A SURVEY OF THE SURVEY of that SUM OF Church-Discipline Penned by Mr. Thomas Hooker, Late Pastor of the Church at HARTFORD upon Connecticot in New England. WHEREIN The Way of the Churches of N. England is now reexamined; Arguments in favour thereof winnowed; The Principles of that Way discussed; and the Reasons of most seeming strength and nerves, removed. By SAMUEL RUTHERFURD, Professor of Divinity in the University of S. Andrews in Scotland.  Revel. 21. 9 
And there came unto me one of the seven Angels, which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will sh●w thee the Bride, the Lamb's wife.  
V. 10. And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and showed me that great City, the holy jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God.  Ezek. 48. 35. And it was round about eighteen thousand (measures,) and the name of the City from that day (shall be) The LORD is there. 
LONDON, Printed by I. G. for Andr. Crook, at the Green Dragon in St Paul's Churchyard. M. DC. LV III.   

Christian READER,  
IT were good there were more believing and less disputing in the world; and that all, especially the Ambassadors of the Prince of Peace, would listen to that 1 Tim. 4. 4. not to give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: as also to consider, that the holy Ghost states an opposition betwixt questions of perverse disputers, and godliness, 1 Tim. 6. 4, 5.  
In this Piece, which the violence of requests in some, the importunity of chiding in others, and the less modest triumphing in not a few hath extorted, rather than willingly brought forth, the question of the preference of humble believing above all factious disputing, even though the subject were the form, the going out and the coming of the house of the Lord, is with me, and (which is of infinite more weight) with the truly godly soon determined: for, Blessed is the servant whom the Master when he cometh shall find watching, praying, believing, not tossing and raising the dust of debating and multiplied Replies and Duplies, since the peace and joy of believing, that we may abound in hope through the power of the holy Ghost, is of great price with those in whom the meekness and gentleness of Christ hath place. For it were desirable, not to be in bondage to either Engine or Pen; and it would appear that there is less of Christ and more of Self in our sickness of overloving these truths, which suffer most bruising and grinding (might I be licenced so to speak) between the Millstones of Sides, Opinions and Contradictions of Parties, as if that were the choicest verity which the man's own engine hath taken out of an Adversaries hand (in a manner) with his bow and his sword. But O how more precious were it, if the holy Ghost had persuaded the man of the sweetness of it from the fountain of holy Scripture! for it is beyond doubting, that syllogisms, and haply thirty two or forty Arguments have not such leading and captivating influences upon the heart, as the convincing light of the Spirit acting upon the supernatural instinct of the new birth, to bring the thoughts captive to the obedience of Christ. For when the head is filled with topics, and none of the flamings of Christ's love in the heart, how dry are all disputes? for too often, servou●of dispute in the head weakens love in the heart. And what can our Paper-industry add to the spotless truth of our Lord jesus? O that Opinions were down, and the Gospel up; and Sides and Parties might fall, and Christ stand; and that all Names, Sects and Ways were low, and the Lord alone exalted! and that we could both dispute for jehovah, and in the same act worship jehovah! There is too much fire stricken out of the letter in our debates: it were good that the Spirit with fire from heaven did animate and inliven the letter and word of our polemics; it were good that the Ministers of the Gospel in the Isle of Britain were well studied and read in that celebrious and noble Text, jesus Christ and him crucified, that we might contend for his high interests, and had the Key of David to open Christ, to commend him in all his loveliness, and people would come and see, and wonder; then should we know how choicer it were to act in ourselves the love of Christ, being warmed and inflamed therewith, than to write the letters of his love in ink and paper, and to declaim of it to others.  
Neither is this spoken to deny but many precious and savoury truths, as Christ himself, have endured contradiction of sinners; but the witnesses both sealed these truths with their blood, and were in their debatings shined upon by the out-letting and emanations of the Spirit of Christ.  
It were safer to lie in the dust and be humbled before the Lord for the breach of Covenant, the vast toleration of false Religions, our vanity of apparel, when we busk and adorn ourselves in filks, even in our state of captivity; for intemperance, execrable swearing, lying, mocking and persecuting of godliness, loathing and hating the godly, covetousness, the barrenness of our profession; and which is the root of all, Atheism, gross ignorance of God and of Jesus Christ, the abounding of many other iniquities, as if we would make it appear, that three England's are scarce sufficient to humble one Scotland. Which is not spoken to justify the Author, or a party from deep accession to these sins, or to clear and acquit the members of our Church from the charge put on them by Mr. Hooker. It's true, we judge it not warrantable to say, that the servants are to call and invite none to the marriage-banquet, but such as they look on as regenerate, and clothed with the wedding-garment; nor to teach, that the Lord of Hosts shall make a feast of fat things, a feast of wine on the lees, of fat things full of marrow, unto, and for a visible society, of which Magus the Sorcerer, judas the Traitor are privileged members; and that the Lord in them shall destroy the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations; 
Isa. 15. 6, 7.  and that in the members of that Church-frame of which we now dispute, it's verified which the Prophet saith, Isa. 30. 26. Moreover, the light of the moon shall be as the light of the sun, and the light of the sun shall be sevenfold, as the ●●ght of seven days, as Mr. H. cited: for without the salvo and ●enitive of a figure, the part for the whole, his Congregational visible Church can never stand under the weight of such glorious Prophecies as are fulfilled in the only really gracious and chosen of God, visible or invisible.  
Yet should the desire of our soul be, that there be upon the bells of the horses Holiness unto the Lord, and the pots in the Lord's house may be like bowls before the altar; yea, that every pot in jerusalem and in judah may be holiness to the Lord of Hosts, Zech. 20. 21. We pray for the coming of his Kingdom, and praise him that the number of those that seek the Lord in Scotland are not diminished, but grow even under evil shepherds and lazy feeders; which is the lily among the thorns, though we go under the name of Protesters, Separatists, hypocrites, unpeaceable, implacable spirits, are made as the filth of the world, and the off-scouring of all things: yea, troubled on every side (in the streets, Pulpits, in divers Synods, Presbyteries, etc. more than under prelacy) yet not distressed; perplexed, but not in despair; persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed. We desire to believe our cry shall come up before the Lord, though we be afflicted and helpless; and look on the right hand, and behold now man knows us, refuge falls us. It's wonder if there be a power now on earth, who saith in reality as job did, when the secret of God was on his Tabernacle, Job 29. 11. When the ear heard me, than it blessed me, and when the eye saw me, it gave witness to me; because I delivered the poor that cried, and the fatherless, and him that had none to help him: the blessing of him that was ready to perish came upon me; and I caused the widow's heart to sing for joy; I put on righteousness, and it clothed me; my judgement was as a Robe and a Diadem; I was as eyes to the blind, and feet was I to the lame; I was a father to the poor, and the cause that I knew not I searched out, etc. And now to other snares this is added:  
That our Brethren have framed and defend one engagement which every Intrant to the Ministry must take and subscribe, otherwise there is no maintenance for him, that he is resolved to live peaceably, and unoffensively under the present government; and how far we are from siding with any seditious, unpeaceable, treacherous, and malignant way, and from raising tumults, is well known; but we dare not deceive our souls, and deal doubly with the Lord, and with the present powers, to make a difference betwixt a resolution to do a duty, and a promise or engagement to do a duty, as our brethren do, when the resolution is declared and subscribed. 2. When it is judicially declared to understanding, and wise men, who cannot take the sense to be, he is resolved for the present, but hath power to alter his resolution to morrow, and judges in conscience he may alter without equivocating. For when the resolution is declared. 2. Judicially inform, declared. 3. When it is declared ad modum compacti, by way of covenant: if the present powers shall give order for his enjoying the stipend, he is resolved to do such a duty. Let any say whether he doth not covenant & promise; and if he speak sincerely as a Minister of Christ, he may not swear the same. This we disown, as no lawful act of a Presbytery, though it be said to be done by a surreptitious meeting of Correspondents from the Synods of this Church, without the knowledge and consent of some and of hundreds of godly Ministers.  
2. As we desire not Presbyterial government to be reproached for such judging, so neither are Prelatical acts of Synods for debarring from the holy ministry men of an holy and unblamable conversation, and for the grace of God in them, and their knowledge and utterance, able and fit to preach the Gospel, upon this account, because they are unpeaceable, and hold up debates, that is, because they will not be satisfied with the public resolutions for taking in to places in the Church, Parliament, Army, Committee of Estates, all the malignant party in the land, or will not promise silence in their matters.  
3. Nor doth it belong to the essence of Presbyterial Government, that all members of this Church, and inferior Judicatures, should so submit to the superior respective Judicatures, that if they be grieved with the sentence, they ought to acquiesce thereunto, and not to contra-act, but only appeal, until there shall be a general assembly to determine the matter. This never was, and I trust, nor shall ever be their mind who are for Presbyterial government; nor do our brethren justly father it upon the general Assembly, 〈◊〉 1648. Sess. 30. For our Church acknowledgeth no subjection nor subordination of inferior Judicatures unto superiors, but in the Lord, and so to submit to any sentence, and to forbear a duty of preaching the Gospel, praying, visiting, exhorting, catechising pastorally in families, to abstain from the Lords Supper, and from acts of due censure necessary for the flock upon the known unjust sentence of a Synod, until a general Assembly (which possibly cannot be convened in an age to determine) is to 1. obey men unjustly forbidding a called Minister of Christ to preach in season, and out of season, rather than God; for they unjustly forbid, and the Lord justly commands; therefore the called Minister must act and contra-act to their unjust sentence, and not forbear for an hour, as the Scripture clears, 2. Tim. 4. 1, 2. Act. 20. 31. 18, 19, 20. 1 Cor. 9 16. Isa. 58. 1. jer. 1. 17. Ezek. 2. 3, 4, 5. & 3. 10, 17. Act. 5. 28, 29. and so this is unjust. 2. It is to make Synods and Ecclesiastical Judicatures Lords of our faith, which the Reformed Churches detest in popish Counsels; for all men and Counsels most lawful can challenge only limited obedience and submission in the Lord to their determinations, if they speak and command according to the Law and the Testimony, Isa. 8. 20. otherwise there is no sight in them. And so it is popish. 3. We conceive in performing acts of that government which Christ owns in his Word, we do not sin; for no authority of a Judicature can make that to be the word of God, and obedience to God, which was not, as to the matter, obedience to God before that authority, nor on the contrary. Now to abstain from preaching, praying, eating and drinking as the Lords Supper in a called minister, and in a visible professor, duly called and fitted, is sin; then cannot the authority of the Church, fat less their known unjust sentence make it lawful. 4. Suppose the general Assembly should ratify and confirm the unjust sentence of the inferior Judicature, or annul their just sentence, the people of God are not obliged to stand to either the one or the other. So we disown the point which our Brethren delivered to us in their papers for union sought by us, as nothing belonging to the essence of Presbyterial government, but reject it as unsound, tyrannical and popish.  
4. As we desire to be humbled for our accession to the sins of the Land, so it's no part of Presbyterial government owned by us, that many unsufficient, ignorant and wickedly weak, not a few, yea, too many scandalous, malignant, and profane Ministers and Elders are in office; and oh if they had not lurked and strengthened themselves in the shadow of such as carry on the public resolutions, and how a purging of the Church is possible (except to him to whom nothing is impossible) is hard to divine, when the body of the Ministry, of whom many are malignant, were prelatical, Arminian (and diverted into us for the 〈◊〉) are ignorant of God, la●y, such as extrude out of their sessions, out of their hearts, godly praying Elders, and call into their place scandalous men, and persecute the godly. When such, I say, are incorporate with the chief leading men of the public Resolutions, and that in opinion, judgement, way, and common counsels and actings, for furnishing Commissions, public Messages to Court, and carrying on the course of desection, and their followers expect they shall not be deserted by their Patrons; and the body of people in congregations are ignorant, profane, and loose, and yet have suffrages in the election of Ministers and Elders, contrary to the word of God, and acts of our Church; and when it's now as it was in the prelatical times, the people love to have it so; and when our Brethren and other opposers have that Catholic advantage known in all ages, to wit, the multitude for them, and against us; and Pulpits have sounded against us in the prelatical language, casting into our bosom that Isa. 65. 5. stand by thyself, come not near me, for I am holier than thou.  
5. Nor look we on the receiving to Church-fellowship men known enemies to the covenant and cause of God, who again and again had broken their engagement, and of many like unto them, any otherwise then as a taking of the name of God in vain, and as an heinous abuse of the ordinance of Church-pardoning and readmitting of penitents.  
6. The admitting of many known unsufficient, and unqualified, and scandalous Ministers and Elders to office in the house of God, and the polluting of the ordinance of the Lords Supper, by admitting thereunto many ignorant and scandalous persons, is to us no part of this Government. Since we earnestly desire the laudable way of the provincial Synod at London for promoving of godliness, and examining of such as are to be admitted to the Lords Supper, and wait to see what the Lord will do for the help of a suffering people, for the gathering of the dispersed of Zion, and building among us the old waste places; nor do we so faint, but we look toward such refreshing words, Isa. 27. 2. In that day sing ye unto her, a vineyard of red wine; I the Lord do keep it, I will water it every moment, lest any hurt it. What is spoken to the whole, the faith of an afflicted part may own it. Isa. 60. 18. Violence shall no more be heard in thy land, wasting, nor destruction within thy borders, but thou shalt call thy walls salvation, and thy gates praise. Isa. 62. 12. And they shall call them the holy people, the redeemed of the Lord; and thou shalt be called, Sought out, a City not forsaken. Isa. 66. 13. As one whom his mother comforteth, so will I comfort you, and ye shall be comforted in jerusalem, and when ye see this your heart shall rejoice, and your bones shall stourish like an herb. Isa. 58. 11. And the Lord shall guide thee continually, and satisfy thy soul in drought, and make fat thy bones, and thou shalt be like a watered garden, and like a spring of water, whose waters fail not. It were not the wisdom of any to disoblige Christ, by either neglecting, or hurting of such as desire to be owned by the Lord Jesus, as his own hidden ones. The Lord was not in the debt of Cyrus for his favour toward his people. He can be angry at all who will not kiss the Son; and better heaven in the length & latitude of it were turned in a mass or web of fiery anger (so it were but creature-wrath) & I were folded in that web, then that I should lie under the Gospel-indignation and anger of the Son of God. But no matter of a despicable handful of such as we are; we are not the godly in Scotland, nor did we ever say we was the only, or all the godly in Scotland; but sure we was either looked on as of the same way, An. 1648. With all that owned Christ, and the godly in the Isle of Britain, or then some did much dissemble with us, though some with whom we took sweet counsel then, do now say we was in an error, An. 1648.  
As I intent to darken the reputation of no man, so far less to undervalue the authority and name of the servant of Jesus Christ, Mr. Thomas Hooker, yea, the Commandment of God lays laws on me to give testimony to his Learning, his dexterous Eloquence and Accuracy in Disputes, and as Christian report bears, to judge him one who walked with God, and preached Christ not with the enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the spirit, and of power. Yet, as I hugely differ from his esteem of these against whom he disputes, in putting them all to the worth of a straw, and every Pen to a nihil dicit, he says nothing; and ranking us among the opposers of Christ's Kingdom, Cerinthus, Ebion, Gnostics, Valentinians, whom godly Fathers did oppose, and with Boniface, Hildebrand, Papists, against whom the Waldenses, Wicliff, Hush, jerom of Prague did witness; and with Prelates, Primates, Metropolitans, as if we were the Prelate's successors, who would keep a dominion in the hands of Elders, so in the particulars in the following disputes; I have apprel ensions far contrary to this man, whose name is savoury in the Churches, concerning the government of Christ's visible Kingdom: and should desire that holiness may shine more eminently in the Churches of Christ; for the first declining of Churches hath its beginning from a loose and profane walk of officers; nor can Assemblies have any other issue then that of which Nazianzen complains, when Pastors are ungodly, than the Sun at noon day goes down upon the Prophets, and Stars fall from Heaven, and the glory of the Lord departs from the Temple. And were our practice more concentric with, and suitable unto our rule, the question of the constitution of visible Churches should be a huge deal narrower. The God of power lead us in all truth.  
Yours in the Lord jesus, SAMUEL RUTHERFURD.   


LIB. I. CAP. I.  
A Survey of the Survey of the Reverend and Godly Servant of GOD, Mr. THOMAS HOOKER.  
The company of Believers without Rulers is no Politic Church; having power of Ordination: What Local Habitation doth to make Church-members.  
Passing what this Learned and Godly man hath said, Chap. 1 Part 1. (in which some things may be noted as Escapes) I come to Chap. 2.  
CHAP. 2. PART 1. c. 11.  
M. Hook. THe visible Church is the adequate subject of our Inquirie.  
Answ. The principal subject is Mr. Hooker his visible Church, yea it is too narrow: the adequate it is not, for the 
The adequate subject of Church discipline is not the visible Church, as M. H. take 〈◊〉 it.  visible kingdom of Christ in concrete, as ruled by Christ, includes the elect and true Believers, for whose sake are all, officers, word; seals, 1 Cor. 3. 21. 22. 2 Cor. 〈◊〉 15. Eph. 1. 22.  
M. H. The Church in her constitution is considered two ways: 1. as totum essentiale or homogeneum, or as totum integrale.  
In the former notion, The Church as a City without a Mayor, hath right to choose its officers, and becomes totum organicum, when officers are in it. Ames. Medu. lib. 1. cap. 33. 18.  
Ans. 1. The argument must so run, 
A Church without officers may not do what a civil corporation without rulers may do.   
What ever a City without a Mayor may do, that may a company of Believers so combined without officers do●.  
Ans. Nothing more false: but of this hereaster. A civil free Corporation may appoint this or that Government, 2. May limit the Mayor to one year to so much power, no more: but M Hooker his new Church cannot do any of these. Amesius there saith not a company of Believers without Officers is a Politic Church. The Scripture in Old or New Testament never said it.  
M. H. As for the manner: Parish precincts, or dwelling within the bounds of a parish cannot make an ecclesiastic right to Church-membership: 
Pag. 13, 14.  For 1. it is but a Civil right that a man hath to his 
What influence habitation hath to make Church-members.  house; 2. Excommunication cutteth a man off from the Church, as if he were an heathen, but not from his house, which is his by birth or purchase: 3. Yea so Papists, Turks, Dogs, should be Church members, to whom Christ hath denied all right. Revel. 21. 27.  
Ans. We grant Parish dwelling simply in a Professor gives not right to be a member of the City of God, but Parish dwelling tali modo is a necessary condition, without which they cannot be fixed members of that congragation, to meet in one house, suppone after supper, as Act 207. 1 Cor. 11. 20, 21, 22. and therefore we condemnn our brethren, who failing on the other extreme, will have persons residing in Old England to be married members to one only Cong●…on v●…ble in New England, and to no other visible Church●… 〈◊〉, and deny all Church-communion of the Catholic 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to all visible Professors, who are sojourners, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ●●●range excommunicating of visible Professors, 2. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 residence; for shall they watch over one another, as they are obliged, by a Church oath, suppose their Church be beyond the Line, and they on this side of it? 3. This full well shall gratify Anabaptists, who will have it no mercy, that infants are born in Zion, or in any Believers house, as the Scripture saith it is, Gen. 17. 12. Psal 87. 5. 1 Cor. 7. 14. Rom. 11. 16. the reasons are not so sure, for birth does it not, but to be born of such Parents at Corinth, makes over to the Infants of Believers, a to be born in Zion, to be born in believing Abraham's house, Gen. 17. 12. Psal. 87. 7. a right to be members of that Church, else upon what right shall they be baptised? As for the place, Rev. 21. 27. Pignetus; Pareus, Piscator, Diodati, English Annotators, Bullinger Nepar, expone the place of the Church in heaven: Marlorat and many others of the invisible Church, and the Text excludes all from that Church but such as are written in the book of life, and so to me it is unpertinent to the purpose, and not concludent.   

CHAP. II.  
Of visible Saints. 2. M. H. reasons to prove that his visible Saints are only members of the visible Church, are discussed.  
MAster Hooker first states the question, then brings reasons 
Survey p. 1. c. 2. pag. 14, 15.  to prove such visible Saints to be the only matter of the visible Church. Saints in charity are such in practice and profession (if we look at them in course, by experience or report) as they savour so much, as they had been with jesus. From all which so much as rational charity directed by rule from ●k● Word, a man cannot but conclude, but there may be some seeds of some spiritual work of God in the soul.  
Answ. If any one word of God were given to prove what 
M. H. his visible Saints are not the only fit matter of the visible Church, nor is it proved but by conjectures.  must be proven, it were good: 1. That Magus, all the three thousand, Act. 2. all the multitude baptised by john, Mat 3. Mark 1. 5. Luk 4. were to Philip, to the Church of Sa●aria, to godly john Bap●ist, to the twelve Apostles, such in practice and profession, as they savoured so much as they had been with jesus; so heavenly a savouriness is not, in one jot, holden out in the Word, the Baptist looks on them as v●pers, and was it fit to omit the styles of Saints, justified, sanctified? 2. The Tryers most have experience of their practice and profession: this shall take days and months to eat (as they say) much salt with them, the Apostles, that same day in few hour's time, baptised them, Act. 2. Who can believe that the huge multitude lived on Locusts and Wild Honey in the Wilderness, until john should experimentally find a generation of vipers moulded into a new frame to savour of the things of the spirit? 3. There is nothing here of 1. Tryers and Judges: 2. Nothing of a Judicature: 3. Nothing of Letters, Witnesses, Testimonies from the Churches: 4. Nothing of the rule of the Word compared with their habitual conversation (which must take a tract of days) 5. Nothing of a sentence admitting some for their spiritual savouriness, rejecting others for that bad smell, and denying them Church-fellowship until they be better tried: all conjectures.  
1. The conclusion is not any thing but (a may be) and that may bear a (may not be) and if it were proven by the Word, that Professors right to the Covenant of God, to the Word, Promises, Seals, depended upon men's rational judgement of Charity, it might quiet the conscience: But a● shall not the Lord be a God to a people, except the people themselves judge in the judgement of charity, that the people so confederate, savour all of them, as if they had been with jesus? and except they from experience can conclude, there may be some seeds of some spiritual work of God in the souls of all these people? Ah, the Lord then cannot say to a nation and a society, I am your God, while first he asks the Church's leave.  
M H. 1. Reason. The members of Christ's Body are fit alore to be members of a true Church, because that is the body of Christ. 
Pag. 15. M. H. 1. Arg.  1 Cor. 12. 12. Ephes. 4. 12, 13.  
But only visible Saints, who according to the rules of reasonable charity may be conceived to have some special good in them, are only members of Christ's Body:  
For to have a member, which neither doth, nor ever did receive any power or virtual impression, in the kind of it, from the head is not only against reason but against that reference and correspondence, which the members have to the head. Now visible Saints only, according to the former explication can be said, by the rules of reasonable charity, to have some virtual influence of some spiritual operation from Christ as a head: therefore such only are members of a Church.  
Answ. No man seems more to study to darken the matter, than the reverend arguer. 1. He omits all along the word (visible) which is mainly in question. 2. He himself is forced to distinguish a two fold headship of Christ; for Christ is head 
Christ is two ways a head by M. H. his way.  to the visible Church, either politic, according to the politic government and guidance he lends to it, or according to the influence of saving grace & life: the members of Christ's body according to the politic external government are fit alone to be members of a true Church visible, or truly visible; such as Magus, 
Or where Christ is in Scripture called the head of Magus, M. R. desires to know.  Demas, and many gifted men are, the proposition is true and granted. But only visible Saints, who according to the rules of reasonable charity may be conceived to have some special good, or which is all one, to be real believers, are only members of Christ's body, according to politic and external government, the assumption is false, and never proved; a mere begging of the question, for not only such as are conceived in charity to to be real converts, such as Magus, judas, etc. but also Peter, john, and such as profess subjection to the Gospel; and withal do really believe, 〈◊〉 members of the true visible Church, and the Lords visible confederates, whether they be 
Men are the confederate people of God visibly, without any man's passing his judgement thereupon.  conceived to have some special good of conversion, and saving grace in them; or not; nor does the formality of a visible member, or a visible confederate depend upon the judgement of men: And it is most false (which is said in the probation) that only conceived and so judged visible Saints have the politic influence of some spiritual operation from Christ the head; for godly professors, whether they be conceived and judged, or not conceived or judged godly professors, have both real and internal in foro Dei, and also external and ecclesiastic right to the ord●…ces of Christ, should all the world say the contrary. And by our brethren's nay, workers of iniquity, and these that are never known nor chosen of God, but are exactly g●lded hypocrites, and never receive any power or trial at all in their kind, from their head Christ; as may be proved from Matth. 7. 22, 23. Matth. 22. 11, 1●. Matth. 13. 47. 48. Matth. 25. 3. 2 Tim. 3. 3. are visible Saints, not because they are so, but because they are falsely so esteemed by men to be such. Hence 1. our brethren's way makes not a whit a cleaner visible Church then our way. 2. The politic influence of Christ the head upon such painted tombs, can be none at all before their membership. How then can they have virtual influence of some spiritual operation from the head? supposed influence is no influence at all. And not any of these tex●s say that the Church, 1 Cor. 12. 12. and Ethes. 4. 12, 13. is not the body of Christ visible, except men conceive it to be his visible body; such new divinity is unknown to Scripture: If the other part of the distinction be applied to the argument, both the propositions shall be false; so the members of Christ's body by the influence of saving grace are fit alone to be members of the true visible Church: nothing is more false, for then the true visible Church should be made up of only true and real converts; glad shall Anabaptists and Familists be of this doctrine, and except the propositions be so taken, M. H. but paints us a false Church.  
3. The places, 1 Cor. 12. 12. Eph. 4. 12, 13 speak nothing of Mr hooker's single congregation, but of the Catholic visible Church, which shall meet all in the unity of faith, and in which the Lord hath set Apostles, 1 Cor. 12. 28. and 4. 14, 15. and that is not a single congregation.  
4. Though the places speak of the visible Church, yet do not these places say that the visible Church as visible, but as the real mystical body of Christ, which shall be glorified with Christ, is called Christ, Ephes. 4. 13. 〈◊〉 Cor. 12. 12, 13. and the body of Christ, by the influence of saving grace.   

CHAP. III.  
Other arguments of M. hooker's for the constitution of the Church of his visible Saints.  
MAster hooker's two reasons.  
These are ●is to be members of Christ's Church that are 
M. H. his Second Arg. part. 1. pag. 16, 17.  subjects of Christ's kingdom.  
The Church is the visible kingdom, in which Christ reigns by the sceptre of his word, ordinances and discipine: he is our king, he is our Lawgiver; they, who are in professed rebellion, are traitors, not subjects, the members of the body are under the motion and guidance of the head; Wolves are contrary to it. But visible Saints, as formerly described, are only subjects of this kingdom. Christ is the king of Saints, not of Drunkard's, Atheists, they alone Saints) proclaim subjection in their practice.  
Answ. The term (only) is wanting in the proposition, which is in the assumption and conclusion, contrary to right Logic.  
2. These are fit to be members of Christ's Church visible) that are subjects (by an influence of grace, to wit, from their head and king calling effectually, Acts 15. 14, 15. Isai. 55. 4. 5. and giving them repentance and forgiveness of sins, Acts 5. 31.) of the kingdom of Christ, visible or invisible; the proposition is true, but that such visible Saints as Magus and judas the traitor (which are the visible Saints M. H. defines 
M. H. 2. Arg. That real Saints only are members and subjects of the visible Church and of Christ's visible kingdom, the place Isai. 33. 22. doth not prove that M. H. his visible Saints are the only matter of the visible Church. Marlorat. comment. in Isai. c. 3●. 20. tentorium firmum) adeo ut ne portae inferorum adversus eam praevaleant, Matth. 16. 18. joan. Piscator. v. 20. adhuc alloquitur pios judaeos. Calvin. in Locum. quin dominus in medio ejus, ideo non commovetur. Muscul. 16. oves meas nemo rapiet è manu mea. Calv. in vers. 22. notandum hic quae vera sit ecclesia Dei scil. (Deum) logislatorem & regem agnoscit. Bullinger. in locum, ita instruct à gratiâ Dei ut malis nec cedat nec frangatur, sed semper permaneat firma.  in terminis, part. 1. cap. 2. pag. 15. conclus. 2.) are subjects and only subjects of this kingdom, as his assumption says in express terms, is most false; now that the argument must mean of the subjects of Christ's kingdom real, and of members by the influence of saving grace from Christ their head and king, I prove from the argument that M. H. brings from Isa●. 33 22. for M. H. his visible Saints Magus and judas cannot. 〈◊〉 Say, the Lord is our Lawgiver, the Lord is our judge, the Lord is our king and he will save us; if Sorcerers and Traitors should say so they should lie. Isaiah speaks of real converts and the true Zion, whose stakes and cords shall never be removed, so as the gates of hell (saith Marlorat on the place) shall not prevail against them. He speaketh (as yet saith Piscator) to the godly jews; so that (saith Calvin) God is in the miast of her; therefore she shall not be moved: for (saith Musculus) my sheep shall no man pluck out of my hand. 2. He speaketh of these (not of such as judas and Magus) who shall be protected and saved by the Lord, vers. 21, 22. he speaks of the true Church which acknowledges God her Law giver and King so Calvin; the Church (saith Bullinger) is so armed with the grace of God, that she yields not to evils, nor is broken, but remains ever sure. 3. He speaks of that kingdom and people, whose inhabitants shall not say, I am sick, the people that dwell 
Calvin. vers. 24. notat● dignum est, quod soli ecclesiae cives hoc privilegio (remissionis) ornantur. Gualther in loc. ad solam ergo ecclesiam & ●ujus cives illa pertinent. Lutherus in loc. quia habet pius populus propitium Deum, condonabuntur ejus peccata.  therein, their iniquity shall be forgiven them, vers. 24. only the citizens of the Church (saith Calvin) are adorned with this privilege, pardon of sins; and it pertains (saith Gualther) to the Church only and h●…r citizens; because (saith Luther) the godly people hath a God gracious, therefore their sins are forgiven. So Bu●inger, Oecolampadius, Diodati, English Divine, Zwinglius, and the popish interpreters, Carthusianus, Vatablus, Arias, Montanur, Corn. à Lipide, Gasp. San●lius, Lyranus, never man before pious M. Hooker, expoun●…d the place of such visible Saints, as have room in this house, to wit, Witches and Traitors. 2. To Si●n a single congregation, as if the gates of hell could not prevail against such ciphers: And 3. he must not be K●ng and Lawgiver (by this way) to godly visible believers, when their congregation is broken, dissipated by persecution, death of officers, O poor comfort!  
But these are fit to be members in Christ's Church that are subjects in Christ's kingd me, by influence of politic guidance and common gifts; the proposition in that sense is neither proved by Isaiah 33. 22. or any reason, but the just contrary conclusion, to wit, that believing and really pardoned Zion, verse 22. 23, 24. must be the persons that make up the kingdom of Christ: nor does it conclude any thing but contrary to M. H. and the way of the congregation, to wit, Ergo only such as are visible Saints, according to the politic influence and common gifts, are fit to be members of the visible Church; which is a most false conclusion, for also true believers sincerely professing the faith, and who are subjects of Christ according to the influence of saving grace, remission and pardon, v. 22, 23, 24. are fi● to be, and really are members of the visible Church, except the argument conclude that only hypocrites appearing to be believers real, are fit to be members of the visible Church, which is most false by the grant of adversaries, and by the truth itself.  
3. M. H. suppresseth the conclusion, and proves the proposition, that real believers are fit to be members of the mystical and true Church, which neither we, nor he deny; and the term in rational charity directed by the word, which should be in both propositions, is neither mentioned in the Argument, not in the Scriptures and Proofs, an unknown way of arguing: and for the assumption,  
But visible Saints (that is, Saints in the judgement of charity ruled by the word) are only subjects of his kingdom.  
M. H. never so much as touches, nor labours to prove, nor is there a Scripture in old or new Testament to prove that men cannot be the subjects of Christ's visible Kingdom, except Apostles, or some visible society declare and pass a judicial sentence that they are subjects of his visible kingdom. 
So the Donatists. Augustin. contra Epist. Parme. l. 11. c. 3. manua nim vestrae sanguine coinquinatae sunt. ●…mo loquitur ju●●a, &c Respo. Austin. Quos isto loco Scriptura describit, ubicunque fuorint inter bonos, non obsunt bon●; sic ut non obest palca frumentis, etc.   
4. The probation is fan toto coelo from the conclusion to be proven. They (saith he) who carry themselves in professed rebellion, they are traitors, not subjects— and Christ is the King of Saints, not of drunkards, Atheists, etc. It's true, he is no visible king to visible Pagans, nor are they as visible professed Atheists, subjects of his visible kingdom. And who teaches any such thing, and against whom doth M. Hooker dispute? if there be any such members in our Church, not censured, and if obstinate, not casten out, it is the sinful and abused practice of men, and we profess we desire to be humbled before the Lord that our Ministers and assemblies received into our Church, men guilty of perjury drunkenness, shedding of the blood of the people of God in the defence of the cause and sworn reformation, and that our Ministers and Elders, (ah to many of them) are scandalous, baters and mockers of piety, though our Church was in as fair way of purging the house of God, but now by the present stroke, we are deprived of liberty so to do, but that is nothing concludent 
Sec Augustin. de unitat. Eccles.  against the right government of Christ, Christ is not the head and king of professed rebels; true, nor is he head and king, in a saving way, of latent rebels, or of your visible Saints, such as Magus and judas, ergo he is head and king to none as visible members, but to men only judged in charity, led by the word to be real converts, no logic can prove the consequence. But our mind is that Christ is visible head by influence of gifts, ordinances, and external guidance to all to whom he says, I will be your God, and who profess subjection to him, whether the Church shall judge them real converts, or not judge them so. M. H. arg. 3. pag. 17. 
If visible Saints be not members,  
Then non-visible Saints may be members.   
The latter is absurd, than these who in the judgement of charity are members of the devil, may be conceived members of Christ in the same judgement of charity: charity then must pluck out her 
M. H. his contradiction of visible Saints membere and non-visible Saints members is naught.  eyes. Answ. 1. here is as good a contradiction, if any goodness there be in these. 
If such as are only visibly Saints, Magus, judas, be no members, but rotten ones:  
Then such as are non-visibly Saints, such as Peter, Paul, who are really justified and chosen, are fit visible members.   
Let M. H. choose him, by his own contradiction which (he saith) divides the breadth of being (though this fancied contradiction divide neither the breadth nor the sixteenth part thereof)  
If only visibly justified and chosen Saints, who are such really, are not visible members:  
Then none visibly justified and chosen Saints are fit members visible.  
The antecedent is true, and Simon Magus is not a visible member to M. Hooker, by this account; and the latter is contradicent to M. hooker's way: for then one who is to the eye of charity visibly justified and chosen, and that really by M. H. metaphysic, which so divides the breadth of being, as Peter visibly believing, and thereby really blessed, Matth. 16. 16, 17. shall be to the same eye of charity not visibly justified and chosen, but in the miscarrying judgement of charity, shall be no visible member, according to the reality thereof, as Simon Magus; and therefore the definition of a visible member cannot agree both to Peter visibly believing, and to Magus visibly believing; for there is a real contradiction between Peter his believing real, and Magus his believing real, as good Logic demonstrates: but the latter is absurd, for both Peter and Magus are visible Saints. Let any man help M. H. in his metaphysic here.  
2. Aristotle long ago taught us that there is no contradiction, 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. l. 1. Aristot. de reprehends. Sophist. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. The Church passeth no judgement upon Magus when he is a member admitted and baptised, that either he is a real chosen, or a real conv●…, 〈◊〉 real non-chosen or a real non. convert, but their judgement abstracteth from both.  when the contradiction is not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉: now there is a mids betwixt a visible Saint, as M. Hooker means, and a no visible Saint; for his visible Saint is, one who by the Church is judged a real convert and his no visible Saint is one who is judged no real convert, example of the former is Peter, or Magus, an example of the latter is an unbaptized Pagan so judged: now the mids to us Simon Magus when he is baptised, and we teach that Philip and the Church of Samaria neither passed any judicial sentence of Magus as a real convert, nor yet as any non-reall convert, and therefore to the eyes of reason and charity (which need not to be plucked out, but have their own use) Magus, when he is admitted a visible member, is neither a real member of the devil, nor a real member of Christ, but a professor, and the judgement of the Church is abstracted both from the eternal election and the eternal reprobation of Magus, and from the real conversion or the real non-conversion of Magus. And we desire one jot or word of Scripture where the servants Matth. 22. are thus limited as M. H. supposeth, invite none to come to the wedding of the King's son but such only as you judge to be really converted and clothed with the wedding garment: the parable saith no such thing, but the contrary, verse 9 as many as ye find bid to the marriage; yea v. 14. saith, the inviters have nothing to do to judge whether they be chosen or effectually called, or not chosen or non-effectually called, though one of them in themselves they must be. And when the Maids of wisdom Prov. 9 are sent out, reads M. H. of such a limited commission, see you call in and admit none within the doors of wisdom's house but only such as you judge to be the spiritual new born children of wisdom: yea the Maids expressly call in the fools and the simple ones to be made wise, v. 4 whereas M. H sup●…oses, they have eaten the dainties of wisdom, before ever they come in a● wisdom's door. And so against common sense in lieu of an argument, he begs the question; so  
If M. hooker's visible Saints only be not members, prove that there are such visible Saints first: otherwise the Papists may say,  
If our visible Bishop be not the visible head of the Church, Then our non-visible Bishop may be head.  
We grant all, and then M. H. bids us yield to what he saith without probation, and tells us it is absurd that his non-visible Saints be members, and so his visible Saints are men in the moon to us, and in reality of truth no such thing.   

CHAP. FOUR  
The place Psal. 50. 16. What hast thou to do to declare my statutes, is discussed, and saith nothing for M. H. his visible members.  
MAster Hooker his fourth reason. 
The same in an other dress, the Donatists' object to Augustin contra Epist. Parmenian l. c. 2. 9 objiciunt, ut quid exponis justificationes meas, etc. It's a naughty consequence, hypocrites are sinfully unfit to be members without the Church's knowledge, ergo the Church sins in admitting of them.   
These who are excluded from his covenant, and meddling with that as unfit, they are not fit to have Communion with the Church; for to that all the holy things of God do in a special manner appertain. It's God's house, and there all his treasure lies, the keys of the kingdom are given to them, to them all the oracles, ordinances, and privileges ●o belong.  
But these who hate to be reform, and cast away his command, they have nothing to do to take his covenant in their mouth. Psal. 50. 16.  
Answer,  
It is to be observed, 1. that M. H. leaves the conclusion to the reader, and sets down a proposition and an assumption all along, such as they are: 2. he never concludes what is denied, ergo, only such visible Saints are members of the visible Church: 3. he speaks most ambiguously, such hypocrites are not fit to have communion with the Church. What Church? he knows the question is of the visible Church only, for he grants part. 1. c. 2. conclus ●3. pag. 27. 28. that such as are found to be corrupted and gross hypocrites being now received members, though they were not so when first admitted, are so far fit to have communion with the Church visible, as they must be tolerated and remain members, until they be judicially examined, convinced, and censunes applied for reformation: 4, it is one thing to prove that open hypocrites should not be admitted members of the visible Church, but it is the sin of the so knowing admitters, for which M. R. now disputes; and a far other thing which M. H. proveth, to wit, it is not fit that hypocrites have communion with the Church: what a lax disputing is this? they that eat and drink unworthily, 1 Cor. 11. 28. 29. and eat things sacrificed to idols, 1 Cor. 10. 21. should not have communion with the Church in the holy ordinances, would Paul therefore infer such, though converts, are not to be admitted members of the visible Church? it is not fit, yea it is sin, that either professed non-converts, or latent non-converts have communion with the Church, for their very profession of the name of Christ, when there is no reality in the thing, is a most sinful unfitness in Magus, in judas, will it follow Ergo the Church sins in admitting Magus and judas? 5. the state of the question is overturned, for the scope of Psal. 50. 16, 17. as Calvin, Musculus, Marlorat, Diodati, English Divines observe well, is to press a sincere reality in profession, and to condemn outward sacrificing and crying, we are in covenant with God, not only without repentance and praying and praising in faith, 12. 13. 14. 15. 16. but when the so professing hypocrites were compartners with thiefs, adulterers, etc. v. 18. 19 20. but the place speaketh not one jot that the Church ought not to have admitted such to be members of the visible Church: 6. Let it be remembered that M. H. here makes the Jewish Church a sampler of the visible single congregations under the new Testament: 7. and since all the holy things of God were committed to the Church of the Jews, Rom. 31. 2. Rom. 9 4, 15 Psal. 147. 19, 20. Deut. 29. 10, 11. If the 
M. H. must make all Israel savoury professors and real converts in the judgement one of another, before ever the Lord of free grace called them to be his people.  Lord called them not, nor planted them into a Church-frame, nor admitted them members, until first they were contrary to these hypocrites Psal. 50 16. 17. and until there was not only a professed willingness to receive the gospel, (I speak the language of M. H. 16 pag. 28.) but a practical reformation in their profession (Survey part. 1. cap. pag. 14. 15.) that they savoured so much, as they had been with jesus, and if so be they must have been the true Israel in men's esteem, before the Lord called and choosed them to be his people, it must follow that God choosed not Israel to be his Church of free 
M. Can necessity of Separate. Sect. 3. 176 177. an. 1642. objected the same, and M. H. does but an. 1648. repeat the same, and M. Ball answers it pag. 30. 71. The wicked are forbidden to meddle with the covenant of God: does David say, they are fobidden only at their first admission to be members to b●eak the third commandment in taking the covenant in their mouth while as they are wicked, and if so, jezabel continuing a member is not forbidden to meddle w●th the covenant; yea the scandalous members which (as M. H.) must be tolerated for a time a●e fit members, and may take the covenant in their mouth.  grace and love, but when they were now professors and practically reform, and a people calling upon God in the day of trouble, offering thanksgiving, paying vows, loving instruction, contrary to these hypocrites Psal. 50, 14, 15 16, 17, 18. which is gross Pelagianism, and contrary to the word of God, 2 Chron. 2. 11. Deut. 7, 6, 7, 8. Psal, 47 4. Psal. 78, 68  
8. Nor is it true that all oracles, ordinances, and privileges do belong to the visible Church, as visible in M. H. sense, i. e. to every single congregation: for there is, there may be a single congregation which there is not one chosen of God, but all made up of such stuff as Magus and judas, yea and the promises of an everlasting covenant, and the privileges of election, effectual calling, perseverance, glorification, are not made to single Churches or kingdoms, provinces, since the famous Churches of Rome, Ephesus, Thessalonica, of Asia are horribly fallen, these previledges belong firstly and principally to the Catholic visible Church as Mystical and invisible both subjectiuè and finaliter, or objectively, especially as they are Gods treasures.  
M. H. pag. 18. M. R. yields the causes while he granteth the wicked are forbidden, what to be Church members? no, but to take the covenant of God in their mouth, for if they come to see their sin, reform their evil ways, they are non-visible Saints, therefore while they remain haters of reformation, they are not visible Saints, and have no title to be Church-members.  
Answ. The cause is never a whit the more yielded, because of M. H. his mistake in proving one thing for another: the Lord, Psal. 50. 16, forbids hypocrites remaining hypocrites to take the Lords covenant in their mouth, but I said not, therefore he forbids the Church to take in any as members but these only to come to see th●ir sin and to reform their evil way, as M H. saith (which is indeed to yield the cause) for if they who leave the ways of Paganism, judaism, Popery, and the ways of sin, profess they are willing to be the disciples of Christ if the profession be not grossly and knownly hypocritical, and their coming in be not for by-ends and to betray the cause, but morally ingenuous and negatively sincere, the Church is to receive such, and is not forbidden to admit them as members, whether to the knowledge of the Church they be real converts or not real converts. I grant it is another thing, if they refuse to come and to be baptised, Luk. 7. 29, 30. Luk. 14. 17, 18. sure no man can be a Church-member against his will. 2. The Lord may well rebuke Magus and judas while they are Church-members, the same way that he rebukes the hypocrites, Psal. 50. 16, 17. and say what have you to do to declare my statutes, etc. for I know your hearts, how you hate instruction, etc. and yet the Church sins not in admitting them.  
3. M. H. confounds these two, to wit, the seeing of sin, and reforming of their evil way, which is real and sincere repentance, if it be a saving sight of sin, they sincerely repent, if it be counterfeit, to wit, the giving evidence of godly sorrow and repentance, the Church may see the latter, and yet Magus and judas remain under the same reproof, for they may in their heart hate instruction, and act these sins of partaking with thiefs secretly, and be secret adulterers, and the word may reprove them, and yet there is no blame in the Church in either admitting them, or in bestowing Church-priviledges upon them.   

CHAP. V.  
Of the call of God to make a Church, 2. there may be a true visible Church, and members thereof, before there be any seals in that Church. Whether the preaching of the word be an essential mark of the Church.  
MAster Hooker pag 18.  
M. Rutherfurd: such as internally hate to be reform may be ordinary hearers and so members.  
M. H. if ordinary hearing made a member, then excommunicate persons should be members for they are ordinary hearers. Ans. If M. R. make every ordinary hearing to make a member of the Church ordinary and entire, he saith something. 2. This twitcheth the question whether the preaching of the Gospel be an essential note and mark of the visible Church. Before I speak how far persons excommunicate are members or not members of the visible Church, hence 1. Any sort of profession, 
How ehe preaching of the Gospel is a note of the visible Church, and how not.  whether by an avowing of that Gospel to one another, or suffering for it, even when the shepherds are smitten and the flock scattered is a practical and very speaking mark, that such a company is a true Church. 2. A pastoral publishing of the word is a special mark and an great-half of a note of a Ministerial, Politic, Church. Though the administration of the seals to those capable of them added thereunto make a more complete mark of a more complete Ministerial Church. 3. The active call of God by the preached word may be transient and occasional to mocking Athenians, Act. 17. and yet intended to save some, and to be a seed to some Church, v. 34. certain be lead, this is the seed of some Church, like some corns of wheat scatteredly fallen in a field that may have an harvest, 4. This active call may be refused, and the refusers never be the Church, Luk. 14 16, 17. not visible members, they visibly refusing the call and counsel of God and neglecting obstinately to be baptised, Luk. 7● 30. 5. But we mean, beside this active call some passive professing and receiving of, and yiel●…g to the offered Gospel. So as they came to the marriage-supper, whether they have, or want a wedding garment. Mat. 22. and receive the seed, whether they be thorny, rocky, or a wayside ground, or they be good soil, and may yield some external obedience; in this consideration, Pagans and Turks are not passively 
There may be a Church and Church-members before there be any Seals.  the called of God, nor members of the visible Church, though they be hearers; but that they be ordinary fixed hearers, and yet in no sort external professors, but remain without, and be Pagans, is not conceivable, except they professedly hear for curiosity, or to mock, or to undermine the Gospel and Church, and so they are not to be admitted to be hearers or Church members, except by violence they thrust themselves in among hearers. 1. Abraham called with his house to leave idolatry obeyeth the calling, buildeth an altar to the Lord, Gen. 12. 1, 2, etc. 18. Professeth and teacheth as a Prophet, the doctrine of the covenant, and God appearing revealeth the Gospel to him, Genes. 12. v. 2, 3 Genis. 15. 4, 5, 6, 7. and he believeth, and so he, and his house is a visible Church, when, not while many years after, and until he was ninety years and nine, the seal of circumcision was ordained, and given to him and his house. Genes. 17. 1, 2, 3. and the Church is a true visible Church in the wilderness, in which was the Angel, of the covenant who spoke to Moses in mount Sina. Act. 7. 38. (which is a note and mark of a true visible Church. Revel. 1. 20. Rev. 2. 1.) which yet wanted circumcision and the passover, forty years in the wilderness. josh. 5. 5, 6, 7. this proves that there is a true visible Church, where Christ is, and yet wanteth the ordinary seals, Baptism and the Lords supper. 2. When the Apostles first planted Churches, we have no ground, that they 
An hearing and Church-profession may be in persons and societies before they be baptised.  preached to Ephesus, to Galathia, to Philippi, to Corinth, where God had much people (as the Lord before had told Paul) Act. 16. 6, 7, 10, 11, 12, 13. Act. 18. 7, 8, 9, 10. and that they framed them not into Churches, until, to the satisfaction of the judgement of charity of the Apostles, they were converts, and so to them all chosen to eternal life, and until they did, first, being a number of visible converts, choose Paul and other planters of the Churches, for their Pastors, whereas they preached to them for their conversion, as no pastors at all; before that choosing, but as gifted men, for that hath not the least shadow of truth in the word: so also they did first hear the Gospel as Disciples and visible Professors, before they could be baptised or received to the other seal, as is evident, by the eunuchs professed reading and ask the meaning of that which he read. Isai. 53. Act. 8. 29, 30, 31. and his professed seeking to be baptised, and the jailors professed hearing, and ask what he should do to be saved. A●●. 16. 30, 31, 32. and by the hearing and pofessing of all his house, before they were baptised, and the Corinthians, hearing and believing. Act. 18. 8. And Lydia, and her houses hearing. Act. 16 14, 15. and the Gentiles reverend professed hearing the word. Act. 10. 33, 44, 45, 46. and the three thousand, Act. 52. hearing and saying, (which was a fair visible profession) men and brethren, what shall we do? before any of them were baptised. Act. 2. v. 37, 41, 42, 43. which proveth, that both active preaching of the Gospel, and a professed receiving thereof go before men be inchurched. And yet if these may be, to wit, hearing and professed receiving, here is an essential mark by which persons, before they receive the seals, are made members visible and disciples, and societies visible, and Churches essentially differenced, 1. From all the false Churches visible on earth, who have not the sound of the word preached, and professedly heard, and visibly received, and 2. from all civil societies, 3. from all Pagan, and Heathen societies on earth. Ergo they were a distinct Christian society, differenced essentially, and if they should all die before they had been baptised, or had received the seals, they had been true visible Church-members; and if killed for the truth, they had died visible professing Martyrs, and the called Church of Christ.  
3. The visible Church is a thing, whose being is in succession 
The visible Church is a society daily more and more inchurched.  and daily growing, and is a society daily more stated (as it were) in a Churchway, according as the active calling on the Lord's part, and his people's yielding thereunto in a daily profession go on, as Isai 65. 2. the Lord all the day long calleth, and (to speak so) inchurcheth daily people by the preached word. Math. 23. 37. How often would I have gathered you? Jer. 7. 25. he sendeth his Prophets, early in the morning, and late at night to call. Hence if that which is the essential mark of the Church visible, to wit, the preaching of the Gospel, be the only instrument, and the draw-net of pulling out and calling of men into fellowship with Christ, by the word preached: And if the seal do only confirm converts, as discipline keepeth the visible kingdom clean from visible scandals, then are these who professedly in that society partake and receive that essential mark, and yield externally thereunto, members of the visible Church, and a society made up of such a true visible Church, though they receive not yet all the ordinances, and are as the outer court, which is a part of the temple. But the active calling of God by the preached word, and the people's professed yielding thereunto, and their ordinary professed hearing, is such a mark, both by the word of God, and all our Protestant Divines, Calvin, Beza. B●l. P. Martyr, Bucanus, Tilenus, Piscator, Musculus, Gualther, junius, Pareus, Zanchius, Professors of Leideu, Willet, jewel, Reynald, Trelcatius, Sadeel, Polanus, etc. Fathers, Counsels old and late, and our brethren cannot build their new Churches, but by losing the foundation-stones laid by these worthy builders, and the Scripture maketh feeding of the flocks & setting up the shepherd's tents. Cant. 1. 7, 8. jer. 3. 15. Feeding of the flock, and the feed flock. Act. 20. 28. 1 Pet. 6. 1. The golden candlestick in the preached word, and these in the house to whom it giveth light, the only mark of a true visible Church, so is it prophesied it shall be under the new Testament. Isai. 2. 3. Many people and nations shall go, and say, Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lords house: how shall the visible mountain be known? and he will teach us his ways, and we will walk in his paths, for out of Zion (the visible Church) shall go 
Our brethren and the Soci●i●●● give us a very uncertain way of knowing the Church. Remonst in apolog. c. 22 doctrinae praedicatio est anterius quid Ecclesiâ quid absurdius? Erge id quod aliquando prius est ecclesiâ, eâdem posterius erit: nota enim notate suo posterior est. Idci●…ò qui● p aedicati● est aliquande instrume●…um ecclesiae collig●…, non po●…sse cert● atque infell thi●●s nota e●… oll●…. vide fol 241. 2●2.  forth the Law, and the word of the Lord from jerusalem, so Isai. 62. 6. The visible city is known. I have set watchmen upon thy walls, O jerusalem, which shall never hold their peace, (but preach and pray) day nor night, Psal. 147. 19 He showeth his word unto jacob, his statutes and his judgements to Israel. And that proveth them to be a Church differenced from other societies, v. 20. He hath not dealt so with any nation. I grant statutes and judgements include seals, sacrifices as all the privileges. Rom. 6. 4, 5. to whom pertained the adoption and the glory, and the covenants and the giving of the Law. Yet by the word sound preached is faith begotten, Rom. 10. 14, 15 And the flock fed, and the disciples made. Matthew 28. 19, 20 It is taught, that sacraments do but confirm faith, now a Ministerial begetting of children is (to speak so) more essential to the visible Church, then to confirm them. 2. that doctrine is not to be holden, which teacheth us no way of certain knowing by faith what is the true visible Church to which we may adjoin ourselves, and what not, but teacheth us a conjectural way only of finding the true visible Church, as Socinians, and Arminians, who tell us the notes of the true Church are not necessary to be known. 2. There is no certain way of knowing the true visible Church, now our way that maketh the profession of the sound doctrine of the Gospel a note of the true Church, holdeth out a way of knowing by certainty, by faith which is the true Church; as we know which is the true doctrine. But Sociniant 
Socinianus Voshelius de vera religione lib. 6. c. 16. primò igitur ad salutem consequendam simpliciter necessarium esse non videtur, ubi Christ● Ecclesia sit perquirere. Minimè consequens est ut quia Christus ecclesiam adire & audire jubet, ●deirco ubi existat ea, inquirendum nobis omnino sitz loquitur iis qui jam ecclesiam agnoverunt. Ait ibidem ad salutem aeternam nihil aliud requiri quam sidem, pe● sidem in Deo per Christum collatam, cujus spiritus atque animaest obedientia. How excommunicated persons are members of the Church, how not.  say two or three fundamentals are all, and they give us a Church so wide as taketh in all Churches, Papists, Socinians, Libertines, etc. and Anabaptists, and those that are for toleration of all religions, yea, and for all errors not fundamentals (since they know not well, what be fundamentals, what not) shall give but conjectures, for the knowledge of the sound Church. And M H. refers all to the judgement of charity, which is a mere doubting uncertain way of finding the true Church.  
As to the argument, if preaching of the word were a true mark of the Church, than were excommunicate persons members of the Church, for they hear the word. I answer, 1. such as are excommunicate for apostasy from the truth▪ 2. such as are stricken with the great excommunication, Anathema Maranatha 1 Cor. 16. 22. are not to be ordinary hearers of the word, and so the argument holdeth not of them, for they are simply rotten members.  
But for such as are excommunicated, because of some particular scandal, as incest, or a particular heresy, and yet profess the truth, as to all other points, they are members cut off, and yet not cut off, in so far as they retain a profession, yea and to the knowledge of the Church, are visible converts, though in one particular scandal, they lie without and give, not such evidences of repentance, as the Church can pardon them, as may be proven from the 2 Cor. 2. 6, 7, 8, 9 they are ordinary hearers of the word, as such as must be reclaimed by the preached word, as sick children, under the medicinal cure of excommunication, and the preached word that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord, 1 Cor. 5. but they are not ordinary hearers as visible professors, nor are they members complete of the Church in the inner court; admitted to the seals, 2. 2 Th●ss 3. 14, 15. They are cut off members, yet not counted as enemies, but to be admonished as brothers. Ergo though they be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, as heathens and Publicans, Matth. 18. Yet are they 
The place 2 Thess. 3. 14. mistaken by M. R. and our brethren.  not simply to be counted Pagans, nor occasional hearers, as Pagans, but brethren: and though Mr. Robinson, and some say the place 2 Thess. 3. is not meant of excommunicated persons, beside that it is against the text, against the current of sound interpreters, yet it proveth our point, that even such as walk disorderly, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, verse 11. and obey not the doctrine of the Gospel, and with whom we should not keep company, v. 14. and so ought to be excommunicate, by M. hooker's doctrine, yet remain brethren, and are to be counted so by members of the Church, and are to hear the word of admonition, and so are visible professors, and so not utterly cast out of the visible Church, and M. H doth no more refute our Protestants, than the Scripture who calleth such as are fed, and the hearers of the Lords testimonies, the Israel of God, and the sheep of his pasture, his flock, inheritance, his vineyard his garath of red vine, his spouse, and what is this but the Church visible, Psal. 147. 19, 20. Hosh. 8 11. What? because the excommunicated who thus hear ordinarily are not members of the Church, because they are not whole & entire members, it is no more consequently spoken, then if he would say a wounded soldier, because he is wounded, and under cure, is not a member of the army and sworn to the colours, because he cannot march and fight as other soldiers. M. H. c. 2. part. 1. pag. 18. 19 and pag. 33. 34. Suppose a minister should preach many years to a company of Infidels in one place, and a Lecturer to many people of divers congregations in the same auditory, shall it follow that Infidel's are members of the visible Church and that these make a visible Church? though there be here settled preaching, yet it is not an essential and 
How preaching many years to infidels is a note of the Church, how not.  differencing property of the visible Church, but a common adjunct or separable accident, as the sensitive faculty is not a proper mark of a man, though it be in man, for so might one and the same man be a member of four such visible Churches, if they meet ordinarily, at several hours, to their several lectures.  
Answ. We mean by settled preaching preaching as opposed to transient and occasional preaching, as when Paul in passing on a journey preacheth to mocking Athenians we grant that will not conclude that the sc●… who occasionally so 
What sort of preaching of the word is a note of the visible Church.  hear, are members of the visible Church, not think our divines preaching so to be an essential mark of the visible Church, but by settled preaching, which we make such a mark, we mean 1. the active calling of God, by God's warrant and command to preach to such, for Ministers may not at random set up a light among Infidels upon their own private choice and spirit, but if God so dispose that they have a faculty of speaking in their own tongue to Pagans, 2. if providence open a door for a call, that there be any passive call or accepting of him for these divers years upon the part of these Infidels, and 3. if the Lord gift the man and stir up his spirit to preach divers years to these Infidels in one place. I shall say there the Lord hath said to that man, go and bid these Infidels and fools come to the wedding, as Mat. 12. 9 and come to wisdom's table, as Prov. 9 4. and there is a visible Church there: if these heathen hair and mock, and lyingl●…are, and still profess and practise the worshipping of their dumb Idols, we shall say preachers have no warrant one year, let alone many years so to preach, and the man preacheth to them without warrant from God, and where there is no professed yielding in some measure, the supposition is without the state of our question. 2. the contret of a lecturer that 
What is to be thought of a lecturer that preacheth constantly to many of divers congregations. See for these lecturers in prelatical times M. Can his il-grounded challenge of lecturers Necess. of Separate. pag. 49. 50. and learned M. Bull's answer to M. Can c. 5. Sect. 1. pag. 84, 85, 86.  preacheth the word to divers professors from sundry Churches, if 1. he have no warrant to administer the seals, or to exercise discipline over them; he seemeth to me some Catholic Doctor I read not of in scripture, not unlike the Popish and Prelatical Deacon, who may preach and baptise (as a midwife to them in case of necessity may baptise) but not to administer the other seal. 2. if he be a lawfully called Pastor, I shall say, the meeting is a true visible Church of visible members met from sundry Churches, and is not a fixed, but a transient Church, and it is no more absurd to say these are members of four visible Churches, to wit, transient members, then to say they are members of the whole Catholic visible Church, and baptised. Whether jews or Gentiles, all, by one spirit, unto one body, 1 Cor. 12. 13. being all one body, having one spirit, one faith, one Lord, one baptism. Ephes. 4. 4, 5. though they belong to divers particular Churches: and this argument beggeth what is in question, that all sound professors are not members of the Catholic visible Church.  
3 This way settled preaching is no common adjunct or separable accident of a visible Church, but an essential note thereof.   

CHAP. VI  
M. hooker's 2. Argument to prove that preaching of the sound Doctrine of the Gospel is no mark of the visible Church.  
MAster Hooker addeth, par. 1. chap. 2. pag. 34.  
If you say that settled preaching as established and remaining in the Church is a mark of the Church, so you make the Church a mark of itself, this plea is too narrow.  
Answ. It is not narrow, nor a plea either to say, that seeing 
That settled preaching is a note of the visible Church.  eyes as fixed in a living creature we call animal, and hearing ears, etc. are an essential note of a living creature, whereas the eyes and ears not fixed in a living creature, but separated from it; should be a narrow plea indeed, to be called the essential mark of a living creature; and yet none can say that a living creature is made a mark of itself. They speak not feebly, but rationally, who say that rational discoursing as fixed in a man is an essential mark of a man.  
M. H. par. 1. c. 2. pag. 19  
M. Rutherfurd said, the argument is nothing against us, such adulterers. Psal. 50. as are not to take the Law in their mouth, are to be cast out, but the question is whether, if they be not cast out, the Church for that be no true Church. M. H. Answer, the first part yieldeth the cause again, for if they should be cast out, there is no reason they should be received, or taken in, nor have they any right thereunto, nor be they fit matter.  
Answ. M. Rutherfurd is not such a yielder of truth as so; for 
Though scandalous men, as adulterers, aught to be cast out, yet M. H. loosely infers, ergo they had never right to be admitted members.  M. hooker's argument yieldeth more thus, these who are worthy to be casten out, had never right to be received in, as Church members, so M. H. But adulterers who take the law in their mouth, known adulterers (so M. Rutherfurd yieldeth and no otherways) are worthy to be casten out: ergo adulterers; who take the law in their mouth, had never right to be received in as Church-members. 1. M. hooker's proposition is most false, for thousands, as Magus, and others worthy to be casten out, had right (Church right, of that only we speak) such as pastors can give them, to be admitted members, so the Scripture, so M. H. part 1. chap. 2. conclus. 3. pag. 27 When then both the proposition and assumption are taught in Scripture, granted by M H see now who yieldeth the cause. 2. to say if they should be casten out, ergo they had never right to come in; is, as if he wou●d say, such a woman hath committed harlotry with many men beside her husband, ergo she had never right to be a married wife, and was never lawfully married; and so hath neither committed adultery, nor deserveth a bill of divorce.  
3 No more can follow from this, that adulterers once admitted to membership, falling into scandals ought to be casten out, ergo if they had been under the same scandal visibly, they ought not to have been taken in, but this supposeth a begging of the question, that there is in Scripture a gathering of Churches of visible converts out of Churches of men and women born and baptised in their infancy within the visible Church, which yet I say was never dreamt of by the Apostles, and though it were so, whether we speak of such a gathering, or of gathering of Churches out of Pagans, persons not capable of Gospel-scandals, before their admission, which may hold them out, as they are guilty of Gospel-scandals, after they profess the Gospel. For then an unmarried woman might be capable of adultery with her own husband, before she be married upon him. 2. as to that which M. Rutherfurd said, that supposed they were not cast out, the question is whether the Church for that be no Church. M. H. saith, that wholly misseth the mark again, for the question is twitching the constitution of the Church, of what matter it should be made, it is not twitching separation from the Church. To which I answer, because I dispute against both these of the congregation, and the Separatists our brethren, having no arguments but such 
M R yields not the cause because he gives two answers to the same argument; one to the rigid Separatists, another to our brethren.  as Separatists and Anabaptists have, and with more vigour prosecuted then they, because I conclude against separation as well as against them, having to do with two adversaries, and giving one answer to the one, (which yet is not taken off) and another answer to the other, it is not equal dealing to say the answer to the Separatists wholly misseth the mark, because it is not the same with the answer to the congregational way.  
2. M. H. declineth an answer to that which I said against the separation, that if any were not casten out, it followeth not that the Church leaveth off to be a Church, and must be separated from. But our brethren's practice in New England is, if any Church do not cast out such as deserved to be cast out, to non-communion them, and declare them to be no Churches of Christ, and so they must be separated from; which can be upon no ground, but because they maintain a Church to be no true Church consisting of false matter, and visibly unregenerate; 
False matter makes a Church to be no Church by our brethren's way. M. Can. Necess. of Separ. Sect. 3. pag. 176. 177. that which destroys a Church, and maketh it either become a false Church, or no Church at all, cannot be a true Church, nor true member of the Church.  and would M. H. have Church-Communion kept with such? yea his arguments first and second, which are both but one, (though he find out four, where there are scarce three) prove them to be no visible Church, for he must stand by this as his own.  
These to whom Christ is head and king by the influence of politic guidance, and motion of the head as liege subjects, are the only fit matter of the visible Church, and the only true visible Church.  
But such as deserve to be casten out, and are not casten out, yea are owned still as Church-members, are not such to whom Christ is head and king. Ergo such leave off to be members and are not a visible Church; the proposition and assumption both are M. hooker's. I confess when an answer cannot be taken away, it is a compendious way, to say not one word to it, but simply, the answer doth wholly miss the mark. M. H. must say a Church of false matter is no Church, or then with us, a society professing the pure doctrine of Christ, though the members be wicked, is a true Church.   

CHAP. VII.  
M. hooker's reason why he passeth in silence the arguments of his own book of discipline of the Churches of New England, for the constitution of a visible Church, and defendeth them not: a scanning of these arguments.  
MAster Hooker part. 1. ch. 2. pag. 19 passeth in silence the arguments of the way of the Churches of New England, 
Way of the Churches of New England chap. 3. sect. 3. pag. 56, 17, 58. printed London. ann. 1645.  except a gentle hint he hath at the first, but he omitteth the nerves thereof, only he bringeth four arguments of his own, in my apprehension, inferior, not a little, to the arguments of learned M. Cotton, it was wisdom so to do; only in the place pag. 15. he giveth us a short list of his visible Saints, we are (saith he) from rational charity, to say and hope, and so are bound to conceive they are Saints, (converts and internally justified) so judas, Magus, Ananias, etc. (though hidden hypocrites) were such; and therefore our Saviour proceedeth with such, not as God who knoweth the heart, but in a Church way as these who judge 
M. H. his conjecture of visible Saints.  the tree by the fruit; the Church cannot judge of bid things, nor censure them.  
Answ. 1. Then the Saints, faithful, brethren, temples of the holy Ghost, at Rome, Ephesus must be proven to be visible Saints from the Scripture, from such a visible Saintship, as our Saviour and the Apostles saw in these goodly ungodly Saints, judas, Magus, etc. for if these titles conclude that they were internally converted, and chosen to grace and glory, etc. as Ephs. 1. 3. 1 Thess. 5. 10. 2 Thess. 13. 14. 1 Cor. 3. 16. as they do, then must all and every visible member of these Churches be visible elects, and predestinate to glory, which if our brethren say of all the members of all these visible Churches, suppose Magus and judas had been among them, it is easy for any to prove the contrary. 2. but if so be that these titles prove they were all internally converted, and that our visible Church must be such, or else they are falsely constituted, then how shall Demas, Magus, find room in the visible Church, as true members since they were not such? if it be said that the argument which proveth that they weremore, may well prove the less, and that they had all the visible Saintship that Magus, judas had, we shall grant that; but than you must stand by this argument.  
Such as were the members of the Churches of Corinth, Rome, Ephesus, Thessalonica, etc. by these places cited by the discipline-book of new England, chap. 3. sect. 3. pag. 56. 57 1 Cor. 12. 27. Ephs. 2. 22. 1 Cor. 3. 16, 17. 2 Cor. 11. 2. 1 Cor. 1. 2. Galat. 1. 2. Math. 16. 16. to 19 such aught the members of our Church visible to be, or then they are constituted of false matter. 
The argument, such as were the members of the Church of Rome, Corinth, such should the members of our Church visible be, scanned and foundfaulty. M H contradicteth the book of discipline of new England. hooker's survey par. 1. c. 2. The places cited by our brethren for visible membership prove that they were read converts and predestinate to glory who are right members visible.   
But the members of these Churches by these places were really and internally converted and justified. Ergo our Church's visible must also consist of these that are really and internally converted and justified, or then they are constituted of false matter; but the conclusion is false and absurd, for so Christ and the Apostles erred even proceeding in a Church way in admitting judas, Magus, to be members; for sure they were not internally and really converted and justified: and yet M H. maketh them true members, and his visible Saints, it was wisdom therefore to M. H. to bury these arguments, and to contradict his own book of discipline, which page 57 saith, that Christ taxeth the pastors, by whose connivencei the man wanting the wedling garment came in, friend how camest thou hither? M. H. saith, nay they were not taxed, that man conveyed it so cunningly that only the master of the feast perceived it, others did not discover it, page 29. but all dependeth on the making good the assumption, that these places prove that they were inwardly and really converted, which I make good by these reasons, 1. the Holy Ghost expressly saith, they were the habitation of God through the spirit. temples of the holy Ghost, espoused to Christ as a chaste virgin; ergo they were really such: to say that Paul speaketh according to the judgement of charity only, and in a Church way, is to beg the question, there is not a word of any such judgement of charity in the Scripture and our brethren have no law to add to the Scripture, to help their own cause. 2. If you adhere to this argument, you must say with M. H. that Christ hoped and was bound to conceive by the fruits of judas his life, that judas was a Saint, and might have some seeds of some spiritual, 
Christ dealt not with judas in a Churchway, it is a dream void of the word.  work of God in his soul, and yet Christ saith, have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you hath a devil? and this he knew from the beginning, john 13. 11, 18. because jesus not as God, but in a Churchway dealt with judas and such: I remit it to any man, if Christ failed against charity, except he believed judas to be a convert, before he betrayed his hypocrisy; what warrant in the Scripture for this? 3. What ground that the Apostles in charity believed and said that Demas, Magus, were converts, temples of the holy Ghost, chosen to life, as the Ephesians? 1. 3. and Thessalonians 2 Th●s. 2. 13. or then they had sinned in admitting them to the visible Church, and baptising them. 4. Whereas he sayeth the Church judgeth not of things hid; whether the Churches of New England do not judge and heavily censure (though they will not give it that name) all the baptised in their Church, whom they exclude from Church-membership and the Lords supper, all their life, as if they were Pagans, because they have not so much charity as to believe them to be visible converts; judge reader. But (say they) this will not prove that they were internally and really converted, because Paul saith so of them; to which I say, then upon the same account must we expone these places Ephes. 2. 4. God rich in mercy hath loved us, and when we (Paul and converted Jews and Gentiles) were dead in sins hath quickened us together in Christ, in the judgement of charity and in a Church way only. 6. and hath raised us up together, and hath made us fit together in heavenly places in a Churchway. verse 10 we are his workmanship created unto good works, and we who verse 12. were sometimes without Christ, strangers to the Commonwealth of Israel, 13. are now made near in the blood of Christ: and verse 18. we who were strangers, have access, by Christ, through one spirit unto the Father, only in a Churchway, by politic guidance of our head Christ: and the like must be said of all the real internal work of the spirit upon the hearts of all the Saints at Ephesus, Colosse, Corinth, Thessalonica, etc. so they were by this reason light in the Lord quickened, had Christ dwelling in them by faith, were sealed, translated from death to life, etc. in a Church way, and from none of these places can we conclude that they were really and internally converted, for all these places and real works of grace must agree to judas, Magus, and to all such visible Saints, because all Churches visible rightly constitute must be made up, by this argument, of such visible Saints, else they are false in the matter, and not according to the pattern of Apostolic Churches.  
3. The assumption is made out also thus, as the Apostle calleth them the body of Christ, the habitation of God, temples of the holy ghost, so also he blesseth God and rendereth thanks to him, that had chosen to life the Ephesians, blessed them with all spiritual blessings in Christ, bestowed on them adoption, redemption, forgiyenesse 
This visible Saintship destroves the faith, hope, joy, thanksgiving of Saints.  of sins, the inheritance of glory, Ephes. 2. 13, 4. etc. ordained the Thessalonians not to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord jesus Christ, 1 Thess. 5. 9 4. had chosen them to salvation through Sanctification of the spirit and belief of the truth, 2 Thess. 2. 13. and upon this buildeth their comfort and faith, ay Thes. 54. 9, 10. 11. so Coloss. 1. 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14. now what joy, comfort, faith, thanksgiving can have place, if these places be not understood of such real internal graces, as election, conversion, etc. as judas and Magus neither have nor can have? otherways all the hypocrites, as Magus and judas, have a like lively consolation with all the chosen of God; and Paul must bless God, because he had chosen, called, justified, etc. such as Magus and judas. 4. I wonder the way of the Churches should 
chap. 3. Sect. 3. 1 Cor. 3. 16. the place much mistaken.  cite 1 Cor. 3. 16. for visible Saintship which dependeth on the judgement of charity, for the place is evidently of real converts, know ye not, that ye are the temple of God, and that the spirir of God dwelleth in you? is this I pray you, the knowledge of charity, which is fallible, and may mistake? nay this, and the like places 2 Cor. 13. 5. and the 1 john 2. 3. 1 john 3. 14. know ye 
Concili. Teldent. sess. 6. c. 6. Bellarmi. Gregori. de v●●●.  not that Christ dwelleth in you etc. by this we know that we know him, etc. are brought by our Divines to prove against Papists, that we may be infallibly persuaded that we are in the state of grace, and know ourselves to be temples of the Holy Ghost, not by the fallible and erring judgement of charity; which we never extend, but to other than ourselves, but by an infallible certainty, though not of faith, yet of supernatural sense and divine persuasion by which we know infallibly ourselves to be in Christ, 2. as to that argument, such should our Churches be in their members constituent, as the Church of Rome, Corinth, Ephesus, were, when Paul writ to them, and after they were now constituted and grown, it is most false. It is just as if Aristotle would say and write to some of his disciples that had studied some years 
Our brethren argue from a grown up Church, to an unplanted Church; this is a high tall-tree ergo it was an high tall-tree, when it was first planted.  under him, you are excellently skilled in the knowledge of the first matter, of motion and time; and another should infer, ergo there be no Academies on earth rightly constituted, where the Scholars are not excellently skilled in the knowledge of the first matter, of motion, of t●me, before they be admitted members of the Academies now the argument should be thus;  
Such as were the Churches of Rome, Corinth, Ephesus, etc. as to their members constituent, before they were admitted to Church membership, such should our visible Churches be according to their members constituent before the members be admitted to Church membership; true, but the Churches of Rome, Corinth, Ephesus, etc. as to their members constituent, were before they were admitted to Church membership, visible converts in the judgement of charity to the Apostles, and planters, it is most false and can never be proven.  
And to argue from grown and planted Churches, after Paul had begotten the Corinthians as a father, 1 Cor. 4. 15. to prove that our Churches should be such in their constitution, is to say, such is a tall-tree now, ergo also before it was sown it was not a seed, but a tall-tree: so the adversaries would not be content we should argue thus, such as was the Church of Sardis in its constitution, after it is now falling, such should ours be in its members constituent, before they be admitted members of the visible Church: but the Church of Sardis, for the most part, consisted of such members as had a name they lived, and were dead, and had visibly defiled their garments, a few only remaining visible converts, as verse 1. compared with verse 4. ergo our Churches should be such, as to the members constituent. Such arguing is as good as that of New England's, and yet Christ had a golden candlestick in Sardis, and walked among them, and held them as stars in his right hand, Rev. 1. 20. Now the conclusion should be against them, and the chief basis of all is, that the keys are given to such, Mat. 16. 16. to 19 as are blessed and enlightened, as believing Peter was, who was not blessed for the profession that Christ was the Son of the living God; for judas was that way blessed who held out but a verbal profession.   

CHAP. VIII.  
Mr. hooker's first inference, that Church-fellowship doth presuppose men to be visible Saints, but doth not make them such, discussed.  
THat men are first converted visibly before they be Church-members is a gross mistake, it leaneth on this, That the Church which Christ hath in his Gospel instituted, to which he hath committed the keys of his Kingdom, the power of binding and losing, the tables and seals, is a company of Saints, a combination of godly faithful men. So the Church of N. England. From this it 
Way of the Churches of N. England, ch. 1. sect. 1.  must follow that there is an instituted visible Church void of Pastors, which converteth souls before there be pastors, and so there must be Sons and daughters before there be Fathers and Pastors to beget them to God, as Ministerial Fathers; and 
By our brethren's way there must be sons and a fed flock, before there be fathers and shepherds to feed them.  they must be fed before they have Pastors to feed them, and if they be converted before they be in Church-fellowship, and Pastors must be nurse-fathers' to feed and confirm these who were born before their father had being. The contrary whereof Paul of the form Church of the Galathians, that he did travel in birth till Christ be form in them, Gal. 4. 15. and when he wrote the Epistle to the Corinthians, they were framed a visible Church, and many not yet reconciled to God; and yet in that case he saith, 1 Cor. 4. 15. Though ye have ten thousand instructers in Christ, y●● have ye not many fathers, for in Christ jesus have I begotten you through the Gospel. Now that he begat them all and every one, and made, them visible converts, before he was their Church-Father, or they in Church-fellowship, 
By our brethren's way none are converted by a visible ministry and by pastors and teachers.  where is it said or dreamt, by any colour of truth? yea 2 Cor. 5. 20, now than we are ambassadors for Christ, at though God did beseech you by us, we pray you be reconciled to God, ergo this supposeth some state of non-reconciliation in many Church members, Rom. 12. 2. be not conform to this world, but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind. Ephes. 4. 22. that ye put off concerning the former conversation, the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts, and be renewed in the spirit of your mind, Coloss. 3. 8. now lay you aside all these. 16. putting on the new man: all which and the like places directed to visible converts, must all be exponed without exception, of second conversion and of reiterating of conversion and reconciliation of these that are already converted and reconciled, which no Scripture can persuade; and by the like order, the children must be born and usibly converted, before they were in the womb of their visible mother who conceived and bore them, contrary to 1 Cor. 3. 15. nor can the mother be any thing but a nurse, nor any other in regard of bringing forth, but a 
5 Cor. 3. 15.  barren mother, which bringeth not forth twins, contrary to Cant. 4. 2. Isai. 54. 1, 2, 3.  
2. The Scripture holdeth forth their pastors as pastors are sent to open the eyes of the blind, to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, Act. 26. 18. yea and the Scripture teacheth that we receive the spirit by the hearing of faith from pastors, as sent and in office, such as were the officed prophets, whose feet were pleasant upon the mountains, as is clear, Rome, 10. 14, 15. compared with Isai. 52. 7. Nah. 1. 15.  
3. If many be brought in to the visible Church and the house of wisdom, who are fools and serving the world, as Math. 22. 8, 9 Prov. 9 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. upon Gods revealed intention and the aim and design of pastors, that they may be converted, and perfected by the work of the ministry, then are they not supposed to be converted before they be brought in to the visible Church; for God cannot intend that they be converted and regenerate of new, if their conversion and regeneration go before any such intention; but the former is true 1. from the nature of the visible Church, the office-house of wisdom, in which God intendeth to make fools wise unto salvation. 2. From the preaching of the Law and Gospel, the only means of conversion, whereas if all be presupposed to be converted, before 
By M. H. his way no pastor as a pastor hath any command of Christ to intend to convert his ●…k or any ●ember thereof.  they come into the house of Wisdom, and the supper of the King, they should from pastors hear no doctrine of Law humiliation to fit them for Christ, but pastors should speak to them all as to converts, as to broken reeds, and to sheep that discernt the voice of Christ, as to temples of the Holy Ghost, as to persons regenerated, justified, predestinated to life and to glory; yea, and if a pastor preach to any of the flock as known now to be yet in th● state of nature; that preaching is not by any command of God given to him as a pastor. Nor. 3. from the revealed intention and command of God laid upon the Pastors and Ministers, whose aim is to endeavour the conversion of all, to espouse them to Christ, to have them put off the old man, to have them rise from the dead, and that the Gospel be not hid to them, nor the savour of death unto death, as it is to many in the visible Church, 2 Cor. 4. 3, 4. 2 Cor. 2. 14, 15, 16. joh. 12. 37, 38, 39 by M. H. his way.  
M. Hookeer par. 1. c. 2, p. 31. Answer the proposition faileth. These who are converts in the judgement of charity, may yet, in God's intention, be brought in to the Church, that they may be truly converted.  
Ans. M. Hooker leaveth out the chief word, wherein standeth 
M. H leaveth out that word wherein the strength of M. R argument stands, and utterly mistakes him.  the force of my argument, he speaketh nothing of Gods revealed intention and command to call in fools that they may be made wise, and he frameth his answer, as if I had argued from the bare intention and hidden decree of God. But I find that M. Hooker utterly mistaketh the distinction of God's decree, and of his approving will, and therefore he taketh for one and the same, the decree or intention of God (from which I bring not my argument) and the revealed intention of God, or his commanding will: the ignorance of which is a stumbling to Arminians, and Socinians, and to M. Hooker, who, as we shall h●ar, goeth on with them, but I judge it one mistake in judgement in that godly man, but no heretical spirit, and therefore his defenders and followers would take heed to it. For I grant all that M. Hooker answereth, but it is to no purpose, and quite beside the mark, and leaveth the argument untuitched (which is too ordinary to that pious man) for no doubt God in his decree and secret intention may intend, by the Ministry of his servants, the true and real conversion of many hypocrites, such as are no less unconverted, than Magus and Demas; for he hath mercy, on whom he will, Rom. 9 17. but according to this way, these who are converts in the judgement of charity (he should say only converts in that judgement) are not according to Gods revealed inten●ion and approving will or command taken in by Pastors, that they may be really converted: for God giveth, in no sort, this command to pastors in his revealed intention. See that ye admit no fools to wisdom's table or within wisdom's house, but such only as you believe in charity are real converts, and both called and chosen, contrary to Prov. 9 1, 2, 3, 4. Math. 22. 8, 9, 14. Ergo by my revealed intention and command you are not to intend their conversion, but to presuppose that they were already converted: otherways, if the Lord by his revealed intention and command will have such hypocrites who are but nominal saints, brought in that they may be truly converted, there must follow two contradictory intentions revealed in God: for the Lords command to Pastors is (I command you to preach to these who are converts in 
There must be two contrary intentions in God by our brethren's way.  the judgement of charity, that upon my intention, they may be truly converted: And also I command you, my pastors, preach to no Church members, that upon my intention, they may be converted, because you are not to preach to any as pastors, but to such as ye know are already converted, according to my revealed intention and will. M. Hooker seeing this addeth.  
But if M. Rutherfurd mean that the Church doth of purpose 
M. Hooker] ibid.  receive them into the Church to be converted, than it is cross to his own tenet, and a person may be received to the seals of the covenant, who doth not notify that he hath faith, nay the Church may receive them to the seals, whom she knoweth hath no right to the seals, for she knoweth they are not invisible members, which in M. rutherfurd's judgement only giveth them right.  
Ans. It is not cross to my tenet, that a person, such as Demas and Magus may be received to the seals, and yet they do not notify they have saving faith and internal conversion, for my tenet is that the Church can only judge of visible walking and profession in point of admission or not admission to seals, and in that point the Church hath nothing to do to judge whether they have faith saving or not, none can partake savingly of the seals for their own personal salvation and without sin, but these only who have saving faith, but the Church may admit without sin multitudes, who eat and drink their own damnation, 1 Cor. 11. 26, 27. and yet pass no sentence of signs notifing faith or no faith, internal conversion or no internal conversion upon them.  
2 M. Hooker knoweth that M. R. differenceth between being admitted to the visible Church, and to the seals, and yet be repeateth my tenet, as if I confounded these, because he confoundeth them himself. Whereas M. H. sayeth ergo.  
3 The Church may receive to the seals whom she knoweth hath no right Ecclesiastical to them: it followeth not; for upon the Church's part, the right is good to confer the seals, upon the knowledge of notifying signs, but of signs in order to conversion or not conversion, that is the place of the master Christ to Judge, not of servants, in this case before they be admitted members. But that the Church may admit to the seals whom she knoweth not whether they have right internal for their own personal salvation, that I teach, and can make good from Scripture, Act. 8. 13 Math. 22. 12. 1 Cor. 11. 26, 27, 30. now I say, that its the place of Christ, not of servants to judge of the conversion or not conversion of members, not because men may, in no sort, judge of the conversion of or non conversion of others; for in these cases we may judge of the conversion of others. 1. in order to speak to their spiritual state, as converts, or not, Act. 17. 22. 1 Cor. 3. 1. (2) in the cases of duties of love, suppose we err upon the matter, as Math. 10. 42. 1 Joh. 3. 14. (3) these that try intrants to the Ministry are to judge authoritatively whether they be converts to them or not, 1 Tim. 3. 10. 2 Tim. 2. 2. but to judge so before their admission wants warrant of Scripture: Pastors as pastors converted none, yea according to the command of Christ are to intend to convert none at all, by M. H. his way.  
4. Where M. R. teacheth, that to be invisible members giveth only right to the seals, I know not.  
5. I teach indeed that the Church may of purpose receive in to the visible Church, who are known members of the Catholic visible Church, and manifestly gracious, upon a purpose, that they may, in a particular congregation, be confirmed not converted. But that is nothing to our point, but M. Hooker holdeth that pastors as pastors are called of God to convert no Church-members, for they presuppose they were before converted: hence I say.  

1. Pastors do either as pastors called of God preach to Church-members, to convert them?  
2. Or then as pastors called of God, they do not preach to Church-members, to convert them. This contradiction is inevitable.   
If the former be said. I gain the point, and M. Hooker must yield the cause.  
If the latter be said.  
Then must pastors as pastors called of God preach to Church-members, as some other officers, either as ruling Elders, which confoundeth the preaching Elder, and the not preaching Elder, contrary to the 1 Cor. 12. 28. 1 Tim. 5. 17. or (2) as Doctors, which again confoundeth the teaching, and the exhorting Elder; contrary to Rom. 12. 7, 8. Ephes. 4. 11. or (3) as Deacons, which is popish: for deacons' serve tables, but attend not to word and prayer, Act. 6. 2, 3, 4. or they preach to them, as private Christians, and unofficed persons, upon an intention to convert Church-members: for if only they preach as pastors to confirm them, not to convert them, they do not fulfil their Ministry which they have received of the Lord, in all points, as they should, Colos. 4 17. then they use not the word as pastors, for all uses, for reproof, for correction, for instruction, for righteousness, 2 Tim. 3. 16. nor do they as pastors, preach in season and out of season, by reproving, rebuking, exhorting. (2) Then must all pastoral feeding formally be in confirming only, not in feeding, nor begetting to Christ, nor in restoring the lost, nor in bringing again the driven away, nor in all these five points, Ezek. 35. 4. which are ascribed to Christ, who feedeth in his sent pastors, ver. 15. 16. Micah 5. ver. 4. nor in delivering the sheep from the Lion and the wild beasts. Now this distinctions should be proved from the word of truth. 2. Then Pastors as watchmen give not warning of the sword, and of dying in sin, as Ezech. 3. 16, 17, 18, 19 20. Ezech. 33. 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, etc. but as unofficed men, and private Christians. But that, way all the citizens of the city shall be made watchmen, which the Prophet Ezechiel and jeremiah condemn, jerem. 23. Ezech. 33. But it may be said, if Pastors as Pastors must instruct gainsayers of the truth, as 2 Tim. 2. 25. then may gainsayers of the truth be Church-members; but the latter is absurd.  
Answ. It followeth not, this only followeth, Pastors may instruct gainsayers and unconverted men, and intent their conversion in a Churchway, by preaching and otherways, viz. as pastors, but if these gainsayers were Pagans and visible opposing Jews, they are not Church-members, nor can they be admitted while they remain such.   

CHAP. IX.  
Mr hooker's second Inference.  
MIstakes in judgement and practice do not hinder men from being 
2. Inference.  visible saints.  
Answ. It is too loosely spoken, without further explanation. All heresies that are works of the flesh, as Socinianisms, etc. are called mistakes in judgement; and this may infer toleration of all Religions, and that men corrupt in their judgement may be truly godly; whereas soundness in the faith is a special part of godliness, nor can a good conscience and a sound faith be separated; see Mr Gillespie, miscellany quest. chap. 12. pag. 142, 143. and consider whether then most of the Sectaries of our time may not be members of visible Churches at least; such a weighty point in one word, should not have been determined, nor can it be a sound inference.  
Third Inference.  
The holding of the visible Churches in England to be true Churches (suppose it were an error, as it is not) doth not hinder men 
See Answer to 32 questions. answer to sect. 9 q. 10. q. 1. q. 2 See M Bailiff vindicat. of dissuasive an. 1655. pag. 1. c. 16. pag. 38. 39 Answer to 32. Quest. sect. 1. pag. 7. 8. 9 pag. 25. 26. 27. ans. to q. 10. p. 29.  from being fit matter for a visible Church.  
Answ. If it be no error, to say that the Churches of England are true Churches, then is it true; and why is it then unlawful to enter in Church-fellowship with them; the contrary of which Mr H. proveth par. 1. ch. 12. pag. 32, 33. 2. Why doth Mr H. teach that the seals ought not to be given to Church-members of old England of approved piety, except they be inchurched their way: this saith that Mr H. holdeth that all that are not inchurched their way are no Church-members.  
Whether Mr Rutherfurd doth unjustly impute to Separatists that they hold that only such as are effectually called, justified and sanctified, to be the only matter of a rightly constituted Church.  
Mr Hooker par. 1. ch. 2. pag. 20, 21, 22, etc. complaineth of Mr Rutherfurd that he dealeth not fairly and candidly with the brethren of the separation and others, and saith that they teach that only internally justified ones are the matter of the true visible Church; and he allegeth passages out of Mr Ainsworth and Mr Robinson, who though they speak in too narrow expressions, yet mind no such thing; for than they should be all chosen and elected that are members of the visible Church; which in words they openly deny.  
Answ. I am conscious to myself of nothing, but a fair and Christian dealing with these godly men against whom I writ, and all that Mr H. bringeth, citations from Mr Ainsworth and Mr Robinson, I acknowledge in words saith the contrary of what I allege, and I know it to be so; but is it any thing against pious moderation, that I prove that their arguments contradict their conclusion? and that one place of M. Robinson contradicteth another; is it against pious moderation that Chamier, Pareus, junius, Amesius, object to Bellarmine and to Papists (though I judge there be some difference in the matter) contradictions, that they writ things contrary to their own grounds, and to things which they in open words peremptorily 
Both Mr Hoo●●r and M Robinson and the Sepaparatists teach that there can be none members of the visible Church but only real converts, and such as are chosen to life; and so contradict themselves, and this is no calumny which M. H. chargeth on them.  deny, as Mr Hooker speaketh, pag. 21, I confess if I make these contradictions not to appear, I wrong them either wilfully, which were in me wickedness; or if of ignorance, it is much weakness and more.  
But 1. as Mr Hooker bringeth citations from Mr Answorth, Mr Robinson, why doth he not from his own writings bring the 
So M. Robinson whom M. H. desends, justification of separation against Mr. R. Rernard, propos. 3. pag. 112. So hath every true visible Church of Christ direct and immediate interest in Christ, and title to Christ himself, and the whole N●w Testament. See pag. 113, 114, 115. Ans. Why saith he not the true visible Church hath direct and immediate interest in Christ, etc. in the judgement of charity; which is sometime Mr hooker's addition, and so he knows that Magus, judas and such, have neither direct nor indirect, mediate nor immediate interest in Christ, but are jeprous members. See pag. 95. The Scriptures never ascribe holiness to a people for some fews sake, if the rest be unholy and profane. Answ. The man hath not read of Israel holy to the Lord, of Sardis with whom Christ was, where there were a remnant, and some few names only saved. See Robinson, pag. 96, 97, 98, 253, 258. mistaking the matter the same way.  like? for I allege the same against his own way; for the way of the Churches of New England S●ct. 3. ch. 3. pag. 56, 57 faith more than the brethren of the separation eve● did say. The Lord jesus is the head of the Church ev●n the visible Church, and the visible Church is the body of Christ jesus, 1 Cor. 12. 12. the habitation of God by the Spirit; Ephes. 2. 22. the members of the visible. Church are said to be the temples of the holy Ghost, 1 Cor. 3. 16. espoused to Christ, as a chaste virgin, 2 Cor. 11. 2. Sons and daughters of the Lord God almighty, 2 Cor. 6. 18. how can they be members of the body, or the spouse of Christ, etc. ex cept they in charitable disor●tion be (〈◊〉 indeed the holy Ghost describeth them to be) Saints by calling? 1 Cor. 1. 2. and faithful brethren, Gal. 1. 2. and that not by external profession, for these are too high styles for hypocrites, but in some measure of sincerity and truth.  
Let that be answered; These who not only in point of charity, and not only in external profession, but in some measure of sincerity and truth must be the habitation of God by the Spirit, the temple of the holy Ghost etc. or then they cannot be admitted members of the visible Church, must be internally justified, sanctified, and chosen, before they can be members of 
Petilianus the Donatist also did allege the Scriptures due to the really sanctfied members, for their Churches, of which Simon Magus was a member. Aug. cont. lib. Petilian. l. 2. c. 45. c. 44. c. 45. Psal. 1. Beatus vir. & 46. Dominus pascit m●, etc. Aug. resp. Non enim verba ista etiam ad Sim. Magum pertinent, qui tamen eundem sanctum baptismum suscepit. See l. 4. c. 13. p. 764 See Aug. cont: l. Petil. l. 2. c. 49.  the Church visible; but such must all admitted members be, by these places cited by the Churches of N. England. M. H. or his defendants choose what they please, and answer, and I shall be cleared.  
2. From this passage, by the way, observe another argument of the Church of N. England. ibid.  
Such should be members admitted to the visible Church, as are exhorted to be followers of Paul as dear children, Ephes. 4. 1. so must the arguments be.  
I assume; but all visible converts or non converts, all known drunkards, harlots, Atheists, etc. are exhorted to be followers of Paul, yea that exhortation obligeth all the known enemies of God in the visible Church, to be renewed in the spirit of their mind, to be converted from dumb idols to serve the living God, for all are exhorted to obey the whole Gospel, hear it, even the scoffing Athenians, Act. 17.  
2. I argue from the fifth argument These cannot be judged fit matter for the visible Church, and con●●i●uting and edifying thereof, who are more fit for the ruin and destruction thereof; such as all hypocrites who will leave their first love, and destroy the Church.  
I assume, but all latent hypocrites, such as judas and Magus, as well as open hypocrites, are more fit for the ruin and destruction of the Church, and will leave their first love.  
If it be said that latent hypocrites appearing to us to be Godly and converts, may be judged (mistakingly and erroneously) to be fit materials for the constituting and edifying of the Church, are men (1) made members of Christ's body, and Christ made the head of Magus In as, not by Christ's command so much as by men's erroneous judgement. (2 Then the visible Church hath all its ess●…nce and nature founded upon judgement that may err, and upon no certain▪ rule of the word. (3) Then should the Apostles have taken more time, and advised more maturely, before they made Magus, Ananias members of the visible Church.  
3. All the arguments brought by M. Hooker and the way of the Churches of N. England and Separatists, do conclude they must be really and internally sanctified, before they can be such members as are in the Church of Rome, Ephesus, etc. and M. Hooker putteth not a finger to them to answer these that I alleged.  
4. Let him answer that which M. Robinson hath pag. 97. all 
justif. of Separate.  the Churches that ever the Lord planted consisted of only good, as the Church of the Angels in heaven, and of mankind in paradise. God hath also the same ends in creating and restoring his Churches; and if it were the will of God that persons notoriously wicked should be admitted into the Church, God should directly cross himself and his own ends, and should receive into the visible covenant of grace, such as were out of the visible state of grace, and should plant such in his Church, for the glory of his name, as served for no other use then to cause his name to be blasphemed, pag. 98. In planting of the first Church in the seed of the woman, there were only Saints without any mixture; now all Churches are of one nature and essential constitution, and the first is the rule of the rest.  
Ans. I now perceive that M. Hooker and his followers in this point defend M. Robinsin and the Separatists, as M. Hooker chap. 2. pag. 20, 21. but I must say these words (thus we have cleared the expressions of our brethren of the separation) must be an owning of their cause. 
M. Robinson & his maintain that the visible Church, as touching its essential constitution, should consist of only real converts, as the Church in Paradise: and M. Hooker defends them in this.   
Ans. But M. Hooker should also clear M. Hooker and his own from contradictions, as well as M. Robinson: for M. Robinson's argument must be thus, or nothing.  
Such as is the essential constitution of the first Church in paradise, in Adam and Evah not yet fallen in sin, and the Church of the Angels in heaven, before their fall, such must be the constitution of all our visible Churches now, for all Churches are of one nature and essential constitution, saith he. I assume.  
But the Church in paradise, and of Angels before either of them fell, consisted of only such as were inwardly and effectually sanctified.  
Ergo such must be the constitution of all our visible Churches now, to wit, they must consist of only inwardly and effectually sanctified, and free of all sin.  
But the conclusion is absurd, for if so, our visible Churches must be as clean from sin, as the Church of Angels and of our first parents were, when they were first created, and yet M. Robinson saith pag. 112. for we doubt not but the purest Church upon earth may consist of good and bad in God's eye, of such as are truly sanctified and faithful, and of such who only for a time, put on the outside and vizard of sanctity; so M. Robinson: the wit of man shall not clear these expressions from contradictions.  
2. If it be not the approving and commanding will of God (for of that will given to men who planteth Churches, he must speak, or he speaketh nothing) that the wicked be admitted into the Church, than it is not God's will that Magus, Demas be admitted into the Church: but this latter is absurd, and contrary to both Mr. Robinson justif. of Separate. pag. 12. and to Mr. hooker's Survey, par. 1. ch. 2. pag. 23, 24. and contrary to the Scripture, Act. 2. 38, 39, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46. compared with Act. 5. 1, 2. Act. 8. 12, 13, 14. Mat. 22. 8, 9, 10, 12. How is Mr. Robinson now cleared if it be said ay? but Mr. Robinson said, it is not Gods will that persons notoriously (or visibly wicked, should be admitted into the Church. He said not as you repeat his words, leaving out notoriously) It is not Gods will that persons 
See Mr. Ca● weakly objecting the very same, Neces. of Separ. pag. 174. and learned M. Ball Ans. sect. 2. p. 51, 52. when you speak of visible Churches, & visible and external holiness, so far as men judge, it's to small purpose to mention the Church of Angels, etc.  wicked should be admitted into the Church. I answer it, but this he must say, or he saith nothing at all. For 1. if it were Gods will that wicked persons should be admitted to the Church, then should he cross himself and his own end, because wicked persons do no less cross God and his end, the glory of his name, than the notoriously (and visibly) wicked; for both cause his name to be blasphemed, and the force of his argument cannot lie in the notoriety or visibility of crossing of God's end, but in the very crossing of it in itself, see Mr. Ball.  
3 Gods creating of the first visible Church of Angels and men without sin, is not a binding and commanding rule to pastors and to the Church to admit none to the visible Church, but such as God created members of the first visible Church free of all sin, or because there is a standing obliging rule to Pastors and the Church, such as this (admit not in the Church of Christ professed Pagans as members thereof) but to God there was no rule but his free will by which he created the first visible Church of only saints, without any mixture.  
Mr. Robinson and Mr. Hooker both do wildly misconceive (to say no more) the distinction of the Lord his discerning will 
M. Robinson & M. Hooker wildly mistake the decreeing & approving will of God. So Armin. Antiperken. p. 60. Corvinus ex. ad Wallach. p. 19 Remonst. in Scrip. Synod ar. 2 p. 256. Remonst. apol. c. 9 fol. 109. Soci● contra Puttin. cap. 10. sol. 325.  or his eternal purpose, and his commanding and revealed will, if they suppose (as their reasoning doth necessarily argue their mind to the judicious Reader) with Socinians and Arminians that every sin is a crossing of the Lords end and purpose; and that; 2. God decrceth and intendeth many things that shall never be; 3. that God may be frustrated of his ends and purposes, and miss the mark in his decrees, though they, I judge, be innocent of any such heresy.  
4. If by the will of God be here understood, the commanding will of God which forbiddeth sin, and enjoineth what is right, as Mr. Hooker and his, who approve of this constitution of the Separatists with Mr. Robinson, must do, then must the Lord in commanding his pastors and Church to receive judas, Magus, as fit materials of the visible Church, as Mr. Hocker teacheth pag. 23. expressly command sin, which is blasphemy, because the holy Lord must command to receive into the visible covenant of grace, such as were out of the visible-state of grace; and such to be planted in his Church, for the glory of his name, as served for no other use then to cause his name to be blasphemed.   

CHAP. X.  
What Mr Hooker fartherbringeth to prove that visible Churches consist of visible Saints.  
MAster Hooker, pag. 20. The pinch of the difference lieth in this, whether such as walk in a way of profaneness, or remain pertinaciously obstinate in some wickedness, though otherways professing and practising the things of the Gospel, have any allowance from Christ, or may be accounted fit matter according to the terms of the Gospel to constitute a Church, this is that which is controverted.  
Answ: This is a disorderly stating the Question after battl 
The same also Petilian the Donatist objected to the Catholics, that they owned all as just and Church-members, who knew some words of Scripture, though they lived as Satan. Aug. cont. lit. Petil. l. 2. c. 49. Sic enim conatus es ostendere Diabolum legisperitum, quasi nos dicamus omnes, qui verb● legis noverant justos esse. Sect. 51. 1. 52. Sect. 53.  given. 2. This pinch of a difference of men walking in pagan profaneness (for of such the question must be) whether they should be counted fit matter to constitute a visible Church, though otherwise they profess and practise the things of the Gospel, cometh to this, whether walkers professedly after their Idol-Gods, and yet professing and practising the Gospel, should be counted fit matter of the visible Church: We answer; Such are not the fit matter of the visible Church; and yet are not to be suddenly and wholly debarred from being ordinary hearers, so they profess their willingness to hear. 2. If the question be of such as are baptised and live within the Church as ordinary hearers, who practice and profess the things of the Gospel, we say these are already within the Church by their baptism and profession, and in regard they remain pertinaciously wicked, though baptised and so professing, they should be unchurched and cast out.  
3. That any such as obstinately remain wicked have allowance from Christ, that is, a command to constitute a visible Church as members, is all one as to say, whether commandeth Christ men to be members of the Church, and to be also pertinaciously wicked: which is no ploughs question, for it is whether doth Christ allow men to be hypocrites? Or if by allowance from Christ Mr Hooker mean, whether doth Christ allow and command the Pastors to own obstinate wicked men, as members, because they profess and practise the things of the Gospel? We answer, they ought not to admit or baptise Pagans of that sort, and if they be baptised, and so wickedly they profess, they ought to cast them out.   

CHAP. XI.  
Other arguments of Mr Hooker for the constitution of a Church of only visible Saints.  
MAster Hooker, par. 1. ch. 2. pag. 25, 26. 
Whether fitness to be baptised be the visible conversion: regenerati●● which M. H. requireth.  Q. What is required of a man of years to fit him in the judgement of the Church, for baptism, that and so much is required to make him a member.  
But visible holiness is required to fit a man of years to be baptised.  
The consequence admitteth no denial, because to be baptised, and to be admitted a member, infer each other.  
The assumption is proved by the constant practice of John Baptist, Matth. 3. 5, 6. where Jerusalem, Judea, Scribes, people and soldiers came to be baptised of him, they confessed their sins, it was a confession that amounted to repentance; so John verse 7. bring forth fruits worthy of repentance and amendment of life.  
Luke 3. 6. What shall we do? the Apostle answers, Acts 2. 38. repent and be baptised; the works of repentance and the aim of baptism do import as much; remission of sins calleth for such competent knowledge of Christ, as may make way for the sight of the need of a Saviour, and also of a going to him.  
Answ. This argument may pass current with these that deny 
Whether they were all to john real converts, whom john baptised. See M. Can. Separa. p. 174. and the Ans. of M. Ball, sect. 2. p. 56, 57  Infant-baptisme, which Mr H. and his do not; but if to be baptised say that the baptised is a member of the Church, must not either the infants of Church-members be not baptised with them, and so no members of the Church, which is strange? or may I not argue thus with Anabaptists against Mr Hooker? What is required of a man of years to fit him for baptism in the judgement of the Church, is also required to make him one within the covenant of grace. But only to be born of believing parents maketh a man of years in the judgement of the Church, to be within the covenant of grace.  
Ergo, only to be born of visible parents maketh a man of years fit to be baptised.  
The assumption is clear, because that God be our God and the God of our seed, Gen. 17. maketh both parents and children within the covenant, yea also within the visible Church, as the Church of New England truly teacheth, and giveth them right 
Answer to the 32 quest. p. 20.  to baptism; and when Egypt shall be the people of God, as is foretold, Isai. 19 25. Egypt is the Church visible, and all their seed, when they so profess, except these two be different, to be professedly Gods people, and to be a visible Church, which cannot be said; and therefore the argument presupposeth a falsehood, and beggeth the question: that there is one thing required of a man of years born within the visible Church, to fit him in the judgement of the Church for baptism and Church-membership, and another to fit an infant for baptism and Church-member-ship, when an infant born within the visible Church, by his birth is fitted both for Church-membership in the judgement of charity, and for baptism; and so the argument proveth that the children of believing parents must have some new qualification before they can be received members of the Church visible; and yet it is granted their birth made them members of the Church visible; so they are members and not 
M. H. ascribeth to all whom john baptised, and who are to be admitted visible members a confession of sins, such as amounted to the real Repentance which john commanded Mat. 3. See Anton. Wal. to. 2. de Baptis. Infan. p. 491. Daniel Chamiez Loc. Com. l. 7. o. 13. p. 210.  members.  
2. If to be baptised and to be admitteed members, infer each other, to Mr Hooker saith, ergo, all that are baptised are members of the visible Church, and all members of the visible Church must be baptised. How then doth the Churches of New England refuse multitudes whom they know to be baptised, and came from England to be Church-members? 3. See how Mr Hooker maketh out the assumption; to wit, from the constant course and practise of john Baptist, Math. 3. 5, 6. in which he layeth this as a ground, that in all judea and jerusalem (for john baptised them all, Mark 10. 5.) there was no visible Church, no visible Saints, no converts till john made them such by baptism. I hold that Christ was born in the visible Church, and that Simon, Anna, Zachariah, Elizabeth, and many others were visible Church-members before john baptised them, and that the Church of the Jews and of baptised Christians were both the same visible Church, the one believing professedly in him who was to come, the other in him who was already come.  
2. He presumeth that by john's baptising these were framed up in particular Independent congregations, by a Church-covenant, for this is brought to prove the frame of visible Churches of New England by Mr Hooker: but how the text speaketh this, who can see, except Mr Hooker himself? for all Judea and Jerusalem were baptised, Mark 1. 5.  
4: How proveth he that all the baptised were visible converts that came to john?  
Those that confessed their sins, by such a confession as john required, to wit, which amounted to repentance, and bringing forth fruits worthy of amendment, these were visible converts, before they were baptised.  
Yea say I, if the confession amounted so high in the practice of all judea, as the precept and command of john required, than all the land of judea, jerusalem, and all the region round about jerusalem, who were all baptised, Matth. 3. 5, 6. Mark 1. 4, 5. all the people, Luke 4. 21. were not only visible saints, but did all really repent and bring forth fruits worthy amendment of life: for Mr. Hooker his argument is not from the people's practice, but from john's command. Bring forth fruits &c. so Mr. Hooker. They confessed their sins, v. 6. it was such a confession as amounted to repentance; that I confess is a sea of Charity to all the visible saints. Now hear how M. Hooker exponeth their practised confession, The Baptist so interprets is, bring forth fruits worthy of repentance and amendment of life. Now sure john commanded never such a confession, as Magus the witch made Act. 8. nor a visible repentance such as maketh a visible saint, but he commanded a real internal repentance, otherwise saith he, if ye bring not forth good fruit, Matth. 3. ver. 10. see your doom, every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down and cast into the fire.  
And therefore if the argument stand thus, such a confession 〈◊〉 john Baptist commandeth Matth. 3. 6, 7. such must be in all before john Baptist and the Church can lawfully baptise them, or admit them to the visible Church, otherwise they sin who baptise and receive into the visible Church visible hypocrites.  
But john Baptist requireth real and internal repentance, without which the baptised should be cast into hell fire, Mat. 3. 10.  
But the conclusion is so gross, that Mr. Hooker could not dream of it.  
But the truth is, the precept of Repentance is not given to the Jews, so as obedience thereunto must be necessarily required before john Baptist can lawfully and without sin admit them to baptism, and into the Christian visible Church, but for their either more personal and fruitful receiving of the Sacrament, or far rather, that they may be saved from the wrath to come, Matth. 3. 10. Luk. 3. 7, 8.  
5. And as to that Act. 2. 38. what shall we do? if it conclude any thing it must have this meaning, men and Brethren what shall we do, before ye can own us as visible saints, and baptise us without your hazard of casting pearls before swine? This is to do violence to the word of God.  
But these words (what shall we do?) must be all one with the like of Saul, Act. 9 6. and of the Jailor, Act. 16. 30. what shall we do to be saved and to obtain life everlasting, and a due room in the visible Church of grace here, and at length of glory? and it is clear that repentance which the Apostles command is the course of repentance all their life to be performed, both before and after baptism, ver. 40. and with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, save yourselves from this untoward generation, which is, walk not in the way of this people: and doth Peter advise no repentance, but such visible repentance as was to go before their baptism? certain he adviseth repentance, new obedience and perseverance therein to their lives end after they should be baptised.  
6. As to the aim of baptism, which is for remission of sins, it importeth a confession such as amounteth to repentance real and true, yea constant and enduring to the end, Ergo they were 
None are to be baptised by M. H. his arguing, while they die, and consummate their course of Repentance.  justified and effectually redeemed in Christ, and persevered therein to the end, before john could baptise them without sin: how weak are these? and so these huge multitudes were never baptised until they all died real converts, and that was never at all; for the Baptist so requires, before they were baptised.  
7. Who shall believe that when john baptised, Mark 5. all the land of judea, and all jerusalem and Matth. 3 5. all judea, 
It is clear that john Baptist had no such judgement of charity that all the multitude which he baptised were real converts. Way of the Church of N. E. cap. 3. Sect. 3. p. 58. The Text is not clear Mat. 3. Mark 1. Luk. 3. that john repelled from his Baptism Saduces and Pharisees. Calvin. come. hoc modo omnes ad interius conscientiae examen citat ut se penitùs exentiant. M. H. complyeth with Papists for a particular confession, Mat. 3. Beza in Mat. 3. Hinc igitur apparet johannem non alios admisisse ad suum baptismum quam qui gratuitae remissionis doctrinam 〈◊〉 seriò amplecti testarentur. Pareus ●n loc. Nec ad baptismum indignos admisit. Piscat. Mat. 3. Docu. 6 ex. v. 6. baptismus nulli adulto conferendus est, nisi prius ediderit confessionem peccatorum ac propterea promissionem sanctae vitae ex v. 6. Piscator in Mark 1. v. 5. Imo nequi quam probabile est joannem ex gisse confessionem publicam (talem enim edebant scelerum ocultorum Belarm. de sacra. penitent. l. 3. c. 3. Rhemists on Mat. 3. v. 6. Annot. 3. jac. Canteri jesuita. in Tabul. Chronograph. sacr. ad an. 100 p. 133. Sect. 11.  and all the region round about jordan: and Luk. 4. 21. and all the people; that they were all in john Baptist his judgement of charity, sound believers, and that all these brought forth fruits worthy of amendment of life? and that all these were pardoned and justified in Christ, and that they were the habitation of God through the spirit, as Ephes. 2. 22. when john preacheth to them, even to the multitude that came forth to be baptised, Luk. 3. 7. and to many of the Pharisees and Sadduces as to a generation of vipers, Matth. 3. 7. 2. as to hypocrites that gloried they were Abraham's sons, and would think they were more than God's sons, when they were now washen by baptism, the new seal of the New Testament? 3. as to fruitless trees ready to be burnt in hell fire, ver. 10. 4. as to these washen with water by a man, not inwardly baptised by Christ ver. 11. 5. to a visible company in which there were wheat and chaff? certainly john should break the bruised reed, if he preached not to them as to real sons of Abraham, inwardly baptised, fruitful trees, and wheat into the Lord's barn. 8. Nor is there any warrant to think that they all asked, what shall we do? and did all bring forth fruit worthy amendment, and that the Pharisees and Sadduces who came to be baptised, Matth. 3. 7. did bring forth such fruits, before john could baptise them, Act. 2. they were baptised the same day: neither must that pass, which our brethren say, that john repelled not only the Scribes and pharisees, Matth. 3. 7. but also the profane people from baptism, as those who were a generation of vipers, and had not yet brought forth fruits meet for repentance, ver. 7, 8.  
Ans. Let the Text speak, Mark 1. 5. And there went out unto him all the land of judea, and they of jerusalem, and they 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 were all baptised. Matthew saith chap. 3. v. 7. And seeing many of the Pharisees and Sadduoes come to his baptism, he said, Generation of vipers, who hath forewarned you to flee from the wrath to come? which argueth rather that he admitted them; but as Calvin well sayeth, he citeth them before the inner tribunal of their consci nce, that they may severely examine themselves, Luk. 3. 7. he said the same to all the multitude that came to be baptised, but especially to he Pharisees, but that john refused to baptise them, there is not one word in the Text, but the contrary, Mark 1. 5. Luk 3. 2. Matth. 3. 3. I deny not, but Beza, Pareus, Piscator, on Matth. 4. say that john admitted none to baptism but such as they judged worthy; but that such worthiness was real regeneration in the judgement of john, no Divine sayeth. But withal Piscator sayeth on Mark, That Bellarmine hath no ground for auricular confession. It is not probable that john sought a public confession of secret sins. Now it is known, Mr. Hooker the book of Discipline of N. England requires far beyond auricular confession. The Rhemists speak just almost in the language of M. H. confessing their sins, not acknowledging themselves in general to be sinners, but also uttering every man his sins, M. H. They confessed their sins. ver. 6. it was such a confession as amounted to repentance. And their own words evidence as much. Luk. 3. 5, 6. What shall we do? if it was such a repentance as john commanded; and such it was (sayeth M. H.) Then it was real and constant, enduring to the end. And this is more charity bestowed upon judea, than the Jesuits of Rheims give them; for they are content to stay within a precept (M. H. sayeth all judea repented) He preacheth repentance (say they) by doing worthy fruits or works of penance. Now M. H. must make this confession, if it amounted to repentance, most particular of all and every one of them, which D. Fulke sayeth was impossible; and Cartwright, that it was common not full, and proveth it by many arguments: and sure, that multitude must have lived upon locusts and wild honey, that john might have been satisfied with their spiritual good estate as lively stones, as our brethren speak, our brethren's confession must have as long a space, to wit, seven years, as D. Fulke sayeth anricular confession would have taken.  
Some bring the place Luk. 7. 29. to prove that john refused 
Annot. 4. D. Fulks ans. to to the Rhemists Mat. 3. 6. If general confession was not sufficient, but every man must utter all his sins in particular, john had shriving work enough for seven years to hear the confession of jerusalem and all jury and all the country about jerusalem. O Papists blush! Cartwright against Rhemists on the place pag. 13. Way of the Churches of N. E. ch. 1. Sect. 2. part. 7. Ans. to the 32. questions quest. 8. part. 23. The place for baptising Luk. 7. 27. and Act. 8. cleared, of the Pharisees and of the Eunuch.  to admit the Pharisees to baptism.  
But that place sayeth it was their sin who would not be baptised, and so despised the counsel of God, whereas the Publicans glorified God, being baptised with the baptism of john, ver. 29, 30. as Calvin well observeth, comparing the Publicans and Pharisees together. See Diod●ti and the English Divines; for it is not holden forth as their punishment, that john debarred them as unworthy. Yea all that came to be baptised, Mat. 3. Mark 1. Luk. 3. were baptised. Nor is it of weight, that Philip sayeth, Act. 8. Thou mayest be, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, be baptised, if thou wilt, so the word noteth, Matth. 12. 24. ver. 10. 12. Matth. 14. 4. Matth. 19 Matth. 20. 15. Matth. 22. 17. Matth. 27. 6. Mark. 2. 24. ver. 26. Luk. 6. 2. joh. 6. 9 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. joh. 5. 10. joh. 18 31. There is no shadow, in the Text, that the lawfulness is referred to Philip his act of baptising, as if Philip might without sin baptise; as if I should say, I Philip cannot lawfully baptise thee except them believe with all the heart; but it is clearly referred to the eunuchs believing. For 1. Philip had more ground of the soundness of the Eunuch's profession so as he might lawfully have baptised him, than he had to baptise Magus; finding the holy Ghost had directed Philip to go to him, Act. 8. 29, 30. 2. He found him reading Scripture, and desirous to know the meaning of it, 36. and desirous to be baptised (3.) There is no shadow of reason in the Text, that it was a case of conscience to the Ennuch, whether it was Philip's sin to baptise him, except he knew he had true faith; but clearly he himself doubted whether he might be baptised, or not, 3. Philip requireth of the Eunuch real believing with all the heart; but visible believing as Magus had, was sufficient for Philip to baptise without sin in the baptizer.  
Quest. What ignorance exoludeth from Church membership?  
M. H. That ignorance which maketh persons to be no Church, 
Par. 1. p. 26.  that will hinder a person from being a member. But there is a simple ignorance of points fundamental, that maketh Papists that never heard the Gospel, and so have not wilfully rejected it (sayeth M. R.) to be no members of the Church.  
A●s●, M. H. To be admitted a member and to be baptised (sayeth 
What ignorance excludeth from Church-membership.  he pag. 20.) inferreth each one another. But all the members of the Church of Rome (sayeth he par. 1. c. 5. pag. 59) have received true Baptism. Let M. H. answer M. H. 2. That ignorance that hindereth persons to be no Church visibly professing, will hinder persons to be true members of the visible professing Church. The proposition is denied; for infants (saith Calvin) baptised are so ignorant, and they are admitted members (say our brethren) in and with 
Calvin. Com. Act. 8. Ans. to 32 quest. q. 20.  their parents, 3. M. R. speaketh of the visible Church, of which Papists ignorant of fundamentals, are not members.   

CHAP. XII.  
How profession doth notify conversion.  
Mr. H. That profession which must notify to the Church, that a person is a true believer, that must notify that he hath 
Par. 1. pag. 26527.  true grace. But the profession that M. R requireth, must notify to the Church that he is a true believer, pag. 196. Faith giveth right to the seals; profession, to speak acu●ately, doth only notify to the Church that the man hath right to the seals. So M. R.  
Ans. What is in question to M. R. it is one thing to be a 
M. R. never said that profession must notify to the Church the person is a true believer before he can be admitted a Church-member, as M. H. would impute to him.  Church-member, as infants and fixed hearers are; and another thing to be by profession, capable of both the seals: the latter are such determinate Church-members, or Church-members in special, but all members are not capable of both seals.  
2. The profession that M. R. requireth doth notify, M. R. said not, Faith must notify to the Church that a person is a true believer, before he can be admitted a member of the Church by the Church. And that is the question now. Not what profession doth notify simply; but what it must notify to the Church before the Church can lawfully admit them to be members. M. R. never said that; nor sayeth M. R. That not every profession, but that which is apparently true doth notify so much, and that which is only savoury to the godly. 2. As also M. H. addeth to my words, the adjective, True, which is not in my words; yea I teach that the profession of Demas, Magus, doth not notify that they are true believers: And though visible profession should notify true faith, it is not necessary that it must offer to judicious charity such overweighing evidences as the Church cannot lawfully admit Magus a member, but they must first positively judge him a real convert; and the like john must judge of all jury whom he baptised. 3. Since M. H speaketh of admission to the seals in the plural number, he must mean both the seals; Hence let this quaere be answered by our brethren, whether they think that profession doth notify to a charitable 
M. H. must be to near to that all infants born of their visible Saints must be real converts.  judgement that all infants of Church-members, because born of Church-members, are real converts. If so, birth must give conversion, and David must give to Absalon conversion by birth. 2. All infants so born must be regenerate; but experience and Scriptures teach that many so born turn Apostates, and prove sons of perdition. How our brethren shall free themselves of some baptismal regeneration, and of the apostasy of the justified and truly sanctified, let them consider, and the sound Reader judge; for our brethren tell us, it is not lawful to put the seal upon a blank.   

CHAP. XIII.  
Of degenerate members of the Church.  
A Church constituted of fit matter may be corrupted by their breaking forth into scandals, as is clear in Corinth, Galatia, Sardis, and the Church of the jews, to whom the Lord threateneth 
Part. 1. c. 2. p. 27.  a bill of divorce, Host 22. and there is a necessity of toleration until by a judicial proceeding the evil be tried, the party convinced, or out off.  
Ergo the corrupting of a Church constitute gives no allowance to bring in corrupt members: but by the contrary, if a pentinaclo●● member should be removed, than such a member should not be admitted.  
Ans. 1. This is the argument of Mr. Robinson, and most are borrowed from Separatists and Anabaptists in this theme, if such as are known to be no visible members must be tolerated, until censures be applied and they convinced or cut off, in that interval the Church must either give the seals to them, and their seed, or not. If the former be said, then must the Church knowingly profane the holy things of God. And so visible members as visible saints, and under that formal reduplication as visible converts, are not admitted to the Church, but as tolerated scandalous persons, upon whom the Church bestows Church-admission and seals, until it be seen they are converts visible, which destroyeth a principal pillar of the brethren's way. If the latter be said, that the seals are to be denied to them and to their seed, in the interval, than the visible Saintship so judged is not the formal reason of membership and Church-priviledges, 
Our brethren cannot admit visible converts upon these formal reasons as visible converts.  to wit, of seals; for hence seals are denied to such members as are seen to be scandalous, but not casten out, which again destroyeth the same principle. 2. The argument presupposeth that none are excommunicate, but under the formal reason of visible non-converts. Ergo David, Peter, and such are undoubtedly visible converts, cannot be excommunicate for adultery or murder, though visible they remain as to all other things (save in the matter of Uriah, and the one particular scandal for which they are excommunicate, sound and savoury saints) but the Church must judge David, Peter, and all such 
Our brethren must say that none are to be casten out of the Church, but as visible non-converts.  whom they excommunicate, non-converts and unchosen to glory; which is against the brethren's way also: for if none be admitted Church-members, but such as according to the command and revealed will of God are judged converts visible; Ergo all casten out are no members, and so non-converts, and should not have been admitted but holden out, though in other things they be visible converts. 3. M. H. cannot produce any argument of M. R. wherein he argueth simply from corrupted and degenerate members, such as the Jews were, Act. 13. who blaspheme, contradict and openly put away the Gospel, that such may be admitted and planted in Churches. But Sardis, for the few names therein, is one of the seven visible Churches and golden Candlesticks among which Christ walks, Rev. 3. and M. Hooker yields the seals were due to these members and their feed, though they had a name of living members and were dead, so they were not visibly scandalous; but M. R. his argument is not brought, but a new one, for M. R. saith that God made a covenant, Deu. 29. with the body of the people for the elects sake, said to be hard, blind, D●●. 29. 3. stiffnecked, Deu. 31. 27. a● that time but professed repentance, Deu. 29.  
3. Our Saviour's aim and decree or intention of saving (which is hidden from us) and the Lords deep dispensation in long bearing with the Church of the Jews, and calling them Lo-ammi, not my people, Host 2. (for that he citys) is no rule to us, but the revealed will; nor is the Church to forbear to 
God's intention or dispensation is not the Church's rule of dispensing consures, but the will of God revealed in his word.  censure so long as God punisheth not; yea than should the Priests have admitted into the Temple the worshippers of Baal, such as offered in the high places to other strange Gods; for God cast not the people of the Jews nor such Idolaters utterly off at that time, but he sent Prophets to them. And there is a far other consideration of a whole Church, and of jezabel a single person. He will not remove his candlestick from Sardis, but he offends that jezabel is not casten out.   

CHAP. XIIII.  
The answers of Mr. Hooker to the arguments of Mr. Rutherfurd are discussed and disapproven. The places Acts 2. 37, 38. etc. And Magus his admission, Act. 8. 15. considered.  
FIrst Argument. In the first receiving of members by the Apostles, there was but a professed willingness to receive the Gospel howbeit seem received it not from the heart.  
M. H. answereth; There was not only a professed willingness, but a practical reformation, that in the judgement of charity giveth grounds of hope that there is something real, before the contrary appear; Therefore Peter who received Magus upon his approbation of the truth, and outward conformity thereunto in the course of his life, rejected him as one in the gall of bitterness, who had no share in Christ, and therefore certainly would not suffer him in the privileges of communion, so persisting without repentance.  
Ans. 1. Not professed willingness, but also practical reformation is required. But is not professed willingness in murderers 
What M. H. requires in members before they be admitted.  of Christ, who said, What shall we do to be saved, some practical reformation? There is nothing but conjectures, that the Apostles did not admit all and every one of the three thousand, until they had experience of their state of grace. and judicially determined 
M. H. neither proves, nor can prove that the Apostles had habitual experience in so few hours, all and every one of the 3000. Act. 2. gave evidence of real conversion to the Apostles.  so of them all. 2. This practical reformation was not an experience of their practice of savoury walking, required by M. H. p. 1. cap. 2. pag. 14, 15. in visible saints before admission, except some four or five hours' time may create an habitual experience, for the same very day they were baptised, Acts 2. 41. (3) M. H. should prove that the Apostles found this practical reformation in all, Ananias, Saphira, and the whole 3000; and that the Apostles tried and smelled the savouriness of saving grace in all; in Saphira, the Text giveth not the least jot of this, we mu● take it upon the naked assertion of M. H. 4) That this practical reformation gave to the Apostles judgement of charity ground of hope, that there was something real, that is, the whole number about three thousand (none excepted, for all were made Church-saints visible) gave grounds of hope that they were all really (otherwise their speaking and hearing the word was real, that is, not imaginary) internally and effectually called, and born over again of the spirit, and so chosen to life eternal from eternity, before the Apostles durst without the offending of God admit them to Church-fellowship and visible communion; those (I say) must be proven. If I durst, I am not far from judging the godly and judicious in cold blood, free of heat of dispute, dare not so judge of the Text, Acts 2. or Acts 8. (5) There is no shadow Acts 8. that Peter (M. H. should say Philip) admitted 
No grounds there are to say that Philip and the Church of Samaria smelled the savouriness of saving grace in Magus before he was admitted a member.  not Magus while he saw such grounds of the sorcerers real conversion and real predestination to glory (6) Peter said that Magus had no share in Christ. True, but said he that he was an unbaptized man who had no share in the visible Church? No. (7) But he would not suffer Magus to share in the privileges of communion, he persisting without repentance.  
True, but it is no answer to the argument from the manner of receiving in, this is something to the casting out, (8) that Peter reproveth him in the gall of bitterness. 2. Exhorts him to repent, to pray for pardon, were great privileges of Church-communion 
Three considerable cases in framing of visible Churches.  bestowed upon Magus.  
The practice of the Apostolic Church is to be considered in three cases. The 1. Case is.  
1. When Churches are gathered out of Churches, for example, out of Galatia, Ephesus, where infants are born and baptised 
quest. 5, 6. p. 20.  Church-members within the visible Church, hence we seek a warrant, why these who were once members of the visible 
Our brethren cast out of the Church these who were baptised in their infancy, and members thereof, because visibly non-regenerated. What warrant for this censure?  Church and baptised, as the answer to the 32 sayeth, and so clean and holy, 1 Cor. 7. 14. Rom. 11. 16. (2) In covenant with God, Acts 2. 38, 39 Act. 15. 14, 15. Gen. 17. 7. 2 Cor. 6. 16, 17, 18. etc. (3) And so redeemed by the blood of Christ and baptised into his body, 1 Cor. 12. 13. even unto Christ, Gal. 3. 17. Act. 2. 38, 39 when they come to age, are for no scandal unchurched, and because they cannot give evidence of real conversion, yet for 60. or 80. years, and to their dying day, are no more Church-members than Pagans?  
2. How could ye baptise Pagans? They are so straited with this, that many among them call for Bishopping or confirmation again. 3. How is it that you once baptised them Church-members and within the Covenant, and so baptised them but for the foresaid want? How is it now (1) You teach, exhort, rebuke, comfort them, and you have no Pastoral call to them more than to Pagans? (2) How, or what calling, or what sort of officers are your Pastors to them? or who called you to take care and watch for their souls who are without, and to you as Pagans? (3) How can you offer Christ all the day long to Pagans? 4. If they refuse to hear the Gospel, you cannot judge them, for they are without, 1 Cor. 5. 12. to you; and Christian 
These are groundless conjectures; When the Apostles first preached to the heathen that 1. they preached not as Pastors: 2. that they waited until, in the Apostles judgement, and the judgement of one another, they were real converts: 3. than the Apostles and themselves judicially inchurch●… them. Way of the Churches of Christ in N. E. ch. 1. Sect. 2. pag. 7. Mr. Tho. Hooker survey of discipline, part 〈◊〉. c. 2. p. 14, 15.  Magistrates cannot compel them that are without to the means of grace by your way.  
The second Case is.  
When the Apostles came with the Gospel to the Gentiles, Act. 14. 47, 48. to Lystra and Derbe, Act. 14. 6, 7. to Philippi, Act. 16. 12. to Corinth, Act. 18. 6, 7, 8, 9 to Ephesus, Act. 19 9, 10. etc. our brethren must prove, 1. That the Apostles first teached to them as no officers, having no Pastoral care of their souls, until they were in the judgement of charity real converts, and then they preached to them as Church-members: (2) And until they were satisfied in conscience of the good spiritual estate one of another, as lively stones to be laid upon the spiritual building, as their way teacheth; And until they in their practice and profession (if we look sayeth M. Hooker) in their course according to what we see by experience, or receive by report and testimony from others. Or lastly, look we at their expressions, favour so much as though they had been with Jesus. And 3. The Apostles knew not any such thing in visible ●converts, as that they should form themselves from an intrinsical power in themselves into an organical body and ordain their own Elders; for to draw this out of any thing we find in Scripture is done with as great difficulty, as to extract water out of a stone; all we find the Apostles did was to preach Christ to them, and an interval of time, as is clear after Act. 13. 14 they had preached the Gospel, Act. 14. 6. ver. 21. they returned to Lystra, and to 
Upon profession of faith presently followeth baptising.  Iconium, and to Antioch; and ver. 23. and ordained Elders in every Church: all which times it appeareth they were visible Churches without seals, and when they preached the Gospel to the aged, and it was received by a profession of faith sincere, whether really or supposed only, presently without delay (as is well observed by M. R. Baxter in his accurate treatise) they baptise Magus, Act. 8. 12. 13. such as hear the word, among 
Mr. Rich. Baxter for infant-baptism.  whom were Ananias and Saphira, who were baptised members, Act. 2. 41, 45. compared with Act. 4. 33, 34. and Act. 5. 1, 2, 3, 4. etc. they baptise Cornilius and his house, Act. 10. 44, 47, 48. When the Corinthians and Crispus and his house believed, they were baptised, and the Jailer and his house, Act. 16. 30, 31, 32, 33. Lydia and her house, ver. 14. 15. And the Eunuch having heard the word and believing was baptised, Act. 8. 35, 37, 38. when the multitude hear john and confess their sins they are baptised, Mark 1. 5. and that without any such conjectures of the congregational way of trying members, as is above said.  
The third Case is,  
When the Christian Church is framed out of the visible Church; and in this I propound these considerations (1) Act. 2. There is no such process as M. H. talks of, pag. 14. 15. (2) No hint of a covenant to a single Congregation, except ye speak of a baptismal Covenant. (3) The Apostles shall not act as Apostles, 
It is not like that the Apostles de facto erred in putting in chalk stones in the first sampler of the visible Church, more than in the first sampler of Synods, Act. 15.  but in an erring way, choosing Ananias and Saphira reprobate mettle in this first Temple, and say, that they acted as Pastors ordinary in a Church way and fallibly, it is not to be supposed, that they more the fact actually erred, and that they thrust in chalk stone, and rotten timber, apt to destroy the whole building, such as were Ananias and Saphira, in the first sampler, than they erred in making heterodox and erroneous acts, Act. 15. in their first sampler of Synods, and yet we prove they acted not as infallible Apostles in that Synod, but by a fallible and ordinary gift, yet so that de facto actually they erred not. (4) Any man judge of M. hooker's words pag. 30. that Peter required of these 3000. to repent and be baptised, according to the like call of Christ, and that Philip saw the like in Magus, ere he baptised him, and that the Apostles had a large measure of spiritual discerning; But if their discerning was put out in admitting none but such as they judged to be real converts, it failed in this, and they laid hands suddenly in few hours space upon Ananias and Saphira: and so did john Baptist upon an huge multitude, Matth. 3 Mark. 1. Luk. 4. nay their admitting of such, whereas their eminency of discerning could have framed the first sampler of Church-constitution without one hypocrite, sayeth to me. That it is the revealed will and intent of the Lord, that men usurp not the chairs of Christ to pass a sentence upon the inward state of Church-members, before they be admitted into his workhouse of conversion. Yea it is destructive to the Lords end to close the gates upon many heirs of glory, and lock fast the doors of Christ's office-house, his vineyard, his kingdom, his house, upon multitudes to be saved and wrought upon and espoused to Christ, after they are unchurched, until they be visible converts, 2 Cor. 11. 1, 2, 3, 4. Gal. 4. 19 (5) The Apostles are accurate in trying of some Church-members, to wit, of Elders and Deacons, and bid receive some, and reject others, Act. 6. 13. Act. 13. 2, 3. 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2, 3, 4. etc. 10, 11, 12. Tit. 1. 9, 10, 11. 2 Tim. 2. 2. 1 Tim. 5. 17, 22. But show us rule, Canon, precept, practise of Apostles, for judicial electing of Church-members; yea to me it is one act of the Lords deep providence in the execution of his decrees of election and reprobation; for when the Lord sends the word of his kingdom to a Nation, and calls them, and they profess to hear, there hath the Lord a visible kingdom, and the Lord builds his house, not Moses, not Paul. (6) The place Act. 2. pleads more for a real and internal repentance, and continued 
The place Act. 2. pleads for real repentance of all the 3000. before they were inchurched, as M. H. expounds it.  and prorogated all their life, ver. 46, 47. they abiding in the Apostles doctrine and fellowship steadfastly, 42. then for a visible repentance in the judgement of charity, though we exclude not visible repenting of some, but in our brethren's sense, visible repenting, i. e. real and sincere, so far as the judgement of charity can reach. 2. Real and sincere repenting of all and every one. 3. Antecedently and before admission to Church-membership, we ever exclude, and we say there is not one Jot● in the word, that the Apostles had such a judgement of Ananias, Magus; and our brethren cannot prove it. The believing of Magus and his ardent continuing with Philip, Act. 8. 13. with eagerness, as dogs in hunting to follow the prey, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 
Magus was no such a visible convert before he was baptised.  Beza citys Mar. 3. 9 Budaeus to stick to any as an assiduous convey, proveth not what M. Lock ●r sayeth; for Luke inspired by the holy Ghost, who needeth not borrow the judgement of charity, but seeth the heart, testifieth of Magus that he believed in his way. All our Divines, Calvin, Gualther, Piscator, 
Caly. Inter fidem & meram simulationem est aliquid mediu●: Epicurei & Lucrani se credere profiletur, quum tamen intus rideant, quum illis fabulosa sit spes vitae aeternae. Bez. an. Credidit fide, scilicet historica. Diodat. He believed, he made outward profession of the faith. Piscat. Credidit, i. e. professus est fidem.  Marlorat, Beza, Brentius, Bullingerus, Pomeranus, Sarc●rius, Diodati, English Divines, say, it was but an historical and temporary faith; if the holy Ghosts meaning were that Magus did savingly believe, we shall not eschew the Apostasy of true believers. The Text saith not that Magus savingly believed to the judgement of Philip, and the Church of Samaria; they saw his faith as they saw his wondering in his cleaving to Philip, and yet this our brethren must prove. Now they saw only such a faith, in the effects, as the Text speaks of; but the Text speaks of a temporary faith: but that they believed the sorcerers temporary faith to be saving faith, and would not otherways have baptised him, that M. Hooker and M. Lockyer conjecture; but in the Text, there is no shadow of such a thing; had there been praying with liberty, and in the holy Ghosts strong persuasion, much labour of glorying in tribulation, rejoicing with joy unspeakable, by selling all and following the Gospel, something had been said, and if the Church had refused without these to baptise him. (7) I retort the argument thus.  
Such should be the members of the visible Church before they be admitted, as Peter requireth the thousands to be before they were admitted members: But Peter requireth of the 3000. real repentance; Repent and be baptised, etc. Yea such repentance 
What real characters of saving faith were in these 3000.  as thereby their anxious conscience might be satisfied, who asked, Men and brethren what shall we do? Ah, we slew the Lord of glory. Ergo, The members of our Church must have real, not visible repentance only, before the Church can admit them. But the conclusion is absurd even to the Anabaptists. The proposition is M. hooker's and our brethren's in terminis; the assumption is the holy Ghosts, Act. 2. Yea and the characters of real conversion, Act. 2. are spoken by Luke inspired of God, not in relation to the fallible discerning of Apostles. There are not only visible signs, but 1. hearing, 2. saying, Men and brethren what shall we do? 3. joining in ordinances with the Apostles, 4. Some expressing of joy in hearing the word, possibly in their countenance. The rest were real, 1. They were pricked in heart, not visibly, but really, so Calvin, Bez●, Gualther, 
Calvin in loc. Hec paenitentiae initium, malorum nostrorum sensu vulnerari. G●alth. Atque hoc factu necessarium, si non tantum ex verbo docemus, sed & electorum exemplis, ut interim nullus nobis de impuris & poenitere nesciis hujus seculi filiis (quales fu●re Ananias & Saphira) sermo sit.  Sarcerius, Brentius, Bullingerus; as also before them, chrysostom, Hieronymus, Cyrillus, Hierosolomytanus; this cannot but be real.  
(2) They were added unto the Church. M. H. granteth, that the holy Ghost in Luke spoke this. Now the Apostles acting as ordinary Pastors in a fallible way (as our brethren say they acted here) could not see this internal adding made by the Lord, ver. 47. The Lord added to the Church, etc. he added not Ananias and Saphira thus; and their receiving the word with gladness of heart, ver. 47. must be real and internal gladness of heart, as their eating of bread with gladness and singleness of heart; all which as they were not visible to the Apostles, so being real must be ascribed by an ordinary figure, to the greatest part. Now that Ananias and Saphira were such real members pricked in heart, or received the word with joy, Luke sayeth not. But M. H sayeth it without warrant of the word.   

