Truth with Time: OR, CERTAIN REASONS PROVING, That none of the seven last Plagues, or Vials, are yet poured out: neither will the time of their pouring out begin, till after the rising of the Two Witnesses, and the forty two months of the Beast's reign be expired.  
LIKEWISE, An ANSWER to the said REASONS; With a REPLY.  
FURTHER, The Author hath here set down (in a brief Exposition) his opinion of the FIRST VIAL.  
By JOHN CAN, Minister of the Gospel.  
Jer. 51.10. Come, let us declare in Zion the work of the Lord our God.  
Dan. 12.10. But the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand: But the wise shall understand.  
London, Printed by J.C. for Livewe! Chapman, at the Crown in Popes-head-Alley. 1656.   

To all the Mourners in Zion, now waiting by faith and prayer, for the fulfilling of the great promises of the last Times.  
Precious Ones,  
THe Lord saith by his Prophet, 
* Psal. 50.5  Gather ye to me my gracious Saints, that have stricken my covenant with sacrifice. Who are meant here, I shall not say: but this I say, The time draws nigh, in which the sanctified and mighty ones of Jehovah shall be gathered together to him; even the hundred forty and four thousand standing with the Lamb on Mount Zion.  
It is possible, this Work of mine at first sight may seem strange to you, being contrary to what hath been generally received; and withal, may occasion some discouragement, as if the day of the Lords vengeance, and the year of recompenses for the controversy of Zion, were further off then you thought before. For the first, I shall refer you to the Discourse itself: but for the later, that is, taking None of the Vials yet begun, it will be for your encouragement and advantage many ways.  
1. Here you may see, what choice and singular Privileges the Lord hath reserved for YOU the Saints of the last times as, to be particularly THESE, Rev. 14.1, 2, 3, etc. and the called, chosen, and faithful, Chap. 17.14. The Angels to come out of the Temple, with seven golden Vials, full of the wrath of God: 
* Psal. 149.7.8.  To do vengeance on the heathens, reproofs in the nations: To bind their Kings in chains, and their Nobles in fetters of iron: To do on them the judgement written; this comely honour is to all his gracious Saints. Hallelu-jah. It never grieves a child, to know more than he did of the Portion which his father left him. I have in this Treatise acquainted you with something more, than what (probably) you knew before concerning your lot (how eminent it is) being fallen in the last days.  
2. If the Lord will thus honour you the Saints of the last times with high and glorious employment, What manner of persons ought ye to be, in all holy conversation and godliness? How should ye study 
* 2 Tim. 2.21.  to be meet for the Master's use; workmen that need not to be ashamed? Surely 
* Levit. 16.21.  he will send by the hand of fit men. Were a man chosen to any great Office in the Commonwealth, he would take pains to have insight in it, and to have all meet qualifications for the discharge thereof. In former times, as Saints saw that their work then was to suffer for the testimony of Jesus Christ; so they went to God, by instant and earnest prayer, for faith, patience, courage, constancy, etc. that they might not love their lives unto the death. We are come, without doubt, near the time of the end, viz. the period of the Beast's reign, and the Vials to begin. Hence we should mind what our Work is NOW, and for THIS be calling upon God day and night, for spirits suitable to the Work.  
3. I know nothing (if duly weighed) of more weight than this, to heal all present Breaches amongst the faithful of the Land, and to gather them in (as one) with and for the Lamb. Never was there a time more unseasonable than now, for brethren to be at odds, whether about Forms, or the like; but rather (bearing each with other in their Opinions) to join together in Fasting and Prayer, that they may all know the Lord, as to the proper work of the day; and therein (as all alike concerned) stand fast together in the defence thereof. I have observed it a long while, that nothing more draws out the hearts of Christians to peace and oneness, than the understanding of the Times. Men walking in a dark room, are apt to stumble and fall one upon another. It is want of Generation-light, that Ephraim envies Judah, and Judah vexeth Ephraim. Can Saints but see, that the day breaks, and the shadows are flying away; those Forms and other things which men now are earnest for, God is shaking, and making all things new: they would lay their hands upon their mouths, and say, Once have I spoken, yea twice: but I will proceed no further. If a Master should come and find his servants quarrelling about some small matter, and in the mean time nothing done concerning things of more weight and importance; though some might be less in fault than others, and so less blamed; yet they would be all reproved, as having neglected the greater and more weighty business. It is true, in these Controversies, as some have more Truth on their side then others; so their fault is the less: nevertheless, not having served their Generation, but contended only about things of lesser importance; for this they may ALL stand ashamed before the Son of man at his coming.  
4. If no Vial yet be poured out, and the Vial-Angels are to come out of the Temple; this considered, should stir up the Churches of the Saints to hear what the Spirit saith unto the Churches. They have seen thy go, O God; 
Rev. 2.7. Psal. 68.24  even the go of my God, my King, in the Sanctuary. My opinion is, near the time of the Vials, the Spirit of God will move among the Saints at their holy Meetings, in some strong and extraordinary way; as to the shaking of the house, as Act. 4.31. or as in Acts 13.2. And the Temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God, and from his power. And therefore, 
Rev. 15.8.  as eminent and infallible confirmations and assurances are to be asked; so God's Answers and Returns are to be heeded: for now Believers are to expect the great promise of the Father, to be endued with power from on high; and to have the Spirit of truth, 
Joh. 16.13.  to guide them into all truth, and to show them things to come. Again, as wonderful and extraordinary things are to be attempted, things new, and in former ages unheard-of: so the wonderful appearances of God, as moving and leading men thereto, are to be observed; which are no other than Gods call to the Angels of the Vials in the Temple: Go your ways, and pour out the Vials of the wrath of God upon the earth. 
Rev. 16.1.  Who is wise, and he shall understand these things; prudent, 
Hos. 14.9.  and he shall know them? For the ways of the Lord are right, and the just shall walk in them; but the transgressors shall fall therein.  
5. To hold that some of the Vials are begun, it draws such a cloud and darkness over men's eyes, as it cannot but disadvantage Saints many ways. For, 1. Those who now suffer upon the account of the Fifth Kingdom, and run not after the error of Balaam for reward; what improvement can they make of their Testimony? I say, how little (comparatively) doth it tend to? If the Sackcloth-Witnesses have poured out Vials upon the Earth, Sea, and Fountains of waters; truly the house of Austria is a business far off, and the following Vials yet further; and in my understanding, all yields very little comfort to those whose present expectation is raised up after great and high things nearer home.  
Again, granting some Vials poured out; but how many, and when, where, and how; here all uncertain: This must needs wrap a soul into a world of doubts; as, what to pray for, and where we are, and what work to prepare for. Paul saith well, It is good to be zealously affected always, 
Gal. 4.18.  in a good thing. For my part, I sincerely speak it, taking the Vials begun, the more I consider where we are, and what to pray for, and prepare for, (as to present Generation-work) the less I am satisfied, as to have things bottomed and well grounded.  
But on the contrary, taking the Vials not begun, here methinks things are easy and plain to him that hath understanding, as to the knowledge both of our Time and Work. Besides, for the Prisoners of hope, here is that will stay them with flagons, 
Eccl. 4.14.  and comfort them with apples. For out of prison he cometh to reign. The risen Witnesses are to begin the work upon the Earth-state Apostasy. After three years and half, (which I take to be the whole time of the last state-apostacy, and the Witnesses lying so long slain) that in Job will be made good: 
Job 17.8.  The innocent shall stir up himself against the hypocrite.  
6. Were this Doctrine concerning the Vials rightly understood, it would awaken many carnal and corrupt Professors; as Formalists, Neuters, Time-servers, etc. It is no marvel that this sort of men are so little affected or affrighted with the seven last plagues: For if three of the Vials (as it is commonly held) are poured out, and yet all things continue as they were from the beginning; Why may not the later do as little as the former did? Whereas, did the Hypocrites and Apostates of this Age know, that none of them are yet poured out; and withal, were they informed who will be the subjects of each Vial, and what the effects: this would be like thunder in their ears: Alas, who shall live when God doth this? 
Num. 24.23.  Now we should see the sinners in Zion afraid; fearfulness would surprise the hypocrites.  
Specially when they shall hear, that the first Vial, whose subject is the Earth, is shortly to be poured forth upon an earthly and carnal Interest, to wit, the Grand Apostates of the last times, described in 2 Tim. 3.2, 3, 4. For the time is come, 
1 Pet. 4.17  that judgement must begin at the house of God; according to his way of old; and begin at my Sanctuary: 
Ezek. 9.6.  And in taking this course, all mouths will be stopped: Be silent, 
Zech. 2.13  O all flesh, before the Lord: for he is raised up out of his holy habitation. What will Rome, Spain, France, Germany, etc. have to say, when it comes to be their Turn to feel the weight and wrath of the Vials, when they shall hear how the Lord began first at his Sanctuary; namely, with those had a Form of godliness, but denied the power thereof?  
7. Neither is the knowledge of this, altogether without some use to the present Powers of the world, especially such, who say they believe that Christ shall have a visible and glorious Kingdom; only they differ from their Brethren in point of time. It was much, that Saul should tell David, I know well (saith he) that thou shalt surely be king, 
1 Sam. 24.20.  and that the kingdom of Israel shall be established in thine hand. One would think he spoke not as he thought; or at least, not as he would have it; when no sooner were the words out of his mouth, but he sought by all the subtle ways he could devise, how to take away David's life, that he might not be king.  
But now, to remove jealousy from men in Authority, in relation to those who already cry Hosanna to the Son of David, GOD SAVE KING JESUS, blessed be he that cometh in the Name of the Lord; and do assert him the only Potentate, and that he shall break all other Potentates and Powers of the world, and alone be exalted: This Apology I dare give forth to the whole world, in their behalf, I speak of those who bear witness to the fifth Kingdom, That they do abhor all secret Designs and Plots; neither is it in their hearts to act as men, nor for men; no, nor to appear in the work of the Lord, till they shall see one of the days of the Son of man, that is, the Lord eminently risen, in lifting up the Standard for his People. So that as they cease from man, and from trusting in Chariots and Horsemen; so it is below their Principles, to provide Pikes and Muskets, or any such Ammunition: for they know, when their time and work comes, if they shall need then any such Weapons, their Enemies will spare them enough, as casting away all they have, that they may fly the faster to Rocks and Mountains, whereby to be hid from the fierce wrath of the Lamb.  
But whereas there is a great Rumour thorough the Nations, of wonderful Actions and Changes at hand; 
Mat. 2.3.  (When Herod heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him:) hence it is suggested, as if the Assertors of Christ's glorious and visible Kingdom, had fixed a certain, definite & determinate Time when the Stone cut out without hands, should begin to smite the Image upon his feet that were of Iron & Clay, and break them in pieces. But this is not true. Yet this we confess, (for we desire, as our hearts are known to God, so to have them naked and opened unto the eyes of all men) we are of opinion, That the Lord will arise, 
Psal. 102.13.  and have mercy upon Zion: for the time to favour her, yea the set-time is come. The vision which was for an appointed time, 
Hab. 2.3.  is at an end, and will speak. The forty and two months, and one thousand two hundred and sixty days, are near their periods; and there shall be time no longer, either for the Beast, or other Tyrants, to bear rule over the Saints of the most High. But what of this? Here is no ground for action: for until the Lord himself make it clear and certain, by his own infallible appearance, that the time is come; men's Conjectures are nothing, as to move any to such undertake.  
And therefore I say further, Had these men who believe that Christ will shortly destroy all worldly powers, as great advantages against any of them, as David had against Saul when he fell into his hands, they would not (I speak as I believe) stir, or act any thing, merely as having such an Advantage or Opportunity: for they eye more than what men call Providence, (which Thiefs of all sorts may pretend to: 
Num. 23.21. ) The Lord God must be with them, and the shout of a King among them. And until the Lord of hosts muster the host of the battle, 
Isa. 13.4.  those that rejoice in his HIGHNESS will remain in their Chambers, having their doors shut about them.  
I speak not this, as if there were the least unwillingness in the Assertors of the Fifth Kingdom to suffer in the behalf thereof. For I am confident, they are as willing as ever were Saints in any Generation, to hold forth (with their lives in their hands) this Testimony of Jesus Christ, namely, 
1 Tim. 6.15.  THAT CHRIST AS MAN SHALL BE THE ONLY POTENTATE, INSOMUCH AS ALL WORLDLY DOMINION, 
Dan. 2.35.  RULE, GOVERNMENT, etc. SHALL BE BROKEN TO PIECES, AND BECOME AS THE CHAFF OF THE SUMMER-THRESHING-FLOOR, AND NO PLACE FOUND MORE FOR IT: 
Dan. 7.14, 2.7.  BUT CHRIST WITH HIS SAINTS SHALL HAVE THE DOMINION, GLORY, AND GREATNESS, UNDER THE WHOLE HEAVEN.  
But what I writ, is to wipe off the Scandal and Reproach which some seek to fasten upon them, by matching them with Cavaliers and Malignants; and as if great Plots (I know not what) were under Consultation amongst them: A thing detested, as most unsuitable to the glorious Cause and Interest which they profess. Besides, they know well enough, as Christ will take the Kingdoms of the world into his own hands: so, when that time shall come, (as we hope it is not far off) he will come with power enough: we need not to take any thought about it: For the zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this. 
Isa. 9 ●.   
Having thus far endeavoured to remove needless Fears, it were well (notwithstanding) if the Great Ones of the world would take notice of what was hinted before, That Jesus Christ is designing against them, (though we are not) to root them out, and to pull them down, and to destroy and overthrow them. 
Isai. 28.22.  Now therefore be not mockers, lest your bands be made strong. For I have heard from the Lord God of hosts, a consumption even determined upon the whole earth. 
Isai. 23.9.  He hath purposed to slain the pride of all glory, and to bring to contempt all the honourable of the earth. What greater folly in men, then to take care to have the walls of their houses high and strong, but no covering to it, whereby to keep off hurt and danger from above, and over head? That BLOW which the Powers of the world may expect next, it's from above, even The finger of God: and therefore if they have not made it well and strong overhead, (strong enough to keep off the hand of God) what will their Soldiers and Guards about them, stead them? Your Covenant with death shall be disannulled, 
Isai. 28.18.  and your agreement with hell shall not stand: when the overflowing scourge shall pass thorough, than ye shall be trodden down by it. 
Isa. 8.9, 10.  Also, associate yourselves, O ye people, and ye shall be broken in pieces; take counsel together, and it shall come to nought. When fire takes hold of sticks bundled together, the one rather furthers than hinders the others burning. When the day of the Lord of hosts shall be upon every one that is proud and lofty, 
Isai. 2.12.  the more they combine together by Power and Policy, the faster they will run, and destroy one the other. No man (I think) could have done more (whether Machiavilian or Atheist) than Herod did, to prevent the great Design of God, when Jesus Christ came first into the world! 
Pro. 21.30.  But it would not do. For there is no wisdom, nor understanding, nor counsel, against the Lord. So a while after, to hinder Christ's Resurrection, what could the devil have suggested, (as a Plot more probably to take effect) then to make the sepulchre sure, 
Mat. 27.66  sealing the stone, and setting a watch? But this would not do neither: for Christ arose in the appointed time, notwithstanding all the depths of Satan in the chief Priests and Pharisees; notable Types of the Rulers and Priests of the last days. Whilst some, like the Wisemen, are ask, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? and mourning with the Disciples, to see him crucified in his Cause and Witnesses: others, with Herod and the Pharisees, are taking crafty counsel how to hinder his Kingdom, Power, and Greatness: But this will not do: 
Psal. 2.6.  Yet have I set my Son upon my holy hill of Zion.  
Neither will Christ stand to that Division and Share which these men have set out to him, viz. Spiritualties: for so they have divided the Government of Nations between Him and Themselves. As for all outward things, Crowns, Kingdom, 
Compare Luke 4.6.  Power, Greatness, Glory, Riches, Laws, etc. this is their Share. Now there is another thing, which they call Spiritual, or inward and invisible; this they allow to Christ; and no marvel: for they know not how to get it out of his hands. But the Prophet speaks of another Decree, which is, 
Psal. 2.7.  That Jesus Christ shall have all; and their flesh (that is, their Revenues, Riches, 
Rev. 19.17, 18.  Greatness, Power, Places, etc.) shall be given to the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven.  
But I shall say no more, as having little hope that such say as these, will take with them. For the old subtle Serpent, who loves to be with them in the Garden, tells them, (when such things come to their ear) YE SHALL NOT SURELY DIE. 
Gen. 3.4.   
8. And here I may not forget, what help and advantage Saints have, by the knowledge of these things: as, to be kept and preserved from the Errors of the last times. For, what is it that doth occasion many poor souls so easily to be led aside into that NOTHING of the Quakers, but their ignorance of the Visions and Prophecies of the Scriptures not yet fulfilled? Hence (knowing little of the visible and glorious Kingdom of Christ, as the Son of man) they turn all things either into Allegories, or a Christ within them; and so make all the great counsels and purposes of God of no effect. As for this sort of people, truly I love them, and pity them: I love them, for many good things which I see in them; as, their honest walking, and civil righteousness; and for that Public Testimony which they hold forth against the scandalous practices of corrupt men. And I pity them much, to see how, pretending to Perfection, and to have the highest Light and Discoveries of Truth, there is nothing to be found in their Writings, Speeches, Lives, but what is very low, and signifies NOTHING, as to be a People raised up for the work of the last days. They tell us of Christ and Antichrist, of Babylon and the New Jerusalem; of the Seals, Trumpets, Vials; the Beast, false Prophet, and the Great Whore, etc. But alas, poor hearts, nothing do they make of it, either as to the truth of the matter in itself, or in their own way, as they apply it, and would be understood. And therefore well may their Way be called NOTHING: for nothing is held forth by them concerning the great things of Christ which Saints now wait for, according to the promise of the Father.  
But to return to you, who are hastening the day of the coming of Christ: Give me leave in the Close to speak one word more. As the expectation of Saints everywhere is exceeding high, after strange and wonderful things: so the Prophecies of the Scriptures (such I mean as respect the last days) are the more diligently to be searched, as the Grounds of our Faith and Hope. And howsoever all of them are of excellent use, whereby to know what must shortly come to pass, and how to be in readiness: Nevertheless, the matter of the Vials (in my opinion) is a thing wherein Christians should labour to have special light and knowledge, as containing the whole Work of God, till the sinners be consumed out of the earth, and the wicked be no more.  
Neither will there lie such Darkness on the Vials, if we once (through Christ) have found the beginning. For as in reading Books, the last word of the Page gives direction to what follows, and how to find it: so (I conceive) in every Vial, there is a light of some direction, whereby to carry us over to the knowledge of the next, and from it to what follows▪ and so of the rest: which will occasion the humble searcher to say, O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God But here no common or ordinary frame is sufficient: but we must labour for high and choice spirits, to be strengthened with might by the Spirit in the inner man, and filled with all the fullness of God.  
Now that such a measure of the Spirit may be poured out upon all the Lords Servants and Handmaids waiting everywhere for the same, is the daily prayer of him who is  
Yours In the love and service of the Truth, JOHN CAN. From Hull, the beginning of this HOPEFUL YEAR 1656.   

