Certamen Brittanicum, Gallico Hispanicum. A TRUE RELATION Of a Conference holden between CHARLES STUART King of Scots, Don LEWIS de HARO, AND THE Cardinal Mazarine, the two Grand Favourites of the Courts of France and Spain. WHEREIN Is touched something of the Interests of the said States one to the other, and of both in relation to the said KING of SCOTS. AS ALSO How much it hath been endeavoured to make Him turn Catholic, with his constant Resolution to live and die in the true Protestant Religion. Sent in a Letter to the Prince of Conde, and by his Secretary to a Friend of private trust in England, who hath caused the same to be faithfuly rendered into English out of the Spanish Copy. LONDON: Printed in the Year, 1659. Certamen Brittannicum, Gallico Hispanicum. A True Relation of a conference holden between Charles Stuart King of Scots, Don Lewis de Haro, and the Cardinal Mazarine the two Grandee Favourites of the Courts of France and Spain. THE two State Favourites and grande Politicians of Europe Don Lewis de Haro and Cardinal Mazarine the two public Ambassadors for the Kings of Spain and France to manage the treaty of marriage between the said King of France and the Infant of Spain, having according to former resolutions met on on the borders of both Kingdoms, after many niceties satisfied, objections resolved, and several ceremonious compliments of respect past, they began to consult of those things, the settling whereof was the foundation of their meeting: wherein among other things, it fell into consideration, who should be included within the articles of the peace to be concluded thereby and who debarred, amongst whom the Cardinal desired that the King of Scots might be one in regard his Master had (contrary to the Law of Nations, friendship and alliance) banished him out of his Court and Kingdom: whereupon Don Lewis answered, there is the more reason he should be taken in, for though his nearest kindred, who had formerly been obliged to his Father, had forced him to retreat from among them, yet seeing he had cast himself upon his Master, he should find he did not rely on a broken reed, which while he trusted would run into his hand, but that he would be to him as Castle of defence, wherein he might shelter him from the injurious storms which undeservedly did threaten him, so that whether or no he be nominally admitted by you it much matters, since he is an ally, a friend and confederate of my masters, all whose allies must and shall be necessarily included. Many days and much time being spent in these debates: and notice thereof being brought to the King of Scots, he thought it very convenient to go to the place of meeting, and there to make his application to that noble person who had stood up so much for his interest, and having at last attained to the end of his journey, (hoping to Crown this beginning of his desires with success) he went privately to the Lord Don Lewis, who though somewhat astonished at his sudden and unexpected arrival did yet nevertheless treat him with many extraordinary civilityes, the usual testimonies of a condiall affection, with promise in convenient time to procure a meeting between themselves, and the Cardinal, in which they would consult what was necessary, and what was fit to be done, whereby he should see, that no stone should be unturned, if it might raise him an advantage or procure him an assistance, so as he on his part, would not stand in his own light, and run himself into a Dilemma, with too much obstinacy in some particulars, at which time they parted with a reassurance of a future meeting suddenly. According to his promise about the midst of September last past the Spanish Grandee gained a meeting: where they after some respects (each reserving to himself his own Grandezza, Don Lewis began; there hath been, Sir, some controversy between the Cardinal his Eminency and myself about your interest, I judging it necessary that upon a conclusion of a peace between two the most potent Princes of Europe, (a third being now distressed through the malevolent dispositions of ill affected and rebellious subjects should not be left out, whereunto the Cardinal replied, I confess it is a work of charity and piety, but where the interest of the state whereof I am a subject, cannot but suffer by such a concession, I must crave pardon: you know or at the least have heard, how the King my Master was compelled to make a peace with the English State, and upon what unequal term we gained the same, he left many of his friends and kindred in the in the Lurch, and was glad to give Dunkirk and some other places for the purchase thereof. He was particularly bound to banish this noble person here present and never to aid or assist him, but to take all persons, his friend, and allves to be our enemies, so that I cannot saluo honore regiae majestatis, conclude any thing as to that point. And doth my Cousin truly (said the King of Scots) so highly prise his so dearly bought peace: surely he cannot but know that the person with whom he made, it was no better than a regicide, a person who washed his hands in the sacred blood of his King, without any just or equal quarrel, for to him and his villainous retinue all things were lawful that might any way serve their turn, all their actions and passions how divers and inconstant soever were in their ambition swallowed up and thereinto converted, they forbear no manner of murders, breach of faith