CHAP. XV.  
Other arguments of M. H. and his answers are considered; as of the draw-net.  
Mr. H. pag. 28, 29. to arg. 2. If the visible Church be a draw-net, where are fish and filth; a house where are vessels 
par. 1. p. 28. 29.  of gold, and base vessels of wood and brass; then a rightly constituted Church there may be where are believers and hypocrites.  
Ans. The argument is wholly yielded, and the cause not touched, much less concluded, as may appear by the state of the question in a right meaning.  
Ans. 1. This argument may be wholly yielded, but is not my 
Paul's Presbytery, c. 9 arg. 2. pag. 101, 102.  argument; I refer the Reader to the place of my book where this is first propounded. The argument is much mistaken, and is not drawn from visible Churches, as they are de facto, and through abuse, though I speak to that also, which I am willing 
M. R. his argument from the draw-net, wronged by M. H. is vindicated.  to dispute with any who will defend M. H. in his survey. My argument is from visible Churches as they were at first planted and constituted lawfully, and to all that read with any considerable attention, planted according, not to the permissive decree of God, according to which I tell M. Barrow, many hypocrites are de facto in the visible Church lawfully constitute; but according to 
Barrow disc. of false Church, pag. 20.  the revealed will of precept. Hence take the argument according to my mind; if the visible kingdom and Church of Christ at both its first planting in fieri, and it's after constitution in facto esse, consist not according to the decree, but even according to the revealed and approving and commanding will of God, of good fish and of bad, and filth; and of vessels of honour and of dishonour: then the visible Church consisteth not of such Saints only as must be real converts in the judgement of charity. But the former is true, M. H. might have known that I of purpose closed up this mousehole, non semel, not once, but 
Calvin in Evang. Matth. in ●●c.  twenty times; the proposition is from the scope of the Parable, which, as worthy Calvin sayeth, that nikil novum etc. that our Saviour teacheth no new thing, but by a new similitude, the same which he taught in the parable of the tares, only as Mr. Dickson hath judiciously observed. That hence the visible 
Dicks. Mat. 13  Church in the way of gathering members, and manner of constitution thereof is like a draw-net, taking in a I who profess subjection to Christ in his ordinances good and bad. To which as for the purpose, it is also most false, that the Lord tacitly commands such Pastors as cast out the net of the preached Gospel, to fish no souls in a Pastoral Churchway, but these 
Pareus. Non restrictè, non hoc modo quo vos vultis, immoderato rigore cum laesione tritici; non prohibet quin Magistratus & Ecclesia faciat officium eradicandis suo loco zizaniis.  who in their judgement of charity, savour of being with jesus (as sayeth M. H. survey par. 1. c. 2. pag. 14, 15) and so are good fish and real converts. Whereas the Lord commands Pastors not to look whether they be converted or not in their judgement; leave that to God, and call in as many as ye find, Matth. 22. 9 Luk. 14. 17, 18, 23. Call in fools and simple ones, Prov. 9 4. which indeed to M. Hooker is a sin and a profaning of the holy things of God. O saith M. H. Beware ye Pastorally call any, or preach to any Pastorally but such as in charity you judge converts; and these only and none other, sayeth M. L●ckyer. As for the Parable of the tares, Let them grow until harvest. Par●us 
Aug. con. Don. c. 10. Sub fluctibus quid cepe●nt retia nesciunt Piscatores, neque palea quae in area est ●ermixta frum●ntis; etiam ipsa sub fluctibus latet, quae sic omnium oculis est conspicua, etc.  (most judiciously) he forbids not to use discipline simply, but use it not so, with such rigour, or imprudently, when the wheat is in hazard to be plucked up, but use it not when the wheat may be hurted and rooted out. 2. The conceit of degenerated members to be tolerated for a while, will not help the matter; for the draw-net of the preached Gospel is to be cast out at the first admission of members, before the members be degenerated. 3. How shall our brethren make it out that the bad noteth the latent hypocrites only, that are not seen, because they are under the water? but the bad noteth aswell the open hypocrites: and so did the Donatists' answer Augustine, as our brethren do; but Augustine replied that the Church is the barne-floore where the 
Aug. con. Don. N●que enim & ipse sicut piscis sub fluctibus erat, & sic ab invitatoribus quomodo à piscatoribus videri●…n poterat.  wheat is hid and the chaff seen. But, sure, the preachers are not to be led by their own judgement, who are really good, or really none converts and bad: for it is the command of Christ, that the bad, that is the non-converted be brought in, that they may be converted and keeped in (except the whole lump be in danger to be infected) that they may be made good.  
Mr. H. p. 29. The like may be said to the man who came without the wedding garment, he carried it so cunningly that none perceived 
Of the man Mat. 22. without the wedding garment. Way of the Churches of N. E. c. 3. sect. 3. pag. 57 Doth not the expostulation intimate a taxing of these by whose connivance he came in? Friend, how ca●●st thou in hither? See Aug. contr. Epist. Parmeni. l. 1. c. 14. Quapropter zizani● vel paleam Catholica segetis nobiscum copiosissime accusent, sed nobiscum serre patientissimè non recusent; noluit enim Dominus ante temp●● eradicare zizania, & à ●rumentorum permixtione separare.  it but the Master.  
Ans. Mr. H. must say, The servants judged him once to have a wedding garment, else they should not have invited him to come. Saith the Text that, or Mr. H. only? If the former, than they sin who invite, and call externally any but such as have a wedding garment: So the Donatists said. 2. Mr. H. contradicts his own Book of Discipline expressly. The rest of my arguments are above vindicated.  
Mr. H. p. 31. The examples of Solomon tolerating Idolatry, 
Solomon and Asa are Chur. members.  of Asa breaking out into persecution, hurt Mr. R. cause, for then the openly scandalous may be received in.  
Ans. These Kings obstinately persisting in such evils, are neither to be admitted, nor kept in: how far Solomon strayed is hard to determine. Amesius, after P. Martyr, teacheth, That 
Amos. in antisydalibus de Pers. c. 7. p. 325. P. Mart. Com. in 1 Reg. 11. 1, 2, 3, etc. p. 86, 87. August. de civ. Dei, l. 14. c. 11.  he neither worshipped Images, nor believed them to be God, nor brought them to the Temple. Augustine excuseth him, that he fell as Adam, to please his wives. Asa at his worst was fitter to be admitted a Member, than Magus at his best; nor can the time of Asa his continuing obstinately in these evils, be well known.  
M. H. M. Ruthurfurd maintains, That such as are admitted must 1. Not be scandalous: 2. Must be baptised after the order of Christ: 3. They must, by their profession, notify that they are true believers.  
Ans. How they are not scandalous, how baptised in Christ's order, and so must repent for their own personal comfort and salvation, is to be tried: Ergo, They must be to us real converts before they be admitted, is a feeble consequence. The third I never require before they be admitted Members: M. cannot read that in my writings, but forged it of his own, as is answered by me.  
Mr. H. p. 32, 33. If I must not enter willingly into any unnecessary civil society, with such as have a show of godliness, and 
M. H. would prove we should enter into no Church where any scandalous person is.  deny the power thereof, and such as are named brethren, but are idolatrous; far less should I enter into a spiritual society of faith with them.  
Ans. What this reasoning meaneth, I know not. But 1. it is unlawful to you to enter yourself a visible married Member of that Church, where one is to be admitted who is known to 
So P●tilian. Quae enim participatio justitiae cum iniquitate? R. sp. Aug. cont. ●i●. Petil. lib. 2. c. 40. Quis nostrum dicit esse participationem talem si judas & Petrus pariter Sacramentum communicent? So the Donatists.  be a scandalous hypocrite, as he is described 2 Tim. 3 1, 2, 3. Yea, suppose in all Churches you find some scandalous, you are to join to some visible Church on earth.  
But this is 1. Unlawful: for say that one would refuse to 
Aug. cont. Parm●nian. l. 2. c. 18 Why h●lyst thou the wicked? So Petilion. Not unlike this, Aug. cont. litter. Petil. lib. 2. c. 46. Beatus vir qui non abiit in Concilio impiorum. August. R●sp. Sed vos maledicti crimina etiam sacramentis objicitis. See Aug. cont. Epist. Parmen. lib. 3. c. 4. Objicit Parmenianus illud, Isa. 52. Recedite, recedite— Resp. Sed cur ipse in ipso populo immunditiam, quam graviter arguebat, in una cum iis congregatione tangebat? So Parmenian ib. Object. 5. Psa. 26. Non sedi cum Concilio vanitatis. Resp. Ang. cont. Epist. Parm. lib. 3. c. 4. in his quicunque dilexerit speciem domus Dei, & locum tabernaculi claritatis ejus, tolerat ca quae sunt in contumelia, nec propter hoc relinquit domum, ne fiat ipse non vas in contumeliam, quod tamen in domo toleratur, sed stercus quod de domo projicitur. The Donatists, Aug. cont. Parm. l. 〈◊〉. c. 1. Put that evil man out from among you.  marry any at all, because no woman on earth could satisfy his mind, hardly could that single life be lawful, if God give not the gift of continency. But say it were lawful to live single, and to marry none, because of such humorous impediments, yet it cannot be lawful to live out of all Church-fellowship, without all Church-ordinances, suppose you were in an Island where one only Church is. 2. Suppose one be married, and fixedly joined to such a Congregation, and divers Members turn like the Members of the Church of Sardis, divers become such as are 2 Tim. 3. 2. Lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, etc. the Apostle saith, We are to turn away from such: now the Elders and Flock refuse to c●… them out. If that turning away 2 Tim. 3. be meant of separating from the Church, we must not turn away from them, except the Church to which we were married give us leave, which were strange. And it is like this is not Mr. hooker's sense; for he maketh it less free to turn away from a Church to which you are married, than not to join to it; as it is less free to the man to leave the wise to whom he is once married, than not to marry: and so he makes the Church a Prison.  
As for the place 1 Cor. 5. he forbids entire conversing with the Excommunicate; Bullinger, he forbiddeth intimate fellowship 
The place 1 Cor. 5. not to eat with a sonicator, misexpounded by Mr. H. Bulling. Contubernium & interiorem convictum prohibet. Beza in 1 Cor 5 Ne samiliariter iis uter●mini. Beza in 1 Cor. 5 P. Martyr. cibus cum iis non capiatur, non dicatur (excommunicatis) Ave. August. cont. Donat. cap. 6. Cypr. l. 3. Epist. 3. Nam et si videntur in Ecclesia zizania, non tamen impedire debet aut fides aut charitas nostra, ut quoniam z●zania in Ecclesia cernimus, de Ecclesia recedamus. August. cont. Epistol. Parmen. l. 3. c. 2. Erat ne Ecclesia Carthaginensis Ecclesia, an non erat? si erat, quero qu●madmodum (i. e. quo pacts?) Cypr. Et caeteri— implebant quod praecepit Apostolus, 1 Cor. 5. siquis frater nominatur, & est fornicator, & avarus— quando cum iis avaris & rapacibus— multiplicantibus faenus— panem Domini manducabant, & calicem bib●bant.  with them. Mayer saith, it is the arguing of Anabaptists (which yet pious Mr. H. here followeth) We should not eat with them: Ergo, we should not join in Church duties with them. But Augustine citeth Cyprian, Because we see tares in the Church, yet let us not separate from the Church; for, saith Augustine, When the godly and the wicked partake of the same Sacrament, neither the cause nor the person is hurt. Entering in Church-fellowship, some one or other, though there be some scandalous persons tolerated and descended in all the Churches, is not voluntary, as to marry or not to marry, but a necessary Ordinance of God: for he lives as a heathen, in a condition of sinning, who is a Member of no visible Church.  
Mr. H. These are not sufficient requisites in one to be a Member, which may be in a drunkard, who is not to be a Member, but to be cast out; Ergo, to be kept out. But these three assigned by Mr. R. 1. To profess the Faith. 2. Eagerly to desire the Seals. 3. To desire Church-fellowship, counting it a disparagement not to be born again, if not admitted to the Sacraments, may agree to a drunkard.  
Ans. For the ordinary drunkard, he is either born and baptised in the Church, or he is a Pagan and an ordinary drunkard having these three. If the former be said, he is born a Member of the Church, and so the question is concerning his casting out, not concerning his receiving in. I confess, I know not how Mr. H. could answer the question himself, concerning children born in their Church of Parents, Father, Mother, that are Church Members, though such live 60 or 70 years never baptised, and have these three requisites, and be free of gross scandals, they could not admit such to the Lords Supper. The Ministers should have some extraordinary call of God to preach to such, as Paul had to go to preach in Macedonia, Act. 16. for by our brethren's way they have no right, by way of Covenant, from the parents, but only a providential right to preach the Gospel, which requires an extraordinary Apostolic cast.  
As for the other, if the man be a born heathen, and shall come to get these three requisites, and profess as Magus did, he is to be received a Member: but if he hath not these three requisites, for he lives in Sorcery, as Magus and Elymas, and opposeth the Gospel, the openly lying profession is scandalous; such a profession Mr. R. faith is not his requisites: If he be a Pagan, and continue in habitual drunkenness, he may be holden out while he gives evidences to others of amendment, and then he may be admitted to the outer court, as a heater; though a profession of faith, if not belied with worshipping of false gods, can hardly consist with Paganism.   

CHAP. XVI.  
Of the principal and prime subject of all the Privileges of special note bestowed in the Mediator Christ upon the Church.  
Mr. H. p. 1. cap. 3. pag. 23.  
1. WHether the invisible Church be the principal, prime; and only subject of the Seals of the Covenant, pa. 3.  
Ans. It is not such a subject by any argument that Mr. R. brings: But Mr. H. frameth a question of straw, as if I had moved it, and disputes against Mr. R.  
My words are: The invisible, not the visible Church, is the 
Due Right of Presbyt. par. 1. pag. 244, 248.  principal, prime, and only subject with whom the Covenant of Grace is made, to whom all the Promises do belong, and to whom all titles, styles, properties and privileges of special note in the Mediator de belong, p. 248. The Promises are preached to the whole visible Church, but for the Elects sake; yet they belong, in God's intention and gracious purpose, only to the Elect of God, and his redeemed ones, to that invisible Body, Spouse, Sister, whereof Christ alone is Lord, He●d, Husband. I wonder then, if Mr. H. did read my book, when he will dispute such a Question with me.  
1. Whether the invisible Church, and the Elect, be the prime subject of the Seals? A question that hath no sense, nor any favour 
The question whether the elect and invisible Church be the prime subject of the Seals, sens●…ss; and the affirmative never imagined by Mr. R. The only visible & first external subject of the external seals, is the visible Church.  from Mr. R. For can the Elect, of which, some are not born, eat and drink at the Lords Supper, or be washed with water? 2. The Lord hath ordained the Seals in an orderly way, and in an Ecclesiastic and Church right to the visible Church, as to the fi●st, prime, and only subject external, visible, in foro Ecclesiae, and according to the command of God to Pastors, they are to be dispensed to all Members of the visible Church, to Magus as to Peter, whether the dispensers or Church repute them real Converts, or not. 3. Here the Seals, Ministers, Word, Promises, are considered only in the sign, letter, external administration by the dispensers, who see not the heart. Now Mr. H. proceedeth against me, Arg. 1. pag. 41. to prove that, to wit, That bare and naked Seals, as Circumcision, are bestowed upon graceless men, Ishmael and Esau: which is to set up an adversary of hay; for I am not the man who either dreamt or wrote, that the invisible Church is the principal, prime, and only subject of the naked Signs bestowed upon Ishmael and Magus: This will be found the mind of Mr. Hock●r; for I spoke expressly of the privileges of special note in the Mediator, pag. 144. But the bare and empty Seals, the Promises as in the 
The external seals and promises preached etc. are not privileges of special note given in the Mediator Christ.  letter preached, and as precisely considered and separated from the grace promised and signed, are not privileges of special note given in the Mediator, for they are privileges bestowed upon Cain and Magus, as upon real believers, Peter and john, the very same way. 4. But the Lord hath ordained Promises, Sealt, and the like, including the inward grace, Christ, Righteousness, Pardon, Perseverance, Eternal life, in his gracious purpose, as I say, pag. 244. to the invisible and effectually called Church, as to the principal, prime, native, internal subject, a right not only Ecclesiastic in foro Ecclesiae, which they have also, professing the sound faith, but also with a real and internal right in foro Dei, Upon these Arguments, never touched nor answered by Mr. Hooker.  
1. These are the first and proper subject of all Promises. Properties, Privileges, Seals of special note in the Mediator 
That the invisible & really believing Church is the prime, proper and principal and only subject of all the Privileges of special note in the Mediator Christ, is proved by 5 arguments, never answered by Mr. H.  (taking the Privileges and Sea's as they include Christ, and the graces promised and sealed) to whom the Covenant, and special promises of a new heart, the Law engraven, perseverance are only promised, and to none other, But these, A new heart, Perseverance, etc. are only promised to Elect Believers, jerem. 31. 33, 35. & 32. 39, 43. Ezek. 11. 19, 20. & 36. 25, 26, 27. Isa. 59 19, 20, 21. Deut. 30. 6. Heb. 8. 8, 9, 10, etc. If these be promised to Cain, Magus, then either absolutely, and so all shall have a new heart, contrary to Scripture and Experience; if conditionally, show the condition to be performed by the Elect, which being done, they shall be therewith gifted: Such a condition is not in the Word; for the condition should be either of Nature, or Common Grace, and both must be Pelagianism: for if of Grace, the question must recurte, What shall be the condition again?  
2. These for whom, and for whose salvation God intends the sweet Marrow of the Ministry, and other Ordinances, the meeting in the Unity of faith, and the knowledge of the Son of God, Ephes. 4. 11, 12, 13. to whom they all belong, 1 Cor. 3. 21. and for whose sake all are, 2 Cor. 4. 15. and for whose salvation only Christ came and died, Matth. 20. 28. Luke 19, 10. 1 Tim. 1. 15. 1 Pet. 3. 18. joh. 15. 13. must be the prime and only subject of all these privileges in their marrow and substance.  
3. These to whom Christ is given only, and with him all other things, must be the prime and only subject, to whom all privileges of special note in the Mediator are given; or then the visible Church, or some other than the Elect and ransomed of the Lord, must be the principal and only subject: But he hath given us Christ, and with him all other things, Rom. 8. 32. And Mr. H. cannot say, that to that visible body, as visible, in which Magus, Cain, are joint Members, having as good Ecclesiastical right as the Apostle Peter, by Mr. H. way, are given all things, Christ, saving grace out of his fullness, etc. as to the first and prime subject.  
4. Christ is Head by the influence of saving grace, King, Husband, Saviour, Ransomer, Surety, Highpriest of the really believing Church: If he give any privileges, than who shall be the first, prime and only subject of graces flowing from him, but his Liege-people, Spouse, Ransomed ones?  
5. The Elect justified, are only the Sons of the Promises, Rom. 9 8, 9 and are internally, and not externally only, as Magus, in Covenant with God, and internally called.  
Mr. H. The Catholic Church invisible is not the prime and only subject of the Seals, as the meaning of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is to Mr. R. though the exposition of the Rule be neither safe nor sound, quod convenit 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, convenit 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  
Ans. Taking the Seals for bare and naked signs bestowed upon Magus, which is Mr. H. mind, he disputes against himself, not against me.  
2. The axiom, what agreeth essentially, and per se, in secundo modo per se, (as aptitude to discourse, or also to laugh, agreeth to man) does both agree universally to all men, and reciprocally; for every man is apt to laugh, and every thing apt to laugh is a man: So the invisible Church is that Company to whom all saving privileges belong, Effectual Calling, Redemption, Justification, the promises of a new heart, of Perseverance, the Seals including Covenant-grace; and reciprocally the same Company to whom all these privileges belong, is the invisible, mystical, Living Church, and not the Company visible of which Magus is a Member. Is this axiom neither safe not sound? Mr. H. should show wherein it is 
The Rule quoth (what agreeth to any) convenit, as such, agrees to it universally & reciprocally, is a safe Rule in Logic.  faulty, and not pass with disdain the Rule as neither safe nor sound. It is defended as a truth of Aristotle by Christian Philosophers. What agreeth in any thing 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, (which Aristotle saith are the same in secundo modo per se) agreeth to all, and to every one, and to such only. So the first modus per se is when the Predicate belongs to the Essence of the subject; so Aristotle taught me long ago. 
Aristot. poster. A●…t. l. 1. c. 4. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Aristot. ibid. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, per se autem (in secundo modo) & quâ tale idem sunt. Aristot. Analyt. 1. cap. 4. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Ant. Ruvio, Colleg. Conimbr. Murcia de L●llana poster. Analyt. l. 1. c. 4. Primus modus per se est quando praedicatum pertinet ad essentiam subjecti, quia vel est definitio ejus, vel pars definitionis, unde istae propositiones sunt in primo modo per se, homo est animal, homo est rationalis. Ruvio. Colleg. Conimbr. Toletus, Masius. Secundus modus per se, est quando subjectum pertinet ad definitionem praedicati, ut homo est admirativus, homo est ri sibilis. Ibid. in textu. Convenire ●utem praedicatum subjecto secundum quod ipsum idem est, ●c convenire illi in quantum tale; hoc est, non secundum rationem commu●●m sed propriam, & hoc est, reciprocè.  So Collegium Conimb●icense, Ant: Ruvio, Murcia de Lallana, Smyglezius, Toletus, and many; yea, all who Comment upon Aristotle. And the secundo modo per se, is when the subject belongs to the definition of the Attribute; as a man is apt to laugh, to weep, to admire, and reciprocally; yea, and what agrees to any, according to its specific nature, and last essential difference, agrees reciprocally: and to this old Logic I stand, it is not new.  Mr. H. pa. 37. 
Mr. R. proveth, That the visible Church, as such, hath not right to the Seals, but the invisible. These only who are within the Covenant have right to the Seals; so Peter proves Infant-baptism, Acts 2. 38. but only the invisible Church hath right to the Covenant.  
Ans. Peter, Acts 2. speaks of persons externally within the Covenant, who by profession engage themselves to walk in the ways of God, though they have not, for the present, the sound work of faith in their hearts, and it may be shall never have it. Now that the visible and intelligible being in Covenant, must be understood Acts 2. is clear, else the counsel of Peter to be baptised, had been null; for invisible Christians only have right to the Seals, (they might reply) but whether we be such, we for the present do not know, and it is certain, and you can neither see nor know the invisible work of grace: it is believed by faith, not known.  
Ans. An error in the first concoction spoileth all: I speak of an internal right in foro D●i, and this way only real and invisible believers have internal right to the Covenant and Seals, including the blessings and graces rem significatam; otherwise, naked Seals, of which Mr. H. speaketh, are not special privileges in the Mediator, for they are (himself granting) bestowed upon base hypocrites: so the right internal to the seals, and Christ in them, and to the Covenant and new heart, is the privilege of special note, which only the invisible and really believing Church hath; Mr. hooker's Saints, Magus and judas have no such privileges.  
2. The answer of Peter, Acts 2. is indeed of a being in Covenant 
How the converts, Acts 2. were in Covenant: for Peter renders to the Chosen a healing answer, You are inter nally in covenant; and to the rest an answer to guard against despair, The promise is preached to you.  visibly, and that being is not excluded, but it is rather and more principally to be expounded of real and internal being in covenant, Repent, and be baptised every one of you, for the promise is made to you and to your children; that is, ye are within the Covenant. Now Peter's answer is a strengthening and comforting answer: for the doubt of their cast-down conscience is, Ah! We murdered the Lord of Life, then must we be rejected of God, we know not what to do! Peter had returned but a comfortless answer, to say, But be of good cheer, the promise is only to you and to your children; that is, ye are only visibly in Covenant: They might say, So is Magus. I grant it is a ground of comfort, Psal. 147. 19, 20. Exod. 20. 2. Deut. 5. 1, 2, 3. but it was not so healing an answer to their question, which was not, Men and brethren; what shall we do to get in to be Members of the visible Church? What better had they been in a place where Ananias and Magus had as deep a share of the comfort as they; and which having, they might eternally perish? But their question was, Men and brethren, what shall we do to be saved eternally, and to be Members of the invisible Church? Peter answereth, There is a Covenant made in the holy mind of God really with you Jews, and your children, and to all that are afar off, with the seed of Jews and Gentiles; and so he must have among you a company ordained to life, and internally in Covenant: So Calvin, Gualther, Bullinger, Marlorat, Beza, Brentius. His meaning is not that they were all the same way within the Covenant, and the Promise made one and the same way; some were actually and really, and so invisible in it; some visible, and in profession; some as fathers, some as children and parts of their fathers. (2.) He cannot speak only of the visible Covenant, but of their being invisible in it; he bids them repent really, not visibly only, as Magus did, and heals their anxious conscience, by this repenting really, for that end that their doubting may be removed; not that the holy Ghost bid● any within the visible Church repent only professedly, and only externally, but the command of repenting, as born in upon the chosen, carries with it the Lords intention often, and his decree to save, and their being internally in Covenant, as here it doth.  
3. I shall desire Mr. Hooker to be true to his own distinction. If being externally in Covenant make a Church-member, as he expounds Acts 2. Then all to whom the Lord saith, I am your God, and to whom the Covenant is externally preached, and 
If these be real Converts one to another who are called the people of God, than all Israel, all the Gentiles must be real converts in the charity of all the Prophets, and of one another.  they by silence hear and accept of it, are to Mr. H. Church-members; then all Israel whom Moses preached to be blind, hardened, Deut. 29. 4. rebellious and stiffnecked, Deut. 31. 27. who had tempted him in the Wilderness forty years, and when they had entered in a Church. Covenant with God, Deut. 29. 10. as our Brethren expound it, they were to Moses, to joshua, and to all the godly, and to one another, real converts, savouring as if they had been with Christ, and practically reform. O what strange charity, when Moses and the Prophets preached, they confess, the world knew their life declare the contrary.  
2. Why should Mr. H▪ deny but the three thousand who heard with gladness, received the Word with joy, were real converts, 
The 3000, Act. 2. are pricked at the heart, & converts by a figure, that is, many or most of them were such, but not all, and every one, as Mr. H. saith.  by a frequent figure, the part for the whole, because the most part were real converts? Yea. Mr. H. will have Ananias, Sapphira, and all of them in the judgement of charity to be real Saints: But when the Scripture calls Israel these whom Saul and David were to feed and rule, 1 Sam. 9 16. 2 Kings 3. 18. 2 Chron. 7. 13. even all the murmurers and ●●bels whom the Lord brought out of Egypt, Deut. 5. 2. Exod. 6. 4. his covenanted people, Will not Mr. H. give us the favour of a figurative speech, a part for the whole?  
3. Or then (which is strange) all Egypt, Assyria, Isa. 19 25. all Nations, Isa. 2. 1, 2. All the kindreds of the earth, Psal. 22. 27. Of the world, Rev. 11. 15. must be in the judgement of charity to one another real Converts.  
4. Could not the Lord call them, and make a Church of them, and say, I am your God, and they, We are thy people, while first the Pastors and the Church passed their judgement of charity upon their real conversion?  
5. Mr. H. passeth over all the Texts cited by me, which conclude only the invisible Church to be really within the Covenant; see them above: and contendeth, That the visible Church only, which is of these who never had, and it may be shall never have any sound work of faith in their hearts, pag. 37. the only prime subject of those special privileges in Christ.  
6. So the Reason is null, if this be the only visible being in Covenant, which is Act. 2. 38. it concludes not: Mr. R. said the contrary, both visible and invisible being in Covenant, must be understood Act. 2. as also invisible grace is believed in itself, therefore it is not known in its effects; it follows not, the invisible and really believing Church, is not visible in the effects to men: Isa. 61. 9 Their seed shall be known among the Gentiles, and their offspring among the people; all that see them shall acknowledge them, that they are the seed that the Lord hath blessed. Isa. 62. 12. And they shall call them the holy people, the redeemed of the Lord, and thou shalt be called, Sought out, A City not forsaken.  
Mr. H. p. 37. That only the invisible Church hath right to the Seals, draws many absurdities: The adversaries of grace will hardly be gained.  
Ans. True: if you mean external signs and Ecclesiastic right; if all Israel be in the judgement of charity within the 
Idolaters and scandalous persons visibly must be visible converts, by M. H. his way.  Covenant, we must indeed believe visible Murmurers, Idolaters, Fornicators, Backsliders, Worshippers of Heathen gods, 1 Cor. 10. 1, 2, 3. Exod. 16. 1, 2. Psal. 78. 17, 18, 19, 20. such as slew their sons and their daughters to Molech, openly under every green tree, Psal. 106. 35, 36, 37, 38, 39 jer. 7. 30, 31. Hos 4. 13. jer. 3. 2, 3. Isa. 57 8, 9, 10. Ezek. 16. 31, 32, 33, 34. to be real converts, and all and many other absurdities follow.  
2. We must believe, That all the visible Church have saving grace; Ergo, we must believe that God hath chosen to life all the Independent Churches on earth.  
3. That God intends salvation, and pardon, and perseverance to all and every one of them of the visible Israel, and that to be false, Rom. 9 6. They are not all Israel which are of Israel.  
Mr. H. p. 38. Mr. R. compasseth us about with a crowd of accusations of the grossest Arminian, Popish, Socinian Doctrines.  
Ans. Why did ye not clear yourselves of conspiring with Papists, in denying the preaching of the Word to be an essential note of the visible Church, and in other points also? 2. Of conspiring with Socinians, in setting up Independent Congregations. 3. Denying the Power of Synods. 4. The necessity of Ordination by Laying on of the Hands of the Elders, etc. to such you say not any thing, in leaving the Reformed Churches, and joining with these enemies of the truth; but of this hereafter: you have yet place to dismiss the crowd.  
Mr. H. p. 38. Let Mr. R. help us to answer the Anabaptists upon his grounds.  
Mr. H. Those that I cannot know have any right to the Seals, to them I cannot give the Seals in any faith: But I cannot know that Infants are of the invisible Church, which only gives them right to the Seals. If Mr. R. grant the proposition, that they give the Seals to such whom they know not to have any right, they triumph.  
Ans. No Anabaptist can object to me. That to be of the invisible 
M. R. disclaims that which M. H. chargethupon him, that to be of the invisible Church only giveth right Ecclesiastic to the seals.  Church only giveth right Ecclesiastic to the outward Seals, which Magus receiveth, Mr. H. calleth the dispensing of the outward Seals a special privilege, but such as Magus hath no special or saving Privilege.  
2. It passeth the wit of man to defend Independents against Anabaptists: for 1. The Anabaptists and Independents both agree in the same constitution of visible Churches, that they must be real converts, as far as we can judge: but that we can judge of no Infants born of believing Parents, except we pluck out the eyes of charity, and believe that Cain, Ishmael, Esa●, and all and every one born within the visible Church, are born converts, is impossible. Hence Mr. H. Those that I cannot know have any right to the Seals, to these I cannot give the Seals of the Covenant in faith, as the Apostle calls faith. So Mr. H. But I cannot know that all the Infants of Believers have right to the Seals, because their parents are visible Saints, some of them Elect, some of them Reprobate: Except I 1. Put the Seal of God upon a blank, contrary to our brethren's Doctrine. 2. Except I profane the holy things of God, and admit heathens to the Church of visible Saints. Let Mr. H. answer the Anabaptists.  
Mr. H. Mr. R. helps the Minor with a distinction So, faith 
Par. 1. p 38, 39  in Christ truly giveth right to the Seals of the Covenant, and that in God's intention and decree, called Voluntas beneplaciti, but the orderly way of the Churches giving the Seals, is, Because such a society is a professing and visible Church, and the orderly giving of the Seals according to Gods approving Will, called Voluntas signi & revelata, belongs to the visible Church. Mr. H. answers, This salve is too narrow for the sore, for the distinction will either make God order the giving of the Seals to such who have no right, and so impeach his wisdom, to appoint the giving of the Seals to such to whom he gives no right to receive them: Or else it doth involve a contradiction and the several expressions contain apparent contradictions; for this voluntas signi which allows the visible Church to give the Seals, it tither gives another right, besides that which the invisible Members have, or else it gives no right: If it give another right, than the invisible Church hath not only right, which is here affirmed; if it give no right, than the visible Church doth give the Seals orderly to such who have no right to them. I confess, such is my feebleness, that I see not how this can be avoided. How have hypocritical Professors right to the Seals? Not as Members visible: For Mr. R. saith, p. 249. The visible Church, as the visible Church, hath no right unto the Seals; as invisible they can give none, for they have none to give.  
Ans. Were it not conscience to the truth, I would be silent of the infirmity of this pious man.  
1. It is a good salve: for it becometh not Mr. H. with Arminians and Socinians to impeach the wisdom of the Holy One, because he appoints the giving of the Seals, Baptism to judas and to Magus, who have no right true and real in foro Dei, in the Decree of God, and in his holy intention, as I spoke p. 248, 249. to the Seals, and the grace sealed; nor to the engraven Law, and Gods teaching of the heart, and to perseverance; and I 
Due Right of Presbyt. par. 1. jac. Gualterius jesuita in Tabulâ Chronographicâ prim. secur. ad an. 100 pag. 91. sect. 17. probat liberum arb. contra Cal●inianos Quint. Classis repugnantiam continens quae saepe inter voluntatem nostram & divinam intercedit. Bellar. de amiss. g●at. l. 11. cap. 16. Mr. H. sides with Arminians, Socinians, and Papists, in saying that the Reformed Churches ascribe to God two contrary Wills. Armin. Antip. pag. 668. edit. Bertiana, at aio, id quod Deus in mandatis & prom●ssionibus dicit tale esse ut Deus citra contradictionem dici nequeat, decreto aliquo suo contrarium ejus vellet statuere. 665. insinuat Deum hypocriseos. Cor●. advers. Molinaeum. c. 4. sect. 6. 7. Piscator & alii voluntatem signi & beneplaciti ut opposita considerant, ut Deum non semper seriò velle, quod mandato se velle significat est voluntas in Deum contumeliosa quae simulationem & hypo●ri sin in Deo ponit. Remonst. in Script. Synodalibus Dordracen. ar. 1. de Praedestinat. pa. 245. Is qui intrinsecè & serio ad poenitentiam vocat reprobos; quos tamen intrinsecè arcano & immutabili decreto ab aeterno absolutè ad damnationem, & damnationis causas destin●vit, is stmul it benevolentiam erga eos, & mel in o'er, ut dicitur, ostentat, & ●●l in cord ●●vet. Doctrina haec pa. 246. Deo duplicitatem animi & simulationem cum deceptione conjunctam attribuit, Deo hypocrisin, mendacium. p. 247. Collocutores Hagienses in appendice de reprobatione. p. 129. Nam ea est simulatio aliquem ad fidem & salutem vocre qui jam ante p●r reprobation is decretum ab utraque est absolutè segregatus. Conrade. Vorst. Amor. duplic. ad Piscatorem, p. 13. par. 1. pag: 293. Esse sic vocationem Dei illusorium. p. 391. Deum ●ubere ut credant mendacio. But the Arminians in their Apology all along, especially cap. 6. where this matter is handled; and cap. 20. where they speak of Reprobation, are as dumb as a fish of all these vain Objections, which otherwise seem to serve their end not a little, now as before. But it is like they were convinced in Conscience they did proceed from a false and erroneous Exposition of the Lords will of Pleasure and of Precept, and therefore I doubt not but Mr. H. did not a little sail against the truth, in carping at this distinction acknowledged by all our Divines.  cite pag. 249. jer. 32. 38, 39 & 31. 33. and pag. 244, 245. par. 1. Psal. 89 33, 34, 35, 36, 37. Isa. 54. 10. All which places Mr. H never looked on the face, but suppressed them all. Then let Mr. H. clear the wisdom of God in appointing a Ministerial and Pastoral offer of Covenant-mercies, Christ, Pardon, the Anointing, the new heart, Life eternal, to be made to such as Magus, and judas the traitor.  
2. Whereas he saith, The distinction of voluntas beneplaciti, and voluntas approbans, contains apparent contradictions. It seems he never heard of this distinction allowed by the Reformed Churches; and that he joins with the Arminians, who teach, That this distinction placeth in God two contrary Wills; and that he wills and decrees one thing from eternity, and commands and approves the contrary to his creatures: Hence there must be guile and dissimulation, and no serious dealing in the Lords commands, saith Arminius, Corvinus, and the Arminians at the Conference at Hague, and the Synod of Dort.  
3. Hence it is, that Mr. H. will have the same very right given by the approved Will of God to Members, that is given by the Decree. Just as Vorstius will have the promises and threatenings every way conform to the Decree: and he and all the Arminians say, We may make them often contrary to the Decree, and make the Holy Lord to deal doubly, and to will one thing within himself, and command the contrary. So Mr. H. saith, we make Gods command to give one right external to the Seals, and his Decree the contrary, or no right at all to some hypocrites.  
But we answer to both: God by his Decree ordains what shall come to pass or not come to pass, or what shall fall out or 
A clearing of that distinction of the Lords will of purpose or decree, & of his commanding or approving Will against Arminians, and against Mr. H. his siding with them in that, though innocently, as Mr. R. in charity judgeth.  not fall out, be it good in his effective Decree, or be it evil in his permissive Decree: For all things were written in his book, when as yet they were not, even all Davids Members, Ps. 139. 16. Eph. 1. 11. But God by his approving Will does not decree what shall come to pass or not come to pass, but only commands what is good, and promises rewards accordingly, and forbids what is evil, and threateneth punishment, whether the good or the evil come to pass, or never come to pass; he commands judas to believe, and Cain, and Pharaoh, that is, he approves of their faith as good obedience, and agreeable to his Law, and yet their obedience never falls out, nor did the Lord ever decree they should obey: for what God decree● shall be, must be; but what he commands does not ever fall out: So the Lord forbids the kill of Christ, Exod. 20. 13. that is, he declareth that he nilleth, disapproveth, and hateth the slaying of the Lord of Life; and yet the kill of Christ falls out, a●d was decreed to come to pass by the permission of God, Acts 2. 23. & 4. 27 28. Here 
The decree & the approving will of God are the same.  is no shadow of contradiction here. Again, God giveth a right to the Seals to hypocrites; that is, he commandeth the Church to give the Seals to Magus, whether such really or hypocritically believe, this is a right not properly inherent in visible Members, for their Profession, yea, or their supposed Conversion. 1. Because all saving and real right to Ordinances is relative to Election to glory, and flows from the Merit of Christ's death; but visible Professors, as such, of whose society Magus and judas are, have not any saving and real right, as chosen and redeemed in Christ, by grant of our Brethren. 2. A right flowing only from an external profession, and from composed hypocrisy in Magus, is no true right; a lie cannot give a true right, I offend that Mr. H. so anxiously contends for a Charter to such Bastards as Magus. 3. It is a favour to 
Of the right that real visible Professors have to the Seals; & that that right which Magus & other painted Members have, is no true right. The command to be baptised as a simple command gives no right Ecclesiastical, no right internal to Magus to be baptised except he believe. Yet doth the Church without sin invite & baptise Professors, without passing a sentence upon their real conversion, or hypoctitical. Visible Professors that are sincere, have both right internal & external to the seals & the marrow of the seals.  hear the Gospel, and partake of the Seals; and Ius activum, an active right the Church and Ministers have to call and admit to the Seals all who profess as Magus, that the Elect in the visible Church may be converted, but it is not a right propriè dictum ne quidem Ecclesiasticum, that they have who are such hypocrites as judas and Magus; for the command and revealed Will of God most unproperly is said to give M●gus a right to the Seals: Except Mr. H. never Divine so spoke; the command reveals the right, but gives none. As also the right of visible Professors is Ius passivum, and a conditional and passive right; for Magus and judas have no right to be visible Members, or to partake of the Seals, yea or to profess the Covenant and Name of God, Psal. 50. 16. but upon condition of faith: for God cannot command sin and an hypocritical profession: yea, he forbids treading in his Courts, Isa. 1. 12, 13. except they repent and believe, ver. 16, 17. therefore Magus sins in professing, and in being baptised, he remaining rotten: But the Church sins not, but does the command of Christ in calling, inviting all that profess, whether they be really, or in the judgement of charity, Converts or no. Which distinction not being observed, our Brethren and Mr. H. mistake the nature of an Ecclesiastical right; for the Lord in the command gives to all visible professors, such as Peter, who really believe, both the Ecclesiastic and external right to the Seals which he decreed to give them, and the same internal and real right which they have by faith, and no other than according to his eternal decree, they have given them in time by real believing. But for hypocrites, as Magus, they have no right Ecclesiastic to the Seals, but a sort of active and permissive right, by which they claim room in the visible Church, and the Seals from the Church. Therefore taking the Church visible as only visible, as contra-distinguished from the invisible and really believing: and as visibility is common to both Peter and Magus, and their external profession obvious to the eye of man, so the visible Church hath no right that is true and real to the Seals: So I retort the Argument upon Mr. H.  
True real believers, as Peter, and hypocrites, as Magus, have 
Peter & Magus have not the same right to the seals. M. H. his argument is retorted upon h●mself.  either one and the same Church-right to Membership and Seals, or another, and divers. The same right they cannot have;  
1. Because the right of truly and really believing ones, is according to the Decree of Election, such as the Lord ordained to be purchased to them by the Merits of Christ, and also according to the Lords revealed Will. He who believes hath right to eat of the Tree of Life, and to Membership and Seals: But this right Magus and hypocrites have not, for they have no part in Christ.  
2. The right that believers, as Peter and john, have, is by fulfilling of the condition. He who believes, and loves to be 
The right of hypocrites to Church privileges & seals, which is only Ecclesiastic & external, is no right real and true.  reform, hath right to the Covenant, Promises, to Perseverance, to the anointing that teacheth all things. These are promised and decreed to them, jer. 31. 33, 34. & 32 38, 39, 40. Isa. 54. 10, 11. & 59 20, 21. compared with Acts 13. 47, 48. joh. 6. 44, 45, 46. & 6. 37. & 10. 26, 27. and to them only, not to Magus and to Reprobates.  
3. Magus, and such like wooden and tree-legs, might claim the same life, living Membership, lively and vital operations, and to have the anointing, and to be kept through faith unto salvation by the power of God, 1 Pet. 1. 4. and to have the fear of God put in their hearts, that they should not depart from God, as jer. 31. 39, 40. if they have the same right to Membership and the Seals in their substance and grace signified with sound believers. And this is most absurd.  
If hypocritical Professors have another external and Ecclesiastical right then real believers upon these grounds, it must be a false and a bastard Charter, founded upon an hypocritical profession. Let Mr. H. show how the right of visible professors who are real believers, and the right of painted and rotten Professors, such as Magus and the like have, is one univocally, and in nature the same right; and yet Mr. H. (which darkeneth the Reader) puts them all in one, and would have Christ the same way to be King, Head, (survey pag. 16.) Redeemer, who hath bought with his blood the Elect, pag. 39, 40. and such rotten ones, as Magus and judas. 2. How a false and a true right can come from the same command of God, let Mr. H. judge.  
Lastly, it is poor to say, How come hypocritical Professors to have right to the Seals? As visible Members they have none, as invisible Members they have none, for such they are not.  
Ans. True, they are not; but Mr. H. gives them the same right with invisible Members: quo jure let him show. Ergo, the Church must give them no Seals, or give them Seals, when she cannot know they have any right, for indeed they have none that is true and real.  
Ans. The Church doth obey Christ in giving them Seals; and it well follows, Ergo, The Church giveth them Seals, when she cannot know they have any right, to wit, internal and real, which is a saving privilege of special note in the Mediator, to the Seals including signs and the grace signified: for so only they do belong in the Lord's intention and eternal decree to real believers, not to Magus and judas, except Mr. H. will stand for Arminian Universal Grace, and say that God intends the same saving grace in Ordinances and Seals to Peter and john, and likewise to Pharaoh and Magus.   

CHAP. XVII.  
Whether the visible Church, as visible, can bear these styles of the Body of Christ, of the Redeemed of God, the Spouse of Christ, etc.  
Mr. H. saith, These things may well be given to the visible 
Par. 1. pag. 40.  Church.  
Those over whom Officers are set, to feed them by Doctrine and Discipline, must needs be the visible Church: But these are the Church, Act. 20. 28. Feed the flock, not of the Elect only, but of the whole visible Church; Take heed to the whole flock of God, else if they were set over the Elect only, they might reply, Lord, we cannot search into thy secrets, who are the Elect and invisible Saints, only to feed them: where as the current and common sense of the Scripture, is, taking Redeemed and Sanctified as visible, though not really such, the stream of the Text runs pleasantly, Feed all visibly redeemed. Elect and Reprobate: So they be redeemed in the judgement of Charity.  
Ans. 1. The Church visible is taken two ways. 1. In the latitude, 
The Church is two ways visible.  as comprehending all Professors, sound, as Peter, or rotten, as Magus; all which have a sort of right to the Seals, but divers ways, as is said.  
2. More restricted, as a Church so and so visible, as the soundest part of real believers, comprehending in Corinth only such as are really justified, sanctified, etc. In the latter ●ense, the Church visible and professing is one in the matter, all one with the Church invisible, and sound and sincerely professing, and Peter is both a real believer, and visible and sound professing believer. In the former sense, Paul writing to Corinth, to Ephesus, 1 Cor 1. Eph. 1. 1. Rom. 1. 7. to the Romans, calleth all the Church visible there justified, or not justified, the Church, to wit, the Church visible. In the latter sense only the so and so visible professors, sanctified, justified, are the only really, sound professing visible Church, and the whole is named from the sounder part. In the latter sense, Christ is head and Husband 
How Christ is the Head of the visible Church.  of the visible Church, consisting of only real, sound, visible Professors, and that not only by the influence of politic guidance, but also by the influence of saving grace. But of this visible Church Mr. H. moves not the question, and therefore his Arguments speed the worse. 
The place Act. 20. 28 Feed the flack, etc. is answered by M. H. the same way that the Arminians answer to it.   
2. The Argument of the same strain is form by the Arminians, so, As many as are the really redeemed Church (say the Arminians) and, As many as are the Church of God redeemed in the judgement of Charity (saith Mr. H.) the Elders were to feed. But the Elders were to feed the whole flock, Elect and Reprobate, real believers and hypocrites. But the Proposition is denied, and how either the Arminians or Mr. H. prove the Proposition, 
Collo. Hagienses in confor. Thes. 2. p. 183. ad Acts 20. 28. Si hic per Eccle siam Christi Redemp●am soli Electi sunt intelligendi, Presbyteris Ephesiis ergo soli electi suerin● in Ecclesia commendati; sed hoc est absurdum, quia 1. Ecclesia Eph● siorum, cujus cura illis mandatur, erat ecclesia visibilis, in qud etiam sunt qui non credunt. 2. Presbyteri non poterant Electos noesse; Ergo, hic non intelliguntur soli Electi. See the answer of Amesius in Coron. art. 2. de Redemptione, pag. 145. As Arminians say, the Church, Acts 20. is the visible Church of the really Redeemed Elect and Reprobate: So that Church (saith Mr. H. is the really Redeemed Elect and Reprobate, in the judgement of Paul, and the really believing Church, Rev. 2. 4, 5. It is false, that as many as were bought with the blood of Christ in the judgement of charity, as were to be fed with Word, Seals and Censures.  we see not: For Redemption to be bought with the blood of God; yea, to be chosen to life before the foundation of the world, which are proper to the invisible Church only, are attributed to the visible Church of Ephesus, Eph. 1. 4. Was it Paul's mind that thanks should be given to God, because God hath chosen us all, and every one of the visible Church (here is Universal Predestination) of Ephesus before the foundation of the world to be really holy (for of that holiness he speaks) because from eternity God had in the judgement of charity chosen to life and holiness such as Magus and judas, and the grievous Wolves in that Church? So must Paul say, 2 Thess. 2. 13. We are bound to give thanks to God for you, all whom we feed, all to whom we write, real converts or hypocrites, that God hath, in the judgement of charity, chosen you all salvation through sanctification of the Spirit, and bilief in the truth.  
2. The Proposition is false, That as many as in the judgement of charity were bought with the blood of God, as were to be fed with Doctrine and Discipline, and so with Excommunication; Then were they to esteem all the grievous Wolves that spared not the flock, but preached perverse things, Acts 20. 28, 29. and all that had in such a manner fallen from their first love, and first works, yea all the Apostates in the judgement of charity to be bought with the blood of God, and eternally chosen to life, and saved: for the Officers were to feed all these with Exhortations, threatenings, Censures. Now the latter is unsound.  
But 3. They were all recommended to the care of Pastors, as dear bought. True: but not as if all were dear bought, the Text saith not that. Mr. H. no doubt, sinned with the Arminians, in adding that to the Text; for a father departing may recommend his family of children and servants to a Steward, because (saith the father) they are dear to me; it will not follow that they are all dear to him as children.  
4. Feed the Redeemed flock, not as known to you to be Redeemed or Predestinated to life, but as professors among whom are my ransomed ones. 
M. H. his interpretation of the bought Church, Act. 20. to be all & every one of that Church to be bought, redeemed and sanctified in the judgement of charity must also make the world, Joh. 1. 29. the whole world of Jews and Gentiles, 1 Joh. 2. 1, 2. to be in the judgement of charity the redeemed & sanctified world. How the visible Church is Christ's body.   
5. The Text runs in its stream most muddily, not pleasantly; if the world, and the whole world, joh. 1. 29. & 3. 16. 1 joh. 2. 1, 2. and the All, that Christ died for, be the Church of converts in charity's judgement, behold, Mr. H. turns the world, all the world, all the world for whom Christ died, before they were born, and had being, into visible Saints; and when the Lord saith, Ephraim is his dear son, Jer. 31. and Israel a holy priesthood, a chosen generation, the currant and pleasant sense must be, All and every one in the ten Tribes, and all Israel are the Lords dear children, and Priests sanctified to offer themselves an holy living sacrifice to God, in the judgement each one of another, though there be to their knowledge many thousand visible Idolaters, Murderers, etc. that are detestable to God, not dear to God, as every where the Scripture teacheth.  
Mr. H. p. 40. The visible Church is called The Body of Christ, 1 Cor. 12. 27. 28.  
Ans. The visible Church in the sense of Mr. H. as including Magus, judas, as such, is not Christ's body. 2. Nothing is proved, except it be made out, that all and every one in Corinth were lively Members under the Head Christ, in the judgement of charity, otherwise it is a sinful addition to the Text.  
Mr. H. A Church may be visibly in Covenant, which hath not an infallible assistance, may err in fundamentals, fall away, and not endure as the days of heaven, and so are his first and fifth arguments answered.  
Ans. It is, I confess, soon done, if well.  
Ans. It is true, if men entertain such things as they call truths, when they are but lies of Arminians, it will be easy to 
If a Church Congregational, the only visible Church may fall away, as M. H. granteth, then is not such a Church visible the first and principal subject of perseverance, and of the like privileges of special note in the Mediator, as M. H. saith.  wipe away all with a dry Negoconclusionem. My first argument to prove that the invisible, and not the visible single Congregation, is the principal, prime and only proper subject of all the privileges of special note given in the Mediator Christ, is Par. 1. pag. 244, 245. because that is such a subject of all these privileges, to which only and principally the Promises belong, that they are a seed enduring as the days of heaven, Psa. 89. and can no more cease to be in God's Covenant favour, than the Ordinances of heaven can cease to be, Jer. 31. 35, 36. then the Mountains can depart, Isa. 54. 10, etc. But the visible Church of a Congregation is not such, etc. Judge Reader of the answer.  
The fifth Argument, Because the invisible Church of the Elect is such as cannot err in fundamentals, cannot fall from the Rock, and not the visible Church of the Congregation, whereof seven may be a Church, and six of them such materials as Magus; nor can such a Congregation bear as the first, only, and prime subject, these styles (say I, pag. 250.) that are proper only to the Elect, Redeemed, and really sanctified Church, the styles of Christ's Sister, Love, Dove, Spouse, Mystical Body of Christ.  
Mr. H. answers by yielding the Assumption, A Church may 
The single congregation may fall away, Ergo it cannot b● either the subject or the first subject of a new heart, perseverance in grace, etc.  be visibly in Covenant, may err in fundamentals, may fall away. And this is Mr. R. first and fifth Arguments. Hence if perseverance and never falling away, be a special privilege given in the Mediator Christ, and it agree not to the Congregational, the only visible Church, and if it agree not to all visible Congregations, then is not the visible Church the only principal subject of such privileges; since the world was, no Logic can say that a property can be denied of its first and only subject, That is a man, and yet is not apt to laugh.  
2. To be visibly in Covenant, is not a privilege of special note, that is, a saving privilege, such as Perseverance, to have the anointing, and a new heart: Of which saving privileges I spoke all along, pag. 244, 245, 246, 247, 248, 249, 250, 251, etc. for to be visibly in Covenant, agrees to Magus, and to all rotten Members; but these saving privileges of perseverance agree not to Mr. H. his visible Church, which may, and doth fall away, saith Mr. H. Judge then, if these two Arguments be wiped away with a wet finger, as saith Mr. Hooker.  
Mr. H. p. 40, 41. A Church may be visibly redeemed by the blood of God, be called the Body of Christ, the Sons and Daughters of God, and yet not be really and inwardly such, which is his second Argument. The third is answered already.  
Ans. This is with a hop and a skip to take away Arguments. 1. Mr. H. should have done so much as repea●ed the Argument. But to be really redeemed, to be the Body of Christ, to be really, to be, I say, in veritate rei, the Sons and Daughters of God, and not to be called so only (a generation of Vipers call themselves, Matth. 3. the holy seed) are privileges of special note in the Mediator Christ, as I spoke pag. 244. and these privileges agree not to the visible and nominal Church, of which Magus is a Citizen, as to the principal, prime and only subject, as Mr. H. yieldeth; and so yieldeth the Argument.  
2. A Church may be both visibly the Redeemed of God, and called, and be really the Body of Christ, and invisibly, be also the Redeemed of God, by a figure, as touching the sound and real visible Saints among them, but that destroys Mr. H. his cause, who will have all and every one in the judgement of charity redeemed, even so many as are fed with Word and Censures.  
3. Mr. H. should have applied his answer to the Arguments, but he saw it would not frame. I have done it. Let the second thoughts of some help here. 
M. H. must expound all the precious Promises of the Lords giving the engraven Law in the heart, of Christ's bearing our sins on the tree, with the like, according to the judgement of charity. Yea, and the Lord doth not, by this interpretation, really commend his Church, but only in the judgement of charity; as Cant. 2. 14. Thy voice (in prayer) is sweet, in the judgement of charity; and Cant. 4. 7. Thou art all fair, my love, in the judgement of charity; and v. 9, 10, 11, 12. must bear the like sense.   
For Mr. H. must apply his answers to the cited places: so jer. 31. 33. I will put my law in their inward parts, according to the judgement of charity; and jer. 32. I will put my fear in their hearts, according to the judgement of charity. And when the Lord saith, I was a husband to Israel, that is, in the judgement of charity. Isa. 53. He was stricken for the transgression of my people, that is, visible Saints, and for Magus, for my confederate people, in the judgement of charity. Ah! ●ee not men dare to add their afterbirth inventions to the truth of God.  
Therefore Mr. H. addeth, pag. 40 They who hold that a visible Church is redeemed externally, cannot say by any good inference, that Christ died for all such in God's intention, or that all such are chosen to glory, or that God intendeth to save all such.  
Ars. This is said, not proved. If Christ die for the whole 
If Christ die for all the world in the judgement of charity, he must intend in the same judgement to die for them, & must in the same judgement c●…e them to glory.  world in the judgement of charity, he must intend and decree in the same judgement of charity to save them by his death, else he is conceived to die for them upon no intention at all. I judge Christ's dying for us essentially includes his intention to save, to deliver from the present evil world, Gal. 1. 4. If therefore this charitable judgement of Mr. H believed Christ died for all the Members of the Church of Ephesus (suppose Magus to be a baptised Member) he must in the same judgement believe that God intended to save Magus: yea, and Mr. H. must believe in charity, by his death he intends to save all and every one in the visible Church, all the earth over, and so did choose to glorify all the visible Saints, and consequently all nations; Isa. 2. 1, 2. all Egypt, all Assyria, Isa. 19 25. all the Gentiles, Isa. 60. 1, 2, 3, etc. all the Kingdoms of the world, Rev. 11. 15. for they are all the visible Kingdoms and Churches of Christ; and charity shall forbid to believe, that there be one reprobate in the visible Churches, and shall necessitate Mr. H. to believe that God intends salvation, and so chose to salvation every man and woman of them. But I shall not undertake to reconcile our brethren's charity and their faith, when the Lord shall fulfil the Prophecies, Isa. 2. & 19, etc. And what reason is there, I pray you, to say, People are visibly redeemed, but not 
Redemption how it is not properly visible.  visibly chosen to glory? for the act of redeeming is not Christ's visibly dying on the Cross, for that Redemption material was visibly to no generations before that crucifying of Christ, or to us; but it is the laying down of the ransom of that noble life for such a certain number of Elect, not one more, not one fewer than are written in the Lamb's Book of Life (I am of that opinion, I hope, with our Brethren) and this is as much hid and invisible to man, until their godly walk make their redemption in its effects to be visible, as their eternal Election to glory; therefore I much wonder of Mr. Lockyers asserting from Acts 15. (but I hope my Reverend Brother Mr. james Wood hath by this silenced him: for we look for only silence from him, except some other lewd brotherly help) that the proper and allowed matter of a visible Church now in the days of the Gospel, is persons truly converted, such as God who knoweth 
Little Stone, pag. 7.  the hearts of all men can bear witness of, as indeed sealed by his holy Spirit; I say, This is the matter that we ought now to take to raise again the Tabernacle of David, and none other, no not in a whole Church, as for that, so far as very spiritual men can judge. It's a dreadful addition to the Word.   

CHAP. XVIII.  
Answer to Mr. hooker's Arguments, That the invisible Church is not the first subject of the Seals.  
Me. H. Ar. 1. If those who were graceless, and had no 
Par. 1. pag. 41, 42.  interest in Christ, had yet a command from Christ to receive the Seals, had warrant from his Word to require them; then they had a right (outward and visible in foro Ecclesiae) to partake of them: for there is no better right than Gods Command to enjoin, and his Word to warrant us to challenge any privilege. But many graceless, who were no invisible members, Ishmael, Esau, and all the males were enjoined to be circumcised, and all the houses of Israel to eat the Passover.  
Ans. 1. What is in question is not proved, to wit, That the privileges of special note in the Mediator Christ, i. e. saving privileges, as Mr. R. often teacheth, pag. 244, 245. belong 
Hypocrites have not any Ecclesiastical right to the seals from the command of God, as a command, but from the command as it includes the fulfilling of the condition.  not to the invisible Church as to the proper and first subject. But Mr. H. proves, That external signs, and external right to the Seals, in foro Ecclesiae, are bestowed upon rotten Members, Magus and others.  
2. He ought to prove the visible Church is the only principal subject of the seals, as he elsewhere asserts. But this Argument proves it not.  
3. He frames the Argument of Infants, who have right to be circumcised, who have no command of Christ (for Infants are not capable of commands or threatenings) and brings not instances of these come to age under the New Testament.  
4. A graceless man, as Magus, hath thus far right to demand the Seals, that he may say to the Church, You sin in withholding the Seals, and therefore I require you baptise me, as Christ hath commanded you: but he cannot say, I have right even external to receive Baptism, and I sin not in receiving it. And Mr. H. Argument to prove it is naught: Why, saith he, Graceless men have the command of God to challenge the Seals; Magus hath the command of God to challenge, and to receive the Lords Supper. A command absolute he hath none: show me such a command, Magus, judas, eat and drink at the Lords Supper, challenge, claim and receive Baptism; All Israel eat the Passover, be ye real believers or hypocrites, be ye self-triers, and prepared or not, be ye clean or unclean: I confess there were no better right to challenge the Seals, than such a command, if any such were; but if Mr. H. or any of his read such a command, I pray I may see, and read also. But Magus hath only a conditional command, which gives him no true and real right, save only conditionally, to wit, Magus, receive the Seals and the Lords Supper, so thou believe, and examine thyself; if not, thou hast no right to the seals, but eatest and drinkest thine own damnation: And because these graceless men fulfil not the condition, and believe not, Mr. H. his Argument is wa●●ry; They have right from the command of God, which is the b●… right: that is, they have no right at all from a conditional command, they not fulfilling the condition, but such right as Robbers have to the Traveller's purse; yea, they have no command of God, but the contrary a severe discharge, Isa. 1. 13. Bring no more vain oblations. Matth. 22. 12. Friend, how camest thou in hither, not having a wedding garment? He that eateth and drinketh unworthily, 
job had right to the seals. Aug. de Civ. Dei l. 12. c. 47. Nec ipsos judaeos existimo audere contendere, neminem pe●tinuisse ad Deum praeter Israelitas— job nec indigena, nec proselyta, id est, Adven● populi Israel fuit, sed ex gente Idum●a genus ducens; ibi ortus, ibidem mortuus est.  eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, 1 Cor. 11. 29.  
Mr. H. p. 42. job and his godly friends were invisible Members, but being strangers they are forbidden to eat the Passover: Ergo, the seals belong not to invisible Members.  
Ans. 1. The thing denied is not concluded. job and his godly friends had the marrow of the Seals, and wanted some external signs, which are not saving privileges, as I allege pag. 244. That job was not circumcised, possibly is said, not proved by Mr. H.  
2. My mind is not to deny that the visible acts of eating, drinking, being washed in Baptism, belong not to visible believers as visible, taking visible as coincident with real believers; for invisible men can no more visibly partake of Ordinances, than Spirits can be baptised, and eat the Lords Supper.  
3. job and his godly friends were not forbidden to be circumcised, 
Genebrard. in Chron. an. Mun. 1239. tempore Patriarcharum vixisse ejus tempore plerosque Ch●nanaeo●um, ad Ecclesiam Catholicam perti●uisse existimat. Pineda in job cap. 1. ver. 1. Nu. 75. c. 4. Ecce docuisti multos fuisse regem & publicum doctorem populi sibi subjecti; When job lived even before the Law, and before Moses. See Theodoret Epitome. Divinorum decretorum, l. 5. de creatione. Origen. Homil. 4. supper Ezek. Euseb. l. 1. Demonst. Evang. cap. 3. Moses videtur septimus ab Abrahamo, job quintus.  nor to sacrifice; job sacrificed warrantably, job 1. c. 42. job professeth he was visibly in Covenant, job 13. 16. and 19 25. I know that my Redeemer liveth. And so they were neither invisible Members only, nor debarred from the seals. Nay, Proselytes were admitted to the seals.  
Mr. H. 〈◊〉. 41. If the invisible Church be the first subject of the seals, the invisible Church must have the seals firstly, and the visible Church secondarily; as heat is first in the element of fire, and secondarily in things hot by participation, as iron.  
Ans. It is no Logic: If the invisible and real believer, for example, Peter, be the first subject of the seals, including Christ signified in them, then to receive the seals worthily, agree first to Peter and to invisible real believers, and secondarily to these same invisible believers, as they do visibly declare by their savoury conversation, that they are really believers: but there is no real transmigration of accidents out of one subject to another; 
The visible Church as visible, is not the first and principal subject of the seals, according to their substance of the new heart, perseverance, etc.  that is cold Logic: but such real and internal right to the seals, and to Christ and his grace signified by the seals, do neither firstly nor secondarily belong to such visible Saints as Magus and judas, yea neither per se, nor per participationem; as the Sun and Stars are neither hot nor cold, either firstly or secondarily, for they are, Aristotle saith, Corpora quintae essentiae, bodies of a fifth essence, different from the elements and all mixed bodies.  
Mr. H. p. 42, 43. The Olive tree is the prime subject of the fatness that issues from it, and appertains to it, and of all the Ordinances. But the visible Church, Rom. 11. is the Olive, the seals and other privileges are part of the fatness which pertains thereunto: Therefore the visible Church is the prime subject of them. That the Olive is the visible Church, see Beza, Pareus, Willet.  
Ans. 1. Will Mr. H. bide by this Conclusion, That the visible Church, including rotten Magus, traitorous judas, is the prime subject of all saving privileges, of the new heart, 
The olive tree Rom. 16. 15. not the visible Congregation as visible, but as it includeth the Elect; and the fatness is not the outward signs only, of which Magus partaketh.  God's inward heart-teaching, perseverance, & c? Then by his own argument, Magus, and the visible body whereof he is a graceless member, as visible, must be first qualified inherently with all these saving privileges, as heat is firstly (saith he) in the fire; and then Justification, Perseverance in grace, must be transferred from such an ugly body as Magus, judas, etc. to real and invisible believers.  
2. The Assumption is false: Read again Calvin, Beza, Pareus; add Pet. Martyr, The English Notes, Diodati, they expound not the Olive of the visible Church only as contradistinguished from the invisible, as Mr. H. takes the visible Church in this dispute, as it includes the whole visible Israel, even Idolaters, who slew the Prophets and the Heir: But the Church visible including the Election, Rom. 11. 7. and also the invisible and really justified, and by fatness, they mean not only external privileges, which the rotten hypocrites wanted not, but the juice and sap of saving grace, by which, saith Pet. Martyr, They that are far off are made nigh, Ephes. 2. 12, 14. and were engrafted in the Head and Body, saith Pareus; yea, Willet citeth Gorham, and Lyra, who expound the fatness of habitual grace.  
Mr. H. Let Mr. R. remember he said, lib. 2. pag. 260. None 
Pag. 45.  are to be cast out for non-regeneration known to be such. But if ye give them the seals (saith Mr. H.) the Church shall give the seals to such whom she knows have no right to them.  
Ans. Mr. H. himself is alike burdened with this as I am: A 
Changed 2. p. 27. Non-regeneration excludes not men from Church-right to the seals, as M. H. imagineth.  toleration there must be of some, until the scandals be examined, and Censures applied, and the Church knows men to be unregenerated, many days before they can know it juridicè. Let Mr. H. then answer, whether they should be debarred from the seals or not.  
2. If such were admitted being free of scandal, it follows not (its a poor begging of the question) that the Church should admit to the seals such as she knows hath no right. Why? because they are not in the judgement of charity real converts; that is, non causa pro causa, no cause.  
Mr. H. Mr. R. puts the formalis ratio, the essential reason of Offices and Officers in another subject, besides the visible Church, in the invisible Catholic Church, convertibly, or reciprocally and universally. Whatsoever hath these privileges, to wit, Offices, Officers, Seals, right to the Seals, etc. is the invisible Catholic Church. And only the invisible Catholic Church (Ergo, not the visible) hath all these privileges. If Mr. R. rid his hands, etc. it's good.  
Ans. Mr. H. hath two pages near by of this, of which whether 
Mr. R. places not the formal reason of offices, officers, seals in the visible Church, as Mr. H. saith.  I have rid my hands, let the judicious Reader determine. Know, Reader, that Mr. H. will have all privileges, external Offices, Officers, Seals, and right Ecclesiastic (which is formally a painted bastard right) in the visible Church, only as its first subject: I rid my hands of this, by granting it; take the visible Church in a good sense, as including good and bad, nor said I ever any thing to the contrary. But these are not the saving privileges of special note, such as to be taught of God, to persevere in saving grace, etc. as I oft say, p. 244, 245, etc. And though Mr. H. his privileges, to be an Apostle, or another Officer, to have right external to the seals (a bastard right) agree to the visible Church, yea to judas and Magus, they being gratiae gratis datae: yet saving privileges, the anointing; the new heart, Justification, Perseverance; the styles of Spouse, Sister, Love, Dove, etc. are such as I desire Mr. H. to rid his hands, and to clear the coasts to us, by his answer to my words. Due right, par. 1. pag. 244, 245. divers pages; how these agree reciprocally to his visible Church. I take but some few. The single Congregatinn of such as Magus and Peter, etc. is the first and reciprocal, and proper subject of the anointing, of justification, and perseverance.  
And convertibly, All that have the anointing, are justified, persevere, are only the single independent Congregation of such as Magus and Peter, etc.  
What then will Mr H. do with his own, that are both visibly and invisibly justified, regenerate, who by persecution or pestilence are broken from the Independent Church? Shall they not share of the anointing, because they are not Members of the single Congregation? This is hard measure to the godly, and bad Divinity. This is not good Logic, that therefore Mr. R. must show some other essential causes of Offices and Officers besides the invisible Church: He must mean the visible Church of which Magus is a Member. I know in Logic, that the subject is an essential cause of an accident; Subjectum sumitur in d●finitione per additamentum, I learned long ago.  
And for the close, the society, the saving privileges, of the new heart, perseverance, is the invisible Church; and all that have these, the anointing, perseverance, etc. is the invisible mystical true Church. I own this reciprocation, as new Logic; though let not the Reader mistake, I take invisible as opposed to visible in its latitude, as it takes in both believing Peter, and the hypocrite Magus; yet so, as the visible Church is so named, to wit, a true visible Church, from the choicest part, but not as invisible is opposed to visible, tali modo, both visible and sincere: for the Catholic Church invisible, is also the Catholic Church visible, to wit, tali modo, in a sincere profession visible.   

CHAP. XIX.  
Mr. H. his formal cause of a Church visible, or Church confederating, is considered.  
Mr. H. We have done with the material cause: Now we 
Survey, par. 1. c. 4. p 45, 46.  come to the formal cause of the visible Church. The faithful, whether they be seemingly or sincerely such, scattered up and down the earth, are like stones in the streets, or timber in the field, they may have a communion by faith, by which they are an invisible Body Mystical, but until they meet together in one place, and have 
See Mr. Robinson his error in this. Justific. of Separate. pa. 297.  right to all the Ordinances there, and be confederate by a Church-Covenant, which gives the formality to these Churches, they are not visible Church members.  
Ans. If the faithful scattered in sundry Congregations have an invisible communion only by faith, and so make up an invisible communion, and an invisible Mystical Body; then two 
These of sundry Congregations have as visible a communion, and so make up as visible a body as th●se of the same Congregation that meet within the same walls.  Sister-Churches that cannot meet in one place, though they may do all the duties of Church-gaining one another, as Mat. 18. yet are not a visible body, no● their acts, acts of Church-profession, not are they visible members of the same Body of Christ, because they partake no● of the Ordinances within the same walls, as do members of the same single Congregation: so there is no visible communion, but within the walls of one Church; which is absurd, and repugnant to common sense.  
2. It is uncharitable, and against the Word, to teach, That when a Church is dissolved, by no sin and scandal visible, but by persecution or pestilence, that the dissolved members, though both real and visible converts, have no right to the Ordinances: for if the formal cause, to wit, their confederacy into one visible body, as Mr. H. saith, be removed, their visible and external right is removed. The like is to be said of visible professors, and of members of another Congregation, and known godly sojourners; these Mr. H. excommunicates for no scandal visible and invisible: for impossible it is that they can meet together in one place with their own Church, with which only they are incorporate by this confederacy.  
Mr. H. This confederating implieth two.  
1. The act of mutual engaging, which passeth away, arising from the act of obligation, the state of membership. The nature of incorporating members to mutual duties will constrain to yield to this.  
Ans. 1. An Oath or Covenant is no passing away thing, as Mr. H. saith, but leaveth the person under the tie.  
2. The state of trying these persons and their seed to be baptised only into the single Body, is a dream, even to Mr. Robinson, 
Marrying of Members to one Congregation only, is a Scriptureless conceit. Mr. Robinson, Justificat. of Separ. p. 317.  and the engagement that gives them right to Ordinances only with that single Congregation, and in one place, and with no society else to partake of one Bread, and of one Christ, 1 Cor. 10. 16 17. is a Scriptureless imagination: for 1 Cor. 12. 12, 13. We are baptised all, jews and Gentiles, by one Spirit into one Body, (Catholic, not a single Congregation only) and are all made to drink into one Spirit, in the Lord's Supper, even all; not of one single Congregation only, but of several Congregations, whether they be engaged Mr. H●. way or not.  
Mr. H. The judgement must be of persons free (in regard of humane constraint) for they may join, or not join to this Congregation, to receive them or not receive them. 2. It gives power to each over another, to watch over one another.  
Answ. Mr. H. makes three properties of this engagement; but he is sharp-sighted, who can difference the third from the first.  
2. Freedom from humane constraint i● dubious: If from the 
It is not free to professors to refuse to be membersof the Congregation in which they were borne of believing Parents, & baptised, and must reside in a convenient nearness to the Assembly of Saints.  Christian Magistrate compelling to Elicite acts of the will; Never man, I think, dreamt of such constraint, as may be laid upon men to believing, loving, fearing. If it be freedom from compelling the external man to Imperate acts; our Divines say, The Magistrate may civilly in his way compel to the means of Salvation, the baptised ones especially, both to hear, and to eat and drink at the Lords Table in some true Church. If it be freedom from a Law of God, or the Church constraint, as this it must be, or then nothing is said.  
1. God hath commanded all to come to the house, Pro. 1. ●0. Prov. 9 1, 2, 3. Matth. 22. 3, 4, 5, 6. Luk. 14. 16. And that is a Prophecy to be fulfilled under the New Testament, Zach. 14. 17. And it shall be that who so will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem, to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, even upon them there shall be no rain. The English notes say, it figures the Elects gathering together into a particular Church, to which every one must reduce himself to partake of the communion of Saints. And they are also the words of Diodati, and Calvin, junius, Piscator, Danaeus, say the same in sense. It is true, preaching to a particular Church should be voluntary, but not by such a Covenant, and so all worship should be; and it were not enough to say, Lord, thou commandest us to get us to the shepherd's tents, Cant. 1. 7. And to come into Wisdoms house; but we have freedom to enter Members to this or this, or all the Churches on earth.  
2. And it is in all the Churches on earth's power to receive us, or not; which is also false. One is born, baptised, comes to be a visible professor in the Church of Boston; is not that providential necessity a ground to the Magistrate to command him to do his duty, and for the Church to constrain him by Ob●estations, Censures, being born a member, to partake of the Ordinances, as his duty is. O but he is not satisfied with the Ministry of Boston, but he hath freedom to enter a Member of a Church a hundred miles distant by a new Church-oath: show a warrant why he ought not to worship the Lord there where his Calling and Trade is; he must confess Christ before men in all places, it is not arbitrary then.  
3. Not one word of God is alleged, that this engagement 
Church-duties of warning, teaching, comforting, rebuking, are by no word of Christ restricted to one single congregation.  gives power to watch over one another in this Congregation only, and not in all Congregations where Providence shall dispose he shall be; as if all these Church-duties to Members of Christ, of warning one another, comforting, watching over one another, taking care for one another, mourning with those that mourn, Col. 3. 16. 1 Thess. 5. 5, 11, 14. 1 Cor. 12. 26, 27. Heb. 10. 24, 25. & 3. 13. Rom. 12. 15. were forbidden as contrary to the Rule of the Gospel, in order to all precious Church-membes of other Congregations of which we are not Members.  
Mr. H. There is good cause why visible Saints (u● supra) who are thus to engage to watch over one another, should be acquainted 
Pag. 47.  with each others fitness, etc. and because the work is weighty, it would be done with fasting and praying, which is not requisite, when one single Member is admitted.  
Ans. That the thousands baptised of john Baptist, and the three thousand, Acts 2. who were to engage themselves, that is, before they were admitted, could have acquaintance and 
Experimental knowledge of the spiritual fitness one of another before the erecting of a Congregation is warranted by no word of God, whatever Mr. H. say on the contrary. Pag 47, 48.  knowledge of the spiritual fitness one of another, is impossible; and not only wants the authority of the Word, but is expressly against it; for it was impossible in some few hours to be done.  
2. Ten neighbouring sister Churches lying together are obliged to watch over one another, than they ought, by the Rule of the Gospel, to come under the same engagement.  
Mr. H. An implicit covenanting may be sufficient: as suppose a Congregation consist of the children of Parents expressly confederate, but vocal and express confederation comes nearest to the Rule. Mr. R. his bitter clamours, that we make all other Churches save our own, no Church, will be past.  
Ans. The Popish and Lutheran Churches in which there is valid Baptism, in which a Vow is made to walk in churchways, as observing one another, shall have the formal cause of true visible Churches, and so must be true visible Churches; for they have this Covenant implicitly and virtually.  
2. How shall we be made from the Scriptures to see that the Baptist, Mar. 1. 5. the Disciples of Christ, who baptised more disciple than john, Jo● 5. 4. did tie by Oath one way or another, (and the Covenant being their complete Rule must be vocal and express) are they so inchurched to engage to these Church-duties within their own Congregations? the word hints at no such thing.  
3. There is a necessity of vocal Covenant always, if it come nearest to the rule; but where is the rule?  
4. What making of matter and form as so described, and what reciding from the Rule of these Churches in the essentials, is so well known to all, as they must be most false Churches that are not made of visible converts, which is the constitution of the Anabaptist Churches: for bitter clamours and unworthy aspersions, I wish Mr. H. had expressed them, that the Reader might judge. I judge that the Church of Christ in N. E. makes true the prophecy, That the wilderness and the desert do there rejoice and blossom as a Rose, Isa. 35.  
5. Judicious Mr. Cawdrey citeth Dr. Holmes making an explicit 
Mr. Cawdreys Review, c. 3. p. 104. Pag 48, 49, 50  Covenant necessary.  
Mr. H. Cohabitation, which is necessary for our Churches, is such as is fit for the end, for the dispensing of Ordinances and Censures where they may conveniently meet, Acts 14 27. 1 Cor. 11. 26. & 14. 23. it suffers some exceptions. The Church may send 
No Covenant in the N. Testament ties any to Christian duties in one only Congregation, otherwise than as providential conversing with them affords, which is in sister-Churches also.  out some to begi●…●…antations where they want able guides, until they attain to a Church-state. State's may be compelled to send men to Sea for traffic and for war, and yet no prejudice is done to the Rule of Christ, they are said to cohabit where the place of their abode is in the issue.  
Ans. If cohabitation be necessary for the attaining the end; then, as the Pastor cannot be a nonresident, by necessity of a calling in Trading, neither can ten godly Merchants be three years absent, as Mr. H. says Solomon's Merchants were, but they must be non-resident, and neglect Church watching, ●nd break Covenant, if it be said (as it must be) it should be the Ministers only calling to reside and watch, but the Merchant hath an extraordinary calling to trade beside.  
Ans. This confirms us not a little; no godly visible professors can tie themselves by Covenant or Oath to exercise the common Christian acts of a Church member only to such a society, but in an occasional and providential way: for it is as unlawful to tie Church-worship to one society or place under 
How D. Bilson abuseth the place. Mat. 18. See Bilson the perfect government of Christ's Church, c. 4 p. 18, 19, etc. he mistaketh both our conclusion, & our arguments.  the New Testament, as it was to tie it of old to Bethel & Gilgal, Host 4. 15. & 9 14. & 12. 11. Amos 44. which is a demonstration that a godly professor carrieth about a Soul with him stands in need of Church-feeding by the Lord's Supper, and other Church Ordinances in all the Christian world, and that he is to warn, admonish, comfort all Church members, and to labour to gain a trespassing brother, not of the single Congregation only whereof he is a Member, Matth. 18. and neither Scriptures, nor sound Divinity, nor the Law of Nature (which is not destroyed by the Gospel) will warrant to limit the word, Brother, as Mr. H. doth, and his Brethren, Matth. 18. 15 If 
It is against our Saviour's purpose to limi●… the gaining of a trespassing brother, Mat. 28. to the only one Congregation of which the offended brother is a member fixedly.  thy brother trespass, if he hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother; to a brother only of the Congregation of which the offended brother is a member; as if Christ had not set down a rule, Mat. 18. of gaining all brethren within the single Congregation, or about it; for the word, Brother, is of this latitude, that it comprehendeth  
1. All that may offend a Brother, that is, one not only within a single Congregation only, of which the brother offended is a member, but also one of another Congregation. Now Mr. H. saith, ye have no Church power over one of a●●ther Congregation.  
2. He is a Brother whom ye are obliged to admonish, Go tell him.  
3. He is a Brother whom thou must labour to gain; Thou hast gained thy brother.  
4. He is a Brother who is obliged to hear the Church: He will not hear the Church.  
5. He is a Brother who may be cast out, Let him be to thee as a heathen.  
6. He is one whose sins ●ay be bound in Heaven, Verse 16, 17.  
7. He is a Brother, who if gained, may pray and meet with others in a Churchway in the name of Christ.  
8. He is a Brother, who if he be gained, Christ grants his desire and prayer, Verse 19, 20.  
9 He is a Brother, who is to be pardoned, If he sin against Peter seventy times seven times, Verse 21, 22.  
10. He is a Brother, who ought to forgive his fellow-Brother, as he would have God to forgive him, Verse 14, 25, 35.  
Now it were a foul straitning of the word of Christ, to say these ten agree only to a Brother in order to another Brother of the same single Congregation, as if we did owe by Christ's Doctrine in that notable Sermon, Compassion, Forgiveness, Teaching, Gaining &c. to no Brethren, but to those of the same Congregation, where of we ourselves are members.  
2. This Doctrine deprives godly travellers, so journers, savoury 
The unedifying and cruel inconvenience that come to the souls of believing merchants, sojourners who are visible Saints, by the Church engagement to one only single Congregation.  professors, of the Lords Supper, for three, for six years, of the Ordinance of the Lords Supper, of Church-teaching, Rebuking, Prayer, Church comforts, of all Church-manifestations, and of all Church communion with Christ, the Head of the visible Church, of all Church-presence of him that walks in the midst of the golden Candlesticks, of all Church-influences, of all Sanctuary-beauty, for no scandal or sin, but only for going about a lawful duty in all the visible Churches on earth, as is clear Cant. 1. 7. & 2. 1, 2, 3 4. Psal. 27. 4. & 73. 16, 17. & 84. 4, & 42. 1, 2, 3, 4. Hib. 2. 12. Psal. 22. 22. & 40, 9, 10. for it cannot take off the Argument to say, The godly professor may have the same comforts, but in an invisible way, which he hath in his own Church, in his native abode in a visible and Churchway: for, 1. This is to beg the question, for h●s professed hearing, praying with a foreign Church is as visible as at home. 2. If Christ no where have deprived a man of the comfort of the Lords Supper, whithersoever he come and profess himself a visible Saint, no men on earth can deprive him; but there is no more warrant why a visible Saint should not every where remember the Lords day by eating, as he may pray every where in faith holding up pure hands: for as he takes God's Name in vain, if he hate to be reform; so also to banquet with Christ, not discerning the Lords body.  
3. If these foreign Churches, of which he is no member (as Mr. H. saith) may and do as well discern Mr. H. his Marks of a visible Saint, as his own Church, to wit, after trading among them divers years, to them he savours as if he had been with jesus, p. 14, 15. he abstains from all known sins, p 24. then have they as good right to tender the Lords Supper to him as his own Church, and he may have a desire, and the same right both real and visible, that he hath to the Ordinances in his own Congregation; then, as the Eunuch said, Here is water, so, here is a ●able, and Christ in eating, what should hinder him to eat? Is not Christ walking beside the golden Candlesticks here as at home?  
4. If Providence necessitate him, as he is chased by persecution to one City, and is banished out of that, that he must fly to another, and from that to another, and from that to a third, and is providentially necessitated to have no certain dwelling, as was Abraham, and the Saints case, Heb. 11. 37, 38. 1 Cor. 4. 11. so was Christ's case, Matth. 8. 20. he must either live by the Rule of the Gospel, all his life, without Church-Ordinances, or as he cometh to ten sundry Churches visible, he must be ten times, twenty times married unto, and divorced from the Church, have and lose Church-right to a communion with Christ in his body and blood, and to the Head Christ, and to all the edifying comforts of Church-Ordinances.   

CHAP. XX.  
The Arguments of Mr. H. for a Church-Covenant considered and removed.  
MR. H. Every spiritual and Ecclesiastical incorporation receives 
Part 1. C. 4. Pag. 50.  its being from a spiritual Combination. So Cities and Towns have their Charter granted them from King and State, to meet for such ends; it is the Cement that sodders all. 2. Polished hewn stones give not being to a house, except they be conjoined, etc. But every particular Church is a City, Heb. 12. 22. A house, 1 Tim. 3. 15. The Body of Christ, Eph. 4. 13, 14. 1 Cor. 12. 27, 28. And all these are particular visible Churches where Pastors and Teachers are set, and Members k●it together. So Mr. R. Lib. 2. pag. 302. A Church in an Island is a little City, a little Kingdom of jesus Christ.  
Answ. Mr. H. in the title saith, 3. The reasons of the Covenant, and concludes nothing for a Covenant, but only tells us Saints are the Matter, like scattered stones, union makes the form; but Union is the result, the Covenant goes before; The proposition is, Every Corporation receives its being from Combination: This shall prove no more, but the Congregation is a Congregation from Union of Members; (this is no conclusion debated by us) and proves as well that a National Church, a larger Kingdom of Christ, as Rev. 11. 15. Isa. 2. 2. Egypt and Assyria are made the Lords people visibly considerated, Isa. 19 25. and that by one Union, one Lord, one Faith, one Baptism, 
The reason for this Church-Covenant from the Privileges of a City is nought, and much against this Will worship.  by the Covenant of Grace so professed; yea, the invisible Catholic Body, the Bride the Lamb's Wife, Rev. 21. is a spiritual corporation by such an Union.  
2. The thing in question is never proved, to wit, that every single Congregation is made a visible Body within itself, by such a Covenant as the Members are engaged to watch over only one another of that society, have a Church right to Ordinances, Word, Seals, censures, only with the Members of that one society that meet within the walls in one house, and with no other all the earth over.  
3. The comparison of a City to a State holds not; See Mr. Cawdry. Cities, 1. have different Charters and Privileges in 
Cawdery review. c. 104. Pag. 106, 107.  measures, trading, selling. 2. Different public Rents, Burrough-Lands. 3. Different Governments, some by Major and Aldermen, as royal burgh's: some far otherwise. And so 4. Free Citizens in London, not free Citizens in York, and here is some specifical difference (as it were) in Laws and Freedoms. But it is a poor begging of the question without probation to say, that single Congregations have these four differences; for all Congregations visible have 1. The same Charter, the Covenant of Grace, one Faith and Doctrine of the Gospel. 2 One inheritance and hope of glory, Eph. 4. 3. One and the same visible Head Christ. 4. The same Baptism, and are all visible brethren and members, having the same right to the Seals all the world over, without any new Church Covenant. Phoebe, justus, Epaphroditus, Rom. 15. 1. Col. 4. 10. Eph. 6. 21. Are brethren (visible professors, the distinction of saluting brethren, and of Church-brethrens must not be taken up on our brethren's word) having right by Letters of Recommendation to Seals, as 
Rutherfurd due right of Pres. par. 2. pag 328, 329. Mr. John Cotton his judicious tractate of the keys. ch. 3. pag. 17. The way of the Churches of N. E. ch. 6. sect. 1. pag 103 and sect. 2. 16. Mr. Hooker Survey par. 3. c. 2. p. 10.  Mr. Cotton teacheth: now Letters of Recommendation, as I prove, (and Mr. H. never lets on him that he did read it) yea, nor do men or Angels give, but only declare right, that brethren Pastors had before in all Churches to Baptism, to partake of the Seals, otherwise they cannot eat the Lord's Supper in another congregation, contrary to both the truth and Mr. Cotton, and the way of the Churches of N. E. except they swear or engage themselves members to all the Churches about where they should and ought occasionally to receive the Seals, and partake of Church-comforts. But this Mr. H. flatly contradicteth; let them agree among themselves: now such an engaging being a binding of themselves to impossibilities, that they shall discharge duties of watching over all, as over their door-neighbours of the same flock, is impossible, and so unlawful; no authority on earth can take saith, or the holy and blameless visible profession thereof from a visible professor; and to whatever Table of the Lord he comes, or ordinances of ministerially preached promises, they are his by his faith visibly professed; Mr. H. must show one inhibition of Christ to debar any visible son from the father's bread; if then the argument be drawn from civil Corporations (as they cry out against this argument in us for Provincial and National Churches) it must be this, as every incomplete Corporation or Lane in London consenting to receive such a man an Inhabitant and Member of that Lane, doth not make the man so received a free Citizen of London, for that he was before they received him, when he was a member of another Lane: and every City admitting a man to be a free Citizen of London, does not make him a subject of the Kingdom of England, for that he was before he was a Citizen: so neither does every single Church receiving a member, make him for that a member of the visible Church: for 1. he was before (we suppose) baptised, and both a real and a visible Saint, and had Church right to partake 
Ch. 6. Sect. 1. Pag. 103. The texts that call the Church a City, are nothing for the Congregational engagement; The Apostle noteth, Eph. 4. the Catholic Elect Church: as also Heb. 12. The way of the Churches of N. E. C. III. sect. 1. pag. 53. Ibid. ch. 4. sect. 6. pag. 82. Mr. H. Survey par. 1. c. 2. pag. 15. Theodoret. electos; Occumenius, fideles quorum nomina scripta sunt in libro vitae. Calvin. Marlorat. C●●lestem ergo jerusalem intelligit quae per totum mundum extruenda erat quemadmodum Angelus f●niculum ejus ab Oriente usque in Occidentem exte●dit. Piscat. Qui electi sunt ad vitam aeternam, Luk. 10. English Annotations, Diodati The Universal Church. Pareus Com. Est igitur Ecclesia invisibilis electorum quam sanctam Catholicā credimus in symbol. Sed an omnes Hebraei erant primogeniti, electi, hoc non dicit, sed ad eos accessisse. Cajetan. Ecclesia● Apostolorum & Discipulorum immediatorum Christi, qui conscripti sunt in libro divinae praedestinationis. Estius. Filios Dei per adoptionem, qui sunt Electi.  of the Lord Jesus, and the bread, not as a seal of our communion with the Members of his own church only, but of all the Churches of the Saints, saith the Church of N. E. The argument is not unlike this: Whatever constitutes Socrates a single person, doth also constitute him a man, which is most false. 2. The Texts in the assumption are widely mistaken, Heb. 12. 22, 23. But you are come to Mount Ziou, that is, to a single Independent Congregation; nay read more, v. 23. To the general Assembly and Church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven; that is, to a company of visible saints, of which seven may be a Church (saith the way of the Churches of N. E.) and these sometimes (say they and M. H.) hypocrites, such as judas and Magus: If so, than these must be called the City of the living God, the heavenly jerusalem, the general Assembly of the firstborn, whose names are written in heaven. It may grieve the godly, that the word of God should be so perverted: Oecumenius, and Thtophylact and Galvin, Piscator, Marlor●●, English Divines, Diedati, Pare●s, as also Cajetanus, Esthius, call them the universal church of the elect.  
The place 1 Tim. 3. 15. is not to be limited to the Church 
Beza in locum. Ecclesi●m corpori comparat, cujus anima est Christus. Calv. Particula universalis (omnes) non sic ut omnes homines in Christum credant, hoc eni●● Synecdochicè de praedestinatis duntaxat à Paulo dicitur, ●i namque soli in unitatem fidei perveviunt, qui ab aeterno electi sunt, Rom. 8. 30.  of Ephesus, Pareus loquitur de columna ministeriali, of a ministerial Church that preacheth the Gospel, and so it's nothing to this purpose; Calvin, Beza, Cr●●iger, he means the Church indefinitely whithersoever Timothy should come, let it be a particular Congregation, it is made up of preaching Pastors, who bear up the truth, by the preached Gospel, as the pillars (say Piscator and Pareus) bear up the house.  
The place Eph. 4. 13, 16. is meant not of a visible Congregation, whose members are Magus and judas; for Christ leading captivity captive, and ascending, gave not Apostles and Teachers finaliter, for the saving and perfecting of the visible body as visible in Mr. H. his way (which must be said, if any thing be proved against us) but of the body which is visible, but not as visible, but as he saved the Church, inlived by Christ, saith Beza: He speaketh, saith Calvin, of the end of the Ministry, Until we all meet in the unity of faith; not that all men shall believe in Christ, but he speaketh by a Synecdoche (saith he) of the predestinate only; for they only come to the unity of faith who are chosen to glory. Zanchius and grave and learned D. Bodius of 
Zanch. in loc. Constat (oorpus hoc) ex E●ectis tanquam membris coagmentatis Christo per fidem. Nostras Ro. Bodi●● à Trocheregia vir nobili genere na●us Com. & Praelection. in Eph. 4. v. 12, 13. pag. 511. 512. Haec p●rro Sanctorum compactio sive coagmentatio bifariam promovetur. Primo, cum nova subinde membra ad corporis hujus compagem adsciscuntur, fide donantur, & Christo capiti per fidem inseruntur. Deinde, quando jam vocati & Christo ins●●i in fide & charitate magis magisque proficiunt. Siquidem utroque hoc modo corpus hoc mysticum ad suam perfectionem tendit. pag. 513. Donec omnia membra (ergo Catholicam Eccle●●●● militantem intelligit) non modò ad corporis hujus mystici compagam & communionem vocata su●●int, ver●m etiam debitum spiritualis illius staturae complementum acceperint. Pareus Com. in Loc. Minus videtur fieri posse ut tam divers● sortis, nationis, conditionis homines in un● corpus coeant.  Trochrigge in his learned Commentary, as also Piscator, Bullinger, Sarcerius, Marloratus, Rollocus, Diodati, English Divines, with the Text expound the place of the true mystical body.  
For 1. Christ ascended for that body, and sent Apostles not for Magus, and such of Mr. hooker's visible saints.  
2. He intends the perfecting and edifying of that body, verse 12. and Apostles and Pastors are theirs, and for their salvation, 1 Cor. 4. 21. 2 Cor. 4. 15.  
3. Christ is the saving head only of that body, and the visible Church is never called his body in Scripture, because visible, but by a figure, because of the lively members among them, drawing life from the head Christ, Eph. 1. 22, 23. Eph. 4. 16. Eph. 5. 23. Col. 1. 18.  
4. He speaks of that body which shall come with all the saints to the unity of faith.  
5. Which grows up into a perfect man, etc. which is a living body, from which I excommunicate Magus and judas. And for the place 1 Cor. 1. 12, 13. It's not a single Congregation 
The visible Church, because visible is never in scripture called the body of Christ. The body, 1 Cor. 12. is the Catholic Church, and how. Mr. Cotton Keys, c. 3. 17. Way of the Churches ch. 6. sect. 1. pag. 103.  visible; show in all the Scripture where a single Congregation, yea, and every single Congregation never so few (for were it but of seven, or ten, or twenty, it is an instituted politic Church (though wanting Pastors to our brethren) is called Christ's, the body of Christ, as this Church. So Calvin, Beza, Martyr, N●● parvae consolatio hac; it is no small comfort, that the Church is called Christ's, because it is his body: for as Cyrillus saith, Christ, assumed the nature common to all. 2. All the members of the body being many are one body, so also is Christ: yea, th●se many are men of divers cases, divers nations (saith Porous) yea Jews and Gentiles, verse 13. And therefore this is the Catholic visible body. 3. It is the body, that have been all made to drink into one spirit, in the Lord's Supper; but this must be the many members of divers Congregations, 1 Cor. 10. 16. as our brethren confess. 4. It is the body that lives by the spirit of Christ, 〈◊〉. 12. For when Christians are said to make one body, it is not understood of a politic body only, but (saith Martyr) of the spiritual and secret body of Christ which aims at life eternal, and 
Martyr in Loc. Cum Christiani dicantur ●num corpus efficere, 〈◊〉 tantum politicum Christi corpus intelligitur, sed spirituale & ar●anum Christi corpus quod ad vitam aeternamtendit, habetque communia hac omnia, Dium, Christum, Spiritum Sanctum, 〈◊〉 Dei, gratiam, sacramenta, ex quibus liquet 〈◊〉 posse in corpore Christi membra arida & mortua esse.  hath all th●se common, God, Christ, the Holy Ghost, the word of God, Grace, the Sacraments, to wit, Baptism, the Lords Supper, called by a Synecdoche, a drinking of the Wine in the Supper; into one spirit, which excludeth not the eating of the bread, v● 13. and so sometimes he speaks of his body in regard of its parts, to wit, of single congregations where the sacraments are administrate, and where there are Prophets, Watchmen, Pastors, Ruling Elders, as eyes and ears, yet not fixed and married by a Church-Oath to one only single congregation, and all along as of the Catholic visible body. And it is true which Mr. R: grants, that a Church in an Island is a little City; but so as it is a member of the Catholic visible body, that hath no charters and privileges spiritual different from these of the whole.  
Mr. H. Arg. 2. They who have mutual power each over other to command and constrain in cases whereas they were free before, must by mutual engagement be made partakers of that power. But such are the Church of believers. Ergo. 
Part 1. pag. 51, 52, 53.   
The second part of the Assumption is clear by Matth. 18. where a legal order is set, by which brethren only of the same Church ought to exercise power one over another, not over infidels, nor yet with other Christians; for I rebuke a Christian of another Church, I cannot call the Church; he departs the place and refuses to come; but I may in a legal way convince and bind Archippus, for he is a brother; and Mr. R. saith, if the classis will not censure him, the congregation may reject him. Learned Whitaker saith, That each of the congregation or counsel hath power over the Apostle Peter, as a brother to censure him; so saith Mr. R.  
Ans. The conclusion denied is not proved, but this, Ergo They must by mutual engagement be made partakers of this power. The question is, whether this Church-Covenant be the formal 
As Mr. H. seldom proves what is denied; so not any of his arguments conclude that we are of no members made visible members of the Church only by this Church Covenant.  cause of membership visible to and in this only Congregation, and no other visible Church on earth.  
2. The proposition is false; for before that engagement so monopolised and restricted to that one only Congregation (which were Will-worship) these brethren being born of believing Parents, and also solemnly by their covenant in baptism were engaged visible members of all the visible Church on earth, and of this of Boston, & these round about (where by providence they dwell) they visibly professing the Gospel. I deny not but it is lawful for a sojourning godly professor, to promise to watch over these of the Congregation where he sojourns: but not in in all cases expedient that he multiply twenty engagements, and it may be twenty oaths, or solemn promises in twenty sundry congregations; so may he engage for a Family, Camp, College, Ship. And it is false to say,  
1. You only are my Church brethren, Matth. 18. 
The Church-covenant destroys all Church-communion.   
2. It is false to say, I have Church-power to the Seals here only.  
3. I am made, by this engagement, a Member of Christ visible, whereas I was not so before.  
4. It is false, that when I remove to another Church from this, that I los● all Church-right to seals, all Church-power to gain brethren to Christ there.  
And 5. it is false, that when I leave this Church, I am unchurched, no fellow-citizen with the Saints, no Church-member, and yet I was never excommunicate.  
3. The Assumption is most false, That by Matth. 18. a brother 
Vid. Chamier. l. 6. c. 6. loc. come. p. 280.  is to gain only a brother of that congregation whereof he is a Member: Mr. H. aims not to prove that, If thy brother trespass, etc. that our Saviour means only of that independent 
What power one member or one Church hath over another.  congregation, whereof the brother is a Member engaged to that only congregation, where the gaining and offended brother is a Member. I have alleged ten Reasons on the contrary. Mr. H. his Reason is against himself and the Text, as well as against us. You (saith he) rebuke one of another congregation, he will not hear you; tell the other Church, he departs the place. What then? his Church he leaves should proceed to censure him by Matth. 18. And may not a brother of the same Church refuse to hear also, and depart the place? and the place of Matth. 18. (say we) proveth that both are to be censured by their own respective Churches, as obstinate offenders.  
4. Mr. R. saith indeed, That one Congregation hath no power of jurisdiction over another, but each may complain of another to a Presbytery, or to a Church above both, else the remedy of Christ to remove scandals between Church and Church, is too narrow, and very nothing; and sister-Churches offending each against others, are not to rebuke, and labour (by Mr. H. his way) to gain one another to Christ; and nothing can be more contrary to love and edification, th●n this, and more contrary to our Saviour's intent, Mat. 18.  
5. What is the formal binding and losing which one Congregation hath over another, or one Member hath over another of the same, or of divers Congregations, the Scripture is silent: The Churches of divers Congregations lay on burdens and bind other Churches under them, Act. 15. 28. and command and enjoin the things to be believed and done: So Mr. 
Mr. Cotton the keys of the kingdom. ch. 6. p. 25.  Cotton. But that one Church-member may bind and lose, is unknown to the Scripture: for you may say so, one Subject may bind and lose, forgive debts and bloodshed, because he may complain, or forbear to complain to the Magistrate, and so one Church may bind or lose another Church, and one 
For one member or one Church to complain of another, is no binding or losing, such as is Mat. 18. as Mr. H. saith.  Member may bind or lose a whole Church, and many Churches, by complaining or not complaining to sound Neighbour-Churches, whose it is to unchurch by non-communion, or to forbear.  
6. Mr. H. proves not that Members have not power over each other by this engagement, because before the engagement they are free, and none can compel them to be Church-members, or to be baptised, Luk. 7. True, but if they reside and refuse to join to the true Church, and so deny Christ before men, and being professors, if they refuse to join to the true Church of Christ, they are to be esteemed as Heathens or Publicans; as the Lawyers who refused to be baptised, despised the counsel of God, Luke 7. 30. and the Gospel-threatning for refusing to come to Wisdoms banquet, Prov. 1. 20, 24. & 9 3, 4. Luk. 14. 18. are no less bindings and constraining in their kind, than Church-rebukes of one to another, and Excommunication. Of this before. It is probable and more, That a godly Christian conqueror may hinder conquered Heathen to blaspheme Christ, and adore Idols, and compel them to hear the Gospel.  
7. It a wonder that Mr. H. should cite Whitaker, or any of our Divines, who are all for the power of Presbyteries, Synods, yea of an Oecumenick Council, from Mat. 18. which he himself disclaims as an invention of men.  
Mr. H. Arg. 3. Voluntary combination makes a man a Member 
Par. 1. pag. 53, 54.  of a Presbyterian Church, as Mr. R. Lib. 2. pag. 320. th●n must voluntary combining make one a Member of a Congregation.  
Answ. Still the point in question is never touched. Will this prove that voluntary engagement is the formal cause of a visible Church? so Mr. H. tells us, ch. 4. pag. 45. Of the formal 
Presbyterial & congregational churches in general, are of divine institution, & yet according to their locality, number of members, etc. are only things of order, etc.  cause of a visible Church: Nor doth voluntary combining make any so a Member of this Presbyterial Church; as he is not also a Member of the whole visible Church, or as he hath no Church right by divine institution to Ordinances and Seals in another Presbyterial and Congregational Church, as this way of Mr. H. teacheth: for, as I say in that place, Presbyterial Churches & Congregational in their being are of divine institution, but in their local bounds, and determitate number of Members, they are things of conveniency, of order, and providential necessity, not of divine institution; and the consequence is poor and nothing; for that is a huge mistake of Mr. H. An implicit Covenant 
Par. 1. p. 47. The implicit Church-covenant is but an imagination.  is, when professors in practice do that whereby they make themselves to walk in such a society without any verbal profession; for then a sojourning believer partaking in forty Churches of the Seals in some few years, occasionally doth enter forty implicit covenants, doth forty times unchurch himself, and lose and take up of new his Burges-ticket and Church-right, and lose it again: For Mr. Cotton, and the Way of the Churches of N. E. teach, That such a man an hundred times 
The way of the churches of Christ in N. E. ch. 6. sect. 1. p. 203. and sect. 203. Mr. Cotton keys, ch 4. pag. 17.  partakes of the Seals in some few years, and may lawfully do it, as a son coming occasionally to ten sundry Tables in ten cities or ten families, which do equally belong to his rich and potent father, as he providentially cometh along; yet is he not ten times for that made a son and member of his father's great family; for his one and the same numerical sonship gives him right to all the ten tables: So one and the same visibly professed sonship gives to a sojourning believer the same Church-right to be fed at all the Tables, to all Church ordinances in ten hundred visible Churches all the earth over; Letters of recommendation do declare, but not create his Church-right to Christ and ten hundred Lords Suppers; and it is a dream, that the practising and partaking of the Lords Supper gives ten hundred new combinations and fancied formalities of Membership to all the Churches, whether Congregational or Presbyterial. Say one be necessitated to dwell in his father's heritage, and must be a Member of that Church; What Scripture doth lose him from the same occasional duties he owes to the Church from whence he departed, as now being no fixed Member thereof?  
Mr. H. 4 Arg. That society of men who may enjoy such privileges spiritual into which none are admitted without the approbation of the whole, that society must be in a special combination; for such an act argueth a combined power, which the whole hath, and not any Member alone; and that they cannot have but by their agreement. But the Congregation is such. They who have power to choose, have power to reject their Officers, who offer themselves to be Members.  
Ans. If none may be admitted without the approbation of the whole Congregation, then may no visible Saints, Members of sister visible Churches, be admitted to Church-ordinances Pastoral, hearing, seals, rebukes, comforts, prayers in a Churchway, but by some Covenant one or other made between the Church and these strangers that come to partake: Let Scripture speak, if communion of Saints be not here enough.  
2. This fell from a sleeping pen, and what the conclusion is who can tell? 'Tis far from the question: for the conclusion is, Ergo, the Members of the Congregation are combined. Why not? Valeat totum. And the whole Church must admit the communicants the many thousands; then ten or twelve thousand of jerusalem must all be acquainted with the visible Saintship of each other; yea, women who have taken the Church-covenant as well as men: then can none hear, nor partake of Church-prayers and seals in another Congregation, without the privity, and conscience and consent of all the Members, suppose they be ten thousand, and without the consent of the whole: now women are confederate Members as well as men.  
Mr. H. Arg. 5. Christian affection makes not the Church; for it is in such as never saw other.  
Ans. It proves nothing: they may be Members of the visible Catholic Church, who never saw one another in the face, 
It is impossible that the whole Church can be acquainted with the Church-hearing of every stranger visible Saint, who comes to join from the Neighbour-churches. See Jam. 2. 2. 1 Cor. 10. 23, 24. Luke 4. 16. Act. 13. 14, 15.  Prov. 11. 15. Isa. 2. 1, 2. & 19 25. Psa. 22. 27, etc.  
2. Cohabitation (saith Mr. H.) and meeting in one place, 
Pag. 54, 55.  makes not a Church; for Turks may meet to hear the Word, 1 Cor. 14. Ergo, covenanting must be the formal of a Church.  
Ans. 1. Divers other things are required to the essence of a visible Church, as we shall hear.  
2. All is beside the question, we dispute not now the essence of a Congregation.   

CHAP. XXI.  
Whether Mr. Hooker doth prove this Conclusion (which Mr. R. never said, nor wrote, nor thought) That Baptism gives formality, or makes a Member of a visible Church.  
Mr. H. If there be a Church, and so Members before Baptism, 
Mr. H. Survey, par. 1. ch, 19 p. 55.  than Baptism cannot give formality; for forma is causal, and before formatum. But the Church now considered as totum essentiale, is before Baptism. For Ministers are before Baptism, else Baptism may be administered lawfully before by such as are not Rulers nor Pastors, which is denied by Orthodox Divines, and none can give a call to Ministers, but only a Church of believers. 
Mr. H. without any ground ascribeth to Mr. R. that he maketh Baptism the formal cause of visible membership.   
Ans. It's a conclusion not ingenuously forged, as if I made Baptism the specific form of Membership visible; he ought to have cited my words. By Baptism (I say) we are received solemnly into the visible Church; and Baptism is a seal of our entry into Christ's visible Body, as swearing to the colours entereth a Soldier a member to the Army; and, we teach not that Baptism constituteth the Church visible simply as the Church, it's a seal of a visible profession.  
I distinguish the simple being of a visible Member actu primo; such are Infants born within the covenant visibly made to parents, the promise is made to Church-members, Gen. 17. 7. Acts 2. 39 from the solemn entry and admission into the visible Church.  
2. I distinguish between simple being of a Member, and actual solemn communion or visible profession: So speaks the renowned 
Due Right of Presbyt. par. 2. q. 2. pag. 210. & 211. & 218. Synod at Westminst. of Great Brit. Conf. c. ●8: p. 58. Ib. Catech. larger p. 137. Calvin advers. Anabaptist. art. 2. Homo in communionem Ecclesiae per baptismum cooptatur. Calv. Instit. lib. 4. c. 15. sect. 15. Est Confessionis nostrae symbolum— ●otestamur nos in Ecclesiam Dei ingredi, 1 Cor. 12. 12. Bucan. loc. 47. q. 53. In unum corpus (●o) baptizati sumus, 1 Cor. 12. Tilen. Syntag. disp. 59 th'. 4. In familiam patris coelestis cooptati per baptismum. Synops. purior. Theol. disp. 44. th'. 34. In Ecclesiam visibilem & particularem insertio. Beza lib. quest. p. 150. Christianos tum à reliquis hominibus sejungit, tum inter se quasi unum sub eodem capite corpus consociat, ut Apost. 1 Cor. 12. 12. Pareus in catech. q. 69. ar. 2. pag. 387. Tertius finis, ut sit symbolum ingressus & receptionis in Ecclesiam, quia Deus omnes Ecclesiae suae cives vult hoc modo recipi. Pet. Mart. come. in Rom. 6. Inferi autem nos visibili Sacramento (Baptismi) in Christum & Ecclesiam declaratur hoc loco.  Assembly, so Calvin, Bucan, Tilen, Professors of Leyden, Beza, Ursine, Tr●l●atius, Pet. Martyr, junius, Pareus, Waleus: it's a seal for our solemn admission, and solemn engraffing and adopting into the visible Church, 1 Cor. 12. 13. For by one spirit we are baptised into one body, etc.  
1. The conclusion is fancied, and nothing against me, who teach, That Baptism is the door, way and means of our solemn installing into actual communion with the visible teaching Ministerial Church, (which Arminians and Socinians deny) Ergo, must Baptism be before the Ministers?  
2. This fancied homogeneous Church visible of only believers, can be no politic Church, and that in ordinary to Christ's second coming, which calleth Ministers, for Ministers did baptise this Church; then must the effect, to wit, called Ministers, be before, and that ordinarily the creating cause, to wit, the Church of believers who made them Ministers, a dream: If this homogeneous Church be a number of unbaptized believers, (and such Pagans they must be, for Mr. H. saith, They are a born Church, before their father's Baptizers) then must unbaptised children (a strange Church) call and give Ministerial being, and that ordinarily, to their fathers, and choose out of their own unbaptized body their own Pastors not yet baptised: and who baptised these unbaptised? not the unbaptized Church, nor themselves. Mr. H. I judge would deny both.  
3. As to that, Whether the Church or the Ministry be first, it is sure, Adam and Evah, as men, were before the Word: if 
The ministry must be before the church of believers.  any say, They being created according to the Image of God, were created a Church; yet some priority there is of the subject, before the concreated Law: but sure they were not created a visibly professing Church, and therefore the Word, as preached in Paradise by the Lord the first Minister, Gen. 3. 15, 16. must be before Adam and Evah as a visibly professing Church. For, the seed is before the tree, the means before the end, the father before the child, and so some Ministry, ordinary or extraordinary begetting, there must be, before the Church begotten. Who baptised john Baptist? or if he was at all baptised, is not much. But that the Church in the ordinary way of Christ is before the baptising and begetting Ministry, is wild Divinity.  
Mr. H. If Baptism cannot be before a Ministerial Church, nor 
Par. 1. p. 55, 56  a Ministerial Church before a Congregational Church, which only can call them to be Ministers; then such a Church is much more before Baptism. For before the coming of some godly zealous Christian and Scholar into a country where there are a company of Pagans converted, they may join in Church-fellowship, and call this man lawfully according to God, to be their Minister, therefore there is a Church before a Minister, and so before Baptism.  
Ans. 1. Mr. H. gives an extraordinary instance of his own devising, without Scripture; and of this he frames a fixed ordinary Rule, May not converted Pagans, which only (saith he) can call Ministers, call this Christian Scholar to be their Minister according to God? No, say we,  
1. God never did it, nor is there any Scripture-proof for it.  
2. Why doth Mr. H. frame a new instance of his own, and pass by the Lord's way? For God sends not private men, or Christian unofficed Scholars (or if he do, their extraordinary 
Mr. H. his calling of a Christian scholar to be an unbaptized minister by unbaptized Pagans conve●ted; a supposition that proves nothing.  sending makes them public Pastors and Prophets, not the people) but he sent Philip an Evangelist, and after Peter and john to Samaria, Act. 8. Paul to Macedonia, Act. 16. and his own Ministers, Tit. 1. 5. 1 Tim. 4. 14. & 5. 22. Paul and Barnabas, men in office, some more than zealous Christians and Scholars to the Gentiles, Act. 13. jonah to Niniveh, Ananias to baptise Paul, Jon. 3. Act. 9  
3. Doth not Mr. H. dress up a providence of a Christian Scholar sent to converted Pagans, and must they be made the ordinary and only Church who can call Ministers? and this Scholar being unbaptised himself, must as the married Pastor in the ordinary way of Christ baptise to his dying day others, and his calling must be null (say our Brethren) except that only 
Answer to 32 questions, q. 20. p. 67.  Church call him; and according to the ordinary Rule of Christ, he must be all his life unbaptised (which must be a reputing of Baptism, with the Famil●st, a thing indifferent) rather than he own a foreign jurisdiction (as Mr. Lockier speaketh) so as to be baptised by a Pastor of another Church.  
Mr. H. If Baptism give the form to visible Membership, then 
Pag 56.  while that remaineth valid, as it doth in excommunicated persons, and when the Church is dissolved, visible Membership must remain; for where the form is, the formatum, the thing having such a form must be also: for, Relata se mutuò ponunt & t●llunt.  
Ans. The conclusion is fancied, and nothing against me. 2. There be two things in baptised Members.  
1. God is their God, of Egypt and Assyria, fathers and sons under the New Testament, as the Prophecy is, Isa. 2. 1, 2. & 19 25. & 60. 1, 2, 3. Rev. 11. 15. 2. Infants are holy as the root, 1 Cor. 7. 13, 14. Rom. 11. 16. and it must be cruel divinity to say, That fathers and feed broken off an Independent Church through persecution, and no sin in them, are by the Lord cast out of visible covenanting with God, and from Membership and Church right to the Seals: nor is Baptism any ways removed.  
2. There is the solemnity of admission by Baptism in the excommunicate; this is hurt: but it's no more to me the formal cause of Membership, than the ceremony of Coronation, or the delivery of a Sword, is the specific form of a King, and of a Major: and therefore all is granted, and Mr. H. proves nothing.  
M. H. Baptism is but a separable accident to the covenant, its 
Surv●y part. 1. c 7. pag. 74.  efficacy may be hindered by the unworthy receiver, and yet it remains in its own nature to the excommunicate and dissolved member, for the form can never be removed from the thing form. If to be the eldest son be the formal cause of possession, it could never have been taken away. But to be a well-deserving heir, is that wh●ch gives formality of possession.  
Ans. 1. It is a wonder that M. H. cannot find valid arguments to bear a free conclusion. For to me Baptism is not a means of a Church-membership simply, but of a Church-member tali modo, that is, of a member conspicuously and solemnly differenced from a Pagan.  
2. It is bad Divinity to join the nocent excommunicate man with the innocent dissolved member.  
3. It is a naughty argument to prove that Baptism is a separable accident of the covenant: why? because its efficacy may be hindered by unbelief: for the efficacy of any thing is the actus secundus, the operation of it, not its essence; so he may prove that Christ the essential subject of the Gospel is a separable accident 
How Baptism is hurt in the excommunicate.  of the Gospel and covenant of Grace, because both the efficacy of the Gospel and of the Redeemer, by men's unworthiness and unbelief is hindered.  
4. He concludes not so much as his own fancied conclusion; to wit, this only, ergo the efficacy of baptism is not the specified form of visible membership; valeat totum: what Dreamer said any such thing? it is sure baptism in fieri, as it is administrate and professed, is the means of the excommunicate man's solemn installing and engaging to be a follower of Christ: and by the scandal that brings on excommunication baptism as professed and as binding is so far hurt as the Covenant-Baptismal is violated: and if the man be excommunicate for Apostasy, than it is disputable whether Baptism be not quite undone.  
5. It is weak moral Philosophy which Mr. H. addeth, that well deserving in an heir gives formality to possession. Well deserving gives just and Law-right to possession in the heir: But he is a weak Lawyer who would so plead; the innocent Traveller believing in God hath due deserving to his own purse, which yet is in the bloody Robbers pocket. Why Mr. H. saith he hath well deserving, which (saith he) is the formal cause of possession, and so he must have possession, for the formal cause cannot be separated from formatum. And so godly David unjustly expelled from his Kingdom for many years, yet deserving well, must have right both to possess his Kingdom, and not possess it, for if he have the formal cause of possession, he must have possession when he is expelled. 
Of the Church of Rome. 3. Arg. pag. 59 junius lib. de Eccles. c. 17. Calvin. Instit. l. 4. c. 2. sect. 1. Baptismum Deus primò illic conservavit faederis testimonium.— Sect. 12. Cum ergo Ecclesiae titulum non simpliciter volumus concedere Papistis, non ideo Eccles●a: apud eos esse inficiamur. Whitaker Controv. 2. q. 3. c. 2. Rivetus to. 3. tract. 2. q. 7. In corpore agro peste insecto adhuc aliqua obscura Ecclesiae vestigia observamus, Scriptural cet sulummodo occultata ibi rem insit, itemque Baptismus, quamvis variis additionibus corruptus, ita ut si aliquid Ecclesiae ibi residuum sit, id fiat ideo quod aliquid de notis nostris ibi supersit.   
Mr. H. It shall follow that the Church of Rome is a true Church, for all the members of that Church have true baptism, which is the formal cause of a true Church: but that is false, that that Church is a true Church.  
Ans. The conclusion of the connex proposition is nothing against me, who deny Baptism to be the formal cause of Membership.  
2. Such a Baptism that is valid, as touching the substance of the seal, as is in Rome, such a Church according to the Metaphysic entity and being of a Church, is Rome a Ministerial Church, teaching necessary fundamentals, though darkening and contradicting all; but it is not morally a true Church, but leprous and unclean. See what junius, Whitaker, Calvin and Rivetus say hereupon: Mr. H. is far from their sound expressions; if this be true, then to jezabel and seducing Teachers, who are under the Church-covenant, the formal cause of membership must appertain, and they must be Church-members, and must be tolerate, till they be judicially tried, and censures applied, so Mr. H. 
a Survey. par. 1. c. 2. pag. 29, 30.  and Church privileges bestowed on them at the command of Christ. So also Mr. H. 
b Par. 3. c. 3. pag. 11, 12.  So visible non-converts, and swine adorned with Pearls, contrary to Christ's command, Matth. 7. 6. and yet keeping the essential form of visible Saints, must be visible Converts. Which is a contradiction.  
Mr. H. The seal of our incorporation, which is latter and posterior to the incorporation cannot be the form of it; for the Sacrament is not appointed to make a thing that was not, but to confirm that was; or it doth not give, but confirm grace. But such is Baptism.  
Ans. The conclusion is not against me.  
2. Observe that Mr. H. sides with Arminians and Socinians, 
Mr. H. makes Sacraments mere and naked signs.  who deny the seals to be exhibitive signs, and make them mere signs: but seals used in faith, both confirm the former grace, and add increase of grace. Baptism seals that union with the visible Church, which was actu primo in Infants, being born federally holy, Rom. 11. 16. 1 Cor. 7. 14. and is a way and means of one more solemn installing in the visible Church; as the receiving of the Keys of a Castle, both confirms the covenant of the Princes giving of the Castle to the receiver, and doth more solemnly authorise the man as Captain of the Castle. The like may be said of the press-money received by the soldier, who before had given up his name to the Captain, and that by covenant.  
Mr. H. The Church was visible, when there was no seal, neither 
Arg. 5.  Circumcision nor Baptism; therefore these do not constitute it, nor any member thereof, Gen. 17 10, 11.  
Ans. 1. These five Arguments Mr. H. borrowed from the 
Answ. to 32. Quest. Q. 4. pag. 12, 13, 14. Baptism is a seal of grace and privileges which were before Baptism was.  brethren, but weakened them by an unjust conclusion, which I own not, nor any of our brethren. This argument also is apt to destroy all the seals; for there was a Church of visible regenerate persons, and of such as by faith saw Christ's day in Abraham's house, Gen. 12. and as yet neither was there Circumcision, nor Passeover, nor Baptism: will it hence follow, that Baptism is essentially no seal of regeneration, nor of any covenant or covenant-Grace, because covenant, covenant-grace, visible membership, and all these were before either circumcision or baptism? but sacred signs are seals of graces and privileges going before these signs, both in time and nature.  
Circumcision so shall essentially be no seal of the covenant, nor of the righteousness of faith, contrary to Gen. 17. 7. Rom. 3. 11. For there was a people visibly in covenant, and Abraham was righteous before that circumcision was instituted. But nothing follows, but only baptism doth not seal our union with Christ, and solemn entry into his Church-visible, until the Lord institute water and sprinkling therewith, and stamp them by his Divine Authority, to seal these graces and privileges.   

CHAP. XXII.  
Whether profession makes a member of the Church visible. So Mr. H. pag. 60.  
FOr the better understanding of the question, Church-right to membership, and to Ordinances and Seals must be considered.  
1. As it is in, and referred to the professor himself; and then 
A necessary discourse how profession gives right to membership, how not.  the question is upon what ground may the man himself challenge a room in the visible house, and the seals: now profession, as profession is not a ground, for then a man should be formally made a visible member, and be fed as one of the flock, and be externally called (which are finaliter, and in themselves saving mercies) because he professeth his desire to be fed, and to have the Gospel sent unto him.  
But 1. there is no such word nor promise: (do this, and profess so and so, and you shall be made a visible member.)  
2. To have right true and real to Membership and to Ordinances, is to be called of God in a Churchway, from sin to grace and glory. So 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, the Church-visible, 
Profession as profession gives no pro●… right to 〈◊〉 & mem●….  and the visibly called, are the same almost. Now no man hath right, true and real to membership and seals, and to be called of a God in a Churchway by the preached Gospel, because he professeth that he desires to be called; but the whole right and ground here is the Lords free grace, sending the Gospel to whom he will, Deut. 7. 7. Deut. 10. 14, 15. Psal. 147. 10, 29. Acts 16. 6, 9, 10. Acts 18. 6, 7, 8 9 Nor hath it a shadow of right in Scripture, that Macedonia and Corinth hath Church-right to the Gospel, and to be a Church, and to be the called of God, rather than other people, Bythinia especially, at this time, because so Corinth shall profess the Gospel, before ever they hear the Gospel; but here the Lord hath mercy upon whom he will.  
But 3. when the Gospel is come to a people, if the question be, what gives to this man, not to this man true real right to Membership, and Ordinances, and Seals, so as he may claim them before God and not sin: The meritorious right is Christ's death, the condition upon his part is faith; hence visible profession as such cannot give right: for than might Magus say, I have right to a room in the visible Church, and to baptism, because I am a visible Saint: for that is an untruth.  
1. If God forbid hypocrisy, and taking a room in the visible Church, and taking the covenant in the mouth, and receiving the seals, when the party hates to be reform, and eats and drinks unworthily, then cannot profession as profession give a man right true and real to room in the Church, and to the seals: but the former is true, Ps. 50. 16, 17, 18. Isa. 1. 12, 13. Matth, 22. 12. Matth. 13. 7.  
2. Profession is in order to the Rulers and Members of the 
Profession in order to the Rulers, gives a sort of right in professors to membership and ordinances without sin, which professors cannot receive without sin, except they believe.  Church, which have hand according to their place, either formal or tacit consent, to receive in members, here especially to be considered. And here our brethren mistake the question; for when the question is, what profession is required in such as the Rulers may without sin admit to membership and ordinances; we say a profession morally true, not real conversion judged to be real by men. Now this confession or profession do●h not make a Church-member, but declare a Church-member, and it only declares him to the conscience of the Rulers, that they sin not in admitting such: but declares him neither to have right before God nor to his own conscience. Yea, for all this profession Magus sinned in being baptised, Magus usurped, and hath no true and real right, no not Ecclesiastic, except in a most unproper sense; the Church hath right and command to receive him to membership and seals, but he sins in occupying room in the house, and receiving seals, having no true right to membership and seals: it is scarce excusable (but it is among that godly man's errors) that Mr. H. saith, graceless men, as Ishmael and Esau, have the best Right that can be to Ordinances, to wit, the command of God. But ah! Magus and such Comedians have no command to receive the seals, but conditional commands, If they believe; which they never do. I return to Mr. H.  
Mr. H. Profession most frequently is a public acknowledgement to the truth delivered in the Word, and our resolution to persist in the maintenance thereof, so it is used by distinction from practice; for an excommunicate person may so profess, yet it gives no formality to Membership. 2. Profession is larger, and includes a suitable-carriage void of scandalous courses. 3. As it must not be too narrow, so it must not be too b●●ad; though one hold some errors out of infirmity, as justification by passive obedience only— This hinders not, but he may profess the faith savingly.  
Ans. Here be three notations of the word, no Scripture for 
Three acceptions of the word Profession, scarce warranted by the Word, are brought by Mr. H.  any one of them. The fi●st is most frequent (saith he) and includes a resolution to maintain: But resolution, as such, is a secret heart purpose; and profession must be visible.  
2. Profession (saith he) is yet larger, and includes a suitable carriage of life. Say stricter, The species is not larger than the genus, or that which is as genus; man is not larger than animal a living creature.  
3. Profession with some errors, should have been more warily delivered, left it set up toleration, the ruin of the one true Religion.  
1. Profession, in Scripture, is rarely distinguished from Practice; when it is differenced from it, then it's condemned, 1 Tit. 1. 16. They profess they know God, but in works they deny 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Par. c. 2. p. 20.  him. Jam. 2. 14. What doth it profit, if a man say, he hath faith, & c? For 1 Tim. 6. 13. & 2. 10. Heb. 3. 1. & 4. 14. & 10 23. Matth. 16. 17. & 10. 32. it includes a holy practice. Now Mr. H. saith, The pinch of the question is, Whether such as walk in a way of profaneness, though otherwise professing and practising the things of the Gospel, have allowance from Christ, or may be counted fit matter, according to the terms of the Gospel. But sure this is a pinch of a question made of contradictions, Whether one walking in a way of profaneness, and yet not walking in a way of profaneness, but professing and practising the things 
The state of the question about visible members is perverted by Mr. H.  of the Gospel, have allowance to be the fit matter of a visible Church. A strange pinch!  
2. Mr. H. takes allowance from Christ by his command, to be all one with being accounted fit matter of the visible Church by the Rulers; for the account must be of men, and the allowance of them as fit matter must be of Christ. But the truth is, there is no pinch of a question, Who a●e they that are fit matter of themselves in se & in●●insece, who have due right to Ordinances, Seals? we say, only sincere real professors. But the question is, Who are fit matter, having right to Ordinances in the account of Rulers and the Church, whether they have true right or not?  
3. Allowance from Christ is ambiguous: for if it be referred to the Rulers, as Mr. H. seems to take them both for one; then the question must be, Whether Christ allow and command Rulers to admit such as walk in a way of profaneness, that is, visible hypocrites, to be fit matter, having right to the holy things of God? that was never a question to either side, Whether Christ command to cast pearls to known swine? or the allowance or command of Christ may be referred to the so walkers; then the question is as blasphemous, to wit, Whether doth Christ allow and command men to be gross hypocrites, and to take his Covenant in their mouth; though they hate to be reform.  
Mr. H. Profession conceived according to the compass of the ●●rm●n 
Page 61.  explication (add a causal power with Baptism too) doth make a member of the visible Church, and a member of all Congregations in all the earth; the expressions of Mr. R. load me thus to conceive his meaning.  
As. Then Mr. H. granteth, that his own conceptions, not my words (for he ought to have cited them) lead him.  
2. I own no such explication of Mr. H. as I have shown.  
Mr. H. Profession lawful of the whole truth hindereth Man 
Page 92.  bership; as suppose one believe mistakingly, all the Churches on earth are ill gathered, he dare not be baptised and made a Church-member: If therefore profession hindereth Membership, as this doth, then is cannot constitute Membership.  
Answ. I retort this Argument; forbearing of all known 
Mr. H. his argument is, an erroneous profession constitutes not membership, etc. a right profession doth not constitute membership.  sins, and practise of known duties cannot constitute Membership, as Mr. H. saith. For suppose one to be admitted a Church member, in a wicked mistake fall in an act of Adultery, and to cover that in a known act of Murder, then cannot practise more than profession constitute this visible Saint a member: for, that which opposes and hinders baptising, and so kinders the formality of membership, that doth not help forward membership. So Mr. H. But such a practice blemished with Adultery and Murder, hindereth both one to be baptised, and to be made a member, for this practice will cast a man out; Ergo, it shall hinder him to be admitted a member. So also Mr. H. ibid. Arg. 2. pag. 92. So here, an erroneous profession of a Seeker, denying either Baptism, lawful Ministry, or right Churches to be on earth, until the Apostles arise again, constitutes not membership, but hinders it. Ergo, a sound profession gives not formality of membership, it follows not though Mr. H. conclude nothing against me.  
Mr. H. That which giveth Membership to a party who had it 
Arg. 2.  not before, that can restore Membership when he hath lost it. But this cannot restore Membership. Now if Profession and Baptism were sufficient to do the deed, Baptism remaining the same as before his Excommunication, and now his profession being renewed, there is the whole formality of Membership, which is false.  
Ans. 1. The Argument supposeth that I make bare profession separated from a non-scandalous practice, the formal cause of Membership: but if one renew his practical profession by Repentance, he is fit to be readmitted a member.  
2. There may remain in one excommunicate person,  
1. Sound profession.  
2. Evidences of Saintship in D●vid excommunicate, except in the matter of Uriah.  
3. A real purpose to adhere to the Church-covenant; yea, and all the three remain, and holy and blameless walking beside in a dissolved member. Ergo, the Church-covenant gives not formality to Membership; but the conclusion is contrary to Mr. H. Therefore the Minor is denied in the sense that Mr. R. 
Survey, par. 1. c. 4. P. 45, 46.  holds of real profession, as is before declared.  
Mr H. That which gives actual existence to a Member, must 
Page 92, 93.  give interest to the whole actually existing, and therefore to some particular Congregation, for only Individuals exist; and since 
Existentia est tantum individuorum.  such an individual person is a Member, he must have reference to the whole that doth actually exist: and this the general nature doth in the particular Congregations only.  
Ans. What is concluded, is not the present question, but it belongs to what follows.  
2. Individuals only exist firstly, and kindly; but the common 
Mr. H. mistakingly all along maketh the Catholick (integral) visible Church to be genus.  nature of a man exists in Peter, in and with the Individual, and the nature of a Congregation exists in this or that Congregation: but the nature of the whole integral Church, of which Peter is a member, as we shall hear, does no more exist in a Congregation, than the whole organic body existeth in the left hand: or the whole body of the Element of Water exists in a drop of the River Euplorates: But the Catholic integral visible Church, existeth in this or that Catholic integral visible Church. Nor doth that which gives actual existence to be a Member, give the same way existence and interest to a totum, a whole integral body; the Thumb hath one way interest of existence to grow in the Hand, and another way interest of existence to grow in the body; and in all the parts of it, it is a member, or part of the hand, and also of the whole body, but the Thumb hath no possible interest of existence to grow in the head, in the leg. And so is john a near and fixed member of the congregation of Boston, and a common and remoter member of the whole integral Catholic Churches of Hartford, of Cambridge, of Norwich, and of all the congregations on earth: but it follows not, Ergo, john hath an interest of existence to be fed and to exist at one time in all the congregations on earth; as the common nature of man, of substantia, corpus, viv●ns, animal, homo, exists in all the individuals at once: It is wild Logic, to put no difference between a whole integral, and the parts; and whole essential, and the parts subjective; or species and individuals: so as one integral member may exist at the same place where all the members exist.  
Mr. H. That which equally belongs to all, that can make no 
Par. 1. p. 63●.  particular appropriation to any out rather than to another: if a woman love all Christian men with Christian affection, she is not therefore a wife to this or that man, but this profession is equal and indifferent, as well to one, and to all, as to another.  
Ans. All is granted; for we teach not that profession, as 
Profession, as such, doth not make one a member married to one congregation only.  profession, makes a man a fixed and a married member of this Independent Congregation, rather than this: so that it shall be spiritual Adultery to partake of Church ordinances elsewhere: we detest such a comparison destructive to Church-communion; for profession, as profession, declares the man to the Rulers to be a Church-member in all congregations on earth. It declares (I say as before) but does not as a formal cause make a Church-member, and it declares he hath right as a citizen of the visible Church, that Rulers without sin may admit him to Ordinances: but profession makes him not a member visible of only this 
It's not properly of divine institution, that a man be a fixed member of this, rather than of this congregation.  one congregation; yea, that one be a fixed member of this congregation, is, 1. An Affirmative command, not binding ad semper. Nor 2. does it tie, but as being a member of the Catholic Church, which is a confession of Christ before men. And 3. it is of providential conveniency for the more careful feeding, but not of divine institution or marriage tie.   