Time with Truth tried: OR, Certain Reasons to prove that none of the seven last Plagues or Vials are yet poured out; neither will the time of their pouring out begin, till after the rising of the Witnesses, and the one thousand two hundred and sixty days, or forty and two months of the Beast's Reign be expired.  
I Am not ignorant, how much it doth savour of affecting Singularity, to publish a new Doctrine, as the Athenians said of Paul; 
Acts 18.19.  especially being a thing contrary to the common received opinion of good men. But here I have not only my own Conscience to witness otherwise for me; but I hope, amongst all such as are wise, and truly godly, I shall find better and more charitable thoughts, when they have duly weighed the Grounds of this supposed New Doctrine.  
That none of the seven last Plagues are yet poured out, c&. it seems to be a Truth, for these Reasons.  
Reas. 1 First: If that be granted, which Mr Tillinghast and others affirm, that by the hundred forty and four thousand, 
But that I think Mr Till. opinion here is not questioned by waiting Saints, otherwise I could give many Reasons, that the rising of the Witnesses, and the 144000, do contemporize.  Rev. 14.1. the Gentile-Saints are signified; and their standing on mount Zion with the Lamb, is to be after the rising of the Witnesses; then I think there will be very little reason to carry the beginning of the seven last Vials any higher, For though it be the opinion of learned and godly men, that some of the Vials are poured out; yet so, as they hold likewise, that the hundred forty and four thousand have already stood with the Lamb on mount Zion. And indeed, this hath Reason and weight in it, That where we begin the time of the one hundred forty and four thousand, there we should also take the beginning of the Vials. And the order of the matter seems to make this clear. The holy Ghost having, chap. 14. spoken of the Harvest and Vintage, that is, what sore plague's the Lord will bring upon Babylon and the followers of the Beast; comes presently, in chap. 15 & 16, to show how, and by what means, the earth shall be reaped, the clusters gathered, and cast into the great wine-press of God's wrath; namely, seven Angels shall come out of the Temple, having the seven last plagues, etc. So then, to take the one hundred forty and four thousand to be after the Witnesses are risen; and to begin the pouring out of the Vials before the Witnesses are risen, in my understanding, it is very improper to the scope and drift of the Prophecy, and crosseth that excellent order which the Spirit seems to observe.  
Reas. 2 Secondly: I do not conceive (under favour) how the pouring out of Plagues, and Vials full of divine wrath, in any good sense, and according to Scripture-use, may be applied to, and understood of the preaching of the glad tidings of the Gospel. Truly I think, that the publishing of the sweet and most precious soulsaving Truths of Jesus, all the time of the the Beasts reign, even the forty and two months, or one thousand two hundred and sixty days, is in another way, and by other words expressed; and not by Vials full of wrath: See Rev. 10.9, 10, 11. And therefore by the seven last plagues filled up with the wrath of God, Rev. 15.1. I understand real and proper plagues, and not the preaching of the Gospel, either by Grosthead, Wickliff, Luther, Calvin, etc. but rather such temporal plagues as shall be in the last days poured out upon wicked men, for despising and persecuting the Truth: 
No doubt the Alleluiahs, Revel. 19.1, 2, 3, etc. are for what was done under the first, second & third Vials, as for the effects of the rest. Now how in the preaching of the Gospel by Wickliff, Luther, etc. God avenged the blood of his servants on the great Whore, I do not yet see.  In her was found the blood of the Prophets and Saints, Rev. 18.24.  
It is true, Luther and others, in discovering the corruptions of persons and things, and lifting up their voices like Trumpets, against the abominations of their Masses, Crosses, Indulgences, Purgatory, Penance, Pilgrimage, etc. did therein take the little book, and prophesied before many people, nations and tongues. That they did this, we have the Word to believe it: but that in preaching the Word of life, and opening the Gospel of the Kingdom, to the ignorant and blind world, by which means multitudes were brought from darkness to light, and from Idols to the serving of the living and true God: 
Observe, it is not said, that the effects of the Vials shall be wrath, or turn to wrath; but, In them is filled up the wrath of God.  That in this (I say) they poured out Vials filled up with the wrath of God, I cannot so take it; neither have I seen Reasons and Grounds why it should be so understood.  
Reas. 3 But thirdly: Suppose it be granted, there is a Vial of wrath poured out, (which to me sounds harshly) and that Wickliff, Huss, Jerome of Prague, Luther, etc. were the Angels; The question than is, Who before them poured out their Vials upon the earth: For it is said, These seven Angels had the seven last plagues; signifying, that there were Plagues before; although for time, persons, matter, and manner of proceeding, and other circumstances, unlike.  
Besides, I see no reason, why some will have the pouring out of the Vials to begin at Luther; others, at Armachan the Irish Bishop; some, at Robert Grosthead Bishop of Lincoln. To me their opinion seems fairer, (taking the Vials for the preaching of the Gospel) who carry the thing higher, (as Mede and others) even to Waldo: yea, and why not further, as to Arnulphus, Arnoldus Brixianus, etc. who publicly witnessed against the Tyranny and Primacy of the Pope, boldly reproved the wicked lives of the Priests; and many other faithful Witnesses, both of 
* Which was about the year 1134.  that time, and before? If we look into Histories and Records of Nations, for aught I yet see, granting some of the Vials already poured out, viz. in witnessing against the blasphemies and beastly vanities of Antichrist, 
Those who assert, that some of the Vials are poured out, should do well to give some Reasons why they take their beginning from such a man, or such a time; and why not before or after?  there is more reason to take their beginning 6 or 700 years past, then to pitch upon any person or persons of later times.  
Reas. 4 Fourthly: I have not seen any reason why so much time is allowed between the first and second Vials: some allow a hundred years, others two, 
From Armach. the Irish Bishop, to the Sweden Wars in Germany, is near 300 years. Rob. Grosted Bishop of Lincoln, was before him almost 100 years. Again, from Luther to our Parliament, an. 1640. was about 120 years. To the rest of the Vials there is not allowed half the time.  and some more; namely, from the pouring out of the first Vial, to the beginning of the second; and to all the rest, not half the time. Truly I think this is worth enquiry, Why from the first Vial, before the second gins, longer time is allotted, then to the Six other Vials.  
If those Vials, or last plagues, have an allusion to the plagues of Egypt, (as it is generally held) than it is probable, when there is once a beginning, they will be suddenly all poured out. 
* Willet from Pererius collects, that within the compass of 27 days, or about a month, all the plagues of Egypt were finished. Comment. on Exod. 7. Quest. 29.  Some have observed from the History in Exodus, that within the space of thirty days, the ten Egyptian plagues (from the first to the last) were executed. Now if we reckon a day for a year, (as it is often in Prophetical Types) within thirty years, the seven last plagues of the seven Angels will be finished. Neither is it to be doubted, but a short work will the Lamb make upon the earth, Rom. 9.28. when those Vials begin to be poured out. Wherefore is Babylon's fall set forth under the sign of a great millstone cast into the sea by a mighty Angel? Rev. 18.21. not only to denote her irrecoverable desolation, but what speedy and quick dispatch the Lord will make, when he calls his Angels out of the Temple: Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, Rev. 18.8. in one hour, vers. 10, 17, 19 in a moment, suddenly, Isa. 47.9, 11.  
I know, the destruction of Babylon, mentioned Rev. 18. is by many restrained to the burning of the City of Rome: but, in my opinion, there is far better Ground to take Babylon there, for the whole Kingdom and Dominion of the Beast everywhere: And let him that hath understanding read the Chapter, he shall clearly see, that it must be understood of the universal Antichristian State, even all that which is to be destroyed under the five first Vials. Neither do I think that any of the Vials will be poured forth till the Angel there come down from heaven, having great power, and the earth is lightened with his glory, Rev. 18.1. For it seems to me, as the pouring out of all the Vials will be the great work of Saints, at the time of the end; so the Lord will make way wonderfully for them: For they shall be enlightened and satisfied, as to the knowledge of their work and time. So then, in short, I think it is a mistake, to apply (as some do) the fall of Babylon to the burning of Rome; or (as others) to the 
* I desire this may be well observed, That the fall of Babylon, Rev. 18. is to be referred to the five first Vials equally. Neither comes any of the 7 Angels out of the Temple, till that mighty Angel descend from heaven, Rev. 18.1.  fifth Vial. For, as I said before, there are manifest proofs in the Chapter, that the Kingdom and State of the Beast (everywhere) is to be understood; and that the other four Vials going before, concern also the same thing.  
Reas. 5 Fifthly: Though I would be loath to detract from any, but desire to have the memory of the Just blessed, especially such who have born any good Testimony against the Beast; yet I cannot conceive how any of the persons to whom the first, second and third Angels are ordinarily applied, do fairly or fitly parallel and agree with what the Scripture holds forth. Certain it is, none of the Angels come out of the Temple, till john saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire, and them that had gotten the victory over the Beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God; and they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, Rev. 15.2, 3. All this well agrees with the description of the one hundred forty and four thousand, Rev. 14.1, 2, 3. But to carry these things to Grostead, Armachan, Wickliff, Luther, etc. if need were, I could show by many reasons the improbability of it.  
There is a great difference between not receiving the mark, or the name of the Beast, or the number of his name; and getting the victory over the Beast, and over his image, mark, name, etc. It is true, in the former sense, there were many of God's people which in the time of the Beasts reign received not his mark, etc. but that any of them, during the forty and two months, got the Victory over the Beast, or over his image, mark, name, etc. to this I cannot assent.  
Neither is their opinion well bottomed, (I speak as I think) who hold, that this victory over the Beast, and singing the song of Moses, and the song of the Lamb, to be before the rising of the Witnesses, even the time that they prophesied in sackcloth, and whilst the woman was still in the wilderness.  
Under favour, I think, that their opinion is better grounded, (I speak as to consonancy of parallel Scriptures) who taking the Witnesses already risen, do carry this victory over the Beast, and the song of Moses and of the Lamb, to the time of their rising; and so begin the Vials. But to hold the Witnesses not risen, nor the woman out of the wilderness, and yet to hold the victory over the Beast past, (the song of Moses and of the Lamb, to be sung some hundred years ago, and so to begin the Vials) this, to me, seems little less than evident 
* That the woman whilst she abode in the wilderness, and the Witnesses prophesying in sackcloth should sing the song of Moses and the Lamb, it seems a contradiction: yet I see not how such as hold some of the Vials poured out, and yet the woman not out of the wilderness, nor the Witnesses risen, can avoid it.  contradiction.  
Reas. 6 Sixthly: My opinion is, that none of the seven last plagues or Vials are yet poured forth, nor will be, till after the rising of the Witnesses, for this reason; namely, because none of the seven Angels come forth with their golden Vials, until the Tabernacle of the Testimony is opened in heaven, 
Mede perceiving the place to be so directly against him and others who hold some of the Vials poured out, puts it off thus: Truly (saith he) that which is there said of the Temple, of the Tabernacle of the Testimony in heaven, that appertaineth not to the beginning, but to the event of the Vials. But by his leave, he takes more than the place allows him.  Rev. 15.5. But that part of the Tabernacle of the Testimony is to be shut all the time of the Witnesses their prophesying in sackcloth, as may be gathered from Rev. 11.1. with vers. 19 Hence this Argument might be framed: 
No Angel is to come forth with his golden Vial, till the  
Tabernacle of the Testimony in heaven be opened.  
But the Tabernacle of the Testimony is not to be opened  
till after the rising of the Witnesses:  
Therefore, no Angel with his golden Vial is to come forth  
till after the rising of the Witnesses.   
The proof of the Argument, are the Scriptures before, viz. Rev. 15.5. with Chap. 11. vers. 1, 19 Now if any do think that the four last Angels shall come out from the Temple opened in heaven, and not the first three; such an opinion is against the Text expressly, which saith, that the seven Angels come out of the Temple, vers. 6. Neither do I know any ground they have, who think that the Angels pouring out the four last Vials, shall have more light, zeal, faith, holiness, etc. then the former had. There is no such thing to be gathered from the Text. But if we may use liberty of conjecture, I see no reason (supposing pre-eminence) why the first should not have it; as he that fights the Enemy, and engageth first, shows himself the most valiant and best-deserving Soldier.  
Reas. 7 Neither (seventhly) do I think, that the effects of any of the Vials (which some suppose are poured out,) make good what is said, Rev. 15.4. For thy judgements are made Manifest. The place to me hath much more in it, than what followed the Doctrines & writings of Grostead, Wickliff, Huss, Luther, Melancthon, etc. or the Swethen wars, or the Parliament in England. For God's judgements, notwithstanding what hath been yet done, remain still dark, doubtful, disputeable, etc. especially to the world, wherein his judgements shall be Manifest in the effects of the Vials.  
As the Egyptians under their plagues, though hardened in sin, yet acknowledged the finger of God upon them, Exo. 8.19. So the followers of the Beast, when the Vials are poured out, notwithstanding their blaspheming God, and not repenting, to give him glory, shall see the hand of God lifted up, & be ashamed for their envy at his people, Isa. 26.11. So manifest at this time will his judgements be, 2 Tim. 3.9. But hitherto the 
* Should we in the particulars consider, beginning either at Grostead, Armachan, Luther, etc. or where else, and come down to our own times, very little can be said as to God's Judgements upon the Antichristians yet Manifested. Neither did the Swethen wars nor Ours, signify much as to what should be Manifested in the effects of every Vial being poured out.  providential appearances & Actings of God have been so dark and hidden, his movings so forward & backward, I mean as to his judgements, that should we begin at Grostead, Armachan, Luther, or anywhere else since the rise of the Beast, and come down to this time, there hath been very little of God's Judgements yet Manifested to his own people, much less to the Enemy: And hence it is that Babylon saith in her heart, I sit a Queen, and am no widow, & shall see no sorrow, Rev. 18.7. Yea, hence it is that the Antichristians, in their writings, and ordinary discourses, do stiffly maintain, that God's judgements have been as manifest, and still are, upon the witnesses, the woman in the wilderness, and all parties opposing them, as they are in respect of them. Now howsoever this may be denied, yet hitherto we have not had matter, nor the cause so on our side, as by the judgements of God against them to put them to silence. But confident I am, the effects of all the Vials shall be such (the 1. 2. 3. as well as the rest) in the manifestation of God's Judgements against the great whore and all her helpers, that the righteous shall see it and rejoice, and all iniquity shall stop her mouth, Psa. 107.42.  
Reas. 8 Eighthly: It is said, Rev. 11.3. I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall Prophesy 1260 days clothed in sackcloth; neither did they put off their sackcloth till they had finished their Testimony, ver. 7. But these Angels which pour out the last plagues (even all 7) have put off their sackcloth, and are clothed with pure and white linen, Rev. 15.6. hence it must needs follow (if I have any understanding of the glorious prophecies to be fulfilled in the last times) that neither 
* If any shall object, that Grostead, Armachan, Husse, Luther, etc. in one respect wore sackcloth, and in another respect had fine linen; I answer, In my opinion, this cannot be: for they never changed their condition, after they were witnesses, but were always sufferers for the truth to their dying day; yea some of them laid down their lives for it.  Waldo, Wickliff, Husse, Luther, etc. can be meant by any of the 7 Angels clothed with white linen. For they never had their sackcloth taken off, but wore it to their graves. What is meant by being clothed with white linen, the Scriptures show, it was an ensign of honour, which great persons used to wear, their condition and state being changed. Gen. 41.42. Esth. 8.15. Pro. 31.22. Ezek. 16.10. Psa. 30.11.  
The truth is, if we take not heed to distinguish between the sackcloth-time of mourning Saints, and the time in which they are clothed with white linen, that is, raised out of the dust, and set with Princes, even with the Princes of his people, Psa. 113.7, 8. but confound these times (which ought to be kept distinct and apart) we shall want an excellent light and help, to bring things to their due and proper places. I cannot deny but many learned and godly men do carry up the beginning of the Vials, to Luther, Melancthon, Zuinglius, and some higher; but withal this they hold, that Luther, and so the rest, had put off their sackcloth, the time of the 1260 days being expired, of the 2 witnesses prophesying in sackcloth. But to think, that any of the Vials should be poured out, and the sackcloth-time not out, I say, the witnesses not having finished their Testimony, to express myself humbly and soberly, I think here is another contradiction: for there cannot be a wearing of sackcloth and fine linen at one time, and by the same persons. Neither are the sackcloth-witnesses against Babylon, the white-linen-Angels which must pour out the last plagues upon her, until they have finished their Testimony, and after they have been slain stand upon their feet through the Spirit of life from God, entering into them.  
Reas. 9 The 9 Reason I take from Rev. 18.21. And a mighty Angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all. If this place belong to the Vials (as to me it seems most evident) surely than whatsoever is attributed to Grostead, Armachan, Wickliff, Husse, Luther, etc. or to the Swethen wars, or to the English Parliament, etc. is far from the works of the Angels which shall pour out the 7 last plagues.  
THUS shall Babylon, etc. The Comparison especially holds in two things: first, a great millstone in the sea doth not one while sink and another while swim; now is falling, then rising again. Thus, that is, when any of the 7 Angels pour out their Vials, the work shall so prosper in their hands, as it shall go still visibly forward, and not be hindered or retarded, by any Adversary-power whatsoever: It shall not be now (as hitherto it hath been) one while the enemy hath been sinking, another while rising and swimming; but where the Vials (whether First, Second, Third, etc.) do fall, the Beast and his party shall be always falling & sinking down to the bottom under them.  
Secondly: As Babylon shall be always sinking under the Vials; so where she is once brought to the bottom, there she shall remain and abide, without recovering herself any more at all. But these things we have not 
* I desire the Judicious reader seriously to consider whether he conceives any thing yet done against the Kingdom of the Beast, which looks like a Vial. It is true God's hand hath been against it many ways: But we are to distinguish between common Judgements, and Vials filled up with the wrath of God: see Isa. 13.19. Jer. 50.40. the wrath is every Vial is no ordinary wrath, as I think.  seen, as the effects of the Vials supposed to be poured out. For neither hath her sinking been like a Millstone; nor hath she kept at the bottom, being down. But that I have intended at this time to be brief, otherwise I could easily show, how Interpreters in their application of the effects of Each Vial, taking the subjects of the Vials to be either this or that Country, do make very little of the matter, to what the Spirit of God declares shall be the effects of every Vial upon the Antichristian Kingdom.  
Reas. 10 Tenthly: If my judgement fails not, there seems to follow an absurdity, taking the effects of the Vials already poured out, to be as they are understood and applied. The absurdity seems thus: When all the Vials are poured out, very little may be signified or done by them, but Tyranny and Idolatry in persons and things, over all nations, people and tongues, as before. To prove this, thus I reason. If after the pouring out of three Vials (yea, as some reckon, 4, 5, 6.) what tyranny and Idolatry was suppressed and put down (as the effects of the Vials) did rise and spread itself again in the same places; Then may the effects of the later Vials be so too: That is, what corruptions and abuses are for a while suppressed (as the effects of the Vials) the same, whether Tyranny or Idolatry, may be established again among the people where formerly they were put down. If so, than the conclusion will stand good, 
John de la March saith the sixth Vial was poured out upon Euphrates about the year 1632 and so forward. The effect whereof (viz. the drying up of it, appeared first in Scotland, An. 1639. in the sentence of Excommunication against the Hierarchy. Complaint of the false Prophets, pag. 19 By such reckoning we shall have little done by the Vials.  that after all the Vials are poured out, very little may be done or signified; but the cause and interest of Christ, and the condition of God's people, whether jews or Gentiles, no better than it was before.  
If any shall object, that under the Vials not poured out (as the 4, 5, 6, 7,) the Germane Empire, the Kingdom of the Beast, the Turkish power, etc. will be broken; I answer, The Question is not what shall be the effects of the later Vials; but being granted that 3 are poured out, and where they fell, what Tyranny and Idolatry soever was for a time put down, (as the effects of such Vials) in the same countries (which were the subjects of the Vials) the former Tyranny & Idolatry were established again: The Question, I say, then is, why the effects of the later Vials may not prove & be as the effects of the former; That is, whatsoever Tyranny and Idolatry shall be suppressed (as the effects of the last Vials) the same may be set up again in the Nations, as it was before in the case of the former Vials; and so in Conclusion all may be poured out, & the times immediately after as corrupt as before.  
Reas. 11 My 11 Reason why I think none of the Vials are yet poured out, is taken from Rev. 15.8. where it is said, And the Temple was filled with smoke, from the glory of God, and from his power; and no man was able to enter into the Temple, till the seven plagues of the seven Angels were fulfilled. How this can be fairly applied to the persons whom I have often mentioned, viz. Grostead, Armachan, Wickliff, Luther, the King of Swethen, or our Late Parliament; I see no reason at all for it.  
For 1. If there hath been no such Temple yet, filled with smoke from the glory of God (as I believe there hath not) then consequently none of the 7 Last plagues have been poured out.  
But 2. Suppose such a Temple 3 or 400 years past; Yet how will it appear, that in all this time, notwithstanding the multitudes which have ever since separated from the false Church, not one man of them was able to enter into the Temple?  
3. For the persons who are thought to be the Angels already gone out of the Temple with Vials of wrath, give them their due and more too, yet I doubt, if things be duly weighed, whether groundedly it can be proved, I speak as to any of them, that the Temple was 
* I am much unsatisfied that not any of the Vials are yet poured out, in regard I see so little proportion and sutableness between the persons who are said to be the Angels; & how the Spirit of God describes the persons and work.  FILLED with smoke from the glory of God and from his power.  
Lastly, I am something confirmed in my opinion, not only to observe, how unsuteably the matter of the Vials is applied to things already done; I say, the disproportion between the one and the other: But what contrarieties and differences there are amongst good men about them. 
a Of this opinion are good men.  Some think Three are poured out, 
b So Mede.  others say Four; 
c Thus holds Mayer.  some Five, 
d So thinks John dela March.  others Six. Now truly my mind gives me, if such things were passed, being of so great concernment, God's people would not be so divided and lost therein.  
Besides, it is my opinion (and I shall ere long give reasons for it) when the time comes, that these Vials shall begin to be poured out, the Lord will set it 
* I Question whether Wickcliff, Husse, Luther, etc. or the King of Sweth, or our Parliament, either the one in preaching the Gospel, or the other in going forth to war, had it put upon their hearts by the Spirit of God, that what they did was in order to the fulfilling of this Prophecy, that is, they knew they were called out of the Temple to pour out such and such of the last plagues upon the Antichristian Kingdom. But I do not question, when the set-time is come that the Vials indeed must be poured out, but such as shall be the instruments and ministers thereof shall fully know that they are the Angels appointed for that work.  home upon the hearts of the Saints, as their work; and not only shall they be Spirited and fitted for it, but they shall know by some divine appearance that the set-time is come; now, as his chosen, & called, and faithful, they must follow the Lamb with golden Vials in their hands. Rev. 15.7. & 16.1. & 18. 1. Isa. 13.3. Psa. 50.4, 5. Dan. 12.10. Rev. 17.1.  
Howsoever I have thus far declared myself, that none of the seven last plagues are poured out, yet I must confess, considering how in this thing, I descent from what hath been, and still is the common received opinion of most pious and precious Saints; I desire to be very humble and sober in my thoughts: and in this regard, I profess in the presence of God, & before the whole Israel of God, that I shall be most willing and thankful (through the good hand of Christ, assisting me) to receive better light, from the least of the Flock, if I am mistaken about the time. And because the knowledge of the times, to wit, when the Vials are to take their beginning, is a thing of special concernment; for here if we mistake, we build upon a sandy foundation, and the whole Fabric is marred by it: Besides, the matter of the Vials is the main thing, which all waiting Saints at this time are diligently to inquire after, as their GENERATION-WORKE. For these and other like considerations, it is my humble request, that whosoever amongst the Little remnant of the woman, is not satisfied with these reasons, but thinks he can produce stronger Arguments (that some of the Vials are poured out,) then those which I have brought, that in the spirit of meekness so much may be made known to the followers of the Lamb.  
And to the end the Answer may be the more full and satisfactory to the Saints everywhere, I will here add a few Queries, the which being answered with the Reasons, will give the more light to the point in controversy.  
Quest. 1 First, If by the Angel pouring out the first Vial, either Waldo, Wickliff, Grostead, Armachan, Luther, etc. be meant, who then is the one of the 4 Beasts which gave unto the 7 Angels the 7 golden vials? Rev. 15.7. By the four Beasts in the Revelation, all Learned and godly Expositors do understand the Ministers & Preachers of the Gospel. If so, how then can they who 
* If the place be well weighed, I think such will see their mistake who apply any of the Vials to the preaching of the Gospel. It is one thing to stir up another to his work, and another thing to take the work out of his hand.  deliver over the Vials to be poured out by others, be the doers thereof themselves?  
Quest. 2 Secondly: whereas the 7 last plagues are to be poured forth by 7 Angels, The Question is, whether by each Angel a single person be meant, or a number. If a number of persons, then whether all godly, or some (suppose the greater number) shall be taken into the work, which are visibly profane and wicked, even such as carry the Mark of the Beast. It seems by the Scripture that none shall be called to the work of the Vials, nor have a hand in the pouring of them out, but 
* Rev. 15.6. & 17.14. & 14 1. Isa. 13.3. Psa. 102.18. Jer. 50.45. Rev. 18.6.  Saints by calling: If so, then how is the 2 or 3 Vial appliable to the Sweden or English wars?  
Quest. 3 Thirdly, why should the Song of Moses & of the Lamb, Rev. 15.34. 
I do not deny but the Lord hath done much for his Church and people in these later times; but it will not therefore follow that he hath given them such victories & deliverances as to sing the song of Moses, etc.  be carried up to the times before the rising of the witnesses; and the new song, Rev. 14.3. brought down many hundred years after? This seems to be, 1. Against the order of the prophecy. 2. The matter of the song, if rightly observed, is not suitable to any time in which the Beasts reigned. Neither, lastly, can it be showed (in my opinion) that ever the Churches of the Saints, since the rise of Antichrist to this day, have had occasion, through any deliverance or Victory, to song the Song of Moses and of the Lamb.  
Quest. 4 Fourthly, That some of these Vials should be poured out in the preaching of the Gospel, by Wickliff, Husse, Luther, etc. Others by Parliaments, Armies, Navies, etc. Though it be so taken, yet I do not see any Reason for it: for their opinion to me seems better grounded (I mean as to order) who apply all the seven last Plagues either to the 
(a) I would have this thing well considered why we should understand in preaching of the gospel Vials & plagues to be poured out.  preaching of the Gospel only, or only to temporal Judgements executed by Civil Powers: But to understand one Vial poured out in a Spiritual way, another in a Civil way, here I desire proof, as being unsatisfied.  
Quest. 5 Fifthly, That the effect of the first Vial, whether by Grostead, Armachan, Wickliff, Luther, etc. poured out, should no further extend, then to the discovering of some particulars of the grosser sort of Idolatry, as Purgatory, Mass, Penance, Corporal Presence, Praying to Saints, Pilgrimages, Indulgences, etc. with a Reformation of some people from the practice of such Corruptions; Many gross Lies and Errors of the Beast, neither discovered nor reproved at the same time by the persons before named: This I question, because when any Vial is poured out, wheresoever it falls, it shall 
(b) That any of the vials should be like a net, which holds some of the greater fish, & lets the lesser go through the holes, I am not of that opinion, Isa. 13.9, 16 Ps. 137.9 neither do I think that any reformation which hath been formerly in Church or State is to be brought under any of the Vials.  break the Kingdom of Antichrist fully and wholly; I say, not some part of it, but extirpate all his Idolatries and Blasphemies root and branch.  
The like may be said concerning applying other Vials, whether to the Wars of Germany, or since here in England. The truth is, so much Idolatry and Superstition is unshaken even to this day, where the Vials are said to fall (as the subjects of them) as I have ground to think, that nothing yet hath been done suitable to the nature and effect of any Vial.  
Quest. 6 Sixthly, whereas it is said Rev. 15.8. And the Temple was filled with smoke from the glory of God, and from his power; and no man was able to enter into the Temple till the seven plagues of the seven Angels were fulfilled. First, If by smoke we understand the wrath of God inflicted upon the Antichristians for their wicked Idolatry, as some do; The question than is, How it can be said, that since the Vials began to be poured out, their darkness and blindeness hath been more and greater than before.  
But secondly, If by the Temple filled with smoke from the glory of God, etc. the Spirit alludes to the history of the Tabernacle, which in the dedication thereof, was wholly filled with a Cloud of the glory of the Lord, so as Moses could not enter into it, Exo. 40.33, 34. And to the history of the Temple, which likewise at the dedication, was filled with the Cloud of the glory of God, so as the Priests could not stand to minister, so long as the glory of Jehovah filled the house: I say, if the place be thus applied (as most do) and that filling to be a testimony and sign of God's glorious presence and approbation: Then here is signified a pouring out of the Spirit upon the Angels, before they go forth, as tarrying in the Temple (as the Disciples did at Jerusalem) until they should be endued with power from on high, Luke 24.59. Indeed this great promise of the Father, concerning the sending of the Comforter to teach us all things, and to bring all things to our remembrance, Joh. 14.26. is by Saints now prayed for, and waited for even day and night; but as yet that Spirit is not 
(c) It is my opinion that no Vial shall be poured out until the saints have the spirit poured out upon them, which was promised to be given in the last days: now if we have not that spirit yet, I may well conclude Grostead; Armachan, Wickliff, Luther, etc. had it not in their days.  given forth from the glory of God, and from his power: Neither probably shall we receive it, until the woman be out of the wilderness. Who is this that cometh out of the Wilderness, like pillars of smoke perfumed with myrrh and frankincense, with all powders of the Merchant? Behold his bed, which is solomon's: threescore valiant men are about it, of the valiant of Israel, etc. Go forth, O ye daughters of Zion, and behold King Solomon with the Crown wherewith his mother crowned him in the day of his espousals, and in the day of the gladness of his heart, Song 3.6, 7, 11.  
Quest. 7 Seventhly, Whereas upon the opening of the seventh Seal, the first Angel of the seven, which had the seven Trumpets, sounded, Rev. 8.1, 7. The question is, Whether (observing order) the first Vial of the seventh is to be poured out, till after the sounding of the first Trumpet? If so, than we are not to begin the Vials until after the rising of the Witnesses; as is manifest Rev. 11.12, 15. Such as think some Vials are poured out, do likewise hold that the 
(d) Brightman holds that the seventh trumpet sounded in the year 1558.  seventh Trumpet hath already sounded. But to grant that some Vials are past, and the seventh Trumpet not yet sounded; here aught to be first good consideration, if we will not be children in understanding. That the seventh Trumpet hath not yet sounded, I think it must be granted by all, who hold the Witnesses not risen. But that any of the Vials are to be poured out, till after the sounding of the seventh Trumpet, truly in my opinion, whosoever shall humbly and soberly observe the Prophecy, shall find little ground to think otherwise. In the days of the voice of the seventh Angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the Prophets, Rev. 13.7. Now unless by finishing the mystery, here is meant the pouring out the seven last Plagues, I know not what is to be understood. It is said before, That there should be time no longer, ver. 6. that is, upon the sounding of the last Trumpet, the seven Angels which had the seven last Plagues, should (obeying the heavenly voice) go their ways and pour out the Vials of the wrath of God upon the earth: and so no more time, viz. for the Beast, and the false Prophet, or any other wicked ones to oppress the Lords people, whether Jews or Gentiles.  
Quest. 8 Eighthly, I desire to know, Whether the seven last Plagues do not contemporize with the third Woe, Rev. 8.13. If so, than no Vial is yet poured out: For the third Woe is not to be, until after the rising of the Witnesses, Rev. 11.11, 14. Again it is said, Behold the third Woe cometh quickly; which is not meant (as I conceive) of shortness of time betwixt this and the former Woe, but of a speedy and quick dispatch, as to the great work of God at this time. As if he should say, When this Woe comes upon the world (which I take to be no other than the pouring out of all the Vials) it shall be (though sharp, yet short) not for space of time, any way in comparison either to the first or second Woe.  
And truly, as I have said before, howsoever some good men do give many hundred years to the time of the Vials, yet for my part, I think otherwise; to wit, that after there is a beginning, they shall be all poured out, and the work finished in less than fifty years. Behold the third Woe cometh quickly.  
Reader, Thou mayest well perceive in framing these Questions, that I expect no Answer from an Adversary, but (if any answer be made) from a friend or brother, one that seeks with the like spirit after the understanding of the times, to know what Israel ought to do. And should these Reasons upon examination, be found not sufficient to prove the matter for which they are brought; yet I shall have comfort in what I have done, considering what PUBLIC ADVANTAGE may follow upon this occasion, as to have this Great Point the more diligently searched into. I may well call it a GREAT POINT, for I know nothing more necessary for Saints, who desire to follow, Christ fully, in the present work of their Generation, then to have clear light and knowledge concerning the Vials; that is, Whether any be past (as is the common received opinion) or none of them yet poured out, according to that small portion which I have in the knowledge of holy things.  That which I see not, teach thou me: If I have done iniquity, I will not offend any more, Job 34.32. 
FINIS.   

