The EARL of PEMBROKE'S SPEECH In the House of PEERS, Upon debate of the city's Petition for a Personal Treaty, to be had with His MAJESTY in London.  
And also upon debate of those Reasons given by their Lordships unto the Commons, for not sending the three Propositions before a TREATY.  
Printed in the year, 1648.   

The EARL of PEMBROKE'S SPEECH In the House of Peers, upon debate of the Cities Petition for a Personal Treaty, to be had with His Majesty in London.  
The CITIZENS being withdrawn, his Lordship spoke as followeth.  
My Lords,  
I Thank God you had no reason to make me your Speaker: And truly (all things considered) I have as little reason to be a Speaker as any man: And yet I will speak; for I have been learning these seven years how to do it extrumpere. I have helped too to bawl down Bishops and Scholars, and Ministers for dumb-dogs, and do you think I'll be a dumb-dog too? A halter I will: If I should sit still and say nothing, and let His Majesty come to London, that were the way to make me dumb indeed, for I can say no more for myself then a dog. I hope the door is fast, that the Citizens do not hear me, because I'll speak my mind: What though I do not know my own mind? Yet I'll speak it as well as I can. 'Tis known I am a true Englishman, though I cannot speak good English, and as honest a man too as my Lord Say can make me; and therefore (my Lords) now I have lived long enough with you, I mean to die with the House of Commons, or else (they say) I shall be no Lord; And so say I to you: Grass and hay, (my Lords) we are all mortal, and must be tied up to the Manger.  
I have been for the City too in my time, when they would pay their money; hear reason, and invite us to dinners. Hang them Rascals, they cannot say but we have given them their Bellyfuls too, (I pray God they do not hear me.) This time twelvemonth they made a young man of me, and yet (as simple as you think me) I am an old man: They drew me into a new War, and made me wait upon a new Speaker, and Vote His Majesty's coming to London: But I was a mad man, I knew not what I did then; for, if the Army had not had the more mercy, I had been a Traitor as well as the rest, for aught I know. Do ye think then I'll Vote the King home again? no I warrant you, I am an old Bird, and scorn Chaff, or to be made a Traitor any more for any King in Christendom. I am an old thing made new now: My man Michael tells me I am an Independent. I think I am a good Christian, I; but Citizens and Scots are Jew's: And who knows but that Personall-Treaty may be a new name for Popery?  
You may bring in Popery, and break the Covenant (if you please my Lords) but I dare not. I am sure we have reason to regard it; For we have gotten well by it: we have gotten the Crown-Lands, Church-Lands, the Cavaliers Lands; every man's Lands too, if we please, and the Devil and all: And how shall we keep them, if we do not keep the Covenant? For my part, I'll keep to my Oaths, and rather than part with them, Damn me I'll swear down all this Personal Treaty.  
And good reason too; for they say it will undo all that we have been doing these seven years: And for my part, I thought all had been undone already, than what needs any more undoing by a Treaty? My Lords, if we must undo, let us undo as the House of Commons does. They do one thing to day, and undo it to morrow. They Voted they would never make any more Addresses to the King, and made us Vote so too, and then they made us un-vote all again. And truly, I think this is a hard Chapter, for, I cannot read the meaning of it, but I am sure they do not mean a Treaty, if they can help it.  
I like the way of sending Propositions, I; for, I love to go on errands. I am sure it is an Honourable employment for an old man to be the State's half-penny-Boy; and I am glad, the Commons will not hear your Reasons for the Kings coming, before He have signed the three Propositions. For, observe (my Lords) if they should hear Reason, they might go whistle: Mistake me not, I mean if they should hear any Reason but their own, and I think that is all the Reason in the world, for it is Reason of State, or the States own Reason. There I think I hit it; for, all other Reason is Malignant and High-Treason. Why then should we Treat with the King? For he'll talk Malignant Reason, and reason of State too, but then, here's the matter (my Lords) he will not talk the State's Reason, and therefore judge ye, whether the State have any reason to talk with Him, when He will talk nothing but Treason, and by that means (my Lords) make you, or me, or any of us all Traitors to our Faces. Trust Him that will, for my part, I shall have as little to say to Him as any of you all, and yet you fee I am a good Speaker, according to the State's Reason.  