CHAP. XXIII.  
Whether Mr. Hooker doth concludently refute this which Mr. R. holdeth, That he who is a Member of one Congregation, is also a Member of all Congregations on earth.  
1. LEt it be remembered, in what sense I make profession and Baptism to have influence in Membership.  
2. That I make not Peter a member of this congregation 
A man is not one and the same way a member of the Catholic integral visible Church, and of a single congregation.  only, and of the whole integral Catholic Church, or of all congregations on earth, one and the same way, for though the right to Christ the Head, to Ordinances and Seals, be one, yet Peter is a fixed member of this congregation, a transient member to all other congreg●tions. 2. He is a proper member, and nearer of this congregation, and a more common and remote member to all; as the thumb is a nearer and proper part of the hand, and a more common and remote part of the whole organical body; and Richard a near member of Norwich, and a more remote and common member of the Kingdom of England.  
3. I am constrained to take in some Arguments transposed by Mr. H. that were in the former Chapter.  
Mr. H. To be a member of the Catholic Church firstly to a 
Par. 1. p 63.  whole, which a man neither did, nor can see nor do any homage to, nor receive any influence or direction from for Government, is a sublimated imagination.  
Ans. This makes the Doctrine of Oecumenick Counsels holden by Calvin, Melancthon, Luther, Whitaker, and all the learned Divines in the Christian world, to be a sublimated imagination, and Mr. Cotton his associate to be sick of the same imagination; and the decrees, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 of the Apostles and Elders, Acts 16. 4. by which the Churches were established, ver. 5. to have no influence of Government upon the Churches.  
2. It must be a sublimated imagination, That the whole Churches of Jews and Gentiles, who could not see the faces of all the Apostles, nor do any homage to them, nor receive any direction (except in their Writings, which yet may be) from them, should be governed by the Apostles; and it must be an imagination, That the Apostles were members of the Catholic integral Churches, and never fixed and married members of the single congregation: and could every one of the ten thousands of the congregational Church of jerusalem, as our Brethren will have it be, be governed by the whole Church, except they had seen the faces of all the thousands that governed them?  
Mr. H. If a man that is a Member of one Congregation, ●e 
Page 64.  also a Member of all Congregations on earth; then he can perform the duties of a Member to all: but that is impossible.  
Ans. The duties we owe to members of the integral Catholic 
We may be members of all congregations on earth, though we cannot discharge all sorts of duties to all these congregations  Church, are,  
1. Common and personal, as Church-praying, Church-praising, Church-fasting for the evils of sin or judgement, Isa. 62. 6. Psal. 122. 6. Eph. 6. 18. & 3. 14. Rom. 12. 18. 1 Cor. 12 26. they being members of the same body with us, Eph. 4. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. and their good or hard condition being known to us, (which say also they are one visible body with us) these duties are possible and necessary, if the meaning be, of occasional duties of love, not in word but in deed, as giving of alms to brethren, 
There be two sorts of duties common and personal, which we owe to members of other Churches.  I judge of all congregations beside our own: jam. 〈◊〉. If a brother or a sister be naked, etc. of what ever congregation on earth, where providence cast your lot to be, 1 joh. 3. 17. If, I say, he mean such duties of members to foreign Church-members, as Church-members, be impossible, I much differ from Mr. H. it is contrary to 2 Cor. 9 1, 2, 3. Gal. 6. 10. And the like I say of duties, of occasional comforting, rebuking, warning one another, even in order to Church-members, and Church-duties; They are this way impossible, that physically I cannot be in all places to discharge these duties. But to fetch an Argument as watery, I might say, A man in Musc●via cannot be to a Scottish-man a neighbour, whom he is to love as himself. A man in Morpeth cannot be a fellow-member both with another m●n in Morpeth, and with another English Subject who dwelleth four hundred miles from him whom he never saw, not can see. Why, its impossible he can discharge the duty of neighbour-love to the one that he never saw, nor possibly can see; or that of a fellow-subject of England, as toward the other: Yea, by this its impossible one can discharge the duties of personal watching over five thousand members of the congregation (as they say) of jerusalem; for while as he watches over one, he must neglect fourscore of hundreds, and above.  
2. What liberty and power a man hath in one particular congregation 
Mr. H. Arg. 2. par. 1 p. 64, 65.  as a member, he hath the same in all, because he is a member every where: Then he hath power in choosing the Officers, and in maintaining them; and these Officers must be sought in casting him out.  
Ans. What liberty and power a man hath jure, habitu, actu primo, by the right as a visible professor in one congregation as a member; that same moral right of Saintship (taken in a right sense) he carries about to all congregations on earth, whithersoever he comes, as is clear by Letters of Recommendation (which I said, and its never answered, only declare, but give no new right to Church privileges) which our Brethren give 
Way of the Churches of N. E. c 6. sect. 6. p. 103 ibid. sect. 7. M. Cotton keys c. 4. p. 17.  to members, by which they have right to the seals in other congregations. But it follows not, what liberty and power a man, as a fixed, nearer and proper member hath in his own congregation, that same liberty and power he hath actu secundo, and that he may actually exercise in all congregations; for to the actual exercise of it, is required the actual knowledge of him, and his right and qualification, that they with him, and he with 
How he that is a member of one congregation, hath Church-power 〈◊〉 habitu and 〈◊〉 prim●, in all congregations, and how not.  them, may act in a Churchway, in other congregations and foreign Churches: And also he cannot act with that power in all congregations, as in his own; not because he hath not the power in habit, and actu primo, but both he cannot orderly exercise it, and without scandal of usurpation, until he first evidence he hath such power; and also because he cannot physically be in many places at once: as a Citizen of London hath power and liberty to do the duties of a Subject of England, such as to save the life of a Subject, and to apprehend a public Robber that waftes the country, in all cities and places in England; but its impossible that he can be physically present in all places of England, where his help may be useful for the performing of these duties.  
2. Nor will it follow that he should give hire to any but to his own personal feeders, from whom he receiveth the benefit of feeding, Gal. 6. 6. 1 Cor. 9 1 Tim. 5. 17, 18.  
3. It is also an untoward consequence, Therefore be cannot be cast out of one congregation, unless the Officers of all others did cast him out: for that is physically impossible, God will have the Catholic integral Church to purge itself in its parts, and it's no more necessary nor convenient that the whole integral Church should, or possibly can pass an actual sentence for the casting out of every person, than all England can convene in Parliament for the passing sentence upon every English Subject guilty of Felony, Murder, Sodomy, Blasphemy, Drunkenness, Swearing, etc. and all guilty of these faults, are both Members of either Cities, Counties, or Shires, and also Subjects of the Kingdom of England: and the Argument is as strong in the one as in the other, even suppose Great-Britain were but one Kingdom. Nor  
4. Will it follow, that a guilty person can require the convening of the whole integral Catholic Church to judge his cause: for he can have no moral right, but such as all in case of scandal have, why he should more decline the Churches judging, 
Christ hath given no power to unjust appeals that are physically impossible.  than their feeding by the Word. Now since such a convening of all Officers to judge every scandal, is physically impossible, it is not to be thought that Christ hath given a moral liberty to all delinquents without exception, to appeal to all the Officers on earth; for the infinite wisdom of God gives not moral power to physical impossibilities, that are physically destructive to edification.  
Mr. H. If he that is the member of one Congregation be a member of all, I cannot see but of necessity it must follow, that 
Pa●. 1, pag. 65●  one particular Congregation must be another, Ephesus must be Smyrna, and Smyrna must be Thyatira: for where there be the same individual members, there be the same whole integral body; and the ground is undeniable from received Rules: Integrum est totum cui partes sunt essentiales. Therefore the same members carry the same essence to the whole. I assume, there be the same individual members of all the particular Congregations: For if one particular professor be a member of every particular Congregation, than all particular professors must be so; and so all of them members of one particular Congregation, and so of every one. Hence there being the same members of every particular Congregation, every particular Congregation is the same: and thence it will follow, that Ephesus is Smyrna, and Smyrna to be Thyatira. Hence when Smyrna is destroyed, yet Smyrna remains.  
Ans. It's a pity to black paper with such Windmills. Where there be the same individual members, there must be the same individual whole or totum integrale. All the individual members of a man's body, either similar parts, flesh, and blood, and bones; or the Organs, eyes, ears, feet, hand, and all the rest taken together, as united, are the whole organical body of man; and so all the Congregations on earth, taken together, are, and make up the whole integral Catholic visible Church, existing in all the Kingdoms and States of the earth. But what follows? therefore the hand is the foot, where there be the same proper and nearer fixed members, the thumb and the 
Mr. H. proves not that Ephesus is Smyrna, or Smyrna is Ephesus, because the same individual persons are common members to them both, & to all the Churches on earth, except he conclude that the little finger is the thumb by the same reason; for the thumb and the little finger are both nearer members of the hand, and common and remote members of the whole body.  little finger of the hand, and also the same common and remoter members (the same thumb & little finger) of the whole organical body, there is the same individual integral whole, so as the one member is affirmed of another, the thumb is the little finger, and the little finger is the thumb: for all the organs are members proper, the eyes, ears, nose, of the head, the fingers of the hand, the toes of the feet, and all the rest, arms, legs, belly, shoulders, and all these same members are common and remote members of the whole body: Just as Peter is a fixed and near member of this Congregation, and also a common and remoter member of the whole integral Catholic Church. And as all the Citizens of London are fixed and near members of London, and proper parts thereof, and yet common and remote members and Subjects of England. Hence by Mr. H. his own Argument, Where there be the same individual members, thereof necessity must be the same whole integral: So I assume (saith he.) But there be the same individual members of all the particular Congregations. I assume also, john, Richard, Thomas, Citizens of London, of York, are all in their very individual natures, individual Subjects of England. Ergo, London must be York, and York must be London; and john Citizen of London, must be Richard Citizen of Yo●k. And contrary. Again I assume, the same individual thumb, and individual little finger and toes, and individual eyes and ears, are all members of the hand, or congregation of fingers, of the feet and society of toes, etc. and they are also common members of the whole organical body. Therefore by Mr. H. his Logic, the thumb must be the little finger; and when the thumb is cut off, the thumb remains. Let Mr. H. or any for him, answer Mr. H. his Sophism.  
2. Mr. H. makes an Assumption, but could not infer any conclusion, nor frame a Syllogism. This connexion is never proved, There are the same members, common, remote, of every particular Congregation, or of all the Congregations on earth, therefore every Congregation is the same, and Ephesus must be Smyrna. Put Mr. H. or any man for him, to prove the connexion, and they must be silenced; These Congregations must be the same, and the one must be affirmed of the other, which have the same individual persons to be common members to both. Nothing more false: and so Mr. H. his received Rules vanish. For 
Congregations and all Churches differ not in their essence & last specific nature, as Mr. H. wou●d make us believe, but only in mere accidents.  say that all Citizens of York were Citizens of London, and Citizens of London were also Citizens of York, and they had the same common Laws, City-priviledges, the same Rules, it follows only they differ not in nature, but in number and accidents; but no Logic can infer, Erg●, York is London, and London is York; or that the one is affirmed of the other, as Ephesus is said to be Smyrna. So nothing follows, but only Ephesus and Smyrna are not Churches different in essence and nature, but only in number, which is that which we teach.  
Mr. H. Mr. R. yieldeth, that one Church hath not power over 
Rage 65, 66. 〈◊〉  another; but if one, who is a member of one Congregation, be a member of all, than the members of this. Province may send messengers to the Synod of another Province.  
Answ. Mr. H. would do well to prove his deductions; for common members as common members send not Commissioners, nay, nor one Church to another: but as God is the God of order, so such a Church in an association do send to a larger Church.  
Mr. H. It is folly to seek differences (saith Mr. R.) between Congregations, from a Church covenant, which is common to all Congregations. It is true (saith Mr. H) particular Congregations, and Church covenants differ not in essence and nature; but there is a real difference from this Church in another Church, in their specificating, and individual formality. The rule of old was, Genus cum forma constituit speciem.  
Answ. It is great folly to seek differences essential, when all Congregations agree in the last specific difference: This Congregation and that Church differ only in accidents, except Mr. H. show us essential and specificating differences between one Christ the head, one faith, one Baptism, one hope of Glory, one Lords Supper, one Bread in all Churches, Eph. 4. 1, 2, 3, 4. 1 Cor. 10. 17. 1 Cor. 12. 13. one power of binding on earth, one and the same body, Matth. 18. 15, 16, 17, 18. joh. 20. 21, 22. 1 Cor. 12. 12, 13. from the same Christ, the same Faith, the same Baptism, etc. in another Congregation: and when the Church of the Jews, and the Church of the Gentiles differ only as two Sisters, Cant. 8. 8. and in regard of age (which is a mere accident) as Mother and Daughter, Isa. 54. 1, 2. Isa. 49. 20, 21. Cant. 3. 4. It is folly for Mr. H. to trouble us with new Logic, such as the specificating formality in Peter, for that is no new degree of essence in Peter which was not in man, but the same contracted to the individual differences of time, place, figure, etc. Let Mr. H. show a specific difference between Christ and the seal in this and in that Congregation.  
2. That Genus cum forma constituit speciem, is neither old nor new rule, the true rules are Genus & differentia constituunt speciem & compositum Metaphysicum, and materia & forma constituunt compositum se● corpus Physicum.  
3. Whereas Mr. H. saith that this and this Congregation and this Church-covenant differ really ut res & res, and if they differ in accidents, these must be either common or proper; it's answered.  
1. Mr. Cotton and Mr. Hooker are not two new kinds and species 
Pag. 66. Because Congregations differ ut res & res, they do not differ in nature, for members of the same Congregation differ ut res & res, and the faith, profession and baptism of Peter differ from the faith, profession and baptism of john his fellow-member of the same Congregation ut res & res. Then there must be ten thousand species and kinds of members and faith in the one Church of jerusalem.  of Pastors, because officers of divers Congregations, and john and Peter members of the same Congregation differ ut res & res; and so in the Church of jerusalem there shall be five thousand species and kinds of members, five thousand kinds of Church-covenants, of Baptisms, of Lords Suppers, of new species of rights to the Seals in one single Congregation. For they differ really ut res & res, when as they differ only in number: and it were good that Mr. H. had expressed to us, what be these proper accidents by which Congregations differ among themselves. It is true the particular combination gives distinct being to the Classis; but it gives not a being distinct in nature and essence, but only in individual properties from the being of other Classis.  
Mr. H. How comes it this Church hath power over this person, 
Pag. 66, 67.  which another Church hath not, but from some special engagement?  
Ans. It is from no marriage engagement, but from providential conveniency; the wise Lord seeing it Physically impossible, that the whole Catholic Church so numerous can be fed in the same field, by the same men, therefore he divided them in sundry little flocks, over which the shepherds combined, have power not as married husbands but as mere servants.  
Mr. H. The peculiar and individual formalities of engagements difference all voluntary covenants; should a man say, I am a Master of servants, therefore thou art my servant: servant-covenant is common to all, there is only a difference in number and some accidents: a people might say to a Pastor of another Congregation, The covenant between Pastor and People is common to all, and makes no difference, but in number and accidents; therefore thou art our Pastor: that a man should be a general husband to all women, and a woman a general wife to all men, because marriage-covenant is common, seems folly; we are content to bear the charge of folly.  
Answ. 1. I am far from charging folly on these godly men, but weakness should appear in the Argument, If Mr. H had framed an Argument thus; if all Covenants of Master and servant, of husband and wife, agree in essence and nature, and differ in number and accidents only, then may a Master claim all men on earth to be his servants, and then may a husband claim all women on earth to be his married w●ves.  
This is most false, and not proved by Mr. H. for the just contradiction is true.  
If covenants between Master and Servant, between Husband 
The covenants of master and servant, and marriage covenants be of the same nature, and differ only in number, it follows not that a master may claim all men on earth to be his servants, or that a husband may claim all women on earth to be his wives; but the contrary.  and Wife differ in number; then must a Master make a covenant in number different with servants; one with this servant, and another covenant different in number from that, with another; or then he can claim neither the one nor the other for his servant, because covenants between master and servant, are all of the same common nature: nor because Abraham married Sarah, and all marriage-covenants are of the same essence and nature, can Abraham claim Hagar and another third woman, and a fourth for his wives, and except he have a marriage covenant with Hagar different in number from the marriage-covenant with Sarah, and a third marriage-covenant with the third different in number, he cannot claim any of them for his wives: for Hagar may say, though all marriage-covenants be of the same essence and nature; yet because Abraham never made a marriage-covenant with me by name, which is essentially required in all covenants of that kind, he is not my husband, nor am I his wife. So a people cannot say to a Pastor of another Congregation, thou art our fixed, proper Pastor, obliged to reside with us, and to employ thy labours ordinarily upon us only, except they had particularly chosen him by name; but this will not hinder, but all elections and covenants with Pastors, as fixed and ordinary labourers with them, are of the same essence and nature, and differ only in number and accidents; nor can this hinder but a Pastor of another Congregation is a Pastor habitu and actu primò, to all Congregations on earth, and no married husband to that Congregation: though it be physically impossible, and contrary to reason, to say he can be a fixed, proper chosen Pastor to all the Congregations of the earth; for fixedness and election of the people is not of the essence of a Pastor.   

CHAP. XXIV.  
The Arguments of Mr. R. against the Church-Covenant are vindicated.  
MR. H. Relation as such is not a foundation of a Covenant, when Twins are born, or Brethren and Sisters near to other in time. The duties issuing there from have their rise and power from the Impression of the Rule of nature, such relations may be multiplied without a covenant.  
Answ. This destroys your Church-covenant, for many in sister-Churches, men and women, are born over again, and made visible members of the body of Christ, and made fellow Citizens to them that are far off, and near to the whole household of God, Jews and Gentiles, Eph. 2. 19, 20, 21. Eph. 4. 1, 2, 3, 4. 1 Cor. 10. 17. 1 Cor. 12. 12, 13. Heb. 12. 22, 23. And the duties 
The necessity of a Church-covenant is Scriptureless and dark.  issuing hence rise from no covenant soddering the members together in one single flock: for they belong to many flocks, but only from the rule of renewed nature. Therefore Mr. H. is obliged to prove, if there be a necessity of a voluntary covenant, that visible Saints of two Congregations now agreeing to be fellow-members of a third Congregation, are now more brethren by Mat. ●8. then before, and have more one Faith, one Baptism, one visible head Christ, one Hope, do more eat one Bread, 1 Cor. 10. than before; are more, yea, now, and never till now, by a positive institution and command obliged to Church covenanting, to Church watching one over another, whereas by this way they were never visible members, nor visible fellow-Citizens before.  
And 2. so Paul hath been less accurate than our brethren in the visible oneness of brethren.  
3. There must be no visible brotherhood, nor Church oneness, but by ordinary meeting within the walls of the same house.  
And 4. this covenanting either implicit or explicit must be of as great necessity as a visible Church on earth.  
Mr. H. The covenant once made by mutual agreement of parents, 
Par. 1. p. 68, 69  may be communicated to the seed, without their consent, Deut. 29. 10. A Minister is a Minister to children born of parents, who have elected him to be their Minister, and they are within the covenant, by virtue of that covenant which their parents made.  
Answ. 1. Nothing then makes children within the covenant 
Children are not under the tie of the Church-covenant.  of grace visibly, but your Congregational covenant. But sure Israel's seed by Deut. 29. 10, 11, 12, etc. and Gen. 17. 7. Act. 2. 39 were born in visible covenant with God, and they knew not any such Congregational watching over one another.  
2. The seed of dissolved members, visible Saints, are then without any sin in parents and children (to speak comparatively) born Pagans, but the Scripture teacheth us of no losing of covenant-right, but by sin, either of the parties themselves, or of their parents.  
3. How are then children of covenanting parents born Church members; yet, when come to age, if they cannot evidence their regeneration holden all their life, for no Church-members are debarred from the Lords Supper, living and dying Pagans? are Ministers, because of their covenant, Ministers to Pagans?  
4. The Scripture teacheth that parents oblige the children to the Gospel-covenant, Deut. 29. Gen. 17. but no Scripture teacheth that parents lay bands of oath and vow of God to be visible members of only (for example) the Congregation of Boston, of only Hartford; for look what covenant obligation lies upon the parents which is to that Congregation by name only, the like must lie upon the children.  
Mr. H. Among such who by no impression of nature, no providence, 
Pag. 69.  or appointment of God, or reason, have power each one over another, there is a necessity of a free engagement by consent, as between Prince and people, husband and wife, master and servant, and the covenant being once made, there needs no new covenant to the exercise of the duties belonging to that relation.  
Ans. The vow in Baptism, and the Gospel-covenant professed 
The covenant of grace being so necessary, the Church-covenant is needless.  by me, without any new engagement, obligeth me in all Churches I am in, to be my brother's keeper, and watch for his soul, otherwise I may make this count, Lord, I was not obliged to any Church-watching over my brother, but my Congregational brother by Mat. 18.  
But 1. was he not thy brother before thou wast inchurched into one Congregation with him? (shall the Lord say.)  
2. Wast thou not to eat the same bread with him before as then? by 1 Cor. 10. 17.  
Secondly, there is no need of engagement to watch Congregationally over all with whom thou eatest the Lord's Supper, except thou being so journer enter in oath to every Congregation, and break it in the morrow.  
Thirdly, The covenant of Prince and people, husband and wife hath nothing to do with this, except the nearer visible oneness, brotherhood, etc. of which I spoke, be cleared from Scripture; and M. H. prove that Peter is tied by oath to that only Pastor and Flock, as subjects to one only sovereign.  
Mr. H. The covenant of grace may be taken in the narrowest acception (believe and live) so it is inward and invisible between the soul and God. But if you take it in the breadth, as it includes whatever is warranted by the Gospel, so it is visible and includeth the Church-covenant, and its ordinance of the Gospel, but not properly the covenant of the Gospel if the Churches be dissolved through persecution, they are not obliged to the duties of confederacy.  
Ans. (Believe and live) is not the narrowest, nor the invisible covenant, but the sum of all duties given to all the visible Church, joh. 3. 16, 18. joh. 5. 24, 40. joh. 11. 26, 27. Rom. 10. 9  
2. If this be a Gospel ordinance, give us Scripture for it.  
3. Dissolved members are never loosed from Church-warning, comforting, rebuking, otherwise they were not to gain their brethren.  
4. Christ by no hint or shadow, lays the duty of gaining a brother upon our membership with single Congregations, a thing of order and providential necessity; but upon brotherhood, Mat. 11. If thy brother trespass against thee, etc. Now he is as near my brother who is of another Congregation, or a dissolved member, as he who is my Congregational Brother.  
5. The enclosed gainable trespassing brethren within the 
Brother is larger than a Congregational brother.  pinfold of a single Congregation, seem to make only the Congregation the visible Kingdom of Christ; the Scripture teaching, Nations, the Kindred's and Kingdom's of the world to be his, Rev 11. 15. Rev. 2. 1, 2, 3. Ps. 22. 27, 28. Ps. 72. 3, 4, 5, 6. Ps. 2 8, 9 Isa. 60. 1, 2, 3, etc. It is true, Christ exerciseth his Ministerial power as King in Congregations, yea, and in Synods also, saith Mr. Cotton. 2. The oneness of his visible body is larger than a Congregation, 1 Cor. 10. 17. 1 Cor 12. 12, 13, etc.  
Mr. H. That a Minister swear an oath of fidelity (saith Mr. R.) 
Par. 1. 72, 73●  to the flock; a Father, a Master to discharge duties to Children and Servants is lawful, but to tie the essence of a Minister, Father, Master to this oath, so that he is no Minister before he thus swear, is to lay b●nds where Christ hath laid none, and will-worship.  
Ans. The instance of a Father, because it results upon a rule of nature, without any free consent required, is not to the purpose; the other two cuts the throat of Mr. R●. cause; can any charge another to be his servant without mutual engagement? that which makes a man a Pastor to this people, is the free choice of the people; we do not make the swearing to do our duty, to be our covenant; a witness ties himself by oath to tell the truth in a Court, here is no covenant between man and man at all. Those are to be distinguished.  

1. An agreement of persons to combine and associate.  
2. The doing of these duties.  
3. The swearing they will do them; the first is the form of the Corproation; the other two may be done after they be combined.   
Ans. 1. The instance brought by me is as well of a moral father, 
The people's choosing makes not a Minister.  as a natural father, and his either agreeing by promise or oath to the people, makes him not a Pastor, (a Pastor to them is another thing) nor doth the election of the people make a Pastor, the ordination of the Elders by prayer makes him a Pastor, Act. 6. 6. 1 Tim. 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2. 2.  
2. The being a Pastor to the people doth not make a Pastor, for it is but actus secundus, the exercise of his calling, not the essence of the Minister.  
3. The man doth tender the Lords Supper, which is a specific and proper act of a Pastor, and that warrantably, to these who are of another Congregation, and never choosed him for their Pastor.  
2. The other two hurt not the truth (I desire not to plead mine own cause) a man is made a servant to a master by mutual 
The people's choice of A. B. makes him not a Pastor, but determines the exercise of his labours (which is latter than the essence of a Pastor) to them only fixedly.  agreement, true: Ergo a Minister is made an Ambassador, Pastor, and Servant of Christ by the election of the people; it follows not: for were he a servant in relation to the people only, this were something; but the people's choosing of him hath not any influence at all in the essence of a Pastor.  
3. My Argument proves, that swearing, as it includes a free agreement to the duties of a Father (Moral) or Officer, or Master, or Pastor, doth not make the man a Father, a Master, a Pastor, especially when the man is Father, servant of Christ, and Pastor habitu, and actu primo, to all the Churches on earth, before he agree to be Father and Pastor to this Congregation, as I thus illustrate, a free City appoint four men fearing God to be Rulers, or Bailiffs to them, the City divides itself into four quarters: the first quarter agreeth with such a man to rule them: The next quarter agreeth with the second to rule, and so do the rest. Now no man can say this first quarter made the man a Magistrate, for the whole City made all the four of private men to be public Magistrates, and quarters by agreement did only appropriate their labours to them. So Titio covenants with a Mason, with a Gardener to build him a House, and plant him a Vineyard; yet this agreement makes neither the one a Mason, nor the other a Gardener, for they were such before: nor doth the sick man's choosing of such a Physician to cure him, make the man a Physician. Any man knows that the people call and choose Epaphroditus, not that they may make him a gracious and an able Minister, but because they discerned him to be such, therefore they choosed him.  
4. A Witness who swears to tell the truth, engageth covenant-wise to tell the truth, though the engagement be put upon him by the command of the Judge.  
Mr. H. Neither the incestuous Corinthian, 2 Cor. 2. 73, 74. (saith Mr. R.) nor these 3000. Act. 2. nor Samaria, nor any planted Churches of Ephesus, Acts 19 of Corinth, Acts 18. Berea, Philippi, Thessalonica, Rome, give any hint of a Church-covenant. Ans. The Church's forgiving and confirming of their love to the incestuous Corinthian, was a receiving of him of new to covenant; had his profession at large made him a member, he had been a member whether the Church received him or not; or had baptism made him a member, that remaining, he should have been a member; a disfranchised man is so received by Covenant anew to City-priviledges.  
Ans. 1. Nothing is answered to these celebrious Samplar-Churches planted without this new covenant.  
2. One excommunicate for a particular scandal, as the incestuous 
No Church-covenant in the first planted Churches.  Corinthian was, retaining some profession, retaineth some membership, and is only deprived of Church-honour, and of some Ordinances.  
3. But of Baptism before.  
4. The forgiving of that man, may say somewhat to the restoring of him to the privileges of the Covenant of Grace, but nothing of a Church-covenant.  
5. The civil Corporations way of readmitting disfranchised members, is no binding Rule to the Church of God.  
Mr. H. There is no word of Church-covenant in these places, Acts 2. it follows not, Ergo, it is not in the word.  
Ans. The consequence is not valid from particular Negatives: but if there be no Covenant in any place, where mention 
There is no ground in Scripture for a Church-covenant.  is made of planting of Churches, it holds well. Heb. 7. 14. Moses (who in his writings speaks of all sorts of Priests) spoke nothing concerning Priesthood in the Tribe of judah: Ergo, there is no Priest of that Tribe. And there is no hint in Scripture, where the sacrifice of Christ is spoken of, that there is any ungodly sacrifice: Ergo, (say our Divines) the sacrifice of the Mass is a device of men. So no such Covenant is in Scripture in framing of Churches.  
Mr. H. The solemnity of fasting and praying is only required 
Par. p. 75.  at the first founding of a Church, Acts 2. where there is only an addition of members, the stroke on the Spirit by the Ministry of the Apostles was so extraordinary, that they needed no miraculous discerning.  
Ans. 1. Mr. H. may make the Reader believe, that I am against fasting and praying, at either planting of, or addition to 
The actings required by M. H. in gathering of churches, are not to be found in the Apostolic Church.  Churches, and therefore divides my Argument: for I argue from the want, not of fasting and praying only, but  
2. No Church-covenant was here; nor  
3. Any frequent meeting of the members to be acquainted with the spiritual state one of another; nor was it possible these things could be in seven hours' space. All which they require in founding Churches, and so there was no day of fasting kept by the Church baptised.  
2. There is an addition, that the Christian Church was also solemnly founded.  
Mr. H. The●r steadfast continuing was after they were added: Ergo, (saith Mr. R.) that could not make them members. Ans. Nor lies the Argument there from the effect to the cause; they continued; Ergo, they took themselves engaged to continue.  
Ans. There is no doubt they took themselves engaged by 
Their persevering, or resolution to persevere covenant-wise, as is said, could neither of them be visible before they were admitted members.  Baptism.  
2. Did Ananias and Sapphira either continue steadfastly, or take themselves engaged by Church-covenant? for we now speak of visible actings that agree to Church members, as such; therefore they took themselves to be engaged members, and members to that only Church by a solemn Marriage-covenant, is a dream unwritten.  
Mr. H. Where there is a solemn baptising into a Church, the person is made a Disciple of Christ, Matth. 28. 19 So to be a Disciple, is to be ingraffed into the body of Christ, and to be made a fellow-heir of the same body, Eph. 3. 6. that is, of the visible Church, Joh. 12. 40. though many believed in him, yet they would not confess him, or be his disciples.  
Ans. 1. If confessing, and being a disciple, be one; and if solemn baptising make a disciple, as from Matth. 28. and joh. 12. Mr. H. saith: Then 1. Must Infants be actual disciples: 2. Actual confessors: 3. In danger to be excommunicate; for the Jews made such an act, joh. 9 
To be ingraffed in the body, is not to be ingraffed into a single congregation.   
2. Engraffing in the body is to be made a fellow-heir, and of the same body of jews and Gentiles, who were partakers of the promise of Christ by the Gospel, and fellow-citizens with the Saints, and of the household of God, built upon the foundation, Eph. 3. 8. & 2. 19 and comprehendeth both the truly believing visible body, and invisible: And when, and who made Magus and judas partakers of the promise of Christ by the Gospel, and fellow-heirs of the same body?  
3. Did ever man dream that this body is a single Congregation, and not that its the great Catholic Body of jews and Gentiles, Eph 3. 5, 6. & 2 15, 16, 19?  
Mr. H. The people are said to magnify the Apostles, that is, 
Page 76, 77.  to approve their doctrine, and the goodness thereof, yet there was more required to this Church-work, and to become a disciple; and therefore it's added, And the believers were added, i. e. they confessed th●ir sins, and became disciples and followers of that Doctrine, and so covenanted for their children: Else we cannot reason against the Anabaptists, If the converted father was baptised, therefore the children. The place thus expounded is not taken out of our hand.  
Ans. The scope of the place is not to show the qualification 
The Texts, Acts 2. and 5. concerning adding to the Lord & to the Church, are vindicated from the gloss of M. H. and have no shadow of a Church covenant.  of visible members, but that though Satan had made a ●oul breach in the Church, by the lying hypocrisy of Ananias and Sapphira, yet the Lord was mighty in the Apostles, by the miraculous and righteous smiting of the hypocrites, and other mighty wonders, to the admiration of all, and the terror of many, Acts 5. 1, 2.— 11, 12, 13. and that breach by their death was made up, ver. 14. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Believers were the more added, not to the visible Church only, but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to the Lord, which was a real addition of real believers, as the same phrase is, cap. 2. ver 47. not unlike.  
2. The magnifying of Apostles, is spoken of believers who not only approved their doctrine, but confessed the power of God to be in the Apostles miracles, and some fear of God, 
Calv. Gualth. Erant medii homines. Occumenius, Virtus verè Evangelica idonea erat quae plurimum colla●daretur. Chrysost Nec convertentes se ad risum● non ad ●inas— sed valde humani erant, & p●ae aliis soliciti.  as Calvin saith: Oecumenius, They praised that Gospel pow●r; Chrysostom, They do not mock, nor threaten, yet they seem, as our Interpreters, to be medii homines, not wicked despisers.  
3. He expounds they were added, i. e. they confessed their sins, and became disciples and followers of that doctrine. But sure, confessing of sins, and professing of the doctrine, if he mean such a following ●s was in Magus, it's a hungry Exposition of being added to the Lord, since it is in many hypocrites that are never added to the Lord. 2. If he mean, that they were practical followers of the Apostles doctrine, (as he must, if he say any thing more than what he said before) sure, that must be an habitual constant walking with God all their life, and cannot be before they were added, Acts 2. for they were believers, and added the same day, cap. 2 and cap. 5. Nor says he any thing for adding of visible members, cap. 5. but all their life they were added to the Lord. And is that the meaning of Luke, either cap. 2. or cap. 5? Sure, Luke sets down the history of men added to the Lord at the sight of these miracles.  
4. It's a wonder men are so bold with the Scripture! They were added, i. e. They became disciples,— and so engaged themselves, and covenanted also for their children But did their being added to the Church, and to the Lord, which certainly, in the sincere part, was real and sound believing, include the swearing of this Church-covenant to be watching members married to the only single Congregation of jerusalem, and to no other visible Church on earth? If to dictate be to prove, than we have more than enough of this.  
5. If Mr. H. judge that Calvin, Pet. Martyr, Beza, Ursin, Pareus, and our Worthies, cannot reason for Infant baptism 
M. H. strengthens Anabaptists by his so reasoning from the place Acts 5.  against Anabaptists, except thus; The fathers are married members by Church-covenant to one single Congregation; Ergo, Infants must be baptised: Or thus; The really converted father must be baptised; Ergo, the children; We have a weak part of it, for this strengtheners Anabaptists not a little; for the common Arguments both of our Brethren and the Anabaptists, are, They must be real converts that are Church-members, as I have proved. And sure our Brethren judge it absurd, that the Seal of Baptism should be put into a blank, or 
Ans. to 32 qu. 4. p. 12.  to a falsehood. Now since Baptism is the seal of our Regeneration, either must our Brethren put a blank and a falsehood (which the Church, who knows not the heart, without sin put upon judas) or then with monstrous charity they must believe all baptised Infants are regenerate. But the truth is, the inward state of none can be said either a falsehood or reality to the Church, following the Rule of the Word in dispensing of Ordinances; for in the like, neither regeneration nor non regeneration can be the object of the Churches discerning. Also this is to be observed, that Christ hath made the sounder part of the visible Church, the Church in the actual exercise of Ordinances. For,  
1. Christ never gave a power to err or to sin to his Church visible, or to any part thereof; as Nature gave not a power to the locomotive faculty to halt, but to move: therefore he cannot have given a power to a Synod as many, but as proceeding right; and to Members as choosing discerningly, not as erroneously.  
2. Those must be the Church, to whom the Promise is made, they fulfilling the condition, to wit, he must promise his presence to those that are convined in his Name. But if the larger part be the Church visible, because larger and more numerous to whom the Promise is made; then when the major part errs, and meets not in his Name, Christ should be obliged to fulfil the promise to them that fulfil not the condition, and ought not to fulfil the promise to those who meet in his Name, and fulful the condition of the promise; which is abominable: for very often the larger part errs, and meets not in Christ's Name, and the lesser part meets in his Name, and shall those who fulfil the condition be defrauded of the blessing promised, because they are fewer?  
Obj. But so no questions shall be determined in Church meetings, for two may say they only meet in Christ's Name.  
Ans. These are but words: for if they not only say so, but it be a real truth, and if all the rest err in that act, these two are only the visible Church, though men judge them turbulent Schismatics.  
Hence, by the way, a word of that necessary and judicious question moved by Calvin, Matth. 18. 18. What ye bind on 
Of the binding & losing on earth & in heaven, Mar. 18.  earth, etc. Since the Church tolerateth many hypocrites, and absolveth and looseth many who do but counterfeit and fancy Repentance, shall we say that such are loosed and pardoned in heaven? Some say, by heaven here is meant the visible Church; and they distinguish between Sin and Scandal: and therefore that by binding and losing, here is meant, not forgiveness, or justification, or absolution from the guilt of sin in heaven, or in the Court of God, or condemnation for that sin, but only deliverance from scandal, and the removing of scandal, and admitting of the man into the visible Church as a Member: suppose his repentance be but hypocritical, yet when the Church proceedeth impartially, according to the Rule of Christ, the sentence is ratified by God, and the man is loosed from the scandal, though not from the sin; the sin is yet bound before God, because he hath not really repent; otherwise the Church, who knows not heart-actings, and who really repent, who not, though proceeding right according to the Rule of Christ, should not have the promise of ratifying in heaven what they do on earth, fulfilled to them; which cannot be said.  
But taking it for a good observation that Calvin hath here, that Matth. 16. Christ speaketh of binding and losing concional, by the Word preached; but here, Matth. 18. he speaketh especially of binding and losing juridical in the Court of the Church, by Excommunication or Absolution from that Sentence. In the former consideration the question is easy.  
No Pastor in preaching Gospel-promises or threatenings, can bind, but conditionally: If the party do not believe and repent, the man's sin is bound in heaven; if he do believe and repent, his sin is loosed in heaven.  
As to the other, we find in the Word no such signification of binding and losing, in regard of scandal, but they are ever 
Calv. Resp. Non ad alios dirigi sermonem, quam qui rectè ac sincerè Ecclesiae se reconciliant. Mat. 18. is nota rule for comforting hypocrites, as if their sins were loosed in heaven.  spoken of in regard of sin and the guilt thereof. And therefore.  
1. Calvin saith well, That the speech of Christ is directed to no other than to those who duly and sincerely do reconcile themselves with the Church; and the Lord being willing to comfort trembling consciences, is not setting down a Rule for comfo●…g of hypocrites: But by the contrary, because hypocrites Soldly provoke to the Tribunal of God, when for gross scandals they are justly cast out; our Saviour saith, The sentence of Excommunication is ratified in heaven. The Scripture-rule is for such as obey, and for those who fulfil the condition, non de obliquis.  
As to the doubt, That the Church often absolves such who really repent not, how then can the hypocrite be loosed in heaven, when the Lord knows he does but fancy Repentance?  
Ans. Two things hère are to be distinguished.  
1. The Churches proceeding in the external Court, as relating to them, if they impartially, according to the Rule of Christ, proceed, and be not sudden in readmitting, but see the incestuous man near swallowed up (though one man's measure of visible repentance be not the Rule to all) before they confirm their love to him, and forgive him, 2 Cor. 2. Suppose his repentance be but counterfeit, or not saving and real, as was that of Ahab, yet are they to receive him, and admit him to the Ordinances, and the Lord ratifies what they do in heaven. As  
1. The Lord ratifies Philip's baptising of Magus; and the 
The Lord ratifies in heaven what the Church doth on earth, though the hypocrite be not pardoned.  Lord approves the Servants inviting to the marriage-supper the man that wanted the wedding-garment: for what the Lord commands, that he must approve and ratify in heaven.  
2. What in charitable judgements is praiseworthy, that God also must ratify in heaven; yea, it is praiseworthy in the Disciples, when they heard Christ say, One of you twelve hath a Devil, one of you shall betray the Son of Man; every one suspected and feared himself; none of the eleven suspected judas, but gave him charity.  
3. Without this God should not approve the gathering of Churches, nor the casting of the draw-net in the Sea, nor the sowing of seed upon all sort of grounds, the way side, the thorny, the rocky, the good ground, that the chosen, who are yet in the state of nature, may be brought in, and effectually called. But in receiving in Excommunicates, the Church would not be sudden. In the ancient Church, Sacrificers to Idols 
Can. Poenir. Concil. Ancy●an.  were six years before they were received; they that defiled themselves with Beasts, were debarred from the Sacrament thirty years; Adulterers, seven; women who made away their 
Can. Nic. Concil. See Chemnit. exam. de Indul.  Births, ten years; such as uncompelled denied the faith, twelve years. What other years Burchardus and Gratianus have, may be seen. Something for edification sure there was here.  
2. There is another thing here, which concerneth the conscience of him who is to be received, and when the Church-Court 
Pag 727, 728.  applies the sentence to the conscience for his personal pardon, sure whatever satisfaction the people have for removing of the scandal, the sentence of Absolution so relating to him, is concional, not properly juridical; and conditional, not absolute; and therefore is to be pronounced by the mouth of 
P●…r in Mat. 18. d●cu. 11. v. 18, 19 Cum 〈◊〉 ex●… on●● l●gi●●mè peractae rata sit apud Deum, e●veant ex●ommunicati ne illam contemnant— recepti firmam fiduciam gratiae concipiant. Calvin. Ergo quisquis admisso delicto suppliciter culpam agnoscit— ab Ecclesia veniam impetret, is absolvitur non tantum ab hominibus, s●d ab ipso Deo— si ludibrio habet— neque illi cum hominibus jam erit negotium, sed Deus erit vindex. Pareus. Sit tibi] judicium gitur Ecclesiae adversus contumac●s divinam habebit authoritatem. Quaecunque ligaveritis] Hilarius. ad terrorem metus maximi. Quaecunque ligaveritis] Hieronymus. quia poterit Contemptoris fratris haec esse responsio, vel tacita cogitatio, si me despicis, & ego ●ed spicio, potestatem tribuit Apostolis, ut sciant qui ab ipsis condemnantur, hominum sententiam divinâ sententiâ roborari. Ita Cyprian. de Un t. Eccles. c. 3. Ita Chrysostomus. Ita Augustinus in loc. What ye shall bind (Diodati) proceeding in knowledge, uprightness, and wisdom. English Divines, An. in loc. 18. Whatsoever ye shall bind (joh. 20 23. 1 Cor. 5. 4.) by convincing men of sin against God, or of wrong done to you. The sentence of Absolution to the penitent is concional, and so conditional, to the Church right proceeding is absolute and juridical. There is not the like measure of visible Saintship required of one at his first admission and at his readmission after excommunication.  the Church, the Pastor, thus: Be it unto thee according to thy Faith and Repentance; and except the man really repent, his sin is not loosed in heaven. So then, the Churches losing from the scandal is conditional, upon a seen condition of outward repentance morally sincere to the Church's apprehension, but they simply and absolutely make him a Citizen of the Church, and admit him to Ordinances, according to the command of Christ, both in private and public Church offences, (If thy brother who offended, repent, forgive him) but his losing from the sin or guilt in heaven, is ever conditional, and never absolutely to be pronounced by the Pastor, the mouth of the Church, who cannot certainly know the condition.  
Hence 1. the scandal is loosed in earth and heaven; the Church impartially following the rule of Christ sometime when the sin remains and is bound in heaven.  
2. The Church may say the man is absolutely freed from the scandal, so as the Church sins not in receiving him in, if they follow the rule; but he sins, and the scandal is bound in coming in, if he repent not: and also as to the guilt, he is freed from the sin only conditionally, for the condition of removal of the scandal is seen, and visible: but the condition of the losing from sin is invisible.  
3. Sometime the man is both loosed from the scandal, and from the sin, and every way loosed in heaven and earth, when he both really and visibly reputes.  
4. The Church should go as near in readmitting a fallen sinner, and losing him on earth, as they can discern the Lords losing in heaven: the Corinthians seem to exceed in this. 2 Cor. 2. 7. So that chose, ye ought rather to forgive him.  
5. There is more of real Saintship required, to receive in again one who hath been once a member and hath fallen, and was cast out, then to admit a member newly come from Paganism.  
1. The larger the means of salvation have been, the greater guiltiness, as the scandal of a Christian is greater than the sin and scandal of a Sodomite, Mat. 10. 15. Mat. 11. 22. Mat. 12 41, 42. And therefore the repentance of the one must be more signal and larger than the repentance of the other.  
2. There is not such a measure of marriage-love required of a Virgin before she be married, as after she hath been married, and born children to the husband; nor can any say there is so much knowledge required in a new Intrant that knows not the first elements of Philosophy, as in one who hath studied seven years.  
Hence 6. it is utterly false, that as visible Saintship and real Repentance, as far as can be, is required of one excommunicate, before he can be received in again; so real visible Saintship, as far as can be seen, must be required in members before they be first admitted. But I desire our Brethren, if they judge the first receiving into the Church a losing from sin and scandal, as readmission is, they will teach it me.  
Mr. H. If Baptism be the Seal (saith Mr. R.) of our entry in 
Par. 1. p. 77. Mr. R. 3. Arg.  the Church, then is not this covenant the formal cause of Church-membership.  
Ans. If Baptism seal our membership, than it is after membership, and so not the formal cause of it.  
Ans. There is in my argument no word that baptism is the formal cause of our membership. Baptism is a seal of our solemn installing in the Church; it's a seal quoadnos, as state and feising in houses or lands is.  
Mr. H. Though children do not covenant personally, yet they are included virtually in their parents, Deut. 29.  
Ans. If Mr. H. mean Children not born, as the place Deut. 29. doth evince, what is that to the purpose? we have no question with any, whether unborn children have right to membership, or to baptism, non entis nulla sunt accidentia; if he mean 
Mr. H. makes Infants to be no actual covenanters.  born infants are but virtual, or potential covenanters, as the seed is a tree in potentia, and no tree actu, so must Infants be no actual covenanters, but in potentia only. Anabaptists shall thank Mr. H. for this, for than they are not actually holy, Rom. 11. 16. nor actually to be baptised, nor is God actually the God of Infants; but some act is required of them, to lay hold on the covenant.  
2. The Kingdom of Heaven than is not due to them, nay not a half salvation but in potentia. But our Saviour pronounced them actually blessed, and said, of such is the kingdom of God, Mat. 18. 14 Mat. 19 14. Mark 10. 14, 15. Yea, as Christ cannot bless unborn Infants, not can he say, of such is the kingdom of God, if they be covenanters only in potentia, and be such only.  
Mr. H. This covenant is either the covenant of grace, or different 
M. R. Arg. 4. Par. 1. p. 78, 79  from it.  
Ans. The new covenant is either considered according to the benefit of saving grace given in it, and so this is not the covenant. Or 2. according to the means of grace offered, and so the Church-covenant is contained within the covenant of grace, and so the consequence is null. A man may be in the covenant of grace, who is not a Church-member, and a man may be a Church-member, who is not within the covenant of grace, as Magus.  
Ans. It is a doubt to me if Mr. H. understand his own distinction of God's decreeing, and commanding will; for with Arminians he saith these are contrary wills.  
2. My argument is this, The Church covenant is tither one and the same, or a branch of the covenant of grace, as it offers grace externally to all, to Peter and Magus, or then it is a different covenant. That it is different Mr. H. denies, for than it 
The covenant of grace solemnly entered in baptism, ties us to all Church-duties in all Congregations, without any special covenant-engagement, making me a special Church-brother to these of this Congregation only, and that by divine command of a new covenant, different from the Gospel-covenant.  should not be warranted in the Gospel, if it be a part of the Gospel-covenant, how can they debar men of approved godliness, and visibly within the covenant of grace from ordinances? for such are implicitly in this covenant.  
3. Some are (saith M. H.) in the covenant of Grace, that are not Church-members, and contrary: true; but not if they be externally and professedly as Israel was, for so to be Gods visible people in covenant, is to be Gods visible Church, Acts 2. 39 Gen. 17. 7. Rev. 11. 15. Isa. 19 25. now we dispute whether the Church-covenant be not a branch of the covenant of the Gospel externally proposed. Mr. H. yields it is, only he saith, the Church-covenant is not the covenant of grace according to the benefits of saving grace given in it: true; nor is the covenant of grace externally preached, according to which Magus and judas, and all such Church-members are in the covenant of grace: the covenant of grace according to the benefit of saving grace given it, to wi●, a new heart, and remission, etc. Then this cannot hinder, but when one vows to duties in baptism, he also vows he shall acquit himself in all duties of warning, rebuking, gaining to Christ persons in all Congregations he shall come unto: for sure to be buried with Christ in Baptism, and to rise again to newness of life, Rom. 6. 3, 4. Col. 2. 11, 12. Gal. 3. 27. 1 Pet. 3. 21. 1 Cor. 12 13. engages a man, when converted, to strengthen his brethren, to gain others, Ps. 51. 12, 13. Luk. 22. 23. 1 Cor. 7. 16. and undeniably to gain a trespassing brother, Mat. 18. and it must be commanded in the covenant of grace; and to exhort another while it is to day, Isa. 2. 3. Isa. 19 23, 24, 25. Zach. 8. 21, 22. jer. 50 4, 5. And therefore it must be will-worship and unwarrantable, to teach that a visible professor is not called, nor can lawfully gain a trespassing brother, as Mat. 18. until he be inchurched a member to that one Congregation, and that he is not to gain to God, and to bring into fellow Church-duties the inhabitants of another City, nor in covenant way to exhort one another while it is to day, nor to strengthen one another in Church duties of love, while first we be all inchurched, by particular agreement, and covenant to this only Congregation. Yea, it is the nature (saith Mr. H.) of all Corporations, that one cannot be a Member, or free Citizen, without the consent of that Corporation.  
Ans. If entering the covenant of grace and professed faith in Baptism put me not in a state of brotherhood to any, but to 
It is vain doctrine that none can be my Church-brother, whom I am to gain, but one under the same only Congregational covenant with me.  the five thousand men, and multitudes beside of the same Congregation, Acts 4. 4. and also Acts 5. 14. Acts 6. 7. (whose faces I never saw, nor can see, to enter this new covenant with them.) Then  
1. All of other Congregations, as to the duty of Church-gaining, as to me are Pagans.  
2. Mr. H. must warrant from the word the distinction of Christians, and of Congregational brethren.  
3. To Christ's s●cond coming, none can be made my Church-Brother, though visibly and professedly he have with me one hope of Calling, one Lord, one Faith, one Baptism, one God, one Father of all, Eph. 4. 4, 5, 6. but one of the same Congregation, and that by this new covenant.  
4. He is never my Congregational brother, but by this new engagement. Nor  
5. Of the same visible body with me, notwithstanding of the oneness, Eph. 4. 4, 5. but by this.  
6. Nor can he eat of one bread with me, contrary to Scripture, 1 Cor. 10. 17. 1 Cor. 12. 13. and our brethren's way, being not my brother, nor a member of that household of Faith, Eph. 2. which to Mr. H. is only a Congregational household.  
7. Nor should I love him as a visible brother to me, contrary to 1 joh. 3. 14, 15. nor give him alms, as such, contrary to 1 joh. 3. 17, 18. 3 joh. 5. jam 2. 14, 15.  
M. H. The word (saith Mr. R.) teacheth that I should confess Christ, walk before God, etc. but that I am under a divine law to swear this covenant which is different from the covenant of grace, in relation to this duty, is no divine law.  
Ans. But to say there is no divine law to necessitate a man to enter into another covenant for marriage, beside the covenant of grace is strange. So a man may take the place, and do the duties of a husband to a woman, and tell her, I have been these many years in the covenant of grace, and there is no necessity to make a mariagecovenant beside. A Nimrod might say, the Gospel teacheth to pay tribute to Princes, and the Prince to exact it, and there needs no other covenant between Prince and people.  
Ans. The reason is altogether impertinent, for a Pastor is no 
Way of the Churches, c. 6. sect. 6. pag. 103 sect. 7. Cotton of the Keys. c. 4. pag. 17. Mr. Hooker Survey. A Pastor is not as a husband to his own Congregation only, for he may perform pastoral duties to other members and Congregations. See Mr. Robinson justific. of Separate. 317, 318. in the the same mistake with Mr. H. but disputing more nervously than Mr. Hooker: Epaphras though at Rome is a Minister at Coloss. Answ. A fixed Minister labouring among them, in that part of the Vineyard: true; but he was actu primo, habitu all the world over a Minister, wheresoever he opened his mouth and tendered the seals.  married Husband, no Monarch to rule over one single Congregation only. So when he dispenceth Bread and Wine in the Lord's Supper to forty of another Congregation, which he may lawfully do, 1 Cor. 10 17. 1 Cor. 12. 13. As our brethren teach: the Pastor saith, I am no married Husband, nor Church-covenanting Pastor to you forty foreign members of another Congregation, but yet I do the duty of your own sworn, and only Husband and Pastor to you, in dispensing to you this Seal of the Covenant, and there is no need of a marriage covenant between you and me.  
Is not this by Mr. H. his own doctrine, to quit the argument, when it undoes his own cause, and to say the comparison of husband & wife is blasphemous? And the like is said of that of Prince and people; for he is no Prince nor Magistrate to a people which never promised, nor covenanted with him for subjection and obedience: and a covenant is necessary in both these, but a Pastor may and doth discharge pastoral acts to these with whom he never entered a marriage-covenant, all our brethren grant.  
2. Mr. R. denies not, but there may be a Covenant between a fixed and a proper Pastor (to make him fixed and proper, not to make him a Pastor) and this Congregation, but that agreement makes neither Husband nor Prince; but my argument is, that the covenant of grace gives marriage membership to the man who entereth it, to all Congregations on earth, and warrants the sound professor to gain a trespassing brother in all Congregations, without the new fancied marriage, or covenant between him and them. And the covenant of grace entered did this.  
See and answer my Arguments, and prove not to me a marriage-membership with this only Congregation, by an asserted comparison, wickedly said. But Mr. H. speaks dishonourably of partaking Church-ordinances, and seals in another Congregation, and from another Pastor, when he will have these acts to be adulterous, and traitorous, performed by no Husband, but by a strange man, and a foreign usurper and tyrant.  
Mr. H. That of Baptism is removed. 
Page 80.   
Ans. The answers of Mr. H. are removed.  
Mr. H. The Gospel requires me to seek for the help of a godly Pastor, and to marry, and not to burn, therefore there is no marriage covenant to make a husband, and such a man a Pastor to me.  
Ans. This heedless similitude ever brought to the fields is already removed.  
2. There is a difference between making a man a Pastor to me fixed, and making him a Pastor simply; the former I grant, and Mr. H. shall gain nothing thereby.  
3. If the Gospel bid me pray every where, remember the Lords death till he come, gain an offending brother every where, teach, warn, comfort the brethren every where; Ergo I must pray Church-ways, partake of seals, etc. at the Church of Ephesus, of Philippi, of Rome, etc. without any new engagement, or covenant superadded to the Gospel-covenant.   

CHAP. XXV.  
Whether a Pastor or Professor be first a member of the Catholic visible Church, before he be a member of a single Congregation.  
MR. H. Some Paradoxes fall from the Pen of Mr. R. a Pastor 
Page 81.  gifted and called by the Church, is a member of the visible Church before he be their Pastor, though he be a member of no Congregation.  
2. That a Pastor may have a calling from the Church before he be elected by a Congregation, and so an Individuum vagum, a Pastor of all people, and yet of no particular people. But if all the Congregations are all the members that all the visible Church hath, than he that is not a member of a particular Congregation, is no member of a visible Church, for that which comes not within the number of members is no member; but all particular Congregations are all the members that a visible Church hath.  
Ans. That he must be a member of a visible Church, before 
One must be a member of the visible Church, though no member of a Congregation, before he can be a Pastor of a Congregation.  he be the Pastor of a single flock is clear.  
1. He must be baptised into one body visible, whether of Jews or Gentiles, 1 Cor. 12. 13. for an unbaptized man cannot be a Minister.  
2. The qualifications of an Elder or Watchman, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2, 3, 4. 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 6, 7, 8. And that he be in covenant with God, and visibly holy, and th●● he as well as the Deacons, 1 Tim. 3. 10. may be proved to be such as agree to learned and godly members, who are broken off from membership for no scandal, but through persecution, and pestilence, than it cannot be a paradox, if some that are no members of a single Congregation, and so visible professors known to be faithful and able to teach others, as 2 Tim. 2. 2. and so in covenant visibly, as the visible Israel of God, and as Gods covenanted Nation and Kingdom, Isa. 19 16, 17, 25. Rev. 11. 15. Psal. 2. 8, 9 Psal. 22. 27. and members of the visibly covenanted people, and Church of God, be called to be Pastors and Elders, except it be said that public suffering for Christ, and affliction only, and not sin make men learned and holy, uncapable to be Elders.  
2. That a Pastor is made a Pastor by ordination, 1 Tim. 3. 22. 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 5, 6, 7. Acts 6 6. by such as Timothy, Titus, Apostles and Elders is clear in Scripture: and not one word in Scripture saith, that unofficed men laid hands upon any to make them Elders. Nor will it ever follow that a Pastor may be ordained, and called a Pastor, or an individuum v●gum, and appointed over no certain flock, except that Mr. H. prove that we now, when Apostles are ceased, do separate the ordination of officers by the Presbytery, from the election of the people, 
A Pastor is made a Pastor by only ordination, but it follows not, Ergo, he is now lawfully made a Pastor by ordination separated for any designed and certain flock, consenting and choosing him to be their Pastor. When Augustine confesseth that the Donatists, who separated themselves from the true Catholic Church, did beget sons to the Church, and had the true Sacraments, he shows that they were members of the Catholic Church, though members of a separated Church. De Baptismo contra Donatist. lib. 1. c. 10. Certe quidem nati erant, nec tamen ad ipsam Ecclesiam, de quâ nati erant, per pacis vaitatis vinculum pertinerent; ergo ipsa generat, & per uterum su●● & per uteros ancillarum ex eisdem Sacramentis tanquam ex viri sui semine.  and that the presbytery may do as the prelate's, ordain a man to be a pastor every where, when as no certain flock calls him; which we teach not: for ordination only makes a pastor, sola ordinatio, but that ordination is not solitary, and it's alone, but inseparably joined with an inviting, and choosing, and consenting people. But that consent and choice doth not formally constitute a man an officer, but only appropriate his labours to this consenting people. Mr. H. argues here just as the Papists do. If we be justified sola fide, by faith only, and not by works; ergo we are justified by such a faith as is void of all works, and so by a dead faith: we deny the consequence, the man seeth with the eyes only, ergo he sees with the eyes plucked out of the head: The like Paradox M. H. imputes to me, if only ordination formally make a Minister, ergo ordination now where Apostles are not, though separated from election of a certain flock, makes a lawful Minister in a settled Church-state, it follows not: indeed in some cases, as hereafter I shall clear, only ordination of Officers makes a lawful Minister.  
Nor is it here as Mr. H. imagines in the case of marriage; for marriage-covenant makes both a man a husband, and a husband to this woman only, and to no other: but election of the people makes not a man a Minister, but only appropriates his Ministerial labours to this flock fixedly.  
3. Not is that any thing but a fancied contradiction, he that is not a member, inchurched and married to one only particular Congregation (for so is Mr. H. his sense) he is not a member of the Catholic visible Church; For Presbyterian members are so neither members one way nor another.  
1. Apostles and members dissolved are not fixed members of a single Congregation, and yet members they must be of the visible Church Catholic: sure it is no Paradox, that the Apostles are such members, for they had right to all the seals in all Congregations; Ergo, they must by this reason be members and no members: the like may be said of godly professors so journers, of these baptised by john Baptist, Matth. 3. by Peter, Act. 10. by Paul, Act. 16. For if we say that professors are only members of a particular Congregation, than we confine a Brother to be gained only to one Congregation, let all the rest perish, they are not my brethren.  
2. To deny men to be members of the Catholic visible Church, is to confine all the Church-blessings, and Church-prayers, Church-comforts, Church-faith in Church-hearing, Church-partaking of seals to the one only Congregation whereof I am a member, for in all other Congregations whereof I am no member, there is no assembly-glory, nor no assembly comfort 
The woeful absurdities which follow from the membership of Pastors and Saints confined to one only Congregation.  promised, Isa. 4 5, 6. no assembly, o● Church-protection, and Church-leading from a cloud by day, and the shining of a flaming fire by night, no joy in the public sanctuary, Ps. 84. 1, 2, 3. Ps 42. 1, 2, 3, 4. Isa. 2. 2, 3. no comfort in a Churchway through ●ion in which the fool shall not err, Isa. 35. 89. no more comfort to me, who am not a member of that flock, then to the Heathen and the Eunuch; for I have no more a place there then the Heathen: contrary to Isa. 56. 4, 5, 6. nor have I Interest in Church-holiness, Zach. 14. 20, 21. and the sanctuary beauty, Ps. 27. 4. Ps. 23. 6. which the Angels desire to learn by the Church, Eph. 3. 10. 1 Pet. 1. 12. 1 Cor. 11. 10. more than if I were excommunicate by Mr. H. his way.  
3. Consider if this be not a Judaizing, and a confining of all these spiritual privileges, and glorious Church-comforts, Worship, and Church prayer once confined to Bithel, to the Temple, 1 Kings 28. 29, 44. Dan. 6. 10. which Christ hath made common, and excepts of in all places, joh 4 21. 1 Tim. 2. 8. Rev. 1. 10. to one single Congregation, whereof I am a member.  
4. It's against the nature of the seals, that is, our union by spiritual engraffing into one body, 1 Cor. 12. 13. and we all eat one bread, 1 Cor. 10. 17. our communion in love with all the Saints is here sealed, and the broken bread seals the body of Christ broken, not for one man, and for only one single Congregation, but it seals Christ's love to the Redeemed world, joh. 3. 16. 1 joh. 2. 2. to the whole redeemed, saved, sanctified Church, Eph. 5. 23, 26, 27. joh. 10. 11. & 11. 51, 52. for the Catholic Bride, not a limb, a single Congregation is the complete object of Christ's intent.  
2. The complete and adequate matter of his work and soul-travel on his incarnation, dying, rising, ascending, interceding, giving of the holy Spirit, Luke 19 10. & 2. 10. 1 joh. 2. 2. 1 Tim. 1. 15. Rev. 1. 5, 6. Heb. 7. 25. joh. 16. 7. Isa. 53. 11.  
3. The only complete recipient, and principal subject of all the gracious and saving actings of Christ, of Church-callings, of the Promises, Covenant preached.  
5. By this the congregational body may say, I have no need of thee.  
Obj. Yea, I have materially need of thee for counsel, rebuke.  
Ans. But is Body-need, Organ-need, and Church-need that Paul speaks of, 1 Cor. 12. 26. Peter's body hath no Organ-need of Paul's feet to walk, for he hath two feet of his own; but he may have physical need of another kind: So the Congregation hath need of Heathens to rebuke them, but this is no Church-need.  
6. Paul, 1 Cor. 12. would have no schism in the body, but would have the Churches to have the same Church-care one of another, and not to be divided in one Faith, one Baptism, one Church-head, one Church-Gospel, etc. which must be, if I be not a member of all congregations.  
7. We are to suffer one with another, rejoice one with another, but no Church-feeling is required of me, if I and those of another congregation be not of the same visible body, by virtue of the fellow-feeling between the members, the Apostle cannot speak of a natural compassion: for humanity will teach Christians to mourn at the destruction of Heathens, but they are not for that of the same body of Christ with us. But as 
Churches and members of associate Churches are visible professors and members no less than single congregations.  all these prove that there is a visible body of m●●y congregations, and so that there is a Catholic integral visible body. So we thus argue: If the Church-actings, and sufferings, and rejoicing condition of those of associated Churches be visible and audible to us, no less than the Church-actings, and sufferings, and rejoicing condition of the single congregation, whereof I am a member: then must the one be a visible Body and Church as well as the other.  
But the latter is true. The Proposition is clear: for if the properties and accidents be visible, the subject is visible; because this is the formal reason why a congregation is visible, for we see not the spirits and faith in the hearts of the single congregation, but we see their profession in single persons, and their meetings in one place, for hearing, praying, praising and partaking of the seals. Now all these we see in three or four or six meetings, or conventions of the Churches associated, which shall but make one numerous congregation of ten thousand, as the dissenting Brethren said of the Church of jerusalem: and we see them severally meet, as we see the Church of our own single congregation. As for their poverty, sickness, imprisonment, and the sufferings of these of the same congregation of which we are members, we see not these in Church meetings, but in single members, and these must be visible in many congregations, as the famine in judea for which Paul made a collection, as well as in one. From all this its clear, that it is false which Mr. H. saith, That all particular Churches are all the members that the Church visible hath. For Apostles, godly sojourners, dissolved members, are not members of congregations, not are they congregations themselves, and yet they are members of the visible integral Catholic Church.   

CHAP. XXVI.  
Other Arguments against the Church-Covenant are vindicated.  
Mr. H. Mr. R. plainly affirms, That when one enters a member of such a Congregation under the Ministry of A. B. he cometh under a new relative state, by an implicit● or virtual covenant, pag. 95. which is cross to that which was affirmed pag. 92.  
Ans. Mr. H. citys not my words to the full. I deny not, 
A sort of covenant is not denied, but the question is mis-stated.  but he that enters a fixed member of a congregation, comes under a new relative state of a virtual covenant, and so does he that enters a member of a Christian Army, of a Family, of a Society in a Ship. But the state of the question is not touched: for the state of the question is not, Whether this new Covenant make the adjoyner a member of the visible Church, where as he was no visible member before; that is, whether a born Englishman, by being made a citizen of London, was made an Englishman and a born Subject of England, whereas he was not a born Subject before?  
2. Whether doth this New-covenant give him right and claim to Church-ordinances, and seals of the Covenant of grace, so as without it, the man hath no right at all to Ordinances. Sure, it's a great sin to lay more weight on either the Temple or the Ark than God hath laid on them. But this Covenant so used is a fancy.  
Mr. H. A Church newly erected becomes a sister-Church with others, yet she needs not a new Covenant (saith Mr. R.) to accomplish 
Par. 1. p. 82.  it. Ans. No certain, our Covenant once entered, all the relations that depend thereupon are included in the first Covenant. A woman once being married, all duties to the husband's kindred results from the Marriage-covenant, there is no need of a new Covenant.  
Ans. Yea, but a Church newly erected becomes as really a part of a Synodical body that is really obliged to engage for association, saith Mr. H. (and it's both lawful and useful) as a person 
Survey, par. 4. cap. 1. concl. 1. pag. 1, 2.  becomes a member of the single congregation. And officers are no less married to Synodical duties (by the light of nature and right reason (saith the same Mr. H.) than single persons 
Mr. H. Survey, ibid.  are married to congregational duties; therefore a covenant is as necessary in the one as in the other, magis & minus non variant speciem, if there be a marriage, here officers are more married to the associated Churches in general, as to the complete correlate, than to the single and inadequate correlate the bit of a single congregation.  
2. A man born in the Covenant of grace, and baptised, is engaged in all duties,  
Mr. H. The Apology said, It's not the Rule of the Word touching Man and Wife, Magistrate and Subject, that makes people in such a state, but the Covenant thus stands unanswered by Mr. R.  
Ans. This is for me; but he being born in the Gospel-covenant, 
The blaspheme us comparison making the Pastor the Husband, and the congregation his married wife, until death, is refuted. Due Right of Presbyt. l. 1. p. 127. Enarist. Ep. 2. Concil. Carthag. 3. cap. 38. Concil. Sard. Cen. 1. Concil. Antioch. c. 21. Enarist. de Epist. ejectis. Sicut vir non debet adulterare suam uxorem, ita neque Episcopus Ecclesiam fuam, ut eam dimittat. Innocen. III. Omnipotens Deus conjugium quod est inter Episcopum & Ecclesiam suo tantum judicio reservavit dissolvendum. Calv. Com. in Isa. 54. v. 5. Ecclesia agnoscat qualem maritum habere ac revereri debeat (〈◊〉 Deum). Luther Com. in loc. Habetis maritum, non Mosem, non Petrum, non Paulum. Bullinger, Musculus, Gualther, Com. in Isa. 14. v. 5. Nor do our Divines acknowledge that Concil. Gener. par. 1. Epistola Papae Calixti secunda, pag. 136. allegata est uxor legi, quamdiu vir ejus vivit, Rom. 7, etc. similiter & sponsa Episcopi, quia sponsa uxorque ejus dicitur Ecclesia.  and baptised to all Churches, he is a son, a married member to all congregations.  
2. Mr. R. constantly denied the naked comparison, as blasphemous and Popish, the Church is Spouse to no sinful man, Pope or any other. Enaristus, The Council of Carthage, of Sardis, of Antioch, so judge, That the Bishop is the Husband, the Church his Wife. Innocentius the III. As Almighty God hath left the Marriage-covenant to be dissolved by his own judgement only, so let not the Bishop leave his Church. But Calvin and Luther say, The Lord is the Husband of the Church: So Bullinger, Musculus, Gualther.  
2. It makes communion between the Pastor and those of divers congregations to be acts of Adultery.  
3. It makes a Pastor to be married till death.  
4. When the congregation is dissolved by persecution, the godly Pastor is cast out of his Master's service by the nature of this covenant, because he is faithful to Christ, and that by Christ himself.  
5. It divorces between all godly Pastors, and all Churches on earth, so that it is not lawful to preach pastorally, or to tender the seals to another congregation, or any member thereof, though Letters of Recommendation (as our Brethren say) may give Church right to the se●ls to those of another congregation to be admitted to the Lords Supper; yet we still desire to Quere, Whether the Pastor, upon the banishment or death of the Pastors of sister congregations, may not lawfully, pastorally preach and tender the seals to them, or not? if the former, here is a strange man acting as a husband to another man's wife.  
2. Here is a Pastor acting as a Pastor and a Shepherd to those that are not his flock, and that by no intervening of a Church-covenant; and he wants the essentials of a Pastor, which is the choice of that people.  
3. Here is Mr. H. his relation between Pastor and People broken, and their principles destroyed, if the latter be said.  
1. What difference is there between his tendering of the seals to those of another congregation in his own Church, and in another Church, except the walls of the house make the difference?  
2. Why should he not tender the other seal of Regeneration common to all covenanted ones, Act. 2. 39 as well as the Lords Supper?  
3. If he may not as a Pastor in another congregation; How, or by what authority of Scripture are Pastors only Ambassadors of the King, Messengers of the Lord of Hosts, Workers with Christ, Stewards, Dispenser's of the Mysteries of the Gospel, Sent of God, Friends of the Bridegroom, and can act only as such within the precincts of a congregation; and lose both name and thing, when they pass over the line to visible Saints of another congregation? The Priests might not offer sacrifice and offerings, but in the place that the Lord should appoint in his Word; show us a word confining pastoral acting 〈◊〉 Ambassadors to one flock only.  
6. This destroys the communion of Churches as Churches, 
Mr. Cotton, Keys, c. 6. p. 25. Mr. H. Survey, par. 4. c. 1. concl. 4, 5.  and makes Synods, in which Pastors act as Pastors to other congregations associate, (as Mr. Cotton teacheth) to be no Ordinances of Christ.  
7. The same husbandly power must be in Doctors, so that they write not books as Doctors to other Congregations, but only to their own.  
8. What Scripture warranteth the same Pastor in the same Sermon preaching to his own flock, and to many strangers of another congregation, to act as a Pastor to his own only, and to others as a gifted man? and to hear in the same word to the conscience of the one by pastoral authority, and to the other by private authority, such as a gifted ploughman or woman hath? 
The Brethren make the pastor a married husband and head of the congregational Church, as Papists make the Pope the Head of the catholic Church. Christum caput Ecclesiae universae libentissime confitemuratqui sub Christo summ● capite vicarius ejus i● terris, caput, ut sic dicam, Ministerialò, non principale rectò nominetur, n●gari nullo modo potest: ita Bellarm. de Sum. Pontif. to. 1. c. 24. col. 1. l. D. & de pontiff. Rom. l. 1. c. 9 So the Jesuits of Rheims on Eph. 〈◊〉. v. 5. Though Christ in a more divine, ample, absolute, excellent and transcendent sort— be severaign Head— in regard of motion, life, spirit, grace ●●suing from him to the members— yet the Pope may be Ministerial Head.   
9 Only Christ is the Bridegroom, Spouse, Husband of his Church, joh. 3. Eph. 5. Cant. 6. 1, 2, 3, 4. and it will not suffice to say, Christ is the supreme Catholic Husband of all Churches, but the pastor is the under-politick head and husband of the congregation, as some distinguish. For the Husband and Bridegroom are as incommunicable Titles proper to Christ only, as to be the Head of the Church, Eph. 1. 22. Col. 1. 18. and yet Jesuits do but mock, when they say, That Christ is the principal and perpetual Head of the whole Church in a sovereign and principal manner, but the Pope is the Ministerial Head. Nor do Papists make the Pope a Father, Husband, Bridegroom and Head of the Church by the spiritual influence of life, motion and grace, yet are they refuted by Willet, D. Fulk, Cartwright, and ours: And Mr. H. will but add naus●am inculcate, that the Pastor is the married Husband, and the Congregation his only Wife; and that he may not act as a pastor toward others than his own flock, more than a man may venture to take the place, and to do the duties of a husband to a woman— and tell her he is in the Covenant of grace— and there need●… Marriage-covenant. Hence I infer, he cannot dispense the Lord's Supper to one of another congregation, contrary to himself and his Brethren, except he be married by a Church-covenant to them; and so he must be a husband, and perform the duties of a husband to a hundred persons, of a hundred associate congregations. But it had been fit Mr. H. had produced any words of mine that bear, that being in the Covenant of grace can warrant a man to discharge pastoral duties, either to one congregation or other, before he be lawfully called of God by the Church, and before he formally consent and engage not implicitly, but formally and expressly to feed the flock of God; or that any man's being in the covenant of grace licenses him to do all duties whatsoever of a Pastor, of a Magistrate, of a Husband, of a Physician, b●fore he be lawfully called of God to the calling of a Pastor, a Magistrate, a Husband, a Physician. And Mr. H. wrongfully would that the Reader should believe, That Mr. R. so teacheth. There are some actions indeed that the visible and professed being in the covenant of grace warranteth a man to do, to wit, to partake of the seals in all congregations, without any new Church-covenant, to gain a trespassing brother, to counsel, teach, rebuke, comfort Church-members of all congregations, where it shall please God he shall be for the present. And Mr. R. denies that these are either pastoral, or husband-duties, and thinks Mr. H. in a great error: for if one of another congregation should trespass against a member of a sister-congregation near by, Mr. H. hath furnished the offender rebuked with this Reply: You and I are not congregational Brethren, nor married members of the same congregation; and therefore the covenant of grace warrants not you to rebuke me, or to tell the Church of my obstinacy in Adultery, except you and I had both sworn in the same Marriage-congregational covenant: for the covenant of grace no more warranteth you to gain me in a Church way, than it warranteth a man to do husband-duties to the Woman with whom he never made any Marriage-covenant; and so all duties of this kind performed by Presbyterians never so godly, must be Antichristian and adulterous.  
Mr. H. This new Covenant makes the new adjoyner a member of the congregation, (saith Mr. R.) never 〈◊〉 of us (saith Mr. H.) said any such thing. The Church as totum essentiale, made of visible Saints covenanting to watch over one another in a Churchway, is before her officers, the particular members are members before they choose their Pastors, and therefore are not made Church-members by this new covenant.  
Ans. There be too many ways to the Well here. I said, the new covenant makes the new adjoyner a member of the congregation. Yea, I add, A member of the visible Church, whereas he was no better than a heathen before, and the Churches of New England say with me; Though Mr. H. say, That never 
Way of the Churches, c. 1. sect. 1. pag. 2. prop. 3. For all the joining of faithful Christians into the fellowship, and estate of a Church, we find not in Scripture that God hath done it any other way, than by entering all of them together (as one man) into holy covenant with himself, to take the Lord as the Head of his Church for their God, and to give themselves to him, and one to another in his fear, etc.  one of them said any such thing. And sure this is one Church-covenant by which persons are made fixed members of a congregation; Ergo, they are by this covenant made members of the visible Church, whereas they were as pagans before. But there is another Church-covenant, by which pastor and people are married, and every member so married, as they cannot act as Church-members without their own congregation, and he cannot act as a pastor toward any, but toward his own flock. Hence a new Quaere, Whether there be two different Church-covenants?  
3. It's without question, that the family of Abraham was Gods covenanted people before circumcision was instituted, Gen. 17. nor is there any ground for a formal Church-covenanting among themselves. And it speaks against all Scripture, to say there was a Church covenant in Egypt, and in the Wilderness, Exod. 19 1, 5. for they were not made Church-members, for members they were before, by these covenantings with God. And this is Mr. H. his own consequence, They are members before they chose their Pastors: Ergo. So I retort.  
Mr. H. If this covenant difference the visible Church from the 
M. R. 5 Arg p. 83, 84.  invisible, as the formal cause; then there have been no visible Churches since the Apostles times till now. Now the Churches (saith Mr. H.) in England, Holland, etc. have the implicit covenant, at their practice evidenceth.  
Ans. Yet it must f●…ow, since presbyterian Churches believe and practise juridical power, without the bonds of a single Independent Church in divers associate Congregations.  
2. And do not contend for, but are against really supposed Saints, as only constituent members of the visible Church, and in the causes internal and external.  
And 3. are so contradictorious to Independency, there have been no Church, according to the rule of the word, since the Apostles days.  
2. If an implicit covenant suffice, we shall find popish Churches to have much of that.  
Mr. H. Though many unwarrantable wayet convey this covenant, yet itself may be warrantable.  
Ans. If by ways Mr. R. mean, as he doth, ways inseparable, 
Read for this a Judicious piece of my reverend and learned brother Mr. R. Baily, his dissuasive from the errors of the time, and the dissuasive vindicated, An. 1675.  causes, pillars, means and undeniable consequences, the covenant must be the more unhappy, as the unlawful ways of the Mass, the lifting up of the bready God, and Idolatrous Ceremonies inseparably conveying it, render it unlucky.  
Mr. H. It is a dream to say, that when the Apostles came to plant Churches, that private men, not the Apostles converted them; Where is the man (of ours) that will affirm that all (All) are converted by private Christians?  
Ans. The reply auswers not a whit to the Charge of Mr. R. now when the Apostles are not.  
2. The Apostles, by our brethren's way, are not Pastors so much as extraordinary nor, public men, for extraordinariness destroys not the nature of Pastors; and to our Brethren Pastor and flock are relatives; but the heathen are no fed stock, nor these who now teach the Gospel to the heathen, Apostles nor Pastors. 
All are converted in ordinary by private men, or by no pastors by our brethren's way.   
3. These who teach that now Apostles ceasing, Pastors as Pastors convert none according to the revealed command of Christ; but pray suppose all are converted before they be admitted members: they convert not as Pastors; Ergo, they must convert them as no Pastors; Ergo, they convert them as private men, except there be a middle preacher between a preaching officer, and a private man, but this every where is taught by our brethren: now this middle uncalled man, must be the ordinary converser of all.  
2. Mr. H. teacheth that the Church homogeneal, in ordinary, now when there are no Apostles, is before Baptism and Ministry; now this Church is all the visible sovieties of confederate 
Survey par. 1. c. 11. p. 55.  converts on earth. Let Mr. H. tell us who converted them: not Pastors, for they are a framed Church in esse and operari, the Fathers and sole Creators of all Officers.  
Mr. H. It is unwarrantable to say Pastors now convert not Indians 
By our brethren, pastors, convert not Indians.  and Heathens, saith Mr R. It is warrantable enough, saith M. H.  
Answ. Enough is a feast. Converters of Heathen now are either Apostles, Evangelists, or Ordinary Officers and Pastors, or of some middle new Officers: this latter cannot without Scripture be said, not the former, for they want the gift of tongues and miracles; nor are they ordinary Pastors. For Pastor and flock, saith Mr. H. Shepherd called, and Church choosing, Husband and Wife are Relatives. But Indians are no choosing Church.  
Mr. H. Men must be satisfied in conscience of the conversion one of another, saith Mr. R.  
Ans. To reasonable charity they should, saith Mr. H. and no doubt it was in Ananias, Saphira.  
Ans. But their long conversing together, for this satisfaction Mr. H. bringeth down to two poor experienced Witnesses, Magus 
Way of the Church. c. 1. pro. 5. sect. 2. p. 6, 7, 8. Survey par. 1. c. 4. 7. p. 87.  and judas, for every one must witness of another, and that witnesses were called and judicially deponed, that all the 3000. Act. 2. and all judea, and all round about who were baptised, Matth. 3. 3, 4. Mark 1. 5. Luk. 4. 21. were real converts, who can believe, except you believe? for so saith Mr. H.  
Mr. H. What is all this to overthrow the covenant?  
Ans. Very much; for it destroys the Ministry: for though some private Christians may convert some, yet no man can show 
The way of our brethren doth destroy the ministry.  me, by our brethren's way, that pastors now do convert any at all; contrary to Mat. 28. 19, 20 Rom. 10. 14, 15. Eph. 4. 11, 12, 13. 1 Cor. 3. 5. 2 Cor. 5. 20. Act. 26. 16, 17, 18. or if they convert any, they do it not as pastors.  
M. H. They which have no Church-power, can put forth no Church power, but such as Churches to other Churches.  
Ans. The proposition is weak, they put forth an act of love, of counsel, of approbation, of conjunction, as well as power. Mr. R. grants one single Congregation to have no power over another; many Churches sent to Parliament, to declare their judgement, may approve of their determinations, if holy, if not, may confute them; yet they have no Church-power over the Parliament.  
Ans. 1. My argument is mistaken, many Churches, suppose mine, have not power by this way to receive in one Church, nor james, Cephas, and john power to receive authoritatively Paul, as they do, say Calvin, Pelicanus, Pareus, Piscator, Diodati, Beza; yea jerom also before them. 
Calv. Com. Gal. 2. incitavit ad sanciendum Ministerii societatem. Pelican. ib. Synod. (Paulus) primarius fuerit inter Apostolos. Pareus, in Collegium Apostolorum nos receperunt. Pisc. Me pro Apostolo agnoverunt. Diodati. Beza. Symbolum nostrae consensionis dextram dederunt. Hieronym. Gal. 2. Many Churches may put forth a Church-power upon one Church associate, as james, Cephas and john, Gal. c. 2. as Apostles received Paul into the College of Apostles.   
Mr. H. If Mr. R. construe a token of consent, consensionis, to be a Symbol of authority, it is beyond my understanding.  
Ans. Mr. R. never understands private consent, or private counsel, such as one private man or woman may give to another private person, of their own, or of another congregation, to be public authority; but I acknowledge a public authoritative, and Aopstolick consent to be in james, Cephas, john; and their meaning was, Brother Paul, our counsel as Brethren, is, and our consent, you be a Preacher, but we have no Apostolic authority from the Lord to own you as an Apostle. Now that is the true meaning of Mr. H. for this of Mr. R. must bide yet strong: these that have no Church-power can put forth no Church-act. Such as one Church may put forth toward another single Sister-Church, as Mr. R. often granteth, as one single man cannot excommunicate another; yet one single man being a Pastor in a Church, Judicature joined with the Church binding and losing, such as is Mat. 18. may give consent, not private by way of counsel, but public, by way of authoritative influence, as a partial and collateral cause, that Paul, Gal. 2. be authoritatively adopted into the number of the Apostles, & that they be excommunicate who say, they are Apostles, but are not, and do lie, Rev. 2. and a married wife hath no marriage-power over any man but over her own husband; nor is it to be heard, which Mr. H. saith, I but she may put forth an act of love and counsel to all men. But I ask, may she put forth a certain act of matrimonial love, or perform a certain matrimonial duty to all men on earth? this would be too near unchaste acting. So let Mr. H. answer, whether these three, james, Cephas, and john, gave Apostolic public consent, that Paul should be received an Apostle, or only a private counsel. If the former be said, why contend we? if the latter, what more had Paul from the given right hand of these Apostles than he had before? he was no more to them an Apostle then before, yea, more to three private Believers in Galatia; contrary to the scope of Gal. 2. These Churches sent to the Parliament that way, not representing the National Church and Kingdom covenanted with the Lord, can give no Church-determination, more than so many single Pastors; yet it is an official judgement, not a private judgement.  
Mr. H. It is not warrantable that one not in office (saith Mr. R.) 
Pag. 88  but a private Christian, should pray, exhort, preside in the framing of a Church, and in ordaining of Pastors. Ans. The practice of the Church of Scotland will say to this, we allow not public prophesying of unofficed men.  
Ans. 1. Here is ordinary prophesying, such as that of the 
Some chief and ordinary church-prophesying, and church-praying is given to the unofficed church, as to the only kindly subject by Mr. H. Mr. H. Survey par. 1. c. 8. p. 52.  Apostle Peter at the calling of Mathias, Act. 1. and public Church-prophesying and praying; such as is by the Prophets or presbytery of the Church of Antioch, Act. 13. when Paul & Barnabas were called to be Apostles to the Gentiles: and since officers are but adjuncts of the Church to Mr. H. and separable accidents, by no institution of Christ have pastors hand in ordaining pastors; but the settled way till Christ's second coming is that the male-Church kindly per se, make and unmake all the officers, which cannot be done, but by Church prophesying of unofficed men. 2. Expectants being pastors in fieri, sons of the prophets, by command of the prophets, vi materiae, for trial must prophesy: that you cannot warrantably say from Scripture of your prophets.    


LIB. II. CHAP. I.  
Whether or not a company of Believers destitute as yet of Officers, and combined together by this new Covenant, be truly called, and be in truth and indeed a Church?  
MR. Hooker moves the question, whether such a 
Mr. H. par. 1. c. 8. pag. 89. Mr. H. is dubious what is the instituted Church in the New Testament. Way of the Church of N. E. c. 1. sect. 1. pro. 1. pag. 1, 2.  company be a Church indeed? by which he insinuates, that it is a certain kind of a visible Church, but not the only visible Church instituted by Christ in the New Testament. Therefore Mr. H. stands obliged either to form the question in other terms, or to show which is the only instituted visible Church in the New Testament: for the Discipline-book of N. E. saith, that Church which Christ in his Gospel hath instituted, to which he hath committed the Keys— the Officers, Censures— is coetus fidelium, a combination of the godly— called a particular visible Church. And Mr. H. comes to our hand, and (so with a trumpet giving an uncertain sound) he tells he speaks of the Congregational Church, as it goes before Officers; which is a Man in the Moon, and proved by no Scripture at all.  
Mr. H. The trumpet here gives an incertain sound. M. R. expressions are so full of variety.  
Ans. It is a groundless charge, except you bring expressions of Mr. R. ambiguities, which is not legible to the Reader: I blow the trumpet always against such a visible Church as Mr. H. forgeth by arguments from the word, which are not answered.  
Mr. H. A Church ministerial is taken two ways. 1. Generally, 
Pa. 8. par. 1. p. 90, 91.  as implying any delegate power in the exercise of any Church-acts, under Christ. So a company of visible Saints hath power of admission of members, and election of officers; and in case they prove heretical, to reject the officer, and make him no officer. All these are granted by Mr. R. Ministerial power is taken strictly, as it includes an office power, so it is not ministerial.  
Ans. Mr. H. dictates, but neither teaches nor brings one word of Scripture to prove a distinction that hath neither head nor feet.  
2. The members of the distinction are coincident; for to ordain officers, and excommunicate them is governing strictly and most properly; as is in the second member. And yet in the first 
Mr. H. makes a Church without Rulers, to be a Ruling Church to ordain officers, and excommunicate. Mr. Cotton Keys c. 4. par. 2 as the Presbytery cannot excommunicate the whole church (though Apostates) for they must tell the church— so neither can the church excommunicate the whole Presbytery, because they have not received from Christ an office of rule, without their officers. M. Cot. contradicts M. H.  member, to excommunicate makes a ministerial Church largely so called. The distinction is a begging of the question, and destroys itself; for it is to ask whether visible Saints, wanting such as are the only Governors and Rulers, who are called in the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, 1 Cor. 12. 28. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, 1 Tim. 5. 17. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Heb. 13. 17. Rulers, be a ruling and a governing Church, for a Society that doth ordain Elders, and which censures them, if heretical, with excommunication, must be a Ruling, and so a Ministerial Church, if there be any Ruling and Ecclesiastic Church on Earth. If any say that a Society that appoints Stewards and Officers over the house, and excommunicateth them, is not a politic governing Society; they may deny that the man which maketh use of reason is a reasonable creature. And to frame a distinction, and say a man is a reasonable 
There is no warrant in the word for a male Church-ruling and admitting members, ordaining & excommunicating officers, and yet that is void of rule and office  creature in that sense, is poor Logic. We can give instances where the Presbytery ordains, and lays on hands, 1 Cor. 4. 14. and where Titus and other Elders are to ordain Elders in every City, Tit. 1. 5. and Timothy, and in him others are charged to lay on hands, and ordain no man suddenly, while he be proved to be a fit Officer, 1 Tim. 5. 22. 1 Tim. 3. 10. and where Timothy and others with him are commanded, 2 Tim. 2. 2. to commit the ministry to faithful men, who are able to teach others. Would Mr. H. show so much for the power of Rule in a company of Believers, void of Officers, or give us a shadow of reason in the word from precepts, practices, promises, for this new Church, that ordains and excommunicates without Officers, they should have something to say to this, who upon good groun● say, they coin a new Church of their own, unknown to word.  
Mr. H. indeed elsewhere saith, Such places shall prove Ti●… thy and Titus to be Prelates.  
I answer, 1. Mr. H. and our brethren's way shall be straited with this groundless Argument, as well as we.  
2. We say, these Epistles in point of governing, as trying 
The Ep●… to Timot●… Titus are ne●… there written to them as to Prelates, & Pastors of Pastors, nor to unofficed christians, nor to them as Evangelists, but especially as representing Elders, to be a copy to officers, to the appearing of Christ.  of Pastors, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2, 3. of Deacons, ver. 10. of Elders, 1 Tim. 1. 17. ordaining or laying on of hands, ver. 22. receiving of accusation by witnesses, 19, 20. the ordaining of Elders thus and thus qualified, Tit. 1. 5, 6, 7, 8. 2 Tim. 2. 2. preaching the Gospel in season and out of season 2 Tim 4. 1, 2. with gentleness, 1 Tim. 5. 15. ruling in the house of God, 1 Tim. 3. 16. charging of men to preach sound doctrine. 1 Tim. 1. 3. dividing the word aright, 2 Tim. 2. 14, 15. These Epistles (I say) are written to Timothy and to Titus, not as little Monarches, with preeminence above other Elders, but to them as representing all faithful Officers in the College of that Presbytery, 1 Tim. 4. 14. who are to keep that command unviolable, to the second appearing of Christ, 1 Tim 6. 13. and they are not written to Elders as having dominion over the faith of the people.  
2. If these Epistles were written to Timothy and Titus not as representing Officers, but as the Church representing the people, yet wanting Officers, and so in a Church-capacity, than it should be Paul's mind that the people in that case destitute of Elders, should preach the word in season and out of season; as Timothy, 2 Tim. 4. 1, 2. and that the people, in that capacity, should, as the approved workmen of God, divide the word of truth rightly, 2 Tim. 2. 15. as well as they ordain Elders, and make and unmake Officers, by the places, 1 Tim. 5. 22, 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 5. yea, and the Apostle should not have ordained Titus to appoint Elders in every city, for he should have appointed the Cities and Churches of only believers to ordain their own Elders.  
Yea 3. the Church void of Elders, by our brethren's way, are the only society and visible Church on earth, who make and unmake, call and excommunicate Officers, and Officers have no hand in it, but accidentally: for, Elders are made, and if heretical, rejected (saith Mr. H.) by the people, having no Elders at all. Ergo, these Epistles must be written to the believers of Ephesus and Crete that yet want Officers, that they may be instructed how to behave themselves in the house of God, how to lay on hands, how to receive accusations, and how to prove and try officers. Yea, Paul should not have written Rules to Timothy and Titus the public Officers, who by their office ought to have no hand in calling or rejecting of Officers by this way.  
Lastly, saith Mr. H. All these are granted by Mr. R.  
Whereas in many pages I dispute against this new visible Church, and grant no such thing, but suppose all the Officers should turn heretical in this, in that case the people in tutelâ inculpata salutis, when they turn Wolves, may withdraw. But 
Paul's Presbyt. cap. 4. ans. to ar. 6. p. 45.  I say not they can authoritatively excommunicate, and make and unmake Officers; and the Officers, when the people turn Familists, may withdraw and remove the Tabernacle.  
Mr. H. God hath set officers in the Church, 1 Cor. 12. 28. Therefore the Church is before officers. 
Page 90, 91.   
The setting of the candle in the candlestick presupposeth the candlestick; the Church is the candlestick, Revel. 1. 20. the officers are the candles. Mr. R. answered, It was not good Logic.  
Ans. I yet maintain this to be naughty Logic, and a naughty Grammatication: and if this be the best Argument for this 
The Logic of Mr. H. God set officers in the Church; Ergo, the Church without officers is a ruling Church before they have Rulers, is naughty. So Mr. Robinson, Justif. of Separate. Pref. p. 9 Bishops and Elders are the only ordinary Governors in the Church— But not essential to the Church. Sure they must be essential to the governed Church. Mr. Robinson ib. p. 295.  new conceit, it cannot stand.  
God (saith Moses, Gen. 2. 7.) form man of the dust, and God breathed in his (that is) in the nostrils of the man, the breath of life.  
Ergo, He is a living man before the soul be breathed in him. It's naughty Logic like this.  
Mr. H. God made man of earth, i. e. the body of man of the earth, and he breathed into the nostrils of that body so made by that mean, the breath of life: to affirm the body was made before the soul was infused; and that the body, which is the subject, to receive the soul, must be in nature before the soul, is very good Logic.  
Ans. The Logic is yet naughty: for Moses saith, God breathed in man a living soul, therefore Adam is a living man before his soul be infused. By this Logic  
Mr. H. will but change my consequence, parallel and large as good as his. And have it thus:  
God breathed in man's body as the matter, a living soul as the form.  
Ergo, the body is in nature before the soul.  
I shall not deny that consequence: but 1. The antecedent is not the Grammatical phrase, and the figurative speech of Moses, as my antecedent is. God breathed a living soul in the nostrils of man: Ergo, he was man before God breathed in him a living soul. So I desire Mr. H. to answer the like quirk of Grammar, Zech. 12. 1.  
God createth the spirit in the midst of man.  
Ergo, he was a man before God created a spirit in the midst of him.  
So Isa. 42. 5.  
God gives breath and spirit to the people, and to those that walk on the earth.  
By this Argument,  
Therefore the people are a living people, moving and walking upon the earth, before God gave them breath and spirit. What more absurd?  
So Mr. H. God hath set officers in the Church:  
Therefore the Church is before the officers.  
So God hath set the members, pastor and people, eye, ear, hands and feet, etc. every one of them in the body, as pleaseth him, 1 Cor. 12. 18. this is as much as, God hath placed single believers also (for believers are not members visible without Gods setting) not yet clothed with adjuncts (as they call them) of officers in the Church, ver. 18. or in the body visible.  
Therefore by the consequence and grammatication every way alike,  
The body or Church visible of combined believers, shall be before the body or Church visible of combined believers. But the Conclusion is absurd. What then hath Mr. H. gained by this Argument? Of necessity then, when the Apostle saith, God hath placed in the Church Apostles, Prophets;  
The word Church, must be the visible Catholic organic Church, which is made organic by such organs as Apostles, Prophets, so seated.  
Like this, God hath created a soul in man, and yet he is a man by the soul that is created in him, and is not a man before it be created in him.  
Mr. H. Beside there's advantage to the cause, that not only the 
Page 92.  subject in which these officers are, is totum essentiale, but by virtue of her choice which is causal of the officers, they are there, saith Mr. H. and therefore in reason must be before them.  
Ans. It's a great disadvantage, and an untruth, to call the 
By Mr. H. the adjuncts beget the subject, the sons the fathers.  Elders and Rulers of a politic ruling visible Church, which is an organical body, the adjuncts thereof: for the members and organs of an organical body, are the integral parts, and so in a physical consideration, the essential parts of the whole integral are not adjuncts by any Logic I know: and if you take away the integral parts wholly, you destroy the integral whole; but if you remove the adjuncts or accidents, you destroy not the subject.  
2. What Logic is this, to make the Fathers, Apostles and Pastors who beget, and the Ministers by whom we believe, and visibly believe, Rom. 10. 14, 15. Eph. 4. 11, 12. 1 Cor. 3. 5. the separable adjuncts of begotten children? This is strange Logic, Whiteness begot Snow! And this is as strange, that this Church of believers is the cause, and the officers the effect; that is, the adjunct is the cause, and the children, the Church of believers, or the subject is the effect, and the effect begets the cause, and is before the cause, and the fruit hath being before the tree, and the children before the father: for if we speak of a constant Rule, as now we must do, when Apostles are removed, if the Church of believers be a visible Church, having the Keys and using them, even to admit officers, and to excommunicate them, they  
1. Dispense censures and govern, who have no call to carry on censures and government, by preaching the Word, or exhorting and praying, for there are no officers as yet, etc. If these be visible believers, who are their fathers who begat them? for there are no officers yet to beget them.  
3. Who begot them by the preaching of the Word? and if they were heathens, and are now converted, who either did convert them or baptise them? for there are no officers as yet: Did every one baptise another? or did unbaptised members baptise their own Ministers who are yet unbaptised? and this argument must be strongly retorted: The officers cannot be the effect of this Church, for they are the only causes of the very materials of this Church; for officers must convert, gather a flock to God, and baptise them, if it be true, that faith comes (in the Lords ordinary and instituted way) by hearing of sent Pastors, Rom. 10. 14.  
Mr. H. The Church (saith Mr. R.) is the candlestick, not 
The Church's Rev. 1. 2. are not a number of unofficed believers, but the believers with Doctors and Teachers as shining Lamps.  simply without candles and lamps; the Church Ministerial is the candlesticks, and the Ministers the shining torches and candles. It's cross to all men's apprehensions, saith Mr. H. that the candlestick should be no longer a candlestick than the candle is in it: They are bought and sold for candlesticks. Is not a subject a subject, though the adjunct be not there? What kind of Logic is this?  
Ans. It's indeed unknown Logic, that officers the fathers should be adjuncts, and the Church of believers begotten by them, as is said, the children should be the subject.  
2. Mr. H. will have a figurative speech against all Logic and Grammar, to be a proper speech, and the candlestick, Rev. 1. 20. to be like the candlesticks of brass or other metal, or wood, which are bought or sold. So when it's said, Christ walketh in the midst of the golden candlesticks, the sense must be, Christ walkesh in the midst of Churohes destitute of Angels and Officers: Whereas he hath promised his presence to the officers, Matth. 28. 20. especially, L●● I am with you— and by this Christ must promise his presence to blind candlesticks, and to Churches wanting officers and Angels. Then the meaning of this, Rev. 2. 5. I will remove the candlestick, must be, O Ephesus, I will remove believers, and that homogeneal body of Saints, as destitute of Angels. Never man dreamt of any such sense as this since the world was. But the true sense is, I will remove a shining Ministry, and the Ordinances, and the eight of the p●…ed Gospel, and the Word of the Kingdom; as Zech. 9 8. Three shepherds also I cut off in one month— Then said I, I will not feed you. Amos 8. 12. They shall seek the word of the Lord, and shall not find it. Mat. 21. 43. The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, Acts 13. 46, 47. Let Mr. H. show how the Church without the Minister is called the golden candlestick? And where the Church of believers, without the stars and torches, is called The light of the world? Godly and found Interpreters, Pareus, Pignetus, Marlorat, Piscater, Di●●ati, English Divines, The Church are candlesticks, 
Pareus Com. in Apocalyp. in loc. Candelabris assimilantur— quia Ecclesia gestat facem coelest is doctrinae. Pignet. Apoc. 1. Quia in ea v●rum lumen lucet. Marlor. Quia in ea sunt Prophetae, Apostoli, Evang●listae— quia lucent per saluberrimam vitae doctrinam. Piscat. Apoc. 1● observ. 39 Candelabra illa quae vidisti— in vera Ecclesia instar auri splendet & lucet pura doctrina. So Diodati, English Annotations, Beza.  because they bear (saith Pareus) the torch of heavenly Doctrine. So Pignetus, Marlorat, Piscator.  
Mr. H. A Corporation of Aldermen, before they choose a Major, is a free Corporation: Ergo, the Church of believers is a visible 
Mr. H. Survey, p. 92.  Church before it have officers. A man cannot be a husband before he have a wife, yet he may be a man wooing woman before he can make her his wise.  
Ans. 1. The comparison is most unlike. For,  
1. A Corporation of Aldermen is a Corporation of free 
It is not a like in a Church wanting officers, as in a civil corporation wanting Rulers. Papists so argue. See Jac. Gualther. in Tabula Chronographic. Secul. 1. ad an. 100 verita. sect. 1. p. 150.  Citizens and Magistrates, such as Aldermen are, though they yet want a Magistrate supreme, or a Major. The Church void of all officers 〈◊〉 not a body capable of governing in a formal way.  
2. Say they want Aldermen, they had by nature an intrinsacal power to choose to themselves private men to be their Rulers, whereas before they were no Rulers: But the making and laying on of hands upon men, to make them Elders, agrees not to believers, because visible believers, by the Law of Nature, but by a positive Law of God is given to a certain number of Presbyters or Elders, 1 Tim 4. 14. as is above proved.  
3. Say that forty Pagans, not baptised, were made by the travels of some private Christian, man or woman, visible Saints, forty unbaptized could not make unbaptised Pag●… their Rulers and Pastors, as they could make some of their members their Civil Magistrates.  
4. That Corporation doe● he get and create their Rulers, and their Rulers, who are posteriour to them, did not beget them, and make them free Citizens'. But officers ●●cording to the fixed Rule of the Gospel, now when Apostles cease to be, are the only fathers who baget visible professor.  
Mr. H. If the Church ●●net a Church without officers, then 
Page 92.  as often as the officers die, the Church di●… also.  
2. When the Church for gross heresias rejecteth the officers, the Church must destroy herself, while she laboureth her own preservation. Doth a Corporation, when they put out a wicked Magistrate out of his place, therefore destroy their own Liberties, and nullify their Corporation? Such Arguments may seem ●n●ugh to cast a cause, and yet Mr. R. by them can turn all aside.  
Ans. It's unfit that a man should so reflect upon his Brethren, 
It is not absurd that a politic body destroy its own politic being, when they rem●ve Lions & Leopards which destroyed h●m.  when there is so little strength.  
1. The Pastors being the husband, and the Church the wife, sure, if the wife destroy the husband to save herself, she destroys her own wife ship, while she labours the preservation of herself as a woman: and if the Church destroy all the heretical officers, is there any absundity to say, She destroyeth her own Ministerial feeding, her own sacramental communion, by which she is one body with all the Saints on earth, as the Brethren grant; and its sure from 1 Cor. 10. 16, 17. & 12. 13. as touching any spiritual well-being and feeding by these wretched feeders: but they have no authority to do it. I see no inconvenience, why a Corporation may not out, and lay aside all their Aldermen and Major, if they turn Lions and Leopards, and so destroy the present individual Government, while they labour their own safety, and the safety of their privileges. But the case is not alike, except Mr. H. prove, That the Church of believers hath the same positive power of Government intrinsical without their officers, and only fathers who begat them to Christ, to use the Keys, and formally to excommunicate them, as a free City hath over their Magistrates.  
2. If the officers die, sure the organical Church dies, and the organical, and the ministerial and politic essence of that visible Church, as it is totum integrale, dies.  
2. I retort the Argument. When the Church of the Jews, Acts 13. & 18. turns heretical, and blasphemes, and refuses to be the married wife (I speak in our brethren's language) if the Church of officers reject them, and turn to others, it shall not follow.  
1. That the officers destroy their own husbandly power, while they labour their own preservation: which is the great absurdity that Mr. H. puts upon Mr. R. as enough to cast the cause.  
2. Shall it follow, That the officers without the people, or governing without, yea contrary to their consent, is a true visible Church? in no sort.  
Mr. H. When the tents are removed, they are not the shepherd's tents: to remove the candlestick is to remove the Ministry, and 
Page 92, 93.  remove all the Officers, the Church is not a body visible eating one bread, 1 Cor. 10. 16, 17. So Mr. R. But Mr. H. answers, Yet they are called tents fit to receive shepherds, and are the same they were before the shepherds were chosen, and remain the same: To remove the candlestick is to remove the Ministry, because Ministry and Ministers have their dependence on the Church; destroy the man the whole, you destroy the parts; but it holds not chose: its true in a Ministerial Church, i. e. an organicum totum, when you take away any part, you lame the integrity of it; but you dedestroy not the essence of it, as it is totum essentiale.  
Ans. It is enough to me, if ye remove all Officers and Shepherds, it is no ruling Church, though the fitness of choice (which is no act of government) do still remain; yet the fitness to ordain and to excommunicate remains not, for they never had it; Luke distinguishes the one from the other, Acts 6. 3, 5. the multitude 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, choosed not the Apostles; but the twelve Apostles, 
To remove the candlestick is to remove the Ministry, and so the church is not a politic church any more.  not the multitude, ordained them by praying and laying on of hands, v 6. as the Elders do, and they only, in the New Testament, 1 Tim. 4. 14. 1 Tim. 5. 22.  
2. It is good that Mr. H. grants that to remove the Candlestick, is to remove the minist●…y; I hope he means the shining, burning, and guiding Ministers and Watchmen, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2. Mat. 5. 14. joh. 5. 35. But in the other page 91, 32. It is cross to all men's apprehensions (saith he) that the Candlestick should include Candles and Lamps.  
3. Nor is it true in Mr. H. his way, that to remove the candlestick, is to remove the Ministry; for there remaineth a preaching and a praying Church (which is at the ordaining of Officers, and sending them, Act. 1●15. & 6. 24. Act. 13. 1, 2, 3. Act. 6. 6.) which doth only make and unmake officers, saith Mr. H.  
4. Destroy the whole (saith he) and you destroy the parts; but it holds not, chose: why not chose? if you destroy all the parts (otherwise the Logic is naught) take away eyes, and ears, and hands, and feet, and all the integral parts, or all the essential parts, and you destroy the whole, in any sense; too much of this Logic Mr. H. gives us.  
5. Take away (saith he) in an Organic or Ministerial body a member, you lame the integrity. Now the ministry and officers are removed by the people, because they are heretical, as Mr. H. teacheth page 90. I pray you, remains there a ministerial or organic body? no, saith M. H. there remains a homogeneous body.  
4. Take away any part, you lame the integrity; take then away the ministry, you lame the body. O Logic! the ministry is a separable adjunct to Mr. H. page 92. Here it is an integral part; is an integral part an adjunct? is the eye an adjunct of the organical body? is the integrity hurt, because a separable adjunct is removed?  
5. Nor is this true, take away any part in an organical body, and you lame the integrity; it is only true of an organical part, not of any part; take away ten members, believers only, the Church remaineth an entire, and unlamed integral body: let ten free members of a City be removed by death, yet the City remains an unmaimed entire body of Citizens, ruled by Major and Aldermen.  
6. Remove the ministry, the essence and organical body remaineth not.  
Mr. H. That which is added, is more beside the cause; It is granted 
Pag. 93.  where Officers are not, there is no communion of the Sacraments, is there therefore no Church-communion?  
Ans. If this communion be removed, there is no communion of the Church, which being many members, is one body, 1 Cor. 10. 16, 17. & 12. 12, 13. And what reason but a Church, and the only instituted visible Church in the new Testament, as the book of Discipline of N. E. makes it, should be a complete Church 
The way of the Churches of Christ in N. E. c. 1. sect. 1. prop. 1. p. 1, 2.  in being and operation, and partake of all Church-communion, though it want the officers, which are to Mr. H. but poor harmless separable adjuncts? page 92. and this is somewhat for the cause.  
M. H. We have done now with the first Quere, and made it clear, That this Church is before all Officers, and may be without them.  
Ans. So Mr. H. hath done, and made it as clear as midnight darkness, with whole two Arguments, the one whereof is a poor Grammatication, and scarce that, and the other a begging of the question; that there is a ruling Church before, and without officers, which may make and unmake officers.   

CHAP. II.  
Of the Nature and Being of a Presbyterial Church.  
Mr. H. The qualification of the Church as totum essentiale, 
Survey par. 1. c. 9 p. 94.  in the order and precedency of it, in regard of her true Officers we have dispatched. Now we speak of it in comparison with a Presbyterian Church.  
Ans. Let not then the Reader expressed any visible Church organical to be spoken of; Organs are but separable adjuncts, the only Church spoken of, and acknowledged by Mr. H. and our brethren, is an homogeneal Church of only believers, which Mr. H. now calls the Church, before he called it a Church, and this Church, page 94. but we ask the question whether the word Church, Mat. 18. 17. Tell the Church, 1 Cor. 1. 2. Unto the Church of God which is at Corinth. And 2 Cor. 1. 1. 1 Thes. 1. 1. 2 Tim. 2. 15. be this congregational Church without the separable adjuncts of officers: and the truth is, the place Matth. 18. The principal copy of the Independent Church, can mean no Church according to our brethren's way: for no reason can say 
Officers can be no essential parts of the visible Church by Mr. H. his way.  that the Keys of the Kingdom of Heaven, Matth. 16 19 and the power of binding and losing. Matth. 18. 17, 18. are given to the separable adjuncts of the Church: but such are the officers, saith Mr. H. page 92. and to such as are no essential parts of the instituted Church, and of the only visible Church of the New Testament. But M. H. makes it clear, as he says, that the Congregational Church is before the Officers, and may be, and is without them, therefore officers can be no essential parts of the Church of the New Testament. And so this Church void of Officers, must be to our brethren, the first and principal subject of all Government, Rule, Keyes, Officers, and what not?  
Mr. H. being to evert Presbyterial Government, he begins 
Pag. 94, 95.  at the Pillars.  
The Presbyterian Church consists of three Pillars.  
1. There must be several congregations, made entire of such members to make up an integral body of Rulers and Ruled.  
Ans. There is a crack in this Pillar, it is not essential to a Presbyterian Church that all the congregation be entire, and form 
The two first Pillars of a Presbyterial Church, to wit, 1. framed Churches. 2. Formal commissioners sent to Presbyteries, are to us no pillars, to Mr. H. they are.  Churches, having their own Officers distinct from the offices of others, we cannot determine that Mathias had a determinate flock, to which only he was a fixed Pastor, and Peter another, and john a third; we rather judge the whole twelve fed in common, sometimes in one congregation, in this house, daily, and sometimes in another; but all the huge thousands could not feed in one house, otherwise many congregations framed and fixed, or not framed and fixed, are all under one Presbytery, as the Learned and Reverend Assembly at Westminster teacheth. If the Pillars be dreams, the house that M. H. storms is also a dream.  
To the second Pillar we shall speak hereafter, if the Lord will.  
3. These Churches send Rulers, by way of delegation, to whom they submit.  
Ans. This also is a faulty Pillar.  
1. They so send as they may be present to hear, dispute, dissent, to what is amiss, nor are the Pastor's delegates.  
2. They submit to them not simply.  
But first, reserving judgement of discretion.  
Secondly, and with liberty to appeal.  
3. The whole Elders of six congregations in a City may all meet in one common Presbytery, without any delegation; and that is a Presbyterial Church, as is the meeting of a Congregational Eldership.  
Mr. H. To their power of jurisdiction the Churches must submit— but it ariseth from a power of order or office to preach.  
Ans. Well said, then cannot they exercise the highest acts of jurisdiction, to excommunicate all the Elders, as Mr. H. saith, page 92. they do, for the people hath no power of order or official power to preach the Gospel, and administer the Seals, page 92. and yet Mr. H. saith, they may communicate all their officers.  
Mr. H. There is a jurisdiction official that issues only from the office, this the officers have.  
Answ. This Lenitive is a Corrosive. Here is the matter, the people have jurisdiction, and do excommunicate, but not by an official jurisdiction, but by another power: So a Midwife baptizeth in the Roman Church, but not by a power of Order, as a Priest, but its valid. An Usurper judgeth, but not by a power derived from the Royal Power of the Sovereign Ruler.  
2. By what Scripture can any power of the Keys given by Christ only to the Church of believers, be given to separable adjuncts of the Church?  
Mr. H. None is a steward, unless appointed over the Family by Christ, 1 Cor. 12. 27, 28. Hence Papists and Prelates err, officers and offices are coronation-mercies, and proceed from Christ's ascension, Eph. 4. 11, 12.  
2. They are means of worship instituted by him.  
3. He only can bless them.  
Answ. 1. None are stewards to put in and put out stewards and excommunicate them, but such as are appointed of God: But believers without officers are no stewards at all.  
2. Censuring and excommunicating is an authoritative way of edifying, 2 Cor. 10. 8. 1 Cor. 5. 4, 5. 1 Thess. 3. 14. show in 
People that are no stewards have no authority to censure, or thereby to edify.  all the Word, where believers and private Christians are to edify and build up in the faith their Pastors, and that in an authoritative way. The people so must  
2. Be coronation-mercies, and gifts given of Christ, ascending to heaven for the perfecting of the Pastors, and the work of the Ministry, to gather in Apostles, Evangelists, Pastors to Christ. Whereas the Text saith the contrary, That Pastors were given to gather in the people, and the people, or unofficed Brethren, were not given to gather in Apostles.  
3. If Excommunication be a Worship administered by the Brethren upon Pastors; then must a promise be made to unofficed Brethren, who excommunicate, Behold, I send you, as Matth. 10. 16. This we read not.  
Mr. H. He that is called and appointed an officer according to God and the Rules of the Gospel, as he needs no other power but that of his office, to authorise him to execute it; So there is no power by rule or right that can hinder him in the due execution thereof.  
Ans. This is a ground against both Episcopacy and Presbytery. Presbyters may preach in other congregations than their own, if they be officers over it, as Bishops may in many congregations. 
How pastors are regulated in the exercise of their calling.   
2. The Pastor, if called of God, may do his office, without horrowing a power from the Pastor of pastors to do it; but he must preach hic & nunc in an orderly way, upon a day, and time of the day appointed by the Church.  
3. He hath an office to preach and administer the seals any where, yet must he have the call by desire, consent, or some other way, before he can do it in another congregation.  
4. Nor can he rule or administer censures as his alone, extra collegium, without the authoritative concurrence of the Elders, and tacit consent of the people, though he be an appointed officer of Christ. So this ground is weak. Other weak grounds we shall consider after.   

CHAP. III.  
The Arguments of Mr. H. against the Presbyterian Churches are removed as weak.  
MR. H. Arg. 1. If the Churches combined have no more 
Survey c 〈◊〉. par. 1. p. 99  power than they had before they were combined, they can exercise no more jurisdiction than before; and therefore have no Presbyterian power, are no Presbyterian Churches.  
But they have no more power after their combination, than before: Ergo.  
The Assumption, where the doubt only lies, is made out thus: They who have no more office and officers than they had before, they have no more jurisdiction; as in the first ground, power of jurisdiction flows from power of office. But they have no more officers, for each send their own; therefore they have no more power.  
Ans. Mr. H. says, The doubt is only in the assumption, and 
The Churches united have more power extensively after they are united than before; but not intensively, & in nature more  takes the proposition for undeniable: The major is false; for by this argument, two single congregations each a hundred in number, lying so near as they may most conveniently meet, cannot lawfully unite in one Church, for the better attaining the end of Christ, which is edification: for say they be the same number of offices and officers, than they can exercise no more power of jurisdiction, after the combination over two hundred, than each of them did over one hundred. But the Conclusion is absurd. Yea, this Argument destroys the Synod, Acts 15. for suppose the number of offices and officers to be equal in the Synod, after the Synodical combination, and in the Church of either Antioch only, or jerusalem only, before the combination, which is a facile and ordinary supposition; then they can exercise no more Synodical power (it matters not what be the kind, whether of power of jurisdiction, or not) after the combination of these Churches than before; and so the judgement of a Synod should be no more than the judgement of a Congregation. But the consequence is absurd. Let Mr. H. see to it, and deal with Mr. Cotton to answer him.  
2. To the Proposition. If the Churches combined have no more power extensively, feeding a larger number after the combination than before, than they can exercise no more jurisdiction, no more, by way of extension; it is false: for their united power is extended to a larger number now, than the divided power was before to each single flock. If the Churches combined have more power intensively, of the same species and nature after the combination than before, than they can exercise no more jurisdiction intensively than before. It's true, it is the same power of Christ, the same valid Excommunication, the same binding and losing as to the specific nature of binding and losing, that is exercised by five Churches in a City, and exercised by ten Churches about. We multiply not species, to make all congregations to differ in nature and specie, as Mr. H. doth against Logic; whereas they have the same essentials, Christ the Head, the same Ordinances, Seals, the same Faith; but than it shall never follow, Therefore they have no Presbyterian power over many Churches, and therefore they are not distinct Presbyterian Churches in local distinction; magis & minus non variant specious. Nor are Presbyterian, and Provincial and National Churches different in nature, but only in extent of Jurisdiction.  
3. It's a wide mistake, That a Presbyterian Church hath its formal essence from a voluntary actual combination in such 
Actual voluntary combination is no pillar of the Presbyterian Church.  bounds, or such a circuit more or less: that is not a Pillar of Presbyterian Churches; for their near association, by dwelling where they may edify or scandalise one another, gives them right to be an associated Church, not simply habitation, but the habitation of such and such professors in covenant with God, baptised, and giving themselves up in profession to Christ as disciples, before there be a formal consent, they are obliged to associate: yea, nor doth that voluntary combination make a Presbyterial Church.  
Mr. H. Arg. 2. If the Presbyterian Ministers have jurisdiction, 
Page 99, 100  then, over all the Churches of the combination, or only ●ver some; not over some only, for that is against the definition of a Presbyterian Church: Therefore they must have jurisdiction over all the Churches, ten or sixteen. If they have jurisdiction over all these, than they are Officers, Pastors, Teachers, Ruling-Elders in office to them all; for there must be an office, and so officer before jurisdiction; and there is no jurisdiction exercised but by an officer. To say they are Pastors of them all, is to make a road and ready way for Pluralities, Non-Residencies.  
Ans. Mr. H. gives us, as also the Dissenting Brethren in 
Twelve pastors feed 12 congregations in Jerusalem, or in some large city in common, not being fixed any of them to any one congregation, all the 12 are pastors to all the 12 congregations, & yet it is not possible physically, that any one man can reside in all the 12 congregations; here shall be divers non-resident & Pluralists, but not in a Prelatical sense.  the Assembly at Westminster did, in stead of Scripture, a number of supposed incongruities, which with equal weight fall upon their own way, as upon ours. For suppose that the twelve Apostles, Act. 2. & 4. & 6. for divers years were Pastors to the many thousands that made up divers, eight or ten congregations, who daily convened from house to house, Act. 4. 46. & 5. 42. in jerusalem; and that all the twelve feed all the ten congregations in common, Mathias not being a fixed Pastor to this congregation more than to this; nor Peter a fixed Pastor to this flock rather than to this, which is a thing most ordinary in great Cities, where there be 12 Flocks, and 24 Pastors, and variety of gifts by interchange, proves more edifying. All the Pastors have jurisdiction, yea and Pastoral charge over every one of the twelve. Then 2. must they be Pastors and Teachers to every one of the twelve, and because all the 24 cannot every one of them be residents and dwellers in all and every congregation of the ten or twelve Churches in jerusalem, (that is physically impossible) here shall be Pluralities and non-resident, and that which our Brethren call Diocesan Prelates here.  
2. That the Presbyterial preachers be pastors and teachers, habitu, and actu primo, and in common to all the Churches of the combination, in acts of common concernment, though they be not actu secundo, actual labourers, proper and fixed pastors, residents and dwellers in every congregation (for that was physically impossible to the Elders of jerusalem) to all and every congregation, is not absurd, but necessary; and the charge of Pluralities, and Prelatical non-resident, follows by no Logic, except you call the twelve Apostles, who preached fixedly at jerusalem some years, non-resident, because that they could not every one of them dwell in every family of so many thousands at once: In which sense, multitudes of Independent Ministers shall be non-resident; and suppose there shall be a common Treasury to pay the labourers their wages, and that collected out of the goods of all the thousands so combined, the Independent Ministers upon the same account must be Pluralists, and receive wages from many, to whom they neither are nor can be fixed, and proper and peculiarly feeding Pastors.  
3. Wisdom may forbid the Brethren to use this Argument, There is no jurisdiction exercised, but by an officer: for the whole people, men and women, the only Church instituted in the New Testament, or their unofficed Male Church, the Fraternity exercise the highest Jurisdiction, and excommunicate all their officers, and yet they are not officers by their own principles.  
Mr. H. Mr. R. denies the Assumption, That they bear the relation of proper Pastors to every one of these Congregations.  
Mr. H. Proper Pastors they must be to all. If the relation of Eldership to a Classical Church be founded upon the same office that a Pastor hath to his particular congregation, than the Elders bear that same relation of Watchmen to a Classical Church, which a Pastor doth to a particular flock: for where there is the same office of a Pastor, there is the same relation of Watchman and Pastor, the one issuing from the other. But the first is said by Mr. R. Lib 2. 335. also they put forth authoritative acts, which issue only from proper Pastors, they are proper Pastors to those upon whom they can exercise such acts, else they had no warrant to put them forth.  
Answ. I yet in this sense deny the assumption, that they are proper Pastors, that is, actual employers of their labours of feeding, both by fixed teaching and governing, to all the flocks of the classical Church; for that is impossible, except they could be in many Congregations at once so feeding. But I deny not, but constantly teach, that the Presbyterian Pastors are properly, that is, formally, essentially, habitu, actu primo, Pastors in relation 
The Elders of the Presbytery are fixed and proper Pastors, only to one flock and Pastor in common, in matters of common concernment to all the rest of though associate Churches.  to all the flocks, not of the classical Church only, but of all the visible Churches on earth. As a Physician by covenant actually employed to attend all the sick of such a City, suppose Norwich, is their proper Physician, yet so as he is essentially a Physician to all in England, who shall by providence employ him. An exquisite Gardener by paction, is a proper Gardener to such a man who conduces or hires him a certain time, to labour such a plot of ground, yet so as essentially and actu primo, he is a Gardener to all the Country round about who shall employ him. So is one a proper Schoolmaster to teach Grammar and Rhetoric to the children of such a City, yet so as he is a Schoolmaster to all the children of the country who shall employ him. Christ sends his Pastor Archippus intentionally to feed all his flocks in all fields, and he is essentially a Pastor to them all; but for the more convenient attaining of Christ's end, he fixes him by the choice of the people to the Church of Coloss, not as a Husband to a Wife.  
2. Mr. H. With his little finger aims not to twitch the probation of this.  
1. Where there is the same office of Pastor, there is the same relation of Watchman and Pastor. It is false, a Physician, a Pastor providentially fixed to cure and feed this City by special covenant, hath a more near relation to cure and feed this City; having a twofold relation, both by the calling in general of a Physician and Pastor, and by a special solemn oath, and hand-writ to this City; and both the Physician is the same public Physician, and the Pastor the same public Watchman officio, by office essentially, habitu, actu primo, to all the sick bodies and sick souls in the country. A mother is the same mother to ten children, but hath a special relation to the eldest as her heir.  
2. As born with more pain and labour then all the other nine.  
3. As more dearly loving him then all the other nine. Here is the same place, the same officer, but sundry particular relations.  
3. Mr. H. leaves that unproved, the Presbyterian Pastors cannot put forth authoritative acts Pastoral, but hoc ipso, they must be proper, i. e. their fixed Pastors, and made theirs by the particular 
A Pastor may administer the Supper of the Lord, which he doth as a Pastor to these of another Congregation, yet is he not a fixed proper Pastor to those of another congregation. Cotton Keys. c. 6. n. 3. p. 25. Mr. H. Survey. par. 2. c. 2. p. 65. Way of the Churches of Christ in New England. c. 6. sect. 6. pag. 103 Hr. H. Survey. par. 4. c. 1. p. 1, 2, 3, 4. Our brethren destroy Synods, though they give them the name of ordinances of Christ. Mr. H. Survey. par. 4. p. 1, 2, 3. When no more is given to a Synod but to counsel and advise, it is for that no more an ordinance of God, than a private man or woman giving a counsel is an ordinance of God.  choice of the people to feed and govern these, toward who● they put forth these pastoral acts; because indeed it is adultery to them who are no husbands, to put forth pastoral acts of governing, upon those to whom they are not fixed Pastors; ye● they tender the Supper to foreign members; and so this is a rotten pillar of this way.  
2. Forsaken by Mr. Cotton, and the way of the Churches of N. E. and by Mr. H. himself.  
3. It destroys Synods and all communion of Churches; for Mr. Cotton yieldeth, as truth of the Gospel taught by a Minister of the Gospel, bindeth to faith and obedience, not only because it is Gospel, but because also it is taught by a Minister, for his calling sake, seeing Christ hath said, whoso receiveth you, receiveth me; they bind not only materially, but formally, for the Synods sake. I see not how this can be answered, though indeed the Discipline of N. E. and Mr. H. say the contrary both of this and their own grounds; for Elders in Synods put forth authoritative and pastoral acts, to these Churches of which these Elders are not proper and fixed Pastors; but Pastors they are to these Churches, as to all the Churches of the combination, else they cannot warrantably put forth acts pastoral, for their feeding and governing to edification, except it be said, a Synod is no ordinance of Christ; which all the Brethren and Mr. H. himself deny. All acknowledge a Synod to be an ordinance of Christ. But the truth is, they but mock the Reader in so saying, for they give no more to it, but an act of charity, to counsel, as one brother counsels another: Intuitu charitatis, saith the Discipline of New England. And so Mr. H.  
For, what 1. avails it more to say a Synod is an Ordinance of God, because they can give a charitative counsel, then to say one single Believer is an Ordinance of God, or a Woman who can counsel a man? The Synod than is no positive Ordinance of divine institution; for upon the same ground, if a Synod be an Ordinance of God, because they may counsel the Churches, we may appoint a new Ordinance of a Synod. For, first, one refuting. Another for rebuking. A third for confirming. And a fourth for comforting.  
2. It is but a mocking of the world, to say the association of Churches is an ordinance of God, for they can give counsel to the Churches of the bounds (what may be replied, had I time, is soon washed away.)  
But first, so can twenty other Churches without the bounds 
Private Christians and women giving counsel to men may as well be called an ordinance of Christ as a Synod.  of these Churches; so can many eminent Christians in another Congregation, not in office, give a counsel by way of charity to a Synod convened synodically, shall they for that be a Synod of a Synod? and shall they be an Ordinance of Christ distinct from a Congregational Church for that?  
Yea, Abigail a woman, a captive maid, gave, the one a divine counsel to David, and the other to Naaman the Syrian. Shall women therefore be made new ordinances of God? and if neither the one counsel nor the other have any weight from the givers of the counsel, but only from the word; it is in vain to name the one an ordinance of God, more than the other: as for reverence to the persons, a Synod of Elders, more than one single man's counsel, adds not the eighth part of a feather as touching authoritative weight to the Counsel, if the Synods counsel amount to nothing more in point of a divine ordinance; then Mr. H. saith, any Counsel may lay a burden upon any 
Survey. par. 4. c. 1. p. 6.  man's conscience; so any Christian that shall publish and preach that 1 Cor. 6. 18. flee fornication— may lay a burden upon every soul, not from the authority of him that speaks, but because it is Scripture that is spoken; and this is all the authority of Synods. Would the Lord appoint Men, Elders, and Brethren, and Churches to come many hundred miles to heal rend and spoilt Churches, and the result of all is a mere counsel which a woman at home may give? for the Scripture by the law of Nature warrants women to give this as well as men, 2 Sam. 20. 16, 17— 21, 22. 1 Sam. 25. 25, 26, 27.— 32, 33, 34. 2 King. 5. 3, 4, 13. And God reveals to women, servants, poor ones, as much of this as to others of higher place.  
Nor shall it help the matter, to say, it is safer to seek counsel from men then from women, from many then from one; for in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.  
Ans. It is true.  
But 1. This is no ground to seek to a Synod of Fathers and Elders of the bounds of these, who are no Pastors nor Elders to us, and can put forth upon us no Synodical, no Pastoral acts; upon this ground, we should select Counsellors out of one or many Churches, that have no relation to us; and so this is nothing for such a Synod, but only for many gracious Counsellors, private or public, nothing at all for a Synod of Elders.  
2. When all is done, their Counsel is but a Counsel, that hath as much weight, as it hath conformity with the rule of the Word, and so hath the counsel of a Woman, or a servant. And it is considerable that the book of Discipline of New England hath no Chapter nor Discourse of Synods, which shows they little value them.  
Mr. H. These authoritative act which are put forth in other 
Pag. 101.  Church's issue from him, either as a Pastor, or as no Pastor; If as no Pastor, than acts of jurisdiction may flow from him that is no Ruler. Mr. R. will gainsay this, if they proceed from him as Pastor, then either as Pastor of his own Church, which cannot be; or of another Church, and then one man may have two Pastoral offices. And all these Churches must be either his flock, or not: his flock they must be, if he be Shepherd to them, for that the nature of relatives requires, the combined Churches are many distinct flocks, and he cannot be a Pastor of many flocks.  
Ans. This is the former argument with a new dress, quod fui● demonstrandum. But did Mr. H. believe his Topick probabilities would be received for demonstrations?  
1. To that, These acts proceed from him either as Postor, or as no Pastor. Let him be a Pastor to a Congregation compassed 
A Pastor constantly feeds his own flock, and administers the Lords supper to forty persons of forty congregations about, as Mr. Cotton and Mr. H. grant: but he hath not forty pastoral offices for that.  about with nine single Congregations in jerusalem, in convenient nearness, he feeds his own particular flock, as a fixed Pastor actually employing his constant labours upon them, and by the same pastoral office, as Pastor habitu, actu primo, to all Churches, and more nearly to these nine, he exercises acts of government for edifying all the ten in points of concernment, which necessarily must concern them all; and it no more doth follow by a shadow of consequence, that he exerciseth two pastoral offices over many Churches, than the same Pastor exerciseth three Pastoral offices, or four over his own particular flock, as if it were four flocks, because he preacheth pastorally to some, and administers the Lords Supper to others, as to strangers.  
2, Others as Infants, he baptises as unconfirmed members. Or,  
3. Others he excommunicates.  
4. Others he converts as finding them no visible Saints; by one and the same office he feeds and governs all.  
2. The same argument is retorted, Archippus administers the Lords Supper (as Mr. H. his book of Discipline, and Mr. Cotton 
Mr. H. Survey. par. 2. c. 2. p. 65 Way of the Churches of N. E. c. 6. sect. 6. p. 103.  teach, and the word warrants him to do) to forty godly visible Saints out of forty Sister-Congregations, either as a Pastor, or no Pastor, to these forty; either as to his own flock, or not his own flock, not as no Pastor. Mr. H. Mr. Cotton (except they follow Socinians) and all shall gainsay that; if as a pastor, then by Mr. hooker's argument, he must have Pastoral offices over forty Churches. So the same argument destroys the Synods, though some way sound established by Mr. Cotton; 
Survey. par. 2. c. 2. p. 65.  yea, Mr. H. grants it is lawful to tender the seal of the Lords Supper to those of other Congregations, yea, he is warranted by the word so to do, 1 Cor. 10. 16, 17. 1 Cor. 12. 13. Eph. 2. 12, 13. Eph. 4. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 11, 12, 13. It is against the Congregational way; and it is not equal to bring, quod fuit demonstrandum, such strong demonstrations (as he calls them) against Mr. R. and the Presbyterian Church, which destroys his own congregational way.  
3. If he act as a Pastor and Shepherd to them, his flock they must be, for that the nature of Relatives require. This is a mistake of the nature of Relatives; for the adequate and complete correlate to which every ordinary pastor is referred as a Shepherd to the flock, as a husband to the wife, actu primo, is all the Churches on earth, as a physician is referred to all the sick on earth, not adequatly to this one sick person, but actu secundo, in the actual exercises of the ministerial calling, very pastor indeed now is referred to one flock, as a fixed providential feeder, and to these round about, the same way in acts of government that concern associate Churches: but it follows not, as is said, that he is a proper fixed pastor to these Churches round about; for these words, feed the flock, which is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, amongst you, 1 Pet 5. 1. & Act. 20. 28. Take heed to all the flock over which the Holy Ghost hath made you Overseers, Have no such sense as feed the one single Congregation only, as a husband to your wife, that is in Ephesus, and beware of the spiritual adultery, of taking pastoral care of the other Churches of Christ that are, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, amongst you. Mr. Cotton saith, the Church in the Canticles (and say I, the pastors also) take care not only for her own members, but for her little Sister, which she thought had no breasts, Cant. 8. 8. And I hence infer, that a pastor is to take a pastoral care of the Churches associate, Acts 8. 14. 2 Cor. 11. 16. for they were among them as well as the single congregation. And when Paul saith, take heed to the whole flock, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, he meaneth not only a single congregation, but divers congregations and many sheep in the flocks of divers congregations, as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifieth not a few, but exceeding many in Scripture, Phil. 2. 21. 1 Tim. 2. 6. Heb. 2. 9 1 Tim. 2. 4. joh. 11. 48. joh. 12. 32. Rev. 5. 13.  
Mr. H. The Presbytery are Elders to the classical Church, saith Mr. R.) in some respect, not simply 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, not in things proper to 
Pag. 102.  each congregation, but in things common to all the united Churches, to wit, in things which rather concern the consociation of the thirty Churches (about) than the thirty Churches combined in particular. By our Saviour's rule, Matth. 18. (saith Mr. H.) the offender is privately,  
First, to be rebuked.  
Secondly, then before two.  
Thirdly, before the Church nearest the Congregation. The classical principles admit not this.  
2. Suppose the man in his private fault continue obstinate, this obstinacy is re● propria, proper to the Congregation, why may not the Congregation without the Presbytery then oast him out? for this pertinacy was made known only to the Congregation or Church.  
Object. But the neighbouring Churches must avoid his company upon knowledge given.  
Answ. So must the Churches of another Presbytery or Classis, or of another Province, and therefore there is no more need the one should have a hand in the censure, than the other.  
Ans. 1. The congregation in private scandals by our principles 
The place Mat. 18. is mistaken by our brethren, contrary to the scope, and to the mind of Fathers, Doctors, Divines, Counsels, Martyrs. So widely D. Bills. mistaketh the place M●t. 18. Perpet. go. vernm. c. 4.  (which Mr. H. it seems, knows not) doth admonish, and the offended person is to admonish, according to the order of Christ, Matth. 18.  
2. Mr. H. taketh for granted, that the place Matth. 18. is a Rule for removing only private scandals: 2. And that by the word (Church) Matth. 18. is meant only his own Independent congregation.  
3. That Christ, Matth. 18 shows of no removing of scandals between two visible Saints dwelling in one Christian family, who by the principles of Mr. H. may by their own free choice be members of divers congregations: (a strange dream!)  
4. He supposes it must be only one single man that trespasseth against a brother, but if ten, or many sister-Churches transgress against sister-Churches. Learned Whitaker, Calvin, Beza, Pareus, all Protestant Divines, all Fathers, all learned Doctors, Papists, Lutherans, Doctors, Counsels, all the Martyrs who by the Text Matth. 18. appeal to a General Council, did but abuse the Text, in applying it to Synods: whereas Tell the Church, is now found to be only the single congregation; whereas the contrary is sure. There is a figure  
1. In thy brother, for he means many brethren, within or without the congregation.  
2. By trespassing, by a Sydecdoche, he means all scandals; else we were not to complain of public scandals to the Church.  
3. By the Church, he means all Churches respectively, as those of Antioch, in case of scandalous doctrine, Tell a Synod, Acts 15. 2. The obstinacy is not proper to that congregation, if public, the offence of it stumbles the neighbouring Churches. But  
4. It will not follow, that All of another Province should have 
Why only the nearest Churches have real hand in healing offences.  hand in the censure, as well as the Presbytery, because those of another Province may hear of it, for that is non causa pro causa: for they are not in danger to be leavened, so as those that are nearer; and the wisdom of Christ hath accommodated Discipline to our bodily craziness. For as when there be twelve thousand members at jerusalem, he will not have them all to meet at one house, since they have twelve Apostles to teach them, but in sundry congregations, Acts 2. 46. & 5 42. not can they partake of the seals in one house, nor can they personally watch over one another, as the new Church-covenant teacheth: So neither will he have Elders 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, in cities, where many thousands were baptised, purging their own body, and it's not to be supposed that actual government for ordinary scandals should be by the personal presence of the Elders of remote Presbyteries and Provinces, far less of the Elders of the whole Catholic visible Church. For Nature, Reason, and the practice of the Apostles would say, Except the scandal be more than ordinary wide and spreading, only the Churches nearest to be edified or stumbled, should have hand in healing and censuring; though the whole Catholic and visible Church have also here some influence, to wit, tacit and virtual in that common Rule of Discipline which regulates the whole Catholic body, as is said hereafter.  
Mr. H. The second difference assigned by Mr. R. is, that the Presbytery takes care rather of the regulating of the acts of governing in all these Churches, than the governed Churches. 
The differences between Elders governing in the Presbytery or Classis, and of the same Elders in their fixed congregations.   
Mr. H. They express their care in judicial acts, and that directly and immediately upon scandals and scandalous persons of any congregation.  
Ans. Mr. H. should have added my words to the full, that the Reader might have seen my mind. What I speak comparatively, Mr. H. would not hold it out to the Reader, as if I meant it absolutely. For  
1. The Presbytery is glad that lesser evils be healed by Rebukes within the congregation.  
2. I deny not but the Presbytery doth, and must directly and immediately judge greater scandals, especially between congregation and congregation, between Elder and Elder, and Rulers and Ruled of the same congregation, but ever under the former Reduplication, as they are an associate body.  
Mr. H. 3 Differ. The Presbyterian Elders are Elders to all the Churches, as the Elders themselves are in collegio Presbyteriali, 
Page 103.  and properly as they are in Court.  
Ans. But I assume (saith Mr. H.) the Elders there are proper Pastors of their own particular congregations; therefore they must (if at all) be so here. A Pastor in an Island cannot teach, admonish, excommunicate, but in coetu congregationali, or severed from his Church, yet this hinders not but in these regards he is a proper Pastor to them.  
Ans. Mr. H. yet halfs my words, and sets down one member 
Mr. H. sets not down M. R. his words perfectly, but often in halfs, & scarce that, as here.  of a distinction, and leaves out the other. They are Elders to the Churches in the Presbyterial Judicature; but separatim out of that (say I, pag. 326.) they do not watch in such a way for all the souls of the Presbyterian several congregations, as they do for the single congregations of which they are fixed Pastors. And this is enough to make different relations pastoral (which is my intent) between the Elders, in order to their own congregations, and to the associated congregations, as the Elders of Antioch are Elders judging in the Synod, Acts 15. one way to jerusalem, and other to Antioch, where they have their proper fixed charge to teach and rule: and I shall not stand to yield that they act as Elders, and by the same office of Eldership in the Presbyterial, and in the congregational Judicature, but an accidental difference there is.  
2. It's most unfound that Mr H. saith, That a Pastor cannot 
A pastor is not a pastor only to the assembled congregation, as Mr. H. saith, but also to them all severally, and to this or that single person of the flock.  teach, admonish, excommunicate, but in a congregational meeting. This is first to make him a congregational Pope or Prophet, as the Papists do the Pope, only in Cathedra, in the pulpit, or before the congregation. 2. All the days of the week, except in the actual congregational Assembly, he is a private man by this reason. But the Word shall warrant the pastor as a pastor to visit, to warn from house to house, Col. 1. 28. Acts 20 20. & 2. 46. & 5. 42. in season and out of season, 2 Tim. 4. 2. & 2. 25. for he does not these as a private gifted man.  
3. By this reason a pastor is so a pastor, a husband, a watchman to the flock actually assembled only, but not a pastor to give an account of this or that man or woman's soul to God in the flock; then if this or that man perish through the fault of the Elder, who gave not warning, Mr. H. hath taught the Minister a good excuse: I cannot be charged as an unfaithful watchman with the blood of this single man who is lost, Mr. H. saith, I am only a Pastor in relation to the flock assembled Church-ways, but I am not a Pastor nor Watchman to one single man. But ah! this distinction shall not save the man from the charge of blood! Ezek. 3. 18, 19, 20, 21. & 33. 13, 14, 15. & 34. 4, 5. Heb. 13. 17. I would not have expected from such a man's pen such a Tenet.  
4. Differ. The Presbytery hath a Church relation to all these 
M. H. pag. 103, 104.  thirty congregations not takin distributively, but collectively, as they are united in one Church classical, and in one Government. Ans. If the Presbytery put forth acts of jurisdiction upon these Churches distributively, as they are severed, than they have a Church-relation to them distributively. But they admonish and censure several persons of several Churches.  
Ans. 1. So do the Synod Elders at jerusalem, Acts 15. put 
Though pastors in a Synod, by M. Cottons grant, put forth pastoral acts upon many congregations, yet shall it never follow, that they are proper & fixed pastors to these congregations: so neither doth this militate against a Presbyterian Church. Page 104. See Bilson, perpetual Government, c. 5. c. 12.  forth authoritative pastoral acts, by the grant of Mr. Cotton, upon the several Churches distributively taken, yet are they not the proper pastors of these Churches, and Commissioners of Parliament upon persons of a single city, but as they have failed not against the Laws of that city, but against the general Laws of the whole Nation and Parliament: But it follows not, that these Commissioners are Aldermen, or fixed Judges of that city; and so Mr. H. his consequence is weak.  
Mr. H. These Presbyterial Elders must exercise jurisdiction over congregational Elders, which is conceived by Mr. R. to be absurd.  
Ans. Pastors, with majority of official Jurisdiction over pastors of another lower species, as Bishops above pastors, I still look upon as absurd. But that Elders in a Synod exercise Jurisdiction over Elders of a congregation that are the same in nature and degree with them, is no more absurd, than for an Eldership of a congregation to exercise Jurisdiction over some two or three scandalous Elders of their own number, which Mr. H. will not call Episcopacy.  
Mr. H. Mr. R. adds, Elders of an Independent congregation, are not Elders of their single congregations, being separated from their Courts. It seems a paradox, for if separated from their Court, their office remain, than jurisdiction must remain.  
Ans. It's not a seeming, but a real paradox, my words are 
Pastor's can exercise no jurisdiction being separated from the court, but pastoral acts of teaching they may in private exercise, and that from house to house. Pag. 104, 105.  halfed. I said, They are not Elders separated from their court in the notion (these are my words omitted by Mr. H.) of the relation of a Church-jurisdiction; for they can exercise no jurisdiction, neither excommunicate, nor relax from excommunication, being not in Court, except they be prelate's.  
But Mr. H. adds a real absurd paradox, that they cannot exercise pastoral acts of teaching, but in the Church-assembly; which refuted before.  
Mr. H. 5 Differ. Congregational Elders have power of order, and power of jurisdiction without the Court, but they have not power of jurisdiction but in the Court. Elders have a power of jurisdiction as watchmen, but a power of Church-jurisdiction they have not, but in the Court.  
Ans. I never heard that their entering into the assembly should 
Sitting in Court gives no new power of office to elders, but they cannot put it forth in formal jurisdiction but in the Court.  add a new power.  
2. Nor did Mr. R. say, their entering and sitting in the Court addeth a new official power; they had the official power actu primo before, but they can no more put it forth in acts, being separated from the Court, than a pastor might excommunicate his alone in his private chamber; which were tyrannical and null.  
Mr. H. The example of the great Sanhedrim toucheth not the cause, or then destroyeth it: Nor doth the example of Commissioners of Parliament; for they get a new office to sit in Parliament, but an Elder of a congregation by sitting in the Presbytery gets no new office.  
Ans. It is a weak answer, to say it helps not, and not show 
It's a mistake all along in Mr. H. th●● if an Elder put forth pastoral acts in a Synod or in a Presbytery, to this or that congregation, that therefore he is a fixed pastor to this or that congregation.  the cause, but to lead the Reader implicitly: for the great Sanhedrim ruled over all the Tribes, and yet a Judge out of the Tribe of Dan, though a member of the Sanhedrim, did not rule over the Tribe of Benjamin, but only in the Sanhedrim, and in some common cases. The getting of a new office is neither up nor down; the Commissioners of Parliament rule in that Court over all the Shires in the Land, and by that Commission every Commissioner becomes not a Major of every City, or a Judge in every Shire. And by Mr. Cottons grant, the Elders in a Synod exercise pastoral acts, and lay on burdens, Acts 15. upon the Churches, and get no new office thereby: But they do not for that become proper Elders and pastors over every single congregation in the bounds of the Synod.  
Yet to Mr. H. this is a principle, That if the Presbyterian Elders put forth pastoral acts upon all the congregations, then must they be pastors to all the particular flocks, for shepherd and flick are relatives, Arg. 2. 101. But the Conclusion is absurd. This is no less against Mr. Cotton, than against Mr. R. and against himself, who admits strangers to the Lords Supper, etc.  
Mr. H. It is obvious to every man, that the Elder of the congregation hath the nature of an Elder in general, and so can and doth put forth general actions, that are common to other Elder. Where the act is, the object must be, in its proportion; and all this he doth without the Classis in his particular station: for the species determines the act of the genus, as Socrates confines the acts of the humans Nature to himself: and it's known, the Classis meddles with the particular offences, that are as special as any Elder in an Island, doth meddle within his own place.  
Ans. 1. It's obvious to all men, That Mr. H. speaks new Logic, obvious to the understanding of no man, I doubt, to his own. For the Elders of a congregation, because independent, and subordinate and countable to none on earth, but to jesus Christ (as Papists say of their wooden Head the Antichrist) determine within themselves. Suppose they he but some twelve of the twelve thousands at jerusalem, if these be once a formal Covenant-wise married Church of people and officers, they do determine of the Doctrine of Circumcision, of the Doctrine of Balaam, Acts 15. Rev. 2. 14. (for Pergamos is to them an independent flock) and of Arrianism, and of Doctrines and Scandals that concern many hundred Churches about; and whether they determine right or wrong, it's against the liberty and power Christ hath given to that Redeemed Body, of ten and twelve to tell the Churches: Oh! they must not part with their Sovereignty so; or if they consult, it's but of courtesy: for, single Pergamus is rebuked (say our Brethren) for not using their Church-power in a Doctrine that concerned thousands as well as them.  
2. What a mystery of Logic this may be, who is so happy 
How wide Mr. H. is in his Logic, the Presbyterian Elders determine of special actions & persons, for species determines the act of the genus.  as to divine? Every particular Elder can, and doth put forth general actions that are common to other Elders: Why? The species determines the act of the genus. The Reason contradicts the Conclusion which it is brought to prove: For if Socrates confines the acts of Humane Nature to himself, they leave off now to be general actions, and by being contracted to the species (his species is Socrates a single person) they are now most special actions.  
Mr. H. takes our meaning to be, That the members of Synods and of the Presbytery, determine of the Ideal, general, abstracted Nature of Men, of Doctrines, of Actions in communi, that needs not (saith he) for the congregational Elders put forth general actions, but confined and contracted to Socrates: So doth the Classis, the National, yea the Oecumenick and General Assembly put forth acts, determinations, both of general Doctrines, and condemn them also, as confined and contracted to Socrates, to Balaam, to jezabel, to the Nicolaitans, and to the single men of that impure Sect. And Acts 15. 24. the Synod condemns some certain particular, individual men, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Some men from us have troubled you, and said, Ye must be circumcised. Now the abstracted nature of men disputed not and made not the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and the rent, as v. 6, 7. but some single men. And this comes from another wild notion of Logic that Mr. H. teacheth, That the Catholic visible Church is the Genus, and under it is this or that Independent Church. Of this hereafter. S● the Church of Boston is the Catholic integral Church: for, G●nus praedicatur de specie.  
Mr. H. It's as undeniable, there be general acts in preaching and watching, which are common to all congregations, which the Presbytery neither do, nor can dispense conscientiously, because the Pastor cannot attend them: It will not suffice to say, He was Pastor to the Catholic Church before, for then before the combination he had as good power to exercise jurisdiction, as any of them. This is against Mr. R. who grants that one Church hath not power over another.  
An. 1. It's undeniable, That the Apostles who were Pastors of the Catholic Church, could not attend acts of Teaching and Ruling in all the single Congregations, for that is physically impossible. But Mr. H. saith, It's morally impossible, and unlawful for a pastor to put forth a pastoral act in any Congregation, but that to which he is married, more than a man can perform marriage-duties to any but to his own wife: 
Neither to be an Apostle, nor to be an ordinary Pastor, doth so give right to any to feed the flock in Macedonia, nor in Bythinia, in this flock and congregation, and not in this, without the intervening of some special call of God.  which is shameful Doctrine.  
2. Mr. H. frequently deviseth Objections of straw, and then fires them at his pleasure, He knows Mr. R. denies, that to be a pastor of the Catholic Church, gives so right to the Apostle to preach and feed in Bythinia, but there was need of a call of God going before, as is clear, Acts 16. and so must pastors of the Catholic Church now have a call from Presbytery and Congregation, before they can lawfelly put forth in act their general pastorship which they have to the Catholic Church. Nor is this against the Church not having power over a sister-Church, because a pastor of one Congregation hath power jointly in a Synod to exercise pastoral acts Synodical over many Churches.   

