. ad Th●ss cap. 3. M S● Cir. in Arc●ivis Biblieth. 〈◊〉 O●on.  Therefore it may be said, that the Saints, both those that lived before, and sin●● Christ's time, do not know all things, and that this is done, that neither the Saints themselves should be too highly conceited, nor others esteem them above that which is meet. And whereas the Romanists repose such confidence's in the intercession of Saints, that they look to receive far greater benefit by th●m, than by their own prayers; Theophylact (tracing Saint 
i Se● the ●i●th Age, Of prayer to Saints.  chrysostom in this very point,) me●ts with this their conceit; Observe (saith he 
k 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Theophyl in Math. cap 15. ) that although the Saints do pray for us, as the Apostles did still for her, (to wit, the woman of Canaan,) yet we praying for ourselves do prevail much more.  
I will close up this point with the testimony of one of our kings of England, William the second. It appeareth by writers, saith 
l Holinshead. Hist. ad ann 1100. pag. 27.  Holinshead out of Eadmerus) that he doubted in many points of the religion then in credit; for he sticked not to protest openly that he believed no Saint could pro●it any man in the Lord's sight; and therefore neither would he, nor any that was wise (as he affirmed) make intercession, either to Peter, or any other for help.   

Of Faith and Merit.  
Theophylact saith, 
m 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Theophyl. in 3. c. ep ad Gal. M S. in Bibl●och Bo●l Oxon.  The Scripture, that is, God himself who gave the Law, hath fore-ordained, that we are justified not by the Law, but by Faith; and again 
n 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Id ibid.  the Apostle having shown how that the Law accurseth, but Faith blesseth, he now showeth; that Faith only justifieth, and not the Law. And Anselm saith, 
o C●rt●●olà fide Abrah●m ●●rtur Deo plac●●sse. Ans●lm● de excellentiâ B. V●●. Mar. c. 3 p. 241.— 〈◊〉 sol●●ide, et grati● accip●●●● remissionem peccato●um Id in 1 Cor. cap. 1. to. 2. pag. 121.  Truly by Faith only was Abraham said to have pleased God, and this was imputed to him for righteousness. Radulphus Arden's saith, and that from the Testimony of Saint Augustine, 
p Test● enim Augustin●, ●olam gratiam suam cororat in nobi● Deus Radulph Ar●ens Do●ini●● 18 post 〈◊〉. Homil. 1.  that God crowneth only his own grace in us; and the same Radulphus, as I find him alleged by D●ctor Usher in his learned Answer to the jesuits Challenge in Ireland, in the point of Merit, (for I could not elsewhere meet with him) saith, 
q Nihil enim aliud quam grat●● 〈◊〉 ●oronat i● no●is D●us; q●i si v●ll●t in 〈◊〉 agerè district●, non ●u●ti●icaretur in consp●ctu 〈…〉 Apos●●lus qui plu●●mnibus l●b ra●it di●it; ●xistimo quo● n●n u●t ●●digne pa●si 〈…〉 que revelabitur in nobis; 〈…〉 R●d A●dens Domi●●●. in S●ptu●ge●. Hon 2.  God crownes nothing else in us but his own grace, who if he should d●ale strictly wi●h us, no man living should be justified in his sight; whereupon the Apostle who laboured more than all, s●ith, I reckon that the sufferings of this time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be re●●●aled in us: therefore this agreement is nothing else but G●ds voluntary promise. In like sort, Occumentus a Greek Scholiast, saith, 
r 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Oecumen. in Rom. 8.18.  We cannot suffer or bring in any thing worthy of the reward that shall be; and our Anselm Archbishop of Canterbury more fully, saying, 
s Si homo mille annis servir●t Deo, etiam ●erv●n●●ssimè; non meritur ex condigno, dimidiam diem ●ss● in regno coe●o●um Anselm● de mensurat. C●ucis. pag. 188. Colon. 1612.  If a man should serve God a thousand years, and that most fervently, he should not deserve of Condignity, to be half a day in the kingdom of heaven. Besides it it evident that this doctrine of freegrace was the received doctrine of the Church, both abroad, and here in England shortly after the Conquest; and for diverse ages after taught and believed both of Priest and people: for there was a certain form of Instruction, appointed to be given unto men upon their deathbeds, to prepare them thereunto, and to lead them unto Christ. It was put into question and Answer, was commonly to be had in their Libraries, and thought (for so saith Cardinal Hosius expressly 
t Sed ●t Anselmus Archiep. Cantuar. Inter●ogationes quasdam praescripsisse dicitur infirmis in extr●mis cons●●●u●is. Hosi●s in Confession Pe●icoviensi. cap. 73. ) to be made by Anselm Archbishop of Canterbury. Amongst the questions propounded to the sick-man, this was one, 
u ●●edis te ●on poss● nisi per mortem ●hristi serva●i? respon●et infi●mus● eti●m tùm illi dic●tur age ergo d●m superest in te anima in ●ac sola mort● fiduciam 〈◊〉 constitue, in null● 〈◊〉 fidu●iam ha●e ●u●● morti te totum commit, ●a● solà ●e totum ●●t●g●. Si dixerit tibi q●òd meru●sti damnationem, d●; Domine mort●m 〈◊〉 I●su Christi obtendo in●er me, ●t mala merita mea, ips●●sque m●ritum offero pro me●●to, quod ego debuiss●m hab●re n●c habeo. Id. ibid.  Do●st thou believe that thou canst not be saved, but by the death of Christ? whereunto he when he hath made answer affirmatively, he is presently directed to make use thereof in this manner: Go to therefore, as long as thy soul remains in thee; place thy whole confidence in this death only; have confidence in no other thing; commit thyself wholly to this death, with this alone cover thyself wholly. If he say unto thee that thou hast deserved damnation's say, Lord I set the death of our Lord jesus Christ, betwixt m● & my bad merits; and I offer his merit in s●eed of the merit which I ought to have, but yet have not. Here was a Cordial for a sick-soule in extr●mis, more sovereign than their extreme unction, or Holy-water-sprinkle; than any Ind●lgences, Re●●kques, or Images, yet their quesy stomaches cannot now digest this Catholicon: but have called S. anselm's visitation into the Spanish inquisition; and there by their expurgatory Index, set out by Cardinal Quiroga, have commanded these Interrogatories to b● blotted out: 
x Ex libro qui ins●●ibitur Ordo Baptizand● cum modo visitandi impr●sso Vene●ijs anno 1575.; è ●olio 34. pau●o post medium; Deleant●● illa verba: Credis quod D. noster ●esus Christus pro nost●a salute mortuus sit● et quòd ●x p●oprijs meri●is, vel al●o modo null possit salvari, nisi merito p●ss●onis ejus? Ind. Expurgat. per Quirog. Mad●it. 1584.  Dost thou believe to come to glory, not by thine own merits, but by the virtue and merit of the passion of our Lord jesus Christ? and, Dost thou believe that our Lord jesus Christ did dye for our salvation; and that none can be saved by his own merits, or by any other means, but by the merit of his passion? whereby we may observe (saith our learned and laborious Bishop 
y Bishop Vsher● Answer to the jesuit. Title of Merits. pa. 569.  Usher) how late it is since our Romanists in this main and most substantial point (which is the very foundation of all our Comfort) have most shamefully departed from the Faith of their forefathers.     

THE TWELFTH CENTURIE, from the year one thousand one hundred, to one thousand two hundred.  

PAPIST.  
YOu said that Satan was loosed in the former ages, was he bound in this?   

PROTESTANT.  
In this age he was mainly kerbed by the professors commonly called Waldenses. There was also in England in the time of Henry the first, (for his knowledge surnamed Beau-clerke, or fine scholar) great contention touching investitures, or the collation of Bishoprickes. When Thurstan elect Archbishop of York, received his consecration from the Pope, 
a Turstanus à Papa consecratur, quod ut Regi Anglorum innotuit, omnem ci locum su●e dominationi● interdixit. Math. Paris. ad an. 1119. in Histor. majore.  the King understanding thereof, forbade him to come within his Kingdoms.  
This contention between the Crown and the Mitre was ho●ly pursued between King Henry the second, and Thomas Becket Archbishop of Canterbury; it was partly occasioned 
b Huic controversiae praestitit ●ccasionem Philip. de Broc. Cano●●cu● Bedford, qui tractus in causam propter Homici●ium, in R●gis justiciarium verbum protulit contumeliosum. id. ibid. in Henr. 2 a● An 1164.  by one Philip de Broc Canon of Bedford, who being questioned for a murder, he used some reproachful speeches to the King's justices, for which he was censured: and I find, that in these days (as the Monk of N●wborrough who then lived, saith 
c ● Iu●icibus intim●tum ●st, quod multa contrà disciplinam publicam, scilic●● furt●, rapinae, homicidia à Clericis s●epius committerentur, ad quos scilicet Laicae non posset jurisdictionis vigor extendi. Gul Nubrigens. ●ib. 2. Cap. 16. p. 137. ) the abuses of Church men were grown to a great height, insomuch as the judges complained in the King's presence, that there were many robberies and rapes, and murders, to the number of an hundred committed within the Realm, by Ecclesiastical persons (upon presumption of exemption from the censure of the laws.)  
Herewith the King was so highly displeased, that he required that justice should be ministered alike unto all sine delectu, saith Novoburgensis 
Rege, ma●efactore●● si●e d●l●ctu exterminari jub●●ti. Gul. Nov●burg. quo supra. , and Roger Hoveden saith, 
Rex v●lebat Presbiteros, & alios ecclesie R●●●●res si c●●pre●e●si fu●ssent in la●r● ciano, vel murdra, vel felo●id, vel in hi●● similibu, d●ce●e ad Secularia examina● & pu●ire, sicu● & La●cum. contr● quod Arch●episcop●● du●h●t etc. Rog Hoveden. Annal. part. po●ter. & Nubrig. ad an. 1164.  the King's pleasure was that such of the Clergy as were taken in any murder, robbery, or felony, should be tried and adjudged in his temporal Courts, as Laymen were; but the Archbishop would have the Clergy (so offending) tried only in the spiritual Courts, and by men of their own coat; who, if they were convict, should at first only be deprived of their benefices, but if they should again be guilty of the like, they should be adjudged at the King's pleasure.  
But the King stood upon his Leges Avitae, his Grandfather's laws and customs; which were indeed the ancient laws of this realm, not first enacted by the Conqueror, but only confirmed by him, and received from his predecessors, Edgar the peaceable, and Alfred the learned Prince, and accordingly the King in a great assembly at Clarendon, 
Ap●d Clarend●● facta est Recognitio consuetudinum & libertatum antecess●●um s●orum, Regis Hen●ici ●vi sui. Math. Paris. ad an 1164.  confirmed the foresaid laws of his Grandfather, and enacted: that none should appeal to the Sea of Rome, for any cause whatsoever, without the King's Licence.  
That it should not be lawful for any Archbishop or Bishop to depart the Realm, and repair to the Pope, upon his summons, without the King's licence.  
That Clerk's criminous, should be tried before secular judges.  
By this we find two main branches, of Papal jurisdiction, 
Bellarm. de Romano Pontifice lib. 2. cap. 21.  to wit, Appeals, and the exemption of Clergy men from being tried in causes criminal, before Christian Magistrates, strongly opposed by the King, and the State.   

PA●.  
Name your men for this age?   

PROT.  
There were diverse worthies who flourished in this age, namely, Hugo de Sancto victore, a second Augustine (as Trithemius calleth 
h V●●●t alter Augustin●s. Trithem, de Script. ●celes.  him) Zacharias Chrysopolitanus, Saint Bernard Abbot of Clarevaux; Robert Abbot of Duits in Germany, usually called Rupertus Tuitiensis: Peter Abbot of Clugni, usually called Petrus Cluniacensis. ●oachim Abbot of Courace, of the order of the Cistertians, a man very famous in this age, and thought to have had a prophetical spirit 
i Scio autem & prophetic d●no d●●atum fuisse passu● per●rebuisse. Possevin. in Apparatu. to. 1 pag. 807. , Petrus Blesensis, Peter of Bloix, Archdeacon of Bath, and Chancellor of Canterbury, a man for his pleasant wit and learning in great favour with 
k Propter ●●uditionem & vita honestatem ap●d principes & episcopos in ●●ecio habitus. Tri●hem.  the Princes, and Prelates of his time; and of inward acquaintance with john of Salisbury, Bishop of Chartres.  
Now also the Schoolmen began to arise, of whom Peter Lombard, Master of the Sentences, was the first, who was afterward made Bishop of Paris; Aventine saith 
l Petrus Lombardus 5. Sanctae philosophiae verit●●tem, fontemque purissimum caeno quaestionum, rivulis opinionum conturbav●●. Aventi●. Annal. lib. 6. , he hath heard of his Masters, james Faber of Estaples, and jodocus Clichtoveus, above a thousand times, that this Lombard had troubled the pure fountain of Divinity, with muddy questions, and whole rivers of opinions: and this (saith he) experience doth sufficiently teach us, if we be not wilfully blind. And yet some of their distinctions, being purged from barbarism, and clearly applied to the point in question, may be of good use: especially, when as according to the proverb, we can eat the Dates, and cast out their stones, and herein Zanchius and junius were excellent. It is reported 
m A qu●bus●●am praedicatur in populis hos tr●s fuisse german●s ex adulteri●●ato●— de hoc tamen doleas, quod non potes dolere, author vitae Gratiani in fine operum ejus.  that Lombard, Gratian, and Comestor, (three pillars of Popery, Gratian for the Cannon law, Comestor for the history of the Church, and Lombard for Schoole-divinity) were three bastards, borne of one woman, who in her sickness coming to confession could not be drawn to be sorry for this her incontinuencie, but thought she had done well in bearing those great lights of the Church; whereunto her confessor replied, that, that was not hers, but God's gift they proved such great scholar; however, she was to be sorry for her fault, and be heartily sorry for this, that she could not sorrow and lament as she should. One of these brothers was called Comestor 
n 
Cog●omento Comestor, quod Script●ra●um aut●o●t●t●s in suis op●s●ulis ●r●o●ius allegando, quasi ●● v●n●●em memory man●u●iri●. T●ithem. de Scriptor. Eccles●●●.  
P●●us ●r●w quem Patient g●●, 〈◊〉 Come●●or, Nunc 〈◊〉—   as it were booke-eater, because he was such a Helluo librorum, a devourer of books, as if book learning had been his ordinary food, and repast: he had the Bible so perfectly by heart, as though he had swallowed it.  
Now what opinion was held of the Papacy, may be seen by the testimonies of such of their own, as were famous in this age. johannes Sarisburiensis, had a conference with Pope Adrian the fourth, called Nicholas Breake-speare, an English man, which himself hath l●ft us in writing. I remember (saith he 
Si●●t ●nim diceb●tur ● 〈◊〉 Roma●● Ecc●●si●, 〈…〉 M. 15. 〈…〉 Colon. 1622. ) I we●t ●nto Apulia to visit Pope Adrian the fourth, who admitted me into great familiarity, and inquired of me, what opinion men had of him, and of the Roman Church; I plainly laid open unto him the evil words I had heard in d●vers Provinces, for thus it is said; The Church of Rome, whic● is mother of all Churches, behaveth herself towards others, not as a mother, but as a stepdame: The Pope (saith he) laughed at it, and thanked me for my liberty of speech. The same john of Sarisbury saith 
〈…〉 p. 4●4. , that th●y wholly apply themselves unto wickedness, that they may seem Concilium vanitatis, a Council of vanity, the wicked Synagogue of the Gentiles, ecclesia malignantium, the Church of the envious, and evil doers. Peter of Bloyes, describeth unto us, in the person of an Official, the fashion and manner of the Church of Rome. For as much (saith he 
Pr●p●●●●e 〈…〉 & de medio Babylonis 〈…〉 Epist, 25. p. 52. ) as I love thee in the Bowels of jesus Christ, I thought good to exhort thee with wholesome admonitions, that thou in time depart from Vr of the Chaldees, & from the midst of Babylon, and leave the mystery of this most damnable stewardship.  
Richard the first, King of England, and Philip the second of France, being on their voyage to jerusalem, and coming into Sicily, and there hearing of Abbot joachim (who was thought to have the gift of Prophe●ie) they desired to know of him what success they should have in this their expedition: the Abbot (saith Paulus Aemilius) 
r I●u●os eos, sed par●● profectures respondit— nimis verus vates joachimus extitit. Paul. A●myl. in Philip. 2. lib. 6. p. 175.  answered, they should not then recover it: and therein he proved too true a Prophet: besides this they heard him expound the vision of Saint john in the Apocalypse, touching the Church's afflictions, and Antichrist who (as he said 
s Explicans (joachim) haec verba Apocalyp. unus illorum nondum venit, scilicet Antichristus, de isto Antichristo dicit idem joachim; quod jam na●us ●st in c●vitate Romaná & in sede Apostolica sublim●●itur. Roger Ho●ed Annal. part. poster. in Rich. 1. p. 681. ) was then borne, and in the City of Rome, and should be advanced in the Sea Apostolic, of whom the Apostle said, He should extol himself above all that is called God: and that the seven Crowns, were the Kings of the earth, that obeyed him; but in the end, the Lord should consume him with the spirit of his mouth.  
I know indeed that Parsons saith, 
t Three conversions of England. part. 1. chapt. 10. nu. 22.  the Pope censured him for certain fond Prophecies, as also some errors about the Trinity. Extravag. de Trinit. But others 
* Martin Luther.  have made his just Apology and cleared him from that imputation. Besides, all is not Gospel that is set down in the Pope's decretals, or Extravagants, no not in their own account. With this of the Prophet joachim, agreeth that of the Prophetess Saint Hildegard, foretelling the utter extinguishing of Religion amongst them of the Romish order. The Roman Empire (saith this Prophecy 
u Hildegardis Prophetia exta● apud Albert. Staden sem post ann. 1149. a pag. 169. ad 178. as is witnessed by Doctor Crakanthorpe in his treatise of the Pope's temporal Monarchy. ) shall decay, and those Princes who did cleave unto it, shall separate themselves from it, and be no longer subject to it: this Empire (in the West) thus decaying without hope of repairing, the Mitre of the Apostolic honour shall also perish, 
x Tunc Insula Apostolici honoris dividetur, quia nulla religio in Apostolico ordine inve●ietur. Hildegard. in C●tal, test. ver●●. lib. 15.  because neither Princes, nor other shall find ullam religionem, any religion in the Apostolic order, that is, in the Popes; therefore they shall take away the honour of the Pope; who shall scarc●●●ve Rome & a few bordering places, under his Mitre. All worldly Princes, (saith the same Nun 
y The prophecy of Hildegard the Nun. ) as also the common people, shall fall upon your Priests, which hitherto have abused me; they shall take away your substance and riches, the holy Church is polluted by them.  
Now also lived Peter Bruis, and his disciple Henry a monk of Tholouse: who for diverse years together preached the word of God about Tholouse, and in the end, ●eter was taken & 
z Sect autem illius origi●●● p●ul● alt●us ●epetam; P●t●●● cognoment●●●●sus, 〈…〉 Co●●●icorpus non e●●e, preces ad Deum pro 〈…〉 ●ocu●sset 〈◊〉 atque ig●e ●r●matus 〈…〉 Annal. Franc. in Philippo A●●●usto. p. 268.  burned. Papirius Massonius deriveth the pedigree of the Waldenses from these two: he saith further that they preached against transubstantiation, or the carnal presence: the adoration of the cross, as also against praying for the dead, and other tenets of the Roman Church: Saint Bernard saith, 
a 〈…〉 bapti●amus infants, quod ●●●mus ●●● mortuis, quod sanc●●●um 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Bernard. in Cant ●●●m. 6●.  they denied purgatory, and invocation of Saints: and the same Bernard more credulous than reason required, reproveth them, that like the Manichees they condemned the use of matrimony, and of flesh, and denied also baptism to infants: but especially 
b Bern. epist. 24●.  against Henry he objecteth the keeping of a Concubine, and playing at dice,  
It is great pity that their own books are made away, so that we are constrained to pick out their life and doctrine from the writings of their professed adversaries, whose report may justly be suspected: for even in like manner we read in Tertullian, 
c 〈…〉 & 〈…〉 Apologet. c●p. 7  that monstrous opinions and crimes were imputed to the first Christians. And yet Bernard in the mean time saith 
d 〈◊〉 sunt ●abitas ●● 〈◊〉, qui boni videri, non esse; ●●li non videre, sed esse volunt. Bern. in Cant. serm. 66.  they are sheep in habit, and these are they that would seem good, and yet are not; wicked, and yet would not seem so. It must needs be then, that their outward conversation was good: it is also confessed 
e Non modò patientes sed & 〈◊〉, ut videbatur duceren●r ●d mortem. id. ibid. , that their disciples went cheerfully to the fire, and constantly suffered all extremities for the doctrine of their faith; now how could this agree with a dissolute life and doctrine?  
Petrus Cluniacensis (a bitter adversary of theirs) having charged 
f Petr. Clumacens. lib. 1. epist. 1. & 2.  them with diverse errors, seemeth to have perceived that he had done them wrong, for he addeth these words: 
g Sed quia eum ita sentire vel praedicare nondum mihi plenè fides facta est, dissert r●spensionem; quousque & horum qu●e d●cuntur indubi●m habeam certitudinem. id. epist. 1.  But because I am not yet fully assured that they think and preach so, I will defer my answer until I have undoubted certainty of that they say. They were favoured both of Clergy and Laiety, and followed with such multitudes, that the Temples (saith Bernard 
h Basilicae sine plebibus, pleb●s sine Sacerdote, Sacerdotes sine debitâ reverentià sunt. Bern. in ep. 240. ) remained without people, the people without Priests, and Priests without due reverence; yea Saint Bernard himself was glad to write to Hildefonsus' Earl of Saint Giles, 
i Bernardi Epistola 24●. ad Hildefons. Comit. S. Aegidij.  (in whose territories they preached) to desire the Earl that he would no longer protect them: 
k Fef●llisse priores, errare posteros. id. ibid.  the argument brought against these professors, was the same with that which is used at this day: Have our Fathers then erred so long a time? are so many men deceived? have these only the truth? And so I come to speak of the Waldenses.   

PAP.  
What say you to these Waldenses? were they men of a good life, and sound doctrine? had they any visible congregations? had they any lawful ordination and succession? were they of any long standing, and continuance? and if they had; can you show that they agreed with you in point of faith and Religion?   

PROT.  
The Waldenses began to show themselves about the year 1160, saith Gretser the jesuit, 
l Circa annum Domini 1160 ortus ●st Petrus Waldus. jacob. Gr●tser. Prolegom. in script. edit. contr. Waldenses.  their adversaries gave them sundry names; sometimes from the place of their abode they were called, Pauperes de Lugduno, poor men of Lions a City in France; sometime Albigenses from the City and Country of Albi; and usually Waldenses, of their principal teacher, Petrus Waldus.  
This Waldus was a rich Merchant, and Citizen of Lions in France, who seeing one fall down dead in the street, made so good use of this spectacle of man's frailty, as that he forthwith began to repent, and change his former course of life; giving alms to the poor: and betaking him to the study of the Scripture, he profited so well therein; that he translated diverse parts thereof out of Latin into the French tongue, and taught 
m Cun. a●●em esset aliquantuluns ●●tera●●s, Novi Testame●ts t●xtum docuit cos vulgariter. Rain●rius contr. H●r●t. cap. 5.  the same in the Mother tongue, to the people that frequently resorted to him.  
This doing displeased the Romish Prelates, who were like the dog under the manger, that can neither himself eat the hay, nor yet will let the horse eat it; so that they raised persecution against Waldus and his followers; and this persecution was the occasion to spread their doctrine farther abroad, not only over France, but almost over all the parts of Europe.  
Now what the Waldenses were, let one of their Inquisitours speak: Rainerius (whose book Gretser the jesuit lately set out among other writers against the Waldenses) saith; 
quam●co●●starum ●co●●starum: & hoc 〈◊〉 de causis, p●ima est qui● e●t Di●tur●ior, aliqui e●●●m dicunt, quod d●●auit à ●●mpore Syluestri; aliqui à t●mpore Apostol●rum. Se●●●ula, quiaest G●neralior, ●●re enim nulla est terra, i● qua haec secta non sit. Ter●ia, quia ●um omnes aliae secte imman●ate blasphemta●um in Deum, audientib●●●●●rorem inducunt, h●c magnam ●●bet speciem pretat●, 〈◊〉 coram homnibus just 〈◊〉, & bene omnia de 〈◊〉 credent, & omnes 〈◊〉 qui in Symbolo con●●●●tor; solu●mo●o Roma●●● Eccles●● blasphemant & ●l●rum, cui mult● t●d● 〈◊〉 ●acili● est ad 〈◊〉. Rame●. contr. 〈◊〉. c. 4.  Amongst all Sects, which are or have formerly been, none is more pernicious to the Church than that of the Leonists. First, because it continued longer than any other, for some say it hath lasted ever since Pope Silvester; others say, ever since the Apostles. Secondly, because no Sect is more general all than this, for there is scarce any Country, in which it is not found. Thirdly, whereas other Sects deter men with their horrible blasphemies, this Sect of the Leonists, maketh a great show of godliness, because they live righteously before men, and believe all things rightly touching ●od, and concerning all other Articles of the Creed: only they blaspheme the Roman Church and Clergy, in which thing the Laity is forward to give credit unto them.   

PAP.  
Parsons the jesuit, 
Pars●ns three Conversions part 2. chap. 10, § 26, 27, ●nd ibid. the third part. chap. 3, numb. 12.  and others charge the Waldenses with diverse errors and enormities; so that howsoever in some points they agreed with the Protestants, yet they mainly differed from them in other; so that they cannot both belong to one and the same Church?   

PROT.  
The learned on our sides 
p 
D. jacob. Vesserius de Christian. eccl●s. succession's & statu. cap. 6. § 20. ad finem.  
The History of the Waldenses, book 1 chap. 4.  
Master Cade● justification of the Church of England. lib. 2. cap. 1. sect. 3. § 4.  
The first Article●   have notably cleared the Waldenses from such foul imputations.  

The first Article Objected.  
Parson's saith, they held that when the flesh doth burn, that all conjunction with man or woman is lawful without distinction. The three Conversions, the 3 part. chap. 3, nu. 12.   

Answer.  
Indeed many have borne false witness against them, but their witness do not agree together 
q Mark 14.56. .  
I know this is objected by Parsons and others; and yet Reinerius who was one of their Inquisitors, said of them (as is already alleged) that they made a great show of Godliness and lived righteously before men, and believed all things rightly touching God, and concerning all other Articles of the Creed. Again, Casti sunt Leonistae; the Leonist's live chastely: and again, Quae libet naturâ turpia devitant: They avoid whatsoever is naturally dishonest.  
Claudius' Seisselius Archbishop of Turin, a man in great credit under Lewes the twelfth, King of France; although he had written a book expressly against the Waldenses, yet he thus far cleareth them saying; 
r No●nihil etiam ad Valdensium con●ir●andam tolerandamque sectam consert, quod praeter haec (quae contrà fidem r●ligionemque nostram assumu●t, in reliquis ●erme puriorem quam caeteri Christiani vitam agunt; non enim ni●i coacti iurant, ●aroque nomen Dei in vanum pros●runt, promissaque sua bon●fide imp●ent Claud. Seissel advers. sectam Valdens. pag 9  that it makes much for the confirmation and toleration of that profession, that (setting aside differences in point of Faith) in other things they well-nigh lead a more godly life than other Christians; for they swear not unless they he constrained, they seldom take the name of the Lord in vain, and they are very careful to keep their promise. When some of the Cardinals, and Prelates accused the remainders of the Waldenses in Merindol and Cabriers, that they were Heretics, sorcerers, and incestuous persons, and thereupon moved that good King Lewis the twelfth to root them out: the Waldenses having notice hereof, sent their Deputies to his Majesty to declare unto him their innocence; whereupon the Prelates were instant upon the King, not to give such Heretics any access or audience: 
s T●m Rex; ●tiamsi, inquit, 〈◊〉 Turc●m aut d●abolum bell●m suscipiendum esset, eoc tamen p●ius a●dire vell●m Wese●be●ij oratio de ●aldens. pag. 418. ●xtat in joach. Ca●●r●●ij Historie narratione de Frat●●●● ort●odexo●●m ecclesijs in Bohemi● etc.  but the King answered, that if he were to make war against the Turk, he would first of all hear him: whereupon the King sent master Adam Fume his Master of Requests, and one Doctor Parvi his confessor, to search and inquire both into their life and religion: the Commissioners accordingly visited those places, and upon their return related to the King what they had found, namely: that 
t 〈◊〉 ad Regem re●erunt, ill● i● locis homines baptizari. Articulos fidei & Decalogum doceri. Dominicos d●● religiose coli, Dei ver bum exponi, venes●i● & s●upra apud ●os rulla esse. Hic au●itis Rex 〈◊〉 ●●urando addito: me, inquit, & caetero populo me● Cat●olico m●●●ores 〈◊〉 viri sunt. 〈◊〉. in orat. de Valdens. ap●d joach. Camerar. pag. 419.  Infants were baptised, the Articles of faith were taught, the Lords Prayer, the ten Commandments, the Lords day observed, the Word of God Preached, and no show of wickedness or fornication to be perceived amongst them, 
u C●terum se in ipsorum templis, neque Imagines, n●que ornaments 〈◊〉 ulla 〈◊〉. ibid.  only they found not any Images in their Churches, nor any ornaments belonging to the Mass.  
The King hearing this report of the Commissioners, said (and he bound it with an oath) that they were better men than he, or his people; better than himself, and the rest of his subjects.  
And thus we have cleared the Waldenses from Parsons his first imputation: a foul slander indeed, but yet such as we find 
x Tertulli●n in Apologet. cap. 7. and 〈◊〉 his wi●ked Or●●ion in Minutius Felix hi● Octavius.  was cast upon the ancient Christians, as well as upon them: and most unjustly and untruly upon both of them.   

Object.  

The 2 and 3 Articles objected.  They held, that it was not lawful for Christians to swear at all, for any cause whatsoever, because it is written, Do not swear, Matthew 5. james 5. They held also that the magistrate ought not to condemn any to death, because it is written, judge not, Matthew chap. 7. Luke chap. 6. Parsons, loco citato.   

Answer.  
Claudius' Seissel (as before is alleged) saith indeed that they do not swear unless they be constrained; belike then being lawfully called they refuse not to swear in judgement: in trivial matters they would not swear rashly, according whereunto they alleged our Saviour's precept; beside, they affirm, 
y In their book entitled, the Spiritual Almanac, in the third Comment. cited by the History of the Waldenses, book 1. chap 4.  that there are lawful oaths, tending to the honour of God, and their Neighbours good, and they allege that place in the sixth to the Hebrews, 16. that an oath for confirmation to them is an end of all strife.  
The other cavil arose upon their complaining, that the magistrates delivered them to death, without any other knowledge of the cause, than the bare report of their Inquisitors, Priests, and Friars, who were parties, and their professed enemies, otherwise the Waldensian doctrine was, 
z In their book entitled, the Light of the treasure of faith fol. 214. cited ibid.  that they were not to suffer the Malefactor to live.   

Object.  
They hold that the Apostles Creed is to be contemned, and no account at all to be made of it, and that no other prayer is to be used, but only the Pater Noster, set down in Scripture. Parsons quò suprà.   

Answer.  
This is an idle cavil; for Reinerius hath already told us, that they believe all the Articles contained in the Creed: beside, in their books they have very good and Catholic expositions of the Creed. Do these men then slight the Creed? They do not indeed hold the Creed to be a prayer, no more do they that of the Angels Hail to Mary they hold it to be a salutation, and no direct invocation, as Claudius Seissel saith 
a Salutationem Angelicam ad Dei genitricem fidelibus frequent●ndam ●on c●nse●t, quasi i●a orationis forma● non habeat, sed salutationis● Claud. Seissel. c. Sectam. Vald. pag. 54.  it follows not hence, because they hold not the Creed, nor the Angelical Salutation to be any direct prayer, that therefore they neglect the Creed. The other allegation is as idle, for their own writers Reyner, and others record diverse other of their prayers, as for grace before meat, this: He that blessed the five Barley loaves, and two Fishes, in the Desert to his Disciples, bless this table unto us; and after meat, thus: God which hath given us corporal food, give us also spiritual life.   

Object.  
They held, that the power of consecrating the body of Christ, and of hearing confessions was left by Christ, not only to priests, but also to lay-men if they be just. Parson's ibid.   

Answer.  
The first part of this Article they held not: but rather the contrary, that neither Priests nor Laikes could consecrate the body of Christ: for Reinerius saith; 
b Reinerius in Su●●a de Catharis & Leonistis.  They do not believe the Sacrament to be the true body and blood of Christ, but the bread consecrated is called in a certain figure the body of Christ, as it is said, the Rock was Christ, and the like. For the second, they said truly, and we hold, that we are to confess our faults one to another, james 5, 16. yea though they be Lay-people, so they be godly and discreet, and able to counsel and comfort us: but especially to the discreet and learned Minister of God's Word, to receive from him Ghostly comfort, counsel, and upon our hearty repentance, absolution.   

Object.  
They held, that no Priests must have any living at all, but must live on alms: and that no Bishops or other dignity is to be admitted in the Clergy, but that all must be equal. Parson's ibid.   

Answer.  
That their Ministers may not lawfully take and enjoy livings, or that it was sin so to do; they taught not, but were sorry 
c So they profess in their Answer: Ad literam Augustini Olmucensis, Anno 1508. et pleni●s in scripto edito 1572.  they had not sufficient stayed livings for them, whereby they might have more time to their studies, and greater opportunity to instruct them with necessary doctrine and knowledged but they were not ashamed of their Ministers that were content to work with their hands to get their living, as the Apostles had done before them.  
So that if they spoke aught that looked that way, it was only pro hic & nunc, as their case then stood: they were now both pastors and people thrust out of their own Country, and goods, and glad to live upon others benevolence and collections, which haply made them call them, The poor men of Lions.  
Howsoever, they were so far from liking the course of the begging Friars, or vowing of voluntary poverty, as that they held the order of begging Friers● to be the Devil's invention 
d Mendicantium Religionem malos D●●mones invenisse. Aeneas Silvius Histor. Bohem. Cap. 35. ; and Monkish vows to be vain, as occasioning foul and fearful lusts 
e Monasticam vitam Ecc●●siae sentinam a● Plutonium esse: vana illius vot●, nec nisi saedis pu●ror●ma●●ribus servi●ntia. Thuan. Histor. Lib. 6. ad An. 1550. p. 513. . If they said that all Ministers must be equal, they meant in Orders, but not in jurisdiction, for they allowed Deacons, Presbyters, and Bishops, as Guido Carmelita observes.   

Object.  
They held, that Mass is to be said once only every year: to wit, upon Maundy Thursday, when the Sacrament was instituted, and the Apostles made Priests. For that Christ said, Do this in remembrance of me; to wit, (say they) that which he did at the time, Luke 22. 1 Cor. 11. Parson's ibid.   

Answer.  
Parson's pret●nds to bring no Articles but such as all Authors charge the Waldenses withal, and yet brings this, which no Author imputes to them, but only Guido Carmelita; and Alphonsus de Castro wonders 
Apu●●ull●●m ali●m ex his qui Valdensium errores 〈◊〉, inveni● u●●am de ha●●e sac●am mentionem. Alphonsus de Castro lib 6. ad●. Haer●se●. tit. de Eucharist. ● Nova●●●.  where Guido found it. Aeneas Sylius mentions it not, but contrarily saith, 
g A●n. Silvius Hist. B●h●m. cap. 35.  they hold that the Priest may consecrate in any place, and at any time, and minister to them that require it.   

Object.  
They held, that the words of Consecration must be no other, but only the Pater Noster, seven times said over the bread. Parson's ibid.   

Answer.  
Alponsus de Castro saith. 
h Alphons. de castro lib 6. a●u. Ha●r. ● tertia Haer. tit. de ●uchar.  It is possible that the Waldenses might have had this fancy, but not probable, for only Guido Carmelita saith it: but Aeneas Silvius, a far more diligent man, and of better judgement, mentions it not: neither Antoninus nor Bernard of Lutzenburg, (though they all professedly reckon up their errors) but rather they say the contrary: that the Waldenses held, that the Priest might consecrate in every place, and time, and minister to them that desire it: and su●ficere ut verba Sacramentalia tantùm dicat; that it was sufficient to speak the Sacramental words only.   


The 10. 〈◊〉 objected.  Object.  
Prateolus saith 
i Du● credebant cum Mani●●●ais principia, Deum viz. bonu● & malum, ●d est Dia●●lum, quem dicebant omnia ●●eare corpora, sicut Deum 〈◊〉 omnes animas● Corporum Resurrectionem nega●●●●. ●ullum in●ernum pu●antes Prateol. l. 1. Elench. Haere●. li● A. Albigens. , that the Albingenses held with the Manichees, that there were two prime beginnings, or Authors of things, that is; one good God, the Creator of good: and one bad, that is, the Devil, the creator of evil; and that they denied the resurrection, and thought there was no Hell.   

Answer.  
Friar Reyner their inquisitor saith, they believed all the Articles contained in the Creed. And for the other imputation, he that shall but read the confession of their faith tendered to Ladislaus King of Hungary, and extant in Orthinus Gratius 
k Confessio Fratrum Waldensium ad Vladi●●aum Hungariae Regem ●issa● extat in Fa●●iculo re●um exp●tend & ●ugiend p. 85. , will easily clear them thereof. This cavil is thought to be grounded upon that assertion of the Waldenses, that the Pope had no authority over the Kings and Princes of the earth, who depend immediately upon God alone; and from hence they took occasion to call them Manichees, as appointing two prime or chief originals & jurisdictions: and it may seem to be taken out of the extravagants of Pope Boniface the eight, who subjecting the authority of Emperors, 
l Quicunq●e h●i● potesta●● resistit, Dei ordinationi r●●ist●t, ni●i duo (aunt Manicheus) ●i●git esse principi●. De Maj●rit. & obed. Ca●● Vnam Sanctam.  saith of his own, Whosoever resists this power, resists the ordinance of God, unless with the Manichee he devise du● principia, two prime originals of things. Now against this imputation, the Waldenses profess, 
m In the book of the Treasure of Faith, the second Article ●●ted by the History of the Waldeuses, book 1. chap. 4. p. 19  that they believe that the holy Trinity hath created all things visible and invisible, and that he is Lord of things celestial, terrestrial, and infernal, as it is said it Saint john, All things were made by him, and without him nothing is made.  
Besides it might be that the Manichees, some of them living amongst the Waldenses, such as spited the Waldenses, by one common term nicknamed them and called them Manich●e●s and Catharists: as sometimes the Donatists, and called 
n Or●●s est conflictus de C●tho●ici nomine & Donatist●rum & C●●ili●●ist●rum. Augustin. Bru●●cul. Collation. cum Donatist. cap. 4. Tom. 7.  the Christians and Catholics Caecilianists. By this that hath been said it appears, that there is not any such odds between the Waldenses and us, as Parsons and Prateolus have given out; but that for substance of Religion they agree with us; and accordingly Orthuinus Gratius saith 
Non multum alicub● dissentit ab i●● q●● vu●go tradun●ur à quibusda● ut ab illi● accepisse videri posi●nt. Or●●uin. Gr●ti●s in Fas●is rerum expetende● & fugiend. de professione Fratrum Waldenstum.  of the confession of the Waldensian faith presented to the King of Hungary, that in some points it little differeth from that which is delivered by others (he meaneth our Protestant professors) so as they may see me to have received it from them; and Le Sieur la Popeli ne'er in his history of France speaks more fully, namely 
p Doctrinam suam, o● c● qua● body Protestants ample●●untur parum different●m, non per Gallam sol●m tot●m● sed ●●iam p●●●●nnes penè Europae oras dissem●ârunt. Popliner Hist. Fr●n●. L●b. 1. fol. 7. b. edit. Anno 1581. ; that the Waldenses and Albigenses, about the year 1100 and the succeeding times, spread their doctrine (parum differentem) little differing from that which the Protestants now embrace.   

Object.  
It seemeth you stick close to the Waldenses, and yet your jewel casts them off, saying; 
q jewels Apology. cap. 7 〈◊〉. 3.  they are none of ours?   

Answer.  
The passage in B. jewel is this; 
r B. jewel ibid.  Master Harding saith that Hus, Hierome of Prage, Wickleffe, Almarick, Abailard, the apostolics, Petrobrussians, Berengarians, Waldenses, Albingenses, Image-breakes, and such like, ever found fault with the Church in their time.  
Whereunto B. jewel replieth in these terms: of Abailard, and Almarick, and certain other your strange names, if they have taught any thing contrary to the truth of God, we have no skill, they are none of ours; of john Hus, Hierome of Prague, and Berengarus: and other like virtuous learned men, we have no cause to be ashamed: their doctrine standeth still, and increaseth daily, because it is of God.  
And elsewhere he saith, 
s 〈◊〉. ●ap. 2. Divis. 1  As for john Wickleffe, john Husse, Valdo, and the rest, for aught we know, and I believe setting malice aside, for ought you know, they were godly men; their greatest heresy was this: that they complained of the dissolute lives of the Clergy, of worshipping of Images, of the tyrannical pride of the Pope, of Pardons, pilgrimages, and purgatory, and that they wished a reformation of the Church: we succeed not them, nor bear their names; we succeed him whose word we profess. By this it appears what Bishop jewel thought of Wald● and others: and if he had cast off the Waldenses as none of ours, it might be imputed to this, that he beheld them as their persecutors painted them out with spots of Manicheisme, and other vile errors.    

PAP.  
If the Waldenses were free from such errors as Parsons, and others have taxed them withal: how came it to pass that such gross opinions were fathered on them?   

PROT.  
You say well, they be fathered on them, even as sometime a light housewife lays her burden at an honest man's door: but themselves never begat such strange opinions; for the Waldenses in their confessions say 
t Harum ●riminatio●●● quibus crebrò culpamu●, nihil consci● sumus. Fasci● rerum expetend. et fugiend. p. 85● , That they were nothing at all guilty of those things that were laid to their charge.  
That worthy Historian Thuanus reckons up their opinions, and then addeth 
u His praecipuis ●● c●rtis e●rum doctrinae capitibus ●li● officta de Conjugal, resurrectione, animae fl●t● post mortem, & de cibis. Thuan. Hist. sui temporis. Ad an. 1550. l. 6. pag. 513 ; To these certain and chief heads of their doctrine (alia afficta) others others were feigned and devised, concerning marriage, Resurrection, the state of souls after death, and of meats.  
Bernard de Girard, Lord of Haillan, saith; 
Et bien qui●'s ●ussent des mauvaises opinions, ●i est●a qu● elles ne suscit●r●●t pastant la haine du P●pe, & des grands Princes, & des E●clesiastiques, c●ntre ●ux, que fut l● liberty du language. Ce ●u●●e principal point qui lesmit e● haine universalle, & qui les charg●● de plus de meschan●e● 〈◊〉, qu●l● n'en avoient. Bern. de Girard. l● Histoire de France sobs Philippe 2. Liure 10 p. 511.  Although they had some ill opinions, yet they did not so much stir up the hatred of the Pope and great Princes against them, as their freedom in speech which they used in blaming and reproving the vices, dissolute manners, life, and actions, of Princes, Ecclesiastical persons, and the Pope himself: this was the chief thing which drew the hatred of all upon them, this caused many wicked opinions to be devised, and fathered on them, from which they were very free and guiltless.   

PAP.  
You say diverse opinions were feigned of them, what then were their own Tenets?   

PROT.  
What they taught in particular may be gathered by that which the Hussites in Bohemia, their scholars held, for as A●neas Silvius, afterwards Pope recordeth, the Hussites embraced the opinions of the Waldenses: now their opinions are thus, set down by An●as Silvius 
y 
Romanum Praesulem r●liquis 〈◊〉 parem ●sse. Purgatorium ignem rullum in●em●i: vanum esse ora●e pro mortuis, & avaritiae sacerdotali● inv●nt●m.  
Dei & Sanctorum imagines delendas.  
Confirmation 'em & extr●mam unctionem inter Ec●lesi ●sacramenta minim● contiuer●.  
Suffragia Sanctorii f●ustrà imp●trari, quae 〈◊〉 non possunt.  
Auricu●a●em Confessionem ●●ga●●m esse.  
〈◊〉 ab Ecclesi● institu●is, nihi inesse mer●●i●  
In Canonicis ho●is cantandis discendisque t●mpus 〈◊〉 t●ri.  
A●n. Sylu. Hist. Bo●em cap. 35.   one of their back friends.  
They held, other Bishops to be equal with the Bishop of Rome.  
That prayers for the dead and Purgatory, were devised by the Priests, for their own gain.  
That the Images of God and Saints, were to be defaced.  
That Confirmation and extreme unction were no Sacraments.  
That it is in vain to pray to the Saints in heaven, since they cannot help us.  
That Auricular confession was a trifling thing.  
That it was not meritorious to keep the set fasts of the Church, and that such a set number of Canonical hours in praying were vain.  
That Oil and Chrism was not to be used in Baptism.  
These with diverse other were the Tenets of the Waldenses.   

PAP.  
Suppose the Waldenses had fully agreed with you in matter of Religion● yet Waldo was a Layman 
z Bret●lye● Apol. tract. 2. chap. 2. sect. 3. , and so wanted calling, and could not confere it on others.   

PROT.  
Why might not a Layman by private exhortation, 
Ruffinus Ecc●es. Hist l. 1. ●●p. 9  persuade others to the Christian faith? We find in the Church-story, that a Tyrian Philosopher arriving in India, was slain by the Barbarians with all his company, except two children which were gone out of the ship, and were learning their lessons under a tree; these children were brought up by the King, and advanced by him, the one to be his Steward, and the other called Frumentius, became his Secretary. Afterward, the King dying, and leaving his son in in his nonage, Frumentius assisted the Queen in the government of the Kingdom: whiles Frumentius was in authority, he enquired among the Roman Merchants for Christians, he showed the Christians all favour, and procured them assemblies for prayer, and the service of God. When the King came to age, they delivered him the Kingdom, and Frumentius went to Alexandria to Athanasius, and told him what was done, desiring him to send some worthy Bishop to those multitudes of Christians: Athanasius thinking Frumentius a fit person, ordained him Bishop, and sent him into India, to convert more souls. Hereby we see, that this Lay-secretary was the first means of converting the Barbarians: and why might not Waldus of France, do the like?  
Besides, though Waldus himself were a Layman, yet the Waldenses might have Bishops, and Pastors. Matthew Paris saith 
b 
Albingenses constituerunt sibi Antipapam in finibus Bulgar. Cro●tiae & Dalmati●e, nomine Bartholomaeum; in quibus partibus error i●●e ●deò inval●it, ut etiam Episcopos, & alios multos regionum illarum ad suam adduxerint pravitatem.  
— ipse create Episc●p●s, & Ecclesias perfide ordi●are co●tendi●. Math. Paris ad●n ●n. 1223.  , the Albingenses were so powerful in the parts of Bulgaria, Croatia, and Dalmatia, that they also drew Bishops, besides many others of those regions, to their parties; yea the Pope's Legate that was sent in commission against the Albigenses, complains that they had a Bishop of their own, called Bartholomew, who consecrated Churches, and ordained Bishops and Ministers.   

PAP.  
Waldus and his followers were but simple, 
c Valdo, quia Idiota erat, al●q●o● libros in linguam vulgarem sibi feci● transferri● quos lege●●, & non in●ellig●●s, in pestilentissim●s l●psus est error s. Alphons. a Castro de justa Haere●. pun●●ione. l. 3. c. 6.  and unlearned men, (Valdenses fuerunt homines Idiotae, & prorsus ignorantes. Castreul. tit. miraculum.)   

PROT.  
What then? God hath chosen the foolish and weak things of the World, to confound the wise, 1 Cor. 1.27. And we read in the Church history of a Philosopher, that could not be overcome by any Arguments, but troubled the council of Nice, and yet was converted by a simple Bishop. Ruffin. eccles. Hist. li. 1. cap. 3.  
Again, it is untrue that Waldus was utterly unlearned: for Reiner the Inquisitor saith 
d C●● esset aliquantulum literatus, Novi Testam●nti text● docuit ●os vulga●iter. Re●er. c. Haeret. cap. 5. ; that Waldus being tolerably learned, taught those that resorted to him, the Text of the New Testament in their mother tongue: and the same Reiner (who was often present at their examinations) witnesseth 
e Inquisitioni & examinations haereticorum f●eq●●nt●r inter●ui, & computatae sunt Scholae Haereticorum in Dioc●si Pataviensi 40. Id. ibid. cap. 3.  that they had above forty schools, and diverse Churches; all within one diocese; so that they had the ordinary means of knowledge. Yea they were of that ability that they had diverse conferences and disputations with the Romists, and one famous one at Mount-royall in France, where they encountered Saint Dominick and others, and maintained these positions; 
f 
jac. Usher. de Eccles. suc●●●ione & statu. cap. 1●. §● 1.  
history of the Albigenses l. primo. cap 2.   that the Church of Rome was not the holy Church, nor spouse of Christ, but Babylon the mother of abomination: that the Mass was not ordained by Christ nor his Apostles, but was an Invention of men. This disputation held for diverse days, and the Waldenses had the better, had not Saint Dominicks sword proved sharper than his syllogism, cutting off more men than arguments; for now (as Platina saith) 
g Non ●●im disceptationi●us verborum tantum, verum etiam ar●●is opus ●uit. Pla●ina in Innocent. 3.— sed ●um parum câ ratione pro●i●●re ●i●i videretur Domini●●s, domin●●o gladio posito, ferr●um stri●xit. Thuan. pistor. ad an 1550.  the matter was not carried by force of argument, but by force of arms,   

PAP.  
Though you show us the Waldensians agreement with you, their calling, succession and ordination; yet you are never a whit the nearer, because their number might be few, and them few scattered and dispersed, so that they had not any visible congregations.   

PROT.  
Concerning the Waldenses, and the visibility of their assemblies, both in France and elsewhere, the matter is clear, even by your own witness.  
Rainerius saith, (as is already alleged) that of all Sects which either are or have been, none hath been mo●● pernicious to the Church (he meaneth the Church of Rome) than that of the Leonists. First, for the long continuance thereof; for some say it hath continued from the time of Silvester, (who was Bishop of Rome about the year of Christ three hundred and sixteen) others say, from the time of the Apostles. Secondly, for the generality, for there is almost no Country into which this Sect hath not entered: the French historian saith 
h Car les Francois, Espagnols, Anglois, Escossois, italians, Alemen, Boemiens, Saxons, Polonois, Lithuaniens, & autres peuples l'ont opinastrement defender iusques ●icy. L'histoire de France, Liure 1. p. 7. b. de l' imprimerie pac Abraham H. 1581. , that the Waldenses about the year 1100, and in the succeeding times, spread abroad their doctrine, little differing from that which at this day the Protestants embrace, not only through all France, but almost through all the Countries of Europe also. For the French, Spanish, English, Scots, Italians, Germans, Bohemians, Saxons, Polonians, and Lituanians, and other Nations have obstinately defended it to this day. Matthew Paris the Monk of Saint Alban hath already told us that they were grown so powerful in Bulgaria, Croatia, and Dalmatia, that among many others they drew some Bishops to their party.  
And there were such multitudes of them apprehended in France, that 
History of the Waldenses book 2. chap. 2.  the Archbishops of Aix, Arles, and Narbonne assembled at Avignion (anno Dom. 1228) about the difficulties of the executions of those which the Dominican Friars had accused, said plainly: there were so many apprehended, that it was not possible to defray the charge of their feeding, nor to find enough lime and stone to build prisons for them: when they came to wage war with their enemies, they were so powerful, that they brought an hundred thousand fight men into the field 
Carciter cen●um milli● a●ma●or●● in 〈◊〉 adversus S●mo●●in consti●isse ●er●t. P. Aemil. the gest. Franc. L●b. 6 〈◊〉 feirent tous ensemble (a ce qu●on dit) un● arm●e ●● env●on cent mille homme●. N●●. Vi●●●er del'Hist●●● del● Eglile en la●nec 1612. pag. 4●●. ; and were then very likely to have utterly overthrown Simon Montfort, General of the Papal army, had not the unexpected death of the King of Arragon (intercepted by ambush) quite discouraged and dissolved the Albigenses army.  
Besides, if the Waldenses had not had any visible assemblies, what needed such counsels & consultations, conferences & disputations, inquisitions and examinations, bans and excommunications against them? They set up the order of Dominican and Franciscan Friars to preach against them; they levied forces of Pilgrims Cruciferi or crossed soldiers, to fight against them; they published their Croysadoes, promised their pardon of sins, and remission of penance enjoined, to as many as would take up the badge of the cross, and wear it on their coat-armour, and go against the Waldenses, as against Sarracens and Infidels. Now sure had the Waldenses been but some few, dispersed and mean persons, they needed no such stir to suppress them. But we find, that they used all possible means for to quell them; 
〈◊〉 Lact●●●. 3. universal co●tra Cath●ros, q●●s Walden●es & Albigenses 〈◊〉 appellant. Binuius in Con●●l ibises.  Pope Inncent the third about the year 1180, called a a solemn Council at Lateran against them: Celestine the third in the year 1197 confirmed 
m Ordo Cru●i●erorum dici●●r confirmatas ● Caelestin●●. A●no 1197. Bellarm in Ch●onol.  the order of the Cruciferi, or crossed soldiers, and they were to war against them. The Monk of Auxerre in France saith, 
n ●●ter●s Papae longè lat●que 〈◊〉 peccatorum ●emissione. & pae●it●ntiarum abso 〈…〉. Chron●●. 〈◊〉 A●t●ssiodor ad ●n. 120●.  That the Pope sent his Bulls far and near, and granted them pardon of sins, and absolution of penance, to such as should serve in his wars against the Waldenses.  
About this time was the holyhouse of Inquisition set up by Pope Innocent the third, and the mastership thereof committed 
o Innocent. Epist. Decretal. Lib. 1. pag 56.  first to Friar Reiner and Guido, and afterwards to Saint Dominicke and his order. Eymericus hath given certain directions 
p Nic. Eymerici Directorium Inquisitor. cum Scholij● Fr. Peguae. Romae. 1578.  to the Inquisitors and Commissioners, and Francis Pegna hath glossed upon them: and there were lately to be seen the several consultations 
q Innocent. Decretal. epist. p. 57 Catalogue. Testium ve●it. Lib. 15.  of the Bishops and Lawyers of France, in what sort they were to proceed against the Waldenses. And the Monk of Newborrow tells us 
r Sub Anathemate prohibentur ne qui●●os in domibus vel in terra sua tenere, vel sovere, vel negotiationem cu●cis exercere pr●sumat. Gul. Novoburg. Hist. Angl. lib. 3. cap. 3. pag 217. & l. 2. cap. 13. pag. 126, etc. , that when the Waldenses came into England, (under the name of Catharist's or Publicans) there was strict charge given, under pain of excommunication, that none should receive, harbour, or keep them within their houses, liberties, or territories: nor to have any commerce or manner of dealing with them; and if any of that sect died in that state, that upon no terms, they should have any prayer or Christian burial; but they saved them a labour of burial: for Caesarius saith 
s Ex quibus quadringenti combus●● sunt in igne; cateri patibulis appensi. Caesarius Hist. lib 5. cap. 21.  that at the taking of La-vail there were four hundred of them burnt, and the rest hanged; and the like execution done in diverse other places; and namely at Vaurcastle, where after they had strangled the Governor Aimerius, they stoned to death the Lady Girard, the Pope's Legates not sparing (as Thuanus 
t Nec mulieribus abstinuere Pontificij Legati. Thuan. ad An. 1550. lib. 6. pag 515.  saith) any Sex at all. Now all this they patiently endured, so that as Altissidore saith 
u Qui omnes s● mutu●●ohor●antes, ro●um accensum u●tronei sub e●unt. Altissiodorens. pag. 106. a. obst●puerunt videntes. ibid. , the beholders were astonished, to see them go so cheerfully to their death, and withal to exhort one another to abide the fiery trial.   

PAP.  
There might be great numbers of the Waldenses, and them of the meaner sort.   

PROT.  
That is not so; for Du Haillan saith 
x De leur parti estoient le Contes de Tholouse, de Coming, de Bigorte, et de Carmain, & Mesm●s l● Roy d' Arragon. Bern. de Girard du Haillan. 〈◊〉 10 , that many Noble and worthy men took part with them, even to the hazarding of their lives and estates, namely; the Earls of Tholouse, of comings, of Bigorre, of Carmain, of Foix, as also the King of Arragon: for Remond had married joan once Queen of Sicily, sister to john King of England, by whom he had a son called also Remond; & after the decease of joan he married Elinor, sister of Peter King of Arragon; so that he was strong in affinity, and confederacy beside, that he had (as one saith 
y Gul Armo●ican. Philippidos. Lib. 8. teste D. jac. Vsserio de Eccles. successione & statu. cap. 10. nu. 31. ) as many cities and castles, and towns, as the year hath days.  
By the way we may observe, that considering the near alliance which was between the Earl of Tholouse, and his brother in law the King of England: as also the Earls lands lying so near to Guienne then in the possession of the English; hence I say we may observe, that this made the way more easy to communicate the doctrine and profession of the Waldenses unto their neighbour's of the English Nation.   

PAP.  
You tell us of great troops of the Waldenses; and yet they had but bad success.   