An Advertisement to the Reader.  
AFter I had sent the former Reasons to the Press, there came this Answer to my hands. It is true, I had a long time expected it, but hearing nothing from my Friend about it, I thought good to publish that little by itself, as intending (if I should see a providence in it) to set forth some thing larger upon the Vials. Now to have the Reasons printed, and to keep the Answer by me in secret (though I can truly say, I knew nothing of the Answer, till after the Reasons were at the Press; yet) to conceal it, it might be judged not lovely, and of good report: And therefore I have published the Answer (with a short Reply) as it came to my hands: Thus.  
I Shall bring out of my poor treasure (which I have received) in answer to your precious lines, Reasons and Quaeres, which were very seasonable and acceptable to me, and not at all offensive, troublesome or unprofitable to me; although I cannot, as yet, concur with your Opinion therein.  

Answer to the 1. Reason.  
For 1. I see no ground for that opinion which makes the beginning of the pouring out of the Vials to be at the same time with the Witnesses rising, and the 144000 mustering upon Mount Zion: And although some godly men say so, that the 144000 and Vials begin together, yet it is no more Argument to me, then that the 1000 years, Rev. 20. are begun (and were begun with Constantine) because some godly men say so. 2. Nor doth the order of the matter (in my eye) manage it. For the holy Ghost tells us, in Chap. 15.1. of another sign, viz. seven Angels: so that it was another distinct from that in Chap. 14, etc.  

Reply to the 1. Answ.  
Rep. 1. The strength of the Reason lies not in what godly men do say, but in the ground and proof they have for what they say: And here I find nothing in the Answer why it should not be so.  
2. Because two signs, therefore distinct as not to be applied to one time: This will not follow; for in Rev. 12.1. the Primitive Church is represented unto John by a wonder or sign in heaven; and in ver. 3. there appeared another sign, behold, a great red Dragon, etc. the which later, is taken for the Roman-heathen Emperors, persecuting the said Church at the same time. So Pharaoh in his dreams had two signs, yet not another distinct, for both signified one thing, Gen. 41.22, 32. But 2. it is called another sign, because that in Chap. 14. respecteth persons more than things; the latter, things more than persons: In the former we have the instruments by whom the Beasts dominion shall be destroyed, in the latter the work itself; that is, how, and in what manner the Judgement written shall be executed. But 3. why should these words (viz. another sign) be understood distinct from that in Chap. 14. seeing in that Chapter there is no mention made of any sign: More probably therefore they should be carried back to Rev. 12.1. as another, or distinct from that sign; there being no other that I know.  
Answ. And as some say, I do think he brings there exegetically, with what Chap. 11, & 12, & 13, & 14. mention but darkly and closely, of the plagues which shall come upon the Beasts dominion gradually by the two Witnesses: and so the order and place of Chap. 15 & 16 is at Rev. 11.6. where the two Witnesses smite the earth with plagues, according to Chap. 16. 1, 2. Pour out your Vials on the earth: and so Rev. 11.6. they turn waters into blood; according to Chap. 16.3, 4. the rivers and fountains of waters become blood; and this was before the Resurrection or Slaughter. So that both our Grounds and Orders seem good: for what can these plagues wherewith the two Witnesses smite the Antichristian earth and waters, be, but Vials, and the last plagues which are to fall upon the Beasts dominion?  
Repl. First, I think the Prophecies of this Book are the more dark to us, through our mis-placing of things, and carrying them disorderly forward and backward, whereas the holy Ghost keeps a better Method. For thus in brief I take it: The Witnesses being treated of, Chap. 11. and the wilderness-state of the woman, Chap. 12. he proceeds to the Tyranny and Idolatry of the Beast, Chap. 13. and so ends the whole History, or Acts, of the two Witnesses, Woman, and Beast, viz. as to the 42 months or 1260 days. What follows from the beginning of Chap. 14. they are things afterwards to come to pass: that is, The Witnesses being risen, and the Woman out of the wilderness, in the 144000 standing with the Lamb on mount Zion, Chap. 14. the Lord now will send forth the Rod of his strength out of Zion, Chap. 15 & 16. But because the carrying on of this great work cannot be without understanding the Prophecies of the last time; hence, Chap. 17. one of the seven Angels which had the Vials, shows unto John (representing the Church near the time of the end) the judgement of the great Whore: signifying, that these mighty ones whom the Lord hath called for his anger, shall have it not only in their hearts to fulfil his will; but what they do, shall be knowingly in order thereunto: see Rev. 21.9, 10. & 22.8. Then follows, Chap. 18. the total and final desolation of the Beasts dominion, fuller and clearer than before: for which, Chap. 19 there is Hallelujah, salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, given unto the Lord our God. Thus it is a continued History, without breach of order: only something concerning the last Vial, Chap. 14.19, 20. and the Armageddon-battel, Chap. 16. is the same with Chap. 19.11, 12, 13, etc.  
2. As I see no order in taking the sackcloth-Witnesses, Rev. 11. to be any of the seven Angels, Chap. 15. so likewise, what you say for it, to me seems no Ground at all; as, smiting the earth, turning waters into blood, etc. For the Witnesses before their rising poured out no plagues upon the Earth, Sea, Fountains, etc. what they did, was no other than did the Prophets of old, who pronounced, indeed, several judgements against the Nations: The burden of the Lord upon Babylon, Egypt, Damascus, Nineveh, etc. and in this sense were set over the Nations, and over the Kingdoms, to root out, and to pull down, and to destroy, and to throw down, etc. Jer. 1.10. so, to take the wine-cup of fury from the hand of the Lord, and to cause all Nations to drink it, Jer. 25. but in this they were no Vial-Angels, as to the execution of any temporal and real plagues. So the sack-cloth-Witnesses, in smiting the earth, what did they? they prophesied against many people's, and nations, and tongues, and kings: Rev. 10.9, 10, 11. In this way I confess they poured out Vials, smote the earth, turned waters into blood, etc. but not otherwise.  
I might add, how Jerusalem (her Walls, Temple, Sacrifices, People, etc.) was smitten, and turned into blood as by Nabuchadnezzar, so by the Prophets too. Now we all know, this was not done neither at one time, nor alike: what the later did, was by mouth, prophetically; what the other did, was by hand, as making good the word of the Lord in the mouth of his Prophets. So Joash King of Israel, at the Prophet's bidding, took arrows and smote on the ground, 2 Kings 13.17, 18. here was a smiting of the Syrians, and victory over them: yet so, as differing far, from the Plagues and Vials afterwards poured out. For Application, thus: The Sackcloth-Witnesses smite the earth, and have power over waters to turn them into blood: but observe the place; this is done in the days of their prophecy, Rev. 11.6. evidently showing, that what they did was by prophecy, expressed a little before, Chap. 10.11. that is, they foretold the fall of Babylon, Popes, Cardinals, Bishops, Priests, Tithes, Mass, and the rest of her, Fornications: but here was no execution of the last plagues; that was left for others to do afterward; viz. seven Angels come out of the Temple, etc. Rev. 15.  
But again, should I grant (which I do not) that the smiting of the earth, and turning waters into blood, Rev. 11. is for the matter and manner alike with Rev. 16.2, 3, 4. yet this would not prove the same to be all one, in reference either of the Instruments or Time. They were Plagues and Vials which were poured out upon the old world, Sodom, Egypt, etc. yet we all know, they are things distinct and apart. But to come nearer, in Rev. 8.8. it is said, The third part of the sea became blood: are the sackcloth-Witnesses here the instruments? Howsoever I do not think there lies much weight merely in words and phrases, yet it is much better (in my understanding) to refer the Acts of the sackcloth-Witnesses, viz. turning 〈◊〉 into blood, etc. as the effects of the Trumpets, rather than of the Vials.  
I have been the larger in this Point, because the main Ground which the Answerer and others have, in holding the Sackcloth-Witnesses and Vial-Angel all one; it is, for that in Rev. 11.6. mention is made of turning waters into blood, and smiting the earth; and something like it (for it is but something, and very little, as I shall show afterward) expressed, Chap. 16.2, 3, 4. Now truly, in my apprehension, the Foundation is too weak to lay so much weight upon it.  
Lastly, that the earth is smitten, and waters turned into blood, by Waldo, Grosted, Armachan, Wickliff, Huss, Luther, etc. preaching the Word of Truth, and so pouring out a Vial; and other Vials are poured out by Civil Powers, in their Armies, Navies, etc. this is more, I think, then is in the text. For if the Vials are filled with the Gospel of the Kingdom, than I say there is no War in them; if War, than no Gospel: to take them both ways, that cannot be.  
Answ. 3. Besides, if so be (as you say) that Chap. 15. & 16. begin with the full harvest and vintage mentioned Chap. 14. vers. 15, etc. then methinks you do not make the Vials and the 144000 in vers. 1, 2. to contemporize (which is your judgement) because the 144000 in the former part of the Chapter, are up before the full harvest or vintage of the whole earth, mentioned in this later part of the Chapter: and the first, second, and third Angels have work to do, between the rise of the 144000 and the harvest of the earth ripe. But the Vials are begun before the harvest of the whole earth: so that this Exposition cannot be the order of the holy Ghost, in my judgement.  
Repl. I confess, the Truth brings forth no Absurdity or Contradiction; neither do I see how any such thing can be fairly concluded from the Reason.  
For 1. I find not in the Reason, where it is said that the 144000 do contemporize with the Harvest and Vintage. But 2. Let it be so; yet here will follow no Contradiction: for though, in a sense, a man may be said to be before his work, as making himself fit and ready for it; yet may he and his work be together. That the 144000 may be risen before the harvest of the earth is ripe; I say, suppose this, (though I hold it not) yet may the 144000 contemporize with the harvest, as being the Reapers thereof.  
2. That three Angels have work to do between the rise of the 144000 and the harvest; to this I say, 1. The Angels are of the number of the 144000; for that is a Type of the Lords whole host mustered against Babylon. 2. For the work there, of the three Angels, it belongs to the Harvest (as part of it) now ready to be reaped. Compare Rev. 18.4. Deut. 20.10, 11, 12.  
3. The Scripture will warrant us to say, that the Harvest of the earth was ripe at the rising of the Witnesses. When the four hundred years were expired, which the Lord speaks of unto Abraham, Gen. 15.13. the iniquity of the Amorites was then full: so the forty and two months being out, the Beasts dominion is ripe. As a field of Corn is not cut down assoon as it is ripe, neither is it cut down all together, but by degrees: so Babylon, though ripe at the rising of the Witnesses, (the forty and two months of her reign being ended) nevertheless, as the Beasts dominion shall not be destroyed all at one time, so there will be some preparation to the work, (as Rev. 14.6, 7, 8, 9 and 18.1, 2, 3, 4.) as well as the execution of it. True it is, if we consider the times of Waldo, Wickliff, Grostead, Armachan, etc. the harvest than was not ripe, and therefore they could not be any of the seven Angels, Rev. 15. for the whole dominion of the Beast must be ripe, before any of the seven last plagues will be poured out.  
Answ. 4. Moreover, if this your interpretation were the genuine sense, I suppose every Vial would be an universal Vial, as on the whole earth: but it is very apparent, that every Vial is not an universal Vial, nor any, until the Armageddon-day. And therefore some think, (upon good grounds) this in Rev. 14.14. of the harvest of the whole earth, and that of the Armageddon, Rev. 19 contemporize.  
Repl. 1. If any such thing may be inferred from the Reason, it is otherwise then I hold; for I hold the contrary. Indeed, this I have said, and am still of the opinion: 1. Though no Vial be universal, yet wheresoever any falls, (whether first, second, third, etc.) the effects thereof shall be such, on the subject where it is poured, that whatsoever Idolatry and Tyranny is thereby suppressed and put down, the same shall be there no more.  
2. Though I think no Vial universal, yet this I think, that by earth, Rev. 16.2. is not meant the grosser parts of Popery, viz. Masses, Pilgrimages, Indulgences, Transubstantiation, praying to Saints, etc. the word earth is often used in this Book, and elsewhere; but never, to my knowledge, is it taken in such a sense, viz. for half, or part of the whole. And therefore, as I said, though no Vial be universal, (as extending everywhere and in all places) yet in some sort universal, that is, wheresoever any Vial falls, not only there shall the grosser and greater parts of Idolatry be destroyed, but the finer and lesser, (as some call it) that is, all the fornications of the Whore, root and branch. As for the present, I see nothing yet, that looks like a Vial. We may take up our complaint in the Prophet's words: Like as a woman with child, that draweth near the time of her delivery, is in pain, and cryeth out in her pangs: so have we been in thy sight, O Lord: we have been with child, we have been in pain; we have as it were brought forth wind: we have not wrought any deliverance in the earth, neither have the inhabitants of the world fallen. Isai. 26.17, 18.  
3. That some think the harvest of the whole earth, Rev. 14.14. and that of Armageddon, Rev. 19 contemporize; it is true: but that it is (as you say) upon good ground, this I question: For the holy Ghost there, makes a plain distinction between the harvest and the vintage; and the former to be meant of the Beasts dominion, which shall perish under the five first Vials; the later, which gins at vers. 17. belongs to the Armageddon-battel, Rev. 19 and falls under the seventh Vial, and part of the sixth.  
Answ. 5. And lastly, I think there is a mistake in what you say in the margin, that the 144000 are the Angels of the Vials, seeing the holy Ghost speaks of them besides, as the remnant of the woman's seed, Rev. 12. ult. and the called, faithful, and chosen, Rev. 17.15. (who I know shall go along with the execution, and serve in it) but he speaks in the singular number of Angel to every Vial, and never above two, as in the third Vial. So that I neither incline to the two Witnesses, as I said before, with whom the remnant go along, and to whom the power of the plagues is given as oft as they will, Rev. 11.6.  
Repl. First, (as I said even now) I take the 144000 to be an Universal Type, representing the persons of all the Saints, who after the rising of the Witnesses shall follow the Lamb in executing the vengeance of the Lord, and the vengeance of his Temple upon Babylon, the people whom he shall create for his praise, Psal. 102.18. that is, the Angels, Chap. 14, & 15, & 16. So the called, chosen and faithful, Chap. 17. 14. and the Angel, Chap. 18. 1, 2, etc. it is the same number that were sealed, Chap. 6.4. and why not the like significant Type?  
2. If I do not mistake you, the remnant of the woman's seed, and the one hundred forty and four thousand, you make to be all one: But to this I agree not: for, 1. The War in Rev. 12. ult. is the Dragon's; this, the Lamb's. 2. There, he first fights; but here, others begin with him. 3. That War seems to be before the rising of the Witnesses: The Dragon not prevailing against the woman in the wilderness, falls upon her seed, nearer home; a remnant, which did not at all fly into the wilderness; the woman being weak, (and therefore called the weaker vessel, 1 Pet. 3.7.) and unable to make resistance against the Dragon's wrath in the Beast, seeks by flight to save herself: But the remnant of her seed, that is, a generation after, through providence have opportunity and advantage to withstand him, without escaping in such a way. And this war of the Dragon with the remnant of the woman's seed, Rev. 12. ult. may probably have some reference to the Swethen wars in Germany; so unto ours, and to the Civil wars in France, the Netherlands, etc.  
But 3. I do not well know what you mean, by saying The holy Ghost speaks in the singular number, of Angel, to every Vial, etc. Do you mean, that the 144000 cannot be the Angels, Chap. 16. because the number is too great? If you understand (as I think you do) by the first Angel, all the Witnesses from Waldo to Luther, it will exceed by far the number here. Besides, though I hold the seven Angels to be a part of that company; yet I do not say the seven Angels are the whole number, much less that every Angel takes in the one hundred forty and four thousand.  
Lastly, whereas you say, I rather incline to the two Witnesses, etc. for my part, I think, if their persons, work, and time, be duly weighed by you, your inclination will be some other way.  
Answ. 1. The preaching of the Gospel is (as you say) very sweet; and yet, for all that, very bitter, and full of plague, in the effects thereof, to the enemies of Christ: for so was Christ's own preaching a great plague to the Pharisees, Rulers, and Jews. Now we say, The effects thereof were plagues to the Popish earthlings, in Grosted's, Wickliff's, Waldo's, Huss and Luther's time, and made them rage, fret, storm, burn, and break out into filthy ulcers, diseases and distempers; and so there fell upon them a real and proper plague under this Vial: and God's wrath upon them, was so eminently seen, that Bellarmine himself says, That ever since Luther, and those Men preached the Pope to be Antichrist, their Church decreased, and many fell from it.  
Repl. 1. It gives cause of suspicion, That a Text is wrested, when it is alone, and hath not another to help it: as I said before, by Earth, Rev. 16.2. to understand the grosser part of Popery; I question, whether such an Exposition can be confirmed by the mouth of two or three Witnesses. So here, if this Text by Consequences and Effects prove the Cause, it stands alone, (by itself) for aught I know. The Text saith, And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven Angels having the seven last plagues: for in them is filled up the wrath of God, Rev. 15.1. Not one word here of Effects, but what is in the Vials, to be wrath; full of the wrath of God. No Gospel so much as named.  
2. Howsoever I grant, (as being most true) it is possible for men in the hearing of the Word, to be thereby more wicked and vile, than they were before; yet the Word is no Vial of wrath, neither are the Publishers, Angels of Vials of wrath: the Cause is not in the Word, nor in the Angels; but by accident: as when purblind people come forth into the Sun, their sight is hereby darker, and more obscure, not that the Sun is the cause, but the cause and fault is in themselves.  
That the Pharisees, Rulers and Jews; so the Popish Earthlings in hearing the Word, by accident, were blinded; it's true: but to conclude therefore, (as it must be so, or it's nothing to the matter) That either Christ, Grosted, Wickliff, Waldo, Luther, etc. were Angels of wrath, and it was the wrath of God which they poured out of their Vials; Here I hope, men will be rather sober than rash. True it is, Mr. Tilling. saith, The matter of each Vial is pure wrath; yea, full wrath, as Chap. 15. 1, 7. Chap. 16.1. Then I say, No Vial is poured out in preaching the Doctrines of Christ: for the ●●tter of the Gospel is not pure and full wrath.  
3. That the Popish Earthlings through the preaching of Grosted, Wickliff, Waldo, Luther, etc. did rage, fret, storm; broke out into filthy ulcers, etc. it being nothing to the matter, I leave it. Howbeit, I could say much against it, as it is applied: but let the effects of their preaching be as you say, yet this proves no Vial; For 1. there was preaching and writing against the Popish Earthlings, long before any of them, even from the first rise of the Beast, with the like effects. Consequently then, the Vials must take their beginning from the first rising of the Beast. 2. Such effects of preaching belongs not to the Vials. If we bring Waldo, Grosted, Wickliff, Luther, etc. to the Trumpets, here we shall find some sutableness and accord, as to the Time, Persons, Work and Effects.  
4. It was no wrath of a Vial, that Bellarmine either saw or spoke of: for when the time comes, that these Vials shall be poured out, the Priests (whether in Rome or England) will have little leisure or heart to write Books against the Interest and Cause of Christ, (or aught else in that kind) but study rather how to escape the consuming fire every way about them, Rev. 18.15, 16. Isa. 13.7, 8. Jer. 50.46.  
Answ. 2. Secondly, we assent to you also, that those good men before mentioned, did eat up the Book, and prophesy, as Rev. 10.8, 9, 10, 11. before or against many People's, Kings and Nations. Now the eating of the Book and prophesying, was the preparing of it; but when it was opened, than the Vials come out, and so executed God's wrath upon that Generation; so that both these will stand together, viz. the prophesying, and the plaguing them, as the effects of their prophesying: for all the Angels of the Vials must eat the Book.  
Rep. What is meant by their prophesying, I have showed before: Now there is something here, which I do not well understand.  
1. How eating the Book and prophesying, should be before the Book is open. I think rather, the Book must be opened first, and prophesying follows after, Act. 8.30, 31. Ephes. 4.10, 11.  
Neither 2. do I know the distinction between prophesying as preparing, then opening the Book for the Vials to come out. As for Waldo, Wickliff, Luther, etc. they had no Vials of wrath, nor did they prepare any such thing for the Nations: they neither intended nor desired men's destruction, but rather their peace, health, life and salvation in Jesus Christ. It is true, the Angels of the 7 last plagues, will come out to execute God's wrath: this I say will be their work, for to make way for the everlasting Gospel to be preached, unto every Nation, and Kindred, and Tongue, and People; a work altogether different from the Witnesses prophesying in sackcloth.  
3. If all the Angels of the Vials must eat the Book, it will hardly be proved, whether some who are held to be the Angels, did ever eat that Book: for if the Tree be known by the Fruit, they were so far from eating it, as that they were visible and professed persecutors of such as in truth did eat the same.  
Lastly, Howsoever I believe that all the Angels of the Vials shall be wonderfully enlightened with the knowledge of the times, as to see their works and move plainly before them, far beyond what either Waldo, Wickliff, Armachan, Huss, Luther, etc. had; yet that eating of the Book, Rev. 10.9, 10. is another thing, then properly to be applied to any Angels of the Vials.  
Answ. It is not preaching alone, or the ministerial witness only, that plagued them; but the magistratical also; who joined with the ministerial in every Generation: so that the 2 witnesses were together in their effects or plagues that fell upon them. And therefore your second Reason in my Opinion is somewhat uncertain, and upon a mistaken Ground or Principal.  
Repl. 1. There is nothing in this Answer, (should it be all granted) to the matter. For though Ministers and Magistrates join together against the power of the Beast, it doth not follow, therefore together they pour out any one of the last plagues.  
2. Should I follow you, and begin at Waldo, and so downward to our times, I could show you (if need were) not in every Generation did the magistratical and ministerial witnesses join together. For in several Ages the faithful Servants of Christ had no aid or secure from the civil Powers at all, much less helped them to plague the Whore.  
3. For some of those Vials (which you apply) as poured out by the ministerial and magistratical witnesses joined together, I think they were rather the actions of the Antichristians themselves, one plaguing another, for worldly and base respects.  
Lastly, It is a great mistake (I think) to make worldly employment (as wars and fight the Enemy) a work of the sackcloth-witnesses; for their work is prophesying, neither do they smite the Beast's Dominion any other way than spiritually, though it do concern civil things. There are many ways to hold forth a witness and Testimony for Jesus Christ: but for that place in Rev. 11.3, 6. it takes in no magistratical witness, if the thing be merely civil: And this is plain in the very Text, They shall prophesy 1260 days. Again, In the days of their prophecy, etc.  
And here it will not be amiss to declare briefly my Opinion concerning the 2 witnesses, Rev. 11. The witnesses I take to be a Generation-Confession or Testimony in the behalf of Christ, against the Idolatries and Blasphemies of the Beast, and all his Helpers, during the time of the 42 months. I call it first a Confession, to distinguish a Testimony from a Truth. A man may profess and practise many excellent and eminent Truths, and yet not have the Testimony of Jesus, Rev. 12.17. for this consisteth in declaring against the evils of persons and things. Secondly, I call it a Generation-witness, because it must be proper to a man's own time, viz. as to own what is of God, then opposed and persecuted; and what is of the Dragon and Beast, countenanced, commanded, authorized, then to testify against it: and if we do not this, we are no Generation-Confessors, or Witnesses. I say, whatsoever Truth, otherwise, we acknowledge, it is not to the matter, Rev. 11. Joh. 1.7, 8. Act. 1.8. & 4.19, 20. & 13.31. & 8.25. & 18.5. & 23.11. 1 Tim. 6.3. Rev. 1.2, 9 & 6.9. As a Soldier, if he see the Enemy dead at his foot, will not stand cutting and hacking of him; but leaving him, follows and fights the standing Enemy: so to declare against Idolatry and Tyranny which is already put down (and nothing else;) this is not Soldierlike, and as becomes a brave Champion of Christ: it must be (to be a Witness indeed) the living and standing abominations of our present time, which we must boldly and openly testify against.  
Again, they are said to be two Witnesses, not in reference to Magistracy and Ministry; but two, as to the things either witnessed for or against; that is, as being comprised in two heads, (neither more nor less:) 1. Ecclesiastical, or Spiritual: 2. Civil, or Secular.  
Now whereas near or toward the end of the 1260 days, this twofold Witness shall rise and speak out with more clearness, and in the Demonstration of the Spirit, and of power, than before; suddenly and strangely it shall be slain: which slaying I take to be no other way, then in the Testimony; that is, Christ's witness, so high and eminent before, is knocked in the head. In some, it is slain through Preferment, Honour, great Places: In others, through a Base spirit, and Fear of sufferings: In others, through Bonds and Imprisonment: In some, through Hypocrisy, Apostasy, and a fearful Departing from God. So that the Witnesses relate not to the persons of men, (for the person may live, though his Witness be slain) neither to any Office or Calling, (whether Magistracy or Ministry) but meant of a Generation-testimony for Truth and Righteousness, against all Ungodliness and Unrighteousness of men.    