CHAP. IU.  
The following Arguments of Mr. H. against a Presbyterian Church are removed. That the classical Elders separate Ruling from Teaching, are Prelates, non-resident and Pluralists, and what not, by Mr. H. his way.  
MR. H. That course which severs which God hath joined 
Pag. 106, 107.  together is unlawful. But the classical combination doth this. Ruling and teaching belong to the office of a Pastor and Teacher, they have the prwer of the Keys, and there cannot be full binding and losing, but by ruling and teaching, Act. 20. 28. 1 Pet. 5. 1, 2.  
2 Both binding and losing are required as necessary to Christ's end, the gathering and perfecting of the Saints, Eph. 4. 12.  
Ans. The assumption may import that the Presbytery must be Rulers, and by office, no Teachers, as the Prelate is, who by majority of power is the rule of the Pastors, and they his Deputies; the so severing of teaching and ruling in the subject cannot be charged upon us, but that the severing of them in regard of the object, is no sort of dividing of those which God hath joined, is clear; because the Pastors teach some, and rule in common others 
The separating of ruling and teaching in Pastors, in regard of office is unlawful; but the separating of them in acts and objects is not unlawful, but necessary.  associate. And Mr. H. hath not proved the assumption.  
For, 1. Elders in Synods dogmatically and authoritatively 
See Bilson, Perpetual Government. c. 5. c. 12. M. H. doth no less separate ruling & teaching then. Presbyterians do.  teach, as Mr. H. teacheth, par. 4. pag. 5. conclus. 3. therefore Mr. H. himself separateth teaching and ruling. And Mr. Cotton saith more.  
2. The people without officers may excommunicate all their officers, and so bind them, and receive them in again upon their repentance, and so lose them, as Mr. H. teacheth par. 1, c. 9 pag. 92, 93. and yet the people cannot teach these officers as their Pastors. Is not here an irregular separating of ruling from teaching?  
3. Such of the flock as are from their youth kept under by the terrors of God, Ps. 88 Godly Elders, who are not to be rebuked, but entreated as fathers, 1 Tim. 5. 1. need not juridical Church-binding and losing, and yet need the preaching of the promises. Then in regard of the act and object, exercise of jurisdiction may be severed from teaching.  
4. Pastor's can exercise no jurisdiction, but only in the Court, but Pastors not in Court may teach pastorally the whole flock.  
5. The Churches that meet in a Synod, may exercise the power of non communion toward a Church (which is a Church-governing, for their edification) if the Church obstinately maintain an heresy; and yet the Churches so convened cannot pastorally teach this Church. Let Mr. H. see if he be not as prelatical as Mr. R. If this be Prelacy, I thought Mr. H. had been better versed in the doctrine of Prelacy.  
Mr. H. Grandfathers and Fathers do bear a relation to the same Children divers ways (So Mr. R.) So then as a Grandfather (saith Mr. H.) cannot be both a Grandfather and a Father to the same 
One may be both a classical Elder to the associate Churches, and a fixed Elder to a single congregation, as the same man is both a Grandfather and a Father to divers children.  Child, neither can an Elder be both a proper Elder and a classical Elder to the same Congregation.  
Answ. One man cannot be both a Grandfather and a Father to the same Child. True; nor is one man a proper Elder to his Congregation, and a classical Elder to his own Congregation; for he is formally a classical Elder, not to his own, but to all the associated Congregations.  
2. It is but a comparison, and so admits of halting; a Grandfather is a Grandfather to his children's children, but a Father to his nearest children; so the same man is a classical Elder to all the associated Churches, and a proper and providentially fixed Elder to his own flock; as one was both a Priest to judge between blood and blood, and yet, if the matter was too hard, the same man was a Judge and a Member of the Sanhedrim, Deut. 17.  
Mr. H. his last difference: The judicature of Classis and Congregations 
Pag. 107, 108.  do not differ formally (saith Mr. R.) but only in more or less extension of power.  
Ans. Then there are no specifical acts that the one puts forth, but the other can put forth, as occasion shall require; gradus non variant speciem, than they can ordain officers and excommunicate in the Congregation. He said before, if there be the same office, there is the same definition, and the same causes, to wit, of election, and choice of the Classical, and of the Congregational Elders.  
Ans. The difference is only of more or less, as of a River and the whole Element, though divers learned men judge the Congregation to be no governing Church at all, but only their Elders the delegates of the Presbyterial Church, which consisting of divers Congregations is the first governing Church.  
2. There are no specific acts which the Elders collectively taken, may not exercise in both the one and the other: but then shall it not follow, th●● a single congregational Eldership may ordain and excommunicate in one 〈◊〉 Congregation there alone divided from the body? for congr●…nal Elders cannot teach orderly (and he is the God of order, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in his Church) in all the Congregations without a cal●.  
Nor 2. Exercise the power of a Synod in them all.  
3. I 〈◊〉 this argument; Archipp●● hath the same office to the whole Congregation, and to the single members who choosed him, and whom he feeds; or then he hath so many officer as there be choosing and fed members, ●●ught by the word and ruled, which is absurd: E●go, as the single vo●● of one member made him a Pastor to one, and of a second made him a Pastor to a second, and so forth. So the ●otes of the whole made him a Pastor to the whole: for that is the same offic● th●● hath the same causes, and the same choice and election, saith M●. 〈◊〉. Ergo, where the same causes are not, the same office cannot be, but one single electing vote, and the electing vot●● of the whole Church by Mr. H. his way, cannot be the same causes, for one vote makes him not a Pastor.  
2. If Archippu● hath the same office to the whole congregation, and to every single member, then as he 〈◊〉 pastoral acts of teaching and ruling to the whole, so to the parts and single members; but this latter is denied by Mr. H, page 104: who saith, That a Pastor cannot put forth Pastoral acts, but in the Church assembly, A strange imagination!  
Mr. H. By the same official power (saith Mr. R.) that a Pastor 
Pag. 108, 109.  teacheth his own fleck viva voce, he teacheth others by writing.  
Ans This is a new invention that I never heard of before.  
1. The official power, by which he preacheth, he receiveth by election, and he may be rejected from it by the people, in case of delinquency.  
2. By his official power he may require them to hear, but may not require all Churches to read his writings; and if they offensively refuse to read, he cannot censure them, as he may censure them that refuse to hear the word.  
3. If this power of writing of Books, to edify the Churches, proceed from his office, all Ministers by their office should write 
A Pastor fixed to a congregation may exercise pastoral acts of writing, preaching to other congregations than his own.  Books.  
4. That which another may do with as much authority, and more authority of truth, as being more able, yet being out of office, that cannot belong to the officer; but to write books is such.  
Ans. 1 Official power is not from election, but from the saying on of the hands of the Elders, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2. 1 Tim. 4. 14. 1 Tim. 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2 2. Tit. 1. 5.  
2. It is true, that a Pastor cannot require by his office those of another Congregation to hear him preach, and receive the seals from him, nor censure them, if they refuse; but it is a bad consequence of Logic, therefore he doth not exercise these pastoral acts to them by his office, as the Brethren grant.  
2. A Minister by his office may require his hearers to give much alms, pray much, read and confer much, both these of his own and other flocks; yet he cannot censure them for not coming up to the highest pitch of these affirmative duties, except he may rebuke them, and so may he do all who are remiss in reading edifying writings, and the Church may censure unsound books, Acts 15. 24.  
3. Neither Mr. R. nor any judicious man can teach that either a gift to write Books, or of eminent preaching, praying, exhorting, proceeds out of a power of office; it is a sanctified gift which the Church seeth and judgeth to be in any, before they call him to office; and any gift is by order of nature and time before the office, and so proceeds not from the office; and therefore it is not required that every Pastor should have a gift of writing books, but if the Lord have given it to any, they exercise it as such gifted officers as the Prophets and Apostles, as such Prophets so gifted did write Canonic Scriptures; so are Pastors, if gifted, to write and preach in their way, and both to write and preach by their office. Nor is it good Logic, that all in office should write books. because some by virtue of their office writ books; for a Minister gifted with four Talents is obliged to gain with these four Talents, and that as a Minister by virtue of his office; but it is weak Logic to infer, Ergo, all Ministers by virtue of their office are obliged to gain with four Talents, for many are obliged by virtue of their office to gain with only two to their Lord, and with only one.  
4. It was needless to Mr. H. to prove writing of books doth not belong to the power of office, because a learned man out of office may do it with more authority; for Mr. R. had no such intention. For, sure if such a thing agreed to the office-power, as the office-power, than all Officers, Pastors, Elders were obliged to write books, and yet Mr. H. does not very happily prove it, because many learned men unofficed may with more authority of truth write books, than officed men. It is only some officed men he must mean, or it is not true. And then I retort it thus; many officed men may write books with more authority both of truth and of office (and two are better than one) then some unofficed men less learned. Ergo, some gifted Pastors do not as Pastors so gifted, and by virtue of their office relating both to the presbyterian Church, and their own Congregation edify all the Churches about, by writing books. It follows not.  
Mr. H. We are told that Elders are ruling in all Churches 
Pag. 109.  collectively taken, and they are teachers 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, in some reserved acts, not constant teachers, he that rules teacheth, but always the same flock.  
Ans. Take classical Elders as they are congregational Elders, and that is all one as to say, no classical Elders, and then they are no teaching Elders; and all that is gained is this; a classical Elder as he is no classical Elder, is a teaching Elder. And so there is no distinction.  
Ans. Such quirks become not grave M. H. What is a Synodical Elder? Mr. H. saith a counselling Elder. I reply, that is no Elder, but a counselling Brother or Sister. But Mr. Cotton and our Brethren say better. A synodical Elder is an Elder synodically teaching the Churches with pastoral and dogmatic authority, without all power of jurisdiction, that is a Synodical Elder, as no Congregational Elder (but as he judgeth in Synod) is a teaching and a ruling Elder. Then I infer, that all Synodical Elder must be both an Elder and no Elder. So animal as he is, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, is non h●mo, but he is viv●●s. It were easy to weary the Reader with many wild unsolid notions, such like, Ergo, animal is homo, non hom●.  
Mr. H. So a Pastor may be a teaching Pastor to one Church, and 
Pag. 110.  a ruling Pastor to two or three, or thirty. This is a B●shop.  
Obj. The B●shop arrogates thi● to himself alone.  
Ans. Show a rule of Christ, why the Elders may not join many Elders to join with him; for you have no rule of Christ to join many to him to rule many Churches, nor hath he a rule to assume many to him.  
Ans. Not any of the separation ever refuted, with that 
A Pastor teaching one congregation fixedly, and ruling in Collegio other associate Churches is no Prelate.  strength of Scripture, Reason, Antiquity, the domineeringg prelacy, as the godly presbyterians in Britain, and the reformed Churches. But so many thousand Independent Monarchies, and two Congregational, or three Elders (for a Deacon is for Tables, Act. 6.) subordinate in point of jurisdiction to none on earth, is a more lively image of a domineering Prelacy, than all the Presbyteries on earth.  
2. There is no rule to join other prelate's or elders to a prelate: an unlawful officer, having power of jurisdiction, the only proper pastor, and all others are but pastors under him and his delegates. But Mr. H. cannot say that the pastor of a congregation is an unlawful pastor, to whom so many bastard pastors are added, if he do, this shall reflex upon his own way; for the Synodical Elder is a pastorally teaching Elder to many Churches, Antioch, jerusalem, and also a teaching and ruling Elder to one congregation by our brethren's way: Is the Synodical Elder therefore a pastor of pastors, and a Bishop? And Mr. H. cannot say but that there might have been divers congregations in jerusalem, and yet unformed Churches; and that the twelve Apostles did feed and rule them all in common, and so shall Peter teach one Congregation at once, and rule many whom he cannot teach (for physically it is impossible he can feed many at once) and yet there was but one Presbytery, and this we shall hear Mr. H. confess hereafter. Ergo, the twelve Apostles and Church-Elders feeding many Congregations not form with fixed Pastors shall bring in such sort of Bishops, as Mr. H. charges upon me. 
Pag. 100   
Mr. H. If they do not both rule and teach, they cannot fulfil their Ministry.  
Ans. How is it proved that Pastors cannot fulfil their Ministry, except they both rule all the Churches with acts Synodical, and their own Congregations also?  
2. How is it proved that there is a blank in the Ministry, except Pastors both teach and rule these same persons? some of the Congregation are so experiencedly taught of God, that rebukes and censures of excommunication are never drawn out, nor need to be drawn out against them; never Interpreter so expounded Col. 4. 
Pag. 110. 111.   
Mr. H. If Pastors be Pastors and in office when they are out of Court, then have they Church-jurisdiction out of the Court; but the first is true. Also censures should be dispensed in the Congregation, and there they must preach also.  
Ans. Priests when not actually sitting in the Sanhedrim, Members of Parliament are Members sitting in the House; and Pastors are Elders actu primo, when not sitting in the Congregational Judicature; Ergo, they can exercise acts of jurisdiction out of Court, in their Houses; and may the Eldership preach out of the Court? it is a shame to hear such Logic.  
2. Belike Mr. H. thinks it impossible to dispense censures, but the Elders must preach: Ergo, when the people excommunicate their whole Officers, because heretical; they must also preach pastorally: for it is pastoral ruling and teaching which makes a fulfilling of the Ministry: but the conclusion is absurd, let Mr. H. see to it.   

CHAP. V.  
The Argument from the onerousness of Presbyterial Ruling of many Churches, and of Congregationally feeding of others, against the Presbyterial Church, are discussed.  
MR. H. The classical course layeth a burden upon teaching Elders, which Gods word never laid, and which they are 
Pag. 111.  not able to discharge; the Apostles appointed Elders in every Church to feed the fl●ck, not the flocks. Mr. R. the way of watching over Sister Churches is as dreadful for onerous, careful, laborious watchfulness in the way of conscience, as to be bound thereto by way of duty; for this bond of lovely and brotherly consociation, which is the foundation of Presbyterial governing, ties us to do no more in governing and helping other Sister Churches, then if We had no further warrant to promote their edification, than the alone relation of brotherly consociation. The sentence is (saith Mr. H.) unperfect; and therefore that it may reach his purpose, I think is must be thus expressed: the bond of brotherly consociation ti●th us to do no more in governing Sister Churches, then brotherly consociation simply can do, is true; but impertinent to Mr. R. his scope, which is to compare the bond and burden between brotherly 
Of the onerousness and labour in governing associating Churches; how it is the same with onerousness & labour in counselling united Churches, and how it is not the same.  association and office-imposition, as if there were a parity between them.  
Ans. 1. The classical course layeth no other burden upon teaching Elders, by way of united jurisdictions in governing neighbour Churches that are the same body, and have the same seals common, as Mr. Cotton and his own Discipline agrees (as I often cite) then the way of Churches both associated by brotherly association, and by Synodical and authoritative governing, as the same Mr. Cotton teacheth, and Mr. H. saith it is true, but not pertinent; and if it be true, why contend we?  
2. That it is not pertinent to my purpose, is denied: Why? Because (saith he) Mr. R. his scope is to make a parity and equality between the burden of Brotherly consociation and of Office-imposition. But that is a change of my words, and therefore must lie upon Mr. H. as his, not my words, except they be wrested; Nor is it my scope to make an equality in quantity, as if there were, as Mr. H. most mistakingly saith, the like care, onerousness and labour required in duties of Christian watchfulness in a brotherly way, as in duties of office relation: But in equality of onerousness of answering to God for duties, the like conscience, the like sincerity, the like faith of giving an account to God, is required in the one as in the other. And he leaves, upon this account, out the word, in way of conscience, or in fore Dei, and saith my words are imperfect; but wherein they are imperfect, he showeth not, which maketh his own words imperfect: and therefore he turneth my Negative, That we are to do no more in governing sister-Churches, than in counselling and brotherly advising, into an Affirmative never dreamt of by me. That brotherly association tieth us to do as much, as if we had no further warrant; and t●… we are to do by his way as much in brotherly duties to all Christians in other Provinces or Nations, in France, Germany, Holland with whom we can by no physical possibility be present, and whose faces we never saw, as we are to do, by fixed office, to the single congregations to which we have a providential call, by the election and choice of the people, for whom we are to search the Scriptures, and study pleasant words, and for whose souls we are to give an account. But  
1. It's a fruitless dispute to prove in sundry pages what Mr. R. grants.  
2. If he proved from my words (from his own he may) that these are necessary consequences, he had done as became a Refuter.  
3. He cannot from what I say deny, but granteth, That brotherly consociation tieth teaching Elders to do no more in governing neighbouring Churches, than brotherly advising, teaching, admonishing, tieth us unto, in point of onerousness and laborious care, and so it well follows, That there is no more laid upon Presbyterial Elders in governing neighbouring Churches, than is laid upon their counselling, and brotherly advising Elders, in point of daily occurring scandals, as is clear in the Rise of Familists, Anabaptists, Antinomians, etc. and many scandalous persons arising in sundry Churches lying together.  
4. The care and onerousness in brotherly watching, essentially, 
The obligatition to brotherly help to my brother, though it be as onerous as an obligation of teaching the flock, it doth not tie me to the use of all the means positively to go all the world over, and warn and admonish as the other doth.  formally in rendering an account to God, as being keepers to our Brethren all the world over, with whom we converse in other congregations, haply at our door, and occasionally, is as binding before God, as the care of teaching Elders in exercising power of Jurisdiction in Collegio, and in things common to divers Churches; but it follows not, that Christian love tieth me to all the positive means of warning my brother to go to Germany, to America, to try and admonish all the scandals that are committed there.  
5. This same Argument is thus retorted upon Mr. H. if the Apostles, as Church-members, as Believers, be obliged all the world over, to eat the Lords Supper, as Paul did at Troas, Acts 20. 11. a● Corinth, 1 Cor. 10. 17 and in all the Churches on earth, to eat and receive the Lo●… Supper, not as an Apostle with an Apostolic, but with a faith common to all Christians; then must he be obliged as a Christian with the like care and onerousness to leave his calling of an Apostle & to go to all places on earth, to remember the Lords death, and as a Christian to lay down preaching, planting of Churches, working of miracles, and to teach, rebuke, as a Christian, in all places. It's not enough to say, That the Apostles  
1. Were privileged persons, and so might eat the Lords Supper all the world over, for they eat not the Lords Supper as 
Apostles were t●ed not as Apostles, but as Christians to eat the Lords Supper in all Churches all the world over.  Apostles, but as believers, who were to try and examine themselves, and so d●●ncerningly to remember the Lords death until he come again, as other believers were.  
2. Is it enough to say, They were occasionally only to discharge these Christian duties, as they should be locally present, for so are teaching Elders to perform official duties to these neighbour Churches with whom they occasionally converse in the occasional emergency of scandals: and if Pastors were in Africa or America, they might, without any new ordination or official call, preach and govern as Physicians of souls. But by Mr. H. his way, the Lord in the day of Judgement might say, Thou wast a member of that body, with which thou hadst a right to ●at the Lord's Supper in all Churches on earth; therefore I require at thy hand the blood of them that are lost in America, because thou watched not over all the Christians on earth, which is physically impossible. And I require at Paul preaching in the the W●st, th● blood of such as perished, when he was 300 miles absent from them, for Paul had an official call to all the believers on earth. As Mr. H. saith, our Presbyterial Elders must give an account for souls that are lost in all the Presbyterial, Provincial and National Churches on earth, and go all the world over to cure scandals, leaving their own calling of Merchandise. But by this (saith Mr. H pag. 115.) a pastoral care is f●r more enerous and laborious than Christian and brotherly care in some sense. I grant all, and there is nothing proved against me, who say, that this ties teaching Elders to no more in governing Sister Churches, in point of binding the conscience to answer for them, as far as they have power in matter of common concernment, for the well being of all the near hand associated Churches, then brotherly consociation can do. And Mr. H. page 112. saith this is true, and yet in some sense pastoral care is far more onerous and laborious, to wit, in using more means in watching fixedly over a Congregation, by constant preaching in season, and out of season, in standying pleasant words, administering the Sacraments, etc. Nor did I ever say any thing to the contrary.  
Mr. H. An eminently gifted man in an Island, where no Pastors 
Pag. 115, 116.  are, is no less (saith Mr. R.) tied in conscience in the extraordinary employment of his calling, then if he were formally ordained and chosen their Pastor. In some extraordinary cases a gift and Christian love ties even as much to onerousness in using means to save, at the office itself. See what I add in that place, (Mr H. saith) than this gifted man in an Island, in using his general calling as a Christian, destroys his particular, as a Merchant, and turn Minister. 2. This is to confound the general and particular calling.  
Ans. Not at all, for in this case, the extraordinary necessity of gaining souls, when other Pastors cannot be had; and ordination and election by that means are invincibly wanting hic & nunc, turns his Christian calling in place and room of the particular calling of a Pastor; and so Mr. R. said well, that in some extraordinary case like this, The naked Relation of jurisdiction addeth nothing to care and onerousness in point of labour, by preaching the Gospel.  
Mr. H. If we have a divine command (saith Mr. R.) to be our brethren's keeper's, than our Christian watch in that regard requires 
Pag. 114, 115.  as much onerousness and care as office watch. It follows not (saith Mr. H.) am I bound by office to watch no more over the people left to my pastoral care, then as a Christian over these of another Province, whom I am occasionally only to gain, and whose faces I never saw.  
Ans. Mr. H. leaves out the words, in point of conscience to answer for them to God, Which I have. Otherwise in regard of 
A man is tied to use more means for feeding the single fl●ck, that he is a fixed Pastor unto, then as a christian he is to use toward other churches.  using of more means, he is obliged to more constant feeding, by word, seals, daily watching over the single flock, then over all Christians on the other side of the Sea, and some thousand miles distant from him.  
But if the foundation of governing classical Churches be the love and union of the members of one body of Christ, then there is much care, onerousness, and labour, which is required in brotherly consociation to help, as the care & onerousness which is required in officership.  
Mr. H. Ans. The proposition hath no truth, because I love all consociated in one Synod, whom I never saw, and with whom I could never meet to do good, or receive good. But if I should be bound to put forth the like onerous and laborious care for their spiritual good, as for these, to whom by way of office I am bound in the same Congregation. Then officers must either do too little, or be bound to do too much.  
Ans. This is neither my Argument, nor my words: my words are, Par. 1 pag. 332. Now if we distinguish ONEROUSNESS, CARE and LABOUR by way of jurisdiction, the former is as GREAT IN FORO DEI, in the Court of conscience, as the latter. These words are left out by Mr. H. qua fide; let the Reader judge; for the toil, care, onerousness and labour in point of conscience in the kind, and sphere; I urge in both, by necessity of a divine command: but the like care, onerousness and labour in quantity, in the use of more means, in constant preaching, personal comforting, to all the Christians on earth, as to the single congregation, I utterly deny. But can Mr. H. deny but the Apostles and Brethren, Act. 15. did owe as much care, onerousness, and labour in a binding conscientious way in laying on synodical burdens, which bind not only (saith Mr. Cotton) materially for the weight of the matter imposed by divine 
Mr. Cotton Keys of the Kingdom, c. 6. pag. 25.  precept, but also formally from the authority of the Synod, upon the Churches of jerusalem, Antioch, Syria, Cilicia, as any pastor owes to his single flock; and that because these Churches are all one consociated body? and yet Elders of the Synod were never to see the faces of all these members of the Churches.  
And I put this quere to the Brethren, what warrant of Christ is there that a member of an Independent Church owe Church-care to watch, teach, admonish, rebuke, comfort, as Col. 3. 16. Heb. 3. 13. 1 Thes. 5 14. to a fellow member of the same congregation only, and owe no Church-care to another brother, dwelling in the same house with him, having with him the same faith, the same baptism, the same Lord, the same covenant of Grace, the same Saviour, only because he is a member of another Independent Church?  
Mr. H. Arg. 5. If they be Pastors over all the Congregations 
Pag. 117.  of the circuit, than they were new chosen by the Congregations, or not, etc.  
Ans. This is a repeated blast of an old horn; there is this required, that Churches about, by their silence approve him as Pastor to one single Congregation; but that all Congregations make a special election of him to be their fixed Pastor, is no more required, then that the Churches of Antioch and jerusalem chose the Apostles and Elders, who yet Act. 15. exercise pastoral and official acts over them by the grant of Mr. Cotton and our Brethren.  
They are Elders of Ephesus, i. e. of enery Congregation of the 
Pag. 117. 118.  combination, as all the Kings, if they were met in one royal Court to govern the Nations, in things of common concernment to all, yet are called the Kings of the Nations. These are words (saith Mr. H. to darken:) the Elders met here, have a new power distinct from the power over their several Congregations, a Commission, i. e. a new Creature. The Kings if so convened, have a joint power of confederate Princes, to act in things of common concernment, and if that power were distinct from the particular power that they have over their own territories, the comparison were parallel.  
Ans. We may suppose such a convention of Kings, the Commissioners 
A commission in a Presbytery is no new office, but apower of order appointed by the God of order.  or Messenger's of the Churches have no new office, but only are met to determine of such a thing as disturbs the Churches, Act. 15 5. they differ as Elders, and such Elders sent and nominate by the Church, and act as Elders by the same official power common to Elders that are not sent, and are called by the Church Apostles and Elders, Act. 15. 23. & 16. 4. & 21. 18, 25. then sending and commissionating is a condition of order appointed by the God of order, no devise of men: and the Churches submit to them as to no new office.  
But 1. as to the messengers of the Church, and gracious and sound Elders.  
2. If they speak according to the Law and the testimony, not otherwise, and the answer is as much against Act. 15. and against Mr. Cotton and all that are for Synods, either juridical or consultative, as against Mr. R. for they go to Synods, who so go by a new power of order, not by a new office.  
Mr. H. This course nullifies the power of Elders, and propl●●f a 
Pag. 119, 120.  Congregation, and their proceeding in a righteous way; for the Classis may judge a member to be excommunicated, whom the Congregation judgeth. and that truly not worthy of that censure; here 
Due right of Presbytery. The votes of associated Churches added to the votes of the Elders of a congregation strengtheneth, but hindereth not right proceeding, except by accident.  the power of Elders and people which act in a way of Christ is wholly hindered.  
Ans. This weak Argument is fully answered by me before; That Government, which of its own nature hinders and nullifies the righteous proceeding of the Congregation is not a power from Christ. True; but now the assumption is false: for the presbyterial power added to the just power of a Congregation does strengthen, and not nullify the power of the Congregation That Government, which by accident, and abuse of their power in over voting two Elders, who proceed according to the rule of Christ, hinders and nullifies right proceeding in on● single act, is not from Christ, is most false: For because an abused power, and abused government is not from Christ, it follows not that the power and government itself is not from God. I added an answer 
Due Right. p. 335.  to this in my Book which Mr. H. passeth over in silence. Suppose the Congregation and Synod agree in the truth, as they do Act. 15. Will you say that Peter, Paul and james, their power is nullified, and their three votes are swallowed up in that greater convention; because to their power is added in this dogmatical determination, the power and voices of the rest of the Apostles and Elders; yea, and some say of the whole Church, Act. 15. 2, 6, 25. & 16. 4. & 21. 18, 25. So say that the Congregation of Thyatira (suppose it so to be) by assuming to themselves a huge number of Elders and visible Saints shall by over-voting the former Congregation, conclude that jesabel shall still teach and seduce. Mr. H. cannot say, that the added power of the Elders and Members of itself is not of Christ, but rather their abusing of their power in that wicked act, is not from Christ; for the adding to the Church two thousand to three thousand, to make five thousand is lawful, Act. 5.  
Mr. H. To this Mr. R. answers, de jure, the power of the greater 
Pag. 120.  in this case ought to be swallowed up of the two voices of the Elders of the Congregation. But saith Mr. H. so the weaker should overbear the stronger, the part the whole.  
2. This opens a gap to endless dissension, the fewer say we have the truth, the other, we have the truth, and who shall be the judge?  
Aus. Mr. A. citeth my words (as frequently elsewhere) so here imperfectly, and mutilates the sense, if their power and voices be against the truth; it is fit that many voices be swallowed up by two, jure in fore Dei: for Christ gave no power to thirty to err, and to excommunicate an innocent person, he hath given no power, but to edification, 2 Cor. 10. 8. 1 Cor. 5. 4, 5. But I said not that jure Ecclesiastico, the fewer, and the part, should overbear the many, and the whole. And what will Mr. H. say, the fewer names in Sardis judge that a jezabel should be excommunicated; the whole saith no. The fewer say we have truth, the whole say, we have truth; by the brethren's way no remedy, but be the matter heresy, or scandals, incest and parricide, the larger part of every single Congregation in the midst of 24. sound Churches hath a power independent, and from which there is no appeal on earth, to excommunicate the few names that are in Sardis and keep their garments clean. If ye say, so is it in a National, in an Oecumenick Council by the 
The sounder part of the Church is the Church.  Presbyterian way:  
I answer in either the one or the other; if there be a manifest departing from the faith, and the man of sin sit in the Temple of God, and the fornications of Babel be multiplied, the fewer and weaker being Saviour pars Ecclesiae, the sounder part are (as Mr. H. saith, jure in the Court of Heaven) the Church.  
Mr. H. Arg. 7. This course cannot attain its end appointed by 
Pag. 121.  our Saviour, whose wisdom fails not, nor can be frustrate in its preparation. But the Classis excommunicating, when the Elders and Congregation refuse to submit, would be of no force.  
Ans. Let the larger part of the Congregation by three votes 
How the ordinances are not conttary to the Wisdom of Christ though they attain not always finem operis.  excommunicate a godly sound man, and discern an Arch-heretick to preach, as a Godly Socinian; Where is the end of Christ attained by you?  
2. It is an Arminian and unsound tenet to condemn the wisdom of Christ, because he draws not his Ordinances, Gospel, Promises, Precepts, Seals, Censures, according to his irresistible Decree, by which the infinitely wise Lord cannot come short of his end intended of the Ordinances themselves, finem operantis; for his Counsels and Decrees must stand, Isa. 14. 26, 27. Ps. 33. 10, 11. Rom. 9 19 and who hath believed our report? Isa. 53. 1. Some, yea many stumble at Christ and the Word, Isa. 8. 14, 15. 1 Pet. 2. 8. Rom. 9 Shall we accuse the Ordinances, the Gospel and Seals, because God attains not the end, the Salvation of the hearers? How unjust is it to accuse the Wisdom of God for this sinful folly of men?  
But the Lord draws his ordinances and seals according to his approving will, and thereby his Wisdom attains the end, finem operis, which is to save and render unexcusable; and though the Classis be divided from the Congregation, and the Congregation be divided, the fewer keeping the rule, and the greater number erring: this is no more a just ground of challenging the immaculate and spotless Wisdom of God in the ordinance of Presbyterial censuring, than we may challenge Christ's coming in the world, to bring the sword, not peace, Matth. 10. 34. his ordinances are media nata apta, of their own nature apt to bring union between the Classis and the Congregation; if it fall out otherwise, the blame is in men's corruption.  
There were answers given to these Arguments by me; Mr. H. would not set them down, nor remove them, as he answers, but in halfs and parts.   

CHAP. VI  
Some seeming inconsistencies mistaken by Mr. Hooker, are cleared.  
MR. H. Pastors as they stand in relation to the Congregation, and in reference (saith Mr. R.) to the Classis, have not two, 
Png. 122.  but one office, page 329; 333. and yet they are elect to the office of a Pastor in the Congregation, l. 1. & l. 2. pag. 201. but not elect to the office of a Pastor in reference to the Classis, l. 2. 345. which is very strange, since there is but one and the same office.  
Ans. Is it strange that Mr. Cotton and the dissenting Brethren teach; Elders in reference to the Synod, and Elders in reference 
How Pastors are Pastors in reference to the Congregation, and how to the Synod, and associated Elders.  to the single Congregation at Antioch, and at jerusalem have but one and the same office of Elders; for they are not twice Elders, nor two sort of Officers, by reason of these two relations. If they be, say it out, and yet these were elect Pastors in order to their Congregations, and chosen to employ their labours constantly there only, as married Husbands to their Wives. So Mr. H. par. 1. c. 7. pag. 81, 82, 83. and yet neither Mr. H. nor Mr. Cotton can say they were elect to the office of Pastors in reference to the Synod, though they exercise pastoral acts in reference to the Synod (Cotton Keys. c. 5. p. 25. Mr. H. par. 3.) and the associated Churches. Is not this strange? For the eighth Argument repeated from Survey, c. 8. Arg. 1. pag. 99 is answered.  
2. I ●esire the Reader also to consider my words, pag. 244, 245. The Congregations acknowledging and consenting to the classical Presbytery, do tacitly choose and consent to the common charge and care that every Pastor hath, as he is a member of that common Court, which d●th concern them all. and therefore when Mr. R. saith, that Pastors are not elect to the office of a Pastor, in reference to the Classis; the sense is in every page known to be, that Pastors are not chosen to be fixed and constant feeders of all the Congregations of the Classis, because they feed and rule in things of common concernment.  
Mr. H. The power of a Congregation, and of a Presbytery, and their acts (saith Mr. R.) differ not essentially. But Elders (saith 
Par. 1. c. 9 pag. 122.  Mr. H.) do, and must preach, watch and feed, by virtue of the essence of their office, therefore they have acts formally different.  
Ans. That Elders do act as Elders, and put forth specific acts of Elders in the Congregation, and in the Presbytery; Ergo, Their acts in one differ in nature from the acts in the other: it no more follows then this, Peter laughs to day, ergo it shall be rain to morrow. That Elders must constantly and fixedly teach and feed the Churches, whom they govern synodically, is denied 
It is, and must be the same office of a Pastor in reference to the congregation, and in reference to the Presbytery & Synods superior.  by Mr. Cotton: and that they must put forth all the acts of the essence of the office, and that constantly and fixedly to all the Churches congregational, presbyterial, synodical, to which they are referred as pastors in their several relations respectively is most false.  
Mr. H. If it be one and the same office of a Pastor to the Classis, and to a Congregation, as Mr. R. saith, l. 2. 329. then the office relates one and the same way to both the classical and congregational Church; then if the congregational Church be their proper flock, so must the classical Church be, quae sunt idem inter se, sunt idem uni tertio.  
Ans. the first consequence is naught; If it be the same office, than the office relates the same way to both the classical and congregational Church. A Pastor hath the same office to the whole Congregation, and to one single man, to whom he preaches; for he is not two Pastors, one to the whole, and another to the part. An Elder is the same officer to Antioch, and to the Synod at jerusalem, Act. 15. for he is not two officers in reference to these two. But it follows not that the office relates the same way to one man, and to all the Congregation; nor is he referred to the Synod as the fixed and constant feeder of the Synod, but he is referred to a Congregation of Antioch, as their fixed and constant Pastor; it is wild Logic, that one and the same office must relate, one and the same way, to one and to ten hund●●d, to the adequate, and to the inadequate correlate; and these that are one in one Faith, one Baptism, one Lord, one and the same Seals, it will not follow that they are one every way, but in illo uno tertio. For the whole Congregations on earth are one in all the essentials of a Church, one Faith, one Lord, but it follows not that all the Congregations on earth are but one single Congregation. The thumb is referred to the hand, as a member, and also to the whole body as a member; yet it is referred to the hand as a nearest and proper member; but to the whole body in a more common relation, as the toe is referred to the body, yet is not the toe a part of the hand as the thumb is, but both are parts of the body.  
Mr. H. The combination of Churches gives no office, and so no 
Pag. 114.  power to the Elders of many Churches, for they were Elders before the combination.  
Ans. That they were Elders before the combination, and made and ordained by the laying on of the hands of the people, which is your homogeneous Church, is an unwritten Tradition.  
2. The tacit consent of Sister-Churches even before the formal combination is enough on their part, who neighbour with them to make them Elders.  
M. H. Would you see a Pastor that hath the formal essence of a 
Pag. 123. The classical Elder hath nothing to do with Prelacy.  Pastor, and yet never did, nor is bound to preach? it is the classical Elder.  
2. The Pastor may preach in his own Congregation, and Minister the Sacraments; but 〈◊〉 Presbytery keeps the key of jurisdiction.  
3. The classical Elder is not bound to preach to them, over whom he hath jurisdiction. And this is the Bishop.  
Ans. A bishop is rather a Pastor to Pastors, then to the Churches: Envy cannot say this of the Elders of the Presbytery.  
2. The formal essence of a Pastor is not in being fixed to one Congregation, as a Husband to a Wife; so that it is adultery to act as a Pastor either in a Synod, or in another Congregation, as Mr. H. teacheth; for so Elders in a Synod, Apostles and Evangelists should not have the formal essence of Pastors.  
3. It is false that he is not bound to preach and minister the seals to another Congregation, or members thereof, if he be called thereunto. But the Bishop is a Bishop ex officio, is bound to preach to none, but a Sermon to the Clergy once a year, and not that he may be a Bishop and never preach.  
3. The Pastor of a Congregation as a Pastor hath power of jurisdiction in Collegio, and hath no majority of jurisdiction and ordination at all, as the Bishop hath.  
4. The Pastor of a Congregation, yea, all the officers thereof, poor men have no jurisdiction without the people, yea, the people without them have majority of jurisdiction to make and unmake all the officers, which is the formal essence of a prelate by Mr. H. his way; the prelate is the virtual Church: tell the Church, i. e. tell one single man, the Prelate, who need neither do by vote, or consent of other Elders or people, as the prelatical way teacheth. Our Elders are neither over the saith of the people, nor can they dispense censures contrary to the mind of the Godly. So Mr. H. hath not found the prelate with us: but the Male, Church which is above all their officers, and all others is the prelatical Church.  
But what if the Elders meet and confer this pow●r of sole jurisdiction upon one man, and make him more than a Moderator?  
Ans. What if the firmament fall? if they make a Bishop, they make a Bishop. I cannot stand; but see more of the prelate's their majority, pride, dignity, privileges in the Authors cited, 
Niceph. l. 8. c. 11. Sozom. l. 1. c. 14 Tripart. Hist. l. 1 c. 19 Cypr. Epist. 80. Bernar. Epist. 80. Euseb. l. 10. c. 3. Hieronymus in Episto. ad Titum, & ad Euagrium Epist. 85. ad Nepotianum de vita Clericorum. Socrates l. 7. c. 35. Cyprian. l. 1. Ep. 4 &. l. 4. Epist. 2. Concil. Antiochen. c. 14. Bernard. in Canti. Ser: 77. & Epist. 82. Brightm. in Apol. 3. See Archiep. Spalaten. de Rep. Eccles. l. 3. c. 1. Edwar. Didoclav. in altar. Damasceno. p. 24, 25, 26, 27. & fere per totum. Beza De gradibus Ministr. c. 1. etc. August. Epist. 19 Whitaker Cont. 4. q. 1. c. 3. sect. 30. Waldenses aut Aeneas Silvius Histor. Bohem. c. 35. Thom. Waldens. Doct. fidei, Tom. 1. l. 2. c. 60. Tom c. 7. Reinold. Colloq. cum Ha●t.  in nature and essence distinct from our Elders, or from Synodical Elders, against whom the argument fights with the like strength as against us. What famous Independents have refuted prelacy, I or a few can read.  
Mr. H. What rule of Christ condemneth the Churches of error, for giving the power of jurisdiction to one man, but will condemn the investing many Elders with jurisdiction over many Churches? let Mr. R. give me one place of Scripture, or one sound Reason for it; that one may be a Pastor to a people, by whom he was never chosen, etc.  
Ans. The places of Scripture that tell us the Elders of jerusalem were over so many as their constant officers, who could not meet in one Congregation, declare they had jurisdiction over that Church, otherwise Elders of that Church they could not be: but they could not all of them be chosen their Elders constantly teaching in all the Congregations; for that was impossible.  
And our grounds for a Presbyterian Church, and for Presbyterian Elders are these.  
1. To appoint Elders 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, in every City. Tit. 1. 5. Is to appoint a College, or Church-officers in every Church, the Town, or City of Samaria receiving the Gospel.  
1. As many, even from the greatest to the least, as were bewitched by Magus, Act. 8. 6. 9  
2. Both men and women were baptised, v. 12. and so were made a Church.  
3. The number being above the strength of Philip, and so more than one Congregation, they stood in need of Peter and john, v. 14. to help in the work.  
2. The first sampler Church of jerusalem is one Church in Government, 
A presbyterial Church was at jerusalem, Rome, Thessalonica, Ephesus, etc.  for their Elders are called the Elders of the Church of jerusalem, Act. 2. 43, 44, 47. & 8. 1, 2. & 5. 11. & 11. 30. But that this Church was not all one Congregation, is clear.  
1. From the multitude thereof, Act. 2. 43. three thousand.  
2. Act. 4. 4. Five thousand. And then 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, multitudes of men, and women, Act. 3. 14. and yet they were multiplied, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, exceedingly; and a great company of the Priests (hard metal to be wrought upon) was obedient to the faith, Act 6. 7.  
2. They meet in sundry places from house to house, Act. 2. 
Synod at Westminster.  46. & 5. 42. for the celebration of the Lords Supper, breaking of bread; nor is it like they durst bring into the Temple the new seal of the Supper. The dissenting Brethren refused that.  
3. The multitude of twelve preaching Apostles for some years, and seven Deacons for the poor, declare, that in  
1. Such a plentiful harvest,  
2. In such a necessity of gathering souls.  
3. Of preaching in season, and out of season; that one Apostle could not preach to one Congregation, the other eleven hearing, that were twelve reapers all in one ridge, in one single Congregation, where eleven that time must be silent.  
4. The Apostle spoke with divers tongues, that these of all nations understood, Act. 2. 1, 2, 3. Therefore in divers meetings; nor is it clear, that all the three thousand heard Peter: the Text saith (v. 37.) they that heard were pricked, Act. 2. 11. the rest of the Apostles also spoke, as Mr. H. thinketh.  
5. What agreeth to the Apostles as Elders, agreeth to all Elders, 
The Apostles act as an ordinary Presbytery, Act. 6.  but the Apostles Act. 6. as Elders, not as Apostles (which is a Presbytery of twelve Elders over divers Congregations) chose Deacons, lay hands on them, and praying ordain them, v. 6. and use the joint concurrence of the people for the choosing of them, as a standing example to the Churches. Now what they do as Apostles either in writing Scripture, working miracles, speaking with tongues, etc. they neither seek nor need the help or occurrence of others, either people, or any else. There is no ground to say that all these thousands meet in Solomon's porch, Act. 5. 12. at one act of divine worship Congregational, or that they were all joining in one and the same prayer, or that they returned (to wit, Peter, and john) to their own, that is, all the thousands, but to the Apostles, who spoke the word with boldness, Act. 4. 23, 31. nor doth the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, multitude, note every individual person, man and woman, Mat. 8. 37. The whole multitude of the Gadarens besought Christ to depart: Festus, Act. 25. 24. All the multitude hath deal● with me about Paul. Luke 1. 10. The whole multitude were praying without. See the Reverend Assembly at Westminster.  
They meet 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, in every house (it notes a Church-meeting, Act. 5. 42. & 16. 15. & 20 7, 8, 10. Rom. 16. 5. 1 Cor. 16. 19 Phil. 1. 2.) but that all these thousands interessed in ordinances and government (as the Brethren say) meet for the same word, breaking of bread, government and censures, in the same house, needs no refutation, it refutes itself.  
3. The Church of Rome, though one body, had many members, 
The Church of Rome was a Presbyterial Church.  Rom. 12. and could not be one single Congregation.  
1. In it were many Church's lesser, as the house of Aristobulus, Rom. 16. 0. Of Narcissus, v. 11. & 14. Philol●gus, Ne●ea, Iul●us, and all the Saints w●th them, v. 15. the Church at the house of Aquila and Priscilla: many teachers and fellow-helpers, ve●s. 3, 9, 12.  
4. The Church of Thessalonica could not be one single Congregation; 
The Church of Th●ssalonica, of Antioch, Presbyterian churches.  their faith being heard in all Achaia and all places, 1 Thes. 1. 6, 7, 8. of them Paul gloried in all the Churches, v. 16. Paul at one Sermon converted of them 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, a great mul titude, and of devout women, Act. 17. 4. not a few: also what must be the growth of that Church, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Act. 15. 33. when they tarried at Antioch, Steph. some time, Beza not a 
Steph. Cum aliquid temporis ib● consumpsissent. B●z●. Aliquandiu, tempore non parvo. Lorin. In Loc. non solum P●trus, sed Pau●us aliique Apoli & Apostolici viri versati sunt. Marloratus, Hoc quidam exponunt quod sacer coetus in eorum d●iro cogeretur. Pareus Com. in Rom. 16. Observemus ve●o Ecclesiae nomen paucis fide●●ous Christi nomine congregatis convenire— ubi duo vel tres— nemo tamen inde collig●● Ecclesiam dom●sticam esse infallibilem. B●za in Rom. 16. 5. Neque mirum est in tam ampla civitate distinct●s fuisse fidelium coetus. Calv. ib. Horum itaque domum Ecclesi●m dixit, non solum quia Christi fidem exceperunt, sed quia hospitio credentes admitterent.  little time. Paul and Barnabas continued there 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, with many other Teachers; and when God layeth the daily care of all the Churches upon one man, 2 Cor 11. 28. and upon other eminent members of the same body, that the Lord sent so many eminent Teachers, and Prophets to one Congregation only at Antioch, at Corinth, who can believe it?  
5. The Church of Eph●sus had divers Congregations, if not more than one, 1 Cor. 16. 19 The Churches of Asia salu●● you, Aquila and Priscilla salute you much in the Lord, with th● Church at their house. So Marlorat, so Par●us and B●za on Rom. 16. See the English Divines on the place, and Diodati. There were divers small assemblies in one and the self same City. See 1 Cor. 16. 19 Col. 4. 15. So were Church-assemblies ordinary for praying in the house of Mary, Act. 12. 12. Joh. 20. 19, 26. in an upper chamber, at preaching, praying and choosing of an Apostle, Act. 1. 13. praying and baptising in the house of justus, Act. 18. 7, 8 preaching in the Scho●l of Tyrannus, Act. 19 9 preaching. celebrating of the Lords supper in a house of Troas Act. 20. 8, 20. & 5. 42. & 10. 24. The Assembly of Divines at Westminster proveth that there were more congregations than one at Ephesus. 2. That there were many Elders over them as one flock, Act 20. 17, etc. 3. That these congregations were one Church, Rev. 2. To which add,  
1. The multitude of converts Luke saith, Act. 19 10, 17. three times 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, all the jews and Greeks in Asia and at Ephesus heard the Gospel, a great door there was opened, Sorcerers converted, Act. 19 and Paul giveth direction to Timothy, how he should govern in the house of God. 1 Tim. 3. 15, 16. at Ephesus, 1 Tim. 1. 3. upon whom he should lay hands, 1 Tim. 5. 22. 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2. 1 Tim. 6. 4. to what faithful men able to teach others he should commit the Ministry, 2 Tim. 2. 2. Had it been a single congregation, where one might teach at once only, what needed such watching over false Teachers, speaking perverse things, and gathering Disciples and Churches out of one single Church, Act 20. 27, 28, 29. and trying of false Apostles, Rev. 2. 1, 2, 3. who were not sent to one single congregation, and there hath been need to take heed to such as speak lies, sow unprofitable questions, 1 Tim. 4. 1, 2, 3, 6, 11, 12. 2 Tim. 6. 3, 4. 2 Tim. 2. 14, 15, 16. and so there must have been many preaching Elders there.  
6. At Corinth there have been many instructers, 1 Cor. 4. 16. many Doctors and prophets, 1 Cor. 14. 24, 31, 32.  
7. Though there be many Churches in Galatia, Gal. 1. 2. yet must they be one lump, who have power to judge and censure false teachers, Gal. 5. 9 and there is a Church restoring made by spiritual officers, Gal 6. 1. otherwise they might have replied, We Galatians have no power in one body to cut off a troubler who infecteth the whole lump, every single congregation is to see to that, and the troubler is without our Churches, save to one only single Independent power, say our Brethren.  
8. It's not possible that the Churches can send their common 
That sund●y Churches send messengers prove a meeting of the Elders of those Churches, for all men & women who are the Churches of the redeemed ones could not meet in one place. M. H. Survey, par. 1. c. 3. p. 40.  Messengers whom they choose, 2 Cor. 8. 19, 23. except the Churches convene, men, women and children, or then convent in Elders of many Churches, or the Apostles must have gone from Church to Church to beg suffrages and votes: which sort of Election is never heard of in any Writer sacred or profane.  
As to the first, who can believe that men and women and children capable to hear and be baptised also (which is the only Church of Believers owned by our Brethren) the externally covenanted and redeemed did send the Apostles to jerusalem? or received the Apostles, and did welcome them? or salute the Saints, as Act. 16 3, 4. Rom. 16. 16 Act. 15. 22, 27, 28? therefore need for it, the second must be said. That the Churches in their Heads, Rulers, Officers, sent them, which is a very Presbyterial Church.  
9 If divers Churches meet for laying on burdens by power of the Keys, as M. Cot. saith, & exercising acts of Church-government, than there is a Presbyterial Church governing without and above a single congregation, by pastors neither chosen to be fixed and constant teachers, nor that can possibly teach many congregations. But the former Mr. Cotton and our Brethren teach.  
Obj. This is no Church-power (for a Synod is not a Church) b●cause it is no Church-jurisdiction.  
Ans. 1. The Antecedent is false. 2. The Consequence is 
There is a Church-power in a Synod without and above a single congregation.  naught. A number of private Christians wanting all official Authority, so might lay on Synodical burdens binding materially, if this be no Church-power.  
2. They are called the Decrees of Apostles and Elders, Act. 16. 4. written and concluded. Act. 21. 25. Saith james, Act. 15. 22. It seemed good to the Apostles and Elders, with the whole Church, to send chosen men. Now whether Church note the Apostles, Elders and Brethren, or the multitude of believers only, or the Church of jerusalem, made up of both, the Decrees must come from Church-power, governing, teaching, uniting and removing a Schism. Though it were no power of jurisdiction, yet here is a Church-power above a Church, except it be said that so many pastors of the same or of divers Churches, or so many private Christians commissionated from no Churches, made the Synod, Act. 15. and Synodically said, It seemed good to the holy Ghost, and to us. But this shall no more import the promised presence of Christ to such as are convened in his Name, Mat. 18. 19 20. & 28. 19, 20, 21. joh. 2. 21. than if so many private Christians had been convened, and so may such of a sister-Church remove all Schisms, and a Synod shall be nothing at all.  
10. If Christ build the power of binding, losing, gaining upon brotherhood, Mat. 18. If thy brother offend, etc. then as far as brotherhood goes, if I possibly can converse with him, and may be offended or edified by him, so far must the power of jurisdiction be extended; because these two, The gaining of a brother, 2. The safety of the Church by edifying of others, and removing of scandals, are intended by Christ. Mat. 18. but brotherhood is without the bounds of the congregation whereof I am a member; Rom. 16 14. Salute the brethren that are with them; 1 Cor. 16. 20. All the brothers salute you. These were brethren of other congregations.  
2. If there be no Church-tye upon me to gain any but those 
Mat. 18. cannot warrant me to gain no trespassing brethren in a Church way, but only the brethren of that congregation of which I am a member.  of mine own congregation: then 1. There may be communion of Saints only within the same congregation, and no communion of Churches: what Scripture is for this?  
3. It must be the will of Christ that we bestow no Church-rebukes upon other Churches; which must be contrary  
1. To Christian love, to save others.  
2. Contrary to zeal for the Lords glory.  
3. Spreading the Gospel.  
4. Desire to remove Scandals.  
5. To be made all things to all men, to save some.  
6. To serve one another in love.  
7. To promote the common interest of the whole catholic Body of Christ.  
8. It's against our praying for the Church, and that all Israel may be saved. 
Narration of the practice of the Churches of N. E. p. 16, 17, 18.   
9 Against the Doctrine of our Brethren, who say, That Churches ought to rebuke, exhort, warn, comfort Churches.  
10. It's against the communion of Spiritual privileges of one Head and Saviour, one Covenant, one God, one Faith, etc. It's not enough to say, We are the same Body entitatiuè, for that 
Way of the Churches of Ch●m. N. E. c. 6. sect. 1, 2, 3. Cotton Keyes.  entitative Body without this congregation, is either visible or invisible; if visible, than members of divers congregations are of the same visible body: and to say that other congregations are not as visible as that whereof I am a member, to me and others about, is to deny twice three to be six; for one Christ, one Faith, one Profession, the same seals, are as visible in a Church within few paces to me, as in the Church whereof I am a member: to say it is invisible, is to speak against sense.   

CHAP. VII.  
Of a Church in an Island.  
MR. H. If a Church in an Island may dispense all Censures, 
Par. 1. c 9 sect. 3. p. 125.  and all Ordinances, than every congregation may: But such a Church may. For 1. it is a City and a little Kingdom of Christ. 2. The essential notes of a visible Church agree to it.  
Ans. The consequence from a broken arm to a whole arm 
The independence of a Church in an Island is its affliction, not its power.  is not good: or, because james the day before he be beheaded in strong prison, cannot discharge all Christian duties to brethren, and to neighbour Churches, therefore he is not actu primo a Christian. A Church in an Island is not actually associated with other Churches, and so cannot in the full extent dispense all Ordinances of rebuking, comforting neighbour Churches, and of withdrawing communion from them, because of the want of the object, not because of defect in the subject: I might retort the argument, Therefore associated congregations cannot dispense all Ordinances of rebuking, comforting, etc. But the latter is absurd.  
2. An homogeneal Church in an Island void of pastors and men able to teach, cannot administer the Seals by Mr. H. his way.  
3. A Church so divided, and not associated, is imperfect, and may remove scandals within itself; but it follows not, Ergo, every associated Church may remove scandals within itself, and without itself also independently, and without any subordination to united powers of the associated congregations, it follows not, the notes of a visible Church agree to such a Church imperfectly; except it be said, That the same Church from its own intrinsecal and internal independency can dispense censures, it proves nothing; but the independency here is extrinsical and objective, and so accidental, and the affliction, not the power of jurisdiction in this Church.  
Mr. H. There be all the officers in such a Church in an Island, and all the operations, operari sequitur esse— and the end is the same in both, the perfecting of the Body.  
Ans. There be neither all the Church-operations, because 
There are neither the same perfect operations, nor the adequate and complete end of edification in a Church in an Island.  there is no dispensing of pastoral acts, censures, Church rebukings, Church-warnings to neighbour Churches; nor is there the same adequate end, which is the perfecting of the visible body round about, as far as may be, which is the complete end of an associated Church: the perfecting of one single congregation, is a mangled and imperfect end.  
Mr. H. 3 Ground. Where there is an office or power appointed of God, there needs no other power, but the office to authorise the work.  
Ans. There is nothing more false. Every pastor hath a power to preach, but there is need of a call of God to preach to Macedonia, not to Bythinia, Acts 16. There is need of a call to preach fixedly to this, not to this flock, and to ossociated Churches.  
2. How is it proved? its but begged that there is a power independent in an associated congregation.  
Mr. H. If the power be the same, and the end the same, the power must be vain, if it be not put forth to the end: the power 
Pag. 126.  and institution of Christ should be wronged, if it should be hindered in attaining its end.  
Ans. This is also a false ground. Power of admonishing, of rebuking, of preaching, is not wronged, when the object, to wit, neighbouring Churches, are not; and the Lord cannot wrong his own institution. It's a carnal reason, to say an institution is in vain, & a power, when they are not put forth in all possible acts. Steven is stoned, james is beheaded, Paul imprisoned, the Church scattered, that they cannot by a physical impossibility meet to remember the Lords death, preach the Gospel, dispense censures, is therefore the power given by Christ to do all these in vain?  
Mr. H. Neighbourhood of other Churches, is but a separable adjunct, it can add nothing to the constitution, and so to the operation of the Church; for death and dissensions may take away some Churches, and may nullify them.  
Ans. This is for me. Neighbour Churches are extrinsical to 
The nonexistence of associated Churches addeth nothing to the power intrinsical of a congregation to rule the associated Churches if they were.  the nature of a Church in an Island: Ergo, the Church in the Island hath a ministerial and official power actu primo to rule, and jointly edify the neighbour Churches, if they be. If any say Evah was accidental to the nature and to the operations of Adam, will it hence follow, a power of procreating children is accidental also to Adam? no more does it follow from the notexistence of neighbouring Churches, that the Church in the Island hath no power to edify, and jointly rule those nighbouring Churches, its poor Logic, because the object is not, to remove the power: Such a man is in a dark dungeon, Ergo, he hath no visive faculty; and because light and colours add nothing to the visive faculty, or to its nature and essence; Ergo, if light and colours be removed, the visive faculty is removed. So associated Churches are accidental to the Church in an Island; Ergo, that Church is deprived of all politic power to govern associated Churches, if they were, it follows not.  
Mr. H. Suppose a Church be gathered in a wilderness, any latter 
Page 126.  Church planted beside it, cannot hinder nor abridge the liberty, power, authority and operations, that all are from Christ; and when the same intrinsical power of constitution according to God, remains unaltered, the operations remain the same.  
Ans. 1. A Church or Churches added, do not hinder or abridge, nor bring any privative power; but the added Churches bring a perfecting, helping and cumulative power to perfect objectively in complete operations the former Church in the Island, in things of common concernment, in which both that Wilderness-Church, and the added Churches must be either edified or scandalised.  
2. When the same intrinsical power remains unaltered, the operations may be altered to the better, and perfected. Mr. H. deviseth much Logic of his own: When the visive faculty of a man brought out of a dungeon who could not see the daylight, seeth now, should the operations remain the same, when he is brought forth; Ergo, as he saw not before, so he sees not now.  
Mr. H. If it be said the Church in an Island should submit to a combination of Churches, as well as combine as members of a congregation: Ans. 1. This is to beg the question. 2. Suppose they will not (submit) than th● other Churches cannot command that, no more than a particular congregation can command me to be a member. 3. They ought not so to combine, as to prejudice the operations of that power they have received of Christ, and there is no warrant of Christ to hinder the operations of a Pastor or ruling Elder, more in one act of his office than another.  
Ans. The contrary is a begging of the question. For 
The adding of associated Churches to a Wilderness-church doth strengthen & perfect, and not nullify the intrinsecal power of the Wilderness-church.   
1. The Church in an Island should submit to the counsel and advice of new added Churches, as to the Lords Word, by Mr. H. his grant, Ergo, a new addition of Churches, as an addition, doth help, and not hinder the power.  
2. The addition of a new power of jurisdiction to the power that was in the Wilderness-church, and that in matters of common edification, as in dogmatic points, by grant of Adversaries, is no prejudging, except they over-vote, in a corrupt way, the Wilderness-church. And we say, Christ never gave any power of erring, or maladministration.  
3. The adding of 50 members to a Wilderness-church consisting of 25, shall have the same inconvenience: for the Wilderness-church is to submit to these added members, if added according to God (as we suppose) as to as lawful a Church-judicature as the Wilderness-church was before the addition. But what if they will not submit? Let Mr. H. see to that. I should think, by Mr. H. his grounds, they ought to submit, for they are added according to the Rule of Christ; and by Mr. H. his grounds they ought not to submit, (which is a contradiction.) For  
1. The power of the Wilderness-church, the authority within themselves, offices, officers, were before complete, were all from Christ. Ergo, the operations should be the same, and they should vote and conclude as they did before, without the addition of 50 members.  
2. Those 50 added are separable adjuncts to the constitution and nature, and so to the operations of the Wilderness-church. For by Mr. H. the Wilderness-church being of 25 members, was complete in essence and operations, before the addition of 50 members.  
3. The 50 members over-vote and nullify the righteous preceding of the poor holy Wilderness-church of 25. Ergo, here the power of a single congregation in the Island and the Wilderness must be over-turned by these three Arguments of Mr. H. Let his defenders see to it.  
4. A congregation may command me a visible professor so and so, dwelling near the Fountain, to confess Christ before men, and so to be a member.  
Obj. They cannot excommunicate a refuser to be a member, for a non-member cannot be c●st out.  
Ans. It's all along a false principle, that a man is no member until  
1● A Court congregational judicially judge of his Regeneration.  
2. Until he actually consent, and give up his Name as a married party: 3. and that to one only congregation; all are rotten and headless principles. What way pastors may be hindered in exercising pastoral acts, or acts of ruling, is clear: he may not publicly preach in a set time of his own appointing, without the Church's consent, by whom he is to be regulated, which is no hindering of the exercise of his power, as Mr. H. imagines, but a regulating thereof.  
Mr. H. The addition of any thing besides an office, adds no 
Pag. 117.  power of right or jurisdiction.  
Ans. True, but it extends the right of the Wilderness-church to so many members added, to 50 Infants to be baptised when born, to ten Churches about, when the Lord shall add them, not to rule over them, but to rule jointly over the whole combination with them, for promoting the Gospel in all.  
Mr. H. The ground of the combination is of no force, to wit, the preventing or curing the taint and pollution that a scandal will bring, by the nearness of combination. Therefore the combination is of no force, the scandal falls out in another Classis. 2. In the outside of the combination, nearer the congregation of another Classis than their own. 3. It goes far to another Province and Nation. The righteous proceeding according to the Rule of Christ, is a cure appointed to remove it, wherever it falls out, far or near.  
Ans. By combination, we do not mean only a combination of a Presbytery, but also of a Province, Nation; yea, of 
When scandals fall out far off or near hand, how association of Churches removeth them.  all the sound Christian Churches on earth, as the Synod of Dort, 1618. condemned the unsound Doctrine of the Arminians, by writing to all those either within or without the Church, and nearness of habitation is not the adequate ground (though a ground it is, 1 Cor. 5. 1. It is reported there is among you fornication, etc.) of the danger of pollution.  
2. The reason, Because the scandal may fall out without the combination of the Classis, is no reason why the combination is of no force, for the combination is upon other grounds also, to wit, the establishing in the faith, the increase of the Churches, Acts 16. 4, 5. the gathering of the Saints, and perfecting of the body, Eph. 4. 12. edifying the body, beside the preventing and curing of scandals.  
3. It's to beg the question, to say, that the proceeding of the Independent congregation of Antioch (say it were so) is a cure for the scandalous Doctrine of salvation by circumcision, preached at jerusalem, Acts 15. 1. troubling the Churches of Syria and Cilicia, Acts 15. 23, 24. Yea, this is for Mr. H. to say, the holy Ghost used not a sufficient cure. As for that, to say scandals should not be prevented and cured by the combination, because they may fall out without the combination; his meaning is, without the combination classical, or congregation, it makes Christ's remedy nonsufficient, that either there can be no Provincial, no National scandals, contrary to experience, or then Christ hath provided no Church-remedy to remove them, but only the power of a single congregation, which hath no power at all, but over themselves. Hence this rotten principle, 
The limiting of Church-edifying and Church-comforting to one only congretien whereof the man only is a sworn member, is an unwarrantable and comfortless way.  That Church feeding is due to none under the New Testament, but to persons hampered into the Pinfold and Judaical Prison of one single congregation, against which 1. it licenseth the most godly Saints on earth, residing at Corinth, if they be no Church-members of that Church,  
1. To deny Christ and Church-ordinances before men, when Christ's sends out his servants, as Mat. 22 3, 4. Luke 14. 16, 17. for they may say, the Lord calls none to Church-ordinances at Corinth, but members of that Church, and such are we not.  
2. It licenseth them to despise Church-prophecying, Church-praying, Church-praising.  
3. To disobey a Gospel-command, though they have visibly to the conscience of all tried themselves. Do this in remembrance of me: whereas Christ limits his invitation to all who can discern his body. Mr. H. must say its adultery for the members of the Church of Philippi, to remember the Lords death in the Church of Corinth.  
4. That Doctrine is not of God, which debars the birds, sheep, and children of God sojourning in what fields or land soever (as it were) from feeding as his Eagles upon the carrion, in every lawful Churchway; or from watching at the gates, and waiting at the posts of the doors of Wisdom, except in that only congregation to which they are sworn by marriage oath, or from seeding at any table of the Lord, or dwelling all the days of their life in the New Testament-sanctuary, to behold the beauty of the Lord, Prov. 8. 35. 36. Psal. 23. 6. & 27 4. except in one single congregation: but such is the Doctrine of 
The Way of Churches of N. E. c. 1. sec. 1. p. 1. c. 4. sec. 3. sec. 4. p 70, 71. Mr. H. Survey, pa. 3. c. 2. p. 10. M. Cotton, keys of the kingd. c. 7. p. 39, 40, 4●.  an independent congregation, the only visible Church of the New Testament, as they say.  
5. That Doctrine is not of God, which confines Church-comforts, Church-praying, etc. to one single congregation, and puts us in a worse, if not in as hard a condition as the Jews, whose public Temple-service was tied to the Temple; whereas in the New Testament, 1 Tim. 3. 8. (as in the Old also in some sense) we may pray in every place, lifting up holy hands without wrath and doubting. But we may not pray, praise, and heat churchways in any place by this way, but in our own congregation, although the Lord promise to create on Zions' assemblits a cloud and a smoke by day, and the shining of a fleming fire by night, Isa. 4. 5. and that upon all the Lords Mount.  
6. The sojourner is left to the Eunuch's complaint, I am a dry tree; there is glory in this assembly, but I have neither part nor portion in it: Nor will it establish the heart to say, I see the beauty of the Lord in my own congregation, for these under the New Testament can find no solace and comfort from that Psal. 106. Remember me, O Lord, with the favour that thou bearest to thy people. Nor can it be the comfort of an Institution, which is something more to a believing sojourner, and David banished to want, than we conceive● when David's spirit is overwhelmed, when he wants the joy, presence and com●ort of instituted holy days, Psal. 42. 4. and of Tabernacle-consolation with the covenanted people of God, which made the sparrows more happy than he was, Psal. 84. 1, 2, 3, 4. and yet he had soul-refreshments in lively desires, Psal. 63. 1, 2. For the godly sojourner is not of that covenanted visible body with the Church to which he is a stranger; for by this way, he is an alien, and deprived of their sanctuary joy and glory of that cong●egregation, both in Church-hearing, believing, and joy of the seals.  
7. By this way, Christ must promise his Ministerial presence, and his Spirit, not always, as Mat. 28. 20. Eph. 4. 11, 12. joh. 20. 21. Acts 1. 8. and in every congregation where they open the mouth, but only in one fixed congregation. With what faith can they preach elsewhere? or people hear the pastors elsewhere?   

CHAP. VIII.  
Arguments against a Presbyterial Church taken from the Name and Nature of the Church, Matth. 18. are discussed.  
MR. H. A Church in the Gospel is never used for the Elders 
Mr. H. par. 1. c. 9 p. 127, 128. sec. 4. 3 ground  only.  
Ans. It is never used in the N. T. for men only who govern, secluding women and children, as Mr. H. takes it; nor for the people secluding the Elders as a governing Society; but of the signification hereafter. But it cannot be a binding and authoritative losing Church.  
Mr. H. There cannot be a definition given that will agree to a Congregational and Presbyterial Church.  
Ans. Ergo, There is no Presbyterial Church, it follows 
One and the same nature agrees to the congregational, presbyterial Church, etc. Pag. 127. 128.  not.  
2. As we take a Congregational Church for the Eldership ruling, it is false. One and the same nature of a Ruling Church agreeth to the Congregational, Presbyterial, Provincial Eldership: and so they differ per magis & minus, as is said.  
Mr. H. If the Congregations be species specialissimae of a true Church, than there can be no lower species resulting or arising from them, as this doth.  
Ans. No Logic can say, the Church of Boston so existing 
The congregational, Presbyterial, National, Oecumenick Churches are species specialissimae.  hath other species of the Church of Boston under it. The hand of Socrates cannot be called species specialissima; nor is the hand, to speak Logically, a species; it is a part, and an uncomplete part of the body. If Mr. H. mean, as it seems he doth, that we make Presbyterian, Provincial Churches, lower species and kinds of Congregational Churches, the pious man refutes Presbyterian Government, which he understands not. For species specialissima praedicatur de inferioribus, according to Aristotle his, Ramus, and all Logic. And O what Monsters feed we if this be true properly (a Presbyterial Church is a Congregational Church) or (a Congregation is a Presbyterial Church) for the congregation is an integral part of the Presbyterian Church, the Presbyterian likewise an integral part of the Provincial: but neither of them is species to other, except we say, Euphrates is the Element of Water, the Element of water is Euphrates.  
M. H. If every congregation hath all the integral parts of a Church, than it is an entire and complete Church.  
Ans. Therefore it is an entire politic Church in its association 
How a congregation is an entire church. Tertul. in Apolog.  with other Churches, it follows not. But what then? London is an entire city having all the integral parts of a Society, Major, Sheriffs, Aldermen, Rulers and ruled, Ergo, London is no part of England, nor ruled by the Parliament of England. What Logic is this? But if the meaning be, that the congregation associated in the midst of ten congregations, is so a city different in species and in nature from all other congregations, and so married to its own Pastors, as the husband and wife are, so that to exercise Church-acts, official acts without themselves, is adultery and unlawful; and so as this Church is no integral part of the body Catholic, it's against Scripture and sound reason, and a begging of the question.  
Mr. H. Every integrum is made up of his members, therefore in nature they are before, therefore Churches before Classis; therefore what each have they receive from them; therefore they have no office, but from them; therefore both ordination and jurisdiction come from them.  
Ans. I desider at a Syllogism.  
Every whole Incorporation is made up of its members that are before the whole, and hath power, offices, ordination and jurisdiction from these members. It is denied by us, and nakedly asserted by Mr. H. For 
Though the Churches of believers, men and women be before the Apostles, Evangelists, Pastors, Presbyteries, Synods, yet it follows not, therefore must Apostles, Pastors, Synods have their calling and authority from those Churches.   
1. The Churches are before the Apostles, Ergo, the Apostles had their immediate calling and power of jurisdiction from the Churches. It is against Scripture: as women and children are by nature before officers; ergo, officers have their ordination and jurisdiction from women and children. 3 Churches are before counselling and advising, yea as Mr. Cotton saith well before, pastorally and authoritatively determining Synods, Ergo, Synods have all their synodical power to counsel and pastorally teach from the Churches, they came from, it follows not, not will our brethren yield the consequence.  
Mr. H. If a Congregation grow too big, and therefore be forced 
Sect. 4. p. 128. Mr. Hooker acknowledges that divers meetings and Church conventions may may be all under one Presbyterial government, only he will not call them Churches.  to swarm out; or in ease they transplant themselves from one place to another, so that part be forced to go before others, to make preparation for those that follow, we then send an Officer with the smaller party, and the greater number remain with the rest: and yet are all but one Church in our account, and under one Presbytery of chosen Elders of the Congregation.  
Ans. 1. Why do not our Brethren show a practice of this in the Church of jerusalem, consisting of so many Act. 2. & 4. & 6. thousands, if more than five thousands all in one congregation? Was there not need that four or six congregations should swarm out of six thousands, and six Officers be sent with them? in which case, suppose they go forty miles to a new Colony, and five congregations meet in five sundry places for Word and Sacraments, here must be five Churches, ●s our brethren take the word Church, 1 Cor. 11. 18. Act. 11. 16 & 21. 22. & 4. 31. Mat. 18. 17. & 16. 18. Sure, though they had no Officers, they are a homogeneous true visible Church, as Mr. H teacheth, page 1. c. 5. page 5. and so here, or six Churches (if we contend not about names) under one Presbyterial government, which is the yielding of the cause, and yet at forty miles' distance, and yet by no will or appointment can they meet in one place, O but they are all one Church in our account! one congregation in Christ's account. Show us Scripture for this acception of the word Church in Old or New Testament; that they are one single congregation, otherwise Mr. H. his account is no account: If they be one Church, because they have one and the same power, jurisdiction; officers they had before. So we say, and the same power and jurisdiction in nature and essence we grant; but so all the congregations on earth have one and the same power and jurisdiction, covenant, seals, saith, Christ, hope of glory; so we agree. Why dispute we, if the meaning be, that all these six swarms (for a thousand will be a number too great for one congregation, if not sufficient) are but one individual congregation, though now separated by forty miles, and meeting in six sundry places.  

1. Give us Scripture for that Church.  
2. Give us any Greek Author sacred or profane, that so speaks, for we stand not to Mr. H. his account in this.  
3. Where there are and must be six sundry meetings, coitiones six numero distinctae.   
2. Six companies hearing at the same time six several Sermons.  
3. Partaking of six Tables of the Lord numerically distinct, 
Way of the Church. c. 1. sect. par. 1.  here sure must be fix congregations, as our Brethren define us a Church, a company of Believers meeting in one place, etc. And if so, here is a prelacy.  
3. A number of non-resident; for all are Elders ruling; but it is physically impossible, that all can be Elders teaching. So Mr. H. then it is no● essential to a Church that they meet all 
Survey par. 1. c. 9 p. 110, 111 etc.  〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, in one place, as the brethren often tell us.  
M. H. But when the Congregations are fixed, and they established in peace, and settled with support about them, not more than may comely and comfortably meet together, to partake of all ordinances, should be one Church.  
Ans. If the six swarms, which issue out of the numerous 
Mr. H. must be forced by his own principles to grant there is one visible Church which cannot meet conveniently 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, in the same place, and yet under the same Eldership.  Church of jerusalem, disturb the peace, and make war and division in the Church, it is strange. The Eldership or Presbytery over these six swarms, so separated by many miles in divers Colonies, may either meet and exercise discipline, and dispense censures to these six swarms not yet settled, and provided with Officers, or they may not meet. To say they may not meet for that end, is to deny that they are under one Presbytery of the same chosen Elders, contrary to what Mr. H. said. If they may meet to dispense censures, here shall be ruling Elders, & no physical possibility of teaching the swarms so separated as forty miles, they may haply hear of written Decrees, as Act. 16. 4. but cannot be edified by preaching.  
2. So this Church congregational which cannot comely and comfortably meet to partake of all the ordinances, is no ordinance of Christ, and so no congregational Church. But such are these swarms that are forty miles distant.  
3. This Church is either visible, or not; neither can be said by Mr. H. his principles, as elsewhere is proved.  
Mr. H. Hence an answer may be easily accommodated to the examples which Mr. R. brings for a Presbyterian Church.  
1. That of the Apostles will no wise suit his end for to make up a Presbyterial Church; there must be many congregations, many Elders appropriated to these congregations, which have power over their own only, and not over others; and these must combine, and upon the combination, the Elders must assemble and d●spence their censures, and set down their decisions. But there were no Elders at Jerusalem appropriate to their several charges and Churches, which had power only over them; and such Elders the Apostles could not be, because though they had all power in them, yet they had no power limited for that should contradict their Apostolic commission.  
Ans. I smile to read this worthy man yield in terminis a Presbyterial 
Mr. H. yields to us a Presbyterian Church at jerusalem.  Church; and yet be saith, the examples serve not Mr. R. his end. Why? saith he,  
1. To make up a Presbyterial Church, there must be many congregations; good: so say we.  
2. There must be many Elders appropriated to these Congregations, which have power over their own only (saith he) and not over others; That we deny. I should say, any other save this worthy man, (whom I much loved and ever honoured) who would write a Book against Presbyterial government, and yet did not understand the constituent elements of a presbyterial Church, deserves to be censured; for Mr. H. yieldeth all the presbyterial Church that Mr. R. pleads for, or that the famous Synod at Westminster desire; where there were eminently learned men, who well understood Presbyterial government, and all adversaries thereof. An eminent man Mr. jer. Burroughs, one of the dissenting Brethren, did not oppose, nor enter his dissent against the proposition, concerning a Presbyterial Church, as Mr. H. does; nor look upon it as a principal of Presbyterial government; only the Dissenters did hold, there was but one single congregation at jerusalem, in which they are redacted to miserable absurdities; and in these two Mr. H. contradicts them: let them compose their domestic contradictions. See the answer of the Assembly of Divines to the seven dissenting Brethren, An. 1644. Suppose in Jerusalem (saith the Synod) there 
Page 51.  were ten congregations, and twenty officers, feeding and ruling them in common, not one of them fixed to any one congregation. This kind of Presbytery would pass for a lawful government: and none of these incongruities or absurdities are charged on them, by this argument: and it shall not follow that ruling and teaching are not commensurable, as the Holy Ghost makes them commensurable.  
2. Mr. H. cannot, nor any man for him, clear from that text Act. 2● whether they were fixed or not fixed, they are the Elders of the Church of jerusalem, that is, as Mr. H. saith, contradicting the dissenting Brethren, Elders of divers congregations, under one Presbyterial government, which is all we crave.  
2. Fixedness or not fixedness of Elders is an accident of the 
Fixedness or no fixedness of the Elders of jerusalem to their own proper congregations is altogether accidental to the Church presbyterial. The Apostles fixed feeding at Rome, at Corinth, is not opposite unto, but of that same nature with his feeding pastoral all the world over.  visible governing Church to our Brethren: who hold that it is the same numerical Church homogeneous, which being void of Elders, may choose their officers, and thereafter being fixed and form, may excommunicate all their Elders, if they turn heretical; so that the people is the Church without their officers, and the officers to Mr. H. are separable adjuncts, and the coming or going of the separable adjuncts of the Church cannot alter the nature of the Church. It is most weak, that Mr. H. saith, that the Apostles could not be fixed Pastors to them, for than they should be limited Pastors to them, and so not Apostles: for there can be no contradiction between Apostles and Pastors, for their fixed preaching, and fixed administering of the seals. For example, Paul's pastoral officiating a year and six months at Corinth, Act. 18. 11. and so many years at Sphesus, so many years at Rome, differs not in nature and essence from the pastoral preaching and administering of the seals in constantly fixed Pastors, chosen to the congregation for all their life: and yet he remained habitu, and actu primo an Apostle. Yes the adding of an extraordinary seal of a miracle, contradicts not the charter, or the preaching of the Gospel, more than samuel's judging at Gilgal, is opposite to his judging all Israel at Ramah: Extension of preaching to many is a mere accident; and a members receiving of the Supper in his own Church is not opposite to his receiving thereof in four other Churches. See the Answer of the Assembly, page 115, 116.  
As also, if the twelve Apostles govern, as they do, Act. 6. All the twelve meetings, and yet neither do, nor can preach all 
All the incongruities that are the only arguments of Mr. H. against a Presbyterial church, are militant against the presbyterial Church which Mr. H. grants was at jerusalem.  of them to every one of the twelve, except all the twelve be in twelve several meetings at once, then (which is a monstrous impossibility)  
1. Ruling is divided from preaching.  
2. Then all the twelve cannot fulfil their Ministry. Yes,  
3. Then Episcopal ruling of many Churches, and neither being bound, nor able to teach any of them, or all of them, is not sinful. But sure the Apostles might govern, send their decrees, and Epistles to many Churches, the members whereof they never saw in the face.  
Nor could all the many thousands, who had power of judging with the Elders, as our Brethren say, meet in one place comely and comfortably to act: and therefore Christ so must never have appointed such a judicature, to rule all these congregations, who are entitatively one; so must they say what we say, and more. For all the congregations on earth are entitatively and in nature one, and yet our Brethren will be far from saying, that they are all under one government, as they say that these meetings at jerusalem were.  
M. H. The rest of the examples of Antioch, Ephesus, Rome, though it were granted upon their greater growth, and increase, and so want of Elders, they might meet in divers places for the while, these might still be under one presbytery, their officers in a distinct manner attending upon them. And therefore Gerson Bucerus in his answer says here, Quis adeo ineptire sustinuerit, etc. Who can say; that because they meet in divers places, they were under divers Presbyteries, or Elders?  
Ans. 1. This is a short way of answering, with a leaving out of the Church of Samaria, a great City, wherein all both men and women were baptised, the Church of Corinth, of Thessalonica, etc.  
2. And yet there is no less cause to say all the Saints 
Mr. H. well near also yieldeth that there was a Presbyterian Church at Antioch, Ephesus, Rome.  at Rome, Antioch, Ephesus, Samaria could not meet in one place, then that these of jerusalem could not.  
2. If they might meet in divers places, for the while, and yet be under one Presbytery; Here is a Presbyterial Church of many Congregations, for a while. Here is a Prelatical and Antichristian Government, for a while, at least ordained by Christ.  
And Mr. H. writes a Book with a huge noise of absurdities, with which he burdens his Brethren the Presbyterians; yet he will suffer their Church to stand, for a while.  
3. Who told Mr. H that a Presbyterial Church may stand for a while, during the time of the growth of the the Church of jerusalem, Antioch, Ephesus, but no longer? for when the swarmed out Churches are once settled, the Presbyterian Church must down again, since the Scripture speaks nothing of this. Who gave Mr. H. leave to set up an Antichristian Tabernacle (for so is the Presbytery to him) for an hour, and pull it down again?  
4. It is a wonder that Mr. H. should cite Gerson Bucer cuttedly, as a Witness so much for a Presbyterial Church, not in the swarming out of Churches only (of which Bucer hath not one word) but in the settled state of the Church: for Bucer contradicts Mr. H. and all his as foolishly erring, when they say such Churches meet in divers places for the Word and Seales; Ergo, they are independent in their government, and cannot be under one common government. Bucer saith, if they lie near together, it is folly to say they are under divers Presbyteries, and so say we.  
Mr. H. 2. It doth not appear out of any Text, nor any evincing Argument gathered therefrom, that (setting aside the Church of Jerusalem) they should needs meet in several places.  
Ans. Then the Church of jerusalem met in sundry places, by Mr. H. his argument: but this shall offend the dissenting Brethren, that maintain against the Synod at Westminster, that 
There are the like reasons, that the multitudes of Believers at Rome, Antioch, Ephesus, Corinth, Samaria, Thessalonica, could not meet in one place, and so there must be in these huge Cities many Congregations under one Presbyterial Government, as for the multitudes at jerusalem.  they meet all in one place.  
2. Mr. H. should have given a reason, why the Church of jerusalem met in sundry places, and not the other Churches of Antioch, Ephesus, but because he saw our Arguments run as strong for other Churches as for jerusalem. He was pleased to dictate what he could not demonstrate, and so leave the Reader in the dark.  
3. Before I leave this, let Mr. H. or his teach what is meant by this, that there were about three thousand added to the Church, Act. 2. 21. whether by the Church be meant the one hundred and twenty, of which ch. 1. and whether there the one hundred and twenty were there to receive the three thousand as members at that time in a judicial way? And if they were not there, how the three thousand were not added primarily to the Catholic Christian Church that then was; and secondarily 
What is meant by Church, Act. 2. were added to the Church.  to this, or to that Church? as we say. For when there were said to be added to the Church, they were not added to themselves.  
Mr. H. 3. Let it be considered, whether by Church may not be meant many Churches. Saul made havoc of the Church. i e. of the faithful of many Churches.  
Ans. It is weak as water, Saul persecuteth the Church, i. e. 
Mr. H. inclines to exp●… the word C●…h of the ●●●thful, Saul made havoc of the C●…. E●…, there is 〈◊〉 Presbytery a church. How watery is this Logic?  members of the independent Church: Ergo, there is no Presbyterial Church. Ergo, there is not such a thing as a Synod, for he persecuted james, Peter, and the Elders and Brethren, members of the Synod, where he might find them; now the Apostles were not fixed member of congregations: and let Mr. H. consider whether Luke gives not a better interpretat on then he, Act. 83. Saul made havoc of the Church, entering into every house, and haling m●n and women, and committed them to p●ison. So that Saul destroyed the scattered members, that were n●t inchurched, and where he found any of this way, Act. 9 2. whether members of a congregation, or not, even members of divers meetings under one Presbytery, as he grants, he persecuted them. And by this the Church at jerusalem, Act. 11. 22. must be Churches congregational at jerusalem. And Act. 2. The Lord added to the Church such as should be saved; that is, the Lord added to divers Independent Congregations, such as should be saved; good: but this Church and these common Elders meet for acts of Government, Act. 2. 18. and the day following, Paul went in with us to J●…, and all the Elders (verse 25.) were present. S●re the place shows they meet for acts of Government. Yea, Act. 11. 30. & 21. 18. They sent alms to the Elders of judea, to be distributed to the distressed in judea. As also the Elders of judea were members of the Synod, Act. 1●. And how could there be administrating of the seals without any jurisdiction at all to debar the unworthy?   

CHAP. IX.  
The Arguments of Mr. R. for a Ministerial Church from Matth. 18. are vindicated from the Exceptions of Mr. Hooker.  
MR. H. If Christ allude to the Synedry, then must Mat. 18. 
Par. 1. c. 10. p. 130.  be expounded of a Presbyterial Church. Mr. H. both Proposition and Assumption is denied.  
Ans. Mr. H. leaps from one Book to another. I no 
Mr. R. argument, Mat. 18. from allusion unto the Jewish Sanhedrim abused, not answered.  where frame an Argument from a mere allusion: but so, if Christ so allude to an authoritative company, that hath power of binding and losing, as the Jewish Sanhedrim in this Mat. 18. then he judgeth the Church, Mat. 18. to be a Juridical Church.  
2. It's a poor Argument, he alludes not to the Jewish Synagogue, because that Synagogue had no power of Excommunication, as this Church Mat. 18. hath, saith he: but can there be no allusion to a judicature, except the one, to which allusion is made, and that of which the present speech is, have the like power? Then cannot the Scripture allude to earthly Princes, who place their greatest Courtier upon the right hand, because earthly Princes have not the like power with the Father of Jesus Christ. This destroys all allusions, which abound in the Scripture; as Paul, Rom. 10. 18. alludes to the Sun; Malachi compareth Gospel-worship to the burning of Incense, chap. 1. shall it then follow, that the one is of the nature of the other? That allusions bring little light, is said without ground; for they being grounded upon Metaphors often, which bring light, must bring much light.  
3. That Synagogues had no power to excommunicate, seems to bring darkness, and not light. The contrary is job. 9 and 16. Though they abused that Ordinance.  
Mr. H. It's in vain to send the plaintiff to a general Council, he might be dead before he be relieved, and the Council be gathered.  
Ans. We send no man by a loup to a General Council, but the grieved man may appeal to the nearest Judicature; and Mr. H. will have him to loup to a General Council at the first, being accused of a scandal, which declares, that he would elude all the Government of Christ, between him and that Judicature.  
2. We do not maintain any Appeals whatsoever, but only 
M R. is not for all appeals whatsoever, justor unjust, but for such as are edifying and necessary, and relieves from tyrannical oppression the plaintiff.  righteous Appeals. Illud tantum p●ssumus, quod jure possumus.  
3. So may the plaintiff be buried before a Synod, by way of consultation, may be had; the ways of Discipline, a● all Christ's ordinary ways in the Gospel, may possibly never take effect in those to whom the word is a savour of death unto death, but that doth not nullify an Ordinance of God.  
Mr. H. Our Saviour, Mat. 18. points at a standing Tribunal of such a Church as is at hand, whereof both parties were members. 
Pag. 131.   
Ans. It's a perverting of the words of Christ, Mat. 18. that 
The removing of scandals, Mat. 18. cannot be of only scandals between brother and brother of the same congregation, except I must not own as brethren to be gained, those of another Church beside me.  no man trespassing, whom I must endeavour to gain, can be my brother, but he who is a member of the same congregation of which I am a member. This is to renounce and quit all brotherly communion with all Churches on earth, but only that single congregation of which I am a member; when not one brother, but twenty or many Churches of brethren without the congregation, as false brethren of judea trespass against Antioch by perverse doctrine, Act. 15. there is not a Judicature a● hand, hath Christ provided to tell no Church, and left no remedy to remove the greatest of scandals?  
Mr. H. How could a Church in an Island, or the first Church at Jerusalem, Act. 1. 23. exercise discipline upon an offender upon this ground?  
Ans. Why not? since the purpose of Christ is, That every Church, even the less of one hundred and twenty, Acts 1. and the greater of ten thousands, Act. 2. & 4. & 6. should respectively purge themselves; and when association of many 
Christ willeth every little congregation to exercise discipline upon an offender, Ergo, there is no discipline to be exercised in a greater Church. So Mr. H. But the contrary rather strongly followeth.  Churches about shall be, they should also purge those without the congregation. Scandals fall out where many meetings are, and one only Presbytery over them, as Mr. H. granteth: to which of the meetings shall: the plaintiffs complain? The offenders are of divers Meetings or Churches that are not at hand.  
Mr. H. The Sanhedrim is a mixed judicature, partly of Ecclesiastical, partly of Civil judges, Deut. 17. 12. 2 Chron. 19 Ergo, allusion cannot be made thereunto.  
Ans. The Consequence is naught. 
The Sanhedrim was not mixed by institution.   
2. Mr. H. with the Prelates, confound the Judicatures, but they are clearly distinguished, while one is appointed for the matters of the King another for the matters of the Lord, 2 Chron. 19 11. So are they distinguished, The Priest or the Judge, not the Priest and the Judge, Diut. 17. 12. Men might sinsully confound them; but sin is no institution of the Lord.  
Mr. H. Arg. 2. The Church of believers is that which meets for prophesying and for praying: but this, Mat. 18. especially for binding and losing, and censures. Mr. H. The Church of believers is assembled mainly for prophesying and praying, yet not only, but for censures also, the Word being ended.  
Ans. That is indeed in question, That men, women and children meet ordinarily every Lordsday for to act in all Ordinances; and after Sermon to lead witness, bind and lose, and that under the notion of believers, for neither here, nor in Scripture, is there warrant for this.  
Mr. H. Arg. 3. The Church Mat. 18. is such a superior and judicial Seat, as is to be obeyed in the Lord, under the pain of excommunication: But a multitude of believers are not such a seat. So Mr. R. M H. The Major is the question, and the Conclusion is to be proved, whether a particular congregation be the highest Tribunal, or the classical Church: and Mr. R. takes one part of the Conclusion to pr●ve the other: If the congregation be not highest, than the classical must be. The Minor should have been proved, not nakedly propounded.  
Ans. I propound a Syllogism, and for answer to the minor, Mr. H. transforms my Argument, which I dreamt not of, and says, I take one part of the conclusion to prove the other, If the congregation be not highest, than the classis is. But, Sir, that is not one part of the conclusion to prove another; but since you bring it, it's a lawful Syllogism, Either the congregation or the classis is the highest Tribunal: But not the congregation. Yet this is Mr. H. Arg. not mine.  
The Church Mat. 18. is such a superior seat, as is to be obeyed, as being over us in the Lord, etc. But no Scripture, no 
Paul's Presbyt. c 8. p. 88 The Church, Mat. 18. is to be obeyed in the Lord by the people, but the Church of the people is not to be obeyed in the Lord by the people.  Divine in the world saith, That the multitude of believers (I use not there the term Congregational Church at all) is such a superior Seat, that is over the Guides, and whom the Guides do obey in the Lord, or disobey under the pain of Excommunication. This minor of mine is not nakedly propounded. The Scripture saith, the officers are over the multitude of believers in the Lord, 1 Thess. 5. 12, 14. 1 Tim. 5. 17. Heb. 13. 17. But the contrary is never said; they do not awake that say, this is to take one part of a conclusion to prove the other; for its a conclusion proved by a medium, that is no part, neither subject nor attribute of the conclusion.  
Mr. H. Arg. 4. of Mr. R. Whatever the Church may excommunicate, every member thereof convened with the Church may inflict all inferior censures.  
But all the members cannot inflict lesser punishment; for neither women, nor aged children, nor the unofficed brethren, can rebuks, exhort, or, by the Word, openly convince the officers. Ans. The consequence is feeble, as appears from the nature of delegated power, which is committed by Christ to persons capable thereof, which women for their sex, children for the want of the exercise of understanding, cannot do. People have power to choose officers, therefore women have power to put in their voices. The Body of a Corporation may put out a Major upon desert; therefore women and children may do it. No, the wise God hath included the votes of women in the male.  
Ans. Nay, but Mr. H. shall not so elude the Argument. Whatsoever the judging, binding and losing Church of believers may do, that every member of the joint community may do, in collegio, if the Keys be given to them (as Mr H. and Mr. Cotton say) as actual believers, giving Peter's confession, Mat. 16. and therefore Mr. H. too suddenly says, The consiquence (he would have said the major, for its a lawful Syllogism) is feeble; for women, children, sons come to ag● servants, which he left out, are formal and essential parts of the believing Church, to whom the Keys are given as to the first subject. If the Keys be not given to them as confessing and professing believers, because not to women, sons, servants, than not to all confessing and professing believers, as such; than not to all blessed, as taught by a teacher above flesh and blood, as Peter was, Mat. 16. This shall cross the Principles of our Brethren (& the Truth and Scripture cannot but cross them) nor can it be denied, but women, sons come to age, servants, are no less members of that Church, than the multitude of male-believers, for they confess Christ, as Peter, are blessed, and built on the Rock, as well as Peter, and are no less conceived in charity, to have some spi●…l good in them, as Mr. H. dictates, cap. 2. par. 1, 15, 16. and these must be visible Saints to whom Mr. H. his definition of visible Saints agrees; and therefore our brethren must either quit the principles they follow, or then a multitude of believers of visible Saints must be larger than the actual binding and losing Church, Mat. 18. and against their will this, Tell the Church, must be understood of, Tell some believers only, (if they will) The Officers; but, Tell not women, nor sons, nor servants, for they are no part of the binding and losing Church; and, If he hear not the Church; that is, as the Hebraism there, If he obey not the Church, if he obey not some believers Men, and Heads of Families, not women, servants, ●ons, Let him be to thee as a publican, etc.  
2. So woman are either not capable of believing and visible 
Women are as essential parts of the believing Church as men, and wom●n must no more blindly believe what the Church believes, than men; nor must their faith in discerning the voice of Christ in this pastor, not in this, be blindly included in the males discerning and so women must be a part of the binding and losing Church, Mat. 18.  Saintship, which none can say; or they are not capable of a power of binding and losing: and so a power capable of binding and losing is not given to the multitude of believers, as the Church, Mat. 18.  
3. Nor are women, sons, servants, debarred from voicing in Election, because it is a Church-power, for it is no power of jurisdiction. For  
1. Their tacit voices and consents are not excluded, because they must try the spirits, & not upon trust, & fide implicitâ believe every teacher more than men, or believe as the Church believes, more than their husbands, nor must they take Doctrines as truth: upon their husband's word; not are women so excluded from speaking in the Church, as they may upon no occasion confess their faith.  
2. Profess vocally repentance.  
3. Depose as Witnesses.  
4. Accuse the guilty before the binding Church.  
4. Nor may a Corporation cast out a Major by an authoritative power, such as binding and losing is, Mat. 18.  
5. We seek a warrant why the votes of women in choosing their Pastors, must more be included in the votes of the male, than their being essential parts of the redeemed Church is included in the males, or their confessing publicly, that Jesus is the Christ, as many women Martyrs, and sons and servants have gloriously done; and yet their confession of Christ to the death must be personal, and not included in the confession of husband or parents, as Mat. 10. 32.  
Mr. H. Arg. 5. of Mr. R. Those to whom the essence and definition 
Survey, par. 1. c. 10. p. 133.  of a Ministerial Church, having power to excommunicate, doth belong; those and those only are understood under the Name of the Church, Mat. 18. But the essence and definition of a Ministerial Church, having power to excommunicate, doth not necessarily belong to a great company of believers assembled Church-wise.  
Ans. Both propositions may be denied. Neither a Church without officers, nor as having them, is here only understood; but the second sense is here firstly attended. For both people and Elders have their power, parts and places in a right order and manner; when it's said, a Ministerial Church is here understood, Ministerial notes either Ministers without the body exclusively, and that is false, or Ministers with the body inclusively. Now a Ministerial Church in the fairest sense aims at both. In the first sense, the proposition is false; in the second it doth not conclude to whom the essence and definition of a Ministerial, i. e. of a Church of Ministers, without the body, having power to excommunicate, doth necessarily belong: These and these only are here understood. This Mr. R. l. 1. p. 226. refu●eth. 
The Church principally meant Mat. 18. must be the binding and losing brethren which are the Church firstly, the officers are only separable adjuncts thereof, saith M. H. Par. 1. c. 11. p. 198.   
Ans. Well then Mr. H. denies the conclusion; then both a Ministerial Church, and a Church of Redeemed, meeting to partake of Ordinances, have their part here: Ergo, women have their part here.  
2. If a Church in both senses be here understood when all the Officers turn grievous Wolves, Socinians, Papists, Familists, such as say they are Apostles, and do li●; then  
1. Must the people that are stumbled complain to themselves. This is not just, to make the complaining party (saith M. H.) judge. What if they unjustly complain, and say their officers are Presbyterial and Prelatical, and are Legal Preachers, and preach neither Christ nor Freegrace, then hath Christ ordained them whose lips preserve not knowledge, to be the only judging and first Church, which hath power to excommunicate, to be the 
When all the officers turn wolves, the people must complain to the people, & when the people turn Familists, Socinians &c. to whom s●a●l the officers complain, according to M. H. mind?  first and only Judges-of sound Doctrine, and Heresy in officers. And suppose the Church of people and officers be here firstly understood; we cannot complain of the Familist people (of which there were too many in N●E.) to the Elders, for the same reason.  
2. Nor is it true, that people and Elders (the people must in judging be first, by Mr. H.) have their power, parts and place in this work, for all Elders and people have equally a decisive voice, except women, and children, and servant's; and by what reason they want votes, a reason 〈◊〉 yet is not heard of.  
3. There is no reason that binding and losing may be transacted by only a power of judgement in people, for then a 
The officers cannot bind potestate officii, since the Keys were given to the Male-church, before the officers had being, as M H saith.  power of office is accidental to binding and losing, how then can a society with both power of judgement and of office be understood here firstly? as Mr. H. saith. Therefore I ask a reason, why officers, who are mere adjuncts, such a● come in at the by, and as latter in nature, power, and operation to the visible Church, should have any hand in binding and losing, since all officers are made and unmade, ordained and cast out by the male-Church, by this way?  
4. Nor can the officers bind and lose as officers, nor hath Christ given this power to the officers as officers, by this way of our Brethren. For they say,  
1. That the Keys were given to Peter, Mat. 16. as to a believer, not as to an officer.  
2. Officers to them are but adjuncts of the visible Church, and the Keys are given to the visible Church before they have officers, and the people may make and excommunicate them.  
3. Here is strange work! the Keys were not given to Peter as an officer, but as a believer, and yet he useth the Keys as an officer.  
4. The Church is not made Ministerial by us, without the body exclusively wholly (for Christ's Government is voluntary) nor ought any new thing to be concluded in our Assemblies, while the people hear of it: for if the Romans used rogare & suadere legem, and obtain the consent of the people thereunto, far more are they not to be acknowledged as Church-laws, that are to be obtruded upon the godly against their will and knowledge; and much more if they be against the Word of God, and former godly acts with consent agreed unto by the Church; that is, whether the people consent or not, but yet without the body, whether they exercise acts of jurisdiction or not, for no act of jurisdiction is due to them; and to exclude the consent of women, no less interessed in practice of conscience than men, is to be Lords of their faith.  
Mr. H. The sixth argument refers to former proofs, etc.  
Ans. And Mr. R. refers to former Replies.  
Mr. H. It's evidently false, that there can be no complaint to a multitude; for complaints may be made to a Parliament.  
Ans. How can complaints be made to ten thousand of the 
We cannot tell the church of Jerusalem or Galatia, by M. H.  Church of jerusalem, for that Church, as Mr. H. grants, pag. 128, 129. met in sundry places, not in one: No Parliament or Judicature consisteth of such a number. We cannot complain to the many Churches of Galatia of their wicked tenet of Justification by Works, for they are scattered in divers societies, and its unlawful (say our Brethren) to meet in their officers to exercise jurisdiction.  
Mr. H. Arg. 8. The house of Cloe complained to Paul. 2. Paul gives rules about the Elders receiving of complaints.  
Ans. That house complained to Paul, because his Apostolic Authority might have been helpful, but they might have complained to any of the Church of Corinth. Paul advises Titus to hear complaints, to prepare them for the Church. 3. If the people must consent tacitly to the censures, before they be dispensed they must hear the complaints.  
Ans. Paul gives rules and directions to Timothy, 1 Tim. 5. 19 v. 1. and Titus, cap. 2. as to pastors, not as to believers, concerning the manner of receiving complaints, nor is there in Scripture, Precept, Promise or practise of believers to receive 
Women have no less a tacit consent, a faith of practice in eschewing the society of the excommunicated, in admitting of him again, and of all members, & in election of officers, than men, and in other duties recommended to Church-members.  complaints, we are surer than our Brethren; and its safer to expound thy, Tell the Church, that is, Tell Timothy and the Elders; then, Tell the Church, that is, Tell any member of the Church at Co●inth, i. e. Tell any woman, or servant, for they are as essentially members as Timothy or any of the Elders: 2. and must join their consent to censures, because members must hear the scandals, because they must tacitly consent before censures be dispensed, it follows not that members must be told; for the tacit consent of women is requisite, for they may be scandalised or edified by the good or evil dispensing of censures as well as men.  
2. They may not converse with excommunicate persons more than men.  
3. Their consciences must not be Lorded over more than the consciences of men, in the dispensing of censures.  
4. They must have a vote tacit or formal in choosing of a Pastor, and must not take him blindly; and complaints to women, sons, servants, yea, and the precepts of withdrawing, Rom. 16. 17. 1 Cor. 5. 6, 10. 2 Th●ss. 3 14. 2 Tim. 3. 5. Tit. 3. 10. joh. 10. 11. oblige the consciences of women, sons and servants, than women may receive witness against Elders; as well as Timothy, 1 Tim. 5. 19 20. but with such qualifications and limitations. For Mr H. maintains this connexion, Complaints may be made unto the Church (Tell the Church, Mat. 18.) to all, without whose tacit consent there can be no proceeding to excommunication. But without women's consent there is no Excommunication, no Admission, no Election, Respond it a, vol non.  
Mr. H. The people may censure heretical Elders in an Island.  
Ans. So they may in justa tutela aeterna salutis, but not by the power of the Keys.  
2. And so may the Elders, remaining godly and sound, remove with the Tabernable and Candlestick from a people in an Island, if they dance to the golden Calf, and be incorrigible: Yea, if the Elders and men in an Island turn Familists, and the women, sons, servant's remain sound, Let Mr. H. show what the sounder part of the Church may do. And though women be forbidden authoritatively to teach in the Church, 1 Tim. 2. 7. 
Let M. H. show how women are all excluded from Church duties in their way, more than men.  1 Cor. 14. and publicly, yet they may teach the younger women, 'tis 2. 2, 3. give a seasonable rebuke and counsel to men, 2 Sam. 20. 16, 17. 1 Sam 25. 23, 24, 32, 33. and a woman a sister is to labour to gain a sister, by Matth. 18. and that in a Churchway; and women, as other Church-members, are to teach, exhort, warn, according to their place, as well as men, Col. 3. 16. Rom. 15. 14. 1 Thess. 5. 14. Heb. 3. 13 & 20. 25. Let M. H. teach us how their faith is included in the men in these duties, in consenting that a savoury man, not an Heretic, be their pastor.  
Mr. H. Arg. 9 That Church is here understood to whom the Keys are given, Mat. 16. but they are given only to a Classical Church. Ans. The minor is barely affirmed.  
Ans. My Argument is divided: The minor is not barely affirmed. The Keys are given to Peter, as representing Elders and Apostles, to whom Christ saith, john 20. Whose sins ye forgive, they are forgiven; to whom he said, As my Father sent me, so I send you: but this official sending is most undue to the people; and its equivalent to that Mat. 28. Go, teach and baptise. But Christ said not to unofficed Brethren, Receive the 
So Cypr. Juban. Epist. 73. pag. 22. Nam Petro primum Dominus super quem adificavit Ecclesiam— Mat. 16. Istaem potestatem (clavium) dedit— & post resurrectionem— sicut me misit pater, etc. Firmilian. ad Cypr. Epist. 75. Cypr. pag. 239. n. 14. Hinc intelligi potest quod soli Petro Christus dixerit, quemcunque ligaveritis, Matth. 16, etc. Quando in solos Apostolos insufflavit Christus dicens, accipite Spiritum Sanctum, etc.  holy Ghost; Whose sins ye forgive, etc. Go, teach and baptise. So Cyprian.  
Mr. H. Arg. 10. of Mr. R. The only apparent argument against this interpretation is weak, and therefore this sense hath ne strength.  
Ans. Both parts fail: 1. There may be other Reasons given. 2. It doth not follow, that the different sense is clear, because many better Reasons haply may be rendered, than were alleged. Mr. Ball according to his sagacity and sharpness of dispute, seeketh far and wide where to find, where the word Church noteth only the Elders, but all cometh to this, One may suppose such a sense.  
Ans. 1. Mr. H. denies the Antecedent and the Consequence, 
The word Church can signify no other, but the ruling Church Mat. 18. and the notation of the word Church in our brethrenssense is neither Mat. 18. nor elsewhere. See how Bilson, Perpetual G ve n. c. 4. mistakes in this.  and proves both to be false with the same Argument, Because many better Reasons may haply be given; which is bad Logic: for other Reasons may be given (and Separatists, Morellius, Anabaptists, and Prelatical men have besieged, but never taken in this Text) but if this be the only seeming and apparent reason given for popular jurisdiction, yea or that can be given, the consequence is not proved by Mr. H. his Adverb haply, which implies No as well as I. And when Mr. R. saith, the Reasons against our sense are Sophisms, it's not an answer to say, I. but stronger arguments haply may be rendered by others, such as never were alleged before. What if one should say stronger Reasons and clearer Scriptures yet than ever have been alleged, may haply be rendered for unwritten Traditions, Image worship, Praying to the Dead? Papists should be little stronger than they are.  
2. The Argument is but this:  
If the word Church in all the Scriptures so often mentioned, be never taken for the Elders only, it a strong suspicion it is not so taken in this place, Matth. 18. But the word Church— is such.  
1. The major is denied. All the judicious Interpreters find a word only in this sense in this place, and that it cannot bear sense according to the analogy of faith, but in this sense only, as scope, matter and circumstances of the place enforce; and yet the same word must be otherwise taken in many other places: And when all is done, the conclusion of the apparent reason amounts but to a suspicion; and Mr. H. of his own adds the qualification of strong suspicion, and Mr. R hath leave upon better grounds to add, that his own suspicion is weak.  
Mr. H. wrongs that eminently learned and godly man, Mr. Ball, who proves the Elders here must be meant, and no other Church, and Mr. H. touches not with one finger his reasons.  
2. I retort the Argument. If the word Church of the Redeemed meet to partake of all Ordinances, Word, Seals, Censures, etc. often mentioned in Scripture, be never taken for Brethren only, excluding believing women, sons come to age of 15 or 16 years, which are the far larger number of the Redeemed, confederate, visible Church, called, sanctified, as 1 Cor. 1. 1. 2 Cor. 1. 1. Eph. 1. 1. Col. 1. 2. 1 Thess. 1. 1. 2 Thess 1. 1, etc. then can it not be so taken, Mat. 18. and the Assumption must be as strong, That the word Church in this sense is destitute of the least loving look of the allowance of any Text, that might be a second in the field; as is the Rhetorication, in place of Disputation of Mr. H. therefore we desire a parallel place for the acception o● the word Church or only male-Church of Redeemed meeting for all Ordinances.  
Mr. H. answers not, when he tells us, that Women for their sex, and children for want of the exercise of understanding, are excluded from governing.  
Ans. That is another question, whether they be excluded from 
Though women, children of age, and servants, be excluded from governing, yet the question now is a far other thing, Whether the word Church, Mat. 18. if it be the Church of Redeemed ones meeting to and for public ordinances in the same place, include not women, etc.  governing from this, what is the notation of the word Church, Mat. 18. and whether women, children come to age, and servants, be not essential parts, and the far larger part of the Church of believors, fed, redeemed, of the Church which Chr●st hath instituted in the Gospel— that is, (saith the Discipline of N. E.) of a combination of faithful godly persons, meeting for that end, to partake of all the Ordinances of God in one place-built on the Rock, Mat. 16. If such a signification of the word Church be not in all the Scripture, is not this to have in the bag a stone & a stone, when we say, Tell the Church— and if he hear not the Church, Mat. 18. is the Church-meeting in one place for hearing the Word, receiving the seals, professing the faith of Peter built upon the Rock, which essentially includes women, aged children, servants, but yet Tell the Church, is not Tell the women, aged children and servants, for they are excluded from governing (say they) true, but they are not excluded from being members of the Church, Mat. 18. which in its proper signification (as our Brethren say) signifieth only this redeemed visible Church built on the rock meeting in one place, etc.  
3. The word Church, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, must in Scripture be restricted to the subject matter and the end, wherefore the convention 
The word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Church, is ever taken in Scripture according to the subject matter and scope of the place, and so must the binding and losing, or excommunicating Church, Matth. 18. be taken, and cannot note a company of redeemed ones, Men, Women, Servants, Children of riper age come together in one to partake of Word, Seals, Censures, the only acception of the Word Church that our brethren can give us from Scripture.  is instituted; and seldom is it taken, but it excludes some such, as Act. 19 it cannot signify the Church of Christ, but a civil tumultuary meeting. The town Clerk dismissed the Church.  
2. Eph. 5. 26. Christ loved his Church, and gave himself for her. The Church there is such a Catholic body visible, or invisible, as he shall present without spot or wrinkle, and excludeth rotten members professors, as Magus, who are no more but visible members, but includeth all real Saints, Men, Women, Infants, Jews, Gentiles, etc.  
3. It notes these who convene in the same place to be fed with Word, Seals, Censures, Act. 11. 26. a whole year they assemble with the Church, 1 Cor. 14 4. he that prophesieth, edifieth the Church. It must exclude Infants, who though members of the visible Church, yet cannot be edified by prophesying: but cannot but include Women, more aged children and servants: and say there were but one place in all the World, where the Church came together for the hearing of the Word, receiving of the Lords Supper, that one place were sufficient to teach what the word Church notes in that place. And so here, Mat. 18. is the like case.  
4. Tell the Church must be, tell the Church that hath power to bind and lose on earth, and which if the offender hear not, he must be declared a heathen; but this is neither women, children, nor servants, by our Brethren.  
2. The binding and losing here is to be expounded of the specific acts of office, never given to any by other Scriptures, but only to officers, 2 Thes. 5. 12, 14. Luke 10. 16. Heb. 13. 17. 1 Tim. 4. 14. 1 Tim. 5. 17, 20. Act, 20. 28. Rom. 12. 7, 8. Mat. 16. 17. 1 Pet. 5. 1, 2. Tit. 2. 5. joh 21. 15. Ephes. 4. 11, 12. Is. 6. 5. jer. 3. 15.  
5. Tell the Church, if he hear not the Church: shall be by us gladly expounded of both Rulers and Professors in their own 
The Church, Matth. 18. & 1 Cor. 5. includes all who meet for the public worship, Elders, Men, Women, Servants, aged Children, every one according to their place, according as Paul rebukes, comforts, teaching in his Epistle, 1 Cor. 1.  kind.  
1. Let him be to thee as a Heathen, that is, to the whole Church, women and servants, by withdrawing from his company. Pu●ge out, all ye who have been puffed up and mourned not, and such were women, and so men also to whom he writeth. 1 Cor. 1. 1. And women were a part of the lump in danger to be infected; and upon that hazard were not to eat & drink with an excommunicated man, 1 Cor. 5. 6, 12. and were not to be mixed, but to eschew scandalous persons, 2 This. 3. 14 Rom. 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Rom. 16. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  16. 17. nor receive such a man unto their house, nor bid him God speed, 2 joh 10. 11. Tit. 3. 10. which the women were to do one way, and the Elders another way. So 2 Cor. 2. 7. Ye ought rather to forgive him, and comfort him. Sure women, children of age, and servants, to whom he writes, were to forgive, in their way, for to them he determined to come, 2 Cor. 1. 15. They were a part of his rejoicing. v. 14. they were anointed, established, sealed 
The women in their daily practice are concerned in conscience to censent unto, or descent from the sentence of excommunication, or forgiving and re-admiting again, and that upon rules of the Gospel as well as men.  by the Spirit, v. 21, 22. as well as the men and Elders. And say the word of confirming their love, were an authoritative word, as it is; Yet it is so, as applied to the Elders, not as applied to women. As the same word of Worshipping relating to jehovah is a religious adoring, relating to David is civil reverence, 1 Chr. ●9. 21. The people bowed their heads, & worshipped the Lord and the King, 1 Sam. 12. 18 All the people greatly feared the Lord and Samuel. Though they were two really distinct actions. And this cannot be denied by Mr. H. who gives to the Elders an official power of jurisdiction, to the Brethren a judicial power of judgement; Ergo, they excommunicate not one and the same way.  
6. Yes, and Paul writes to Timothy, not as to a Christian simply, but as to a Pastor representing the company of Elders (as Christ speaks to Peter, Mat. 16.) as to a Pastor to take heed to Doctrine and reading, 1 Tim. 4. 14, 16. What Widows, 1 Tim 5. 9 What Watchmen, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2. 2 Tim. 2. 2. 1 Tim. 5. 17, 22. What Deacons, 1 Tim. 3. 10, 11. there should be in the Church. How he should rebuke, preach. Now this way the people should be warned, how to preach, how to rebuke, not to lay on hands suddenly, to save themselves and others by preaching, if they have a joint power of ruling with officers. It is true he writes to Timothy as to a Christian, to flee the lusts of you h●, but in order to the Ministry, that he may be an example to the flock, 2 Tim. 2. otherwise women, children come to age, servants, are to flee lusts, and to follow righteousness, faith, love, peace, etc. yet they are to exercise no jurisdiction.  
7. Tell the Church, cannot bear this, as Mr. H. would say, tell first the Church of Officers and people, when the officers are too ordinarily grievous wolves, seducers, blind guides, Idol-shepherds, Act. 20. 29. Mat. 7. 15. 2 Pet. 2. 1, 2. 1 john 4. 1. Rev. 2. 14 20. 'tis 3. 10. jer. 23. 9, 15. jer. 14. 14, 15. Isa. 56. 10, 11. Mich. 3. 5, 6. Zach 11. 8, 15, 16. Then must the keys and power of binding and losing be firstly in the people, not in the officers who are separable adjuncts (as our brethren say) the garments of the Church, not parts of the Church, as garments are not parts of a man.  
Lastly, Mr. H. cannot build his new house, but by raising the foundation stones of all our worthy Protestant Divines, and Fathers, 
Caelv. Inst. l. 3. c. 4. sec. 12. Instit. l. 4. c. 1. sec. 2. Instit. l. 4. c. 12. sec. 2. l. 4. 9 2. Pet. Martyr, 1 Cor. 8. Dau. Parens in explic. catech. q. 85. Art. 4. Obj. 1. p. 480, 484. Com. ●n Mat. 18 Gul. Buc●n. loc. come. de potest. Eccles. & Syno. lo. 43. q. 25. Dan. Tilenus Synt. dis. 30. de Concil. Th. 4. 9●. 〈◊〉, 23. Profess. Leyd. Synop. purio. Theolo. diso. 49. thes 10. pag. 779. joan. Pisc. come. in Ma●th. ●8. 15 d Eccles. lo. 23. thes. 73. Willet Syn. Papis. con. 3. Gen. Conc. 4. 7. pag. 140, 141. B●za in ●n. Mat. c. 18. Trem. lives in vers. Syr. Mat. 16. 19, 20. junius dis. 47. De Discip. Eccles. th'. 〈◊〉. th'. 6. joan. Comerio Tract. in quo Eccles. Roman. p●ae exam. c. 17. pag. 567. Anton. Walaeus To. 1. defunct. Eccles. pag. 467. Wende●●n Theol. l. 1. c. 28. fig. VII. q. 1. pag. 622, 623.  who prove that the Pope should hear the general Council from Matth. 18. So Chrysost. hom. 85. in joan. Orig. hom. 7. in Ezek. August Ssrm. 49. de ver. domini. Cyprian. jewel Apolo. c. 8. div. 2. page 55. Tho. Mort. Appel. Protest. l. 4. c. 2. sect. 8. page 451. 452. Aene. Sylu. in Gest. Conc. Basil. fol. 5. 51. Rom. Pont. non audist Eccles. Christum non audiet. And Riu. Catho. Ortho. To 1. Tract. 1. q. 8. Papists that are sounder, as Gerson, Almain, Occum, Cusanus, Contaren●●s, Ca●etanus, Ferus, Toletus, Menochius, Maldonatus, etc. say the Pope is a Brother, and aught to hear the Church.  
Mr. H. The Angel of the Church of Ephesus stands for the whole Church. saith Mr. R.  
Ans. See how strangely shall that sound, To the Angel of the Church of Ephesus, i. e. To the Church of the Church of Ephesus.  
Ans. This is a poor consequence, it is known there are often two Tropes in one word. The word Angel being put for many 
What is meant by the Angel of the Church, Rev. 2. Mr. H. his conceit removed.  Angels, as Didoclavius and other learned Authors from Psal. 34 7. prove. And then these many overseers are put for the Church, and rebuked in the people, and the people in them. When an Ambassador speaks to the Parliament, he speaks to England, and when he speaks to the Speaker, he speaks to the Parliament. Will it follow, the Ambassador speaks to England of England? A headless conceit, and such quirks make a cause to be suspected; so when one offended tells the Church, he but tells the brethren of the Church; and this is the Church of the 
Rob Parker. de Politia Eccles. l. 3. c. 15. n. 1. Ex his qui eluctari, capit nobiscum, sentire necesse est Ecclesiam fidelium à Christo intellectam esse (Mat. 18.) non quia simpliciter consideratur, sed quia disciplinam exercet juxta temperamentum Aristocraticum in Presbyterio, Ecclesiam quippe primo loco dic Ecclesiae praecise partem Aristocraticam, id est, Presbyterium existimamus, quae vero posteriore his verbis, Si Ecclesiam non audietit, etc. sic excommunicantem propter contemptum Ecclesiam, includit, & non decernentem tantum & examinantem, tum & partem Ecclesiae Democraticam continet, quâ populi consensus ad excommunicationem necessarius est.  Church. And if women, sons, servants be excluded, as Mr. H. excludes them, than he tells the Church of the Church.  
Mr. Parker, though not far from our brethren's way, hath said the very same; for which Mr. H. refuteth Mr. R. And if Mr. Parker shows my mind in that, when Mr. H. refutes therein M. Parker, I yield; but he contradicts Mr. Parker.  
Mr. H. It is said Acts 18. 22. Paul saluted the Church at Jerusalem, it cannot be thought in reason, that the Elders only were saluted; because the scope of Paul was to confirm the hearts of the Disciples, and therefore had an eye to the weakest, and those that wanted his sweet refreshing, who heard of his arrival, and assembled to give comfortable entertainment to him, and to be comforted by him.  
Ans. The Argument must then be thus, if any: Paul saluted and kissed (for so is the original word) as many as he confirmed and encouraged in the way of grace at jerusalem. But he confirmed in that way, all and every one, man, woman, servants, rich, poor; Ergo, he kissed them all, and saluted them all. Let Mr. H. see to the conclusion, it is all his own.  
2. The Argument is not brought to prove that the word Church there noteth precisely only the Elders. Nor does Mr. R. allege it upon that account precisely; but that the word Church may note some eminent professors, and note a Church of all, men, women, children, yea the thousands who meet in 
The place Act. 18. 22. Paul saluted the church is wronged by M. H.  sundry places, by the grant of Mr. H. came not out to meet Paul, and were saluted of him; for to be saluted, was but a matter of courtesy, though Christian, but to be comforted and confirmed in the faith is another thing.  
Mr. H. The word Church in the Hebrew and Greek used by the Septuagint, notes the Rulers of the Church, not always the body; and it is granted without any hurt to our cause.  
Ans. Since the signification of words, and of the word 
The word Church is not in scripture, as our brethren take it. Nor is there a place in Old or New Testament, or in any Divines, imaginable for the sole male-Church.  Church, as Moses and the Prophets use them, is frequently followed in the New Testament by the Evangelists and Apostles; it is clear, our Saviour, Mat. 18. departed not from the received signification of the words in the Old Testament used by the Septuagint. And so the word, Tell the Church, hath a better warrant to be expounded. Tell the Rulers, then, tell all the faithful men, women, children, and servants; therefore the suspicion is so strong, as Mr. H. said, that there is no parallel Text for this signification of a male-Church excluding women and officers, who may excommunicate all officers; and whereas he so much contends for the signification of the word Church, Let him answer what is meant there, 1 Cor. 11. 16. If any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the Churches of Christ. If the meaning be, that the congregations meeting in the same place, contend not among themselves; what if they so should do? who should right them, by our brethren's way? and if that be the Church that meets in one place only, when shall the Church Catholic which Christ loved, and gave himself for, meet? not until the day of Judgement? and did the Brethren testify of the charity of Gaius, 2 joh. 16 before the Church, was that in the convened together congregation? or was it not before the men of the Church? And 1 Cor. 11. When ye 〈◊〉 together to the Church, Was not this to the meeting of men and women, except women be debarred from the Lords Supper? And when Saul made havoc of the Church, he must persecute only the binding and losing Church; but the Scripture saith, he persecuted both men and women, Act. 8. 3. & 9 2.  
Mr. H. Arg 11. The Church which the Plaintiff must tell, is to admonish publicly the offender. But this is the Church of Elders, 1. Thes, 5. 12. 13. 1 Tim. 5. 20. Luk. 10. 16. for they only are to receive public complaints, Tit. 1. 13. 1 Tim. 5. 19 2 Tim. 4. 2.  
Ans. Complaints are to be given to the Elders, that they may prepare them for the congregation, and lend the action. Therefore the incestuous Corinthian 〈◊〉 said to be r●… of many, and so judged of many, not by the judgement only of discration; for so they might judge these that were without, but legally.  
Ans. Mr. H. answers not one word of Scripture for telling the complaints to the Elders. Christ saith, Tell the Church, that is, tell all the visible Saints, say our Brethren.  
2. That the incestuous Corinthian was rebuked legally of many, that is, of the Elders and Brethren, or Male-Church only, that is said, not proved. If we speak of judging by the judgement of discretion, he was rebuked of Elders, Brethren, Women, aged Children, Servants, for it concerned them in conscience to have knowledge of it, and to yield to withdraw from him, and to forgive him, upon his repentance to join with him, else their obedience must be blind.  
2. The minor is false.  
1. For though they judge Heathen with the judgement of discretion, it follows not, that therefore Brethren, Women, aged 
It cannot be denied but all in their own respective ways officers, men, women, servants, 2 Cor. 2. did rebuke and censure, and also forgive the incestuous Corinthian.  Children, and Servants should not also judge an excommunicate person by the same judgement.  
2. The probation is faulty, for I appeal to the conscience of our Brethren, whether there be not sundry kinds of judgement of discretion, and whether Church-members have not one kind of judgement of discretion toward the excommunicate man, who is now under a medicinal Church-cure, and another judgement of discretion toward them that are without, and were never members.  
Mr. H. to Mr. R. his twelfth Argument, It hath received an 〈◊〉 out of a mistake, because neither women alone, nor children will make a Church, nor have any public power put into their hands for that purpose.  
Ans. I never said in any Argument, that women and children there alone ma●e a Church, nor spoke I of women's ruling there: But yet I say, women, children of years of discretion, servants being the Lords freemen and professing the faith.  
Arg. 1. The essential parts and largest part of the Congregation●… Church of Believers, professing the faith of Peter builded upon the rock, Mat. 18. ●●●ting every Lord's day to partake of all the Ordinances; and therefore if the Church, Mat. 16. 
The way of the Church, c. 1. sect. 1. p. 1, 2.  signify such a Church 〈◊〉 ●hat which you say, women and such children and servants must especially be understood as parts thereof, under the name of the Church, tell the Church, and if so, the Church to which we complain, doth not bind and lose by your own grant.  
2. What ground is there in the Word, that the Brethren alone, 
Women by our brethren's way, servants, and children of age, who meet to partake of the ordinances, word, and seals, as our brethren say, must be parts of the Church, Matth. 18.  because men should, only be mooned by the name of the instituted Church in the Gospel, or the 〈◊〉 Church of Believers, partakers of all the ordinances, excluding women and such children and servants, since there 〈◊〉 neither made nor female, bound nor free to be regarded in the condtion of believing visible Saints? Gal. 3. 28. 〈◊〉 9 14. 1 Cor. 7. 21, 22. So is not this very like to the respect of persons condemned by the Apostle I●…, ch. 2, 3, 4, 5. when brethren because of their sex, and heads of families must be the only Church of believers, built upon the rock, the Body of Christ, the Kingdom of Christ, the Redeemed of God, partakers of all the precious ordinances, and the only visible Church above all the officers, women, children, servants?  
3. Nor hath such a Church of only few, any such power put in their hand, and so to say, because it is said, Tell the Church, except Mr. H. prove them to be the governing Church above the Officers, is to beg the question; for Mr. Cotton and Mr. Burroughs say, without officers the brethren can exercise n● jurisdiction, 
Cotton Keyes. par. 16. Burroughs Iren,  no excommunication, one of the highest acts of rude in the Church; they have nothing without the officers (saith Mr. Burroughs) but brotherly admonition, no jurisdiction. And Mr. H. is to give a parallel place in old and new Testament if he hear not the Church, id est, the male-Church of Brethren, let him be cast out.  
Mr. H. Arg. 13. Not only the Church must convene to worship God in Spirit and Truth, but that they bind and lose by the Pastoral Spirit of Paul, and officers in their convention.  
Ans. The Church met hath power to execute all acts of discipline, as well as doctrine.  
2. The Church of Corinth is blamed, because without the knowledge of Paul, or his authority (as they ought to have done) they did not excommunicate the incestuous person, only for their encouragement, he expresseth his consent, and the concurrence of his spirit.  
Ans. That the Church of Believers without the pastoral spirit and authority of Paul or any other officer, and excluding the tacit consent of women, children of age, and believing servants, could exercise all acts of Discipline and Doctrine, that is, of pastoral preaching, destroys Mr. H. his principles; for who can preach but sent Pastors? Rom. 10. 14. not unofficed brethren. And as to the point of Jurisdiction, Mr. Cotton and Mr. Burroughs, with me, deny it, and Mr. H. nakedly saith it. That the Church of Corinth was rebuked for not excommunicating the man, is true: But 1. what means he by the Church rebuked?  
1. All that were rebuked must be the Church; can Mr. H. deny but women, children of years, servants, were rebuked, as those who were puffed up, and mourned not? ver. 1, 2.  
2. And as those who were a part, and the largest part of the 
If as many do excommunicate, as Paul writes unto, 1 Cor. 5. and as Paul rebukes for not mourning, and were a part of the lump in danger to be leavened, and were to keep the feast, and eschew the company of the scandalous, that is, the whole redeemed Church, as Mr. H. argues, then sure Women must excommunicate, 1. Cor. 5. as well as men. See Mr. H. par. 1. c. 10. p. 138.  lump, that is, of the body of the people in danger to be leavened with that scandal, ver. 6.  
3. As those who were to keep the feast (Christ being sacrificed for them) With sincerity, ver. 8.  
4. As those who should not familiarly converse with scandalous fornicators, ver. 11. but all of them were to judge, and put away the wicked person from among them, ver. 13. in a way suitable to their place, that is, the officers with Paul's Spirit, or a pastoral authority like unto it, the brethren, women, children of age, and servants, professing the faith in their way, by consenting, and by the judgement of discretion so far as belonged to their practice in withdrawing from the delinquent. 2. Not did I deny that the Church of Corinth should have excommunicated the man before Paul wrote to them, but that they should have done it without Paul's knowledge, is only said, not proved; and that any save officers, and such as were endued with such a pastoral spirit as was in Paul, could have done it, is only asserted by Mr. H. his sole word; and this answer insinuates, that the only male-Church did it, and they needed not any pastoral spirit; only Paul addeth ex superabundanti his encouraging consent, whereas the work might have been done without officers by this new male-jurisdiction, which is contradicted by Mr. Cotton, and not owned by the Scripture.    