PROT.  
We must not measure the lawfulness of war by the issue; nor judge the cause by the event. The eleven Tribes of Israel were appointed by God himself to go and fight against the Benjamites; the Israelites were more in number than the Benjamites, and had the better cause; and yet the Israelites were twice overcome by the Benjamites 
Iud●●● 20. : so King Lewis of France fight against the Turk, his army was scattered, and himself died of the Plague.  
●esides, you have little reason to stand on the success of this war; It is true indeed that their chief Cittties Tholouse and Avignion were taken, and the King of Arragon was slain in the Waldensian war; but so also was Simon Montfort General of the Pope's army; he was slain, like Abimelech (judges 9) with a stone cast out of a sling 
Simon Comes m●ntis sor●is, a●te portam 〈◊〉 (Tolosae) l●pi●● de Peti●rio em●sso, in capite per●●ss●s, sub●●o expiravit. Math. Paris. H●●. ad an. ●●19. , or engine; and the same supposed to be ●lung or darted by a woman 
b Chassagmon. l. 4. c. 11. cited by the history o● the Albing●●ses, book 2 Changed 2 . And as for King Lewis he died at the siege of Avignion, and (as Math●w Paris saith 
c 〈…〉 interfectis. & in 〈…〉 & 〈…〉, plus quam 〈…〉. Math. P●●is 〈◊〉 ad an. 1226. ) sustained great losses by a terrible plague, strong and venomous flies, and great waters devouring, and drowning his army; so that there were two and twenty thousand French slain and drowned during that siege.  
Lastly, the Waldenses had no such ill success; for though themselves were persecuted, yet their doctrine was thereby communicated to others, and spread abroad throughout the world.   

PAP.  
You make as if the Pope had dealt ill with the Albingenses; but they dealt ill with him: for the Earl of Tholouse, or some of his subjects killed the Pope's Legate Friar Peter de Casteaneuff: and this was it that stirred up the Pope.   

PROT.  
This was but a colour of the war, and an untruth: when the Pope's Legate charged the Earl with this fact, his answer was; 
d Hist. of the A●bingens. book 1. Chap. 3.  that he was no way culpable of the Friar's death; that there were many witnesses of the death of the said Monk, slain at S. Giles, by a certain Gentleman, whom the said Monk pursued, who presently retired himself to his friends at Be●caire: that this murder was very displeasing to him, and therefore he had done what lay in his power to apprehend him, and to chastise him; but that he escaped his hands; that had it been true which they laid to his charge, and that he had been guilty of the fact, yet the ordinary courses of justice were to be taken against him, and not to have wracked their anger upon his subjects, that were innocent in this case. In the end he was forced to confess that he was guilty of the murder, only because it was committed within his territories: so that he was glad to do penance, and that in a strange sort, for the Legate put a stole about his neck (such as Priests use to wear) and having his head, feet, and shoulders bare, he led him by the said stole, and made him go nine times about the grave of the deceased Friar, scourging him with rods; which the Legate had in his hand, as long as he went about the said Sepulchre, the Earl to get himself out of the Legates hand, went to Rome, and was there absolved by the Pope: upon his return, the Legate refused to restore him, but renewed the excommunication against him 
e Hi●●. of the Albig. book 1. Cap. 8. , not as being guilty of the death of the said Monk, but because he had not driven the Albigenses out of his Country; as he was bound by promise. The Earl seeing the Legates dealing, strengtheneth himself with his Allies and Confederates, and so they fell to open hostility. Lewis the son of Philippus Augustus, was signed with the cross on his military Cassock, and strongly besieged Avignion one of the Earls chief Cities; swearing 
f Math. Paris ad An. 1226 H●●t. m●●or. , that he would not depart thence, till he had taken the Town: but he was glad to go aside to an● Abby not far distant, to avoid the Pestilence, whereon he shortly after died: the Legate the more easily to win the City, kept secret the King's death, and despairing to prevail by force, attempted to do it by fraud. He cunningly persuaded the City to send unto him twelve of their Citizens to confer upon some good conditions, giving them his oath for their safe return, protesting and swearing 
g A●●irmans cum ●●ramento, se non ob 〈◊〉 obsi●io●em protraxisse, nisi ut sal●tem qu. creret animarum. Id ibid. , that he prolonged the siege for no other end, but for the good of their souls: but wh●n the gates were opened to receive them so returning, his army rushed in, and t●oke the gate, and finally the City, contrary to his oath given. Thus the City of Avignion, which could not be taken in three month's siege and assault by the power of the King of France, was easily taken by the fraud and perjury of the Pope's Legat.  
Matthew Paris, the Monk of Saint Albans, tells us what others thought of these proceedings: it seemed unto many a great wrong (saith he 
h V●debatur enim multis abusi●, ut homi●●m fidel●m Christianum in●estarent, c●● co●staret, multip precibus persu●si●se Legato, ut veniret ad singulas terrae suae civitates, inquirens à singulis arti●●●et fidei. Id. ibid. ) to trouble a faithful Christian thus, who earnestly entreated the Legate to examine the faith of his people: and if any City held out against the Catholic faith, he would make them give satisfaction; and be punished as the Church should think fit; and for himself he offered, to give an account of his faith; but (as Matthew Paris saith 
i Pro se autem ipso obtulit, si Legatu● vellet, etiam fidei examen subire. Hae● omnia Legatus contempt ●it● nec potuit Cones Catholicus gratiam inve●ire, nisi pro se & haeredibus suis, haer●ditat●m su●m deserens, abjurare●. Id. ibid. ) the Legate nothing at all regarded these offers, but sleigted them; nothing would satisfy him unless the Earl would resign and quit claim his lands and his territories, pro se & haeredibus suis; for himself and his Heirs for ever; and accordingly they were given to Simon Montfort, for service done and to be done to the Church.   

PAP.  
You must show the continuance of your Waldenses, as well as their numbers and multitude: but that I think you cannot do, for now it seemeth they were rooted out.   

PROT.  
Indeed that was strongly attempted: Saint Dominick spent ten years amongst the Tholousians; 
k Vincent. Bellona●es. in speculo Historiali. lib. 29. cap. 103. & 105.  and he, and Didacus a Spanish B. marched against the Land of the Albigenses, the Friars, Preached, the Inquisitours plotted, the Princes warred against them; and the Popes they accursed their persons, and interdicted their lands; tolli tamen non poterant, saith Paulus Aemylius 
l Lucius P. utramqui sectam damnaverat, (Humiliatorum & pauperum à Lugduno) tolli tamen non poterant. Paul. Aemil. lib. 6. the gest. Franc. p 191.192. ; and yet for all that the Pope could do, they could not be suppressed; and yet the Pope condemned both the Humiliati, and the poor men of Lions; (for so they nicknamed them.) john de Serres in his Inventory of the History of France, 
m Le manuscript de● miserabiles Albigeois ad●ouste, que comme le Pape vouloit continuer lafoy persecution country eux— & s●aprest●it à no●elle recherche pour en exterm●n●r les r●stes: Lovis ne les voulut su●●ri●, disant qu● ille● falloit persuader par ●araison, & noales contraindre par la force. Don● il avi●t que beaucoup de familles ont es●e conservees ●nces provinces là. I●han de Serres l'Inventaire in Ludovio. 9 ad An. 1227. tom. 1. p. 505 506.  tells us out of a Manuscript, that as the Pope would have continued his persecution against them, and that the Marshal de la Foy (so called for that he was as it were the chief champion of the immortal war decreed against the Albingenses) prepared for a new s●arch to root out the remainders: Lewis would not allow of it, saying: that they must persuade them by reason, and not constrain them by force, whereby many families were preserved in these provinces. By this we see some reason given of their preservation and continuance● and Thuanus a noble, and unpartial historian, sometime precedent of the Court of Parliament in France, directs us to the place of their abode, and habitation.  
Though the Waldenses, (saith Thuanus 
n Cum huc ●llac ab eo tempor 〈◊〉 ubi● exagitarentur, tamen extilere s●mper ●er 〈◊〉, qui eorum doctrinam 〈…〉, joannes Viclevus 〈…〉 Boh●mia. I●. 〈…〉 pag. 515. ) were tossed from post to pillar, (as they say) yet there were ever some found, who in their several courses have revived and renewed their doctrine buried as it were for a season; and such were john Wickliff in England, john Hus in Bohemia, Jerome of Prague, and in our days Martin Luther: so that reliquiae eorum, the remnant and remainder of their doctrine and profession began to be kindly entertained and countenanced by many, at Martin Luther's coming: specially towards the Alps, and the provinces thereunto adjoining.  
The same Author saith 
o  ; that after the Waldenses were overcome by force of arms, they retired into Provence, and towards the Alps; and in those pla●s, they sought out some shelter for their life, and profession of doctrine: some of them went into Calabria, where they continued a long time, even unto the days of Pope Pius the fourth, (anno 1560) some of them went into Germany, and Bohemia, and there set up their rest: others of them came Westward into Britain and there took Sanctuary and harbour: and ●here I leave them, and come to Saint Bernard.  
In this age flourished that devout Father Saint Bernard, who in diverse main points of Religion held with us. He believed justification by faith alone, saying 
p  . Let him believe in thee who justifiest the ungodly, & ●ei●g justified ●y faith only, he shall have pe●ce with God.  
He disclaimed justification by works; for he accounted no better of men's best actions, as they proceed from man, than of a menstruous cloth 
q  , according to that of the Prophet, All our righteousness is as filthy clouts.  
Indeed he held good works to be the means by, but not the causes why; to be the Kings High●way to eternal life 
r ●i pr●prie app●li●●tur 〈…〉, qu●e dicim●s nostra, spei quidem s●minaria su●t— via r●gni, non caus● regnandi. Id. de great & lib. arb. , but not to be any proper cause of salvation. Now the high way is not the cause, that makes a man come to his journeys end; the way is but the means, the motion is the cause.  
He left his own Inherent, and laid hold on Christ's righteousness imputed to us, saying: 
s Nunquid justitias meas cantabo? Domine, memora●or ●ustitiae tuae solius. Ipsa est enim & mea— no● est pallium breve quod non possit ope●i●e duos;— & te pariter, & me operiet largit●r larga & ae erna justitia. Bern. sup Cant. Serm. 61.  What, shall I sing of mine own righteousness? No Lord, I will remember thy righteousness alone; for that is mine too; thou art made unto me of God, righteousness; should I fear that it will not serve us both? It is not a short Cloak, such as cannot cover two; thy large & everlasting mercy, shall fully cover both thee and me: in me it covers a multitude of sins; in thee Lord, what can it cover, but the treasures of piety, and riches of bounty?  
Concerning free will Saint Bernard reporteth, 
t Loqu●nte me ●oram aliquando, & Dei in me gratiam commend ●●t●, quòd scilìcet. ab ipsa me in bono & praventum ●gnoscerem, & provehi sentirem, & sperarem per●iciendum. Quid tu ergò, ait unus ex circumstantibus opera●is? aut quid m●rcédis speras, si totum facit Deus. Bern. the great. & lib. arb. in 〈◊〉.  that whiles he commended Gods free grace which prevented, promoted, and (as he hoped) would perfect the good work begun in him, some that stood by replied, what is it then that you do? what reward can you look for, if God do all? and these and such like Pelagian speeches of some Monks, occasioned him to write his treatise of Grace and free will, wherein he (denying such freewill as many Popish schoolmen teach) ascribes the whole original power of good, in the consent of the will unto grace, saying; 
u Non partim gratia, partim liberum a●bitrium— sed ut totum in illo, sic totum ex illa. Id de great & lib. arb.  That the good which we do, is not partly Gods; but it is to be ascribed wholly unto God.  
He disclaimed humane satisfactions, saying; 
x Cum ●ec millesim●e, imo nec minimae par●i, debitorum suorum valeat respondere. Id serm, de quadruplici debito.  Who will murmur and say, we labour too much, fast too much; since we are unable to discharge the thousandth, nay not the least part of our debts?  
He held that man was unable to keep the Law (in perfection according to God's Commandments) Neither (saith he 
y Nec latuit praeceptorem praecepti pondus, ●ominum excedere vi●es; sed judicavit utile ex hoc ips● sua illos insufficientiae admoneri— ergo mandando impossibilia, non pr●v●ricatores homines ●ecit, sed humiles, ut omne o● obsti●atur— accipientes quippe mandatum, & sentientès defectum, clamamus in coelum, & miserebitur nostri Deus. Bern. sup. Cant. ser. 50. ) was the commander ignorant, that the weight of the Commandment exceeded man's strength, but he judged it to be profitable, thereby to put them in mind of their own insufficiency: so that God by commanding things impossible (to us) did not thereby make man a transgressor, but humbled him, to the intent, that we receiving the Law, and feeling our own wants, might call to heaven, and the Lord might help us.  
And to the same purpose he elsewhere saith; 
z Proptereà mandata sua ma●d●vit custod●re nimi●, ut vi●entes imp●r●ectionem nost●●m def●●ere, & non posse 〈◊〉 quo● de●et, ●ugi●mus ad 〈◊〉. Ber. serm. 2 vigil nativ. ●om.  God hath therefore commanded his precepts to be observed exceedingly, or to the full, that we beholding our imperfection, and falling short, and finding that we are unable to fulfil that which we ought, may fly to his mercy.  
He held certainty of Salvation, saying; 
a H●c est te 〈◊〉 quod 〈◊〉 in cord nostro Spirit 〈◊〉 sanctus, dicens, Dim●s●a sunt tib● peccata 〈◊〉. Id. S●rm. 1. in. ●●nunciat.  that a just, man by the testimony of the Holy Spirit within him, may be assured of grace.  
Bernard likewise held, that our works do not merit (condignly,) and herein he is most direct and punctual against all Popish merit-mongers. Dangerous (saith he) 
b 〈…〉 P●alm. Q●i 〈…〉 1  is the dwelling of them that trust in their own merits; dangerous, b●caus● ruinous. And, 
c Hoc to●um 〈◊〉 m●ritum, 〈…〉 spem suam 〈…〉 eo qui totum ●ominem 〈…〉. ibis' serm. 15.  This is the whole merit of man, if he put all his trust in him who saveth the whole man. Again, the merits of men are not such (saith he) as that eternal life is due to them of right; 
d 〈…〉 hominum merita ut 〈…〉 ex ●ure; aut 〈…〉 serm. 1.  or as if ●od should do wrong, if he did not yield the same unto them; and he giveth a reason hereof: because all merits are Gods gifts, and so man is rather a debtor to God for them, than God to men; for what are all merits to so ●reat a glory? Indeed he elsewhere telleth us of his merits, but they be Christ's; and these we do willingly embrace with Saint Bernard and apply them to ourselves; his words are these.  
Therefore my merit is the mercy of the Lord 
M●um prouide meritum, mis●ratio Domini. Non 〈…〉 sum 〈…〉 sum. Id. in Cant. 〈◊〉 61. . I am not poor in merit, so long as he is not poor in mercy; and if the mercies of the Lord be many, my merits also are many otherwise, S. Bernard renounced all confidence of his own merit, reposing his soul on that imputative justice, (which is without man) even the merit of Christ, as in that alsufficient satisfaction, saying 
f ●ateor non sum dignus ego: nec proprijs possum meritis 〈◊〉 obtiner● c●lorum, 〈◊〉 duplici jure illud obtine●● Domin●s meus, hareditate scilicet Patris, & m●rito passin●is; alt●ro ipse contentur, alterum mi●i donat. Bernardus moriens. ut est in ejus vita. lib. 1. cap. 12. ; I am not worthy I confess, neither can I by my own merits, obtain the kingdom of heaven, but rest upon that interest, which I have in the merits of Christ's passion. Now what could be spoken more Protestant-like? and yet thus spoke Bernard of himself. And in this sweet meditation the devout Father closed his life, as the reporter thereof hath left recorded.  
Now besides these Articles already mentioned (which are weighty ones) Bernard was no universal T●ent Papist: neither held he diverse points which your Trent Counsel hath established for foundamentall; and namely, the doctrine of Transubstantiation of which he is altogether silent, even there where he was likeliest to treat of it, if he had then known it for Catholic doctrine: yea he there delivereth that which makes against it 
g 
●a●em ●aro nobis, 〈…〉 〈◊〉. etc.  
Q●id est m●ndu●a●● ejus 〈◊〉, & ●ib re sanguin●m nisi 〈◊〉 p●●sionibus 〈◊〉. Id Psal Qui habitat. s●r 3.  .  
He taught also that the Eucharist was a commemorative sacrifice only: 
h Ser. in coena Dom.  insomuch as alleging those words, Do this in remembrance of me: he mentioneth no real sacrifice of christs body and blood, such as is made in the Mass, but a thankful remembrance of his death and passion 
Vt illa p●●ë 〈◊〉 victima viver●t in memo●i● ut praet●●ite mo●tis hab●atur memoria. Se●m i● C●na Dom. .  
Indeed S. B●rnard in that Sermon of the Lords Supper 
Long di●●at a stylo Bernardi. B●llar. de scriptor. Eccl●s seoul 12. , if it be his, (for Bellarmie saith, it is nothing like S. Bernard's s●ile) speaks 
l 〈…〉 suum t●ne●e, & aliis dando p●r●ige●e. S●r. in ●●●na Dom. Deum suum manu & ore 〈◊〉, & colloquentem sinijp●is aud turi. Id ibid.  of the Priests holding his God and reaching him forth to others; as also of touching God with their hand, with their mouth, and hearing him speak unto them. Now as the Priest heareth Christ speak unto him, so he holdeth Ch●ist in his hand; but the Priest heareth not Christ speak verily and indeed, but in a certain peculiar manner, and form of speech, therefore he holds not Christ in his hand really and indeed, but after a sort: for a strain of Rhetorical amamplification, he is said to hold God, that holdeth any thing specially pertaining to God.  
Besides, he held the sufficiency of the Scriptures without Traditions; for writing unto a Covent of Abbots, he requireth 
m Illo praesertim Con ilio, in quo no● hominum trad●tiones obstinat●●s desensantur, sed diligenter inqu●ri●ur quae sit voluntas Dei bona & beneplac●n● & per●ecta. Bern. Ep. 91.  such a Council, wherein the traditions of men are not obstinately defended, but which doth diligently and humbly inquire what is the good and perfect will of God: and elsewhere he saith, 
n Verbum Dei omnia in omnibus. Id. de ●tilit●te Verbi Dei Et sup. Ca●t. ser. 86.  that the Word of God is all in all.  
He held habitual Concupiscence to be a sin, saying; 
o G●nus illud peccati quod toties conturbat no●, (concupiscent●as loquor & desideria ma●a) ●eprimi quidem deb●t. de A●ventu. serm. 6  That kind of sin which so often troubles us (I mean our concupiscence and evil desires) ought indeed to be repressed.  
Besides, he never taught adoration of Images, he held not the precise number of seven Sacraments; 
Serm● de sacro A●tari, & ablut. pedum; & serm. alio de coena Dom.  he stood against the opinion of the immaculate conception of the blessed Virgin Marie 
q Epist. 174. , and the like Tenets which be Articles of Faith with you.  
In a word, he plainly confessed, 
r Religionis antiquae non sotum ●●●tutem amisimus, sed nec spe●i●m r●tin●mus. Apo●ogia ad Guli●lin. Abba●.  that the Roman Church was degenerate from the ancient religion.  
And this may suffice to show what religion S. Bernard professed: if any man desire to see more testimonies, he may find them in Master Pankes Collectanea, out of Saint Gregory the Great, and S. Bernard the devout, showing that in most foundamentall points they are ours.   

PAP.  
Well, but I challenge Saint Bernard for one of our side.   

PROT.  
I have shown already, that he was ours on the surer side: he was indeed a Monk, and in some things superstitious; and no marvel, since he lived in a later age, above a thousand years after Christ, what time as errors crept into the Church, which he might suck in from the age wherein he lived; nevertheless, he was sound in the principal points of Religion: for other things we defend him not; since as your own Proverb goes, Bernardus non vidit omnia, even holy Bernard had his blemishes.  
Yet since he held the foundation of justification by Faith only in Christ, and disclaimed his own merits: though otherwise his hay and stubble 
s 1. Corinth. 3, 11.  of praying to Saints, and such like stuff, as cannot endure the fire of the Holy Ghosts trial, do burn and consume; yet since he kept close to the foundation, we doubt not but his soul is safe, and rests with the Lord, God pardoning his errors, and ignorances, which, he being carried with the stream of the time, took up, as they were delivered to him, without scanning or examining them.  
The like may be said of Bede, Gregory, and others, that holding Christ the foundation a right, and groaning under the weight of men's Traditions, humane satisfactions, and the like popish trash; they by unfeigned repentance for their errors & lapses known, and unknown, and by an assured faith in their Saviour, did find favour with the Lord: these and the like, we hold to be God's servants, and propter meliorem & saniorem partem, by reason of their better and sounder part, to be with us, lively members of the true Church, though in some things they were mistaken; and that they may be termed professors of our faith, inasmuch as the denomination is to be taken from the better part, and not always from the greater: For example sake, there is much water, and little wine mixed in a glass, yet it is called a glass of wine; so say we of professors, S. Bernard and such like, there is in them some bad parts, some superstition, and Popery; and some good, in that they hold Christ jesus the foundation aright; in this case they may in respect of their better part, be termed and denominated true professors; and therefore you must give us again Saint Bernard with others, to whom you have no right or claim, unless it be to their errors which they sucked in from the corrupt breasts of some of your side: and so I proceed to the several points in question.  

Of the Scriptures Sufficiency and Canon.  
Saint Bernard (as we heard) approveth 
t Bernard● Epist. 91:  such a Council, wherein the Traditions of men are not obstinately defended, but the revealed will of God enquired after: for that, 
u I●em de utilitate verbi & super C●nt. serm. 86.  this is all in all. Claudius' Seyssel Archbishop of Turin in Piedmont, (one that was Neighbour to the Waldenses, and laboured to inform himself touching their positions, and also to confute them) saith 
x 〈◊〉 tan●um quae vel in vete●● vel in novo Testam●nto sunt ●ons●r●ta, u●i ad literam j●cent, abs●●lla s●na interpretatione ad●●ttuat. Claud. Scys●●l. adv. seclam Walden. pag. 4. , that they admitted only the text of the old and new Testaments: so that they denied unwritten traditions to be the Rule of Faith.  
Petrus Cluniacensis, after he had reckoned up the canonical books, saith 
y Res●ant pos● hos authentic●s sanctae Scripturae libros, se● non 〈◊〉 lib●i. Pet. Clu●●ac. de aut●orit. v●t. Te●●am. Epist. c. P●tro Brusian. ; There are beside the authentical books, six other not to be rejected, as namely, judith, Tobias, Wisdom, Ecclesiasticus, and the two books of Macchabees, which though they attain not to the high dignity of the former, yet they are received of the Church, as containing necessary and profitable doctrine. Hugo de Sancto victore saith 
z Suat praeterea alij quidem libri ut Sapientia Salomonis. libe● Ie●u filij Syrach & Tob. & libri Machab qui leguntur ●uidem. sed non scri●●●tur in Cano●●. H●go de S. Vi●●. praen●tat. Elucidat. de s●●ip. & Sc●iptor. Sacris, ●ap. 6. & cap. 7. ; All the Canonical books of the old Testament are twenty two: there are other books also (as namely) the Wisdom of Solomon, the book of jesus the son of Syrach; the books of judith, Tobias, and the Maccabees; which are read but not written in the Canon.  
The Bible was translated into English some hundred years (as it is probably conjectured) before Wickliffs' translation came forth; a copy of which ancient translation myself have seen in our Queen's College Library in Oxford; in the preface whereof it may be seen, that the translator held the controverted books for Apocrypha; for thus he saith: what ever book of the Old Testament is out of these (he maketh the same ●anon with us) twenty five before said, shall be set among Apocrypha: that is, without authority of belief. Therefore the book of Wisdom, Ecclesiasticus, judith and Toby, be not of belief. Hierome saith all this sentence in the prologue on the first book of Kings; now if at that time the above said books had been accounted Authentical by the Church, and of belief, he would have said; but this opinion of Hieromes is not approved by the Church, as Doctor james hath well observed 
Dr. james of the Father's corruption. Part. 2. p. 74. .   

Of Communion under both kinds, and number of Sacraments.  
HVgo de Sancto victore giveth a reason of the entire communicating in both kinds: Therefore (saith he) 
b Ideo duabus speciebus sumit●r, ut significetur hujus Sacramenti duplex effectus; valet enim ad tuition●● corporis & 〈◊〉. Hugo de S. Vict tom. 5. cap. 6.  the Sacrament is taken in both kinds, that thereby a double effect might be signified: For it hath force, as S. Ambrose saith, to preserve both body and soul.  
Gratian rehearseth 
c Gratian. de Consecrat. dist. 2.  many ancient Canons and constitutions for communicating in both kinds. Saint Bernard, in his third Sermon on Palm Sunday, maketh the Sacrament of Christ's body and blood the Christians food.  
Touching the Sacrament of Christ's body and blood, (saith he 
d De sacrame●to corporis & sanguinis sui ne●o est qui nes●iat ●anc quoque tan●am & tam singularem al●moniam ●● pri●um die ex●ibitam, ea die commendatam & mandatam deinc●ps ●requentari. Bern. s●rm. 3. in ramis Palmarum. ) there is no man who knoweth not that this so singular a food was on that day first exhibited, on that day commended, and commanded to be frequently received. Saint Bernard's words have reference to the Institution of Christ: now at our Saviour's last Supper there was Wine as well as Bread, and Bernard treating thereof saith it was commanded to be frequently received; now if the whole Church were enjoined so to do, than also is every particular believer who is of age, & fitted thereunto, enjoined to receive it accordingly.  
The precise number of seven Sacraments was not held for catholic doctrine, no not in the Church of Rome, until more than a thousand years after Christ; this is ingenuously confessed by Cassander. Until the days of Peter Lombard (who lived about the year 1145) you shall scarce find any author (saith their Cassander 
Nec temeré quemquam reperias ante Petrum Lombardum, qui certum a●iquem & de●initum Sacramentorum numcrum statuerant: & de his septem non omn●s quidem Scholastici aequè proprié Sacramenta vocabant. Cassand. Consult. art. 13. ) who set down any certain and definite number of Sacraments; neither did all the schoolmen call all those s●ven, proper Sacraments: but this is without all controversy (saith the same Cassander 
f In hoc c●rtè controversia nulla est, duo esse praecip●a s●lutis nostrae Sacramenta, quomodo l●quuntur Robertus Tuitiensis, & Hugo d● S. v●ctore, part. octaud c. 2. de Sacramentis. Cassander ibid. ) that there are two chief Sacraments of our Salvation: that is to say; Baptism and the Lords Supper, and so speak Rupertus, and Hugo de Sancto victore, and he saith true; for Rupertus 
g sanguinis●ucharistia ●ucharistia. Rupert● de victoria Verbi. ●. 12. c. 11. Notimbergae. 1525.  putteth the question, and asketh Which be the chief sacraments of our salvation? and he answereth, Baptism, and the Supper of the Lord.   

Of the Eucharist.  
IN this age ●ratian the Monk affordeth us a notable testimony against transubstantiation; his comparison is thus drawn; This holy bread is after its manner called the body of Christ, as the offering thereof by the hands of the Priest is called Christ's passion; now the Priest's oblation is not properly and literally in strict terms and sense, the passion of Christ; but as the Gloss hath it, the Sacrament representing the body of Christ, is therefore called Christ's flesh, not in verity of the thing, but in a mystery (namely) as the representation of Christ therein is called his Passion.  
Gratian'ss words are these 
h Sicut ergo coelestis paxis, qui Chri●ti 〈◊〉 est, suo modo vocatu● corpus C●rist●, cum revera sit 〈◊〉 ●orporis C●ri●●i— 〈…〉 ●arnis quae 〈…〉 3. D● Cons●●rat. Dist. 2. . As the heavenly bread, which is Christ's flesh, after a sort is called Christ's body, whereas indeed it is the Sacrament of his body; and the sacrificing of the flesh of Christ, which is done by the Priest's hands, is said to be his passion, not in the truth of the thing, but in a signifying mystery.  
I●annes Semeca who was the first that glossed upon Gratian'ss decrees, telleth us how this comparison is to be meant. This Sacrament (saith the Gloss 
i 〈◊〉 sa●ramentum, qu●d 〈…〉 Christi 〈…〉 s●d 〈…〉 corpus Coristi, 〈◊〉 signi●i●atu●. Gloss. D●●r●t. de Cons●●rat. Dist. 2 verbo, C●●lestis. ) because it doth represent the flesh of Christ, is called the Body of Christ, but improperly, not in the truth of the thing, but in the mystical sense, to wit, it is called the Body of ●hrist, that is, it signifieth his Body.  
From these premises we infer, that after consecration, the Sacrament is not in truth Christ's Body, but only in a signifying mysteries rei veritas, the truth of the thing, as it is opposed to significans mysterium, a signifying mystery, simply excludes the reality of the thing; for it is all one, as if he had said, that it is there only in a signifying mystery; as also in saying it is there suo modo, after a sort only, he implieth, that it is not there truly, or in the truth of the thing, visibly or invisibly. So that these words of Gratian, drawn from Saint Austin, and Prosper, seconded by the Gloss, and inserted into the body of the Cannon law, confirmed by Pope Gregory the thirteenth, make strongly against the real presence of Christ's body, under the Accidents of Bread and Wine, as my learned friend Master Doctor Featly made it appear in his first day's Conference with Master Musket, touching Transubstantiation 
k Dr. Featlyes' conference with Mr. Musket. April● 21. 1621. .  
Besides, there were diverse in this age, who employed both their tongues and their pens in defence of this truth.  
Zacharias Chrysopolitanus saith 
l Sunt nonnulli, imò forsan mul●i, sed vix notari possun● qui cum damnato Berengario i●em senti●●t, & tamen ●undem cum Ecclesia damnant— Illud quoque maximé derident, quod panis & vini species quidam dicunt in a●re apparere, quidam ver● s●nsus corporeos falli, post conversionem panis & vini i● carnem & sanguin●m Christi Zachar. Episc. Chrysopol. Comment. in Evangel. Montessar. l. 4. c. 156. ; that there were some, perhaps many, but hardly to be discerned and noted, that thought still, as Berengarius did, whom they then condemned, scorning not a little the ●olly of them that say, the appearing accidents of Bread and Wine after the conversion, do hang in the air, or that the senses are deceived.  
Rupertus saith 
m Hoc loco silendum non est, malè quosdam ignotos, sed absconditi nominis homines opi●ari, suis quo●que de●endere dictis & scriptis● panem verum & potum, quem in sancto Altari sum●●●●● nihilomin●s Patr●s ill●s manducasse ●un● tempo●is & minisse— huic erro●i pro maximo ●rgumento ad●ib●nt authoritatem Apostoli 1 C●r. 10 3.4.— Igitur eadem que ●●ctenus in Ec●l●sia tole●atur discord●ntium & con●rad●●enta●● permixtio. Rup●rt. lib. 6. in commentar. in Io●an. cap. 6.— & in lib● 7. ; It is not to be concealed, that there are divers, though hardly to be discerned, and noted, which are of opinion, and defend the same both by word and writing: that the Fathers under the Law did eat and drink the very Bread and Wine, which we receive in the Sacrament of the Altar. And he saith they grounded their opinion upon that of the Apostle 1 Cor. 10.3.4. They did all eat the same spiritual meat, and did all drink of the same spiritual drink (for they drank of the spiritual rock that followed them: and the rock was Christ) and the same Rupert addeth, that the Church tolerated this diversity of opinion touching the sacrament of the Eucharist, for so he saith in his seaventh book; whence we may observe that forsomuch as the Fathers under the Law did eat of the same Christ in Manna that we do in the Sacrament of the Supper, and yet did not, nor could not eat him carnally, who was not then borne, nor had flesh: we also in our Sacrament can have no such fleshly communication with Christ as some imagine.  
And whereas Bellarmine replies 
n At ●andem inter se, non nobiscum ●andem. Bellar. lib. 1. de euchar. cap. 14. § Quia. , that the Fathers received the same among themselves, but not the same with us Christians; he is controlled by Saint Austin, who saith 
●piritalem u●ique●andem, 〈◊〉, corpo●alem alteram; qu●a illi 〈◊〉 nos aliud ● idem signi●i●avit virtute spiritali Aug. tracts 26. i● Io●n.  it was the same which we eat; the corporal food indeed was divers, but the spiritual meat was the same; they eat of the same spiritual meat.   

Of Images and Prayer to Saint.  
Nicetas Choniates, a Greek historian reports in the life and reign of Isaac Angelus one of the Eastern Emperors, that when Frederick Emperor of the West made an expedition into Palestina, the Armenians did gladly receive the Almains 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Nicet. Ch●●●at. Anal● l. 2. , because among the Almains and Armenians, the worshipping of Images was forbidden alike.  
Claudius' S●yssell, 
●●ror●s Waldensium cir●a Imagines Cla●d. Seys●●. c● sect Valdens. p. ●5.  and Claudius' Coussord 
r Bell●●. d● Reliq. Sanct. l. ●. c. 6 § post. , both which wrote against the Waldenses, reckon up this, among the Waldensian errors, that they denied the placing of Images in Churches, or worshipping of them.  
Gratian saith 
De mortu●s autem quaeritur, utrum 〈…〉 vivis ●●runtur; 〈◊〉 ex pers●●a pop●li 〈…〉 ● Abraham pater uester ●●s●rvit nos. De●●●t. 〈◊〉. 2. caus. 13. qu●est. 2. , that question is moved, whether the deceased do know what the living here on earth do, and withal he addeth, how that the Prophet in the person of the afflicted Israelites saith; Abraham our father is ignorant of us, and Israel knoweth us not, Esay 63, 16. and herein Gratian followed Saint Austin 
t Augustin. de cura pro mortuis. cap 13.  who maketh the same inference upon that place of Scripture.  
Gratian'ss resolution, in this point is farther laid down by the Gloss in those terms 
u Fa●it Gra●ianus quindam 〈…〉 & re●pondet quòd non; & ●oc ●rob●t aut●oritate Esaiae. Glos●a. in 13. q 2. Demortui●. . Gratian moveth a certain incident question; whether the dead know the things that are done in this world by the living? and he answereth that they do not; and this he proveth by the authority of Esay (viz. Esay 63.16.) the Master of the Sentences saith 
x Non est incredible ●nimas sanct●rum, quae in abscondit●●acici Dei veri luminis illustratione laetantur, in ipsi●s contemplatione e● quae foris aguntur int●lligere Petr. Lombard. Sentest. l. 4● Distinct. 45. F. ; It is not incredible, that the souls of the Saints, that delight in the secrets of God's countenance, in beholding the same, see things that are done in the world below. 
Inveni●ntur tamen quidam S. Patrum dixisse, quasi ni●il sit in creaturis quod non v●deant, qui vident omni● videntem. Ego ●mplius judicare non praesumo ni●i noc solum, quod tantum vident, qu●ntum illi placitum est quem vident, & in quo vident— difficile est de huju●modi judicare. Hugo de S. victore de Sacram. Fidei lib. 2. c●p. 11. tom. 3.  Hugo de Sancto victore leaveth it doubtful whether the Saints do hear our prayers or not, and rejecteth that saying of Gregory, brought to prove that they do, qui videt videntem omnia, videt omnia; he that seeth him who seeth all things, seeth all things: he confesseth ingenuously saying, I presume not to determine this matter ●arther than thus, that they see so much as it pleaseth him whom they see, and in whom they see what soever they see: and he saith, it is a hard task to decide these points; and withal thus debateth the matter.  
Yea 
z Sed non audiunt, inquis, & ego in ventum ve●ba in●undo, non audientibus & non intell●gentibus loquent. E●ce dicamus, non audiunt Sanct● verba postulantium, neque ad beatitu●inem illorum a●●ine● ista nosse quae foris aguntur. ●cce dicamus, non au●iun●; nunquid Deus non audit? Quid ergo laboras investiga●● quid audi●t & quant● audiunt Sancti qu●s oras, cum ipse Deus ●udiat propt●r quem oras? ipse videt ●umilitat● tuam, qui remuneraturus est devot●●nem t●●m. I● ibid. , but thou wilt reply: If they hear me not, I do but waste words in urine, in making intercession unto them, that do neither hear ●nor understand. Be it so, Saints hear not the words of those that call unto them: well; nor is it pertinent to their blessed estate, to be made acquainted with what is done on earth, admit that they do not hear at all: doth not God therefore hear? If he hear thee, why art thou solicitous than what they hear, and how much they hear, seeing it is most certain that God heareth unto whom thou prayest? he seeth thy humility, and will reward thy piety and devotion: so that in effect, Hugo makes it not any material thing or of necessity to pray unto Saints.  
Rupertus, upon those Words of our Saviour, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my Name, he will give it yo●; john 16.22. says, 
Qu●● videlicet praeter hunc nu●a vi●, nullumque est aliud ostium— solum hu●us unig●niti silij Dei nomen quod est Iesus Christus, necessarium universae o●ationis est vehicul●m. Rupertus lib. 12. in joan. cap. 16. tom. 2.  that it is the wholesome custom, and Rule of the Catholic Church, to direct her prayers to God the Father through jesus Christ our Lord, because there is no other way nor passage but by him; and again, we need no other chariot save only the name of jesus to carry and convey our prayers into heaven.  
Claudius' Seyssel saith 
b Error Valdensium circa Sanctos; dicunt, in●nes ess● ad Christi matrem caet●rosque Sanctos preces nostras, superstitio s●mque esse illorumado ationem. Claud. Seyssel adun sectam Valdens. pag. 68  the Waldenses held that it was in vain to pray to the Saints, and that it was superstition for to worship and adore them.   

Of Faith and Merit.  

c Credat in te ●●justificas im●ium, & solam ju●●ifica●●● 〈…〉. sup. 〈◊〉 serm. 2● & 〈◊〉 sol●m fid●m 〈…〉 salutem Id. 〈◊〉. 77.  SAint Bernard believed justification by Faith alone, saying; Let him believe in thee who justifiest the ungodly; and being justified by Faith only, he shall have peace with God. Rupertus saith 
d 〈◊〉 in c●●t●ntione 〈◊〉 Iud●us & qu● sola 〈…〉 fide jesu Ch●isti contempts, num●ros●● 〈…〉 arrogat ex op●rib●s. R●pert. li●. 2. in li● Rep. ca●. 29. to. 1. , that the obstinate jew sleights the Faith of jesus Christ, which alone is able to justify him, and seeks to be saved by his own works.  
Rupertus saith, 
e Ad quam [salutem] nos g●●tis, ul e●t, nullis nostris prae●●dentiom meritis per praedica●ores suos ipse vocavi●, & gr●tuad peccatorum re●●●sione justis●cavit. Id. lib. 1. in ● 1. joan.  that God hath freely called us by the ministry of his Word, unto the state of Salvation, and justified us by the gracious pardon of our sins, not upon any precedent merits of ours.  
Saint Bernard likewise held (as we have shown) that our works do not merit (condignly:) and herein he is most direct and punctual.  
The merits of men are not such (saith he 
f Neque●alia sunt hominum 〈◊〉, ut propter ●a vita aete●na debeatur ex jure; aut D●us t●juriam faceret, nisi ●am donaret— me●ita omni● dona Dei sunt, & ita ho●o magis propter ipsa D●o debtor, q●im est Deus homini●● quid sunt omnia merit● ad 〈◊〉 glo●iam? Ber. i● Annunt serm. 1. ) as that eternal life is due to them of right: or as if God should do wrong, if he did not yield the same unto them; and he giveth a reason hereof, because all merits are Gods gifts, and so man is rather a debtor to God for them, than God to men, for what are all merits to so great a glory?  
Bernard indeed elsewhere telleth us of his own merit; but it is the Lords mercy which he calleth his merit 
Meum proin●e meritum, mis●●atia Domini. Non pla●● sum me●iti inops, quamd●● ille mis●rationum non ●uerit. Quod si misericordie Domini multae, multus ni●●lominus ego in mer●tis sum. Id in Can●●●. s●●m 61. . Therefore my merit is the mercy of the Lord: I am not poor in merit, so long as he is not poor in mercy; and if the mercies of the Lord be many, my merits also are many.     

THE THIRTEENTH CENTURIE from the year of Grace one thousand two hundred, to one thousand three hundred.  

PAPIST.  
WHat say you of this Age?   

PROTESTANT.  
In this age Sophistry began to encroach upon Divinity; Aristotle and the Philosopher's were as much studied as Saint Paul's Epistles; Gratian and Lombard were as oft mentioned in the Schools, as the holy Scriptures; and hence came so many Sums, Sentences, Quodlibets, Legends, Rules, Decretals, and Decrees: for now by the example of Peter Lombard many devised subtle, and intricate disputations, calling almost every thing into doubt, after the manner of the Skeptiques, or Academiques; and leaving the plain and wholesome food of the holy Scripture, they began to gnaw on the bones of a controversy; doting about questions, and strife of words, 1 Timoth. 6.4. and yet in this curious and scholastic age, when men had almost lost themselves in the maze and mist of distinctions, the Lord raised ●●●●ch plain witnesses, as served to testify his trut●● though not in the words which the wisdom of man teacheth, yet in such as the Holy Ghost teach●th 
1 Cor. 2.13. .  
In this age lived William Bishop of Paris, Gulielmus Alt●ssiodorensis: Hugo Cardinalis, who made the first Concordance upon the Bible. Honorius Augustodunnensis, who composed the sum of history.  
Alexander of Hales an Englishman brought up in Paris; he was styled the Irrefragable Doctor, and was tutor to Bonaventure, of whom he used to say, 
b In fratre Bonaventura Adam peccasse non videtur. Tri●hem. de sc●ip Eccles.  that He was of such a godly life and behaviour, as Adam might seem not to have sinned in him.  
Now also lived Ioh● Duns called Scotus, because he was descended of Scottish blood; he was from the subtility of his wit, styled the Subtle Doctor● he was borne at Emildon, in Northumberland, and being brought up in Merton College in Oxford, as also having heard 
c Alexandri Alensis● Angl●● quon●am Parisijs auditor. ●●ithem. ibid.  Alexander Hales read and profess in the University of Paris, he became wonderful well learned in Logic, and in that crabbed and intricate divinity of those d●yes; yet as one still doubtful and unresolved, he did overcast the truth of religion with mists of obscurity, and with so profound and admirable subtlety, in a da●ke and rude style, he wrote many works, that he deserved the title of the Subtle Doctor, and after his own name erected a new sect of the Scotists. That he was bo●ne here in England is vouched out of his own Manuscript works in the Library of Merton College in Oxford, which myself have seen, which concludeth in this manner 
d Expli●it lectura Su●●ilis in Vni●e●si●a●e Parisiens. D●ctoris joannis D●●s in quod●m Vi●●ul● Parochiae, de Emildon vocate Dunston, in Comitate Northumbriae pertinen●e domui Scholarium de Mer●on H●ll in Oxoni●. Camden Britan in Ott●di●i. & Scoti opera MS. in Bib●ioth. Me●●one●● Oxoniae.  explicit Lectura etc. that is, Thus en●eth the Lecture of the subtle Doctor in the University of Paris; john Duns borne in a certain little Village or hamlet within the Parish of Emildon called Dunston in the County of Northumberland, pertaining to the house of the Scholars of Merton Hall in Oxford.  
The famousest of all the schoolmen was Saint Thomas of Aquine, entitled the Angelique Doctor.  
In this age lived Robert Grosted, Doctor of Divinity in Oxford, and Bishop of Lincoln; he was termed the Maull and Hammer of the Romanists; 
f Romanorum malleus & contemptor. Math. Paris. in H●nr. 3. ad an. 1253.  he wrote a famous letter to the Pope, extant in Matthew Paris, wherein he proved the Pope by his abominable soule-murthering actions, to be an heretic worthy of death, yea to be Antichrist, 
Si quis animas perdere non formidat, nun A●tichristus meritò est dicendus ● Id. ibid.  and to sit in the chair of Pestilence, as next to Lucifer himself. Herewith the Pope was so incensed, that he swore by Saint Peter and Paul, he could find in his heart, to make the doting Prelate a mirror of confusion to all the world for his sauciness: but some of the wiser Cardinals dissuaded him from such courses, telling him that it was true 
h Vera sunt quae dicit, Catholicus est nobis religio●ior consilium dederunt, ma●imè propter hoc, quia s●iu●t, quod quand●que discessio est ventura● Id. ibid. p. 1162.  which he said, that he was holier than any of themselves and therefore it was best to hush the matter, and not to stir the coals; specially sith it was known, that at length there would be a departure from their Church: he prophesied 
i Nec literabitur Ecclesia ab Aegyptiac● servitute, nisi in ore gladij ●ruentandi. Id. ibid.  that the Church would never be set free, from her Agyptian bondage, but by the edge of the sword, which we have seen in part accomplished.  
In this age flourished those two learned men, 
k Histor. Gisburn. Gua●●. Hemings. apud Illyric in Catal. Test. verit lib. 18.  Gerardus disciple to Sagarel us of Parma, and Dulcinus disciple to one Novarius Hermannus; these held and preached, that the Pope was Antichrist, and the Church of Rome Babylon: some thirty of their followers came into England, and were there persecuted for preaching that and the like doctrine.  
It is like ●hat this Dulcinus had many followers, for Coc●l●us saith, 
l Fornicatus est spiritualiter cum alienigenis plarimis, cum Wiclevistis, cum Dulcinistis. Cochl. Hist Hussit. lib. 2. p. 100  that john Hus committed spiritual fornication with the Wiclevists, and with the Dulcinists.  
Bergomensis the Chronologer saith; 
m Ad sex millia utriusque s●xu● hominum coll. gerat Dulcinu●: quinimo ad●uc in Tridentinis montibus aliquae ejus extant reliquia jac. Phil. Bergom. in supplem. supplem. l. 13. ad an. 1305.  that there were some six thousand people that followed Dulcinus; and that in his time, the remainders of this profession were living about Trent; now he continued his Chronologie unto the year of Grace 1503.  
Prateolus saith, 
n Ejus reliquia nostra aetate varijs in locis & Germaniae & Galliae, Sacramentarijs eosdem redintegrantibus, re●igu●runt Prateol. tit. Dulcinus.  that the remainder of the Dulcinists had in his time revived and renewed their opinions, in diverse places of France and Germany. Platina saith 
o Platina in Clem. 5. , they were called Fratricelli, or the Brethren, and that Pope Clement the fifth sent out an army against them into the Alps, where he famished and starved diverse of them.  
Nicholas Eymericus in his Directory for the Inquisitours saith, 
p Totam illam terram Lombardiae suis error●bus implentes, Geraldus, & Dul●●unt. Nic. Eymeric. secunda p●●t. Director. Inquisitor. qu●est. 12.  that they filled the whole land of Lombardie with their opinions, which he calleth erroneous. Petrus de vincis, Chancellor to Frederick the Emperor, in his letters to the Christian Princes, feareth not to call the Pope an Apostata, 
q Bestiam ascendentem de 〈◊〉, plen● nominibus Blasphemy, Pardique vari●tatibus circumscriptam ●du●i potest non Curia, sed Cura: mar●●●d sidera●s plus quam M●rcum: du●s Sa●monem legens, despi●it Salomonem. Pet. de ●in●is. ●ib. 1. Epist. ●1  and the Beast rising out of the Sea, full of names of blasphemy, and like unto a Leopard; and again, the Court of Rome, may be called non curia, sed cura, marcam desideraus plusquam Marcum, more desirous of a mark (of silver) than of S. Marks Gospel, or of taking of Salmon, than of reading of Solomon.  
About this time lived Arnold de nova villa, a Spaniard, who taught 
r Catalogue. Test. verit. lib 16 , that Satan had then seduced a great part of the world: that the faith then taught, was but such a faith as the devils might have who believe and tremble, meaning belike a historical, and not a saving, justifying faith; as also, that the Pope led men to hell: that, he and his Clergy did falsify the doctrine of Christ: that masses were not to be said for the dead.  
In this age there were great odds between William of Saint Amour a Doctor of Paris, and the Friar's Mendicants, or jacobins; he accused them for troubling the peace of the Church, in that they preached in Churches, against the will of the ordinary Pastors, and heard confessions, slighting the parish Priests, as men of weak abilities; and also for that they had made a book, which they called the everlasting Gospel, whereunto they said Christ's Gospel was not to be compared: Pope Alexander the fourth was content upon complaint made unto him, that the Friar's book should be burned 
s Prae●●pit Papa, ut li●●r secretor & si posset ●ieri, fine Fratrum scandalo, combureretur. Math. Pa●s. Hist. add an. 1256. , provided that it were done covertly and secretly, and so as the Friars should not be discredited thereby: and as for William of Saint Amour, he dealt sharply with him, commanding his book to be burnt: as also he suspended 
t Dignitatibus & be●e●icijs omnibus sunt privati, done● juraverunt revocare Patisijs, & malijs ●tvitatibus & locis, quicqui● co●tra dictorum Frat●um ordi●es implicitè vel e●plicit● evomulssent. Tho Can●●pratan. lib. 2. exempl. memorabil su●●●mpori●. c. 10. § 23.  from their benefices and promotions all such as either by word or writing had opposed the Friars, until such time as they should revoke and recant all such speeches and writings at Paris, or other places appointed: so tender was his holiness over the Friar's credit and reputation, knowing (belike) what service might be done to him and his successors by these newly errected orders of ●riers: I call them newly erected, for in the time of Pope Innocent the third about the year 1198, the jacobites (an order of preaching Friars) were instituted by Saint Dominicke; and about the beginning of this age, the order of Franciscans (preaching) Friars Minors was instituted by Saint Francis 
u Franciscu● Ordinis Mino●um institutor ex As●iso civitate Italiae ori●ndus, clarvit Anno 1220. epithem. de scriptor. Eccles. , borne at Assize a town in Italy.  

Of the Scriptures sufficiency, and Canon.  
SCo●us saith, 
x Et id●ò pat●t quòd Sacra scriptura su●ficienter contin●t doctri●am necessariam vi●tori— quantum ad credenda, speranda, operanda. Sco●us 1. Sent. prolog. cue est. s●●und.  that supernatural knowledge, as much as is necessary for a wayfaring man, is sufficiently delivered in sacred Scripture. Thomas Aquinas in his commentary upon that place of Saint Paul, the Scriptures are able to make one wise unto salvation, that the man of God may be perfect, 2 Timoth. 3.15.17. saith 
y Non enim qualitercunque bonum facit, s●● perficit. Hebr. 6. ad pe●●ectinnem ●eramur. Per●●ctum est 〈◊〉 nihil deest. Tun●●rgo homo est per●●ctus, quando est instructs. Aquin. i● 2. Tim. 3. in tom. 16.  that the Scriptures do not qualify a man a●ter an ordinary sort, but they perfect him, so that nothing is wanting, to make him happy. And accordingly Bonaventure saith; 
z Fructus Scripturae non est quicunque, sed plenitudo aeternae foeticita●is. Bonaventura in Breviloq. sect. 3. tom. 6  The benefit of scripture is not ordinary; but such as is able to make a man fully blessed and happy.  
Hugo Cardinalis speaking of the books rejected by us, saith 
Et tales recipit Ecclesia, non ad p●o●ationem Fidei, sed ad m●rum instructionem. Hugo in Prologue Galcatum S. Hieron.  These books are not received by the Church for proof of doctrine, but for information of manners.   

Of Communion under both kinds; and n●mber of Sacraments.  
ALexander Hales, howsoever he some way incline to that opinion, that it is sufficient to receive the Sacrament in one kind: yet he confesseth 
b Licet illa sumptio quae est in ac●●pi●ndo sub una specie ●a●li●●at: illa tamen quae est su● duabus est materie merit●; tum ratione aug●entationis devotio●●, tum ratione ●idei di●atation●s actualis, tum ratione su●ptionis completioris, sumptio sub ●traque specie, quem medum sumen●t tra la●it Dominus, e●t majoris efficaciae & compl●m. a●●. Halens. summae part 4 cue est. 53. membro pri●o.  that there is more merit and devotion, and completeness, and efficacy in receiving in both. Again, he saith 
c Totus Chris●us non con●i●●tur sub utraque●●ecie sacra●entaliter● se● ca●o tanti●●● sub spe●ie panis; sangui● tan●●m su●●pecie vi●i. H●lens. part. 4. qu●est 4●. memb. 3. ●ie●. ; Whole Christ is not sacramentally contained under each form; because the bread signifieth the body, and not the blood; the wine signifieth the blood, and not the body. Concerning the Church's practice, we do not find that the lay people were as yet barred of the cup in the holy Sacrament: for our Countryman Alexander Hales who flourished 
d Alexander de Al●●, nati 〈◊〉 Eclogue, cla●uit anno ●●40●. T●●them.  about the year of Grace 1240. saith; that we may receive the body of Christ under the form of bread only, sicut fere ubique fit à Laicis in ecclesiâ, as it is almost every where done of the Laiety in the Church; 
●uia C●ristus integrè ●am●●● sub utr●que spe●ie, b●●e lic●● su●ere c●●pus 〈◊〉 sub ●●ecie ●anis tantum 〈◊〉 ●ere 〈…〉 Loicis on Ecclesi●. Hal●ns. part. 4. S●m●●. qu. 53. memb. 1.  it was almost done every where, but it was not done every where.  
Concerning the Sacraments, the Schoolmen of this age can hardly agree amongst themselves, that there be seven Sacraments properly so called.  
Alexander of Hales saith 
f Sed duo instituit per s●psum, 〈◊〉 Sac●ame●tum Baptismi & Eucharistis. Sacramentum ve●ò Confirmationis & extreme ●unctionis didst per Apostles. Alia ve●ò tria Sacra●enta quandam habent additionem à Domino in Evangelio. Halens. Summae, part. 4 quaest. 8. memb. 2 artic. 1. , that there are only ●oure, which are in any sort properly to be said Sacraments of the new Law; that the other three supposed Sacraments had their being before, but received some addition by Christ, manifested in the flesh; that amongst them which began with the new Covenant, only Baptism and the Eucharist were instituted immediately by Christ, received their forms from him, and flowed out of his wounded side.  
Touching Confirmation, the same Alexander of Hales saith 
g Sine praejudi●io dicendum, quod Dominus neque hoc Sacramentum institue, neque dispens●vit, neque Apostoli● Institutum suit hoc Sacramentum Confirmationis Spiritus sancti instinctu in Concilio Meldensi, quantum ad formam verborum, & ma●eriam elementarem. Id. part. 4 qu. 23. memb. primo. ; the Sacrament of Confirmation, as it is a Sacrament, was not ordained either by Christ, or by the Apostles, but afterwards was ordained by the Council of Meldain France.  
Touching extreme unction, Suarez saith 
h Inter Catholicos nonnulli negarunt hoc Sacrament●m ●uisse à Christo institutum, ex quo p●anè s●quebatur non esse verum Sacramentum; ita vero sen●it Hugo de S. victore l. 2. de Sacram●. 2. quem secutus est magister in 4. dist. 23. Alens. qu. 8. ●n. 2. Altissiodor. l 4. Sum. tract. 7. c. 1. S●a●ez. in 3. part● Thomae. disp. 39 § 2. tom. 4. , that both Hugo of Saint Victor in Paris, and Peter Lombard and Bonaventure, and Alexander of Hales, and Altissidorus (the chief schoolmen of their time) denied this Sacrament to be instituted by Christ, and by plain consequence (saith he) it was no true Sacrament, though they were of opinion that a Sacrament might be instituted by the Apostles, and therefore admitted not of this consequence.   