Answer to the third Reason. To your third Reason, the integral of which lies in the marginal Question, What reason there is, to begin there, as you say, and not after nor before; I answer, 1. Because, till then, the Beast was not grownfull enough for the Vials: but then he was at a full growth, and all the world wondered after him.  
Repl. 1. Here again you are much mistaken, to think that the Beast was grown full enough for the Vials, in the times of Waldo, Wickliff, Huss, Luther, etc. For he comes not to his growth for the Vials, till the time of his reign be expired, that is, the forty and two months. The sins of the Amorites, no doubt, were many and great, in Abraham's time; yet not grown full enough for the Vials, till the four hundred years were expired, Gen. 15.13, 16. To make the iniquity either of a Person or State full, the time must run out which God hath appointed.  
Hence than I might frame this Argument: 
Till the Beast be grown full for the Vials, they are not to be poured out upon him. (So you.)  
But till the forty and two months are expired, the Beast is not grown full enough for the Vials. (So the Scripture.)  
Therefore none of the Vials are to be poured out upon the Beast till the forty and two months are expired.   
But 2. had you said that the Beast in Waldo's or Luther's time, was grown full enough, as to be discovered and known to be the Beast; therein I would agree with you: but begin else where you will, (for it is all one) whether at Waldo or Luther, or four hundred years before either of them, the Beast might be said to be grown full enough for the Vials; the time only excepted, which is the main thing.  
Answ. 2. Because then (and not before or after) the gross earth of Papacy, in all manner of filthy trash, etc. appeared in height eminently, and most universally, as the adequate subject of the first Vial.  
Repl. 1. I have once or twice touched this wrest-interpretation; and the rather, lest we should fall into the fault of our forefathers, who, because Errors for a while had passed currant from hand to hand, at length believed them, without any trial. That by earth, Rev. 16.2. should be meant the grosser parts of Popery, truly in my opinion, it is as weakly gathered from that place, as a thing can be. For among the several acceptations of the word (earth) in Scripture, not one will be found to second such a sense. It is no good way, to have the Scriptures follow things; but rather, let things follow the Scriptures. Because we see, by the preaching of Waldo, Wickliff, Armachan, Huss, Luther, etc. nothing fell, but a little of the grosser part of Popery: therefore we must expound earth to be that grosser part of Popery: this is not to give pre-eminence to the Scriptures: but, on the other hand, when the Word hath its latitude, fullness, perfection; to apply then what is suitable and agreeable to that, this is to give honour to whom honour is due.  
But 2. and to come nearer to the Answer: Then (say you) and not before or after. Truly I think, this will not appear so, in either of your ways; though by earth we should understand the grosser parts of Popery.  
For 1. The grosser part of Popery appeared in height, eminently and universally, some hundred years even before Waldo, (yea, and witnessed against) as in his time, though not so publicly, boldly, and clearly opposed, as then. 2. Neither did the good men you mention, put down the grosser part of Popery; it remained in most places in height, eminently and universally, as before. It is, in my opinion, a strange sense, that by earth should be meant the grosser part of Popery, as the adequate subject of the first Vial; and Waldo, Wickliff, Armachan, Grosted, Huss, Luther, etc. the Angel of it; and yet the earth (the adequate subject of the Vial) not touched in most places, as to the destroying and rooting of it up. 3. To say, Nor after, I may say, What meaneth then the bleating of the sheep? etc. Is there not, in Rome, Italy, France, Spain, Germany, Poland, etc. as much of this gross earth, as was in Waldo's or Luther's time?  
Answ. 3. Because then (and not before or after) were the effects of the first Vial, viz. plague-sores, burning, broiling, raging ulcers, breaking out, and begun to appear.  
Repl. To let pass what is supposed, but not proved, viz. that the Sackcloth-witnesses are Vial-angels; the plague-sores, burning, broiling, etc. Rev. 16.2. the effects of Waldo's and Luther's preaching: I say, The Beast raged, and had such sores and boils upon him, (as you speak of) many hundred years before their times; occasioned by other Witnesses, who spoke boldly against the Tyranny and Idolatry of the See of Rome. I could name many who suffered for their faithful Testimony this way. 2. The Brownists, Anabaptists, Non-conformists, etc. (as they are called) by their Doctrines and Practices, smote the earth, (as you understand) more eminently and effectually then either Waldo or Luther did; and yet these came forth after them. And, to speak the truth, to begin the Vials at these men, it hath more show of something like a Vial, than the other. For, to bring in Grosted and Armachan, and such men, as Angels clothed in pure and fine linen, and having their breasts girded with golden girdles; the odds and disparity (in my opinion) is too great as once to be named.  
Answ. 4. Because till then, the seventh part of the sixth Trumpet, or the plagues by the hands of the Turks, (Rev. 9.14, 15, 16, etc. the four Angels loosed from the river Euphrates) were executing upon the Papists; so that these last plagues began not before: and that they began not after, I suppose the effects of Grostead, Armachan, Waldo, (whom we exclude not) Wickcliff 's, hus 's, Luther 's preaching, easily prove. That is a mistake, to think we leave out Waldo, or the Witnesses of his time, seeing we apply it not to persons, but to Witnesses. And seeing the earth (the subject of this first Vial) was so universal, viz. in all carnal Christendom, etc.  
Repl. 1. In saying, that Waldo, Wickliff, Armachan, etc. began the Vials under part of the sixth Trumpet, you quite lose the matter so much pleaded for; because the Vials begin not till the beginning of the seventh Trumpet, as the Trumpets begin not till the opening of the seventh Seal, Rev. 8.1, 2, 3. So then, according to the time which you apply them to, they may be Angels (and indeed, I think so they were) of the Trumpets, but not Angels of the seven last plagues.  
2. I do not see what Ground there is, in the least, to take the beginning of the Vials from the Turks executing plagues upon the Papists: for the Papists were plagued by them, both before Waldo's time, and long after. Besides, for the four Angels loosed from the river Euphrates, though I consent with you, that the Saracens and Turks are there meant; yet to what time the place should be applied, it is doubtful. Brightman refers it to the rise of the Ottoman Empire, about the year 1300: and gathers, that the power of the Turks shall continue to the year 1696, and then finally be broken. Mede thinks the four Angels signify so many Sultan's or Kingdoms into which the Turks were divided, when first having passed over Euphrates, they had spread themselves into the neighbouring Coasts of Asia and Syria, about the year 1080. Others ascend higher, even to mohammed himself, the first Author of the Eastern Impieties and Blasphemies, about anno 620. So Bullinger, Illiricus, Pareus, Mayer, etc. And, in my opinion, they have the better ground who take it thus: which was many hundred years before Waldo's time.  
Lastly, whereas you say, It is a mistake, to think we leave out Waldo, or the Witnesses of his time, seeing we apply it not to Persons, but to Witnesses: First, then, here you differ from Mr Tilling. who saith expressly, The times of Wickliff, Huss, the Waldenses and Albigenses, could not be any part of this Vial; and therefore strictly gins at Luther. 2. Seeing the Witnesses were to prophesy in Sackcloth 1260 days, (the whole time of the Beast's reign) I see no reason (according to your opinion) why any of the Witnesses should be left out; but to begin the Vials at the beginning of the 1260 days, with the first Witnesses.   

Answer to the fourth Reason. There is (I conceive) considerable reason to allow more time to the first Vial then to the last, for their pouring out; seeing first, every true motus est velocior in fine.  
Repl. 1. This Answer is two ways defective. For, 1. The Question is not, Why more time is allowed to the first; but, Why more to the first, then to the six other Vials. 2. Neither is the Question simply about the time, but why four or five hundred years are allowed to the first Vial, and not one hundred to all the rest.  
2. For the Rule which you bring from a Natural Cause, as it proves nothing in things Spiritual and Divine, so it is not rationally true, as you apply it. For suppose seven men shoot one after another, (or together) it will not follow, that his Arrow which went out last, flies faster and swifter than the first. It is true, as every Arrow comes nearer the Centre, so the motion may be said to be the speedier. These seven Angels are distinct; they have not one motion: and therefore if any thing may be gathered from that Rule, it is applicable only to each Vial, as a part and independent.  
Answ. 2. Seeing the subject of the first Vial, viz. the earth, was so universal, and took up so much ground at that day.  
Repl. Not to repeat things over and over, how ungroundedly (in my opinion) the first Vial is interpreted; I say, 1. By earth, Rev. 16.2. to understand it universal, is against the Text. True it is, vers. 1. earth there is universal; but as the subjects of the other Vials, viz. sea, fountains, sun, the Throne of the Beast, Euphrates, are not universal, but limited: so earth, Rev. 16.2. is not universal, but restrained to a particular subject. 2. Be it granted, (though it is not so) that the earth is universal; yet I see no reason therefore to conclude, that it must take up so much time, viz. three or four hundred years more than the other Vials: especially considering, 1. That the subject of the first Vial is only the grosser part of Popery, the lesser part, and so the easier and sooner to be smitten. Then 2. The last Vials contain the whole affairs of the Jews; a thing more universal, and for importance far beyond the first, as it is applied.  
Lastly, to take the earth for the grosser part of Popery, and universal; seeing since the first Vial began to be poured forth, there are past four or five hundred years, and this earth notwithstanding in most places yet untouched; there may be allowed as much time more, (viz. four or five hundred years) before by the effects it may prove to be a Vial.  
Answ. 3. Seeing the effects of the first Vial arose in a different manner from the following, namely, ex se, as the Greek intimates, the ulcers arising out of their own bodies, were the subjects of this first Vial; whereas the effects of the following Vials, were from others; theirs from within, them from without. Now the subsequent Vials must needs be with quicker dispatch than this Vial, because a sore or ulcer is rising by degrees to a head or perfection, and so takes up a long time; whereas the cutting off with the sword, and by other hands, etc. makes a quicker work and end of it.  
Repl. Not knowing where the strength of this Answer lies, it is possible I may not hit it. Howsoever,  
1. Though the holy Ghost, speaking of the effects of the first Vial, mentioneth a noisome and grievous sore, (or, as the Greek reads, evil and wicked) alluding to the sixth plague of Egypt, Exod. 9.10. yet I think this is not to be taken in the letter, but metaphorically; and so the application impertinent and improper. Some indeed expound the sores to be the Neapolitan disease that came upon the Beasts warriors, Anno 1494. But the Answerer (I know) doth not take it so.  
2. Should I grant the Comparison, viz. between a sore rising by degrees, etc. and cutting off with the sword; yet I do not see, that therefore the subsequent Vials must needs be with quicker dispatch than the first. For, 1. My opinion is, that the effects of every Vial, will be cutting off by the sword; and so all alike, as to the matter and kind of plagues; though as to persons and things, more may be cut off under one Vial, then under another. 2. Neither is the comparison always true: for a Plague-sore may assoon dispatch a man, as the sword; and without taking up longer time.  
Answ. 5. Another Reason is, the want of the measure of the spirit of life in the first and second Vials, which is given to them that execute the last. Now the more Spirit, the more speed. So that it must needs be, that more time is allowed for the pouring out of the first, then of the last, according as the Spirit from on high, in a more greater measure.  
Repl. 1. It was a great fault, which is charged on some of the Spies, that they brought up an evil report of the Land which they had searched, unto the children of Israel, Num. 13.32. I think there is more here, then is meet, imputed to the first Angels, as if the work in their hands would go the slower and harder on, in not having that measure of the Spirit which shall be given afterward to others. I am sure, the Scripture countenanceth no such thing; but they are all alike gifted, spirited, and qualified for the work.  
2. To say that it must needs be, etc. the Consequence follows not: for a man may have the Spirit from on high in more and a greater measure than another, and yet not finish his work assoon as he. The twelve Apostles (and Paul too) after Christ's ascension, had as much of the Spirit (if not more) then the Baptist had; yet more time was allowed them, then to John. There needs no Application.  
Answ. 6. And for that God will cut short his work in righteousness, Rom. 9.28. which is not meant at the beginning, but at the later end God will do it: so that in the last Vials a shorter work is to be expected, according to God's promise, then in the first; and than it is, that for the elects sake, the days shall be shortened. So that in my judgement, there is much reason to allow more time to the first then to the last Vials.  
Repl. 1. Under favour, it is more I think then can be proved, 1. To say positively, By God's cutting short his work, is not meant at the beginning. 2. For the Elects sake, that this must be applied to the last Vials, should a man with the Prophet go into the Sanctuary of God, and humbly inquire in his Temple, I believe he would be taught otherwise. As these are the seven last plagues, so this cutting short is meant from the beginning, till the whole mystery of God be finished: and so for the elects sake, Rev. 11.14. & 10.6, 7. Matth. 24.22.  
2. Touching your judgement, viz. that there is much reason to allow more time to the first, etc. besides what is said, I add, 1. You have missed the Question, which is (as I said before) Why more to the first, then to all the rest? and why so much? 2. Should a man take the like liberty, he might, for your six Reasons, give out as many more, to prove that more time ought to he allowed to the last Vials then to the first, and as much weight and reason in them as I find there.  
Answ. Nor do I find much weight in your allusion to what Willet from Pererius asserts of the 27 or 30 days-time, when the ten plagues fell upon Egypt, intending a day for a year; seeing the holy Ghost made no mention of it there, of the Vials in Scripture: and seeing from the 1290 (which I suppose periods, as Mr Till. saith, with the 1260 days, when you judge the Vials begin) to the year 1335, is 45 years: and seeing it is grounded (in my poor opinion) upon mere presumption and supposition.  
1. It is true, I cited Willet: now whether the holy Ghost doth intent any thing in it, as to the time of the Vials, as I do not affirm it, so, for your saying it is grounded upon mere presumption, etc. that signifies as little. Howsoever, this further: Add to the thirty days, the days from the last plague of Egypt, to their drowning in the Red-sea, (which might be a Type of the last Vial) I think the number will amount to yours here, viz. 45.  
2. It is true also, that Mr. Till. periods the 1290 with 1260: Not to gainsay what he hath said in the thing; here some Cautions might be minded: 1. Then the 1290 must not be carried to the sixth Vial; for the 1260 periods, before that Vial gins to be poured out. 2. Neither must the coming in of the ten Tribes, be understood of this Period, (whose return in special I think is meant) Rev. 16.12. by the kings of the east, coming from the Land of Sinim, Isai. 49.12. (which we call China) the furthest Empire in all the East. 3. Seeing blindness is to remain on the Jews, until the fullness of the Gentiles come in, Rom. 11.25. I conceive the Beast's dominion must be destroyed, and the everlasting Gospel preached, before any thing very considerable will appear amongst the Jewish nation. So then, taking the 1290 to end with 1260, it must be some low stirring among some few of that People, not appearing so eminent and glorious as the risen Witnesses in their work.  
But lastly, the Answer is short of the Reason: for alluding to the plagues of Egypt, I said, It is probable, when the Vials begin, they will be suddenly all poured out, as were the ten Egyptian plagues. And this is probable: for the Scripture seems plainly to express as much, Rev. 18.8, 10, 17.9.21. Isa. 47.9, 11. But to allow three or four hundred years to the first plague upon the Beasts dominion, before the second gins; I think it is not probable, but as far from Scripture as from the Allusion.   

