Sl

|-. >> ^>> )A M^^'^) w
. ¦.•yi„!„i,n ''•:, III, i'liiillt ¦¦•''; ;

SOME ACCOUNT

LIFE AND OPINIONS

CHARLES,

SECOND EARL GREY.

BY LIEUT.-GENEEAL HON. C. GEEY.

LONDON:
EICHAED BENTLEY, NEW BUELINGTON STEEET.
iau*IW]&£r in Oriitnars ta i^er Ma^egtp.
1861.

PREFACE

The following Memoir was written for the most part
upwards of ten years ago. The Continent of Europe
was then scarcely recovering from the convulsions of
1848-49. England had almost alone weathered the
storm ; a safety which, I think, she owed mainly to
the sound principles of Grovernment inaugurated by
the Whig Ministry of 1830, and afterwards neces
sarily adhered to by succeeding Administrations, of
whatever party denomination.
The passing of the Eeform Act had indeed ren
dered Government on any other principles imprac
ticable ; and in this fact we flnd the defence and
justification of that measure, as well as the object of
its authors. Certainly, at all events, this was the sole
object of my father as the leader of the Eeform move
ment, to insure the future conduct of the Government

IV PEEFACE.
on sound and constitutional principles, not, as has..
been sometimes asserted, to perpetuate the tenure of
ofiBce in his own party.
The present volume, however, will stop far short of
the time when Eeform principles achieved their final
triumph ; but I shall often have to aUude to that time,
and to the results that have followed the policy then
adopted, as afifording a fair subject for comparison
with the period of which I am now to speak, when a
widely dififerent system of Government was still in the
ascendant. I do not propose at present to bring down the
notice of my father's public life beyond 1817, when the
alliance which for upwards of eleven years had sub
sisted between the Whigs aud Grenvillites was finally
dissolved ; nor even as regards that period do I int-endT"
to enter into anything like a detailed or connected
narrative of events, which are matter of history, and
with which I shall suppose my readers to be more or
less acquainted — further, that is, than may be neces
sary to illustrate my father's political opinions and
principles of action. I shall take the expression of
these opinions and principles as much as possible from
his own words, either written in familiar correspond
ence with his family and friends, or spoken by him in
his place in Parliament. My object will be  if I
cannot persuade the world on all occasions,' as I am

PEEFACE. V
myself persuaded, of the general soundness of his
views — at least to endeavour to impart somewhat of
my own conviction of the singularly straightforward,
disinterested, and high-minded motives which ever
guided his public conduct,
I make use of the appellations ' Whig ' and ' Tory '
as they applied to the parties as they stood opposed
to each other at the time of which I write; by no
means as they are now assumed by parties and indi
viduals who have no earthly claim to be characterized
as either one or the other. In fact, since the settle
ment of all the great questions formerly dividing men
on soraewhat higher grouuds than those of mere per
sonal pretensions and individual rivalry, these names
have lost all significance. From the time that the
Reform Act was finally accepted by the Conservative
party, and that Sir Eobert Peel issued his famous
Tamworth manifesto in 1834 — (every word of which,
my father said at the time, he might himself have
written) — there has indeed been no difference between
public men as to the principles on which the Govern
ment of the country should be conducted ; and the re
tention of the old party names serves no other end, to
my way of thinking, but that most mischievous one, of
keeping apart those, who, differing on no one principle
of national policy, might act together to the great
advantage of the State, but for the accident which has
a 2

vi PBEFACE.
thrown them to this or that side of either House of
Parliament. The Whigs (so called) of the present day have little
in common with the men who, like my father, were
ever the unflinching advocates of a due balance of the-
powers conferred by the Constitution on the different
estates of the realm ; who upheld the just preroga
tives of the Crown, and at the same time asserted
the privileges of Parliament, and contended for the
rights and liberties of the people ; who, if they were
still foremost to resist the undue influence of the
Court and the corrupt system of Government to which
it led, — if they opposed the harsh and arbitrary mea
sures of the Cabinet or the uncalled for (as they
deemed it) suspension of the safeguards of our free
Constitution, — were yet as forward to resist any un
constitutional extension of the democratic principle,
and that constant ' pressure from without '* to which
everything would appear now to be conceded. ' I
' should be anxious,' my father writes to Lord Gren
ville, on the state of parties in 1809, ' to mark equally
' the line of distinction between us and the Ministers
' on the one hand, and those who are urging these
' popular questions in such pernicious modes on the
' other.' * This expression, whioh is now so universally adopted, was first
used by my father in 1834, in answer to Lord Ebrington, who forwarded
a letter to him, signed by numerous members of the House of Commons,
praying that he would reconsider his determination to resign.

PREFACE. vii
The Tory of the present day — I mean the man, if
such there be, who still assumes the name — would be
almost surprised to be told that the distinguishing
characteristic of his party in former times was that
of the most uncompromising hostility to any approach
towards civil or religious liberty : coercion with its
most stringent and oppressive enactments in the one
case ; intolerance in its most bigoted form in the
other. It is unnecessary for me to enter into the reasons
which have hitherto delayed the publication of this
Memoir. I regret that delay, unavoidable as it has
been, for fresh generations have sprung up, or are fast
springing up around us, belonging to which, I fear,
there are few who have much knowledge of, and still
fewer who take any interest in, these bygone times.
While of those who took any part in the events of
those days, who had either already entered, or were
about to enter, upon the political stage, —
' How few, all weak and wither'd in their force,
Wait on the verge of dark Eternity,
Like stranded wrecks, the tide returning hoarse
To sweep them from our sight !— Time runs his ceaseless course.'
On one account, indeed, I am not sorry for the
delay. During the period that has elapsed since I
compiled this volume, many valuable additions have
been made to the history of these times, and there are
now few eminent statesmen amongst my father's con-

yiii PREFACE
temporaries whose memoirs, diaries, or correspondence
have not been given to the world by their surviving
friends and relatives. But even in such of these pub
lications as give an exclusively Tory view of the
events of the day, I have found nothing to render
necessary any material change in what I had written.
I deal, as I have said, with opinions and principles
rather than with facts ; and even where I discuss the
latter, as in the case of the dismissal of the Grenville
Administration in 1807, or the negotiations for
changes of Government in 1809-11 and 12, I find
no reason to alter the impressions I had' already
formed and expressed. I have merely added pas
sages or notes from time to time, as I have read these
works, either to mark some confirmation of my own
views, or to correct what appears to me to be a mis
statement or a misapprehension on the part of others.
I must here add, that for all such views and opinions
as I may express in the course of this volurae, more
especially whenever I compare the times to which
it relates with those that have followed, I am entirely
and solely responsible.
I have not attempted to give any account of my
father in private life further than the short summary
that will be found in a supplementary chapter at the
end of the volume, simply because I found it utterly
impossible, by any description in words, to give

PREFACE. IX
an adequate idea to those who did not know him
of all that he was in his family. I have, however,
inserted in that chapter extracts from his letters to
my mother, which will abundantly confirm what I
elsewhere incidentally allude to — his fondness for his
home, and his distaste for the turmoil of politics.
Even these are insufficient, indeed, to make him tho
roughly known as I should wish the world to know
him, aud as he was known to his family, in all the
beauty of his character ; his noble and generous natm'e,
the indulgent kindliness of his disposition, his tender
affectionate heart !
Of the manner in which I have discharged the task
I have set myself I need say nothing ; of this it is for
others to judge. I do not pretend to an impartiality
which I should be ashamed of feeling — and indeed I
have before me the example of others to warn me from
any such profession * — lest while reading others a lec
ture on the duty of such a quality in a biographer,
every line I write should be in contradiction to my
own precepts.
I am well aware how far my execution of the work
falls short of what I could wish it to be, aud of what,
considering the subject, it ought to be ; but I shall
* See the editorial remarks on the ' Diaries aud Correspondence of
the Eight Honourable George Eose,' passim.

X PREFACE.
cheerfully submit to any criticism, whatever its nature,
which may affect myself, if I shall have helped the
public in any degree to a better appreciation of him,
whom I believe from my heart to have been one of
the most enlightened statesmen, certainly one of the
honestest and most disinterested politicians of this
or any other age.
Incorrupta fldes, nudaque Veritas —
Quando ullum invenient Parem I
April, 1861.

POSTSCRIPT TO THE PREFACE.

In a notice of my forthcoming volume, I have seen
it alluded to, as to an expected " Life of Lord Grey,"
to contain many details of his private life. Now I
wish especially to guard against such an impression.
The following pages do not contain what can be pror
perly termed a " Life " of my father. They relate to
too short a period of his public career, and want the
order and connection necessary to give them such a
character. They contain, in fact, simply what the
title page announces : " Seme account " of his life and
opinions. Nor should I have published them as they
are, had I either had time myself to enlarge them into
a detailed and connected memoir, or had I seen any
prospect of any one else, better qualified than myself
for the task, undertaking it.
I have been influenced, too, by the following con
sideration. My father's opinions were based upon
fixed principles, which, however he might at times
consent to modify their practical application,, he saw
no occasion to change, and most assuredly never com-

POSTSCBIPT TO PREFACE.
promised at any period of his career ; and I have
therefore thought, that in giving to the world even this
account, all incomplete and imperfect as I feel it to be,
of what he thought and said during the earlier years
of his public life, I should enable men to form a correct
judgment as to his principles of action, down even to
its close.
It is possible that, at some future time, these pages
may form the first volume, or rather form the
groundwork of the first volume, of a more complete
biography ; but, in their present shape, I must repeat,
they contain nothing more than is professed on the
title-page, — namely, " Some account of the Life and
Opinions of Lord Grey."
AprU, 1861.

CONTENTS.

CHAPTEE I.

PAGK

From first Entrance into Public Life to Termination of Mr.
Pitt's first Administration — 1786 to 1801 .

CHAPTEE IT.
1801 to 1806.
From the Foemation of Mr. Addington's Administration, in
1801, TO Mr. Pitt's Death, in January 1806 . . 60

CHAPTEE III.
From the Death of Mr. Pitt, and Formation op the Whig
Ministry, in 1806, to my Father's Removal to the House op
Lords, in 1807 . .... 106

CHAPTER IV.
From my Father's Removal to the House op Lords, in
November 1807, to the End of Session of 1809 . . 174

CHAPTER V.
From the Overture by Me. Perceval to the Whigs, in Sep
tember 1809, TO THE Commencement op the Regency, in
February 1811  226

CONTENTS.

CHAPTER VI.

PAGE

From the Commencement op the Regency in 1811 to the Ter
mination OP THE various NEGOTIATIONS POE A CHANGE OF
Government in 1812 ... . 278

CHAPTER VII.
From Closer Session op 1812 to the Separation op my Father
AND Lord Grenville in 1817 . 339

CHAPTER VIII.
Biographical Sketch ... . 385
Appendix ... ' . . 429

SOME ACCOUNT OF
THE LIFE AND OPINIONS
op
EARL OREY.

CHAPTER I.

Peom first Bnteancb into Public Life to Termination of Mr, Pitt's
FIEST Administration — 1786 to 1801.
Mt father, the eldest surviving son of General Sir
Charles, afterwards Earl Grey, was born at Fallodon,
the seat of his father, in Northumberland, on the 13 th
of March 1 764 ; and at the early age of six years
was sent to a preparatory school in Marylebone.
At this school, of which, in after life, he always
sp'jke with the utmost horror, he remained for three
years, and then completed his education in the usual
course at Eton and Cambridge.
That he was considered to have distinguished himself
at Eton we may assume from the fact of his having
been asked to contribute the Latin verses composed
by him at that sehool, to a publication which ap-

2 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
peared in 1795, under the title of the ' Musas Etonen-
ges ;'— and at Cambridge he obtained more than one
prize for Enghsh composition and declamation. But
he never had himself a good opinion of the system of
education pursued either at Eton or the University at
that time ; and used to say that almost all he knew
he had acquired for himself after leaving College.
On quitting Cambridge, and not being yet of age
when the general election took place in 1784, he
passed some time, on the Continent, travelling through
the south of France, Italy, and part of Germany, in
the suite of Henry Duke of Cumberland.
A vacancy, however, having occurred two years
afterwards in the representation of Northumberland,
he was returned, in July 1786, at the age of twenty-
two, for his native county. This seat he held for
twenty-one years ; until the dissolution of Parliament
following the dismissal of the ministry of which he
had formed a part, in 1807 ; when being unexpectedly
threatened with a contest, which the ' No Popery '
cry, got up against the members of that Government,
made it difiicult for him to support — at all events
without an expense that, iu his position, expecting
almost daily to be called to the House of Lords by
fhe death of his father, it would have been madness in
him to incur — ^he declined presenting himself for re
election. He made his maiden speech in the House of Com
mons in opposition to the address moved by Mr. Black-

LORD GREY. 3
burne to thank his Majesty for the Commercial Treaty
with France, negotiated by Mr. Pitt ; expressing a dis
trust of the French Government, which was at least
greatly modified in after years, when, as first Minister
of the Crown, he studiously and successfully cultivated
the most friendly relations between the two countries.
It may also be objected to that speech that the
opinions it avows are inconsistent with the now
recognised principles of sound political economy.
But questions of finance and commerce were never
much to his taste, and the opinions he then pror
fessed were those very generally entertained at the
time by men supposed to be most conversant with such
subjects. Be this, however, as it may, the effect of
that speech was at once to place him, young as he
was, in the foremost rank, amongst the orators of an
assembly rendered illustrious by the names of Fox,
Pitt, Burke, Sheridan, &c,
Mr. Addington (afterwards Speaker) thus describes
my father's first appearance : —
' We had a glorious debate last night upon the
' motion for an address of thanks to the King for
' having negotiated the Commercial Treaty, &c. . . A
' new speaker presented himself to the House, and
' went though his first performance with an ^clat
' which has not been equalled within my recollection.
' His name is Grey. He is not. more than twenty-
' two years of age ; and he took his seat (for North-
' umberiand) only in the present session. I do not
B 2

4 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' go too far in declaring" that in the advantage of
' figure, voice, elocution, and manner, he is not sur-
' passed by any member of the House ; and I grieve
' to say that he was last night in the ranks of Opposi-
' tion, from whence there is no chance of his being
' detached.'* In.this belief Mr. Addington was fully borne out
by the event ; for though, even some months after, Mr.
Fox declared in the course of debate that he ' did not
' yet consider Mr. Grey as a party man,' (expressing,
however, his hope that he would soon become so,)
my father does not appear himself to have hesitated
for a moment as to his future course. He attached
himself at once to that eminent man and the party of
which he was the chief, as the exponents of those
great principles of well-regulated and constitutional
liberty, from his allegiance to which he never, in the
course of a long public career, swerved for a single
instant. Devoting himself to the support of these principles
with aU the eagerness and energy of a thorough con
viction, and of an ardent and generous nature, he may,
in alter years, have felt reason to regret that he had
at times been hurried by his anxiety to promote them
into participation in measures, or into the adoption of
language, of which his maturer judgment disapproved ;
but it is given to few public men to be able to look
* Letter from Mr. Addington to his father, published in his Me
moirs.

LORD GREY. 5
back upon a political career extending over half a
century, with the satisfaction of feeling that the
principles to the support of which he had dedicated
himself at its commencement, had not only been con-
consistently adhered to by him throughout with an
ever-increasing conviction of their soundness, but
that their truth had been ultimately admitted by his
very adversaries; and that they had finally been
adopted by the nation at large, as those alone on
which any future Government could be constituted.
At no period of his life, however, could my father
be justly considered as a mere party man. With the
highest sense of the duties of men professing to belong
to the same party towards each other, and of the
necessity for the exercise of that forbearance and
moderation in urging individual opinions without
which he thought no body of independent members
could be kept together for any useful or practical pur
pose, he never came to the consideration of any great
question with a mind narrowed to mere party views ; —
that is to say, he was always far above adopting
any line of conduct with a view to mere party advan
tage, if not satisfied, at the same time, that it was
such as the true interests of the country demanded.
It has been well and truly remarked of him, ' that
' instead of lessening himself to the stature of a
'mere Whig, he would raise Whiggism to his own
level.'* * Notice of Lord Grey's Life in Monthly Chronicle.

(5 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
The immediate effect of his first speech, was, as
has been already mentioned, to rank him amongst the
foremost men in the House of Commons ; and he
was shortly afterwards named one of the managers
charged with conducting the impeachment of Warren
Hastings ; in which capacity he was intrusted with
the introduction, in Westminster Hall, of the charge
relating to the treatment of Cheyt Singh.
From this time till the dissolution of Mr. Pitt's
first Administration in 1801, he was in constant and
active Opposition. On the question of peace or war
in the then state of the Continent, and on those
affecting the domestic government of the country,
he was at all times diametrically opposed to that
Minister. During this period, as is well known, the revolu
tionary fever in France, with all its attendant horrors,
was at its height ; — exciting in its commencement, and
during its progress, hope or alarm in England, according
to the particular bias of men's minds. While, on the
one hand, encouraged and led by the example of
France, many Societies sprang up in England, assert
ing the wildest doctrines of the day, — as furious and
unreasoning a cry was raised, on the other, for
the adoption of the most violent and unconstitu
tional measures of coercion and repression ; — a cry
that was unfortunately only too successful, as the
measures which were consequently adopted were
only followed by the usual result of such a policy ;

LOED GEEY. 7
that, namely, of aggravating the mischief it was in
tended to abate.
If my father, not sharing in the anti-revolutionary
fever which prevailed amongst the adherents of Govern
ment, extending even to many of the leading Whigs,
denounced in strong language the course upon which
Ministers now entered ; if he even sympathised in the
earlier efforts of the French people to amend the
system of Government that had so long oppressed them ;
no one, not the most violent of the alarmists, not Mr.
Burke himself, could condemn more strongly than he
did the subsequent proceedings of the revolutionary
party in France. ' There was na man,' he said, in
the course of the discussions to which the events in
France gave rise, * who abhorred more than he did
^ their present Government. He thought the Govern-
^ ment of France was what it had been called by a
' right honourable friend of his (Mr. Fox), a furious
' and a rigid tyranny. Furious and rigid it certainly
' was, and the last form of Government under which
' he would wish to live. He had rather live under
' Caligula or Nero, than under the present Govern-
'ment of France.' And having, on a subsequent
occasion, been reminded of these words, he repeated :
' He was much obliged to the honourable gentleman
' who had done him the honour to remember his words.
' He had declared, and he would declare again, that
' he would rather live under the most despotic mo-
' narchy, nay even under the rule of the King of

8 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' Prussia, or the Empress of Eussia, than under the
' present Government of France.'*
In disapproving, therefore, entirely of the domestic
policy adopted by the Government under the circum
stances of the time, it was not that he sympathized in
any degree with those by whom the Societies above
alluded to were formed. On the contrary, no man
could disapprove of their proceedings more strongly
than he did. He was at all times opposed to any
extreme democratic changes in the constitution, and
many years . later, in writing to Lord Holland on the
subject of those who advocated such changes, he says,
'I was opposed to these men in 1792, and I am op-
' posed to them now.' We accordingly find, throughout
his political career, that the Eadical Party, even while
supporting his measures, evinced a strong spirit of
hostility to himself. And when he at length formed
the Administration by which his early principles were
carried into effect, the question of Parliamentary
Reform was no sooner settled than they became the
most inveterate and persevering opponents of his
Government. But he believed that the true way to meet and frus-
* The extracts given in the course of this Memoir from my father's
speeches, are all taken from the published Reports in Hansard. No
thing could in general be more unsatisfactory than the manner in which
reporting was conducted at this period, and it is sometimes difiicult
even to catch the meamng of what is given as a speech in Parliament.
Nor was my father in the habit, like many Members, of sending a cor
rected copy of his speeches as he spoke them, or intended to speak
them.

LOED GREY. 9
trate the designs of such men, and to give real strength
to the Government, and to the institutions of the
country, — was by the removal of glaring and acknow
ledged abuses ; and if, — after the famous quarrel in
the House of Commons between Mr. Fox and Mr.
Burke, ending in their final political separation, and in
the secession from the party of the alarmist WTiigs, —
if my father .then attached himself more zealously thau
ever to Mr. Fox, — if he even went beyond that states
man in his assertion of popular principles of Govern
mient, and in the steps which he took to support them,
— it may be fearlessly asserted that it was strictly in
a spirit — to use the expression he himself adopted
many years later in speaking of the principle on which
he had proposed the Eeform Bill of 1831 — a spirit
' conservative of the constitution.'
It was entirely in this spirit that he now joined
with other leading members of the Whig party in
what was named the ' Society of the Friends of the
People ;' a Society formed, not for the purpose of them
selves advocating revolutionary doctrines, but for that
of supporting those constitutional reforms and changes
which were needed for the removal of acknowledged
anomalies and abuses in our institutions, and which, if
effected, they believed would afford the best security
to the country against the designs of those who aimed
at the subversion of the institutions themselves.
The following leading members of the Whig party
were associated with him in this Society : —

10 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
Lords Lauderdale, Dacre, Kinnaird, Lord John
Eussell (the late Duke of Bedford), Hon. Thomas
Maitland, Hon. Thomas (afterwards Lord) Erskine,
Sir Philip Francis, Sir E. Throckmorton, Messrs.
Sheridan, Whitbread, Lambton, Dudley North, Cur-
wen, Tierney, Piggott (afterwards Solicitor-General),
Leach (afterwards Yice-ChanceUor of England), Eogers
(the poet). Mackintosh, George Byng, &c.
Mr. Fox, though not joining it himself, does not
appear to have discouraged its formation. On the
contrary, in writing to his nephew Lord Holland in
1795, he would seem to give a complete justification
of it : ' But among all the dangers,' he says, ' of
' which we have the option, I have no doubt that the
' right part of a man who means well to the country
' is to endeavour to rouse the people, before it becomes
' too late, to act by other means than those of force, by
' giving them leaders who mean well, to direct their efforts
' to such remedies to the present evils as are least likely to
' create confusion.^
Lord John Eussell, in the 2nd vol.. of his ' Life of
Fox,' p. 281, says, indeed, that Mr. Fox disapproved
of the formation of this Society, and that my father
joined it without consulting him. Still I found what
I say, as to Mr. Fox not discouraging its formation,
on what my father himself told me. During his last
illness, when no longer able to walk, he used to be
wheeled about the house in a chair, and on one occa
sion, when stopping, as he often did, before Mr. Fox's

LOED GEEY. 11
bust, and speaking of the influence he had held over
him, he added, ' Yet he did not always use it as he
' might have done — one word from him would have
' kept me out of all the mess of the " Friends of the
' People," but he never spoke it.' When I remarked
that, considering he only advocated as one of that
Society the principles to which he had given effect as
Minister, this was hardly to be regretted, he replied,
' that might be true, but there were men joined with
' them in that Society, whose views, though he did not
' know it at the time, were widely different from his
' own, and with whom it was not safe to have any
' communication.' On mentioning this conversation
to the late Lord Dacre, he told me he remembered
Mr. Fox used always to say he did not like to dis
courage the young ones.
My object, however, is less to discuss the prudence
or imprudence of the step, than to show the truly
honest and patriotic motives which alone influenced
my father in taking it. For this purpose I need only
quote the following explanation which he himself
gave ofthe principles and objects of the Association : —
' The fact was that observing an opinion was rising
' in the country that was likely to lead to danger if
' means to prevent it were not taken in time, a set of
' gentlemen, of whom he had the honour to be one, had
' thought the best possible means of preventing mis-
' chief was to look into the constitution, and to suggest
' the correction of such abuses as might be found to

12 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' exist in its practice, in order to take from its ene-
' mies the only great ground for their clamour, that
' the constitution was beautiful in theory, but corrupt
' in practice. . . Far was he or any gentlemen of the
' Association from meaning to do anything that could
' trench upon the constitution. Their object was to
' preserve and maintain it — an object for which he
' was wiUing to sacrifice everything that was most
' dear to him.'*
The petition adopted by this Society, and presented
to the House of Commons by Mr. Grey, will be found
at length in the Parliamentary history. Truths, now
long acknowledged to be such, are there stated in
plain and strong language ; but only party prejudice
can characterize the documents, as Mr, Adolphus does
in his history, as a 'manifesto in which terms of
' extreme contumely were feebly disguised by a flimsy
' veil of irony.'
It was as a member of this Association, and in
support of the views thus temperately and constitu
tionally declared, that my father now took up that
question with the success of which, forty years later,
his name must ever be identified. And it was under
somewhat sirailar circumstances, a revolution having
again overturned the Government in Prance, that he
ultimately, as first Minister of the Crown, proposed
and carried a measure of Parliamentary Eeform, in
* See page 247 for the declaration of principles issued by the Society,
and quoted by my father in a speech in the House of Lords in 1810.

LOED GEEY. 13
its main features and provisions, almost identical in
principle with that which he now brought forward as a
member of the 'Society of the Friends of the People,'
I must here explain, at the risk, perhaps, of being
thought unduly to anticipate the history of later
times, what I mean by saying that my father's name
must ever be identified with the success of the Reform
question. It is not that I wish to claim for him any
exclusive merit in ultimately procuring that success, or
to assert any pretensions on his part to be considered
the sole author of the measure which became law in
1832. The cause doubtless owes much to the perse
verance and ability of others, who supported it under
adverse circumstances with unflinching energy and
zeal ; and to the able assistance of those who were
united with him in the Government by which it was
at last effected. Above all, a large share of credit
belongs to Lord Althorp, who undertook the manage
ment of the Bill in Committee in the House of
Commons, and who met the persevering and elaborate
objections made to every detail with a patience and
industry that were beyond all praise. He had to under
go the labour of making himself master of all the facts
and statistical minutise on which the Bill was founded,
and to fight it through a Committee which lasted
longer than any upon record ; and this in addition to
all the work of his own heavy department.
But admitting the claims of others to the fullest
extent, I can by no means acquiesce in the justice of

14 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
entirely setting my father aside, when the question of
Eeforra is talked of, in order to give the whole credit
of the triumph that was then achieved, to younger
reforraers, who played, after all, but a subordinate
part in the final struggle. We have Lord John
Russell's own admission, on introducing the Bill on the
1st of March 1831, that my father laid down the prin
ciples on which the measure was to be founded, the
details of which were worked out by other members of
the Government. 'Although,' he said, 'I cannot
' pretend to be the author of the measure, neither can
' I say that I have been kept in ignorance of its
;' nature. The measure itself, after the nohh Lord who
' is at the head of the Govemment had formed it in his
' own mind, and communicated it to his coUeagues, was
' communicated to me, &c. . , . Sir, I regret that the
' noble Lord cannot by the law and usage of Pariia-
' ment be permitted to explain his measure to the
' House, in his own clear and intelligible language ;
' but as that is impossible, I trust the House will
' favour me with its indulgence, &c.'
And the fight once begun, it was to my father,
above all others, — to the skill and courage with which
he conducted it,— that the victory was due. Without
the firmness and, strange as it may sound in Tory ears,
the moderation he displayed in carrying the measure
through Parliament ; had he yielded on one side, to
the attempts of the Opposition to irapair the efficiency
of the raeasure ; or, on the other, had he allowed him-

LORD GEEY. 15
self to be driven by the clamour of the liberal press,
and of the more eager of the party, into a premature
and unnecessary exercise of the power conceded to
him by the King of creating peers ; the question
would, in all probability, either not have been settled
at all in 1832, and in 1848 we might, like the rest of
Europe, have had to deplore the evils and miseries of
a state of revolution, — or it would have been settled
only after a social struggle which would have placed
the very existence of the Empire in jeopardy, and
would have proved assuredly fatal to all well-regulated
and constitutional liberty.
As an instance of the pressure, to which I have
alluded above, put upon him when the success of the
Reform Bill seemed doubtful in 1832, I must here
quote a letter from the late Mr. Sydney Smith,
written to my mother during the crisis : —
'I am alarmed for Lord Grey. So are many
' others. Is there a strong probability, araounting
• almost to a certainty, that the Bill will be carried
' without a creation of Peers ? No. Then make them.
' But the King will not. Then resign. But if the King
' vnll create, we shall lose more than we gain, I doubt
' it. Many threaten who will not vote against the
' Bill. . . There is not a moment to lose. The charac-
' ter of Lord Grey is a valuable public possession.
' Lord Grey must say to his colleagues to-morrow :
« " Brothers,, the time draws near •, you must choose
' this day between good and evil," . . . " I am sure the

16 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' Bill will not pass without a creation ; it may pass
' with one. It is the only expedient for doing what
' from the bottom of my heart I believe the country
' requires, I will create, and create immediately, or
' resign," ... If you wish to be happy three months
' hence, create Peers. If you wish to avoid an old
' age of sorrow and reproach, create Peers. If you
' wish to retain my friendship — it is of no sort of con-
' sequence whether you create Peers or not ; I shall
' always retain for you the most sincere gratitude and
' affection, without the slightest reference to your poli-
' tical wisdom or your political errors ; and may God
' bless and support you in one of the most difficult
' moraents that ever occurred to any public man.'
The following note is added by my mother to the
above letter : — ' Many of Lord Grey's friends, as re-
' presented by Mr, S, Sraith, concurred in the opinions
' expressed in this letter, and the whole of the liberal
' press, the " Times " in particular, urged the neces-
' sity of creating Peers with alarming violence, and
' did not scruple to assert, that even the life of an old
' and timid man should be sacrificed for the good of
' the country ! And had the Bill been again thrown
' out, there is every probability that Lord Grey would
' have run considerable risk. Fully aware of this fact,
' it was therefore an act of no inconsiderable courage
' to resist the entreaties of his friends and the opinion
' of the public •, but the event justified the wisdom of
• his decision. Sincerely determined to carry the Bill

LOED GREY. 17
' if possible, he felt that his best chance of success was
' in resisting the clamours of his party, and the dan-
' gerous method proposed for meeting the difficulty.'
But it is time to return from a digression into which
the natural desire to vindicate my father's right to a
share at least of the credit attaching to the Reform
victory of 1832 has led me.
The success which has attended that measure —
strongly marked as it has been by the position main
tained by England when not only France, but the
whole Continent of Europe was again convulsed by
revolution in the year 1848 — is the best answer that
can be given to the objection, successfuly urged in
1792, against the policy recommended by the Whigs,
viz. : that the time was not fit for the consideration
of such questions.
In giving notice on the 30th of April 1792, ' that
' he should, in the course of next session, have the
' honour of submitting to the consideration of the
' House, a motion, the object of which was a Eeform
' in the representation of the people,' — my father pro
ceeded to say that, ' Abuses had been permitted to
' creep into the constitution through neglect, or had
' been introduced into it through corruption, and those
' abuses were of a nature so dangerous that they
' threatened the very existence of the constitution
' itself.' . . ' The times were critical, and the minds of
' the people agitated. It was to do away every cause
' of complaint, and to preserve the peace of the public
c

18 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' and the general tranquillity, that he wished a Reform
' to take place in the representation. In his mind it
' was a point of the utraost iraportance that the House
' should enjoy the good opinion of the public, and
' possess their confidence as a true representation of
' the people. . . The loss of that character might
' produce all thc miseries of civil commotion, with
' which God forbid this nation should ever bo afflicted.
' If there were those who wished to promote confusion
' and excite mischief he exceedingly regretted it. He
' disclaimed all connection with such persons, and
must ever reprobate their conduct. He was con-
' vinced, however, that the evils which threatened the
' constitution could only be corrected by a timely
' and temperate Reform ; and, in his mind, the measure
' demanded the serious consideration of every friend
' of his country, and would be found deserving oi his
' support.' Such was thc moderate and constitutional languagei
in which my father, as the organ in Parliament of the
Society of the Friends of the People, then advocated
the necessity of this great measure, and in a sirailar
tone of moderation (a tone from which he at no tirae
departed), he corresponded with such of the provin-*
cial associations in connection with the Society in
London, as applied to hira for advice. Of this the
following letter to the Secretary of the Society formed
at Norwich, may be taken as an example : —

lord grey. 19
' Sir, ' I HAVE been favoured with your letter, toge-
' ther with one for the Society of the " Friends of the
' People," which I have sent to London to be laid
' before the Committee. . . . You are pleased to
' desire my instructions as to what is proper to be
' done. The best I can give you are contained in the
' different publications of the "Friends of the People,"
' which I have desired to be sent to you, and which
' contain a fair exposition of our principles, and of
' the means by which we -wish to carry them into
' effect. Above all let me recommend to you modera-
' tion, both in your views and in your language. It is
' thus that you will defeat the enemies of liberty, whose
' chief advantage consists in representing every pro-
' posal for Reform as tending to subvert the constitu-
' tion. I shall be happy at all times to receive from
' you such communications as you may be pleased to
' honour me with, and to assist you by every means
' in my power, so long as your proceedings shall be
' temperately and wisely conducted, in endeavouring
' to obtain such a measure of Reform as will correct
' the abuses without impairing the forms or violating
' the principles of the constitution.
' I have the honour, &c.,
'C. Gret.'
But strictly constitutional as were the principles on
which this Society was founded and the objects which
c 2

20 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
it had in view, and studiously moderate as was the
language in which those views were advocated, it was
always the policy of the Government to seek to
confound it with the other more violent and really
revolutionary Societies which no doubt also existed.
Contemporary historians, attached for the most part
to the Tory party, have followed this example ; and
nothing can be generally more unfair or erroneous than
the impression which has consequently been created as
to the principles and objects of this Society. It may be
doubted, indeed, whether, considering the circumstances
of the tirae, and what was afterwards shown to be the
character and designs of sorae ofthe members, its forma
tion was altogether a prudent measure; and on the
latter ground especially, my father himself, in later
years, as I have already mentioned, saw reason to
regret the share he had taken in it. It is also certain
that it tended to widen the breach already existing in
the great Whig party. But numerically weak as the
Opposition already was, it scarcely seems that the
immediate effect of this Society could have been of
much importance one way or the other; and on the
other hand, in its ultimate consequences, when the
principles on which the Society was founded achieved
their final triumph in 1830-32, there can be no doubt
that my father, as leader of the great Reform move
raent at the latter period, derived additional strength
from the circurastance, acknowledged by the most
inveterate of his opponents, that he was only giving

LORD GREY. 21
effect, as Minister, to the policy which he had con
sistently and unflinchingly advocated, through good
report and evil report, from the time when, forty years
before, he had first agitated the question of Reform as
the organ of the * Friends of the People.'
In 1793, in pursuance of the notice which he had
given, my father brought forward his motion for
referring the petition of the ' Friends of the People,'
praying for Parliamentary Reform, to a committee.
' He well knew,' he said, ' the difficulty he should
' have to encounter in the argument as to the danger
' of the times. This indeed was a never-failing argu-
' ment, in times of war and in times of peace. If our
' situation happened to be prosperous, it was then
' asked whether we could be more than happy or more
' than free ? In the season of adversity, on the other
' hand, all reform or innovation was deprecated, from
' the pretended risk of increasing the evil and pressure
' of our situation. . . . From all this it would ap-
' pear the time for Reform never yet had come, and
' never would come.' In the course of his speech on
this occasion he added in a prophetic spirit, ' that he
' and his friends had published last year their opinions
' on this subject, and credit would some time or other
' be given them for it.' That credit has at length
been given. The principles of progressive Reform
are now, we may say, universally adopted ; but at the
time we are writing of, Ministers did not appeal in
vain to the fears of the House. Under the terror

22 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
then inspired by the proceedings in France, the danger
of bringing forward such questions at such a period
was successfully urged, and the motion was rejected
by a vast majority, only forty-one members being
found in the House of Commons, after a two-days'
debate, to vote in its &vour. That Reform might at
this time have been safely conceded, my father thus
records his opinions in a letter, written in November
1793, to a friend in Northumberland: 'I am more
' convinced than ever,' he writes, ' that a Eeform in
' Parliament might now be peaceably effected. " Mais
' cet effet tient a la minute, et dans peu il ne sera
' peut-^tre plus temps de regarder sa montre." . , .
' I am afraid that we are not wise enough to profit by
' experience, and what has occasioned the ruin of
' other Governments will overthrow this — a perse-
' verance in abuse until the people, maddened by
' excessive injury, and roused to a feeling of their
' own strength, will not stop within the limits of mo-
' derate reformation,'
'Things grow every day more unpromising,' he
again writes to the same friend, in March 1794, 'and
' the high-prerogative doctrines of the Government on
' one side, and the violence of those on the other
' whose conduct I do not commend, but whose temper
' I cannot much wonder at, seem to threaten an
' alarming crisis,'*
* Letters to Thomas Bigge, Esq., kindly communicated to me by
his son.

LORD GREY. 23
Failing in all his endeavours, renewed in succeeding
sessions, to have the subject of Parliamentary Eeform
referred to the consideration of a Committee, my
father, in 1797, brought forward himself a specific
plan. But in 1797 the same fears whieli had hitherto
indisposed men's minds to the entertaining of such a
question still prevailed. They still saw confusion and
revolution in every proposal for any change or im
provement in our institutions, however constitutional
the proposal might bc, and however temperate the
tone in which it was advocated ; and it was easy for
Ministers, taking advantage of these fears, to defeat
all such proposals, as tending to inevitable anarchy
and confusion, such as existed in France. The pro
posed measure was consequently rejected by a majority
of two hundred and fifty-six to ninety-one.
Equally unavailing was the opposition which my
father strenuously offered to what he considered the
false system adopted by Government ; that, namely,
of endeavouring to check revolutionary principles by
measures only of coercion and repression. The true
way, he argued, to avert danger, was to remove any
just cause of complaint; while the opposite course,
which alone seemed to be relied upon by Ministers
for the maintenance of tranquillity, could scarcely fail
to produce the very evils against which their legisla
tion was directed. ' If the conduct of any set of men,'
he said, ' was calculated to excite insurrection, it was
' that of Ministers, who, by proclamations calumniating

24 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' whole descriptions of men as seditious, and announcing
' insurrections that never existed, filled the minds of
* the people with false alarras, and taught every man
' to distrust, if not to hate, his neighbour.' ' And
' certainly,' he repeated upon a similar occasion a few
years later, ' recourse ought not to be had to measures
' of terror. He was convinced that such a system
' would create that dissatisfaction and jealousy which
' had produced such fatal effects in other countries.'
Let rae here state in Mr. Fox's words, the principles
of the policy advocated by hiraself and that portion
of the Whig party which, with my father, still ad
hered to him : —
'It may be asked,' he said, 'what would I propose
' to do in times of agitation like the present ? I will
' answer openly. If there is a tendency in the
' Dissenters to discontent, because they conceive
' themselves to be unjustly suspected, and cruelly
' calumniated, I would instantly repeal the Test
' and Corporation Acts, and take from them, by such
' a step, all cause of complaint. If there were any
' persons tinctured with a republican spirit, because
' they thought the representative Govemment was
' more perfect in a republic, I would endeavour to
' amend the representation of the Commons, to show
' that the House of Comraons, though not chosen by
' all, should have no other interest than to prove itself
' the representative of all. If there were men dissatis-
' fied in Scotland or Ireland on account of exemptions

LOED GREY, 25
' and disabilities, of unjust prejudices and cruel re-
' strictions, I would repeal the penal statutes, which
' are a disgrace to our law books. If there were
' other complaints of grievances, I would redress them
' where they were really proved ; but above all, I
' would constantly, and cheerfully, and patiently
' listen,' Every one will judge for himself, according to his
peculiar bias, whether the policy recommended by the
Opposition, or that pursued at this time, by the
Government, is the true policy to follow under such
circumstances as the country was then placed in.
Those who support the former may, however, be
allowed to point, with some degree of confidence, to
the result, which followed the course pursued by my
father's Government in 1830 — 33, when he had an
opportunity of carrying into practice the principles he
now advocated in vain. The throne of France had
again been overthrown by a revolution, which had
extended to Belgium, and which had found its usual
echo amongst the disaffected of all countries; and
under the excitement caused by the events on the
Continent, (rendered more dangerous, as it was, by
the existence of a considerable amount of distress, and
consequent discontent amongst the labouring classes
at home,)* revolutionary and republican doctrines
* The feeling in London was such, that the Duke of Wellington had
thought it necessary to advise the King not to pay an intended visit to
the City ; whilst in the agricultural districts incendiarism prevailed to
a fearful extent.

26 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
were rife through the land; and political unions,
proclaiming the wildest theories of Government, sprang
up on all sides. Great was the alarm they occasionedj
and strong the pressure put upon Government to
induce it to adopt energetic measures for their repres
sion. But though, my father was always prepared,
by a vigorous exertion of the existing powers of the
law, to uphold its authority, and to punish its viola
tion, he steadily refused to have recourse to extra
ordinary means, and, adhering to the conciliatory
policy he had advocated in 1792, the danger which
had been apprehended from these bodies passed away,
and even those who had been the most alarmed, and
the most claraorous for stroug measures, afterwards
admitted the wisdom of his decision.
But far different was the course pursued by Mr.
Pitt's Government in 1792, and the following years.
Supported by immense majorities in Parliament,-
Ministers obtained a suspension of the Habeas Corpus
Act ; various enactments were passed, giving a wider
construction to charges of treason and sedition ; pro
clamations were issued against seditious meetings, &c.
But when, encouraged by the support they thus re
ceived in Parliament, they endeavoured to give effect
to their coercive measures, and under the new inter
pretation of treason. Home Tooke, Hardy, Thelwall,
&c, &c,, were in October 1794, brought to trial at the
Old Bailey, they no longer met with the same success.
The prosecutions thus instituted by the Attorney-

LORD GREY. 27
General, resulted, as political prosecutions of this
nature generally have done in England, in the ac
quittal of all the prisoners.
' I have written all the news,' my father writes to
my mother, ' to Mrs. Ponsonby, or rather have told
' her that there is nothing new. The only thing I
' have omitted, is the arraignment of the prisoners for
' high treason this morning at the Old Bailey. They
' all pleaded not guilty . . .
' Home Tooke made a speech on the subject, which
' he introduced by saying, " My lord, you as yet do
' not know what imprisonment is." When he was
' asked, as is usual, how he would be tried ? He
' shook his head, and said, "I would be tried by God
' and my country ". , . The first trial, which will be
'Hardy's, comes on on Tuesday. I believe I shall
' attend it in order to learn how to conduct myself
' when it comes to my turn. You see by these new
' constructions of treason, they have found a much
' better way of disposing of obnoxious persons, than
' by sending them to Botany Bay ; and one which
' will save both you and me a great deal of trouble.
' I am not, however, very ambitious of being classed
' even with Algernon Sydney.'
My father, again writing from the Old Bailey, where
he attended these trials, denounces strongly the ' new
' constractions of treason under which no man was
' safe,' and the 'shocking scenes of infamy' exhibited
in the examination of the Government spies, ' I have

23 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' no power,' he says, ' nor do I believe the English
' language affords words sufficiently strong, to express
' my abhorrence of the whole proceeding. If this
' man ' (Hardy, who was first brought to the bar) ' is
' hanged, there is no safety for any one. Innocence
' no longer affords protection to a person obnoxious to
' those in power, and I do not know how soon it may
' corae to my turn,' * And in another letter he says,
' I am writing from the bench with a judge at my
' elbow, who I am not quite sure does not think I
' ought rather to be in Mr, Hardy's place at the bar.
' I went last night,' he adds, ' with Sheridan and Lau-
' derdale, during an interval of the trial, to see Home
' Tooke in Newgate, I always disliked him, and
' never before met him but in contest ; but the oppres-
' sion and persecution of which he is the victim, make
' me forget all that is past,' Again he says, ' So hor-
' rible a scene of perjury as was exhibited last night
' raakes one- blush for the depravity of human nature.
' But what shall we say of those who can employ such
' instruments, to whose means of seduction, which poor
' men often cannot resist, these horrors are owing?'
, , , * Such have been in general,' he adds, ' the last
' efforts of expiring Governments, and they only acce-
' lerate the conclusion. God grant that the effect
' which experience proves, in most countries, to have

* Wherever, as frequently hfippens, I quote letters without saying to
whom they are addressed, it is to be understood that they are to my
mother. >

LORD GREY. 29
' followed from such causes, may not happen in this, —
* I think the whole proceeding equally wicked and im-
' politic, and these men, alive or dead, who are now
' under trial, will be more dangerous than they were
' before,' It was long, however, before our Ministers learnt
the lesson which the failure of these trials was calcu
lated to teach — that popular discontent is not to be
successfully met by suspensions of the Habeas Corpus
Act and by prosecutions for high treason. And it was
not till many years later, after repeated failures on
the part of a Tory Government to stifle the voice of
the people by such means, that a Whig Administration
was at length formed under my father, vindicating by
the success of their measures in restoring tranquillity
to a disturbed country, the soundness of the principles
of Government which he and his friends had so long,
in Opposition, advocated in vain.
In 1798 my father was summoned to Maidstone as
a witness to character on behalf of Arthur O'Connor,
who, with Dr, O'Coigley and others, were tried for high
treason in consequence of their supposed connection
with the Irish rebellion. This was a very different
case from that of the English agitators, to whpse trials
allusion has already been made. In their case no
doubt could exist of the treasonable nature of the de
signs of the Irish rebels, and the only question could
be as to how far Mr, O'Connor and the other prisoners
were concerned iu them, ' You will probably hear,'

30 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
he writes to my inother, ' before this reaches you, of
'O'Connor's acquittal .... This is all the good I
' have to tell you, for what will you say of the
' huraanity and justice of the Duke of Portland ' (then
Horae Secretary), ' when I tell you that there was a
' warrant in Court, signed by hira, to take O'Connor
' on another charge of high treason ! Apprehensive
' ofthis, as soon as sentence of death had been passed
* on O'Coigley, O'Connor stepped over the dock, in
' hopes that he was legally discharged, and raight get
' away before the raessengers could seize him. They
' immediately rushed forward, calling out to stop iim,
' as they had another warrant. Some of his friends
' endeavoured to obstruct . them, and this for sorae
' minutes created a great confusion in the Court, which
' ended by O'Connor's being seized by the messengers.
' He then addressed the Court, and said he would
' rather be consigned to the same fate as O'Coigley, and
' suffer death iramediately, than drag out an existence
' under such continued persecution, . , . He is to be
' removed immediately to Ireland, I suppose to be
' tried there, where, I suppose, the Duke of Portland
' and his associates think they raanage things better.'
O'Connor was acquitted, as above-mentioned. Dr.
O'Coigley was convicted, and afterwards executed.
' And to say the truth,' my father says, in writing of the
latter, ' he deserves his fate,' But against the system
of government in Ireland which had led to the out
break, his voice was raised as loudly as it was against

LORD GREY. , 31
that which he so long combated in vain in England ;
unfortunately, with as little effect, ' Alas !' he writes
on the 23rd of May 1798, in speaking of Ireland,
' what can we do ? We have no means of obtaining
' redress. But, I' confess, against those who have I
' begin to feel almost as much indignation as against
' the active authors of our calamities.' And again in
July of the same year :* ' Bad as the public accounts
' are,' he says, ' they are not worse than I expected, or
' than I shall continue to expect, so long as that hor-
' rible system, to which I for one shall ever ascribe
' the present revolt, continues to be acted on. We
' used all the efforts we could to give some check to
' it, and I really thought that by the last debate in
' the House of Commons we had made at least such
' an impression with respect to the conduct of Lord
' Clare as would probably have occasioned his removal
' from office. ... In the House of Lords, however, a
' very different tone was assumed, and put an end to
' all these speculations. From that moment all hopes
' of any change, either in the councils or system of
' Ireland, ceased in my mind, and with them all hopes
' of preserving for any length of time the connection
' of the two countries. ... I for one,' he proceeds,
' cannot rejoice in the accounts that are called good.
* Even in the view of our Ministers, who rest for the
' suppression of the revolt upon the use of unqualified
' force alone, I cannot think them so good as they
* Letter to Mrs. Ponsonby, July 11, 1798,

32 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' would make us believe, ... To me, however, who
' think the use of the scourge and the bayonet will
' only create fresh provocation, and that though you
' may gain victories, victories will not gain the peo-
' pie, the accounts published every day in the Govern-
' ment papers furnish only fresh matter of despondency
' and dismay.'
While parties were thus at issue on the subject of
our doraestic policy, the progress of events had also
involved the decision by this country of the question
of peace or war. Several discussions on the same
subject had already taken place, in which ray father
took an active part ; first, on the occasion of a dispute
with Spain, respecting certain occurrences in Nootka
Sound; and afterwards, with respect to the circum
stances under which an armament had been prepared
for possible hostilities against Russia. The details of
these disputes would now be of little interest, and they
are only referred to here in so far as their discussion
afforded my father an opportunity of explaining the
general principles which invariably guided him on
similar questions, and more particularly on that (of
constant recurrence for so many years), of the nature
of our relations with the French Republic and Empire.
On the question of peace or war, he invariably sepa
rated the consideration of the measures necessary for
the efficient conduct of a war, if war there was to be,
from that of the conduct of the Govemment which had
led to it. To inquire into the latter, he considered

LOED GREY. 33
the special privilege and even duty of Parliament.
Nor could the fear, or indeed the certainty, of having
his motives misconstrued or misrepresented, induce
him to forego the privilege, or deter him from the per
formance of the duty.
Having given his hearty concurrence to the address
moved by Mr, Pitt, to assure His Majesty of the
zealous and effectual support of the Commons, should
the dispute with Spain unfortunately lead to hostilities,
he afterwards made several motions for the production
of papers to explain the state of our relations with that
country. He admitted, to the fullest extent^ the wis
dom of our institutions, in giving to the Crown the
prerogative of making peace or war ; but he com
bated on every occasion the doctrine by which it was
sought to shelter ministerial responsibility under the
shadow of that prerogative, and insisted strongly on
the right of the House of Commons to full information,
' As such a motion,' he said, in allusion to one he
had made in this view, ' niight be construed as if it
' were designed to embarrass Government and impede
' their measures, he found it necessary to declare, that
' no man felt more strongly for the honour and dignity
' of the British nation than he did. National honour
* was thought a visionary thing by some, but he hardly
' imagined it would be professed in that House to be
' so. Every nation ought to be careful of that honour ;
t ought not to be guilty of one single mean submis
sion, lest such submission should countenance other
D

'1

34 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' attacks upon its honour, a vigorous maintenance
' of which was the most likely means of preserving the
' blessings of peace,'*
' No raan applauded more than he did,' he observed,
upon another occasion, ' the wisdora of the Legislature
' in giving to the Executive Power the separate right
' of negotiating all treaties of alliance, and of war and
' peace. No man felt the principle more strongly or
"acknowledged its value more gratefully. It was to
' that principle, maintained and supported by the
' House, that we owed our honour, and the rank we
' held araongst the nations of Europe. But if this
' principle was so sacred, how were we to secure it
' inviolate ? Where were we to look for the preserva-
' tion of this power frora abuse, but to Parliaraent ?'
. . , 'It was a first principle, in that House, to
' inquire, when inquiry was safe, and raight be adopted
', without the sraallest degree of danger.'f And again,
on a subsequent occasion: 'He could not sit down,'
he said, ' without taking notice of those doctrines
' of confidence which were every day carried to a
' greater extent, and which converted the House of
' Commons into what was little better than the Parlia-
• ment of Paris before the late Revolution. If this
' doctrine of confidence was still extended, that House
' would soon serve no other purpose than merely to
' approve and register the acts of the King's Ministers.'
* May 12, 1790.
t Speech on moving for Papers relative to the Convention with
Spain, Deo. 13, 1790.

LOED GEEY. 35
. . . 'They were desired to give the Minister full
' credit for everything he had proposed ; they were to
' act on his bare word. This, he contended, was no
' part of the necessary confidence due to the executive
' Government.' . , . ' He had not the smallest objec-
' tion to the Royal prerogative ; and particularly to
' that part of it which enabled the Crown to make
' peace and war, alQd to manage foreign negotiations ;
' but he thought they were the best friends of that
' prerogative who wished to confine it within proper
' limits.'* And in the course of another debate, he
again asserted ' the right of the House of Commons — a
' right not to be defeated by new-fangled doctrines of
' confidence or prerogative,' . . . ' A right in tbat
' House to inquire into the justice, policy, and wisdom
' of a war, before involving the country in expence in
' support of it.'t
' He hoped,' he once more repeated — on moving for
papers relative to the war between Russia and the
Porte — •' he hoped that the House would never be so
, ' attached to a system of blind confidence in Adminis-
' tration, or so remiss in the discharge of its first and
' most sacred duty, as to neglect all inquiry. This
' was now the third time he had come forward to move
' for the production of papers, and no ill success should
' discourage him from persisting in what he considered
* Speech on moving Resolutions respecting the Preparations for a
War with Eussia, April 12, 1791.
t Speech on moving for information respecting the cause of the pre
sent armament, June 2, 1791.
d2

36 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' to be his duty. First, when he moved for papers on
' the subject of the Spanish armament, it was then
' urged as an objection, the necessity which existed for
' secrecy, and the danger of producing papers pending
' a negotiation. Secondly, when he had taken an
' opportunity of renewing that motion, when called
' upon for a vote of approbation, it was found that
' though the negotiation was over, the reign of confi-
' dence had not ceased,' , . . ' Thus with confidence
' pending negotiations, and confidence after their con-
' elusion, the Minister appeared to have got a general
' indemnity.' , . . ' The question was, whether they
' should, on that occasion act as became the honest
' representatives of a free people, or like the syco-
' phants of the Crown, and the flatterers of the people.
' He rerainded the House of Her Imperial Majesty's
' answer to the arrogant deraands of the right honour-
' able gentleman. She had said that there was a duty
' which she owed to her subjects, and that she was
' bound to convince them that their blood and treasure
' had neither been wantonly nor unnecessarily ex-
' pended. He lamented that it should be necessary
' to quote the opinion of a despotic monarch, who well
' knew that absolute as her power was, as her subjects
' theraselves confessed it to be, and extensive as were
' her dominions, the existence of the one, and the
' integrity of the other, depended on opinion. She
' well knew that in this country, obedience to the
' Govemraent implied protection to the subject, and

LORD GREY. 37
' it was incumbent on that House to take up her
' language, and to say that there was a duty which
' they owed to their constituents, and that they were
' bound to convince them that their treasure had not
' been wantonly or unnecessarily expended.'
It has not been my object in this memoir to enter
into the history of the particular events of the time,
further than as they serve to illustrate the general
principles on which my father based his political
opinions. Otherwise it might not have been with
out interest, considering the late war in which we
have been engaged with Russia, to consider in some
detail the causes which had almost led us into a
quarrel with the Empress Catherine in 1791, and from
which, indeed, we only escaped by the abandonment
of the pretensions we had at first put forward.
Amongst other points that we had at first insisted on^
was the restoration of Ocksakow (a fortress on the
right bank of the Dnieper, and opposite Kinburn) to
the Turks. We yielded to its retention by Russia, as
well as to the other demands of the Empress, whose
remarks, quoted above, had reference especially to
this object. The dispute respecting the possession
of this fortress, gives a good measure of the advance
made by Russia in the East since 1791.
On the general question of peace and war my father
had thus expressed his opinion :— ' There were some
' truths,' he said, ' which appeared to be so clear and
' evident that no man was disposed to dispute them.

38 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' Amongst these, he conceived, ought to be reckoned
' the just causes for going to war,' . , , 'He should
' raaintain this proposition, that the only just cause of
' war originated in the principle of self-defence ; and
' no war could be justified on the grounds (to use a
' fashionable phrase) of political expediency, whatever
' the consequences of it raight be, and however profit-
' able and advantageous it might turn out to the State,
' The principle of self-defence, therefore, was the sole
' ground on which a war could be justified. The
' cases in which a war was just, he conceived, might
' be reduced to three heads : — First, when it was
' undertaken to redeem a right forcibly withheld, and
' to which we had an irresistible claira ; secondly, in
' providing for future safety ; and the last, a right of
' repelling anunjust attack. These,' he said, ' were the
' only three causes that could justify any war, except
' another, which might be included under the third
' head, and that was, where an ally had been unjustly
' attacked. He laid particular stress upon the words,
' unjustly attacked, not being willing to admit that
' when an ally was an aggressor, and refused to make
' reparation, the nation with whora he was in alliance
' was obliged to support him. A nation was bound
' to support an ally only in the case of an unjust attack,
' and even then only according to the specific meaning
' of the treaty entered into between them. The only
' three causes, therefore, for going to war were, to
' redeem a right, to provide against danger, and to

LOED GEEY. 39
' repel an attack ; and any principle of supposed policy
' that stood in opposition to these three causes, and
' did not come within one or other of them, could
' never be a just cause of war. Omnia quce defendi,
' repeti, repelli possunt. These were the words of
' CamiUus to his soldiers, and were full of wisdom,
' policy, and justice.' , . , ' Perhaps he might be
' told that he had admitted that a country was bound,
' for its own safety, to guard against the dangerous
'aggrandizement of any one power. This was cer-
' tainly true ; but he must be understood to suppose
' that that aggrandizement was aimed at by violent
' and unjust means ; that it was clear and obvious ;
' that the danger arising from it was evident ; and the
' not providing for it in the best way in our power
' would be to neglect our own safety. The country
' which failed to watch and oppose the aggrandizement
' of another that became dangerous, would neglect its
' own interest. But he could not see the necessity of
' that superfluous caution which was alarmed at every
' slight appearance, and anxious to guard against every
' remote contingency,' . . . ' It was on this principle,
' on the first view of it, that the balance of power of
' Europe had been founded,' . , . 'To that system
' and to the preservation of it, he had heard the
' epithets of wild and romantic applied. The balance
' of power in Europe was, indeed, a matter of the
' greatest importance. He would not tell the peasant
' that this balance was wild and romantic. He would

40 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
* not seek to convince hira that the object which he
' incurred so many burthens to support was a mere
' illusion. If it was necessary, he would advise the
' peasant to subrait to new burthens in order to pre-
' serve that balance frora any real danger. If the war
' was just in principle, and necessary in policy, he would
' tell hira that, as a raember of the State, he was in-
' terested in its welfare, and that his sufferings might be
' misfortunes, but were not injuries.'* Mr. Adolphus,
in his history, says of this speech, that ' Mr. Grey re-
' peated an old observation on the unimportance of
' the balance of power to the poor tenant of a thatched
' cottage ! !'
In accordance with the principles thus declared, ray
father warmly seconded the endeavours of Mr. Fox, in
1793, to prevent this country fi-ora being hurried,
as he thought unnecessarily, into a war with the
French Republic.
The main principle on which they acted was, as
explained by Mr, Fox,. ' that it was the true policy
' of every nation to treat with the existing Govern-
' ment of every other nation with which it had relative
' interests, without inquiring or regarding how that
' Govemment was constituted, or by what means those
' who exercised it came into power,' And many years
later my father stoutly asserted the same principle,
in a speech against the policy of resting the renewal of
the war with France, after the return of Napoleon
* Speech on Preparations for a War with Eussia, April 12, 1791.

LOED GEEY. 41
from Elba, on personal objections to that individual
and his Government. ' The nature of a Government,'
he then argued, as Mr Fox argued at the com
mencement of the war with the Republic, ' might jus-
' tify you in demanding securities for your own safety,
' which you might not think it necessary to require
' were that Government otherwise constituted, but
' could not of itself be deemed a sufficient cause of
' war, unless the securities which you might think its
' existence rendered necessary, were refused,'
He now placed his opinions on this subject, as they
applied to the war of 1793, on record, in the form of
an address to the Crown,* in which, after professing
the attachment of the Commons to the Sovereign and
the family on the throne, and to the Constitution —
their zeal, at the same time, for thekin terests and honour
of the nation — and their readiness at all times 'to
' support His Majesty in any measures which a due
' observance of the faith of treaties, the dignity of the
' Crown, or the security of his dominions might compel
' him to undertake,' — he proposed fiirther to declare :
' that it was no less their resolution than it was
' their duty to second his efforts in the war thus fatally
' commenced, so long as it shall continue ; but we deem
' it a duty equally incumbent on us, to solicit His
' Majesty's attention to those reasons or pretexts, by
' which his servants have laboured to justify a conduct
' on their part, which we cannot but consider as having
* February 21, 1792.

42 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' contributed in a great measure to produce the present
' rupture,' . . . ' We will not dissemble our opinion
' that the Decree of the National Convention of France,
' on the 19th Nov, 1792, was in agreat raeasure liable
' to the objections urged against it ; but we cannot
' adrait that a war upon the single ground of that
' Decree, unaccompanied by any overt acts by which
' we or our allies might be directly attacked, would be
'justified, as necessary and unavoidable. Certainly
' not, unless upon a regular deraand made by His
' Majesty's Ministers of security and explanation , . .
' the French had refused to give to His Majesty such
' explanation and security.' . . , ' The grounds upon
' which His Majesty's Ministers have advised hira to
' refuse the renewal of intercourse with the existing
' Government of France, appear to us neither justified
' by the reason of the thing itself, nor by the usage of
' nations, nor by any expediency arising from the pre-
' sent state of circumstances,' , , , ' Deploring as we
' have ever done (the address proceeded), the melan-
' choly event which has lately happened in France
' (the execution of the King), it would yet have been
' sorae consolation to us, to have heard that the power-
' ful interposition of the British nation on this subject
' had at least been offered, although it should have
' been unfortunately rejected. But instead of receiving
' such consolation frora the conduct of His Majesty's
' Ministers, we have seen thera, with extreme astonish-
' raent, employing as an incentive to hostilities, an

LOED GEEY. 43
' event which they had made no effort to avert by
' negotiation. This inaction they could only excuse
' on the principle that the internal conduct of nations
' (whatever may be our opinion of its morality) was
' no proper ground for interference or remonstrance
' from foreign States ; a principle from which it must
' still more clearly follow, that such internal conduct
' could never be an admissible or justifying reason for
' war. We cannot refrain from observing, that such
' frequent allusions as have been made to an event
' (confessedly no ground of rupture), seemed to us
' to have arisen from a sinister intention to derive from
' the humanity of Englishmen, popularity for measures
' which their deliberate judgment would have repro-
' bated, and to influence the most virtuous sensibilities
' of His Majesty's people into a blind and furious zeal
' for a war of vengeance,' * This address being moved
merely as a matter of form, in order that the opinions
thus expressed might be recorded on the journals of
the House, led to no discussion, and was negatived with
out a division.
But while condemning the policy of going to war on

* Prom a letter from Lord Grenville to Lord Auckland, of the 6th
November 1792, published in the correspondence of Lord Auckland,
it wonld appear that the war now entered upon, was indeed a war
prompted, as my father said, rather by personal feehng, than by
national policy. None of the advocates for maintaining peace with the
French Repubhc, speak more strongly in favour of non-intervention
and of keeping ' ourselves out of the struggle upon the Continent,' than
does Lord Grenville in this letter. — Correspondence of WiUiam, 1st Lord
Auckland, vol. ii., pp. 464, 465.

44 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
the grounds stated by Ministers, my father repudiated
in the strongest manner the imputation of being insen
sible to the honour of-the country, or of counselling any
course incompatible with it. ' It was asked,' he said,
in the course of the discussions on the subject of peace
with France, ' was Great Britain to sneak and crouch
' to France ? No ! neither sneak nor crouch, but
' negotiate like a great and high-minded nation ; and if
' redress was refused for any injury offered, then de-
' nounce war,' . . . ' We were not to be hurried away
' by our indignation against the perpetrators of the
' crimes coramitted in France ; we are to decide on
' national policy, not on personal feeling.' , . . ' I
' will raaintain our treaties with our allies, but first I
' will advise them, if necessary, to concede a point
' that it may be beneficial to concede, and let it be
' shown that we have done all in our power to bring
' the French to an amicable arrangement, and then I
' may yield to a war, but still with reluctance.'*
And now, as ever, he upheld the necessity, if war
should unhappily ensue, of the most vigorous prosecu
tion of it. ' If we must have a war,' he said, ' it must
' be a war of vigour and exertion, not such a petty
' warfare as sorae gentlemen seera to think, and the
' Minister in his speech frora the Throne would in-
' sinuate.'t * Speech on Mr. Pox's motion for sending a Minister to Paris, Dec.
15, 1792.
t Ibid.

LORD GREY. 45
Acting upon the principle thus declared, the Oppo
sition showed every readiness to give the Minister all
the means necessary for an energetic prosecution of the
war, and Mr. Fox emphatically declared he would have
voted for 40,000 seamen as readily as for the 25,000
demanded by the Government. With this they were
taunted in the course of these debates, particularly by
Mr. Burke, in answer to whom my father said : ' The
' right honourable gentleman had stated it to be a
' new case that any member should vote for the sup-
' port of the war and at the same time condemn that
' war ; but had the right honourable gentleman never
' been himself in such a situation ? Had he not sup-
' ported the war against America, though he threat-
' ened Ministers with an impeachment for involving
' the country in it ? It was the duty of that House
' to support a war whenever we were involved in it,
' but it was also their duty to examine the measures
' of Ministers, and if they were found to be measures
' of aggression, it was their duty to address the Crown
' for their removal and punishment, and to hold out
' such honourable terms of peace to the enemy as
' might induce them to end the war.'*
Surely the extracts above given from my father's
speeches at the commencement of the revolutionary
war are a sufficient answer to the accusations with
which it was the invariable practice of Ministers and
* Speech on the Debate on Mr. Pox's Resolutions against the War
with France, Feb. 18, 1793,

46 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
their partisans to meet the arguments of those who
condemned either the policy of the war itself or the
manner in which it was conducted, — of being insensible
to the honour of the country or of endeavouring to
thwart and erabarrass the Governraent in its endea
vours to raaintain it.
Mr. Fox, the great leader of the Whigs, was more
particularly the object of such attacks,* and a declara
tion from Lord Sheffield that he ' felt asharaed of the
' enthusiasm he had once felt for that right honour-
' able gentleman,' gave my father an opportunity of
proclaiming, on the contrary, ' that if the enthusiasra
' of any man for my right honourable friend be abated,
* mine, if possible, is increased. The state of the
' country calls upon him to stand in the gap and
' defend the constitution. He has said he will do so,
' and while I have power of body or mind he shall
' not stand alone, A firm band of admiring friends —
' not the less respectable, not the less likely to prevail
' frora the present disproportion of their nurabers —
' will faithfully stand by hira against all the calumnies
' of those who betray, while they affect to defend the
' constitution.'! * This was only natural, and to be expected at the time while the
discussions were in progress, and when party spirit was at its height ;
but the virulence of the editor of Mr. Rose's Diaries, whenever he
speaks of Mr. Pox, whose name he never introduces without some con-
tumeUous epithet, is quite inconceivable ; and this, while he is lavish
of his censure on others for writing with a party bias ! 1860.
t Speech on Mr. Fox's motion for sending a Minister to Paris Deo
15, 1792.

LORD GREY. 47
I may pass shortly over other questions which came
under discussion during this period, of sufficient im
portance at the time, but of which the interest has
now for the most part passed away. It has already
been stated that my father took an active part in
opposition to the coercive measures of the Govern
ment — to the suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act,
the Traitorous Correspondence, the Seditious Meet
ings Bills, &c, ; and in 1799 he joined also in opposing
the Alien Bill,* on the ground that no case of neces
sity for such an enactment had been shown. He
admitted that it was the ' characteristic of free States
' to vote extraordinary powers in times of extraordi-
' nary danger, but,' he said, 'there was another cha-
' racteristic of a free Government, and it was the chief
' excellence of our constitution ; — it was this : the Ex-
' ecutive Power was never to judge of the necessity
' of that extraordinary power ; it was always the pro-
' vince of the legislature to form its opinion upon that
' subject, and therefore when any power was to be
' given to the Crown in cases of emergency, it must
* be given by Parliament.' In the course of the dis
cussion it had been argued that the King by his own
prerogative could do all that was proposed by this
Bill; but against that doctrine my father protested
now, as he did again in opposing a similar measure in
1817, when the same claim was set up. The oppo'
* By this Bill the residence of foreigners in this country was sub
jected to very vexatious conditions, and a summary power was given of
removing them from the kingdom.

48 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
sition, as might be expected, was of no avail, and the
measure was carried by the usual overwhelming raa
jority that supported the Minister in all his coercive
policy. In 1795 my father concurred in the opposition that
was offered to the second payment of the Prince of
Wales's debts, which he resisted on the ground of the
assurance given at the time his debts were before paid
in 1787, that no raore should be incurred.* The large
sura of 650,000^, was now farther deraanded for the
sarae purpose, and it was comraonly believed that the
grant of this money was the raain inducement held out
to the Prince in order to obtain his consent to the
marriage which had been proposed to hira with the
Princess of Brunswick. Considering the result of that
raarriage, it may perhaps be thought matter of regret
that the opposition to the grant was not successful.
On the question of the Regency — which was ori
ginally raised in 1788, on the occasion ofthe King's
first illness, and which involved a great constitutional
principle, — my father took the line that he followed
on subsequent occasions when the subject came again
under discussion ; arguing in favour of proceeding by
* In 1783 the Coalition Government proposed an allowance of
£ 100,000 for the Prince of Wales, on his coming of age — which the ¦
editor of Mr, Rose's Diaries makes the subject of a sneering remark on
the claims of the Whigs to be considered ' a liberal Administration.'
He says nothing, however, of the liberality of Mr. Pitt's Administration,
whioh, haying paid the Prince's debts in 1787, now came to Parliament
iu 1795, for £650,000 more for the same purpose ! — Diaries qf Bt. Eon.
O. Eose, vol. i., p. 100.

LORD GREY. 49
address to the Prince of Wales to assume the authority
which of right belonged to him as heir apparent to the
throne, and in support of an unrestricted Eegency,
' The restrictions,' he said, ' would obstruct the Eegent
' in the just and useful exercise of his power, and
' would limit him in the choice of his political ser-
' vants, while, should he or his Minister be disposed
' to abuse that power, they would oppose no strong
' obstacle to his designs,'
Now that the question can be judged of free from
the bias of party politics which then influenced its
decision, the highest authorities appear to concur in
the opinion that the course proposed by the Whigs, of
proceeding by address from the two Houses, was the
constitutional one, though the argument in favour of
the inherent right of the Prince of Wales to the
Eegency may have been pushed too far. Party
politics were, however, at this time, as they were again
in 1810, when the Eegency BiU was passed, mixed up
with the question. The Prince of Wales being con
sidered the adherent of Mr. Fox, the restricted
Regency was proposed by the Government, and
would undoubtedly have been carried, as it was in
1810, had not the King's recovery postponed for the
time any decision on the subject.
Having failed in all their efforts to promote a pacific
policy abroad, and a more conciliatory system of
Government at home, the Whig party had, after the
defeat of -my father's motion for Reform in 1797, gene-
E

50 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
rally withdrawn from their attendance in Parliament.
Of this secession my father in after years always
expressed his disapprobation, and regretted the share
he had taken in advising it. The grounds on which
that step was adopted were thus stated by hira in
1802, in answer to some taunts on the subject thrown
out by Mr. Pitt, who ' took advantage,' he said, ' of
' one or two points in Mr, Whitbread's speech to
' pronounce a general panegyric on his own Adminis-
' tration,' ' The right hon, gentleman,' he proceeded,
' is not content with defending his own conduct. He
' accuses us of despairing of the resources of the
' country ; of leaving the House under such an im-
' pression, and of retuming only for the purpose of
' obstructing the raeasures of Govemraent. I am not
' accountable to the right hon, gentleraan for any part
' of my conduct, I wish, however, to say, that neither
' I, nor any of those with whom I acted, ever despaired
' of the resources of the country. We reprobated the
' system pursued by the late Ministers ; we opposed
' to the utraost of our power their destructive measures,
' and we predicted consequences of the raost disastrous
' kind, and even ruin, as the result of the adherence to
' those raeasures. But with a systera of moderation
' towards foreign powers, instead of insult and in-
' dignity ; of laudable econoray instead of lavish pro-
' fusion ; of constitutional liberty instead of unjus-
' tifiable infringeraents of the liberty of the subject,
' we never despaired of the fortunes of our* country.