Of the Eucharist.  
COncerning the Eucharist, Scotus saith, 
i Scotus lib 4 Dist. 10. quaest. 1. § quantum ergo ad is●ud a●gum.  that it was not in the beginning so manifestly believed as concerning this coversion. 
k Principaliter autem videtur me movere quod de Sacramentis tene●dum est, si●ut tenet S. Romana Ecclesia ● nunc autem ipsa tenet panem transubstantiari in cerpus, & vinum in sanguin●m, 〈◊〉 manifesse habetur Extravagante de Summa Tri●●t. & ●●le cath. firmiter Credimus. Ecclesia declaravit istum intellectumesse de veritate Fidei in illo Symbolo edito sub Innoentio●ertio ●ertio in Conci●io Later●nensi. et si quaeras quare voluit Ecclesia eligere istum difficilem intellectum hujus Articuli, cum verba scriptu ae possent salvari secundum intellectum facilem, & veriorem secundum apparentiam: dico, quod ●o spiritu expos●● sunt scripturae, quo conditae, & ita supponendum est quod Ecclesia Cath. eo modo exposuit, quo tradidit nobis fides Sp. sancto veritatis edocta; & ideo hunc intellectum elegit, quia verus. Scotus— in 4. S●ntent. Dist. 11, quest 3. §.  But principally this seemeth to move us to hold Transubstantiation, because concerning the Saraments we are to hold as the Church of Rome doth. And he addeth; we must say, the Church, in the Creed of the Lateran council, under Innocent the third, which begins with these words, Firmiter credimus, declared this sense concerning Transubstantiation, to belong to the verity of our faith. And if you demand, why would the Church make choice of so difficult a sense of this Article, when the words of the Scripture, This is my Body, might be upholden after an easy sense, and in appearance more true? I say, the Scriptures were expounded by the same spirit that made them: and so it is to be supposed, that the catholic Church expounded them by the same spirit: whereby the faith was delivered us, namely being taught by the spirit of truth, 
l Vnum tamen addit Scotus quod minime p●obandum est, ●nte Lataranense Concilium non suisse dogma fidei transubstantiationem: id enim ille dixit quia non lege●at Concilium Romanum, sub Gregorio 7. neque consensum illum Patrum, quem nos add●ximus. Bellar. l. 3. de Sacram. Eucharist. cap. 23. §. u●um.  and therefore it chose this sense because it was true: thus far Scotus.  
Let us now see what Bellarmie saith. Scotus tells us (saith he) that before the Council of Lateran, (which was held in the year one thousand two hundred and fifteen) transubstantiation was not believed as a point of faith; this is confessed by Bellarmine to be the opinion of Scotus: only he would avoid his testimony with a minime probandum est; Scotus indeed saith so, but I cannot allow of it; and then he taxeth Scotus with want of reading: as if this learned and subtle Doctor had not seen as many Counsels, and read as many Fathers for his time, as Bellarmine.  
The same Bellarmine saith, 
m ●oc Dicit Scotus, non ext●re sum Scriptura tam expresum, ut sine Ecclesiae declara●ione evidenter cog●t transubstantiationem admittere. Atque ad non est omnino im●ro●●bile. Nam e●●●●si Scriptura videatur nobis tam cla●●, ut po●sit cogere hominem non protervum: tamen an 〈◊〉 sit, meri●o dubitari pot●●t, cum homines doctissimi, & 〈◊〉, qualis i●primis Scotus fuit, contra●●●● 〈◊〉 Id ibid. § secu●●o.  that Scotus held, that there was no one place of scripture so express, which (without the declaration of the Church) would evidently compel a man to admit of Transubstantiation: and this, saith the Cardinal, is not altogether improbable. It is not altogether improbable, that there is no express place of Scripture to prove Transubstantiation without the declaration of the Church (as Scotus said) for although the Scriptures seem to us so plain that they may compel any but a refractory man to believe them; yet it may justly be doubted, whether the Text be clear enough to enforce it, seeing the most acute and learned men, such as Scotus was, have thought the contrary: thus far Bellarmine, unto whom I will add the testimony of Cuthbert Tonstall the learned Bishop of Durham.  
His words are these 
n An s●tini autem fui●set curiosis omnibus impos●●i●se silentium, ne 〈…〉 quo i● fieret— an verò potius de modo quo id fieret, ●uriosum quemque s●●e relinquere conjecturae, si●ut lib●●um suit a●te ill●d Conci●●um, modò veritatem orp●●is & s●nguinis 〈◊〉 in Eucharisti● esse sateretur, quae ●uit ab i●itio 〈…〉 fide●. Tonst●ll de Eucha●istia lib. 1. pag. 46. ; Of the manner and means of the Real presence, either by Transubstantiation, or otherwise, perhaps it had been better to leave every man, that would be curious, to his own conjecture, as before the council of Lateran it was left: and Master Bernard Gilpin, a man most holy, and renowned among the Northern English, and one that was well acquainted with Bishop Tonstall his kinsman, and Diocesan, saith 
o M●nini Ton●●allum●pis●opum ●pis●opum saepi●s narrasse Innocentium tertium inco●saltius se●isse, quod transubstan●stanti●●tionis opinionem arti●●lu● fidei 〈◊〉. Quum a●ted liberum ●uisset vel sic vel aliter 〈◊〉. V●ta Bernardi Gilpini pag. 40. ; I remember that Bishop Tonstall often tol●e me that Pope Innocent the third had done very unadv●sedly in that he had made the opinion of Transubstantiation an Article of Faith: seeing in former times it was free to hold or refuse that opinion.  
The same Bishop told me, and many time ingenuously confessed 
p Ita ut Scotus (quod & Episcopus Tunstallus saepenum●ro ingenuè ●atebatur) existimarit, multo melius faciliusque pot●●sse Ecclesiam uti comm●diore interp●e●atione v●rborum in sa●●a ●oena. Rever●ntèr cum antiquis Pa●ribus de sacra Co●na loquendum judicavit Episcopus, & Transubstantiationis opinionem ●●itte●dam esse. Illud etiam idem Tunstallus ex scriptis & sermonibus affirmare solebat, Innocentium tertium nescisse quid ageret, quando Transubstātiat●onem inter ●rticulos fidei posuerit: dicebatque Innocentium d●c●is circa se hominibus car●isse● adeo equidem inquit Tunstallus, si ipse fuissem ei ● Consilio, non dubito me potuisse Pontificem ab e● Consilio vetraxissè. Vita Be●. Gilpini. pag. 46.  that Scotus was of opinion that the Church might better and with more ease make use of some more commodious exposition of those words in the holy Supper: and the Bishop was of the mind that we ought to speak reverently of the holy Supper, but that the opinion of Transubstantiation, might well be let alone. This thing also the same Bishop Tonstall was wont to affirm both in words and writings, that Innocent the third knew not what he did when he put Transubstantiation among the Articles of Faith, and he said that Innocentius wanted learned men about him, and indeed (saith the Bishop) if I had been of his council, I make no doubt but I might have been able to have dissuaded him from that resolution.  
By this that hath been said, it appears that Transubstantiation was neither holden, nor known universally in the Church before the Lateran Council; twelve hundred years after Christ: and that when it began to be received as a matter of Faith, it was but believed upon the Church's authority; and this Church virtually and in effect was Pope Innocent in the Lateran Council, twelve hundred years and more after Christ; before which time there was no certainty, nor necessity of believing it; and the Council might have chosen another sense of Christ's words more easy and in all appearance more true; there being no scripture sufficient to convince it.   

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
HOnorius of Authun in France, saith: 
q Nullu● sapiens Crucem● sed Christum crucifixum adorat. Honor. Augustud. in Gemma animae● ut citatur à Cassandro in Consult. cap. de Imag.  There is none that is godly wise, who will worship and adore the Cross, but Christ crucified on the cross.  
Roger Hoveden, our native historian, who lived in the beginning of this age, condemned the adoration of Images; for, speaking of the Synodall Epistle written by the Fathers of the second Nicen council, wherein Image worship was established, he tells us; 
r Carolus Rex Francorum misit Synodalem librum ad Britanniam sibià Constantinopoli directum, in quo libro (he● pro● dolour) ●ulta inconvenienti●, & v●●● fidei contrari● reperieba●tur; maximè quod penè omnium Orientalium Doctorum, non minus quam trecentorum, vel eo amplius Episcoporum, u●animi assertione confirmatum fuerit Imagines adorari debere, quod omnino Ecclesia Dei execr●tur. Roger Hoveden part. 1. Annal. p, 405. an. 792.  that Charles the King of France sent into this Isle a Synodall book directed unto him from Constantinople, wherein there were diverse offensive passages (but especially this one, that by the joint consent of all the Doctors of the East, and no fewer than 300 Bishops, it was decreed that Images should be worshipped (quod ecclesia Dei execratur) (saith he) which the Church of God abhors.  
Guilielmus Altissiodorensis saith 
s Proper ista● ratione● & consim●let d●cunt 〈◊〉, quòd nec n●s oram●s S●nctos, nec ipsi orant pro nobis nisi improprie; i●e● 〈◊〉, qui● or●mus ●●●m ut Sancto●um 〈◊〉 no● 〈◊〉 Gul. Al. tissindo●. in Summ● part. 4. li●. 3. tract. 7 q● est. 6.  that for such and such reasons many do say, that neither we pray unto the Saints, nor they pray for us, but improperly: in respect we pray unto God, that the merits of the Saints may h●lpe us.   

Of Faith and Merit.  
THomas Aquinas saith, 
t Opera 〈◊〉 sunt causae 〈…〉 sit justus apud Deum, sed ●oti●s 〈◊〉 executiones & mani●est●tiones just t●●. Th. Aquin comment. in c. 3 Ep. ad G●lat lict. 4. & Rom. 3. Lict. 4. &— ●usti●icationis in sola ●ide● Id in ● 〈…〉. 1●ect ●ect 3. 〈…〉 side pa●sionis 〈◊〉 r●mitt●tur omnis 〈…〉 fide ejas null●s justifi●atur Bonaventura in 4. ●ent. di●t. 15. quest. 1.  that works be not the cause why a man is just before God, but rather they are the execution and manifestation of his justice: for no man is justified by works, but by the Habit of Faith infused; yea justification is done by Faith only. And Aquinas in his commentary on the Galatians in the place alleged, though at the first he mention such works as are performed by the power of nature, yet afterwards he speaks also of works wrought by the power of grace, and of such as Saint james mentions, Chap. 2. saying; Was not Abraham justified by works? but these were works of grace; and yet Thomas excludes from justification, works done in the state of Grace; and saith, justification is done by Faith only. Bonaventure saith, 
〈…〉 in B. Ch●ys. & quatuor D●ctor. Eccles. in 〈◊〉 8 August●● quaest. 13.  that by only Faith in Christ's passion, all the fault is remitted, and without the faith of h●m no man is justified. Velosillus in his animadversions upon the writings of the Fathers and Doctors of the Church observeth 
y S. Thomas 〈…〉 in 1. 〈…〉 art 5. & in Rom. 4. constanter a●●irmat, ●ullum esse i● peccato e●meritum suae justificationis 〈◊〉 ex cōg●●o, 〈…〉. Vega in opus●us. 〈◊〉. 6. de justicoat. , that Scotus held not merit of Condignity. And Vega saith, that Thomas Aquinas the flower of the Schoole-Divines constantly affirmeth, that a sinner can not merit his own justification either of congruity, or of condignity; and thus have these men given in their verdict, but now let us hear themselves speak.  
There is no action of ours, saith Scotus 
z Qui [actus] s●cundum se co●●iderat●s absque tal● acceptatione divin● secun●●m ●●r●ctam justiciam non fuiss●t dignus t●li 〈◊〉 ex intrinse●● bonitate quam haberet ex 〈◊〉 principijs; quod 〈◊〉; semper enim praem●um est majus bonum merito; & justitia 〈…〉 non reddit meli●s pro 〈◊〉 bo●o; id●o benè dicitur quòd semper Deus praemiat ultra meritum condignū● Scotus in prim. Sent●●t● dist. 17 cue 3. nu. 2. , that without the special ordinance of God, and his divine acceptation, is worthy of the reward with which God rewardeth them that serve him, in respect of the inward goodness that it hath from the causes of it; because always the reward is greater than the merit, and strict justice doth not give a better thing for a thing of less value: And again he saith 
a Loquendo d● strict justiti●, Deus nulli nost●um propter qu●cu●que merita est debitor perfectionis reddendae, tam intense; propter immod●ratum ●xcessum ill●●s perfectionis ultrà ill● merita. Idem in 4. dist 49. qu. 6. , That speaking of strict justice, God is bound to none of us, to bestow rewards of so high perfection as he doth, the rewards being so much greater in worth, than any merits of ours.  
The Prophet David (saith 
b Dr. Ushers Answer to the jesuit title of Merits. pag. 547.  the learned Archbishop of Armagh hath fully cleared this case, in that one sentence Psalm. 62.12. With thee Oh Lord, is mercy; for thou r●ward●st every man according to his works. Originally therefore, and in itself, this reward proceedeth merely from God's free bounty and mercy: but accidentally, in regard that God hath tied himself by his word and promise, to confer such a reward, it now proveth in a sort to be an act of justice, in regard of the faithful performance of his promise's. For promise amongst honest men is counted a due debt; but the thing promised being free, and on our part altogether undeserved, if the promiser did not perform, and proved not to be so good as his word; he could not properly be said to do us wrong, but rather to wrong himself, by impairing his own credit. And therefore Aquinas confesseth, 
c Non sequitur, quod Deus effic●atur simpliciter de●itor nobis, s●d 〈◊〉; in quantum debi●um est, ut sua ordinatio impleatur. 2● quest. 114 art 1. ad 3 'em.  That God is not hereby simply made a debtor to us, but to himself; in as much as it is requisite, that his own ordinance should be fulfiled.  
William, Bishop of Paris, treating of prayer, giveth us this Caveat; 
d Cavendum est tibi in 〈◊〉, ne debili aut fragil● fundamento i●n●t●ris, quod ille proculdubio fa●it, qu● de meritis suis con●idit, & t●nquam m●ritis suis debita petit●●n oratione dona Dei; qui so●is suis viribus aut meritis i●nititur, D●i ●uxilio, & viribus scipsum private. Gu●●. Parisiens. de Rhetoricâ diviná, cap. 52.  Not to lean on the weak and frail foundation of our own merits, but wholly denying ourselves, and distrusting our own strength, to rely on the sole favour and mercy of God; and in so doing, (saith he) the Lord will never fail us.  
Cassander saith 
e Omnes enim tàm veteres, quam recentes— uno ore pro●itentur, remissionem peccatorum, & gratiam justificationis n●minem suis qu●mvis in speciem bonis operibus mereri— nec ab ●ac sententiâ abhorrent Scriptores Scholastici, & recentiores Ecclesiastici. Cassander C●s●ll. Art. 6. de Bon. operi●. , That both ancient a●d modern with full consent profess to repos● themselves wholly upon the mere mercy of God, and merit of Christ, with an humble renunciation of all worthiness in their own works; and this doctrine Cassander derives through the lower ages of the Schoolmen, and later writers; Thomas of Aquine, Durand, Adrian de Trajecto (afterwards Pope Adrian the sixth) Clictoveus, and delivers it for the voice of the then present Church.     

THE FOURTEENTH CENTURIE. From the year of Grace 1300. to 1400.  

PAP.  
WHat say you of this fourteenth Age?   

PROT.  
In this Age learning began to revive; for so it came to pass, that diverse learned men among the greeks, abhorring such cruelty as the Turks used against their Countrymen the Grecians, left those parts, and fled into Italy. Now by their means, the knowledge of Letters, and study of Tongues, specially the Greek & Latin, began to spread abroad thorough diverse parts of the West. Of this number were Emanuel Chrysoloras of Constantinople, Theodorus Gaza of Thessalonica, Georgius Trapezuntius, Cardinal Bessarion, and others; in like sort also afterwards john Cap●io brought the use of the Greek and Hebrew tongues into Germany, as Faber Stapulensis observeth 
Lingnarum ●●gnitio, & 〈◊〉 L●tinae & G●aecae, (●um postea Hebra● 〈…〉 ex●itat●●●st) circase p●r● Constantinop●l●os 〈◊〉 hos●●bu● Christ● expugnate, ●●dire c●●it; pauci● Graecis, nimirum Bess●●one, Theodoro Gaza, Georgio Trape●●ntio, Emanuel● Chrysolora, illinc in Italiam recepte. jac. Faber St●pulen●●n p●ae●at. in comment. in Evangelia. : And in the beginning of this age, Hebrew was first taught in Oxford, as our accurate Chronologer Mr. Isaacson hath observed 
g Mr. Henry Isaacsons Chronology add an. Chr. 1314. .  
Now also lived Nicholas de Lyra, 
h Nicolaus de Lyra, natione Anglicu●, studiofissimus● Trithem. de scriptor. Eccles.  a converted jew, who commented on all the Bible.  
In this age there were diverse both of the Greek and Latin Church who stood for Regal jurisdiction against Papal usurpation; and namely, Barlaam the Monk; Nilus' Archbishop of Thessalonica; Marsilius Patavinus: Michael Cesenas' General of the grey Friars; Dante the Italian Poet; and William Ockam 
i Gul. Ockam, natione Anglicus, joannis Scot● quondam discipul●s. Trithem. de scriptor. Eccles.  the English man, sometime fellow of Merton College in Oxford, surnamed the Invincible Doctor, and Scholar to Scotus the subtle Doctor: Now also lived Durand de S. Porciano. Nilus allegeth diverse passages out of the general Counsels, against the Pope's supremacy, and thence inferreth as followeth.  
That, 
k 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  
Nilus de primatu Papae lib. 2. pag. 64.   Rome can not challenge pre-eminence over other Seas, because Rome is named in order before them; for by the same reason Constantinople should have the pre-eminence over Alexandria; which yet she hath not. From the several and distinct boundaries of the patriarchal Seas he argueth, that 
l 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. id. ibid. Pag. 66.  neither is Rome set over other Seas, nor others subject to Rome.  
That whereas Rome stands upon the privilege, that other places appeal to Rome; he saith 
m 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. , That so others appeal to Constantinople, which yet hath not thereby jurisdiction over other places. That whereas it is said the Bishop of Rome judgeth others, and himself is not judged of any other; he saith 
n 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. id. ibid. Pag. 70. , That St. Peter whose successor he pretends himself to be, suffered himself to be reproved by S. Paul; and yet the Pope (tyrantlike) will not have any inquire after his doings.  
Barlaam proveth out of the Chalcedon Council, [Canon 28.] That the Pope had not any primacy over other Bishops, from Christ, or S. Peter; but many ages after the Apostles; by the gift of holy Fathers and Emperors: if the Bishop of Rome (saith he 
o Nam si Episcopus Romanus an●eà primus ●uiss●t, orbisque terrarum P●stor ● S. Petro constitutus, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Nunquam sanctissimi Imperarores Co●stantin. & justinian. ut dere sui juris promulgassent: Decernimus ut Romanus Episcopu● primus omnium sacerdotum sit; quia lege non opu● visset. Barlaam de prim●●● Ponti●ic. c. 4. p. 198. ) had anciently the supremacy, and that S. Peter had appointed him to be the Pastor of the whole Church; what needed those godly Emperor's decree the same as a thing within the verge of their own power and jurisdiction?  
Marsilius Patavinus wrote a book called Defensor Pacis, on the behalf of Lewis Duke of Baviere, and Emperor, against the Pope, for challenging power to invest and depose Kings: He held, 
p 〈…〉 principatus siv● contenti●sa jur●sd●ctionis, regiminal, s●u coac●ivi judicij ●ujuslib●t in hoc seculo, Chri●●us s●ipsum & 〈◊〉 os exclusit, & ex●ludere vo●u●t. Marsil. Pata● Def●nsor pacis p●rt. 2. c 4 p. 2.  that Christ hath excluded, and purposed to exclude himself and his Apostles from principality, or contentious jurisdiction, or regiment, or any coactive judgement in this world.  
His other Tenets are reported to be these 
q Catalogue. 〈…〉. li●. 18. : 

1 That the Pope is not superior to other Bishops, much less to the Emperor.  
2. That things are to be decided by Scripture.  
3. That learned men of the Laiety are to have voices in Counsels.  
4. That the Clergy, and the Pope himself are to be subject to Magistrates.  
5. That the Church is the whole company of the faithful.  
6. That Christ is the Head of the Church, and appointed none to be his Vicar.  
7. That Priests may marry.  
8. That St. Peter was never at Rome.  
9 That the popish synagogue is a den of thiefs.  
10. That the Pope's doctrine is not to be followed.    
With this Marsilius of P●dua, there joined in opinion john of Gandune, and they both held, that 
r Q●òd Clerici si●t & ●sse 〈◊〉 ●ure subjecti potestati 〈…〉, tum 〈◊〉 j●di●ijs, prae●ertim in causis ●on Eccl●sias●icis, 〈◊〉 de Milan, & Io●nnes de Iand●no do●uer●●t 〈◊〉 de ●leri● l●b. 1. c. 2● § p●str●mo.  Clerks are, and should be subject to secular powers, both in payment of Tribute, and in judgements, specially not Ecclesiastical: so that they stood against the Exemption of Clerks.  
Michael Cesenas General of the Order of Franciscans, stood up in the same quarrel, and was therefore deprived of his dignities by Pope john the two and twentieth, from whom he appealed 
s ●go secund●m fo●mam juris ab ip●● s●ut ab h●re●ico app●llavi egiti●è ad universalem Ecclesi●m, & generale C●n●ilium. Michael d● C●zena, Epist. 12.  to the Catholic universal Church, and to the next general Council.  
About this time also lived the noble Florentine Poet Dante, a learned Philosopher and Divine, who wrote a book against the Pope, concerning the Monarchy of the Emperor; but for taking part with him, the Pope banished him 
t Dantes Aligeriu●, vir tàm ●n divinis Scriptures, quam in secularibus literi● omnium suo tempore studiosissimus, pu●sus pa●●â omnibus diebus suis exulavit. ●rithem. de scriptor. ecclesiast● . But of all the rest, our Countryman Ockam stuck close to the Emperor, to whom he said 
u D●xit Ludovico Imperatori: O Imperator, defend me gladio, & ego defendam te Verbo. Trithem. de scriptor. Eccles. verbo Guil. Ockam. , that if he would defend him with the sword, he again would defend him with the Word. Ockam argueth the case, and inclineth to this opinion, that 
x Servus non est major domino. Pilat●s jurisdictione● habuit coa●tivam super C●ristum, camque ordinariam, non usurpatam. Ockam lib. 6 Dialog part. 1. cap. 4.  in temporal matters, the Pope ought to be subject to the Emperor, in as much as Christ himself, as he was man, professeth that Pilate had power to judge him given of God; as also, that neither Peter, nor any of the Apostles had temporal power given them by Christ, and hereof he gives testimony 
y St●tisse lego Apostolos judicandos, sedisse judicantes non l●go, Bern. ad Eugen. Ockam ibid. cap. 3.  from Bernard and Gregory. Ockams' writings were so displeasing to the Pope, as that he excommunicated him for his labour, and caused his treatise or work of ninety days, as also his Dialogues to be put into the black bill of books prohibited and forbidden 
z In Romano Indice prohibita sunt ●uae scripsit contrà joannem Pap. 22. Possevin. apparat sacer. tom. 1. li●. G. p. 709. .  
It is true indeed, that Ockam submitted his writings to the censure and judgement of the Church; but (as he saith 
a Si quid autem scripsero, correctioni Ecclesiae Catholicae, non Ecclesiae malignantium submitto. Ockam in Prologo compend. errorum joan. Papae 22. , to the judgement of the Church Catholic, not of the Church malignant. The same Ockam spoke excellently in the point of general Counsels: He held, 
b Non ideò solummodò vocatur Concilium generale, quià authoritate summi Pontificis co●vocatur. Ockam. Dial. pa●r. 1. lib 6. c 84.  that Counsels are not called general, because they are congregated by the authority of the Roman Pope; and that 
c Reges & Principe● & nonnull● Laici, possunt si voluerint, ad generale concilium conveni●e, & e●●sdem Concilij tractatibus interest. Id. ibid.  if Princes and Laymen please, they may be present, & have to deal with matters treated in general Counsels.  
That, 
d Concilium generale, licet sit par● Ecclesiae militantis universalis, tamen non est Ecclesia universalis. Igitur teme● arium e●● dicere quod Concilium generale contrà fidem errare non potest. Id. ibid. part. 1. l. 5. cap. 25.  a general Council, or that congregation which is commonly reputed a general Council by the world, may err in matters of faith: and in case such a general Council should err, yet God would not leave his Church destitute of all means of saving truth, but would raise up spiritual children to Abraham, out of the rubbish of the Laiety, despised Christians, and dispersed Catholics 
e Quod si Concilium in ●●●resin ●abe●etur, remanerent alij Catholici, qui occultè vel publicè prout expediret, auderent fidem defendere O●thodoxam— potens est Deus de lapiditus, id est, Laicis rudibus, & ●bjectis pauperibus, & de spectis Catholicis, Dei filios suscitare. Id. ibid. p. 1. l. 5. cap. 2●. .  
We have heard the judgement of the learned abroad touching jurisdiction Regal and Papal; let us now see the practice of our own Church and State.  
In the Reign of King Edward the third: sundry express Statutes were made 
f Statute of Provisors. An. 25. Edward. 3. cap. 22. Stat. an. 27. Edw. 3. cap. 1. S●●t. an. 38. Edw. 3. cap. 1. , that if any procured any Provisions from Rome of any Abbeys, Priories or Benefices in England, in destruction of the Realm, and holy Religion: if any man sued any Process out of the Court of Rome, or procured any personal Citation from Rome, upon causes whose cognisance and final discussion pertained to the King's Court, that they should be put out of the King's protection, and their lands, goods, and chattels forfeited to the King.  
In the Reign of King Richard the second it was enacted 
g An. 13. Richard. 2. Statute an. 16. Rich. 2. cap. 4. & 5. , That no Appeal should thenceforth be made to the Sea of Rome upon the penalty of a Praemunire, which extended to perpetual banishment, and loss of all their lands and goods: the words of the statute are 
g An. 13. Richard. 2. Statute an. 16. Rich. 2. cap. 4. & 5. , If any purchase or pursue in the Court of Rome any Translations of Bishoprickes, processes, and sentences of excommunication, Bulls, instruments, or other things; they shall be out of the King's protection, and their lands and tenements, goods and chattels forfeit to the King; and process to be made against them by Praemunire facias.  
It was also enacted in the Reign of King Henry the fourth 
h Stat. an. 11. Henr. 4. cap. 8. , that all elections of all Archbishoprickes, Abbeys, Priories, Deaneries, and other dignities should be free, without being in any wise interrupted by the Pope. And indeed it was high time to curb the Pope's bestowing of Benefices on foreigners; for upon an Inquisition taken by Simon Langham Archbishop of Canterbnry, it was found 
i In ●a Inquisitione compertum ●uit, no●nu●os viginti Ecclesias & dignitates ipsiu● Papae authoritate possidere, illisque in super i●s dem privilegijs indult●m esse, ut sine mode atque numero n●ctas licite retinere possi●t. Antiq. Britan. pag. 249. , that some had above twenty Churches and dignities by the Pope's authority, and were thereby further privileged to hold so many more as they could get without measure or number. Yea, the Romans and Italians were so multiplied within a few years in English Church-livings, that when King Henry the third caused a view thereof to be taken throughout the whole Realm, the sum of their revenues was found to be yearly, as Matthew Paris saith 
k 
Math. Paris in Henr. 3. ad an. 1240.  
— Rex per singulos Comitatus Angliae ●ec●t inquiri summam Redituum Romanorum, et inventum est, quod ad ta●tundem pe●●●e ascendisset, quantum Reditus ipsius, videi●●et 60. millia Ma●carum puri redditus. exceptis aliis varijs emolumentis. Math. Westmon●st. ad an. 1245. in Henr. tertio.  , Sexaginta millia marcarum, threescore thousand marks, to the which sum the yearly revenues of the Crown of England did not amount.  
By this that hath been said, it appears to be an untruth, which the Papists in their Supplication 
l The Papists Supplicat. answered by Gabr. powel. , and the Author of the treatise called the prudential Balance, have given out, to wit● 
m prudential Balance cap 21. that all our Christian English Kings to King Henry 8. we●e Roman Catholics.  That all the Kings of England unto King Henry the eight were papists; for diverse of them died before the grossness of Popery began; othe●s of them, as namely King Henry the first and second, King john, King Richard the second, and Edward the third, opposed the Papacy. Now the very being & essence of a Papist consists, in acknowledging the Pope's supremacy 
n Bellar. lib. 3. de Eccles. milit. cap. 2. § Nostra. , which since these did not acknowledge, but withstood it; they cannot properly be termed Papists, though they were carried away with the errors of those times.  
In this age lived those famous Florentine Poets, Dante and Petrarch; as also our English Laureate, Chaucer; as also joannes de Rupe scissâ, or Rocke-cliffe, and S. Bridget. And these found fault with the Romish faith, as well as with her manners. Dante in his Poem of Paradise, written in Italian, complains that the Pope of a shepherd was become a wolf, & diverted Christ's sheep out of the true way; that the Gospel was forsaken, the writings of the Fathers neglected, and the Decretals only studied. That in times past war was made upon the Church by the sword, but now by a famine and dearth of the Word, which was allotted for the food of the soul, & not wont to be denied to any that desired it; that men applauded themselves in their own conceits, but the Gospel was silenced; that the poor sheep were fed with the puffs of wind, and were pined and consumed away.  
Dante his words are these, 

o Dante Ca●●o. 9 del' paradiso. pag. 483.  Produce et spande il maladetto fi●r●,  
Cha desu●ate le pecore et gli agni,  
Però che fatto ha lupo del pastore.  
Per quest● l' evangelio i dettor magni  
Son derelitti; et solo à i decretali  
Si studia si; i pair, à i lor vivagni,  
A questo intend ' l papae Cardinali.  which may be thus Englished, 
She did produce, and forth hath spread  
The cursed flower, which hath misled  
The sheep and lambs, because that then  
Shepherds became fierce wolves, not men.  
Hereupon the Gospel clear  
And the ancient Fathers were  
Forsaken; then the Decretals  
By the Pope and Cardinals  
Were only read; as may appear  
By th' savage of the gowns they wear.  Again, 

p Id ibid. Canto 18 p. 538  Già solea con le spade far guerra;  
Majesty's hor si fa, togliondo hor qui hor quivi  
Lo pan; ch' el pio padre a nessun serra.  
I' th' days of old with sword they fought,  
But now a new way they have sought  
By taking away now h●re, there then  
The bread of life from starved men;  
Which our pious fathers ne'er denied,  
To any one that for it cried.  Again, 


q Id. ibid. Canto. 29. pag. 601.  Per apparer ciaf●un in gl●gn●, et face  
Sue inventioni, & quelle sontrascorse  
Da predicanti; e● l vangilio sitace.  
Non disse Chris●o all su primo convento,  
Andate, & predicate all mondo ciance;  
Ma d●ed e l●r verace fondamento:  
Et quel tanto fond ne le sue guance,  
Si cli à pugnar, par accender la fede,  
Del' evangelio fero scudi & lance.  
Hora si va con motti et coniscede,  
A predicar; & pur che been si rida,  
Gonfi● o' l cappuccio, & più non si richiede  
Matal ucel nel' bechetto SH' annida:  
I se'l vulg i'll vedesse, vederebbe  
La perdonanza, di che si confida,  
Per cui tanta stultitia in terra crebbe;  
Che sanza prova d' alcun testimonio  
Ad ogni, promession, si converebbe;  
Di questo n grassa l' porco Sant Antonio  
Et altri auch●r, che son assai più porci,  
Pagando di moneta sanza conio.   

Christ said not to th' Apostles, go  
And preach vain toys the world unto:  
But he did give them a true ground,  
Which only did in their ears sound.  
So providing for to fight  
And to kindle faiths true light,  
Out of the Gospel they did bring  
Their shield and spears t'effect the thing.  
Now the way of preaching, is with toys  
To stuff a sermon; and herein joys  
Their teachers; if the people do but smile  
At their conceits, the Friar i'th'meane while  
Huff'es up his Cowle, and is much admired;  
For that's his aim; there's nothing else required:  
●ut in this hood there is a nest  
Of birds, which could the vulgar ●ee,  
They might spy pardons, and the rest,  
How worthy of their trust they be.  
By these their Indulgences and pardons,  
[And by their Friar's absolutions]  
Such follies on the earth abound,  
That without proof or other ground  
Of testimony, men agree  
To any promise that made can be.  
By this St. Anthony pigs grow fat,  
And such like Pardoners; so that  
Hereby they feed the belly and the groin,  
Paying their people with counterfeit coin.    
Here we see how the Poet taxeth papal Indulgences which the Friars vented, enriching themselves by marting such pardons, or Bulls signed or sealed with Lead, for which the people paid currant money; he also taxeth such as vainly trusted to such pardons; as also the fond conceit they had of being shriven and absolved in a Monks cowl, as if some rare virtue had laid in that Cuculla or Capuccio, alluding (belike) to the Monks hood, or Friar's cowl, as if the fashion thereof had resembled the Cuckoo.  
The same Dante in covert terms, calleth Rome the whore of Babylon mentioned in the Apocalypse; his words are these 
Dante In●erno Canto 19 pag. 120. . 
Di voi pastor s' accorse ' l' vangelista;  
quando colei, che side soura l' acque,  
putaneggiar co i regi à lui fù vista;  
Quella; che con le set teste nacque,  
et da le diece corna hebb' argomento,  
fin che virtute al suo marito piacque.  
The Evangelist meets with you well  
You [Romish] Pastors'; when he doth tell  
How he did see the woman, which  
Sits on the waters [that foul witch]  
To play the whore with Kings; that Beast  
That borne was with seven horns at least.  
And had the sign of some ten more  
T'appease her husband by their power.   
The Author alludes to that in the Revelation, of the great whore that sitteh on many waters, Revelat. 17.1. and of the beast that beareth her, which hath seven heads, and ten horns, vers. 7. with whom the Kings of the earth commit fornication. Chap. 18. v. 3.  
Francis Petrarch the Laureate Poet, and Archdeacon of Parma, a man excellently skilled in the Scriptures, and one who (as Trithemius saith 
s ●r. Pe●rarcha vir in divinis scripturis e●udi●us, literas humanitatis post longa silentia mortuas (ut ita dixerim) ab ●nferis revoca●it ad superos. Trith. de script. Eccles. ,) Revived learning after it had been a long time decayed, speaks more fully, saying 
t Petrarcha Son●ti 92. pag. 85. part. 1. ; 
Del' empia Babylonia, ond' è fugitta  
Ogni vergogna, ond' ogni bene è fuori,  
Albergo di dolour, madre d' errori,  
Son fugitt ' ●o per allongar la vita.  
Out of wicked Babylon  
By God's help at length I am gone;  
From which all shame is banished,  
From which all good is vanished.  
The Lodge of grief and misery,  
The Mother of all Heresy.  And elsewhere he speaks as roundly; 
u Petrarch. part. 1. Sonetti 108. pag. 149. in tom. 4. Basil. 1581.  

Fontana di dolore, albergo d' ira,  
Scola d errori, e tempiod heresia,  
Gia Roma, hor Babylonia, falsa e ria  
Per cui tanto si piagne; e si sospira.  
O fucina d' inganni, o prigion d' ira;  
Ove ' I been more, e ' i mal si nutre e cria;  
Di vivi inferno, un grand mira col fia,  
Se Christo teco al fine non sad ira.   

Wellspring of grief, and fierce wrath's Hospital,  
The School of error, temple of Heresy;  
Once Rome, now Babylon, most wicked, all  
With sighs and tears bewail thy piteous fall.  
Thou Mother of deceit, bulwark of Tyranny,  
Truth's persecuter, nurse of iniquity,  
The Living Hell; a miracle it will be,  
If Christ in fury come not against thee  
Most shameless whore.    
These sayings of Petrarch did so gall the Pope, that Pius Quintus hath caused three Sonnets to be razed 
x Pius Quintus tr●a e●us cantica abradi jussit. Bellar. in Append. ad librum de Pont●f. c. 21.  out of Petrarch; and so indeed I found in the Petrarch which used Mancano three sonnetti 
y Pe●rarch. pag. 113. Vene●. 1600. , that three Sonnets were wanting, but that which I have alleged, is found in the Basil edition.   

PAP.  
Bellarmine saith 
z Non potuit Petrarches, cum Romam, sive Ave●●●n●m, ●b Curiam summi Po●ti●i●●s, Babylonem appell●v●t, de ●ide, ●e religione, sed de vitijs tantum, quae tu●c ●●geba●t, ea dicere. Bellarm. in Append. c. 21. , that Petrarch spoke thus of the Court of Rome, and not of the Church of Rome; of Rome's corruption in manners, not in doctrine.   

PROT.  
This answer will not serve: for though Petrarch might mean the Court, by the name of Babylon, and by imputing to it Covetousness and Licentiousness; yet when he charges Rome with Idolatry, and calls it the Temple of Heresy, can this be intended of the Court of Rome? or of corruption only in point of life? Besides, if any should think, that Petrarch spoke thus only in a Poetical vein, he is the same man in Prose in his Latin Epistles; for therein addressing his speech to the Sea of Rome, 
〈◊〉 d●cam●an i●sa●●● m●●●trix fornicata ●um Regibus te●●e. Illa ●quidem e● quam in Spiritu s●●er videt 〈◊〉, illa ead●m in 〈◊〉 es, no ●alia, sede●●u●er aqua●●●●tas. Petrarch● Epist. 16 to. 2 p 729.  he saith; Thou art that famous, or rather infamous h●rlot, which committest fornication with the Kings of the earth; the self s●me strumpet thou art, which the sacred Evangelist saw in the spirit; the self s●me, I say thou art, and no other; having thy se●t upon many waters; then he speaks of her doom, saying 
Quid exp●ct●● nisi quod Io●nnes idem 〈…〉 Babylon magna, p●30 ●30. 〈…〉 & ne p●●ticipes ●●tis ●el●ctorum ●jus, & de pl●gi●●jus ibid. ; What other end dost thou expect, but the same prophesied by john: Great Babylon is fallen, is fallen, and made an habitation for devils? But thou my dear friend, with the same Apostle hear another voice speaking from Heaven, Come out of her my people, and be not partakers of her iniquities, that so you may receive none of her stripes.  
To these two Italians (to make up a Triumvirate of famous Poets) we may join our English Laureate Sir Geoffry Chaucer. This noble Knight, who by marriage was brother in law to john of Gaunt, Duke of Lancaster, found fault with the Faith, as well as the manners of the Romanists in his days, as may appear by these instances following; of St. Peter's successor he saith 
c The ploughman's tale in Chaucer. , in the ploughman's tale. 

* P●t●r the Apostle.  Peter was never so gr●at a fool,  
To leave h●s 
* [Key] which the Papists say he hath of Heaven gate.  Key with such a 
* [Such a Lorrell] as the Pope.  Lorrell,  
Or take s●ch cursed such a tool;  
He was advised nothing well,  
I trow they have the key of hell.  
Their Master is of that place Martial,  
For there they dressen them to dwell;  
And with false Lucifer there to fall;  
They been as proud as Lucifer,  
As angry, and as envious;  
From good faith they been full far,  
In covetise they been curious.   
This, and much more doth he utter in the person of a simple Ploughman, implying thereby that the meanest Country●body in those days, could out of God's Word, tell what was right and religious, and what otherwise; yea, and tax the wickedness and blindness of the Romanists in those days.  
Touching their Shrift, Relics, Pardons, and merit of works, he saith as followeth 
d Chaucer in Prologue. in the description of the Friar. . 
Full sweetly heard he Confession,  
And pleasant was his Absolution.  
He was an easy man to give penance,  
Th●re as he w●st to h●ve a good pittance.  
For unto a poor order for to give,  
Is sign that a man is well yshrive.  
For many a man is so hard of heart,  
That he may not weep though him smart.  
Therefore in stead of weeping and of prayers,  
Men moat give silver to the poor Friars.   
Touching the pardoner he saith 
The Prologue to the pardoners tale. ; 
Ne was there such another Pardoner,  
For in his male had he a pillowberes,  
Which as he said was our Lady's veil.  
He said he had a gobbet of the sail  
That Saint Peter had when that he went  
Upon the Sea till jesus Christ him shent.   
In the Pardoners tale he saith 
f The Pardoners tale. Chaucer. , 
Mine holy pardon may you all warish,  
So that ye offer nobles, or starlings,  
Other ●ls● silver spoons, brooches, or rings.  
Boweth your head under this Bull;  
Come up ●e wives, and offereth of your wool;  
Your names h●re I ent●r in my roll anon,  
Into the bl●sse of Heaven sh●ll ye all gone.  
I you assoil by mine high power  
Ye that offerens, as clean and eke clear  
As ye were borne.   
And elsewhere he saith 
The Summoners tal●. Chaucer. , 
The cleanness and the fasting of us Freers,  
Maketh that Christ accepteth our prayers.   
In the Romant of the Rose, he applieth the name of Antichrist to that Sea, saying 
h The Romant of the Rose. Chauc. , 
Of Antichrist's men am I,  
Of which that Christ saith openly;  
They have habit of holiness,  
And living in such wickedness.   
Take now a taste of the questions, which in the person of jack Vpland, he moves to the Friar.  
Friar saith he 
i Chaucer's Treatise called jack Vpl●●d. , Why make ye men believe that your golden 
* A Trental is thirty Masses.  Trentals, sung of you, to take therefore five or ten shillings at the lest; 
Against the Mass.  will bring souls out of purgatory? if this be sooth, certes ye might bring all souls out of pain, and that will ye nought, and then ye be out of charity.  
friar, what charity is this, to press upon a rich man, 
Against works of Supererogation.  and to entice him to die in a Friar's cowl, and be buried among you, from his Parish-church; and and to such rich men, give letters of Brotherhood, confirmed by your general seal; and thereby to bear him in hand, that he shall have part of all your Masses, Matins, Fast, wake, and all other good deeds done by you, and your brethren, both whiles he lives, and after his death? Why grant ye them the merit of your good deeds, and yet weeten never, whether God be apaid with your deeds, ne whether the party that hath that letter, be in state to be saved, or damned?  
Fre●re, 
Of Auricular Con●ession.  why hear ye not poor folk's shrift, but are Confessors to the rich, to Lords and Ladies, whom ye mend not? but they be bolder to pill their poor tenants, and to live in lechery.  
In this Age john de Rupe scissa was famous for prophecies and predictions. The Chronicler reports of him as followeth 
k Le Pape Innocent s●●. brus●er en ce temps (l'accus●nt de sorcellerie) un Cordelier nomme I●an de Rocque taillade en Avignon, pource qui'l estait fort aspre en ses sermons country le siege Romain; e● pourc●● qui'l avoit prophetise beau●op des choses advener touchant les Papes. jan. François le Peti●● Le Grand Chronique d● Holland. tom. 1. lib. 3. pa● 293. . Pope Innocent about that time caused a Cordelier, whose name was john de Rupe scissa, (accused of sorcery) to be burned in Avignion; because he was too sharp in his Sermons against the Sea of Rome, and because he had prophesied many things to come concerning the Popes, and amongst others said in plain terms; that the Pope would be one day like unto that Bird, which being naked, was fledged and feathered by borrowing a feather of every bird; and then seeing herself so furnished, fat, and fair, she began to flutter and strike at others with her beak and claws; the other birds that had made her so gay, seeing her pride and insolency, redemanded their own feathers, and so left the poor bird naked, and starved with cold. The like (saith he 
l Le semblable diso●t il que c● seroit un jour du Pape, et ●ource 〈◊〉 tenu et declare heretic. Il avoit commance a prophetiser des l' an. 1345. du ●emps du Pape Clement 6. e● vit on advevo● plusieurs choses de ce qui'l avoit prealit. id. ibid. ) will one day befall the Pope: and for this he was taken and pronounced an Heretic: he began to prophasis from the year 1345. in the days of Pope Clement the sixth; and diverse of those things came to pass which he foretold. Thus far the Chronicle.  
Froissart the Historian saith 
m Ence temps ung ●●ere 〈◊〉 p●●in de grand Clergy & de grand intendment e● lafoy Cite D● A●ignon es●oit qui lo app●lloit ●rere I●han de Roche taillade; l● quel ●rere min●ur le Pape innocent 6. fas●it 〈◊〉 en prison a● chastel de Baignoux pour les grandes marvell●s quil disoit a advenir. Io. Froissart. tom. 1. pag. 14●. ; Under Innocent the sixth there was at Avignion a c●rtaine Franciscan Friar, ●ndued with singular wit and learning, called joannes à Rupe-scissa, whom the Pope kept in prison in the Castle of Baignoux, for wonderful things which he affirmed should come to pass, especially upon Ecclesiastical Prelates. This john offered to prove all his assentions out of the Apocalypse, and the ancient books of the holy Prophets; and indeed this Parable, or similitude of the Bi●d, may very well seem to be taken out of the Apocalypse; for there it is said; that The Kings of the earth gave up their power and strength to the Beast: Apocalypse 17.13. but at length they shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat● her flesh, and burn her with fire. v. 16. And this was it that he meant by the Parable of the Bird, namely, that Christian Princes which had endowed the Sea of Rome with large privileges and possessions, would in time spoil her, and leave her desolate, accordingly as St. john foretold.  
In like sort Br●dg●t, a Canonised Saint, foretold as heavy a doom to the Papacy. She 
n Crucisigi● & p●rdis ani●●● electorum 〈◊〉; si●ilis 〈◊〉 Luci●●ro; 〈◊〉 Pilato, immitior juda, ab●o●minabi●ior judaeis. Sed●s tua demergetur quasi lapis ponde●osas, qui non sub●●lit ●ntequam 〈…〉 novissi●um pro●undi. Brig●t. in Revelat. 〈◊〉 1. cap. 41.  calls the Pope a Murderer of souls, the disperser and devourer of Christ's sheep, more abominable than the jews, more despiteful than judas, more unjust than Pilate, worse than Lucifer, and that his seat should sink like a weighty stone, alluding belike, to the fall of Babylon set forth in the Revelation, Apocalypse 18.21. by the Parable of a Millstone cast into the Sea, so shall Babylon be thrown down, and found no more.  
Alv●rus Pelagius wrote a book of the Lamentation of the Church, wherein he notably taxed Monastical vows; for speaking of the Monks and cloisterers of his Age, he saith 
o Paupertatis professores, sed haereditatum successores. Alvar. Pelag. de planctu eccles. lib. 2. c. 54.  They professed poverty, and yet expected other men's states and inheritances. And speaing of Priests and Votaries which had vowed chastity, he saith of them 
p Sed hodie Cellulae nostrorum Anachoritarum Hypocritarum à mulierculis visitantur. Id ibid. lib. 2. c. 51. , That the Cells of Anchorites were daily visited by women; and in another place 
q Per plurimos annos de latere Concubinae qualibet die surgunt. l. 2. c. 27. ; Priests for many years together do arise every day from their Concubine's sides, and without going to Confession, say Mass. And again 
r Perpaucisunt hodie Presbyteri, maximè in Hispania, & regno Apuliae, qui cum sint publici Concubinarij etc. Id. ibid. lib. 2. c. 7. , There be few Priests in these days, in Spain and Apulia, which do not openly foster Concubines. He saith 
s Def●cit hodie in Ecclesia Spi●itus prophetiae. Id. l. 2. cap. 5.  that now adays, The Law is perished from among the Priests, and vision among the Prophets, and that is fulfiled which is written, 1 Kings, Chap. 22. v. 22. I will go out and be a false spirit in the mouth of all his Prophets.  
In this age the Church and State of England was much burdened with the order of Franciscan Friers● insomuch as Richard Fitz-Ralph, an Irishman, Chancellor of Oxford, Archbishop of Armagh, and Primate of Ireland, a learned Divine, as Trithemius saith 
t Vir in divinis scripturis eruditus. Trithem.  wrote and preached against the begging Friars.  
In his Sermons at Paul's Cross in London in the year 1356. he taught 
u In statu [Innocentiae] nullus fuisset mendicus, ergo juxta ejus statum ●●si legis necessitate urgente non voluit esse, nec d●buit mendicus● unde consequitur, quòd nec unquam Christus ●uit sponte mendicus. Lex praecipit, omnimo indigens & mendicus non erit inter vos, Deut. 15. cap. ●rmacanus serm. 1. fact. in vulgari apud crucem S. Pauli London. 1356. , That Christ did not undertake any such voluntary poverty, as the Friar's vow; he held it an unchristian course to be a wilful beggar, as being condemned in the fifteenth Chaper of Deuteronomy.  
He discovered 
x Id ibid. Serm. 4.  the Friar's hypocrisy, in that though they pretended poverty, yet they had houses like the stately Palaces of Princes, Churches more costly than any Cathedral Churches, more and richer ornaments than all the Princes of the world, more and better books than all the Doctors of the world; cloisters and walking places so sumptuous, stately and large, that men of Arms might fight on horseback, and encounter one another with their spears in them: and their Apparel richer than the greatest Prelates.  
The contentions between Armachanus, and the Friars grew so hot, that Armachanus went in person to Avignion 
y Comparentibus ●àm Archi●piscop● quam Fratribus in Avinione coram P. Innocentio sexto, An. D. 1357. Richardus public● protul●t & legit propositiones suay. T●ithem. verbo Rich. Archiep. Ardma●. , where Pope Innocent the sixth kept his Residence, and there in the presence of the Pope, and the four orders of Friars he declared his opinion, and maintained such propositions as he had formerly held and publicly taught: the issue was this; the Pope had such use of these Friars, and the Friars had such store of money, 
z Armachanus opiniones suas ●rg● Fratre●coram summo Pontifice diu, pleurisy sustinuit, & ipsos manifest ● suis deviasse regulis multis rationibus demonstravit. Sed t●ndem (p●o● dolour) Clero Anglicano sibi subtra●ente promise, & exub●r●●te ●●uria Fratium sa●i● magn● 〈…〉, Fratres sua 〈…〉 ant su● data 〈…〉. Walsing●m in Edw●rd tertio.  (as Walsingham saith) that they procured favour in the Pope's Court; so that Armachanus could not prevail; though (as the same Walsingham saith) He proved the cause stoutly and manifestly against them.  
To speak yet a little more of our homebred witnesses: now lived Richard de Bury, Bishop of Durham, borne at S. Edmundsbury in Suffolk, and son to Sir Richard Angervile Knight; he wrote Philobiblon 
a 〈◊〉 and M●. Godwin in his 〈…〉. , and had always in his house many Chapleines that were great Scholars; Of which number were Thomas Bradwardine, Confessor to King Edward the third, and consecrated Archbishop of Canterbury, but never enthronized: Richard Fitz-Ralph, Walter Burley, and Robert Holcot the Dominican.  
Bradwardine was sometime fellow of Merton College in Oxford; and commonly called The profound Doctor. He taught the Article of free justification through Faith in Christ, the principal foundation of Christian Religion. He complains that the same had happened to him in this cause which sometime fell out with Elias the Prophet. Behold (saith he) 
b 〈…〉 Domi●e, ●odie ●um Pel●gio p●o libero 〈…〉 gratuitum gratiam 〈◊〉 pugnant; & ●ontra Paulum ●ugil●m g●a●i● 〈◊〉?— T●tu● 〈…〉 mundus post Pela●●●● 〈◊〉 in errorem: 〈◊〉 Domin●, & judi●●●●usam ●uam Tho. Bradw●●●in. Pres●t. in libr●s de 〈◊〉 Dei co●t●a Pelagium.  I speak it with grief of heart, as in old time against one Prophet of God, there were found eight hundred and fifty Prophets of Baal: So at this day, in this cause, how many (O Lord) do now sight with Pelagius for freewill against thy free grace, and against Paul the spiritual Champion of grace? how many at this day reject free grace, and only declare freewill to be sufficient unto Salvation? for the whole world almost is gone after Pelagius into error. Arise therefore O Lord, and judge thine own cause.  
Now also lived that famous Preacher Taulerus at Strasbrough in Germany; Bellarmine tells 
c Hunc vir●m, ut suspecti● circa fidem cōtempsi● Io. Eckius, sed egragie eum defendit Ludovicus Blosius. Bellar. de scriptor Eccles.  us that Eckius (Luther's great Antagonist) suspected Taulerus that he was not a sound Catholic; but Lewes Blosius hath notably defended him; the truth is, his judgement was reasonable clear, considering the time wherein he lived. For instance sake; he saith 
d Religiosi●tique, ad●o fo●tem reliquerunt aqu●e vivae (jerem. 2.) ut in fundo suo par●● aut nihil luminis & vitae habea●t Taul●rus. serm. in Ascens. Dom. Marc. ult. , There be many, and then of the religious sort, that have forsaken the fountain of living waters, and digged themselves pits, that can hold no water, jerem. 2.13. and these (saith he) are wholly addicted to their own I●stitutes, orders, und outward exercises; now though they perform many and great works in appearance, yet it is not their going on procession and pilgrimage, to procure pardons and indulgences (as they call them) it is not all their Orisons, their knocking on their breast, their gazing on curious pictures and images, and their bowing of the knee before them; all this (saith he) 
Et. licet multa isti opera grandia & apparentia perficiant, ut quòd pro Indulgentijs (ut vocant) consequendis circum●unt, quòd orationi insistunt, qu●d pectora ●un●unt, quòd pulchras contemplant●r Imagines, quòd genua flectunt, quòd totam per vagantur civitatem, nihil tamen horum acceptum est Deo in illis. Quare? quod a●orem, & intentionem suam in his omnibus non a● Deum referant, sed contorquent ad creaturas. Idem. Dominic. 18. post Trinit. serm. 2. Math. 22.  will not make their service acceptable to God: and why? because that in doing this, they direct not their affections and intentions unto God, but divert them to the Creature.  
He saith 
f Mul●i sunt qui Religiosi vocantur, qui magna qu●dam adsumant exercitia, ve●bi gratia; ●●junia, vigil●as, orationes, ●reb●as con●essiones, credunt namque se ob sola externa opera ●usti●icari & salvari posse, quod utique●ieri non potest; ●tiam cor exigit Deus. id. Serm. in Festo de uno aliquo Confessore, Luc, 11. , There be many that go under the name of Religious, who take great pains in set Fasts, wakes and vigils, orisons, and frequent shrift; and think they shall be saved and justified by these bodily exercises; but it can not be so, for God requireth the heart. He saith, (alleging the Prophet Esay, 64.6.) that all our righteousness is as filthy elouts; and that therefore we must not put our trust, or repose our con●●dence in any thing that is ours, be it our words or works, but in God.  
He commends unto us 
g Faciendum, quod mulierem Ch●nanitidem fecisse ex ●vangelio didicimus: quid enim illa fecit? ac●essi● ad Dominum. Id. Domini●. 2 Quadrages. Math. 15. ●xiens jesus, secessit in pa●t. ● Tyri & ●ydonis.  the practice of the woman of Canaan; and farther saith, he knew a Virgin who took the like course, and obtained her request; Now we know the practice of the woman of Canaan, of whom S. chrysostom long before him observed 
h Chrysost. in dimissione Chananeae; see Cent. 5. ; that she entreated not james, nor john, nor came to Saint Peter, but breaking through the whole company of them, said; I have no need of a mediator, but taking repentance with me for a spokesman, I come to the fountain itself.  
By that which hath been said, we see what Taulerus thought touching humane traditions, man's merits, and Saintly invocation.  
In this age also lived Gregorius Ariminensis, whom Vega styles 
i V●lent ille Gregor. Ariminensis, maximus & studiosissimus Divi Augustini propugnator. Vega in Opus●. de Iusti●icat. quaest, 6. , The most able and careful defender of St. Augustine. This learned Schoolman in his book upon the Sentences hath diligently confuted diverse tenets which are now holden by the Church of Rome touching Predestination, Original sin, freewill, the merit of works, and other points.   

PAP.  
You have produced diverse witnesses; but Mr. Briereley excepteth against them 
Pro●. Apology in the Authors advertisement in margin. ; and namely against Nilus, as erroneous touching the proceeding of the holy Ghost, as also a professed adversary to the Roman Church; insomuch as his book is put in the Catalogue of books forbidden 
l Nilus Thessalon. contrà Pap● Prim. al●às Illyrico suppositus, po●itur i●ter libr●s prohibit●s, in 〈◊〉 lib. prohib. ●ussu Concil. Trid. Hanou. 1611. . And as for john de Rupe scissa, William of St. Amour, Petrus Blesensis, Ockam, and Scotus, they were such as only reproved the life and manners of the Clergy 
m Prot. Apol. tract. 2. cap. 2 sect. 2. pag 328. .   

PROT.  
If you bar Nilus from witnessing on our behalf, because he erred in the point mentioned, by the like reason may we challenge Damascen, whom you usually produce on your behalf, as also others of the Greek Church.  
Neither can you disable his testimony, because he wrote against the Pope's primacy and purgatory; he had no personal quarrel with the Bishop of Rome (for aught we know) he might give his judgement on these points, and be unpartial: if the Pope forbade his book, there be other good men that approve it, and that for the proofs and reasons which he brings.  
Touching the other exception; for the preventing ●hereof, I have purposely given instance in this Catalogue in points of faith, and sparingly alleged such as only taxed Romish corruptions in life and manners; which yet is ofttimes accompanied with error in judgement; for as Ockam saith 
Mali m●res excae●ant intellectum, & ita qui potest peccare, potest incidere in errorem etiam contrà fidem. Ockam Dialog. part. 1. lib. 5 cap. 26. ; Because evil manners blind the judgement, therefore every assembly which may err notoriously in manners, may err against the Faith. Besides, William of St. Amour (as hath been said) opposed their Monkish vows, which is a Doctrinal point; Ockam opposed the Pope's supremacy, which is a Dogmatic point; Peter of Bloix, and john de Rupe-scissa, held the Pope to be Antichrist, and Ockam and Scotus held with us in diverse doctrinal points.  
And now having cleared this coast, I come to speak of our countryman john Wickliff; he was borne in the North, where there is (near to the place where I live) an ancient and worshipful house, bearing the name of Wickliff of Wickliff: He flourished about the year 1371. was Fellow of Merton-colledge, Master of Balioll-colledge in Oxford, where he commenced Doctor, and was chosen Reader in Divinity. In his public Lectures at Oxford he showed himself a learned Schoolman, in his ordinary Sermons a faithful Pastor of the Church, for whose use and benefit he translated the whole Bible into the vulgar tongue; one Copy whereof written with his own hand, is extant in St. john Baptist College in Oxford. In his writings he spoke and taught against the then corrupted doctrine of the Church of Rome, and specially against the order of the begging Friars, exhibiting a complaint to the King and Parliament against the Orders of Friars; which thing created him the hatred of diverse Prelates, but many good men favoured him.   

PAP.  
Were there many that took part with Wickliff, and followed his doctrine? and were those of the better rank, or only some mean persons?   