LIB. III. CHAP. I.  
Of the first subject of Ecclesiastic Power: Of the delegated Power of the Church.  
THere is a double Authority, one Supreme and Monarchical 
Mr. hooker's. Survey; par. 〈◊〉. cap. 11. p. 185, 186.  only in Christ, and another Subordinate and Delegate; which 〈◊〉 a Right given by Commission from Christ to fit person●, to act i● his House according to his order. By Right, is meant jus, or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, which according to God, certain persons possess in their external administrations issuing from such special relations, unto which they are called by Christ. 2. It's given to 〈◊〉 persons who are capable to receive this power, not to women, children, madmen, etc. Therefore let the Reader take notice of that, as not worthy to be considered. If power be in the Church of believers, than women and children may exercise it, 〈◊〉 Mr. Ball, Mr. R. for they are not fit persons appointed by Christ to manage this power. Lastly, they must act according to God's order. The whole Church is an Army terrible with Banners, but the parts do fight in their own order: The power is in the whole firstly, but each part knows his rank; the officers in their part, order and manner, the members in theirs. The whole acts some things immediately, some things mediately.  
Ans. A Monarchical power in Christ we know, and authority delegate of Jurisdiction in the Ambassadors and Officers, 
Mr. H. his fit persons the first subject of the Keys, examined, is found light  who are called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, 1 Tim. 5. 17. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, 1 Thess. 5. 12. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Heb. 13. 17. Rulers we know: but that the people or Church of believers especially separated from officers, are called Rulers, or endued with any delegate power over we know not whom, we read not in Scripture.  
2. By the Keys he must mean both the Keys of Knowledge and of Jurisdiction: But what Scripture gives the pastoral Key to unofficed Brethren? I do not know a right given to fit persons, without any mentioning of the first subject, the Church of confederate Saints, as Mr. H. which includes women, 
Sect. 2. p. 192.  children of age, servants, (for these are fit persons to be members of the Church built on the Rock) and of the Church of Believers) Ergo, they are fit persons, and as fit, some of them, to wit, children of years of discretion, and believing servants, as the Brethren; for neither Sex, nor want of understanding, nor distemper of judgement, the three causes of unfitness owned by Mr. H. can render them more uncapable than the brethren: yea, the brethren being often unlettered Tradesmen, 
Unlettered brethren are not fit persons to judge of sound and of heretical doctrine, as M. H.  and many of them dull and rude, though believers, are most unfit persons to judge of sound and unsound Doctrine, and of controverted points, whether the Pastors teach perverse things, Acts 20. 29. hold the doctrine of Balaam, Rev. 2. 13. or not; and yet by Mr. H. they are the only, and none but they are to judge and try the learning, ability of Pastors, unsoundness in Socinian, Antinomian, Popish, Arminian, etc. Tenets, though they know no more the Tongues, Arts nor Sciences, than some Priests who can scarce read the Mass-book in Latin, nor understand the Language thereof; and they only have power to depose them all for Ignorance and Heresy.  
2. As for women, they are redeemed, built on the Rock, and have a voice tacit, or no, let Mr. Hooker say.  
1. To choose or refuse Officers, 1. They are of the sheep that can discern the voice of Christ in sent Pastors, Joh. 9 and this is Mr. H. his argument to prove that the people should call their own pastors, as hereafttr he saith.  
2. Women must have a vote in admission of members, which Mr. H. calls potestatem judicii, a power of judging; for they 
Survey, pa●… 1. c. 11. propos. 4. p. 203.  are not to own as Church members, and to rehuke, and tell the Church, and to gain brethren and sisters blindly; they, by the judgement of discretion, if not by more, according to Mr. H. must have some hand in this. Women are to try, by the judgement of discretion, the spirits of Teachers, whether Antichristian or not, whether they be of God, or no, and to hold what is good, as men, 1 joh. 4. 1. 1 Thess. 5. 21. Ergo, they must try both men and doctrines; and must, as was said, withdraw from the unsound and scandalous: therefore what Mr. Ball and Mr. R. say touching them, must be considered, If the power be in the whole Church firstly, then must the power of the Keys be in all the members firstly also, if Logic have place; and if it be in all, then it's in women: How came it to women? show the Scripture. And whereas Mr. H. saith, The whole Church is terrible as an Army with Banners, it saith, the Church ruling and conquering by the Keys both of Knowledge and jurisdiction, is made up of ruled commanders, and ruled soldiers, not of a number of only brethren; and soldiery acts of ruling (for of the Church that beareth the Keys Mr. H. must now speak) in women Mr. R. would know: for that terribleness is in acts of Discipline, not a little: if all be terrible, then also women. Your homogeneous Church, which only, and none but they, by Mr. H. his doctrine, may lift a Banner against all the officers, and depose and excommunicate them every man: But Mr. Cotton saith to this, What haste brother Mr. H?  
Mr. H. This power is either a power of many when combined, and this is either a power—  
Of judging, judicii; or of donation:  
Or its power in one a power of Office:  
The power of judgement the whole hath, and doth use in admissions and excommunication: the same pow●r that takes in must cast out.  
Ans. The distinction of power of Office or Order in one 
Consent is in the people, but no judicial authority, as antiquity and our Divines prove.  who is a Pastor, and of Jurisdiction in many in a Presbytery, is warranted by Scripture.  
But for the power of judging, and of giving of power, potest as donationis, to others to preach and administer the seals, in the people who have no power themselves, it hath neither the countenance of Scripture nor Reason, and is but a device of Merellius holden by Mr. H.  
Calvin saith, The thing before judged was cleared to the people. Pet. Martyr, Pareus, and others, say well, Excommunication 
Calvin Com. In 1 Cor. 5. In horum primorum confessu prima erit cognitio, inde res ad populum, sed jam praejudicata, deferebatur. P. Martyr in 1 Cor. 5. De Excom. quaest.  would not be done nisi plebe consentiente, without the consent of the people; which includes women and servants, over whose consciences, faith and practice, Rulers are not to domineer, more than over the consciences of men. Cyprian by the plebs and universa fraternitas, the people and fraternity, understands the whole redeemed flock, men and women. It's true, Cyprian threatens some Presbyters, that if they go on in their scandalous way, they should give an account to the people, apud plebem universalem; and writes to some that desired to be reconciled to the Church of Carthage, All things shall be examined, you the people being present. But judging there, as frequently 
Pareus in 1 Cor. 〈◊〉. Cyprianus ad Cornelium Episcopum Romanum scribit se multum apud plebem laborare, ut pax daretur lapsis, quam si per se dare potuisset, non erat cur in plebe persuadenda se fatigaret. Cyprian. Epist. 3. Examinabuntur singula praesentibus & judicantibus vobis. Cyprian. Epist. 16. 11. 5. Quando à primordio Episcopatus mei statutum nihil sine consilio vestro (presbyter is & diaconis fratribus scribit) & sine consensu plebis meae privatâ sententiâ gerere. Cyprian. Epist. 38. Vehementer contristatus sum J. C. acceptis ●●eris vestris, cum mihi propositum semper & votum sit universam fraternitatem vestram incolumem continere & gregem illibatum etc.  with Cyprian, is no authoritative judging given to the people. He who answers to Pamelius in his learned Annotations, gives no more to the people, but the knowledge of Church-affairs: About Anno 70. as Eusebius saith, Simeon the son of Cleophas is chosen in the room of james, all the disciples consenting. The Council of Carthage, Anno 420. Let not a Bishop ordain any Clergyman without an Assembly of the Clergy, and let him seek the people's consent, connivance and testimony.  
So was Cornelius made Bishop of Rome by the Authority of God and of the Clergy, and by the suffrages of the people. Our Divines, Bucerus, Calvin, Bucanus, Tilenus, Beza, Virttut, give consenting, and in some cases correcting, not judicial 
Bucer in Mat. 16. Ut Romae olim, ita hic potest as populi, authoritas senatus.  power sure, but which is great enough, a Negative consent for eschewing of a Schism. And the Professors of Leyden, Urfine, Pareus, junius, give the people a vote, a consent in Excommunication: and this cannot exclude women who are offended, when the whole Church is offended. The times of Ambrose did witness more pride in the Clergy, who began to do all without 
calv. Instit. l. 4. c. 11. num. 6. Cyprianus sic clerum (in excommunicatione) praefuisse, ut plebs interim à cognitione non excluderet.  the people.  
Chemnitius, Daneus, the Confession of Bohemià, of Helvetia, the Synod of Middleburgh, the Synod of Tylleburgh in Nassovia, Anno 1582. teach, That the whole Church with consent of all did excommunicate, but the judging Authority is in the Eldership.  
Mr. H. The power of election is especially to be attended by the end, as a corporation hath power to choose a Major, and to give him power. 3. The safety of the whole is to be attended, and that is to submit one to another, and be rebuked one by another. 
Bucan. de disciplina Eccl. l. 44. quaest. 13. Jus excommunicandi penes presbyterium, sed tamen consciâ & approbante tota Ecclesiâ. Tilen. Disp. 28. Thes. 12. Quamvis scripta sit epistola ad to●…m Ecclesiam Corinthiacam, non tamen omnia quae in ea continentur ad singulos pertinent, ut ex elequentiae, scientiae encomiis patet. Pareus in catech. Ursin. quaest. 85. 4. 4. pag. 477. Beza de gradibus minist. cap. 23. Viretus dialo. 20, 21. Zwingl. Cor. 31. Profess. Loyd. Sy●…. disp. 48. th'. 24. Synedrii authoritas, popu●i consensus. Ursinus ad Fred●…. 3. Elect. & 9 85. junius, Eccles. 3. 1. Cypr. cod. vetust. Epist. 68 Coram omni Syn●goga jubet Deus constitui sacerdotem, & ●stendit ordinationes sacerdotales non nisi sub populi assistentis consci●nt â si ri oportere, ut plebe praesente, vel detegantur malorum crimina, vel bonorum merita praedicentur, & sit ordinatio justa & legitima quae omnium suffragio & judicio fuerit examin●ta; nec hoc in Episcoporum tantum & sacerdotum, sed & in diaconorum ordination: bus observasse apostolos animadvertimus. Origen. contr. cells. lib. 3. Senatum Ecclesiasticum qui est Athenis, Corinthi invenies 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. M. H. and his Brethren following Papists, prove their Male-Church from civil corporations. The example of the people both creating and choosing their Major and Rulers, brought by Mr. H. to prove that the people ordain and call their officers, it Popish, and is no rule to us, and the differences are waste.   
Ans. Papists prove. the Pope and Prelates from such have their warrant, peoples choosing of their Pastor is from the rule of the Word, not from civil corporation, from which it differs.  
1. The people makes one of no King to be a King, and does not only choose him, 2 Chron. 29 22. the people kinged Solomon; S●ul, 1 Sam. 11. 15. David, 1 Chron. 12. 38. but the choice of the people doth not make an officer, but the laying on of the hands, or ordination of the Presbytery doth that, 1 Tim. 4. 14. 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 5. Act. 6. 6.  
2. The Corporation civil may limit the Major in regard of time, for a year, and no longer: 2. they may make him half a Tyrant, a Dictator, and absolute, or give him less power, that he shall rule none but with the consent of 12 Assessors; but the people may not make him a Pastor for a year, and then lay him aside for no fault, as a Major is unofficed; nor may they limit him so as he shall not preach in season and out of season, but by the consent of 12 men.  
3. The Corporation may erect itself in a Kingdom or Commonwealth, and may create Consuls, Dictator's, Praetors, Tribunos Plebis, etc. as may most serve for the safety and peace of this State: but the Church may bring in no new officers, but those appointed by Christ; nor may they alter the government, and metamorphose it into another than that which is according to the pattern showed in the Mount.  
4. Women and servants have no vote in choosing or creating Rulers, but since they are to be fed, and this concerns their conscience, it is not so here in the Church; though men may domineer over the civil power of women, yet not over their faith. If some acts were to be performed by a King or Major, without the skill & knowledge of counsellors, and of which the counsellors are as ignorant as the Church of believers ordinarily are of Tongues and Controversies, it might well be said, that the Wisdom of God never appointed such counsellors, and for such an end, as to appoint such men to be counsellors, and such to create Pastors; and therefore it's a naughty Argument taken from a Civil Corporation, and Popish. From a worldly Monarchy, Papists prove their Monarchy in the Church. Yea, this Argument proves,  
1. That Pastors as Pastors have no warrant by any Institution of Christ, to try, ordain, and lay on hands upon Pastors: for 1. that which is to be done according to Divine Institution by a company of visible believers, to whom Christ hath committed the power of the Keys, as to the first and prime subject, before officers be created, that cannot be done by officers, as having the power of these Keys.  
2. So visible saints and women, as well, yea, and by better right, might appoint Elders, i. e. choose and elect them in every City, than Titus could do; yea. Tit. 1. 5. 〈◊〉 Tim. 〈◊〉. 22. 〈◊〉 better right than Timothy: as for the place Eph. 5. 21. wh●●h Mr. H. had no leisure to cite, every one submit unto another, what Logic is here? is every Woma● a Church to another? for it 
The place 〈◊〉. 5. a● submit one to another, is mistaken by Mr. H. it speaks nothing of Chu●ch-subjection. Z●…us in loc. 〈◊〉 ux●●es, libero●, & maritis & pa●●ntibus. B●…s, 〈◊〉 in familia & Republica. Calvia. Ubicunque regnat charitas ib● mutu● est servit●●. B●za, mutua reverentia. Hi●ronymus, Baines on Ephes. 3. C●jetan. in ●ocum. T●…llian. in Apolo. President probati qu●que. Seniores honorem istam non pre●io, sed testimonio adepti. Theophylact. in Mat. 18. Non solum quae solvunt Sacerdotes s●nt soluta, sed quaecunque & nos injuria affecit, vel ligamus, vel solvimus, & ipsa 〈◊〉 ligata & soluta. 〈◊〉 o●. in 1 Tim. 5. Synagoga & posteri Ecclesia Seniores habuit, sine q●o●um consilio ni●●● agebatur in Ecclesiâ, quod qua negligentià ob●…t nescio, ●●si forte doctorum desid●●— magis superbly.  is not spoken of Church-subj●ction, but as Ambrose, of the subjection of humility. Mr. R Boide, Zanchius, of t●e subjection in families, and Commonwealths, as of the Wife to the Husband, the Children to the Parents, of the subjection of L●ve, as Calvin and Beza. Hieronymus, poni● general● principium politiae Christiana. So Caj●tan. Paul Baines saith, it is the submission of humility, which the highest owe to the lowest, the husband to the wife; is not every woman the daughter to submit to the mother? is not this a busing of Scripture? may not the father & the son be in divers congregations? and though it were meant of Church subjection, owe not I Church-subjection to these of another congregation, as to these of my own? and should Mr. H. limit the sense of the Holy Ghost to one single congregation, i. e. submit only to these of your own congregation?  
Mr. H. The power of rebuking pertains to all, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to rebuke, 
Rebuking Mat, 18. is wildly mistaken by Mr. Hoo●●r.  Mat. 18. 15. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to judge, 1 Cor. 5. 1●. both which express acts of proceeding in a judicial way, the whole may censure the part; they are superior, as officers, when they keep the rule, but inferior, as members, and in submission, when they break the rule.  
Ans. There is little Logic in dividing the power of private judging, which every one owe to another (no man is a Church to his brother) into a power of rebuking, and a power of Church-judging; for that 1 Cor. 5. 12. is the Church-judging by excommunication: so the face is where the neck should be.  
2. The rebuking, Mat. 18. 15. is indeed in order to Church-rebuking, and to excommunication; yea, to rebuke is a duty of the law of nature, Leu. 19 17. Ps. 141. 5. but by Mr. H. his way, I must rebuke none but offenders of my own congregation. May I not then rebuke, but hate brethren of another congregation? for so Moses expoundeth Leu. 19 17.  
3. If to rebuke be a judicial Church-rebuking; I pray you, may not women rebuke women and men both, and labour to gain them, if they trespass, and to tell the Church? sure, Abigail, pilate's Wife, Sarah, and other godly women did rebuke, counsel, and complain of offences, and they are not exempted from this duty of the law of nature. Doth not then M. H. cloth women with a Church-power? and why but as jezabel and wanton widows are censurable, Rev. 2. 20. 1 Tim. 2. 12. may they not rebuke? and it appears that a brother must forgive until seventy seven times (for upon this occasion Peter moves the question, Mat. 18. 15, 21, 22.) but not so, women, aged children, and servants, for they must be less apt to forgive then men.  
3. If Mr. H. so much please himself in Dichotomies, why but to these two he might have added 2 Cor. 2. 7. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to forgive, and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to comfort; and others also, as teaching, 
Mr. H. his division of power of 1. rebuking, 2. of judging, a narrow and a weak Dichotomy.  exhorting? all which cannot be taken from women, servants, aged children, except you ex●me them from the Law of Love. And howbeit the rebuker be the superior as he rebukes (which yet is not true in an unjust rebuker, for he is inferior) yet either too much shall be taken from, or too much given to godly women by Mr. H. his way.  
Mr. H. objects, If the people should censure the Pastors, than there should be Pastors of Pastors, and the Sheep should be Shepherds, not the Sheep.  
Ans. The consequence is feeble, because the people judge not as officers, but as members of the whole, to whom by virtue of the common Laws of combination they have subjected themselves to be ordered, for the common good.  
Ans. Mr. H father's not this argument upon me, nor upon any of ours, but Stapleton, Grego. de Valen. Toletus, Pererius, Esthius, and other Papists, who urge the like to exime their 
By Mr. H. his way, the flock are over the shepherds, the flock feed, and watch for the soul of the pastors.  Clergy from being subject to civil powers. Own the Argument, for then the shepherd should be subject to the sheep, which is not absurd, in diverso causarum genere. But these who gave power as officers to excommunicate, are here ruled by such as have that power, and such, to wit, the people and flock, have that power, have the keys.  
2. Are to edify by excommunication, 1 Cor. 5. 5. 2 Cor. 10. 8. 1 Tim. 1. 20.  
3. The Rulers are to obey the people, as such, who watch for their souls, Heb. 13. 17.  
4. Take heed that they perish not, and therefore must give warning and rebuke, lest these perish over whom they have the power of the rod that way. And so the people authoritatively watch for their shepherds, and the shepherds, to wit, all the officers must submit unto the sheep, the people, as being over them in the Lord, having the power of excommunication above their heads.  
2. It is but a conceit, to say, that the brethren excommunicate 
It is but a poor evasion of Mr. H. that the people doth excommunicate the officers, not as officers, but as members; for none are sure to be excommunicate, but as scandalous and rotten members.  not their pastors as if they were officers, for they excommunicate them, as having received the keys to use them against their Pastors, as the Church having authoritative power over their Pastors, as members of the Church; and it hath no sense to say, that the Church excommunicates, not as the Church, and contrary to Mat. 18. 17, 18. nor can members as members excommunicate; but saith he, the officers are not excommunicated as officers, but as members. Nor are any the most scandalous excommunicated as officers, or as saints, or as members, but as scandalous officers, or scandalous professors, or as rotten and leavening members corrupting the whole lump.  
Mr. H. Suppose the members of a Class offend, the rest who censure them are not Pastors of Pastors to these whom they censure.  
Ans. The whole watch for themselves, and rule, and govern themselves, as the Parliament do rule their own members. But it is nonsense to say that the sheep are in the Lord over the flock, for the Scripture saith the contrary, Heb. 13. 17. 1 Thes. 5. 12, 13. v. 7.  
Mr. H. Suppose the Pastors turn Heretics, the ruling Elders with the rest censure them; here are the inferiors judging the superiors.  
Ans. This is to beg the question, for if there be none to excommunicate the Pastors, but only the ruling Elder with the 
The ruling Elders there alone with the people have no power by the Word to judge the Pastors.  people, Christ committed not half a Key to any society. The Key of Ruling without the Key of Preaching is committed to no society on earth; and therefore not to the ruling Elder with the people. If there be more teaching Pastors with the ruling Elders, than an heretical Pastor may be censured by the whole Judicature, and by the ruling Elders in Collegio, where he hath an equal vote with the teaching Pastor, and doth not as an inferior judge the teaching Elder, but as a collateral and joint Judge censure with the whole Judicature.  
Mr. H. It's a staple Rule, No man by nature hath an Ecclesiastical 
Pag. 189, 190.  power over another by constraint; one comes a Christian convert from China, to a Country or City where many Churches are, 
It is no staple rule, that one cannot be compelled to join in a congregation.  none of them can, by the rule of the Gospel, compel him to join with one more than another. He may freely choose what is most suitable to his heart, and may be most to promote his spiritual edification.  
Ans. Neither Civil nor Ecclesiastic power here hath place. 1. This staple Rule (Mr. H. abounds with staple Rules which are much irregular) except it be proved by the Word, is a staple untruth. No man by Nature hath a spiritual power, either gift, office, or grace: But by Nature here is opposed to free consent. Children born in Abraham's house are without free consent members of that Church: Be it so, one congregation more than another cannot compel the China-convert to be a member of their congregation; but if he be baptised and profess, the godly Magistrate may compel him to hear the Word, and receive the Seals in the place he resides, so it be a sound Church. The Magistrate cannot compel him to faith and heart duties, but he may compel him to external profession; nor doth his being a member of this rather than of any other Church, make him a member of th● visible Church; nor is that any thing but staple forgery: the ●uler cannot compel a man to love his Neighbour, but he can c●mpel him to the external duties of love, and punish him if against love he beat or kill his Neighbour. He cannot compel any to the faith, but if one come to years' desert his faith professed in baptism, both the Church and the Magistrate may punish him as a run away.  
The Church cannot by carnal weapons (saith he) impose any Church-constitution, as Nature gives not this power Ecclesiastic: true, it is a free gift of God: So a civil Ruler (saith he) should not impose it, that is a poor consequence, he should impose all civil duties that are external, and which the man's baptism and profession ties him unto. What ever is done here (saith he) in the constitution of Churches, is done by an Ecclesiastic Rule, not by a Rule of policy. This yet is most weak. The Magistrate 
The Ruler makes no Church-laws, but he may compel Christians, yea and subdued heathens in some case to obey them when they are made.  makes no rule of constitution of Churches, nor any Ecclesiastical Rule, as Mr. H. saith. But it follows not, therefore he cannot impose it, when it is made. The Magistrate makes not the hearing of the Gospel to be lawful; but it follows not, Ergo as the preserver of both Tables of the Law, he may not command Christian subjects to hear the Gospel: yea, to me its most probable, he may compel heathen people lawfully conquered to desist from Idolatry, blaspheming of Christ, and to hear the Gospel.  
The man comes from China acknowledging God in all his ways, as Abraham left his Country, Gen. 12. if he be an Idolater, they should not lodge him, 2 joh. 10. he comes not as indifferent to be married to this or this Church, or to none at all; as a man sins not if he marry none at all, 1 Cor. 7. but if he be a professor that joins to no Church, he lives scandalously; therefore the adequate cause of membership, or to this membership, is not mutual consent, as in marriage, but both parties are under a command to confess Christ before men; and it's a selfish thing to make a man's own heart the Judge and Determiner of his membership, and not the Churches led by the Rule of the Word: and so the Church is obliged to receive him, and he is obliged to join a member, according to Cant. 1. 7, 8. Mat. 10. 32. 
Pag. 190, 191. There is no Scripture that unofficed men have a power of creating of officers.   
Mr. H. The power scattered in many, when they are voluntarily combined, they may give it to one, and this is a power of Office, and they may covenant to submit to him their united right. Hence it is more than plain, they may give a call and power to such and such to be Pastors, and yet themselves be no Pastors. Christ gave some to be Pastors, Ephes. 4. he furnishes men, 1 Corinth. 12. 28.  
Ans. Where is Mr. H. his Logic now? Why made he not once a Syllogism, or a face of a Consequence?  
1. There is a power scattered in many. What power? of ordaining by laying on of hands to make men to be Pastors which were none before? By what shadow of Scripture or Reason is this said? one half of a Command, or Promise or Practice shall silence me, if they may give their scattered powers of Jurisdiction to one, they may create a Monarch, an Arch-Pastor or Pope over themselves. I judge Mr. H. thinks not so: but Scripture should here speak, and not Mr. H. and tell us, who gave to people, to men and to women (who have no less a power to know the voice of Christ in this Pastor, and to choose an officer than men) the scattered powers official to call and create officers.  
2. They may give this power to one: prove this; it's a non ●ns, a power of ordaining even virtual they have not, therefore they cannot give it.  
3. Christ gave gifts to men, God hath placed Pastors in the Church, Apostles: what! Ergo, the people gives power of being Apostles, Pastors, to men who were not Apostles and Pastors before? This is Mr. H. his Argument: Are Mr. H. his words 
Ames. in Bellarm. enervato ●om. 2, l. 3. c. 2, Oves rationales (foeminae, adulti, pueri, servi) possunt eligere sibi pastorem non per jurisdictionem, sed potius per subjectionem. See the mistakes of D. Bilson, Perpetual Governm. c. 7. Page 191.  Oracles, and Principles that cannot be denied?  
4. The people, men and women as sheep, choose a Pastor by no act of jurisdiction, saith Amesius, but rather by Subjectione and Election makes not a Minister, but only appropriates his labours to his people, quoad administrationem, saith Cyprian, Ordination is the call and juridical sending. Now the Apostles and Presbytery ordained Elders, Tit. 1. 5. laid on hands and ordained, Acts 6. 6. 1 Tim 4. 14. 1 Tim. 5. 22. committed the charge to faithful men, able to teach others. 2 Tim. 2. 2. 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2. 3. show me so much for your new Male-Church, excluding Females, who may be unbaptised men converted in China.  
Mr. H. A divided power in many, is not an united power from many. The people's is a divided power, lying in many combined, and therefore not the same. Hence the power of judgement is not the power of office, and therefore the fraternity may have the one, when they have not the other.  
Ans. Here is no Argument at all. This new Church, that now is called the Fraternity, a new name, not in Scripture, in 
Many bre●h●ē have no divided powers to make ●ne an officer.  this sense hath neither a divided nor an united power, to make, ordain and call to the holy Ministry one who was no Minister before; and so the question is begged, A divided power to choose in many, is not an united power. It's true of the power of electing and choosing of Officers, they are divers powers, and therefore the society hath the united power of choosing a Minister: but some men there alone have not a power, being divided from the Church of women, children and servants.  
2. Mr. H. finding himself ebb in proving, he tells us, that the fraternity may have the power of judging, and not of office: and he hath given no Word of God to prove, that the power of office, and the power of juridical judging (for of that we now speak, for the judgement of discretion women have) are different, that is, in divers subjects: But I deny that any hath official power, but that man hath juridical power also; or that any hath juridical power, but he hath also a power of office. Mr. H. brings no argument of the weight of a feather on the contrary. I deny not but they have divers formal exceptions, and because the power of judgement is not the power of office, therefore the fraternity may have the one, not the other. Weak Logic. Differunt conceptibus formalibus, Ergo, differunt subjectis. A power of discoursing, rationale, is not a power of laughing, risibile; sure: and therefore (saith this simple Logic) a man may have the one, and not have the other, that is, a man may be rational, and yet not risible: I am sorry that godly and judicious men build such hay and stubble upon the foundation.  
3. Why does Mr. H. give this new Church a Latin Name, The Fraternity, that is, a Church of Redeemed ones built on the 
The fraternity or brethren are in no place of Scripture put for the male-Church of Redeemed ones, far less for the congregational male Church. Way of the Churches, cap. 1. sect. 1. pag. 1, 2.  Rock, made up of Brethren and no Sisters? Ah! are women, servants, aged children, nor redeemed, not built on the Rock? So is there a Gospel-instituted Church described. The word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, as Stephanus tells us, is only twice in the New Testament: 1 Pet. 2. 17. Love the brotherhood, that is, the company of the brethren, say Mr. Leigh, Beza, Calvin, English 
Stephan. in Concord. N. T. Mr. Leigh Crit. Sac. N. T. p. 7. Beza 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 achava pro fratrum coetu. Calvin. Pro fratribus collectiuè sumptis. English Divines and Lorin. ipsam Ecclesiam. Esthius. Qui regeneratione fratres sunt. Piscator. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, die brud●rschaff id est, totam multitudinem fratrum: sic infra 5. v. 9 sic Latini nobilitatem pro nobilibus. Cyprian. lib. 3. Epist. 17. Cum fraternitatis nostrae vel utilitas vel necessitas sic utique gubernetur— fraternitatem universam meo nomine salutate. So Cypr. lib. 3. c. 18. Augustine. Basilius Epist. ad Galliae Episcopos fratres.  Annotators. The company of the brethren; Lorinus, The Church; Esthius, The brethren by regeneration, and new birth. So Piscator, The brethren that are regenerated; as the Nobility is put for the Nobles. Let any man judge, if name or thing be so much as hinted at, when Paul and the rest of the Apostles export the brethren, jam. 5. 12. My brethren, swear not, does he not forbid women to swear? or speak they of the brethren only of a single congregation? Yea, and when Paul determined to come to the brethren at Rome, Rom. 1. 13, 14. to whom he was debtor to preach the Gospel, came he only as such a debtor to brethren of a single congregation? or only such brethren of a single congregation justified by faith? are they only no debtors to the flesh? Rom. 8. 12. & 7. 1. & 10. 1. & 7. 4. Wherefore my brethren, ye are bec●me dead to the law by the body of Christ: are not women dead to the law through Christ? See Rom. 8. 12. 1 Cor. 1. 10, 26. and in many places of the Old and New Testament, if the Scripture mean only unofficed men by the Fraternity and Brethren. Cyprian hath the word Fraternity, the whole Fraternity: but all that read him know, he means most ordinarily the whole Church and flock of men and women. And when it is taken for only men, it is brethren in office, Act. 10. 23. & 15. 23. never for brethren of this new devised Church. Augustine useth it sometime for brethren in the Ministry, and so doth Basil and the Fathers.  
Mr. H. However the Elders are superior to the fraternity in regard of office, rule, act and exercise, which is proper only to them, and not to the fraternity, the people or Church are superior to the Elders in point of censure, each have their full scope in their own sphere and compass: The office of Major, King, Emperor is not prejudged, because the Corporation, Parliament, Princes and States for faults may depose them.  
Ans. What he calls the fraternity in the one line, in the next he calls it without all Scripture, the People or Church, as if women 
If brethren & Church be all one, women must be no members of the Church. M. H. makes censuring no act of ruling.  and servants were no part of the people and Church redeemed by Christ.  
2. Whereas he makes the people or Church superior to the Elders (all of them if Heretics) in regard of censure, not of office and rule: He makes censuring or excommunicating no part of rule, contrary to Scripture. Excommunicating is either an act of teaching; or 2. of administering the Seals; or 3. of visiting, by private exhorting, convincing or comforting, for an act of feeding for public edification it must be, 1 Cor. 5. 5. 2 Cor. 10. 8. But that it can be none of these, it needs no probation; to excommunicate, is not to preach, etc.  
2. It is contrary to Mr. Cottons words. 
Cottons Keys; c. 4. n. 2. p. 16. Excommunication is one of the highest acts of rule in the Church, and therefore cannot be performed but by some Rulers: Now where the Elders are culpable, there be no Rulers left in that Church to censure them.   
3. The Ordinance of Christ is prejudged, where unofficed men take on them the name of the Church, and are not the Church, and to excommunicate, where they have no such power of the Keys given to them by any word of Christ. The instances of a Major, King, etc. prove nothing: All free Societies 
L●x-Rex, 〈◊〉 6. pag. 28, 29, & seq.  may, by the Law of God, create, and also choose Solomon, David to be their King, and unking them again for a fault, as elsewhere I have proved. And here is a clear Law of God, but that a new devised fraternity of some few unofficed brethren should rule and overrule, and the sheep excommunicate all their officers, must have a word of institution, not Mr. H. his naked word.  
M. H. Hence the censure of Excommunication, for the act is 
Page 191.  common to the Elders, only for the manner of managing of it, its peculiar for the Elders to be leaders in that action: and thence it is they are called (Leaders) 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Heb. 13. 17.  
Ans. I know not why the censure of Excommunication should not be common to both the Elders and this new fraternity, both in regard of the power and the act of Excommunication, except Mr. H. show, that the office adds a new power of Excommunication, which the fraternity hath not; and if so,  
1. The fraternity, before they were officers, and now when they are all turned grievous Wolves, do excommunicate, and yet they want this new official power of Excommunication, which is strange; for than they shall not have the complete power of Excommunication: and yet they exercise the act with commission from Christ.  
2. It is to me a mystery, what superiority in the manner of managing the act of Excommunication, the officers have above 
M. H. abus●s, but expounds not the place Heb. 13 17. in making all pastoral authority over the people to be in the pastors, presiding and ordering of the meeting in the censures, especially of Excommunication.  the fraternity, they load, i. e. they preside and moderate in the actual dispensing of censures, and therefore are called Overseers, Heb. 13. 17. Good; Ergo, moderating the acts of judging, makes the Pastor an overseer and watcher for the souls of the members of the judicature, as one who must give an account to God, for so the place Heb. 13. 17. 18. is. Was ever Scripture so tortured? The scope of that place is, Heb. 13. that men, women, obey their watchmen, feeding by the Word preached, by Seals and Censures, the flock; so the words. So Beza, Calvin, Pareus, Marlorat, Piscator; so Cajitanus, justinus Martyr, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Rulers. Never man, I dare say, Father, Protestant, Lu●●●ran, Papist, or Interpreter, who expound that passage, dreamt that the officers are called overseers, Heb. 13. 17, 18. because they lead and preside, or convene and dissolve the congregation. 
Calvin. Ut plebs fidem & reverentiam pasto●●bus habeat. ●ar●us. Obedient in domino. Marlorat. In summo pretio habeant cum charitate, 1 Thess. 〈◊〉 12. Piscat. Hortatur ad obedientiam erga ipsorum deuces & ductores, id est, pastors, ●●ctores, gubernatores. Cajetan. Subditos ad obedientiam hortatur. Esthius idem.  For it follows, the Moderator of a Judicature hath a superiority of office over the members of the Synod, and watches for their souls.  
2. That he is the Pastor of Elders and Pastors in the act of Excommunication, and rules them, but reacheth them not, and this is the Prelate.  
3. When there be twelve Pastors over one congregation of jerusalem in acts of censure, Peter or some other leading the action, must be a Pope with superiority of office over these to watch for their soul●  
4. When the Brethren excommunicate all their officers, an unofficed Brother must lead the action as an overseer, Heb. 13. ●7. What superiority of Jurisdiction hath this or any Moderator or Speaker in Parliament, or Prolocutor in a Synod? for he hath but one vote. If it be a priority of honour, for age, and grace and gifts, we must obey all the aged, and such as in learning and holiness exceed us, for they watch for our souls, by the place Heb. 13. 17. as Mr. H. teacheth us.   

CHAP. II.  
Of the first subject of the power of the Keys.  
MR. H. The power of the Keys is committed to the Church 
Survey, par. 〈◊〉. c. 11. sect. 2. p. 192.  of confederate Saints, as to the first subject thereof; it is no new opinion.  
2. I oppose Fathers to Fathers.  
3. If it be in the people's power to hinder excommunication to take place, than the Elders only have not a power given them of Christ, to manage this: but this is against the wisdom of Christ to ordain means that cannot attain the end; which must be, if the people may ●inder it.  
Ans. If man be the first and proper subject of capacity to laugh, then must all contained under this subject, Peter, Ann●, be capable to laugh; but women, servants, aged children are as properly the confederate and inchurched Saints by Mr. H. his words, as men. Cyprian and most of the Fathers take in the 
Cypr. lib. 〈◊〉. E●. 4. pa●. 1. ca 11 p. 186. Par. 1. c. 2. p. ●5 The way of our brethren in most of 〈◊〉 p●…ples is the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉  people with the Rulers in the exercise of censures, by way of consent; but without vanity, I say, never Fathers, Greek or or Latin, Counsels, old or late, Doctors, Schoolmen, Prote ●ant, Papist, or any Divine, till of late the Socinians, and now the brethren of the Congregational way, and the Separatists and Anabapti●●s taught, that the Church of believers of a single congregation, hath formally a power of jurisdiction in them to make and unmake officers, to call and excommunicate them. But you shall find all the principles and grounds of this new way 〈◊〉 the Arminian Authors and Socinians cited in the Margin; and Mr. H. never laboured to vindicate their way from these impure Sects. For,  
1. They deny the notes of the visible Church, as the brethren do against the reformed Churches.  
2. They deny the word Church, either Mat. 18. or elsewhere to signify any thing but Believers, never Rulers only.  
3. They deny the definition of a visible Church, from a profession, and require reality of holiness, at least some of them, as our brethren with Anabaptists do.  
4. Episcopius maintains separation. 
Episcopius Arminianorum antesignanus in respons. ad di●ēmata decem Pentificia, to 2. quaesit. 2. p. 255. Nuspian sub Ecclesiae nomine pastors, Episcopi, Doctores veniunt, uti videre est, Act. 14. 1. & 14. 22. & 15. 12. 20. 17, 18. & 1 Cor. 12. 18. & 14. 4. Philip. 1. 11. pag. 156. Si quaesitor secundo sensu à nobis judicato Ecclesiae vocem sumit, unam sanctam ca▪ holicam Christianam multitudinem vere p●o 'em & simplicium Christianorum reperiri, qui ubique in sacris Christ● oves aut ov●le, Christi corpus, & Ecclesia vocantur, pro certo et●ā ap●d nos esse, professio●em cum dicimus (not●m Ecclesiae, inquit id●m Episcop. part. 3. disp. 28. thes. 9) eam intelligi volumus, quâ non singulitantum, sed plerique singulatim, doctrinam Christi salutarem profitentur dictis ac factis: sed juncti etiam ea faciunt quae Deus fieri voluit, & quae non nisi in coetu fieri poss●nt. Remonst. in declara●. suâ c. 22. 〈◊〉. 9, 10. thes. 7. Extern●m mandatorum Jesu Christi observationem n●tam esse Arminius in disp. 54. 11. 8. signa haec sunt verae fidei, professio, & vitae s●cundum spiritus praescriptum & instinctum institutio, quod ad externas actiones attinet, de quibus ●olis judicare possumus homines. disp. 58. 11. 3. Concilium nullum (maxim orthodoxum) potest successoribus suis praescribere Episcop. par. 3. disp. 31. 11. 12. nec enim fas est, ut quis se socium in celebratione nominis ac beneficiorum Jesu Christi faciat ejus quem ni●il minus quem Christianum esse novit. Ecce manifesta est separatio prorsus illicita. Idem ●●sp 32. th'. 5. Si vero ad decidendum alicujus in religione cap●t●, sive veritatem sive necessitatem indicantur, non tantum non utiles esse conventus, sed pericalosos etiam & tyrannicos asser●mus. R menst. declare. c. 25. th'. 2. 6. conditio Synodorum, si quod in iis statutum est, libere semper examini (1 joh 4. 1. 1 Thess. 5. 21.) & ulteriori tevisioni subjectum relinqu●tur. R monst. Apolog. c 22. Scriptura testatur nos per fidem fieri filios Dei, membra corpor●s Jesu Christi, im● corpu● Jesus Christi (visibile de quo l●quuntur) ut unum quidem corpus cum eo esse, per eundemque fiuci spiritum.   
5. They deny all jurisdiction and necessity of lawful Synods, as our Brethren do.  
6. All Churches to them are visible congregations which meet in one place to hear the Word; so our brethren Churches of C●. in new England, c. 1. sect. 1. par. 1, 2. and Mr: H.  
7. Our brethren reject ordination by the laying on of the hands of the Presbytery, and all juridical mission by officers of associate Churches, and teach that aptness to teach, and holiness of live is sufficient for a call, so the people desire them, or choose them; and so do also the Arminians and Socinians.  
8. Th●● the whole Church, id est, the Brethren, and the Officers by accident, being only separable adjuncts of the Church, have a juridical power of excommunication; so Socinians acknowledge all the godly and believers to be the visible Church, though scattered all the world over, and reject the authority of all visible Churches and Counsels, deny all juridical calling and ordination; so that it is clear that they judge the visible professors and people to be the visible Church, which governs and excommunicates, which is the mind of Mr. Hooker.  
Mr. H. And the brethren and (9) some Socinians, as Nicolaides and others, hold that wicked men by no law of God are 
joan. Volkelius Socinianus de vera Religione, Lib. 6. cap. 1. Particularis Ecclesia eo hominum coetu continetur, qui in certo quodam loco convocatus est: veluti est Ecclesia unius domus ac familiae, c. 15. p. 690. Animadvertendum est Ecclesiam loci illius, in quo res ista geritur, totam in unum locum ●ogendam esse, ut nimirum tum omnes, de ejus, qui excommunicandus est, peccato justissimum judicium faciant, tum ipsius animadversâ mal●tiâ uno consensu eum in Christi membris nullo pacto haberi posse statuant. c. 16. p. 695. Ubi sit vera Ecclesia, res non est scitu necessaria ad salutem. c. 17. p. 669, 700. Nullae sint notae aspectabilis Ecclesiae, & quas credis esse has (assignatas à Protestantibus) non sint verae. Theoph. Nicolaides, de Ecclesia & missione Ministrorum r●su. cap. 2. p. 9 Ego ostendo Socinum affirmare, quaestionem de Ecclesia non omnem, sed aliquam, nempe quaenam, & apud quos sit, esse non simpliciter & absolutè, sed vel propemodum vel modo quodam inutilem, resut. c. 3. p. 27, 28. Certe etiamsi in Ecclesia esse possunt tam boni quam mali; non est tamen vera Christi adspectabilis Ecclesia, in qua mali sunt perpetuo. Nam mali qui sunt in Ecclesia, qua mali, ferendi non sunt, sed aut ad frugem perducendi, vel tandem excommunicandi, ita ut dici non posset jure (ita plane Robinsonus) in Ecclesia esse vel bonos vel malos, 16. 29. non dici illo loco, Ephes. 4. Christum dedisse pastors— donec occurra●●us omnes— in Ecclesia perpetuo extituros apostolos. Pesse enim verba illa ad sola Apostolo●um tempora referri, qu●bus scilicet multa extabant quae ab unitate fidei remorissima erant, & tantum doceri quodnam sit officium pasterum 31. semen esse semper ad finem mundi, etiamsi non sint qui illud spargunt. c. 9 89. In prima Apostolica Ecclesia, semel tantum ad consilia itum est. c. 10. p. 197. An linear docere absque missione, hoc est, an absque antegressa humana vocatione & licentia ab aliis datâ, quam ille mediatam missionem vocat, liceat ei qui ad docendum alios aptus, & vitae inculpatae, alios docere Evangelium Christi. Notandum vero hic imprimis illud est, nullam missionem quae ab hominibus proficiscatur, vel mediatam dari. Missio solius Dei est Jesu Christi: Adeo ut nec ipsi Apostoli quenquam mittere propriè loquendo, potuerint, aut misisse legantur. 102. Qui nova revelat ei missione nec opus est, nec esse potest: Apostlis opus fuisse missione, non ministris qui nunc sunt.  to be suffered in the visible Church, and they are not there jure. Mr. H. offends, that unregenerated men, when known to be such, are to be suffered to be there, or that the ordinances should be dispensed to them; which to be, is against  
1. The patience and meekness of Christ (I speak of the known non-regenerated, that are not scandalous) and so against the 
Pag. 106. So. cinus satis esse ad munus publicè docendi comprobandum, si illi ita velint, qui cohortationes & explicationes istas audiunt, id est, solam & nudam electionem populi absque ordinatione pastorum facere comprobatum ministrum: Belle. Socin. adversus Gabr. Ementropium adversus Cap. 1. p. 7. Quaenam & ubi sit Ecclesia, plane incertum. Socinus. Resp. 11.— ad Resp. Andr. Volani, nullus deinceps hominibus quantumvis doctrinâ— & authoritate, add etiam sanctitate pollentibus, nullus hominum conciliis quamvis sanctè in speciem & legitimè congregatis, nulla denique— visibili Ecclesia quamvis perpetua & universali— in judicio— divinorum oraculorum interpretatione standum nobis jonas Schlighintingius ex praelectione. joan. Crelbi Com. ad Galat. in c. 5. p. 263. Duo autem tantum sunt quae hoc Christianae communionis vinculum ru●pere possunt: vel pestilens aliquod dogma, quod salutem prorsus adimat; vel mores minime Christiani— si in errore pertinaciter haereat; aut etiam ob flagitia pro Synagoga Satanae haberi debeat, nihilominus ob mores flagitiosoes, nisi prorsus sunt flagitiosi, non tam licet uni alicui, aut multi minori parti ab aliis recedere, quam omnibus ab uno, vel longè pluribus à paucioribus, si ipsis interea paucioribus liceat secundum Dei praecepta vivere, ac conscientiae suae consulere, & nullus extat caeteris Christianus purior— vel etiam sperari possit. Valentinus Smalcius in Refutat. Thesium Wolfangi Iranthii, disp. 12. pag. 297. Ubi vero non est obedientia, ibi nulla est vera Ecclesia. Idem pag. 282. Vera & sincera doctrina forma est Ecclesiae, quae scilicet illi dat esse, & gyrus est valdè ridiculus, si pro notis Ecclesiae doctrina vera & salutaris censeatur; tam enim incertum est, ubi sit vera Christi Ecclesia, quam incertum est ubi sit vera & salutaris doctrina, nota enim semper est notior eo cujus est nota.  patience and meekness required in his servants and Church in order to his end.  
2. Against the institution of the visible Church, the school of Christ; no master ought to exclude out of the school a child, who though dull of learning, yet is well disposed, and keeps the laws of order and discipline; for it is ordained ●o fine, that the non-regenerate may be effectually called.  
3. None should be excommunicated, but these who are extremely scandalous, or obstinate; and so none are to be excommunicated for simple non-regeneration, which can appear only to be non-regeneration to some regenerate only, Ps. 36. 1. and not to them infallibly.  
4. By the command of Christ, and so jure, john Baptist baptised huge multitudes, of whom he had no assurance that they were regenerate, when by the spirit of God he names them a generation of Vipers, and rebukes them as Hypocrites, who thought it holiness enough to be the carnally born sons of Abraham, Mat. 3.  
10. I do not speak this to lay any odium upon the brethren, as if they loved the ways of Arminians and Socinians, but upon a twofold account.  
1. Because Mr. H. passes all what I said of this, as not worthy 
Ref. Thes. de ordine Eccles. disp. 4. p. 377. An hujusmodi constitutio (missio) sit prorsus necessaria ad constituendum verbi Dei Ministrum: Hoc autem nos negamus, nihil enim tale (quod caput rei est) legimus in descriptione eorum quae ad Episcopum constituendum requiruntur, ubi tamen omnia ea recenseri necesse est, sine quibus munus istud consistere nequit; nec curandum est quicquam, quod two qui alios docent ab illis nec vocati nec missi sunt, dommodo secundum canonem Apostolicum apti sunt ad munus illud obeundum. Cateches. Raccovien. de Ecclesia Christi, c. 1. pag. 334. Non multum juvat signa verae Ecclesiae inquirere— at tenere salutarem doctrinam, cum ecclesiae Christi sit natura, signum illius, si propriè loquatis, esse non potest, cum signum à re cujus est fignum differre oporteat. c. 2. 240, 241. Nun two qui docent in ecclesia, ut singulari aliqua ratione mittantur, opus habent? Resp. Nullo modo— Apostolus describens diserte omnia quae ad constituendas personas ejusmodi pertinent, nullam missionis facit mentionem.— Cum his duabus rebus p●aestant, vitae innocentia, & ad docendum aptitudine, proper ejusmodi constitutionem meritò apud omnes justam authoritatem invenire debent. Ita Episcop. disp. 26. th'. 2, 3. Ostorod. institut. cap. 42. defence. nocin. Tract. de Eccles. & Minist. miss. contra Miedzebo, c. 1, 2. Falsum est Apostolos semper requisivisse in Ministro ordinationem. Andr. Radecius in notis in Resut. nodi Gord. c. 4. Absque approbatione aliorum aliquem munus aliquod ob●re non posse concedimus, sed hac ratione missio eliditur, nam ut liberum est in liberâ republicâ, eum qui aprus sit ad munus obeundum eligere, sic in Christi ecclesia, eum qui aptus est ad docendum alios ad id munus eligere, notum est Orbi Christiano Arminianos' & Socinianos' tolerantia●●, locum habere debere profiteri in omnibus doctrinae capitibus, exceptis paucissimis, quae fundamentalia vocant. Episcop. disp. 28. th'. 14. Remonst. in Apol. Ubique in declare. in Praef. Arminius ubique libertatem prophetandi vastam praedicat. Theoph. Nicolaid. in resut. Tract. de exer. de Ecclesia, c. 2. Socin. Com. m. 1. epist. joan. & ubique. Socin. tractatu de Eccles. pa. 4. Ecclesia significat omnes non professione tantum, sed simul etiam re ipsa Christi fideles & revera pios— p. 1. Ecclesiae nomine intelligere debent coetus omnes adspectabiles, qui Christi salutarem doctrinam profitentur. Adolp. Venator. in declarat. sua, pag. 164. Credo Ecclesiam coetum esse in unum evocatum, ad audiendum ea quae divina & spiritualia sunt, & ad salurem spectant. Quae ad salutem necessaria paucissima sunt— Remonst. in Confess. cap. 22. sect. 4. Sub uno tamen praecepto sidei in Jesum Christum (sed verae, sed vivae per charitatem operantis) comprehendi possunt. Theoph. Nicolaid. Refut. Tract. de Eccles. c. 11. S. 2. c. 3. Socinus Tract. de Eccles. sect. 124.  the answering; though indeed, to speak or comply in opinions with enemies to Christ, his redemption, satisfaction, and free grace, is not overly to be looked on; especially in a new frame of government spiritual in the house of God.  
2. Because the Presbytery is called Antichristian, prelatical, formal, by our brethren. I love not high appeals, judging that they often fail against the third command; as for toleration maintained by Socinians and Arminians I impute it not to Mr. H. or the brethren of N. E. But there be not many, to my knowledge (I say no further) for the congregatonal way, but they are for toleration in nonfundamentals: and how few fundamentals there be possibly.  
2. What they are, who can define? so that this way seems to me no less new, than other sinful ways of Arminians and Socinians; and what mischief toleration brings forth in Britain also.  
Lastly, we hold that censures should not be dispensed against the people's mind; for as Augustine saith, the censure shall not 
August. contra Donatistas'.  edify, if most of the people be infected with the same scandal; and if the people shall not in their practices yield, it may breed a separation and a schism. But it is a naughty consequence, if 
Though the peoples not consenting may hinder excommunication to be, it shall never follow, that therefore the people have judicial power to excommunicate.  the people may hinder excommunication, than it is no ordinance of God, which is executed without the people's judicial power; this follows not, except the people had a Ius, a judicial power from Christ to hinder excommunication, which they have not; yea, and though they had a judicial power, yet if they use it not right, but abuse that judicial power (suppose they had it) it follows not, Ergo, excommunication is not an ordinance of God. For,  
1. The Elders may abuse their power, and so hinder excommunication; and without them, saith Mr. Cotton, no act of ruling and excommunicating can be; shall therefore excommunication be no ordinance? persecutors do hinder the preaching of the Gospel, shall the preaching of the Gospel for that be no ordinance of God? but the people lawfully may withdraw their consent, and then there shall be no excommunication. This yet proves not; If the people's power lawfully used hinder undue excommunication, than the Elders only have not power. For the people's power lawfully used, hindered King Saul to put jonathan to death, and hindered all the Judges from doing the same; Ergo, King Saul and the Judges only have not judicial power of life and death, but the people have it also? it follows not: yea, but (saith he) that Christ shall appoint a means of reformation, and purging the Church, that in an ordinary course shall not attain the end, is deeply prejudicial to the faithfulness, wisdom, and power of Christ: any manner of way this is an argument carnal and humane.  
1. Where hath Christ interposed his faithfulness and wisdom, that if officers and brethren make use of the judicial power he hath given to them, the Church shall be actually purged, is not this the question?  
2. Where hath he promised a reformed Church, in case these who have power to reform, stand in the way, shall Christ's wisdom be accused, or the Gospel reproached, because either men hinder it to be preached, or these to whom it is preached, believe it not? or does the faithfulness of God fail, though all men are liars? Rom. 3. Is his wisdom darkened, though all become vain and foolish in their imaginations? yea, if women, servants, children of age refuse to withdraw from the excommunicate, the censure cannot edify; they have not for that a judicial power to excommunicate by Mr. H. his way.  
Mr. H. The keys of the kingdom, by way of Metaphor, signifies all that ministerial power by Christ dispensed, and from Christ received; whereby all the affairs of his house, in point of opening to such as stoop to him, and of shutting to such as will not come under his authority, are acted according to his mind. 
The Keys by all Interpreters not a judicial power of officers. Wilson Dict. the power of teaching and ruling. Leigh. Potestas animadversionis & poenarum est & symbolum docendi. Beza. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Metaph. Occonomi potestas, Es. 22. Chrysost. Hom. 55. in Matth. Magna potestas notatur. August. de Civ. Dei, lib. 20. cap. 19 Beda in joan. Potestas solvendi & ligandi. Cypr. Epist. ad lapsos Ep. 27. alias lib. 5. Epist. 6. Et tibi dabo claves— inde per temporum & successionum vices Episcoporum ordinatio & Ecclesiae ratio decurrit, ut Ecclesia super Episcopos constituatur, & omnes actus Ecclesiae per eosdem propositos gubernetur, cum hoc itaque divina lege fundatum sit, miror quosdam audaci temeritate sic mihi scribere voluisse, quod Ecclesia in Episcopo & Clero & in omnibus stantibus.   
Ans. Learned Mr. Wilson, Mr. Liegh, Beza, Beda, chrysostom, Augustine, jerom, Cyprian, tell us that the keys noteth ministerial power, never since Learning and Tongues were in the world, given to unofficed and private men, to exercise and make use of them, but to the oeconomus Master-houshold, or steward. Cyprian, and the learned Annotator, who answers Pamelius, make Stantes distinguished from these who fell a part of the Church, because they are not utterly to be debarred ut prophani & canes, as profane, ab omni rerum Ecclesiasticarum cognition, but never endued with juridical power, as the Rulers; to these Mr. H answers nothing: only all such means (saith he) as are sufficient, private, or public, to open and shut Heaven, may be called the keys. All means of promises and threatenings in the mouths of women. Abigail and others of ged children and servants, yea, and of these of another congregation are sure means of the word, for opening and shutting Heaven; shall these women and children, and servants, for that bear the keys of the Kingdom of God?  
Mr. H. The key of Royalty is only in Christ, the key of charity in the hand of all believers, who out of Christian love lend some help, but have no power judicial to proceed. There is the Key of subordinate power which only such and all such have as are combined in a special corporation, and come under the external government of the Sceptre of Christ; such have good law to proceed against such as will not stoop to the rule.  
Ans. 1. What the Brethren have more than the key of charity, 
Women, servants, & others have the Key of love as well as the Male-Church.  to lend help out of love, is the debate; sure if women be not excluded from the Law of Love, this key cannot be taken from them.  
2. If only such, and all such (omne & solum) as are combined in a special corporation, have the key of subordinate power; this power essentially and universally must agree to the so combined body. But women, aged children, servants, are especially combined by the Church-covenant, as is easy to prove from Mr. H. quod convenit omni & soli convenit reciprocè & universaliter. Ergo, only the combined Church-members, and all the Church-members (so women) must excommunicate, and all for them; then the officers, as members combined, not as officers do excommunicate; I quit all Logic, if this can be eluded. Now Mr. H. says that confederate Saints, all, and only have the keys.  
Mr. H. Pro. 3. The keys of subordinate power are seated firstly in the Church, and by virtue of the Church, they are communicated to any that in any measure or manner share therein: heat to first in the fire, as its proper subject, the faculty of sense belongs first to the sensitive soul, etc.  
Ans. The power of the keys belongs to the Church of Believers, 
How the Church is the subject of the Keys, 1. Virtual. 2. Formal. 3. The Object.  of men and women, as the first virtual subject.  
2. To the rulers and guides, as to the formal subject; as heat is in the fire, so every part of the fire is formally hot, as a part of the first formal subject: as iron is hot by participation, by the fire. But by this Mr. H. must say all the parts of the Churches of Believers are endued with this power of binding and losing, as the partial and incomplete subject. So yetmust women, children and servants be endued formally with the judicial power of the keys: but this is false.  
3. The keys are in the whole, in the exercise, in the rulers formally by the judicial power inherent in them, in the people, men, and women by consent, not by any inherent formal power juridical.  
4. The keys belong to all rulers, ruled, men, women, masters, servants, parents, children, objectively and finaliter for the edification of the whole body, and every part thereof, Eph. 4. 11, 12. 2 Cor. 10 8.  
Mr. H. Is suits not with right reason to cast some part of the power firstly upon the people, some part upon the Rulers, as though there were two first subjects of this power which the letter of the text gainsayeth, to thee will I give, not to them: it were to speak daggers and contradictions to make but one first subject of the power, and yet have others to share in this power, is more wide from the mark.  
Ans. Judge if it suits with reason, which judicious and godly Mr. Cotton saith, when the Church of a particular Congregation 
Keys, cap. 7. 3 Prop. 33.  walketh together in the truth, all the brethren of the Church are the first subject of Church liberty, and the Elders thereof of Church-authority, and both of them together, are the first subject of all 
The subject of the Keys according to Mr. Cotton.  Church power needful to be exercised within themselves, whether in Election, Ordination, or Censures of their own body.  
They may distinguish between the power of the keys, and between Church power. But it suits as little with reason to make two, to wit, Elders and Brethren, the two first subjects, or one complete first subject of Church power, as to make them one complete first subject, or two first subjects of the power of the keys. Nor is it against reason, that the body organic be the first virtual subject of the Keys, and the same body be the first formal subject of both the Keys, and of Church-power in the exercise, the Rulers acting their way, and the people their way, as is said; nor are there for that two subjects of power.  
2. The Argument by which Mr. H. proveth this is most feeble, It is said to Peter, to thee I will give the keys, not to the 〈◊〉 Ergo, Peter represents the people, Believers only, 〈◊〉 est, the male-Church of the redeemed: I would not buy such Logic for a Not, for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is a collective, and represents many, for the Keys of the Kingdom noteth the Keys of jurisdiction, of preaching the word, etc. Now see, he gives the keys of knowledge principally and firstly to the people, and secondarily to the Elders who labour not in the word and doctrine, in so far as they concur to make the word effectual. Nor can the Lord have given the Key of only ruling to the preaching Elders, and therefore he speaks to Peter as representing two subjects.  
3. It is neither dagger nor weapon of blood, that the Catholic visible Church of the firstborn including rulers and ruled, be the first subject of free redemption, of all power of the Keys in their saving fruit, of all styles, the Spouse, Body, Love, etc. the saving privileges of special note, that one promised in the covenant of grace, the new heart, remission of sins, perseverance, ruling in the visible kingdom by binding and losing, and that your particular congregation and society share of all these at the second hand. And Mr. H. must be content that we look upon it as weak Divinity, that Christ gave himself for the Catholic Church, and bestows all upon her firstly, and that this be the first natural recipient subject of all these, as the element of fire, not this or that fraction or fragment of that Element is the first adequate, natural recipient subject of heat, as is above explained.  
Mr. H. Prop. 4. The power of the keys take it in the complete nature thereof, is in the Church of Believers, as in the first subject, but in the manner and order of ruling that Christ appointed, in the parts.  
Ans. Mr. H. speaks not distinctly, and should have told us what the power of the keys is in its complete nature, and what in its incomplete and half nature it is.  
2. When he says the Church-congregational, and the male-Church of Believers so confederate, is the first subject of the Keys, he saith an untruth like to this, this particular fragment of the Element of fire is the first subject of heat. And, Sir, what say you of the rest of the quarters of the Element of fire, must they, I pray you, be the subject of heat secondary, and by way of participation? So you may say London is the first subject of the power of government in England, yea, or Norwich; now the first subject by you is omne and solum, and so doth Mr. Cotton go before you; it is like England would take it evil, and judge that Norwich did not logically distinguish. Our Brethren 
Cotton, Keyes, cap 7. 29. The first subject 1. Receiveth that power reciprocally. 2. It first addeth and putteth forth the exercise of that power. 3. It first communicateth that power to others.  must be content no Congregation is any other but an integral part (as D. Ames. grants) of the Catholic visible Church. And Christ's design of Love was, that the whole, by order of nature, as the first subject, should partake of all the special privileges.  

1. Grace.  
2. Redemption.  
3. Covenant blessings, etc. power of binding, losing, seals in their blessed fruit for the whole.   
Nor can I say Amen to that of Mr. Cotton. 
Keys, chap. 7. p. 81. 1 Prop.   
A particular Church or Congregation professing the faith taken indefinitely, for any Church (one as well as another) is the first subject of all the Church Officers, with all their spiritual gifts and power— whether it be Paul, or Apollo, or Cephas, all are yours (speaking of the Church of Corinth, 1 Cor 3. 22.)  
Ans. 1. Mr. Cotton must prove that Paul there speaks of a 
The place 1 Cor. 3. 21. All things are yours etc. misinterpreted by Mr. Cotton.  particular Church that comes all together into one place, as he speaks, citing 1 Cor. 14. 23. and that formally as a single congregation meeting in one. It were a most comfortless Doctrine to limit that soul delighting privilege, 1 Cor. 3. 21. all things are yours, than Christ, and Grace and Glory are yours. And vers. 23. ye are Christ's, only to Saints, as they are a Church-meeting in one place. What is this, but by the scope of that place, you have right to Christ and Salvation, and Covenant-promises, as the first subject only under the reduplication of a congregation meeting in one place, as an organised Church. 
If the congregation in abstracto, as the congregation, be the first subject of all officers, gifts, graces, by this, All things are yours, than the godly Saints visible are excluded from Christ only, because they are not members of a congregation, and no promises of a new heart, of remission, are made to any, but to and for the congregation.  Ah! and shall not Christ and all things be theirs, who are in no Church-state like that of Corinth, but wander in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens, and cave● of the Earth, Heb. 11. 38 and have no certain dwelling house, nor fixed Church congregational, 1 Cor. 4. 11?  
2. What agrees to Believers, as Christians, and Believers, to believing women, aged children, servants, and to the scattered Saints. Now in no such Church state, as Mr. Cotton imagines the Corinthians to be in, and to john in the Isle of Pathmes, and to the Apostles as believing Apostles, that cannot agree to a congregation as the first subject, which reciprocally and only receiveth this power. But such is this, Revel. 21. 7. He that overcomes shall inherit all things, all are yours, death in the sweet fruit of it belongs to women, and to Christians as Christians, though in no congregational state; Ergo, women, and the whole Catholic Church, whether in such a Church-state or not, must be the first subject of the Keys. And it is wretched Logic; Paul saith, all things are yours, and ye are Christ's, to a congregation that meets in one place: Ergo, such a promise is made to a congregation, as to the first subject, and as to a congregation: then may I infer the promise to eat of the Tree of Life, to receive the hidden Manna, and the ●…ning Star, and to sit in a Throne with Christ, is made to such as overcome in the congregation (as our Brethren say) of Ephesus, of Pergamos, of Thyatira, etc. Rev. 2. 3. therefore these promises are made to the Church of a congregation, as to the first subject; upon the same ground all the congregational Church must be the first subject, and so the only subject of all privileges of the congregational Church of Corinth, of being justified, sanctified, Temples of the Holy Ghost, redeemed and bought with a price, etc. And if so, these privileges must agree to the congregation firstly, and to all other for the congregation, as that agrees first to the fire, and then to iron, to water for the fire.  
3. Paul saying, all are yours, whether Paul, etc. he cannot mean Paul, as an Apostle, is proper to you as a congregation, in all his Apostolic travels, for that is false: nor can the meaning be, Paul as a fixed Pastor is yours, for he was no fixed Pastor to them, tied to that congregation only. Then the meaning must be, Paul, and by a Synecdoche, all the Apostles and Pastors, and the World, and Life and Death, in their labours must be for you, and the Catholic Church, and all the Saints all the earth over, whom they must gather in, and perfect as Christ's body, and parts of his body, Ephes. 4. 11, 12, 13. and not as a congregation; so our Brethren in this as in many other points abuse, but expound not the word.  
Mr. H. The power of the keys is in her (the Church congregational of Believers) as in the cause subordinately under Christ, and it may thereby here be acted as potestas judicii, in admission of members, in the absence of Ministers, in censuring by admonition, for each man is a judge of his brother, and there is a judicial way of admonition, when the parties are in such a state as in foro exteriori, they can make process juridicè, against each other, so there is a power of gift in all elections. Or else this power of the keys is communicated from her to the officers, the soul doth not see but by an eye, makes an eye and sees by it, so that the Church makes a Minister, and dispenseth Words and Sacraments by Officers.  
Answ. We seek Scripture, and see only Mr. H. his naked assertions.  
1. The power of the Keys is radically in the Church of redeemed 
The Scriptureless and unproved assertions concerning the Male-Church excluding women.  ones, to wit, the male-Church of redeemed ones, a creature for name and thing, not in the Word.  
2. That this male-Church by a judicial power admits members, prove that.  
3. In the absence of Ministers this is done, than Ministers and Elders with the male-Church excluding women, aged children, judicially admit members, than all female members, and children, and servants with blind obedience must own these members, and watch over them: prove this, for women have neither consent nor vote.  
4. That every one may judicially process another, that is, judicially accuse one another and complain, and bring witnesses against one another, and prove the scandal: that is true, and may judicially accuse before the Church the daughters, or servant women, yea, or men that are incorrigible after private admonition, but that the members of the male-Church judge one another by the power of the Keys, is the question. Give us Scripture for it.  
5. There is Potestas doni, a power of a gift in all elections, well; a power of a gift of discerning & trying, who shall be my Pastor, sure women have their gift of discerning; why should Pastors be obtruded upon women blindly? should men have dominion over their faith? I am glad that Mr. H. gives no juridical power to the call and making of Officers: but only a power of gift, Potestas doni. But the Church communicates this power of the Keys to the Officers, that is, the male Church of redeemed Brethren. This is proved by no word of God, but by a similitude, in which it is said (by poor Physiology) The Soul makes an Eye, and the Brethren make their Officers, which we deny: God makes them by the laying on of the hands of the Elders, Acts 6. 6. 1 Tim. 4. 14. 2 Tim. 2. 2. 1 Tim. 5. 22.  
Mr. H. The power of judgement is the Church formaliter.  
Ans. It is often said, never proved to be formaliter in your male Church.   

CHAP. III.  
Whether Mr. Hooker his Arguments conclude strongly that the People have a power of judging.  
MR. H. 197. The power of judgement is in the Rulers directively (as formally in the people) they out of an office power, leading the whole proceeding therein.  
Ans. I never heard that a chief member, either Speaker in 
All power of office is by Mr. H. only in moderating and opening the Assembly, which is no power of Jurisdiction.  Parliament, or Precedent in Council, or Chairman in Committee, or Moderator in Assembly, was a place of juridical power, or office over the Judicature, or Members of the Church; a place of priority of order it is, which one may have to day and want to morrow: for the nature of order requires that one open the Assembly, and moderate the meeting: if this be all, the official power that Mr. H. gives to officers, is weak, and of no worth:  
2. There is no power, no act of ruling and governing given to the Pastors above the Brethren. For,  
1. To call an Assembly, Io●l 2. Is not proper to the officers, the Assembly by its intrinsical power from Christ, may convene in his name. Nor,  
2. To examine members, whether they be Apostles or not, by their way cannot be proper to the Elders ruling, for it agrees to other members, as wel● as to them.  
3. Ordination is, and may be (according to our Brethren) and creating of Officers, though Mr. Cotton make it peculiar to Officers, because of Act. 6. 6. 1 Tim 4. 14. as Mr. Cotton citys; yet Mr. H. saith, the Brethren may do it.  
4. It is no act of the Key of Authority, that the Elders open the doors of speech more than that one speak before another, or that Elihu speak more than the rest of the friends, is no act of the power of the Keys. Nor,  
5. Is the preparing of matters, and receiving of complaints, by our brethren's way proper to them then to other officers more, since Mr. H. saith all equally have the power of the Keys from the Church of Brethren. What power of the Keys the Pastors have in preaching and exhorting, they have it rather over the congregation, then over the male-Church of Brethren; nor is it so properly a superiority of rule, as of doctrine, which in Synods they have over Churches; nor can the Pastor have a directive power as a Pastor over the brethren; since by M. H. his way, they may judge and censure him. Can the King be their Judge with a directive power, who not being a Parliament, may judge authoritatively whether he should be King or not, and may dethrone him?  
Mr. H. Arg. 1. Ejusdem ist instituere & destituere, The people have power to censure and depose Officers in case of heresy, or otber iviquity, for they gave power by election to Rulers.  
Ans. It is ordinary to our Brethren to prove in a Circle, the fraternity have power to choose Officers, ere they have power to depose; and they have power to censure & excommunicate, he whole being above the part: ergo, they must have power to ordain: we deny the Fraternity can either make or unmake officers.  
2. That is not so undeniable a proposition, an Assembly of Officers, a Church of thirty may constitute themselves in a Judicature, and so may a Parliament, by an intrinsical power in themselves: Ergo, they may for heresy and scandal against the Law of Nature destroy and censure themselves, it followeth not.  
3. Apostles were immediately called of God, and made Pastors 
Men have not the being of Pastors by every new call to preach.  habitu, by that call and special direction of the spirit (which was in stead of Election) Paul is forbidden to preach in Bythinia, and called to preach in Macedonia: how many times should the P●ostles be made Pastors, and unpastored again, if the present call be that only which makes them Pastors? Levites were ordained to serve the Tribes jointly, and when the Tribes were dispersed, the Levites were dispersed, and remained Levites in whatever place they came to, as Mr. Hudson showeth. 
Essence and Unity of the visible Church chap. 6.   
4. If Pastors be baptised, and members of the Churchonly to which they are chosen Pastors, then as to the former part, they and all other baptised to one single congregation, when 
It may be said if professors be members baptised to one only congregation, they are unbaptised when they depart and turn members of another congregation.  that Church is dissolved, are no more baptised, and as Pastors cannot exercise pastoral acts, but to their own Church; neither can they act as baptised professors in another Church, baptising being a Citizens solemn incorporation to the Church, and by this way to the Church independent only: as a man that is only a free Citizen in Norwich, cannot for that be a free Citizen in York, or perform the acts of a free Citizen in all free Cities in England, as he can perform them in Norwich. And suppose that Norwich lose its freedom, the man is a Citizen of no free City of England: for as he is made solemnly by admittance into the Church, into which he is baptised a visible member incorporated by Baptism, as by his Burges Writ, or Burges Ticket, when the City is dissolved, and no free City, either his Burges Ticket to be a member of that City is null, or then by 
The Apostle & John Baptist asked for no congregation but immediately upon confession baptised.  his Burges Ticket he was made a member of all other congregations. john Baptist and the Apostles, Act. 8. joh. 3. after a confession never asked for their conversion, but baptised, for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, straightway without delay, even in the night (for so the word noteth, Matth. 21. 19 Luke 4 39 & 5. 25. & 8. 44.) The Jailor and his house, Act. 16. Cornelius and his house, Act. 10. the Eunuch, the multitude of john Baptists hearers were baptised members of the universal Church, 1 Cor. 12. 12, 13. where there was no particular congregation to receive, & admit them as members, as Mr. Richard Baxter solidly observes: nor is it worthy the refuting, that the Apostles by an extraordinary power might baptise them, though to no certain Church, but Pastors now have not that power: for the Apostles baptising and preaching, and administering the other seal differ not 
The Apostles preached and baptised in all places, as ordinary officers by the same command, Mat. 28. 19 by which we teach and baptise.  in species and nature, from the ordinary pastoral acts of an ordinary Minister, they speak with tongues, work miracles as Apostles; but they preach and baptise hic & nunc, as ordinary Officers. And as to the other part, the call of a Minister so, must be up and down, as he officiates to his own Church, he acts as a Pastor, as to these of another flock he tenders the Lords Supper as a gifted man.  
5. Though a congregation be of Divine right, and Paul be assigned to teach the Gentiles, Peter the Circumcision, Gal. 2. by an ordinance of God, yet it follows not, that Peter acts not as a Pastor, when he baptises Gentiles, or that Paul acts not as either, Apostle or Pastor when he baptizeth the Jews, and that Paul was ten hundred times a Pastor, and again no Pastor, as God called him to act pastorally in ten hundred congregations, and went from them; for the call of God's divine leading where to preach, and where not, in Macedonia, not in Bythinia, Act. 16. but the local division of congregations and provinces: as the second General Council defines; and that the provinces that belonged to Ephesus were added to Constantinople, as Socrates 
Concilium Nic. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Socrat. l. 3. c. 8. Concilium Chalced. c. 2. Every Bishop is a Bishop of the Universal Church, as is the Pope. Doct. joan. Crakantborp in defence, Eccles. Anglica. contra M. Antonii de Dominis Archiep. Spalleto injurias Anno 1625. Ed. per joan. Barkham c. 28. p. 168, 169. Episcopi omnes, quâ Episcopi, Universalis Ecclesiae pastores sunt consulendo, hortando, monendo, arguendo, increpando, scriptis simul & voce alios omnes instruendo, & cum vel haeresis ulla vel Schisma grassari coeperit, velut incendium publicum illud restinguendo & ne latius serpat providendo.  saith was from custom.  
When the Bishop of Spalleto defending the Supremacy of the Pope, saith, that he thus differs from other Bishops, that he is universal Bishop of all the Churches on earth, but other Bishops are Pastors of their own particular Dioceses and Chuches. D. joan. Crakanthorp Chaplain to King james wrote a learned book, in which he proves, that all Pastors are Pastors of the Church Universal, habitu & actu primo, as well as the Bishop of Rome, especially because in General Counsels 2. and without them, they are to care for all the Churches on earth.  
2. That the particular designation of single congregations, is by no divine right assigned by Christ; but by the prudence of the Church.  
1. For if it were not so, there could be no transporting of Ministers from one Church to another.  
2. Because Churches than could not be enlarged, nor diminished, nor changed, which we see may be done. Cyprian as most sound in many things, so in this is to be considered, we are (saith 
Cyprian. l. 3. Epist. 13. pastors multi sumus, unum tamen Gregem pascimus, & oves universas quas Christus suo sanguine & passione quaesivit, colligere & fovere debemus.  he) Many Pastors, but we feed one flock. We saw how Mr. H. was pleased to fall upon me, because I said that every Pastor is a Pastor to the Church-universal, by exhorting in Word and Writ; yea, by ruling in Counsels, and is not tied as a Pastor to employ his labours to one single flock only: we therefore condemn in our Brethren; (1) That the care pastoral of any Church, but of one congregation, of which the man is Pastor jure divino, quasi glob● affixus, is perished, since the Apostles died.  
2. That they distinguish not between a Pastor as he is a Pastor to all Churches, as the Lord in providence shall call, and between the same pastor, as tied to his single Church, rather than to another, by no divine right, but the prudence of the Church which is not infallible.  
3. That it is utterly unlawful to transplant Pastors upon any necessity of the greater good of the Church, against the law of nature.  
Mr. H. 2 Arg. It's in the power of the Church and Fraternity to admit members; Ergo, to cast them out, as appears in the admitting of officers.  
Ans. 1. Observe the circular probation between this and the former Argument, as is said.  
2. Give us one Scripture or jot where the Fraternity is either called the Redeemed Church, for so women are not Redeemed, 
The sole fraternity neither is, nor is called by any Scripture, the redeemed or governing Church.  or the governing Church, for the officers are not Rulers; or let Mr. H. give us a third Church.  
3. That the Fraternity only, and no women, gave their tacit consent to the choosing of Mathias, Act. 1. of the Deacons, Act. 6. of the Elders, Act. 14. 23. since their consciences were concerned, and they are parts of the fed and redeemed Church as well as men, can never be proved: and who can deny women 
Cypr. l. 3. ep. 3. Plebs maxime potestatem habet vel dignos sacerdores eligendi vel indignos recusandi. Cypr. l. 1. ep. 5. alias ep. 66. Lib. 1. ep. 7. alias 64. Lib. 4. ep. 6. alias ep. 56.  to be of the plebs, people and fraternity, as Cyprian speaks? and of the brethren that Paul, james, and the Apostles wrote unto? Doth not Cyprian divide the Church in stantes & la psos? were there not women that both yielded to the Persecutors, and denied the truth, and stood to the truth and suffered? Read Cyprian cited by Mr. Cotton, and in other places.  
M. H. 3 Arg. Either the people have a causal virtue in judging, or only a consent; the latter cannot be: To consent to evil is sin; to descent from a just sentence, makes them to hinder the execution of a just sentence.  
Ans. This is already answered, and hath not the weight of the some of the water. Elders have either a causal virtue in judging, or only a consent: the former I see not how they have.  
Mr. H. Mr. Tho: Goodwin, and Mr. Philip Nye, give them 
M. Tho. Goodwin and Mr. Philip Nye, Preface to Mr. Cottons treatise of the Keys.  only an authoritative directing power, such as Parents have in the marriage of their daughter, which is an authority extrinsical, which the Magistrate and Pastor in their kind have; but the Virgin hath the only formal and intrinsecal power to consent, and so to make the marriage, and to descent so as it shall be no marriage: In which case the Fraternity only or Male-Church formally, intrinsically judgeth, and may judge, though there were no 
The people have no causal virtue in judging, but only in consenting by the judgement of discretion to the sentence. The argument is re●orted.  officers, as the Maid may marry, though Parents and Tutors were dead; and the directive authority of the officers may be wanting, as the directive authority of the Magistrate may be wanting.  
2. The officers cannot consent to a sinful sentence, it's not their duty to sin, nor can they descent from a just sentence, for than they might hinder the execution of a just sentence, and the officers shall keep communion with a man whom the people excommunicates; and that the people may err, is too well known, in the condemning of jeremiah, of Christ, and of others, And whereas he saith, The dissenting shall blemish the wisdom of God, it's answered already: It blemishes our folly, but not his wisdom, when people are divided from Rulers, and Rulers from people.  
3. There is a midst between consenting to an unjust sentence, and a dissenting from a just sentence, to wit, a consenting by the judgement of discretion tacitly to a just sentence, in which there is a causality popular, nor judicial nor juridical, coming from the inherent power of the Keys.  
Mr. H. Arg. 4. It crosseth the rule of righteous proceeding, to 
Pag. 197, 198.  understand the Church. Mat. 18. of the Elders only: Suppose three Elders in a Church all have been convinced before witnesses 
There is a necessity of telling the Presbyterial Church, by M. H. his own argument.  in private of an offence; they will not hear; the offended brethren must tell the Church: that is, they complain to these three Elders of these three Elders, and make the guilty both judge and party in their own cause. 2. Suppose of these three two be offenders, the grieved party must tell the third, and so one shall be the Church.  
Ans. This inconvenience follows clear from the hampering of all power of the Keys within one single congregation, in the midst of six congregations round about.  
2. The Book of Discipline of New England saith, A Church Independent may consist of four officers and three brethren, three brethren are offenders, if they cannot in this case tell the Elders only, for they are not the Church, Mat. 18. saith Mr. Hooker; Ergo, the three offending brethren must complain to the three offending brethren, and make themselves both Judge and party; therefore the Argument necessitates us to tell the Elders of associate Churches.  
Mr. H. Arg. 5. If the power of judgement be in Rulers, than 
Page 19●.  it is either in some or one, to wit, Peter, and to h●m derived from the rest, and that is Popery, or it is in them all equally; for those that are equal in commission, are equal in power, but that is not, for the teaching Elders are in degree and also in power superior to the ruling Elder.  
Ans. The issue of this Argument is to strip the officers naked of all power of Rule, and Mr. H. must take it away off his own way, as well as off ours.  
2. The teaching Elders are worthy of double honour above the ruling Elder, 1 Tim. 5. 17. for they speak to us the word of the Lord, Hebrews 13. 7. and are the Ambassadors of God, who in Christ's stead beseech us to be reconciled to God, 2 Cor. 5. 20. Their feet are pleasant, because of their message, and in this have power above ruling Elders, and those who serve Tables, Act. 6. and above the brethren and Church, as being sent of God with pastoral power, not only vi materiae, by virtue of their commands, but as in an Epistle is spoken judiciously to this purpose by Mr. Tho. Goodwin and Mr. Philip Nye, by reason of 
M. Tho Goodwin, Mr Phil. Nye, Epist. to the Reader prefixed to the treatise of the Keys.  their Ministerial Authority. Now how they can be equal in commission of judging to the people, is the question: for as the woman is independent in regard of intrinsecal power of consenting or dissenting in point of marriage, the Parent's directive power of commanding extrinsical, as the judicious Prefacers say, so the Fraternity is the only judging society by them. Yea, Mr. H. saith, The Elders are superior to the fraternity or brethren (I would he had said to the sisters also) in office, rule, 
Pastors & ruling Elders are equal as touching power juridical, but as touching the power pastoral of the Keys of knowledge, they are not equal, but the pastor is above the other  act and exercise, and in managing the censures, are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, overseers, by Hen. 13. 17. How are leaders and overseers in the same managing of censures, equal in power, and not above those whom they lead and oversee, yea, to whom they are to yield obedience, as Mr. H. citys to that purpose the place Heb. 13. 17. are Parents equal in power who do command the Virgin, whose it is to consent to the marriage?  
3. Let the godly Reader consider, whether the Brethren, though believers, yet ignorant of the mystery of Balaams' doctrine, and of jezobils teaching, Rev. 2. and of the learning and qualification of pastors, and of the deep and subtle Heresies for which pastors must be cast out, are by the Word of the Lord equal in judicial power, and trying of Doctors and Pastors, with the Rulers, whose office it is to know more of the mind of God, than Brethren? and whether are they by Divine Institution so?  
Mr. H. If Rulers alone have power to excommunicate by Mat. 
Pag. 198, 199.  18. than may three Elders excommunicate 400 or 500 brethren; and if so, Rulers should not only censure the fraternity, but destroy themselves: for where no flock is, but all are excommunicated, there are no shepherds. Besides, as Ames. saith, a body 
No Scripture for the judicial power of the male-Church, but Matth. 18. which is to M. H. a Church of redeemed men and women meeting in one place to partake of all the ordinances. M. Cott. Keys, c. 5. p. 22, 23. as Act. 19 9 Exo. 33. 7. Mar. 6. 11. Act. 13. 46. D. Ames. de consc. l. 4. qu. 29. 11. 10. 25.  cannot be cast out of itself.  
Ans. 1. Observe in all these six Arguments, there is not one jot of Scripture, but the one Magna Charta of Mat. 18. where yet Mr. H. will not stand to the signification of the word Church.  
2 They are not there alone to excommunicate the Church of believers, without the consent of the Church; and we judge it no way of Christ to excommunicate not 400 only, but six thousands, who all made one congregation of jerusalem, say our Brethren: But Mr. Cotton saith well in the case of the defection of a congregation to blasphemy and persecution, and no help by a Synod is to be hoped for, the Elders may withdraw, and separate disciples from them, and carry away the Ordinances with them, and denounce judgement against them.  
3. D. Ames. whose name is savoury in the Church of Christ, saith, But if a Church should be excommunicated, than a body having and retaining its essence, should be cast out of itself. No Judge can properly punish himself, but the Presbytery and Synod may declare a Synagogue of Satan to be a Synagogue of Satan.  
4. It is against the meekness of Christ, and not warranted by any Scriptures, that faithful pastors that are pastors to the universal Church should be unpastored, because this or that particular flock to which they were sent, leave off to be the flock of Christ, that is as much, as because they are faithful in his house, Christ will have them cast out of his house. The argument will conclude, That the Church excommunicating all the officers, destroyeth itself. Of this before also.   

CHAP. IU.  
Mr. Ruthurfurd's Arguments that prove that the People are not the first subject of the Keys, are vindicated from the unsatisfying Answers of Mr. Hooker.  
MR. H. That is not to be held, that is neither in Scripture 
Sect. 3, p. 199, 200.  directly, nor by consequence:  
But that belivers lay hands on men for the Ministry, or receive witness, or have in them any such power of Government, is such. So Mr. R. etc.  
Ans. The first three Arguments touch not the question, for office-power is formally in some select persons, who have a Ministerial spirit and gifts. Mr. Robinson saith, The Government before and under the Law, and in the Apostles time, and still now, is not in the multitude, but in some chief men: But it follows not because office-power, which is a little part of the power of the Keys, is in officers, therefore the power of the Keys is firstly in the officers, but firstly in them who gave both the power and the office, and therefore had a power before they gave it, and therefore can take it away.  
Ans. Mr. H. hath quickly expeded my Arguments with 
Due right of Presb. c. 1. sect. 2. p. 9, 10, 11, 12.  Veni, vidi, vici; It is a scorn to say, without all proof, that the office-power is a little part of the power of the Keys: For the includent by no Logic is a part of the thing included, the City is not a part of the House which is a part of the City; but the contrary: now the office-power in Rulers includes preaching, 
The office power is not a part, but the whole power of the keys.  administrating of the seals, as Mr. H. grants, and also it includes a power of binding and losing, and of ordaining, since the holy Ghost gives rules of right ordaining of Elders to Timothy, and to Teachers, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2, 3, & 10. 1 Tim. 5. 17, 18, 22. 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 5, 6, 7, etc. as to Pastors, not as to Believers, and by this to rebuke, censure, shall be no ruling at all, if Mr. H. deny ruling power to agree to Pastors as Pastors, or to be a part of office-power, because ruling power in officers is common to both officers and brethren.  
1. He begs what is in question, for the brethren are ruled and to obey, and not Rulers.  
2. If it be said ruling power is not office-power; it's replied that Mr. H. saith that the Elders are superior to the Brethren or male-Church in regard of office, rule, act and exercise. Now if ruling 
Page 191.  be common to both officers, and the Brethren, or such a male-Church of the redeemed; then are not the officers as officers superior to this Church in rule; yea, this Church giveth power, and taketh away the power of governing by way of censure, from the officers: and so the brethren in ruling must be above the Officers, as for the superiority official in preciding and managing the actual dispensing of censures, as Mr. H violently alleges Heb. 13. 17. to this purpose, it is a ruling over the ruling of the Brethren, the like whereof was never heard, the mouth of a Judicature ordereth, but judgeth not the ruling, and judging of the Judges. Again, if officers be both officers in teaching, administrating the seals, watching over the manners of the people, and also in dispensing censures with the Elders, then must office-power take up and include both official acts, and also judicial acts and power in governing; Ergo, the power of office is not a part of the power of the Keys, but the whole power of the Keys.  
2. It is not to the purpose, to say that Government is not in the multitude, as in the first subject; for then the multitude and 
The Church Mat. 18. binding & losing is not a church of selected persons, by our brethren's way.  Church of Redeemed, that meets in the same place, for all the ordinances is not the instituted Church, to which the offended must complain by Mat. 18. nor is it the first subject of the keys. Expound to us then Matth. T●ll the Church, i. e. tell some select persons, the Church of some males, only excluding women, aged children, servants: alas that is not the Church Mat. 18. nor the New England instituted Church, which is defined to us in the first words of their Book of Discipline; for that is not a Church of selected persons, but includes men, women, servants, children of age, as I demonstrate from their words. 
Way of the Churches of Christ in N. E. c. 1. pro sect. 1. p. 1, 2.   
1. The Church which Christ in his Gospel hath instituted, to which he hath committed the Keys of his Kingdom, the power of binding and losing, the tables and seals of the covenant, the officers and censures of his Church, the administration of all his public worship and ordinances, Is costus fidelium, a company of believers? These are their words. But I assume some select Brethren only is no Church.  
1. To whom Word and Sacraments only are due.  
2. Such only are not such a Church as the Church of Corinth, justified, sanctified.  
3. Such only is not the company that meets in the same place to partake of all ordinances, as they teach; for women, aged children, servants were justified, sanctified, partakers of ordinances, as well as select Brethren: Ergo, the visible Church instituted by Christ, is not the first subject of the power of the Keys, except you mean the virtual subject, than it is not the first formal subject, as fire is of heat, nor is the complete virtual subject.  
But Mr. H. saith cap. 11. sect. 2. page 192. The power of the Keys is committed to the Church of confederate believers, as the first and the proper subject thereof. Pro. 1. page 193. That the power of the Keys is seated in the Church as the proper subject is no novel opinion. ●b. We will suffer years to speak a little in this place, The place of those that Peter sustained in Mat. 16. to them the keys were given. But Peter speaks in the name and sustained the place of the Church: as the Ancients, Origen, Hillary, Augustine, frequently— troops of our Divines say.  
Ans. I pray our Brethren, do the Fathers mean the Church of visible Saints, the multitude of Believers? or go our Divines 
The church of believers built on the rock is not the formal first, and proper subject of the keys.  in troops along with them in the formal, first and proper subject of the Keys, as fire is the first formal subject of heat. As Mr. H. page 193. Now I judge Mr. H. means his own only instituted visible Church in the new Testament, that meets together in one place for the ordinances; if I should say the whole element of fire is the first proper and formal subject of heat, and yet exclude four quarters or parts of this body, as utterly uncapable of heat, were I worthy to be called a Philosopher? But the same way Mr. H. maketh the Church confessing as Peter, Mat. 16. such a formal subject, and saith the fourth part of this subject, women, children of age, etc. are not capable of the Keys; if it be said, the organical body is the proper subject of seeing, of hearing, etc. yet neither legs nor hands are capable of either seeing or hearing.  
I answer: Then 1. the organical body is not the first and formal subject of seeing, but Arms and Legs are capable of touching; but women, aged children, servants, though essential parts of the visibly confessing Church, Mat. 16. are formally capable of no power, of no exercise of the Keys at all.  
2. If God give the power of seeing to the eye, as to such a watching member, then gives he not the power of seeing to the organical body; but if God give the power of seeing to the eye, as to a member and part of the body: Ergo, he gives the power of seeing to all the members, Quod convenit, qua tale, convenit omnibus; Ergo, he must give the power of watchers to women who are members.  
Mr. H. Office-power is but a little part of the power of the Keys, and therefore it may be in Officers, and yet the power of the Keys not be firstly in them, but in them who gave Office-power.  
Ans. This is, as if one would say, the power of a Master-houshold and of a Steward, is a part and a little part of the power of the Keys of a family; when these only under the Lord of the house have the Keys committed to them, show in all Oeconomies in state, a family where the Keys are committed to any but to those in office, and such as are subject of the power of the Keys, a part and a little part of the power of the Keys, is not the Key, the nible of a Key is not the Key. Yes, but it may be said, the Queen and Mistress of the Royal Family is above the Officers of the Royal House, since they are her Servants, no less than the King's Servants.  
Ans. The officers are the believers servants objectively and finaliter, for the building of their souls, Eph. 4. 11. but the question now is, whether they be subjectively sent Potestate missionis, by ordination, and laying on of hands (the ceremony to 
How the officers are above the Church of Believers, and the Church of Believers above them.  me is Oeconomy not to be despised, but for the thing itself I contend) of Elders, or people, and in an official power of the Keys to shut or open Heaven, either by preaching, seals or discipline; there is not any above the officers, not the Church of believers in an authoritative way; as for a way of Christian dignity, believers are, without all doubt, above all the officers on earth. And when the Mistress is a society of sinners, that she hath the power of the Keys in any authoritative way, over herself, or any other way committed to her, but by a whole consent, or godly withdrawing when the Rulers turn Wolves, is against Scripture and all Reason.  
Mr. H. Not only the Officers, but Offices also are included in the Keys, as being of that ministerial power by which Heaven is opened and shut; and Officers and Offices are ordinances, and Christ's gift to the Church, Eph. 4. 11. He gave some to be Pastors, etc. As Mr. K. with Chrysostom acknowledge.  
Ans. To say the Officers and the Offices are included in the 
The offices & officers are with as little sense included in the keys, as if we would say, the King and the royal office are included in the royal power.  Keys, is to say ●eedless, that both the Stewards and the office of Steward included in the power of the Keys; or the King himself, and the royal office are included in the royal power: what sense or rather nonsense is here? It's true, the office and officers, Ephes. 4. 11, 12. are given to the Church of men, women, children, servants, to the multitude of redeemed, for the perfecting of the Saints, for edifying of the body of Christ, vers. 12. finaliter and objective, even till the coming of Christ; but Mr. H. must prove by that Text (I doubt if he can, or any for him) That Offices and Officers are given to the Church subjectively, that is, not to the multitude, but to some select persons, the male-Church of the Fraternity; that this new power may shuffle the power of the Keys from her, to some officers. But,  
1. Who gives our brother leave to leap from one signification 
There is no Church of only believing males wanting officers in Scripture.  of the Church Catholic of the visible Saints to the new male Church?  
2. From the gift given objectively for the Church, as clear it is in the Text, to the Church subjective of his own devising.  
3. Why contends Mr. H. for the accidents, or gifts, or privileges of nothing, or a non 〈◊〉, for in Old or New Testament he cannot give us a Redeemed Church of only believing males.  
Mr. R. The offices that include both the power of the Keys, and and the exercise of them are given, Mat. 16. to some select persons, to Peter.  
Ans. Therefore they must be given to some that are not officers, for how unpleasant is the sense to thee who bearest the place and person of an office, I will give an office, thou that hast an office, to thee will I give an office.  
Ans. This quirk (for an objection it is not worthy the light) is not against me, but against the Scripture, and Beza, Bullenger, Pareus, Calvin, and all the Fathers, who say there is promised to Peter who now was an Apostle confined, as yet to 
Beza 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, non dedit, sed dare promittit. Bull. non dicit dedi. Pareus promittit in futurum. How Christ gives to Peter the Keys, as representing the officers.  judea, the power of the Keys as an Apostle all the world over, and in him to all the officers. As when a Prince gives a confirmation of the office of Sheriff with larger privileges, than he had before. He saith, I give to thee who bearest the place and person of an Officer, and Magistrate, that same Magistracy with more ample privileges. And doth not Mr H. speak as unpleasantly? I create thee Peter, who wast a visible Saint before, now a visible Saint. Beside that he ties so the Apostles to be fixed members of one single congregation, which he knew their Apostolic office could never permit them with a good conscience to discharge.  
Mr. H. Arg. 4. This complete power of binding and losing is given 
Page 201.  to the officer: firstly, either as teaching, or as ruling in a special work or as officers ruling in general; if the first, than the power must be given to teachers only 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, as Mr. R. and so only Teacher, shall be Rulers. If this power be given to them as Rulers, in regard of the common or general nature of ruling, then is their equal power of ruling in both Teachers and Elders.  
Ans. The K●yes are given, Non uni divi●…, sed unitati conjuncti●●, 
Mr. H. with no better Logic may prove the General and Council of War, the Major and Aldermen are not the first formal subject of their respective powers, as Pastors & Elders cannot be the same formal subject of the Keys.  to all in the College of the Judicature. The ruling Elders vote, if according to the rule, is of as much weight as the teaching Elders vote; and it is not absurd, but necessary that all be alike here, except Mr. H. hold a sort of Episcopacy of Rulers over Rulers in the same Judicature. This conceit (for there is no solidity of reason here) might prove that the King and Parliament, the General and Council of War, the Major and the Aldermen are not the first subject formal (for of the virtual subject we speak not) of their respective military power, or civil State powers. Yea, the Pastor as a labourer in the Word and Doctrine, is in honour and power above the ruling Elder; the King and General acting severally, are above their general Counsels. A Child in Logic may answer such arguments.  
Mr. H. If the faithful may not lay on hands, nor receive witnesses, as Paul, Titus, Timothy, then are they not the first subject of the power of the Keys.  
Ans. The consequence is false, for ruling Elders cannot so lay on hands, nor so receive witnesses as teaching Elders do, yet they have the power of the Keys.  
Ans. The Argument is not mine, in that place. I neither call 
Paul's Presb. c. 1. p. 9, 10.  the organic Church the subject, nor the first subject; but only say, since the world was, the people are never Key-bearers, nor so called; the Presbytery lays on hands, 1 Tim. 4. 14. the Apostles, Act, 6. 6. Timothy a Pastor, 1 Tim 5. 22. for to bear the Keys is borrowed from a Steward, Oeconomus; as all agree, 
Because the brothers lay not hands on nor ordain Ministers at all, therefore they do not so lay on hands, and ordain as the officers do.  both Fathers and latter Divines. As to bind and lose is borrowed from such as command G●ols, as Pareus observeth, Ps. 105. 18, 20. 2 Kings 25. 27. Ps 149. 8. Act 12. 6. but no official power nor act of office, as of a Steward or Jailor is given to the people. And it is like much Logic I have here met with; the ruling Elders cannot so lay on hands, and so receive witnesses as the teaching Elders; Ergo, teaching and ruling Elders for all that may well be the first subject of the Keys; my meaning is, they lay not on hands so, that is, by any pastoral teaching power. But as for the people, they bear not the Keys at all over themselves, nor are they in any sort Stewards to feed themselves; and therefore they are no more the subject of the Keys then private servants of the house, to exercise the Keys authoritatively: the Ethiopian is not white at all, Ergo, he is not so white as a Raven.  
Mr. H. To whomsoever Christ giveth the Keys, to them he gives 
Page 401.  a ministerial spirit by way of special Embassage to remit or retain sin.  
Ans. This is unsound, for the Keys are given to ruling Elders, who have no such ministerial spirit; it is not enough to say, that power of preaching is not formally given to ruling Elders; yet it is effective given in the fruit to them, as Mr. R. saith: for they who receive the same commission, or equal power of the same commission, must receive the power of the keys formally.  
Ans. The Keys in a ministerial way of special Embassage, to remit and retain sins, are given to teachers by a concional way of remitting and retaining sins, and to both teachers and ruling Elders effectually (saith Mr. R,) in the judicial and authoritative 
Paul's Presb. c. 1. p. 9, 10. The ministerial spirit of forgiving and retaining sins in the external Court, though not in a concional way, is due to the ruling, as to the teaching Elder.  application in the external Court of Christ's Church: but believers as believers, and as visible Saints confederate, have no such power judicial formally, or effectively. Let Mr. H. prove this, and it shall be seen there it sticks, hic haeret ei aqua: nor is it denied, but ruling Elders have the same power of the Keys formally, as touching the judicial application of the word preached in the external Court: For the whole Court, Teachers and Elders, do formally, in a judicial way, apply to the conscience of the incestuous Corinthian his sin, thus; Thou by name hast committed incest, we, by the formal power and ministerial spirit given to us by Christ, deliver thee to Satan, etc. All have alike formal and effective, and so causal influence in this sentence. 2. I also thus frame the Argument:  
To whatsoever society Christ hath given the Keys, to some of that society he hath given the spirit to remit and to retain sin by way of concional preaching the Gospel, john 20. 21, 22. Matth. 28. 20. Mark 16. 15, 16. for there is a binding and losing chiefly in the preached Word, and to all of them he hath given a formal power of binding and losing in the Court of Christ, conjoined with the former binding, and not to be separated from it. Give us in the word Excommunication separated from the preaching of the Word. But Christ hath given no power judicial of this kind to excommunicate all the officers, to ordain all the officers, to the society of brethren destitute of Pastors. And give us leave to keep this ground of vantage, we can produce Scripture for this practice, that the Elders laid on hands, and ordained Elders, Act. 6. 6. 1 Tim. 4. 14. & 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 5. Let our Brethren show, where the male-Church of only unofficed brethren did the like, and give precept or promise, and we are silent.  
We may justly ask, By what power unofficed men may make 
The male-Churches ordaining wanteth an institution of Christ. Pag. 202. Paul's Presbyt. c. 1. p. 10.  officers; there must be an institution for this, and its hard to prove positive institutions by far off consequences.  
Mr. H. Ruling Elders do not effectually (he should say effectively, as I do, which is a far other term) apply the word in the external Court: why? because the application of the word thus dispensed, implies that it is issued and ended.  
Ans. If the meaning be, the Sermon is closed and done, and 
It's childish to say, because a Sermon is closed before the censure be dispensed, therefore there is no application of the word made to the conscience of delinquents in excommunication.  the incestuous man reputes not, therefore all place for judicial application of the Word to the conscience of the scandalous man in the Court of Discipline, is ended: How weak and watery is such a consequence? except we say that the whole Court of Teachers and Elders do not apply medicinally to the man in the external Court the Word preached; which to say, were to destroy all Church-discipline.  
Mr. H. There is a judicial power in making application of the word preached by any of the members who have power to admonish judicially.  
Ans. That is to beg the question: for none have power to admonish judicially as the Church, but the officers, and those that are stewards, who bear the Keys; otherwise women have power to apply the Word, and to rebuke, and to exhort.  
2. This contradicts the former just now spoken. The Elders cannot effectively apply in the Court the Word preached; why? the Word dispensed and preached is ended: But here every member may judicially apply out of the Court, though the Word dispensed be ended.  
Mr. H. Mr. R. Arg. 4. The government of the Church is complete in officers, their number, their dispensed censures of binding and losing without any power of the keys in the people, and therefore it is superfluous; yea, if the believers have power there alone to excommunicate all the officers, as Mr. H. saith, the Elders in governing must be as superfluous as the sixth finger in the hand. Ans. Though the people have power of judging, yet they have not power of office, which is necessary.  
Ans. Power of office is necessary to the preaching of the 
Officers are superfluous in dispensing censure, by M. H. his way.  Word, and to the administrating of the Seals, of which we now speak not. I hope Mr. H. questions not the necessity of a standing Ministry to the end; but since officers are created, and all the officers may be excommunicated by the only brethren, as Mr H. saith, contrary to Mr. Cotton and the Word (now ordaining of pastors, and excommunicating of them are the highest acts of Rule) than the Elders are as superfluous as the sixth finger to the hand, in the highest point of Ruling, and officers must be only necessary ad bene ess●, for the better directing and managing of censures, as Mr. H. saith, only for authoritative ordering and counselling; as Mr. Goodwin and Mr. Nye: But they may be wanting, and censures well administered without officers.  
M. H. Mr. R. Arg. 5. The multitude of believers must have this power either from heaven or from men; if from heaven, either from the Law of Nature, or a positive Law of God.  
Ans. There is a positive Institution, Mat. 18. Mat. 16. Mr. R. saith, God hath not made all Rulers, and have left none over other in the Lord. Ans. To have the power of the Keys is one thing, and to be Rulers another. The Court of Aldermen can proceed against a delinquent Major, yet not one of them is Major. The members by covenant, not as officers and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, censure one another, though in the manner of dispensing the censure, they need of ficers as guides. And so the seven●h is answered.  
Ans. Mr. H. grapples with my Arguments by two's, but answers them all with a begging of the Conclusion. It's good that these two only places, which are sometimes expounded of the 
Way of the Churches, c. 1. sect. 1. prop. 1. p. 1, 2. Survey, ch. 10. arg. 5. p. 133.  Church of believers meeting in one place for the Ordinances, and that includes all Saints visible male and female, as your Discipline; sometimes Mr. H. expounds Matth. 18. the Church, firstly, as it is an integral body of both people and Elders; and 3. Mr. H. takes it for the Church of the Redeemed, and offends that Mr. Rall and Mr. R. takes Mat. 18. for the governing 
Survey, ch. 11. par. 1. p. 186. Mr. H. takes the word Church in the Magna Charta, Matth. 18. & 16. sometimes for visible Saints, male and female. 2. Sometimes for the Church of Elders. And 3. here, for the male-Church without officers and women, and other visible Saints.  Church. Now 4. here the Magna Charta of the word Church from Mat. 18. & 16. must not only he the male-Church of selected brethren; so doth the sick man love to change his bed. Now Ted the Church, must be, Tell the male-Church, Mat. 18. which is built on a Rock, against which the gates of Hell shall not prevail; as if there were no fixedness on the Rock for women, aged children, and believing servants, but they must all turn Apostates, and only the male-Church, Mat. 16. persevere in grace, and dwell finally upon the Rock.  
2. To have the Keys, and to be Rulers, are so one thing to us, as twice three and six are one thing. And it's a wide mockery to say, that members covenanting are to submit to one another; and, in a Churchway, judge one another, by rebuking, 
Members judge and censure, & excommunicate one another, and yet they bear not rule over one another, as M. H.  exhorting and gaining one another, and yet are not made rulers and key-bearers to one another; that is, they exercise the keys and power of ruling over one another, and yet they rule not one another 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, this is to distinguish between Isaac and the son of Abraham. 2. Do not women covenant to gain the younger women in their way, by rebuking, by Mat. 18. 15. Lov. 19 17. 1 Sam. 25. 25, 26, 27. Tit. 2. 3, 4. both men and women? and do they for that rule, as the male-Church? and by what Oracle? am I not to rebuke a trespassing offender of another congregation dwelling within twenty cubits to my door, and being my beloved brother in Christ? are not the brethren 
If all be rulers mutually one to another, as M. H. must say that word, obey them that are over you in the Lord, must be spoken only to women and children.  both rulers and ruled, both the stewards using the Keys, and members of the house, both shepherds and flock; and what sense can that have? Obey them that are over you in the Lord, etc. 2 Thess. 5. 12. Heb. 13. 17. except it be a speech to only women, and children, and servants, whereas he wrices to all, and directs such exhortations to all, except to officers, in the judgement of all Divines whoever before our brethren so expounded Scripture; yea, he should have said, Obey one another, for ye are all over one another in the Lord.  
3. The comparison of Major and Aldermen halts, except Mr. H. say, the Citizens have power of ruling authoritatively over, and to depose from office both Major and Aldermen, if delinquents.  
Mr. H. There is a peculiar office-power in the officers that is not in the flock.  
Ans. In order to preaching there is, but in order to juridical ruling there is none at all; and so the eighth Argument stands untouched.  
Mr. H. The 6 and 11 Arg. of Mr. R. If the power of the Keys be given to believers as believers under that reduplication, than all believing men and women and children have authority over the congregation, for à quatenus ad omne valet consequentia, and all should be pastors.  
Ans. It's strange that Mr. R. so often acknowledges, that we require only charitable Saintship in members, yet he frequently supposeth that we require sincerity: 2. The believers as believers scattered, are not the first subject, but as covenanting and fitly capable, and counted so; which women are not.  
Ans. To this I before answered: Nor is it strange that I should charge real contradictions, which by good consequence follow, upon my Adversaries repugnant principles.  
2. The question is now, What is the first subject of the power of the Keys? but whether the place Mat. 18. proves (as Mr. H. saith) that the first subject is not believers as believers, but believers with three limitations. 1. As visible to judicious charity. 2. As covenanting Church-wise. 3. As capable to Rule, excluding women and children: but all the three are forgedly added to the Text, Mat. 16. The first is added; for Peter in this confession represents not Saints as visibly to men's account, but real Saints. For,  
1. Christ pronounces Peter, and all that confess truly and 
Peter was not visibly blessed, as Magus, Mat. 16. nor did he represent hypocrites like judas, who are M. H. his saints and make the same confession  really (though visibly, for these are not here supposed) Christ to be the Son of the living God, really and truly blessed, as Peter, whose heart the Lord saw. But Peter is not blessed, nor all whom he represents blessed, by Mr. H. his way, and by his wresting of the Text only in a visible way, as judas, who might give the same confession with other rotten hypocrites, and not be blessed, but cursed.  
2. All who give this confession, as Peter, have received the Spirit of revelation from the Father, wh●ch is neither visible nor audible, but is as the hidden Manna, known to the man himself, and to God only.  
3. All that so confessed, are really upon the matter differenced from all the false Religions and Sects, of which, some said Christ was john Baptist; some, that he was Elias, etc. as is clear otherways, if Christ speak of a visible confession, which Magus and other Church members like him may give; the so confessors were no more blessed, than the wretched Herodians, who said Christ was john the Baptist risen from the dead, and denied him to be the Son of the living God.  
4. The so visible confessors are the Church, whom Christ builds on the Rock, that shall prevail against all temptations of Hell, and be saved, but such are the really and eternally saved only, not the so built on the Rock, as judas and Magus were, and therefore that is but sand, not a rock, which is given to believers in charity combined, and who are counted fit by Christ and capable, which women, children, deaf and dumb are not. So Mr. H. doth make the Text or our Saviour say, I charitably judge Peter, and Judas, and Magus are blessed, are built upon the Rock.  
2. The other two limitations are as blasphemous, and contrary 
M. H. deprives all women & believing children of age of all comfort from confessing Christ as Peter did, and of being built on the Rock, because they are not capable of the Keys.  to the scope of the Text: for our Saviour's scope is to furnish solid consolations of sound faith not to Peter only, not to seeming believers only, not to Church-members only as such, but to all persons who renounce false Religions, such as Heredians were, and others, v. 13, 14. men and women, Marry Magdalen and others, who by this very Scripture do really, and with the reality of saving faith, from the Spirit of the Father of Christ, confess Jesus to be the living God, as v. 17, 18. And I appeal to the consciences of our brethren (I say not any thing to those that are asleep in the Lord) whether Magdalen and others should in sincerity confess, that Christ is the Son of the living God, and had received the anointing, and had received no Keys, no visible membership like to what they say, may not as well claim to this place and blessedness as Peter. And if Christ should answer them, Ye women, who by the Spirit of the Father of Christ confess me to be the Son of the living God, and for that suffer death from Herod and other persecutors, are blessed; but ye have no right to real blessing by Mat. 16. 15, 16, 17, etc. for I count you women not capable of the Keys. O what perverting 
Mr. H. gives to none the benefit of the faith, joy of believing, peace, con solation in the like confession of Peter, Mat. 16. but only in & through visible membership of a single congregation, which is as due to Magus the forcerer, as to all real believers. Pag. 104.  of the Word of God is this! Surely Mr. Smith in his Parallels hath more reason for him to prove that women share of the honour of the Keys as well as men, from Mat 18. and Mat 16. But of this hereafter. Show me a place in all the Scripture where Christ saith, I give the Keys to the Church of Redeemed ones. 2. Show me where in Scripture the blessing of real and sincere confession of Christ from the teaching Spirit of revelation, and anointing, is hampered and confined to male-believers, and to male-believers only, members by marriage-covenant of one single congregation. Sure the brethren fail here, as the Popists, who retrench it to the only Church of their Pope and Clergy.  
Mr. H. The rule of Mr. R. faileth much against the fundamentals of Logic, quod convenit 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, convenit 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, yet visible Saints and believers accounted according to the rules of charity, are the subject matter of the Church, and therefore though they be justly excommunicated, yet in God's account they may be inwardly Saints. And again, close hypocrites, as Judas, may be real unbelievers, and therefore the profession is sufficient to keep such in their office, and to evidence that all their actions Ministerial are valid.  
Ans. As Mr. R. hath, following Aristotle, expounded 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, that which agrees as the ultimate specific form, or as a 
A contraction in M. H. his first and proper & formal subject of the Keys.  proper passion, agrees to the subject reciprocally; as rationale 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, resibile, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 homini, See the medi 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 above expounded: But make fundamental or superstructure Logic of these two, except the Logic of contradiction, and I am silent. Mr. H. Survey, cap. 11. pro. 2. p. 194. Subordinate power (of the Keys) only such, and all such have, (a perfect reciprocation) who are combined in a special corporation, and come under the external Government of the Sceptre of Christ in the Gospel. If women, servants, aged children be excluded, they being combined in a special corporation, and under the extern l Government of the Sceptre of Christ, judge, Reader; and yet believers as believers (saith Mr. H. Survey, cap. 11. pag. 203, 204.) are not the first subject of the Keys, but believers, as 1. Combined by Church-covenant: 2. As counted in charity believers: 3. And counted capable men, not women. Any man remove that contradiction.  
3. I ask, If profession be enough (according to our brethren's way) to evidence the ministerial actions, Baptising, etc. for example, of judas, to be valid, why saith not Mr. H. profession is 
Mr. H. must hide something under that, That profession is enough to evidence the ministerial actions of Judas and such to be valid.  enough to render their ministerial actions to be valid, but only to evidence that they are valid? If profession do only evidence them to be valid, they may be, in se, in themselves null and invalid. What is under this, I know not: If Mr. H. his sense be, that judas was blessed, and had a Spirit of revelation to teach him to give Peter's confession, and upon this account of a profession though rotten, yea to Christ's charity apparently fair, yet Christ for his seeming confession gave the Keys to Peter as to judas. If Mr. H. would cause the Text speak this, Mat. 16. he should gain much upon me: But no wit of men, but our brethren's, shall throw this out of the Text. What a poor comfort is it, this profession keeps Peter in office? yea, it makes him blessed above men.   

CHAP. V.  
The rest of Mr. R. his Arguments proving that the Male-Church of only unofficed Brethren have no power of the Keys, are delivered from the unsatisfying Replies of Mr. T. H.  
MR. H. The 9 Arg. of Mr. R. If Christ give the Keys to believers, he gives answerable gifts to them. Ans. Such as 
Pag. 204. 205.  have received the anointing, can discern the voice of Christ and follow him, are able to choose to themselves Pastors, as being able to relish the savour of spiritual administrations, and to feel what key will best open their lock, can see and discern what courses be sinful and scandalous, persons obstinate and pertinacious therein, therefore they may choose and reject officers— They need not the tongue of the learned, they are reproved for careless watching, in not purging out the incestuous man, 1 Cor. 5. 2, 3.  
Ans. 1. My Argument is mangled. And whereas I, with the Word, say, If the male-Church be Rulers, Watchmen, the only men appointed to rule, make and unmake officers, I demand. 
The Epistles to Timothy and to Titus must, by Mr. H. h●s way, be written to unofficed brethren, the males only of a congregation.  If the Epistles to Timothy and Titus be Canons to the brethren of the male-Church that they must rule well, 1 Tim. 5. 17. rule their own house well, be apt to ●each, 1 Tim. 3.  
2. Whether unofficed brethren must be such Rulers as are to commit the Word to faithful men, able to teach others.  
3. Whether the endowments that are required in Bishops, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2. Tit. 1 5, 6, 7, 8.  
4. Whether the count that Watchmen, who must stand and feed, and not sleep, nor let the flock perish, Ezek. 3. Chap. 34. Isaiah 56. Zech. 11. lie upon unofficed brethren?  
5. Whether the crime of usurping be theirs, and not the Prophets, jerem. 23. and yet they are the only feeders, rulers, Judges of all to the highest censure of Excommunication. But all the qualifications that Mr. H. gives to the male unofficed Judges are saving grace of anointing, 1 joh. 2. 20. 27. which woman, who have Christ for their Advocate as well as men, 1 joh. 2. 1, 2. the discerning of the voice of Christ, and following him, which all the sheep and Elect of God have, joh. 10. 27, 28. except women, aged children, servants, be excluded out of the number of the sheep of Christ, this is a turning of the Gospel upside down, to Popishly confine all the Privileges of Saints, the anointing the spiritual discerning 
The spiritual qualifications for calling of Ministers, as Mr. H. describeth them, as being able to relish the savour of spiritual administrations, to discern & know the voice of Christ & follow him, etc. are given to women and to all.  what key will open the heart, to some few male-believers: 1. Aged; 2. Incorporate, so and so. But I retort it thus: To whom Christ hath given the only qualifications spiritual of Rulers endued with power of judging, those hath he called according to the rule of the Gospel to be such Rulers, and they must dig their Lords talents in the earth, if they improve them not for that end. But the Lord hath given to all Believers as Believers of the same or of another flock, whether in Churches this way, or not, to women, as to males, in some measure, the anointing grace to know Christ's voice. Ergo.  
2. Let it be observed, that the tongue of the learned, Esay 50. of which Mr. R. spoke, to absolve and open heaven to a man swallowed up with grief, and a gift of a son of thunder, to shut the gates of heaven against the obstinate, and such as are to be delivered to Satan, are not required in the exercise of the keys of the Kingdom, but only such gifts as are in women; is this a good frame of Church discipline?  
Mr. H. God gives to men no calling to a place, but he gives 
Pag. 205.  rules how they are to order and direct themselves in it. But the Word hath no Canons how the people should order the Keys.  
Answ. Matth. 18. 15. If thy brother, etc. The Lord points his finger to the Fescue, and says, Build up one another in the most holy faith, 1 Thess. 5. 11, 12, 13. 2 Thess. 3. 14. Heb 13. 17. Rom. 16. 17. Observe those that cause dissensions among you, etc.  
Ans. My Argument is mistaken. If there be Rules in the 
The argument of Mr. R. that there be no rules in the Word how the male-Church should rule & judge, Ergo, there is no such judging Church, stands unanswered. Mr. H. his way overturns the Ministry.  Word how Officers should acquit themselves, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2, etc. how Judges, Kings, etc. so ought there to be Rules how unofficed brethren, the only Judges, (for Church-officers do but order and regulate judging, as our Brethren say) should behave themselves. But this is not by our brethren's way.  
2. The Reader may observe all along, that Mr. H. and his way lays the Axe to the root of the Ministry; for he ascribeth the Church acts of office, of opening and shutting heaven, of the learned Tongue, of Excommunicating, etc. to unofficed men; or then he denies that there is any necessity of such in judging, and ascribes such acts and qualifications as are in women, to their judging Church; the very way of Anabaptists and rigid Separatists.  
3. Mat. 18. 15. shall make every Church-member, brother 
See Mr. john Collins his vindic. Minist. Evangel. an. 1651. the question accurately and clearly discussed. The Pulpit guarded with 20 Arg. an. 1652. A Plea for the use of Gospel-Ordinances, by Hen: Laurence against Mr. del, 1652. p. 44, 45. Vindication of Presbyt. Governm. and Ministry, by the Ministers of the Province of London, an. 1649. M Gillespy Miscel. q. 1. p. 1, 2, 3. etc. Vindic. Minist. Evang. by the Ministers of London. The Ius Divinum of Presbyt. c. 11. p. 180.  or sister, who are to gain by admonishing one another, a Church-Judge, to exercise the Keys one over another. I thought the power had been given, not uni sed unitati, to brethren in the Judicature, not to stones scattered.  
The edifying one of another, and comforting one another, and withdrawing from dividers, are acts of love required of men, women, and of Christians of all ranks, and by no word tied to those of the same single congregation, but to all the Catholic Church; should not women withdraw from dividers? and therefore these places, 1 Thess. 5. 11. 2 Thess. 3. Rom. 16. are abused.  
4. Ambrose, Theophylact, Oecumenius, Paraphrastes, Beza, Calvin, Marlorat, nor any Interpreter dreamt the place Heb. 13. 17. was meant of unofficed brethren, who watch and must 
Ch. 11. p. 191. M. H. his way destroys the ministry of the N. Testament.  give an account for souls: yea, Mr. H. expounds it of officers, and yet he citys Heb. 13. 17. Obey them that are over you in the Lord, i. e. Brethren of the male-Church obey brethren.  
Mr. H The prwer of the Keys is larger than the power of office, and therefore the Lord requires not so much abilities in the brethren as in the Officers.  
Ans. The difference is said, not proved.  
2. If God require the highest abilities in officers to the laying 
Mr. H. denies that the highest abilities that are required in the Epistles to Timothy & Titus, are required to be in such as open and shut Heaven by the Keys. Page 206.  on of hands, 1 Tim. 5. 22. to the highest censurer, 1 Tim. 19 20, 21. compared with 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2, etc. 1 Tim. 3. 6. 7, etc. then he must require these same far more in brethren, the first and proper subject of all power, or then the Lord calls them to highest actings, and promises to them no gift to, or for these highest actings, such as delivering to Satan, cutting off of members.  
Mr. H. The Keys are given to Peter, as representing Church guides, Matth. 16. not excluding the consent of the people.  
Ans. We so give the power radically and firstly to the Church of Believers, as by them we communicate office power to the Elders, though they be not the first subject.  
Ans. Such a shifting of office-power from the Church of believers, which yet is but the third part of the redeemed single Church to Elders, if Christ teach, Matth. 16. or elsewhere, we rest.  
Mr. H. If the Keys be given to the Church, the house of wisdom, 
Page 207. Due Right. l. 2. c. 9  Prov. 9 1. of God, 1 Tim. 3. 15. Heb. 3. 4. builded by Pastors, Teachers, Ephes. 4. 11, than not the Church of Believers without Pastors. Mr. H. the assumption fails, for a Church without Pastors is wisdom's house, as we proved, and is Act. 14. 23.  
Ans. Mr. H. answers nothing to the places, Pro. 9 wisdom 
The ninth argument of M. R. stands unanswered, the Apostles made the Church a politic church by framing organs official in it.  hath maids and a table; the house in which Timothy was to walk, was built by officers, Act. 20. 28. 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2, 3. 1 Tim. 5 17, Give us a pattern of your homogeneal Church, for clear it is the Church Act. 14. 23. was the Church of believers, no politic ministerial Church until Paul and Barnabas with the free election of the people, made them a politic Church: so until Titus ordained Elders, the Churches of Crect, bear the name of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Cities, and though these Cities were Churches, yet could they exercise no politic actions, nor frame Organs official to themselves, until the first founder made them politic ministerial Churches. Otherwise, as Paul and Barnabas exhorted them to continue in the faith, so they should have commanded them to use that radical power, to create officers and not have encroached upon their power of the Keys.  
Mr. H. Paul charging the Elders to feed the Flock, or the Church, Acts 20. implieth there is a Church distinct from feeders.  
Ans. No doubt, there is a flock of redeemed and fed ones of men, women, children, 1 Pet. 4. 2. jam. 2. 2. Act. 15. 35. that were of late Catechised, Gal. 6. 56. different from watchmen, 
The feeders & the fed church are different, but this fed church is not the ruling and judging church.  but Paul bids the feeders censure the grievous Wolves, v. 29, 30. but he bids not the fed Church do it, far less implies he, that the third part of the redeemed was the male-Church, and did, or could exercise discipline over both officers, and women, servants, and children. Let us see that employed.  
Mr. H. If they want Officers (saith Mr. R.) they want the power of edifying.  
Ans. They want the power of edifying, as an organic body, but it hath power to ed●fie itself, as totum essentiale.  
Ans. Christian edifying one of another in divers congregations, 1 Thes. 5. 12. Col. 3. 16. Heb. 3. 13. by women and children of age we deny not, but a Church edifying without Pastors, or a perfecting of the body without officers, Eph. 4. 11, 12. 1 Cor. 12. 12, 13, & 28. 1 Cor. 14. 4, 12. we find not. (2) Your male-Church edifying without Pastors, must also edify as an organical body. In it women and children be silent, and some unofficed 
Mr. H. gives to unofficed men what is peculiar to Pastors.  brother teach, pray, and preside in the creating of officers, and do the like, when the Officers turn grievous Wolves, and are to be cast out, for then some unofficed brother must be Mouth and Organ to the rest, and that is the very charge that Peter sustained in pastoral preaching, at the creating of an officer, and the Apostle Mathias, Act. 1. 15.  
Mr. H. Let Mr. R. tell how God set teachers in the Church, if teachers be before the Church.  
Ans. Let Mr. H. tell how God giveth breath to them that walk on the Earth, Isa. 42. 5. Was there breath before there was a living 
The Church is no politic Church before they have officers.  man walking on the earth, or was there a living man walking on the earth, before there was breathing? Teachers are before Converts, as Fathers are before Children. john Baptist and the Apostles were before such as they converted to the faith and baptised. Noah before the Vineyard, which he dressed, God planted Apostles and Teachers, even in the organical politic Church, before it was a politic organical Church; for by setting Organs in the body, he made it an organical body; but it is a senseless inference, Ergo, these Organs, who are both Organs and Fathers, and causes procreant of the Church, had no being before the politic Church had being; for natural organs in a physical body are only organs, but not causes of the natural body, but politic organs may be both, and in this case are both.  
Mr. H. To these are the Keys promised, who are Stewards of the mysteries of God, 1 Cor. 4. 1. servants of his house, 2 Cor. 4. 5.  
Ans. The Servants are Pastors and Teachers in these places, than the ruling Elder shall bear no Key.  
Ans. Yet the conclusion is strong against the unofficed bearers.  
Mr. Cotton & the New England Discipline and Paul are herein 
Way of the Church of N. E. c. 2. sect. 2. p. 13, 14, 15. & p. 36.  as much crossed as I am; for to them the ruling Elders are Stewards applying in censures in the external Court of Christ, the Word, as the Teachers apply it concionally. Mr. Cotton makes the ruling Elders to be included with the Teachers of Ephesus, Act. 20. And by the Argument Mr. H. may deny office-power of overseeing the house, to all, but to such as labour in the Word and Doctrine.  
Mr. H. The places, Isa. 9 6. Revel. 3. 7. speak of Monarchical power in Christ only, and prove not the point of delegated power.  
Ans. Nor did I bring them for any other end, but to prove 
Mr. H. denies the signification of the Keys given to all officers contrary to all the learned read, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Isa. 14. 17. Isa. 50. 5. Isa. 26. 2. Isa. ●2. 2●.  that the Keys whoever bear them, Head or Servants, do signify a power of office, steward, Oeconomus, Commander of the Castle, and so are never given to unofficed brethren, for which cause I brought Fathers, Doctors, Divines, Protestants, Learned Papists, saying the same. And Mr. H. passes them all without an answer. So the Learned Pag●in, Mercerus, Shiml●rus, Buxtorf. Ark of Noah, Mr. Leigh, and all Dictionaries expound the word, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, when given to House, Prison, Gaol, Kingdom; and Stephanus, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, and Mr. H. dictates against the authority of all the Learned Interpreters and Linguists, and tells us beside an office power, it noteth, Matth. 16. a judicial power of the spouse and wife to admit unto, or reject out, in the family as cause requires. But 1. one word of Scripture he gives not. 2. Nor 
Page 209.  saith Christ, Matth. 16. any such thing, as he gives the Keys to the Church upon the Rock, as the formal subject, though it may be gathered, he gives them for that Church as the object and final cause.  
Mr. H. To these Mat. 16. doth Christ give the Keys, to whom be giveth warrant and official authority, for actual exercising of opening and shutting; but this he giveth to Peter, as representing Teacher's and Elders: to thee will I give, etc. whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth, etc. So Mr. R.  
Ans. All may be granted, and the official authority may be formally in the officers, and originally and virtually in the Church.  
2. The proposition is fall●, to wit, to them the power of the Keys is given, firstly, to whom warrant and official authority is given for the exercise of the same Keys; for the power of the Keys is larger than office-power.  
Ans. 1. My Argument is yet wronged, to the same person 
Mr. H. wrongs this argument of mine, for by Mat. 16. both the power actu primo, and the exercise of binding and losing actu secundo is given to Peter; Ergo, these two cannot be given to all believers as believers. The keys cannot be given to Peter, as representing believers, & also as representing the guides.  to whom he promiseth the power, or keys, or the power in its essence, actu primo, to the same person he promiseth shall exercise the specific acts of the power and the second acts, that must be the first formal subject to which God promises a ●…sonable soul, and the second and specific acts of discoursing, and that must be essentially a man: Now unofficed brethren are not Ambassadors, but they are only these, to whom the Ambassadors and officers are sent.  
2. By Mr. H. the ●eyes must in their official power begiven to Peter, as representing the Guides, ●nd also the power of the Keys, in the power of ruling must be given to Peter, as to the first subject representing believers: If the Text speak this, it is a new conceit, that never an Interpreter dreamt of, and it must be made out, that Peter i● spoken of in the Text, in that twofold relation; but that Peter's binding and losing on earth are acts of office, or at least include acts of office, and acts both of concional and also juridical remitting and retaining of sin, and who despiseth Peter and the officers in either, despiseth Christ and him that sent him, is clear, and that remitting and retaining sins is a binding and losing, cannot be denied, and that remitting 
Binding and loo●… flows from th● Lords calling to an office, joh. 10. 21 22. So Cyprian as is cited before.  and retaining of sin flows from Christ calling the Disciples to an office, is as clear, john 20. 21. As my Father Apostled me, so send I you, receive the Holy Ghost, whose sins ye pardon, they are pardoned, etc. And that this is a clear commission to Peter and all officers in him to exercise an official power of binding and losing, is apparent by this Text, if by any in the New Testament. But Mr. H. against this clear Text saith, here Pastors have good warrant for their office power, because the Church hath received power to admit, choose and refuse officers, etc. But because Mr. R said they have clear commission for the Keys, both in power, v. 19 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, and in the acts and exercises, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, and what thou shalt bind on earth, shall be bound in heaven; But, though the place be clear, and all Interpreters teach it, yet will not Mr H. grant that by Mat. 16. 〈◊〉 Peter and other Church-officers, Christ gives both the power of the Keys, or the Keys and the exercise of the power, v. 10. I will give to thee the Keys— and whomsoever thou shalt bind, etc. And if Mr. H. say not this, he shall be forced to say that these, to wit, the power of the Keys, and actual exercise of the Keys, which are clearly holden forth, v. 19 are given to Peter, so confessing Christ, that is, as he represents all believers so confessing Christ. And so all such must have both the Keys and the formal exercise of pastoral binding; for that pastoral binding is given to Peter, v. 19 and brethren and women so confessing, must pastorally bind, v. 19 Then how can an official power be given to Peter, as he represents this male-Church upon a mere allegiance? As to the place, Matth. 28. 19 it abundantly 
The place Mat. 16. must warrant all officers to their official calling and to the acts thereof, to wit, of binding & losing by way of preaching.  warrants the Disciples to an office-power. But the question yet remains, whether this place, Matth. 16. especially doth not warrant more clearly, Pastors as Pastors to both the power and exercise of the power of the Keys: And by this, To thee will I give the Keys, must yet have this sense, I will give the Keys to thee Peter, as representing both the Pastors and Believers of the male Professors only. Yet Peter gave not that blessed confession as an Apostle, but as a Believer enlightened by the spirit of the Father abo●e flesh and blood; nor was Peter as an Apostle builded upon the Rock, and above the prevailing temptations of Satan and Hell, except we hold from this place, the Pope's infallibility; but it is good that it is granted, that by this place, the Keys must be given to Peter, as representing the officers also: for here (saith Mr. H.) Pastor's may have good warrant for their office power. Then is the thing we contend for 
Mr. H. grants that by Matth. 16. the Keys are given to Peter, as representing the officers also.  granted, if M. H. would prove the other, that here the male Church excluding women hath good warrant, as the first and proper subject to challenge the power and exercise of the Keys here spoken of, Matth. 16. he had indeed performed a great point. But this remains that the Reader is left in the mist what to make of our brethren's way by these words, upon this Rock will I build my Church, and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it. Nor is it fair arguing to flee to the old Testament, saith judicious Mr. Firmin, because the Children of Israel, Numb. 8. 10. laid 
Firmin, Separation examined. p. 70, 71. The Children of Israel's laying on of hands, Nam. 8. what it was, that it is no shadow for the male-Church to ordain officers of the New Testament.  hands upon the Levites: for what if one say, Moses the Magistrate laid on hands?  
2. If it be a good warrant where officers are, as in the place were Aaron's sons, yet the people only, and not the Presbytery, though there be a sufficient one, must lay on hands.  
3. Aanon, as Mr. Firmin noteth, verse 14. completed the ordination; for he did wave those Levites before the Lord. 2. How is it proved that Moses gathered the whole people, Numb. 8. 10. Thou shalt gather the whole assembly, the whole Church: and they shall offer them in sacrifice (saith Vatablus) and by that 
Aria. Mont. Coetum. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Vatablus, offeret Levitas in oblationem Domino. Menoch. Ut hac manuum impositione testentur se Levitas contribules suos à se abdicare, & Deo quasi munus & sacrificium offer, in ejus dominium & ministerium transfer. junius Numb. 8. approbante Ecclesia. Cyril. Alexand. Cyprian. Epist. 24. 33. 68 De divina ordinatione descendit, ut sacerdos plebe praesente ordinaretur. Tertul. Apolog. c. 39 Leo Mag. Epist. 87.  (saith Menochius) who collects from R. Stephanus, Vatablus, and others) they did not author it atively ordain the Levites, but gave over to the Lord and his service, the Levites, Deut. 31. 20. Gather to me all the Elders, v. 30. and Moses spoke into the ears of the Congregation. Rehal, junius, Di●dati, English Divines, they consented to the call of the Levites. Cyrillus, Alexandrinus, and Cyprian, Tertullian, as Leo Magnus also say, the people choosed, or the Levites were called, they being then present. So Beda, 
Quidam ex populo manus imponebant. junius. Piscator. Pareus. Cajetan. Lorinus. Principes Tribuum pro populo. Lyran. Numb. 8. Ponent manus] quia assensum devotionis electioni debent praebere.  Lyranus, junius, Piscator, Ainsworth, say a part of the people laid on hands on the Levites. Cajetan and Lorinus, the Princes of the Tribes, in place of the people, laid on hands and consented, quia offerens (saith Lyra) deb●bat ponere manum super oblationem suam. So Diodati, they imitate such as offered by laying on the hand on the oblation.  
Now Mr. H. his binding & losing comprehend. 
A filis Israelis Beda, sub multorum testimonio & cognition facienda est electio, ut examinatio digna celebretur, ut nemo reprehendere possit, debent enim testimonium habere bonum.  eth all acts of Church-power not only by public 
Jer. 40. 4. Psal. 105. 20. Rev. 9 14. Job 12. 18. Psal. 105. 17. Judg. 15 10. Psal. 149. 8. Act. 21. 8. Act. 22. 4. Mark 3. 27. Psal. 102. ●0.  preaching (for so the ruling Elder should have no key) but also by excommunication and admission, admonitions which issue from judging power, as we proved.  
Ans. That is said gratis, admonition and consent to receive in, and cast out members by cansent, necessarily agree to women, it so much concerning their daily practices and conscience, and they have no judicial power.  
2. By no Scripture can Mr. H. prove that admonition of Brethren is Church-binding and losing, 
Binding and losing are acts of authority by the Scripture in Rulers, who have command of prisons, which unofficed people have not, they not being Rulers.  and that it is limited to one congregation. Nor can a single flock bind a member of the Catholic Church, or a sojourning visible Saint to Church▪ judging in one single congregation; nor is there one jot in Scripture to tie the Brother, Mat. 18. 15. If thy Brother tr●spss, etc. To a Brother member of that only congregation, of which the Plaintiff is a member.  
3. I said that binding and losing are words of official authority undue to unofficed brethren, at the Scripture saith. See the Margin, jer. 40. 4, etc. above.  
Mr. H. The promise is made to Peter, because of his confession in name of the Believers.  
Ans. The Text saith no such thing, but because of his confession.  
1. He, and all men and women, who so sincerely confess, are blessed, because really regenerate; flesh and blood hath not revealed that, etc. v. 16.  
2. Because of this confession, a promise of perseverance is made to the whole Catholic Church invisible, than the way how to fulfil this promise is set down, I will make this invisible 
The true sense of that, I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom, etc.  Church visible, and I will give the Keys of Word and Censures to thee Peter, and to all the called Pastors, etc. for the Church's salvation of men and women, that they may be kept invincible upon the Rock.  
Mr. H. grants, that the Keys are given to believers who may be hypocrites.  
Ans. Add, and to them as the first formal subject: This is before refuted. But it is asked, Why Brethren believing and 
It's not said, Mat. 16. that Christ promiseth the keys to the Church of redeemed ones.  as so incorporated, should be made the first subject of the Keys by this Text, and not also the first subject of the love of Election and Redemption, by which they are built on the Rock, and made impregnable against the gates of Hell; for the one is said of the Church here, and not one word that he will give the Keys to the Church.  
As also Mr. H. granteth, that Christ speaks not to Peter as representing all believers, but only the disciples and male-believers: But whom say ye that I am (ye disciples?)  
Ans. It's true, he propounds the question to the disciples only, but saith he that hence only men and unofficed Brethren 
The evasion of Mr. H. that Christ said, Whom do men say that I am? to the disciples only, as representing only the male-believers of a single congregation, excluding women and all who so confess Christ with the same sinceriey, hath no feet. How far from the mind of sound Antiquity and of Protestant Divines, the places Mat. 16. Flesh and blood hath not revealed this; and, Upon this Rock, etc. See Magdeburgens. Hist. Vol. 1. Cen. 1. l. 1. c. 4. p. 56. ib. p. 32. as super hanc Petram, i. c. confessionem. lb. p. 40. What is the true Church, see hist. Magd. ib. Cent. 1. l. 1. c. 4. p. 127, 129. 130. The Magdeburgenses hist. Vol. 1. Cen. 1. l. 1. c. 4. p. 138. expounds it sound of the perseverance of the Saints, not of the visible Church, as Papists do.  of a single congregation who give such a sincere confession, are blessed, and built on the Rock? So he saith, Matth. 13. 10, 11. to the disciples only, To you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, to them it is not given: Are there then none the Elect of God, men or women, to whom the grace of saving faith is given, but only the disciples? So Luke 22. 28. Ye are they that have continued with me in my temptations: v. 29. And I appoint unto you a kingdom. Then to the disciples and men, not to women who suffer with Christ, there is a kingdom appointed. Upon this account, all the Promises and Consolations of sending the Comforter, of the many mansions in his Father's house, which he was to prepare for them, do belong to the disciples, as brethren, and as a male-Church of a single flock without officers, not chosen women, aged children that believe: and therefore these words of Mr. H. that Christ sp●…s not to all believers in the person of Peter, Blessed are ye, for flesh and blood, etc. most injuriously bereave all women, all men, that are not members by Covenant of this male-congregation, of all the Promises of the Gospel, and comforts which Christ uttered to his disciples only. Not to say what before I said, that  
1. This is contrary to the scope of the Text. And  
2. contrary to the Peace, 2. Comfort, 3. Joy, 4. Blessedness 
Mr. H. his exposition of Mat. 16. that Peter in that confession represents the male-members of the congregation only, is contrary to the scope of the Text, and to the faith, comfort and blessedness of all believers so confessing.  in the state of Regeneration, 5. Faith of their Perseverance, and 6. Victory over temptations, from the gates of Hell; of all, who contrary to Sects and Heresies, and sundamental Errors touching Christ his Nature, Offices and Dignity, sincerely believe, and confess that he is the Messiah the Son of God, be they women, aged children, servants, sincere visible Saints of another congregation, or sojourning Saints.  
Mr. H. If believers (saith Mr. R.) 〈◊〉 giving Peter's confession, and built upon the Rock Christ, be made a ministerial Church, than the official power of binding and losing should be made as fi●m and sure from defection, as the Church of believers built on the Rock.  
Ans. The Assumption is denied, for the Church to whom the Keys are firstly given, though they have a virtual power to call men to office, yet they have not formally official power; nor is official power, which in great Apostasies may fail, of like stability with the visible Church, which can never totally fail.  
Ans. My Argument is not faithfully repeated (of which I often complain) if the Ministerial formal power of ruling, and creating and unmaking of officers (a virtual power of which he of new speaks, I know not, for who hath the formal power of calling officers then?) be given to believers, though destitute of Pastors, because believers are in a congregational frame 
If to be built upon the Rock be to be built in a congregational Church-frame, than the gates of Hell cannot prevail against the office, against the visible frame of congregations. Some of our Divines make the Church of believers, men and women, the virtual subject of the Keys, and of all Church-power. But Mr. H. maketh them more than a virtual subject, for he must make the formal calling and creating of officers, and excommunicating of them, and so preaching, as was the Apostle Peter's case, Act. 1. 15. and the Prophets, Act. 13, 3. who prayed and laid on hands on Saul and Barnabas, and sent them as Apostles to the Gentiles, a formal act of the Church of Redeemed ones, men and women, servants and children, for which we have no Scripture, and as little Reason, for we may so say the Flint formally makes fire. Hist. Magdeb. Vol. 1. Cen. 1. l. 1. c. 4. p. 138.  built upon the Rock, nothing hindereth but ministerial power, that is the power of the Keys given to believers, which is but a gift given to hypocrites often, should be as firm as though believers were built on a rock. Mr. H denieth the Assumption only, and seems to yield the Proposition. I appeal to the Reader, if these words, I will build my Church (in the frame of a Congregation Independent) upon the Rock Christ, of the confession of Peter, have any such sense; for in all Scripture the building upon the rock hath no such sense, but noteth Christ's building of real believers on himself in the most holy faith, which building cannot sail. And whereas Mr. H. saith, The visible Church cannot totally fail, as our Divines say, they mean the Catholic visible Church, and not your Independent congregations, of which they knew nothing who teach this Doctrine. So this Argument of mine stands. Promises of never falling are made in Scripture to things, not to persons, as to the Kingdom, to the Gospel, to the Dominion of Christ, Psal. 72. 8. Isa. 9 7. Luke 1. 33. Isa. 55. 11. Psal. 110. 2. Mat. 24. 14, etc. but ever in order to persons, especially to that excellentest of persons: But of temptations to offices, and institutions and promises to such, as here, we read not.  
Mr. H. Those to whom (saith Mr. R.) Christ giveth the Keys, do represent the person of Christ, and who despiseth them, despiseth Christ, and who honour them, honour Christ, Mat. 10. 40. Now Scripture never saith so of believers, They that hear and obey believers, hear and obey me. Ans. The Proposition is false, to represent Christ as stewards, belongs only to them who have office power; but the Spouse had power in the family before the stewards and officers were.  
Ans. 1. Yet that must be meant of believers, men and women, 
Those who bear the Keys represent Christ as sent by him. But this do not the male-Church.  He that despiseth the preaching male Church, despiseth me.  
1. The forgiving or losing from excommunication, as well as preaching the Gospel, 2 Cor. 2. 10. and excommunication itself, which is given to unofficed brethren by Mr. H. is done, 1 Cor. 5. 4. in the name, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, therefore they who despise the unofficed Brethren excommunicating, despise Christ; and excommunicating of heretic Pastors, or judicial rejecting there cannot be, except unofficed brethren publicly rebuke, 1 Tim. 5. 20. and in the Name of Christ judicially declare the man an Heretic, and the doctrine Heresy, Tit. 3. 10.  
2. The comparison that makes every male. Church a Spouse 
The Scripture makes not every male-church the Spouse & body of Christ.  of Christ, and so multiplies Spouses and Bodies of Christ; whereas the Scripture makes but one visible Spouse on earth, Cant 4 1, 2. & 6. 8. 9 & 7. 1, 2. Eph. 5. 26, 27. one Body, 1 Cor. 12 12, 13. Eph. 1. 23. Col. 1. 18. will not furnish an Argument. For,  
1. A Spouse without stewards may feed; may therefore 
Theoph. Nicolaides de miss. minist c. 10. p. 91, 92, 93, 94.  unofficed brethren preach, and tender the Seals, as Socinians say they may baptise one another?  
2. A Spouse may create servants of her own devising; so may not unofficed brethren do.  
3. The Scripture makes the Catholic Church Christ's Spouse by faith; what Word of God warrants every male-society to be a Spouse of Christ by a new devised Oath or Covenant? and our brethren cannot give us a Scripture, where the male congregation excluding women is called the Spouse, Body of Christ built upon the Rock, etc.  
Mr. H. Those to whom the Keys are given (saith Mr. R.) do authoritatively forgive and retain sins: The fraternity (saith Mr. H.) forgives judicially, 2 Cor. 2. the officers authoritatively.  
Ans. Brethren and sisters forgive by way of charity, the officers authoritatively. A judicial forgiving distinct from both in a male-Church, is the question begged by Mr. H. not proved.  
2. He supposeth Paul writeth to this male-Church void of Pastors; whereas there were many Pastors there, 1 Cor. 14. 29, 
The male-Church of Corin'h doth neither judicially forgive, nor is it written unto by Paul excluding women & others.  30, 31. & 4. 15. &. 1. 12. nor could they without officers celebrate the Lords Supper, as they did, 1 Cor. 1 〈◊〉 frequently.  
3. He supposes they only were judicially to forgive the incestuous man; whereas all in their own way, men and women, were to forgive him, and to converse with him as a brother, 2 Cor. 2 7, 8. as is said before.   