I think, we never had good world, since we had so much Reason: For my part (I'll speak my mind plainly) I never had any reason of my own, nor will I own ever any but Michael Oldsworth's and the States, and by the life of Pharaoh, I think they two are as reasonable Creatures as any in the world. But to this point of Reason I mean to speak more, now I come to examine your Lordship's Reasons of State, which the House of Commons have Voted contrary to the State's Reason: For as I take it (my Lords) they are the STATE, and you know we are all bound to submit to the STATE, or else we are Traitors; I am sure few of us but have been made so for not submitting, and 'tis God's mercy we are not all Traitors. Howsoever, I'll be one not more, if I can help it, but keep as well as I can to the State's Reason, and I advise your Lordships to do so too; for they care not a Fig for all your Reasons, nor I neither. 'sdeath, I am sure some of you have no reason to the contrary; you know how you were whipped with the Black-Rod lately; and I can tell you, there's a black-Book too at the Headquarters: If you'll do reason, ye may, but (mark ye, my Lords) it's very dangerous to talk Reason, it's the only way to be put in the black-Book, and then you know the black-Rod follows. I am an old man, I, and some of you are old enough too, but (you see) we are not past whipping, and yet you will not take warning.  
Howsoever, I shall have a care of one, and in the mean time see what reason you have to venture to talk Reason to the STATE. If you were their Fellow-Commoners, you might have some reason to make bold to give them Reasons, but being as it is, me thinks you might know your distance. You say you would not have the three propositions offered to the King before the Treaty; First, because the Citizens here, and divers Counties have petitioned for it. The Citizens! 'Tis true, they have brought us in a Petition here for it. But the more Rascals they: They may go home & say their Prayers; for, they are not like to be heard here. What do they pray when they should curse? Damn me do they think the States a Chameleon to live upon air, good words, and Petitions, and Treaties? They were all for a new-war, and drew me in too this time Twelve months, & now they are against a new-war. Is there any Reason in this, when the States have not yet done their business? must They do and undo as well as the STATE, and now by doing nothing quite undo the STATE? They shall be hanged first, Damn me they shall: I am somewhat the more eager against this, (my Lords) because you say 'tis Reason; but yet I hope the Citizens do not hear me. I would not have all that I speak, to be spoken on the Housetops, because usually (my Lords) I seldom speak, but I am o'th' Top of the House before I am ware. But this I say, why should they stand for Peace and Treaties, that first set afoot the war! And now when we expect they should serve another Apprenticeship to the STATE to maintain the war, they meant to leave Reformation like Dun in the mine, and are become so Popish as to Cross us with Treaties. If they were for a new-war this time Twelvemonth, 'tis all the Reason in the world they should be so now. What though the Case be not the same, nor the STATE the same now that it was then? I hope the Cause & the State are alive still, and will be as long as the King and the Cavaliers live; & outlive them too; for, They are the Same still, and fit for another world than the STATE'S world: For the STATE'S world runs round, and hath done so these seven years, but the King and the Cavaliers are the same still: And therefore (my Lords) I shall conclude with as good Logic as any I have left in the University, as long as the King and the Cavoliers are the same, the CAUSE must needs be the same, though the STATE be not the same, but mangled, and rend, and patched, and new-modeld, and the Covenant likewise cracked all to pieces. And where is your Reason now (my Lords?) doth it not follow then, that they ought not to take the same Course to maintain the war against the King and the Cavaliers, and not trouble the STATE thus with Treaties? especially, seeing Guilds Hall is the same, the Excise, the City-Bags, and Public Faith too, are all the very same still, and as full and fluent as ever. And if these fellows that come here to vex the STATE thus with Petitions, will not go home in Peace, to forward a new-war, and be the same men again that they have been, I hope the Army will come & pickle them up in the Tower, & serve them the Same Sauce, their fellows had this time Twelvemonth. For what other end (I pray you) do we keep the Army, or the Army keep us?  