PROT.  
He was highly favoured of the Nobility, the City of London, and the University of Oxford. He was publicly borne out (as Parsons confesseth 
o Three Convers. of England, part 1. ch. 10. n●. 36. ) by john of Gant, and Lord Henry Percy, the one of them Duke of Lancaster, the other Marshal of England: And Walsingham saith 
p De Curia Principissae joannae Ludovicus Clifford pompose vetans ne praesum●r●nt aliquid contrà ipsum sententialiter definire— timore con●●●●● sunt. Walsingam i● Rich. 2. p. 205. , That when Wickliff personally appeared before the Prelates, who purposed to put the Pope's Mandate in execution, Lewis Clifford came with a Prohibition from the Queen, charging them not to give sentence against him; whereupon they were sore frighted, and desisted.  
In like sort, another time he escaped their hands, by the means of the Citizens, Burgesses, and Commons of London, as the same Walsingham saith 
q Non dic● 〈◊〉 tant●m Londinenses, sed ●●l●● ipsius 〈◊〉 si impudent●r ing●rere praesump●●runt in●●●dem ca●ellam apu● Lambeth, & 〈…〉. Id. ibid. pag. 206. ; and indeed the Londoners favoured him so much, that in all likelihood it stayed the Prelates from farther proceeding against him. But that which Walsingham most admires, is this; that Wickliff's opinions were not only entertained in Cities and Towns, but even in the University of Oxford itself, where was (as he saith 
r Ox●n●●●se 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 gen●rale quaè ●● g●avilapsu●●●p●●●tiae & s●ien●●ae ●●mine 〈◊〉. Id. ibid. p. 200. Prae●● 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, non in qui●●●●●● 〈◊〉 aut civi 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 said in ipsa Vniversitate Oxoniae, p●o●estis diebus: Cancellarius p●o tunc Magister N●●●●us Herford 〈◊〉 sectator joannis Wickliff, & quidaem Canonicus Leicestriae, & alij. Id. ibid. p 285. ) the very height and top of wisdom and learning. Neither did some young Students only follow him, but even the chief of the University, Master Robert Rig Vicechancellor, and the two Proctors took part with him; as also Nicholas Herford, john Ashton of M●rton-Colledge, john Ashwarby of Oriel-Colledge, Pastor of St. Mary's Church; these being preachers, and Bachelors of Divinity joined with him, and were questioned on that behalf.  
Thomas Walsingham specially notes 
s Robertus Ru●ge d●ebus solen●ioribus commisit onu● e●bihijs quos scivit acerri●●os joamnis Wic●●● sectatores. Philippus Rippendon Canonicus de Leycestria. talia per oravit● In doctrina autem speculativa cujufmodi est mat●ria de Sacramento Altaris: ponam (inquit) custodiam ori m●o, ●onec Deus aliter illustraverit, sive inst●ux●●it corda Cleri. Id. ibid. pag. 286. , that when the Archbishop of Canterbury had sent Wickliff's condemnation to Robert Rig, Chancellor of the University of Oxford, to be divulged, he appointed them to preach that day, whom he knew to be most zealous followers of Wickliff; and among others, he ordained one Philip Repington, a Cannon of Leycester, to preach on Corpus Christi day, who concluded his Sermon with these words; for speculative doctrine (saith he) such as the point of the Sacrament of the Altar is, I will set a bar on my lips, while God hath otherwise instructed or illuminated the hearts of the Clergy. And afterwards, when Bulls came thick from Rome, from the two Gregory's the eleventh and twelfth, against Wickliff and his doctrine; the whole University gave a testimony in favour of him, under their seal, in their Congregation house in these words among others 
t john Stows Annals in Richard the second. An. 1406. Octob. 5. . God forbid that our Prelates should have condemned a man of su●h honesty for an Heretic: but there is nothing that may more amply testify the spreading of his Doctrine, than an Act of Parliament in the days of King Richard the second, where it is related 
u Statute Anno qùinto Rich. 2. cap. 5. , that there were diverse, preaching daily, not only in Churches and Churchyards, but also in Markets, Fairs, and other open places, where a great congregation of people is, diverse Sermons containing heresies, and notorious errors for so they pleased to style it in those days.   

PAP.  
Was Wickliff's doctrine followed after his death?   

PROT.  
That which Wickliff taught, was neither borne with him, nor died with him; indeed if either the strength or policy of man could have made it away, it had not continued as it doth, to this day; for in the year 1378. Pope Gregory the eleventh directed his Bull to the University of Oxford against the doctrine and Articles of that learned man; even Rome itself ringing of his opinions in that University; and Walsingam saith 
Diu in pendule harebant utrum papal●m Bullam deberent cum honore recipere, vel omnino cum deed core ●efutare. Th. Walsing. in Rich. 2. p. 200. , that the Pope taxed the Heads of the University for the sleight care they took in the suppressing of Wickliff's doctrine; and the same Walsingham complains, that those of the University were long time in suspense, whether they should receive the Pope's Bull with honour, or reject it with reproach. Afterwards Gregory the twelfth directed another Bull to Oxford against Wickliff. Thomas Arundel Archbishop of Canterbury, held a Council at Oxford, and procured a visitation and sharp Inquisition against the Heads of Colleges, Halls, and others suspected of Wicklevisme, or Lollardy: and this Constitution is to be seen in Linwood 
y Constitut. Provincial. Angli● in Gul. Linwood. lib. 5. cap de Magistris §. Quia in super; & lib. 5. cap. de H●eret F●●aliter. . Now this was but a Provincial Constitution; in comes the Council of Constance, and condemns Wickliff, causing his bones to be taken up 
z Anno Dom. 1428. teste Gulielmo Linwood, q●i 〈…〉. Glossa in Provin●. Constitut. Angl. l 5. tit. de Magistris in verbo joan. Wickliff. , and burned forty years 
Obij● Wiclevus an. Dom. 1385. Th. Walsingh. Hypodigm. Neu●●r.  after his death and burial; and this mandate of the Popes was executed by Richard Fleming Bishop of Lincoln, as Linwood testifieth, who lived at the time when this was done, to wit, in the year 1428. and thus was the canonical censure passed upon Wickliff, and his adherents; now the secular power joined with them; for in the days of King Henry the fourth and fifth, there was made the Statute de Haeretico comburendo 
b Statute an. 2. Henrie● q●inti. cap. 7. against heresy and Lollardry. & an. ●. Henr. 4. cap. 15● , whereby the Wicklevists and Lollards were adjudged to be burned.  
After this King Edward the fourth sent mandatory letters to the Governors in Oxford, to make search for Wickliff's books, and to burn them; and accordingly the Masters and Doctors did: Here is now both his bones and his books burnt; they thought (belike) to make sure work, and never to hear more of the man again: but so it was, that out of his ashes, as it were, there arose another Phoenix and generation of Wicklevists which renewed his memory & doctrine; belike then there were many that followed his Doctrine; or else why made they so much ado? what needed so many Statutes, Letters, and Proclamations? so many Bulls, Counsels, and Constitutions? Indeed there were many in Oxford, and elsewhere, and them of good note, who embraced Wickliff's opinions after his decease, as namely 
d Mr. Fox's Church-story, vol. 1. in Rich. 2. pag. 475. etc. , Laurence Redman, master of Arts, David Sawtree, a Divine, William jones, Thomas Brightwell, William Haulam a Civilian, Ralph Greenhurst Fellow of New-colledge, as also one Walter Bruit a Layman, mentioned by one William Wideford, a great Papist; this Wideford writing against Wickliff, mentions 
e Vt aliâ● declaravi in Epistola missa Domino Ersordensi contralibrum Waltheri Brittae. Wil Wid●ford in artic. 11. advers. joan. Wiclevum, in Fascic. Rerum expetend. & sugiend. pag. 110.  a book of his own, sent to the Bishop of Hereford, in confutation of the book of Walter Bruit.  
In a word, Wickliff's doctrine was not contained within England only, but it gave light to other countries also; insomuch as one Peter Pain 
f Petrus Paine Anglus de Civili dominio Clericorum per tres desd●sseruit. id. ibid. pag. 157. , who was Wickliff's Scholar; and was sent with other Legates to the Council at Basil, went into Bohemia, whither he carried with him some of Wickliff's books, some part where of john Huss● translated into his mother's tongue, as Cochleus saith 
g Petrus pain Anglus, discipu●us Wiclephi. Pragam cum libris illius profug●●at. Cochleus Histor. Hu●sit. lib. 1. p. 8. ; who also reports 
h De quibu● & mihi ex Anglia quidam scripsit ●piscopus, esse sibi adhuc hodie duo maxima volumina Wiclephi, quae mole sua videantur aequare opera B. Augustini. id. ibid. p. 7.  how one of the Bishops wrote to him out of England, that he had two Volumes of Wickliff's, which were almost as large as Saint Augustine's works.   

PAP.  
What taught Wickliff? taught he as you do?   

PROT.  
He taught the same in substance, that we do; as may appear by a Treatise 
i Wickless Conformity to the Church of England by Tho. Iam●●.  of Wickliff's Conformity with the now Church of England both in doctrine and discipline. Besides, we may take a taste of his Tenets out of his Treatise against the orders of Friars, wherein he saith as followeth.  
First 
john Wickliffs' Treatise against the orders of Friars. cap. 1. & 18.  Friars say, that their Religion founden on sinful men, is more perfect than that Religion or order, which Christ himself made.  
Friars pursuen true Priests, and let them to preach the Gospel 
Cap. 12. & 36. ibid. . They pursuen Priests, for they reproven their sins, as God bids; both to burn them, and the Gospel of ●hrist written in English, to most learning of our nation.  
Friars send out Idiots full of covetise to preach, not the Gospel; but Chronicles, fables, and leasings, to please the people, and to rob them 
m Cap. 13. .  
Friars 
n Cap. 15.  by letters of Fraternity deceiven the people in Faith, robben them of temporal goods, and maken the people to trust more in dead parchment, sealed with leasings, and in vain prayers of Hypocrites, than in the help of God.  
Friars 
o Cap. 16.  perverten the right faith of the Sacrament of the Auter, and bringen a new heresy, they say it is an Accident withouten subject; which heresy came never into the Church till the foul fiend Satanas was unbounden after a thousand years.  
Friars 
Cap. 19  being made Bishops, robben men by extortion, as in punishing of sin for money, and suffren men to lie in sin, gotten of Antichrist false exemption.  
Friar's 
q Cap. 20.  teachen Lords, and namely Ladies, that if they dyen in Francis habit, they shall never come in hell, for the virtue thereof.  
Men say, the Friars be not liegemen to the King 
Cap. 23. , ne subject to his laws. For though they stealen men's Children, (to enter into their orders) it is said there goes no law upon them.  
Friars 
s Cap. 27.  saien apertly, that if the King and Lords, and other men stonden thus against their begging, and other things; Friars will go out of the land, and come again with bright heads: and look whether this be treason or no?  
Friart 
t Wickliff's complaint to the King and Parliament. The 2 Article.  feign, that though an Abbot and all his Covent been open traitors, yet the king may not take from them an half penny.  
Friars 
u Cap. 34. ibid.  also destroyen the Article of Christian faith, I belief a common or general Church: for they teachen that th● men that shall be damned, be members of holy Church, and thus they wedden Christ and the devil together.  
Friars 
x Cap. 44.  by hypocrisy binden men to impossible things that they may not do, for they binden them over the commandments of God, as they themselves say.  
Friars 
y Cap. 24.  wast the treasure of the land, forgetting Dispensations, vain pardons, and privileges.  
But of the pardon that men usen to day fro the Court of Rome ᶻ, they have no sikernesses (that is, certainty) by holy writ, ne reason, ne ensample of Christ, or his Apostles.  
By this we see that Wickliff stoutly opposed those Innovatours the Friars, who (like their successors the Jesuits) taught and practised obedience to another Sovereign than the King; persecution for preaching the Gospel; exemption of Clea●gy-men; the use of Legends in the Church, and reading of fables to the people; pardons and indulgences; the heresy of an accident without a subject; singular and blind obedience; and lastly, works of Supererogation.  
Now whereas Wickliff was reputed an Heretic, it is likely that this imputation was laid upon him especially by Friars, to whose innovations he was a professed enemy.   

PAP.  
Many exceptions are taken against Wickliff, and namely, that he held 
a Wicle●● Articulus sextus in Concilio Cons●antiensi dam●atus sess. 8. Deus debet obedir● diabolo. Bellarm. i● praefat. controversiar. Harding in Apologiâ juelli part. 1. chap. 2. divis. 1. ; That God ought to obey the devil.   

PROT.  
Our learned Antiquary of Oxford, Doctor james, hath made Wickliff's Apology, and answered such slanderous objections as are urged by Parsons, the Apologists and others.  
Now for the objection made, there is neither colour nor savour of truth in it; there was no such thing objected to him in the Convocation at Lambeth; neither can his adversaries show any such words out of any book written by Wickliff, although he wrote very many. Indeed we find the quite contrary in his works, saith his Apologist; for Wickliff saith 
b Commentar. in Psalm. p. 112 ●este T. jamesio in Wicklif●es conformity. , That the devil is cleped (that is, called) God's Angel, for he may do nothing but at God's suffering; and that he serveth God in tormenting of sinful men. The phrase indeed is strange, and if either he, or any of his Scholars used such speeches, their meaning (haply) was, that God not in his own person, but in his creatures yieldeth obedience to the devil; that is, sometimes giveth him power over his creatures.   

PAP.  
Wickliff taught 
Rhemist. annot. in 1 Peter 2. sect. 8. and Parsons three convers. third part. chap. 3. , That Magistrates and Masters are not to be obeyed by their subjects and servants, so long as they are in deadly sin.   

PROT.  
Even as light Housewives lay their bastards at honest men's doors, so you falsely father this misbegotten opinion on Wickliff, which some of your own side say 
d Alphonsus à Castro advers. ●ares. lib. 14. tit. Tyrannus. Gerson primâ parte contrà Assertiones joannis Parvi● fol. 81. , belongs to one john Parvi, a Doctor of Sorbone. And indeed in right it is your own, inasmuch as you, upon colour and pretence of heresy in Princes, absolve subjects from their Allegiance 
A Bull granted by Pope Pius the fifth to D. ●●●rding for absolving the Queen's Subjects. , and raise them up in arms against their lawful Sovereign; witness your bloody massacres in France, the death of the two last Henry's in France; the untimely death of the Prince of Orange; the many attempts and treasons against Queen Elizabeth; as also that hellish design of the Gunpowder treason.  
But suppose Wickliff said so, yet his words might have a tolerable construction; to wit, that a Prince being in state of mortal sin, ceased to be a Prince any longer; he ceased to be so in respect of any spiritual right or title to his place, that he could plead with God, if he were pleased to take the advantage of the forfeiture; but that in respect of men, he had a good title still in the course of mundane justice; so that whosoever should lift up his hand against him, offered him wrong 
f D. Field of the Church-book, 5. chap. 45. in fine.— Wickliff thought that godless persons, howsoever Officio in office and place, they be Kings and Bishops; yet merito, that is in merit, they are neither, because they are unworthy to be either. D. Field in Append. 2. part. p 86. .  
Wickliff indeed admonisheth the King, and all other inferior Officers and Magistrates, as elsewhere he doth Bishops; That he beareth not the sword in vain, but to do the office of a King, well and truly to see his Laws (rightly) executed, wherein if he fail, than he telleth him, that he is not properly and truly a King, that is, in effect 
g Perdens nomen officij & ordinis in effectu. lo. Wicleu. de verit. script. 513.  and operation; which words are spoken by way of exhortation: but so far was he from mutiny himself, or persuading others to rebellion, that never any man of his rank, for the times wherein he lived, did more stoutly maintain the King's Supremacy in all causes, as well as over all persons ecclesiastical and civil, against all usurped and foreign jurisdiction, and one of his reasons was this, that otherwise he should not be King over all England, but Regulus parvae partis 
h Id. de fundam. leg. Angl. cap. 36. , a petty governor of some small parts of the Realm.   

PAP.  
Wickliff taught 
i Brereleyes' Pr●t. Apolog. tract. 2. cap. 2. sect. 4. , that so long as a man is in deadly sin, he is no Bishop, nor Prelate, neither doth he consecrate, or baptise.   

PROT.  
If Wickliff said so, he said no more than the Fathers, and a Council said before him. Saint Ambrose saith 
N●msi aliter esse cupis, Epis●opus esse non potes; nisi si● irr●prehensibili●, 1. Tim. 3. Ambros. de dignit. Sacerdot. c. 4. tom. 4. , Unless thou embrace and follow the good-worke of a Bishop, a Bishop thou canst not be. The Provincial Council saith 
l Quicunque sub ordinat●one Presbyterij, vel Episcopatus mortali crimine se dixerint esse pollutos, à supradictis o●dinationibus submovend●s c●nsuimus. Concil. Valentinum sub Damaso. cap. 4. , Whosoever after the order of Bishop or Priesthood shall say, they have been defiled with mortal sin, let them be removed from the foresaid orders.  
The truth is, Wickliff lived in a very corrupt time, and this made him so sharply inveigh against the abuses of the Clergy; but abusus non tollit rei usum; and yet Wickliff writeth 
m Lib. Miscel. pag 260. Wiclev. i● Ms.  against them that will not honour their Prelates. And he elsewhere expresseth his own meaning, that 
n Nomen non facit Episcopum sed vita. De v●rit. Scrip. p. 443.  it is not the name, but the life that makes a Bishop; that 
o Quicunque nomine tenus Sacerdos, vel Episcopus qui non compensat illi nomini ipsius● nomini● ration●m, non est verè Episcopus vel Sacerdos. ib. pag. 443. , if a man have the name of a Prelate, and do not answer the reason thereof in sincerity of doctrine, and integrity of life; but live scandalously and in mortal sin, that he is but a nomine-tenus Sacerdos, a Bishop or Priest in name, not in truth: Nevertheless his ministerial Act may be available, for thus saith Wickliff 
p Nisi Christianus ●u●rit Christo ●nitus per g●atiam, non habet Christum Salvatorem, nec sine falsitate dicit verba Sacrament●lia; licet pro●int capacibus: Oportet enim Sacerdotem con●cientem esse memb●um Christi, ●t u● Sancti loquuntur, quodammodo ipsum Christum. de verit. Script. pag. 138. , Unless the Christian Priest be united unto Christ by grace, Christ cannot be his Saviour; nec sine falsitate ●icit verba sacramentalia, Neither can he speak the Sacramental words without lying, licèt prosint capacibus, Though the worthy receiver be hereby nothing hindered from grace.   

PAP.  
Wickliff held 
Parsons and Brerely. loccitat. , that it was not lawful for any Ecclesiastical persons to have any temporal possessions, or property in any thing, but should beg.   

PROT.  
This imputation is untrue; for what were the lands and goods of Bishops, Cathedral Churches, or otherwise belonging to Religious houses, which were given Deo & Ecclesi●, were they not temporal possessions? and yet are rightfully held, according to Wickliff●s tenure by Ecclesiastical Ministers; and long might they and peaceably enjoy them for him, in as ample manner as ever they did, so long as they were well employed according to the will and purpose of the Donours, willing nothing contrary to God's Word.  
But for the lands belonging to so many Chaunteries, Abbeys, Friaries, Priories, Monasteries, and other religious houses, he was of opinion 
r 〈◊〉 malum foret ●t expropriata f●rent omni● temporalia quibus Ecclesi● Anglicana est dotat●. De verit. Script. p. 465. , that Kings might dispossess them of them, and give them genti facienti justitiam, to good and godly uses.  
Concerning the other part of the objection; Wickliff indeed commends a kind of Evangelicall poverty, and withal allegeth 
s Wicklif●es Complaint to the Parliam. pag. 13.  that of Saint Paul to Timothy, That we are to be paid, that is, contented, if we have lifelode, that is, living, and to be hiled, that is, covered withal, to wit, with food and raiment; nevertheless he did not debar Ministers from actual having, but from affecting the things of the world, which were to be renounced per cogitationem & affectum 
t Vt Cleric●●int pauperes in facto, vel i● anito, vel utrinque, & ●mninò quod cov●a●● ab ●●ariti● & fostu seculi. De ver. Scrip. p. 570 , in mind and affection, as he saith.  
Lastly, touching begging, he was so far from joining himself to the begging ●ri●r●, and their order, that he wrote a set Treatise against their order, as also he put up a petition to the Parliament against them. 
u Parsons three. Convers. part. chap. 10. num 37.    

PAP.  
Wickliff and his disciples went barefooted, and basely clothed in course russet garments down to the heels,   

PROT.  
Wickliff went well apparelled, and kept a good table of that which was his own; insomuch as he professeth 
x Inter alia peccata de quibu● timeo, hoc est unum prae●●puum, quod consumendo in excessivo victu et vestitu, bona pa●perum, deficio● De versed. Scrip. pag. 192. , that He feareth not any thing will be so much laid to his charge, as that he spends that in good fare and apparel, which might be bestowed on the poor.   

PAP.  
Wickliff held 
b Deci●ae sunt purae eleemosi●e ●t parochiani possunt ●ropter peccata suorum Praelatorii ad libitum s●um auferre ●as. Wicklevi Artic. 18. damnat. in Concil. Constant. , that tithes were mere Alms, and that for the lewdness of the Priests, the parishioners might detain their tithes at at their pleasure.   

PROT.  
Wickliff lived in a time wherein he saw tithes, oblations, and the Church's revenues spent in riot and luxury, the cure of souls neglected, and the poor unreleived; and seeing this great abuse of tithes, he let some inconsiderate speeches fall touching tithes: so that whereas he seemeth to be against tithes, it is to be understood against tithes, as than they were abused by Friars; for Friars then had power from the Pope to appropriate tithes to their Covents, by which means tithes came into their possession. This thing Wickliff thought unlawful, and would have had tithes reduced to their ancient use again.  
Besides, Wickliff would neither have tithes taken from the Church, nor yet from the Incumbent but in some cases: not from the Church, for his rule was 
c 
Decima praediales non debe●t subtrahi, cum ad Ecclesiam pertinean●.  
Wickliffe● conformity.  , that predial tithes were not to be taken from the Church, since they belong to the same; yea, he cha●rges the people in ●alutem animae 
d ●d Parochianos put●n●● in ●●lutem A●i●● Decima● ac ob●a●io●es id●●e● ministrare. De verit. Script. pag. 435. , upon pain of their salvation, to pay their tithes du●ly and truly unto their Parson: neither would he have them paid to a good Minister only, but to others also 
e Posi●●, quod sit not●rio crimine irreti●us. Ibid. pag. 413 , unless the fact were v●ry scandalous and notorious; and thereof he would ●ot have the people, but the Prelates and superiors to judge and censure: And in case the party delinquent be either so vicious a man of life or doctrine, as that there is no hope of his amendment, or else hath committed some such fact as wilful murder or Treason, whereby he is ipso facto depriveable in law, the tithes are not to be quite taken away from 
f Auserre à Clerico bona fortun●e est paena mitissima ibid. p. 430.  the Church, but to be sequestered, as it were for the next Incumbent; and he gives instance in Elies' sons 
g Wickliff's complaint to the Parliament. pag. 12. .   

PAP.  
Wickliff taught 
h Prot. Apol. tract. ●. cap. 2. sect. 4. , that All things come to pass by absolute necessity, which is Stoical.   

PRO●.  
Wickliff telleth us 
i Deus nemini promitti● paenam vel praemium, nis● sub conditione tacitâ vel expressa De verit. Scrip. p. 383. , that God's promises and threatenings are conditional; and that as God hath appointed the end, so he hath appointed the means of our salvation; but notwithstanding he grants such a necessity, yet he adds 
k In exposit. Decalogi. p. 81 , quamvis omnia futura de necessitate eveniant, Deus tamen vult quod bon● servi● suis eveniant, per medium quo oratur.   

PAP.  
He condemned lawful Oaths, savouring therein, saith Os●ander, of Anabaptism 
l Brereley ibid. .   

PROT.  
Had Osiander seen Wickliff's Latin exposition upon the third Commandment 
m It is the second Commandment in his account. , and his book of the truth of the Scripture, or his 
De aquivocis Iu●amentis et ●all●cibus vitandis. De verit. Script. pag. 284●  treatise against A●quivocation; he would have been of another mind; for therein he plainly shows the contrary; condemning equivocal propositions 
o Scribi● contra propositionem incompl●t●● & pe●dulam intelligend●m cum sensu suo sinistro. ibid. p. 282. , whether with Oath, or without Oath; willing men not for a world of worlds 
p N●mo me●tire●ur quocunque levi mendacio, pro s●lvatione vita propriae, et vi●ae proximi, vel p●o salvatio-infinitorum mu●dorum. ibid. p. 242 , or for the salvation of his own, or another's soul, to lie and equivocate. And elsewhere he saith 
q Wickliff's Complaint. p. 55. , God teaches to swear by him in need, and not by his creatures: whereby it appears that Wickliff was no usual dissembler of his faith, as Mr. Brerely would have it.   

PAP.  
Wickliff 
r Brereley loc. citat●.  inveied against the Church, for that he had been deprived by the Archbishop of Canterbury, from a certain Benefice.   

PROT.  
Because he was deprived of his Benefice, he wrote against the Church; by the like reason, because he was preferred to another Benefice in Leicester-shire where h● died; therefore he should not have inveighed against the Church. But I should think that the great john of Gaunt, Duke of Lancaster, might have helped him to a small head-ship of Canterbury College in Oxford. For Pars●ns confesseth 
Three Convers. part. 1. c. ●0. n●. 36.  that Wickliff was in great favour with the Duke, and publicly borne out by him; and the Duke (as th● same Parsons saith 
s Ibid. part. 3. cap. 5. num. 11 ) Governed all in the later days of his Father King Edward the third, and was also in good favour with his Nephew King Richard the second, all the time that Wickliff lived; so that in all likelihood he might have helped him to the Bishopric of Worcester.  
Besides, if Wickliff (as Parsons saith 
t Ibid. part. 3. cap. 5. ●●. 14. ) contemned all temporal goods, a●d adjoined himself to the begging Friars; what made him then affect the Bishopric of Worcester?  
Well, but the missing of these places provoked him to inveigh against the Church; so was Jerome provoked by the Clergy of Rome, and this sharpened his style against them 
u Cum in babylon ver s●rer, & pu●pur●ta meretrici● colo●●● essem— & ec●e Pharisae●rum c●●c●●●avit Senatus. Hieron. ad Pa●linam. in lib. Dydim● de Spir● Sancto● praef●t. ; and yet are not Saint Hi●romes works any whit the more misliked.  
Lastly, he inveighed not against the Church; for he protesteth that he did as near as he could both write and speak, and do all things, ad Honorem Dei & utilitatem Ecclesiae 
x De verit. Script. p. 145. & 15. , for the glory of God, and the benefit of his Church.  
The occasion of Wickliff's discontent I find to be this 
y Godwins Catalogue of the Bishop● of England.  Simon Langham, Archbishop of Canterbury, sequestered the fruits of the Benefice of Pagham from Canterbury College; and withal molested the Scholars there, intending to displace them all, and to put in Monks, which in the end he brought to pass. Now Wickliff was one of them that were thus displaced, having withstood the Archbishop in this business with might and main; but by the Pope's favour, and the Archbishop's power, the Monks overbore Wickliff and his fellows,   

PAP.  
You have spoken enough of Wickliff, and his Disciples; what were those Lollards you mentioned?   

PRO●.  
They were a company of true and godly professors; ●ome have conceited them to have been called Lollards of Lollium, cockle or darnel, and so saith the gloss in Linwood 
z Linw●od sup● provincial. Constit. Angl. lib. 5. ●ap. de Haeret. § Finaliter. Glossa in verbo Lollardi●, sic dicta à Lollio. quia s●●ut Lollium inficit s●getes, ●ic Lollardi. ; as also in the Squire's prologue in Chaucer.  
I smell a Loller in the w●nde (quoth he) abideth for Gods digne passion, for me shall have a predication, this Loller here will preach us somewhat— here shall he not preach, here shall he no Gospel gloze, ne teach; he believeth all in the great God (qu●th he) he would sown some difficulty, or spring cockle in our clear corn. But they were called Lollards from one Raynard Lollard, 
History of the Waldenses. book 2. ch. 11.  who at the first was a Franciscan Monk, and an enemy to the Waldenses, but yet a man carried with a sanctified desire to find the way of salvation. He afterwards taught the doctrine of the Waldenses, was apprehended in Germany by the Monks Inquisitours, and being delivered to the secular power, was burnt at Cologne. He wrote a Commentary upon the Apocalypse, wherein he applied many things to the Pope as to the Roman Antichrist. This was he of whom the faithful in England were called Lollards; where he taught, witness that Tower in London which at this present is called by his name Lollards Tower, where the faithful that professed his religion were imprisoned.  
john l● More in the third part of the difference of Schisms 
b Predit plus●curs ●utres saints pe● son's par revelation divine, si comme Boc●ace. Saint Vincent de Valence, de ●ord●e de Fr●res prescheu●s. ●albe Ioach●n Calabro●s, Frere Reynard, L●dart. I●h●n le Ma●●e de Belges en la ●●erce pa●t●● de la disser●●ce des schisms ●t des Concil●es de 〈◊〉, ●●sive 24. , puts him in the rank of those holy men that have foretold by divine revelation many things that have come to pass in his time; such as were Boccace, Saint Vincent of Valence; of the order of preaching Friars; Io●chim Abbot of Ga●abria; to them he adjoineth the Friar R●ynard Lollard. And so I proceed to the several points in question.  

Of the Scriptures suffici●n●y and Canon.  
Wickliffe saith 
c De verit. S●ript. pag. ●5 l●b. de 7. p●●●●t. mortal. pag. 40.— Scriptura s●c●ndu● sensum suum s●cr●m 〈◊〉 pr● qua●●m scien●●● necessary 〈◊〉 de ver. S●rip. pag. ●6● , that Christ's law sufficeth by itself to rule Christ's Church; that a Christian 〈◊〉 well understanding it, may thence gather sufficient knowledge during his pilgrimage h●re on earth. Lyra upon those words in the Gospel, They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them, Luke 16.29. makes this inference 
d H●bent Mosen qu● docuit moralia & agenda; & ●r●p●●●as qui doc●er●nt mystica & credenda; et ista suffic●unt ad salutem; & ideo sequitur. audiant il●os. Lyra 〈◊〉 Lucae cap. 16. ver. 29. , Moses he taught morality, and what was our duty to do; the Prophets taught mysteries, and what we are to believe; Et ista sufficiunt ad salutem, and these are sufficient for our salvation; and therefore it follows, Hear them: so that he reduceth all to two heads; the Agenda, or practical part● and the Credenda, or Articles of the Creed, and these essential necessaries contained in the Scriptures, he makes sufficient to salvation.  
Amongst the sundry opinions which Ockam reckons up, this is one, saith Ockam 
e Illae solae ●eritates sunt Catholicae repu●ande. & de necessitate s●lu●is credende● quae in Canone Bibliae explicitè vel implicit● asseruntur. Itaque si a●ique veritatoes in Biblia sub ●o●ma propria mini●è contmentur, ex solis tamen contentis in ●a consequentia necessaria & ●ormali possunt inferri; sunt in●er Catholica● connumerand●. Ockam Dialog. pa●t. 1. lib. 2. cap. 10. , That only those verities are to be esteemed Catholic, and such as are necessarily to be believed for the attaining of salvation, which either expressly are delivered in scripture, or by necessary consequence may be inferred from things so expressed.  
Richard Fitz-Raphe, Archbishop of Armagh, and Primate of Ireland, saith, It is defined in general Counsels, that there are two and twenty Authentical books of the Old Testament. 
f Concilijs Generalibus definiunt viginti duos libros veteris Testamenti esse authenticos. Armacha● in Quastionib. Armenorum, lib. 19 ca●. 19  Nicholas Lyra the converted jew, is plentiful in this argument; Now that I have by God's help 
g Postquam anxiliante Deo scripsi super libr●s Sa●rae Scripture Canonicos, super alios intendo scribere qui no● sunt de Canone, scilicet● L●ber Sapientiae, Ecclesiasticus, judith, Tobias, & libr● Maccabaeorum; recepti sun● ab Ecclesia, ut ad morum informationem in ●a legantu●, ●amen eorum authoritas ad probandum e● quae in contentionem veniunt minùs idonea reputatur. Lyra praefat. exposit. in Tob●am.  (saith he) written upon the Canonical books of holy Scripture, beginning at Genesis, and so going on to the end; trusting to the help of the same God, I intent to write upon those other books that are not Canonical, such as are the book of Wisdom, Ecclesiasticus, judith, Tobias, and the books of Macchabees; and withal addeth, that it is to be considered, that these books which are not Canonical, are received by the Church, and read in the same for the information of manners; yet is their authority thought to be weak to prove things that are in controversy. And the same Lyra writing upon the first of Esdras, the first Chapter, saith, That though the books of Tobias, judith, and the Maccabes be Historical books, yet he intendeth for the present to pass by them, and not to comment on them, and he gives his reason; namely, quia non sunt de Canone apud judaeos, nec apud Christianos', because they are not in the Canon, neither with the jews, nor with the Christians.  
Wickliff also held 
h S●tis est pro su● militia ●abere 22. libr●s de veteri Testamento— Authentic●s. Wickli●●e de ver. Scrip. p. 110. , that there are but two and twenty Authentical books of the Old Testament.   

Of Communion under both kinds; and number of Sacraments.  
THe custom of communicating in both kinds, was not abolished in the beginning of this Age, but was retained in certain places, especially in Monasteries, until the year of our Lord thirteen hundred and more. Thus writeth Cassander 
In utraque spec●e Communio 〈…〉 locis, prasertim 〈◊〉 Mon●sterijs ret●nt●●st, idque usque ad annum amplius mille ●imum trecentesimum. Cas●ander Consult. Art. 22. . Beatus Rhenanus saith 
Prohibetur ne qu●cquam pretio s●rum vaso●um possideant, praeter C●licem ●rgente●m, & fillulam, quâ Lai●i Domi●●cum absorbeant sanguinem, Bea●. Rhenan in Tertullian. de Corona militia. , that Conradus Pellicanus, a man of wonderful sanctity and learning, did find in the first constitution of the Carthusians, That they were forbidden to possess any vessels of price, besides a silver Chalice and a pipe, whereby the lay-people might suck the blood of our Lord.  
Durand their profound Doctor denieth 
l Matrimonium non est Sacramentum strictè & pr●priè dictum, sicut alia Sacramenta novae l●gis. Durand. in lib. 4. dist. 26. quaest. 3.  Matrimony to be a Sacrament properly so named, and of the same nature with the rest, or to give grace.  
Robert Holcot our countryman, denied 
m Ho●cot● (apud Petrum de Aliaco in qu●rtum) negat Confirmationem esse propriè Sacramentum. Cassand. Consult. art. 13,  that Confirmation was from Christ's Institution; now Bellarmine saith 
n Sacramentorum a●t●orem solum Christum esse. Bella●. l. 1. de Sacram. cap. 23. , that Christ only can institute a Sacrament 
o Alphonsus de Castro advers. Hares. lib. 14. tit. unct. extreme. , Alphonsus à Castro telleth us, and that from the testimony of jodocus Clichtoveus, and Thomas Walden, (a bitter adversary of Wickliff's) that Wickliff held extreme unction, or annealing, was not a Sacrament.   

Of the Eucharist.  
Ockam saith 
p Occam Cent●log. conclus. 39 , There are three opinions of Transubstantiation, of which the first supposeth a conversion of the Sacramental Elements; the second, an annihilation; the third affirmeth the bread to be in such sort transubstantiated into the body of Christ, that it is no way changed in substance, or substantially converted into Christ's body, or doth cease to be, but only that the body of Christ in every part of it, becomes present in every part of the bread. This opinion he saith, the Master of Sentences mentioneth, not much disliking it; yet it is not commonly holden.  
Their own Proctors and Canonists, Hostiensis and Gaufridus tell us 
q Hostiensis etiam & Gaufridus, & Berengarius sup. Decretal. firmiter credimus; et cum Martha e●●e quod pa●is substantiam remanere dicunt; imò potius referunt ad Confessionem Berengarij, quae fuit per Concilium approbata Durand. in 4. Sent. dist. 10 q. 1. nu. 13 , that there were diverse in those days, who taught, that the substance of bread did remain; and this opinion, say they, was not to be rejected.  
Durand was of opinion 
r Durand. 4. di●●. ●●. qu● 1. , That the material part of the consecrated bread was not converted; insomuch that Bellarmine professeth 
s Bellarm. l. 3. de Euc●ar● c. 13. sententia Durandi haeretica est, licet ipse non sit dicendus haereticus, cum pa●atus fuerit Ecclesiae judicio acquiescere. , that saying of Durand is heretical, although he is no heretic, because he is ready to submit to the judgement of the Church.  
Wickliff saith 
t Wickliff against the orders of Friars. cap. 16. , that Friars perverten the right faith of the Sacrament of the Auter, and bringen in a new heresy of an Accident withouten subject; and whence Holy writ says openly, that this Sacrament is bread that we breaken, and God's body; they say, that it is nother bread nor God's body, but accident withouten subject, and nought; and thus they leaven holy writ, and taken new heresy on Christ and his Apostles, and on Austin, jerom, Ambrose, Isidore, and other Saints, and the Court of Rome, and all true Christian men, that holden the faith of the Gospel. Now for his own opinion, he expresseth it in these terms 
u Iste panis est bene, ver●, e● realiter, spiritualiter, virtualiter, & sacramentaliter corpus Christi. Wickliff. Confessio de Sacram. Eucharist. pag. 58. , that the body of Christ was really & truly in the Sacrament, in his kind, that is, Sacramentaliter, & figuraliter by way of Sacrament, & figuratively; to wit 
x Sicut johannes Baptista figuraliter fuit Elias, & non personaliter. Art. 4. in Synod. Constant. damnatus. ; as Saint john Baptist figuratively was Helias, and not personally. So he saith 
y Est verus panis naturaliter, & corpus Christi figuraliter, Art. 49. Oxon. damnatus.  of the consecrated host, that it was Christ's body in figure, and true bread in nature; or which is all one, true bread naturally, and Christ's body figuratively. And Wickliff is very confident in his opinion; for he saith 
z Confess. de Sacram. Anglice pag 64. , that the third part of the Clergy of England, would be ready to defend the same upon pain of losing of their lives, cum non fuerit materia martyrij plus laudanda, there being no better cause of Martyrdom.   

Of Images and Prayer to Saints.  
TO speak properly (saith Durand) ᵃ the same reverence and respect which is due unto the Sampler, or person represented, is not to be given to the Image, sign, or Representee, neither aught the imag● to be adored with Latria, (or divine worship) for any reference or relation it hath to the thing represented thereby. Holcot also a principal Schooleman, saith 
b Nulla adoratio debetur Imagini; nec licet aliquam Imaginem adorare. Holcot. in lib. Sapient. cap. 13. lect. 158 p. 524. ; No adoration is due to an Image, neither is it lawful to worship any image; and his reason is this; Latria, or divine worship, is due only unto God. But the image of God is not God, therefore Latria, or divine worship is not due unto an Image: Otherwise (saith he) The Creator and the creature should both be adored with one honour. By this we see the Tenet of Thomas Aquinas controlled, who taught 
c Thom. Summ. par●. 3. quaest. 25. artic. 3. , that the Crucifix and Image of Christ was to be worshipped and adored with the selfsame honour, to wit, of Latria, that Christ jesus himself was to be honoured with.  
Durand also held 
d Fa●ere Imagines ad r●praesentandum D●um Pa●●em, & Spiritum s●nctum, aut v●nerari ●●s imagines ●atuum est. Vnde Damascenus dicit, qu●d insipientiae summae est, & im●ietatis figu●are quod est d●vinum● Durand. in 3. Sent. dist. 9 qu. 2. num. 15. , that it was utterly unlawful to picture or represent the Trinity, or God, otherwise than as in Christ he took our flesh, and was found among us as man. Wickliff was of opinion 
e Wickliff's Apology. chap. 8. sect. 6. , that it were better to banish Images clean out of the Church; and to this purpose he allegeth that noted saying of Epiphanius; and according to his doctrine not long after 
f Wa●singam● p. 358.  William N●vill, L●wis Clifford, Thomas Latimer, and john Montague turned out Images out of certain Chapels within their jurisdictions.  
Concerning prayer to Saints, whereas we hold it vain to pray to the Saints deceased, unless we might be assured that they heard and understood our prayers, and beheld the secret thoughts of our heart; some have conceited the glass of the Trinity, according to that of Gregory; He that seeth God, who seeth all things, cannot but see all things in him; but this saying is rejected by Hugo de S. Victore, as we heard in the last age, as also by Occam 
g O●●ham Dial pag. 2 tr. 1. cap. 3. ubi con●utat Iohan●em 22. H●●●sin esse pronunciat. difede; ●il●ntes Deum nulla ignorare, etc. Magist Sent. l. 2. dist. 11. accipiendum dicit d●ctum G●●gor●●, de hij● quorum cognitio beatum facit cogni●●rem, ut sunt ●a quae pe●ti●●● ad mysterium Trinitat●s. Sed haec explicatio ●●r●o Gregorij non convenit moral. 12. ●. 13. ●●llo ●odo tr●dendum est quia ●oris sit ●liquid quod ignorant. Cum igitur non vid●at omnia● & per consequens non Facialiter cl●rè vident Deu●●. , Scotus, and sundry other excellent men. It is true indeed, that they see God face to face. 1. Corinth. 13.12. yet this facial vision maketh not the blessed Saints to know all things. Every one which beholdeth the Sun, doth not behold every thing which the Sun effecteth and enlighteneth. The Saints know according to the capacity of creatures, and so far forth only as it pleaseth God, and is sufficient for their happiness: so that this glass of the Trinity doth not represent things according to the manner of a Natural Glass; but as Speculum voluntarium; such a Glass as maketh reflection of such notices as God is pleased to manifest more or less, when, in what manner, and to what persons himself pleaseth. Gregorius Ariminensis resolveth peremptorily 
h Greg. A●●minens. lib. 2 di●t. 9.10. quaest. 1. ex 2. Paralipom. ex dicto Salomonis, Tu solus nos●i corda istorum hominum; et ex libro de Ecclesiasticis Dogmatibus, Secreta cordis ill● solus novit, etc. probat nullam cre●turam ●ognos●ere cogitationes ●o●dium n●st●orum. , that neither Saints nor Angels know the secrets of our hearts, but that this is reserved as peculiar to God alone.  
Besides, there wanted not some, who in this dark age of the Papacy, held it superfluous to pray to the Saints; insomuch that john Sharp in the University of Oxford publicly disputed these two questions, of praying to Saints, and of praying for the dead 
i cont●artum●ohn ●ohn Sharpe prooem. in quaestiones de orationibus sanctorum, & suff●agijs via●orum M S. in Bibliot●eca Collegij Mertonensis Oxon. Cited by D. Usher in his answer to the jesuit Tit. of prayer to Saints● p. 452 , especially, because it was esteemed by some famous men, and not without probability, that such suffrages and prayers were superfluous in the Church of God, although some other wise men thought the contrary.  
Wickliff also is noted by Bellarmine 
k Bellar. lib. 1. de Sanct. B●atit. cap. 15. ex●ho ●ho. Waldensi tom. 3. tit. 12● cap. 108 & sequent. , for one that opposed Invocation of Saints. Wickliff indeed saith as followeth 
Stultitia videtur sontem omn●o● par●t. orem relinqu●re, & ad rivum turbidum & remotum accedere. Quis faceret Scurram med●atorem suum, ut R●gis p●ratioris et clem●ntioris colloquio potiretur? Wickli●fe cap. 30. Te●tij Trial. & Waldensi● tom. 3. tit. 12. cap. 111. et 114 ; It seemeth to be a very great folly to leave the fountain which is at hand, and fetch water a far off out of a muddy pool. Who would make a Scurra, or vain fellow his spokesman to procure him access and audience in the King's Court, the King himself being more courteous and easilier to be entreated, than the mediator whom the petitioner used? where Bellarmine 
m Quib●s verbis obiter Sanctos Scurris, & rivis ●●rbidis conferebat. Bellar. 〈◊〉 citato.  bids us, by the way observe how Wickliffe● compared the Saints deceased to scurrilous persons, and troubled waters; this indeed is a shrewd imputation, but Wickliff presently expresseth his own meaning; saying 
n Sancti igitur incoelo licet non sint Scurrae, sed incorporati Christo per gratiam Salvatoris, tamen minus se habent in comparatione ad i●lum, quam Scurra ad Regem terrenum. Apud Wicletum & Th. walden's. loco citato, , The Saints in Heaven although they be no scurrilous persons, but incorporated into Christ by the free mercy of their Saviour; yet they are less in comparison of him, than any mean Groom, ●ester, or Para●ite is in comparison of an earthly King. Now what great harm is there in this comparison? job compared man, Yea a righteous man, to a worm; even the son of man which is but a worm. job 25. v. 6. Yea but the word Scurra, is an odious term; so it is indeed as now adays it is used. The vulgar Interpreter used the word Scurra, and Lyra expounds it de vilibus perfonis, of mean persons; and our English translates it, vain fellows. Wehn David danced before the Ark, Michal said to him 
2 Sam. 6. 2●. , The King uncovered himself to day in the eyes of his servants, as one of the vain fellows openly uncovereth himself. Howsoever, were it that 
p Sanctos non esse invocandos docuit joannes Wiclevus, qui● scilicet & ipsi K●ave● sive scurrae, hoc ●st servi, (vocabulo in hoc sen●u veteribus Anglis usitatissimo) essent, non autem Ne●u●ones, ut odiose interpretatur Bellarminus Anglici Idiomatis prorsus igna●us. Gabr. povelus in praefat. ad Acad. Oxon. ad lib. de Antichristo.  Wickliff used the Latin word Scurra, in a mollified sense, or the word Knave in the English. Time we know is the Emperor of words, and in process thereof some of them degenerate from their first institution. Idiota at first was used for a private man, now we take it for a fool, for an Idiot. The Wisemen that came from the East, were called Magis, Math. 2.1. Now we may not term them Magicians, for that were to call them Sorcerers: if one should call a King a Tyrant, it were treason, or a Wise woman Saga, he would be hardly thought of: so among the Latins, Fur, a Thief, when before it was a Servant.  

Virgil.  Quid faciant Domini audent cum talia Fures?  
When 
* Thiefs.  Slaves thus saucy are,  
What will their Masters dare?  
In like sort, the word knave sounded not formerly so odiously as now adays it doth; for Chaucer 
q The Miller's tale.  used it for a Servant. Go up (quoth he) unto his 
* Servant.  knave, Cleape at his door, 
* Cleape, that is, Calls  and knock fast with a stone. And in the same sense it is used by Sir Philip Sidney in his Arcadia.  
If that my man must praises h●ve,  
What then must I that keep the knave?  
Now, to proceed, Wicliffe in the other comparison alludes to that of the Prophet; 
r jer. ●. 13.  They have forsaken me, the fountain of living waters, and hewed them out Cisterns, broken cisterns that can hold no water: and so indeed are the purest creatures in comparison of God; for (as job saith) he charged his Angels with folly. job 4.18. Yea, the heavens are not clean in his sight. job 15.15. So that Wickliff's comparison was very fit, when he said the Saints were but like troubled waters, and them remote, and a far off, in respect of God, who is the pure wellspring, and at hand, for as the Psalmist saith 
s Psal. 145.18. ; The Lord is nigh unto all them that call upon him; yea, all such as call upon him faithfully.   

Of justification, and Merits.  
Chemninitius hath collected a number of sayings out of the Fathers and Schoolmen for proof of justification by faith only, and amongst the rest, for this fourteenth Century he produceth 
t Lyra in 3. cap. ad Galat● Ad quid suit lex utilis? quasi dicat, ●i Lex non justificavit, s●d sola fides, quare ergò posita est & datae? Chemnit. loc. Theolog. part. 2 â de justificat. p. 773.  the testimony of Nicholas Lyra.  
Wickliff also taught 
u Dec●everunt Apostoli sufficere ad salvationem Christianismi— fidem Domini jesu Christi. De ver. Script. pag● 494 Maritum. Christi per se su●●icit 〈◊〉 hominem r●dimere à Geh●nna. ibid. pag. 552. De per se Sufficientiâ● intelligitur sine 〈◊〉 ca●sa 〈◊〉 ibid. pag. 553. , that Salvations that, the merit of Christ is able by itself, to redeem all mankind from Hell, and that this sufficiency is to be understood without any other cause concurring.    

PAP.  
Master Brereley saith, that the Doctrine of justification by only faith, was unknown to Wickliff. Prot. Apol. Tract. 2. cap. 2. sect. 4. subdivision, 2.   

PROT.  
By that which hath been alleged, it appears it was known to him; but what if it were not so fully known to him? Wickliff was a long time kept in the mist of popery, so that he could not by and by discern the truth in all points; we blame him not for that he saw no more: we bless God for it, that he saw so much as he did, specially in this dark time of the papacy.   

PAP.  
Walden saith 
x Waldens. tom. 3. cap. 7.8.9. , that Wickliff defended Humane Merits.   

PROT.  
The same Friar saith 
y Wicklevist● d●str●●nt lib●rum arbitrium. Walden. tom. 3. pag. 24.  that the Wiclevists overthrew the point of freewill; if they took away freewill, how held they humane merits? D. james shows out of Wickliff's works, that he refuted the doctrine of merit, specially in his Commentaries upon the Psalms, where he beareth down 
z Commentar. in Psalm. p●g 474. , those proud Pharisees, which said, that God did not all for them, but think that their merits helpeth.  
He taught, that we are all sinners, not only from our mother's womb, but in our mother's womb 
Infant's peccant in matris utero. In exposit. Decalogi. pag. 77. ; so that we cannot so much as think a good thought 
b Comment in Psalm. pag. 109. , unless jesus the Angel of the great Council send it; nor perform a good work 
c Ibid. pag. 423. , unless it be properly his good works 
d Ibid. pag. 79. , His mercy comes before us, that we receive grace, and followeth us helping and keeping us in grace: he concludes, 
Comment. in Psalm. pag. 374.  that it is good only to trust in God: was this man a Pelagian? Friar Walden would make men believe he was one. Howsoever, there be other of our Countrymen, Bradwardine, Occam, and Holcot, men of special note in this age, who speak excellently in this point.  
Bradwardine, in his defence of the cause of God against the Pelagians of his time, disputeth this point at large showing; 
f Disputat meritum non esse causam ●terni praemij: ●umque Scriptura & Doctores confirment● Deum praemiaturum bonos propter merita sua bon●, Propter, non significare caus●m propriè● s●d impropriè vel causam cognosc●ndi velordinem, vel denique d●spositionem subjecti. Th● Bradward. in summa contra Pelagian. à pag. 350. ad 353.  that Merit is not the cause of everlasting reward: and that when the Scriptures and Doctors do affirm, that God will reward the good for their good merits (or works:) Propter did not signify the cause properly: but improperly, either the cause of knowing it, or the order, or the disposition of the subject thereunto.  
Occam saith, 
g Quia nullus actus ex puris naturalibus, nec ex quacunque cau●a creata potest esse meritorius, sed ex gra●ia Dei voluntary, & liber● acceptante. Ockam in prim. Sen●. dist. 17. cue est. 2.  No act done in puris naturalibus, or proceeding from any created cause whatsoever, can be meritorious, but by the free promise, and acceptation of God. Holcot saith, that our works have this worth, or value in them, not naturally, as if there were so great goodness in the nature or substance of the merit that everlasting life should be due unto it● but legally, in regard of God's ordinance and appointment: even 
h Sicut parva pecunia Cupri, ex natura ●ua, sieve natu●●li valone, non valet tantum, quantum unus panis, sed ex institutione Principis tantum valet. Rob. Holcot in lib. Sapient. cap. 3. lect. 36.  as a little piece of copper of it own nature or natural value, is not worth so much as a loaf of bread, but by the ordinance and institution of the Prince it is worth so much.  
Richard Fitzraufe afterward Archbishop o● Armagh in Ireland, saith 
i Cum aliquod genus praemij a●icui red●endum est, non propter condignitatem operis, sed propter promissionem, & sic p●opter justitiam pr●mianti●. Armachan. in quaest. Armenor. lib. 12. c. 21  that the reward is rendered, not for the condignity of the work, but for the promise, and so for the justice of the rewarder.  
Gregorius Ariminensis concludeth peremptorily, 
k Ex hoc ulterius infero, quòd nedum vi●ae aeternae, sed nec alicujus alterius praemij aete●ni vel temporalis aliqui● acts hominis ex quacunque cha●itate●licitus, est de Cond●gno meritorius apud Deum. Greg. in 1. Sent. dist. 17. qu. 1. art. 2.  that no Act of man, though issuing from never so great charity, meriteth of condignity from God, either eternal life, or yet any other reward; whether eternal or temporal; and he giveth his reason out of the Apostle, 1 Cor. 4.7. quoniam quilibet talis actus est donum dei, juxta illud Apostoli, 1 Cor. 4. because every such act is God's gift, every such work is the gift of God, and what hast thou, that thou hast not received? and if thou hast received it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it? Durand also is most resolute in this point 
l Quod redditur potius ex liberalitate dantis quam ex debi●o operis, ●on cadit sub meri●o de cond●gno stricte et proprie accepto. Sed quicquid à Deo accipimus, sive si● gratia, sive sit g●oria, ●ive bonum temporale vel spirituale, potius & principaliùs accipimus exlib●ralitate Dei, quam redd●tur ex debi●o operi●●rgo nihil penitùs cadit sub me●ito de Condigno sic accepto. Durand in 2. Sent. dist. 27 cue est. 2. sect. 12. , that which is conferred rather out of the liberality of the giver than out of the due of the work, doth not fall within the compass of merit of Condignity, strictly and properly taken. But whatsoever we receive of God, whether it be grace or glory, whether temporal or spiritual good, whatsoever good work we have before done for it, yet we receive the same rather out of God's liberality, than out of ●he debt or due of t●e work. Therefore nothing at all falleth within the compass of Merit of Condignity, so taken  
And 
m Caus● autem ●ujus ●st, quia et ●uud quod sumus, & quod habemus, ●ive sunt boni actus, sive bo●i ●●abitus, s●u ●sus; ●otum est in nobis ex liberalitate divina gratis dante & conservante. Et quia ex d●no gra●●ito nullus obligatu● ad dandum amplius, sed poti●s recipiens m●gis ●bligatur danti: ideo ex bonis habitibus, & ex bonis actibus, ●ive usibus nobis à Deo datis, Deus non obligaturnobis ex aliquo debito lu●●itiae ad aliquid amplius dandum, ita quòd si non ded●rit ●it i● jus●●s; sed potiu● nos sumus Deo obligali: & sentire, seu dicere opp●situm, ●st tamerarium se● Blasphemum. Id. sect. 13.14.  the cause hereof is, (saith he) because both that which we are, and that which we have, whether they be good acts or good habits, or the use of them, is wholly in us by God's liberality, freely giving and preserving the same. Now because none is bound by his own free gift to give more, but the receiver rather is more bound to him that giveth: therefore by the good habits, and by the good acts or uses which God hath given us, God is not bound to us by any debt of justice to give any thing more, so as if he did not give it he should be unjust; but we are rather bound to God. And to think or say the contrary, is rashness or blasphemy: and yet the Rhemists in their Annotations upon the sixth chapter of the Epistle to the Hebrews and the tenth verse, go very far in the contrary.    

THE FIFTEENTH CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 1400. to 1500.  
The Benefit of Printing.  

PAPIST.  
WWhat say you of this fifteenth Age?   

PROT.  
In this Age knowledge increased by the means of Printing, which was found out at Strasburg in Germany by one john Guttenburg: And indeed the benefit of Printing was great; for hereby the languages were divulged, books were far easilier now dispersed, than formerly the Manuscripts could be, and learning and good letters were generally communicated. Besides, that in this Age God raised up diverse Worthies, who by their confessions, writings, and martyrdom, witnessed the truth of the Gospel, as namely john Husse, and Hierome of Prague.   

PA.  
Were Hus and Hierome men of learning, and a godly life, and withal were they Martyrs, as you would seem to make them?   