CHAP. VI  
What Church it is that is built on the Rock, Mat. 16. whether the visible or invisible Church, the Catholic or the single Independent Church.  
BEfore I examine Mr. H. his Reasons, take notice of what 
Chap. 11. pro. 2. p. 215.  Mr. H. saith, which may conduce to this:  
The Keys and power (saith Mr. H.) must be given to a single society, i. e. to a sort and condition of men under some special relation, To thee will I give, etc. as to a single society, not to them.  
Ans. That the Keys must be given to a single; that is, according to Mr. H. his sense, to a single Independent congregation only, that they may exercise Jurisdiction only within themselves, and that all others, though as free Churches as it, are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, without is never proved by Mr. H. nor gives he ●s a pattern of such a Church Independent in Jurisdiction.  
2. His Argument, Because it is said, To thee, as a single society, 
Ch. 7. sect. 4. p. 128. Many thousands may be one Church.  not to them, is naught: Did not the Lord give, in Peter, the Keys to the twelve Apostles, and to six or ten sundry societies in jerusalem? but they were one Church; so the combined Elders in a Presbytery is but one single society: yea but saith he, they are many Churches. Ans. They are, and may be but four societies meeting in four sundry places, and scarce all eight hundred, and therefore a more single society than eight thousand and above, which Mr. H. saith made but one congregational Church of jerusalem: And is not the society of a Synod Provincial or National, one single society also by this account?  
2. Let the Reader judge how our brethren use the word 
Way of the Churches of Ch. m. in N. E. c. 1 sect. 1. pro. 1. p. 1. 2.  Church, as Kid leather stretching it in and out at their pleasure, as it serves best for their turn, for here the single society capable of the Keys, is a new male Church of redeemed ones.  
Also consider but the first proposition.  
1. These words, The instituted Church of Christ in the Gospel, 
The 1. proposition concerning a Church instituted, Way of the Churches of N. E. c. 1. sect. 1. prop. 1. p. 1, 2, 15. is examined, & found insufficient & faulty.  to which Christ hath committed the Keys, the power of binding and losing, the seals, officers, are most ambiguously set down, and can hardly bear truth either in a passive or an active sense: for its false that the Keys passively are not committed to women, for they must be bound and loosed, and have the Seals and Tables of the Covenant, as well as men.  
2. In an active sense, its false, that to women, understanding children, the dispensing of Censures, Seals and Tables are committed.  
3. The power of the Keys are not committed to the Church instituted, as to the proper subject, but only by those pious Authors, to a limb or wing of it, the male redeemed are never called, The instituted Church of the New Testament.  
4. And how the seals are given to the male▪ Church as to the 
How our brethren make the seals to be given to their congregation.  subject, when they want Pastors, I see not: The Tables and Seals are given to men and women redeemed, as the end and object for their salvation and edification.  
5. So they are given to Pastors, Doctors, Elders, Deacons, to all visible Saints, but in the intention of God, to all Rulers and ruled, men and women, not as mere visible professors (for God intends no such thing to a mere Magus, to whom agrees the complete essence of a visible member) but as invisible and chosen ones.  
6. Nor is it either didactic or suitable to a Systeme of Church-policy, That the administration of all Christ's public Worship and Ordinances, is committed to a company of believers, for the active administration of Baptism and the Lords Supper, and of the preached Word, is not committed to unofficed brethren, or to women, who are members of this instituted Church of the Gospel; otherwise in a passive sense all are to partake of the Worship and Ordinances, according as their capacity is: but how the male-Church void of pastors can receive them, I know not.  
7. I say not much, that it's not Grammar to say that this Church is a communion of Saints: A community it is, which word is in our language a Concrete.  
8. That its a combination of Saints meeting for that end (to partake of the Ordinances) by common and joint consent into one congregation, is ut erly unsound; for as this is a delineation of 
Our Brethren describe their Church from a Church-assembly, and exclude all of another congregation from their Church-assemblies.  a New Testament Church-Assembly, to partake of the Ordinances, so it makes it contrary to the institution of a Church under the Gospel, to members of another congregation to meet, to partake of pastoral preaching or seals in a Church, whereto they never gave common and joint consent, as never being inchurched members thereof; yea, and all of another congregation by this reason hear the Word in that foreign congregation, not as visible Saints, but as Pagans, and such as are without. And it's as strongly concludent against hearing in another congregation than their own, as against Church-rebukes, and (as our Brethren teach) Church judging, and admonishing between brother and brother: for as there is indeed a providential necessity of partaking of pastoral preaching and seals in another congregation than the members own; so is there the same soul-necessity of the like rebuking and gaining of a brother, Mat. 18. 15. If the trespass be committed in another congregation, 
There is a necessity of Church-communion in rebukes, as in seals.  and be private as yet, as if it were done in the offenders own congregation, except it can be proved that from Mat. 18. Christ's mind is, if a brother of another congregation fall in a pit to the hazard of his salvation, I should let him perish there, I am not his keeper as touching any Church-remedy for gaining, according to Mat. 18. which sure we cannot do to our enemy's ox, if he fall in a pit; yea, and there is as great, if not a greater necessity, to use the remedy of rebuking, Mat. 18. to gain him when he falls in a spiritual ditch in another congregation, as to preach pastorally, and to tender the Lords Supper to him in another congregation, and as the Bread in the Lord's 
Way of the Churches of Christ in N. E. c. 6. sect. 1. pag. 103. Cotton, Keys of the Kingdom, c. 4. p. 17.  Supper (say our brethren with Mr Cot.) is one Bread, and a seal of our communion with the Lord jesus; but also of our communion with his members not only of our own Church, but of all the Churches of the saints: so we are to gain our brethren by admonition, teaching rebuking, by Matth. 18 not only as they are members of the single independent body congregational, but of the whole Catholic body, 1 Cor. 12. 16. for whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it, or one member be honoured, all the members rejo●c● with it. And Rome 12. 4, 5. compared with verse 15. for there is one Body (visible) one Spirit, one Lord, one Faith, one Baptism, one God and Father of all, Eph. 4. 4 5. and one body Catholic, into which all are baptised, Jews and Gentiles, 1 Cor 12. 12, 13.  
8. It is false that there is no Church which Christ in his Gospel hath instituted— but a particular visible Church, that meets in one place all of them: for Christ hath sanctified and cleansed with the washing of water by the word, a Catholic Church, which he shall present as a glorious Church, without spot or wrinkle, Eph. 5. 25, 26, 27. and perfected body (visible) when we all meet in the unity of faith, Eph 4. 11, 12, 13.  
9 That this instituted Church is to meet together all of them, 
Our brethren in the large description of the only instituted Church in the New Testament make no mention of infants, as do the seven Churches of Anabaptists, almost in the same terms. Propositions concerning Church government by the Assembly at West. An. 1647.  even the whole Church for the administration of the holy ordinances of God, to public edification, 1 Cor. 14. 27. is a manifest debarring of Infants born within the visible Church, from being members of that Church, which Christ in his Gospel hath instituted, etc. for they are neither capable of convening in one place every Lord's day, nor of public edification by prophesying, as is meant. 1 Cor. 14. 23. cited by them. How they defend Infant-Baptism, who make them incomplete and unconfirmed members, let them see; the learned, pious, and grave Assembly at Westminster provided better, that particular visible Churches members of the general Church were made up of visible Saints, viz. of such as being of aged professed faith in Christ, and obedience to Christ, according to the rule of faith and life, taught by Christ, and his Apostles, and of their Children, Act. 2. 38, 41. Act. 2. v▪ ult. compared with Act. 5. 14, etc. There is not one word of Infants in this large description of instituted Churches of the Gospel, and to it, in all, the Anabaptists subscribe, yea, the seven Churches have, upon the matter the same description of the visible 
Confession of faith of the 7. Churches, called Anabaptists, An. 1645. and An. 1646. Art. 33. which Church is a company of visible Saints, called, and separated from the world, by the Word and Spirit of God to the visible profession of the Gospel, being baptised unto that faith, and joined to the Lord, and each to other by mutual agreement (Church-Covenant, say our Brethren) in the practical enjoyment of all ordinances commanded by Christ their head. Art. 36. Independency of Jurisdiction is asserted. As also Art. 42. Art. 34. The whole body of men and women are the Church which Art. 36. hath power to choose an▪ call Elders. And Art. 42. to cast out any member.  Church, without one word of Infants.  
Mr. H. That Church is here, Matth. 16. meant, which is built 
Pag. 216, 217.  upon the Rock Christ, by the visible confession of Peter, as explicated immediately before; but the invisible Church is not built by a visible profession, such as Peter was. The second part of the assumption is clear by the opposition between visibility and invisibility. The proposition is proved by the meaning of the words, Thou hast made a confession of myself a Rock, and therefore are called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, and upon myself so confessed, will I build my Church.  
Ans. The proposition is not true in his sense, the assumption most false, the conclusion both untrue and unjustly expressed: for the visible single congregation is not here meant, and I will build my Church congregational, in its frame, upon the Rock by this 
See Hist. Magdeburg. vol. 1. cent. 1. l. 1. c. 4. pag. 119, 120, 121. cent. 1. l. 2 c. VII. p. 404. Histor. Magdeburg. vol. 1. l. 11 c. X. pag. 423, 424. Celeberrima est confessio quam de Christo, tum 〈◊〉 de suo, tum reliquorum Apostolorum nomine, edidit. Pa. 211. Ob. 4. M. H. Teacheth that the Church is builded on the rock by the intervening of an hypocritical profession.  confession. Except Mr. H. the place had no Author, no Divine, or any other for this sense, so destructive to the text. Therefore there hath been some trepidation of mind upon the pious man. After many thoughts (saith he) floating in my mind, what might be the meaning of our Saviour, etc. And after many thoughts, he could not find a way to answer Mr. R. his Arguments, but by a Popish Exposition, for Bellarm. lib. 3. De Eccles. c. 13. brings this place to prove that the visible Church shall never fall away. So the Jesuits of Rheims, 1 Tim. 3. 15. citys the same place. D. Fulk answers, every true Christian is builded on the same Rock, which is Christ. So Cornel. à L●p. Matth. 16. the visible Church cannot err: To the proposition Mr. H. yielded. That the Church to whom the Keys are given, may receive the Keys by the intervening of an hypocritical confession, or profession of Christ, such as is in Judas and Magus. So the proposition is false, to wit, that Church is here meant which is built upon the Rock Christ, by the visible confession of Peter so explicated; for it is explicated to be a visible confession.  
1. Sometimes true, sometimes hypocritical.  
2. Sometimes it is expounded to be the confession only of the male-Church, excluding women.  
3 Of the male Believers of a single Church void of Pastors: while the world stands, such a visible confession as may be false, and lying is no means of Christ to build the Church of men and women so upon the Rock Christ, as they shall persevere in saving 
A hypocritical profession Mar. 16. is never intended by Christ to be the means of building believers upon the invincible rock, against which hell cannot prevail, as Mr. H. saith. Mr. Ainsworth Can. 2. 14. the rock whither this Dove the Church was now fled, seemeth most properly to mean faith in Christ, as Mat. 16. 18. wherein she hideth herself, for fear of God's wrath for her sin. Iuni●●. My Dove that dwells in the secret decree of Election, tanquam in rupe inaccessâ, as in an impregnable Rock.  saith; so as the gates of Hell, and the temptations of the World, the Devil and the Flesh shall never prevail against them. The only internal and effectual way of building men upon the Rock, is the sincere real believing on Christ, coming from the revelation of the Father of Christ, Mat. 16. 17. And the external building upon the Rock, is by the preached Gospel; this is also Popish, for by a lying profession none are builded upon the Rock Christ.  
2 The Scripture makes being builded upon the Rock, all one with being builded upon God, the Rock of salvation. So the door of the Word is the house built upon the Rock, Matth. 7. 24. the spouse is the Dove that dwells in the cliffs in the Rock, in the secret places of the Stairs, Cant. 2. 14. for which see the Interpreters in the margin: the believing Ephesians are by saith built upon the foundation of the Apostles and Prophets, as lively stones, Christ being the chief corner stone, and made the habitation of God, not through visible profession, but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, by the spirit, Eph. 2. 21, 22.  
3. It may make any to tremble, to see pious men do such violence to the word, for he tells us this or that particular congregation may fall away, but the universal congregation, or Church, existing in the particular Churches falls not away. Orthodox Divines, 
The Church builded upon the rock cannot be the congregation, but the invisible Catholic Church made visible. Hieronymus. Contra Luceferan. ingemuit totus orbis & Arrianum se factum esse miratus est. Hilarius. contra Auxentium. Bellarm. de eccles. l. 3. c. 1. Gregor. de Valen. Tom. 3. p. 8. Eccles. jam. omni tempore esse visibilem Stapleton. Relect c. 1. quest. 3. art. 1. pag. 33. Azorius. Moral. instit. par. 2. l. 5. c. 21. Rhemens'. in Mat. 5. Calvin. Institut. l. 4. c. 8. D. Willet. Synopsi. Papismi 2. contr. Genes. 4. 3.  and Mr. R. grants that the visible Church doth not fall. The just contrary is taught by our Divines, that the Catholic Church shall never fall away; but there was a time when Elias complained, he only was left; The Council of Selencia and Arminium condemned the Nicene faith: Hieronymus, as also Hila●ius complain, that the Arrian heresy had overspread all the World, and that mountains, woods, lakes and prisons, in which the Prophets mourned, were more safe than the towns. Bellar. Valentia, Stapleton, Azorius, say the Church is ever visible, as a City on a mountain, D. Fulk answers the Jesuits of Rheims, Calvin, Willet, and ours say, that the Catholic Church all the world over can never totally fail, because they are by faith builded upon the Rock, but that the frame of a particular congregation Independent, is a building upon the Rock Christ, never man dreamt▪ and that the gates of Hell cannot prevail against the visible frame of a single congregation, is wild Divinity.  
4. Calvin, Swinglius, Bucer, Marlorat, Pareus on this place, 
Calvin. Quorum singuli sunt Dei templa. Ainsworth, Ps. 18. 2. Two names of a rock are here; S●laugh, a stony rock or clif, and Tsur, a strong or sharp rock.  Perkins De praedestinatione, D. Twisse extend this to all believers, of whom (saith Calvin) Singuli sunt Dei Templa, Every one is the Temple of God. Now it is clear, that the building on the Rock, signifieth the building of persons in the faith, not of the society, as a visible society and frame external: hence all who are builded on the Rock Christ by a firm faith, do trust in God, and can say, 1 Sam. 2. 2. Neither is there any Rock like our God, and so every single man so built, may say, God is my Rock, Psal. 18. 2. It is often a title of God himself (saith Ainswer 't) Psal. 18. 13 46. Blessed be my Rock, Psal. 92. 16. Deut. 32. 4, 18, 30, 31. Psal. 71. 3. Psal. 42. 9 Ps. 62. 7. 2. He only is my Rock and my Salvation, the Rock of Israel, 2 Sam. 23. 3. Now how ordinary is it, that God is the Rock of his Saints? and insolent and dry when Mr. H. must say, my God is the Rock of this institution of a single independent frame? And whereas persons are set upon a Rock, that this new institution is builded 
That there is a promise made of the gates of hell not prevailing against the frame of independent congregations, or against persons, such as Magus, judas (it may be) in that frame is an abusing of the Word, never heard of until M. H. first forged it.  upon the Rock by the hand of Christ; and whereas persons are tempted by the ports of Hell, but being upon their Rock they are kept, to say institutions are tempted, but being upon their Rock, they are kept, is new and insolent Divinity. If it be said, the persons are built by Christ in this Church-frame of Independency, they believing and professing sincerity, it is almost the same.  
For than 1. the persons in the very frame are kept in the 
Thus said also the Donatists, August de unit. Eccles. c. 9 Cum libero arbitrio homo creatus, & si vult, credit in Christum, si non credit— noluerunt homines perseverare, & defecit omnibus gentibus Christiana religio, excepta parte Donati.  frame, so that the ports of Hell shall not demolish the visible frame, they sincerely believing; but since the promise is made to all that sincerely adhere to their profession, and fulfil the condition, shall all such godly incorporations, as by persecution and malice of Satan, and the ports or strength of hell are dissolved, and all godly and visible Saints, who by banishment, exile, or violent death, are pulled away from visible membership, be thrown off the rock Christ? And doth the gates of Hell prevail against such believers? If it be said, yet in a spiritual sense, such are eminently and satisfyingly made members of a more glorious society, even of the Church triumphant, as the promise of the fifth command, Eph. 6. of long life is fulfilled to an obedient gracious son, who dies young; and so here: I am sure it will not be found, especially in the New Testament, that the Lord ties a promise spiritual of perseverance in grace, and deliverance from the prevailing temptations of Hell to any single visible Church-frame.  
But 2. the building on the Rock, and deliverance from the prevailing temptations of Hell, by this exposition is made by the grant of Mr. H. to the visible profession that may be in judas and Magus; and is it to be believed that Christ promiseth with his own hand to build upon the rock Magus and judas, who are as essentially stones of the building, and whose acts of the Keys are a● valid as these of sincere believers, so as the gates of Hell shall never prevail against these sons of perdition? So Mr. H. expounds it.  
3● Many Martyrs faithfully perform congregational duties, yet doth not Christ make good this promise, for when members are dissolved by banishment, they are thrown off the rock. That which by our Saviour is set down, as contrary to their comfortable union with, and building upon Christ their rock, is being foiled with the Temptations of Satan and Hell, and being thrown off the rock, like the Hypocrite, Matth. 7. who is the house builded on the sand, for the strength of a war City, as Calvin noteth, and Pareus, were in iron gates and bars, Psal. 
See the M●gdeburg. vol. 3: cent. X. c. 4. p. 104. 106 Leo in Natali Apost. Petri & Pauli, Serm. 2. Et dabo tibi claves, etc. tran siv it quidem in alios Apostolos vis istius potestatis, sed non frustra uni commendatur quod omnibus ●intimatur; Petro enim singulariter hoc creditur, quia cunctis Ecclesiae Roctoribus (non ergo populo) formal s●st fides & confessio qua christum filium Dei viventis ag●●vit pr●p●●tu.  127. 5. Deut. 3. 5. and so by this interpretation the Lords dissolving of a Church, which often is a work of mercy, and putting of his children to an honourable condition of Martyrdom, and glorifying of God by suffering and scattering of his Church, as Acts 8. 12. must be a throwing them off the rock Christ, and a prevailing of the ports of Hell against them: contrary to the scope and intent of Christ in the Text.  
6. It is a most uncomfortable doctrine, that men and women builded on the Rock Christ, and chosen to salvation, have only right, by this so expounded Text, to union with Christ their Rock, and victory over the gates of hell, in so far as they are inchurched covenant ways into such an independent corporation; when the Saints builded upon the Rock, and persevering by the grace of God, contrary to all the machinations of hell, may be scattered, 1 Pet. 1. 2. wander in the mountains and deserts, Heb. 11. 38. and have no certain dwelling house, 1 Cor. 4. 11. and sojourning visible Saints, and be not so much as visible members, and it is cruelty to say such are no members of Christ's visible body, but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, without, and not builded on the Rock.  
7. Mr. H. grants a man may give Petors confession, par. 1. 
Way of the Churches of 〈◊〉. E. c. 1. sect. 2. page 2. hooker's Suru. par. 1. ch. XI. page 203.  c. 6. page 62. and men may be scattered stones, visible Saints, and yet through some opinion concerning the visible Church, be members of no such congregation; are they for that not builded upon the Rock? and Mr. H. brings this interpretation. Salve ●●liore judici●, by stress of argument.  
2. As to the Minor; But the invisible Church is not built by a visible profession upon the Rock, as Peter was. It is most false; for there is a twofold invisibility, and twofold visibility.  
1. Such as in the election of God only, and are not called yet, are invisible, as Saul persecuting; such indeed are not actually built upon the rock by visible profession, as Peter was.  
But 2. Peter and all sincerely professing Christ, as Peter and the other ten are both the invisible Church, in so far as sincerity 
Two sorts of visibilities.  of faith, and love is only in the heart, and known infallibly to none, but to God, and to the man himself, who hath received the white stone, the new name, Rev. 1. 17. and also they all such are, and may be built by the same visible confession of Peter, real and sincere (for of a sincere visible and audible confession only as real and saving our Saviour speaks, Mat. 16. as Mr. R. holds) upon the rock. I grant there may be degrees of real sincerity, more or less in men and women, but the same in nature, 
The same Peter is both an invisible Saint, in regard his faith was known to God, and he really blessed; and also he was a real visible professor by his confession that was audible and visible to men.  & sp●●io, that is in Peter is in women, by which they are built upon the rock, and so they are invisible members in the latter sense, and are also built visibly & really upon the rock, by Peter's faith coming out in a real visible confession, and the invisible Church in this sense is also the true real visible Church; and a visible confession or profession, is either real, or hypocritical and seeming, that it is real of which the Text speaks Mr. R. proves, because from it Christ pronounces Peter really blessed.  
2. Because it was taught Peter by the Father of Christ, and not by flesh and blood; Mr. H. contend● that it may be seeming only. I desire he or any for him, may prove it was seeming only, or may be seeming only; yea, it was exclusive of judas the Traitor his confession, for he knew nothing of the revelation of the Father, nor was he blessed as Peter, nor is it our Saviour's purpose to praise and commend hypocrisy, Mat. 16. and therefore there is not truth in that which M. H. saith, that there is a 
Visibility so expounded is not contrary to invisibility. Arist. de Repr. Sophist. l. 1. c. 4.  contrariety or opposition between visibility and invisibility. So expounded, the opposition is not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, nor 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, as Aristotle and Ramus both require; and therefore it is granted, that the house of God, 1 Tim. 3. 15. in which Timothy was to behave himself right, was the visible Church of Eph●sus, and the other Church Presbyterial; but that this cannot consist with invisibility is most false, it destroys the ministry & faithful Apostles and 
Page 217.  Pastors calling, who are sent to gather into Christ all the invisible members of Christ's mystical body, and to make them visible professors.  
And whereas he says, that this direction of Paul to Timothy; was to continue to all succeeding officers to the end, and that in all particular charges given to them, is truth seen through a cloud.  
1. This direction in these Epistles was to continue to all succeeding officers; Ergo, the laying on of hands, and ordaining 
Mr. H grants a succession of officers & keys to the end of the world.  watchmen and Bishops; and this direction appointing Elders, faithful men able to teach, and the rest belonging to the Keys must b● given to officers, not to the male Church.  
2. Here is some succession of godly Pastors to the end, to all Pastors and Elders with such qualifications, as a Bishop must be blameless, etc. 1 Tim. 2. Deacons must be such, etc. the direction is giv●n to all succeeding officers to the end: why not rather to the first proper subject of the Keys to the male-Church?  
3. That 1 Tim. 3. 15. The house of God is the pillar and ground of truth, and the body of Christ; for the perfecting and edifying whereof, Eph. 3. 12. Christ gave Apostles, Evangelists, Pastors and Doctors, 10. 11. is the single particular independent Church (Salvo m●liori judicio saith Mr. H. in his conjectural modesty) is contrary to all Scripture; and this is the very Church builded upon the rock, against which the gates of hell shall not prevail; and upon this account hearken to Mr. H. his 
It is a come fortless doctrine, that this or that congregation, or this or that believer may be thrown off the Rock, and may fall from saving grace, ●…ough the congregation universal shall continue on the Rock.  distinction.  
Mr. R. propounded an argument never yet answered to prove that the Church builded upon the rock cannot be the single visible congregation, against Papists & Socinians, and our Brethren.  
That Church is here Mat. 16. understood, against which the gates of hell shall never prevail; but against the visible independent congregational (the seven Churches of Asia now are fallen away) Church, the gates of hell hath prevailed. Ans. This or that particular Church or congregation may fall away; but there must be a Church universal existing in its particulars, this or that Church, which Christ will have while the world continues, Eph. 4. 11. D. Ames. medulla l. 1. c. 31. 37.  
Ans. To begin with what Amesius saith, it's utterly impertinent: 
Ames. Medul. lib. 1. c. 31. De Ecclesia mysticè considerata. Cap. 32. De Ecclesia instituta. Mr. H. his Exposition of Matth. 16. 18. infers the apostasy of real believers. Ames. Coronis art. 5. de perserver. arg▪ 2: pag. 413, 414. Si damnatio sola fidelium per has portas intelligatur, tum consistere potest haec promissio cum totali defectu Ecclesi● militantis, nihil enim sponderet militantibus (Ecclesiae Catholicae membris, ut ex seri● discurfus) sed solis desunctis. Socinus in praelect. Theolog. c. 13. p. 71. Si tamen placeat eos qui in praedictis locis in lib. vitae à constitutione mundi scripti esse dicuntur, satis est ostendisse ibi non de●certis quibusdam hominibus agi, sed de hominum quodam genere. Pag. 72. Verum nomen alicujus scriptum esse 〈◊〉 libro vitae, non significat eum nullâ ratione prorsus interire posse.  The title of that Chapter is of the Mystical Church, the members of which can never fall away, but must be until the end of the world, as the title of the next Chapter is of the instituted Church; yea, Am●sius saith, this place Matth. 16. is a special promise made to those built on a Rock, to the Militant Catholic Church, and to real believers only, not to hypocrites. Mr. H. by this teacheth the Patrons of the Apostasy of the Saints, a distinction useful for their Error. So cinus saith, The places which saith, They are saved who are written in the Book of Life before the world was, do not speak of some particular man th●● or that, (as Mr. H. this or that single Church may fall off the Rock) but some kind of men, and therefore Mr. H. renders this a comfortless doctrine, which Christ makes a singular bulwark of Faith and Consolation to single persons, Peter, Mary, who believe, and are built upon the Rock, that such shall never fall away; but this or that congregation of some few persons, though true and real believers, may and do fall away. This is the downright Apostasy of believers.  
2. This strongly savours of the Jesuit Ruiz. his Necessitas vaga (though Mr. H. hate Doctrine and Way, when his sharp 
Henric. Wolfing. lib. de offic. homin. Christ. p. 6. 3. Decretum electionis, communiter loquendo, necessario refertur non ad certas aliquas personas, sed ad certum hominum genus qualitate aliqua obedientiae vel inobedientiae praeditum.  engine sees them) when a thing is necessarily to fall out, in, upon, or about the kind of men, but not in, or upon this single man; as it is infallible and necessary that there be war and be peace, and that there be husbandmen and be sailors, but God determines and bows the heart of no single man to be a husbandman rather than a sailer; he might say to be a King rather than a poor Beggar. This kind of necessity is against the providence of God's special care, as to great things, as to Kingdoms, Dan. 4. 32. so to all smaller things, the stirring of a Sparrows wing, Mat. 10. 29, & 30. the hair of the head, the growing and withering of a gourd, jonah 4. 6. the motion of a worm eating the gourd; which confused providence, Suarez, Cumel, 
Suarez in opus. lib. 3. de auxil. c. 17. Lib. de Praedest. c. 13. num. 4, 5. Lib. 3. de Praedest. c. 1. Cumel. variar. disp. tom. 1. p. 360. Ledesma. 1. 3. q. 22. art. 9 pag▪ 173.  Ledesma, forsake as shameful.  
3. The particular Independent congregation is either built upon the Rock unmovably, by a promise of the Gospel, as no Divine can deny, that the grace of perseverance (if such a grace, as it must be, be granted, for by Nature men persevere not) is given by a Gospel-promise, or by no promise. But men persevere 
Mr. H. holds the vaging necessity of Did. Ruiz, & some other Pelagianising Jesuits, that this or that man may fall away, but God hath confusedly decreed that some there shall be who shall never fall away, and so sides with Arminians and Socinians. Remonst. Apol. Non promittitur Ecclesiam semper mansura● Ecclesiam, sed tantum Ecclesiam quâ Ecclesia est, semper mansuram invictam à morte & condemnatione. Socinus in Miscelan. p. 262. Quamdiu vera Christi Ecclesta fuerit, fieri non posse, ut ab ipsa morte atque inferno (Mat. 18.) quidquam detrimenti patiatur. Did. Ruiz de mont. Jesuita tom. de provide. tract. 2. disp. 8. sect. 1. num. 5, 6. Plurimae sunt per quarum disjunctivam indeterminationem vagari potest infallibilitas & necessitas quae nullam illarum rerum determinat, sed tantum in confuso & universali numero. 6. necesse est ●…niant scandala, veruntamen vae homini per quem eveniunt scandala! ubi Christus Dominus apertè significat necessitatem vagari per varias personas, & varia scandalorum genera indeterminatè; nec enim necesse est, ut per hunc hominem fiat, nec ut hoc & non aliud scandalum fiat. Porro haec necessitas non est sola & nuda indigentia mediorum ad finem, sed etiam infallibilis consecutio effectuum ex causis efficientibus ita dispositis.  without any Gospel-promise, as the Sea ebbs, the Wind blows, which yet cannot be said, if a promise there be, then when this particular Church falls away. Now Mr. H. grants the Apostasy of this or that particular Church of Ephesus from the Rock, and the prevailing of the gates of Hell against the single man or Independent Church of Ephesus: for he saith, the place Mat. 16. The gates of h●ll shall not prevail, etc. is to be meant of the Church Congregational existing it its universal nature in its particular Congregations, than he must mean, that some one single congregation of Ephesus or S●…, may and do fall off the Rock, which is a clear Apostasy of the Saints: for it cannot be said this or that single Church shall fall away so, being they pray and watch. For,  
1. That is the very thing which the Arminians and Socinians say on this place, that the Church Mat. 16. 18. remaining and persevering a true Church, remains unconquered by death and condemnation.  
2. Praying, and persevering in praying, and watching thereunto, Ephes. 6 18. is a great part of persevering; and so persevering is promised upon condition of persevering: and therefore Mr. H. must betake himself to a more unthrifty shift, and quit the place Mat. 16 and so gratify Arminians and Socinians, who say, that it proves not the perseverance of the Saints; and so must say, that the building of the Church upon the Rock is the Lords continuate act of forming single societies upon the Rock Christ, giving them victory over Hell. So that he miscarries and ●●lls from his intended end, in keeping this or that single man or Church upon the Rock, but yet obtains his principal end in keeping the universal nature of man, and of an Independent Church upon the Rock. A more confused providence than ever Pelagius or any devised, and a singular gratifying of Jesuits and Sociniam.  
3. If the keeping of believers 〈◊〉 Saints upon the Rock Christ, so that the gates of 〈◊〉 shall 〈◊〉 prevail to throw them off the Rock, and put those that once were justified, and by faith built upon the Rock Christ, in a state of condemnation, be referred to the De●rce of God, then must God have made the same general confused De●r●●, That some by saving faith built upon the Rock Christ shall persevere, and some shall not persevere; but yet so, as God hath decr●●d a visible single Independent Church one or many there shall be, until all be gathered in to meet in the unity of the faith. But  
1. This is a Decree confused and general, so as the number 
M. H. his exposition of Mat. 16. 19 infers a great confusion in the decrees of God.  of the saved and kept upon the Rock, shall be indeterminate in the Decree of God, whatever it be in the prescience of God: But he who hath numbered in his Decree drops of water, rain, and dew, the blasts of wind, the stars by their names, Isa. 40. 12. Prov. 30. 4. Psal. 147. 4. job 38. 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. & 39 1, 2, etc. must in his Decree have fixed all the Churches, and all Church-members, men and women, old and young, who shall be kept on the Rock, and preserved by the power of God, through faith, unto salvation, 1 Pet. 1. 4, 5▪ 2 Tim. 2. 19  
2. What Popish trepidation and trembling of conscience 
Mr. H. his distinction of necessity inferreth the uncertainty of a believers salvation, & destroys his peace, joy, comfort, etc.  must it breed, that such as once were built upon the Rock, may be thrown off, and the gates of hell prevail against them? but some in the general nature of Independent Churches shall abide upon the Rock against all the strength of hell, until the second coming of Christ. But whether this can be a Gospel-comfort or not, that Christ builds the universal nature of Independent Churches upon the Rock; but though I be built upon it, whether I shall be thrown off it or no, I have no assurance from the promise, Mat. 16. 18.  
5. If this or this individual congregation be built upon the Rock, so as they cannot fall away, as Christ promises, Mat. 16. 
It destroys the faith, consolations, promises and certainty of the number saved.  then all congregations must also continue upon the Rock, for a promise of perseverance made to all in Christ, must be su●e to all that seed, and to all single congregations of that kind, if David, Solomon, and all single persons justified may fall away, then may all the justified fall away, nothing can be said in the contrary, but that the society may leave off to be a Church, but it follows not that they fall from the state of Justification. Ans. That is, they fall from Church membership only, but remain believers. Ans. Nay, they fall from the Rock Christ, and the gates of hell prevail against them; and so by Mat. 16. must fall from saving grace. But it were cruelty to say, that such as are scattered and broken out of membership by persecutors, and that for righteousness, that such were fallen off the Rock Christ, and that the gates of hell did prevail against them.  
6. All built upon the Rock are to believe their own perseverance, it being a promise of the Covenant of grace, jor. 31. 35. & 32. 39, 40. Isa. 54. 10. & 59 21. Mat. 10. 27, 28 and so to believe, they being once built upon the Rock Christ, they shall never fall away, as the promise is, Psal. 89. 31, 32, 33, Host 2. 18. 1 joh. 3. 9 joh. 14. 16. Psal. 125. 1. joh. 4. 14.  
7. Promises of perseverance and of saving grace, as being built on the Rock, are made to the seed indeed, Psal. 89. 29, 36. 2 Sam. 7. 12. Isa. 59 21. but never in the universal Generick nature to a visible society, but to single persons and individual men, joh. 4. 14. joh. 11. 26, 27. jor. 32. 39, 40. the abstracted nature is not capable of the love of Election, of free Redemption, that is made to single persons.  
8. So shall the number of the chosen and saved not be wri●ten, but unsure and dubious.    


LIB. IV. CHAP. I.  
The Congragation in its abstract nature is not the first subject of the Keys.  
Mr. H. pag. 218. TH● Key▪ as we have heard, is a power delegated from Christ to disponse and administer the holy things of his House.  
Ans. Why then give you the dispensing of 
Some certain officers not unofficed people are to be Judges & Porters under the N. Testament.  the holy things of God, given to Aaron and his sons, and the keeping of the charge of the Lord, and the judging of his House, and the keeping of his Counts, given to the Highpriest joshua, and, in his person, prophesied to the given to the officers of the New Testament, Zech. 3. 7. to any unofficed men? and whether doth not the Lord prophecy in the new Temple builtunder the Messiah, Ezek 44. (for it's neither the first nor second Temple spo●… of 〈◊〉) that New Testament-Levites (no question not the unofficed brethren) should keep the charge of the Lords holy things, and should be porters to keep the doors of the Lords sanctuary, to hold out the uncircumcised in heart and fl●sh, v. 8, 9, 10, 11. as Paul saith, 1 Cor. 12. 29. Are all Apostles? are all Prophets? are all Teachers? are all New Testament-Levites?  
Mr. H. What is meant by the Catholic and visible Church, I cannot know by Mr. R.  
Sometimes he seems to cast the Catholic visible Church upon the general nature of a Congregation.  
Ans. It but seems so, and to only Mr. H. to no living man else.  
Mr. H. To what principal subject hath the Lord (saith Mr. R.) given reason, and the faculty of discoursing? Is it to Peter or John? No, it's for and to the race of mankind, Lib. 2. p. 291.  
Ans. Ergo, God hath given the Keys to and for a single 
The Lord hath given the keys to the Catholic guides, as to the first & formal subject and to the Catholic integral visible Church, as to the object and end; not to the independent congregation, at M. H. saith.  congregation of 40 or 50 visible Saints; that is none of my Logic: but, Ergo, to the Catholic guides all of them, as to the first and formal subject, and to the Catholic visible Church, as for the principal end and adequate object. Here is plain enough expression, 1 Cor. 12. 28, God hath placed in the Church first Apostles, etc. Sure the Lord never meant to place Apostles, whose flock was all Nations, Mat. 28. 19, 20. as fixed members and pastors of your Independent flock of 40, which is no more countable for their doings to any on earth but to Christ only, in a juridical way, than the Pope.  
Mr. H. Sometime Mr. R. his expressions seem to intimate an O●cumonick Council, or a Representative Catholic Church, sometime a Catholic visible, as it is totum integrale, of an integral nature.  
Ans. Both these, with Protestant Divines, I own; the one, as the first subject, whether convened in a Synod, or scattered, I shall, God willing, declare; the other as the object and the end of the Keys.  
Mr. H. We say a congregation of visible Saints covenanting to walk in the Ordinances of the Gospel is the prime and original 
Pag. 219, 220.  subject of the power of the Keys; we understand it not of this or that individual congregation, as though they only had it, and none but they, and they had it firstly, and all of them; but because its a congregation of such. This is our Saviour's meaning, Mat. 16. I will build my Church, taking a visible congregation of visible covenanting believers, as that which is a pattern and sampler (as I may so speak) which leaves an impression upon all the particulars, as common to all, and is preserved in all.  
Ans. If the Church congregational as congregational, not as this or that congregation, be built on the Rock, than this or that congregation must of necessity be also built on the Rock. If man as man be rational, then so are all individual men, Peter, john, Anna; if the congregational Church as such, be built on the Rock, than this or that congregation, etc. must be built on the Rock. Quod conveni● 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, convenit 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. But this presently Mr. H. recals, This or that visible Church may, doth, and will fail. But this or that visible congregation partakes of the common nature of a congregational Church; and what reason this Church more than this should fall off the Rock, since the promise is made to the congregation in its common nature? then of necessity the Church must have the promise upon some other account than as the congregation in its common nature.  
Mr. H. Each particular congregation is complete and independent 
Pag. 221●  for the exercise of all acts and dispensations belonging to a congregation or Church, without any reference to any other congregation, because they are distinct species, which firstly and equally participate of the nature of the genus, or the general nature of the Church.  
Ans. 1. Then are there no clamours raised against you by 
M. cotton of the Keys, c. 6. p. 25.  those who say, It is most unjust that 10, or 30, or 40 should be an Independent Male▪ Judicature (as if others had no souls) countable only to Jesus Christ for their administration.  
2. By Mr. Cotton his true principles, they are not independent within themselves to exercise all acts belonging to a congregation; for Synods not only have power to give light and counsel in matters of truth and practice, but also to command and enjoin the things to be believed and done.  
1. If then the Synod hath a share of the Keys, the single congregation must be too narrow a first subject of the Keys, especially when the Synod as the Synod hath the power of the Keys to command the Churches as the Churches, and several congregations. 2. So the necessity of being circumcised or not circumcised, if we would be saved, Act. 15. must belong to a congregation, and to all the congregations of Anti●●h, of jerusalem, etc. then the Lord Jesus hath not given a power independent to any single congregation, to exercise all acts and all dispensations belonging to them: for sure they cannot determine in a matter belonging to other Churches, and more belonging to other Churches than to themselves, because of the multitude of concerned Churches, but they must no less impose upon the consciences of other Churches, if the same seem good to the holy Ghost, and to them only, (otherwise it's a bastard determination) then if they should determine it contrary to the knowledge of their own Church congregational, and members thereof.  
2. Mr. H. takes the word Congregation and Church for all one, against the Grammar of the holy Ghost, who taketh the 
The word (Church) is not taken by M. H. according to the Grammar of Scripture.  word Church even in the New Testament, for the collection of believers, agreeing in one Faith, one common Redemption▪ common Saviour, common hope of Glory, though they be 〈◊〉 a congregation that meets in one place, Eph. 5▪ 23, 25, 27, 29. & 1. 22. Col. 1 18. H●b▪ 12. 23.  
3. The reason why they are independent in the exercise of all acts and dispensations belonging to a Cong●…gation or Church, to wit, because they are distinct▪ species and Churches different in nature, is most frivolous; for beside, that the reason is false, except Christ the Head of one congregation be different in nature from the same Christ the Head of another congregation, and their Faith, Baptism, Hope of their calling, be different in nature; whereas they are all one in nature, in all the whole Catholic Body, Eph. 4. 3, 4, 5, 6, 1 Tim. 4. 10. Eph. 5. 23, 25, 29. judo ver. 9 1 Cor. 10. 17. They are as distinct species and Churches, different in nature, in regard of pastoral preaching, 
Way of the Churches of N. N. c. 1. sect. 1. pro. 1. p. 1, 2. I●… as unlawful to communicate in seals, and hearing pastoral preaching in another congregation than that which is proper to the member of an Independent congregation, as to submit to their Jurisdiction.  and partaking of the same seals, as the Brethren teach, (if any difference of this kind be) as they are different in nature in regard of censures; and so as it is unlawful, by their way, to one of this congregation to submit to the foreign and extrinsical Jurisdiction of other Churches, (as they call it) so it's as unlawful to submit to pastoral preaching, and the seals tendered by the foreign authority of other Churches, because if the Head Christ, and power juridical be peculiar to one congregation independently, so must pastoral preaching and the seals be to the same Church; and a member must be as much restricted to their own officers only for acts of office, since they are set over them by the holy Ghost, as our Brethren say, from Act. 20. 28. 1 Pet. 5 2. Philip. 2. 25. as they are to hear, Matth. 18. that Church only in acts of Jurisdiction. The Brethren are obliged to show a difference, or to yield to the Argument.  
Mr. H. A particular congregation is species specialissima, which 
Page 220.  hath in it the nature of the Churches in general, and of the species or kinds of Churches, are complete without the Class●s.  
Ans. Let the congregation be complete, as species specialissima 
All single congregations are complete only in some respect, but differ not in nature & specie among themselves.  in its kind, yet in extension of power it's not complete; for we hold, that Classis, Synods, Congregations, differ in nature, and that every one of them, yea the whole integral Catholic visible Church are all species specialissima; and Mr. R. grants they differ only in more or less extension of power: and therefore Jurisdiction is firstly in them all, as the heat is firstly in the whole body of the fire, not firstly in this or that quarter or portion of the Element.   

CHAP. II.  
The Arguments of Mr. R. for the first Adequate and Catholic subject of the Keys are vindicated from the unsatisfying replies of Mr. H.  
MR. H. The Apostles (saith Mr. R.) stand in the room of the whole Catholic ministerial guides, when they revealed the Keys.  
Ans. The Apostles in that commission were extraordinary persons sent to all the world to lay the foundation of the Gospel, by an Apostolic power; and in this sense they have no successors, nor stand in the room of any.  
Ans. If the Apostles represent none in this sense, Mat. 28. 19 Mark 16. 15. john 20. 21. Go and teach, etc. whose sins ye remit, etc. Then none succeed the Apostles to teach, baptise, remit, and retain sins; Pastors than must do these without a commission from Christ, or these ordinances must cease.  
2. Mat. 28. john 20. he sends the Apostles, and says, behold I am with you to the end of the world, in preaching and baptising. 
The Apostles Mat. 28. 19, 20 Joh. 20, 21, 22. When they received power to preach and baptise, did represent all ordinary teachers to the end of the world, or then ordinary teachers want all calling. Annot. of the English Divines, Mat. 28. 29. I'll uphold you and your Successors in the ministry at all times, without intermission. Calvin. in Locum. Usque ad consummationem] haec particula denotat non solis Apostolis esse dictum, quia non in unam aetatem, etc. Beza, alloquitur Ecclesiam.  But the▪ Apostles do not live to preach and baptise to the end of the world; Ergo, that ministerial presence of Christ must be promised to some represented by the Apostles. So the English Divines, Calvin, Beza, Diodati, as Apostles gifted with power of working miracles, etc. they represented none, nor had they any successors. So Mat. 28. the Pastors have the power of the Keys and of office given them, page 210.  
Mr. H. To that Church (saith Mr. R) hath Christ given, as 
Mr. H. c. 12. pa. 1. page 214. 225.  to the first subject, the ordinances and ministry, which he principally intended to perfect, to gather, and to bring to the unity of faith. But he principally intended to perfect, to gather, to bring to the unity of faith, by these ordinances and ministry, the whole Catholic visible Church, and secondarily this or that congregation.  
Ans. Mr. R. lib. 2. p. 248. professedly disputes for a Church invisible, to be the first subject of all ordinances, Christian privileges and officers.  
Ans. Mr. H. halfs my words, how Mr. R. makes the invisible Church such a first subject is abundantly declared.  
2. These are not to me contrary; for the Catholic visible Church, which the Lord intends and decrees to bring to glory▪ 
The Catholic integral visible Church which Christ intendsto save, and the Catholic integral invisible church are the same, and d●ffer but in accidents But M. H. his Church Catholic visible and invisible, in many persons, differ as Elect & Reprobate.  is both the invisible chosen, and really believing Church, the Church Mystical, and also the Church Catholic visible, fed by the visible and audible ministry of Apostles, Pastors, etc. only in that place I deny that body, Eph. 4. 12. to be visible in Mr H. his sense, as he makes his congregation visible, of which Magus and judas are members; and therefore Mr. H. in vain alleges, that those whom Christ purposes to bring to the unity of saith etc. Eph. 4. 11. are such who certainly shall be saved, and are true believers, and it is undeniable, ordinances and ministry in their saving fruits, are given firstly to true believers, if we regard the Lords intention, as I ever teach.  
Mr. H. Mr. R. teacheth that the intendment of Salvation, and the giving of Ordinances and Ministry keep not equal pace each with other. So the Arminians (saith he) teach lib 2 page 248. but that God doth intend principally to bring the whole Catholic visible Church, that consists of Elect and Reprobate, to the unity of the faith, &c, is false.  
Ans. Repeat my Argument as I frame it, and the flubble is blown away: To, and for that Church, as the subject and object and end, hath Christ given as to the first Church, the ordinances and ministry which he principally intends and decreet, to bring to the unity of faith, and to salvation:  
But he intends and decrees to bring to the unity of saith, and to salvation, by these means, only the whole Catholic visible Church, and that mystical Catholic body of itself invisible, but made visible by a calling and inviting ministry of Apostles, Pastors, &c, Eph. 4. 11, 12. for the Lord giveth for the loved world, john 3. 16. for the Catholic visible Church, sanctified by the word and baptism, Eph. 5. 25. for his sheep, john 10. 11. for all his scattered children, john 11. 52. for the whole world, 1 john 2. 1, 2. Christ and Apostles, Pastors, Ministry, Seals in their substance principally, and all these for this or that, or these real believers secondarily. Mr. H. leaves out these words of mine, first to, and for the Saints, and so perverts my Argument, and frames another of his own for mine, which I own not.  
9 If that proposition be utterly untrue, These whom Christ 
M●. H. must side with Arminians and Socinians, who ●ach that God intends to save many who are never saved. Remons. Syn. Do●drac. Art. 1. p. 7, 8. Remonstran. Confes. c. 9 Collatio Hagiens. p. 83, 84. corvin. contr. Tilen. p. 105, 106, 154, 398, 399. Episcop. disp. 9 Th. 5.  intends to bring to the unity of faith, are such certainly, as shall be saved: Then must Mr. H. side with Arminians, who say that grace is common to all, and that God by his antecedent will intends to save all without exception, Elect and Reprobate, but the Reprobate break that intention and decree of God. So the Arminians.  
3. Saith he, It is undeniable that Ordinances and Ministry are not given first to real believers.  
Ans. It is undeniable that Ordinances and Ministry are given first to real believers, upon a purpose and intention to save them, Eph. 4. 11, 12. and that all privileges of special note in the Mediator Christ, promises, ministry, seals in their fruit, are given according to God's gracious intention, to, and for only the invisible Church, as I demonstrate, and not to and for Mr. H. his visible congregation, whereof Magus is a member, and according to my principles, the intendment of salvation from God, and the giving of ordinances and ministry, first, according 
That is false that Mr. H. saith that the whole visible Church, Eph. 4. 11, 12, which Christ intends to bring to glory, doth consist of good and bad.  to that intendment: secondly, in their saving fruit, as Mr. R. demonstrates, go with equal pace.  
3. That God intends to bring the whole visible Church of real believers, to the unity of faith; for visible and invisible in my sense are not contrary, but the whole visible Church Catholic is both invisible, being known to God only, and visible also, being called by a visible and audible ministry, according to the purpose of God. As Paul, Rom. 8. 28. being a body perfected and gathered by the ministry of Apostles, Pastors, Eph. 4. 11, 12.  
And 4. It is undeniably false, which Mr. H. saith that the whole visible Church consists of good and bad, Elect and Reprobate; for this Catholic visible Church and body, Eph. 4. 22. Eph. 4. 11, 12. Colos. 1. 18. consists only of elect ones and real believers: but Mr. R. will not undertake. So much for Mr. H. his Catholic congregation, of which Magus and judas are visible Citizens: and such a Church is not the first and proper, 
Armin. Resp. ad art. 5. p. 102 Armin. Anti-Perkins p. 57 Remonst. Syn. Dordra. Art. 3. 4. p. 8, 9 16, 17 Remonst. conf. c. 17. sect. 2. Cat●ches. Ruttoviensis c. 6. pag 210.  and principal subject of ordinances, promises, seals, ministry in their saving fruits, except Mr. H. will side with Arminians and Socinians in this point; who teach that God intends grace and salvation to all, but many are not saved, and so the intention of God fails.  
Mr. H. But what is all this to the present controversy, that to the guides of the Catholic Church Christ hath committed the keys, as to the first subject: we argue thus.  
To that Church which Christ principally intends to bring to the unity of the faith, Christ hath given the power of the Keys, as to the first subject. But Christ doth not principally intend to bring to the unity of faith, etc. and to gather the ministry of the Catholic Church; therefore to the ministry of the Catholic Church hath he not given the Keys, as to the first subject.  
Ans. This is not to the controversy, concerning the first 
Due ●ight of Presb. c. 9 sect. 9 Pag. 242, 243.  subject of the Keys, nor did I bring it in upon that account, but the question is concerning the constitution of a visible Church, in which I deny that the visible congregation, o● our brethren's visible Church, of which judas and Magus are as essential members, and their Church acts as valid, as Peter and john the visibly and really believing Apostles are, or their Church acts are. I deny (I say) such a congregation to be the first subject of the styles, properties, privileges of special note, of promises, seals, officers in their saving fruits in the Lord's intention, and have demonstrated that the Catholic invisible Church is only the first, principal and proper subject of these, and that our brethren mistake the nature of the visible Church, I mean in all the dispute the integral Catholic visible Church militant: otherwise Divines take the Catholic Church, for these that have been, and now are glorified, and shall be, and are not yet born, and that now are; but none of the two former are capable subjects of the Keys.  
2. The proposition is not mine, nor the argument: the Keys are given (say I) to the guides of the Catholic visible Church, as to the formal subjectum, first and proper, and are exercised by them, by the consent of the people, men, or women; nor should any new act of Doctrine be passed, or weightier points of discipline in Assemblies, until the people hear of them, the keys are given to, and for the whole Catholic Church of believers, as the object and end, for the gathering them in to the unity of faith, Eph. 4. 11, 12. and as this visible Church falleth under the intention and decree of God to be saved, they are one and the same persons with the invisible Church, as the body of Christ, Eph. 4. & 12. is taken for both the invisible body.  
It is 2. taken more largely, as the Catholic visible body comprehends all that hear, and profess subjection to the Gospel, elect and reprobate, and the Lord gives a ministry, seals, and visible membership to all, and every one of this body; to Esau, to jacob, to judas the traitor, as to Peter a believer, not to bring all and every one of them to the unity of faith, and to the acknowledgement of the Son of God, but for other unlike ends, finibus disparibus, to save some, to make others inexcusable.  
Mr. H. If all ministerial power (saith Mr. R.) be given to a congregation (as our brethren say) under the name of a flock of redeemed 
Pag. 22●. ●17.  ones, as the body of Christ, Acts 20. 28. Colos. 1. 18. Then it belongs to the Catholic Church, for these titles agree first to the Catholic visible Church, Colossians 1. 18. Ephesians 1. 25, 26. 1 Tim. 3. 15. Eph. 2. 19, 20. and so they come to our hand.  
Ans. The Catholic Church admits of a threefold apprehension.  
1. As it implies a covenanting congregation of believers.  
2. As it represents the whole, ut totum representative, an Oecumenick Council.  
3. Ut totum integrale, as it is the whole Catholic Church spread all the world over, if Mr. R. mean the first, we agree, but the guides cannot be the first subject, for the Catholic Church, and the guides are different. The second part Mr. R. grants, that the ministerial power of the Keys is given to a congregation under the name of the flock, etc. Hence his cause must needs suffer shipwreck, that the Keys are given to the ministry of the Catholic Church.  
Ans. That the first member of your threefold apprehension hath any warrant in Scripture, or sound Divines, is a mere apprehension. I desire the Reader to consider the Catholic Church.  
A● 1. It implies a covenanting congregation of believers; 
The Catholic Church congregational is a new fancy, void of the word and all reason & unthority of Fathers, Doctors, Divines, etc.  give a warrant from Scripture, sound Reason, or Divines for that. The Catholic Church is the whole body militant on earth, excluding none; but a congregation of covenanting believers excludes all Churches on earth, except forty or fifty persons.  
2. The Catholic body organical of man, includes all the body and organs of it, head, eyes, mouth, tongue, feet, etc. Now what sense is here? the Catholic organical body of man admits of a threefold apprehension.  
1. It implies the congregation of five fingers combined in the hand, and the hand is predicated of this or that hand: and so is the Catholic body of the whole Catholic organic body of man. Or to come to a politic body, the Catholic body of England admits of a threefold apprehension.  
1. It implies the congregation of all the City of York covenanted together, and the City of York is the Catholic body of England, which is predicated and affirmed of this or that City of York. No man speaks so but only Mr. Hooker that I know. Since the world was, no man can say a single congregation, take it either in the common nature of a congregation of a 1000 or for this or that congregation, that a congregation is the Catholic Church, no more than the hand is the Catholic organical body of man.  
2. Mr. R. grants (saith he) that the ministerial power of the Keys is given to a Congregation under the name of a flock, etc.  
Answ. Read my words, if I deny not that, and speak only according to the grant and confession of our Brethren.  
2. Only hypothetically, if all power Ministerial be given to a congregation (by our brethren's confession) under the name of a flock of Redeemed ones, etc. then it belongs firstly to the Catholic Church, i. e. to the congregation, I never dreamt that a congregation was the Catholic Church, and I should be crazed in judgement if so I had spoken. And how 
How the Keys belong to the Catholic visible integral Church as to the object, and to the Catholic Ministry & officers as to the formal subject.  the Keys are given, or belong to the Catholic integral body as the object and final cause, to the Guides of the Catholic Church as the first formal subject, I often declare: and what shipwreck or breaking of board is here, let the Reader judge. I difference between the Ministers and the Catholic Church by this means: but that Mr. H. hath said not one word to my Arment. If power, privileges spiritual be given to the congregation as the redeemed flock and body of Christ; then must power and privileges be given first and principally to such a company to which these styles of The Redeemed of Christ, The Body of Christ agree first; but to be the redeemed of Christ, to be the body of Christ, to be his redeemed ones, agree first not to the Church of Ephesus, nor to any particular Church National, Provincial, Presbyterial, or Congregational, but to the whole Catholic Body, joh. 3. 16. & 10. 11. & 11. 52. 1 joh. 2. & 2. and when Christ is called the Head of the Body, Eph. 1. 22. Coloss. 1. 18. I shall judge him scarce worthy the name of a Divine. I cannot expound the places of a single congregation, 〈◊〉 Eph. 1. ●2. Col. 1. 18. the holy Ghost speaks of that Body, which is the fullness of him, who filleth all in all, Eph. 1. and of the Body of which Christ i● Head, as the first begotten of the dead, and of the whole body reconciled by the blood of the cross, if it be said, the congregation in its common nature is the first subject of the Keys, for it contains all the Catholic Church.  
Ans. It contains no women, aged children, servants, nor sojourners, nor dismembered visible Saints, and therefore the congregation Independent, in any sense is a narrow and impertinent subject of the Key; and this is shipwreck really to the cause of Mr. H. as for that, that the Church, Cant. 6. is a congregation, 
The Church that is one, Cant. 6. is not a congregation in any sense that can meet in one place.  in general, and that the Church is one there genere in kind, it's against the Text.  
1. The congregation is not one, but hath threescore Queens, fourscore Concubines, Virgins without number, who are integral parts of that one Catholic Church, ver. 8. but essential parts of a congregation, in any sense they are not, but Churches in nature different: If these were species, than every one of the threescore must be that one only Church, for genus praedicatur de specie. But it is sure that the innumerable Virgins, that is, believers, members of the Church, who with chaste love adhere to their only Husband Christ, Cant. 1 3. that is, such as are chosen and called of God (saith Ainsworth on the place) and 
Ainsworth contradicts M. H. Cant. 6.  faithful (whether whole Churches, as 2 Cor. 11. & 2. or particular persons) cannot be every one of them that one only Church Catholic, for then every single Church should be the only one Spouse of Christ, ver. 8, 9  
3. To that Church, I mean, for their salvation and good, hath Christ given the Keys, which is the complete Spouse of 
The congregation is not the complete Spouse to which Christ beareth an adequate relation of husband-love, as to his redeemed ones  Christ, and to which Christ bears the adequate and full relation of the love of Redemption, Eph. 5. 25. joh. 3. 16. 1 joh. 2. 1, 2. job. 10 11. of love of justifying and washing, Rev. 1. 5. & 5. 4, etc. But neither the congregation this or that, nor the congregation that exists ut genus in specie (a● most illogically Mr. H. says) is the complete Spouse of Christ, nor doth Christ bear the full and adequate relation of the love of Redemption, of Justification, Sanctification, to the congregation in any sense. For.  
1. This object of love takes not in the visible Saints sojourners, dismembers, as said is, to whom Christ bears a love as to chaste virgins.  
2. Nor is the love of God in choosing, effectual calling, justifying the ungodly; carrying them on to persevere to the end, terminated upon societies visible, as visible congregations, for so he should love all the Reprobates, judas, Magus, who are all visible Church-members: But its certain Christ loves none of these with that adequate love of Redemption, nor with marriage-love, as he doth his beloved Spouse, Cant. 4. 7, 8, 9, 10. & 6 4, 9, 10.  
3. Not is that love of Redemption terminated upon persons only upon the bare relation of Church-members, for Christ takes them not into the King's Chambers, Cant. 1. 4. to his banqueting house, Cant. 2. 4. nor draws he them after him by his powerful grace, Cant. 1. 4. joh. 6 44. nor blesses he, or embraces them, his left hand being under their head, and his right hand embracing them, Cant. 2. 6. nor doth God teach them, joh. 6. 45. nor engrave his Law in their heart, or give a heart of flesh, and a new heart, jer. 31. 33. Ezek. 11. 19 & 36 26, 27. only in the capacity of visible Church-members, for he bestows this love upon the Jailor, upon Saul, upon the Eunuch, and upon many thousands, before they profess as members; yea, and upon thousands in the bosom of the Church of Rome, who out of weakness (though that be their sin) dare not profess the Gospel: Then it must be false, that the nature of the Church, and of those spiritual privileges that belong to the congregation in general, or in this or this congregation; and that the relation of Christ as Husband, King. Head, Seeker of the lost, Good Shepherd, and of his Redeeming love, is broader than a visible congregation, in any sense Mr. Hooker shall take it, and is no ways commensurate thereunto. And so not one of my Arguments but stand in force.   

CHAP. III.  
Some further Considerations of the place Matth. 16.  
ANy sense, according to Mr. Hooker, can hardly be put upon 
The place Mat. 16. Upon this rock will I build my Church; and, The gates of hell, etc. is torn and abused by Mr. H.  that, Upon this Rock will I build my Church. For,  
1. The question is, Whether they do any thing to inchurch themselves upon the Rock; for sure they are active in professing, 2. In suiting membership, 3. In covenanting: Then must Magus and judas, by acting the part of hypocrites, build themselves upon the Rock. Wild Divinity again!  
2. Christ's act of building is either absolute or conditional: if absolute, then saith Christ, I inchurch you upon the Rock, whether ye believe or believe not; but Scripture never tells us of Peter, 
Chrysost. hom. 55. Matth. 16. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Hil. de Tri. l. 6. Aug. in Joh. 1. tract. 10. Christ's act of building men upon the Rock either absolute or conditional, cannot stand with Mr. H. his new gloss of Mat. 16.  or any built upon the Rock Christ, but by real sincere faith. If Peter's act of faith be conditional, the condition must be either sincere faith, or mere profession; if the former, we stand strong, Mr. H. is at a loss: for there is no promise of real union with the Rock, and perseverance, but to such as are living members in Christ, joh. 15. if the latter, then saith Christ, I I promise to you, Judas, Magus, real union with the Rock; or, Upon this faith, (saith Chrysostom; so Hilary, so Augustine) so you play the hypocrites egregiously, and seem to believe. Now this shall be non sense.  
3. It cannot be said, I promise to build all in a Churchway, so they believe sincerely. For,  
1. The ports of Hell and Satan should not prevail against persons to strip them of Church-membership, contrary to experience.  
2. The promise is made to persons that confess, as Peter; but many real believers and visible professors have been put to death, and are never made Church-members this way; and many real believers in the Church of Rome never profess, and many Church-members, and Churches of visible Saints are dissolved through persecution.  
Again, there is a name and room promised in the House of God, Isa. 56. but not upon condition of hypocritical, but real believing.  
Obj. judas was not made an Apostle upon condition of faith.  
Ans. True: a man may be made an officer, and his acts valid, and yet the man no sound believer.  
Q. Should a man be admitted a Church-officer who is not judged a real convert?  
Ans. The Scripture is sparing in submitting conversion or regeneration to the authoritative determination of men, yet the equivalent of this is said.  
1. If Timothy must commit the Word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to 
Officers must be visible Saints before they can be admitted.  faithful men, who are able to teach others, as 2 Tim. 2. 2. And if  
2. The Elders and Pastors which Titus is to admit, must be to his discerning, beside negatives, not selfwilled, not soon angry, etc. also lovers of good men, sober, just, holy, temperate, holding fast the faithful word, etc. Tit. 1. 5. compared with v. 7, 8, 9, 10. Then must the real holiness of officers be known to Timothy and to Titus.  
3. If the Apostle will have Timothy to try Bishops and Deacons also, and that experiencedly, that they be vigilant, sober, patient, grave, no novices, humble, holy, etc. the way that metals are tried in the fire, 1 Tim. 2. 1, 2, 3, etc. so the word is, Luke 14. 19 jam. 1. 12. 2 Cor. 13. 5. and will have him lay hands suddenly on no man, but deliberately, 1 Tim. 5. 21, 22. Then surely the Apostle supposes that they may be known to be such.  
4. If the Apostles do charge the multitude, who had no judicial authority to look out from among them, seven men of honest report, full of the holy Ghost, and of wisdom, Acts 6. 5. to be Deacons, than Luke supposes that that might be answered, We cannot know whether men have the holy Ghost or no. The second Book of Discipline of Scotland, cap. 3 pag. 81. The qualities in general requisite in all them who should bear charge in the Kirk, consist in soundness of Religion, and godliness of life, according as they are sufficiently for forth in the Word of God. Now it's not to be supposed, that in a Book of Church-policy, our Reformers speak of godliness that is invisible, and known to God only; and so the Acts of the Assembly of the Kirk 
Assembly at Glasgow, 1638.  of Scotland. And the cause of the sudden declining of the best Churches, and why Nazianzen complained so much of the corruption of Synods, as Sozomen, Theodores, Socrates, Ruffinus, Histor. Magdeburg. tell us, was, Because the Churches take not that care, that Ministers be savoury and gracious; from the Steersmen all Apostasy and rottenness begin. O if the Lord would arise and purge his House in Scotland! As for Church-members, they ought to be holy; and though all baptised be actu primo members, yet such as remain habitually ignorant after admonition, are to be cast out, and though they be not cast out certainly, as paralytic or rottened members cannot discharge the functions of life: So those that are scandalous, ignorant, malignant, unfound in the faith, lose their right of Suffrages in election of Officers, and are to be debarred from the Seals. Nor can we defend our sinsul practise in this: it were our wisdom to repent of our taking in the Malignant party, who shed the blood of the people of God, and obstructed the work of God, into places of Trust in the Church, State, and the Army, contrary to our Covenant, they continuing still Enemies.   

CHAP. IU.  
Of the Church-Representative, and its power.  
MR. H. We have dispatched the first member of the controversy, 
Survey, par. 1. c. 13. p. 229, 230.  That the power of the Keys doth not appertain to the Guides of the visible Church; take it as totum genericum, or universale.  
Ans. The first member is so dispatched, as the power of the Keys is by Mr. H. dispatched and banished out of its due seat and subject, and lodged in the congregation of redeemed visible Saints, sometimes only unofficed Brethren, sometimes the Church of visible Saints, confederate men and women.  
2. No man of ours (let him be named, if Mr. H. or any for him can name him) ever said, that the Keys appertain to the guides of the visible Church, taken as totum genericum & universale. For the Guides of the visible Church is, to all our Divines, the Guides of the Catholic Universal Church, made up as an interal Body of all Churches, National, Provincial, Presbyterial and Congregational all the earth over. And to make this integral Universal Body Genus, and the congregational Church Species, and Genus praedicatur de specie, is, as if this were our Logic, The Church of Boston is the whole integral Church of all the earth, made up of National, Provincial, Presbyterial Churches. A Monster!  
Mr. H. There be two things, wherein stand the qualifications of members that are Commissioners: 1. Gifts and fitness. 2. Delegation, which is the formale, as that they are sent by the Churches. The Churches, if they follow the pattern, must send, beside Pastors, Teachers and Elders, learned and holy men, that may personate and represent the whole Church. This is made the hinge and casting difference betwixt us and Papists, whereby our men vindicate the liberty and power of the Brethren, for all have definitive voices, not the Pope and his Proctors only.  
Ans. How can Mr. H. speak of a pattern of Oecumenick 
The unofficed Brethren are not by our Divines those that have a decisive voice in Counsels. A new question between us and Papists. Mr. H. par. 1. c. 13. p. 230. The paths to these general Counsels have been so long disused that they are almost grown out of sight, & as he sometimes speaks in a like case, the highways are unoccupied. Pag. 232. By the space of. 300 years after our Saviour, there was not the name of an Occumenick Council heard of in the world Whittaker cont. 3. q. 3. c. 1. de Concil. Nostra vero sententi● est non solos praelatos habere jus definiendi in Conciliis, sed homines quosvis idoneos (non ait laicos) eligi posse. Willet Synops. papis. cont. 3. gener. q. 3. p. 125. What an absurd saving is it— that the Bishop is the only Pastor. The Fathers of Basil. Who doubteth but the government of the Church is committed to others than only Apostles? Prof. Leyden in Synops. purio. Theolog. disp. 49. th'. 29. Verum tamen ab iis (Laicis pi●s) in publica hac act one consilium & a bi●…ium potius quam suffragium requiritur. Vid. th'. ●1. C●lvin l 4. Inst. 〈◊〉. 1. Romano pontifici & ejus satellitibus totum deferunt. Com. Act. 15. v 12. Plebis modestia h●nc colligitur, quod postquam Apostolis ac Reliquis Doctoribus j●…m ge misit, nunc quoque subscribit corum decreto, pastorum Tyranni● est excludere populum. B●…us loc 43. q. 21. Jus— Ecclesiis— conscio & comprobante grege. Vid. q. 23. Non exclusis L 〈◊〉. etc. T●en. Syntag. de Concil. disp. 1. q. 18. p. 619, 610. Qui solis Episcopis sententiae dictionem. vindica●…, iis tum Apostolici Concilii, Act. 15. 6. Tum Nicaeni & Constantinopolitaniss primi authoritate refelluntur— Neque negari potest quin de causa fidei ad omnes pertineat dicere qui prophetae sunt dono & vocatione, 1 Cor. 14, 32. See 〈◊〉. Theolog. Christian. 〈◊〉. 1. c. 28. Piscat. loc. 23. the 29. On the contrary are the Rhemist. on 1 Tim. 5. sect. 13. Bellarm. de Concil. lib. 1. c. 19 Cornel. à Lap. Lorinus, Act. 15.  Counsels, and claim kindred to our Divines against Papists? ●or Mr H. mocks such Counsels. 2. Mr. H. cannot name the man of our Divines, except Separatists, who draw nigher to Socinians and Arminians in these points, than to our Divines, who 1. Ever taught, that the male-Churches of a congregation, are the only Churches who send Commissioners to an Occumenick Council? which Mr. H. saith hath neither warrant in Scripture nor in Antiquity for 300 years after Christ. 2. The controversy between Papists and our men, was, Whether only Bishops soli Praelati, say Whittaker, Willet, Professors of Leyden, Calvin, Bucanus, Tilenus, Windelin, have a decisive voice, and ought not also Pastors, Doctors, Elders learned and holy, to have a decisive voice in Synods? And whether the people should be excluded from debating, reasoning, consenting; for Papists debar Laics as profane, and say, If such Beasts touch the Mountain, and meddle with holy things, they are to be thrust through with a dart. But Mr. H. his hinge of a question is, Whether only unofficed Brethren, members of the male congregation, are the only members of an Oecumenick Council, or with them officers, but as sent by those male-societies, otherwise they want the essential form of members, according to our Divines judgement? He is a great stranger in the Writings of our Divines, who so guesseth at a new question, though I judge Mr. H. hath read them diligently. See what the Jesuits of Rheims, Bellarmine, Cornel. à Lap. Lorinus and others, if ever they dream of such a hinge of a controversy.  
M. H. The representative body is but a part of the Catholic Church, not the whole of it, and represents the whole— what the commissioners do by their delegation, it is all one, as if the body did it; the Keys cannot then be firstly in it.  
Ans. It is a mistake wide enough, there is a twofold representing.  
1. The Apostles in receiving the Keys, Matth. 16. john 20, Matth. 28. represented all officers, even those not born, but they had no commission from unborn men. And so August. Serm. 13. de verbis domini. Chrysost. homil. 55. in Matth. 16. Hieronym. l. 1. contra. jovian. and our Divines, Calvin, Pareus, Luther, Melancthon, Willet, etc. say, that the Keys in Peter, who represented all the Apostles and faithful Pastors, were given to all Ministers. Now if Mr. R. say that the Keys were given first to this representative body Apostolic, let Mr. H. or any man beat him with strong arguments, and that is a good revenge.  
3. These whom the Churches, (not the male-congregations, as Mr. H. saith) send as Commissioners to a Synod, are not to be looked 
Mr. Cotton Key. Two sorts of Representatives not considered by, Mr. H. Commissioners neither carry the people's conscience to the Synod, not does their Commission give them a new office.  upon.  
As 1. If the Churches were resolved aforehand how far they will follow them; for why then (saith Mr. Cotton) do they send to the Synod for light and counsel?  
2. Neither as if they were sent to carry the faith and consciences to the Synod, and the people in and through them did teach Synodicè, and the people must follow their determination, be it right or wrong. And so it is a wide mistake, to say what Delegates do or say, it is all one, or the like reason (saith Mr. H.) as if the Represented did, or said it. For if the Synod say the Gospel is not the word of God, the Church did not say either personally (for that is impossible) or legally the same: only the Churches send them to pray & inquire the mind of God from his word, and engage they shall follow them, in as far as they follow Christ.  
Nor is delegation the formalis ratio of determining synodically, it is only a necessary condition of determining, and of synodical judging.  
Obj. But Mr. R. saith Amen to this distinction of Mr. Parker.  
Ans. True; these two, fitness and gifts, together with a commission, make a man a commissioner and messenger of the Church; but delegation makes him not a formal Definer and a Judge: nor do the Churches send them as officers, but as such eminently able and faithful men, who have hazarded their lives for the cause, as Act. 15. 25. and they determine as such eminently holy and able officers; their delegation is a thing of mere order, because all cannot be sent, nor doth it create them of new officers, nor yet such eminent officers, for they were both these before, only their delegation puts them in an actual orderly capacity to determine formally, Ut approximatio ligni aridi ad ignem non est formalis ratio comburendi.  
Mr. H. Mr. R. l. 1. p. 305. to 309. runs all upon this, the power 
Par. 1. p. 231, 232.  of the keyer, by order of nature, is only in the Catholic representative body: but the power of the Keys was before there was any Representative some 300. years, when there was no Oecumenick Council, and since the Churches give their power and officers to the Assembly, they had that power before the Assembly. 
Due Right of Presb. Keys of the King d. c. 7. p. 47, 48. The whole body of all church guides is the first subject of the power of the Keys in its latitude of that power, and the first subject of such a special power is a Synod.   
Ans. Read from c. 10. sect. 10. & p. 289. to p. 346, 347. where I speak of the Catholic Church. I say, only that such a synodical power of the Keys, as is dogmatic, especially for light and peace, as Mr. Cotton speaketh, is first by order of nature in the Oecumenick Council: the doubting and contending Churches cannot bind; Ecclesia dubitans non docet, Ecclesia errans non judicat, Ecclesia contendens non liga●n, on solvit, for the doubting, the erring, the contending of Churches are no ordinances of God, and erring and contending Churches cannot heal themselves; and therefore the healing power is seated by Christ's appointment in the synodical Church, which is more diffused and stronger, as is clear, when the Churches of Antioch and judea are broken, ren●and sick, the wisdom of God, Act 15. hath appointed that these should meet in a Synod of the select and choicest parts, Apostles and godly Elders; Ergo, the healing power of the Keys must be first in them.  
2. Mr. R. runs not, but ass●rts lently, that power of the keys in binding and losing, and in opening and shutting heaven in the latitude of preaching, and censures, Mat. 16. was not before Christ gave it to the Apostles, the then Representative of all the faithful guides to be in the Church christian to the world's end, and this grant was made to Peter and the Apostles, not as to such, private men, Simon, such fisher's, but by evidence of Scripture truth.  
2. The testimony of all sound Antiquity.  
3. The judgement of Protestant Divines.  
4. Canons of Counsels.  
5. The Doctrine of sounder ancient Schoolmen and Popish Doctors, Occam, Alen●is, Almain, Gerson, Bon●venture, etc. not only not 300. years after, but before Christ's death, and confirmed before his Ascension to heaven. That ever Mr. R. said that the power of the Keys in their latitude of binding and losing was in an Oecumenick Council, a Representative of formally sending Churches, and a body of formally sent Commissioners, is utterly denied, and no where to be seen in any book that ever he wrote.  
Such as cite him at random would remember (3) that I teach that the power of the Keys, 1. In its latitude is first given to the Apostles, Mat. 28. 19, 20. Mat. 16. 18, 19 john 20. 21, 22. Mark 16. 15. Act. 18. as the only then Catholic representative body, sustaining the person of all officers to the end of the world, and so the first formal subject of the power of the Keys in its latitude, is not either the congregation or congregational Eldership, nor the Presbytery, or Synod, all these are but parts, and to make a quarter, or a part of the body of the Sun, the first and adequate subject of light, and a quarter, or a part of the body of the Element of water the first and adequate subject of the cold and moistness, since these qualities are kindly in the rest of the quarters and parts of the body of the Sun, and the body of the Element, were bad Philosophy. So the adequate first complete formal subject of this power must be the integral Catholic body of the guides, as existing in their several Churches; for this power is as kindly and natively in the guides of this Church, as in the guides of that Church, and equally in all.  
2. The power of the Keys as this power synodical is considered either in the breadth of synodical power, and so to condemn 
A power synodical is but a part of the keys, and was not before a Synod had being.  Catholic errors and heresies is in an Oecumenick Council, and where the local distance of visible Churches is greater and wider, the external visible communion in being edified or scandalised is less, and less use there is of censures. A General Council being only necessary for the optimum esse, the most Catholic union and peace of the Catholic Church: & that such a Council is an ordinance of God Mr. Cot. proves from Act. 15.  
3. As the power is narrower, it becomes narrower than Ecumenical, and descends to National, to Provincial, to Presbyterial, to Congregational; and all these are parts only.  
4. Though the Churches send Officers to the Synod, and have some power of the Keys in their kind before the Synods have being; yet Mr. H. can hence conclude nothing of his purpose against me; for it follows not, Ergo, the male-congregations have the complete power of the Keys in its latitude, before the Synods have being; nor does it follow, that congregational 
Inferior churches confer not properly a superior power to the churches, ●…y have a synodical power by the institution of God, Act. 15.  Churches, or Presbyterial have that complete power, before Synods have being, nor do they confer (if we speak accurately) a synodical power of the Keys, they only send messengers who are materials of the Synod; but the synodical power is in its parts scattered in the Churches of the Province and Nation, as Immes of Gold in divers parts of the Earth; and the synodical power comes from the institution of Christ, who promises the holy Ghost, and fulfils his promise, as Mat. 28. 20. compared with Act. 15. 28. Nor can the scattered Churches bring forth of themselves any synodical power of the Keys when they are met in a Synod, the promise made to such as are gathered together in his name, does the business; and therefore that is soon blown away. It is impossible that a proper quality can be either in nature, or time, before its subject th● gives it being: but the power of the Keys was 300. years before there was any General Council in the world. For this proves only that some certain power, to wit, formally synodical, cannot be, until the Synod be.  
2. Grave Divines judge the Synod, Act. 15. to be a General Council; but though it were not so, it differs not in nature from a General Council, and so must partake of its natural qualities, as the natural properties of a man are in a same man. Now beside that, Christ gave the complete power of the Keys to the Apostles, be sent them as his Father sent him, as a Prophet to remit and retain sins, Joh. 20. to be a teaching and baptising ministry, Mat. 28 20. which he never gave to the unofficed 
To define in Counsels is an act of officers. Mr. Dickson, Expos. Mat. 28. v. 19 doct. 6. Par. I. p. 232, 233.  male-Church. Christ also appointed an Assembly with them in Galilee, and keeped it, Mat. 26. 32. Mat. 28. 16.  
Mr. H. To define in Counsels is no proper work in officers.  
5. For so saith D. Ames, no Pastor of the primitive Church, and few of the after ages should have fulfilled their Pastoral charge.  
2. That which is common ●o the Brethren is not proper to Pastors.  
3. Whitak. It's open popery to take it from Breath ●n.  
Ans. Ames is miscited, he states the question, whether only Bishops have decisive votes. Though it were proper to Bishops and Pastors, yet it may be (saith Ames) communicated 
Ames. Bellar. E●●rvat. To. 2. c. 2. An soli praelati majores, i. e. Episcopi habent jus suffragii ordinariè, ex privilegio & consuetudine etiam Cardinal. Abbates. Bellar. Affirmat nos negamus. Ames. To. 2. c. 〈◊〉. Th. 1. p. 4. Si esset proprium Episcoporum & Pastorum, nihil prohibet quin possit cum alii, Theologis praesertim Ministris 〈◊〉 Deo institutis communica●i. Calv. Act. 15 6. Gu●lth. Act. 15. 22. Calv. sic non enim dicit Lucas totam Ecclesiam congregata●, sed eos qui doctrinae & judicio pollebant, & qui ex ●atione officii hujus causae legitimi e●●nt Judices; fieri quidem o●est, ut coram plebe habita su●ri● disputatio: sed ne ad tractandam causam vulgus promiscuè fuisse admissum putemus: Lucas disertè Apostol os & Presbyteros nominat. Gualther. ibid. homil. 103. Non ita dominium & imperium sibi vindicarunt (Apostoli & Seniores) ut populum ab eorum cognitione excluderent ●ive arcerent, quae ex aequo ad totam Ecclesiam pertinebant— in populo modestia est— quod veritati omnes libenter cederent; haec Gualther. Bullinger. Act. 15. 6. convenerunt Apostoli] palam hoc loco Admonemur ad Apostolicos viros pertinere rerum ad fidem quaestionem. Bez●. Act. 15. 1●. Multitudin is autem nomine intellige non totam Ecclesiam utpote quaen●ndum esset tota Advocate, sed totum Apostolorum & Sensorum coetum, ut v. 6.— unde apparet quae sit yera legitimae & Apostolicae Synodi ratio, etc.  to other Ministers of God.  
2. It is not a Pastoral, but an Official act that we contend for.  
3. It is a poor question, for if learned godly men be chosen, if they be not Doctors and ruling Elders, they should be such.  
4. The Martyr hath a learned discourse, 1 King. 12. De Schism●te, and hath nothing of the question: but from Act. 15. he condemns Papists, who exclude Laics from Synods, for Constantine subscribed the sixth Synod, Basilius the eighth Synod; nor is it Popery, except Calvin maintain Popery, for he gives to the people consenting, to the Apostles and Elders judging: and so doth Gualther, nor doth Whitaker call it popery to seclude Laickes from defining, but ●rom speaking, discerning, consenting. I wonder that Mr. H. is so confident in this matter.  
Mr. H. Arg. 3. If the power of the Keys belong firstly to the Oecumenick Council, than it belongs to all others by virtue of that, risibility agrees first to man to Richard, John, not as these individual men, but as th●y have the nature of man: hence there can no power of the keys (as ordination, excommunication, &c) be put forth but by virtue of an Oecumenick Council giving in their influence first to that work; which is contrary to the evidence of Scripture, and the experience of all ages. The proposition is proved by the rule of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, if none have this power, but only this subject, than this power can go no farther than this, for this 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, require.  
Ans. 〈◊〉. Mr. H. wrongs the Reader, who sets not down my answer to this argument: for p. 299. I say, the power of the keys is not given to the Catholic Presbytery, as to the first subject, to be a mean of edification in an ordinary way but only in an extraordinary and occasional way in these things, wh●ch concern the power of jurisdiction belonging to the whole Catholic Church. By Extraordinary, 
How the whole body of Apostles, Evangelists, Pastors, Doctors, Elders are the first immediate subject of the whole power of the Keys.  I mean not that which is against, or above a particular law of God, but that which rarely falls out. Hence I never make an Ecumenical Council the first subject of the power of the Keys in its latitude, as man is the first only subject of risibility, the element of water of cold and heat, for so as only man is risible, and Peter visible for man's nature, so only an Oecume nick Council should firstly and principally excommunicate and ordain Ministers: but I say the just contrary of this, to wit, that an Oecumenick Council is only the first and principal subject of that synodical power, or of that certain power, or special power that belongs to an Oecumenick Synod formally convened as such, and so to this or that Ecumenical Council, because of the common nature of an Ecumenical Council.  
Yea, This special power of the Keys is but a part, or a certain kind and species of the power of the Keys in some rare and extraordinary things that belong to the Catholic Church. But we are now disputing of the first seat and subject of the power of the Keys in general, in the latitude of binding and losing, opening and shutting the gates of heaven by preaching and censures. And I deny expressly that an Oecumenick Council is the first subject of the power of the Keys in this general. And so Mr. H. fights with a shadow. Non concludit negatum. So my Simile is never touched by Mr. H. as pag. 305. The light is first in the whole body of the Sun, as the first and prime subject of light; yet supposing now the received opinion of Astronomers, that the Sun doth exceed the quantity of the Earth 167, it doth not follow, that this or that part of the Sun hath no light in it intrinsical, but that which is derived from the whole body of the Sun, for then this or that part of the Sun should have light derived to it (extrinsecally) from some other.  
Now the power of the Keys is in the whole Catholic Body of Apostles, Pastors, Doctors, Elders, all the world over, as they act respectively in Congregations, Presbyteries and Synods of all sorts, so that one part of the Catholic integral body of the Catholic Church, for example, hath not that power of the Keys due to them, derived from the Presbytery to the congregational Eldership, or from the Synod derived to the Presbytery, and so forth, by either ascending or descending: But when Christ gave the whole power of the Keys to the body of the Apostles, Mat. 28. 19 & 16. 19 joh. 20. 21, 22, 23 Mar. 16. 15. they were the Body Representative (I never call them an Oecumenick Council) and did immediately represent any Apostles to be chosen, Mathias, Paul, Evangelists, Pastors, Doctors, Elders, that were to be, even to the second coming of Christ, and he promiseth his Ministerial Spiritual presence to them all immediately, Mat. 28. 20 Go teach and baptise— lo, I am with you always, (administering Word, Seals, Censures, according to the Rule) even to the end of the world. Now the Apostles were not to live preaching and baptising to the end of the world, therefore the promise must be made to them all, though not yet born. Now we read not of deriving of any power to Synods, Presbyteries, Congregations, by mediation of Churches, for Christ instituted Synods, Mat. 28. 16. Act. 1. 12, 13, 14, etc. & 6. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. & 13. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. & 15. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, etc. and that immediately he instituted Presbyterial Churches, Act. 2. & 4. 9 & 5. 21, 42. and Churches congregational to meet in one place, 1 Cor. 11. 17. And as one part of the Element of water (suppose we make 24 parts of all) hath not natural moistness and cold from the other 20 parts, but hath it as intrinsically, without the intervening influence of the other twenty three parts, as they have: So the Presbyterial and Congregational Eldership have as primarily, intrinsically, immediately in their sphere and orb the Keys due to them, according to the proportion of the associated body, as the whole integral-Catholick Presbytery and Church hath, whether in an Oecumenick Council, or out of it.  
It is then a wide mistake in Mr. H. to tell us, If an Ecumenical Council be the first subject of the Keys, (as it is not) that there can be no act of power in ordaining of Ministers, in excommunicating of delinquents, but by virtue of an Ecumenical Council giving their influence first to that work. For if the meaning be (as it must be) that a General Council must prove an act, and put forth some actual Mandate, commanding such a man to be ordained an officer, such a delinquent to be excommunicate, else the Churches cannot proceed: for to take Mr H. his own comparison, Richard or joshua cannot be a man, or apt to laugh, except the abstract nature of man give in his influence to the work. And since Mr. H. and his Brethren make the male-congregation 
M. H. Survey, par. 1. c. 11. p. 186. Way of the Churches, c. 1. sect. 1. pro. 3. M. Cotton keys. c. 7. p. 31.  abstracted from this or that congregation, the first formal subject of the whole power of the Keys, what influence (I ask) doth the so abstract congregation give to the work of Ordination and Excommunication in a particular congregation? Abstracted natures do not send abroad mandates to all the congregations all the world over, before they can ordain, censure, or excommunicate. If it be said, this agrees to the nature of a congregation in general to ordain and excommunicate, but there needs no other actual influence of a command to come from the congregation in general to this individual congregation for their using of the Keys. True, there needs not, by the like, that any mandate pass from the Oecumenick Council in general, to this or that individual Oecumenick Council in the exercise of its Synodical acts.  
But (saith Mr. H.) if the Oecumenick Council be the first formal subject of the power of the Keys, then inferior Courts cannot ordain nor excommunicate without a warrant, and actual command from them.  
Ans. This is feeble: for beside that the Oecumenick Council 
Inferior courts may use the keys without any influence of a command from a general Council.  is not at all any such formal first subject, as is said, it's a naughty consequence; for though power of life and death be in King and Parliament as in the first subject, it follows not that an inferior Judge or free City cannot put to death notorious Traitors and Murderers all England over, without the influence of some actual Mandate from King and Parliament to the putting to death of every Traitor. So when Christ gave power of Word, Seals and Censures to the Apostles, as representing all officers, (say we) or as representing all believers (saith Mr. H.) it follows, that officers and the male-Church cannot administer Word, Seals, Censures, without the influence of a new actual command from the Apostles, who did represent all such to whom Jesus Christ gave the Keys, by this arguing of Mr. H.  
Nor does Mr. H. his first deduction follow, that if a General Council be such a subject (as it is not) that therefore the existing 
Though a general Council exist not, yet ●he use of the keys ceaseth not in inferior courts.  of such a Council is as necessary as the well-being of the Church. For a Parliamentary power is necessary for England, yet suppose by war, and other invincible impediments, a Parliament could not meet for divers years, yet neither power nor exercise of Justice do cease. So here Synodical power may be, and by the care of the Lord of his House, is continued in lesser Assemblies, though such Counsels exist not. But 2. the Antecedent being true, the Consequence is null.  
Nor is the power of the Keys in its latitude, as is said, either firstly or only, and so not perfectly in this Council, but firstly and intrinsically in the whole integral Presbytery all the earth over.  
Nor is it necessary that this General Council, though it were the first subject of the Keys, always attain all its end in the use of the Keys. For the male-Church void of Pastors cannot attain all its end, to wit, the pastoral preaching, the dogmatic and official sentencing of delinquents, the right tendering of the seals, yet is the male-Church the only formal subject of this power to Mr. H.  
Mr. R. said well, that a General Council can hardly excommunicate 
Hardly can a general Council excommunicate a National Church.  a whole National Church: for it could hardly be known to them, but many are not obstinate in the National Heresy and Scandal, who through weakness and fear of persecution dare not confess. And it's enough that a National Church may be declared to be no Church: as Moses removed the Tabernacle, and pitched it without the camp, Exod. 33. 7. and Paul turned away from the blaspheming Jews Acts. 13. 45, 46. and yet neither the one nor the other is the excommunicating of a National Church, for the word of the Covenant remained in the Nation of the Jews, after Paul and Barnabas turned from them, and preached to the Gentiles, jam. 1. 1. Heb. 1. 1. & 3. 6. & 10. 25. 1 Pet. 1 1. 1 joh. 1. 1. & 2. 1, 2. Nor is our brethren's new censure 
Non-communion of Churches, as our Brethren use it, is not warrantable.  of non communion of Churches so warrantable. For,  
1. The removing of the Candlestick seems to be a judgement inflicted only by Jesus Christ; and they who declare such a society to be no Church, must have the warrant of Christ going before, and really removing the Gospel. For if the Word, the contract of marriage, and seals, remain there in their substance, they can only (the profession thereof not ceasing) declare them an impure and corrupt Church, but not to be no Church.  
2. The doctrine or practice of a Church may be erroneous, hurtful 
See the paper of Accommodation at the Synod at Westminster, anno 1644. Sept. 13.  and destructive to holiness, as that of Pergamus and Thyatira, and they defend it; and yet remaining sound in other points, they cease not to be a people in covenant with God, and they cannot be declared no Church, and the Ministerial acts of baptising invalid, and to be reiterate, as is clear in the Church of the Jews, though Idolatrous, and in the Scribes and Pharisees, corrupt the same way in practice and doctrine, whom Christ commandeth to hear, Mat. 23. 1, 2. far more for a sinful act of Jurisdiction, leave they not off to be a Church.  
3. How can it be clear to a sister-Church, that there are not there, the Church being above a thousand, or many Churches, (for many Churches may be unchurched as well as one) a few names that out of weakness only are silent at the sinful doctrine and practice of the Church.  
4. It's hard to say the Church of Rome, in which there are the matrimonial Tables, the Old and New Testament, valid Baptism, and Salvation to a covenanted people by the fundamentals preached, is no Church, though communion with such a Whore be unlawful.  
Mr. H. If the Churches refuse the sentence of Excommunication 
Par. 1. c. 13. p. 234, 235.  inflicted by the Court Ecumenical, it can never prevail to attain its end.  
Ans. Ergo, its unlawful. It follows not, the Churches, the 
Excommunication attaineth not its end always; Ergo, is not lawful. M. H. so, Nor doth the Gospel ever attain its saving end; Ergo, it's not the Gospel.  person excommunicate refuse to abstain from the society of one excommunicate, and excommunication hardens and humbles not; Ergo, its unlawful: So the Gospel is the savour of death unto death, 2 Cor. 2. 16, a Rock of stumbling, 1 Pet. 2. 8. and prepared vengeance, 2 Cor. 10. 6. to some; Ergo, it's not the Word of God. Many such consequences have been drawn, to make Mr. R. his way odious to the godly. But I desire to contend for truth.  
Mr. H. To the Ministry and Catholic Guides of that visible Church, hath Christ committed the Keys as the first subject, to the which he hath given his Word, Ordinances, Sacraments, Ministry primarily. This is Mr. R. his in terminis determinate conclusion beyond all gainsaying. But to the Oecumenick Council, as the Representative of all Churches, God hath not primarily given his Ministry, Word, Sacraments, Ordinances; then an Oecumenick Representive Church hath not the Keys given to it as to the first subject. The Assumption only needs proof. 1. There was no such Council for 300 years after Christ. 2. Counsels consist primarily of Pastors and Elders; then must Ministers be sent to feed Ministers. 3. Word and Seals are not primarily attended in Counsels, but scanning of controversies.  
Ans. 1. I complain of unfaithful repeating of my words. The title is not of Oecumenick Counsels, but chap. 10. sect. 10. pag. 289. Of the communion of the visible catholic Church. To the Proposition I answer; To the Ministry and Guides of that Catholic visible Church hath Christ committed the Keys, as to the first subject, unto which he hath given his Word, Ordinances, Sacraments, Ministry primarily.  
This neither is conclusion nor principle of mine, but a same 
Mr. H. sorcer upon Mr. R. a proposition as a principle in terminis beyond gainsay, which was never in M. R. his mind nor book  and curtailed proposition of Mr. H. My words are these, cap. 10. sect. 10. pag. 289.  
To this Church catholic visible hath the Lord given a Ministry, and all his Ordinances of Word and Sacraments principally and primarily, and to the Ministry and Guides of this Catholic Church visible hath the Lord committed the Keys as to the first subject, and for the visible Church catholic, including also the invisible Church as for the object and end, hath he given his Ordinances and the power of his Keys; and the Ministry and Ordinances are not given to this or this congregation which meeteth ordinarily in one place. So the Proposition which I own from these words, must be this.  
To the Church catholic visible as to the first subject primarily, and as for the l●st end and object, hath the Lo●d given all his Ordinances, Word, Sacraments, Ministry. This is mine in terminis. And this also: To the Guides of this Catholic Church, not of a single congregation, hath the Lord committed the Keys as to the first formal subject, but for the Church catholic visible and invisible, as for the end and object, that they may be saved.  
But Mr. H, his proposition is not mine, he devised it himself, and its false, gainsaid by Mr. R. to wit, To the Guides of that catholic visible Church hath the Lord committed the Keys as to the first subject, unto which he hath given his Word, Ordinances, Sacraments, Ministry primarily. For,  
1. I know no Guides of any Church on earth, to whom the Lord hath given the Seals primarily, for God hath given the Seals primarily to his chosen people, to the Guides secondarily, as they are visible Saints.  
2. I know no Ministers of any Church to whom the Lord hath given the Ministry primarily: it's a senseless saying.  
3. I refer it to the Reader, if such a senseless proposition can be drawn from my words. The Catholic visible Church is neither the subject, nor first subject, but the object and end for which the Keys are given to the Ministers and whole Officers of the Catholic Church visible and invisible. Yea, I demonstrate by many Arguments, that believers are not the subject of the Keys. I say indeed, not the visible Church whereof Magus and judas are members, is the prime subject, but the invisible Church is in the Lord's intention such a subject of all Ordinances in their saving fruits: but then the first subject is all one with the object and end of God in Predestination.  
2. The Assumption is granted, but Mr. H. his probations are naught.  
1. There was no General Counsels the first 300 years after Christ.  
Ans. Mr. Simpson, and other grave Divines say, the Council 
Simpson, Cent. 1. c. 1.  at jerusalem, Act. 15. is more worthy the name of an Occumenick Council, than the Counsels of Nice, of Constantinople, of Ephesus, of Chalcedon.  
2. Such a Council is not the first subject of the Keys, but only of the Synodical Keys in such a General Council, of the Keys Catholic dispensed.  
3. The Apostles, the Representative of all the Guides of the Church, may well stand for a formal Council Occumenick.  
4. The long want of General Counsels, through providential 
The want of gen. Counsels through providential impediments proves not that they a●e not Ordinances. English Divin. on Host 3. 4. Diod. Host 3. 4. jun. Host 3. 4. Nam ex quo Israelitae in Assyrian fuerunt deportati per Shalmanasarem, id est, ab anno sexto Ezekiae ad Christum incarnatum fuerunt anni quasi sexcenti octoginta. Partus come. ib. Zanch▪ come. ib. Dissenting Brethren in their Reasons against Synods, 2 arg. p. 120. The same God that suits his providences to his institutions, would not have failed in what is the most sovereign remedy of all other, that it might have been existent in all ages, as we see his promise was to the Jews, to keep their land when the males thrice a year went up to the General Assembly at jerusalem.  impediments, can no more prove them to be no Ordinances of God jur● which ought to be, than if one should say, Circumcision, and the Passover, and Sacrifices, and an Ephod, are no Ordinances of God. For it is thought by the learned on Host 3 4. Israel was without a King, Sacrifice, Image, Teraphim, Ephod, from the sixth year of the Reign of Hezekiah, when Salmanasser carried away the ten Tribes, until Christ was crowned King, to wit, six hundred and seventy five years. See the English Divines, Diodati, junius, Pareus. Zanchins on the place: By this it shall follow, that Circumcision, the Sacrifices, Ephod then are no Ordinances of God, for if they were (say the Dissenting Brethren) institutions are suitable to providenoes. When ye go up to jerusalem, no man shall desire your land. Then if a General Council were an Ordinance of Christ, the Lord should suit his providence to a peaceable meeting of the Churches in a General Council. But so from the sixth year of the Reign of Hezekiah in Israel, Sacrifices, Priests, Ephods, the Kingly power shall be no Ordinances of God, for even till Christ these were not in Israel; and by this profession of the Gospel, and congregational Churches were not at all. And should not the Lord have framed the like providence, that professors of Christ meet in daylight in congregational assemblies? For as the Lord made a special typical promise, when the males go up thrice a year to jerusalem to worship, the Nations were not permitted of God to desire their land: So must the like promise of providence suiting with the profession of Christ be in the New Testament, the Heathen Emperors shall not desire your lives. Now the plain contrary providence is foretold by our Saviour, Mat. 10. 17, to 25. Luke 21. 12, to 18. joh. 16. 1, 2. and the Lord must, by this, fail against his Ordinance of professing Christ before men. When in the persecution of Flavius Domitian, 
Euseb. Eccles. hist. l. 5. c. 1. Bucolc. Index. Euseb. l. 2. c. 25. Epiphan. cont. haer. Tertul. de Cor. milit. in Apolo. Cairo, l. 3. Monar. 4. How lose that is, that providences must suit with institutions.  an. 96. of Trajan, an. 108, so many Martyrs were killed, as Eusebius saith; and Plinius 11. the Deputy was smitten in conscience with their number and patience. So multitudes suffered under Antonius Pius; and in the time of D●cius, an. 250. there was no congregation, no Eldership. Many suffered under Nero, many under Maximinus. So Euseb. l. 6. c. 28. under Valerian, an. 259. who killed Pastors and Professors; as Eusebius, l. 7. c. 10, 11, 12. especially godly Cyprian. Now sure the Lord had as sweet and comfortable a providence suiting with the glorifying of his Name, and advancing his Gospel by the death of so many Witnesses, as if he had suffered them to meet in congregations, to meet peaceably, none desiring to take away their life or land, as in Israel's day, for their meeting to serve God in congregations. And it's an overturning of the Ordinances of God in the New Testament, in which there is not given a land flowing with milk and honey, and a promise of a temporal typical providence, that they shall be free of persecution in following Church-duties, and public Worship congregational, which is not existent in all ages: Nor saith Mr. Ruthurfurd, that Ministers are given to Ministers primarily, but as they are members of the Body visible, and chosen of God, Ephes. 4.   

CHAP. V.  
Whether the Congregation as the Congregation doth excommunicate a delinquent? or is it the Catholic visible. Church which excommunicates?  
MR. R. his meaning is, that the congregation excommunicateth 
The Catholic Church excommunicates antecedently, when a particular Church excommunicates: but the Catholic Church hath not, nor putteth forth a deliberate act of citing, accusing, condemning before the particular Church act any.  not as a congregation, by a power which by order of nature is first in itself, but by a power which by nature is first in the whole Eldership; but yet not by an act coming from the privity, knowledge and conscience of all the whole Catholic Body of Officers all the world over. And so I grant, that the Catholic visible Church doth not anteced ntly excommunicate, leading witnesses, and summoning, and accusing, and sentencing the person before the congregation; as when Norwich puts a Traitor to death, the State of England by the Law common to all England, in and by Norwich putteth the man to death: Nor doth Norwich as a single Corporation (though neither simply as a Representative) but acting as a part of the Body of England. And the whole State doth this antecedently:  
1. Because the City doth this by the same power of Law common to all England: quae sunt communi●ra sunt priora.  
2. Norwich puts this Traitor to death, not as an enemy to that single Corporation only, but as a common enemy to the whole Kingdom.  
3. The City doth this by an innate power, as an integral part of England, for the peace and safety of the whole Kingdom: yet doth not the whole Kingdom knowingly exercise an act of deliberate judicial authority in this; for the man is put to death without the privity and knowledge of the whole Kingdom.  
I used the comparison (to cousin the inconsiderate Reader (saith Mr. H.) I hate cozening) The left hand cuts off the finger of the right hand lest it infect with a Gangrene the whole body, acted by the natural instinct, and innate desire of self. safety, which is in the whole man. But (saith Mr. H.) the chief officers are not at the mind and will, and the other Churches as the whole man: but the rest of the brethren are as the whole man, who have an intrinsical power for the safety of the whole congregation, to cut off an an infectious member.  
Ans. Nor is the comparison to be strained; I shall only desire it to be taken as Mr. H. saith. It's true, the left hand doth not cut off the contagious finger, but the whole man, deliberate will and reason consenting thereunto; and the finger is cut off, not by the power of the left hand only, but the intrinsical power of the body.  
And it is so exactly in a particular congregation, the chief officers, as the mind and will, and the rest of the Brethren as the whole, have an intrinsical power from Christ to remove an infectious member.  
Ans. They have a power to remove him (saith Mr. R. in his 
The comparison of cutting off an infectious member from the whole Catholic visible Church, is strained by M. H.  comparison) not from that congregation only, but from the whole Catholic Body: As the left hand cuts off the contagious finger, not from the right hand only, but from the whole body. It wrongeth Christ to say, he hath given so selfy and narrow a power, to liberate only a body of 10 or 20 Independent members from the contagion of scandal, but not to free five thousand, and the associate bodies round about: Let them perish, Christ hath given no Organic or Church-care to the congregation toward them all (saith Mr. H.)  
2. The comparison is not exact. When the fraternity excommunicates all their officers, where is the mind and will then? for they excommunicate their own mind and will.  
3. Mr. R. never meant the comparison should hold in this, That the Catholic Church, as mind and will, should put forth acts of deliberate reason— antecedently to cite, accuse, sentence every delinquent in an Oecumenick Council, or some Catholic Judicature, and to excommunicate all Delinquents, before ever the congregation cite them. With divers arguments he refutes an antecedent excommunication, as if I held any such thing. So Mr. H. loves to prove strongly what Mr. R. never denied.  
But Mr. H. speaks nothing to my Argument, if the m●n be cast out, and bound on earth, he must be bound only on that tract of earth where twenty Independents are.  
But 1. Church binding in heaven, and the guiltiness of the scandal is alike in all places, and often more infectious to others, if it be a taking heresy, then to their own congregation.  
2. Who shall persuade that our Saviour's sense is so hampered? Let him be to thee as an heathen, Mat. 18. 17. as thee only, who art a member of the congregation whereof he is a member; yea, as touching Church binding, neither is he a known guiltless visible Saint to all Churches on earth. It is nothing but a naked evasion to say he is consequently cut off from right to ordinances in all other congregations, for because one species of corporations hath condemned a man (saith Mr. H. page 236.) it follows not, that therefore all have condemned him to imprisonment perpetual, or the like.  
Ans. Yea, what one City doth in punishing a Malefactor by Law power, common to all England, that same all England 
He who is excommunicate in one Church is antecedently excommunicate in all.  doth in law: for twenty Sons have by the same Law and Authority of the Father's right of twenty Tables of twenty Families of the Father. One is for sedition against his Father cast out of one Family, whereof he is a fixed member; the other nineteen, though they know nothing of the fact, and do never actually cite him, yet do legally, and by the Law, and the same very will of the Father, that ruleth them all, cast him antecedently out, or concomitanter; or then another Law must appoint the other nineteen Families to cast him out. So the same right idem numero, that Peter hath to Christ and Ordinances in one Church, he hath it in all; and that same act of the Keys administered according to the rule of the Word, in one Church removing that right, removeth it from him all the World over.  
3. Visible Saints by this shall not be the same spiritually politic body, visible, being of divers congregations: contrary to Scripture, expounded by Mr. H. and Mr. Cotton, we being many are one body visible, and visible of twenty congregations, partaking 
1 Cor. 10. 17. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Excommunication by consequence is no excommunication at all.  of one bread and body of Christ. Now by this, as a finger cut off Paul, is not a finger cut off john, for john hath all his ten fingers entire, and Paul hath his nine fingers only: So also if Thomas disobedient he cast out of only his own congregation, he is never cast out of Church-right to Christ, and ordinances in the rest of the congregations; for excommunication by consequence, is only a declaring by witnesses (as Mr. H. saith pag. 242.) that the man is cast out of his own congregation. Now the declaring that Paul's finger is cut off, is not a cutting off of his finger, that is impossible. Far less is it possible, that the declaring that Paul's finger is cut off, can be either a declaring that Peter's finger is cut off, or that that declaring is a cutting off of Paul's finger, or a cutting off of Peter's finger. Therefore Peter's being cast one of his own Church-right, and Church only, is no casting of him out of other Churches, or real removing of his Church-right to ordinances in other Churches. For that which was never really removed, and Peter once had, it must remain with Peter yet: now Peter was never a member of any congregation but of one; then membership to another congregation cannot be taken from him.  
4. A member is cast out as really scandalous; his adultery obstinately continued in makes him be deprived of Christian fellowship with Brethren as Brethren: Ergo, he is deprived of the Christian fellowship of all Brethren. For 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 followeth upon 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  
And 5. It is thus confirmed; his visible scandal is a Church-offence to one of a Sister-congregation, and is apt to bring a Church-contagion to these of another congregation, who are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, one body with him at the Lords Table; and therefore are they now to look on him as an Heathen. But who put him in that state, if he be not really and formally cast out 
A strange exposition of that, he that heareth you heareth me; which follows from Mr. H. his way.  of that body, when his own Church excommunicates him?  
6. He that hears not the Church, hears not Christ, and he that despiseth any Pastor sent in the name of Christ, despiseth Christ, Mat. 10. 4. Luke 10. 16. john 13. 20. Now if this stand good, one that despiseth his own Pastor only, and his own congregation only, though he despise all the godly Prophets, Pastors, and soundest Churches on earth, despiseth not Christ nor his Father that sent him; nor is he first in foro Dei, bound in Heaven, and guilty before God, nor deserves he to be excommunicate, for he hath not failed against that, He that despiseth you despiseth me. For that is true only when any despiseth their own Pastor, or their own congregation. And if so, then when one is cast out, and judgeth an heathen for not hearing of his own Church, he is not heathen in Heaven, and in foro Dei, as touching his communion with other Pastors and other congregations.  
7. Peter before he was excommunicated, had a real right to the Lords Table in all Churches on earth, and so a sort of membership and visible communion with all these Churches. Now if by the act of excommunication in his own Church, this right be not taken from him, then must it be taken from him by all the Churches: and so all the Churches must excommunicate when one excommunicates: and by the like, all must admit one into membership, when one admits into membership.  
Mr. H. The Sister Churches (Mr. R.) receive members of other Churches to communion, by an intrinsical Church power.  
Ans. By an authoritative Church power we can enjoin our own members to come to the seals, or else censure them; but we cannot so deal with others, if it shall seem good to them to refuse.  
Ans. This only follows, that the congregation hath a larger Church power over their own members, both to censure them, if they come not, and positively to admit them, if they come: but Mr. H. must confess that the congregation admits strangers of other congregations, by a mere private p●wer, and by no Church power, which is gross Erastianisme, and makes it arbitrary to one single Pastor to admit some to the communion, as he pleaseth, and some not.  
2. By no Church power is the Sacrament tendered to strangers of another congregation; so may the Minister give this 
Mr. H. allows of private Communions.  seal to a stranger in his chamber, which is a private communion, for there is no authoritative Church power required to give it to some. Whereas Paul saith, it is a privilege of the Church, coming together to eat the Lords Body, 1 Cor. 11. 17, 18, 21. 1 Cor. 10. 17.  
3. This Supper must be given to our own Church members by Church authority; to strangers by no Church authority.  
4. It is by accident that the congregation cannot compel strangers to come to this seal, for in Collegio the Elders of the congregation may jointly with the rest of the Presbytery censure these of another flock, who altogether refuse the seals.  
5. Mr. H. grants that a congregation excommunicates in the 
Page 240.  general nature of a congregation. Well then, the general nature discourseth in man; and so doth a Church in an Island excommunicate; Ergo, that Church proceeding according to the rule of Christ, casts the man formally out of all the congregations on earth.  
Mr. H. addeth, yea the neighbour Churches are (saith Mr. R.) to 
Page 241, 242.  exercise the punishment of avoiding the excommunicate person as an heathen, which follows from a power which is no ways in them; what conscience is here?  
Ans. A good conscience, if we may carry ourselves to a scandalous m●n so declared by two or three witnesses, as we avoid his company; far more upon the testimony of a whole Church, are we to avoid his company.  
Ans. Then nothing is left to the neighbour Churches, but is he excommunicate or not, by one only congregation, they had no hand in it, only they must believe the man is rightly cast out, upon the word of five or six of the male-Church, who are both Judge and Party. This is what I said. A declararation of Excommunication is no Excommunication. And then must the congregations about with the mere judgement of discretion, which women have, eschew the man as a Pagan.  
Obj. By Mr. R. his way, you have the testimony of the Church only which did excommunicate?  
Ans. Yea, place is left to many Churches and Synods to judge: this is another matter, than four of the male-Church that are both Judge and Party, who declare he is cast out.  
Mr. H. One classical Church excommunicates not antecedenter. But a man in the confines of two Presbyteries is excommunicated by the Presbytery only of which he is a member, saith Mr. R.  
Ans. What ropes can tie the consequent with the antecedent? What Mr. R. hath said of the antecedent excommunication of the Catholic Church, is plain by the former discussion.   

