A PEDLAR AND A ROMISH PRIEST In a very hot Discourse, full of Mirth, Truth, wit, Folly, and Plain-dealing. By John Taylor. Printed in the year 1641. A Pedlar and a Romish priest in a very hot Discourse, full of Mirth, truth, Wit, Folly, and plain-dealing. A Poland Pedlar went upon a day, Unto a Romish Priest to learn to pray; The Priest said Pedlar get thee to the cloister And learn the Ave and the Pater Noster. Pedl. Now good sir John (quoth he) what talk is that I hear you speak, but God in heaven knows what. Priest. It is that worthy holy Latin letter Doth please the Lord well and our lady better. Pedl. Now good Sir John, I know not what they be The Latin tongue is heathen Greek to me. Priest. Pedlar if thou to me wilt but repair Within one Month, I`le teach thee Latin Prayer. And though thou understand not what thou sayst, Thou shalt speak pretty Latin when thou prayest Pedlar To pray so sir, is only but in saying, In words, nor sense, a prating not a praying; Shall I that am a man of perfect age, Talk like a witless parrot in a Cage. Priest. A parrot can but prattle for her part, But towards God hath neither mind or heart. Then seeing I have head and heart to pray, Shall not my heart know what my tongue doth say For when my tongue talks, if my heart miscarry, How quickly I may mar your Ave Mary? And I sit having many things to seek, How should I speed not knowing what I speak. Priest. God understands all tongues, & knows, & he The thoughts and secrets of the heart doth see. Pedl. Then if I think one thing and speak another, I wrong myself, and Christ, and his blessed Mother; For when I pray they would my pack repair, Your Ave marrow is a fruitless prayer. Priest. The Latin prayers are but general heads, For our reliefs in all our wants and needs: The Latin serves us as a liturgy, As curious Arts directs Chirurgery, And in that language mass is said and sung, For private things pray in thy Mother tongue. Ped. Then I must have a tongue, sir John, for either, 1 for the Mother and 1 for the Father. Prie. Thinkst thou the Mother doth not know such small things, Christ is her Son man, and he tells her all things. But where did that blessed Virgin learn her Latin, For in her days was neither mass nor Martin, Nor yet one Priest that Latin then could speak, For holy words were Hebrew then or Greek, She never was at Rome, nor kissed Pope's feet, How came she by the mass fain would I weet. Priest. Pedlar, if thou believe the Legendary, The mass is older far than Christ or Mary, For all the patriarchs both more or less, And great Melchisedeck himself said mass. Pedl. But good sir priest, spoke all these Fathers Latin And said they mass in golden copes or Satin; Could they speak Latin long ere Latin grew, (For without Latin no mass can be true) And you that would enforce us to this task, Me thinks 'tis like a may-game or a mask. Priest. Well Pedlar thou art too too curious, Thy purblind Zeal's fervent, but furious, I rather would a hundred monks direct, Than such an ignorant of thy mad sect; This thou must know, this cannot be denied, Rome governed all when Christ was crucified. Rome, Heathen then, but afterwards converted, And grew so honest, and so holy-hearted, That now our Emperor is turned to a pope, Whose holiness (as you have heard I hope, Hath made a Law that all the world must pray In Latin language to the Lord each day; He's Christ's full Vicar, and I'll boldly say, That what he doth command we must obey, He bids us pray in Latin, even so We must do, where we understand or no, He hath full power to confound or save, And who dares then but do as he will have. Pedl. This purpose to some purpose puts me back, And hath more points, than pins are in my pack, What ever power you give unto your pope, He cannot make a man an Ape, I hope, And if he be full Vicar to our Lord, Should not his words and Christ's keep one accord. Priest. Doubtless they do, and never are contrary, In Pater noster, Creed, or Avemary. Ped. But Christ's Disciples when they made their motion, Unto their Master, how to make devotion, As I have done to you (sir John) to day; I pray you in what tongue bade he them pray, Christ did not one word Latin to them speak, Their talk was then all Siriack, Hebrew, Greek, He bade all Nations pray after one manner, But bade not all take Latin for their Banner: Your Latin is but one of the Translations, Why should it then exclude all other Nations; And on my soul, sir John, if I do say, In mine own mother tongue when I do pray Lord help me, Lord forgive me all my sins, Yea (why not) Lord supply my pack and pins. And every thing whereof I stand in need, (For this depends upon our daily bread) I hope in God that I shall speed as well, As if in Latin I my wants did tell: And since some tongues have more antiquity Than Latin, were it not iniquity To force all people to pray like the Pope, No good (sir John) you'll not say