and buying other men's fidelity, they esteem as a virtue and think no place strong where an horse laden with gold may enter, not any City or State unconquerable, where any of the greatest hope to be made greater can lose the sense of other men's sorrow and subjection: pardon my deviation, he that speaks of his own griefs, of his own troubles speaks sensible: such than I say, were the men your Master's men, subjected himself to: and I pray for what reason, why out of a spirit of revenge the one sought, the other did conclude a peace, the first to satisfy his desire on the Prince of Conde, the other that he might fulyll his cruelty towards me. Truly said Don Lewis and that possibly might be the design of both; for I know the King of Spain was tampered with, to the same purpose and when by policy and undermining the effect could not be attained, then strait a war was included with Spain, Jamarca seized on by violence, and Dunkirk with some few other places stolen into by craft, but I really believe, that if they should take a view of their Treasury and but reckon the men those inconsiderable places have cost them, they would quickly find the blood and treasure hugely to overbalance the worth thereof. For what advantage have they gotten thereby for Jamaica is so poor a place, that without continual fresh supplies the souldyary and people there must starve, and then observe but the danger of bringing in provision, the place being wholly environed with Islands under the King of Spain's dominion well fortified, well attended on by ships and populously rich and the whole place will not countervail either half the danger or charge. And as for Dunkirk which they boast is the key into Flanders, if they can make no better use thereof for the future, than they have hitherto done, it may possibly prove to them mors in olla, a thing of so hard a digestion that their greedy stomaches shall be forced to restore, let it be as it will, quoth the Cardinll, we shall endeavour to hold out own and neither meddle in the settling or unsettling Commonwealths or Kingdoms. 'Tis well, answered the King of Scots, but you were I am sure of another mind when you were banished out of France: but the wheel with you was quickly round, thanks to your policy, and Machiavellian principles: but as to the main point for this is but beating about the bush, my desire is that as in this happy treaty and conclusion of a peace, and a marriage, most of the Princes, and states of Europe will have a share of happiness, I alone may not be set aside: and I am very well assured, that if my condition (as being most wrongfully expulsed out of my Father's Kingdom and my lawful inheritance) were but taken in among the rest of your friends, the very sense thereof would so move other neighbour Princes and states, that they would suddenly turn their many promises into actions, and instead of words aid me with Swords. I must deal ingeniously with you, said Don Lewis, it is the intent of my Master to take you in as an Ally and Friend: and I am sure having him, you gain the whole house of Austria, who by reason of their great power and sway in the Empire, (as having the Emperor of their kindred) command the chief and greatest part of Europe: for by that means all the Catholic Princes there will be assistant: and if you but weigh the alliance between these, the Dane, the Pole, and several others, in the whole, it will be found that two third parts of Europe will all follow. I must confess replied the Cardinal, you have said much to the purpose, the Leagues and Alliances you have spoken of are many and very strong, but most of them will find business enough to defend themselves against the Swede and his partakers, for though by the new League they may seem sorely to threaten him, yet he is able by Himself and his Confederates (as he hath done some years already) to find them employment at home. Indeed (retorted the King of Scots) I think your chief hopes is on the King of Sweden, who if I be not mistaken, is in the League with your Eminencyes Master, as also with my Enemies: but I hope (and something I have of confidence to assure me thereof) that the Marquis of Brandenburg (not to mention my Cousin of the Palatanate) who is late joined with the Emperor and house of Austria, will so pull his feathers, that on a sudden he shall not fly fare abroad. It may be so (answered the Cardinal) but now admitting all your hopes to be certainties, they will little avail, for his Holiness is not at all thought of: and with out all dispute he will go fare in Italy: 'tis true, Italy is divided into four parts, viz. Lombary, Tuscany, St. Peter's Patrimony; and the Kingdom of Naples: In Lombary stand many rich Governments, as the Dukedom of milan (which is my Masters) of Mantua, of Florence, and others of less note: none of which you have mentioned; these together St. Peter's Patrimony, and the State of Venice are all at his Holiness beck. What then (answered Don Lewis) is not my Master the eldest son of the Church? I am confident his Holiness will as soon bend towards him as the greatest. Is not the Kingdom of Naples his? are not you to deliver him the Dukedom of milan? Doth not he keep a good Fleet of Galleys at Otrauto continually, which is the nearest passage from Italy into Greece to prevent any invasion from the Turks: why then should he have less hopes of his Holiness than you. And I dare presume that if his Majesty of Scotland here