CHAP. VI  
Whether there be a whole Catholic integral visible Church?  
MR. H. The Catholic Church hath sometimes such a respect a●s totum integrate, an whole integral Catholic Church. So A●es.  
Ans. D. Ames maintains that there is not only such a respect, but that there is a Catholic integral Church; and he 
Survey par. 1. c. 14. p. 243. Aims Medul. l. 1. c. 32. Thes. 5. Ecclesia igitur particularis respectu commanis illius naturae quae in omnibus particularibus Ecclesiis reperitu, est species Ecclesiae in genere, sed respectu Ecclesiae Catholicae, quae habet rationem integri, est totum ex aggregatione variorum membroru●●ingularium compositum, at que adeo respectu ipsorum est integrum.  never dreamt, nor any learned man of Mr. H. his Catholic Church affirmed of this or that congregation, and is as much as to say, Norwich is Catholic England. The Catholic Church of Angels and men in all ages, all times, all places, is not that integral Catholic visible Church which we make the subject of the Keys.  
But this integral Church militant, as existing in divers ages, is 
That there is a Catholic integral militant Church.  before the congregation in the Lord's intention, as the Lord intends the organic body of man, and not a hand only; and a complete world, not a nation, not a City only; so his design is not for this or that congregation, but for a world of visible Churches, a whole seed, a willing people, Psal. 110. who is flowing to the mountain of the Lords house, Isa. 1. 1, 2. his flock and scattered sons, Isa. 9 7. under the government of Christ by the Word, Seals, Censures, Luk. 1. 32, 33. make them in their times, and places, all the world over, visible by profession, calling, gathering, feeding, jer. 33. 31, 32. Zech. 8. 6, 7, 8. Psal. 2. 8, 9 Psal 72. 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, etc. Rev. 11. 15. Psal 22. 27, 28. john 15. 52. And the congregations come in here as secondary parts and parcels of Christ's great visible flock. Mr. H. denies this, and it is, as if a man would say there be two hands, ten fingers, two feet, head, eyes, ears, etc. but should deny there is an whole organic body; or as one should yield there are rivers, floods, fountains, seas, but deny there is such a thing as the integral element of water.  
2. This integral militant body is before the congregation, in 
Arg. 2.  the relation of a Spouse that hath breasts, and brings ●orth children, Isa. 54 1, 2. Cant. 3. 4. Cant. 4. 1, 2, 3, 4 Cant. 6. 4, 5, 6, 7 etc. in the relation of a body wrought upon by a Ministry, Eph. 4. 11, 12, 13. 1 Cor. 12. 12, 13, 14, 15. the congregation is but his Spouse and body secondarily, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Some congregation of seven or ten, where all may be of the stamp of judas and Magus, is abusively called the Spouse.  
3. In duration and stability, there is a Church gifted with a 
Arg. 3.  Ministry, having the Keys of the Kingdom built upon the rock, against which the gates of Hell shall not prevail, Mat. 16. 17, 18, 19 enduring as the days of Heaven, which is so as the object of our faith, Isa. 59 21. Psal. 89. 28, 29 etc. jer. 31, 32, 33, etc. they are also a visible sheepfold of Jews and Gentiles, john 10. 16. the building of God, the planting of the Lord, Isa. 61. 3, 4, 5, 6. Mich 7. 14, 15. & 5. 4, 7, 8. and the congregations little companies in mount Zion.  
4. There is a Church integral militant, visible, and in its 
Arg. 4.  choicest part invisible, to whom as the subject, and for whom, as the end and object, are given the covenant, word, promises of life, ministry, seals, censures, in their saving fruits, as before is said, jer. 31. 31, 32, etc. jer. 32. 38, 39, 40. Psal. 132. 11, etc. these in an inferior way the congregations have and enjoy.  
5. The whole and complete work of the spirit in the Ministry 
Arg. 5.  and Word, is terminated upon the Catholic integral militant body. Isa. 5. 20, 21. Eph. 5. 25, 26, 27, etc. and the congregation hath the waterings thereof in a lower way.  
Mr. H. You cannot demonstrate out of Scripture, that there is 
Pag. 244, 245.  such a thing in the New Testament as a Catholic visible Church. Mr. R. saith the subject, 1 Cor. 12. 28. is a Catholic visible Church, not a politic body under one head, the Pope; but the Catholic body of Christ mystical, as visible.  
Ans. The Catholic invisible body as visible, I conceive not; to consider a body invisible as visible, is a contradiction, as if a man would say, I consider whiteness as blackness.  
Ans. 1 Cor. 12. is neither meant of a politic body, under the Pope. 
Arg. 6.   
2. Nor a General Council:  
3. Nor of a Catholic visible body, that meet in the same place. Such is not found under the new Testament, whence he must mean that under the Old Testament. There was a Catholic 
Way of the Church of N. 〈◊〉. c: 1. sect. 1. p. 1, 2.  visible Church of the Jews that meets in the same place at one time, as the Brethren take a visible Church, which is impossible to be demonstrate in either Old or New Testament.  
2. Mr. H. hath from me no such expression, as to consider 
Mr. H. supposeth by no Logic, that the same body of Christ cannot be both invisible, and in another respect visible.  an invisible body as visible, though it be no contradiction, as is blackness and whiteness in abstracto. If Mr. R. had said, visibleness may be considered as invisibleness, Mr. H. should have better Logic; why is it a contradiction? The mystical body in common (saith he) is the invisible body. True, and the mystical body is both invisible, being the really chosen of God, and the object of our faith, and the same invisible Church which shall be presented without spot or wrinkle before the Lord, Eph. 5. 27. and the same Church and body is sanctified by the Word, preached and professed, and washed with Water in Baptism, v. 26. and so visible. And Eph. 4. the body which shall come to the unity of faith, and to the perfect man, the Stature of Christ, Eph. 4. 13. is the mystical, and savingly believing body, and so invisible; & also the body of Christ gathered by the ministry visible, and edified by the word preached and professed, is v. 12. the same body, and must be visible, for Apostles & Pastors preach to the visible Church. A child in Logic can conceive, the same politic body savingly believing to be invisible, and also savingly professing what they believe to be visible. So the twelve Apostles, Act. 6. are both real, and so invisible believers, as no man doubts (judas being in his place) and the Scripture in it, Mat. 19 27, 28, 29. Luke 12. 32. Luke 22. 28, 29, 30. and he is not worthy to be refuted, who denies the same twelve Apostles in another respect to be visible professors, visible preachers of the Gospel. So Peter, as touching his soul, is invisible and immortal, as touching his body, visible and mortal. I cannot help it, that Mr. H. conceives this to be a contradiction. I observe (saith he) that Mr. R. puts visible in an equal latitude with mystical.  
Ans. Add to the observation, that in this I take not visible 
What way M. R. puts visible in an equal latitude with mystical, what way not.  for Mr. H. his visibility, which agreeth to Magus and judas; but that sincere and honest visible profession, that for the most part is in the Catholic integral militant redeemed body, and mystical, well near of an equal breadth and latitude. Not but that there may be, and are many believers members of the mystical body, who have little or no visible profession. But it is enough to assert as truth, that one and the same body is both invisible, mystical, and the saved body, and also visible, and clothed with a real sincere profession; and that both these agree to the Catholic integral militant Church. Though I deny not, but that there be many hypocrites in this great body, whose ministerial acts are valid. But the Catholic visible Church in that latitude is not then both subject, object, and intended end of all Ordinances. And I speak now of it.  
Mr. H. I cannot think that Mr. R. takes the Catholic Church for the whole integral body.  
Ans. It is mistaking charity of me. Mr. H. that Church is meant 1 Cor. 12. in which God sets teachers, helps, ordinary officers, firstly, v. 28. But God sets not such in the integral body; for they are set by the election of the people in particular congregations, Acts 14. 23. & 6. 5. Tit. 1. 5.  
Ans. This is my own argument, but not rightly form; that Church is here meant, in which the Lord hath respectively placed first Apostles— and Teachers, both Extraordinary and Ordinary Officers. But God hath not set Apostles fixedly and firstly over congregations, they being organs of the Catholic integral body, and are sent to preach to Heathen (who after were Churches. As it is said, jacob served for a Wife, to be married, not married as yet) who could not choose the Apostles as their pastors.  
2. Workers of miracles were not chosen by a single congregation, no● such as had the gift of Tongues, 1 Cor. 14. 22. Tongues are for a sign to them that believe, not to them that believe 
Calvin. B●za in loc. Pareus. Pet. Martyr. Nec Corinthii cum ●ideles (professione, non Ethnici) essent, dono linguarum indigebant. Piscator. English Divines. Diodati in loc. Estius in loc. Cajetan. Page 186. A congregation only cannot be meant 1 Cor. 12. 28. but also the Catholic integral militant Church.  not. See the Divines on the place. Miracles and Tongues were to persuade unbelievers, and were not firstly set to congregations, nor could have any imaginable election and call from them.  
3. The places, as elsewhere is said, prove not any thing to the point.  
Mr. H. Arg. 2. In what Church Pastors are firstly set over them, they have firstly and primarily pastoral power in dispencing acts of ruling and preaching: But ordinary Teachers have not this over the Catholic visible Church. Congregations may justly refuse to hear other Teachers than their own; but their own may preach to them, though they refuse to hear.  
Ans. Every word is censurable. 1. Apostles were 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, firstly both in regard of dignity of Office, and of Apostolic Universality, sent to all Nations to preach, not to a single congregation to exercise pastoral acts firstly over it, as fixed Pastors.  
2. By a catholic Church Mr: H. means (sed suis musis solus canit) a congregation. Now if the Apostles be firstly set in the congregation in general, they must be secondarily set in this individual congregation; then must the ordinary Teacher be set before the Apostle, who was often his sender, in the individual congregation.  
3. The Proposition is false: A pastor may tender the Lords Supper to hundreds of a sister-congregation; but Mr. H. I hope, will not say that a pastor is set over, and firstly over hundreds of another congregation. The Antecedent and consequence are both Mr. hooker's.  
4. It's false that ordinary Teachers have not power to exercise pastoral acts to those of other congregations. Nor is it proved, they cannot exercise pastoral acts over them, because they cannot censure them. It's an illogical consequence, ordinary to Mr. H. The Apostles, both as Apostles, by miracles and the gift of Tongues, plant Churches among the Heathen, and as pastors they exercise ordinary pastoral acts to the Heathen, in 
Pastor's may exercise pastoral acts toward many whom they cannot censure or excommunicate.  planting and preaching the Gospel to them, but they could not draw out Church-censures against the Heathen, yet remaining Heathen, because of the incapacity of the object, they could not cast them out who were not yet within: 1 Cor. 5. 12, 13. but this they could not do not through want of pastoral power over them.  
5. It's false, that other Churches may justly refuse to hear other Teachers than their own: For if their own be sick and dead, or if other Teachers have an earnest suit and desire from their own officers and some one of the congregation, they most unjustly refuse to hear, and come under the guilt of despising Christ in despising his Messengers, as Mat. 10. 40. Luke 10. 16. joh. 13 20. except the sense be, He that receiveth not his own congregational pastor, receiveth not me, otherwise not. A strange and new sense!  
6. If the flock refuse all their own pastors to hear them, as being ravening Wolves, they unpastor them, and recall the official being, which our Brethren say they gave them in election, and so unjustly refuse to hear them; and they cannot justly preach to them, who so refuse to hear, for they justly refuse, a● Mr. H. teacheth.  
Mr. H. God must either (saith Mr. H) have pl●●ed in all the 
Par. 1. p. 247, 248.  Church Catholic, Apostles, Teachers, which we say, or then in some part of it only. And what is that part which is excepted? Surely he intends not salvation to that part of the Church in the which he sets no Teachers.  
Ans. At the common nature of a Corporation exists in all corporations; so the congregation-nature exists in this or this congregation— So if the nature of a Corporation be common to all, and the King hath set Major and Common-council in all and every Town: Therefore the Major of one Town may rule in another. So all States set Generals, Colonels, Captains in the Army. The King sets Constables in all towns, Sheriffs in all counties: Because Constables are common to all towns, therefore a Constable may exercise his office in another town.  
Ans. 1. The Argument must run thus: As the King hath set in England the Lord Keeper of the Great Seal, the Lord Chief Justice, the Sheriff, the Constable in every County and 
Though the rulers of one City cannot fixedly govern in another, yet it's not consequent, therefore a Pastor cannot act as a Pastor in divers Churches.  Town; so hath God set in his Church, that is, in the congregation, first Apostles, secondarily Prophets, thirdly Teachers, after that miracles, than gifts of healings, etc. But the King hath set in England the Lord Keeper, the Lord Chief Justice, the Constable in every County, in every Town, how many Great Seals, how many Lords of Chief Justice should then be in England? And do not our ●ound Divines condemn in Papists the Argument from civil Government, and honour due to persons in the point of the government of God's House, and of adoring of God in Images? He is a stranger to Bellarmine, Valentia, Suarez, Vasquez, Tanerus, etc. and to our Divines, Reynold, Chamier, Calvin, Bucanus, Tilenus, Daneus, Chemnitius, Luther, etc. who knows not this.  
2. Neither major Proposition nor Assumption have any truth: for hath God set the Apostles, the planters and framers of Churches out of heathen societies, in no Chair, but fixed them to a congregational Pulpit only? The Apostles have care of all things, 2 Cor. 11. 28. command Schismatic Churches, 2 Cor. 10. 8. plant and lay the foundation of Churches, as wise Master-builders, Acts 16. 12. 13, 14, 15, 16. & 18. 7, 8, 9, 10, 1 Cor. 3. 6. 11. appoint new offices in the Church, Acts 6. 6. 
God hath not every way seated officers in his Church, as the King hath placed Underjudges in the State.  Now if God have seated the Apostles in such a way in every congregation, as ordinary Teachers are, than the Apostles proper place must be only to water and confirm visible converts, and members of a fixed and framed congregation; where than are the Apostles Letters Patents to build, to plant, to lay the foundation?  
3. When it's said, as it must be, or it comes not home, the King hath placed in England the whole integral body of the Kingdom of England, the Lord Keeper, the Lord chief Justice, the Constable, as he hath placed in the Church Apostles and Teachers in the whole integral Church: These extraordinary and ordinary officers it cannot be meant, the King hath placed a Lord Keeper, and a Lord chief Justice in every Town and City of England; so neither hath the Lord placed an Apostle in every congregation upon the same account, and he who is an Apostle in one congregation, can no more be an Apostle in another, than a Major of one City can be a Major in another: and it must run so; The State hath placed a General, Colonels, Captains in their Armies, i. e. in every particular society of the Armies, and so every company must have a General, therefore hath the State set Generals, Colonels, Captains in their Armies in the plural number. Now the State hath set but one General over all the Army, as the Church is but one.  
4. If the Argument run thus: As the Major of Norwich 
Let M. H. answer whether the Major of Norwich may lawfully do justice upon one of York, who is oppressed by his fellow-citizen of York, as the pastor of Boston may tender the L. Supper to 20 of the congregation of Hartford. Here the parallel is broken, I judge. Way of the Churches of N. E. c 6. sect. 1. p. 103. Mr. Cotton of the keys, c. 5. p 17. M. H. Survey.  may not rule as Major of York; so neither may a pastor in one congregation teach & rule as a pastor in another congregation. This is utterly false: and it's an Argument like this, As God hath confined Rulers to one society only in the civil State, so hath he confined the officers of his Son's House: one word of Scripture to prove this should silence Mr. R. It's not lawful to devise parallels between the Civil State and Christ's Kingdom. Suppose all the Majors, Rulers, Citizens of all the Cities and Towns in England had the same divine right to command in all the Cities and Towns in England, and that these Majors were Rulers equally and in common to all those Towns, and that it were a matter of providential Order, not of Divine Jurisdiction, that A. B. should be fixed Major of Norwich, and C. D. fixed Major of York, and so forth: then if C. D. by providence should be at Norwich, he might rule as a Major at Norwich, or any Town or City of England, as well as at York: and so is here the matter; a called pastor is a pastor, and may act pastorally, and dispense the Seal of the Lords Supper to those of another congregation, say our Brethren, and so to another whole congregation; for there is the same reason in both.  
So all visible professors have the same divine Church-right to the same Christ the Head:  
2. To the same Gospel and Covenant of grace: (for distinct Church-covenants are men's lawless inventions, as used by our Brethren.)  
3. To the same Lord's Supper, 1 Cor. 10. 17.  
4. To the same eternal life So Mr. H. shall gain nothing by this, but lose: for there is no such right civil, common to civil Rulers and civil Citizens. One Town hath City privileges that no other Town in the Kingdom hath.  
Mr. H. Right of jurisdiction flowing from office-call, a Pastor hath not, save in his own congregation.  
Ans. There must be one call or other for a Pastor to exercise his office: but a new office, or new right of jurisdiction 
There is some call required for a Pastor to put forth pastoral acts, but no new office, no new right of jurisdiction.  other then pastoral, which he received in ordination, is not requisite for a pastor to act as a pastor. Yea, he sins against his office-charge and talon, if in all congregations he do not preach the word, be instant in season and out of season (not at Ephesus only, for an Evangelist, such as Timothy was, not an ordinary fixed Teacher) if he do not reprove, rebuke, and exhort with all long-suffering, 2 Tim. 4. 1, 2. The danger of perishing of souls, or the absence, or removal of the Pastors by death, is a fit call of God, though the greater part of Sardis love not to be rebuked.  
Mr. H. God hath set in his Church, i. e. in the congregation existing in its particulars, Apostles, etc. and therefore all congregations 
The place 1. Cor. 12. 28. God hath set in the Church, is not meant of only Mr. H. his congregational Church.  are here intended.  
Ans. 1. By this God hath set Apostles, Miracles, in the single congregation, whether as Apostles, or as Pastors, if the former, speaking with Tongues, working of Miracles, which are for unbelievers and heathen, 1 Cor. 14. 22. shall be officers or gifts ordained for visible Saints converted. By what Scripture?  
2. Though the Church exclude not the congregations, but in some respects include them; yet it is a body called Christ mystical, v. 12. to which Christ is head by influence of his spirit, and brings no small consolation to us, as Beza, Calvin, Pet. Martyr, who make this the Catholic Church.  
3. Whereas Mr. H. his single congregation of Magus and judas can hardly stand under the weight of that denomination.  
Nor 4 can it well be said, that great Apostles, Prophets, workers of Miracles, such as speak with Tongues, are eyes and ears fixed in single congregations; for this is such an organical body, v. 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17. Never Interpreter, neither Occumenius, nor Augustine, nor Beza, Calvin, Martyr, Pareus, nor 
Beza on 1 Cor. 12. 12. Adeo 〈◊〉, Ecclesia tota nihil aliud sit quam unus Christus; quoniam videlicet, totum corpus mysticum à capite denominatur. Calvin. Locus plenus eximiae consolationis— ut Christus nolit tantum in se, sed etiam in membris suis censeri & recognosci— vocat Ecclesiam complementum illius, Eph. 1. 23. Pet. Martyr. Hoc corpus vivit spiritu Christi, & hac de re praeclarum habemus fidei articulum quo Ecclesiam Catholicam confitemur. Occumenius. Ibid. Ita Christus multa quidem habet m●mbra (nempe singulos fideles) unum vero corpus— perfectum ergo Catholicum. Pareus in loc. Minus videtur fieri posse, ut tam diversae sortis, na ionis, conditionis homines in unum corpus coeant, & tamen per unum Spiritum Christo omnes uniuntur: ut sit in tanta diversitate intima societas & Communio Sanctorum, ubi cunque locorum habit●nt. August. De unitat. Eccles. c. 4. Totus Christus caput & corpus est— sponsus & sponsa duo in una carne. English Divines, An. 27. All the faithful wheresoever they are, make but one whole body. You Corinthians are not the whole body, but members only, neither all the members, but a part only.  judicious Papists, Victorinus, Carthusian, Estius, Cajetanus, expound it, as Mr. H. of a single congregation, but of the Catholic Church (saith Martyr) of men of all nations (saith Pareus) though they dwell in divers places of the earth (saith Pareus) this is the mystical body (saith Estius) membra autem omnes fideles, the members are all the faithful. He proves (saith Cajetanus) omnes Christianos esse unum corpus Christi, all Christians (behold the Catholic Church) to be the one body of Christ, because they are all begotten into one Spirit by Baptism.  
4. The Church here is the Church all baptised into one body, whether jews or Gentiles, whether Bond or Free, which all drink the same drink in the Lord's Supper. Mr. H. In all these congregations are comprehended both jews and Gentiles, for the whole nature of the General is comprehended in the Particulars. Well; and the Spirit that is in all the body must be one Genere, and the drink in the Lord's Supper must be one Genere, and so must the Christ of which we partake be one Genere Hence there being many species and kinds of congregations different in nature, there must be many Christ's different in nature, many Spirits, many Bodies, many Lords Suppers different in species and nature, of which we partake. Who ever heard in the Church of Christ many Christ's, many Baptisms?  
Yet Mr. H. makes many congregations so different in nature, as he that hath right to Christ, Seals, especially Baptism, hath no more right to Christ, Baptism to his seed, censures in another congregation, than a Turk hath.  
5. It's absurd that Jew's and Gentiles are all baptised unto one single congregation. We do not think that the Apostles (ad joh. Baptist) baptised all the thousands, as tried converts, into visible framed Congregations, whom they baptised, Mat. 3. So the Brethren. We think the contrary. Nor can such dream, as that these thousands so baptised can be warrantably obtruded as a platform of discipline upon the Churches of Christ.  
5. This (we are all one) must be in the head Christ, and by faith really apprehending Christ; yea, as the Father and the 
How absurdly our Brethren say we are one body, 1 Cor. 12. 12.  Son are one, john 17. 21, now not only members of an Independent congregation are so one, but also all believers of a Province, of a Nation; yea, all that shall believe in God, through the word of the Apostles, john 17. 20. and all given of the Father to Christ: who shall behold the glory that the Father hath given to Christ, john 17. 24. and who abide in him as branches in the Vine tree, john 15 4. Except we say no Believers, even dissolved Members, and such as live in the Church of Rome by faith, and yet are afraid to confess, are not one with God, by faith, because they are not members of the single congregation.  
6. No more can it be said, we are all one, as touching the nature of Ordinances and Seals, so we believe. But so judas, Magus, and a congregation of these is the body of Christ their head. Give Scripture for that.  
2. Not the single Congregation only, but also all these of divers congregations. who eat one bread, being many, are one body, 1 Cor. 10. 17. by our brethren's grant.  
3. This is an union by institution, conditional, and actu primo: but the Text speaks of a real union by faith and the spirit, 2 Cor. 12. 13.  
7. By this interpretation, when Paul saith the body is one, he meaneth a generick body; and the particular congregations are subjective parts, suitable to the whole: Now it is unconceivable to know how congregations are eyes, and ears, and organs to congregations, except there be an integral whole body, which they deny: nor do we think that congregations are organs, in the sense that Apostles or Teachers are organs 
How many congregations make one organical body, and are organs and members of the same.  to watch officially over congregations: but otherwise the Elders of congregations are official organs, and overseers to the associate congregations.  
2. It is only an elegant Allegory, and holdeth only in the particulars for which it is brought, especially in organical care and sympathy, to be grieved, and suffer with suffering members, and to rejoice with the honoured members, 1 Cor. 12. 26. Rom. 12. 5, 15.  
And 3. Congregations are visible members one of another, in regard of eminency of gifts, holiness and zeal. As Paul, 1 Cor. 19 9, 10, 11. 2 Cor. 11. 28. james beheaded, Acts 12. john was eminent for suffering, Rev. 1. what Eusebius, Jerome, 
Cent. 1. Euseb. Eccles. Histor. l. 3. c. 32. Hieron. Cato Scrip. Eccles.  say of james the Son of Alpheus called justus, thrown over the Pinnacle of the Temple, Simon of Canaan crucified under Trajanus: prove they dying for the truth, not as Apostles, but as eminent witnesies, edified by their gifts a●d zeal the whole Catholic Church. Peter and Paul were martyred at Rome, Andrew crucified in Achaia, Matthew beheaded in Ethiopia, Bartholomew in Armenia, Simon Zelotes in Britain. The eminency and learning of the Martyr Cyprian, Athana●ius his soundness in the faith against Arrians, Epiphanius against the Heresies of 
Nazia. in laud. Athana. Histor. Magd. Cent. 4. Socrat. l. 5. c. 6. Ru●●in. l. 1. c. 9 Theod. l. 5. c. 8. Sozo. l. 6. c. 32. Congregations in their eminent parts are organical parts of the Catholic integral visible Church.  his time, Nazianzen against the Heresy of Apollinaris, Basilius against the Heresy of Eunomius: Hilarius, Ambrose instrumental against Arrians, Augustine against Pelagians, Donatists: and huge multitudes of famous instruments through the Catholic Church, prove, that they were not eminent as members only of a single congregation, but that congregations in their eminent members are organs, members and parts of the Catholic integral Church visible. For all these were more visible in their times, for the good of the Catholic body, then of a part or single Independent congregation.  
8. Organs as organs are only and principally for the proper functions and operations and good of that body whereof they are organs only, the eye to see for that body: and should the eye of john see for Peter, Paul, and thousands of individual men, it should not be the eye of Peter only: no more can Apostles who see for all the Churches, Mat. 28. 20. Gal. 2. 7 8. 2 Cor. 11. 28. Eph. 4. 11, 12, 13. and such as have the gift of Tongues and Miracles to speak to all Nations in their own language, for the planting of the Gospel, be set as eyes and organs, to see and watch for a single congregation where the Gospel is received and believed already, and where ordinarily they speak one language.  
9 The absurd inconsistency of Mr. H. is clear in his interpretation; All the members of the body being many, are one body, that is, one genere, for the genus exists and acts in the particular kinds, pag. 247. So Paul must teach us Logic, and oneness Metaphysical here, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, which Scripture teacheth us not. Sure, here it is not taught, for the oneness here is in Christ, v. 12. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. in one Spirit of Christ, v. 13. in one common office of love, to work every one for another, and the use of another, v. 14, 15, 16. in one sympathy and fellow-feeling of affection, that one member suffer and rejoice accordingly with another, v. 26.  
10. Ver. 21. The eye cannot say to the hand, I have no need of thee. By Mr. H. his interpretation, one Church Independent of Boston can say, I have no members need, no organical-need of Hartford Church, and so the gloss of Mr. H. contradicts the holy Ghost. It will not help what our Brethren say, One congregation 
One congregation hath member-need of all the congregations; 〈◊〉, they are all one body ●…ble.  hath need of another, for rebuking, teaching, counselling.  
1. For a Papist, an heathen Idolater stands in need of a Christian to rebuke and convince him of his Idolatry, but it's no member-need such as Paul meaneth; for Papists, heathen Idolaters, and a sound Christian, are not fellow-members of one and the same visible body of Christ baptised by one Spirit, of which Paul speaketh, ver. 12, 13, 14, 15 etc. john blind hath need of Thomas his eyes to lead him, but that is not member-need, or vital body-organical-need, for then the eyes of Thomas should be organs and members of john; it's only extrinsical need. So that yet every congregation must say to another, I the congregation of Boston have no need of thee my sister, or of any congregation on earth, in the sense of the holy Ghost, 1 Cor 12. as one member of the body hath need of another, the head of the feet, for I am a complete Independent body, having no member-need of any sister Church on earth.  
2. If one congregation stand in member need of all the congregations of Jew and Gentile baptised unto one body, 1 Cor. 12. 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 21, 22. to tender the Supper upon occasion to them and their members, as Scripture, 1 Cor. 10. 16, 17. and our Brethren teach; and stand in need of the Church-praying, Church-praising, Church confirmation by pastoral teaching of eminent Teachers, and of Church suffering, etc. by Martyrdom and otherwise; Then must that congregation be a visible member with all visible congrega●ions on earth, and, by good Logic, all the congregations on earth are one integral catholic visible Church.  
11. If the Apostle here condemn a Schism and Rent, not from one single congregation only, but from the body of Jews and Gentiles baptised into one Spirit, ver. 12, 13. & 25. from the Churches of Galatia, Gal. 5 20. from all Churches, jude v. 19 and commend union with all Churches, because of one Faith, one Lord, one Baptism, Eph. 4. 1, 2, 3, 4. then he supposes they are one Body. Cyprian B. of Carthage, Cornelius B. of 
Euseb. l. 6. c. 43. Socrat. l. 2. c. 38. Parum abfuit, quin co●dunarentur. Aug. de unit. Eccles. sive cont. Petilianum, t●m. 7. Quaestio inter nos v●rsatur ubi sit Ecclesia, utrum apud nos, an apud illos, quae utique una est, quam Majores nostri Catholicam nominarunt, ut ex ipso nomine ostenderent, quae per totum orbem est. Optat. M●livit. adv. Parmenianum Donatist. l. 2. Ecclesia est una— eam apud vos solos esse dixisti; Ergo ut in particula Africa. Calvin. Instit. l. 4. c. 13. sect. 14. Pet. Mart. Com. in 1 Reg. 12. Disp. de Schismate, pag. 101.  Rome, justly excommunicated Novatus, denying mercy to them that fell: Ergo, those great Churches made one visible body, and the Novatians were not Schismatics, because they separated from one single congregation; but, saith Socrates, they hindered the Churches from union. Augustine and Optatus Melivit. and the Fathers make the Donatists' Schismatics in separating from the catholic Church, and denying there was any Church but their own in one part of Africa. See Pet. Martyr learnedly disputing about Schism; and Calvin. See Aug. and Opt. Melivitan.  
12. It's true (saith Mr. H.) of all congregations, that the members do and should care one for another.  
Ans. And this (12) I bring for one Argument, if this gloss of Mr. H. remove all member-care and all organical-care of suffering and joy, such as is betwixt the members of the same body, from congregations toward all other congregations, as toward their fellow-members, and limit member care, and member fellow-feeling, to only members of the same congregation: then this gloss must contradict the holy Ghost, 1 Cor. 12. 26. And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it, or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it: for this gloss saith, I the Church of Boston, complete and independent within myself, care not with member care for all the congregations on earth, though they utterly perish; nor do I rejoice with the fellow-feeling joy of fellow-members, at the honour and spiritual good of all the congregations on earth. Sure this doctrine cannot 
One congregation is to suffer & rejoice with a fellow-feeling of membership at the weal and we of all congregations on earth; Ergo, all the congregations on earth make one Catholic integral visible body.  be of God, which is so contrary to Scripture; for that was not typical in the Old Testament, that the members of the Jewish Church should sorrow and rejoice with members of that covenanted Nation, as with those members of the same body; as David, Psal. 19 2. & 122. 1, 2, 6, 7, 8 & 119. 63. Moses, Exod. 2. 11. Heb. 11. 24, 25. Mordecai and Esther, Esth. 2. 1, 2. ver. 15, 16, 17. cap. 21, 22. and the captive people, Psal. 137. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. and jeremiah, cap. 9 1, 2, 3. Ezekiel, cap. 9 8. & 11. 13. Daniel, cap. 9 16, 17, 18, etc. but we are not to mourn with those that mourn, nor to rejoice with those that rejoice, as Rom. 12. 15, with a fellow-feeling affection, as with members of the same visible body, though their weal and woe be most visible to us, as their Church and Saintship is, except with those only who are members of the same Independent congregation, for they are not of the body of which we are members: as the body of Socrates feels no member pain when the finger of john is cut off.  
7. There is a body to be gathered into the unity of faith, 
Arg. 7.  and of the knowledge of the Son of God, a body to be glorified, Eph. 4. 13. Now this is the Catholic Body of Christ, 
Eph. 4. 11, 12, 13. proves an integral Catholic Church visible.  and the Lords end why he gave Apostles, Prophets and Doctors, till we be all glorified; and this Church is visible, because gathered and edified by a Ministry, they are the visible Church which is fed by Ministers.  
The Church built upon the Rock, against which the gates of 
Arg. 8.  hell cannot prevail, can be no single congregation, for the gates of hell prevail against the single congregation; therefore it must be the Catholic Church which only continues to the 
Matth. 16, 17, 18, 19 proves a Catholic integral Church.  end. And this Church is visible, for to the Ministers thereof are the Keys given to open and shut the Kingdom of Heaven by the word preached, seals and censures, Matth. 16. Ergo, there is a Catholic integral militant Church visible.  
If Christ reign by the preached word, seals and censures, over 
Arg. 9:  the Kingdoms of the World, Rev. 11. 15. over the Nations, Isa. 2. 1, 2. Psal. 2 8, 9 Psal. 22. 27, 28. Psal. 96. 10, 11, 12. Psal. 97. 1, 2, 3, 4, etc. Psal. 98. 7, 8 9 Psal. 99 1, 2, 3. and have a visible government in the house of David, Isa. 9 7. over the earth, Isa. 11. 4, 10, 11. from sea to sea, Psal. 72. 8 etc. then is there a Catholic integral visible Church: but the former is true.  
Obj. All our Divines say it is a Popish tenet, that the Catholic Church is visible: our Divines acknowledge no Church visible, but only a particular Church.  
Ans. Mr. Hudson a learned and godly man reaps so cleanly, 
In what sense our Divines affirm or deny the Church to be visible: The Church which is catholic, in regard of time, and of all ages, and of places, and nations, is not visible, nor is it ever visible, i. e. conspicuously glorious before men, as learned Mr. Hudson.  that I shall not cast any sickle into his field, no● is there need.  
1. The Papists contend for a catholic visible Church, to set their man of sin over it: this Church includeth (some of them say) Purgatory, and Heaven, and Hell, of both which he bears 
Salmeron in Matth. 16. 19● Cornel. à Lap. Dat ergo ipse indulgentiam defunctis, non per modum juridicae absolutionis, quia defuncti illi non sunt ampliùs subditi, sed per modum suffragii. Bellarm. De purgato. l. 2. c. 15. Justi defuncti sunt membra hujus corporis. Bellarm. De purge. l. 2. c. 16. Bellarm. De notis Eccles. l. 4. c. 4. Prima nota est, ipsum Catholicae Ecclesiae & Christianorum nom●n. Ibid. Pacian. ad Sympronian, Dicit nomen Catholicum convenire capiti principali, & trunco illius arboris, unde multi ●an●● va●… temporibus excinduntur.  the Keys. Salmeron, Cornel, à Lapide, they may be loosed that are under the earth by Keys, as members of the body. He gives (saith Cornelius à Lapide) pardons to the dead (invisible members indeed) not by way of juridical absolution, for the dead are no longer subjects on earth, but by way of suffrage. B●llarmin proves from Pet. Cluniacens. that the dead in Purgatory are members of the catholic Church. And the Pope (saith Bellarmin) as the chief dispenser of the treasures of the Church, may bestow upon those in Purgatory, bona opera poenalia quae in Thesauro sunt, the good works of the godly done by way of suffering. In this the Catholic Church cannot be visible.  
2. The Papists contend for a catholic Church visible, such as we believe to be the catholic Church in the Apostles Creed. So Bellarmin makes the name of Catholics, and the name of Christians all one, and the catholic Church a tree from which, through divers times and ages, branches have been cut. And so must be, as Rodericus de Arriaga, Catholic, extending itself 
Roder. de Arri. To. 5. tract. de fide disp. 7. sec. 3. Est Catholica, hoc est, communis, universalis; extendit enim se licèt diversis temporibus, ad totum mundum. Ad. Tanne. De fide, spe. disp. 1. q. 3. dub. 3. n. 75, 76. Vincent. Li●inen. Tann●rus Jesuita Tom. 3. Quod ubique, quod ab omnibus, quod semper— de universalitate temporum ad finem usque mundi, à primo sui exo●tu perpetuò— Ps. 88 30. Ponam in seculum seculi semen ejus, & universalitatem locorum Scripturae— Ps. 8. Dabo tibi gentes haereditatem tuam. Alb. Pighius Hierarchiae Ecclesiasticae, l. 1. c. 1. pag. 2. Una & universalis, nullo certo loco, nulla regi●ne & patria, nulla Gente, natione aut populo, nullo denique tempore conclusa, circumscripta aut determinata. Whitaker de Eccles. l. 3. ad Duraeum, fol. 69. Catholica Ecclesia non modo nostrae aetatis finibus circumscribenda non est, sed ipsos quoque Patriarchas, Prophetas, Apostolos, Sanctosque omnes qui vel sunt, fuerunt, vel futuri sunt, complectitur; haec Ecclesia ex singulis horum temporum Ecclesiis constans est visibilis● nihil minùs. Anton. Sedeel Respons. Ad fidei quam vocant professionem à Monachis Burdega lensibus factam, A●. 1585. etc. Ar. 60. pag. 5●3. Si Ecclesia Catholica significat ve●os sideles & electos, qui fuerunt, qui sunt, quique futuri sunt, oportet istos Monachos miro oculorum a cumene praeditos & perspicuitate, si cernere possint Ecclesiam Catholicam— necessariò igitur constituendum est discrimen inter Ecclesiam Catholicam & Ecclesiam visibilem; nam Ecclesiae visibiles sunt particulares, ut erant Apostolorum tempore Ecclesiae Corinthio●um, Ephesiorum— in his solent esse Hypocritae & Reprobi non pertinentes ad hanc Ecclesiam particularem. See D. Willet 2. Gene. Contra. q. 1. par. 2. pag. 67. Pareus in Ursin. q. 54. Art. 2. pag. 303. Tilenus' Syntag. dis. 14. d. 1. Thes. 36, 37. Professo. Leid. in Synop. Pur. Theol. dis. 40. th'. 8. Parts hujus Ecclesiae 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 consideratae statuunt Pontificii tres, unam laborantem in purgatorio, alteram triumphantem in coelis, tertiam militantem in terra, etc. Th. 9, 10, 11. praes●…im Th. 26, 27, 28, 30, 32, 33.  all the world over in divers ages and times. Ad. Tannerus, The Church is called Catholic for the Universality of the Doctrine, and the Universality of Time, from the beginning of the World to the end, enduring ●or ever; and for the Universality of the Place. Now they make the Pope the head and chief Pastor of this Church catholic. D. Whitaker saith, the catholic Church contains not only the Church of our time, but the Patriarches, Prophets, Apostles, and all the Saints which have been, are, or shall be to the end; and is this Church which is made up of the Churches of these times visible. These Monks must be exceeding sharp sighted (saith Anton. Sadeel) who see this Church, and see the Apostles and Martyrs in Heaven.  
3. Nor hath Mr. H. cause to cast this signification of visible, that it is taken for conspicuous and glorious. Nor is it worthy the refuting, that he ●aith that Bellarmin distinguisheth visible and conspicuously glorious; for he must split a hair of the head, as to its latitude, who can distinguish Beauties fifteen notes: many of his own side reduce them to a fewer number.  
2. Conspicuity of glory is but visibility in such and such ways, 
Conspicuity of glory is visibility.  as amplitude and multitude all the world over; visibility in glory of preaching, of working miracles, and victory over their enemies, and external prosperity, which are things most visible, and not done in a corner.  
3. Their own men speak not, but as Mr. Hudson doth, the Jesuits of Rheims An. 3. on Matth. 5. explain this conspicuity, The light of the World, and City on a Mountain, and Candle upon a Candlestick, signifieth the Clergy and whole Church, which must needs be visible to the World. See how D. Fulk and Mr. Cartwright answers them. Malderus a Bish. Antwer. profess. Lov. in 22. de virtu. Theol. de Obj. fidei disp. 1. A●. 10. q. 3. The Catholics yield that the Church is not ever aequè conspicuam, alike conspicuous, Res. ad 3. Habet tamen suas proprietates visibiles, It hath its visible properties, true miracles, works of holiness, antiquity, visible succession, perseverance on the rock: and this is all one as to be conspicuous and visibly glorious. Gregor. de Valentia Tom. 3. in 22. disp. 1. q. 1. de Obj. fidei punct. 7. 6. propriet. p. 142, 143. The Church is not adeo conspicua, that it may be seen with the eyes, but yet it may evidenter omni seculo conspici, be evidently in every age seen, known, and pointed out by the finger, as a City on a mountain, Matth. 5. as the Sun in the Heaven, Psal. 19 And disp. 1. q. 1, punct. 4. pag. 78, 79. he proves the glory of miracles, and other the like, make the Church of Rome, and not of Sectaries (as he names us) to be visibly known to all the world. And Tannerus Tom. 3. de fide, spe, q. 1. dis. 3. dub. 3. n. 85. Insignibus quibusdam notis inter omnes alios coetus eminet, its conspicuous and glorious above all other societies, by these properties, that it is One, 2. Holy, 3. Catholic in Doctrine, Time, Places. And Causabon. in Epistola ad Cardinalem Baronium. Olim Ecclesia Catholica similis civitati supra montem positae nullo pacto dubia erat, sed nota omnibus, perspicua, certa, longè latèque per orbem diffusa, sub Imperatoribus florins, quorum dominatio ab ortu ad Occasum, à Septentrione ad Meridiem porrigebatu●— at distractionem imperii postea secuta est distractio Ecclesiae Catholicae, ex illo tempore Ecclesia Catholica non desiit esse quidem, sed minus illustris esse coepit. So junius disp. Theolo. 43. Th' 11. It may be there is no particular Church publicè nota, publicly known on earth, but that all have loosed their external splendour. And what this differs from conspicuity and glory let Mr. H. or any man show: and what glory and conspicuity is in the Christian Churches, and what Sea-ebbings and flow that glory hath, read (though all be not to be believed which some say) Philip Nicolai. l. 1. de Regno Christ. etc. Bellarmin de notis Eccles. l. 4. c. 7. Io. Gerard. to. 5. de Eccles. 
Buc. loc. 41. q. 7. pag. 459. Ratione adjunctorum cacholica Ecclesia est invisibilis, quae vera tantum Christi membra, seu electos— complectitur. Id●i●●o vocatur invisibilis hominum tantùm respecta. Quia vera fides, quae est differentia constitutiva Ecclesiae (fides vera in coetu non in uno homine) & per quam Ecclesia est id quod est, in cord sita est, & proinde invisibilis— & nisi à Deo 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, certò cognosi no● potest. A●to. walaeus Magnus Theologus Tom. 1. locor. Comm. de Eccles. pag. 43. Ecclesia invisibilis vocatur Catholica, & comprehendit omnes ve●è ●ideles, qui per totum orbem terrarum Dei oculis conspicui sunt; vocatur verò invisibilis, quia universalitas fidelium nulli homini est conspicua. 2. Quia fides & ipsa regeneratio quae est ●uj● Ecclesiae 〈◊〉, ab hominibus videri non potest. Ursinus, quo non est major in Theologo●um cho●●, Catech. q. 44. Ar. 2. joan. Piscator, loc. 23. de Eccles. Thes 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14. Magnus Colvin. Instit. l. 4. c. 1. Refertur ad omnes electos Dei, in quorum 〈◊〉 sunt etiam qui morte defuncti sunt. Sec. 3. Coet●●ù ad amplexandsm eam unitatem nihil opus est Ecclesiam ipsam oculis ce●…re, vel maribus palpare, quin po●i●● co quod in fide sita est, admonemur nihilominus cogitandam, dum intelligentiam nostram praeterit, quam si palam appareat, etc. lib. 4. c. 8. sect. 7, 8, 9 etc. wind●linus Christ. Theo●. 1. c. 28. Th. 16. pag. 578, 579 Luc. T●… Pater loc. 16. art. 3. n. 4. Quid sit Catholica, pag. 426. Froneisc. junius. The. Theo. disp. 43. th'. 4. Cumplectitur ergo haec Ecclesia Catholica omnes universè homines in coelo & in terra, qui fuerunt, sunt, & futuri sunt illius vocationis divinae & grat●o●ae participes, The. 8. cum potior pars in coelis triumphans sit, à conspectu hominum remota sit, tota haec Ecclesia visibiiis nobis esse non possit; quinimo quaslibet particulares Ecclesias ad eam paucitatem posse redigi, ut non sit aliqua Christi vera visibilis Ecclesia mundo in terris publicè nota, eam verò interdum externum suum splendorem amittere, hominum oculos latere— asserimus. Chemnitius exam. Conc. Trident. c. 6. can. 7. pag. 285. Catholicum Vincentius Lirinen. rectè definite, quod semper, quod ubique & ab omnibus similiter observatum fuit— neque enim caput à membris, hoc est, Christum ab Ecclesia, & principalia membra; hoc est, Apostolos cum sua doctrina & exemplis à reliquo corpore Ecclesiae resecare debemus, quando de catholica seu universâ Ecclesiâ lequimur. joan. Gerhardus tom. 5. de Eccles. c. 11. num. 151. Hujus catholicae Ecclesiae caput est Christus, membra omnes verè credentes, sive in coelis jam dum triumphent, sive in terris adhuc militent— hujus proprietates sunt, quòd sit Sancta, quod invisibilis. Hieron. Zanchius, tom. 7. de Ecces. c. 3. Est fidelium coetus. c. 5. omnes particulares Ecclesiae sunt una & eadem Christi Ecclesia. c. 7. are 1. sub hac universali visibili Ecclesia continentur privatae & particulares, seu illius parts, etc. See Turrianus in 22. de fid. spe. de Eccles. disp. 15. dub. 1. disp. 14. dub. 1. dub. 2. Roder. de Arriag. to 5. sect. 4. sect. 5. Bellar. to. 2. de Eccles. Mil. l. 3. c. 12. De pontisic. Rom. l. 1. c. 10. Phil. Gamach. to. 3. disp. de Indulg. c. 3. de protestate applicand: Thesaurum Ecclesiasti. Gregor. de Valent. in 22. tom. 3. de fid. spe. disp. 1. q. 1. de obj. fidei, p. 7. sect. 26. sect. 27. sect. 28. Suarez. tom. de. fid. spe. disp. 9 sect. 8. n. 1, 2, 3.  c. 11. sect. 5. n. 184, 185, 186. Euseb. l. 5. Hist. c. 24. Cyprian. de unit. Eccles. Tertullian. contra judaeos c. 3. Vega. in opus. de fid. & oper. praesertim. c. 3. Acosta jesuit. de procuratione judorum salutis.  
4. It's not to be passed, that our Divines condemn a visible 
Our Divines deny popish visibility of 〈◊〉 catholic visible body under the Pope, but not the visibility simply of the catholic church.  catholic Church only under one Pastor, the Bishop of Rome, the ministerial head and catholic Pastor of Pastors over all the catholic Church on earth, and taking upon him to be Pastor of Pastors: yea, and the Church of Rome is perpetually visible, and (saith Valentia) the Pope is the only head of this catholic visible Church. The Heretics (saith Suarez) deny in the catholic Church (subjected to the Pope, as the visible head) proprietates ullas visibiles, any visible properties by which it may be known from the Churches of Satan. And therefore the Church must be invisible— and therefore they deny omnem externam hierarchiam Ecclesiae, caput visibile, regulam fidei animatam & visibilem, all the external sacred order of Prelates, the visible head, the living and visible rule of faith. That visibility of a head catholics, and visible body under that head we profess that we deny. Now that the Pope should be the only Pastor of a Church, which by no possibility he can see, and that he is the only feeder of such a flock, to him invisible: Suppose he had the eyes of Argu● ten thousand times, is that visibility of a Church catholic, of a Church Diocesian, which we deny and detest? but we deny not, but teach that the Church is visible in a right sense.  
And 1. we teach that the catholic Church militant on earth is visible in its parts, though it be not in its whole bulk and body all at once visible, as Amesius, who also is in some points 
Ames. Medulla Theol. l. 1. c. 32. Th. 1. Ecclesia quae in terris agit, quamvis non sit tota simul visibilis, in suis tamen partibus est visibilis.  for this new way of Independency. So the whole body of the Heaven in both the Hemispheres is visible when enlightened with the Sun, yet is not the whole Heaven all at once visible to any man living So the whole element of Water is visible, not all at once, and yet is so visible in its parts, in the parts of the Sea, Rivers, Floods, as it were nonsense to say such a part of the Heaven, and of the Sea, as in day light is obvious to our eyes, were simply invisible, in that sense, that we say the mystical body of the catholic Church of sound Believers is invisible, and believed, but not seen.  
2. Therefore the Church catholic is 1. considered as comprehending all the families in Heaven and Earth, Eph. 3. 15. 
Of the catholic church, & the three Scriptural acceptions of the Word.  Heb. 12. 22, 23. Col 1. 20. this is the most large catholic Church consisting of elect Men and Angels.  
2. The catholic Church is that company of redeemed men for whom Christ died, and it contains all that have been, are, or shall be, that are clarified and presented without spot or wrinkle, sanctified by the washing of water by the word, Eph. 5. 25. Husband's love your Wives, as Christ also loved the Church— 27. that he might present it to himself a glorious Church, etc. and to this is the place Eph. 1. 22, 23. referred. For which see Calvin, Beza, Zanchius on the place, and especially solidly learned D. D. Boyd of Trochrigge, learned and sharp Mr. Paul Baines in their learned Commentaries on Ephes. 1. 21, 22. Hence Augustine, It contains all the sanctified ones. But we do not now contend with Papists concerning the catholic Church in 
August● de Catech. c. 20. Cives sunt omnes sanctificati homines qui fuerunt, & qui sunt, & qui futuri sunt.  its latitude of these two acceptions.  
As 1. Whether the Elect Angels, and the Glorified in Heaven, and these that are to be members of the catholic visible Church, but are not yet born, are visible members?  
2. Whether the Pope be visible head, and have the power of the Keys to feed with word, censures, and seals, the Elect Angels, the Patriarches, Prophets, Martyrs, etc. who are now preferred in glory?  
3. Whether the Church catholic in that latitude containing such noble members, can err in a general Council, or out of it, or can err in Fundamentals, and cease to be a Church? As to the latter acceptions, our Divines condemn Papists, who tell us that the Pope is the visible head of the visible catholic Church: we say we believe there is a catholic Church, but visible it is not. And neither Mr. Hudson, nor I, nor any of ours do dispute for a catholic integral visible Church, or for a catholic body of Presbyters and Officers that are, have been, and now are glorified, and shall be born, as if they were the first formal subject of the Keys. Mr. H. loses his time in blotting paper to make us dispute any such question, and to bring in popish inferences against us in that.  
But 3. there is an integral catholic visible Church, to and 
Confess. of the Assembly of Divines at Westminster, An. 1063, 1644 1645, etc. c. 25. And the large Catechism of that Assembly, pag 91, 92. Synopsis purio. Theol. per. 5. 5. Theo. professores in Academia Leydensi disp. 40. de Eccles. pag. 567. pres. th' 27 33, 34. The catholic Church is divers ways visible.  for which Eph. 4. 11, 12, 13. 1 Cor. 12. 12, 13, etc. The Lord hath given all his Ordinances, as by succession of ages it existeth on earth. See the accurate Confession of Faith. See judicious dispute of the Professors of Leyden by Anton. Walaeus worthy to be read of all, in which they solidly observe, that many confound the particular Church, and the visible, and invisible, and universal Church which are indeed to be distinguished, for the universal integral Church is in its own way visible.  
1. In its parts, as is said before.  
2. In the community of profession of the same faith, both in preaching, confession, and writings, so that it hath no sense to limit visibility to one single congregation, as our Brethren do. For our eyes may as well see two congregations, and many to be visible Saints, and to worship in a Churchway the same Lord jesus, as we see the members of our own one congregation.  
3. Whether Synods be for counsel and advice only, as our Brethren say?  
Or 2. For pastoral teaching, and dogmatic determining of truths, for edification, as Mr. Cotton contrary to his Brethren teacheth.  
Or 3. For jurisdiction: it is against common sense, to deny that the integral catholic Church is visible in Synods, whether Ecumenical, or National, or Provincial; For the representative is as visible as the congregation. And whereas our Divines say, that the Church is invisible, because faith which is the specific and constitutive form of the Church, is invisible, and known only to God the searcher of hearts; they are not so to be expounded, as if this were their argument to prove that the catholic Church is invisible, and the congregation only visible. 
Our Divines argument to prove that the catholic church is invisible, is not because faith is only believed, and not visible.  Nor do they use such an argument for such a conclusion; for the true faith of a congregation is as invisible and known to God only; yea, the faith of one single member is as latent and invisible to the eye of sense, and more latent than the faith of the whole catholic visible Church: for faith is persuaded there is a visible Church, for the Scripture saith, that Christ hath a seed: but the Scripture says not that this or that man, or that this congregation hath saving faith. It's true, the profession of the catholic Church is, because of the universality, of Saints remoter from our senses, and so less visible; which hinders not that to be true which our Divines say, that in time of great persecution, the Churches knew not one another, as saith Augustine, who also compareth her to the Moon, which 
August. de baptism. contra Donatist. l. 6. c. 4. August. in Psal. 20. Fuilb. Ans. to the Rhemists, Rev. 12. An. 2. Cartwright Ans. to Rhemists, Rev. 12. An. 5. Beda hist. l. 5. c. 22. Omnes Ecclesiae per orbem unam Ecclesiam faciunt.  is often ●id, as in the time of Elias. And jerom tells that the Christian World sighed under Arrianism. The Pope by cruel wars banished those called Waldenses, Albigenses, Pauperes de Lugduno Picardi; until Wickliff rose there, was (saith D. Fulk) about the time of 350. years, great darkness. See Cartwright. Nor is it possible for Mr. H. to prove, that when our Divines do say, particular Churches are visible, that they mean Mr. H. his particular Independent congregations only: he is a great stranger in our Divines writings, who knows not, that from Matth. 18. Tell the Church, they prove that a general Council hath juridical power to censure Peter, or the Pope. Since learning was, it was never counted a point of popery (except all our Reformers be Papists) which Mr. H. citeth from Turrianus, if it be spoken in Thesi (but he applies it to the visible body under the Pope in Hypothesi) for it is but what Beda and others say from Scripture, Eph. 4. 1, 2. But as Papists in Thest speak sound in the attribute of Omnipotency: so here, when in Hypothest applying the Doctrine of Omnipotency to their 
In what sense some of ours say the Churches in the primitive times were congregational. See Didoclavius i. e. Mr. Calderwood in altari Damasc. de Episcoporum gradibus, c. 2. p. 39, 40. item de Episcopi potestate extensiuâ. p. 282, 283 Item quod Episcopus & Presbyter sint ejusdem ordinis, p 298, 299, 300 D. D. Ro. Bodius à Trochoregia Com. in Eph. c. 4. v. 11. p. 504 M. Bains Diocesian Trial. Euseb. hist. l. 3. Ignat. Epist. ad Eph. Eccle. Tertull. in Apol.  miracles, to Transubstantiation, to Adoration of Images, they vanish in vain speculations. Nor can we deny, but some of our own have gone too far: one in saying, that the Churches of the Apostles were not so numerous, but they met all in one place, and that the Church of Alexandria, Hierapolis, jerusalem, were congregations that met in one place: they would explain their mind in that point more circumstantiately, if they were to speak thereof again. But their purpose is in the point of Prelacy to prove a true conclusion of P. Bains, that the Scripture gives no warrant to a Diocesan Church, that is, to 60 or 100 congregational Churches to be fed by Word, Seals and Censures, by one little Monarch called a Prelate: whereas the Church fed so, as is said, is a single congregation meeting in the same place, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  
2. There cannot be an ordinary exercise of the Keys by the weekly converse of the Officers of 80 or 100 Churches so many miles separated one from another.  
3. It's true, Eusebius in divers places calls the Churches of Alexandria, Hierapolis, etc. Par●●cias, congregational meetings; and Ignatius writes to the Church of Ephesus, that they should convene 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉; and Tertullian saith, the Churches of his time met in one body. All which is true of the Churches distributively. But Cyprian shall resute them, who says, the Church of Carthage was one congregation. Scripture, Reason, Fathers, shall quickly speak against them, who shall say the Church of Rome, of Constantinople, were one congregational Church under Cornelius and chrysostom.   

CHAP. VII.  
Ordination, not Election of the people, gives the essentials to Officers. 2. The method and order of Ordination and Election. 3. The place 1 Tim. 4. 14. touching the laying on of hands of the Presbytery, is opened. 4. The necessity of laying on of hands. 5. Designation to a certain flock is not essential to a Pastor.  
MR. H. Ordination, according to the mind of Mr. R. and 
Mr. H. Survey, par. 2. c. 2. con. 2. p. 52, 53. Mr. R. his order of ordination before election hinders not ordination to give the essentials to the call of officers.  his method, as preceding the Election of the people, doth not give the essentials to the outward call of a Minister.  
Ans. Ordo causandi non tollit ipsam c●●salitatem. If Plate say the soul was created before the body, this will not prove but body and soul are essential causes of man. So because Ordination administered Mr. R. his way and method gives not the essentials to a Minister; this by no Logic can cashier Ordination from an essential cause thereof.  
Mr. H. Luke saith, Acts 6. first they chose Steven, ver. 5. then the Apostles laid on hands, ver. 6. if not any but those who are elected by the people should be ordained, and all such who were so chosen could not be refused, then to ordain before choice, is neither to make application of the Rule, or a communicating of the Right in an orderly manner. But the first is plain, the Apostles would not take that sovereignty in ordaining Elders, therefore they would not allow their Scholars to arrogate to call so, Acts 14. 23. When they had created them Elders in every Church, (the Geneva, When they had ordained Elders by election of the people) and prayed, and fasted, they commended them to God, etc. then the officers had a full call, and a full night to the execution of their office before laying on of hands, which is not necessary; and must not the setting in order things amiss be done by Titus, i. e. the Officers and the Church also? Tit. 1. 5.  
Ans. 1. Luke saith not they were elect called officers with 
See D. Bilson, Perpet. Gover. c. 7.  a full call and full right, before the Apostles laid on hands: for Mr. R. saith they were chosen, that is, nominated as godly men before the Apostles laid on hands; as David and Saul were both chosen, set apart by God before unction and choice of 
Formal and complete election is later than ordination.  the people, but they were not formally chosen Kings, having full royalty, while as yet the people knew them not from other men: but the seven men were not formally and completely chosen as officers, before ordination, and so had neither right, nor official full right to be their Deacons, while the Apostles ordained them: for this Rite (say Beza, Bullinger, Calvin, Gualther, Diodati, English Divines) used in Sacrifices, was used in creating 
Cypr. l. r. Ep. 4. alias 68 Leo Ep. 87. c. 1. Calvin. Acts 6. Praescribunt autem Apostoli quales deligi opo●reat— atque hoc inter tyrannidem & confusam licentiam est medium, ut nihil quidem agatur nisi ex consensu & approbatione plebis. Gualth. in ioc. Totius Ecclesiae consensu & authoritate Diaconi electi sunt.  of officers, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, ver. 3. to choose is a far lower word, as Cyprian saith, it noteth Pl●bis approbationem: Leo, con sensum plebis: Calvin, the approbation of the people. What then is the Apostles and officers part? Authority official there must be, laying on of hands (saith Mr. H.) was not of necessity required: yea, but its safer to believe the holy Ghost, it was done; than it was no unnecessary compliment, the cup was given to the people by the Apostles, 1 Cor. 11. True, (say Papists as Mr. H.) it was not of necessity required. 2. (Though there be a wide difference in the matter) if none should be ordained but those only that are first chosen, (as formally and completely as their fixed 〈◊〉) than election goes before ordination. Mr. R. denies the connexion, and desires Mr. H. to prove it: yea, the contrary follows; Ergo, the people cannot appropriate the man to be their fixed officer, nor consent he be theirs only (and this to me is only formal election) until he first be ordained an officer. The sick man cannot choose A. B. to be his Physician, until he first be a Physician, nor can a Scholar choose C. D. to be his Teacher of Philosophy, until C. D. he first a Philosopher.  
3. The Assumption is false: But all such who are so chosen 
The people cannot choose A. B. to be their fixed pastor, until A. B. be first a pastor.  could not be refused; then must the Elders be necessitated to lay hands on Nicolaus, though they know him to be the head of that unclean Sect, of which Epiph●nius, Ir●…s, D●roth●●s, T●rtullian judge him to be leader: Why? the people have chosen him, than the Elders must lay on hands suddenly on an heretical Teacher, a Wolf: Why? they cannot refuse him (saith Mr. H.) for, The people hath chosen him. What tyranny of conscience is here?  
4. This calling of the Deacons, and consequently of all other officers, if we suppose that the office was instituted (as now it was) by Mr. H. his way, might well have been without either presence or acting of either Apostles or officers (for saith Mr. H. there was no necessity of laying on of hands) by the only multitude, and I require one Scripture for the calling of one officer without the concurrent acting of Apostles and officers, by the sole people, and can show warrants for the presence and acting of Apostles and officers in the calling of officers, especially those Acts 1. 15, 23. & 6. 6. & 14. 23. Tit. 1. 5, 6, 7, etc. 1 Tim. 4. 14. & 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2. 2. 1 Tim. 2. 1, 2, 3, 10. Revel. 2. 2. ver. 20. Acts 20. 28, 29, 30. & 13. 1, 2, 3, 4.  
5. Be it as the Geneva reading saith (as it is not) yet as Mr. 
M. Lazar. Seaman of Ordination, arg. 1. Diatribe, p. 14. Stephan. in Thesauro. Mr. Leigh in Crit. Sacr. in N. T. Bals. & Zonar. Can. 1. Apost. See Calvin Instit. l. 4. c. 3. sec. 15. Beza An. in Act. 14. 23. Ames. Bellarm. Eneru. tom. 2. l. 3. p. 98, 99 Non negamus Paulum & Barnabam suffcagia sua tulisse, sed solos illos negamus tulisse.  Seaman well observes, and Calvin saith it also with Beza, the officers had their official votes, and are said 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, as Stephanus, Mr. Leigh, Theodor. Balsamo, Zonaras and Bellarmine grants it; and it proves, that the only people created not officers, Ergo, by neither this place, nor by any other Scripture, could they give them full right to their office. See Amesius and Calvin. Hence if the officers by these places have suffrages and votes in ordaining of officers, as why should the holy Ghost bid prophets separate Paul and Barnabas for such a ministry, and command Timothy to lay hands suddenly on no man, 1 Tim. 5. 22. but on faithful men, that are able to teach others, 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 5, 7, 8. if officers have no official work in creating officers, but only to choose them, which any brother or woman may do? then it is not needless that officers concur to create officers; and if it be not required of necessity that they concur, it must be idle work both here and in the cited places, that they concur, but because they did concur. I have as good reason, that the people's concurring in choosing was needless, though they did choose, as Mr. H. hath cause to say, the officers concurrence is needless in ordaining, though in truth the Word of God require both as necessary.  
Lastly, For the setting in order things, since these must be things of jurisdiction also, we say juridical acts by no Scripture are ascribed to the whole Church, except by the Church be understood the Church of Rulers, the rest only consenting: which is our mind.  
Mr. H. Arg. 2. That place 1 Tim. 4. 14. favours not Mr. R. for ordination by officers, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, 1. Notes gracious dispensations accompanying salvation, Heb. 6. 9 or freely given gifts, 1 Cor. 12. 9, 28. 1 Cor. 7. 7.  
2. It notes offices, Rom. 12. 6.  
3. The grace of free justification, Rome 5. 15. Now it's rather meant of grace out habilities which Timothy received by way of prophecy, by which he was fitted to that extraordinary work of an evangelist: the office is not first attended, but the gifts with an eye to the office.  
1. It's harsh; forget not the office that is in you: a man is more fitly said to be in the office, an office is adjunctum adhaerens, not qualitas inhaerens.  
2. The parallel place is 2 Tim. 1. 6. stir up the gift which is given thee by the laying on of my hands: a man is not said to stir up his office.  
Ans. There is nothing here to weaken Mr. R. for 1. it 
The place 1 Tim. 4. 14. Neglect not the gift that is in thee, etc. is opened, and M. H. his mistakes thereof removed. See Bilson Perpet. Governm. c 10. pag. 128, 129.  was spare time to leave out more necessary significations of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, the gift, and to seem to put upon some a dream of giving the grace of justification in the blood of Christ, by prophecy, by laying on of the hands of the Presbytery.  
2, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, by, is not prefixed to the laying on of the hands of the Presbytery: but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is prefixed to the laying on of hands: neglect not the gift given thee by prophecy, than he addeth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, with (not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, by) the laying on of the hands of the Presbytery. So that with Mr. H. his leave, Timothy received no gracious hability by the laying on of the hands of the Presbytery, as far as this Text speaks, so that the prophecy was extraordinary, 1 Tim. 1. 18. and the gift might be so also, and the laying on of the ●ands of Paul, 2 Tim. 1. 6. was of another nature, and there he useth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, and this was known to be extraordinary, for the giving of the Holy Ghost, Act. 8. 17. which Magus affected, v. 19 It is true 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is put for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, but rarely, Act. 14. 17. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Act. 13. 17, So the laying on of 
Stephanus in Concor. in voce 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Beza, An. Act. 13. 17. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 pro 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Act. 13. 1, 2.  the hands, may be ordinary, and the gift given by prophecy, as Calvin, Beza, Parent, Piscator, D●…i, Cruciger, the gift declared to be given thee by prophetical revelation, 1 Tim. 1. 18. as Paul and Barnabas were sent to the Gentiles by the command of the Spirit. So Paul exhorts Timothy neither to neglect the one nor the other, so neglect not, but (●s D●…) exercise carefully thy calling of an Evangelist, revive and strengthen the gifts that thou hast received, especially since thou hast received imposition of hands from the College of Elders.  
2. It is harsh (saith Mr. H.) Forget not the office in thee. Didoclavius told him thus, but what then? A man is said in our 
Didoclavius, Da. Calderwood. in altar. Damasc. c. 4. pag. 158. Ista phrasis (donum Presbyterii vel Presbyteratus quod est in te) durior erit.  language to be in office; but it's both new, and will but poorly prove, therefore it is harsh in the Greek, and it is known there be harsh phrases in both the Septuagints, and in the New Testament, and that neither of them is the most pure of that language, and there is a heavenly eloquence in all Scripture.  
Mr. H. Whether by Elders be meant, the Elders of many, or of one congregation, I could never learn. Didoc●. 160.  
Ans. Then this place shall say nothing for the Eldership of an Independent congregation; to which Mr. H. gives after an official power dogmatic, and doctrinal, to hear witnesses and pronounce a sentence of excommunication, which the congregation can no more oppose, than the word of God: and I hombly desire another place for such a new Judicature: for sure men and women both have the judgement of discretion to oppose all errors.  
2. There was a College of Elders, Act. 1. & Act. 6 & Act. 13. & Act. 21. At the ordaining of officers, and weighty affairs 
Mr. H. can by no Scripture warrant to us an Eldership of one single congregation, as we can give a proof of many, yea, a College of Prophets, Pastors, and Elders of many congregations at the ordination of Officers.  of the Churches either must Mr. H. warrant by Scripture, that there is such a like Judicature in every Independent congregation, which (say they) may consist of seven (and that is impossible) or that he shall be at a low ebb to prove such an ordination of officers in their Churches as is in the Word.  
As for imposition of hands; to me it is commanded in the Word, where the right way that it be not done 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, suddenly, is charged upon Timothy, before God and his Son jesus Christ, 1 Tim. 5. 21, 22. yet not so as it must be so necessary, necessitate medii, as it must be a null, and no ordination where it is wanting.  
2. It must be a Rite of designation of the person to the office, but no Sacramental Rite of obsignation of grace, as Papists make it a Sacrament.  
3. Mr. H. fails, who makes it no command contrary to 1 Tim. 5. 21, 22.  
4. This place 1 Tim. 4. 14. so straits Papists, that Bellarmin 
Menochius in loc. Presbyt. majorum, i. e. Episcoporum. Bellarm. l. 1. de Cler. c. 15. Nobis verior videtur Graecorum expositio, qui nomine Presbyterii intelligunt chorum sive coetus Presbyterorum, id est, Episcoporum. Ita & Lyran. Cajetan. Com. in loc. Manuum impositione] add significandum p●urium sacerdotum concursum. Vatablus in loc. Intelligit electionem qua à Presbyteris, i. e. senioribus Christianis Timo●●aus est electus. Maldonatus in manusc. Citato à Cor à Lapide. Notat per Presbyterium ordinem sacerdotalem. Cor. à Lap. in loc. Verba (Vatabli) sapient Haeresin. Estius Com. in loc. An soli Episcopi, an etiam simplices Presbyteri concurrant, etc. Res. modum hunc ordinationis omnibus Presbyteris esse communem constat ex Can. 3. Concilii 4 Carthaginensis. Quod & palam significat Synodius Tridentina Sess. 14. c. 3. Vide Bellarm. de Cler. l. 1. c. 15. Tilen. in Paraenes. ad Scotos. Calderwod. Altar. Damasc. c. 4. p. 159.  makes the Presbytery a company of Bishops; and so Cor. à Lap. But Cajetan. Vatablus, Maldonat. Estius, are more equitable to the Text then Mr. H. Lyran. makes the Presbytery to be Bishops.  
Mr. H. To give the essentials to Timothy an Evangelist by imposition of hands of Presbyters that are inferior to Evangelists, that are superior and extraordinary, is beyond the power of Presbyters.  
Ans. The same is objected by Papists, and by Prelaticals, as Tilenus and others. What? will Mr. H. determine whether Timothy was ordained by the Presbytery an Evangelist (for in that case his argument which he borrowed, hath Nerves) or a Presbyter? for some prelatical, men say, he was twice ordained: nor can his argument stand, except upon the popish pillar; A great Apostle or Bishop cannot be blessed by a lower Presbyter. So that the Presbytery that laid hands on Timothy must be Bishops or only Apostles: so say the Jesuits, Bellarmin, Menochus, Cor. à Lap. So Lyranus. See the answer of Didoclavius.  
2. His own men, say the Brethren, that are lower than Officers, make, unmake Officers; the people, Act. 1. (say they) have a hand in creating, that is, in choosing Mathias (for that 
There is not a contradiction between a mediate and immediate call.  is their creating) an Apostle. Ananias laid hands on Paul, Acts 9 Prophets, on Paul and Barnabas, to undergo an extraordinary charge to preach to the Gentiles, Act. 13. Mr. H. here as often deviseth a contradiction, that then the same call must be both mediate and ordinary, and immediate and extraordinary, saith he: but if mediate be taken (as it must be) for that in which men have an intervening hand, there is new Logic, but no contradiction. Parker saith, there is of man something, 
Park. de polit. Eccles. l. 3.  and much immediately from God here, as the people's praying, and casting of lots in Mathias his calling, and yet he is an immediately called Apostle. So in Paul's call, Act. 9 in the call of Paul and Barnabas, Act. 13.  
2. It's now absurd to say that an Evangelist, an Apostle, is lower than a whole College of Presbyters. See worthy Mr. 
M Gill●…. miscel. quaest. c. 8. page 103.  Gillespie.  
What means Mr. H. to object that as a paradox which Mr. R. saith, A. B. is made a Pastor indefinitely, and the Pastor of such a people only? and here is a new contradiction also, for A B. is made a Physician indefinitely, habitu, actu primo, to all, and by choice, and compact, he is made a Physician fixedly only to such a corporation: so is the Pastor A. B. Here is as poor a shift, the man expoundeth Scripture in his own congregation as a Pastor, but in another, or in his own house, as a gifted man. Let 
Suru. par. 2. c: 2. page 63.  him answer his own words: ever whom a Pastor hath no power, ●ver such he can do no pastoral act, for that is an act of principal power: But to administer the Supper of the Lord to these of another congregation is a pastoral act, and that a pastor may do to these of another congregation. So Mr. H. so Mr. Cotton, 
Greg. Tom. 3. disp. 1. q. 1. puncto 7. sect. 41. Rob. Baron. in appendic. tra. 5. de authorit. Eccles. c. 15.  so their own Discipline save this contradiction. It's too nea● popery to preach, in the chair the Pope cannot err, as a private Dostor he may err: So when a man preacheth as a pastor to the congregation, the members can no more oppose him then they can oppose the word of God; and when they hear the same man expound the same Scripture in his family, they are no more to submit to his Doctrine, though the same which he spoke in the chair, than he is to submit to their Doctrine: for he preacheth as no Pastor in his own house, but as a gifted man, saith Mr. H.  
Mr. H. Ordination and Election (saith Mr. R.) are all one by the brethren's way. Mr. H. Ans. We never said they were all ones  
Ans. True, you never said it, but you say that election gives all the essentials to an officer, and destroy ordination, and make election to be all, and so you make election all one with that which to us is ordination, and that is Mr. R. his meaning.  
Mr. H Election rightly ordered by the rule of Christ gives the essentials 
Par. 2. pag. 66.  to an officer.  
Arg. 1. Pastor and people, shepherd and flock are relatives, but relatives are mutual causes one of another; a pastor before a people choose him, is a husband without a wife. See Amesius.  
Ans. 1. Pastor and flock, i. e. a single congregat on (for this only Mr. H. means) are not adequate Relatives, for a Pastor is referred to all members of other congregations to whom he is 
The relation 〈◊〉 a fixed Pastor to his own single congregation, proves not at all, that their choice made him a Pastor.  a Pastor, and to whom he may tender, as a Pastor, the Lords Supper, 1 Cor. 10. 17. and is granted: Ergo, a pastor is a pastor to multitudes of members of other congregations, who never chose him: so that a man that hath but sipped on Logic, a● Mr. H. must thus argue, a pastor choosed and made a pastor is relatum, and referred to his own single flock, all and only choosing and making him a pastor: in which there is no sip of truth. He is not a pastor to them only, as is said, for he acts as a pastor.  
2. Dogmatickly, sure and what he says in the Synod binds not, only because it is Gospel; but (saith Mr. Cotton) also because 
Keys of the Kingdom, c. 6. pag. 15.  it is taught by a Minister, for his calling sake: (as Christ, who so receiveth you, receiveth me) the associate Churches, who never made him a pastor.  
3. Nor are all his flock, whom yet he feeds with Word, Censures, and Seals, to wit, women members of the flock, and children, and servants, the far larger part of the flock, three for one, the choosing correlate: poor souls they are as passive in acts of jurisdiction to make and unmake Pastors as brute sheep; nor can the argument be from feeder and fed simply, sheep as sheep made not their shepherd, but from feeder and the fed choosing, creating and marrying their feeder and husband; and should not Mr. H. say as true, Solomon is a married husband to three hundred women, and yet two hundred fifty of them had no causative influence, gave never consent nor oath to accept him as their husband. So neither can the Pastor be referred to two hundred and fifty women, aged children, and servants, as a part of his flock creating him a husband and feeder; for the fifty males did make him a Pastor, and they only.  
2. Amesius says, the man made a pastor without a flock, is a husband without a wife. And the Prelates did wickedly in so doing, for they were but hirelings going up and down to preach for hire, whereas the work requires a fixed labourer to every corner of the Vineyard: but it's non causâ pro causâ, and no sip of Logic, Ergo, every Pastor is so referred to his own flock, as husband and wife, so mutual consent made him a husband to them only, and a Pastor to no other, and them a spouse and wife to him only. But should the Church lose some men from their fixed charges, and send them to visit and water many planted Churches with the word and seals, these men should be lawful and edifying Pastors, not husband without wives. See Amesius, who proves Classis and Synods to be lawful from, 1. The law of Nature. 2. From common Equity. 
Amesius Theo. Medul. l. 1. c. 39 th'. 23. Par. 1. p. 95, 96   
But to return to what I had almost passed. If the laying on of hands be no specificating act of an office, because it is used in other performances, as in the sending of Paul and Barnabas to preach to the Gentiles, Act. 13. Then shall water not be essential to Baptism, nor drinking to the Lords Supper, nor blessing Sacramental in that Supper, because in Levitical Washings, in the feasts Sacred, in the Passeover, in praying for a blessing to the Word preached, all these were used. It's loose Logic, A genere ad speciem, the question is not of laying on of 
It's bad Logic, à genere ad speciem, imposition of hands is used in many other things: Ergo, this imposition of hands is not necessary to ordination of Officers.  hands in general, but of a certain kind and species of laying on of hands by way of prayer and designation. Mr. R. knows there be divers kinds of laying on of hands.  
2. Nor do I say that the Rite is essential to Ordination, but of the necessity of before.  
3. Suarez and Stapleton so argue with Mr. H. from an extraordinary command.  
1. The spirit speaks from Heaven, Act. 13. Separate me Saul, etc.  
2. The Lord names two men.  
3. He designs their work: There is here no election of the people, saith Calvin. So Mr. H. Paul was called to be an Apostle before, Act. 9 and this is for me. Though they were Apostles 
Calvin. Nulla hic electionis ab Ecclesia mentio, quia vocatio prorsus divina erat. Stapleton, in Antidote. page 409. Suarez. Tom. 3. in 3. par disp. 34. sect. 1. Non esse tune Saulum, vel Barnabam ordinatos, vel Presbyteros, vel Episcopos & impositionem manuum esse tantum deprecantium. Calvin. in loc. Solenni Ecclesiae subscription● obsignari jubet. Gual. in loc. Consecrationis Symbolum fuisse. So Diodati. D. Willet Controu. gener. 16 q. 1. August. De Baptism. l. 3. c. 16. Confess. Bohem. c. 14. Confess. Wittenberg c. 35. Book of Discipl. of Scotland, l. 2. c. 3. Synops. pur. Theol. disp. 42. th'. 31. Mr. Seaman treats of ordination, page 71, 7●. Diodati. English Divines Annotations, [Separate me] Paul and Barnabas to be held in equal degree, and intallible authority with the rest of the Apostles. Paul was not called to be an Apostle, Acts 9 nay, not until Acts 13. that is the error of Mr. Robinson Justific. of Separar. page 296.  before, the Lord will not have us to think imposition of hands a needless toy: but the wise Lord will have their calling by this solemn subscription of the Church, to be sealed, saith Calvin. as by a solemn Symbol of consecration; so saith Gualther, and Mr. H. is mistaken: we use imposition of hands, as both the Bohemian and Wittenberg confession teach; and it's not to be found in the Text, that grace was given to Paul and Barnabas thereby, but that it was used as an ordinary R●te with praying, as the Presbytery doth, verse 3. And when they had fasted and prayed, and laid their hands on them, they sent them away. See Mr. Seaman. Yea, suppose it be granted that Saul was an Apostle before, Act. 9 Yet 1. he was not such a designed Apostle, to wit, of the Gentiles until now. 2. Nor did the Church their part until now, that they laid their hands on them. 3. The English Divines and Diodati think they were not owned by the Church as Apostles until now. And I humbly doubt if they were called Apostles until now, Act. 13.  
Mr. H. If a pastor may have all his essentials without a certain flock, then may he be a pastor without it: As the Ring is completed in the Goldsmith's shop, its ready for any buyer.  
Ans. Mr. Best and Mr. H. both make the difference, That the Apostle is a pastor to all the world, but the pastor is ●●ed to a certain congregation. Then have they answered themselves; The Apostle hath all the essentials of a true pastor without a certain flock: Here is the Ring in the shop ready for all congregations. Now the Apostle and ordinary pastor differ not essentially as pastors in the latitude of preaching to all congregations, and to one single congregation, as the acts of preaching the same Christ, and of baptising in an Apostle, and in an ordinary pastor, are of the same species and nature. Mr. H. and Mr. Best will have them to be pastors different in nature; why? then but their Gospels and Seals, the formal objects of their calling, must differ in nature, as indeed they make pastors of divers congregations to differ in nature, and so as many congregations different in nature, as many Gospel's different in nature. The pastor is tied (saith he) to a certain congregation, out of which he is not to exercise pastoral acts. But is not the Apostle a pastor, and an excellent one to preach and tender the Seals, as well as the pastor? 2. Why saith he not, (as he ought, if he speak suitably to his own principles) It is not lawful for him to exercise pastoral acts without his own congregation, for its adultery so to do? and so its adultery to him to tender the Supper to those of another congregation, contrary to Mr. H. and his Brethren. 
Survey, par. 2. c. 2. p. 65. Mr. H. makes many pastors, many congregations, many preached Christ's and Gospels and Seals to be different in species & nature.  Nor can be open and shut the doors of the Kingdom in pastoral preaching to his own flock, and to twenty of other congregations, except one and the same act of preaching pastorally be a valid pastoral act to his own flock, and twenty times no valid pastoral act, but an act of a gift or Christian counsel which an unbaptized Pagan (so he have a talon and utterance) or a woman in a private chamber may also tender. We may without offence crave a warrant from Scripture for such an unheard Novelty. Yea, it ought to be proved, and not nakedly told us, That this congregation is essential to this A. B. their own pastor; for this or these sick persons are not essential to this Physician.  
2. Paul preaches the Gospel, administers the Seals an hundred times to an hundred form visible Churches; do these pastoral acts vary their nature into an hundred new species and natures, because all the hundred Churches are different in species and nature? and must there be hundreds thousands of Gospel-seals, Keys of the Kingdom, all different in species and nature? for so our Brethren vary Churches.  
Mr. H. We allow of no Pastors ordained without a certain flock (saith Mr. R.) I reply (saith Mr. H) Quid verba sudiam, cum videam facta? for if a pastor may have all his essentials without a certain flock, than he may be pastor without a flock.  
Ans. Mr. R. allows no individnum vagum, nor a prelatical Deacon made a pastor by the Prelate without any flock, nor knows our Church of Scotland any such. But I have before shown, there may lawfully, and to edification be Ambulatory and itinerary shepherds sent both to feed and gather, or plant Churches.  
2. A pastor may have all his essentials without a certain flock belonging to his essence: A man hath his essentials without aptitude to laugh, which follows his essentials; and Snow hath all its essentials without whiteness: yet I say, I neither allow nor can yield that there is a man existent in the world, but he is apt to laugh, nor Snow existent but it is white. But it follows 
This or this flock is extrinsical to the essence & nature of a pastor; yet is it naughty Logic, Ergo, the Prelates do right, and the Church ordinarily do lawfully create pastors without flocks. A Synod of N. E aught to ordain so many Pastors, lay hands on them, and pray and make them Pastors to the Americans, for planting Churches there, so the Americans profess their willingness to hear.  not hence, that when the Church calls men to the exercise of their pastoral calling, that they may lawfully ordain them all to labour in no certain flock, sure that would hinder edification, but will never prove that this flock is so essential to A. B their pastor, as the wife to the husband; or that A. B. is married to this flock only, as A. B. is married to this wife only, and to none other, so as A. B. commits adultery if he celebrate the Lords Supper in another congregation nor his own. Nor will it follow, that it is intrinsically unlawful for a Synod of New England to send 24 gracious youths understanding in the Language, ordain them pastors by laying on of hands of the Elders, and by fasting and praying, instruct them to go and act as pastors among the Savages, preaching and baptising; and their warrant is Act. 13. and here are pastors without certain flocks. If any Act. 13. say, the Spirit gives a special command there, and names Saul and Barnabas, but it's not so here: I answer, There is without question something extraordinary, Act. 13. nor are we with Seekers (too much ●ortified in their way by our brethren's Doctrine) to wait for the Lords naming from heaven john, Thomas to be preachers in such a place. But to me  

1. The nearness to the Savages,  
2. The knowledge of their Language (as I suppose)  
3. Their weak desire, or the professed not hating of the Gospel, were equivalent to a command from heaven, Go preach to the Americans, and that in the capacity as proper pastors.   
Mr. H. A Pastor is only a Pastor of that flock (saith Mr. R.) over which the holy Ghost hath set him, by the authority of his Church; but yet so, as when he preacheth to the other congregation, he ceaseth not to be Pastor, howbeit not the Pastor of that flock.  
Ans. We are then agreed: If a Pastor be [ONLY] only a Pastor to that flock, then is he not a Pastor so any beside, then can he do no pastoral acts to them.  
Ans. Great words are often small and weak Arguments His 
A pastor is the only fixed and appropriated pastor of his own flock, so as he is a pastor to all congregations on earth where by divine providence he shall be.  last answer (saith he) yields the cause wholly— We are then agreed. Mr. R. is not a whit agreed with either Independency or the present question. If the Pastor be (Only) only the Pastor (fixed, proper, actu secundo, in the exercise of calling pastoral) to that flock, then is he not a Pastor (actu primo, habitu, occasionally to act pastorally) to any beside. It's false, and we are distant the whole breadth of a contradiction. If a Physician be only a fixed Physician to Colchester to attend their sick, by a compact between him and the City, than he ceaseth to be an occasional Physician to any sick in the country, when the health of the Inhabitants of that City can permit, so as he can exercise no acts of a Physician to any beside: It follows not at all to be a pastor occasionally to all Churches, and to be a fixed pastor ordinarily and by covenant to this flock, are most consistent.  
Mr. H. That which the communion (so Mr. R.) of sister-Churches requires to be done, that pastors lawfully may do (Mr. R. ought in conscience to do.) But that a pastor as a pastor may officiate (to other congregations and their members, (saith M. R.) this the communion of Churches require in the necessary absence of the pastor, to defend the flock from Wolves. The Assumption is denied, and left wholly destitute of proof. Supply may be lent, in such cases, by Christian counsel, and by mutual consociation of advice, though there be no expression of jurisdiction, nor can we be said to take away communion of Churches, where God hath granted no right of communion.  
Ans. Mr. H. cuts and divides my Arg. for it hath a demonstration of the truth of the Assumption. Christ hath established the communion of Saints, and of all Saints in specie, and of Churches in Church-praying one for another, Church-praising one for another, Eph. 6. 18. praying always with all prayer— 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, for all Saints: but Churches as Churches 
M. H. destroys the communion of Churches as Churches, & destroys his own & his brethren's principles. Way of the Churches of N. E. c. 6. sect. 1. p. 103. We admit members of other congregations to the Lords Supper with us, for we look at the Lords Supper not only as a seal of our communion with the Lord Jesus, but also of communion with his members, and that not only with the members of our own Church, but of all the Churches of the Saints.  are Saints. Mr. H. gives us the name of communion of Saints by advice and counsel, which is the communion of Pagans and Saints; for Saints owe Christian counsel and Christian advice to Pagans and Idolaters. And Mr. H. gives us this goodly Divinity, God never granted any right of communion between Churches therefore it cannot be taken away. Hence one congregation owes no more Church-communion to another, than to Pagans; contrary to their own express Doctrine: for if the Brethren hold a communion of divers members of divers Churches in partaking of one Lords Supper at the same Table, then must they hold a communion of Churches as Churches. But the former they held, as the words cited clear.  
Mr. H. If Ministers (saith Mr. R. in his second Arg.) may labour to convert unbelieving strangers, and to add them to their flock, that they may enlarge Christ's Kingdom, then may they exercise pastoral acts over and above others than those of their own charge. 2. Divers congregations are to keep visible communion of exhorting, rebuking one another.  
Ans. Those that were no officers, but dispersed, yet preached the Gospel, Act. 8. Apollo's no officer edified those that believed, Acts. 18. 27, 38. that these may be done where no pastoral acts are, is evident.  
Ans. Mr. H. is pleased to answer my Arg. The proof is added where no need is, that which is feeble, false, that hath no shadow of truth, to wit, the consequence is not at all confirmed, nor any attempt made to that purpose. It's well known a fixed pastor in his 
A pastor as a pastor preaching to his own flock, may convert some of his own & of other congregations, & administer the Lords Supper to both.  own Pulpit preaching to his own flock, hath in the same act been instrumental to add to his own flock real converts. Let the Reader judge what truth it hath, that in the same numerical single act of teaching, the man acts both as a pastor, and as no pastor, but as Apollo's a private man only, as Mr. H. saith.  
2. Whether it be feeble or no that a pastor tenders the Lords Supper to one of another congregation (which he may lawfully do, say our Brethren 
* Way of the Churches of Ch. in N. E. c. 6. sec. 1. p. 103. Mr. H. Survey, pa. 2. c. 2. p. 65. ) as a pastor; if he tender it as a private man, I know how feebly Mr. H. and all Anabaptists and Socinians can defend this: Then there is a real truth in this, that a pastor may exercise pastoral acts to others than to those of his own charge.  
3. It seems to me feeble, though the instances of the dispersed who preached, Acts 8. and of Apollo's, Acts 18. as private Christians, and as no officers, were granted (which to me is false) therefore when a pastor in one and the same Sermon and words, preaching to his own flock, converts one of his own flock and one of another flock, that be acts as an officer, and opens pastorally the gates of the Kingdom of Heaven to the one, and acts as no officer, as not sent of God, but as a private man to the other: (except Mr. H. maintain the Socinian sending to preach) I see not how Mr. H. can here expede himself.  
4. Mr. H. will not say all that were scattered Act. 8. (for 
What sort of preachers the scattered disciples, Act. 8. were.  they were all scattered, except the Apostles, ver. 1.) did preach the Gospel, for there were of them women, ver. 3. then some of them only preached. And if Mr. H. say they were not officers, Mr. R. says they were officers, and that the extraordinariness of their condition, supplied the want of a Church calling, and let Mr. H. but attempt to bring a proof for it.  
5. If nothing extraordinary was here, l●t Mr. H. or any for him vindicate the place Act. 8. from Anabaptists, who allege the same place Act. 8. to destroy the standing Ordinance of the Ministry: and read the judicious Tractate of the Ministers of London, of Mr. Collings.  
6. I had rather believe Oecumenius and chrysostom, who judge Apollo's to be a Minister; and far rather follow Gualther, 
〈◊〉 Gualth. in Act. 18. homil. Dioda. An. Act. 18. 27. through grace] this may have relation to Apollo's, who by his authentical Ministry called grace, Rom. 1.— did much advance the Christian faith. Calvin. Com. in Act. Potens in Scriptures] docet hic locus, debere potentes eos esse in Scriptures quibus docendum est in Ecclesia.  Diodati, and Calvin, who ●each, that Apollo's was a renowned Minister, the Successor and Colleague of Paul at Corinth, 1 Cor. 3. 6. Mr. H. not caring for these Lights, without warrant of Scripture determines Apollos no officer, and so do many Anabaptists with him.  
7. Nor is there any disease in my third Arg. for take away Church-rebuking, and Church comforting, and pastoral acting of officers toward fellow-Churches, as Mr. H. expressly and in terminis doth, and turn all those into Christian counsels and advices, which Christians out of Church-order, and women owe to those that are no Churches, even to Pagans: And you  
1. Take away all communion of Church-talents, and Church-gifts and graces, for the edifying by Word or Writ sister-Churches.  
2. You destroy all pastoral and official gifts to sister-Churches in extreme necessity of ravenous Wolves raging among them: for a pastor as a pastor must be able to convince gainsayers, Tit. 1. 9, 10, 11. And suppose the officers of the Church of Sardis were sick and imprisoned, there is taken away all communion of pastoral talents to convince Arrians, Nicolaitans, the Disciples of Ebion and Cerinthus, or to strengthen and heal backsliders.  
3. The sister members of the mixed congregation, as private Christians in their closerts and houses, may pray for their sick sister, but it is unlawful for the Church to put up any Church-prayers or Church-rebukes, let them perish a thousand times: Is not the Lord offended at this wicked selfishness?  
But Mr. R. saith, That one congregation hath no power over another, 
Page 64.  nor one Classis over another.  
Ans. He bids at all, that two parallel members, two parallel Churches as perallel, are coordinate, and have no power juridical to excommunicate one another, for then one member john may excommunicate Thomas, for ex communication and juridical Court-power is not exercised by the Church as the Church, for then all and every Church had power juridical of excommunication, which Mr. R. will not yield, but it is exercised by such a Church as hath power over its own members subordinate not coordinate: But this is nothing against me; for Church-power is wider than juridical power to excommunicate: Church-power 
Church-power is broader and larger than juridical power.  includes Church-preaching, Church-hearing, Church-praising, Church-rebuking, Church-exhorting, Church-comforting, Church-tendring of the Seals. But Church-power of excommunicating i● but a branch of all these. As also this is a wide mistake in Mr. H. that he thinks, if a pastor have right to administer pastoral acts, there he hath pastoral power to challenge his right, and preach there where there are fixed pastors all 
Pag. 64.  the land over; nay, he must for the actual exercise of his right have some providential call, as is clear Christ saith, Go teach all 
Mat. 28. 19  nations, baptising them: that gives to Peter, john, yea all the Apostles, Paul and others, right to be pastors to all the earth: Yet it is clear, that for the actual exercise of that right, there is required a special call of God for the place; as  
1. Peter and john could not preach to Samaria, while God disposed so that the Apostles sent them, hearing that they had received the Gospel, Acts 8. 14, 15. Nor Peter preach to the Gentiles,  
2. While he was warned by a Vision, Acts 10. 20. & 11. 12. Nor  
3. Could Paul and Barnabas go and preach to the Gentiles: Nor  
4. Peter and Paul go, the one to preach to the Jews, the other to the Gentiles, while they had a warrant from the Spirit so to do, Acts 13. 1, 2, 3, etc. Gal. 2. 7, 8. Nor  
5. Could Paul forbear to go to Bythinia, and go to Macedonia to preach the Gospel, Act. 16. 7, 9, 10, 11, 12. without a warrant from God. Upon the same ground, though a pastor called by the Church to be a pastor, and be chosen by such a 
Though one be a complete pastor to all Churches actu primo, yet the call of God is necessary for the exercise thereof hic & nunc. Pag. 66, 67.  flock, be by his Ordination made a pastor to all congregations, yet for the actual exercise thereof, he must have a call, or some choice or desire of the people ●o preach pastorally hic & nunc, and even as the Apostles, who were called by Christ, Mat. 28. 19 to be pastors to all Nations, yet could not hic & nunc, actu secundo, exercise their calling, but by direction of the Spirit, as is said.  
And all congregations (saith Mr. H.) may justly deny hi● leave to administer either seals or censures among them, and yet he is a complete officer.  
Ans. It's a dream to say, a particular Classis or Presbytery hath called him, and yet they refuse him leave to administer seals and censures among them; that is as much, as, They have called him, and they have not called him. We now in a constituted Church, contend not for one who is ordained by the Church a pastor to all Nations, as Mat. 28. without an eye to a certain society, country or flock, either as an Ambulatory pastor (as is said, for the care of spreading the Gospel is not dead with the Apostles, as Seekers' truth) or as an ordinary fixed pastor, and 
Whoever hath a pastoral power to preach to the people, hath not a juridical power to censure them.  their obstinacy to whom he offers the Gospel, hinders him not to be a complete officer, as is clear Mat 10. 13, 14, 15. Luke 〈◊〉. 51, 52, 53. Mat. 2●. 3, 4, 5. Act. 13. 44, 45, 46. & 17. 32. & 18. 6. in many who refuse to hear and receive the Apostles, who yet are the complete officers and Ambassadors of Christ. Nor is it true, that whoever hath a pastoral power to preach, they have also a juridical power to censure the refulers to hear. The Brethren will not stand to this by their own way.  
Mr. H. The people may put a pastor out of his office, if scandalous 
Pag 68, 69.  and heretical; Ergo, they give him the office. The Antecedent is proved, Mat 7. 5. Phil. 3. 2. Beware of false teachers, beware of dogs. Mr. R. They may reject him from being their pastor, but their power reaches not so far as to reject him from being no pastor.  
Ans. Then a species may be destroyed, and the general nature remains: he is not their pastor, and yet he is a pastor in general; Thomas or John is destroyed, and yet the general nature of Thomas or John remains safe.  
Ans. If Independent Government depend upon no better Logic than this, (as too much like stuff I meet with in reviewing this Review) I trust it shall not stand. For  
1. Christ, Mat. 7. 15. speaks not to a single Independent congregation as such, which he must do, if Mr. H. dispute as a Logician. And the Argument must be thus:  
Whos● are commanded to beware of false Teachers and dogs, they may authoritatively depose officers. But women are to beware 
Mr. H. his Logic is, we are to beware of false Teachers, Ergo, the congregation may depose their officers if heretical and scandalous.  of false Teachers, and to try the spirits, and to beware of justification by circumcision, Phil. 3. yea, those that are of other congregations, and single persons, children and servants, and all Christians who are not to judge rashly, Mat. 7. 1, 2, 3, 4. all who are to pray earnestly, ver. 7. all who are to choose the narrow way to heaven, v. 13. and to know Teachers by their works, v. 16. all who are to worship God in the Spirit, rejoice in God, have no confidence in the flesh, Phil. 3. 2, 3. and thousands beside the male-Church of a single congregation, are to do all these, and women are not to receive false Teachers into their house, 2 job. 10. 11. are to beware of false Teachers. Did Mr. H. believe a judicious Reader would, or Mr. H. should pass his judgement of such toys as these?  
2. To be a fixed pastor to this flock, is no species of a pastor, but a mere accident; nor to be a pastor habitu to all the congregations 
To be a pastor to all congregations, by Mr. H. is most mistakingly made a genus, and for the same man to be a fixed pastor to he a species.  on earth, a genus to A B. but to be a pastor habitu to all congregations, is and makes A. B. as individual a pastor, as to be a fixed pastor makes him an individual pastor. A Rudimentary in Logic would not say, the same individual pastor could be a genus to himself, as homo is genus (homo is species he ought to say) to Thomas. So when an accident is removed, such as fixedness of the pastoral calling to the congregation of Boston, Mr. Cotton remains a pastor: Else I might say, When Thomas is no more a Physician to sick john, for sick john is dead, Thomas leaves off to be a Physician to any other sick person on 
To be a fixed pastor to this or that flock, is a mere accident, not a species or kind of a pastor, not to be a Pastor habitu to all congregations, can be genus to such a Pastor, as Mr. H. saith.  earth: So Thomas is destroyed as Thomas, (whereas a poor accident only to be a Physician in actual excercise to sick john is only destroyed) and yet the general nature of Thomas is still safe and maintained. The like answer is due to that which he calls a fundamental Rule, sublato uno relatorum tollitur alterum. A man would say Logic and Reason were turned upside down. Thomas is no actual Physician to john now dead, and that relation between Thomas and the dead man is gone: Ergo, Thomas himself, as a man, and his other relations to all other sick persons who call for his medicinal labours perish. Reason and Logic should perish in the man who should so argue.  
Mr. H. If a person or Presbytery have Ministerial power, they 
Par. 2. p. 70, 71.  must execute it in their own persons and places, they cannot delegate any supernatural power, or saving quality, or habit to another— the mystery of iniquity in some measure hath eaten into the Presbytery. They have taken power to ordain before election, and make indefinite Pastors, and have taken all power from the people.  
Ans. 1. The issue is, the male-Church only hath this power, to make and unmake officers: and they have of late, being not the fourth part of that which they call the only visible Church of Redeemed Ones, taken all power of Censures, so 
Presbyters may delegate messengers of the Churches.  that the rest have no consent, which is a popish domineering over their faith; whereas we hold, the Church not consenting, Censures are not to be drawn out at all: here is more popery and bratish domineering over the consciences of the officers in point of Heresy, to speak nothing of divers points of Popery, Anabaptism, Socinianism that goeth along with this way.  
2. That the Churches cannot delegate a power to Paul and Barnabas their messengers, to determine in a Synod according to the Word, can be denied by none, but such as deny Synods, contrary to Act. 15.  
3. Nor knoweth the Scripture any rule from civil Corporations, who both make and choose David and Saul Rulers and Kings, to infer that the male-Church cannot preach nor administer seals, but they both create and choose Spiritual Officers. We may long call for Scripture to prove this, but in vain, it is a Tradition that we must believe, because so say our Brethren.  
Nor is it Episcopacy for Timothy and Titus to ordain Ministers in a joint society (in collegie) (Episcopal Monarchy in Pope and Prelates.) Nor is it to ordain Pastors indefinitely, when it is done both with consent of the flock, and in reference to a certain flock. It's true, 1 Tim. 5. 22. Tit. 1. 5. there is no mention made of a Presbytery, nor is there mention there of a congregation: but Timothy cannot preach in season, and out of season 2 Tim. 4 1, 2. nor can he rebuke before all these that sin publicly, but in the congregation, 1 Tim. 5. 20. So neither can Timothy his alone prove the Deacons, 1 Tim. 3. 10. for the Apostles, Acts 6. did it not, nor would he 〈◊〉 a prelatical Monarch, his alone lay on hands, and call to the Ministry, 1 Tim. 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2. 2. for the Scripture saith a College did it, 〈◊〉 13. 1, 2, 3. 1 Tim. 4. 14. and Papists have the same ground (but it is groundless) that the Keys were given to Peter only, Mat. 16. and there is no word of a Presbytery: and Christ saith, john 21. thrice to Piter only, Lovest thou me? feed my sheep. And there is no word of a College of Apostles: but our Divines with Ier●m, Cyprian, and the Fathers, say, equal power of 
See and beware of D. B●●son of Perper. Government, c. 12. pag. 208. he abuses both Scripture and Fathers. Tilenus, jam deficiens paraenes. ad Scotos, page 10. Dunam. Conc. in Apoc. 2. Beza in Apo. 2. Reynaldus lib. Apocryph. praelect. 62. See Tilen. Syntag. disp. 26, ●7. Bucan. loc. 43. q. 39 Professor. Leydens'. in Synopsi purioris Theologiae disp. 42. thes 31. Jus Pastoris eligendi est penes Ecclesiam (ausim dicere non marium solum) ac proinde plebi commun● cum Presbyterio, jus ordinandi soli Presbytetio proprium. Cyprian. Ep. 68 Videmus de divinâ authoritate descendere, ut sacerdos, plebe praesente, sub omnium oculis deligatur, & dignus atque idoneus publico judicio ac test●monio comprobetur.  feeding, and power of the Keys was given to them all at a Synod, Mat. 28. 19, 20. joh. 20. 21, 22, 23. Acts 〈◊〉. 8. and the same objection Prelates mo●e.  
Nor shall we be against junius, Melanctho●, Whit●aker, Danaeus. The jus and right of ordination is in the Church, as in the virtual subject, to wit, in Elders and people. (But our Brethren must have a sole male-Church of Brethren.) But we may well say, the call in concreto, is that which these Divines mean● so Melancthon saith, the calling contains jus ●ligendi, vocandi, ordinandi. Other Divines speak more accurately, as the learned Professors of Leyden, who beyond all doubt follow Cyprian.  
Mr. H. These, in whose power it is whether any shall rule over 
Mr. H. Suru. pa. 2. c. 2. p. 72, 73.  them, or no; from their voluntary subjection it is, that the party chosen hath right, and stands in possession of rule and authority over them. It holds not which Mr. R. saith. Now ordination is an act of jurisdiction, such as to send an Ambassador, but that an Ambassador consent to go (such as is election) is no act of jurisdiction, for a Father to give his Daughter in marriage to one, is an authoritative act of a Father: but for the Daughter to consent to the choice is no act of authority.  
Ans. True, consenting gives n● power, but the people's giving of the pastor authority ever them, their call, and by willing subjection, delivering up themselves to be ruled by him in Christ i● an act of power. That is false which Mr. Ball and Mr. R. say, If the people could virtually give being to Pastor and Teacher, than they might execute the office of Pastors and Teachers: for Aldermen ch●se the Mayor Soldiers the General, yet nonè of them can execute the office of Mayor and General.  
Ans. 1. The proposition is printed in other Characters, and hath nothing found in it, nothing of Scripture or reason to prove it, and is a needy begging of the question.  
Those in whose power it is whether any shall rule over them or no, etc. Mr. H. seeing himself widely out, durst not assume. But it is in the people's power, whether any rule over them or no, etc. This the assumption must be, or the argument is nonsense: It's not in the people's power, whether any rule over them or no. More wild Divinity is scarue heard of, it must then be in men's power, whether there be Rulers, Apostles, Pastors, Teachers in the Church; and Government, or none at all but Anarchy and confusion: but a Divine institution was never in the power of people; but Christ Jesus 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, gave, instituted, and ordained Apostles, Pastors, and Officers in his house, Eph. 4. 11. 1 Cor. 12. 28.  
2. The proposition is false and never proved; That their voluntary subjection, whose it is to choose officers, gives formally and causa●iv●ly right of ruling to the chosen. I thus resort it, to show the falsehood of it; Then the sick man, in whose power it is to choose Thomas to be his Physician, and no other man, he gave causatively right and being to Thomas to be a Physician.  
Then 2. he in whose power it is to choose john and no other, to build him a house: he in whose power it is to choose Richard to be a School master to teach his Son, and no other Schoolmaster, 
That these in whose power it is that any should rule over them, or no, from their voluntary subjection it is, that the party chosen hath right, & stands in possession of rule and authority over them, is most false, yet a principle to Mr. H. Yea, there is a voluntary subjection to the Ministry sent in general, Isa. 52 7. Rom. 10. 14, 14. Matth. 10. 14, 40, 41. Act. 2 37. Act. 16. 30. and to every ordinance of God in converts, Act 9 6. Act. 10. 32, 33. Matth. 9 9, 10, etc. but it followeth not therefore such give a being to their ordinances. There is a difference between being a Pastor, and being a fixed Pastor to this people.  he gave causatively right and being to the party john, so chosen to be a Mason, and to the party so chosen, Richard, causatively right and being to be a Schoolmaster. Nothing more false, john was a Mason, Richard a Schoolmaster before their choosers were born. Nothing follows, but the sick man's choice made Thomas a Physician, not simply, but to him only: and so must we say of the other two, and multitudes of other examples. And ●o nothing follows from Mr. H. his argument, but only this flocks choice gave him causatively right and being, not simply to be a Pastor (ordination of the Elders, Act. 6. 6. 2 Tim. 2. 2. 1 Tim. 5. 22, etc. did that) but to be this flocks fixed Pastor: for we must distinguish betwixt a Pastor and this people's Pastor, a Pastor actu primo, and a fixed Pastor in the second acts and exercise of his calling, hic & nunc, to this people, as touching their formales rationes, if our Brethren will give us leave, if not, we value not; Scripture and good Logic are for us.  
3. Mr. Ball and Mr. R. say not in several places, yes, no where, that the people may preach and baptise, if they give causatively being to Pastor and Teacher: but the people may then do and perform as high acts official and juridical. To the impertinent instance of Aldermen and Major, I have answered.  
4. It is but ●nsis and gladius that is in the reply; for the people's delivering up themselves by voluntary subjection to be ruled by him, gives him no more being and right to be a Pastor, but only right to be their Pastor (which is accidental to their calling) than the sick man's voluntary subjection of, and delivering up of his body and health under the Lord and Creator of life, to Thomas a skilled Physician, to follow all his medicinal injunctions, gives causatively being to Thomas to be Physician, whereas he was a Physician many years before.  
Mr. H. Ordination is not an act of supreme jurisdiction, but 
Page 74.  of order rather. It gives not being nor constitution to an officer, but is rather the admission and confirmation of him in his office.  
Ans. That is said, not proved; if it be an act of order, and commanded of God, a● where the regulating of a thing, that it be not done 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, rashly, is commanded, there the thing itself is commanded, 1 Tim. 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2. 2. Then your ordinatihn by the sole male Church void of all officers, and calling of 
What being ordination confers. See Book of Ecclesiastic Discipline at Geneva. M. DCXXX. page 65, 66.  officers without officers (a thing without example in the Scripture, except where God calls immediately) wants an act of order commanded of God, and that in an ordinary way; for your way is, in ordinary the Church is before the officers and gives being to the officers.  
2. If ordination be but an approbation of the officers, who have already being, and not necessary that ordination should be where there is election of people, than it shall be strange, that there were officers at all; the calling of officers we read of in the New Testament (who yet need not be there, but are ex superabundanti, present) as Act. 1. Act. 6. Act. 13. 1, 2, 3. Act. 14. 23. 1 Tim. 4. 14 1 Tim. 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 5. 1 Tim. 3. 10, etc. and no where is there vola vel vestigium, of a command or promise to the Church destitute of officers, to call and give being to officers, nor any practice of the Apostles for it. And I am so far from owning such a Logic as Mr. H. puts upon me, The Church have not received power of excommunicating all their officers; Ergo, they have not received that power, a● neither thing, nor words, are in my mind, or book. But I 
The specific acts of calling men to the Ministry ascribed to Ministers, but never in Scripture to unofficed brethren, prove our ordination.  provoke all the Brethren for a warrant, or shadow of a warrant, by precept, by promise, by practice in Scripture for a Church void of officers, that hath power to call and give being to officers, or admit in, or cast out members, or perform any Church worship.  
3. Let it be considered, if Christ have given any jurisdiction at all, it must be in calling and in giving being to the officers of Christ's visible Kingdom: but the specific acts of giving being to the officers are to set men over the work, Act. 6. 3. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to separate and set apart for the calling, Act. 13. 2. to prove 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, before they be put in the Ministry, whether they have the requisite qualifications or not, 1 Tim. 3. 10. to lay hands on men for the office cautelously, 1 Tim. 5. 2●. to commit the charge to faithful men, able to teach others, 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 5. are ascribed to Elders, to Prophets, to 
〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  Pastors. Show me the like ascribed to your Church wanting officers. Mr. R. his comparisons of an Ambassador, etc. must stand then till you answer these often proposed Arguments.  
It is weak, that Mr. H. that the Elders of Ephesus was congregational. 
Page 86.  Mr. H. answers not my Arguments on the contrary, nor toucheth them.  
2. It's most weak to say. Doth Paul exhort the Elders, when they are assembled in the Classis to watch against rav●ning Wolves, or did they not this in their special charges? As if a Judicature of civil Watchmen, a College of Physicians were not both alone, and in their respective Assemblies to watch over the City and the sick.  
Mr. H. When Churches were completed with all officers, that 
Page 82, 83.  then ordination was acted by a College of Pastors, there is nothing in the Text saith any such thing.  
Ans. The homogeneal Church yet wanting officers (saith Mr. H.) is complete to create and call its officers, and a● Independent in an Island without officers, and hath that power, 
Par. 1. c. 8. pag. 89, 90, 91.  and no word of precept, or promise, or any such practice for such a Church creating their officers. Paul should have bid them use their power of ordaining, as the twelve Apostles, Act. 6. hids them use their power of choosing. And Paul should not have charged Timothy to usurp ordaining of officers, where there was a Church in an orderly way, being the first formal subject of the Keys to do it. And Mr. R. gives instances, where the Elders are commanded to ordain, and lay on hands, and says this command or practice is not to be found in the Word, in the hands of the people.  
My fourth Argument stands, because every twelve in a family, 
Page 89. There is an Independent Church in a family.  is an homogeneous Church. True (saith Mr. H.) but they watch one over another by family rules.  
Ans. That is a begging of the question; for a family combination hath all the essentials of a Church combination, if the Church be taken for an homogeneal association, and wanteth only the name: for they cannot watch over one another, as touching seals, and no more can any homogeneous Church of divers families so watch over one another.   

CHAP. VIII.  
Whether Covenant-right to Baptism be derived from the nearest Parents only, or from the remoter, the Grandfather's.  
MR. H. It belongs not to any ●…d ●●ssors, either nearer or 
Suru. par. 3. 6. 2. Conc. 2. page 13.  further off removed, it is from the next Parents, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, and firstly to give Covenant right of Baptism to their Child 〈◊〉 when I say Predecessors near e●…r further off, I include and comprohend all, beside the next parent— Now covenant right agrees 
Augustine dreamt not that Baptism is only right administered in a single congregation, but in the Catholic congregation, or Church. Contra Donatistas de Baptismate, l. 1. c. 11. Non iis, itaque dicimus nolite dare (Baptisnium) sed nolite in schismate dare— nec iis, quos videntur baptizaturi, dicimus, nolite accipere: sed nolite in schismate accipere— ubicunque (vel in hae, vel in illa congregatione) invenit (baptismum) non hominum, sed Dei esse cognovit, etc.  not to all other fo● them, nor can the P●… 〈◊〉 this 〈◊〉 out the next parent (in Church covenant) who is the adequate●●●s● of deriving these privileges  
Ans. 1. When Mr. H. saith, it belongeth not to remote Parent's 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, and fistly to convey Covenant right to the children, he would make the Reader believe that remote Parents have some causative influence, but not primary, as the first subject. But the truth is, if the nearest parent be the adequate cause of conveyance (as ●e saith) then shall he not leave any influence at all to remote parents.  
2. It is not the nearest parent as visibly in the covenant of 
The nearest Parents, while they are made the only conveyors of grace, the Church covenant of men is preferred to the covenant of Grace.  grace, but as visibly in Church-covenant Independent wise, by Mr. H. his Doctrine: for (saith Mr. H. ibid.) the next parents can give the privilege and title to Baptism, without any help of the predecessor.  
Hence 1. more weight is laid upon the Church-covenant 
Ans. to the 32 quest. ans. to the 10 quest. p. 28, 29, 30. Ans. to 32 qu. to 〈◊〉 qu. p. 7, 8. in which they prevaricate. Ans. to 12 qu. p. 39, 40. Ans. to 6. pag. 21, 22. Ans. to 7. 22. 23. Ans. to qu. 10. q. 10. p. 28, 29.  than upon the Covenant of Grace; and the Traditions of men are heightened above the Gospel and command of God. For suppose that judas, Magus, jezabel, who are under the Church-covenant, be never discovered, nor judicially cast out, they convey covenant-right to Baptism. But  
1. These of approved godliness and visible Saints, who cannot in conscience submit to their Church-covenant, are secluded from the Seals, and their seed from Baptism, as the places in the margin clear, and Magus and jezabel their children are admitted to Baptism for the new Church-covenant, and others, famously known to be godly to the Brethren of the congregational way, and who bring sufficient testimonial with them, (as their own words are) though the testimonial be from private Christians; yet because the testimonial is not from a Church, a Church known to them to be under a Church-covenant either implicitly or explicitly, are not admitted to Church-ordinances, and so neither their seed to Baptism.  
2. Godly so journers known to be such, and visible members broken off from Church-membership through no sin or scandal 
The woeful evils of making the nearest parent the only conveyer of covenant right to the children. See Tostat. Abulens. in Exod. c. 34. in v. 6. Gen. 9 & 10.  in them, but either through violence of persecution, or some stroke of judgement, as Pestilence, that hath scattered them, and removed the Elders by death, can have no Baptism to their children, though they be visibly in the Covenant of Grace, yet the seed of Magus and jezabel, upon the sole account of the Church-covenant; so that opus opera●um, the deed done, the want of the formality of their membership, without the contempt, reigns here as in Popery.  
3. Then by this they cannot have a wedding-garment to men's discerning, who are not inchurched their way.  
4. They are not in the Covenant of Grace, nor the visibly called of God. Nor  
5. Members visible of Christ's Body, but as Pagans and Publicans, who are not thus inchurched in the nearest parent, and their seed unclean and Pagan-seed.  
6. Then the seals were never administered according to the Rule of the Gospel until the Independent Churches arose.  
7. Nor can Egypt, Assyria, the Kingdoms of the world, be the Kingdoms of of the Lord, and of his Son Christ, as Isa. 19 25. & 2. 1, 3. Rev. 11. 15. except only in the nearest father and mother inchurched by the Church-covenant; The ●●ed of the Gentiles and their offspring blessed of the Lord, Isa. 61. 9 their seed and their seeds seed. Isa. 59 21. the enduring seed of Christ, Psa. 89 29, 36. Isa. 53. 10. Gen. 13. 15. Isa. 45, 25, by our brethren's way are but only the nearest sons and daughters 
The covenanted seed so often mentioned in Scripture, must be only the children of the nearest parent believing, the rest must be Pagans. Ans. to quest. 7. pag. 22. If you can give us a sufficient answer to take us off from that Scripture, 1 Cor. 7. etc.  of the only nearest father and mother in Church covenant. So Christ is not David's seed, for David was not (I judge) his nearest father according to the flesh. When it is said, the seed of the godly is blessed, Psal. 37. 26. his seed is mighty on earth, Ps●●. 12. 2. it must be only his nearest sons and daughters, not the thousand generations, Exod. 20. And when it is said, Praise him all ye seed of jacob, Psal. 22. v. 23. none are then invited to praise God, but the nearest sons and daughters of the nearest parents: for our Brethren (from whence is the marrow of Mr. H. his Book) tell us, the 1 Corinth. 7. 14. seems to limit the foederal sanctity or holiness to the children, whose next parents, one or both, were believers— for if we go one degree beyond the next parents— we might baptise the children of all the Turks, and of all the Indians: and if so, all the huge multitude of sons and daughters coming in to the Church, that make an eternal excellency, Isa. 60 4 15. and the joy of many generations, who shall inherit the land for ever, v. 21. to whom the Lord shall be an everlasting light, v. 19 shall be the children only, whose next parents, one or both, are believers. But we think the second Command, Exod. 20. takes the Brethren off that Scripture.  
8. And such ups and downs, and leaping like Locusts and Frogs from earth to water, and from water to earth, hath not been heard: for how often are Independent members in the Covenant of Grace, and Christians, and out of it again as Pagans, and their seed Pagans, and their seeds seed Pagans? If all the fastening of an everlasting covenant to a Kingdom, be only nearest parents, and if they break the Charters of Heaven, all Covenant-mercies are canceled to the seed, and the seeds seed.  
9 If we speak with Scripture, the adequate cause of covenant 
The adequate cause of covenant-love from fathers to children is free grace.  love to fathers and sons, is the free grace of God, Deut. 7. 7, 8. & 10. 15 2 Sam. 7. 23. 24. Luke 1. 50, 68, 69. Eph. 2. 4. the conveying subordinate cause, is sometime a family, as Abraham, not as a physical parent only, to convey the covenant-right only in the direct blood thread or blood-line from parent to child, but as both Physical and Moral, or Oeconomick parent; for Abraham getteth the covenant-charter given to him, and not only to his blood-seed, but to strangers and servants born under him, to the sons of his servants, Gen. 17. 7. 12. It's given to Cornelius and his house, Act. 10. 48. & 16. 33. sometimes to Samaria a great city, Act. 8. to Macedonia, to a great kingdom: Exod. 3●. I am the God of thy fathers, the God of Abraham. Now Abraham was not their next parent: Deut. 10. 11. He gives the land promised to the fathers. Luke 1. 72. He saved us, to perform the mercy promised to our fathers; v. 73. to remember his holy covenant; v. 74. The oath which he swore to our father Abraham. Acts 2. The promise (v. 39) is to you, and to your children: What? only to your nearest children? yea & to all that are afar off even as many as the Lord our God shall call. 2 Cor. 6 16. I will be their God, and they shall be my people; 
The covenant that the Lord will be our God, must extend further than to the nearest seed.  according to that, I will be thy God, and the God of thy seed, Gen. 17. 7. Either must this fail in the New Testament, or we have no more right to the promises made to Abraham, than the children of Pagans have; for if their nearest parent believe. they have covenant right, but that is but a yesterdays charter: yea, though the children do worse, and corrupt themselves more than their fathers, Judg. 2. 19, 20. Deut. 29. 25. Ezek. 2. 3. yet if they repent, Leu. 26. 42. then I will (saith God) remember my covenant with jacob, and also my covenant with Isaac, and also my covenant with Abraham will I remember, and I will remember the land— I will not cast them away, etc. Nor is this a Tempore●●●rcy only, 〈◊〉 Ezek. 38. 24, 25. 1 Kings 11. 32. & 8 19 〈◊〉 Kings 19 34. & 20. 〈◊〉. Psal. 132. 10 Isa. 37 35. Now if the Parent nearest be the adequate cause, the mercy is not conveyed by David, o● for David's sake, as the Scripture saith, more than to the wildest Pagan. And that 1 ●or. 7 14. must be meant of the farther off children, as Rom. 11. 16. If the root be holy, so are the branches; he means the branches to be graffed in again, v. 23. the branches beloved for the father's sake, v. 28. far off branches, not yet ingraffed again, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in, v. 25, 26.  
Mr. H. In the place Exod. ●0. the Lord ●ies not himself to a law, but walks in breadth, as best be●●om● his Wisdom; so ●e eximes some from the threatening, and withhelds the expression of his love from others.  
Ans. The expressions of the Lords love and mercy, is one thing, (the Lord useth the latitude of sovereignty here) and the extending of covenant-mercy to the thousand generations, is a far other thing.  
2. When Mr. H. saith, that the Lord withholds the expressions of his love from others in the thousands mentioned, if he mean the expressions of his covenant-love, (as he must, what is this from contradicting the words of the Text? Calvin (whom Mr. H. 
Calvin. Instit. l. 11. c 8. sect. 20. Promissio de propagandâ in mille generationes Dei misericordiâ, quae etiam frequenter in Scriptures occurrit, & in solenni Ecclesiae soedere inseri●ur, Ero Deus tuus, & feminis 〈◊〉 post ●e. Perkins in 2 Com. ●●lv. ib. Quia non perpetuam hic figere regulam voluit legislator, quae suae electioni. deroga●et.  misciteth) saith, it's meant of covenant-mercy to be propagated to the thousand generations, according to that, I will be thy God, and the God of thy seed. Now neither Scripture nor Calvin ever meant by seed, the nearest seed of the nearest parent only: Quod D●… gratia (inquit Calvin) in fam●… p●orum aeterna resideat. Perkins is as clear in this. I wonder that Mr. H. was not afraid to cite these worthy servants of God, for an opinion so repugnant diametrally to the letter of the Scripture: and  
10. To the longanimity and patience of God. For an earthly Prince making a covenant of grace with a man and his family, were it grace and gracious dealing to cut off all his posterity for the fault of only the nearest parents, so as all the rest of the blood-line should be to him as damned Traitors and Rebels? And  
11. It close everts the liberty of God in his free election of grace; for doth not Scripture and Experience teach, that the Lord never sent his Gospel to a Nation, but he had there among them his chosen ones, both of the seed of the Elect and Reprobate, Acts 18. 9, 10. and therefore the Nation called of God by the Gospel, is also the chosen of God, and the loved of God, according to the most precious part: So the Scripture, Deut. 7. 7, 8. & 10. 15. Eph. 1. 1, 2, 3. 1 Cor. 1. 26, 27. Psal. 132. 13, 14. 15. & 147. 19, 20. Now if he should e●●t off men from the covenant for the real defection of the only nearest parent, he must remove the Gospel for the same defection, and conclude himself that he should not choose to life the children of some Reprobates, contrary to Scripture: and it's as great a wonder to me, that Mr. H. should claim to Zanchius for this opinion, 
Zanch. tom. 4. l. 1. de secundo Praecepto, cap. 14. p. 375. Unde etiam apparet, non esse verum, quod quidam ex hoc loco colligunt, nimirum ●orum parentum, qui à foedere exclusi sunt, propter suas, scilicet, iniquitates, & def ctionem à Deo) eorum etiam liberos exclusos esse; pugnat hoc non solum cum aeterna electione, ut dictum est, sed etiam cum promissione facta, Abrahae, 17. ero Deus tuis, & seminis tui post te, in generationibus sempiternis promissio fit Abrahae & semini ejus, ergo eorum qui à semine Abrahae, nemo à foedere hoc excludebatur, etiamsi ex proximis parentibus impiis & idololatris natus esset; ratio est, quia intermedii patentes impli continuationem foederis in liberis non impediebant— Rom. 11. Quid enim si quidam non crediderunt, etc.  for he expressly refutes it.  
Mr. H. They who imitate the sins of parents may expect plagues, they that follow the obedience of faithful parents may expect mercies.  
Ans. It's impertinent; for such as follow the sins of parents are none of the thousand generations of them that love God, not the latter, of them that hate God.  
2. Though both these be true, Mr. H. must prove that mercies promised Exod. 20. are covenant-mercies derived from the nearest parents only, else he saith nothing for his own cause.  
Mr. H. The mercies here promised are not all the particular blessings and privileges that the parents were possessed of. Israel wanted circumcision forty years in the wilderness, and in the time of the judges, and in the 70 years' captivity they wanted sundry privileges they enjoyed under David and Solomon; the mercy here must be grace and glory.  
Ans. 1. This is for me: But when Mr. H. would have Infants of nearest parents excommunicated, to be excluded both from Baptism and Covenant-mercy, and have them in the case wholly with the Infants of Pagans, they must be excluded from grace and glory; else Mr. H. must show, with Anabaptists, some way of Salvation of Infants who are without the covenant, and so have no share in that only precious Name by which men are saved.  
2. I hope Mr. H. will not say, Israel wanted circumcision in the Wilderness for the sins of their nearest parents only; there was a physical impediment; the Lord, who loves mercy better than sacrifice, would not have Infants wounded in that wearisome journey: Nor was it for their nearest parents Idolatry only, but because they and their fathers from Egypt until that day, Ezek. 2. 3. rebelled, they were deprived of this other privilege.  
3. Mr. H. must prove, that the people in the Wilderness, in 
Ps. 85. 8, 9, 10. Heb. 3. 17. Judge 9 19 Ezek. 2. 3. 2 Chron. 36. 14, 15, 16.  the time of the Judges, a stiffnecked generation, who did worse than their fathers, despised, mocked and killed the Prophets, were all of them visible converts, a generation of lovers of God, and such as kept his commandments.  
Mr. H. This being the meaning, as Calvin, Zanchius, Junius, Perkins, what inference can be made for the conveyance of the right of Baptism from remote parents to children, I know not; for how doth this agree to children to love the Lord, and keep his commandments, who are not yet capable, being not come to years to put forth such acts?  
Ans. I shall not invite Anabaptists to triumph in pulling this 
Mr. H. denies covenant right to baptism to Infants, as Anabaptists do, because they do not actually love & obey God.  Argument for Infant-baptism from our Divines; for if the words must be expounded of actual love to God, and actual obedience in Infants; so that, if Infants be not capable of actual love and obedience to God, the covenant-mercy must be broken off in all Infants who die before they can come to years to actually to love the Lord, and keep his commandments; And if the flux of covenant-mercy be suspended, while Infants come to be capable to actually love God and obey him; where then shall be covenant right in the males of the Jews to be circumcised, and in the Infants born of covenanted parents under the New Testament to be baptised? For the Argument, if any be, must be thus:  
To such as cannot actually love God and keep his commandments for want of age, there be no covenant-right to Baptism 
Yea, Infants of Turks come to age, if they actually love & actually obey God, and by faith lay hold on his covenant the Lord extends mercy to them, I● 56. 4, 5, 6, 7 thin infants have nothing by nearest or remote parents, but what they have without them. Survey, par. 3. 〈◊〉. 2. p. 15, 16.  conveyed. But this want of age and capacity to love God and actually obey him, is in all Infants in Old or New Testament; except Mr. H. mean, that nearest parents can supply the want of capacity, and infuse actual understanding to Infants, that they may actually love God, and keep his commandments, which remote parents cannot do, which is a mystery I am yet to learn. But to the Reader it is clear, that Infants have no right to Baptism until they come to years to actually love God; Ergo, they should not be baptised until they be converted. But again, no Anabaptist teacheth, that any are to be baptised by covenant-right from parents near or remote, except they personally believe and profess actually: and the very like Mr. H. saith.  
Mr. H. Where shall we stand if a thousand generations have interest in Baptism? Then the children of Turks cannot be excluded, for some of them are found between us and Adam.  
Ans. Is not this to cavil at the Lords words, not at us? so they set this Conjecture down as a part of their Discipline; It's not above 66 generations from Noah to Christ,— and if God's mercy to a thousand generations may fetch in the children of excommunicated 
Way of the Churches of N. E. c. 4. sec. 6. p. 87.  persons, the same promise may fetch in all Turks and Infidels at this day. But I pray you are Turks such as love God and keep his commandments? are not Turk's avowed enemies to Christ and the Gospel-covenant? and so for many generations have deserted the covenant and visible Church, so that they are no visible Church, the Lord having removed the Candlestick: Can this be said of children born in the visible Church, either of the Jews or of Christians professors, because their nearest parents are extreme wicked or excommunicated, since they are yet born in the visible Church where the Candlestick is? shall the children be cut off from circumcision, since the Lord for Abraham, for David's sake, for the holy Roots sake (not the nearest, who were most unholy, and cast out, Rom. 11. 7.) gives circumcision and Church-room to the branches, Rom. 11. 16? And if the child of nearest parents excommunicated be born in 
Way of the Churches, ib. c. 4. sect. 6. p. ●8.  a believers house, or resigned to a believer, to be brought up as his own, he is to be baptised, say our Brethren; but the being so born, hinders not the child's cutting off from the covenant. Where then is his covenant-right to baptism? It's either from his remote parents, which we say; I will be thy God, and the God of thy seed: or from his nearest excommunicate parents. This latter Mr. H. denies: or from the Believer, in whose house he was born. If so, we shall not contend, than the covenant-right is not broken and removed, because the nearest parents are excommunicate. Some parental covenant-right is conveyed to this Infant, which is not conveyable to the Infant of a Turk.  
2. Mr. H. hath the words of the second Command for his party: for, i● the nearest parents excommunication deprive the children of all covenant-mercy and right to the seals, the words should be false, and the Lord should be less in showing mercy, in extending it to one generation only, to the nearest children only, for their nearest parents loving of God, and keeping of his Commandments, and more abundant in severity of justice, in visiting the sins of the Fathers upon the Children, unto the third 
Mr. H. his exposition of the second Command, overturns the gracious intent and sense of the Lord in both threatening and promise.  and fourth Generation of them that hate him. But this turns the promise and the threatening of the Command upside down, for mercy is so extended to Father's nearest & nearest Children, and punishing justice to four, and the command extends mercy unto thousands, & justice to only four Generations. Now two Generations, as they are fewer than four, so are they far more fewer than a thousand Generations: as also, if mercy extended to a thousand Generations, only be upon condition, they imitate their godly parents (saith Mr. H.) by loving (actually) and obeying (actually) his Commandments, especially that of the truth of his worship, then is mercy not extended to the nearest one generation of Infants; for it is certain the nearest one generation of Infants cannot be yet capable (saith Mr. H. with the same 
Suru. par. 3. c. 2 page 16.  breath) being not come to years to put forth such acts of actual love and obedience in worshipping the true God, as he hath commanded in his word: and if mercy be not extended to one generation, nor Covenant-seals to Ishmael, for Abraham's, nor to Esau for Isaac's sake, contrary to all Scripture: the Lord shows not mercy to thousands of generations, because not to one generation. And so again, the promise of mercy is destroyed, for the condition of actual love, and of actual obedience is physically impossible to all sorts of Infants, both of Parents loving or hating God.  
And 3. the sweet and merciful proportion is destroyed, for God punisheth Infants Children of Achab, of the Am●lakites, of jeroboam in the cradle, though these Infants be as uncapable to bow the knee to Idol gods, or to imitate the Idolatry and actual abominations of their Fathers, as the Infants of godly parents are to imitate the actual love and obedience of their parents: and yet the Scripture and experience teach, that justice proceedeth to four generations against the one: And Mr. H. denies that mercy goes along to the thousand generations with the other, because poor Infants on the breast cannot bow their knee and pray in faith to God, and do the like acts of true worship, as their godly parents do: and yet Mr. H. fathers his meaning upon Calvin, Zanchius, junius, Perkins.  
Mr. H. The next parents being excommunicate, cannot give to the child the right which they have not themselves. 
Par. 3 pag. 18.   
Ans. I grant, because they are not the sole and adequate cause of conveying covenant-right to the children. But where then (saith Mr. H.) shall we stand, how shall it be conveyed to remote parents? The answer is easy, so long as the nearest children 
When, and how the posterity are cast off.  of excommunicate parents are born in the visible house, where the King yet dwells, and the golden candlestick is not removed, the children are heirs to the remote parents, the children are followed with covenant-mercy, passing by the nearest parents: (saith the Lord) for my servant David's sake, 1 King. 11. 32, 34, 36. he would not destroy judah for his servant David's sake, 2 King. 8. 19, 2 King. 19 34. 2 King, 20 6. for the promise is not laid down in the hand of the nearest parents only, but in their hands with whom first God signally covenants, as with Abraham, David, with the three thousand baptised, Act. 2. 39 and their children, and all that are afar off, and as many as the Lord shall call with the seed, with Samaria and theirs, Act. 8. so long as a calling Gospel is there: This shall not fetch in the Turks. How will Mr H. with so short a good night of Christ break off the longanimity of God to the seed for their nearest parents, if they break a new congregational covenant? Yea, if by persecution, and through no sin of the nearest parents, they be broken out of congregation-state, presently the Candlestick is removed from the seed, and a bill of Divorce sent to the whole race, and they banished out of the house, and declared Pagans. O Scriptureless cruelty, to make God to break the covenant first, the parents continuing in covenant-obedience and suffering for Christ!  
Mr. H. Men of approved piety in covenant with God visibly, are to be admitted to the seals (saith Mr. R.) but (saith Mr. H.) gracious men be pertinacious.  
Ans. Pertinacy in a scandal mars approved piety; but because they approve not your way, are they therefore pertinacious?  
Mr. H. To be a member of the visible Church in general, and 
Par. 3. pag. 20.  have no particular existence of membership in any particular congregation, is a fancy, as to say there is a part of manhood not existing in John, Thomas, or any Individuals.  
Ans. Mr. H. fancies there is a promise of continuing on the Rock made to the congregation in general, and yet this or that congregation falls off the Rock.  
2. Mr. R. his Church-general is no abstract generick nature, but an individual integral Catholic body, existing in all the earth; and one is baptised a member to all congregations jure, and exists and dwells in one only: as a man may have right to all City-priviledges, and yet may reside, and actually enjoy only the City privilege of London. Mr. H. imagines that our Catholic integral Church is genus, and the Congregation species: and if so, the Church of Boston should be the whole integral Catholic Church, and the little finger the whole body of john.   

CHAP. IX.  
A new device of Mr. H. his two sentences, the official and dogmatical sentence of officers, yet not concional, nor juridical, and another juridical of the male-Church, is examined.  
MR. H. It is the office of Rulers dogmatically to discover the mind of God, and the mind of Christ, in convincing by witnesses 
Par. 3. c. 3. pag. 41.  the offenders, and preparing the cause. And the brethren have no more power to oppose the sentence of the Censure thus prepared, and propounded by the Elders, than they have to oppose their Doctrine, for the Elders may preach it as the word of God, by virtue of their office.  
Ans. 1. Scripture tells us nothing of two sentences.  
2. Two Judicatures which lead witnesses. 
Two new Judicatures, one dogmatical, or official by the Officers, another Juridical by the male-Church, must be an unwarrantable 〈◊〉 〈◊〉   
3. Two sorts of binding Judges. This then is will-worship.  
2. No Scripture tells us of leading of witnesses to convince Delinquents concionally, by way of preaching, Old or New Testament, not Mr. H. must here speak, Rev. 2. 2, 14, 20. Acts 15. Matth. 18. 1. 1 Cor. 5 1, 2. 1 Tim. 5. 22. and elsewhere we read of but one juridical censure by the whole Court, and of one sentence: If he h●a● not the Church, etc. they are not Apostles but liars, Rev. 2. 2. jezabel should not be suffered to teach. Who can dream that these w●… first concluded dogmatically, or aught to have been so c●…ded by the officers in one Court, and then were concluded juridically by the male Church?  
3. These words, T●●l the Church, whether must they be then, t●…ll the Officers, that they may dogmatically determine, or tell the male-Church that they may juridically determine? and yet, one of these bear the name of the Church, by our brethren's way.  
Or 3. Tell the Church of Redeemed ones, which is their only Church. The first is our Church of Rulers, which they cannot endure: the other two cannot subsist.  
4. Who gave ruling Elders a joint power to preach juridical sentences, which must bind the unofficed brethren as the preached Word of God, for they have no calling to labour in the word and doctrine, 1 Tim. 5. 17? and how can they preach, except they be sent, Rom. 10. 14, 15?  
5. How can rude and unlettered men, who labour not in the word and doctrine, by virtue of their office dogmatically resolve deep points of Heresy, more than unofficed brethren, and predetermine their conscience? should the ruling Elders lips that way preserve knowledge? and should they as the Messengers of the Lord of Hosts, with the pastors, carry the Word of God so binding others? What they do in Synods is a far other thing, for there they act juridically rather than dogmatically, and jointly with Pastors and Doctors.  
6. This sentence must lay bands upon the consciences of the male Church, so that there is nothing left to them but to obey; and can obeying and submitting to the Word leave any room to judging in an authoritative way? sure, by this they must either hear and believe after a popular judging, or then reject, and so must women and children of age; and what place then is left to juridical sentencing by the Elders or Brethren? yea, so the Church's freedom of judging is none at all, when the Church may no more oppose that dogmatic sentence, than they may oppose the Word of God in the mouth of their officers? and what greater power can be given to any, than what is given to this Independent Eldership?  
7. When there is a contradiction between the two sentences, which of the Judicatures must be supreme? If the dogmatic be supreme, they may dogmatickly determine, that the fraternity ought to be excommunicated for opposing the Word of God in their sentence; and who can excommunicate an Independent Church? And again, when the Elders themselves turn Wolves, who then can give out an official and dogmatic sentence against them? that must be wanting: and hath not the like of this brought forth among Brownists reciprocal excommunications?   

CHAP. X.  
Of Synods and their Power.  
MR. H. Synods are necessary for union in the Churches: In the multitude of Counsellors there is safety, Acts 15. Prov. 16.  
Ans. Union in truth and peace among Churches, say these Churches, must make one visible Body; then ruptures, renting, 
Union or division among associate churches, say the associate churches, must make up one visible body.  scandals, must say there is in this body visible, a necessity of Government and Jurisdiction must be incident to that visible body, which they deny: for this union must be a professed union, to speak and think the same thing, Phil. 2 2. c. 4. and this is visible union; and so they must meet, not in their members (that is impossible) and here is a visible Church meeting, (for Civil it is not) debating, advising about matters of government of the House of God. So strong is truth.  
Mr. H. There are associations of divers sorts, Classis, Synods, 
Survey, par. 4. p. 2. par. 1. c. 13. p. 230, 238. Reasons of the Dissenting Brethren, pag. 118, 119, 120. Suru. Par. 4. c. 1. p. 6.  Provincial, National, Oecumenick.  
Ans. 1. A general Council is before mocked as a nothing, and the Brethren bring arguments against the being and nature of Synods, Commissioners, Representees: The contrary is here asserted.  
Mr. H. The acts must 'tis (saith Mr. R.) 〈◊〉 Ecclesiastic Decrees.  
Ans. Ambignity, darkness: to bind as a part of Scripture, is 1. That which is contained and clearly deduced from Scripture. Or 2. that this act of decreeing issuing from the immediate revelation and assistance of the Spirit, maketh that which is decreed to be Scripture: in the former sense acts tie as good advice and counsel only; in the latter they tie not as Scripture.  
Ans. No man (I do not say its done consultò) more darkens. I brought three members to clear the matter. Mr. H. leaves 
Mr. H. his mistake as touching the burdens of the acts of Synods, which is, that they tie the conscience only as the godly counsels of women tie men. M Cotton of the keys, c. 6. p. 25.  out the third, and darkens all: for acts of Synods lay on bands neither as formal Scripture, for they come not from the immediately inspiring Spirit, nor yet only as clear and infallible deductions from Scripture, for so the counsel of a woman Abigail, infallibly deduced from the sixth Command, laid a burden upon the conscience of David. And this is all the tie that Mr. H. gives to Synods, they tie as godly counsels of women and servants. But Mr. R. and so Mr. Cotton, gives a third member, they lay burdens on the consciences of the Churches, not for the matter only, as the godly advice of women, but formally, as from the Ministerial Authority of the Commissioners. And this power Mr. Tho. Goodwin and Mr. Ph. Nye give to all Ministers 
Preface to the Treatise of the Keys.  over their congregations: So as these three shall be Judges of Mr. H. his great mistake in this distinction. Hence two contradictions are here: Mr. H. gives no power to Synods, but power of advising, such as women over men. Mr. Cotton offends at that, and says, that Synods have a Ministerial power over the Churches. In the former Mr. H. leaves his Brethren, and sides with Socinians and Arminians. And Mr. H. shall 
Socin. contra Gabr. Ementropium, c. 1. p. 7. Socin. Res. 11. add Resp. Andr. Volam. Nullis deinceps hominibus, etc. Smalcius Ref. lib. de Error. Aria. 1 c. 1. p. 6. Qui vult sensum Scripturae ab illis peti, qui post Apostolos vixerunt, dum hoc facit, tacitè deserit Scripta Apostolica, etc. Epist. ad 3. th'. 8 disp. 26. th' 10. disp. 32. th'. 1. Remonst. Apol. c. 25. fol. ●94. fol. 282, 283. Armin. disp. 58. n. 3.  confess the weakness of this distinction, if applied to doctrines delivered by Pastors to the flock; for they neither bind as women's godly counsels deduced from Scripture only, not do they bind as immediately inspired formal Scripture.  
2. The first and formal subject of the power of the Keys is the male-Church of the congregation (saith Mr. H.) yea, not that only, saith Mr. Cotton, a part of the power of the Keys is in a Synod.  
The Dissenting Brethren gave in a Paper to the Committee 
Paper, anno 164●. S p. 13. The dissenting Brethren of the famous Synod at westm their judgement of Synods and Presbyteries.  of Accommodation at Westminster concerning Synods, etc.  
1. At these meetings, let them pray, and expound Scripture, resolve difficult Cases of Conscience.  
2. They may dogmatickly declare what is the will of Christ in these cases: and this judgement ought to be received with reverence and obligation 〈◊〉 from an Ordinance of Christ.  
3. If the doctrine or practice of any Congregation be erroneous, hurtful, or destructive to holiness and peace of that, or of other congregations, they are bound to give an account thereof to the Classis or Synod.  
So we owe a reason of our hope 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to every one, women and Magistrates that are scandalised, 1 Pet. 3. 15. Rom. 14. 15. 1 Cor. 10. 31, 32.  
4. The Classis and Synod may examine, admonish, and in case of obstinacy declare against that congregation.  