And now (my Lords) that I have done with the Citizens, I shall fall upon the Counties. What have they to do with Petitions? they are out of their Calling: they should follow the Plough, and let the STATE alone to Harrow, and fetch in Harvest. I warrant you they had rather have a King, and see us Quartered, then endure any more freequarter; but I think the States-Guard quartered them sufficiently, and made drawn-Cats of 'em, I mean the Surrey-men, so that I think they, or the rest, will have little stomach again to come a Petitioning. What reason then (my Lords) have you to regard what They say for a Treaty? They can but talk (you see) and the State can fight, and be ne'er the more Traitors for it; but if these fight, they are Traitors presently, as soon as we have conquered them. I tell you (my Lords) if the STATE had voted me a Soldier, I would have no more mercy upon these Fellows than if they were Traitors in gingerbread. What though They would by't? I have ventured ere now the tenderest Member that I have, with a biting Thing, and lain in a month for it under the Surgeon's hands; and I'll venture my Tongue with any Biter of them all, but I'll be sure to have a care of my Head for the service of the STATE; and who knows, whether I may keep it if there be a Treaty? But I wonder what good my head would do them: I am not weary of it yet, for, I never much troubled it, nor have been much troubled with it, and yet I should be much troubled to part with it. 'Tis true, I for my part never got any thing by it, and I suppose no Body else will: Therefore they had as good let it alone. But neither you have any Reason to venture yours, nor I mine; and therefore to this part of your reason (my Lords) I say the Counties are as very Rascals as the Citizens, that would have us to pull an old House upon our Heads by a Personal Treaty. They would have a disbanding of the Army too, would they? Bus they shall snap short; For, I love the Army, Dammee I do dearly. Sink me, they would have us disband I think too, and sit no longer; but if the Army will love us, we'll love the Army; for, why should the Counties be so much against the Soldiers, poor wretches! Consider (my Lords) an 'ttwere your own case; for, it might have pleased God to have made some of us Soldiers. And so (my Lords) I think I have mauled your first reason against the three Propositions.  
Your second Reason is, because His Majesty hath often declared, that he will sign nothing till all things be concluded, and therefore that the sending of those three must needs cause delay to the Treaty. I would have you to know (my Lords) I am not for delays, I hate them; for, I think I am as hasty as any man; but yet I care not, if we delay a Treaty with God or the King till Doomsday, and that I think is a fair time; for, it may be to morrow for aught we know: And it is a very fit time, I think, since His Majesty will agree to nothing till the conclusion of all things. I wish him well, he was my Master, but I care not much for seeing him, nor for kissing his hand; I can kiss my Lady May, and she is my Mistress. I care not for kissing of men: I am an old man, and it is not for me to be kissing: but if she be for a personal Treaty, than indeed this Reason holds good against delay, and I am of your opinion.  
Then you say too, it is contrary to the rules of treating to grant any thing before the Treaty. Have we done what we list all this while, and must we go by Rule now? Then it will follow too, that we must let the King rule again. He is in a fine condition to rule, is he not? I thought we could have ruled one another better than he. I am sure my Lord SAY rules me, as well as ever I would desire; and I believe he rules you as well as me; and then we can never be against the Rules of Treating, as long as he rules the Roast, because he says a Treaty is out of all Rule, and none but unruly Fellows do stand for it, and it is not for our Honours (my Lords) to be unruly: But Dammee, I think we cannot be unruly; for, we have as good a disciplined Army as any is in the world to rule us.  
But I say further, that it was the desire of the Scots to have His Majesty come to some of his houses near London, and therefore we should yield to it presently, to keep a fair correspondence with them. Dammee and sink me (my Lords) what have we to do with them now? we had occasion to use them a while ago, but now that they have helped us to conquer the King, we have done with them. We (my Lords) must be ruled, but the Scots (you see) are the Lords of misrule. For my part, I'll have nothing to do with them; I cannot abide a Scot; for, a Scot switched me once, and cracked my crown with my own staff, the very virge of my Lord-Chamberlainship, and now they are all coming to switch you too. They say Hamilton is their General. He is a Duke; I cannot abide a Duke, because I am not one myself; but do not I look as like a Duke as Hamilton? Well, I might have been one, if I had had wit enough to keep that honour which I had: But I had honour; what then had I to do with wit? That's for Poor Rogues; for, wit and honour seldom meet together. I know many men count swearing to be wit; and if I had been so witty as to keep close to my Oaths at Court, and not broke them by playing false with the King, and forswear myself by taking the State's Oaths, and the Scots Oath: Dammee I had been as good a Duke before this time, as any Scot of them all. But hang Dukes, we are Princes now, an't please the Commons.  
As for the King's coming to one of his houses, I know not what that means, for he hath never a house: I say they are the State's houses time out of mind, at least these seven years, ever since His Majesty was turned out of doors. I am afraid, if he should come to any of his houses, and we not agree with him, nor let him be King again, we shall be turned out of our House, and the Commons out of their House; and then we shall not have a house to hid our heads in. Mark ye too (my Lords) it must be to some one of his houses near London. How d'ye like that? I am sure some of you have no houses near London, and ye thought to make bold with His Majesties. 'Sdeath, I thought ye had housed him for that purpose, and will ye now give over house-keeping?  