PRO.  
Indeed they bitterly inveighed against the ambition, pride, covetousness and negligence of the Clergy; they urged the necessity of oftener preaching then was usual in those times, and desired to have the Communion in both kinds, according to the ancient custom of the Primitive Church, and could not be induced simply and absolutely to condemn the Articles of Wickliff 
a Er●ores Ioannis ●ss damn●ti in Concilio Constantien●i, quonia● publicè prae●icab●t ●oann●m Wicleff, vi●um Catholi●um, et authorem Evangeli●um Concil. Constant. Caranza in Summa Council. , but thought many of them might carry a good sense; and that the Author of them was a man that carried a good mind, howsoever he might fail in some things; and for these and the like tenets and reproofs they were burnt at Constance contrary to the public faith, and safe conduct given by the Emperor, yea, Aeneas Silvius (afterwards Pope Pius the second) saith expressly 
b Placuitque Sigismun d● Imperatore suadente joannem & Hieronymum ad Synoduns vocari. Aen. Sylu. Hist. Bohem. cap 36. ; It was thought good by the persuasion of Sigismond the Emperor, that john and Hierome should be called to the Council of Constance, so that they came not of their own accord, nor yet without their warranty and safe conduct: but the Fathers of the Counsel dealt ill with them, breaking the faith of the Emperor, and dispencing with the breach of his safe-conduct, as being of no force without theirs; because (forsooth) faith was not to be kept with Heretics (as th●y vainly alleged;) therefore these poor men must have no privilege of their Passport; the Emperor (saith Campian 
c Caesar obsignavit, Christ●mus orbis r●signavit, major Ca●sare● C●m. Rat. 4.  in a flourish of his) Sealed their Pass, but the Christian world, to wit the Council of Constance greater than Caesar, broke up the seal, and voided the Imperial warran●, notwithstanding the Emperor had both called the Council, and in a City of his owns, where he only had authority; and Wenceslaus King of Bohemia, at the request of the Council, sent thither john Hus, under the safe-conduct of the Emperor.  
Now what Master Hus his learning was, his works yet remaining do testify. Besides, he translated the Scriptures into the Bohemian tongue, which occasioned (as Cochleus saith) 
d Instituit Mechanicos● qui sac●as literas in ver●a●u●am li●guam tra●sl●ta●●●●vide l●g●●t●s, ●um Sacerd●tibus c●ram plebe d●●pu●arēt● quinetiam libros 〈◊〉 mulleres. Cochleus Hist. Hussit. lib. 1. pag. 18.  Artisans and Tradesmen to read them; insomuch as they could dispute with the Priests; yea, their women were so skilled, as one o● them made a book, and the Priests of the Thab●rites, were so skilled in arguing out of the Scripture, that one of them named Rokyzana, who had been present at the Counsel at Basil, undertook 
e Vobiscum, Fr●ter dilecte, pro sancti Calici● Communione ad plebes, scriptures S. Doctorum sententij●. C●●●num deductionibus, & rationibus, gaudens & l●●t●●, vol● hab●re collationem. Epistola Rokyzanae ad lo. Capistranum. Cochl. ibid. lib. 10. pag. 370.  to dispute with Capistranus, a great and learned Papist, touching Communion in both kinds, and that out of the holy Scriptures, the ancient Doctors, and the Church's Canons and Constitutions, as also from the force of natural reason.  
Aen●as Silvius saith, 
f Hut lingu● potens, & mundioris vitae opinione cl●rus. Aen. Sylu. Hist. Bohem. cap. 35.  That Hus was an eloquent man, and that in the world's estimation, he had gained a great opinion of holiness.  
Hierome was a man of that admirable eloquence, learning and memory, that Poghius the Florentine Historian and Orator admired his good parts; and the same Poghius being an eyewitness of his trial at the Council of Constance 
g Nihil unquam protul●● indignum vi●o bono; ut si id in ●ide sentiebat, quod verbis profitebatur, nulla in eum, nedum mortis causa inveniri justa poss●t. O virum dignum memori●, hominum sempiterne. Epist. Poghij ad Leonard. Aretin. in Fasc●c. rerum expetend. & fugiend. pag. ●53.  saith; He was a man worthy of eternal memory, that there was no just cause of death in him; that he spoke nothing in all his trial unworthy of a good man; yea he doubteth whether the things objected against him were true or no. Besides, he was so resolute at his death, that when the Tormentor kindled the fire behind his back, he bid him make it in his sight: For if I had 
h Id. Ibid.  feared the fire (said he) I had never come hither, and so whiles the fire was a making, he sung Psalms, and went cheerfully to his death.  
The like resolution was in john hus at his death: for whereas his enemies made a crown of paper with three ugly devils painted therein, and this title, Archheretic set over; when john Husse saw it, he said, 
i Acts and Monum. volum. 1 book 6. p. 624.  My Lord jesus Christ for my sake were a Crown of thorns, why should not I then for his sake, wear this light Crown, be it never so shameful? I will do it, and that willingly, and so he died constantly; and so indeed the story reports, 
k Qu●si ad epulas invitati ad incendium properar●●t. Aen. Sylu. Hist. Bohe●. cap. 36.  that they went to the stake as cheerfully, as it had been to a banquet. john Husse may seem to have had some prophetical inspiration: for at his death he prophesied, saying, 
l Cum duceretur ad r●gum, have voce● f●tidic● edidit: Post centum anno● exoriturum Cygnam, que● non sicut istum imbecillem Anserem ustulari sint Sacerd●t●s. Martin Mylius in Apotheg. Mori●●t. seu● Homo disce mori. pag. 93.  You roast the Goose now, but a Swan shall c●me after me, and he shall escape your fire: Now Husse in the Bohemian tongue signifieth a Goose, and Luther a Swan, and this Sw●n succeeded him just an hundred years after: fo● so these two blessed servants of God prophesied saying, 
m Ad E●is●opo●um agm●● dixisse sertur: Post c●ntum an●●s r●spondebit●s D●o & mihi. Id. Ibid.  We cite you all to make answer, a●d after an hundred years to give an account of this your doing un●o God: and accordingly as they foretold, it came to pass: for they suffered martyrdom in the year 1416. and just an hundred years' af●er, to wit, in the yea●e 1516. the Lord raised up Luther, who ind●ed called the Pope and his doctrine to a reckoning. Upon this prophetical speech of john Husse, there was money coined i● Bohemia, with this inscription in Latin on the one side, 
n Acts and Monum. vol. 1● book 6. pag. 770.  Cintum revolutis annis Deo respondebitis et mihi, anno 1416 High onymus condemnatus: that is, After an hundred years you shall answer to God and to me: and on the o●her side of the plate was engraven, Credo unam ●ss● sanctam Ecclesiam Catholicam, anno 1415. Io. Husse, I believe one holy Catholic Church.   

PA  
Did hus and his followers teach as you do?   

PRO  
For substance of doctrine, they taught as we do; their enemies indeed misreported their doctrine, and charged them with that they never held: insomuch as hus solemnly protested, even at the point of death, 
o Cum ergo Arti●ules 〈◊〉 ●unqua● tenerim, qu●s ●alsi testes 〈◊〉 me diposu●runt, sed ●ontrarium tenu●rim, 〈◊〉, scripse●imque & praedi●av●●im. Cochl H●st Husti●. lib 2. p●. 110.  That he never held those Articles which the false witnesses deposed against him: but held, and taught, and wrote the contra●y; taking it upon his death, that he taught nothing but the truth of the Gospel, which he would then seal with his blood. Now touching their doctrine, we are driven to tak● the scantling of their opinions from the pens of their adversaries', by whom we perceive that it is very probable, 〈◊〉 Hussi●es were instructed, and much helped by Wickl●●ss books; and accordingly we find, that both Aen●●s Silvius 
p Ex quibus vir q●idam genere nob●li●, apud Oxoni am lit●●is studens● cum 〈…〉, quibus de 〈…〉 preciosum 〈…〉 suae 〈◊〉. Ae● Sylu. Hist. Bohem. cap. 35.  and Cochleus report, that the means whereby ●he Bohemi●ns came to know the doctrine of Wickl●ffe was, for that a certain noble man studying in Oxford, carried thence with hi● into Bohemia Wi●klifs books, de Realibus universalibus As if it had been some rare jewel: and Cochleus saith, 
q Cochl. Hist. Hussit. ● 1. pag. 8.  That as a Bohemian brought first into Bohemia Wickliff's books, de Realibus uni●er●alibus, So there was afterwards one Peter Paine● a Scholar of Wickliff's, who after the death of his Master came also into Bohemia, and brought with him W●●kliffes books, which were in quantity as great as Saint Au●●ines Works; many of which books Husse did afterwards translate into their mother tongue. Bellarmine 
r Bellarm. Praefat. general. controvers.  j●ynes the Wicklifists, Hussites● and Waldenses together, as holding the same points of doctrine, and reproving the same abuses of Rome. And Platina, saith, 
s D●o ex sectatoribus Vigleff. ●ombusts sunt joann ● & Hieronymus. Pla●●na in vita joan. 24.  that H●sse and Hierome were condemned in the Council of Constance, as being followers of Wickliff. Aeneas Silvius saith, 
t Valden●ium sectam amplexi sunt. Aen. Sylu. Hist. Bohem. c●p. 35.  the Hussites embraced the profession of the Waldenses: Now we have already shown the tenets of the Waldenses and Wickliff. But to come to particulars; besides, the Hussites, there were others also of his disciples, which were called Thaborites, 
u Confess. Tabor. ●. Rokensan. An Dom. 1431.  of the place Thabor, which their General Zisca built as a City of refuge for his men. These Thaborites dissented more from the Church of Rome, a●d came indeed nearer to the purity of the Gospel, than the rest of the Hussites. There is in Cochleus a confession of faith, made by one john Pezibram a Bohemian, 
x Coc●l. H●st. Hussit. lib. 6. p●g. 233. & ●ib. 2. pag. 93  who speaking of these Thaborites, recordeth these following to have been some of their tenets; namely, That material Bread remains in the Sacrament, and herein they were very confident, insomuch as Procopius one of their Governors' said● 
y Quod si c●ntum forent Doc●ores, p●nem m●te●●alem in Sacra●ento non m●nere cont●stan●●s, di●o eo● omnes 〈…〉 ad collu● & fallere Cochl. lib. 6. pa. 22●.  That if an hundred Doctors should hold the contrary, he would t●ll them to their face they were all mistaken.  
Th●y held, 
z A●●n. Sylv de Orig. Bohem cap 35. Bellar. lib. 1. d● Sanct. Beat. c. 15. §. Deinde  That the Saints now triumphant are not to be prayed unto.  
H●sse his scholars after his death broke 
a In omnibus civitatib●s P●age frange●tes u●ique Imagines in e●●dem. Cochl. lib 4. ●ag 177.  down Images in Churches and Monasteries. Prateolus saith, 
b Pu●gat●rium ig●em nullih● inv●niri. Sub uti aquè specie co●ma i●●dum. P. ●eol. in El●ncl●o Haeret. 18.  They denied Purgatory, and by consequent, Prayer for the dead. They maintained Communion in both kinds to be administered to the Lay-people.  
They held 
c N●n Papa s●d Christus est Caput Ecclesiae. Coc●l. l. 1 pag 50.  That Christ is the head of the Church, and not the Pope; as also that the Pope might err, and that diverse Popes had been 
* Ibi●. pag 52.  Heretics.  
They held 
d 〈…〉 est slandu● 〈…〉 & 〈…〉 se 〈…〉 Scriptu●e 〈◊〉 et novi Test●m●●●i. 〈◊〉. li. 1. pag. 51●  The holy Scriptures to be the judge in point of controversy.  
Lastly, Husse was condemned by the Council of Constance, for holding, 
〈◊〉 est sancta univers●l●● E●clesia, que est pried 〈…〉. C●n●● Coast●●● 〈◊〉 15. Art. 1. apud C●ranz.  That the Congregation of the Predestinates, and Elect, were the Church of God, which yet was the sel●e same doctrine which Gregory the Great taught: For he held the Church of God to consist of right Believers, saying, 
f Se●undum 〈◊〉 sue gratiam san●●am ●cclesi●m de in 〈◊〉 p●rmansuris Sanctis construxit. Greg. in Cantic. cap. 3. tom. 2.  That Christ according to the grace of his fore knowledge, hath built his holy Church of Saints, which shall continue for ever: and that 
g Intra 〈◊〉 mensuras sunt omnes electi; extra has omnes ●eprobi. Id Moral. in job l 28. c 9 tom. 1.  All the Elect are contained within the compass and circuit of the Church, and all the Reprobates are without: because 
h Specie tenus ad ●idem Regni veniunt. Id. ibid. lib. ●5. cap 11.  they do but only in outward show come ●o the kingdom of grace: So that Gregory saith as well as hus, That the Elect only are of the Church.  
Now (as learned Doctor Field saith) 
i Richa●d Field of the Church, book 1. cha. 8.  This was the meaning of Wickliff, Husse, a●d others; who say, that the Elect only are of the Church, defining the Church to be the multitude of the Elect; not for that they think them only to pertain to the Church, and no others; but because they only pertain unto it principally, fully, effectually, and finally; and in them only is found that which the calling of grace (whence the Church hath all her being) intendeth, to wit, such a conversion to God as is joined with final perseverance, whereof others failing and coming short, they are only in an inferior, and more imperfect sort, said to be of the Church.   

PA.  
Did the doctrine of hus, and his followers continue any long time?   

PRO.  
It continneth even unto this day; for Cochleus in the year 1●34, Wishes 
k Faxit Deus ut videam Hussita●um reliquia● ad per●ectam ●●●lesiae unitatem redire. Cochl. lib. 12. pag. 441.  that he may see the remainders of the Hussites to return to the Church, and the Germans to cast out all n●w sects; whereby it is clear, that Husses doctrine was sensibly and apparently continued not only unto the days of Luth●r (who began not to show himself till the year 1517) but even after his time also.   

PA.  
Had the Hussites any Bishops or Priests of their own, lawfully calle●?   

PRO.  
Huss● and H●erome were Priests themselves, and whiles they lived they had Priests and Preachers; and after their death, the●r follower, 
l Nacti sunt Episc●pum Archtepiscop● S●ff●●g●neum, ordina●●runt ●er ●um Cle●●cos ●●ctae suae quotquot voluerunt. Cochl. lib. 4. pag. 168.  Got them a Bishop, who was Suffragan to the Archbishop of Prague, and by him th●y put into holy Orders, as many Clerks as they would, which thing the Archbishop took so ill, that h●e suspended his S●ffragan. But it was not long af●er, that Conradus the Archbishop himself, became a follower of hus likewise; and under this Conrade Precedent of the Convocation, the Hussites 
m Concilium Pragense Hussitarun In nomine D●mini Amen. ●n●ipit Sancta Synodus ann. D●m● 1421. sub Conrado Archiep● civitatis pragensis etc. Cochl. lib. 5. pag. 186.  held a Council at Prague, and there they compileda Confession of their Faith, which the said Archbishop and diverse Barons of Bohemia did afterwards resolutely maintain. Besides Sigismond the Emperor (in a treaty with the Bohemians) 
n Scholar's Diocaesis Pragensis ad sacros ordines cons●●rabunt. Cochl. li. 8. pag. 298.  Granted that the Bishops should promote to holy Orders the Bohemians, even Hussites which were of the University of Prague.   

PA.  
Were there many that followed hus, and were they of the better sort, or only some mean persons?   

PRO.  
They were neither few, nor base: had they been few, what needed the Pope call the great Councils of 
o O●uphrius in tabuld Concilior. 〈◊〉 Platinam. Constant●●ns● Concil. contra Hussitas.  Constance against them? What needed Pope Mart●n the fifth 
p exemplar Bullae Indulgentia●um contra Hussitas ex●at apud Cochl. lib. 6. pag● 237  publish and proclaim a Croysado against them? promising remission of sin to all such as did either fight against them, or contributed towards the wars. Our rich Cardinal Henry Beaufort was sent into 
q Papa Martinus quintus modernus cont●a ips●s Bu●mo● cru●●atam e●●x●● hoc anno Dom 1429 sub ductu D. H●nrut 〈◊〉 S. Eus●bij pr●s●● ter● C●●dinalis, 〈◊〉. Ep●s● Liwo●d su●●rovincial. Const. Ang● lib. 5 cap de Magistr in glossa in verbo ●oan. Wicli●.  Germany by the Pope in the year 1429, to raise forces against the Hussites in Bohemia.  
Cochleus saith, 
r Qui● putasset xl. millia Eq●itum Germanicae 〈◊〉, ●am levit●r in jugam compelli posse? Id. Ibid. pag. ●43.  There were forty thousand Germane Horsemen gathered together to destroy them; but upon their approach the Germans turned their backs and fled, not without some secret judgement of God as he thinks.  
Sylvius●aith ●aith, 
s I●stituti su●t tres ex●●●cit●s, priusq●am hostis 〈…〉 ●on p●ctu d●retur, foedss●●a ●●●pta ●uga— mi●atur ●ulia●us unde hic ti●or. Aen. Sylu. hist. Bo●em. cap. 48.  There were three several Armies levied against the Hussites, entering Bohemia in three places; but (as th● story saith) Non visum hostem fugerunt, they ●led before they did see the enemy; and again the second tim●, Priusquam hostis ullus daretur in conspectus, foedissima coepta fuga; they fled away with shame, before any enemy came to fight, and left their Tents to the Bohemians: insomuch as julian Cardinal of Saint Angelo, marvailes exceedingly at this their sudden fear, and shameful flight.  
When Pope Eugenius had sent the same Cardinal julian his Legate to the Council of Basil, and presently after sent him commandment to dissolve it; julian laid open unto him by letters, how great an injury he should do himself; and brought many reasons against it, among others this, that the Bohemians, who had been called thither, would by good right, say: 
t Nun vide●itur hic digitus Dei? 〈◊〉 exercitus ●r●●torum ●o●ies f●g●t à 〈◊〉 corum, & nun● 〈…〉 ●u git; 〈◊〉 nec arm●● n●c liter●s v●n. ipossu●● 〈◊〉 mira●u●●m Dei eviden●er● d●m 〈…〉 s●●●ire & nos 〈◊〉 a Epi●● julian Cardinal ●d Engen. 4. Pontific●m Rome conant●m 〈◊〉 Concilium B●●ihen●●. Aen. 〈◊〉. hist. Boh●m. ●● p. 48.  Is not here the finger of God to be seen? Behold Armies have so often fled from before them, and now the Universal Church also flieth behold they can neither be overcome with Arms, nor by Learning; this must needs appear a miracle wrought by God, to declare that their opinion is true, and ours false.  
Neither were the Hussites any such mean persons, for e●en the Nobles of Bohemia, sent two solemn Ambas●ages 
u john F●x in Con●ilij Con●tanti●●● hist●ria.  to the Council of Constance, in the behalf of hus; and when the Council neglected their request, and dealt ill with them, burning their Pastor Husse, notwithstanding his safe conduct given him by the Emp●rour; then indeed they defended themselves under th● conduct of john Z●scay their General, who at one time led fo●●● tho●sand soldiers into the field, 
x 〈◊〉 supra 〈…〉 millta 〈…〉 convenere Aen ●ylv. hist. Bohem. cap. 38.  and had such success in his enterprises, that Aeneas Silvius reports of him, That eleven times in fought battles, he returned Conqueror out of the field. Yea, Cochleus wondereth at the strange success he had, saying, 
y Mirae pro●ectò et fortunae & indust●iae, in bellis suit Zisca, ut vix ulla Graecorum, H●brae●●●, out Latmorum historia talem re●●rat belli du●●m, qualis Zisca ●uit. Cochl. Hist Huss. lib. 5. pag. 206.  That scant any history of the greeks, or Latins, or Hebrews doth mention such a General a Zisca was.  
Now for th●ir visible Congregations, there needs no other Testimony than this; when the Council of Constance had robbed them of their Minister hus, and nimmed from them the blessed Cup of the Eucharist, which Christ had bequeathed unto them; then the Bohemians much affected with this ill dealing, Assembled themselves together near unto Thabor Castle, and there to the number of thirty thousand, 
z Circiter triginta millia hominum convenerunt, atque i●i CCC. mensas in patentibus C●mp●s erexerunt, ex quibus p●pulo Sacramentum Cali●is ministrarunt. Cochl. ibid. lib. 4. pag. 172.  having three hundred tables erected in the fields for that purpose, they received the Eucharist in both kinds.   

PA.  
Master Brerely saith, 
a P●ot. Apol. tract. 2. chap. 2. sect. 5.  The Hussites rose up in arms, and were seditious; and Father Parsons saith, 
b Parson's third Part● of the three convers. chap. 6. nu. 16, 17, 18.  That Zisca was a rebel against his king Wenceslaus.   

PRO.  
The Reverend and laborius Dean of Exeter, Master Sutcliffe saith, 
c Matthew Sutcliffes' Answer to Parson's third part. chap. 6. book 1. pag. 81.  That the crime of rebellion is rather to be imputed to the Romish Clergy, and their adherents. For Subinco the Archbishop of Prague stirred up Sigismond against the king, as Silvius testifieth. Hist. Bohem. c. 35. And that king was taken prisoner, first by his Barons, next by his brother Sigismond, as is testified in the same History c. 34. Whereas the wars of Ziscay were rather against strangers, than others; and happened after the Council of Constance, and the king's death. And again, 
d Math. Sutcliff. ibid. li. 3. cap. 11● pag 284.  Being forced by the perfidiousness of the Pope and his complices, he took arms for his own necessary defence, and the protection of the innocent; so that he defended his poor countrymen against the invasion of strangers 
e Id ibid. Book 1. ch. 2 pag● 28.  And thus far master Surcliffe.  
And so I come to speak of such other worthies, as God raised up in this Age, whose Testimonies we shall have occasion to produce; as namely, Peter de Alliac● Cardinal of Cambrey, john G●rson Chancellor of Paris, Paulus Burgensis, Alphonsus Tostatus Bishop of Avila, Thomas Walden the Englishman, Nicholas Clemangtes Archdeacon of Bayeux in France, Dionys●us Carthusianus, Cardinal Bessarion, Cardinal Cusanus, Trith●m●us Abbot of Spanheim, Wesselus' Preacher at Worms, Hierome Savonarola a Dominican of Florence Gabriel Biel, john, and Francis Picus Earls of Mirandula, Laurentius Valla a Patrician or Senator at Rome, Baptista Mantuan the Poet and Historian.  
john Gerson was a good man, and one that much desired the Reformation of things amiss, he was present at the Council of Constance, 
f Claruit personaliter in Co●cilio Constantiensi— pro ver●t●te tuend●●●ivatu● est patri●●t dignitatibus, ad civitaté Lugdunensem con●ugit. Trithem de Scriptor. Eccles.  and for speaking freely therein against the Disorders of the Roman Church he was deprived of his goods and dignities by the Pope, and expulsed the University by th● Sorhonists; it is recorded of him, 
g ●●tule ●●t ●hi ●●le digniss●mi, D. 〈◊〉 Ge●son. multos coll●giss●●ue ulos, quo● quotidie ip●e in medio corum st●ms ●ube●at ut verbis Gall●ers post ●ese in hunc ●oquerentur ●enoren Mon Dieu mon createur 〈…〉 de vestre poure se●viteur I●han Gerson. In sine quartae partia operum Gersoni●.  that being thus deprived of his goods and dignities, he betook himself to teaching of School, wherein his manner was daily to cause all his Scholars, ●he little children, to join with him in this short Prayer; My God, my maker, have mercy upon thy miser●bl● servant Gerson. john de Serres in his Inventory of France, in the life of Charles the seaventh saith, that Gers●n returning from Basil, died for grief at Lions: and in the third part of Gersons works, I find this Epitaph made on him; 
— aemula turba fugat,  
Ast hunc dum fugeret, fovit Germania felix,  
Fit tibi Lugdunum posterior requies.   
That is; 
The envious multitude do make him ●ly,  
But flying he finds r●st in Germany;  
And after this at Lions.   
Touching the power of the Pope, in disposing the affairs of Princes, and their States; Gerson saith, it was given unto him, by such as flattered him, and told him, 
h Non est potestas temporalis vel ec●l●siastica nisi à Papa; in 〈◊〉 ●emore scripsit Ch●is●us● R●x Regum, Dominus dominantium, de ●●jus potestate disputare instar sacril●gij est, cui neque quisquam di●e●e potest, cur i●a ●a●is? men●●r si non inveniun●ur hae● scripta ab illis etiam qui sapientes sunt in o●ulis suis; si non inveniuntur praet●●ea ●uisse per summos Ponti●ices haec credita. Gerson de potestate Ecclesiastic. considerate. 12. in part primâ oper.  That as there is no power but of God, so there is none whether Temporal or Ecclesiastical, Imperial or Regal, but from the Pope, in whose thigh Christ hath written, King of Kings, and Lord of Lords; of whose Power to dispute, is Sacrilegious boldness, to whom no man may say, Sir, why do you so? though he al●er, overturn, waste and confound all States. Let me be judged a liar (saith he) if these things be not found written, by them that seem wise in their own eyes, and if some Popes have not given credit to such lying and flattering words; yea he saith, 
i Etiam usque ad imitationem Lu●i●●ri ut ad●rari velint sicut Dij. Gerson in part prima post tractatum de unitate ecclesiastic● addit quatuor co●siderationes ad ●ulcimentum praem●ssarum; in qua●tâ consid. haec verba hab●ntur.  That in imitation of Lucifer, they will be adored and worshipped as gods; not enduring whatsoever they do, that any one should ask them why they do so, they neither fear God, nor reverence men.  
Gerson denied the infallibility of the Pope's judgement, and taught, 
k Cum summus Pontifex sit peccabilis. Id. de potest. Eccles. considerate. 11.  That he was subject to error, and that in case of error, or other scandalous misdemeanour, he may be judicially deposed; and to this purpose he wrote a treatise De auferibilitate Papae; 
l Libellus de aus●ribilitate Papae in parte prim●, oper. Gerson  That the Pope might be safely taken away from the Church, and yet no danger follow of it.  
Gerson showeth, 
m Nulla ●ff●nsa Dei est venialis de se, nisi tantummodo per resp●ctum ad divinam misericordiam 〈…〉 vult de ●ac●o quamlibe● offensam imput●re ad mo●tem, cum ill●d p●sset justissime. Gerson de vi●a ●pirituali animae. lect. 1. part. 1.  that all sins, Even they that seem least and lightest, are by nature mortal.  
Touching Indulgences or pardons; whether the power of the Keys extend only, to such as are on earth, or to them also that are in Purgatory, the opinions of men (saith 
n Vtrun verò claves ecclesiae se p●ssint ●xtendere non solum super terram, sed sub te●râ in purgatorio, sunt opiniones ad utramque partem probabiles; & favorabile est dicere quod sic, saltem per indirectum propter communionem in charitate. Gerson. de Indulgent. Consideratione 11. parte primâ oper.  Gerson) are contrary and uncertain: but howsoever, this he pronounceth confidently, 
o Idem ibid. Consid 8.  That only Christ can give such Pardons for thousands of days and years as many Popes assume to themselves power to grant. So that in Gersons time it was not resolved, whether the power of the Keys extended only to such as are on earth, or to them also that are in Purgatory: yet he saith, it might be favourably construed, that they reached to them in Purgatory, at least Indirectly.  
Concerning their Priests and Votaries, he saith, 
p Oculos aperite & inquirite, si q●ae hod●è Claus●ra Montalium fact● sunt quas● prosti●u●a Meretricū-Ger●on De●la●atio defectuum virorum E●clesiasticorum. part. 1. oper.  That their Cells and Nunneries were like Brothel-houses, and common stews. Gerson seeing there was small hope of reformation by a General Council, wisheth 
q Provideant sib● dum s●ive●int et po●ueri●● membra per provin●ias aut Regna. Gerson in Dial. Apologet. de Concilio Const●ntiensi in p●rte 1. ope●.  that several kingdoms and Provinces would reform and redress things amiss; and accordingly the several parts of Christendom in the West, as the Churches of England, Scotland, France, and Germany have made reformation.   

PA  
Gerson was present at the Council of Constance, and there preached against the Articles of Wickliff, and the Bohemians; if Wickliff make for you, Gerson doth not; for Gerson condemned Wickliff's opinions.   

PRO.  

D. Field in his Appendix. fi●st part. pag. 85, 86, 87.  Gerson preached against such Articles as Were brought to the Council of Constance, by the English and Bohemians; now those Articles were many of them impious, in such sort as they were proposed by them, that brought them: as that 
s Concil. Constantiense Sess. 8.  God must obey the d●vill: that Kings or Bishops, if they fall into mortal sin, cease to be Kings or Bishops any longer, and that all they do is merely void. Whereas Wickliff never delivered any such thing, nor had any such impious conceit, as they sought to fasten on him: neither is it to be marvelled at, that impious things were falsely and slanderously imputed to him, seeing we are wronged in like sort at this day For Campian is not ashamed to write, 
t Campian Rat●o●. ●.  That we hold God to be the Author of sin, and that all sins are equal in God's sight; and Bristol saith, 
u B●istow Motive 39 p●g. 151. Antuerp. 1597.  That Protestants are bound to avoid all good works; which tenets we utterly disclaim and detest: and many things no doubt were writ●en by Wickliff and Husse, and others, in a good and godly sense, which as they are wrested by their adversaries, were heretical and damnable. So then Gerson might condem●e as impious, s●me positions falsely imputed to Wickliff, not knowing but that they were his, and dislike other that indeed were his, as not delivered in such sort, and such form of words, as was fit, or savouring of too much passion and violence; and yet for all this, both Gerson and Wickl●ffe be good men, and worthy guides of God's Church in their times.  
And so I come from Gerson to Cameracensis, from the Scholar to the Master; for Petrus de Alliaco is willingly and respectfully acknowledged 
x In Epistol à ad P●trum Episcopum Cameraci●s— tuus d●●cipulus Ioannes Cácellarius ●●dig●us E●●l●siae Parhisiensi●.— S●ripsit super hoc Reveren●●ssimus Pater D. Cardinalis Cameracens. Praeceptor m●us in●litus. Gerso●. Se●m. pro Vi●gio Regis Rome p●rt. 1.  by Gerson to have been his Tutor and Instructor.  
Petrus de Alliac●, gave a Tracked to the Council of Constance, touching the Reformation of the Church: 
y P●tr●●e Alliaco Card. Cam●rac. de Re●ormatione Ecclesiae libellus ●biatus primo●ibus Ec●lsiasticts in ●ōcllio Constaī●tensi c●ngregatis. E●tat. in Fase. ●e●urn expet. & fug. pag. 206. etc.  there doth he reprove many notable abuses of the Romanists, and giveth advise how to repress them; this treatise of the Cardinals is extant in Orthuinus. Gratius his Fasciculus rerum expetendar●● & fugiendarum, paginâ 206. etc. There should not be multiplied (saith he) 
z Quod in Ecclesiss ron tam m●gna imaginum varietas multiplicaretur, non tot nova Festa solemnizarentur, etc. P●t. de Alliac. de reform. Eccles. consid. 3.  such variety of Images and Pictures in the Church, there should not be so many Holy days, there should not be so many Saints canonised; 
a Maximè vid●tur necessarium quod dim●nu●rentur Religiones Ordinum M●ndicantium; eorum s●atus onerosus hominibus, damnosus Hospitalibus ac aliis verè pauperibus.— adeo ut jam horrendum quorundam proverbium sit, Ad hunc s●atum venisse E●clesians, ut non sit digna regi nisi pe● reprobos Id. Ibid consid. 4.  such numbers, and variety of religious persons is not expedient● there are so many orders of begging Friars, that their state is burdensome to men, hurtful to Hospitals, and to the poor. He saith, that it was then a Proverb, The Church is come to that estate, that it is not worthy to be ruled, but by Reprobates: yet withal he concludeth, 
b Id. Ibid. considerate 6. apud Orth. Grat. pag. 208.  That as there were seven thousand, who had not bowed to Baal; so it is to be hoped there be some, which desire the reformation of the Church.  
Now also lived Archdeacon Clemangies, who in a set treatise, freely painted forth the corrupt state of the Roman 
c Liber de corrupto statu Ecclesiae.  Church.  
He wrote an Epistle to Gerard Maket, 
d Non mentis tantum affectu à Babylone descedendum, sed etiam pedib●s corporis. Nam qui de tali loco hoc praecipit, quid de illo put●s ●uisse dictur● in quo non modo sanam doc●●inam non recipiunt sed acerbissime insecta●tur, si qu● corun●oluntatibus, imo verò in sanijs ad versetur? Nic. de Clumangijs epist. ad Gerard● Maketi, doctorem Paris. p. 174.  a Doctor of Paris; the argument whereof is this: That w●e are not only to depart from Babylon with our affections, but with our bodily foot: now he that commands this of such a place, what dost thou think (saith the same Clemangies) he would have said of that wherein not only sound doctrine is not received, but where such are cruelly persecuted, as contradict their w●ls, yea rather their madness? Speaking of their votaries, he saith, 
Puellarum Monasteria, V●●eris execranda prostibu●●— ut idem sit hodi● puellam velare, quod & publice ad scortandum i●pellere. Clemang. de corrupto statu Eccles Sect. 2. p. 22.  What I p●ay yo● are Numeries now a days, but Br●thel-houses and common Stews: the harbours of wanton men, where they satisfy their lusts? that now the vailing of a Nun, is all one, as if you prostituted her openly to be a Whore. He spoke excellently also in the matter of General Counsels, and so did Cardinal C●sanus, who treating of Counsels, and the Pope, delivereth these positions following.  
That 
f Sed a● universale Concil●um pr●priè captum, sit suprà R●manum Pontifice, creò● dubium esse non debere. C●san. de Concordanti● Catholic●. lib. 2. c. 17.  it is without all question, that a General Council properly taken, is both superior to the rest of the patriarchs, and also to the Roman Pope.  
I believe (saith Cusanus) 
g Id. Ibid. lib. 3. cap. 15.  that to be spoken not absurdly, that the Emperor himself, in regard of the ●are and custody of preserving the faith committed unto him, may Praeceptive indicere Synodum, by his imperial authority and command assemble a Synod, when the great danger of the Church requireth the same, Negligence aut contradicente Romano Pontifice, The Pope either neglecting so to do, or resisting and contradicting the doing thereof.  
He saith, 
h Rom●num Pont. in condendis statu● is generalibus ●am non habere potestatem quam quidam adul●tores eidem contribuunt; ●ilicet, quod ipse tantum statuere habeat, aliis consulentibus. Id. Ibid lib. 2. cap. 12.  That the Roman Bishop hath not that power which many flatterers heap upon him; to wit, that he alone is to determine, and others only to consult or advise.  
Whiles we defend (saith Cusanus) 
i Dum hanc partem defendimu●, quod Papa non e●● universalis Ep●scop●s, sed super al●os primus; & sacr●rum Concili●rum non in Papà, sed in consensu omnium vigorem fundamus; tùnc quia veritatem defendi●us, & unicuique suum honorem reserva●us, recte Papa● honoramus. 99 Dist. Ecclesiae. Cusan. Ib. c. 13.  That the Pope is not universal Bishop, but only the first Bishop ●ver others; and whiles we ground the power of sacred Counsels upon the consent of the whole assembly, and not upon the Pope, we maintain truth, and give to every one his due honour: and then concluding the former positions, the Cardinal saith: 
k Idem cap. 15.  I observe little or nothing in ancient Monuments which agreeth not to these my assertions. Now also lived Laurence Va●la a learned man, and a most excellent Divine (as Trithemi●s calleth him) 
l Theologus praes●antiss. Trith. quò suprà.  he was a Roman Patrician, and Cannon of the Cathedral Church of Saint john of Lateran in Rome: he wrote a treatise of purpose against the forged donation of Constantine, whereby the Pope challengeth his pretended jurisdiction  
He pronounceth of his own experience, 
m Papa & ipse bella pacatis populis infert & inter civitates principesque discordias se●it; Papa & alien●● fitit opes & su●● absorbet, rem Ecclesiastican, & spiritum sanctum quaestui habet— Recentes vero P●ntifices id viden●ur lab●rare, ut quantum pris●● sure sapientes & sancti, tant●m ipsi & impij sint e● stu●ti. Lau●ent. Vallens. de falso creditâ, & ementi●● Constanti●i Donatione D●clamatio. extat. in Fascie. rerum. expetend. & fugiend. pa. 78, 79.  That the Pope himself doth make war against peaceable people, and soweth discord between Cities and Princes; that the Pope makes gains, not only of the comm●n wealth, but even of the state Ecclesiastical, and of the h●ly Ghost, a●d that later Ropes laboured to be as foolish and wicked, a● the ancient ones were holy and wise. For this and the like freeness of his speech and p●●● he was driven into exile by the Pope. I know indeed that Master Brereley is offended with us for challenging Cus●●●● and Valla, as witnesses on our behalf: and therefore he would make his Reader believe, 
n Prot. Apology in the Author's advertisement.  that Valla being an eager enemy to the Pope, can not be an indifferent witness, but rather a party; and that both o● them retracted their opinions, and submitted themselves to the Catholic Church, and so they might without yielding to the Romish faction: he saith they retracted, but he cannot tell when, or before whom this Recantation was made or written, perhaps it is written on the back side of Constantine's Donation.  
Neither have we corrupted Valla, to make him a party for us: he was an honest man, and we take his testimony as it is recorded, and cometh 〈◊〉 our hands; he was not an enemy to the Pope, but to the forgeries of the papacy: and this madethem billet his name amongst such books as are forbidden, and 
o In I●dice prohibit●rio Pij quarti autho●itate ●dit. Pag. 81.  prohibited.  
In the later end of this age lived Baptista Mantuanus, and Franciscus Picu●, Ea●le of Mirandula: the Oration of Picus in the Council of Lateran is extant: wherein, besides his taxing the behaviour of the Clergy, he useth these words: 
p Piet●s in superstitio●●● penè pr●●●●uit. Io●n. Franc. Pici Mirand. de Reformand. morib. Oratio ad Leon. 10. & Concil. Latera●. tom. 2.  That piety is almost sunk into superstition.  
He held not the Pope's sentence for an infallible Oracle of truth: for he saith, that if the greater part offer (as was done in the Council at Ariminum, which stood for the Arrian heresy) to decree aught against the Scriptures; we are not in this case to follow the most voices, but to join ourselves with the lesser number, being sound in faith: Yea we are rather (saith he) 
q Quinimo simpl●●i po●ius Ru●●ico, & in●anti, A●●●ulae, quam & Pontifici Maxima● & mille Episcopis credendum, si cont●a Evangelium ●sti illi p●o Evangelio verba ●a●erent. joan Franc. P●●us Mirand Theorem. 16. to. 2.  to believe a plain countryman, a child, or an old woman, if they speak according to the Scriptures, rather than the Pope, and a thousand of his Prelates speaking against the word of God.  
That the Pope may err, he showeth by this Similitudes 
r Fieri autem potest, ut ●t vicarium caput aegrote●, quemadmodum & naturale, & sicuti noxios hoc humores, ita illud prava d●gm●●a immittat in corpus, quod cum accidit, pro medelà laborandum, & si desperatur sa●us ab●●nd●n ●umcapi●●s au●●m malè sani & deliri ●ōt●gia vitanda sunt, ne & ipsi artus pestilenti humore tabe●ie●ent. Id. de ●ide & ordine Credendi. Theorem. 25.  Even as the natural head may be sick, and noisome humours may flow from the brain into th● body: Even so this Deputy-head (to wit ●he Pope) may be sick, and from hi● head-ship naughty opinions (saith he) may be derived and conveied in●o the body of the Church.  
He was one who desired the Church's reformation: for in the foresaid Oration in the Lateran Council, he wisheth 
Sacra literae vtriusqu● Instrumenti rec●gnoscend●e, & c●m a●tiq●●● & castigatis prim●ve originis exemplaribus ●onserende, ut ab er●at●● purgentur— ver● historiae ab Apo●ryph●s nugis segregand●e. O●●tio ●ici. in Fasci●. ●er expet. & fugìend. pag 210. , That the copies of the old and new Testament were compared with the ancient and best Originals, and purged from such faults, as they have contracted through tracked of time, or the neglect of the Transcribers; and that the true and authentic Histories were severed from the Apocryphal.  
Baptista Mantuan was a famous Poet and Historian, and Prior of the Carmelite Friars: he is commended by Trithemius 
t Sacrae The●logiae Doctor; Philosophus insig●is. Tri●hem de Scriptor. Eccles. verbo B●pt. Mantuan  for a great Divine, and an excellent Philosopher, he is very sharp against the Romanists, as may appear by these few instances following; 

u Mantuan de calalamit. tempor. lib. 3. tom 2.  Tyrij vestes; venalia nobis,  
Templa; Sacerdotes, Altaria, Sacra, Coronae,  
Ignis, ● hura, Preces; Coelum est venale, Deusque●   
That is; 
Temples and Priests, Altars and Crowns,  
they sell for pelf;  
Fire, Frankincense, Prayers, Heaven,  
and God himself.   
Whereby he (haply) meant, their breaden God in the Mass.  
Mantuan saith 
Mantuan de Calam. temp●r. lib. 3. pag. 61.  as followeth, of Hilary a married Bishop; and Bishop of Poitiers in France. 
Non nocuit ●ibi progenies, non obstitit uxor,  
Legitimo conjuncta thoro, non herruit illâ  
Tempestate Deus thalamos, connubia, taed●s.   
That is; 
Thy offspring was no prejudice to thee,  
Nor could thy lawful wife an hindrance be:  
In those day's God allowed the Marriage bed  
To Priests; their cradles, and the lamps which led  
To Hymen's rites.   
Of the Woman Pope he saith as 
y Mantuan. lib 3. in Alphonso, pag. 26. to. 3.  followeth; 
Hic pendebat adhuc, sexum mentita virilem  
Foemina, cui triplici Phrygiam diademate mitram  
Extollebat apex, & Pontificalis adulter.   
That is; 
Here yet her statue hung; who feigned  
Herself to be a man; who's famed  
The Purple-triple Crown t'have bore,  
And last was proved a Popish Whore.   
Where it may be, the Poet meant th●t at that time there remained the Statue or Picture in Rome, resembling the Woman Pope travailing with Child; or the statue or seat, whereon the new Pope sat, to try that he was a man, and no woman, according to that of Henry Stephens, in his Apology for Herodotus. 
Cur etiam nostro jam hic mos tempore cessat?  
Ante probet quod se quilibet esse mar●m.   
The same Mantuan glanceth at their manner of such frequent repetitions, as they used in their Prayers; as if God were served by reckoning up their 
z M●ntuan. lib. 4. Alphonsi.  Muttering upon a pay●e of Beads, for so he termeth it. 
Qui filo insertis numerant sua murmura baccis.   
Now also lived john of Vesalia, a Doctor and Preacher at Worms; he held, 
a V●●m textum expone●do per alium, Doctorum Scriptu, etiam sanctorum quantum cunque nec gloss ●r●di●● So●a Dei grati● salv●ntur E●ec●i; Indulgential nihil esse credit; Per●grinantes ●om●m fatui sunt. P●ral●ipom. Abbatis Vrsp●rgens.  That the best Interpreters o● the Scriptures expound one place by another, because men obtain not the spirit of Christ, but by the spirit of Christ. That the Doctors, be they never so holy, are not to be believed for themselves, and the Gloss as little. That, the Elect are saved only by the mercy of God. That Pope's Indulge●ces, auricular Confession, and Pilgrimages to Rome a●e vain. For holding these and the like propositions he was sharply handled by the Inquisitours; he is charged by Parsons, but unjustly, to have held the old error of the Greckes, 
b Math. Sutcliffs Answer to Parson's t●ird p●rt of the three convers. book 1 chap● 3.  Who deny the Holy Ghost to proceed from the Son, as well as the Father.  
There lived at the same time (but somewhat younger) Doctor Wesellus of Gronning in Friz●land, he was called Lux Mundi, the light of that Age. He wrote a set treatise of Papal Pardons and Indulgences; and therein he saith (grounding his speech on Gersons testimony) that 
c Liquet ig●tur ex vene●a●i●● huju● vi●i sententia, indulgential Papules non ●am ●e●t●m si●num remiss●●●●● esse quam perfectam 〈◊〉 ri●ionem cordis inter hoc 〈◊〉 lares contriti. Wess●l de po●estate Rom. in Indulgent. cap. 4. pag. 579.  Papal Indulgences and Pardons are not so sure a token of the remission o● a man's sin, as is the true contrition of heart. He saith, that 
d Doctores antiqui nihil expressè scripserunt, quia 〈◊〉 abusus nondum temporibus Augustini, A●bro●ij, Hi●r●●●mi, Gregorij ●●repserat. Id. Ibid. c. 7.  The ancient Doctors wrote nothing expressly of Pope's Pardons, because this abuse was not crept into the Church, in the days of Saint Austin, Ambrose, Hierome, and Gregorie● And having consulted both with Civilians and Canonists, he cannot find them to make jubilees, and Pardons, ancienter than Pope Boniface the eight, who lived about the year 1300.  
It is now time to look homeward, and to acquaint the Reader with our homebred Confessors and Martyrs. I will begin with the reign of King Henry the fourth, who was (I take it) the first English King that put any to death for denying the Romish doctrine: for after that Richard the second was deposed, and that this Henry came violently to the Crown, he was willing to keep in with the Clergy, who in those times ba●e great sway.  
In this King's reign, 
Acts & Monuments, Book 6. pag. 515. volume. 1  William Sawtree a Priest, was burnt for denying the real presence; and so also was john Badby burnt, for being a Wicklevist, or Lollard, as they termed i●. William Thorpe, Priest, and john Purvey, were persecuted for the doctrine of the Sacrament. Waldensis call●d this Purvey, The Lollards Library, and a Gloss upon Wickliff.  
Now these men 
f Gabr. Powel. in Praefa●. ad lib. de Antic●●isto●  were not void of Learning and knowledge, for Sawtree was an Oxford Divine, Thorpe was Fellow of our Queen's College in Oxford; Purvey was Master of Arts in Canterbury College, and wrote a Commentary on the Apocalypse whiles he was in Prison.  
In the time of King Henry the fifth's Sir john Old Castle was a chief Favourer of the Wickliffians. This Sir john, by his Marriage contracted with a Kinswoman of the Lord Cobham's of C●uling in Kent, obtained the title thereof. He was (as Friar Walsingham a peevish enemy of his, saith) 
g Erat iste Ioannes fortis vi●b●s, ope●i Ma●tio sati● id●neu●. R●gi prop●e● probitatem chorus & acceptu●● sed tamen propter haere●●cam pravitat●m valde suspectus. Walsing. in Henr. 5. pag. 382.  A very valorous Gentleman, and in speciale favour with his Prince, for his honest Conversation, though held in some jealousy in point of Religion.  
He wrote his belief which was very Christianlike, but the Prelates accepted not of it; so that diverse crimes were devised against him, and at last he was pronounced an Heretic in the point of the Sacrament, and was executed by the Statute of Lollardie.  
Walsingham saith, 
h Ecce domi●e joannes in hac schedula vestrâ plu●a ●ona continen●ur, ac satia Catholica, sed habens terminum ad responde●dum super ali●s. Id ibid. pa 383.  That this Sir john being brought before the Archbishop of Cante●bury, he took out of his bosom A copy of the Confession of his Faith, and delivered it to him to read, which the Archbishop having read, said, That it contained in it much good and Catholic matter; but yet he must satisfy him touching other points: the same Walsingham saithe that 
i Ali●erqu● se●tit et docet de Sacramenti● Altaris, & Poenitentiae, Pe●eg●inationibus, & adorationibus im●ginum, ac clavibus, quam Romana Eccl●sia docet & affirmat. Ibid.  It was alleged against him, that he held and taught, touching the Sacrament of the Altar, and Penance, Pilgrimages, Adoration of Images, and the Power of the Keys, otherwise than the Church of Rome taught.  
saith) 
p La q●al mo●te suppo●●●ta 〈…〉 constante. 〈◊〉 lib. 3 p 93.  They constantly endured their death. Whiles Savonarola was in durance he wrote excellent meditations upon the Psalms; and therein in the matter of free justification he is very sound, and clear on our side. The E●le of Mirandula accounted him an holy Prophet, and d●s●nded him, and his Writings: the like also did that rare Scholar Marsilius Ficinus. Philip de Commi●●es that excellent Statesman, and Historian, was well acquainted with him, and had often conference with h●m: For my part (saith he) 
q 〈…〉 p. 338.  I hold him to be an honest man, and a good: he counted him also to have had the spirit of prophesy, 
r 〈…〉. Id. I●id Ch●pit●e 53.  inasmuch as he foretold many things, which in event ●roved true, yea such things as no mortal man could naturally have known; For he foretold the French King my Master (saith Comminees) that after his son's death, the King himself should not long survive him; and these his Letters to the King myself have read.   

PA.  
Parson's saith, 
s The 〈◊〉 p●●t of the t●ree Co●ve●s. Chap. 9 nu. 9, 10. 11●12.  That Savonarola was put to death for moving and maintaining of sedition in the Commonwealth of Florence, though in all matters of Religion he agreed fully with the Catholic Roman Church.   

PRO.  
What his Religion was, let his own works testify: Guicci●rdine saith, 
t 〈◊〉 Do●t●ina sua 〈…〉 Catolica. 〈…〉 li● 3. pag. 94.  that amongst other things h●e was charged, That his doctrine was not fully Catholic, he meaneth Roman Catholic; and Comminees saith, 
〈…〉, q●id 〈…〉 Fre●e 〈◊〉 l' appellant he●●t●que. Phil. Comm●es, C●●nique du Cha●les 8. cap 5.  That one of the Friar Minorites, his professed adversary, charged him to be an Heretic; so that in his opinion, he was not in each point a Roman Catholic. And to take the Pope's process which was published against him, as we find it in Guicciardine; Therein it is given out, that Savonarola had a holy desire, 
x ●he per opera sua si ●onvo●●ss● il Con●ilio u●iv●●sa●e● nel qual● 〈…〉 stata d●lla 〈…〉 Hist. 〈…〉 pag. 95.  that by his means a General Council might be called, wherein the corrupt customs of the Clergy might be reform, and the estate of the Church of God, so far wandered, and gone astray (might be reduced, so far forth as was possible) to the likeness of that it was in the Apostles time, or those that were nearest unto them, and if he could bring so great and so profitable a work to effect, he would think it a far greater glory, then to obtain the Popedom it self: in the same Process it is contained, 
y 
Disprezzato i●commandamenti d●l ponte●ice, aff●rmando le cen●ure publicate contro lu●●ss●re injust ●t invalide. Id. ibid. pag. 94.  
Non per revelatione divina, ma per opinion● propria fondata sulla do●trina, & oss●rvatione dell● Scrittura sacra. Ibid. pag. 95.   how he despised the Pope's commandments, and returned publicly to his ol● office of preaching, affirming that the (Pope's) censures published against him were unjust and of no force: as also that the matters by him prophesied, were not pronounced by divine revelation, but by his proper opinion grounded upon the doctrine, and observation of holy Scripture.  
And now let the Reader consider by that which Guicciardine reports of Savonarola, and namely touching the opinion he had of the Pope's authority, and his excommunications; touching general Counsels, and the deformity and degeneration of the Church's state, in respect of antiquity; as also what Comminees saith, of his preaching of the Reformation of the Church, and that by the Sword as formerly our Grosthead Bishop of Lincoln foretold, and then let him judge of what profession he was likely to be.  
Now for the point of faction and sedition: It is true indeed that there was a great faction in Florence, not only amongst the Laity, but the Spiritualty al●o; but it doth not appear that Hierome, was the Author or nourisher of this discord, or that he had any hand in that tumult 
z Amazzarono Francisco ●alori p●imo dé fauto●i d●● Savonarola. Id. pag 95.  wherein Francisco Valori, a principal favourer of Savonarola, was slain.  
When Saint Paul preached the Gospel in Asia, the whole City of Eph●sus was full of confusion, and they rushed into the Common place, and caught Gajus and Aristarchus, Paul's companions of his journey. Act. 19 ver. 29. Was Paul, or his companions the occasion of this tumult? Savonarola preached the word of God in Florence, his adversaries took Arms, entered the Monastery of Saint Mark where he was, and drew him, and two of his brethren, Dominick and Silvester, out of the Covent, and put them into the common prisons, upon occasion of a mutiny in the City; but Hierome and his f●llowes occasioned not this tumult.  
It was indeed p●●tended tha● he sided with the one faction in Florence, but Philip de Comminees (who knew him better than Pa●sons) toucheth that which brought the Fr●er to the s●ake; namely, In that he prophesied, and that so vehemently and freely of the coming in of foreign forces, and of a King that by force of Arms should reform the corrupt state of the Church, and chastise the Tyrants of 
a Et dis●it que l●●oy 〈…〉 de Die● pou● r●●orme● l' Eglise par for●e, chastier les tyrants. Et ●●au●e de ce 〈◊〉 disoi● seavo●r les 〈◊〉 par revelaton● mu●m●r●●nt plu●ieurs contr● 〈◊〉, & ●●q●ist la ●ayn. du Pape & d● plu●i●urs d● la vill● de Floren●e. P●●l de Comine●s, cap. 5●● qu● su●●à.  Italy: this was it (saith he) which made the Pope, and the state of Florence hate him.  
Thus have we heard of his life and death, there remaineth nothing now but his Epitaph, wherewith Flaminius, a famous Poet of Italy hath honoured him.  
And thus it is, 
Dum fera fla●ma tuos Hieronyme pascitur artus.  
Religio flevit dilani●ta comas,  
Flevit, et, o, dixit, crudeles parcite flammae,  
Pa●ite, sunt isto viscera nostra rogo.   
That is, 
Whiles Hi●rome to the fiery stake was led,  
Religion tore her hair, and wept, and said,  
You cruel flames, oh spare this tender heart,  
For whiles he burns, Religion feels the smart.   
And so I proceed to the several points in question.  

Of the Scriptures Sufficiency and Canon.  
Ge●son 
b Secun●●m scripturam ●acram divinitus re●elat● regulari debet judicium de 〈…〉 subditorum; ●uoniam ●ectu● ju lex est su● & obl●qu●. Ge●son. de Potest ec●lesi●st. considerate. 13. ●art. 1. op●r.  makes the word of Christ the sole authentical ground of faith, and the only infallible rule to decide controversies. The Scriptures (saith he) 
c S●●iptura nobis tradita● est, tanquam Regula suffi●iens & in●●llibili●, pr● regiment 〈◊〉 ●ccl●si●stici corporis, in●●br●rumqu● in f●ne●● se●u● Gerson. de examine. Doct●. Consid. 1.  is given unto us, as a sufficient and infallible Rule, for the government of the whole body of ●he Church, and each part thereof unto the end of the world.  
What evil (saith the same Gerson) 
d Quid autem mali attulerit contemptu● sac●ae S●ripturae utique sussi●●ētis p●o regimin● E●●l. ali●quin Ch●●s●us fuisset Legislator imperfectus. Gers. Se●m in die Circumcis. Concid. 1 part 1  hath followed upon the contempt of holy Scripture, which doubtless is sufficient for the government of the Church, for otherwise Christ had been an unperfect Law give●, experience will teach.  
That Wickliff affirmeth, that neither Friars nor Prelates may define a●y thing in matters of faith, unless they have the authority of sacred Scripture, or some special revelation, I dislike not, saith Waldensis, 
e Ved●tur infer●● quod nulli fratr●s ●el Praelati quidq●am debeant in mate●ià fi●ei de●mire, nisi ad hoc habu●●●●t Scripturae autho●itatem, v●l revelationem à spirit● sancto spec●●l●m,— in Scrip●ura sa●ra est sinaliter qui●scendū,— non vitupero v●am datam, said latently d●mn● proterviam. W●ldens. Doctrinal. Fid●i lib 2 cap. 19 tom. 1.  but his waywardness and craft I condemn, and think it necessary (lest we wrest the Scriptures, and err in the interpretation of them) to follow the tradition of the Church, expounding them unto us and not to trust to our own private & singular conceits. This is that which Vincentius Lirinensis long since delivered.  
Alphonsus Tostatus saith, 
f Qua●quam is●i libri ab Eccle●ia recipiantur ●oll●us ●uctoritat is solid sunt; id●o ad confirmandum & probandum, ●a quae in ●●●bi●● venerint inutiles sunt Tostat. p●aefat. in lib●● Paralipom. q. 2.  Although the books (in question) be received of the Church, yet are th●y not of any solid authority; and therefore they are improfitable to prove, and confirm those things which are called in question, according to Saint Hierome.  
Thomas Waldensis cities out of Hierome, the Can●n of the old Testament in these words: 
g In 22. volumina supputantur quibus q●●si literis et exordijs in Dei D●ctrina etc. Wald. doct. fide●. lib. 2 Art. 2● circa initium.  As there are tw●nty two letters, by which we write in Hebrew all that we speak; so there are accounted twenty two books, by which as letters, we are instructed in the doctrine of God; and withal addeth; That the whole Canonical Scripture is contained in the two and twenty books.  
Dionysius Carthusi●nus in writing upon Ecclesiasticus, saith, 
h Denique lib●r iste non est de Canone id est inter s●ripturas Canoni●as cōputād●● quamvis de ●●us ve●itate n●● dubitatur Di●nys Carth. prolog. in Ecclesiast.  That book is not of the Conon (that is) amongst the Canonical Scriptures, although there be no doubt made of the truth of that book. This is likewise confessed by Pererius the jesuit, saying, 
i Miro● m●g●● Ni●. de Lira, et Dion. Carthusianum, quinon n●gant ●as historia● esse veras ●●d negant ●as ●am● ad Canon. Scrip●uram, si●●t nec librum To●i●●, judith, et Machahaeo●ū pe●tin●re Perer●m D●● c. 16● in mit.  Dionysius Carthusianus, and Lyra, do not deny the History of Susanna to be true, but they deny the books of judith, Tobit, and the Maccabees to appertain to the cononical Scriptures. And the like observation touching Lyra, is made by Picus Mirandula; and 
k job. ●●●pic. Mi●●ād theorem 5. de Fide ●t ord.. Adve tendun multa quae in decretis numer●̄tur Apocrypha, et ita apud Hieron. ●●lentur, ni●ilominus in officijs divinis l●g●, I●. theor. 6●. 2.  Picus himself would have us note, that many things which in the Decrees are reckoned for Apocryphal, and so accounted by Hierome, are nevertheless read in the Divine Service, and many things also which some hold not to be tru●.   

Of Communion under both kinds; and number of Sacraments.  
The Council of Constance did not simply forbid the ministering of the Sacrament in both kinds, but the teaching of the people, that of necessity it must be so ministered; for so we find in the thirteenth Session of the said Council, 
l Concil. Const. ●ess. 13  That if any should obstinately maintain, that it was unlawful, or erroneous to receive in one kind, he ought to be punished, and driven out as an Heretic.  
Gerson, howsoever he thought, that the Church might lawfully prescribe the communicating in one kind alone, (wherein we cannot excuse him) yet he acknowledgeth, 
m Deb●t con●edi quod ●●●q●ando potu●t fi●ri. & factum est sine peccato, imò ●um merito, quod aliqui L●ici communicarent sub ut●á●que specie. Gerson. tracked. de Communione sub utr●que specie. part. 1.  That the Communion in both kinds was anciently used.  
The Council of Basil 
n Concil. Basil Sess. 30.  permitted the Bohemians to continue the use of the Communion in both kinds, upon condition, 
o Cum eà conditione ut crederent Communionem sub una esse ●●citam. Bell●r. li. 4. de Euchar cap. 26. § Secundo Ex Ae●. Sylu. hist. Bo●em. cap. 52. & Genebra●d. lib. 4. thron.  That they should not find fault with the contrary use, nor sever themselves from the Catholic Church.  
jacobellus Misvensis 
p 〈◊〉 Sylv i● hist. Bo●e. edit per Orth●in. Gratium. Co●pit hortart popu●um ne de●n●●p● communionem Calicis q●●q o pac●o negliger●nt. Ae●●. Sylv hist. Bohe● cap. 35. jacobellum Misvens●m instruxit in e●d●m opinion.  a Preacher of Prague, being admonished by Petrus Dresdensis, after he had searched into the writings of the ancient Doctors, and by name Dionysius, and Saint Cyprian, and finding in them, the communicating of the Cup to the Laity commanded, he thenceforth exhorted the people by no means to neglect, or omit the receiving the Communion of the Cup.  
Cardinal Bessarion, Bishop of Tusculum, professeth in express terms: 
q Stigitur haec duo sola S●cr●me●t● in Evangelijs manifes●è tradita legimus: Bapti●m●s domini●●s persi●itu● verbis, & Eu●haristia. Tr●ctat. Cardinal. Bess●●ion de S●cram. Eucha●ist. p●g. 181. Traitorous hic habe●ur inter Litu●●ias S. Patrum.  We read only of two Sacraments, which were plainly delivered in the Gospel.   