so I hope. Priest. Well pedlar, one thing I would fain make plain, Return we to our Lady back again, And if thou hadst as much capacity As roving wit, with great audacity, The case is clear, that Virgin Mary meek, Could all and every tongue and language speak. Hast thou not heard man how the Holy Ghost, Came down like cloven tongues, at pentecost, And filled the house where all the 12. were ready, And one tongue truly lighted on our Lady, And think not that I talk of toys and dreams, Ask but the Reverend Jesuits of Rheims, And what they write of this but wisely nor. Ped. In faith sir John it is not worth a groat; Will I believe't think you because they say it; Priest. Nay but they prove't as no man can denay it; Saith not the Text, that when the Lord ascended, Unto the 12. he earnestly commanded, That from Jerusalem they should not go, Until the Comforter did come, and so Act. 1. They all conjoined with one joint consent, And to an upper room together went, Where Mary was and others whole fix score, That with the 13. did daily God adore. Then (Says the text) when Pentecost was come, They were together then both all and some, And all were filled with the Holy Ghost. Ped. Now good sir Priest you count without your Host, I see well that your Rhemish Jesuits tongues, Hath cloven the text even to the very lungs. That (ALL) for which you reckon up six score, Is here meant only of the 12. no more; Nor Mary is not named there as than, What need we then believe it, holy man, On with your spectacles sir John and read, And credit this as one point of your Creed, The Holy Ghost did fall upon no more, Than he was promised unto before: Now he was only promised to the twelve, Look on the text, I pray, and judge your self; Speak man, and be not silent, I am sorry, To see you ignorant of such a story; For shame, let not a pedlar with his pack, Put you with all your sophistry to wrack. For as the Stories in themselves are divers, Flowing and falling into sundry Rivers, In divers Chapttrs so they stand divided, the 1. & 2. chap. So that the case may clearly be decided; For when those 6. score were at first convened, There was another mystery than meaned; To wit, Mathias free Election, And so Saint Peter gave direction, That all those six score than should bear record Of their proceedings then before the Lord: The choosing of a pastor was in hand, Which without church's knowledge cannot stand, And so Mathias, (by the power of Heaven) By lot was took as one with the Eleven. Then (Says the the Text) all these together were, What all these were doth very plain appear, To be the 12. in the last verse before, And not make leap year of eleven verse more. To draw all back to that hundred and twenty, Indeed this way should have tongues in plenty, They differ in 12. verses, the Text says, Besides the time is different full 10. days, The first upon the day the Lord ascended, The other when the holy Ghost descended. Such glaZen arguments will bide no hammer, For they are but bad logic and worse grammar; As for the Holy Ghost 'tis verifide, His coming down, unto no Law is tied; Sometimes invisible, and sometimes seen, As diversely at divers times hath been, Few needs to see his coming with their eyes, His works are witnesses which may suffice; And so Saint Paul this gift found privately, By Annanias hand assuredly. Act. 9 And so, sir John, to show you all my pack, And let you see my breast as well as back; I wonder ye consider not the end, Why God the Holy Ghost in Tongues did send: Know ye not women are forbidden preaching, Know ye not tongues were only given for teaching; Women (at home) have hardly leave to speak, But they take leave, and often silence break; Their husbands must permit their tongues to walk, And therefore, in God's House, they may not talk: And then, sir John, what worship do you win Unto our Lady, when you bring her in As a Companion with the whole six score, Who got the Holy Ghost and she no more, And where the Pope hath made her Queen of heaven, You make her here like one of the Eleven, In this, her dignity doth seem to fall, You thrust her to the kitchen from the Hall. And this is also one of your rare Themes, Held by your reverend Jesuits of Rheims, That Latin came not with the Holy Ghost, When as the tongues came down at Pentecost. Now if it came not than I pray, express How came it by that perfect holiness, That in it only, and no other tongue, Both mass and matins must be said and sung. Your last refuge will be unto the Pope, So knit up all together in a Rope. Pri. Wert thou at Rome, & half these words didst speak, Pedlar it were enough thy neck to break; But here you live, and talk and prate secure, And undervalue that blessed Virgin pure, Yielding no honour, or no adoration To her, or to her days of celebration. (Go but to Spain, and show thy vild condition, Thou shalt be tortured in the Inquisition) Her Miracles, of