LORD GREY. 51
' We left Parliament, not because we despaired of the
' national resources, but because our views and the
' views of Ministers, supported by a great majority of
' the House, were so different, that we saw no good
' could be derived from our attendance. Since that
' time occasions have occurred when we have thought
' it our duty to resume our places in this House. I,
' for one, however, must declare that I have never
' attended without reluctance, and that my attendance
' has been dictated by an imperious sense of duty.
' Any apology for my conduct at present would be
' impertinent. My reasons for taking the step are
' sufficiently well known, and I leave the decision of
' them to the public ; or, if they cannot be fairly esti-
' mated by the public now, I leave them to the decision
' of an impartial posterity. If the right hon. gentleman
' looks back with pleasure to the whole conduct of his
' Administration, I assure him that I look back to the
' share I have had in opposition to his general system
' with no less satisfaction,'
One subject of debate on which my father resumed
his attendance in 1799 and 1800, though Mr. Fox and
the party in general still continued to absent them
selves, was the proposal of the Minister for a legislative
Union between England and Ireland, and he formed
one of the very small minority by which that measure
was opposed throughout.
By his marriage in 1794* he had become intimately
* To Mary Elizaheth, daughter of Mr., afterw&rds Lord Ponsonby. [Her
E 2

52 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
connected with the leading members of the Irish
Liberal party, and the interest which he at all times
took in the affairs of Ireland was thus naturally
increased. It did not, however, require such a consideration to
make him disapprove of — ^and condemn as strongly as
he had done a similar system in England — the
coercive policy adopted by Ministers in their adminis
tration of Ireland, and, as it seemed to him, alone
trusted to by them, either for the suppression of
present disturbances, or for the raaintenance of future
tranquillity, A letter to Mrs. Ponsonby, already
quoted (page 31, ante), contains, as will have been seen,
a strong denunciation of the policy adopted at this
tirae towards Ireland,
The opposition which my father now gave to the
legislative Union between Bngland and Ireland, was
chiefly founded on the means which had been adopted
to carry it, contrary to the known feelings and wishes
of the Irish people. We may infer the nature of
those raeans from the correspondence of the late Duke
of Wellington, when he was Secretary for Ireland,
recently published (1860) by the present duke, in

Her grandfather had been Speaker of the Irish House of Commons, and
was closely connected with Lord Shannon and other leading members
of the Irish Liberal party at that time. Her uncle, Mr. George Pon
sonby, was Chancellor of Ireland during Lord GrenvUle's Administra
tion, and afterwards, on the removal of my father to the House of
Lords, was acknowledged as Leader of the Opposition in the House of
Commons.

LORD GREY. 53
which frequent allusion is made to the ' secret union
' pensions,' &c., by which, doubtless, support to the
ministerial plan had been purchased. My father
blamed the Govemment as 'ill-advised in pressing
' forward a measure which the first principle of policy,
' naraely, the tranquillizing of a great part of the
' empire, should have induced them at all events to
' suspend.' ... ' If the truth be,' he said, ' that the
' free, unbiassed, uncontrolled opinion of the Irish
' nation is decidedly in favour of the measure,' (it had
been so stated by the Minister,) ' I see no objection
' to proceeding ; but if the case be different, and the
' Irish took every opportunity left to them of testifying
' their abhorrence of a Union, we are bound, in reason
' and justice, not to proceed one step further in the
' business.' And again, ' We have no right,' he said,
' to discuss the question, unless it be proved to us
' that the passing of these resolutions will be agreeable
' to the great body of the Irish nation.'
He argued also, (it may be thought, perhaps, not
without reason, considering what the state of Ireland has
been up to a very recent period, when more than half
a century had elapsed since the passing of the Union,)
' that the evils by which that country had been so
' long afflicted, did not originate entirely in the exist-
' ence of a separate Parliament, and that the remedy
' need not be sought in its abolition.'
A principal inducement held out to the Irish Par
liament and nation in order to obtain their concurrence

54 LIFE AND' OPINIONS OF
in the proposed measure, was the hope (to give it no
stronger narae) encouraged by Mr. Pitt, that the
legislative Union would be followed by the reraoval
of the Roman Catholic disabilities. The event, how
ever, justifled the fears expressed by my father during
the discussions on the BiU, that ' those raeasures of
' liberality and justice towards the Catholics of Ire-
' land, which were expected as fraits of a legislative
' Union, are yet far fi-ora being realized.' Having
succeeded in carrying the Union, Mr. Pitt found him
self utterly unable to give effect to the hope which he
had encouraged, if not the engagement he had entered
into, and resigned office ; — nor was it tiU thirty years
later that the consideration of the claims of the Irish
Catholics to equal rights with their Protestant fellow-
subjects, having been forced by irresistible circura
stances on a reluctant sovereign, the Whigs raainly
contributed, by their cordial and disinterested support,
to enable a ministry, the principal members of which
had aU their lives been opposed to any concession, to
carry a raeasure, for which they themselves had
forfeited office, and repeatedly sacrificed all hopes of
power ; and the settlement of which by their aid was
to lead to no change in their own political situa
tion, I cannot refrain (though I am aware that I am
again anticipating what belongs properly to a much
later period) from here inserting some reraarks taken
from an article in the ' Edinburgh Eeview ' on the settle-

LORD GREY. 55
ment ofthe Catholic Question in 1829, which appears
to me only to do justice to my father and the Whig
party on that occasion.
' In commenting upon the invidious remarks to
' which the conduct of the Ministers was exposed, we
' have been led to make mention of that pursued by
' their adversaries — perhaps we should rather say,
' those who had been their adversaries. But where
'all are praiseworthy there maybe some peculiarly
' entitled to admiration, and we doubt if at this
' moment there is any one so blinded by party preju-
' dice, as not to reflect with feelings of heartfelt
' respect upon the course followed by Lord Grey on
' this great question. He sacrificed power in 1807,
' with his colleagues, Lords i Grenville, &c., and was
' made the object of a religious and political outcry,
' which, having driven him from office, deprived him
' also of his seat for- his native county. Those who
' succeeded upon the clamours thus raised, (some of
' them all the while friends of emancipation,) carried
' silently a few years later the very measure for which
' they had cried him down. For no other reason than
' his attachment to this great question, has he been,
' during by far the greater portion of his life, excluded
' from the service of the State. He now sees it
' brought forward by his adversaries, and he hastens
' to lend them, in completing the work, an aid as
'hearty and zealous as it is briUiant and decisive.

56 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' Yet we doubt not there are who still go on with
' the cuckoo note, that all politicians are alike, and
' that there is no virtue in public men,'
One ground on which my father opposed the Union
had reference to the question of Parliaraentary Ee
form, and, strongly impressed, as he was, with the
necessity of such a measure, had no doubt greatly in
fluenced the course which he now pursued. This was
the belief that the addition of one hundred Irish
members to the House of Coramons, would, under the
existing system, only serve, as the Scotch union had
done, to increase the power of the Minister. Influ
enced by this consideration, he moved in the debate
for going into comraittee on the Union Bill, that it
should be an ' instruction to the Coramittee, to take into
' their consideration the raost effectual means of pro-
' viding for, and securing, the independence of Parlia
ment,' His plan was, to make room for the one hun
dred Irish merabers by abolishing an equal number of
seats for rotten boroughs — buying up these seats as
was done at the sarae time in Ireland. He often after
wards expressed his opinion that if this had been
carried into effect, it would have obviated, or at least
deferred, the necessity for a great measure of Eeform.
He also took that occasion of once more asserting
the principles which ever guided him in advocating
Parliamentary Eeform.
' I wish,' he said, ' to guard against the insinuation

LORD GREY. 57
* SO often thrown out against those who are favourable
' to Reform that they are inclined to be swayed too
' much by theories of government and sj'^stems of
' speculative perfection. These are far from the prin-
' ciples which I have ever followed or approved, I
' never proposed any scheme of Reform to this House
' upon the mere recommendation of a specious and
' beautiful theor3^ The only reason why I ever urged
' the House to adopt a measure of ParUamentary Re-
' form was because it appeared to me to be a neces-
' sary remedy for an existing evil. No man can sub-
' scribe more cordiaUy than I do to the maxim, that
' in Government practical good is infinitely preferable
' to speculative perfection, I know that it is incum-
' bent on every wise legislative assembly to be guided
'bythe dictates of this fundamental rule. Without
', it. Government would be destitute of all steadiness
' of operation and uniformity of design. Instead of
' following maxims sanctioned by experience, the
' course of Government would be continually exposed
' to the dangers arising from the ebullition of tempo-
' rary passions, to the shocks of incessant experiment,
' and to the projects of visionary speculation, , , .
' Government would be a fluctuating and uncertain
' establishment, balanced by no stock of embodied
' wisdom — directed by no certain landmarks — obedient
' to no steady principle of action. To a Govemment
' so abandoned by all experience, and resigned to

58 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' every conflict of passion, would apply the words of
' the poet in his description of winter —
" A leafless branch her sceptre, and her throne
" An icy car, indebted to no wheels —
" But urged by storms along, its sUppery way !" '
The opposition to the legislative Union between the
two countries was as fruitless as that to the other
ministerial measures, and it soon passed into a law.
But in this, perhaps, the only matter for regret is that
it was unaccorapanied by that great act of justice to
the Catholics, the hope at least of which had certainly
been held out by Mr. Pitt, And thirty years later,
when that act of justice had at length beeu tardily
and ungraciously performed, my father, as Minister,
gave his most strenuous opposition to the mischievous
agitation excited and kept up by Mr, O'Connell with
a view to the repeal of the Union which had been thus
effected. Constant evidence will be found in the course of
this memoir of the deep interest which my father took
throughout life in the affairs of Ireland, and of the re
peated sacrifices he made (if, indeed, the abandonment
of all hope of power could ever be considered in his
case a sacrifice) to obtain the extension to that country
of an equahty of civil and religious rights. At pre
sent it will suffice to mention that he had already
given practical proof of this disposition during the Ad
ministration of Mr. Pitt. The foUowing extract of a

LORD GREY, 59
letter to Mrs. Ponsonby, written in 1796, shows that
an overture of some sort had already been made to
him on the part of the Government, and that he had
refused it, chiefly on account of Ireland,
' It is certainly true,' he writes, ' that overtures were
' made to me when I was in London, which I rejected,
' I cannot write an account of all that passed, I will
' only say that one principal cause of my not agreeing
' with them was their refusal to remove the present
' Irish Ministers, though they gave me every possible
' assurance of adopting all the measures in that country,
' short of Parliamentary Reform and Catholic Eman-
' cipation, that I could have wished.'
It is painful to reflect upon the return he met with
in after years from that party in Ireland, for which he
had done so much !

60 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF

CHAPTER II.
1801 TO 1806.
Prom the Formation of Mr. Addington's Administration in 1801, to
Mr. Pitt's Death in January 1806.
Shoetlt after the opening of Parliament in 1801,
Mr, Pitt, finding insuperable objections on the part of
the King to that measure for the relief of the Eoraan
Catholics which he had contemplated as an essential
accompaniraent to'the Act of Union, and which, it is
beUeved, the Catholics had been led to expect as its
just consequence, resigned office ; and was succeeded,
at the head of the Treasury and of the Governraent, by
Mr. Addington.
This change, however, raade little immediate dif
ference in the relative position of parties iu the House
of Coramons, and the Whigs under Mr. Fox continued
in the sarae fruitless opposition to the new Govern
ment which they had offered to the old. Before Mr.
Pitt's resignation, my father had moved an amend
ment to the address in answer to the King's speech,
asking the House to pledge itself to an inquiry into the
state of the nation. He had subsequently given notice
of his intention to move for the appointment of a com
raittee which should be charged with such an inquiry,
nor did he see any reason, in consequence of the
change, to alter that intention, or to postpone his

LORD GREY, 61
motion. He accordingly brought it forward on
the 25th of March, ' The new Administration,' he
said, ' acting, professedly, on the principles of the old,
' he could not have much confidence in them ; and he
' called upon those who believed that the system pur-
' sued by the old Ministers, and to be adopted by the
'new, was subversive of all that is venerable in the
' British constitution,' . . ' to renounce a system of
' blind confidence, and accede to a motion the object
' of which is constitutional inquiry.'
But the opposition to the Administration of Mr.
Addington proved equally unavailing with that so long
offered in vain to the measures of Mr, Pitt. And not
withstanding all the efforts of the Whig party, the
new Ministers were supported by large majorities, in
the coercive policy which, instead of that great measure
of conciliation that had been hoped for as the conse
quence of the Union, was now adopted towards Ireland.
Bills were passed for proclaiming martial law in that
country under certain circumstances, — for suspending
the Habeas Corpus Act, — and for indemnifying those
who had been engaged in the arrest or detention of
suspected persons.
I must here notice two events which occurred in
the course of 1801, though they belong perhaps more
properly to the narrative of my father's private life ;
for they were events which exercised a material
influence on his future political career.
One was the acceptance by his father of a peerage
from Mr. Addington, without his previous knowledge,

62 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
and against his known wishes, as being hiraself in
direct and avowed opposition to the Govemraent of
which Mr. Addington was at the head.
The other was the arrangeraent with his uncle. Sir
Harry, by which Howick becarae for the future his
permanent residence in the country.
The forraer event, as rendering his removal from
the House of Coraraons inevitable, and that, prbbably,
at no very distant period, can only be regarded as a
misfortune to the country ; for in the House of Cora
raons alone could any hope exist of an, effectual check
being given to the pernicious systera of Government
which so long prevailed : while the latter event, fix
ing him ^t a distance frora London, which, though now
easily performed between breakfast and dinner,. it took
at that tirae four long days to accoraplish, raade it ira
possible for hira to give that constant attention to the
proceedings of the party, which subsequent events
proved to be so necessary.' His presence in the House
on any sudden eraergency was put out of the question ;
and even his regular attendance on the ordinary busi
ness of the session, becarae every year shorter and
more uncertain. His correspondence with Mr, Fox-
at this time, is filled, on one side, with entreaties for
his presence, and regrets at the distance which sepa
rated thera ; on the -other, with repeated pleas and ex
cuses to justify his continued absence;
Indeed, aU his letters at this period, speak of his
ardent desire to withdraw entirely frora politics; and
writing to Mr, Pox in December 1802, in answer to a

LORD GREY. 63
pressing entreaty that he would come to London in
consequence of the critical state of our relations with
France, he declares his determination ' never again to
' take anything like a lead in politics.' And when
Mr, Fox, in combating such a resolution, urges him to
consider that if he perseveres in it, ' all hope of any
' good in the country, nay, of any aUeviation of evil,
' or any check to the career of despotism, is at an end '
: — he repeats: 'I have formed a juster estimate of
' myself than your partiality has done, and I know
' that it is in my power to do little good — non tali
' auxilio. If the career of despotism is to. be checked,
' it must be by a more powerful hand than I can
' oppose to it.' . . ' Indeed, if you consider the matter
' impartiaUy, I am persuaded you will think my de-
' cision such a one as a proper examination of myself,
' and of the situation of public affairs, ought to
' dictate.' It is possible that in announcing su'ch a determina
tion, and in the unwillingness he showed to attend
Parliament, he may have been, in some degree, in
fluenced by the feeling that, on the question of our
relations with France, his opinions were not in entire
accordance with those of Mr. Fox, He had taken no
part (having been at Howick at the time it occurred)
in the debate on the terms of the preUminary treaty
signed in October 1801. But if we may infer his
opinion from that which he afterwards expressed, when
events had led, towards the end of 1802, to the well-
founded fear that, though the definitive treaty had

64 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
only been signed on the 28th of the preceding March,
a fresh rupture was imminent, it would appear that
he did not materially differ from those who thought
the terms of peace scarcely compatible with the
honour of the country.*
In the difficulties which had arisen since the conclu
sion of peace, Mr. Fox, asserting his belief that France
was in the right, and that, if hostilities were resumed,
the fault lay with our Government, and believing that
Mr. Addington was likely to be forced into war,
against his will, by ' the goadings of the War Party,'
was rather disposed to support him against that party.
My father, whatever his opinion of the peace itself
raight be, though equally desirous as Mr. Fox of pre
serving it, if it could be maintained with honour — did
not see the necessity of supporting Mr. Addington
with such an object, so strongly. In the first place he
could not help thinking the conduct of the French
Governraent ' Wantonly offensive ' to this country. ' I
' confess,' he writes to Mr. Fox in December 1802,
' that everything I have learnt frora those sources of
' public inforraation which alone are open to rae, both
* See letter of December 1802, quoted in the next page, and par
ticularly what is there said of ' Switzerland, Italy, and Germany too,'
being all ' left at the mercy of Bonaparte.' See also what is said in the
same letter of ' making us drink the cup of our disgrace to the very
dregs,' &c.
Mr. Windham called it a peace ' glorious for France ;' and he said he
oould not join in the general rejoicing ; because he feared many years
would not elapse before it would be tumed into repentance and bitter
sorrow. Mr. Sheridan said it was a peace, of whioh every man ought to he
glad, but no man would be proud.

LORD GEEY. 65
' during the negotiation, and since the conclusion of
' peace, seems to me to evince a disposition in the
' Chief Consul, very unfavourable to such an opinion '
(Mr, Fox had expressed his opinion that Bonaparte
was really desirous of peace), 'I do not mean to
' contend that by any of those open and undisguised
' acts of ambition by which he has annexed new
' dominions to France, either the letter of the treaty
' of Amiens is violated, or that the power of that
' country is, in fact, extended. Italy, Switzerland,
' and Germany too, were all left at his mercy. But
' there may be a way of using power, so threatening
' and so insulting, as, at last, even under the most
' disadvantageous circumstances, to force resistance ;
' and he appears to me to be determined to make us
' drink the cup of our disgrace to the very dregs ; to
' omit no opportunity of studied aggravation and
' insult, and to push us, point by point, till at last we
' shall be compelled to take some measures which may
' give him a pretext for the hostilities which he medi-
' tates.' Nor would my father go the length of
saying with Mr, Fox that the acts by which France
had given evidence of her hostile dispositions, would
not be just causes of war, ' I think Switzerland,' he
writes, ' certainly would.' All he said was, that he
did not think ' all or any of them came so near us, as
' to. make war necessary.'' Again he asks : ' Do you
' think there is nothing offensive to England in Bona-
' parte's speech to the Swiss deputies ? " You must
p

66 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' have no treaty with England," I do not know that
' it is our interest to have any ; but surely to be
' publicly tabooed in this manner, is, if we are not in
' a condition to resent it, most degrading to us as a
' nation.' . . ' Then the cession of the Floridas' (to the
' United States of America), ' of which I hear there is
' no doubt, is another subject of just complaint on the
' part of this country. I dread a renewal of the war
' as the greatest calamity; but are there to be no
' liraits to our subraission ?'
In fact the feelings of dislike with which my father
had viewed the earlier proceedings of the revolutionary
Government in France, had not been reraoved by
what had occurred since the advent of Bonaparte to
power. ' I rather envy you,' he writes to Mr, Fox,
on the return of the latter from the visit which he had
made to Paris during the peace of Araiens. ' I rather
' envy you having seen all the wonders of Paris,
'though ray hatred to the Govemraent would, I
' believe, even if I were at liberty, prevent my going
' there. Perhaps you will think me very foolish, but.
' I certainly never felt a stronger indignation against
' the principles of the coalition against France, than I
' do against those of the Consular Government.'
In the next place he did not think that Mr. Adding
ton's Government, which appeared to hira to take
every opportunity of courting Mr. Pitt aud the Gren
viUes at the expence of Mr. Fox's party, had any
claira upon their support; and, above all, he had

LORD GREY. 67
serious doubts whether, were this otherwise, their
avowed support would not, in the interests of peace
itself, be rather a disadvantage than an assistance.
' Are you sure,' he asks, ' that our interference will
' be very conducive to the preservation of peace ?
' There has appeared to me, in all the debates, a
' readiness to seize upon every argument and expression.
' of yours, to renew the old controversy of last war,'
Concurring, however, with Mr, Fox, that they
should support 'any measures which may have for
' their object peace on honourable terms,' he further
cautions him strongly against showing any appearance
' of indifference to the power — still more of anything
' like approbation of the measures, of the French
' Government.' ' I know,' he adds, ' that when peace
' is the object, topics of irritation ought not to be
' dwelt upon ; but I doubt much whether a total
' avoidance of all subjects of this nature would be
' either right or politic. In the latter view it un-
' doubtedly affords additional matter of aggravation,
' which has been but too often successfully used by
' those who wish to mislead and inflame the country.'
When on the 8th of March 1803, the King's message
to the two Houses of Parliament, informing them that
* in consequence of the military preparations in the
' ports of France and Holland, and as discussions were
' now subsisting between His Majesty and the French
' Government, he had thought it necessary to take
' additional precautions for the security of his domi-
F 2

68 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' nions ;' — when this state of affairs had raade Mr, Fox
stiU raore pressing for ray father's attendance, he at last
reluctantly consented to leave the North ; but before
doing so, he once raore urged upon Mr, Fox the neces
sity of great caution in his language. ' The more I
' think,' he writes on the 19th March, 'the more <x)n-
' vinced I am that, however desirous we may be of
' peace, we ought not to show ourselves backward in
' offering to support the raost vigorous exertions for
' the prosecution of the war. Of course, while things
' reraain undeterrained, if the subject should corae to
' be debated in such a shape as should afford us a hope
' that we might, by raoderate counsels, contribute to
' the preservation of peace, I should be as rauch in-
' clined as you to adopt that line. But I hardly think
* such a chance will be left to us ; and after all that
' has passed, at the sarae tirae that I would avoid most
' decidedly all those foolish tirades* which, however
' magnificently they sound, add nothing to the real
' vigour of our measures, and serve no purpose but
' that of irritation, I think we should take care to
' obviate the charge (a most unjust one it has hitherto
' been), that we were insensible to the honour of the
' country, and always disposed to underrate or to pal-
' liate the aggressions of France.' . , , ' Let us always
' remember,' he adds, ' that the cause of peace must
* He alludes here to a speech of Mr. Sheridan's, on Sth December
1802, in favour of war, which was much cried up at the time by the
War Party.

LOED GREY. 69
• suffer, if the real friends of peace are run down by
' the effect of misrepresentation,'
The discussions between the two Governments were
still proceeding on my father's arrival in London, nor
were all hopes of peace abandoned for some weeks
later. The negotiations continued throughout the
month of April, the speculations and opinions as to
the result varying from day to day. Even as late as
the 7th of May my father writes : " I have seen a note
' from Andreossi,* in which he says, " II y a encore
' quelque lueur d'esperance," ' These hopes, however,
proved delusive. On the 12th of May, Lord Whit
worth left Paris, and on the 16th, a message from the
King announced the termination of diplomatic inter
course with France, ' I am here in a full house,' my
father writes on that day, ' waiting in expectation ofa
' message from the King to put an end to aU our
' hopes. Lord Whitworth slept at Boulogne last
' night, and Andreossi left town at five this morning.
' Oh ! that it were as easy to make peace as war !'
And the next day he continues, — ' You will see in
' the papers of to-day, the melancholy confirmation of
' the news I sent you yesterday. We are now actu-
' ally at war, and we can only say, God send us a safe
' deliverance, which, under such Ministers, can hardly
' be hoped. Hawkesbury, in moving to have the
' King's message taken into consideration on Monday
' next, was absolutely convulsed with fear, and could
' hardly articulate from the violence of his agitation ;
* French Ambassador in London, at that time.

70 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' and to raake the thing quite ridiculous, Addington
' appeared in the full dress of the Windsor uniforra,
' and strutted up the house in the raidst of a burst of
' laughter, just as the Speaker was reading the Medi-
' cine Act a second tirae. Pitt went down to take his
' seat but was too late. He certainly attends upon
' the debate, and will, I believe, as certainly support
' the war,'
On the 18th, a forraal declaration was made of the
causes which had led to a resumption of hostilities,
and on the 23 rd the subject came under discussion in
the House of Commons. On that day Lord Hawkes
bury raoved an Address to assure the King of their
sense of his uniform efforts to preserve peace; — of
their confidence in his disposition again to terminate
the calaraities of war ; — of their indignation against
France, &c. ; and of their firm determination to give
His Majesty their best support in the contest in which
he was thus involved.
To this my father moved an araendraent, which
equally assured the King of their determination to
afford hira their vigorous support and co-operation, but
expressed in stronger terms the satisfaction it would
give them to see peace restored, and omitted whatever
might appear like approbation of the past conduct of
Ministers. ' The debate was adjoumed last night,' he
writes the next morning. ' Pitt raade one of the raost
' inflararaatory speeches that ever was heard, and has
' plunged the country into another war of ten years,
' I answered hira, and under all the disadvantages of

LORD GEEY, 71
' speaking to a house preoccupied and inflamed by
'one of the most magnificent pieces of declamation
' that ever was made, I got through it, however, tant
' bien que mal, and ended by moving an amendment,
' merely to say that we would support the war in
' which we are engaged, and holding out the hope and
' desire of peace. My reason for moving an amend-
' ment was, that I could not consent to the original
' Address, which implied an approbation of the en-
* deavours of Ministers to preserve peace, and asserted
' the war to be unavoidable without sufficient infor-
' mation.' In fact, the perusal of the papers laid be
fore Parliament had convinced my father that, how
ever justly we might resent the conduct of France, as
' wantonly offensive ' to this country ; and though
some of our grounds of complaint might possibly justify
even a declaration of war ; it was very much owing
to the conduct of our own Government, that affairs
had been brought into a position in which war had
become unavoidable. ' Upon reading the papers,' he
had written on the 19 th of May, ' I am completely
' convinced that it would have been very easy for men
' of any ability, and desirous of peace, to have pre-
' served it,' And again he says, in still stronger lan
guage, ' I have a satisfaction in having joined with
' Fox in an endeavour to stop a war which I believe
' to be the. most unnecessary of any in which this
' country ever engaged.'
This opinion that the renewal of the war might have
been avoided, had our Government been so disposed,

72 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
has since been adopted by our latest Tory historians.
Sir j^ , Alison says in his history : ' Upon coolly re-
' viewing the circumstances under which the contest
' was renewed, it is impossible to deny that the British
' Govemment manifested a feverish anxiety to corae
' to a rupture ; and that so far as the transactions be-
' tween the two countries are concemed, they were
' the aggressors.'
In moving his amendraent, however, it is certain,
though ray father's speech is not reported,* that it was
quite in the spirit which he had always recomraended
to Mr. Fox ; for, till after Mr, Fox had spoken, the
araendraent was only objected to as interfering un
necessarily with the unaniraity which it was so
desirable to preserve on this occasion, — Mr. Thomas
Grenville declaring that it did not contain a word
in which he did not cordially agree, and Lord Hawks-
bury adding that it was the same, in fact, as the
original address.
But when Mr, Fox, on the second night of the
debate, in a speech which my father described as ' the
' most wonderful display of wisdom and genius,'
before which 'everything else shrinks into dust,' had
been led, in his ardent love of peace, into a vehement
denunciation of the conduct of those to whom, much
more than to the French Govemment, he attributed
the annihilation of aU hope of its being preserved,
the language of Govemment and of their supporters
* The reporters, my father says, had been excluded from the gallery,
by a new regulation ofthe Speaker's.

LOED GREY. 73
at once changed. Mr. Fox was immmediately assailed,
as my father had warned him he would be, with aU
the hacknied accusations with which it was the custom
at that time to endeavour to silence the advocates for
peace. Want of patriotism, insensibility to his
country's honour, &c., were imputed to him; his
speech was even denounced by Mr, Windham for its
wickedness ; and the amendraent was rejected in a full
House by the enormous majority of 398 to 67,
The die was now cast. War was once more a stern
reality. A war, too, that was to endure, with no
relaxation or intermission, for nearly twelve long
years ! My father had done his best to assist Mr. Fox
in his efforts to keep the country out of it ; but, true
to the principles he had ever professed, once engaged,
his sole desire was that it should be vigorously con
ducted ; as thus alone could any hope be entertained
of seeing it brought to a satisfactory conclusion.
Of this there appeared little probability, under an
Administration so incompetent, and so low in public
estimation, as that of Mr, Addington. And the state
of parties in Parliament, and the possibility of union
with one or other of them, without which it seemed
impossible to form a Cabinet either equal to the exist
ing emergency, or sufficiently strong in Parliamentary
support to give it a chance of permanence, became a^
subject of anxious consideration and of frequent dis
cussion between Mr. Fox and my father.
The question of some such union had indeed been
raised almost from the commencement of Mr, Adding-

74 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
ton's Government. At first it was scarcely believed
that the change of Adrainistration in 1801 was a bonS,
fide one, and Mr, Pitt's early resumption of power
was confidently speculated upon. The beUef was that
there was an understanding between Mr. Pitt and
Mt. Addington, and that the latter merely held the
post of Premier until it should suit the former to
resume it. But when it becarae clear that there was
no such understanding, it was as confidently expected
that Mr, Addington would seek to strengthen hiraself
frora the Whig ranks ; and it was thought that a
junction with that party would be rauch facilitated by
the coraraenceraent of negotiations for peace, and by
Mr, Addington's supposed anxiety to conclude it.
Sorae atterapt at negotiation, with such a view,
seeras to have been raade towards the end of 1801, iu
the hope of obtaining the accession of my father and
others of the Whig party to the Govemment. Mr.
Fox, in answer to a question frora Mr. Wyvill, a
Yorkshire meraber of ParUament, and a staunch
Whig and reformer, who appears to have heard
reports of such a treaty, and to have expressed the
fear that it might lead to the abandonment of Eeform,
thus writes : — ' It is true that Mr. Grey, at the
' request of persons for whom he has the greatest
' deference, had some comraunication with a member
* of the present Governraent ; but to say the treaty
' was broken off is not so correct a description of the
' transaction, as to say that what passed in that con-
' versation did not afford any ground for any negotia-

LORD GREY. 75
' tion whatever. It would, on many accounts, be
' improper to enter into any particulars, further than
' to express my entire confidence that Grey never will,
' nor never can, either upon the subject of Reform, or
* on any other, act otherwise than is consistent with
' his own honour and the good of the country.'
Whatever the proposal may have been (and no
mention is made of it in any of the contemporary
histories or memoirs that I know of), my father, in
writing to Mr. Fox in December 1802, speaks of its
failure as the ' happiest escape ' he had ever had in
his life ; — and he adds (the Duke of Bedford, who, it
appears, was to have had a principal share in the
arrangement having died in the mean time*), ' Even
' if the Duke of Bedford were living, I would not
' embark upon the terms which were proposed last
' year ; now, no earthly consideration should induce
' me to do so,' And again in April 1803, when the
rupture of the negotiations with France was hourly
expected, having received an intimation through his
father, who supported Mr. Addington's Government,
that ' overtures would probably be made to him by
' Addington, in consequence of the failure of the
' negotiations with Pitt,' he repeats : ' I have an-
' swered, stating my belief that no overtures would be
' made, and, if any, none that I could accept ; that I
' have no reason to believe the Ministers would offer
' better terms now than they did a year and a half
' ago ; and that I should feel myself compeUed by the
? Francis Duke of Bedford, died 2nd March, 1802.

76 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' circumstances of the present moment to insist upon
' a great deal more. In short, that I would not
' negotiate on any ground but that of having a ma-
' jority in the Cabinet, Fox being one. This deter-
' mination nothing can alter.'
It would seera frora the concluding sentence above
quoted, that whatever the arrangement proposed in
1801 was to have been, Mr. Fox, probably in re
ference to the King's prejudices, was to have had no
personal share in it ; and if this were so, it is quite
certain that in consenting ' at the request of persons
' for whom he had the greatest deference,' to listen at
all to such overtures, my father raust have acted by
the direct advice, and in obedience to the express wishes,
of Mr. Fox hiraself. Nothing less could have induced
hira to give even this moraentary consent to a principle
of exclusion which he ever after stoutly resisted, and to
which, as will be seen, not even the authority of Mr.
Fox himself could again persuade him to subrait.
But, in truth, all ray father's own feeUngs and
opinions were strongly opposed to any scheme of
junction with Mr, Addington and his party, of whose
abilities, as public raen, he had the raost conteraptible
opinion. ' As to Addington and his associates,' he
writes to Mr. Fox, in March 1803, ' you know what
' I think. Nothing could induce rae to subscribe even
* to an apparent toleration of thera, but the fear that
' by joining in the cry against thera, we might assist
' those whose politics are for war. But when war has
' actually taken place, this danger ceases ; and how.

LORD GREY. 77
' ever strange it may appear, I should have a better
' hope of peace even from GrenviUe, than from the
' present Ministry. An imbecility under which there
' could be no hope that the resources of the country
' could be well managed, and which must excite the
' contempt of the enemy, would not only add to the
' immediate danger of the contest, but to the proba-
' bility of its continuance.'
But he was at this time generaUy averse to any
coalition. He thought highly of the Grenville party,
as containing men of ' vigour and ability,' moved too,
' by a principle which while you are acting with them
' makes them more to be depended on.' StiU, they had
been members of Mr, Pitt's Government, and had, as
such, been identified with that system at home, and that
poUcy abroad, to which Mr, Fox and his party had so
strenuously objected. 'I have not considered,' my
father had already written to Mr. Fox, in December
1802, ' the possibility of joining the GrenviUes, I
' agree with you in preferring the men ; but the line
' they have taken puts it quite out of the question,
' and what may happen when they have purified them-
' selves by a long opposition is hardly worth consider-
' ing,' Again, in April 1803,* when the renewal of
the war was imminent, and when he felt, as expressed
in ene of the letters already quoted, that there was a
better hope of peace from them than from the Adding-
* See in ' Diaries and Correspondence of the Right Honourable
George Rose,' an account of the negotiations that took place at the
beginning of this month between Mr. Pitt and Mr. Addington, vol. ii.,
p. 30 et seq.

78 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
ton ministry, he had strong doubts of the propriety of
an avowed coalition with thera, ' In the event of a
' war,' he writes, in answer to sorae reraarks of Mr,
Fox on this subject, ' as the country never was ex-
' posed to so great a danger, there never was a tirae
' which required so much the sacrifice of all past
' injuries for the sake of the public defence,' StiU,
feeling this, and admitting that 'unions of parties
' have often been called for,' he adds that, ' the effect
' of such calls has not been very encouraging ;' and
expresses his fear, that ' an union amongst those
' who have had apparently fundamental and irrecon-
' cileable differences,' could not, under any circum
stances, be ' exerapt frora a suspicion which would
' defeat its object,' At the sarae time, he observes
that, ' in the coraraon danger which threatens us, it
' would be right for us to avoid, as rauch as we can, all
' reference to past disputes,' , . . ' The existence
' of such a Ministry as the present is surely, in such cir-
' curastances, a national evil ; and without any violence
' of manner towards thera, 1 should be inclined, in the
' event of a war (and, indeed, in the event of a peace, if
' it could be done without the danger of a war), to join
' with those who call for an Administration which
' might afford a better hope to the country.'
As time went on, and the incapacity of Ministers
becarae daily raore apparent, the different parties in
the House of Coramons, which disapproved equally of
their measures, were naturaUy brought into raore
direct co-operation; and writing to Mr, Fox, in

LORD GREY. 79
October 1803, my father expressed his opiniou, that
it would be right ' to smooth the way as much as
' possible for co-operation with those whose sentiraents
' are the same as ours, as without some such union
' nothing useful can be hoped for.' StiU the difficulties
attending an avowed coaUtion with men to whom they
had been so long opposed, were not, in his mind, to be
lightly put on one side ; and in December 1803, he
again writes : ' Of my general disposition and opinions
' about unions you are already sufficiently informed.
' The measures of Government have given very
' general disgust, and their characters are despised.
' But then, on the other hand, the GrenviUes, and
' Windham still more, are very unpopular. While
' Pitt keeps away, their numbers will be small ; and
' the general dislike to them will have its full weight,
' so that I see no chance of any good being done,'
Even in January 1804, when Mr, Fox writes to an
nounce ' that he had had a direct communication
' (wholly unsought by him) from that part of the
' Opposition which sits at the Bar end of the House,*
' to the following effect : that it is their wish to join
' us in a systematic opposition for the purpose of re-
' moving the Ministry, and of substituting one on the
' broadest possible basis,' and adding that ' there was
' an openness and appearance of cordiality in the
* Seceders firom a Ministry, or men who, though generaUy opposed
to the Government, do not belong to the party in direct and avowed
opposition, usually sit together below the gangway, or passage that
leads on either side of the House, from the floor to the back benches.
Seceders from Government generally sit below the gangway on the
Ministerial side. But this does not by any means soften the asperity
of their attacks.

80 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' raanner of making the proposal that much pleases
' me ; — even this direct proposal, coming from men of
whose vigour and ability, and of whose principle of
action in party warfare, ray father had, on various
occasions, expressed a favourable opinion, could not
at once reconcile him to the proposed step. He
writes in answer : ' When I have considered that
' alone we can do little good, and have examined the
' different parties with which it raight be possible to
' forra a junction, I have always thought that of the
' GrenviUes the raost eligible. Yet now that the pro-
' posal coraes directly frora thera, and it is necessary
' to say aye or no, I doubt and fear,
' They certainly are able raen ; their conduct is
' direct and open ; we agree with thera in opinion, both
' as to the character and the measures of the present
' Adrainistration ; and the overture which they have
' raade appears, frora what you say, well calculated to
' inspire confidence. But on the other hand their oppo-
' sition has appeared to proceed rather frora personal
' disappointment than from public principle, . . I say
' nothing of personal attacks. These I ara as rauch
' disposed to forget as any one. But is it for our own
' honour — at once, upon the very first proposal — to
' declare ourselves their hurable servants ? Is there,
' from our doing so, a fair chance of advantage to the
' pubUc ? It is upon the answer to the second ques-
' tion that the importance of the first seems to depend,
' For though I think there is something like the same
' principle of honour to which we must bend in private

LOED GREY, 81
' life, to be observed in our public conduct, which
' might give to a too easy forgiveness of personal in-
' jury or insult the appearance of interest or meanness,
' I would by no means allow this to stand in the way
' of a great and evident public good.'
He doubted, also (and in this opinion he was borne out
by the result of the different divisions in the House of
Commons during the contest of the succeeding April,
when Mr. Addington, up to the very moment of his
' running away,' as it was termed by Mr. Fox, had a
majority over all the parties combined in opposition,
including Mr. Pitt) — he doubted whether the union now
proposed between the Whigs and the GrenviUes would
do more than form ' at best what would be called a
' strong opposition,' And as one of the conditions of the
proposals was that both Mr. Fox and himself should
give a constant attendance in. Parliament, and syste
matic opposition to the Government — ' to engage in a
' long siege of the sort,' the probable success of which
was at all events distant, was more than he felt in
clined to promise. He counselled, therefore, a civil
answer : ' expressing a general inclination to support
' — promising it on certain occasions —but declining a
' regular and systematic attendance.' Even this ad
vice he qualifies before the letter in which it was con
tained was despatched. In a postscript written the
following morning he adds, ' A night's reflection has
' not reUeved my doubts. I still fear that an avowed
' coalition with the GrenviUes for the purpose of over-
G

82 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' turning the Ministers would be iU received by the
' pubUc ; and to give it the strongest effect, if it
' should ultiraately take place, it wiU be better to
' enter into no engagement at present, except to sup-
' port them on the Yolunteer business ; both sides being
' at Uberty to act as the result of that may render ex-
' pedient,' This advice prevailed, and the different parties in
Opposition continued, according to the expression of
Mr, Windham, to raove in ' separate colurans.' Their
co-operation, however, as the fight proceeded, becarae
more and more direct ; and the various motions
brought forward by them against the Government
were so framed as to obtain the combined support of
all. Even Mr. Pitt, who had hitherto, for the most
part, held himself aloof, entered actively into the op
position to the Government, and opened a direct com
munication with Mr. Fox, through Lord GranviUe
Leveson, 'afterwards Lord Granville.
But the co-operation of Mr. Pitt was only intended
to be given while the parties were acting in opposition,
or till the victory was won. Should they succeed in
displacing Mr. Addington, it did not necessarily enter
into his speculations that he should share office with
those by whose assistance that object raight have been
accoraplished, ' If called upon to forra a Govern-
' raent without them, . , . he would be ready,' he
writes to Lord Melville, on the 29th March, 'to do
' so as well as he could araongst his own iraraediate

LORD GREY. 83
' friends, united with the most capable and unexcep-
' tionable persons of the present Government,' *
That this was, in fact, Mr, Pitt's object, my father
had all along been convinced. As far back as the 7th
April 1803, he had written to my mother, ' All the
' reports of changes will, I believe, end in nothing but
' the removal of  , If any more extensive one
' happens, it will be for the introduction of Pitt ; for
' as to us, I hold that no change can bring us into
' power.' And on the 20th of May following, he
says : ' I think I now understand the game that Pitt
' is playing, which, if I am right, is a very double one.
' I believe that he secretly does not discourage the
'violence of his young friends against Addington,
' who, with the GrenviUes, after the debate on the
' King's message, will make a series of attacks upon
' him. In that debate he builds upon our moving some
' amendment in favour of peace, of which he will take
' advantage to make a speech to maintain the honour,
' and excite the spirit of the country, and concur in
' the original address, and afterwards again absent
' himself. By these means he may hope, at the same
' time that the present Administration is weakened by
' different modes of attack from the different sides of
' Opposition, to recommend himself both to the King
' and to the country by his apparent forbearance and
' disinterestedness.' f In March 1804, when, as has
* See Letters printed for private circulation by Lord Stanhope.
t See Lord Malmesbury's Diary ; which shows that Lord Malmesbury,
g2

84 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
been seen, the opposition to the Govemment had
taken a ' more decided form, he repeats a siraUar
opinion in still stronger language ; but as the convic
tion in 1803, of the advantage which Mr, Pitt was
prepared to take of any araendraent moved by him (a
conviction that was entirely justified by the result),
could nbt prevent my father on that occasion from
doing what he considered right, so the equally strong
conviction in 1804, that the defeat of the Government
would lead merely to the reinstatement of Mr, Pitt in
offlce, without any of those by whose co-operation that
defeat raight be effected, could not deter hira frora
giving his best assistance in bringing about what he
deemed essential to the safety of the country. And
though again expressing his conviction, in writing to
Mr. Fox on the 22nd of April, when the contest was
at its height, that it would aU end ' either in the con-
' tinuance, under certain conditions, of the Addington
' Govemment . , . or in Pitt's forraing his Administra-
' tion without you.' He adds : ' This doeS not alter ray
' opinion of the propriety of perseverance in the opposi-
' tion you have begun, though I wish the event raay
' not exemplify the old fable of the Log and the Stork,'
Mr. Fox answered, that he could not concur in the
' danger of getting anything worse than King Log. I
' do not think,' he says, ' th^ Stork (which, by the
' way, is Pitt's crest) would be worse, for reasons
' which we raay discuss when we meet.'
though a constant supporter of Mr. Pitt, had not formed a very difFerent
or more flattering opinion of Mr. Pitt's condudt and motives in these
transactions.

LOED GEEY. 85
But my father himself took no personal part in the
parliamentary warfare which ended in the abandon
ment of the Government by Mr. Addington, Though
pressed by almost daily letters from Mr. Fox to come
to town, and though cordially approving all that was
done by him, he had been unavoidably detained in the
North, and when he at last arrived in London on the
1st of May, the fight was already over. Mr. Adding
ton had, as Mr, Fox expressed it in one of his letters,
'run away.' And indeed the resignation of the
Minister seems to have been rightly characterized by
this expression ; for though his last majority in the
House of Commons before that event, had been only
thirty-six in a full house (considered a very small one
in those days), and though he was threatened with an
effective attack in the House of Lords in the shape of
a motion for inquiry into the state of the nation ; yet
there can be little doubt that, if he had possessed
nerve to continue the contest, supported as he was by
the Court, Mr. Addington might have successfully
defied the combined opposition of Mr. Fox, Mr. Pitt,
and the friends of Lord Grenville. ' It seems to me,'
— my father writes to my mother from the road, on his
way up, — 'it seems to me as if the Doctor was deter-
' mined to fight it out, and if he can really screw his
' courage to the sticking-place, I shall not be very
' much surprised if he withstands the combination
' against him, powerful as it is,' Such was also beUeved
to have been the opinion of Lord St. Vincent, and one
or two of the more energetic members of the Govern-

86 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
ment,* and their advice was said to be in accordance
with that opinion.
But there were traitors in the camp. It is now
known that at the very height of the contest, while
the attacks upon the Government of which he was a
raember were in their fuU vigour. Lord Eldon was
in secret coraraunication with Mr. Pitt ! — that before
the raotion raade by Mr. Fox on the 23 rd of April,
and which was strongly supported by hira, (drawn up
and agreed upon, indeed, in previous concert with hira,)
Mr. Pitt had, through Lord Eldon, written a letter
to the King, the object of which was to urge the
necessity of a change of Governraent, and to place
hiraself (Mr. Pitt) at the absolute disposal of His
Majesty: the only pereraptory condition of the
change being, as appears from the letter to Lord Mel
ville already quoted, the dismissal of Mr. Addington
and Lord St. Vincent, and his own appointment to the
place of the forraer !
Mr. Fox's motion had originally been fixed for
Friday the 20th, but had been postponed, Mr. Fox
writes, ' at the earnest request of Mr. Pitt, for reasons,
' foolish and fanciful beyond belief, till Monday the
' 23rd,' But the ' fanciful ' reasons given to Mr. Fox
do not appear to have been the true ones, Mr. Pitt,
in charging Lord Eldon on the 22nd with his letter to
the King, writes that he 'certainly feels most anxious
* Mr. Addington himself is supposed to have been influenced, in
abandoning the contest, by the state of the King's mind, though it does
not appear how this was to operate more strongly to prevent his con
tinuing the Government, than any one else from undertaking it. The
term * ruuning away,' seems to me, therefore, properly apphed.

LOED GEEY. 87
' that this letter should be put into His Majesty's
' hands, if it can with propriety, hefore the discussion of
' to-morrow.' In a second note of the same date he adds : ' My
' wish is to leave it entirely to your discretion whether
' it can be delivered before the debate to-morrow,
' If not, I anxiously wish tliat it should he known to His
' Majesty, in due time, that it was deposited with you
' in order that it should be so delivered,' &c.
It may be well doubted whether in all the annals
of Parliamentary and Party contests, an equal instance
can be found of treachery on both sides.
My father, as has been seen, foresaw from the first
that any change in the Administration would in all
probability be limited to the extent above mentioned.
He again expresses the same opinion on the day of his
arrival in London (May 5) : ' The most probable
' event,' he writes, ' is that the new Ministry will be
' formed without us,' And before the issue of Mr.
Pitt's interview with the King, on the 7th of May,
was known, he again states his belief, that ' it will
' end in Pitt's coming in without any of us,'
This speculation was fully confirmed by the event.
After pressing, more or less strongly, upon the King,
the necessity of a junction with Mr. Fox, Mr. Pitt
yielded to His Majesty's objections; and, failing to
induce Lord GrenvUle to concur in the same course,
formed his Administration out of the members of the
late Government, with the mere addition of two or
three of his own personal friends.

88 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
A faint disposition had been shown to offer office to
my father and others of Mr, Fox's party, but to the
exclusion of Mr, Fox himself; but to such a proposal
ray father would not listen for a single moment, and
he took steps, on the first ruraour of such an intention,
which prevented the proposition being actually made ,
' The objection,' he writes, ' being personal to him,
' Fox expressed a wish that his friends, if they could
' be adraitted as a party to their full share of influence
• and power, and rather more than if he hiraself forraed
' part of the arrangeraent, should accept ; and Pitt
' seemed inclined to discuss this proposition in a per-
' sonal interview with Fox, But I put an absolute
' veto upon it, and we are all excriided,' And in
another letter after mentioning that Mr, Fox was the
only person objected to, he proceeds : ' If by stating
' Fox to be the only person objected to, they raean
' that the King would accept of me or any other of
' Fox's friends, and that they have hopes of gaining
' us, they are, as far as relates to me at least, com-
' pletely mistaken. No earthly consideration should
' make me accept office without Fox. How unceasing
' the persecution of hira is ! How honourable to hira-
' self— how disgraceful to all those who concur in, or
' subrait to it !' The disgrace of such submission did
not attach to the Grenville party. ' The GrenviUes,'
my father writes, ' have also refused, and have indeed
' behaved in the most honourable manner, so that Pitt
' must make up his Ministry out of the rump of the
' old Administration, and his own imraediate .friends.'

LORD GEEY, 89
These friends, however, seem themselves to have
been dissatisfied with this result. Lord Malmesbury
in his 'Diaries,' says that Mr. 'Canning's leanings
' were entirely with Fox and the GrenviUes, and that he
' was disposed to think Pitt might have done more with
' the King.' He further says that Mr. Canning had
told him that he did not 'conceal from Pitt his
' concem and dissatisfaction, and even disapprobation of
' what had passed—that he considered the great and
' only opportunity of uniting the whole ability of the
' country gone by and lost.'
Whether or not the loss of this opportunity is to be
imputed to Mr, Pitt, — whether or not he was sincere
in his desire to overcome the King's objection to
Mr, Fox, — are questions which every one must de
cide for himself. There seem to me, however, to
be strong reasons for concurring in the opinion
which Lord Malmesbury tells us that Mr, Canning
expressed to him : that ' Pitt might have done more
with the King,' and for believing that the will was
wanting. In 1852 Lord Stanhope (then Lord Mahon) printed
for private circulation certain correspondence between
Mr. Pitt and Lord Melville on the state of the Admi
nistration at the beginning of 1804. Firmly im
pressed, as he states himself to be with the conviction
that every week for which the existence of Mr.
Addington's Government might be protracted, would
be attended with increased danger to the country, Mr.
Pitt avows his intention of 'endeavouring by par-

90 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' liamentary means' to effect a change. With this
view he proposed to write to the King to explain the
dangers which, in his opinion, threatened both his
crown and people from the continuance of the existing
Government, and to urge upon His Majesty the ne
cessity of a change which should result in the forma
tion of a Govemraent of ' a strong and coraprehensive
' nature,' But he adds that various considerations, and
especially the King's last illness, induce him to ' feel
' that a proposal to take into a share of his counsels
' persons against whom he has long entertained such
' strong and natural objections, ought never to be
' raade to him, hut in such a manner as to leave him a
' free option, and to convince him thai if he cannot he
' sincerely convinced of its expediency, there is not a wish
' to force it upon him.' He adds that, from his know
ledge of the King's character, he thinks this would be
the most likely method to obtain his consent to the
forraation of a strong Governraent ; and then proceeds
to say that, having taken this- step, whatever raight be
the result, he (Mr, Pitt) would have acquitted himself
of his duty to the King ; and if it produces no effect,
' / should then,' he adds, ' have no hesitation in taldng
' smih ground in Parliament as would he most likely to
' attain the object.'
What is the plain English of this, but that if the
King persisted in supporting Mr, Addington's Go
vernraent, and in excluding Mr. Pitt, he was to be
forced, if possible, by ParUaraentary attacks, into
accepting the latter as his Minister ; but, having con-

LOED GREY. 91
sented to this step, he was to be indulged in his ani
mosity to Mr. Fox or any one else ? Under no circum
stances could that conduct be right in Mr, Pitt's own
case which was wrong in Mr, Fox's ; yet he was, if
necessary, to be forced upon the King by Parliamentary
pressure, while Mr, Fox's exclusion was to be ac
quiesced in.
Lord Melville in his answer assumes that if Mr,
Pitt is called upon to form a new Administration, it
will be upon what he calls the ' narrow basis.' Indeed
it seems hard to imagine how any other expectation
could have been entertained after the assurances which
Mr, Pitt announced his intention of giving to the King,
that those against whom he entertained ' such strong
' and natural objections,' should not be forced upon
him ; and a ' knowledge of the King's character '
should have led Mr, Pitt to a directly opposite conclu
sion from that to which he came. But Lord Melville
adds that he should be 'sorry if the business should
' end that way ' (in the formation of a Government on
the narrow basis), ' being' he says, ' as convinced as he
' ever was of anything in his life, that nothing can
' bring the country out of its difficulties except a sus-
' pension of political animosities, and a collection of
' all the talents, vigour, and experience of the country
' in one general mass of energy and action.' Should
Mr. Pitt be unable to effect this, he urges the necessity
at least of distinct explanations both with Mr. Fox
and Lord Grenville, and of an understanding with
them, without which, he asks iu conclusion, whether

92 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' the Government forraed on the narrow scale would be
' much hetter than the presenti
Mr, Rose appears also to have disapproved of the
determination taken by Mr. Pitt, in which he thought
he ' had not acted upon his own cool and temperate
' judgment,' and ascribes it (unjustly as it seems frora
what is above stated) to Lord Melville and the ' eager
' irapatience of that nobleraan for office.' Mr. Rose
expresses great indignation against those who insisted
on Mr. Fox's immediate adraission into the Cabinet ;
that is, against those who, like my father and Lord
Grenville, would not acquiesce in the principle of
exclusion on which the new Cabinet was to be founded ;
but fears rauch, ' though Mr, Pitt can lose no character,
&c.,' yet that ' he risks loss of consequence ' to a very
great extent, and looks upon ' the forming an Admi-
' nistration with little more than some of the late
' Ministers (whom we have been holding up to ridi-
' cule for a long time),' considering the attitude
assumed by the Prince of Wales, 'as a desperate
undertaking,'* * The Reverend Editor of the Diaries of the Eight Honourable G.
Eose, in his remarks upon these transactions (vol. ii. pp. 100 et seq.),
quotes a passage from Lord Brougham, warning historians against giv
ing undue faith to contemporary writers, who must necessarily be in
fluenced by their party predilections. And then goes on to offer him
self as glaring an example (to use his own expressions) of ' an obhquity
' of mental vision, produced by party zeal,' and of ' falsehood embraced
' for truth, in order to impute ill motives to those whom they dishke,'
as ever came under my observation. He can see impropriety in the
epithets applied to George III. by Lord Brougham, but none in those
he himself lavishes so freely on Mr. Pox. Nor does it seem to strike
him as unfair, if not positively untrue, to say of that great man, in
1804, that his ' Ufe, it is admitted, was a " hfe of gambhng, intrigue, and
' faction," ' as if such a charge were still applicable ; whereas Lord
Brougham appUes the terms, thus unfairly quoted, to the early folUes
aud irregularities of Mr. Fox's life, which had been long forgotten,
' leaving' (as Lord Brougham adds, in the very passage from which the

LORD GREY. 93
My father thus expresses his own opinion of the
conduct of Mr, Pitt on this occasion. Writing to my
mother on the 8 th May, when the nature of the new
arrangement was known, he says : ' I saw Pitt in the
' House of Lords, and I think he looked very miser-
' able. We have no right to impute any unfairness to
' him, for he always avowed that he would do as he
' has done ; but I would rather be any man in England
' than him,' And again a few days later, ' I do not
' say so but to those to whom I can speak confi-
' dentially, but nothing can exceed my contempt for
the meanness of his conduct. In public, I say, as
' indeed I am bound to say, that we have no right to
' complain, but I should be sorry to think that either
' Fox or I, if placed in the same situation, could have
' acted as he has done.'
Of my father's own conduct in adhering as he did to
Mr, Fox, involving as it did the prospect of a probably
perpetual exclusion from office, there ean be, I should
imagine, but one opinion ; and it certainly contrasted
very strongly with the principles on which many public
men of that day were not ashamed to act, and even to
avow that they acted.*
above words are taken, but which the Reverend Editor does not quote)
' the noble heart and sweet disposition of that great man unscathed
' in passing through an ordeal, which, in almost every other instance,
' is found to deaden all the kindly and generous affections.' I find
no fault with the Editor of these Diaries for expressing ari opinion un
favourable to the Whigs as to these transactions. Every man has a
right to form and declare his own. I will cmly say mine is exactly the
reverse of his, and that the perusal of Mr. Rose's Diaries confirms in
my mind the views whioh I have taken.
* See letterfrom Sir A. Hamond, described as a distinguished naval
of&cer, and I believe a member of George III.'s household, to Mr.
Eden, in the Journals and Correspondence of Lord Auckland, lately

94 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
To Mr. Pitt's new Adrainistration, forraed as it was,
my father thought as little confidence was due as to that
which had preceded it : ' For though,' he writes, on the
17th May, ' we would have joined Pitt to forra a strong
' Administration, we never can be supposed to have
' entertained the opinion that he alone could give that
' character to what he has retained of the last, and the
' miserable irabecility which he has added to it.'
Opposition, therefore, now resuraed its natural and
accustomed course, but with this important difference,
that the honourable conduct of Lord Grenville and his
party in refusing to concur in the exclusion of Mr.
Fox, had drawn thera and the Whigs still closer
together, and Mr, Fox could write, in October 1804,
that ' Opposition seeras now restored, at least to what
' it was before the Duke of Portland's desertion and
' the otber adverse circurastances of the tiraes.' But
as ray father had again for sorae months retired to
Northumberland, he adds, ' Mind I say, seems, for if
' you stay away, it will be very far from being really
' so ; and whatever is gained will be thought by all,
' and raost certainly by me, a bad exchange for you.'
pubhshed. He congratulates Mr. Eden, who had been an active parti
san of Lord North, and a strong supporter of the Coalition Government
in 1783, on his extrication ' out of an entanglement that bore the
' worst of aspects,' i. e. his connection with a party out of favour at
Court, and with little hope of restoration to power. ' As to Charles
Fox,' he adds, ' though I admire his abilities as much as anybody can,
' yet I am convinced that nothing but the death of the King, or a war,
' can bring him forward, and therefore I consider him destined to pass
' the greatest part of his life in Opposition. I have heard the King
' speak of him with that indignation, that I really believe he would
' rather sacriflce everything than allow him to come forward. Se there-
'fore oiight not to expect that people who are noway proscribed, should con-
' tinue their adherence beyond certain limits,'- — Correspondence of William.
1st Lord Aucldand, vol. i. p. 362.

LORD GREY. 95
Mr, Fox's letters to my father abound in similar
passages expressive of the importance which he at
tached to his advice and co-operation, without which
he had said, as already quoted, that 'all hope of
' any good in the country, nay, of any aUeviation of
' evil, was at an end.' And he had looked to my
father as the fittest person to be placed at the head of a
liberal ministry, if such should be formed. ' Make up
' your mind,' he writes to him in February 1804, ' to
' be what you must be if things take the turn which I
' think not improbable, / will give you every assist-
' ance, but you must be at the head.'
When, however, the reconstruction of the Govern
ment under Mr, Pitt, in May 1804, to the exclusion
of the parties both of Mr. Fox and Lord Grenville,
had led to a more direct and avowed union between
these last, and the acknowledged weakness of the
Administration induced the belief that Mr, Pitt would
be compelled to enter into negotiations for the forma
tion of a Government on a more extended basis, Mr,
Fox wrote : ' As to yourself you know my wishes ;
' but if a great sacrifice were made (a sacrifice which
' I feel quite sure will never be made) * on the other
' side, perhaps it would be expected that the nominal
' head should be a person less marked than you or I.' f
* The resignation, namely, of Mr. Pitt, as a preliminary to any nego-
tiation'Jor a new Government.
\ In' Mr. Rose's Diaries, &c., we find an interesting account of the
conversations he had at the end of 1804 with the King at Weyraouth
and at faistiwn place, CuffneUs. Mr. Rose expresses very strongly his
own opinion of the absolute necessity of strengthening the Government ;
the King would then, Mr. Rose says, have consented to admit as many
of the members of the Pox or GrenviUe parties, excepting only Mr. Fox

96 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
No overtures, however, were made by Mr. Pitt,
though reports of such an intention on his part were
constantly renewed during the whole of the short
Administration which terminated with his death in
January 1806, Attempts, indeed, at negotiations
seera to have been set on foot during the same period
from Carlton House, having for their professed object
the formation of a strong Administration ; but they
also came to nothing. A sine qui, non condition, in my
father's opinion, before any proposition from Mr. Pitt
could be even entertained, was the resignation by that
Minister of his situation as head of the Governraent,
aild a declaration that his Ministry was at an end.
' I do not think,' ray father writes to Mr, Whitbread,
on the subject of possible overtures from Mr. Pitt,
and after giving other reasons for thinking that if
raade they would come to nothing — ' he will ever
' bring himself to relinquish his present office, which I
' hope Fox will insist on as a sine qua non,' There
was, ray father thought, a material difference between
coraing in on equal terms with Mr. Pitt, and coming
in to hira ; and he was further strongly of opinion
that if they consented to take office at aU, they ought
to provide a security for their principles being acted

himself, as Mr. Pitt desired. But in September, 1805, he extended his
objections to the whole Opposition, and ' stated a positive determina-
', tion against taking a single individual from the Opposition,' &c Mr
Eose attributed this change of feeling on the parly of the Kino-— though
only the natural consequence of Mr. Pitt's original acquiescence in the
exclusion of Mr. Fox— to the secret machinations of Lord Hawkesbury
the Chancellor, &c. The King's opinion of his several Ministers, as ex
pressed m these conversations, is curious if not very flattering.— i?ose's
Diaries and Correspondence, &c. vol. ii. pp. 155 et seo. -

LORD GREY. 97
upon, by insisting upon having a majority in the
Cabinet. 'In short,' he concludes, in the letter to
Mr, Whitbread above quoted, ' on all sides I see so
' much difficulty, and, in every result, so little pros-
' pect of good, that, in the first place, I cannot beUeve
' any new arrangement including us will take place,
' and in the next, I have no wish that such an arrange-
' ment should be effected,'
With such opinions on one side, and with Mr.
Pitt's well-known arrogance of disposition on the
other, which, as Mr. Fox said, rendered him incapable
of ' acting fairly and on a footing of equality with his
' equals,' it was clear that no agreement could be
come to, nor is it to be wondered at that none was
consequently attempted. Mr, Pitt was therefore re
duced to the painful necessity of endeavouring to
strengthen himself by a reconciliation with the very
Minister he had so lately joined in opposing; and
such a reconciliation (proving however but short-lived)
was effected in the autumn of 1804, This gave him
fbr the time a large majority in the House of Com
mons over the united parties of Mr. Fox and Lord
Grenville on all subjects of either foreign or domestic
policy. He was supported on the questions of the
Continued Suspension of the Irish Habeas Corpus
Act,* and of the rupture with Spain,t by majorities of
* The first reading of the Bill for suspending the Habeas Corpus
Act in Ireland was carried by 112 to 33. The motion for going into
Coinmittee on the BiU, by 159 to 54.
f Mr. Pitt's motion for an Address on the rupture with Spain was
carried by 313 to 106. H

98 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
between three and four to one ; while a motion by Mr,
Windhara on the Defence of the Country,* and another
by Mr, Sheridan for the repeal of the Additional Force
Bill f (the latter only carried in the preceding session
by the narrow majority, in a full house, of forty-four)
were negatived by raajorities of more than two to one.
The rupture with Spain was the only question on
which ray father (who had reluctantly yielded to Mr.
Fox's repeated solicitations that he would attend the
session of 1805) took a leading part. On Mr. Pitt's
raotion (Feb. 11) for an address to the King, afflrming
their conviction of the justice of the war, and giving
Govemraent credit for the ' fairness and moderation '
which had marked their conduct towards Spain, he
proposed an amendraent by which, instead of express
ing such approbation of the conduct of Ministers, he
asked the House to record its opinion of their ' errors,'
and of the ' fatal consequences that have resulted
' from them ;' aud while repeating the assurance of their
readiness to support His Majesty to the utraost ' in every
' measure necessary to assert the rights and vmdicate
'the honour of his Crown,' to point out that those
objects ' could never be successfully pursued by negli-
'gent and undecided counsels, nor attained by the
' violation of those engagements on which those with
' whora they treated had rested their security.'
My father admitted in the course of his speech that
the treaty of San Ildefonso between Prance and Spain,
raight in itself have been a justifiable cause of war
* Negatived by 242 to 96. f Ditto by 267 to 127.

LOED GREY. 99
with the latter power. But having consented not so
to consider it, if the Spanish Government did not go
beyond the stipulations of that treaty in support of
France ; and having, tacitly at least, acquiesced in the
substitution of succour in money, for the stipulated
succour in men ; Spain having further yielded to those
demands on our part, without which she was informed
that her neutrality could not be respected ; our con
duct in seizing the treasure ships without any previous
declaration of war, and in the absence of any fresh pro
vocation, was not only unjust towards Spain, but dis
graceful to the Government which was guilty of it.
In the discussions relating to the impeachment of
Lord Melville, brought forward by Mr. Whitbread and
carried against the Government, and in the course of
which the short-lived alliance between Mr. Pitt and
the Addingtons was again dissolved, my father took
little part. He supported Mr, Whitbread, however,
in the course proposed, of proceeding by impeachment
in preference to a criminal information ; and he re
peUed an attack which Mr. Canning, in an intemperate
speech, directed against ' the friends of Sir John Jervis
' and the kindred of Sir Charles Grey ' for now ' join-
' ing to hunt down ' the nobleman, who, when ' these
'eminent commanders' Were attacked in 1795, for
their conduct in the West Indies,* ' had stood forward
* They had commanded the combined naval and military forces by
which Martinique and other West India islands were captured in 1794 ;
and seldom, I beUeve, has so cordial an understanding exi,3ted between
our admirals and generals in any similar expedition.
H 2

100 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
' as the raost zealous of their defenders,' In answer to
this, ray father, after detailing the nature of the attack
then raade, and the circurastances under which Lord
Melville, as a raember of the Government, had resisted
it, proceeded .: ' The right honourable gentleman has
' spoken as if those noble persons received favours
' from the noble lord who appeared in their defence.
'But I utterly disclaira the existence of any such
' favours. The noble lord had defended thera, because
' they had served with credit and honour those by
' whora they were employed. This justice was due, not
' only to their particular merits, but it was due also
' to the country whose interests they had promoted.'
Shortly before the prorogation of Parliaraent (on
the 20 th of June), ray father moved an address to the
King, praying His Majesty not to resort to such a mea
sure until he should be enabled to give more full in
forraation as to his relations with Foreign Powers, and
as to his views and prospects in the contest in which he
was engaged. In support of his raotion he showed
what he conceived to be the generally critical state
of public affairs. He pointed out the unsatisfactory
condition of our finances, with a debt increased in two
years by the sura of thirty miUions, in the face of
the assurance given by the Ministers that the resources
of the country were sufficient to meet the expenditure
of the war. On the other, hand, he called attention,
notwithstanding our enormous expenditure, to the in
adequacy of our arraaraents; no sufficient addition

LORD GREY. 10]
having been made to our regular army ; and our navy,
in spite of the attacks made by Pitt on its administra
tion by Lord St. Vincent, being still in an inefficient
state, as proved by the escape of the different French
squadrons then at sea, and the fears felt at that mo
ment for the safety of our colonial possessions. He
praised the spirit of loyalty that animated the people :
' Never,' he said, ' was the spirit of the whole nation
' more determined to resist every attack on their in-
' dependence, and to defend themselves at aU hazards.'
The state of Ireland, too, he thought afforded
ground of satisfaction, owing chiefly ' to the concilia-
' tory administration of Lord Hardwicke,' though much
remained to be done ; and he urged especially, as the
only means of converting that country from a source
of weakness, as it had hitherto been, to one of real
strength to England, the necessity of removing every
obstacle to the entire satisfaction ofthe Roman Catho
lic body. ' Much indeed,' he added, ' had been done '
(in producing a good feeling towards England) ' by
' the example of the consequences of French aid to
' those who ever looked with any degree of hope to
' the effects of French co-operation.' . . . ' There is
' reason to hope that the Irish now see the advantage
' of British connection, and that they know that what
' they have to expect from the liberality and policy
' of Great Britain, would be utterly lost by French
' conquest ; that by contributing to the injury of their
' natural friends by a correspondence with France,
' they would only be adding themselves to the Ust of

102 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' those slaves whom France had reduced under her
' dorainion, either in an abject dependence, or totally
' stripped of their narae and existence as nations,'
With respect to continental poUtics, he fully ad
mitted that the ' interests of this country are inti-
• mately connected with those of the Continent,
' because without a great and powerful co-operation on
' the Continent, there can be no chance of reducing the'
' power of France ; and because, faUing that, unless
' the Great Powers take a part in negotiation in one
' shape or other, any hope of perraanent peace will be
' much weakened,' But though he deprecated on
these grounds the conclusion of a separate peace, and
thought that great responsibility would attach to those
who raight conclude one, even this might be preferable
to the continuance of the war, in case the co-operation
or concert of other Powers in negotiation should
lead to no result. It was therefore, he thought, ' the
' iraperious duty of the House to call upon Ministers
' to give us sorae rational prospect of pursuing the
' war with success, or to explain to us that peace on
' equitable and honourable terras is not tobe obtained.'
The ignorance in which the House was kept as to the
nature of the pacific overtures which had been mad-e
by France, and as to the state of our relations with
other Powers, particularly with Russia — ^added to the
unsatisfactory state of our finances as well as of our
military raeans — were the reasons which induced him
to move this address.
The motion was strongly supported by Mr, Wind-

LORD GREY. 103
ham and Mr. Fox— opposed by Mr. Pitt, Mr, Canning,
and Lord Castlereagh — and negatived by a majority of
two hundred and sixty one, to one hundred and ten.
Upon the questions above referred to, and upon
others of minor interest that occurred during this
session, but requiring no special notice here, there
had been a general coincidence of opinion between the
old and the new Oppositions,* and they had, for the
most part, concurred heartily in their attacks upon the
Government. But during the recess another subject
came under discussion, on which not only was the
agreement between the parties less entire — but in
volving no slight danger of-the revival of former
differences. That question had reference to our continental
policy ; for though my father had admitted, as already
stated, that ' without a great and powerful co-opera-
' tion on the Continent, there could be no chance of
' reducing the power of France, &c, ;' yet both he and
Mr, Fox were strongly opposed to the system of en
deavouring to obtain such co-operation by means of
large subsidies ; and to such a system the GrenviUes
had been too long parties, as members of Mr, Pitt's first
Administration, to admit of their now uniting with
the Whigs to condemn it. They consequently objected
to the attack which, before the fatal result of the
German campaign of 1805 was known (though all
* In the correspondence between my father and Mr. Fox, the Whig
and GrenviUe parties, are constantly thus distinguished.

104 LIFB AND OPINIONS OP
the inteUigence received seemed to point surely and
inevitably to that result), Mr Fox thought ought to be
directed against Mr. Pitt, for having ' set on foot the
' ill-tiraed, rash, and ill-concerted attack of the
' Austrians, without waiting either for Prussia, or
' even for the Russian armies that were to form so
' main a part of the strength,' The chief reason given
by them for objecting, was the fear that such attacks
would 'tend to destroy all hope and spirit here.'
And Mr. Windham, in writing on the subject to my
father, expressed his ' regret and alarm at the extent
' to which Mr. Fox carried his doctrine of not resisting
' by force.' The difference'of opinion between thera on
this point, would, he thought, render it necessary that
they should in the ensuing session, ' raove in two or
' three separate columns ; all, however, he hoped, assist-
' ing each other, and tending to one point.' My father,
however, saw in these 'separate colurans, or rather
' these separate armies,', a probably ' great advantage
' to Pitt,' and he feared that 'instead of meeting in one
' point, it will end in some of them joining him.'
When the news arrived of the catastrophe of Aus
terlitz, this danger seemed to be materially lessened ;
and my father, in writing to Mr. Fox, expresses his
hope that ' should the continental war be over, the
' motions for inquiry that wUl be obvious ; and of
' censure, if upon the result of that inquiry it should
' appear that we urged Austria to acts of direct hos-
' tiiity before Prussia was engaged, before the Russian

LORD GREY. 105
' army could arrive, and even before we ourselves
' were prepared to make the slightest move in her
' support,' , , . would not occasion ' any diversity of
' opinion.' The turn, however, that affairs might take in the
. ensuing session seemed still doubtful ; and Mr. Fox
wrote on the 10th of January 1806, that 'he was
' more sanguine than he had been about our all agree-
' ing, though God knows far from feeling anything
' like certainty,' ' I do not think,' he proceeds, ' that
' any of our friends, or even the Ministry, are mad
' enough to wish for another campaign in Germany,
' even with the Russians ; but the difficulties wiU be
' of a minor kind, arising from apprehensions which I
' deem unreasonable, lest the condemnation ofthe par-
' ticular attempt should imply a condemnation of the
' general system.'
All these doubts and speculations, however, were
speedily set at rest by the unexpected death of Mr,
Pitt, which occurred soon after the opening of the
session, without his having been once able to appear
in Parliament ; and whatever might have been the
consequences of the differences above alluded to, had
the two parties continued to occupy the Opposition
benches, they were soon cordially and firmly united
under Lord Grenville, in an Administration powerful
in everything but the support of the Court,

106' LIPE AND OPINIONS OF

CHAPTER III,
Prom the Death op Mr. Pitt, and Formation op the Whig Motibtry
IN 1806, TO MY Father's removal to the House of Lords in 1807.
On the death of Mr, Pitt, the parties of Lord Gren
viUe and Mr, Fox came into power ; and were united
under the former as First Lord of the Treasury, and
the latter as Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, m.
a Governraent — powerful, as I have already remarked,
in aU but the support of the Court,
The King, it is believed, had done aU he could to
avoid the necessity of calling the Whigs to his councUs ;
and during the five days that elapsed before he com
missioned Lord Grenville to form a new Administra
tion, is supposed to have endeavoured to induce Lord
Hawkesbury, or indeed any other raember of the old
Administration who should have nerve for the task,
to undertake the responsibility of still carrying it on.
But though it would thus appear that the new
Government was, in a raanner, forced upon the King,
and he seeras to have been ready to seize the first
opportunity of getting rid of it, yet the circurastances.
attending its forraation appear greatly to strengthen
the suspicion that Mr, Pitt was not sincerely desirous,
in 1804, of obtaining the co-operation of Mr. Fox in

LORD GREY. 107
the Administration; and that, nad he been so, he
would have found no insuperable objection on the part
of the King. For Lord Malmesbury tells us that, on
the death of Mr. Pitt, the King spontaneously adopted
the opinion, contrary to that expressed by the Duke
of York, that the presence of Mr. Fox in the Cabinet
was essential to the stability of any Government that
might now be formed,
Mr, Rose, also the devoted friend of Mr, Pitt, sees
the probability that this inference may be drawn from
what now occurred: 'His Majesty,' he says, 'had
' made up his mind to admit of such an Administration
' as should be recommended to him, without any exclu-
' sion. The promptitude with which that determina-
' tion is taken may, I think, lead to a suspicion in
' some minds, that Mr. Pitt had not made all the exer-
' tions he stated to his friends he had done, for pre-
' vailing with the King to admit Mr. Fox to his
' councils ; the certainty of which, however, is as clear
' to me as my own existence,'*
In the Government now formed, my father was ap
pointed First Lord of the Admiralty, and was made at
once to experience all the annoyances to which men in
power are ever subject, and which to him were pecu
liarly painful, arising from the impatience and unrea
sonable complaints of friends, either angry at being
passed over altogether, or dissatisfied with the arrange
ments proposed for them.
* Diaries of Right Hon. G. Rose, vol. ii., p. 236.