Of the Eucharist.  
Waldensis saith, 
r Primi Conv●●sion●m 〈◊〉 p●r viam identificationis supposito●um efficiunt; secundi per viam impanationis; tertij per viam appellationis figuralis & tropi●ae, ●um quibus concurrit Wicleff. Via impanationis in●●●ntum placuit Guidoni, ut si fo●et Papa ●psam decerneret eligendam. Tho. Waldensis de sacram Euchar. cap 64. tom. 2.  That some supposed the Conversion that is in the Sacrament, to be, in that the bread and wine are assumed into the unity of Christ's person: some thought it to be by way of Impanation; and some by way of Figurative and Tropical appellation.  
The first and second of those opinions, found the better entertainment in some men's minds, because they grant the essential presence of Christ's body, and yet deny not the presence of the bread still remaining to sustain the appearing Accidents.  
These opinions he reports to have been very acceptable to many, not without sighs, wishing the Church had Decreed, That men should follow one of them. Whereupon john Paris writeth, That this way of Impanation so pleased Guido the Carmelite, sometime Reader of the Holy Palace, that he professed, if he had been Pope, he would have prescribed and commanded the embracing of it.  
Petrus de Alliaco 
s Cameracens●● 4. Sent. quest. 6. a●t. 2. lic●t ita esse non s●qua●ur evidenter ex Sc●ipturà.  the Cardinal, profess●th, that for aught he can see, the substantial Conversion of the Sacramental elements, into the body and blood of Christ, cannot be proved either out of scripture, or any determination of the universal Church, & maketh it but a matter of opinion, inclining rather to the other opinion, of Consubstantiation. His words are these, 
t Pa●et quod i●●e modus sit possibilis, nec repugnat rationi, nec authoritati Bibliae, im● faci●●or ad intelligend● et rationabilio● quam etc. Camerace●s. in 4. Sent. qu. 6. art. 2. pag. 265. lit. F.  That manner or meaning, which supposeth the substance of bread to remain still, is possible; neither is it contrary to reason, or to the authority of the Scriptures; nay it is more easy, and more reasona●ble to conceive, than that which says, the Substance doth leave the Accidents. And of this opinion no inconvenience doth seem to ensue, if it could accord with the Church's determination. And he adds, That the opinion which holdeth the substance of bread to remain, doth not evidently follow of the Scripture, nor in his seeming, of the Church's determination.  
Biel saith, 
u Non inven●tur ●xpressum in Canon● Bibliae, unde de hoc antiquit ùs suerun● diversae ●piniones. Bi●●. in Canon. Mis●ae. ●ect. 40.  It is not expressed in the Canon of the Bible, how the body of Christ is in the Sacrament, and hereof anciently there have been diverse opinions.  
Cajeta● saith, 
uu Dico autem ab Eccl●siâ q●um non apparea● ex ●vangelio ●●acti●um aliqu●d ad intelligendum haec verba prop●iè. Ca●etan. in 3. part. Thom. qu. 75. a●t. ●.  that secluding the Church's authority, there is no written word of God sufficient to enforce a Christian to receive this doctrine [of Transubstantiation.]  
Saurez the jesuit ingeniously professeth, 
x Ex Catholici● sol●● Cai●tanus in Commentario ●ujus articul● qu●●●ssu ●ij v. in Romanà editio●e expu●ctu● est, d●cuit, se●●usà ecclesi● authoritate ve●ba i●●a al veritatem han● confirmandam non suffice●e. Su●rez to●. 3. Disp. 46. § ●erti●.  that Cardinal Cajetan in his Commentary upon this Article, did affirm, that those words of Christ. [This is my Body] do not of themselves sufficiently prove [Transubstantiation] without the Church's authority: and therefore by the Commandment of Pius Quintus, that part of his Commentary is left out in the Roman Edition.  
By this it appears, that their learned Council of Schoolmen who lived in this Age, were not fully agreed upon the point.   

Of Images, and Prayer to Saints.  
Abulensis 
y Quaedam suot qu●e nec in statu● nec in figurà congruè assignate possunt, sicut Trinita● beata. Abulens. in De●t. 4. quaest. 5.  was so far from allowing the worship of Images, as that he held it a thing unlawful in itself, Deut. 4.16. secluding Adoration, to make any visible Image or representation of God according to his de●ty: for hence (saith he) these 
z In imaginib●s ●ignan●ibus Deum pu●è, s●ilice● trinitatem, duo inconvenientia siqui possunt; primum, Idolatria, ne etiam Im●go colatur; secundum, error et haeresis, scilice● attribuere D●● illam Corporieta●em, & essentiale● differentiam, qualem tres i●●as siguras sign●re canspi●imus Id Ibid. quaest 4  two inconveniences will follow: First, The Peril of Idolatry, in case, the Image itself should come to be adored: and Secondly, Error and Heresy, whiles one shall ascribe to God such bodily shapes and forms, as the Trinity ●s usually pictured withal.  
Now that Abulensis with oth●rs held it unlawful to picture or represent the Trinity, is acknowledged by Bellarmine, saying, 
a Bell●r. de Imag. Sanct. lib. 2. cap. 8. § Hae● opinio Calvi●● est aliquorum Catholicarum.  It is calvin's opinion in the first book of his Institutions, cap 11. that it is an abominable sin to make a ●●sible and bodily Image of the invisible and incorporeal God; and this opinion of calvin's is also the opinion of some Catholic Doctors, as Abulensi● [upon 4. Deut. quest. 5.] and Durand [upon 3. dist. 9 qu. 2.] and Peresius, in his book of traditions.  
Gerson condemned all m●king of an Image, or portraiture, appointed or accommodated to worship and aadoration● saying, 
b Ad adorandum ig●ur & colendum prohibe●tur imagines fieri. Gerson in compend. Theolog. de 1. pr●●●●pto. in secund● parte oper.  Thou shalt ●ot adore th●m, nor worship them; which are thus to b● distinguished, Thou shalt not adore them; that is, With any bodily reverence, or bowing, or kneeling to them; Thou shalt not worship them with any devotion of mind. Images therefore are prohibited to be either adored or Worshipped.  
The same Gerson disliked 
c judicate si tanta Imaginum & pic●urarum in Eccl●sijs var●tas expe●iot, & an places simpli●●s nonnu●quā 〈…〉. G●rson 〈…〉. defect. viro●um Ec●l●si●st. part 2 O●er.  the variety of pictures and Images in Churches, occasioning Idolatry in the simple.  
If Christians were in no peril of Idolatry by worshipping Images, why doth Gerson complaine● 
d H●n● superstitiones in populis quae Religion●● inf●●●unt Chisti●●●●, d●m sicut ●lim judei solo si●na qu●runt, dum Imaginibus exhibent La●●iae cultum. Gerson de prob●tione spi●i●uum. Pa●t. 1. oper.  that Superstition had infected Christian Religion, an● that people, like Iewes● did only s●eke after Signs, and yield Divine honour to Images.  
Cassander writeth in this manner: 
e Sa●io● thus Sch●l●sti●is d●sp ic●t sententia Thom●, qui●●nset ●magi●em eàdem ●d●ratione ●ol●ndā, qua●es ipsa ●●litur quae ●magine signifi●atur; in quipus ●st Durandus, et R●b. Holc●t. Gabriel qu●que Bi●●●L●ct. 4●. in Canon. Saniorem s●nte●tiam ●●fer● eorum, qui dic●nt, quod Imago, neque ut consideraturin se 〈◊〉 quoth lignum est, l●pis 〈◊〉 m●t●llum, neque ut considera●ur secund●m rationem ●●gni & imaginis, est adoranda. Cas●and. Consult. de Imagine.  The opinion of Thomas Aquinas, who holdeth, that Images are to be worshipped, as their Samplers, is disliked by sounder Schoolmen, amongst whom is Durand, Holcot, and Gabriel ●iel.  
Biel reporteth the opinion of them which say, that an Image, neither as it is considered in itself mater●ally, nor y●t according to the nature of a Sign or Image, is to be worshipped.  
And he saith well, that this opinion of Thomas was disliked of others; for besides those already mentioned; this was one of the Problems which Picus Mirandula proposed to be maintained by him at Rome, namely; that 
f Nec cr●x Christi, ne● ull● Im●g● ado●anda e●t ad●rat●one L●trie, eti●m ●o m●d● quo p●ni● Thomas. 〈…〉 M●rand Conclusiones t●m 1.  Neither the Cross, nor any other Image was to be worshipped with Latria, or Divine worship, no not in that sense as Thomas would have it. And when othe●s carped at this, and other his Assertions touching ●he Sacrament of the Eucharist, himself made his own Apology, and defence.  
Touching Invocation of Saints, though Gerson did not absolutely condemn it, yet he reprehendeth the abuses and superstitious observations, then prevailing in the worshipping of S●ints, ve●y bitterly. For in his Consolatory tract of Rectifying the Heart, amongst many o●her considerations he complaineth, 
g Co●d●●●●ns●de●at●6 ●6.  That ●h●re is incollerable superstition in the worshipping of Saints, innumerable observations without all ground of reason, vain credulity, in believing things concerning the Saints, reported in the uncertain Legends of their lives, superstitious opinions of obtaining Pardon and remission of sins, by saying so many Pater nosters in such a Church, before such an Image; as if in the Scriptures and Authentical writings of holy men, there were not sufficient direction for all acts of piety and devotion, without these frivolous Additions.  
Gabriel Biel in his Lectures upon the Canon of the Mass, saith, 
h Dicendum quòd sancti in Patrià qui de facto in coelis sunt, naturali cognitime purà vespertina, quae est cognitio rerum in proprio genere, nullas orationes nostrum in teraè consistentium, neque mentales, neque vocales cognoscunt, propter immoderatam distantiam ●●tor nos & ipsos. Gabr. Biel. in Canone Missae. Lect. 31.  That the Saints in Heaven, by their natural knowledge, which is the knowledge of things in their proper kind, know no Prayers of ours that are here upon earth, neither mental nor vocal, by reason of the immoderate distance that is betwixt us and them. Secondly, 
i Non est de ratione beatitudinis essentialis; ut nostras orationes, au● alia facta nostra, matutina cogni●ione videant in verbo. Id ibid.  That it is no part of their essential beatitude, that they should see our prayers, or our other actions in the eternal word; and thirdly, 
k Vtrùm autem videre n●stra● orationes pertineat ad eorum beatudinem accidentalem, non per omnia certum est. Ibid.  That it is not altogether certain, whether it do appertain to their accidental felicity to see our Prayers. At length he concludeth, 
l Vnde probabilitèr dicitur, q●. licèt non necessa●io sequitur ad sanctorum beatitudinem, ut orationes nostras audiant de congruo; tamen Deus eis revelat omnias quae ipsis offeruntur. ibid.  That it may seem Probable, that although it do not follow necessarily upon the Saint's beatitude, that they should hear our Prayers of congruity, yet it may seem probable, that God revealeth unto them all those suits, which men present unto them.  
By this we see that for the main, Gabriel concludeth; that the Saints with God, do not by any power of their own, by any natural, or evening knowledge whatsoever, understand our prayers mental or vocal; they and we are disparted so far asunder, as there can not be that relation between us; so that we might haply call, and they not be Idonei auditores, not at hand to hear us.  
Now as learned Master Montague, now Lord Bishop of Chichester saith, 
m Master Richard Montagu, now L. Bishop of Chichester, his Treatise of the Invocation of Saints. pag. 129.  The Saints their natural or evening knowledge only is that which we must trust unto, as being a lonely in their power to use and to dispose; and of ordinary dispensation.  
In a word, Peter Lombard saith, 
n Pet. Lombard. Sent. lib. 4. dist. 45.  It is not incredible, that the souls of Saints hear the prayers of the suppliants.  
Biel saith 
o Bi●l in Canon. Missae lect. 31. , (as we have heard:) That it is not certain but it may seem probable, that God reveleth unto Saints all those suits, which men present unto them: here is nothing but probability and uncertain●y; nothing whereon to ground our praying to Saints.   

Of justification and Merits.  
Trithemius the Abbot, who lived in this age complains, that 
p Cr●briùs Philosophos Gentili●m quam Christ● Apostolos all●●●ntes; ut in Cathedrà Christi crebriùs Aristoteles ●it●tur in medium quam Paulus ●ut Petrus— veram num igitur ● Kymolane, quaeramus sapienti●m, quae in Sol● Fide Domin● nostri Ies● Christi formatá consillit. Trithem. epist. Familiar. epist. 26. ad Kymola●.  Aristotle and the heathen Philosophers were oftener alleged in the Pulpit, than Saint Peter and Saint Paul; and therefore he dissuades his friend Kymolanus from too much study of profane sciences: Let us (saith he) seek after true and heavenly wisdom, which consisteth in faith only in our Lord jesus Christ, working by love.  
Cardinal Cusanus in a treatise of his De pace fidei, brings in Dialogue-wise, Saint Peter and Saint Paul instructing the several nations of the world, greeks and Arabians; the French and the Almanies, Tartarians and Armenians; and there in that conference he laboureth to bring them to an agreement In pace fidei, in the unity of faith; and amongst other things he proves 
q Paulus quid igitur justificat cum qui iustitiam assequitur? Tartarus. Non merita, ali●s non esset gratia, sed debitum● Vis igitur quod sol● Fides justific●t adper●eptionem ●ternae vitae? Paul. Volo. Cusan. de P●ce fidei. cap. 25. pag 876.  at large, That we are justified only by faith in Christ, and not by any merit of our own works.  
The doctri●e of free justification is excellently handled by Savonarola in his meditations upon the fiftieth Psalm, which Possevine 
r Pridi● quam d●ceretur ad mortem, sc●ipsit inter imn●nē●●● supplicij angustias latin● sermone 31, et 50 med●tationes. Possevin. in App●rat. tom. 1. verbo Hi●●onym. Savonar.  acknowledgeth, to be composed by him whiles he was in durance, the day before he was led to the stake.  
Upon occasion of those wo●ds of the Psalmist, They got not the land in possession through their own sword; neither was it their o●ne arm that helped them, but thy right hand and thine arm, and the light of thy countenance; because thou hadst a favour unto them, Psalm. 4●. ver. 3.4. ●e sweetly comm●nteth on this sort; 
〈…〉 quia vo●ui●. S●vonarol. in Psal. 50. ve●s. 1.  Thou favouredst them, that i●, they were not saved by their own merits or works, l●st they should glory therein; but even because of thy go●d will and pleasure. Upon occasion of that Petition of the Lords prayer, Forgive as our trespasses, he renounceth all merit of his own works, and professeth 
t Verè tanquam pa●nus menstraute sunt omnes ●ust●●●ae a●strae, [E●ai. 64.6] ●●gitationum mal ●●um nostra●●● nullus est numeras. Hieron. Savon●r. in orat. Do●●nic. pag 177.  in the words of the Prophet Esay, That all our righteousness is as the rags of a menstruous woman.  
Picus Mirandula treating on the same Petition saith, it is certain that we are not saved for our own merits, but by the only me●cy of our God.  
Gerson taught that we are not justified by the perfection of any inherent quality, 
u Quia cert 〈◊〉 est, quo●●os non salv●mur p●opt●r m●rlta nostra, sed per s●●am Dei miseri o●diā P●e. Mirand. in orat. Dom. to 1  
x Quis gloriabit●r mundum ●or se habe●e? po●rò qui● Esaias se cum ●eteris i●volvens ●ibique vil●scens humili cō●●ssione prot●lerit l●gimus; om●es 〈◊〉 no●t 〈…〉 G●rson de Consolat. li 4. P●o●● 1. 〈…〉  that all our inherent righteousness is imperfect; yea, that it is like the polluted rags of a menstruous woman, that it cannot endure the trial of God's severe judgement; even Esay himself with the rest became vile in his own eyes, and pronounceth this lowly confession, all our righteousness is as filthy rags.  
The Cardinal of Cambray proveth 
y 〈◊〉. 1● Sent. Dul. 1. qu. 2.  by many reasons and authorities of Scrip●u●e, That no act of ours, from how great charity soever it proceed, can merit eternal life of condignity. And whereas God is said to give the kingdom of heaven for good merits or good works; the Cardinal for clearing hereof delivereth us this distinction; 
z ●aec dict ●, Propter, 〈◊〉 capi●●r Consecutive; & tun● den●tat ordinem consecutiones uni●s rei ad aliam quand●que vero capitur Cau●alites● Pet. C●meracens. in 1. S●n●. Dist● 1 qu. 2. art. ●.  That the word Propter, or for, is not to be taken Causally, as if good works were the efficient cause of the reward, as fire is the cause of heat; but improperly, and by way of consequence, noting th● order of o●e thing following o● another; signifying that the reward is given after the good work, and not but after it, yet no● for it: 
a 〈…〉 ad p●●es●ntiam esse unius sequitur esse alteri●s non ●am●s vnt●tejus ne● ex natur●rei sed ex solà vo●unta●e alterius● & s● actus 〈◊〉 dicitur cau●a 〈◊〉 praemij. Id in 4. Sent. qu. 1. ar●. 1.  so that a meritorious act is said to be a cause in respect of the rew●rd, as Causa sine qu● non also is said to be a ca●se, though it be no cause properly.  
Thomas Walden professeth plainly his dislike of that saying: 
b Qu●d homo 〈◊〉 〈…〉 est dignan 〈…〉, aut h●● grai●●● vel 〈◊〉 g●ori●; quam●is qui●am S●●olastici inve●●runt ad hoc dicendum terminos de condigno & cong u●. W●ldens. tom 3. ●● Sacram. tit. 1. cap. 7.  That a man by his merits is worthy of the kingdom of heaven, of this grace or that glory: howsoever certain schoolmen, that they might so sp●ake, had invented the terms of Condignity and Congruity. But 
c Reputo igitur saniorem Theologum, fidelio●em catholicum, et Scripturis sanctis magis concorden; qu●●ole meritum simplicitèr a●negat, et cum mo●●sic●tione Apostoli, & scriptur●rum concedit, quia simpliciter quis non mer●tur regnum coelorum, sed ex gratià D●i, aut voluntate la●gi●oris. ●b.  I repute him (saith he) the sounder Divine, the more faithful Catholic, and more consonant with the holy Scriptures, who doth simply deny such merit, and with the qualification of the Apostle and of the Scriptures, confesseth, that simply no man meriteth the kingdom of heaven, but by the grace of God, or will of the Giver: 
d Si●ut om●es sancti pr●ores ●sque ad recentes Scholast●cos, & comm●nis scripsit Eccles●● Ibid.  as all the former Saints, until the late Schoolmen, and the Universal Church hath written.  
Out of which words of Waldens we may further observe (saith the learned and Right Reverend Doctor Usher, Archbishop of Armag●) 
e Bi●●●p Ushers answer ●o the Iesu●s Challenge Tit of Me●●t. p 581  both the time when, and the persons by whom this innovation was made in these later days of the Church: namely, that the late Schoolmen were they, that corrupted the ancient doctrine of the Church, and to that end devised their new terms of the merit of Congruity and Condignity.  
Paulus Burgensis, expounding those words of David, Psal. 36.5. Thy mercy O Lord is in heaven (or reacheth unto the heavens) writeth thus. 
f Glorian coelestem nu●lus de condigro secundùm legem communem m●re●ur— Et sic manifestum est, quotha coelo m●ximè 〈◊〉 misericordia Dei in beatis. Paul. Burgens. addition. ad ●yran. in Psal. 35.  No man according to the common Law can merit by condignity the glory of heaven. Whence the Apostle saith in the 8. to the Romans, that the sufferings of this time are not worthy to be compared with the future glory which shall be revealed in us. And so it is manifest, that in heaven most of all the mercy of God shineth forth in the blessed.  
I will close up this point, as also this age, with that memorable saying of Ernestus, Archbishop of Magdeburg, lying on his deathbed 
g Quinquennio o●●e Luther. job. ● Munster in Vortlage heredi●●●ij, discurs. Nobilis. Propos. 3. ad Ann. 1512.  some five years before Luther showed himself: 
h Keimich ●rawe, ich begere ewer work nirgents Qu● Mein●s He●ren Christi we●ke mussens assein thune Daraus v●rl●sse ich mi●h. Catalogue test. verit. lib. 19 ad ve●bum, I trust no b●dy, I d●e not desire your wo●kes, to any thing, the works of my Lord Christ wholly must do it, on those I rely.  It is witnessed by Clement Scha●, Chaplain to the said Archbishop, and one who was present at his death; that a Friar Minor used this speech to the Archbishop: Take a good heart most worthy Prince, we communicate to your excellency all the good works not only of ourselves, but our whole order of Friar Minors; and therefore doubt not, but you receiving them, shall appear before the tribunal Seat of God righteous and blessed. Whereunto the Archbishop replied; By no means will I trust upon my own works. or yours, but the works of Christ jesus alone shall suffice, upon them will I repose myself.     

THE SIXTEENTH CENTURIE, From the year of Grace, 1500. to 1600.  
Of Martin Luther.  

PAPIST.  
WHat say you of this sixteenth Age?   

PROTESTANT.  
We are now (by God's assistance) come to the period of time, which was agreed upon in the beginning of our conference; to wit, to the days of Martin Luther; for about the year of Grace 1517, he began to teach, and Preach against Indulgences. And withal I have produced a Catalogue of our professors, unto this present sixteenth Centurie.   

PA.  
Stay yourself; you must (saith Master 
a Prot. Apolog. tract. 2. chap 2. Sect. 11. sub. 3.  Brerely) show us your professors during the twenty years' next before Luther.   

PRO.  
It is done already; for besides our English Martyrs, we have produced Trithemius the Abbot, and Savonarola, both which lived within the time mentioned, and held with us the Article of free justification; and Savonarola (howsoever the matter be otherwise coloured) was burnt for Religion in the year 1498.  
Besides, there have been in all Ages, and in the time mentioned, such as held the substantial Articles of our Religion, both in the Roman, and Greek Church; and by name, the Grecians in common with us, have openly denied the Pope's Supremacy, Purgatory, private Masses, Sacrifices for the dead; and defended the lawfulness of Priest's marriage.  
Likewise, in this Western part of the world, the Scholars of Wickliff, called Lollards, in England, the Tabo●ites in Bohemia, and Waldenses in France, maintained the same doctrine in substance with our modern Protestants, as appeareth by a Confession of the Waldensian Faith, set forth 
b Responsio excu●atoria ●ratru● Wal●ensium contra 〈◊〉 literas Doctor. Augustin. exr●t. in Fas●●●ul. reru● expetend. & ●ugiend. pag. 87.  about the year of Grace 1508, which was within the time prefixed.  
Neither did these whom we have produced dissemble their Religion; but made open profession thereof, by their Writings, Confessions, and Martyrdoms, as also their just Apologies are extant, 
c Acts and Monum. vol. 1. lib. 6. pag. 812.  to clear them from the Adversaries imputation.   

PA.  
I thought Luther had been the first founder of your Religion; for there be some of your men who call 
d Bu●●r in epist ad Episcop. Hereford. prot. Apo●. tract. 2. ●ap. 2. sect. 11.  him the first Apostle of the reformed doctrine.   

PRO.  
Luther broached not a new Religion, he only drained and refined it from the Lees and dregs of superstition; he did not form or found a new Church which was not in being, but only reform and purged that which he found, from the soil● of errors, and disorders.  
When Hilkiah the Priest, in Iosiah's time, 
2. King. 22  found out the book of God; he was thereby a means to bring to light, what the wicked proceedings of Manasses, Amon, and others, had for a season smothered; and so did Luther, he was the instrument whom God used for the farther enlightening his Church; and yet hereupon it no more followeth that he was the first that preached our Religion, than upon the former, that Hi●kiah first preached the Law.  
The Protestants Church by Luther's means began no otherwise in Germany, than health begins to be in a body, that was formerly sick, and overcharged, and now recovered.  
So that in respect of doctrine necessary to salvation, the Church in her Firm members (as Saint Austin speaks) 
f 
Etiam tun● suis firmissimis eminet Ecclesia. August epist 48. tom. 2.  
Quid●m fideles fi●missimi ●ur●aba●tu●. Aug Epi. 80. Quid●m ●●miss●mi p●o ●ide forti●er exulab●rt, quid●m toto orbe l●●●●bant. Id. ibid. epist 4●.  
Sic Ecclesiai● F●um●ntis Dominicis conserva●a est. Ibid.   was the same before Luther, and afterwards; and it began to be by his means only according to a grea●er measure of knowledge, and freedom from such corruptions, as formerly (like ill humours) oppressed it, and overcharged it. The Protestant's Church than is the same with all good and sound Christians that lived before them, and succeedeth the sound members of the visible Church, that kept the life of true Religion in the substantial matters of Faith and Godliness, though otherwise those times were darkened with a thick mist of errors.  
Now whereas some call Luther the first Apostle of the reformed doctrine, they did not thereby intent, that he was the fi●st that ever preached the doctrine of the reform Churches; for they could not be ignorant, that after Christ and his Apostles, and the Fathers of the first five Ages, Bertram, and A●lfricke, and Berenger, Peter Bruis, and Henry of Tholouse, Dulcinus, and An●ldus, and Lollardus, Wickliff, Husse, Hierome of Prag●e and others stood for the same truth which we profess; but their meaning was, that Luther was the first, who in their Age and memory, publicly and successfully set on foot a general reformation of the Church in these Western parts.  
And thus in a tolerable sense Luther may be called the first Apostle of the Reformation, though not simply the first that preached the Protestants doctrine.  
Americus Vesputius is 
g Chytrael Chronolog.  reported to have discovered the West Indies, or America, and withal bears the name thereof; and yet Christopher Columbus discovered it before him.  
Bishop jewel saith, 
h Apolog part. 4 cap. 4. di●●●. 2.  that in Luther's days, in the midst of the darkness of that Age, there first began to shine some glimmering beam of truth; his meaning is not, that the truth was then first revealed, but that by Luther's m●anes, it was manifested in a fuller measure and degree of l●ght and knowledge, than it was in the f●rmer and danker times of Popery; yea, he giveth particular instance of true professors that were before Luther, namely; Saint Hilary, Gregory, Bernard, Pauperes de Lugduno, the ●ishops of Greece and Asia, as also 
i Id. Part 4 pag. 411.  Valla, Marsilius, Petrarch, Savonarola, and others.   

PA.  
Did Luther himself acknowledge he had any predecessors, or forerunners?   

PRO.  
I answer with my worthy and learned friend Doctor Featly, 
k M●st●r ●●shers R●●l●●tion, & Doctor Featlyes' Answer.  that Luther acknowledged the Waldenses (termed fratres Pigardi) as appears by his Preface before the Waldension Confession. I found (saith he) in these men a miracle, almost unheard of in the Popish Church; to wit, that these men leaving the doctrines of men, to the utmost of their endeavour, meditated in the Law of God day and night, and were very ready and skilful in the Scriptures: whereas in the Papacy, the greatest Clerks utterly neglected the Scriptures. I could not but congratulate both them and us, that we were together brought into one sheepfold.  
Of john Husse and Hi●rome of Prague he saith, 
l joannem Hu● & Hier●● 〈◊〉 utros Catholicos 〈◊〉 runt●●●retici ipsi, & 〈◊〉. ●uthe●us in 〈◊〉 articuli 32. ap●d ●o. Ruddocks.  They burned john hus and Hierome both Catholic men, they being themselves Heretics and Apostates: and in his third Preface he saith; he hath heard from men of credit, that Maximilian the Emperor was wont to say of john Husse: Alas! alas! they did that good man wrong.  
And Erasmus Roterodam in the first books which he printed (lying yet by me) writeth; 
m ●o Hus exustum quidem, sed non convictum esse.  That hus indeed was condemned and burned, but not convicted.   

PA.  
To what Church did Luther join himself? and why left he the Roman Church.   

PRO.  
He joined himself in point of faith, to the ancient Primitive and Apostolic Church that went before him, and for his present Communion, to that sound part of the Roman Church, which then with him, hated the corruptions, which the Romish faction, for the maintenance of their pomp and profit had upheld.  
In particular, he joined himself to those honourable personages, the Dukes of Saxony and Wittenberg, and the Earl of Mansfield, and to such Christian congregations as within their territories began to abandon Popery, and reform themselves. He received Ordination in the Church of Rome; this ordination (for substance) was good, and by virtue thereof he preached t●e word, and brought the people to see and detest, not the Church of Rome, but her corruptions, from whence he severed himself, to wit, from the Roman Court, and faction therein: so that he leapt not out of the Church, he kept himself still within the barne-floore thereof, only he leapt out of the husk of popish errors.  
Now this his separation and ours from error ●s warranted by God's word, since God's people are commanded, 
n Apocalyp. 18.4.  and that upon a grievous penalty to depart out of Babylon, and spiritual Sodom; and this we ●ake to be Rome, since your own Jesuits, 
o 
Babylon matter Forn●cationum, Roma quidem est Ribera in cap. 14. Apocal nu. 39  
De Rom● intelligendum, non soll●● quali● sub Ethnicis Imperatori●us olim ●uit. 〈◊〉 qualis in ●ine seculi 〈…〉. Id. in cap. 14. Apoc. nu● 4●.  
Coll●itur, Romam postqu●m à fid● defecerit. Viegas in cap 18. Apoc. come. 1. Sect. 4.   that have commented on the Revelation, call Rome, Babylon; and that this is to be understood not only of heathen Rome, but of Rome Christian, after that it had forsaken heathenism, and had received the faith of Christ, and turned again from that unto Antichristianisme.   

PA.  
If any Protestant Church were in being before, or at Luther's appearing, then would they upon his preaching, have acknowledged him, and joined themselves to him; but (as Bell●rmine says) 
p B●ll●r. lib. a. de not. 〈…〉 5. §. ●rae●●re●●●i.  they did not.   

PRO.  
Alpho●sus de Casiro saith 
q N●c s●us Lu●herus 〈…〉 s●d mult●r●m 〈…〉 〈…〉 ; Neither did Luther in this age come ●orth alone, but accompanied with a gr●at troop, as with a Guard, waiting for L●t●er as for their Captain and Leader: such were Philip Melanchton, Conradus P●llican●s, ●ambert Fabricius, Capito, ●si●●der, Stu●mius, a●d Ma●tin Bucer: and th●se (saith he) seemed to have expected him b●fore he came, and upon his coming d●lcl●a●e unto him; so that he wanted no● such as gave him the right hands of fellowship, Galat. 2.9.  
Carolus Mi●titius being sent from Pope Leo to Fredrick, professed, 
r Ill ri● in Catal. T●st. ve●t● E● 〈◊〉. in 〈…〉 tresprote contrà Pap●m ●●bant●  That all the way as he came, having sounded m●ns affection's, he found three to favour Luth●r, for one that favoured the Pope.  
And Lut●er professeth, 
s Prae●ot oper. Lutheri.  that the applause of the world did much support him, most men being weary of the frauds, and wicked practices of the Romanists.  
Neither are these penurious examples, to give instance in Melanchton, Pelican, Bucer, and others, as Brereley scornfully calleth i●, 
t Prot. Apol● tract. 2. ●a. 2 sect. 11.  for they were as great scholl●rs as that age afforded. P●llican was one who made great help for reviving t●e Hebrew tongue, and was Luther's ancient; and so was Io●n Capnio, or Reuchlin, who brought Greek and Hebrew into Germany.  
Now besides his chevals, and contemporaries, the Waldenses, as also john H●sse bare a torch before Luther, and showed him his way.   

PA.  
Master Brereley saith, 
u Id ibid. pag. 443.  That Melanchton, P●lican, and Bucer were originally Catholics, and followed Luther's example in revolting from the Catholic Church.   

PRO.  
Saint Paul was originally a Pharisee, and yet he did well to forsake the leaven of their traditions, and embrace the doctrine of the Gospel. And so did Saint Austin the 
uu Quem meum ●●rorē nonnull●● op●●●ula me● satis ind●ca●t ante ●pis●opatum me●m s●●●pta. Aug de P●aedestinat. Sanct. cap. 3. tom 7.  error of the Manichees and Pelagians, and embraced the truth of the Gospel.  
Besides, they left not the Catholic, but the Roman Church, nor that altogether, but the faction that was therein, to wit, the papacy.   

PA.  
Schlusselburg saith, 
x Impudennter scribit joannes Vte●hovius pag. 143. se ex Co●rado Pelluano audiviss●, mult●s viros e●udi●o● in G●rmanià, p●iusquam prodi●●t Lutherus, Evangelij Doctrinam tenursse, ●deoque ipsum Pellican●m, p●tusquam auditum ess●t nomen Lutheri purgato●ium Papisli●um reij●isse. Conrade. Schlus●elburg Theolog. Calvinist. lib. 2. pag. 130.  It is impudency to say, that many learned men in Germany did hold the doctrine of the Gospel before Luther.   

PRO.  
Schlusselburgs words are these; Vtenhovius writes impudently, that he heard Pelican affirm, that many learned men in Germany, held the doctrine of the Gospel before Luther appea●ed, and that Pelican himself impugned the popish purgatory, before the name of Luther was heard of. Now why may we not believe Vtenhovius and Pelican affirming the same, and being honest men, as well as Schlusselburg denying it.  
Besides, admit there were not any in Germany, yet there might be elsewhere many thousands; as in Bohemia, France, and England, and other parts, who b●fore Luther's time, embraced the doctrine of the Gospel.   

PA.  
Master Brereley saith 
y Prot Apol. tract. 2. c●p 2. s●ct ●1. subd. 2. & P●op●. Apol. the Conclus. S●ct. 9  out of Luther's works, that upon a conference had with the Devil, Luther gave over the Mass, and changed his Religion.   

PRO.  
Suppose this Conference were extant in all the Dutch copies of Luther's works (which yet some make doubt of) yet might this conference be only imaginary, even a strong spiritual 〈◊〉, and not ●ny personal or real conference: now from such a spiritual conflict, dream or app●●ition, you cannot draw any sound proof.  
But (supposing the truth of this conference) had not Christ a con●●●●nce with Satan, and Saint Bernar● a combat with him 
Aff●it autem Satan 〈◊〉 adv●●●●. Author vitae Bern●●d●. lib. 1. cap. 12. ? is thei● religion ere a whit ●he worse to be liked?  
Your Romish Saints were very familiar with the Devil. Saint Oswald wrestled with him; Saint Dunstane took him by the nose; Christopher in the Legend is said to have served the Devil; and Saint Xavier was usually vexed with him after Dinner, Supper, Recreation, and saying of Mass; insomuch as the Devil oft times put him into a cold sweat; as H●ssenmullerus 
a Tur●ianus jesuita mihi notiss●mus saepe dixit illum [Z●vie●] à coena, prandio, Miss●. in recreationibus eti●m ita à demonibus exagitatum, ut in magna copi. à frigidissimum mortis sador●m fuderit Hassenmuller. Histor. Ie●uit●ci ordinis cap. 11. pag. 427.  reporteth of him from Turrian the jesuit.   

PA.  
The Devil brought arguments against saying of Mass, and disputed against it; therefore the Mass is good, or else the Devil would not have found fault with it.   

PRO.  
This followeth not; for every thing the Devil mislikes, is not therefore good, neither is all he moves one unto, therefore bad. For instance sake; 
b Aliqua de parte nos allegavit [Deus] ut te duceremus in c●nobium sac●aram virginum. Del●io. Disquisit. Magic. tom. 2. lib. 4. cap. 1. pag. 144.  he came in the habit of Saint Ursula, and moved one to enter into the Order of Nuns; will you say, therefore veiling of Nuns is bad?   

PA.  
Luther used the selfsame arguments against the Mass, which Satan did: now how could they be good proofs that were brought in by Satan? or why would Luther believe him?   

PRO.  
Luther shows only, how Satan tempted h●m to despair, for that he had been a Massmonger; which Luther knew to be naught without the Devils prompting.  
Besides, all that the Devil speaks is not devilish: the Devils, that possessed the men, confessed, and said, 
d Luke 8. chap.  Thou art Christ, the Son of the living God; afterwards they entered into the Herd of Swine; now the Herdsmen they came into the City, and told what was done, and said, now what though the H●ard-men told how the Devils confessed this Article of the Christian Faith, That Christ was the Son of the living God? was not this a true confession, though the Herdsmen had fi●st heard it from the Devils, and likewise reported it from them?  
Luther heard such and such arguments against the Mass; might not those arguments be true, though Luther hea●d them from Satan, God's Ape?  
It is true indeed that the Devil in telling truth, ha●h an evil intent; and so it was here: for he laboured to drive him to Despair, by accusing him for saying M●sse, which now he condemned: and the more to terrify him, he lays down 
e Quid si tales missae horrenda essent Idololatria? Luther tom. 7. de Mis●â priva●â. pag. 230.  reasons against it; thereby to let him see his old errors; and all this to drive him to despair: thus Satan truly lays a man's sin before him, truly accuses him; but it is to make him despair: as he dealt with Cain and judas, whose example Luther accordingly allegeth upon this occasion. And this was the end the Devil aimed at, as appears by Luther's own words, saying, 
f Proindè bone siater domine Papista non mentitur Satan quando accusat, aut urget magnitudinem peccati— sed ibi m●nti●ur Satan quando ultra u●get ut d●spèrem de grati●. id. ibid.  Satan lieth not, when he lays a man's sin to his charge, and the heinousness thereof; but then doth Satan lie, when he would have me despair of the mercy and favour of God.  
Again, it is observable, where Luther was thus tempted● not whiles he kept in the Monastery, but when he was leaving it, and coming to the truth; then the devil began to be busy with him, fearing that he had slipped his chain.  
Lastly, mark the issue of this conference; in this conflict the devil was foiled, and Luther won the field, and in effect makes this glorious conquest: I Luther have sinned in saying private Masses without Communicants, contrary to Christ's Institution● but the devil lieth in tempting me to despair with Cain; I will therefore with Peter be s●rry for my fault, and return to my Saviour.   

PA.  
Luther broke out into distempered passions, and was at odds with some of Zuinglius his followers.   

PRO.  
What if Luther after the plain homeliness of a blunt Germane liberty, used some over broad speeches? that he was too much carried with the violent stream of his passion, it is to be imputed to humane infirmity, and the perverseness of the manifold adversaries he found in those times.  
Besides, there was as great unkindness 
g Socrat hist. Eccles. lib. ●. cap. 13.  of old, between chrysostom and Epiphanius, Hierome and Ruffinus, and others.   

PA.  
Bellarmine saith 
h Bellar. lib 4. de notis Eccles. cap. 13 § eod●m.  out of Cochleus, that Luther began to oppose Indulgences, not because he had any just reason to mislike them; but because the publishing of them was committed to the Dominicke Friars, and not to the Augustine Friars, of which order himself was.   

PRO.  
This is reported by his sworn enemy, and that against the whole course of things that passed in those times. For Luther (before this occasion was offered him) had cleared the doctrine of Original sin, of nature and grace, of freewill, and the like; which were the main grounds wherein he dissented from the Romish Synagogue.  
Indeed he manifested his opposition chiefly against papal Indulgences; and he had reason for it: for at that time things were in so bad a state, that the blood of Christ was proph●n●d, the power of the Keys was made contemptible, and the redemption of Souls out of Purgatory, was set at a Stake at Dice, by the Pardon-sellers, to be played for, as Guicca●di●e saith; This bred great indignation, and many scandals in diverse places, but (as he saith) 
i Havena concitato ni mo●ti 〈◊〉 indegnatione, & scand●io ass●i, & specialment nella Gemania, d●ne ● molti de ministri er●●●ved●ta vender● per poco prezz●● gracan si sulle tavern la ●acu●ta de● liberare l' anime d' 〈…〉 purgatory 〈◊〉. histor. libro terzo decimo pag. 379.  especially in G●rmanie, where were discovered many of the Pope's ministers selling for a small price, or set upon a game at Tables in a Tavern, the power to redeem the Souls of dead men out of Purgatory.  
In like sort, that other noble Historian, Th●anus, of more credit than a hundred Cochleusses, saith, 
k Peccatum in sacris maneribus dispensa●du, Leo graviore ●umulavit, ●um Laurentij puccij Cardinalis impulsu, pec●niam ad immensos sumptus undique corrogaret, missis per omnia Christiani orbis Regna Diplomatis omnium delict●rum exp●atio●em ●c vitam aeternam polli●itus est, constituto pi●tio, quod quisque pro peccati gravitate dependere●. jac. Thuan. Histor. sui Temp. ad ann. 1515.  that Pope Leo, by the instigation of Cardinal Puccius, gathered huge sums of money, by sending his Breves abroad every where, promising exptation of all sins, and life everlasting upon a certain price, which any should give according to the ●eynousnesse of his offence. Then arose up Martin Luther a professor of Divinity in Wittenberg, who first confuting, and then condemning the Sermons which were made for Indulgences, at length questioned that power, which the Pope assumed to himself in the same Breves.   

PA.  
Was Luther a man of an holy life?   

PRO.  
Erasmus who was well acquainted with him, saith 
l Et tamen ●i illi faverem ut viro bono, quod fatentur et hosts. Erasm. tom. 3. in ●pist. ad Albert. Episc. & Principem Moguntin. Cardinal.— Illud video ut quisque vir est eptimus, it a illius scriptis minimè offendi. Id. Ibid.  that He was accounted a good man, even of his very enemies; and this I observe (saith the same Erasmus) That the best men are least offended with his writings.  
He had gained such reputation with the people, that (as 
m Come se le persecutioni n●s●●ssimo pi● dalla innocenza della sua vita, & d●lla sani●à d●lla do●trina ●heda altra ●agione. G●●cciard Histo●. It●l. lib. 13. pag. 380.  Guicciardine saith) against●uther ●uther, took their Original, from the innocence of his life, and soundness of his doctrine, rather than upon any other occasion.  
Erasmus seemeth to point at that which brought Luther to most of his troubles, namely; for that he touched to close upon the Pope's power, and Supremacy; as also that he taxed their Indulgences and pardons which served for the maintenance of their prelacy and Clergy; for thus it is reported 
n Erasmus duo magna esse Lutheri peccata dixit; quòd ventres Mona●●●●●●, et Coronam P●pae attigisset Charion in Chron. auct. a Pencero. lib. 5.  of him; that when he was asked by Frederick Duke of Saxony his judgement of Luther; he said, that there wer● two great faults of his, one, That he meddled with the Pope's Crown; another, That he meddled with the Monk's Bellies.  
And let this suffice to be spoken by way of Apology, and in behalf of Martin Luther, and that Reformation which so many worthies before him desired, himself began and attempted, and others now at length h●ve happily effected.   

PA.  
You tell us of a Reformation: did the Catholics desire it, were they not content with the Religion then in use?   

PRO.  
It seems they were not; for diverse of them Gave up their lives, for the name of our Lord jesus Christ, Act. 15.26. rather than they would yield to the Romish superstition.  
Besides, I have already given instance in such as foretold, and wished for this Reformation.  
Robert Grosthead Bishop of Lincoln, prophesied, 
o Non liberabitur Ecclesia ab Aegyptiacà servitute, nisi in ore gladij cruentandi. Math. Pa●●s. in Henr. 3. ad Ann. 1253.  that The Church would never be set free, from out of her Egyptian bondage, but by the edge of the Sword.  
Another of our Countrymen, William O●cham, a learned School man, complains, that in his time, 
p Scripturas S. subver●unt, dicta Sanctorum denegant, sacros Canon's, legesque civiles reprobant: qui videbantur Ec●l●siae nostrae columnae, in haeresium soveam se praecipitant. Occam in Prologo. Compend. error. Ioanni● 22.  They perverted Scriptures, Fathers, and the Church's Canons; and that these were no Young men, or novices, or unlearned ones; but such as should be Pillars of the Church, did cast themselves headlong into the pit of Heresies.  
john Gerson advised, that in case the Pope and a General Council would not make Reformation, (whereof he had little hope) 
q Provi●eant sibi dum silverint ●t po●uerint membra per Provincias aut R●g●a. Gerson. in Dial. Apologet. de Concil. Cō●stant in part 1. op●r.  than the several par●● and provinces of Christendom, should themselves redress things arispe.  
The Cardinal of Cambrey, and Picus Mirandul● presented their treatises of the Church's Reformation, the one to the Council of Constance, the other to the Lateran Council.  
Pelagius Alvarus set out the Complaint of the Church, and archdeacon Clemangies the Corrupt State of the Church.  
Hierome Savonarola the Dominican, told the French king, Charles the eight (as Philip de Comminees saith) That he should have great prosperity in his voyage into Italy, and that God would give the Sword into his hand: and all this, to the end he should reform the corrupt state of the Church, which if he did not perform, he should return home again with dishonour, and God would reserve the honour of his work to some other, and so (saith he) it fell out.  
When Luther arose, and began to oppose Indulgences, the more wise and moderate sort wished the Pope to reform 
r Poi ●he non era accompagnata col corregere in loco medesimile cose damnabili Guicciard. hist. It●liae lib. 13. pag 380.  things apparently amiss, and not to prosecute Luther: but this Council was not followed: whereupon, diverse parts (according to Gersons Council) began this work of Reformation, so much desired by all good men, howsoever opposed by the pope, and his adherents.   

PA.  
A Reformation presupposeth that things were amiss; will you charge the Catholic Church with error?   

PRO.  
We say that particular Churches (and such is that of Rome) may err, and diverse have erred. Sixtus Senensis reckons 
s S●xt. Senens. Biblioth. lib. 5. annot. 233.  up many Fathers that held the Millenary error, mistaking that place in the Revelation, 20.5. They said, that there should be two Resurrections; the first of the godly, to live with Christ a thousand years on earth, in all worldly happiness, before the wicked should awake out of the sleep of death; and after that thousand years, the second Resurrection of the wicked should be to eternal death, and the godly should ascend to eternal life: this error 
t Baron. ann. 37●.  continued almost two hundred years after it began, before it was condemned for an heresy; and was held by so many Churchmen of great account, and Martyrs, that Saint Augustine and Jerome did very modestly dissent saith the same Senensis.  
The opinion of the necessity of Infants receiving the Sacrament of the Lords body and blood, as well as Baptism, did possess the minds of many in the Church for certain hundreds of years, as appeareth by that which Saint Austin writeth of it in his 
u August. contra duas Epist. Pelag. lib 1. cap. 22. tom 7. & Epist 107. to. 2.  time; and Hugo de Sancto victo●e 
* P●eris re●ens natis idem Sacram●ntum in specie sanguinis est administrandum dig●to sacerdotis quia tales naturaliter sugere possunt. Hugo de S. Victore de Sacram. cap. 20. tom. 3.  many hundred of years after him.  
Were there not also superstition and abuses in the primitive Churches? did not a Council 
x Concil. Eliberti●. can. 34, 35  forbid those night vigils which some Christians then used at the graves of the Martyrs, in honour of the deceased Saints? and are not these Vigils now 
y Bellarm. lib. 3. de cul●u Sanctor. cap. 17.  abolished?  
Doth not Saint A●stine confess 
z August de mor. Eccles. Cathol lib. 1 cap. 34.  there were certain Adoratores sepulchr●rum ●t picturarum, worshippers of tombs and pictures in the Church in his time? and doth not the same Father tax them for it?  
To come to later times, Thomas Bradwardine complained 
a Totus etenim penè m●ndus post pelagium abij● in errorem; exurge igitur Domine, & judica ca●sam tuam. B●adwardin. prae● in lib. de caus● Dei contr● Pelagium. ; That the whole world almost was gone after Pelagius into error; arise therefore O Lord (saith he) and judge thine own cause.  
Gregorius Ariminensis saith, 
b Aut si in aliquo discordat, magi● deviat à Catholica veritate, quam dic●um ●elagij Greg. Arim. lib. 2. dist. 26 qu. 1. ar●. 2.  That to affirm, that man by his natural strength, without the special help of God, can do any virtuous action, or morally good, is one of the damned heresies of Pelagius, or if in any thing it differ from his heresy, it is further from truth.  
The same Gregory saith, 
c T●emendum mihi videtur negare authorit●●em Sanctorum, ● contra etiam, non est tutum contraire ●ōmuni opinioni, & con●c●sioni magistrorum nostrorum. Id. lib. 2. dist. 33. quest. 3.  The heresies of Pelagius were taught in the Church, and that not by a few, or them mean men, but so many, and of so great place, that he almost feared to follow the doctrine of the Fathers, and oppose himself against them therein.  
Cardinal Contaren saith; 
d Alij enim Catholicae sese religionis tit●lo venditantes, & luth●ranorum adversarios jactantes, du● arbitrij libertatem nimium astruere conantur Christi se gratiae plurimum detrahere non intelligunt. Contaren. de Praedestin.  That there were some who pretended to be Catholics, and opposite to Luther, who, whiles they laboured to advance freewill too high, they detracted too much from the freegrace of God, and so became adversaries to the greatest lights of the Church, and friends to Pelagius.  
It is not strange then, that we● say there hath been a defection not only of Heretics from the Church and faith● but also in the Church, of her own children, from the sincerity of faith delivered by Christ and his Apostles: not for that all, or the whole Church at any time did forsake the true faith, but for that many fell from it; according to that of Saint Paul, 1. Tim. 4.1. In the last times some shall depart from the faith, attending to spirits of error.  
Besides, such a famine of the word, as fell out in these later times, must needs have brought in corruption in doctrine; and this was it that called for Reformation.  
For in sundry ages last passed, the Roman Church hath behaved herself, more like a stepdame, than a natural mother; insomuch as she hath deprived her children of a principal portion of the food of life, 
e Nam fides ex diviat verbi auditu. R●m. 10. V●i vero id nec legitur● nec aud●tur, fidem ●e●ire, & labefaclari ne●●sse est● ut ●●diè, inquit pro● dolour! omnibus sire locis c●●nimus Espen● D●g●ssi●n. in 1 Timoth lib. 1. cap. 11 ex Nicolao Cl●m●ng.  the word of God: her public readings and service were in an unknown tongue; the holy Scriptures were closed up, that people might not cast their eyes upon them: fabulous Legends were read and preached 
f Facilius Augiae stabulum, quam tal●bus fabellis multor●m tum libros, tum● onciones repurges. Id in Poster. epist ad Tim●th. cap. 4. Digress 21 Quaàm ind●gn● est Divis & hominib●s Christianis ill● sanctorum historia, qua Legenda aurea nominatur, quam nescio cur auream appellent, cum scripta sit ab homine ferrei oris, plumbei cordis. Lud. Vives de cause. corrupt. A●t. l. 2. p. 91. Quae de Divis sunt scripta, praeter pauca quedam, multis sunt commenti●●oedata. Id. de tradend. Disci●linis. lib. 5. p●g 360. Majores nostri tantâ licet quanta nos erga sancto● devotione, justum came● non putarunt, tot Sanctorum gesta recitari, ut legi non possent sacra utriusque Testamenti volumina. Espenc. in prior. ep. ●d Tim. Digress. lib 1. cap. 11.  instead of God's word: but as Claudius Espencaeus, a Doctor of Paris, a bitter enemy to B●za, and therefore more worthy of credit in this behalf, saith; Our Ancestors as devoutly affected to the Saints as we, thought is not fit, that the rehearsal of the Saints lives, should shoulder out the books of the old and new Testament, and the reading thereof.  
And hereby it came to pass (as one of their own Authors saith) 
g Quoni●m in universà christian● republicâ circa haec tanta est socordia, ut multos p●ss●m invenias ni●il magis in pa●ticulari & explicitè de hisce rebus credere, quam Ethnicum quendam Philosophum solà unius veri D●i na●urali cognitione p●aeditum. Navarrus in Enchirid. c. p. 11. nu. 22.  That the greater number of people understood no more concerning God, and things divine, in particular and distinct notions, than Infidels or heathen people. And here in England, there was such a dearth of the word, in these later times of pope●y; 
h Acts and Monum. vol. 2. lib. 7. pag. 819. in Henr. 8.  that some gave five marks, some more, some less for an English book; some gave a load of hay for a few Chapters of Saint james, or of Saint Paul in English.  
Was it not now high time to reform these things? but Rome would neither acknowledge her errors, nor reform them, but rather sought to defend them, persecuting such as by authority established, laboured this reformation. How easy and safe had it been for Rome (had she tendered the peace of Christendom) to have (according as the truth required) permitted the u●e of the Cup, as sometime the Council of Basil allowed it to the Bohemians, and the public service of God in a known language, as was sometimes granted to the Slavons 
i A●● Sylvi●s hist. B●●●m cap. 13 : as also to have abolished the worship of Images, and the like, without which the Church w●s, and that very well for a long time. But Rome would not yield in one point, lest she should be suspected to have erred in the rest; and therely the Infallibility of the Roman Oracle the Pope, be called in question.   

PA.  
That which is reform, 
k Id reformatur, quod id m●n substant●à per● everat. A●ch●●p. Spalatens. Consil. redit.  remains the same in substance that it was before: And therefore the Catholic Religion, and the substantial exercise thereof should have remained in England upon the Reformation; but you have set up another Religion.   

PRO.  
We do not say that the Catholic Religion is reform, for that cannot be amended; but that we have reform Religion, in that we have purged it from certain devises and corruptions which had crept into it.  
Before this reformation, Religion was like to a certain lump●, or mas●e, consisting partly of gold, a●d partly of other refuse mettle and dross; to a sick body, wherein besides the flesh, blood, and bones, and vital spirits; there were also diverse naughty humours that had surprised the body; 
l 〈…〉. Angl c. Sp●l●ten● cap. 85.  our reformation took not away your gold (to wit those fundamental truths wherein you agree with us) but purged it from the dross; it drew not the good blood from the body, but only purged out the pestilent humour; so that we have retained whatsoever was sound, Catholic, and primitively ancient: only those things that were patched to the ground-soles of Religion, that we have pared away as superfluous: we have not removed the ancient landmarks, but only cast down some encroachments and improvements of popery: we have no more erected a new faith in respect of the substance, and essentials thereof, than that zealous reformer josia, 
m 2 Kings, 23.  built a new material Temple when he cast out the Idols, and Idolatrous worship out of the Lords house.  
There is no other difference betwixt the Reformed and the Romish Church, 
n D. V●hers Se●mon at Wansted pag 31.  then betwixt a field well weeded, and the same field formerly overgrown with weeds: or betwixt a heap of corn now well winnowed, and the same heap lately mixed with chaff. And if it be a vain and frivolous thing to say, it is not the same field, or the same corn; as vain and frivolous is it to say, the Church is not the same it was, or in the same place, after it is swept, and cleansed of the filth and dust: or to say, 
o D Field of the Church book 3. chap. 6.  the Churches of Corinth and Galatia (after their reformation occasioned by Saint Paul's writing) were new Churches, and not the same they were before: because that in them before, the Resurrection was denied, Circumcision practised, discipline neglected, and Ch●is●s Apostles contemned; which things now are not found in them; 
p Master Cade his justificat of the Church of England. lib. 1. cap. 1. § 5. & lib 2. cap 1. § 4.  or to say Naaman was not still the same person, because before he was a Leper, and now is cleansed.   

PA.  
If our Roman Church were so corrupt, whence then had you the truth? what you had, you received from us.   

PRO.  
Saint Austin saith, 
q Codi●●m portat judens undé credat Christianus, Librarij rost●i facti sunt, quomodo solent ●ervi post domin●s c●di●es far. Ang. in Psal. 56. ●om 8.  that the jews were to the Christians Library-keepers of the books of the Law and the Prophets: and might not the Romanists perform the like office to the Protestants?  
The jewish Church what time it was unsound, preserved the Scripture●Canon; and by transcribing● and reading the same, 
r Rom. 3.2. Acts 15.2.  delivered the whole text thereof truly to others. And thus the Roman Church, though in many things unsound, preserved the books of holy Scripture, and taught the Apostles Creed, with sundry parts of divine truth gathered from the same; and by these principles of Christianity preserved in that Church, judicious and godly men, might with study and diligence find out what was the first delivered Christian doctrine in such things as were necessary to salvation.  
And herein was Gods gracious providence s●ene, that even that Church wherein Luther himself received his Christianity, Ordination, and power of Ministry, should for the benefit of God's children preserve the Word and Sacraments, and deliver them over to us, though somewhat corruptly, by their adding more Sacraments than ever Christ ordained, and abusing those which we retain with diverse unwarrantable rites and Ceremonies.  
In a word, we received from you some truth mingled with error; we have pared away your corruption, as a worm out of an Apple, and retained the wholesome and substantial truth.   

PA.  
Was there any Chucrh in being save our Roman Catholic, in th● Ages next before Luther? if so, show u● where it was, and with whom it held Communion?   