small worth you esteem, Her merits at low value you misdeem, Her sacred relics you condemn, despise, And all her attributes you much misprise: Thou sayst with six score I do make her share, Yourselves will her with your course wives compare, Shame and confusion doth to all belong, Who dare the best, most blessed of creatures wrong. Pedl. Indeed (sir John) you come upon me now, With some things which my faith doth disallow, I pray you to consider but a little, You give her many a title and a tittle, For which you have no warrant in the word, And yet pursue us both with fire and Sword, As heretics, for doing not as ye do, Yet, what the word bids and no more that we do; Think you that any man can be so mad, As to hold Christ his Saviour, and so bad, As to hold Mary for his saviour's Mother, And not to love her far above all other, Above all Creatures, she was full of grace, And sure in Glory she hath supreme place And eminence, all other souls transcending In joy and bliss, that never shall have ending. The Holy Ghost inspired her beyond measure, She was possessed with Heaven & earth's whole treasure, And grant she could speak Latin, and all Tongues, Yet mass or matins to her not belongs. Of all that mortal were she was the best, And her immortal soul is now most blessed. Her memorable Honour to preserve, Her days of celebration we observe, The Feast of her Anuntiation, Her clear and pure Purification, The Church (in reverence) hath ordained these days, On which we should send up our prayers and praise, To our good God, whose mercy was so great, To leave his glorious and immortal seat, And to the blessed virgin's womb he came, And took on him our filthy sin and shame; And on these days we pray that we may be, The virgin's followers in humility, That our true meekness, and our lowliness, May raise us to eternal blessedness; We hold it the sure way to our salvation, To follow her in holy imitation; Through heavenly influence her excellence, Must be admired with love and reverence, And those that dare compare most saucily, Their wives or mothers with her sanctity, Are saucy knaves in pride and ignorance, Or Atheists, fit to lead the hangman's dance; We love her then, though we believe not in her, Nor (by will-worship) do we think to win her; We hold her blessed for Christ's flesh conceiving, But far more blessed for Christ's faith receiving: She was his mother, so's the Church his wife, Which was to him much dearer than his life, Now if that one could fall at odds with th'other, He would respect his wife before his mother; For who so to him once a wife doth take, Must father, mother, friends and kin forsake. And this is every Spouses carriage, But most in this spiritual marriage, As Mary's mother of Christ's human life, She's but the Daughter of his heavenly wife, By which means only, faith doth me persuade, Of Christ blessed body she's a member made; Whereby these glorious Titles she hath won, Maid, mother, wife, and sister to her son. All this sir John I do but briefly say, To let you see you play us much foul play. Pri. Well Pedlar, tho that pack about thou bear, thou'rt some apostate monk or friar I fear, Of Luther's love, or Calvins' cursed crew, And sent abroad such business to brew, Disguised like the person of some Pedlar. Ped. No faith (sir John) I am not such a meddler, Nor have I mind or means, so high to mount, A little I can read and cast account, My wits are weak to utter rhyme or Reason, I know not what you call your Keirieleison. So help me God (sir John) I know no better, Nor in your Latin can I read a letter, For Latin is a Language admirable, And my poor friends and parents were unable, To purchase one scrap of it, for my share, And sure without it I can sell my ware, And though I have no Latin, yet I can Ask what I want of either God or man, In mine own mother tongue, I know and see, How simple souls by you abused be. And how your doctrine half our prayers would carry, From Christ our Saviour to the Virgin Mary, I also do perceive how you do frame, Strange innovations to that heavenly Dame, Ascribing her that Honour, which to none Is due, but only unto God alone: Of which she takes small notice, nor will she For it, at any time your helper be. Priest. Read but the Legend, Pedlar, and there view Her miracles, approve her honour due, For which the Pope in Latin doth prefer, That mass and matins must be said to her. Read, and consider, and believe it well, Or else thou art at least half ways in hell. Ped. Sure Hell is not within the Pope's commission, Though purgatory, and the Inquisition, Are things which he himself of late created, Yet of small worth, by wise men they are rated; I answer I oft before have said I love, and reverence that blessed mother maid, But I believe in God, and when I pray, Christ help me (when my soul or corpse do stray) And so what e'er I either have or want, I neither pray to he or