108 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
No man was ever less exacting for himself; and he
was at all times ready to abandon any claims of his
own to those of his friends — happy if, by so doing, he
could satisfy and remove discontent on the part of
others. To a dear personal friend, and one of the
raost unreasonable of those who considered theraselves
aggrieved by not being included in the new arrange
ments, he thus writes: 'The very few words you
' uttered to rae to-night have hurt me beyond expres-
' sion ; not only as they showed the mortification you
' suffer, which can never happen without pain to me,
' but as they conveyed something like reproach for my
' neglect of you. What could I do ? . , . I stated ray
' wishes to Fox, ... I ara, for myself, the worst soli-
' citor in the world ; and perhaps the sarae feeling
' may make me not so good an advocate as I ought to
' be for my friends. But could I do more than suggest
' the arrangeraent which would be most gratifying to
' me, and leave it to hira (Fox), to take the necessary
' steps, or rather such steps as he could take, for that
' purpose ?'
Again he says, ' Indeed, the subject which appears
' to hurt your feelings so rauch, is not less painful to
' mine ... I cannot ask for the  . Fox has
' heard me say enough to be out of all doubt as to my
' wishes. Upon ihis 1 shall not say another word, for
' I cannot be pressing for myself. With this feeling I
' play at a very unequal garae, for I do not meet
' with the sarae forbearance in others, particularly in

LORD GREY. 109
' some of my new colleagues.' And in real bitter
ness of spirit at such repeated and unjust accusa
tions of neglecting his friends, he writes at another
' time : ' I have not had a moment's happiness since
' this cursed arrangement began ; and I am now
' going to have another sleepless night. I wish to
^ God I could satisfy all discontents by resigning my
' own office.'
I must take this opportunity of protesting against
the gross injustice which has, since 1830, been done to
my father on this question of patronage ; for I may
fearlessly assert that, of all the unjust accusations that
have ever been made against a public man, there is
none that is more unjust, or more unfounded, than that
which it has been sought to flx upon him, of nepotism
in the distribution of his patronage, when Minister
from 1830 to 1834, And I have sometimes doubted
whether we have been right in treating this charge
with the silent contempt with which it has ever been
met, when repeated, as it has been, ad nauseam, by
vulgar opponents in speeches and newspaper articles.
Several relatives no doubt held office in his administra
tion, but they were all, with scarcely an exception,
those who had already achieved for themselves a posi
tion in the Whig ranks that would not have allowed
them to be passed over, totaUy irrespective of their
connection with my father, in any Liberal Government
that was formed. Without going into details, though
this would be easy, my short answer, then, to the

110 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
charge of nepotism is, that to no one of his own faraily
did he give either pension or place, as a raeans of pro
viding for thera, during his tenure of office, Comrais-
sionerships of Customs and Excise, and of Greenwich
Hospital and other places, which have usuaUy been
considered by Ministers, both before and after his time;
as fair appointments for sons or nephews, &c,, fell to his
disposal ; but he invariably gave them to those who
had the strongest claims upon the Party— and this
with seven younger sons of his own, all indifferently
provided for, not one of whom benefited in the remotest
degree hy his being for four years at the head of the
Government. As he himself says, in the letter quoted
above, no one was ever so little pressing for hiraself.
And yet this is the raan who is to go down to posterity
with the charge of nepotism affixed to his narae !*

* Since the above was written, I have read the GrenviUe Correspond
ence, published by the Duke of Buckingham, and the Diaries, &c. of
Mr. Q. Rose, edited by Mr. Vernon Harcourt. Who that has read the
former, has not tumed with something approaching disgust from the
pertinacious advancement of personal pretensions : the querulous com
plaints for claims disregarded ; the demand for places and pensions or
the reversion of sinecure offices ; the eagerness, in short, with which a
' provision ' from the public purse was sought by those who figure in
this correspondence, for themselves or friends ! Even Mr. Pitt, whose
disinterestedness (against which I do not wish to say a word) it has
been the fashion to exalt at the expense of my father, made it his dying
request, according to Mr. Rose, that pensions of from £1200 to £1500
a year should be granted to each of his three nieces, daughters of Lord
Stanhope, and of £1000 a year to each of his two nephews ! Mr. Pi.tt
received, I believe, the salaries both of the First Lord of the Treasury
and Chancellor of the Exchequer — besides being Warden of the Cinque
Ports— a total of from £13,000 to £15,000 a year. My father had the
salary of First Lord of the Treasury alone, which it was one of the first

LORD GREY. Ill
The measures of the Grenville Administration are
matters of history, into which I do not wish to enter
further than as my father was personally concerned iii
them. And while he was at the head of the Ad
miralty, the duties of the office being too heavy to
admit of his taking much part in the general business
of Government, his name seldom appears in the de
bates of the House of Commons, where, indeed, his
attendance during this time was very uncertain.
Of his administration of the Admiralty I may con
fidently affirm, that at no time was more energy dis
played in preparing the means for defeating the mari
time enterprises of France ; never were those means
more judiciously applied ; and never was the success
which resulted from them more signal or decided.
But he was only too soon called to a more promi
nent position in the party and Government, Towards
the middle of June Mr. Fox's health had become such
as to excite the alarm of his friends ; and some time
before the conclusion of the session he had been forced
to discontinue his attendance in the House of Commons.
It soon became apparent that there was only too much
reason to apprehend a fatal result to his iUness. Still
it was not till towards the middle of August that all
hope of his ultimate recovery was abandoned. On
the 2nd of that month my father wrote to Mr. Whit-

acts of his government to reduce from £6000 to £5000 a year ; nor wiU
one word be found in his most private correspondence, from first to
last, of claim or demand for place, pension, or any pubUo 'provision
whatever, either for himself or any of his friends or relations.

112 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
bread : ' I am happy to say that the good appearance
' and good spirits of Fox to-day, but still more the
' good symptoms, have given me a little gleam of hope,'
This glimmering of hope, however, soon faded away ;
the disease made steady progress, and on the 8 th of
September my father again writes : ' I myself called
' at Chiswick, and if Esculapius himself were to assure
' me there was the slightest chance of poor Fox's reco-
' very, I should not believe him. I had not seen him
' before since he was last tapped, and I was shocked
' at the change since that time. If ever I saw the
* marks of death in a man's countenance, they were
' legible in his, and my own belief is that he has not a
' fortnight to live.'
The end was even nearer than he anticipated. The
next day he again writes : ' Poor Fox is going more
' rapidly than I expected. A sudden faUure of strength
' took place yesterday, about eleven, and he was only
' supported through the day by strong cordials and
' brandy. The account is a little better this raorning,
' but I should not be surprised if he is dead when this
' reaches you,' Frora this to the 13th he raerely lin
gered on without a ray of hope. On that day my
father's last comraunication frora Chiswick announces
that he was ' at the last extreraity,' and before it
closed this illustrious statesraan had breathed his last.
Attached as ray father had been to Mr. Fox for
twenty years, and that with a depth of devotion which
the endearing qualities of that great raan and his trans-^

LORD GREY. 113
cendent talents were so well calculated to inspire— by
none was his loss more keenly felt or more bitterly
deplored. He had lost not only the poUtical chief
by whom, from his first entrance into public life, he
had been distinguished above all others, and by whose
precepts and example he had been confirmed in his
attachment to constitutional liberty, and to principles
based upon a benevolent and comprehensive philan
thropy ; but the friend between whom and himself there
existed an affection, which mutual generosity of feeling
and abnegation of self could not fail to engender. In
truth, these two great statesmen (surely I am justified
in so qualifying my father) had been united in a
stricter, more intimate, and more enduring friendship,
than is often found to smooth the path of public life.
Their whole correspondence breathes the spirit of two
noble, generous, and unselfish natures, whose only
aspirations were for the good of their common country.
To the last hours of his own life my father clung with
unabated affection to the memory of his early political
guide and friend ; and in his latter years it was a source
of self-congratulation with him to reflect, that through
out his connection with Mr. Fox there had never been
the slightest approach to difference between them, that
he had stood by him through evil report and good
report, when some of his earliest friends for a time fell
from him, and that he had deserved the reciprocity of
confidence and affection with which his constant devo
tion had been rewarded.

114 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
My father has recorded his feelings of love and ad
rairation for Mr, Fox in an inscription under his bust
at Woolbeding in Sussex, at that tirae the seat of Lord
Robert Spencer, and a great resort during the intervals
of Parliaraentary business for the chief members of the
Whig party. In. 1822 he also had an intention, why
abandoned I know not, of further recording, his affec
tion for the memory of Mr. Fox by a sirailar inscrip
tion under his bust at Howick, He wrote one for the
purpose, which, after sorae sUght verbal araendraents
by Mr, Tate of Richmond School in Yorkshire, stood
ultiraately as follows : —
Carolus Jacobus Pox
Vir
(Si quis aUus)
Moribus simplex, prsestans ingenio, recti tenax.
Amicus, jucundus, comis, benignus.
UtUitatis neghgens privatse —
PubUcae studiosissimus.
Ob Eloquentiam vi, fulgof e, abundantia
Nee minus, festivitate et venustate exceUentem,
Inter celeberrimos oratores —
Ob Fidem, Benevolentiam, Probitatem, Constantiam,
Inter Optimos Cives, numerandus,
Et dignua quem homines Universi amarent
Ut humanarum injuriarum presentem vindioem.
ImmortaU Viro,
Carolus Comes Grey
Per viginti annos
Sanctissima cum eo amicitift conjunctus,
Ejusque preceptis, exemplo, auctoritate.
Ad Instituta Majorum
Et Civium jura tuenda, instructus
Hoo pro se,
Quod sui omnes diu oontemplentur,
Pietatis et Desiderii
Monumentum
Ex animo dedicat.

LOED GREY. 116
On the death of Mr, Fox my father lost no time in
paying the last mournful tribute of affection to his
memory, by arranging with his other friends, and with
the consent of his nephew. Lord Holland, for his funeral
in Westminster Abbey.
My father now stood in Mr. Pox's- place as leader
of the Whig section of the Government, and it fell
upon him to discuss with Lord Grenville the new
arrangements rendered necessary by the untimely
death of that great man.
He proposed three plans : —
1st, To take the Foreign Office himself, with the
lead of the House of Commons, Mr, Thomas Grenville
succeeding him at the Admiralty, and Lord Holland
being appointed Privy Seal.
2nd, To remain himself at the Admiralty, Lord
Holland succeeding his uncle as Foreign Secretary.
And, 3rdly. To go out of office altogether himself, or
to go up to the House of Lords either as President of
the CouncU or Privy Seal, Mr. George Ponsonby (then
Irish Chancellor) taking the lead of the House of Com
mons and the Horae Department, Lord Holland the
Foreign Sea,ls, and Lord Spencer the Admiralty.
The only condition on which he thought it was due
to Mr, Fox's friends that he should insist as a sine qua
non, was that either Lord Holland or himself should
succeed to the Foreign Office,
The Prince of Wales was at this time an avowed
partizan of Mr, Fox's ; and I must here insert two
I 2

116 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
letters written by hira to ray father, when he first
heard of the loss which the Whigs had sustained in the
death of their great leader, and of the arrangeraents
which were in contemplation forthe reconstruction ofthe
Ministry, These had been immediately communicated
to him by my father ; and I insert his answers, both
because they show how completely at this- time the
Prince identified himself with the Whig party (a
curious fact to note, considering the relations in which
he afterwards placed himself, both as Regent and
King, towards that party), and because the tone of the
letters must set at rest many idle stories that have
been related of an estrangement of long standing, and
of its causes, between His Royal Highness and my
father, ' Knowsley, Sept. 18, 1806.
' My dear Grey,
' I am hardly in a state to write at aU, much
' less to answer your very friendly letter. As to ray
' feelings it would be superfluous to say anything, as
' they exceed aU beUef, and aU power of description,
' I consider the loss we have sustained as incalculable
' to the country, and irreparable to aU his friends, and
' to rayself in particular. Having, frora the earUest
'period of ray Ufe, when I first entered a political
' career, looked up to no one but to Pox ; having been
' constantly and invariably attached to him and to his
• principles ; having trodden that path which he marked
' out for me ; and having been guided through it by the

LORD GREY. 117
' support of his hand ; I do candidly acknowledge to
' you, that the differende is so prodigious, the loss so
' immense, that my thoughts are quite bewildered, and
' that as yet I have not been able to collect my ideas
' so as to bring them to any one point.
' As to Lord Grenville, for whom I entertain the
'very highest personal regard and friendship, I felt
' quite confident that you would find him everything
' that could be wished or expected from a strictly
' honourable and great-minded man ; which opinion I
' have long entertained of him, and which induced me
' so anxiously to wish to bring him and our de-
' parted and for-ever-to-be-lamented friend together,
' and to frame and consolidate that union in which I
' afterwards so fortunately succeeded. But as to our-
' selves, my friend, the old and steady adherents and
' friends of Fox, we have but one line to pursue, one
' course to steer — to stick together, to remain united,
' and to prove by our conduct, in our steady and un-
' shaken adherence to those principles which we imbibed
' from Fox, when living, that now, though alas ! he is
' no more ! that we were not merely nominally his
' friends, but that we are not unworthy of him, and that
' his memory wUl for ever live in our hearts. In say-
' ing this, all I mean to convey is, what my sentiments
' are as to the line which it behoves us to trace, and
' abstractedly attaches to us, as the old, firm, and uni'-
'•form adherents of Fox,
' As to my opinions, if I can form any at the present
' moment, and to which I profess myself perfectly

118 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' unequal, it does appear to rae that everything ought
' to be done which can be done, for every possible
' reason, to convince and to substantiate to our own
' nation, as well as to foreign powers, that such is the
' respect, such the regard, that the present Ministers
' not only feel individually as raen, but collectively as
' a Government, for the memory of our dear departed
' friend, and such the estimation in which they hold his
* principles, and the reverence with which they view
' the great and enlightened system which he had pre-
' pared, and was so indefatigably pursuing ; and which
' no one was able to frarae but hiraself; and which there
' is no doubt he would have successfully brought to the
'desired point; that they are resolutely resolved,
' steadily and firraly to adhere to, and to follow up
' those ideas, those views, those plans, which were laid
' down by his masterly hand, and which line will be
' attended, 1 have no doubt, with the happiest conse-
' quences, as it will infallibly be the raeans of esta-
' bUshing confidence at home, as weU as all over the
' Continent. ' The simplest and raost natural raode, it does, I
' confess to you, appear to me of effecting this in the
'first instance (subject always to better and wiser
' opinions than raine, and subject also to any subsequent
'arrangeraents that it raight be thought necessary
' or advisable to raake) would be, without any delay,
• not to raake any change whatever just at the present
' raoraent, but to put the seals for the Foreign Depart-
' ment into the hands of Holland. You know Holland

LORD GREY. 119
' too well to make it necessary to say one word about
' him ; but as far as I can aUow or induce myself to
' view anything that tends to business under our
' present most distressing situation, this is what appears
' to me to be the most correct, as well as desirable
' measure, and it cannot but be attended with universal
' satisfaction, and pecuUarly so to all Fox's old friends,
* and, though last, most singularly grateful to myself,
' With respect to what you so delicately state to me,
' my dear Grey, concerning yourself, as you know me
' to detest all flattery, and all prolixity of expression, I
' shall merely say, that the regard and admiration with
' which I have viewed your talents, and the friendship
' which has always subsisted between us, decide my
' opinion upon the propriety and wisdom of those duties
'which rested upon that great and for-ever-to-be-
' lamented man, devolving upon you. It remains only
' for me to assure you how truly happy I shall be, and
' what comfort it will afford me, to communicate in the
' fullest confidence with you, and by every means in
' my power, to aid and strengthen the views and wishes
' of the Government, ' I am, ever,
' Very affectionately yours,
' (Signed) George P.'
My father having told the Prince the plan which
had been proposed for reorganising the Ministry — the
difficulties which interposed — and having aUuded to
the possible alternative of having to declare to the

120 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
King that they were unable to form an AdniinistratiQn
capable of meeting the present crisis, his Royal
Highness wrote in answer, as follows : —
' Private and Secret. ' Doncaster, Sept. 22, 1806.
' My dear Grey,
' Although it is now past three in the morning,
' and that I ara quite knocked up with the long joumey
' of this day, I cannot delay writing a few lines in
' answer to both your letters, the one of which I re-
' ceived at Knowsley this morning previous to my
' departure, and the other which I have this instant
' found on my arrival here, I think myself peculiarly
' fortunate that the cursory view I took in my letter to
' you of our present situation coincides so entirely with
' your opinions ; but I raust candidly and most confiden-
' tially acknowledge to you, that it grieves rae rauch
' that any of Fox's old friends should, of themselves,
' think of retiring from their situations at a moment
' like the present : as there never was a moraent, in my
' poor opinion, that could so iraperiously call upon thera
* to remain in office, were it only by every exertion, on
' their part, to further and bring to bear, as far as lay
' in their power, that general system, but more espe-
' cially that system upon the Continent, which the great
' and powerful mind of our poor friend would soon have
' effected, I think it is a duty they owe his memory,
' and a duty they owe to this country, as well as to
' Europe, For God's sake talk not to me of such an

lord GEEY. 121
' alternative' as you mentioned in the letter which I re
' ceived from you this morning, I really conceive it
' would be ruinous in every point that I can view it ;
' ruinous to the country in the first instance, and ruinous
' to your own reputations in the second ; and I am cer-
' tain, were he alive, it would be what he would deprecate
'more than anything else ; and last of all it would be
' considered as a miserable copy of the grounds which
' the last despicable and odious Administration took,
' upon the death of Pitt, for sending in their resignations:
' My dear friend, this is a strange world we live in,
' and nothing can be done in it without a little temper
' and a little policy. We must do the best we can, and
' because we cannot have everything our own way, we
'must not, therefore, instantly throw up the whole
' game, and by that means become the tool of others,
' This would not be consistent with what we owe to our
' own characters ; to the language we have held ; to the
' line we have publicly pursued ; and, last ofall, to what
' we ought never to lose sight of, — the precepts we have
' learnt from Fox, and what I am confident, were he now
' able to advise, would be his wishes. At the same time
' that I say this, I desire, my good friend, that you will
' clearly understand me — that T by no means mean that
' we should relax in any one instance, to carry such
' points as may be necessary to the completion of those
' great views, nor in any effort that may tend towards
' the accompUshment of them : though there may be
'difficulties and delays, still we must not be dis-

122 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' heartened, but boldly meet them, and, if it should be
' necessary, reasonably to submit to thera. I should
' hope that when you raentioned such an alternative to
* me, you were influenced by the distress imder which
' we were both suffering, and which may mislead the
' very best judgment. Besides what I have already
' said, reflect one instant how fatal it would be to me,
' in this peculiarly delicate and awful raoraent, to be
' left in such a situation by all my friends, exposed to
' the accuraulation of distress both public and private.
' I need not, I ara sure, my dear Grey, say more to you
' than this — only to call upon you to rouse all the
' energies of your mind — but, proudly and with cool
'judgment, let us meet whatever may arise, thereby
* perforraing, to our best, our duties to the country, as
' well as those which we owe to the memory of our
' departed friend,
' I reaUy am so fatigued that I cannot answer for
' any inaccuracies you may find in this letter ; but I will
'answer for my firm and steady adherence to these prin-
' ciples and opinions. ' I am, ever, my dear Grey,
' Most truly yours,
' (Signed) George P,'
It wiU be seen from the above letters that the Prince
wish!ed Lord Holland to succeed his uncle in the
Foreign Office ; and Mr, Fox himself, in the only con
versation in which he seems to have alluded to the

LORD GREY. 123
arrangements to be made at his own death, expressed
a similar desire to Lord Lauderdale, My father also
stated in writing to Lord Grenville that of the three
plans he had proposed he thought the second (that,
namely, which would simply transfer the seals of the
Foreign Office to Lord HoUand) ' would be the most ac-
' ceptable to Fox's friends,' adding that 'the last (that
' which involved his own retirement, or removal at
' least, to the House of Lords), whatever surprise it
' might at first create, would ultimately prove the
'most advantageous,' He then proceeds, with that
abnegation of self which invariably marked his con
duct in such matters : ' As far as I am myself con-
' cerned, I am equally ready to accede to any one of
' the three, if no other arrangement should suggest
' itself to you. My wish is to make all personal con-
' siderations subservient to the general interests of the
' Government ; but I could not give you any useful
' support if I should appear to Fox's friends to have con-
' sented to too great a sacrifice of their influence ; and
' I feel it to be absolutely indispensable in any arrange-
' ment which may be made, that the Seals of the Foreign
' Department should be held either by Lord Holland
' or myself. I must at the same time declare, with
' the most perfect sincerity, that I would, on all
' accounts, infinitely prefer seeing them in his hands to
' holding them myself.'
The great objection to the second plan was the dif
ficulty which my father might find in adding the busi-

124 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
ness of the House of Commons to the very heavy detail
duties of the Admiralty ; and that it also required a
greater re-arrangement of offices, entailing upon others
what they might consider as personal sacrifices. And
such, though ever ready to make them himself, he
says he should be ' unwilling to urge with unreason-
' able importunity upon any one else,'
The advantage of the third plan was that it would
be a final settlement ; and that on the death of his
father, and his own consequent removal to the House
of Lords (an event, as it seemed, in all probabUity not
far distant), no new arrangement would be necessary.
'I foresee,' he writes to Lord Grenville of this
plan — ' that it will startle you ; but upon the whole I
' beUeve it to be the best. Sacrifices must be made by
' somebody, and those which I have offered wUl be made
' with the raost sincere satisfaction, George Ponsonby,
' 1 am persuaded, will prove, if not at first, after a
' short time, the most effective Leader of the House of
'Commons; and, according to this arrangement, no
' farther changes would be necessary.'
The first of the three plans proposed, was, as might
be expected, that which was decided upon by Lord
Grenville, and finally carried into effect. Indeed, he
(Lord GrenviUe) had never contemplated any plan as
possible, in the existing state of the House of Com
raons, which did not give the lead in that assembly to
my father, and seems to have looked forward to his
probably early removal to the House of Lords, as

LORD GREY. 125
likely to involve the breaking up of the Adminis
tration. The political connection between my father and
Lord GrenviUe which was thus commenced in 1806,
continued without interruption, and in a spirit of mu
tual confidence and respect worthy of such high-minded
statesmen, till 1815, In that year the different view
taken by them of the policy which it became England
to adopt on the return of Napoleon from Elba, followed
in 1816 and 1817 by more important differences on
the subject of our domestic policy (and which will be,
more particularly noticed in their place), led to a final
political separation : without, however, impairing those
mutual sentiments of attachment and respect, resulting
from their long union, and the knowledge each had ac
quired of the character and high principle of the other.
Lord GrenvUle's correspondence proves, not only
the importance he attached during this period to
the continuance of my father in the House of Com
mons, but that his own connection with the Whig
Party, through many years of opposition, was main
tained entirely by the confidence he felt he could
repose in him. ' I had great confidence,' Lord Gren
ville writes, after the dismissal of the ministry, and in
speaking, in November 1807, ofthe prospects of the
opposition in which they were then embarked : ' I
'had great confidence in Lord Howick's principles,
'temper, and management. . But Lord Howick being
' gone ' (be had then been removed to the House of

126 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
Lords by the death of his father), ' I have no concep-
' tion that the opposition in the House of Commons can,
' by any other person whatever, be kept within many de-
' grees of those Umits which 1 should prescribe myself.'*
On the other hand, ray father says, in speaking of
Lord Grenville's own conduct during the discussions
consequent upon Mr. Fox's death, and in language
equally applicable to the whole period of their poUtical
connection : ' Everything he has done, and every view
' he has taken of this raelancholy subject, has been
' entirely in that fair and liberal spirit in which the
' union between hira and Mr. Fox was originaUy
' forraed. Nothing indeed could have been in every
' respect raore cordial and more open than the whole
' of his conduct.'
To my father himself the re-arrangement of the
rainistry had not been without a repetition of the an
noyances to which he had been subjected on its first
forraation ; and he now writes to the same friend of
whose conduct he had had to complain on the former
occasion, that they ' would at once have decided him
' to give the whole thing up, if he had thought he could
' do so with honour, or without giving poor Fox's
' friends, a right to coraplain of hira,'
When my father succeeded to the Foreign Office,
* Mr. Wm. Fremantle also, in writing to Lord Buckingham, speaks
of ' Lord- Howick's loss in the House of Commons as irreparable — per-
' fectly so, as long as the connection exists between your friends and
' him, and I am sure you wiU see with me that nothing can take his

LORD GREY. 127
the negotiation with France which had been opened
through 'Lord Yarmouth, and with which Lord Lau
derdale was afterwards charged, was drawing to a close.
Every effort to bring the French Government back to
the basis which they had themselves proposed had
hitherto failed ; and as Lord Lauderdale's further en
deavours to effect that object proved equally vain, he
was ordered to demand his passports, and accordingly
left Paris on his return to England on the 6th of
October, An attempt was made by the French Emperor to
ascribe the failure of this endeavour to restore peace,
to the death of Mr, Fox, and to a departure, on the
part of those who succeeded him in the conduct of our
Foreign Affairs, Irom the policy which had been acted
upon by him. The same impression seems to have
been formed and expressed by Mr, Whitbread, to
whom my father thus writes in December, 1806 : —
' I have received your letter, and cannot express
' my disappointment and regret at the impression which
' the French publication has made upon you.' . . ' The
' more I consider it, the more I am satisfied with
' Lauderdale's conduct. Indeed, I do not see how it
' was possible for him to do what I suppose you would
' have approved more, i.e. to show a greater disposition
' for peace. It was necessary to bring the French back
' to the offer by which they had induced us to enter
' into the negotiation, and the whole time he was at
' Paris he was engaged in an ineffectual struggle for

128 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' that purpose. No professions short of this could be
'satisfactory, even if they were to be trusted; and
' when the conduct of the negotiation comes to be ex-
' amined, I ara rauch raore apprehensive that we shall
' be accused of going: too far in our endeavours to obtain
' peace, than that we did too. little.' . . ' You know
' poor Fox's anxiety for peace, an anxiety certainly
' not lessened by the situation in which he was during
' the negotiation. He entirely approved of Lauder-
* dale's conduct, and thought that the French Govern-
' ment had left him no choice. The last time he spoke
'ofthe negotiation was on the Sunday before he died.
' He then said the great points for the country to ad-
' here to, were : 1st Sicily,* 2nd Russian connection.f
' And on these the negotiation broke off.'
But in truth the negotiation can scarcely be said
from the beginning to have been conducted by Mr,
Pox. Soon after the termination of the first corre
spondence between him and M, de Talleyrand, in which
he make^ concert with Russia a sine qui non, his last
Ulness coraraenced, rendering hira, almost from the
* The basis originally proposed through Lord Yarmouth was that of
the Uti possidetis ;— and as holding Sicily for the King of Naples, expeUed
by the French from his continental possessions, the EngUsh Goverm
ment felt itself bound in honour to insist that it should not be made an
exception to the proposed basis.
t For a short time after the signature ofa separate Treaty on the
part of Russia, by M. d'Oubril, independent negotiations were com
menced, and Lord Yarmouth, rather hastily as it was thought by
Govemment, produced his fuU powers. But when the Russian Govern
ment refused to ratify M. d'Oubril's treaty, the principle of joint nego
tiation was again insisted on.

LORD GREY. 129
first, -incapable of attending to any busiuess, 'He
'has, from the beginning of his iUness,' my father
writes to Mr, Whitbread shortly before its fatal termi
nation, 'banished from his mind all subjects which
'give him any uneasiness. He never inquires, and
' generally changes the subject if you attempt to talk
' to him on the conduct of the war or the progress of
' the negotiation. The whole of the latter has indeed
' been carried on in his name without his reading the
' papers which he has signed.'
His opinion, however, was well knewn to his friends ;
and in mentioning his belief that Mr. Fox had ' never
' read the instructions to Lord Lauderdale, though he
' signed them,' my father adds : ' But I can answer for
' their being in strict conformity with his opinion.'
I may here quote a letter which my father wrote to
Mr. Whitbread in July 1808, in which he again
adverts to this attempt to fix upon those who succeeded
Mr. Fox in the conduct of affairs, and particularly
upon himself as his successor in the Foreign Office,
any blame that might attach to the rupture of this
negotiation, 'I have always,' he says, 'thought it a
' little hard, that a sort of distinction should be made
' upon the question of peace between the other members
' of the Administration, and particularly between
' myself, and Fox. You may be assured that there
' was not a single point insisted upon in the late nego-
' tiation, which he did not think material to be insisted
' on. Above all, the acknowledgment on the part of
K

130 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' the French of the principle on which we had been
' invited to treat. This he thought the more essential,
' as he had trusted to their good faith in the sort of
' irregular communication we had received ; that it
' was quite intolerable, and destroyed aU hope of a
' successful issue, after having drawn us into a nego-
' tiation upon a stated ground, afterwards to recede
' from it ; and that they must be brought back to it,
' or the negotiation raust cease. It was on this point
' that the last letter he ever wrote was written ; and
' though, as his malady increased, his attention to these
' matters lessened, I can most confidently affirra that
' there was nothing done that had not his approbation.'
Our conteraporary historians have generally ap
proved of the course pursued by the Governraent with
respect to these negotiations. But their conduct of
the war has been as fiercely assailed. The failure of
the expedition to Constantinople under Sir John
Duckworth, the fruitless result of that sent from Sicily
to Egypt, and the disastrous termination of that to
South Araerica, have been constantly and raore par
ticularly dwelt upon, as proofs of the want of judgment
or capacity on the part of Ministers, both in planning
and conducting military enterprises. The narrative
of these events belongs properly to history; and as
the War Departraent, and the conduct of the war,
was not under ray father's direction, and he had only
the. liraited responsibility which attaches to every
raember of a Cabinet by which a particular course is

LORD GEEY. 131
adopted, any lengthened notice of them here would be
out of place, I may remark, however, that the judg
ment which has been passed upon the Whig Ministers
for these expeditions seems most undeserved; at all
events as regards those to Constantinople and South
America. Of the former, even that high Tory historian.
Sir A, Alison, admits it to have been well conceived, and
only to have failed through the incapacity of Sir John
Duckworth, and his positive disobedience of orders.
But the failure of this expedition, although owing
to causes over which they had no control, was yet a
source of deep mortification to the Government which
had planned it, but which had left office before the
issue was known. My father in writing on the 2nd of
May to Mr. Adair, at that time our Minister at
Vienna, thus expresses his feelings on the occasion :
'The business of Constantinople has mortified me
' beyond all description, I had thought the arrival of
' so powerful a fleet must have been decisive, nor do
' I think it could have failed of its effect, if so inuch
' time had not been so unaccountably lost in negotia-
' tion, A prompt compliance with our demands, or im-
' mediate hostilities, should have been the alternative,
' and if this had been acted upon, in the state of
' preparation in which the Turkish capital appears to
' have been on the first appearance of our fleet, it
' seems to me nearly certain that the business would
' have been completely done. I have not seen Sir
' John Duckworth's despatches, and do not know how
K 2

132 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' he will justify his conduct ; but his instructions were
' precisely in the spirit in which I have been writing,
' and it will require some strong facts to excuse hira
' for having departed from them. Of course it wiU be
' the object of the partizans of the present Ministers
' to throw the blame on us, and their newspapers are
' teeming with attacks of this nature. The chief charge
' is our not having sent troops ; as if any number we
' could have sent would have been of any use in such
"' a situation, either to attack Constantinople, or to
' hold the castles of the Dardanelles, which might have
' been immediately wrested from them, if they could
' have gained possession of them, by the imraense
* railitary population of those countries. But the
' great object was expedition. The delay of a pre-
' paration to carry any considerable land force, and
' the erabarrassraent which it would have occasioned
' to the fleet, were, in this view, to be avoided. If
' we had done this, tirae would have been given to
' raake an effectual preparation against our passage,
' which any nuraber of troops that we could spare
' would afterwards have been unable to assist in forcing;
' But nothing of this kind was required, or even
' hinted at, by Arbuthnott,* All he desired was, a
' strong squadron, as sure of its effect. This passed,
' as we had been encouraged to believe, without rauch
• difflculty or material loss ; and if it afterwards failed
¦ from uncertainty and indecision, the fault is not ours.'
* British Ambassador to the Porte.

LOED GEEY. 133
Sir John Duckworth's own despatches show that
the prompt and decided operations which were in
tended by the Government, were in the power of the
British fleet in the first instance, and that the oppor
tunity was only lost by his own indecision and hesita
tion. He states in his official despatch, that for a few
hours on Sunday (i. e,, the day after his arrival)
the wind was favourable for carrying the squadron
under the walls of the SeragUo. And that entire
success would have followed such prompt action on his
part (which would indeed have been only in accord
ance with his instmctions), we have the indisputable
evidence of General Sebastiani, the French ambassador
then at the Porte.
On the 4th of March, Sebastiani writes to the Ducde
Raguse, then commanding in the Illyrian provinces :
' Mon G^n^ral, nous avons amuse les Anglais avec des
' negociations pendant tout le temps qui a ete neces-
' saire pour mettre cette capitale en etat de defense ;
' mais des que les ouvrages ont et6 termine's, la Porte
' a signifie' k I'amiral Duckworth qu'elle ne pouvait
' acceder k aucune de ses demandes.' , . . ' Nous avons
' couru ici des dangers. Si I'amiral Anglais le lende-
' main, ou le sur-lendemain de son arrivee, avait tente
' I'entree du Port, nous ne pouvions lui opposer aucune
' resistance, et sa reussite etait complete. Nous
' aurions re9U notre logement aux sept tours,'
If Sebastiani had reason to rejoice at an unexpected
escape from the Seven Towers, Sir John Duckworth had

134 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
no less reason to congratulate himself on an escape
from the Court Martial which surely awaited hira (as I
have oft;en heard my father declare) had the Whig
Ministry remained in office.
Of the expedition to South Araerica, it is weU
known, that it was undertaken without orders from,
or even the knowledge of, the Governraent at horae ;
that the support given to it in the first instance, when
the news of the opening successes reached England,
was in fact forced upon the Ministers ; and that they
raarked their disapprobation of the enterprise, by
bringing Sir Horae Pophara, the chief author of it, to
a Court Martial for having acted without instmctions.
But on the subject of the last-naraed expedition, as
well as upon that of distant operations generally, we
have ray father's opinion on record, in a minute drawn
up by hira at the time, and docketed as ' objections
' intended to have been submitted to the King, if the
' plan for raore extended operations in South Araerica
' had been persevered in,'
In that paper, after expressing his concurrence in
the opinion that it was expedient to send out ' a general
' officer of higher rank to take the coraraand of the
' troops in the River Plata,' with instructions, should
Buenos Ayres have been retaken before his arrival,
to keep possession of it till he can receive further in
structions from home— and, iu the raeantirae, to coUect
and transmit all the information he can as to the state
and disposition of the couutry — he thus proceeds : —

LOED GREY. 135
' Here, I am afraid, my concurrence in the proposed
' measures ends. I have been from the beginning
' adverse to distant expeditions for the purpose of ex-
' tending our colonial possessions. They are neces-
' sarily attended with a further division of our force,
' and with a diminution of our means of acting in'
' Europe. Whilst we are acquiring colonies, the
' enemy is subjugating the Continent ; and though I
' am by no means disposed to raise doubts of our
' ability to maintain the contest in this manner, I can-
' not help fearing the effect of any system which might
' enable the French, either completely to subdue the
' remaining Powers of the Continent, or to engage them
' in opinion against this country. I believe a chief
' cause of our failure in the last war to have arisen from
' the want of a sufficient union amongst the members of
' the Confederacy against France; and we shall be
' again in danger of incurring the same evil, if, whilst
' our allies are caUing upon us for assistance, we
' shall appear to be pursuing separate objects of our
' own. ' In Europe the most formidable danger exists. It
' is there that every effort should be made to stop the
' career of the enemy. Our interest and our reputa-
' tion are equally at stake. Our allies have a right to
' look to us for support, and our honour requires that
,' we should not appear to be wanting to the common
' cause. ' With a view, therefore, to a continuance of the

136 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' war on the Continent, I ara strongly of opinion that
' we should iramediately coUect and prepare for em-
' barkation the largest possible British force that can
' be raade applicable to such a service. The point to
' which this should ultimately be directed I cannot
' pretend now to indicate ; either in the north of Ger-
' raany, or the coast of HoUand, or on that of France
' itself. Engaged as the French armies now are at an
' iramense distance from their own frontier, there must,
' I think, if the war continues, arise opportunities of
' acting for which we ought to be prepared, either to
' assist Russia as a diversion, or to encourage Austria
' and Sweden to take an active part in the contest, , . .
' No time should, in my opinion, be lost in concerting
' the raeans for such an operation,'*
In a defensive point of view also my father thought
that as large a force as possible should be kept in rea
diness at home, and that all further diminution of that
force by 'distant expeditions' should be avoided,
' These opinions,' he proceeds, ' would undoubtedly
' have corapelled rae to object to an original expedi-
* tion for the purpose of raakmg conquests in South
* Mr. Alison is loud in his censure of the Whig Ministry for not
having assisted Eussia before the battle of Friedland. But as Lord
GrenviUe's Administration was dismissed two months before the navi
gation of the Baltic was open, he ought, in fairness, to attribute the
blame of this inactivity to the succeeding Government. They found a
considerable body of troops collected at Cork on their accession to-
office, but not, as evidently appears from the above Paper, intended, as
Sir WiUiam Napier sneeringly insinuates, for ' Quixotic enterprises ' in
South America.

LORD GREY. 137
' America. Such an expedition being undertaken,
' though without the authority of Government, obliged
' us to support it, and I further acquiesced, though
' very reluctantly, in the expedition under General
' Craufurd, which was proposed as a consequence of
' that which had succeeded against Buenos Ayres, and
' with a view to securing the full advantage by a posi-
' tion on the opposite coast, which might be derived
' from that conquest. In the same manner we raust,
' if Buenos .Ayres should already have been retaken,
'after a full view of all the circumstances neces-
' sary for our information, decide upon the expe-
' diency of retaining it. But if no attempt should
' have been made previous to the arrival of the officer
' proposed to be sent out, it becomes in some degree
' an original question, and all the objections which I
* have already stated apply to it.' . . , 'I feel my-
' self corapelled, therefore, to dissent from the pro-
' posal contained in the minute of the Cabinet, being
' of opinion, if Buenos Ayres should not have been
' retaken, that no discretion should be left to the officer
' to be sent out to pursue that object. . . , ' That his
' instructions should be to send to St, Helena, to
' India, and to the Cape, whatever force may be re-
' quired to supply the deficiency in these places ; that
' if Maldonado should be found a tenable position, a
' sufficient garrison should be left to secure that posses-
' sion as one which, from affording a good anchorage
' for our ships, may enable us to Qommand the naviga-

138 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' tion of the river La Plata,' . . . ' And that with the
' force which raay reraain after providing for these ob-
' jects, he should be ordered iramediately to return to
' England.' While these events were in progress abroad, and
before any tidings of the probable results could reach
this country, the Administration of Lord Grenville
had ceased to exist; and it affords another melan
choly proof, amongst raany, of carelessness, if not of
soraething worse, in those who obtain the name of
great historians, that Sir A. Alison says, in speaking
of these events, that public confidence in the Govern
ment had ' already been shaken ' by these ' repeated
' failures abroad,' when the Catholic Question was
raised on which the Administration broke up. The
slightest attention to dates would have shown him that
two of what he calls the failures had not even occurred,
and that the news of the third could not have reached
Bngland till long after the dismissal of the Govern
ment- '
That disraissal took place early tn March 1807, in
consequence of the endeavour of the Govemment to
modify in a very slight degree the existing laws as
they affected the Roraan Catholics.
The claims of the Roman Catholics to an equality
of civU rights with their Protestant fellow-subjects had
long enUsted in their favour the syrapathy and active
exertions of those who were now the leading merabers
of the Government. Lord Grenville had concurred

LORD GREY, 139
in 1801 in Mr. Pitt's resignation, on the ground of his
inability to give effect to the expectations which had
been held out to the Irish Eoman CathoUcs during the
discussions on the Union ; but he had been no party
to, or even cognisant of, the offer which, before the
Addington Ministry was confirmed in office, Mr, Pitt
had made to abandon the Catholic Question if allowed
to retain the Government.*
Mr. Fox had ever been a strenuous supporter of the
principle of religious as well as civil Uberty, ' If,' he
said, in explaining the principles on which he and his
friends acted in the early years of the French revolu
tion, ' If there were men dissatisfied in Scotland or
' Ireland on account of exemptions and disabilities, of
' unjust prejudices and cruel restrictions, I would repeal
' the penal statutes, which are a disgrace to our law
' books,' And in 1803 he had only been prevented
by the opinion given by Mr. Grattan and Mr, George
Ponsonby, that it was inexpedient at that time, from
bringing on ' the question of Ireland,' with reference
to the position of the Roman Catholics, He had
acquiesced most reluctantly in the opinion thus given,
and in writing to my father gave strong expression to
the vexation he felt at what he termed the ' cowardice '
of the party. My father warmly espoused the same
* Mr. Fox, in writing to my father on the 19th April 1804, to relate
the purport of a conversation he had had with Lord GrenviUe, on the
subject of Cathohc Emancipation, mentions that, in the course of it,,
'Lord Grenville confirmed the extraordinary fact of Pitt's never haviug
' told him of his offer to continue without it in 1801.'

140 LIPE AND OPINIONS OF
views on this subject, and wrote in answer to these
complaints of Mr. Fox : ' I do not wonder that you
' are vexed at being restrained from bringing on the
' CathoUc Question ; but do not give it up too hastily.
' What are Grattan's reasons? Do they convince
' you ? If not, why not follow your own judgment ?'
At the same tirae he himself thought that the policy
of bringing on the Question ' must depend — first on
' the wishes of the Catholics ; and next on the proba-
' bility of its being well supported. . , It is a question,'
he adds, ' on which you wiU, of course, be prepared
' for the old cant against disturbing the unaniraity,
' which the general danger requires, by the introduc-
' tion of subjects of partial grievance. Of the unsound-
' ness and injustice of such pretences, which I should
' call foolish if they did not answer the purposes of
' those who use thera, nobody can be raore sensible
' than I ara ; — but they serve as an excuse for the
' wicked, and seldora fail to irapose upon the weak.
' I should therefore be apprehensive that it wiU not
' be a very good question for a division, and in your
' view of the poUcy of raoving it, it should be well
' considered whether the appearance of a strong deter-
' raination in the Court, and of a large majority in
' the House of Commons against them, would not be
' more likely to confirm the despair of the Catholics,
' than powerful arguments and respectable names, if
' supported only by smaU uumbers, would be to
' encourage their hopes.'

LORD GREY. 141
These considerations, which had operated to prevent
Mr. Fox and his party fl'om moving the Catholic
Question when in Opposition in 1803, operated equally,
after the formation of Lord Grenville's Administration,
to prevent the introduction by the Government of any
general measure of relief for the Roman Catholics.
Such a course was most reluctantly acquiesced in by
my father and the other friends of the cause ; but it
was hopeless to expect to overcome the objections of
the King to any such measure, — and the objections of
the King being unfortunately supported by public
opinion throughout England, it was felt that the con
sequence of moving prematurely in the question,
would be, as my father wrote to the Duke of Bedford
(then Lord Lieutenant of Ireland) in December 1806,
' to throw the Government into the hands of those
' who would be pledged to resist this great measure of
' conciliation, and the aggravation of all the dangers
' arising from the present state of the Catholic body,
' by throwing them into absolute despair.'
But while yielding most reluctantly to the obstacles
which made it impossible to do full justice to the
Catholics, my father turned his most anxious atten
tion to the possibility of introducing other measures
of practical benefit for the Irish people. ' Could
' nothing,' he asks the Duke of Bedford, ' short of
' Catholic emancipation, which might of itself afford
' considerable relief, and would have the incalculable
' advantage of showing a disposition in the Govern-

142 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' raent to which the people of Ireland raight look for
' greater future benefits, be attempted ?'
Amongst other raeasures which he suggests in this
view, was one for the araendraent and raodification of
the Tithe Systera ;— a system destined, for many year's
yet to corae, to afford a fertile subject of declaraation
to the agitators who could not fail to spring up under
the policy so long unfortunately and obstinately per
severed in by succeeding Governraents. It appeared
to ray father to be, as he said, ' the moment of all
' others, just after the suppression of the late dis-
' turbances* by a vigorous but wholesome exertion
' of the legitiraate powers of Governraent, in which
* some conciliatory raeasure should be atterapted
' without delay, , , But to give this a fair chance of
' success,' he repeats, ' it would be necessary to
' obviate the designs of those who are always ready
' to aggravate in description (if not to foraent in fact),
' the troubles of Ireland ; by preventing any move-
' ments on the part of the Catholic body, of which
' they would iraraediately avail themselves, . . .
' Whether this can be done you are the best judge.
' But I ara confident that nothing would tend more
' effectually to disable the Government frora taking
' such measures as their inclinations or their policy
' would dictate, than any agitation of the Catholic
* The West of Ireland had been disturbed by some of those bands so
often associated in that country, under various names, for purposes of
nightly outrage and plunder. A Special Commission had been ap
poiuted to enforce the law, and had succeeded in restoring tranquilUty.

LORD GEEY. 143
' Question at the present moment. One of two things
' must be the inevitable consequence. Failure would
' be certain, and we should either continue in office
' weakened, and, to a certain extent, discredited, by
' the result of an ineffectual effort, or we should resign
' our situations to those who would come in on the
' avowed principle of supporting that system which
' has already been so fatal to the peace of Ireland,'
While, therefore, the Government was anxiously con
sidering what measures it might be in their power to
introduce with any chance of success for doing partial
justice to the Roman Catholics ; it was deemed essential
to such success, to avoid any proceedings calculated
still further to inflame that religious animosity against
them, which was already so strongly excited in Eng
land. Above all it seemed desirable to prevent the
presentation of a petition which had been proposed by
Mr, Keogh in a most inflammatory speech, and adopted
at an aggregate meeting of the Irish Roman Catholics,
Of that speech Lord GrenviUe writes : that ' for its
' intemperance and inflammatory tendency ' it had
' hardly -ever been equalled,' And he adds of the
general conduct of the Catholics — ' They know that
' their petition cannot be carried ; they contrive to
' embarrass the only public men who are friendly to
' their cause, and put upon us the necessity of either
' breaking up the Government for their sake, and
' giving it over into the hands of their avowed op-
' poneuts, or of ranging ourselves also in opposition, not

144 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' to the cause itself, but to the time, and still more to the
' manner, in which it is brought forward, without having
' given Government the time even to deliberate upon
' it, much less the raeans of reconciling the innuraerable
' difficulties which attend their cause ; and, above aU,
' to the public avowal of the sentiraents and language
' of Mr. Keogh, which of theraselves are enough, with-
' out any other cause, to create insurmountable ob-
' stacles to success here,'
¦All the endeavours of the Irish Government to stop
the presentation of this petition having proved vain,
Lord Grenville appealed through my father to Lord
Ponsonby (my raother's brother), requesting hira to
go over to Ireland and exert the influence which ' the
' confidence that had been placed in his father and his
' faraUy ' by the Irish Roraan Catholics, would give
him, to prevent a step which would not only be
erabarrassing to the Govemment, but positively inju
rious to the cause of the Catholics theraselves, ' Your
' Lordship's opinion and advice, 'Lord Grenville writes
to Lord Ponsonby, ' raust on every account have great
' weight with the temperate and considerate part of
' the Catholic body in Ireland. . . , There can be no
' hope, founded on any of the circumstances which
' affected the discussion of this question in the last
' Parliaraent, that it could now be renewed with a
' better chance of success, and the evil it would in-
' evitably produce is great and obvious. Whatever
' of prejudice or claraour has been at any former time

LORD GEEY. 145
' excited against this measure, would be much in-
' creased by the intemperance of the course now pur-
' sued. . . . An impression generally unfavourable to
' the conduct of the Catholics would thus be created ;
' no part of the former opposition to their wishes would
' be softened ; many fresh persons would be pledged
' against them ; and even their warmest advocates
' must acknowledge, in this instance, a total want of
' that temper, moderation, and discretion, which on a
* former occasion they were enabled justly to applaud.'
' The Catholic Question ' my father writes at the
same time to Mr, George Ponsonby (then Lord Chan
cellor of Ireland) ' certainly came upon us with little
' previous preparation. We were discussing the ques-
' tion of tithes as one, the arrangement of which might
' most essentially contribute to the peace and security
' of Ireland, . . , And so striking a proof of the dis-
' position of Government to consult the interests, and
' to attend to the feeUngs of the people of Ireland, I
' cannot help believing might have materially assisted
' us under the difficulties which must attend the appli-
' cation of the Catholics, though it could not be con-
' sidered as an immediate concession to them,' Having
then shown the hopelessness of Government being
enabled to carry the measures which had been sug
gested as concessions to the Catholics, in order to
induce them to withhold the threatened Petition, he
proceeds : ' If, then, the Catholic petition can only be
' averted by such concessions, independently of the

146 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' objections to making any concession upon such a prin-
' ciple, no hope can any longer be entertained of keep-
' ing it back,* We must then look to the consequences
' of the renewed agitation of this raeasure, and these I
' have already stated to you. They can be productive
' of nothing but raischief, and chiefly of mischief to the
' interests of the Catholics themselves. There is no
' possible view of the case in which they raust not be
' the losers. They can hope to gain no new advocates
* to their cause. Sorae even of those who have for-
' merly supported thera may, very possibly, on account
' of the manner in which the measure is brought for-
' ward, withdraw their assistance ; aU must lament its
' preraature and ill-advised discussion at the present
' raoraent ; and those merabers of the Govemment who
' have hitherto given the most unequivocal proofe of a
' favourable disposition to the cause of the Catholics,
' may perhaps be divided araongst themselves, but
' must inevitably be exposed to the necessity of
' choosing between a line of conduct which may occa-
' sion suspicions of their sincerity, or of breaking up
' the Administration,'
' If all attempts,' he writes on the same day to the
Duke of Bedford, ' either to stop or give a different cha-
' racter to the Petition should faU, what must be done
* Lord GrenviUe also says in the letter to Lord Ponsonby above
quoted : — ' It would be wholly improper, for the purpose of presenting
' a petition, to hold out to the Catholics any other inducements than
' those which arise out of a calm and unprejudiced consideration of what
' their own interests and those of the empire at large so evidently re-
' quire.'

LOED GEEY. 147
' by those who are pledged to the Support ofthe CathoUc
' claims must become a subject of the most deliberate
' and anxious consideration. I will not now anticipate
' the decision ; but I cannot say less than that the bring-
' ing forward the Petition must endanger the continu-
' ance of the present Government, as at present formed,
' or at least my continuing to be a member of it.'
On the 6th of March, the day after he had moved
for leave to bring in a Bill for the admission of Roman
Catholics into the army and navy, he writes to Lord
Ponsonby, and again enlarges on the difficulties that,
in the existing temper of the Parliament and the
country, would inevitably follow perseverance on the
part of the Irish Catholics in the course they were pur
suing, ' We have had two debates,' he says, ' one on
' the extended grant to Maynooth, and the other on
' the introduction of the Bill yesterday, which have
' exhibited on the part of our opponents such a spirit
' of illiberality and bigotry, as would have been worthy
' of the darkest ages of superstition and intolerance.
' In my language I was studious to show the Catholics
' that they had real friends in Government ; and the
' result of the debates, to those who view them with a
' rational desire to regulate their proceedings according
' to honest principles, and who do not look to objects
' of personal ambition, must, I think, be to prove that
' the introduction of the Petition at this moment, in
' addition to all the other difficulties attending it, must
' be to furnish a new occasion to those who are de-
L 2

148 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
• sirous of raising a Protestant cry, to erabarrass their
' true friends, and raaterially to injure their own cause.'
The language used by ray father in the debate on
the extended grant to Maynooth, to which he aUudes
above, was as follows : ' he fully agreed that we had
' too long neglected to take the situation of Ireland
' seriously into consideration. He confessed that we
' were deeply crirainal for the part we had acted,
' but he also hoped we should begin to discharge the
' long arrears against us. For his own part, he can-
• didly avowed that he should feel that the proudest
' and happiest day of his life, when he should^ be able
' to set about the work of raaking up for the tirae which
' had been misspent with respect to Ireland,'
Lord Ponsonby's endeavours to prevent the presen
tation of the Petition were ultiraately successful ; but
before that result was finally attained, the raischief
which raoving the question at all had been calculated
to produce had been done, and the Whig Ministry
had been disraissed.
Amongst the measures which the Govemraent had
designed for the relief and concUiation of the Irish
Catholics, short of complete emancipation, and which
they raight reasonably entertain hopes of being able
to carry, was one for the adraission of Roraan Catholics
into the army and navy. A BiU for that purpose had
been introduced by ray father on the 5th of March,*
* It had flrst been proposed to effect the object by the-addition of
two clauses to the Mutiny BiU, but had afterwards been thought better
to introduce a separate BiU for the purpose.

LOED GEEY. 149
in the debate upon which, he writes to Lord Ponsonby
in the ^ame letter from which au extract has been
given above : ' I think I completely succeeded in
' checking the effect of Perceval's attempt to raise a
' flame on the Catholic Question, In my reply last
' night I had the House very much with me ; and our
' victory upon Birch's motion in the Common Council,*
' was better than my hopes. It leads to a well-founded
' expectation that, by degrees, the public opinion may
' be brought round ; — but not to defeat this, it is
' necessary above all things that the Catholics should be
' patient for the present. There exist the materials
' of inflammation — there are incendiaries to take ad-
' vantage of them, and the slightest spark struck out
' by an intemperate act, might produce the worst
' effects.' The hopes which the success of this first night's
debate, and the proceedings in the City had raised,
were soon extinguished. Before the day fixed for the
second reading of the Bill, my father again writes,
March 12 th : ' The Court is taking an active part
' against my Bill for the introduction of Catholics into
' the army and navy; and my opinion is at present
' that the Government will break up.'
This note was occasioned by a communication which
Lord Sidmouth seems to have made this day (the 12 th
* Mr. Birch brought forward a motion in the Common CouncU on
the subject of ' Lord Howick's alarming notice,' which was negatived
by a majority of seventeen.

150 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
of March), to my father, of the conversations which
he had had with the King on the subject. Lord Sid^
raouth was known to be opposed to the measure, and
had indeed tendered his resignation. But it appears
that he had not waited for its acceptance to communi
cate with Mr, Perceval, and even to concert with hira
the raeans of defeating the Bill,
Doubts had indeed before arisen, whether the King
quite understood the full extent to which it was pro
posed to go by this Bill, At all events, he pleaded
such ignorance as a reason for objecting, after the
introduction of the raeasure, to certain of its provi
sions. Whether this ignorance could be fairly pleaded,
— though the historians of the day have for the raost
part admitted the plea, and, Tory in their politics, have
sedulously echoed the cry that the King was deceived
by his Ministers,— may be well doubted.
Before the introduction of the measure, a despatch
had been written by my father (in the absence of
Lord Spencer, the Horae Secretary) to the Lord-
Lieutenant of Ireland,* for the express purpose of
calling the King's attention to the difference between
it and the Irish Act of 1793, He had also verbally
explained the measure to His Majesty on the 4th of
March, and left him under the impression that he had
* Tho Irish Act, in opening the army to CathoUcs, did not aUow of
their rising beyond the rank of Colonels. They could not be Generals
on the Staff. The distinction was felt to be not only invidious but use
less—as a Catholic might, as a Colonel, command as large a body of
troops as if he had beeu a General.

LORD GEEY. 151
his consent— a reluctant one, certainly, but still his
consent^-to proceed. On the Sth March, the BUl was
accordingly introduced ; and on the 6th of March, the
day following, my father writes to the Duke of Bedford :
' You will perhaps have been surprised at my despatch
' the other day, which I had not time to accompany
' by any private explanation. It was written for the
' purpose of attracting the King's attention to the
' extent of the measure we proposed, which there was
' some reason to apprehend that he might not undet-
' stand to proceed further than the Act of the Irish
' Parliament.' And from this day tiU the 12th of March, when my
father wrote the note above-mentioned to Lord Pon
sonby — that is, during a whole week, while the conver
sations with Lord Sidmouth were taking place — not
one word was said, nor any hint given, in any of the
interviews which Lord Grenville had with the King,
to lead the former to suppose that His Majesty's objec
tions to the Bill were insuperable.
it seems hard to imagine that, on a subject on
which, above all others, he took a deep if not an
absorbing interest, and with regard to a measure to
the introduction of which he had in the first instance
consented with the greatest reluctance, the King should
not have made himself thoroughly acquainted with its
provisions ; but it is still more difficult to believe that,
when his attention was specially caUed to the subject
by a despatch written for the express purpose of clear-

152 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
ing up any misapprehension he might be under, as to
the nature and extent of the raeasure to which he had
given his assent, — he should, contrary to his well-
known habits of industrious and laborious attention to
public, business, have passed that despatch over in
so careless a manner, as still to remain in ignorance of
the intentions of his Ministers ; more particularly as
the subject to which the despatch in question related,
had been for sorae tirae raatter for discussion between
the King and his Ministers. As early as the 10th of
February, Lord Grenville, speaking of the changes in
the Mutiny Act, which it was proposed to raake in
favour of the Roman Catholics, says : ' In this form a
' despatch was drawn, and was last night submitted to
' the King, whose answer, received this raorning, is
' perfectly calra and collected, but such as to leave no
' hope of his consenting even to this raeasure,'
The next day, however, he adds, ' I have just tirae
' to tell you that the business I raentioned yesterday
' is, I trust, in a train of being satisfactorily arranged,'
Whether or not the King had reaUy raisunderstood
the extent of the raeasure to which he had given his
sanction, the objections, now raised by hira, raade the
re-consideration of the Bill, with a view to its pos
sible raodification, a matter of necessity, ' It is ira-
* possible for me,' my father again writes to Lord
' Ponsonby (March I7th), ' at this moment to enter into*
' a detailed explanation of the erabarrassing circura-
' stances in which we are placed, I can only say that

LOED GREY. 153
' we are under the necessity of giving up some parts of
' the Bill ; but that I have very great doubts whether
' even this disposition to concede will enable the
' Government to go on,' The event proved that this
fear was only too well founded. Even the total
withdrawal of the BiU, ' a sacrifice,' my father writes
to the Duke of Bedford, ' he had brought himself to
' make in deference to the opinion of his colleagues,
' and of a great majority of their friends in Parlia-
' ment, and, as he believed, of the public in general,'
did not suffice ; and on the 19th he thus announces
to Lord Ponsonby the dissolution of the Administra
tion : ' I have only a moment to say that things are
' now brought to a crisis, and that the Administration
' may be considered at an end. I have not time for
' the detail of the circumstances which have led to
' this, but the result, after all that has happened, is
' the only one under which I could have felt com-
' fortable. We had, contrary I confess to my opinion,
' agreed to give up the BiU ; but, upon reserving the
' liberty of proposing such measures as we might here-
' after find necessary, the King declared, in an answer
' received this morning, his positive determination
' never to concede anything, and required from us a
' promise not to propose any further concessions to
' him. To this, of course, there can be only one
' answer, which we meet for the purpose of framing
' to-night, and to-morrow I hope the thing wiU be de-
' termined in such a manner as to admit of its being
t made public'

154 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
The deraand raade by the King, named above, and
on the refusal of which he announced his intention of
changing his Ministers, carae as a raost unexpected
and welcorae relief to ray father. It was with the
greatest reluctance that he had given his consent to
the withdrawal of the Bill he had introduced. In giv
ing way on that point to the opinion of his colleagues,
' The consideration,' he writes to the Duke of Bedford,
' which weighed most with rae was the state of Ireland,
' and the danger of adding to all the bad effects of so
' severe a disappointment to the Catholics, the cala-
' mity of establishing a Govemment there founded on
' principles of exclusion. The evil of this was strongly
' urged by Grattan, and his opinion against our resig-
' nation was earnestly pressed. The consciousness,
' however, of acting frora these motives did not recon-
' cile me to the raeasure we had taken, Notwithstand-
' ing all that could be urged in their favour, I had a
^feeling which arguraent and reason assailed in vain,
' and which told me that the character and the strength
' of the Government must both be raateriaUy irapaired
' by such a concession. From the time I had con-
' sented to it, I never had a happy moraent ; and
' personally I stood in a more unpleasant situation
' than my colleagues, being so publicly committed,
' both by the despatch which, in Lord Spencer's ab-
' sence, I had written to you, and by the introduction
' of the Bill into Parliament.
' You may imagine, then, the relief I have found in
' the conclusion of this business by the King's requir-

LORD GEEY. 155
* ing us to withdraw the reserve we had made of entire
' freedom in the advice we might hereafter find it
' necessary to give respecting Ireland, and to give him
' an assurance that no proposal connected with this
' subject should be made to him in future. This left
' us no alternative ; and our answer conveyed, in
' respectful but decided terms, our inabiUty to comply
' with a demand so incompatible with our duty,
* The result shortly is, that the Government is at an
' end, and that we consider ourselves as only holding
' our offices till the King has made his arrange-
' ments,' On the same day my father wrote to Lord Ponsonby,
in answer to a letter in which the latter strongly con
demned the concessions to which the Government had
consented in even modifying the Bill for the adrais
sion of Roman Catholics into the army and navy, ' I
' entirely concur with you,' he says, ' in the feelings
' and opinions you express upon the concessions we
' were induced to offer, I yielded to the opinions of
' others, more particularly those of Grattan, aud to
' the fear of re-establishing an Orange Government
' in Ireland. I therefore regard our present situation
' as a great escape from the concession which we had
' offered, and of which, notwithstanding the powerful,
' and I may add conscientious, motives which had in-
' duced me to acquiesce in it, I never could bear to
' think from the moment I had consented to it,'
On the 23rd March my father stated, with the King's

156 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
permission, in answer to a question put to him, that
though he had not yet received His Majesty's com
mand to * deliver up the seals of his office, he had
' reason to believe, from such facts as are generaUy
* known to the public, that His Majesty had sent for
' persons not at present in the number of his servants,
' for the purpose of making arrangeraents for a new
' Adrainistration,' It was not, however, tiU the 26th
that Lord Grenville in the House of Lords and my
father in the House of Commons were enabled to an
nounce the actual dissolution of the Government, and
to explain the circumstances which had led to it.
Thus ended the Liberal Administration of 1806 ;
and, considering the question which was the immediate
cause of its downfall, it is curious to observe that in
1817 Lord Sidmouth, as member of Lord Liverpool's
Adrainistration, hiraself introduced a raeasure, as my
father described it, ' in substance and effect neither
' more nor less than that for proposing which the Ad-
* rainistration of 1807 went out of office,' in producing
which result Lord Sidmouth himself, as we have seen,
was an active agent. It was a BiU for placing Roman
CathoUcs, as regarded oaths, on the same footing as other
Dissenters— a Captain Wright, of the navy, having
complained in a petition to Parliament, presented by
my father, that having been proraoted to the rank of
commander, the oath imposed on Roman CathoUcs had
prevented his deriving any advantage from his promo
tion.