Answer to the fifth Reason.  
The characters given to the seven Angels, Rev. 15.2, 3. of victory over the Beast, his Image, Mark, etc. all are to be found in all together; but not all together (as I conceive) in one Angel or Generation.  
Repl. 1. The Text allows no such distinction, but expresseth the contrary.  
2. Grant such a Supposition; than it may be supposed, that some of the Angels had overcome, others had not: one had the Beasts mark, another had not: some prophesied clothed in sackcloth, others not, etc. I forbear to mention what strange things might be hence inferred.  
Answ. But 2. In every generation, according to the controversy up against the Beast, his Worship, Image, Mark, etc. the Angels of the Vials have the victory over him and his matters.  
Repl. 1. It doth not appear from Waldo to Luther, (nor yet at this day) that any of the Witnesses got victory over the Beast, whether we consider their Persons or their Testimony, as Rev. 15.2, 3. It is true, in the dark times of Popery, some (through grace) were kept from committing fornication with the Whore, (at least, from much of her grossest blasphemies) but for victory they had not, as may easily be seen, by comparing their times with that text.  
But 2. Taking the word (overcome) in a sense, or large acceptation, so indeed a Christian holding forth his Testimony against the errors and corruptions of men, though imprisoned, banished, murdered, etc. may be said to overcome; but this must be understood as to his witness, faithfulness, constancy, etc. Not that the Enemy thereby was overcomed, and put to silence, and the errors and corruptions no more practised, as Rev. 15.2, 3. intends. Mr. Tillingh. on the place, hath these words: The meaning is, (saith he) as I conceive, that Saints immediately before the Vials begin to be poured out, shall so far have gotten the victory over the Beast, as concerns either the safety of their own persons, or the doing of their work: Antichrist shall not have power over them, to make them subject themselves to him, allow of his Image, Mark, the Number of his Name, or else to persecute them, or kill them with the sword, as in former times he hath done: nor shall he have such a power, as to hinder them in the work they are about, of pouring out the Vials.  
I think, from this, a man may fairly conclude, that the Vials begun not with Waldo, nor Luther, nor yet are begun. For Saints have not gotten victory over the Beast, so far as concerns their safety either of body or soul. They have been, from their days, hitherto all along, persecuted and killed; and the work they were going about, stopped continually. The million of Martyrs since Waldo, viz. in France, Germany, the Netherlands, Italy, Spain, Bohemia, England, etc. is proof enough: And therefore, in my understanding, there is very little reason to begin there, the victory of the Saints over the Beast, where the Beast begun his victory and triumph by slaughter over the Saints.  
It is worthy of memory, that in the time of the Sackcloth-Witnesses, when the people of God were under cruel persecution, they made use of that Prophecy, (as then proper to them) Rev. 13.7. And it was given unto him to make war with the Saints, and to overcome them: this they applied as an argument of comfort and constancy. This being so, how that should be the time, wherein Saints had gotten victory over the Beast, as to the safety of their own persons, etc. and in regard of so great deliverance and enlargement, sung the song of Moses, etc. even then when the Beast made war with them, and OVERCAME THEM: I say, How these two things can stand together, viz. the Beasts victory over the Saints, Rev. 13.7. and the Saints victory over the Beast, Rev. 15.2, 3. as to be in respect of time and persons all one; truly this, or my understanding, is much out of the way.  
Thus far I agree with that holy man, That before the Vials begin to be poured out, the Lord will so fit and spirit his Angels for the work, as they shall go prosperously forward: Neither shall the Beast, or any of his Helpers, after they begin to be poured out, prevail against the interest of Jesus Christ or his people, in any Nation under the Sun.  
Answ. So 3. Mr. Till. Waldo, Grosted, Luther, were qualified in their several Ages and Generations, having victory over the Beast, and his Mark, and the number of his Name, (then reigning, and resisting the truth and faith of Christ) as over Popes, Cardinals, Prelates, Mass-Priests, Masses, Indulgences, the Whore's Cup, Pilgrimages, Transubstantiation, Ceremonies, Superstitions, and a world of Popish trash, which were rife, and which they witnessed against in their days: so that, according to the height and degree of the Testimony and Controversy, they had the victory over the Beast, &c: and held the harps of God in their hands: yea, they were ( their Generation) the called, faithful, and chosen, the upright hearts, followers of the Lamb, redeemed from men, first-fruits to God and the Lamb, that left all for him, denied themselves, took up the cross, and followed him wherever he went, in the witness of their days against the Beast, and overcome him; and so (as I humbly suppose) did sweetly answer the Characters of the holy Ghost: besides, had light in their preaching, and so (with others) poured out the Vial upon the Beast, viz. the earth, or gross element.  
Repl. This being no more (though more words) than what was said before, I shall be the briefer.  
1. Whatsoever was done by Waldo, Grosted, Luther, etc. against Popes, Cardinals, Prelates, Priests, was no other victory then in the sense I named before.  
2. Neither did they find fault with the Places, Offices, and Callings of such men, (though unlawful and Antichristian) but for some abuses and miscarriages therein. It is well known, that Armachan, Grosted, and others, were Prelates, Priests, Mass-Priests; and never renounced their Calling.  
So 3. For many of the particulars here set down, they bore no Testimony against them, but allowed and practised a multitude of Ceremonies, Superstitions, and Popish trash.  
4. To say they had the harps of God in their hands; here again I am at a loss. Whilst the Jews were in Babylon, they hanged their harps upon the willows, Psal. 137.2. Indeed, when the Lord turned again the Captivity of Zion, then was their mouth filled with laughter, and their tongue with singing, Psal. 126.1, 2. I had thought that the harps of God come not into the hands of Saints, till after the rising of the Witnesses: But by this, it seems, whether before or after, the times are all one, as to Victory, Triumph, sing, etc. only in measure and degree some odds. Poor encouragement and comfort for such who expect to have all things new!  
5. I think, what is said of Waldo, Grosted, Luther, and others, as to be the called, chosen, and faithful, followers of Lamb, redeemed from men, first-fruits to God and to the Lamb, etc. it is more than their due, if referred to Rev. 17.14. and Chap. 14.3, 4, 5. It is said of Job, that he was a perfect man, upright, one that feared God, and eschewed evil, Job 1.1. Now howsoever the like may be said of others, and truly too; yet it would be absurd to say, that in that Text they are so described. Whatsoever these men were in their Generation, (I say, to give them their due to the full) none of the Characters in Rev. 14 & 15. belong to them, viz. the matter there, it relates not to them. Besides, it is a great darkening of the holy Prophecies, and destroys all Order, to apply to the last times, things passed many hundred years before.  
Answ. And yet 4. I do not find a perfection or full answer to these Characters in every point, as having the full victory and triumph over the Beast till the Armageddon-battel be over, or the seventh Vial. So that for these and some other Reasons, I think your fifth is of no force.  
Repl. 1. Seeing neither Waldo, Grosted, Luther, etc. had the Characters, and so consequently were none of the seven Angels; it is nothing to our matter, whether there shall be perfection and full victory, or not, till the Armageddon-battel.  
But 2. To give some light here, (according to the light I have received) That which you call perfection or full victory, as to the Characters, is to be considered two ways. 1. Particular; and thus the effects of every Vial shall be perfect and full, according to the subject; not one Vial to carry on and perfect, what was left by the other unfinished. 2. Universal, that is, when the last Vial is poured out, all is done, as Rev. 16.17.  
It hath been thought, (but whence taken, I know not) the first and second Vials not being full and perfect; the third and fourth falling on the subjects of the former, are to finish what the other left undone: and this is one great cause of men's mistake about the beginning of the Vials; which is neither so, nor so.   

Answer to the sixth Reason.  
This seems somewhat considerable, and genuous; yea, at first sight, to have much force: yet I must confess, I am not satisfied with it. For, 1. I think, the Tabernacle of the Testimony is opened gradually, (as the Witness or Testimony rise) out of which the Angels of the Vials go, Rev. 15. So that in every generation, such a Tabernacle hath been opened, with the Testimony against the Beast, in proportion more or less, whence the Vials have issued: and therefore I must deny the Assumption of your Argument, and say, The Tabernacle of the Testimony was in a degree opened in Luther's time, in the Brownists time, and is at this day against the Beast, in a proportionable purity and spirituality of Worship, amongst the remnant of the woman's seed; and so Wickliff, Huss, Luther, Zuinglius, the Puritans (so called) Independents, and others, and now the holy and upright ones, called The Fifth Monarchy-men, were in the Tabernacle of the Testimony worshipping, whence the Angels of the Vials come out.  
Repl. 1. If I understand any thing of this Answer, it implies 2 things: 1. The Testimony of the Tabernacle in heaven, was never shut whilst the sackcloth Witnesses prophesied the 1260 days: for if in every generation, such a Tabernacle hath been opened, with the Testimony against the Beast, in proportion more or less, etc. admit it were gradually; The Conclusion cannot be denied. 2. That the pouring out of the Vials, hath been ever since the sackcloth Witnesses began to prophesy, and so began with the 1260 days. Neither is it strange, that such things should pass; for taking the Vials to begin before the rising of the Witnesses, it cannot be avoided.  
2. Now the Reason (I conceive) of this mistake, is, not observing (though the Scripture is clear in it) the distinction which the Holy Ghost makes between the Temple and the Tabernacle of the Testimony. It is true, the Witnesses, and the Woman in the Wilderness, had a Temple to worship God in, and an Altar, (which is Christ) by which to have access to the Father: See Rev. 11.1. which seems to be the same, Chap. 12.6, 14. viz. the place prepared of God, for their feeding and nourishment. But for the Tabernacle of the Testimony; that is, the innermost part of the Tabernacle, called, the holy of holiest, and the most holy place, where the 2 Tables were put in the Ark, Deut. 10.5. 1 King. 8.5. and that Ark placed in the innermost part of the Tabernacle or Temple, 1 King. 8.6. Heb. 9.3, 4. that remained shut; neither could men see into it, out of the Court or Temple.  
But 3. and more plain, the Answerer is mistaken, in taking the Tabernacle of the Testimony, for the Temple: for these are not only two, and distinct in sound; but as much in sense and signification. What is said in the Answer of Lutherans, Brownists, Independents, Puritans, etc. it is thus far true, That in every Generation a Temple hath been opened, that is, some good people (more or less) seeing the abominable Idolatries and Blasphemies of the Beast, have separated from the same, according to their present Light: and being thus far out of Babylon, have joined together in a more holy Communion. And further, (as the Answerer saith very well) this hath been gradually: for if we consider this Temple, that is, either Church, Ministry, Worship or Government, we shall find it hath been gradual indeed, both in eschewing the Errors of Antichrist, and practising the Truths of the Gospel.  
But now for the Tabernacle of the Testimony, this is another thing within the Temple, and seldom seen, and by the Highpriest alone; which I understand to be the opening of the Prophecies of the last time, as Daniel and John's Visions, such as these, Dan. 12.4, 9, 11, 12. Rev. 11.2. & 12.6, 14. & 13.13. & 22.10. Heb. 2.3. It is not for you (saith Christ) to know the times or the seasons, etc. Act. 1.7. Now it is not meant, as if the Question there propounded by the Apostles, (namely, when the Kingdom should be restored again to Israel) was a secret never to be revealed; but it was not then seasonable, nor necessary or proper for them (as to their Generation) to have the knowledge of it. So the Tabernacle of the Testimony is shut, whilst the Witnesses prophesy in sackcloth, because the things therein belong not to their Work or Age, yet to be opened near or about the time of the end, as being then (and not till then) necessary and seasonable.  
Neither doth Mr. Tilling. in his 3 Proposition, pag. 42. differ from this, speaking, That God's call to the Angels of the Vials is to be principally looked for, out of the Temple. I understand (saith he) not so much of the general call, as a more particular and special Call, peculiar to this time of the Vials. The general Call to Generation-Work is dispensation; but now at this time, (besides the Call of God's Dispensations) the instruments God shall raise up to ruin the Whore, shall have a more particular Call to this Work, to the end they may neither flag nor draw back, namely, the loud and uncessant cry of the Temple.  
Hence two things may be gathered: I. The Vials are not begun; for such a particular and special Call, hath not been yet out of the Temple. It is true, God hath raised up some men, and brought them forth against Babylon; as in France, Germany, England, etc. But this hath been no other than a General Call: for 1. They have not moved nor acted like Angels which had golden girdles upon their breasts. Neither 2. hath God's presence and appearance with them held forth such a thing. Besides, by the event it hath been well enough seen, both in the Work and Instruments, what the Call was. So that we need now no other witness or proof, viz. That neither by the Swedes or English any Vials were poured out, than the things themselves. II. That this particular and special Call out of the Temple, cannot be until the Tabernacle of the Testimony be opened, and the Ark seen: for what else is God's Call to the Angels of the Vials to pour out their Vials, but Light and Life? that is, knowing the 42 months are expired, the witnesses risen; and that it is the day of the Lord's vengeance, and the year of Recompenses for the controversy of Zion; Now as the called of God, they come forth to pour out their golden Vials: not like Jehu, to raise up themselves by other men's ruin, but to follow the Lord fully and faithfully. And this is according to the Prophet, I have commanded my sanctified one's; I have also called my mighty ones for mine anger, even them that rejoice in MY HIGHNESS, Isa. 13.3.  
Answ. 2. I except against your proof, Rev. 11.19. for I do not take that for the Tabernacle of the Testimony, as you assert; but for a full opening of the Temple, in as primitive and purity of state, as the Church was in before the Beast arose, or in the first 3 Centuries, which will not be at the rising of the 2 Witnesses, nor before the Armageddon-battel: but the Tabernacle is opened before the Temple, (as David 's Tabernacle was before Solomon 's Temple.) Now it is the Tabernacle of the Testimony which is opened, and from whence the Vials come; which Tabernacle grows up to the Temple, Eph. 2.21. by degrees: but the Temple, when it is opened, is opened all at once, (I conceive) and universally (not by degrees) and to all the faithful Saints; whereas the Tabernacle, to the Generation-Saints that are faithful to the Testimony.  
Repl. 1. It is no marvel, that taking one thing for another, you may go on thus in mistakes: 1. To suppose that Rev. 11.19. is not one with Rev. 15.5. there is no ground for it: why is it called, the Tabernacle of the Testimony, Numb. 1.5. & 17.17. but in regard of the 2 Tables of Stone, whereon was written (as I said before) the Law of God, the Testimony of his will, Exod. 34.28. and these Tables put into the Ark, and that Ark placed in the uttermost part of the Temple? So that to say the Tabernacle of the Testimony was opened and seen, and not the Ark, in my Opinion is no other, than to imagine, what is within a Chest or Closet may be seen, and is open; but the Chest or Closet itself, neither seen nor open. 2. Whereas you would have the Temple not open, till the Armageddon-battel, but the Tabernacle open before: If things here be duly weighed, the Temple was never shut, but only the Tabernacle of the Testimony: and therefore what you speak of opening the Temple all at once universally, and not by degrees; I find no Temple to apply such matter to. Neither do I know any Tabernacle David had, otherwise than taking care to provide a place for the Ark, 2 Sam. 6.17. Psal. 132.  
Answ. 3. This appears more plain from the time this Temple is opened, which the Holy Ghost tells us in Rev. 11.19. is after the seventh Trumpet sounds, and Proclamation of the Kingdoms of the World to be Christ's, vers. 15. or yet more expressly under the 7 Vial, Rev. 16.17, 18, 21. under which we find the very same voices, thunders, lightnings, Earthquakes, and hail, mentioned in the aforesaid Rev. 11.19. But the Tabernacle of the Testimony must needs be opened before that, as none will deny it.  
Repl. 1. That Rev. 11.19. contemporizes with Chap. 15.5. it is clear to me; neither do I see weight of Reason in what is here objected, namely, That Rev. 11.19. is after the 7 trumpet sounds, and proclamation of the Kingdoms, etc. If a man have several things to speak, he must have time to deliver them one after another; he cannot speak them all at once. Besides, it is an excellent order, which the Spirit of God useth in setting down the Particulars. Having spoken of the risen Witnesses, he shows first what shall be some present effect, vers. 13. then proceeds to the Concomitants, as the beginng of the third work, vers. 14. with the sounding of the 7 trumpet, vers. 15. afterwards declares what joy there shall be in the Churches of the Saints, that the Kingdoms of the world are falling in to Christ, vers. 16, 17, 18. Lastly, that there might be no doubt made of these things, he shows how the work shall be managed and carried on. And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament, etc. vers. 19 agreeing to Rev. 15.5. meaning a clear light which the 7 Angels shall have of their Work, and when to begin.  
2. To bring Rev. 11.19. under the 7 Vial, I think there is no ground for it, 1. Because there is no mention made under that Vial, of the Ark of the Testament opened in heaven: such a thing is not so much as expressed. 2. To gather it from lightnings, voices, thunderings, etc. in both places; This will not hold: for, 1. Such Expressions in this Book are frequent, Rev. 4.5. & 8.5. belonging neither to one time, nor signifying one thing. Moreover, for these lightnings, thunders, voices, etc. they belong to every Vial. Hence in Rev. 11.19. they are first mentioned, as then beginning; afterward, Rev. 16.17, 18, 21. as the end: signifying, That all the time the Vials are pouring out, these things will be; as showing thereby both the nature and effect of every Vial.  
Lastly, If the 1000 years take their beginning, (as M. Till. saith) from the battle of Armageddon; how should the Temple be opened at that time, seeing John speaking of the blessed new Jerusalem-State, saith, and I saw no Temple therein? Rev. 21.22.  
Answ. 4. That is yet more amply expressed by the holy Ghost, that the Vials are begun, before the Temple is opened, Rev. 11.19. because when the Witnesses arise, the very same hour, verse. 13. is the earthquake, that overthrows the tenth part of the Beasts dominion, and seven thousand men are slain. Now this must needs be a Vial or Plague; but this is before the seventh Trumpet blows, or the Temple he opened.  
Repl. 1. How I take the order of things in Rev. 11. I shown before. But I much marvel, why the Answerer should be so strict, as not to admit some things to contemporize, because they stand three or four verses distant one from another: he knows it is usual with the Interpreters of this Book, (and himself doth it too) to carry places back from Chap. 16. to Chap. 9 & 10, 11, 12, etc. Why then so often it must needs be? as if that in v. 19 may not be joined with the rising of the Witnesses; and so the third Woe, and sounding of the seventh trumpet, fall in likewise with the same time.  
2. I am of your opinion, that the earthquake, in which the tenth part of the city fell, is indeed a Vial: and truly I think it is meant of the first Vial,  
1. Because it is presently upon the rising of the Witnesses, and so no other seems to be between it and their rising.  
2. It is an earthquake, or shaking of the earth; that is, earth is the subject of it, the same with Rev. 16.2. Now howsoever I never find the word earth to be taken for the grosser part of Popery, yet often for worldly and earthly persons, as Apostates, Hypocrites, men of corrupt minds, who make gain their godliness, and carry on a self-interest, and base ends, under a form of Religion. Gen. 6.11. Zeph. 3.8. Mal. 4.6. Joh. 3.31. Rev. 12.16. 1 Chron. 16.33. Psal. 82.8. Isai. 11.3. Rev. 13. and 14, 15, 19 This is that earth (I verily think) which Paul by the spirit of prophecy foretells: This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, without natural affection, truce-breakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God, having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof. 2 Tim. 3.1, 2, 3, 4, 5. There are two great Apostasies foretold in Scripture: the first, of things, 1 Tim. 4.1. the later, of persons. Now this later I take to be the earth, the subject of the first Vial, viz. THE GRAND APOSTATES OF THE LAST TIMES. And howsoever there be not in this subject of the first Vial, as much sea, rivers, fountains of waters, &c, as in the following; Nevertheless, what is wanting here in such particulars, is made up in having the more earth. For indeed, it is nothing but earth; an earthly and carnal interest.  
3. My opinion is, where the Witnesses lie three days and a half unburied, that place (as earth) shall be the subject of the first Vial. Now it is well observed by judicious Mede, that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of the City (which in Rev. 11.8. is translated street) cannot be understood of a Marketplace, or any street or broader place within the walls of the city; but without the city, as no part of the great city: and he gives many Reasons for it. So that it seems to me, the place where the Witnesses lie slain being without the city, and so no part of it, cannot be meant of Germany, Italy, Spain, France, etc. for these are either buildings or streets within the walls, but this is without, as bordering upon it; being an inlet or thoroughfare, whereby relief and provision is brought to the great City, and a great helper and prop of the Beast's dominion.  
4. I cannot but take notice, how it is said, Rev. 11.13. The tenth part of the city fell: it is not said, The great city: Now I do not find in all that Book, when the Beast's jurisdiction is mentioned by City, but it is always 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, that great city: which makes me think, that the Tyranny and Idolatry of the Beast, is not here so properly meant, as that earth-State-apostacie, mentioned before. And in very deed, the word GREAT here, is not left out without cause, as not worthy to have GREATNESS given to it, Because, 1. It will be illegitimate, brought forth without law or conscience. 2. It will have nothing of loveliness or beauty in it. 3. Not desired, but by a few temporizers and turn-coats, such as were named before, 2 Tim. 3.2, 3, 4, 5. 4. It will be scandalous to the whole world, and cause that glorious and fearful Name, Jehovah, thy God, everywhere to be blasphemed. 5. It will be upheld by cruelty, injustice, arbitrary power, etc. 6. As it will have a sandy foundation, so it shall soon fall; and great will be the fall thereof.  
5. I think this earth-State-apostacie will be the subject of the first Vial, because the Beast which ascendeth out of the bottomless pit, and by whom the Testimony of Jesus in his servants is slain, is that same Apostasy in 2 Tim. 3.1, 2, etc. and so not the Beast nor his image, Rev. 13. but another, distinct, and more proper to the later Apostasy. In the first Apostasy, viz. under the Beast, Rev. 13. the Faithful shall suffer in their Persons, by burning, hanging, drowning, etc. but under the later Apostasy or Beast, rather the WITNESS itself, than the Persons: for through the depths of Satan, there shall be at this time such an eminent, high, and glorious WITNESS slain, as the like before had not been from the rise of the first Beast.  
Besides, it seems to me, that this Earth-State-Apostacy, doth contemporize with the slaying of the Witnesses, and their lying unburied 3 days and an half:  
1. Because that Apostasy is to be in the last days, 2 Tim. 3.1. Now without doubt, the last days are the 3 days and an half, Rev. 11.8.11. for the Word of God doth not only distinguish between times and times, (viz. as there is a set time to every purpose under heaven) but shows that all Visions and Prophecies shall have their due accomplishment in their appointments. Thus there is a time for the Witnesses to prophesy in sackcloth, which time must be expired before they are slain in their Testimony. Again, their WITNESS being slain, they must lie so long unburied. To be brief, This later Apostasy cannot be referred to the 2 Witnesses prophesying in sackcloth; for that was not the last days, nor after their rising; for then this first Vial is to be poured upon that Earth, as the Subject of it. Therefore of necessity (neither before nor after) it must contemporize with the 3 days and an half: so that three years and an half is the whole time of the later Apostasy, answerable to the time of the slain WITNESS.  
2. Whereas it is said, perilous times shall come, or hard, terrible, grievous, or difficult: this must be understood of a State or Government, not of single persons, who have no Rule or Authority in their hands. But as the first Apostasy or Beast, was a State, Kingdom, Dominion; so is the other.  
My Reasons are, 1. To apply the place to single and inconsiderable persons, (though lovers of themselves, covetous, proud, etc.) this were no more than what hath been in all Ages before, and so to put something impertinent and absurd upon the Holy Spirit. Neither 2. would the time be terrible; for what hurt or damage could the WITNESS suffer by a few naked and unarmed persons, as to the slaying of it?  
It must therefore (to be terrible) be understood, as I said, of a State-Apostacy; and so indeed it will be terrible and hard against the Witness, slay it outright, and let it lie like a dead body in the street.  
First, Because of a multitude of Sycophants and Parasites, who for their belly will say any thing against the WITNESS, having such Earth to reward them for it.  
Secondly, Terrible and hard, because of the cruel Edicts and Laws made against the WITNESS; specially, that it may have no Resurrection.  
Thirdly, this later Apostasy for subtlety and craft will exceed the former: so, that there shall be neither trust nor truth in it. This will be found (
* Sir Henry Vane meditat. c. 23. p. 380.  saith a late writer) by experience, a most certain truth, that Hypocrites and Apostates, when once they come to wilful sinning, and with Saul to discern that God hath left them, and is departed from them (as to what divine presence and fruits of it they had before been made sensible of) none will be more ready to join avowedly with the Devil, and the worst of his Instruments to accomplish their rage against the suffering Saints of Christ. Hence the Beast is said to ascend out of the bottomless pit, Rev. 11.17. Therefore terrible to the WITNESS.  
Lastly, The more perilous, because the grand Apostasy of the last times shall be clothed over with a form of godliness, 2 Tim. 3.5. Hence the Beast having slain the WITNESS, in Churches and Church-Officers, by Promotion, Honour, great Places, etc. he will make use of these Persons to slay It in others: I say, By their Mouths, Pens, Examples, to murder It outright in all places.  
6. To open the words a little further: And the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand; and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven, Rev. 11.13. There are four effects of this Vial.  
1. It reacheth to the carnal Church, Ministry, Worship, and Government, as being part of the Apostasy, and which joined with the Beast in slaying the WITNESS. This is set down in the word TENTH, wherein the holy Ghost closely intimates, how the rise of this earth-apostacy, so far as the Clergy are concerned in it, and should be carried forth with madness (not zeal, like Paul when he was a Persecutor) to slay the WITNESS, both in themselves and others, It would be for the TENTH: for otherwise they would not nave made shipwreck of Faith, and a good Conscience, in betraying so glorious a Cause, to set up THAT SHAME.  
And whereas it is said, The tenth fell; in Scripture very usual, falling is taken for slain, so the Word signifieth in Gen. 14.10. Josh. 8.24, 25. Judg. 8.10. and many other places: in Chron. 21.15. it is said there fell of Israel; for which in 2 Sam. 24.15. it is written there died. And probable, as this TENTH will be a main cause of slaying the WITNESS: so when the Witnesses shall stand upon their Feet, some eminent death will be executed upon it. We to him that coveteth an evil covetousness to his house, Hab. 2.9. Behold thine end is come, and the measure of thy covetousness, Jer. 51.13.  
2. It is said, in the Earthquake was slain names of men, seven thousand; that is, Men of note, renown, famous, Gen. 6.4. contrary hereto, is, men without name, Job. 30.8. It seems to allude to the Rebellion of Corah, Dathan, and Abiram, with certain of the children of Israel, 250 Princes of the Congregation, the called of the Assembly, men of Name, Numb. 16.2. Worthy Ainsworth here noteth, that these were Statesmen, famous and renowned; whereby the Conspiracy was the stronger. But what became of these men of name? they were slain by an Earthquake, Numb. 16.32, 33. Here may be meant Soldiers and Lawyers, as Priests before.  
3. And the Remnant were affrighted, etc. we do not find the like effect of any Vial after: no giving glory to the God of Heaven; but blaspheming the God of Heaven, Rev. 16.9, 11, 21. The Reason may be, because the Subject of this Vial is Earth, that is, a mere Earthly and carnal Interest, and so no part of the Beast's Dominion; I mean, not so properly and directly as are the Subjects of the other Vials. Hence this Earth-Apostacy is not obeyed for Love and Conscience, but either of fear, or for some worldly advantage: and therefore no marvel there will be a Remnant (howsoever with it before) seeing it swallowed up in the Earthquake, shall bless God for it, and say, Hallelujah, Salvation, and Glory, and Honour, and Power unto the Lord our God.  
The last Effect is in Rev. 16.2. And there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the Mark of the Beast, and upon them which worshipped his Image. Here it is to be observed, that these have the Mark of the Beast, and so distinct from the Remnant before. The Effects of this Vial extends further than the Subject.  
And therefore whereas it is said, The first Vial falls upon such as had the Mark of the Beast, and worshipped his Image; This is true, if we understand the Effects; otherwise, the Subject is only Earth, viz. the grand Apostasy of the last times.  
As they that dwelled upon the Earth rejoiced, and made merry, when they saw the WITNESS stain, being afraid it would have reached them, (as doubtless it would, had not that Apostasy been) so now they are much more tormented to hear the same WITNESS is risen again, and hath poured a Vial upon that Earth or Beast, by whom it was slain. The Canaanites, when they heard what the Israelites had done unto the two Kings of the Amorites that were on the other side Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom they utterly destroyed; assoon as they had heard these things, their hearts did melt: neither did there remain any more courage in any man, because of Israel, Josh. 2.10, 11. Such will be the effect of the first Vial: when Babylon shall hear by those posts, Jer. 51.31. what the Lord by his risen Witnesses hath done upon THAT EARTH, the other side Jordan; O what a noisome and grievous sore will be upon the Canaanites! their hearts will die within them, as foreseeing their destruction, in seeing the drawn Sword of Jehovah in the hands of his Mighty Ones.  
Thus I have given a short Paraphrase of the first Vial (it is indeed but short, to what might be said) only I have done it to show, that taking the Vials not yet begun, but to begin at the rising of the Witnesses, there is (in my Opinion) more Scripture-Ground for it, than to begin at Waldo, Wickliff, Armachan, etc. or by Earth to understand the grosser part of Popery. But this I leave to the judicious and godly Reader.  
Answ. 5. Lastly, Should I grant (which I do not) what you say, yet out of one and the same Temple, all the Angels go. 3 although not so opened to the first, as to the last. Now whereas you apprehend not a sufficient ground to say the last Vials are more perfect, high, or accomplishing than the first; I suppose there is, seeing the holy Ghost hath given such a Character of perfection to the last, Rev. 16.17, etc. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, as he hath not given to the first. And besides, it must needs be, that as the spirit of life comes down from on high more and more, the instruments will be purer and purer. And besides, he is not always the best, that engageth the first, for the engagement may be greatest and the work hardest at last; and then the Lord reserves instruments of more excellent principles, and proportionable Faith and courage, as I believe he hath for the Armageddon-battle, and to bring up the rear under the seventh Vial. So far for your sixth Reason, which I have been the larger in, because I did take it for one of the Weightiest.  
Repl. 1. As the difference lies betwixt us, the matter is not much, whether the Tabernacle of the Testimony be not opened to the first, as to the last; seeing, till after the rising of the Witnesses, it is not opened at all, and so no Vial poured out by any of the Angels. This was the thing which I asserted, and find nothing in the whole Answer to the contrary.  
2. For the Characters of perfection, etc. if there be any thing meant by the holy Ghost, in the word (〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉) to prove it, You see more than I; for to me it is no more, than if seven men, having done seven several things one after another, the last, (knowing they have all done) saith, They have done. How this can prove the last to be a better instrument than the first, I know not.  
I confess, some take the last Angel to be Christ: now in this sense it is true, he is more perfect and high, etc. than the first; yea, than all the other six, put them all together.  
3. Although, (as I said before) we are here off from the matter, viz. that the Instruments of the last Vials shall have more excellent principles, and proportionable Faith, and courage, etc. yet for the thing itself I question: It is easier to overcome a dismayed Enemy, and broken in his Forces, than when he is in heart, and whole. The first Vial (I conceive) shall be poured out upon the Earth, when Babylon shall say in her heart, I fit a Queen, and am no Widow, and shall see no sorrow, Rev. 18.7. the following Vials upon her, as being full of fear, terror and amazement; so that the work seem to be hardest at first.   