PRO.  
When Christ came first into the World, the jewish Church was corrupted both in doctrine and manners; this Church had in it Scribes and Pharisees as well as Zachary and Elizabeth, joseph and Mary, Simeon and Anna, with others: these were all of the same outward Communion with the Priesthood; for they resorted to the Temple, there they prayed and performed such holy rites as God himself enjoined, until they heard farther of the Gospel by Christ's manifestation.  
Now I demand, were not joseph and Mary, and such good people ●ound members of God's Church, although the Scribes and Pharisees bore all the sway in the Church, and had the Priesthood, the word, and Sacraments in their dispensing? yet even then God had a 
s Esai. 1.9.  Remnant of holy people which made up his Church; though others went under the name thereof, and exceeded them in number. Now with these, the sound part kept an outward Communion, yet did not partake in all their erroneous doctrines, but condemned their grosser errors.  
In like sort, we were all of one outward Communion, of one Church wherein salvation was; and yet we shared not in those errors, which a faction in the Church (like the Pharisees of old) maintained. For (as learned Dr. Field saith 
t Doctor Field of the Church. book 3. chap. 6. ) The errors which we condemn at this day, whereupon the difference groweth between us and the Romish faction, were never generally received, nor constantly delivered, as the doctrines of the Church; but doubtfully disputed, and proposed as the opinions of some men in the Church, not as the resolved determinations of the whole Church. For had they been the undoubted doctrines and determinations of the Church, all men would have holden them entirely, and constantly, as they held the doctri●e of the Trinity, and other Articles of the Faith. And I have already shown from age to age, that the errors condemned by us, never found general allowance, and constant consent in the days of our fathers, but that some worthy guides of God's Church ever opposed them.  
And thus was our Church preserved under the Papacy, as whea●e is among tares; 
u S●c Ecclesia i●●rumentis Domi●i●is conserv●ta e●t. Augus●in. ep 48. tom. 2.  for we were formerly mingled together like corn and chaff in one heap, until the time of Reformation came, and winnowed our wheat from the chaff of Popery: So that howsoever diverse under the Papacy (not brooknig Reformation) maintained sundry erroneous opinions, 
Si Concilium in haeresin la●eretur rem●ne●ent alij Catholici qui 〈◊〉 vel ublicè prout expe●●i ●t, and re●t 〈…〉 orthodoxam Occh in Dialog. part. 1. lib. 5. c. 28.  Yet there were other worthies who (living within that Community) were not equally poisoned with error, but firmly believed all fundamental truth, and delivered the main Articles of Christianity over unto others.  
For Answer then to the Question, Where had our Church her being in the Ages next before Luther? we say, It was both within the Roman Church and without it. For (as learned Doctor Chaloner saith 
x D●ctor Chaloner's treatise upon Credo Eccl●si●n S. Catholic. 2. part. ●●ct. 2. ) Our Church had in those days a twofold Subsis●encie, ●he one, Separate from the Church of Rome, the other Mixed and conjoyne● with it.  
Separate, so it was in the Alb●genses, and Waldenses, a pe●ple who● so soon as the Church of Rome had interpreted herself touching sundry of those main points of d●ff●rence between us, and that a man could no l●nger Communicate with her in the public worship of God, by re●son of so●e Idolatrous rites and customs which sh● had establish●d● arose in France, Sav●y, and the places near adjoining, and professed the same substantial Negatives and Affirmatives which we do, in a state, Separate from the Church of Rome, having Pastors and Congregations apart to themselves, even unto this day. From these descended the Wicklefis●s in England, and the Hussites in Germany, and o●hers in other Countries, who Ma●gre the ●urie of fire and Sword maintained the same doctrine as they did.  
The state of the Church mixed and conjoined with the Church of Rome itself, consisted of those, who making no visible separation from the Roman profession, as not perceiving the mystery of iniquity which wrought in it, did yet mislike the grosser errors, and desired a Reformation.  
To answer then the question directly, where was the Protestant's Church before Luther's time? that is, where was any Church in the world that taught that doctrine, which the Protestants now teach? ● say, it was not only apparent enough in the Greek and Eastern Churches, and in such as had made an open separation from the Romish corruptions; such as were in these Western parts, the W●ldenses, Wickle●i●ts and Hussites; but it was also within the community of the Romish Church itself: even there (as in a large field) grew much good corn among tares and weeds: there (as in a great b●rne, heap or garner) was preserved much pure grain, mixed with store of chaff.  

Object.  
I except against that you have said: Master Brereley calls 
y Prot Appol. tract. 2. cap. 2. sect. 13.  it a Riddle, To say your Church was under the Papacy as wheat is under the chaff, and yet the Papacy was not the true Church.   

Answer.  
It is no Enigma or Riddle, it being all one in effect as to say; the Christian Church at our Saviour's coming, and after, consisting of joseph and Mary, Simeon and Anna, the Shepherds and the Sages, Christ's disciples and others, was in and under the jewish Church, consisting of Scribes and Pharisees (who with their false glosses, and vain traditions had corrupted the Law of God) was not sanum membrum, a sound part of God's Church; but as our Saviour saith, Like sheep without a Shepherd, Mark 6.34.   

Object.  
You say your Church was under the papacy, but the papacy was not the true Church; by the like reason you may say, that the hidden Church of God is preserved among the Turks: can there be a Church without an outward ministry?   

Answer.  
It followeth not, and the reason of the difference is; because amongst the Turks there is not that means of salvation; inasmuch as they have not given their names to Christ; but the true Church of God may be preserved within the Romish Church, in as much as they have the Scriptures, though in a strange tongue, as also Baptisms and lawful ordination, and the like helps, which God in all ages used, that his Elect might begathered out of the midst of Babylon.  
And whereas you urge an outward and public ministry, this maketh nothing against the Church of England, which (for substance) hath the same descent of outward ordination with the Roman Church, 
z  neither can any man show a more certain pedigree from his great Grand father, than our Bishops and Pastors can, f●om su●h Bishops as your Church accounts canonical in the time of King Henry the eight, and upward: such ●a●re evidence can we produce for an outward and public ministry in the Church of England, and such ordination we hold very necessary; and yet in case it cannot be had, God's children by their private reading, and meditation of that which they have formerly learned, may supply 
a  the defect of a public ministry, even as some Christians at this day being slaves in Turkey or Barbary, may be saved without external ministry: but this is in case of extremity; for us, we never wanted a standing ministry.  
Neither did the Waldenses, Wickliv●sts, and Hussites, (for so I call them for distinction sake) ever want an outward and lawful ministry amongst them, for the administration of the word and Sacraments●   

Object.  
You say your Professors communicated with the Roman Church, but did not partake in her errors, as you call them; did they not join with them in the Mass●, and the Litanies of the Saints, and the like?   

Answer.  
The thing we say is this; that howsoever they outwardly communicated with Rome, yet diverse of them misliked in their heart their grosser errors, they groaned under the Babylonish yoke, and desired reformation, beside, many of them were ignorant of the depth and mystery of popery.   

Object.  
If your Protestant Church were in b●ing, at, and before Luther's appearing, then did such as were members thereof, either make profession thereof, or not: 
b Bellarm. lib 3. de Eccles. Milit. cap. 13. § Denique.  if they did, tell us their names, and where they did so: if they did not, then were they but dissemblers in Religion, according to that of Saint Paul, Rom. 10.10. and our Saviour, Math. 10.33.   

Answer.  
I will but take what your Rhemists grant, and re●o●t your own argument: they say 
c ●h●m. Annot. in 12. Apocal. ; That the Catholic Church in their time was in England, although it had no public government, nor open free exercise of holy function: whence I argue thus; if their Roman Church had any being at that time in England, than their Priests and jesuits, either made public profession of their faith, or not: if they made open profession, why then did they go in laymen's habits, and lurk in corners? if they made not open profession, than were they but dissemblers. Besides, I have already given you in a Catalogue of our professors, who within the time mentioned, witnessed that truth which we maintain by their writings, confessi●ns, and Martyrdom.  
Now, for us we have rejected nothing but popery, we have willingly departed from the Communion of their errors, and additions to the faith; but from the Communion of the Church we never departed.  
In a word, there were some who openly, and constantly withstood the errors and cor●uptions of their time, and sealed with their blood that truth● which they with us professed: others dissented from the same errors, but did not with the like courage oppose themselves; such as would s●y to their friends in private: Thus 
d Sic dic●rem in s●holis, s●d 〈◊〉 (maneat inter 〈◊〉 d●v●rs●m sertio; 〈…〉 p●obari ●x sa●ris 〈◊〉. P●ralipo●. ad A●●at. Vrsp●rg pag. 448 edit. B●sil. 1569.  I would say in the Schools, and openly, Sed (maneat inter nos) diversum sentio, but keep my Council, I think the contrary.    

PA.  
Was not the Mass publicly used in all Churches at L●thers appearing? was protestancy then so much as in being? saith Master 
Prot. Apol. tracked 2. cap. 2. sect. 2. pag. 3●●.  Briefly.   

PRO.  
If by a Protestant Church, (saith learned Doctor 
D●ctor Field of the Church 〈◊〉 second edition in h●s Appendix to the third book. Ox●o●d 16●8.  Field, we me●ne, a Church believing and teaching in all points as Protestants do, and believing and teaching nothing but that they do, the Latin, or West Church (wherein the Pope tyrannised before Luther's time) was and continued a true Protestant Church; for it taught as we do, it condemned the superstition we have removed, it groaned under the yoke of tyranny which we have cast off; howsoever there were many in the midst of her, that brought in, and maintained superstition, and advanced the Pope's Supremacy.  
But if by a Protestant Church they understand a Church that not only dislikes and complains of Papal usurpation, but also abandon●th it; and not only teacheth all necessary and saving truth, but suffers none within her jurisdiction to teach otherwise; we confess that no part of the Western Church was in this sort a Protestant Church, till a Reformation was begun of evils formerly disliked.  
Now whereas it is objected, that the Mass (wherein they say many chief points o● their Religion are comprehended) was publicly used at Luther's appearing.  
It is answered by Doctor Field that th● using o● the Mass as the public Liturgy, is no good proof; inasmuch as manifold abuses in practise beside, and contrary to th● word of the Canon and the in●en●●●● of them that first compo●ed the same● have cre●t into i●; as also sundry Apocryphal things have slipped into the public Service of the Church, these things will better appear by particular instances.  
Concerning private Masses, wherein the Priest's alone doth Communicate without the people, it is contra●y to ●he Canon of ●he M●sse, saying in the plural number [Sumpsimus] we have ●ec●ived; 
g Mi●●ale Eccles. Sarisbur●in Cano●●.  an● Quo●quot ex hoc altaris participatione, etc. That all we which in ●he participation of the Altar, have receiv●d the sacred body and blood of t●y Sonne● etc.  
john Hossme●ster a learned man, expounding the prayers of th● Mass●, hath these w●rds; 
h C●ss●●der. consult. de solita●ia M●ss●●  The thing it self proclaimeth it, th●t as w●ll in the Gre●ke, as Latin Church, not only the Priest which sacrif●●eth, but the other Priests and Deacons also, yea and the people, or at le●st some part of them did Communicated which custom how it grew out of use I know not; but surely we should labour to bring it in again.  
By this it appears, that the Priests receiving alone and the neglecting or excluding the communicating of others, as no● much necessary, is indeed a point of Romish Religion; but contrary to the words of the Canon; and ●he ancient custom of the Church: it proceeded from the indevotion of the people, or rather ●he negligence or error of the guides of ●he Church, that either failed to stir them up to the performance of such a duty, or made them bel●eve their Act w●s sufficient to communicate the benefits of Christ's passion to th●m; but this course was misliked by them of the bet●er sort.  
Concerning Communion in one kind, that is another point of Romish Religion, supposed to be contained in the Mass, which yet wan●s the liking and approbation of the best and worthiest guides of God's Church then living: 
i Cassander in Consult. d● utr●que specie.  Cassander saith, It is sufficiently manifest, that the ●niversall Church of Christ until this day, and the Western or Roman Church, for more than a thousand years after Christ, did minister the Sacrament in both kinds to all the members of Christ's Church, at least in public, as it is most evident by innumerable testimonies, both of Gre●ke and Latin Fathers.  
It is true indeed, ●hat in case of necessity, as when children, or such as were sick and weak, were to ●eceive the Communion, th●y used to ●ip the mystical bread into the consecrated wine, under pre●en●e of Ca●efull avoiding the danger of spilling it, and greater reverence towards the holy Sacrament: from this customs' wh●●● yet was ●isl●ked (as appears by Hildebe●● 〈…〉 
k 〈…〉 epist 64 in tom. 12. Biblioth. P●● pag 3●●. Colon. 1618. ) some proceeded farther, and began to teach the people, that seeing the body and blood of Christ cannot be separated, in that they partake of the 〈◊〉 they partake of the other also, and that therefore it was sufficient to receive in one kind alone. N●●th●r y●t could this give satisfaction; for howsoever the custom of communicating under one kind prevailed; yet there wanted not such as sufficiently expressed their judgement, that communicating in both kinds, as Christ first did institute, and the Church for a long time observed, was fit and convenient, perfect and complete, and of more efficacy, and clearer representation, than the other under one kind alone.  
Come to another main point, the proper, and propitiatory sacrifice for the quick and the dead, and see whether at Luther's appearing, before and after, all that used that Liturgy had such an opinion of a sacrifice.  
Saint 
l Offerings quid●●, sed 〈…〉 Amb. o●. in H●b●. 10.  Ambrose, and Saint chrysostom 
m 〈…〉 Chrysos'. in Heb 〈…〉 17. , by way of correction say, We offer the same sacrifice, or rather the remembrance thereof.  
Peter Lombard proposing the question, whether that which the Priest doth, may properly be named a Sacrifice, or Immolation, answereth; 
n 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 et oblationem, qui● 〈◊〉 est, & 〈…〉 Quotid●● autem 〈…〉 Sacramento, quia in sacramento 〈…〉 illius quoth 〈…〉 Pet. 〈…〉 Sem lib. 4 Dist. 12. li●. ●●..  that Christ was only once truly and properly offered in sacrifice; and that h●e is not properly immolated or sacrificed, but in Sacrament and Representation only.  
Lyra saith, 
o 〈…〉 in Heb 10. ca  that If thou say the Sacrifice of the Altar is daily offered in the Church; it must be answered, that th●re is no reiteration of the sacrifice, but a daily commemoration of that sacrifice that was once offered on the Crosse.  
Georgius Wi●elius, a man much honoured by the Emperor's Ferdinand and Maximilian, 
p G●●g. Wi●●lius in 〈…〉 D. Field  defines the Mass to be a Sacrifice Rememorative, and of praise and thanksgiving, where many give thanks for the price of their Redemption.  
The Author of the Enchiridion of Christian Religion, published in the provincial Council of Colen, saith; 
q Enchir●d Col●ni●nse de Euch●r. t●ste coa●m.  In that the Church doth offer the true body and blood of Christ to God the Father, it is merely a representative sacrifice; and all that is don● is but the commemorating and representing of that sacrifice which was once offered on the Crosse.  
By that which hath been said, it is clear that the best and worthiest guides of God's Church, both before and after Luther's time, taught not any new real offering of Christ to God the Father as a propitiatory sacrifice to take away sins, but in effect as we do; namely, that the sacrifice of the Altar is only the sacrifice of praise and thanksgiving, and a mere representation and commemoration, of the sacrifice once offered upon the Cross, his being the real sacrifice on the Cross, ours only the Sacramental Representation, Commemoration, and Application thereof; so that Christ is not newly offered any otherwise, than in that he is offered in the view of God, nor any otherwise sacrificed, than in that his sacrifice on the Cross is commemorated and represented.  
And thus the Fathers term the holy Eucharist, an unbloody Sacrifice, not because Christ is properly, and in his substance offered therein, but because his bloody sacrifice upon the Cross, is by this unbloody commemoration represented, called to remembrance, and applied.  
Besides these points mentioned, I have already produced witnesses in all ages and in all parts of the world, rejecting those books as Apocryphal that we do; and shown, that even until Luther's time, the Church did not admit the Canon of Scripture which the Romanists now do, nor ever accounted those books canonical, which we think to be Apocryphal: and by these instances it may appear, That all were not Papists who held with the Mass.  
Th● thing than we say is this; that though the Mass was generally in u●e, at, ●nd b●fore Luther's time● yet diver● points belonging thereunto, were not believed by t●e worthiest guides in God, Church, at, and before Luther's time; though indeed there were some in the Church ●hat so conceived of them, as the Romanists now do; and the reason hereof is this.  
They were not generally received by all m●n, nor as the undoubted determinations of the Church; not as Dogmata fidei, but Dogmata scholae, controverted, and diversely disputed among the learned, & holden with great liberty of judgement by the greatest Doctors; as appears by their own books of controversies, written by Bellarmine, Sua●ez, Azorius and others, which confute their own writers almost as much as they do Protestant's.  
Besides, had they been the undoubted doctrines and determinations of the Church, all men would have holden them uniformly, entirely, and constantly, 
r Doctor Fields Ap●ndix to th● fi●th Book, part. 3. p●g. 11.  as they held the doctrine of the Trinity, the Creation, the Incarnation of the Son of God, and other Articles of the Faith.  

Objection.  
If these points were held as you say, not by the best members of the Church, but by a domineering faction therein; how came it that the prevailing faction suffered others to descent from them in judgement?   

Answer.  
So long as men yielded outward obedience to the Church-ceremonies without scandal; in other things they were suffered to abound in their own sense; so that they submitted themselves to the obedience of the Church of Rome.  
Besides, the Church of R●me had not so strictly defined those Tenets in any Council before, as afterwards they did in the Council of T●ent.    

PA.  
Our name Catholic is ancient; your Protestant name came not in till after Luther: Besides, it is a scandalous thing for your Church to derive authority from Wickliff●, Husse, Luther, and Calvin.   

PRO.  
Indeed, the name Protestant began upon the 
s Sicid in. Com. lib. 6. ad ann. 1529.  protesting of the Elector and La●d grave against the Edict: howsoever, the Faith is ancient, though the name be not, and yet if you stand upon names, we are called 
t Acts 11.26.  Christians, and into that name were we 
u 1 Co●inth. 1.13.  Baptised; and that is ancienter than your Roman catholic. Now you are called Catholics, but it is with an aliâs, or addition, Roman-Ca●holickes; as much as to say, Particular Universal, the part is the whole, one City the wo●ld; and it is yourselves that term you Catholics. Now if one Papist call another so, it is but as if one Mule should claw another. The Hagarens boldly usurped the name of Saracens, although they were only the brood that sprang from the womb of Hagar the handmaid of Sara. The Papists by this term Catholic, work upon simple people, arguing from the one, to the other, as if all the privileges of the Catholic Church belonged to the Roman, but we tell them, as 
x 〈…〉 sed Cath●●●●● non ●st. ●●tat lib. 3.  Optatus did the Donatists (who pinned up the Church in a corner of Africa, as the Romanists now con●ine her to their See) that Their Church is Quasi Ecclesia, in some sort a Church, but not the Catholic Church, but an unsound member thereof.  
We do not derive our Church from any other than the Primitive, Catholic, and Apostolic Church; The Lord is not far from every ●●e of us; 
y Acts 17.27.28.  for we are also his of spring. Christ jesus is the top of our ki●ne, and Religion the stock. Your pedigree m●y be drawn in part from some of the ancient Heretics; in ●espect of your Invocation of Sain●s and Angels● you are a kin at least by the half blood to the Angelici, Who (as Saint Aust●ne saith) 
z 〈…〉 p 39  were inclined to the worship of Angels; and were from thence, as Isidore noteth, 
a 〈…〉 Isidor. origin lib 8 cap. 5.  Called Angelici, because they did worship Angel●.  
By your Hyperdal●a, and w●●ship given to the blessed Virgin, you show yourselves allied to the Collyridian Heretics, whom Epiphanius 
b 〈…〉 ●9.  terms Idolaters; now th●y were called Collyridians', from the Collyrides or Cakes, which at a certain time of the year they used to offer unto the blessed Virgin, sacrificing to her as to the Queen of heav●n.  
By your doctrine of merit, and works of supererogation, you resemble the Pelagians or Catharists. Isidore notes it for a property of the Catharists, or ancient Puritans 
c  To glory of their merits. Thomas Wald●n saith, It was a branch of the Pelagian heresy to ●old, 
d  that according to the measure of meritorious works God will reward a man so meriting. Now the Rhemists, a sprig of this branch, maintain; That they do 
 wo●ke by their own freewill, and thereby deserve their salvation; as also that, 
f 〈…〉 6. sect. 4.  Good works are meritorious, and the very cause of salvation, so far that God should be unjust, if he rendered not heaven for the same.  
Now concerning the names of Wickl●ffe and Husse, Luther and Calvin, wherewith you pressour; you sh●ll not hereby drive us from holding that with them which th●y held of God: for though we rejoice not in names drawn from men, but in the name of Christians, into the which we are baptised; yet we know no great harm by them, nor you, we think (set slanders apart) why we should be ashamed of them, more than o●r Fathers were of Caecilian, 
g  of whom the Donatists c●lled th●m Caeci●ianists: but had they been as evil almost as their enemies report them (from which imp●tations they are already cleared) an● thei● doctrine ●ix● with l●●ven as was the Pharisees; yet Saint Paul hath tau●ht us, 
h  to acknowledge ourselves even Pharisees (i● need be, not only Lutherans, or Waldenses) in that the Pharisees taught a truth of Christian faith, to wit, the Resurrection of the dead.  
In a word, we esteem of Calvin and Luther, and the rest of the first Reformers as worthy men, but we make them not Lords over our 
i 2 Cor. 1.24.  faith.   

PA.  
What think you of our forefathers, that lived and died in the time of Popery as you call it? they were of our Religion.   

PRO.  
I think charitably of them, that they might be saved, for many of them were well meaning men, and wanting means of better instruction, they were carried with the sway of the times, and as Saint Paul saith, 1. Tim. 1.13. Did it ignorantly, like those two hundred, 2. Sam. 15.11. who in simplicity of heart followed Absalon, knowing nothing of his treason and rebellion intended: they knew not the depth and mystery of popery, not their Merit of condignity, nor their several sorts of adoration, their Latria, Dulia, and Hyperdulia.  
Indeed the Scriptures and Church-service were locked up in an unknown tongue; and yet even in the depth of Popery (as appears by a Council held at Clyffe, and also by a Provincial Constitution of john Peckam, Archbishop of Canterbury) The Priests were 
k 
Praec●pi●u● ut quilibet sacerdos quater in anno exponat populo vulgariter xiv ●idei Articulo●, Decem mand●ta Decalogi, et septem gratiae Sacramenta. Provincial. Constitut. Angliae apud Gul. Lindewood. lib 1. Ignorantia Sacerdot. [Vulgariter] in linguá ma●e●n● & vulgari, A●glicâ videli●et Anglicis, Gallicâ Gallicis, Glossa Ibidem.  
In a Council at Cliff (anno 747) it was decreed, th●t the Lords Prayer & Creed, should be read, and taught in the English tongue. Malmesb. de gest Pont. lib. 1.   enjoined to teach the people the heads of Christian faith and Religion, and namely to expound unto them the Creed, the ten Commandments, and the Sacraments; and that vulgariter, that is (as the Gloss there saith) in the vulgar and mother tongue, to wit, in English to the native English, and in French to the French-born; so that even in those danker times, there was a measure of explicit faith required at the hands of Lay-people, and they were to be trained up in the knowledge of those Credendorum; so far as the Letter of the Creed might lead them; and Faciendorum, such as the Decalogue appointed them; and Petendorum, comprised in the Lord's prayer; and Recipiendorum tendered in the Sacraments.  
It is Lyrae's 
l 
Apostolus specialiter d●●it se velle loqui quinque verba; quia predicatores d●●ent annun●iare quinque s●●luet Credenda, Agenda, Vitanda, T●mend●, Sper●nda, qui● p●●d●catio d●b●t esse de ●ijs quae pertine●●●●d s●dem, & sic hab●t●r primum; & de hijs qu● per●●ne●t ad ●o●es, et sic habentur quatu●r● virtutes & vit●a, p●na & gloria Lyra in 1 Cor. c. 14  
Scriptura 〈◊〉 unter continet Doc●●inam necessariam viatori,— quantum ad Credenda Sp●randa, & Operand●, Scotus 1. Sent. Prolog. cue 2.   conceit, that when Saint Paul saith, 1. Cor. 14.19. He had rat●er in the Church speak five words with his understanding, than ten thousand in a strange tongue; that those five words, were those Agenda and Credenda, which concern our faith and manners; as also those Vitanda, Timenda and Speranda, which the Pastors were to declare unto the people.  
Besides, there were diverse parcels of the Creed concerning Christ, and namely touching his Incarnation, Passion, his Resurrection and Ascension that were wont to be represented to their memories and meditations in the several Festivities and Holidays which the Church solemnised.  
Besides, we hope the better, for that they erred in points of less moment and danger, such as blemished indeed, but took not away the Churches being: and that they held the true foundation of Religion, that is, justification, and Salvation, by jesus Christ his merits only, God dealing graciously with our forefathers, in that this point was ordinarily taught in their books of Visitation and Consolation of the sick.  
In this respect, we hope that diverse, both formerly and in our days, who live Papists, die Protestants: for howsoever in their life time they talk of Works, Merits, and Satisfaction to God; yet on their deathbed diverse of them find little comfort in Crosses and Crucifixes, Pictures and Pope's pardons, in Agnus Dei's, blessed Grains, Relics, and the like: then they renounce all mere humane satisfaction, merit and works; and breath out their last breath in the Protestant language of that holy Martyr Master Lambert, 
m Acts and Monum. vol. 2. book 8. pag. 1124. ad ann. 1538.  who lift up his hands, such hands as he had, and his fingers ends, flaming with fire, and cried out to the people in these words; None but Christ, none but Christ.  
The example of Stephen Gar●iner Bishop of Winchester is notable to this purpose: 
n ibid. lib. 11. p. 1788. ad Ann. 1555.  when the Bishop lay sick on his deathbed, and Doctor Day Bishop of Chichester coming to visit him, began to comfort him, repeating to him such places of Scripture, as did express or import the free justification of a repentant sinner, in the blood of Christ; hereunto Winchester replied: What my Lord (quoth he) will you open that gap now? then farewell altogether; you may tell this to such as me, and others in my case, but open once this window to the people, and then farewell altogether.  
La●tly, we are not simply, and in every thing to follow our Ancestors: it was the argument of Simmachus the heathen 
o Servanda est totiu● seculi fides, & sequendi sunt nobis parentes qui secuti sunt faeliciter suos. Amb●os. epistol. lib. 2. tom. 5. ; Our religion which hath continued so long is to be retained; and our Ancestors to be followed by us, who happily traced their fore fathers: but the Lo●d saith, 
p Ezech. 20.18.  Walk ye not in the ordinances of your forefathers, neither after their manners, nor defile your s●lves with their Idols; I am the Lord your God: walk ye in my statutes, and keep them, and not after 
q 1 Pet. 1.18.  your vain conversation which ye have received by the tradition of the Fathers, as Saint Peter speaks.  

Object.  
If you hope so well of our forefathers, why hope you not so well of us their children?   

Answer.  
The parties are not alike; beside there is great difference of the times, then and now; the former were times of ignorance, these are the days wherein light is come into the world; in what they erred, they erred ignorantly, following the conduct of their guides, doing as they taught them; and so were misled as Saint Austin saith, 
r Hoc inquies majo●es nostri à suis parentibus accepe●●●t; respondetur, sed errantes ab errantibu● aut calumniantibus. Aug. cont. Crescon. grama●at. li. 3 c. 33. tom. 7.  Errantes ab errantibus, by their blind guides: but upon better information we presume, they would have reform their errors. Now he is more to be pitied who stumbleth in the dark, than in the daylight; men are now admonished of their er●rours, offer is made to them to be better instructed, so that their censure will be heavier, if either they dote on their own opinions, unwilling to be instructed in the reveled truth: or after sufficient knowledge and conviction, for some worldly respects, they wilfully and obstinately persist in their old errors; and (which is far worse) hate and persecute the maintainers of the truth.  
Saint Cyprian saith, 
s Si quis de an●ecesso 〈…〉, vel ●●noran●èt, vel simplicitèr, non hoc obser●avit & t●nuit, quod n●s d●mi●us f●cere exem●●o & m●gist●rio suo doc●it, potest simplicitati e●us de ind●lgentia domini 〈◊〉 ●o●●edi: nobis ver● non po●erit ignos●s, qui nu●c à Domino ad●oniti & inst●u●li ●umas. Cyprian epist. 63. Pan●el. num. 13. in ali● edit. lib. 2. epist. 3.  If any of our Predecessors, either of ignorance of simplicity, hath no● observed and held that which our Lord hath taught us by his word and example, by the Lord's mercy pardon might be granted to his simplicity: but to us that are now admonished and instructed of the Lord, pardon cannot be granted.  
Saint Augustine 
t Alla ●●usa est ●orum qui in istos haereticos imprudentèr in●urrunt, ipsam esse Christi e●clesiam ex●stimante●; alia co●um qui noverunt non ●sse Catholic●n. Augustin. de Bap●. 〈◊〉. Donat. cap. 4..  puts a difference betwixt Heretics, and them that believe Heretics; and he saith farther: 
u Qui se●tentiam suam 〈…〉 ●als●m ac perversam, n●ll● pe●tinaci anim●sit●te defendunt; praesert●● quam non auda●●● presumptionis ●ue pepere●unt, seda seductis, atque i● err●rem lapsis parenti●●s acc●per●nt, quaeru●t autem ca●t● sollicitudine 〈…〉. A●g●st. ●pist. 162. ●om. 2.  They that defend an opinion false and perverse without pertinacious selfe-mindednesse; especially, which not the boldness of their own presumption hath begotten, but which from their seduced and erroneous Parents, they have received, and themselves do seek the truth with care and diligence, ready to amend their error, when they find the truth; they are in no wise to be reckoned among Heretics: this was the case of our Fathers under the Papacy.  
In a word, our Fathers they lived in those errors of ignorance, not of obstinacy, and knew not the dangerous consequence of them; such men by particular repentance of sins known, and general repentance of unknown, might by God's mercy be saved.   

Object.  
If holding the foundation will serve, as you seem to say in the case of our forefathers, than we may safely obtain salvation in the Church of Rome.   

Answer.  
This followeth not; for the Church of Rome buildeth many things which by consequent destroy the foundation: 
uu Doctor 〈◊〉 in his 〈◊〉 Advertisement 〈◊〉 to his 〈◊〉 of the Old Religion.  Rome doth both hold the foundation, and destroy it; she holds it directly, destroys it by consequent. As the Galathians held the foundation (to wit, salvation by jesus Christ) and yet withal held a necessity of joining Circumcision with Christ; which doctrine, by consequence destroyed the very foundation, for so Saint Paul wrote unto them, Galat. 5.2.4. If they were circumcised, Christ profited them nothing, h●e became of none effect unto them, they were fallen from grac●. In like sort, Popery opposeth the Faith, not directly, but obliquely, not formally, but virtually, not in express terms, but by consequence.  
Popery overthrows the foundation by consequence, whiles it brings on so many stories of unsound adjections, and corrupt super-additions, upon the ancient ground-sole of Religion, as are like to ●ndanger the whole frame. The learned, and acute Doctor, Doctor Hall, now Lord Bishop of Exeter, gives several instances hereof. 
x Doctor Hall, Decad 6. epist. 4. to Doctor M●b●u●ne.  Popery overthroweth the truth of our justification, whiles it ascribes it to our own works: the all-sufficiency of Christ's own Sacrifice, whiles they reiterate it daily by the hands of a Priest. Of his Satisfaction, while th●y hold a payment of our utmost farthings, in a devised Purgatory. Of his Mediation, while they implore others to aid them, not only by their Intercession, but their Merits; suing not only for their prayers, but their gifts: the value of the Scriptures, whiles they hold them unsufficient, obscure in points essential to salvation, and bind them to an uncertain dependence upon the Church. Now for the simpler sort, whil●s in truth of heart, they hold the main principles which they know; doubtless, the mercy of God may pass over their ignorant weakness in what they cannot know. For the other, I fear not to say, that many of their errors are wilful. The light of truth hath shined out of heaven to them, and they loved darkness more than light. Thus far that learned bishop.    

PA.  
The Protestants (at ●ast many of them) contesse there may be salvation in our Church; we absolutely deny there●s salvation in theirs: therefore it is saf●r to come to ours, than to s●ay in theirs, to be where almost all grant salvation, than where the greater part of the world deny it.   

PRO.  
This point is fully cleared by the judicious Author 
y M●ster Fisher's Relation o● his ●hi●d Conference, ●●●wered b● R. B. Compleine to t●e R●●ht R B. o● St. D●●ids.  of the Answer to Fisher's Relation of his third Conference.  
Upon this very point saith h●e 
z Ibid. pag. 68.69. , (that we acknowledge, An honest ignorant Papist may be saved) they work upon the advantage of our Charity, and their own want o● it, to abuse the weak; but if they would speak truly, and say, many Protestants indeed contesse, there is salvation possible to be attained in the Roman Church, but yet the errors of that C●u●ch a●e so many (and some, such as weaken the foundation) that it is very hard to go that way to heaven, especially to them that have had the truth manifested unto them; the heart of this Argument were broken.  
The force of this Argument lies herein; that we and ou● adversaries' consent, that there is salvation to some in the Roman Church. What? would you have us an malicious (at least as rash) as yourselves are to us, and deny you so much as possibility of salvation? if we should, we might make you in some things strain for a proof. But we have not so learned Christ, as either to return evil for evil in this heady course, or to deny salvation to some ignorant silly Souls, who hold the foundation, Christ jesus, and survey not the building.  
But this was an old trick of the Donatists who shut up the Church in Africa, as they do now in Rome, and the Roman See. For in the point of Baptism (Whether that Sacrament was true in the Catholic Church, or in the part of Donatus) they exhorted all to be Baptised among them: Why? Because both parts granted, that Baptism was true among the Donatists; which that peevish sect most unjustly denied the sound part, as Saint Austin 
a 〈◊〉 apud Donati●●●● B●pti●mum. & ●lli ass●runt, & nos conced● 〈◊〉 &c Augustin. lib. ●●de ●aptismo cont. Donat. cap. 3.  delivers it. I would ask now, had not the Orthodox Baptism among them, because the Donatists denied it injuriously? or should the Orthodox against truth, h●ve denied Baptism among the Donatists, to cry quittance with them?  
Besides, what have they gained by some Protestant's confession, saying tha● some might be saved in the Roman Church? this term, [Might be Saved] gr●nts but a Possibility, to some we●ke ones, no sure or safe way to salvation. For a safe way they can hardly go, who pertinaciously adhere to their errors, having sufficient means to be bet●er informed. Howsoever, their reckoning is like to be ●he heavier, who for some by-respects oppose a knowle truth, which they either do, or might believe, if their hearts were upright, and not perversely obstinate, and not only so, but draw other we●ke ones to their bent. Saint Augustine saith, 
b Si mi●i vide●etur unus & id●m Hereti●us & Haereti●●●redens homo, &c August●● de ut●lit. credendi cap. 1. tom. 6  There will be ever a difference between an Heretic, and a plain well meaning man th●t is misled, and believes an Heretic. God pitieth the blind, that would fain see and cannot; but will he pity them that may see and will not? that harden themselves in their affected wilful blindness? he delivered jonas from drowning in the bottom of the Sea, will you plung yourselves therefore, to see if God will deliver you? Because we grant, 
c Bishop V●●ers Sermon it Wins●●d, of ●he Vn●●e of Faith. pag. 26.  (saith that most learned Prelate, Doctor Usher) that some may scape death in Cities, and Streets, in●ected with the Plagu●, will you therefore be so fool hardy, after warning giust of the present danger, as to choose to take up your lodging in a Pest-house? if you do, we may well say, in our C●arity, Lord have mercy upon you: but you may justly fear, that you dangerously tempt the Lord, to send you Strong delusion to believe a lie, 
d 2 Th●s. 2.10.11 12.  b●cause you received not the love of the truth, to believe it.  
L●stly, if we grant you a possibility of salvation, and you deny the same to us (which yet is not yours to give, or to withhold;) ●h●s showeth not tha● you have mo●e truth on your side than we, but rather that we have more charity than you, who without truth or modesty (a● our learned Prov●st of Queen's College in Oxford hath shown in his 
 Answer to Charity mistaken) dare affirm, that protestancy destroyeth salvation.  
B●● l●t n●t the Protestant b●e discouraged with this h●●dy censure; for we are confident, that the faith p●o●essed in the Church of England is the Catholic, Orthodox, and saving ●aith, and we can show good ●eason ●o● it.  

 For to believe the Scripture of the two Testaments, to b●l●●ve the th●ee Creeds, in the sense of the ancient P●●●itive Church, to receive the four great general Coun●●ls, so m●●h magnified by antiquity; to admit, What ever the Fathers for the first five hundred years with joint consent agreed upon, to be bele●ved as a necessary point 〈◊〉 salvation, or at leastwise to be humbly silent, not presuming to condemn the same, is a faith, in which to live and die, cannot but give salvation, specially being accompanied with a godly life, and a faithful death.  

 Now whether it be wisdom in such a point as Salvation is, to forsake a Church, in the which the ground of salvation is f●●me, to follow a Church, in which it is possibl● o●e may be saved, but very probable one may do wo●s●, if he look not well to the foundation, judge ye●● I am sure Saint Augustine 
h  thought it wa● not, and judged it A great sin, in point of salvation, for a man to preferr● 〈…〉, incertainties and naked possibilities b●fore an 〈◊〉 and certain course. Now this ●ul● of Sa●nt Augustine's makes for us; for we go upon cert●in●●●s, an● walk in 
 the Via tu●a, the safe way, ●s th●t learned Knight, and my worthy good 〈…〉 hath shown at large.  
〈…〉 b●ene said, the vanity of the 〈…〉 for (as Master ●●del saith, 
 in hi● 〈…〉 Wad●sworths motives) by the 〈…〉 better to have become a jewish Proselyte, i● th● Apo●●les time, than a Christian: for the Christians acknowledged the jews to be the people of God, and s●iled them brethren, notwithstanding their zeal to the Ceremonies, and traditions of their Fathers, excused their ignorance, and ba●e with ●hem. Whereas on the contrary they called those that professed Christ, Heretikes●nd ●nd Sectaries, accursed th●m, drew them out of their Synagogues, imprisoned them, as you do now the Protestants.  
By like reason a Pagan in Saint Augustine's time, should rather have made himself a Christian among the Donatists, then with the Catholics. For (as it is already noted) the Catholics granted the Donatists' Baptism to be true, and accounted them brothers: the Donatists on the contrary 
l pi●●●8 ●8.  renounced their brotherhood and baptism both, rebaptised such as fell to their side, used these forms of speech to their friends, 
m Co●ule animae 〈…〉. A●gus●. de 〈…〉. lib. 2. 〈◊〉. 7.  Save thy soul, become a Christian, like to those terms used by our Romish Reconcilers at this day.   

PA.  
Prove what you say, that in point of Religion you go the safe way.   

PRO.  
This appears to be true, in that diverse of your side, the moderate and sober sort at least, 
n 
 
〈…〉 against 〈…〉. And Sir 〈…〉 1●.   do oftentimes grant our Conclusions, and that in sundry things our course is the safer. As in making no Image of God. In trusting only in the merits of Christ. I● worshipping none but the Trinity. In directing our p●ayers to our Lord I●sus Christ alone. In allowing Ministers to marry. In diverse other points also, many of your side, say the same with the Protestants, as it is already shown in this treatise.  
And therefore, if you will force the Argument, to make that the safest way of salvation, which differing parts agree upon; why do you not join with u●, since for the Positive, and Affirmative Articles of our Religion, no● only the m●st, but al●, Pr●t●stant and Pap●●● ag●e● therein?  
For example s●ke, 
〈◊〉 C●alo●er's 〈◊〉 Credo Eccle●i●m S. Catholicam. Pag. 8● 85.  We agree on bo●h sides, the Scriptures to be the R●le of Faith, the books of the old Testament written in Hebrew to be Canonical, that we are justified by Faith, that God hath made two Receptacl●s for men's s●●les aft●r death, Heaven and Hell, that God may ●e worshipped in spirit without an Image, tha● we are ●o pray unto God by Christ, that there be two Sacraments, that Christ is really received in the Lords Su●per, that Christ made one oblation of himself upon the Cross, for the Redemption, Propitiation, and Satisfaction for the sins of the whole world.  
In a word, where they take the Negative part, as in withholding the Cup from the Lai●ie, forbidding the administration of the Sacraments in the vulgar tongue, and restraining the marriage o● Priest's, yet even in th●se they condescend unto u●, for t●e lawfulness of the things in themselves, and in respect of the law of God, an● oppose them only in rega●d of their conveniency, and for that the Church of Rome hath otherwise ordained.  
But see, our ●ffi●mations content them not. To the Scriptures the● add● and equalise unwritten Traditions; to ●he Hebr●w Canon, the Apocrypha; to Faith in the act of justification, works; to Heaven and Hell, Purgatory, Limbus Patrum, and Limbus Puero●um; to the worship of God in spirit, Images; to Prayer to God by Chri●t, Invocation and Intercession of S●in●s; to Baptism and ●he Lords Supper, five other Sacraments; to the Reality of Christ in the Sacrament, his Corporal presence; to t●e Sacrifice of Ch●ist upon the Cros●e, ●he Sacrifice in t●e Mass; wit● other like; and these we deny, as being Corrupt Additions to the Faith.  
These be our grounds wherein we enter-common with them; and these be their additions and improvements which they have raised and enclosed upon the Lords Freehold. Let us briefly survey them both: Bell●●m●ne is confid●nt that The Apostles never used to Preach openly to the people other things than the Articles of the Apostles Creeds the ten Comman●●m●nts, and some of the Sacraments: because (saith he) 
p 〈…〉. B●lla. de 〈◊〉 D●i. lib. 4. c●p 11. § Primum.  these are simply necessary and profitable for all men; the rest beside, such as that a man may be saved without them.  
If one worship God without an Image, they will not deny but that this spiritual worship is acceptable to God. If one call upon God alone, by the only mediation of Christ, they will not say that this devotion is fruitless. If one say the Lords Prayer, or other devotions in the vulgar tongue, they will not deny but that such Prayers as a●e made with understanding and in a known language may be fruitful and effectual.  
For Lyra saith, 
q Si populus int●llig●● orationem Sac●rdoti●, m●lius ●educitur in D●um● & d●voti●s ●●sp●nd●t 〈◊〉. Lyra in 1 Cor. 14.  that If the people understand the prayer of the Priest, they are better brought to the knowledge of God, and they answer Amen with greater devotion.  
Cardinal Cajetan who had often performed the public service in an unknown tongue in the Church, yet contrary to his practice professeth, 
r 〈…〉 doc●rinâ ●a●etur, quod melius ●st ad Eccl●si● 〈◊〉, orati●nes publi●as quae ●ud●●nte p●p●lo 〈◊〉 lingu● 〈…〉 & p●pulo quam 〈…〉. 〈…〉 in c●p. 141. ad Co●inth. ve●s. 17.  It is better, by Saint Paul's doctrine, for the edifying of the Church, that public prayers were made in a vulgar tongue, to be understood indifferently by Priest's and people, ●han in Latin.  
If a man receive the Sacrament in both kinds, they will not, I suppose deny, but that it is very comfortable to receive bo●h p●rts o● the Eucharist.  
Alexander of Hales, the first and greatest of all the School m●n, pr●fesse●h; 
s Illa tamen quae ●st sub d●●bus est majori● me●i●i● t●m ratione augmenta●ionis d●vo●ionis, tum ratione fide● dilatationis ac●ualis Hale●s. in 4. Sent cue ●●. membr. 1.  that Though the order of receiving in one ki●d b● sufficient, yet the order of both kinds is of mor● merit, for increase of devotion and faith.  
If o●e perform the best wo●kes he can (which we also require) and stand not upon the point of merit, but only upon the mercy of God, as we do, this likewise serves. to justify our doctrine; for they themselves hold it a Man's safest course, 
t 〈◊〉 est 〈…〉 benignitate 〈◊〉 Bell●r. de Iusti●●c. l●b. 5. 〈◊〉. 7 §. Si●.  not to trust to his own merits, but wholly and solely to cast himself on the m●rcy of God in jesus Christ.  
Now this justifies our Religion, and shows that it is sufficient to salvation; in as much as the grounds thereof (setting aside the matters in question between us) are fully able to instruct a man in all points necessary to his salvation, both how to live religiously, and to die comfortably.  
Hence also it followeth, that (by their own confession) the controverted points are unnecessary, and superfluous; in as much as a man may be saved, who neither knows nor believes, nor practices these additions and excesses of theirs.  

Object.  
You talk of our excesses, and conceal your own defects: now (as the Archbishop of Spalleto saith) 
n 〈…〉 1. nu. ●. 9, 10. 〈…〉 Docto 〈…〉 in De 〈…〉 cap. 47 nu 12.  Heresy consists in the defect, not in the excess of believing; and he is an Heretic, who falleth short in his faith, by not believing something that is written, and not he that abounds in his faith, by believing more than is written: now you fail, in that you scant the measure of your faith.   

Answer.  
The Analogy and integrity of faith is hurt and broken by Addition, as well as Subtraction, by Diseases as well as by Maims. We are forbidden, 
〈◊〉 4.2. Revelat. 22.18.  under the same penalty, either to add, or diminish aught from God's word: Faith is of the nature of a rule, or certain measure, to which if any thing be added, or taken from it, it ceaseth to be that Rule. Faith (saith Tertullian 
〈…〉 cap. 14. ) Is contained in a Rule; to know nothing beyond it, is to know all th●ngs. And a little before, 
z 〈…〉. Ib. ca 8.  This first of all we believe, that no more ought to be believed, as necessary to all. V●rtue is in the mean●, vice as well in the excess, as in the defect in our body the superabundance of humours is as dangerous as lack of them: as many die of Plethories as of Consumptions; a hand or foot which hath more fingers, or toes than ordinary, is alike monstrous, as that which wanteth the due number. A foundation may be as well overthrown, by laying on it more than it will bear, as by taking away that which is necessary to support the building: Errors of addition are dangerous, as appears by these instances following. The Samaritans feared the Lord, and served their own Gods, 2. King. 17.33. The Galathians believed the Gospel, yet retained also, and observed the legal Ceremonies, Galath. 4.9. 
a August. Haeres. 85.  Helvidiu● held that blessed Mary had other children unto joseph her husband, after her son jesus; here was an excess of belief, for he believed more than was revealed: this opinion of Helvidius, although it be not denied in the Scripture, yet it is erroneous, in as much as it is not therein affirmed, neither can it be thence deduced by any good consequence; and therefore the Church holding that she was a pure Virgin both before the birth of Christ, and that she also continued a Virgin all her life after, condemned Helvidius for an Heretic: now why were the Helvidians adjudged Heretics? surely because they believed more than was reveled in the word, and would have thrust that on the Church for an Article of faith, which had no ground at all.  
And this is your case, you over-teach in your belief as the Helvidian Heretics did: witness your tenets of Transubstantiation, adoration of Images, Invocation of Saints, Purgatory, the Pope's supremacy, and the like; wherein your faith is monstrous, 
b 2. Sam. 21.20.  like the G●ant of Gath, who had on every hand six fingers, and on every foot six toes: and so it is with you; who in the new Creed of Pope Pius the fourth, have shuffled in more Articles of faith than ever God, and his Catholic Church made.  
Neither do we fall short in our belief: for we measure our faith, by the standard and rule of Gods written word● now since it jumpeth with the rule, it neither faileth in defect, nor over-reacheth in excess. Now by this time I hope I have performed the task which I undertook.    

PA.  
You have indeed given in a Catalogue of visible Professors in some part of Christendom, but what is this to the whole universal Church?   

PRO.  
Very much; for these particular congregations serve to make up the whole state of Christ his Church militant here on earth: now this Church far and wide dispersed, hath in her particular members (for substance of doctrine) taught as we do.  
To begin with the Eastern Church amongst the Grecians and Armenians.  
The Grecians held, 
c Nilus' Episcop. Thessalon de Primatu P●pae. B●ri●am de Primatu Pap●. & Guido C●rmelit. de haeres. Grae●or. cap. 3. & 20.  that the Roman Church had not any Supremacy of jurisdiction, authority and grace, above, or over all other Churches.  
They celebrated the Sacrament of the Eucharist in both kinds, 
d Graeci asserunt, esse necessarium sub utr●que spe●ie communicandum. Prateol. de haeres. l●b. 7.  as we do.  
They denied that there was any 
Docent nullum esse Purgatorium. Id Ibid.  Purgatory fire.  
They denied 
f Docent ext●emae unctionis sacramentum aegrotantibus non prod●sse ad sal●tem corporis. Id. Ibid.  Extreme unction to be a Sacrament properly so called.  
They 
g Master Brie●wood in his Enquiry of Religion's cap 15.  reject the Religious use of Massy Images, or Statues, admitting yet Pictures or plain Images in their Churches.  
The Armenians deny 
h Non credunt quod sit sub speciebus panis & vini ve●e & realiter verum corpus & sanguis Christi, sed tantum in similitudine & signo Guido Episcop. in sum de ●aeres. cap. 22.  the true body of Christ to be really in the Sacrament of the Eucharist under the Species of Bread and Wine.  
They deny 
i Guido loco alleg. & Prateol. lib. 1. de Haeres.  the virtue of conferring grace, to belong to the Sacraments Ex Opere operato.  
They deny the Pope's Supremacy, and are subject to two of their own patriarchs whom they call 
k ●rateol ibid.  Catholics.  
They 
l Pra●●ol. ibid.  reject Purgatory.  
They have their public Service in their 
m Brocard descriptio terrae sanctae. teste Ed●ardo Brierwood loco citato.  vulgar language.  
The North-east Church, amongst the Russians and Muscovites, as they were converted to Christianity by the Grecians; so have they ever since continued of the Greek Communion and Religion.  
They 
n Totum sacrum vernacul● lingu● apud Moscovitas peragi solet. Sigismond. de reb. Moscovit. pag. 46. tit. de Decimis.  have their divine Service in their own vulgar language.  
They 
o Purgatorium nullum credun●. Ibid. ti●. Purgator.  reject Purgatory.  
They communicate in both 
p Communicant sub utràque specie. Ibid pag. 40 tit. Communio.  kinds.  
They deny the spiritual efficacy of 
q Sacranus de error. Ruthenor. cap. 2. & Prateol. de haeres lib 16.  Extreme unction.  
To proceed, now to the South-Church amongst the Habassines, or mid land Aethiopians: the Character of their Religion is this; as I find it in Ma●hew Dresser, who reports it from Francis Alvarez, a Portugal Priest, and sometimes Legate into Aethiopia.  
They communicate in both 
r Sacramentum integrum tam Clerici qu●m La●ci accipiunt. Math. Dresser de Religione sub precioso joanne. pa. 525.  kinds.  
They use no 
s Id. Ibidem.  Extreme unction.  
They 
t Sanctos venerantur, sed non invocant; Matri Christi honorem mag●um tribuunt, s●d neque adorant, n●que op●m eius implorant. Ibid. pag. 526.  reverence the Saints, but they pray not unto them; they do much honour the mother of Christ, but they neither adore her, nor crave her mediation.  
They have their Liturgy, or Church Service in their own 
u Alvarez. cap. 11.  vulgar language.  
They 
x Math. Dr●sser. loco citato. pag 529.  have a patriarch of their own, who is confirmed and consecrated by the patriarch of Alexandria, on which See they depend, and not on the Roman.  
In the Western Church we have the consent of the Waldenses in France, the Wicklevists in England, commonly called Lollards, and Thaborites in Bohemia.  
Here be then the Greek and Latin Church; the Churches in the the East, West, North, and South; all of them teaching (for substance of doctrine) as we do.  
I know indeed, that Bellarmine sleighteth these Churches of Graecia, Armenia, Russia, and Aethiopia, saying, 
y Bellarm. de verb. Dei. lib. 2. cap. ult. in fi●e  We are no more moved with their examples, than with the examples of Lutherans and Calvinists; for they be either Heretics or Schismatics. So that all Churches (be they never so Catholic and ancient) if they subscribe not to the now Roman● Faith, are either Schismatical or Heretical. But we may not be so uncharitable to these afflicted Churches. For (as learned Bishop Usher saith) 
z Bishop Ushers Sermon of the Unity of Faith. pag. 28.  if we should take a survey of these Churches, and put by the points wherein they did differ one from another, and gather into one body the rest of the Articles wherein they all did generally agree, we should find, that in those propositions which without all controversy are universally ●eceived in the whole Christian world, so much truth is contained, as being joined with holy obedience, may be sufficient to bring a man unto everlasting salvation.  

Object.  
I except against the Greek Church, for that it denieth the procession of the Holy Ghost from the Son of God.   

Answer.  

See the learned Answer to Master Fisher's Relation of his third Conference, by R. B. pag. 5.  Every error denieth not Christ the foundation. Indeed it would have grated the foundation, if they had so denied the procession of the Holy Ghost from the Son, as that they had made an inequality between the Persons; but since their form of speech is; 
a Spiritum verò sanctum & ex Pa●re, et Spiritum patris nominamus, ex silio a●tem Spiritum sanctum non dicimus● sed spiritum filij nomin●mus. D●mascen. lib. 1. ●id. Orthod c●p. 11.  that the Holy Ghost proceedeth from the Father by the Son, and is the spirit of the Son, and since, (as the Master of the Sentences saith) 
b Sed cum non sit aliud Spir●tum sanctum esse Patris vel Filij, qu●m esse à Patre et Fi●io: etiam in hoc in eandem nobiscum Fi●et s●ntentiam convenire videntur, linnet in ve●bis di●●●●tiant. Magist. 1. Sent. Dist. xi. D.  Non est aliud, It is not another thing to say, the Holy Ghost is the Spirit of the Father and the Son, then that he is, or proceeds from the Father and the Son, in this they seem to agree with us, In eandem fidei sententiam, upon the same sentence of Faith, though they differ in words: Since I say, they thus express themselves, they may continue to be a true Church, though erroneous in the point mentioned.  
In like sort, Scotus (following his Master Lombard) saith, 
c Pate●et ips●m contr●rietatem non esse veracitèr real●m, sicut est vocal●●. Scotus in 1. S●nt. Dist xi. qu. 1.  that The difference between the greeks and the Latins in this point, is rather Verbal, in the manner of speech, than Real, and material.  
Besides, it seems by the same Scotus, that the Greeks held no other Heresy, 
d Sed quis audet hunc auctorem D●mascenū, Basilium, Gregorium, & similes patres Graecos arguere haeres●os. Id. Ibid.  than Saint Basil and Gregory Nazianzen held, whom yet no man durst ever yet call Heretics; so that you must give us the famous Greek Church again.    

PA.  
I have yet diverse 
e Parsons, third part of the three conversions. In his examen of Fox's Calendar. Chap. 6. num. ● & nu. 9 & nu. 11.  exceptions to take at your Catalogue, as also at your English martyrology; for you have named out of Fox, some for Martyrs, who were very mean persons, namely, john Claydon, a Curriar of Leather, Richard Howden a Wooll-winder; as also some, by name, Thomas Bagley, for a Martyr, who was a married Priest.   

PRO.  
What though some of them were tradesmen? did not Peter stay diverse days in joppa, with one Simon a Tanner, Act. 9.43. Was not that godly convert Lydia a seller of Purple? Act. 16.14. Hath not God chosen the base things of the world to confound the mighty? 1 Cor. 1.27. etc.  
Besides, they were no such base people; for among others, I produced Sir john Old Castle, Lord Cobham, and Sir Roger Acton knight, burnt for Religion in the reign of king Henry the fifth: and in Queen Mary's days, there were five Bishops, one and twenty Divines, and eight Gentlemen who suffered for the truth.  
Lastly, what though some of them were simple people? 
f Ruffin. Eccles. His●. l●. 1. cap. 3.  Ruffinus makes mention of a heathen philosopher at Nice, who through his great skill in the art of Logic, wound himself (Adder-like) out of the bishop's arguments, that they were not able to put him to silence, until there rose up in the Council a simple man who knew nothing but Christ and him crucified, who with some blunt Interrogatories so amazed the Philosopher, that not only as a dumb man he had not a word to reply, but yielded himself to the truth which the plain man had uttered. Yea but they were married priests, whom we produce for martyrs; what then? Gregory Nazianzen brings in his Father, who was Bp. of the same See, speaking thus of him; 
g Gr●gor. Nazianz. in Carmine d● vitá ●u●. Edit. Morel. Paris. tom. 2.  Nondum tot annisunt tui, quotjam in sacris mihi sunt peracti victimis: that is; the years of thine age, are not so many, as of my Priesthood. Whereby it is clear that Gregory Nazianzen was born to his father, af●er the time of his holy Orders. 
h Doctor Hall the Honour o● the married Clergy. lib. 2. sect. 8.  And lest any man should suspect that this 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, this nondum, or, not a● yet, might reach only to the birth, not to the begetting of Gregory Nazianzen, so as perhaps he might be born after his father's o●d●rs● and begotten before th●m; it is further shown (which makes all sure and plain) that Gorgonia and Caesarius the sister and brother of this Gregory, were by the same father begotten afterwards; as is evident both by that verse of Nazianzen, who speaking of his mother, as th●n childless when sh● begged him of God, 
i Nazianz Ibid.  lays; 
Cupiebat illa masculum soetum domi  
Spectare, magna ut pars cupit mortalium.   
And the clear testimony of Elias Cretensis, saying, 
k Quamvi● enim si nari vitatem●pectes, etc. Eli●s Cr●t●ns. in orat. G●eg. Naz. 19  Although if you regard his birth, he was not the only child of his Parents, forasmuch as after him both Gorgonia, and Caesarius were borne.  
Now if this Bishop after holy Orders conversed conjugally with his wife, and that without the Church's scandal; then is it not any disparagement to some of our Martyrs that they were married Priests.   