LOED GEEY. 157
The formation of the new Administration, of which
the Duke of Portland was placed at the head, does
not appear to have been exempt from difficulty ; and
before the arrangements for effecting it were defini
tively concluded, my father writes : ' I am not with-
' out some apprehension, from the fears which appear to
' prevail in the Court, that, notwithstanding the King's
' apparent determination, an attempt may be made to
' compromise matters in some way or other. This
' would be exceedingly perplexing ; but, I hope I may
' add with confidence, that there will be no disposition
' in any of the members of the Cabinet who have con-
' curred in this point, to consent to retain their places
' but on such terms as would carry with them their
' own justification to the public'
Even after the formation of the new Government, it
did not appear impossible that events might lead to the
old Ministers being recalled to office, ' I do not think
' it very probable,' my father writes to Mr. George
Ponsonby, ' that the King wUl easUy be brought to
' resort to us again ;' but in the very unlikely event of
his doing so, it was desirable, he thought, to ascertain
at once ' what might be expected from the Catholics.'
Sincerely attached as he was to the principles of reli
gious liberty involved in the question of Catholic
emancipation, and firmly impressed with the convic
tion of the necessity for the safety and tranquillity of
Ireland that that question should be set at rest in the
only way in which it was possible effectually to set it

158 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
at rest, yet he saw and admitted the hopelessness of
success in that object during the lifetime of the King,
supported as the King was in his objections to any
concessions to the Catholics by the general feeling of
the country. He therefore put the question to Mr,
George Ponsonby, whether the Catholics ' after the
' experience now acquired, might not think it better,
' for their own interest, to abandon for the present all
' endeavour to obtain any concession whatever beyond
' those already granted, and to express their wish that
' we should accept of office without any other means
' of serving thera than those to be found in our own
' disposition and the present state of the existing
' laws.' As to the raode of coramunicating with the Ca
tholics, he adds, 'that care should be taken to do
' nothing which might give ground for a suspicion that
' we are desirous of office, and anxious to be courted
' to resurae it, God knows, nothing is further from my
' thoughts and from my wishes. It is no bed of roses
' which we have left, and I can say to you what to
' another raight expose rae to the charge of insincerity
' and affectation, that what I ara now doing is at-
' tended with a considerable sacrifice of my personal
' ease, from motives of public duty,'
It is perfectly unnecessary to defend my father from
the charge that has sometimes been made against Lord-
GrenvUle's Ministry, tbat in refraining from bringing
in a raeasure to give effect to the opinions and prin-

LOED GEEY. 159
ciples professed by them in Opposition, they were
actuated by an unworthy love of office. His whole
career, and more particularly the sacrifice of all hope
of power which he made to this very question for the
next three and twenty years, is a sufficient refutation,
as far as he is concerned, of any such imputation. His
sole desire, both in acquiescing in the non-introduction
of any general measure of emancipation by the Go
vernment of which he was a member, and in the
suggestions he now made to Mr, Ponsonby, was that
that course should be adopted which should appear
most advantageous to the Catholics themselves.
Thus he writes (certainly in no factious spirit of
opposition to the new Government) after the dismissal
of the Grenville Ministry : ' I am more anxious than
' ever that the Catholics should, if possible, be kept
' quiet. Their hasty proceedings, and above all, the
' speech of Keogh, have not only produced the dissolu-
' tion of the Administration, but have indisposed the
' mind of the public here towards them to a degree
' that will not easily be recovered. The only chance
' of repairing the unfortunate consequences of the
' measures into which they have been so unadvisedly
' hurried, will be to show now the greatest patience
' and moderation. I, therefore, anxiously hope that
' they will not, on account of what has happened,
' press for a discussion in ParUament on their petition.
' Surely our sincerity has been sufficiently proved to
' give us some title to their confidence, and the sacri-

160 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' fice we have made establishes some claim upon them
' for attention to our advice. It is for their sake more
' than our own that I am induced raost strongly to
' press this request, a corapliance with which can
' alone, in ray opinion, afford us a hope of serving thera
' more effectually hereafter,'
How easy would it have been for my father, and
how much raore consonant with the usual tactics of an
out-going Minister, to have endeavoured to inflame
instead of to soothe the minds of the Irish Catholics
imder a sense of disappointment, with a view to the
embarrassment of his successors in office ! But neither
the embarrassment of an adversary, -nor the mere
triuraph of his own party, were ever actuating motives
with ray father during any part of his public career.
Before disraissing the subject of Ireland at this
period, it may be raentioned that the system of conci
liation at all tiraes so strongly advocated by my father,
was not intended by him to apply only to the Roraan
Catholics, All parties, he thought, should have equal
justice done to thera. None, not even the Orangemen,
should have just cause to coraplain of exclusion. In
putting an end to the domination of one party which
had been exercised with such fatal results to the peace
of Ireland, he had no wish to establish what would
probably be the equally mischievous doraination of
another, and hence, probably, the secret of the unre
lenting aniraosity with which, after fuU justice had
been done to the Eoman Catholics, he was tn after

LOED GEEY, 161
years assailed, as the reward for all the sacrifices he
had made for them, by the leaders of that party.
The moderate and conciliatory spirit in which he
wished the Irish Government to be conducted, is
strongly exemplified by a letter which my father
wrote to Lord Ponsonby with reference to the elec
tion for the city of Cork in October 1806. Lord
Ponsonby had written on that occasion : ' If you
' leave a Government of such pure skim milk you
' will lose all your old trusty friends. They are
' more afi-aid of the clamour of a clerk than of
' abandoning the best, firmest, and most powerful of
' their supporters.' . . . ' I really am quite disgusted.
' I am favoured with plenty of fine speeches, &c., but
' power is always, somehow or other, exerted against
' us, . . . and I seriously believe that there is not
' one of the immense class of underlings who lives or
' respects the Government,— a Government which has
' supported them against the voice of millions who
' demanded justice, and, I am aorry to add, at the
' expense of its own honour.'
To this my father replies : —
' Nothing will do if the system of conciUation on
' which the Duke of Bedford very truly says the present
' Government was formed is not pursued. Even to-
•' wards the Orangemen it must be adopted ; for if, by
' a proscription of them, we force them to maintain
« themselves as a distinct party, looking to a change
' of Government again to give them the ascendancy, M

162 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' aU hope of perraanent tranquillity for Ireland raust
' faU. It ought to be our policy to prolong the effect
' of any measures we raay be able to carry beyond our
' own Adrainistration, which cannot be done if the
' country is to be kept divided between two inveterate
' parties, alternately gaining power, according to the
' changes which may take place in Bngland. It
' was, therefore, not so much with a view to the ease
' and convenience of the Administration, as for the
' sake of Ireland itself, that we originally wished to
' conciliate the leaders of a party, whose principles
' and conduct you cannot more strongly condemn
' than I do.'
And writing to the Duke of Bedford at the same
time on the subject of Lord Ponsonby's coraplaints, he
says : ' On the general policy of conciUation, and
' indeed of the necessity of doing away, as much as
' possible, all former animosities, which cannot be
' effected if either party is to be absolutely proscribed,
' nobody can raore cordially agree with you than I do.
' You say truly it was the principle on which this
' Government was formed, and which was even more
' necessary in Ireland than here,' Still he considered
that there must be sorae lirait to such a policy : ' and I
' confess,' he proceeds, ' (and this I know was Fox's
' opinion,) that it would be carrying this policy too far,
' and perhaps risking its proposed effect, if the direct
' countenance and support of Government was given to
' any persons remarkably prorainent in the cruelties

LOED GREY. 163
' committed at the time of the rebeUion : at least tiU
' the people had had some reason to place entire con-
' fidence in the Administration, and till the altered
' conduct of these persons had rendered them less
' obnoxious.' It has been mentioned that notwithstanding the
patriotic and disinterested nature of the motives which
alone influenced the members of Lord Grenville's
Government in the course which they adopted with
regard to the Catholics, both as to what they did, and
what they did not attempt, they were attacked for the
apparent inconsistency of their conduct in office with
the opinions which they had professed and advocated
in Opposition,* And some years later, in writing to
Lord HoUand on the occasion of a motion which he
had made, and in which he had given expression to
some strong opinions, my father alluded to what had
happened in 1807, to Lord Grenville's Administration,
and to the experience thus gained, as teaching a lesson
which future Oppositions would do weU to profit by,
' Though I admit,' he writes, ' the complete accuracy
' of aU you say as to your known opinions and inten-
' tions on this subject, I could have wished that you
' had not made the motion. I have now had between.
' twenty and thirty years' experience of discussions of
* Attacks of a very different nature were made upon them by some
of the subordinate members of their own Administration, who could
see nothing in what had occurred but the loss of their salaries, and
they indulged their vexation by sneering at those who not only knocked
their heads gratuitously against a waU, but who built up the very wall
for the purpose.
M 2

164 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' this nature ; and unless they are likely to meet with
* even more popular support than hitherto has followed
' them, that experience would serve to prove that their
' principal effect has been to give to Government ad-
' ditional facilities in the prosecution of the very mesir
' sures they are intended to counteract. But their bad
' effects do not stop here ; and the Adrainistration of
'1806 furnishes a further instance of the sort of attack
' to which you will be exposed both fi'ora the Court
' and the deraocrats, . . if you do not, when in Govern-
' raent, carry into forraal effect all the raeasures which
' you have urged in Opposition. It is in vain that
' you carry on a Govemment in the true spirit of those
' measures— :that you are moderate, forbearing, and
' liberal. If you do not force their literal execution,
' if you enter into any compromise with those whora
'you have formerly opposed; in a word, if you do
' not make it utterly irapossible to form an Adminis-
' tration in which you can take any share ; you will be
'branded as an apostate. This happened to your
' uncle and me in 1806 ; and the same fate will be ex-
' perienced by you unless you determine to sacrifice
' every other good that may be within your reach, for
' points in which raany with whom you are connected
' could not concur, though in the practical conduct of
' the Govemraent there would be no difference between
'you, 'The lesson that I have learnt, therefore, is to
'pledge myself to as little as possible whilst in Opposition,

LORD GREY. 165
' and, when in Government, if ever it should be my
' lot to be again in that situation, to do as much as lean.'
But though inculcating upon the Roman Catholics
themselves, and upon their supporters in Parliament,
the necessity of the utmost moderation in their con
duct, my father soon convinced himself that the power
of settling the Catholic Question must in future be
made a sine qu& non condition of his own return to
office. And in 1809, he writes to Lord Grenville
that his mind was made up, ' I think, unalterably, not
' to take office unless the power of immediately propos-
' ing measures for the conciliation of Ireland be con-
' ceded to us.'
This determination on his part, consistently adhered
to as it was, resulted in his exclusion from office for
up wards, of three and twenty years.
To return to the events of March 1807.
The explanations relative to the change of Govern
ment had been made by Lord Grenville and my father,
as already stated, on the 26th of March; but the
new Ministers in the House of Commons were neces
sarily absent at that time on account of their elections,
and it was not till the 8th of April, that the subject
came to a formal discussion on a resolution moved by
Mr, Brand, ' that it was contrary to the first duties of
' the confidential servants of the Crown, to restrain
' themselves by any pledge, express or implied, from
offering to the King any advice that the course of cir-
' cumstances might render necessary for the welfare

166 LIFB AND OPINIONS OP
' and security of any part of His Majesty's extensive
' empire.' It was with reference to the probability of this re
solution being carried that my father wrote, as already
noticed, to Mr, George Ponsonby, to ascertain what
the wishes of the Catholics would be in the event, im
probable but not impossible, of their being recaUed to
the Government. The motion was seconded by Mr,
William Lamb, the late Lord Melbourne ; and being
met by the 'previous question,' was rejected by a
majority of two hundred and fifty^eight to two hundred
and twenty-six.
In the course of the debate on Mr, Brand's resolu
tion, my father alluded to the belief which he could
not help entertaining, that the course taken by the
King upon the measure proposed by the Government,
had been concerted with certain members of the Op
position, Whether this were so or not must ever re
main a subject of controversy and speculation for the
curious in history, on which every one wiU decide
according to his poUtical bias. It certainly is remark
able, as I have already observed, that though my father
(in addition to the despatch to the Duke of Bedford,
before aUuded to) had personally explained to the
King the difference between the proposed measure and
the old Irish Act of 1793, of which it was an extension ;
though he had introduced the measure under the im
pression that at that interview he had obtained the
King's consent,—' an unwilling consent certainly,' but

LORD GEEY. 167
still his consent, — to proceed; though a week had
elapsed since the introduction of the Bill, during which
His Majesty had had more than one interview with Lord
Grenville, the head of the Ministry ; it certainly is
remarkable, considering how strong the King's feelings
upon this subject were supposed to be, that during all
this time no hint was given of the objections he enter
tained to the measure being insuperable. Surely
something must have happened between the 5th March,
when my father introduced the Bill, and the 12 th,
when he wrote to Lord Ponsonby that the ' Court was
taking an active part against it,' to give activity to
these objections. At aU events it is known that on
the 14th, the Saturday before the pledge was de
manded, on the refusal of which the Government was
dismissed, Lord Eldon had an interview with the
King. 'What passed at that interview,' my father
said, in his speech on the 9 th of April, 'he did not
'pretend to state. He would leave the House to
' conjecture.' Lord Eldon, indeed, denies that at that
interview, either he or the King once alluded to a
subject which both were known to have equally at
heart ! It is surely not very uncharitable, however,
to doubt the trath of this denial ; particularly as it is
certain that Lord Sidmouth, a member of the Cabinet,
was already in communication with the Opposition,
with a view to the defeat of the measure ; and Lord
Eldon's conduct in 1804, in aiding Mr. Pitt to over
turn the Government of which he was himself a mem-

168 LIPE AND OPINIONS OF
ber, shows that he was capable of plotting not only
against an Administration to which he was openly and
avowedly opposed, but against one to which he him
self belonged.*
' I have said nothing,' my father writes to the Duke
of Bedford, ' of Lord Sidmouth. His opinions on the
' general question are well known. His consent to the
' BiU I believe was originaUy given under a misappre-
' hension of its extent. When the point was cleared
'up, he stated his objections, but did not, to ray ap-
' prehension, express an intention of separating from
' the Government, or making a decided opposition to
* it in Parliament. This intention, however, he soon
'afterwards manifested, and accompanied it by an
' offer to resign. So far there is nothing to complain
' of. But he has since acknowledged that during this
' interval, when he had been desired by Lord Grenville
' to suspend his resignation, and when the raeans of
' accommodation were under discussion, he had a direct
' coraraunication with Perceval, which originated in a
' proposal made by him to concert their measures in
' opposition to the Bill,'
Lord Sidmouth had also had several conversations
on the subject of the Bill with the King, and was,
indeed, the first to teU my father of His Majesty's
strong objections to it. Is it probable that, in those
conversations, he had left the King in ignorance of his
own sentiraents with respect to it, or of the raeans he
* See page 85

LOED GREY. 169
was taking to defeat it ? — and does not this make it
still more improbable that nothing passed on the
subject in the interview between the King and Lord
Eldon ?
This however is, as I have said, a matter of specu
lation, which every one must decide for himself.
The new Ministers had been supported in two great
trials of strength in the House of Commons, by
majorities of thirty-two and forty-six in full Houses,
with every probabUity too that this would prove a
growing majority, as they became confirmed in power.
Notwithstanding this, however, and though the exist
ing Parliament had only been called in the preceding
October, it was considered desirable to take advantage
of the ' No Popery ' cry which had been most in
dustriously excited through the country, in order still
further to strengthen the new Government; and
accordingly before the end of April, Parliament was
again dissolved.
The event fiilly answered the expectation of Minis
ters — and on the first great trial of strength, which
took place in the new Parliament upon an amendment
to the Address, moved by my father, the Governraent
showed an array of three hundred and fifty supporters
against only one hundred and fifty-five opponents.
My father had himself lost the seat for Northumber
land, which he had retained ever since his first return
to Parliament, one-and-twenty years before. An
opposition had most unexpectedly sprung up, which

170 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
he had no reason to' anticipate, having been assured
by the Duke of Northumberland that he wished the
county not to be disturbed. He had, therefore,
delayed his departure from London, and had adopted
no steps for canvassing the county, when he was
taken by surprise by the information that, on the pre
tence of a requisition, set on foot apparently by the
Duke's own agents, Lord Percy had been suddenly
brought forward; and that, in a way to insure a
doubtful and expensive contest to my father, if he
chose to persevere in it.
Lord Percy had supported the late Government,
and had been brought in by their influence, on the
death of Mr. Fox, for Westrainster, He had even
spoken in favour of Mr, Brand's raotion above re
ferred to, though he had in the course of that speech
expressed opinions unfavourable to concessions to the
Catholics, But now, by the course pursued by the
Duke's tenantry, in withholding their second votes
frora ray father, and by Lord Percy's own advertise
raent, in which the ostentatious profession of his
attachment to the ' Constitution in Church and State,'
was an apparent echo of the cry which had been
raised of ' Danger to the Church '¦ — the movement in
the county seemed directed particularly against my
father's seat. The result was that the latter found, as
his canvass proceeded, that ' there was no hope of his
' success.' ' At least,' as he writes to Lord Grenville,
' without an expense which, in justice to my famUy, I

LORD GREY. 171
' could in no case encounter ; but which, with my
' precarious tenure in the House of Commons, would
' be quite madness,'
He, therefore, withdrew from the representation of
his native county, and was returned, by the influence
of Lord Thanet, for Appleby, for which borough he
sat for the few months during which he stiU continued
a member of the House of Commons, The speech in
which he took leave of his late constituents was long
remembered in the county, and the enthusiastic de
monstrations of popular respect and attachment with
which that farewell was responded to, were weU cal
culated to soothe the mortiflcation which could not
but attend the loss of a seat he had so long held.
Mr, Ord, member for Newcastle, and himself a
consistent Whig, thus describes the termination of the
election :—' May 19, 1807. WeU, it is aU over!
' Poor dear Lord Howick has given it up in a speech
' that harrowed one's very soul, and roused alternately
' all one's passions — of admiration for him, of hatred for
' his vile betrayers, and of contempt for the miserable
' wretches that were opposed to him. The multitude
' were affected to the greatest possible degree of en-
' thusiasm. They would not bear to hear of another
' name than Howick, , , . Sir Charles Monck moved
' the thanks of the county to Lord Howick for his long
' and faithful services, which was carried unanimously.'
My father attended regularly in his place during
the short Session that foUowed the meeting of the new

172 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
Parliaraent, and stoutly defended the course which had
been adopted by the late Government with respect to
Ireland, and their refusal to take the unconstitutional
pledge deraanded frora thera by the King ; and alraost
the last words he ever spoke in the House of Coramons
were in recommendation of that conciliatory policy for
which he and -his friends had forfeited office. In
moving an araendraent to the Address in answer to
the Speech fi'om the Throne, on the 23rd of June, ' he
' earnestly pressed His Majesty's Ministers to attend to
' the advice of an honourable gentleman, unfortunately
' no longer a raember of that House, the late Attorney-
' General for Ireland, Mr. Plunket, to make Ireland
' the first and the last object of their thoughts. Too
' much anxiety could not be shown on this subject. He
' should be glad to hear that some systera of conciliation
' was proposed. He did not allude to any extension
' of indulgences, but to other regulations which would
' tranquillize the people.'
And, again, on the Oth July, he repeated that ' he
' considered that part of the erapire as the raost im-
' perative in its calls for attention and care ; and
' though he would not say that any measure of
' Catholic indulgence should now be brought forward,
' he would say that good policy called for _a general
' system of concUiation and kindness,'
On the 14th of August Parliament was prorogued,
and with the close of the Session terminated ray
father's career in the House of Commons. His

LORD GEEY. 173
father's health had long been failing. On the IOth
November he grew suddenly worse, and his death on
the 16th, finally removed my father from the place
where his presence was more than ever required, as
events soon proved, to control and regulale the pro
ceedings of the combined Opposition,

174 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP

CHAPTER IV.
From mt Father's Removal to the House of Lords in November
1807 TO Enh of Session of 1809.
My father now took his seat in the House of Lords by
the side of Lord Grenville, as the leader of the Whig
section of the Opposition, but with a vastly dirai
nished power of effecting any good. The influence of
the House of Lords was, even at that tirae, corapara
tively small, and the House of Comraons was then, as
it is now, the place where the fate of Ministers was
decided, and, with thera, the nature of our national
poUcy. In that House the loss of my father's influence was
not long in making itself felt. Formed as the Opposi
tion was of parties between which, on raany important
questions, a considerable difference of opinion existed,
it had required all his tact and judgment during the
Session of 1807, to prevent these differences from be
coming apparent. Without a recognized leader in
the House of Coramons, there seemed no hope of pre
serving anything like unity of action ; but though all

LOED GREY. 175
parties appeared equally convinced of the absolute
necessity of such an appointment, it had proved no
easy matter to induce them to agree as to the person
by whom it should be filled. To reconcile conflicting
clauns, to soothe jealousies, to satisfy the exigencies
of vanity and self-conceit, was no whit easier fifty
years ago than it has proved in our own times ; and it
was not without the greatest difficulty, and only after
much discussion, that an unwilling acquiescence had
been brought about in the nomination — as the best
which under the circumstances of the time could be
made — of Mr. George Ponsonby (the late Chancellor
of Ireland) to succeed my father as Leader of the
Opposition in the House of Commons,
If it had been found no easy task to obtain general
consent to this arrangement, it proved still more diffi
cult to procure obedience or deference to the authority
it had thus been agreed to set up ; and it soon became
apparent that the parties composing the Opposition in
the House of Commons were little disposed to own the
control of any leader. All seemed bent on pushing
their separate views and opinions, without regard to
circumstances or seasons, and thus all assisted in
giving increased strength to the Government it was
the professed common object of all to oppose !
Lord Grenville had long foreseen this state of
things. While still in office he had looked to the
expected removal of my father from the House of
Commons as likely to break up the Administration,

176 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
and now that they were in Opposition, he saw still less
hope of matters being ''so conducted in that House, as
to make it probable that the good understanding which
had been hitherto maintained, not without some diffi
culty, could be long preserved. In contemplation,
therefore, of the differences which he anticipated, he
had, before the opening of the Session of 1808, ex
pressed a strong desire to withdraw from anything
like a constant attendance in Parliament, a desire
which, shortly before his own departure from Howick
to attend the House of Lords, my father thus com
bats: 'What,' he writes to Lord GrenviUe, January
Srd, 1808, ' will be the consequence of your reUn-
' quishing that active superintendence of a nuraerous
' party, which, however painful it may be at such a
' moment, I wish to inspire you with a belief is a
' duty from which you cannot, without hereafter find-
' ing reason to blame your conduct, withdraw your-
' self? Though you are absent, you must be aware
' that others will continue their attendance. If they
' were left merely to themselves by your retireraent,
' the want of your advice and control would be felt in
' their conduct, and, above all, in their language. It
' is probable that raany, frora discontent at such a
' measure, would become regardless of your opinions ;
' others, affecting to consider themselves as left at
' liberty to form new connections, would join the
' Administration, In short, it is hardly possible that
' the party, under such circumstances, should not lose

LORD GREY. 177
' in its numbers, fall into heats and divisions,- and that
' precisely that species of opposition should not be
' produced, which in such a crisis you would think
' most detrimental to the interests of the country,' . , .
' These are, in fact, the very evils we apprehend when
' we express so much anxiety for the appointment of a
' leader in the House of Commons. Can such an
' appointment be effectual for any good purpose ? Can
' it give the necessary authority to George Ponsonby,
' or to anybody else, if you adopt the measure of
' secession ?' , . ,
But while thus doing his best to dissuade Lord
Grenville from any such intention, he adds as regards
himself : ' After what I have said it will appear an
' odd conclusion to state that it will hardly be possible
' for me to give a very close^ attendance during the
' ensuing Session. If I had remained in the House of
' Commons I certainly would have done so, whatever
' the inconvenience to me might have been ; but I do
' not take my family to town, and this, and other
' circumstances, will naturally render me anxious to
' make my stay there as short as possible. This, if
' you take the part I wish you to take, will be of no
' consequence, and if you do not, my dislike of Par-
' liamentary business will be so much increased, that
' I am afraid considerations of duty will have but
' little power over me.'
Of the different parties in the House of Commons,
the one most difficult to control was one that would
N

178 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
now be called a ' Peace-at-any-price ' party,* the pro
ceedings of which, as being chiefly directed by his own
near connection and early political friend, Mr, Whit
bread, were the source of peculiar annoyance to my
father. It has already been seen, that though cordially
agreeing with Mr. Fox in his ardent desire for peace,
and earnestly seconding all his efforts to preserve it,
he had never gone quite so far as Mr, Fox in advo
cating pacific principles, and had more than once ex
pressed strong doubts whether the display of an over
anxiety for peace was the surest way to obtain it.
To this doubt was now added the fear of endangering
the good understanding with Lord Grenville and his
friends. The question of peace was the one of all
others, the discussion of which was most dangerous to
the continued union of their parties in opposition ; for
it could not be raised without reviving to a certain
extent the recollection of ancient animosities, when
the friends of Mr. Fox and those of Lord Grenville
had been directly, and even fiercely", opposed to each
other upon it, during the first Administration of Mr.
Pitt. These considerations raade ray father raost anxious
to raoderate, if possible, the course which the peace
party seeraed inclined to pursue, and in Deceraber
1 807, he had written to Mr, Whitbread to express his
' hope that nothing will be hazarded either in language
* This was written in 1855.

LORD GREY. 179
' or action, without the most serious consideration of
' the consequences it may produce. Above all, I hope
' that nothing will be done to encourage a clamour
' for peace, against which I must set my face decidedly
' and strenuously.' And he now repeats in January
1808, ' I am, believe me, as desirous of peace as you,
' believing that real peace is the only cure for all our
' evils. And it is precisely for this reason that I
' deprecate measures which can have no possible effect
' but that of removing peace to a greater distance.'
And again, a few days later, he writes on his way up
to London : ' The impediments which these Yorkshire
' meetings must throw in the way of peace seem to
' me pretty obvious. In the first place, they will
' produce counter petitions, which may have the
' effect of encouraging Ministers if, as I really do
' not believe, they are disinclined to peace. In the
' next, they cannot fail to inspire Bonaparte with
' an exaggerated opinion of our distresses, and to in-
' flame the pretensions which he is already but too
' well disposed to urge.'
But it was not easy to turn Mr, Whitbread from
any course which he had once persuaded himself it
was right to adopt ; and at a dinner at Lord Gren
ville's, soon after my father's arrival in London, where
the leaders of the Opposition met to consider their
course in the ensuing Session, ' he begun,' my father
writes, ' upon the subject of peace in so hot, and, I
' must say, so wrong-headed a manner, that I am afraid
N 2

180 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' the impression raust have been very unfavourable to
' hira ; the disposition being already to consider him
' as a most impracticable man to deal with. Grenville
' seeraed quite durab-foundered, and hardly spoke a
' word, and I very rauch fear that all the pains I had
' before taken, as I thought with sorae prospect of
' success, to bring hira off his project of secession, will
' now be fruitless.'
Fortunately there was at this time the most perfect
agreement on all the great public questions of the day,
as well as upon the course which it became the Oppo
sition to pursue, between my father and Lord Gren
ville ; and this alone seeras to have prevented the line
taken by Mr. Whitbread from producing the conse
quences my father had apprehended frora it. ' Lord
' GrenviUe,' he writes, on the 27th Jauuary, 'is all
' activity and good huraour ; notwithstanding, I raust
' say, sorae provocation to the contrary, for Whitbread
' shows raore and more a disposition which, for his
' own sake, as well as for that of the public, all his
' friends must laraent. He gave yesterday notice of
' a motion for peace, without even taking tirae to see
' the papers on which it is to be founded. Even this,
' however, does not seera to have discoraposed Lord
' Grenville, which I can only attribute to our being
' as perfectly agreed as we are, and his being con-
' vinced that this kind of proceeding is more unplea-
' sant to rae even than to hira.'
All atterapts failed to induce Mr, Whitbread to

LORD GREY. 181
abandon this intention, and he drew up his inotion in
the form of three resolutions,* ' for one of which,' my
father writes, ' I certainly could not vote, and to
' another of which I should have considerable ob-
' jection  He sent them to your uncle ' (Mr.
George Ponsonby) ' to be communicated to Lord
' Grenville and me, and I expressed my opinion upon
' them.' For a short time, indeed, it was hoped that an open
display of division in the Opposition, which must
necessarily occur if these resolutions were forced into
discussion, might be avoided. Mr. Whitbread had
accepted an address, drawn up by my father, which
he proposed to substitute for the resolutions, and which
there was reason to hope Lord Grenville and his friends
might concur in, ' It was a very handsome proceed-
' ing,' my father says of his own part in drawing up this
address, ' because I disapprove of any motion at pre-
' sent on this subject ; but I could vote for the address
' which I have written, and its practical effect with
' respect to the object which Whitbread has in view,
' Would, perhaps, be greater than that of his own
' resolutions,' The hopes of thus preserving the appearance of
union in the party were, however, short lived ; for
' though,' my father writes, 'Lord GrenvUle in the
handsomest way possible has concurred in it (the ad-
' dress), expressing, however, the opinion which I
* See Hansard for the Resolutions and the debate upon them.

182 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
'entertain, that it would have been rauch better, to
' have had no raotion on the subject of peace at pre-
' sent,' and though Mr, Whitbread had consented ' to
' further alterations in it, tending to soften the strong
' expressions of a desire for peace, far beyond my ex-
' pectations,' yet at a raeeting held at Mr, George
Ponsonby's, to consider the subject, ' Windhara and
' others,' ray father proceeds, ' strongly objected to the
' raotion even in this shape ; and the consequence is,
' that the original resolutions are resumed. We go,
' therefore, to the House of Comraons quite divided,
' On the two first Resolutions, though I do not like
' even them, your uncle will support hira (Mr, Whit-
' bread), but on the third he will declare his opinion
' of the impropriety of moving it now, and support the
' previous question. This is raost unfortunate, if not
' fatal, to the party,'
The appearance of division in the party when the
debate took place was even greater than he had anti-
bipated. The meeting at Mr. Ponsonby's had been
allowed to separate without a clear understanding as
to the course to be pursued ; and the most general im
pression seeras to have been that the resolutions were
to be supported. When, therefore, Mr. Ponsonby,
iraraediately after Mr, Whitbread's opening speech,
took the course which had beeu agreed upon between
hiraself, my father, and Lord Grenville, and moved
the previous question, it ' occasioned,' my father
writes, ' great surprise and disappointment amongst

LORD GREY, 183
' our friends, who were in no degree prepared for it
' by what had passed on the preceding night, and who
' complain loudly that, without any previous commu-
' nication, a course should have been taken so contrary
' to what they had reason to e^ipect, . . . The cpnse-
' quence was that a great majority of the Opposition
' Members present voted with Whitbread, and very
' few followed your uncle ; and I am afraid that the
' result, in every view, must be considered as fatal to
' the future union, and, at all events, to the power
' and consequence of the party. In this fear I ought
' to add that there are some who do not participate, and
' who think the present uneasiness will soon disappear,
' and that we shall pull together again upon other
' questions.' If his fears were not realized to their full extent
(though this difficulty was only a fair sample of similar
ones of constant recurrence), it was very much owing
to his own exertions to maintain the peace of the
party. These, indeed, had from the first been unre
mitting. Before the commencement of the Session, in
speaking of the want of union that prevailed, he had
said : ' Though I have the character of a hot, in-
' temperate fellow, I begin to think I am the most
' reasonable person amongst them,' And now, after
the division on Mr. Whitbread's motion, he repeats :
' No endeavours that I could use to reconcile differ-
', ences, and to prevent what has happened, have been
' wanting on my part, and perhaps the evil has been

184 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' aggravated in some degree by that attempt.' But
though encouraged by soraewhat better appearances a
day or two later to express a hope that ' there is a
' chance of our getting back to the state in which we
' were before this unfortunate difference took place,'
he had had too much experience of those with whora
he had to deal, to believe that harraony, even if restored
for the raoraent, could be long preserved. ' You raust not
' think,' he writes, ' that this has not left a consider-
' ably increased disgust on my raind with respect to
' politics, or that I do not still entertain very great fears
' for the future union and harraony of the party. The
* principal of these, I confess, arise frora the proba-
' bility I think there is, that the encouragement Whit-
' bread has received frora his success on this occasion,
' raay increase his disposition to do things in future, act-
' ing upon his own separate views and opinions, Avhich
' raay again produce differences which, if repeated, must
' be fatal. If my own interests only were concerned,
' this would give me no trouble, for I can raost un-
' affectedly assure you that ray greatest wish is to have
' nothing more to do with politics or parties. But
' any chance of good— and God knows it is Uttle enough
' — that yet remains, consists, in my opinion, in the
' preservation of the union between Fox's friends
' and Lord GrenviUe's, and in the discretion of the
' latter as leader of the party.'
Matters do not appear to have gone on raore satis
factorily during the remainder of the Session of 1808,

LORD GEEY. 185
and Lord Grenville seems again to have hinted at an
intention of partial secession, in answer to which my
father thus wrote in December of that year : ' I parti-
' cipate in all your feelings with respect to the pro-
' ceedings in the House of Commons during the last
' Session of Parliament, I must confess not only that
' they have disappointed my hopes, but that person-
' ally, from circumstances which I need not explain,
' they have given me a degree of pain which it is not
' easy for me to express. After this experience,
' therefore, and entertaining the same opinion gene-
' rally which you do of the present state of politics,
' and what is required by it, I certainly can no longer
' press you to a constant and active attendance in
' Parliament, But if I understand you rightly, you
' did not mean to disband the great and powerful
' party which has been formed by a junction of Fox's
' friends and yours. On the contrary, I am persuaded
' you will agree with me in thinking that such an
' event would be so great a misfortune that all reason-
' able endeavours should be used to prevent it.'
In this view my father proceeds to deprecate any
declamtion, on the part of Lord Grenville, of an in
tention not to attend ; and adverting to the experience
which he had himself gained by the total failure of the
famous Whig measure of secession, he advises him ' to
' keep himself unrestrained by any declaration, to act
' as circumstances may require, without imposing on
' himself the necessity, if his conduct should alter, of

186 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' answering the taunts to which he would be exposed, by
' distinctions and explanations which are never received
' by an adverse party, and which it is not easy to raake
' generally understood,' ... 'If George Ponsonby,
' Petty, and Tierney,' he proceeds, 'thoroughly under-
' stand oue another, and act cordially together, the
'raischief of last year may, I hope, be in a great
' degree, prevented. We must not expect, however,
' that, upon whatever system we. act, sorae unpleasant-
' ness will not occur, or that, in any state of party
' connection, sorae concessions of opinion, and sorae
' deviations of conduct, may not occasionally be found
* necessary,' While endeavouring to soothe the irritation which
the proceedings in the House of Comraons had tended
to excite in Lord Grenville's raind, he was no less
anxious to moderate, if possible, the conduct and lan
guage of that section of the Opposition, of which he
thought Lord Grenville had had such just cause to
complain. With this view, before the opening of the
Session of 1809, he wrote as follows to Sir Arthur
Pigott, who had been Solicitor-General in the late Ad
ministration, and who was an active member of the
Whig party. And those who believe that the Govem
ment of the country, under our parliamentary system,
can only be conducted by raeans of party connection,
would do well to lay to heart the counsel which ray
father thus atterapted to irapress upon the Whigs of
1809. 'I am very glad to find,' he says, 'thatj^ou

LORD GEEY. 187
' agree with me in thinking that the present state of
' affairs is such as to make it peculiarly incumbent on
' us to avoid giving any fair occasion to the charge of
'carrying on a vexatious and harassing opposition.
' What led me particularly to use that expression, was
' the proofs I have had from many quarters, most of
' them extremely well-disposed to us in general, of the
' very bad effect produced by the character of the de-
' bates in the House of Commons during the last
' Session of Parliament. It is not because opposition
' was merely fruitless, but because what happened last
'year did more to lower all public men, and, with
' them. Parliament itself, in the general estimation,
' than ever was done before, that I stated my utter
' despair of doing any good either now or hereafter,
' unless things were carried on with a very different
'spirit,' , , .
' That in a large party, composed of liberal-minded
' and independent men, there should not occasionaUy
' occur differences of opinion, cannot be expected. If
' such differences are fundamental, the party necessarily
' separates, with honour to all the persons concerned.
' If they are of a subordinate nature, and such as may
'exist without destroying the general principle on
'which the party is united, they must be modified and
'softened by mutual compromises and concessions.
'Without such a temper of conciUation I need not
' tell you that no party can long exist either usefully
' or honourably, and it is the want of this conciUatory

188 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' spirit, that, I think, too frequently appeared in the
' last Session, which many of our friends, and I in
' coramon with them, have greatly lamented,
' If this evil can now be avoided, I shall sincerely
' rejoice ; because there is nothing that I have raore
' at heart, whatever part I may be able hereafter to
' take in it, than to preserve the connection which was
' forraed, so usefully I think for the public, between
' the friends of Fox and Lord Grenville. It has been
' most honourably adhered to by the latter, and I
' think he has some right to expect that degree of for-
' bearance with respect to particular questions, which,
' from various causes, might be erabarrassing to hira,
' which was necessarily understood as the very ground-
' work of our union with hira, and to which every
' person connected with us was at the time bound to
' make up his raind, or to have declared his positive
' objection to the junction, which would have prevented
' his being a party to it. This, again I say, was not
' the character of the proceedings in the House of
' Coramons during the last Session, and you must not
' be surprised, tlierefore, that Lord Grenville, wishing?
' as I know he does raost anxiously, to preserve the
' party in all its weight and respectability, and being
' nowise disposed to pass over the extreme misconduct
' of the present Ministers, should wish to take such a
' line as may prevent his being implicated in measures
' of which it is irapossible he should approve.' . . .
' As I have often said, a cordial and conciliatory spirit

LOED GREY. 189
' in those who are to act together is the first requisite,
' and if both the appearance and the reality of this is
' lost by pertinacity and impatience in individuals to
' force on even questions on which we might agree, at
' their own time, and in their own mode, all hope of
' doing any good must be abandoned,'
I am afraid I may have dwelt too long on the
difficulties and party differences with which at this
time the leaders of Opposition had to contend. But
as similar obstacles have at all times been found to
impair the power cf a party in opposition — springing,
too, from the same cause — namely, the impatience and
wrongheadedness of individuals in pressing their par
ticular views without regard to the wishes and
opinions of others, this notice of the consequences
which followed such a line of conduct in 1808, and
which must ever follow a similar one, may not be
without its advantage.
The questions that principally engaged the atten
tion of Parliament during the Session of 1808 were
those affecting our relations with neutral Powers, as
involved in the Orders of Council of November 1807,
and the policy which had led, also in 1807, to the
attack on Copenhagen and the seizure of the Danish
fleet. On both these questions, as well as on all
others of public interest, there was at this time a
perfect agreement between Lord GrenvUle and my
father: 'It is a great satisfaction to me to find,' my
father writes to Lord Grenville on the Srd of January

1.90 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
1808, ' that of the public measures which must corae
' under discussion, none are likely to produce any
' difference of opinion between us. On the question
' of peace — on that of Ireland — and on the conduct of
' Governraent towards neutrals, we entirely agree,
' Only with respect to the last I must reraark, that
' though I conderan as strongly as anybody both the
' policy, and what I conceive to be the illegality, of
' the late Orders in Council, and though I think we
' should have shown ourselves desirous of encouraging
' all fair coramerce, just in proportion to Bonaparte's
' wild attempts to destroy it, and, therefore, that we
' should have sought conciliation with all neutral
' Powers, and particularly with America, to the
' utraost lirait of reasonable concession ; yet in the
' language and the conduct of the latter Govemment,
' enough has appeared to create a well-founded doubt,
' whether this policy, however carefully pursued,
' would have been successful. Upon this subject,
' therefore, as upon that of peace, we should be care-
' ful, in censuring the rash and impolitic measures
' of our Ministers, not to say or do anything which
' may encourage a belief that there exists any dis-
' position in a party here, to concede any iraportant
' right, or to abstain from a prompt and severe exer-
' tion of the power of the country, if circumstances
' should unfortunately require it,'*
* M. Thiers takes very muoh the same view of what ought to
have been the policy bf France towards America. ' En vue d'obtenir

LORD GREY, 191
' Upon the Danish business,'* my father continues,
' I had some apprehension that there might be a
' shade of difference between us ; but your letter is
' quite satisfactory to me. I do not wish to go farther
' than to state that, as at present informed, there does
' not appear any sufficient ground to justify such an
' attack, and to condemn, as wicked and diabolical,
' the principle of resorting to the practice of the
' enemy with regard to other powers, and fighting
' him, as it is called, with his own weapons,'
It was on a question connected with this subject
that my father spoke for the first time in the House
of Lords, and he thus describes the impression which
it made upon him, ' You will see,' he writes, ' by

' un tel rfisultat' (that of obtaining American co-operation in the war
against England) ' aucun sacrifice ne devait nous couter, et il ^tait
' evident que pour I'obtenir il fallait d'abord faire cesser toute
' plainte fondle des Americains contre nous, afin que leur irritation
' fut exclusivement tourn^e contre I'Angleterre 
' Singulier spectacle,' he adds, ' donne par deux grands Gouvernements ;
' l'un, celui de la France, ayant toutes les lumieres du genie — I'autre, ce-
' lui de I'Angleterre, toutes les lumieres de la liberte — et tous deux
' aveugles de ses passions, entrant a I'e'gard de rAm6rique dans une
' vraie concurrence des fautes ; car il faut malheureusement le recon"
' naltre. Les Pays Ubres se passionnent et s'aveuglent comme lea
' autres ; seulement on peut dire, que la liberty est encore de tous les
' remedes contre I'aveuglement des passions, le plus siir et le plus
' prompt.' * The expedition against Copenhagen in the preceding autumn, un
der the command of Lord Cathcart and Lcrd Gambler, which ended in
the bombardment of the town from the 1st to the 7th of September,
and a capitulation, by which the Danish fleet, the object of the expe
dition, was surrendered to us. The defence of the measure was, that
if England did not get hold of this fleet, France would.

192 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' the papers, that I made ray debut in the House of
' Lords, iast night,* What I said was, I believe,
' neither good or bad ; and it was a subject on which
' I had so great a disinclination to speak, particularly
' for the flrst tirae, that I should have reraained
' silent but for the extreme unhappiness Holland
' seemed to feel at being left without support. But
' what a place to speak in ! With just light enough
' to make darkness visible — it was like speaking in a
' vault, by the gliramering of a sepulchral larap, to
' the dead ! It is impossible I should ever do any-
' thing here worth mentioning,' And a few days
later, when he was about, for the first tirae, to raake
a raotion in the House, he says : •' I feel so unaccount-
' ably nervous, and have, besides, so many papers to
' read before the debate of to-day, that I can literally
' only thank you for your letter. Why a new theatre
' should occasion all these feelings, particularly one
' for which I have no great respect, I do not know,;
' but anything I ever before experienced has been a
' joke to this. My hands are so cold, and I have such
' a nervous trepidation, that I really can hardly write.
' Yet I have plenty of matter in my head, and do not
' see why I should be afraid of getting it out. But
' fear is an unaccountable thing, and I am, at this
' moment, subject to all its influence.'
* On the 27th of January, on the motion for a vote of thanks to
the Forces employed at Copenhagen, Lord HoUand objected to it ; at
all events to the navy, who had not been engaged, being included in
the vote.

LORD GREY. 193
This feeling of nervousness before a debate in which
he was to take part, never forsook him. Neither
habit, nor the consciousness he must have felt of
general success, sufficed to conquer it; and he con
stantly alludes in his letters, on such occasions, to
what he termed his ' oppress.' I believe this feeUng
on the part of Parliamentary debaters, even of those
who have achieved the most unequivocal success, is
more general than those who have heard or read their
speeches would easily believe. But to return to the
affairs of 1808.
The Danish question was the one on which the
most vigorous and effective efforts were made by the
Opposition, and which led to the most acrimonious
debates. It was the practice of Ministers, in defend
ing their poUcy, to endeavour to divert the attention
of Parliament as much as possible from the real
merits of the case under discussion, by attacks on the
conduct of their predecessors in office ; and the effect
of this was, from the manner in which it was done,
and the tone of the debates which it occasioned, to
' lower ' as my father expressed his belief, ' more
' and more the character both of Parliament and of
' the parties engaged in these disputes, in the opinion
'both of the country and of Europe. . . There is
' neither a man nor a party,' he adds, ' in whom mj
' degree of confidence is placed ; and the want of this
' authority and respect, at such a crisis, is not the leas.t
* of the evils which surround us.'

194 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
Mr. Canning seeras to have been the greatest
offender in this respect. In advocating the policy pur
sued by the Govemraent towards Denmark, he
adopted the line of argument which my father thus
so thoroughly deprecated ; asserting that those who
had sanctioned the expeditions against Constantinople
and Alexandria, and who had meditated the seizure of
the Portuguese fleet, were the last men who had any
right to find fault with the attack on Copenhagen, and
the capture of the Danish ships. He also endeavoured
to create the impression, by reading partial extracts
from my father's despatches, when Secretary of State,
to our Minister at the Danish Court, that the late
Govemment had contemplated a similar measure;
thus insinuating that it was raerely their change of
position in ParUament, which caused the Opposition
now to object to the policy of the present Ministers,
This mode of raeeting an attack by a sort of argu-
raentura ad hominem, and by carrying, as it is called,
the war into the enemy's camp, may generaUy be
taken as a symptom of the weakness of the cause
which it is sought to defend. There can be no doubt,
however, that it has often been found effective, and
up to a certain point, perhaps, it is even aUowable,
But it seems to rae that a Minister is greatly wanting
in the self-respect and dignity that befits his position,
when he rests the defence of his policy on aught but
its own raerits. The raistakes or short-comings of his
predecessors in office can afford no legitimate excuse

LORD GREY. 195
for his own, and this sort of ' tu quoque ' argument
generally recoils upon him who uses it. So did it
prove now with Mr, Canning ; and it will be seen that
he was himself the person chiefly damaged, in the
course of the very bitter and acrimonious debates to
which the course he pursued gave rise. These de
bates were not confined to the Lower House, My
father, as having been the Foreign Secretary in the
late Administration, felt that he was the person whose
conduct was principally brought in question ; and the
discussions which followed the explanations he thus
found himself compelled to make in the House of
Lords, were not altogether free from the same tone of
recrimination which marked the proceedings in the
House of Commons,
Of Mr, Canning's speech on the occasion alluded to
my father writes on the following day : ' It will, I
' have no doubt, be very much celebrated. It cer-
' tainly was eloquent and powerful, at least the parts
' I heard of it ; but for audacious misrepresentation,
* and even for positive falsehood, I never heard it
' equalled,' Again my father says, a day or two later, ' We are
' to have the Copenhagen Debate on Monday, and I am
* to make some motions for Papers on Thursday, the
' object of which is to enable me to make a statement
' in refutation of the charges brought against the late
• Government, This has been, perhaps, delayed too
' long, but the scandalous misrepresentations, not to
0 2

196 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' say falsehoods, resorted to by Canning in the House
' of Comraons, make it irapossible to put off the justifi-
' cation which we owe to ohrselves and the country,
' any longer. It is irapossible for any person unac-
' quainted with the facts, to conceive the length of
' audacious falsehood to which he has gone. If I
' had been in the House of Coraraons I hardly know
' how I could have spoken of it at the time without
' violating the rules of Parliaraentary decorura. The
' heat occasioned by all this is becoraing very great,
' and wiU probably produce sorae violences in the
' House of Comraons ; but the gravity of the House
' of Lords will prevent sirailar explosions, though not
« so rauch so, I hope, as to dirainish the effect of a
' strong exposure of the most unlimited systera of mis-
' representation and fallacy that was ever practised.'
In fact, the conduct of Mr, Canning in quoting joar-
tial extracts from despatches not before the House,
and the production of which he was at the sarae tirae
resisting, in order to create an impression unfavour
able to the consistency of the late Administration,
was felt on all sides to be most indecent. When
attacked on the Sth of February in both Houses for
such conduct, scarcely any defence was attempted, and
Mr, Perceval was compeUed to deny that there was
any ground for the 'unfavourable impression against
' Lord Howick, which some gentlemen seemed to ap-
' prehend ' (from the quotation of those extracts), and
to disown in explicit terras that it was ' the intention

LORD GREY. 197
' of his right honourable friend to produce any such
' impression.' The subject continued, however, to be discussed
with much warmth in both Houses. On the llth
February my father made his motion for Papers, and
the next day he writes : ' We had a most triumphant
' debate last night in the House of Lords. My open-
' ing speech must, I think, have appeared long and
' tiresome,* but our statement remained uncontra-
' dieted, and we even extorted from Hawkesbury an
' acknowledgment of the total want of foundation for
' some of the charges which have been so industriously
' propagated against us,f The remarkable feature of
' the debate was Lord Bathurst's calUng Lord Hut-
' chinson to order for stating what was contained in
' confidential despatches. This produced, of course, a
' battle on this point, in the course of which, after
' showing that Lord Hutchinson was perfectly correct,
' we feU without mercy on the indecency and unfair-
' ness of those who, after quoting partial extracts from
' papers against others, denied them the means of
' defence^ by endeavouring to stop them when, in con-
' sequence of the attack they had sustained, they were
' giving the explanations which that attack had made
' necessary. The Chancellor acknowledged that the
' practice of reading Papers of this sort, by whomsoever
* It is impossible to form any opinion of it from Hansard, where it
is compressed into httle more than two pages.
t Particularly for not having raade a diversion in favour of Eussia^
not having advanced a loan to that Power, &c.

198 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
* it might have been introduced, was a breach of duty
' to the King and of the orders of the House,* This I
' fixed upon him, and applied the censure to Canning
' and Hawkesbury, who had begun this raode of war-
' fare. The whole of this scene was very amusing,
' and produced a temporary animation not usually
' found in the House of Lords, The strong way in
' which Canning's conduct has been condemned thus
' publicly by the Chancellor, and in private conversa-
' tion by many of his colleagues, proves that there
' cannot be any cordiality amongst thera.'
A report was also current that the King had ' ex-
' pressed a strong disapprobation of Canning's con-
' duct,' and this, added to the state of the Duke of
Portland's health, and the ' evident syraptoms,' as my
father wrote, ' of internal discontent and division '
amongst the Ministers, led to a very general belief in
approaching changes in the Govemraent ; and ' every
' one,' ray father adds, * was ready to infer that
' Canning either was, or must be out.' ... 'At other
' times,' he proceeds, ' and with other persons, all
' this would lead rae to concur in the opinions which
' are now very much afloat. But my answer now
' always is, that these men cannot separate. They
' have no hope but in reraaining together, however
* ' He (the Chancellor) was clearly of opinion that it was disorderly
' in any person who had been employed in a public capacity to read a
' part and disclose the contents of a public despatch without the leave
' of His Majesty.' . . . ' If a breach of order had been committed and
' permitted in another place, that was surely uo reason why a similar
' breach of order should be tolerated by their Lordships.'

LOED GREY, 199
' much they may hate one another, and however
' frequent their disagreements may be, &c., &c.'
Mr. Canning's conduct in making use of his official
position to read partial extracts from despatches which
were not before the public, was so generally condemned,
and the incessant attacks made upon him in Pariia
ment, were felt to be so damaging to his character,
that on the 26th of February he found it necessary to
come down to the House, and himself to move for the
production of many of the very Papers which he had
before refused. This was a great triumph to the
Opposition, and they appear to have made the most of
it — attacking him both on account of the Papers which
he still kept back; and, because, having refused to
allow the production of documents which others
thought required for the vindication of their cha
racter, on the ground that their production would be
injurious to the public service, he was no longer
influenced by this consideration when his own position
seemed to make it expedient to produce them,
' Ministers are going on,' my father writes on the
27th (the day after Mr, Canning had moved for those
Papers), ' in a way that I believe would make me
' hang myself, if I was one of them ; and, to say the
' truth, they look as raiserable as heart could wish.
' Last night I hear that Canning was literally pulled
' to pieces, and that he seemed to feel it to the
' greatest degree,'
On the 4th March Mr. Adam brought the subject

200 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
of such quotations from official documents, formally
before the House of Commons — moving resolutions
which, after reciting what had been done by Mr.
Canning, and strongly condemning his conduct, con
cluded with affirming ' that such conduct is contrary
' to the trust which is reposed in the confidential
' servants of the Crown.' The Minister, however, was
not deserted by the majority which the general elec
tion had secured to him ; and Mr, Canning having
made his defence, and then left the House, the motion,
after a debate, very shortly reported in Hansard, was
rejected by one hundred and sixty-eight votes to
sixty-seven. My father had been necessarily detained in town as
long as these discussions lasted, ' You will see,' he
writes, ' how much the conduct of the late Govern-
' ment is brought into discussion, and how much my
' particular department and the papers written by me
' are concerned. There are many more moved for
' than have been yet produced, aud till this contest is
' over, in which not only the character of the late
' Govemment but my individual character is so much
' involved, it will be impossible for me to stir..'
I need not allude at any length to the other ques
tions which occupied the attention of Parliament
during the Session of 1808. My father took littie
part in their discussion, and early in April left town
for the North. Upon the raost important of those
questions, and that which, next to the Danish busi-

LORD GREY. 201
ness, came most frequently under discussion — that,
namely, relating to the Orders in CouncU of the llth
November 1807, and to our general poUcyas regarded
neutral powers, his opinion is fully expressed in the
letter written to Lord GrenviUe before the opening of
the Session and already quoted. It has been seen
that he doubted the possibility, under any system of
policy, of long keeping out of the quarrel which the
United States seemed disposed to force upon us;
though, at the same time, he strongly condemned the
policy, and questioned even the legality of the course,
pursued by the Ministers ; and denied, what the
Govemment endeavoured to assert, that the principle
of the Orders in Council issued in January 1807, by
the Cabinet of which he had been himself a member,
and of those of the llth November, issued by the
present Government, was in any degree the same.
He anticipated but too correctly what must be the
result of the present state of things, and in one of his
first letters from London had said that he ' looked
' upon an American war as inevitable.'
I must, however, shortly notice another question
which was brought forward before my father left
town, and in the discussion of which he took part ;
not as being in itself of general interest, but as
having afforded him the occasion of once more record
ing those opinions in favour of progressive Reform,
which he had so often and so fruitlessly advocated
ever since he had held a seat in Parliament ; and of

202 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
again combating that alleged dread of innovation,
which was so long successflUly pleaded by those who
resisted all improveraent ; also, as presenting a rather
curious illustration of Parliaraentary tactics ; of the
state of parties in the House of Lords, and of the
forms of that House,
Towards the close of the Whig Administration, an
address had been carried, deprecating the practice of
granting offices in reversion. The subject had been
referred to a Select Committee, on whose recoraraenda
tion a Bill had been subsequently introduced, to which
the present Ministers had given an unwilUng consent,
for the purpose of preventing such a practice in future.
This Bill had passed the House of Coraraons during
the preceding Session, but was thrown out in the
House of Lords. It had been revived in the present
Session, and, having again passed the House of Com
mons, now stood for consideration in coramittee in the
House of Lords, It was violently opposed by Lords
Arden and Redesdale, as not only interfering with the
Royal Prerogative, and encroaching on the privileges
of that House, but as a measure dangerous in its
principle, from the consequences to which it would
lead, and which should, therefore, be resisted in the
very beginning. In answer to these objections, ray
father, having first shown that it was no infringement
of the Royal Prerogative ; and that, on the contrary,
it was as a friend to the ' Constitutional Prerogative
' of the executive authority ' that he ' called upon

LORD GREY. 203
* the House to put an end to a System above all
' others calculated to strip the Crown of those rights
' which are so necessary to its honour and security,'
proceeded thus : —
' But says the noble and learned lord (Redesdale),
' I cannot reconcile myself to support the principle of
' this measure, because in its operation, or in being
' made the precedent for succeeding innovations, it
' might possibly, or probably, be attended with most
' mischievous and dangerous consequences. Really,
' my Lords, it is impossible to answer this argument
' but by others which have heretofore on many occa-
' sions been introduced into discussion. If, indeed,
' such an objection was to succeed — if the spirit of
' improvement was to evaporate from the influence of
' possible dangers, and probable apprehensions — if
' errors were not to be corrected, or evils remedied, from
' an overweening dread of innovation, — then this coun-
' try would have to lament the want of all those great
' and glorious privileges and securities which constitute
' so deservedly our national boast and our most essen-
' tial safeguard. For what was Magna Charta but an
' innovation ? What else was the Petition of Right ?
' What else the Revolution, that glorious epoch when
' this country obtained a recognition of its liberties ?
' Indeed, I would ask the venerable bench of Bishops,
' whom, on this occasion particularly, I see in such
' formidable numbers arrayed against me, whether if

204 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' this dislike to innovation, this hostility to improve-
' ment, had existed some centuries past, this country
' would have participated in the enlightened wisdora
' and numerous benefits of the Eeformation ; or whether
' they theraselves would have ever had a seat within
' these walls, with power to decide on this measure of
' Reform, which they are now perhaps prepared to
' oppose,' Having then traced the calamities of the
French Revolution, and the melancholy fate of
Louis XVL, 'to the obstinacy with which every
' improveraent was opposed, and to the unbending
' disinclination to conform to the spirit of the times
' and the progress of mental advancement,' he asked,
' Where can we find a more signal and melancholy
' exemplification of the danger of not yielding to those
' plans of salutary and wholesome correction, which
' the defects of all human institutions render absolutely
' necessary ? ' And he called upon ' those who are so
' particularly attached to the Court, and upou the
' iUustrious and Royal personages opposite ' (the
Dukes of York, Curaberland, and Carabridge), ' who
' are so active in their opposition to the raeasure,' to
consider the state of foreign sovereigns, reduced ' to
' the lowest vassalage to the great and inordinate
' power of France ! Be assured,' he continued, 'that
' rauch as the unrivalled conqueror of the European
' Continent owes to his own extensive talents for
' success, — much as he is indebted to the undisputed

LORD GREY. 205
* sagacity of his plans for his gigantic elevation,— he
* has had great and powerful auxiliaries in the selfish-
' ness, the sordid views, the UUberal jealousies of the
' dynasties he has subverted ; in the apathy and torpor
' of the oppressed and despised populations over whom
• he has triumphed.'
The following is my father's own account of the
above discussion, and of the proceedings which led to
the final rejection of the proposed measure,
'We had last night a most curious scene in the
' House of Lords. The Princes, four in number, came
' down in force with all the household troops and
' bishops, and endeavoured to throw out the Reversion
' Bill on the question for going into Committee. They
' beat us in the numbers present, but the majority of
' proxies being on our side, we were equal upon the
' whole, and, according to the established usage in the
' House of Lords, the question was therefore decided
' in the negative, so that the motion made by the
' enemies of the BUl for discharging the order for the
' Committee was lost. In the Committee Hawkesbury
' moved an amendment to limit the duration of the
' Bill to two years.' ' Ministers,' my father explained
in another letter, ' being against the measure in their
' hearts, had,' to avoid the unpopularity of a direct
opposition to it, ' hit , upon this expedient, declaring
' that without this limitation they must be against the
' measure.' They therefore ' moved this amendment.

206 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' to which Lord Holland and I objected as making the
' Bill worse, but declared that we did not mean to
' press our objection (feeling that the Bill would be
' lost if the amendment were negatived) ; though, if
' we were compelled to vote, we must do so in sup-
' port of the Bill as it stood. We did not intend,
• therefore, to divide ; but the courtiers, who held the
' Ministers pledged to oppose the Bill if the amend-
' raent was lost, divided the House, and voted with
' us against it, and the Ministers were left in a
' minority of only twenty-one. The BiU, therefore,
' passed the Committee without any alteration, and
' on the third reading was opposed both by the
' Court and the Administration, and thrown out ac-
' cordingly.' The small rainority in which the Governraent was
left when deserted by the 'King's fi-iends,' showed
the real strength of the party now in power without
the Court, while the result of the division on the third
reading of the Bill, when the Court and Ministers were
again united, afforded the best practical answer to the
assertion of Lord Redesdale, that the influence of the
Crown was decreasing. ' The increasing influence of
' the Crown was a topic,' Lord Redesdale said, ' which
' in all times it had been fashionable to dwell upon.
' Since Mr. Burke's famous Bill, he would, however,
' contend that the influence of the Crown had been
' diminished rather than increased.'

LOED GREY. 207
My father had been most anxious to attend the
expected debate on the Roman Catholic petition, but
the state of my mother's health, and the death of his
uncle. Sir Harry Grey, at the beginning of April,
made his continued attendance in Parliament impos
sible for the remainder of the Session, He concurred
entirely with Lord GrenviUe and other friends to the
Roman Catholic cause, in thinking the presentation of
the petition at that time ill-advised. But the Catholics
being determined to take that step, and having hiraself a
strong conviction not only of the justice of their claims,
but of the expediency, not to say the necessity, of
granting them, he was desirous of giving them his best
support. But he disapproved most strongly of the course
which the Catholic party subsequently adopted. In
the debates consequent upon the presentation of the
petition, Lord Grenville in the House of Lords, and
Mr. George Ponsonby in the House of Commons, had
announced the consent of the Roman Catholics to
giving the King a veto on the appointment of their
Bishops, and much stress had been laid on the im
portance of this concession on their part. Lord Gren
ville adduced it as an ' unquestionable proof of their
' solicitude to meet the kindness of their fellow-sub-
' jects, and to accede to any practicable means of
' removing even the most groundless jealousies ; '
adding, that ' this provision formed a part of the plans

208 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' intended to be brought forward at the period of the
' Union ; and what we then knew,' he said, ' of the
« sentiments of the CathoUcs respecting it, left no
' doubt upon our minds that the matter raight be
' easily and satisfactorily adjusted.'
It was therefore with extrerae surprise, and still
more indignation, that my father heard frora Mr.
Ponsonby in October following, that the Roman
Catholic Bishops had repudiated this condition.
' I will not dwell,' he writes in answer, ' on Dr.
' Milner's conduct further than to say, that it proves
' him to be a man not to be trusted. The authority
' he gave you is a full justiflcation of what you said in
' the House of Commons, and in my opinion it wUl,
' at some time or other, be necessary for you to
' produce it.
' It is now incurabent on us,' he proceeds, ' to con-
' sider what should be done to retrieve this unfortuuate
' step of the Catholic Bishops, and to preserve our
' own consistency and honour. You raust know enough
' of the public opinion in this country to be convinced,
' that unless the negative on the appointment of the
' Bishops is given, particularly after such an expeeta-
' tion has been held out, and so much stress laid upon
' it, all hope of carrying the question in favour of the
' Catholics must be abandoned.'
Attempts should therefore, he tiiought, be raade to
get the Catholic Bishops to rescind their resolution, or.

LORD GREY. 209
if they would not do so, to separate the moderate
Roman Catholics from them. ' Our conduct,' he pro
ceeds, ' as a party who have hitherto supported the
' Catholic claims, must necessarily be regulated in a
' great degree by the same views as the moderate
' Catholics themselves, ... at the same time that we
' must be actuated by a due regard to our own cha-
' racter and influence in the country. These, in my
' opinion, imperiously require that we should raanifest
' a determined resistance to this ill-advised measure of
' the Bishops. I hope it is unnecessary to make any
' professions as to the abstract principle of not ex-
' eluding men from civil rights on account of religious
' opinions. No man more readily assents to, or more
' cordially cherishes that principle than I do. But
' there are few circumstances in human life, I believe
' I may say none in politics, that can be reduced to
' mere abstractions. Expediency must operate in all,
' and he who pretends otherwise is either a hypocrite,
' or unfit for the affairs of this world.
' If therefore the negative on the appointment of the
' Bishops be a thing reasonable in itself ; if it be a
' security which, considering the particular character of
' the Papal Power (nothing like which prevails in any
' other sect) may properly be required, either to allay
' fears or to obviate prejudices ; if it is a point which
? cannot be stated to affect injuriously the rights of the
' Catholic Church, and to which we have something
' equal almost to positive proof that the Catholics feel

210 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' no conscientious objection ; above all, if we are
' morally certain that without it the question cannot
' be carried, and have pledged ourselves by recent
' declarations to an opinion of its expediency and
' importance ; it seems to me that the interests of the
' Catholics, no less than our own consistency and
' honour, require that we shonld make an early decla-
' ration, that this concession is indispensable to our
' fiiture support of the cause.'
At the same time my father wrote both to the
Duke of Bedford and Lord Grenville to suggest the
propriety of such a declaration being at once made,
which ' coming,' he said, ' from those who have hitherto
' so zealously maintained the claims of the Catholics,
' and who have given such unequivocal proofs of their
' sincerity, by the sacrifices they have made for them,
' could not fail, I should hope, in giving to the
' moderate Catholics a decisive weight in an appeal, if
' ultimately an appeal should be necessary, to the
' general body of that religion.' And to Mr, Whit
bread he says, in sending him a copy of his own
correspondence on the subject with Mr, Ponsonby,
' I am convinced that if it ' (the resolution of the Ca
thoUc Bishops) ' is persevered in, it will be impossible
' to carry the question either in this or the succeeding
' reign, even if there should be a King and Govern-
' ment friendly to it ; and the only chance, as it appears
' to me, either of preserving our own credit in the
' country, or of destroying the influence of a malignant

LORD GREY. 211
' party amongst the Catholics, and bringing them to
' a policy absolutely necessary for the accomplishment
' of their object, is to be found in the iramediate adop-
' tion of the measure I have suggested to George
' Ponsonby, viz. : that it should be signified to Lord
' Fingall and those amongst the leaders of the Catholics
' with whom we have been in the habit of communi-
' eating, that we cannot again bring forward or sup-
' port their question till this resolution is explained or
' rescinded.' The Duke of Bedford and Lord Grenville, as well as
Mr. Whitbread, disagreed with my father as to the
propriety of such a declaration ; and as its effect
depended entirely, he thought, on the unanimity with
which it was adopted, he had no alternative but to let
it drop. Not that his own opinion was in anyway
changed : ' But when I found,' " he writes to Lord
Grenville, ' that you did not approve of my proposal,
'and that the Duke of Bedford and Whitbread, as
' well as Lord Holland, were decidedly averse to it,
' as there could no longer be any question of a
' measure, the whole effect of which depended on our
' agreement, I deferred it ' (that is, writing to him
again on the subject) ' till we could have an oppor-
' tunity of more full discussion.' . . . ' I will now only
' state,' he adds, ' that everything I hear confirms me
' in the opinion that such a measure as I proposed
* afforded us the only chance of again putting that im-
p'2

212 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' portant question on a footing which raight enable us
' all to agree, or which could reconcile either the
' King or the people of this country to it.' And he
further adds, with how rauch truth the subsequent
history of Ireland, with its long years of selfish and
deraoralizing agitation too miserably proves, ' But I
' ara convinced that the resolution of the Bishops was
' forced upon thera by the activity of a party of the
' raost raalignant description, who are still most assi-
' duously, and, for want of resistance, I fear too suc-
' cessfully, employed in kindling and inflaming a
' general spirit like their own,'
Mr, Whitbread not only disagreed as to the pro
priety of such a declaration as my father had thus
suggested, but he also, unfortunately, with some of
the more violent raembers of Opposition, took very
much the sarae line as that of the extreme party
in Ireland above referred to ; and having hinted
that Mr, Ponsonby was not justified in affirming so
positively the assent of the Catholic party to the veto,
my father repUed : ' I cannot think that George
' Ponsonby outstepped his authority in what he said
' in the House of Commons. You will observe that
' he not only had the direct authority of Dr, Milner
' speaking his own opinion, and what he had every
' reason to believe to be the opinion of the Bishops, but
' that of Lord Fingall also ; and both confirmed by the
' knowledge that the negative had been formally

LORD GREY. 213
' offered, at the time of the Union, by the Bishops
' themselves,'* ' It is true that till the last Session the question
' had been brought forward without making this veto
' a preliminary consideration ; but I do not imagine
' that anybody ever thought the claims of the Catho-
' lies were to be simply conceded, without any securi-
' ties against the dangers which might be apprehended
' from such a concession. Such, I am sure, was not
' Fox's opinion ; and I well remember his answer
' when Pitt taunted him with his magnificent and
' sweeping way of doing things, without any regard to
' the provisions which might be necessary for the
' safety of the Protestant Establishment ; his answer
' was : " that Pitt had no right to represent him as
' being less friendly to the Establishment, or less
' anxious for its safety thau he was ; and that, un-
' undoubtedly, all proper securities ought to be
* taken." He mentioned to me this very measure
* of the negative as one of them.'

¦* Mr, Ponsonby being questioned in the House of Commons as to
the authority on which he affirmed the readiness of the Irish clergy to ,
consent to a veto on the appointment of their Bishops, replied : ' that
* he made his statement on the authority of Dr. Milner, who was a
' Catholic Bishop in this country, and who was authorised by CathoUc
' Bishops of Ireland to make the proposition, in case the measure of
' Emancipation should be acceded to, that the person to be nominated
' to any vacant bishopric should be submitted for the King's approba-
' tion ; and that if the approbation was refused, another person should
' be proposed, and so on in succession until His Majesty's approbation
' should be obtained, so that the appointment should finally rest with
' the King.'

214 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
It will be seen that two years later Lord Gren
ville found hiraself corapelled to write to Lord FingaU,
as the representative of the Irish Catholics, very much
in the sense of the declaration which my father now
advised. But it had not then the effect he believed it
eertainly would have had, if it had beeu adopted at
the time that the conduct of the Irish Bishops afforded
so complete a justification for it.
Without anticipating what occurred with regard to
this question in after years, I must here give some
extracts frora one of my father's letters to Mr, Whit
bread, written in January 1810, as explaining the
principle on which he then and at all tiraes acted with
respect to it,
' With respect to the Catholic Question,' he writes,
' I raust continue to be of the opimon that nothing can
' be raore prejudicial to the hope of carrying it in time
' to prevent the most fatal consequences, or raore
' erabarrassing to those who have supported it on the
' grounds on which Lord Grenville and I have sup^
' ported it, than a renewal of the motion at the present
' moraent and under the present circurastances. . . .
' With these opinions ' (as to the consequences which
would follow its introduction) ' I raust deprecate the
' discussion ; though, if it takes place, I shaU not fail
' to give, not a cold and reluctant, but the most
' zealous support I can give, to the principles I
' beUeve to be sound ; upon the ground and with the
' explanations by which, as it appears to me, those

LORD GREY. 215
' principles ought practically to be regulated. These
' opinions are, after much reflection, so deeply fixed
' in my mind, that I must act upon them, and I must
* beg leave to lay all considerations of popularity
* out of the question. If popularity follows me in
' doing what I believe to be right, I shall always
' be glad of it ; but I never have, and never will,
' sacrifice one item of what I believe to be right
' to obtain it, any more than I would for Court
' favour. The desire of the one may at one moment
' be imputed to me, and at the next the pursuit
' of the other ; and I must trust that eventually
' my conduct will satisfy the public that neither
' imputation has been just. Now, I have very little
' doubt it will be said, as you apprehend, that the
' last is my object ; but, probably, a very short time
' will prove most unanswerably that it could not be
' so, when, in opposition I believe to the opinion of
' almost all my friends, I shall make the immediate
* settlement of this question, the sine qu& non of my
' acceptance of office.'
What can be added to this clear and noble exposi
tion of his principles of action on this subject, to prove
the high-minded singleness of purpose, which, dis
daining all personal considerations, made the success
of the cause his one and only aim, and to show how
Uttle he was disposed to make the question a weapon
of ParUamentary warfare, or a stepping-stone to
power ! Yet there were not wanting men, and in the

216 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
position of Cabinet Ministers, (and who, though pro
fessing themselves friendly to the claims of the Catho
lics, owed their situations as such to the ' No Popery '
cry which had been raised against their predecessors,)
who were not asharaed to resort to such arguments,
and judging of the motives of others by their own
standard, to accuse their opponents of having been
influenced in the course they had pursued on this
question, in and out of office, by a mean love of place I
But a new subject was now rising to agitate and
divide raen's rainds.
The French invasion of Portugal, which had at first
taken place in concert with Spain, had resulted in the
latter country also being overrun and occupied by
French armies, and in the dispossession of her King
and Royal Family under circumstances of peculiar and
revolting perfidy ; nor was there any one who viewed
the events now occurring in the Peninsula with more
heartfelt indignation than did my father.
In subsequent years, indeed, when experience had
shown how little dependence could be placed upon the
Spaniards themselves ; — when, owing entirely to an
undue reUance upon Spanish promises of support and
co-operation. Sir John Moore's array had been forced
to re-embark after a disastrous retreat, closed indeed
by a victory that reflects undying glory on the British
arras ;— when the army of Sir Arthur Wellesley was
only saved from still greater dangers after the battle
of Talavera, arising too from the came causes, by the

LORD GREY. 217
energy and decision of its chief; — when on one side
my father considered the enormous aggregate of
the French force arrayed against us, (still amounting
in 1812 to upwards of 300,000 men,) and wanting
nothing but unity of command to make it a matter of
impossibility that the comparative handful of British
troops which we alone maintained in the Peninsula,
could long stand before them ; — and when he saw, on
the other hand, the reckless and fruitless manner, as it
appeared to him, in which our resources were squan
dered, and the miserable and inadequate attempts of an
incapable Ministry to support our army ; — when he
considered all these things, my father certainly did, in
after years, feel strong doubts both of-the prudence
and possibility of maintaining the contest in Spain.
He did not then foresee — who indeed did ? — that Na
poleon would, of himself, by his insane invasion of
Russia, wantonly destroy those means, a comparatively
small portion of which would have speedily sufficed to
establish his dominion in Spain ; nor did my father
then (the fact may be stated, which he was himself
afterwards the first to admit,) do full justice to the
consummate skill and judgment, the energy and
unwearied patience, of the great commander who was
at the head of our forces ; who, while providing every
means for the possibly and even probably necessary
re-embarkation of his troops, and taking every pre
caution for their security against a catastrophe, saw
with an unfailing sagacity, that he had only to bide his

218 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
time, and that if he could but maintain a footing upon
the soil of the Peninsula, the time must surely and
inevitably arrive when the restless and insatiate am
bition of our great enemy, leading him ever to fresh
enterprises against the liberties of the world, would
give the British array the opportunity of contributing
effectively to his final overthrow.
At the comraencement of the struggle, however, my
father's whole sympathies went with the Spaniards.
' What a scene of perfidy and atrocious cruelty,' he
writes to Mr, Whitbread in June 1808, ' this has been
' in Spain ! Surely this villain will push things too
' far at last, and I ara sometimes inclined to hope more
' from the despair of a people, than could at any time
' have been effected by any combination of power.
' If it should once begin to be attended with success
' anywhere, there is no saying to what it might lead.
'Spain, if the energies of that country were once
' brought into action, affords perhaps greater means
* for permanent resistance than any country in Europe
' except this. I wish Lord St. Vincent had been off
' Cadiz at this moment.'
' One hardly dare hope,' he writes again, a few days
later, ' that the poor Spaniards can be successful. Yet
' their country affords means of resistance, and presents
' difficulties to the attacker which he has not yet met
' with. Much depends on the man at their head, and
• on the conduct of our Government. This is indeed
'a case in which no sacrifice would be too great.

LORD GREY. 219
' Men, money, ships, to the utmost extent that the
' country will afford them, ought to be sent without
' delay. It is provoking that at such a raoment so
' great a proportion of all should be wanted in Sweden,
' where, by this time I take it. Ministers have found
' that it was easier to blame us for not supporting that
' mad King, than to do so themselves. The advantage
' to us, and the security to Sweden, from the attack on
' Copenhagen, are now pretty strongly exemplified,'
Mr, Sheridan brought the state of Spain before the
House of Commons on the 15th of June, but the
manner in which the motion was made by hira, and
met by the Ministers, was equally condemned by my
father. 'I never read anything,' he wrote to Mr.
Whitbread, 'better contrived to do mischief in all
' ways, as tending,' he thought, ' still more to damage
' the character of public men, of parties, and of Parlia-
' ment ;' while ' as to its professed object of indicating
' a general feeling here which might prove useful in
' Spain, nothing could more completely fail. In this
' view, however,' he adds, ' I am inclined to think some
' good perhaps might have been done, if the subject
* had been introduced by a person who had not looked
' exclusively to the gratification of his own vanity, and
' if we had not Ministers who never see anything to be
' gained in a debate, but an opportunity of throwing
' some slur on their predecessors in office, or their op-
' ponents in Parliament,'
But strongly opposed as he was to the general tone

220 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
and policy of the Govemment, his at least was no fac
tious opposition ; and he was ever ready to express his
approval when the conduct of Ministers seemed to him
to deserve it. Thus he writes to Mr, Whitbread, in July
1808 : ' Nothing can, in ray opinion, be more proper than
the manner in which this subject is treated in the King's
' speech' (at the close of the Session), ' and if the Minis-
'ters pursue the line which their language indicates,
' they will have my hearty approbation,' And in writ
ing to Lord GrenviUe, a "few months later (Dec. 29 th,
1808), he says, in allusion to the assistance given to
Spain by this country, and to the Ministerial decla
ration that accompanied it (on both of which points
Lord GrenviUe seems to have expressed an adverse
opinion) : ' I certainly am one of those who approved
' of giving assistance upon the largest scale to Spain,
' and who stiU think if a powerful army had been sent
' there in sufficient time, and upon a reasonable plan,
' it might have contributed to the ultimate defeat of
' Bonaparte's attack upon that country, I think, too,
' that it was right first to secure Portugal, though not
' to lock up an army there after the expulsion of the
' French.' With respect to the ' Declaration,' he pro
ceeds : 'Do not think I raean to defend Canning's
' foolish flourishes, or that upon reconsidering the
' raatter I am prepared to contend that it might not
' have been better to avoid the pledge which has been
' given. But of all the infamies ever incurred by a
' nation, I think the greatest would have been, in the

LORD GREY. 221
' then situation of affairs (not quite so desperate, I
' yet hope, as you deem it), to have appeared to aban-
' don the Spaniards, or to have treated under the idea
' of acknowledging Joseph Bonaparte as King of Spain.
' I must think that we were bound by every tie that
' can bind a nation, both in interest and honour, to
' support the Spaniards as long as theyhave the means
' of resistance, and do not themselves abandon their
' own cause.'*
His feeling on this point was so strong that he says
to Mr. Whitbread: 'This is the only thing that I
* believe could make me feel a moment's wish to be in
' office,' The sanguine hopes, however, which he expressed
in July 1808, 'That the Spaniards would succeed in
' their glorious enterprise,' and that ' Bonaparte would
' find reason to repent of this most atrocious of all his
' villanies,' were soon damped, owing chiefly, as it ap
peared to him, to the misconduct of our Ministers.
And on the 21st of AprU 1809, having first pointed
out, in a powerful speech, how the ' hopes of the nation
' had been raised and all their most generous sympa-
' thies excited, as he trusted they would never fail to
* Overtures had been made by both Russia and France, from Erfurth,
to treat with England on the basis of the ' Uti possidetis,' but as the
French insisted that this condition should embrace the recognition of
Joseph Bonaparte as King of Spain, the overture went no further than
a single exchange of notes. On the 15th of December, 1808, the
Enghsh Govemment issued a declaration (referred to in the above
letter) explaining the grounds on which they had refused to entertain
the proposition.