to she Saint; And as for Tongues, I have but one, no more, And wot ye well, although I had six score, I would conform myself to Paul's commanding, Pray with my tongue, pray with my understanding. Think you the twelve, when they received the tongues, Talked, and knew not whereto their talk belongs, Yielding a sound not knowing what they said, Idle in preaching, ideler when they prayed, No, each of them knew well what he did say, And why not we (sir John) as well as they, For since each man hath one tongue at command, Shall men speak tongues they do not understand? Alas good sir, had I been trained at school, As I am but a silly simple fool, A hundred Questions more I might have moved, But here I cease for fear to be reproved, For these few doubts I learned in sundry places, Me thinks such men as you should clear all cases. Priest. Now Pedlar, I confess thou putst me to it, But one thing I will tell thee if thou'lt do it; If to our Prior thou wilt with me go back, Perhaps he will buy all that's in thy pack, And teach thee better how to pray then any, For such a holy man there are not many, Be here to morrow between six and seven, And thou wilt find thyself half ways in Heaven. Ped. Content sir John, but there is one thing more, I must have your opinion in before, Suppose the holy prior have no leisure, To talk of every purpose at our pleasure, Your book which is the golden Legend named, (Wherein as many lies as lines are framed) And, on my conscience, I do think that you, Do know the most on't to be most untrue; And therefore tell me sir before you go, Whether yourselves believe it, yea or no. Priest. Yes verily we do believe it all, And Hold it holy and authentical. Ped. Then I'll repeat a tale or two in prose, Which few wise men believe as I suppose. IN the 45. and 46. leaf of the aforesaid book, I have read, that in the reign of King William the Conqueror, the Danes had a purpose to war against England; to prevent which, the King William sent Helliseus the Abbot of Ramsey ambassador into Denmark, who having ended his embassy, as he returned homeward, he was on the Sea dangerously distressed with an impetuous and terrible Tempest, so that the Master of the Ship, and all the Martiners did yield themselves as lost men: In which extremity they all prayed devoutly to our Lady for help, and suddenly there appeared walking on the water a Reverend personage in the form or likeness of a Bishop, who called the Abbot Hellizeus to him, and told him that our Lady had heard their prayers, and that she had sent him to deliver them from the storm, and that it was her pleasure to have the day of her Conception kept holy yearly for ever on the eight day of December, which the Abbot promised to do, and presently the Angel vanished away, the Tempest ceased, the Abbot arrived safely in England, and reported what he had heard, seen, and suffered; and lastly the feast was commanded to be kept on the 8. day of December accordingly. ALso in the same book and leaf is related, that a Cousin german of a King of Hungary, who reigned I know not when, whose names were I know not what, did marry with a Lady (I know not who) at a place I know not where, did I know not why, forsake his wife I know not wherefore, to serve our Lady I know not how; for the story lies thus, that he was a devout and daily invocator to the blessed Virgin, and (being newly married) the same day of the marriage the Bridegroom stayed alone in the Church, remembering that he had not that day done his accustomed Orisons, wherefore he sent his new Bride home, and himself stayed in the Church to perform his devotion, where presently our Lady appeared to him, and taxed him with unkindness, in that he would leave her and betake himself to another, but if he would forsake his wife, and follow her in a devout life and conversation, than she promised to give him the kingdom of Heaven, whereupon it is said, he presently forsook his wife and ever after was a true servant to our Lady. What think you now (sir John) is this good stuff, It edifies me, much like blind man buff; Is't not a shame, that you these things dare do, To wrong poor people and our Lady to; You have no starting hole, nor no excuse To cover or to colour your abuse; But by your leave, I'll tell a tale or twain In prose, and fall into our Verse again. IN the 88 leaf I did read of another nameless Lady, that dreamed she was before the shrine of our Lady on a Candlemas day, she then (as she dreamed) had a burning Candle in her hand, which Candle she three times commanded to offer to the Image of the Virgin, which she not doing, the Angel strove with her for it, and broke it in the midst, at which the Lady awaked, and found half a Candle in her hand, which she ever after kept as a holy relic, and with the touch of it did many Miracles, and cured a great number of diseases only with the very touch of the said Candle. THere was