PA.  
Fox nameth some for Martyrs, who afterwards were living.   

PRO.  
There might be some that received the sentence of death, and martyrdom, and yet the same parties upon occasion, and mediation, might come to be reprieved, or released, and this not come to Mr. Fox his knowledge. This cannot discredit the whole story, taken for the most part out of your own registers, and other credible witnesses.   

PA.  
You have put some into your Catalogue who were excommunicate persons, and condemned to be burnt for Heretics: as namely hus, and Wickliff, whose body was digged up forty years after his burial, and burnt by the Pope's command.   

PRO.  
Indeed they were Heretics in such manner as Christ was called and condemned for a 
l Math. 26.65.  Blasphemer; or as Saint Paul saith 
m Acts 24.14. , After the way which they call heresy, so worship we the God of our Fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and the Prophets.  
Indeed, if this be heresy, to acknowledge no other foundation, then that which God himself hath laid, no other Mediator than Christ jesus, nor any expiation but by his blood, nor any propitiatory sacrifice but his death, nor any satisfaction to God's justice but his obedience, nor any rule to guide us infallibly to salvation, but his word contained in the holy Scriptures; if this I say be heresy, then may they and we be so reputed.  
Now to discover who be Heretics indeed, let the Reader look to the voice of the Church before these odds grew, and see which way the Church inclined. For though in the Primitive Ages thereof, the writers could not speak so expressly and punctually against heresies until they sprang up, yet even then they delivered such grounds, as might serve to overthrow the errors and superstition which afterwards arose.  
Yea but our Professors have been excommunicated and condemned, so was the blind man in the Gospel, whom our Saviour cured, he was cast out of the Synagogue, 
n 
john 9.34.  
Ejecerunt ●um ●oras, id est, ● societate aliorum homi●um excommuni●●verunt. Ly●a. in loc.   and yet Christ took him into his protection, for the good profession he made.  
It might be that in those papal censures, the keys were mistaken, or the wards of the lock changed, and then Errante clave Ecclesia, their censures did not bind.  
The Ephesine latrociny (for so it was called, Synodus 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉) 
o Act Conci●lab. Ephes. citata in Acts Conc. Chalced Act. pag. 57 b.  adjudged and condemned Flavianus, an holy and Catholic B●shop, for an Heretic, under that censure Flavian●● died, nay was martyred 
p Caesus Flavianus dollar pl●ga●um migravit ad Dominum. Ib. cap. 12.  by them: the holy Council at Chalced●● after the death of Flav●anus, loosed that band, wherewith the Latrocinous Conspirators at Ephesus, thought they had fast tied him, but because their Key did err, they did not in truth, they honoured and proclaimed Flavianus for a Saint and Martyr, 
q Que (Synodus Chalced.) Flaviano palmam morti● tribuit gloriosae. Edict. Valen. & Mart. in Chalced. Concil. Act. 4, p●g. 86. a. Et Flavian●s injust quidem in vi●● condem●ut●s, just p●st mortem revocatus est à be●to Leone & sanctà Synodo Chalcedonens● Iust●●ian. Edict. §. Invenimus.  whom the faction of Dioscurus had murdered for an heretic. By which example and warranty of that holy Council, our Church of latter time, restored to their Pristine 
r Histor combu●●ionis Buceri & Fagij & re●●●tu●ion●s eorum. Argentinae. 1560.  dignity and honour, to Flaviani in their age, Bucer and F●gius after their death; what time that papal conspiracy had not only with an erring Key bound, but digged up their bodies out of their graves, and burned them to ashes.  
The papal faction hath been but too peremptory in their censures; ●hey were far from the moderation of the Curate in Paris, who being to publish an Excommunication, what time there was great difference between the Emperou● Frederick the second, and Pope Innocent the fourth, he thus acquitted himself. Give ear (saith he to his 
s Morney of the Mystery of Iniquity. Progress. 51.  Parishioners) I have received commandment to pronounce the solemn sentence of Excommunication against the Emperor Frederick, candles put out, and bells ringing. Now I know not the cause that deserves this, and yet I am not ignorant of the great odds that is between them: I know also that one of them doth wrong the other, but which it is I know not: so far forth then as my power doth extend, I excommunicate and pronounce excommunicated one of the two, namely him that doth the injury to the other, and absolve him that suffereth the wrong, which is so hurtful unto all Christendom. Thus far he.  
Now the thing which we require on the behalf of out professors so injuriously dealt withal, as that their sworn enemies become both their witnesses and their judges, which even common reason itself 
t Inimicus capitalis nunquam admittitur esse accusator. Glossa apud Gratian. par. 2. causâ 3. quaest. ●●.  forbids; that I say which we crave, is this; that since neither themselves have confessed the crimes laid to their charge, nor others have as yet justly convicted them thereof, that they may have the benefit of the Law, and accordingly be restored, according to an ordinary 
u Restituendus est quem neque convictum, neque con●essum, constat esse ejectum. Gratian part. 2. causâ 2. cue 1. tit. Nicol●us.  Canon provided in that case.   

PA.  

uu Parson's third part of Convers. chap. 3.  Your Waldenses, Wicklifists and Hussites, and such as you account Confessors and Martyrs they errea in diverse points, they varied amongst themselves, and differed from you; so that they cannot belong to the same Church.   

PRO.  
Concerning Wickliff●, Husse, and the rest, if they have any of them borne record to the truth, and resisted any innovation of corrupt Teachers in their times, even to blood, they are justly to be termed Martyrs: yea, albeit they saw not all corruptions, but in some were themselves carried away with the stream of error. Else, if because they erred in some things, they be no Martyrs; or because we descent from them in some things, we are not of the same Church, both you and we must quit all claim, to Saint Cyprian, justin Martyr, and many more whom we count our ancients and predecessors, and bereave them also of the honour of martyrdom, which so long they have enjoyed. Irenaus, and justin Martyr held the error of the Millenaries, Cyprian & many others held Rebaptisation necessary for such as were baptised by heretics. S Austin, and the greatest part of the Church for six hundred years, held a necessity of the Eucharist to Infants; and in other things differed one from another; and from the Church in the aftertimes, correcting their errors: yet because they all entirely and steadfastly held all the necessary fundamental principles which these errors did not infringe, neither held they these errors obstinately, but only for want of better information; they were of the same Church and Religion whereof we are. S. Austin saith, 
x 
Alia sunt de quibus inter se aliqu●●do etiam doctiss●mi atque optimi R●gulae Catholic●e d●fensores salva sidei co●page non consonant, & alius alio de un● re melius aliquid dicit & ver●us. Hoc autem undè nunc agimus ad ipsa fid●i perti●●t ●undamenta. Augustin l. 1. cont. julian. Pelagian. cap. 2. tom 7.  
Mult● ign●rari possunt, salv● Christian● fide, & alicubi e●●●ri, sine aliquo Haereti●i dogmatis crimine. Idem de pecc. orig. contr. Pelag. & Coelest. cap. 23.   There be some things in which the most Learned, and best Defenders of the Catholic Rule (the bond of faith preserved) do sometimes not agree among themselves; and one in some one thing saith righter than anoher.  
Now if the different opinions of the Fathers in some points, hindered not their union in substance of the faith, and their being members all of the same Church: why should the like or lesser differences now among the Protestants, hinder their union in substance of the same faith, and their being members all of the same Church, both among themselves and with the Fathers? yea but Wickliff and Husse with others mentioned in our Catalogue, they erred in point of faith; it is true, but yet their error was not joined with pertinacy; they erred not incorrigibly, bu● for want of better information; they erred in that doctrine of faith, wherein the truth was not fully scanned, declared, and confirmed by a Plenary Council, as S. Austin speaketh 
y 〈◊〉 & ipse sine dubi●●ederet, si 〈◊〉 illo tempo●e ques●io●is ●ujus veritas eliquata & de●larata per pl●nari●● C●ncilium soli●●●●t●r. Aug lib. 2. de Bap●●smo cont●. Donat. cap 4. ; had it been, we may well think the very same of all those holy men, which Austin most charitably 
z Vniversi orbi● authorit●ti p●●e●acta veritate 〈◊〉. Ibid.  saith of Saint Cyprian; Without doubt they would have yielded to the truth, being manifested unto them, by the authority of the whole Church.  

Object.  
We are at unity, but your Protestants are at odds, 
a M●ste● Brereleys table o● Lutheran books against Calvinis●s; in the end of the ●rot. Apol.  and namely your Lutherans and Calvinists in the point of the Sacrament, the one holding Consubstantiation, and the other opposing it.   

Answer.  
The Protestants, especially we of the Church of England are at unity, as appears by the Harmony of our confessions, as also by our joint subscriptions to the Articles of Religion established.  
And for the point mentioned, the difference is nothing so great, as you would have it thought: for (as the mo●t learned and judicious Zanchius 
b De D●ssidio in Coenâ Domini H●●●. Z●nchij judicium. H●●●. Knollo● nobili Anglo. Hier. Zanchy's 〈◊〉 plu●. dicit extat hoc Iudici●m in tom. s●ptimo, in sine mi●cel●ancor.  observeth, and our 
c Doctor Fiel● of the Church. Lib 5. Appendix part. 1 pag 114.  Doctor Field out of him.) In all necessary points, both the parties agree and descent in one unnecessary, which by right understanding one another, might easily be compounded.  
Both sides 
d Extra C●●●am, panis non dissert ab aliis communibus ●ibis— pa●●m esse verè & 〈…〉 corpus C●risti utraque pars m●rito n●g●●it— u● per illa Symb●a ●●n ta●t●m signifi●●tur sed etiam verè ex●●●catur Corpus & sarguis Christi, hoc est, Christus ipse. Zanc●. Ibid  saith Zanchius, do agree, that the elements of bread and wine are not abolished in their substance, but only changed in their use; which is, not only to signify, but also to exhibit and communicate unto us, the very body and blood of Christ, with all the gracious working and fruits thereof.  
Both parties agree, that the very body and blood of Christ are truly present in the Sacrament, and by the faithful truly and really received.  
Thus far all parties agree, that is, in the whole necessary and sufficient substance of the doctrine of this Sacrament: for the other matter wherein they differ, 
e Sed de modo praesentiae inter hos & illos non convenit. Ibid.  de modo, of the manner how Christ is present in the Sacrament, seeing it is not expressed in the Scriptures, in the judgement of Zanchius, 
f Neque enim in scriptis ulla aperta mentio est de union Corporis Christi cum Symbolis, vel de praesentia corporis Christi in Coena; quamobrem potuisset. haec questio s●●e ullo ecclesiae detrimento omitti. Ibid.  it might well be omitted; and they themselves confess, when they have gone as far as they can to determine it, still it is ineffable, and not possible to be fully understood. It is enough for us (saith the same 
g Quare Ecclesiam Christi, et fideles non solum panem; sed etiam ipsum verum Christi corpus in Coena recipere ac manducare: id quod certi satis, meo judicio, esse debuerat in Ecclesia Christi. Ibid.  Zanchius) to believe the body and blood are there, though how and in what manner we cannot define.  
So then in this main controversy between them about Consubstantiation, which as Zanchius saith, 
h Secum traxit illam aliam de ubiquitate quaestionem. Ibid.  did afterwards occasion that other of ubiquity; in both these controversies, the main truth on both sides is out of controversy; that Christ is really & truly exhibited to each faithful Communicant, and that in his whole person he is every where: the doubt is only in the manner, how he is in the Symbols, and how in heaven and earth.  
Now for other odds amongst us, they be but in Ceremonies, or at worst, in points of no absolute consequence; whereas the differences amongst Papists concern the life of Religion.  
They differ concerning the Supreme authority of the Church, whether it be in the Pope, or in the General Council. The Counsels of Constance and Basil determined, 
i Constant. Concil. sess. 4 Basil. sess. 33. Comment. Aen. Sylvij de gestis Basil. Conc. lib. 1.  that a General Council was above the Pope; the Council of Florence decreed the Pope to be above a General Council.  
They differ concerning the manner of the conception of the Virgin Mary. The Dominican Friars following the Thomists, hold that she was conceived in Original sin; the Franciscans hold the contrary.  
The modern Popes disagree with the ancient, concerning the dignity of universal Bishop, adoration of Images, Transubstantiation, Communion in both kinds, and the Merit of good works, as is already shown in the fifth and seaventh Centurie of this treatise.  
So clear is it, that some doctrines of the later Roman Church were opposed by the ancient Roman Bishops themselves, to wit, adoration of Images 
k Adorare verò Imagines, om●ibus modis d●vita. Greg. lib. 9 ep. 9 , as also the dignity and title of universal Bishop 
l Idem lib. 6. ep. 30. Quisquis se universalem sucerd● tem uncat in clat●one 〈…〉 praecur●it. Idem. lib 2. ●p 61. Sacerdotes mens tuae manui comm●si— Et Imperatori ●●●d●entiam ●●abu● , by Gregory the Great: communion in one kind 
m Sanguinem autem redemptio●is nostrae hourne 〈…〉 nant. Leo Ser. 4 〈◊〉.  ● as also the merit of good works, 
n Nequ● enim de qualitate nos●re●um 〈…〉 d●norum. Id. Se●m. 1. de Assumpt.  by Leo the first: 
o Et t●men esse non desinit substantia vel natura panis 〈◊〉 vin●. Gela●. cont. Nestor. & Entich.  Transubstantiation by Gelasius the first.  
Besides, the jesuits and Dominicans differ at this day concerning the weighty point of freewill and Grace.  
The truth is, the Popish Faith varieth not only with their persons, but according to time and place; so that they can exchange their tenets upon occasion, advance or cry down their opinions at their pleasure, as may best serve for their advantage. For, (as Azorius the jesuit saith 
p Frequenter accidit ut quae 〈◊〉 pa●cis ab hinc 〈…〉 non crat, modo 〈…〉 recipi●tu●. In 〈…〉 non●ulla scriptores tradid●tun● Cru●em non esse 〈◊〉 daen honore & ●eneratione Lat●●ae, s●d●●o Inferio 〈…〉: at in Hisp●nia c●mani cons●r sione d●cetur Cruc● cultum & ●●norem L●●●●ae deferendum. Azor Mo●●l. justit tom. 1 lib 2. ●p 13 ) It falls out often, that that which was not the common opinion a few years since, now is. And, that which is the common opinion of Divines in one Country, is not so in another; As in Spain and Italy, it is the common opinion, that Latreia, or divine worship is due to the Cross, which in France and Germa●y is not so, but some inferior kind of worship due thereunto. And Navarrus the Casuist says, 
q 〈…〉, ut contraria asseratur in e●; scilicet Papam esse Concilio superiorem. Mart. 〈…〉 cap. Novit. de Iudi●ijs.  That at Rome, no man may say, that the Council is above the Pope, nor at Paris, that the Pope is above the Council.  
In a word, the Papists are at great odds, but they cunningly conceal them; insomuch as it is observed, that some of them would say to their friends in private; 
r Sic dicerem in Scholis; sed tamen (mane●● in●er nos) div●rsu● sentio. 〈◊〉. ad Abbat. Visperg. pag. 448. edit. Basil. 1569.  Thus, or thus I would say in the schools, and openly; Said (maneat in●er nos) diversum sentio; but keep my counsel, I think the contrary.    

PA.  
We may (haply) be at odds in some Scholastic points; but not in matters defined by the Pope and a General Council.   

PRO.  
You would have us believe, that at the sound of the Pope's sentence, like frogs in a marish, at the falling in of a great log or stone, you are all hushed and silenced: but it is not so, for since the Trent decrees were published, diverse of your side are divided about the sense thereof; insomuch as they differ in the main points thereof, which in your account are fundamental, and the deniers thereof reputed Heretics. This may appear by these instances.  
The Pope in the Counsels of Trent and Florence decreed the Apocrypha to be Canonical Scripture; yet since that decree, 
s Driedo de Scriptur. et Dogmat. Eccles lib. 1. cap. ult.  Driedo, and 
t Sixt. Senens. Biblioth. ●anctae lib. 1.  Sixtus Senensis have called them in question, and rejected them. The Pope in the last Lateran Councel● is decreed 
u Sess● 11.  to be above a Council; and yet since that time, 
uu Convincitur inde aliquid magis esse authoritatis penes totum Concilium recte (ut decet) congregatum, quam penes solum Ponti●icem. Alph. à Castro. advers. haer. lib. 1. cap. 2.  Alphonsus à Castro hath writ the contrary. The Trent Council teacheth (Sess. 6.) justification by Inherent righteousness, condemning those that believe the imputation of Christ's Righteousness; and yet Albertus Pighius 
x Pighius controvers secunda de Iustis●●t. hominis.  defendeth imputed righteousness, & so doth Cardinal Contaren, in his treatise of justification.  
Again, the Pope decreed against the certainty of grace & salvation, defining (Sess. 6.) that no man should believe these things of himself; & yet 
y Dic●mus, 〈◊〉 acroborari, & clariorem in nobis a●●idue ●ie●i ad●ptae Grati● Certitudin●m. Catharin. Disceptat. 〈◊〉 de certitudine Gratiae.  Catharinus defended the contrary, holding that a man might have the certainty of Faith touching these things● and when the Trent Counsels authority was objected against him, he eluded it by diverse sleight distinctions. The truth is, the Papists have a kind of unity, to wit, a superstitious and hypocritical crouching to the pope's chairs for so long as they agree to go to mass, swear to the pope's supremacy, other things are tolerated although they consent like harp & harrow.  
And surely were it not for the great profit, and riches, which knit the parts of this body together like twins that have different heads, but tied together by the belly, we should see this great body of the papacy, would soon be divided, scattered, and dispersed.  
Howsoever, for any differences amongst the Protestants, we may thankfully acknowledge, that it was the wonderful Providence of God, that so many several Countries, Kingdoms and States, abandoning the abuses of the Church, or rather Court of Rome, and making particular reformation in their own dominions, without general meetings and consents, should have no more, nor greater differences than are found amongst them.  

Object.  
It is usual with you in your Catalogue to say, such and such, as namely S. Bernard, or the like, taught (for substance) as you do, agreeing only with you in some fundamental points; but this will not serve to make them members of your Church; for by the like reason the Quartadecimanes, Novatians, Donatists, and Pelagians might pretend to the Catholic Church, in as much as they agreed therewith in some fundamental truths.   

Answer.  
1 Agreement in one or more fundamentals, maketh not a man a Catholic Christian, though disagreement in any one fundamental joined with obstinacy makes a man an Heretic.  
2 To make a man actually a member of the true Church, more is required than agreement in the profession of the same fundamental points of faith: for not only heresy, but schism also excludeth a man from Communion with the true Catholic Church.  
3 Fundamental points as well concern life and manners, as faith; and he that impugneth the doctrine of the Decalogue, is as well an Heretic, as he that impugneth the doctrine of the Creed. Nicholas directly impugned the one, and by evident consequence the other, by maintaining his impure communion, or rather community of wives.  
4 The Quarta decimanes, who kept Easter on the fourteenth day precisely were of two sorts.  

Some, as Polycrates and other Bishops of Asia, kept it so, merely in imitation of S. john the Evangelist; and those were never condemned for Heretics.  
Others kept the fourteenth day by virtue of the Mosaical Law; and these by consequent destroyed the foundation; as those did among the Galathians, who urged Circumcision, to whom S. Paul there professeth, That Christ should not profit them, and that they were fallen from grace.   
5 Novatians erred in a fundamental point concerning Repentance, and by consequent overthrew that Article of the Creed, Credo remissionem peccatorum.  
6 The Donatists were rather Schismatics than Heretics, and rather made a rent in the Church, than were excluded from it. Saint Austin in his seventh tome, every where calleth it Schisma Donati: in the end they grew to be heretics, and denied in effect that fundamental Article, Credo Ecclesiam Catholicam.  
7 The Pelagians erred in diverse fundamental points, concerning original sinn●, and the necessity of Grace.  
For farther answer we say, that the Authors we produce against the Romanists are of two sorts.  

1 Some we allege only as Testes veritatis, in such or such a point, or points of faith.  
2 Others we produce as members of our reformed Church, and forerunners of Luther.   
Of the first sort is Bernard, very orthodox in all points against the Pelagians, but otherwise tainted, and an open enemy to the Albigenses.  
Of the second sort are the Waldenses, Wicklifists, and Hussites who (as appears by their confessions of faith extant in Orthuinus Gratius, and the History of the Waldenses) agree with u● in all Fundamentals, not only in some, as the Heretics above mentioned agreed with the Church.   

Objection.  
What though Saint Hierome, Bernard, and others agree with you in some general truths? men of contrary religions may have diverse materials of doctrine common to both: now this is but a generical agreement, which is no more than the agreement between a man and a beast.   

Answer.  
1 Saint Hierome and Bernard are not well ranked together; Saint Hierome was a through Papist in no point; Bernard was in some, living in a corrupt age, seven hundred years after Saint Hierome.  
2 Besides, we answer, that Waldo, Wickliff and Husse, with others, agree with us not only Generically, in the common grounds of Christianity, but Specifically in those formal points, which we hold at this day against the Roman Church; and as for such calumnies as are cast upon them, they are already confuted in this treatise, neither will any indifferent person regard them; for when once that infamous name of Heretic was fastened upon a man, nothing was too heavy for such an one, any thing was believed of that man: and from thence it is, without question, that we find so many, so absurd, so senseless opinions imputed to them by the Romists; such as indeed could not in truth with any possibility, fall into the imagination, or fancy of any man, much less be doctrinally, or dogmatically delivered.  
Besides, many of the books and writings of Wickliff and Husse are extant, wherein are found no such doctrines as Papists have charged them with, but rather the contrary.  
So that we hope there is no indifferent person will regard their slanders; for even at this day, when things are in present view and action, they calumniate the persons, and falsify the doctrine of our professors, as grossly as ever Pagans traduced the Primitive Christians, for instance sake, they give it out, that we hold, that 
z Norint isti suorum axiomata● Deus est author peccati, opera nostra Deu● nequaquam curate, etc. Campian. rat. 8.  God regardeth not our good works; whereas we believe, that 
a Apologia Ecclesiae Anglicanae (in 2. part. ca 2●) testatur, Bona opera necessaria esse Christiano ad salutem. Rainold. apolog. Thess. Pag. 263.  Good works are necessary to salvation; and, 
b Sona opera sunt necessaria ad salutem; non tanquam causa ad eff●ctum, vel meritum ad mercedem; sed tanquam antecedens ad Consequent, vel tanquam medium ●i●e quo non ad ●inem. Zach. Vrsinus Catechetic. part 3. de gratitudine.  Works are said to be necessary for us unto salvation, to wit, not as a cause of our salvation, but as a mean or way, without which we come not unto it; as a Consequent following justification, wherewith Regeneration is unseparably joined.  
In like sort, they gave out, that Beza recanted his Religion before his death; whereas he lived to confute this shameless lie, and with his own hand wrote a tract which he called Beza Redivivus, Beza Revived.  
Thus also of late have they, dealt with that Reverend zealous and learned Prelate, Doctor King, late Bishop of London, giving it out in their idle 
c The Protestants plea. The Bishop of London's Legacy.  Pamphlets, that he was reconciled to the Church of Rome, which is unanswerably 
d Doctor Henry King's Sermon at Paul's Cross 25. Novemb. 1621.  proved to be a gross lie: for towards his death he received the holy Sacrament at the hands of his Chaplain, Doctor Cluet, archdeacon of Middlesex: he received it together with his wife, children, and family, whom he had invited to accompany him to that Feast: whereof he protested in the 
e Si● Henry Martin his Chancellor, Master Mathias Chaldicot● Master Philip King his brother. Doctor Henry King, Doctor john King, his son●es etc.  presence and hearing of diverse personages of good note, that his soul had greatly longed to eat that last Supper, and to perform that last Christian duty before he left them: and having received the Sacrament, he gave thanks to God in all their hearing, that he had lived to finish that blessed work, for so himself did call it. And then drawing nearer to his end, ●e expressly caused his Chaplain, than his Ghostly Father, to read the Confession and absolution, according to the ordinary form of Common prayer appointed in our Liturgy. Did this worthy Prelate now dye a Papist, who to his last breath, communicated with the Church of E●gland?  
Besides, whereas Preston the Priest was given out to be the man that reconciled the Bishop to the See of Rome; Preston (as appeareth by his Examination and Answer taken before diverse honourable Commissioners 
f The Examination of Thomas Preston, t●k●n before the Lo●d Archbishop of Canterbury at Lambeth, Decemb. 20. 1621. ) protested before God, and upon his conscience, as he should answer at the dreadful day of judgement, that the said Bishop of London did never confess himself unto him, nor ever received Sacramental absolution at his hands, nor was ever by him reconciled to the Church of Rome, neither did renounce before him the Religion professed and established in the Church of England.  
Yea, he added farther, that as he hoped to be saved by Christ jesus, he to his knowledge, was never in company where the said Doctor King, late Lord Bishop of London was, neither did he ever receive letter from him, nor did write letter unto him, neither did he ever (to his knowledge) see the said Bishop in any place whatsoever, nor could have known him from another man.   

Object.  
You have singled out some testimonies of Fathers, Schoolmen, and others; and alleged them on your own behalf, as if they had thereby been of your Religion: whereas they be our witnesses, and speak more fully for us, than for your side.   

Answer.  
According to the Rule in law; Testem que● quis inducit pro se, te●etur recipere contra se; you have produced them for your own ends, and now in reason you cannot disallow them, when they are alleged by us; so that you must give us leave to examine your men upon cross Interrogatories.  
Besides, one may be a material witness, who speaks home to two or three Interrogatories, although he cannot depose to all the rest.  
It is no part of our meaning to take the scantling of our ancestors Religion from some single testimonies, wherein they either agree with, or descent from us; but f●om the main body of the substantial points of doctrine which are controverted betwixt us at this day. Neither make we any such simple collection, Such a man held such a point with us, therefore he was a Protestant: no more than we allow them to frame the like: Such a man, in such or such a particular, agreed with the n●w Church of Rome, therefore he was a Papist. For, it followeth no more than this; an Aethiopian or Tauny-moore is white in part, namely in his teeth, therefore he is white all over. But our care hath been, (that since In the mouth of two or three witnesses every word is established, Deut. 19.15. and tha● as 
g Vnique testi, ne● Catoni creditum est. Hieron. Apolog. advers. Ruffian. lib. 2. pag. 223. ●om. 2.  Hie●ome saith, One single witness, were it Cato himself, is not so much to be credited) to join together the several testimonies o● such worthies as lived in the same age; presuming, that what some of note delivered, and the same not opposed by their contemporaries, that, that is to be supposed to have been the doctrine commonly received in those countries, and at that time.  
Upon these and the like considerations, the Reader may be pleased to rest satisfied with such passages as have been produced on our behalf, though not so thronged and full in every age; inasmuch as diverse of our Ancestors have not left unto us sufficient evidence, whereby it might appear what they held in diverse particulars. Besides that, there be diverse testimonies suppressed, so as we can hardly come by them; as namely in Faber Stapulensis his Preface to the Evangelists, there is a notable place touching the Scriptures Suficiencie; the words are these: The Scripture sufficeth, and is the only Rule of eternal life; whatsoever agreeth not to it, is not so necessary as superfluous. The Primitive Church knew no other Rule but the Gospel, no other Scope but Christ, no other Worship than was due to the Individual Trinity. I would to God the form of believing were fetched from the Primitive Church. Thus saith Stapul●nsis.  
Now this whole passage is appointed by the Expurgatory Index of Spain, to be l●f● ou● in their later editions; and yet by good hap, I met with this passage 
h Verbum dei suffi●it, hoc unicum satis est ad vitam quae terminum nescit inveniendam: ●aec u●ica regula vitae aeternae, magistra est, u●inam credendi form● a Primitive peteretur E●clesi●, quae nullam regulam prae●e● Evangelium novit. jac. F●ber. Stapulens in prae●●t. in quatuor ●vangelia, edit. Basileae. Ann. 1●23.  in an edition a● Bas●l● as also in another at Colen An. 1541.  
In like sort I ●●nd alleged out of Lu●ovicus Vives, his Commentaries upon Saint Augustine d● Civitate Dei, these passages following touching the Canon of the Scripture, and the practised Adoration of Images in his time; namely the same Vives saith, that The story of Susanna, of Bel, and the Dragon are not Canonical Scripture; he saith also, that Saints are esteemed and worshipped by many, as were the Gods among the Gentiles.  
These places I carefully sought for, in the several editions of S. Austin, at A●twerpe, Anno 1576. at Paris, Anno 1586. at Coleine, Ann. 1616. but no such place was there to be found, the Divines of Louvain had taken a course with them, and suppressed these testimonies; but by good hap I met with them in the Basil Edition, 
i 
Q●●dea Beli H●●toria & tot●m 14. caput ●um histo●ia Su●●nnae Apochrypha si●t, ne● in Hebraeo hab●●●t it, nec sunt versa a 70. s●nib●●. Lud. Vives Comment. in lib 18. cap. 31. August de Civit. Dei.  
Multi Christiani in re bon● plerumque peccant qu●d Divos Divasque non a●●ter venerantur quam Deum. Nec video in multis quod sit discrimen inter eorum opinionem de Sanctis, & id quod Gentiles puta●ant de suis Dijs. Ludou. Vives Commentar. in 8. lib Aug. de Civit. Dei. ca 27. tom. 5. edit. Basil. anno 1569.   Anno 1569.   

Object.  
Those whom you have named in your Catalogue, were 
k Bellar. lib 4. de Eccl. cap 5. §. P●ae●ereà. And Brereley● Prot. Apol. tract 2. cap. 2. sect. 12.  originally Catholics, and not Protestant's; Wickli●fe and Husse were Catholic Priests, and Luther was an Augustine Friar: you cannot name such as were Protestants originally, they came forth of our Church.   

Answer.  
Whence I pray you sprang Christ's Apostles? were they not taken out of the jewish Church at that time much corrupted? S. Paul speaking of himself, and the service of his God, 
l 2 Timoth. 1.3. Cui servio a progenitoribus meis● id est, Abraham, Isaac & jacob, qui ●uerant veri culiores Dei● & similiter Ga●ali●● qui nut●ivit Paulu●, & in lege do●uit. Ly●an. in loc.  saith, Whom I do serve from my progenitors, meaning Abraham, Isaac and jacob, the first Fathers of the faithful; for as for S. Paul's immediate predecessors, it is likely that they relished of the leven of the Pharisees.  
It can be no more prejudice to our Church, that Luther, Wickliff a●d hus were originally Papists, than to S. Paul that he was originally a Pharisee, or to S. Austin that he was orinally a Manichee, or to our Ancestors at the first conversion of our land that they were originally heathen, or to all true Converts that they were originally unregenerate. For as Tertullian saith, 
m De ve●●ris suimus, s●unt ●on nascuntur Christiani. Terullian Apologet. advers. Gent. cap. 18.  Fiunt non nascuntur Christiani; We are not borne Christians, but we become Christians.  
Neither is it true that we can name none of our Church that were not originally Papists. For Farellus and the Waldensian Ministers for more than 400. years were not originally Papists (though Waldo himself was.)  
Besides, the Fathers for 600 years, and the Monks in Britain at Augustine's coming were not originally Papists.  
In the Greek Church from 700. to 700 afterwards, many thousands held as we do in all fundamentals, who never were originally Papists, nor millions of others in the Eastern Churches, and namely in the Greek Church, there have been from 700. to 700. afterwards, many thousands which held as we do in all fundamentals, and never were originally Papists.  
Lastly, the like argument might be urged against all that embraced Reformation in josias days, that they originally were involved in the common errors and Idolatry of the jewish Church. Likewise that Zachary and Elizabeth, and Simeon, and Anna, and the Apostles were originally deduced from that Church, which held many errors concerning the temporal kingdom of the Messias, and divorces for other causes than adultery, etc. Which errors Christ and his Apostles reproved.  
In England, and most parts of the world, the first Christians were originally Paynims and Idolaters: what prejudice is that to Christianity, or advantage to Heathenism?   

Object.  
Your Church's professors mentioned in your Catalogue wanted lawful succession.   

Answer.  
There is a twofold succession; the one lineal and local, the other doctrinal; this of doctrine is the life and soul of the other. 
n Eyes obaudire opportet qui ●um Episcopatus successione Charisma verita●is certum a●ceperunt; Reliquos qui absistunt à principali successione suspectos habere. Iren. advers. Haer. lib. 4. cap. 43.  Irenaeus describeth those which have true succession from the Apostles; To be such as with the succession of the Episcopal office, have received the c●rt●ine grace of truth: and this kind of succession he calls the principal succession. Gregory Nazianzen having said, that At●anasius succeeded Saint Mark in godliness, 
o Greg Nazianzen. in l●●d 〈◊〉.  addeth, That this succession in godliness is properly to be accounted succ●ssion: for he that holdeth the same doctrine is also partaker of the same throne, but he that is against the doctrine, must be reputed an adversary, even while h●e sitteth in the thro●e, but the former hath the thing itself, and the truth: so that according to Irenaeus and Nazianz●n, succession in doctrine sufficeth: yea Nazianzen (as we have heard) makes it all one 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉; so that he which holds the same truth of doctrine may be said to sit in the same Chair of succession.  
Besides, we are able to show succession also in place for ●ive hundred years in most parts of Christendom; and since that in the Greek Church until this day, and in the Latin Church from the time of Waldo, in France, Bohemia, and other places.  
And for the Church of England, the lineal succession of her Bishops is shown particularly by Mr. Francis Mason, de ministerio Anglicano; Mr. Goodwin in his Catalogue of the Bishops of England, and Mr. Isaacson in his Chronological Table of the succession of the Bishops of England.    

PA.  
Name in the space of a thousand years' next before Luther, three known and confessed Protestant Bishops, succeeding each to other, and if you had such, express their agreement with you, in the main points controverted between us.   

PRO.  
This demand was eagerly pressed upon me, by a Romish Priest, but the Stone which he hurled at me, not coming forth of David's sling, recoils upon himself, like the stone that Achilles flung at a dead skull, which rebounded back and struck out the slingers eye● 
— Redijt lapis ultor ab osse,  
Actorisque suifrontem, ocul●squè petit.   
For I would in like manner demand of him to name three known and confessed Popish Bishops succeeding each other, who maintained the worship of Images before the second Council of Nice; or that believed Transubstantiation before the Roman Council under Pope Nicholas● or that avowed the dry and half Communion before the Council at Constance under Martin the fifth; or that held the effect of the Sacraments to depend upon the Priest's intention before the Council at Florence; or defined the Pope to be above a General Council before the Council of Lateran under Leo the tenth; or that determined the twelve new Articles of Pius the fourth his Creed to be all de Fide, and necessary to salvation, before the Council of Trent.  
Besides, there is no necessity of naming three Bishops succeeding each other, and opposing Popery: It sufficeth to name such as opposed it, though they sat not successively in the same Chair; for all Romish errors and superstitions rushed not in at once into the Church, but by degrees; now such as held the fundamentals with us, and opposed any one error or more when they were first espied to creep into the Church, they were Protestants, though they went not then under that name.  
Now according to this account of Protestants, we can produce many more than three Bishops succeeding each other, who in their times made head against Romish usurpations and superstitions; for instance sake, S. Austin, and with him two hundred and seventeen Bishops of Africa, and their successors for a hundred years together (if their own 
p 
Boni●acij 2. Epis●. ad Eu●al. Al●xandr. extat in Li●d●●i pan●pliâ Ev●ng lib. 4 cap. 89. in ●i●e.  
Hardiness Answer to Bishop jewels Challenge Artic. 4. Divis. 2●.   Records be true) opposed the Pope's supremacy in point of Appeals.  
To speak nothing of the innumerable Bishops in the Eastern Churches, and the Habassines and Muscovites, and elsewhere succeeding each the other for many hundred years, differing in no fundamental point from Protestants, and keeping no quarter at all with the Pope or See of Rome; when Austin the Monk was sent into England by Gregory the Great, the most ancient British and Irish Bishops withstood the Pope's authority and ordinances, stiffly adhering to the Churches of Asia in their celebration of Easter; and though they were cut off from the Pope's Communion, yet they slighted it, and persisted in their former opinions and customs, as I have already shown in the sixth Centurie.  
In the later ages, 
q The History of the ●●ld●nses book. 1. Cham 9  Rainerius the Popish Inquisitor, makes mention of two famous Bishops of the Waldenses, one Balazinanza of Verona, and one john de Lugio, about the year 1250. And I have shown in the twelfth age, out of Matthew Paris, 
r Ipse [●ath●l●m●us] ●reat Epi●●opos, & Ecclesias pers●●e ordina●e ●ont●ndi●. Math. Par●● Hi●●or. ad ann. 1223  about the year of Grace 1223, that amongst the Albigenses, there was one Bartholomew who ordered and governed the Churches in Bulgaria, Croatia, Dalmatia, Hungaria, and appointed Ministers, insomuch as the Bishop of Portuense, the Pope's Legate in those parts, complained thereof. And in the fifteenth age, I have shown out of Cochleus, in his History of the Hussites 
s Cochleus Histor Hussit. lib. 5. , known and confessed Protestants, how Con●adus Archbishop of Prague became an Hussite, and held a Council at Prague in the year 1421 and there compiled a Confession of their Faith agreeable to the doctrine of the Reformed Churches. Now those who succeeded the forenamed Bishops among the Waldenses and Albigenses, as also the Hussites, although they carried not the titles of Bishops, yet they exercised Episcopal authority in ordaining Priests, the Catalogue of whom is extant in the history of the Waldenses and Albigenses. And thus they have in 
t Master ●ed●l● letters to Wadsworth. chap. 11.  Germany, those whom they call Superintendents, and general Superintendents; and where these are not, as in the French Churches, yet There are, saith Zanchius, usually certain chief men that do in a manner bear all the sway, as if order itself, and necessity led them to this course. And what are these but Bishops in effect, unless we shall wrangle about names, which for reason of State, those Churches were to abstain from.   

PA.  
Since you impute so many errors to the Church of Rome, which you pretend to have reform, tell us when those corruptions came in, for doubtless some histories would note them, some learned men oppose them: for in every great and notorious change, there may be observed the Author, time and place, with the like Circumstances, as Bellarmine 
u In omni insigni mutatione demonstra●● possunt author ejus, tempus quo coepit, locus ubi. Bellarm. lib. 4. de not. cap. 5. §. In omni.  saith.   

PRO.  
By the like reason it would follow, that a Tenant who had long dwelled (he and his Ancestors) in a decayed house, should not be bound to repair it, unless his Landlord could tell him in what year or month every rafter or wall began to decay; a sick patient should not purge out an ill humour, unless he or his Physician could name the time, when his first mis-diet had bred this humour; so Naaman because he was once clean, and could not tell the very time, means, and degrees of the coming of his Leprosy, might be proved to be clean still, and need neither the Prophet nor the washing, 2 King. 5.  
Errors and abuses are not all of one sort; there were some heresies, such as the Arrian and Nestorian, which struck at the very head, the one at the divinity of Christ, the other at the divinity of the Holy Ghost, and these being notorious, were soon discerned, and opposed, and herein Bellarmine's reason many take place: but Popery, like that mystery of iniquity, 2 Thes. 2.7. works closely, it creeps and spreads abroad like a Cancer, or Gangrene, 2. Tim. 2.17. it is like the Cockatrice's Egg, a long time in the shell, before the Cockatrice itself appear.  
Now these kind of corruptions creep into the Church secretly and insensibly, and are best known by their differences from their first pure doctrine; so that if we can show the present doctrines of Rome (refused by us) disagree from the Primitive, it is enough to show there hath been a change, though we cannot point out the time, when every point began to be changed.  
Tertullian saith, 
uu Ipsa enim doctrina ●orum cum Apostolicà comparate. ex divers●tate & cont●ari●ta●e suà pronunciate, n●que Apostoli alic●jus Auctoris esse, neque 〈◊〉. ●ertul. pr●escrip. ●dve●●. Hae●●t. cap 32.  The very doctrine itself being compared with the apostolic, by the diversity & contrariety thereof, will pronounce that it ●ad ●or Author, neither any Apostle, nor any Apostolical man. 
x M●th 19 8.  If from the beginning it was not so, and now it is so, there is a change. 
y 1 Cor. 11 28.  All drank of that Cup, now all must not: 
z 1 Co●. 14.  all than prayed in known tongues with understanding, and all public service done to edification, now the custom is altered, though we know not when this change began.  
Besides, they that call upon us to show the time, place, and persons, of such and such changes in Religion, cannot themselves perform the like.  
Gregory de Valentia, a learned jesuit, confesseth, that the use of receiving the Sacrament in one kind, began first in some Churches, and grew to be a general custom in the Latin Church, not much before the Council of Constance, in which, at last (to wit, about two hundred years agone) this custom was made a law. But if they put the question to him, as they do to us, and ask him, When did that custom first get footing in some Churches? he returns this for Answer, 
a Valent. de Legit. usu Euchar. cap. 10.  Minimè constat, it is more than he can tell.  
Doctor Fisher 
b ●●ssens. Assert. Luther●n consul Artic. 18.  bishop of Rochester, and Cardinal Cajetan, 
c Cajetan. opusc. tom 1. tract 15. the bedung cap. 1.  grant, that of Indulgences no certainty can be had, what their Original was, or by whom they were first brought in  
Doctor Fisher addeth, 
d Apud Prisco● null●, vel quam ●arissima f●●bat 〈◊〉; sed & grae●is ad hunc usque diem non est cred●tum purgatorium esse. Ross●n Ibid.  that Of Purgatory, in the ancient Fathers there is no mention at all, or very rare, that th● Latins did not all at once, but by little and little receive it; that t●e Grecians believe it not to this day: and that Purgatory being so long unknown, it is not to be marveiled that in the first times of the Church there was no use of Indulgences; for they had their beginning after that men had a while been scared with the torments of Purgatory, which as the same R●ffensis saith, 
e Quamdiu nulla ●uera● de Purgatorio cura, nemo quaesivit indulgential; nam ●x illo pond●t omnis Indulg●ntiarum existimatio: quum itaque purgatoriu● 〈…〉 cognitum ac re●●ptum Ecclesiae ●uerit universae. Ibid.  was but Sero cognitum, lately known and discovered.  
The Original of their private Masses (wherein the Priest receiveth the Sacrament alone, and none of the people communicate with him, but are all lookers on) Doctor Harding 
f Hardings answer to the first Article of Bishop jewels Challenge. of private Masses. Divis. 7.  fetcheth from no other ground, than Lack of devotion on the people's part; now let them tell us in what Popes days the people fell from their devotion, and then we may haply tell them when their private Masses began.  
Bellarmine saith, 
g Sancti coeperunt coli in Ecclesiâ universali, non t●m Lege aliqu●, quam consuetudine. Bellarm. de SS. Beat. lib. 1. cap. 8. §● ult.  that The worship and Invocation of Saints was brought into the Church rather by custom than any precept.  
Concerning prayer in an unknown tongue; It is to be wondered how the Church altered in this point, (
h Mirum in h●c re, quam Ecclesiae mutata fit consuetudo. Erasm. in 1. Cor. 14.  saith Erasmus) but the precise time he cannot tell. So little reason have they to think that all such changes must be made by any one certain author, it being confessed, that some of them may come in pedetentim (as B. Fisher saith of purgatory) by little and little, not so very easy to be discerned; some may come in by the silent consent of many, & grow after into a general custom, the beginning whereof is past man's memory (as the abstaining from the cup) & some may arise of the undiscreet devotion of the multitude (as those of Purgatory and Indulgences) and some from the want of devotion in the people, (as ●he private Masses) and some also must be attributed to the very change of time itself; as public prayers in an unknown tongue, in Italy, France and Spain, for there a long time the Latin was commonly understood of all: but when afterwards, 
i Seu paucorum decide, ne laborem susciperent immutandi & corrigendi Liturgiam, posteaquam p●r barbaras gentes, Latinus sermo paulatim corruptus exolevit, & a●ire coepit in varias vulgares Linguas, etc. Rainold. Thes. 5. pag. 164.  by the invasion of those barbarous nations, the Goths and Vandals, their speeches degenerated into those vulgar tongues that are now used there, than the language, not of the Service but of the people, was altered; so that upon the fall of the Empire, learning began to decay, and the public Service no longer to be understood, by reason of the change of the vulgar tongues.  
Lastly, we are able to show, (as appears by the eighth Centurie of this treatise) when, and by whom corruption of doctrine hath been brought in; and how opposition hath been made from time to time in case of the adversaries violent intrusion; for instance sake, for the space of six hundred years and more, next after Christ, the Catholic doctrine of the Church of Rome was this, that Images were not to be adored; and this is witnessed by Gregory the Great, who allowed 
k G●●gor. lib. 7. epist. 109. ad Seren.  no use of Images but only Historical; for so he saith, They are not set up to be worshipped, but only to instruct the people that be ignorant: yea he speaks positively, 
l Imagines ador●re ●mnibus modis de v●ta 〈◊〉 lib. 9 ●p. 9  that The worshipping of Images is by all means to be avoided. Now this doctrine maintained by Gregory the first, was changed by Gregory the second and third, Adrian the first and second; so that here we have taken them 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 with the manner, to wit, with doctrine novel, and differing from their Ancestors, and therefore need no farther examination. But that the Reader may trace them along; we find that this Innovation was resisted by three hundred thirty eight Bishops at Constantinople, in the year 754, and though afterwards it got strength at Nice, was defended by Rome, and at last got to be a part of the Roman Faith; yet was the same disliked, denied, opposed, and resisted by all the good men that lived in that and aftertimes, as Charles the Great, the council of Frankford, Lewis his son, the Synod of Paris, Alcuinus, and the Church of England.   

PA.  
Will you charge our Religion with novelty? can that be called new which is of so long continuance?   

PRO.  
Divers points of your Religion are confessed novelties; your own men yield, that for Above a thousand years after Christ, 
m Bellar. de Rom. pon●. lib. 4. c. 2. §. Secunda opinio.  the Pope's judgement was not esteemed infallible, nor his authority 
n Bellar. de Concil. lib. 2 cap. 13.  above that of a General Council; the contrary being decreed in the late Counsels of Constance and Basil: that Not any one ancient Writer 
o Gregor. de Valent. in Thom. tom. 4. Disput. 6. p. 2  reckons precisely seven Sacraments; the first 
p Bellar. de S●cr●m. lib. 2. cap. 25: Cassand. Consult. de num Sacram.  Author that mentioneth that number being Peter Lombard, and the first Council that of Florence: that in former ages for thirteen hundred years, 
q Cassand Artic. 22 de utráque specie Sacram. Lindan Panopl. lib. 4. c. 25  The holy Cup was administered to the Laity: that 
r Nic. de Lyra in 1. ad. Corinth. cap. 14. & Cassand in Liturgic. cap 28.  divine service was celebrated for many ages, in a known and vulgar language, understood by the people: that Transubstantiation was neither named, 
s 
Scotus apud Bellarm. lib. 3. de Euchar. cap. 23.  
Et Erasm. in 1 ad Cor. cap. 7. In Synoxi, Transubstantiationem, serod●●●●ivit Ecclesia; diu satis ●rat ●redere, sive sub pa●e consecrato sive quocunque modo adesse verum corpus Chris●i.   nor made an Article of faith before the Council of Lateran, which was above twelve hundred years after Christ: beside, many more confessions of this kind which might be produced.  
Now that a thing may be novel, though of long duration may appear by this; our Saviour when he would declare Pharisaical Traditions to be Novelties, did not respect their long continuance in the corrupt estate of the Church, but saith, Math. 19.8. Ab initio non fuit sic, that they were not from the beginning delivered by God, or practised by the Church: so that if the duration and antiquity of your opinions be but humane, that is, not Apostolical, neither from Apostolical grounds, they may according to Tertullian, 
t Constat p●oinde ●mnem doctrinam quae cum illis ●c●l●sijs Apostolicis, mat●icibus & Originalibus fidei conspire, veritati d●pu●andam, id sinc dubio tenent●m, quod Ecclesiae ab Apostolis, Apostoli à Christo, Christus à Deo sus●epit; reliquam verò de mendacio praejudicandam, quae sapiat contrà v●ri●at●m Eccl●siarum & Apos●olerum, & Christi, & Dei. Tertull. de praescrip. adverses. Haeret. cap. 21.  be esteemed new and novelties; for a point is new in Religion that did not proceed from God and his blessed spirit, either intermin●s, or by deduction from his word that is the Ancient of days, whatsoever pretences of duration and continuance may be supposed.  
It remaineth then, that that is new in Religion which is not most ancient; so that if you cannot derive your Religion further than from some of the Fathers, the tradition whereupon it is builded, is then but humane, and so a new thing, even Novelty itself. And therefore Tertullian telleth us, 
u Id ve●ius qu●d prius, id prius quod et ab ini●io, ab i●●tio quod ab Apostolis Tertul. lib. 4. adv●●. M●●cion. cap. 5.  That is most true, which is most ancient, that most ancient which was from the beginning, that from the beginning which was from the Apostles; as if there were no truth in faith that was not from the beginning. If Christ was always and before all, truth is a thing equally ancient, and from all eternity, saith the same 
uu Si s●mper Ch●●●us ●● prior omni●us, aq●● ve●●tas s●mpiterna & antiqua ●●s. Tertul. de Virgin. V●land. cap. 1.  Father; and therefore whatsoever savor●th against the truth, this (saith he 
x Q●od●uaque adversus veritat●m sapit, hoc erit heresy, etiam vetus ●onsuetu●o. Ibid. ) is Heresy, tho●gh it be of long continuance; for there is no 
y Veritati nem● praescribere potest, non spatium temporum, non patro●inia persona●um. Ibid.  prescription of time, that will hold plea against the Ancient of days, and his truth.  
I know that Pamelius in his notes upon Tertullian would ward off these testimonies by saying 
z Vide●ur issued pertinere ad initium su●erroris: Nam & num 6. meminit Paracleti à Domino missi, id est, Montani, ●ac. Pamelius in notis in Tertul. de Virginib. Veland. ca 1. , that Tertullian spoke thus, When he began to fall into the fancy of Montanus; but be it so, yet he delivered some truths after he lapsed into Montanisme: beside, Bellarmine for proof of Monastical vows, and veiling of Nuns, 
a Bellar. lib. 2. de Monachis. cap. 27. §. Tertullianu● libro de Velandis Virgin.  allegeth diverse places out of the same treatise of Tertullias, de Virginibus velandis, of veiling of virgins; and then (belike) Tertullian was no Montanist, when Bellarmine for his advantage alleged him.   

PA.  
Our Religion 
b Prot. Apology, tract. 2. cap. 2. sect. 12.  Mr. Brerely is that good seed, which Christ the good husbandman first sowed in his field, Math. 13.24. yours is like the Tares, which the enemy (afterwards) came and sowed among the wheat.   

PRO.  
A great part of your Religion, specially that which is controverted betwixt you and us, and namely your Trent additionals and Traditionals, was not sown by the good husbandmen, Christ and his Apostles; but by the envious man, by the craft of the man of sin, and his complices, the sins of Christian men so requiring; for (as it is already observed) erroneous doctrine, it may be, antiqua, ancient, but it cannot be, prima, that one truth and faith, Ephes. 4.5. Which was once delivered to the Saints, as 
c Saint 〈◊〉 vers. 3.  S. Ind speaks: and therefore is Christ the Husbandman, first presented in the Parable, as Seminans, sowing good seed in his field, before the Enemy is produced Reseminans, resowing the same Acres with unprofitable grain.  
Besides, Religion is one thing, and Reformation another, the one presupposeth the other; our reformation is of a later date, our Religion is the old Religion, coevall with the Primitive and Apostolic, howsoever you tax us with novelty.  
But the Disciple is not above his Master; the jews could say to our Saviour, 
d Mark. 1.27.  What new doctrine is this? and the Grecians to S. Paul, 
e Acts 17.18.  May we not know what this new doctrine, whereof thou speakest is? but we say in our just defence, 
f Nos non sumus Novatores, sed vos estis Veteratores. jos Scaliger. Respons. ad Nic. Sera●ij Min●●vale.  it is not we that affect novelty, but it is you that sergeant the face of Antiquity; as the 
g josh. 9.4.5.  Gibeonites dealt with joshua, deceiving him by the show of old sacks, old bottles, old shoes, old bread that was mouldy, as if they had come a far off, whereas they dwelled but hard by: in like sort you put on a visor of antiquity, but once search the ground thereof, and draw aside this mask, and then your tenets appear to be but novelty in comparison of primitive antiquity: for as Tertullian saith, 
h Ita ex ipso ordine manifestatur, id esse Domini●um & verum, quod sit prius traditum; id outem ext●aneum & falsum quod po●●eriùs immissum. Tertul de p●ae●. advers. Haer. cap. 31.  That is true which is first, and that false which is later.  
In a word, we are no 
i Reformatam modò religion●m dictmus, non formatam de novo. Renovatores modò sumus, non Novatores. L. Eliens. Episc. in Respons. ad Bellar. Apolog. cap. 1 pag. 21.  Innovators, but Reformers; we do not profess any Religion new made, but a religion reform, and refined; so that we may say with the Christian 
k Bapt. Matuan. ad Leon. X. Eclog. 10.  Poet: 

Haec novitas, non est novitas, sed vera vetustas:  
Relligio, et Pietas Patrum instaurata resurgit,  
Quod tua corrupit levitas, et nota tuorum  
Segnities; igitur si quis labentia tecta  
Erigat, et sterilem qui mansuefecerit agrum,  
judice te damnandus erit.   

It is no novel thing we preach,  
But such as ancient Fathers teach.  
The truth which former Popes concealed,  
Doth now begin to be revealed;  
Must he be blamed that repairs  
The ruined Church, and weed's out tares?  
And thus have our Reformers done,  
And they for this must be undone.    
It is true then that the good seed was first fowne by the Apostles, and fructified in the Church generally for 60. years; afterwards the Enemy sup●r-seminavit zizania, he resowed the tares, which in part were weeded out by Waldo, Wickliff and Husse, but more universally and publicly by Luther, Calvine, and others; so that we have not sown any tares upon the Church's glebe land, but only weeded out such as were sown by others in the dead of the night, in the time of ignorance, not whilst the Husbandman himself slept, For he which keepeth Israel neither slumbereth nor sleepeth, but cum dormirent homines, whiles men slept, that is, the overseers of the Vineyard grew careless, and negligent. And thus might tares be sown, though the time and seedsman were not known: for it is confessed by your Trent-fathers, 
l Cum multa, sive temporum vitio, sive hominum in●u●ia & improbitate irrepsisse videantur, quae à tanti s●crisi●ij dignitate aliena sint. Concil. Trid. Ses●. 22 in Decreto de obtervandis & evitandis in ●●●●bratione Missae.  That many things, through the fault of times, or the negligence and wickedness of men, have seemed to have crept in [to the Mass] which are repugnant to the dignity of so great a sacrifice: and yet they cannot t●ll when these abuses crept in, nor by whose default.  
And thus by God's assistance, I have finished the task which I undertook, having named out of good Author's, a Catalogue of such professors as taught (for substance) as the Church of England doth, and withal cleared the Catalogue of our professors from such exceptions as the adversary hath made against them; and in producing this evidence, I have (as he speaks in job 8.8.) enquired of the former ages, and made search of their Fathers, and have dealt as Ioseph's steward did when he made search for his master's Cup, He began at the eldest, and left at the youngest: and the Cup was found in Benjamin's Sack, Gen. 44.12. we have begun with the former ages, passed along the middle, and descended unto Benjamin's, even to the later ages, abutting on Martin Luther's time, and have found even with these younger ages the Cup that we sought for, to wit, A Protestants Church, visible and conspicuous.  
And now having (I hope) satisfied your demand, Where was our Church before Luther; I would require the like of you, namely, to show, if you can, out of good Authors, I will not say, any Empire or Kingdom, but any City, Parish or Hamlet, within five hundred years next after Christ, in which there was any visible assembly of Christians to be named, maintaining and defending either your Trent Creed in general, or these points of Popery in special; to wit, 

1. That there is a treasury of Saints Merits, and super-abundant sati●factions at the Pope's disposing.  
2. That the Laity are not commanded by Christ's Institution, to receive the Sacrament of the Lords Supper in both kinds.  
3. That the public Service of God in the Church, aught, or may be celebrated in an unknown tongue.  
4. That private Masses, wherein the Priest saith, Edite & bibite ex hoc omnes, eat and drink ye all of this; and yet eateth and drinketh himself only, be according to Christ's Institution.  
5. That pope's pardons are requisite, or useful to release souls out of purgatory.  
6. That extreme unction is a Sacrament properly so called.  
7. That we may worship God by an Image.  
8. That the pope cannot err in matters of Faith.    
Show us now, if you can, or any Papist in the world, that these points above named, which are main points with you, inasmuch as you account the deniers thereof Heretics; show us, I say, that they were generally and constantly held for Catholic Church tenets in the first five hundred years next after Christ, which is the very flower of primitive antiquity.  
But of these matters, (since this present conference is enlarged beyond my expectation) at our next meeting, if you please. Mean time and ever, the Lord of his mercy direct us in his own ways, In the old way, which is the god way, as the prophet calls it, jerem. 6.16. and call home such as wilfully, or by ignorance, have gone astray, that at length they may be brought to that 
m john 10.16.  One Shepherd, and that One Sheep fold of Christ jesus: to whom, with his Father and the blessed Spirit, be praise for evermore. Amen.   
FINIS.   

Approbatio Censoris.  
PErlegi hunc Librum, cui titulus (The Protestants Evidence, etc.) Quem, quoniàm doctum judico, et in palaestrâ Theologiae versatis utilissimum, typis mandari permitto.  
THO: WEEKS. D. P. D. Episc. Lond. Cap. Domest.