222 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
' be, when the contest is between justice, freedom, and
* public independence, on the one side, and the highest
' degree of atrocity and oppression on the other ;' and
having also shown how, under the universal sympathy
with the cause of the Spanish people, ' the voice of
' opposition had ceased, and a liberal indulgence was
' given to Ministers of all they pleased to demand,' he
raoved an address to the Crown, to declare the opinion
of the House, that it was owing to the want of informa
tion and foresight on the part of Ministers ; to their
supineness, rashness, and mismanagement, as con
trasted with the activity, foresight, and prudence of
the enemy ; to the inadequacy of the suppUes Sent to
the army ; and to the want of ' any rational plan of
' operations, either for the direction of our own exer-
' tions, or for corabining thera with those of the Spanish
' and Portuguese nations ; that the hopes which the
' nation had been led to entertain have been disap-
' pointed ; a large and useless expenditure of the
' means of the country has been incurred ; a.great and
' dangerous accession of poUtical, naval, and military
' strength has already been attained by the eneray ;
' and above 7000 of His Majesty's brave troops, toge-
' ther with their gallant coraraander have been sacri-
' ficed without advantage, in an enterprise without
' plan, corabination, or foresight, and equaUy ill-tiraed
' and misdirected,'
This motion was powerfully supported by Lord
Grenville ; and the large minority, as it would even

LORD GREY. 223
now be considered, of ninety-two peers voted in its
favour. The state of parties in Opposition, of which my
father had seen so much reason to complain during
the Session of 1808, and which has been alluded to at
some length at the beginning of this Chapter, was even
worse in 1809, and to the old causes of dissension was
now added a new one. A Colonel Wardle had
brought forward charges against the Duke of York
relative to his administration of the army, and was
supported iu them, to the unspeakable disgust of my
father, by a large number of the more violent members
of the Opposition. It will suffice on this subject to
record the opinion which, in a letter written on his
way to London in May 1809, he thus expresses of
Colonel Wardle and his supporters : ' From the ac-
' counts of the debates that I have seen in the papers
' on the road, the enrage's ' (so he termed the extreme
party by which these proceedings were instigated)
' seem to be going on more absurdly and extrava-
' gantly than ever. . . . The effect of their latter pro-
' ceedings, however, I am inclined to think will be
' good, as they must disgust all persons of sense and
' honourable feelings ; and indeed it seems as if
' the Ministers, and House of Commons in general,
' were beginning to take a little heart against them.
' I was very glad to see that one Member spoke of
' Wardle as I think he deserves, and said he would as
' soon vote thanks to Mrs. Clarke for her virtue as to

224 LIPE AND OPINIONS OF
' him for his patriotism. I really think they stand on
' pretty much the sarae ground ; nor can I conceive
' anything baser than the conduct which is now held
' up as entitled to the gratitude and adrairation of the
' whole country. An inforraer, however useful his in-
' formation raay prove, is generally shunned as an
' infamous character ; and I do not see that Mr,
' Wardle, who, by his own acknowledgment, forraed
' an intiraacy With a vile prostitute to get into her
' secrets^ and to induce her to betray the man whose
' confldence she had before abused, and who stole her
' letters for the purpose of supporting his charges, de-
' serves to be viewed in a much better light.'
' The violent party in the House of Comraons,' he
repeats, on his arrival in London, ' are going on worse
' than ever,' And after condemning their proceedings
as such as would never have been countenanced ' in
' other times or by men of liberal spirit,' he proceeds ;
' but now a new code of politicalj.morality and honour
' has been adopted, and everything seems greedily
' taken up that can tend to fhrow discredit on the
' general system of the Government. Lord GrenviUe
' seems very uneasy upon this point, as well as upon
' the general course of public opinion, and it is impos-
' sible not to admit the reasonableness of his feelings,
' It is very difficult, however, to find a remedy for
' evils which have been brought on by the manner in
' which the present Ministers came into office, and by
' the conduct which they have been pursuing ever

LOED GEEY. 225
' since ; the more especially as they seem to have no
' plan or foresight, living from day to day, and trust-
' ing to what accident may produce in the course of
' each debate as it arises. They are more divided than
' ever amongst themselves, and a very general senti-
' ment prevails that they cannot stand.'
But as this state of things led to changes in the
Govemment and to negotiations for other changes
which will require particular mention, I must reserve
all further notice of it for another chapter.

Q

226 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP

CHAPTER V.
From the Overture by Mr. Perceval to the Wraas, in September
1809, TO the Commencement of the Eeoenot, in February 1811.
Reports of divisions and dissensions amongst the
members of the Government had been more or less
prevalent almost frora its first forraation in 1807;
but they had becorae much more general towards the
beginning of 1809, and my father on arriving in Lon
don in May of that year, after writing, (May 10th, 1809,)
as already quoted, that ' the Ministers are more divided
' than ever amongst theraselves, and a very general
' sentiment prevails that they cannot stand,' proceeds
thus: — 'This language, indeed, is openly talked by
' some of the most considerable of their adherents, and
' even by some amongst themselves ; and if I could
' persuade myself that anything would induce Canning
' to go out, I should believe fi'om facts that have come
' to my knowledge since my arrival, that his determi-
' nation is taken, and wiU be publicly announced even
' in the course of this week.
' If this should take place, the Administration must
' break up ; but then I really do not know who are to

LORD GREY. 227
' take their places. I have no idea that the King
' will submit to the conditions which we should think
' indispensable for our assuming office ; and, to tell
' you the truth, this is one of my greatest comforts,
' for I never looked at anything with more real horror
' than the prospect of being caUed upon to take a
' share in the Administration, in the present situation
' of the country. The reports of my being sent for
' are more prevalent than ever, and I have no doubt
' there are very few who do not -believe that I am
' come to town with that expectation. They little
' know how reluctantly I came, and how anxiously I
' am looking to the moment when I may be allowed
' to return to Howick.'
But the violent section in the House of Commons,
whose proceedings, as has been shown in the preced
ing chapter, my father had always so strongly depre
cated, had continued, notwithstanding all his endea
vours to moderate their course, to act in a manner
which he could only consider as, in fact, breaking up
the Opposition. ' 1 look upon the party,' he writes
on the 20th May, ' as quite disbanded in the House
' of Commons. Thus Ministers have obtained a new
' lease by the wise conduct of those who wish to exhibit
' themselves to the country as the purest of patriots,
' and the most effective of its benefactors. Their
' exertions, however, seem to have slackened, and if,
' as I think probable, they find the public growing
' sick of their nonsense, they will have time to reflect
q2

228 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' on what they have done.' And again : ' The Minis-
' ters are set up ; and to them (this violent section)
' the country will owe the benefits, whatever they raay
' be, of their continuing in office. Not that they do
' not yet talk of a desire to strengthen themselves, and
' this is very generally expressed with regard to me.
' The report of my coming in is still prevailing all
' over the town, I do not think this will lead even to
' a proposition ; but, if it does, it wiU be on a ground
' to which the answer will be short and easy. If they
' had declared, as ten days ago I feared they would,
' their inability to carry on the Government, it would
' have been more embarrassing. But a proposal to
' come in as an auxiliary to these men can admit of no
' hesitation. The truth is, if I would treat on these
' terms, I have no doubt I might have the Duke of
' Portland's office before the end of the week, and all
' I shall get, probably, by holding off, will be still to
' be represented as a person desirous only of place.
' It must be confessed that there is not, in the gratitude
' of the public, much encouragement to political virtue,'
The dissensions in the Cabinet were soon made pub
lic by the celebrated quarrel, ending in a duel, between
Lord Castlereagh and Mr. Canning, and their conse
quent resignation of office ; and the Duke of Port
land finding it necessary, on account of the state of
his health,* to retire about the same time, an applica-
* He had a severe paralytic stroke in August, and died iu October,
1809,

LORD GREY. 229
tion to the leaders of the Opposition could no longer
be avoided. On the 23rd of September Mr. Perceval
wrote to my father and Lord GrenviUe to ask them
to come to town to confer with himself and Lord
Liverpool, 'for the purpose of forming an extended
' and combined Administration.' * But the proposition
being, as my father had anticipated it would be, to come
in as auxiliaries to the existing Administration, he
answered, without a moment's hesitation, and by return
of post, as he had already announced his intention of
doing : ' that such an union was, with respect to him,
' under the present circumstances, impossible,' and that
this being the answer he found himself under the
necessity of giving, there could be no advantage in his
complying with Mr. Perceval's request that he would
come to London, where his appearance 'at such a
' moment might be attended with some inconvenience,'
Lord Grenville's answer was to the same effect as
regarded the proposed junction, but there was this
difference between his mode of meeting the proposition
and that of my father, that he thought it right to go
up to London as requested by Mr. PercevaL My
father's only doubt as to his own course was, lest his
refusal to do the same should be misconstrued ; and
he afterwards wrote to Mr. Whitbread, that ' though
' quite satisfied upon reflection that the line he took
' was, in all views, the best ; if he could have been
* Mr. Perceval's letter to my father, and the answer of the latter,
will be found at length in Appendix I., p. 429.

230 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
quite sure that Lord Grenville would have decided
to go to town, he certainly would have met him
there.' In sending Mr. Whitbread a copy of his
answer to Mr. Perceval, he again says : ' I am satisfied
in my own mind as to the propriety of what I have
done on the main point, though I was unfortunately
without any person here to consult upon it. As to
the manner, I hope there was nothing very wrong,
though I am by no means so confident that I ought
not to have gone to town. I thought it better, how
ever, not to do so, in order to give the most decisive
proof of the settled resolution, fi-om which my refusal
to enter into any treaty with the present Ministers
has proceeded, and to obviate, as far as I could, the
speculations which would necessarily arise on my
appearance in London at the present moment. I
can hardly expect that I shall not meet with blame
from many quarters, — from many of my friends, for
having lost what they may think a fair opportunity
of bringing back the Govemment to a better system,
— from the adherents of the Court, for what will
perhaps be condemned as a haughty and uncomply
ing disposition, — and from the patriots of the Crown
and Anchor, as having been influenced by a sordid
desire of office, to which sufficient aUureraents were
not held out, AU this I must bear ; but I shall
hope that from yourself, and those who know me,
ray conduct will meet with a raore candid interpre
tation.'

LORD GREY. 231
Mr. Whitbread quite approved of the course my
father had adopted. ' I rejoice,' he says in answer,
' in the decision you have made, and in the manner of
' doing it. ... I could have no doubt as to what
' you would do, and in a letter to Tierney I antici-
' pated that you would not come to town, unless the
'message to you was directly from the King, com-
' manding your attendance.'
Mr. Horner also writes on the 30th September:
' The Courier (newspaper) I understand states that
' Lord Grenville is arrived in town, but that Lord
' Grey has declined to come. If the summons was
' from the King, how could Lord Grey refuse ? And
' if it was an invitation from Perceval, how could
' Lord GrenviUe accept ?
While at the same time Sir Samuel Romilly says of
this proposal : * It was probably not intended as an
' insult to Lord GrenviUe and Lord Grey, But surely
' no greater insult could be offered to any public men,
' than to suppose them to be so eager to be in power,
' that they would unite in an Administration with per-
' sons whom they have constantiy represented as
' having supplanted them by a dark and disgraceful
' intrigue. , . . and as having entered on their office
' upon the most unconstitutional principles.'
If the extracts given in a former chapter from Lord
Grey's letters to Mr. Fox during the Administrations
of Mr. Pitt and Mr. Addington have not been for
gotten, it will be seen that the course he now adopted

232 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
was strictly in accordance with the opinions he then
expressed as to the only conditions on which men
who had been long opposed to each other in pubUc,
could honourably corae together either in or out of
office. Mr, Perceval's overture having been thus rejected
by the Opposition leaders, the Government was at
length reconstituted, though not till the month of
November following, under Mr. Perceval himself, who
added the office of First Lord of the Treasury to that
which he already held of Chancellor of the Exchequer,
Of this arrangement, and of the delay that took place
in effecting it, my father thus writes : ' I always be-
' lieved that the King would encourage his Ministers
' to try anything rather than abdicate the Government ;
' and I also believed them to be men not to stick at
' trifles ; but I confess I had no idea that they would
' have the courage, or the folly (which should it be
' called ?), to keep the country without a Govern-
' ment for two months, and, after all, to venture
' upon such an Administration as has at last been
' formed.' Considering that on the declaration of the Regency,
in little raore than a year frora this tirae, the Prince
of Wales continued the Adrainistration thus forraed in
office, and that he confirraed thera in power at the ex
piration of the year of restrictions, it is amusing to read
Colonel M'Mahon's account of the manner in which His
Royal Highness now received the notiflcation of the

LORD GREY. 233
formation of Mr, Perceval's Government. ' The Prince,'
Colonel M'Mahon writes to my father, 'further de-
' sires me to say that he is only prevented, at this in-
' stant, from writing to you himself, by the laughter
' which so Ixjtdicrous a circumstance has necessarily
excited.' ! !
The Government thus reconstituted, weak as it was
in talent, and low as it stood in the estimation of the
public, was strong in the support of the Crown, and in
the continued divisions of the parties in Opposition ;
and notwithstanding that it was defeated in the House
of Commons on the 26th January 1810, on a motion
for inquiry into the policy and conduct of the expe
dition to the Scheldt, when the Opposition was united
for the raoment, it maintained its ground successfully
against all attacks, till violently terminated, two years
later, by the assassination of Mr, Perceval in the lobby
of the House of Commons.
A short notice will suffice for most of the questions
that were agitated in Parliament during the Session of
1810. To enter into any lengthened detaU of them
would only be to reproduce, as far as my father
was concerned in the discussions that took place, the
expression of opinions which have been already suf
ficiently explained.
He concurred entirely in the condemnation so gene
rally felt and expressed regarding the Walcheren ex
pedition, on the ground that the object itself was per
fectly unattainable, and if attainable, that it could have

234 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
no effect whatever on the general result of the war,
' When he held the seals of the Foreign Department,'
he said in the Debate on the Address at the opening of
the Session, ' the expedition to the Scheldt, wliich had
' been undertaken by the present Ministers, had been
' fi-equently pressed upon him, he therefore turned his
' attention to it, and after making every due inquiry,
' he was convinced that the object of destroying the
' arsenals at Antwerp and the shipping in the Scheldt
' was not attainable,' But he objected to this expe
dition still more as part of a system of frittering away
our force in isolated and unconnected efforts, when it
was raost essential to a successful conduct of the war,
that our resources should be husbanded with care, and,
if we would effect any great purpose, that they should
be concentrated and directed, in undivided power, to
one weU-considered and practical end. This was cer
tainly not the principle on which 40,000 men had
been eraployed in the Scheldt, 15,000 in Sicily, and
45,000 in the Peninsula.
With regard to the operations in the latter quarter,
he felt it to be a painful duty, whUe doing fiiU justice
to the gaUantry and good conduct of the officers and
men who had fought at Talavera, and speaking at the
sarae time of Lord Wellington as an able, active, and
enterprising officer, to object to the vote of thanks
proposed by Ministers for that battle. The thanks of
ParUaraent, he maintained, were only properly be
stowed for decisive victories, foUowed by all the con-

LORD GREY. 235
sequences of victory.* This could not be said of
Talavera. The enemy was indeed repulsed, but he
was not defeated. He retired in good order, and took
up a position where we could not venture to attack
him, within sight of the field of battie. On the other
hand we were ourselves compelled to retreat in order
to extricate the army from a position of great peril,
leaving our sick and wounded to the care of the
Spaniards, the result of which was that they fell into
the hands of the enemy. There was also, as it ap
peared to him, a culpable want of information as to
the strength and positions of the French, and an
undue reliance on Spanish co-operation, which, after
the experience already acquired, could not be excused.
But having stated his objections .to the vote of
thanks to the general (not, however pushing them to
a division), he gave his hearty concurrence to those
proposed for the officers and men of the army, who
had, he said, ' done their duty in the most admirable
' manner.' The majority against the Government on the ques
tion of the Scheldt expedition, had led to revived
reports of a change in the Administration ; and my
¦* Lord Liverpool himself admitted this principle in moving a vote
of thanks to Lord Wellington, in 1814, when he said, ' he was perfectly
' ready to admit that it was not merely a brilliant action that was en-
' titled to that high honour.' But he defended the former deviation
from this principle at the time of the battle of Talavera, by adding,
' Six years ago when victory appeared a stranger to every standard in
' Europe except that of France, it became highly expedient to court the
' first advances of victory on the part of this country,' &c.

236 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
father writes, on the 30th January 1810 : ' My specu-
' lation is that a new proposal will be made to us, not
' so much for the purpose of obtaining our services, as
' for that of making out a case which shall deprive us
' of the support of the public ; and this atterapt will,
' I think, be successful. We shall break off on the
' Catholic Question, and I am convinced there will be
' a greater clamour against us than on any former
' occasion,' That question was again in agitation, and the pro
ceedings of the Irish CathoUcs were as embarrassing
as ever to" its real friends. Lord Grenville had at
length felt it necessary, in consequence of the course
they were now pursuing, to write to Lord Fingall in
the sense of the declaration advised by my father in
1808 on the repudiation of the veto by the bishops,*
Of this letter ray father says (February 3, 1810) : ' I
' ara 'sorry you do not approve of Lord GrenviUe's
' letter, as ray advice had a material influence in its
' being written. We must look not only at what is
' necessary to gratify the feelings of the Catholics, but
' to what is due to our own characters and to the feel-
' ings and opinions of the people here,
' Whilst the Catholics of Ireland, acting under the
' influence of persons whose views are of the raost
' mischievous nature, reject all reasonable measures,.
' all attempts to carry their qnestion raust be hopeless.
' We have, besides, a duty imposed upon us not to
* See preceding Chapter, page 208 et seq.

LORD GREY. 237
' acquiesce in pretensions which, both in themselves,
' and much more in the manner of urging them, are
' quite unjustifiable. In such circumstances it ap-
' peared to me that the only line we could take, either
' with advantage to them or with honour to ourselves,
' was, at the same time that we gave them what must
' be considered by aU reasonable men as a sufficient
' pledge of our sincerity, to endeavour to bring them
' back to a more reasonable consideration of their own
' interests ; and on the other hand, to prove to the
' people of this country that in contending for the ad-
' mission of the Catholics to the fuU enjoyraent of the
' civil constitution of their country, we are not indif-
' ferent as to the best means of securing our own
' establishments, civil and religious. It is with a view
' to this double effect that Lord Grenville's letter was
' written.' . . , ' Determined as I am,' he adds, ' not
' to accept office without the concession of full power
' to settle this difficult question immediately, these
' previous steps will, I think, also be useful in showing
' the reasonableness of our views, though I doubt much
' whether they will be sufficient to obviate the clamour
' which, after such a refusal, I foresee wiU be raised
' against us.'
The effect of the letter in Ireland disappointed my
father's expectations, without, however, changing his
opinion as to its propriety. 'The accounts from.
' Ireland,' he writes, on the 5th of February, ' are
' very bad. Lord GrenviUe's letter has been very

238 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' badly received, and the violent party are doing all
' they can, and, I fear, with too much success, to
' inflame the body of the Catholics. I do not, how-
' ever, alter my opinion with respect to the propriety
' of the measure, though what I hear increases my
' regret that it was not taken when I first proposed it.'
On the 22nd of February my father presented the
petition of the EngUsh CathoUcs to the House of
Lords, but stated at the same time that considering
' all the circumstances of the case in another part of
' His Majesty's dominions,' he did not intend to make
any raotion on the subject during the present Session.
He saw the hopelessness of success unless sorae check
could be given to the course pursued by the violent
party in Ireland. The unprincipled men, however,
who composed that party found their owm advantage
in the agitation they kept up for so many years ; and
to thera, fully as much as to the selflsh English poU
ticians who were content to comproraise their opinions
on this iraportant question for the sake of office (and
to both these parties, much more than to the regular
opponents of Catholic Emancipation), may be ascribed
the long and injurious delay that took place in its
settlement. But when Lord Donoughraore, in presenting the
petition from the Irish Catholics, moved that it should
be referred to the consideration ofa Committee, true to
the principle he had ever professed, of giving his most
zealous support to the question whenever it was

LOED GEEY. 239
brought forward, however unseasonable he might him
self consider the discussion, my father made a powerful
speech in favour of the motion. He did not, hpwever,
conceal, in the course of it, his opinion of the un
fortunate consequences resulting from the conduct of
the bishops on the veto, and explained clearly the
principles on which he had ever acted in accordance
with the expressed opinions of Mr. Fox in advocating
the measure of Emancipation.
Notwithstanding the appearance of union in the
Opposition displayed by the majority against Govern
ment in the House of Commons on the question of the
Scheldt expedition, the state of the parties composing
it had at no time been more unsatisfactory, and the
conduct and language of the violent section had latterly
become such as to make it imperative both in my
father's and Lord Grenville's opinipn that they should
publicly disclaim being parties to them.
The doctrine which has now become so fashionable
did not then prevail: that the leader of a party,
whether in or out of office, was justified, in exchange
for the votes of his followers when they were required
on a great emergency, in allowing them at other times
the utmost license of language and conduct. Even in
Opposition, the leader of a party then felt himself
bound to control, or if he could not control, to disavow,
the proceedings of his followers whenever they over--
stepped those limits of discretion and moderation
within which he thought they ought to be confined.
Thus, on the occasion of a dinner given by the

240 LIFB AND OPINIONS OP
Livery of London to Mr. Whitbread, at which the
language used seems to have been more than ordi
narily violent. Lord Grenville had thought it necessary
publicly to mark his disapprobation of it ; and having
coraraunicated to my father the steps he had taken for
that purpose, the latter, writing from Woburn, thus
repUes —
* I cannot give you a stronger proof of my con-
' currence in the propriety of the measure itself, and
' of the sentiments which you have expressed, than by
' telling you that in my way hither, in conversing on
' this matter, I expressed to Tierney, who accompanied
' me, my wish that you naight be induced to do exactly
' what you have done.' , . , ' But whatever we may
' ultimately resolve upon, whether to persevere in a
' regular Opppsition, reduced as it must be in numbers,
' and standing between two parties to whose views, in
' opposite ways, we are equally hostile ; or to with-
' draw ourselves from a very constant and active
' attendance in Parliament ; it is equally necessary,
' considering what we owe both to the country and to
' our own character, that we should mark by some
' such declaration as you propose, the principles upon
' which we act,' , , . After stating his objections to
one or two modes that had been suggested for effect
ing this object, he proceeds: 'Now I shoidd be
' anxious to mark equally the line of distinction be-
' tween us and the Ministers on the one hand, and
' those who are urging these popular questions in such
' pernicious modes on the other. It had occurred to me.

LOED GREY. 241
'therefore, that the best way of doing this would be
' to move an address to the King, containing a general
' statement of the different circumstances which menace
' the safety of the country, in which all these topics
' might be introduced. This being done in both
' Houses would mark clearly to the country the prin-
' ciples on which we act, in such a manner as ought to
' be above suspicion, and would also show what is the
' number and character of those on whom, acting upon
' these principles, we can depend for support,
' Should this plan appear to you advisable, such a
' motion would naturally corae after the other great
' subjects, such as the Spanish and Catholic questions,
' are disposed of ; and would, I think, be a satisfactory
' way of winding up the Session. If you approve of
' it I should have no objection to move suchau
' address, unless you feel that it would be more proper
' for you to do it yourself. In drawing it up great
' care will be required, and for this we must necessarily
' rely chiefly on you.'
The course my father thus suggested seems to have
been only partially adopted, for I cannot find that
any address, in the sense proposed, was moved in the
House of Commons. But on the 13 th of June, in
accordance with the views above expressed, he himself
moved an address to the King in the House of Lords,
on the state of the nation. In the course of the speech
in introducing that motion, he marked strongly the
difference between himself and those of whose conduct

242 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
he had expressed such strong disapprobation, more
particularly on the two questions then most violently
agitated out of doors — those of ParUaraentary Reform
and the Privileges of ParUament,
The subject of the latter, of which ray father was
ever a stout upholder, had becorae involved in a
question that had been raised relative to the printing
and publication of the debates in the House of
Coramons. A Mr. Gale Jones, President of a de
bating society caUed the ' British Forura,' had spoken
of the proceedings of the House in enforcing their
orders on this subject, in a raanner that had been
unanimously voted to be a breach of privilege, for
which, by another vote of the House, he had been
committed to Newgate. The power of coraraittal
thus clairaed by the House of Commons, had, how
ever, been loudly called in question, and the part
taken by Sir Francis Burdett in the discussions that
arose, and raore particularly a letter written by hira
on the subject to his constituents, had also been voted
by the House to be a flagrant breach of their privi
leges, and had led to his committal also to the
Tower, This was the signal for the most violent outbreak,
not confined to raere language on the part of the
Radicals, as the violent party now grew to be called.
Riots ensued, on the occasion of Sir Francis Burdett's
being conveyed to the Tower, resulting in loss of Ufe ;
and petitions poured in from all parts of the country,

LORD GREY. 243
adopted at meetings where the most inflammatory
language was used, praying for what was termed a
' Radical Reform ' of Parliament, and for the libera
tion of Sir Francis Burdett and Mr. Gale Jones,
Such proceedings, which had been at all times most
repugnant to my father's feelings, received, in his
opinion, only too much encouragement from some of
the violent merabers of Opposition in the House of
Commons ; and he was besides, as I have already
remarked, a stout upholder of the privileges of Parlia
ment, He took advantage, therefore, of the oppor
tunity afforded by this motion, to raark, in a raanner
which should admit of no mistake, after a strong
expression of the grounds on which he disapproved of
the measures and general policy of the Government,
and of the principles on which they acted, his equally
strong dissent from the views and proceedings of the
Radical Reformers, and of those who called the privi
leges of the House of Commons in question.
On the subject of Parliamentary Reform, after
alluding to the ' strong opinions which he took up at
' an early period of his life, and pursued with all that
' eager hope and sanguine expectation so natural to
' the ardour of youth,' he said, that ' the general
' opinions he then formed, he had not, in his maturer
' age, seen cause to change ; and whatever distinction
' might exist between his early and his present views •
' of Reform, on its great grounds, that question had
* not been abandoned by him.' He freely acknow-
R 2

244 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
ledged that a degree of difference did exist between
his former and his present irapressions, and he added :
' He, indeed, must either have been prematurely wise,
' or must have leamt little by experience, who, after a
' lapse of twenty years, can look upon a subject of this
' nature in all respects precisely in the same Ught.
' Still,' he said, ' after as serious and dispassionate a
' consideration as he could give to what he believed to
' be the raost important question that could employ
' their Lordships' attention, it was his conscientious
' opinion that much good would result from the
' adoption of the salutary principles of Reform, gra-
' dually applied to the correction of those existing
' abuses, to which the progress of tirae must unavoid-
' ably have given birth ; taking especial care that the
' measure of Reform should be raarked out by the
' Constitution itself, and in no case exceed its whole-
' some limits,' , . . 'I, therefore,' he proceeded,
' ara ready to declare ray deterraination to abide by
' the sentiraents 1 have before expressed, and that I
' am now, as I was formerly, the advocate of a tem-
' perate, gradual, and judicious correction of those
' defects which time has introduced, and of those
' abuses in the constitution of the other House of
' Parliament, which give most scandal to the public,
' at the same time that they furnish designing men
' with a pretext for inflaming the minds of the mul-
' titude, only to raislead them from their trae interest.'
He then went on to express his disapproval of those

LORD GREY. 245
theoretic notions, and those general and vague specu
lations, which it was the ' folly and presumption of
' the present day ' to adopt ; and his dissent from
those ' dangerous errors which were not then for the
' first time propagated in this country by mischievous
' or misguided men ;' supporting his argument by the
authority of Mr. Fox, ' than whom,' he said, ' there
' never existed one who more fully understood the
' principles, or more affectionately appreciated the
' blessings of the venerable Constitution under which
' he lived. If in his political creed there was one
' article which he held more steadfastly than another,
' it was, that while a system was practically good, he
' would always abstain from mending it by theories.'
' Never, my Lords,' my father said, ' can I forget
' his powerful observations when, in his place in
' Parliament, he stated his conviction of the absolute
' impossibility of providing for all the variety of
' human events, by any previous speculative plans.
' For, said he, I think that if a number of the wisest,
' ablest, and most virtuous men that ever adorned and
' improved human life, were collected together and
' seated round a table, to devise, k priori, a Constitu-
' tion for a State, it is my persuasion that, notwith-
' standing all their ability and virtue, they would not
' succeed in adapting a system to the purposes re-
' quired, but must necessarily leave it to be fitted by
' great alterations in the practice, and many deviations
' from the original design. And this opinion he was
wont to illustrate by the familiar but apt example of

246 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' building a house, which, notwithstanding all the
' study and consideration previously bestowed upon
' the plan, was never yet known to supply every
' want, or to provide all the accoraraodation which, in
' the subsequent occupation of it, were found to be
' necessary. Nay, he used to reraark, that however
' fine to look at, a regular paper plan raight be,
' no house was so habitable and so coramodious as one
' which was built frora time to time — ^piecemeal, and
' without any regular design,'
' To the principles of practical Reform,' my father
continued, ' so wisely enforced by that great states-
' man, he Was deterrained to adhere,' again repeating,
' that the reraedy he sought should be liraited by the
' existing defects, should be raarked out by the Con-
' stitution itself, and that he would .not launch
' out into any extravagance of theory, which even
' appearances might recommend,' . , . These opinions
were the sarae as he had held in 1792, when, as one
of the Society of the Friends of the people, ' it was
' his fate then, as it was now, to have their raotives
' and conduct made the subject of great and unraerited
' obloquy by the sarae description of persons who now
' describe us as no sincere friends to Refonn— no real
' advocates for the rights of the people — because we
' were not prepared to support what was then, as it
' is now, called, and most falsely called, a Radical
' Reform.' My father then quoted the declaration which, in
consequence of the proceedings of other societies, with

LORD GREY. 247
which they declined aU intercourse, the Friends of the
People thought it right to make in 1792, explanatory
of the moderate and constitutional principles on which
they had themselves acted on this question.
' We profess not,' it was stated in this declaration,
' to entertain a wish that the great plans of public
' benefit which Mr, Paine has so powerfully recom-
' mended should be carried into effect ; nor to amuse
' our fellow-citizens with the magnificent promise of
' obtaining for them the Rights of the People in their
' full extent — the indefinite language of delusion
' which, by opening unbounded prospects of political
' adventure, tends to destroy that public opinion which
' is the support of all true Governments, and to excite
' a spirit of innovation of which no wisdom can foresee
' the effect, nor skill divert the course. We view man
' as he is, the creature of habit as well as of reason.
' We think it, therefore, our bounden duty to propose
' no extreme changes, which, however specious in
' theory, can never be accomplished without violence
' to the settled opinions of mankind, nor attempted
' without endangering some of the most inestimable ad-
' vantages we enjoy. We are convinced that the people
' bear a fixed attachment to the happy form of our
' Government, and to the genuine principles of the
' Constitution, These we cherish as the objects of
' such attachment, not from any implicit reverence or
' habitual superstition, but as institutions best calcu-
' lated to produce the happiness of man in civil society ;

248 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' and it is because we are convinced that abuses are
' undermining and corrupting them, that we have
' associated for the preservation of those principles,
' We wish to reforra the Constitution, because we wish
' to preserve it.' This declaration, which concluded
with declining all further intercourse with a Society
whose views appeared to be ' irreconcileable with
' those real interests' on which tfie Society of the
Friends of the People ' professed to inform and en-
' lighten the people,' was signed by the late Duke of
Bedford, then Lord John RusseU.
My father then added : ' These are the opinions
' now censured and misrepresented by the very same
' men with whom I still disclaira all intercourse or co-
' operation.' And he concludes his reraarks on the
subject by declaring : ' The only Reform which alone
' I will support is that which araends — not that which
' would subvert the Constitution, The change which I
' desire to see effected by teraperate and constitutional
' raeans, is one which has for its object the restoration
' not the ruin of the Government, When I act, ray
' Lords, it will be in opposition to men, who, under the
' pretext of Reform, would drive, us into wild and
' extravagant theories, wholly inconsistent with the
' fundamental principles of our system,'
Here spoke the true Conservative statesraan t
Strange, that so raany years should yet have to
elapse, before those who professed raore particularly
to be the champions of the Constitution, could learn

LORD GREY. 249
what appears to us at the present day the self-evident
truth — that to maintain an admitted abuse from fear
of the possible lengths to which innovation (as it
was called) might be pushed, was a source of weak
ness, not of strength, to the cause they supported.
Having thus once more placed upon record the
principles on which he had ever supported the ques
tion of Parliamentary Reform, my father expressed
an equal anxiety ' to meet and correct those pernicious
' errors, which are industriously propagated out of
' doors, respecting the privileges of Parliament.' These
privileges he considered to ' rest upon their known
' utility, and upon their being necessary for preserving
' that freedom of discussion and power of inquiry,
' without which Parliament would be incapacitated
' from discharging its most important functions. , . ,
' Deprived of such powers what security has Parlia-
' raent ? What security have the people, for that just
' and unprejudiced discussion, for that freedom of
' deliberation, and for those ministerial functions on
' which, above all other privileges, our most valuable
' rights depend ? . . . And though such powers should
' be carried to the extent of imprisoning persons guilty
' of a contempt of its authority, it must stUl be re-
' membered that they are exercised for the protection of
' the people, and the maintenance of public liberty. . .
' Against what obstructions,' he proceeds to ask,
' is it that the privileges of ParUament are intended
' to provide ? Is it not against the influence of the

250 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' Crown ? Certainly, my Lords ; and there is no raan
' who would go further than I would in opposition
' to an unjustifiable exercise of that influence. But is
' it not possible for other persons to excite against
'Parliaraent a popular indignation, equally fatal to
' that uncontrolled discussion which constitutes its
' essence ? If its deliberations may be intermpted by
' popular insult and comraotion, as well as by Royal
' encroachraent — if its decisions can be made the
' subject of the raost degrading calumnies, and widely-
' extended slanders — is not the " Civium ardor prava
' jubentium " as necessary to be resisted as the uncon-
* stitutional invasion of the Crown upon its freedom ?
' In either case, Parliaraent, I contend, must possess
* a power coraraensurate to the evil, to be exercised
' internally and separately by either House, without
' recurring to any other branch of the legislature,'
This doctrine he proceeded to show was that of our
ancestors. It had been held by the best and ablest
of our statesraen ever since the Revolution, It was
the doctrine of Mr. Fox, of Mr, Pitt, Mr. Burke, and
other leading men of that day, ' But,' he added, ' I
' will not rest my argument upon authorities however
' eminent and distinguished. It stands upon the
' broad basis I have already stated — of general utiUty,
' and the absolute necessity of such powers, in order
' to preserve to Parliament the due exercise of those
' iraportant functions with which it is entrusted,'
Having, then, combated the ' popular arguments

LORD GREY. 251
' which,' he said, ' had been employed to excite in the
' public mind an aversion to the existence of those
' privileges,' — ^having shown how little Sir Francis
Burdett was entitled, by his conduct on this question,
' to hold himself forth as a martyr in the same good
' old cause for which Hampden died in the field
' and Sydney and Russell on the scaffold :' ' the
' functions of the Crown,' he proceeded, 'are those of
' benignity and mercy ; and it is impossible in their
' exercise to bring the Monarch into such a conflict
' with the passions and prejudices of his people as
' would render such a power necessary. , , But with
' regard to Parliament the case was widely different.
' Parliament has often to originate harsh measures.
' From it spring all the revenue laws ; indeed, all their
' ordinances are restraints upon the people ; and, as
' Mr. Burke observed, the very iraposition "of taxes
' brings thein and the people into perpetual conflict
' with each other. But though severe and unpalat-
' able, their measures are still necessary, and they
' ought to possess the meai^s and power of protection
' against any effort of popular discontent.'
Resolved, therefore, to assist to the utmost of his
power in upholding privileges, the maintenance of
which he considered so essential to the best interests
of the country, he thus concluded : ' In following this
' course I am by no means insensible to the danger of
' misrepresentation which I incur, nor of the obloquy
' to which my motives and conduct will probably be

252 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' exposed. 1 know how easy it would have been to
' have taken up the popular side of the question, and
' meanly to have courted popular applause at the
' expense of sincerity and principle. But such a
' line is Uttle suited to the habits of my life ; stUl less
' consistent with the feelings and principles by which
' ray public conduct has been governed. I am not,
' however, ignorant,' he said, with that indignation
which the proceedings out of doors had so justly
excited, ' of the degrading artifices by which this
' applause is acquired, — artifices with which neither
' virtue nor talentfe have any connection, — arts which
' men possessed of neither are best fitted to practise —
' raensuch as we have lived to see in the present day,
' who, renouncing the obligations of faith and honour,
' breaking through all the bonds and engagements
' that hold society together, have, in their career of
' foul slander and dirty calumny, entirely set thera-
' selves above all the decencies of private life— above
' all the courtesies which raen who really endeavour
' to discharge their duty, willingly concede to their
' adversaries^ For such arts, and for those who have
' recourse to thera, I shall ever feel a sovereign con-
' terapt ; by me they can never be practised, even to
' acquire the highest favour that my country can
' bestow. It is true I cannot but feel a deep regret
' if I should see myself deprived of my popularity by
' any misunderstanding of my views and objects on
' the part of the people. This is, however, a sacrifice

LOED GEEY. 253
' which I am compelled to make in common with men
' in all ages much greater than I can ever hope to be,
' But, my Lords, it excites my warmest indignation
' to be robbed of it through the basest misrepresenta-
' tions and vilest delusions, practised by men who,
' without any regard to truth, sacrifice every virtuous
' and truly patriotic object to the shouts of a vulgar
' clamour. Yet even to this mortification I can submit
' with patience, feeling that it is the result of a defect
' inherent in all free Governments. It has indeed
' been truly said, that, in the distribution of her
' favours, popularity is as blind and fickle as fortune.
' If it should follow my humble efforts in that pursuit
' which I feel to be alone compatible with mine own
' honour and my country's interests, 1 would hail it
' as a most grateful proof of having faithfully dis-
' charged my duty ; but if I am reduced to the
' alternative between popularity and freedom of
' thought and action, I cannot ever hesitate a moment
' what decision to make,
' Laudo manentem. Si celeres quatit
' Pennas, resigno quse dedit, probamque
' Pauperiem sine dote qusero.'
' Under every sacrifice I never could endure that
' hardest of all servitudes, that lowest of all degrada-
' tions, that most despicable and abandoned of all
' pursuits — the deep and inexpiable guilt of flattering
' the worst passions of a capricious multitude, only to
' delude and betray them !'

254 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
He could no raore condescend, then, as a leader of
the Opposition, to conceal or coraproraise his opinions
for the sake of popularity out of doora or support in
Parliaraent, than he could in later tiraes stoop to the
degradation (too coramonly subraitted to since his
tirae) of standing, as he himself expressed it, the
' shadow of a Minister,' unable to guide the course of
his own policy, in order to retain power.
But the violence of an extreme party was not the
only danger which threatened the unity of Opposition
in 1810, Towards the end of that year the return of
the King's malady had again raised the question of a
Regency ; and this was the source of a much more legi
timate fear lest the good understanding which had so
far existed between ray father and Lord Grenville, as
the leaders of the different parties composing the
Opposition, might not be maintained.
When the question was last discussed in 1788, Lord
Grenville, as a meraber of Mr, Pitt's Governraent,
which proposed to proceed by BUl, and ray father, as
a follower and supporter of Mr, Fox, who stoutly
upheld the inherent right of the Prince of Wales to
supply, as heir apparent to the Crown, the want occa
sioned by the incapacity of the King, and who argued
that the proper raode of proceeding was by address to
his Royal Highness to assurae that authority which
of right belonged to hira, had been directly opposed
to each other on a question of constitutional prin
ciple which admitted of no compromise. And as

LORD GREY. 255
Ministers now proposed to adopt the precedent of 1788
in all the proceedings rendered necessary by the King's
present illness, the same question of principle came
again into discussion, on which the Opposition leaders
must necessarily be again divided against each other.
That spirit of forbearance, however, which had
hitherto distinguished their political connection, and
on which, indeed, it had been originally founded, suc
ceeded in averting this danger, and that too without
the slightest compromise of principle, or unworthy
concealment of opinion on either part..
On both sides the principles which had guided the
conduct of each in 1788 were again avowed, but with
out any unnecessary vehemence, or any revival, except
on the part of some of the more violent merabers of
the House of Coramons, of bygone differences.*
In fact, the difference between those who advocated
the procedure by Bill, and those who supported that
by Address, was only one as to the means by which
an end, equally desired by both parties, was to be
arrived at. All agreed as to the Prince of Wales
being the proper person in whom the authority and
functions of the Sovereign should be vested during
the incapacity of the King, and the only question was,
whether he was to receive that authority as delegated
to him by the two Houses, or to assume it as an
* Sir Samuel Romilly, in particular, made a violent attack on the
system of Mr. Pitt, in a speech of which he himself says, in his Diary,
that it gave as much displeasure to the leaders of the Opposition as to
the Government.

256 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
inherent right, belonging to hira as heir apparent tb the
Crown. Lord Holland, on the 27th December, in mov
ing his araendraent to the second resolution of Govem
raent, affirraing the right of Parliament, &c., said : ' It
' was a resolution on which there was a recorded differ-
' ence of opinion, , . , Sorae persons thought the Heir
' Apparent had a right to the office of Regent, some
' thought the right to appoint was vested in the two
' Houses. All these jarring opinions, these metaphy-'
' sical niceties in discussion, resolved theraselves into
' arguraents of logic and grararaar. But all men knew
' there could be but one Regent, and the universal
' wish was that the Royal authority should be con-
' ferred on the Heir Apparent.'
An important constitutional principle was no doubt
involved in the question, and one that could not
lightly be put on one side for the sake of -agreement ;
but this point once decided, the accordance between
the Opposition leaders on other points was as cordial
as ever, and any hopes that the Govemment raight
have entertained of exciting dissension between them
on this subject were happily disappointed.
My father did not, however, himself attend the
discussions that now took place on this question. He
had gone up to town, indeed, on the first announce
raent of the King's iUness, and waited till the expira
tion of a second adjournment of a fortuight, to which
he and Lord Grenville had equally objected, without,
however, pushing their opposition beyond objections in

LOED GREY. 257
debate, no division being taken on the subject, ' We
' have determined,' my father writes, ' to acquiesce
' under a strong protest.' , . . ' I should have been
' for more vigorous measures, but excessive prudence
' is the order of the day.' But when on the 29th of
November, in consequence of a report from the phy
sicians examined before the Privy Council on the
28th, favourable to the hope of a re-estabUshment of
the King's health, Ministers proposed and carried a
further adjournment to the 13 th of December, my
father at once returned to Northumberland. He had,
in fact, remained in town most reluctantly even for so
long. He was extremely anxious to get home in con
sequence of my mother's expected confinement ; and in
writing to Mr. Whitbread, shortly after his return, to
announce that event, he said, ' I would not have been
' absent, to be myself Regent or King.'
But though thus prevented from taking any per
sonal part in the discussions on the preliminary resor
lutions proposed by Government, or in the debates on
the method * proposed for giving a legal existence to the
Parliament, my father's friends had the full benefit of
his opinions in writing ; and the proceedings of the
Whig party in the House of Lords, in opposition to
the course pursued by Ministers, was entirely in
"* Of this method Lord HoUand said that it had been ' ludicrously,
' but happily and acourately caUed by its opponents " the Phantonii" '
And by this name, during the discussions upon it, the proceeding by
whioh Ministers proposed to imply the Royal Assent to their measures,
was very generaUy known. S

258 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
accordance with the advice given in the following
extracts from a letter of the 1 7th December to Lord
Holland : —
' If the Ministers intend,' he writes, ' to ' follow, ver
' batim et literatim, the precedent of 1788, they wiU
' begin, I presume. With resolutions ;'— for these, how-
' ever, there cannot now be urged the same pretence.
' There has now been no assertion of right, nor any
' claim made, or insinuated, which can be stated, as it
* was then, to be a bar to the functions of the two
' Houses. Such resolutions would now, therefore, be
' a mere gratuitous assertion of a right which, though
' perhaps disputable, has not been disputed, and are
' calculated, therefore, only to recal differences, to
' create divisions, and to produce an unnecessary
' delay in a proceeding which nobody can now con-
' tend ought to be delayed beyond what absolute
' necessity may render unavoidable. These resolu-
* tions should therefore, I think, be in the first in-
' stance objected to on this, ground, and the Previous
* Question moved upon them.
' If this should not be thought expedient, as creating
' a superfluous debate (the force of which objection I
' acknowledge), or if the question should be lost, you
' must then amend the Resolutions, it being impossible
' for us to assent to them in the form in which they
' were moved in 1788, And as I thought it might
' save you some trouble, or at least afford a groimd
' for deliberation, I have drawn up what foUows, the

XOED GEEY. 259
' difference of which from the votes of 1788' you will
' see by comparing them together.
' 1st. Being a resolution of fact, merely stating the
' King's illness, requires no alteration.
' 2nd. That for supplying the defect of the personal
' exercise of the Royal authority arising from His Ma-
' jesty's said indisposition, it is necessary that the Lords
' spiritual and temporal, and Commons of the United
' Kingdom nowassembled, and fuUyandfreelyrepresent-
' ing aU the estates of the people of these realms, should
' take such measures as the exigency of the case re-
' quires ; and thaJt in all such measures it is their duty
' strictly to conform themselves to the principles of the
' Constitution as essentially connected with the preser-
* vation of hereditary monarchy, and of the established
' line of succession to the Crown of these kingdoms.
' 3rd. That His Royal Highness the Prince of
' Wales, being of mature age, be requested to assume
' and take upon himself the exercise of the powers and
' authorities of the Crown, in the name, and on the
' behalf of the King, during the continuance of His
' Majesty's present indisposition.
' 4th. That an address founded on this resolution be
' presented to His Royal Highness the Prince of
<¦ Wales, requesting him to assume and take upon him-
' self the Executive Government as aforesaid, and that
' the further opinion of, &c,, &c, ; that it will be expe-
« dient to abstain from the exercise of all such powers
' as the immediate exigencies of the State shall not
s 2

260 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' call into action, until Parliament shall have passed a
' Bill or BiUs for the future custody of the Royal per-
' son, and for securing to His Majesty, whenever it
' shall please the Divine Providence to restore his
' health, the resumption of his Royal authority, be at
' the same time, and in the same raanner, corarauni-
' cated to His Royal Highness,
' You will observe that in the second resolution I
' have been careful to omit the assertion of the right *
' of the two Houses, which is more particularly ob-
' jectionable when coupled with the words at the end
' ofthe resolution of 1788, which iraply a right of free
' election, and have endeavoured to describe the pro-
' ceeding which it falls to them, there being no other
' body on which such a duty can devolve, to take, as
' a proceeding created by necessity, and strictly limited
' by the principles of the Constitution. From the
' necessity thus established, and the duty thus de-
' scribed, flows as of inevitable consequence the raea-
' sure of addressmg the Prince to take upon himself
' the Governraent during the King's indisposition,
'which is expressed, in the third resolution. But I
' have added a fourth, in the hope fhat the last clause
' in it may, under the circumstances supposed at the
* In moving an amendment to the second resolution, as recom
mended by my father. Lord HoUand declined to enter into a discussion
of this principle. ' The difference of opinion which existed,' he said,
' was already recorded in the journals, and he always thought it dan.
• gerous to debate abstract questions, for the introduction of whioh
' there was no necessity.'

LOED GEET. 261
' beginning of this letter, reconcUe Lord Grenville, or
' at least some of those who were implicated with the
' Government of 1788, to this mode of proceeding,
' The words I have adopted have been carefully framed
' to prevent our being supposed to imply any opinion
' as to the expediency, in any case, of any limitations
' on the power of the Regent. They leave it open,
' however, to those who think such limitations right
' and necessary, to propose them, and impose as strong
' a restraint as the united authority of the two Houses
' can impose on the Regent, with respect to the exer-
' cise of all such powers as can be supposed to be the
' subject of limitations, tiU the matter shall have been
' discussed in a Parliament legally composed of the
' Three Estates,'
In the commencement of this letter my father had
alluded to the probability of Ministers being ' driven
' to the necessity of proposing some measure for the
' issue of money, which, in any form that such a thing
' can be done,' he said, ' appeared to him so decided an
' usurpation of the Royal authority in one of its most
' important functions, and so complete a subversion of
' the securities of the Constitution, as far as they may
' depend upon the principles of an hereditary monarchy
' . . . . that he could not help believing that Lord
' GrenviUe, feeling himself compelled to choose between
' this, and what we contend to be the ample, correct,
' and only constitutional course, will determine in
' favour of the latter.'

262 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
While, however, my father was thus anxious, in
framing resolutions which should express his opinions
and principles on the constitutional question that was
now under discussion, to do so in the manner most
likely to remove Lord GrenviUe's difficulties in coin
ciding with them, he felt that the open and decided
assertion of those principles must be the first object.
And if, notwithstanding aU his endeavours to avoid it,
the division of the party should be the result, ' the
* case is too important,' he writes to Mr. Whitbread,
' not to impose upon us the duty of maintaining om-
' own opinions, and of moving an address to the Prince
' to assume the functions of the King during his inca-
' pacity, as the plainest, the most direct, and only
' constitutional mode of supplying that deficiency.'
The course suggested by ray father was exactly
followed in the House of Lords ; and Ministers having
proposed the resolutions which had been adopted in
1788, Lord Holland moved amended ones, nearly word
for word as they had been drawn up by my father.
It is no part of my purpose to give any account of
the debates which took place on the subject ; but I raay
mention that one main argument against the proposal
of Ministers was based upon the ground of its being
an infringement upon the prerogatives of the Crown,
which was, in fact, an infringement of the rights of the
people. 'I contend,' Lord Holland said, 'that these
' prerogatives have been conferred for their security—
' that they are a part of their rights— that unless

LORD GREY. 263
' necessary to their interests and conducive to their
' safety, they ought not to exist at all — but being their
* right, and being necessary for their security and wel-
' &re, there exists no other power but that of a full
' Parliament competent to wrest them from them.'
My father also spoke on a subsequent occasion of
the Royal prerogatives as ' not given for the personal
' advantage of the monarch,' but as ' trusts vested for
' the benefit and advantage of the people.'
The opposition to the Government proposal was
followed by the result which my father had anticipated ;
' for do not imagine,' he says in concluding the letter
above quoted, ' because in some parts of what I have
' written respecting the amended resolutions, I have
' expressed myself as if they might be carried, that I
' think there is the smallest chance of such a result.
' I have no doubt that the Ministers will carry sub-
' stantially whatever they propose.' And so indeed
it proved. The amendments were all negatived ; the
third and fourth resolutions, as drawn up by my father
(moved as a single resolution by Lord Holland), the
only ones which were pressed to ai division, being
rejected by a majority of one hundred to seventy-four.
Lord Grenville voted in the majority, and reasserted
in the debate the principles on which the Government
pf 1788 had acted. But the division which had been
apprehended as Ukely to result from the opposite views
entertained on this question by the different parties in
Opposition, did not occur. Lord Grenville stated the

264

LIFE AND OPINIONS OF

grounds on which he differed from his present friends
on this point temperately and calmly: nor was the
cordiality with which he acted with them on every
other point, interrupted for a single moment by this
partial difference of opinion.
The preliminary resolutions having been carried,
they were foUowed by five others defining the con
ditions and limitations under which it was proposed to
confer, by BUl, the Regency on the Prince of Wales ;
and these having been agreed tc^ after considerable
discussion, durmg which several araendraents were
carried in both Houses against the Govemment, they
were coraraunicated to the Prince by a joint deputation
frora the Lords and Commons on the llth of January
1811. My father had been unavoidably detained in the
-country during the whole of these discussions, and
only arrived in London a day or two before Lord
Liverpool moved the final resolution, to declare it
expedient that letters patent should now issue under
the Great Seal, ' on the authority of the two Houses,'
to name a commission for opening the Parliaraent in
the usual form, simply adding after the words ' by the
' King himself,' the additional sentence, ' by the advice
' of the Lords ^iritual and temporal, and Commons of
' the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland.'
The House of Commons having concurred in the reso
lution, the ' phantom ' was duly constituted. Legal
effect being thus given to the course of proceeding

LORD GREY. 265
which had been resolved upon, my father took that
opportunity of shortly expressing his full and entire
concurrence in the sentiments expressed by his friends
during his absence, on the principle of the proceeding
proposed by Ministers. 'Now that the period is
' arrived,' he added, ' when this House is caUed upon
' to join in affixing, by its own authority, the Great
' Seal to a commission for the purpose of procuring the
' sanction of the Royal name, it is impossible for me
' to neglect this opportunity of entering my formal
' protest against that proceeding — a proceeding, my
' Lords, which, in my estimation, formed upon aU the
' inferences that I can draw from the analogies of the
' Constitution, the spirit of our laws, and the practice
' of our ancestors, is at once unprecedented and unjus-
' tifiable. It goes, in my opinion, under the form of
' law, to violate aU law ; professing to preserve the
' Constitution, it counteracts its most essential prin-
' ciples ; and pretending a scrupulous regard to the
* monarchy, it tends to subvert the foundations on
' which it stands.'
On his way up to London my father had been met
by letters informing him that the Prince had ' at last
' sent for Lord Grenville, and had also required his '
(my father's) ' presence.' His Royal Highness, who
up to this time had always identified himself to a
certain degree with the Opposition, was universally
believed to entertain the intention of changing the
Government as soon as he should be established as

266 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
Regent. And he now gave public evidence of this
intention, by referring it to my father and Lord
GrenviUe to draw up an answer to the comraunication
from the two Houses already referred to. But what
occurred respecting that answer gave a sad foretaste of
the difficulties which were likely to be thrown in the
way of the Prince's Ministers, whoever they raight be,
by the secret advisers of Carlton House. My father,
in writing to my mother on the 12th of January
1811, thus relates what then took place : —
' I told you,' he says, ' that Sheridan was acting in
^ his usual spirit of mischief. The Prince had referred
' it to Lord Grenville and me to draw up an answer to
' the two Houses. We had prepared one accordingly,*
' with some difficulty in reconciling our different
' opinions on the subject of restrictions. Lord Gren-
' viUe, however, gave way as much as I thought
' necessary, and the answer, though it certainly needed
' correction, would, I think, with such corrections as
' might easily have be^n made, have done very weU.
' I read it to the Prince on Thursday evening, saying
' I was at Holland's, ready to receive his commands if
' he wished for any alterations. Instead of taking this
' course he set to work with Sheridan and Adam, after
* At the end of the volume (App. IL, p. 431 e< sey.) wOl be found a copy
of the answer as agreed upon between my father and Lord GrenviUe, and
submitted by them to the Prince. Also of one proposed in the fli-st in
stance by my father, but to whioh Lord GrenviUe could not agree, from
the manner in which the proposed ' Umitations ' were mentioned ; as
weU as of that drawn up by Mr. Sheridan, and finaUy adopted by the
Prince.

LORD GEEY. 267
' dinner, to examine it ; and the former, after puUing
' it to pieces, paragraph by paragraph, flnally per-
' suaded the Prince to reject it, and to substitute one
' of his own. They came to me with the information
' of this result at Holland's between eleven and twelve,
' and desired me to read the answer that had been
' agreed upon. I did so, saying that I should do
' nothing more ; that as the Prince had rejected
' the answer which I had framed with Lord Grenville,
' I could not concur in framing another, and that my
' opinion of that proposed was, that it was, in its whole
' tenour and character, utterly objectionable,* I added
' that the Prince had certainly a right to adopt the
' answer which he approved most of, but that it must
' be understood that it was adopted without the con-
' currence of Lord Grenville and myself, and that we
' could not be responsible for it, Sheridan attempted
' some discussion, which I declined, seeing that he was
' pursuing it in a way which I thought extremely
' improper, and feeling that I could not very well
' command my temper. I therefore, after expressing
' these opinions,, remained very silent, and showed whaf
' I hear he has represented, with less departure from
' truth than usual, a good deal of haughtiness and iU-
' humour. I afterwards remonstrated privately with
"¦ Lord Lauderdale and Lord HoUand who were also present when
Mr. Sheridan read it, expressed, a similar opimon ; as it appeared to
show throughout an unbecoming soreness on the subject of the restric
tions, and was, besides, expressed, in many places, in a very undignified
manner. See letter from Lord Lauderdale to my father. Appendix IL,
p. 439 et seq.

268 LIPE AND OPINIONS OF
' Adam on the impropriety of having the advice which
' Lord Grenville and I were called upon to give, sub-
' jected in this manner to the examination of an inferior
' CouncU, and stated that if such was to be the practice,
' I must decline giving any in future,' , . . ' I heard
' from Lauderdale that Sheridan afterwards resumed
' the discussion with Lord Holland, who expressed as
' strong an opinion upon the impropriety of the whole
' proceeding as possible. Yesterday moming I had a
' note from Adam, saying that he had been kept up
' till half-past three at Carlton House, and enclosing
' the answer which had been finaUy agreed upon. He
' called soon after, and we went to Camelford House,
' from whence Lord Grenville and I sent a short note,
' thanking the Prince for the communication of his
' intended answer, upon which we did not presume to
' offer any opinion, as it did not appear that he re-
' quired any of us.* We afterwards sent a long
' written Representationt on the treatment we had
' received, where the matter now rests.
'In the course of the transaction  's lying
• and baseness have been beyond all description.

• ' Lord Grey and Lord GrenviUe desire Mr. Adam to express on
' their part their dutiful acknowledgments to the Prince for the gracious,
'communication of the answer whioh His Royal Highness intends
'making to the deputation from the two Houses this day. On the
' tenour of that answer it would be presumptuous in them to offer any
' opinion in a case where their advice is not required by His Royal
' Highness — January 11, 1811.
t See copy of this Representation at length, at the end of the,
volume (Appendix IL, p. 436).

LORD GREY. 269
* Adam, on the contrary, has behaved as well as
* possible. Upon the whole I think it lucky that the
' thing has occurred, as it has given us in the outset an
' opportunity of meeting and repelling a danger to
' which we should have been continuaUy liable. The
' answer you will see in the papers, with its puling
'phrases of "reverential delicacy," &c., in the style
' of a vulgar novel, but it is infinitely less objection-
' able, bad as it stiU is, than in the way in which it
' first appeared,'
In the Representation to the Prince above referred
to, my father and Lord Grenville protested firmly but
respectfully against the course which had been pur
sued, of submitting the advice of those who had been
commissioned by his Royal Highness to prepare his
answer, to the judgment and decision of an ' inferior
' council,' and deprecated such a system as being
opposed to those ' principles of constitutional respon-
' sibility, the maintenance of which they deem essen-
' tial to any hope of a successful administration of the
' public interests.'
The stand thus taken by my father and Lord Gren
ville against the interference of secret advisers, though
it may very probably have influenced the Prince, to a
certain degree, in his subsequent determination to
continue the old Ministers in office, yet seems to have
greatly alarmed him for the moment, and he called
personally on Lord HoUand the next day, and seemed,
as Lord Holland wrote to Lord GrenvUle, ' anxious

270 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' to do away any unpleasant feelings oh the subject df
' the answer to the resolutions ofthe two Houses; and
' said he thought it best to have no raore said on the
' subject. At the same time he observed, and autho-
' rised me and Adam to repeat to Lord Grey and
' you, that the misapprehension had arisen from the
' different views which he and you had taken of this
' stage of the proceedmg : in which, according to his
' notions, you were not yet in a situation when his
' advisers would become strictly and constitutionally
' responsible, but which you had considered as placing
' you in that situation.'
Of this explanation my father said, that it was ' in
' fact acknowledgmg that he had no answer to give,
' and was, as anything would have been, short of
' defending the practice, sufficient for our satisfac-
' tion. What has happened wiU not, therefore, I
' think, be without its advantages,'
The difficulty which had thus arisen having been
smoothed over, my father and Lord Grenville applied
themselves to the consideration of the other questions
which the R-ince had at the same time put to them.
First, with respect to the propriety, under the existing
circumstances, of ' changing the Administration if a
' Regency should take place ;' and, second, ' as to the
' means of forming a new one.'
The latter question was one which it was not found
easy at once to answer in a manner satisfactory to all
parties. In the course of the discussions upon it.

LORD GREY. 271
many difficulties were raised, particularly by Lord
Grenville, which more than once threatened to compel
them to declare their inability to form a Government,
¦ On the 16th of January my father writes, that as he
had objected to the course proposed by Lord Gren
ville, of seeking assistance from the ranks of their
opponents, ' his (Lord Grenville's) present determina-
' tion seems to be to say to the Prince that, not
' having it in our power to form an Administration
' which would have a fair prospect of permanency, we
' cannot undertake the Government, and consequently
' cannot, as far as depends on us, advise him to make
' any change. In this declaration I have told him I
' cannot agree, being satisfied that with our own
' strength, supported by the influence of the Govern-
' ment, there is a sufficient prospect of stability to
' impose it on us as a duty, not to shrink from the
' task that the Prince has proposed to us, and that,
' though I cannot undertake the Gpvernment without
• him (Lord Grenville), I feel it necessary to except
* myself from the opinion he has formed, and to
' declare that, if he had seen the matter in the same
' light that I do, I certainly would, however arduous
' the times may be, have undertaken the Administra-
' tion.' On the 18th he again writes: 'The night before
' last I found a sort of manifesto of fifteen pages from
' Lord GrenviUe. This must have led to an answer
' from me,; which would perhaps have endangered our

272 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' connection, but in the course of the ^day they took
' fright, desired to withdraw the paper, and everything
' seeras now raore likely to go on weU ; but stUl there
' are difficulties. In the midst of aU this turraoU I
' continue quite well, and begin to feel that I ara not,
' and ought not to be, afraid of any of them,'
AU preliminary points were, however, at last satis
factorily arranged, and on the 21st of January my
father and Lord GrenviUe returned an answer to the
Prince's questions. In that answer they stated that
if, after taking - raeasures for procurmg the raost
precise information that could be obtained, as to the
state of the King's health, he (the Prince) ' was satis-
' fied that the duties on which he was about to enter,
' must, in all human probabiUty, be of such duration
' as to impose on his Royal Highness an absolute
' necessity of exercising his own judgment on the
' policy and measures of the Government which he
' was called to administer ;' in that case, the opinion
they had always expressed of the system pursued
during the last four years, founded, as it was, ' on a
' full consideration of the state and interests of the
' country,' would lead them to advise ' an iramediate
' and total change of public councils. Nor,' they
added, ' would they decline to take upon theraselves
' all the responsibility resulting from this opinion, if,
' upon full consideration, His Royal Highness should
' deem it expedient to carry this, their humble advice,
* into execution.' They further informed the Prince,

LORD GREY. 273
that having considered the means of forming a new
Administration, ' they had concerted with each other
' such general outlines of the arrangements as they
' had found most practicable in the present divided
' state of parties, and under the very embarrassed
' state of public affairs,' and that they were prepared
to enter, whenever required to do so, into the details
of these arrangements.
On the same day they had a long interview with the
Prince, of which my father writes, that ' it was satis-
' factory in all respects ;' and that, though they did
not ' get the length of talking of particular arrange-
' raents, all the preliminary points were completely
' agreed upon. Lord Grenville and I,' he adds,
' understand one another so well, that, with respect to
' our views, everything will go on smoothly ; but I
' foresee other difficulties, particularly a long list from
' Carlton House, which may produce great embarrass-
' ment.' The very next day showed that there was
only too good reasons for entertaining this apprehen
sion. ' The Prince ' he writes, (22nd January,) ' is
' making an effort for Sheridan to go to Ireland as
' Secretary. To this it is impossible that we should
' agree, I foresee,' he repeats, on the 29th of January,
' so many difficulties with the Prince when we come
' to more close conference about arrangements, that I
' cannot see how they are to be got over. Sheridan
' they still fight for. If it were a mere question of
' giving him a place, however high, with large emolu-
T

274 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' ments, nobody would be more ready to consent to it
' than I should be. But I really cannot make up my
' mind to sending a man with a lighted torch into a
* magazine of gunpowder. It would be irapossible to
' prevent his communicating with the agitators of
' Ireland ; and in the present disposition of that
' country, of which we receive daily raore alarraing
' accounts, who could look at the possible, or rather
' the probable, consequences of such coramunications
' without horror ? If it were not for this, it certainly
' would be most desirable to get him out of the way ;
' but, with such an apprehension on my mind, how
' could I hope for sleep or peace ?'
It was, therefore, with something like a feeling of
relief, that three days later— namely, on the 2nd of
February — my father could announce the Prince's
intention not to change his Ministers. While the
discussions above referred to were going on, and
while the Regency BiU was stiU under consideration
in Parliaraent, confident reports were mdustriously
circulated that ' the King was recovering.' And on
the 28th of January my father wrote that he was
' persuaded, if the present reports of the King's
' iraproved state continue, that he (the Prince) wiU
' not dare to make any change in the Administration,
' This,' he adds, ' will not, as you know, be an unwel-
' come event to me, if it happens by no fault of
' mine.' On the soth he mentioned the Prince having ' had

LORD GEEY. 275
' a letter from the Queen, saying that Perceval had
' seen the King yesterday, and had laid before him
' the whole state of the business now pending in
' Parliament. The letter is evidently written in
' concert with Perceval, appears, indeed, to be of his
' dictation, and is evidently part of a plan to intimi-
' date the Prince, by the expectation of the King's
' immediate recovery, from changing the Administra-
' tion. So barefaced a plot, and so much of the same
' character as the proceedings of 1804, ought to have
' a directly contrary effect ; but I believe it will he suc-
' cessful.' On the 1st of February, my father says, 'The
' King is certainly better ; but no time can be fixed,
' even by the most sanguine of the physicians, for his
' j*ecovery ; nor are the hopes which they express such
' as to justify me in advising the continuance of
' Ministers of whom I think as I do of the present.
' But, as I have already said, I believe the Prince
' certainly will not remove them. To this I have,
' personally, no objection.' And on the 2nd, as
already referred to, he announces the fiiU confirma
tion of this expectation : the Prince ' having at last
' made up his mind not to change his Ministers. He
' cannot bear, he says, the idea of doing a thing
' which may have the effect of throwing the King inl;o
' a new paroxysm, or of being thought to do so. This
' decision was communicated to Lord Grenville and
' me last night by Lord Hutchinson and Adam, and
T 2

276 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' is to be comraunicated to us personally by the
' Prince to-morrow. It is, I confess, a great relief to
' me. I am now exempted from the difficulty and
' danger of taking any part in the Government ; and
• by no fault of my own. What has passed,' he
adds, ' has given rae such an insight into the probable
' state of things under a new Govemraent, that I
' rauch doubt whether any circumstances could ever
' induce me to take a share in it.'
In speaking, however, of the course pursued by the
Prince, he took a very indulgent view, of his conduct.
' His feelings and his fears,' he wrote, 'have been
' worked, upon so powerfully, and so insidiously,
' particularly by our friend H-^ — , who has proved
' hiraself a most consummate politician (I will not
'apply a harsher name), that his decision admits of
' much excuse. His situation was certainly an em-
' harrassing one ; and if he had not nerves to over-
' come his difficulties by facing them at once, he is to
' be pitied rather than blaraed. There can rest upon
' hira no iraputation of deceit or treachery ; his
' wishes were to act otherwise ; his disUke of the
' present Ministers is unaffected and strong ; and
' everything he has done and said with respect to
' us, has been as kind as possible. After all,
' he has only relieved us from a situation of great
' difficulty and danger ; and as I have neither to
' coraplain of him nor to reproach myself, I am
' better pleased with this event, regarding my own

LOED GEEY. 277
' personal interest, than with any other that could
' have happened.'*
However unwillingly the Prince may, in the first in
stance, have been driven to continue a Tory Adminis
tration in office, he soon identified himself heartily
with them ; and the ' old, firm, and uniform adherent
' of Fox,' as he had delighted to boast himself in 1806,
became, for the rest of his life, the equally staunch
upholder of a system of Governraent, and of a policy,
to which Mr. Fox had ever been diametrically op
posed !
* Such, as regards my father, is the expression of ' disappointment
' and rage,' which, with that charity that distinguishes all his remarks
when speaking of the Whigs, the Editor of Mr, Rose's Diaries attri
butes to ' the Opposition,' when the Prince ' determined to retain his
' father's Ministers in office.' — Diaries, &c., vol. ii., p. 447.

278 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP

CHAPTER VL
From the Commencement of the Rbcjenoy in 1811, to the Termina
tion OP THE VARIOUS NEGOTIATIONS FOB A CHANGE OF GOVERNMENT IN
1812.
The Prince in parting with my father and Lord Gren
ville at this time, assured them of his unchanged senti
ments, and ofhis determination, as soon as the restric
tions on his power should expire, again to have recourse
to their advice. But from the moraent he had raade
up his raind to raake no iraraediate change in the Go
vernraent, my father foresaw that he would gradually
become identified with the system and policy of the
Ministers whom he thus retained in office, and ex
pressed his fears to that effect in a letter to Lord Hol
land : ' Though,' he says, ' I see nothing to make us,
' as far as we are personally concerned, regret the
' Prince's decision, I fear that he will find hiraself in-
' volved in great erabarrassments by it, particularly
' with respect to Ireland.'
The system to be pursued in Ireland was, in fact,
the question on which the Ministers and the party
with which the Prince had hitherto identified himself
were most directly opposed to each other, and my
father little foresaw the entire change in His Royal

LORD GREY. 279
Highness's opinions on this subject, which now com
menced. In spite of many reports to the contrary which
reached him from London in the course of the year,
my father still gave the Prince credit for those un
changed sentiments towards himself and Lord Gren
ville which he had professed in parting with them ;
and in the October following, when the language and
conduct of Carlton House had created a very unfavour
able impression amongst their friends as to the inten
tions of the Prince, he wrote strongly to deprecate the
impatience that had been shown, and to counsel the
propriety of ' remaining perfectly quiet,' and ' marking
' no distrust.' He could not but admit, indeed, that
there was ground for such distrust ; nor feel, he said,
in writing to Lord HoUand, much surprised that late
events should make his friends impatient and violent ;
but for himself, he said at the same time, ' he had little
' doubt that the Prince really entertains the intention
' which he voluntarily professed both to Lord Gren-
' vUle and me last winter.' ' Nor,' he adds, ' will any
' failure in tha execution of such an intention make
' me think that it has not had a sincere existence.
' The same causes which have so long delayed its exe-
' cution, may finally prevent it altogether, or, what is
' more probable, lead to some such proposal as you
' hint at — of a coalition.'
' To such a proposal,' he again writes, when the be
lief had gained strength that, instead of the total change

280 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
of men and measures which had been looked for at the
termination of the year of restrictions, an attempt
would be made to bring about a coalition between
some of the present Ministers and their opponents —
' To such a proposal I should have little fear in giving
' as short an answer as I did two years ago ; — ^though
it might possibly, he thought, be prudent, with a view
to taking such ground as the public would understand
and approve, that the questions on which an insur
mountable difference of opinion existed should be first
brought forward, ' To coalitions,' he proceeds, ' where
' circumstances have occurred to render them useful
' to the public, and honourable to the parties concerned
' in thera, I ara, as you know, no enemy. I feel strongly
' and warmly in the moraent of contest, but perhaps
' no man less cherishes permanent resentment, either
' political or personal, than I do. This good at least
' I must speak of myself. But to give to coalitions
' the character which I have assumed to be indispens-
' able, and without which the raischief they do in
' lowering the character of public men, and giving
' currency to all the vulgar calumnies against them
' (one of the greatest evils of the present time), is in-
' calculable ; — to give thera this character, some pre-
' vious agreeraent, or, at least, a raarked approxima-
' tion to agreeraent, in the great features of the policy
' to be followed at the tirae, raust have taken place.
' Now nothing of this kind can be said to exist with
' respect to the present Ministers, as far as we can

LORD GREY. 281
' judge from their language and conduct ; ' and he adds
that ' with Perceval, the only one with whom a
' coalition would be worth forming, it is certain that
' we agree in no one of the most material questions of
' the moment.' So completely, indeed, in his opinion,
was any union with the existing Ministers out of the
question, that in counselling forbearance to his friends,
as already mentioned, he had stated that his own for
bearance would not extend beyond the opening of the
Session, if it should then be evident that no change of
system was to be expected, ' We must then,' he said,
' be either in declared Opposition, or 'Ministers with
' the confidence of the Parliament and the Regent.
' The very fact of opening the Session, without any
' attempt at a change, will be of itself an unequivocal
' declaration of the Prince's intention to make none.
' .... In short,' he concludes, ' my motto is : For-
' bearance to the last possible moment ; — ^but when the
' period of hostUities arrives, vigorous and determined
' war.' When, therefore, at the close of the year of restric
tions, instead of giving effect to the intention volun
tarily announced to my father and Lord Grenville in
January 1811, of then making that change in the
Government, which the supposed improvement in his
father's health, and the limitations on his own power,
had alone prevented on his assumption of the Regency,
the Prince wrote to the Duke of York,* merely to
¦* See lettera at the end of the volume, Appendix III., p. 441 et seq.

282 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
express the 'gratification he would feel if some of
' those persons with whom the early habits of his life
' were formed would strengthen his hands and form a
' part of his Government ; ' when he at the sarae time
declared that he should be anxious, ' in the critical
' situation of the war in the Peninsula, to avoid any
' measure which might lead his alUes to suppose that
' he meant to depart frora the present system ; ' adding
that ' he could not withhold his approbation from those
' who had honourably distinguished themselves in sup-
' port of it ; ' and further stating that he had ' no pre-
' dilections to indulge, no resentments to gratify, &c.'
— When this appeal to his forraer friends only went the
length of asking thera to combine with the present
Ministers, in forming a ' vigorous and united Adrainis-
' tration upon the most liberal basis ; ' — there could be
but one answer ;* and my father and Lord Grenvillei
in a formal reply drawn up by the latter, and com
municated to the Duke of York at a personal inter
view, stated that the differences of opinion, which they
described as ' embracing all the leading features of the
* See opinion of Sir Samuel RomiUy, on the proposal made by Mr.
Perceval, in 1809, quoted in a note to the last Chapter. He now says
of this proposition through the Duke of York : ' He (the Regent) has
' proposed indeed a coaUtion with Mr. Perceval, a proposal whioh he
' knew must be rejected. The very proposal indeed imports that a total
' sacrifice of honour and character was a necessary quahfication for en-
' tering into the Prince's service. He says in his letter, that he has no
' predilections to indulge, and no resentments to gratify ; a most dan-
' gerous statement at the commencement of his reign considering his
' past conduct and his past professions. It wUl be understood to mean
' that there are uo injuries he wiU not forgive, and no services he wiU
' not forget.