present will be but reconciled to the Church of Rome, all difficulties will so easily be removed: that he shall but ask and have Men, moneys, ammunition, Ships, and what not, without the help or thanks of your Master, or his Friends who have already once apostatised from him. I must confess (answered the King of Scots) I would very willingly be reinstated in my Kingdoms and would even give, forgive, grant or do any thing even beyond expectation to be hoped from me to come to that happiness, but to seek or gain them, and to lose or hazard my hopes of Heaven, I dare not, I cannot, for I shall sooner choose to die an exile from my native Country then to banish or change the Religion I have been bred and born in for a settlement there. Alas (answered the Cardinal) what is your Religion but a new fangle, a thing never thought of till Luther's time. I deny that (replied the King) for it is the same in its purity which was professed in the primitive Church, so that it is as old as Christianity at self: and all along hath been upheld (but with some mixtures I must confess) I need not say much herein, a great part of the World are therein as well satisfied as myself. Yea (replied Don Lewis) but you cannot show that it was ever openly preached or professed till of late days. I suppose (answered the King) your excellency in this point is misinformed, what think you of the Waldenses, of John Wickliff who openly preached and upheld the same even in the public and famous University of Oxford, in the time of King Edward the third of England, and favoured by John of Gaunt Duke of Lancaster, and other great men of that time: Were John hus and Hierom of Prague no body, who in defence thereof, both sacrificed their lives. It is founded upon the word of God, and is the same which is taught in the Doctrine of the Prophets: yea by Christ himself, and his Apostles, and is of greater antiquity then that which is grounded but upon the decrees of counsels and humane traditions: but I shall not argue any further thereof, for I am no Prophet, nor no Prophets Son. But quoth the Cardinal this obstinacy will never do you good: your Father might have still b●en a King, or you his peaceful Successor, if he had not been so resolutely bend in these points: And for this very cause, I take exceptions against you: you know what Machiavelli saith, It matters not whether a Prince have Religion or no, so he make a pretence thereof sufficient to serve his own ends: you must learn to transform yourself into any shape, for Qui nescit dissimulare, nescit regnare. It is usually found in Counsels of State, that the busy heads of a few do carry all the rest: And many times Men make a surrender of their own judgements to him that hath gotten a name by giving happy directions in troubles forepast. A fair Argument hath your Eminency used (said the King) but I doubt hardly sufficient to work on me: for I am like Antigonus (one of Alexander's Captains) who was as good a Man of War, of as deep judgement, as high a spirit, and as great undertaking as any of the rest, but his employment was less, which made him less respected, but his thoughts were as high as theirs, for he valued himself by his own worth, not by the opinion of others, in like manner, I though at present kept an exile by those who ought to be my Subjects, have yet nevertheless the thoughts of a King: for why may not the same providence that cast me of, put me in again, Saepe redit pulsâ nube serena dies. In truth (said Don Lewis) your resolution is much to be commended, and generally we find good success to be the reward of a well grounded patience, and if you can with the contented mind of Socrates, conclude that every place is the wise Man's Country, and all parts a Palace to a quiet mind, you will not miss the reward of your patience, for Saepe prement Deo fert Deus alter opem. And for my own part, I do here protest to your Majesty, that I shall in what I may assist you, and that I will be earnest with the King of Spain my Master to that purpose. But I pray (quoth the Cardinal) let not your excellency be over hasty, for since it hath pleased the divine providence to bring the affairs of these two great Crowns to so hopeful a period: I hope this shall not be any cause of breach, and therefore shall rather honour this noble Prince with the title of friend: Some of his evill-willers we have seen to fall, those that have risen have waded through a Sea of blood: And those that now remain are ready to destroy one another about parting the Stakes, I wish therefore the effects may prove successful, and that the event of our conference may be a happy amen towards his settlement. Yet if you please (quoth Don Lewis to the King) I shall not advise you to trust to the inconstancy of the French Nation: but rather that you will go to the Court of Spain, where your retreat shall be warranted and safe, whereupon after many congratulation● on both sides at the present they parted. This is the exact relation of the conference, as near as possibly could be gathered, which for public satisfaction I have here made public, that the World may see that that poor banished Prince the King of Scots is neither so helpless nor freindless as many Men imagine. Shortly after this conference ended, the King took his course directly for the Court of Spain, where according to information from thence since received, he is safely arrived, and with courtesy and humanity entertained. FINIS.