You say likewise, there is more reason to offer a Treaty with him now, then there was heretofore at Oxford and Uxbridge. Well (my Lords) you may do what you will. Sink me if I don't live and die with the House of Commons. I am for the State, I: But if you'll undo yourselves with reason, I can't help it: you see the Cavaliers have undone themselves with it already. And if you'll beggar yourselves with it too, and leave me to keep house here by myself, you may. You know the House of Commons and I are all one; and if you leave the House of Peers to me and two or three more, the Commons House and ours will soon be all one too. Hang reason then, will you provoke the State, and leave my company for a little reason? You know whither my Lord of Holland is gone for his reason, & what's become of my Lord Francis and the rest, and where His Majesty is with all his reason, and where I am that have reason. You talk of treating at Oxford and Uxbridge. 'Tis true, His Majesty baffled us with reason: but how hath he prospered after it? I believe it never did any body any good; and I am sure, though we had no reason to get the better, yet we got the better with no reason: And therefore because we thrived so well then without reason, I think 'tis wisely done to deal out of all reason ever since. And so (my Lords) I think I have tickled you for all your Reasons, against our sending of the three Propositions before a Treaty.  
Now (my Lords) in the next place I'll prove the Propositions themselves to be so reasonable, that I know you'll never trust to your own Reasons again. What though they are unreasonable, yet they are not so, if I keep to my former distinction, that is, not according to Reason of State, but the State's Reason; for seeing a Treaty would quite undo the STATE, sure 'tis all the reason in the world, they should propound things out of reason, on purpose to prevent Treating. Therefore I'll maintain the first Proposition is most reasonable, that the King should recall all Proclamations and Declarations against us; and well he 'scapes so too; for, I am sure he slandered us sufficiently with a matter of truth, though he called us out of our Names: 'Sdeath! which of all us are Rebels and Traitors? Do I look like one? what, am I a Faux or a Catesby? I am sure I had no hand in this last powder-plot; nor the first neither: I scorn to be a Traitor, I dammee; what Declarations and Proclamations to cut off our Heads, and not recall them? you may choose whether you'll have 'em recalled or no, but sink me I'll have 'em recalled. What shall our heads be fitted with an Iron Capcase, and set a sunning these Dog-days upon the top of the house here to spoil our complexions? dammee we must all come to't, if we be Rebels and Traitors: Traitor then in his face, if he will not recall his Proclamations; for, they will make us traitors in spite of our teeth, if we do not make them treason against the STATE. What though the House of Commons have made us traitors in many things in spite of our teeth? I hope the STATE may do any thing? and be no treason: Therefore I say these Proclamations are treason against the STATE, and so not to recall them is to be a traitor against the STATE.  
But the Cavaliers say, if the King recalls them, than he makes Himself and Them to be the traitors. And all the reason in the world believe me, for, do what we can we cannot make them traitors; why then should not he make them so to our hands? for, I am sure we use them like traitors; and one had better be traitors (I think) than used so: But they are stubborn fellows, their shoulders are broad enough to bear any thing, and therefore the STATE hath reason to make them the Traitors I remember when they proclaimed my Lord of Essex a Traitor, and my Lord SAY here a traitor, all that stuck to them traitors. I am sure I stuck to them close, and yet I think we are never the worse traitors for being proclaimed. What's a Proclamation? I am sure there are some in the STATE that have torn his Majesty's Proclamations. How can they be Traitors then? But I'll tell you (my Lords) who are the traitors. The King's evil Councillors are the traitors; for, they never left him till we shut him up close prisoner, and put them away. We are the King's great Council now: What though we will not let him come amongst us? yet I am sure we are his best Council; for, we save him a great deal of trouble, and dispatch all things for him without a hearing, and so I hope we shall dispatch him too, if he will not recall. Judge you then (my Lords) whether he had not best recall his Proclamations.  