a thief whom they call a Knight, that had long time used to rob on the High way, by which accursed Gentle-man-like Trade, he was grown very rich, and kept tall fellows to attend him, who were as arrant Thieves as himself, amongst whom one that performed or served the office of his chamberlain was a devil in the shape of a man. It fell out so, that they robbed a holy man, who desired he might speak with the chief or Master thief, which being granted, the Holy man requests that he might see all the servants together, whereupon they were called, than said the Holy man, Here are not all, and then they missed the chamberlain, and called him, who was no sooner come into the said blessed man's presence, he cried out, saying, I am a devil in this human form, who have followed this Knight a long time to destroy him for his bad Life, but I could never have any power over him to hurt gim, because he did daily, with great devotion, oftentimes salute the blessed Virgin Mary, with Ave Maria, leaf. 105. IN the 217. leaf there is a tale of a monk, that was a great Lecher, who by accident was drunk and drowned in a River which he fell into, and the Devils came busily about his carcase to carry it to Hell, but because the said monk had used constantly to pray to our Lady, she then appeared herself and commanded the Devils to depart, and then she gave the soul of the monk into his dead body again, and ever after he had a care to live honestly. IN the same 217. leaf there is a Relation of a Knight that had spent all his substance wastefully in riot, and being desperate in his wants, he would have sold his wife to the devil for a great sum of money; but the bargain being made, and the good Gentlewoman to be delivered to the fiend, our Lady appeared to her, and laid her in a sleep, taking upon herself the shape of the sleeping Gentlewoman, which when the Knight would have delivered, the devil began to roar and howl, and trembling said, that the Knight had deceived him, in bringing the Mother of God to him instead of his wise; and with that the devil fled away, and the Knight with repentance took his wife again, and in conclusion our Lady give them wealth, so that ever after they lived together lovingly. IN the 220. leaf it is said, that as the body of the blessed Virgin was carried towards her grave or burial, that a Jew in despiteful manner laid both his hands on the Beire, and violently would have overthrown it, when presently his hands sundered from his arms, and clave fast to the bier, at which the Jew roared, cried out and repented, and Saint Peter commanded him to kiss the Beire, whereby he was presently recovered, and had his hands restored to his arms again. Also it is said, that the house that the blessed Virgin dwelled in at Bethelem was removed by heavenly Angels, and carried through the air many thousand miles over Sea and Land, to the country of Dalmatia, where it did remain for a certain time, and then it was again removed to Laretto in Italy, where it remains to this day, being a Holy place, much visited by Pilgrims, and (by virtue of it) many miracles are wrought daily. And thus the book you brag of, far excels The lies of Jews, Turks, moors, and Infidels; And sure the Heathen, hearing of these lies, The Christian Religion despise; He that will one day guerdon good and bad, T'whose word we must not dare abate or add, Against those he will draw his vengeful sword, That mingle fables with his sacred Word. Pri. Thy blinded zeal my very heart doth grieve, Thou understandest not what thou should believe, Thinkst thou so many Grave and learned men, Have lived and dy'd in blear-eyed errors den, Dost think all Popes, all Cardinals, all liars, Abbots, most zealous monks, most holy friars. Dost think all these for many a hundred year, Did not profess and know the Truth sincere? These men maintained the Church in glorious state, Till Luther and cursed Calvin 'gan to prate. Ped. Like as a squirrel skips from tree to tree, Even so (sir John) you from the matter flee: Our talk was Latin, and our Lady first, And you to other arguments out burst. I tell you I that Virgin love and honour, Although my prayers do not wait upon her, Nor do I hold her relics of such price, To raise souls to the heavenly Paradise. You her supposed apparel do adore, Hairlace and Slippers (which she never wore) Her comb, her Girdle and her gown of filke, Her apron and the pot that held her milk, Her cloak, her handkerchief, her Hood, her hair, To these you mumble many a Latin prayer, And therefore I defy you, and in sadness, I hold such holiness a kind of madness; And so, sir John, we two will make an end, And each of us about his business wend. Yet e'er we part I would fall to again, And of the Latin speak a word or twain, There was but one tongue at the Birth of Abel, And many at the building up of Babel, A wicked work, which God would have confounded, But when