Answer to the seventh Reason.  
I shall not need to say much to this: for not only we have it out of Cardinals and Papists mouths, as to the first Vial; and so as to the Swedes under the second: but now as to the third Vial in the end wars in Britain (to which indeed it properly appertains) the very Enemies, as well as Friends, have said, True and righteous are thy judgements, O God, against the King, Prelates; yea, the very Cavaliers and Malignants, acknowledging, That the hand of God▪ was against them; and that it could be no other than the finger of the Lord: and in time (as the plagues go out) it will appear without dispute, on whose side the truth is, to such as will see.  
Repl. 1. That the three first Vials are thus placed, I never yet saw ground for it. To forbear the first, (having already spoken of it) why should the second Vial be applied to the Swedes, and not rather to the Civil Wars in France, or Bohemia, or to the long Wars of the Albigenses against the Papists? Sure I am, there was as much of God (if not more) seen in these wars; and his judgements a● manifest, as in the Swedes. So for the third Vial, which properly appertains (you say) to Britain: and why not to Scotland in their Mary's Reign? or, to the Netherlands? seeing as much was done there in point of Reformation, as here in England. Methinks to take in the Swedes, and leave out others more considerable, significant, and Vial-like, (in your own way) is not well. But some may say, There are not Vials enough to give such allowance.  
2. For Cardinals, Prelates, Cavilliers, etc. we have had little yet out of their mouths. It may be, some few, now and then (as it hath been so, since there were such men) have acknowledged Gods appearing against them in some remarkable providence. But how? as a Vial of wrath? No; but as the Corrections of a Father, making use of bad men (as Roundheads, Brownists, Anabaptists, Sectaries, etc.) as his Rod or Instruments: hoping, for all this, to recover their losses, and to have their former Places and Superstition restored. So that God's judgements have not been manifest, as to the conviction of enemies: n●● was there more acknowledged amongst them of God finger, under the two supposed Vials, than what hath been often at other times. And therefore from such a Principle, I do not see but every Fight or Battle must be one of the seven last Plagues; I mean, when a few amongst the Captives and Prisoners shall acknowledge that the hand of the Lord was out against them.  
3. And lastly, For the place, Rev. 15.4. For thy judgements are manifest; It doth not concern so much the Enemies of the Truth, what they confess, as how manifest Gods judgements are in themselves. Howsoever therefore something was manifested in the Swedes and in Britain against the Beast, (as at other times as much) yet this doth not prove that the second and third Vials were then poured out. I deny that: for when such Plagues shall come forth, God's judgements then will be manifest indeed. Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty: just and true are thy ways, thou King of Saints.  
That the seven Vials allude to the plagues of Egypt, it is granted by all. Now howsoever without doubt, whilst the Israelites abode in Egypt, God smote the Egyptians with many plagues, yet none were so manifest, as the ten last. It is my opinion, (and methinks the Scripture is clear for it) that there will be as great difference between God's judgements already executed upon the Beast, and what shall be made manifest when the Vials begin to be poured out, as between the twinkling of a Star, and the shining Sun at noonday. As that which lies lowest at the bottom of the Cask, are the dregs: so the seven last plagues are the deepest, greatest, and heaviest, all dregs, wrath without mixture, Rev. 18.8, 10, 15, etc. Isa. 13.9, 10, 15, 19, 20. & 14.19, 20. & 34.8, 9, 10. & 63.1, 2, etc. Jer. 50.25, 26, etc. & 51. Psal. 137.7, 8, 9 Psa. 75.8. Rev. 14.8, 10.  
Here were a fit occasion for me to deliver my sense concerning the second and third Vials; which the Answerer confidently carries to the Swedes and English. But because I desire first to know what satisfaction God's people have, by this which I have published in differing from the common received opinion, I shall not treat thereof at this time.   

Answer to the eighth Reason.  
At the first glance, this out of Rev. 15.6. may go for very good, till it be well weighed; and then we shall see, 1. That the Witnesses, during their Sackcloth or suffering estate, have power to smite with plagues, Rev. 11.6. or Vials, Chap. 15.1.  
Repl. 1. I have (I think) said enough, in making it evident and clear, that the Sackcloth-Witnesses, and Angel-Vials, are distinct both to their works and times; and therefore I shall not reply still only to words. Herod holding the opinion of Pythagoras, Plato, and other Heathen men, that the souls of the dead come again in other bodies, could not but think, (believing that John Baptist was risen) but that great wonders would be done by him now, though John in his life-time wrought no miracle. If the Witnesses, in their Sackcloth and suffering estate were the Angels, Rev. 15. that is, had gotten the victory over the Beast, had the harps of God, sung the song of Moses, had the Tabernacle of the Testimony opened to them, poured out Vials, etc. I see very little what their Resurrection-state will signify or amount to. The Nations need not (if the case be so) to be frighted, (as Herod was) when they shall hear they are standing upon their feet. See Rev. 11.11, 12, 13.  
Answ. 2. By white, is not always meant a Change of raiment; but by white (I conceive) is meant uprightness, innocence, truth, integrity: and so, Rev. 19.8. for the fine linen, is the righteousness of Saints, or the Generation-righteousness, which is as the holy Ghost saith, Rev. 15.6. the seven Angels come out clothed with pure and white linen; by which I think may be meant the Generation-righteousness, purity, and sanctity: and so the two Witnesses may have the sackcloth for suffering, and white robes for uprightness, innocence and truth too: what should hinder? And so the Waldenses, Lollards, Hussites, Lutherans, etc. in their Generation, were clothed in white.  
Repl. 1. Were it true, (as you say) viz. by white is not always meant a change of raiment, that is, of condition and State; yet it may be meant so, Rev. 15.6. and I think both you and others, observing well the place, will not take it otherwise.  
But 2. Grant farther, by white sometimes is meant uprightness, innocence, etc. why in the very same place may not change of State be meant likewise? I do believe, let the Scriptures be searched, never is pure and white linen given to Saints, but a change of State is always meant, whatever is meant besides.  
3. For Rev. 19.8. it is to be understood of the Jews preparing as a Bride adorned for her husband, which is by casting off her own righteousness which is by the Law, and no other than filthy rags, Isa. 64.6. to put on the righteousness of Christ, which is of God by faith. A most glorious change of State.  
4. For Generation-righteousness, innocence, etc. attributed to the Waldenses, Lollards, etc. whatsoever they had of these graces; all Saints before them (and since) have had the like. Considering therefore, that in Rev. 15. nothing is set down, but things high, eminent, singular; I much marvel the place should be brought so low; as if nothing were there meant, but what is ordinary and common to every Christian.  
Lastly, That the two Witnesses should have sackcloth for suffering, and white robes for righteousness; here I think Mr. Tilling. says better, who understands sincerity, uprightness and integrity to be meant by the golden girdles upon their breasts; according to Paul, Having your loins girt about with truth, Eph. 6.14.  
Answ. 3. The word here, Rev. 15.6. which is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, is not the word that is used for change of raiment, but signifies a plain, easy, soft, cotton-whiteness; which may well be worn with sackcloth: but the change of raiment is rather 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, a brave silken whiteness, or Princely Robe, Ezek. 16.13. and so in the places you name, as Gen. 41.42. Esth. 8.15. therefore it is not here meant such a change of Robe as cannot be received till the Sackcloth is put off.  
Repl. It is true (as you say) the word is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but for the explanation and application, I like neither of them. First, not the Explanation; as if the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 should signify only some plain and course cloth: whereas rather, it is fine flax, (as the Greek translateth, Isa. 19.9.) whereof in the East they made their richest and choicest linen.  
Nor 2. the Application: for the holy Ghost (who knew best his own meaning) besides 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 hath 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, which is not only bright and resplendent, but gorgeous, Princelike, such as was worn by Kings and Nobles. Hence Godwyn well observes, that Purple, above other colours, was affected by the Emperors and Nobility of Rome, and White by the Nobility of the Jews: whence the Hebrews termed their Noblemen Chorim, albatos, men clad in white: On the contrary, men of mean rank, Chaschucim, men clad with foul garment, Jam. 2.2. Pilat his soldiers clad Christ in purple, Matth. 27.28. and Herod the Tetrarch of Galilee put on him (〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉) white garments, Luke 23.11. both therein applying themselves to the customs of their own Countries, clothing him as King, though in derision. Moses and Aaron, lib. 1. cap. 4.  
Besides, in Jam. 2.2, 3. the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is taken for apparel, quite differing to a plain, easy, soft cotton, which may be worn with sackcloth, etc. So that (I conceive) if any weight lie in the words, it is not in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the cloth, but in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, (the colour or kind) which is gorgeous, Royal, Princelike linen.  
Answ. But 4. Were it meant of such a Robe, yet those (forementioned) brave Champions of Christ, in their generation, might be said to be clothed therewith by faith, whilst they trampled, and had the generation-victory over the Beast, (as we said before) being above him, and beating him before them, by a most noble and notable spirit of faith, courage, and undaunted resolution, that would not yield an inch unto him; and so were (as it were) Princes, (in spirit) and above sufferings. But so far for your eighth Reason, which I take for the most considerable and serious.  
Repl. 1. I have seen what is extant concerning the persons (specially Grosthead and Armachan) so often mentioned; but am not of your opinion, that they were such brave Champions, as trampling the Beast, and beating him before them, etc. I do not judge their Generation-work amounted to so much.  
Neither, 2. had they any victory over the Beast, as Rev. 15.2. For that place intends more than Generation-victory, viz. by speaking or writing against the errors and evils of men, or beating the adversary in such a kind: it is an execution of temporal judgements; which they never did, and therefore could not be the Angel of the first Vial.  
But 3. Should it be granted they were such brave Champions, had generation-victory, etc. all this might be, and yet not clothed in Princelike white, because Rev. 15.6. is to be understood of the time after the rising of the Witnesses, whereas they were before.  
Lastly, taking the Grounds and Principles of some men to be true, I do not see, why the fourth and fifth Vials should not be poured out, as are the first, second and third. For in my opinion, there hath been as much of Vials poured out upon the sun, and throne of the Beast, as upon the earth, sea, and fountains of waters: I say, as much as can be said of the other three: And therefore I see no reason why there is a stand at the third Vial; and why no Vial poured out upon the house of Austria, or German Emperor; yea, and why not upon Rome itself. If there be no more to make up the effects of a Vial, in trampling and beating the Beast, and to have Generation-victory over him, than a bare Testimony against his Idolatries and Blasphemies. Besides, more Reasons, (I think) and better too, may be given, that in the Swethens and Britain Wars, the Sun and throne of the Beast were smitten, than either Sea, or fountain of waters.  
That there is no Answer made to the ninth Reason, the Reason is, because that Argument was not sent with the rest to my friend. Besides, there are some passages added to the Reasons as they are printed, which were not in the Copy sent to the Answerer.   