1. This is but toward an offending Church.  
2. A brother or wom●n may declare against, or withdraw from obstinate offenders, though not as from a Church.   
5. The Classis or Synod may judge of any who deserve excommunication.  
6. If the particular Eldership refuse to do their duty, the Classis aught not only to withdraw communion from them, but also to exercise the sentence of excommunication themselves.  
This was refused by some; but it's a great testimony from Adversaries for Presbyterial Government, only it wants Scripture.  
7. In the case of an appeal from an unjust sentence, the Classis may repeal (they say not, by the power of Jurisdiction, for a Christian woman, a Martyr, repealed the Acts of Trent) the 
Mr. Baily in his vindicat. ann. 1655. p. 48. If Synods have no jurisdiction, heretical Elders of a congregation (as he solidly saith) Arrius, Macedonius are safe from all censures to the world's end.  unjust sentence, if the congregation be obstinate.  
8. The Classis or Synod may ordain Ministers for congregations that have not a sufficient Ministry.  
In all this (except the sixth) much is yielded, and nothing is yielded. For  
1. Every godly counsellor, man or woman, as a counsellor, by the fifth Command is above such as are counselled, being honoured to carry the mind of God, as a private messenger of God, beside that the counsel for the matter binds the conscience: So David saith to a woman, 1 Sam. 25. 32. Blessed be the Lord God of Israel, which sent thee this day to meet me.  
2. They insinuate a distinction of erroneous doctrine hurtful to holiness, and some erroneous doctrine not hurtful to holiness; whereas he who commands us to be holy as he is holy, 1 Pet. 1. 16. commands all sound opinions in fundamentals, or all revealed truths; nor can it but be hurtful to holiness, to have erroneous opinions of God and Christ, such as Socinians, Antinomians and Familists, and others have.  
3. They do not with Christian candour set down their mind concerning Synods and Classis, as they call them, nor confirm what they say by Scripture.  
Mr. H. If a heathen turn a member of the jewish Church, he 
Par. 4. p 7. 8.  is by Mr. R his way, by the Law of Nature to submit to jewish ceremonies, because every-member of the corporation must be under the Laws of the whole: This shall make every Law positive to be the Law of Nature.  
Ans. Not so: It's the Law of Nature in general, that the 
It is the Law of nature that the part be ruled by the where in the general, & not in every particular.  whole rule the part, but it follows not, Ergo every member is to submit to every positive Law of the whole, though most unjust, the member is t●… submit to every Law of Nature commanded by the whole: The little finger infected with a Gangrene, is to submit to the whole man, that it be cut off for the safety of the whole body, but it's against particular nature that it be cut off, but most suitable to universal nature. So in the general, its natural for the creature rational to obey the Creator; but it follows not, but it's a mere positive Law that Peter give his life for the Gospel, when God by a positive command calls him to it; and the Law positive, if Divine, i● not contrary to the Law of universal Nature. Mr. H. frequently in such purposes slips.  
Mr. H. The division of a Nation into Provinces, of a Christian Province into Territories or Presbyteries, is either a device of man, or a Divine Institution. 
The division of a Christian Nation into Provinces, territories & Presbyteries, is neither a device of men simply, no● simply a divine institution, but a mixed ordinance.   
Ans. If a device of man be taken for an act of Christian prudence, it is then neither simply the one nor the other, but mixed of both; for a device of man is taken in an evil part, for an unlawful forgery, as 1 King. 12. 33. Host 13. 2. Psa. 106. 39 and so whatever is an act of Christian choice, is not a device of man.  
Mr. H. That which is acted by one, and may be altered by another Prince, is a device of man. But such is the division of a Nation into provinces.  
Ans. That which is in question is not concluded, the division of a Christian Nation into Presbyteries and Provinces according to local bounds and Mathematical inches, is alterable; and so a congregation Independent of 350, rather of 349, or 360, is alterable, shall it not upon reason be an alterable device? The quantity of water in Baptism, of wine that every one drinks at the Lords Supper, how long the pastor shall preach, two hours or three, are alterable, as to the quantity, by men; but for that the Ordinances of a congregation, of water in Baptism, are not devices or forgeries of men, that there should be such associations of Provinces, of Territories, for convenient feeding, 
Page 6, 7.  governing, and Mr. H. granted for counselling, Mr. Cotton for command and use of the Keys yields also; so the question shall not be of the subject, but of the power and of the bounds, where acts of free choice of rectified reason for civil ends also have place. But the Conclusion is naught. So, That which is not in the Word (saith he) is a device of man. I assume, the 
Par. 4 p. 10.  frame of the meetinghouse for congregational Worship, the number, names, trades, callings of members, the quantity of 
Mr. H. his mistake of individual moral acts and the mixture in them.  water in Baptism, the quantity of Bread that every one eats a● the Lords Supper, are no more in Scripture, than the Territories or bounds of Presbyteries, yet are they not for that humane devices.  
Mr. H. It is doubtful that all our singular actions (as Mr. R. saith) are mixed, for eating and drinking must be for God's glory, and Omnis actio in individuo est moraliter bona vel mala.  
Ans. If Mr. H. doubt of this, Ames, Didoclavius can speak 
D. Ames fresh suit against D. Eurg●s. Didoclavius altar. Damasc. c. 9 p. 495, 496, 497. Hieron. Ep. ad Aug. in Epist. August. 11. Bonum est continentia, malum est luxu: i●, inter utrumque indifferens ambulare, capitis naribus purgamenta projicere— Scotus in 2 dist. sen. 7. q. unic. Thom. 1. par. q. 103. q. 13. art. 8. Lombard. 2 dist. 40. Durand. l. 2. dist. 40. q. 1. not. 6. Siactus sequatur rationem deliberatam, sic impossibile est aliquem actum esse indifferentem, sed necessariò quilibet est bonus vel malus moraliter— quia ordinatur ad finem debitum à ratione deliberatâ. Gregor. de Valent. Tom. 2. disp. 2. q. 13. de bonit. & mali●. act. hum. puncto 6. Omnis actio à deliberatâ ratione, (non à sola imaginatione, ut cum qu●s fricat barbam,) p●ocedens, est individuo aut bonus, aut malus secundum circumstantias; Quia vel habet finem debitum, vel non debitum.  to it. There is such a thing as an action indifferent, as Augustine saith, or rather Jerome, that is neither good nor evil, but it is not a humane action properly, as to spit or purge the nose. But see all the Schoolmen, Scotus, Thomas, Lombard, and all that writ upon them, and you shall never read this new Axiom, Omnis actio in individuo est moraliter bona v●l mala. Durandus indeed, and the Schoolmen say, that every act individual which followeth deliberate reason, is necessarily either morally good or evil. See Greg. de Valentia.  
2. For the mixture of our actions; its clear there is something physical in eating at the Lords Supper, as the word hath not set a rule concerning the physical quantity of Bread and Wins, so there be not too much, for it is not to feed the body, nor too little, for it must work upon the senses. And there is in praying, preaching, the tone, the accent of the organs, of the voice, and their motion: so that we eat and drink for God, and soberly and seasonably, is moral, and squared by the word; but a man sins not in eating quickly or lently, in the house, or in the garden, or sometime in his bed, sometime at midnight, upon necessity.  
Mr. Hooker errs not a little. in calling the acts of the Synod, Act. 15. Counsels, such as godly men and women, who are not Apostles and Elders, may give to others: for counsels are not burdens laid upon the people and Churches, by the wisdom and authority of the Holy Ghost.  
2. By Apostles and Elders, who sharply rebuke the pressers of circumcision, as subverters of the souls of people.  
3. Neither are they indifferent advices, ●hich they might reject, but these they could not reject, without despising God and the Holy Ghost, the very thing that the Lord saith, he that despiseth you, despiseth me: which cannot be said of a counsel of the Heathen man to a Christian. It is (saith Mr. Cotton) an 
Mr. Cotton Keys of the Kingd. c. 6. p. 23. Synods have more than power of counselling.  act of the binding power of the Keys, to bind burdens, as Acts 15. 27.  
4. The Decrees of no properly so called Church on earth are called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, the Decrees of Apostles and Elders. Mr. H. calls them only Advices and Counsels: is it not safer to believe Luke, Act. 16. 4. then Mr. H? But a Synod is never called a Church, say they; this is but to contend for names; for the word Church, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, is three times, Act. 19 32, 39, 40. given to a civil meeting: and Mr. H. will not have it given to bodies meeting for the affairs of the Church of Christ.  
Mr. H. Where there is no delegation of messengers by mutual consent, there is no right of jurisdiction, decrees only bind the Churches who send them.  
Ans. Antioch, Act. 15. 2. and jerusalem sent messengers, therefore two Churches, at least were sent, and were bound; as 
Absents from the Synod are tied to obedience.  for delegation, we shall speak hereafter of it.  
2. If they ought to send, and stand in need of light and peace, and send not, they are the same way tied, that some hundreds absent, when jezabel is sentenced and excommunicate, are obliged to withdraw from communion from her, though they were not present to consent to the sentence.  
Mr. H. It's no prejudice to the care and wisdom of our Saviour, that the punishing of the congregational Throne be reserved to God 
Page 60.  only.  
Ans. When scandals between congregation and congregation, and members of divers Churches are greater in number and 
It suits not with the wisdom of Christ that no remedies should be for a scandalous Church.  offence, and necessity of edifying and scandalising greater, his wisdom must provide for the more rather than the less.  
Mr. H. If when a Church offends, I must tell a higher, then must I at length tell an Oecumenick or General Council.  
Ans. General Counsels being more abstracted from infecting scandals of conversation, are rather doctrinal Remedies: nor are censures the ordinary possible adequate way of removing of Scandal. The Word and Censures exercised in the Catholic integral visible Church, in parts integral is the adequate cause.  
Mr. H. If every man be allowed his appeal to an higher, than also to a General Council, then for many hundred years, while the appeal be discussed pendente appellatione, the appealer cannot be censured.  
Ans. We allow only just appeals in case of oppression, to relieve the oppressed. 
What appeals we allow.   
2. In difficult cases, Deut. 17. which rarely are such as call for a general Council, in case of general defection in point of Doctrine, such may be; and the inferior Churches, that truth suffer not, are to declare for the truth.  
2. We allow only what men jure may do.  
3. The argument supposeth that we approve a towering up of appeals, even to a General Council, as a liberty of every member, whatever unjust prejudice be in it: and that every such appeal may stop the actings of Christ's visible Kingdom and called Pastors. Christ hath given no power to sin.  
Mr. H. It's a wonder, that because Churches may rebuke, yea, Christians may rebuke Heathens, though not in a Church way, that therefore the Synod hath a power of jurisdiction— Paul rebuked the Athenians, Acts 17. A 〈◊〉 these acts of Church communion?  
Ans. My argument is not à genere ad speciem, sed specie ad genus. These convened in the name of Christ by the Holy 
The juridical power of Synods is concluded from Acts 15. and their Churchway of rebuking, etc.  Ghost, who 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, with one consent, by way of suffrage and judgement. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Act. 15. 9 & 21. 25. rebuke perverters of souls, Act. 24. 28. and lay on burdens and commands, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to observe, Act. 21. 25. and keep such things, and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, to abstain from such things, Act. 15. 29. and give Decrees, by which the Churches were established in peace and truth, Act. 16. 4, 5. these have power to excommunicate the refusers of such acts, according to Matth. 18. for Paul and Barnabas were scandalised, and complained to the Church of Antioch. Act. 1. who sent them to complain to a Synod at jerusalem, Act. 15. 2, 3, 6. and these who in a Churchway determine against perverters of souls have juridical power: if therefore these men had done the contrary, and had refused to hear the Church, or Churches convened, and should teach these decrees came not from the holy Ghost, were they not to us as Publicans and Heathens? Yea, and wh●● more could the Church of Pergamus, and that of Thyatira Independent 〈◊〉, say our Brethren, do in making acts against such as h●ld the Doctrine of Balaam, of the Nichola●… against jezabel, Rev. 2. 14, 15. 20. If they should after prctice and practise such impure doctrine, but declare them perverters of souls, and charge others to keep no fellowship with them? and shall all be but a rebuke, & such a counsel as one private man giveth to heathen? and sure Paul's rebuke of these at Athens, Act. 17. though it made not up the rebuke of a Church, yet Paul rebuked them not as a private man, or as a godly woman may rebuke Idolaters, but formally as a Pastor. And Paul and Barnabas as Pastors removed the Caadlestick, and turned to the Gentiles, Act. 13. and unchurched the Jews, which no private men could do. So the prophecies of Isaiah, jeremiah, Ezekiel, against Babylon, Persians, Tyrus, etc. as they made not the people to be Churches, so they came not from private men, but from the immediately inspired Prophets; and such Prophets of Divine authority these are proved to be from these Prophecies: So the juridical Church-authority of the Synod, by Whitaker, Calvin, Beza, and hosts of learned Divines, is concluded from Act. 15.  
Not is it my mind, that the Jews did excommunicate the 
Of the Samaritans, and their religion, See Tostat. Abulen. in 4. Reg. c. 17. qu. 24. joan. Wolph. Com. in 2. Regn. c 17. v. 24, 25, etc. pag. 346. The Jews deservedly excommunicate the Samaritans. Weemes Christian Synag. par. 7. Diatr●. 147. Origen. To. 4. in joan. receperunt tantum, scilicer, libros Mosis. Epiphanius haer. 9 joseph. of't. 11. c. ult. Quando res Iudaeorum erant prosperae, se judaeos, alioqui Assyrios se dicebant: judaei convitium jactantes, Samaritanum appellabant. Ita Hieronym. Epist. ad Algas. 4. 5. joseph. l. 13. antiq. c. 14, Religione corruptiss●… crant Samaritae. Carol. Sigon. de Rep. Hebr. l. 1. c. 3. Ex josepho, Ephraimitas praedicarunt se, Iudaeis ab Antiocho Epiphane asflictis, Samaritae perterriti, se non Deum (judaeorum) sed Deos colere asseruerunt, nec se Israelitas, sed S●doniosesse dixerunt, & Templum ipsum jovi Cretensi se dedicaturos esse professi sunt: atque ita praesentem armati B●gis iracundiam eluserunt. August. in iocum joan. 4. Omnino vasculis eorum Iudaei non utuntur.  Samaritans so formally as a single delinquent is excommunicate: nor do I defend the superstition by Mr. jo-weemes, and Jewish Doctors in the manner of excommunicating them. It's sure, the Jews, the true Church deservedly renounced Church-communion with them. Origen, josephus, Car●lus Sigonius, and others, tell us they were most corrupt in their Religion, 2 King. 17. and though Augustine say the Jews so abhorred them, that they would not drink water out of any vessel of the Samaritans; and Christ refutes that, seeking water to drink from the Woman of Samaria. Yet since Christ saith, joh. 4. 22. Ye worship ye know not what; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the jews; he evidently, as Mr. R. said, justifieth the substance of the excommunication, which is all I intent: let their fooleries pass.  
Mr. R. granteth one Church hath not power over another.  
Ans. True, but one associate with many hath power.  
Mr. H. A man may separate totally from a Church, and from an assembly of Turks; but for one man to excommunicate, were a profanation of the Lords Ordinance.  
Ans. A single person could not separate from the Church of the Jews, though they had not a few corruptions, Mat. 23. 1, 2, 3. Mat. 8. 4. no single person can lawfully be a member of a Turkish Church, how can he then separate from such?  
3. The Church of the Jews (and salvation was of the Jews, joh. 4 2●.) was not one man; therefore their excommunicating of the Samaritans is not hence concluded to be null.  
4. But when the sounder part, though fewer, separateth from the major part, and the major part makes manifest defection from the truth, and professed cause and covenant.  
And 2 carry along with them the body of Atheists, and malignant opposers of pure Religion, and wicked men.  
3. And that the fewer and sounder part have the collective part of the godly, and generality of such as make conscience of their ways with them.  
And 4. That major part is again and again warned and 〈◊〉 go on to hold out and cast out, as far as they can, all, not of their sinful way, though in their conscience they in other things judge and profess them to be sound and godly: in that case I judge the fewer part the Church, and their censures valid: for the promise is made to such as meet in the name of Christ, Mat. 18.  
Mr. H. If all common affairs that concern many congregations (saith Mr. R.) were managed not by one congregation, 
The acting of Apostles in things belonging to many Churches, wi●h the Church's concurrence, proveth that a Synod hath Church power.  but by the suffcages, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Act. 15. 25. Apostles, Elders and select Brethren, than Synods and their Church-power most be lawful: but the former is true in the choosing of Mathias, Act. 1. and the treasury of the Churches, and calling of their Deacons, Act. 4. & 6. are disposed by a Synod of Apostles, with consent of the Churches. Paul instructeth a Synod or meeting of 〈◊〉 at Ephesu● in their duty of feeding, Act. 20. & Act 11. Peter gives an account of his going in to the Gentiles, to a meeting of Apostles and Bre●…, 〈◊〉. 〈◊〉, 4. It's true, in the choosing of Mathias, something extraordinary there was, that the Apostles could not do as Pastors, but as Apostles: as Apostles they appoint two, v. 23. God only could limit the call to two certain men, all the Pastors and Churches on earth could not do that: and as Apostles, v. 24. they pray for the directing of the lo●…: and Act. 6. as Apostles by the immediately inspiring authority by which they writ Scripture, they appoint a new office of Deacons, which was not in the Church before: but they do most of the rest by the Churches going along.  
Mr. H. There is no Synod in these.  

1. There be no delegate Commissioners.  
2. No gathering of members by common consent.  
3. No disputing.  
4. No common determination.   
Ans. Neither the first nor the second are essential to Synods, if they be persons in public authority they have a material delegation; a formal commission is a matter of order; nor were the last two wanting, not to say where the matter is plain, shall it lose the nature of a Synod, because it wants doubtsome ●…diations?  
But Mr. H. and Mr. Cotton are obliged to give an instance scriptural beside the question: we have Act. 15. a meeting of Apostles, Elders, Brethren, exercising by the grant of Mr. Cotton and the 7. dissenting Brethren some specific Church●●cts of 
A Synod acting some specific acts of a governing Church, may act all the rest of the acts of the Church.  synodical, pastoral, authoritative teaching and commanding of more congregations than one: Ergo, they have power to exercise juridical acts: for if Peter may exercise one specific act of a man, let us suppose to play the Musician, the Astronomer, to number things numerable, to admire, to laugh, no man can deny but Peter then must be a man, and hath power to discourse and argue. So if a Synod, as a Synod can exercise one specific act of a Church, being convened in the name of Christ, a reason must be given, why a Synod hath not the essence of a Church to exercise all the specific acts of a Church. A Synod is not a congregational Church; Ergo, it's no Church, est incons. à negatione species, etc.  
Mr. H. Peter gives an account of his fact, Act. 11. to the jews, 
Peter Acts 11. gives an account to the Apostles.  who doubt of the lawfulness of his conversing with the Gentiles: but here is no Synod.  
Ans. Yea, the Jews, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Syrus, Chrysostom, 
Syrus. Chrysostomus, Valde offensi expostulabant. Epiphanius haer. 28. Beza, alter carunt. Gualth. in loc. homil. 67. Atque semper eam in Ecclesia veteri consuetudinem fuisse cernimus, ut Episcopi ab Episcopis sese judicari & corrigi paterentur. Calvin. ibid. Sponte Ecclesiae judicio se: submisit. Lorinus, Cornelius à Lapide in loc. Summus pontifex non imperiose refutat,— non dicit— vestrum est obedire, etc. Act. 21. Paul submits to a Synod of Elders.  they accused Peter before the Apostles. Epiphanius thinketh C●rinth●s set them on work, Beza, they chid. It's like, saith Gualther, the Apostles did not understand this; but they accuse no● Peter. But Calvin well observes, Peter willingly submits himself to the judgement of the Church, and renders an account to the Apostles and Church: and what is that but a Synod? Mr. H. his answer is one with that of the Jesuits Lorinus and Cornelius, that he gave out of humility an account to the people, not to the Apostles, for he was above the Apostles.  
Mr. H. Act. 21. The Elders were occasionally 〈◊〉, they prescribe nothing ●o Paul.  
Ans. It seems Calvin takes up the mind of Luke 〈◊〉, for he saith, Hence we may gather, when any serious business was to 
Calvin. c. 2●. Colligere licet ex hoc loco, quoties tractandum erat serium negotium, Seniores convenire folitos fuisse, etc. Gualith. homil. 138. In Ecclesia ordine certo opus esse— nihil enim privata authoritate agit, etc. Lorinus, Corn. à Lap. in loc.  do, the Elders were in use to assemble, and Paul doth nothing in the Church of other pastors (●aith Gualther) by his own private authority, but gives an account to the Ministers. B●… saith, this was the fourth Council; Lorinus, no, for there were no v●tes asked (saith he) no debates, etc. Corne●●us à 〈◊〉 also denies it was a Synod, and says it was but a meeting that saluted Paul. Mr. H. owns their opinion for his own, and calls it only an ●●easional meeting. But say that it were so (as all synodical meetings, both that Act. 1. and Act. 6. and that Act. 15.) it will not conclude it to be no Synod.  
2. The saluting of Paul was a Christian formality of courtesy; but Paul in the Synod, v. 18, 19 gives them an exact account, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, singula ordine (saith 〈◊〉) particularly what God had done among the Gentiles: which is a business of the spreading of the Gospel through the habitable world, and they show their judgement of Paul's carriage toward the Jews, and the ceremonies were not fully expired to them, and toward the Gentiles, they confirm the act of the Synod, Act. 15. businesses worthy of a Synod.  
Mr. H. Independent Government is deficient (saith Mr. R.) 
Suru. par. 4. p. 32.  because now when Apostles are not, all the means of public and pastoral propagating the Gospel to other Churches, and to the heathen, are confined to a single congregation: whereas the Elders thereof can act nothing as officers, and the members can act nothing in a Churchway without that one congregation. This Argument of 
That proposition of Mr. H. Those whom pastors cannot judge, over them they have no pastoral power, is many ways false.  mine is not answered by that of Mr H. Those whom pastors cannot judge, as being without to them, because of another congregation, and heathen, over them they have 〈◊〉 pastorlike power. For the Proposition is most false: Pastors cannot excommunicate those of another congregation, or heathen; Ergo, they cannot teach them as pastors. It follows not, ex negatione speci●i, non sequitur negatio generis: This is not a man, therefore this is not a living creature. So  
1. A single pastor, he alone cannot excommunicate an offender of his own congregation; for one man is not a Church, Ergo he cannot preach as a pastor to this offender. The consequence is most false, and contrary to Mr. H. for he hath no other proper pastor on earth but he. So weak is M. H. his present Proposition.  
2. Paul and Barnabas preach as sent pastors authorized both by God, and the laying on of hands, and praying of the Prophets at Antioch, Acts 13. but they have no power to excommunicate the Gentiles, who are yet no members of the Church, nor baptised. Paul, Acts 16. 15. is sent to preach to Macedonia, without their choosing him to be their pastor; and yet Paul could not cast out those that were no members until they should be member. If it be said, that Paul and Barnabas preached to the Gentiles not as pastors, because not chosen by them, but as Apostles, this is well near nonsense. For,  
1. Apostles as Apostles essentially are Catholic pastors, not private Teachers; and so Apostles preached as men, not sent of God, nor yet of men, whose Baptism was neither from heaven, nor from men.  
2. Why not pastors? because not chosen by the people? that is, men only can make properly so called pastors, but God cannot. Whither go we!  
3. Are not all pastors either Apostolic or extraordinary or ordinary the same pastors in nature and essence? except acts of preaching Christ and of Baptising differ in specie and nature, as they flow from Apostles, and as they flow from ordinary men, which were to make Ordinances, the Gospel, the Seals, of different nature, better or valid, or worse and less valid, as they come from Apostles, or from ordinary pastors. Strange Divinity 〈◊〉  
3. By this Doctrine of Mr. H. the Gospel must be propagated to the world, and Churches planted among heathen,  
1. Either by Apostles, which are not now, and shall gratify Seekers, or by pastors as pastors, which we say, and Mr. H. and his gainsay: or  
2. By private men, or by pastors as private men gifted. 
Private men as private men, and as no pastors, are made by M. H. the only spreaders of the Gospel to heathens. Hieron. in verb. Qui usque ad consummationem seculi se cum discipulis. futurum promittit, & illos. ostendit semper esse victuros, & se nunquam credentibus recessurum. Chrys. in verb. Ut ex omnibus Gentibus Ecclesiam, id est fideles & sanctos mihi congregetis.  But 1. are private men successors of the Apostles, to plant Churches among the heathen? What Scripture for this? Is that Promise, L● I am with you to the end of the world, left by Christ to private men? Sure that Promise is made to the Apostles and their Successors, in all acts of their pastoral preaching, either in planting or watering: So he showeth (saith Jerome) that the Apostles shall ever live in faithful pastors to succeed them, both in planting Churches, that ye may gather to 〈◊〉 my Church and Saints (saith chrysostom) out of all Nations. Now by Mr. H. his way, the Lord promiseth thus: I will be with you, and all faithful pastors in preaching (when the Apostles are dead) to their own form congregations; but I promise no presence nor Ministerial assistance at all to pastors ordinary, when they preach in another congregation than their own, or when they preach the Gospel to heathens, and those that are not yet Churches of Christ, for than they act not as pastors. Then must either private Christians, or some new kind of officers that are unknown to the Word, and are neither Apostles, Evangelists, Pastors, nor Prophets nor Doctors, be the only planters of Churches among the heathen: and where is there Scripture for that? Or then this Promise of Christ's presence must be made to private men. But have not some private men brought the Gospel to heathens? True: but now we dispute of the only fixed ordinary spreaders of the Gospel to other congregations and heathen societies, since the Apostles are now dead; ye●, and we find that the Lord gave a sort of new calling to the Apostles touching those to whom they were hic & nunc to preach, as Peter and john are called to Samaria, Acts 8. Peter to Cornelius and the Gentiles, Act. 10. Paul and Barnabas, Act. 13. to the Gentiles, Paul to Macedonia, not Bythinia, Act. 16. Now is there nothing of this in the ordinary pastors, but private men must be heirs to these Apostolic warnings from God.  
4. It must follow, if pastors be now so confined to one congregation in all pastoral actings, than all pastoral care of Apostles for vacant Charges, for planting of new Churches, relief of the poor, removing divisions etc. Act. 1. & 6 & 4. 35. & 11. 1, 2. & 15 22, 23, 24, etc. 1 Cor. 11. 28. Act. 8. 14. & 21. 18. & 20. 38. & 13. 1, 2, 3. were temporary and Apostolic stirring●, not pastoral duties now, but such as died with the Apostles; which is contrary to the wisdom of Christ.  
Mr. H. If government by Independent congregations be insufficient, because it authorizeth not persons to be pastors over pagans, 
Par. 4. c. 37.  government by Synods is sick of the same disease.  
Ans. We judge the essence of a pastor not to stand in the 
The essence of a pastor is not in their call & suit to whom he is sent.  call and choice of those to whom they are pastors; for it makes Paul, Barnabas and the Apostles to be no pastors to the Gentiles and to the heathen, to whom they preach, and maketh the Apostles as Apostles to be no pastors.  
2. Synods from Act. 15. and Act. 13. may lend men authorized 
Evangelists are now ceased as well as Apostles.  with pastoral power to heathens to spread the Gospel, and private men as no pastors, but as private men, are intruders authorized by Mr. H. for they have no promise, such as pastors have by Mat. 28. 19, 20. Mark 16. 15, 17. jer. 1. 6, 17, 18. to plant Churches among the heathens, nor is there a warrant to say that Evangelists are ordinary officers left by Christ to plant Churches.  
If Richard Hooker have any ground from Eusebius or Scripture 
Rich. hooker's Eccles. Polit. l. 5. sect. 78. p. 421, 422. Euseb. l. 〈◊〉. c. 34.  for Evangelists now, or in Trajan's time, he must show that they have the gift of Tongues: for how could Evangelists be fellow-helpers to preach the Gospel to the Churches planted by the Apostles, if they were not an extraordinary office only? See those Divines in the margin, and my learned and dear Brother 
Tilen. Syntag. dis. 19 th'. 38. Apostolorum vice, ubi res poscebat, fungebantur. Profess. Leyd. in Synops. purior. Theol. dis. 〈◊〉. thes. 17. p. 605. Bucan. loc. Com. 42. q. 45. Calvin. Com. Eph. 4. Apostolis proximi erant Evangelistae, & munus affine habebant. Bullinger. ib. In plebe potissimum e●udienda. Zanch Com. ib. Apostolorum Comites— non immediate mi●●●— sed assumebantur. D. Ro. Bodius à Trochoregia Com. Eph. 4. p. 493. Apostolorum Comites modo huc, modo illuc missi, modo re vocati ab Apostolis, extraordinarii.  M. George Gillespy, Miscel. quest. c. 7. If the Church should send any to the heathen any way rip● for the Gospel. these could be no other than ordinary pastors to them.  
I omitted that of Mr. H. There is nothing Act. 1. but any one might have done.  
Ans. If he mean, that any one private man might have chosen Apostles, he speaks wonders; if he mean Peter might have called Mathias to be an Apostle,  
1. It's without practice, that Apostles could call Apostles.  
2. It follows not therefore it was not a Synod. Paul did more in writing Scripture, than if alone he had penned the decrees, Acts 15. & 16. 4. But Mr. Cotton and all his Brethren will deny M. H. his Consequence; Ergo, there is no Synod at all, Act. 15.  
Mr. H. If the Apostles by extraordinary power cared for the poor, Acts 4. Ergo there was a Synod.  
Ans. The Antecedent is not mine, but false.  
2. There was no doubt but ordinary pastors might oversee the Poors goods of many Churches.   

CHAP. XI.  
Of the National Church, and the lawfulness of a National Covenant.  
MR. H. The greater authority of the politic whole body 
Par. 4. pag. 38, 39, 40.  (saith Mr. R.) should help the weaker parts, 1 Cor. 12. 23, 26.  
Ans. It's true: but there is no National Church under the New Testament to help the congregational Church, nor are Churches Christian now in Worse ●ase than the Church of the jews, for they had a Highpriest and a National Worship, at which they were to meet three times in the year.  
Ans. That there is an integral Church Catholic, which is 
The Church of the Jews was no more pe●…se, & kindly, but only accidentally a national Church, than any kingdom under the N. T. is a national Church.  more than National, is proved.  
2. Our Brethren allow the association of many Churches for help of counsel: and the Proposition that is granted by M. H. is as true, for Church help, as is said, associated Churches could not yield, for union in peace and truth, except they made one visible body united. Natura conjugatorum hoc ●vincit.  
3. Visible and professed covenanting with God, makes a visible Church, Gen 17. 7. Deut. 7. 6. For thou art a holy people unto the Lord thy God; Deut. 10 15. Only the Lord had a delight in thy fathers, (Abraham, Isaac, as a covenanted seed and Church, Gen. 12 1, 2, 3. & 17 6, 7, 8, 9) to love them and their seed after them. Now the seed of Abraham visible covenanted, 
Suru. Par. 1. c. 5. p. 5. p. 59 arg. 5. The Church was visible when there was no seal, neither circumcision ●o. 〈◊〉.  by M. H. his confession was a visible Church, before they had an Highpriest, or a Temple, or a National Worship in Abraham's house, Ergo, the High Priesthood and National Worship was accidental to the visible Jewish Church. If it be said, Ye●, but they were in Abraham's time a congregational Church. It's answered, Yet then Priesthood, Temple, and National Worship differenced not the Church of the Jews from the Church of the Gentiles. Our brethren's Argument in this, is of the same stamp with that of the Murderers of Steven, Acts 7. Steven all along in his Apology refutes them, and ●aith, the Jews were a true Church in Egypt, when they had no Temple, no Ceremonies, no National Worship, but by faith only rested upon the promises. So Calvin, Gualther, Bullinger, Brentius, Marloratus, Beza, contend, that Steven his Apology had been impertinent, if this 
Calvin. Com. Act. 7. v 6. Interea commonefiunt Judaei fuisse Ecclesiam Dei (etiam Nationalem) alibi quam in terra in qua degebant, fuisse electos patres in populum peculiarem & sub fide tutelaque Dei protectos, antequam staret Templum, vel instituti essent externi legis ●…s, haec ad generalem cautionis scopum pertinent. Gualth. in Act. 7. homil. 45. in v. 16. Ideo mortuos in Aegypto ut constet illos in ●a Religione diem ob●●sse quae nullis externis ceremoniis nitebatur, sed in sola fide, etc.  had not been his scope.  
2. They were a visible Church in Egypt multiplied above an hundred congregations, Exod. 1. 9, 11, 15. more in number than the Egyptians, and the Lords covenanted Church, Exod. 3. 6, 7, 8. & 6. 7. 8. obliged to sacrifice to God, Exod. 8. 29. and did eat the Passover, and were circumcised in Egypt, Exod. 4. 24, 25, 26 & 12. 1, 2, 3, etc. when as yet Aaron was not consecrated Highpriest, and there was no Temple, nor any National Temple-worship thrice a year at that time in the world.  
3. When Priesthood, Temple-National-worship thrice a year, sacrificing are removed, judah remained in the Babylonish captivity, the visibly covenanted people of God obliged to pray to him with their faces toward the Temple, 1 King. 8. 35. Dan. 6, 10, 11. and this is no more one National worship, than the hearing of the Word, and receiving the Seals of the N T. are one National worship to all the Protestant Church-members in Scotland.  
4. That which is common to God's people of the Jews, and to Egypt and Assyria, and the people of God in the Gentiles, is no distinguishing character differencing the Jewish Church, as National from the Christian Church as not National, Quae sunt communia ●a non distingunnt. But to profess, say and swear by the Lord, and give him public Church-worship, agree to Egypt and Assyria, and to Kingdoms and Nations of the New 
To swear a covenát agreeth to all Kingdoms covenanted visibly with God, as well as to the Church of the Jews.  Testament, as to the Jewish Nation; as Isa. 2. 2. It shall come to pass in the last days, (under the New Testament) v. 3. that many people shall go, and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the Mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of jacob, and he will teach us of ●ù ways, etc. So Isa. 19 25. God shall bless thus, saying. Blessed be Egypt my people, and Assyria the work of my hand, and Israel my inheritance. Which the seventh Angel declares to be fulfilled in the New Testament, Rev. 11. 15. The Kingdoms of this world are become (the Kingdoms) of our Lord, and of his Christ, and he shall reign for ever and ever. So is the same, Psal. 2. 8, 9 & 22. 27, 28, 29. & 72. 8, 9, 7. & 97. 1, 2, 3, 8. & 99 1, 2. & 110. 1, 2, 3. Mal. 1. 11. Isa. 19 16. & 55. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. & 35. 1, 2, 3, & 60. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. & 62, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 6, etc. jer. 23. 6, 7. Zech 13. 8, 9 Nor will it help a whit, to say, O but the Kingdoms visibly covenanted under the New Testament, have not all one Temple, nor one National Worship in the way of the jews. It's answered, That was accidental to the visibly covenanted Nation; for as a visibly covenanted Nation they the same way worshipped the same God in their Synagogues, and in a Churchway as a Church-Jewish, as we worship God in a Churchway in one single congregation. Temple-worship agreed to them not as a visible Church, but as such a special paedagogical visible Church.  
5. The being a National Church in that sense, to wit, typically 
A National Church differs not in nature and essential causes from a National typical Church.  National, doth not essentially difference the Church of the Jews from the Church of the Gentiles, as to the internal parts constituent of a visible Church. For  
1. Peter saith, 1 Pet. 1. 2, 9 of the Gentiles, what the Lord of his people Israel, Exod 19 5, 6. said, But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, (for he writes to visible professors then dispersed, as Beza and others, and the Text evinceth) a peculiar people, that ye may show forth the praises (in public Church-profession, 1 Pet. 2. 1, 2. by Hearing, Baptism, 1 Pet. 3. ●1. and visible feeding of the flock by called Ministers, 1 Pet. 5. 1, 2. eschewing false Teachers, 2 Pet. 2. 1, 2, 3. etc. and receiving messengers, Sylvanus and others, sent to you to water the planted Churches, 1 Pet. 5. 12) of him who hath called you out of darkness to his marvellous light.  
2. The Jews and Gentiles are made one catholic Church, the partition wall now being broken down, Ephes. 2. 12, 13, 14, 15. Isa. 6. 3. & 61. 4, 5, 9 & 62. 1, 2, 3, 4. & 54. 1, 2, 3, 4. and have communion in visible Ordinances, Isa. 66. 10, 11, 12. Zech. 14. 16, to 21. Isa. 49. 6, 7, 18, 19, 20.  
3. The Churches of the Jews and Gentiles have the same Head and King in them, reigning in the same Ministry and Word, Host 1. 11. Eph. 1. 21. & 4. 11, 12, 13. Col. 1. 18. saved by faith, and the same grace of Christ, Acts 15. 8, 9, 10, 11. & 10. 42, 43. Heb. 11. 1, 2, 3,— 1 Cor. 10. 3. They did all eat the same spiritual me●t, 4 and did all drink the same spiritual drink (for they drank of the same spiritual Rock, and the Rock was Christ) Here our Brethren argue from the constitution and matter, visible Sain●s, as Mr. H. frequently, and the same formal cause, the Church covenant in the Church of the Jews, when it seems to make for them; and when the government makes against them, than they reject the argument from the Jewish Church.  
6. What agrees to the Church of the Jews as a Religious society, to keep peace and Religion in purity, and to purge out offenders, and agreed to them in a moral, and no typical consideration, that agrees to us also. But National Assemblies and National Engagements for Religion, agreed to the Jewish Church in a moral consideration, as it cannot be shown there was any thing typical in that Assembly at Mizp●h, Judg. 20. but to cognosce of the public wickedness in the matter of the Levites concubine. The revenge was indeed civil, but the Assembly, for a scandal which made Religion to be evil spoken of, was a Religious Meeting, for no such folly should be done in the Israel of God. And the meeting of the whole congregation at Shilo● in their Heads was Religious, to condemn the new Altar, as was reported, set up by the two Tribes, josh. 22. 12, 13, etc. And the Assembly of Israel at Mount Carmel, 1 Kings 18. procured by Elijah, was to prove that jehovah was the Lord, and for the keeping of Religion pure. And the Covenant that joshua made with the people, and that which jehoiada made between the Lord and the people, that they should be the Lords people, josh. 24. 25. 2 Kings 11. 17. and that the people swore under Asa, 2 Chron. 15 8 9, 10, 11, 12. were morally binding Covenants, prophesied to be under the New Testament, Isa. 44, 5. & 19 21. The Egyptians shall vow a vow to the Lord. So Zanchy. There was indeed a thing temporary, and some typicalness in the manner of the punishing the breach of it, 
See M. Robinson justif. of Separate. p. 145, 160, 161. who widely argues the Church of the Jews being National, having one High Priest, one Altar, etc. being now done away, is not our Rule. See pag. 162, 163, 164. Ans. We argue from the nature of the Jewish Church in general as National in Egypt, in the Wilderness, as God's people in covenant as we & our seed are, before they had a Temple & an Altar, etc. yea, the synagogue worship was a sufficient Church-worship, whatever M. Robinson say, Eusebius de vita Constant. l. 3. reckons it to be an. 333. Tom●s of the Counsels. Hist. Magd. cent 4. c. 9 Theodoret. l. 1. c. 30. & alibi c. 17. c. 35. Socrat. l. 1. c. 27. & 32. l. 2. c 8. & 20. Sozom. 1. c. 7. l. 2. c. 16. l. 3. c. 5. Ruffia. l. 1. c. 5. & 6, etc. l. 4. 〈◊〉. 6. D. 〈◊〉 3 Gen. Controu. concerning Counsels, p. 120, 121. M. Patr. Symson, c●●●. 4. c. 4. Review of the Council of T●●●t in Prench, translated an. ●638. by Gen: 〈◊〉. D. Fulk Ans. to the Rhemists on N. T. Act. 15. An. 4. An. 5. p. 289, 390, 391, 392, 393. T●o: Cartwright his answer to the same Rhemists, Act. 15. An. 4, 5, 6, 7. p. 293, 294, 295, 296. Whitaker de Conciliis.  Diut. 13. 15, 16. & 7. 24, 25, 26. but that ceremonial kind of punishment did not belong to the essence of National covenants, and therefore makes not the National covenant to be typical, and not morally binding to Christians, no more than Mr. Hooker will say, that the Law of punishing capitally false Prophets seducing to Apostasy, and divers other Laws to which something typically did belong but accidentally, doth not, as touching their substance, obligeth us Christians. So were also Counsels morally binding to us, and consequently Engagements and Subscriptions to them and their Act●. Nor can any say, but upon the supposition that Christ hath appointed officers for his house, but it was a moral duty, not typical (the Rule Acts 15. & 6. & 21. & 13. going before) and warranted by the Law of Nature; That the Nicone Council about anno 327 should convene against Arrius denying Christ to be God equal with the Father, and by the Emperor's authority: And that in the Council of Constantinople about ann. 383. Macedonius denying the holy Ghost to be God, should be condemned: and Nestorius affirming two persons in Christ, ann. 434. and that Eutyches holding one Nature to be in Christ after the Incarnation, and so confounding the Humanity and Divinity together, should be condemned in the Council of Chalcedon ann. 454. See for more of this, Authors cited in the Margin, and their judgement of Counsels.  
7. How shall Egypt, Isa. 19 25. Assyria, ibid. be a covenanted Nation to God? by our brethren's way, they must be a covenanted Nation only in parts, as members of an Independent congregation; and so none shall be visible Covenanters with God, as Isa. 19 but their visible members.  
Mr. H. To covenant with God is a free act, no Prince can compel a Nation to swear a covenant National.  
Ans. Then a Prince cannot compel a single man baptised, to hear the Word, nor a Minister to do his duty, to preach or feed, for these should be free acts in order to God, nor can a Judge by this compel a single man to witness the truth; for swearing should be a voluntary act of worshipping of God: but a Pr●nce and State can compel people to do a known duty of adhering to the worship of God, 1 Chron. 15. which they in circumcision undertook before to do, which duty ought in foro Dei, to be willing.  
Mr. H. An oath to keep God's commandments (saith Mr. R.) is a part of the third command, Psal. 119: 106. we are to contend for the faith, Judas 〈◊〉. 3. and profess God before men; that which binds a man morally, binds a Nation. Ans. David's ●aking an oath, was upon lawful grounds, to a lawful thing: but National Churches, and National Covenanting are now abrogate.  
Ans. Then a desire to preserve Religion which is called in question in the Land, and to transmit it safe to posterity, be a lawful ground, as it is, and to continue Religion be a lawful thing, and to remain the Lords people, we have these two, which by Mr. H. made Davids taking of an oath lawful: Ergo, so must our National Oath, by Mr. H. be lawful.  
2. That a National Church meeting all in one place at once 
Our nationalcovenant is sworn by Independent Churches in single congregations apart.  to worship God, is abrogate: we say, the Church of the Jews was no such Church, nor contend we for any such national Church. But if a National Church swearing a covenant to worship the Lord in sincerity, in parts, in several congregations be abrogate; then suppose all England were visible Saints, and all moulded in single Independent congregations, it were unlawful for all the members to swear their Church-covenant: why? all National Churches are abrogate, saith Mr. H. but is not here a National covenant, such as we desire granted by Mr. H.  
2. We contend not for a whole Nation meeting in one place 
A national oath is lawful under the New Testament.  to swear. But sure all the land of judea, and they of jerusalem were all baptised of John, Mark 1. 5. and all Divines grant there is a religious vow and covenant in baptism. Here is such a National covenant of all the Land of judea as we contend for, as lawful under the New Testament.  
3. Suppose the Turk came with a huge army against Britain with fire and sword, to kill old and young, except we will deny Christ's Gospel, and our Baptism: Mr. H. by his way thinks it Judaisme for the Prince and Parliaments, to command all between sixty and sixteen to rise in arms, and to swear an oath to King and State: that we shall confess Christ before men, and stand by the Gospel and fight to the death, and die a Nation of Martyrs, before we yield to that Turkish Tyranny. Why? a National oath is judaism: for as a man is to confess Christ before men, Mat. 10. 32. so far more a Nation when called thereunto.  
2. To take a covenant should be a free Ecclesiastical act. no Prince can compel to National Oaths: It's my prayer to God 
Par. 4. pag. 40. See Dan. Chamier. in loc. Com. l. 6. c. 7. pag. 286. in Baptismo voveri Deo. Lombard. l. 4. dist. 38. Come mune votum, quod in baptismo faciunt omnes. Zanchius Tom 4. l. r. in 3. precept. thes. 1. th'. 2. page 635, 636. th'. 4, 5. Et seq obligatio jurandi interdum oritur ex ipsa naturali lege; ut reveletur veritas & lis finiatur, & glori●icetur Deus, 〈◊〉. 6. See Deut. 6. 13. To fear God and swear by him are conjoined. See Sotus. l. 8. de Justit. q. 1. art. 2. c. 4. Suarez de Relig. tom. 〈◊〉. de Juranient. l. 3 c. 〈◊〉. num. 6. pag. 420. Suarez de Religione tom. 2. tract. 6 de votis l. 1. c. 2. pag. 47●. num 6. lneptè votum numeratur inter hujusmodi legalia vota sunt antiquiora lege Mosis, ut patet in voto jacob. Gen. 28.— & Gentiles naturali lumine voveban●, etc. Chrysost. in 1 Cor. 7. praeceptum non ●abeo, etc. Hieron. Epist. 151, ad Algasiam q. 10. Votum ●●se p●…ssionem Deo factam leg● naturae & gratiae consonam.  that our Brethren in New England, be not compelled to quit Christian Religion, as we in Scotland were thralled to embrace Popery by the domineering power of Prelates. And shall it be Judaisme for Protestant Nations to swear the like, if the man of sin should blow the trumpet, and raise all the Catholic Romans i● Christendom, against the Lamb and his followers?  
4. If it be lawful for one professor to avow Christ before men, Mat. 10. 32. Mark. 8. 38. Luke 5. 26. & 12. 8. Rev. 2. 10, 13, 15. shall not Egypt, Asyria be obliged to set up (as it were) Altars to the Lord, and speak the language of Canaan, Now that is a professed engaging to avow the Lord: now I might put Mr. H. to it, and it's but an Anabaptist ground, to seek a warrant for a National covenant under the New Testament; for I again desire him to give me a warrant for a National profession.  
2. A National promise to be the Lords people.  
3. A National confession of sins, and of leaving of the truth.  
4. A National petitioning for grace to avow the truth to the end, and to transmit it pure to posterity.  
5. A National confession of faith, except we argue thus, a single man does this, a David warrantably did swear, Ps. 119. 106. Ergo, a Nation may do the like.  
5. The examples of the Jews Church are moral, not typical: T●e oath was not tied to Temple, Sacrifice, or the like.  
6. It's prophesied there shall be swearing, and subscribing to the Lord, and that the Jews shall renew their covenant to God, I●r. 50. 4, 5. see 1 Tim. 5. 12.  
7. An oath is a law-band against back sliding under the New Testament, as under the Old enjoined in the third Commandment. And there be warrants for oaths in the New Testament, Rom. 9 1 Phil. 1. 8. 1 Thes. 2. 10. 2 Cor. 1 23. & 11. 31. Rom. 1. 9 Matth. 5. 8. It is moral, Deut. 6. 13. & 10. 20. Isa. 19 18, 21. & 45. 23. See Par. Zanchius, etc.  
Mr. H. Were the oath lawful, yet not in a private man as in 
Par. 4. pag. 45. Equal strength is not required in all that take an oath of a society.  a Nation, yet it must suit with our strength, that which is helpful to one, because strong and able to perform, is hurtful to another.  
Ans. To swear single life is impossible, for there is no command binding me to it.  
2. Will Mr. H. say a●l baptised by john, Mark 1. 5. and all their Church members that swear the Church covenant have a like strength, and all engaged to be buried with Christ in Baptism, Rom. 6. 3. 1 Cor. 12. 13. Gal. 3. 27. Col. 2. 11, 12. all Asa and jehoiadah their covenants had alike strength?  
Mr. H. The ground is worse, to wit, that which ties one man, ties a Nation: a man is not morally tied to keep God's Commandments; he may live all his life and never take a private oath, and not sin; if he swear, this is a moral command to keep his oath, his manner of swearing seems to be private, it's but a freewill offering.  
Ans. To lay bands of promises and oaths upon a back-sliding heart, is commanded in the third Command, and is not Judaical, 
It said that a National covenant is Typycal and Judaical. Mr H. never with his little finger aimed at any probation. 1. What if I say that a Nation as Israel avow the Lord to be their God was typical? then no Nation, Egypt, nor Assyria can lawfully under the New Testament avow him to be their God. National profession hath as good warrant for typicalness (if any there be) as National swearing. 2. National praying, National praising, National flowing to hear, Isa. 2. National worshipping, Isa. 66. 20. Mat. 1. 11. Zech. 14. 17 National joining to Christ, and conversion to him. National submitting to the Lord, reigning in his ministry, and joining to the true Church, Rev. 11. 15. Psal. 22. 27. Isa. 60. 1, 2, 3, 4 etc. have all the like ground of typicalness with national covenanting: A vocal oath commanded mars all, saith Mr. H.  Gen. 14. 22. Gen. 28. 20. Psal. 132. 2. Psal. 76. 11. It's prophesied as a moral duty of Egypt converted under the New Testament, Isa. 19 21. They shall vow a vow to the Lord, all the Gospel purposes and resolutions spoken to the Lord in praying, in suiting grace to do duties, confessing sins are so many Gospel vows laid upon the heart, to do such duties: nor is there a formal swearing required in vows made to God. And this is sinful omission of a morally obliging duty, and morally obliging one man: so it obligeth a Nation, as affiirmative precepts do: and this smells of Anabaptism to cry down all Gospel-vows.  
2. The manner of swearing to continue in the professing of faith, when temptations from the Prince, and Edicts to receive the Mass Book are no more private and arbitrary vows, than the oath of your Church covenant.  
3. It's poor Divinity to say that the freewill offerings to the Tabernacle and Temple were free, that is, arbitrary, so that a man might have lived all his life, and never been guilty, though all his life he never offer a freewill offering to Tabernacle, Temple, or to the Lord, as a man may all his life never swear a National covenant, be guilty of no sin; so he may well say a man all his life may give nothing to the poor, to Hospitals, to maintain the Ministry, and Schools, and yet not be guilty, for all these are freewill offerings. It's a gross mistake, to say the freewill offerings were not commanded, as well as all sacrifices and other offerings, Exod. 35. 4, 5. Levit. 22. 21. Deut. 16. 10. they are free, not from a commanding law (I am ashamed of such weak conceits) but are free in regard of the willing heartiness of givers; and because the determinate quantity precisely fell not under a command, as in other offerings, but was referred to the holy freedom of the offerer.  
Mr. H. The Rule is uneven, a particular man may engage not to drink Wine, as hurting his health and soul— a Scholar swears he will study painfully; a Blow man he shall labour diligently; shall the whole land be tied to such ●●ths? yea, the contrary rule holds for the most true.  
Ans. A mistaken Rule is soon made uneven; what morally binds one single man, not as a Scholar, or a Ploughman, or such a special professor, but as a Church-member, baptised, 
The Rule, what binds particular men as covenanted professors, binds morally the Nation. Religion directs how we are to swear by the Lord, swearing is not a worship (as praying, which was in the state of innocency) absolutely commanded, but only for truth's cause to be cleared. Suarez. Tom. 2. de Relig. de jus jur. l. 3. c. 1. n. 8 pag. 420. And we see moral necessity of being the Lords people, of reformation after back-sliding, Deut. 24. 3, 12, 13. Of putting ●●ay Idols, of seeking the Lord God, 2 Chron. 15. 8, 12. 2 Chron. 29. 10. 11. & 30. 12, 13. when sad judgements were on, 5, 6. and because of this, to wit, defection and bondage, they made a sure Covenant, and wroten, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Nehem. 9 38. no shadow there is of a type looking to Christ or to the Church under the Gospel.  circumcised, as a visible professor, as to keep the Lords Commandments, Psal. 119. 106. to be the Lords people, to continue sound in the faith, to confess Christ before men, when called to it, Matth. 10. 32. to seek the Lord God of Israel, 2 Chron. 15. 13. 2 King. 11. 17. that also morally binds the whole nation, be it Egypt or Assyria, in covenant with God, when he shall call them to lay the band of an oath upon themselves, as being tempted by higher powers to deny the truth, and embrace popery, as was our case in Scotland; and this is our rule. Mr. H. deviseth an uneven rule, and would father it upon me. A Blow man as a special professor swears he shall painfully till the earth: Erg●, all in covenant with God may swear, be they Kings, Nobles, Barons, Burgesses, and all the land may swear they shall desert all callings, and only till the earth. The like is to be thought of the other oath, which often is the drunkard's oath, he shall never drink Wine, and with a spoon he sips till he be drunk: Ergo, all the Nation may so swear; but I know no such rule. It shall be Mr. H. or any man's, not mine.  
Mr. H. The ends of general Reformation may be attained by 
Par. 4. p. 42.  the Magistrate, commanding all the Churches in their several assemblies to attend the mind of Christ, to humble themselves and fast, and if Churches be corrupt, they may be compelled by the civil power to attend the rules of Christ.  
Ans. It's too laxily spoken, he speaks not one word of the Christian Magistrate or the magistrate godly and sound in saith, nor of the rule the Scripture, but only of the Civil Magistrate, the Civil Power. What if he be a Heathen? what if he be a Papist, a Socinian?  
2. That the ends of reformation may be attained by the Civil 
The power that Mr. H. gives to the civil Magistrates in commanding the Churches is undue.  Power only, who can believe? For Mr. H. speaks not one word of the Concurrence of spiritual power and jurisdiction. Will not Erastians' approve this, and say Church-discipline is needless? Mr. H. says, the end of Reformation may be attained by the Civil Magistrates commanding, etc.  
3. Mr. H. tells us often that Church-duties should be willing free acts, pag. 40. hearing, fasting, praying, are acted by Ecclesiastical policy, God's people are free and wi●●ing; but here they may be compelled by the Civil Power to act these duties.  
M●. H. the Church-power is above the Synod, because the 
Mr. H. par. 4. page 54.  Churches sent the members.  
Ans. It only follows, that the Churches are above the Commissioners, as they send them, but in actu Synodico & Pastoraliter 
How the churches are above Synods, how not.  imperandi, as the Synod pastorally teach, as Mr. Cotton saith, and lay on burdens, Act. 15. the Synod is above them. How the male Church owe obedince to the dogmatic sentence of Pastors, we heard before.  
Mr. H. If the Synod err, Churches have power to call another 
Mr. H. Survey. par. 3. c. 3. page 41, 42.  Synod, and pass sentence against them.  
Ans. Nothing hence follows, but what I yield, the Churches in their way are above, and worthier than Synods that err.  
Mr. H. A Synod may enjoin a man to believe contradictions, two Synods in two divers Provinces may conclude contradictory 
Par. 4. c. 3. p. 54  things: a man goes to another Province to dwell, he believes a contrary conclusion to what he believed before.  
Ans. In some things of mere order in one country the Sermon 
Mr. H. will have Synods to determine contradictions  begins at eight or nine hours, in another Province not while ten: but these are not contradictory faiths.  
2. There is no solidity, but emptiness here, an erring Synod could not jure determine contrary to the decrees of the Apostles and Elders, Acts. 15. Christ hath given no power to Synod-Assembly, or Churches to conclude lies, in dogmatic points; the contradicent of a true and sound Decree, deduced sound from Scripture is a lie, and came not from the Synod. So Mr. Hooker may condemn Ministers, Churches, Preachers, Doctors, Assemblies, all who give counsel and advice, as no Ordinances of God, for the men that are Ministers, Churches, etc. may sinfully contradict the truth, and lie: but the Ordinance lies not.  
Mr. H. In all Synods, but an Ecumenical, its lawful to make an appeal, and therefore to refuse.  
Ans. In no Synod at all following the rule of Christ, is it lawful to appeal; but that is ever true which our Saviour saith, 
Of appeals, they prove not that Synods may be refused.  he that despiseth you, despiseth me. It's a slandering of us, as if we taught any appeals, but from partial Judges, and opressive sentences.  
2. In general Counsels erring, as they are not infallible, we may appeal to another not erring General Council, and to the collective Catholic Church.   

CHAP. XII.  
Of the Magistrate's Power in convocating Synods.  
MR. H. It belongs to the supreme Magistrate (the King) 
Par. 4. c. 3. p. 56.  as peculiar to his power and place, and not to the Church, to enjoin the solemn and public concurrence of the several persons of the Churches, and to appoint and nominate whom he will have to consider of those weighty and doubtsome cases which concern the public professing and practising of the worship of God within his Dominions.  
Ans. Erastians', and such as make the King the Head of the 
M. H. gives the power of convocating & of choosing members of Synods to the King only. Of this see Becanum in Opuse. tom. 11. de primatu Regis Angliae. Marc. Anton. de Dominis Archiep. Spalatens. tract. annex. l. 6. de Rep. Ecclesiast. qui inscrib. Ostensio Errorum Francisci Suarezii Jes. in opuscul. lib. 1. Quantum Anglica secta à fide Catholic. dissideat lib. 6. de forma juramenti fidelitatis. Sacellan. in Tortura torti. Rob. Abbot's de suprem. potest. Reg. contr. Bellarm. & Suarez. See Gasp. Scioppius in Eccles. c. 49. p. 160, 161. c. 48. p. 157. Qui tolerat hae. eticos, lupis cum ovibus commorandi potestatem facit.  Church, can give no more to the Prince, than Mr. H.  

1. By his Royalty he only can convene Synods.  
2. He, by that same power, chooseth the members of Synods.  
3. Of his supreme Power in controversies we shall hear.   
1. The Apostles, Elders and Church must then be in an act of Rebellion in convening, Act. 1. to choose Mathias, Acts 6. to ordain Deacons, Act. 4. & 5. to preach the Gospel in the Temple, and convene a Synod, Act. 15. from divers Churches, without the knowledge or consent of the supreme power. It cannot help to say, There was no Christian Magistrate then; for Mr. H. says, it was peculiar to his power; and proves it afterward, because Arg. 4. pag 58. he cannot otherwise maintain the peace of his subjects. Arg. 5. he cannot give them protection without this, pag. 59 But the heathen Magistrate as a Magistrate is to procure peace and protection to his Subjects, Rom. 13. 1, 2, 3. 1 Tim. 2. 1, 2. So must the Apostles, who gave to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, have laid the foundation of the Gospel upon a rebellious usurping of that which is peculiar (saith Mr. H.) to the civil power and place.  
2. The Churches of Corinth, Ephesus, Rome, etc. must have convened to Divine Worship, 1 Cor. 11. 17, 18, etc. without warrant, for Paul rebukes them for going to law before heathen Judges, 1 Cor. 6.  
Mr. H. They may, as Christians, maintain private communion one with another; and as they be Churches, use that Christian privilege to further their own good, and promote the work by counsel: for what I do quâ Ethicus, quâ Oeconomicus, quâ Christianus in private, appertains not to the Magistrate, except it entrench upon his policy.  
Ans. 1. Mr. H. makes all that Christians do as Christians and as Churches, that is, gathering of Churches, hearing, partaking of seals and censures, to be private actings not belonging to the Magistrate. Strange it is, that the convening of the ten thousand Subjects in the same place (as our Brethren say) belongs nothing to the Magistrate; sure it sides with peace or war. And yet Mr. H. saith, The Magistrate may compel men to 
Page 42,  attend the mind of Christ, and solemnly to humble themselves by fasting and prayer. See how these two consist.  
2. It's strange to say the Magistrate hath nothing to do with 
M. H. seems to say it appertains not to the Magistrates to take order with thefts, murders, robberies done in private.  what a man doth as a moral man, as a member of a family, or as a Christian so they do these things in private which they do; which is to say the Magistrate hath nothing to do with the Villainies, Particides, Adulteries and Robberies that men commit in private. And Mr. H. saves not the matter by saying, The Magistrate hath nothing to do with the man, to punish him; I judge in these capacities, except he entrench upon his policy, that is, except he break his Laws. But sure, he can punish no man in any imaginable capacity, private or public, except he break his Laws. Beside that, it's neither Law nor Divinity, to say, that a man intrencheth upon the Magistrate's policy, and violates his Laws, as Ethicus, a moral man, or a member of a family either in private or public; for more abominable it is to say. He violates Laws, and Whores, Murders, Robs as a Christian: for Christianity teacheth men to deny all ungodliness, Tit. 1. 11. for he must do all these as malus civis, as a wicked member of the Commonwealth.  
3. I wonder more in what capacity the Magistrate can have to do with commanding and governing men, if not as they converse morally with men, and in their families, as fathers and sons, as Masters and servants, and as Christians who both in private and public may perform duties to one another, or oppress one another; else the Judge could not punish the rebellious son, the wicked servant, or the murdering father, and the oppressing Master. Yea, the more secret that wicked acts are, a godly Magistrate doth the more resemble God, who can say, as job, chap. 29. 16. I was a father to the poor, and the cause that I knew not I searched out. Nor do men, except extremely flagitious, commit Villainies, Robberies, Murders, Parricides, Adulteries, but in private: And it appertains to the Ruler the more to search them out, the more privately that they be acted. But if Mr. H. mean, that private actings of citizens, of members of families, of Christians, that are good and indifferent, do not appertain to the Magistrate, who is an adversary to him in this? Though all good actions done in private or public deserve praise, reward and protection from the Magistrate, except Mr. H. expound that Rom. 13. 3. Do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same, so thou do good in public only, as hypocrites: but thou shalt have no praise of the Ruler, if thou do good within doors. Is this good moral Philosophy of Mr. H? But how godly Princes may compel to external worship, 
The godly Magistrate may compel. The Bishops of France at desire sent to Britain Germanus and Lupus from a Synod, to drive away Pelagianism out of Britain, which they did. B●da Eccle●●hist Angl. l. 1. c. 8. & l. 1. c. 17. Polonia, Russia, Lithuania, were commanded by Rulers to be baptised, and quit Idols. Munster Co●mograph. fol. 894 90●. After Scripture, the practice of joshua, Josh. 24. 25. of Asa, 2 Chron. 14. 3, 4, etc. of jehoshaphat, 2 Chron. 17. of Hezekiah, 2 Chron. 30. 1, 6. 2 Kings 18. 4. of josiah, 2 Chron. 34. See Aug. contr. litter. Petilian. l. 2. c. 86. Aug. contr. Crescon. l. 3. c. 50. Eusib. de vit. Const. l. 1. c. 37. Socr. l. 1. c. 34. Theodoret. l. 5. c. 20. Aug. contr. Epist. Parmen. l. 1. c. 10.  see Margin.  
Mr. H. Commission and just permission are all one: A Ruler permits a Finder to set up a School, he needs no commission.  
Ans. If fencing be useful, the Ruler must give him positive 
Commission & permission which Rulers give are not all one, as Mr H. saith.  protection, as others that do well; else if one kill him when he teaches his Scholars, the Ruler ought not to revenge that murder, though most treacherously committed, and say he promised to the Fencer only permission; and yet it's worse to say the Christian Ruler owes to Assemblies, Pastors, Schools only permission. Paul saith, he owes praise, Rom. 13. 3. which, with good ground, famous Interpreters expound to be countenanting, favour, protection, reward, stipends. And if the Christian Magistrate do but permit Assemblies to convene, as a very Episcopal man D. Bilson said permissio est à magistratu, commissio à Christo: What more influence (if permission and commission be all one) hath the godly Magistrate in the public worship 
Emmanuel Sa in Aphorismis suis. Episcopus potest procedere contra quemcunque ob peccatum mortale, nisi essen jure permissum, ut meretricum. Par. 4. p. 57  of God, and Assemblies of the Church, then heathen Magistrates, Ahasuerus, the Kings of Chaldea, who permitted the people of God to worship the true God, Esth. 4. v. 16, 17. Dan. 6. v 7, 8. or the Church of Rome have, who by public Order establish Stews, and permit fornication? See Emmanuel Sa, who saith, Bishops and Priests are by Law permitted to have Whores.  
Mr. H. 1 Arg. That a right opinion and worship of God should be openly professed within the Territ●… and jurisdiction ●f a State, appertains to them, as that which comes within the verge and object of the State and policy to attend. 1. They could not provide that the Subjects live in godliness and honesty without this. 2. Nor could be Nurse-fathers' to the Church and Religion, if they should suffer open blasphemy and idolatry to be maintained and professed. 3. The Kings of Israel did punish such crimes, not as types of Christ, but by a civil power.  
Ans. 1. If the Magistrate have only a permissive power 
Mr. H. makes the King the only Lord and Prince of the Subjects faith and Religion. See Bilson Christ. Subject, par. 3. p. 302. Bills. Chr. Subject, par● 2. p. 297. that Princes may prescribe what faith they list— is no part of our thought. See Gas●. Scioppius in Ecclesiastico opposito authoritati Serenis. R. jac. M. Brit. c. 38, 128. try that. Americani gladio materiali Ecclesiae subjiciendi erant. See c. 39  here, as even now he said, how doth Mr. H. again exalt the Magistrate as Head of the Church, to inquire and judge of professions, and of true and false Religions by his civil power, as after he speaks? If he do this by an antecedent Magistratical power, as Mr. H. saith in the following words; then hath God made the Christian Magistrate as the Magistrate by the power of the Sword (for the Magistrate's power is formally coactive, not suasory or moral, not Ecclesiastically juridical, to excommunicate) the only Supreme Judge and Determiner of all true and false Religions; which Bilson disclaims. Hens  
1. By his Office he may deny protection and justice to all that are not of his Religion, and banish them out of his Dominions. It's true, they may say he plays the Tyrant in that; but yet God hath given him the only supreme power, both to inquire (saith Mr. H.) and judge of Professions and Religions, which is true, and aught to be maintained, which is false, and aught to be rejected. And if so, the many godly who fled from Old England to New England, because of Prelatical Tyranny of conscience, did believe that the late King Charles had power as a King to judge the Service book and Ceremonies imposed upon the godly in England, yea and upon Scotland also, was the only true Religion, and had power given him of God as supreme Magistrate, to command all the three Kingdoms to be of the King's Religion, or then let them all be banished out of his Dominions: But is not this to make the King a Pope, and the only carver and Lord of the Faith and Religion of his Subjects? and so the King, by his Office, is the Messenger of the Lord of Hosts, and a Royal Prophetical Teacher, who watches for the souls of all his people. What Scripture puts the King in such an Office?  
2. Did not the godly and sound condemn such an Headship 
Forma juramenti ab Elizabetha. Ego A. B. prorsus testificor & declaro in conscientia mea, Reginam solam esse supremam Gubernatric●m & istius Regni Angliae, & aliorum omnium 〈◊〉 Majestatis Dominionum, & ●…ionum, non m●nus in omnibus Spiritualibus atque Ecclesiasticis rebus vel causis quam temporalibus; & quod nemo, externus Princeps vel persona, praelatus, status, vel potentatus, aut facto aut j●re, haber aliquam perestatem, supericritatem, pr●…nent 〈◊〉, vel authoritatem Eccl●siasticam ●●t spi●itualem in hoc Regno; ideoque planè 〈◊〉 ●…o & repudio omnes externas jurisdictiones, potestates, superiori●ates atque autho●….  in the Oath of Supremacy, and in the King's Proclamation; in which he, as King, commands all to receive such a Religion as he thinks fit, even the substantials of the Mass, and no Prayers but book-prayers (the other Prayers being fancies?) And this command is equal to a pastoral or Synodical Decree.  
1. Because it comes from the King having no act of the 
Proclamation by act of Council of K. Charles I. ann. 1637. to Scotland, printed before the late Book of Common-Prayer-Our Will is, & we charge you straight and command, That incontinent these our Letters seen, you pass, and in our Name and Authority command and charge all our Subjects both Ecclesiastic and Civil, by open Proclamation— to conform themselves to the said public form of worship, which is the only form which we (having taken the counsel of our Clergy) think fit to be used in God's public worship; commanding all Archbishops and Bishops, and other Presbyters and Churchmen, to take a special care that the same be duly obeyed and observed, and the contraveners condignly censured and punished. Sacettanus in Torture. Torti, pag. 338. Rex Britan. caput Ecclesiae, 1 Reg. 15. Nun cum parvulus esses in oculis tuis caput factus es in tribibus Israel? Book of Canons obtruded upon the Church of Scotland, ann. 1636. c. 1. & 2.  Church, but only having taken the counsel of his Clergy, and so by civil power peculiar to his power Royal and place, as Mr. H. speaks, p. 56.  
2. Because its the only form of worship he thinks fit.  
3. Because he commands it to all Ecclesiastic persons, Archbishops, Bishops, etc. as the only Spiritual Pastor of Pastors on earth.  
Hence if Christ hath given such power, it's not lawful, without breach of the fifth Command, to embrace or profess any Religion in a Christian Kingdom, except it be first instamped by or with the Authority of the King the Head (as the Chaplain calls him) of the Churches by his Royal Authority. Yea, our Book of Canons say, that Christian Kings now have the same power in causes Ecclesiastical, that the godly Kings among the jews had: And are they not then Prophets by office, and may write Canonic Scripture, as David and Solomon did? and so we must not, without Rebellion, profess the Faith or the Christian Religion, but when, and where, such as the King commands us; contrary to Mat. 10. 32. or we are to confess Christ before men, but not except the King teach and command a confession, and such a confessor?  
3. Paul must have told us, Eph 4. 11, 12. of the King, as well as of the Apostle given to edify the Body, and gather the Church, if so be that he is the only supreme judge of true and false Religions: And he must be some spiritual officer, and one who chooseth a God and a Religion to his Subjects; and he must be ●he holiest Subject, who can say, The King's God is my God. When I read this, I was sad, to see Mr. Tho: Hooker speak and write like the Royalist Mr. Rich. Hooker.  
4. The Magistrate supreme and inferior, except Mr. H. be an Erastian, is a member of the Church, and under the Sceptre of Christ in the preached Gospel, and to be edified by the Word, Seals, Rebukes and Censures; for otherwise. He that despiseth you despiseth me; and, if he hear not the Church, let him be as a heathen; and, Faith comes by hearing, must suffer a strange exception in the person of the King; he may despise pastors and the Church without guiltiness, for he is above the pastors, and carves their Religion, and prescribes, as our cited Proclamation saith, the causes why Bishops should excommunicate and censure, to wit, if they refuse the King's Religion; and Mr. H. warrants him by a power peculiar and supreme so to do.  
5. We read not that the Kings of Israel and judah prescibed what was true and false Religion, but were subject to the Priests and Prophets, who spoke the word of the Lord: and the Prophets rebuked Kings, as jeroboam and others, for intruding themselves in that office. Moses, Samuel, David, Solomon were Prophets, 2 Chron. 36. 16. Isa. 50. 19  
6. The Magistrate is the Minister of God, and bears the Sword to take order with evil doers, and is Custos & vindex utriusque tabulae, and the Religion is supposed to be before the Ruler.  
7. It's somewhat heathenish, like Numa, Lycurgus, who to procure obedience and authority to themselves, gave out, that they prescribed what Religion was true, and that they conversed much with God.  
8. All questions and controversies of Religion in the Nation must be determined, all cases of conscience resolved by this Pope, who only can determine what is true, and what is false Religion; and the King must be the Oracle and Priest, with whom only the Urim and the Thummim must be.  
9 All fall against Religion must be Treason against the King: whereas Kings and people are rebuked, because they harkened not to the voice of the Prophets, not because disobedient to the word of the Lord in the mouth of the King. Either this is to take both the Swords from the Pope, and to give them to the King, or it is nothing: for without controversy the King bears the Sword to take vengeance of him that doth evil, Rom. 13. 4. 1 Pet. 2. 14. and whosoever determineth by his supreme power, what is true and false Religion to all the Subjects, must bear the other Sword.  
10. M. H. makes out his Assertion thus: Kings could not provide for their Subjects, to live in godliness and honesty, except they had power to inquire and judge of true and false Religions. Now this is spoken of Nero and of heathen Kings, 1 Tim. 2. 1, 2. But out of doubt, God never made heathens, that are enemies to true Religion, supreme determiners of true and false Religion: And if this agree to Rulers as Rulers, as M. H. saith, it is peculiar to their power and place; then all Rulers, Heathen, Christian, high and low, sound in the faith, and corrupt and heretical, should be carvers of so many sundry Gods and Religions. But the next Reason is ill and worse, if because the King is a Nursefather to the Church, he must be father, and a begetter both of Religion and of the Church, & because he protects and defends the true Church, then true Religion must be before him: As also when Mr. H. saith, that the Prince is a Nurse father to the Church, he means, the Independent Church only, so that he owes no protection to Presbyterians, nor justice to them. And if the Nurse-fathers' care be, that there should be a right opinion and worship openly professed within his Territories, the Magistrate is to do this no other ways, but by the Sword, for another power he hath not; then must he with the Sword compel all within his Dominions to be 
M. H. Suru. p. 4. c. 2. p. 40. God's people, who enter into Church-covenant, should be free—  professed members of Independent Churches, else M. H. judges there is some other sound worship and sound profession: But this compelling of men to be Church-members, Mr. H. before disclaimed.  
Mr. H. doth also suspiciously give his sense of Toleration, while he limiteth the Magistrate's power, to the not suffering of 
M. H. his imperfect sense of Toleration limited to the non permitting only of open blasphemy and idolatry.  open Blasphemy and Idolatry. But beside open Blasphemy, there is Blasphemy Pepery in the hesds of it, many dangerous errors about superstructures and nonfundamentals, are these erroneous opinions professed to be tolerated? Mr. H saith nothing against the Belgic and Socinian Toleration of all Errors, except fundamentals, which are made few by them, and hard to be known: And what the Gospel suffers by the Toleration holden 
Remonst. Apolog. Preface, p. 1, 2. sect. 24. Confessio seu declaration Remonst. in praefat. Eplse. dis. 28. th'. 14, 15. Omnes itaque Ecclesiae, etiamsi in varlis doctrinae articulis perperam sentiant, tolerand●…. Socin. Com. 1. 1 Joh. Theoph, Nicolaides in refut. tract. de Eccl. c. 2.  by the Independents in England, and swarms of Sects there, is too manifest to the Christian world. See the Arminians and Socinians in the Margin.  
Let the Reader judge of Mr. H. his Reason, The Kings of Israel did punish Blasphemy and Idolatry, not as Types of Christ, but by a Civil power. Mr. H. shall not in haste teach us what was typical, what moral. Mr. Lockier and others make the constitution of the Jewish Church typical, and of another nature from the New Testament Church; others, not so. But I am afraid our Brethren augment the Calendar of Typicals, until the Old Testament be well near laid aside, as many Anabaptists do. The Kings of Israel punished blasphemers, not as types of Christ, but by civil power. But Ioh● Goodwin will reply, Was it a civil power morally that belongs to all Christian Magistrates to destroy the city, in which the Inhabitants are seduced to Idolatry, and that all the Inhabitants and the cattle be utterly destroyed, and the spoil burnt with fire, as Deut. 13. 15, 16? to punish the cattle of Idolaters and Apostates with death, and burn all the goods with fire, surely must be temporary then. But let Mr. H. show what is typical in a National Oath: They say, 
How unjustly our Brethren argue against a National oath from typicals.  There is no shadow of it in the New Testament. Ans. If the meaning be, there is no express command, no practice of it in the New Testament, or for it, and therefore it must be typical.  
1. By this Argument negative, this is not in the New Testament, Ergo there is no warrant for it in Scripture, is fair for all who would cashier all the Books of the Old Testament as no Scripture; and so that the Magistrate should take away the life of one that commits Sodomy, Bestiality, murder's Father or Mother, must be typical, and not obliging under the New Testament: for let Mr. H. show an express command or practise for it in the New Testament. A general there is, Rom. 13. but Socinians, Anabaptists tell us, You must not take away the life of him who is created according to the Image of God, by Logic and argumentative consequences, but by express Law.  
2. Let it be showed by what express precept or practice in the New Testament, a rich Son should take in to his house and feed and maintain his Father-in-law, and his Grandfather, and his Grandmother that are begging.  
3. Mr. H. may also press us for an express precept, or practice of a promissory oath in a private person, as well as in a 
Mr H. may as well seek an express warrant for a promissory oath in a private man, as in a Nation in the New Testament.  Nation; and for a covenant of peace by oath between a Christian Nation, and a neighbour Christian Nation in the New Testament: or suppose a Christian Nation should neighbour with a nation that worships the sun, compelling all strangers that come within their bounds, by death, to deny Jesus Christ, & worship their God the Sun, there must be an express particular precept for a covenant oath, for peace to warrant such a paction, that the Heat●… Nation shall kill none of theirs for refusing Sun-Worship.  
4. The particular temptations that may tempt jonathan to be on his own Father's side against David, and might stir David up against Saul and all his seed, were a sufficient call to put David and jonathan under the tye of the oath of God one to another. There were good grounds of the covenant between Laban and jacob. And some Nations designed of God should submit, suit peace, and embrace the Jewish Religion. Was there not cause, why both they and Israel should lay upon themselves the band of a covenant oath? that both of them should be the united Confederates of God: and the like National temptations press a Nation now, when it's become the Lords covenanted Kingdom, as Isa. 19 25. Rev. 11. 15. which within and without is enticed to receive the mark of the Beast, and his name on their foreheads, to guard themselves against such snares by a National oath, not that every one of the Nation, though ignorant, profane, and malignant, and treacherous enemies to the truth should be admitted in covenant. And Mr. H. seems to say that promissory oaths of single persons under the New Testament are not necessary; and (say I) not lawful, if not necessary. For Mr. H. saith, a man is not necessarily and morally tied to swear or vow. And I believe a man may live all his life and never take a private oath, I say, private 
Suru. par. 4. c. 2. page 4●.  betwixt God and himself, to keep his Laws, and yet not be guilty of sin in so doing.  
Mr. H. speaks most mistakingly of the doctrine of vows, 
Mr. H. great mistake in the matter of vows.  as if he had not read our Divines.  
For 1. Our National vow that we shall be the Lords people, cannot be called a private vow.  
2. If a vow to keep God's commandments tye not morally, and so be not necessary, it is not lawful; and if so, we must condemn these general vows which one makes to God in prayer, Psal. 32. 2. I will bless the Lord at all times, Psal. 101. 2. I will behave myself wisely in a perfect way. Who can pray in faith to God in private, but they must engage themselves to 
General Christians vows to moral duties of praying, praising, etc. are of eternal obligation, & so bind under the New Testament. Calvin. Instit. l. 4. c. 13. sect. 5, 6. Professor. Leyden. in Syno●purior. Theol. dis. 28. de votis thes. 15, 16, 17. Tylen. Syntag. dis. 43. de tert: precept. thes. 12, 13, 14, 15. Bucan, 102. 45. q 3, 4. D. Willet Synop. papismi. 6. Gen. contr. q. 1, 2, 3. Durantus de Ritibus Eccles. Cath. l. 11. c. 34. Gabr. Bicl. in Can. missae. lect. 29.  God to run, if he draw? and what suits an enlarged heart, and strength against temptations? and who can pray for faith, and perseverance, but they vow new obedience? ●●d yet Mr. H. saith, a man may all his life never vow betwixt God and himself to keep the Commandments of God, and not be guilty. As for vows of particular things, vows concerning spare dye●, our Divines, a● Calvin, professors of Leyden, Tilenus, Bacanus, teach they are utilia potius quam necessaira, useful, and in regard of particular temptations, profitable rather then necessary. Now one National vow is to the whole duties of the first and second Table, which we tie ourselves to perform both in Baptism, in the Lord's Supper, in selfe-judging, in confession of sin.  
And 2. To say a man all his life may never be tied to a vow, is to say a man may never pray, never confess his sins, never speak in private his godly Gospel-resolutions, and purpose of heart to cleave to the Lord, and yet not be guilty.  
3. This is to make all Gospel-vows to be unnecessary, and will worship under the New Testament. Whereas Papists tell us in the Mass they make a general vow of obedience to God. See Durantus and Gab. Biel.  
Mr. H. For if the Magistrate were bound to follow the judgement 
Survey par. 4. c. 3. p. 57  of the Churches and Ministry, if they should judge a toleration of all Religions lawful, or judge the false to be true, he then were bound to nurse the false Religion, and false Churches.  
Ans. 1. No shadow of consequence is here, for neither Magistrate nor people can be bound to follow the judgement of the Churches or Ministry, farther than they follow the Rule of the Word, they follow their judgement conditionally, not absolutely and simply; and it is a great calumny of Mr. Burton 
How Prince and People are to follow the judgement of the Churches and Ministry, & how not.  and our Brethren, that we lay bands on the consciences of Prince and people to follow the acts and determinations of the Church, be they true or false: and that there is no place left to appeal to the next, or a better informed Synod, and to the consciences of the collective Church of the godly judicious professors, and to protest and deny obedience to erring Assemblies. If it be said, but where is there a judge to determine whether this or another well informed Synod, or the conscience of the collective body of the godly be right? This argument falls with equal weight upon all Judicatures, all Judges, Parliament, Prince and Councillors with him, & upon all Assemblies; for what they determine, be it toleration of all blasphemies, or a strictest uniformity in Worship and Religion, it hath no power to bind the conscientious and moral practices of Prince or people, more than to bind their conscience by this: for the Fraternity and whole Church is tied to follow the dogmatic determination of officers, in preaching or in sentencing delinquents without gainsaying: what the officers decree (saith Mr. H.) it is to all as the word of God. But Mr. H. must answer us, Churches 
Survey par. 2. c 3. page 41.  and Ministry are bound either absolutely or conditionally to follow the Judgement of the King, who judgeth popery is the only true Religion, to which he can tender protection. If the former, what Tyranny are we under, who must submit to the Religion of the Prince, or be denuded of all protection, and exposed to fire and sword? If the latter be said, to wit, that Churches and Ministry are only conditionally to follow the judgement of the King, so they find it agreeable to the Word, otherwise not: than it must be false which Mr. H. said, that the Prince is the only supreme Judge of all true and false Religions: to say they must either obey or suffer, saith, that Christ exposed all to Martyrdom.  
Mr. H. If it be in the Magistrate's power lawfully to forbid and hinder, than it is not in the power of the Churches to do lawfully for 
Arg. 1. Par. 4. c. 3. p. 57  then the same thing should be in the same regard both lawful and unlawful●… and the rules of providence shall be opposite one to another: but the supreme Magistrate may hinder any of another Nation to come into his Kingdom, or his own subjects to go out, otherwise he should want power to oppose them who come to lay waste the State, and should not have power to require homage of his own people.  
Ans. 1. The probation of the proposition is most false, for 
The Prince's power over the locomotive power of subjects is a watery and feeble plea for his sole lawful power of convening of Assemblies.  the power of the Magistrate is not to forbid, or command what he pleaseth, but according to the rule of the Word, and the Church's power is the same; if both the powers be lawful, their objects cannot be contradictory: for God hath not given to two lawful powers any lawful liberty, that the one may command what is lawful, and the other what is unlawful: for than he should give a power to command unlawful things, and the command of a created power should make it lawful, which is blasphemous: this argument falls with weight upon the Independent way. There is a Iezabel in the Independent Church of Thyatira, and another Iezabel in the Church of Pergamus, each Church (say our Brethren) hath an immediate Independent 
The Lord never gave a lawful power to command both things lawful, and things contradictory to lawful things.  Church-power to excommunicate. Thyatira useth their power and excommunicates jezabel which is under them. Pergamus absolves and defends their Iezabel. Both powers are highest and immediate, and countable to no juridical power on earth: both are lawful powers. Then must it follow, if it be in the power of the one Church, to wi●, of Pergamus, lawfully to forbid and hinder the excommunication of their equally guilty jezabel and the c●…ning of her blasphemous Doctrine: (for Pergamus absolves their ●…l, and commends, and defends her Doctrine as so●…d and ●…g) than it shall not be in the power of T●… lawfully to excommunicate their Iezabel, and condemn he● plasphemous Doctrine: for it shall follow, that the same Doctrine must be in the same regard both lawful, and sound, and edifying (saith the lawful power of Pergamus) and 〈◊〉 unlawful, and unsound, and destructive to souls, saith the lawful power of Thyatira.  
2. The probation is feeble and wacery, the King hath sufficient power to oppose wasters of his Kingdom, and to require homage 
The Prince's duty to preserve peace & godliness makes him not Lord of Church-Assemblies, and of Religion. See Bilson of Perpet. Gou. c. 10. pag. 150, 151.  of his subjects. Suppose he have not an unlimited power to forbid these of other Nations and Churches, and his own, to go to a Synod, within or without his Nation, for the settling of the Churches in necessary peace and truth, if the Churches must seek liberty and counsel for their souls good, and edification: nor hath he any lawful power from God to hinder his own subjects to send Commissioners to sound and godly Synods for counsel and synodical light, more than jeroboam could lawfully forbid the people to go and worship at jerusalem, upon pretence, that they might be persuaded to cleave to Rehoboam their lawful Prince, and waste his new Kingdom: nor hath the Prince an unlimited and absolute power to exact such absolute homage of his people; nor such a power over their moving from place: for so the Church Independent of jerusalem consisting 
The Lord of Life hath principally in the first Table laid a law upon our locomotive, and all our actings, to honour and love him first, and the Prince only secondarily and subordinately to God; if God charge us first to go to public meetings to honour him, the Prince under pretence of peace cannot forbid the people to go up to jerusalem to worship; we are to obey God rather then man.  of ten thousand, if not more, should have no intrinsical power to meet for the public worship of God; but the Prince must have a lawful power to hinder their meeting, or then the Church cannot have a lawful power to meet; for the convening of ten thousands, if abused, is as dangerous for wasting of a Kingdom in its own way, as the convening of a national Synod, is, or may be destructive to peace.  
Mr. H. To appoint such solemn public Assemblies is an act merely civil; Ergo, the Prince may do it. A civil act belongs not to an Ecclesiastic power. A right opinion, rectus de Deo sensus & cultus, of God, and a right worship of God is a merely civil act.  
Ans. There is nothing here sound, but evil and worse. Christ ●…h given an Ecclesiastic intrinsical power to his Church to meet, it being a part of his free Kingdom, and he himself a free King. Suppose the Princes of the earth oppose, Ps. 2. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. Ps. 110. 1, 2, 3.  
2. King's are Nurse-fathers', having a civil, but cumulative power to command them to meet and assemble, but no privative 
The Prince's power to convocate Synods is cumulative, not privative to hinder them.  power to hinder them.  
3. This proves they may not meet in a single congregation without the leave of the heathen and persecuting Magistrates, and condemns all the assembles and Church-meetings of the Apostolic Church as rebellious; for they had neither allowance nor command of the Magistrate, yea, they were forbidden: and heathen Rulers as Rulers have power to oppose wasters of their Kingdoms, and so had the heathen Emperors in the Apostles times, as well as Christian Magistrates have such a power.  
4. A right sense and opinion of God is no civil act. This yet more makes the Magistrate an Ecclesiastic person.  
Mr. H. To call what members of the Synod he pleaseth to consult about the good of the Church belongeth to the Prince, and their homage requireth this, otherwise he could not maintain the peace of the subject in godliness, for providence doth not require the end, but allows also the means.  
Ans. Because the third and fourth Arguments are one, they are here.  
1. The godly and sound Prince may call godly and learned Divines where the Churches are rightly constitute; but when the Churches make no free election of these Divines, it is neither a free Synod, not are the Divines messengers of the Churches, nor sent by the Churches, as Act. 15. 1, 2, 3. nor may 
The Magistrate may not use what means he pleaseth, and domineer over Assemblies to choose members, and convocate them as a Magistrate, to preserve godliness. Histor. Magdeburgen. Cent. 4. c. 9  the Magistrate for the maintaining of the peace of the subjects in godliness, use what means he pleaseth for that end, but only means prescribed of God, except Mr. H. can prove that Christ hath annexed to the royal Office, a gift of choosing members of Assemblies, more excellent than is in the Churches, which we read not. And if 2. this belong to the Magistrate as the Magistrate, than all Magistrates, Heathen, Arrian, Socinian, Popish (for sure they are Magistrates) must have this power, and this power only, if it be given to godly and sound Magistrates, as such, Mr. H. his instance of Herod comes far short of this power. Read then the Council of Antioch holden by the Arrians under Constantius. Then must Maximus Bishop of jerusalem, and julius' Bishop of Rome, who refused to come to that Council, be Rebels by Mr. H. his reason, and deny homage to the Emperor. For the Magdeburgenses, Sozomen, Socrates, 
Sozom. l. 3. c. 5: Socrat. l. 〈◊〉. c. 8: The Emperors had not that power over assemblies, which Mr. H. says. Socrat. l. 2. c. 29 30.  tell us these godly men justly feared the Princes siding with Arrians, and the design of casting out of Athanasius, at the Assembly at Antiochia, Anno 344. and the altering of the Nicene faith, as fell out: and it's known that Constantius rigorously and unjustly commanded those of the Council of Sirmium, Anno 356. to recall the two Confessions of Faith, one in Latin, another in Greek, in which though abstaining from the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, (which should not have been) they gave great glory to the Son of God; yet that they too much inclined to obey his wicked design, in that he also banished many worthy Bishops, Liberius Bishop of Rome, Paulinus Bishop 
Bulling, de Concil.  of Triere, Dionyfius Bishop of Alba, Osius Bishop of Corduba, and others, because they refused to ratify in the Council at Milan, the deposition of Athanasius, and to alter the Nicene Faith. See Theodoret, Socrates, Sozo●en, Ruffin. Much more 
Theod. l. 1. c. 15. Socrat. l. 2. c. 36 Sozom. l. 4. c. 9 Ruffin. l. 1. c. 20.  of the flexibleness of Constantius in opposing the Council of Ariminum, and in arming with power Ursatius and Valens to publish the sum of the Arrian Faith, and to eject sundry Bishops, who refused to subscribe thereunto: and in gathering a Council in Nica a town in Thracia, which ratified the Arrian Faith, and called it falsely the Nic●●● Faith; as if the world knew not then and now, the difference between Nica in Thracia, and Nice in Bythinia. See Socrates and Sozomen. 
Socrat. l. 〈◊〉. c. 37 Sozom. l. 4. c. 17  Who shall read the Histories shall find, 1. That the Emperors were not Masters of true and false Religion, as Mr. H. saith. 2. That they had not power of choosing members of the Council. as Mr. H. 3. That godly Bishops refusing to come to corrupt Counsels at the command of the Emperor, were not counted rebellious, as Mr. H. saith.  
To the fifth Argument, The Churches need the protection of the Prince in Assemblies, and are to give an account to any of their 
The Church is to give an account of their syned 〈◊〉 acting 〈◊〉 the Prince, but this proves not, that the Prince hath over the Church any such headship as Mr. Hooker ascribeth to him.  faith and doings, 1 Pet. 3. 18. and far more to the Christian Prince: but it follows not, that they have no intrin●…l power from Christ to meet themselves, if the Prince refuse to convocate them, as Asa, Hezekiah, josiah did, for the Magistrate ought to protect the Independent congregation, and every single Professor: but it follows not, therefore the single congregation hath no power intrinsecal to meet for Word and Seals, except the Prince who is a persecutor, give him leave: nor follows it yet, therefore no single member can profess Christ before men and the Ruler (who often persecutes confession of Christ) except the Ruler give him leave to profess Christ, and to meet in a Synod: For Christ hath given to his Church, and members thereof, power to worship him in private, in public, in Church-Assemblies, and hath laid above their heads no lawful privative power of Rulers to hinder his people to worship the Lord God, Exodus 3● and the Argument retorted concludes against Mr. Hooker. The Prince hath no power under pretence of keeping civil peace to Caesar, to hinder actings of rendering honour to God, contrary to truth, and destructive to the Gospel.   

CHAP. XIII.  
Antiquity knew nothing of the Mystery of our brethren's Independent Way.  
THe external Society of the Church (say the Magdeburgenses 
Magdeb. cent. 1. l. 11 c. 4. p. 288. Ecclesiae ve: o●…tum externum ex bonis & ex malie omnibus temporibus esse mixtum Apostoli tradunt, pag. 289. Paulus in Ecclesia Romana etiam malos (visibiliter) mixtos ostendit, Rom. 16. & in Ecclesiâ Corinthiacā plurima desiderat, sunt enim intereos contentiones— idololatrae, convitiatores, ebriosi, rapaces, 1 Cor. 5. incestuosus— litigant sub infidelibus, & damno afficiunt fratres: Scortatores, avari, 1 Cor. 6. vescuntur Idolothytis, 1 Cor. 8. & 10, etc. Galatae à doctrina Evangelii defecerant— fermentum inter eos alii alios devorant, etc. sio in●er Thessalonicenses, 2 Thess. 3. & Philippenses, 2. omnes quae sua sunt quaerunt, 2 Tim. 1. Asiani omnes aversati sunt me, etc.  is at all times mixed of good and bad. Our Brethren say of all visibly good, even visible converts. The Magdeburgenses teach, That after Paul hath commended the faith and obedience, love, sanctification, growth of grace of the visible Church of Rome, Rom. 1. 6, 7. Corinth, 1 Cor. 1. 2. Galatia, Gal. 1. 2, 3, 4. Thessalonic●, 2 Thess. 1. 2, 3, 4. Philippi, cap. 1. ver. 5, 6. and the seven Churches, Rev c. 2. & 3. which are commended highly by Christ; yet in the same very Epistle, the mixture of visible hypocrites was to be seen among them.  
See Fla●. Illy. in Catalogo Testium veritatis lib. 2. pag. 91, 92, 93.  
Pa. Simpson his Centuries, Cent. 1, 2, etc.  
Baron●● annal, Cent. 1. & sequentibus, ann. 204, 242, 245.  
jacob. Gualterium jesuitam in Tabulâ Chronographicâ, a. 1. seculo ad seculum 17. Sac. 1. ad an. 100 pag. 153. sect. 3. & sequintibus  
See Bernard.  
See August. tom 7. contra Epistolam Parmeniani Donatista, l. 1, 2, 3. de Baptismo contra Donatistas', lib. 7.  
Contra literas Petiliani Donatistae, lib. 3. Lib. de Unitate Ecclesiae.  
August. contra Cresconium Grammaticum lib. 4. Colla. cum Donatistis. Ad Donatistas post collationem, l. & l. de gestis cum Emerito.  
See Cyprian. ad plebem & quinque Presbyteris Schismaticis factionis Foelicissimi, Epist. 40. vol. l. 1. Epist. 8.  
Cyprian. ad Cornelium de ordinatione ejus à s● comprobata & Foelicissimo, Epist. 42. vol. l. 2. Epist. 10.  
Cyprian. Cornelio, Epist. 45. al. l. 4. Ep. 8.  
Cyprian. Antoniano's de Cornelio & Novatiano, Epist. 42. al. l. 4. Ep. 2. Cornelius Factus est Episcopus à plarimis Collegis nostris, qui tunc in urbe Roma aderant, qui aa nos literas honorificas & ●audabiles, & testimonio suae praedicationis illustres de ejus ordinatione miserunt, etc. Ib. pag. 119. Quod vero ad Novatiani personam pertinet— Quisquis ille & qualiscunque est, Christianus non est, qui in Christi Ecclesia non est— nisi si Episcopus tibi videtur, qui Episcopo in Ecclesia à s●deci● Coepiscopis facto, adulter atque extraneus Episcopus fieri à desertoribus per ambitum nititur; & cum sit à Chricto una Ecclesia per tolum mundum in multa concorbra aivisa, item Episcopatus unus, Episcoporum multorum concordi num●rofitate diffusus, isse post Dei traditionem, post connexam & ubique conjunctam Catholicae Ecclesiae unitatem, humanam conetur Ecclesiam facere, etc. Mr. H. who cries out against me, because I teach, that he who is a pastor of one Church, is a pastor of all the Churches in the earth, may cry out against Cyprian.  
See Cyprian. cum Collegis Lucio Papae Roman Ep. 58. al. l. 3. Ep. 1. Cyprianus ad Stephanum de Martia●o Arelatensi, qui Novatiano consensit, Epist. 67. a●. l. 3. Epist. 13. In all which, this is clear to Cyprian: Episcopatus unus, quamvisplures Episcopi in Ecclesia catholica, which throws down Mr. H. his way of a pastor married to one single congregation.  
See my Reverend Brother Mr. Baily, Vindication of his Dissuasive, ann. 1655. especially to Mr. Cotton, cap. 4. sect. 2. pag 49, 50.  
There was an equality of Jurisdiction in this age among the Churches; but that these Writers mean not single congregations as such, that every congregation hath power to call and depose officers, I do not concide; for they deny a supremacy 
Magdeb. Cen. 11. c. 7. p. 102. Si quis p●ivatos hujus 〈◊〉 autores prespi●●at, ●●debit ●…m gubernation propemodum 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 si●ilem f●●isse. Singulae 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ●…em habebant potestatem, verbum Dei pur● docendi— excon●● 〈◊〉— 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ●…ligendi, vocandi, ●r●●nandi & just ●●ssimas ob causas iterum dep●…, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 S●●odo● conv●cand●, scholas instituendi & conservand●, in rebus d●b●●s & 〈◊〉 ve●…●…um sententias ●…ulandl, judicandi, decidendi: deinde vicin● Ecclesiae vici●arum, charita●is & aedificationis studio non prop●er pr●matum aliquem, sed propte● manda●●m Christi de●…aternâ dilectiene, tum in sua necessitate opem implorab●nt: tum vicissim earum curam gettbant & quasi inspectrices & adjutu●ces erant, ut verbum Dei pure 〈◊〉— ut vocarentur & ordinarentur p●● & erud●ti v●ri ad ministerium Ecclesiae. E●…. ex Apollinari● ait, l. 〈◊〉. c. 16. Nuper natas doct inas (〈◊〉 provinciales aut ple●●que doctores) exami●abant, & prophanapron●●●abant haeresinque istam reprobantes, Ecclesiâ ej●●iebant & excommun cab●….  to the Churches they speak of here 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Rome. Constantinople; but these as Mother Cathedral Churches, not as single congregations, claim supremacy, as here also they ascribe Jurisdiction to associate Churches.  
Observe also, that they say the form of Government of the Church, was almost like to popular Government, not a Democracy itself. It is like in times of Persecution, the meeting of Christians being early in the morning, at the time of receiving of heathens to Baptism (in which all the Christians, as well as the one baptising congregation, were interessed) and in the Lord's day acts of Discipline have been few The Magdeburgenses tell us from justinus, from Plinius his Epistle to Trajan, 
Magdeb. ce●●. 2. c. 〈◊〉. p. 8●.  from Eusebius, l. 4. c. 23. as Dienysius Corinthus in that place saith they read the Prophets and Apostles, a pastor exhorted to follow what was read, the whole company stood up and prayed, and received the Lords Supper, and thereby obliged themselves to walk as Christians, not to kill, not to whore, etc. By Doctors and Rulers Ministers were ordained, as the History 
Magdeb. cent. 2. 〈◊〉. pag 87. Certo ordi●● & ●●●●bus pr●fici Eccle●●●● Doctores & Gubernatores joan. Apostolus à ●…bus roga●us vicinas ●…strat provincias, consti●●●as●bi à se Ecclesias Episcopis & ministris ornat. Euseb. 3. c. ●3.  of the Apostle john witnesses, and casting of lots in the election of pastors. Hence the name 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, the Clergy. No shadow of a male-Church here.  
Tortullian shows, that in Church-meetings there were exhortations, 
Tertul. in Apol. Co mus in coetum & congregationem, ut ad Deum quasi manu factâ precationibus ambiam●s orantes: haec vis Deo grata est— Ibid. etiam exhortationes, castigationes, & censura divina; nam & judicatur magno cum pondere, ut apud certos de Dei conspectu; summumque futuri judicii praejudicium, si quis ita deliquerit, ut à communione orationis & conventus & omnis sancti commercii relegeru: president probati quique seniores, honorem istum non pretio, sed testimonio adepti. Magdeb. Cent. 3. c. 6. p. 94. Ejusdem provinciae proximi quique Episcopi manus imponebant. Athan.  corrections, and divine censures— and the whole Elders that are approved, rule in the meeting. Elders (faith he) who have obtained that honour, not by price, but by a good testimony. Now this being done by the whole congregation meeting for public prayer, could not be done by the people, and by women, except consenting: for Tertullian saith, De veland. virg. Non permittitur muli●ri in Ecclesia loqui: sed nec docere nec tingere. Eusebius l. 6. c. 8. when Origen was ordained Bishop, saith, and Cyprian l. 2. Epist. 10. ad Co●n●l. All the nearest Bishops of the Province came, and laid hands on him prasente plebe, saith Cyprian.  
The fourth Age showeth what is true and false Antiquity: and whereas there was in the beginning thereof a sad desolation through the persecution of Dioclesian; so also there came a change in a glorious manner, most suddenly, by Constantine. Eusebius l. 3. de vita Constan. mentions the Synod of Nice, famous like the meeting of the Church in the Pentecost, Acts 2. as the Magdeburgenses, cen. 4. c. 2. p, 2. say. Now since the Gospel was spread through Europe, Africa and Asia, as Eusebius and as A●kanafius, from the East to the West: And the Magdeburgenses cite julius Firmicus Maternus, Optat. Milevitanus, Basilius, teaching, that the Church of Christ was all the 
julius Firmicus Maternus l. ad Imperat●res de abolendis Idolo●at●iis Ethnici●: Quis locus in terra est, qui non Christi nomen possederit 〈◊〉 quâ sol oritur, quâ occidit, quâ erigitur septentrio, quâ vergi● austere, ●ocum venerandi nu●…nis Majestas implevit. Basilius Ep. 72.  world over where the Sun did shine, East and West. South and North. Let the impartial Reader judge, if it have a shadow of Reason, that the Churches who sent Commissioners to this famous Synod of Nice, were only congregational Churches.  
1. The Magdeburgenses set down numerous and famous 
Magdeb. cent. 4. c. 11.  Churches in Asia, in Palestine, Caes●rea, Tyrus and Zidon, in Gaza. Arabia, Syria, Mesopotamia, Pamphilia, Cilicia, Lydia, Phrygia, Bi●hynia, H●llespontus, Galatia, Paphlag●nia, Cappadocia, Persia, etc. in the Isles in Europe, in Africa, most of all sent messengers to this Synod: What an Assembly must this be, if petty congregational Churches sent Commissioners? What house could contain them? There was  
2. A catalogue of Bishops sent to this Synod, before this called Overseers, and Prapositi by Cyprian, not pastors simply of one single congregation.  
3. Eusebius tells of Provincial Synods, and so of Provincial 
Euseb. l. 4. c. 7. & 13. Euseb. de vita Constan. l. 4. Cen. 4. c. 1 & 2.  Churches, which must have sent Commissioners. There was a Synod of Tyrus under Constantint, a Synod in S●l●ucia. See the Magdeburgenses.  
4. The number of those added to the Church, saith, that they could not only be congregational Churches; Theodoret saith, that Constantine writes to Eusebius Nicomediensis, there 
Theodoret. l. 1. c. 6. In urbe quae nostrum nomen complectitur, auxiliante Salvatoris Dei providentiâ, ingens hominum multitudo sese addixit Ecclesiae: ita admod●● augescente omnium ibi numere, admodum dignum videtur, etiam Ecclesias in eâ plures construi. Niceph. l. 7. c. 34. Euseb. l. 8. c. ult. Imperat. Caesar. Galerius Maxim●nus mo●bo fatal correptus, e●iam in hâc causa indulgentiam nostram extendendam sse putavimus, ut ruisus Christiani sint, ac domos, (Templa) in quibus convenerunt, sic denuò constituant, ut nihil contra disciplinam publicam faciant— Deo suo supplicent pro salute nostra, pro R●p. proque seipsis. Magdeb. cent. 4. c. 3. pag. 25. Congregantur per singulas civitates Ecclesiae, habentur Synodi.  was a great multitude in the Town named from himself added to the Church, so that they behoved to be divided into many Churches: and who would deny this to be a Presbyterial Church? Nicephorus saith, when Constantine was baptised, more than twelve thousand men, beside women and children, were baptised, and many added to the Church. It's apparent, the very nature of Christian Religion, requires congregational and synodical meetings. Galerius Maximinus having given toleration for Christian Religion, though he condemned the Religion itself, incontinent in every city congragations are erected, and Synods or Presbyteries kept, say the Magdeburgeuses from Eus●bius.  
Donatists excuse their separation from the Church, because in 
Aug. l. de un, Baptis. c. 14.  communion of the Sacraments mali maculent bonos. August.  
For Ordination and Election of Ministers by the votes and laying on the hands of the pastors, and consent of the people, without the device of a male-congregation destitute of officers: See the Magdeburgenses, cent. 4. c. 6. p. 244, 245. who cite Bosil. Epist. 58. ad M●l●t. Th●●dor. l. 1. c. 19 the Epistle of the Ni●●n● Council to them of Alexandria, as Th●●doret citys it, l. 4. c. 10. the History of Ambro●●us Mediol●…, as Secrates hath it, l. 4. c. 30, etc. saith the same. See Magdiburg. vol. 3. cant. 11. c. 6. p. 140. See vol. 3. cent. 13. c. 6. p. 260, 261.  
The Magdeburgenses say, the reason of multiplying of Officers, Bishops, Presbyters, Deacons, Lectors, Canons, Exorcists, 
Magdeb. cent. 4. c. 7. p. 274. Quemadmodum sub finem superioris seculi caeperunt augeri coetus Ecclesiastici— & operae Presbyterorum in plura genera distribui, eo quod pauciores ●●s efficiendis non essent pares. Magdeb. cent 4. c. 7. de Politia Eccles. p. 290. See the Magdeb. vol. 3. cent. 13. c. 6. p. 239. Et Magdeb. vol. 3. cent. 13. cap 7. pag. 307.  etc. was in the end of the third Age, Ecclesiastic congregations began to be multiplied.  
2. Metropolitans, Archbishops, Bishops, Deacons, Archdeacon's in Rome, in Constantinople, as Sozomen l. 4. c. 2. in Alexandria, as Sozomen l. 7. c. 19 and Optat. Mil●vitanus l. 1. contr. Parmen. and the 14 Canon of the Council of Neocaesarea ordains, that in amplu civitatibus, in large cities there should not be above seven Deacons. Now sense and reason would say, there could be no ground of appointing such a number of officers, if Rome, Constantinople, Antioch, Alexandria had been all one single congregation, meeting 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, within the same walls, and not a large Presbyterial Church.  
3. They must be great strangers to Rome, who know not that there were at Rome many Churches and Meeting-places consecrated to the Saints; and that the Synod of Nice, as Ruffians and Athanasius say, ordained the Bishop of Rome to care for the Churches of the Suburbs, as the Magdeburgenses say: yet all was called the Church of Rome. See the Magd. burgenses vol. 2. cent. 5. c. 6. p. 357, 358.  
Of the Church's mixture of wheat and chaff, see A●gustins 
August. de fide ad Peerum, cap. 43. Nullatenus dub tes aream esse Dei Ecclesiam Catholicam, & intra eam usque in finem seculi frumento paleas mixtas contineri— nec pro malis bonos deserendos, sed pro bonis malos, in quantum exigit fidei & charitatis ratio, tolerandos, id est, si vel in Ecclesia nullius pe●fidiae semina spargunt, vel fratres ad aliquod malum opus mortifer â imitatione non ducunt— ut ad bonam vitam per Dei misericordiam convertantur. Sic in Epist. Petil. c. 13. l. de Bapt. contr. Donat. c. 2. Prosp. de promis. & praedic. Dei c. 7. esse a●eam.  and Prosper, who say, Evil men, if they infect not, must be tolerated, and the good not separated from, because of the evil known to be such: Otherwise Donatus and his never taught men to separate from latent hypocrites, which are seeming and visible Saints; as also they must be tolerated, that they may be converted.  
Augustine asserts a catholic integral visible Church in Ps. 56. Corpus autem ejus non est ista a●● illa Eccl●s●a, sed t●t● orbe diffusa— for the whole Church, saith he, is made up of all the faithful having Christ for their Head. For the ordination of pastors 
Magdeb. voi. 2. cent. 5. c. 〈◊〉. p. 377, 378.  by the laying on of hands of the Ministers and consent of the people, se● the Magdeburgenses. So was Chrysosto●●● ordained cons●nsu cleri & populi Constantinopolitaniss, as Socrates l. 6. c. 2. and Sozomen l. 8. c. 2. witness. So saith Augustine, that not the Church of Carthage only, and of Numidia, sed propinquiores Episcopi, the nearest Bishops and Pastors laid on hands. See the Magdeburg. For association of Churches, see the Magdeb. vol. 2. cont. 5. c. 7. p. 417, 418. 422, 493.  
The Magdeburgenses tell us of famous and celebrious Churches 
Magdeb. vol. 11. cen. 6. c. 11. p. 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 Vol. 3. cen. 10. c. 7 p. 200. Euagrius l. 4. c. 21. Ni●●ph. l. 18. c. 28. Magdeb. cent. 6. c. 6. p. 161, 162. Constantinopoli in suburbio fuit Templun Joan. Baptistae, ut Nicep. l. 18. c. 4● Justinianus Imperaror incomparabile Sophiae Templum extruxit, & pretiosissimis lapillis, & aliis donariis auxit, restauravit etiam Sanctorum. Apostolorum, delubra struxit in usum vi●orum, soeminarum, puerorum, senum. Cyriacus. Episcopus Constantinopolitanus ibidem Mariae Virgini Sacellum posuit. Vide Euagrium. l. 4. c. 31. Sic Hierosolymis varia sunt Templa, ut Magdeb. cent. 7. c. 5. p. 65, 66.  in the sixth Age in Asi●●, Africa and Europe, in renowned c●●ies, which had eminent Bishops in them, and new Church's buil● especially. justiman the Emperor built in Constantinople in Thra●i● the noble Church of Sophia, incomparable for magnificence to any inthe world, saith E●agr●us and Nicephorus: And where there be many places of meeting for Worship in great cities, Constantinopie, Auti●ch, the Church of that city must be Presbyterial, not congregational to sounder Antiquity. That the Church of Rome could not meet congregationally, the multitude of Churches dedicated to Saints do evince. Magdeb. cent. 6. c. 6 p. 181. Quod saepe in publicis locis Romae Christiani ad sacra peragenda convenerint, ●estantur innu●era ●lla delubra 〈◊〉 Sabellico expressa, ut Templum Cosinae & Damiani, Saturnii: Vaticanum, Batjonae, Sop●iae, Euphemiae Marcelli, Pancratii. mention●●● facit Gregorius Papa Templorum Petri & P●●li Romae, Agathae— Caesa●ii Martyris, & Jul●i, Mariae, Agnetis, & Foelicitatis, Stephani, Andreae, etc.  
It's true, many of these Churches (say the Magdeburg●●ses) were built not so much for the Worship of God, as for Super●…: 
Magdeb. cent. 7. c. 6. pag. 94. Ro●na mu●t is Templis e●orna●a fuit: in quae non tam ad cultum Dei, quam ad superstitiones per●ge●●das conventum est. Magdeb. cent. 7. c. 7. p. 111, 112. Et cent. 8. c. 7 p. 249, 250. Magdeb. cent. 9 c. 4. pag. 86, 87. Haymo in Gal. 4. Magdeburgens. Vol. 3. cent. 10. c. 4. pag. 102. Theoph. in Matth. c. 3. Ecclesia multos habet baptizatos, sicut in a●ea, omne quod cultum fuit in agro, etc.  yet no sober man can say, the Christian● in Ro●● could m●●● in one congregation, but that many Churches were needful.  
See for association of Churches the Magdeburg●●s. That the visible Church is made up of good and evil, see the Magdeburg, who ●i●e Hayme and others; though in this and former ages gross corruptions daily grew. So the Magdeburg●●ses vol. 3. cent. 10. cite Thophylact for the same: and Vol. 3. c●nt. 12. c. 7. p. 457, 458. and cent. 13. c. 4. p. 185.  
The Magdeburgenses ascribe the power of the Keys, Matth. 
Magdeburgen. cent. 10. c. 4. pag. 98. Theophyl. in Mat. 16. Theophyl. in Mat. 18. Radulphus. l. 12. in Levit. c. 1. l. 20. c. 5. in Mat. 16. 19 Ausbertus in cap. 〈◊〉. Apocalyps. Anselmus in Matth. c. 18. Excommunicatio sieri debet per os Ecclesiae, id est, per sacerdotem: Sacerdote autem excommunicante, totum corpus Ecclesiae operatur. Magdeb. Vol. 3. cent. 11. c. 4. p. 85, 86, Vol. 3. cent. 12. c. 4. p. 181, 182.  16. to Peter, representing Pastors; and for this they cite Theophylactus, and Radulphus, Ausbertus. Aus●…s gives so the power of binding and losing to the Priests, E●●●. in Evang. as excommunication shou●● 〈◊〉 by the mouth of the Church, the Priest: for when the Priest excommunicates, the whole body of the Church acts in him. See the Magdeb. cent. 11. Ausel. in Mat. 18. Qu●r●● re●●seritis] nec 〈◊〉 Apostolis, sed ●●nibus Episcopis, Pr●…, haec potest as conces●● est. See the Magdeburg●nses citing the Schoolmen, Thomas Aqu●●●●, B●…tura, Albertus to this purpose also.  
For the notes of the true Church in the dark midnight of Popery, Petr. Waldensis in France, ann. 1160. taught the same with us: and yet Mr. Hooker refusing these marks, tells us, Truth is the Daughter of Time, and excellently doth the twelfeth Age agree with the first Age. Of Pet. Waldensis were the Waldenses, the sincere part of the Church giving testimony against the daily growing corruptions of Rome.  
The Magdeburgenses in their Preface to the third volume of their History, Cent. 10. Sunt autem not● 〈◊〉 so● prop●●●● 〈◊〉 ga●manae 
M●●debur. vol. 〈◊〉. Cent. 1●. c. 8. page. 549. De Eccles. a●●. 4 Ecclesiam Christi esse, quae sincerum Christi verbum audiat, & sacramentis ab ipso institutis utatur, ubicunque locorum ea existat. Magdeburgens. vol. 1. Cent. 1. l. 1. c. 4. p. 127. ex Matth. 16. Ecclesia est coetus veram Christi notitiam habens, ●amque profis en●, ornatus potestate clavium regn● coelorum, pag. 129. Prima ac praecipua nota Ecclesiae est verbum sincerum, altera est verus usus Sacramentorum & clavium; te●●ia, est confessio ac perseverantia.  Ecclisiae Christi, verbi Dei predicates 〈◊〉▪ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉▪ 〈◊〉 Sacramentoru● usus iustitut●● à Christo 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 study conjunctus. These men knew true Antiquity well. H●…. W●lif, Jerome of Prague, and the renowned Martyrs of Christ sealed with their blood the same truth, as Antiquity witnesses of them. Mr. 〈◊〉. calleth the preaching of the Gospel a common adjunct of the Church. But we appeal to Antiquity (though the Scripture be above all) for a warrant of their Church.  

a Tertul. ad ver. hae●et. c. 22. p. 207.  Tertullian offends at such who say the Apostles were ignorant of any thing, to whom the Lord gave the Keys to open and 〈◊〉 Heaven, which secrets the people know not: and the Apostles d● that in opening and s●utting heaven, which only God can 
b Turtul. pe pud●cit. c. 21. pag. 618.  〈◊〉. 
c Tertul. adver. Gnosticos c. 10 p. 482.  Christ ga●● the K●… (& per ●um Ecclesiae) to Peter, and by him to the Ch●rch.  
Epiph●ni●● 
d Epiph. adver. haer. l. 1. to. 2. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  ass●●●● 〈◊〉 Universal Integral Church, though the tongues be divers: and God keeps carefully his Church spread through all the World, as dwelling in one and the same house: 
e Epiph. adver. hae●. to. 1. l. 2. hae●. 4●. sive 61 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  〈◊〉, it's not in P●rygia, Cilicia, and Pa●phylia only, but all the World over. And he citys that of Christ: this cannot be a congregation.  

f Lactan. de vera Sapien. l. 4. c. 13. p. 282. Sola igitur Catholica Eccl●sia est, q●a verum cultum retinet, hic est sons verita●●●, hoc est domicilium fidei, hoc Tempsum Dei.  Lactantius is for our notes of the Church, not for Mr. H. the Ph●yges, Novatiani, Valentiniani, Marcionitae, Authae piani, aut A●riani, leave off to be Christians: that then is the only catholic Church, which retains the true worship of God. Eusebius Pamphil. 
g Euseb. de praepar. Evangel. l. 6. c. 1●. 〈◊〉. 302. G●●g. Nazianz. Ora. 29. in Sanc. Luc. p. 609. Et 〈◊〉 an●● lanuginem 〈◊〉 doc●s, 〈◊〉 G●●●etra●●●nca una, nec denique nautam una navigatio facit.  The Church is diffused all the world over, East and West, South and North. He expounds Matth. 16. the Church upon the Rock, to be the Church from the East to the We●●, which fills all the World. De prop. Evangil. l. 1. c. 3. pag. 8. then it's not one single congregation.  
Gregorius Nuzianz●nus Orat. ●8. de 〈◊〉 partis, The people give their consent only to ordain the Bishop. And this election of Bishops, ibid. page 480. i● to be committed to the cleaner part of the people, to sacred Ministers, and to our Nazarites, and not to the foolish and rash common people, tum eximia ac purissimae p●puti parti, hoc est, & 〈◊〉 Ministris & nostris Nazar●●, quibus vil sol● vel pot●ssimum 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ills commitis op●rtebat (sic enim nun●… Ecclesia 〈◊〉 esse●) ac non 〈◊〉 qui opibus & potentia 〈◊〉 (magistratees notat) a●● stultae ac te●erariae plebi. It's clear that Nazianzen gives a presidency to Teachers over the Church, when 
h K Grego. Nazianz. Orat. 35. ad cla. Episcop. Before 15. Bishops convened by Theodosius the Great, against Macedonius. Vide Presbyterorum Concilium, canitie & prudentia 〈◊〉 natorum, diaconorum mod●stiam atque ordinem— lectorum moderationem & conci●●itatem, plebis attentionem— omnibus supernum Senatum honorantibus.  he forbids that young men, before they have hair on their face, be 〈◊〉 to reach old men; and they object (saith he) Daniel: but that which rarely falls out, is no law to the Church, one Swallow makes not the Spring: but election here by Nazianzen is put for the whole calling of men to the Ministry. The Church of Byzan●… 〈◊〉 commended for discipline by Nazianzen. See in the Church a Council of Prebyters decored with age and wisdom, an high Senate which they all honoured: nor did he in a grave Synod dec●… the praises of the discipline of a single congregation.  

i Greg. Nazianz. de compos●ta disserendi tatione. Orat. 7. p. 221, 222. Utique nec incedit oculus, sed dux est; nec prospicit pes, sed progreditur, deque loco in locum movet; nec lingua voces excipit, cum hoc sit auditus; nec auditus loquitur, cum hoc sit linguae— nimirum imperat ac praesidet hoc (membrum) illud ducitur ac gubernatur.  Nazianzen hath a savoury discourse of the order and gifts, and variety of members in Christ's body, and citys 1 Cor. 12. 28. not of a single congregation.  
For 1. he saith we are all one body in Christ:  
2. He saith there are in the Church Apostles, Prophets, etc. the eye walks not, but is the Captain; nor does the foot fee, but walk, and move from place to place; nor doth the tongue receive sounds, that is proper to the hearing; nor doth the ●ongue speak, but the tongue, etc.  
And 3. he speaks of a number of Prophets, of which two or three prophecy by course, and one Interprets.  
Basilius Magnus Nicopolitanis Presbyteris Epist. 10. Tom. ult, 〈◊〉 ex albo vest●● defecis, & 〈◊〉 unus & alter conseculus est— 〈◊〉 adhu● corpus vestrum est per Die gratiam 〈◊〉, Basil. ci●●bus Nicopolitanis disp. Epist. 13. Tom. ult. Dispensationes Ecclesiasticae fiunt quidem per 〈◊〉 quibus est illorum cura conoredita, verum à plobe confir●antur.  
Basil. Epist. 18. vol. ult. Presbyteris A●tiochiae solicitudinem illam quam 〈◊〉 Ecclistis D●…, ex 〈◊〉 〈◊〉— 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, qui vobis t●tius 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 charitate● & affectum expon●i. At the first reading a Presbyterial body over divers congregations appears.  
Theophylact. 
k Theoph. in Ena●. Mat. 19  Every one of us is the Church, and the House of God, and if we continue in the faith confessed, the gates of hell shall not prevail against us, that is, sins.  
2. The power of binding and losing he expounds to be the power of remitting of sins, which Peter hath, and such as have the office 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, of an Oversee●. 
l Theoph. Mat. 18. 1.  Theoph. If thy Brother offend thee] thy Brother only of the same congregation whereof thou act a member, saith Mr. H●●ker. Nay, saith Theophylact, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, 
m Theoph. enar. in Joan. 20.  whose sin ye remit]. See (saith he) the Dignity of the Priests: for it God who forgives sins, but they are honoured as God. 
n Theoph. enar. 1. Cor. 1. 5.  On these words, we judge those th●● are within.] Are not 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, Christians judged by us? but a more terrible judge shall judge those that are with●●.  

o 〈◊〉. origen● sive Ety●…. l. 8. c. 1. p. 101. Non 〈◊〉 conventicula ●…rum ●…tur, sed ●…tum orbem terrarum dilatata diffunditur. Se● Isid.: Sent●nti●r. 〈◊〉 l. c. 22. p.  Isidorus Hispalens. Episcopus, The Church is called Catholic. quasi 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, for it is not limited to some countries, as the Conventioles of Heretics, but spread all the world over. The con●…tions of Heretics are only in ordinary, not catholic, but very rarely. See him (p) elsewhere.  
What saith these called the Canons of the Apostles deserve, I dispute not; they 
m Canon Apostol. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  allow no Bishop to he ordained without two or three Bishops.  
The 
n Concil. Gen. par. 1. Concil. Nicae 1. p. 310.  Bishops of the whole earth, that is, from all Churches (not congregations, that was impossible) were at the first Nic●ns Council 318. in number subscribed.  

o Nicae. Conc. can. 4.  A Bishop should be ordained by all the Bishops of the Province; if that be heard by three, the rest consenting by their Letters.  

p Concil. gen. par. 1. tom. 2. c. 1● p. 757.  More than two hundred Bishops in the Council of Ephesus condemned Nestorius.  
Among the Articles of joh. Wiclif this is the seventh, If a man be duly contrite for sin, any farther confession is needless. 
q Conci. Gen. ●om 3 par. 2. Conci. Const. 〈◊〉. art. joh. 〈◊〉. 7. page 1570. Si homo debitè fuerit contritus, omnis confessio exterior est superflua.  So our Brethren and Mr. H. his judicial confession before the Church is as superfluous and scriptureless, before they be admitted and engaged members of the visible Church.  
On the other extremity they fail, who condemn Wiclif his eleventh Article, that a Minister ought not to Excommunicate, except he know first the man 
r Ibid. art. Io. Wicclif 11. Nullus proelatus debet— aliq●em excommunicate, nisi sciat eum esse excommunicatum à Deo.  to be excommunicate of God.  
And joh. Hush was unjustly condemned for descending Wiclif in these and the 
s 1b. p. 1600.  like.  
Nor was it a damnable error that joh. Hush held, that there is but one Universal holy Church, as there is but one certain number of men predestinate to glory. Mr. H●●ker his new catholic abstract congregation divided in so many thousand little catholic Churches is too near to the Papists in this.  
john Hush 
u Mr. Fox his monuments of the Martyrs. tom. last Council of Constance. K. Henry the V. articles of john Hush page 810, 811, etc.  before his Judges and accusers, often professed that Christ limited not Jurisdiction and ruling of the Church militant to Peter only, but gave it to all the Apostles and true Pastors; but never to Mr. H. his male Church. 
t Concil. Gen. 3. Tom par. 2. conc. Co●stan. ●ess. 15 p. 1600. Universalis sancta Ecclesia tantum est una, art. 1. Io. Hush.   

x Theod. Inter. in Psal. 47. page 137. co. 2.  Theodores judgeth the Church builded upon the Rock. Mat. 16. not to be a single visible congregation with Mr. H. which certainly perisheth; but the company of chosen believers builded upon the foundation of the Prophets and Apostles, whose corner-stone is Christ. And though this be one catholic Church divided all the world over, habet domos àse invicem divisas, and is 
y Theodor. Inter. in Ephes. c. 2: page 747.  one body, of which Christ is head, one company, one City; which cannot be said of one single congregation. And 
z Theodor. Inter. in 1 Cor. 12. No● vos 〈◊〉, sed omnes qui in universio orbe tertarum credidetunt.  1 Cor. 12. ye are all the body of Christ] not ye only, but all they who through the whole world believe. Theodoret on 1 Tim. 5. shows that there is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, praefectura, a power of receiving witnesses against Elders, and of examining them before they be ordained.  
This 
b Ambrose 1 Cor. 12. Caput itaque in Ecclesia Apostolos posuit, quia legati Christi sunt.  Ambrose shows, making Jews and Gentiles one body having one Baptism, and the Apostles caput Ecclesiae, the chief members of the Church. As also 
c Ambrose in 1 Cor. 5. A quo crimine mali docto●es aut d●ssimulabant, aut negligentius argueb●nt, sicut & Eli Sacerdos, etc.  the Doctors in the Church of Corinth dissembled or carelessly censured the Incest, as Eli the Priest did his Sons. Then there was a Presbytery to cast him out. See if 
d Ambrose, tom. 3: de natali sanct. Apost. Petri & Pauli, ser. 66. l. 16. pag. 291  Ambrose gives the Keys to Peter, yes, to Peter and Paul only, and to the Rulers; only he saith, inter ipsos (Petrum & Paulum) quis 〈◊〉 proponatur incertum. The same (saith 
e Ephe. Syrus, tom. 1. de sacerdotio, p. 2.  Ephraim Syrus) of these two.  

f Greg. Nyss●nus in illa verba, Tunc etiam ipse filius subjicietur, page 110.  Gregorius Nyssenus Episcop. frater Basilii Magni, All we who are joined to one body of Christ by faith, make one body— and that he excludes not, but includes the visible body, he proves from 1 Cor. 12. ye are the body of Christ: and Eph. 4. the body gathered by the Ministry of Apostles, Evangelists, Pastors, etc. which shall be brought to the unity of faith. So 
g Greg. Nyssen. Ut Petra vitae Christus, etc. page 255.  Christ is the rock of life, and the rock of faith to the Church builded upon the rock (which admits not Magns, who is not builded upon the rock; as joh. Hush refused a wicked Pope to be head, or member of the Church so built.)  

h Hieronymus commentar. Matth. 16. 19 Et tibi dabo] istum locum Episcopi & Presbyteri non intelligentes aliquid sibi de Pharisaeorum assumunt supercilio, ut vel damnent innocentes, vel solvere se noxios arbitrentur, omnis credentium turba perveniat. Hieyonym. ibid.  Hieronymus clearly expounds the ports of Hell to be Vi●ia atque peccata (re●r) v●l certè 〈◊〉 Doctrinas, sins or heresies, which is strong for the invisible Church of true believers; not for the visible congregation, of which judas and Magus are members to Mr. Hooker, and were never built on the rock. And the Keys are given to Bishops and Presbyters, who may not under that pretence condemn the innocent. And Hieron. Com. Mat. 18. 18. Si Ecclesiam non audierit, quaecunque alligaveritis] potestatem tribuit Apostolis, ut sciant qui à 〈◊〉 conde●nantur, humanam sententiam divinâ roborari, & quodcunque ligatum fuerit in terra, ligari pariter & in coel●. See Hieronym. Com. ad Eph. 4. 11. who expounds the body of Christ of the Church, until we all meet, all the company of believers. And 
i Hieronymus come. in Tit. 1. 5. Ut constituas] audiant Episcopi qui habent constituendi Presbyteros per urbes singulas perestatem, etc. Ibid. Idem est Presbyter qui Episcopus.  H●eron. Let the Bishops hear who have power of ordaining Elders in every City. Nor need our Brethren suspect Hieronymus to be prelatical, his judgement is known to be contrary thereunto. See Hieron. in Tit. 1. 5. See him for the present purpose in Opuscul. in Prover. c. 7 p. 217. See Ruffinus 
k Ruffin. in Symbol. Multi enim & alii Ecclesias congregaverunt, ut Martion, & Valentinus, & Ebion, & Manichaeus, & caeceri omnes haeretici, sed illae Ecclesiae non sunt sine macuiâ & ●uga perfidiae.  for the marks of the true Church, saying with us, That pure doctrine declares a pure Church: and so the Churches which Martion, Valentinus, Ebion and Manicheus and other heretics gather, are not true Churches.  

l Chrysostom. in Math. 16. hom. 5. 5.  Chrysostom, If the ports of hell prevail not against the Church, far less shall they prevail against me: therefore thou shouldst not be troubled (Peter) when thou hearest that I shall be crucified. Then by the mind of Chrysostom, Christ speaks here for the comfort of Peter, as a sound believer, and not as an external visible member of a congregation, as saith Mr. H. And see 
m Chrysostom. ibid.  here a fisherman is made Pastor and Head of the whole Church. Then it could not have been the mind of Chrysostom, that such a headship (whatever it was, or whether peculiar to Peter or no, is another question) was given to the people. 
n Chrysostom. Mat. 18.  Chrysostom expounds, tell the Church, tell the Rulers. 
o Chrysostom. lab. 20. homil. 85. Quemadmodum enim Rex praefectos mittens, ut in carcerem reos intrudant, & ut liberent, potestatem praebet, ita Jesus Discipulos dimittens, hac munit authoritate.  Chrysostom, As a King sending judges, gives them power to cast guilty men in prison, and to deliver them; so sends Christ his Disciples, and arms them with authority. Will any dream that Chrysostom judgeth that Christ gave this power to the people?  

p Chrysostom. in Act. c. 6. homil. 14.  Chrysostom saith, the Apostles take to themselves to determine the number of the Deacons, and to ordain them; but they give the election of the men to the people, lest the Apostles should seem partial, and to favour men. Mr. H. saith the contrary.  
Valiant 
q Athanasius unum esse Christum, orat. pag. 520. tom. 1. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉, etc. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  Athanasius makes the Church builded upon a Rock, to be a strong, an unshaken promise; and that the Church is an inseparable thing, although hell itself were moved, and these that are in hell, and the Princes of darkness should rage: Sure this great Witness never meant any such invincible promise to an external visible congregation, and its members judas and Simon Magus. Peter himself, who received the heavenly Keys, sinned (saith 
r Athanas. tom. 1. contra omnes haereses, p. 853.  Athanasius.)  

s Hilarius Com. in Mat. can. 16. pag. 296.  Hilarius commends the Rock which breaks the ports of Hell 
t Hilarius come. in Mat. can. pag. 301. immobile severitatis Apostolelicae judicium praemisit, etc. hi●… Apostolicae conditione sententiae in coelis quoque aut soluti sunaut ligati. Clemens ad Corinth. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Scriptum aliud est impletum, edit, bibit, dilatatus est & incrassatus, & recalcit avit, hinc aemulatio, invidia, contentio, seditio, persecutio, commotio, bellum, captivitas. Clem. p. 53. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. Clem. pag. 54, 55. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  and says that men are loosed or bound in Heaven, by condition of the Apostles sentence: then doth he not think it the sentence of the people. Let the learned judge of the ancient writings of Clemens: that Epistle of his to the Corinthians, read sometimes in the ancient Church, will have Mr. hooker's visible converts only Church-matter, though he writ to them as the true Church, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉: Yet he writes of a sad change of their profession, such as was in Israel, when they made defection to Idolatry, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉. It were hard to say such a company are all visible converts.  
2. Clemens seems to deny to the people power of commanding, and to say that the preachers ordained Bishops and Deacons, 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉.  
Cyrillus Alexandrinus upon these words, I will give thee the Keys] he gifted universally all the Apostles with power over unclean spirits: then neither the one power nor the other gave he to the people. Cyril. Alexan. in Isa. l. 5. pag. 393. & Cyrillus tom. 2, dialog de Trinitat. l. 4. pag. 278. Peter is so called from his most firm and unshaken faith, in qua Ecclesia Christi ita fundata ac firmatt ess●t, ut non laberetur & esser expugnabilis inferorum portis, aeter●…um manens: on which the Church is built, that it cannot fail, but remains for ever, cannot be overcome by the ports of hell. Cyrillus well knew single congregations are not invincible; and he speaks of such a saving faith, as Magus cannot have, it came from the Father, teaching ex ineffabili eruditione superna, etc. See what Apostolic dignity he gave to them, which he gave not to the people. Cyrill. in joan. l. 12. c. 56. page 699, 700. Cyrill. on Isa. 5. c. 60 page 383.  
August. tom. 10. Dom. 11 post Epiphan. sect. 2 page. 235. Tertius modus est, quomodo totus Christus secundum Ecclesiam, id est, caput & corpus praedicetur● etenim caput & corpus unus Christus, non quia sine corpore non est integer, sed quia & nobiscum integer esse dignatus est— membra Christi & corpus sumus omnes simul: non qui hoc loco sumus tantum, fed & per universam terram: nee qui tantum hoc tempore, sed qui dicam ex Abel●…sto usque in finem seculi, quandiu generant & generantur hominis.  
It were needless to prove a visible integral catholic Church all the world over, not in Asia only from Augustine.  
2. Or to prove a mixture of tares and wheat, of good and bad in the visible Church; and that they are not visible converts that are members of the visible Church.  
3. How far in the communion of the Church and of Sacraments mali maculent & contaminent bonos, see August-cont. 
Lib. 2. contra Epist. Parm. c. 3. non obest palea frumen●●s.  Epist. Parmen. Mr. H. deviseth a way for this: It's referred to a man's free choice, without any compulsion of any, to what congregation he shall join himself or not: and though the doctrine and ordinances be most pure, yet he may keep within himself the causes of his not joining, thinking such are profane, and so there is little or nothing of Christ's presence in this Church. But the formal cause of joining to a Church in which one should 
Aug. contr. Ep. Parmenia l. 2. c. 7. the Priests should be holy that minister. Aug. resp. Dicant mihi, cui sancto secundum salutem spiritualem obsuerit, vel in sacerdotibus, vel inter populum coustituto, malus aut maculatus sacerdos? ubi erat Moses & Aaron, ibi murmuratores sacrilegi, quos Deus à facie sua semper perdere minabatus; ubi erat Caiaphas erant & caeteri tales, ibi Zacharias, ibi Simeon & caeteri boni.  reside, is not the holiness of members, but the soundness and purity of the Ordinances; and if the Gospel be there, he is obliged to profess it, as he is to confess, and not deny Christ before men. 2. If any of Israel goodwell in another city or town, where another Priest shall teach, is it in his choice to be taught by that Priest or not? or was there no freedom under the Old Testament, but there is freedom now? Prove this difference from the Word.  
4. The Don●… in that contr. P●…. l. 11. c. 14. A wicked Minister can no more convert, quam vivificare quenquam mortuus potest, than a dead man can give life. So our Brethren, they are not fit to be edifying matter, who shall destroy the Church.  
5. August. lib. Retract. 2. c. 18. Ubicunqus autem in 〈◊〉 libris commemoravi Ecclesiam non habentem maculam a●… rugam, non sic accipiendum, quasi jam s●●, sed qu● praeparatur ut sis. Augustine owns no Church, that in the esteem of Saints is without spot or wrinkle.  
6. Augustine cond●… the Donatists, Aug. contr. litter. Petil. Episc. Donatists, l. 1. 〈◊〉 1. they were broken off from the catholic Church, ab or bis 〈◊〉 sancta communiono; that was, sure, no congregation, for they set up congregations of their own: but they said, With themselves only was the true Church.  
7. Petilianus said, What hath righteousness to do with unrighteousness? Augustine saith, It's not righteousness taking 
August. contr. litter. Petil. l. 2. c. 6.  part with unrighteousness, Si Judas & Petru● paritor sacramenta communi●….  
8. Petilianus applied the Scriptures that are spoken of real 
August. contr. litter. Petil. l. 11. c. 4. & 44. & 45. & 46. Non enim (c. 46.) verba ista etiam ad Simon. Magum pertinent, qui tamen eundem sanctum baptismum suscepit, non sunt haec verba zizaniorum— Non sunt verba paleae, sed tritici, quamvis eadem pluviâ simul nutriantur.  Saints, as Psal. 1. Blessed is the man; and Psal. 23. The Lord is my shepherd, he leadeth me, etc. to their only members of separated Churches. So do our Brethreu. Mr. Cotton, Mr. Hooker. So Mr. Robinson. Augustine answers, These words belong not to baptised Simon Magus— They are not the words of the tares, of the chaff, but of the wheat.  
9 Petilian said, the Catholics admitted all to be just, and members of the Church qui verba legis noverunt, that knew words of Scripture; and Satan knew Scripture: The same Mr. H. objects to us. See Aug. 
a Aug. contr. litter. Petil. l. 11. c. 49.   
10. The question between us and the Donatists is, Where is this Body (visible, for it were madness to think the question was touching the invisible Church, where it is) Where the Church is? What then shall we do? shall we seek it in our words, or in the words of her Head the Lord jesus? See 
b Aug. de unit. Eccles. l. c. 1. & 2.  August. It's known Augustine acknowledgeth in all these Writings a Catholic Church from Sea to Sea, to which men should join themselves as to the visible society of Christ.  
11. Our Brethren will have none to be baptised, except they be baptised into a particular congregation. And 
c Aug. de unit. Eccles. c. 5. Ne baptismus vel extra Ecclesiam ire credatur, vel qui extra datus fuerit, acceptetur.  Aug. condemns the Donatists, who will have it no baptism which is administered without the Church.  
12. Our Brethren will have so many conditions of the visible Church.  

1. That the matter be fit, visible Saints.  
2. That the form be a Church covenant.  
3. That they meet in one place, etc. Augustine 
d Aug. de unit. Eccles. c. 6. & 7. Quid in prophetis quam multa, & quam manifesta sunt testimonia ecclesiae per omnes Gentes toto orbe terrarum diffusae? Cap. 5. Quare (O Donatistae) vos irritum facitis testamentum Dei, dicendo, nec in omnibus Gentibus completum esse, & periisse jam de Gentibus, in quibus erat semen Abrahae?  following the Word, saith, All of Jews and Gentiles in covenant are the visible Church.   
13. This or that congregation or believer may fall off the Rock, defecit ex omnibus Gentibus Christiana Religio, excepta parte Donati, except some following Donatus, and some in America, aut alibi. See Aug. 
e August. de unit. Eccles. c. 9   
14. They who (saith 
f Aug. de unit. Eccles. c. 10.  Augustine) teach, That the Church which was to take its beginning at Jerusalem, is not that visible City, but by a figure is the whole Church that is in heaven and earth, may say that also is spoken by a figure, It behoved Christ to die, and to rise the third day. Then Augustine thinks the Church of Jews and Gentiles all the world over to be one visible City, against the Donatists and our Brethren.  
Catholics (as August 
g Aug. collat. cum Donatist. 3. dia. c. 10. p. 213.  teacheth) said, that it was the mind of Cyprian, that the tares were in the Church, not lurking, but seen: to which the Donatists durst answer nothing, they were so moved with the authority of Cyprian.  
Cyprian 
h Cypr. Epist. 73. p. 220.  clearly saith, the Lord gave first to Peter, upon whom he built his Church (nor did he then build the Church upon the confessing Church) power to bind and lose— as also he saith, after the Resurrection, to the Apostles, As my Father sent me, so send I you. To Cyprian then one place in joh. 20. expounds Matth 16. Now Cyprian never thought that Christ sent the people as the Father sent him: And Cyprian 
i Cypr. 75. 239, 240.  soli Petro dixit, Quaecunque ligaver●s— Quando in solos Apostolos insu●●●vit Christus dicens, accipite Spiritum Sanctum: si eujus remiseritis p●ocata 
k Cypr. Magno filio, Epist. 76. p. 246.  Cyprian proves, that the Church is one, and Baptism one; What talk they then of multiplied visible congregations, and multiplied Baptisms? And see 
l Cypr. 3. de unit. Eccles. p. 296, 297.  Cyprian, Et quamvis Apostolis omnibus post resurrectionem dicat, Sicut ●ifit me pater, etc. tamen ut unitatem manifestaret, unam Cathedram (Petri) constituit, etc. 
m Cypr. Lapsis, Epist. 27. p. 62.  Cyprian expounding Matth. 16. 18. And I say to thee, Thou ●●t Peter, etc. the Church is founded upon the Bishops, and every act of the Church by these overseers is guided; and therefore the lapsi should not have peace, but by satisfying Church-discipline.  
FINIS.