LOED GREY. 283
' present policy of the empire,' were ' too many and
' too important to admit of such an union.' The Duke
of York, indeed, contended in the course of the inter
view that the intention of the Prince in making the
communication through him had been misunderstood,
and that it was by no means meant to imply, neces
sarily, a junction with the existing Government ; but
his explanation was not thought sufficient to induce
any change in the answer, and it only remained, there
fore, for the Duke to report to the Regent the utter
failure of this appeal to his former friends. And may
we not here ask, whether the Regent could fairly ex
pect any other result from a step so very different from
what he had led my father and Lord Grenville to expect
he would take, as soon as he should find himself in
possession of the full powers of the Sovereign? It
seems indeed very questionable whether he desired
any other result. Nor does it show any great lack of
charity to suppose, that the offer, such as it was, was
made rather to satisfy any scruples of conscience he
might have felt at the abandonment of those 'with
' whom the early habits of his life were formed,' than
with any expectation that it would be accepted. He
might now flatter himself that he had shown his desire
to continue the political connection which had so long
existed, and, if this desire was not responded to, he,
at least, was not to be blamed.
With respect to this overture, my father afterwards
expressed his belief, in the debate which took place

2 84 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
after its failure, on Lord Boringdon's motion respecting
the formation of an efficient .A.drainistration, that it
had been made by the advice of Ministers. ' But did
' the noble lords opposite,' he asked — ' they who were
' the advisers of the Regent on the occasion: — ^who
' were his Ministers before, and had continued to be
' his Ministers since — did they expect that, in conse-
' quence of the Regent's letter, his noble friend and
' himself would have condescended to coalesce with
' thera ? Would they venture to deny that they were
' consulted on the letter ? . . . , Suppose he and his
' friends had been in power, and had sent the noble
' lords opposite such a letter, would they have acceded
' to it ? '
Araongst the subjects of difference with the present
Ministers which made any junction between them and
the Whig party impossible, the question of Ireland
appeared to my, father and Lord Grenville to be of
the most imraediate and vital iraportance, ' We are
' firmly persuaded,' they said, in their answer to the
Duke of York, ' of the necessity of a total change in
' the present system of Government in that country,
' and of the immediate repeal of those civil disabilities
' under which so large a portion of His Majesty's sub-
' jects still labour on account of their religious opinions,
' To recoramend to Parliament this repeal is the first
' advice which it should be our duty to offer to His
' Royal Highness, Nor could we, even for the
' shortest time, raake ourselves responsible for any

LORD GREY. 285
' further delay in the proposal of a measure without
' which we could entertain no hope of rendering our
' services useful to His Royal Highness or to our
' country.' My' father entered warmly, in the course
of the interview with the Duke of York, into this
subject, and alluded particularly to the Prince's former
opinions upon the question, expressing his apprehen
sion of the effect of the disappointment which would
consequently follow if the Government which he
might form should continue to act upon the principle
of resisting the claims of the Catholics, This opiniou
he repeated in the debate which was raised on a mo
tion by Lord Boringdon on this overture, 'A very
'general hope,' he said, 'was entertained that the
' Prince Regent was favourable to their claims, and
' that a new era would, by the course of nature,
' arrive, when bigotry and oppression should no longer
' oppose them. That new era had now arrived, but
' instead of its bringing to the Catholics a consum-
' mation of their hopes, they saw the whole power of
' the Government embodied against them, under some
' cursed and baneful influence, and nothing remaining
' to them, but a prospect of perpetual exclusion from
' the benefits of the Constitution. ... If the House
' believed the Irish to be a brave, a warm-hearted, a
' sanguine, a high-spirited people , . . the dangerous
' effect of such a disappointment would be formidable
' in the same proportion.'
It will be seen that this reference to the Prince's
former opinions on this subject gave great offence.

286 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
Mr. Perceval's Governraent was now firmly esta
blished, with the full confidence and support of the
Regent, but only for a few months. On the 12th of
May 1812, it was brought to a violent termination by
the hand of an assassin ;* and as no one then con
templated the possibility of an Administration being
formed out of the materials he had left behind him,
which should defy aU opposition and retain undis
turbed possession of power for the next fourteen years,
it was deemed necessary once more to have recourse
to the parties in Opposition.
But even this acknowledged necessity could not
now induce the Regent to call again upon those in
whom, little more than a year before, he had pro
fessed to repose his entire confidence. They -were
not, indeed, to be openly cast off; but such proposi
tions were to be made to them, through others, as
could not, by possibility, lead to any result.
Lord WeUesley was, in the first instance, corarais
sioned to form an Adrainistration, to be constituted,
if possible, from the ranks both of the Opposition
and of the existing Government, of which the basis
should be —
1st. That of takmg into the early and serious con
sideration of the Executive Government, the state of
the laws affecting the Roman Catholics, with a sincere
* However opposed to Mr. Perceval in his pohtical opinions, my
father did fuU justice to the pubUc honesty and disinterestedness of
that statesman, and seconded the Address ft^m the House of Lords to
the Regent on his atrocious murder, giving his cordial support to the
provision proposed to be made for his femUy.

LORD GEEY. 287
*
and earnest desire to bring that important question to
a final and satisfactory settlement.
2nd. That of the prosecution of the war in the
Peninsula with the best means of the country.
With this view, while Mr, Canning entered into
communication with Lord Liverpool and other mem
bers of the Government, Lord Wellesley himself com
municated directly with my father and Lord Gren
ville, In their answer to a proposal made to them by
Lord Wellesley on the 23rd of May, they admitted
the ' duty of all public men, both by frank and con-
' ciliatory explanations of principle, and by the total
' abandonment of every personal object, to facilitate,
' as far as may be in their power, the means of giving
' effect to the late Resolution of the House of
' Commons.'* They assured Lord Wellesley of their
readiness warmly to support any proposal made by
any Minister for the immediate consideration of the
Catholic claims, 'and expressed their concurrence in
the wish to bring the war in the Peninsula to a suc
cessful termination; though on the latter point they
added, that they thought the ' direction of military
' operations in an offensive war, and the more or less
' vigorous prosecution of those operations, are ques-
* Mr. Stuart Wortley (the late Lord Wharncliffe) had moved an
Address to the Eegent praying him to take steps for forming a ' strong
' and efficient Administration,' which had been carried against the Go
vernment by one hundred and seventy-four to one hundred and
seventy.

288 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' tions, not of principle, but of poUcy, to be regulated
' by circumstances in their nature temporary and flue-
' tuating, by the engagements of the country, the
' prospects of ultimate success,' &c.
But while there appears to have been so far a gene
ral agreeraent between Lord Wellesley, my father,
and Lord Grenville, as to the principles of the basis
on which a new Government might be formed, diffi
culties arose in the course of Mr. Canning's negotiation
with Lord Liverpool * and the merabers of the exist
ing Adrainistration which induced Lord Wellesley to
declare, on the 27th of May, that his mission was at
an end. And though this was iraraediately pro
nounced to be a raistake, and a renewed and more
forraal proposition was raade by him on the 1st of
June, it was with no better success. This second pro
position was indeed utterly inadmissible. To the first,
merely defining the principles on which it was hoped
that a strong and comprehensive Administration
* Lord Liverpool's answer to the communication made to him by
Mr. Canning, was, that he declined entering into any consideration of
the proposed basis, as he and his colleagues felt themselves ' bound,
' particularly after what has recently passed, to decline the proposal of
' becoming members of an Administration to be formed by Lord Wel-
' lesley.' Some discussion appears to have gone on in the hope of
inducing a change in this determination, but without effect. In
announcing the flnal failure of his attempt to form an Administration,
Lord WeUesley ascribed it to the existence of the ' most dreadful per-
' sonal animosities,' &c. ; and in answer to the storm of disclaimers of
having been actuated by such motives, whioh was brought upon him
from all sides — from my father and Lord GrenvUle, as weU as from
Lord Moira, on the part of the Prince to whom the expression had been
very generaUy appUed — he referred to Lord Liverpool's answer to Mr.
Canning, as an ample justiflcation of what he had said.

LOED GEEY. 289
might be formed, my father and Lord Grenville had
shown themselves, as proved by the answer quoted
above, not indisposed to listen. But the second, in
which the members to be brought by each party into
the Cabinet were already defined, being based,as it ap
peared to them, upon a ' new and objectionable princi-
' pie,' tending ' to establish within the Cabinet itself a
' system of counteraction, inconsistent with the prose-
' cution of any uniform and beneficial course of policy,'
was at once rejected by them.* In fact, the radical
objection to the whole proposal was one that could
scarcely be removed, namely, that it was sought to
unite men in Government, who up to that very moment
had been, and indeed still were, opposed to each other
on all the ' leading features ofthe policy of the empire,'
and from whose junction in the same Administration,
no good could be expected, sufficient to counterbalance
the bad effect of the shock which public opinion could
not fail to receive from -such a union.
' When an union could be honourable,' — my father
had already said in the House of Lords in the Debate
on the proposal made, as already related, through the
Duke of York — ' when an union could be honourable

¦* See letter from Lord Wellesley, with the answer f»m my father
and Lord GrenviUe, in Appendix IV., p. 454 et seq.
An interesting account of the circumstances under which Lord Wel
lesley resigned office in January, 1812, and of the part he took in the
subsequent negotiations for the formation of a more efficient Adminis
tration, wiU be found in a Memoir written by Colonel Meyrick Shawe,
in 1814, and published in the seventh supplementary volume of the
Duke of WeUington's Despatches.

290 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' and advantageous to the nation, he would ever be
' ready to unite. But character was as much the
' strength of men, as it was that of a nation, and he
' could conceive nothing more dangerous than to shock
' the public opinion, by an appearance of sacrificing
' principle for the sake of attaining office and eraolu-
' ment,' , . . ' They had heard,' he added, 'of broad and
' narrow Administrations ; and the Noble and Learned
' Lord on the Woolsack (Lord Eldon) had observed
' that nothing was so mischievous as a broad-bottomed
' Adrainistration, With this character he was dis-
' posed to concur, if the Noble Lord meant such a broad
'and liberal, basis, as should comprehend persons of
' the most discordant opinions ; who, for the sake of
' coalition, must either sacrifice. their own interest, or
' carry dissensions into the Cabinet,' It was only to
be expected, therefore, that any attempt to forra an
Administration on the principle proposed through
Lord Wellesley, would fail, and the comraission with
which he had been intrusted for that purpose was
finally declared on the 3rd of June, to be at an end.
Had the Prince's feelings towards ray father and
Lord GrenvUle remained the same as he had pro
fessed in the spring of 1811 — had his opinions on
questions 5f public policy been the sarae as he had
then avowed^ — a plain and simple course was before
him ; namely, to call upon my father and Lord Gren
ville to carry into effect the arrangements for forming
a new Adrainistration with which they had been pre-

LOED GEEY. 291
pared, with his own assent and concurrence, at the
time that he first assumed the Regency. This course,
too, had been pointed out by my father, in answer to
a letter which he received on the 3rd June from Lord
Moira, who, during all these transactions, was in
constant and confidential communication with the
Prince, Lord Moira had written to explain his
own conduct and that of the Prince after the ter
mination of Lord WeUesley's commission; and the
next day wrote a second letter suggesting a conference
for the purpose of considering the means of forming a
strong A.dministration. ' It is my deliberate convic-
' tion,' my father writes, in answer, ' that till the Prince
' shall see, that to render our services useful to himself,
' it is necessary that he should give us full powers in
' making the arrangements in every part of the Govern-
' ment, in the same manner as he professed to do in
' the spring of 1811, and as he promised to do when-
' ever the restrictions on his authority should cease ;
' in short, till he is prepared to give us his full confi-
' dence both as to men and measures, it certainly is
' not desirable for us, and perhaps not for him, that
' we should be caUed to his councils.
' I am afraid there is no chance of such a disposition
' as this on the part of the Prince ; and when you ask
' me whether a private conference between us might
' enable you to put matters in such a train as would
' be likely to produce a useful result, all I can say
' is, that if it could lead to our being called by the
d2

292 LIFE and OPINIONS OP
' Prince to form an Adrainistration comprehending the
' persons with whom we have been in communication,
' founded on the principles which have already been
' stated, and with full assurance of support in carrying
' other important measures which have not yet been
' talked of, but upon which, I am confident, there
' would be no disagreeraent between you and me ;
* everything in the forraation of that Adrainistration,
' in all its branches, being left open to fair considera-
' tion and decision ; — if such a result should be
' probable, I would go to the conference which yon
' suggest with the greatest readiness, and with a
' sincere hope that its effect raight be such as we
' desire. But if this prospect is not afforded me, I
' should despair of success,
' In a disposition to conciliate I trust you will not
' suppose rae to be wanting. But after what has
' passed, I could not venture to undertake any share,
' however unimportant, in the dangerous task of
' Govemment, without the full security of its being
' composed of persons on whose support and co-opera-
' tion I could depend in all its departments, and the
' strongest evidence to the public, both in the principle
' and the details of its forraation, that it was so.'*
But the course pointed out by my father was one
which, if in the power of the Regent, it was no longer
* Letter to Lord Moira, June 4, 1812. It certainly seems extra
ordinary that Lord Moira, with this letter before him, should expect
only two days afterwards acquiescence in his condition not to change
the Household !

LOED GREY. 293
his wish to adopt. It was not only that he had
gradually become identified, as my father had foreseen
he would, during the year which had since elapsed,
with the policy and system of his present advisers,
and had become in the same degree estranged from his
former friends ; but in the course of the discussions in
Parliament that followed the negotiation attempted
through the Duke of York, grave cause of offence had
been found.
My father, in the course of the explanations which
then took place, had alluded, as has been already
mentioned, to the former supposed opinions of the
Princeton the Catholic Question, This seems to have
been ill taken ; and Lord Moira, while the result of
Lord WeUesley's commission was still uncertain, had
written (on the 31st of May) to ask an explanation of
what he had then said, ' It is difficult,' my father writes
in reply, ' to remeraber precise expressions so long
' after they were spoken, but I cannot be far wrong
' in stating the substance of what I said as follows : — ¦
' I was speaking on the subject of the Irish Catholics,
' and particularly on the charge of intemperate con-
' duct which had been urged against them, I stated
' that great allowances were to be made for this, con-
' sidering their repeated disappointments, and I cited
' as instances of these, the recall of Lord FitzwiUiam,*
* In 1795, by Mr. Pitt's Government. He had been appointed Lord
Lieutenant of Ireland after the split in the Whig party, occasioned by
t'le difference of opimon on the poUcy rendered necessary by the French
Revolution.

294 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' and the Union. I then said that the most distinct
' and authentic pledges had been given to them of the
' Prince's wish to reUeve thera frora the disabilities
' of which they coraplained ;* that I spoke in the
' hearing of persons who could contradict me if what
' I said was unfounded, and who would, I was sure,
' support its truth, if questioned ; that now, when the
' fulfilraent of these pledges was confidently expected,
' to see an Adrainistration confirraed in power which
' stood on the express principle of resisting their
' claims, was, perhaps, the bitterest disappointment
' they had yet experienced ; and that it was not sur-
' prising, if, under such circurastances, they felt and
' acted in a way that all well-wishers to the peace of
' the erapire raust regret,
' This I give as the substance, and by no raeans as
' a correct repetition ofthe particular expressions used
' by rae ; and this statement I can neither retract nor
' endeavour to explain away. If, in consequence of it,
* In a debate which subsequently took place in the House of Com
mons on the Catholio Claims, Mr. Ponsonby was oaUed up by some
assertion of Lord Castlereagh on this subject, and stated, ' I say that
' the noble Duke (Bedford) lately at the head of the Irish Government
' and myself, did receive commands, not merely permission, but the
' actual commands of the iUustrious personage aUuded to, to make the
' communication that such were the intentions of that great personage
' in respect to the Roman Catholics of Ireland, and that he would never
' forsake their interests.' This statement it was impossible to deny,
and it could only be met by pleading that ' it was unconstitutional to
' make allusions to the conduct and opinions of His Royal Highness the
' Priuce of Wales, previous to his accession to the regency, with a view
' of calUng in question the conduct he might have subsequently thought,
' it right to adopt.'

LORD GREY. 295
' the Prince feels a strong personal objection to
'me, I can only repeat what I have already said
' to you, that I am perfectly ready to stand out of
' the way ; that my friends shall have my complete
' concurrence in taking office without me, and my
' most cordial support in the Government, if their
' measures are directed, as I am sure they always
' must be, by the principles on which we have acted
' together,' This answer was considered satisfactory by Lord
Moira (whatever it may have been by his master), and
he congratulates himself, in acknowledging its receipt,
on having thus ' removed preliminary obstacles from a
' negotiation in which the dearest interests of the
' country were at stake.'
But in the same speech in which he had made these
allusions to the Prince's former opinions on the Ca
tholic Question, my father had referred to another
point, on which, though no explanation seems to have
been asked for, it appears still more probable that
lasting offence must have been taken. He had de
nounced in strong terms ' the existence of an unseen
' and separate influence,' (he also called it ' a cursed and
' baneful influence,) which lurked behind the throne,'
an influence to which he could alone ascribe the letter
of January 1812 to the Duke of York, should
Ministers deny having advised it. ' Would they (the
' Ministers) deny,' he had also asked in the House, ' that
' they were consulted on the letter ? If so, it would

296 , LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' establish the point that there was an influence behind
' the throne, the raost dangerous that could exist.'
-Ajid he had declared it to be his ' rooted and unalter-
' able principle not to accept of office without coraing
' to an understanding for the abolition of this destruc-
' tive systera.'
In this deterraination, further strengthened as it was
by the course adopted bythe Regent in the subsequent
negotiations, so directly at variance with . the pro
fessions he had raade in 1811, we have the explanation
and the justification of the stand taken on the subject
of the Household appointraents, on which the fresh
negotiations opened by Lord Moira, upon the final
failure of Lord WeUesley's atterapt to forra an Adrai
nistration, at once broke off.
That negotiation commenced on the 5th of June by
a request from Lord Moira to my father and Lord
Grenville that they would confer with hira, in the hope
that it might lead to the possibility of ' co-operation in
' the Prince's service.' ' No advantage, however,' they
thought, ' was likely to result from pursuing this
' subject by unauthorized discussions,' and the con
ference was declined. It was therefore necessary for
Lord Moira to procure direct authority frora the
Regent to apply to ray father and Lord Grenville, or
to discontinue the negotiation.
This authority he received, and on the 6th the
possibility and raeans of forraing an Adrainistration
were, discussed between thera in a conversation, of

LORD GREY. 297
which a minute was afterwards drawn up and read in
both Houses.*
The explanations respecting measures which ap
peared ' to be of the greatest urgency at the present
' moment,' were declared to be satisfactory. But as
Lord Moira refused to acquiesce in the demand of
my father and Lord Grenville that the ' appoint-
' ments to those great offices of the Household which
' have been usually included in the political arrange-
' ments made on a change of Administration,' should
be considered in the same manner on the present
occasion, the negotiation was at once terminated ; and
on the Sth of July, Lord Liverpool in the House of
Lords, and Lord Castlereagh in the House of Commons,
announced that the Prince Regent had named the
former nobleman First Lord of the Treasury, and
intrusted him with the task of forming a new Adrai
nistration, In the explanations which ensued in both Houses,
my father and Lord Grenville were violently attacked
for having acted, as it was said, ' on a settled design
' of humiliating the Prince Regent, and of irritating
' his" feelings,' This my father indignantly denied.
Both he and Lord Grenville emphatically stating that
in making the demand above alluded to, they ' acted
' on public grounds alone, and with no other feeUng
' whatever, than that which arose from the necessity of
' giving to a new Government that character of effi-
* See Minute in Appendix V., p. 458, at the end of the volume..

2^^ LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' ciency and stabiUty, and those marks of the consti-
' tutional support of the Crown, which were required
' to enable it to act usefuUy for the public service ;
' and that on those grounds it appeared to them indis-
' pensable that the connection of the great offices of
' the Court with the political Adrainistration should be
' clearly estabUshed in its first arrangeraent,'
This principle is now so generally admitted, and
extends so rauch fiirther than it was then sought to
apply it— embracing as it now does, not only the
great offices, but every situation in the Household held
by raembers of either House of Parliaraent— that one
can scarcely understand its having, at this tirae, been
even brought into question. Sir Robert Peel carried
the principle so far as to make the non-dismissal even
of the wives of the former Ministers, the ground for
refusing to take office in 1840.
My father also repelled the accusation that when
they insisted upon the preliminary condition of the
power to dismiss the Household, they must have
known that the principal raembers of it had already
declared their intention to resign. This had been said
by Lord Yarmouth, who stated in the House of
Commons, for hiraself and other raerabers of the
Household, that they had had this intention, and had
taken every raeans of raaking it known, coraraunicating
it in particular ' to a right honourable gentleraan who
' had taken an active part in the negotiations,' Mr, Pon
sonby declared that whoever this right honourable gen-

LORD GREY. 299
tleman might be, ' he could state with certainty that
' nothing of the import of what had fallen from the
' noble lord had been ever stated to himself or to 'my
' Lords Grey or GrenviUe,' And Mr, Tierney added,
that on applying to Mr, Sheridan, in consequence of
the reports that were spread of intended resignations,
he was met by the offer of a bet of five hundred
guineas that ' no such thing was ever in contemplation.'
Mr, Sheridan, in a shuffling explanation, interrupted
once by illness, and which branched off into every irre
levant topic, could not deny either the conversation
with Lord Yarmouth, or the bet to which Mr. Tierney
alluded. The latter, however, he said, referred only to
the ' contingency on which the resignations were to
' depend,' And as to the former — the communication
alluded to by Lord Yarmouth — that nobleman ' knew
' that he was one of the last persons to whom the
' authority for making such a communication would
' have been given. The noble lord knew that he was
' not in the habit of having political comraunications
' with Lord Grey, much less with Lord Grenville. A
' message of that sort he would not take, &c,. &c."
My father declared at the same time, in the House
of Lords, that he had never heard of the intended
resignation of the ' Household from anything in
' the shape of authority, and the very loose rumour
' he did hear was immediately contradicted,' Nothing,'
he added, 'could be further from his wishes or
' intentions than to do anything that could be

300 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' offensive to the Prince. They required only the
' changes that had been usual upon a general change
' of Government. If they could have believed the
' resignations to be about to take place, they would
' have been perfectly satisfied, and would have ac-
' cepted the arrangement in the manner most agreeable
' to the Prince, and to the feelings of the individuals
' concerned in it,'
But there was one condition without which, neither
on this nor on any other occasion, could ray father be
induced to accept the situation of a Minister respon
sible for the policy of the country ; and that was, the
assurance of having the constitutional support of the
Crown in bringing forward the raeasures which he
considered that the interests of the country required,
' For rayself, my Lords,' he said, ' I will never become
' one of any Government, unless I have complete
' assurance and security that the principles I have
' professed shall be fully and fairly discussed, and the
' raeasures which I consider absolutely necessary for
' the salvation of the country, adopted ; and with these
' sentiraents I have now little prospect of being called
' to the councils of ray Sovereign,'
And had the late negotiations been of a nature to
give hira reason to hope that if he accepted office such
would be his position in the Governraent ? or had the
propositions raade to hira been such in themselves, or
had they been introduced in a inanner, to encourage
such a hope ? A short recapitulation of the various

LORD GREY. 301
stages of these negotiations, which I must make at the
risk of appearing tedious, will show how far this was
from being the case.
While the discussions on the Regency BiU were still
in progress, the Prince had openly declared his inten
tion of intrusting my father and Lord Grenville with
the formation of an Administration ; and he had dis
cussed with them the general arrangements which they
had agreed in proposing, in a manner that my father
spoke of as entirely satisfactory,*
When this intention was abandoned for the moment,
under the pressure put upon him on the ground of the
then state of the King's health, the Prince had volun
teered to my father the assurance that as soon as the
restrictions, which had been iraposed upon him for a
year, should expire, he would again recur to their
advice. But when this period arrived, what had been
the conduct of the Regent ? Without the occurrence
of a single event to merit the forfeiture of the con
fidence which he had professed to repose in them,
and in direct contradiction to the assurance thus
voluntarily given to them, my father and Lord Gren
ville found themselves merely invited to consider the
possibUity of forming a junction with the existing
Adrainistration. Nor even on the death of Mr, Perceval, when a
fresh attempt to strengthen the Government was, as
* See extract from a letter to my mother of the 21st January 1811,
quoted in the last Chapter.

302 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
it were, forced upon the Prince, had he thought
proper to make a direct appeal to his forraer chosen
counsellors. The negotiations for forraing a new Go
vemraent were, in the first instance, coraraitted to
Lord Wellesley* and Mr. Canning, whose employraent
on such a mission by the Regent had been character
ized by my father as far back as the preceding August
(when a report of their being so commissioned already
prevailed) as 'inconsistent with the comraunications
' he (the Prince) entered into with Grenville and me
' last spring, or with the language and professions
' which he thought proper to use when he parted with
' us.'t ' How stood,' — my father said, in the course of
the explanations that took place on the Sth of June, —
' How stood our affairs at the coraraenceraent ? Can
' I forget that I received authority to forra an Admi-
' nistration, but that His Majesty's Governraent was
' continued by His Royal Highness frora the raost
' araiable raotives — the hope of the recovery of the
' King, But at the same tirae we received assurances
' that if his Royal Father should not be restored, and
' the Prince should assume the reins of Govemment,
' he would act upon those principles he had formerly
' entertained, and that the commission with which I
' had at first been intmsted, should be renewed,
* I have not thought it necessary to enter into the details of the
second proposition made by Lord WeUesley. The Minute and Answer
in the Appendix sufficiently show the nature of that proposal, which-
was one that no one attempted for an instant to say ought to have been
accepted. t Letter to Lord Holland, August 4, 1811.

LORD GREY. 303
' Conscious of nothing that should induce His Royal
' Highness to recall his gracious purpose, we did en-
' tertain hopes of being indulged with the confidence
' of our Sovereign. We were disappointed ; yet to the
' first proposition made by the Noble Marquis (Welles-
' ley), confessedly without authority, we retumed an
' answer which showed our disposition to conciliate,
' in compliance with the general wish of the nation,'
Lord WeUesley's mission failing, and a more direct
communication with the Opposition leaders becoming
unavoidable, the Regent did not even then take the
simple and direct, as well as the customary, course, of
sending for those who were to be at the head of the
Administration, and giving them full powers for its
formation (a course which only a few days before my
father had intimated to Lord Moira was the only one
likely, as far as he and Lord Grenville were concerned,
to be attended with success*) ; but a third person was
again employed. Their acceptance of office was to be
a subject of negotiation ; and in the course of that
negotiation, on asking the preliminary question— a
question which the course of these transactions made
it, in their opinion, more than ever imperative upon
them to put — as to the extent to which they were to
possess the powers with regard to the Household
appointments, usually granted to those charged with
the formation of a new Ministry, and the possession of
which was supposed to mark more particularly the
* See extract already quoted from letters to Lord Moira of 4th June.

804

LIFE AND OPINIONS OF

confidence of the Sovereign. On asking this, under
existing cireumstances, most important question, they
were told that they were indeed to possess all these
powers, but with the understanding that they should
not be exercised !*
BeUeving, as my father did, in the existence of a
secret influence — an influence which had first prompted
the offer made to them through the Duke of York, and
had afterwards stood in the way of that direct appeal
to himself and Lord GrenviUe which they had a right
to expect, — believing in the existence of such an
influence, which would probably now be exerted to
thwart him in pursuing that poUcy to forward which
could be his only object in joining the Administration,
was it possible for him to acquiesce in such a condition ?
Had not past occurrences given hira a right to be
more than usuaUy on his guard ? And had not the
circumstances attending the different proposals made
* Mr. Canning, in defending Lord Moira for his conduct on this occa
sion, said, he merely ' resisted the apphcation of a power which he
' acknowledged to exist ;' but he fixes on that nobleman aU the responsi
bUity of having prevented the formation of a new Administration, when
in relating what occurred on the termination of Lord Moira's conversa
tion with my father and Lord GrenviUe, he proceeds to state upon
authority, that when ' he (Lord Moira) retumed to the Eoyal presence
' he put this question directly : " Is your Eoyal Highness prepared, if I
' should so advise it, to part with aU the officers of your household? "
' The answer was, " I am." " Then," said Lord Moha, " your Royal
' Highness shaU not part with one of them." '
Lord Moira laid himself open to much suspicion, as to the motives on
which he had acted on this occasion, by accepting the appointment of
Governor-General of India from Lord Liverpool, only a few months
later. ' I pretend to no chivalry,' my father writes on that occasion to
l.ord HoUand, ' but I would rather rot and die in gaol than act as
' Moira has done.'

LORD GREY. 305
to him, araply justified him in expressing, in the House
of Lords, the suspicion — ' either that we were not to be
' admitted to the Cabinet at all, or that we were to be
' bound down in such a manner, that the public should
' have security that the principles and measures to
' which, during our whole Parliamentary existence,
' we have been pledged, should be decidedly over-
' ruled. The same suspicion,' he continued, ' occurred
' to my noble friend near me, Lord Grenville. Was
' this, I appeal to the House, a flt, a decent proposal
' for us to accept ? What is there in my conduct —
' what is there in my life— which should induce even a
' momentary belief that I would consent to degrade
' myself into an instruraent — a tool, to accomplish the
' designs of others ? Was it really believed that I
' would now support measures I have strenuously and
' uniformly condemned ? Shall I permit myself for an
' instant to indulge the idea, that any man could dare
' to hope, that for the despicable emoluments of office
' I would barter the principles that have actuated
' my life ; or that I would now abandon the mjeasures
' which, in my opinion, are essential to the salvation
' of the State ?'
In contending, therefore, for the recognition of the
power to make such changes in the Household as they
might deem requisite, my father and Lord Grenville
were only contending, as they beUeved, for the power,
without which they could not honourably accept office,
of carrying into effect the policy to which they were
X

306 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
pledged.* Nor did they do this in any principle of
exclusion. They had shown in their answers to Lord
Wellesley that they were not only wiUing to act with
any men who agreed with them on the general prin
ciples of the policy to be adopted, but that they were
also ready to waive the claira which they undoubtedly
had upon the Regent, to be themselves at the head of
any new arrangement,! But this simple and constitu
tional view of the case was studiously kept out of
sight, A cry was raised of a design to humiliate
the Regent, This pretence ,was eagerly seized upon

* Lord Moira in his explanation, treated the matter as a mere ' point
' qf form,' which he considered it improper to press, and a ' pretension,'
the consequences of yielding to which ' would have been singularly
'mischievous.' Lord GrenviUe repUed, 'that it was not on a, pretension,
' as the noble Earl terms it, but on a difference regarding a most im-
' portant point of the Constitution, necessary as we conceive to the
' good government of the empire that our dissension was founded. . .
' The question was no less than this— whether we could consent to
' become efficient members of an Administration formed on a principle
' which, in our dehberate opinion, was calculated to overthrow the ac-
• knowledged practice of the Constitution.' It is difficult to understand
on what ground or principle Mr. Canning spoke of the ' wish of tbe
' noble lords to have the whole power of the Government put into their
' hands,''iS the condition of their acceptance of office, as an ' undue pre-
' tension ' on their part.
f See page 287. — Colonel Meyrick Shawe, in a memoir published
in the seventh supplementary volume of the Duke of Wellington's
Despatches, shows that Lord Wellesley recognized this obUgation on
the part of the Prince Regent, and advised him to act upon it. He was
consulted, apparently by the Prince, as to the Government he should
format the close of the year of restriction. In answer. Lord WeUesley
said, ' It is generaUy credited that your Royal Highness is pledged to a
' particular set of men. It is of great importance to the country and
' to yourself that your Government (in your own name) should com-
' mence with unblemished honour. My advice therefore is, that yoa
' do not leave your honourable pledges unrede&med, cost what it may'

LORD GREY. 307
in an unreformed and subservient House of Com
mons ; and the same Ministers, who, when a change of
Government seemed imminent, were conderaned, by
the deliberate vote of the House, as unequal to the
exigencies of the times, were, now that they appeared
to be confirmed in power, assured of the confidence
and support of the same House by a raajority of one
hundred and twenty-five !
I must not conclude my notice of these negotiations
without mentioning that there was considerable dif
ference of opinion amongst the members of the Whig
party themselves, as to the course pursued by my
father and Lord Grenville in refusing the Government
on the conditions offered. Many of their friends,
indeed, condemned their conduct very strongly.
' Whitbread,' my father wrote to Lord Holland, ' is
' against us on the subject of the Household. He says
* the point of honour was saved by Moira's stating
' that we had power to change the officers in that
' department, and that , , . we ought not to have
' insisted on the exercise of the power ;' and Mr,
Horner writes to Mr, HaUam : ' I regret very much
' that you are not satisfied with the conduct of Lord
' Grey and Lord Grenville in their rupture of the
' negotiation,' Mr. Horner himself took what seems
to me a very just view of what occurred. ' Their
' mode of closing the negotiation was '¦ — he gives it as
his opinion, — 'the most honourable and upright for
' themselves, though with a little more reserve they
X 2

308 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' might have left it to be terminated with more dis-
' grace to the Prince, , . I ara now satisfied,' he adds,
looking back to the whole intrigue, that they never
' had any chance of coraing into office ; and am some-
' what inclined to apprehend that the high tone of
' personal honour, and the strict stoical raaxims of
' political conduct, which the present leaders of the
' Whig Opposition are guided by, , , . are not
' calculated to obtain place for them^ except in a
' favourable conjuncture of accidents, or to win imrae-
' diate favour for thera with the public. , , I will not
' say that nothing of the peculiarities of temper was to
' be detected in their prompt and peremptory manner
' of negotiating ; but, on the other hand, they negotiated
' with all the odds against them, arising from their
' integrity and rigid honour being known to those who
' intrigued against them with fewer scruples.' And
again, in speaking of the difficulties they would have
had to contend against in office, he says : ' From all
' this they are saved. Not by any want of courage
' on their side, but by the triuraph of inveterate
' duplicity, and the low arts of a palace over an
' inflexible and proud integrity, I beUeve the gene-
' ral opinion to be at present against the Whigs ; and,
' with the usual sagacity of the public, they see
' nothing but a struggle for a few places in the deter-
' mination not to accept office without power,'
Such were the efforts made by a Prince who had
claimed for himself, only a few years before, the titie

LOED GREY. . 309
of one of the 'old, firm, and uniform adherents of
' Fox,' to introduce into his Government the advo
cates and representatives of the principles which it
had been his own boast to have learnt from that great
man ! And from this time, to the end of his life, his
estrangement and separation from his ' early friends '
were final and complete.
Of the two questions which had been put forward
by Lord Wellesley in his attempt at the formation of
a Government, as those an agreement on which might
form the basis of a negotiation — I need not add
a word to what I have already said in explanation
of my father's views respecting the clairas of the
Catholics, His opinions on that question never varied
till its final settleraent in 1829, But shortly after
the termination of all the negotiations for a change of
Administration above mentioned, a vote was corae to
by the House of Commons which might well provoke
the contrast which he drew between the course the
House seemed now disposed to adopt, and the circum
stances under which it had been elected in 1807, On
the 22nd of June Mr, Canning moved, and carried by
a majority of 129, a resolution pledging the House to
an early consideration, in the next Session, of the
Roman Catholic claims, with a view to their ' final
' and conciliatory adjustment,'* And the next day,
* The numbers were : —
For Mr. Canning's Resolution . . . . 2.35
Against it .. .. .. .. .. 106
Majority .. " ,. 129'

310 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
when Lord Wellesley gave notice of his intention to
make a sirailar raotion in the House of Lords, my
father thus alluded to the vote of the preceding night
in the other House,
' Yesterday,' he said, ' it was exactly five years
' since this Parliaraent met, after the dismission of an
' Administration for bringing forward an inadequate*
' raeasure in favour of the Catholics, He said inade-
' quate, because he felt it to be so, but was at the same
' time satisfied that more could not have been carried
' at that period. It would be recoUected under what
' circurastances this Parliament was assembled. A
' cry was sent forth through the country against the
' disraissed Adrainistration, upon the raerabers of which
' every species of obloquy was cast, fbr the effort which
' they had made towards the conciUation of His Ma-
' jesty's Roman Catholic subjects. Yet he now had
' the satisfaction to witness, and he congratulated him-
' self and the country upon the event, that in this very
' ParUament, the House of Commons had agreed to a
' proposition, the object of which was the complete
' conciliation of His Majesty's Roman Catholic sub-
' jects, and that proposition brought forward by one
« who was a member of the Administration under
' whose auspices this Parliament was asserabled. This
* Not because the measure was inadequate, as the manner in which
his words are reported would seem to imply, but, because any conces
sion to the Roman Catholics, however slight, was objected to. Nothing
can generaUy be more unsatisfactory than the reports of the Parha
mentary debates at that time, unless, which my father never did, the
speakers sent corrected reports of their own speeches.

LORD GREY. 311
' would teach him still more forcibly to persevere in
' the line of duty, whatever obloquy might be cast
' upon him, satisfied that, sooner or later, his motives
' would be justified to the public, and his conduct
' shown in its true and proper light.'
Lord WeUesley's motion was only rejected by a
majority of one ; and such a division in the House
of Lords, which had always been considered to be the
stronghold of the anti-CathoUcs, following the decisive
majority by which the principle of conciliation had
been affirmed in a House of Commons chosen under
all the excitement of a 'No Popery ' cry, might well
encourage a hope on the part of the Catholics, that the
success of their cause was not far distant.
But an expedient had been for some years adopted
with respect to this question, infinitely more fatal to
its success, and better calculated to defeat the hopes
of its advocates, than any direct opposition could have
proved ; that, namely, of making it what is called an
open one. The effect of adopting this principle has
simply been to exempt the Government, upon this the
most important question that could be brought under
their consideration, from the necessity of declaring, as
a Government, any policy whatever, and thus to save
the Minister at its head from the usual consequences
of a vote adverse to his views. Indeed it would seem
as if this expedient had been expressly hit upon, as a
means of satisfying the consciences of those who pro
fessed to be in favour of the policy of concession, yet

^12 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
who were not prepared to sacrifice office to the advo
cacy of that poUcy. And though the Cabinet Minis
ters were on this occasion, and continued to be
throughout Lord Liverpool's Administration, pretty
equaUy divided ih both Houses on the subject of the
CathoUc claims, the only result of their balanced
opinions was the long disappointment of every hope
which the present favourable deraonstration in both
Houses raight have tended to encourage. Seventeen
years were yet to elapse— seventeen years of miserable
and mischievous, yet, considering aU things, of per
haps nbt inexcusable agitation — ere the concessions
which could not be obtained from the justice were
wrung from the fears of a British ParUaraent.
And ara I not right in attributing this unhappy con
sequence rather to the professed friends than to the
avowed opponents of the Roraan Catholic claims?
Can any one doubt that if Mr, Canning, Lord Castle
reagh, and others who acquiesced, as raembers of
Government, in raaking this an open question, though
acknowledging the importance of settling it in the only
way in which it could be settled, had foUowed the
example of my father and Lord GrenvUle in making
that settieraent a sine qua non condition of their accept
ance of office, it would have been utterly impossible for
either Mr. Perceval or Lord Liverpool to have formed
Administrations which did not adrait the principle of
concession to the CathoUcs ? Nor, at the coramence
ment of the Regency, did the difficulty which had been

LORD GREY. 313
hitherto interposed by the personal objections of the
Sovereign any longer exist. George III, in 1812 was
helplessly insane, and admitted to be so ; and the
Regent was still supposed to be favourable to a cause
which he had hitherto avowedly supported.
The vigorous prosecution of the war in the Pen
insula was the second question proposed by Lord
Wellesley, on which agreement was necessary before
negotiations could be entered into for a new Admi
nistration ; and to this I must advert at some length,
for on no subject have the opinions of my father been
more grossly or more systematically misrepresented.
In fact the systematic misrepresentation of the opinions
and sentiments expressed by their opponents was one
of the most effectual weapons used by Ministers and
their supporters to defend themselves from attack.
My father had more than once complained of this, and
now, in the course of the explanations arising out of
the late political negotiations, he said : ' He was well
' aware that he had little chance of escaping consider-
' able misrepresentation, for he knew from experience
' that, say what he would, he could not exempt him-
' self from having, in the course of a few days, and
* frequently in the course of a few hours, sentiments
' imputed to him directly opposite to those which he
' actually delivered.'
It has been seen that no one had hailed with more
eager hope and sympathy the first rising of the
Spaniards against their French invaders ; that he had

31'4 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
entirely approved ofthe policy of supporting them with
the best raeans of the country ; and, when negotiations
with France were subsequently spoken of, that he had
declared his opinion that no greater infaray could
attach to any country, than would attach to England,
if she consented even to treat upon the condition of
abandoning Spain to the French usurpation.
But he had never conteraplated our making our
selves principals in the contest. We should give the
Spaniards, indeed, our best assistance, and that with
no niggard hand, both as to men and money. But it
was for them to work out their own deliverance. And
the result of Sir John Moore's campaign, proving how
little dependence could be placed in Spanish proraises,
or on Spanish exertion, had led hira to question the
policy of continuing the war in the Peninsula at such
an expenditure of the resources of the country as it
seeraed likely to entail upon us.
This opinion had beeu further strengthened by the
issue of the Talavera campaign, when faith in Spanish
assurances had again nearly led to fatal results ; and
even after Lord Wellington's great successes in 1811
and 1812 had given a brighter aspect to our affairs ih
the Peninsula, ray father felt his hopes rauch damped
by the disgust with which the conduct of the Spanish
Provisional Governraent continued to inspire him, and
which he feared was * preparing for us new disappoint-
' raents,' Having this opinion of the Spaniards, and an alraost

LORD GREY. 315
equal distrust of the Portuguese Government, it is not
surprising that when, at the close of 1810, Lord Wel
lington had been forced to retire upon Lisbon, and
when he saw the whole of Spain overrun and occupied
by an overpowering French force (amounting at that
time to near 400,000 men), he should have doubted
the possibility of the 30,000 or 40,000 British troops
who held the lines before Lisbon, being enabled long
to maintain their ground against well-directed efforts
on the part of the French, or that he should express
his fear lest it should prove impracticable to withdraw
our army, without ' either a convention, or the certain
' loss of a considerable portion of it.'
He could not believe that Napoleon, departing from
the principle to which much of his great success had
hitherto been owing, of finishing one war before en
gaging in another, would now embark in so insane a
project as that of the invasion of Russia, leaving be
hind him, as an open sore, calculated of itself to
exhaust the resources of his empire, a war in Spain
which, so far from promising a speedy conclusion, was
daily gathering fresh intensity, and a wider sphere of
importance, as it proceeded.
So strong was this opinion, that even in the month
of August 1811, when Portugal had been finally
evacuated by the French, and our prospects of ulti
mate success had assumed a much brighter appearance,
he expressed in writing to Lord HoUand his disbelief
in the rumoured ' war in the north, as he could not

316

LIFE AND OPINIONS OF

' think this a likely moraent for Bonaparte to choose
' for pushing any demands that might provoke resist-
' ance ; ' and he anticipated, on the contrary, a great
effort on his part, to retrieve the faUure of the preced
ing year in the Peninsula,*
On these grounds alone my father had, at the close
of 1810 and the beginning of 1811, expressed his
doubts as to the prudence of continuing the war in
the mode or on the scale on which we had hitherto
conducted it. But even when things were at their
worst, he wrote to Lord HoUand that, 'On the ira-
' portance of defending Spain, if it can be done,
' nobody can hold a stronger opinion than I do, I
' was raost sanguine in my hopes in the beginning,
' and even now I should be for supporting the war
' there to this extent, that by our exertions we force
' the French to a greater comparative expenditure of
' their resources than we are likely to suffer, and that
' we do not ultiraately injure our own means of de-
' fence, in which will be included the power of with-
' drawing our army without material loss, if it should
' be found necessary to do so.'
When, therefore, the noble stand made by Lord
* I find in Colonel Shawe's Memoirs, to which I have already
aUuded more than once, that Lord WeUesley entertained the same
opinion as to the course Napoleon would pursue. ' Lord WeUesley
' certainly expected,' Colonel Shawe says, ' that Bonaparte would feel
' the necessity of endeavouring to drive the English army from, the
' Peninsula, before he attempted to pursue his schemes of ambition in
' the North, and that he would have directed aU his forces to that
' object after the peace with Austria, in 1810. — Supplement to the Duke
qf WeUirigton's Despatches, vol, vu.

LORD GREY. 317
Wellington before Lisbon, and his patience in there
awaiting the sure effects of time and the failure of
their supplies on the French army, had been rewarded
by entire success ; when the enemy had been driven
to a disastrous retreat, and to the total evacuation of
the Portuguese territory, no man was found to rejoice
more unfeignedly than my father in this success. And
he joined eagerly in supporting the vote of thanks pro
posed by Lord Liverpool, 'for the abiUty, fortitude,
' and perseverance ' — so the resolution ran^' which
' he (Lord Wellington) had displayed in the important
' services he had performed in the defence of Portugal
' against the enemy.'
He was the more anxious to mark his entire con
currence on this occasion, because, as already men
tioned, he had formerly felt it to be his duty not to
assent to the vote of thanks proposed after the battle
of Talavera, and because, as he admitted, he had been
one of those who ' anticipated a very different result
' to the campaign from that which had happily taken
' place. He could not sit silent,' he said, ' on this
' occasion, impressed as he was with feeUngs of grati-
' tude and admiration towards that great commander
' who was the subject of this vote, and deriving a just
' national pride from the consideration that the honour
' of the country had been so greatly exalted by the
' conduct of that great general and his brave army.
' There were also additional motives of imperative
' force, and of a nature personal to himself, which

318 LIFE ASD OPINIONS OP
made him anxious to follow the noble Earl, and to se
cond the present motion.' These were ' the apparent
contrast, or contradiction, as some raight call it, be
tween the sentiraents he had now delivered, and the
opinions he had expressed on former occasions when
the nature and policy of the campaign in Portugal
were the subject of discussion. ... He trusted their
Lordships would do him the justice to believe that
the opinions which he had formerly delivered, though
now happily contradicted by the event, were at least
the sincere and honest dictates of his mind, taken up
from no Uliberal or invidious feeUng. He had no
hesitation to qualify and retract thera ; and this very
circumstance, perhaps, gave a value to his vote on
the present occasion which would render it, pro
bably, not less grateful to hira who was its object,
and which would not have belonged to it had he
been one of those who anticipated success from the
greatness of the means employed to obtain it. Those
who looked forward to success at all periods of the
campaign, were bound toacknowledge the valour and
consummate skill of the coramander of the aUied
forces; but that acknowledgment was still more
araply due frora those who, like hira, did conceive
the difficulties in which Lord Wellington was placed,
to be such as to threaten hira and his array with the
greatest danger, and greatly to diminish the hopes of
a successful issue. This was the only use he wished
to make of these recollections and allusions, which

LORD GREY. 319
* only served to exalt in his mind the character of this
' consummate Commander, and to heighten his grati-
' tude for that transcendent skill and valour which
' had surmounted such formidable difficulties.'
He hailed with equal joy and hopefulness the news
of the brilliant victory of Salamanca in 1812, and most
heartily and sincerely did he congratulate Lord Hol
land, who had ever been the fast friend of the Spaniards,
on that event. 'I must congratulate you,' he writes,
' on the confirmation of Lord Wellington's victory,
' for although the official accounts have not yet reached
' me, those which appeared in the papers brought by
' the last post, show that it must have been decisive
' and complete. This is indeed a great event in what-
' ever view you may take of it, whether you look to
' its effects immediately on the war in the Peninsula,
' or to its possible, and I hope not improbable, in-
' fluence on that which is carrying on in the north of
' Europe.' To this latter war, indeed, when (contrary to the belief
he had expressed, and which, indeed, was only founded
upon the reasonings of common sense) Napoleon had
fairly committed himself in the invasion of Russia, he
looked from the first with the most sanguine hope that
it must lead to ultimate success in the general struggle
against French domination ; and before the French
army had suffered a single reverse, while it was still
advancing in unbroken and overpowering strength,
he expressed his just appreciation of the position of

320 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
the French Eraperor, ' Ih the north,' he writes, 'if
' Bonaparte is unsuccessful, or indeed if he does not
' obtain some decisive success, its consequences (those,
' namely, of the victory of Salamanca) may b^ incal-
' culable. For though I do not believe that he has
' sustained anything like even a partial defeat, and
' though it cannot be doubted that his manoeuvres
' have obliged the Russians to abandon a position
' which they must have intended to defend, and have
,' enabled hira to overrun a great portion of territory;
' frora which he will draw considerable resources for
' the future prosecution, of the war; yet it seeras to
'¦ rae equally clear that he has failed in his object of
' bringing on an action which might have had a more
' decisive result ;* and his disappointment is strongly
' expressed in the complaints, which his bulletins con-
' tain, of the failure of some of his expectations frora
' the inactivity or negligence of his generals. In
' short, the Russian army is still untouched, and a pro-
' tracted war at such a distance, particularly with the
' loss both of reputation and power, which he is sus-

' * The Duke of WeUington, I have heard, considered that Napoleon's
great fault in this war was, that he made a great battle the object of
the campaign, and that he continued to run afler jit tiU he had been
drawn on to Moscow, from whence a retreat without disaster was
impossible. A battle, he thought, should never be sought for itself..
If one became necessary iu pursuing some weU-considered and defined
object, it ought to be accepted, but could never, in his opinion, stand
itself in the plaoe of such an object. Napoleon, however, who had been
accustomed to see the princes opposed to him brought at once to his
feet by a single victory, had some excuse for acting differently, '

LORD GREY. 321
' taining in Spain must place him in the greatest
' difficulties.'* Sanguine, however, as were the hopes which my
father had expressed, ' they depended,' he added, ' on
' two circumstances. First, that Bonaparte shall be
' detained in Russia without gaining any decided
' success ; and, secondly, that your friends the
' Spaniards shaU at last make only a moderate
' exertion in their own cause ; and surely such an
' event would animate even stones, I must admit,
' however, that experience justifies strong apprehen-
' sions on this subjecti't
The events which followed the battle of Salamanca,
and the disastrous retreat of the British army from
Burgos, seemed amply to justify these apprehensions.
' I had hoped,' he writes to Lord Holland, in December
1812, ' that the opportunity afforded them by the
' victory of Salamanca, and the Russian war, might
' have produced some exertion ; but if this oppor-
' tunity has been lost, and if, even with the force
' remaining in Spain, the French have regained so
' decided a superiority over Lord WeUington, what
' hope could there have been, if Bonaparte had con-
' eluded such a peace with Russia, as would have
' enabled him to apply his undivided power to the war
' in the Peninsula ?' And how much less hope if he
had never pushed his differences with Russia to a
* Letter to Lord HoUand, August 12, 1812.
t Letter to Lord HoUand, August 29, 1812,

322 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
rupture, which it is clear that Power was anxious to
avoid ; or attempted, even in the event of war, his
insane invasion of her territory.
But the tum which affairs had taken in Russia, and
the accounts which were daily arriving of the reverses
and sufferings of the French array during the fatal
retreat frora Moscow, inspired hira with a sanguine
hope that, notwithstanding the shortcomings of the
Spaniards, the French would not be able to maintain
the contest in the Peninsula, ' The events in Russia,'
he writes to Lord Holland, ' are, indeed, beyond all
' hope, and almost beyond comprehension. That
' Bonaparte might have lost a decisive battle I can
' conceive. Accident, mistake, the Mlure of a coluran,
' the raisunderstanding, negligence, or cowardice of a
' commander in an important point, might have pro-
' duced this effect, without the fault of the general,
' and in spite of the best-concerted plan of operations.
' But that he should have pressed on in such a
' country, at such a season, and to such a distance, as
' to have no retreat, and to expose his army to de,-
' stmction, almost without a battle, is quite incon-
' ceivable.' ' Our being in Spain,' he says in the
same letter, " when the French give up the struggle,
' wiU, perhaps, be a great advantage.' This proved,
however, he thought, that ' the success of the contest
' depended on other causes, in a rauch greater degree,
' than on our exertions ; and if it were not for these,
' I see no ground for your hope that the enemy must

LORD GREY. 323
' retire again to the Ebro, or that they would not, if
' their forces were under one commander, very soon
' compel us to quit the Peninsula altogether.'
It was not, however, to the backwardness of the
Spaniards alone that he ascribed the disappointment
of the hopes that had been raised by the victory of
Salamanca. Our own Ministers had, he thought, been
sadly wanting in exertions to provide Lord Wellington
with the means of following up his success, and he
warmly supported a motion for inquiry which was
made on the subject by Lord Wellesley, in March
1813. There was at this time a great approximation of
opinion between Lord Wellesley, who had resigned
the office of Foreign Secretary shortly before the
death of Mr. Perceval, and the Whigs. — On the
Catholic Question — the first of the two questions pro
posed by him as the basis of negotiation for a new
Ministry in the preceding May, — there was, indeed, a
perfect agreement. — On the second question, it is
trae — that, namely, of the conduct in the war in the
Peninsula, — there was apparently an important dif
ference of opinion. Lord Wellesley contending that we
should ' engage in the contest as principals,' while my
father and Lord GrenviUe thought we should only act as
auxiharies. ' If we continued to be left as principals
' in the war of the Peninsula,' my father said, in his
speech on the vote of thanks to Lord Wellington already
mentioned, ' he much doubted, still, the chances of our
Y 2 " -

324 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' being ultimately successful. There must be very
' different exertions made from what we had hitherto
' witnessed on the part of the Spaniard,* to enable
' us to entertain a rational hope that the indepen-
' dence of the Peninsula would, or could be finally
' established,' Lord GrenviUe, who had ever been, and who con
tinued to be, a strenuous advocate for the vigorous
prosecution of the war with France, condemned, still
raore strongly than my father, the policy of making
England a principal in the Spanish war, and had even
gone the length of doubting the propriety of sending
troops to Spain at all.
It does not seera, however, that this difference of
opinion between my father, and Lord Grenville, and
Lord Wellesley, would have led to any practical
difficulty between them — feeling, as they did, on both
sides, the necessity of raaking every exertion possible
to strengthen Lord Wellington, and to place hira in a
* Even Lord WeUesley, in the course of his speech on the motion
above mentioned, said, ' that it had always appeared to him from the
' very beginning of the struggle, that the only sohd ground of success,
' the only reasonable hope of ultimate victory, the only practical sys-
' tem of resistance which could be adopted, was to awaken in the
' people of Spain a spirit of hostility to Prance. . . If they could be
' brought to this pitch of patriotism and resistance, everything might
' he hoped from the contest. It was true, indeed, that the perseverance
' he had desoribed was a species of which philosophy afforded no defl-
' nition, nor history any record, but it was by that spirit alone that any-
' thing great could be achieved in the struggle between Spain and
' France.' Is this opinion quite consistent with that which he pronounces in
the same speech, in favour of our being ' engaged as principals ?'

LORD GREY. 325
position to be able to profit by any opportunity, that
the events in the North of Europe were likely to open
to him.
My father had watched these events in their course
with the most intense interest, always hoping that they
might lead ultimately to the re-establishment of gene
ral peace. The reverses which the French Emperor
had sustained might, he thought, now induce him to
listen to proposals made in a sincere and moderate
spirit ; and having no confidence in the constancy of
the Continental Powers in a prolonged struggle, or,
should the war continue, in their military operations
being so conducted as to afford rauch prospect of ulti
raate success against such a comraander as Napoleon,
wielding the whole resources of the French nation, and
directing its armies by his single, undisputed will ; it
was his opinion that the opportunity now offered of
entering upon negotiations, with some hope that
they might lead to a satisfactory result, should not be
neglected. In January 1813, before the first successes of the
French army in the campaign of that year had encou
raged the Eraperor Napoleon to refuse his assent to
the terms of peace proposed by Austria,* and before
that Power had, in consequence of his refusal, declared
against France, there had been some talk of a mission
* I think he never positively rejected the terms proposed ; but
hesitated so long, that when at last instructions were sent to M. de
NoaiUes to agree to them, it was too late, and Austria had joined the
confederacy.

326 LIFB AND OPINIONS OF
to Yienha. Mr, Adair had been led to believe in the
possibUity of its being proposed to hira to undertake
this raission ; and, in conteraplation of such a proposi
tion being made to him, he consulted ray father as to
the propriety of his accepting it.
The answer to this appeal involved other considera
tions beyond those of the nature of the raission and its
objects, and of the probabUity of success or failure in
undertaking it. It involved, further, a question of
party allegiance, and on such a subject ray father always
thought that every raan must judge for hiraself, ac
cording to his own feeling, of the course which it
became him to pursue. The more strong his own feel
ing Was on the subject, the less he was incUned to
offer advice which might not be well received. But
his long and intiraate friendship with Mr. Adair led
hira in this instance to give his opinion freely and
without reserve, and he thus replied to the appeal
made to him.
' With respect to this raatter,' he says, ' I feel sorae
' delicacy, and no small degree of difficulty, the raore
' as 1 ara convinced that to teU any of ray friends that
' they ought not to accept any eraployraent frora per-
' sons to whora we are opposed together in a party
' connection, is nothing less than to condemn them to
' a perpetual exclusion frora all employraent. But
' this is a feeling which cannot and ought not to pre-
' vent ray stating frankly what I think, even at such
' a risk, to you. . . .

LOED GEEY. 327
' I must fairly state, then, that in your situation,
standing as you do with respect to the present Minis
ters, I think I should not accept such a mission if it
were proposed to me. The obligations of a party
connection will no doubt sometimes interfere with the
opportunities of public service ; but looking at such
a party as ours, as constituted on a public principle,
and in itself forming a great public interest, it resolves
itself into the weight of one public duty balanced
against another. Generally speaking, therefore, the
harm that is done to public characters by such a con
nection with political opponents (for you may be
assured that the world is too uncharitable not to put
a bad construction upon it), and the example and
encouragement it gives to others, without the same
motives or the same justification, for a defection from
the cause in which they are engaged, are evils which,
in my mind, greatly overbalance the partial good
which may result from the use of an occasion such
as that which we are contemplating,
' But I am convinced that your acceptance of a mis
sion to Yienna under these Ministers would eventu
ally implicate you in the greatest difficulties. To
accept it at all, except on the principles and terms
which you have described, is evidently out of the
question. But suppose these terms and principles
acceded to, what security can you have for their being
acted upon in their true spirit ? In the first place,
believing these Ministers to be the creatures of the

328 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' moment, and to have no settled views or system, even
' if they at this raoraent desire peace, I can have no
' security that sorae new speculation, founded upon
' nothing better perhaps than the idle ruraour of some .
' disturbance in France, would not entirely alter their
' inclination. In the next place, you cannot doubt
' that their own views of policy would give way at
' any moraent to those of the Court ; and between the
' two, though they raight profess fairly, and give you
' instructions ostensibly suitable to your own opinion,
' you raust be sanguine indeed if you could hope, that a
' plausible rupture of any negotiations which you
' raight be directed to bring about with France, and
' the acquisition of Austria as an ally in the war,
' would not be their first object, instead of being, as
' they ought to be, secondary only upon the failure of
' a fair, open, and raoderate attempt at peace. The
' consequence would be, that you would find yourself
' involved in their measures without the possibility of
' exempting yourself from the blarae ; for between the
' obligations of duty in such a situation and the various
' raeans. by which the objects of your raission might
' be defeated, whilst the word of proraise was kept to
' the ear, you would be deprived of aU power of raak-.
' ing out a plain and intelligible case in your own de-
' fence. ' This you wiU say resolves itself into not accepting
' a confidential raission from persons in whom you can
' have no confidence, or rather, whora you have every

LORD GEEY. 329
' reason to distrust. In truth I think so. I should
' have much more to say, but I have said enough in a
' case where my opinion is so strong and so decided as
' in this. I shall be sorry if it does not agree with
' yours ; but being asked the question, I feel that I
' should have no excuse in not answering it without
' reserve.' The hopes of peace which the French losses in
Russia had encouraged my father to indulge were
sadly damped by the hesitation of Napoleon to en
tertain the proposals of Austria, by the adherence
of that Power to the confederacy against France, and
by the resumption of hostilities. But as the events of
the war in Germany proved more and more unfavour
able to the French arms, as the successes of the allies
in the campaign of 1813 followed each other in rapid
succession, until crowned by the decisive victory of
Leipsic, his hope again rose that a permanent and
secure peace might be the result.
But to effect this, he thought our true policy was to
show moderation in our demands ; and, notwithstand
ing the decisive nature of the victory gained by the
allies at Leipsic, he held it to be impolitic to push
matters to an extremity, or to risk driving the enemy
to desperation, by insisting on terms which he would
rather fight to the last than agree to ; with all the
chances that his own superior skill, and the great
resources of France would still afford him, in a pro
longed contest carried on on her own soil.

380 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' The tirae is come,' my father writes to Mr. Adair,
on the 14th of November 1813, ' when we raay hope
' to raake a peace upon such principles as to afford a
' reasonable hope of perraanency and security. But
' in my raind this will depend rauch raore on its being
' made whilst the weight and union of the Confederacy
' are entire, than upon the particular concessions to
' be gained frora France. So much of concession
' undoubtedly must be insisted on, as to secure both
' the general and separate independence of the allies ;
' but if this is supposed to be unattainable, except by
' the reduction of France within her ancient Umits, I
' very much fear, if we act upon that principle, we
' shall produce another fatal reaction from France, or
' in a protracted contest (for who can hope that such
' an object can be accoraplished by a short effort ?), that
' we shall see the present Confederacy dissolve.' He
was always raost raistrastful both of the constancy
of our various allies, and of their ability to raaintain
a prolonged struggle.
' Approving, therefore, of the policy which would
' cultivate our allies, which would endeavour to unite
' thera in peace as well as in war, and which should have
' for its raain object the establishment of a balance to
' the power of France, I may, perhaps, from the fear
' I have expressed, be more inclined to negotiation,
' upon terms short of what at the beginning of the
' last century would have been thought necessary,
* than many of our friends would approve, I confess,

LORD GREY. 331
' therefore, that I should have been better pleased if
' Lord Grenville had not gone, as he appears to me to
' have done, beyond the line which the Ministers had
' marked in the Prince's speech, and particularly if he
' had omitted what he said about Holland. Not
' because I do not wish Holland, and Italy, and
' Switzerland, and the Netherlands too, to be sepa-
' rated from France, but because I think there is so
' much danger in the attempt, that I apprehend losing
' by it the advantages we now possess. It is possible,
' indeed, that the consequences of this campaign and
' its effects both in France and in the other countries
' of Europe, may be such as to open this prospect
' fairly to our hopes ; but till we see our way more
' clearly, I should think it very unadvisable to pledge
' ourselves to more than our own means and the
' circumstances of the alliance may appear to place
' within our reach.'
After stating his fear, that ' if we endeavour to
' goad or bribe ' Austria, whose views were supposed
to be moderate, 'to undertake more than her own
' views of her present policy would suggest, the first
' reverse will produce a dissolution of the Confede-
' racy,' he proceeds : ' Above all things, therefore, I
' think it necessary to negotiate in time, and for such
' objects as the allies will mutually and cordially
' pursue ; rather than for the sake of obtaining what,
' though most desirable, or almost necessary, may
' be beyond our reach, to risk the loss of the more

332 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' limited advantages which it is now in our power to
' secure. ' When I speak, however, of what is now in our
' power, I must guard myself against being supposed
' to be too confident. Perhaps I ought rather to say,
' what it would be felt both by friends and enemies in
' general, our present situation gives us a right 'to
' demand. To this I am not very sanguine in my
' belief that Bonaparte would now consent. Much
' will depend upon the feeling of the people of whose
' resources he has the disposal. But I think the trial
' should be made whenever it can be done with the
' general consent and good will of the allies, . , , I
' am not sorry,' he adds, 'that 1 was not present on
' the first day ; for I should, I have no doubt, have
'been thought too pacific. If I had spoken, I should
' have been under the necessity not only of putting
' sorae guards on what Grenville said about Holland,
' but of disclairaing the support of the present Con-
' federacy, as being the necessary result of the policy
' of Pitt's Governraent in the original war against
' France. Perhaps, if I had heard GrenviUe, I might
' not have felt the difficulty which appears in the
' report of his speech ; but if we are to talk about the
' questions of 1793, I raust show that the present
' alliance is supported by rae upon the ground that it
' is directly contrasted with the coaUtion of that
' period. The fact is, that the allies have now been
' placed by France in the situation in which France

LORD GREY. 333
' was originally placed by the allies. The success of
' both has been occasioned by the spirit of resistance
' produced by injury and oppression ; and my great
* hopes of the present confederacy are chiefly derived
' from this, that it has arisen rather from the feeling
' of the people, than the policy of the Governments
' which it embraces.'
If, contrary to the apprehensions expressed by my
father, the policy of those who advocated a prosecution
of the war till France should be again reduced to her
ancient limits, was successful — the cause, as all who
have read the various histories which record the events
of 1813 and 1814 must be aware, lay entirely with
the Emperor Napoleon himself, who threw away,
under the influence of some partial and fleeting suc
cess, repeated opportunities of concluding peace on
honourable and advantageous terms.
My father at all times attached the greatest import
ance to the maintenance of a cordial understanding
with the Continental Powers, His opinion at this
time, as expressed in another letter of January 5th,
1814, to Mr, Adair was, that ' the first object we ought
' to have in view is that of a defensive connection
' with the present Confederates in peace : and that no
' frontier, no territorial arrangement whatever, is of
' equal value to the preservation of that connection.
' By this you will not imagine that I mean to sur-
' render tha care of all British interests to the discre-
' tion of the allies in the negotiation and the terms

334 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' of peace. That can only happen when by our mis-
' manageraent we lose all influence in their councils.
' This will be raost effectually provided against, when
' by a frank exposition of views directed to the cora-
' mon welfare, and a conduct regulated by a firm and
' liberal policy, we inspire that confidence which can
' alone secure to us the weight we ought to possess ;
' and which subsidies, lavished with ever so profuse
' a hand, will not acquire, if that policy is wanting.'
During the latter part of 1812, and the beginning
of 1813, there had been various indications of a desire
on the part of Lord Wellesley to draw nearer to ray
father and Lord GrenviUe. There was, as I have
already remarked, a great approxiraation of opinion
between them on the raain questions of the day, and
consequently there existed on ray father's side every
disposition to consider favourably any proposal that
might be made for a junction with Lord Wellesley,
When, therefore, in the raonth of April 1813, a direct
overture to that effect was made by the latter through
Mr. Adair, my father thus replied : ' I reaUy do not
' wish to add a word to what was so well and so
' judiciously said by you in answer to the coraraunica-
' tion from Lord Wellesley. You have put the
' principle of coalitions in the true Ught, They never
' can be useful or honourable, unless the parties con-
' cerned in them can be brought to feel that the public
' interests must claim the first, and personal arrange-
' ments only the second consideration. . . , If a

LORD GREY. 335
' prospect opened to us of co-operation on the honour-
' able ground of a concurrence in principles and
' opinions, a just sense of public duty must command
' my endeavours to give it effect ; and if we unite
' cordially and systematically to rescue the country
' from the dangers which threaten it, future official
* arrangements, should we be called upon to form any,
' will corae to be discussed, as you have well stated,
' not between persons jealous of each other, but
' amongst friends united in a common cause, and
' labouring for a comraon end. Do not, however,
' suppose me so romantic, as to conceive that even
' then personal considerations will not, and ought not,
' to have their fair influences ; as poor Fox says, in a
' letter published in Harding's life of Lord Charle-
' mont, to persuade men to disgrace themselves is no
' part of my system ; and in forming a junction upon
' public principles, it would be my wish that those
' whom I join, should not only really have, but appear
' to have, the degree of influence which fairly belongs
' to them, which is necessary to the support of their
' public character, and which is therefore required to
' render their services satisfactory to themselves and
' their friends, and useful to the public.
' With such a disposition, ready to allow to others
' all that I claim for myself, I should come to the dis-
' cussion of any fair proposition for an union of par-
' ties, . . . But this union can only take place by a
' full and unreserved communication of our respective

336 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' views and opinions, by the coraplete banishment
' of all disposition to intrigue, and, above all, by the
' iraraediate and firra rejection of every intimation
' which may be held out by the Court of its separate
' favour, and the absolute renunciation of all separate
' pretensions on that account.' . . .
Nothing, however, came of the overture thus made
by Lord WeUesley. The great obstacle in the way
of an arrangeraent was Mr. Canning, to a junction
with whom several of the principal members of the
Whig party had the strongest objections ; and though
my father hiraself did not push his own objections so
far as to think, if there was a fair prospect of present
agreeraent in principles and opinions, that past differ
ences should be allowed to stand in the way of a junc
tion which would be of advantage to the public, yet
he too said, ' If he (Mr, Canning) is to be for ever
' stating that the country owes its salvation to Pitt,
' and that it has now no other hope of safety but in
' adherence to his systera, I do not see how we can
' hope to act with hira.'
But it was not only found impracticable, at this
tirae, to give increased strength to the Opposition by
a junction with other parties professing an equal dis
approbation of the course pursued by the Government,
it proved scarcely less difficult to preserve harmony
in the ranks of the Opposition as it already existed.
The same violent section, of whose proceedings my
father had already so often had reason to coraplain.

LORD GREY. 337
was again working him sirailar annoyance; and in
conteraplation of the prospect before him, and the
slight hope it afforded that he would be able to main
tain that unity, without which the Opposition could
act to no good purpose, he not only felt indisposed to
leave the North to involve himself in difficulties which
he was ' convinced,' he said, ' that he could do little
' or nothing to obviate by his presence,' but even ex
pressed a desire to withdraw himself entirely from the
lead of the party, ' If I am absent,' he writes to
Lord Holland, ' I hope it will be generally felt I shall
' be able to say with truth that I stand clear of Whit-
' bread's motions,' And alluding to his own want of
power to induce Mr, Whitbread to modify these mo
tions, and to the consequences that must inevitably
follow his adhering to them, he proceeds : ' The strong
' inclination of my mind is to believe that the only
' remedy is your taking the place which I now occupy
' in the party. Do not imagine that this is any move-
' ment of spleen, or that I do not know all that your
' friendship will make you feel at my even hinting
' such a proposition ; but it is my sincere wish to see
' the thing in your hands. When known to be placed
' there by my desire, I am sure no dissatisfaction will
' be felt even amongst my most particular and nearest
' friends, and I am persuaded that to all others of our
' branch of the Opposition such an arrangement would
' be most acceptable. You would have my coraplete
' support, even my active support in Parliament when

338 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' it could be useful ; and I am quite sure that the
' affairs of the party would go on in every respect
' much better. If the discontented among the merabers
' of Opposition are to be satisfied, this would render
' it raore easy ; if new alliances are to be raade they
' would be found raore practicable ; and even if the
' Prince is ever to be reconciled to a Whig Adrainis-
' tration a great part of the difficulty, and the whole
' of his personal objections, would be reraoved.'
It is needless to say that such a proposition could
not be for a raoraent entertained ; and ray father con
tinued to be the acknowledged leader of the Whig
party, and of the Opposition to Lord Liverpool's Ad
ministration, giving a raore or less active attendance
in Parliaraent, a more or less direct superintendence
to the affairs of the party, till the death of Lord Liver
pool, some fourteen years later, leading to a total
change in the relative position of ParUamentary par
ties, produced, as will be seen in its place, a tempo
rary separation between him and the main body of
the Whigs,

LORD GREY. 339

CHAPTER YIL
From Close of Session of 1812, to the Separation of my Father and
Lord Grenville in 1817.
I SHALL have in this Chapter to record the final
political separation of my father and Lord Grenville ;
but before coming to the events which produced that
unfortunate result, I have still to notice more than
one subject of great public interest and constitutional
importance, on which there continued to be a perfect
agreement between them. It was not till after the
return of Napoleon from Elba, when they differed as
to the pdlicy which that event made expedient ; and
until the occurrence of serious domestic disturbances
after the final conclusion of peace had revived a
difference of opinion which had existed between them
during the early years of the French Revolution, as to
the mode in which such troubles should be met ; that
farther agreement between them became impossible,
and that the poUtical alliance, which had so long and
so advantageously united them, was gradually and
tacitly dissolved.
The years 1813 and 1814, however, found them
z 2

340 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
still acting cordially together. They had watched
with equal interest the result of the French invasion
of Russia, and the events which had followed in 1813,
both in Gerraany and the Peninsula, and which had
far exceeded my father's raost sanguine expectations,
high as those expectations had been raised from the
raoraent that he had seen the French Eraperor fairly
coraraitted within the Russian territory. They had
equally laraented the want of vigour and capacity,
which, as it appeared to them, prevented our Govern
ment from turning these events to the best advantage,
and they concurred in condemning the conduct of
Ministers, as failing on the one hand to profit by the
raany opportunities afforded by the success of the
allied arms in 1813, for entering upon negotiations for
peace under the most favourable circumstances, and
wanting, on the other hand, in those vigorous efforts
for the prosecution of the war, which that success
seemed to point out as alone wanting to insure its
speedy and triumphant terraination.
But however desirous they might be of corabined
and vigorous exertion in the coraraon cause, there was
one raeasure adopted by Ministers (probably with that
view) to which, as fraught in their opinion with the
most flagrant injustice, and opposed to every principle
which ahould regulate the mutual relations of inde
pendent nations, they gave their most strenuous
opposition. This was, the signature of a treaty with
Sweden, which comraitted us as parties to the forcible

LORD GREY. 341
transfer of Norway to that Power — a transfer by
which Denmark was to be punished for her continued
adherence to France, and the co-operation of Sweden
with the AlUes was to be rewarded.
On the Srd of March 1813, a treaty was signed
between Great Britain and Sweden, by which it was
stipulated, that ' in consideration of the proof given
' by Sweden of her desire to contribute to the success
' of the common cause, . . . His Brit-annic Majesty
' will not only not oppose any obstacle to the annexa-
' tion and union in perpetuity of the kingdom of
' Norway as an integral part of the kingdom of
' Sweden ; but also will assist the views of His Majesty
' the King of Sweden to that effect, either by his good
' offices, or by employing, if necessary, his naval co-
' operation in concert with the Swedish and Russian
' forces.' In June 1813, when this treaty came under dis
cussion in the House of Lords, my father denounced
the course pursued by Government as being ' incon-
' sistent as well with policy as with justice ; with
' those maxims which were necessary to the common
' protection of all nations.; with those principles of
' public law, the violation of which, on the part of
' France, that House had so often heard reprobated
' in terms as severe as they were just.'*
Though concurring in the policy which had been
'* The treatment of Denmark seemed the more unjust, as in the
month of February, and before the conclusion of the above treaty, she
had expressed her readiness to co-operate with the AUies.