Answer to the tenth Reason.  
Nor can I see, as you suppose, an absurdity in asserting the Vials begun, and the effects of them, (as we have said) seeing one Vial perfects another, as the following doth the foregoing.  
Repl. If any man speak, let him speak as the Oracles of God, 1 Pet. 4.11. For my part, I had rather observe how things are expressed in the Scriptures, than the liberty which men take in their Exposition. That one Vial shall perfect another, etc. I am sure this is not in the text; neither to be gathered from it, as I conceive. When the first Vial hath been poured out upon the earth, where is it said that the second, third, fourth, etc. shall follow, to perfect the work upon that subject? or what Reason is there for such an inference?  
Some, in opening these Vials, allude to waters; when one stream falls into another, and these two into a third; here is no running backward: for though the waters are increased, yet their course is still forward. It is true, the first Vial having perfected its work, (as going forward) may fall in with the second; and so these two, (the effects of the second being perfected) with the third: but that the second or third shall run backward; as the similitude taken from waters, is against humane reason, so this against divine Truth, in my understanding. Now upon this mistake it is, that many good men ground their opinion, that the Vials begun to be poured out by Waldo, Wickliff, Luther, etc. as taking it for granted, that one Vial perfects another, as the following doth the foregoing: But the Word of God justifies no such opinion; neither shall the earth, as the subject of the first Vial, have any other poured out upon it; neither is it to be thought needful, no more than when persons or things are once destroyed, to say they must be put down again by others after.  
Mr. Tilling. his fifth Proposition is, That the effects of one Vial do ofttimes run into another Vial. I answer: The effects of each Vial, are the evils or sufferings themselves which lie upon the enemies of God, and their works, by reason of the wrath of God formerly poured out; as sores, blood, scorching men with heat, darkness, etc. Now how such evils or sufferings do run one into another, I understand not. He saith, My meaning is, the immediate following Vial, or the Vial following that, may sometimes be poured out, before the effects of the foregoing Vial are wholly ceased. This I grant: As for example, Before the effects of the first Vial (whose subject is the earth) are ceased, the second Vial may begin to be poured out upon the sea: So the third Vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters, before the effects of the second are over. But hence it will not follow, That the second Vial, whose proper subject is the sea, shall fall upon the earth; or the fourth, whose subject is the sun, upon the third, viz. the rivers and fountains of waters, as one Vial to perfect another: This is only supposed, and the holy Ghost seems to carry it quite otherwise: for he distinguisheth both the Angels, Subjects, and effects; and puts them all a part. Whereas, to take it in the other way, viz. one Vial perfecting another; here is mere confusion: Here earth is no more the subject of the first Vial, then of the second; nor sea the subject of the second Vial, more than of the third or fourth.  
Answ. 2. Seeing the two Witnesses have power to smite with the plagues, Rev. 11.5. before their slaughter, yet have not power to end any of the Beasts dominion in any one street, till after their rise, vers. 13. because till then, the spirit of life which does so, comes not into them; and till then, the end of the 42 months, or Beasts period, is not ended; and therefore it is, that their plagues in the 42 months are more defective, and at the end of the 42 months more perfective: for until then, they could plague, but not period the Beasts Government in any street; so that no wonder if the Beasts Tyranny be still up in one kind or other, till the end comes.  
Repl. Here are still suppositions one after another. 1. One Vial perfects another. 2. The sackcloth-Witnesses are the Angels, Rev. 15.3. Before their slaughter, defective; after, more perfective, etc. These being only Conjectures, without proof, I shall say the less.  
But 1. If Grosthead, Armachan, Huss, etc. were such brave Champions, and had all those Characters, Rev. 15.2, 3, 4, 5, 6. and Chap. 14.2, 3, 4. I cannot see how they were without the spirit of life, Chap. 11.11. Neither so defective: for, in my opinion, the spirit of life is no other, than what in Chap. 15 & 16 is expressed in particulars.  
2. To say, The Witnesses could plague, but not period; it is as much as to say, They were not the Angels, Rev. 15. For every Vial shall period; neither doth the last period more or further than its proper subject.  
3. If you mean, by end, the last Vial, (as I perceive you do, by what follows) therein I differ: for the Beast's dominion shall end with the fifth Vial. And howsoever there shall be a party at the Armageddon-battel, gathered together for the cause and interest of the Beast; yet as to his Kingdom and power that was broken before, Rev. 18. We know whose House and Family is cast out of this Nation, yet there are some (had they opportunity) would willingly engage to raise it up again out of the ashes. So here.  
I know the Beast and false Prophet, Rev. 16.13. & 19.20. is taken for one: by Beast, the Civil power; by false Prophet, the Ecclesiastical. But I think, in both places, by the false Prophet, is meant mohammed, that is, the Turkish dominion or State: 1. Because it is not probable, that so considerable a matter should be left out; which must be, if it be not here. 2. In both places, where the false Prophet is mentioned, the things properly belong to the Mahometans, and fall under the last Vials, viz. the great Army of Gog and Magog; God's judgements upon them, and Israel's victory, Ezek. 38 & 39 3. Neither doth the title, That false Prophet, belong so fitly to any, as to that monster Mahumet. Hence, since his rising, he hath been usually so called. 4. Whereas the working of miracles in Rev. 19.20. is referred (not to the Beast, but) to the false Prophet; this much strengthens (methinks) the sense. For at this time, Satan's greatest workings will be among the Turks, with all power, and signs, and lying wonders. As a Tyrant, having lost several strong holds, he seeks to maintain, by what supply he hath, such other Forts and Castles as yet are in his hands: so Satan, being driven out of his Western hold, and nothing left him, in a manner, but the false Prophet's dominion: here he will be working all the Miracles and lying Wonders he can, to draw multitudes to him. And howsoever Babylon be fallen, yet the Beast is said to be with the false Prophet, because of a party joining then with the Turks, to raise up the ruins of the Great city, or the Beasts dominion again.  
Answ. 3. Sure it is from an absurdity, because the holy Ghost gives not that note of perfection, till the last, Rev. 16.17. and then he saith, It is finished: and therefore the last must needs make perfect all the other, in all streets and nations, and put a full period to all Tyranny and Idolatry: which we cannot say of the first. Besides, the last Vial is the most universal and thorough also. Now the Reason why the four last Vials make a more thorough work then the three first, I gave before; because the end of the Beasts dominion is now come, which was not in the former.  
Repl. 1. I think the Absurdity (if any be) remains still, for any thing is said to the contrary. It was objected, that when all the Vials are poured out, nothing may be signified, etc. To which we have this Answer: The holy Ghost at the last (and not before) saith, It is finished. Now what is finished, but the work and effect of each Angel and Vial? That is, as the first Angel, in witnessing against Idolatry and Tyranny, poured out his Vial, and therein (as a brave Champion) did his duty, howbeit Tyranny and Idolatry continued still: so the rest, one after another: And having thus trampled upon the Beast, and beat him before them, as the first did; a voice at last shall be heard, It is done. And may not all this be, and yet earth, sea, sun, etc. remain still?  
2. Methinks it is strangely gathered, Because the holy Ghost saith, It is finished; therefore the last must needs make perfect all the other, etc. One Scholar may answer for the rest, that they have all done their Parts or Exercises, and yet it is possible every one might perfect his own work.  
3. In granting that the end of the Beasts dominion was not come in the three first Vials, you must needs grant, (if I am not extremely mistaken) that no Vials are yet poured out. For, as the end of the Beasts dominion is not till after the forty and two months; so the last plagues begin not till then: he is not grown full enough for the Vials, (to use your own words) till those months be expired.   

Answer to the eleventh Reason. I do not understand how you make it an argument against the pouring out of any of the Vials to be now; 1. Because the Temple in so full purity, is not opened till after all the Vials; although the Tabernacle of the Testimony, Rev. 15.5. Now until it be opened, Rev. 11.19. no man is able to enter into it, Rev. 15.8. till the seven plagues of the seven Angels be fulfilled; which appears to be after the seven Vials, Rev. 16.17, 18. So that it hinders not but that the Vials may be begun.  
Repl. I have showed before, how I think the Answerer is in a double mistake about Rev. 15.5. & 11.19. First, in taking them apart, as if the Tabernacle, Chap. 15. should be opened before the Vials are poured out; the other, viz. Chap. 11. not till afterward: whereas both places belong to one matter and time. 2. He takes that for the Tabernacle, which I take to be the Temple, Rev. 11.1. Whilst the two Witnesses prophesied in sackcloth, they had a Temple: but the Testimony of the Tabernacle is not to be opened till after their rising. Besides, if Christ personally shall appear between the sixth and seventh Vial, Rev. 16.15. and the thousand years take their beginning immediately upon the Armageddon-battel; we must rise higher for light, then to take it from the Temple or Tabernacle. And so much seems to be signified, by that Angel standing in the sun, Rev. 19.17. wherein will be fulfilled that prophecy, Isa. 30.25, 26. And there shall be upon every high mountain, and upon every high hill, rivers and streams of waters, in the day of the great slaughter, when the towers fall. Moreover, the light of the moon shall be as the light of the sun, and the light of the sun shall be sevenfold, etc. Though a man where he stands may see very much, yet being set up higher, as on a hill or mountain, (suppose as high as the sun) he sees a great deal more than he did before. True it is, no sooner are the Witnesses risen, but the earth is enlightened, Rev. 18.1. by the Ark of the Testament, Rev. 11.19. and the Tabernacle of the Testimony opened in heaven, Chap. 11.5. But when the Sun of righteousness shall arise with healing in his wings, Mal. 4.2. Saints than shall be higher than Temple or Tabernacle, Rev. 21.22. for their light shall be seven times more than before, as being raised to a higher pitch and degree of light and knowledge, then either the Prophets or Apostles had.  
Answ. 2. He saith, No man shall be able to enter in; but he doth not say, No man shall be able to go out. And in this he alludeth to Solomon's Temple, wherein the Priests could not enter, 2 Chron. 7.2. they could not go in, but those who were in could go out, 1 King. 7.10, 11. being so filled with the presence and glory of the Lord, that they went out. So here, the Angels of the Vials shall go out, being so filled with the presence, spirit, and glory of the Lord, that they will not be able to abide in. Though none go in, yet he saith not, None go out. So that I cannot see how this hinders, but the Vials may be begun.  
Repl. I think you have laid down a very good Ground, by your distinction, to prove that the Vials are not begun. For, 1. If those in the Temple must be filled with such a presence, spirit, and glory of the Lord, before they go out; I am strongly persuaded, that neither Waldo, Wickliff, Armachan, etc. were any of the Angels; nor the Swedish or Britain Soldiers; nor yet is the Temple filled with such a presence. It is one thing to be in the Temple, and another thing to have it filled with this glory you speak of. For such a time will not be, neither is it to be expected, till the Antichristian darkness be more expelled.  
Should a man now make enquiry amongst the choicest Saints concerning Temple-presence, I know what they would say, (and not without cause) we have not the understanding of men, clouds and darkness are about us, we want the presence and spirit of God; there is a death, darkness and deadness spread over all things, as, worship, ordinances, Scriptures, etc. Nevertheless, sure I am, there is as much now of the presence and spirit of God with his people, as any of those ever had, who are said to be the Angels of the first Vials. So then, if there be no coming out, until the Temple is filled with the presence, spirit and glory of the Lord; we may conclude, Either none are come out; or if any are, they had not the presence and Spirit of God; which the holy Ghost expresseth, Rev. 15.8.  
2. As none are to come out of the Temple, until filled with the Spirit; so not until they are called, Rev. 16.1. The which Call, I do not take to be in following Providence; but more than ordinary, as the Prophets and Apostles were, by some immediate impulse of spirit; the Lord making them now clearly to see, that their work and time is come: As I have said before, A particular and special call, peculiar to this time of the Vials, as Mr. Tilling. saith, which hitherto no man had.  
Answ. 3. Whereas he saith, No man; we must observe the subject: he doth not say, No Angel; but, No man; which is a different dialect of the holy Ghost, and doubtless means some other, and not them that execute the Vials; for they are called Angels: and indeed, I think it refers to a more inferior subject; and therefore cannot hinder, but that the Vials which are poured out by Angels (are more glorious instruments then common men) may begin.  
Repl. 1. You have given me occasion to declare my thoughts of the place. It is true, (as you say) he saith not No Angel, but No man; signifying thereby, when the Vial-time gins, what a most glorious Reformation there will be both of persons and things: For such shall be the light, judgement, zeal, and conscience of Saints, as no man shall be admitted into the Temple: no carnal and formal Professors, no corrupt Hypocrites; no such Apostates as 2 Tim. 3.2, 3, 4. Now that shall be verified: Holiness becometh thy house, Jehovah, to length of days, Psal. 93.5. Hitherto (especially since the great Apostasy) the vile with the precious have been in the Temple: Whilst men slept, the enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, Matth. 13.25. What through ignorance, partiality, covetousness, self-love, MAN hath entered into the Temple, most unworthy persons have been taken into Church-fellowship: but now, no man is able, etc. it is so filled with smoke from the glory of the Lord, and from his power.  
So then, the meaning is, upon the rising of the Witnesses, the Church draws to primitive perfection both for light and life. As the Tabernacle of the testimony shall be opened, that is, large discoveries of Gospel-mysteries: so the Temple shall be shut, as no entrance for man: none but Angels shall go in and out. And though I am not of your opinion, that this refers to the blessed Jerusalem-estate of the thousand years; yet it is a forerunner, and carries the character and likeness of that glorious time. Hence in part will be fulfilled Isa. 35.8. & 48.2. Joel 3.17. Isai. 26.2. 1 Cor. 6.9, 10. Psal. 15.1, 2. & 24.3, 4. Isai. 60.21. Rev. 21.27. & 22.15. Compare 1 Cor. 3.3. Are ye not carnal, and walk 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉; according to man?  
Now whereas Mr. Tilling. opinion is, That Saints, before the Vials begin, shall not attain to that purity the Church of Christ enjoyed before the corruptions of Antichrist crept into it; I think otherwise; and the Scripture which he quotes, viz. Rev. 4.6. in my opinion is against him. For then (saith he, speaking of the Primitive time) there was a sea of glass clear as crystal: here is a sea of glass, but not yet so clear as crystal. There is more in Rev. 15.2. than a sea of glass: for it is added, mingled with fire. Now the reason why these words, mingled with fire, are left out in Chap. 4.6. it is, because of the purity which the Church then was in, (as to Doctrine and Discipline) before the Apostasy of Antichrist; and so the sea of glass needed no mingling with fire. But the impure and filthy dross of Antichrist being crept into the Church, than indeed there was cause to have the sea of glass mingled with fire, whereby to consume and burn up not only the grosser part of Popery, or the lees and dregs of that Religion; but the whole, great and small: as the fire leaves no dross or impurity in silver refined. So then, whereas the sea of glass is said to be mingled with fire, it is not to denote (as I conceive) any struggling of the Saints with the Beast, nor hot jars and contentions among themselves; but, that all the corrupt and rotten devices of the Beast should be (as dross in a furnace) utterly consumed.  
Object. It is said, Till the seven plagues of the seven Angels were fulfilled. Then Man, afterward, is able to enter into the Temple.  
I answer, The particular until is often taken for never, Gen. 8.7. & 28.15. 1 Sam. 15.3. 2 Sam. 6.23. Matth. 1.25. So here.  
2. For your sense of the place, (if I understand it) it makes a difference between Saints, as some superior, others inferior. But I think all Saints, (so judged and known) as Angels, shall enter, etc. Neither will there be any such difference amongst the people of God after the Vials begin.  
Answ. And 4. No man as then without the Temple: yet 5. I think it refers to the blessed New-Jerusalem-state of 1000 years, Rev. 20, 21, & 22. which is not begun till after the seven plagues; and therefore till then, none can enter into it.  
Repl. 1. Doubtless many who are without, when the Temple is first filled with the glory of the Lord, shall yet enter in, before the Vials are poured out. For the everlasting Gospel is to be preached, upon the rising of the Witnesses, whereby many will be called out of Babylon, and other Gentiles from their idols and vanities, to the faith and obedience of the Gospel.  
2. For referring it to the New-Jerusalem-state, it seems to have no footing in the text: for the holy Ghost speaks there of no New Temple or State; but directly of that Temple in which the seven Angels then were.  
Besides, in my opinion, so to take it, it's far below the stile of the holy Ghost. For, to say, The new-Jerusalem-state will not begin till after the seven plagues; it's a truth indeed: but how? As if a traveller were told that his journeyings must be finished, before he can be at home; or a Soldier, till the enemy be subdued, he is not to have the glory and honour of the Victory.  
Answ. 6. Should we concede to your Argument, the edge thereof would turn as much against your own opinion and apprehension; seeing none could enter in, as you grant, till the Temple were opened, Rev. 11.19. which is after the seventh Trumpet hath sounded. The Scripture you quote, Rev. 15.5. being meant of the Tabernacle of the Testimony, whence the Vials go out indeed; but not out of this Temple, which is not opened till after all the seven plagues of the seven Angels be fulfilled, as that text expresseth in terminis.  
Repl. 1. How the Reason should be against myself, I see not. Indeed my opinion is, that both places, (as I said before) relate to one time, and take their beginning before the Vials: Neither is there any mention of a Tabernacle or Temple opened in heaven, after the Vials are poured out; though you say that text expresseth it in terminis. For Rev. 16.17, 18. (which you often quote) speaks no such thing, but that there came a great voice out of the Temple of heaven: not said to be then opened, (as Rev. 11.19. & 15.5.) because it was not opened at that time, but long before.  
But 2. This is true, in Rev. 19.11. heaven is said to be opened; which I take to be between the sixth and seventh Vials, signifying a most glorious success of the everlasting Gospel; partly through the light which came from the Ark, Rev. 11.19. and the Tabernacle of the Testimony, chap. 15.5. opened before; and partly through the fall of the Western Babylon, Chap. 18.  
Answ. So that neither by this, nor any of your former Reasons, is my faith in the Vials begun, stirred or enervated; but rather ratified for the present, without I see more than I do: and am of Mr. Tilling. opinion, that the Vials are begun; and that for these Reasons.  
Repl. I know it was Mr. Tilling. opinion: so Brightman's, Pareus, Mede, and 
* Burton, Cotton.  many others which I have seen: and it is (I think) the opinion of most men still, whose learning and godliness I do willingly acknowledge, and do honour the very name of some of them; yet neither do I think them so learned, but they might err; nor so godly, as in all things to be followed. This reverence every man stands bound to give to the graces of God in other men, That in his difference from them, he be not suddenly or easily persuaded; but being jealous of his own heart, he undertake the examination of things, and so proceed with fear and trembling; and so having tried all things, hold fast that which is good, 1 Thes. 5.21. so shall he neither wrong the graces of God in himself nor in others. But on the other side, for a man so far to suffer his thoughts to be conjured into the Circle of any mortal man, or man's judgement, as either to fear to weigh what is offered to the contrary in the balance of the Sanctuary; or finding it to bear weight, to fear to give sentence on the Lord's side; yea, though it be against the common opinion of good men: this is to honour man above God, and to advance a throne above the throne of Christ, who is Lord and King for ever.  
I must confess, to the glory of God, and mine own shame, that one Reason why I questioned not till of late, but that the Vials were begun, it was, because I found such an unanimous accord amongst Expositors therein. Hence I made the less search into the thing, there being no doubt made (among them) as to the truth of it. Now it is possible, my case here may be the case of other men.  
Answ. 1. Because the two Witnesses in their Sackcloth-condition, in the time of the 42 months, before their slaughter or rise, pour out plagues, or smite with plagues, Rev. 11.5, 6. But the Vials are such plagues, Rev. 15. Therefore, they pour out Vials.  
2. Because the very same subjects of the Witnesses smiting with plagues, Rev. 11.5, 6. are the subjects of the Angels Vials, Rev. 16.1, 2, 3. viz. earth, waters turned into blood, and expressed by the holy Ghost in the very same phrases.  
Repl. We have answered this before: yet farther, thus: The places have no such full agreement as is pretended. For, 1. in Rev. 11. waters there, are before earth: but in Chap. 16. there earth is before the waters. Neither do I think, but, according to the order set down, the Witnesses did so, viz. smote the waters first in the days of their prophecy, prophetically.  
2. The sea, which is the subject of the second Vial, Rev. 16.3. in Chap. 11. is not so much as named; which is very strange, that the second Vial should be thus left, and yet all one thing, and in the very same phrases.  
3. How do they agree in phrases? When the one only smites the earth, the other pours out a Vial on the earth. Doubtless, here lies a great difference, not so much in words, as matter, if well considered.  
4. In Chap. 16.4. the Angel poured out his Vial upon the waters, and they became blood: but Chap. 11. the Witnesses have power over the waters, to turn them into blood. It is not said they smote the waters, or that the waters were turned into blood. What may be gathered, is one thing; but the phrases are not alike.  
5. If the places are so alike in phrases, why are they made so unlike in exposition? The first Vial is applied to Waldo, Wickliff, Luther, as smiting the Beast with their mouths and pens: the second and third, to Soldiers and Armies, and so kill men with their swords and guns.  
Answ. 3. Because the Egyptian plagues alluded to, were begun by the two Witnesses Moses & Aaron, before the end of the Captivity or sojourning in Egypt: and it is very evident, this hath such an allusion, Rev. 11.8. because the holy Ghost calls this forty and two months Egypt also.  
Repl. If the Egyptian plagues by Moses and Aaron (the two Witnesses) were all poured out before the end of the captivity; then following the Allusion, all the Vials should be poured out whilst the Witnesses are in sackcloth. And to say truth, to take it otherwise, it destroys the life and light of the Argument. For if the Vials begun before the rising of the Witnesses, then must they be all poured out before the end of the forty and two months, as the ten plagues by the two Witnesses Moses and Aaron, were before the end of their Captivity or sojourning in Egypt.  
Thus you see, by dividing the Vials, as some to go before the rising, and some after, is contrary to the Allusion. For if some were, than were all: but taking it that none were, so there is (in my opinion) both reason and truth as to the Allusion; viz. as Moses and Aaron the two risen Witnesses (not in sackcloth) near or about the end of the four hundred and thirty years, plagued the Egyptians: so the forty and two months of the Beasts tyranny being going out, the Spirit of life from God shall enter into his Witnesses, for the pouring out of the last plagues upon the Beasts dominion.  
Answ. 4. For that the remnant (I humbly conceive) are to strike in, and not to begin; to succeed and follow, not to direct and lead; to execute, not to prepare: but your opinion makes 144000, or the remnant, to begin; and the two Witnesses to fall in with them: which I see not.  
Repl. Either you or I are here in some mistake, both to the Remnant and Witnesses. For, 1. I do not take the Remnant (as you do) to be the one hundred forty and four thousand; but (as I said before) part of the woman's seed, which never fled into the wilderness; against whom the dragon makes war, Rev. 12.17. and this, before the rising of the Witnesses; and so, in likelihood, refers to the wars in France, Holland, Germany, Britain, etc. 2. I take the one hundred forty and four thousand, and the risen Witnesses, to be all one. For, (as you said well) it is a testimony or Witness (not persons) that is slain; the which Testimony or Truth (that is, the glorious Cause and Interest of Christ) riseth and lives again, by a spirit of life from God entered into the one hundred forty and four thousand.  
Answ. 5. For that all the hitherto-plagues upon the Beasts dominion, do signify nothing, if they were not the matter of the Vials.  
Repl. 1. The conclusion will not follow. For whilst the Israelites were in Egypt, no doubt the Lord plagued the Egyptians at several times; yet they were none of the ten last plagues. To come nearer; when Abbeys and Monasteries were put down in Hen. 8. his Reign, this was a plague upon the Beasts dominion, and signified something. So hath he been plagued in France, Scotland, Bohemia, the Netherlands; yet reckoned no Vials. Besides, what did the Goths, Huns, Vandals, etc. but pour out plagues upon the Beasts dominion?  
2. That they are said to be the last plagues, it clearly shows, that there were plagues upon the Beasts dominion before. For the distinction between former and later, must be understood of the Beasts dominion as the subject: that is, several plagues should be poured upon it, before the seven last Plagues or Vials begin.  
Answ. 6. And lastly, the subjects of the Vials, Rev. 16.2, 3, 4, 5, etc. of the first, the second, and the third, as the holy Ghost in Scripture opens them, have been under the very same wrath mentioned in the first, second, and third Vials: so that I am much persuaded that they are begun, by a Scripture-clearness.  
Repl. That which first gave me occasion to question the beginning of the Vials, it was, that I could not see neither the subjects nor the effects of the Vials, as the holy Ghost opens them, Rev. 16. under the same wrath, as they are interpreted; neither the first, second, nor third: there being nothing yet done, in my opinion, that carries the character of VIAL-WORK upon it.  
1. That the earth should be taken for the grosser part of Popery, where do we find in Scripture a ground to raise such an Exposition? 2. That the subject earth should be universal, and yet in many places this gross earth never moved, but to this day remains as much and as bad as ever. 3. That Waldo, Wickliff, Armachan, etc. should be Vial-Angels, a thing no way suitable to the description of the holy Ghost, Rev. 15.  
So again, for the second and third Vials, I am not satisfied, as they are applied. First, why the second, to the Swedish war in Germany; the third, to ours in Britain. Or, 2. (as others) why the second to the Romish discipline or Hierarchy in England, Anno Dom. 1641. the third, to fall upon England, the Low-Countries, and France: I do not see Scripture-clearness for these things. Nor 3. do I understand what difference there is between the earth and sea, as they are expounded: for I think the Romish Hierarchy, viz. Popes, Cardinals, Archbishops, Bishops, Monks, Friars, etc. with all that rabble, root and branch, as gross earthly superstitions, as their Mass, their Crosses, Purgatory, Penance, Pilgrimage, etc. And therefore, to make a distinction between Romish doctrine, and Romish discipline, as two distinct subjects, I am not of that opinion: but as they risen together, so they shall fall together, inseparably, under one and the same Vial. I confess, in things to come, as they are secret, so we cannot well judge whether men hit or miss (in their opinions) till they come to pass: But in things that are past, and so visible, here we can say a little more, whether men speak pertinently, and to purpose.  
I thought to have forborn the Queries: but not knowing how it might be taken, I have set down the Answers to them.   