Christ came, all tongues again resounded, To build his Church, by his Apostles teaching; Which was in praying sure as well as preaching; For prayer is the full and true perfection Of holy service (Faving your correction) Then if our Lord to mine own tongue be ready, What need I then with Latin move our Lady, Or if to both my prayers must be in, I pray sir tell with which should I begin, And to pray jointly to them both as one, Your Latin prayers than are quickly gone. For Pater noster never will accord With her, nor Ave Mary with our Lord. If I have him, what need I seek another, Or will he nothing do without his Mother, And this (sir Priest) was much in Question, Disputed long, with deep digestion, Whether the Ave Mary should be said To God, or to our Lady when they prayed, With which Saint Andrew's University, Was puzzled with a strange diversity, And sat so long they cooled all their Kale, At last the Master Cook heard of the tale, And like a mad man ran among the Clergy, Crying with many a Domine me asperge, To give the Pater noster to the Father, And Avies to our Lady altogether, And every man may think (that wise or grave is) She's more then satisfied with Creeds and Aves. At which the clergy (fearing more confusion) Were all contented with the cook's conclusion. Priest. Pedlar, this tale, is of thee coined new; Ped. Sir John I'll lose my pack if't be not true; Again, all learned monks and friars have read, How Christ himself taught us of his own head, That every soul that is with sin oppressed, Should come to him, and he would give them rest: Come all to me (said he) not to another, Come all to me (said he) not to my Mother. And If I do as our good Lord commanded, I know our Lady will no ways withstand it: And so if I should say my prayers in Latin, Unto the Lord at evensong or at Matin, And never understand what I were saying, Think you the Lord would take it for true praying, No sure, he will not, for I truly know, My tongue and heart must both together go, And hereupon I'll tell you what befell, To learned clerks, that Latin well could spell, With whom by chance I lodged at an inn, Whereas an old wife on her wheel did spin, And towards evening she fell to and prayed, But neither they or I knew what she said, One said she canted, others said she mumbled, And still strange language from her lips she fumbled, Round run her wheel, and round her tongue did run, She mumbled and she slavered, and she spun; What think you now sir John of this old Hussie, Where was her heart when as she was so busy. At last (said one) Dame wot you what you say, No, not (quoth she) but well I wot I pray; You pray (quoth he) and know not what I grant, Alas how can you be so ignorant. The woman, musing little at the motion, Said, ignorance is Mother of Devotion. If Ignorance be mother then (said he) Sure darkness must her only daughter be; Prayed you, (quoth I) when all the time you span, What matters that, quoth she God's a good man, And knows what I speak in the Latin tongue, Either at Matins or at evensong. Alas, good sir, I was not this wife abused, Whose soul and senses all were so confused, You know these unknown tongues can profit no man, And one tongue is enough for any woman; But when we pray in true sincerity, As God commands in spirit and verity, The heart sends up the tongue as Messenger Unto the Lord, a pleasant passenger. Priest. But Pedlar, here's a pretty little book, Wherein if thou wilt spare the time to look, Set forth by a good Catholic Divine, Which out of doubt will settle thy engine With it, thy conscience will be better framed, The Gag of the new Gospel it is named: He clearly proves by Zachary's example, When he did sacrifice within the Temple, And all the people prayed and stood without, They knew not then what tongue he spoke no doubt; Ergo the mass may be both said and sung, In other language than our mother Tongue. Ped. Sir John I see your holy Catholic, Upon the Text hath put a pretty trick, Did Zachary speak in a Latin stile, When all the people stayed without the while, He was a Jew sure, and knew Hebrew well, And spoke no Latin for aught you can tell; For if the people heard not what he said, Could they or you know in what tongue he prayed Since understanding cometh by the ear, He cannot understand that doth not hear. Prove it that Zachary spoke Latin, then I'll say all monks and friars are honest men. Because a learned Priest may pray in Latin, And mumble o'er his evensong, mass, and Matin, Ergo a Pedlar to the Lord may pray, And know no syllable that he doth say, So when you put me to your Pater noster, I ask an egg when I would have an oyster. And seeing thus our Faiths do disagree, That neither I with you, nor you with me Can be united, with one mind and heart, I think it best we take our leaves and part. I'll pray that God, in Grace and mercy, would Bring all his straying Flock into his Fold. FINIS.