Now, for the second Proportion for settling of Church-Government, there is all the Reason in the world for it: For, I say every tub ought to stand upon his own bottom: Why then should not the Church of England be settled upon a Scotch bottom? Here's such a deal of do about a Church and Religion; I tell you plainly (my Lords) I am an Independent; I love it better than Presbytery, and yet I think they are both but a tale of a tub: But howsoever, it is an ill tub that hath no bottom: therefore (my Lords) I keep to my first saying, the Church will never be settled, till every tub stands upon its own bottom. Judge you then, whether I am not fit to be a Reformer: The Assembly says, we must reform according to the Word of God. For my part, I never trouble myself to read a word of it, and yet you know I am an Assembly-man. What need I read the Word of God, when I keep a Chaplain to read it? Besides, they say the reading of it would spoil my oaths, and I'll not leave one word of my oaths for all the word of God: But I am willing to be rid of the Scotch Oath, because they say 'tis taken out of the Word of God, and it may be so for aught I know. But yet I would feign keep the Covenant, because it hath kept many of us these hard times, and because it keeps the Bishops away from us. I cannot abide Bishops, they have so much learning and antiquity: I hate Surplices too, ever since Mr. Henderson preached it up for the Whore of Babylon's smock. It seems he had taken it up often, for he had many a Bout with her (as Mr. Sedgwick says) now and anon too: But hang the whore of Babylon; she is an an old whore, and I am an old man (I thank God) but I cannot abide old whores, nor you neither (my Lords) I hope. Therefore judge you, whether His Majesty ought not to settle Church-Government presently, that all old whores may be excommunicated.  
As for our third Proposition, for the settling of the Militia, I know not well what to say to it. This Militia is a hard word, and so is public Faith, but yet the Citizens made a shift to swallow it. The Devil's in their guts, they will down with any thing these hard times; and they will down with Militia too if we would let them. Sure, it is a very hard word; for, we have much ado to make His Majesty part with it, and we are as loath to part with it as His Majesty. But I think we have made him part with it in spite of his teeth. What though he will not give it us? we have it already, and we are fools (I think) if we do not keep it. What, take away our Arms? does he think to make the STATE cross the cudgels, and be Popish again? The STATE shall order Hammond to trip up his heels first, and if he cannot do it, Rolph shall go and make him kick up his heels. He is a member of the STATE's Militia; he may do it. Dammee he may, for, no body that I see dares question him. Judge you then, whether His Majesty had not as good let us cut his throat with the Militia as without it. And so (my Lords) I think the three Propositions are very reasonable, and that you will never trouble the STATE with any more reasons against them.  
Now (my Lords) for the Cities Petition here before us, I have but one word more to say. I say, their Petition is worse than your reasons. They would have a Treaty too, and no propositions; but they are not half so mannerly to the STATE as your Lordships; for, you give reasons, but they bring not a word of reason that I can understand; and yet they will have no nay to a Treaty. Hang 'em Rascals; it is to save their purses. They had rather save their purses, than themselves or the STATE: but Dammee their purses and they are both R●probates, and therefore I say the STATE must damn them both. It's possible in time the STATE may hang them for all their services; I do not mean the Aldermen in their own chains; for, the Troopers will find other ware for execution: And well they deserve it; for, the poor Army hath taken the pains to conquer the Kingdom, and them too; and yet the churls are so miserable, they never could find in their hearts to give them so much as one meal of thanksgiving; therefore I think after their cold breakfast before Colchesler, they had best come and fall aboard upon the City. I am sure they have some friends here that will bid them welcome: Shippon hath a thousand Horse for the purpose; and I think they will help pretty well to fetch recruits out of these dogged fellows of the City, and keep out a personal Treaty.  
Then mark (my Lords) they'll have this Treaty to be in London. No other place will serve them to have the King in but London. I thought they had Kings enough at London already: but they'll have King Charles; that's a malignant word if you put God to it; for, it is the Cavaliers word, and I am for neither. I hope (my Lords) you will be so too, and not turn Cavaliers now at last; for, what should we do with King Charles? which of us can look him in the face? Dammee, I think you have as little reason to treat with him as I. Well (my Lords) I have spoken my mind; I pray you do not order the printing of my Speech; for, I would not have every body know my mind before myself. I should speak oftener if I might be less in print; for, a Speech in print is near kin to learning, and I hate learning; I hate King; I hate King Charles. Do you do so too, and le'ts love one another, and be obedient to the STATE: For, Dammee, sink me and rammee nine miles into the bottom of a hedge, we are undone, if we do not make slaves of the City, and keep off a personal Treaty.  
FINIS.