A few words to your Queries.  
To the first, I answer: The one of the living creatures, (for I like not the name of Beasts; nor is it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Rev. 15.7. & 4.6. Living creatures, or Cherubims, as Ezek. 1.5.) Now this one I will not say, as some do think, to signify the first (which is the Lion) in this place; though in some places it doth, Dan. 10.13. Mar. 16.2. especially when we speak in order of number, with others, as Rev. 6.1. But so it is not in Rev. 15.7. Wherefore here I rather incline to the last; as Rev. 21.9. there came one of the seven Angels, is meant the last of the seven: so here, one of the living creatures, I do believe is meant the last of the four animals: and so the holy Ghost signifies, by bringing up all with ONE, or the ONE, as the sum, or utmost, or concluding number of all. Besides this, it agrees very well with the description: for the last is the flying Eagle, Rev. 4.7. who gave (I conceive) the Vials to the seven Angels, for these Reasons.  
1. For that it is a bird of a most excellent spirit; and the meaning is, That most excellent spirits must manage all those Vials; and the Angels under this Eagle-administration from the Throne, will be full of sagacity, quick sent, and apprehension, etc. See Job 39.27, 29.  
Then 2. for that the Eagle is swift, and so the most suitable of all the four living creatures, to give the Vials, for the swiftness of his dispensations in the Vial-days, especially when the two Witnesses are up.  
3. For that he is so full of courage, that he fears not to set upon the Great Beast; and so will the executors of the Vials fall upon the Greatest of the earth, yea the great Beast whom the earth hath worshipped, feared and adored.  
4. For that the way of the Eagle is a strong and unknown way, Prov. 30.19. and so the most suitable to give out the Vials, which will be executed in strange and unknown ways, or untrodden paths.  
5. For that he will fly full to the sun, with eyes open; and goes out to his prey at noonday: and so will the Vials be openly in the sight of the sun; and those that pour them out, will be open-eyed, and move in the full light of the work, with their faces to Jesus Christ, and eyeing the sun of righteousness, Mal. 4.  
6. He is called, the flying Eagle: for he hath his nest on high in the rock; and soaring so, he falls from on high right down upon his prey: And so will this Vial-work fall from above, upon the heads of them under it, Hos. 8.1. and there is no escaping it. The Eagle falls suddenly, in the twinkling of an eye, (say some) upon his prey.  
7. For that he is accounted the King of birds: and so the Vials are all the wrath of God and the Lamb, or the King of Saints.  
8. The eagle's prey is blood, or the carcases of them killed, Job 39.30. where the slain are, there is she, Luk. 17.37. And so he is the suitable administrator from the throne, to give out the Vials, which turn waters into blood, and pour slaughter upon the Beasts followers.  
9 It appears to me, it is the Eagle too, by the contents of what judgements he hath to show, in Rev. 6.7, 8, 9 unto the end. All bring what the four living creatures or Eagle saith, Come and see, unto (viz.) the sword, famine, death, hell, (all which will fall on the Beast by those Vials, Rev. 18.8. & 19.20.) and the wrath of the Lamb, Rev. 16.16. & 17.14.  
10. It appears yet further to me, in the order of the four living creatures, and their several times and works, expressed by the holy Ghost, Rev. 6.1, 2. the first said, Come and see, to his conquering with the Gospel in the Nations: and this was in the primitive times of the ten persecutions, or before the Beast risen: for the Saints were then under a most lion-like, noble, courageous, Angellike spirit. The second, v. 3, 4. said, Come and see, to the Red horse, or Scarlet beast, Rev. 17.3. wherein the Riders had a great sword to slay us: this was in the Beasts rise and crowning, by cruel persecutions, murders, and massacres of the Saints; and so they were under the ministration of the second living creature, (I conceive) like a Calf for Butchery and slaughter. 3. V 5, 6. the third living creature said, Come and see, to him that had the balances to weigh in time of great scarcity of God's own bread; only the oil and wine (as the anointing) were preserved: and this I think was the ministration which the two Witnesses were under in their Sackcloth-prophesying, who had the face and grace of a man. But now 4. the Eagle is the ministrator under whom the Angels of the Vials are: and so the two Witnesses, in that state or predicament, are under the Eagle, who flieth high, strong, clear, swift, etc. which appears to me to be the flying Eagle that gives them out, for that they are to reach over all Nations, and to fly over all; which the flying Angel (who flies with the Gospel over every nation, kindred, tongue and people) prepares, Rev. 14.6, 7, 12. And it seems to me the last living creature, because the plagues are the last plagues which are in the Vials, Rev. 15.5. So that for these Reasons, I have hinted my thoughts unto your first Query.  
Repl. I have no intent to meddle with things besides the Point in hand; neither shall I speak much here.  
But, 1. The Answerer (I think) misseth the Question: for it was not queried which of the four Beasts (or living creatures, as he rather chooseth) gives out the Vials: But, if by the Angel pouring out the first Vial, Waldo, Wickcliff, Grosthead, Armachan, or Luther, be meant; who then is the one of the living creatures that delivers the Vial to them? that is, how are these men, in publishing the Gospel, VIAL-ANGELS, and also the living creature or Eagle that puts the Vial into their hands?  
2. Concerning this large discourse of the flying Eagle, and Eagle-administration, here is enough said (the premises granted) to show, that no Vial is yet poured out.  
For, 1. Must all the Vials be managed by most excellent spirits, men full of sagacity, quick sent and apprehension? Such than have not been yet, since the rise of the Beast: Though we see light and day at the dawning, yet is not the same full and most excellent, till a while after. I grant, some of the persons  were good men; but yet had not most excellent spirits, were not complete and full to manage any of the Vials.  
2. For swiftness of dispersations in the Vial-days, what can be more evidently against you then this; viz. that in eight or nine-hundred years, (for so long it is since the Vials began, according to your Grounds) very little should be done as to the destroying of the grosser part of Popery; methinks it rather carries the likeness of a snail slowly creeping over the earth, than the swiftness of an Eagle flying in the air.  
3. For courage and boldness, this is no more than what the Antichristians had: Sometimes the victory hath gone on our side, otherwhile on theirs. But if the Swethen King were a Vial-Angel, it's strange he should be slain in the War: for my opinion is, that none of the seven Angels which have their breasts girded with golden girdles, Rev. 15.6. shall fall by the hand of their enemy, or at any time lose the Victory.  
4. If the way of the Vials be strange and unknown, then were not the persons so often named, the pourers of them out: for neither Waldo, Huss, Luther, King of Sweth, etc. went in untrodden paths; but what they said or did, they had Precedents and Examples before; and so were followers of others in known and trodden paths.  
5. Will those who pour out Vials be open-eyed, and move in the FULL LIGHT of their work? how then can it be fairly applied to such men as sat in darkness, saw little of the things of Christ, practised most gross idolatry, and, for some of them, had not their faces to Jesus Christ, eyeing the sun of righteousness; but their own private advantages?  
6. That the Eagle falls suddenly in the twinkling of an eye (as it were) upon his prey; it is very true, and suitable to the Vial-ministration: for surely when that Work gins, it shall go speedily and prosperously on, without obstruction or let, and all done in a little time. Ergo, etc.  
7. If the Vials are all wrath, even the wrath of God and the Lamb; then could not Waldo or Luther pour any forth in preaching the doctrine of the Gospel. I have showed before, that whatsoever the Sackcloth-witnesses did in smiting the earth with plagues, it was only by reproof; as Psal. 141.5. Prov. 19.25. It is true, through unbelief and hardness of heart, the Lord afterward brought real plagues upon the wicked world, and will bring many more (and greater) in the Vials.  
The Eighth is answered before, viz. in what sense the Sackcloth-Witnesses turned waters into blood.  
For the Ninth and Tenth Reasons, what is there applied to the Eagle, is more against the Answerer than the rest. For if under the second living creature like a Calf, be meant the cruel persecutions, murders, and massacres of the Saints after the Beast risen; then cannot the Eagle-ministration be brought up to the time of the Beasts reign: for who are the Saints then butchered, if not the Sackcloth-Witnesses? Therefore, to say that at one time they should be under the ministration of the second living creature, viz. like a Calf for butchery; and under the administration of the fourth living creature, namely, the flying Eagle, in smiting and killing their enemies; this cannot be: neither is there any method, order, or reason kept (in my opinion) in this fourfold ministration; unless the Eagle-time be understood after the rising of the Witnesses.  
Besides, the Answerer in his words following, grants as much, saying, It seems to me, the last living creature, because the plagues are the last plagues which are in the Vials. If the Witnesses, before their rising, did pour out the last plagues; who before them poured out the first plagues upon the Beasts dominion? Now here I see no reason why any should begin those last plagues, either at Luther or Waldo, and leave out the Sackcloth-Witnesses before their times. I shall here in brief set down what hath been publicly witnessed against the Beast many years before either of them.  
In the year 1126 (which was forty years before Waldo) Peter Bruis, sometime a Priest, was so zealously earnest against the grosser parts of Popery, as first in the Diocese of Arles, of Ambrun, and of Gap; then after, throughout all Auvergne, Languedoc, and Given, he boldly and openly preached against Transubstantiation, the Sacrifice of the Mass, Masses, Suffrages, and Oblations for the dead, Purgatory, Worshipping of Images, Invocation of Saints, Single life of Priests, Pilgrimages, Superstitious holidays, Consecrations of Waters, Oil, Frankincense, & other Romish trash. And withal, sharply inveighed against the pride and excess of the Pope and his Prelates, whom he called Princes of Sodom; and the Church of Rome he termed Babylon, and the mother of Fornication and confusion. For which glorious Testimony, he was burnt to ashes.  
About the same time, there was one Henry a disciple of his, who as publicly declared against the Blasphemies of the Beast; for which they were so mad and enraged, as being taken, he was bound in Chains, and sent by Albertus' Cardinal of Ostia into Italy, where it is thought he was secretly murdered: for he was never seen nor heard of afterwards.  
So in the year 1125. one Arnulph, a zealous and devout man, for reproving the Looseness, Covetousness, Pride, and other Vices of the Clergy, was at Rome, by their wicked hands, cruelly murdered.  
Again, Anno 855. (before Waldo three hundred years) Grontier Archbishop of Collen, and Thietgaud of Trevers, with their Colleagues, gave forth this Testimony to the world against the Pope, and sent it to him: Thou art (say they) a Wolf unto the Sheep, a Murderer of the Living, and one which thrustest men into hell: Thou bearest the show of a Bishop, but art a very Tyrant: Thou art in habit a Pastor, in heart a Wolf: Thy Title promiseth as a Father, but in thy Deeds thou carriest as a God: (alluding to the place in 2 Thess. 2.4.) Thou callest thyself, A servant of servants; and seekest by all means to become a Lord of lords: and consequently, according to the doctrine of our Saviour, thou art the least of all the Ministers of God's Church, who yet in thy ambition runnest headlong to perdition; thinking every thing lawful to be done, which pleaseth thee. We care not for thy words; we fear not thy Bulls, nor yet thy Thunders, etc.  
Yea more, Anno 734. Albertus Gallus, and Clemens Scotus, and many other learned men in France and Germany, withstood the Pope in Relics, Images, Single life, Purgatory, Supremacy; and openly called the Pope the author of Lies, the disturber of Peace and Piety, and the corrupter of Christian Doctrine. So Claudius Bishop of Taurin, Anno 799.  
I forbear to mention Bertram, Anno 812. and the Bishop of Florence, Anno 1114. and many others, who long before Waldo, were condemned of Heresy, for teaching and writing against the grosser parts of Popery, as Transubstantiation, Purgatory, Images, Masses, Pilgrimages; and asserting the Pope to be Antichrist, etc.  
So then, if the first Vial be to be understood of the Sackcloth-Witnesses speaking against the grosser part of Popery; the time cannot begin at Luther nor Waldo, but with the Witnesses before. For (as I said) there is no reason why such flying Eagles should be left out, who were as high, valiant, quick, and public against the Beast, (eight or nine hundred years past) as were Armachan, or Grosthead, or the like. In a word therefore, how these can be the last plagues begun so long ago, to wit, when the Sackcloth-Witnesses begun first to smite the earth, (which I think I can make it appear, was assoon as the Beast did rise) I shall leave it to the READER'S judgement.  
Answ. Your second Question is answered before. For I cannot see how any Angel can be single persons, but the Witnesses principally, and the remnant of the woman's seed as auxiliaries and assisting.  
Repl. 1. Neither doth the Answerer here come home to the Question. For the Question is not so much, Whether a single person or a number be meant, as concerning the condition of the persons (few or many) which are to pour out the Vials. As for Example: If the Swethen Army poured out the second Vial, as the Angel mentioned Rev. 16.3. then may the Vial-Angels or Instruments, which shall pour out the last plagues, be visibly profane and wicked persons; which is contrary to Rev. 15.3, 4, 5, 6. That no single person is meant by any Angel, I agree with the Answerer. But mark then, in taking the Swethen Soldiers to be the second Angel, it must follow, that each Angel may be made up (a part at least) of Idolaters, Adulterers, Swearers, Drunkards, and most lewd wretches: But I think not so. For though no Angel be a single person, yet my opinion is, that all the persons which shall make up each Angel, shall be sanctified ones, called, and chosen, and faithful, Rev. 17.18.  
2. Either the Answerer or Replyer is much mistaken concerning the Vials: for I do not think, that either the two Witnesses, or the Remnant of the woman's seed, to be any of the seven Angels, Rev. 15.  
Otherwise then, thus: The forty and two months of the Beasts reign being out, one hundred forty and four thousand are upon their work. It is true, the spirit of life from God enters into them: but this is to be understood distinct from the remnant, Rev. 12.17. and after the rising of the Witnesses.  
Answ. To the third Question: I confess, it is my judgement, that the song of the Lamb, Rev. 15.3. and that song, Chap. 14.3. are one and the same; and that Hallelujahs are the effects of the Vials: but with this caution, That the song having several parts and degrees, is not sung all at once; but as the victory ariseth, and grows higher and higher over the Beast, in every generation the song goes on, as the effect of every Vial in its degree and proportion, for the redeemed at that day to sing, i. e. redeemed from among men, Rom. 14.4.  
Repl. We are here so agreed, as I hope we shall no more differ about the beginning of the Vials. You grant, it is one and the same Song. For the Caution, I shall wave it, viz. about parts and degrees, as nothing material: but for the Song, Rev. 14. it is doubtless after the Witnesses are risen. Now you say, It is the same song, (which must be in respect of time and persons, or it's not sense) then, I say, it must needs be after the rising of the Witnesses. Behold how good and how pleasant a thing it is for brethren to dwell even together! Psal. 133.1.  
Answ. The fourth Question hath had a full Answer before.  
Repl. Through mistake, this is the sixth Query, p. 17. The Reader shall have the Answer and Reply, pag. 52, 53, 54, 55, etc.  
In the Copy which my friend had, the fifth Query was thus: To mention but one effect of the Vials supposed to be poured out, viz. the effect of the second Vial on the sea, in which every living thing died: now the question is, How this was fulfilled either by the Parliament in England, or the German war, or any other way, as it is applied unto things past.  
To which the Answer is thus: Under the second Vial, every living thing in that sea (that was turned into blood) died a civil death, and stank like the dead fishes, Exod. 7.18. Isai. 50.2. Psal. 105.29. Every living soul in that sea, that lived, moved, swimmed, and delighted in it, as well the Clergical as Laical, were under the wrath of this Vial. As Beza saith, Whatsoever living creature, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, which is taken for every kind; and so every one, whether Martial, Civil, or Ecclesiastical, died a civil death, yea, and a spiritual also; the sea being brought into a filthy savour to all living ones, or the people of God, by this Vial. Now all that stayed in the sea, so died. Wherefore I find it true, that every soul, i. e. referred to the subject-matter of this Vial, died. For, as Chemnitius saith, such particulae universales non in infinitum extendentur, sed ad materiam subjectam restringuntur.  
Repl. I conceive the Answerer intends here the Swethen war; but he names none. And it was better to forbear the name of persons, time, action, or Country: for it may be as well applied to France, England, Holland, Bohemia, as Germany.  
But 1. Though it be true, a number of Papists died in that War, yet for aught I know, as many of the other party. Besides, things afterward came to that pass, as the PROTESTANTS had more Loss than Advantage by that War.  
2. I do not know what you mean by a spiritual death: if you mean, as to sin, they were as dead before, and so not slain by the Vial. If you apply it to a second death, it is beyond my line.  
3. There was as filthy savour before that War, and since, as then: very little was done that time, either to increase or abate the stink.  
4. What fish soever died in that Sea, (turned into blood) it soon multiplied again: it seems the Sea was not very bloody; for the fish increased and multiplied as fast as before.  
5. I think there is as little ground to carry the second Vial to the Swethen war, as by earth to understand the grosser part of Popery.  
Lastly, I cannot believe that the Swethen Army were ever in the Temple of God, and from thence went forth clothed in pure and fine linen, etc. with golden Vials.  
Besides, to deliver my opinion freely, (and I think most men now are of my opinion) for that Swethen War, more fitly may it be set forth under Kites and Ravens, then by the Eagle, as the Answerer hath described that King of birds.  
The sixth and last Question which my friend had (for the Book hath more than he saw) was this: Whereas some restrain the rising of the Witnesses to the fourth Vial, others to the fifth, we question what Reasons and Grounds such have; and why may not the rising of the Witnesses and first Vial contemporize?  
To which the Answer is: Why the rising of the two Witnesses and the first Vial may not contemporize, I have answered before: that I begun with your Queries.  
Repl. The difference between us is stated here. I think, the rising of the Witnesses, and the beginning of the Vials, contemporize. The Answerer is otherwise minded, and refers his Reader to what he hath written before. For my part, I do the same, and have done for this time. Now if I hear that this which is done be acceptable and useful to the Saints waiting for the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, for whose 〈◊〉 I have published it, I shall (by the good hand of God assisting me) according to that light which the Father of lights hath given in the Vials, speedily set forth an Exposition of them; it being already prepared for that purpose.   
FINIS.   

Courteous Reader,  
BY reason of the Author's far distance from the Press, more Faults have escaped than either He or the Printer could have wished: some of the chief are these: Viz.   

ERRATA.  
The Title over the Pages, should be only (as you find it towards the latter end of the Book) Truth with Time. P. 14. in marg. at the letter a, read, Of this opinion are many good men. P. 16. l. 31. read, to sing the song. P. 31. l. 18. for rather, r. neither. P. 32. l. 30. you must take that Answer to be the answer to the second Reason. P. 50. l. 1. leave out Mr. T●ll.  
Other Mistakes there are, which thou art desired to take notice of, and correct thyself.