342 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
urged in defence of the treaty, of cultivating the
closest connection with Russia, my father regretted
that ' that connection should have been sulUed by
' engagements which bound us to assist in robbing an
' independent Power ;' and declared that he would
' never consent to purchase any advantages at the
' expense of justice.'
But it was not only that he objected to the treaty
as sanctioning an unjust and unmerited spoliation of
Denraark ; he took his stand yet raore strongly against
the principle so extensively applied afterwards to the
territorial arrangeraents of the Treaty of Yienna;
the principle by which certain great Powers arrogated
to theraselves the right of disposing of independent
States, without regard to the wishes or interest of the
people thus disposed of. And when, after the terraina
tion of hostilities in 1814, Denraark had found herself
compelled to agree to the cession deraanded of her,
and it was sought, by means of a blockade, maintained
by British ships, to coerce the Norwegians into sub
mission to this transfer of their aUegiance, it seemed
to him to be a gross and unjustifiable outrage against
the rights and liberties of an independent people, and
as such, it raet with his deterrained but unavailing
opposition. In arguing against the treaty with Sweden, he had
expressed his opinion, as regarded our treatraent of
Denmark, that ' British policy had never sustained a
' deeper shock — the British character had never re-

LORD GREY. 343
' ceived a deeper stain — than by that transaction^ He
now contended, as regarded Norway, that even the
consent of Denmark could not justify its transfer to
another Power, contrary to the wishes of its people.
' The rights of the sovereign over his subjects,' he
said, ' are not the rights of property. They do not
' confer the privilege of transferring them from one to
' another like cattle attached to the soil. ... No
' matter to what degree the impunity of power might
' silence the claims of right, its nature cannot be
' altered ; it is equally sacred, equally important, and
' is equally to be recognised, in every attempt to pro-
' tect the weak against the strong,'
Arguing upon these principles, he contended that
under the reciprocal engagements that bind a sove
reign and his people to each other, and by which
allegiance is given in return for protection, the King
of Denmark had no right to alienate the sovereignty
of Norway, without the consent of the people of that
country.* ' He might withdraw himself,' he said,
' from their protection. He might absolve them from
' their allegiance to himself; but he had no right to
' transfer that allegiance to any other State. It be-
' came, then, the right of the people to decide to whom
' their allegiance should be given.'
In answer to the argument by which it was attempted

* Lord Grenville, in supporting the address moved by my father,
spoke also of the ' horrible injustice by which an unoffending people
' were to be bent to the dominion of a foreign power.'

344 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
to de^nd the course pursued with respect to Norway,
as conferring ' very important advantages upon the
' Norwegian people,' ray father asked, ' whether it
' could be argued that any country shall be obliged to
' accept what a foreign State thinks proper to consider
' as happiness ? ' 'No sort of tyranny,' he adds, ' can,
' in my judgment, be conceived more complete, than
' that a Government should undertake to force another
' people to submit to that system which such Govern-
' ment may regard as happj, although that people
* may think quite the contrary.' And in raoving for
an address to the Regent, praying hira, in accordance
with the sentiments above expressed, to suspend the
hostile operations by which it was sought to coerce the
Norwegians into submission, he called upon the House
to act in a manner ' consistent with the honour and
' character of the country,' and to manifest their sym
pathy with a ' nation struggling so valiantly as the
' Norwegians continued to struggle, in support of their
' rights and privileges.' ' If it be said,' he concluded,
' that the tendency of my motion would be to engage
' this country in a war with Russia and Sweden, stiU
' I should say, that whatever result might follow, I
' would ask my country, for the sake of its credit and
' character, for the sake of justice and humanity, to
' co-operate in the honourable and glorious cause of
Norway,' This appeal to the House of Lords was vigorously
supported by Lord Grenville.

LORD GREY. 345
'On all the grounds,' he said, 'first of justice, right,
' and the law of nations, and lastly even upon poUtical
' considerations, I feel myself called upon to support
' any measure that, stopping for a short period the
' rapid tide of events, would afford a breathing-time
' to enable Ministers to reflect upon the consequences
' of the step they are now taking, and to pause before
' they employ the British flag to cover projects so dis-
' graceful, which excite the disgust and abhorrence of
' ninety-nine hundredths of the natives of the civilised
' world.' Their efforts were, however, ineffectual, and
the proposed address was negatived by a majority,
including proxies, of one hundred and fifteen to
thirty-four, I have already mentioned the generous and un
grudging spirit in which my father had joined in the
vote of thanks to Lord Wellington after the retreat of
the French from Portugal in 1811, and have shown
how little he was disposed, as has been often igno
rantly imputed to him, to depreciate the merits of our
great commander, or to undervalue the importance of
his services. He was not present when the thanks of
the House were voted for the battle of Salamanca ; nor
afterwards, when they were again voted for the still
more decisive victory of Yittoria, But no one exulted
more sincerely than he did in these triuraphs of the
British arms ; and in March 1814, when the victory of
Orthes, and the occupation of Bordeaux by a portion
of the British army, had once more called forth from

346 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
Governraent and frora Parliaraent the renewed expres
sion of a nation's gratitude, he eagerly seized the oppor
tunity of again recording his adrairation of the great
achieveraents of our troops and of their general, ' He
' could not,' he said, in seconding Lord Liverpool's
raotion for the vote of thanks on this occasion — 'he
' could not add anything to the detail so properly
' given by the Noble Earl, and which so clearly esta-
' bUshed the iraportance of this last triumph of the
¦ iUustrious comraander whora they were now so justly
' called upon again to thank. He said the last triumph,
' because he trusted that the series of splendid suc-
' cesses which had raised the glory of the British arms
' to a height of renown unknown in any age or coun-
' try, in the annals of history, . . . would be finally
' crowned by a safe and honourable peace, to which
' our illustrious comraander and the glorious array he
' handled would have so essentially contributed.' And
on a subsequent occasion, in referring to what he now
said in support of this vote of thanks : 'If,' he observed,
' I was not as forward and zealous as the Noble Earl
' hiraself (Lord Liverpool) in applauding the achieve-
' ments and expressing our gratitude for the services of
' Lord Wellington, I can only say that I faded most
' lamentably in the language I selected, to give utter-
' ance to the sincere and ardent feelings of my heart.'
But when it was sought to establish a claim on the
part of the Home Government to a similar meed of
praise to that which he had shown hiraself thus ready

LOED GEEY. 347
and anxious to accord to Lord Wellington and his
gallant followers, he deraurred to any such obligation ;
and in answer to Lord Carlisle, who found fault with
his speech on this occasion, because he had omitted
to give Ministers the share of credit to which he
(Lord Carlisle *) thought they were entitied, he stated
that the occasion did not seem to him one on which
any allusion whatever to the conduct of Ministers
was called for; and this more particularly, as they
refused obstinately to afford the information, which
could alone enable the House to judge of that con
duct : and. Lord Carlisle supporting the Govemraent
in this refusal, it was, he thought, ' a little extraor-
' dinary, if not inconsistent, in his noble friend, to
' call upon them to follow his example in pronouncing
' an eulogium upon the general conduct of the ser-
' vants of the Crown. 'f
In the general principle of the settlement by which
the Bourbons were to be placed on the throne of
France, as that which was ' upon the whole the best
' that could have been attained for the preservation of

* Grandfather of the present Lord Carlisle.
f Ministers affirmed that the negotiations at ChatiUon had been
broken off by the ' ambition of Bonaparte, and the injustice of his de-
' mands, and not by any want of moderation on the part of the AUies.'
On the first rupture of those negotiations Lord Liverpool had promised
to lay the papers connected with them on the table of the House.
During the recess, the abdication of Napoleon had become known;
fresh negotiations had been entered into with the Bourbons ; and
Lord Liverpool now resisted the production of the papers as being no
longer necessary. Without them, however, my father declared it was
impossible to express any approval of the conduct of Government.

348 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' the general liberties of raankind, and for the peace,
' security, and happiness of Great Britain,' my father
was disposed to concur, ' It was the best,' he thought,
' with only one exception ; for he could have wished
' that what had recently been done in Paris in the
' presence of a foreign force, had been accomplished
' by the uninfluenced exertions of the French people.'
However he might assent to the expediency of the
exceptional course which the state of things in France
seemed, as it were, to force upon the AUies, still the
right of every independent people to choose their own
forra of Governraent was sacred in his eyes, and he
could not, without reluctance and regret, consent to
see it even temporarily set aside.
But though he thus agreed, under the peculiar
circumstances of the time, in the principle of the
settlement proposed after the termination of hostilities
in 1814, as far as related to the restoration of the
Bourbon dynasty in France, he 'strongly condemned
the proceedings of Congress with regard to the stipu
lations and territorial arrangeraents by which that
settleraent was to be accorapanied ; and to the course
now pursued by the Allies he was inclined, with Lord
Grenville and Lord Wellesley, principally to attribute
the return of Napoleon frora Elba,
That event occurred in March 1815, while the
Congress was still sitting at Yienna, and on the 7th
of April was the subject of debate in the House of
Lords, on a raotion of Lord WeUesley's, who de-

LORD GREY. 349
nounced, in the strongest language, ' the conduct of
' Congress as having led to the events which they had
' to regret,' . . . and ' the system which the Powers
' at Yienna had established, as having been in his
' opinion, the true cause of the dethronement of the
' august faraily of Bourbon : if that,' Lord Wellesley
said, 'could be called a system which was nothing
' but an undigested mass of mutilated materials. No
' general system,' he further said, ' had been acted
' upon. The mere will and pleasure of the parties
' was consulted, and the sovereigns at Yienna had
' punished one Power because it first entered into the
' contest with them, and another because it had last
' quitted the cause which it had espoused. The
' result had been, that instead of fixing a system of
' permanent tranquillity and happiness, the labours of
' Congress had been devoted to establish a system of
' gross injustice and absolute discordance. . . France
' had been severely punished, while other Powers had
' been aggrandized to an iramense extent, and great
' accessions of territory had been given to those who
' had, from various causes, become objects of peculiar
' favour. This it was that had produced so strong a,
' feeling in France against the Bourbons ; for the
' people considered them merely as agents in the
' hands of foreign Powers, who had made them the
' instruments of degradation and injustice to the
French nation. One of the chief advantages obtained
' by Bonaparte, and of which he had made such ample

350 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' use in his declarations, was that France had been de-
' graded and lowered in the eyes of Europe, by means
' of those whom foreigners had placed upon her throne.'
My father supported the view taken by Lord
Wellesley in a powerful speech ; and in answer to
the plea of Ministers that ' Europe could not revert
' from a state of military arraaraent to a condition of
' tranquillity and social happiness, without sorae con-
' vulsion and disturbance in our progress to that
' condition,' — adraitting the truth of this proposition,
he complained that ' instead of measures having been
' taken to avert the evils which the Noble Lord
' asserted were foreseen, all the arrangeraents of
' Congress had contributed to produce that convulsion
"• and disturbance. By the neglect of Ministers,' he
said, ' the total want of principle which had raarked
' their conduct, and a most culpable blindness to con-
' sequences which they now wished to persuade the
' House they had contemplated, the highest interests
' of Europe and of the world had been sacrificed ;
' and to them, he thought, was principally to be
' attributed the new war in which we were about to
' be engaged, , , The Noble Earl,' (Liverpool,) he
proceeded, 'had argued that it was our interest to
' conclude a peace honourable to France. Unques-
' tionably, that was the flt line of policy, . . But
' instead of pursuing it, as the Noble Marquis (Wel-
' lesley) had said, our conduct had been totally dif-
' ferent, and we had given Bonaparte and the French

LORD GREY. 351
' people reason to say, that we had made the family
' of Bourbon instruments in the disgrace and degra-
' dation of France in the eyes of the world,'
Lord Grenville concurred in this condemnation of
the proceedings of the allied Powers at Yienna, and
spoke of the ' loose and negUgent stipulations which
' had produced the dreadful alternative that lay before
' them ;' — characterizing the treaty by which the war
had been terminated in 1814, as 'affording no secu-
' rity against its instant and immediate renewal,'
But though my father and Lord Grenville were
thus of one mind as to the causes which had led to
the existing state of things in France, they differed
widely as to the course which that state of things
rendered expedient ; and the unfortunate difference
thus springing up between them, though not irame
diately followed by their political separation, may be
considered as the first step towards that result, which
broke the strength, and for so many years paralysed
all the exertions of Opposition,
Lord Grenville starting on the assumption that
' real peace with Bonaparte on the throne of France
' was absolutely unattainable,' was of opinion ' that
' the best hopes of a successful resistance (where
' resistance in some shape or other was a matter of
' necessity) were to be found in immediate and vigor-
' ous exertion on our part, as the only means of
' combining and animating the exertions of the Con-
' tinental Powers.' And with this view he thought

352 ' LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
that our object ought to be ' to renew the concert of
' last year with a view to iramediate action.'
He supported these opinions on two grounds : the
first derived frora the nature of Bonaparte's power,
founded and maintained as that power had been by
railitary success, which made war, and ' above all,
' war with England, an absolute necessity for him ;'
the second, resting on the hope that ' in the present
' raoraent the irapressions under which those Powers
' acted last year would be still fresh in their minds,
' They had then found out, however late, that their
' only safety was in united resistance. They had seen
' and felt the destruction they had brought upon
' themselves, by suffering theraselves to be succes-
' sively disunited by the bait of partial and teraporary
' advantages. These feelings raust be still upperraost
' in their rainds. But I would not answer for it,' he
continues, ' that if we discourage thera by showing
' hesitation in our own conduct, and if, by teraporiz-
' ing ourselves, we give tirae and scope for French
' intrigue, we raay not see a recurrence of the same
' disgraceful and miserable . policy. And then we are
' left absolutely without hope,' Another considera
tion with hira was, ' the greater difficulty which
' Bonaparte must now feel in bringing forward,
' exactly in the present raoraent, the resources and
' raeans of France, than if tirae be given hira for fresh
' conscriptions,'* &c,
* Letter from Lord GrenviUe to my father, AprU 1816.

LORD GREY. 353
My father, in his answer to the letter m which
Lord GrenvUle communicated to him the above
opinions, admitted the critical situation in which the
country was placed by the re-estabUshment of Bona
parte ; and that both ' his personal character, and the
' nature of his power rendered the perraanent security
' of any peace with France, while he was at the head
' of the Government, to say the least, extremely
* doubtful.' The ground, also, he thought, ' on which
' any statesman must act, was that of considering that
' a power was established in France which threatened
'the most formidable dangers to this country; and
' that our safety required us to put ourselves imme-
' diately on our guard against it,'
Agreeing, however, thus with Lord Grenville as to
the character and nature of Napoleon's power, and as
to the necessity consequently entailed upon us of im
mediate and vigorous preparation ; and also concurring
in the prudence of renewing, if possible, the ' concert
' of last year,' he differed widely as to the object for
which that concert should be renewed. Lord Gren
viUe would renew it ' with a view to iramediate action,'
' By this,' my father says, ' I raust understand that
' you would immediately go to war with France,
' merely because Bonaparte is Emperor, I should
' say that our object ought to be to renew the concert
' of last year on a principle purely defensive. That
' we should consider the Treaty of Paris as a treaty
' between two countries not necessarily abrogated by
2 A

354 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
a change in the Government of either; . . . and,
consequently, that we should not engage anew in
hostilities without such a cause as would, in other
circumstances, justify that melancholy extreraity be
tween two independent Powers, . . . This I should
urge as the true line of our policy, even if I went
with you the length of believing all peace with Bona
parte to be absolutely irapossible. Even in that
case I should say, raore, rauch more, would depend
upon the evident justice of our cause than on any
supposed present advantage from our greater forward
ness in preparation. Upon what principle could you
now declare war against France, except that which
is so unfortunately and so rashly (I think so unjusti-
ably) announced in the declaration, viz,, the principle
of excluding Bonaparte personally frora the throne of
France, (the declaration says from the world !) ? — thus
leaving youraelves no alternative but the full attain
ment of that object or the raost irretrievable faUure
and disgrace, , , . Remember that Pitt, in the very
height of his popularity and power, was obliged to
give way, at the very beginning of the war of the
Revolution, when I brought forward a raotion to
repudiate the principle that the character of the
existing Government in France precluded negotia
tion. He was made to feel that neither the public
nor the Parliament would support him in the open
¦ avowal of such a principle, . , . The first effect,
' then, of attacking France in the way which you feel

LORD GREY. 355
' yourself called upon to recommend, would be to
' divide the country at home and to increase and con-
' solidate the power of the enemy ; nay, to assist and
' expedite the re-estabUshment of that very railitary
' system, the present dissolution of which in many of
' its most material parts, you assign as one of your
' main inducements to immediate action. Would the
' hope be much better with respect to the other Powers
' of the confederacy ? I fear not, Violent counsels
' are seldom supported with constancy and firmness,,
' Past experience, as well as the recent proceedings of
' the Congress, show how little their union is to be
' depended on when their separate interests come in
' the way. After aU that I have seen in the last
' twenty years, I should not be very sanguine as to
' their perseverance under reverses, even in a war un-
' dertaken on the strictest principles of self-defence ;
' but I am sure a confederacy formed for the purpose
' of expelling Bonaparte from the throne of France
' would break to pieces amidst mutual complaints and
' accusations, on the first bad success.
* Even if I were certain, then, that peace with Bona-
' parte could not ultimately be preserved, I should say,
' take care that your cause is evidently just ; but,
' above all, take care that you do not undertake the
' war on a principle which may strengthen your enemy,
' weaken and divide yourselves, and diminish a hope
' of a persevering effort in the confederacy which you
' wish to form. Prepare, indeed. That your safety
2 a2

356 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' requires. But wait till sorae aggression has given
' you a just cause of war.'
Nor did ray father believe, witt Lord Grenville,
that peace with Napoleon, though doubtful, was im
possible, and he thought there were circumstances in
his situation which raight well be expected to render
hira raore pacific. Without, however, laying rauch
stress upon this consideration, he argued further, on
the score of expediency, in favour of delaying any hos
tile declaration. He doubted, in fact, whether France
was not actually better prepared for imraediate action
than the Allies. ' The best part of our army, much
' reduced by misfortune, is,' he said, ' in America, The
' Russians are beyond the Vistula, and Poland un-
' settled. The Prussians have their Saxon spoliation
' to secure and to maintain. Austria will find in Italy
' occupation for a very large proportion of her force,
' France, on the contrary, with an army already perhaps
' too eager for war, more numerous and better equipped
* than you seem to apprehend, will find in the Nether-
' lands not only an object which her whole population
' is desirous of pursuing, but allies anxious for her
' assistance ; and in the interior of France such nura-
' bers of returned prisoners and disbanded soldiers, as,
' for a tirae at least, will fill her ranks without the
' necessity of conscriptions.'
My father thus suras up his reasons against irame
diate war : —
' 1st. Because I think the principle of attacking

LORD GREY. 357
' France, for the purpose of comxpelling her to renounce
' the government of Bonaparte, utterly unjustifiable.
' 2nd. Because I think such an attempt exposed to
' accumulated disadvantages and dangers ; and, if it
' fails, that it leaves us no hope of escaping absolute
' ruin. ' Srd. Because, though I feel the greatest doubts of
' the possibility of preserving peace, I do not abso-
' lutely despair of it ; and I think that chance, however
' doubtful, ought to be preferred to a declaration of
' war. 'And, 4thly. Because by gaining time you leave
' yourselves open to the chances which that time may
' afford ; and ultimately, if compelled to engage in
' hostiUties, it seems more likely that you would gain,
' than that you would lose by the delay,'
The reasons thus given failed to convince Lord
Grenville ; and though equally lamented on both
sides, the subject of difference was felt by each to be
too important to admit of a compromise. ' We must
' both feel,' Lord Grenville wrote, in answer to the
letter above .quoted, ' in such a case the necessity of
' declaring our sentiments such as they really are,
' To know that yours differ from mine in any degree,
' gives me, as you well know, the greatest pain,' And
again he says : ' How deeply I lament this it is need-
' less to say. We must both of us discharge our duty,
' and aU I can further say is to assure you, that every
' feeling of my heart will always lead me to make that

358 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' difference as sraall in character and as remote in time
' as duty will permit, and at aU events to confine it
' strictly to those points on which it does really
'exist.'* My father expresses in his reply his sorrow for the
difference that had thus arisen between them in stUl
stronger language. He, too, felt that the question was
' too importiant to allow either of us to suppress or
' coraproraise our opinions upon it. But,' he proceeds,
' to say that I laraent the difference that exists between
' us would be to express rayself too feebly. Since
' Fox's death I have looked to you as the person best
' quaUfied to take the chief direction of the party in
' which we have acted together. You know how little
' I have sought for rayself any such distinction. Sepa-
' rated frora you, I must abandon all hope of being
' useful ; and I probably shaU withdraw myself from
' aU further interference in politics, except upon occa-
' sions, if any such should arise, when my duty as an
' individual peer may require that I should state my
' opinions,' The opinions expressed in the letters above quoted
were afterwards stated on either side in the debate
which took place in the House of Lords on the 23rd
May, on the occasion of a motion by Lord Liverpool
for an address to the Regent, to assure him of the
* cordial support of that House in all measures which
' it raay be necessary for His Royal Highness to adopt,
* Letter from Lord GrenvUle to my father, April 1815.

LORD GREY. 359
' in conjunction with His Majesty's AUies, against the
' common enemy, at this important crisis,'
My father, lamenting that he had 'on this occasion
' to differ from a noble friend of his, whose enlarged
' understanding, whose liberal opinions, and whose
' extensive experience entitle him to the greatest
' respect ;' but considering ' the discharge of duty
'paramount to every other consideration,' moved an
amendment to the address, in which he proposed to
add to any assurances of support, ' in all measures
' necessary for maintaining the honour of His Majesty's
' Crown,' an expression of dissent from the principle
of making the personal proscription of Bonaparte the
ground of renewed war with France. ' Such a war,'
the amendment said, ' appears to us questionable in
' its principle and fraught with the greatest dangers,
' leaving us no alternative with a view to the re-estab-
' lishment of peace, but complete success in destroying
' the Government so proscribed, or humiliation and
' disgrace in submitting to acknowledge it after such
' proscription.' The battle of Waterloo, with its enormous results,
leading fo the immediate and entire overthrow of
the proscribed Government, averted all the dangers
which my father had apprehended from the principle
on which we had re-embarked in hostilities ; and
those who advocated the poUcy on which the EngUsh
Government acted, have a right to plead the success
with which that poUcy was attended. But on a calm

360 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
review of all the circumstances and events of the time,
wUl any one say that there was no ground for such
fears as my father had expressed? His belief that
France was better prepared than the Allies for irarae
diate action was verified by the initiative which Napo
leon was enabled to take in the short carapaign that
ensued. And without going the length of saying,
with Napoleon at St, Helena, that, in fighting the
battle of Waterloo, eighty chances out of one hun
dred were in his favour, will any one contend that
there was no raoraent during the protracted struggle
of the 18 th, at which the fortunes of England and of
tlie world seeraed to tremble in the balance ? And
had the scale turned against us, does any one believe
that ray father's apprehensions, as to the consequences
which such a reverse would have had on the con
federacy, would not have been araply realised?
The difference which had thus arisen between my
father and Lord Grenville was confined at this tirae to
the one subject above referred to. On other subjects
the agreeraent between thera was still, undisturbed ;
and alraost concurrently with the discussions on the
renewed war in which this difference of opinion had
shown itself, they had been acting cordially together
on a question which was destined in later years to
exercise a fatal influence over the union of parties,
and the stability of successive Adrainistrations.
The state of the Corn Laws had been brought
under the consideration of Parliaraent during the Ses-

LOED GEEY, 361
sions of 1814 and 1815, and the measure proposed by
the Government for giving increased protection to the
agricultural interest had excited the most violent op
position and agitation throughout the country, and had
led, in London, to serious riots, attended with loss
life. My father formed one of a small minority in
the House of Lords which supported Lord Gren
viUe in opposing the new laws. Lord Grenville, far
in advance on such subjects of the statesmen of the
day, and in anticipation of the policy which has now
been universally acquiesced in in England, deprecated
any legislation whatever in this matter. ' If he were
' called upon,' he said, ' to describe one of the greatest
' causes of mischief in this country, — one of thetenden-
' cies most deeply to be lamented, — he knew nothing
' that appeared to him to be a more prolific source of
' evil than the proneness to this over-love of legis-
' lative interference. He beUeved it would be much
' more advantageous to the community at large, he
' was sure it would be infinitely more beneficial to the
' interests of agriculture and of trade, if the Legislature
' could be persuaded to abstain from endeavours to
' meet temporary inconveniences, at every turn, by
' some Bill, some protection, some remedy. He was
' persuaded that nothing could be more wise than that
' principle which it was the fashion always to admire
' in theory, but always to abandon in practice, of
' refraining from perpetual attempts to supply defects,
' to correct errors, to guide speculations, to restrain

362 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' enterprise, to limit profits, to reduce hazards, by
' legislative interference. If it was true that provi-
' dence had iraplanted in the mind of every man an
' industrious and sagacious view of his own interest,
' by which he was much better directed to the attain-
' ment of his objects than by any legislative assistance,
' why were their Lordships condemned to hear that it
' was so, and yet condemned at the same time to wit-
' ness perpetual and successful attempts at the viola-
' tion of the principle?' ... He did not advocate,
however, any ' sweeping or sudden change.' ' If the
' measures,' he continued, ' which had formerly been
- adopted for the protection of trade and manufactures
' were right, let them be continued — -if wrong let them
' be abrogated ; not suddenly, but with the caution
' with which all policy, however erroneous, so engrafted
' into our usage by time, should be changed.' . .
My father's opposition, however, was grounded
chiefly on the consideration that the House was not
in possession of such inforraation upon the subject as
should precede, or be the condition of, any legislation
upon it. ' The petitioners against the Bill,' he said,
i uniforraly stated that the raeasure would have the
' effect of preventing a cheap supply of food to the
' labouring classes. , , , They might probably be
' labouring under a raistake ; their feelings might
'have been improperly excited, . , , but the true
' corrective of this evil would be to go into a dispas-
' sionate inquiry into the subject. ... If the people

LORD GREY. 363
' Were right in their views they had a claim on their
' Lordships to interfere to protect them from the in-
'jury they apprehend; if they were wrong it was
' their Lordships' paramount duty to endeavour to en-
' lighten their judgment, and to show at least that
' they had themselves examined the subject,'
Upon the general principle of protection which was
involved in the question, my father did not pronounce
any decided opinion. He impUed, indeed, that if the
existing laws compelled the agriculturist to pay more
for his coat, he thought that it would be only just that
he should be enabled to obtain more for his corn.
But this was one of those questions of political eco
nomy for which, as I have mentioned in the flrst
Chapter of this memoir, he had little taste ; and what
ever his personal bias might be, he was prepared at
all times to give the subject his most dispassionate
consideration. Without such consideration, which he
contended had not been given in this instance, and for
which they were not in possession of the requisite
information, he deprecated what he now considered
the party legislation of Government, as he deprecated
in after years the means taken to excite and agitate
the country on the subject, in order to reverse the
policy which, up to that time, bad been constantly
pursued. My father's motion to refer the measure to a Special
Committee was negatived by a great majority, and
the opposition which he supported Lord Grenville in

364 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
giving to the Bill in its different stages, was equaiUy
unavailing. The principle of protection was then tri
uraphant, and continued to prevail for more than a
quarter of a century longer.
The difference of opinion between ray father and
Lord Grenville, which had been occasioned by the
return of Napoleon from Elba, was unfortunately re
newed in 1816, with respect to the raain provisions of
the arrangeraent by which, after the flnal overthrow
of the French Eraperor, it was sought to secure the
peace of Europe against future disturbance.
Lord Grenville, impelled by his aversion to the Im
perial regime in France, to which, perhaps not without
reason, he principaUy ascribed the troubles in which
Europe had been so long involved, was disposed to
acquiesce in the policy, now adopted by the Allies, of
formally proscribing by treaty all the merabers of the
Bonaparte family from any future share in the Govern
ment of France, and of guaranteeing the possession of
the French throne to the old dynasty in legitimate
succession. This was an araount of interference in the
affairs and internal Governraent of an independent
nation, which ray father thought utterly at variance
with the principles which he had ever been taught to
regard as inviolable. ' I cannot consent,' he wrote to
Lord Grenville, ' to the doctrine of legitiraacy as now
' asserted and acted upon. It seems to me absolutely
' contradictory of the principles of our own revolution ;
' and, if true, I do not see how we oan deny that our

LORD GREY. 365
' present Government originated in treason ; and that
' the family now on the throne sit there by an usurped
' title.' Not denying that the ' restoration of the
' lineal heir of Louis XYL' was a ' desirable event,'
with a view to the permanence of peace, — 'the
' question,' he said, ' wUl be with respect to the nature
' of the transaction by which this end has been ac-
' compUshed, and whether or not it is consistent with
' those principles which I have been taught to consider
' as the true foundation of Government, really legiti-
' mate, and of the independence of nations, as well as
' with the obligations of good faith. At the com-
' mencement of the war I expressed, as well as I was
' able, my utter repugnance both to the principle and
' policy of an attempt to force upon the people of
' France a Government to which they were adverse,*
' Such an intention was solemnly and publicly dis-
' claimed, and if the event has been to corapel the French
' to submit to a Government which nothing but the
' presence of a foreign force can maintain, and to
' engage this country by a forraal guarantee to main-
' tain it by these means, the objections which I
' stated to the attempt, are increased to its accomplish-
' ment, by the breach of the assurances by which the
' people of both countries have been deceived.' . , ,
* Lord GrenviUe thought our right of interference with the imme
diate Government of France unquestionable under existing circum
stances. ' As the war,' he said, ' was necessary, it was just, and the
' conqueror had a right by the law of nations, to impose upon the con-
' quered such terms as would prevent the recurrence ofthe evil for the
' remedy of which the war was undertaken.'

366 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' Thus far, if I collect your opinions rightly from your
' letter, I fear there must be a wide difference between
' us.' And in contemplation of this difference he
reconciled hiraself to the circumstances which made
it impossible for him to be present at the opening of
the Session, and deprived hira of the opportunity, of
which he would otherwise have wished to avail himself,
of ' stating his opinions on the principles of the peace,
' and the securities by which it is to be maintained.'
With respect to these principles, and the proposed
securities, my father's opinion coincided with that of
Lord Grenville. ' I certainly,' he writes, * consider
' them as highly objectionable on all the grounds
' that you have stated. They leave France in pos-
' session of nearly the whole of her former population
* and territory, and they are at the sarae tirae so in-
' suiting, that no Govemraent of that country, legiti-
' mate or illegitimate, Bourbon or other, can avoid
' feeling the raost veheraent desire to seize the first
' opportunity that raay offer, to throw off such a load
' of injury and disgrace. They depend on the union
' of Powers so Uttle bound together by a coramon
' interest, the danger which iraraediately threatened
^ them being removed, and so likely to be divided by
' clashing pretensions, that even during the negotiations
' of the Congress, they were seen arming and entering
' into defensive alliances against each other ; and they
* produce the necessity of a system at horae, which,
' however favourable it may be to what I am per-

LORD GREY. 367
' suaded is a settled design of the Court, is equally
' dangerous to our Constitution and to our finances.'
And he thus protests against the course which was
now adopted (with what success let the events of
1830-81 declare), of fashioning the map of Europe
according to the will and supposed interests of certain
great Powers, without reference to the wishes or feel
ings of the people whom they thus arrogated to them
selves the right to dispose of. ' There is,' he says, ' a
' principle of the general arrangements essentially con-
' nected with the peace of France, from which I fun-
' damentally dissent, as being inconsistent with any
' true notion of the balance of Europe, and most
' dangerous in practice — I mean the principle of par-
' tition, by which it is supposed peace is to be main-
' tained by rounding and balancing in sorae propor-
' tion of equal force the dominions of three or four
' great Powers, without any regard, where this supposed
' convenience is interrupted by the possessions of
' weaker States, to the claims of right or justice ; I
' am afraid I might add, in some cases, to the obUga-
' tions of treaties, or what is equivalent to them.'
Lord GrenviUe had argued in the letter to which
that from which the preceding extracts have been
given was an answer, that it would have been a wise
poUey upon the conclusion of peace, ' materially to
' abridge the territory of France.' ' The events,' he
said, ' not only of the last twenty-five years, but the
' experience of a century and a half,' demonstrating

368 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' that necessity, with a view to the peace and tran-
' quillity of Europe,'
In this view my father so far concurred, as to feel,
he said, ' the reduction of the power of France to be
' at all times a great object both of British and Euro-
' pean policy,' Nor did he deny, ' if it be trae that
' we cannot be secure against any Government in
' France out of the line of her ancient kings, that such
' a reduction of territory as would prevent that Power
' from being forraidable would, on that ground also, be
' a legitiraate object.'
But then he thought tha,t in pursuing such an object
it raust be clearly shown that it was with reference to
our own safety, and, above all, that any arrangeraents
by which it was sought to effect it, ' should be such as
' to relieve us frora the necessity of any interference
' in any new change.'
There was another point incidental to the main
question of the terms and stipulations of the peace, on
the inexpediency and impolicy of which my father
and Lord Grenville entirely agreed. They both ob
jected to the continued occupation of France by the
allied armies, as a raeasure that could serve no pur
pose but to irritate the French nation without neces
sity, and without any corapensating advantage.*
* Lord Grenville also objected to it as affording a pretence for keep
ing up a large mUitary establishment ; a pohcy which he deprecated as
unconstitutional and dangerous in its consequences. He was warmly
supported in this objection by Lords HoUand and Lansdowne, &c. My
father himself was absent when the terms of the peace were discussed in
1816.

LOED GEEY. 369
' With respect to our conduct in the arrangeraents
' regarding France,' my father said in the debate on
the address on the opening of ParUament in January
1817 : ' There was but one of two courses to pursue.
' Either we should have conciliated the goodwill of
' the French people, by abstaining, after the destruc-
' tion of their former Government, against which alone
' we protested that our hostility was directed, from
' any further interference in their internal affairs,— a
' course which I should have preferred, because, in
' my opinion, it would have been more consistent with
' wisdom, liberality, and- justice, and therefore our
' true policy (for from true policy, wisdom, liberality,
' and justice are inseparable) ; or, if it had appeared
' that the people of France were in such a state, and
' that the seeds of disorder were so widely dissemi-
' nated in that unhappy country, as to render her
' dangerous to the general tranquillity, it was open to
' us, having unsheathed the sword and conquered, to
' insist on our rights as conquerors, and to take secu-
' rities for our own safety, and for the reduction of the
' power of France to such a degree as would enable us
' to repose in security. But neither of these courses
' was taken by His Majesty's Government. They
' adopted a third description of proceeding. They
' determined on raaintaining a British force in France,
' for the support of the family on the throne ; and the
' consequence is, that without having reduced the
' power of that great concentrated empire they have
2 B

370 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' generated an implacable spirit of animosity on the
' part of the people.'
With the correspondence between them on the sub
ject of the peace, the political intercourse and connec
tion between my father and Lord Grenville may be
said to have terminated. Questions soon arose at
home, producing a raore important difference between
them, which placed them once more, as they had been
during Mr. Pitt's first Adrainistration, in direct oppo
sition to each other on points, not merely of policy or
temporary inexpediency, but of constitutional prin
ciple. The conclusion of peace had been followed by an
unprecedented amount of distress pervading all branches
of our national industry — commercial, manufacturing,
and agricultural ; and this distress had, as usual, led
to feelings of discontent, of which a few mischievous
and obscure agitators had taken advantage, to excite
the people to partial attempts at insurrection, if indeed
the disturbances which took place in London, and in
some of the Midland counties, may be dignified with
such a name.
In the speech from the Throne on opening the Ses
sion of 1817, the Regent had alluded to the ' attempts
' which have been made to take advantage of the
' distresses of the country for the purpose of exciting
' a spirit of sedition and violence.' And this had been
foUowed on the 3rd of Febraary 1817, by a message
recommending tlie Houses of Parliaraent to take into

LOED GEEY. 371
' their immediate and serious consideration ' the infor
mation which he had commanded to be laid before
them ' respecting certain practices, meetings and com-
' binations in the metropolis, and in different parts of
' the kingdom, evidently calculated to endanger the
' public tranquillity, to alienate the affections of His
' Majesty's subjects from His Majesty's person and
' Government, and to bring into hatred and contempt
' the whole of our laws and constitution.'
The House of Lords responded to this message by
the appointment of a Secret Committee * to take the
information thus laid before them into consideration,
of which Committee Lord GrenviUe was a member.
On the 18th the Committee made its report, ex
pressing, after detaUing at some length the circum
stances which had led them to form it, ' their decided
' opinion that further provisions are necessary for the
' preservation of the public peace, and for the protec-
' tion of interests in which the happiness of every class
' of the community is deeply and equally involved.'
In pursuance of this recommendation, BiUs were
introduced, with the entire concurrence of Lord Gren
vUle, for the suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act,—
for the more effectual suppression of seditious meet
ings,  and for punishing any attempts to seduce the
troops from their aUegiance.
* These Committees were appointed by ballot, which, when the
great majority of the House supported the Government, insured their
being composed of members devoted to it.
2b2

372 ^ LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
'He felt it his bounden duty,' Lord GrenviUe said,
in the debate on the suspension of the Habeas Corpus
Act, ' to declare that he considered the present situa-
' tion of the country to be one of extreme danger,
* and that some extraordinary legislative measures
' were absolutely necessary  Such being the
' serious conviction of his mind, he felt it to be his
' duty openly to declare his opinion, and to give his
' cordial support for the passing of a Bill for the tem-:
' porary suspension of the Habeas Corpus Bill,' That
BiU was introduced in the House of Lords by Lord
Sidmouth (Horae Secretary) on the 24th Febraary,
and the two other Bills alluded to, in the House of
Coraraons on the sarae day by Lord Castlereagh.
My father, as he had done in 1794 and 1795, took
his stand against the policy now adopted by the Govern^
ment. In the debate on the address he had already
strongly deprecated the extraordinary measures which
the expressions in the Regent's speech, with reference
to the disturbances which had taken place, led hira to
anticipate. 'That it is in huraan nature, when dis-
* tressed,' he said, ' to express its discontent, who will
' deny ? A free people will soraetimes express their
' feelings in a manner not the most guarded. Nobody
' has been raore obnoxious to popular assemblies, to
' the friends of Reform, than myself. On no man have
' more severe remarks been made. But, my Lords,
' though they may continue to stigmatise me as a per-
' son who has forfeited their confidence, and whose

LORD GREY. 373
' moderation is hateful to them, I am far froni wishing
' to deal out the same uncharitable measure to them.
' Though I extremely disapprove of their views, which,
' if they could be carried into effect (and I am per-
' suaded they cannot), would prove most pernicious,*
' I believe many of them to have sincerely good in-
' tentions. ... I should be sorry to b'elieve that there
' existed in any great number of them a disposition to
' overthrow the Constitution. I should therefore most
' deeply regret if what has occurred f should be made
' the pretext for introducing new laws, inconsistent
' with the true spirit of the British Constitution, If any
' individuals should appear to be animated with evil
' designs, that ought not to be advanced as a reason
' for depriving the people of England, who have borne
' the heavy burthens imposed on them with patience
* so exemplary, of their constitutional rights and pri-
' vileges — their best possessions and their best hopes.
' If such be the conduct that your Lordships should
' unfortunately pursue, will not the people with justice
' exclaim — We sought for bread, and are requited with
* Meetings had been very generaUy held for the purpose of getting
up petitions for ParUamentary Reform, of which the general prayer was
for universal suffrage and annual Parhaments ; and those whose views
did not go this extreme length, were denounced, as stated by my father,
as no true friends to Reform. In hke manner, those who are satisfied
with the length to which Reform was carried in 1832, or wlio desire at
most to remedy the defects of that measure, are now denounced as
apostates if they oppose the views of those who advocate the ballot,
triennial parhaments, and a democratic extension of the franchise !
t AUuding to the attack made on the Regent, as he was returning
from opening the Session, when the window of his carriage was.brpke
either by a stone, or a buUet from an air-gun.

374 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' a stone ! Will you show them that ParUament is more
* anxious to lirait their rights than to reUeve their
' wants — to stifle the voice of coraplaint rather than to
' attend to the prayer of their aggravated distresses ?'
My father did not object to the reference of the
subject to a Select Committee, ' Undoubtedly,' he
said, on that proposition being made on the 4th of
February, ' it was the duty of Ministers to comrauni-
' cate any information they might have received of
' practices threatening danger to the Constitution,
' to Parliament ; and they could not do so in a raore
' proper raanner, than by adopting the course which
' had been pursued on similar occasions.' But he
regretted that any such necessity should have
arisen, and could not, he said, but think it ' a most
' unfortunate circurastance, a most lamentable neces-
' sity, that at this period of distress and misery, when
' no one measure of reduction or retrenchraent has
' been carried into effect, ... a raeasure should be
' proposed which, there is too much reason to appre-
' hend, may lead to some invasion or infringe-
' ment of the people's rights,' He repeated the ad
juration of the Ministers, that ' their Lordships would
' proceed to the inquiry without favour, without par-
' tiality, and without fear.' ' Or if,' he added, ' fear
' should mingle with their deliberations, with at least
' as much fear and apprehension of weakening and
' impairing the liberties of the people, as of injuring
' the Constitution.'

LORD GREY. 375
When the Committee made its report, and the
Government proceeded, in accordance with its recom
mendation, to introduce their repressive measures, he
objected strongly to the suspension of the Habeas
Corpus Act, proposed by Lord Sidmouth, on the
ground that no sufficient case of necessity had been
made out, ' He did not wish,' he said, ' to underrate
' the danger that might exist. He could have no
' interest in doing so. Whatever of rank or' of pro-
' perty he possessed, he was anxious, like every other
' man, to transmit unimpaired to his children ; and if
¦ the schemes mentioned in the report of the Com-
' mittee were capable of being carried into effect, he
' could not be so foolish as not to know that he must
' be amongst the victims,' He admitted, indeed, the
necessity of granting to Government such a power as
they now asked, on extraordinary emergencies, but
only on such emergencies, ' If,' he said, ' they had
' it at all times it would be found too strong for
' freedom ; while, on the other hand, if they were
' without it in cases of extreme urgency and danger,
' there would be no safety for the Throne, the Conr
' Stitution, or the country.' He did not, however,
now believe the danger to be ' of that imminent
' nature, which the Ministers of the Crown would have
' the House to beUeve,' and which would alone justify
such an infringement of the public liberties. The
danger, such as it was, might, he was convinced, be
' effectually met and guarded against by the enact-

376 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' ments already existing. . . . Fortified and en-
' trenched as they were,' he said, ' up to the very
' teeth, by the influence of the Crown, and by a large
' military force, he would ask had they no other
' securities still ? Let them look at their laws. There
' were enactments which restrained the liberties of the
' Press — which regulated popular meetings — which
' punished illegal oaths — and yet they carae to ask
' for a suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act !'
Lord Grenville and his friends now supporting the
Government, a very sraall rainority voted with my
father in opposition to the Governraent policy. The
second reading of the BUl was carried by a majority,
including proxies, of one hundred and fifty to thirty-
five, and it was then comraitted, reported, read a third
time and passed, on the same day.
The measures introduced at the same time in the
House of Commons were afterwards carried with equal
facility through the House of Lords, but my father
took no part in their discussion.
But the repressive measures adopted by the Go
vemment did not stop here. On the 27th of March
Lord Sidraouth issued his famous circular letter to the
Lords-Lieutenant of counties, acquainting them with
the opinion given by the law officers, that a justice
of the peace might issue a warrant for the apprehen
sion of any person charged with seUing, or in any way
publishing, blasphemous or seditious libels, and might
compel him to give bail to answer the charge.

LORD GREY, 377
This letter, and a copy of the opinion of the law
officers having been laid on the table of the House,
on the motion of my father, he brought it under con
sideration on the 12th of May, in a speech of which
Lord Holland said that he 'believed an abler legal
' argument never had been delivered either at the Bar
'or from the Bench.' Lord Erskine also said that he
' had prepared himself to enter fully upon the legal argu-
' ment, but it would now be pedantry to do so, as the
' able and convincing speech of his noble friend, had
' received no answer.' Even the Lord Chancellor
(Eldon) observed that though he could not agree with
Lord Grey, ' he had no difficulty in declaring that he
' had argued the case with such ability as held him in
' some degree of check.'
This speech, the longest my father ever made, and
which occupied four hours in the delivery, was one of
the few that was ever corrected by himself, and was
separately printed. Its length makes it impossible to
give more here than a short summary of it; nor,
perhaps, consisting, as it does, for the most part of
an elaborate legal argument, would lengthened ex
tracts possess much interest for the general reader.
He first argued against the legality of the power
asserted in this letter, supporting his argument by
the opinions of our greatest law authorities, which
aU went to show that a justice of the peace had
never been held to possess the power now claimed
for him.

378 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
Next he showed the dangerous tendency of such a
power in cases of alleged libel, even if it should
legally exist. ' In all the varieties of writings,' he
said, ' which might constitute that offence, what is more
' difficult to be decided than the question of their
' guilt or innocence ? What more exposed to the in-
' fluence of undue raotives in its decision ? It has
' been formerly stated by some of the most Eminent
' persons in the profession of the law, nay, by almost
' all of them, to be so nice and difficult a question that
' it could not be left safely even to a special jury, that
' they were only to find the fact of publication, and
' that the criminality of the writing as a question of
' law, was exclusively for the decision of the Court.
' This, my Lords, was long contended for, and long
'acted upon as law, till, happily for the freedora
' of the Press, and for the liberty of the country
' of which the Press is the great palladium, by the
' perseverance of my noble and learned friend near
' me (Lord Erskine), and by the exertions of the
' man whom in public life I raost loved and ad-
' raired (Mr. Fox), whom I had nearly called one
' of the greatest lawyers, but who certainly was one
' of the greatest men the country ever produced, that
' principle was at length exploded, and by the Libel
' Bill it was at last established, that in prosecutions
' for libel, both the law and the fact were within the
' province of the jury, and to be decided by them,
' But, ray Lords, what avails this just and beneficial

LORD GREY. 379
' statute, what security is there for the freedom of the
' Press, or the liberty of the subject, if, whilst you
' have imposed this salutary restraint upon the judges
' in trials for libel, you give to justices of the peace,
' before trial, a right to decide that difficult question,
' and to commit to prison (in many cases, perhaps, to
' inflict a severer punishment than the Court upon
' conviction would adjudge) upon a charge which, after
' all, may turn out to have had no foundation but in
' the false interpretation of words perfectly innocent,
' by the justice before whom the charge was brought ?
' I cannot, my Lords, I will not, believe that you can
' sanction the exercise of such a power. That it is not
' law, I think I have already shown. But if it is law
' your duty calls upon you to lose no time in altering
' it. With respect to offences over which this au-
' thority is acknowledged, it is ordinarily a simple and
' intelligible fact, of which the magistrate has to judge.
' . . , But upon libel, where the whole guilt or inno-
' cence of the offence must depend upon the intention,
' and must be inferred from the construction and the
' inuendoes, often difficult for the most impartial and
' unbiassed person to decide, where the prejudices,
' interests, or passions of the justice before whom the
' charge is brought, are so likely to influence his
' interpretation of the words ; where in political or
' reUgious libels, more especially, his particular opi-
' nions and attachments must unavoidably have so
' great a sway : in cases of this sort, to place upon

380 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' the charge of any coramon informer the personal
' liberty of every writer and publisher on politics,
' religion, or law, or any other public question, the un-
' fettered discussion of which is of the very essence
' and principle of a free Government, at the discretion
' of magistrates mixing in aU the contests of the time,
' and partaking on one side or the other, in aU the
' heats and prejudices which personal or party interests
' engender ; — if such be the power of the magistrates,
' and if this be law, where, I ask, are aU the boasted
' securities of our independence and freedom ?'
Having next shown that in the absence of any
statute conferring such a power on justices of the
peace, there was also no such ancient and continued
practice as could forra a plea in its justification, he
proceeded to argue against the act of the Secretary of
State in sending this circular, as an unconstitutional
interference with the raagistracy in the exercise of
their judicial functions.
' It is, my Lords,' he said, ' amongst the very first
' principles of a free Governraent, that there should
' be an insurmountable line of separation between the
' executive and the judicial authorities, — that the
' latter should be kept independent of the former :
' and hitherto any interference of a Minister of the
' Crown with the administration of justice, has been
' considered as a political offence of so serious a ten-
' dency to the liberty and security of the subject, that
' at other times it would have called down the indig-

LORD GREY. 381
' nation of Parliament on the head of the offender. I
* say, my Lords, this has been such an interference,—
' a direct interference, not with the ministerial, but
' with the judicial duties of the magistrates,— by in-
' structing them in what manner they are to administer
' the law with respect to a particular class of offences ;
' the consequence of which is, to subject to the power
' of arrest, and imprisonment, if baU cannot be pro-
' cured, every author, printer and publisher, — nay,
' perhaps, every possessor, of any writing which, in
' their judgment, they may deem a libel.' *
My father's opposition to this proceeding of the
Minister was as fruitless as that which he had offered
to the suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act, and the
motion with which he concluded, for the production of
the case submitted to the law officers, on which the
opinion was founded by which Lord Sidmouth justifled
his letter, was negatived by seventy-five to nineteen.
It does not appear that there was any formal decla
ration of the dissolution of the political connection be
tween my father and Lord Grenville.f But the very
* In the Session of 1818, Lord Erskine introduced a BiU to prevent
arrests by justices ofthe peace for libel, before indictment found ; but
it was thrown out on the second readuig by a majority of thirty-one to
thirteen. j- In the Memoirs of the Courts of George III. and the Regency, pub
lished by the present Duke of Buckingham, no letters are given for the
years 1815, 1816, and 1817, most important years to omit; but it
would appear from those published, for the year 1818, in which great
anxiety is shown on the part of some of Lord Grenville's friends to
form a ' third Party,' (evidently as a step towards joining the Govern
ment,) and from the disapprobation expressed on one occasion by Lord
GrenviUe of the reception, by Lord Temple, of a communication from

382 LIFE AND OPINTONS OP
different view now taken by them of the condition of
the country, and of the measures which that condition
rendered expedient, led virtually to that result. While
my father (as has been seen) raised his voice loudly
against a course of policy which he considered no less
impolitic than unconstitutional, Lord Grenville sup
ported the Government in all their coercive raeasures.
And it was probably in contemplation of that separa
tion which such a difference rendered inevitable be
tween the parties that had hitherto coraposed the
Opposition, that the latter, in supporting the Bill pro
posed by Ministers in June 1817, for prolonging the
suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act,* spoke of the
probability of that being 'alraost the last occasion on
' which he should have to claim the attention of their
' lordships.' The conduct, indeed, of those who were now eagerly
pressing the discussion of Parliamentary Reform, and
promoting meetings for the pmpose of getting up peti
tions for that object, at which both the language used,
and the views advocated, were often of extreme vio
lence, was such, as, with Lord Grenville's known
opinions on such subjects, made his further co-operation
with the Opposition irapossible.

Lord Liverpool, that though he (Lord GrenviUe) had withdrawn from
any active part in ParUament the connexion with the Whig party had
never been formaUy dissolved.
* In the first instance the Habeas Corpus Aot had only been sus
pended tiU the 1st of July, In June, a second BiU was introduced to
continue the suspension.

LORD GREY. 383
My father himself^thongh disapprovmg strongly of
the coercive measures to which the Government had
recourse in order to meet this agitation, or rather the
consequences which they chose to attribute to it, was
as much opposed as Lord GrenviUe himself could be,
to the views advocated by the Ultra-Reformers, I
have already quoted at some length a speech which he
made in 1810,* in moving an address to the King on
the state of the nation, in which he disclaimed all par
ticipation in the views of the so-caUed Radical Re
formers. He now repeated, in presenting a petition
from the Lord Mayor and Corporation of London, on
the 18th of September 1817, praying, amongst other
things, for a Reform of Parliament, that he most fully
' disclaimed the project of annual parliaments and
' universal suffrage. His noble friend (Lord Holland)
' had shown, to the conviction of that House, that such
' doctrines never were acknowledged by the Constitu-
' tion. That they never would become part of the
' Constitution he most sincerely hoped  In his
' conscience he believed that their realization would
' not only be unattended with any salutary or beneficial
' improvement, but would lead to the subversion of all
' that this nation, over every other part of the world,
' enjoyed.' But he was not prepared to ' impute to every man
' who held such doctrines, improper or sinister designs,
' ... It was natural, he felt, that the people should
' look, under the pressure of unparalleled distress, to
* See Chapter V.

384 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
' every measure likely to obtaiugredress.' And though
' he could not conceal from hiraself that in the very
' anxiety for that redress, they were ready to subscribe
' to plans and systems of Reform without particularly
' weighing the specific merits or applicability of such
' propositions,' still less was he prepared to concur,
on that account, or on account of the disturbances
of which it was said the language used at the Reforra
raeetings had been the cause, in the coercive measures
now proposed by Ministers and supported by Lord
Grenville. If mischievous raen took advantage of the
existing distress to encourage irritation, and used the
opportunity afforded by the meetings in favour of Re
form to preach revolutionary doctrines, ' the suspension
' of the Habeas Corpus Act was not the proper remedy
' for the discontents that prevailed.' Nor was it, he
thought, either politic or just, ' because there were a
' few designing persons ready to take advantage of the
' distressed, to urge thera to acts of violence, that the
' whole people of England were to be deprived of their
' liberties, and those discontents aggravated, which a
' wise Government would endeavour to remove.' *
The separation between my father and Lord Gren
ville was thus, from the comraencement of these dis
cussions, complete ; and the united and powerful party
which had constituted the Opposition for the last ten
years, under their joint leadership, was thenceforward
irrevocably broken up.
* Speech on the renewal ofthe suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act,
June 1817.

LORD grey; 385

CHAPTER YIII.
BIOGRAPHICAL SKETCH.
In the preceding chapters I have attempted to give
some idea of the principles on which my father's
political opinions were founded, and by which his
public conduct was invariably guided. My object has
been less to vindicate their truth and justice (though
entertaining myself the most implicit faith in both)
than to show that, such as they were, they were the
honest convictions of his mind; that, as such, being
earnestly and sincerely adopted, no raotive of self-
interest — ^no consideration of party advantage — no
desire for office, such as the vulgar idea is too apt to
impute to public men — not even the nobler ambition
to obtain power for the sake of the good it might
enable him to effect, could induce him, for a single
instant, to abandon or even to compromise them.
To the possession of office he was at all times not
only indifferent but indisposed ; and he ever contem
plated the possibility of the course of events leadmg to
his being called upon to take a share in the Govern
ment of the country, as a sacrifice which his duty
2 0

386 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
might, under certain circumstances, render imperative ;
but still as a sacrifice of that domestic comfort and
happiness which no man perhaps appreciated more
highly, or clung to raore fondly, than hiraself.
The continued existence of successive Tory Admi
nistrations, he regarded, under the circurastances of
the tiraes, as a national raisfortune; and he joined
eagerly and zealously in the Opposition which had for
its object the substitution of a Government based on
raore liberal principles. But great as, in his opinion,
would be the national advantage of the establishment
of a Liberal Administration in power, that advantage,
he also thought, might be too dearly purchased if
attained at any, even the slightest, sacrifice of cha
racter. Nor was it enough, as regarded hiraself, that
there should be no real abandonment of political prin
ciples for the sake of place ; there must not be even
such an apparent comproraise of it, as might lead the
public to doubt for a moraent the purity of the raotives
on which he had acted. He held the character of a
public man to be a national property that must not be
lightly, trifled with; nor could it, in his idea, be
damaged in any degree, without corresponding injury
to the public interests.
It was this feeling that led to the interraption of the
various negotiations for changes in the Adrainistration
which I have already noticed. It cannot be denied
that, in acting upon this conviction, the bulk of the
party did not always go with hira ; and on more than

LORD GREY. 387
one occasion the unbending spirit, which alone stood in
the way of his accession to power, was loudly con
demned by many of its members, who could ill un
derstand his high principle of action, and who could
only feel resentment against one to whom they attri
buted the disappointment of their hopes,
I am aware that the passing of the Reform Bill has
been urged as a reason why such elevated notions of
the obligations of a public man, should in latter times
have apparently ceased to operate, and that a Ministry
is not only thought to be justified, but to be called
upon by duty, to adhere to office after defeats which
in other times would have been considered to render
immediate resignation the only course compatible with
a due regard to character and honour, I cannot,
however, concur in this opinion, or join with those
who attribute to the Reform measure the weakened
authority of successive Administrations. To my mind
it seems more correct to trace the general disrepute
into which all Governments have undeniably fallen,
and the existing want of confidence in the honesty of our
public men, to the abandonment of that high principle,
which, as it prevented my Mher from accepting office
without full power to carry his own policy into effect,
would never have allowed him to retain it, by the
constant sacrifice of his opinions to the ever-increasing
exigencies of a party.
There can be no doubt, however, that if the acqui
sition or retention of power is to be the first object of
2c2

388 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
a public raan, this is not the way to secure it ; and
my father hiraself affords a striking proof, that such
principles of action can only result in almost perpetual
exclusion frora office, and in the consequent loss of
opportunity to effect much good, that, with a less
unbending spirit — with a lower standard of public
virtue — he would years before have been in a position
to accoraplish. To this it is sufficient to answer that
it ought not to be so; and had others been actuated
by sirailar high notions of political honour and con
sistency — ^tad they made, as he did, the power to give
effect to their principles a sine quS, non condition of
their acceptance of office ; for instance, as I have
more than once observed already, and raust again
repeat, had those who professed to share his beUef in
the vital importance to the erapire of the settleraent of
the Catholic Question, raade that settleraent, as he did,
a condition of their forming part of the Government — ¦
he would not have had to wait a quarter of a century
before occupying his proper place in the councils of
his country ; nor would a generation have grown up
in Ireland, nursed and reared in a system of habitual
agitation, which could not be expected to end with the
cause whence it first sprang, and which went far to
neutralize the good effects anticipated frora the great
raeasure of justice and conciliation that had been so
unfortunately delayed.
I propose in the present Chapter to give a short
notice of ray father in his. doraestic life; though, per-

LORD GREY. 389
haps, there are few men so distinguished in public,
whose life in private was so devoid of all incident
which could render its lengthened description generally
interesting. Its even and unvarying tenour might
almost be termed monotonous, if monotony did not
seem to imply ennui and weariness — feelings from
which no man's daily life was ever more completely
free. Each portion of the day had its appropriate
occupation ; none was mis-spent or trifled away, and
between the well-regulated hours devoted to business
or study, and those given to his family, his life passed
on, as I have said, in an even and unvarying tenour,
but one singularly happy in its course.
It would be impossible in language to give any
adequate idea of the spirit of gentleness and affection
that marked all his intercourse with his family and
famiUar friends. Nor shall I attempt it, farther than
to say, that no one was ever endowed in a higher
degree with those domestic qualities, which insure to
their possessor the attachment of children, friends, and
dependents. High-minded as were the principles, and
pure the motives, that marked his public career, it
was in private — in the every-day relations of family
life — that the whole beauty of his character became
most apparent. But he was not demonstrative by
nature, and a certain reserve of manner in general
society, led the world to judge him most erroneously.
The most indulgent of men towards others—the most
humble and modest in his judgment of himself— has
been represented as haughty ahd overbearing! one

390 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
whose heart was overflowing with feelings of kindness
and syrapathy for all around him, has been described
as ill-tempered and unforgiving I I shall be disap
pointed, however, if the extracts which I give in the
course of this memoir, from his letters to my mother,
Mr. Fox, &c., do not lead those who read them to
estimate him more correctly.
I know little of my father's life, when not attending
his Parliamentary duties, before his marriage. It is
probable, however, that rauch of his time was spent
either in the North, or with his father, who then com
raanded in the South of England.
In 1794, as I have raentioned in the first Chapter, he
married the daughter of Mr., afterwards Lord, Pon
sonby, of Bishop's Court, in the County of Kildare,
whose family had long taken a lead in the party -
opposed to the Government in Ireland. He was thus
brought into intimate relations with the most distin
guished of the Irish Liberals.
On his marriage he took a small house in Hertford
Street, May Fair, where he Uved during the Sessions
of '95, '96, '97, and '98, spending the suraraer of the
three forraer at Howick, the seat of his uncle Su*
Harry, and his own future residence during raany long
and happy years ; and that of '98, partly in Hertford
shire, and partiy with Lord Frederick Cavendish, at
Holker, in Lancashire.*
* My mother's grandmother. Lady Betty Ponsonby, was sister of
WiUiam, third Duke of Devonshire ; and this relationship had pro
duced the greatest intimacy between the Ponsonby and Cavendish
families.

LOED GEEY. 391
In 1797 my father was twice caUed down' to
Brighton, where my grandfather and grandmother were
then living. First, on account of the illness of the
former ; and, again, on the distressing errand of commu
nicating to them the intelligence of his brother's death.
Colonel Thomas Grey, who died in command of a
regiment at the Cape of Good Hope, after a Ungering
iUness. I mention these visits to Brighton, though
well aware how little of interest their mention can
possess for strangers to himself and his family, because
they give me the opportunity of quoting extracts from
letters of his to my mother, which show his character
better than anything I could myself say.
' Though I hate leaving you even for a minute,' he
writes to my mother, on the first of these occasions, ' I
' am very glad I came here, and I think it will be some
' relief to them, I am sorry to tell you that I think
' my father looks very indifferently. He has not been
' out of the house these two months, and some time
' ago had a spitting of blood,' . . . And the next
day he adds : ' I cannot help wishing that I had
' brought you here and remained some time, as I think
' I might have been able to do my father some good.
' Even these fine days have not tempted him to go
' out, and he is so low that it is quite distressing to
' see him. I am sure you will feel for my poor
' mother, who has everybody else, as well as herself
' to support, I think my grandmother is the best of
' the family both in health and spirits. When I
' express a wish to stay here, if my other avocations

392 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' Would permit it, I assure you it is only from the
' motive of doing good to ray father : I never saw a
' place I should so rauch disUke to live at for any
' tirae.' In April, when he again went down with the news
of his brother's death, he writes : ' This has been a
sad scene of affliction, as you may too well conceive ;
for though we ought all to have been in some degree
prepared for the loss, yet it was irapossible not to
feel the shock which the certainty of it must occasion.
My father and mother are both as well as I could
expect them to be. Indeed, the fortitude of both,
under many severe trials, but none so severe as this,
to which I have seen them exposed, cannot be ex
ceeded. I think our coraing here has been of great
use, and I hope we shall stay at least tUl Tuesday,
though I cannot help regretting every raoraent I ara
kept from you,' . . . ' We had a raost prosperous
journey, and arrived here at half-past eight. During
the latter part .of it, I cannot describe to you what I
felt in the reflection that I was carrying such un
happy intelligence to persons at the tirae, probably,
quite unconscious of it, perhaps engaged in a pleasant
party, and without a thought of the raisery which
was approaching thera.'
The following day he adds : ' We all continue as
well as you could wish us, with the exception of the
raost material, I mean my father and mother. They
are neither of them well ; particularly the former,
who is sadly reduced by his last illness, and this

LOED GEEY. 393
' most heavy loss appears to press upon them more
' heavily, as they think more of it. Indeed, it is
' impossible to recall to one's mind aU poor Tom's
' amiable qualities, without feeling, if possible, still
' more from reflection,'
In 1799 my father gave up his house in Hertford
Street, and took one on Ham Common, where he lived
for the next two years. The drawback to this situa
tion was its distance from London, which raade it
impossible for him to return at night after attending
the House of Commons. Thus it frequently happened
that he was detained in town for the whole week ; and
this at a time when the state of the neighbourhood
was such, as naturally to fill him with anxiety on
account of his family. Nearly every house on the
Common, I believe, except his own, had been broken
into while he lived there. My mother, however,
passed much of the time of his unavoidable absences
with Lord Frederick Cavendish, at Twickenham Park.
In November 1799, my father's brother, William,
who had been severely wounded in Holland, having
been landed at Yarmouth, in Norfolk, he accompanied
my grandfather and grandmother to that place, which
I again mention only to introduce the following ex
tracts from his letters written on that occasion,
' We arrived,' he writes on the 21st, ' yesterday
' evening between six and seven, and found poor
' William as well, I think I may say better, than I
' expected, , . . I have had a conversation with
' Mr, Tudor, the surgeon, who gives us every reason

394 LIFB AND OPINIONS OP
' to hope that his life wiU be safe, though the lirab is
' still in danger. Indeed, the probabiUty is that he
' wiU lose it, and in the raost favourable event he wiU
' have a stiff joint.'* , , . 'We have got very
' tolerable lodgings exactly opposite to the house he
' is in, and where I shall remain for some days. My
' father and mother go away on Saturday, On this
' unfortunate occasion my being so long and so far
' separated from you is not the least of my grievances,
' I cannot at present fix any time to return, and
' though I am sure that ray absence is no less painful
' to you than it is to rae, yet I ara also sure that you
' will not wish me to corae away, whilst I can be of
' any use to poor Williara.'
On the 22nd he says : ' My father and raother have
' deterrained to stay till to-raorrow ; which I ara very
' glad of, as it appears to gratify poor Williara,' And
he thus describes the appearance of sorae of the Rus
sian soldiers who, after their defeat at the Helder, had
been brought to Yarraouth in our fleet : ' I have seen
' sorae of the Russians, and do not at all wonder at
' their being beaten. My father cannot get over his
' astonishraent at their appearance. They really are
' not huraan, and their filth is shocking to the greatest
' degree. Those that are landed, to be carried to the
' hospital, are iramediately washed frora head to foot in
' a warra bath, their heads are shaved, and new clothes
' given to thera to prevent contagion. Such parts of
' their own clothes as can be rendered wholesome and
* This was the result.

LOED GEEY. 395
' useful by washing, are reserved for them, and the
' rest are burned. But it is quite impossible to give
' you any adequate idea of their sordid, miserable ap-
' pearance. The convicts in the galleys in France, or
' in the hulks in England, come the nearest to them
' in general resemblance and dress. Most of them are
' in rags, squalid and disgusting to the sight, or wrapped
'up in a large loose white great-coat, of a texture
' between a blanket and cloth, which is tied by a
' string or dirty pocket-handkerchief round the waist,
' In short, you would take them to be anything but
' soldiers, ' Your letter, which I received yesterday,' he writes
on the 24th, ' has been the greatest comfort I have
' experienced since I came here. The assurances that
' you are all well, and that my sweet children are
' well, make me most happy. There is, however, one
' little sentence for which I have a great mind to
' quarrel with you. I should do so most seriously,
' if I thought you could really iraagine that any-
' thing could make up to me the want of you and
' my children. Riches — I mean in moderation, for I
' am not sure that great possessions do not bring with
' them as much embarrassment as pleasure — riches
' in moderation might add to our comforts, but the
' want of them, I trust, will never destroy our happi-
' ness. Look at all your rich acquaintance, and teU
' me whether the situation of any of them is really and
' intrinsically as happy as ours. I wiU answer the
' question for myself, and in doing so I think I may

396 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' answer it for you too, that there is no creature upon
' earth with whom I would change — no, not even with
' Bonaparte,' In December of the same year he writes frora
Southhill, where he was passing two or three days
with Mr, Whitbread and his sister : ' I shall certainly
' not protract my stay here beyond Tuesday, but I
' am afraid I shall not be able to see you on that day.
' I promised to dine with my father. I shall therefore
'sleep in town, and be with you at dinner on Wed-
' nesday. I hope you will stay at Twickenham till
' that day. How I do long to return to Tacitus and
' our own comfortable fire ! Do you ? I must now
' snub you a little. Do you know that in the letter
' you wrote yesterday there is no notice whatever —
' no, not a single word — of my darling children ! Your
' letter of the day before says they were well, and I
' ara quite easy about thera, but I like to hear you
' speak of them, and tell me that they soraetiraes
' appear to recollect me, God in heaven bless them !'
Whenever my father was away from home he never
omitted, however his tirae raight be otherwise en
gaged, to write a daily letter to ray mother, giving
her a full account of everything that had occurred of
either public or private interest. And throughout
this correspondence there breathes the same spirit of
fond affection for his family, the same yearning after
the comfort and happiness of his domestic life, the
same impatience of it^ interruption.
In July 1800, he writes, during a shprt visit by

LOED GREY. 397
himself to the Duke of Bedford at Woburn : ' I did
' not find so large a party as I expected. It con-
' sists at present of only Fox, Lord Robert (Spen-
' cer), Fitzpatrick, Lord John Townshend, Francis
' (Sir Philip), Dudley North, Richardson, and myself,
' Sheridan and Adair are expected to-day, and Hare
' to-morrow. Pleasant as the people are with whom
' I am living, and comfortable as this place is, they do
' not make up to me for your absence and that of my
' sweet children. They are so necessary to me that
' I cannot enjoy as I ought to do society anywhere
' from home. I should here if anywhere, for the style
' of the house is the best imaginable, and I never felt
' so completely at my ease and comfortable, under
' any roof that was not my own, I feel ungrateful
' when I form a wish beyond what I possess, for who
' ever possessed such real blessings ? Indeed, if I
' were at liberty to make my way of living conform
' to my situation, I feel confident that I should have
' no regrets to disturb my happiness. A small com-
' fortable house, a little land to afford me occupation
' out of doors, are all that are necessary to me ; but if
' we were only rich enough fto entertain occasionally
' at home a smaU society with comfort, I should not have
' a wish ungratified,' — Such a society, in "fact, as he
was then enjoying at Woburn, composed of men no
less distinguished by their abiUties and patriotism in
pubUc life, than bythe genial qualities which threw so
great a charm over their intercourse in private.

398 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
Of the foremost man amongst them all, to whose
memory he clung with the most devoted affection
till the latest hour of his own life, he thus speaks on
the sarae occasion : ' Fox is in the highest spirits.
' It is quite delightful to see such a raan in the midst
' of a society which he appears to like, so unas-
' suming, good-humoured, and cheerful. Everything
' seeras to be a source of enjoyment to hira, and I
' hardly know which to envy raost, his araiable dis-
' position or his unrivalled talents. When I descend
' from admiring hira to think of rayself, how I
' sicken at the contrast ! He is enthusiastic about
' poetry, and adraires Spenser as much as we do,
' You raay remeraber how cheap Francis appeared
' to hold us for this taste at Woolbeding,* He is not
' stout enough to disparage Spenser as much as he
' did then, before Fox, but I assure you his opinions
' on the subject, as far as he has ventured to express
' them, have gained him no applause,'
'I gave you an account,' he writes the next day,
' of the party yesterday ; and though the society is gay,
' cheerful, and arausing, there is no great variety of
' events and occupations which would afford you any
' interest. We sit up rather too late, and dine too
' early, considering the hours we keep ; but otherwise
' nothing cau be pleasanter than the raanner in which
' the day passes. The room we inhabit is the Ubrary,
"* The seat of Lord Robert Spencer, near Midhurst, in Sussex, and a
frequent resort of Mr. Pox and the leading AVhigs.

LORD GREY. 399
' where we lounge over books, or join in conversation,
' as suits our inclination. In this manner the morn-
' ing, or the greater part of it, passes, with perhaps a
' sauntering walk in the pleasure grounds, or the
' tennis-court, where Fox and Lord Robert generally
' play for an hour or two. We dine at four, and gene-
' raUy walk out after coffee ; after which there is a party
' of good players, from which I am excluded, at whist,
' in a room which opens into the library, where the
' rest of the party amuse themselves as in the morning,
' Supper is served in anotber adjoining room about
.' eleven ; after which we generally sit up pretty late.
' The library is the most delightful room you ever saw.
' All the castles I have been used to build about
' Howick are fading away very fast, and, to say the
' truth, I wish I could divest myself of all remaining
' partiality to it. The distance will certainly not only
' be a great inconvenience on account of the education
* of our dear children, but will make it almost impos-
' sible to have any society that is pleasant, which God
' knows the county itself cannot afford,'
But Howick was soon to become his permanent
residence ; and instead of divesting himself of his exist
ing partiality to it, that partiality deepened into an
attachment to the place which has been rarely
equalled. He had only taken the house on Ham Common for
two years, and he thus writes during a short absence
in London during the spring of 1801 : 'We must soon

400 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' begin to think seriously of some shelter after the 1st
' of May, which approaches very fast. What I should
' like best, would be to take a house in town for a
' couple of months : but I fear we could not afford one
' which would hold us and the children with any com-
' fort ; and besides, the expense of moving twice is an
' important consideration, I soraetiraes think it would
' be a good plan, if I could borrow the money, to buy
' some small place with a few acres of ground. The
' interest would be less than the rent we must pay for
' any hired place, A little ground would assist very
' much in our housekeeping, and being our own, it .
' might furnish us with sorae occupation. Should
' better times arrive, which might raake us wish to
' change, we could not lose by seUing it, and if, which
' I think most probable, for the sake of being nearer
' town for the education of our children, and for other
' reasons, we should find it prudent to remain, the im-
' proveraents which, even in a little way, we raight
' now carry on, would serve to attach us to the place,
' and contribute to our future comfort. I am much
' incUned to soraething of the sort, for I really am
' quite tired of this uncertain and unsettled life, with-
' out any hope, and without any occupation,'
His yearning was now, as it always was, for the
corafort and happiness of home.
This question of home was settled for him in the
happiest manner. The circurastances under which he
anticipates, in the above letter, a possible desire to

LOED GEEY. 401
change any residence in which they might now esta
blish themselves, were doubtiess those attending his
probable succession to Howick on the death of his
uncle. But the kindness of that uncle, by allowing
him to fix himself there at once, made such future
change unnecessary,
June had found him still uncertain as to his future
plans ; but in the course of that raonth he thus writes
to ray mother, then at Lord Frederick Cavendish's at
Twickenham : —
' I have no news to tell you but such as will I think
' be equally surprising and pleasing to you. Sir Harry
' has, in the handsomest way possible, consented to our
' going to Howick, and to our Uving there, on our own
' account, in future. I have only a moraent to save
' post, and must defer particulars till I see you to-
' morrow. He seems quite impatient that we should
' set out, and thought I fixed a very late day when I
' talked of the middle of July. You must begin soon
' to make your preparations, and, above all, prepare
' yourself to become a notable farmer's wife, for we
' shall be very poor, but, I hope, very comfortable.'
I think it was on the 17th of July, 1801, that he
arrived at Howick with his family ; and on the anni
versary of that day, forty-four years later, he there
l?reathed his last ! During the whole of this period,
when not attending his Parliamentary duties, and
with the exception of three winters passed in Devon
shire for my mother's health, and of the few years
2 D

402 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
when he was afterwards in office, by far the greatest
portion of each year was here spent. How he loved
the place, — with what reluctance he at all times left
it,— and with what deUght he ever returned to it, his
letters abundantly testify ! And had he not a right to
love a placc, as it may in truth be called, of his own
creation ? Where, with the exception of the few old
trees about the house and garden, and in the glen lead
ing to the sea, there is scarcely one which is not of his
own planting, — where there is not a walk or an im
proveraent but of his laying out, — and where he could
look round on the corafort and happiness of aU about
hira, with the proud satisfaction of feeling how much
he had himself contributed to thera.
A minute description of Howick, its house and
grounds, would be of little interest to strangers. Yet
any account of my father's private life would be
incomplete, without sorae notice of the place to
which he was so fondly attached, and with which his
whole life, frora this tirae forward, was so corapletely
identified. Situated about a raile frora the sea, on the eastern
coast of Northuraberland, — some thirty miles, by the
road, south of Berwick, and forty north of Newcastle,
— Howick, though it has no pretensions to be classed
araongst the fine places of Bngland, and though the
surrounding country has little beauty to recoraraend it,
yet raay be confidently asserted to be, as it now exists,
the creation of ray father, one of the most comfort-

LOED GEEY. 403
able and enjoyable residences to be found in the king
dom. The house stands on the north side of a little brook,
which issuing from woods, mostly of my father's own
planting, to the west, makes a tolerably wide sweep
directly in its front, and then again disappearing be
tween high banks, winds its way through a pretty glen
for about a mile and a half to the sea. Down this
glen, which is wooded on both sides to the very beach,
winds, with the windings of the stream in a south
easterly direction, a most delightful walk, which, after
emerging on the sea-shore, turns to the north, and fol
lowing the indentures of the coast, just above the rocks,
of which it here almost entirely consists, is continued
for another mile and a half, to the northern boundary
of the estate.
Other walks there were— broad, sociable, enjoyable
walks— about the gardens, and up the brook, and
through the woods to the west of the house, tiU they
extended in different directions to an aggregate length
of littie less than seven miles— all laid out by my
father himself— formed and kept with the greatest care,
and from the nature of their formation, dry in a few
minutes after the heaviest rain. But the walk down
the glen, known as the ' long walk,' and that along the
sea-shore, have seemed to me to deserve especial men
tion, not only as giving in fact a character to the
place, but as the round which each Sunday in succes
sion, weather permitting (and it must indeed have been
2 D 2

404 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
a bad day that kept us at home), my father would take
with his family. If it is difficult to exaggerate the
beauty and variety of the sea and coast views that met
you at every turn on the sea walk (so was that along
the shore caUed), it is stiU more difficult adequately to
describe my father's enjoyment of them, or the happi
ness of those who accompanied him.
But a description of the every-day life at Howick in
its even and unbroken course, the raorning occupations,
the afternoon rides, the evening readings, — though
to my father's faraily it raight recaU the recoUections of
a chUdhood and youth of more than common happiness,
reminding them of sorae particular instance of the affec
tionate indulgence of hira to whom they owed it, yet to
the general reader such a detail might appear monoto
nous and uninteresting. I shall not, therefore, attempt it.-
When 1 speak of a childhood and youth of more
than common happiness, I do not speak too strongly.
Rarely indeed, if ever, has the grown man or woraan
had reason to look back upon that early period of
life with such fond recoUection. The hours for study
were strictly regulated ; but, out of those hours, it was
my father's system to leave his children to enjoy them
selves in their own fashion. Uncontrolled by the pre
sence of either governess, or tutor, or servant, they
were free, — subject only to the condition of observing
the prescribed hour of return, — to roam at will over the
country; and this alraost from their very earUest
years. This freedom, he justly thought, not only

LOED GEEY. 405
tended to their health and happiness, but also taught
them to be self-dependent, accustoming them early to
act and think for themselves. He thus explains, in
1804, the views he entertained on the education of chil
dren generaUy, and on which he acted with regard to
his own, ' I am afraid,' he says, ' that  will ulti-
' mately be found rather to have overpowered than
' improved her children. After all, health is the first
' object ; even for the improvement of the mind, it is
' the first. For without brisk animal spirits, and a
' good state of health, there will not in general be very
' great powers of mind. I know this by woful expe-
' rience. Then, though adequate instruction is not to
' be neglected, I am convinced that children may be
' taught too much as well as too little. To exercise
' and strengthen faculties by placing them in situations
' to act and think for themselves, seems to me at
' least as necessary a part of education, as to teach
' them what others have thought and done. But on
' this subject I know we agree,'
Most parents would shudder at the manner in which
the freedom thus allowed was exercised ; at the dis
tances and places to which the enterprise of the
children, thus left to themselves, would often lead
them ;— and, certainly, considering the nature of the
rocks forming the coast at Howick, and over which
we clambered at wUl, it does seem almost like a
special protection of Providence, that averted any
serious accident.

406 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
The increased distance at which my father was now
from London, added to the aversion he so constantly
expressed for political life. In the first years of his re
sidence at Howick, the expense of the long journey
raade it impossible for him to move his faraily, when
forced hiraself to go to town by his Parliaraentary
duties. This naturally increased his reluctance to
leave horae, and his correspondence with Mr, Fox,
from 1802 to 1806, shows the difflculty with which he
was brought up, even in the raost iraportant political
crises ; — and when thus alone in London, his longing
desire to return to the happiness of his own domestic
circle, almost unfitted him for the business in which
he had to engage. Mr. Fox saw this so strongly, that
on one occasion, when urging his attendance at the
opening of the Session, he writes : ' And now, as you
' have addressed yourself to Mrs. Fox, let me do so
' to Mrs, Grey ; and beg of her not to think of letting
' you corae alone, or that at least she will follow very
' soon after. God knows, when you are in town
' without her you are unfit for anything, with aU your
'¦ thoughts at Howick ; and as the time for which your
' stay may be necessary must be uncertain, you will
' both be in a constant fidget and misery.'
My father's answer to this appeal shows the feeling
with which he yielded to it : 'I have at last,' he says,
'determined to set out, though most unwillingly,
' Indeed, you cannot conceive what it costs me ; and in
' return for the sacrifice I now make, I raust stipulate

LOED GEEY. 407
'that if, towards the end of the Session, I should
' determine to resign my seat, you will not say a word
' against it.'
The whole of 1802 seems to have been passed
quietly at Howick ; — but the apparent imminence of
war with France, and the King's message on the sub
ject, of the Sth of March 1803, would not permit my
father any longer to disregard Mr. Fox's urgent entrea
ties for his attendance, ' Another fine day,' he writes,
from the road on his way up, ' but a most melancholy
' one to me ! Have you been riding, or planting
' cuttings of laurel ? Whatever doing, I hope you
' have been well, and as happy as you can be. I try
* to figure to myself all your occupations through the
' day. When shall I hear from you ?'
He was detained in London on this occasion till the
3 1st of May, Unable to leave town while the question
of peace or war was still in suspense, or till the termi
nation of the discussions that followed the renewal of
hostilities, he had borne this long separation from his
family with ever-increasing impatience, aggravated by
the discomfort of the lodging in which he lived, ' I
'feel quite provoked,' he writes, on the 4th of April,
' at having been taken away so soon. It wUl make it
' more difficult for them to move me another time,'
' , . , God bless you. Kiss the dear children, and
' tell me what I can get that would please them most,
' and at the same be useful to them,'
' I am quite worn out,' he repeats, on the 3rd of

408 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
May, ' with the state of uncertainty in which things
'still remain, and with vexation at having been so
' long absent frora you, and literaUy for nothing It
' raust end this week, however ; and though I cannot
' now fix the 7th of May for setting out, I think no-
' thing can detain me beyond Saturday, or, at furthest,
' Monday se'nnight. I think the communication pro-
' mised by Addington will probably be made on
' Friday, and the debate on it take place on Monday
' next, and if I allow the rest of the week for any dis-
' cussions that raay follow, I think I shall do very
' handsomely. As to negotiations for offlce, I do not
' see the least possibility of any.' , , . ' The whole
'situation of public affairs presents on every side so
' many unpleasant cireumstances, with so little tempta-
' tion to any honourable ambition, that my disposition
' to withdraw myself from it entirely increases every
' hour . . . We have had a great deal of rain for the
' last two days, which from your account appears to
' be,much wanted in the North, and I hope will enatile
' you to plant the evergreens. How does your garden
' look ? particularly the American plants, the planting
' of which was one of our last occupations ? I hope
' you will not scruple making any improvement you
' like. You do all you can to reconcile me to your
' solitude. I think I see you at your dinner, and the
' children at their supper with an appearance of com-
' fort which raakes mc hope that you pass that hour at
' least in happiness. How I do wish that I had fol-

LORD GEEY. 409
' lowed my own inclination, and that I had resigned
' my seat at the general election. The event has
' proved that I could do no good, and I might now
' have been with you. This train of thought raakes
'me melancholy, and it is time to close my letter,'
His impatience to return to the North was now
much increased by the appearance of scarlet fever in
the neighbourhood of Howick, ' I got your letter,' he
writes from the House of Commons, on the 16th,
' before I came down here, which has quite terrified
' me about the scarlet fever. Pray never neglect
' writing a single post whilst there is the slightest
' symptom ofit remaining in the neighbourhood, I shall
' not know a moment's peace while it lasts , , ,'
Again, the following day : ' I have just got your letter,
' and am quite terrified at your account of this dread
'ful fever, I think you have done quite right in re-
' moving the chUdren to Fallodon,* I am sure you
' need give yourself no concern about the trouble this
' may occasion. In the first place I know your society
'is a pleasure to them. In the next you must feel
' that they have an interest, inferior only to our own,
' in the safety of our lovely children. How this adds
' to my regret at being absent !' ' My anxiety for the
* post,' he says, a few days later, ' is now greater that
' yours can be. My day is passed in apprehension,
' tiU it is relieved by your letter to tell me that you
' are all in safety. I hope you left orders at Howick
* His father's place, six miles from Howick.

410 LIPE AND OPINIONS OP
'that the poor people should have every assistance
' that can be given them in the way of wine, provisions,
'or anything necessary in their distress, from the
' house.' The King's iUness in February 1804 again took
ray father to town by himself. 'You wiU see,'
he writes, after his arrival, and after a discussion on
the subject in the House of Coraraons, in which he
took part, ' that I only said a few words, and those
' few were as bad as anything that could have corae
'from the Doctor* hiraself. I feel very much the
' want of habit and experience in debate, which is
' absolutely necessary to give that readiness without
' which nothing can be done, and which I unfortunately
' do not naturally possess. I feel every day raore and
' raore convinced of ray unfitness for a pursuit which
' I detest, — which interferes with all my private com-
' fort, — and which I only sigh for an opportunity of
' abandoning decidedly and for ever. Do not think
'this is the language of moraentary low spirits; it
' really is the settled conviction of ray raind.'
He returned to the North early in March, and itwas
not without the greatest difflculty, and after repeated
entreaties, that Mr. Fox persuaded him again to leave
home towards the end of April, to take part in the
attack, then in its full vigour, against Mr. Adding
ton's Adrainistration. 'Alone, unfriended, melan-
' choly, slow,' he writes, at the end ofhis second day's
* Mr. Addington's usual soubriquet. ,

LOED GEEY. 411
journey ; ' not very slow either, for I have come about
'one hundred miles to-day, but as melancholy as
' heart can be, I feel more than my usual pain at
' leaving you, and as I look forward to all the business
' in which I am going to engage, the less hope I feel
'that it can come to any good, I never felt less
' heart ; the contest does not animate me, and I
' hardly wish for success,'
The fight was over, and Addington was out when
he arrived. Then followed the discussions between
the leaders of parties ; the final arrangeraent of Mr.
Pitt's second Administration ; the delay in the public
business occasioned by the re-election of the new
Ministers ; — all detaining my father necessarily in
London, while his heart was at Howick with his family
and his improvements, ' I wish,' he writes, on the
17th of May, ' that I could go to you without further
' delay, but I know you would not wish me to do so
' against my own conviction of what is right. It cer-
' tainly would have a bad appearance to leave town
'before any Parliamentary business comes on, and
' subject me to an imputation of coming from an ex-
' pectation of office. In this respect things have hap-
' pened very unluckily ; first in the delay which the
' re-election of the Ministers occasions, and next from
' the intervention of the Whitsuntide hoUdays at the
' beginning of next week,' , . . ' I hope your north-
' east wind has at last left you. We had it here about
' the time you wrote, but it is now as w^arm as ever.

412 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' Fox was at St, Anne's on Sunday and Monday, and
' he says he never saw so fine a spring ; the lilacs
' and laburnums in full beauty, and the foliage of the
' trees uncoraraonly fine. This was confirraed by the
' appearance of the garden at Carlton House on Tues-
' day, which was quite beautiful. How I do wish I
' was with you superintending our iraproveraents !
' Why do you give way to Taylor ?' (The gardener,)
' He is conceited and obstinate, and I think you raay
'depend upon your taste corresponding better with
' ray taste, than his. Have you saved the walnut-tree ?'
Again, on the 24th, when the delay in the intro
duction of Mr, Pitt's measures was still prolonging
his stay in London : ' Enough of politics,' he says, ' I
' ara going to dine at Whitbread's, and shall pass the
' evening there if they do not go out, in which case my
' only resource will be Des-Haye's benefit, I never
' was less gaily inclined, but I cannot bear the gloomi-
' ness of ray Own solitary room. It is not like a room
' one is settled in, and I generally pass as much of
' the day as I can in the streets, I am almost ashamed
' of this confession, for I do not see why I should not
' be able to occupy myself with a book or with busi-
' ness. But my restlessness increases rather than
' diminishes by the length of ray stay, and I can look
' to nothing but Howick for the means either of occu-
' pation or comfort.'
Notwithstanding what he here says, no one, per
haps, ever possessed a greater ' power of occupying

LOED GEEY. 413
himself at almost aU times. Even those broken
minutes, those odd quarters of an hour, which form,
in the aggregate, so large a portion of aU men's lives,
were seldom thrown away by him. While waiting
tiU others were ready to walk or ride, or on other
similar occasions— even for such short moments — he
could take up his book, and had the power of giving
it at once his undivided attention. This power of con
centrating his thoughts on whatever he was about,
was, in him, very remarkable. He seldom took notes
during a debate; yet, in reply, he rarely missed a
point it was necessary to answer, and would take the
arguments of his opponents in 'their order with sn
accuracy, and, I may add, a fairness, which has been
rarely equalled, if, indeed, it has been ever attempted,
by any other great Parliamentary debater. And this
faculty, which he early acquired, he was wont to
ascribe to Mr, Fox, who on one occasion, when he was
yet young in Parliamentary life, stopped him- as he
was about to follow the example of others in leaving
the House as some dull member rose to speak, and
inculcated upon him the necessity, if he would himself
succeed in debate, of patiently listening to all speakers,
even the dull ones, as from the duUe_st he might derive
ideas whieh he could afterwards turn .to his own use.
To revert to the period of his stay in London
'during the months of May and June, 1804. His
return home had been still farther delayed by the
state of the King's health, which had led to a corre-

414 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
spondence between the Prince of Wales and the Lord
Chancellor, and to the consideration whether some
forraal proceedings should not be taken by the Oppo
sition in Parliament, The King's recovery from
the threatened attack rendered this unnecessary ; but
it was not till the last week in June that my father
was enabled to leave town for the North, ' The
' King's state,' he writes on the 7th June (' we , have
' now got an admission under the hands of the physi-
' cians that his recovery is not perfect) is very embar-
' rassing. It is impossible for rae to raove till some
' deterraination is taken whether we shall act or not ;
' but this suspense, I hope, wiU not, and, I think,
' cannot last very long. In the mean time it raakes rae
' perfectly raiserable. The raost unhappy time 1 ever
' spent has been the last month,' , . , And again, on
the 9 th, when a very strong division against Mr, Pitt
in the House of Coramons had led to the belief that
he w-ould not be able to stand, he adds : ' I cannot
' say that this gives rae any particular pleasure, any
' further than as I think it will be advantageous to
' the country. But 1 dread the thoughts of being
' detained in town, and I have alraost an equal fear
' of office. What I most wish for my own happiness,
' and what I still hope is, that I shaU get away next
' week. The suspense quite kiUs me — the heat relaxes
' me — the uncertainty irritates me. I have no plea-
' sure and no interest in anything. I sleep badly —
' am restless all day, and more uncomfortable than I

LOED GEEY. 415
' ever was in my life. Your description of the beau-
' ties of the country adds to my hatred of the town,
' and to my impatience to leave it. It is too hard
' that we should not enjoy this season together.'
The rest of the year 1804 was spent in corafort
with his family at Howick — only interrupted by short
visits to friends in the neighbourhood; but as the
time approached for the opening of the Session of
1805, Mr, Fox grew more pressing for his early
attendance, and made that appeal to my mother which
I have already noticed, and which was successful in
drawing him from his retirement. My mother, on
this occasion, accompanied him to London, as she did
again for the opening of the Session of 1806 ; and the
change occurring at the beginning of the latter year,
which gave the Whigs a short fourteen months' tenure
of office, they were necessarily established in town for
that period. There is consequently a longer cessation
than usual of the daily letters which, during their
occasional separations, contain such full and faithful
accounts of public events, as well as so true and unaf
fected an expression of my father's opinions and
feelings. It was not till the close of the Session of 1807,
during which he had resuraed his seat on the Opposi
tion bench, that they were enabled to return to
Howick. In November of that year my grandfather
died ; and in January 1808 we find ray father once
more on the road by himself, on his way to take his

416 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
seat for the first tirae in the House of Lords ; and once
more writing from the inn where he passed the first
night : ' I am quite well, but most unhappy at having
' left you. Yet I am very sanguine, nay, very confi-
' dent, that ray stay in the place that I hate raost will
' be short, I see you all at this moment in the draw-
' ing-room, and two of ray sweet children at the
' pianoforte.' And again on the third night of his
journey : ' We have had a raost deUghtful day, which
' I hope has been equaUy fine at Howick. When the
' sun was shining, with a fine, mild air, I figured to
' myself you and my two sweet girls on the Heugh,'
(A hill to the west of the house, round which there
was a favourite gallop, and whence there was a mag
nificent view over the house and woods to the sea —
taking in all the indentures of the coast, far to the
north and south — with the ruined castles of Dunstan
borough and Baraborough in the extreme distance on
the one side, and Warkworth and Coquet Island, with
its white lighthouse, on the other.*) ' I saw Ida going
* At Coquet Isle their beads they tell
To the good saint who owned the ceU ;
Then did the Alne attention claim.
And Warkworth, proud of Percy's name ;
And next they crossed themselves to hear
The whitening breakers' sound so near.
Where boihng through the rocks they roar
On Dunstanborough's cavemed shore ;
Thy tower, proud Bamborough, marked they there,
King Ida's castle, huge and square.
From its taU rock look grimly down,
And on the sweUing ocean frown. Marmion, canto ii.
[Dunstanborough,

LOED GREY. 417
' beautifully, and the light in the house, and the craig
' behind, with the calm, blue sea, were delightful to my
' imagination. Oh ! that I could see them in reality !'
He was kept in London, partly by the business of
the Session, and partly by the iUness, ending in the
death, of his uncle Sir Harry, tUl the beginning of
April, when he returned to Howick.
My father's love for the country was second only
to that for his home and family; and whenever he
was in London by himself, he eagerly embraced every
opportunity of spending a night or two in the com
parative quiet and freshness of Holland House, or of
passing a few days with Mr. Whitbread at Southill,
or the Duke of Bedford at Woburn,
The charm and attractions of the society at Holland
House, as it was then, are well known ; and my father
had, besides, the most sincere love and affection for
Lord Holland, which I believe to have been as sincerely
returned.* ' I came here yesterday,' he wrote from
Holland House, in January 1808, 'as I told you was
' my intention, and, having been most kindly pressed
Dunstanborough, about three mUes north of Howick, finely situated
on a bold promontory, and containing seven acres within the walls, was
a favourite lion of visitors at Howick— as was Warkworth, eight miles to
the south, on the pretty river Coquet. Queen Margaret is said to have
landed at Dunstanborough before the battle of Hexham.
* Lord HoUand's hnes on himself, found amongst his papers at his
death, are weU known : —
Nephew to Fox, and friend to Grey,
Enough my meed of fame —
If those who've deign'd to watch me, say
I've tarnished neither name ! 2 F.

418 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' to do so, shall stay tiU to-morrow. , , . Independently
' of my liking to be here, or, indeed, anywhere rather
'than in London, the least breath of country air
' always makes me feel so much better than I do in
' London, that this alone would make it pleasant to
' rae.' And the next day he repeats frora the House
of Lords : ' They have put off coraing to town, and I
' ara so much happier there ; and sleeping out of town
' does rae so rauch good, that I ara going back with
' Holland.' In May 1809 he writes frora Woburn on his way
back to Howick frora another short absence of three
weeks, to which he had submitted at the earnest
request of his friends : ' Since I began this I have
' been taking a drive, and every time I corae here I
' ain more indignant at the fashionable injustice of
' calling this an ugly place. Some of the ground is
' beautiful. There are everywhere the finest trees,
' and an extent of flourishing young plantations that
' excite ray envy. One part of the drive was through
' a beautiful wood, in which I do not exaggerate when
' I say that the lily of the vaUey is as thick as the wild
' hyacinths at Howick, I never saw the country in
¦greater beauty. The laburnuras are loaded with
' blossoras ; and the richness of the verdure of the grass,
^ and of the foliage of the trees, is very refreshing
' after the dirt of LoAdon,'
The care of his own plantations was always a
favourite occupation with him, and one which he

LORD GEEY. 419
thoroughly understood, and all planting and thinning
tiU the very last years of his life were conducted
under his own superintendence, I should in vain
attempt to paint him, as he was in the midst of his
wood-cutters! Suffice it to say that there never was
a happier time, either for himself or his children, than
that so spent.
In 1810, my father took a house in Portman Square ;
and from this time forward my mother and sisters
accompanied him regularly each season to London.
In January, however, of that year, he had been again
there by himself to be present at the opening of the
Session. 'I must confess,' he writes on the 24th,
' that you have had lately cause to complain of my
' letters. They have been very uncomfortable and
' very short. In truth I have found it difficult to
' write. The shoals of people that will corae in
' whether I ara refused at the door or not ; the quan-
' tity of papers I have had to 'read ; the plague of
' settling our house ; and, above all, the nervous agitar
' tion which always precedes a debate, particularly the
' first debate of the season, — have altogether made it
' impossible for me to write more. When I say that
' I have been nervous about the debate, you have
' seen me too often in that state to require any further
' description of it, I think I hardly ever felt so much
' so, and I have been continually asking rayself, how,
' without the slightest chance of doing any good, I can
' be such a fool as voluntarily to create to myself so
2 B 2

420 LIFE AND OPINIONS OF
' much uneasiness. Thank God, however, iny first
' effort is over, and, if I raay beUeve my friends, was
' not entirely unsuccessful. I should say myself it
' was about the standard of my ordinary productions,
' which you know I am not disposed to adraire to
' excess,' But I need not follow in detail the various occasions
on which, in successive years, my father was taken by
himself to London in order to attend his Parliamentary
duties ; or reproduce more of the letters written by
him during these separations, I have already, per
haps, quoted more than enough to show the nature
and strength of his feelings when forced to leave
horae; and very few and short passages frora his
letters in 1819 shall be the last I will extract. In that
year he had felt himself compelled to go alone to town,
once more to offer his most strenuous opposition to
the coercive policy with which Government met the
disturbances in the country, which distress and other
causes had occasioned. But his stay there was one of
protracted vexation. He was at this time, and con
tinued to be sorae years, subject to sudden attacks in
the storaach — spasras of pain, producing violent sick
ness, for which weakening remedies were necessary.
Dispirited by repeated attacks of this character, he
felt acutely the lukewarmness and even disaffection of
some of his friends, who could not be brought to face
the majority arrayed against them, or who, really
alarmed at the state of the country, were now disposed

LOED GEEY. 421
to support the Ministerial measures ; and the hopeless
ness of the contest in which he was engaged, increas
ing the disgust with which politics always inspired
him, wrung from him repeated expressions of his wish
to withdraw from them altogether. The day after his
arrival in town he writes : ' In addition to my regret
' at leaving you, I have before me all the annoyances
' which the present state of politics must bring upon
' me. Oh! how I wish I was again at Howick !'
' I shall not have a happy moment,' he says in
another letter, after recounting all the vexations and
difficulties with which he had to contend, ' till I see
' the carriage at the door to take me back to Howick.'
— Again : ' I sometimes almost resolve to discharge
' my mind of it, and to declare I cannot go through
' what is required of me. The truth is that I ought to
' have stayed quietly at Howick,'
' I have not shrunk, and I hope I shall not shrink,'
he writes a few days later, ' from the performance of
' my duty. But there are times in which a man who
' feels that his efforts are useless may withdraw him-
' self from a scene of unavailing contest, in which,
' without advantage to any individual, he risks his
' health, and sacrifices his family comfort.'
I shall have to recur to the events of 1819, and to
the circumstances under which the letters, from which
the above are extracts, were written, should I retura,
in another volume, to give some further account of my
father's public life.

422 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
The year 1820 was one of repeated sepai-ations. My
mother, with two of my sisters, went in the month of
May to visit her mother at Bishop's Court near Dublin,
— the first time she had been in Ireland since her mar
riage in 1794 — and my father was called up to London
no less than three times on account of the unfortunate
proceedings against the Queen in the House of Lords.
This business belongs also to a future chapter ; and it
is not necessary, after the many extracts I have
already given frora his letters written on other occa
sions of absence, to say raore than that now also they
were filled with the usual yearnings for his own fire
side, and the corafortable evening readings with his
faraily for his audience, and with lamentations over
the ' sad manner in which this poor year has been cut
' up by various separations.'
In 1821 my mother had a dangerous illness, from
which, in consequence ofthe severity of the treatraent,
her recovery was very slow; and in 1823 it was
deemed essential that the winter should be spent in a
milder cliraate than Northumberland. Anti this being
made known to the Duke of Wellingtoh, he kindly
offered my father the use of Governmenf^House at
Devonport, which belonged to him as Governor of Ply
mouth. The next three winters were spent there — indeed
the greater part of each year — only interrupted by
short visits of my father to London — and one joumey
by himself, in 1824, to tiie North. During this ab-

LORD GREY. 423
sence my grandmother died at Wentworth, ' I know
' it is impossible,' my father writes from the North,
' that you should not feel— deeply feel— the loss you
' have suffered. Your poor mother's amiable quaUties,
' and the confidence and affection which made her
' more to you than a mother, can never recur to your
' mind without the most painful reflection on your
' being deprived of them in this world for ever. But
' they ought also to be a source of comfort and con-
' solation, in the other reflection which as naturally
' accompanies them, that they were returned by you
' with more than the attachment and devotion of a
' chUd, and that you have not a reproach to make to
' yourself for any one act of your life with respect to
' her, and that under many severe distresses and dis-
' appointments, she always found in your affection the
' means of comfort and happiness, I do hope, there-
' fore, that with deep and bitter regrets, more com-
' fortable feelings also attend the thoughts which
' necessarily turn to her,' , , , . ' I hope further that by
' degrees you will reconcile yourself to the inevitable
' conditions of our mortal existence, and that you wiU
' find in the duty which you owe to yourself and to
' those who have surviving claims upon you, the
' strength of mind which is necessary to the support
' of evils to which we must all submit , , , . And
' now I wiU dismiss this painful subject, not from any
' indifference to it, for I really loved her as a mother,
' but because I think it is a duty, of which I ought to

424 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP
' set you the example, not to dwell on recoUections
' which can be of no use to those who are the objects
' of them, and which cannot be indulged too much,
' without interfering with what we owe to others,'
In the spring of 1826 he bade a final adieu to De
vonshire ; and from that time untU 1843, with the
exception of the three years and a half he was in office,
from Noveraber 1830 to July 1834, the accustoraed
life at Howick was resumed, broken only by the usual
visits to London for two or three months in each
season. The events of these years will be raatter for a future
volurae which, I trust, my brother will himself under
take, and which may contain a true history (still want
ing, notwithstanding the many publications that have
appeared professing to give an account of that period)
of the Reform Administration, In that volume, any
incidents, connected with ray father's private life in
these latter years, which raay seera deserving of
raention, raay find their place. For the present I have
said enough, and quoted enough of his correspondence
with my mother, to prove the happiness of his domes
tic life, and the unwillingness with which he ex
changed it, at any tirae, for the troubles and vexations
of party politics. I need only further say that these
feeUngs gained strength with his advancing years, as
the two following extracts — one frora a letter in 1824,
when there was a general idea that a change of govern
ment was imrainent, the other frora his faraous reply

LORD GREY. 425
on the debate for the second reading of the Reform
Bill — will abundantly testify : —
' You talk of scolding ! But what do you call what
' I have just received for not speaking ? In the parti-
' cular instance it was most unjust. For in the state
' in which the debate ended .... I should not in the
' most active period of my life have thought it neces-
' sary to say one word. But really I cannot believe,
' when you consider the matter coolly,' that you will
' think me really to blame for withdrawing from all
' active politics. I really am unequal to constant
' attendance and exertion even out of office. In office
' it would be quite impossible for me to support the
' fatigue and anxiety which must attend any leading
' situation in the Government. I am now past sixty, I
' have arrived at that age havingbeen but one year in
' the ministry. I had not in that short period the means
' of acquiring official knowledge and experience , , . .
' Looking at all these circumstances, surely a scene is
' exhibited which may well excuse a person, long past
' the vigour of his life, for wishing to pass the remain-
' der of it in peace and retirement,'
' I had no desire,' he said og the second occasion to
which I have alluded, ' for place, and it was not sought
' after by me. It was ofiered to me under such cir-
' cumstances that nothing but a sense of duty could
' have induced me to accept it .... I have lived a
' long Ufe of exclusion from office — I had no official
' habits — I possessed not the advantages which those

426 LIFE AND OPINIONS, OP
' official habits confer, I am fond of retirement and
' doraestic life, and I lived happy and contented in the
' bosora of my family, I was surrounded by those to
' whom I am attached by the warraest ties of affection :
' what then but a sense of duty could have induced
' rae to plunge into all the difficulties, not unforeseen,
' of my present situation ? what else in my declining
' age ? — " What else could tempt me on the stormy seas,
Bankrupt of hfe yet prodigal of ease !"
' I defy my worst enemy, if he has the most moderate
' sense of candour, to find ground for charging rae
' with any other motive,'
In 1843' the long illness coraraenced which ended,
after sufferings borne with the most exemplary patience
and resignation, in my father's death on the 17th of
July, 1845,
Leaving now the reader to forra his own estiraate
of his character from the raaterials which I ara aware
I have raost imperfectly put before him, I shaU
conclude this volurae with an extract frora a notice
of his public'fffe,' supposed to have beeh written by
one who had been brought up in the opposite carap,*
and which, amid much that is fanciful and iraaginary,
shows, on 'the" wholie, a just appreciation of the high
honour' and consistency, the elevated and generous
principle^,' kkd' the pure and disinterested patriotisra
which marked ray father's whole Career,
* Ascribed, I know not how correctly, to the Hon. George Smythe,
afterwards Lord Strangford.

LORD GREY. 427
' The old Whig traditions,' says this writer, 'were
' preserved by him pure and intact, sacred and com-
' plete. Their greatest modern illustrations were of his
' achievement. The abolition of the slave trade in
' 1807, when he was Foreign Secretary ; the abolition
' of slavery in 1834, when he was Prime Minister ;
' their long and magnanimous exile from power, from
'1806 down to 1830, for the sake ofthe emancipation
' of Ireland ; the Reform Bill which he proposed in one
' century, and which he carried in another. Such were
' araong the triumphs of his magnificent career. Rare
' trophies, and almost unexampled in one public life !
' . , . , And these great deeds were memorably car-
' ried, not by artifice, nor machination, nor statecraft ;
' not by the maxims of " the Prince," here bowing to
' the monarch, there bending to the people— here abat-
' ing a principle, there compromising a truth ; but by
' a straightforward, open, and honest, pubUc-hearted,
' English course of conduct,'
To this I may further add the following inscription
written by the late Rev, Sydney Smith, for the statue
erected to my father in Newcastle, but which, as Lady
Holland* says in the Memoirs of her father, ' as it
' did not entirely meet the views of aU the subscribers,
' was not adopted ; though I have reason to beUeve
' it was much approved of by the family.'
* Daughter of the Eev. Sydney Smith, married to Sir Henry HoUand,
M.D.

428 LIFE AND OPINIONS OP LORD GEEY.
To CHARLES EARL GREY, K.G.,
Of Howick, in Northumberland,
This Monument,
In a spirit of solemn respect
And deep gratitude,
Is erected by many of his feUow-citizens.
They have seen him through a long life
Dedicating his fine talents to promote the best interests
Of Mankind,
And, in evil days, with high moral courage.
Defending the almost extinguished Liberties of England.
¦ They owe to him that memorable Reform,
Which, blending Freedom with Loyalty and Order,
Has infused fresh hfe and energy into aU
Our Institutions ;
A Reform which he planned in his youth,
Aud brought to triumphant perfection in his advanced age.
Remembering these things.
They have deemed it an act of saored justice
To record, by a Public Monument,
Their admiration of this great Statesman :
Not without hope
That the young, seeing what those quaUties are
Whioh command the gratitude of mankind,
May strive to be as good and pure as he
Whose image is here placed before their eyes.

APPENDIX.

Letter from Mr. Perceval to Lord Grey, and Lord
Grey's Answer.
' My Lord 'Windsor, September 23, I8O9.
' The Duke of Portland having signified to His
' Majesty, his intention of retiring from His Majesty's
' service, in consequence of the state of his Grace's
' health, His Majesty has authorised Lord Liverpool,
' in conjunction with myself, to communicate with your
' Lordship and Lord Grenville, for the purpose of form-
' ing an extended and combined Administration.
' I hope, therefore, that your Lordship, in consequence
' of this communication, will come to town in order
' that as little time as possible may be lost in for-
' warding this important object ; and that you will
' have the goodness to inform me of your arrival.
' I am also to acquaint your Lordship that I have
' received His Majesty's commands to make a similar
' communication to Lord GrenviUe of His Majesty's
' pleasure. ' I think it right to add, for your Lordship's infor-

430 APPENDIX.
' mation, that Lord Castlereagh and Mr, Canning have
' intimated their intention to resign their offices,
' I have, &c,,
(Signed) ' Spencer Perceval.'

Lord Grey to Mr. Perceval.
i gjj; ' Howick, September 25, 1809.
'I have this evening had the honour of re-
' ceiving your letter of the 23rd, informing me that
' in consequence of the Duke of Portland's intention of
' retiring from His Majesty's service, His Majesty had
' authorised you, in conjunction with Lord Liverpool, to
' coraraunicate with Lord Grenville and myself, for the
' purpose of forraing an extended and corabined Ad-
' ministration, and expressing a hope that, in conse-
' quence of this communication, I would go to London,
' that as little time as possible might be lost in for-
' warding this important object.
' Had His Majesty been pleased to signify that he
' had any coraraands for me personally, I should not
' have lost a moment in showing ray duty and obedi-
' ence, by a prorapt attendance on his Royal Pleasure.
' But when it is proposed to me to coraraunicate
' with His Majesty's present Ministers for the purpose
' of forraing a corabined Administration with them, I
' feel I should be wanting both in duty to His Majesty,
' and in fairness to fhem, if I did not frankly and at
' once declare, that such an union is, with respect to
' rae, linder the present circurastances, irapossible.

APPENDIX. 431
' This being the answer which I find myself under
' the necessity of giving, my appearance in London
' could be of no advantage, and might, at a moment
' like the present, be attended with some inconvenience,
' I have thought it better therefore to request that
' you will have the goodness to lay my duty at the
' feet of His Majesty, humbly entreating him not to
' attribute to any want of attachment to his Royal
' Person, or to a diminished zeal for his service, my
' declining a communication which, upon the terms
' proposed, could lead to no useful result, but raight
' be of serious detriment to the country, if, in conse-
' quence of a less decisive answer from me, any further
' delay should take place in the formation of a settled
' Government, ' I have, &c.,
(Signed) ' Grey.'

II.
Answer of the Prince to the Two Houses op Pap.
LIAMENT ON ASSUMING THE REGENCY, JaN. 1811.

Draft of Answer proposed hy Lord Grey.
' My Lords and Gentlemen,
' I receive the resolutions communicated to rae
on the part of the two Houses, with all the considera-

432 APPENDIX.
' tion due to their high authority, and with those
' feeUngs which an occasion so deeply interesting to
' rae raust necessarily inspire.
' A sense of the duty which I owe to ray King and
' Father, and to ray country, will not allow me to
' decline the arduous charge thus offered to my
' acceptance. But I cannot be insensible in this
' season of great and increasing difficulty, to the
' possible practical inconvenience, and to the danger-
' ous principle of the limitations annexed to it, how-
' ever short their duration.
' The two Houses cannot be more anxious than I ara
' to make all necessary provisions for His Majesty's
' present comfort, and for the future exercise of His
' Royal Functions, whenever, by the blessing of God,
' he shaU be enabled to resume them. Proportioned
' to the pain I now feel, will be the happiness of that-
' day when I shall be called upon to restore to the
' King those Powers, which, as belonging only to him,
' are in his narae, and on his behalf, now to be entrasted
' to me. It will be, in the mean time, my earnest and
' unreraitting endeavour to adrainister thera in such a
' manner as raay be most conducive to the honour of
' His Majesty's Crown, and as raay best accord with
' the general spirit and principles of our free con-
' stitution. 'With this object nearest to my heart, I shall
' anxiously study, at all times, to conciliate the aid
' and assistance of the two Houses of Parliaraent, and

APPENDIX. 433

' the support of a generous and loyal people ; con-
' scious that on these my hopes of a successful Ad-
' ministration must, under the Divine Providence,
' chiefly depend,'

Draft of Answer proposed by Lord Grenville and Lord
Grey, and r^ected by the Prince.
' My Lords and Gentlemen,
' Under the heavy affliction which has fallen
* upon us, I can have no greater consolation than in the
' testimonies of your regard and favourable opinion,
' These are my best encouragement, and their continu-
' ance must be my chief support in the unexampled
' difficulties of the task on which I am about to enter,
' With respect to the proposed limitations of the
' authority to be intrusted to me, I retain my former
' opinions. The two Houses cannot be more anxious
' than I am to make all necessary provisions for tfie
' present comfort of His Majesty, and for the future
' exercise of his royal functions, whenever, by the
' blessing of God, he shall be enabled to resume them.
' Proportioned to the pain which I now experience,
' will be the happiness of that day when I may restore
' -to him those powers which, as belonging only to him,
' are, in his name and on his behalf, to be intrusted
' to me.
' For such a purpose no restraint can be necessary
' to be imposed on me, 2 P

434 APPENDIX.
' To the arrangements, however, which your wisdom
' shall ultimately deera best suited to such an occasion
' I shall readily accede ; conscious that whatever
* degree of confidence you raay think fit to repose in
' me, it will at least be justified by the integrity of
' my views, by my attachment to your welfare, in
' which my own is inseparably involved, and by my
' unceasing soUcitude for the discharge of all the
' various duties which I owe to my Father and to my
' Sovereign, ' For myself I can desire nothing more than that I
' may, with your assistance, uphold the glory, and the
' essential interests of his Crown ; that he may resume
' the government unimpaired and undirainished when-
' ever it shaU please Providence to restore him to our
' prayers ; and that he may then have the satisfaction
' to learn that the conduct of his son, in this perUous
' crisis of our affairs, has been such as was best cal-
' culated to promote the objects nearest to his heart —
' the safety and happiness of his affectionate and faith-
' ful people.'

Draft of Answer prepared by Mr. Sheridan as adopted
by the Pnnce.
' Mt Lords and Gentlemen,
' I receive the coraraunication which the two
' Houses have dfrected you to raake to me of their
' joint Resolutions on the subject of " providing for the

APPENDIX. 435
' royal authority during the continuance of His Ma-
' jesty's iUness," with those sentiraents which I am
' bound to feel for the united desires of the two Houses,
' With the same sentiments I receive the expressed
* hopes of the Lords and Commons, that, from my
' regard for the interest of His Majesty and the nation,
' I should be ready to undertake the weighty and im-
' portant trust, proposed to be invested in me, under
' the restrictions and limitations stated in those reso-
' lutions. Conscious that every sentiment of my heart
' would have prompted me from dutiful affection to my
' beloved Father and Sovereign to have shown all the
' reverential delicacy inculcated in those Resolutions,
' 1 cannot refrain from expressing some degree of
' regret, and no less of mortification, that I should be
' stript of the opportunity of manifesting to his loyal
' and afflicted subjects that such would have been my
' conduct, ' Deeply impressed, however, with the necessity of
' tranquillizing the public mind, and determined to
' submit to every personal sacrifice consistent with the
' regard I owe to the security of my father's Crown,
' and the equal regard I owe to the welfare of the
' people, I do not hesitate to accept the office and
' situation proposed to me, restricted as they are — stUl
' retaining every opinion expressed by me upon a
' former and similar distressing occasion,
' In undertaking the trust proposed to rae, I am
' well aware of the difficulties of the situation in whioh
2p 2

436 APPENDIX.
' I shall be placed, but I shaU rely with confidence
' upon the constitutional advice of an enlightened Par-
' liament, and the zealous support of a generous and
' loyal people, I will use aU the raeans left to me to
' merit both,
' My Lords and Gentlemen,
' You will communicate this ray answer to the
' two Houses, accompanied by ray raost fervent wishes
' and prayers that the Divine wUl may extricate us
' and the nation from the grievous embarrassments of
' our present condition, by the speedy restoration of
' His Majesty's health,'

Bepresentation sent hy Lords Grey and Grenville to
the Prince of Wales. ' January 11, isn. '
' The circurastances which have occurred respecting
' your Royal Highness's answer to the two Houses,
' have induced Lord Grey and Lord Grenville most
' hurably to solicit permission to submit to your Royal
' Highness the following considerations, with the un-
' disguised sincerity which the occasion seems to re-
' quire, but with every expression that can best convey
' their respectful feelings of dutiful and inviolable
' attachment, ' When your Royal Highness did Lord Grenville the
' honour, through Mr. Adam, to command his attend-

APPENDIX. 437
• ance, it was distinctly expressed to him that your
' Royal Highness had condescended to select hun, in
' conjunction with Lord Grey, to be consulted with as
' the pubUc and responsible advisers of that answer ;
' and Lord GrenvUle can never forget the gracious
* manner in which your Royal Highness had the good-
' ness to lay these your orders upon him. It was also
' on the same ground of public and responsible ad-
' vice, that Lord Grey, honoured in like manner by the
' most gracious expression of your Royal Highness's
' confidence on this subject, applied himself to the con-
' sideration of it, conjointly with Lord Grenville,
' They could not but feel the difficulty of the under-
' taking which required them to reconcile two objects
' essentially different, to uphold and distinctly to mani-
' fest that unshaken adherence to your Royal High-
' ness's past and present opinions, which consistency
' and honour require ; but to conciliate at the same
' time, the feelings of the two Houses by expressions
' of confidence and affection, and to lay the foundation
' of that good understanding between your Royal
' Highness and the. Parliament, the establishment of
' which must be the first wish of every man who is
' truly attached to your Royal Highness, and who
' knows and values the constitution of his country.
' Lord Grey and Lord Grenville are far • from the
' presumption of beUeving that their humble endea-
' vours for the execution of so difficult a task, might
' not be susceptible of many and great amendments.

438 APPENDIX. .
' The draft which they humbly submitted to your
' Royal Highness, was considered by them as open to
' every remark which raight occur to your Royal
' Highness's better judgraent. On every occasion,
' but raore especially in the preparation of your Royal
' Highness's first act of Government, it would have
' been no less their desire than their duty to have
' profited by all such objections, and to have laboured
' to accomplish, in the best manner they were able,
' every command which your Royal Highness might
' have been pleased to lay upon them. Upon the
' objects to be attained, there could be no difference of
' sentiment. These, such as they have above de-
' scribed, are, they confidently believe, not less irapor-
' tant in your Royal Highness's view of the subject,
' than in that which they theraselves have ventured
' to express,
' But they would be wanting in that sincerity and
' openness by which they can alone hope, however
' iraperfectly, to raake any return to that gracious con-
' fidence with which your Royal Highness condescend-
' ed to honour thera, if they suppressed the expression
' of their deep concem, in finding that their hurable
' endeavours in your Royal Highness's service have
' been subraitted to the judgraent of another person, by
' whose advice your Royal Highness has been guided
' in your final decision on a raatter, in which they alone
' had, however unworthily, been honoured with your
' Royal Highness's coramands

APPENDIX. 439
' It is their most sincere and ardent wish that in
' the arduous state in which your Royal Highness is
' about to fill, you may have the benefit of the pubUc
' advice and responsible services of those men, who-
' ever they may be, by whom your Royal Highness's
'glory, and the interests of the country can best be
' promoted. It would be with unfeigned distrust of
' their own means of discharging such duties, that they
' could, in any case, venture to undertake them. And
' in the humble but respectful representation which
' they have presumed to make of their feelings on this
' occasion, they are conscious of being actuated no less
' by their dutiful and grateful attachment to your
' Royal Highness, than by those principles of constitu-
' tional responsibility, the maintenance of which they
' deem essential to any hope of a successful adminis-
' tration of the public interests,
(Signed) ' Grey,
' Grenville.'

Copy of Letter from Lord Lauderdale to Lord Grey.
'January 11, 1811.
' Dear Grey, ' ^^^'¦^' ^ °'«i°'''^ ^•^•
' When I returned into the room I found Lady
HoUand ; Harrison and Allen had retired, and Adam
• and Sheridan were engaged reading the two answers
¦ to Holland.
' HoUand disapproved of Sheridan's, as showing
throughout an unbecoming soreness at the restrictions,

440 APPENDIX.
' and as worded in some parts in a very undignified
' raanner. Of the other he said, that if the Prince had
' objections to any part of it, what he ought to have
' done was, to have sent for you and GrenviUe, to whom
' those objections oUght to have been submitted ; ex-
' pressing hiraself very strongly upon the impropriety
' of substituting another answer, after having desired
' the advice of Lord GrenviUe and you concerning the
' answer he was to give. I think the answer you sent
' not so good as that you read to me in the morning,'
(see first drafts given above), ' and there is a passage
' at the beginning of it which is really objectionable.
' But that is a totaUy separate consideration,
' The impropriety of the whole transaction was for-
' cibly stated to Sheridan, and he was distinctly told
' by Holland that the Prince must be considered as
' withdrawing his confidence from Lord Grenville and
' you, if he adopted an answer suggested by another,
' and rejected that which had been drawn up at his own
' request. At the sarae tirae the obvious course was
' pointed out to hira ; that if he disapproved of any
' part of what had been submitted to him, he ought to
' have sent for Grenville and you to learn his objec-
' tions, and afterwards to draw out such an amended
' answer, as, consistent with your opinions, you could
' advise His Royal Highness to make.
' Sheridan muttered something about his thinking
' that the Prince was not yet in a situation to have a
' responsible adviser, which was flatly contradicted.

APPENDIX. 441
' and he was told that such certainly was not the
' opinion of the Prince, who' had employed you and
' Lord Grenville to draw it out, after explanation of
' his intention to confide in you. Adam and he must
' have returned to Carlton House with the impression
' that HoUand thought the Prince had only one Une
' which with propriety he could pursue — that is, to
' send for GrenvUle and you in the morning, and
' submit the whole to your joint consideration.
' You will see that I could do nothing to prevent
' this discussion, for they were actually engaged in
' reading one of the answers when I returned.
' Yours,
(Signed) 'L  ,

III,
Proposal made by the Prince Regent to Lords
Grey and Grenville through the Duke of
York at the expiration op the year of
restrictions.

The Prince Regent to the Duke of York.
' My dearest Frederick,
' As the restrictions on the exercise of the
' royal authority will shortly expire, when I must
' make my arrangements for the future Administration
' of the powers with which I am invested, I think it
' right to communicate to you those sentiments which
' I was withheld from expressing at an earlier period
' of the Session, by my earnest desire that the ex-

442 APPENDIX.
* pected motion on the affairs of Ireland might undergo
' the deliberate discussion of Parliament, unmixed
' with any other consideration,
' I think it hardly necessary to call your recollection
' to the recent circumstances under which I assumed
' the authority delegated to me by Parliament, At a
' raoraent of unexarapled difficulty and danger I was
' caUed upon to raake a selection of persons to whom I
' should intrust the functions of executive Govern-
' ment. My sense of duty to our royal father solely
' decided that choice, and every private feeling gave
' way to considerations which admitted of no doubt or
' hesitation, I trast I acted in that respect as the
' genuine representative of the august person whose
' functions I was appointed to discharge ; and I have
' the satisfaction of knowing that such was the opinion
' of persons for whose judgraent and honourable prin-
' ciples I entertain the highest respect. In various
' instances, as you well know, where the law of the
' last Session left me at full liberty, I have waived
' my personal gratification in order that His Majesty
' might resume, on his restoration to health, every
' power and prerogative belonging to his Crown. I
' certainly am the last person in the kingdom who can
' be permitted to despair of our royal father's recovery.
' A new era is now arrived, and I cannot but reflect
' with satisfaction on the events which have distin-
' guished the short period of my restricted Regency,
' Instead of suffering the loss of any of her possessions
' by the gigantic force which has been employed

APPENDIX. 443
'against them, Great Britain has added most im-
' portant acquisitions to her empire. The national
' faith has been preserved inviolate towards our allies ;
' and, if character is strength as applied to a nation,
'the increased and increasing reputation of His
' Majesty's arms will show to the nations of the Con-
' tinent how much they may still achieve when ani-
' mated by a glorious spirit of resistance to a foreign
' yoke. In the critical situation of the war in the
' Peninsula, I shall be most anxious to avoid any
' measure which can lead my allies to suppose that I
' mean to depart from the present system, Persever-
' ance alone can achieve the great object in question ;
' and I cannot withhold my approbation from those
' who have honourably distinguished themselves in
' support of it, I have no predilections to indulge ;
' no resentments to gratify ; no objects to attain but
' such as are common to the whole empire. If such is
' the leading principle of my conduct, and I can appeal
' to the past in evidence of what the future will be, I
' flatter myself I shall meet with the support of Par-
' liament and a candid and enlightened nation,
' Having made this communication of my sentiments
' in this new and extraordinary crisis of our affairs, I
' cannot conclude without expressing the gratification
' I should feel if some of those persons with whom the
' early habits of my life were formed, would strengthen
' my hands and constitute a part of my Government.
' With such support, and aided by a united and vigo-

444 APPENDIX.
rous Administration, fornled on the most liberal
' basis, I shaU look with additional confidence to a
' prosperous issue ofthe most arduous contest in which
' Great Britain was ever engaged.
' You are authorized to communicate these senti-
' ments to Lord Grey, who, I have no doubt, will
' make them known to Lord Grenville.
' I ara always, my dearest Frederick,
' Your ever affectionate brother,
(Signed) ' George, P, R.'
' Carlton House,
'February 13, 1812.
' P,S,— I shall send a copy of this letter immediately
to Mr. Perceval,'

Lords Grey and Grenville to the Duke of York.
<¦ gjjj ' February 15, 1812.
'We beg most humbly to express to your
' Royal Highness our dutiful acknowledgments for the
' gracious and condescending manner in which you
' have had the goodness to communicate to us the
' letter of His Royal Highness the Prince Regen£, on
' the subject of the arrangements to be now made for
' the future Administration of the public affairs. And
' we take the liberty of availing ourselves of your
' gracious permission to address to your Royal High-
' ness, in this form, what has occurred to us in con-
' sequence of that communication.

APPENDIX. 445
' The Prince Regent, after expressing to your Royal
' Highness, in that letter, his sentiments on various
' public matters, has, in the concluding paragraph,
' condescended to intimate his wish " that some of
' those persons with whom the early habits of his life
' were formed, would strengthen His Royal High-
' ness's hands, and constitute a part of his Govern-
' ment," And His Royal Highness is pleased to add,
' " that with such support, aided by a vigorous and
' united Administration, formed on the most liberal
' basis, he would look with additional confidence to
' the prosperous issue of the most arduous contest in
' which Great Britain was ever engaged,"
' On the other parts of His Royal Highness's letter
' we do not presume to offer any observations. But
' on the concluding paragraph, in so far as we may
' venture to suppose ourselves included in the gracious
' wish which it expresses, we owe it, in obedience and
' duty to your Royal Highness, to explain ourselves
' with frankness and sincerity.
' We beg leave most earnestly to assure your Royal
' Highness that no sacrifices, except those of honour
* and duty, could appear to us too great to be made
' for the purpose of healing the divisions of our country,
' and of uniting both its Government and its people.
' AU personal exclusions we entirely disclaira. We
' rest on public measures ; and it is on this ground
' alone that we must express, without reserve, the im-
' possibility of our uniting with the present Govern-

446 APPENDIX.
ment. Our differences of opinion are too many and
too important to admit of such a union. His Royal
Highness will, we are confident, do us the justice to
reraember that we have twice already acted on this
impression; in 1809, on the proposition raade to us
under His Majesty's authority ; and last year when
His Royal Highness was graciously pleased to require
our advice respecting the forraation of a new Govern
ment, The reasons which we then humbly submitted
to him are strengthened by the increasing dangers of
the times; nor has there, down to this moraent,
appeared even any approximation towards such an
agreement of opinion on the public interests, as can
alone form a basis for the honourable union of parties
previously opposed to each other,
' Into the detail of these differences weare unwilling
to enter. They embrace almost all the leading
features of the preseut policy of the erapire. But
His Royal Highness has hiraself been pleased to
advert to the late deliberations of Parliaraent on the
affairs of Ireland. This is a subject, above all others,
iraportant in itself, and connected with the most
pressing dangers. Far from concurring in the senti
ments which His Majesty's Ministers have on that
occasion so recently expressed, we entertain opinions
directly opposite. We are firmly persuaded of the
necessity of a total change in the present system of
Government in that country, and of the iramediate
repeal of those civil disabilities under which so large

APPENDIX. 447
'a portion of His Majesty's subjects stUl labour on
' account of their reUgious opinions. To recommend
' to Parliament this repeal is the first advice which it
' would be our duty to offer to His Royal Highness,
' Nor could we, even for the shortest time, make
' ourselves responsible for any further delay in the
' proposal of a measure without which we could enter-
' tain no hope of rendering our services useful to His
' Royal Highness or to our country.
' We have only, therefore, further to beg your Royal
' Highness to lay before the Prince Regent the ex-
' pressions of our humble duty, and the sincere and
' respectful assurance of our earnest wishes for what-
' ever may best promote the ease, honour, and ad-
' vantage of His Royal Highness's Government,
' and the success of his endeavours for the public
' welfare. ' We have the honour, &c,
(Signed) ' Grey.
' Grenville.
' His Royal Highness the Duke of York, K.G.
&c. &c.'

Copy of ' Minutes of a Conversation which took
' place between His Royal Highness the Duke of
' York, and Lords GrenviUe and Grey, on the 15th of
' February, 1812, drawn up by His Royal Highness,
' with the corrections of Lords Grenville and Grey in
' red ink.' (Thus endorsed by my father.) The paper

448 ' APPENDIX.
when sept by the Duke of York for correctign was
accorapanied by the following note frora Mr. Adam : —
' Mt DEAR Lord Grey,
' I SEND you a fair copy of the Duke of York's
' account of the conversation, with your amendments
' inserted in red ink,* to all which His Royal Highness
' accedes, subject to some observations inserted in
' common ink. The Duke of York expressed much
' gratification at the manner in which your Lordship
' expresses Lord Grenville's sentiments and your own,
' regarding His Royal Highness.
' Your Lordship's ever most faithfuUy,
(Signed) 'William Adam,'

Minutes of my Conversation ivith Lords Grey and
Grenville, I5th Feb., 1812,
Lord Grenville began by stating
to rae, that he and Lord Grey had
thought it raost advisable to put
their sentiments upon the Prince
Regent's letter to me in writing
(of which he delivered to me two
copies, as well as retumed me the
letter itself), and was sorry to ac
quaint me, that, after the most ma
ture deliberation , they were under
* The red ink amendments of the original MS. are inserted in smaU
type in the margin.

appendix, 449
the necessity of declining to enter The proposal that had
into the proposed negotiation', to been made to them ;
which I replied, that I lamented
most sincerely this communication,
but begged leave to read the
answer through, and to state any- .
thing that might strike me as want
ing explanation in it.
Having read it, after a short
pause, Lord Grey hegan hy saying both Lord GrenvUle and
that they disclaimed aU personal Lord Grey said,
exclusions, but that a it was quite political unions could
impossible for them to unite with not be honourable where
^ there was not an agree-
the present Government. And j^ent on pubUc mea-
upon my expressing my surprise at sures, and that on this
this notion of the proposal, and
asking an explanation. Lord Grey
answered that it was collected from
the expression in ihe Princes leiter of whole tenor and con-
hiswish that some of ^Aose persons struction of the Prince's
letter which consisted of
with whom the early habits of his a communication of His
public Ufe were formed, would Eoyal Highness's sen-
. , , timents on the advan-
strengthen his hands, and which ^^^^ resulting from the
system pursued by the
present Government,
and concluded, after
having made this com
munication, by express
ing the gratification the
Prince would feel if
some of the
2 o

450 APPENDIX.
they understood to mean a junction therefore they could
..1 .1 , 1 T . • , ,. only understand
With the present Administration,
To which I replied, that this was
by no means the Prince's intention.
That his idea was to form an Ad
ministration upon a broad basis,
by a union of different parties, of
which he should consider himself
the keystone and as a centre round
which their Lordships and others
might rally ; and that this was one
of the reasons for which he had
chosen to employ me upon this
overture, as it had generally been
considered as a piece of political
etiquette that the person who was
eraployed in such negotiations was
considered to be at the head of the
new Adrainistration, whereas that
could never be the case in ray in
stance. In this part of the
conversation the Duke
of York mentioned the
difference in this respect
between this proposal
and that of 1809, which
had been made through
Mr. Perceval ; to whicli
Lord GrenviUe answer
ed, that, in that respect,
there was a total differ
ence, and that nothing

APPENDIX, 451
could be more honour-
* able to Lord Grey and
himself than the Duke
of York being the chan
nel of the present com
munication, but that
this circumstance, flat
tering as it was to them,
could not vary their
answer to the terms of
the letter.
¦And upon Lord Grey's saying that
this expression had not been under- explanation could not
7 ,,„ ,. , . _ be collected from tho
Stood till his explamition, I pro- ^^^^^^ j^self by anybody
posed, as this might make a dif- who read it,
ference in their sentiments, that
they should reconsider their paper.
Lord Grey seemed at first to hesi- To this Lord Grey said
..7, 7j7j'., 77 that what they were re-
tate, but soon answered that it would . , ^
quired to consider, was
probably occasion an alteration only a written statement of
of an expression without making *^« ^'^'^^^'^ sentiments,
that to this an answer
any change in the general sentiments ^^^i^ only be made in
of the paper; and that as this was writing, and that they
7 , . 7 7 • 7 /• 7 could not, under a ver-
the impression they denved from the ^^^ explanation, answer
letter till explained by me, the answer a written statement,
ouqht not to he altered. ^ , ^^,°?^ ° ^ f ^™,j
'' which it obviously would
not bear ; that, undoubt
edly, if the proposal to
them had been to form
an Administration, com
prehending as large a
description of persons as
could be brought to
agree with them in thedr

452

APPENDIX.

views of the pubhc inte
rests, a different answer
would have been given,
and that if in their pre
sent answer they should
ax^pear to the Prince to
have misunderstood his
meaning, the naistake
might be corrected.
To this correction the
Duke of York added the
foUowing remark, ' I do
' not exactly recoUect
' this passage, but I re-
' member something hke
' it. However, my view
' of this part of the sub-
'ject had been aheady
' given ty me, viz. that
' it was inconsistent with
' my being the person
'to make the overture,
• which was to avoid the
' proposal assuming the
' shape of coming from
' either party, but as
' being the Prince's pro-
' posal, of which he con-
' sidered himself to be
' the centre.'

Lord Grey then slightly touched
upon the question in the Prince's
paper, of his approbation of the
management of the political con
cerns of the nation, but entered
warmly into his and his friends'
feelings on the subject of Catholic

APPENDIX. 453
Emancipation, and hinted at the
Prince's former opinions upon that
head in the years 1803 and 1804 ;
to which I answered that I was
not informed of them, but asked if
their Lordships had not been ac
quainted with the Prince's senti
ments on that head in the years
1806 and 1807, which stiU con
tinued the same, and his wish to
prevent the question being brought
forward. To which they answered,
that they had equaUy wished to
keep it back then ; that it had
been brought forward at that time
against their wills, and that it was Lord Grey certainly
did not say that it had
likewise so this year. been his wish to keep it
back this year, which
would have been con
trary to the fact. His
statement was, that he
had endeavoured to pre
vent its being forced in
to discussion in 1807,
but that the danger was
now sogreat and so much
increased in Lord Grey's
apprehension, by the
probable effect of the
disappointment which
would foUow, if the
claims of the Cathohcs
were not acceded to by
the Govemment of the

454 APPENDIX. Prince Regent, that he
could not take upon him
self the responsibihty of
the shoi-test delay.
¦ I then asked if this was the only
impediraent to forming a combined
Adrainistration; when both Lord
Grey and Lord Grenville said that
they differed with the present Ad
ministration upon almost every
poUtical subject, many of them of
the highest importance, and only
secondary to the Catholic Question,
so that they saw no hope or possi
bility of any favourable termination
to a negotiation. A It then only re- for an imion with them.
mained for me to express that I
should carry the answer with a
heavy heart to the Prince, who, I
was sure, would lament it equally
with rayself.
IY.
Lord Welleslet's Second Negotiation for the
Formation op a Government,

Minute of a Communication made by Lord Wellesley to
Lord Grey, at Lord Grey's house. June 1, 1812.
Lord Wellesley stated that he had on that raorning
received full authority frora the Prince Regent, to

APPENDIX. 455
foi*m an Administration under his Royal Highness's
commands ; and that he was specially authorised to com
municate with Lords Grey and Grenville on the subject.
That his Royal Highness entertained no wish to
exclude from the proposed Administration any person,
or description of persons, who could unite in the prin
ciples on which the Administration was to be founded.
That the two propositions stated in Lord WeUes
ley's Minute of the 23rd of May (and subsequently
explained by the letters which passed between Lord
Wellesley and Lord Grey of the dates of the 27th,
28th, and 29th of May 1812) were intended by his
Royal Highness to constitute the foundation of this
Administration. That his Royal Highness had signified his pleasure
that Lord Wellesley should conduct the formation of
the Administration, in all its branches ; and should,
be First Commissioner of the Treasury; and that
Lord Moira, Lord Erskine, and Mr. Canning, should
bie members of the Cabinet,
That it was probable that a Cabinet formed on an
enlarged basis must be extended to the number of
twelve or thirteen members ; that the Prince wished
Lords Grey and GrenvUle, on the part of their friends,
to recommend for his Royal Highness's approbation
the names of four persons (if the Cabinet should
consist of twelve), and of five persons (if it should
consist of thirteen), to be appointed by his Royal
Highness to fiU such stations in his Councils as might
hereafter be arranged.

456 APPENDIX.
That His Royal Highness left the selection of the
naraes to Lords Grey and Grenville, without any
exception or personal exclusion.
That in completing the new arrangement, the
Prince Regent has granted to Lord Wellesley entire
liberty to propose, for his Royal Highness's approba
tion, the names of any persons now occupying stations
in his Royal Highness's CouncUs, or of any other
persons : that if the proposition raade to Lords Grey
and Grenville should be accepted as the outline of an
arrangeraent, all other matters would be discussed
with the most anxious solicitude to proraote harradny
and general accoramodation. (Signed) Welleslet.

Answer of Lords Grey and Grenville.
' Camelford House, June 3, 1812.
' Mt Lord,
' We have considered with the most serious
' attention the Minute which we have had the honour
' to receive, aud have communicated it to such of our
* friends as we have had the opportunity of consulting,
' On the occasion of a proposal made to us under the
' authority of the Prince Regent, we wish to renew, in
' the most solemn raanner, the declaration pf our un-
' feigned desire to have facihtated, as .far as was m our
' power, the raeans of giving effect to the late vote of
' the House of Comraons, and of averting the irarainent

appendix. 457
' and unparalleled dangers of the country. No sense
' of the public distress and difficulty, no personal feel-
' ings of whatever description would have prevented us,
' under such circumstances, from accepting with dutiful
' submission, any situations in which we could have
'hoped to serve His Royal Highness usefully and
' honourably. ' But it appears to us, on the most, dispassionate
' reflection, that the proposal stated to us by your
' Lordship, cannot justify any such expectation. We
' are invited, not to discuss with your Lordship, or with
' any other public men, according to the usual practice
' in such cases, the various and important considera-
' tions both of measures and arrangements which belong
'to the formation of a new Government in all its
' branches ; but to recommend to His Royal Highness
' a number, limited by previous stipulation, of persons
' willing to be included in a Cabinet, of which the out-
' lines are already definitively arranged.
' To this proposal we could not accede without the
' sacrifice of that very principle which the House of
' Commons has recommended — the formation of a strong
' and efficient Government, We enter not into the
'examination of the relative proportions, or of the
' particular arrangements, which it has been judged
' necessary thus previously to establish. It is to the
' principle of disunion and jealousy that we object. To
'the supposed balance of contending interests in a
' Cabinet so measured out by preliminary stipulations.
2h

458 APPENDIX.
'The times iraperiously require an Administration
'united in principle, and strong in mutual reliance —
'possessing also the confidence of the Crown, and
' assured of its support in those healing measures which
' the pubUc safety requires, and which are necessary to
' secure to the Government the opinion and affections
' of the people. No such hope is presented to us by
'this project, which appears to us equally new in
' practice, and objectionable in principle. It tends, as
'we think, to establish withm the Cabinet itself, a
' system of counteraction, inconsistent with the prose-
' cution of any uniform and beneficial course of policy.
' We raust therefore request permission to decline all
'participation in a Government constituted on such
' principles : satisfied as we are, that the certain loss
' of character to ourselves, would be productive only
' of disunion and weakness in the adrainistration of the
' public interests, (Signed) ' Grenville.
' Gret.'

Y.
Minute of a Conversation between Lord Moira and
Lords Grey and Grenville, at which Lord Erskine
was present. St. James's Place, June 6, 1812.
Lord Moira stated to Lords Grey and Grenville
that he was authorized by the Prince Regent to

APPENDIX. 459
consult with them on the formation of a new Govern
ment; and satisfactory explanations having taken
place between them respecting such measures as ap
peared to be of the greatest urgency at the present
moment, more especially with reference to the situa
tion of His Majesty's Roman Catholic subjects, and
the differences now unhappily subsisting with America ;
and that Lord Moira had received this commission
without any restriction or limitation whatever being
laid by the Prince on their considering any point
which they judged useful for his service ; — they ex
pressed their satisfaction with the fairness of this
proposal, and their readiness to enter into such dis
cussions as must precede the details of any new
arrangement. As a preliminary question, which appeared to them
of great importance, and which they thought it ne
cessary iramediately to bring forward to prevent the
inconvenience and embarrassment of the further delay
which might be produced if this negotiation should
break off in a more advanced state, they asked
whether this full liberty extended to the consideration
of new appointments to those great offices of the
Household, which have been usually included in the
political arrangements made on a change of Adminis
tration, intimating their opinion that it would be
necessary to act on the same principle on the present
occasion. Lord Moira answered that the Prince had
laid no restriction upon him in that respect, and had

460 APPENDIX.
never pointed, in the raost distant manner, at the pro
tection of those officers from removal. That it would,
however, be impossible for him (Lord Moira) to
concur in making the exercise of this power positive
and indispensable in the forraation of the Adrainistra
tion, because he should deera it, on public grounds,
peculiarly objectionable. To this Lords Grey and
Grenville replied, they also acted on public grounds
alone, and with no other feeling whatever than that
which arose frora the necessity of giving to a new
Governraent that character of efficiency and stability,
and those raarks of the constitutional support of the
Crown, which were required to enable it to act usefully
for the public service ; and that on those grounds it
appeared to thera indispensable, that the connection of
the great offices of the Court with the political Ad
ministration should be clearly estabUshed in its first
arrangements. A decided difference of opinion as to this point
having been thus expressed on both sides, the conver
sation ended here with mutual declarations of regret.
Nothing was said on the subject of official arrange
ments, nor any persons proposed on either side to fill
any particular situations. THE END,

raiBTED BT WILLIAM CLOWES AHD SOKS, STAMFOED 5TBEET AND CHAEIHG OEOSS.

YALE UNIVERSITY LIBRARY

3 9002 04067 3965

-^'

' '^¦' 'Vl Uilii , .nil ,.,,',/;; lihiL.

^1 A.,

•¦/r